MBB: Centennial Conference

Started by swish, March 01, 2005, 04:51:33 PM

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ronk

Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on December 12, 2018, 02:15:20 PM
Quote from: Swat Fan #1 on December 12, 2018, 02:12:11 PM
Quote from: Gabriel on December 12, 2018, 01:38:59 PM
As this is a slow time for this board, I am going to revisit the topic of financial aid which we addressed a couple of weeks ago---particularly as it relates to the ten teams that participate in Centennial Conference MBB.  First of all, there are the important NCAA rules:

---Financial aid should be the same for all students. Student athletes and non-athletes should be treated the same.
---Athletics staff members are not allowed to have any role in determining institutional aid and are not permitted to modify or arrange
          financial aid packages.
---All institutions must participate in an annual electronic reporting process which compares financial aid packages of freshmen and
          transfer student athletes with those of aid packages of other freshmen and transfers.

How much financial aid can an institution award?  That depends on the institution and what they can afford----but, it must be allocated equitably between athletes and non-athletes.  How much an institution budgets for financial aid is probably related to the size of their endowments---more specifically---their endowment ratios per student.

Thank you for that. Financial aid I believe is a tricky thing to figure out. I know my three kids at three different colleges (Swarthmore, Skidmore, and Ithaca College) had widely different financial aid packages. Swarthmore's was by far the best, especially the last two years. I never realized it was a set rule that athletes and non-athletes had to have the same financial aid package. Is that really a NCAA rule or just they should be somewhat close? Why can a kid who is good at science or playing the tuba allowed to get huge scholarship type aid help, but not a kid with a good jump shot? I am really interested why a good tuba player is ok and a good jump shot is not. Thanks. Good and interesting topic by the way.

I believe the variation for fin-aid between athletes and non-athletes can't be more than 3% in either direction.  Don't quote me on that, but it's something close.  That obviously applies to merit aid.  Need-based is more straightforward.  As long as you've got a standard you use for all students, that goes smoothly as well.

It would seem to violate the 1st rule above that there be no difference.

Gabriel

Endowments are used to smooth out college's cash flow and to fund special chairs, student services, research etc.  Typically they do not touch the principal (corpus) but use some or all of the income from the investments.

Perhaps I should have said the financial aid packages offered athletes at given school should resemble similar packages offered to non-athletes.  Also, Ryan, the variance allowed by the NCAA is 4 percent. Complicated stuff!

noonhooper

 I am not sure the rules you presented are complete enough to cover all the gray areas in the process (some schools award "leadership scholarships" of various sizes that can be given to students (athletes included), for example) and I KNOW that "endowment divided by student body" is not an accurate determination of what is available for students from the school.

JHU and Swat might cover all need without loans but you also have to get into those schools and both of them are very unique places some students might not fit. McDaniel might be cheaper overall but are you guaranteed housing all four years and, if not, how much does housing cost around campus? What is the ROI on an F&M diploma vs one from Gettysburg?

The topic of financial aid is an important component of recruiting and, thus, basketball programs in the conference. I jokingly posted about a month ago that a financial aid discussion could be its own thread but no one would go there, yet here we are. I sure hope we can get some hoops talk going on this board soon.

Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)

Quote from: noonhooper on December 12, 2018, 04:58:18 PM
I am not sure the rules you presented are complete enough to cover all the gray areas in the process (some schools award "leadership scholarships" of various sizes that can be given to students (athletes included), for example) and I KNOW that "endowment divided by student body" is not an accurate determination of what is available for students from the school.

The percentage was instituted to get around the "leadership" loophole.  It's been in place at least a decade, I think.  You can award all the leadership scholarships you want, but if your athletes get 10% more aid than the general student population, you're in big trouble.

I haven't heard about too many aid issues since the rule went in.  It's pretty straightforward and tough to get around without outright fraud.

The bigger issue is simply the amount of aid a school gives to students in general.  I know the Centennial has wide variations with the amount of aid available and it definitely affects athletic recruiting.  Your coaches sometimes have to be great salespeople for the school itself to overcome financial differences.
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BleedingGreen

Hank, please do not make me return from my slumber.

If you bring back your blashpemous and boisterous BS then I shall rise like the Dark Knight.

All the best to everyone during the holidays.

