Spring Practices

Started by Kuiper, July 20, 2022, 04:47:57 PM

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Kuiper

Before Summer ends and fall practices began, I thought I would raise a topic about spring practices (outside the context of the 21st Century Model proposal or anything like that).  One of the major structural distinctions between D1 and D3 soccer is the amount of time you can devote to spring practices and games.  I think D3 schools can now hold 15 practice days, one of which can include games (and many schools have multiple games on that day to get everyone playing time), as compared with something like 45 days and 5-6 games in D1.  Both of these, of course, are a sharp difference from what many of these kids are used to in their clubs, where they often play close to year-round with shorter breaks interspersed throughout rather than going large periods of time without the sport.  With field houses and futsal facilities, soccer can be year-round almost anywhere.

My understanding, however, is that NESCAC prohibits its soccer teams from playing in the Spring.  Is that just games or any coach-organized practices or games?  If the latter, do captain's practices fill the void for players who are available or does space and weather make it largely impossible to do much more than strength and conditioning + some late night futsal at some or most of the schools?  I know there are some advantages to this policy for purposes of enabling internships and study abroad opportunities, and it certainly hasn't hurt NESCAC schools in terms of competitive success in the NCAA tourney, but I'm just trying to get the lay of the land.

Do other schools/leagues refrain from any organized spring practices? 

Conversely, are some D3 schools known for having a particularly strong spring program and/or a culture and history of well-organized captain's practices when coaches cannot be there, including the facilities to support it without battling other sports?  What do those practices look like in terms of frequency/length etc?

SimpleCoach

I have heard that NESCAC is going back on the spring training.  Not sure this is true but heard it from a pretty reliable coach.

SC.

Kuiper

Quote from: SimpleCoach on July 21, 2022, 06:16:08 PM
I have heard that NESCAC is going back on the spring training.  Not sure this is true but heard it from a pretty reliable coach.

SC.

Thanks SC.  That would be an interesting development.  I just heard an assistant coach at a NESCAC school mention the prohibition in a talk with prospective recruits, but he probably wasn't someone who would be in the know if changes were afoot.  I wonder if the change in heart was because it was hurting them with some students in recruiting or whether facility improvements had made it no longer necessary.

College Soccer Observer

Quote from: Kuiper on July 20, 2022, 04:47:57 PM
Before Summer ends and fall practices began, I thought I would raise a topic about spring practices (outside the context of the 21st Century Model proposal or anything like that).  One of the major structural distinctions between D1 and D3 soccer is the amount of time you can devote to spring practices and games.  I think D3 schools can now hold 15 practice days, one of which can include games (and many schools have multiple games on that day to get everyone playing time), as compared with something like 45 days and 5-6 games in D1.  Both of these, of course, are a sharp difference from what many of these kids are used to in their clubs, where they often play close to year-round with shorter breaks interspersed throughout rather than going large periods of time without the sport.  With field houses and futsal facilities, soccer can be year-round almost anywhere.

My understanding, however, is that NESCAC prohibits its soccer teams from playing in the Spring.  Is that just games or any coach-organized practices or games?  If the latter, do captain's practices fill the void for players who are available or does space and weather make it largely impossible to do much more than strength and conditioning + some late night futsal at some or most of the schools?  I know there are some advantages to this policy for purposes of enabling internships and study abroad opportunities, and it certainly hasn't hurt NESCAC schools in terms of competitive success in the NCAA tourney, but I'm just trying to get the lay of the land.

Do other schools/leagues refrain from any organized spring practices? 

Conversely, are some D3 schools known for having a particularly strong spring program and/or a culture and history of well-organized captain's practices when coaches cannot be there, including the facilities to support it without battling other sports?  What do those practices look like in terms of frequency/length etc?

Middlebury had organized practices this year for the first time.  They did not have any games or scrimmages, but I know I was surprised to see that they could actually work with the coaching staff in an organized fashion this spring.

Another Mom

I believe W&L has a strong spring season,  in the sense that it's super organized and focused on working on a particular area. I can't speak to frequency etc as ahem, I have a boy, and he doesn't share every detail with me.

