FB: Minnesota Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

Started by admin, August 16, 2005, 05:19:08 AM

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DuffMan

Quote from: DuffMan on October 16, 2019, 04:12:02 PM
Alright, 57J!  You've convinced me to pick one up after work to see what the fuss is.

You were right.  The "improved" version isn't nearly as good as the original.  :(

A tradition unrivaled...
MIAC Champions: 1932, 1935, 1936, 1938, 1953, 1962, 1963, 1965, 1971, 1974, 1975, 1976, 1977, 1979, 1982, 1985, 1989, 1991, 1993, 1994, 1995, 1996, 1998, 1999, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2008, 2009, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2021, 2022
National Champions: 1963, 1965, 1976, 2003

Mr. Ypsi

Quote from: SagatagSam on October 16, 2019, 05:22:10 PM
Quote from: DuffMan on October 16, 2019, 04:07:45 PM
Aside from revenue, I don't see it as a benefit to either party.  U$T would get nothing out of winning (ooh la la, you beat a D3 team), and a loss to a D3 team would be embarassing.  I don't believe there are any  incentives for SJU playing an out-of-division opponent (regional rankings, playoff selection) aside from ticket sales/media mentions.

I'm all about beating the Tommies, but the biggest factor is what is best for the program.

The money is the only thing that would make this thing go. But, even if we were to assume they would keep it going for a decade, I think the money (read: interest) would fade rather quickly given the mismatch in divisions.

If the Tommies-to-D1 thing is as real as it seems, I'd rather see the rivalry go out with a bang in 2020-2021 as opposed to a fizzle 5-10 years from now.

The way to assure this is for the team that remains in D3 (or in IWU's case at the time, dual NAIA/D3) to beat the team moving 'up'.  In 1970, ISU decided it would no longer play us (located 1 mile away), because they were going D2 on the way to D1, so the games would no longer be 'competitive'.  So, by way of saying good-bye, we beat them in the final game ever between the schools, leaving them knowing they not only lost the last game, but would never catch up in the 70+ game series!

retagent

I'll talk to my golf partner, a retired Nestle Exec, and see if he can do something about bringing it back to Nestle under another name. I'm thinking "Clutterdinger"?

formerd3db

Quote from: DuffMan on October 16, 2019, 04:07:45 PM
Aside from revenue, I don't see it as a benefit to either party.  U$T would get nothing out of winning (ooh la la, you beat a D3 team), and a loss to a D3 team would be embarassing.  I don't believe there are any  incentives for SJU playing an out-of-division opponent (regional rankings, playoff selection) aside from ticket sales/media mentions.

I'm all about beating the Tommies, but the biggest factor is what is best for the program.

You don't value the tradition then?  I respectfully disagree with you on this.  Those factors are in essence irrelevant that SJU would be playing an out-of-division opponent because they still have to win the MIAC title to get the AQ for the playoff and the same goes for St. Thomas.  As to St. Thomas beating a DIII team, so what-again, St. Johns is no bottom or middle tier team in DIII as well as it comes back to the history and tradition of the series/rivalry. 

Those of you who are alumni of either school, obviously come at this from a different perspective than me as an outsider.  Appreciate your opinion though.       
"When the Great Scorer comes To mark against your name, He'll write not 'won' or 'lost', But how you played the game." - Grantland Rice

OzJohnnie

Quote from: formerd3db on October 16, 2019, 07:05:23 PM
Quote from: DuffMan on October 16, 2019, 04:07:45 PM
Aside from revenue, I don't see it as a benefit to either party.  U$T would get nothing out of winning (ooh la la, you beat a D3 team), and a loss to a D3 team would be embarassing.  I don't believe there are any  incentives for SJU playing an out-of-division opponent (regional rankings, playoff selection) aside from ticket sales/media mentions.

I'm all about beating the Tommies, but the biggest factor is what is best for the program.

You don't value the tradition then?  I respectfully disagree with you on this.  Those factors are in essence irrelevant that SJU would be playing an out-of-division opponent because they still have to win the MIAC title to get the AQ for the playoff and the same goes for St. Thomas.  As to St. Thomas beating a DIII team, so what-again, St. Johns is no bottom or middle tier team in DIII as well as it comes back to the history and tradition of the series/rivalry. 

Those of you who are alumni of either school, obviously come at this from a different perspective than me as an outsider.  Appreciate your opinion though.       

This made me chuckle.  Well, you Johnnie heathens, don't you value your own tradition?  Come on.  Answer up.  Especially you, DuffMan, as you have a lot to answer for in your woeful contributions to the Johnnie football tradition.
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Mr.MIAC

There are lots of experts here. How many teams that have moved up a division or two have maintained rivalries with lower division teams? I can't think of many, but again, lots of experts here. Any idea?

DuffMan

SJU and SCSU used to play each other in football regularly (cross-town rivals), but that rivalry died long ago.

A tradition unrivaled...
MIAC Champions: 1932, 1935, 1936, 1938, 1953, 1962, 1963, 1965, 1971, 1974, 1975, 1976, 1977, 1979, 1982, 1985, 1989, 1991, 1993, 1994, 1995, 1996, 1998, 1999, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2008, 2009, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2021, 2022
National Champions: 1963, 1965, 1976, 2003

sjusection105

Quote from: jamtod on October 13, 2019, 05:26:27 PM
Interesting consideration for Tommie Johnnie week: who are the biggest transfers from one school to the other?