Swat Fan #1

I just wanted to share a stat from the York game the other night that many of you may have missed: Swarthmore out-rebounded York 63-23! By 40 rebounds. I have never heard of a game like that. I also believe York was 4-0 against Centennial teams this year. How in the world do you out-rebound a team by 40 rebounds. I've been involved with basketball for 50 years and I never remember anything like that ever happening at any level.

Rofrog

That's alot Former Scranton head coach Bob Bessior had 43 rebounds in a game that is hard to believe also it was against kings 1955

Dave 'd-mac' McHugh



Finals are done. Teams are getting a break, short or long. Everyone is taking a moment to slow down, enjoy time with family (hopefully), and take a breather.

That's what happens when the first semester comes to a close. Before long, the pressure will increase and games will be in full throat. This break will seem like a distant memory.

In an ode to those leaving work, campus early for the holidays - maybe hitting the road in the afternoon instead of evening, Hoopsville wraps up the finale to the first semester with an early show on Thursday. Dave talks with a couple of programs who have captured his attention. He also chats with a conference commissioner who not only has had a direct impact on the evolution of Division IIII basketball, but is also hanging up his commissioner's hat at the end of the academic year.

And who wants to "buy or sell" women's programs? Gordon Mann joins Dave with his take on the first six weeks of the season. There isn't anyone better to break down DIIII women's hoops, than Gordon.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can tune into Thursday's special edition starting at 2:00 p.m. ET LIVE in the video player above. If you miss any of the show, you can watch it On Demand or listen to the audio-only podcast to the right (available shortly after the show goes off air).

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to hoopsville@d3hoops.com or use any of the social media options to the right.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
-Michelle Filander, No. 25 Austin women's coach
-Gordon Mann, D3hoops.com Deputy Editor ("Buy or Sell")
- Steve Ulrich, Centennial Conference commissioner
-Shanan Rosenberg, Linfield men's coach

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diplomaniac1

Fellow CC Fans -

Greetings! As we approach the new year, we welcome back D III men's basketball after an almost three-week hiatus for exams and the holidays. Hope everyone had a good Christmas holiday. Best wishes to all for 2019.

During the early games this year, freshman guard Watida Mukukula played significant minutes off of the bench for the Diplomats and scored some points. I have not seen his name in the box scores for the games just prior to the holiday. Does anyone know why he "disappeared"? Is he still on the F&M roster? Did he leave the program or is he injured?

Bring on the games again!

Eric

Gabriel

A very entertaining game at the Land of Magic Tourney in Daytona Beach last night as #5 Hamilton outlasted Ursinus 114-101.  Tough to ring up 101 points and still lose but the Bears played well offensively as they shot 54% from the field including 58% from three.  Defense was another story but make no mistake about it Hamilton is very good and worthy of their national ranking. Ursinus was a bit short handed missing two starters but others filled in admirably.

Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)


Headed to see Middlebury at Swarthmore this afternoon.  Should be a good one.
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ronk

Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on December 30, 2018, 07:51:57 AM

Headed to see Middlebury at Swarthmore this afternoon.  Should be a good one.

Hopefully, Williams @ Moravian tomorrow afternoon will be another good one.

Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)


Swat looked pretty good.  Visconti is hurt and didn't play, which was disappointing, but we got to see the Zac O'Dell show - he basically, single-handedly closed an eight point deficit in seemingly ten seconds towards the end of the game.  I think he very well might be the best player in the Mid-Atlantic Region - certainly the first one I'd draft, if such a thing existed.

A lot of sloppiness, but some better play than earlier this season.  I think they'll get there and with just one senior, the future is pretty bright.
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Swat Fan #1

Thanks! Any idea what Visconti's injury is? Big win for Swat! I love O'Dell and have said it before, but the best player on the team by miles is Wiley. He is what makes the team go. I am glad to see some guys really stepped up this year and are playing well. Thanks again for game analysis. My internet was really slow so I just did stats. They don't always tell the tale of the tape.

Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)

Quote from: Swat Fan #1 on January 02, 2019, 01:17:08 PM
Thanks! Any idea what Visconti's injury is? Big win for Swat! I love O'Dell and have said it before, but the best player on the team by miles is Wiley. He is what makes the team go. I am glad to see some guys really stepped up this year and are playing well. Thanks again for game analysis. My internet was really slow so I just did stats. They don't always tell the tale of the tape.

I didn't get specifics, but it didn't seem serious.  "He's banged up" kind of stuff.  He might play tonight.  I don't know.
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