NESCAC

Started by LaPaz, September 11, 2011, 05:54:52 PM

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blooter442

Quote from: Jump4Joy on December 19, 2015, 01:36:10 PM
NESCAC COY split between coaches from Bowdoin (3-3-4 for #6 NESCAC seed; 11-4-4 [includes NESCAC and NCAA post-season]) and Middlebury (7-2-1 for #2 NESCAC seed; 13-2-2 [includes NESCAC post-season; did not qualify for NCAA post-season]). Bowdoin did win NESCAC tournament, but I believe NESCAC COY is based on regular season performance (?).

National COY to Amherst (9-0-1 for #1 NESCAC seed; 18-1-2 [includes NCAA post-season]).

Who got it right?

Ok, ok, we get it. Can't you just be happy with your national championship? ;)

Mr.Right

Quote from: Jump4Joy on December 19, 2015, 01:36:10 PM
NESCAC COY split between coaches from Bowdoin (3-3-4 for #6 NESCAC seed; 11-4-4 [includes NESCAC and NCAA post-season]) and Middlebury (7-2-1 for #2 NESCAC seed; 13-2-2 [includes NESCAC post-season; did not qualify for NCAA post-season]). Bowdoin did win NESCAC tournament, but I believe NESCAC COY is based on regular season performance (?).

National COY to Amherst (9-0-1 for #1 NESCAC seed; 18-1-2 [includes NCAA post-season]).

Who got it right?

Note: Is it really true that this co-COY is Saward's second from NESCAC? Seems strange for a 31-year vet. Maybe the conference hasn't been awarding it for too long?




Nescac has only been considered a "playing" league since Fall 2000. Before 2000, Nescac existed but was not recognized as an official league and therefore did not get AQ's. This was quite normal for D3 up until the 1990's. Nescac would rely on "Pool C's" to get into the NCAA's from 1993-1999 and they got their fair share of them. Almost as many then as now and with a much smaller NCAA tournament. There are 3 reasons why Saward does not have more COY's.

1. Nescac has only been handing out conference rewards since 2000.
2. Williams absolutely dominated Nescac from 2000-2006 and Amherst has dominated from 2008-present.
3. Middlebury had their BEST 3 year run from 2006-2008 in which they won the NCAA's in 2007 and Saward got his due. They were very good in 2008 but had lost Ftorek and a couple others to graduation and almost got back to the Final 4 but came up short. After 2008 they began a steady fall. Minus a surprising run in 2010 that saw them lose to Bowdoin in the Elite 8 at the buzzer in amazing fashion of which you can catch a glimpse on youtube. That 2010 Midd team overachieved incredibly. They got a good draw and were benefited from Babson beating Williams in the RD32. They have struggled for Midd standards since 2010.

Jump4Joy

Blooter:  ;D
Mr. Right: helpful info. I was wondering if it had to do with the official formation of the conference.

Jump4Joy

Somehow I have picked up two more negative karma points in the days since Christmas?

Wishing positive karma to us all for the new year!

blooter442

An interesting thought I've had recently is how much Bates could really go either way next year, although I had the same thought this past year. I'm tempted to say that next year could be the year that they become NESCAC contenders (not in the same vein as Amherst or Middlebury, but perhaps in the Conn. College category.) They have some talent and their 7-6-3 record last year was their best in quite some time, and they bring back pretty much all of their key players except for Pereira and Polito. They even looked to be in contention for an NCAA bid after starting 5-1-1 and beating Williams in 2OT on the road. In fact, in starting 5-1-1, they eclipsed their number of wins from the year before.

However, they did not finish the season strongly at all, and it was quite telling that they couldn't put a goal past Colby with a NESCAC bid on the line. Obviously, winning a road game can be difficult, especially when it is a "must win," but that's a game that I definitely thought they would win. Another concern was that the week after the Williams win they lost at home to Trinity. There was brightness in flashes for Bates, but the Bobcats lacked the consistency on both sides of the ball to challenge.

One thing to note about Bates is that they have some good talent in Knoth, Merchant, and Murphy, but the issue that could rear its ugly head for Bates is its overall lack of height and physicality. For example, those three players — the Bobcats' three key returners, I'd argue — are 5' 8", 5' 10", and 5' 8", respectively. And of its key outfield players, Parsons is the tallest at 6' 1".

Based on returning players only, Bates has an average height of 5' 9.76". Compare that to:

Amherst 6' 0.04"
Bowdoin 5' 11.35"
Hamilton 5' 11.04"
Middlebury 6' 0.21"
Trinity 5' 11"
Tufts 5' 11.59"
Wesleyan 5' 10.74"
Williams 5' 11.54"

Obviously that doesn't take into account people coming in next year, but Bates is the shortest team in the NESCAC*, and is nearly an inch shorter than the next-shortest team, Wesleyan, who is 0.98" taller on average. Knoth and Merchant are quick and skilled, but as I've said before not on the same level as Majumder or Conrad, and I think part of that has to do with their inability to impose themselves up top like those two do. Soccer is very much played on the ground, but in a league where set pieces and physicality are so important, the Bobcats are at a huge disadvantage.

