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Division III basketball (Posting Up) => Women's Basketball => Region 1 women's basketball => Topic started by: Senator Frost on March 12, 2005, 09:18:11 AM

Title: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: Senator Frost on March 12, 2005, 09:18:11 AM
Who then should have been chosen, if not Wesleyan?
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Gordon "Marco Scutaro" Mann on March 12, 2005, 01:21:53 PM
Nancy:

While we didn't project Wesleyan in the tournament, I think they represented themselves well enough.

They beat Chestnut Hill and CSI, which most C teams probably would have.  But they played a talented Springfield team down to the wire.

The Pride are much better than that 21-point blowout to Wes in December.
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Nancy Abromowitz on March 12, 2005, 01:44:38 PM
Gordo

I am a big UAA fan, Brandeis or NYU is better then Wesleyan
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Senator Frost on March 12, 2005, 04:18:11 PM
Didn't Deis "Spit the bit" v Emory and Wash U by 30 at Deis? A talented team that sometimes isn't 'in the mood?' (Hmm, where have I heard that before???)
 Isn't "Spit the Bit" pretty similar to "Off with their heads?"
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: yellstoomuch on March 13, 2005, 04:09:23 PM
Let Brandeis beat Emmanuel like Wesleyan did by 18, and then we can talk.
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dr.Fager on March 13, 2005, 04:50:56 PM
Just returned from Scranton. Probably will need two posts with some time in between to get my thoughts together.  
Bowdoin didn't lose, but Scranton won. Both teams brought their defenisve teams to the arena last night and the game was up for grabs until the last minute of play. To paraphrase that coach at U.Conn.,  Scranton had Mellody and Bowdoin didn't. Taryn Mellody was WILLING and ABLE to take the outside shot. She can elevate and even though Bowdoin was often in her face,  was able to knock down the game winner.
Bowdoin led by Justine P.'s defense limited Scranton to 8 buckets from the floor other those scored by Mellody. The Bowdoin coach changed their pattern of pressing and the Scranton team had trouble all night bringing the ball up court, but finally the tune was Mellody and Bowdoin couldn't answer on the offensive end.
The game felt like the D3 Championship game but I won't go that far as it would be unfair to the other three teams that will meet in Virginia.
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Allen M. Karon on March 13, 2005, 05:13:21 PM
Dr. Fager--

That final sentence in your last post rings with a lot of truth.  I do not believe that I have seen a field in the DIII Women's Final Four like I have seen this year.  I can honestly say that the best four teams in DIII women's basketball right now are in this Final Four.  Usually, because of geography, one does not get these types of match-ups like the people at Virginia Wesleyan will see this weekend, but when the 4 teams in the DIII Final Four are also in the Top 10 in both the D3Hoops.com and the WBCA polls respectively, I can safely say that there will be a lot of exciting moments next weekend.  Honestly, I cannot predict with certainty who will win the national championship next weekend, but the survivor next weekend will be a highly deserving national champion.

(Message edited by deiscanton on March 13, 2005)
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Senator Frost on March 14, 2005, 07:48:17 AM
The best four teams????? Bates was denied a home
game based on what??? Their gym is too old??? These folks at the NCAA assigned to D3 would appear to have delusions of Grandeur. I assume the Bates gym has a regulation floor and regulation baskets. If that's the case then the game should have been held there.
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Steve on March 14, 2005, 08:06:28 AM
Sen. Frost-there's also the issue of seating and hotel space. The honest truth is that it is easier to find hotels in Portland than Lewiston, and USM can hold a lot more people than Bates.

Plus, the isn't the only example of a number 1 seed being shipped out.  Millikin had to play at No. 7 Calvin. It's a 40 minute drive from Bates to USM; it's more than 5 and a half hours from Millikin to Calvin. I didn't hear them complaining, they just went out and won the sectional.
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Senator Frost on March 14, 2005, 08:31:06 AM
The honest truth?? What are you talking about???????? Lewiston and Auburn, it's sister city have well over 50,000 people. PLENTY of Hotel space-No case there.
More seating-Yes you are right but why should the better team be penalized? I mean it's not like there is a ton of $$$$$$$ at stake here. How many more seats? (after both sides inflate)
 Millikin? Who cares about Millikin? Isn't that a Red State anyway? Bates isn't complaining. I was merely responding to the post about the so called  "best four". That's all.  
 This seating thing takes it away from those who deserve it and gives it to those with a few more seats-(By George, that's America!!)  
As I said, Delusions of Grandeur
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Senator Frost on March 14, 2005, 08:32:19 AM
Maybe Illinois was a Blue-I can't recall.
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Steve on March 14, 2005, 10:50:11 AM
Illinois was blue, but that couldn't be further from the point.  USM has hosted a national championship before, clearly they consider it a much more worthy site than Bates.  Also, I don't think they always make the decision based on who is the higher seed, but which is easier to accomadate four teams.

I grew up in Maine, and let's be honest Gorham/Portland is much nicer than Lewiston/Auburn.
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 14, 2005, 02:41:16 PM
Millikin was already hosting high school playoffs and could not host the sectional this past weekend.

Bates' gymnasium, I believe, was considered too small. This isn't about making money, however, as much as it is about letting as many fans as possible see the game. You don't want to turn half your fans away.
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roy Alexander on March 14, 2005, 02:53:30 PM
Hello NESCAC posters; I typically post in the MAC section and am a big Scranton fan. I just felt compelled to write on this page and express my thoughts from the Bowdoin-Scranton game. Although I am extremely happy with the outcome I was very impressed with the Bowdoin team. Forget the talent--you either have it or you do not, I was more impressed with the class that the Bowdoin team showed. It was a very verbal\raucous crowd and not one of the Polar Bears seemed affected. Often times when fouls are called players glare at the refs and\or argue calls, I was amazed at the composure that your ladies showed throughout. They are a classy bunch of ladies. And about the talent, yes they have that as well, Scranton was just a bit better that's all.
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pinna on March 14, 2005, 03:04:51 PM
I can't believe people are dissin' the smelly 'Scoggin.  Nothin' like it as you enter Lewiston from Auburn.  As a Batesie, it's disappointing Alumni Gym cost the Lady Bobcats being the host team.  However, I can completely understand the decision.  Too bad they didn't get shipped out of Maine like Bowdoin.  No history between Bates and Scranton... I think they win that game.  Bates embarassed USM early.  This was a classic "payback" game.  Fact is, any of the top seven or so teams appears able to beat another at any given time.  'Lot of parity.  Bates' alumni letter talked a great deal about renovations to the campus, primarily in housing and eating facilities.  With both basketball programs being on the map now, maybe it's time to consider putting money into the athletic facilities (what a concept!).
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red on March 14, 2005, 10:39:56 PM
The NCAA sticks with seating provided that the highest seeded team has a gym that meets all of their standards of court availability, adequate practice facilities, adequate lodging in the area, and adequate size of gym.  The only thing Bates missed was that Alumni only holds 750, and the NCAA regulations say that a gym must hold 1000 people to host a sectional

As to whether the four best teams made the final four:  I think that was moot when Bates and USM had to meet in the sweet sixteen.  I believe that both of them were in the top 4.  Also, Bates beat USM badly in Lewiston, and took them to overtime at USM.  At their level, the best teams should always win at home, but as close as the game was at USM, I think that it shows that Bates would likely have won on a neutral court.

I believe that to truly determine the best team, the sectionals also need to be on a neutral court.  I don't know how expensive an endeavor this would be, but there must be some decent sized d3 gyms whose teams would no longer be playing, that would be fairly cheap for the NCAA to rent if necessary.
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Steve on March 14, 2005, 11:16:52 PM
Which final four team are you leaving out Red?
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Senator Frost on March 14, 2005, 11:39:35 PM
Good idea about the neutral court. I disagree strongly with that 1000 seating thing. This is D3 and teams should be rewarded without regard to gym capacity. Bates is one of the poorer NESCAC schools. Maybe they felt they had better things to do with their $ given that they do not have an endless supply. So less people would have seen the game, hardly a big deal. Interest would have been heightened and those who wanted a ticket would have had to hustle and some may have gotten shut out. Again, hardly a big deal.  Bates would have gotten the home game they deserved.
 No question in my mind Bates was the better team since they went to overtime AT USM as was stated.
Steve-of course Red State Blue State was irrelevant. So was fact (even if true) that Millikin wasn't complaining.
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 15, 2005, 12:15:24 AM
Steve and Senator Frost,

My dad is from Portland, and we have a cabin on Sabbathday Lake (10 miles from Auburn), so I feel (semi)qualified to step in on this fight.

I LIKE Lewiston/Auburn, but ...  

Senator, you have enough hotel rooms - are you kidding?!  WHERE are you imagining these rooms to be?  Aside from the fact (apparently) that the gym at Bates is too small to meet NCAA standards, where exactly are these (imaginary) hotel rooms??  

I admit that I haven't been to Lewiston in nearly two years, and maybe they've been on a building boom, but nearly all the 'hotels' I know of are by the 'coast' (i.e., near Portland).  The Lewiston/Auburn I knew two years ago would be stretched thin to host more than 3-400 people.

(Message edited by cabonney on March 15, 2005)
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Paul Clancy on March 15, 2005, 11:47:45 AM
I'm a big fan of the neutral court idea, and in this case, the sweet irony would have been to play the USM/Bates game at Bowdoin, which was good enough for a sectional last year - and where neither Bates nor USM has won the past two years.  The facts on home courts speak pretty plainly for themselves:

USM loses to Bates in Lewiston and Bowdoin in Brunswick; Bates loses twice to Bowdoin in Brunswick and beats them in Lewiston; Scranton last year loses to Bowdoin at Brunswick and beats Bowdoin this year in Scranton; Bowdoin beats Emmanuel for several years in Brunswick then goes to the Yawkey center and loses.

There are certainly exceptions, and the fact they are so notable and noteworthy just proves the general case.  Neutral courts should be the venue for "big" games, and the sectionals qualify.
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Lloyd Christmas on March 15, 2005, 04:14:35 PM
Wow, just a couple of days on the road and we've got all sorts of things on this board. Good stuff.

First, congrats to Scranton on the big win. Holding an opponent to 43 points, whether one of the best or just average, is quite an achievement. Best of luck. USM was dismissed by a lot of people because of the Jones thing, but they've exceeded expectations. They should be lauded for their effort.

While Bates is one of the "poorer" NESCACs (Bowdoin's endowment is larger than Colby + Bates combined), they built an ice hockey rink on campus suitable for a DIII team, but yet have no hockey teams. Odd. A venue for a sanctioned varsity sport would have made more sense (and allowed them to host).

Bates knew they wouldn't be able to host the sectional at the beginning of the season. Everyone knew they had to win games away from home in that round if they made it, so arguing for a neutral site now smacks of sour grapes.

Cabonney, Brunswick has no problem housing the visiting teams and fans for sectionals and B-wick is considerably smaller than L-A. Hotels is a non-issue.

Nancy, run back to the ECAC...er...UAA board. You can figure out where to hang that second-straight "Not Good Enough" banner. This board is reserved for teams making the Sweet 16...all three of them. Best of luck with Pine Manor next year.
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d-mac on March 15, 2005, 04:49:55 PM
And then there were FOUR... or really eight!
This weekend... the best of the best are crowded
But before then... we tell you who we think are the best... on "Hoopsville"!!!


Eight teams in the nation can see where the road finishes. But who is going to get past the final two exits?

Millikin took out Calvin in a hard fought battle... to earn their way to the Women's Final Four. So is this Illinois team ready to go? Coach Lori Kerans will let us know. Her #6 ranked Big Blue Ladies are the lowest ranked team remaining, but still battle tested and ready for their semi-final game with Southern Maine.

The #1 ranked Scranton Lady Royals sure had a tough road to drive as they took on last year's championship finalist, Bowdoin College in the Elite Eight. Scranton showed why they are the #1 team in the nation, knocking off the Polar Bears. So do the Lady Royals have anything left in the tank for Randolph-Macon in the semi-finals? Coach Mike Strong answer that question and if that #1 ranking adds any pressure.

On the men's side, Rochester is still marching... even though mid-way through the season, most thought they had no chance. But their star player returned... and they knocked off not only last year's Final Four finalist Amherst in the Sweet 16... but then took out a suddenly hot SUNY-Potsdam team in the Elite Eight. Now, Rochester has been here before, and Coach Mike Neer has the experience. But how does his team prepare for a tough Final Four match-up with Calvin.

Calvin - people warned us about. They are the only team left in this men's tournament that has played every game to get here. First Wheaton, then Aurora, finally Mississippi College fell to the side of the Knights. Then came MIAA conference foe - and champion Albion. Which Calvin disposed of 60-52... to take their drive to Salem... for the first time since they won the national title in 2000.
So, what will Coach Kevin Vande Streek use from that last title run to help his team get past Rochester and into the title game? We will ask him that and much more (including if he saw Albion's buzzer beater Friday night? Jared did!).

And then there is York College (PA)... 11-15 last year... flew under many radars most of the year... and now they are in the first Final Four in the school's history.
Coach Jeff Gamber has traveled to Salem before, but never with a team playing. Now, after 28 years... he in Salem as a participant. But, this trip is completely new to Coach Gamber and the Spartans, who until this year had never won a NCAA Tournament game. We will talk to the coach of York and see if he has yet to come down from the high of beating Kings on Saturday to lock up the trip to Salem.

So come join us online and LIVE from 8-10PM Eastern!
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red on March 15, 2005, 06:07:33 PM
As for the hotel issue, There is a large hotel in Auburn just accross the "scogg" from downtown Lewiston, plus there's a Ramada, Motel 6, and Super 8 in Lewiston just so you can choose your price.  On top of that USM players and fans would just travel on game day, and go home afterwards like Bates did, so there's only 2 teams that need hosting.  Believe me LA can handle it.

As for Lloyd's comments about sour grapes:  who cares?  It seems clear from arguments stated by Frost et. al. that on a neutral court Bates would have likely won.  That's not saying that the game last week was unfair, or unjust, and I'm not trying to whine.  All I was saying, and many seemed to agree, was that a system truly designed to determine "the best team" should play the big games on a neutral court.  D1 is not played completely on neutral courts for both men and women for no reason.  I was just suggesting a possible improvement for the future, not complaining about the past.

I'd prefer to spend my time being proud of Bates'school record accomplishments this year rather than annoyed about one game.
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Senator Frost on March 15, 2005, 07:31:14 PM
Red: And there are more hotels. I thought Bates was the best team I saw this year. I saw Bowdoin too, I might add. My opinion is small comfort.Maybe one day they will have a neutral site deal just like the D1's. When you think about it, why shouldn't everyone be trated the same???
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Steve on March 15, 2005, 09:21:40 PM
Women's basketball in DI wasn't played on all neutral sites until a couple of years ago.  Now both the men and women play in a pod system, and sometimes lower seeded teams can play closer to home than higher seeded teams, if there is an upset.
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Steve on March 15, 2005, 09:24:05 PM
On the men's side, Illinois gets to play in Indy, Chicago, and St. Louis.  If Syracuse had played a little better they could have played the sectional at home.
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red on March 15, 2005, 11:25:39 PM
Syracuse could not have played the sectional at home.  Part of the D1 system is that all the games are on a neutral court.  Syracuse may have gotten a higher seeding in a different bracket, but the NCAA would not have put Syracuse in their home bracket.  Example:  Two years ago with Carmello Anthony Syracuse got a #2 seed, but was still sent to another bracket so they wouldn't be at home.

Close to home or far from home, the fact is it's not at home.  That makes a tremendous difference. Example:  Emmanuel is much closer to Brunswick than Ithica, NY, but Bowdoin lost to Emmanuel and beat Ithica.  Note that Ithica and Emmanuel were fairly evenly matched.  The most important factor wasn't how far Bowdoin was away from home, it was just that they were away from home.
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Steve on March 15, 2005, 11:40:56 PM
Well, Tennessee women are playing in Knoxville in the first round of the tourney
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 16, 2005, 12:09:32 AM
Red and Senator,

I think of 1500-2000 as a BARE minimum for being able to accomodate teams, fans (and other travellers), but I forgot that Bates can only hold 750 and was therefore ineligible by NCAA standards anyway.

Hotel/motel accomodations WAS a moot point!
Title: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Senator Frost on June 19, 2005, 05:52:29 PM
Yoo Hoo-Anybody home?? Hope I'm not disturbing something but I just heard Trinity is looking for a Head Coach. It will be interesting to see if Trinity really wants to win or if they give the job to a Downhill Specialist who knows someone. Trinity Women used to be at or near the top and I'm guessing they want to return. We will see.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: myepa on October 26, 2005, 10:37:06 AM
let's go people. nov. 1 is just around the corner. who's ready to start it up?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on October 28, 2005, 12:17:14 AM
The hoops season is about to start (official practices start on 11/1 in NESCAC), and here is my preseason ranking for the women's Nescac.  Comments and critiques are encouraged.

1.  Bates - Bates and Bowdoin are the two power houses again this year.  Bates took a big loss in the graduation of All-American Olivia Zurek.  I expect this to effect the team a little.  I expected Laura Trenkle's graduating to effect Bowdoin a lot, and it really didn't, so I've learned and adjusted my reasoning in this regard.  The conference home game between these two is at Bates this year, so I think this is the Bobcats' year to win the conference and play the NESCAC tournament at home.

2.  Bowdoin - The only reason they won't be number 1 is because the conference game is at Bates.  The top two NESCAC teams will, however, split there two games home and home.  Bowdoin returns standouts Justine Pourevalis and Eileen Flaherty among others for another year.  They will continue to impress.

3.  Williams - The Return of leading scorers Colleen Hession and Maggie Miller will give Williams the best shot of anyone at cracking the into the top 2.

4.  Wesleyan - A Consistently good team looks to improve on a slightly off year.  Wesleyan made the NCAA tournament last year as a Pool C team one week after falling to Amherst in the first round of the NESCAC Tournament.  There were those who felt that Wesleyan may not have been deserving of the pool C bid.  Wesleyan looks to prove the naysayers wrong this year, and with Hannah Stubbs entering her senior year look for her to lead this hungry team to some big wins.

5.  Tufts- This is one of my surprise picks, especially with the loss of Allison Love to graduation, but Valerie Krah and Jessica Powers have each had a year to mature.  Tufts has had an extremely successful string of years of late and these two have been huge contributers to that.  Look for Tufts to have a strong showing this year.

6.  Amherst  - This is a team of fighters.  I admitt that I know nothing of their first-years, but this is the same for all the teams.  As much fight as this Amherst team has in them (nearly upsetting Bates a few years ago at Bates in the first round of the Nescac tournament) I just don't see them quite at the level as the top 4.  Look for some great games in the battle for 5th place with Tufts.

7.  Middlebury - I know nothing about this team, but it seemed reasonable given last years perfomance, and what I know of the other teams.

8.  Colby - They're losing Wendy Bonner to graduation, but they're picking up a new coach.  They won't make the same mistakes as last year and will find their way into the Nescac tournament this year. 

9.  Trinity - I know nothing about this team, but it's been a few years since they've been largely successful in Nescac, and they don't show any signs of that changing yet.  They key word here is yet.  Be aware of this team, and be careful, they will be strong again some day, and they showed a few hints of it last year when they beat Tufts, played very close to Amherst, and took Bates right down to the final buzzer.  This team is ready to break through, but I think there's a little bit too much talent ahead of them this year.  *sleeper team*  Trinity is going to my pick as sleeper team.  They played within just a few points of a lot of good Nescac teams last year.  They might be able to pull off some surprises.  Be on the lookout.

10.  Conn. College-  I don't really know anything about this team, but they've been spending some time down here lately, and I haven't seen any evidence that they're ready to move up just yet.

This is my annotated preseason poll.  (note:  this is just my opinion, I'm not an expert, nor do I represent one.)

Cheers
Red1 (formerly Red--it's a long story   ;))

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: angus_king on November 01, 2005, 07:07:50 PM
Red (1),

I would agree with your picks with one change: I'd move Amherst up to No. 4 and bump everyone down a peg. I think the Lady Jeffs will be better wire-to-wire this year, expounding on the late season success of last winter.

I'll also tip my cap to the Ephs, who will play a very strong early schedule, making me think their coach feels they have a contender. It's always smart to play USM early than late, as well. Even if they stumble, they'll be battle-hardened for the conference slate.

Red, hopefully you'll be brought along for the Bobcats' Vegas trip... ;D

Angus King (formerly Lloyd Christmas...an even longer story...).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on November 01, 2005, 09:30:13 PM
Angus King,

I have a specific reason for dropping Amherst down from last year.  My reason is based on a little inside information that I've come accross.  This information has not been made public, and I don't want to be responsible for divulging any team's secrets, so I'll have to leave it at that.  I have my reason, and I'll just have to ask you to trust me that Amherst, while a good team, will probably not quite  be able to keep up with the numbers they put up last year.

At this point I don't think "feeling like a contender" is enough for Williams.  I think they know that they're contenders, and they're scheduling themselves as such.  They have a decently tough schedule with USM early on at the U Maine Farmington tournament, an interesting choice (and a long distance of travel) for williams, but it does get them that matchup against USM that I think will help them along the way.  Don't forget they knocked off Scranton in the first game of the season last year, and Scranton didn't take another loss until the NCAA semifinals.  They also have a home game against Springfield, a team that some thought had a very easy route to the quarter finals, and would very much like to prove that they belonged there.

To talk about tough schedules though, I have to let my bias show through and point out Bates' schedule.  They have games against USM (a remach of last years' NCAA sweet 16 at USM), Baldwin Wallace (in Vegas), if they win that then likely Scranton (also in Vegas). If they make the finals then they'll likely hit Brandeis (at Brandeis) in their tournament, not to mention the Williams tournament (at Williams), and that's all in 2005, the 2006 portion of the schedule will not get much better with the Springfield tournament (at springfiled), and a home and home set of games against Bowdoin (1 of which is in conference).  Also note that in 24 games only 8 are at home, and 5 of them are conference games expceted to be at home.  All of the top level opponents that Bates faces (and as you can see there are a lot) are on the road.  Now that is a tough schedule!

Here's looking forward to a great basketball season!

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on November 01, 2005, 10:41:17 PM
  Wesleyan will be without Nora Bowman. I was a big fan but maybe they can do as well without her?? Amherst was 4W 5L last year and gets everyone back. In addition they beat Wesleyan in the NESCAC Tourney at the endd of the season AT Wesleyan. I do wonder about your 'Inside Info' as you do not seem like the type who would make something up.
  A team that is too low in my opinion is Middlebury. They too were 4W 5L last year but they were missing two starters for most of the season. On paper they only had one Senior so if all return, I can't see why they shouldn't be a little higher.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: angus_king on November 02, 2005, 01:16:14 AM
Wow, Nov. 1 and we've already got the insider scoop kicking in. Good stuff. Unless your insider info has to do with Kostakis, I think Amherst will be better. No need to confirm or deny...probably not appropriate for this board.

Bowdoin's schedule is okay (USM, Ithaca, Emmanuel, Staten Island) in non-conference, but nothing like last year (so far). Forgive me if I'm not impressed with the Brandeis tourney. The Judgettes are painfully overrated in this site's ranking and have again decided to fatten up with the dregs of New England (Bobcats excluded) in an effort to get an at-large sniff. They're an ECAC lock, more along the lines of a Plymouth State or UNE than a big dog. Murph better be careful, he may have bitten off more than he can chew...unless he thinks he has a contender, as well.

I guess I'll go ahead and put Bowdoin at the top of my list, since they've managed to hold off everyone for the last five years and this team might be the best of the bunch.

Frost, Middlebury? They haven't been on the radar for a while. They get some people back, but any difference-makers? But hey, Wesleyan made the NCAAs after falling in the quarters, so anything can happen, I suppose.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on November 02, 2005, 09:49:43 AM
It is not inside info, but Kostakis transferred to Bates, giving Bates the two top sophomores in the conference.  That will really hurt Amherst.  Still, that is likely not enough to put Bates over Bowdoin, who loses very little, when Bates lost its star player.  So I would say, Bowdoin, Bates, and Williams in that order.   Williams is just as talented as the top two, but has to prove that it can hold on to a late-game lead in a big game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: myepa on November 02, 2005, 10:33:28 AM
"Murph better be careful, he may have bitten off more than he can chew...unless he thinks he has a contender, as well."


Well, obviously he thinks he has a contender, why wouldn't he? As with any great coach, he always believes his teams are contenders, and this year he has as much reason to believe as ever. And as far as biting off more than he can chew, the tough schedule will do nothing but good for bates in the long run, and i believe they will handle it superbly in the short run anyways. duck soup, chicken dinner.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bearswatcher on November 02, 2005, 12:32:41 PM
Angus,

Just skimming todays posts since the UAA has been dead, we all know that Wash U is better then everyone in the UAA and if you go to our site you'll find the UAA coaches again voted us preseason #1 in the conference, but heck, I saw Brandeis beat us last year here and they are pretty damn good, cupcakes in 2005 or not. You need to see them before you scream over rated, I don't think they lost anyone meaningful from last year either so they will be tough.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: angus_king on November 02, 2005, 01:08:50 PM
Interesting about Kostakis. I'll be curious to see how she fits in with Bates' style of play. I agree, Williams has all the pieces to win the league this year. They just need to learn how to finish. They also get Bates and Bowdoin at home, both of which are the Saturday games.

Bears, you are correct, I do need to see Brandeis. In the NCAAs. Until then I will scream(?) overated. If they couldn't beat out Wesleyan, a team knocked out in the first round of the conference tournament, for an at-large bid, I consider them an also-ran. They've done nothing to rectify the problem (weak non-conference schedule) that hurt them last year. If they get thrown against the third-best team in the NESCAC again this year for an at-large, say Bowdoin, Brandeis will experience the same fate. It appears they have the scheduling mentality of "the UAA AQ or bust," a risky move considering the strength of both their conference and region.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bearswatcher on November 02, 2005, 06:00:46 PM
Angus,

why is the NCAA's, from last year no less, your barometer? Heck there are some "pxss poor" teams in the NCAA's every year. Believe me, like going into Bowdin or So. Maine, any team that can go into NYU or Wash U and win is a real team, it is not a fluke when a team beats teams like tose above on their home court.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on November 02, 2005, 06:20:43 PM
I didn't know that it was public that Kostakis had transferred to Bates, and I didn't want to say anything if the teams were trying to keep it a secret.  This was indeed the information that I had that led me to drop Amherst in my preseason rankings.

As to the Bowdoin/Bates question I picked Bates even though Olivia Zurek graduated because the year before I thought the graduation of Laura Trenkle would hurt Bowdoin significantly and it didn't.  Applying that to this year, and the adding of Kostakis, I think that Bates will overcome the loss of Zurek and win the NESCAC.  Also, even if they're just close they will likely split and win their home games against eachother and Bates has the conference game at home this year.  That's why I picked Bates

As for the Middlebury question, I still know nothing about this team.  Perhpas I did put them too low.  I had know idea that they were missing two starters for most of the season.  We'll see what happens.

As for the Brandeis question, I know very little about Brandeis, but over the last few years there has been a lot of question as to how good Brandeis' record really is.  The key to Brandeis' excellent W/L record has been that they don't play a single competitve team in their non-conference schedule.  Last year they played Tufts pretty well in their only competition with NESCAC, but Tufts finished 7th in NESCAC, and the margin of victory was well below Brandeis' average.  Beating Tufts by a below average margin is a far cry from being competitive with Bates, Bowdoin, or Williams.  Until Brandeis plays a competitive non-conference opponent, and wins, to prove the worth of their record, I will believe that they are overrated.  Fortunately, we may not have to wait very long.  Bates is participating in the Brandeis tip-off tournament this year and the two teams are likely to meet in the finals.  We can all wait and see.

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on November 02, 2005, 08:54:47 PM
  Without Kostakis, I too have to lower Amherst. I thought they'd be Fourth and get a Home Playioff game. Still, you never know. Last year Wesleyan had a Frosh guard who looked VERY good (On Paper) She made some all state teams and then she hardly played when she got to Wesleyan. Was she hurt? Was she being groomed to take over for Bowman? Perhaps she was overrated in High School?
  So without Knowing whether Bowman will be replaced and now with the news of Kostakis, I very hesitatingly have Middlebury in Fourth. One reason is that they play Bates Bowdoin and I think Williams at Home. Maybe they can squeeze a win out of those 3 games??
    I heard Bowdoin has an All State Maine player and I think Bates does too. That's all I know about Frosh so far.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: angus_king on November 03, 2005, 01:33:05 AM
The miserable teams that get into the NCAAs every year are AQs from weak conferences, not from the at-large pool. I use Pool C as my barometer for judging teams -- and conferences -- because it invariably means those team were willing to play a tough schedule and fell a game or two short of the AQ. Brandeis will either get the AQ from the UAA this season (an event that will certainly earn them the credit some think they've already earned) or they will continue to be the poster gals for the ECAC. For whatever reason, Brandeis is unwilling to put itself out there for Pool C consideration, and because of that they will continue to remain a second tier from my perspective.

I have that sickening feeling I've opened up the tiresome 'no double-round robin' can of worms, but hopefully I'm wrong.

As I look at the NESCAC schedule this year, I think the team that ends up hosting the tournament will have one loss.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on November 03, 2005, 12:34:48 PM
One point of interest -- it appears that Williams and Amherst each enrolled one half of a pair of twin frosh on their respective teams (both roster posted).  That should make for a fun rivalry for the next four years!  Hopefully the evil twin at Amherst will realize her mistake and transfer ...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on November 04, 2005, 07:53:43 PM
It's Bowdoin and then everyone else in NESCAC this season.
Bates will be thin and opponents will probably double and triple Sarah Barton -- who is the real engine of the Bates team.  The other four on the floor won't be good enough to lead them to championship caliber -- don't get me wrong, they will definitely win their share of games -- just not an elite team.   Bowdoin is going to continue to dominate this conference until the day that Coach Pemper decides to leave.  Anyone who watches a lot of NESCAC games knows that she is light years ahead of her coaching counterparts -- and perhaps most importantly, she outworks them by a substantial margin  ( check out the local, regional and national camps, check out the local high school games and see who is there -- ask her assistants what is expected of them, etc).  Anyhow, to me the most intriguing team to watch in the next couple of seasons will be Colby with the addition of Coach McBride.  They will be "not good" this season but McBride comes with a resume somewhat similar to Pemper when she showed up at Bowdoin seven or eight years ago.  P.S.  On paper, USM looks almost unbeatable
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on November 04, 2005, 11:00:02 PM
Bates has no one other than Sarah Barton who can lead a championship calibur team?!  Let's examine this shall we?  There's Meg Coffin, she was second team all Nescac and is shaping up to be a star.  She might very well be the best player on the team.  Oh well, we'll just ignore her and maybe she'll go away, or perhaps Barton (the league leader in assists last year) won't be able to see a 6-1 center wide open under the basket for the easy layup.

Perhaps they cover Coffin while double or triple teaming Barton, somone has to be open.  How about Matia Kostakis who was also a rookie of the year last year.  Another big scorer, rebounder, and blocker, not unlike Olivia Zurek. Perhaps she's too young to be a championship calibur player.

Maybe she'll find Kyla Decato in the corner.  Not that Kyla can shoot or anything.  She only led NESCAC in 3pt shooting % last year.

The point being, Bates isn't good because they have one or two or three players of a certain calibur.  They're good because they have a talented team.  If Zurek was the only championship calibur player then double and triple teaming her would have shut Bates down.  As teams learned, it did nothing of the sort, because if Zurek was double or triple teamed then there were 2,3,or 4 other people with more than enough talent to put the other team away, one of whom was always open, and if they didn't double team her, she'd win the one-on-one every time.  It's the multi-faceted threat that makes Bates so tough.  You double team someone they find the open player who takes it to you, you don't double team, and any one of them can beat you one-on-one.  It's not about the individuals, it's about the team as a whole, that's why Bowdoin and USM are so good too.  They don't win because they have one or two or three championship calibur players, but because they meld so well as a team.  A significant portion of the credit for this should go to the coaches of each of these teams too.  Bates and Bowdoin split their games home and home last year, and will likely do so again this year.  The conference game is at Bates this year.  If you really believe that Bowdoin will run away with it this year, I think you're in for a surprise.

As for the USM comment, they look almost unbeatable on paper because they are almost unbeatable.  That "almost" is extremely important.  They are beatable every once in a while, but very rarely.  USM has won 20 games every year since the mid to late '70s (I'm not exactly sure which year, but it's in that area.)  The Huskies are truly a dynasty in Women's DIII basketball.  I think that winning at least 20 games a year qualifies as "almost" never losing.  They were almost unbeatable last year too, but Bates and Bowdoin both took advantage of that "almost" as did Milikin.

