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Division III football (Post Patterns) => Region 1 football (New England-ish) => Topic started by: pg04 on June 30, 2007, 04:13:03 AM

Title: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on June 30, 2007, 04:13:03 AM
On a Basketball board, member Sac began a list of the top 10  individual teams in that conference of the D3hoops.com era.   I thought that this was a pretty cool idea and decided to do it for the entire Eastern Region for the last 8 or so years that D3football.com has existed.  For example, a team that will probably fall on this list is the 2006 St. John Fisher team. 

I will release one team each day, starting on Sunday Night, with an analysis of their season, etc.  You all can come up with your own lists and post them here as well, but I would like for you to wait until I start it on Sunday.

For now, does anyone have nominations that could put a team on my radar that might not otherwise be? 

Hope you will enjoy it!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on June 30, 2007, 04:45:40 PM
I'm stunned.  No one has responded.  i guess you'll have to deal with my picks!!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: cruiser on June 30, 2007, 04:49:22 PM
this years williams squad was very very strong...
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on June 30, 2007, 05:12:06 PM
One of the biggest debates I had was whether to include NESCAC teams or not.  I guess we'll see if your suggestion or other possible candidate Trinity from they years of 2003-2005.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on June 30, 2007, 05:24:49 PM
I think you have to include a number of the Rowan Squads, and definatly this years SJFC team, the 03? RPI team that went to St. Joes... I mean it wouldn't be a east squad without an Ithaca team any suggestings
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Pat Coleman on June 30, 2007, 08:47:15 PM
Does John Carroll 2002 qualify? :)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: rams1102 on June 30, 2007, 09:13:24 PM
As a Montclair fan, it kills me to say this but Rowan is definitely in the mix. The Pacific Lutheran year and the Bridgewater (clock) year.  ::).
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on June 30, 2007, 09:48:34 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on June 30, 2007, 08:47:15 PM
Does John Carroll 2002 qualify? :)

No but the team they played in the regional final might !  ;)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on June 30, 2007, 10:14:59 PM
Quote from: rams1102 on June 30, 2007, 09:13:24 PM
As a Montclair fan, it kills me to say this but Rowan is definitely in the mix. The Pacific Lutheran year and the Bridgewater (clock) year.  ::).

Yes I believe it would be a faulty list if Rowan wasn't on it.   :)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Pat Coleman on June 30, 2007, 10:22:01 PM
At least once.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: theoriginalupstate on July 01, 2007, 10:17:05 AM
What are you looking for?

Success in the regular season?

Success in the Eastern Region playoffs?

Success vs other regions?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 01, 2007, 10:45:16 AM
All of the above but Playoff success would obviously help a team's cause.  You can't be one of the best if you aren't good in the playoffs. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: theoriginalupstate on July 01, 2007, 11:46:46 AM
Quote from: pg04 on July 01, 2007, 10:45:16 AM
All of the above but Playoff success would obviously help a team's cause.  You can't be one of the best if you aren't good in the playoffs. 

I'd put more weight on playoff success vs other regions.....

I've already got my list made up, just waiting on you now....
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: rams1102 on July 01, 2007, 01:15:44 PM
I'm looking since 1999. That's 8 years. To make my list you have to at least go (3) deep in the playoffs. It breaks my heart, but there is only (1) that has done that (4) times, and you know who that is. ::)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: theoriginalupstate on July 01, 2007, 01:46:52 PM
Since you are taking your sweet time with it, I'm releasing mine!

Since 1999 here are my top 10 teams:

1) 1999 Rowan Profs: 12-2
2) 2006 St. John Fisher Cardinals: 12-2
3) 2001 Ithaca Bombers: 11-2
4) 2002 Brockport State Golden Eagles: 10-3
5) 2003 RPI Engineers: 11-2
6) 2000 Springfield Pride: 11-2
7) 2001 Rowan Profs: 11-2
8) 2005 Delaware Valley Aggies: 12-1
9) 2003 Lycoming Warriors 9-2
10) 2000 Union Dutchmen: 9-2

Honorable Mention:
(in no particular order)
2000 Brockport State Golden Eagles: 8-1
1999 Montclair State Red Hawks: 9-2
2004 Rowan Profs: 10-3
2005 Rowan Profs: 11-2
2002 Cortland Dragons: 9-2
1999 Buffalo State Bengals: 7-3
2004 St. John Fisher Cardinals: 10-2
2003 Ithaca Bombers: 10-3
2002 Hobart Statesmen: 8-2
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 01, 2007, 01:56:42 PM
I said starting on Sunday Night...Anyway that's a good list
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 01, 2007, 05:43:03 PM
Quote from: Upstate on July 01, 2007, 01:46:52 PM
Since you are taking your sweet time with it, I'm releasing mine!

Since 1999 here are my top 10 teams:

1) 1999 Rowan Profs: 12-2
2) 2006 St. John Fisher Cardinals: 12-2
3) 2001 Ithaca Bombers: 11-2
4) 2002 Brockport State Golden Eagles: 10-3
5) 2003 RPI Engineers: 11-2
6) 2000 Springfield Pride: 11-2
7) 2001 Rowan Profs: 11-2
8) 2005 Delaware Valley Aggies: 12-1
9) 2003 Lycoming Warriors 9-2
10) 2000 Union Dutchmen: 9-2

Honorable Mention:
(in no particular order)
2000 Brockport State Golden Eagles: 8-1
1999 Montclair State Red Hawks: 9-2
2004 Rowan Profs: 10-3
2005 Rowan Profs: 11-2
2002 Cortland Dragons: 9-2
1999 Buffalo State Bengals: 7-3
2004 St. John Fisher Cardinals: 10-2
2003 Ithaca Bombers: 10-3
2002 Hobart Statesmen: 8-2

I would say 2003 RPI engineers have to be further up the list than that...I would probably take them over the 01 Ithaca team
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: theoriginalupstate on July 01, 2007, 05:52:55 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 01, 2007, 05:43:03 PM
I would say 2003 RPI engineers have to be further up the list than that...I would probably take them over the 01 Ithaca team

3 to 5 I looked at regular season dominance, IC was smoking people, Brockport was also.  RPI had a lot of close games.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 01, 2007, 06:52:01 PM
Ithaca got RIPPED by Rowan that year...Brockport was all defense, only put up points against bad teams and RPI advanced further than all of those teams
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 01, 2007, 07:17:13 PM
The Wait is over, the Countdown begins!!

We start with..

# 10:  2006 Wilkes Colonels

The Basics:

Overall Record:  11-1
End Result: Eliminated by Rowan in 2nd Round of Playoffs.
Key Regular Season Wins:  vs. Delaware Valley 14-7 (OT), @ Widener 23-20
Key Regular Season Losses: NA
Points For: 26.7
Points Against: 8.7

Key Strength:

The team was a defensive force, allowing only 8.7 points a game on average. They also shut out two teams, and only allowed two teams over 20 points: 20 by Widener and 21 by the team that eliminated them, Rowan. 

Key Players:

Offense:

Tom Andreopoulos, RB: 235 attempts for 1285 yards and 12 touchdowns.
Jim Jordan WR: 56 catches for  870 yards and  8 Touchdowns.  This accounted for more  than 40% of the receiving yards.

Defense: 

Anthony Serafin:  11 Sacks (one of the two on the team that had 11) on the season and 57 tackles.
Mike Ferriero:   5 INTs, 1 for a touchdown as well as 28 tackles.

Eventual cause of demise (because let's face it, the Eastern teams always have a demise) :

A 21-14 loss to the Rowan Profs in the 2nd round of the playoffs.  After coming off a 42-0 win over Washington and Lee, and with Rowan seemingly limping in, it seemed like this may be the year that a MAC team would beat Rowan.  Leading 14-7 with about 3 minutes left, and Rowan unable to provide anything offensively, it almost seemed like a certainty.  However, the Rowan magic would be summoned again, and the profs were able to score on 2 short Mike Orihel runs.  Al Karaffa's fumbled snap with 2:47 left while leading 14-13 was the dagger that they could not overcome, as the aforementioned Orihel would score soon after.


Why did they make the list?
:

The basis behind this pick is the regular season performance, sweeping through the MAC and going into the playoffs with an unblemished record.  Also, they very well could have  beaten Rowan (Rowan's 2006 team will not be on this list, by the way) in the 2nd round.  In fact, they probably should have.  Overall, I think the defensive efforts of the Colonels make them deserving of a slot in this ranking, albeit just creeping in over the "honorable mention teams" that will be named after the #1 team is announced.

Agree? Disagree?  That's why I'm doing this during the summer to summon up some football talk.

Next up, the #9 team, tomorrow night. 



Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 01, 2007, 07:48:35 PM
hmmm If a team this good is 10 curious to see what we're gonna get from here....the defense could be one of the all time good ones...and thank god 06 rowan will not be on the list
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: rams1102 on July 01, 2007, 08:28:12 PM
Here are my Top 10 :

1.  Rowan (01)
2.  RPI (03)
3.  Fisher (06)
4.  Rowan (99)
5.  Springfield (00)
6.  B-Port (02)
7.  Rowan (04)
8.  Rowan (05)
9.  Ithaca (01)
10.Union (05)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 01, 2007, 08:37:13 PM
Quote from: rams1102 on July 01, 2007, 08:28:12 PM
Here are my Top 10 :

1.  Rowan (01)
2.  RPI (03)
3.  Fisher (06)
4.  Rowan (99)
5.  Springfield (00)
6.  B-Port (02)
7.  Rowan (04)
8.  Rowan (05)
9.  Ithaca (01)
10.Union (05)

03 RPI
Sept. 13 at Utica •  W 17-6     
Sept. 20 Coast Guard •  W 44-7     
Sept. 27 at Worcester Polytech •  W 34-26     
Oct. 4 Rochester • *  W 47-26     
Oct. 11 Union • *  W 33-7     
Oct. 25 at Hartwick •  W 52-7     
Nov. 1 at St. John Fisher •  W 24-17     
Nov. 8 at St. Lawrence • *  W 55-0     
Nov. 15 Hobart • *  L 43-25     
Nov. 22 Curry #  W 34-20     
Nov. 29 at Springfield #  W 40-34     
Dec. 6 Ithaca #  W 21-16     
Dec. 13 at St. John's #  L 38-10 


06 Fisher
Sat., Sep 2 4:00 pm vs. King's • W, 30-0     
Sat., Sep 9 7:00 pm at Rochester • W, 30-10   
Release
Sat., Sep 16 1:00 pm vs. Mount Ida • W, 55-0   
Release
Sat., Sep 23 1:00 pm vs. Ithaca • * W, 34-10   
Release
Sat., Sep 30 7:00 pm vs. Hartwick • * W, 57-16   
Release
Sat., Oct 7 1:00 pm at Brockport State • W, 27-20     
Sat., Oct 14 1:30 pm at Norwich • * W, 32-0   
Release
Sat., Oct 21 1:00 pm vs. Springfield • * L, 38-55   
Release
Sat., Oct 28 1:30 pm at Utica • * W, 64-0   
Release
Sat., Nov 11 1:00 pm at Alfred • * W, 41-13   
Release
Sat., Nov 18 12:00 pm vs. Union W, 49-21   
FINAL | Release
Sat., Nov 25 12:00 pm at Springfield W, 27-21   
Box score | Release
Sat., Dec 2 12:00 pm vs. Rowan W, 31-0   
Release
Sat., Dec 9 12:00 pm at Mount Union L, 14-26


Fisher should be #2 thanks to romps over Alfred, Union, Rowan and a big win over Ithaca...
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 01, 2007, 08:52:05 PM
Yea that fisher team last year should be ranked above 03 RPI easily.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 01, 2007, 08:57:50 PM
Quote from: Upstate on July 01, 2007, 05:52:55 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 01, 2007, 05:43:03 PM
I would say 2003 RPI engineers have to be further up the list than that...I would probably take them over the 01 Ithaca team

3 to 5 I looked at regular season dominance, IC was smoking people, Brockport was also.  RPI had a lot of close games.

Yea but RPI was running an offense (from what I understand) that gets better as the season goes along and as the players move along that arent used to the system.  Plus it was new and they were getting better as a coaching staff too I would assume.

Just something to take into consideration with that 03' RPI team.

Plus we know its a fact that if it didnt snow Ithaca would have won the game.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: 'gro on July 01, 2007, 09:07:29 PM
very tough call, since winning the east doesn't automatically make you the best team, but winning is everything right? Consider this 'gro taking the easy way out.

1. 1999 Rowan (1st hand exp.... How they lost the stagg, unknown)
2. 2006 SJF (stuck with Mount Union)
3. 2001 Rowan (clock game anyone?)
4. 2003 RPI (beat the springfield juggernaut on the 'fast' turf... and they beat some team from central NY)


Re: Ranking Ithaca '01 and Brockport '02 above RPI '03.... REDICULAS!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 01, 2007, 09:12:05 PM
Quote from: 'gro on July 01, 2007, 09:07:29 PM


Re: Ranking Ithaca '01 and Brockport '02 above RPI '03.... REDICULAS!

I dunno about Brockport '02, but one can assume that Ithaca would have had the same result vs Bridgewater as they would have against Rowan, simliar to the RPI/St Johns score.

But the fact that there were 3 teams clearly better than IC in 01' and that they got smacked so bad should put RPI 03' over Ithaca 01'.

I wouldnt call it redisisculus but I agree
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 01, 2007, 09:15:14 PM
Quote from: 'gro on July 01, 2007, 09:07:29 PM

Re: Ranking Ithaca '01 and Brockport '02 above RPI '03.... REDICULAS!

Ithaca got trounced in the regional final and Brockport lost to JCU--- though it was close.  I think the 3 teams are pretty close when you start stacking up the whole portfolio of work.

A lot of you are pretty close to what I have though. 

I would agree that winning is "mostly" everything. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: rams1102 on July 01, 2007, 10:21:49 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 01, 2007, 08:37:13 PM
Quote from: rams1102 on July 01, 2007, 08:28:12 PM
Here are my Top 10 :

1.  Rowan (01)
2.  RPI (03)
3.  Fisher (06)
4.  Rowan (99)
5.  Springfield (00)
6.  B-Port (02)
7.  Rowan (04)
8.  Rowan (05)
9.  Ithaca (01)
10.Union (05)

03 RPI
Sept. 13 at Utica •  W 17-6     
Sept. 20 Coast Guard •  W 44-7     
Sept. 27 at Worcester Polytech •  W 34-26     
Oct. 4 Rochester • *  W 47-26     
Oct. 11 Union • *  W 33-7     
Oct. 25 at Hartwick •  W 52-7     
Nov. 1 at St. John Fisher •  W 24-17     
Nov. 8 at St. Lawrence • *  W 55-0     
Nov. 15 Hobart • *  L 43-25     
Nov. 22 Curry #  W 34-20     
Nov. 29 at Springfield #  W 40-34     
Dec. 6 Ithaca #  W 21-16     
Dec. 13 at St. John's #  L 38-10 


06 Fisher
Sat., Sep 2 4:00 pm vs. King's • W, 30-0     
Sat., Sep 9 7:00 pm at Rochester • W, 30-10   
Release
Sat., Sep 16 1:00 pm vs. Mount Ida • W, 55-0   
Release
Sat., Sep 23 1:00 pm vs. Ithaca • * W, 34-10   
Release
Sat., Sep 30 7:00 pm vs. Hartwick • * W, 57-16   
Release
Sat., Oct 7 1:00 pm at Brockport State • W, 27-20     
Sat., Oct 14 1:30 pm at Norwich • * W, 32-0   
Release
Sat., Oct 21 1:00 pm vs. Springfield • * L, 38-55   
Release
Sat., Oct 28 1:30 pm at Utica • * W, 64-0   
Release
Sat., Nov 11 1:00 pm at Alfred • * W, 41-13   
Release
Sat., Nov 18 12:00 pm vs. Union W, 49-21   
FINAL | Release
Sat., Nov 25 12:00 pm at Springfield W, 27-21   
Box score | Release
Sat., Dec 2 12:00 pm vs. Rowan W, 31-0   
Release
Sat., Dec 9 12:00 pm at Mount Union L, 14-26


Fisher should be #2 thanks to romps over Alfred, Union, Rowan and a big win over Ithaca...

This is why this is a lot of fun. You could make Fisher #2 and RPI #3, no problem. That's what it's all about. I'm trying to be objective. Like I stated before, I hate to say it but Rowan should be #1. pg04 : Thanks !!!!!!!!! :)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 01, 2007, 10:34:29 PM
Rowan should absolutly be 1, Fisher two just for the fact that they hung around with MUC...very few teams have the ability to say that
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 01, 2007, 10:45:56 PM
You are welcome rams  ;), even though your arch-enemy Rowan is prominently featured in the top 10, as everyone expects.  :P

By the way, I am thinking that once I get to the top 3 I will release those 3 all at once because by then everyone should know the 3 teams remaining  :)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 02, 2007, 09:14:07 PM
I want team #9 come on PG04 stop slackin ;D
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 02, 2007, 09:30:49 PM
Just got home from work!  Hopefully it will be posted within the hour!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: maxpower on July 02, 2007, 09:31:38 PM
You gotta remember pg04 is on the Southern Time Zone....
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 02, 2007, 10:04:03 PM

# 9:  2003 Springfield Pride

The Basics:

Overall Record:  10-1
End Result: Eliminated by RPI in 2nd Round of Playoffs.
Key Regular Season Win:  vs. Ithaca 51-22, @ Montclair State 22-14
Key Regular Season Losses: NA
Points For: 42.4
Points Against: 17.1

Key Strength:

What else could it be on this Pride team? The option offense.  To prove how one-sided that this team was, the team amassed 4384 yards on the ground while only passing for 541.  This is about an 8 to 1 ratio! 

Key Players:

Offense:

Tim Lutgens, FB: 215 rushes for 1307 yards and 14 touchdowns.
Ryan Sylvia, QB:  11-31, 386 yards and 7 TDs passing; 173 rushes for 1122 yards and 20 touchdows on the ground.

Defense: 

Jesse Baker: 70 tackles and 4 interceptions on the season.  He also had 2 sacks.
Mark Bartelini: 36 tackles and 3 sacks.

Eventual cause of demise (because let's face it, the Eastern teams always have a demise) :

A 40-34 loss to the RPI Engineers in the 2nd round of the playoffs.   After getting the first round bye and the "number 1 seed" in the Eastern Region, the Pride looked poised to finally make that deep playoff run.  Well they didn't, they ran into the buzzsaw that were the RPI Engineers.  The dagger in the heart came when holding a 27-17 lead in the 3rd quarter, Springfield's defense disappeared and RPI would score 23 unanswered points to lead 40-27.  Dan Cole would be responsible for all of them, throwing 3 strikes to the endzone for the engineers, including a 58-yard TD completion.  The pride would mount a comeback, but the inability to throw the ball would do them in and they were eliminated.  Another pride team stopped in the 2nd round. 


Why did they make the list?
:

The reason for this pick was once again the regular season performance.  The pride went 10-0 including the thrashing of Ithaca mentioned above.  They literally ran over opponents on their way to the last FFC championship, and to the first round bye.  In the playoffs, though falling short and being the favorite, were almost able to defeat eventual National Semi-finalist RPI.  Overall, I believe the spectacular performance in the regular season and their awesome running game warrants a spot in this list! 

Thoughts???

Next up, the #8 team, tomorrow night. 




Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 02, 2007, 10:53:21 PM
hmmm....this seems like a standard for springfield losing in the second round to the eventual national semi finalists
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 03, 2007, 07:26:09 AM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 02, 2007, 10:53:21 PM
hmmm....this seems like a standard for springfield losing in the second round to the eventual national semi finalists

Dont worry, it's not...9 and 10 were really on the edge with the honorable mention teams, but I felt they were deserving, especially in that year
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 03, 2007, 11:15:05 PM


# 8:  2005 Delaware Valley Aggies

The Basics:

Overall Record:  12-1
End Result: Eliminated by Rowan in Regional Final
Key Regular Season Win:  vs. Wilkes 17-14, vs. Albright 35-34
Key Regular Season Losses: NA
Points For: 34.6
Points Against: 18.2

Key Strength:

A very balanced offensive attack.  2,954 yards of the offense came on the ground for the season, while 3,429 of it came through the air.   That along with a very balanced quarterback came some very successful times in the regular season and deep into the playoffs.

Key Players:

Offense:

Adam Knoblauch, QB: 246-414 for 3307 yards and 29 Touchdowns; 142 rushing attempts for 737 yards and 10 touchdowns
Don Marshall, WR: 59 receptions for 1010 yards  and 9 touchdowns.
Steve Cook, RB: 229 attempts for 1284 yards and 8 touchdowns. 

Defense: 

Justin Porter: 8 sacks, 4 interceptions and 55 tackles.
John Pursell : 108 tackles (50 solo) and 3.5 sacks.

Eventual cause of demise (because let's face it, the Eastern teams always have a demise) :

A 27-21 loss to the Rowan Profs in the 2005 Regional Finals.  The Aggies looked like they were well on their way to an easy victory over Rowan, leading 14-0 at halftime.  However, the dagger would once again fall on the MAC team as the profs would force 3 turnovers on the first 3 Delaware Valley 2nd half possessions, and eventually scoring 27 unanswered points.  Del Val would cut it to a 27-21 lead, and then get deep into Rowan territory, but their comeback attempt would fall short and the Profs were once again off to the National Semifinals, and there was once again disappointment for Del val against Rowan.  This was the second year in a row they had lost to Rowan in the Regional Finals 


Why did they make the list?
:

An undefeated regular season run followed by a nice playoff run gets them on this list.  They were able to defeat Curry and Hobart in the playoffs before finally falling to Rowan.  Also, the overall balance of the team, as mentioned above, makes them a good candidate.  This team probably would have been higher had it's regular season wins been a little more impressive, and if they had a harder run to Rowan in the playoffs.  All and all, I believe this team was worthy of this spot.   

Thoughts??? -- It dried up a little with the Springfield pick!

Next up, the #7 team, tomorrow night. 





Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Tags on July 04, 2007, 12:31:58 AM
PG- Although you're my sworn enemy, I'll give you a +k for the effort you're putting into this.

And also for having the team colors make an appearance - nice touch.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: union89 on July 04, 2007, 03:11:33 AM
Could be just me, but DelVal had to fight tooth and nail to beat Curry in the 1st Round.....no way a team that has to come from behind to beat a marginal NEFC team should even be considered unless they win the East.

VERY weak year for the MAC....
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 04, 2007, 10:02:33 AM
Quote from: Union89 on July 04, 2007, 03:11:33 AM
Could be just me, but DelVal had to fight tooth and nail to beat Curry in the 1st Round.....no way a team that has to come from behind to beat a marginal NEFC team should even be considered unless they win the East.

VERY weak year for the MAC....

That may be so, but how many teams have gone 12-0 in their first 12 games of a season in the East? Not many.  They did beat Hobart and gave Rowan a run for their money which to me means they were in the top tier for that year.  Union of that same year could have been in this same position, but instead become the first team out on my list.  Basically, it's a factor of, "You can only pick 10 teams".  I hope there are disagreements so they can be discussed here.

Tags, thanks, right back at ya. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Reno Hightower on July 04, 2007, 10:19:53 AM
Quote from: pg04 on July 04, 2007, 10:02:33 AM
Quote from: Union89 on July 04, 2007, 03:11:33 AM
Could be just me, but DelVal had to fight tooth and nail to beat Curry in the 1st Round.....no way a team that has to come from behind to beat a marginal NEFC team should even be considered unless they win the East.

VERY weak year for the MAC....

That may be so, but how many teams have gone 12-0 in their first 12 games of a season in the East? Not many.  They did beat Hobart and gave Rowan a run for their money which to me means they were in the top tier for that year.  Union of that same year could have been in this same position, but instead become the first team out on my list.  Basically, it's a factor of, "You can only pick 10 teams".  I hope there are disagreements so they can be discussed here.

Tags, thanks, right back at ya. 

I think that you have to rank the 05' Union squad over the 05' Del Val Squad. I am biased, yes. However, here are my unbiased reasons:

1. Perfect regular seasons match each other. Union beat 2 postseason entrants (RPI and Hobart), I know Del Val beat at least 1 (Wilkes), do not know if they beat another.
2. Both teams beat Hobart so those wins match each other.
3. Yes Del Val went 1 round further in the playoffs than Union but they got to play Curry and Hobart, I think we can all agree that Union would have beaten those 2 teams also given that bracket.
4.Both beat Hobart at home. Union by 10, Del Val by 6.   Both lose to Rowan at home. Union by 4, Del Val by 6.
               Thats the tie breaker. 2 common opponents, both go 1-1 against said opponents. Union beats Hobart by
               more and loses to Rowan by less.


The U should be the pick in this spot.

Hate to critisize you because you are putting a lot into this. But like you said, the controversy is generates is fun!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: rams1102 on July 04, 2007, 10:41:40 AM
pg04,

Great job. To me a great team has to go playoff deep. My top 8 went playoff deep even though (1) did it (4) times. :( Give them credit they deserve it. I forgot Widner (00) & 01) which should at least have  one or two teams in the top ten.  Your 8-9-10 are good teams but not great teams. I think they would definitely make the top 10 honorable mention.

Happy July 4th To All  !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 04, 2007, 10:52:20 AM
Earlier today due to day off and getting out to festivities later....


# 7:  2001 Ithaca Bombers

The Basics:

Overall Record:  11-2
End Result: Eliminated by Rowan in Regional Final
Key Regular Season Win:  vs. Cortland 21-14, vs. Hobart 52-13, @ Springfield 17-16
Key Regular Season Losses: vs. Brockport State 24-22
Points For: 34.3
Points Against: 15.9

Key Strength:

This was another very balanced team offensively.  2231 yards on the ground and 1811 coming through the air (Regular Season Stats).  With this efficient passing attack and hard nosed running, the bombers would only lose once heading into the playoffs. 

Key Players:

Offense:

Brian Young, QB: 112-202 for 1562 yards and 19 touchdowns; Would get injured on 2nd play from scrimmage in first round of playoffs @ Montclair State.

Dave Maddi, RB: 141 attempts for 743 yards and 7 touchdowns. 

Tommy Giorgio: 134 attempts for 506 yards and 10 touchdowns.

Defense: 

Mark McDonough: 103 tackles (41 solo) and 5 sacks.
Anthony Melville:  5 interceptions and 22 tackles

Eventual cause of demise (because let's face it, the Eastern teams always have a demise) :

A crushing 48-0 loss to the Rowan Profs in the 2001 Regional Finals.  Led by back-up quarterback Greg Sheeler, Ithaca never had a chance in this one.  The proverbial dagger fell when the opening gun went off as the bombers never really got going.  The Rowan defense held Ithaca to only 56 yards rushing on 43 attempts, taking away all the balance that I had discussed earlier.  Not only this, but Rowan also had 7 sacks on the game, not allowing Sheeler to feel comfortable behind center.  Once again a Rowan team was heading to the National Semifinals, while Ithaca continued to once again be unable to ascend to the top of the Eastern Region as they had in decades past.


Why did they make the list?
:

As someone mentioned previously on the board, Ithaca was crushing people during the regular season, including a 52-13 win over Hobart and also were able to win the Cortaca Jug.  They also were forced to go on the road for all 3 of their playoff games, winning the first two over Montclair and RPI.  However, they probably would have been further up the last had they not lost in such devastating fashion to Rowan.  This combined with the loss of their Senior Leader was a big blow to the team.  Overall, this Ithaca team was one of the best of the last 8 or so years, and is deserving of it's spot in the top 10. 

Thoughts???

Next up, the #6 team, tomorrow night. 






[/quote]
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 04, 2007, 10:59:57 AM
Quote from: rams1102 on July 04, 2007, 10:41:40 AM
pg04,

Great job. To me a great team has to go playoff deep. My top 8 went playoff deep even though (1) did it (4) times. :( Give them credit they deserve it. I forgot Widner (00) & 01) which should at least have  one or two teams in the top ten.  Your 8-9-10 are good teams but not great teams. I think they would definitely make the top 10 honorable mention.

Happy July 4th To All  !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Actually Widener is a good choice but I thought at that time they were considered part of the South Region.  If this is not the case someone let me know for sure because I will definitely make an addendum and slot them tied with another team that I have put on the list...because they are definitely deserving of at least one slot. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: rams1102 on July 04, 2007, 11:49:41 AM
Quote from: pg04 on July 04, 2007, 10:59:57 AM
Quote from: rams1102 on July 04, 2007, 10:41:40 AM
pg04,

Great job. To me a great team has to go playoff deep. My top 8 went playoff deep even though (1) did it (4) times. :( Give them credit they deserve it. I forgot Widner (00) & 01) which should at least have  one or two teams in the top ten.  Your 8-9-10 are good teams but not great teams. I think they would definitely make the top 10 honorable mention.

Happy July 4th To All  !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Actually Widener is a good choice but I thought at that time they were considered part of the South Region.  If this is not the case someone let me know for sure because I will definitely make an addendum and slot them tied with another team that I have put on the list...because they are definitely deserving of at least one slot. 
[/quote

Good point on Widner. I never could understand why the MAC was part of the South. I always thought of them as an East Team.

Maybe Pat should make the call or maybe put them in with an (*)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 04, 2007, 11:52:11 AM
The MAC moved to the east in 2005 or so.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Ralph Turner on July 04, 2007, 01:02:21 PM
Quote from: pg04 on July 04, 2007, 10:59:57 AM
Quote from: rams1102 on July 04, 2007, 10:41:40 AM
pg04,

Great job. To me a great team has to go playoff deep. My top 8 went playoff deep even though (1) did it (4) times. :( Give them credit they deserve it. I forgot Widner (00) & 01) which should at least have  one or two teams in the top ten.  Your 8-9-10 are good teams but not great teams. I think they would definitely make the top 10 honorable mention.

Happy July 4th To All  !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Actually Widener is a good choice but I thought at that time they were considered part of the South Region.  If this is not the case someone let me know for sure because I will definitely make an addendum and slot them tied with another team that I have put on the list...because they are definitely deserving of at least one slot. 
In the spirit of good-natured off-season boosterism, I encourage you to include the 2000 Widener team, considering that they had one regular season loss to Western Maryland, only to see Western Maryland defeated 32-10 by #1 South Region seed Hardin-Simmons in the second round of the playoffs.

I have ranked that 2000 Hardin-Simmons team as the #5 team in the South in the "Modern" era.  Widener, the Pool A bid from the MAC in 2000, was the beneficiary of a plethora of Pool B bids (Union and Hobart from the Upstate Collegiate AA and Brockport St) being awarded in the upstate NY region before the consolidation of the conferences moved those  Pool B bids to Pool A.  The "East Bracket" that year included Brockport, Hobart, Union, Springfield (Freedom FC), Widener (MAC), Montclair St (NJAC) and Bridgewater St. (NEFC).
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Reno Hightower on July 04, 2007, 02:55:37 PM
Id love to see the site do something like this every year. Like a best teams of the last 10 years every year or something like that. using the same format we are in here. Could be done for each of the 4 regions and for the nation.....would make out of season stop bys at the site more frequent I am sure. You could even go one step further and add different categories like they do with the end of the year reviews (and even added a mid year one last year also I believe?).
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 04, 2007, 06:18:23 PM
Next year, when we've been around for 10 years, I think we might do something along those lines. But I want to stick to the years we have some authority on.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: 'gro on July 04, 2007, 08:03:46 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 04, 2007, 06:18:23 PM
Next year, when we've been around for 10 years, I think we might do something along those lines. But I want to stick to the years we have some authority on.

As long as it's not as tacky and pointless as ESPN's "Who's Now?", I'll look forward to it.  You can, however, authorize the use of Stewart Scott's likeness for the project.

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ibcsports.com%2Ffootball%2F2005%2Fswac%2FStuart-Scott-lg.JPG&hash=35bf6a0abf8b0604230b9bb80e5c7b5e370e980e)
Can I get a D3 "BOOYA!"
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: JT on July 05, 2007, 10:11:08 AM
Here's my list:

1. Rowan 2001 (Best chance for Nat title, ruined by refs)

2. Rowan 1999 (Made school realize that requiring OC and DC to teach Monday and Tuesday before a National Championship game is a bad idea, 2000 becomes the 1st year OC and DC are full time coaches)

3. St. John Fisher 2006 (First team to ever dominate Rowan in the East Region playoffs, hung with Mount Union)

4. Rowan 2005 Hung with Mount Union after losing starting QB, AA Defensive End, and starting RB.

5. RPI 2003 Almost didn't get a bid. Hung with National Champs for a half.  Possibly played better than Mount Union did against St. John's

6. Widener 2000 Got waxed by Mount Union 70-30. I know they weren't in the East in 2000, but they are only 15-20 minutes West of Rowan.

7. Rowan 2004 Pasted by Linfield 52-0

8. Brockport 2002 Great defense.  Lack of offense cost them against OAC's John Carroll

9. Ithaca 2003 Epic battle against RPI in a blizzard

10. Del Valley 2005 Late comeback by Rowan keeps Del Valley from semi-final
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: lewdogg11 on July 05, 2007, 10:21:54 AM
I better see this team as 'Honorable Mention':... ;D 

This team will easily get lost in the mix as Rowan dominated the 1999 year, but an undefeated regular season followed by a valiant showing in RPI's first ever NCAA playoff game, should most definately warrant, at the very least, an Honorable Mention....(Had we gotten a better draw than to host Rowan in the first round, this could have been a playoff run of our own - Which leads to the NCAA 'conspiracy theory' that Rowan was 'punished' by not being able to host a game, but was seemingly given a first time playoff contender...sounds fishy to me...)

1999 RPI Engineers

Kean W 55-7
Coast Guard W 42-3
@WPI W 42-27
Rochester W 34-6
Union W 16-7 (Also LD11's infamous 21st birthday)
@Hartwick W 48-3
@St. John Fisher W 38-7
@St. Lawrence W 32-7
Hobart W 17-6
Rowan L 29-10

This is the Rowan that ended the 54 game Mount Union Winning streak, only to lose in dissapointing fashion, at the hands of Pacific Lutheran.

Just some food for thought...
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: realistic on July 05, 2007, 10:34:53 AM
Great topic....don't know how I missed this until now.  I will try and get points down without going back and imbedding tons of quotes.

as for '06 SJF v '03 RPI...it may be a slight advantage for SJF but it is pretty damn close.  Going into St Johns and going into MUC is pretty similar...and Collageville in mid-december is something else.  The '02 playoffs Coe v SJU was -2 before the windchill the Saturday after Thanksgiving.  Nasty.

JT - I think the '01 Ithaca team has to be taken over the '03.  1) they won at RPI, 2) They won at MSU (with a backup qb and rb)  3)  They had (prob arguably) a better regular season.  Granted they got hammered by rowan but you have that team as #1 and they were on the road and all kinds of beat up at that point.

Finally - unfortunatly I think JT's list is probably closest with 3 Rowan teams.  I know lists like this tend to try and have very few repeats...but those Rowan team were the best.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: JQV on July 05, 2007, 10:36:04 AM
Good list JT.

After looking at all the lists I have to say that I think everyone has the '03 Bombers and the '01 Bombers reversed.  The '03 Bombers had a better showing in the Region Final but I still think the '01 team was better for a few reasons.  1) they got smoked by a really good Rowan team, at Rowan.  2) they were playing with their backup QB in the playoffs whose first career start came in the second round.  3) they were deep as hell.  4) they dominated everyone right up until that Rowan monkeystomping.