Obviously we've got our buddy I.A.
Late 90s St John's DE Phil Trier started with a year at St Thomas.
Technically Josh Parks is a transfer through St John's.

Who else?
Brady Beeson circa 2008- was  on roster as SJU Kicker/Punter lost the audition to Russel Gliden (aka Bethel killer)  transferred to and kicked for UST.
As of now they're on DOUBLE SECRET Probation!

formerd3db

#95063
Rev:

No one is claiming to be an expert here (at least I am not.)  I think everyone is simply sharing their thoughts/opinions on this. ::) :)

Edit: for spelling
"When the Great Scorer comes To mark against your name, He'll write not 'won' or 'lost', But how you played the game." - Grantland Rice

Retired Old Rat

#95064
UMD moved from the MIAC to D2 in the mid 70's. I don't think any of the MIAC schools continued playing them. I think SJU had a decent rivalry with UMD over the years.

Concordia Moorhead played D2 Moorhead State D2 for many years. Not certain why they stopped.
   
National Champions: 1963, 1965, 1976, 2003

Retired Old Rat

Quote from: DuffMan on October 16, 2019, 09:11:56 PM
SJU and SCSU used to play each other in football regularly (cross-town rivals), but that rivalry died long ago.

St. Cloud State sucked. They got tired of losing to a D3 school.  It was a fun rivalry, especially since we won most of the games. My first Johnnie game was at St. Cloud in 1974.
   
National Champions: 1963, 1965, 1976, 2003

Pat Coleman

Catholic and Georgetown played a series for 20 years when both were at the D-III level, but when Georgetown went I-AA non-scholarship, they dropped the series.
Publisher. Questions? Check our FAQ for D3f, D3h.
Quote from: old 40 on September 25, 2007, 08:23:57 PMLet's discuss (sports) in a positive way, sometimes kidding each other with no disrespect.

jamtod

Other folks articulated the reasons for and against continuing Tommie Johnnie so I don't have much to add. I'd like to see it continue IF we go Pioneer League and see several benefits to it and limited downside (again, assuming non scholarship D1).

Anyway, my big questions for Saturday are:
* Can St Thomas adapt on defense to limit Erdmanns quick passing game? Does this mean actually getting home on pressure, better coverage? Going to need all of this.
* How does Dolan deal with a strong defense and the pressure he will undoubtedly feel? Against UW-EC pressure, he looked a bit frazzled at times but hopefully has grown since then.
* Health: will Parks and Loeffler be back? Typically in big games, we will see a significant dose of our primary RBs, although FB Molina carried a load at Target Field. J-Rob wasn't healthy in that game, and the other RBs didn't have great games.

OzJohnnie

Anyway, my big questions for Saturday are:
* Can St Thomas adapt on defense to limit Erdmanns quick passing game? Does this mean actually getting home on pressure, better coverage? Going to need all of this.


Blitz him and he dumps early.  Play coverage and he pin-points you long.  Do both (as per UMHB) and he still almost beats you (and I reckon he will next time if given another shot).  The Johnnies will play five wide a lot, stretching the Tommie D and pretty much demanding man-on-man coverage.  I reckon the Toms need to get pressure with a four man rush, a five in once in a while.  But the real trick will be to score early, score fast and score often. Put scoreboard pressure on the offence.

* How does Dolan deal with a strong defense and the pressure he will undoubtedly feel? Against UW-EC pressure, he looked a bit frazzled at times but hopefully has grown since then.

Tommies will be hoping that Dolan puts on his man-pants this game because he will be feeling pressure.  Tommie receiver #6 is pretty dangerous so you would think he sees a lot of double coverage.  Dolan will need the patience and skill to move down his selections.  If the Johns get to him early and get him rattled it could get ugly.  Biggest performance of his life yet for this game.

* Health: will Parks and Loeffler be back? Typically in big games, we will see a significant dose of our primary RBs, although FB Molina carried a load at Target Field. J-Rob wasn't healthy in that game, and the other RBs didn't have great games.

If fumbly is in for this game then I'm happy.  :)

Less the runners than the O-line I think.  Those boys have got to control the LoS for the Toms to win.  When you beat us at Target, it was the O-line play that was demoralising.  It kept coming and we couldn't break it.  UWEC caught your boys sleeping.  They better have a good does of smelling salts before this game


But I don't think anyone will be sleeping this one.  It's a big game.  All will be ready to play and to turn out their best.  I hope it's clean and decisive.



Tommies Suck              Tommies Suck              Tommies Suck              Tommies Suck              Tommies Suck              Tommies Suck             
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skunks_sidekick

Wading in here.  Greetings ROR!  Great to see you alive, kicking, saving lives, and living the dream.

Here's hoping SJU can beat the hated Tommies, UWW stays the course, and when the playoff smoke clears SJU at Mount, and UWW at MHB for a semi.  That would literally be the semi's of all semi's. 

All SJU fans, there WILL be a party of all parties if that would ever happen.  Mrs. SS says you are all welcome....to stay at any hotel you can find!   ;D