MBB: University Athletic Association

Started by Allen M. Karon, February 21, 2005, 08:19:26 PM

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Dave 'd-mac' McHugh

Quote from: gordonmann on June 05, 2020, 03:09:05 PM
QuoteWhile I understand Gordon's point ... couldn't that be said about a lot of the schools in the UAA? Most of them are succeeding.

Could be the difference between schools that are need blind and those that are need blind and committed to filling the financial aid needs of the students they admit. Take it for what it's worth but NYU is listed as the former. You can get in, but you may not be able to afford it. Same goes for Brandeis and CMU.

https://www.cappex.com/articles/match-fit/need-blind-admission-colleges

Emory, Rochester and Chicago are in the latter category.

That's why I throw softballs at Gordon ... I always get interesting details back at me. :)
Host of Hoopsville. USBWA Executive Board member. Broadcast Director for D3sports.com. Broadcaster for NCAA.com & several colleges. PA Announcer for Gophers & Brigade. Follow me on Twitter: @davemchugh or @d3hoopsville.

Titan Q

Quote from: gordonmann on June 05, 2020, 03:10:34 PM
QuoteAnd, speaking of NYU and recruiting, head coach Dagan Nelson was interviewed on a podcast this week.

He did talk about the recruiting advantages he has at NYU and even suggested that he gets 60-70 e-mails a day from prospects and could field 6 or 7 teams.

That speaks to volume of recruits, not quality. Would any of those 6 or 7 teams contend for the UAA title?
No. 

They'd have 6 or 7 JV teams basically.

WUPHF

NYU is 33-66 since 2016-2017 with just 8 wins in the league, so they are already a JV team.

I am sure Coach Nelson was talking about more than volume when he talked about his ability to bring in players, but if someone wants to listen to confirm, the interview is great.  I like him.

I am open to the idea that a need-blind admissions policy can be helpful or harmful as far as recruiting goes, but this is not universal.

Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)


I mean, are we going to deny the obvious?  Atlanta and St. Louis are pretty cool places, but they're not lower Manhattan. It takes a very specific kind of student athlete to go to NYU to play basketball.  Like we've said, it's not impossible to recruit there and the new gym will definitely help, but you're competing with A LOT more alternatives for student-athlete attention than at most schools, even very good ones.

I don't think it's hard to see why recruiting nationally competitive players at NYU might be more difficult.

According to NYU's website, their aid is largely merit-based, but weighted by need vs WashU where they're committed to every student from a family making less than $75,000 a year graduating without any debt, and they're still giving a median need-based scholarship of $30,000 to kids from families making $200,000+.

NYU is super popular and awesome and they don't need to spend as much on aid to get the kind of students they want.  That's going to definitely hurt a non-scholarship athletic program.

I don't think any of these are excuses, though - just obstacles.
Lead Columnist for D3hoops.com
@ryanalanscott just about anywhere

Gregory Sager

#5899
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on June 05, 2020, 08:23:50 PM

I mean, are we going to deny the obvious?  Atlanta and St. Louis are pretty cool places, but they're not lower Manhattan. It takes a very specific kind of student athlete to go to NYU to play basketball.  Like we've said, it's not impossible to recruit there and the new gym will definitely help, but you're competing with A LOT more alternatives for student-athlete attention than at most schools, even very good ones.

NYU's location is a feature, not a bug, as far as recruiting is concerned.

It's not about competing with alternatives for student-athlete attention. You're underestimating the focus and drive of a basketball player. A kid who wants to play college basketball will want to play college basketball no matter where he ends up. But lower Manhattan is an enticing location for when you're not playing basketball, because college basketball players don't play pickup games, work on their shooting, and lift weights 24/7/52. They have lives, too. And when you're twenty years old, living that life in Greenwich Village can seem like a very cool thing, whether you're a basketball player, a tuba player, or a Halo player.

Plus, in terms of internship opportunities on the academic and future-career side of things, Manhattan is a treasure trove of possibilities.
"To see what is in front of one's nose is a constant struggle." -- George Orwell

Pat Coleman

Quote from: Gregory Sager on June 05, 2020, 09:29:42 PMcollege basketball players don't play pickup games, work on their shooting, and lift weights 24/7/52.

At least, not in D-III.
Publisher. Questions? Check our FAQ for D3f, D3h.
Quote from: old 40 on September 25, 2007, 08:23:57 PMLet's discuss (sports) in a positive way, sometimes kidding each other with no disrespect.