They don't deserve too much credit because we really don't know what they could have done with the starter still in at QB.  I just think they should be higher than the '03 team.

EDIT: Good post realistic
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: lewdogg11 on July 05, 2007, 10:38:03 AM
Quote from: JT on July 05, 2007, 10:11:08 AM
Here's my list:

1. Rowan 2001 (Best chance for Nat title, ruined by refs)

2. Rowan 1999 (Made school realize that requiring OC and DC to teach Monday and Tuesday before a National Championship game is a bad idea, 2000 becomes the 1st year OC and DC are full time coaches)

3. St. John Fisher 2006 (First team to ever dominate Rowan in the East Region playoffs, hung with Mount Union)

4. Rowan 2005 Hung with Mount Union after losing starting QB, AA Defensive End, and starting RB.

5. RPI 2003 Almost didn't get a bid. Hung with National Champs for a half.  Possibly played better than Mount Union did against St. John's

6. Widener 2000 Got waxed by Mount Union 70-30. I know they weren't in the East in 2000, but they are only 15-20 minutes West of Rowan.

7. Rowan 2004 Pasted by Linfield 52-0

8. Brockport 2002 Great defense.  Lack of offense cost them against OAC's John Carroll

9. Ithaca 2003 Epic battle against RPI in a blizzard

10. Del Valley 2005 Late comeback by Rowan keeps Del Valley from semi-final

I think this list is good, with the exception of 2003 Ithaca...I think 2003 Springfield definately makes the list over Ithaca in 2003.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: realistic on July 05, 2007, 10:40:34 AM
haha - Jose...spot on.

Lewdogg - I think you are right as well...that Springfield team needs to have a place as well but I still think the '01 Bombers as well as the '03 Pride should be in there.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 05, 2007, 10:47:04 AM
JT,

What were the Rowan OC and DC teaching in 1999?  I mean even Coach Welch teaches at IC even now.  I mean he isn't setting up Chem Labs or anything but he is still teaching classes along with the rest of the IC staff I believe.....
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: 'gro on July 05, 2007, 10:55:11 AM
Springfield '03 should definetly be on this list... they rolled over the regular season competition...

LD is right about the '99 Engineers, they deserve an HM shout. A very cocky Rowan team rolled into troy (players and coaches, yes coaches, doing some jawing on Friday as one team finished practice and the other arrived.) And much like RPI did to Ithaca in '03... Rowan '99 got out to a 14-0 lead and RPI just could make up the difference, falling 29-10.

Then again, the best RPI team I ever saw was 1997, not in the modern era though.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: PBR... on July 05, 2007, 11:16:04 AM
Quote from: pg04 on July 03, 2007, 11:15:05 PM


# 8:  2005 Delaware Valley Aggies

The Basics:

Overall Record:  12-1
End Result: Eliminated by Rowan in Regional Final
Key Regular Season Win:  vs. Wilkes 17-14, vs. Albright 35-34
Key Regular Season Losses: NA
Points For: 34.6
Points Against: 18.2

Key Strength:

A very balanced offensive attack.  2,954 yards of the offense came on the ground for the season, while 3,429 of it came through the air.   That along with a very balanced quarterback came some very successful times in the regular season and deep into the playoffs.

Key Players:

Offense:

Adam Knoblauch, QB: 246-414 for 3307 yards and 29 Touchdowns; 142 rushing attempts for 737 yards and 10 touchdowns
Don Marshall, WR: 59 receptions for 1010 yards  and 9 touchdowns.
Steve Cook, RB: 229 attempts for 1284 yards and 8 touchdowns. 

Defense: 

Justin Porter: 8 sacks, 4 interceptions and 55 tackles.
John Pursell : 108 tackles (50 solo) and 3.5 sacks.

Eventual cause of demise (because let's face it, the Eastern teams always have a demise) :

A 27-21 loss to the Rowan Profs in the 2005 Regional Finals.  The Aggies looked like they were well on their way to an easy victory over Rowan, leading 14-0 at halftime.  However, the dagger would once again fall on the MAC team as the profs would force 3 turnovers on the first 3 Delaware Valley 2nd half possessions, and eventually scoring 27 unanswered points.  Del Val would cut it to a 27-21 lead, and then get deep into Rowan territory, but their comeback attempt would fall short and the Profs were once again off to the National Semifinals, and there was once again disappointment for Del val against Rowan.  This was the second year in a row they had lost to Rowan in the Regional Finals 


Why did they make the list?
:

An undefeated regular season run followed by a nice playoff run gets them on this list.  They were able to defeat Curry and Hobart in the playoffs before finally falling to Rowan.  Also, the overall balance of the team, as mentioned above, makes them a good candidate.  This team probably would have been higher had it's regular season wins been a little more impressive, and if they had a harder run to Rowan in the playoffs.  All and all, I believe this team was worthy of this spot.   

Thoughts??? -- It dried up a little with the Springfield pick!

Next up, the #7 team, tomorrow night. 









d@mn you!! pbr had finally put this game to rest somewhere deep in the back of pbr's mind only to have the wound open again. this was one of the most painful games pbr has ever witnessed...  great lists and input done by everyone on here.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: JT on July 05, 2007, 11:16:21 AM
I can certainly see valid arguements for Springfield 03 and Ithaca 01.  Also, RPI 99 might have gone on a run had they not faced Rowan in round one.  

I would enter these honorable mentions in no particular order:

Ithaca 2001 - could be considered top 10 over Ithaca 2003

Springfield 2003 - could also be considered top 10

RPI 1999 - Hung with a DI transfer laden Rowan team, including a DE taken in the 6th round by the Seahawks.  He was on his way to making the team before a freak accident with a blocking sled ruined his knee (Phat insurance settlement)

Union 2005 - Late comeback by Rowan prevented an Aggie/Dutchman regional final

Wilkes 2006 - Toppled Del Val to take MAC.  Turnovers cost them an opportunity to upset Rowan

Rowan 2002 - 10-0 regular season.  Had no answer for Brockport's DE's.  In the Rowan backfield most of the day.

Union 2000 - came back from a 26-0, losing to Widener 33-26 in the regional finals.







Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: 'gro on July 05, 2007, 11:18:20 AM
2005 Union and Hobart could make their case for a spot or at least an honorable mention Union went undefeated in a year where the Big 3 were all good. Then they beat Ithaca in the playoffs. Hobart beat a tough cortland team in the 1st round.

Both teams lost close 2nd round games (union to a depleated rowan squad, which they could have won I was there and hobart to del val)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: JT on July 05, 2007, 11:28:18 AM
Quote from: Paul Revere (JU) on July 05, 2007, 10:47:04 AM
JT,

What were the Rowan OC and DC teaching in 1999?  I mean even Coach Welch teaches at IC even now.  I mean he isn't setting up Chem Labs or anything but he is still teaching classes along with the rest of the IC staff I believe.....

Not sure.  But player alumni still grouse about defensive and offensive games plans not being set until Wednesday or Thursday.

For the longest time I wondered why Rowan looked so out of synch at the Stagg.  A few years ago some former players gave me the 411.  Even so, I think the Profs could have made better in game adjustments then they did.

Profs were bigger and stronger trying to play finesse with a great finesse team.  Rowan played smash mouth with Mount Union, they should have played smash mouth with PLU. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 05, 2007, 06:29:18 PM
Quote from: JT on July 05, 2007, 11:28:18 AM
Quote from: Paul Revere (JU) on July 05, 2007, 10:47:04 AM
JT,

What were the Rowan OC and DC teaching in 1999?  I mean even Coach Welch teaches at IC even now.  I mean he isn't setting up Chem Labs or anything but he is still teaching classes along with the rest of the IC staff I believe.....

Not sure.  But player alumni still grouse about defensive and offensive games plans not being set until Wednesday or Thursday.

For the longest time I wondered why Rowan looked so out of synch at the Stagg.  A few years ago some former players gave me the 411.  Even so, I think the Profs could have made better in game adjustments then they did.

Profs were bigger and stronger trying to play finesse with a great finesse team.  Rowan played smash mouth with Mount Union, they should have played smash mouth with PLU. 

I dunno, that sounds like a horrible excuse to me.  Therese always time (even in college classes) for a video in class!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: JT on July 05, 2007, 06:42:32 PM
Quote from: Paul Revere (JU) on July 05, 2007, 06:29:18 PM
Quote from: JT on July 05, 2007, 11:28:18 AM
Quote from: Paul Revere (JU) on July 05, 2007, 10:47:04 AM
JT,

What were the Rowan OC and DC teaching in 1999?  I mean even Coach Welch teaches at IC even now.  I mean he isn't setting up Chem Labs or anything but he is still teaching classes along with the rest of the IC staff I believe.....

Not sure.  But player alumni still grouse about defensive and offensive games plans not being set until Wednesday or Thursday.

For the longest time I wondered why Rowan looked so out of synch at the Stagg.  A few years ago some former players gave me the 411.  Even so, I think the Profs could have made better in game adjustments then they did.

Profs were bigger and stronger trying to play finesse with a great finesse team.  Rowan played smash mouth with Mount Union, they should have played smash mouth with PLU. 

I dunno, that sounds like a horrible excuse to me.  Therese always time (even in college classes) for a video in class!

Remember it was finals or pre-finals prep. They played the game.  This didn't come from a fan.  Personally I couldn't see PLU being able to hang, let alone put the smackdown on Rowan. The Profs pushed Mount Union around then all of sudden they forgot what brung 'em to the dance.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 05, 2007, 07:22:25 PM
I love all the input, this is what I was hoping for!! 

To Refresh, 10-7 are as follows:

10.  2006 Wilkes
9.   2003 Springfield
8.  2005 Delaware Valley
7.  2001 Ithaca (I also believe this team is better than the 2003 one)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: theoriginalupstate on July 05, 2007, 07:44:37 PM
Upstate's top 10: Mulligan Style!

1) 1999 Rowan Profs: 12-2
2) 2006 St. John Fisher Cardinals: 12-2
3) 2001 Rowan Profs: 11-2
4) 2003 RPI Engineers: 11-2
5) 2001 Ithaca Bombers: 11-2
6) 2002 Brockport State Golden Eagles: 10-3
7) 2000 Springfield Pride: 11-2
8) 2005 Delaware Valley Aggies: 12-1
9) 2005 Union Dutchmen: 11-1
10) 2003 Lycoming Warriors 9-2
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 05, 2007, 08:11:42 PM
Allright, it had to be done.  JU's top ten eastern region teams of the d3football.com era......

1) 2003 Ithaca Bombers
2) 2006 St. John Fisher Cardinals: 12-2
3) 2001 Rowan Profs: 11-2
4) 2003 blizzard over Troy County, New York
5) 2001 Ithaca Bombers: 11-2
6) 2002 Brockport State Golden Eagles: 10-3
7) 2000 Springfield Pride: 11-2 8
8) 2005 Delaware Valley Aggies: 12-1
9) 2005 Union Dutchmen: 11-1
10) 2003 Lycoming Warriors 9-2

Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 05, 2007, 08:30:48 PM



# 6:  2002 Brockport State Golden Eagles

The Basics:

Overall Record:  10-3
End Result: Eliminated by John Carroll in Regional Final
Key Regular Season Win:  vs. Ithaca 21-0, @ Wesley  17-6
Key Regular Season Losses: @ Cortland State 12-21, vs. TCNJ 7-21
Points For: 21.9
Points Against: 9.4

Key Strength:

Well Anyone who saw this team knows what the answer is.  The stellar defense stood far above the offense on this Regional finalist team.  The team only allowed 122 points on the season, and  allowed less than 3000 total yards on the season. Overall they had 44 sacks on the season. Although the offense sputtered at times, the defense made up for it big time.

Key Players:

Offense:

Adam Webster, RB: 344 attempts for 1473 yards and 7 touchdowns.

Defense: 

Mike Condello: 18 sacks and 66 tackles (33 solo)
Matt Walther: 6 Interceptions, 1 touchdown, 80 tackles (44 solo)
Jeremy Lynch: 5 interceptions and 33 tackles; 2 punt return touchdowns and 1 kick return touchdown.


Eventual cause of demise (because let's face it, the Eastern teams always have a demise) :

A heartbreaking 16-10 overtime loss to John Carroll @ Rochester's Fauver Stadium.  This one is hard to talk about!  Brockport had lost it's top 2 quarterbacks (Including Starter Bob Darnley) and were led by Chet Holcomb. The Golden Eagles lost their last regular season game due to the lack of chemistry, but came into the playoffs and was able to shut out Springfield then upset #1 seed Rowan in an improbable game.  The defense had led them to the finals.  However an impostor to the Eastern Region would take the region.  The dagger came on two different occasions: First, after causing a fumble late in the game, they had their last second winning FG attempt blocked.  Then, on 4th and Inches in overtime, Brockport inexplicably ran Billy Spalik and NOT their workhorse Adam Webster, and was stopped for no gain.  The defense did all it could, but it wasn't enough on this day.


Why did they make the list?
:

They made it farther than any other Eastern Team of that year, and even though they really had trouble on offense a lot of times, their defense was one of the best of the era, if not the best.  Without Darnley, many people (including myself at times) wrote off this team but they showed a tad bit of Cinderella.  Condello had the best year of anyone I had seen at Brockport.  I flip flopped on this team and the Ithaca 2001 team, but decided to put Brockport ahead.  The two teams were really close, however in my book.

Thoughts???

Next up, the #5 team, tomorrow night. 

Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 05, 2007, 08:33:11 PM
Quote from: 'gro on July 05, 2007, 11:18:20 AM
2005 Union and Hobart could make their case for a spot or at least an honorable mention Union went undefeated in a year where the Big 3 were all good. Then they beat Ithaca in the playoffs. Hobart beat a tough cortland team in the 1st round.

Both teams lost close 2nd round games (union to a depleated rowan squad, which they could have won I was there and hobart to del val)

Union is definitely an honorable mention, I think I stated much farther back that they were the last team out.  It was very hard to exclude them. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: dewcrew88 on July 05, 2007, 09:31:36 PM
PG: Check your PMs.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: rams1102 on July 05, 2007, 09:46:36 PM
Quote from: pg04 on July 05, 2007, 08:30:48 PM



# 6:  2002 Brockport State Golden Eagles

The Basics:

Overall Record:  10-3
End Result: Eliminated by John Carroll in Regional Final
Key Regular Season Win:  vs. Ithaca 21-0, @ Wesley  17-6
Key Regular Season Losses: @ Cortland State 12-21, vs. TCNJ 7-21
Points For: 21.9
Points Against: 9.4

Key Strength:

Well Anyone who saw this team knows what the answer is.  The stellar defense stood far above the offense on this Regional finalist team.  The team only allowed 122 points on the season, and  allowed less than 3000 total yards on the season. Overall they had 44 sacks on the season. Although the offense sputtered at times, the defense made up for it big time.

Key Players:

Offense:

Adam Webster, RB: 344 attempts for 1473 yards and 7 touchdowns.

Defense: 

Mike Condello: 18 sacks and 66 tackles (33 solo)
Matt Walther: 6 Interceptions, 1 touchdown, 80 tackles (44 solo)
Jeremy Lynch: 5 interceptions and 33 tackles; 2 punt return touchdowns and 1 kick return touchdown.


Eventual cause of demise (because let's face it, the Eastern teams always have a demise) :

A heartbreaking 16-10 overtime loss to John Carroll @ Rochester's Fauver Stadium.  This one is hard to talk about!  Brockport had lost it's top 2 quarterbacks (Including Starter Bob Darnley) and were led by Chet Holcomb. The Golden Eagles lost their last regular season game due to the lack of chemistry, but came into the playoffs and was able to shut out Springfield then upset #1 seed Rowan in an improbable game.  The defense had led them to the finals.  However an impostor to the Eastern Region would take the region.  The dagger came on two different occasions: First, after causing a fumble late in the game, they had their last second winning FG attempt blocked.  Then, on 4th and Inches in overtime, Brockport inexplicably ran Billy Spalik and NOT their workhorse Adam Webster, and was stopped for no gain.  The defense did all it could, but it wasn't enough on this day.


Why did they make the list?
:

They made it farther than any other Eastern Team of that year, and even though they really had trouble on offense a lot of times, their defense was one of the best of the era, if not the best.  Without Darnley, many people (including myself at times) wrote off this team but they showed a tad bit of Cinderella.  Condello had the best year of anyone I had seen at Brockport.  I flip flopped on this team and the Ithaca 2001 team, but decided to put Brockport ahead.  The two teams were really close, however in my book.

Thoughts???

Next up, the #5 team, tomorrow night. 



We finaly agreed on one. This is a lot of fun, and the post's from everyone are great !!!!!!!!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 05, 2007, 09:49:38 PM
It's odd.... Several people had Brockport at #6.  I guess they fit perfectly in that position. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Reno Hightower on July 05, 2007, 11:24:26 PM
Reno is baffled to see a few of these top 10 having both the 2005 Union and Del Val squads in there but not the 2005 Rowan Profs.....who beat BOTH those teams!!!!!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 06, 2007, 12:01:05 AM
well I hope that we limit it too a max of 3 teams....if not you could make a list and have 1-4or 5 be all rowan.... how much fun is that...I think 06 springfield should get some consideration...they ran over everybody but ithaca...and just ran in to a team of destiny in SJFC
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 06, 2007, 12:45:32 AM
Quote from: Reno Hightower on July 05, 2007, 11:24:26 PM
Reno is baffled to see a few of these top 10 having both the 2005 Union and Del Val squads in there but not the 2005 Rowan Profs.....who beat BOTH those teams!!!!!

Yes, actually that was one thing I noticed with the lists.  We may not have seen Rowan yet on My list, but there is a big dose of them coming.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 06, 2007, 12:47:39 AM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 06, 2007, 12:01:05 AM
well I hope that we limit it too a max of 3 teams....if not you could make a list and have 1-4or 5 be all rowan.... how much fun is that...I think 06 springfield should get some consideration...they ran over everybody but ithaca...and just ran in to a team of destiny in SJFC

2006 did get some consideration.  And about Rowan, if they are deserving of spots they should get them.  If you did the top 10 North Region teams of the last 10 years, how many of them would be Mount Union? At least 8.  That's why the Eastern region is much more interesting.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 06, 2007, 12:58:05 AM
Quote from: pg04 on July 06, 2007, 12:47:39 AM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 06, 2007, 12:01:05 AM
well I hope that we limit it too a max of 3 teams....if not you could make a list and have 1-4or 5 be all rowan.... how much fun is that...I think 06 springfield should get some consideration...they ran over everybody but ithaca...and just ran in to a team of destiny in SJFC

2006 did get some consideration.  And about Rowan, if they are deserving of spots they should get them.  If you did the top 10 North Region teams of the last 10 years, how many of them would be Mount Union? At least 8.  That's why the Eastern region is much more interesting.

in my mind you can not compare MUC and Rowan...MUC has won 9 national titles...they are in a league of their own and often the 2nd 3rd or 4th team in the north could have contended for the national title if Mount was not there
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 06, 2007, 01:03:35 AM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 06, 2007, 12:58:05 AM
Quote from: pg04 on July 06, 2007, 12:47:39 AM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 06, 2007, 12:01:05 AM
well I hope that we limit it too a max of 3 teams....if not you could make a list and have 1-4or 5 be all rowan.... how much fun is that...I think 06 springfield should get some consideration...they ran over everybody but ithaca...and just ran in to a team of destiny in SJFC

2006 did get some consideration.  And about Rowan, if they are deserving of spots they should get them.  If you did the top 10 North Region teams of the last 10 years, how many of them would be Mount Union? At least 8.  That's why the Eastern region is much more interesting.

in my mind you can not compare MUC and Rowan...MUC has won 9 national titles...they are in a league of their own and often the 2nd 3rd or 4th team in the north could have contended for the national title if Mount was not there

I'm not comparing their national prowess to MUC, but in my mind Rowan is deserving of what spots I give to them to come.   You just can't deny Rowan's success in the eastern Region. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Tags on July 06, 2007, 01:34:06 AM
Quote from: pg04 on July 06, 2007, 01:03:35 AM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 06, 2007, 12:58:05 AM
Quote from: pg04 on July 06, 2007, 12:47:39 AM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 06, 2007, 12:01:05 AM
well I hope that we limit it too a max of 3 teams....if not you could make a list and have 1-4or 5 be all rowan.... how much fun is that...I think 06 springfield should get some consideration...they ran over everybody but ithaca...and just ran in to a team of destiny in SJFC

2006 did get some consideration.  And about Rowan, if they are deserving of spots they should get them.  If you did the top 10 North Region teams of the last 10 years, how many of them would be Mount Union? At least 8.  That's why the Eastern region is much more interesting.

in my mind you can not compare MUC and Rowan...MUC has won 9 national titles...they are in a league of their own and often the 2nd 3rd or 4th team in the north could have contended for the national title if Mount was not there

I'm not comparing their national prowess to MUC, but in my mind Rowan is deserving of what spots I give to them to come.   You just can't deny Rowan's success in the eastern Region. 

This is entirely too late to be discussing this.

Also, Tombstone is a fantastic movie - if you hurry you can catch the last half hour on TNT.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 06, 2007, 01:35:36 AM
Quote from: Tags on July 06, 2007, 01:34:06 AM
Quote from: pg04 on July 06, 2007, 01:03:35 AM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 06, 2007, 12:58:05 AM
Quote from: pg04 on July 06, 2007, 12:47:39 AM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 06, 2007, 12:01:05 AM
well I hope that we limit it too a max of 3 teams....if not you could make a list and have 1-4or 5 be all rowan.... how much fun is that...I think 06 springfield should get some consideration...they ran over everybody but ithaca...and just ran in to a team of destiny in SJFC

2006 did get some consideration.  And about Rowan, if they are deserving of spots they should get them.  If you did the top 10 North Region teams of the last 10 years, how many of them would be Mount Union? At least 8.  That's why the Eastern region is much more interesting.

in my mind you can not compare MUC and Rowan...MUC has won 9 national titles...they are in a league of their own and often the 2nd 3rd or 4th team in the north could have contended for the national title if Mount was not there

I'm not comparing their national prowess to MUC, but in my mind Rowan is deserving of what spots I give to them to come.   You just can't deny Rowan's success in the eastern Region. 

This is entirely too late to be discussing this.

Also, Tombstone is a fantastic movie - if you hurry you can catch the last half hour on TNT.

Too late? I've only yet begun to argue! haha. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: rams1102 on July 06, 2007, 08:22:54 PM
pgo4,

Since I have a little time to spare and Clone walked Matsui with the bases loaded,we are all tied at 3. Let's see what the Yankees are made of. We need a sweep or at worst 2 of 3. Posada doubles Yanks 5-3. Colone just yanked. Should be a long night.

Down to D3 Football. 5 picks left. RPI & St. Johns 2-3 or 3-2. The other 3 spots to Rowan. IMHO

End of 3, Yanks up 8-3.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 07, 2007, 04:36:33 PM
Took a little hiatus yesterday...haha, back later with the #5  pick!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 07, 2007, 06:24:22 PM
# 5:  2005 Rowan  Profs

The Basics:

Overall Record:  11-2
End Result: Eliminated by Mount Union in National Semifinals
Key Regular Season Win:  @ Christopher Newport 21-14, @ Cortland State  24-16
Key Regular Season Losses: @ William Paterson 20-19
Points For: 28.5
Points Against: 15.1

Key Strength:

Well for a few games of the season, with Mike Orihel, it was a high powered passing attack.  However, after he got injured, a balanced running attack took hold, and the passing efficiency became much less.  Also, a sack-happy defense was very instrumental in the team's success. 

Key Players:

Offense:

Mike Orihel, QB:  5 games played, 119-176 for 1533 yards and 9 touchdowns. 

Sakeen Wright, WR:  74 receptions for 899 yards and 7 Touchdowns.

Phil Silva, WR: 46 receptions for 681 yards and 9 touchdowns.

Ulysses Encarnacion, RB: 163 rushes for 850 yards and 8 touchdowns.

Defense: 

Randy Tosh: 102 tackles (55 solo), 13 sacks, and 1 interception

Keith Heimerl: 63 tackles (35 solo) 11.5 sacks, and an interception.


Eventual cause of demise (because let's face it, the Eastern teams always have a demise) :

A 19-7 loss to perennial national powerhouse Mount Union.  Rowan had Crushed Wilkes, and squeaked by Union and Delaware Valley to win the Eastern Region and make it to the National Semifinals to face off with the Purple Raiders once again.  Both defenses played well in the contest but Mount Union's was better on this day and held onto the ball for more than 40 minutes.  The profs were only able to muster up 176 yards and were not able to make a comeback after falling behind 14-0. 


Why did they make the list?
:

Winners of the eastern region and not getting blown out by Mount Union gives them this spot on the countdown.  Although they lost their starting quarterback and a consistent passing attack, They were able to persevere with a rushing attack and make it to the showdown with the Purple Raiders.  That combined with a pretty good defense lands them in the top half of the ranking.  Not the best Profs team of the era, but still one of the best of the era. 

Thoughts???

Next up, the #4 team, tomorrow. 


Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 07, 2007, 06:28:51 PM
I must say I'm a little dissapointed that we haven't seen the cardiac kids '04 fisher....for the shear fact that they won so many damn close games...including THE hailmary against Brockport and the Pic against Ithaca marking fisher's first ever victory over the mighty bombers...
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 07, 2007, 06:34:43 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 07, 2007, 06:28:51 PM
I must say I'm a little dissapointed that we haven't seen the cardiac kids '04 fisher....for the shear fact that they won so many damn close games...including THE hailmary against Brockport and the Pic against Ithaca marking fisher's first ever victory over the mighty bombers...

They weren't one of the best teams, they were just lucky.   :),  Just kidding, they were definitely in my thought process but again only 10 teams can fit. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 07, 2007, 06:52:11 PM
so why isn't fisher 1-10 I think some of those 0-10 teams were better than they looked
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 07, 2007, 07:01:33 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 07, 2007, 06:52:11 PM
so why isn't fisher 1-10 I think some of those 0-10 teams were better than they looked

huh? lol
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 07, 2007, 07:30:45 PM
Oh and I like the Cake next to my age in my profile signifying my birthday, It's a nice touch that I hadn't noticed before.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 07, 2007, 10:41:02 PM
Happy birthday PG-04....
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 08, 2007, 12:36:57 AM
Thanks Superman, +K!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Tags on July 08, 2007, 10:13:51 AM
Quote from: pg04 on July 07, 2007, 07:30:45 PM
Oh and I like the Cake next to my age in my profile signifying my birthday, It's a nice touch that I hadn't noticed before.

Happy belated birthday pg
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 08, 2007, 02:16:03 PM
# 4:  2003 RPI  Engineers

The Basics:

Overall Record:  11-2
End Result: Eliminated by St. John's in National Semifinals
Key Regular Season Win:  vs. Union 33-7, @ St. John Fisher 24-17
Key Regular Season Losses: vs. Hobart 25-43
Points For: 33.5
Points Against: 19

Key Strength:

This team was an offensive juggernaut, relying heavily on the passing attack.  The team racked up over 3800 yards of passing, most of them coming from quarterback Dan Cole.  The rushing attack wasn't bad either,  compiling over 1800 yards rushing.

Key Players:

Offense:

Dan Cole, QB:  303-514 for 3679 yards and 40 touchdowns.  Also ran for over 250 yards. 

Flynn Cochran, WR: 109 receptions for 1274 yards and 15 touchdowns.

Otis Williams, RB: 174 rushes for 1104 yards and 6 touchdowns.

Defense: 

Ramses Jimenez: 59 tackles (33 solo) and 9.5 sacks.

Mike Defilippi:  7 interceptions, 78 tackles (48 solo) and 1 sack

Eventual cause of demise (because let's face it, the Eastern teams always have a demise) :

A 38-10 loss to eventual National Champion St. John's.  The engineers had a Cinderella type run in the playoffs, beating Curry 34-20, then winning at Springfield 40-34, and finally winning the East Region Title by beating Ithaca in the famous snow game 21-16.  They certainly had a nice run , and challenged the Johnnies until halftime, even leading 10-7 at one point, but the St. John's defense was able to stay strong, and the Johnnies offense would explode to make the game a blow out.


Why did they make the list?
:

They won the East Region and hung with St. John's for a half in their first ever appearance in the National Semifinals.  That combined with the fact that the offense was extremely potent made this team a shoe-in to be in the top 5 of this list.  The snow game with Ithaca could quite possibly be one of the best in quite a while.   

Thoughts???

Next up, the #3 team
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: lewdogg11 on July 08, 2007, 03:30:01 PM
Quote from: pg04 on July 08, 2007, 02:16:03 PM
They won the East Region and hung with St. John's for a half in their first ever appearance in the playoffs.  That combined with the fact that the offense was extremely potent made this team a shoe-in to be in the top 5 of this list.  The snow game with Ithaca could quite possibly be one of the best in quite a while.   



Wasn't RPI's first ever appearance in the playoffs.  Maybe I misread as first ever appearance vs. St. John's.  But RPI was also in the playoffs in 1999 and 2001.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 08, 2007, 03:31:08 PM
OOps that was meant to read First appearance in National Semifinals, I will edit it.  Thanks.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 08, 2007, 04:29:09 PM
I must say that the 03 RPI team was impressive but lucky....they had quite a scare from the young Fisher squad....but they ysure could pass the ball
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 08, 2007, 04:32:13 PM
I will let any and all RPI posters respond to this one...lol. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: theoriginalupstate on July 08, 2007, 04:39:29 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 08, 2007, 04:29:09 PM
I must say that the 03 RPI team was impressive but lucky....they had quite a scare from the young Fisher squad....but they ysure could pass the ball

That young fisher squad was loaded with seniors (myself included), that game was extremely boring untill the 4th qtr.  Our DE picked off a shuffle pass and took it the distance and w/ less than 2 minutes to play one of our DB's fell and left their WR wide open in the endzone.  then with 5 seconds to go, RPI has the ball on 4th down.  they take the ball and toss it downfield where no one was around resulting in a intentional grounding.  SJF gets the ball back in RPI territory (couldnt do anything with it even with a Pass Interference penalty on RPI), wierdest ending ive seen.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: 'gro on July 08, 2007, 04:46:02 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 08, 2007, 04:29:09 PM
I must say that the 03 RPI team was impressive but lucky....they had quite a scare from the young Fisher squad....but they ysure could pass the ball

The '03 team wasn't lucky, that was the '05 team that beat SJF in the ECAC game.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 08, 2007, 05:46:26 PM
04 fisher was also an impressive but lucky team....
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 08, 2007, 06:05:35 PM
Quote from: 'gro on July 08, 2007, 04:46:02 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 08, 2007, 04:29:09 PM
I must say that the 03 RPI team was impressive but lucky....they had quite a scare from the young Fisher squad....but they ysure could pass the ball

The '03 team wasn't lucky, that was the '05 team that beat SJF in the ECAC game.

Not going to judge whether they were lucky or not, but they needed a TD with 1:22 left to beat Fisher in '03.

http://www.d3football.com/story.php?story=1418
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 08, 2007, 06:07:09 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 08, 2007, 06:05:35 PM
Quote from: 'gro on July 08, 2007, 04:46:02 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 08, 2007, 04:29:09 PM
I must say that the 03 RPI team was impressive but lucky....they had quite a scare from the young Fisher squad....but they ysure could pass the ball

The '03 team wasn't lucky, that was the '05 team that beat SJF in the ECAC game.

Not going to judge whether they were lucky or not, but they needed a TD with 1:22 left to beat Fisher in '03.

http://www.d3football.com/story.php?story=1418

wooo Pat to the rescue
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 08, 2007, 06:18:21 PM
Quote from: 'gro on July 08, 2007, 04:46:02 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 08, 2007, 04:29:09 PM
I must say that the 03 RPI team was impressive but lucky....they had quite a scare from the young Fisher squad....but they ysure could pass the ball

The '03 team wasn't lucky, that was the '05 team that beat SJF in the ECAC game.

Speaking of the 2003 RPI team, did you see how they set up the visitors sideline during the Ithaca game?

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.poy.org%2F60%2F09%2Fphotos%2F0901evanm01.jpg&hash=a6bfcb55d6054779000009b7a6293aaae4726ca8)

Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: union89 on July 08, 2007, 06:22:36 PM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on July 08, 2007, 06:18:21 PM
Quote from: 'gro on July 08, 2007, 04:46:02 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 08, 2007, 04:29:09 PM
I must say that the 03 RPI team was impressive but lucky....they had quite a scare from the young Fisher squad....but they ysure could pass the ball

The '03 team wasn't lucky, that was the '05 team that beat SJF in the ECAC game.

Speaking of the 2003 RPI team, did you see how they set up the visitors sideline during the Ithaca game?

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.poy.org%2F60%2F09%2Fphotos%2F0901evanm01.jpg&hash=a6bfcb55d6054779000009b7a6293aaae4726ca8)




Utah, I love your persistance in ball busting on this one!!!  Sort of like the RPI guys busting the Union boys with the wine and cheese thing.....only difference is, yours NEVER gets old.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: theoriginalupstate on July 08, 2007, 06:30:08 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 08, 2007, 06:05:35 PM
Quote from: 'gro on July 08, 2007, 04:46:02 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 08, 2007, 04:29:09 PM
I must say that the 03 RPI team was impressive but lucky....they had quite a scare from the young Fisher squad....but they ysure could pass the ball

The '03 team wasn't lucky, that was the '05 team that beat SJF in the ECAC game.

Not going to judge whether they were lucky or not, but they needed a TD with 1:22 left to beat Fisher in '03.

http://www.d3football.com/story.php?story=1418

Not trying to make excuses but Senior starting RB Jason Meyers was hindered by a high ankle sprain, FR Mark Robinson was out with a concussion, SO Craig Fitzpatrick suffered a knee sprain.  Our first, second and third string RB's were either out or injured. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 08, 2007, 06:35:24 PM
Quote from: Union89 on July 08, 2007, 06:22:36 PM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on July 08, 2007, 06:18:21 PM
Quote from: 'gro on July 08, 2007, 04:46:02 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 08, 2007, 04:29:09 PM
I must say that the 03 RPI team was impressive but lucky....they had quite a scare from the young Fisher squad....but they ysure could pass the ball

The '03 team wasn't lucky, that was the '05 team that beat SJF in the ECAC game.

Speaking of the 2003 RPI team, did you see how they set up the visitors sideline during the Ithaca game?

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.poy.org%2F60%2F09%2Fphotos%2F0901evanm01.jpg&hash=a6bfcb55d6054779000009b7a6293aaae4726ca8)




Utah, I love your persistance in ball busting on this one!!!  Sort of like the RPI guys busting the Union boys with the wine and cheese thing.....only difference is, yours NEVER gets old.

You know what is really funny about what you said and got me thinking?  

When Im 60 years old, am I still going to be posting on LLPP?  I mean, I just don't ever see myself not comming to this site and checking up on d3football.  Imagine some 20 year old kid comming on here in 2051 and hearing me bust gro's balls about the 2003 IC/RPI playoff game and thinking WTF are these old fogies talkin about?

I mean at my funeral in 2079, is LD11 going to come up to my kids and tell them that Jonny Utah was a good man?  Or are my grandkids going to look in the funeral mass book and say "Hey Ma..who the hell is enginegro?"

