MBB: Wisconsin Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

Started by Pat Coleman, February 24, 2005, 09:17:07 PM

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AndOne

Quote from: Gregory Sager on September 19, 2018, 10:49:45 AM
Quote from: tomt4525 on September 19, 2018, 09:46:55 AM
Quote from: tomt4525 on September 18, 2018, 06:34:14 PM
I wondered why we hadn't heard much about WW's recruiting class...but they did bring in a pretty big class after all.

Malik Clements (Madison West), Melvin Brown Jr. (Milwaukee Vincent), Lewrenzo Byers (Brown Deer), Tywon Bressler (Dominican), Jack Brahm (Nicolet), Finley Schumacher (Waukesha West) and Paul Kingsley (Chicago St. Rita).

I did a little digging on WW's recruiting class, it won't help the stigma of being transfer university.

Translation: That's a key rival of the school that I support, so I'm going to malign an entire category of college students, a category that makes up a substantial percentage of American college students in general (37% as of a decade ago, and it could only have gotten higher since then), just to take a jab at that rival school by referring to that category of students as a "stigma".

Gentlemen,

Perhaps we can holster our six shooters for a minute and consider the following, especially concerning attachment of the word "stigma" to the subject at hand.

* First of all, I don't believe tomt was referring to anything but the UWW basketball program. I really don't think he was trying to impugn the name of the entire university and everything associated with it.

* But, Mr. T, I do think you could have used a better word than stigma.

* Lots of kids transfer schools for a variety of reasons. Probably mainly cost. And, I bet many, if not most, transfers involve moving from a more expensive private to a less costly public. So, a school with a rather large percentage of transfer students shouldn't have the stigma of Transfer U attached to it.
Especially, not a larger public school where a pretty good percentage of transfers is often more the norm than the exception.

* Unfortunately, there are students who play basketball who, by virtue of their actions, attach unto themselves the stigma of being a athlete-student rather than a student athlete. We've all seen them. These are players who move from school to school. Often their journeys find them making stops not at 2 schools, which I believe is common to both athletes and non-athletes alike, but at 3 and sometimes even more schools. The primary thing these kids are looking for is visibility. Starting at a JUCO, or a smaller D3 or NAIA if they somehow qualify, then hopefully to a large(r) school, which because of it's size is noticed more, discussed more, just generally in the public eye more. More than an education, these kids are in school to play basketball because they think that's the route to riches or at least a free or close to free "education." Get to a (usually big(ger) school with more visibility, get noticed, get a D1 scholarship, and then it'll be on to the pros.

* Deserved or not, some schools basketball programs have a reputation, as being more accepting toward this type of basketball playing student. Maybe because their lineups often have a high percentage of transfers (not necessarily a bad thing by itself), maybe because they seem to be a place where grades don't matter much as long as you have game, or maybe because they have a history of being a school that takes a good player from another school but who then leaves for a third school after a year, or who plays at 2 or even 3 other schools before arriving at Transfer U or Transfer College.

* I don't know if UWW falls into this category or not. They do seem to often have a roster populated with a goodly percentage of transfers. But again, this isn't necessarily a bad thing. Lots of college kids transfer, basketball (and other sports) players included.

* I probably haven't said what I wanted to very clearly or concisely. But those of you who follow the college sports scene closely, especially on the D3 level, know what I mean.

In summary, as an observer outside the discussion, I don't think tomt was trying to taint UWW as a whole. I do think tomt could have chosen a better word than stigma as it can be seen as applicable to transfer students in general.

Now, because I've, probably feebly, attempted to clarify the situation, everyone can yell at me.  😟

AndOne

#20116
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on September 19, 2018, 02:04:32 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on September 19, 2018, 02:01:02 PM
I don't see why it is a stigma. For some students, it is the cheapest and most efficient way to graduate from college. By saying it's a stigma, you are doing what Sager is indicating ... making light and dismissing students who take that track.

Besides, while it might be a stigma if students were constantly transferring AWAY from a school, how could it possibly be a stigma to have students transferring IN?

Come on Ypsi. You are smarter than that.
As I said above, stigma is probably the wrong word, and UWW might not even be in the discussion. But you know there are schools, unlike your Alma mater where everything is the best and perfection is the only word that applies to all aspects of the operation, that care at least as much about a kid's ability on the court as in the classroom. ⛹🏼‍♂️ 😏
Yes, no, maybe? 😏

Dave 'd-mac' McHugh

Quote from: AndOne on September 19, 2018, 06:47:50 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on September 19, 2018, 02:04:32 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on September 19, 2018, 02:01:02 PM
I don't see why it is a stigma. For some students, it is the cheapest and most efficient way to graduate from college. By saying it's a stigma, you are doing what Sager is indicating ... making light and dismissing students who take that track.

Besides, while it might be a stigma if students were constantly transferring AWAY from a school, how could it possibly be a stigma to have students transferring IN?

Come on Ypsi. You are smarter than that.
As I said above, stigma is probably the wrong word, and UWW might not even be in the discussion. But you know there are schools, unlike your Alma mater where everything is the best and perfection is the only word that applies to all aspects of the operation, that care at least as much about a kid's ability on the court as in the classroom. ⛹🏼‍♂️ 😏
Yes, no, maybe? 😏

AndOne ... this response from Ypsi was near the beginning of the stigma conversation. You cannot ding Ypsi about the stigma word and say "as I said above." Ypsi hasn't responded to your comment, yet. :)
Host of Hoopsville. USBWA Executive Board member. Broadcast Director for D3sports.com. Broadcaster for NCAA.com & several colleges. PA Announcer for Gophers & Brigade. Follow me on Twitter: @davemchugh or @d3hoopsville.

fredfalcon

UWRF has a transfer from Dakota County Tech, Cole Murray, from Rogers, MN high school originally. I hope he's as good as our transfer from Mankato, Alex Herink, two years ago. Bring on the transfers!
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GOT BALLS? PLAY FOR THE FALLS!