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bearswatcher on November 04, 2005, 11:23:12 PM
I rooting for Brandeis to beat Bates, Not only because they are in the UAA but because you guys are almost as obnoxious as me, but I am still a student so I don't count
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on November 05, 2005, 12:06:11 AM
  These guys aren't obnoxious at all. They are just fans. If Brandeis beats Bates stick around and you will see concentrated obnoxiousness. She'll be back.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: myepa on November 06, 2005, 06:07:49 PM
First of all, Red, you took the words right out of my mouth. Second of all, anyone who denies coach murphy's work ethic is a fool...last year he won nescac coach of the year in both soccer and basketball, he must be doing something right. and stephanie may be a hard working coach, ill give you that, but she does still wear a sweater with a polar bear on it.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: newtonnancy on November 06, 2005, 06:53:30 PM
New season, read some posts, and since I am in Chicago still, I have been keeping tabs on UC since I am removed from Brandeis (Allen, come I need some reports) and hear they played Northwestern (yes BIG 10 Northwestern) even up yesterday at NWU.

Congressman, I wthought I'd make your day
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: myepa on November 09, 2005, 01:37:54 PM
:-\ 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on November 09, 2005, 02:06:47 PM
Angus--

1.) It is not my fault that Bowdoin decided to go to the Eastern Conn. tip-off tourney-- my ultimate dream Brandeis tip-off tourney would have Brandeis v. S. Maine in the opening round with Bowdoin v. Bates as the second game.  Winners face off against each other for the title.  :)  However, since I can't get it this year, I am more than satisfied with the tip-off field that I got.  The rest of the non-conference schedule, though, does look like typical "bread and butter."  ;)

2.)  The NCAA field is now 63 teams, starting this season.  There are 21 Pool C bids now, so the scenario that befell the UAA last year where only the UAA automatic qualifer went to the NCAAs will not happen again this year-- unless Wash U wins the league by 4 games or more, which won't happen.   I expect NESCAC to send at least 2 or 3 teams to the NCAAs this year in this new field, too.  This change is well deserved.

3.)  Regardless of what happens, I will be in Springfield, MA on March 17, 2005 to see the national semis and championship game.   If the NESCAC makes it to Springfield,  I will look forward to it.

4.)  Brandeis does have the team to win 19 or 20 games again this year-- it is just a matter of playing these games one at a time.  The same goes for the top NESCAC teams.

I hope that you have an excellent NESCAC season, Angus.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: angus_king on November 09, 2005, 02:35:10 PM
1. Considering recent history, Bates and Bowdoin will see enough of each other without meeting in a tip-off tourney. With three meetings almost assured already, I think fans will get enough of that rivalry. If I had to put together an enticing tourney, Brandeis is not among the four.

2. My point still stands: if Brandeis gets thrown into a Pool C scenario with that schedule, they will be a low seed, if qualifying at all.

3. I hear Springfield is lovely in the spring. Make sure to lock your hubcaps.

4. It's impossible to play more than one game at a time under the currently accepted space/time continuum theories, which I believe have been adopted by the NCAA...

On a side note, I would take Justine Pouravalis (D3H HM Preseason AA) over Ashley Marble (2nd team).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on November 11, 2005, 06:37:45 PM
  I am not familar with all the NESCAC W coaches. I do know that Murphy is the Soccer Coach and that McBride is an Asst. Football coach. Does Pemper coach anything besides basketball?  I heard there are some coaches who are assts. and then they take off to coach Basketball towards the end of the other sport.
Murphy and McBride stay with their Fall sport until the end. It's easier if you have nothing to do but coach one sport. Not saying that is the case, I am merely inquiring.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on November 12, 2005, 09:53:47 PM
Quote from: senatorfrost on November 11, 2005, 06:37:45 PM. .  Does Pemper coach anything besides basketball?  I heard there are some coaches who are assts. and then they take off to coach Basketball towards the end of the other sport.
Murphy and McBride stay with their Fall sport until the end. It's easier if you have nothing to do but coach one sport. Not saying that is the case, I am merely inquiring.

The only sport that Pemper coaches at Bowdoin is basketball but I think that she also has administrative responsibilities of some sort in the Bowdoin athletic department.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on November 13, 2005, 12:16:33 PM
 Then she certainly has it a lot easier than McBride and Murphy and probably some others. I had always thought you had to be involved in coaching two sports as either a head coach or an Asst. I guess I was mistaken.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on November 13, 2005, 11:54:07 PM
Just a little addition to the conversation on coaches:

Coach Murphy and the soccer team just ended their season, falling in the second round of the NCAA championships.  For the last 2 weeks Coach Murphy has been attending practices and performing full coaching duties for both of these teams at the same time.  (Players as you know are not allowed to be in two sports at the same time, but apparently coaches can.)  He's really been doing double duty, and had the soccer team won, he'd have been forced to miss the Brandeis tip-off tournament in order to coach the soccer team.  (Meg Coffin, also, would have been forced to miss it as she is on the soccer team too.)

Along with the sorrow of losing in the NCAA tournament comes the joy of knowing that the women's basketball team won't be travelling to Brandeis without their star center and head coach.  That could have resulted in disaster.  Actually the assistant coach for the basketball team (Carla Flaherty) is also the assistant coach of the soccer team, so I don't know who would have coached the basketball team next weekend if soccer had won.

This long winded post was just to give everyone an idea of how hard Coach Murphy works this time of year.

Cheers,
Red1

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: myepa on November 14, 2005, 10:01:02 AM
Did anyone hear about the Bates alumni bball game this past weekend? I've received word through the grapevine that those alumni really gave bates a run for their money. a real nail biter i heard. a barn-burner, if you will. another thing i heard about the game was that there was a whole lot of straight hair flowing about. anyone else notice that?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: angus_king on November 14, 2005, 06:53:15 PM
While not up to the workload of an asst. football coach (perhaps the rarest women's hoops combo out there, up there with Harvey Shapiro's former role as w. hoops/baseball duo) or a two-sport varsity coach, Pemper is not sitting around fishing out of season. I believe her administrator duties include being the SWA, which is a year-round job.

With a little research:

Amh: McBride - Asst. Football
Bates: Murphy - W. Soccer
Bow: Pemper - SWA
Colby: Gear-McBride -  unknown (I'd guess asst. softball like O'Brien)
Conn.: Hungerford - none listed
Midd: Pecsok - Asst. Softball, Club sport liasion
Trin: Davis - none listed
Tufts: Berube - none listed
Wes: Mullen - Adjunct Professor
Will: Manning - couldn't find anything, but i believe she is an asst. with another team

Purpose? I think good coaches are good coaches, regardless of the workload. I would argue the workload of a good coach might be increased just because they have shown success. Murphy stands out because of his ability to have his teams at such a high level in consecutive seasons (a little more common in the fall/spring double).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on November 19, 2005, 03:33:45 PM
Here's the early matchup we've been waiting for.  Bates v. Brandeis at Brandeis this afternoon.  On the downside both Meg Coffin and Matia Kostakis are benched with injuries.  If Brandeis wins it will show some strength, but not as much as if they beat a fully healthy Bates team since the two injured players are both stars.  If Bates wins it will show that Brandeis' record and rank benefit greatly from their weak non-conference schedule making them appear far better than they may actually be.  Good luck to all.

Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Snowman on November 20, 2005, 12:58:33 AM
Red,

Got love you. You all rip Brandies, they beat you and the excuses fly already. I would wonder if any of Brandeis starters were injured, except, you can only beat what you play. Hopefully everyone will be healed so the same excuses don't fly when you play USM.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on November 20, 2005, 02:03:12 AM
Oh, great, now we have all the Brandeis nitwits coming over to the NESCAC board 'judging' themselves the best. At least we know that D3hoops will keep its long-standing tradition of taking into account injuries when putting together their poll.  ::) Methinks Bates won't get the same affection as USM did last year. Such is the price of being a NESCAC. I'll take the Bobcats at the end of the year.

It appears Bowdoin might be in danger of a step-off, as well, as they only managed to hang a 46-spot on the CCC frontrunners.  :D The USM game should be a gem in Gorham. Polar Bears have to be at least a 10-point underdog. I thought Williams would give the Huskies a better game, but the more things stay the same...

Jury is still out on Wesleyan. If they beat Trinity (Tx) on Sunday they would certainly get back on the scene. Three games in three days is tough for anyone.

Here's hoping all the work-study hours are all in line for USM. The new math can be tricky.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Snowman on November 20, 2005, 09:39:42 AM
Aren't we a bit sensitive? First off I am not a Bandeis anything, the real reference was regarding USM, but again I find it very interesting that you all beat the heck out of Brandeis and the first opportunity they get they win handily. I wasn't at it but was told they did the same to USM in our scrimmage. A little credit may be due, but all you do is make excuses. Winning with grace is easy but me thinks thou hast won to much and ist spoiled.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bearswatcher on November 20, 2005, 06:19:32 PM
Hey, thought I'd come back for a vistit after the Lady Bears laid the smackdown on the competition this weekend and after checking UAA results to find Brandeis handled your wonderful Bates. Snowman, you can be my new best friend, come to the UAA and the Central boards for a visit, we don't make excuses there, people get hurt, sick, whatever, and we just play, look back, no crying from us when Brandeis came to town and nipped us last year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on November 20, 2005, 10:30:52 PM
  Two starters were out for Bates. I didn't realize that mentioning that made one a 'crybaby'. Hey it's good to see 'Deis' building not just one, but TWO programs. They are a force to be reckoned with, yessirreee! I remember last year Fig Newton warned folks of the dire consequences that would befall all those who did not believe in the power of 'Deis'. (or words to that effect)
   Personally I feel 'Deis' should be congratulated for their win over a quality NESCAC opponent. I now view 'Deis' in the same light as I view Salem State and Southern Maine. EXACTLY the SAME light, and in EVERY way.
    Now if that isn't enough praise, all I can do is shrug.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: JeffRookie2 on November 22, 2005, 02:31:49 PM
I think Amherst could be as high as 3rd or fourth in the conference. Although Matia left, last year's incoming class that included Muller, Reiff and Pollack is very solid. The terrible team chemistry from last season should be much improved now that pretty much the entire original '07 recruiting class has decidided to leave the team  (Glazier, Avis, Polales, Passmore), none of those players contributed much on the floor, and by all accounts as a group they caused a lot of problems. I've heard the incoming class might even be better than last years, and if there is one player to step into the pf/c role that kostakis left, the Jeffs would have a really solid starting five, with Latham, Reiff, Muller and Pollack being the other four. Football fans might notice that Ngai Otieno's little sister Amanda is on the team, hopefully she will be as athletic as her brother.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on November 22, 2005, 05:33:44 PM
Hey, I understand posters coming over to the NESCAC board looking for affirmation. Being the best women's basketball conference in the nation, as well as the undisputed top overall academic and athletic conference available, it is high praise just to be mentioned on this board. Be thankful if your team is even acknowledged.

However, it does seem odd that a self-described USM fan and a Wash U backer would come visit this board to play up Brandeis/tear down Bates. Is it just an opportunity to take a potshot at the NESCAC? A chance to see your name in lights? It's envy, and it is transparent.

Back to the board:

I wouldn't be surprised if Amherst was a home-seed. They were decent last year and it sounds like they had addition by subtraction (I'll explain that concept later if the non-NESCACers are still reading). McBride had that outstanding team in 2001 and seems to be trying to rebuild ever since. With the quality of player Amherst attracts (see: men's team), I'm surprised they haven't been more consistent.

Midd is off to a decent start (called by Frost in the preseason). Not the stiffest of competition, but a good start. They get the almighty Wash U. this weekend, so it appears we'll be graced by Bearswatcher's presence for another 15 minutes of fame. If Midd can clean up the back-end of the conference, they should be a decent away seed.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Snowman on November 23, 2005, 04:50:04 PM
COULDN'T HAVE SAID IT BETTER MYSELF

GORHAM, Maine — Junior forward Ashley Marble (Topsfield, Maine/Woodland) scored a team-high 16 points and grabbed a career-high tying 17 rebounds to lead the nationally-ranked University of Southern Maine Huskies to a 66-48 win over the nationally-ranked Bates College Bobcats, Tuesday at Warren G. Hill Gymnasium on the Gorham campus.
With the win the Huskies improve to 3-0 early in the 2005-2006 season. The Bobcats, suffering their second loss to a ranked opponent in as many games, drop to 1-2 overall.
The 5-9 Marble was tremendous on both ends of the floor for the Huskies shooting a sparkling 8-for-10 from the field en route to her second double-double of the season. Marble's 17 rebounds ties her career-high set in the Huskies last match-up with Bates in the Sweet Sixteen of the NCAA Touranment. Marble also added two assists, a blocked shot and two steals in 26 minutes.
Senior guard Donna Cowing (Weeks Mills, Maine/Erksine Academy) was the only other USM player to score in double-figures as the Huskies had eight players score at least four points in the game.
Bates freshman forward Val Beckwith (Woburn, Mass.) led all scorers with a game-high 17 points on a 7-for-10 effort from the floor. Sophomore guard Sarah Barton (Portsmouth, N.H./Portsmouth) and junior forward Katie Franklin (New Preston, Conn./The Taft School) chipped in with eight points each.
Southern Maine controlled the game from the start and never trailed opening the game with a 7-0 run. The Huskies shot an outstanding 56 percent from the floor in the opening half, connecting on 14 of their 25 shots, to take a commanding 36-17 lead at the half. Conversely, Bates struggled offensively shooting a dismal 20 percent (7-for-20) in the first half.
Although the Huskies' shooting cooled in the second half, Southern Maine remained in control of the contest throughout and led by as many as 27 points with just over three minutes to play. Southern Maine ended the game shooting a solid 46.3 percent (25-for-54) and held a decisive 59-31 edge in rebounds. Bates ended the game with a sub-par 25 percent effort from the floor, connecting on just 18 of 72 shots.
Senior guard Katie Frost (Calais, Maine/Calais) and senior forward Megan Myles (Auburn, Maine/Edward Little) each scored eight points for the Huskies. Frost ended the game with eight points, four assists, two steal and a blocked shot, while Myles grabbed seven boards.
Southern Maine returns to action after the holiday break at home against in-state rival and nationally-ranked Bowdoin College Polar Bears on Tuesday, November 29 at 6 p.m. Bates heads back to the hardwood on the same date against the Husson College Eagles. Tip off is scheduled for 7 p.m.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Snowman on November 23, 2005, 05:28:49 PM
Damn, I hope Bates can win some games this season, if they keep losing like this it will do nothing for anybody's strength of schedule ;D
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on November 23, 2005, 10:37:07 PM
  The loss to Norwich and the loss to Mount Holyoke leave me beginning to doubt whether Amherst can have a really good season if you measure things in terms of W's and L's. Are the new coaches at Trinity and Colby going to improve their teams records? Amherst still has plenty of time to improve things but on the other hand Bowdoin is looking better and better.
How serious is the injury (or whatever) to Coffin? How long will Maggie Miller be out? These and other burning questions haunt the consciousness of the loyal fan whoever they may actually be rooting for. There should be injury reports and updates so I would have more free moments to concentrate on how nice my Girl's hair looks, now that she's finally found a  'True Stylist'
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bearswatcher on November 26, 2005, 10:35:48 AM
Well, going to watch the Lady Bears play your Middlebury team today. Will report back to you all later. By the way I would match the academics at Washington, NYU, UChicago, Emory, URochester, Brandeis, Case Western Reserve and Carnigie Mellon with your NESCAC schools any day of the week. Heck I thought we were the elitists.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bearswatcher on November 26, 2005, 11:08:07 PM
WELL ALL I CAN SAY IS UGLY[/size

I think it is now UAA 2, Nescac 0 in head to head match ups..........  
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bearswatcher on November 27, 2005, 08:13:59 AM
Feces...wooooops I mean Senator ;)......no comments about being 0-2 against UAA opponents, maybe you want to go the academic back patting route some more.

I am going to go check to see if there are any more UAA/Nescac match ups this year, you guys are fun.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on November 27, 2005, 05:53:29 PM
Unlike many of the UAA teams who schedule non-conference games against weak teams like Salve Regina, Coe, or Middlebury (very bottom of the Nescac pack) Bates has 12 out of 15 non-conference games on the road, 6 of them against top 25 teams (3 in the top 5), and 2 more against teams that are getting votes, and may get into the top 25 later in the year.  This is a suicide schedule (quite possibly the most difficult in the nation this year) and if Bates makes it through December with limited losses the Bobcats will be in great shape when their top two starters return.

While the UAA continues to play mostly weak non-conference games, and mostly home ones (although this is understandable given the amount of travelling they do for conference games.)  Bates takes on the best in the country and does it on the road.  USM takes pride in a difficult non-conference schedule with Bates and Bowdoin on the list.  When the best teams hit eachother the home team usually wins.  Perhaps this is why the Huskies are afraid to play any difficult games on the road (and don't try to tell me the conference road games are difficult.  The LEC is cake compared to the UAA and Nescac).

One last note:  Coffin injured her back near the end of the soccer season.  She'll return once it has healed.  The prognosis is the beginning of January.  Kostakis broke her foot at the end of the volleyball season.  She'll return when the bone has healed and is strong enough.  The prognosis is also the beginning of January.  Without these two players bates has an extremely small team and has been unable to establish a strong inside presence.  Coffin was one of the big rebounders for Bates last year, and Kostakis was a big rebounder last year too.  Bates will be a completely different team when their top players return.

Cheers,
Red1 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on November 27, 2005, 09:01:51 PM
 I am very glad Red
to hear your people are coming back. I am not a believer in injuries deciding a conference or any other kind of title. Middlebury is not and has never been at the bottom of the NESCAC pack- Seems like they had mild case of the 'Jitters'. They came back to demolish a decent team in the consolation.
However, something has me puzzled. How does one Match the Academics? What are  Academics? Are they people/Profs involved in academia. Are Academics the course contents at the different schools?? Perhaps Academics means the number and quality of books assigned, as well as those read on one's own. (But then how would you measure that?) Would you measure Academics by the quality of students enrolled? How would you measure the quality of said Students.? SAT scores? Standing in class? Would you throw in 'Good Works" performed,as a factor in this determination?
  Well I give up. I have decided to take Bearwatcher at his word. I think it likely that in his in depth analysis (I assume he performed some kind of study) that the UAA has better Academics than NESCAC. Congratulations to all those UAA fans out there on your well earned Victory. You should send Bearwatcher a note of 'Thanks' or something like that.
   It should be noted that in all likelihood that certain UAA Basketball Rosters were excluded from Bearwatcher's study. I can think of One who should have been.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Snowman on November 30, 2005, 09:04:38 AM
Feces...wooops I mean Senator and everyone else, will the NESCAC win any games against quality competion this year? I mean outside of the NESCAC of course since the NESCAC has most of the quality teams in the country within it, hmmmm, basketball wise and academically.  ;) Well as they say, tomorrow is another day, GO USM
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on November 30, 2005, 09:24:48 AM
Hmmm, Williams already beat Springfield, I would say that is a quality win.  USM has had success against NESCAC this year, but of course, they have had a good deal of luck as well -- playing Williams without its best player who was injured, and Bates without its two top front court players who were likewise injured.  Also, all three games (except the Williams game, which was a de facto home game up in Maine) came at home.  Take away USM's star, or two stars, and play NESCAC teams on the road, the results would likely be very different.  Not to say they weren't solid wins, but they hardly establish that NESCAC is no longer the regional power, especially when Bowdoin has beat up on everyone in recent years (including USM until last night) and Bates, Williams, and Wesleyan are all potential top 25 teams this year (in fact Williams should crack the top 25 soon the way they have been playing now that they are back at full strength). 

Just don't get too cocky until later in the season when the results could be very different ...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on November 30, 2005, 01:02:52 PM
Good win for USM on Tuesday night, but of course, we'll have to wait and see if the paperwork for this pay period is in line for the work-study students. Rumor has it, filling out time sheets is now a 200-level course in Gorham.

The improvement/confidence shown by Loonin will be a big boon for the Polar Bears in conference play. Not sure if it is a result of her getting better or just getting a chance, but she is taking advantage at this point.

Senator, while I certainly feel the 'good works' provision for academic ranking is a fine idea, USNews gives us a good indicator of academic prowess. Average rank for NESCAC schools: 15.7. UAA: 23.3. UAA backers should head over to the Centennial board; they're closer to the same reading level. And before the UAA savants join in the discussion, remember your own rules: no excuses.

And Bearswatcher, I take exception to your 'elitist' comment. We're not elitist. We're not snobby. We're not arrogant.

We're just better than you.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on November 30, 2005, 09:02:53 PM
What a difference a center makes!  Bates defeated Husson College 88-49 in Lewiston this evening.  For the first time this year the Bobcats played their style of basketball and dictated the play rather than allowing the game to be dictated by their oponents.  They finally got an inside presence, took many more layups, and many fewer 3point shots, made quite a few blocks, and dominated the boards, all things that they hadn't been able to do so far this season.  The reason for this is because Meg Coffin has returned to the floor.  She wasn't expected until January, but the cornerstone of bates speedy play and excellent transition game was back on the court today and the difference showed.  Not only was Meg dominant on both sides of the court in the paint, but her return allowed Annie Whiting to move back to the strong forward spot where she excells.  I understand that the game was in Lewiston (a rare home game for Bates this year), and I understand that Husson is not an especially strong team, but it's a good stepping stone for Bates to get back on the right track.   Bates looked like a new team with Coffin back.  I look forward to seeing the further improvement that will come with return of Matia Kostakis.

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Snowman on December 04, 2005, 02:16:11 PM
WOW you guys lose a few games and everuone goes silent
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: simon on December 04, 2005, 06:46:11 PM
Meg coffin is good but I saw her play in the first game of the Williams tourny and she didn't do so well. Although they won it wasn't because of her. Give credit to the rest of the team. She played better against Williams but they also had a bad day shooting.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on December 04, 2005, 07:57:53 PM
Oh, I think you always have to give credit to an entire team.  Basketball is very much a team sport, and is rarely if ever won by individuals.  I don't, however, consider 21 points and 10 rebounds on 9 or 12 shooting from the field and 3 of 4 from the charity stripe to be "not doing so well."  I consider it very good.  Against Williams Meg dropped to 17 points on 7 of 8 shooting and 3 of 4 from the line and only 7 rebounds.

While these stats are still pretty good the points and rebounds are not the only important aspects of Megs return.  She controls the paint (Bates was getting almost no points from within the paint, nor were the Bobcats rebounding well), and by having her at Center it allows Annie Whiting to move out to the strong forward position.  I think it's clear how much better this position is for the tournament MVP.  Also, Meg draws defenders which helps the other shooters get open looks.  This is a strong contributor to the elevated shooting percentage.  Yes, Williams was off today, but give credit to the Bates defense for keeping it that way.

It's not just what Meg does when she's on the court, but what her presence allows her teamates to do.  When a strong forward has to favor the help side in case she needs to double up on Meg that leaves Annie Whiting an open shot.  If the defense shifts to cover Annie then that leaves one of the guards a good look at the basket.  So you see, just having Meg back on the court with her ability to control the paint opens up numerous offensive avenues that wouldn't otherwise be open. 

Of course, this only works when the rest of the team steps up, makes good decisions, and plays well.  So the entire team really does deserves the credit for the way the bobcats are playing right now, but what Meg brings to the court to allow this to happen should not be overlooked.  Watch out everyone, Bates is back.  Now lets see what happens when Kostakis' injury is healed.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on December 05, 2005, 01:16:21 AM
Great win for Bates. Beating the Ephs in Williamstown is always a great win, and they did it convincingly. Now that the Bobcats are getting everybody back it appears it returns to a coin-flip in the conference with Bates and Bowdoin. And I would agree that it's tough to argue against the numbers Coffin put up. She is a complete player.

Emmanuel is down from their usual spot (losing to EConn, a team Bowdoin beat by 40) but Colby played closer than I thought they would on the road. The new coach is obviously doing something right. Getting Emmanuel/USM/Bowdoin in an eight-day frame is a tough stretch for anyone.

Wasn't sure about Wesleyan (two OOR loses), but getting thumped by Salve Regina is not a good sign. Amherst is clearly worse than I suspected, especially considering that schedule. Despite getting waxed by Wash U, Middlebury is obviously better than year's past.

1. Bowdoin
2. Bates
3. Williams
4. Wesleyan
5. Middlebury
6. Colby
7. Tufts
8. Trinity


Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on December 06, 2005, 09:18:07 PM
Ouch. UMF 62, Bates 59. Traditionally, UMF is no slouch, but this is certainly an eye-opening loss for Bates, and potentially costly if they don't win the conference. Bates now goes into two pretty decent tournaments barely affording another loss. Haven't seen a box, but would be curious to see how this happened...

Plymouth State isn't real strong, but another victory for Middlebury. Amherst is still awful.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on December 06, 2005, 10:23:42 PM
Williams only beat Keene by 3 AT Williams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Snowman on December 06, 2005, 10:24:28 PM
I see Bates took another dump. Gotta question the quality of the NESCAC
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on December 07, 2005, 02:44:58 PM
Bates went 8-for-15 from the free throw line, including 5-for-11 in the second half. Bobcats led by nine with 4:00 to go and six with 2:35 left. Didn't score again from 2:35 in. With 22 seconds left and Bates trailing by one, it appears Sarah Barton was called for an offensive foul. Not good. Barton and Coffin combined for 15 TOs.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on December 11, 2005, 10:18:55 PM
After conducting exhaustive analysis I am able to report the following:
Cumulative Out of Conference Records through 12/10/05

UAA:
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on December 11, 2005, 10:24:08 PM
After conducting exhaustive analysis I am able to report the following:
Cumulative Out of Conference Records through 12/10/05

UAA: 30-16
NESCAC: 48-27
Little East; 30-16
NEWMAC:43-27

My conclusion is that it doesn't really tell us very much about who's good and who isn't.  Individual teams within conferences are what it's all about, because there are no Division III conferences in the country that have strong teams top to bottom.  The scary teams appear to be Washington U. and USM.  Bowdoin just a shade behind along with MAYBE Brandeis -- need to see more of the Judges..I'm not sold yet.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on December 11, 2005, 10:28:24 PM
Err...uh...  I mean the UAA out of conference record is 45-10, not the previously posted 30-16  sorry folks
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: JeffRookie2 on December 13, 2005, 02:23:52 AM
I haven't seen any of the Amherst games, someone tell me what the hell is going on.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on December 14, 2005, 10:30:20 PM
JeffRookie2 -- I had the opportunity to see Amherst play last week.   They are not going to fare well in NESCAC this season.. probably can compete with Conn and Trinity, maybe Tufts.  Will get beaten by Bates and Wesleyan, will get beaten by a bit more by the hated Ephs and will get absolutely destroyed, of course, by Bowdoin.
The problems are as follows:
1) They have two or three kids who are reasonably athletic, but they have no one, and I mean no one, who is a real good basketball player. 
2)  I don't mean to criticize but, they don't appear to communicate well on the floor...it appears that messages sent by Coach McBride and/or Coach Hersey are not being received by the players.
3) But most importantly, they play with ZERO intensity, they look like they don't want to be out there.  An over-achieving, high energy team like Clark just took them apart and Clark would be middle of the pack, at best, in the NESCAC
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bearswatcher on December 17, 2005, 06:55:46 PM
Well, let's see, Wash U wins starts the season 10-0 and another all mighty Northeast superpower bites the dust. Come one guys, maybe it just isn't the NE's year. Last couple years NE teams spit the bit anyway. UAAUAAUAAUAAUAAUAAUAAUAAUAAUAAUAAUAAUAAUAA
UAAUAAUAAUAAUAAUAAUAAUAAUAAUAAUAAUAAUAAUAA
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Snowman on December 18, 2005, 10:32:54 AM
I bow my head, the Snowman willchill for a while with the unexpected loss to Salem State. AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHBUMMER
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on December 20, 2005, 10:22:44 PM
Bates plays #6 Baldwin-Wallace very tough in Las Vegas, ultimately losing 66-63.  Most interesting element of this game, it seems, is the effect the returned Kostakis had, scoring 14 in 23 minutes.  Though I doubt they will overcome Bowdoin perhaps they will make it a bit more interesting than I originally thought.  By the way, Barton's 14 assists in a recent game... anywhere close to the school record?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Snowman on December 22, 2005, 07:42:36 AM
I see Bates bites the dust again
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Snowman on December 22, 2005, 09:06:14 PM
LET'S ALL THANK THE ALMIGHTY BATES FOR HELPING WITH OUR REGIONAL RANKINGS..........LOSERS
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on December 26, 2005, 10:30:58 AM
And let's thank USM for driving the mean SAT score in the state of Maine below 1,000...but to paraphrase Judge Smails, "the world needs ditch-diggers, too."

With Ithaca in the tank after last year's NCAA run, Bowdoin's next test will be the Emmanuel/UMF duo in a three-day span. They are in Brunswick, which will be very important against an Emmanuel team very comfortable at home.

Middlebury and Tufts keep rolling. It appears Tufts has signed up for the Brandeis Memorial Tour-of-the-NEWMAC schedule.

Bates = tanked.

Williams appears to be the last legit team to dethrone Bowdoin, unless Bates gets its act together. Wesleyan loses to Salve Regina and beats Springfield? I think Colby could be two years away from being very good. Their coach has maximized that team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Snowman on January 01, 2006, 08:39:13 PM
WOW, you turkeys struggle a bit and you all go silent, some difference from when Bowdoin is #1 or Amherst and Williams are playing better..

Well At least Bates finally won a game
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 01, 2006, 09:44:52 PM
It's been kind of a quiet week all across the site. I wouldn't say this board is any different.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on January 03, 2006, 03:16:14 AM
Bates is FINALLY at full strength and it shows.  Losing 3 starters to injuries at the beginning of the season did not bode well, but the Springfield tournament shows that Bates can compete with the ranked teams when they're at full strength.  Look for a big turnaround in 2006.  The 14 assists for Barton against Hardin-Simmons was 1 shy of the school record of 15 set in '95.

Cheers,
Red1

p.s.  not that I need to say anything about USM losing the moment they play a half way decent team on the road, but I will say it any way:  told you so.  It has become quite clear why USM didn't dare play any road games against their toughest opponents.

p.p.s.  Congrats to the UAA, I tip my cap.  4 undefeated teams ranked in the top 25.  I'm impressed.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Snowman on January 03, 2006, 07:21:11 AM
Red,

I guess Bates wasn't at full strength in Las Vegas, eh?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NEWMACwatcher on January 03, 2006, 08:58:43 AM
I've not seen a lot of Bates but was at the tournament. Bates defense forced Springfield into something like 28 turnovers. Bates shot the ball extrememly well and had a very nice inside out game that Springfield never adjusted to.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Snowman on January 09, 2006, 10:14:59 AM
WHERE IS EVERYONE
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 09, 2006, 07:08:47 PM
Snowman, go look for a friend on one of the lesser boards. You're out of your league in more ways than one.

Friday is the game everyone had circled on the calendar, but the bloom is off the rose with Bates' inconsistent start. The "glass half full" types like Red might feel everything is back to normal in Lewiston, but it will be a considerable upset if the Bobcats pull it off. I'm certainly not saying it can't be done, but it seems Bates is still trying to find itself and that is not a good trait with the Polar Bears in town. I base that statement on the fact that it is dead last in points allowed -- a stat previously unimaginable for a Bates/Murphy team, regardless of strength of schedule.

With that said, Coffin is putting up POY-type numbers and would probably get my vote at the break even with time missed. Most of this is due to the fact that Bowdoin spreads out the individual numbers between 5-6 players.

Admittedly playing a schedule weaker than Bates, Bowdoin is tops in scoring and scoring defense, as well as FG percentage and defense, along with rebounding margin. Bates beating Colby by only 10 points is a little surprising to me. I'm going to guess a 62-55 win for Bowdoin. Also:

Friday
Tufts 66, Colby 52
Middlebury 80, Conn. College 55
UPSET: Wesleyan 67, Williams 62

Saturday
Bowdoin 72, Tufts 55
Bates 65, Colby 49
Trinity 77, Amherst 67
Wesleyan 64, Middlebury 50
Williams 90, Conn. College 61

I know about the rivalry, blah, blah, blah, but Williams beating Amherst by only five points is suprising. I would have guessed a 20-point game.

Am I the only one who feels Hannah Stubbs has been around for about six years?  ???  Did she have a sister?