Or will I be at a Dutchman Shoes game someday with the boys and we all spot some guy with a  "HOllADAWG LIVES" shirt on?

Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: 'gro on July 08, 2007, 07:01:28 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 08, 2007, 06:05:35 PM
Quote from: 'gro on July 08, 2007, 04:46:02 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 08, 2007, 04:29:09 PM
I must say that the 03 RPI team was impressive but lucky....they had quite a scare from the young Fisher squad....but they ysure could pass the ball

The '03 team wasn't lucky, that was the '05 team that beat SJF in the ECAC game.

Not going to judge whether they were lucky or not, but they needed a TD with 1:22 left to beat Fisher in '03.

http://www.d3football.com/story.php?story=1418

yeah most teams are satisfied with a close score in the final minutes, but not RPI, they go for that mystical thing called the win....      Do you have something you'd like to add Herm?

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.themightymjd.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2006%2F04%2Fherm.jpg&hash=23e94f929193071e7a0a25e7f3210041066cdc62)
You play to WIN the game.... HELLO??
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 08, 2007, 07:12:12 PM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on July 08, 2007, 06:35:24 PM
Quote from: Union89 on July 08, 2007, 06:22:36 PM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on July 08, 2007, 06:18:21 PM
Quote from: 'gro on July 08, 2007, 04:46:02 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 08, 2007, 04:29:09 PM
I must say that the 03 RPI team was impressive but lucky....they had quite a scare from the young Fisher squad....but they ysure could pass the ball

The '03 team wasn't lucky, that was the '05 team that beat SJF in the ECAC game.

Speaking of the 2003 RPI team, did you see how they set up the visitors sideline during the Ithaca game?

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.poy.org%2F60%2F09%2Fphotos%2F0901evanm01.jpg&hash=a6bfcb55d6054779000009b7a6293aaae4726ca8)




Utah, I love your persistance in ball busting on this one!!!  Sort of like the RPI guys busting the Union boys with the wine and cheese thing.....only difference is, yours NEVER gets old.

You know what is really funny about what you said and got me thinking? 

When Im 60 years old, am I still going to be posting on LLPP?  I mean, I just don't ever see myself not comming to this site and checking up on d3football.  I mean, imagine some 20 year old kid comming on here in 2051 and hearing me bust gro's balls about the 2003 IC/RPI playoff game and thinking WTF are these old fogies talkin about?

I mean at my funeral in 2079, is LD11 going to be at my funeral and come up to my kids and tell them that Jonny Utah was a good man?  Or are my grandkids going to look in the funeral mass book and say "Hey Ma..who the hell is enginegro?"

Great stuff. :)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: 'gro on July 08, 2007, 07:27:20 PM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on July 08, 2007, 06:35:24 PM
You know what is really funny about what you said and got me thinking?  

When Im 60 years old, am I still going to be posting on LLPP?  I mean, I just don't ever see myself not comming to this site and checking up on d3football.  I mean, imagine some 20 year old kid comming on here in 2051 and hearing me bust gro's balls about the 2003 IC/RPI playoff game and thinking WTF are these old fogies talkin about?

I mean at my funeral in 2079, is LD11 going to be at my funeral and come up to my kids and tell them that Jonny Utah was a good man?  Or are my grandkids going to look in the funeral mass book and say "Hey Ma..who the hell is enginegro?"

Or will I be at a Dutchman Shoes game someday with the boys and we all spot some guy with a shirt that says "HOllADAWG LIVES" shirt on?

yeah If I was ever going to quit posting I would have done it by now...
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 08, 2007, 07:34:00 PM
In 30-40 years we'll all be the Frank Uible of the Posting boards, with the youngins mocking us for our definition of blazing speed.   ;D


;
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 08, 2007, 08:12:09 PM
With 15,682,304 posts and a karma to match. Meanwhile, the board will have its own server and connection to the backbone. Though I don't know what it will look like in Web 15.0. :)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: lewdogg11 on July 08, 2007, 08:14:32 PM
Quote from: 'gro on July 08, 2007, 07:01:28 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 08, 2007, 06:05:35 PM
Quote from: 'gro on July 08, 2007, 04:46:02 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 08, 2007, 04:29:09 PM
I must say that the 03 RPI team was impressive but lucky....they had quite a scare from the young Fisher squad....but they ysure could pass the ball

The '03 team wasn't lucky, that was the '05 team that beat SJF in the ECAC game.

Not going to judge whether they were lucky or not, but they needed a TD with 1:22 left to beat Fisher in '03.

http://www.d3football.com/story.php?story=1418

yeah most teams are satisfied with a close score in the final minutes, but not RPI, they go for that mystical thing called the win....      Do you have something you'd like to add Herm?

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.themightymjd.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2006%2F04%2Fherm.jpg&hash=23e94f929193071e7a0a25e7f3210041066cdc62)
You play to WIN the game.... HELLO??

Yeah, from reading that article, it sounded like SJF played a lot of teams pretty close that year.  So, in conclusion, I guess everyone who has a narrow victory is pretty lucky.  What???

The 2001-2002 Patriots were pretty lucky too.  BUT, they still won the Super Bowl.  Isn't the 'W' what really counts in sporting events?

And, since the SJF guys seem to have an issue with this, when WAS the last time you beat RPI?  I believe 1993 is the correct answer.  And your overall record is 1-11 from my sources.  Just a thought...
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 08, 2007, 08:17:33 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 08, 2007, 08:12:09 PM
With 15,682,304 posts and a karma to match. Meanwhile, the board will have its own server and connection to the backbone. Though I don't know what it will look like in Web 15.0. :)

I wonder if the Karma number will cause a buffer overflow  :D
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 08, 2007, 08:24:33 PM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on July 08, 2007, 08:14:32 PM
Quote from: 'gro on July 08, 2007, 07:01:28 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 08, 2007, 06:05:35 PM
Quote from: 'gro on July 08, 2007, 04:46:02 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 08, 2007, 04:29:09 PM
I must say that the 03 RPI team was impressive but lucky....they had quite a scare from the young Fisher squad....but they ysure could pass the ball

The '03 team wasn't lucky, that was the '05 team that beat SJF in the ECAC game.

Not going to judge whether they were lucky or not, but they needed a TD with 1:22 left to beat Fisher in '03.

http://www.d3football.com/story.php?story=1418

yeah most teams are satisfied with a close score in the final minutes, but not RPI, they go for that mystical thing called the win....      Do you have something you'd like to add Herm?

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.themightymjd.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2006%2F04%2Fherm.jpg&hash=23e94f929193071e7a0a25e7f3210041066cdc62)
You play to WIN the game.... HELLO??

Yeah, from reading that article, it sounded like SJF played a lot of teams pretty close that year.  So, in conclusion, I guess everyone who has a narrow victory is pretty lucky.  What???

The 2001-2002 Patriots were pretty lucky too.  BUT, they still won the Super Bowl.  Isn't the 'W' what really counts in sporting events?

And, since the SJF guys seem to have an issue with this, when WAS the last time you beat RPI?  I believe 1993 is the correct answer.  And your overall record is 1-11 from my sources.  Just a thought...

I agree, Most teams will have a close game here and there.  Winning them is the important thing. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 08, 2007, 08:41:26 PM
And that Herm Edwards pic is bugging me.  Has that guy ever been a good coach anywhere?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: 'gro on July 08, 2007, 09:39:51 PM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on July 08, 2007, 08:41:26 PM
And that Herm Edwards pic is bugging me.  Has that guy ever been a good coach anywhere?

His career is pretty average 48-48 in the regular season. 4 playoff teams in 6 years. 2-4 in the playoffs.

I think he's a little weird, but as a cheifs fan going from Vermiel to him is business as usual.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: JT on July 08, 2007, 10:03:11 PM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on July 08, 2007, 08:41:26 PM
And that Herm Edwards pic is bugging me.  Has that guy ever been a good coach anywhere?
.
That is the thing.  He is a good coach, but JT feels he'll never make that next step.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: rams1102 on July 09, 2007, 12:48:29 PM
So now we have (3) slots left. Logic should have it as Fisher and Rowan twice. I'm no fan of Springfield, but the 2000 team should be in. They went very deep into the playoffs. Any thoughts?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Tags on July 09, 2007, 12:56:34 PM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on July 08, 2007, 08:14:32 PM
Yeah, from reading that article, it sounded like SJF played a lot of teams pretty close that year.  So, in conclusion, I guess everyone who has a narrow victory is pretty lucky.  What???

The 2001-2002 Patriots were pretty lucky too.  BUT, they still won the Super Bowl.  Isn't the 'W' what really counts in sporting events?

And, since the SJF guys seem to have an issue with this, when WAS the last time you beat RPI?  I believe 1993 is the correct answer.  And your overall record is 1-11 from my sources.  Just a thought...

I would not say all SJF guys feel that way. I'm a Fisher fan, but don't really echo that sentiment that people who score late are lucky. I think Super was speaking on his own there.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 09, 2007, 01:12:21 PM
Quote from: Tags on July 09, 2007, 12:56:34 PM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on July 08, 2007, 08:14:32 PM
Yeah, from reading that article, it sounded like SJF played a lot of teams pretty close that year.  So, in conclusion, I guess everyone who has a narrow victory is pretty lucky.  What???

The 2001-2002 Patriots were pretty lucky too.  BUT, they still won the Super Bowl.  Isn't the 'W' what really counts in sporting events?

And, since the SJF guys seem to have an issue with this, when WAS the last time you beat RPI?  I believe 1993 is the correct answer.  And your overall record is 1-11 from my sources.  Just a thought...

I would not say all SJF guys feel that way. I'm a Fisher fan, but don't really echo that sentiment that people who score late are lucky. I think Super was speaking on his own there.

hold on...you are playing a team that had NEVER had a winning season...and you pic them off with 40 seconds to go...to only give the ball back get a pass interference call and you STILL win the game... I call that lucky...not saying all close games are lucky just some..... Luck always plays into games...a bounce here or there and it's a different game
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 09, 2007, 04:19:00 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 09, 2007, 01:12:21 PM
Quote from: Tags on July 09, 2007, 12:56:34 PM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on July 08, 2007, 08:14:32 PM
Yeah, from reading that article, it sounded like SJF played a lot of teams pretty close that year.  So, in conclusion, I guess everyone who has a narrow victory is pretty lucky.  What???

The 2001-2002 Patriots were pretty lucky too.  BUT, they still won the Super Bowl.  Isn't the 'W' what really counts in sporting events?

And, since the SJF guys seem to have an issue with this, when WAS the last time you beat RPI?  I believe 1993 is the correct answer.  And your overall record is 1-11 from my sources.  Just a thought...

I would not say all SJF guys feel that way. I'm a Fisher fan, but don't really echo that sentiment that people who score late are lucky. I think Super was speaking on his own there.

hold on...you are playing a team that had NEVER had a winning season...and you pic them off with 40 seconds to go...to only give the ball back get a pass interference call and you STILL win the game... I call that lucky...not saying all close games are lucky just some..... Luck always plays into games...a bounce here or there and it's a different game

"RPI got a 22-yard touchdown pass from senior quarterback Dan Cole to junior Dan with just 1:22 left in the fourth quarter to defeat St. John Fisher 24-17 in a Division III football game before 2,684 fans at Growney Stadium. With the victory, the Engineers improve to 6-0. Fisher is now 5-3 with the losses by a total of 11 points.

After an RPI interception with 40 seconds left, Fisher regained the ball with less than two seconds to play. Fisher moved to the RPI 26 on a pass interference call at the goal line. On the ensuing play quarterback Greg Roland threw to Noah Fehrenbach, but the pass was broken up by the Engineers' Mike Defilippi."

That doesnt really sound lucky to me.  The only things that sound lucky to me are that SJF had 2 chances to score in the last 1:22.  But a pass interference on the goal line could have been a big one.  NFL rules and SJF might have been able to tie it up from what it sounds like.



Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: theoriginalupstate on July 09, 2007, 04:34:01 PM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on July 09, 2007, 04:19:00 PM


That doesnt really sound lucky to me.  The only things that sound lucky to me are that SJF had 2 chances to score in the last 1:22.  But a pass interference on the goal line could have been a big one.  NFL rules and SJF might have been able to tie it up from what it sounds like.





Here's the last 1:22 of play after the RPI TD....

R 1-G  R35   PENALTY FISHER personal foul 15 yards to the 50 yardline.
--------------- 2 plays, 60 yards, TOP 00:15 ---------------

               Ed Garcia kickoff 50 yards to the FISHER0, touchback.
      F 1-10 F20   ST. JOHN FISHER drive start at 01:22 (4th).
      F 1-10 F20   Greg Roland pass complete to Dan Whelehan for 6 yards to the FISHER26
                   (Tim Frame).
      F 2-4  F26   TEAM rush to the FISHER24, fumble by TEAM recovered by FISHER Greg
                   Roland at FISHER24.
      F 3-6  F24   Greg Roland pass intercepted by Mike Defilippi at the FISHER40, Mike
                   Defilippi return 0 yards to the FISHER40.
--------------- 3 plays, 4 yards, TOP 00:36 ---------------

  R 1-10 F40   RPI drive start at 00:46 (4th).
  R 1-10 F40   TEAM rush for no gain to the FISHER40.
  R 2-10 F40   Timeout St. John Fisher, clock 00:43.
  R 2-10 F40   TEAM rush for loss of 4 yards to the FISHER44.
  R 3-14 F44   Timeout St. John Fisher, clock 00:39.
  R 3-14 F44   TEAM rush for loss of 2 yards to the FISHER46.
  R 4-16 F46   Timeout RPI, clock 00:05.
  R 4-16 F46   Dan Cole pass incomplete, PENALTY RPI intentional grounding 13 yards to
               the RPI41.
--------------- 4 plays, minus 19 yards, TOP 00:00 ---------------

      F 1-10 R41   Greg Roland pass incomplete to Dan Whelehan, PENALTY RPI pass
                   interference 15 yards to the RPI26, 1ST DOWN FISHER, NO PLAY.
      F 1-10 R26   Greg Roland pass incomplete to Noah Fehrenbach (Mike Defilippi).
      F 2-10 R26   End of 2nd half, clock 00:00.
--------------- 1 plays, 15 yards, TOP 00:00 ---------------


RPI got lucky, Cole/coaches made a boneheaded play/decision to throw the ball to no one w/ no time left to give SJF the ball at their own 41.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: union89 on July 09, 2007, 04:45:06 PM
Quote from: Upstate on July 09, 2007, 04:34:01 PM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on July 09, 2007, 04:19:00 PM


That doesnt really sound lucky to me.  The only things that sound lucky to me are that SJF had 2 chances to score in the last 1:22.  But a pass interference on the goal line could have been a big one.  NFL rules and SJF might have been able to tie it up from what it sounds like.





Here's the last 1:22 of play after the RPI TD....

R 1-G  R35   PENALTY FISHER personal foul 15 yards to the 50 yardline.
--------------- 2 plays, 60 yards, TOP 00:15 ---------------

               Ed Garcia kickoff 50 yards to the FISHER0, touchback.
      F 1-10 F20   ST. JOHN FISHER drive start at 01:22 (4th).
      F 1-10 F20   Greg Roland pass complete to Dan Whelehan for 6 yards to the FISHER26
                   (Tim Frame).
      F 2-4  F26   TEAM rush to the FISHER24, fumble by TEAM recovered by FISHER Greg
                   Roland at FISHER24.
      F 3-6  F24   Greg Roland pass intercepted by Mike Defilippi at the FISHER40, Mike
                   Defilippi return 0 yards to the FISHER40.
--------------- 3 plays, 4 yards, TOP 00:36 ---------------

  R 1-10 F40   RPI drive start at 00:46 (4th).
  R 1-10 F40   TEAM rush for no gain to the FISHER40.
  R 2-10 F40   Timeout St. John Fisher, clock 00:43.
  R 2-10 F40   TEAM rush for loss of 4 yards to the FISHER44.
  R 3-14 F44   Timeout St. John Fisher, clock 00:39.
  R 3-14 F44   TEAM rush for loss of 2 yards to the FISHER46.
  R 4-16 F46   Timeout RPI, clock 00:05.
  R 4-16 F46   Dan Cole pass incomplete, PENALTY RPI intentional grounding 13 yards to
               the RPI41.
--------------- 4 plays, minus 19 yards, TOP 00:00 ---------------

      F 1-10 R41   Greg Roland pass incomplete to Dan Whelehan, PENALTY RPI pass
                   interference 15 yards to the RPI26, 1ST DOWN FISHER, NO PLAY.
      F 1-10 R26   Greg Roland pass incomplete to Noah Fehrenbach (Mike Defilippi).
      F 2-10 R26   End of 2nd half, clock 00:00.
--------------- 1 plays, 15 yards, TOP 00:00 ---------------


RPI got lucky, Cole/coaches made a boneheaded play/decision to throw the ball to no one w/ no time left to give SJF the ball at their own 41.


I agree, according to that rundown, Cole could have run around a bit and taken a knee.  Brutal clock management in that SJF got two 'free' plays. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 09, 2007, 04:51:53 PM
I dont see anything in there that would seem that anything would be lucky. 

I mean SJF should be considered the lucky ones that RPI gave them back the ball with such great field position! Plus they recovered their own fumble before that?

And I still dont get one thing.  RPI runs the ball and with 5 seconds left calls a timeout?
---------

R 3-14 F44   TEAM rush for loss of 2 yards to the FISHER46.
R 4-16 F46   Timeout RPI, clock 00:05.
---------

Maybe it was a bonehead play by RPI but that doesnt make anything lucky.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: union89 on July 09, 2007, 05:04:34 PM
In all honesty, I jumped into that one late and was referring to brutal play....not actually luck.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 09, 2007, 06:59:38 PM
Quote from: rams1102 on July 09, 2007, 12:48:29 PM
So now we have (3) slots left. Logic should have it as Fisher and Rowan twice. I'm no fan of Springfield, but the 2000 team should be in. They went very deep into the playoffs. Any thoughts?


Once again, I have only 10 slots, and the 2000 springfield team was definitely in the consideration.   I don't disagree that they may have deserved better than I gave them.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: rams1102 on July 09, 2007, 08:17:10 PM
Quote from: pg04 on July 09, 2007, 06:59:38 PM
Quote from: rams1102 on July 09, 2007, 12:48:29 PM
So now we have (3) slots left. Logic should have it as Fisher and Rowan twice. I'm no fan of Springfield, but the 2000 team should be in. They went very deep into the playoffs. Any thoughts?


Once again, I have only 10 slots, and the 2000 springfield team was definitely in the consideration.   I don't disagree that they may have deserved better than I gave them.
[/quot

How about 2003 Montclair Team. It was a pretty good team. Did they ever cross your radar during your deliberations. ;)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 09, 2007, 08:47:25 PM
# 3:  2006 St. John Fisher  Cardinals

The Basics:

Overall Record:  12-2
End Result: Eliminated by Mount Union in National Semifinals
Key Regular Season Win:  vs. Ithaca 34-10, @ Alfred 41-13
Key Regular Season Losses: vs. Springfield 38-55
Points For: 37.8
Points Against: 13.7

Key Strength:

The team had a very good offensive attack outscoring their opponents 529-192, led by star running back Mark Robinson, and seconded by James Reile.  Rob Kramer was also no slouch in at quarterback.  All in all, this team was very hard to stop!

Key Players:

Offense:

Mark Robinson, RB: 222 rushes for 1570 yards and 24 touchdowns.

Rob Kramer, QB: 151-233 passing for 2019 yards and 22 touchdowns. 

Sean Nowicki: 44 receptions for 746 yards and 6 touchdowns.

Defense: 

Gene Lang: 147 tackles (67 solo) and 3 sacks.

Eventual cause of demise (because let's face it, the Eastern teams always have a demise) :

A 26-14 loss to eventual National Champion Mount Union.  Fisher had shown its dominance of the Eastern Region for 2006, starting out with a whitewash of Union 49-21 in the first Round.  They followed that up with a 27-21 win at Springfield to avenge the regular season loss.  Then, they had a 31-0 rout of Rowan to win the Eastern Region.  That left them with Superpower Mount Union and quite frankly not many gave the Cardinals a chance.  However, they showed strong, trailing only 9-7 at halftime, leaving East Regioners wondering if finally the East would break through again.  Mount Union would use a steady dose of running back Nate Kmic in the 2nd half to slowly pull far enough away to win the game.  Kmic would run for an astounding school-record 371 yards in the game.   This was too much for the Cardinals as their run came to an end.



Why did they make the list?
:

They did a very good job of blowing away most of their opponents during the regular season, and also showed their true worth by crushing both Union and Rowan in the playoffs.  They also did a good job of restoring some credibility to the eastern region once again.  Overall the strong offensive attack and spectacular play was deserving of this top 3 spot.   Only one school in the Eastern Region can say they had better teams during this era, and in my opinion that could be debated too...


Thoughts???

Next up, the #2 and #1 teams.  Which Rowan team grabs the number 1 spot?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 09, 2007, 09:09:56 PM
"Eventual cause of demise (because let's face it, the Eastern teams always have a demise) :"

Can we change this phrase to........

"Eventual cause of demise (because let's face it, the Eastern teams have always have a demise over the last 16 years....) :
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: 'gro on July 09, 2007, 09:31:48 PM
me thinks the '06 cards got the snub... for conversation purposes? Most everyone had the final 3 1. Rowan 99, 2. SJF '06, 3. Rowan '01

'06 SJF spanked union, revenged a springfield loss, stompped rowan, then hung with mount union.  All from a program that a few years ago couldn't find their ass with both hands.  Impressive in my book.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: RunningRobby25 on July 09, 2007, 09:42:17 PM
Quote from: 'gro on July 09, 2007, 09:31:48 PM
me thinks the '06 cards got the snub... for conversation purposes? Most everyone had the final 3 1. Rowan 99, 2. SJF '06, 3. Rowan '01

'06 SJF spanked union, revenged a springfield loss, stompped rowan, then hung with mount union.  All from a program that a few years ago couldn't find their ass with both hands.  Impressive in my book.

I'm gonna have to agree w/ 'gro on this one... of course I am a bit biased ::)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: union89 on July 09, 2007, 09:46:36 PM
Quote from: RunningRobby25 on July 09, 2007, 09:42:17 PM
Quote from: 'gro on July 09, 2007, 09:31:48 PM
me thinks the '06 cards got the snub... for conversation purposes? Most everyone had the final 3 1. Rowan 99, 2. SJF '06, 3. Rowan '01

'06 SJF spanked union, revenged a springfield loss, stompped rowan, then hung with mount union.  All from a program that a few years ago couldn't find their ass with both hands.  Impressive in my book.

I'm gonna have to agree w/ 'gro on this one... of course I am a bit biased ::)


Make that 3......SJF's run last year was truly special AND dominant.  To roll over a very strong Union team and then totally crush the defending Eastern power was amazing.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 09, 2007, 09:46:48 PM
I will say this, the top 3 teams were pretty close, However, of the two Rowan teams, 1 made it to the National Final and the other SHOULD have went to the national final (Clockgame--- I've seen it on youtube, Rowan got legitimately screwed).  All and All I wouldn't think #3 is too shabby?  ???
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 09, 2007, 09:47:54 PM
And both Rowan teams were dominant as well.  I think Fisher being more recent has made more people think this way. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: RunningRobby25 on July 09, 2007, 09:56:36 PM
Quote from: pg04 on July 09, 2007, 09:46:48 PM
All and All I wouldn't think #3 is too shabby?  ???

I don't know what's worse for us... Being #3 in this poll or dropping to #4 in the D3 football poll at the end of the season...


I guess I'll take em both and run anyways!!!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: boobyhasgameyo on July 09, 2007, 10:07:37 PM
Yeah keep in mind that Union game wasn't as close as the final score reflected.  They were up 28-3 at halftime and put in a lot of reserves in the second half.  Also the Mount Union game I believe Fisher really did have a shot at winning that.  A couple of narrowly missed passes would have resulted in 2 different touchdowns that I can remember and would have put Fisher over the top.  Mount Union was shell shocked you could tell.  I remember one play in particular when Robinson busted through the line for a 40+ yarder.....The Mount Union fans became silent, I think it was then they realized it wasn't going to be all cakes and pies for them.   
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 09, 2007, 10:10:08 PM
Quote from: boobyhasgameyo on July 09, 2007, 10:07:37 PM
Yeah keep in mind that Union game wasn't as close as the final score reflected.  They were up 28-3 at halftime and put in a lot of reserves in the second half.  Also the Mount Union game I believe Fisher really did have a shot at winning that.  A couple of narrowly missed passes would have resulted in 2 different touchdowns that I can remember and would have put Fisher over the top.  Mount Union was shell shocked you could tell.  I remember one play in particular when Robinson busted through the line for a 40+ yarder.....The Mount Union fans became silent, I think it was then they realized it wasn't going to be all cakes and pies for them.   

+K for using the phrase "cakes and pies" in a post.  I like that.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 09, 2007, 10:10:52 PM
Most people would call going from No. 16 to No. 4 rising, not dropping.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 09, 2007, 10:11:47 PM
Utah,

What do you expect from a guy that has booby in his handle (Yes i know what it's referring to)  :D
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: boobyhasgameyo on July 09, 2007, 10:12:54 PM
ha i was hoping somebody would find the humor in the cakes and pies reference. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: RunningRobby25 on July 09, 2007, 10:22:17 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 09, 2007, 10:10:52 PM
Most people would call going from No. 16 to No. 4 rising, not dropping.

Now Now Pat, let's not get you on my bad side this soon!

I was only referring to put Capital (who lost in a round previous to us) was ranked ahead of us.  Also, if you were going by saying they played Mt. Union tougher then why would Whitewater be put ahead of us as well?  No biggie, just stirring the pot now that I can finally say something on here :)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 09, 2007, 10:29:03 PM
Mount Union had to actually pass the ball to beat UW-Whitewater. The Purple Raiders beat St. John Fisher with half its offense tied behind its back.

Mount Union types will back me up on that -- this is their own answer to the same question when fans asked in December.

Just because the bracket placed Capital in Alliance one week earlier doesn't negate the final result -- a three-point game which was tied entering the fourth quarter and which was a three-point game or less for 13 and a half minutes of the final quarter.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: RunningRobby25 on July 09, 2007, 10:31:50 PM
Fair enough Pat,

I was just messin with the idea anyways... no real anger here anyways, just wanted to get ya fired up on my first night... Still friends?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 09, 2007, 10:34:58 PM
You bet -- I'm not at all upset anyway. Thought you deserved a real answer, though.  :)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Tags on July 09, 2007, 10:39:04 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 09, 2007, 10:29:03 PM
Mount Union had to actually pass the ball to beat UW-Whitewater. The Purple Raiders beat St. John Fisher with half its offense tied behind its back.

Are you kidding me? If they could have done anything else & blown Fisher out they would have.

Edit: Don't read too much more into that than there is. Mt. Union is truly a great football team, and their win vs. Fisher was solid. My point is that they try to put teams away quickly, and put them away definitively, I think we all can agree on that. It was close all game, despite Kmic having a career day.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 09, 2007, 10:47:19 PM
Nah. If you watch Mount Union over the years you know that they don't pull anything out of their bag of tricks on offense that they don't need.

Again, I invite you to take this question to the OAC folks. I can track down the quotes, I guess, and save the doubters the trouble.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 09, 2007, 10:54:44 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 09, 2007, 10:47:19 PM
Nah. If you watch Mount Union over the years you know that they don't pull anything out of their bag of tricks on offense that they don't need.

Again, I invite you to take this question to the OAC folks. I can track down the quotes, I guess, and save the doubters the trouble.

you know what though, those oac folks are so defensive if you ever say anything even close to quesioning Mt Union it seems like its almost no use talking to them.

And Ive seen enough Mt. Union over the years to know that they can make the 2nd best team in the country look like one of those Alaskan 7 man eskimo football teams. 

Im not commenting about the SJF/MUC game as I havent seen it  but Ive seen other MUC games where its 35-7 and the second quarter isnt even really started yet.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Tags on July 09, 2007, 10:56:37 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 09, 2007, 10:47:19 PM
Nah. If you watch Mount Union over the years you know that they don't pull anything out of their bag of tricks on offense that they don't need.

Again, I invite you to take this question to the OAC folks. I can track down the quotes, I guess, and save the doubters the trouble.

I can understand where you're coming from on that, I just don't believe they would have left it that close of a ballgame if they felt they had more options to put Fisher away more quickly.

You can say "they didn't have to throw", which is a legit argument I suppose, but I disagree. I think that one game away from the national championship they try to do more than be up
19-14 after 3 - Especially on a team that they knew was dangerous offensively.

I really don't feel like seeing old quotes from OAC folks, not sure what an old quote from a poster on a message board will prove. Agree to disagree.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 09, 2007, 11:01:05 PM
Nate Kmic was a man beast on that day so they did not need an air game...but if I remember the game well enough they were having some issues throwing the ball in the game....(but please don't quote me on this as I was incredbily sick during the game and only really remember the botched punt snap for a saftey the f'd up field goal and Nate kmic's back
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 09, 2007, 11:06:41 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 09, 2007, 11:01:05 PM
Nate Kmic was a man beast on that day so they did not need an air game.

Indeed, and for the past two years in the playoffs, Larry Kehres has ridden him until team can slow him. Just look at the playoff rushing totals.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Tags on July 09, 2007, 11:12:29 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 09, 2007, 11:06:41 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 09, 2007, 11:01:05 PM
Nate Kmic was a man beast on that day so they did not need an air game.

Indeed, and for the past two years in the playoffs, Larry Kehres has ridden him until team can slow him. Just look at the playoff rushing totals.

The kid is a great back, no doubt about it. He ran harder than anyone I've seen in person that's for sure. Let's remember that his line was gigantic & very talented as well - nobody handled Fisher's front like that all year long, and the backers had a helmet on them most all game as well. It was an impressive showing for their line, and when you give a back like Kmic an opportunity he's going to burn you, which he did.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 09, 2007, 11:17:46 PM
And to think I was going to put Reile in my Key offensive players for Fisher.  I wonder if that would have stirred anything up, eh tags?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Tags on July 09, 2007, 11:24:02 PM
Quote from: pg04 on July 09, 2007, 11:17:46 PM
And to think I was going to put Reile in my Key offensive players for Fisher.  I wonder if that would have stirred anything up, eh tags?

You're opinion doesn't have to be the same as mine PG - you're obviously entitled to your own thoughts on that.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 09, 2007, 11:36:08 PM
Quote from: Tags on July 09, 2007, 11:24:02 PM
Quote from: pg04 on July 09, 2007, 11:17:46 PM
And to think I was going to put Reile in my Key offensive players for Fisher.  I wonder if that would have stirred anything up, eh tags?

You're opinion doesn't have to be the same as mine PG - you're obviously entitled to your own thoughts on that.


What is this a new leaf for you tags? A new season, a nicer tags??
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Tags on July 09, 2007, 11:38:05 PM
Quote from: pg04 on July 09, 2007, 11:36:08 PM
Quote from: Tags on July 09, 2007, 11:24:02 PM
Quote from: pg04 on July 09, 2007, 11:17:46 PM
And to think I was going to put Reile in my Key offensive players for Fisher.  I wonder if that would have stirred anything up, eh tags?

You're opinion doesn't have to be the same as mine PG - you're obviously entitled to your own thoughts on that.


What is this a new leaf for you tags? A new season, a nicer tags??

Eh, not really - just don't want to beat a dead horse ya know.

Edit: Of course, the signature will remain  :)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 09, 2007, 11:45:13 PM
Boy that horse is rotting by now!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Tags on July 09, 2007, 11:46:50 PM
Indeed - a new year PG.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: K-Mack on July 10, 2007, 01:15:42 AM
Quote from: 'gro on July 01, 2007, 09:07:29 PM
very tough call, since winning the east doesn't automatically make you the best team, but winning is everything right? Consider this 'gro taking the easy way out.

Since I've only read up through this post, I'll take the easy way out too, by sitting back and watching what everyone else comes up with. Offseason = I get to play the role of reader.

In any case, in response to the earlier question about the NESCAC, I would say that league compares favorably (as in equally) to some of the other top private school teams in the East Region that I've seen. Hobart '05 is a good example of a team I think top NESCAC teams would have gone toe-to-toe with, and that team went toe-to-toe with the best East teams of that year. I think to make the true East Region list you would have to look at a couple Wiliams teams, including this past year's, and some of those Trinity teams. Not sure if Amherst had an undefeated in the D3 era, but they're worth checking out.

With playoff Ws being key criteria here ... well, let's just say that furthers my annoyance with the whole NESCAC not participating thing.

I think considering Wilkes '06 better than Rowan '06 is a fine move, and both the '99 and Clock Year Rowan teams were pretty damn good.

Not that thrilled with RPI's '03 run compared with how some other East teams fared in their semifinal matchup, but they did lose to the national champion.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: K-Mack on July 10, 2007, 01:28:29 AM
Quote from: Tags on July 09, 2007, 11:12:29 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 09, 2007, 11:06:41 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 09, 2007, 11:01:05 PM
Nate Kmic was a man beast on that day so they did not need an air game.

Indeed, and for the past two years in the playoffs, Larry Kehres has ridden him until team can slow him. Just look at the playoff rushing totals.

The kid is a great back, no doubt about it. He ran harder than anyone I've seen in person that's for sure. Let's remember that his line was gigantic & very talented as well - nobody handled Fisher's front like that all year long, and the backers had a helmet on them most all game as well. It was an impressive showing for their line, and when you give a back like Kmic an opportunity he's going to burn you, which he did.

OK,
I did skim some of the Mount Union/SJF stuff ... and while I always give credit for SJF hanging in there with MUC, I think there is some merit to the 'not at full strength/holding back' argument.

It only really made sense after seeing both the MUC/SJF game and then a week later the MUC/UWW game. For a team to run for 400-some-odd yards one week and then pass the ball as well as they did in the Stagg Bowl does open some eyes.

For certain, Garcon had a broken hand against SJF and had 1 catch for 3 yards. I've seen on SJF's website where it says Steve Stepnick shut him down. I don't think that's really the whole story. They took a couple shots with Garcon early and missed, but when they established the run, they basically never went back to that.

Whether you think it was because Kehres is a super-genius who realized he could beat SJF by being one-dimensional and knew he would need to pass to beat UWW, and therefore show as little as possible (assuming UWW had a way to see that game since 2 week old tapes are usually what teams get in the playoffs) ... or if you just think that they happened to have success running and felt they didn't need to go back to Garcon ...

... fact is, dude was lights-out at the Stagg Bowl. Looked like he'd never been injured. Game-breaking speed and moves in the open field and sure hands. He looked nothing like that against SJF, and whether that was due to chance or acting or scheme or some combination of the three, no one heals that much in a week.

Not even sure he played all that much after the 1st quarter against SJF, and he is a major part of their offense.

I agree that if MUC could have been up more than 19-14 they most certainly would have been. But by the same token, if they had been trailing or desperate, or not having so much success running the ball, they most certainly would have tried to involve Garcon more, and he is a major, major difference-maker, as the past two Stagg Bowls prove.

