FB: Minnesota Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

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art76

The final Top 25 is posted here: http://www.d3football.com/top25/2014/final

MIAC Teams:

12. St. John's
16. St. Thomas
30. Bethel
33. Concordia Moorhead

I think they got the top eight teams correctly, but I would have put them in this order:

1. UW-Whitewater
2. Wartburg
3. Mount Union
4. Linfield
5. John Carroll
6. Wheaton
7. Mary Hardin-Baylor
8. Wesley
You don't have a soul. You are a soul.
You have a body. - C.S. Lewis

SagatagSam

Quote from: OzJohnnie on December 21, 2014, 05:15:43 PM
Can I just say: I'm really getting bored of the UWW/MUC lockout.  Come on Johnnies, you're doing it for all DIII.

Help us Gary Fasching


You're our only hope
Sing us a song, you're the piano man
Sing us a song tonight
Well, we're all in the mood for a melody
And you've got us feelin' alright.

art76

MIAC players on the D3Football All-American Teams

First Team Offense:
St. John's, Sam Sura,

Second Team Offense:
Bethel, Bubba Friedlund
St. Thomas, T.J. Woodrow

Second Team Specialist:
Bethel, Brandon Marquardt

Third Team Offense:
Gustavus Adolphus, Matt Boyce

Honorable Mention Offense:
St. John's, Ross Carlson
You don't have a soul. You are a soul.
You have a body. - C.S. Lewis

AO

What's all this business about the lack of parity in college football?

Div III   Carleton MN   beat   Hamline   13 - 6
Div III   Hamline   beat   Augsburg   28 - 27
Div III   Augsburg   beat   Bethel MN   62 - 61
Div III   Bethel MN   beat   Concordia Mhd   27 - 17
Div III   Concordia Mhd   beat   St John's MN   23 - 14
Div III   St John's MN   beat   WI River Falls   27 - 8
Div III   WI River Falls   beat   S Dakota Tech   43 - 28
Div II   S Dakota Tech   beat   Wm Jewell   62 - 44
Div II   Wm Jewell   beat   Missouri S&T   34 - 27
Div II   Missouri S&T   beat   St Joseph's IN   14 - 13
Div II   St Joseph's IN   beat   Valparaiso   31 - 10
Div I - FCS   Valparaiso   beat   Butler   17 - 3
Div I - FCS   Butler   beat   Stetson   49 - 41
Div I - FCS   Stetson   beat   Marist   22 - 14
Div I - FCS   Marist   beat   Jacksonville   17 - 16
Div I - FCS   Jacksonville   beat   San Diego   35 - 18
Div I - FCS   San Diego   beat   W New Mexico   23 - 17
Div II   W New Mexico   beat   Ft Lewis   24 - 17
Div II   Ft Lewis   beat   CSU-Pueblo   23 - 22
Div II   CSU-Pueblo   beat   Sam Houston St   47 - 21
Div I - FCS   Sam Houston St   beat   McNeese St   38 - 22
Div I - FCS   McNeese St   beat   Northwestern LA   35 - 28
Div I - FCS   Northwestern LA   beat   Louisiana Tech   30 - 27
Div I - FBS   Louisiana Tech   beat   W Kentucky   59 - 10
Div I - FBS   W Kentucky   beat   Bowling Green   59 - 31
Div I - FBS   Bowling Green   beat   Indiana   45 - 42
Div I - FBS   Indiana   beat   Missouri   31 - 27
Div I - FBS   Missouri   beat   Arkansas   21 - 14
Div I - FBS   Arkansas   beat   Mississippi   30 - 0
Div I - FBS   Mississippi   beat   Alabama   23 - 17

Pat Coleman

Quote from: art76 on December 22, 2014, 08:23:00 AM
The final Top 25 is posted here: http://www.d3football.com/top25/2014/final

MIAC Teams:

12. St. John's
16. St. Thomas
30. Bethel
33. Concordia Moorhead

I think they got the top eight teams correctly, but I would have put them in this order:

1. UW-Whitewater
2. Wartburg
3. Mount Union
4. Linfield
5. John Carroll
6. Wheaton
7. Mary Hardin-Baylor
8. Wesley

If Mount Union had gotten blown out in the Stagg Bowl I could have seen another No. 2 team, and we've done that in the past (say, last year). But Mount Union was competitive and I wouldn't advocate for anyone else as No. 2.