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on January 09, 2006, 10:29:01 PM
Interesting predictions for the coming weekend slate. I have not seen Wesleyan, but I seriously doubt they will beat Williams, though I would love to see it.   My guess is that it is more like 60-40 Bowdoin over Bates, even on Bates' floor.  Bowdoin gets after it defensively unlike any D-III women's team I have seen.   I see Pourevalis ( sp?) neutralizing Coffin rather easily.  Loonin, Flaherty Russell and Anelauskas are too good a group- Bates really only has Barton to try to offset that.  The X-Factors are Kostakis for Bates and Berne for Bowdoin.  I'll take Berne any time.  Way too difficult to match up with.  If anyone watches closely they would consider Berne as a strong candidate for All-NESCAC.  I'm actually surprised that Coach Pemper doesn't ask more of her.   Finally, I will re-state my comments from early in the season.  The Pemper - Murphy coaching match-up is a mismatch.  Murphy is just a soccer guy who somehow fills his winters with reasonably successful basketball teams.  Pemper is a real basketball coach... players' approach to game, x's and o's, game strategy and adjustments all reflect her true professionalism.  Bowdoin by 20.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 10, 2006, 12:43:34 AM
Rem,

While I agree that Pemper is the best coach in the league, I must dissent on your take on Murphy. I'm by no means a fan of Bates (as a school), but I think Murphy is easily the second-best coach in the league. Also, I think your soccer/basketball theory is backwards. I would say his soccer coaching is still evolving (I believe he was standout football player at Bates) while his basketball coaching ability has always been top notch. Bates was a women's basketball backwater (comparable to a current day Trinity) before he arrived and all of their program success has come during his time. (Check out <http://www.bates.edu/x30485.xml> for an overview).

In addition, I think Murphy is a good guy and well-respected by his peers -- something that is not always easy for a successful male coach in a women's game. I think many coaches don't mind seeing Murphy find success because of his demeanor, as opposed to some other male coaches (see: Fifield, Gary).

My Wesleyan pick over Williams is definitely an upset, but no more so than Bowdoin winning by 20 in Lewiston. I would consider that to more of a shocker. We'll see.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on January 11, 2006, 12:53:04 AM
Rem,

I feel like I've heard those prediction of Bowdoin over Bates many times before, and the games are always closer than the predictions.   I think you'll find the disparity not as large as you may think.  I agree that Bowdoin's defense is probably the best in the NCAA, and has been for the last few years now, but that didn't stop Bates from knocking off the Polar Bears in Lewiston last year.

You seem quite certain that Pouravelis will dominate Coffin.  Did you know that the Nescac leader board lists 8 individual stats, and that both are listed in 5 of them:  points, field goal %, steals, rebounds, and blocks?  Did you also know that Coffin leads Pourevalis in each and every one of those categories?  (Note:  neither player is on the leader board for the other 3 categories:  assists, ft%, and 3pt %).  I'm not sure if you've noticed, but Pouravelis never guards Coffin one on one.  No body does.  She always gets double teamed, without exeption.     I'm sure the same is true the other way around because they're both excellent centers.

You mention Coffin and Barton as being the only two decent players Bates has (actually you left out Coffin, but having addressed her specifically I assume she was included in that list).  You sort of allow for Kostakis, corookie of the year last year.  I think you'll find she's far better than you may realize.  You also fail to mention Jackie Powers, a transfer from Boston College, and last weeks NESCAC player of the week.  You don't earn player of the week honors if you aren't good.  Finally, I think the coach issue has been taken care of by Feces Monkey.

Can Bowdoin beat bates?  Absolutely.  Will Bowdoin beat Bates?  That's why the game is played.  Can Bates beat Bowdoin?  Absolutely.  This is one of those rivalry games.  Even when one team is supposedly vastly better than the other, they still play close.  As evidence I point you to Bates' victory over then #2 Bowdoin in 2002 at Bates, when Bates was unranked and Bowdoin highly favored.  I also point your attention to Texas v. Texas A&M football.  That game had no business being close either, but it's one of those rivalries.

Looking foward to the game on Friday.

Cheers,
Red1




Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on January 11, 2006, 10:40:47 PM
I'll take the upset with Amherst taking down Trinity. Coming off a win against Hamilton and a first half against Williams where they led 28-14, they will be able to start conference play 1-0.

Nervous about the two Wes games, Bates, Bowdoin, and the remaining Williams game. If they can take the rest of the conference games and turn them into W's then they will finish in the 5 hole.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on January 13, 2006, 09:07:54 PM
Bates 56 Bowdoin 51.  I guess Porevalis (sp?) couldn't dominate Coffin. (although I still think that Porevalis is the best rebounder in the league.)  The real difference in the game, however, was the x factor as Rem put it.  He was right on the nose with that one.  Kostakis had a very good game (although 4 fouls is a bit high, but she was being too handsy tonight and got caught, something for her to work on). Anyway, Berne was uncharacteristically ice cold from behind the arc.  She was probably just a little too pumped up, but she was consistently missing off the back of the rim.  This stat really makes the difference in the game because the stats were pretty even around the floor everywhere else as far as my untrained eyes could tell.

Like I said in my previous post.  This is one of those rivalry games, and in those big games the better team sometimes falters.  I'm not sure who I think is the better team at this point.  Bowdoin is a phenominal team, certainly the best defensive team in the country, but Bates has been on a tear since New Years, and I don't think it's just a streak anymore.  Might we see a NESCAC tournament away from Bowdoin for the first time?  If Bates can win a few more tough games it could be.

So, Bates defeats Bowdoin, and hands the Polar Bears their first conference loss since?  I believe 2002 when Bates also beat Bowdoin, but lost to Middlebury.  Bowdoin took first in the 3 way tie breaker, Middlebury second, and Bates 3rd.  Is this correct?  Does anyone remember?  I hope this outcome answers some of the doubters.

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on January 13, 2006, 10:38:14 PM
Nice post Red1.  So much for my ability to accurately predict game outcomes. Obviously, I wasn't even close. Thirty lashes with the old wet noodle for that one!  I didn't see the game but kudos to Bates for finding a way to guard people.  Isn't it amazing how constantly we are reminded of the importance of good free throw shooting? I was interested  to see in the box score that Pouravelis (sp?) was 4-5 from the floor.  Any reason she didn't shoot more?  Was it Coffin or an inability of her teammates to find her?
Anyhow, I have lately been kind of rough on Coach Murphy..but certainly must now defer to his team's excellent effort...and give him the credit he deserves..he found a way.    Finally, I agree that this may not be just a streak for Bates... it appears they have the pieces of the puzzle in order and may well be a regional and national force as the season moves toward tournament time.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on January 13, 2006, 11:24:50 PM
Porevalis' reaction to receiving a pass seemed nearly always to be "turn and post up." The instant she turned her back to the basket she was double teamed.  Not facing the basket and unable to make the turn with 2 people guarding her she was forced to pass back out.  It appeared that the Bates defensive plan was mainly to limit Poravelis' shot making ability as much as possible at considerable cost to most other areas on the floor.  This is how Flaherity got open for so many points (well that, and because she just flat out burned several people), and it's what allowd Berne to take so many 3pt shots.  Had Berne not been so cold, or more importantly, had Bowdoin shot better from the charity stripe, the Polar Bears would likely have won.  Needless to say, when Poravelis did shoot she didn't miss much.

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on January 14, 2006, 05:08:02 PM
Bates 61 Colby 37, no big shock there.  Coffin was just too much to handle in the paint for the Colby Center and Forwards.  They had absolutely no answer for her.  Adding Kostakis and Annie Whiting to that mix under the basket certainly didn't make things any easier for Colby.

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 17, 2006, 07:30:54 PM
The Alumni Gymnasium House of Horrors!

Actually, it would be unfair to the Bates team to talk about the gym because they played a great game against Bowdoin. The defense, which I wrote about previously, appears to be back for the Bobcats and the performance by Kostakis was superb. Going 13-for-14 from the stripe in a game of that magnitude is big-time. In the recent past, foul shooting used to be the achilles heel for Bates, but the script was flipped in the last game.

Bates did a great job against the three-point shot, but I don't think the Polar Bears excel when they take 17 three-pointers (although many attempts were late). Flaherty played well, but Loonin and Berne were taken out of their game. Congrats to the Bobcats.

As predicted, Wesleyan beat Williams and now the Cardinals are real players in the conference. They would appear to be the only team left with a shot at giving Bates a loss with the game in Middletown. (Bates has already proven they can beat Williams on the road). I could see three teams tied with a 7-1 mark at the end of this season, especially with the way home and away plays out. But at this point, it's tough to think the final four won't be in Lewiston. That is assuming the NESCAC committee feels Bates is able to host a semifinal and final (kidding, kidding).

Walzy was on the Amherst game. That one wasn't even close. Nice road win.

I was hoping Tufts would be able to give Brandeis a game, but the Jumbos aren't real good. And with three straight weeks on the road in-conference, Tufts will be lucky to make the Top 7.
Title: Bates Stinks
Post by: Pops Morra on January 18, 2006, 12:50:46 PM
I think Bates stinks, and that they have always stunk. 

Anyone that has ever played there should never touch a basketball again,  not even at the YMCA or corporate basketball leagues.

holla
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on January 18, 2006, 05:37:31 PM
Bates will go through nescac with a clean slate. Hard to say they stink when they finish 9-0.

I'll take Wesleyan over Amherst on Friday by 8. And Amherst over Conn on Saturday by 11.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 19, 2006, 01:32:02 AM
While I agree that Bates stinks (or is that the Androscoggin?), it's best not to rile up Red...he can be a nasty bugger.  ;) And don't worry about the corporate leagues. Bates grads are too busy getting Bowdoin and Colby grads coffee to play hoops... ;D

Talked to my buddy in Vegas, and he, like Walzy has Wesleyan -8* for the Amherst game. I'll take the Cardinals and give the points. Also:

I'll take:
Trinity (+15) at Conn. College
Middlebury (-13) vs. Bates
Tufts (-9) at Williams

Saturday, I'll take:
Bates (+6) at Williams
Tufts (-2) at Middlebury
Amherst (+13) vs. Conn. College
Wesleyan (+19) vs. Trinity
Bowdoin (+22) vs. Colby

*(Lines strictly for recreational purposes only...)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on January 19, 2006, 02:10:53 AM
Oh you're probably smelling the Scog (there's a reason we call it the scog around here.)  Or you could be smelling the collective sweat from everyone sitting in the gym as it's hotter than your average sauna in there.  But I can assure you that stink is not coming from the basketball team.  If a team that just beat Bowdoin and Colby stank what would that say about Bowdoin and Colby?  Well, I'm not sure about Colby ;), but Bowdon definitely does not stink.

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on January 19, 2006, 09:23:47 PM
 Williams has had some problems with Bates the last two years. I think Bates beat them earlier this year without Kostakis and Powers. Plus they beat them three times last year.  I'll give the 6.
Middlebury beat tufts easily AT TUFTS last year while missing some starters. Each team lost a Senior starter and Tufts might have lost two. This year the game is at Middlebury. I'll give the 2
  I want a two team parlay of Bates and Middlebury , both games on Sat. for two Dimes and a Nickle.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on January 19, 2006, 09:36:18 PM
 In addition I want a 3 team parlay (All on Sat.) Amherst, Bates and Middlebury for a Dime.
Finally I want a three team parlay of Amherst on Friday with Bates and Middlebury on Sat.
I'm tempted to go for Bowdoin but Coach Pemper seems like a basically gentle sort and she might show some mercy. I was tempted to go for Conn. College on Friday but then I remembered one of their key players transferred to Scranton-
My final Temptation was Williams on Friday but the Ephs might be looking ahead to bates.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on January 19, 2006, 09:38:29 PM
Forgot to mention that the last parlay mentioned, is for a Dime. Amherst on Friday and Middlebury and bates on Saturday.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on January 20, 2006, 01:50:56 PM
Feces Monkey,

I think you meant Wes -19 at Trin and Bowdoin -22 at Colby... if they are GETting 19 or 22 then I will bet the house on them (parlay em too why not). I also would not make Bates a 6 pt dog, but rather make that a Pick Em game. Hard to give a team as hot as Bates has been recently points, even if it is at one of the tougher gyms to play in.

Senatorfrost has gotten really into the forum once spreads made an appearence...interesting...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 20, 2006, 04:47:15 PM
Walzy, you are correct. I have the giving (-) and getting (+) tags backwards. This is probably a good indicator as to why I stay away from the book in Vegas and/or why I am so unsuccessful.

And knowing the vernacular as well as he does, I'm guessing Senator has an associate with a name like "Slippery Pete" or "Knuckles" on his speed dial. I had hoped he would use the word "vigorish" in one of his replies.

For simplicity's sake:

Friday:
Trinity, Bates, Williams
Saturday:
Bowdoin, Wesleyan, Amherst, Bates & Middlebury (although I wouldn't be suprised if Tufts won).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on January 20, 2006, 09:57:46 PM
Well, anyone who picked Bates to cover the spread (or just to win) you won either way, and so did Bates 73-60 over Middlebury.  I was hoping that it spread would be a little larger, the defense to hold the Panthers to a few less points, and the offense to score a few more.  I'm being picky though.  A 13 point win is a 13 point win.  Learn, improve, and walk away with a smile.

Williams continues to have some form of psychological block preventing them from beating Bates or Bowdoin no matter how well the Ephs play.  Bates already beat Williams at Williams without several of their starters, but they also shot an insane 60% or thereabouts from the field, a stat I doubt they can repeat.  With Kostakis and Powers playing this time, and both at the top of their game I don't think they'll need to repeat that stat.  Prediction:  Bates 74 Williams 65

Cheers,
Red 1 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on January 21, 2006, 03:39:06 PM
Love the Bates Williams prediction. Can't see the Ephs beating Bates unless they shoot 65%+ from deep.

Must win game today for Amherst since they need to win all the games that "they are supposed to win". Got Trin, Conn today and Colby later should put them in postseason play. Once in NESCACs, anything can happen.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: carolina on January 22, 2006, 03:43:17 PM
Well, so much for the Williams/Bates prediction. Williams dominated. Bates couldn't stop O'malley in the middle and Coffin looked horrible. Yes she had 5 fould but not until the end of the game, so that wasn't a factor. Bottom line Williams played great....Bates played horrible due to the intense defense Williams Dished out!!!!!!!! Go Ephs
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on January 22, 2006, 07:19:33 PM
I don't know what happened, but those stats are quite poor.  Congratulations to Williams.  Luckily for Bates this game has very little effect on the bobcats ability to win the regular season Nescac Crown.  I still think it's safe to expect Bowdoin to beat Williams, and since Wesleyan already did beat Williams that would be 2 losses.  The hard part for Bates is that they will absolutley need to beat Wesleyan.  That should allow Bates to cost to the end of the season with only 1 conference loss and having won the conference game over Bowdoin that would give the Bobcats the tie breaker anyway.  It's not the way Bates wanted to go through the Nescac schedule, but, luckily, they still have an excellent shot at winning the regular season title.

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on January 22, 2006, 10:27:27 PM
Wes's victory over Williams was the little three game I believe. Williams was 4-0 in conference play last time I checked.

If Wesleyan doesn't beat Bates, Bowdoin or Williams, and Bowdoin beats Williams, then there will be one of those funky three team tie breakers.

Williams holds their destiny, but hopefully they drop something along the way.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on January 22, 2006, 10:48:45 PM
Williams shot very well against Tufts, they clearly won't shoot that well every game but they are capable of doing so, with the shooters they have, every once in awhile.  First half they played poor defense, second half they played very good D, I'd say overall Williams probably played one of their best games, if not their best game, of the season against Tufts, they are capable of playing a little better (particularly on D), but not much. 

Fatigue was definitely a factor against Bates, I would guess.  It sounded like Williams had a lot of trouble on defense and tired legs on their outside shots, not surprising after a very intense, physical, fast game that went to wire against Tufts, followed by a long road trip to Bates.  That combined with Bates' very solid defense made for a long night for the Ephs.  Overall, a split on their toughest road trip of the season is pretty solid for the Ephs.  I think Bates is a little better than Williams right now, but I don't think the differential is as vast as this weekend made it seem.  Hamilton is obviously huge to see if they can have a bounce back game and build off Tufts rather than getting discouraged from easily their worst performance of the season.

I agree that Williams has to go inside much more.  No one in the league can really stop Newton one on one and many of the 3's the Ephs take will usually be there (unless they are really wide open on the break), I think they rush way too many 3's early in the shot clock and they should be more patient, trying to get it to Newton and Kuntz inside more consistently because the outside shots won't always drop and definitely won't get the opposing team in foul trouble, plus an inside game will open up better looks.  Too content just to bomb away at this point. 

At this point, with the rest of New England falling apart, I'd say the top of the region goes like: Amherst, WPI, Bates, Trinity, Williams, Tufts.  The top 4 are all top-30/40 caliber teams for sure.  I expect that Bates won't lose again the way they have been playing until their brutal stretch at the end of the season.  That final Bates/Trinity/Amherst/Tufts week should go a long way towards determining how many teams NESCAC can squeeze into the NCAA tourney.  Ephs still have a shot at getting a 2/3 seed in the NESCAC tourney, but they will have to play with a lot more energy on defense and a lot more patience on offense than they did against Bates, particularly with the Amherst/Trinity home weekend on the horizon.  If the Ephs can beat Midd and get a split that weekend, reasonable goals, they are in pretty solid shape. 

Congrats to the Eph women for stunning Bates -- they definitely deserve to crack the top 25, with one of 3 losses at Southern Maine and the other two against very solid teams as well, and now a few good wins on their resume. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: yellstoomuch on January 22, 2006, 10:50:50 PM
Actually the Wesleyan overtime victory over Williams was the NESCAC game. Wes is 4-0 in the conference, and Williams is 3-1 (see the NESCAC website). The little three game is Tuesday.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan99 on January 23, 2006, 12:58:41 AM
The likely result of the Williams win over Bates is that Williams will play Bowdoin at Williams in their last regular season game with the NESCAC Championship on the line. 

Wesleyan will likely lose to Bates at home and Bowdoin on the road.  Bates will likely not lose anymore NESCAC games.  Bowdoin will win all of theirs till that last weekend as will Williams.  If the happens then Williams would control their own destiny.  A win over Bowdoin would give Bowdoin two conference losses like Wesleyan and Williams and Bates would each have a loss.

But Williams would be NESCAC champions and have the home court for the Tournament because of their win over Bates as the first tie breaker.

That's a lot of ifs but it is the most likely outcome that Bowdoin and Williams will meet with the championship on the line.  Of course if Bowdoin beats Williams then Bates would host because of their win over Bowdoin.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 23, 2006, 03:16:42 AM
Reading through nescac1's missive I felt like a Southern Maine player filling out a time sheet.

If you're going to cut and paste a 500-word essay, please have more than one graph on the women's team. I understand Williams has admitted goobers with 800 SATs and a good jumpshot for the past ten years, but at least give the illusion of higher education when posting. Thank you. Go straight and take a left and you'll find the men's board.

Also, Carolina, please be a little more careful with your cliches. A "dished out" defense doesn't work. At the current pace, I won't be surprised if Amherst passes Williams in the next year's U.S. News rankings (much to Walzy's pleasure, I'm sure). And yes, I know we'll all be working for you some day...

Anyhoo, it's good for the NESCAC board that the win flushed out the Williams sect (the kings -- and queens -- of all front-runners). Assuming Williams beats Bowdoin in "Billsville" (which they should at this point) and Wesleyan loses along the way (which will likely happen), it should come down to a coin-flip as to where the conference tourney is held. The conference plaque hasn't been anywhere but Brunswick since the conference's inception, I'll still stick with the Polar Bears.

Much like the Bowdoin-Bates non-con game on the horizon, the Will-Wes game on Tuesday will go a long way for at-large purposes. While I have the highest respect for the Cards, they won't win in West Nowhere, considering the latest results. They will get to spend time Pownal, Vt., which is the next best thing to winning.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on January 23, 2006, 06:11:03 AM
My bad, meant to post that in men's section ...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: carolina on January 23, 2006, 11:11:10 PM
Hey Feces
First of all I am not a Williams fan. I just do not like Bates!!!! I am a basketball fan who likes to see a good game and love when a team can upset someone who everyone thinks should win. As far as my "dished out " quote. Williams did dish it out and bates couldn't take it. By the way I wouldn't want you working for me.

Anyhooo, The Nescac is a tough conference and most of the top teams can get beat any given night. That is why the games are played. Good Luck to all teams, it should be interesting!!!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 27, 2006, 02:49:16 AM
Quote from: carolina on January 23, 2006, 11:11:10 PM
By the way I wouldn't want you working for me.

Good choice. In retrospect, I wouldn't want me as an employee either. But don't tell my boss...

The conference brings a 16, 13 and four 12 win teams into this weekend and  only one would appear to be losing this weekend. I'll take:

Friday
Bates
Bowdoin
Wesleyan
and, um, Colby (?). Home court, I guess.

Saturday
Bowdoin and Tufts are easy...the rest are dicey...
Williams over (at) Midd makes sense, but might not be easy
Guess I gotta take the Lady Jeffs over Colby
Instinct says Bates will beat Wes on the road...no confidence, though

A clean sweep by Wesleyan would most likely mean a 'C' qualifier and the final four in Middletown. It's like Hartford, but without the barbed wire...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: goubears89 on January 27, 2006, 07:28:05 AM
Great piece in today's Boston Globe on Bowdoin. Living in Pittsburgh I really miss seeing the Polar Bears in Morrell Gym. http://www.boston.com/sports/colleges/womens_basketball/articles/2006/01/27/polar_express/
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on January 27, 2006, 10:11:15 AM
Quotethe final four in Middletown. It's like Hartford, but without the barbed wire...

hahaha

FRI

Bates by 32
Bowdoin by 25
Colby by 7
Wesleyan 11

SAT

Bowdoin by 37
Williams 16
Amherst by 5
Tufts by 16
Wesleyan by 3
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on January 28, 2006, 01:34:59 AM
FRI

Predicted Bates by 32                 Actual Bates by 18
Predicted Bowdoin by 25            Actual Bowdoin by 30
Predicted Colby by 7                   Actual Colby by 4
Predicted Wesleyan 11               Actual Wesleyan by 12

4 for 4 with 3 of the four predictions within 5 points.

Bowdoin is good...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on January 28, 2006, 05:51:31 PM
Bates 69 Wesleyan 58.  Huge win for Bates.  Bates should win out the rest of the Nescac schedule as they're playing 3 weaker teams and all in Lewiston.  Bates will need some help to win the regular season crown, specifically the Polar Bears from Bowdoin will need to defeat Williams on the final weekend, and I gotta like the Polar Bears' chances against anyone.  Todays victory puts an end to the Cardinals' win streak, and gives the Bobcats an excellent shot at the Nescac crown.

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 29, 2006, 06:09:26 AM
"NESCAC folks, just so you know, in most conferences play each two times. You should check it out."

It has arrived at the point where D3hoops.com has started to question the NESCAC's policy of having a single round robin in conference play. D3hoops.com has an established anti-NESCAC bias -- a natural reaction to the success of the conference. I think this topic deserves a logical discussion. I invite other NESCAC types (others please talk amongst yourselves on your respective boards) to debate the topic.

Here are my thoughts:

The current NESCAC schedule has created three NCAA qualifiers for last years -- one Pool A and two Pool Cs.  Why would the conference change the its format when it can get the most qualifiers of any conference in the country? Would a change get the NESCAC anymore qualifiers? Almost certainly not. It would seem the conference has the best structure around.

Another issue is the commitment made by the NESCAC presidents to academics. The conference, unlike others, does not have the luxury of having a Tuesday-Saturday or Thursday-Saturday conference schedule. Classes come first, and rightly so, forcing the conference to go with the back-to-back weekend schedule. Plus, the conference, in an effort to diversify the student-athletes, attempts to schedule as many "other" schools as possible, limiting the number of games in conference.

Obviously, the next question is: is the single round robin somehow "unfair" to the other conferences, since most, if not all, use a double round robin?

From the NESCAC's point of view, the answer is: who cares? Is the NESCAC somehow indebted to the current NCAA format? Absolutely not. The NESCAC has set the standard for academic and athletic excellence, and should be used as a model. Just because there is a certain structure used by most does not make it right. I applaud the NESCAC for setting the new standard -- a standard validated by the NCAA and multiple NCAA bids.

Additionally, the NESCAC was forced to go without NCAA qualification for decades, as they were finally eligible in 1994. Dozens of men's and women's basketball teams were left out of the NCAA mix when many would have been serious contenders, if not national champions, if given the chance. It would seem that the current bids would be an indictment of the other frauds getting NCAA bids in the region and a recognization that the NESCAC is the preeminent women's (and men's) conference in the nation.

These are opinions, and I invite other worthwhile input from NESCAC types on the issue. If you are unable to come up with a cogent thought on the issue or are limited intellectually, please refer your comments to boards of the dregs of DIII, such as the UAA or Little East.



Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on January 29, 2006, 11:16:44 AM
Well put Feces Monkey. One last thing I would like to add...

Even if d3hoops.com has an established anti-NESCAC bias, when the point in the season comes when the RPI comes out each week, the nation's top hoops teams are ranked mathematically with zero bias. Considering that the NCAA selection comittee uses this ranking system and not d3hoops.com polls or posting forums, there is no reason why NESCAC should change. The reason why there have been 2 pool C bids each of the last 3 years is because our conference has had 3 legitamate top 25 teams. In addition to those 3 teams playing eachother once, they also schedule most of the toughest non conference opponents that are within reason of traveling distance.
Also, two and three years ago (but not last year) when Williams and Amherst were two of the three NESCAC teams in, they did play eachother twice as per the Little Three rivalry (and in those 2 years NESCAC was represented with 3 final four teams).

Quit hatin'
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: carolina on January 29, 2006, 11:47:12 AM
The GNAC also play each team only once on the Women's side, not that the GNAC conference matters because it is so weak but the system seems to work, not to mention it provides a team to play more out of conference games to strengthen their schedule. If other conferences and teams are so good it shouldn't matter how many times you play a team!!!! Just win!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on January 29, 2006, 01:38:18 PM
I'm thinking that Walzy is probably referring to the men's side with the Amherst/Williams thing, but the same holds true on the women's side.  Not only do the little 3 play eachother twice, but so does BBC (Bates/Bowdoin/Colby), and on the women's side Bates and Bowdoin have been the top 2 teams for the last 3 years and Bowdoin has been the best since I've been watching NESCAC (6 years, I was living in upstate, NY and following the then UCAA, now Liberty League, before that).  Bates also routinely plays Williams twice because they play in the Williams holiday tournament.  Before that they played twice with Wesleyan.

I think it quite likely that some Nescac schools (especially Bates, Bowdoin, Williams) play non-conference schedules that are considerably more difficult than a second round of conference play would be.  Bates played Brandeis on the road, Southern Maine on the road, Baldwin Wallace on a neutral court, Simpson on a neutral court, Trinity (TX) on a neutral court, Bowdoin on the road all of these teams are or were at the time in the top 25, Bowdoin, Brandeis, and USM were in the top 5, and B-W was 6 at the time. Bowdoin and Williams have slightly easier schedules, but not much.  Bates also has only 8 home games, far fewer than those with the double round robin because nearly all of the non-conference games are away making it even harder on themselves. 

How many times do we see teams in conferences with double round robins schedule a pansy non-conference schedule?  If this team wins their league then all they've proven is that they're probably better than the other teams in the league, but they've proven nothing beyond that.  They can't even show how good they may or may not be as compared to the other teams in their regions.  This happens more times than I can count each year. 

I love to mention St. John Fisher men's basketball here because they rarely play anyone good (other than Rocherster, who beats them more often than not) and they usually win the Empire 8, have a great regular season record, and get a 1 or 2 seed in the east region of the NCAA tournament.  They rarely get passed the second round (note that they don't play the first with a 1 or 2 seed) and never get past the third round.  They play a pansy non-conference schedule and they win their conference, but they've clearly proven nothing about their abilities on a regional or national level.

NESCAC, on the other hand, plays the toughest non-conference opponents possible in their region.  They prove how they compare, not just with everyone else in the region, but even on a national scale as many of them travel out of region for tough non-conference games.  Very few, if any, can say that.

I'm sorry this post is so long, it's a subject that I'm rather passionate about.

Cheers,
Red1

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: carolina on January 29, 2006, 05:46:51 PM
Well put RED...I agree with you. I think you ought to post this to all the NESCAC haters on the front of D3hoops since they are the ones complaining!!!!!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 30, 2006, 02:40:00 AM
Quote from: feces monkey on January 29, 2006, 06:09:26 AM
D3hoops.com has an established anti-NESCAC bias -- a natural reaction to the success of the conference.

That is patently ridiculous, especially since the NESCAC is the only conference in the Northeast and East regions combined that gets anything resembling regular front-page coverage from us.

Yes, we are against the NESCAC gaming the system to gain an advantage over other Division III conferences. The fact that the NESCAC withheld itself from postseason play is no excuse for gaming the system now.

Similarly, we are against the MAC gaming the system to gain two automatic bids by splitting its conferences when convenient, yet combining the conferences to get one automatic bid when neither side qualifies on its own. But that doesn't mean we are biased against the MAC, we simply disapprove of its policy.

We are against the SCIAC limiting football teams to nine games, denying the student-athletes the same 10-game opportunity to compete that other conferences' schools have (NESCAC aside).

The point is not about who schedules tough outside their conference. The point is about determining a valid conference champion. Ten conference games is not a realistic measure.

It's nice that CBB and Little Three play each other twice each, but even that means that only some of your schools play a whole 12 games against conference opponents. And it doesn't go toward determining your conference seeding, so it doesn't help legitimize your championship.

I am surprised that on the women's NESCAC board there is not more support for a double round-robin. Are you happy with the fact that only one team gets homecourt advantage for the Bates/Bowdoin game that counts in the conference standings? Would it not be more fair to your conference institutions to have a home-and-home in the conference standings?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on January 30, 2006, 03:27:50 AM
Pat,

I think that by playing some of the toughest non-conference schedules in the country it legitamizes each and every team in Nescac for both men's and women's, and that in itself makes the Nescac champion a legitamate conference champion since that team played better than all the other teams that proved where they placed in the region.

On the other hand, I think the double round robin can make the champion less legitamate.  Take the St. John Fisher men's team.  The double round robin in the very weak empire 8 gives St. John Fisher more home games, more games against weaker teams, and fewer non-conference games to pad, and they do pad their non-conference schedule.  The only team they play that has shown itself to be good is Rochester and Fisher normally loses that game.  This kind of padding consistently gets Fisher ranked very high in both DIII polls, and mathematically earns them a first round bye in the NCAA tournament.  A bye, mind you, that they routinely squander because they aren't remotely close to the best, or 2nd best team in the region.  They never play anyone that makes the east region bracket until they lose to the first one they meet in the tournament. 

Any Nescac team would feel ashamed if they weren't undefeated with Fisher's schedule.  The St. John Fisher style (and they're not the only team that does this, they're just the first to enter my head) of easy scheduling and coasting to the big dance strikes me as less legitamate than a single round robin in conference play where teams play tough non-conference schedules and prove that they belong in the big dance. 

At least you know that whoever comes out of the Nescac has played, and can play with the other teams in the Northeast bracket, and has truly earned their place in the tournament by defeating the other contenders rather than avoiding them.  On the women's side especially, it might be a little easier to have a double round robin, particularly for Bates so that the every other year conference game at Bowdoin doesn't eliminate the Bobcats in week 1.  Yes it's much harder with the single round robin, but making the big dance despite the difficulty is what makes these teams so great, and  I think that is the most legitamate way to earn a selection to the NCAA tournament.

Cheers,
Red1 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 30, 2006, 03:38:23 AM
No. It makes the conference champion strong. It does not make the conference champion legitimate.

St. John Fisher is a legitimate champion of the Empire 8 after a double round-robin and a conference tournament. Are they GOOD? No, not necessarily. But the conference was decided in a legitimate manner. You're arguing a separate topic entirely ... and taking a lot of time to do so.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 30, 2006, 03:41:34 AM
And if your league is so good, then why isn't it good for you to play these great teams twice? :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bearswatcher on January 30, 2006, 07:58:25 AM
You guys are clowns. First of all if there is a D3Hoops.com bias it is and has always been against the UAA. I think Pat Colman will agree that he has a natural dilike for the conference. Second, your elitist attitude with regard to the Nescac academics and playing dates policy is laughable. The UAA is easily as academically strong as the NESCAC and frankly, how about traveling 1/2 way across country for Friday/Sunday games. Also, regarding your elitist statments concerning your 3 teams in the NCAA's the last three year, compare your totals over the past 10 years with the UAA and oh how many NESCAC National Champions have there been over that period, you sound like you have had more the the UAA....