Also, to the comments about Kmic and his line ... I think "it all starts up front" is a major reason behind MUC's success over the years. You almost never see a QB or RB get touched in the backfield, and most of us know how much easier it is to pass without consistent pressure, or how much easier it is for an RB to get running downhill, and to avoid unexpected hits that cause fumbles once he has a few seconds to secure the ball, see what's in front of him and hit his hole.

That line last year was phenomenal. I wish I could explain it in more technical terms, but I'm not much of a technique guru when it comes to line play.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: labart96 on July 10, 2007, 02:07:53 AM
Quote from: K-Mack on July 10, 2007, 01:15:42 AM
In any case, in response to the earlier question about the NESCAC, I would say that league compares favorably (as in equally) to some of the other top private school teams in the East Region that I've seen. Hobart '05 is a good example of a team I think top NESCAC teams would have gone toe-to-toe with, and that team went toe-to-toe with the best East teams of that year. I think to make the true East Region list you would have to look at a couple Wiliams teams, including this past year's, and some of those Trinity teams. Not sure if Amherst had an undefeated in the D3 era, but they're worth checking out.

TGP agrees with K-Mack on this assessment.  Especially since most kids who are looking at NESCAC schools are also probably going to have places like Union and Hobart on their list.  Hamilton is Hobart's #1 overlap and Trinity is definitely a top 10 overlap with Hobart as well.

However, the fact that NESCACs remain an island to themselves and don't play non-conf nor playoff games, trying to rate them will always be conjecture vs. reviewing teams that either play head to head or have common opponents.

Still, TGP thinks an argument (albeit not a particularily strong one) could be made for the inclusion of certain NESCAC teams on this list on the low end (8-10) of the scale.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: labart96 on July 10, 2007, 02:19:44 AM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on July 09, 2007, 10:54:44 PM

you know what though, those oac folks are so defensive if you ever say anything even close to quesioning Mt Union it seems like its almost no use talking to them.

And Ive seen enough Mt. Union over the years to know that they can make the 2nd best team in the country look like one of those Alaskan 7 man eskimo football teams. 

JU -

Yeah, TGP had the gall to comment on a post stagg thread that the MUC dbs often had UWW receivers open behind them for good chunks of the game (and UWWs QB overthrew them on at least 2 wide open TDs) and was blasted for it by the MUC faithful. 

TGP never said that UWW should have won the game (MUC was clearly the better team), but TGP was really surprised how personally some of the OAC posters seemed to take what was meant as just a passing comment based on one fan's (and former DB) observations.

Per K-Mack's OL mention above - they appear to have an almost NFL-esque zone blocking scheme down pat.  They move off the line of scrimmage with such speed and quickness, it's really something to behold.  It's almost vintage Denver Broncos-esque.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Tags on July 10, 2007, 09:53:05 AM
Quote from: K-Mack on July 10, 2007, 01:28:29 AM
[open some eyes.

For certain, Garcon had a broken hand against SJF and had 1 catch for 3 yards. I've seen on SJF's website where it says Steve Stepnick shut him down. I don't think that's really the whole story. They took a couple shots with Garcon early and missed, but when they established the run, they basically never went back to that.


His broken hand healed between the Fisher game & the Mt. Union game?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: lewdogg11 on July 10, 2007, 09:59:16 AM
Quote from: K-Mack on July 10, 2007, 01:15:42 AM
Quote from: 'gro on July 01, 2007, 09:07:29 PM
very tough call, since winning the east doesn't automatically make you the best team, but winning is everything right? Consider this 'gro taking the easy way out.

Since I've only read up through this post, I'll take the easy way out too, by sitting back and watching what everyone else comes up with. Offseason = I get to play the role of reader.

In any case, in response to the earlier question about the NESCAC, I would say that league compares favorably (as in equally) to some of the other top private school teams in the East Region that I've seen. Hobart '05 is a good example of a team I think top NESCAC teams would have gone toe-to-toe with, and that team went toe-to-toe with the best East teams of that year. I think to make the true East Region list you would have to look at a couple Wiliams teams, including this past year's, and some of those Trinity teams. Not sure if Amherst had an undefeated in the D3 era, but they're worth checking out.

With playoff Ws being key criteria here ... well, let's just say that furthers my annoyance with the whole NESCAC not participating thing.

I think considering Wilkes '06 better than Rowan '06 is a fine move, and both the '99 and Clock Year Rowan teams were pretty damn good.

Not that thrilled with RPI's '03 run compared with how some other East teams fared in their semifinal matchup, but they did lose to the national champion.

This is 100% a statement of subjectivity.  How can you make a statement like that, when the NESCAC teams NEVER play anyone else?  Shoot, I can watch how nasty and talented Boise St. was for the last several years on ESPN, against their own conference, and say how they could definately match up with the top teams in the country.  Just because they look so good against competition with similar standards, does that mean they can match up with the best teams?  You just don't know until they play, and until last year, Boise St. showed that they in fact WEREN'T good enough to be looked at in that top tier.  

No disrespect to Williams and Trinity, MAYBE they are as good, if not better than the other East teams, but HOW can you gauge it with no actual proof?  In the NFL, Arizona and San Francisco looked INCREDIBLE against each other in week 1 last year.  How did they fair against everyone else?

All I'm trying to say is that this is a pointless argument because everything is based on your opinion of how these teams look against each other.  It is impossible to rank them amongst the 'living' because they choose to seclude themselves, play a short schedule, and never venture into unchartered territories, so for that reason, they should be ignored.

The NEFC could hold the same argument if they didn't venture out.  Curry sure looked good last year at 11-0 in the Regular season, but in typical NEFC fashion, they got smoked in the playoffs by Springfield, 42-14.  Would this happen to the NESCAC???  Maybe...Maybe not.  Guess we'll never know.  But until we know, I'll take Hobart in 2005 over any of them.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: JT on July 10, 2007, 10:02:20 AM
Quote from: pg04 on July 09, 2007, 08:47:25 PM

Next up, the #2 and #1 teams.  Which Rowan team grabs the number 1 spot?


Having the benefit seeing both squads.  I'm going with 2001 over 1999.  2001's offense was scary and they hit the playoffs rolling.  You could see fear in the opposing defense. Rowan scored 50.6 ppg while allowing only 19.9.  Some of the 19.9 was scored on the second and third team defense when the game was over in the third quarter. More experence on both sides of the ball.

Good balance 4741 total yards of offense (1,977 rushing/2,764 passing), 57 TD's.

This was perhaps the fastest group of Wr's in school history. Before Bridgewater turned into a muddy mess the Profs were kicking ass 21-7 in the 1st quarter.  Dry or turf field we wouldn't even be talking about the clock today. Note: Last regular game of the season Profs spanked Montclair on turf 53-21, in the cold pouring rain.

On that dry Stagg field... it made me ill just watching the game.

1999 great defense but lacked experience in the offensive backfield.  Rookie QB, rookie FB and RB.  The lack of experience hurt Rowan in the Stagg Bowl.  It was great to end Mount Union's streak, but I think the 2001 would have taken home the title.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: JQV on July 10, 2007, 10:12:32 AM
KMac

I don't think you need to tell Fisher how nasty Garcon is...they know from experience.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: 'gro on July 10, 2007, 10:14:13 AM
reguardless of what the coaches, players, fans, etc think... as long as the NESCAC secludes itself from the rest of D3 football, they shouldn't be part of the discussion.

You can watch all the NESCAC football in the world and come up with how you'd think they'd compete against the rest of the east, but it would just be an assumption. JV games (sometimes RPI JV plays Williams JV) aren't going to help either.

I wish they would compete like normal schools. I think that a top NESCAC team could compete in a 1st round matchup... but until we get some games being played, we'll never know.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 10, 2007, 10:23:12 AM
Your boy RedTackle felt last year's Williams was on par with the Liberty League contenders on our Game of the Week broadcast, IIRC.

But yes, lack of evidence is why they usually don't get ranked. Not every voter is convinced by a team running the table against Pool D.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: union89 on July 10, 2007, 10:24:07 AM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on July 10, 2007, 09:59:16 AM
Quote from: K-Mack on July 10, 2007, 01:15:42 AM
Quote from: 'gro on July 01, 2007, 09:07:29 PM
very tough call, since winning the east doesn't automatically make you the best team, but winning is everything right? Consider this 'gro taking the easy way out.

Since I've only read up through this post, I'll take the easy way out too, by sitting back and watching what everyone else comes up with. Offseason = I get to play the role of reader.

In any case, in response to the earlier question about the NESCAC, I would say that league compares favorably (as in equally) to some of the other top private school teams in the East Region that I've seen. Hobart '05 is a good example of a team I think top NESCAC teams would have gone toe-to-toe with, and that team went toe-to-toe with the best East teams of that year. I think to make the true East Region list you would have to look at a couple Wiliams teams, including this past year's, and some of those Trinity teams. Not sure if Amherst had an undefeated in the D3 era, but they're worth checking out.

With playoff Ws being key criteria here ... well, let's just say that furthers my annoyance with the whole NESCAC not participating thing.

I think considering Wilkes '06 better than Rowan '06 is a fine move, and both the '99 and Clock Year Rowan teams were pretty damn good.

Not that thrilled with RPI's '03 run compared with how some other East teams fared in their semifinal matchup, but they did lose to the national champion.

This is 100% a statement of subjectivity.  How can you make a statement like that, when the NESCAC teams NEVER play anyone else?  Shoot, I can watch how nasty and talented Boise St. was for the last several years on ESPN, against their own conference, and say how they could definately match up with the top teams in the country.  Just because they look so good against competition with similar standards, does that mean they can match up with the best teams?  You just don't know until they play, and until last year, Boise St. showed that they in fact WEREN'T good enough to be looked at in that top tier.  

No disrespect to Williams and Trinity, MAYBE they are as good, if not better than the other East teams, but HOW can you gauge it with no actual proof?  In the NFL, Arizona and San Francisco looked INCREDIBLE against each other in week 1 last year.  How did they fair against everyone else?

All I'm trying to say is that this is a pointless argument because everything is based on your opinion of how these teams look against each other.  It is impossible to rank them amongst the 'living' because they choose to seclude themselves, play a short schedule, and never venture into unchartered territories, so for that reason, they should be ignored.

The NEFC could hold the same argument if they didn't venture out.  Curry sure looked good last year at 11-0 in the Regular season, but in typical NEFC fashion, they got smoked in the playoffs by Springfield, 42-14.  Would this happen to the NESCAC???  Maybe...Maybe not.  Guess we'll never know.  But until we know, I'll take Hobart in 2005 over any of them.


My thoughts exactly....well stated by LD.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: lewdogg11 on July 10, 2007, 10:31:24 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 10, 2007, 10:23:12 AM
Your boy RedTackle felt last year's Williams was on par with the Liberty League contenders on our Game of the Week broadcast, IIRC.

But yes, lack of evidence is why they usually don't get ranked. Not every voter is convinced by a team running the table against Pool D.

I am not saying they are NOT on par.  They might be.  And i'm not saying they aren't impressive to watch live, against 'Pool D'(I like that).  I'm just saying that there is no way to tell where, in the grand scheme of things, they fall, so the arguments made on both ends can't be justified.

They are kind of like their own entity of the NAIA.

Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 10, 2007, 10:32:56 AM
Quote from: 'gro on July 10, 2007, 10:14:13 AM
I think that a top NESCAC team could compete in a 1st round matchup... but until we get some games being played, we'll never know.

Oddly enough, this is exactly what a poll is -- what people think. :)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: 'gro on July 10, 2007, 10:39:23 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 10, 2007, 10:32:56 AM
Quote from: 'gro on July 10, 2007, 10:14:13 AM
I think that a top NESCAC team could compete in a 1st round matchup... but until we get some games being played, we'll never know.

Oddly enough, this is exactly what a poll is -- what people think. :)

yeah yeah yeah but they have some kind of basis even 3 or 4 times removed that boils down to on the field play.  The old A beat B who beat C who beat A stuff.

EDIT
I guess my point is since the NESCAC wants to be separate, why give them the kudos of votes in the D3.com poll?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: lewdogg11 on July 10, 2007, 10:54:59 AM
Quote from: 'gro on July 10, 2007, 10:39:23 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 10, 2007, 10:32:56 AM
Quote from: 'gro on July 10, 2007, 10:14:13 AM
I think that a top NESCAC team could compete in a 1st round matchup... but until we get some games being played, we'll never know.

Oddly enough, this is exactly what a poll is -- what people think. :)

yeah yeah yeah but they have some kind of basis even 3 or 4 times removed that boils down to on the field play.  The old A beat B who beat C who beat A stuff.

EDIT
I guess my point is since the NESCAC wants to be separate, why give them the kudos of votes in the D3.com poll?

They can have their own poll, and base it on their head to head records...   ;D
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: JT on July 10, 2007, 10:59:53 AM
Quote from: 'gro on July 10, 2007, 10:39:23 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 10, 2007, 10:32:56 AM
Quote from: 'gro on July 10, 2007, 10:14:13 AM
I think that a top NESCAC team could compete in a 1st round matchup... but until we get some games being played, we'll never know.

Oddly enough, this is exactly what a poll is -- what people think. :)

yeah yeah yeah but they have some kind of basis even 3 or 4 times removed that boils down to on the field play.  The old A beat B who beat C who beat A stuff.

EDIT
I guess my point is since the NESCAC wants to be separate, why give them the kudos of votes in the D3.com poll?

This is one voter that doesn't vote for the NESCAC.  If all their sports programs refused to compete in the NCAA playoffs, it would be admirable.  Singling out football smacks of hypocrisy.

Secondly they offer no actual proof that they can compete on a National level.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Senor RedTackle on July 10, 2007, 01:03:33 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 10, 2007, 10:23:12 AM
Your boy RedTackle felt last year's Williams was on par with the Liberty League contenders on our Game of the Week broadcast, IIRC.

But yes, lack of evidence is why they usually don't get ranked. Not every voter is convinced by a team running the table against Pool D.

RT likes the "RT reference" from the guru
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Trin9-0 on July 10, 2007, 02:32:01 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 10, 2007, 10:23:12 AM
Your boy RedTackle felt last year's Williams was on par with the Liberty League contenders on our Game of the Week broadcast, IIRC.

Also, D3football.com's own Keith MacMillan seemed impressed with the overall play of the NESCAC and Trinity in particular in 2005 when agreed that the Bantams were "one of the 10-12 best teams in the country."

the article: http://www.d3football.com/atn.php?id=83

For the record, I don't think NESCAC teams belong on this list because they don't play non-conference opponents. In fact I always wondered what criteria was used when the undefeated Trinity/Williams teams showed up in the D3football.com National Top 25 poll (albeit at the very end of the year when almost every team has at least 1 loss).

Though I also think the top NESCAC teams would more than hold their own against the top teams in the East Region.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 10, 2007, 02:36:54 PM
Quote from: JT on July 10, 2007, 10:59:53 AM
If all their sports programs refused to compete in the NCAA playoffs, it would be admirable.

For two decades, they did just that.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: lewdogg11 on July 10, 2007, 02:45:31 PM
Quote from: Trin8-0 on July 10, 2007, 02:32:01 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 10, 2007, 10:23:12 AM
Your boy RedTackle felt last year's Williams was on par with the Liberty League contenders on our Game of the Week broadcast, IIRC.

Also, D3football.com's own Keith MacMillan seemed impressed with the overall play of the NESCAC and Trinity in particular in 2005 when agreed that the Bantams were "one of the 10-12 best teams in the country."

the article: http://www.d3football.com/atn.php?id=83

For the record, I don't think NESCAC teams belong on this list because they don't play non-conference opponents. In fact I always wondered what criteria was used when the undefeated Trinity/Williams teams showed up in the D3football.com National Top 25 poll (albeit at the very end of the year when almost every team has at least 1 loss).

Though I also think the top NESCAC teams would more than hold their own against the top teams in the East Region.

Seems to be a common theme here...Unfortunately, we'll probably never find out.  I think the NESCAC could bring a nice spark to the East Region Tournament bracket.  It's a shame.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: JQV on July 10, 2007, 02:46:39 PM
I just don't understand the point of the rule.  Was it originally based on some kind of "like minded institution" logic?  That seems like it would easily be thrown out the window given their success in other sports where they beat schools with different admissions philosophies.  So why just football?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 10, 2007, 02:47:46 PM
Same reason the Ivy League does it.

I don't even know why the Ivy League does it, but it sure seems that if Ivy does it, then NESCAC wants to, too. :)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: lewdogg11 on July 10, 2007, 02:48:25 PM
I still don't understand the thought behind the NESCAC reasoning.  Most likely 1 school(2 at the most) would make the playoffs each year, and it extends the season a couple of weeks?  Rediculas!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: realistic on July 10, 2007, 02:50:59 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 10, 2007, 02:47:46 PM
Same reason the Ivy League does it.

I don't even know why the Ivy League does it, but it sure seems that if Ivy does it, then NESCAC wants to, too. :)

I think that is exactly the point...but the main difference (In my opinion) is that the Ivy's would generally get killed across the board, even in 1AA competition while the NESCAC could compete.  I think any academic reasons are pretty weak too...
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: JQV on July 10, 2007, 02:53:11 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 10, 2007, 02:47:46 PM
Same reason the Ivy League does it.

I don't even know why the Ivy League does it, but it sure seems that if Ivy does it, then NESCAC wants to, too. :)

Crazy.  Seems like the gap between the Ivy Teams and some of the 1-AA powerhouses is a lot greater than the gap between the NESCAC and D3 powerhouses.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: 'gro on July 10, 2007, 02:57:57 PM
It would be in the NESCACs interest to keep playing the no non-conference game schedule, BUT send their champion to the playoffs.

I know football is a subset of a subset (student athletes) but the NESCAC must be losing some kids to UAA schools and other lib arts like Union, Hobart, St. Lawrence, etc because of this playoff thing.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Tags on July 10, 2007, 03:10:05 PM
Quote from: 'gro on July 10, 2007, 02:57:57 PM
It would be in the NESCACs interest to keep playing the no non-conference game schedule, BUT send their champion to the playoffs.

I know football is a subset of a subset (student athletes) but the NESCAC must be losing some kids to UAA schools and other lib arts like Union, Hobart, St. Lawrence, etc because of this playoff thing.

Good point
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: JT on July 10, 2007, 03:31:15 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 10, 2007, 02:36:54 PM
Quote from: JT on July 10, 2007, 10:59:53 AM
If all their sports programs refused to compete in the NCAA playoffs, it would be admirable.

For two decades, they did just that.

I also don't want to take a vote away from a school that participates "fully".
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 10, 2007, 04:35:05 PM
Quote from: JoseQViper on July 10, 2007, 02:53:11 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 10, 2007, 02:47:46 PM
Same reason the Ivy League does it.

I don't even know why the Ivy League does it, but it sure seems that if Ivy does it, then NESCAC wants to, too. :)

Crazy.  Seems like the gap between the Ivy Teams and some of the 1-AA powerhouses is a lot greater than the gap between the NESCAC and D3 powerhouses.

Not so true.  If you see Harvard has beaten some A-10 and Patriot League teams pretty bad.  And those are the better teams from the best leagues in 1-AA.

Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 10, 2007, 04:38:11 PM
And if you look at these nescac rosters you would be suprised as to how national they are now.

LL schools (and Ithaca) still have Id say about 75% from NY state and 25% from NE, NJ and PA? (thats off the top of my head.)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: union89 on July 10, 2007, 06:37:57 PM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on July 10, 2007, 04:35:05 PM
Quote from: JoseQViper on July 10, 2007, 02:53:11 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 10, 2007, 02:47:46 PM
Same reason the Ivy League does it.

I don't even know why the Ivy League does it, but it sure seems that if Ivy does it, then NESCAC wants to, too. :)

Crazy.  Seems like the gap between the Ivy Teams and some of the 1-AA powerhouses is a lot greater than the gap between the NESCAC and D3 powerhouses.

Not so true.  If you see Harvard has beaten some A-10 and Patriot League teams pretty bad.  And those are the better teams from the best leagues in 1-AA.



Not sure I understand this correctly.  Are you saying the Patriot League is one of the best in 1-AA??  If so, I strongly disagree with that one and disagree totally with that rationale!!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: JQV on July 10, 2007, 06:42:11 PM
Quote from: Union89 on July 10, 2007, 06:37:57 PM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on July 10, 2007, 04:35:05 PM
Quote from: JoseQViper on July 10, 2007, 02:53:11 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 10, 2007, 02:47:46 PM
Same reason the Ivy League does it.

I don't even know why the Ivy League does it, but it sure seems that if Ivy does it, then NESCAC wants to, too. :)

Crazy.  Seems like the gap between the Ivy Teams and some of the 1-AA powerhouses is a lot greater than the gap between the NESCAC and D3 powerhouses.

Not so true.  If you see Harvard has beaten some A-10 and Patriot League teams pretty bad.  And those are the better teams from the best leagues in 1-AA.



Not sure I understand this correctly.  Are you saying the Patriot League is one of the best in 1-AA??  If so, I strongly disagree with that one and disagree totally with that rationale!!

Colgate went to the title game a year or two ago...right?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 10, 2007, 06:56:50 PM
Yea I guess the league as a whole might not be the best, but Colgate and Lehigh are two of the best 1-aa teams in the country the last 10 years.

And JQV is right, Colgate made the national championship game a few years ago.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 10, 2007, 06:58:20 PM
Quote from: Union89 on July 10, 2007, 06:37:57 PM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on July 10, 2007, 04:35:05 PM
Quote from: JoseQViper on July 10, 2007, 02:53:11 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 10, 2007, 02:47:46 PM
Same reason the Ivy League does it.

I don't even know why the Ivy League does it, but it sure seems that if Ivy does it, then NESCAC wants to, too. :)

Crazy.  Seems like the gap between the Ivy Teams and some of the 1-AA powerhouses is a lot greater than the gap between the NESCAC and D3 powerhouses.

Not so true.  If you see Harvard has beaten some A-10 and Patriot League teams pretty bad.  And those are the better teams from the best leagues in 1-AA.



Not sure I understand this correctly.  Are you saying the Patriot League is one of the best in 1-AA??  If so, I strongly disagree with that one and disagree totally with that rationale!!

I could look it up but Im pretty sure Harvard ended up in the top 10 in the country a few years ago.  At least the top 20.  And they play other 1-aa teams.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: union89 on July 10, 2007, 07:06:29 PM
Lafayette and Lehigh do well in the Patriot and get smoked for the most part outside.....Holy Cross is pretty bad for the most part........I'll give Northeastern as a pretty good team, but regularly mix in atrocious years as well.....IMO, Harvard does mot play a strong out of conference schedule.....not as bad as RPI's, but bad.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Reno Hightower on July 10, 2007, 07:07:13 PM
Quote from: boobyhasgameyo on July 09, 2007, 10:07:37 PM
Yeah keep in mind that Union game wasn't as close as the final score reflected.  They were up 28-3 at halftime and put in a lot of reserves in the second half.  Also the Mount Union game I believe Fisher really did have a shot at winning that.  A couple of narrowly missed passes would have resulted in 2 different touchdowns that I can remember and would have put Fisher over the top.  Mount Union was shell shocked you could tell.  I remember one play in particular when Robinson busted through the line for a 40+ yarder.....The Mount Union fans became silent, I think it was then they realized it wasn't going to be all cakes and pies for them.   

Having been at the Union-SJF game, I can honestly say that SJF did not call the dogs off so to speak. Maybe the last 5 minutes or so of the game but even then I dont think that they did that. To say they tried to do that against Union is wrong, in fact I even remember them running a fake punt in a situation that with the lead they had, they would only do so to try to score more points as the game was clearly over.

Also, in regards to the MU-SJF Game. I have to say that I believe that SJF's Pass Defense definetly needs to be given some credit. And a lot of it. As a Union fan, I can honestly say that I thought that was the best part of their whole team. Yes, they shut down TA in that game but this was for a variety of reasons (Im not going to say TA was injured, even though he was. Ive stated in the past that even if he had been healthy, running behind Union's O-Line he would not have been able to run for 100 yards on 25 carries vs SJF).....the #1 reason Union could not run the ball against SJF was because they had so much confidence in their pass defense that they were not afraid to use their db's to defend the run. I have not seen their game against MU but if I had to guess, as someone who considers himself to be very knowledgable about the game of football.....I would say that they probably used a very similar game plan against MU as they used against the U, but that they got pushed around in the front 7 by MU's dominant OL. SJF was very fast up in the front 7 but not very big at all. I would wager that MU ran  a lot of inside run plays behind that big OL and dominated up front.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 10, 2007, 07:13:58 PM
Quote from: Union89 on July 10, 2007, 07:06:29 PM
Lafayette and Lehigh do well in the Patriot and get smoked for the most part outside.....Holy Cross is pretty bad for the mosst part........I'll give Northeastern as a pretty good team, but regularly mix in atrocious yars as well.....IMO, Harvard does mot play a strong out of conference schedule.....not as bad as RPI's, but bad.

Yea but I wouldnt say they get smoked.  Especially if Colgate is making the final game.  And Lehigh always does some damage when they make it. 

And you are right about Harvards non comference schedule, but lets not kid ourselves and say its as bad as RPIs.....

Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: union89 on July 10, 2007, 07:15:22 PM
Of course not......that would be REDICULAS!!!!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 10, 2007, 07:20:38 PM
Quote from: Union89 on July 10, 2007, 07:15:22 PM
Of course not......that would be REDICULAS!!!!

Speaking of RPI football....

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.womenssportsnet.com%2FPortals%2F57ad7180-c5e7-49f5-b282-c6475cdb7ee7%2Fimages%2Ffootball%2FOC_breakers%2Fnosebreaker.jpg&hash=648f95617b2551f4e2aeeb4813c656b0db8ca947)
RB Tina Waters prepares for Smith College's opening game vs. RPI
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Knightstalker on July 10, 2007, 07:50:38 PM
I think RPI better watch out for her.  Of course KS has already told the stalkerette that she could play football if she wanted to.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: lewdogg11 on July 10, 2007, 08:17:05 PM
Nah seriously guys, why you gotta be like that? 

Word on the street is that RPI dropped the Hudson Valley scrimmage this year, and penciled in Troy High to get more 'week-one-like' experience. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Tags on July 10, 2007, 08:33:25 PM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on July 10, 2007, 08:17:05 PM
Nah seriously guys, why you gotta be like that? 

Word on the street is that RPI dropped the Hudson Valley scrimmage this year, and penciled in Troy High to get more 'week-one-like' experience. 

Now that's funny.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 10, 2007, 10:09:46 PM
Is Troy any good anymore...they used to be real dominant in the area...it was always a big rival with them LaSalle Insitute and Amsterdam football....some good players came from those teams
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 10, 2007, 10:13:36 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 10, 2007, 10:09:46 PM
Is Troy any good anymore...they used to be real dominant in the area...it was always a big rival with them LaSalle Insitute and Amsterdam football....some good players came from those teams

Ever heard of Justice Smith?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 10, 2007, 10:27:49 PM
are you kidding me.... I Grew up in Amsterdam...as a kid I idolized Justice Smith...I had a copy of the SI issue he was on a long time ago......
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 10, 2007, 10:31:51 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 10, 2007, 10:27:49 PM
are you kidding me.... I Grew up in Amsterdam...as a kid I idolized Justice Smith...I had a copy of the SI issue he was on a long time ago......

He was on the cover of SI?  I worked with him for 2 years at this bar in Boston.  Great kid.  I think he was moving to Arizona or somewhere like that.  This was back around 2000 I think though.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 10, 2007, 10:39:41 PM
you know what I just went and researched it it wasn't the cover but I recall it was either an article or something but there was a great photo of him and then he goes and f's up his knee
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 10, 2007, 10:40:57 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 10, 2007, 10:39:41 PM
you know what I just went and researched it it wasn't the cover but I recall it was either an article or something but there was a great photo of him and then he goes and f's up his knee

Im trying to remember, he was too young to be on the BC team that beat #1 ND in 93 right?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 10, 2007, 11:25:04 PM
no ...what I am remembering is from I wanna say '94
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 10, 2007, 11:45:03 PM
# 2: 1999 Rowan Profs

The Basics:

Overall Record:  12-2
End Result: Eliminated by Pacific Lutheran in National Finals
Key Regular Season Wins: vs. Buffalo State 43-7, @ Cortland State 30-9
Key Regular Season Losses: vs. Montclair State 24-28
Points For: 35.8
Points Against: 13.8

Key Strength:

They lost their quarterback early in the season but stayed resilient and continued strong on the arm of a Freshman quarterback, blowing away most of their opponents.  Their defense also was solid, only allowing 13 points in the 1st quarter all season up until the final game.  They were the number 1 ranked rush Defense in the country and also forced 21 turnovers.

Key Players:

Offense:

Mike Warker, QB:  The freshman QB threw 114-221 for 1861 yards and 17 touchdowns after Jeff Orihel went down with a knee injury

Justin Wright, RB:  119 rushes for 871 yards.  Was injured in the Game against Cortland State.

Jason Frabasile, RB:  Replaced Wright and had 131 rushes for 610 yards and 7 touchdowns. 

Scott Lipford, WR:  56 receptions for 904 yards and 5 touchdowns.

Defense: 

Tim Watson: 10 sacks, 50 tackles, 1 interception and 2 fumble recoveries.

Cornelius White: 10 sacks, 49 tackles and 2 interception

Eventual cause of demise (because let's face it, the Eastern teams always have a demise) :

The team on this list that came closest to not having a demise, eventually fell in the national final 41-13 to Pacific Lutheran.  The profs were coming in off a high, defeating Mount Union in Alliance the week before, ending their 54  game winning streak.  In the playoffs they had also avenged their regular season loss to Montclair State.  It looked that FINALLY, Rowan was going to get over the hump and win a national title.  This was not the case as the problems started from the first play of the game when Warker fumbled and the Lutes recovered on the Profs 31.  It was really all downhill from there as they would be down 27-7 at halftime.  In an astounding stat, the profs ran for a Stagg Bowl Record  -63 yards rushing (yes that's a negative). 



Why did they make the list?
:

As the only team in the era to make the National Final, they are certainly deserving of the position, and many will say deserving of the first slot for this very reason (and also that they ended the Purple Raiders Streak).  However, The next team, the 2001 team, appeared to me statistic wise and also as an overall team to be better than the 1999 one. 


======================================================================


# 1: 2001 Rowan Profs

The Basics:

Overall Record:  11-2
End Result: Eliminated by Bridgewater in National SemiFinals
Key Regular Season Wins: vs. New Jersey 28-27, vs. Montclair State 53-21
Key Regular Season Losses: @ Cortland State 31-32
Points For: 46.9
Points Against: 18.4

Key Strength:

This one in my mind was easy.  The ability for them to just blow out their opponents and score at will was undeniable.  As an example, Just look at the winning scores in the playoffs :  vs. Brockport 40-17, vs. Western Connecticut 43-14, and vs. Ithaca 48-0.  This combined with some regular season scores like 67-17, 63-14, and the Montclair state win mentioned above made them appear virtually unstoppable (of course they were stoppable).

Key Players:

Offense:

Tony Racioppi 166-283 for 2600 yards and 37 touchdowns.

Scott Lipford: 47 receptions for 969 yards and 16 touchdowns.

Paul Northern:         42 rushes for 392 yards and 4 touchdowns     
Antwine Simmons:    61 rushes for 427 yards and 3 touchdowns       
Creg Bethea:            61 rushes for 359 yards and 2  touchdowns   


Eventual cause of demise (because let's face it, the Eastern teams always have a demise) :

The clock.  In a game that one second took like 5 seconds to elapse,  Bridgewater defeated Rowan 29-24/ 
you can see the footage here:  http://youtube.com/watch?v=hYpYCOS4WyE (http://youtube.com/watch?v=hYpYCOS4WyE).  Before this game, as described above, the Profs absolutely had no trouble with the eastern region.  This game was back and forth, but in the end, the Profs should absolutely have won and gone on to play Mount Union in the National Final (That national final, Mount Union won 30-27).



Why did they make the list?
:

This question should probably be why are they number 1?  Well, I believe that this was absolutely the most dominant team in the Eastern Region of this era.  They rolled over opponents with relative ease and although they did lose in the regular season, they are hard to deny.  Racioppi had an awesome year and the team really deserved better, as I have discussed.   Not only did they have the explosive offense but a very nice defense as well making them the #1 Team in the Eastern Region of the D3football.com era!!!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 10, 2007, 11:54:07 PM
And that's it folks!!  :)  Thanks for the discussions and have at it on the first two picks...

Thanks for D3football.com for most of the stats!

Honorable Mention Teams:

Trinity 2003   8-0
Trinity 2004   8-0
Trinity 2005   8-0
Ithaca 2003   10-3
Springfield 2000   11-2
Springfield 2006   10-2
Union 2005   11-1
Rowan 2004   10-3
Montclair 2003 9-2
RPI 2001 8-1

As For the Trinity Teams, they were considered but as people have recently mentioned, I don't think it would be fair to put them in the top 10 without playing anyone in the east or being in the playoffs.

As For Widener, if they were included, probably would have been in the top 5.  However, I had already started this and had my teams set before they were brought into the discussion. 

Overall, I hope you enjoyed all this and continue discussions.

I am currently thinking about possibly doing another Top 10 topic soon (Not Right away, However). 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Trin9-0 on July 11, 2007, 08:27:48 AM
Quote from: pg04 on July 10, 2007, 11:54:07 PM
And that's it folks!!  :)  Thanks for the discussions and have at it on the first two picks...

Thanks for D3football.com for most of the stats!

Honorable Mention Teams:

Trinity 2003   8-0
Trinity 2004   8-0
Trinity 2005   8-0
Ithaca 2003   10-3
Springfield 2000   11-2
Springfield 2006   10-2
Union 2005   11-1
Rowan 2004   10-3
Montclair 2003 9-2
RPI 2001 8-1

As For the Trinity Teams, they were considered but as people have recently mentioned, I don't think it would be fair to put them in the top 10 without playing anyone in the east or being in the playoffs.

Appreciate the honorable mention for Trinity, especially having the '03 Bantams on top  ;D .  Though as several have mentioned, if Trin is included then a few of the undefeated Williams teams should get a nod as well (most notably '01, 06).

Great work on the Top Ten!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: tecmobowler on July 11, 2007, 08:54:57 AM
While they're not going to make these sorts of lists due to missing the playoffs, the best Ithaca team I have seen (since 1999 when I arrived at the school) by far was the 2004 version.  The offense was simply electric at a time when Ithaca's defense was still the main attraction.

A tough one point loss on the road to Brockport, and a controversial double overtime loss to Fisher on the road.  Seems it should have been enough to get in, as there were a couple two loss teams that squeaked into the tournament.  I really thought that squad could have gone a long, long way.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: 'gro on July 11, 2007, 09:12:45 AM
Good work all around PG.

Nice to see RPI'01 get a HM slot.  '99 was probably the better team but '01 was the 1st year of the spread offense, and we were coming off of the 3-6 debacle of 2000.

That was a crazy season (gro's senior year). Shirley cancelled the coast guard game due to 9-11 after both coaches agreed to play, we beat then #10 Union, we beat Hobart with "The Miracle on '86 Field", We somehow got the #1 seed in the east, then the Evil Empire (Ithaca) rolled us in the 2nd round.