What was different for Bates this year, though, is that it was able to score more than in the past, especially against big teams like Middlebury and Williams. If Bates was able to get Abdi Shariff-Hassan from Lewiston, that would be a huge coup. However, he is also being courted by Dartmouth and other NESCAC suitors. The hometown link could be big, but, with no disrespect to Bates intended, it'd be hard to imagine him not considering destinations elsewhere, especially those more prestigious academically or perhaps boasting a better program than Bates. Regardless, he would be an excellent addition and could make an impact right away, but I don't think he alone would be the difference. It will be up to the whole squad to make the difference if they want to challenge in the NESCAC.

* Heights were not listed on Colby or Conn. College's rosters.

FourMoreYears


FourMoreYears

(sorry for the formatting ... posted in case the above link isn't working or is removed)

Away   Home   Notes/Location      Time   Links
Wednesday, September 7
Norwich    Middlebury    Middlebury, Vt.      4:00 PM   
Saturday, September 10
Hamilton    Bates    Lewiston, Maine      TBA   
Trinity    Williams    Williamstown, Mass.      TBA   
Tufts    Colby    Waterville, Maine      TBA   
Amherst    Bowdoin    Brunswick, Maine      TBA   
Middlebury    Connecticut College    New London, Conn.      TBA   
Saturday, September 17
Colby    Williams    Williamstown, Mass.      TBA   
Bowdoin    Wesleyan    Middletown, Conn.      TBA   
Trinity    Hamilton    Clinton, N.Y.      TBA   
Bates    Tufts    Medford, Mass.      TBA   
Amherst    Middlebury    Middlebury, Vt.      TBA   
Saturday, September 24
Bowdoin    Middlebury    Middlebury, Vt.      TBA   
Connecticut College    Hamilton    Clinton, N.Y.      TBA   
Williams    Amherst    Amherst, Mass.      TBA   
Colby    Trinity    Hartford, Conn.      TBA   
Wesleyan    Bates    Lewiston, Maine      TBA   
Sunday, September 25
Middlebury    Hamilton    Clinton, N.Y.      TBA   
Williams    Bates    Lewiston, Maine      TBA   
Colby    Connecticut College    New London, Conn.      TBA   
Saturday, October 1
Amherst    Tufts    Medford, Mass.      TBA   
Middlebury    Colby    Waterville, Maine      TBA   
Hamilton    Wesleyan    Middletown, Conn.      TBA   
Williams    Connecticut College    New London, Conn.      TBA   
Bates    Trinity    Hartford, Conn.      TBA   
Sunday, October 2
Hamilton    Tufts    Medford, Mass.      TBA   
Bates    Amherst    Amherst, Mass.      TBA   
Trinity    Wesleyan    Middletown, Conn.      TBA   
Tuesday, October 4
Maine Maritime    Colby    Waterville, Maine      TBA   
Saturday, October 8
Hamilton    Amherst    Amherst, Mass.      TBA   
Wesleyan    Colby    Waterville, Maine      TBA   
Tufts    Middlebury    Middlebury, Vt.      TBA   
Connecticut College    Bates    Lewiston, Maine      TBA   
Trinity    Bowdoin    Brunswick, Maine      TBA   
Sunday, October 9
Bowdoin    Colby    Waterville, Maine      TBA   
Saturday, October 15
Colby    Amherst    Amherst, Mass.      TBA   
Bowdoin    Hamilton    Clinton, N.Y.      TBA   
Middlebury    Trinity    Hartford, Conn.      TBA   
Wesleyan    Williams    Williamstown, Mass.      TBA   
Tufts    Connecticut College    New London, Conn.      TBA   
Sunday, October 16
Amherst    Connecticut College    New London, Conn.      TBA   
Wesleyan    Middlebury    Middlebury, Vt.      TBA   
Bowdoin    Williams    Williamstown, Mass.      TBA   
Tufts    Trinity    Hartford, Conn.      TBA   
Bates    Maine Maritime    Castine, Maine      3:00 PM   
Saturday, October 22
Amherst    Wesleyan    Middletown, Conn.      TBA   
Bates    Middlebury    Middlebury, Vt.      TBA   
Connecticut College    Bowdoin    Brunswick, Maine      TBA   
Hamilton    Colby    Waterville, Maine      TBA   
Williams    Tufts    Medford, Mass.      TBA   
Wednesday, October 26
Trinity    Amherst    Amherst, Mass.      TBA   
Middlebury    Williams    Williamstown, Mass.      TBA   
Tufts    Bowdoin    Brunswick, Maine      TBA   
Colby    Bates    Lewiston, Maine      TBA   
Connecticut College    Wesleyan    Middletown, Conn.      TBA   

amh63

FYI, there is a soccer story wrt Milton Rico's training with a pro team in Brazil on the Amherst website