But at least you don't play that bush schedule that the LEC does...you know where USM or ECSU beat the crap out of all those power houses they play and then spit the bit.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on January 30, 2006, 01:48:37 PM
Bearswatcher,

This is the NESCAC forum not the UAA forum.

PatColeman,

One thing I would like to add that Red1 didn't touch upon is:
You are right in that if NESCAC played a double round robin with home and homes then the seeding would be more accurate. BUT, if NESCAC were to instill that system, then they would also need to instill cutting down the conference tournament field from 8 to 4. Follow the Patriot League's lead in making the regular season worth something. Yeh a regular season title is nice, but a first round exit to the 8 seed would be disasterous and could end their season. What ends up happening in NESCAC now (and what would happen to a more severe degree if we did double round robin), is that a few teams fight for the top seed, and the other teams that are in coast through into the playoffs (often not playing players who have slight injuries but probably could play if the game meant anything). Then once the tourny starts, those 6, 7, and 8 seeds who only had to beat conn and trinity twice each, will play with a rejuvenated roster and make serious waves in the tournament.

Example being Amherst beating Wesleyan last year in quarter finals. Should have ended Wesleyan's season (but luckily it didnt and Wes had a great run in NCAAs).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 30, 2006, 02:44:00 PM
If you prefer to cut the tourney down to four, that wouldn't bother me personally. Many conferences have just four teams in their tournament.

Bearswatcher, I guess we can put the UAA on the list of schools we are allegedly biased against. Guess I am wasting my time listening to the UAA games on Fridays and Sundays every week, since I hate them so much.

I don't have a natural dislike for the UAA. Honestly, the UAA has probably been on the front page more in the past six years than anyone else. The advent of prevalent online audio broadcasting has helped the UAA get noticed because it plays games on Fridays and Sundays, when most conferences are off. When Johns Hopkins was still playing a half-league schedule, I would drive through D.C. rush hour traffic every Friday night up to Baltimore to see whomever was in town. I've seen NYU, Rochester, Chicago, Carnegie Mellon and Wash U play in person over the years.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 30, 2006, 04:18:16 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 30, 2006, 02:40:00 AM
Yes, we are against the NESCAC gaming the system to gain an advantage over other Division III conferences. The fact that the NESCAC withheld itself from postseason play is no excuse for gaming the system now.

The thought of the NESCAC presidents adopting a single round-robin format for its women's (and men's) basketball programs because it somehow provides the conference an advantage over (i.e., "gaming") other conferences is absurd. And, frankly, perpetuates an anti-NESCAC theme.

There was much trepidation by the NESCAC presidents to allow NCAA participation in all sports in 1993, and has a tradition of limiting the amount of class time missed or the potential for athletics to take too great an importance on campus. This is why the conference opted out of the ECAC tournaments. This is why they flirted with the possibility of limiting team participants into the NCAA to just the automatic qualifier (no others would be allowed into an at-large pool). This is why NESCAC teams are not permitted to have non-traditional seasons (coach supervised "fall/spring ball.") in any sport despite it being allowed by the NCAA. This is why coaches are not allowed off-campus recruiting visits/contact with prospective-student athletes -- a practice done by all other conferences. This is why the football team is not allowed to participate in the NCAA tournament.

Do these sound like the practices of conference "gaming" the system? But yet, the single-round robin is some diabolical plan by the presidents to get a monumental advantage? Hey, don't let the facts stand in your way.

The main reason for the single round-robin format is a relatively simple one: cost. This may sound laughable with the endowment sizes of some of the schools (Williams' $billion-plus endowment would be the envy of most conferences), but the reality is very little of that money trickles down to athletics, relative to the amount of students who participate.

For a team like Bowdoin, they will have to pay the travel expenses for a Middlebury/Williams trip once every two years, instead of once a year. When you look at a lot of NESCAC schedules, you will see that a majority of their non-conference games are played close to campus (in Bowdoin's case, UMF, USM, Husson, Maine Maritime, etc.) in order to keep costs low. They will sometimes have longer (both time and distance) trips, but it is rarely a yearly accurance and almost without fail falling on a break from classes.

An important point to understand about the NESCAC is they are not looking to satisfy other's definition of "validity." The conference looks internally for its solutions, not outside, and is often a trendsetter in many facets (for example, the admissions process for a prospective student-athlete).

The NESCAC's athletic success is unmatched (by Director Cup standings), even in the face of tight rein from the conference presidents. The conference's athletic success is a natural by-product of the excellent students who attend and their individual expectations, and are not helped by any logistical (scheduling) machinations.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 30, 2006, 04:34:30 PM
Even if you went to divisions and played your more local teams twice and the distant teams once, that would be more legitimate.

And frankly, I don't think the rest of the Division III conferences getting jobbed by the NESCAC or MAC care about whether the presidents or coaches or ADs or boards of trustees or trainers make the call. It affects them negatively. It borders on unsportsmanlike.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on January 30, 2006, 05:06:24 PM
There's no rule in the NESCAC against home-and-home series. In fact, it is done in the case of women's hockey. It's not done for men's hockey but primarily because of a desire to preserve long-standing rivalries with non-NESCAC teams. I would think that the NESCAC presidents would strive for more intra-NESCAC competition not less as schedules would be more balanced with a home-and-home schedule.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on January 30, 2006, 05:56:58 PM
Pat, I don't see how the NESCAC "jobs" anyone.  I believe you are affiliated with Catholic -- they play 14 regular season conference games a year, plus I'm not sure how many playoff games.  Williams (who, like Catholic, has won a men's national title)  plays 11 regular season conference games a year, plus 2-3 in the playoffs in good years.  Hardly a material difference.  Do smaller conferences "job" bigger conferences because they have fewer teams in their conference and hence fewer conference games and an easier road to an automatic qualifier?  Why would an extra game a year against Colby or Tufts make Williams more legitimate than playing usually-strong regional rivals Hamilton and Springfield on a regular basis?  NESCAC teams face one of the toughest roads to an automatic qualifier of any conference: they have to emerge from a 10 team conference that regularly includes 3-5 potential top 25 caliber teams on both the women's and men's side.  Compare that to MASCAC, which you deem to be legitmiate because it plays in a round robin fashion -- a much smaller conference with few if any good teams.  Yet they also get an automatic qualifier.  I don't see how Nescac is "jobbing" anyone.  Usually, probably at a higher rate than other conferences in recent years, the best team wins the conference tournament (Williams and Amherst most recent years in men's with Trinity sprinkled in; Bowdoin almost every year in women's), so however the league sees fit to set up its system, it works and works well in terms of establishing who the best team is year in and year out. 

Also, again to take an example, if Williams played 18 games against its conference members, plus its annual games against regional rivals Hamilton, Springfield, and MCLA, that leaves a grand total of three regular season games it has scheduling discretion over -- which would be a lot less fun and interesting for players, who generally are better served via exposure to different venues, styles of play, opponents, etc.  It would mean no more Amherst trips to play Occidental, no more Trinity trips to PA for tourneys, no more interesting tournaments at home, or at least very few.  I just don't see what the benefit is.

In sum: NESCAC teams play as many conference games, in total, as the smaller conferences, the best team usually gets the AQ, the teams face off against their biggest rivals in some cases twice a year, the teams usually face a demanding and fun out of conference slate, and the qualifier has to get through a big, brutal conference to make it to the dance.  How this does not serve NESCAC well, or in any way prejudices any other conference, I still can't fathom.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bearswatcher on January 30, 2006, 08:05:44 PM
Waltzy....good come back
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bearswatcher on January 30, 2006, 08:08:49 PM
Pat,

Ok I will take you at your word, and never (fingers crossed) accuse you of UAA bias again
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 30, 2006, 08:40:09 PM
Quote from: nescac1 on January 30, 2006, 05:56:58 PM
Pat, I don't see how the NESCAC "jobs" anyone.  I believe you are affiliated with Catholic

I am a graduate of Catholic, yes. I am not affiliated with Catholic. I haven't drawn a salary from Catholic since May 1995.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 30, 2006, 09:11:46 PM
Quote from: bearswatcher on January 30, 2006, 08:05:44 PM
Waltzy....good come back

It wasn't a "come back." It was a point of fact, which, clearly, was lost on you. In addition, I'm sure embarassingly simple one-line "zingers" constitute a coherent debate in a UAA classroom, but if you are unable to stay away, at least try to rise to the intellectual level of the discussion. Don't worry, we'll give you points for trying.

Quote from: speedy on January 30, 2006, 05:06:24 PM
There's no rule in the NESCAC against home-and-home series. In fact, it is done in the case of women's hockey. It's not done for men's hockey but primarily because of a desire to preserve long-standing rivalries with non-NESCAC teams. I would think that the NESCAC presidents would strive for more intra-NESCAC competition not less as schedules would be more balanced with a home-and-home schedule.

I never wrote, nor intimated, that the lack of a double round-robin was a conference "rule." It is just what makes more sense, fiscally and academically, for the NESCAC.

Also, women's ice hockey is a poor comparison, considering the paucity of women's ice hockey teams in the region, and the country. There are just not enough competitive women's programs in the same ratio as basketball to allow the conference to move away from the double-round robin format. In time, it likely will. As for men's hockey, the retention of UMass-Boston, Salem State, Southern Maine, etc., in the same league has nothing to do with preserving "long-standing rivalries," but rather, again, the closer geographic locations and subsequent cost savings.

D3hoops.com's distaste for the NESCAC is not an altogether uncommon affliction. Success, which the NESCAC has in abundance, breeds contempt. It's just that most are a tad more subtle in their contempt, or at least try to couch their bias in something other than jealousy.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on January 31, 2006, 03:47:53 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on January 30, 2006, 09:11:46 PM
. .  As for men's hockey, the retention of UMass-Boston, Salem State, Southern Maine, etc., in the same league has nothing to do with preserving "long-standing rivalries," but rather, again, the closer geographic locations and subsequent cost savings.  . .

You're making stuff up. The NESCAC-ECAC East relationship in men's hockey has everything to do with preserving traditional rivalries and nothing to do with saving travel money. The top teams in the NESCAC and the ECAC East all played in the same conference and had been so for some 40 years before the formation of the NESCAC as a playing conference in 1998. The ECAC East was a shrunken relic of iteself and the 2 conferences agreed to continue to play as one during the regular season (but each with its own champion and play-offs) so tthat both leagues would have a strong schedule. And anyway, it would make no difference whatsoever for the NESCAC to move to home-and-home in men's hockey in terms of travel costs as the ECAC East, with 2 Vermont teams and 1 NY team, includes more far-flung teams than the NESCAC.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 31, 2006, 07:48:48 PM
While there is perhaps a more appropriate board for a debate on the evolution of the NESCAC-ECAC men's ice relationship, I will respond and perhaps make an attempt to keep the discussion somewhat germaine to DIII basketball.

In 1998, when the NESCAC "broke free" and actually used conference standings, it was unfeasible to have strictly a NESCAC schedule in men's hockey. One team, most likely Hamilton, would have been left without a travel partner - a massive disadvantage. As a result, staying within the East/NESCAC framework made sense for competition, as well as cost.

In 2001, when Tufts finally made the jump from the ECAC Northeast to the NESCAC, per se, the league finally could have migrated to an equitable double round-robin format, but chose to stay with the current format. As stated before, they did this for financial reasons. The longer and shorter trips for most schools are staggered on a yearly basis in order to save cost (i.e., if Colby travels to Midd/Williams, it will host Norwich/St. Mike's).

If you believe that the NESCAC presidents somehow are sentimental about the historical significance of the Colby-UMass Boston, Middlebury-Castleton State or Wesleyan-New England College match-ups, you are delusional. Do you think the NESCAC is eager to throw its lot in with St. A's, USM and Norwich? Please name one rival for a NESCAC team out of the current conference? Assuming you conjure up a couple, a NESCAC double round-robin would still leave plenty of games to continue traditional rivalries (for example, Middlebury-Norwich).

As stated previously, the reason basketball does the same is because of cost. I can understand, considering how well the schools are doing financially, how this would be not easily accepted. And I understand it may be a little tough to swallow for hockey fans who think the Skidmore-Trinity game was retained because it makes the NESCAC presidents pine for the classic battles of yesteryear between the Bantams and Greyhounds. The truth is often difficult.

And if you think I'm "making this stuff up," I urge you to further examine the issue, although the conversation is more suited to USCHO.com.

A more appropriate question for this board is: Can Bates stop The Streak in Brunswick?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 31, 2006, 07:53:59 PM
Ugh. I meant "germane."

For this transgression, I'll allow the powers-that-be deduct another "karma" point from my dwindling till...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on January 31, 2006, 09:54:35 PM
The answer to the Bowdoin/Bates question is Bowdoin 76-Bates 59.  I don't I've ever seen that high a score on the Bowdoin side in a Bates/Bowdoin matchup.  If Bowdoin beats Williams in the last game of the season (and I think that's a good bet) then Bates will likely host the semifinals and finals of Nescac (barring an insane upset).  The home court will give Bates the best chance they've had of knocking off Bowdoin in the Nescac championship game as they two teams will likely meet in the final for the fourth consecutive year.  Bates' defense will have to improve immensely if the bobcats are going to bring forth the first non-Polar Bear Nescac champion ever.  They've showed inclings of what they need in the conference game against Bowdoin, and the last nine minutes of the game at Wesleyan.  If they can harness that defense, coupled with the home court advantage, look for Bates to finally exercise their nescac championship demons and dethrone the polar bears in Lewiston (that is, unless Williams manages to upset Bowdoin on the last day).

Cheers,
Red1

p.s.  the reason cited by the presidents for the lack of NCAA tournaments for football, and the long tradition of no NCAA tournaments for basketball (followed by only the conference champion being allowed to participate) was that the athletes would spend too much time away from the classroom and their studies.  I believe what they said at the time was along the lines of "The NESCAC's dedication is primarly to academics, and secondarily to athletics."  I'd suggest that this thought process likely continues in their reasoning for having just a single round-robin, and the desire to limit travel when classes are in session for all sports in question.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on January 31, 2006, 10:13:23 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on January 31, 2006, 07:48:48 PM. .

In 1998, when the NESCAC "broke free" and actually used conference standings, it was unfeasible to have strictly a NESCAC schedule in men's hockey. One team, most likely Hamilton, would have been left without a travel partner - a massive disadvantage. As a result, staying within the East/NESCAC framework made sense for competition, as well as cost.

In 2001, when Tufts finally made the jump from the ECAC Northeast to the NESCAC, per se, the league finally could have migrated to an equitable double round-robin format, but chose to stay with the current format. As stated before, they did this for financial reasons. The longer and shorter trips for most schools are staggered on a yearly basis in order to save cost (i.e., if Colby travels to Midd/Williams, it will host Norwich/St. Mike's).

And if you think I'm "making this stuff up," I urge you to further examine the issue, although the conversation is more suited to USCHO.com.

A more appropriate question for this board is: Can Bates stop The Streak in Brunswick?

There is ZERO cost savings from having the NESCAC-ECAC East interlock. You're off your rocker if you think that there is. The Maine duo end up with just as many long trips because of the interlock as they would without it. And clearly you know nothing about hockey or you would know that Middlebury, Bowdoin, Colby, Williams, etc, have all played Norwich, St Anselm, UMass Boston (when it was Boston State), and Salem State for 30 plus years and Babson for almost as long and have decades of competing with them in the ECAC play-offs.

And the answer to your question about Bates is, of course, no way!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 01, 2006, 09:24:42 PM
Quote from: speedy on January 31, 2006, 10:13:23 PM
You're off your rocker if you think that there is.

"Off your rocker" is one of my favorite pejoratives. Reminds me of my grandfather. I'll concede the argument; not for facts, but fatigue.

Bowdoin is now in the situtation Bates was last year: won the non-con game, but pretty much helpless to host the tourney. I haven't run the numbers completely, but it believe it would take Tufts, Amherst or Trinity to beat Bates to give their own destiny back to the PBears. Don't like those odds (no offense, Walzy). Basically comes down to Williamstown and Lewiston, and the way Bowdoin is playing I'd like to think they'll win at Williamstown, although it won't be easy.

As a result, Bates will have to chip away at their endowment in order to pay the heating bills, as Alumni will likely be hovering around 90-95 degrees for the tourney. And if the Androscoggin is on fire (again), it could be even higher.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on February 02, 2006, 12:08:00 PM
No offense taken. I will predict a Bates win of 17 points over Amherst and 32 over Trinity. I hope I am wrong though.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: mrmike88 on February 03, 2006, 01:04:18 PM
WAMH will be broadcasting the Amherst-Williams doubleheader tonight.  We go on the air for the 6:00PM women's tip off.  Check out http://wamh.amherst.edu/ to listen live.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on February 04, 2006, 12:22:38 AM
Amherst won the double header on aggregate. -14 and +28
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on February 04, 2006, 12:38:04 AM
A very wild OT win for Bowdoin over Weleyan to keep the home win streak going at something like 66. A Wesleyan player was fouled while attempting to make a 3 with the game tied and a little less than 2 seconds left in the game. Somehow, the Wesleyan player managed to miss all 3 foul shots and Bowdon ran away with the game in OT as Wesleyan was completely demoralized.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on February 04, 2006, 12:30:33 PM
Wow that is intense Speedy. I feel bad for that girl. Too bad Bates is going host the tournament...I would love to see the home record on the line in the tournament for the PBears.

I'll take Amherst today 57-55 over Middlebury
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: carolina on February 04, 2006, 05:43:23 PM
First of all, the only way that the tourny is going to be at BAtes is if Bowdoin beats Williams (if everyone wins out up to that point) Williams beat Bates so they would win the tie-breaker if they can beat Bowdoin. Correct me if I am wrong!!!! If Bowdoin wins then Bates will host due to their win over Bowdoin. Again there is still another weekend left so lets not get ahead of ourselves.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on February 04, 2006, 06:02:31 PM
Bates had few problems with Tufts in a 30+ pt. win at Alumni Gym.  I forgot to write down the score when I left, but It was along the lines of 76-45.  Tufts jumped out to an 18-8 lead with twelve and a half minutes left in the first half, but the bobcats decided to start playing basketball and ran away with it. 

I was very displeased with the officiating in the 2nd half.  I understand that Bates was up by 30+ points and the tendency is to give the Jumbos a little leeway (Libby Park's 4 fouls on account of pickiness early in the game prove this motive) but the officials still need to set a limit and stick to it.  If nothing else it keeps the game from getting out of hand, and it keeps players from getting hurt.  It was lucky that no one was injured tonight.  It was one of the most violent games I've seen.  (Wentworth tech managed to earn 3 flagrant fouls and an ejection a couple years ago.  No game will ever top that one for violence.)  Pics turned into shoves, boxing out turned into pushing people out of the way,  steal attempts turned into slaps accross the face, and this only happened on one side of the ball.  The officials needed to step it up, stop the madness, and control the game, and I'm disappointed in their inability to do that.

Senator, don't worry, I'm sure Bowdoin can keep their win streak going for another year.  They can put it on the line in the tournament next year (if Bates doesn't end it during the regular season.)  Besides, it's been done... 5 times... in a row :P.   For some reason, and it may just be wishful thinking, my gut tells me that Bates will be the team who ends Bowdoin's home win streak, and it will happen in a Nescac final.

Carolina,  you're correct that Bowdoin (or anyone else for that matter) will need to beat Williams for Bates to host instead of Williams, and we are getting a bit ahead of ourselves, but the likelihood of Bowdoin winning at Williams is quite high.

Cheers,
Red1

 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: carolina on February 04, 2006, 07:46:32 PM
RED1
As far as Bowdoin winning at Williams.  Thats what people on the site said about BATES going to Williams and we know what happened there. Bates also had a full squad in that 20 point loss. Bates played better when they didn't have their full squad in Williams' Tournament but on the other hand Williams didn't play all that well in the beginning of the season. I gues anything can happen and that is why the games are played. It should be fun!!!!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 09, 2006, 12:17:20 AM
First, I want to echo Walzy's sentiments about feeling awful for the young woman from Wesleyan. I honestly can't thing of any situation more devastating psychologically to a team or individual (no, I'm not a psychologist). Giving up a half-court buzzer-beater is rotten, but you can chalk it up to dumb luck. Missing three consecutive freebies is a little more personal. She'll hopefully be stronger for it (as intercollegiate athletics is, along with the entire college experience, a life-lesson learning tool).

I must admit, after the near miss against the Cardinals, I'm not quite as sure about the tournament locked into Lewiston. Here's how I see things playing out:

Williams sweeps this weekend, clinching the tournament, putting Bates in the second seed and Bowdoin, winning the head-to-head with Wesleyan, taking third, followed by the Cardinals.

The four top seeds will all win (granted, Amherst has a history of playing spoiler). Bowdoin is able to beat Bates on a neutral floor, while Wesleyan stuns Williams in the other semifinal. PBears eclipse Wesleyan in the final, locking up at least three NCAA spots. I would have thought Bates would be the odd team out, but the recent regional rankings make me believe they would have a quality shot if my scenario plays out.

Was lurking around the men's board and saw the guesses for the all-conference team, so I'll lob one out for the women for discussion.

First Team
Coffin (Bates)
Pouravelis (Bowdoin)
O'Malley (Williams)
Stubbs (Wesleyan)
Miller (Williams)

Second Team
Barton (Bates)
Flaherty (Bowdoin)
Cox (Trinity)
McVary (Middlebury)
Hession (Williams)

POY: Coffin
Def: Pouravelis
ROY: Anelauskas (Bowdoin) -- could be co- with Fourney (Wes)
COY: Manning (Williams) -- coaches typically pick the coach of the conference champ, but if Bowdoin wins it, I don't think Pemper will get it (for variety's sake). Manning is deserving, although next year's team might be better.

I actually feel kind of sick to my stomach picking all the Williams players (reference a previous post about success breeding contempt), but I think this is how it will play out. McVary and Cox could easily get bumped, but I don't know by whom. Amherst has had a solid year, but nobody stood out (correct me if wrong, Walzy). Colby, Conn., & Tufts are undeserving. I could understand Flaherty or Barton bumping one of the Williams kids from the first team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: carolina on February 09, 2006, 05:49:35 PM
FecesMonkey

Not that it matters much to you but I agree with some of your picks. How can you give Coffin POY. She was injured in the beginning and was horrible in the game agaisnt Williams where Williams beat them by 20. I don't know who POY should be but i Don't think Coffin should get it.

Also, I know Maggie Miller reached a 1000 points but when you take a million shots you should hit a 1000. The reason I dont like that pick is because she doesn't play any defense. It's a good thing she can score some points because she wouldn't be playing on any team of mine not playing any defense!!!!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 09, 2006, 07:22:32 PM
Carolina,

Interesting points. My rationalization for the selections were based primarily on one premise: What players do opposing coaches have to gear their defensive (or in the case of Pouravelis, offensive) game plans around to win?

While Coffin did miss two games early in the season, I think she gives coaches the most concern heading into a game. That's not to say she has a great game every time (she didn't really do much in Bates' win over Bowdoin, either), but I think the coaches worry about her and will vote for her. That's not to say a case couldn't be made for any of the players I selected for the first team (or even Barton or Flaherty, for that matter). Just my feeling.

In the same vein, Miller's tendency to be a gunner may rankle some, but it definitely makes her a concern. And, unless you are an overwhelming difference maker on the defensive end (such as Pouravelis), I believe coaches are willing to overlook defensive deficiencies when voting.

In addition to having to gameplan, I think class, in respect to both year in school and how players handle themselves, plays a big factor in voting, as well team success.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: carolina on February 09, 2006, 09:56:10 PM
FecesMonkey

I see your points but with the Maggie Miller situation I still think the defense is a concern. Maybe not for the voting process but there is an old saying "offense wins games, defense wins champioships." I think the defense of Miller will hurt her team when it comes to going against the better players. She can have all the points in the world but if her player scores the same amount it really means nothing. Just my opinion
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: allaboutball on February 10, 2006, 10:57:16 AM
wow all this talk of maggie miller.
I think we are forgetting that she is leading the NESCAC in blocks, I mean I don't think she gets them just because she is taller than people. or maybe you didn't get a chance to see the game against Bates where she hit a number of jumpers in Coffins face. I believe she shot above 60% that game.
but then again just numbers. so maybe you should,
get your facts straight before calling somebody out on not playing defense, I mean to be 6-1 in NESCAC, playing essentially as you would say 5 on 4 out there, isn't likely. she may not jump out of the gym like Pouravelis, but she can play the 3, 4, 5, bring up the ball.
I would say she is one of the most finese players I've seen in a long time. she may take a few bad shots, but who is to say others don't do that either.
so buddy find someone else to pick on, someone who maybe isn't leading their team in scoring, rebounding, blocks, and assists.
then maybe we can have a normal conversation.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: carolina on February 10, 2006, 04:27:31 PM
First of all, I never said Maggie wasn't a good player. Offensively she is tough but she is lacking on the defensive end and I really don't care how many blocks she has, she IS 6 feet tall. I also think she deserves to be an ALL-Star but IN MY OPINION which i am entitled too, I am not sure she deserves to be on the first team just like I do not think Coffin should be POY. I am not sure who should be but I am entitled to my opinion. Maggie does wonders for her team but she has also hurt them at times. Now the way you are defending her I am sure you are an EPHS fan or just A MAggie Miller fan. I like the EPHS myself but it was just an observation of mine and if you don't like it to bad. That is why we have this board....TO EXPRESS OUR THOUGHTS!!!!!!!! GET OVER YOURSELF
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on February 10, 2006, 09:15:05 PM
Bates 83-Amherst 41.  Amherst had no answer for Meg Coffin in the paint.  They tried to triple team her when she got the ball and it still didn't work.  She scored virtually at will, rebounded at will, and topped it off with a couple of good blocks.

All-Nescac predictions:
First Team
Coffin (Bates)
Pourevalis (Bowdoin)
Flaherty (Bowdoin)
Stubbs (Wesleyan)
O'Malley (Williams)

Second Team
Miller (Williams)
Cox (Trinity)
Barton (Bates)
Serafin (Conn)
Hession (Williams)

Other possibles that might get 2nd team in place of my picks:  McCabe (Col), McVary (Mid)

POY:  Coffin (Bates)

DEY:  Pourevalis (Bowdoin) (I haven't been impressed by NESCAC defense this year in general.  I've never been impressed with Pourevalis on the defensive end because she falls for absolutely every ball fake and gets beat by going for steals that she can't get to.  On the other hand she's solid when she stays off the perimeter, and no one else has really impressed me with her defense either.)

ROY:  Anelauskas (Bowdoin)

COY: If Bowdoin wins NESCAC tournament:  Pemper (Bowdoin)
If anyone else wins the tournament:  Manning (Williams)

Cheers,
Red1



Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on February 11, 2006, 04:53:19 PM
Bowdoin downs Williams 70-60. I guess that means that Bates will end up hosting the NESCAC tournament!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on February 11, 2006, 05:08:18 PM
Bates 78, Trinity 47.  Trinity is a small quick team with some good shooters, but absolutely no answer for Coffin and Kostakis in the post.  These two players absoultely took control of the game and led Bates to a convincing win.

Congratulations to the Bates College Bobcats 05/06 regular season Nescac champions and hosts of the 2006 Nescac tournament!!

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: carolina on February 11, 2006, 07:11:23 PM
Boy you are a rocket scientist!!!!! Tourny will be at Bates but I don't see them winning it. Heard the refs did a job on Williams even on there home floor. Congrats to Bowdoin for the win and to Bates for Hosting. It was ibteresting until the end but look for Williams to win the Tourny!!!!!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on February 11, 2006, 08:21:30 PM
The home floor is a monmumental difference for the bobcats as they went undefeated at home including the conference win over Bowdoin.  For the past 3 years Bowdoin has beaten Bates in the final in Brunswick.  Look for the homecourt advantage to make its mark again. 

Williams will have to get through Bates and Bowdoin in that order to win the tournament.  I find that highly improbable, especially on Bates' floor.  Wesleyan's got the same deal.  There's a distinct level change from the top 4 teams to #s 5-8, so look for the top 4 to be playing at Bates.  Bates might very well have the second biggest homecourt advantage in the country (behind Bowdoin of course).  Not even the mighty Polar Bears, nor the current #1 Huskies have found an answer to Alumni Gym.  Look for Bates to win it all this year.

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: usmhoops1 on February 11, 2006, 11:05:24 PM
Red1
Sounds like some fun in  Lewiston is on the way!!

FYI:  Checked the archives
USM  vs Bates
1997-98 season / @ USM 91-60  USM wins
98-99 / @ Bates  (1-21-99) 55-52  USM wins
99-00 / @ USM / 65-52  USM wins
00-01 / @ Bates / (11-21-00) 77-69  USM wins
01-02 / @ USM / (11-20-01)  71-68  USM wins
02-03 / @ Bates / (11-26-02) 69-66 USM wins
**USM was down 18-20 and came back in this one**
03-04 / @ USM / (11-25-03)  84-61  USM wins
04-05 / @ Bates / (11-23-04) 61-37 Bates Wins
05-06 / @ USM / USM wins

My daughter played at USM from  99-03.  Missed no games her Soph, JR and Sr years
Huskies have taken 3 of last 4 at Bates. I think USM has done quite well in Lewiston.


I wish Bates, Bowdoin, USM and whoever else is on top could play more often.  Win or lose, those are great nights of basketball.
Playoffs at Bowdoin and at USM the last 3 years have been incredible nights for womens hoops in our state.  Just wish we did not have to wait so long in between games for the epic matchups!!

Good luck to all the rest of the way!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: carolina on February 11, 2006, 11:41:36 PM
Ok
I will give Bates and Bowdoin their due but Bates got lucky with the home seed because technically Bowdoin and Bates were tide in the win/loss column but I guess that is why we have the tie breaker. The top teams are so good I think it would make for a more interesting game if they played at neutral sites for the tourny (JUST MY OPINION). I would like to see all teams play have the same advantages or disadvantages. I don't care what anyone says. Referees play a major role in a close game when on the home floor of a team. Just let the teams decide who is best on a given night. IN MY OPINION ONCE AGAIN....I believe Bates, Bowdoin and Williams are very Simliar with their talent. I guess you might add Wesleyan to that group. So a neutral floor would be nice.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on February 12, 2006, 12:10:47 AM
USMhoops1,

I was referring to Bates current home win streak which extends more than 2 years, and during which Bates defeated USM in Lewiston (and Bowdoin twice).  Your numbers only further support my point about just how large Bates' homecourt advantage has been over the last 2+ years.  Prior to that USM had no trouble against Bates anywhere, but since the streak began even the mighty Huskies fell at Bates.  By the way, how many D1 transfers does USM have now?

Schedule more games between Bates, Bowdoin, and USM.... Are you a fan of pain?  Besides the fact that USM doesn't have enough non-conference games for that it would physically and mentally burn all three teams out.

Carolina,
Have no fear, Williams will likely make the NCAA tournament with an at large bid if they don't win the automatic bid.  The same is true for Bowdoin.  The same, however, may not be true for Bates as the bobcats have struggled away from home this year.  The current scenario gives the NESCAC the best chance for 3 teams in the tournament this year (perhaps even 4 if Wesleyan is good enough to make it).

Cheers,
Red1,

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: usmhoops1 on February 12, 2006, 08:55:59 AM
Red,

The only D1 transfer at USM is Marble and she was a D1 Volleyball player at Orono, not basketball.  She would struggle to play basketball at UMaine.  Hard to be a 5'9" forward even in UMaines current state of being!!  She was a solid volleyball player at best at that level and Maine is not on top of the Volleyball world by a long shot.

USM vs the in state NESCAC schools play on each others floors on alternating years.  I think the Bowdoin streak at home is really something!!  Not to take a thing away from the Bobcats.  I enjoy watching Coach Murphys teams play.  Great guy and a fun style to watch.  Bates would need to go about 3 plus more years to equal what the Polar Bears have done at home.

Unfortunately, the home of the Bobcats is not legal by NCAA standards to host the NCAA's which is too bad for that to happen.  Maybe raising the tuition a few grand could get the new place built!!