The Miracle on '86 Field
Trailing 29-21 midway through the fourth quarter, RPI put together a 13-play, 75-yard drive, capped by a 1-yard plunge by sophomore quarterback Dan Cole. The two-point conversion failed and the Statesmen led, 29-27, with 4:55 remaining in the fourth quarter. After holding Hobart to just two yards on the next series, the Engineers got the ball back on a punt with 2:57 showing on the clock.

Starting at their own 15-yard line, the Engineers went 71 yards on five plays, including a juggling 56-yard catch by Evan Cochran, to set up first-and-10 from the Hobart 14-yard line. The Statesmen forced three incomplete passes and a Rensselaer field goal attempt. The visitors surged the line and blocked the attempt, but RPI’s holder, sophomore Mike Defilippi, picked up the ball and outran the Hobart players to the corner of the end zone for the go-ahead touchdown with 1:56 remaining. A two-point conversion made the score 35-29 and senior defensive back Chris Speck ended Hobart’s final drive with an interception with 51 seconds left.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: realistic on July 11, 2007, 09:30:19 AM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on July 10, 2007, 06:56:50 PM
Yea I guess the league as a whole might not be the best, but Colgate and Lehigh are two of the best 1-aa teams in the country the last 10 years.

And JQV is right, Colgate made the national championship game a few years ago.

Didn't they make it two years in a row?  Or at least the semi's?  They had a stud RB. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: JQV on July 11, 2007, 09:43:02 AM
Quote from: tecmobowler on July 11, 2007, 08:54:57 AM
While they're not going to make these sorts of lists due to missing the playoffs, the best Ithaca team I have seen (since 1999 when I arrived at the school) by far was the 2004 version.  The offense was simply electric at a time when Ithaca's defense was still the main attraction.

A tough one point loss on the road to Brockport, and a controversial double overtime loss to Fisher on the road.  Seems it should have been enough to get in, as there were a couple two loss teams that squeaked into the tournament.  I really thought that squad could have gone a long, long way.

A friend close to the program also wanted to nominate the 2004 Bombers. 

I avoided them for two reasons: 1) I never saw them play and (2) they didn't make the playoffs.

I think if you evaluate the way they played down the stretch, there may be no comparison.  The 2001 Bombers were more consistent but the 2004 team finished in a way that no team has in quite a while.  Good call Tecmo.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: PBR... on July 11, 2007, 10:16:10 AM
Quote from: realistic on July 11, 2007, 09:30:19 AM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on July 10, 2007, 06:56:50 PM
Yea I guess the league as a whole might not be the best, but Colgate and Lehigh are two of the best 1-aa teams in the country the last 10 years.

And JQV is right, Colgate made the national championship game a few years ago.

Didn't they make it two years in a row?  Or at least the semi's?  They had a stud RB. 


lehigh was especially good about 5 years ago and made several runs late into the playoffs,  until their coach moved on to greener pastures. current coach is good but they have seemed to lost that edge the previous coach had. (sorry i cant remember his name off the top of my head)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: gordonmann on July 11, 2007, 11:47:28 AM
Great work on this, PG.  It's a very creative, effective way to engage people during the off season.  And you did an outstanding job with the analysis.

For what it's worth, I agree with your top 2 teams.  That 2001 Rowan team was very, very good.

I'd be curious to see what other regions would posit as their Top 10.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: JT on July 11, 2007, 12:28:20 PM
The North might be a little hard to compile  ;)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: gordonmann on July 11, 2007, 12:38:04 PM
True.  It would probably be a pretty anticlimactic process focused more on which Mount Union team was the best.  I'm not sure how much fans of other schools would enjoy that.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: labart96 on July 11, 2007, 01:46:53 PM
Quote from: 'gro on July 11, 2007, 09:12:45 AM
Good work all around PG.

Nice to see RPI'01 get a HM slot.  '99 was probably the better team but '01 was the 1st year of the spread offense, and we were coming off of the 3-6 debacle of 2000.

That was a crazy season (gro's senior year). Shirley cancelled the coast guard game due to 9-11 after both coaches agreed to play, we beat then #10 Union, we beat Hobart with "The Miracle on '86 Field", We somehow got the #1 seed in the east, then the Evil Empire (Ithaca) rolled us in the 2nd round.

The Miracle on '86 Field
Trailing 29-21 midway through the fourth quarter, RPI put together a 13-play, 75-yard drive, capped by a 1-yard plunge by sophomore quarterback Dan Cole. The two-point conversion failed and the Statesmen led, 29-27, with 4:55 remaining in the fourth quarter. After holding Hobart to just two yards on the next series, the Engineers got the ball back on a punt with 2:57 showing on the clock.

Starting at their own 15-yard line, the Engineers went 71 yards on five plays, including a juggling 56-yard catch by Evan Cochran, to set up first-and-10 from the Hobart 14-yard line. The Statesmen forced three incomplete passes and a Rensselaer field goal attempt. The visitors surged the line and blocked the attempt, but RPI’s holder, sophomore Mike Defilippi, picked up the ball and outran the Hobart players to the corner of the end zone for the go-ahead touchdown with 1:56 remaining. A two-point conversion made the score 35-29 and senior defensive back Chris Speck ended Hobart’s final drive with an interception with 51 seconds left.


Ugh - TGP would smite Gro for the painful reminder of this debacle, but TGP will (grudgingly) give credit were credit is due.

Mucho K+ to PG for setting up this thread!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Ralph Turner on July 11, 2007, 02:30:30 PM
Quote from: JT on July 11, 2007, 12:28:20 PM
The North might be a little hard to compile  ;)

I want "The 10 Best non-MUC North Region Teams of the Modern (D3football.com) Era".
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 11, 2007, 07:25:41 PM
Thanks everyone, it was fun to research as well, and I have found it hard to disagree with any of the points made by anyone here.  It's good to  get everyone in the football spirit!   :)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: union89 on July 11, 2007, 08:09:39 PM
PG04.....great work...thanks for the effort!!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Tags on July 11, 2007, 08:13:48 PM
Quote from: gordonmann on July 11, 2007, 12:38:04 PM
True.  It would probably be a pretty anticlimactic process focused more on which Mount Union team was the best.  I'm not sure how much fans of other schools would enjoy that.

Eh, always fun debating who the "best of the rest" would be. Or arguing which 9 out of the 10 would go to what specific MU squad :)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Tags on July 11, 2007, 08:19:25 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 10, 2007, 10:27:49 PM
are you kidding me.... I Grew up in Amsterdam...as a kid I idolized Justice Smith...I had a copy of the SI issue he was on a long time ago......

I forgot you grew up there - do you know AJ Sainato?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: rams1102 on July 12, 2007, 08:52:08 AM
pg04,

Great job on the the Top 10 Teams in the East. It was nice to discuss football during a time when the boards are pretty quiet. It was nice to see Montclair-03 make the Top 10 Honorable Mention. That was a talented team. We needed to clean house the next year and Coach G. did it. The comeback really started last year. With Wilkes, Springfield and Wesley out of the blocks this year it will definitely be interesting and not to forget Rowan, Cortland and the rest of the NJAC. Thanks again for a great time !!!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 12, 2007, 10:08:01 AM
Quote from: Tags on July 11, 2007, 08:19:25 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 10, 2007, 10:27:49 PM
are you kidding me.... I Grew up in Amsterdam...as a kid I idolized Justice Smith...I had a copy of the SI issue he was on a long time ago......

I forgot you grew up there - do you know AJ Sainato?

I know of him...he was older than me... I grew up playing soccer with his sister...man she schooled all the guys
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Tags on July 12, 2007, 10:13:10 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 12, 2007, 10:08:01 AM
Quote from: Tags on July 11, 2007, 08:19:25 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 10, 2007, 10:27:49 PM
are you kidding me.... I Grew up in Amsterdam...as a kid I idolized Justice Smith...I had a copy of the SI issue he was on a long time ago......

I forgot you grew up there - do you know AJ Sainato?

I know of him...he was older than me... I grew up playing soccer with his sister...man she schooled all the guys

He's a good friend of mine. Pledged w/ him at the infamous SUNY school North of Syracuse. From what I hear, he was a good linebacker back in the day.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on July 12, 2007, 11:45:40 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 12, 2007, 10:08:01 AM
I grew up playing soccer with his sister...

Only an SJF guy could truthfully say something like this........
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Tags on July 13, 2007, 12:04:52 AM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on July 12, 2007, 11:45:40 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 12, 2007, 10:08:01 AM
I grew up playing soccer with his sister...

Only an SJF guy could truthfully say something like this........

Ya ... Super, you should play that stuff closer to the vest.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 13, 2007, 12:22:22 AM
seriously...it was when we were 8...
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: theoriginalupstate on July 13, 2007, 12:25:48 AM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 13, 2007, 12:22:22 AM
seriously...it was when we were 8...

yeah, my cousin used to play in a league with girls....

he's gay now, but im sure thats totally unrelated...
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: union89 on July 13, 2007, 12:43:03 AM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on July 12, 2007, 11:45:40 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 12, 2007, 10:08:01 AM
I grew up playing soccer with his sister...

Only an SJF guy could truthfully say something like this........


+1K
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on July 13, 2007, 12:44:37 AM
Quote from: Upstate on July 13, 2007, 12:25:48 AM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 13, 2007, 12:22:22 AM
seriously...it was when we were 8...

yeah, my cousin used to play in a league with girls....

he's gay now, but im sure thats totally unrelated...

get the quotes straight she played on an all guys team...because we did not have enough girls to form a girls team...and she was better than all of the guys...I dare you to make fun of her to AJ's face...
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: union89 on July 13, 2007, 12:47:34 AM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 13, 2007, 12:44:37 AM
Quote from: Upstate on July 13, 2007, 12:25:48 AM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 13, 2007, 12:22:22 AM
seriously...it was when we were 8...

yeah, my cousin used to play in a league with girls....

he's gay now, but im sure thats totally unrelated...

get the quotes straight she played on an all guys team...because we did not have enough girls to form a girls team...and she was better than all of the guys...I dare you to make fun of her to AJ's face...


My last girlfriend could kick balls hard too.......

She was good......
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Tags on July 13, 2007, 12:52:16 AM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 13, 2007, 12:44:37 AM
Quote from: Upstate on July 13, 2007, 12:25:48 AM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 13, 2007, 12:22:22 AM
seriously...it was when we were 8...

yeah, my cousin used to play in a league with girls....

he's gay now, but im sure thats totally unrelated...

get the quotes straight she played on an all guys team...because we did not have enough girls to form a girls team...and she was better than all of the guys...I dare you to make fun of her to AJ's face...

57, I don't think anyone made fun of his sister.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: JQV on July 13, 2007, 08:21:30 AM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on July 12, 2007, 11:45:40 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 12, 2007, 10:08:01 AM
I grew up playing soccer with his sister...
Only an SJF guy could truthfully say something like this........

And your my new signature JU.  Nicely done.

EDIT:

I am picturing Superman showing John Madden the Annexation of Puerto Rico on his computer while the Ice Box finishes off practice in front of the barn...
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: theoriginalupstate on July 13, 2007, 12:15:41 PM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 13, 2007, 12:44:37 AM
Quote from: Upstate on July 13, 2007, 12:25:48 AM
Quote from: Superman57 on July 13, 2007, 12:22:22 AM
seriously...it was when we were 8...

yeah, my cousin used to play in a league with girls....

he's gay now, but im sure thats totally unrelated...

get the quotes straight she played on an all guys team...because we did not have enough girls to form a girls team...and she was better than all of the guys...I dare you to make fun of her to AJ's face...

I know, I know....

Just messin...

Young people, so angry these days....
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: K-Mack on July 30, 2007, 11:50:50 PM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on July 10, 2007, 09:59:16 AM
Quote from: K-Mack on July 10, 2007, 01:15:42 AM
Quote from: 'gro on July 01, 2007, 09:07:29 PM
very tough call, since winning the east doesn't automatically make you the best team, but winning is everything right? Consider this 'gro taking the easy way out.

Since I've only read up through this post, I'll take the easy way out too, by sitting back and watching what everyone else comes up with. Offseason = I get to play the role of reader.

In any case, in response to the earlier question about the NESCAC, I would say that league compares favorably (as in equally) to some of the other top private school teams in the East Region that I've seen. Hobart '05 is a good example of a team I think top NESCAC teams would have gone toe-to-toe with, and that team went toe-to-toe with the best East teams of that year. I think to make the true East Region list you would have to look at a couple Wiliams teams, including this past year's, and some of those Trinity teams. Not sure if Amherst had an undefeated in the D3 era, but they're worth checking out.

With playoff Ws being key criteria here ... well, let's just say that furthers my annoyance with the whole NESCAC not participating thing.

I think considering Wilkes '06 better than Rowan '06 is a fine move, and both the '99 and Clock Year Rowan teams were pretty damn good.

Not that thrilled with RPI's '03 run compared with how some other East teams fared in their semifinal matchup, but they did lose to the national champion.

This is 100% a statement of subjectivity.  How can you make a statement like that, when the NESCAC teams NEVER play anyone else?  Shoot, I can watch how nasty and talented Boise St. was for the last several years on ESPN, against their own conference, and say how they could definately match up with the top teams in the country.  Just because they look so good against competition with similar standards, does that mean they can match up with the best teams?  You just don't know until they play, and until last year, Boise St. showed that they in fact WEREN'T good enough to be looked at in that top tier.  

No disrespect to Williams and Trinity, MAYBE they are as good, if not better than the other East teams, but HOW can you gauge it with no actual proof?  In the NFL, Arizona and San Francisco looked INCREDIBLE against each other in week 1 last year.  How did they fair against everyone else?

All I'm trying to say is that this is a pointless argument because everything is based on your opinion of how these teams look against each other.  It is impossible to rank them amongst the 'living' because they choose to seclude themselves, play a short schedule, and never venture into unchartered territories, so for that reason, they should be ignored.

The NEFC could hold the same argument if they didn't venture out.  Curry sure looked good last year at 11-0 in the Regular season, but in typical NEFC fashion, they got smoked in the playoffs by Springfield, 42-14.  Would this happen to the NESCAC???  Maybe...Maybe not.  Guess we'll never know.  But until we know, I'll take Hobart in 2005 over any of them.

Good for you. Calm down, killer.

This IS a subjective post. No one said it wasn't.

How I can make a statement like that is because I saw teams with my own eyes and thought they would fare well against each other.

Your Boise State example stinks, they were hanging with and beating power conference teams long before 2006. Look it up. Your other arguments are kind of silly too. NEFC/NESCAC = not same. You'll take Hobart '05 based on what? If proof is what you need, you can't definitively say they AREN'T as good or better than other D3 teams just like no one can say they ARE. We'll never know and subjectivity is all we have to go on.

I could say they're better than Mount Union and you have no "proof" they're not.

You're also preaching to the choir, as no one dislikes the NESCAC's seclusion more than me. It's documented in ATNs back to who knows when.

Although it's largely of their own school's doing, the players suffer plenty as they are almost never ranked in the top 25 and deprived of the playoff experience while other NESCAC sports play non-conference and compete in the playoffs (Amherst, as you might know, is the reigning men's bball champ). However, just because they take their ball and go home doesn't mean they aren't D3.

You can ignore them if you want to. However, if other people care to take a crack at comparing, I'm telling them what I saw. Trinity and Amherst remind me a lot of teams like Hobart and Occidental.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: K-Mack on July 30, 2007, 11:53:31 PM
Quote from: JoseQViper on July 10, 2007, 10:12:32 AM
KMac

I don't think you need to tell Fisher how nasty Garcon is...they know from experience.

Oh. Well that ship's sailed. My B.

Although I usually post for the benefit of the general board-reading public, not the players who appeared in the games.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: K-Mack on July 31, 2007, 12:16:27 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 10, 2007, 10:23:12 AM
Quote from: 'gro on July 10, 2007, 10:14:13 AM
reguardless of what the coaches, players, fans, etc think... as long as the NESCAC secludes itself from the rest of D3 football, they shouldn't be part of the discussion.

You can watch all the NESCAC football in the world and come up with how you'd think they'd compete against the rest of the east, but it would just be an assumption. JV games (sometimes RPI JV plays Williams JV) aren't going to help either.

I wish they would compete like normal schools. I think that a top NESCAC team could compete in a 1st round matchup... but until we get some games being played, we'll never know.

Your boy RedTackle felt last year's Williams was on par with the Liberty League contenders on our Game of the Week broadcast, IIRC.

But yes, lack of evidence is why they usually don't get ranked. Not every voter is convinced by a team running the table against Pool D.

I agree with you 'gro, I wish they would compete. They seem pretty set in their ways though, as discussed in that Nov. '05 ATN on the subject.

I don't have any problem with voters saying 'I don't have enough information on them to justify ranking them.' Massey and other computers do the same thing, group the NESCAC alone, because their systems at some point rely on some set of subjective data (like rank of conference strength) that can't be applied to the NESCAC. Going strictly off mathematical comparisons of scores, there's only that limited number of outcomes withing the closed group and we get no perspective from including them in the larger group.

But let's be serious here.

Nearly every conversation on this board and every voter's ballot is based on some amount of subjectivity.

The only absolutes are the final scores, and even those aren't infallible. If A > B and B > C, A isn't always > C ... do we have to trot out some UWW/UMHB/Wesley-type score triangles. It happens several times a year, the three-way tie everyone beat everyone scenario.

We actually can't even guarantee that if A > B that it A will still be > B in a second meeting.

There's so much subjectivity involved in all of this. Home-field advantage. Weather. Playing surface. Injuries. At what point in the season the teams played. Strength of schedule. Etcetera.

Please stop acting like subjectivity with regard to the NESCAC is somehow out of place here.

As said, I'm fine with how the NESCAC is treated; it's their own fault, and if they cared about changing, they would.

But no Division III top 25 that refuses to acknowledge the NESCAC is a true representation of what's believed to be the 25 strongest teams. And neither is a top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com era.

If the people participating on this thread want to exclude them just to save us all the hassle of having arguments where there's not enough data to compare them, I completely understand, however.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: K-Mack on July 31, 2007, 12:28:01 AM
Quote from: Union89 on July 10, 2007, 10:24:07 AM
My thoughts exactly....well stated by LD.

Your arguments are silly then too.

Quote from: LewDogg11 on July 10, 2007, 10:31:24 AM
I am not saying they are NOT on par.  They might be.  And i'm not saying they aren't impressive to watch live, against 'Pool D'(I like that).  I'm just saying that there is no way to tell where, in the grand scheme of things, they fall, so the arguments made on both ends can't be justified.

Sounds like we understand each other here.

Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 10, 2007, 10:32:56 AM
Quote from: 'gro on July 10, 2007, 10:14:13 AM
I think that a top NESCAC team could compete in a 1st round matchup... but until we get some games being played, we'll never know.

Oddly enough, this is exactly what a poll is -- what people think. :)

You don't say?!?

Quote from: 'gro on July 10, 2007, 10:39:23 AM
yeah yeah yeah but they have some kind of basis even 3 or 4 times removed that boils down to on the field play.  The old A beat B who beat C who beat A stuff.

Oh sweet, Gro. I hadn't even read that when I made my attempt at footbalgebra. You're going to love it.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on July 31, 2007, 12:34:10 AM
Quote from: K-Mack on July 31, 2007, 12:16:27 AM

If the people participating on this thread want to exclude them just to save us all the hassle of having arguments where there's not enough data to compare them, I completely understand, however.

Agreed.  Hence why they were put in the Honorable mention and not top 10 of my poll...
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: K-Mack on July 31, 2007, 12:43:11 AM
Quote from: 'gro on July 10, 2007, 10:39:23 AM
I guess my point is since the NESCAC wants to be separate, why give them the kudos of votes in the D3.com poll?

Generally speaking, we don't. But the theory for including them would be strangely akin to the theory behind the top 25 as a whole: To attempt to identify the 25 best teams in Division III.

As long as they are in Division III (and that might not be all that long), there's an argument for it being a worthwhile pursuit.

Quote from: JT on July 10, 2007, 10:59:53 AM
This is one voter that doesn't vote for the NESCAC.  If all their sports programs refused to compete in the NCAA playoffs, it would be admirable.  Singling out football smacks of hypocrisy.

Secondly they offer no actual proof that they can compete on a National level.

See, I don't think that's right, to make up your mind to never vote for a NESCAC team. That smacks of bitterness. And there's no actual proof they can't compete.

When we first ranked conferences way back when, we had the NESCAC pretty low, based partly on the strength of the other New England football teams and the East as a whole at that time. And partly it was based on what we thought.

I got an e-mail that opened my mind on it, saying that NESCAC compete for athletes that have a chance to play Division I-AA and II, which is true of a lot of Division III schools and conferences. NESCAC schools often compete nationally in other sports (though I really only count basketball in the non-country-club test) and are in well-organized athletic departments backed by well-funded boosters. They have facilities comparable to other similarly-sized institutions.

Finally, I asked Pat to pay to send me to a game between top NESCAC teams so we could give it the old eye test. And while that's a rather small sample size to go on, if I had seen anything extraordinarily crappy, it wouldn't take but a short time to find out.

Pat has seen both NEFC and NESCAC as recently as last season. Maybe he could speak more authoritatively on the subject.

Point is, in subsequent conference rankings, even though we'd seen a few games ourselves, we felt like it was wiser just to not rank them. Because there just isn't enough to go on, especially since playoff performance and non-conference record are major factors in our conference rankings. So in essence, Pat and I both agree with all of you.

But, when it comes to listing the teams I think are the 25 best in the country, I think I have enough to consider the NESCAC same as I consider all the other conferences. If other voters don't, that's fine.

Anyway, I don't want to beat this any further into the ground, but I just don't get around to these parts of the board that often and wanted to respond to as much as I could while I had time.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: K-Mack on July 31, 2007, 01:01:31 AM
Quote from: JoseQViper on July 10, 2007, 02:46:39 PM
I just don't understand the point of the rule.  Was it originally based on some kind of "like minded institution" logic?  That seems like it would easily be thrown out the window given their success in other sports where they beat schools with different admissions philosophies.  So why just football?

Been dying to get the NESCAC presidents (who apparently make the final call) on record with this, but the one year I actually started researching the story, about 4-5 presidents had been on the job a year or less, meaning they basically were likely just doing what had always been done and hadn't been involved in the decision-making process  >:(

I'm to the point where I think there are other stories that deserve our attention, but that doesn't mean we should pretend NESCAC doesn't exist (kinda makes us the bigger men though, since they pretend we all don't)

I agree it's Ivy-influenced, and I also think it's silly (I trot this out in the 'playoffs would never work in I-A arguments too) to say playoffs take up too much time since only 1/9 of them would have to worry about it, and maybe for an extra week or two, max.

Although in my conversation with Gennaro Leo in the article linked back on p. 12, he made a very convincing case for getting the season over with.

And in all honestly, a lot of us played seasons where the playoffs were not an option. So I sort of respect the ol' regular season means everything/enjoy the games/know that the last week is the last week theories.

Still, nothing beats playoffs. This will not be debated.

That means you Herbstreit, Corso and May. Stop with the Plus-1 BS.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Ralph Turner on July 31, 2007, 01:47:44 AM
K-Mack, I think that we need to include baseball, ice hockey, track and field, volleyball   and cross country in the non-country-club sports for the NESCAC.

Remember the D-1 CWS in 2003 when Stanford and Rice squared off.  Those SAT's were pretty good there.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: K-Mack on July 31, 2007, 02:41:35 AM
Quote from: Ralph Turner on July 31, 2007, 01:47:44 AMK-Mack, I think that we need to include baseball, ice hockey, track and field, volleyball   and cross country in the non-country-club sports for the NESCAC.

Remember the D-1 CWS in 2003 when Stanford and Rice squared off.  Those SAT's were pretty good there.

Yes, I didn't mean to imply that there were no other non-country club sports. I just meant I use football and basketball as a quick test to determine whether or not I can say School X is good at sports besides "country club" sports.

It is certainly not a scientific or even a very reliable test, but it is fast and available on the D3Sports.com network!

(adds baseball to test)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: frank uible on July 31, 2007, 07:57:09 AM
My guess is that the majority of those wonderful international-quality Brazilian futebol players originate from the City of God and other favelas and not any country club.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: lewdogg11 on July 31, 2007, 10:33:57 AM
Holy Crap!!!  I just had to hop in the Delorean, take a trip back a while, and hop into the reflection room to remember what I typed in some of those messages.  1.21 Jigawatts!!!

And just for the record, my Boise State example did not smell particularly bad.  My comparison was that no one knew if they could be considered a top tier team, or just a really solid program vs. good (not great) competition.  You argue they were hanging with and beating power conference teams long before 2006.  Look it up.  Well, I looked it up...

2002
Record:  12-1
Notable Wins:  Utah State  63-38, Hawaii 58-31, Fresno State 67-21, Iowa St 34-16
Loss:  Arkansas 41-14
No real standout teams beat here.  Other than putting major points ont he board...

2003
Record:  12-1
Notable Wins:  BYU 50-12, Fresno State 31-17, Hawaii 45-28, # 19 TCU 34-31
Loss:  Oregon State 26-24
Again, nothing blowing me away here other than some of their offensive point totals.

2004
Record:  11-1
Notable Wins:  Oregon State 53-34, BYU 28-27, Fresno State 33-16, Hawaii 69-3, San Jose State 56-49, Nevada 58-21
Loss:  Bowl Game vs. #7 Louisville 44-40
Same thing.  Only ranked team they played(Louisville) they lost to.  And Louisville isn't in the same category as other top programs.

2005
Record:  9-4
Notable Wins:  San Jose State 38-21, Utah State 45-21
Losses:  #13 Georgia 48-13, Oregon State 30-27, #20 Fresno State 27-7, #18 Boston College 27-21
Can't beat a ranked team.  Hmmm.  Still sounds like a solid program.  But not a top tier.  And if they didn't add Georgia, and get BC in the bowl game, you would question how good they are...

2006
Record:  13-0
Notable Wins:  Oregon State 42-14, Hawaii 41-34, Utah 36-3, Fresno State 45-21, San Jose State 23-20, #11 Oklahoma 43-42
Losses:  None
FInally ran the table.  FInally beat a ranked team, albeit a #11 Oklahoma who was suspect to begin with.  Still made a name for themselves, FINALLY, as potentially being able to play with the big boys.

The point is, there is no point.  Boise State has looked amazing on TV for many years.  But they are showing 1 win of real quality, and it just happens to be their last game played at this point.

Some NESCAC teams look really good, really put together, very crisp, very athletic.  But they don't even have the losses to good(not great) programs outside of their conference.

Rowan LOOKED like they would beat Pacific Lutheran by 70 points in 1999.  The scoreboard showed differently.  Where the NESCAC top teams fall are nothing more than a guess, so if you want to rank them, break out your magic 8 ball, pull straws, flip coins...whatever you have to do.  It's all suspect, so why bother arguing about how good they are?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: 'gro on July 31, 2007, 10:50:08 AM
LD, that is an all time great post. High ranks for comedy, actual knowledge, fact finding, it was the total package. Rich and compelling.

K-mack, appreciate your knowledge on the subject, and we know that you cover all the boards... but man, why come in so late with all that extra analysis?  Please don't let us find you outside the ESPN offices in september casting your vote for "who's now?". Also, I am a big fan of your midnight and later drive by postings... how do you do it?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: JT on July 31, 2007, 11:52:53 AM
Quote from: JT on July 10, 2007, 10:59:53 AM
This is one voter that doesn't vote for the NESCAC.  If all their sports programs refused to compete in the NCAA playoffs, it would be admirable.  Singling out football smacks of hypocrisy.

Secondly they offer no actual proof that they can compete on a National level.

Quote from: K-Mack on July 31, 2007, 12:43:11 AM
See, I don't think that's right, to make up your mind to never vote for a NESCAC team. That smacks of bitterness. And there's no actual proof they can't compete.

I'll resolve to keep an open mind going forward.  I wish they'd play out-of-conference, so I can get a feel for the league year in and out.  Future webcasts might help.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Senor RedTackle on July 31, 2007, 12:16:24 PM
Where do the 1992-94 RPI teams rank in this poll.....you know, the ones w/ Redtackle dominating the line of scrimmage????? ECAC playoff berths meant more back then!! :)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: lewdogg11 on July 31, 2007, 01:17:41 PM
Quote from: Senor RedTackle on July 31, 2007, 12:16:24 PM
Where do the 1992-94 RPI teams rank in this poll.....you know, the ones w/ Redtackle dominating the line of scrimmage????? ECAC playoff berths meant more back then!! :)

Somewhere in between Williams, Trinity, Mount Union, Becker, and Boise St.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: K-Mack on July 31, 2007, 11:44:13 PM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on July 31, 2007, 10:33:57 AM
Some NESCAC teams look really good, really put together, very crisp, very athletic.  But they don't even have the losses to good (not great) programs outside of their conference.

Rowan LOOKED like they would beat Pacific Lutheran by 70 points in 1999.  The scoreboard showed differently.  Where the NESCAC top teams fall are nothing more than a guess, so if you want to rank them, break out your magic 8 ball, pull straws, flip coins...whatever you have to do.  It's all suspect, so why bother arguing about how good they are?

Why bother?

Well, shi-, uh, er, shoot ... if that's your point, why bother posting here at all? Opinions, bias and subjectivity are a message board's foundation.

Like I said earlier, everything's suspect -- people argue all kinds of shoulda, coulda, wouldas from 'if he hadn't been injured' to 'if that game hadn't been on turf' -- so why stop when we get to the NESCAC?

If you don't want to consider the NESCAC possibilities, fine ... but why you want to censor opinions that other people may or may not care to hear is beyond me.

At least you broke out a Marty McFly reference for that, er, butt.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: K-Mack on July 31, 2007, 11:47:55 PM
Quote from: 'gro on July 31, 2007, 10:50:08 AM
K-mack, appreciate your knowledge on the subject, and we know that you cover all the boards... but man, why come in so late with all that extra analysis?  Please don't let us find you outside the ESPN offices in september casting your vote for "who's now?". Also, I am a big fan of your midnight and later drive by postings ... how do you do it?

Real easy. I work 6 p.m.-2 a.m., so midnight is like 3 p.m. to me.

I come in late on discussions because I just click the little tab that takes me to that last post I made on the board ... whether or not it was weeks ago is irrelevant to me, at least in the offseason. If people care to revive the discussion, they will, if not, they'll skim/skip.

It helps when I'm bored and it's a slow day at work.

Now you guys know how I got the nickname "TiVo" among my fantasy league crew.

Who's Now? ... I don't really see that happening  ;)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: K-Mack on July 31, 2007, 11:52:21 PM
Quote from: JT on July 11, 2007, 12:28:20 PM
The North might be a little hard to compile  ;)

Quote from: gordonmann on July 11, 2007, 12:38:04 PM
True.  It would probably be a pretty anticlimactic process focused more on which Mount Union team was the best.  I'm not sure how much fans of other schools would enjoy that.

What? The race for the 10th spot would be all kinds of exciting.

Would it be a Mount Union non-national champion, or would it be some team a national champion MUC eliminated along the way

(revives more old stuff; catches up slowly)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: K-Mack on July 31, 2007, 11:59:24 PM
Quote from: pg04 on July 10, 2007, 11:54:07 PM
And that's it folks!!  :)  Thanks for the discussions and have at it on the first two picks...

Thanks for D3football.com for most of the stats!

Honorable Mention Teams:

Trinity 2003   8-0
Trinity 2004   8-0
Trinity 2005   8-0
Ithaca 2003   10-3
Springfield 2000   11-2
Springfield 2006   10-2
Union 2005   11-1
Rowan 2004   10-3
Montclair 2003 9-2
RPI 2001 8-1

As For the Trinity Teams, they were considered but as people have recently mentioned, I don't think it would be fair to put them in the top 10 without playing anyone in the east or being in the playoffs.

As For Widener, if they were included, probably would have been in the top 5.  However, I had already started this and had my teams set before they were brought into the discussion. 

Overall, I hope you enjoyed all this and continue discussions.

I am currently thinking about possibly doing another Top 10 topic soon (Not Right away, However). 

Hey ... Just caught up, and thought of a new excuse: I only have time to read when I'm not swamped with Kickoff '07 stuff ... solid, solid work.

I might have some room for this kind of "fan analysis" in Around the Nation ... let me holler at the guru. Of course, who needs the big time when you've got the LL board to impress?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Trin9-0 on August 01, 2007, 09:07:30 AM
K-Mac, I'm curious... after your vigorous defense that the NESCAC deserves to be considered for top 10 status in the Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era... do you actually think a team from the NESCAC should be ranked and if so, where would you rank them?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on August 01, 2007, 09:02:54 PM
Quote from: K-Mack on July 31, 2007, 11:59:24 PM
Quote from: pg04 on July 10, 2007, 11:54:07 PM
And that's it folks!!  :)  Thanks for the discussions and have at it on the first two picks...

Thanks for D3football.com for most of the stats!

Honorable Mention Teams:

Trinity 2003   8-0
Trinity 2004   8-0
Trinity 2005   8-0
Ithaca 2003   10-3
Springfield 2000   11-2
Springfield 2006   10-2
Union 2005   11-1
Rowan 2004   10-3
Montclair 2003 9-2
RPI 2001 8-1

As For the Trinity Teams, they were considered but as people have recently mentioned, I don't think it would be fair to put them in the top 10 without playing anyone in the east or being in the playoffs.

As For Widener, if they were included, probably would have been in the top 5.  However, I had already started this and had my teams set before they were brought into the discussion. 

Overall, I hope you enjoyed all this and continue discussions.

I am currently thinking about possibly doing another Top 10 topic soon (Not Right away, However). 

Hey ... Just caught up, and thought of a new excuse: I only have time to read when I'm not swamped with Kickoff '07 stuff ... solid, solid work.

I might have some room for this kind of "fan analysis" in Around the Nation ... let me holler at the guru. Of course, who needs the big time when you've got the LL board to impress?

It's easier to impress the nation!

thanks for the comments...Also, I think a fan analysis might be good!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: K-Mack on August 09, 2007, 12:19:10 PM
Quote from: Trin8-0 on August 01, 2007, 09:07:30 AM
K-Mac, I'm curious... after your vigorous defense that the NESCAC deserves to be considered for top 10 status in the Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era... do you actually think a team from the NESCAC should be ranked and if so, where would you rank them?

Yeah, the funny thing is, my major point there was that the truest rankings must consider everyone, even though the NESCAC gives us less information to work with.

That said, I find it really hard to get behind any particular NESCAC team on the level with the Rowan Stagg Bowl or Clock Game teams or some of the other power teams of the era, because they just don't have the convincing results to prove it.

However, if I'm saying that top NESCAC teams look like top Liberty League teams (as opposed to NEFC), then I guess I'm saying one of the Trinity teams in the streak could have gone as far as RPI did in '03.  :o

I wouldn't know off the top of my head which team to get behind, but it is my opinion that an 8-0 NESCAC team is possibly good enough to make this list somewhere.

As to which one and where they land, that's where I agree with everyone that they've made it tough on us by not giving us much to work with. But if we really wanted to determine, I bet we could come up with a good guess.

Doesn't seem like anyone really wants to though. If the list and criteria is fine as it is by most everyone in here, then its fine by me.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: DanPadavona on August 27, 2007, 12:31:01 AM
Great Topic!

I used my computer power rankings system (similar to Massey, Laz Index, etc) to gather a list of the best teams.  Then I tweaked the rankings based on my opinions.