Gregory Sager

True. But I didn't want to invite the distraction of differentiating between scholarship players and non-scholarship players, because that's not what the discussion is about.
"To see what is in front of one's nose is a constant struggle." -- George Orwell

WUPHF

Also, who wouldn't want to go to school with the next Spike Lee, Lady Gaga, Jack Dorsey, Anne Hathaway, Rainn Wilson, Woody Allen, Amal Clooney, Paul Tagliabue, Chelsea Clinton, Perez Hilton, Judy Blume, Dolph Schayes and a few hundred more movers and shakers?

Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)

Quote from: Gregory Sager on June 05, 2020, 09:29:42 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on June 05, 2020, 08:23:50 PM

I mean, are we going to deny the obvious?  Atlanta and St. Louis are pretty cool places, but they're not lower Manhattan. It takes a very specific kind of student athlete to go to NYU to play basketball.  Like we've said, it's not impossible to recruit there and the new gym will definitely help, but you're competing with A LOT more alternatives for student-athlete attention than at most schools, even very good ones.

NYU's location is a feature, not a bug, as far as recruiting is concerned.

It's not about competing with alternatives for student-athlete attention. You're underestimating the focus and drive of a basketball player. A kid who wants to play college basketball will want to play college basketball no matter where he ends up. But lower Manhattan is an enticing location for when you're not playing basketball, because college basketball players don't play pickup games, work on their shooting, and lift weights 24/7/52. They have lives, too. And when you're twenty years old, living that life in Greenwich Village can seem like a very cool thing, whether you're a basketball player, a tuba player, or a Halo player.

Plus, in terms of internship opportunities on the academic and future-career side of things, Manhattan is a treasure trove of possibilities.

Of course we know the premise is faulty.  D3 basketball players end their careers early all the time precisely because they have other interests and commitments.  It's one the things that makes D3 great.  Yeah, players who have basketball as their #2 priority (because they're all students first, right) may not choose a place like NYU, because they're less interested in the other things.

Maybe instead of saying obstacle, I should say NYU has a unique recruiting profile that's going to require some creativity from a coach to do really well.

If you can recruit, you can recruit anywhere; I just imagine its a little tougher finding the basketball players from whom NYU is the right fit - and that's for a good reason, not a negative.
Lead Columnist for D3hoops.com
@ryanalanscott just about anywhere

jmcozenlaw

Quote from: WUPHF on June 05, 2020, 11:40:51 PM
Also, who wouldn't want to go to school with the next Spike Lee, Lady Gaga, Jack Dorsey, Anne Hathaway, Rainn Wilson, Woody Allen, Amal Clooney, Paul Tagliabue, Chelsea Clinton, Perez Hilton, Judy Blume, Dolph Schayes and a few hundred more movers and shakers?

Anne Hathaway? Sure, I'm in for the moving and shaking. Not so much Chelsea though ;)

WUPHF

#5905
Washington University adds three to the roster with the class of 2024: https://washubears.com/sports/mbkb/2020-21/releases/20200616epncq2

The 2020-2021 schedule has yet to be posted in full but washubears.com provides a glimpse in to UAA play and things get started in the first two weekends with Emory and Washington squaring off in the second game of league play.

Emory at Rochester, hosts Washington University and Chicago
Washington University at Chicago, at Emory and at Rochester

PauldingLightUP

Quote from: WUPHF on June 16, 2020, 11:47:18 AM
Washington University adds three to the roster with the class of 2024: https://washubears.com/sports/mbkb/2020-21/releases/20200616epncq2

The 2020-2021 schedule has yet to be posted in full but washubears.com provides a glimpse in to UAA play and things get started in the first two weekends with Emory and Washington squaring off in the second game of league play.

Emory at Rochester, hosts Washington University and Chicago
Washington University at Chicago, at Emory and at Rochester

Looks like a full schedule is now up for WashU

https://washubears.com/sports/mbkb/2020-21/schedule

WUPHF

#5907

Rickey Paulding, Mizzou '04

hopefan

Quote from: WUPHF on June 17, 2020, 01:22:56 PM

Rickey Paulding, Mizzou '04

Ok wupifff... I know who Ricky Pauling is... why am I seeing you post a picture of him in the UAA room?
The only thing not to be liked in Florida is no D3 hoops!!!

Gregory Sager

Quote from: hopefan on June 18, 2020, 09:16:47 AM
Quote from: WUPHF on June 17, 2020, 01:22:56 PM

Rickey Paulding, Mizzou '04

Ok wupifff... I know who Ricky Pauling is... why am I seeing you post a picture of him in the UAA room?

Check out the posting name of the poster above him for the answer to your question.
"To see what is in front of one's nose is a constant struggle." -- George Orwell