Kuiper

#5
NCAA just passed a proposal that seems pretty significant in the context of a player's experience in D3 soccer.  They are now allowing 24 coach-led practice days in the Spring, instead of 16. Still only one game day, but that's a pretty big increase.

https://twitter.com/ncaadiii/status/1614290110027005952?s=46&t=NNzZNlqUIM-E-tq-G6v9jg

Newenglander

interesting on the change - wonder if NESCAC will allow it.......

Kuiper

Quote from: Newenglander on January 16, 2023, 08:15:00 PM
interesting on the change - wonder if NESCAC will allow it.......

As you see upthread, College Soccer Observer reported that Middlebury was having organized practices last Spring and Simple Coach mentioned this summer that NESCAC was going back on spring practices.  Not sure what is going to happen this Spring among NESCAC schools, but I believe this NCAA change is for the 2023-2024 year, so it wouldn't increase this Spring's practice days to 24 regardless.

My guess is that for some NESCAC players, the absence of spring practices is one of the attractions of the league, since they believe it allows them to do internships and semester abroad programs (I say they "believe," because there are probably NESCACs where the culture of captain's practices is stronger than others and there may be some pressure to participate because of that culture, which could be reinforced by captain's reports to the coaches).  The weather and limited field house space can also make spring practice difficult anyway, although the fact that the new NCAA rule also allows for more flexibility in terms of when practices are scheduled can mitigate that to some degree.

For players who want to replicate something closer to their year-round club practice schedule, 24 days rather than 16 or zero may start to push them toward non-NESCAC schools.  My guess is that will be a school-to-school determination, though, and some schools will try to sell that "advantage" in recruiting.  I know some people have reacted to the change by arguing that they should have increased the games allowed, rather than practices, since they believe no players really care about more practices, but I based on my conversations with lots of players, the ones who want spring practices crave the regular schedule practices provide.  It keeps them on task, creates a positive routine, and is a good social and mental health outlet.  Captain practices at many schools are far inferior to coach-led practices at accomplishing all of that.  Players would ideally like to see more games at the end of that spring "season" too, but this change is essentially cost-free for the schools, while adding games would increases costs.

EnmoreCat

I hear what you are saying Kuiper, but I do think in terms of the extra practices I can't imagine the prospect of extra ones, particularly without more games involved, would be that big a deal.  At my son's former D1 school, they are well and truly back into training now and he described what he experienced last Spring as super tough, as they are working very hard every day.  Whilst that's great if you have aspirations, it comes at the expense of academics.  He is looking forward to a more relaxed spring. 

I do like SC's idea of elongating the Fall season and think it has great merit, but I am less convinced about the real benefits of more spring time.

Kuiper

Quote from: EnmoreCat on January 17, 2023, 01:44:21 PM
I hear what you are saying Kuiper, but I do think in terms of the extra practices I can't imagine the prospect of extra ones, particularly without more games involved, would be that big a deal.  At my son's former D1 school, they are well and truly back into training now and he described what he experienced last Spring as super tough, as they are working very hard every day.  Whilst that's great if you have aspirations, it comes at the expense of academics.  He is looking forward to a more relaxed spring. 

I do like SC's idea of elongating the Fall season and think it has great merit, but I am less convinced about the real benefits of more spring time.

It obviously depends upon the person, but my sense is it's a bigger deal to recruits who are comparing D1 and D3 since the difference between what you are allowed to do in the Spring is the most tangible, objective, difference between schools at each level.  Even for recruits, it depends upon what kind of club environment you came from, since MLS Next is at least 4, if not more, days a week, plus games, while other platforms might still only be 2 and 3 (and that can cut both ways, the former might prefer less and the latter might prefer more).  After they arrive at a school and they experience the academic and social environment, some players may be happy to have less practices, although I think some of those that want less might still prefer fewer games and practices per week over a longer period rather than non-stop for a couple of months and then nothing for the rest of the year.  I also think there are serious differences in how D1 programs approach spring practices (similar to the differences in D3 teams).  I think there tend to be more happy mediums at higher academic D1s, but even that is probably an over-generalization.

Chargers96

I'm not a fan of more spring practices.  I can tell you many D3 players don't relish 7 am practice and no meaningful games in the spring.  A big draw to D3 for many players is that they get to be STUDENT athletes.  I think the NCAA made a mistake with this one.