Now, I'd agree on No. 3, and about five other voters agreed with me, but I'd recommend listening to the final podcast for more about that.
Publisher. Questions? Check our FAQ for D3f, D3h.
Quote from: old 40 on September 25, 2007, 08:23:57 PMLet's discuss (sports) in a positive way, sometimes kidding each other with no disrespect.

Mr. Ypsi

I agree on Wartburg over Linfield for #3 (Linfield had the best single win [@UMHB], but to me that is more than matched by the loss to Willamette).  I would also slightly quibble about 7 and 8 (Wheaton's only loss was by 2 AT JCU, and JCU's only losses were by 7 and 8 both AT UMU; there is nothing there that suggests Wheaton would have ever fallen behind UMU by 70-0!).

From 9 on down my ballot differs quite a bit from d3football's poll, but no serious complaints - from 9 thru at least 35 you could almost throw darts! ;)

wartknight

Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 22, 2014, 01:43:19 PM
I agree on Wartburg over Linfield for #3 (Linfield had the best single win [@UMHB], but to me that is more than matched by the loss to Willamette).  I would also slightly quibble about 7 and 8 (Wheaton's only loss was by 2 AT JCU, and JCU's only losses were by 7 and 8 both AT UMU; there is nothing there that suggests Wheaton would have ever fallen behind UMU by 70-0!).

From 9 on down my ballot differs quite a bit from d3football's poll, but no serious complaints - from 9 thru at least 35 you could almost throw darts! ;)
I am definately bias, but I would have the Knights no lower than 3! They pushed the Hawk D unlike has been seen in a while.
Had Schrader not gone down, I believe the hardware would be in the Wav town!!
"Talent is God given. Be humble. Fame is man-given. Be grateful. Conceit is self-given. Be careful." John Wooden

art76

Quote from: Pat Coleman on December 22, 2014, 12:10:32 PM
Quote from: art76 on December 22, 2014, 08:23:00 AM
The final Top 25 is posted here: http://www.d3football.com/top25/2014/final

MIAC Teams:

12. St. John's
16. St. Thomas
30. Bethel
33. Concordia Moorhead

I think they got the top eight teams correctly, but I would have put them in this order:

1. UW-Whitewater
2. Wartburg
3. Mount Union
4. Linfield
5. John Carroll
6. Wheaton
7. Mary Hardin-Baylor
8. Wesley

If Mount Union had gotten blown out in the Stagg Bowl I could have seen another No. 2 team, and we've done that in the past (say, last year). But Mount Union was competitive and I wouldn't advocate for anyone else as No. 2.

Now, I'd agree on No. 3, and about five other voters agreed with me, but I'd recommend listening to the final podcast for more about that.

Pat, and others,

As you and Keith have said enumerable times, there is parity at the top - and of the top 4 or 5 teams, none of them "blow out" each other if they had played. Having watched and listened to as many of the final games as was possible for me to do this year, I have put forth this alternative ranking based on those observations. In particular, if Wartburg and Mount Union were to play when both teams are healthy, Wartburg wins the game. Reality is, Wartburg is not as deep in the roster as Whitewater or Mount Union.

Side note, because that is the reality, that the next tier of teams behind the perennial purple powers is not as deep may be the "real reason" they continue to stay at the top. If you were to match up the first team players on two given squads, and let them have at it, we'd be able to better determine "who's better." It is conjecture and speculation at best the way we have to do it now - not that I'm complaining, just laying it out.