My reference to having them play more, I know will not happen.  Duke vs NC, and rivalries of that nature happen home and away each year so I guess wishing for the same in our great state is reasonable!!
Hope the blizzard doesnt wreak too much havoc today.  Not going to any games today.  My wife does have a list for me though!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: usmhoops1 on February 12, 2006, 06:00:10 PM
Just found something interesting.  Reading about the upcoming NCAA tourney and the new format.  According to what is printed in that info,  there is the potential that the NCAA may relax a few of the standards for who may host. 
Talk of having seperate admissions for the first 2 games of the regional.  I wonder if that would help someone like Bates  with attendance being an issue as far as how many Alumni gym can seat.  Anyone know more about this.

On the home page of this site you can find the article about this.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: carolina on February 12, 2006, 08:09:46 PM
Well I guess the rumor was correct. Bowdoin shot 33FOUL SHOTS TO Williams 6. Quite the disparity. Luckily for Bowdoin they had those shots or they might not even of been in the game. I know Williams probably fouled but I am sure it shouldn't of been 33-6!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: demonizzy on February 13, 2006, 02:14:05 PM
Quote from: carolina on February 11, 2006, 11:41:36 PM
Ok
I will give Bates and Bowdoin their due but Bates got lucky with the home seed because technically Bowdoin and Bates were tide in the win/loss column but I guess that is why we have the tie breaker.

Wait, Bates got "LUCKY" with the home seed? I don't think going 8-1 AND beating Bowdoin, the other 8-1 team in the league, makes them "lucky" to have the home seed. As far as I can tell, Bates EARNED that home seed.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 14, 2006, 04:19:08 AM
Quote from: usmhoops1 on February 12, 2006, 06:00:10 PM
Just found something interesting.  Reading about the upcoming NCAA tourney and the new format.  According to what is printed in that info,  there is the potential that the NCAA may relax a few of the standards for who may host. 
Talk of having seperate admissions for the first 2 games of the regional.  I wonder if that would help someone like Bates  with attendance being an issue as far as how many Alumni gym can seat.  Anyone know more about this.

On the home page of this site you can find the article about this.

I think Bates might be allowed to host a regional but still probably not a sectional.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: usmhoops1 on February 14, 2006, 08:30:03 AM
That would be great for the Bobcats.  If they earn the right then they should be able to host it.  Would be a great night for ticket scalpers!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on February 14, 2006, 10:20:50 PM
Bates has hosted regionals before (that is games in the first 2 rounds).  In fact they did that last year when they beat Emmanuel.  The rounds of 16 and 8 are both considered sectionals although the round of 16 is also the regional final, and Bates has never (and probably will never in Alumni) be allowed to host sectionals even if they do earn the highest seed.   This was proved last year when top seeded Bates had to travel to second seeded USM, and lose all of the advantages they had earned with that top spot, because Alumni is too small.  If Bates could host regionals before the NCAA relaxed its standards then they certainly should be able to do so still.  I think it would take a lot more relaxing then the NCAA is willing if Bates were to host a sectional.  This may all be a moot point this year anyway as Bates will likely have to win the NESCAC tournament just to get in to the NCAAs and even if they do it's highly doubtful that the Bobcats will get to host any round this year.

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 15, 2006, 01:30:08 AM
Quote from: usmhoops1 on February 12, 2006, 08:55:59 AM
Maybe raising the tuition a few grand could get the new place built!!

Unfortunately, instead of revamping Alumni, the Bates money men (women?) would probably use any leftover cash to expand the hockey arena. This would allow them to...um...bolster that club hockey team. I don't want to make too much fun of the rink, as I know Red is still a little sore after Johnny Weir beat him out for the Olympic figure skating team.

I actually like Alumni, and would rank it as my second favorite gym, behind Tufts' barn. I love that place. Colby, Conn., Midd, Williams, Bowdoin and Trinity's courts all seem so antiseptic to me. LeFrak is slightly bizarre, but not bad. I haven't seen Wesleyan's new one, but from the pictures it looks to be of the sterile variety. I'm dating myself, but the worst "NESCAC" court I've ever seen was Hamilton's. Not sure if they still play on the tartan surface on the infield of their indoor track, but that was awful. And there was usually one blown ACL per game.

Methinks if Williams had beat Bowdoin, Carolina would not have been lamenting that the tourney wasn't played on a neutral floor. While some DIII tournaments are played on neutral courts (the ODAC for one), I think it is logical for a team who wins the regular season to get some kind of benefit. Plus, per conference rules, schools aren't allowed to claim "regular season champion," so it's only right they should get a leg up.

And yes, Carolina, I know it's only your opinion. But it's still wrong. Maybe if your girl, Maggie Miller, hit a couple of more shots, you could paint your face purple and gold in Chandler. Or was it the officials who robbed the Ephs?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bballsneaks on February 15, 2006, 07:07:29 PM
well said, feces. well said.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: carolina on February 15, 2006, 09:23:57 PM
Feces

I could care less who won the game.I still think a neutral floor is best and an opinion can not be wrong. You can disagree with it but it is only wrong if you diseagree with it. As far as Maggie hitting a few more shots...if any of her teammates hit more shots they would of been better off but that still doesnot change the fact that there was a big discrepency in the fouls. 33 to 6 is ridiculous for any game. However, I was very impressed  that Bowdoin connected on 30 of those. You do not see that too often. Alot of games are won and loss on the foul line and it is very obvious that winning by ten and scoring thirty of your 70 points from the foul line made quite the difference. I am not blaming the refs totally but it sure was a big discrepency!!!!!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on February 15, 2006, 09:30:24 PM
Wow, it's been quite a while since you've been to Hamilton, Feces.  I grew up in Clinton, and frequented the field house/basketball gym on the hill, but while the location is the same, the basketball team is not playing on the same surface.  Hamilton purchased a removable hardwood floor back before I moved to Maine.  I think it was the summer of '98, but it could have been '97.  Same field house, new floor.  No torn ACL on a game by game basis.  The wood floor is elevated 3 inches from the real floor (the one you remember), so there are 2-4 sprained ankles per game now instead.

I've never been in so much pain as when I was denied a spot on the olympic team.  I'll get to keep trying however as Underhill is not expected to change with the long-term plan.  The first stage involves building some new dorms, the second expanding the campus accross Campus Ave, and reorienting it, and the third is new dining a facilites, and student spaces which will be right next to Alumni.  What I don't know is whether they'll expand Alumni while their building right there anyway.  I suspect they might.  I also don't know if any of this will ever actually happen it's just in the planning stage (and has been for 2.5 years now).

I understand how Carolina feels.  I felt the same way when Bates lossed the sectional host to USM last year because Alumni was too small.  I was especially hurt when Bates lost in overtime because I thought Bates had earned the right to host, and would have won at home.  I, too, insisted that neutral courts would be better.  I got over it, however, very quickly because I knew that the NCAA made the correct decision.  Alumni really is too small for a sectional.  The game was over, I moved on to the next season.  Perhaps Carolina will get over Williams not hosting soon when he realizes that the correct team, the team that earned the right, is hosting.  Then we can move on to next weeks games.

Predictions for the tournament:

1 Bates d. 8 Colby by 40
2 Bowdoin d. 7. Tufts by 35
3 Wesleyan d. 6. Trinity by 20
4 Williams d. 5. Amherst by 12

1 Bates d. 4 Williams by 3 (It's in alumni now and Bates is hungry for revenge.  This game will be different than the last)

2 Bowdoin d 3 Wesleyan by 7 (Their Bowdoin, need I explain further?)

1 Bates d. 2 Bowdoin by 3 in ot (This may just be wishful thinking, but these two teams have made the final 3 times in a row, and they've played close a three times in Brunswick.  I think that being in Alumni is just enough to swing that close game in Bates favor)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 16, 2006, 07:59:42 PM
Red, I will confess that Clinton is not on my shortlist of travel destinations, thus my dated comments. I much prefer Oneonta...

Bates could use the upgrade, but I think it will always be hurt by the lack of organization on campus. The dorms, facilities and administrative buildings seem so haphazardly located. Life in the big city, I suppose.

As much as I like to tease Carolina about it, Bowdoin would have been much better served to play the semifinals in Chandler. While the players wouldn't be able to sleep at home like they will with Lewiston, not having Bates (Bowdoin's biggest threat) in their own gym would be pivotal.

I agree with all of Red's first round predictions, although I think the margins in all game will be less, most by half. I agree on both semifinal predicitions and, as much as I would like to disagree, that finals score sounds about right. That would put three NESCACs in and if Wesleyan beats Bowdoin -- which is certainly well within the realm of possibility considering the last result -- I think they could get four. I just hope Bowdoin, Bates or Williams gets a crack at Brandeis -- home or on the road --to debunk that myth.

In regards to officiating, I wasn't at the Williams-Bowdoin game so I can't comment with authority on the officiating, but the "blaming-the-refs" argument is tedious, and mildly insulting to the opposition. Officiating is different from game-to-game and it's the responsibility of the teams to adjust.

An example comes to mind from the Bates-Bowdoin series. It was the NCAA tourney in, I want to say, '98, and Bates had owned Bowdoin in the regular season behind an unbelievable player (MacCrave? MacCord? Something like that). She could steal the ball from anybody and was fast as the wind. In the NCAA game, the officials are calling it really tight, and the player gets a couple of quick reach-in fouls and is pretty much hampered the whole game. Bowdoin wins. Bates just never adjusted. Sometimes it's convenient to blame officials, but there is no rule that the fouls have to be even. You have to adapt.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: carolina on February 17, 2006, 04:44:32 PM
Feces
I can take the teasing. However, for the last time I am not blaming the refs!!!!!! I am simply saying the game would have been more exciting had they not tried to control the games themselves. Some officials are on power trips and try to control every aspect of the game. Just let the players decide the game. Never did I say the fouls had to be even but if you are going to call it one way for one team then call it the same way for the other team. All I ask is for consistency. On the other hand you are right, teams need to adjust but they should not have to play against the officials too, playing Bowdoin is tough enough without adding the stripes in the equation. I am not saying Williams would have won because anyone who watches their games knows that their foul shooting can be skeptical at times. I am just looking for consistency among all officials. If you want to call it tight do it both ways. If you want to let them play do it both ways. Thats all
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: D3Cast on February 18, 2006, 09:02:10 AM
Here's the webcast schedule for schools in the D3Cast network today:

NESCAC women's quarterfinals:
Colby @ Bates, 2 p.m. on BatesCast audio & video

Enjoy!

Steve Clay
D3Cast
http://www.d3cast.com

P.S. Look for D3Cast's announcement about the NESCAC men's and women's basketball championship weekend (semis and finals) on Monday...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on February 18, 2006, 05:02:05 PM
Bowdoin 52 Tufts 41
Bates 65 Colby 44
Williams 55 Amherst 39

those results are final so far. closer than predicted.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on February 18, 2006, 05:59:12 PM
Feces,

You were right, I got a little carried away with the scores.  (okay a lot carried away).  The teams were right and the margin of victory was approximately half of what I'd predicted just as you said.  I tip my cap on that one. 

The Bates/Colby matchup was extremely frightening as Meg Coffin got tackled, yes tackled, 3 times under the basket.  Colby really didn't have an answer for her.  Bate took a 4 pt. lead to half time very upset with their small lead.  The response:  shift it into high gear.  The bobcats did just that and pulled away from the white Mules to the tune of the afore mentioned score.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: carlweathers on February 20, 2006, 09:58:23 AM
Tackled?  That seems like a bit of an exaggeration.


Quote from: Red1 on February 18, 2006, 05:59:12 PM

The Bates/Colby matchup was extremely frightening as Meg Coffin got tackled, yes tackled, 3 times under the basket. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: D3Cast on February 21, 2006, 11:11:53 AM
D3Cast to Webcast NESCAC Basketball Championships

MARBLEHEAD, MA — The New England Small College Athletic Conference (NESCAC) and D3Cast (http://www.d3cast.com) of Marblehead, MA, announced today that all three games of the semi-finals and finals of both the 2006 NESCAC Men's and Women's Basketball tournaments will be webcast on D3Cast on February 25-26, 2006. Live video and audio are planned for all webcasts.

"We're thrilled to have the opportunity to bring these two high-profile championships to an eager live audience," said D3Cast president Steve Clay. "We recognize that in the past three years, one national champion, four national Final Four teams, and eight sectional finalists have participated in these two tournaments, and we're proud to be a part of that legacy.

"In the past three years of the two NESCAC tournaments themselves," said Clay, "six games in the semis or the finals have been decided by four points or less, and we expect that our audience will be treated to some exciting games this year, as well."

The schedule:

SATURDAY, FEBRUARY 25
2 p.m.: Men: Bates at Amherst
2 p.m.: Women: Williams at Bates
4 p.m.: Men: Tufts vs. Trinity (@Amherst)
4 p.m.: Women: Wesleyan vs. Bowdoin (@Bates)

SUNDAY, FEBRUARY 26
12 p.m.: Men: Championship (@Amherst)
12 p.m.: Women: Championship (@Bates)

For more info, contact sbc@d3cast.com.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 21, 2006, 08:22:40 PM
http://www.boston.com/news/local/maine/articles/2006/02/21/clean_water_activists_take_aim_at_androscoggin/

Above is a feel good story from today's Globe for all of those heading to Lewiston this weekend. Rumor has it the conference office is toying with the idea of selling t-shirts with the following slogan:

"My team made the NESCAC women's hoops tourney, but I'll I got were these lousy skin lesions and an irritable bowel."
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on February 21, 2006, 11:05:24 PM
As long as you don't actually go into the 'Scog or drink directly from it you'll be fine.  If you do either of those two things I suggest you find the nearest hospital, directions can be provided.

There's nothing better than Nescac championships in Lewiston.  You get to watch 3 basketball games and get 1 or 2 free saunas besides (depending on if you stay for the finals or not).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on February 23, 2006, 12:05:19 AM
For Senatorfrost,

Bates +3.5 Vs. Williams
Bowdoin -6.5  Vs. Wesleyan


Bates to win NESCAC championship outright 3:1
Bowdoin to win NESCAC championship outright  even money
Williams to win NESCAC championship outright  3:1
Wesleyan to win NESCAC championship outright  18:1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on February 23, 2006, 10:57:10 PM
Thank you Walzy. I know people like Bowdoin. I missed a mumber of games this year and have only seen Amherst and Williams. (I saw Wesleyan for a few minutes once at Wesleyan)  Anyway Bates has the home edge and with 3-1  I like them for 3 units

#1 Bates to win NESCAC-3 units

#2- Parlay =Bates over Ephs with Bates to win NESCAC-2 units
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 24, 2006, 01:39:05 AM
Playing in their own barn, it's tough not to put money on Bates at 3-1. However, I'll take even money and bet the Polar Bears for three units. I'll also put another two units each on Wesleyan and Bates to cover in the semis (especially with Bates getting 3.5 at home). And just because I like the payout, I'll put one unit on Wesleyan to win it all.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on February 25, 2006, 07:26:02 PM
Bates 71 - Williams 55 

A slightly bigger margin then I predicted.  Williams is the fastest team I've seen this year by far, and also the most physical.  It was the second one that hurt them because Bates spent too much time on the charity stripe.  Also, Williams missed the first shot of their 1-1 tries more times then I can count.  Colleen Hession surprised me.  She was taking 3s from 5 feet behind the arc.  Her pecentage was very low, and it's no wonder.  She needs to step in and take better shots.  Those long 3s didn't cut it and Bates rebounded just about all of them.  Those shots hurt her team. 

Maggie Miller definitely put on a shooting display this afternoon, but the player who impressed me the most was Ellen Wilk.  If the rest of the team played with intensity that she played with for the whole game (like she did) it could have been a very different outcome.  I'm not saying that Williams didn't work hard, but Ellen worked much harder then everyone else (on either team), and really made a lot of plays on both sides of the court.

Normally the best player on the winning team gets game mvp honors, but I'm going to make an exception.  Meg Coffin played an excellent game, and certainly put up solid numbers as usual, but I think Ellen Wilk was the best player out there today.  She did all the little, but very important, things that don't show up in the stats and kept Williams alive for as long as they were.  Without her on the court slowing the guards down and keeping Bates from setting their offense I think Bates just blows Williams away  Ellen Wilk gets game MVP.  (This is my opinion, it is not official).

Bowdon 61 - Wesleyan 46.

Wesleyan had a couple of good runs to keep it close, but in general their performance was rather lackluster.  Too often Bowdoin would knock the ball away and the Wesleyan players would stand their and watch expecting their teamates to get it, but no one went after it right away.  Bowdoin was able to grab way too many loose balls because of this. 

The other difference in the game was foul shooting.  Weslyan's foul shooting was downright awful.  They easily missed more fould shots then the difference in the score.  Every once in a while they'd have a good burst, draw some fouls, and get to the line.  Generally, a good strategy, but then they'd consistently miss both free throws and Bowdoin would take the momentum.

Eileen Flaherty absoulutely owned Wesleyan.  She owned their whole team regardless of who was guarding her.  This was a no-brainer.  Eileen Flaherty was the MVP of semi-final #2.  (This is not official)

Looking forward to the 4th consecutive Bates/Bowdoin Nescac championship game.  Let's go Bobcats!

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 25, 2006, 07:44:38 PM
Good recap, Red.

In terms of NCAA berths, I still think Williams is in rather comfortably, and Bates getting to the finals after what they did in the conference during the regular season should get them even if they don't win the tourney (I'm not savvy enough with the QOWI and all that stuff to break it down with the actual determing factors). Bowdoin is in, regardless of Sunday.

My instinct is Wesleyan won't make it, but who knows (especially after last year -- when I wrote them off, as well). I imagine they'll go up against some of the other UAA teams (NYU, Rochester) for an at-large, and they actually match-up pretty well there. It would be nice, but four from one conference, even if it's the best, might be too many. We'll see.

Tomorrow's game will be big for Bowdoin because if they win, they'll almost certainly get a home seed for the first weekend (assuming they don't get tossed out of region like they did last year). With UMF, Bowdoin, USM and Bates in, the state will be well represented.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: D3Cast on February 26, 2006, 08:10:49 AM
Just a reminder that the NESCAC final is on www.d3cast.com (audio and video) at 1 p.m. EST (change from the original noon start time, I think because Bates is coming back from break today, but I'd selfishly like to think it's to give more people a chance to watch both the men's and women's webcasts today  :)).

Hope you enjoyed yesterday's webcasts, and we'll do our best today to give you a great experience.

-steve
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Snowman on February 26, 2006, 02:08:20 PM
WELL LOOKS LIKE THE PARTY IS OVER FOR BATES........

SEE YA NEXT YEAR.......NEITHER TEAM LOOKED TO IMPRESSIVE SO FAR ..........
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Snowman on February 26, 2006, 02:33:03 PM
Think the BATES SUPERSTAR (????) center could hit a free throw
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on February 26, 2006, 03:03:38 PM
While free throw shooting may not be Meg's strength she has been consistently putting up the best overall numbers in the NESCAC, and she has a back injury to boot.  Having a Williams center foul her hard from behind yesterday certainly didn't help that.

Bowdoin 68-Bates 58.  Bates' home win streak ends at 23.  I've never seen a team shoot as hot as Bowdoin did in the second half today.  They couldn't miss, and the offense they poured on was just too much for the Bobcats today.  The officials let the game get completely out of control in the last minute. Sarah Barton was shoved into the scorers table, and some free throws had a slim chance of hope, but no call.  Then with 10sec. left and the game not mattering Eileen Flaherty was knocked to the floor.  Again, no call.  It was extremely lucky that no one was injured, and it would have been on the officials if someone had.

That said, Bates' season is probably not over yet, although Snowman would clearly like it to be.  They are one of the top contenders for a class C bid at this point.  An event that Snowman clearly fears, and he should.

On a last note Dr. Fagar says hi to everyone.  He's not posting this year, but I did meet him at the game today.  He wants everyone to know that he hasn't forgotten about the posting up board.

Cheers,
Red1

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Snowman on February 26, 2006, 04:32:47 PM
RED...stop crying.....Bates in or out they are not beating any good teams....they haven't thus far this year save one upset that was just corrected.....

Enough all of you NESCAC people love to bitch and moan so and so is hurt so and so has been hplaying with an injury and now "she's been playing with a bad back all year"...ENOUGH.....every team in the country has key people playing hurt.......it is not a factor you play with what you have and thats it.....its championship time...stop making excuses
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on February 26, 2006, 06:20:00 PM
Snowman,

Bates also beat Williams twice, and knocked Trinity (TX) out of the top 25.  That's 4 top 25 wins (yes Williams is in the top 25).  I don't see where 4 wins against top 25 teams would mean anything.

I don't see where crying comes in.  Bowdoin was the better team on the floor today, and I never said otherwise.  Coffin's put up the best numbers all year no matter how you look at, injurty or not, give her the props she's earned.

This is the NESCAC board, if you don't like the way we operate then GO AWAY and stop whining at us.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Snowman on February 26, 2006, 06:41:00 PM
Red, you elitist crybaby, face, Bates just isn't that good, neither is Bowdoin for that matter, but you guys ALWAY use the "injury" excuse....SUCK IT UP....you act like you teams are the only oonles with hurt players......Also, Wiliam's doesn't make it out of the 1st weekend they also are not that good....IT SURE HELPS WHEN YOUR LEAGUE MINIPLULATES THE SYSTEM BY ONLY PLAYING EACH TEAM IN THE CONFERENCE ONCE.....and don't even try to tell me that it is not a QOWI advantage....everyone know it is
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on February 26, 2006, 08:36:30 PM
Right, I'm an elitist crybaby, and that's why snowman feels the need to whine, snivel, and bully the nescac.  Am I missing something?  People say that bullying is a sign of insecurity with oneself.  Snowman, is there something you'd like to talk about?

I don't know what injury excuse snowman refers to.  I never said Bates lost because Coffin was injured.  In fact, I credited Bowdoin with being the better team today flat out.  I only said she put up the best numbers in the conference throughout the year, and I think she deserves mad props for that.  There's no excuse needed for being the best.  It appears that snowman has trouble admitting mistakes.  Instead of accepting that his statement that bates plays "no one" was incorrect he decided that a personal attack based on more incorrect information was the best way to deal with that.  I think this is unnecessary and inappropriate for this board.

I'm now completely done with this conversation.  I'll return when someone has a constructive topic to discuss in a civil manner (the normal way of the nescac board).

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Snowman on February 26, 2006, 08:58:23 PM
RED

Lets revisit the conf. manipulating the system to boost QOWI numbers......
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bearsonocow on February 26, 2006, 09:50:50 PM
Snowman,

Both Red and I apologize that you didn't get into a NESCAC school and that you have to work for a graduate of one.  It could be worse, you could be working for an Ivy League Grad like me.

But let's not add any trash to this board, let's focus on the numbers: Coffin leads the league in rebounding and is #2 in scoring, #2 in field goal percentage, # 3 in steals and #4 in blocked shots, not bad out of 8 categories.  She's likely to be first team and in contention for player of the year.  [ stats from this weekends NESCAC program]

Hey, even Labron James missed 7 consecutive free-throws just this past Friday night. [sportscenter is my source]

And when it comes to the NESCAC, let's not let QOWI numbers muddy the facts:
Bowdoin Women - a NESCAC school - made it to the final four 2 years ago.
Amherst Men have made it to the final four in the last two years.
And Williams Men won the National Championship in 2003, the first New England School to do so and then made it to the Championship game in 2004.

You should do your homework before you start trashing the league.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 26, 2006, 10:24:07 PM
It's true that most teams have players competing with injuries. Southern Maine, however, is unique in that it loses players for fudging work-study hours, trying to bilk the federal government out of grant money. Injuries just don't have the cachet as being a common criminal.

Unfortunately, this will no doubt be the first in a long line of nitwits and whiners if/when the NESCAC gets four teams in, as is projected. Just another example of the strength and vision of having a single-round robin tournament.

Looks like Loonin and Byrne had big second halves for the Polar Bears. Man, six-straight. Pretty impressive, especially at Alumni. Hats off to Bates for making a strong second half run into the tourney. I was worried there for a while...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on February 26, 2006, 10:28:15 PM
This just posted on the front page.  The Nescac did, in fact, get four schools into the  tournament.  Bowdoin (obviously), Bates, Williams, and to my pleasant surprise, Wesleyan (CT).

Just thougt everyone would want to know.

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on February 26, 2006, 10:34:54 PM
pemper over murphy when it matters...every time...
When are the Bates people going to figure this out?

Today's game involved two major adustments (cover weak side and go to the rack...both by Bowdoin). After Bates came out smokin' in the first 2:40 of the game...Bowdoin simply assessed, adjusted...and won going away.  Bates didn't even try to counter the Bowdoin adjustments...maybe because they don't know how?  
:P
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: usmhoops1 on February 26, 2006, 10:37:32 PM
Let the fun begin.  A little surprised that 4 NESCAC schools got in but all 4 are deserving and will all be tough outs in the tourney.  Even with Bates number of losses, still a team that nobody will be too fired up to play.
Some of these first rounds are going to be unreal.  Unless they ship some teams out, I count 12 New England teams in.
The 4 NESCACS, Salem, Norwich, USM, Colby Sawyer, Norwich, Springfield, Brandeis, MMA.  Just getting out of those regionals will be a chore.  Too bad they couldnt do what the D1's do and go Thursday/Saturday  and Friday/Sunday.  That way the real junkies could overdose on 4 days of hoops!!!  I know that cant happen for a host of reasons but wishful thinking!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on February 26, 2006, 10:49:47 PM
this is an outrage!!!  how could  Colby and Tufts not get in?
Doesn't that selection committee know they play in the NESCAC?! -- besides, they only lost a total of 25 games combined ---but they're NESCAC schools...doesn't that count for anything anymore?!   geeesh...the NESCAC gets hosed again.... ;)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 26, 2006, 10:50:54 PM
I think Amherst was on the bubble... :D
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on February 26, 2006, 11:02:03 PM
I think it's on the agenda for the next Conference of the Supreme Presidents of the NESCAC members.... a non-negotiable demand that ALL member institutions get an automatic bid to the NCAA tournament...with an accompanying rider that no NESCAC member should be required to play ANY conference games.  If demand is not met, NESCAC will close down Division III basketball altogether.   These non-NESCAC conferences just don't have the intellecual capacity to truly appreciate and comprehend how important the NESCAC is to the well-being of Division III athletics as a whole. ::)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on February 26, 2006, 11:47:24 PM
USMhoops,

I think you hit the nail on the head.  They will shipt some teams out.  Wesleyan will likely be in the mid-atlantic like last year, Norwich will likely join them in that horribly weak region, and I suspect Williams will be playing in the east region.  This leaves 9 teams to deal with, and I think that USM will get the bye.  It will be harder, however, to move 2 more teams than 1.  My prediction is that after their bye, USM will be playing in the east region (which is a little misleading because the games will most certainly be played in Gorham).  The remaining 8 teams will make up the New England bracket.   These are just my predictions.  I could very well be wrong, but I thought I'd give it a try.

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: usmhoops1 on February 26, 2006, 11:52:49 PM
Would not surprise me to see Wesleyan or Williams get shipped out as well.  That would leave 8 teams.  Just not sure how they would bracket them.  2 NESCAC's would have to be in the same bracket 1st weekend.  Maybe somebody getting a bye is possible or 3 sites in New England with some shuffling in Mass and CT with those teams.  The NCAA does not like to fly teams at this level if at all possible.  We shall see in the am. 

I will say that I think it was very smart to allow more time to bracket.  Guess the NCAA should get some credit occasionally!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on February 27, 2006, 01:13:50 AM
I have an idea:

The NESCAC's in a tournament versus the UAA for the NCAA championship!!...lol, congrats to the NESCAC for your 4 teams also
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: carolina on February 27, 2006, 12:18:14 PM
Snowman

Why are you even on this board. If you can't spell we have no use for you. You are a NESCAC hater so just leave. Congrats to all NESCAC schools and good luck.

As far as the Bates/Williams game:  If Williams could hit a foul shot it would have been a different game. In my opinion any team that can not hit from the charity stripe WILL NOT win a championship!!!!!  To the person who commented on Ellen Wilk---- She should be a started. No she is not a great offensive player but if you have someone like that on defense she does't need to play offense. That is why it is called a team game. Defense is what is going to win a championship....well that and foul shooting.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 27, 2006, 12:40:04 PM
Wesleyan vs. Muhlenberg (25-2) at Mary Washington
(winner gets MWC/TCNJ winner)

All of the teams in the bracket have impressive records, but at least the Cardinals didn't get the home team in the first round. I know nothing about the Centennial, so wouldn't even have an idea what Wes is in store for. They didn't look too inspired in the NESCAC semis, but then again, they didn't look too inspired in last year's NESCAC quarters before making a nice run (although against a seemingly weaker bracket).

Bates vs. Bridgewater (Va.) (20-6) at Mt. St. Mary's
(winner gets Mnt. St. Mary's/Baruch winner)

Bridgewater comes out of the ODAC, and its double-round robin schedule is so incestuous, it makes me glad the NESCAC has some variety. I think Bates advances. Mt. St. Mary's has an impressive record, but the Skyline conference looks a little dubious and, frankly, some of the teams in the conference look made-up. Since USM is playing the lamest first-round bracket I have ever seen, a rematch is likely (USM will be there, we'll see if Bates is).

Williams vs. NYU (18-7) at Messiah
(winner gets Messiah/Springfield winner)

NYU has lost five of its last six games, but clearly they play in a well-regarded conference with the UAA getting four in, while Williams has lost two of its last three. Not exactly a pair of streaking teams. I'm guessing this is a match-up of the fourth-best team from each conference. I'd say this is a toss-up, with the winner probably in for trouble against Messiah.

Colby-Sawyer (23-4) at Bowdoin
(winner gets Brandeis/Salem winner)

Bowdoin has already hung a 30-spot on CSC earlier this year in Brunswick, so it's tough to envision the Chargers closing the gap. Won't be 30, but likely a comfortable win. The Brandeis/Salem game could be a dandy. Brandeis is the favorite, but Salem always seem to play with a ton of confidence in the postseason (a testament to its coach) and the Vikings know they beat the best (see: Maine, Southern). That game was at home, however. Either way, the second game of the weekend will be excellent.

Wesleyan 65, Muhlenberg 61
Mary Washington 72, Wesleyan 55
Bates 66, Bridgewater 44
Bates 80, Mnt. St. Mary's 65
Williams 70, NYU 68
Messiah 75, Williams 59
Bowdoin 68, CSC 45
Brandeis 67, Salem 62
Bowdoin 66, Brandeis 58
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 27, 2006, 01:07:56 PM
From the Lewiston Sun Journal:

"If I were the NCAA committee, I wouldn't take us. We have eight losses," said Bates coach Jim Murphy. "If you look at how many teams have ever gotten in after losing eight games, I know it isn't many."

Looks like the Bobcats will be taking the loosey-goosey, just-happy-to-be-here approach to the NCAAs.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 01, 2006, 04:39:52 PM
2005-06 NESCAC Women's Basketball All-Conference

First Team   
C     Meg Coffin Bates Jr. Westford, Mass.
F Eileen Flaherty Bowdoin Jr. Fairfield, Conn.
F Maggie Miller Williams Jr. Wellesley, Mass.
F Justine Pouravelis Bowdoin Sr. Old Orchard Beach, Maine
F Hannah Stubbs Wesleyan Sr. Arlington, Va.
     
Second Team   
G Sarah Barton Bates So. Portsmouth, N.H.
G Colleen Hession Williams Sr. Northampton, Mass.
G Jessica Powers Tufts Sr. Massapequa, N.Y.
F Sarah Cox Trinity Jr. Norwell, Mass.
F Matia Kostakis Bates So. Andover, Mass.
F Meghan O'Malley Williams Jr. Topsfield, Mass.
     
Player of the Year   
F Meg Coffin Bates Jr. Westford, Mass.
     
Defensive Player of the Year     
F Justine Pouravelis Bowdoin Sr. Old Orchard Beach, Maine
     
Rookie of the Year   
G Ali Fourney Wesleyan Fr. East Northport, N.Y.
     
Coach of the Year   
Stefanie Pemper Bowdoin
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on March 01, 2006, 06:06:42 PM
Well deserved all around.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on March 02, 2006, 09:47:36 AM
Quote from: carolina on February 27, 2006, 12:18:14 PM
Defense is what is going to win a championship....well that and foul shooting.