Flying Weasel

#3803
Quote from: amh63 on March 21, 2016, 10:48:05 AM
FYI, there is a soccer story wrt Milton Rico's training with a pro team in Brazil on the Amherst website

Interesting town to go to.  Of all the out-of-the-way places in Brazil, I actually know and have passed through Tubarão numerous times.  In fact, my wife and kids just changed buses in Tubarão on Friday on the way to visit relatives about an hour north of there in Garopaba.  There's some very beautiful beaches along that stretch of coast north from Tubarão up to Garopaba (half of these are in that strecth) that beyond being very scenic are also known for some of the best surfing in Brazil and for annual whale breeding just off shore.

I'm inferring from the article that Rico was trying to make the club's U-20 team as one of the three allowed over-aged players, and he made it to the final week of cuts before being let go.  Whatever the case may be, I'm sure it was a great experience, on and off the field.

Mr.Right

Surprised by this as Rico was IMO the least effective as the years went on at Amherst. I thought his best year was his Sophmore year. Personally, he was a skilled player that Amherst usually bypassed by blasting it over his head but he also had a bit of a dirty streak and certainly will not be missed by Nescac opponents. He sometimes would come in late and hard which some thought to be "dirty" but I just chalked it up to his competitiveness. He is replaceable and is by no means a pro player

Mr.Right

The 5 Out of conference games for Nescac schools are basically finalized for and they are WELL BELOW AVERAGE and frankly disappointing for EVERY Nescac team.

NOTE: I have not seen Wesleyan's schedule yet but did notice they will be playing Swarthmore on their bye week-end so that is promising but I am guessing they dropped Haverford for Swat and that would be a level below.

2 Massive disappointing schedules are, yes you guessed it, Midd and Amherst. Tufts and Williams have the better schedules in the league like last year but even Williams drops a notch as they dump Oneonta for ECONN. It is understandable considering Williams had its worst season in maybe 35 years last year but it maked no sense to me. ECONN will be in Williamstown with 10 men behind the ball and Williams will struggle to break that down instead of playing Oneonta in a free flowing attacking game. Hats off to ECONN for playing half of the Nescac teams as that reminds me of Springfield and WNEC as they used to play about 4-5 Nescac teams each year. I will rate Tufts as the BEST with games at Brandeis and playing Keene St, Gordon and Endicott. Ho-Hum.

However the absolute biggest embarrassment has to be your defending national champion Amherst.

Amherst-----------------They have their usual 5 road non-conference games to pick up max SOS. They drop WNEC, WPI, Elms and Mt St Mary's and pick up Pine Manor, Mt. Ida, Rhode Island College and MIT. New England College stays on the schedule. That is such a complete JOKE for the reigning National Champions. Get some nut sack and play some real teams PLEASE. Pine Manor and Mt Ida is just pathetic. RIC and MIT are decent but MIT will be rebuilding next year and should fall off from last years surprise Sweet 16 run. MIT will most likely finish Middle of the pack in NEWMAC next year. The only way Serpone will learn is if they get the Middlebury 2015 syndrome and by the looks of this schedule if Amherst fails to win the Nescac tournament and drops a few key Nescac games they will be left out of the dance.


Midd---------------------This is AGAIN A JOKE and SHOCKING especially after everything that went on in 2015 and being snubbed by the NCAA committee, They will play 4 below average teams( Colby-Sawyer, Norwich, Castleton St and Plymouth St) and 1 very average team in Keene St. Looks like Saward either 1. Could care less about whether he makes the NCAA's or 2. Did not learn from last years scheduling debacle. Hey at least they dropped Southern VT and Green Mountain, two teams that would get beaten by a talented JV High School team full of 8th graders.



Flying Weasel

Pine Manor and Mount Ida?!?!  Good grief. 

Is Serpone really playing the SOS game?  If Pine Manor (10-7-1 in 2015), Mount Ida (12-7-1), Rhode Island (11-7-0), New England Col. (12-8-1), and MIT (18-3-1) can all stay a few games over .500 like last year (a big IF, however), then given those are all away games, that will be OK for Amherst's SOS when combined with their NESCAC slate.  Can't expect an SOS over .600, but approaching .600, sure. And it's an improvement over last year when they had Elms (8-10-1) and Mount St. Mary (5-10-4) on their schedule and still managed a SOS of .573.