1.  Rowan 2001
2.  St John Fisher 2006
3.  Rowan 1999
4.  Rowan  2005  (with Orihel, they might have been #2 or #3)
5.  RPI 2003
6.  Springfield 2006 (Don't forget their games with Fisher)
7.  Ithaca 2003
8.  Cortland 2002
9.  Brockport 2002
10.  Del Valley 2005

Interestingly, Cortland 2006 would have been about #5 on this list prior to losing Smith.  After all the injuries piled up, their ranking fell fast to just below the top 10.

I could listen to arguments on any of the #4 to #10 selections, but I am pretty set on top 3.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: XDragon59 on September 04, 2007, 08:12:33 PM
Quote from: Cortland_Football on August 27, 2007, 12:31:01 AM
Great Topic!

I used my computer power rankings system (similar to Massey, Laz Index, etc) to gather a list of the best teams.  Then I tweaked the rankings based on my opinions.

1.  Rowan 2001
2.  St John Fisher 2006
3.  Rowan 1999
4.  Rowan  2005  (with Orihel, they might have been #2 or #3)
5.  RPI 2003
6.  Springfield 2006 (Don't forget their games with Fisher)
7.  Ithaca 2003
8.  Cortland 2002
9.  Brockport 2002
10.  Del Valley 2005

Interestingly, Cortland 2006 would have been about #5 on this list prior to losing Smith.  After all the injuries piled up, their ranking fell fast to just below the top 10.

I could listen to arguments on any of the #4 to #10 selections, but I am pretty set on top 3.

Springfield 2000 was another great team, went deep into the NCAA's and had an almost unstoppable ground game.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: WUDLINE on September 13, 2007, 01:06:51 PM
I guess you are all forgeting about the  Widener team that lost to Mount Union. True they were a southern region team for many years but if my memory serves me correctly they were moved to the east region that year, and ripped through the east bracket. During the Jones and Coleman era they embaressed many  quality teams from the east such as Union, Springfield, Hobart, Bridgewater. I would have to plae them at the top of any list.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: union89 on September 13, 2007, 01:40:16 PM
Quote from: WUDLINE on September 13, 2007, 01:06:51 PM
I guess you are all forgeting about the  Widener team that lost to Mount Union. True they were a southern region team for many years but if my memory serves me correctly they were moved to the east region that year, and ripped through the east bracket. During the Jones and Coleman era they embaressed many  quality teams from the east such as Union, Springfield, Hobart, Bridgewater. I would have to plae them at the top of any list.


Wuddie....you lose any sense of credibility when you claim that Widener 'embarassed' Union with a 33-26 score.  I was at that first round game and Widener got smoked in the second half and was very lucky to get out of Schenectady with a win....
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Pat Coleman on September 13, 2007, 02:17:28 PM
Quote from: WUDLINE on September 13, 2007, 01:06:51 PM
I guess you are all forgeting about the  Widener team that lost to Mount Union. True they were a southern region team for many years but if my memory serves me correctly they were moved to the east region that year, and ripped through the east bracket. During the Jones and Coleman era they embaressed many  quality teams from the east such as Union, Springfield, Hobart, Bridgewater.

They embarrassed Bridgewater? They lost to Bridgewater 57-32 in 2001 and did not play them in any other season.

So ... half your list is bogus. What's left?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Senor RedTackle on September 13, 2007, 02:51:30 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on September 13, 2007, 02:17:28 PM
Quote from: WUDLINE on September 13, 2007, 01:06:51 PM
I guess you are all forgeting about the  Widener team that lost to Mount Union. True they were a southern region team for many years but if my memory serves me correctly they were moved to the east region that year, and ripped through the east bracket. During the Jones and Coleman era they embaressed many  quality teams from the east such as Union, Springfield, Hobart, Bridgewater.

They embarrassed Bridgewater? They lost to Bridgewater 57-32 in 2001 and did not play them in any other season.

So ... half your list is bogus. What's left?

ZING!!! The Guru strikes again.......
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: gordonmann on September 13, 2007, 03:28:48 PM
Not to pile on, but Widener 2000 probably wasn't considered for the same reason John Carroll 2001 wasn't -- they were teams moved into the region, not actual East region teams at the time.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on September 13, 2007, 07:28:16 PM
Exactly.  And if WUD had actually read back a little bit, I mention that is exactly why Widener wasn't in this list. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: WUDLINE on September 13, 2007, 07:35:58 PM
Gordonmann -
Please do not feel bad for pointing out your interpertation of the facts. However, I still contend that WU did roll through the east that year and as I said thumped many of these so called powers.

Anyone who attended the WU vs. Union game should remember that WU was up 26 - 0 at the 7:46 point of the 3rd quarter before they began sitting on the clock. Did Union battle back a little. However, I question the credability of anyone who would claim a team is luck to escape with a win after they have controled the game.

Pat - You are correct about WU losing to Bridgewater Va, However, that was Jones and Coleman's senior year and was in the South regional final. I was speaking of the Bridgewater , Mass. team that Hobart beat in the 2000 playoff's 25 - 0 before widener beat them.

Gordon - Though you are correct about the format, we are all aware of the fact that the d3 playoff committee has been placing teams in geographical regions for years, and 2000 was not any different. WU was bumped out of the South bracket because of a earlier season loss to McDaniel and sent to the so called Union bracket - If we are not to consider this the East Bracket then what is it. The bracket consited of every team ranked in the Eastern Lambert Poll. If you want to be picky, and claim it was not the east that is fine. However, I stand by my opinion that the 2000 widener team is still at the top.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Pat Coleman on September 13, 2007, 07:40:39 PM
Quote from: WUDLINE on September 13, 2007, 07:35:58 PM
Gordonmann -
Please do not feel bad for pointing out your interpertation of the facts. However, I still contend that WU did roll through the east that year and as I said thumped many of these so called powers.

Anyone who attended the WU vs. Union game should remember that WU was up 26 - 0 at the 7:46 point of the 3rd quarter before they began sitting on the clock. Did Union battle back a little. However, I question the credability of anyone who would claim a team is luck to escape with a win after they have controled the game.

Pat - You are correct about WU losing to Bridgewater Va, However, that was Jones and Coleman's senior year and was in the South regional final. I was speaking of the Bridgewater , Mass. team that Hobart beat in the 2000 playoff's 25 - 0 before widener beat them.

Gordon - Though you are correct about the format, we are all aware of the fact that the d3 playoff committee has been placing teams in geographical regions for years, and 2000 was not any different. WU was bumped out of the South bracket because of a earlier season loss to McDaniel and sent to the so called Union bracket - If we are not to consider this the East Bracket then what is it. The bracket consited of every team ranked in the Eastern Lambert Poll. If you want to be picky, and claim it was not the east that is fine. However, I stand by my opinion that the 2000 widener team is still at the top.

OK, dude, that's Bridgewater STATE, and that is not a power in any sense of the word, by anyone's measure.

That team's conference is winless in eight years with an automatic bid.

And surprisingly, Lambert poll is not how this ranking measured the East.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on September 13, 2007, 07:51:26 PM
that's funny that like a school saying hey we destroyed St. John Fisher we should be ranked in the top ten like them and then you find it was in the early 90's when fisher sucked... or a guy saying my team beat Michigan...oh wait it was east west southern michigan community college
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: WUDLINE on September 13, 2007, 08:00:07 PM
Superman -
Not sure of your point. Maybe you can clarify in english. I was stating that WU went to the NY regional bracket in 2000 (east) and pretty handly beat all the competition that was offered. Went to the final four and lost to a great Mount Union team.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Knightstalker on September 13, 2007, 08:08:21 PM
But they still were not an East region team at that point and therefore were not eligible for the poll.  It is really very simple to understand, evin we'ins state skul stewdense unnnerstan it.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: theoriginalupstate on September 13, 2007, 08:44:26 PM
Quote from: WUDLINE on September 13, 2007, 08:00:07 PM
Superman -
Not sure of your point. Maybe you can clarify in english. I was stating that WU went to the NY regional bracket in 2000 (east) and pretty handly beat all the competition that was offered. Went to the final four and lost to a great Mount Union team.

Then under your logic John Carroll should be ranked in this top 10 then, am i correct in that?

Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on September 13, 2007, 08:57:14 PM
i was making fun of the fact that you mixed up the bridgewaters... listen this is not just about post season but also regular season...so just chill
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: union89 on September 14, 2007, 05:36:37 PM
Quote from: WUDLINE on September 13, 2007, 07:35:58 PM
Gordonmann -
Please do not feel bad for pointing out your interpertation of the facts. However, I still contend that WU did roll through the east that year and as I said thumped many of these so called powers.

Anyone who attended the WU vs. Union game should remember that WU was up 26 - 0 at the 7:46 point of the 3rd quarter before they began sitting on the clock. Did Union battle back a little. However, I question the credability of anyone who would claim a team is luck to escape with a win after they have controled the game.

Pat - You are correct about WU losing to Bridgewater Va, However, that was Jones and Coleman's senior year and was in the South regional final. I was speaking of the Bridgewater , Mass. team that Hobart beat in the 2000 playoff's 25 - 0 before widener beat them.

Gordon - Though you are correct about the format, we are all aware of the fact that the d3 playoff committee has been placing teams in geographical regions for years, and 2000 was not any different. WU was bumped out of the South bracket because of a earlier season loss to McDaniel and sent to the so called Union bracket - If we are not to consider this the East Bracket then what is it. The bracket consited of every team ranked in the Eastern Lambert Poll. If you want to be picky, and claim it was not the east that is fine. However, I stand by my opinion that the 2000 widener team is still at the top.


Wuddie,
Get your facts straight man.....The HALFTIME score of the game was 26-7, which means Widener being up 26-0 hafway through the 3rd is wrong.
Union had the ball twice in Widener territory with under 3:00 on the clock and couldn't punch it in to force overtime.....Union also rolled up about 450 yards of total offense.
So all in all, I would say Widener was fortunate to escape with a win rather than your statement which was 'Widener embarassed Union'.....facts help opinions, keep that in mind....
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Frank Rossi on September 15, 2007, 11:59:46 PM
Just to back up Union89, Union had two chances to tie/take the lead in the late fourth quarter.  It would have been the comeback to which we would equate all East Region comebacks if it came to fruition.  It proved that Union that year was one of the best adjustment teams that played.  I did sideline commentary for that game for WRUC -- and I ended up taking off my top shirt in cold weather and became a cheerleader on the sideline.  It was quite an afternoon, but the Dutchmen pulled up a hair short.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: redswarm81 on October 15, 2007, 07:40:05 PM
Quote from: JT on July 10, 2007, 10:59:53 AM

This is one voter that doesn't vote for the NESCAC.  If all their sports programs refused to compete in the NCAA playoffs, it would be admirable.  Singling out football smacks of hypocrisy.

Secondly they offer no actual proof that they can compete on a National level.
I don't understand why, if it's admirable for the conference to keep ALL of its sports teams out of national playoffs, it is somehow shameful to keep only one of its sports teams out of the playoffs.  Why isn't it admirable to keep the one team out, but shameful to let the other teams participate?

NESCAC teams compete very successfully on a national level in every other sport, which I think is reasonably interpreted as evidence that they would likely do well competing nationally in football.

I've been the target of much dark energy from PPPosters whenever I've pointed out a few facts to consider about NESCAC schools and the Division III football playoffs:

Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: lewdogg11 on October 15, 2007, 07:47:49 PM
Quote from: redswarm81 on October 15, 2007, 07:40:05 PM
Quote from: JT on July 10, 2007, 10:59:53 AM

This is one voter that doesn't vote for the NESCAC.  If all their sports programs refused to compete in the NCAA playoffs, it would be admirable.  Singling out football smacks of hypocrisy.

Secondly they offer no actual proof that they can compete on a National level.
I don't understand why, if it's admirable for the conference to keep ALL of its sports teams out of national playoffs, it is somehow shameful to keep only one of its sports teams out of the playoffs.  Why isn't it admirable to keep the one team out, but shameful to let the other teams participate?

NESCAC teams compete very successfully on a national level in every other sport, which I think is reasonably interpreted as evidence that they would likely do well competing nationally in football.

I've been the target of much dark energy from PPPosters whenever I've pointed out a few facts to consider about NESCAC schools and the Division III football playoffs:


  • The football roster is likely the largest team in the whole school, so the impact of playoff participation is greater on football than on any other sport;
  • The football playoffs start in mid-November and can extend for 5 weeks, meaning all the way through finals, thus creating an increasingly high stakes distraction through the most important time of the fall semester;
  • The duration of the playoff participation is a big unknown - 1 to 5 weeks - and NESCAC schools are top academic schools, who charge their tuition paying customers a high price for what they claim is a known quantity--high quality education that is never second priority to athletics;
  • NESCAC schools are blessed with the luxury of longstanding and fierce rivalries that likely provide as much motivation and "rounding" as national playoffs would, e.g. Williams v. Amherst, Colby v. Bates v. Bowdoin, Trinity v. Wesleyan; and
  • NESCAC schools take their Division III "academics ahead of athletics" pledge seriously, and IMO deserve no disrespect for that, especially not from other Division III "academics before athletics" types.

What would you rather have, an 'A' on your micro-economics final or a National Championship and an 'A-' or 'B+'.  If football hurts so much academically, how do they handle it all semester long?  Gimme a friggin break.  In the slim to zero chance that a NESCAC team MADE the national championship game, would it be remotely possible that those players on ONE team in the conference could have slightly different exam schedules than the other students?

And as an RPI grad, that's going and saying that the football players at RPI are hurt academically by their ability to play in the postseason.  Your arguments are ridiculas, and borderlined retarded.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: 'gro on October 15, 2007, 08:09:27 PM
Can't think of a class where the final exam was more than 25%, and those were rare... usually the final is about 20% of the total grade.  80% of your grade is DURING the season and all those oh so deadly distractions of football.

Gro was more distracted in school by playing nintendo 64 than football ever did. And N64 has NO offseason, right LD?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: letsgou on October 15, 2007, 08:11:22 PM
All time LL win/loss records 2004 to present

Union           22-2 (.92)
Hobart         21-3 (.88)
RPI              15-8  (.65)
UofR            12-11 (.52)

UCAA 00 to 03
Union           11-5
Hobart         12-4
RPI              10-6
Uof R           7-9


Total since 2000

Union        33-7   (.833)
Hobart      33-7   (.833)
RPI           25-14  (.64)
UofR         19-20  (.49)

All other teams have losing records in both LL and UCAA.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: lewdogg11 on October 15, 2007, 08:13:30 PM
Quote from: 'gro on October 15, 2007, 08:09:27 PM
Can't think of a class where the final exam was more than 25%, and those were rare... usually the final is about 20% of the total grade.  80% of your grade is DURING the season and all those oh so deadly distractions of football.

Gro was more distracted in school by playing nintendo 64 than football ever did. And N64 has NO offseason, right LD?

Truth be told, LD11 was a MUCH better student in-season due to the regimented structure of football season.  Off season spelled more drinking, more games of Bond, more chicks during the week, more Gus's hot dogs, and more sub-3.0 semesters.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: redswarm81 on October 15, 2007, 08:14:20 PM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on October 15, 2007, 07:47:49 PM

If football hurts so much academically, how do they handle it all semester long?


They don't do it all semester long, that's the point.  They have an eight game season in a 15 or 16 week semester.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: redswarm81 on October 15, 2007, 08:16:42 PM
Quote from: 'gro on October 15, 2007, 08:09:27 PM
Can't think of a class where the final exam was more than 25%, and those were rare... usually the final is about 20% of the total grade.  80% of your grade is DURING the season and all those oh so deadly distractions of football.

You did NESCAC, 'gro bro?  I thought you were an Engitutineer.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: redswarm81 on October 15, 2007, 08:34:34 PM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on October 15, 2007, 08:13:30 PM

Truth be told, LD11 was a MUCH better student in-season due to the regimented structure of football season.  Off season spelled more drinking, more games of Bond, more chicks during the week, more Gus's hot dogs, and more sub-3.0 semesters.

We've been through this, haven't we?  I understand that every single one of you DIII standouts was a better student during football season (than spring semester?  than during late November?).  I believe you, I really do.  However, that still ignores at least two immutable facts:


I just don't see how the NESCAC deserves criticism for using those immutable facts in a calculation to conclude that at their schools--which have the highest academic reputation among all DIII schools--the football teams ought not participate in the national playoffs.

Don't forget, fellow engineers and scientists, that the NESCAC schools are liberal arts schools, among the finest in the country.  As I understand it, liberal artists take many classes where they have to do this thing called "write papers" or some such nonsense, and many of those papers that they have to write are due during finals.  K-Mack's Williams interviewee mentioned multiple papers in his discussion of why he wasn't bothered by lack of playoff participation.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: lewdogg11 on October 15, 2007, 08:42:09 PM
Quote from: redswarm81 on October 15, 2007, 08:34:34 PM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on October 15, 2007, 08:13:30 PM

Truth be told, LD11 was a MUCH better student in-season due to the regimented structure of football season.  Off season spelled more drinking, more games of Bond, more chicks during the week, more Gus's hot dogs, and more sub-3.0 semesters.

We've been through this, haven't we?  I understand that every single one of you DIII standouts was a better student during football season (than spring semester?  than during late November?).  I believe you, I really do.  However, that still ignores at least two immutable facts:


  • Football IS a distraction from academics; and
  • The DIII national playoffs extend that distraction for an unknown period of time, often through finals.


I just don't see how the NESCAC deserves criticism for using those immutable facts in a calculation to conclude that at their schools--which have the highest academic reputation among all DIII schools--the football teams ought not participate in the national playoffs.

Don't forget, fellow engineers and scientists, that the NESCAC schools are liberal arts schools, among the finest in the country.  As I understand it, liberal artists take many classes where they have to do this thing called "write papers" or some such nonsense, and many of those papers that they have to write are due during finals.  K-Mack's Williams interviewee mentioned multiple papers in his discussion of why he wasn't bothered by lack of playoff participation.

Riddle me this then...

Why might a school like Williams allow hockey season to start prior to their first game on 11/17/2007 running all the way through 2/23/2008.  Or even basketball running from 11/16/2007 until 2/28/2008.  Granted, they take off finals WEEK from games, but they still have to practice don't they?  How does that make any sense?  Last I checked, hockey and basketball were pretty demanding sports, no?

Wouldn't it be 'in their best interest' to start the seasons AFTER finals?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: superman57 on October 15, 2007, 08:46:28 PM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on October 15, 2007, 08:42:09 PM
Quote from: redswarm81 on October 15, 2007, 08:34:34 PM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on October 15, 2007, 08:13:30 PM

Truth be told, LD11 was a MUCH better student in-season due to the regimented structure of football season.  Off season spelled more drinking, more games of Bond, more chicks during the week, more Gus's hot dogs, and more sub-3.0 semesters.

We've been through this, haven't we?  I understand that every single one of you DIII standouts was a better student during football season (than spring semester?  than during late November?).  I believe you, I really do.  However, that still ignores at least two immutable facts:


  • Football IS a distraction from academics; and
  • The DIII national playoffs extend that distraction for an unknown period of time, often through finals.


I just don't see how the NESCAC deserves criticism for using those immutable facts in a calculation to conclude that at their schools--which have the highest academic reputation among all DIII schools--the football teams ought not participate in the national playoffs.

Don't forget, fellow engineers and scientists, that the NESCAC schools are liberal arts schools, among the finest in the country.  As I understand it, liberal artists take many classes where they have to do this thing called "write papers" or some such nonsense, and many of those papers that they have to write are due during finals.  K-Mack's Williams interviewee mentioned multiple papers in his discussion of why he wasn't bothered by lack of playoff participation.

Riddle me this then...

Why might a school like Williams allow hockey season to start prior to their first game on 11/17/2007 running all the way through 2/23/2008.  Or even basketball running from 11/16/2007 until 2/28/2008.  Granted, they take off finals WEEK from games, but they still have to practice don't they?  How does that make any sense?  Last I checked, hockey and basketball were pretty demanding sports, no?

Wouldn't it be 'in their best interest' to start the seasons AFTER finals?

Lew I'm gonna agree with you on this..because with Hockey and Basketball you are also playing multiple games a weekend...so if you have a friday game your gonna miss classes...plus not be home for 2 days to write those papers
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: 'gro on October 15, 2007, 08:50:10 PM
boo freaking hoo, I've had this 25 page paper I was assigned when the semester started, but I was too preoccupied with the 3 hours I spent voluntarily playing non scholarship football each weekday to even get started.  Now that football is over (early), I can concentrate on my work with those precious 3 hours per day -- plus the entire weekend instead of just Sunday, how much fun that will be instead of playing football -- I've regained from that activity that I didn't have to sign up for in the 1st place. Now that I have a full 16 hours to concentrate on academics (all NESCAC students sleep for 8 hours, no more no less) there's no way that any other distraction of college life could possible derail my coursework.

Sincerely,

Johnny NESCAC
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: redswarm81 on October 15, 2007, 09:50:19 PM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on October 15, 2007, 08:42:09 PM

Riddle me this then...

Why might a school like Williams allow hockey season to start prior to their first game on 11/17/2007 running all the way through 2/23/2008.  Or even basketball running from 11/16/2007 until 2/28/2008.  Granted, they take off finals WEEK from games, but they still have to practice don't they?  How does that make any sense?  Last I checked, hockey and basketball were pretty demanding sports, no?

Wouldn't it be 'in their best interest' to start the seasons AFTER finals?

If you want to criticize NESCAC schools for letting their hockey seasons and basketball seasons threaten their commitment to the DIII principle of "academics over athletics," be my guest.

I happen to think that with respect to national football playoffs, NESCAC policy is consistent with their stated pledge of "academics before athletics."  I tend to praise commitment to principle, not criticize it.

I honestly don't know if NESCAC basketball and hockey teams have to practice during finals.  Do you know if NESCAC basketball and hockey teams have to practice during finals?

What does "in their best interest" have to do with anything?  In whose best interest?

I am aware that I started to acquire "dark matter" (neg karma) as soon as I posted my minority opinion.  Some people think that "there's too much free speechifyin' goin' on around here!"
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: redswarm81 on October 15, 2007, 09:55:09 PM
Quote from: Soopahmhanfifffty7 on October 15, 2007, 08:46:28 PM

. . . with Hockey and Basketball you are also playing multiple games a weekend...so if you have a friday game your gonna miss classes...plus not be home for 2 days to write those papers

Oh, is THAT the explanation, Supe57?  You played Hockey and Basketball?  That's a lot of classes missed fo sure.  ;D
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: redswarm81 on October 15, 2007, 10:19:37 PM
Quote from: 'gro on October 15, 2007, 08:09:27 PM
Can't think of a class where the final exam was more than (log10x2e)%, and those were rare. . .

You have "The Knack" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmYDgncMhXw (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmYDgncMhXw)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: @d3jason on November 16, 2007, 02:02:52 PM
New number 1, Mount Union 2007 ???
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on December 16, 2007, 03:40:03 PM
May I suggest that no team in the East made a statement to be put in this list this year? 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: JT on December 16, 2007, 04:59:48 PM
Quote from: pg04 on December 16, 2007, 03:40:03 PM
May I suggest that no team in the East made a statement to be put in this list this year? 

Ithaca did IMHO
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on December 16, 2007, 05:35:41 PM
Quote from: JT on December 16, 2007, 04:59:48 PM
Quote from: pg04 on December 16, 2007, 03:40:03 PM
May I suggest that no team in the East made a statement to be put in this list this year? 

Ithaca did IMHO

I thought about Ithaca too.  In terms of the whole season, Ithaca probably didnt deserve to be on this list.  But after seeing them in that last game, they were pretty dam good, and might have been deserving of this list at that point in the season.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: boobyhasgameyo on December 16, 2007, 08:08:06 PM
They weren't one of the 10 best teams since 1999.  Ithaca had a nice end to the season but they didn't accomplish anything noteworthy unless you guys are hanging your hats on losing to Mount Union by 24 instead of by 42 as a reason to be nominated.  Cortland and Alfred turned out to be pretenders so I would fully expect Ithaca to win the games they did late in the season. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on December 16, 2007, 09:21:37 PM
Quote from: boobyhasgameyo on December 16, 2007, 08:08:06 PM
They weren't one of the 10 best teams since 1999.  Ithaca had a nice end to the season but they didn't accomplish anything noteworthy unless you guys are hanging your hats on losing to Mount Union by 24 instead of by 42 as a reason to be nominated.  Cortland and Alfred turned out to be pretenders so I would fully expect Ithaca to win the games they did late in the season. 

I guess you have to ask yourself if the November 17, 2007 Bombers could beat the 2005 Union or Ithaca teams to which I think they could. 

But in terms of a ranking as a team the whole season they might not deserve to be that high.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: JT on December 17, 2007, 10:21:42 AM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on December 16, 2007, 05:35:41 PM
Quote from: JT on December 16, 2007, 04:59:48 PM
Quote from: pg04 on December 16, 2007, 03:40:03 PM
May I suggest that no team in the East made a statement to be put in this list this year? 

Ithaca did IMHO

I thought about Ithaca too.  In terms of the whole season, Ithaca probably didnt deserve to be on this list.  But after seeing them in that last game, they were pretty dam good, and might have been deserving of this list at that point in the season.

Somehow I read that no team from the East made a statement this year.  I guess they may be on the outside looking in at the top 10. I would however think that Ithaca should jump up pretty high in the final D3 top 25 poll, given that they played fairly well against #2 and #2 gave #1 a battle.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Frank Rossi on December 17, 2007, 12:47:01 PM
PC thinks MHB is a better #2, he said in his discussion with KMac and Gordon after the game (podcast located on the front page).  So, Ithaca may not have technically hung with #2 when the final poll comes out.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: JT on December 17, 2007, 12:57:25 PM
Quote from: Frank Rossi on December 17, 2007, 12:47:01 PM
PC thinks MHB is a better #2, he said in his discussion with KMac and Gordon after the game (podcast located on the front page).  So, Ithaca may not have technically hung with #2 when the final poll comes out.

A case for MHB being #2 can certainly be made.  I think #1, #2, #3 are very close.  UWW, MUC, and MHB all could have realistically taken the title given a few plays and and bounces one way or another.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: AUPepBand on December 17, 2007, 01:17:30 PM
Quote from: JT on December 17, 2007, 10:21:42 AM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on December 16, 2007, 05:35:41 PM
Quote from: JT on December 16, 2007, 04:59:48 PM
Quote from: pg04 on December 16, 2007, 03:40:03 PM
May I suggest that no team in the East made a statement to be put in this list this year? 

Ithaca did IMHO

I thought about Ithaca too.  In terms of the whole season, Ithaca probably didnt deserve to be on this list.  But after seeing them in that last game, they were pretty dam good, and might have been deserving of this list at that point in the season.

Somehow I read that no team from the East made a statement this year.  I guess they may be on the outside looking in at the top 10. I would however think that Ithaca should jump up pretty high in the final D3 top 25 poll, given that they played fairly well against #2 and #2 gave #1 a battle.

Pep stated to FDC tailgaters prior to IC's 42-25 win over Pep's Saxons at Butterfield that, "This Ithaca team is much better than was on the field early in the season." The Bombers, after faltering early at Hartwick and against Fisher, got its act together and was all business after that.

After years of AU losing 30-0 games to Ithaca in Week 2 or 3, Pep was happy that the IC game was moved toward the end of the season....until this year!

On Saxons!

Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: K-Mack on February 05, 2008, 12:44:31 AM
East Region threads ... still a thrilling read months after the posts.

Well in!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pg04 on June 13, 2009, 11:11:41 PM
Would any of the 2008 teams in the east make it to this list?  Once again, like 2007, I don't think so.

Thoughts?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: theoriginalupstate on June 13, 2009, 11:45:15 PM
The only one that has a chance from 2008 would be Cortland.  11-2 and had a decent showing at MUC. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pumkinattack on June 14, 2009, 05:05:22 PM
I wouldn't include any of them. 

Can't really make the case for Cortland with the Ithaca game, two NEFC opponents in the playoffs and their conference didn't get a second team into the field. 

Seems like you need two of three between tough and undefeated non-conference, strong conference (two teams in is the barometer here, I think) and/or winning one or two difficult playoff games to be a "great" or top ten team. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: AUPepBand on June 16, 2009, 09:02:36 AM
Given the title of this thread, Pep was curious as to what D3 Eastern Region football programs had accumulated the most wins since 1999. Thanks to d3football.com, that information was easy to find, particularly for a library assistant!

Top 20 Eastern Regional Teams By Wins Since 1999:
1) Curry (91)
2) Rowan (89)
3) Ithaca (83)
4) Widener (77)
    Hobart (77)
6) RPI (75)
7) Montclair (72)
8  Union (71)
9) Bridgewater State (69)
    Brockport State (69)
11) Cortland State (68)
12) St. John Fisher (67)
      Springfield (67)
14) Trinity (65)
15) Delaware Valley (64)
      Western Connecticut (64)
      Wilkes (64)
18) Alfred (63)
19) Lycoming (62)
      Massachusetts-Dartmouth (62)

Pep knows that this will certainly be cause for discussion as "strength of schedule" may have something to do with win production. Nevertheless, these are the "facts" pertaining to the matter.



Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pumkinattack on June 16, 2009, 11:46:12 AM
That's pretty interesting. 

If anyone has the motivation, what's the overall winning percentages and winning percentages against others in the top 20?  That would really tell us where these teams stood. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on June 16, 2009, 12:26:17 PM
Quote from: pumkinattack on June 16, 2009, 11:46:12 AM
That's pretty interesting. 

If anyone has the motivation, what's the overall winning percentages and winning percentages against others in the top 20?  That would really tell us where these teams stood. 

Well it just took me 10 minutes to figure out Ithacas record against these teams..

-Ithaca has played these teams in 68 games since 1999.

-Ithaca has played the rest of their games (not in this list of top 20 eastern winning teams) 43 times.

-They are 44-24 with a .647 winning percentage against teams in the top 20 for wins.

-Ithaca is 39-4 against the rest of those teams.

Heres the break down

Versus the top 20

SJF-      6-4
SC-       8-2
Bport-   6-4
Hobart  3-2
cortlnd  5-5
union    0-2
alfred   8-1
wilkes   1-0
montclr  2-0
rpi         1-1
rowan   0-1
lycoming 3-1
umass    1-0
curry      0-1

Versus those not in the top 20

Mansfield    3-0
New jersy   1-0
st lawrnce   5-0
AIC              0-1
Buff St         7-1
Utica           8-0
Hartwick      6-1
Norwich       5-0
Huntington  1-0
Kings           2-0
Mt union      0-1
Frostburt    1-0
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: slick on June 16, 2009, 01:07:00 PM
Quote from: AUPepBand on June 16, 2009, 09:02:36 AM
Given the title of this thread, Pep was curious as to what D3 Eastern Region football programs had accumulated the most wins since 1999. Thanks to d3football.com, that information was easy to find, particularly for a library assistant!

Top 20 Eastern Regional Teams By Wins Since 1999:
1) Curry (91)
2) Rowan (89)
3) Ithaca (83)
4) Widener (77)
    Hobart (77)
6) RPI (75)
7) Montclair (72)
8  Union (71)
9) Bridgewater State (69)
    Brockport State (69)
11) Cortland State (68)
12) St. John Fisher (67)
      Springfield (67)
14) Trinity (65)
15) Delaware Valley (64)
      Western Connecticut (64)
      Wilkes (64)
18) Alfred (63)
19) Lycoming (62)
      Massachusetts-Dartmouth (62)

Pep knows that this will certainly be cause for discussion as "strength of schedule" may have something to do with win production. Nevertheless, these are the "facts" pertaining to the matter.


Trinity is only allowed 8 games a season (NESCAC rules) so 63-17 since '99, .787 winning pct.
Like to see a winning pct list for the last 5 years, ... is that info handy?

Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: AUPepBand on June 16, 2009, 04:50:41 PM
(Notso) Slick:  If you wanna do the work, that info is certainly available....I look forward to seeing the results of your labors.

Pep added the (Notso) because Slick unwittingly added his comments WITHIN his quote of my post, thereby making it appear that Pep was speaking.  ;)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Ralph Turner on June 16, 2009, 04:58:57 PM
Quote from: AUPepBand on June 16, 2009, 04:50:41 PM
(Notso) Slick:  If you wanna do the work, that info is certainly available....I look forward to seeing the results of your labors.

Pep added the (Notso) because Slick unwittingly added his comments WITHIN his quote of my post, thereby making it appear that Pep was speaking.  ;)

Yeah, it appears that he is a newbie (with just 16 posts) and is just learning all of the buttons.

I don't know whether he has the modify button on his toolbar, yet.

;)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: theoriginalupstate on June 16, 2009, 05:19:57 PM
Quote from: slick on June 16, 2009, 01:07:00 PM
Quote from: AUPepBand on June 16, 2009, 09:02:36 AM
Given the title of this thread, Pep was curious as to what D3 Eastern Region football programs had accumulated the most wins since 1999. Thanks to d3football.com, that information was easy to find, particularly for a library assistant!

Top 20 Eastern Regional Teams By Wins Since 1999:
1) Curry (91)
2) Rowan (89)
3) Ithaca (83)
4) Widener (77)
    Hobart (77)
6) RPI (75)
7) Montclair (72)
8  Union (71)
9) Bridgewater State (69)
    Brockport State (69)
11) Cortland State (68)
12) St. John Fisher (67)
      Springfield (67)
14) Trinity (65)
15) Delaware Valley (64)
      Western Connecticut (64)
      Wilkes (64)
18) Alfred (63)
19) Lycoming (62)
      Massachusetts-Dartmouth (62)

Pep knows that this will certainly be cause for discussion as "strength of schedule" may have something to do with win production. Nevertheless, these are the "facts" pertaining to the matter.

Trinity is only allowed 8 games a season (NESCAC rules) so 63-17 since '99, .787 winning pct.
Like to see a winning pct list for the last 5 years, ... is that info handy?

Figure them out for yourselves..

SJF has a .78 winning percentage over the past 5 years (48-13)...
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pumkinattack on June 16, 2009, 09:44:48 PM
Pep,

  I'm sure you just went through all east teams and I know this discussion is had ad nauseum, but I mentally threw out Trinity already since they don't compete with the rest of the region. 

  Notice that the slickster ignores the W/L vs other top 20 teams but wants to talk winning percentage. 

  I may go through Hobart's in the next few days, but my thought on W/L vs. other top 20 and winning percentage was that it would provide better color on relative strength.  I'm thinking Rowan comes out on top of that one and the NEFC teams quickly drop down the list. 

JU, good work on IC.  How do you feel about the losing record, 4-5, against the LL top 3? ;D
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: labart96 on June 16, 2009, 10:54:21 PM
Quote from: pumkinattack on June 16, 2009, 09:44:48 PM
Pep,

  I'm sure you just went through all east teams and I know this discussion is had ad nauseum, but I mentally threw out Trinity already since they don't compete with the rest of the region. 

  Notice that the slickster ignores the W/L vs other top 20 teams but wants to talk winning percentage. 

  I may go through Hobart's in the next few days, but my thought on W/L vs. other top 20 and winning percentage was that it would provide better color on relative strength.  I'm thinking Rowan comes out on top of that one and the NEFC teams quickly drop down the list. 