Defense wins games. Rebounding wins championships....well that and foul shooting.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: carolina on March 03, 2006, 10:53:33 PM
Aweeee too bad Bates lost.  :'(   I didnt think Coffin deserved POY anyway. Congrats to Williams and Bowdoin!!! Good luck in the next round!!!!!! Atleast someone from Bowdoin should have gotten it since they did win the NESCAC tourny and if not Bowdoin then Williams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 05, 2006, 11:06:21 AM
Congrats to the Ephs on the upset.   Sounds like they shot the lights out from 3 all weekend.  They'll have to do the same to pull two more wins and earn a trip to a practical home-game at Springfield.  Looks like they are bigger than their next opponent, so hopefully the inside game can carry them.  I think it's 50/50 to get to the elite 8, where they would be a huge underdog -- but they did beat Scranton last year, so they won't lack for confidence!  Good luck to the Ephs ...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: goubears89 on March 05, 2006, 11:33:06 AM
What do folks think will be the likely venue for the upper left bracket? In the women's preview, it's noted that technically, it's Atlantic's turn, but that Mary Washington is ineligible to host. So, do you have it in Maine at Southern Maine or Bowdoin, or at Bridgewater? Any pundits have any likely scenarios?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: usmhoops1 on March 05, 2006, 01:10:32 PM
** Newsflash**

Looks like USM will host according to a post from Pat Coleman.  No other details.  Should be an incredible atmosphere for basketball again in Maine.  USM/Bridgewater  and Bowdoin/Mary Washington.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 05, 2006, 03:54:43 PM
Southern Maine's selection is predictable, and, from my point of view, the appropriate selection as I am a firm believer a team she be rewarded for a season's success. I'm sure the Polar Bears are looking forward to the challenge because, as we all know, a Final Four berth was locked if the regional was at Bowdoin.

The selection of USM does makes me feel for Bridgewater and Mary Washington. Instead visiting Brunswick, one of the jewels of New England, with its majestic pines, soft sea breezes and pastoral landscapes, they will be forced to visit Gorham, an oozing and slightly infected pimple on the face of Maine.

The USM campus is a big enough blight to the area, but the amenities in Cancer Valley are not exactly geared for visitors -- especially our good friends from the Confederacy. Perhaps the Gorham Chamber of Commerce can request the paper mills in Westbrook be fired up over the weekend so the fans of Mary Washington and Bridgewater can get a life-like feel of the existence in the armpit of Maine. I would suggest all visitors of this regional stay in Freeport or Yarmouth -- this would ensure a pleasant stay and no risk of growing a third arm in a couple of years.

The good news is the regional will certainly be well-staffed with all the bonus hours available to students.

Cheers to Williams for bringing down a couple of windbags, especially on the road. Jeers to Bates for pulling defeat from the jaws of victory.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 09, 2006, 08:00:01 PM
D3hoopsNet, under contract from NCAAsports.com, will be broadcasting the entire Southern Maine sectional. Coverage starts a half-hour before tipoff and includes a preview of all four sectionals, plus in-game "live look-ins" at other sectionals in progress.

Mark Simon on the call.

http://www.d3hoops.com/audio/
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 10, 2006, 10:50:23 PM
Another huge upset for the Bowdoin women tonight. It looked like the Polar Bears might get run out of the gym early, but Flaherty was unbelievable. The Cinderella story continues tomorrow against USM. If Bowdoin beats the Huskies, it would eclipse the 1980 USA hockey win as the greatest upset in the history of team sport.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on March 11, 2006, 01:06:14 PM
not sure the PBears' season can be a "cinderella story"...it was, afterall, their 5th straight trip to the sweet 16 and 5th straight NESCAC title.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bbald eagle on March 11, 2006, 01:12:31 PM
they had lots of help from three fairy godmothers in stripes  ::)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 11, 2006, 01:46:30 PM
Ah, yes. The siren song of the sore loser: blame the officiating.

I'll let Bowdoin's head coach sum it up for tearful Mary Washington fans, per the Portland Press Herald:

"I thought it was very similar to NCAA games we've played before in terms of physical play. I think with their style, they do a lot of perimeter stuff and we do a lot of inside stuff."

Inside play is where you get fouled, not taking jumpshots. The two teams who beat Bowdoin this year had consistent inside play (and took more foul shots than Bowdoin).

Sure, Hickey got a couple of quick fouls, but she ended with two fouls. Her playing only 11 minutes is purely a coaching decision, so if you can't handle the fact you were beat and need to point fingers, blame her. Flaherty, who dominated, only had four of her 29 points from the foul line. Might want to try and guard the opposition's best player, don't ya think? Or perhaps grab a defensive rebound?

Bowdoin's best player: 29 points, 10 rebounds
MW's best player: 3 points, eight rebounds, six turnovers

Damn those officials!

Normally I'd congratulate the play of the opposition and leave it at that, but since MW fans can't give credit where credit is due, I'll let them know why they lost: just too soft.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: fairmont1113 on March 11, 2006, 05:09:32 PM
I am Bridgewater (Va) fan, but was also at the Mary Wash v. Bowdoin game. I did not think it was the best officiating I have ever seen, but at least it was consistent both ways. I also do not think a team that is ranked #5 in the nation on the d3hoops website, only has two losses on the season, and is the NESCAC champion can even be put in the consideration to be called a "cinderella story".  I am saying that as a compliment to Bowdoin. They looked like a very good team to me, and I think they have a good chance to knock USM off tonight. So, cinderella story? NO. Very good team with a good chance of making it to the final four? YES.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bbald eagle on March 11, 2006, 05:26:07 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on March 11, 2006, 01:46:30 PM
Ah, yes. The siren song of the sore loser: blame the officiating.

I'll let Bowdoin's head coach sum it up for tearful Mary Washington fans, per the Portland Press Herald:

"I thought it was very similar to NCAA games we've played before in terms of physical play. I think with their style, they do a lot of perimeter stuff and we do a lot of inside stuff."


selective editing, mr. feces

add this from the Bowdoin coach from the same article:

"it seemed odd that Bowdoin shot 27 free throws (making 18) to Mary Washington's six (5 successful). ... 'I am really surprised by the disparity," Bowdoin's Pemper said as she perused the stat sheet."

And this, from the same paper: "on a court 45 miles from Brunswick, where she (Pourvalis) and Flaherty and their teammates actually felt at home. 'It was nice,' said Pemper, 'not having to play USM for once on this court.' She looked at the media listening to her candor ... 'I don't really want to see that at the top of your story.'"
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: carolina on March 11, 2006, 11:32:14 PM
Feces, you crack me up!!!!! Love you posts.....However I know how people feel as far as officiating..remember the Bowdoin/Williams game.  Bowdion made 30 0f 33 foul shots to Williams 6 foul shots...but Bowdoin is a very good team and teams have to adapt to the way the officials are calling the game...So quit crying Bowdoin won!!!!!! I am sure there has been times BBALD EAGLE that your time was on the better end of some calles from the officials. Every team has their turn.  Congrats to the Ephs on a great season!!!!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops and the rankings
Post by: tothehole on March 21, 2006, 07:48:56 PM
"There are 25 voters on each panel -- three from each of the NCAA's eight regions with myself as the 25th voter. The voters are coaches, Sports Information Directors and media members.

We do not reveal individual voters' names because we do not want them subject to lobbying and backlash from coaches and fans of teams. This is something we have experienced in voting for other polls. "

After looking at the final rankings what were they smoking this weekend
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 21, 2006, 08:48:44 PM
Regarding what?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 23, 2006, 03:22:02 AM
As much as it pains me to say, the final poll looks pretty fair. Nice work.

Crikey, how good was Hope? They did it against all the heavyweights. Good for them. Hmm, but I wonder if D3hoops.com will be able to crow about how aptly they were ranked in the future...(15th preseason? You're slipping...) :P
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: usmhoops1 on March 23, 2006, 04:29:31 PM
Hope was very good.  The hard thing about the polls is there is such limited crossover that it is hard to know who really are the top teams.
I was at the games in Springfield and thought that Hope was the best team.  It would have taken an outstanding game from USM to pull it off and that did not happen.  There were possessions in the first half when the Huskies were in the lead that they did not open up that lead.
All in all a fabulous atmosphere.  I will be in attendance next year regardless of who is there.  D3 womens hoops at its best!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops Rankings
Post by: tothehole on March 25, 2006, 11:50:16 PM
There are 25 voters on each panel -- three from each of the NCAA's eight regions with myself as the 25th voter. The voters are coaches, Sports Information Directors and media members.

We do not reveal individual voters' names because we do not want them subject to lobbying and backlash from coaches and fans of teams. This is something we have experienced in voting for other polls.

I guess they( the voters) go some it right. Number 1,2,3.... That was it #4 Did they get to the final 4 they lost and went up.
Maybe Amherst should be @#1 with that logic. It doesnt end there  Mr C., just tell the folks how many teams that lost inthe opening round of 64 got to the top 25 , second round  of 32 are in the top 25 and 16 and so on and so on. Rochester in the sweet 16 ranked 19 Williams who beat Messiah unbeaten at home for 2 years 17 Messiah 16.
I can go on and on it comes down to this the SIDS and Media s---s who voted for the loosers to get higher ranking forget that the season is for seeding and the tourney is for the gold. The voters in one breath rank Hope 1 but disrespect virtually all the other teams. Now the ladies at Messiah should get points for their sportmanship which should be lauded but they got beaten on their home court?  Most of this final poll is the same s---t that we see in D1 where the Dukes Tenn Uconns get ranking based on rep and $. Hey did anybody tell the voters that Hardin-Simmons was fourth? The SIDS and media can feed us this s--t but we and the players dont have to take it any more. Coach Parcells often says you" are what your record is " and these ladies and coaches should be lauded for their body of work in the touney.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 26, 2006, 03:54:24 AM
The NESCAC board requires a modicum of intelligence -- or at least something other than an incomprehensible stream of consciousness -- to be taken seriously. I suggest you visit one of the Southern or Midwest boards to air this type of drivel. They are used to it.

While we here in the NESCAC enjoy a good rant, cogency is mandated. In addition, the bleeped out swear words are a bit much. While they may be useful to the other regions and conferences, and perhaps received with some applause, they are substandard here.

USMhoops, I'm not sure if your attachment to USM has expired this season, but I'd be curious to get your take on the State of the Huskies for next year. Logic would say that Bowdoin would be the third best team in the NESCAC next year with what Bates and Williams has returning. It's hard to believe that USM would be threatened in the LEC, but are they a semifinals team again next year? The first team to end Bowdoin's home streak would seem to be USM. Thoughts?

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 26, 2006, 10:41:26 AM
Hardin-Simmons finished fourth in the tournament, sure, but what did they do in the regular season? Are we to throw that out entirely? Doubt it.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on March 26, 2006, 12:36:25 PM
So if H-S finished first you vote them what 3rd? because of their season? The season is the tourney for those who make it.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 26, 2006, 01:15:17 PM
No, of course if Hardin-Simmons beats all comers then they win the title. But they didn't beat all comers, they didn't play the national champ, and they didn't beat any of the teams in Springfield.

Remember, this isn't Division I. Not all roads to the Final Four are created equal. Hardin-Simmons proved it was better than McMurry, Howard Payne, Randolph-Macon and Pacific Lutheran. I think you'll find that HSU is ranked ahead of all of those teams, accordingly.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on March 26, 2006, 01:49:52 PM
Right, this isnt d1 football either you're not taking the top 2 teams for the national title based on season records. Maybe you should, if season records mean so much.The teams have to earn it on the floor and very often at someones elses home court.  The regular season spiff is your seeding, the final ranking is for you perfomance in the tourney and your preseason poll is for all the reps. Williams 17 beat Messiah 16th HS lost in the final 4 Bowdoin in the eilte 8 HS 7 Bowdoin 4th previously ranked 5th went up with a loss mmmmmmmmmmmm so expain that. Bottom line is that you believe that the only school that gets respect in the tourney is the winner and the rest is left to ranglings of the sids egos. Players and coaches be damned.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 26, 2006, 02:48:39 PM
Hey, I agree with you on Williams/Messiah. That wasn't the way I voted and I was disappointed with that result, though remember they came from 14 spots apart to meet at that point.

Bowdoin went up with a loss? Pardon me but I believe they won three games in the tournament as well, including two against Top 15 teams. Then they lost to then-No. 1, now-No. 2 Southern Maine.

At least, I think that's what you're complaining about. Your posts are really hard to get through with the optional punctuation. Let me know if that's not what you're griping about.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 26, 2006, 02:51:23 PM
Quote from: tothehole on March 26, 2006, 01:49:52 PM
Bottom line is that you believe that the only school that gets respect in the tourney is the winner and the rest is left to ranglings of the sids egos. Players and coaches be damned.

Don't try to tell me what I believe, thanks. You have no idea. Everyone's tournament performance counts for something. But I laid out my points already and if you don't like them, I'm sorry. That's the way it's always been.

BTW, SIDs make up just less than one-third of the panel. I don't know if their egos are involved but I would be very surprised if they were.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: usmhoops1 on March 26, 2006, 10:26:50 PM
Feces Monkey:

I will continue to follow the huskies. 

On to next year.  I know of 3 freshman that plan on attending.  1 outstanding pt guard and 2 combo/off guards, small forwards.  All very good athletes.  All 3 from Maine.  1 took her freshman  year off from playing hoops and just studied.  She missed it tremendously and should be a help next year.  Either Welch  or Samuelson will need to improve as a presence in the post, which both are capable of.   Never know who else might show up or transfer but the 3 that will be there will help. 

They will miss all 3 seniors.  Both Myles and Frost will be hard to replace.  Donna Cowing will be very difficult to replace as well.  She made so many plays that the boxscore  never shows. Whether they are at the level they were this year remains to be seen.  I am sure they will be very competitive.
ONLY 7 MONTHS till practice starts again!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 29, 2006, 02:05:00 AM
USMhoops1,

In rereading my previous post, I fear I may have been too obtuse. My comment about your attachment to USM was not meant to imply you were a bandwagoner, but rather you may have had a daughter/relation/friend on the team who may be graduating, thus diminishing your interest. Unimportant, either way.

As an opposing fan, watching USM is truly frustrating because of their consistent success, even when it seems assured they will drop off with players graduating. This is a testament not only to Fifield, but also to the state of Maine, which continues to stock the program. You look at the in-state talent that has gone through the "Big Three" (USM, Bowdoin, Bates) the last 5-10 years, I'd put them up against any DIII state. Not bad for a such a small population. Fifield's been doing it for 20 years, so you've gotta assume 20+ wins and a home seed in the playoffs. I think the state is up for grabs next year, with UMF and MMA returning some key players and the natural improvement of Colby.

I must say, I find it humorous that when a raving lunatic comes on this board barely able to string a couple of sentences together, the administrator chimes in four of the last seven posts. When I try to have a logical conversation about topics worthy of discussion....(crickets chirping)....silence. "Karmic"  justice, I suppose. Or it just doesn't pay to have a rational dicussion. Oh, well. I'll get over it.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: goubears89 on March 29, 2006, 08:48:39 AM
Any word on recruits for NESCAC for next year? And what about Southern Maine or elsewhere in the Northeast Region? What have folks heard?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: goubears89 on November 07, 2006, 10:48:28 AM
Hey where are the preseason pronostications? Rookies to watch? Returning gems? Mysterious transfers to Lewiston? Brilliant strategy in Brunswick? Not living in New England anymore and missing my NESCAC women's hoops talk!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on November 07, 2006, 01:12:33 PM
                                                       

                                                       
rumor is that things are not looking good up in lewiston for bates - meg coffin suffered a season ending knee injury in soccer and one of their starting guards that transfered in last year has left the school (perhaps to transfer elsewhere???). with this news, my preseason nods go to bowdoin and williams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on November 08, 2006, 09:06:56 PM
if meg has a "season-ending" injury, why would they use a roster spot on her?

if it is that serious though, some of these new girls better be ready to step in right away for bates to be able to do anything...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on November 08, 2006, 09:56:36 PM
"Bates' optimism was tempered dramatically when Coffin, also a soccer All-American, hurt her knee in October. The injury may require season-ending surgery, although Bates sports information director Andy Walter said Saturday that Coffin has considered wearing a brace that might allow her to play."

So best case she'll likely be pretty limited.  With that, Bowdoin is the clear favorite, and Williams the clear number two, as each lost one key player but have plenty of depth returning. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on November 08, 2006, 10:24:15 PM
that certainly is bad news for the folks in lewiston....get well meg!

anyone have any info about any of the new names to the bates roster?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on November 19, 2006, 07:15:05 PM
Bates has two freshman that have looked strong out of the gate.  Lauren Yarnofsky, a 6-0 forward (possible move to full time center to replace Meg?) has gotten quite a bit of playing time and shown decent numbers.  Teal Carroll, 5-9 forward has also seen some pretty good court time and looks solid from behind the arc.

Especially impressive is Val Beckwith's ability to step it up and take charge so far this year.  A lot of players are going to need to step up and have strong seasons if the Bobcats are going to be successful without Meg.

http://www.bates.edu/x152241.xml

This is Bates' team roster.  Note that Meg Coffin is no longer listed.  Her knee injury is too severe for any kind of athleticism.

Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on November 19, 2006, 09:19:02 PM
went to the Bates-Babson game today...I think they could be a fun, if inconsistent, team this year. very young--at one point, katie franklin and four freshmen were in at once. yanofsky really impressed me--looks to be an excellent shot blocker/rebounder and has a pretty good looking jumper as well...she looks a little timid, like val did this time last year, but I have very high hopes for her. Kellie Goodridge also looked great when in, but she was in foul trouble. Val is making the best of the defensive focus being on Matia--I think Val's improvement from when I last saw her is outstanding, she was much more confident and aggressive around the basket. Sarah Barton is Sarah Barton--fantastic. I don't know if the team will come together to be in the class they've been in the last few years (or really most of the time under Murphy), but I was very encouraged by the frosh and would say that even if this year isn't as strong as usual, it will be building the team together for the coming few years.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: usmhoops1 on November 19, 2006, 11:48:17 PM
I had just heard about Coffins injury.  I am sure I speak for everyone that we feel  bad for her not being able to play.  One gets such a short time to play and to have an injury that keeps you out like this is sad.  She is such a fun player to watch.

Bates vs USM on Tuesday at Bates.  I will bring some shorts and a tank top as I am sure the gym will feel like Texas in July!!  Always hot.  Anyone  going to be in attendance?  Should be a good one  as always.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on November 20, 2006, 01:08:39 AM
I think that this is going to be a nail-bighter to end.  My prediction, in the spirit of elections on CNN is "too close to call."  Ashley Marble is a force to be reckoned with, and the person who has the best chance to stop her is injured.  On the other hand I see that USM is drawing a lot of fouls and making a lot of foul shots (enough for it to make the difference in their game against UMF).  Meg wasn't exactly known for staying out of foul trouble which will be extremely important for everyone if Bates is going to stay close to USM.  Even though Coffin is injured the bobcats have been rebounding well, and USM has not had a particulary large advantage on the boards.  They are especially short on offensive boards.  If Bates can find an inside presence against USM (which is extraordinarly hard to do) then USM will have their work cut out for them.  Besides, the best time to pull off a big upset is at the very beginning of the season when teams are still a little rusty.

Alumni gym will be relatively empty on Tuesday as nearly all of the students have left for break.  I will be there, and I suspect other faculty and staff will be there, but that's still not much without the students.  It wouldn't be right if Alumni gym wasn't unbearably hot, although Texas in July doesn't really account for the high humidity level that is also present.

Looking forward to an excellent double header.

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: usmhoops1 on November 24, 2006, 02:37:09 PM
As predicted,  the gym was very warm at Bates.  Both teams were just about as warm shooting.  Bates in the upper 40's and USM in the 50's  as far as fg%.

Now the Bowdoin -USM  game this Tuesday.  Again should be another great night of hoops in the great state of Maine.  Any thoughts, predictions, etc.??
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on November 27, 2006, 12:44:54 PM
Assuming UMF and Bates are as solid as last year (which may be a stretch), one would think USM will be better prepared heading into Tuesday. Bowdoin's non-conference schedule has been Brandeis-esque so far. Playing in Brunswick obviously has its advantages for the the Polar Bears.

I'd probably go Huskies by three.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on November 27, 2006, 08:35:24 PM
Bowdoin Polar Bears in overtime  :o
The Officials will call a tough game, The Bowdoin Fans will make the difference.  ::)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on November 29, 2006, 02:46:26 PM
Time will tell how good this win was, but I have to wonder about USM's strength if Bowdoin can hang a 15-spot on them with the Polar Bears missing one of its best players (Loonin, who, according the Portland Press Herald, has a 'twisted ankle'). Maybe it was just one of those nights. The rebounding numbers were impressive as USM is always a good team in that respect. Shooting 21 three pointers without Loonin is odd.

Since that juggernaut Mary Washington team is not on the schedule, Bowdoin should get through New Year's unscathed...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on November 29, 2006, 03:13:21 PM
Plain an simple - The winner last night was:

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.bowdoin.edu%2Fincludes%2Fglobal_new%2Fimages%2Fbear-rightcolumn.gif&hash=d625edf3cea049e58f17f5cf188f93e16178a5fb)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: LUMAN80 on November 29, 2006, 05:25:59 PM
thanks for the pictures in case any of us needed optical enhancement :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on November 30, 2006, 10:05:10 PM
Bates win over Husson, Sarah Barton has school record 18 assists, 9 turnovers. What's the over-under on no-look passes thrown? 47?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on November 30, 2006, 10:43:10 PM
What's the over/under on Husson players who actually know what rim they're shooting at? 3?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on December 11, 2006, 04:00:09 PM
i also can't help but notice her assist/turnover ratio - for every no look pass there is one that follows that ends up in the 3rd row of the bleachers.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on December 15, 2006, 03:27:44 PM
Barton is an excellent player, and will rightfully earn league honors again, but there is less margin of error for Bates this year (for obvious reasons), and she needs to be more efficient with the ball. Losing to Norwich once can be chalked up to a couple of bounces. A second loss is disturbing, with or without Coffin.

Looking forward to seeing Tufts this year. The 20-point win over Salem State has me intrigued (especially since the Lady Vikes beat Williams earlier). Maybe the Jumbos will be the first team to stay within 14 of Bowdoin, although I think the Polar Bears will be tested by Emmanuel.

I'm a Polar Bear fan, but how is Hope not the No. 1 team in the country?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on December 15, 2006, 03:38:33 PM
ASSIST/TURNOVER RATIO (Min. 3.0 assists/game)
## Player-Team               Cl  G Asst   Avg Turn   Avg  Ratio
---------------------------------------------------------------
1.Katie Cummings-BOW....... SR  8   40   5.0   12   1.5   3.33
2.Kaylan Tildsley-WIL...... SR 10   42   4.2   15   1.5   2.80
3.Julia Loonin-BOW......... SR  7   24   3.4   11   1.6   2.18
4.Shaina Pollack-AMH....... JR  9   43   4.8   21   2.3   2.05
5.Sarah Barton-BAT......... JR  8   70   8.8   36   4.5   1.94

katie cummings with 5 assists and a 3.33 ratio isn't too bad herself and has 24 less turnovers that barton, granted she has 30 less assists. but still, i think barton needs to handle the ball better.

as for hope vs/ bowdoin, i agree with you that i think hope should be #1 albeit by a very close margin. i think neither teams with the exception of 1 top ten win for each in baldwin wallace and southern maine has had too tough a schedule. however, hope has only played 6 and bowdoin has played 8 and southern maine is slightly better this year thatn baldwing wallace and traditionally better then baldwin walllace. if hope beats wash u (who they play right after xmas) i think those teams will flip-flop #1 and #2 again.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on December 17, 2006, 10:13:55 AM
personally, i think sarah is the special kind of player where you can overlook the mistakes. from the fan's standpoint, she's fun to watch; from a plain basketball standpoint, she's extremely important to the team. she doesn't necessarily have the tools of the prototypical point guard, but she knows her game and maximizes it, and other teams have to change their entire defensive strategy when she's out there (there's a reason when murphy pulls her it's usually only for about 30 seconds to settle her down). i don't know that stats back it up, but when it all comes down to it i want her running my team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on December 18, 2006, 11:09:27 AM
Quote from: whoarewebobcats on December 17, 2006, 10:13:55 AM
personally, i think sarah is the special kind of player where you can overlook the mistakes.

For me, Coffin fell into this category. Being the primarily ball-handler magnifies Barton's mistakes. Again, still an excellent player.

Interesting numbers, NH, I had not seen those before. Cummings has been overlooked on those Bowdoin teams (and still is to some degree) but has been consistent, although not flashy (as Loonin sometimes is).

As for the rankings, barring a loss by either team, Bowdoin will hemorrhage votes until Hope overtakes them, probably sometime in mid-January (about three months too late). Then, because its loss came early in the season and was not indicative of its "current status," USM will leapfrog Bowdoin a short time later (about two months too early). Thank goodness for the WBCA.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 20, 2006, 01:56:57 AM
Guess we'll find out.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on December 21, 2006, 08:17:50 AM
From the D3hoops.com front page:

"No. 1 on the women's side fared better, as Hope won its 38th consecutive game and improved to 3-0 in the MIAA with a 68-56 win against Albion."

Well, Pat, it seems you've taken the suspense out of it. Or have you gone with the WBCA poll, too?

Yikes.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 21, 2006, 12:22:14 PM
Nope, just to mess with your head.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on December 24, 2006, 07:31:40 PM
Only Losers Post On Christmas Eve   ::)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on December 27, 2006, 01:01:33 PM
Things are so bad for Mary Washington that its fans have resorted to self-loathing on the NESCAC board. I'm sure there's a bottle of cooking sherry in the pantry you can crack open and ease the pain.

Actually, there should be some self-loathing after losing to York. Is that even an accredited academic institution? Frankly, it sounds made up.

Keep your head up, slugger.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on December 28, 2006, 12:31:51 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on December 27, 2006, 01:01:33 PM
Keep your head up, slugger.

Actually I am a displaced Bowdoin Fan   :-*
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on December 28, 2006, 02:55:18 PM
No seats left on the bandwagon. Move along.

Maybe Frostburg State has an opening...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on December 28, 2006, 05:27:22 PM
Moving along only requires a few key strokes   ::)  Frostburg State should prove to be an interesting trip, best of all to both teams.

Tell me Monkey are you one of those colorful lads that stands at the far corner of Morrell Gymnasium attempting to unnerve opposing women basketball players who come to enjoy the game? Do you dress like your picture?  :o

I have never been to Frostburg State, I have been in Morrell Gym many a time though  :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on December 28, 2006, 06:58:39 PM
I have been known to wear fur, but it's strictly 100 percent chinchilla, with a tangerine scarf as an accent. I leave the simian outfits to those attending the safety school over in Lewiston.

The players provide my entertainment in Morrell, and I allow the more outgoing types to provide the sideshow. Perhaps I can handle my liquor a little better.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on December 31, 2006, 12:48:22 PM
predicted nescac standings.....

1. bowdoin
2. williams
3/4. tufts/bates... i think this one is a toss up
5. middlebury
6. amherst
7. wesleyan
8. trinity
9. colby
10. conn
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 01, 2007, 03:49:35 PM
Excellent. Back to hoops.

My predictions as conference play draws near:

1. Bowdoin - I thought this team would struggle early and maybe find momentum down the stretch. Hopefully it'll play Norwich on Thursday as the Lady Cadets (?) are obviously a strong team and should be receiving votes. Same with Emmanuel. Things are changing in the GNAC, evidently. If they win both, the PBears will likely finish with only one or two losses.

2. Williams - Salem State loss is looking worse and worse, but a ton of talent. Not the favorite any more (I would have thought so heading in), but could change that on the 12th.

3. Wesleyan - Two losses to Emmanuel, and we'll see how legit those are when Bowdoin plays the Saints on the 6th. Not sure how good those midwest teams were.

4. Bates - Jim Murphy is the second best coach in the conference. It's a shame about Coffin, as Bobcats are a Top 10 team with her from my view.

5. Tufts - Would have been a lot higher had they not lost to WPI. Reasoning: Bowdoin beat RPI by 50; RPI beat WPI by one; WPI beats Tufts by six. (And, yes, I know comparative scores mean nothing). Salem State win has lost its cachet.

6. Middlebury - Racking up a decent record against Sister's of the Poor, but don't have enough to be a threat. Middlebury is a hockey school, but this program used to be really good (and should be).

7. Amherst - At the advent of the NESCAC tourney ('01), Amherst was the team to beat. The Lady Jeffs seemed to be back on course a couple of years ago, and then Kostakis transferred and it has been tough sledding.

8. With the current climate, Polar Bears are now officially an endangered species, but as long as the Chickens are still around, Bowdoin will get to the second round of the conference tourney. Another team that used to be really good (and should be better).

9. Conn. College - The Lady Camels are improving, but still a ways off. Date against Colby could be game of the year.

10. Trish O'Brien (current coach at MIT) should give back her last two year's salary to Colby for the hatchet job she did on this program.

Conference is down as a whole, but should get three teams in (Bowdoin, Williams & Wesleyan). Bates would need a conference title to get in, which is not out of the question.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on January 02, 2007, 10:41:44 AM
Considering that Tufts would be ranked at #5 in the NESCAC without their leading scorer and rebounder in #30 Khalilah Ummah-- who is a key reserve off the bench--, I would think that once Khalilah Ummah recovers fully from an injury that she sustained in the winter break (the injury probably occurred in a Tufts practice over the past few weeks), the Jumbos will once again be a tougher team to be reckoned with.

I saw Tufts on Saturday at the WPI Invitational when they played Plattsburgh State and immediately noticed something was up when Ummah did not come off the bench in the first half.  Ummah did not play against Plattsburgh and tried to play against WPI on Sunday, but was only on the court for about a minute, so it is safe to assume that she has not yet fully recovered to full strength.  The missing 13 points per game and 8.1 rebounds per game provided by Ummah off the bench were clearly felt by the Jumbos over the weekend.  Tufts had 43 rebounds against Plattsburgh on Saturday, and got outrebounded by WPI, 36 to 32, on Sunday.  Tufts came into the WPI Invitational averaging 46 rebounds a game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 04, 2007, 11:26:10 AM
I was hoping that Norwich would give the Polar Bears a test, but all the Lady Cadets managed to do was set the game back to 1979. Frightening to believe that team beat Bates twice. Norwich only lost by the same amount as USM, so they have that feather in their cap, as Bowdoin continues its search for a team that can stay within 14 points.

Emmanuel should provide a stiffer test, especially in their gym. Polar Bears embarking on 5-game/8-day journey, as well as a 4-game/5-day run. My guess is they'll pick up a loss in that stretch.

Tufts hung around with Brandeis for a half, but sent the Judgettes to the line 21 times in the second, sealing the loss.

Williams beats Bates, setting up the big game in Brunswick on the 12th. The Bobcats may struggle to get a home seed in the conference tourney at this point.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 04, 2007, 01:14:20 PM
1. Packing in a zone and praying for an off shooting night does not consitute a "defensive powerhouse." It constitutes an overmatched team hoping to stay close enough so it looks respectable in the paper the next morning (which it didn't). Just be thankful the game was on a neutral court, because if the two teams meet again it's going to be in Brunswick. Norwich might not crack double-digits.

2.
Quote from: D3Ballin on January 04, 2007, 12:46:16 PM
And I'm not one to blame the refs for games, but once the 2nd half came around it appeared to almost all in attendance that Pemper was paying the refs in her favor, Norwich was getting absolutely HAMMERED underneath and the refs would not blow the whistle against the Polar Bears, but were more than willing to blow it against the Cadets. With more than two minutes remaining Norwich was down by 7 and at that point whether they meant to or not, the refs helped them in 'resorting' to fouling and the Bears capitalized on their free throws pushing their lead to 14.

Due to the comical nature of this post, it deserves a redux. Thank goodness you're "not one to blame the refs." As a Polar Bear fan, I've already come to grips with the fact that over the past five years, the 145 Bowdoin wins are due to unfair officiating. And the 12 losses were when the refs finally decided to leave their bias at home. Ballin, you should hop on the CAC board and bond with the Mary Washington fans, who also suffer from the same form of dementia.