AndOne

Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on September 19, 2018, 08:27:07 PM
Quote from: AndOne on September 19, 2018, 06:47:50 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on September 19, 2018, 02:04:32 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on September 19, 2018, 02:01:02 PM
I don't see why it is a stigma. For some students, it is the cheapest and most efficient way to graduate from college. By saying it's a stigma, you are doing what Sager is indicating ... making light and dismissing students who take that track.

Besides, while it might be a stigma if students were constantly transferring AWAY from a school, how could it possibly be a stigma to have students transferring IN?

Come on Ypsi. You are smarter than that.
As I said above, stigma is probably the wrong word, and UWW might not even be in the discussion. But you know there are schools, unlike your Alma mater where everything is the best and perfection is the only word that applies to all aspects of the operation, that care at least as much about a kid's ability on the court as in the classroom. ⛹🏼‍♂️ 😏
Yes, no, maybe? 😏

AndOne ... this response from Ypsi was near the beginning of the stigma conversation. You cannot ding Ypsi about the stigma word and say "as I said above." Ypsi hasn't responded to your comment, yet. :)

I suspect and hope that with as long as we've been going back and forth, Ypsi knows I wasn't firmly dinging him, but rather gently needling him. Furthermore, that I was doing so more with regard to his old school rather than UWW or any other specific institution. 😊

Mr. Ypsi

Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on September 19, 2018, 08:27:07 PM
Quote from: AndOne on September 19, 2018, 06:47:50 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on September 19, 2018, 02:04:32 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on September 19, 2018, 02:01:02 PM
I don't see why it is a stigma. For some students, it is the cheapest and most efficient way to graduate from college. By saying it's a stigma, you are doing what Sager is indicating ... making light and dismissing students who take that track.

Besides, while it might be a stigma if students were constantly transferring AWAY from a school, how could it possibly be a stigma to have students transferring IN?

Come on Ypsi. You are smarter than that.
As I said above, stigma is probably the wrong word, and UWW might not even be in the discussion. But you know there are schools, unlike your Alma mater where everything is the best and perfection is the only word that applies to all aspects of the operation, that care at least as much about a kid's ability on the court as in the classroom. ⛹🏼‍♂️ 😏
Yes, no, maybe? 😏

AndOne ... this response from Ypsi was near the beginning of the stigma conversation. You cannot ding Ypsi about the stigma word and say "as I said above." Ypsi hasn't responded to your comment, yet. :)

And I hadn't planned to respond at all to such a snarky post, but now that I've been called out ...

I'll posit that tomt meant to refer only to the basketball program, but his post(s) specifically smeared the entire university - and 'smeared' is the right word since 'stigma' is ALWAYS negative.

And yes, AndOne, I AM smarter than what you are implying.  tomt specifically referred to "transfer university".  Some basketball programs may be willing to bend all sorts of academic standards to admit 'stud' players, but I have seen no evidence that UWW (as a university OR a program) is in that category.  And overall, how can massive IN-migration to a university possibly be construed as a negative?  (Even if it is purely an economic fleeing of an expensive private to a cheaper public, they still chose UWW rather than UWO, UWSP, etc.)

EDIT: saw your latest post just before I hit 'post'.  I recognized that it was not a serious slam (glad I toned down my initial response! ;D)  But be snarky about my Titans at your own risk!  I suppose it's about time we give this board back to WIACers!


Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)


I'll just add that the response I got (from lots of coaches) when I talked to them for my transfer column (I think two seasons ago) was that public schools, especially larger state schools, get a lot more athlete transfer inquiries, and thus the number of transfer players often reflects that.  I won't buy that wholesale without some research, but it does make some sense to me.
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WUPHF

The public institutions generally get significantly more transfer inquiries from students in general, so it would make sense that this would be true for student in general.

I do not know as much about the UW schools, but if you look at the public institutions in Missouri, you see a variety of institutional missions, a variety of transfer admissions standards, and a variety of institutional commitments to transfer student recruitment and retention.

Greek Tragedy

Pointers
Breed of a Champion
2004, 2005, 2010 and 2015 National Champions

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TGHIJGSTO!!!


Pat Coleman

Oh good. Can input those final three games we were lacking.
Publisher. Questions? Check our FAQ for D3f, D3h.
Quote from: old 40 on September 25, 2007, 08:23:57 PMLet's discuss (sports) in a positive way, sometimes kidding each other with no disrespect.

Greek Tragedy

If anyone didn't notice... Point was only able to get 10 nc games. That's disappointing, but I understand that scheduling can be tough.

*2018 NCAA tournament team

At St. Olaf (20-8)*
BVU (17-9)
Edgewood (11-16)
At Augustana (25-6)*
Superior (7-18)
At Hope (19-10)*
Ripon (18-7)
At St. Thomas (14-12)
At Cal Lutheran (9-15)
Vs IWU (19-8)*
Pointers
Breed of a Champion
2004, 2005, 2010 and 2015 National Champions

Fantasy Leagues Commissioner

TGHIJGSTO!!!

tomt4525

Quinn Steckbauer, 5'11" Merrill PG, will play basketball at UW-Oshkosh.  He averaged 17 a game and was 2nd team All Conference last season as a junior.

Pat Coleman

Publisher. Questions? Check our FAQ for D3f, D3h.
Quote from: old 40 on September 25, 2007, 08:23:57 PMLet's discuss (sports) in a positive way, sometimes kidding each other with no disrespect.