Just another reminder that the SOS computation needs re-worked and the home/away multiplier needs to be softened.

Mid-Atlantic Fan

Mr. Right good to hear from you! Is it possible that Midd had already been in a contracted agreement for their schedule or are they playing different teams than last year for non-conference? If so, maybe they already had the schedule pretty much finalized before they knew what happened with NCAA's. To my understanding, scheduling can be tricky because teams are scheduling teams throughout the season before knowing their fate with NCAA's sometimes. It could be hard for them to drop an average team in trying to pick up a good team. One because it may look bad to drop a poor team after having them on the upcoming schedule and may cause bad blood and two because there is still the factor of finding another team in their place...but I would imagine the coach would have that lined up with an agreement to play the better team before dropping the poorer team. Just a possibility? Any insight on this?

Mr.Right

Quote from: Mid-Atlantic Fan on June 15, 2016, 11:22:03 AM
Mr. Right good to hear from you! Is it possible that Midd had already been in a contracted agreement for their schedule or are they playing different teams than last year for non-conference? If so, maybe they already had the schedule pretty much finalized before they knew what happened with NCAA's. To my understanding, scheduling can be tricky because teams are scheduling teams throughout the season before knowing their fate with NCAA's sometimes. It could be hard for them to drop an average team in trying to pick up a good team. One because it may look bad to drop a poor team after having them on the upcoming schedule and may cause bad blood and two because there is still the factor of finding another team in their place...but I would imagine the coach would have that lined up with an agreement to play the better team before dropping the poorer team. Just a possibility? Any insight on this?


I would say this is tru possibly 15% of the time. Usually you have your regular out of conference opponents and you have them lined up during the season and just need to fit in the dates and times for both teams. You also have the "new" out of conference opponents that you MUST atleast get in a Home and Away match but those games might not be decided until December / Jan...However, as far as Midd goes we came up back in the winter with a list of Liberty League teams that are within 2 hours and would be a big boost to their schedule. For example, RPI, Skidmore, SLU, Union etc. Now Liberty League teams play a 8 or 9 game in conference schedule which always means most of those teams are searching for games out of conference and in some instances begging for games to fill their schedule. If Midd called I would guess most of those teams would play, but Midd never called. RPI will play anyone anywhere. Oneonta literally begs good progrmas to play them every year. My point is that this is on Midd and for that matter Amherst. Now both teams have put themselves in another spot  where they better beat 75% of the ranked Nescac teams they will play because neither of them will be playing any ranked teams out of conference.

Mid-Atlantic Fan

Quote from: Mr.Right on June 16, 2016, 08:21:21 PM
Quote from: Mid-Atlantic Fan on June 15, 2016, 11:22:03 AM
Mr. Right good to hear from you! Is it possible that Midd had already been in a contracted agreement for their schedule or are they playing different teams than last year for non-conference? If so, maybe they already had the schedule pretty much finalized before they knew what happened with NCAA's. To my understanding, scheduling can be tricky because teams are scheduling teams throughout the season before knowing their fate with NCAA's sometimes. It could be hard for them to drop an average team in trying to pick up a good team. One because it may look bad to drop a poor team after having them on the upcoming schedule and may cause bad blood and two because there is still the factor of finding another team in their place...but I would imagine the coach would have that lined up with an agreement to play the better team before dropping the poorer team. Just a possibility? Any insight on this?


I would say this is tru possibly 15% of the time. Usually you have your regular out of conference opponents and you have them lined up during the season and just need to fit in the dates and times for both teams. You also have the "new" out of conference opponents that you MUST atleast get in a Home and Away match but those games might not be decided until December / Jan...However, as far as Midd goes we came up back in the winter with a list of Liberty League teams that are within 2 hours and would be a big boost to their schedule. For example, RPI, Skidmore, SLU, Union etc. Now Liberty League teams play a 8 or 9 game in conference schedule which always means most of those teams are searching for games out of conference and in some instances begging for games to fill their schedule. If Midd called I would guess most of those teams would play, but Midd never called. RPI will play anyone anywhere. Oneonta literally begs good progrmas to play them every year. My point is that this is on Midd and for that matter Amherst. Now both teams have put themselves in another spot  where they better beat 75% of the ranked Nescac teams they will play because neither of them will be playing any ranked teams out of conference.

Do you think Amherst is worried about losing Bull, NPL, and others which is why they "dumbed down" there schedule this season? I can't imagine this is the reasoning? But Messiah has done the same thing this year but that was after having a poor year, by their standards, but maybe Amherst is trying to avoid that down year altogether and is hoping to have a lot of wins out of conference to help boost momentum for conference...would be tough to keep the defending champs out if they have a decent record...example Tufts? Just thinking aloud is all  :)