3. Hey, best of luck to Norwich. Now that they have been scalped, every win for them is now a win for Bowdoin
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on January 04, 2007, 01:53:28 PM
                                                       

                                                       
that's priceless, feces! nice work.

dballin (i.e. caitlyn bailey #14, norwich women's basketball) your team is good and in my opinion is one of the better teams in NE. that being said, bowdoin would beat you 99 times out of 100. if you two were to play again, the outcome would be the same. bowdoin has had a lot of close games over the years and find a way to win pretty much all of them (except 12 over the past 5 years). the norwhich game was no different - bowdoin is at the top every year and walk into every game with a HUGE target on their back with every opponent being up to play one of the best. think of last night and how pumped/excited/giddy/etc. you and your team was to face the #1 ranked team in the nation and to get a chance to knock them off. imagine having to play those opponents EVERY time you stepped on the floor and your team might have more than one loss and perhaps, a few closer games too.
lastly, while you "don't like to blame refs", do you think that your opinion is somehow "tainted" given you played in the game and ended up on the losing end? did you read the boxscore to see that the fouls were 16-16? and that was after you intentionally fouled at the end of the game, thus bowdoin was called for more than norwich.

moving along. what a big week for my alma mader's women's basketball team. williams faces amherst as part of one of the best rivalries in college sports. throw out the records, they don't mean a lot in this game....though, williams has won the last 13 meetings i believe. i know the ephs will not be looking ahead to bowdoin with this game in front of them but i think the game in brunswick next weekend will pose the biggest threat to bowdoin's untainted record, #1 ranking, and 83475683745687 home win streak b/c not only do i believe the ephs to be the 2nd best team in the nescac but i think they are catching bowdoin at a good time with them having played 5 games in 8 days before meeting the ephs. i am not necessarily predicting a williams win, but i think they have a good shot, especially given the circumstances. we'll see.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on January 06, 2007, 03:05:31 PM
No P-Bear loss to Emmanuel:

Bowdoin 67 Emmanuel 58
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on January 06, 2007, 05:14:27 PM
Good going P-Bears!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 06, 2007, 07:21:51 PM
The Emmanual game will likely be viewed as just another win over an unranked opponent, but I think it's the most impressive win of the season for the Polar Bears. EC is always strong at home (two years ago a 10-0 Bowdoin team went to the Fens and lost by five, and the Polar Bears finished with a 26-3 record and trip to quarters) and always has a ton of talent. The frenetic pace instituted by their goofball/brilliant/entertaining coach is tough for any team.

The USM win was obviously a highlight, but that was at home. This one was better.

EC is by far my favorite non-conference team because they want to play all the good teams. When Bowdoin started making a name for itself, there was EC ready to play them. The fact that Brandeis does not play Emmanual -- it's about a 15 minute ride down the Pike -- tells me the BU coach is chicken, because I'm confident the EC coach made the call.

Least surprising result: Williams rolls. Friday is going to be exciting. Most surprising/saddening: Fitchburg over Tufts. Huh? Missing one player does not lose you a game to Fitchburg St., pal. Most predictable: Wesleyan beating Lasell. Isn't there a better team in Metro-Boston for the Cardinals to play than the Lazers...?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on January 06, 2007, 09:35:57 PM
Good call feces on two points...the willingness of EC to play the tough ones and the unwillingness of a vastly overrated Brandeis team to take them on.  Brandeis will be fortunate to be in the top 25 by season's end.

Bowdoin will defeat Williams, but not without a struggle...  the basic differences are that Williams is full of kids who are excellent athletes who happen to play basketball and Bowdoin is full of kids who are basketball players.  Secondly, Bowdoin is light years beyond William in terms of coaching...if the game hinges on game management and adjustments forget it..Williams may as well just forfeit.

Finally...I would be willing to bet that there is no women's team in DIII (other than Bowdoin) that has a positive assist to turnover ratio...not Hope, not Rochester, not Scranton, not USM, not Chatham College, not Linfield, not whomever you want to list....No big secret why Bowdoin almost always wins.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 08, 2007, 01:47:28 PM
Quote from: remsleep on January 06, 2007, 09:35:57 PM
...Williams is full of kids who are excellent athletes who happen to play basketball...

To be fair, the same thing could be said of Emmanual. In addition, according to the conference stats, Williams has a positive assist/turnover ratio.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on January 09, 2007, 10:19:08 AM
remsleep,
i completely DISAGREE with your statement regarding williams being a bunch of athletes and not basketball players. actually, i think it is the complete opposite - i wish they were physically a little bigger/stronger than they are but i think they have some REALLY good basketball players. however, i do completely AGREE with your statement in regards to coaching. pemper is the best in the conference (and one of the best in the nation) while manning is one of the worst in the conference based on the few games i have seen over the years and word of mouth. if it comes down to the wire and "strategy" is needed i'd go with bowdon everytime. i'd like to think my alma mater has a shot but realistically i'll take bowdoin by 8.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 11, 2007, 10:50:27 AM
I've read a lot of different stories on the Bowdoin streak, but the 'Around the Nation' take on the near-misses may have been the most interesting. The angle was well conceived and well researched. There was no byline on the piece, but a thumbs up to the author.

Unfortunately, with only nine of 24 regular season games at home this season, there won't be much movement on the 'streak.' Williams has had some tough luck against Bowdoin. If memory serves, the year before the Ephs coughed up the one in Morrell, they were leading the Polar Bears by 20+/- in the second half at home, only to lose by one on a running three-pointer at the buzzer in overtime. The Wesleyan game was absurd.

Friday:
Middlebury at Colby -- The Panthers aren't good, but the White Mules are not in the same hemisphere. Midd by 13.
Bates at Trinity -- The Bates bandwagon has been wiped out quicker than 'Big Grab' bag of Cheetos in the hands of an SID. The Hens have best record in years. Still, Bates by 18.
Tufts at Amherst -- Tufts is about on par with the Ham Tech squad that beat the Lady Jeffs by a sawbuck. Jumbos by 10.
Williams at Bowdoin -- This game is likely to determine the home seed in the conference semis. It's also the first home game for Polar Bears in 34 days. Bowdoin by 6.

Saturday
Williams at Colby -- Ephs by 25.
Middlebury at Bowdoin -- Polar Bears by 15.
Wesleyan at Conn. College -- Cardinals are quietly hanging around for an at-large bid, like they do every year. Wes by 14.
Bates at Amherst -- Bobbies by 24.
Tufts at Trinity -- Jumbos by 9.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ralph Turner on January 11, 2007, 11:16:17 AM
Quote from: feces monkey on January 06, 2007, 07:21:51 PM
The Emmanual game will likely be viewed as just another win over an unranked opponent, but I think it's the most impressive win of the season for the Polar Bears. EC is always strong at home (two years ago a 10-0 Bowdoin team went to the Fens and lost by five, and the Polar Bears finished with a 26-3 record and trip to quarters) and always has a ton of talent. The frenetic pace instituted by their goofball/brilliant/entertaining coach is tough for any team.

The USM win was obviously a highlight, but that was at home. This one was better.

EC is by far my favorite non-conference team because they want to play all the good teams. When Bowdoin started making a name for itself, there was EC ready to play them. The fact that Brandeis does not play Emmanual -- it's about a 15 minute ride down the Pike -- tells me the BU coach is chicken, because I'm confident the EC coach made the call.

Least surprising result: Williams rolls. Friday is going to be exciting. Most surprising/saddening: Fitchburg over Tufts. Huh? Missing one player does not lose you a game to Fitchburg St., pal. Most predictable: Wesleyan beating Lasell. Isn't there a better team in Metro-Boston for the Cardinals to play than the Lazers...?

Monkey, thanks for the update.  I appreciate your opinion on Emmanuel. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: atn alum on January 11, 2007, 01:25:51 PM
Feces

Thank you. Give props to Jim Caton, the Bowdoin SID too, who supplied a good # of the tidbits peppered throughout the piece.



Quote from: feces monkey on January 11, 2007, 10:50:27 AM
I've read a lot of different stories on the Bowdoin streak, but the 'Around the Nation' take on the near-misses may have been the most interesting. The angle was well conceived and well researched. There was no byline on the piece, but a thumbs up to the author.

Unfortunately, with only nine of 24 regular season games at home this season, there won't be much movement on the 'streak.' Williams has had some tough luck against Bowdoin. If memory serves, the year before the Ephs coughed up the one in Morrell, they were leading the Polar Bears by 20+/- in the second half at home, only to lose by one on a running three-pointer at the buzzer in overtime. The Wesleyan game was absurd.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on January 12, 2007, 08:54:56 PM
Bowdoin's home win streak reaches 75 as it easily downs Williams 68 to 58. Bowdoin established a 9 or 10 lead early in the second half and never looked back . .
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on January 12, 2007, 10:10:33 PM
RE: Williams v Bowdoin.  Poorly played by both teams, but outcome really never seriously in doubt.
Williams just does not have basketball players other than Miller.  The little guard #15 isn't bad but her lack of physical strength finally had her folding up ( consistent with NESCAC Hoops' observation the other day wishing the Ephs were bigger and stronger...overall, however let's be real..Williams has  very good size....they just aren't an elite team).

Each  team coughed it up 26 times....what is this?... Smith v.Connecticut College?

Without question, Manning leaves a lot to be desired as a game manager.  Terrible.   She sucks up a lot of air around the bench by constantly whining at the officials...just a cover for the fact that she has no idea how to adjust in the course of a game.   

To emphasize the gap between Bowdoin and everyone else...Polar Bears were not good tonight...still way better than Williams and anyone else in the conference.  I hope we get to see Bowdoin v. Hope at the end of the year in Springfield....but still a long way to go I guess
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on January 12, 2007, 11:07:16 PM
Actually, I'm pulling for a Bowdoin/Scranton rematch...then Springfield can really host a party.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: simon on January 13, 2007, 06:33:05 PM
I hardly think a ten point game was an easy win!!!!!! However, congrats to Bowdoin.  Before people go bad mouthing the coaches maybe you should try and coach and see how hard it is. Until you have a degree in coaching then you shouldn't use your post to add personal attacks. Its pretty classless.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on January 15, 2007, 11:43:59 AM
remsleep,
i still disagree with your statement regarding williams having basketball players. i'd say maggie miller, #15 and #14 (stetson?) are really true bball players. the williams point guard isn't a "bball player", but is one of my favorite pt. guards.....smart, leads team, good passer with a lot of assists and very few turnovers, and plays great defense....you can't ask much more from a true point guard. #21 (omalley) has the size i would like to see but doesn't nearly have the skill of miller, however miller doesn't have the physical size of omalley. i'm not talking about height, i'm talking physical strength. if miller had omalley's strength and omalley had miller's skill, they would be a VERY scary tandom. however, as it concerns their post play, they just have a great player in miller down under who can sometimes be overpowered by physically stonger opponents. admittingly, i haven't seen them a whole lot since their freshman season, but have seen them enough over the last 3 years to know.
manning has never been my favorite. word on the street is that she is a good scouter of other teams and prepares her team well but when it comes to making adjustments (if the opposing team does things outside the scouting report), she just can't make them. i don't think she is a "quick thinking" coach. if you told her the day before that at the 11 minute mark of the second half that miller was going to pick up her fourth foul and the defense was going to go back to man-to-man defense, then i think she could make a good, appropriate adjustment when she has time to think about it. unfortunately, that doesn't happen in a real basketball game. kudos to the polar bears, they always seem to get the job done even if it isn't pretty. i took bowdoin by 8 and they won by 10...i wish my predictions were that close to those i made on football this past weekend.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on January 15, 2007, 11:50:25 AM
How will the Lady Mariners do against The Polar Bears this Wed. ?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: usmhoops1 on January 15, 2007, 02:56:28 PM
Should be a competitive game but Bowdoin by  10+. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 15, 2007, 05:48:39 PM
Quote from: simon on January 13, 2007, 06:33:05 PM
Before people go bad mouthing the coaches maybe you should try and coach and see how hard it is. Until you have a degree in coaching then you shouldn't use your post to add personal attacks.

One does not need a degree in meteorology to know it's raining, nor does one need a 'degree in coaching' to criticize a coach. With that being said, it's pretty transparent that remsleep has, for whatever reason, an axe to grind with the Williams coach. The Williams coach's regular season and postseason records speak for themselves.

Bowdoin navigated the four game/five day course with pretty high marks. Flaherty has locked up player of the year status. Perhaps I should come to grips with how average the Bobcats are, but Bates losing by 14 to Amherst is stunning. I still think the Polar Bears will have a hard time winning in Lewiston.

I am disappointed that Hope lost. I was looking forward to seeing my prediction of Hope overtaking the Polar Bears in the rankings come true (it was getting real close) in order to highlight the silliness of an SID-driven poll. I guess I'll have to wait until next year (unless I'm in store for a treat this week).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: simon on January 15, 2007, 10:07:11 PM
Yes Feces I will agree with you maybe what I should of said was until one coaches and is put in similiar situation they shouldn't throw out personal attacks. Even if they never coach they shouldn't. I just like the fact that the board for the most part is about statistics and great basketball conversation and there isn't any need to throw out personal attacks thats all.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 15, 2007, 11:36:39 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on January 15, 2007, 05:48:39 PM
I am disappointed that Hope lost. I was looking forward to seeing my prediction of Hope overtaking the Polar Bears in the rankings come true (it was getting real close) in order to highlight the silliness of an SID-driven poll. I guess I'll have to wait until next year (unless I'm in store for a treat this week).

I know you hate our poll, but only eight of the 25 voters are SIDs. Gotta find another reason to hate on us other than that.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: mrmike88 on January 16, 2007, 01:02:55 AM
WAMH has our first women's basketball broadcast of the season Tuesday.  We'll have the Amherst-Wesleyan game live on the air.  Pre-game starts at 4:55, game at 5:00.

http://wamh.amherst.edu/

Following the women's game, we'll have the 7:00 Amherst-Elms men's game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 16, 2007, 02:16:50 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 15, 2007, 11:36:39 PM
I know you hate our poll, but only eight of the 25 voters are SIDs. Gotta find another reason to hate on us other than that.

I'm more frustrated with your poll than hateful of it. At a fundamental level -- publicizing Division III women's basketball -- I'm appreciative of your poll. However, I think you are missing opportunities to increase its legitimacy, and thus its value. Hence, frustration.

And having nearly a third of your electorate as SIDs is not a negligible percentage.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on January 16, 2007, 04:23:24 PM
williams lost votes this week for losing a competitive game to the #1 ranked team in the country and in a gym that no visiting team has won in since ben franklin invented the light bulb.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 17, 2007, 12:30:13 AM
Quote from: feces monkey on January 16, 2007, 02:16:50 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 15, 2007, 11:36:39 PM
I know you hate our poll, but only eight of the 25 voters are SIDs. Gotta find another reason to hate on us other than that.

I'm more frustrated with your poll than hateful of it. At a fundamental level -- publicizing Division III women's basketball -- I'm appreciative of your poll. However, I think you are missing opportunities to increase its legitimacy, and thus its value. Hence, frustration.

And having nearly a third of your electorate as SIDs is not a negligible percentage.

I think if you knew the amount of information the voters get each week you would understand that we do work very hard to educate the "electorate." It's something I picked up while working at USA Today, helping manage the D-I baseball coaches' poll.  In the mid-90s, there was almost no coverage of D-I baseball on TV and informing the voters was paramount.

I'm not convinced that eliminating SIDs would make the poll better. I actually find -- in general -- the SIDs to be less biased toward their own conference than the coaches are.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 17, 2007, 12:43:30 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 17, 2007, 12:30:13 AM
I think if you knew the amount of information the voters get each week you would understand that we do work very hard to educate the "electorate."

I think if I knew simply who the voters were, it would go a long way in alleviating some of my concerns about the poll (proportional regional representation, credentials, etc.). Transparency of voters is paramount to legitimacy in my eyes.

If I remember correctly (and please correct me if I'm wrong), you feel transparency would lead to lobbying of the voters. Why would this happen more with your poll than others?

Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 17, 2007, 12:30:13 AM
I'm not convinced that eliminating SIDs would make the poll better. I actually find -- in general -- the SIDs to be less biased toward their own conference than the coaches are.

You feel this way because you have incorporated your own bias ("I...find") into the discussion. Groupthink is not a positive for a poll -- it leads to a static entity unable to flow with current trends.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 17, 2007, 12:53:37 PM
Well, I'm sorry you feel that way -- I have voted on polls and been inundated with junk because of it, so for that reason I do not release the voter names.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on January 17, 2007, 09:27:59 PM
POLAR BEAR SCOREBOARD

Jan. 17 W. B'ball vs. ME-Maritime L 51-49

http://www.bowdoin.edu/athletics/
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 17, 2007, 10:56:09 PM
http://www.nbcsports.com/cbk/862414/detail.html
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3bballinboston on January 18, 2007, 07:42:02 AM
wow a NAC school beating the best NESCAC team in the country!  This is pretty impressive.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 18, 2007, 10:50:16 AM
Into each life some rain must fall,
Some days must be dark and dreary.
                          -- Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
(Bowdoin Class of 1825)

Maine Maritime hit the magic trifecta: 1.) Shot well from the floor (50%); 2.) Outrebounded the Polar Bears (which had a 10+ margin coming in); 3.) and put the clamps on Flaherty (4-for-20). A lot of really good teams have tried to do that Morrell over the past four years and couldn't, but MMA did. All the credit to them. The most impressive part was MMA didn't shoot particularly well from the free throw line (10-of-18), which is usually a killer in close games, and also ceded 30 more shots to Bowdoin.

Personally, I'm glad it was a Maine team that snapped the streak.

Perhaps I'm being pollyannaish, but I see nothing but good coming from this loss. It was a non-conference game, so no damage done to conference tourney seedings. It comes right before the final regular season push, which should refocus the team down the stretch. The whole streak thing is put to bed and will no longer be a possible distraction. Same for the No. 1 ranking. It's time to get down to business.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on January 18, 2007, 11:42:57 AM
ive heard of the sports illustrated cover jinx and i've heard of the madden video game football cover jinx - i think d3hoops is now in their company with the feature they did on their front page of the bowdoin steak no more than a week ago. wow. congrats to MM. i agree with feces, and think this takes the monkeys off their back.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on January 18, 2007, 09:48:57 PM
Congrats to Maine
By the by when was the last time Da Bears had more personal fouls than a visiting team?
Maybe when Longfellow was a student.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: atn alum on January 18, 2007, 11:02:40 PM
at home?

vs Southern Maine earlier this season.

And yes, I know it was a rhetorical question...

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: JeffRookie2 on January 19, 2007, 12:22:30 AM
Hey, I'm an amherst fan, but I don't pay much attention to the women. I know they are not nearly as good as the men, but where do they stand in the conference? What is the general conference rank? Obviously Bowdoin is number 1 and Williams 2. Who are the best players, first team, second team etc? I'm just kind of looking for a general league summary if someone would be so kind.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on January 19, 2007, 05:39:41 AM
See the NESCAC website.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 19, 2007, 11:56:48 AM
This weekend will feature two contrasting days of action. Friday's slate features four games, all of them dogs, that hardly merit a mention. Williams, Bowdoin and Wesleyan will all be heavily favored, and with Amherst streaking right now, they are double-digits faves, as well.

On Saturday the games get a little meatier.

Williams (13-3) at Amherst (9-7): The Lady Jeffs started out 7-7 and were living up to predicitions of mediocrity, but the last two games have shown a little fight. Amherst handled both Bates and Wesleyan by double digits, and they could make a huge statement with a win over Williams. That kind of win still might be a year off. Ephs by four.

Bowdoin (15-1) at Wesleyan (10-3): The Cardinals had their eight-game win streak snapped by Amherst in their last game, and the Polar Bears' last contest has been well documented (although both will easily win on Friday). A win for Wesleyan could net them home court for tourney. Unfortunately, Bowdoin isn't pleased. Polar Bears by a dozen.

Bates (9-6) at Tufts (10-5): The Bobcats are basically playing spolier now, and Tufts can't afford a loss. I have no idea about this game, but I'll go with the home Jumbos. By six.

Trinity (9-5) at Middlebury (9-5): The battle for the seventh seed in the conference tourney should be a barn-burner. I like the Chickens, by three.

And now, the Game of the Week:

Colby (3-10) at Conn. College (8-6): Don't let the Camels' record fool you -- their non-conference schedule would make Brandeis envious. Not that I blame them; they're trying to build a program. The White Mules are just trying to dig out of the wreckage. Neither of these teams will make the tourney, but this game could give one of them a leg up in the race for the eighth seed in '08. Camels, at the buzzer, by two.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on January 19, 2007, 12:08:16 PM
feces,
i always like predictions. i don't see the bowdoin/wesleyan game being that close. the game could be that close but only if bowdoin clears the bench at the end of the game or wesleyan finds one of their own to ref the game, which is what is seems like down there a lot of the times. i think with what wesleyan lost last year in their two big girls, they really don't have an answer for flaherty and bowdoin's post game. and i might flip with you on the middlebury/trinity game -- that's a lot of traveling for the bants on the second day and i think midd may have more experience, and maybe skill, than trinity. i agree with you in regards to williams/amherst....lefrak is a tough gym to shoot in and i think amherst has some confidence now. however, they have always found a way to lose to williams. we'll see.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 19, 2007, 01:55:58 PM
N'Hoops,

Interesting point about the travel. I guess I tend to discount that, but with Midd and Trinity being so close (from my perspective), I suppose it could be a factor. It all depends on whether the Bantams are staying at the Ladd Brook Motel in Pownal, Vt., after the Ephs game. I always slept well there, so that might negate any Panther advantage. If they are staying in North Adams, all bets are off.

LeFrak can make you dizzy (what kind of architectural style would you say it is? -- gotta love the '70s), but the Ephs have been there enough and are too talented.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on January 19, 2007, 03:25:45 PM
feces,
williams and midd are not actually all that close to one another....as it compares to other nescac traveling pairs. it might even be the greatest distance, though maybe tufts/bates is slightly longer. it's a straight shot up there to midd but takes around 2 and a half hours on a bus...maybe closer to 2 hours.

i don't know what i would call the amherst gym. to me, the roof always looks like one of those big party tents with the points on the ends. i guess ugly is the style i would call it. it's a tough place to shoot in but, like you've said, the ephs have played there enough (3 times for the seniors) to know that. more than anything, i think amherst has developed a "complex" and don't believe themselves that they can beat williams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on January 20, 2007, 09:54:57 AM
Quote from: feces monkey on January 16, 2007, 02:16:50 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 15, 2007, 11:36:39 PM
I know you hate our poll, but only eight of the 25 voters are SIDs. Gotta find another reason to hate on us other than that.

I'm more frustrated with your poll than hateful of it. At a fundamental level -- publicizing Division III women's basketball -- I'm appreciative of your poll. However, I think you are missing opportunities to increase its legitimacy, and thus its value. Hence, frustration.

And having nearly a third of your electorate as SIDs is not a negligible percentage.

As the season progesses monkey gets clearer and clearer but the rankings don't, one can only wonder what the next poll will reveal  ;)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: mrmike88 on January 20, 2007, 11:49:09 AM
LeFrak is definitely like playing in a tent.

Amherst is playing much better of late than they were coming into the last matchup vs. Williams.  One big difference over the past three games (all wins) has been the turnover margin.  Turnovers killed Amherst against Williams last time (22-7).  If they can take better care of the ball like they did vs. Wes on Tuesday, this could be a game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on January 20, 2007, 05:19:59 PM
Fecesmonkey was right on--Tufts beat Bates by 6 or 7. It was a mostly defensive first half until with about two minutes left both teams just played run and gun; I think between the two they hit five threes in the last two minutes of the first half. 33-28 Tufts at the half. Back and forth most of the second half; Murphy called a timeout (and was none too pleased) with 7:45 to go; by the 6:30 mark it was a tie game, but Tufts pulled away, mostly by keeping the ball away from Sarah Barton, and Teal Carroll and Maggie Fitzgerald couldn't replace her (obviously).

Sarah played about as well as I've seen her play, and this board knows I'm high on Sarah. She did all the things she's great at and really didn't turn the ball over too many times in the process. When she was out (about two minutes all game) Bates suffered. Katie Franklin has played well all season and did today; Lauren Yanofsky and Kellie Goodridge both played very well in limited minutes.

My biggest complaint about this team is that they don't pass well, which is pretty important with Murphy's offensive scheme and a creative player like Sarah running the show. Other than Sarah, Lauren, and Kellie, I think the whole team is subpar in terms of passing--contrasted to Tufts, it was really obvious, as the Jumbos consistently hit their scorers (11 and 33, don't know the names) immediately off picks, and could get the ball underneath sufficiently. Bates couldn't get the ball to Matia underneath in the first half, and she got completely out of rhythm by firing away from long range. Kudos to Val Beckwith for taking it to the hole several times and playing hard as she always does, but she also wasn't as effective as I've seen her. The freshmen, excluding Lauren, don't have the timing down and miss opportunities to hit the open girl. Also, the Bobcats, I think, have become too accustomed to hitting the guards who step out rather than the girls rolling around picks underneath (if you've seen their offense, you know what I'm talking about)--several times Matia, ShawnRose, or Val would be open sliding through the paint and the girl on the wing, whether it was Teal, Kellie, Maggie, or even Katie, would not hit them and throw it back to Sarah or one of the other wing players. Luckily, this is really mostly a transitional/learning year anyway, as we have next year with Sarah, Matia, and Meg as seniors with Val as a junior and an extremely strong soph. class with a year under its belt. I'd lobby for more PT for Lauren, who does everything and is a rare mix of athleticism and size--one she gets confident, she will be a near impossible matchup-- and Kellie, who to me is a much stronger defender and ball handler than Teal, who started. However, Teal is a fantastic shooter, so she deserves her time as well.

A nice showing by the girls, but they couldn't overcome the Jumbos today.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 20, 2007, 11:49:47 PM
Quote from: whoarewebobcats on January 20, 2007, 05:19:59 PM
Luckily, this is really mostly a transitional/learning year anyway, as we have next year with Sarah, Matia, and Meg as seniors with Val as a junior and...

WAWB, who is this 'Meg' you speak of? I don't see anyone on the roster by that name. Surely the '06 Player of the Year is not going to pony up $22 large (or whatever the half-price rate is on the Androscoggin these days) for a half-year of hoops action. She's already burned her soccer allowance, right?

I'll assume that Murph has a transfer from Unity by that name coming in.

Enjoyed the game summary. Hope you had a good time. I hear Waltham is beautiful this time of year...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: papabear on January 21, 2007, 05:08:16 AM
Well the lady polarbears won a hard fought game today in Middletown. The Bowdoin squad is a superior team but did not play extremely well and the home court almost gave the home town the upset. The game was close the whole way but Flaherty was unstopable for the polabears and even the usual home town officiating could not let this game slip away. Bowdoins coach (Pemper) is great but sometimes rests her stars to much at the ends of halfs. A late 5-0 first half run after reinserting Flaherty allowed the better team to survive on the road and stay at the top of the polls.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: yellstoomuch on January 21, 2007, 11:13:12 AM
Bowdoin is the last team that should complain about home town refs, who saved their game against Wesleyan last year. The fact is that this year Wesleyan played great defense. Home town refs didn't cause Bowdoin's 30 second clock turnovers, and Wesleyan didn't get the call on their last shot that would have tied the game. Bowdoin played great defense at the end of the game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on January 21, 2007, 11:36:45 AM
FM-- what I've heard is Meg isn't enrolled in school this semester and will finish her senior year at Bates next year since she still has basketball eligibility. So she wouldn't join the team until January, but she (obviously) will still have an impact once she rounds into shape. That's the rumor anyway.

Waltham is lovely, but as it turns out, so is Medford...  I actually really like Tufts, it was my second choice after Bates.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: atn alum on January 21, 2007, 05:20:51 PM
I joked to our publisher that I should auction off my women's top 25 first-place vote this week, because I have NO IDEA who to pick from the 7 to 8 legit contenders (and yes, I admit to being a voter)...I've considered bumping up the likes of Howard Payne, Chicago and Calvin, and I have no idea what to do with where to put Maine Maritime.

So I open it up to the good folks of the message boards...

I do take my vote seriously, and plan to study up before I cast mine this week. However, if a fan out there has a legitimate argument  (as opposed to trash talk) as to why I should give Bowdoin a mulligan, feel free to share...

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 22, 2007, 12:11:34 AM
WAWB,

Fascinating stuff. Without a doubt the return of Coffin -- even if in a mercenary-like three month stint -- would be a massive boost to the Bobcats. I would guess that a NESCAC student-athlete delaying graduation simply for athletics goes against many of the tenets of the conference's philosophy, but if you've got the scratch, why not? (I wish I had some credits that needed to be filled...I'd be back in a heartbeat.)

Medford is a surprisingly nice place, especially considering how close it is to Somerville. The Jumbos were a finalist for my tuition bankroll, but also finished second.

ATNwriter,

Throwing your ballot out there for discussion is noble if one applauds the ideals of socialism. I, for one, find the creeping claws of socialism to be one of the fundamental ills clutching the country.

You were right to entrust your ballot to those on the NESCAC board, as we are all blessed with a larger world view. However, by nature, the forum dynamic opens up the discussion to the Great Unwashed -- those with a selfish purview. The response on the Top 25 discussion board is a prime example. Reading those missives was like watching hungry dogs fighting for a scrap of meat. Sad really.

If I were to give you advice (which I won't), I would say give your top vote to a team that needs it rather than the team that deserves it. The NESCAC will continue to churn out the next generation of America's leaders regardless of whether one of its teams matches the sensibilities of the College Sports Information Directors of America.

The numerous peripheral conferences -- UAA, CAC, MIAA, etc. -- are always searching to make their mark. They are in need of your help. The NESCAC's primacy is assured.

Good luck, and God speed.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 22, 2007, 03:50:26 AM
monkey,

atnwriter posted his message on the Top 25 board too. Don't get too high on yourself.

Quote from: feces monkey on January 20, 2007, 11:49:47 PM
WAWB, who is this 'Meg' you speak of? I don't see anyone on the roster by that name. Surely the '06 Player of the Year is not going to pony up $22 large (or whatever the half-price rate is on the Androscoggin these days) for a half-year of hoops action. She's already burned her soccer allowance, right?

I'll assume that Murph has a transfer from Unity by that name coming in.

I sure get sick of the sarcasm.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: atn alum on January 22, 2007, 09:52:30 AM
Feces

I'm not sure the purpose of your remarks, other than to lower your karma ratings...it's a shame. Based on reading some of your past work, you clearly have the capability to provide a legitimate response. Such discussions on the Top 25 seem pretty common on the men's board. Commentary such as yours only serves to damage the credibility (and provide a yuck or two for yourself) of these boards and chase people such as myself away.

Feel free to enlighten us with credible observations, but otherwise I suggest you stop wasting the time of yourself and others with pithy sarcasm.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 22, 2007, 11:32:58 AM
A pollster prostituting his ballot on a message board lecturing others on 'credibility.'

Now that's rich.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: atn alum on January 22, 2007, 11:45:56 AM
Oh brother...

This is why I don't post on these boards too often.

I apologize for my digression in my previous post. And forgive me for trying to become better informed on this subject matter.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on January 22, 2007, 12:15:10 PM
If a person's user name is Feces Monkey, should you really expect a serious response?