JU, good work on IC.  How do you feel about the losing record, 4-5, against the LL top 3? ;D

TGP calc's Bart's WP as approx 75% since 99.  Approx 80% since '04
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pumkinattack on June 16, 2009, 11:19:56 PM
Hobart since 99:

   1999   2000   2001   2002   2003   2004   2005   2006   2007   2008   W/L   %
1) Curry (91)   -   -   -   -   -   W   -   -   -   -   1-0   100.0%
2) Rowan (89)   -   -   -   -   -   L   -   L   -   -   0-2   0.0%
3) Ithaca (83)   L   W   L   W   L   -   -   -   -   -   2-3   40.0%
4) Widener (77)   -   L   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   0-1   0.0%
6) RPI (75)   L   W   L   W   W   W   W   W   L   W   7-3   70.0%
8  Union (71)   L   W   L   W   W   W   L   L   W   L   5-5   50.0%
9) Bridgewater State (69)   -   W   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   1-0   100.0%
11) Cortland State (68)   -   -   -   -   -   -   W   -   -   -   1-0   100.0%
12) St. John Fisher (67)   W   W   W   L   L   -   -   -   L   -   3-3   50.0%
14) Trinity (65)   NA   NA   NA   NA   NA   NA   NA   NA   NA   NA   NA   NA
15) Delaware Valley (64)   -   -   -   -   -   -   L   -   -   -   0-1   0.0%
18) Alfred (63)   W   W   W   W   W   -   -   W   W   -   7-0   100.0%
19) Lycoming (62)   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   W   1-0   100.0%
                                 28-18   60.9%
                                    
Dickinson   L   W   W   W   L   W   W   W   L   W   7-3   70.0%
Franklin & Marshall   W   W   W   W   W   L   W   -   -   -   6-1   85.7%
SLU   W   W   W   W   W   W   W   W   W   W   10-0   100.0%
U of R   W   L   W   W   L   W   W   W   W   W   8-2   80.0%
WPI   -   -   -   -   -   W   W   W   W   W   5-0   100.0%
Susquehanna   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   W   W   2-0   100.0%
Coast Guard   -   -   -   -   -   W   W   -   -   -   2-0   100.0%
Mt. Union    -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   L   0-1   0.0%
John Carroll   -   -   -   L   -   -   -   -   -   -   0-1   0.0%
MMA   -   -   -   -   -   W   W   W   W   W   5-0   100.0%
Norwich   -   -   -   -   W   -   -   -   -   -   1-0   100.0%
William Paterson   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   W   -   -   1-0   100.0%
Carneige Mellon   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -   W   W   2-0   100.0%
                                 49-8   86.0%
                                 77-26   74.8%

I can't get the formatting to drop in the way it looks on my spreadsheet, but here's the upshot.  75% overall (just under) as TGP stated.  28-18 (60.9%) against this top 20 list and 49-8 (86%) against others including a 13-6 vs E8 (incl. 03 Norwich game), 43-10 vs. LL 1-2 vs MAC (all postseason) and 2-1 vs NJAC (one non playoff win vs Willy P).  The E8 is skewed a little by a 7-0 record vs. AU.  Also of note is a 7-3 record vs a solid Dickinson program that probably has won 70 or percent of its own games and has made multiple appearances in the playoffs in the CC.

Not quite as good as IC, but close and I think we've earned some street cred over the last decade. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: AUPepBand on June 16, 2009, 11:32:04 PM
Quote from: pumkinattack on June 16, 2009, 09:44:48 PM
Pep,

  I'm sure you just went through all east teams and I know this discussion is had ad nauseum, but I mentally threw out Trinity already since they don't compete with the rest of the region. 

  Notice that the slickster ignores the W/L vs other top 20 teams but wants to talk winning percentage. 

  I may go through Hobart's in the next few days, but my thought on W/L vs. other top 20 and winning percentage was that it would provide better color on relative strength.  I'm thinking Rowan comes out on top of that one and the NEFC teams quickly drop down the list. 

JU, good work on IC.  How do you feel about the losing record, 4-5, against the LL top 3? ;D

You're right, Pumpkin....Pep went through the entire East Region as they appear on this website...65 teams if Pep remembers correctly. Indeed, that includes the exclusive group that has resulted in domination for Trinity and humiliation for Hamilton, although the Continentals will continue to improve their record under Stetson.

Pep only wishes Hobart had chosen to host his Saxons Oct. 17, 2009 to provide a solid tenth game for both programs. But Pep understands that with its sights on the NCAA Playoffs, a Hobart team that is 8-1 with one loss in the LL has a much better chance at a Pool C than an 8-2 Hobart team. Hobart has nothing to gain by beating Alfred but a loss would be devastating. That's the one thing Pep regrets with the NCAA Playoffs...it plays too much into scheduling when in the pre-tourney days, everyone was happy to meet for a backyard brawl for gridiron bragging rights.

Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Jonny Utah on June 17, 2009, 12:23:18 AM
Quote from: pumkinattack on June 16, 2009, 09:44:48 PM


JU, good work on IC.  How do you feel about the losing record, 4-5, against the LL top 3? ;D

Well of those 9 games, 4 were playoff games (3 NCAA and an ECAC game), and most were against the LL's best team.  So I don't feel too bad, as they would probably have a better record against those teams if they played them every year.

And if IC is putting St. Lawrence and Union on the regular season slate, I can only imagine that Hobart will go back on in the near future as well.

Hobart/Ithaca seems like just a natrual upstate rivalry game that should be played every year.  1-2 hour day trip games between two teams like IC and Hobart are too hard to pass up..........but this makes me think again about these automatic bids and why I don't like them.  Pool A bids make some teams think about playing the best teams around.  I know they are good for d3 sports in general, but I still don't like them.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pumkinattack on June 17, 2009, 09:25:25 AM
Quote from: AUPepBand on June 16, 2009, 11:32:04 PM

You're right, Pumpkin....Pep went through the entire East Region as they appear on this website...65 teams if Pep remembers correctly. Indeed, that includes the exclusive group that has resulted in domination for Trinity and humiliation for Hamilton, although the Continentals will continue to improve their record under Stetson.

Pep only wishes Hobart had chosen to host his Saxons Oct. 17, 2009 to provide a solid tenth game for both programs. But Pep understands that with its sights on the NCAA Playoffs, a Hobart team that is 8-1 with one loss in the LL has a much better chance at a Pool C than an 8-2 Hobart team. Hobart has nothing to gain by beating Alfred but a loss would be devastating. That's the one thing Pep regrets with the NCAA Playoffs...it plays too much into scheduling when in the pre-tourney days, everyone was happy to meet for a backyard brawl for gridiron bragging rights.


I'd like to continue to play AU and IC (drop MMA if they weren't a league game, makes no sense to have in the conference except to rattle RPI's cage last year), but I think they'd only add one of those by dropping another game, e.g. not playing ten.  It's hard because I also like having Dickinson, which has been a longstanding game, every year since at least 1995 and Carnegie Mellon/Franklin & Marshall for the geographic diversity from NYS play.  Unless they go back to a tenth game, and unfortunately I don't see it happening except for as a filler as Susquehanna goes out of the LL on a temporary basis, I can't see Bart swapping either of their first two OOC games for either AU or IC.  It'd be interesting to see who they did add if there was a tenth game on the schedule, if it came down to AU or IC. 

In fairness, Hobart has won it's share of pool A bids since 2004 also, so it's not like they're going into the season assuming to have to take a pool C.  Typically, Hobart has been the only on of the LL's big three to not drop a stupid game to a non big three and is 7-3 vs. RPI and 5-5 vs. Union in this past decade.  RPI-Union is pretty even (don't know exactly).  It's also not like we play patsies (re: RPI) in OOC.  Dickinson should be pretty good with an excellent WR and solid D coming back and Carnegie is usually pretty good, if an odd offense to play.  If I was dropping one, it'd be Carnegie.  We've beaten them the last two years, but the game is brutal.  We lost a Will LB ( FR Reggie Robinson) and they just punish the right side of your D with big blockers/RB's and FB's all day and its an offense you're not likely to see again.  This year the secondary and outside should be stronger than the interior for Bart, though. 

Quote from: Jonny Utah on June 17, 2009, 12:23:18 AM

Well of those 9 games, 4 were playoff games (3 NCAA and an ECAC game), and most were against the LL's best team.  So I don't feel too bad, as they would probably have a better record against those teams if they played them every year.

And if IC is putting St. Lawrence and Union on the regular season slate, I can only imagine that Hobart will go back on in the near future as well.

Hobart/Ithaca seems like just a natrual upstate rivalry game that should be played every year.  1-2 hour day trip games between two teams like IC and Hobart are too hard to pass up..........but this makes me think again about these automatic bids and why I don't like them.  Pool A bids make some teams think about playing the best teams around.  I know they are good for d3 sports in general, but I still don't like them.

I liked the IC-Hobart game even though I caught the tail end of IC's dominance (although that 96 game in the COLD was pretty close).  Took until 2000's shutout to get that monkey off the back.  Battle of the Native American Finger Lakes?  If it takes you two hours, to Geneva your driving way to slow or cutting across to Watkins Glen and then up.  It's 96 all the way (or if you like a little more scenic, 89 until the Ovid cutover to 96) in an hour tops. 

You'll quickly improve your LL record if you are going to schedule SLU regularly. 

Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: redswarm81 on September 10, 2009, 01:17:58 AM
Quote from: Jonny Utah on June 16, 2009, 12:26:17 PM
. . .

-Ithaca has played these teams in 68 games since 1999.

-They are 44-24 with a .647 winning percentage against teams in the top 20 for wins.
. . .

Heres the break down

Versus the top 20
. . .

curry      0-1


Boy, that one entry sure looks odd.

Quote from: slick on June 16, 2009, 01:07:00 PM

Like to see a winning pct list for the last 5 years, ... is that info handy?


The 9 game schedules would probably bump RPI and 'bart ahead of WideNer in winning percentage.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Bombers798891 on December 18, 2012, 01:23:38 PM
I'm reviving a zombie thread because I had an interesting chat with Mike Welch last week, and we were discussing the best Bomber teams/players of the past dozen or so years, and I mentioned that I've always believed his 2004 team was his best. He smiled, nodded, and said "Yup". I think the 2001 and 2003 Bomber teams got mentioned on here, and I understand why—they won two playoff games; the 2004 team missed the NCAA's completely—but I think that 2004 team is criminally underrated. It was interesting to hear that seconded by Welch
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: ITH radio on December 18, 2012, 01:32:55 PM
that is interesting re welch - btw how is he doing health wise?

recall him stepping down due to issues w. his heart this season.  good to hear he's doing ok and talking shop. 

On a separate note, we should throw the 2012 statesmen into this category now too. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: lewdogg11 on December 18, 2012, 01:52:42 PM
This is meant in now way to put down 2012 Hobart, but my biggest issue here with ranking them among the Top 10 is that we really don't know how good they were.  For all we know Widener, Cortland, and even Salisbury, Rowan, Fisher, Kean, Lyco or Del Val could have beaten Washington & Lee and Wittenburg.  Maybe not, but because of the unfamiliarity, it's tough to rank where they are in the East.  Would I put them in the Top 10?  Sure.  Where?  Tough call, but probably in the 8-10 range.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Bombers798891 on December 18, 2012, 02:51:47 PM
Quote from: ITH radio on December 18, 2012, 01:32:55 PM
that is interesting re welch - btw how is he doing health wise?

recall him stepping down due to issues w. his heart this season.  good to hear he's doing ok and talking shop. 

On a separate note, we should throw the 2012 statesmen into this category now too.

He was in good spirits and said he felt fine, which is great to hear
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pumkinattack on December 18, 2012, 03:52:31 PM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on December 18, 2012, 01:52:42 PM
This is meant in now way to put down 2012 Hobart, but my biggest issue here with ranking them among the Top 10 is that we really don't know how good they were.  For all we know Widener, Cortland, and even Salisbury, Rowan, Fisher, Kean, Lyco or Del Val could have beaten Washington & Lee and Wittenburg.  Maybe not, but because of the unfamiliarity, it's tough to rank where they are in the East.  Would I put them in the Top 10?  Sure.  Where?  Tough call, but probably in the 8-10 range.

That's fair and the OOC wasn't great this year as well.  I felt like the 2008 and 2011 Hobart teams were as good as any in the East, but because they got MUC in Round 2 and Wesley in Round 1 those years, other teams were sort of crowned best of the East.  The idea that the 2008 Cortland team was so great doesn't resonate with me at all as they had a cakewalk through the first two rounds.  Last year, well I just think (to steal a phrase from a prior post) that Hobart was criminally underrated.  Same team as this year basically with better receivers (slightly weaker at one or two defensive positions) and end up unranked because of an oddball loss to RPI (the team that the league game gave their QB Offensive Player of the Year two years running) where we had no kicking game (couldn't make one from 5 yards out literally) on a wild comeback. 

It's an extension of the same argument we (east) have vs the rest of the region.  Guys claiming that the East's best would be #3 or #4 in a top conference meanwhile Hobart laid waste to the team that dropped 52 on the OAC #2.  W&L is a good team, IMO, could compete with the top of the East's conferences.  Not saying they'd win, but they'd perform as well as Springfield/SJF/IC/AU did this year (8-3 and you can argue after they lost their top 2-3 QB's that you could really write off the first few games).  I'm not really how good Wittenburg is.  That conference is more or less on par with the LL overall.  Considering that most of the experts had Heidelberg going to St Thomas, the fact Witt went to their field and put up 52 is fairly impressive.  By virtue of the east region fan poll and the people who follow the East closely, its safe to say that Hobart/Widener are the top 2.  Widener did beat Sals in Round 2 and Sals won the E8 so that knocks out SJF.  Kean and Rowan, I don't know bout the NJAC, but they still get street cred for what Rowan did back when I was playing (and I feel old).  Lyco and Del Val, they both lost to Widener.  Basically Widener can stand tall over those guys.  You have to extrapolate a little more for Hobart and the W&L game doesn't tell much (other than they held the best rushing team in the country - better than Sals, to half their total) other than a good win, but I think the Wittenberg win, by a large margin in a game that was over well before the 4th quarter tells a pretty good story for them. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: lewdogg11 on December 18, 2012, 04:25:21 PM
Quote from: pumkinattack on December 18, 2012, 03:52:31 PM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on December 18, 2012, 01:52:42 PM
This is meant in now way to put down 2012 Hobart, but my biggest issue here with ranking them among the Top 10 is that we really don't know how good they were.  For all we know Widener, Cortland, and even Salisbury, Rowan, Fisher, Kean, Lyco or Del Val could have beaten Washington & Lee and Wittenburg.  Maybe not, but because of the unfamiliarity, it's tough to rank where they are in the East.  Would I put them in the Top 10?  Sure.  Where?  Tough call, but probably in the 8-10 range.

That's fair and the OOC wasn't great this year as well.  I felt like the 2008 and 2011 Hobart teams were as good as any in the East, but because they got MUC in Round 2 and Wesley in Round 1 those years, other teams were sort of crowned best of the East.  The idea that the 2008 Cortland team was so great doesn't resonate with me at all as they had a cakewalk through the first two rounds.  Last year, well I just think (to steal a phrase from a prior post) that Hobart was criminally underrated.  Same team as this year basically with better receivers (slightly weaker at one or two defensive positions) and end up unranked because of an oddball loss to RPI (the team that the league game gave their QB Offensive Player of the Year two years running) where we had no kicking game (couldn't make one from 5 yards out literally) on a wild comeback. 

It's an extension of the same argument we (east) have vs the rest of the region.  Guys claiming that the East's best would be #3 or #4 in a top conference meanwhile Hobart laid waste to the team that dropped 52 on the OAC #2.  W&L is a good team, IMO, could compete with the top of the East's conferences.  Not saying they'd win, but they'd perform as well as Springfield/SJF/IC/AU did this year (8-3 and you can argue after they lost their top 2-3 QB's that you could really write off the first few games).  I'm not really how good Wittenburg is.  That conference is more or less on par with the LL overall.  Considering that most of the experts had Heidelberg going to St Thomas, the fact Witt went to their field and put up 52 is fairly impressive.  By virtue of the east region fan poll and the people who follow the East closely, its safe to say that Hobart/Widener are the top 2.  Widener did beat Sals in Round 2 and Sals won the E8 so that knocks out SJF.  Kean and Rowan, I don't know bout the NJAC, but they still get street cred for what Rowan did back when I was playing (and I feel old).  Lyco and Del Val, they both lost to Widener.  Basically Widener can stand tall over those guys.  You have to extrapolate a little more for Hobart and the W&L game doesn't tell much (other than they held the best rushing team in the country - better than Sals, to half their total) other than a good win, but I think the Wittenberg win, by a large margin in a game that was over well before the 4th quarter tells a pretty good story for them.

I'm totally with you.  And I would definitely rank Hobart #1 in the East this year with Widener a close 2.  But it's a strange feeling not to know where they stand overall in recent history.  RPI in 2003 beat a really good Ithaca team and what I thought was a National Championship caliber Springfield team.  It was easier to gauge them.  Like you kind of said, my major issue was were they even better than Widener?  We really have no way to be sure.  I feel like to us East people, the Widener victory over Salisbury holds more water than Hobart beating W&L or Witt.  Only because we are more familiar with them and their strength in comparison to the rest of the region.  But then they went and got blown out by Mount and it got tarnished. 

Hobart season was a great one, but it didn't have that marquee win or close loss to a great team.  Almost beating Wesley last year and blowing out Fisher made the 2011 team appear more impressive to me.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Bombers798891 on December 18, 2012, 04:35:12 PM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on December 18, 2012, 04:25:21 PM
Quote from: pumkinattack on December 18, 2012, 03:52:31 PM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on December 18, 2012, 01:52:42 PM
This is meant in now way to put down 2012 Hobart, but my biggest issue here with ranking them among the Top 10 is that we really don't know how good they were.  For all we know Widener, Cortland, and even Salisbury, Rowan, Fisher, Kean, Lyco or Del Val could have beaten Washington & Lee and Wittenburg.  Maybe not, but because of the unfamiliarity, it's tough to rank where they are in the East.  Would I put them in the Top 10?  Sure.  Where?  Tough call, but probably in the 8-10 range.

That's fair and the OOC wasn't great this year as well.  I felt like the 2008 and 2011 Hobart teams were as good as any in the East, but because they got MUC in Round 2 and Wesley in Round 1 those years, other teams were sort of crowned best of the East.  The idea that the 2008 Cortland team was so great doesn't resonate with me at all as they had a cakewalk through the first two rounds.  Last year, well I just think (to steal a phrase from a prior post) that Hobart was criminally underrated.  Same team as this year basically with better receivers (slightly weaker at one or two defensive positions) and end up unranked because of an oddball loss to RPI (the team that the league game gave their QB Offensive Player of the Year two years running) where we had no kicking game (couldn't make one from 5 yards out literally) on a wild comeback. 

It's an extension of the same argument we (east) have vs the rest of the region.  Guys claiming that the East's best would be #3 or #4 in a top conference meanwhile Hobart laid waste to the team that dropped 52 on the OAC #2.  W&L is a good team, IMO, could compete with the top of the East's conferences.  Not saying they'd win, but they'd perform as well as Springfield/SJF/IC/AU did this year (8-3 and you can argue after they lost their top 2-3 QB's that you could really write off the first few games).  I'm not really how good Wittenburg is.  That conference is more or less on par with the LL overall.  Considering that most of the experts had Heidelberg going to St Thomas, the fact Witt went to their field and put up 52 is fairly impressive.  By virtue of the east region fan poll and the people who follow the East closely, its safe to say that Hobart/Widener are the top 2.  Widener did beat Sals in Round 2 and Sals won the E8 so that knocks out SJF.  Kean and Rowan, I don't know bout the NJAC, but they still get street cred for what Rowan did back when I was playing (and I feel old).  Lyco and Del Val, they both lost to Widener.  Basically Widener can stand tall over those guys.  You have to extrapolate a little more for Hobart and the W&L game doesn't tell much (other than they held the best rushing team in the country - better than Sals, to half their total) other than a good win, but I think the Wittenberg win, by a large margin in a game that was over well before the 4th quarter tells a pretty good story for them.

I'm totally with you.  And I would definitely rank Hobart #1 in the East this year with Widener a close 2.  But it's a strange feeling not to know where they stand overall in recent history.  RPI in 2003 beat a really good Ithaca team and what I thought was a National Championship caliber Springfield team.  It was easier to gauge them.  Like you kind of said, my major issue was were they even better than Widener?  We really have no way to be sure.  I feel like to us East people, the Widener victory over Salisbury holds more water than Hobart beating W&L or Witt.  Only because we are more familiar with them and their strength in comparison to the rest of the region.  But then they went and got blown out by Mount and it got tarnished. 

Hobart season was a great one, but it didn't have that marquee win or close loss to a great team.  Almost beating Wesley last year and blowing out Fisher made the 2011 team appear more impressive to me.

Man, that Springfield/IC/RPI trio in 2003 was really good. Springfield took a nasty Ithaca team to the cleaners that season...
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: bman on December 18, 2012, 04:52:45 PM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on December 18, 2012, 04:25:21 PM
Quote from: pumkinattack on December 18, 2012, 03:52:31 PM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on December 18, 2012, 01:52:42 PM
This is meant in now way to put down 2012 Hobart, but my biggest issue here with ranking them among the Top 10 is that we really don't know how good they were.  For all we know Widener, Cortland, and even Salisbury, Rowan, Fisher, Kean, Lyco or Del Val could have beaten Washington & Lee and Wittenburg.  Maybe not, but because of the unfamiliarity, it's tough to rank where they are in the East.  Would I put them in the Top 10?  Sure.  Where?  Tough call, but probably in the 8-10 range.

That's fair and the OOC wasn't great this year as well.  I felt like the 2008 and 2011 Hobart teams were as good as any in the East, but because they got MUC in Round 2 and Wesley in Round 1 those years, other teams were sort of crowned best of the East.  The idea that the 2008 Cortland team was so great doesn't resonate with me at all as they had a cakewalk through the first two rounds.  Last year, well I just think (to steal a phrase from a prior post) that Hobart was criminally underrated.  Same team as this year basically with better receivers (slightly weaker at one or two defensive positions) and end up unranked because of an oddball loss to RPI (the team that the league game gave their QB Offensive Player of the Year two years running) where we had no kicking game (couldn't make one from 5 yards out literally) on a wild comeback. 

It's an extension of the same argument we (east) have vs the rest of the region.  Guys claiming that the East's best would be #3 or #4 in a top conference meanwhile Hobart laid waste to the team that dropped 52 on the OAC #2.  W&L is a good team, IMO, could compete with the top of the East's conferences.  Not saying they'd win, but they'd perform as well as Springfield/SJF/IC/AU did this year (8-3 and you can argue after they lost their top 2-3 QB's that you could really write off the first few games).  I'm not really how good Wittenburg is.  That conference is more or less on par with the LL overall.  Considering that most of the experts had Heidelberg going to St Thomas, the fact Witt went to their field and put up 52 is fairly impressive.  By virtue of the east region fan poll and the people who follow the East closely, its safe to say that Hobart/Widener are the top 2.  Widener did beat Sals in Round 2 and Sals won the E8 so that knocks out SJF.  Kean and Rowan, I don't know bout the NJAC, but they still get street cred for what Rowan did back when I was playing (and I feel old).  Lyco and Del Val, they both lost to Widener.  Basically Widener can stand tall over those guys.  You have to extrapolate a little more for Hobart and the W&L game doesn't tell much (other than they held the best rushing team in the country - better than Sals, to half their total) other than a good win, but I think the Wittenberg win, by a large margin in a game that was over well before the 4th quarter tells a pretty good story for them.

I'm totally with you.  And I would definitely rank Hobart #1 in the East this year with Widener a close 2.  But it's a strange feeling not to know where they stand overall in recent history.  RPI in 2003 beat a really good Ithaca team and what I thought was a National Championship caliber Springfield team.  It was easier to gauge them.  Like you kind of said, my major issue was were they even better than Widener?  We really have no way to be sure.  I feel like to us East people, the Widener victory over Salisbury holds more water than Hobart beating W&L or Witt.  Only because we are more familiar with them and their strength in comparison to the rest of the region.  But then they went and got blown out by Mount and it got tarnished.  Hobart season was a great one, but it didn't have that marquee win or close loss to a great team.  Almost beating Wesley last year and blowing out Fisher made the 2011 team appear more impressive to me.

Barring UHMB, Wesley, ST Thomas and Osh Kosh, I think all East teams fare the same against UMU right now...
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Bombers798891 on December 19, 2012, 01:46:37 PM
Quote from: LewDogg11 on December 18, 2012, 04:25:21 PM

Hobart season was a great one, but it didn't have that marquee win or close loss to a great team.  Almost beating Wesley last year and blowing out Fisher made the 2011 team appear more impressive to me.

I'm going to go with the 2012 team. Seven wins in a bad conference is a pretty paltry resume. But that 2011 team was good too
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pumkinattack on December 19, 2012, 02:25:05 PM
One of those wins was 56-20 at Fisher.  Supposedly the 8th best team in the country at the end of the season (and Fisher beat the crap out of Hobart the year before when we were opening the new Boswell field so it was turn about so to speak). 

So really you'd be comparing 7-2 (2011) 1-1 vs ranked teams both on the road (aforementioned Fisher game & close loss to Wesley in Rnd 1), OOC wins vs Dickinson & SJF, loss to RPI (1pt, we missed multiple FG's from close and Hermann played the half of his career after being down 28-7)  vs.

12-1 (2012) 1-1 vs ranked teams w at home l on the road (and not a "good" loss, but circumstances certainly didn't break Hobart's way which did impact the final score by 14pts or so).  OOC wins (all by 20 or more) vs Dickinson, Geneva & Utica.  No reg season losses. 

I think if you gave the 2011 team the path Hobart had this year or SJF's path last year, the 2011 team would have finished 9-2, but that's the nature of the draw.  This is the first year it's really helped Hobart out.  Of the past I don't know how many (7-10 or so), they've gotten a couple of good first round draws, but a couple of bad ones, but rarely has the second round been a team below the top 10 in the country and all on the road.  Hopefully they can earn better draws in future years, but it's clear (and Pat mentioned it on in the huddle at one point, shortly after the MMA game) that the collective wisdom does incorporate this notion that it's how far you go in the playoffs and also that they often look at final scores (same podcast thinking the MMA game was genuinely close because they closed the game from 35-6 going into the 4th to 42-21 or whatever the final score was vs the deep backups).  I think both of those notions are fallible, but I don't vote or get that involved, so it's just a private complaint (perhaps shared by others).   
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Bombers798891 on December 19, 2012, 02:49:49 PM
Quote from: pumkinattack on December 19, 2012, 02:25:05 PM
One of those wins was 56-20 at Fisher.  Supposedly the 8th best team in the country at the end of the season (and Fisher beat the crap out of Hobart the year before when we were opening the new Boswell field so it was turn about so to speak). 

So really you'd be comparing 7-2 (2011) 1-1 vs ranked teams both on the road (aforementioned Fisher game & close loss to Wesley in Rnd 1), OOC wins vs Dickinson & SJF, loss to RPI (1pt, we missed multiple FG's from close and Hermann played the half of his career after being down 28-7)  vs.

12-1 (2012) 1-1 vs ranked teams w at home l on the road (and not a "good" loss, but circumstances certainly didn't break Hobart's way which did impact the final score by 14pts or so).  OOC wins (all by 20 or more) vs Dickinson, Geneva & Utica.  No reg season losses. 


That RPI loss is one of the big things. That was a 4-5 team that did not beat a single other team with a winning record and lost to a 2-7 WPI and a 3-7 MM. It may have been a fluky sort of game, but this season's Hobart team played a bunch of teams that were probably as good, if not better than that RPI team, and won impressively.

Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pumkinattack on December 19, 2012, 03:41:46 PM
That's fine.  I love both teams.  It was a fluky game and I still don't know what the hell happened as we were up 28-7 at the half.  Comes down to the argument of who you beat vs. who you played/lost to.  That debate goes on every year in all regions. 

Interestingly, w the St Thomas game - we lost Devin Worthington on the first defensive play (from our 4 on a bad snap on a punt) - either 1b or #2 most important guy on the team and the magnitude of the dropoff to the backup is massive (with all due respect to Dimarco, Hearon and the rest of the SS/OLB's).  I see the Linfield guys claiming their game with OshKosh could've been different had they not lost to a defensive player (Dom Forrest - LB & 2nd team AA from D3FB.com).  Depth matters when you get to that point, but there's a handful of guys that just can't be replaced mid season every year.  Usually a QB or RB, but sometimes it's defense.  We played better without Strang and our #3 WR last year vs. Wesley than we did w/o Worthington vs. St Thomas. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 19, 2012, 04:27:54 PM
Of course, the Oshkosh-Linfield game went to overtime. A lot easier to sell the "one guy can make a difference" line of thinking there.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Bombers798891 on December 19, 2012, 05:28:20 PM
Quote from: pumkinattack on December 19, 2012, 03:41:46 PM


Interestingly, w the St Thomas game - we lost Devin Worthington on the first defensive play (from our 4 on a bad snap on a punt) - either 1b or #2 most important guy on the team and the magnitude of the dropoff to the backup is massive ).  Depth matters when you get to that point, but there's a handful of guys that just can't be replaced mid season every year.  Usually a QB or RB, but sometimes it's defense.  We played better without Strang and our #3 WR last year vs. Wesley than we did w/o Worthington vs. St Thomas.

That might explain some of the defensive issues, but there were still problems with offense in that game both in the passing game (50% completion, 0 TD/3 INT) and running game (two carries generating 2/3 of the rushing total). Hobart's first nine drives—not counting the one just before the half—generated 137 total yards of offense. Seven generated less than 20 yards.
167 of the 294 yards Hobart finished with came on the final three drives, which began with them trailing 40-7.

The Statesmen were good, but they were not one player away from changing that game.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: pumkinattack on December 19, 2012, 10:23:13 PM
No that's absoultely true.  The offense was always the weakness of the team (with the secondary being the second weakness).  I told a buddy alum a few times that while Strang had an excellent career, he wasn't as talented as 3 QB's since 2000 -Swanson, Mizro & Strom, and really on par with Rich Doyle who sat behind Mizro for three (playoff) years.  JR Woodard is on par with most of the best WR's of the last weekend, but there's been better #2 and #3's than Yosh K and whoever #3 was this year.  Even TE, we had a soph come on late in the season who'll be a weapon, but not much there either.  The rushing game was on par with any Hobart's had and the defense is the best I've ever seen in 15 odd years, but the passing game was spotty and could make the team one dimensional at times. 

As for Osh-Kosh Linfield.  That's true, but I don't see how amazingly competitive Osh Kosh was the following week vs. St Thomas.  Sure Hobart's game was a blowout, but the way I see it, Osh Kosh got down 28-7 and it was all over.  Even the Elmhurst game vs. St Thomas, Elmhurst was lucky to catch some breaks early and get out to 14-0, then basically got shut out for three quarters (24-3 in the final three quarters).  Games are won and lost typically by the better team and everyone knows it who watches it, but scores can be all over the map in games dictated and dominated by one side and all three when I look closely at them tell the same story in different ways. 
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Ralph Turner on April 27, 2018, 07:14:33 PM
This board has been quiet for 5 years. It is the off-season. How about an update?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: AUPepBand on June 13, 2018, 10:33:08 AM
Okay, I'll get it started by making a preposterous statement that everyone will disagree with and perhaps thereby provoke some posts but usually my posts result in nothing but crickets.

I'll say that ALFRED is among the Top Ten Eastern Region teams since 1999 (which Pep believes encompasses the D3football.com Era). Where the Saxons stand? Will need to take a look....later.

For now, Pep will suggest that Wesley, Del Valley, St. John Fisher, Hobart all ought to be in the Top Ten.

Are we discussing specific seasons of teams or overall predominant programs?

Discuss.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Bombers798891 on June 13, 2018, 11:16:21 AM
I think we'd talk about specific years.

The interesting thing about these lists, for me, is seeing how people go about their list. I told this story a few pages back in this thread, but I was talking with Mike Welch about the best IC team he ever had, and both of us agreed it was the 2004 team...which completely missed the NCAAs. Keep in mind, Mike's first ever team was a play away from going to the Stagg Bowl, and his '01 and '03 teams won two playoff games as well.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: dlippiel on June 13, 2018, 11:46:31 AM
Quote from: AUPepBand on June 13, 2018, 10:33:08 AM
Okay, I'll get it started by making a preposterous statement that everyone will disagree with and perhaps thereby provoke some posts but usually my posts result in nothing but crickets.

I'll say that ALFRED is among the Top Ten Eastern Region teams since 1999 (which Pep believes encompasses the D3football.com Era). Where the Saxons stand? Will need to take a look....later.

For now, Pep will suggest that Wesley, Del Valley, St. John Fisher, Hobart all ought to be in the Top Ten.

Are we discussing specific seasons of teams or overall predominant programs?

Discuss.

dlip agrees with that. Just a couple of years ago they had an offense that UMU could barely contain...of course Alfred's defense couldn't contain UMU but that's par for the course.

dlip would also argue that Union's 2005 team should be in the discussion possibly as one of the top ten.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: AUPepBand on June 13, 2018, 03:21:26 PM
Quote from: dlip on June 13, 2018, 11:46:31 AM
Quote from: AUPepBand on June 13, 2018, 10:33:08 AM
Okay, I'll get it started by making a preposterous statement that everyone will disagree with and perhaps thereby provoke some posts but usually my posts result in nothing but crickets.

I'll say that ALFRED is among the Top Ten Eastern Region teams since 1999 (which Pep believes encompasses the D3football.com Era). Where the Saxons stand? Will need to take a look....later.

For now, Pep will suggest that Wesley, Del Valley, St. John Fisher, Hobart all ought to be in the Top Ten.

Are we discussing specific seasons of teams or overall predominant programs?

Discuss.

dlip agrees with that. Just a couple of years ago they had an offense that UMU could barely contain...of course Alfred's defense couldn't contain UMU but that's par for the course.

dlip would also argue that Union's 2005 team should be in the discussion possibly as one of the top ten.

Okay, so if we're going for the best team by season, Pep will go out on a limb and say that Brockport 2017, St. John Fisher 2006 and Alfred 2016 teams are three that belong on this list of Top Ten since 1999.

Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: dlippiel on June 13, 2018, 04:47:07 PM
Quote from: AUPepBand on June 13, 2018, 03:21:26 PM
Quote from: dlip on June 13, 2018, 11:46:31 AM
Quote from: AUPepBand on June 13, 2018, 10:33:08 AM
Okay, I'll get it started by making a preposterous statement that everyone will disagree with and perhaps thereby provoke some posts but usually my posts result in nothing but crickets.

I'll say that ALFRED is among the Top Ten Eastern Region teams since 1999 (which Pep believes encompasses the D3football.com Era). Where the Saxons stand? Will need to take a look....later.

For now, Pep will suggest that Wesley, Del Valley, St. John Fisher, Hobart all ought to be in the Top Ten.

Are we discussing specific seasons of teams or overall predominant programs?

Discuss.

dlip agrees with that. Just a couple of years ago they had an offense that UMU could barely contain...of course Alfred's defense couldn't contain UMU but that's par for the course.

dlip would also argue that Union's 2005 team should be in the discussion possibly as one of the top ten.