So back to my reasoning, if you go down my list, at least in my mind, the team above the team below would win more times than lose if they met in real life. I'm not giving as much credence to final scores, it's more intuitive (I can't believe I just said that!) - a gut feeling, as it were. I do firmly believe Wartburg was the team to beat in the play-offs this year, and Whitewater did it. Kudos to them and that's why they are ranked #1 on my list. If it were possible for both these teams to meet 3 or 4 or 5 times in a season, I think Wartburg wins the majority. They were that good. Hence, they would also beat Mount Union in the same manner.

Moving down my list, I'm not really sure what to make of the Linfield - Mount Union match-up. And because Mount Union did make it to the final, I gave them the nod. John Carroll is really almost as good as Mount Union, and likewise Wheaton was almost as good as John Carroll, so their positions are not really too disputable. Mary Hardin-Baylor was soundly defeated by Linfield and Wesley got hammered by the machine. I do think that Wesley could not beat anyone above them, at least this year.

So, for whatever it's worth, that's why I ranked them thus. Others will put more weight in other things like statistics or performance against a common foe, but I'm going more by what I've seen and heard about the squads as the season has unfolded.

And please, anyone else reading this, feel free to chime in with your thoughts.

Have a very Merry Christmas all!
You don't have a soul. You are a soul.
You have a body. - C.S. Lewis

DuffMan

The nice part about D3 football is that we know who is best because they prove it on the field.  While it may seem worthwhile to squabble over who deserves #3 or #4, I don't see the point.  There is no trophy for third place.

A tradition unrivaled...
MIAC Champions: 1932, 1935, 1936, 1938, 1953, 1962, 1963, 1965, 1971, 1974, 1975, 1976, 1977, 1979, 1982, 1985, 1989, 1991, 1993, 1994, 1995, 1996, 1998, 1999, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2008, 2009, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2021, 2022
National Champions: 1963, 1965, 1976, 2003

OldAuggie

Quote from: art76 on December 23, 2014, 07:44:16 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on December 22, 2014, 12:10:32 PM
Quote from: art76 on December 22, 2014, 08:23:00 AM
The final Top 25 is posted here: http://www.d3football.com/top25/2014/final

MIAC Teams:

12. St. John's
16. St. Thomas
30. Bethel
33. Concordia Moorhead

I think they got the top eight teams correctly, but I would have put them in this order:

1. UW-Whitewater
2. Wartburg
3. Mount Union
4. Linfield
5. John Carroll
6. Wheaton
7. Mary Hardin-Baylor
8. Wesley

If Mount Union had gotten blown out in the Stagg Bowl I could have seen another No. 2 team, and we've done that in the past (say, last year). But Mount Union was competitive and I wouldn't advocate for anyone else as No. 2.

Now, I'd agree on No. 3, and about five other voters agreed with me, but I'd recommend listening to the final podcast for more about that.

Pat, and others,

As you and Keith have said enumerable times, there is parity at the top - and of the top 4 or 5 teams, none of them "blow out" each other if they had played. Having watched and listened to as many of the final games as was possible for me to do this year, I have put forth this alternative ranking based on those observations. In particular, if Wartburg and Mount Union were to play when both teams are healthy, Wartburg wins the game. Reality is, Wartburg is not as deep in the roster as Whitewater or Mount Union.

Side note, because that is the reality, that the next tier of teams behind the perennial purple powers is not as deep may be the "real reason" they continue to stay at the top. If you were to match up the first team players on two given squads, and let them have at it, we'd be able to better determine "who's better." It is conjecture and speculation at best the way we have to do it now - not that I'm complaining, just laying it out.

So back to my reasoning, if you go down my list, at least in my mind, the team above the team below would win more times than lose if they met in real life. I'm not giving as much credence to final scores, it's more intuitive (I can't believe I just said that!) - a gut feeling, as it were. I do firmly believe Wartburg was the team to beat in the play-offs this year, and Whitewater did it. Kudos to them and that's why they are ranked #1 on my list. If it were possible for both these teams to meet 3 or 4 or 5 times in a season, I think Wartburg wins the majority. They were that good. Hence, they would also beat Mount Union in the same manner.