Newenglander

Quote from: Kuiper on January 17, 2023, 12:21:41 PM
Quote from: Newenglander on January 16, 2023, 08:15:00 PM
interesting on the change - wonder if NESCAC will allow it.......

As you see upthread, College Soccer Observer reported that Middlebury was having organized practices last Spring and Simple Coach mentioned this summer that NESCAC was going back on spring practices.  Not sure what is going to happen this Spring among NESCAC schools, but I believe this NCAA change is for the 2023-2024 year, so it wouldn't increase this Spring's practice days to 24 regardless.

My guess is that for some NESCAC players, the absence of spring practices is one of the attractions of the league, since they believe it allows them to do internships and semester abroad programs (I say they "believe," because there are probably NESCACs where the culture of captain's practices is stronger than others and there may be some pressure to participate because of that culture, which could be reinforced by captain's reports to the coaches).  The weather and limited field house space can also make spring practice difficult anyway, although the fact that the new NCAA rule also allows for more flexibility in terms of when practices are scheduled can mitigate that to some degree.

For players who want to replicate something closer to their year-round club practice schedule, 24 days rather than 16 or zero may start to push them toward non-NESCAC schools.  My guess is that will be a school-to-school determination, though, and some schools will try to sell that "advantage" in recruiting.  I know some people have reacted to the change by arguing that they should have increased the games allowed, rather than practices, since they believe no players really care about more practices, but I based on my conversations with lots of players, the ones who want spring practices crave the regular schedule practices provide.  It keeps them on task, creates a positive routine, and is a good social and mental health outlet.  Captain practices at many schools are far inferior to coach-led practices at accomplishing all of that.  Players would ideally like to see more games at the end of that spring "season" too, but this change is essentially cost-free for the schools, while adding games would increases costs.
that wasn't the point - Middlebury practices and SC comments were under COVID rules and not before the formal NCAA expanded spring practice rules were agreed on.

Chargers96

I believe many D3 programs schedule scrimmages with nearby D1 teams for their "game" day.  Curious if anyone has any results/commentary?  Obviously, any "result" has to be taken with a grain of salt.  CNU dropped its game with William and Mary 2-0.  0-0 at half and a back and forth exciting game.  I think CNU had more shots and forced more saves.

Kuiper

I thought I would revive this topic to see if people were able to report how schools/conferences are adjusting to the new rules for spring practices, which took effect in Spring 2024.

As a reminder, under the old rules, D3 soccer programs were limited to 15 coach-led practices (not including trainer-led weightlifting/conditioning sessions not attended by the soccer coaches) over a 5 week period, plus one competition day, which I think technically could include more than 1 game if no one played more than 90 minutes over the games.  No limit on captain's practices.

Starting this spring, the new rules provide that soccer teams can start spring practice as early as Feb 1 (which is actually earlier than D1 and D2, which start Feb. 15) and must conclude no later than 5 weekdays before finals week.  So, they have much longer than 5 weeks.  They may have as many as 24 coach-led practices during that period, but no more than 4 per week.  Same rules for 1 competition day and no limits on trainer (not soccer coach)-led weightlifting and conditioning sessions as well as captain's practices.

What are people hearing/seeing?  Are schools taking advantage of the extra time and practice days this spring?  The extra time period over which to run practices may be somewhat irrelevant at some schools where fields are unavailable or weather makes practice less feasible.  In places like Southern California, they could theoretically run two days a week of coach-led practices for 12 weeks, plus captain's practices and weightlifting and training sessions and basically run a program for almost the entire Spring Semester.  On the other hand, in colder places, they may instead choose to run 4 practices per week over 6 weeks in March/April to have a concentrated 24 practice period with a break in-between for spring break.  And, of course, some schools may simply not choose to use all 24 practices or are sticking to how they've always done spring practices (or not done spring practices) under the prior rules.

Kuiper

Here is some Spring 2024 games involving D3 teams v. D1 teams

The College of New Jersey is playing at DI Monmouth on Sunday, April 7 at 10:00 am

Mary Washington plays at DI Mount St. Mary's on Sunday April 7 at 1 pm

Christopher Newport is hosting DI William & Mary on Friday, April 12 at 6 pm