Okay, so if we're going for the best team by season, Pep will go out on a limb and say that Brockport 2017, St. John Fisher 2006 and Alfred 2016 teams are three that belong on this list of Top Ten since 1999.

Dlip likes both, program and team by season. For some reason team by season intrigues him a bit more.

Dlip may honestly place BP 2017 behind SJF 06 and Alfred 16...maybe. On top of that the Springfield Pride team of 2006, which SJF 16 defeated in the NCAA's should be under consideration as well IDHO. They were ****ing nasty...anyone recall dlip' man crush on Chris Sharpe?
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: dlippiel on June 14, 2018, 11:53:07 AM
Quote from: dlip on June 13, 2018, 11:46:31 AM
Quote from: AUPepBand on June 13, 2018, 10:33:08 AM
Okay, I'll get it started by making a preposterous statement that everyone will disagree with and perhaps thereby provoke some posts but usually my posts result in nothing but crickets.

I'll say that ALFRED is among the Top Ten Eastern Region teams since 1999 (which Pep believes encompasses the D3football.com Era). Where the Saxons stand? Will need to take a look....later.

For now, Pep will suggest that Wesley, Del Valley, St. John Fisher, Hobart all ought to be in the Top Ten.

Are we discussing specific seasons of teams or overall predominant programs?

Discuss.

dlip agrees with that. Just a couple of years ago they had an offense that UMU could barely contain...of course Alfred's defense couldn't contain UMU but that's par for the course.

dlip would also argue that Union's 2005 team should be in the discussion possibly as one of the top ten.

dlip also thinks that if he were to include the Dutchmen team of 2005 (maybe) then would then have to consider the 10-0, 12-1 Del Val team of 2006 and definitely the 11-2, 5-1 Rowan 2006 team which defeated both of previous teams mentioned and only lost to UMU in Alliance 19-7. However, when looking back dlip almost ****ing **** himself in disbelief seeing as the Prof's lone conference loss that year was to Willy P???
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Bartman on June 14, 2018, 05:28:29 PM
OK, all good input. As a homer selection, I would love to relive the Hobart teams of 2012, 2013 and 2014, all undefeated in the regular season and 34-3 overall. Perhaps the best consecutive years in the last 20. I think the 2012 team was one of the best of the East in last 20 years(final Eight), just had a bad game at St. Thomas when Nick Strang had an off day and Devin Worthington,OLB, went down on the first play. Not sure that the Alfred team of 2016 would have beaten the Hobart team of 2012(heck the H2016 was tied with MUC in the 4th and lost by fewer points than Alfred did and I wish Hobart and Alfred played each other instead of MUC in 2016) If H2012 played Brockport 2017 that would have been brutal but I do think Brockport 2017 would win 2 out of 3. Tyre Coleman chasing and catching Germinerio or Tyler Johnson would have been special ....although we'll never know.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Bartman on June 15, 2018, 01:45:42 PM
Ok, here are some stats from last 15 years(D3football goes back to 2003), Includes Wesley All years, Ranked by times in Top 25(End of Season)

  Team                  Top 25          Top10          Top 5
   1.Wesley              13                11               4
   2.Hobart                8                  2               -
   3.SJ Fisher             7                  3               1
   4.Del Val                7                  2               2
   5.Rowan                6                   3               1
   6.Ithaca                 6                  1                -
   7.Cortland             5                   1
   8.Salisbury            5                   1               -
   9.Frosty                 2                   1
  10.Brockport           2                   1
  HM.Albright             2
       Alfred                 2
      Union                  2
      RPI (03 Team)      1                  1               1

If anyone checks these numbers and finds an error, congratulations you are more of a Nerd than I am ;)
I must REALLY need the season to start......
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: MUC57 on June 15, 2018, 03:15:45 PM

Bartman

We ALL need the season to start!
I find your stats very interesting. Have never seen them presented in this format before. I assume these are rankings at any time during the season. Right? As opposed to preseason only or end of season only?
I really like them. To me, they tell a story of success (or not so much).
Go Hobart! Go Mount Union! You guessed it, Go Everybody! ☠🏈
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: dlippiel on June 15, 2018, 03:16:50 PM
Quote from: Bartman on June 15, 2018, 01:45:42 PM
Ok, here are some stats from last 15 years(D3football goes back to 2003), Includes Wesley All years, Ranked by times in Top 25

  Team                  Top 25          Top10          Top 5
   1.Wesley              13                11               4
   2.Hobart                8                  2               -
   3.SJ Fisher             7                  3               1
   4.Del Val                7                  2               2
   5.Rowan                6                   3               1
   6.Ithaca                 6                  1                -
   7.Cortland             5                   1
   8.Salisbury            5                   1               -
   9.Frosty                 2                   1
  10.Brockport           2                   1
  HM.Albright             2
       Alfred                 2
      Union                  2
      RPI (03 Team)      1                  1               1

If anyone checks these numbers and finds an error, congratulations you are more of a Nerd than I am ;)
I must REALLY need the season to start......

Good stuff Bartman +k and yes those Hobart teams were quite nasty and certainly worthy of consideration. Wesley is a ****ing beast!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: MUC57 on June 15, 2018, 03:22:31 PM

Hey Bartman

If dlip can give you a +k, I can too. You got it! ☠🏈
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: UfanBill on June 16, 2018, 01:37:21 AM
Quote from: MUC57 on June 15, 2018, 03:22:31 PM

Hey Bartman

If dlip can give you a +k, I can too. You got it! ☠🏈

Hey MUC57, THAT'S worth a +k to get you back to even!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: MUC57 on June 16, 2018, 05:47:50 AM

UfanBill

Thanks. I needed that! I seem to get -k even when I don't post. Ah, such is life.
Don't know who your team is but I wish them the best. Well, unless they're playing Mount Union.
Hey, I always hope every team plays it's best. Gotta love Dlll football. ☠🏈😀🍺
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Bartman on June 16, 2018, 08:34:38 AM
Quote from: MUC57 on June 15, 2018, 03:15:45 PM

Bartman

We ALL need the season to start!
I find your stats very interesting. Have never seen them presented in this format before. I assume these are rankings at any time during the season. Right? As opposed to preseason only or end of season only?
I really like them. To me, they tell a story of success (or not so much).
Go Hobart! Go Mount Union! You guessed it, Go Everybody! ☠🏈

Thanks MUC57,
         These are End of Season polls from D3.com . I edited my post to note this. I could do MUC , but it would probably be 15 years of top 5, plus another category for Championships...very boring 8-)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Bartman on June 16, 2018, 08:39:27 AM
Quote from: MUC57 on June 15, 2018, 03:22:31 PM

Hey Bartman

If dlip can give you a +k, I can too. You got it! ☠🏈

Thanks MUC57, but I would trade all of my +k's for one of your Championships. Hope to see you guys play at the Boz again in my lifetime with the right ending ;D
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: MUC57 on June 16, 2018, 08:55:10 AM

Bartman

At my age, I'll be happy to see Mount Union play anywhere, even the Boz. If you've looked at other boards, you'll see - I'm old. I get mixed up and i forget things! ☠🏈🍺
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Bartman on June 17, 2018, 09:09:13 AM
Quote from: MUC57 on June 16, 2018, 08:55:10 AM

Bartman

At my age, I'll be happy to see Mount Union play anywhere, even the Boz. If you've looked at other boards, you'll see - I'm old. I get mixed up and i forget things! ☠🏈🍺
MUC57....good luck to the Raiders this season and +k for longevity , a tough crowd on the North boards , where I seem to pick up a -k just for venturing in the neighborhood...much safer over here.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: MUC57 on June 17, 2018, 09:49:38 AM

Bartman

Don't know why you would get -k on the North board. You're one of the more sensible and good guys on these boards. But then again, I get -k when I don't even post. I don' really worry about that karma stuff.
Good luck to Hobart on the season. Seems like they're always in the hunt. And, if it's applicable, Happy Father's Day. 🇺🇸😀
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Bartman on June 19, 2018, 11:24:49 AM
Quote from: dlip on June 15, 2018, 03:16:50 PM
Quote from: Bartman on June 15, 2018, 01:45:42 PM
Ok, here are some stats from last 15 years(D3football goes back to 2003), Includes Wesley All years, Ranked by times in Top 25

  Team                  Top 25          Top10          Top 5
   1.Wesley              13                11               4
   2.Hobart                8                  2               -
   3.SJ Fisher             7                  3               1
   4.Del Val                7                  2               2
   5.Rowan                6                   3               1
   6.Ithaca                 6                  1                -
   7.Cortland             5                   1
   8.Salisbury            5                   1               -
   9.Frosty                 2                   1
  10.Brockport           2                   1
  HM.Albright             2
       Alfred                 2
      Union                  2
      RPI (03 Team)      1                  1               1

If anyone checks these numbers and finds an error, congratulations you are more of a Nerd than I am ;)
I must REALLY need the season to start......

Good stuff Bartman +k and yes those Hobart teams were quite nasty and certainly worthy of consideration. Wesley is a ****ing beast!

Dlip,
    Looking prior to 2003, great years for Union in 83 and 89 as national runners up ...and Ithaca, current LL member, with National titles in 79,88 and 91. I don't think the current LL will ever get to this level again, but just fighting for and obtaining the LL title and winning a couple in the tourney is good enough for me .
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Bombers798891 on June 19, 2018, 12:49:38 PM
The polls don't have as much sway with me as the individual takes fans have on their program's best teams.

The 2013 Bombers were a lot of fun to watch. But there's simply no way they were better than the '04, '07, or '08 teams, polls be darned. I know I've heard Fisher fans talk about their '10 team in a similar fashion.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Bartman on June 19, 2018, 04:03:42 PM
Bombers,
     Agree on your point about insights from fans v rankings. I looked back and I am even more convinced that the Hobart team of 2012 was our best. 12-1 record with disappointing one sided loss to St. Thomas in final 8 with a flat performance...... team had 5,386 yards gained vs 3,133 against, Points scored 469 vs. 225 against, with Tyre Coleman(Regional DPY) and All American 1st team, Devin Worthington OLB and second team AA, Nick Auriemma, NG, 3rd team AA, and on offense, Art Garvey OG, first team AA, Ali Marpet,nuff said, with 2 great backs in Steven Webb and Bobby Dougherty both All region. If we had Shane Sweeney and Brandon Shed on that team???...........fun to think about.
    It will be interesting to see the 2018 Bombers development this year, as they should be the preseason pick to win the LL. At least Hobart gets to play them at the Boz.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: dlippiel on June 20, 2018, 10:32:09 AM
Quote from: Bartman on June 19, 2018, 11:24:49 AM
Quote from: dlip on June 15, 2018, 03:16:50 PM
Quote from: Bartman on June 15, 2018, 01:45:42 PM
Ok, here are some stats from last 15 years(D3football goes back to 2003), Includes Wesley All years, Ranked by times in Top 25

  Team                  Top 25          Top10          Top 5
   1.Wesley              13                11               4
   2.Hobart                8                  2               -
   3.SJ Fisher             7                  3               1
   4.Del Val                7                  2               2
   5.Rowan                6                   3               1
   6.Ithaca                 6                  1                -
   7.Cortland             5                   1
   8.Salisbury            5                   1               -
   9.Frosty                 2                   1
  10.Brockport           2                   1
  HM.Albright             2
       Alfred                 2
      Union                  2
      RPI (03 Team)      1                  1               1

If anyone checks these numbers and finds an error, congratulations you are more of a Nerd than I am ;)
I must REALLY need the season to start......

Good stuff Bartman +k and yes those Hobart teams were quite nasty and certainly worthy of consideration. Wesley is a ****ing beast!

Dlip,
    Looking prior to 2003, great years for Union in 83 and 89 as national runners up ...and Ithaca, current LL member, with National titles in 79,88 and 91. I don't think the current LL will ever get to this level again, but just fighting for and obtaining the LL title and winning a couple in the tourney is good enough for me .

dlip is with you here 1000%. A national championship is just not in the cards for an LL team (most likely in our lifetime) unless the dynamic of the D3 make-up changes (which in fairness it has since the 80's and even 90's). Winning the LL title and getting to the NCAA's is where it's at for us. Honestly, to dlip, a top ten ranking (realistically 5-10) at the end of the season would almost parallel a national championship to dlip, for an LL and/or E8 team.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: AUPepBand on June 20, 2018, 03:29:46 PM
Quote from: Bombers798891 on June 19, 2018, 12:49:38 PM
The polls don't have as much sway with me as the individual takes fans have on their program's best teams.

The 2013 Bombers were a lot of fun to watch. But there's simply no way they were better than the '04, '07, or '08 teams, polls be darned. I know I've heard Fisher fans talk about their '10 team in a similar fashion.

That 2010 Fisher team was sick. The Saxons were pretty good that year, too...and Pep is thinking a trick play that resulted in an AU touchdown, a masterfully called and exquisitely executed play, doomed a Cardinal crew that could have made some noise in the NCAAs.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Machiavelli on June 25, 2018, 12:53:59 PM
I know everyone will resonate to more recent success, but for anyone who was around, this list cannot start without these teams from the earlier(<2005) years:

Rowan 1999, 2001 and 2005
Widener 2000 and 2001
RPI 2003
Brockport 2002
Del Valley 2005

I'm sure I left one or 2 out, but these ones are memorable. Ranking these alone, i'd put them:

1 - Rowan 1999
2 - Widener 2000
3 - Brockport 2002
4 - Rowan 2001
5 - Widener 2001
6 - RPI 2003
7 - Rowan 2005
8 -  Del Valley 2005
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: @d3jason on June 25, 2018, 03:19:37 PM
Quote from: Machiavelli on June 25, 2018, 12:53:59 PM
I know everyone will resonate to more recent success, but for anyone who was around, this list cannot start without these teams from the earlier(<2005) years:

Rowan 1999, 2001 and 2005
Widener 2000 and 2001
RPI 2003
Brockport 2002
Del Valley 2005

I'm sure I left one or 2 out, but these ones are memorable. Ranking these alone, i'd put them:

1 - Rowan 1999
2 - Widener 2000
3 - Brockport 2002
4 - Rowan 2001
5 - Widener 2001
6 - RPI 2003
7 - Rowan 2005
8 -  Del Valley 2005

I would put the '01 Rowan up higher, they may have been the best team in D-III that year, but for the longest second ever at Bridgewater during the semifinals.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: MUC57 on June 25, 2018, 03:52:45 PM
@d3jason

I agree with you on the 2001 Rowan team. The semifinal with Bridgewater had a strange final minute to end the game. That'll be talked about in Glassboro for a long time. Instead, BC had to play Mount Union in the Stagg instead of Rowan. Close game, 30-27, won by the Raiders. If Rowan had played, who knows the outcome.
Hope you don't mind an old Mount guy jumping in on your board. Just wanted to agree with you. I'm sure that made your day.
Good luck to all your teams in the fall. There are some really good teams in the East. Hopefully they'll get the recognition they deserve. ☠🏈
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: gordonmann on June 25, 2018, 04:54:09 PM
I'm not sure which version of Del Val was better -- 2005 or 2017. One was led by the offense, the other by the defense. Something to debate on road trips next year.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: @d3jason on June 26, 2018, 08:13:08 AM
Quote from: MUC57 on June 25, 2018, 03:52:45 PM
@d3jason

I agree with you on the 2001 Rowan team. The semifinal with Bridgewater had a strange final minute to end the game. That'll be talked about in Glassboro for a long time. Instead, BC had to play Mount Union in the Stagg instead of Rowan. Close game, 30-27, won by the Raiders. If Rowan had played, who knows the outcome.
Hope you don't mind an old Mount guy jumping in on your board. Just wanted to agree with you. I'm sure that made your day.
Good luck to all your teams in the fall. There are some really good teams in the East. Hopefully they'll get the recognition they deserve. ☠🏈

I coached against both versions. The '01 team just seemed so much more explosive on offense. It was the first time they went to the spread and Scott Lipford was a handful at receiver. The '99 team was probably better defensively and they did beat Mount.

Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Machiavelli on June 26, 2018, 08:24:32 AM
Quote from: @d3jason on June 25, 2018, 03:19:37 PM
Quote from: Machiavelli on June 25, 2018, 12:53:59 PM
I know everyone will resonate to more recent success, but for anyone who was around, this list cannot start without these teams from the earlier(<2005) years:

Rowan 1999, 2001 and 2005
Widener 2000 and 2001
RPI 2003
Brockport 2002
Del Valley 2005

I'm sure I left one or 2 out, but these ones are memorable. Ranking these alone, i'd put them:

1 - Rowan 1999
2 - Widener 2000
3 - Brockport 2002
4 - Rowan 2001
5 - Widener 2001
6 - RPI 2003
7 - Rowan 2005
8 -  Del Valley 2005

I would put the '01 Rowan up higher, they may have been the best team in D-III that year, but for the longest second ever at Bridgewater during the semifinals.

I definitely hear you. Those 2 years for Widener were sick and the '02 Brockport team was one of those 'special' teams, probably the way 2017 will be looked at if they aren't as good this year.  I think those Widener teams get lost in the shuffle sometimes because they weren't considered 'East' back then, but they were awesome. But those Rowan teams through 2002 were so good every year. Athletically they were probably most dominant teams in the country for that stretch, but one of the most undisciplined teams to boot. Those teams could have and should have won 5-6 National titles from like 1993 through 2002 instead of losing 5 or whatever. The '99 team was pretty much just a D1 transfer team, so big, so fast. But, I suppose I can adjust... :-)

1 - Rowan 1999
2 - Rowan 2001
3 - Widener 2000
4 - Brockport 2002
5 - Widener 2001
6 - RPI 2003
7 - Rowan 2005
8 -  Del Valley 2005
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: @d3jason on June 26, 2018, 08:35:57 AM
Quote from: Machiavelli on June 26, 2018, 08:24:32 AM
Quote from: @d3jason on June 25, 2018, 03:19:37 PM
Quote from: Machiavelli on June 25, 2018, 12:53:59 PM
I know everyone will resonate to more recent success, but for anyone who was around, this list cannot start without these teams from the earlier(<2005) years:

Rowan 1999, 2001 and 2005
Widener 2000 and 2001
RPI 2003
Brockport 2002
Del Valley 2005

I'm sure I left one or 2 out, but these ones are memorable. Ranking these alone, i'd put them:

1 - Rowan 1999
2 - Widener 2000
3 - Brockport 2002
4 - Rowan 2001
5 - Widener 2001
6 - RPI 2003
7 - Rowan 2005
8 -  Del Valley 2005

I would put the '01 Rowan up higher, they may have been the best team in D-III that year, but for the longest second ever at Bridgewater during the semifinals.

I definitely hear you. Those 2 years for Widener were sick and the '02 Brockport team was one of those 'special' teams, probably the way 2017 will be looked at if they aren't as good this year.  I think those Widener teams get lost in the shuffle sometimes because they weren't considered 'East' back then, but they were awesome. But those Rowan teams through 2002 were so good every year. Athletically they were probably most dominant teams in the country for that stretch, but one of the most undisciplined teams to boot. Those teams could have and should have won 5-6 National titles from like 1993 through 2002 instead of losing 5 or whatever. The '99 team was pretty much just a D1 transfer team, so big, so fast. But, I suppose I can adjust... :-)

1 - Rowan 1999
2 - Rowan 2001
3 - Widener 2000
4 - Brockport 2002
5 - Widener 2001
6 - RPI 2003
7 - Rowan 2005
8 -  Del Valley 2005

The '02 Brockport team had an incredible defensive unit. I didn't see the Widener teams or RPI. It would have been interesting to see how the '05 Wesley team fared against Del Val and Rowan teams. The Wolverines were crushed by Brockport and then UWW in the semifinals, but did beat a UMHB team in Belton that had been to the Stagg Bowl the previous year.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: bman on June 26, 2018, 09:15:00 AM
Quote from: @d3jason on June 26, 2018, 08:35:57 AM
Quote from: Machiavelli on June 26, 2018, 08:24:32 AM
Quote from: @d3jason on June 25, 2018, 03:19:37 PM
Quote from: Machiavelli on June 25, 2018, 12:53:59 PM
I know everyone will resonate to more recent success, but for anyone who was around, this list cannot start without these teams from the earlier(<2005) years:

Rowan 1999, 2001 and 2005
Widener 2000 and 2001
RPI 2003
Brockport 2002
Del Valley 2005

I'm sure I left one or 2 out, but these ones are memorable. Ranking these alone, i'd put them:

1 - Rowan 1999
2 - Widener 2000
3 - Brockport 2002
4 - Rowan 2001
5 - Widener 2001
6 - RPI 2003
7 - Rowan 2005
8 -  Del Valley 2005

I would put the '01 Rowan up higher, they may have been the best team in D-III that year, but for the longest second ever at Bridgewater during the semifinals.

I definitely hear you. Those 2 years for Widener were sick and the '02 Brockport team was one of those 'special' teams, probably the way 2017 will be looked at if they aren't as good this year.  I think those Widener teams get lost in the shuffle sometimes because they weren't considered 'East' back then, but they were awesome. But those Rowan teams through 2002 were so good every year. Athletically they were probably most dominant teams in the country for that stretch, but one of the most undisciplined teams to boot. Those teams could have and should have won 5-6 National titles from like 1993 through 2002 instead of losing 5 or whatever. The '99 team was pretty much just a D1 transfer team, so big, so fast. But, I suppose I can adjust... :-)

1 - Rowan 1999
2 - Rowan 2001
3 - Widener 2000
4 - Brockport 2002
5 - Widener 2001
6 - RPI 2003
7 - Rowan 2005
8 -  Del Valley 2005

The '02 Brockport team had an incredible defensive unit. I didn't see the Widener teams or RPI. It would have been interesting to see how the '05 Wesley team fared against Del Val and Rowan teams. The Wolverines were crushed by Brockport and then UWW in the semifinals, but did beat a UMHB team in Belton that had been to the Stagg Bowl the previous year.

Was Widener in the East back then?  I feel like they may have been in the South...I could be(probably am) wrong annnd I know its semantics...

I also feel like maybe a (Ali Marpet) Hobart team should be in here somewhere...
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: ITH radio on June 26, 2018, 10:25:48 AM
Ironically the 2005 Hobart team, which was a big underdog at the time, nearly beat that 2005 DVC team. Came down to a final play in a 21-14 loss.

One caveat re the 2012 and 2014 Statesmen (both ended up 12-1) would be they bowed out in the quarterfinals, in a 47-7 blowout to UST and what was a close game with Wesley until the Wolverines pulled away late, 41-13.

Not sure that makes the Top 10...
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Machiavelli on June 26, 2018, 10:47:01 AM
Quote from: bman on June 26, 2018, 09:15:00 AM
Quote from: @d3jason on June 26, 2018, 08:35:57 AM
Quote from: Machiavelli on June 26, 2018, 08:24:32 AM
Quote from: @d3jason on June 25, 2018, 03:19:37 PM
Quote from: Machiavelli on June 25, 2018, 12:53:59 PM
I know everyone will resonate to more recent success, but for anyone who was around, this list cannot start without these teams from the earlier(<2005) years:

Rowan 1999, 2001 and 2005
Widener 2000 and 2001
RPI 2003
Brockport 2002
Del Valley 2005

I'm sure I left one or 2 out, but these ones are memorable. Ranking these alone, i'd put them:

1 - Rowan 1999
2 - Widener 2000
3 - Brockport 2002
4 - Rowan 2001
5 - Widener 2001
6 - RPI 2003
7 - Rowan 2005
8 -  Del Valley 2005

I would put the '01 Rowan up higher, they may have been the best team in D-III that year, but for the longest second ever at Bridgewater during the semifinals.

I definitely hear you. Those 2 years for Widener were sick and the '02 Brockport team was one of those 'special' teams, probably the way 2017 will be looked at if they aren't as good this year.  I think those Widener teams get lost in the shuffle sometimes because they weren't considered 'East' back then, but they were awesome. But those Rowan teams through 2002 were so good every year. Athletically they were probably most dominant teams in the country for that stretch, but one of the most undisciplined teams to boot. Those teams could have and should have won 5-6 National titles from like 1993 through 2002 instead of losing 5 or whatever. The '99 team was pretty much just a D1 transfer team, so big, so fast. But, I suppose I can adjust... :-)

1 - Rowan 1999
2 - Rowan 2001
3 - Widener 2000
4 - Brockport 2002
5 - Widener 2001
6 - RPI 2003
7 - Rowan 2005
8 -  Del Valley 2005

The '02 Brockport team had an incredible defensive unit. I didn't see the Widener teams or RPI. It would have been interesting to see how the '05 Wesley team fared against Del Val and Rowan teams. The Wolverines were crushed by Brockport and then UWW in the semifinals, but did beat a UMHB team in Belton that had been to the Stagg Bowl the previous year.

Was Widener in the East back then?  I feel like they may have been in the South...I could be(probably am) wrong annnd I know its semantics...

I also feel like maybe a (Ali Marpet) Hobart team should be in here somewhere...

I was only using 1999-2005 teams since they can be forgotten. That said, I think the teams back then across the board were better than they are now. Everyone was just bigger and faster. Maybe dumber too, but definitely bigger and faster.

As far as Widener's region, I guess we'd need someone to define the ground rules because it's correct that Widener, Wesley, Delaware Valley etc were all 'South' before a few years ago.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: @d3jason on June 26, 2018, 11:19:47 AM
Quote from: Machiavelli on June 26, 2018, 10:47:01 AM
Quote from: bman on June 26, 2018, 09:15:00 AM
Quote from: @d3jason on June 26, 2018, 08:35:57 AM
Quote from: Machiavelli on June 26, 2018, 08:24:32 AM
Quote from: @d3jason on June 25, 2018, 03:19:37 PM
Quote from: Machiavelli on June 25, 2018, 12:53:59 PM
I know everyone will resonate to more recent success, but for anyone who was around, this list cannot start without these teams from the earlier(<2005) years:

Rowan 1999, 2001 and 2005
Widener 2000 and 2001
RPI 2003
Brockport 2002
Del Valley 2005

I'm sure I left one or 2 out, but these ones are memorable. Ranking these alone, i'd put them:

1 - Rowan 1999
2 - Widener 2000
3 - Brockport 2002
4 - Rowan 2001
5 - Widener 2001
6 - RPI 2003
7 - Rowan 2005
8 -  Del Valley 2005

I would put the '01 Rowan up higher, they may have been the best team in D-III that year, but for the longest second ever at Bridgewater during the semifinals.

I definitely hear you. Those 2 years for Widener were sick and the '02 Brockport team was one of those 'special' teams, probably the way 2017 will be looked at if they aren't as good this year.  I think those Widener teams get lost in the shuffle sometimes because they weren't considered 'East' back then, but they were awesome. But those Rowan teams through 2002 were so good every year. Athletically they were probably most dominant teams in the country for that stretch, but one of the most undisciplined teams to boot. Those teams could have and should have won 5-6 National titles from like 1993 through 2002 instead of losing 5 or whatever. The '99 team was pretty much just a D1 transfer team, so big, so fast. But, I suppose I can adjust... :-)

1 - Rowan 1999
2 - Rowan 2001
3 - Widener 2000
4 - Brockport 2002
5 - Widener 2001
6 - RPI 2003
7 - Rowan 2005
8 -  Del Valley 2005

The '02 Brockport team had an incredible defensive unit. I didn't see the Widener teams or RPI. It would have been interesting to see how the '05 Wesley team fared against Del Val and Rowan teams. The Wolverines were crushed by Brockport and then UWW in the semifinals, but did beat a UMHB team in Belton that had been to the Stagg Bowl the previous year.

Was Widener in the East back then?  I feel like they may have been in the South...I could be(probably am) wrong annnd I know its semantics...

I also feel like maybe a (Ali Marpet) Hobart team should be in here somewhere...

I was only using 1999-2005 teams since they can be forgotten. That said, I think the teams back then across the board were better than they are now. Everyone was just bigger and faster. Maybe dumber too, but definitely bigger and faster.

As far as Widener's region, I guess we'd need someone to define the ground rules because it's correct that Widener, Wesley, Delaware Valley etc were all 'South' before a few years ago.

Maybe bigger, I don't necessarily think faster. Football has changed a lot since then. It's really hard to compare eras. There is more of an emphasis on getting players in space and spreading the field horizontally now. I think the coaches are better at teaching it now too. More players have specialized roles, defenses rotate a lot players in and out especially along the defensive line.

I sometimes wonder how the teams at Wesley in the mid-90's when I was on the coaching staff would match-up with more recent editions. There were some great players there then too. For most of that time, it was harder to get into the playoffs with only 16 invites. A lot of good teams stayed home. Just rambling now.... :)
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: dlippiel on June 26, 2018, 11:55:38 AM
RPI team of 2003 was damn good! Was Cole the QB? Team went the the semi's dlip believes with a loss to St. Johns.  Also a tough loss to Hobart during the regular season. Regardless dlip remembers watching them and really noting how ****ing good they were.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Machiavelli on June 26, 2018, 12:10:27 PM
Quote from: dlip on June 26, 2018, 11:55:38 AM
RPI team of 2003 was damn good! Was Cole the QB? Team went the the semi's dlip believes with a loss to St. Johns.  Also a tough loss to Hobart during the regular season. Regardless dlip remembers watching them and really noting how ****ing good they were.

RPI 2003 was very very good, but more of a finesse team that had a couple bounces in the right direction in the playoffs. Curry was excellent that year, but still is a good first round draw(and they should've been home but their field wasn't cleared by the NCAA to host so it was in Troy). Springfield probably could've had a crack at the National Championship that year, legitimately, but RPI got a lead and that Triple Option doesn't bode well when time isn't on your side. I remember Springfield still running option plays down by 14 with like a minute to go because they couldn't throw. And then there was the infamous Snow Bowl (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCxCKwxwoRc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCxCKwxwoRc)) game against Ithaca. Ithaca had gotten smoked by Springfield that year but was still really friggin good nonetheless. They were a lighter lift on paper than Springfield, but in clean weather it could've gone either way.

Then of course was the St. John's game which was tied toward the end of the 3rd quarter. They eventually won 38-10 then blew out Mt. Union the following week. So reliving this a bit, maybe RPI should probably be in that 3-5 range.

Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Ralph Turner on June 26, 2018, 01:53:40 PM
Quote from: Machiavelli on June 26, 2018, 10:47:01 AM


As far as Widener's region, I guess we'd need someone to define the ground rules because it's correct that Widener, Wesley, Delaware Valley etc were all 'South' before a few years ago.
Yes.  And now CNU and Salisbury...
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Bartman on June 27, 2018, 07:21:32 PM
Quote from: dlip on June 26, 2018, 11:55:38 AM
RPI team of 2003 was damn good! Was Cole the QB? Team went the the semi's dlip believes with a loss to St. Johns.  Also a tough loss to Hobart during the regular season. Regardless dlip remembers watching them and really noting how ****ing good they were.
Some good football back in 2003. Watched parts of the Snowball film of win by RPI over IC, pretty intense win by the Engineers. Hobart beat RPI that year by 43-25 by putting up 28 in the fourth quarter in Troy.(Hobart team matured the next year and went 7-0 in the first year of the LL in 2004).St. Johns did the same 4th quarter thing to them in the NCAA, but despite that RPI was solid in 2003 by getting to the semis for one of the top teams of the last 15 years.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: fisheralum91 on June 28, 2018, 08:45:14 AM
Nice to see action on the boards!
Obviously Im a homer and I have to say that the 2006 Fisher team was one of the best I saw.
07 was amazing as well minus the hiccup down in Oneonta (god I hate Hartwick)......The 06 team was special- and when I traveled out to watch the Rowan game- I didnt quite know what to expect.  What I got was a total beat down of the beast from the east.  The Mount loss hurt but from all accounts- even from Mount fans themselves - there was a point in that game where it could have gone either way.

Oh to be back in those years......

Lets hope Vos rights the ship!
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Bartman on June 29, 2018, 09:10:17 AM
Quote from: ITH radio on June 26, 2018, 10:25:48 AM
Ironically the 2005 Hobart team, which was a big underdog at the time, nearly beat that 2005 DVC team. Came down to a final play in a 21-14 loss.

One caveat re the 2012 and 2014 Statesmen (both ended up 12-1) would be they bowed out in the quarterfinals, in a 47-7 blowout to UST and what was a close game with Wesley until the Wolverines pulled away late, 41-13.

Not sure that makes the Top 10...
ITH, if the Lambert Cup Hobart team of 2012(only Hobart team to win one) was not a top ten team in the East of the D3.com era(last 15 years) then no Hobart team is worthy of consideration. They dominated the regular season and had two one sided wins in the Playoffs against W&L and a strong Wittenberg team. I attended all of the playoff games and Hobart was dominant until the trip to Minnesota. The Tommies game was their best opponent and worst played game. Worthington was injured on the first series after a blocked punt by the Tommies. Nick Strang was throwing high all game (2 Ints) and should have been pulled early. We could run the ball but , the play calling was not the best by DeWall . St. Thomas had an unbelievable Oline that just wore us down and the Tommies went on to play in the Stagg bowl, losing to MUC. If you want to eliminate this team from consideration based on the St. Thomas playoff game, that is your opinion, but based on my live observations of this team and the teams in the last 15 years they could have played with any of the top teams in the East during this period and won their fair share.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: ITH radio on June 29, 2018, 10:37:55 AM
That's fair, and I agree bc of the Lambert designation.

Btw - Devin wasn't injured on the punt. He was taken out by a Tommie OL chop block from my recollection of watching the game. Maybe not a dirty play, intentionally, but it was a big blow. I had also forgotten UST went on to the Stagg, so it does put that in context.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: Bartman on June 30, 2018, 02:00:19 PM
ITH, 
   Yes,Devin went down on the first defensive series after the blocked punt. It was a big loss against a team that we needed everyone on the field. Only Hobart score was a 66 yard run by Steven Webb that was a beauty I think sprung by Marpet. Tommies were the better team, for sure, but just wasn't our day either.
Title: Re: The Top 10 Eastern Region teams of the D3football.com Era
Post by: bman on August 09, 2018, 05:24:53 PM
Quote from: MUC57 on June 25, 2018, 03:52:45 PM
@d3jason

I agree with you on the 2001 Rowan team. The semifinal with Bridgewater had a strange final minute to end the game. That'll be talked about in Glassboro for a long time. Instead, BC had to play Mount Union in the Stagg instead of Rowan. Close game, 30-27, won by the Raiders. If Rowan had played, who knows the outcome.
Hope you don't mind an old Mount guy jumping in on your board. Just wanted to agree with you. I'm sure that made your day.
Good luck to all your teams in the fall. There are some really good teams in the East. Hopefully they'll get the recognition they deserve. ☠🏈

just catching back up on the boards.  Wish I had seen this earlier.   I said it back then, and I'll say it now.  When that video surfaced after the game, Bridgewater should have forfeited.   It showed what the administration and athletic department really cared about (which wasn't sportsmanship).  Whether they owed D3 football or Rowan the forfeit and or the fact that the NCAA had no way to alter the outcome of the game after the fact is immaterial.  The video showed clearly that Rowan had won the game, because Bridgewater had no right to the final snap of the ball.   Forfeiting was the right thing to do, and they didn't do it,how competitive they were in the Stagg Bowl was of no consequence.   Although I am not a fan of Rowan (or Keeler), I lost every bit of respect for the administration, athletic department and coaching staff of Bridgewater after that...