Moving down my list, I'm not really sure what to make of the Linfield - Mount Union match-up. And because Mount Union did make it to the final, I gave them the nod. John Carroll is really almost as good as Mount Union, and likewise Wheaton was almost as good as John Carroll, so their positions are not really too disputable. Mary Hardin-Baylor was soundly defeated by Linfield and Wesley got hammered by the machine. I do think that Wesley could not beat anyone above them, at least this year.

So, for whatever it's worth, that's why I ranked them thus. Others will put more weight in other things like statistics or performance against a common foe, but I'm going more by what I've seen and heard about the squads as the season has unfolded.

And please, anyone else reading this, feel free to chime in with your thoughts.

Have a very Merry Christmas all!
I agree with your top two art. Wartburg looked like they were on a mission this fall, when AUG moved down field and finally got in range to kick a field goal the players that gave up the yardage for Wartburg were so frustrated you would have thought they lost the game. That attitude with the weapons they had made me say now three times on here that the only team that could beat them was Whitewater. If Wartburg did not lose Schrader v Whitewater they might just win that game. Hard for me to say this because I have never have seen MU other than on ESPN a few years ago v UST and then back in 2003 v SJU. Linfield, never. The rest of your top 5; no chance that I know what they are like as teams. I just know a talented, very focused football team when I see one. 
MIAC champions 1928, 1997

BDB

Quote from: DuffMan on December 23, 2014, 08:18:08 AM
The nice part about D3 football is that we know who is best because they prove it on the field.  While it may seem worthwhile to squabble over who deserves #3 or #4, I don't see the point.  There is no trophy for third place.

+K

hazzben

Quote from: art76 on December 23, 2014, 07:44:16 AM
In particular, if Wartburg and Mount Union were to play when both teams are healthy, Wartburg wins the game. Reality is, Wartburg is not as deep in the roster as Whitewater or Mount Union.

Art, I don't necessarily disagree with slotting Warburg at #2. But I think it's a stretch to say it's a black and white deal that if Warburg were to play Mount, Warburg is the clear favorite.

Teams match up differently. Warburg was very physical up front and were a good matchup v. UWW. But could Warburg have matched up as well against Mounts athleticism? Maybe, but none of us know for sure.

It's fun to debate, and again, I don't necessarily disagree with the bulk of your post. But none of us can say definitively who would win between those two teams. If you'd asked me prior to their game, who wins between Linfield and UMHB, I'd have definitely put my money on UMHB at home. So would most of D3 I'd wager. But the result was a different thing all together.

But, like Duff said, we know, definitively, that Whitewater is #1 and proved it on the field against great competition, within their conference and a brutal West Region.

DuffMan

Quote from: hazzben on December 23, 2014, 10:44:51 AM
But, like Duff said, we know, definitively, that Whitewater is #1 and proved it on the field against great competition, within their conference and a brutal West Region.

...and we know, definitively, that SJU is better than U$T and Bethel because they proved it. :)

A tradition unrivaled...
MIAC Champions: 1932, 1935, 1936, 1938, 1953, 1962, 1963, 1965, 1971, 1974, 1975, 1976, 1977, 1979, 1982, 1985, 1989, 1991, 1993, 1994, 1995, 1996, 1998, 1999, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2008, 2009, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2021, 2022
National Champions: 1963, 1965, 1976, 2003

hazzben

Quote from: DuffMan on December 23, 2014, 11:18:22 AM
Quote from: hazzben on December 23, 2014, 10:44:51 AM
But, like Duff said, we know, definitively, that Whitewater is #1 and proved it on the field against great competition, within their conference and a brutal West Region.

...and we know, definitively, that SJU is better than U$T and Bethel because they proved it. :)

trying to think of a comeback ... yeah, well, when's the last time you beat us in wrestling!!  :P  ;D

OzJohnnie

The Vikings suck.  We all know this.  But this last weekend's loss was so sucky that I don't think It can ever be beat.  It is the nadir of suck.  There is no way to lose that could possibly suck more.

So let's lift our glasses and give three cheers to the Queens of Suck: Huzzah! Huzzah! Huzzah!
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