I think the reason you didn't get much of a response, ATN, is two-fold. One, this board isn't terribly active (as compared the the men's NESCAC board, at least). Two, almost everyone I've seen on any of these boards is very much biased--there aren't many people that follow D3 basketball without having some vested interest somewhere. My response would have been "not Bowdoin", because I spent four years in Lewiston, and hate Bowdoin, particularly their women's program. And those kinds of responses are probably all you're going to get, I would think. I also don't think people that follow D3 ball stray far from their own league--how are we to have credible opinions of teams we've never seen play. So, in sum, I don't have a good response for you and I don't think many of this group's posters would. But I don't think that means the boards are useless, it's all for fun, so don't get too worked up over FM.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 22, 2007, 12:50:15 PM
Atnwriter:

Unfortunately, **** monkey has an ax to grind with the poll and can't seem to get past it. It does seem he/she could be a valuable poster if it were possible for him/her to look past the chip on his/her shoulder.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on January 22, 2007, 01:10:39 PM
i had heard of the meg coffin rumor (coming back next year) a little while ago and hoped that is wasn't true. as a williams fan, obviously i don't want to face her. however, that wasn't the reason i hoped that she wasn't coming back. i don't really think the coffin family knows how to "let it go" when it comes to sports. you don't go to a nescac/d3 school to become a professional basketball player. meg coffin will not be drafted by a WNBA team - so go graduate with your class this spring and enjoy a "normal" college experience. yes, that's awful about her knee and she is missing out on a season, but really...let it go. she will still be a great player next year, but will probably never be 100% given the severity of tearing all 3 ligaments. maybe i would feel differently if i was in her position, but wasting a year of my life and the idea of not graduating with my incoming class/friends doesn't seem worth a half semester of basketball.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: The Observation Deck on January 22, 2007, 01:23:26 PM
Who's to say playing a fourth year of basketball is not a normal experience, though? If it were me, I'd rather try to rehab and come back than spend my life wondering what might have been. If THAT'S the normal experience, count me out.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on January 22, 2007, 01:43:25 PM
I don't know Meg personally or anything, but everything that's ever been said/written etc. about her talks about how serious she is about her sports. Ultimately it's up to any person to do what they wish, and if this is what she wants to do I don't see any reason why anyone should judge her negatively about it. I think not having another crack at a NESCAC title and an NCAA tourney run would be much less "normal" for Meg than graduating with her class, I agree with TOD's comments that Meg would likely wonder what could have been. A huge part of her college experience has been sports, and a huge part of that has been basketball--why let it go unfinished?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on January 22, 2007, 04:02:39 PM
last year, matia kostakis, sarah barton and a HEALTHY meg coffin made an NCAA "run" that ended after the round of 64. yes, i am not one to tell meg coffin how/when to spend your senior year. and i think bates will fare better in the NESCAC next year with what bowdoin and williams are losing this year and with an 85% (?) healthy meg coffin. who am i, but i think she is missing the "joy" of being a d3/NESCAC athlete.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 22, 2007, 06:14:33 PM
I say do whatever it takes to play your maximum available years under the rules. Why not?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on January 22, 2007, 07:48:11 PM
one thing about bates' 06 year--it was very much a transitional year. We had just lost the Taylor-Zurek-Hochadel trio that defined the team for the previous few years; Matia was new to the team, so was Jackie Powers (who the hell knows where she went), and Val was a frosh getting a lot of minutes--that's a lot of new blood around Meg that didn't really know where they belonged. Plus, and anyone who saw Bates before about this time last year can attest, Sarah played pretty poorly early on--she didn't look the same. I think they were trying to redefine her role, and I think she struggled getting acclimated to not having players who knew where to be--it's much easier to throw backdoor passes, no-looks, cross-court etc etc if you know where everyone's going to be. I consider this also to be a transitional year in many ways--half the team is freshmen, several of whom are very good--and the rest are solidifying. But I think they have the formula of a winner next year, with Sarah, Teal, Val, Matia, Meg (if she is coming back) starting and Kellie Goodridge, Lauren Yanofsky, and probably one or two new frosh getting big minutes. But Murphy does need to get more consistent with his recruiting classes, it seems each year half the team is new.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on January 23, 2007, 10:04:49 AM
Quote from: whoarewebobcats on January 22, 2007, 07:48:11 PM
one thing about bates' 06 year--it was very much a transitional year. We had just lost the Taylor-Zurek-Hochadel trio that defined the team for the previous few years;

the '06 team beat bowdoin in the conference game and hosted the nescac finals (which i believe was the first time bowdoin hadn't hosted in the past 5 years) so it's hard to blame their ncaa tourny demise on a "transistion year" when they finishes first in the conference for the regular season - zurek and co. never even beat bowdoin, though correct me if i'm wrong. bates merely just blew it in the ncaa's - no excuses.

my friend is in the athletic department up at bates and said that it was "suggested" to jackie powers that she leave the school undisclosed reasons. but officially, she left on her own terms.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on January 23, 2007, 12:57:10 PM
interesting about jackie powers...I had heard some things around campus about her not really fitting in in terms of the student body, but nothing credible and only from a couple of people (which obviously doesn't represent, necessarily, a fair assessment). I hadn't heard of any problems she had had or anything like that, but the whole situation seems to have had a weird vibe.

A few things about your previous post. You seem to be responding to something different than what I was saying. I wasn't trying to justify/apologize for the team's shortcomings, or even say that they were bad or anything like that. It is a fact that they were in a transitional year: the starting 5 had almost always three new players (Sarah and Meg being the only holdovers). They lost a class that defined the program for three years and led them through their most successful run as a team, including the nationally recognized Olivia Zurek. They had two girls transfer in, Matia and Jackie, one who's role went from relatively unimportant to suddenly crucial (Annie Whiting, going from giving Olivia and Betsy rest to playing alongside Meg and Matia for most of games), and deal with both losing Leah Schouten, who had really emerged as a solid contributor the year before, playing without Meg early on, and having Kyla Decato inexplicably come off the bench while Becca Buckler, now transferred out, starting over her (which I always figured caused some drama, since Kyla played hard and seemed to play less as she got older, but that's just me guessing). Granted, it is almost defintional of college programs to have transitions every year, but to me this is a pretty significant transition, much like the boys team will be facing this coming year. Expectations were not high for last year's Bates team--but I didn't say they were terrible. I also didn't try to make excuses for why they didn't go far in NCAAs or anything like that--it is commendable that they got that far, in my mind. I rest the "blame" of their "NCAA demise" on the fact that all but one team loses, ultimately. I never even spoke in those terms. It was a successful season given what happened, but if you had told anyone who followed the program that they would go 8-1 in conference and make a late run, at the beginning of the year when things looked kind of bleak, or, at least, unknown, they would have doubted you.

"Zurek and co." did beat Bowdoin at Bates in 04-05; the game was non-conference though it was never explained why. Someone in the athletic dept. told us that Bowdoin asked to switch which game counted for conference play, the earlier (which Bowdoin hosted) instead of the later (which Bates hosted). I don't know why this was requested (or really if it was, perhaps it's just a rumor) or why Bates accepted the request, but that's what I heard. The 04-05 team was the strongest team I've seen Bates field--having Heather Taylor and Sarah in the same backcourt was unbelievable--but that Bowdoin team was also strong and when it came down to it always did the little things to come out on top.

So, in summation, I don't understand where your post is coming from--I wasn't making excuses, getting to the tourney was a surprise, an accomplishment, etc. etc. I simply expect the 07-08 team to come close to the level of the 04-05 team, the biggest question mark being whether they can have the same kind of teamwork as a team that played together for so long. Every program has years that are more transitional with lower expectations, you can't expect to win it all every year, but you ramp up for the years that it seems possible. Last, I think it's pretty premature to guess what kind of health Meg will be at (85% was your conjecture)--we're talking about a full calendar year from now. Anything could happen, what's the point in guessing.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on January 23, 2007, 01:01:47 PM
one other note, I was just looking at the 03-04 year and the conference game between Bates and Bowdoin was also the first one, which Bates hosted, so the reasoning must go back beyond that year. Normally, the second game is the conference game, as far as I know--who knows why it changed and when exactly it did, etc. etc. As I said, what I had heard was a sort of source-from-a-source situation, so who knows what's right. Just wanted to clarify that I wasn't "making excuses" or anything like that, I was simply relaying what I had heard, because it had seemed strange at the time.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 23, 2007, 01:38:15 PM
It's Coffin's decision, so best of luck whichever way, but I have one question:

Is there a minumum number of semester credits required to participate in athletics? I think it's a school-by-school policy and, if memory serves, you have to be taking three full-credit (i.e., one credit) courses at Bowdoin to participate intercollegiately.

I'm sure there is an NCAA policy, but I believe Bowdoin's (and likely most NESCAC's) is more stringent. Anyone know for sure? I checked the Bowdoin academic website, but it is so convoluted I think I actually reached the end of the internet while navigating through it.

Obviously, if someone was coming back for a semester I would think they would be taking a full course load regardless of graduation minimums, considering the price.

Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 22, 2007, 12:50:15 PM
Unfortunately, **** monkey has an ax to grind with the poll and can't seem to get past it. It does seem he/she could be a valuable poster if it were possible for him/her to look past the chip on his/her shoulder.

My ax has been worn down to a nub, and the solicitation of votes by ATN has figuratively snapped the handle. I officially give up trying to legitimize your poll. I do, however, appreciate the gender neutrality in your post. Quite progressive.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on January 23, 2007, 01:50:19 PM
jackie powers is, for a lack of a better word, "sketchy". she left boston college, where she was on the soccer team and may have had a scholarship, but left a week into their preseason and then enrolled in bates for the second semester. my buddy doesn't know/tell her exact reason for leaving the school, but i think it was disciplinary and not "fitting in" with the student body.

i wasn't saying you were making excuses - i meant no excuses can be made for them losing the ncaa game. sorry, misunderstanding. i think that bates had to readjust that year with what they lost in the year prior with graduating zurek and co. however, by beating bowdoin and getting to host the nescac finals, they proved that they had figured out "life after zurek" by regular season's end. yeah, they had some early season bumps along the road as they adjusted without those 3 seniors and an injured meg coffin. however, come ncaa tourny time, there are no excuses based on how well they did last regular season for losing in the first round. they were better than that, even if they weren't expected to have the season they did in the first place. after playing 20+ games together, the two rookie of the year's from the previous season (one up for all american nomination), the nescac POY and all american (or canidate?), and a bunch of talented veterans (annie whiting was VERY good) should have made it past the first round game. next year bates will also have to readjust with the come back of meg coffin, incoming freshman, etc. - kostakis will not get as many looks, etc. of course it will make bates a better team with coffin back but last season they had shortcomings with her at near 100%. yes, she has a full calendar year to heal however, tearing your entire knee apart is a tough injury to recover from fully, especially for somebody as big and mobile as meg. i hope she recovers fully - she will probably be one of, if not the best, top players in the conference again but i don't think she will necessarily be the same. that being said, the nescac takes a big hit with williams and bowdoin losing so much. however, bowdoin always seems to stay on top time and time again even if they are going through what many think will be a "transition year" for them.

feces,
meg coffing isn't going to school this semester....or the next one either. she is taking a full year off (this spring semester and next fall semester). she will take the classes she would have been taking this semester to graduate  and will take them in spring '08 so she will have a normal/full classload. in other words, she is no longer a bates student again unti next january. somebody correct me if i'm wrong but that's what i heard.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 23, 2007, 02:27:13 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on January 23, 2007, 01:38:15 PM

My ax has been worn down to a nub, and the solicitation of votes by ATN has figuratively snapped the handle. I officially give up trying to legitimize your poll. I do, however, appreciate the gender neutrality in your post. Quite progressive.

Just shut up. It was an exercise in getting people to actually post on the damn board. Some people we don't need to have post on the board. You're one of them.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on January 23, 2007, 02:35:12 PM
nescachoops, Points well taken, though I disagree that the season is as much of a failure as you deem it. It's true and fair to say that they had figured themselves out over the course of the season, and they had the tools to do some things. I think they had the tools to do, basically, what they did, and not really any more. Admittedly, I don't know much about other conferences so I don't know how we should match up nationally--I know Bates has been, at least over the course of the Zurek era, high up in the rankings with Bowdoin and USM, so perhaps they did underachieve. I was simply laying out the expectations, but, again, point taken that they learned to play with one another over the course of the year. As I said in the last post, most every year is transitional by definition for college programs, and the good ones, like Bowdoin, fight through them. Also, I should have been clearer when talking about projecting Meg's health--I wasn't saying she'd be 100%, I'm simply saying there's no way of telling now, so there's no point in projecting how she'll feel in a full calendar year from now. One other point of contention, but this is pretty much semantics--Annie Whiting was a solid player, no more no less. She was nice to have on the court, could hit out to 16-18 ft reliably, and had some size underneath. I don't know that "VERY good" is fair--I think she was generally overmatched as a starter. It's sort of like Katie Franklin this year--excellent work ethic/team player, but skill-wise I think most Bates fans are surprised with the senior outputs of girls like Annie and Katie after seeing them in limited action throughout the course of their careers. I loved having Annie on the team, she seemed to have a great personality and solid set of skills, but I think expounding on her skills as a reason why Bates should do more is maybe overstating things just a bit.

Also, love the description of Jackie Powers. Wonderful.

Feces, I've heard the same as nescachoops, that Meg will not enroll the next two semesters and finish her workload winter semester. Bates' credit system is extremely easy, there aren't credit hours, everything is just 1, and you need 32 to graduate, so assuming she's taken 4 every semester, she'll take a normal 4 that semester and keep going. If memory serves, you can't be enrolled at all with less than three credits, athlete or not. I think they're trying to separate from schools that have part-time students, or something (along the same lines as wanting everyone to live on campus). As for the gender neutrality, I think the image of a monkey as your ID might raise Pat's progressiveness to consider that you're a woman. Perhaps if you're a dude you should go with a skull and crossbones, or a large SUV, or some other macho thing. Or perhaps the anonymity only adds to the Feces Monkey Mystique.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on January 23, 2007, 02:58:51 PM
i do not always agree with the d3hoops poll, however i do appreciate how hard it is to have an accurate poll when no games are televised and there are few out-of-region games, and a lot of the votes are made based on hearsay, how team x and y played against a common opponent, and other forms of opinions that have to be made with out having actually seen a lot of the teams in person. it's not entirely accurate but it does give a broad idea of where teams stand. yes, i would like to see my williams women's team ranked higher but they are "receiving votes" and should not be ranked any higher than 20th. however, the d3 poll has them in the right area of the poll, which is the most you can ask from voters who often times have to vote on teams who they have never seen or have never even seen one of their opponents play. that being said, i didn't like the hope-bowdoin "flopping". i think that if you rank a team 1st, they should remain there until they lose. that's my only real complaint so far this season. yet, i still like the poll for no other reason that it sparks debate/discussion about teams i would otherwise never heard of from outside the NE region.

wawb,
i don't think the season was a failure at all - regular season conference champs, beat #1 bowdoin, coffin nescac POY, etc. however, i was pointing out that when meg coffin returns it is not exactly guaranteed that they will have a long run into the ncaa tourny and should not be the sole reason for her decision to return, which i know it is not completely. last year's team will was about as good as i expect next year's team to be (no whiting, and possibly not the "same" meg coffin balanced out by kostakis and barton with another year of experience). i am in no way trying to quanitfy loss/gain of talent or the extent of an injury, but i still expect last year's and next year's teams to be about comprable....albeit in a much weaker conference. like i've said before, it is obviously meg's decision and i might choose differently if i was actually in her shoes. however, as someone who has sat next to the family when i was both rooting for the same team (for williams and her older brother) and rooting against (when meg played williams), i think they are somewhat missing the point of nescac athletics - excellent athletes who have a chance to have a complete  college experience both socially and academically . again, who am i to decide? but that was what i found to be the best part of being a nescac athlete. just my opinion but i think down the road it could be a little "awkward" explaining in an interview to an employer (who may not understand the importance/significance of athletics and why one would return) why there is a one year gap in her education and why it took her five years to graduate. more importantly, i found spending my senior spring with my classmates to be one of the more special times of my college years. however, i understand this is MY experience and can still respect her decision.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on January 23, 2007, 03:14:07 PM
nescachoops, thanks for the insights. I think there are probably many people who lose sight of the importance of NESCAC athletics, the Coffins wouldn't be the first. As a fan, I'm psyched at the possibilities of next year; I don't know what I'd do in her shoes, mostly because I'm not an athlete so I can't imagine what that part of life means to a person. I hadn't thought about it from an employment standpoint--interesting.

Also, I agree about the poll--let's not be too critical about it (though I think FM is just having some fun). There's no way to make a completely "legitimate" poll in the sense that there's always going to be argument--even if you can see a lot of games, you still might make a different choice than others. I suppose they could use computers but A) that's soulless and a copout and B) look where it got college football. The poll is fun for fans and probably good locker room material, but let's not get too worked up over it. If someone wants some input on their vote, fine; if you don't want to give any input, that's fine too.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 23, 2007, 05:25:24 PM
You want a messed-up poll -- the coaches' poll can't even seem to agree what games it's taking into account.

Rank Institution - First Place Votes Last Week's Rank Record Points
     
1. University of Chicago (Ill.) -7 5 16-0 246
2. Bowdoin College (Maine) - 1 1 17-1 212
3. Messiah College (Pa.) 7T 16-1 206
4. Calvin College (Mich.) 10 15-1 202
5. Wilmington College (Ohio) 9 16-1 196
6. University of Southern Maine 6 15-1 193
7. Howard Payne University (Texas) 12 17-0 192
8. Hope College (Mich.) 3 15-2 191
9. University of Scranton (Pa.) - 2 4 15-2 187
10. University of Rochester (N.Y.) 2 14-2 175

So you tell me -- is it through last night, with Scranton ranked No. 9, or is it through Sunday, with Scranton receiving two first-place votes?

Very strange. I wish the coaches' association took its polling more seriously.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: mytwocents on January 23, 2007, 06:06:12 PM
Must be a typo regarding the 2 first place votes for Scranton?  All the team records seem up to date and with a total 245 of 250 would'nt Chicago have 9 first place votes?  Thanks.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 23, 2007, 08:16:16 PM
A first place vote, like ours, is worth 25, second place is worth 24, third place is worth 23. They have 175 points' worth of first place votes and that means 71 from the other three ballots (24, 24 and 23, or two No. 2 votes and a No. 3).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on January 26, 2007, 07:27:06 PM
i've seen amherst - they are much improved from last year. why #13 (pollack) doesn't start is beyond me. i can see coaches wanting a "spark" off the bench, but she is more than a spark. she is their best player. at the very least, she should pay more minutes. as a williams fan, i suppose it's  fine with me

ill take bowdoin by 10 in a close game that doesn't look as close in the newspaper due to fouling at the end. amherst won't have answers for flaherty underneath.

i hope the ephs have a relatively easy time with the panthers, as i expect they will.

i will be very interested to see the wesleyan/bates score tonight. ill predict the bobcats will win a close one at home.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on January 27, 2007, 10:01:42 AM
Quote from: nescac hoops on January 26, 2007, 07:27:06 PM
i will be very interested to see the wesleyan/bates score tonight. ill predict the bobcats will win a close one at home.
bates 59, wesleyan 56. i'm going to vegas.

whoarewebobcats and feces,
i know you love barton. i, on the other hand, find her overrated. last night she had 6 assists...and 7 turnovers. her assist/turnover ratio is slowly approaching 1:1, which is unacceptable for a point guard (she is 4th in the league for nescac PGs) and completely unacceptable for a PG who had reeived all american nominations. i'm sure not having coffin around puts a lot of pressure on her to create things. however, i have always felt this way about her, even when she had zurek and coffin. she'll throw a really nice no-look pass or two and everybody ooooh's and awwww's - but they miss the part when she then throws 3 more no-look passes into the 6th row in alumni (which is the last row there). thoughts?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bbald eagle on January 27, 2007, 12:53:35 PM
nescac hoops-
monkeys been silent lately. I'm betting monkey can't reply to your questions. I'm betting he's been banned from posting - see below

Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 23, 2007, 02:27:13 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on January 23, 2007, 01:38:15 PM

My ax has been worn down to a nub, and the solicitation of votes by ATN has figuratively snapped the handle. I officially give up trying to legitimize your poll. I do, however, appreciate the gender neutrality in your post. Quite progressive.

Just shut up. It was an exercise in getting people to actually post on the damn board. Some people we don't need to have post on the board. You're one of them.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: JeffRookie2 on January 27, 2007, 12:56:31 PM
Today's game between Amherst and Bowdoin at LeFrak will be webcast by WAMH. You can listen at www.amherst.edu/~wamh.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on January 27, 2007, 02:37:05 PM
first of all, it would be a shame if feces had been banned...they were saying anything inappropriate, they just disagreed with someone and had a little attitude about it. everyone needs to chill out.

I certainly understand the criticisms of Sarah. Naturally, I disagree, and I can't refute the stats you bring forward. She's the kind of player that if you have, you can't imagine the team without, and if you don't have, you can't imagine why you'd want her, in some way, because the entire team's look changes because of her style (the only other person I've described like this is Antoine Walker--I couldn't believe the Celts could ever unload him because he was such a weird player, and I couldn't imagine them without him either. Then again, I hated Antoine, so maybe I shouldn't be admitting this comparison). One thing I'll say for the TO's--Sarah handles the ball a lot. I know most PGs do, but I think she probably has more touches a game than any player on any team. Watch their possessions, the ball often goes through Sarah about 4 times, which could lead to more TOs. Obviously, this theoretically should lead to more assists/shots/etc., so maybe that's not fair. But, that's how I justify the turnovers--I hate turnovers, normally. To me, it's worth all the stuff Sarah does for the team. I think the threat of her creativity/passing ability is just as important as her actually executing that ability. Defenses have to completely change what they do--this happens in the first half of almost all of Bates' games--to combat Sarah, figuring out how much room they can give their defenders and so forth. She has an outstanding basketball IQ, and makes things possible that most players can't. At the expense of executing that IQ and making those things possible, she turns the ball over.

Over her career, her defense has improved markedly, as has her shot, particularly from 3 (I'm not looking at stats, maybe the stats don't reflect it but she has hit many big 3s for that team over recent years). As I've mentioned before, both in conjunction with Sarah and just in our conversation from earlier this week, after opening her career playing with girls who always knew where to be and where all their teammates were (Heather, Olivia, Betsy), Sarah was really able to showcase her skills. With another outstanding ballhandler in the backcourt (Heather), the defensive pressure wasn't as high on Sarah, either. So to some observers, she may have declined, or may now seem overrated after coming out so strong her frosh year. She certainly has made more mistakes and more plays as she becomes more of a feature of the offense (obviously), so if you like her or hate her, that feeling will probably become magnified. She's not a terribly vocal leader (or really vocal at all), which is probably a knock against her as a PG, and Murphy gets more irritated with her than anyone else (especially in big games, Murphy often pulls her out about two minutes in, whether she deserves it or not, just to keep her from taking too many chances). But, you'll notice that, much like Zak for the boys, Sarah plays almost the entire game pretty much every game, and when she's out they don't play as well. They don't keep a +/- stat, as far as I know, so I can't back that up, and given my obvious bias I may be wrong.

In sum, there's nothing I can say, really, to change your mind. She has her weaknesses, and has her strengths. Her TOs are obviously frighteningly high, but I've found a way to excuse it. She's valuable in a way beyond the box score (much like I think Zak is to the boys), and I think when paired with another good ballhandler--much the reason that I call for more Kellie Goodridge--I think she is that much better. That's why when I looked forward to next year, if Meg were to return, she could have the formidable front court of Val, Meg, and Matia, which would rival the frontcourt she played with her frosh year, and Kellie, who to me resembles Heather Taylor in every way, game, look, attitude, etc., I have high hopes for the team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: papabear on January 30, 2007, 02:20:37 AM
All this chatter about Barton, but no speculation about the usually hyped up Bowdoin v Bates game. It is evident that the game will not be that close but if Barton is all that is said it could be close. Predictions ?? Also baring an unforseen incident Bowdoin's Flaherty will break the scoring record tomorrow. Lets hope for a competitive game in a place Bates usually pulls some miracles.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on January 30, 2007, 09:33:55 AM
I've seen the Bates girls several times this year (5 or so?) and I would be very surprised it we could hang with Bowdoin. Matia isn't really a dominant force, she's a great frontline complement to Meg, but without Meg I don't think Matia can do as much--she gets bottled up, shoots too many shots from outside, and the rebounding suffers. Val has really emerged this year, which is great, but I wonder whether she's the caliber player to lead Bates against such a tough team. They basically all need to play out of their minds, and hopefully a large faction of Bates people shows up in the stands like they did for the boys. As always, I'd like to see Kellie Goodridge and Lauren play more, which probably depends on whether Teal is healthy (I haven't heard anything but I know she missed a couple of games--anyone have any info?) and also whether they trust the frosh (Maybe Murphy tightens the reigns and only plays the vets since it's Bowdoin). I expect Bowdoin to jump out early and have Bates keep the lead to 8-12 all game, struggling to stay in it. Granted, I haven't seen Bowdoin this year, but I don't think I have to to expect them to be good.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 30, 2007, 12:57:30 PM
There's talk this game might have an audio broadcast tonight. Check our Scoreboard page later for a link if there is one.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: D3Cast on January 30, 2007, 07:32:03 PM
Yes, it's the 2007 debut of BatesCast at www.batescast.com (http://www.batescast.com). Enjoy!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on January 30, 2007, 08:47:07 PM
To no surprise, Bowdoin wins, 58-50. BatesCast guys did a great job, I caught the second half and felt like I was right there (though, one note--they shouldn't be referred to as the Lady Bobcats at any point, most schools have purposefully removed "lady" from the women's team's names, many didn't have it to begin with). Matia hurt her ankle with a few minutes left and Bowdoin pulled away from there. My crew informed me that Matia was walking, with help, after the game, so maybe it isn't too bad. Sounds like the refereeing was a little inconsistent, but of course Bowdoin is the better team. Sounds like a valiant effort on Bates' part, which is encouraging.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on January 30, 2007, 08:57:12 PM
Of course, Bobcat Broads has a better, and also alliterative, ring to it than Lady Bobcats.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: papabear on January 30, 2007, 10:13:35 PM
Bowdoin wins Flaherty sets record and again Cummings out plays Barton. 5 assists 1 Turnover to Bartons 7 and 5. Why is she not getting consideration as the best point guard?? I do not need to let you know I am a Bowdoin alum, but the numbers speak for themselves....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on January 30, 2007, 11:09:38 PM
Quote from: papabear on January 30, 2007, 10:13:35 PM
Bowdoin wins Flaherty sets record and again Cummings out plays Barton. 5 assists 1 Turnover to Bartons 7 and 5. Why is she not getting consideration as the best point guard?? I do not need to let you know I am a Bowdoin alum, but the numbers speak for themselves....

I really do not want to come across as disrespectul to Katie Cummings or any other player, but Papabear, please,  this is a case where the numbers really do lie.  There is simply no comparison between Barton and Cummings.  Barton is a far superior player - no one could reasonably argue otherwise.  Having said that, Cummings is the perfect fit on the Bowdoin team because she plays very hard, doesn't lose her cool and knows how to play within a team framework which includes a lot of talented teammates.  If she were asked to do what Barton is asked to do it wouldn't be pretty.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on January 31, 2007, 10:07:13 AM
i would not go as far to say that cummings is better than barton - they play on very different teams that having very different players surrounding them. however, i do not think that papabear's statement is too absurd. i have said numerous times that barton is WAY OVERRATED. yes, she can make some nice passes and she single handedly changes the way opponents have to defend bates. however, her speed, shooting percentage, defense, and no look passes that hit observers (which is approaching half now -- 1:1 assist/turnover ratio) leaves something to be desired in a supposed all conference, all american nominee point guard.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on January 31, 2007, 01:50:50 PM
As for the stats, I feel the need to intervene a bit (though I've already written extensively that to me, Sarah's value is beyond what the box score shows)--yes, Cummings A-TO ratio is better, at 4:1. Barton's isn't "approaching" 1:1--it's not getting worse, it's at 1.5:1, which obviously isn't great, but I've already made my case for the TO numbers. Bowdoin is so well-balanced that Cummings is the 7th highest scorer on the team and plays 27 minutes. Sarah is Bates' third-highest scorer (and shoots 35% not great, but better than Cummings' 31%) while playing 35 mins a game (I'd be curious to see how many players play more than Barton). Her speed is below-avg. for a PG, but her size is above-average. This kind of argument doesn't do a whole lot for me anyway--I agree with whoever said that it's not even really a fair comparison based on what their teams ask of them--but I just wanted to put some of those stats out there.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: papabear on February 01, 2007, 01:55:39 AM
Enough of these stats that mean nothing. I was at the game last night and Barton throws the ball around the gym routinely, into the stands off walls and once and a while makes a fantastic pass that her teamates are not ready for. Cummings is the 7th scorrer and that is because she knows her role. She can score when needed and has scored this season.. Flaherty has got over 300 assists from Cummings and the bottom line is BOWDOIN wins. Barton's team will be lucky to win a NESCAC game come tourney time, and Cummings is a leader much more than the stats show.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on February 01, 2007, 09:28:34 AM
Saying that Cummings is better than Barton because Bowdoin is better than Bates makes zero sense. I already said that the teams ask different things of each player. You have the no. 2 team in the country, be happy about it. There's no question that Bowdoin is better than Bates, I'm pretty sure I never challenged that. I only brought the stats in because nescachoops was throwing around estimations that weren't true. If Sarah really "threw the ball around the gym occasionally making an assist", then her TOs would be far higher than her assists, so obviously that also is hyperbole. If you find her overrated, fine. If you like Cummings better, that's fine too.

BTW, if you want to throw stats out the window, you're going against the trend in evaluating sports that is being established at every level in every sport. Though I agree that stats don't say everything (namely because we don't measure everything), and have supported my case for Sarah time and again with non-statistical material, they have to be considered.

I never said that Bates would definitely win a tourney game (they'll probably win one, though), nor did I say Bowdoin wouldn't. Bowdoin's success also doesn't reflect Cummings as a leader; and Bates' lesser success doesn't mean that Sarah leads less. They each have different roles, it's a useless comparison, I don't know how many times I have to say it. I was simply clarifying the unsupported statements nescachoops was providing.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on February 01, 2007, 11:24:25 AM
wawb,
i think barton is a very good player...with a lot of very big flaws for a pt. guard. she is very good - i just do not think that she is all-american material and maybe not even all conference (maybe 2nd team) worthy this year.
also, who do you see the bobcats beating in the first round? they will most likely be away in the first round against amherst, tufts, or williams - most likely amherst i think, a team they lost to in a game that wasn't all that close.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on February 01, 2007, 11:52:31 AM
nescachoops- I'm not sure where all of this all-American talk comes from, I definitely never said anything of the sort. Was she nominated last year? I wouldn't say she is "all-American" material, at least this year. She certainly isn't flawless, I just happen to enjoy watching her and would want her running my team.

Looking at the standings, they would play Amherst is the season ended today, but they would host the game, and the game they lost (65-51) was at Amherst. I can see them winning at home, though the Alumni crowd post-05 has been disappointing (for both the men and the women). But, looking at the schedule left, it looks like they should go (using present rankings) 2-2, leaving them at 5-4 in the conference, probably not good enough to hold on to the 4th seed. So maybe you're right. I honestly (obviously) didn't put a whole lot of thought into that part of it, I was just responding to the insinuations made. This has been a pretty under-whelming year as far as the girls go--other than Val's emergence as a pretty serious player and Lauren Yanofsky, the whole team has looked pretty lax in my opinion. But I wouldn't sleep on them in the first round, either, because they have plenty of talent and a good coach, they just need to put things together. Part of that is getting higher-percentage shots (the games I've seen have Matia shooting from too far outside, just like Stockwell for the boys--but I'm a traditionalist in that sense: if you're big, stay underneath), and part of that responsibility lies with Sarah to create those looks.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on February 01, 2007, 12:00:05 PM
wawb,
http://www.d3hoops.com/tow/wompreallam07.htm
she was nominated as a preseason all american. not by you, but by d3hoops. i don't think she is worhty of it - great player but not an all american.
bates is ahead of amherst right now HOWEVER amherst has already played bowdoin, and bates hasn't played their conference game with them, which is at bowdoin i believe. amherst has games remaining with all the CONN team - wesleyan is the only game i could see them losing, however they did beat them already in a non-conference game. thus, i have a feeling amherst will host that game given the two team's remaining schedules and that amherst has the head-to-head advantage.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on February 01, 2007, 01:33:52 PM
ah, well, 4th team...I don't know, I've never seen any of those other girls. Hard to say, but I wouldn't say her play of this year has been "all-American" stature, in part because of her own flaws and in part because of Bates'.

I agree completely about the scheduling the rest of the way, that's why I forecasted Bates at 5-4 at the end, and probably not good enough for the 4th seed.

Yes, Bates' conference game is at Bowdoin, in a week or two. I would give them a little more chance than most only because having just played them, I think a lot of Bowdoin's tendencies, etc., will be fresh in Bates' mind (obviously this goes both ways, but that sort of advantage usually goes to the lesser team). It's sort of like how they say in professional football that it's hard to beat the same team three times in a year, even if it's the best and worst teams matching up. If teams are familiar with one another, there's more of a chance of an upset. But, don't get me wrong, I don't *expect* Bates to win, Bowdoin is no. 2 in the country for a reason, and Bates didn't receive a single top 25 vote for a reason.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: papabear on February 01, 2007, 05:05:47 PM
Ok this bates homer will not change his opinion obviously. Bates has zero 000000 chance against BOWDOIN at Bowdoin the last weekend of the season, with senior week and all the other reasons Pemper would not allow a loss. How can you even think that, they should have lost by twenty the other night to Bowdoin at Bates. The place will be packed and it will be the last time the Bowdoin seniors get to play bates. Look for a big game by Flaherty and Cummings who both will want to go out at home against their rivals in style. Bowdoin by 18
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on February 01, 2007, 05:40:03 PM
Papabear, please read my posts more carefully.

First, I didn't say I thought Bates would win. It is unlikely. I'm a little tired of repeating myself to you, but I will because you don't seem to be reading me correctly: Bowdoin is a better team than Bates. By a pretty significant margin.

But I can't let you get away with the way you provide evidence for what you say. There is never a game in which a team as zero chance of winning. If they show up and field players, they immediately have a chance. If they have some talent, then they have a little more of a chance. I think you get where I'm going. Did I say Bates had a great chance against Bowdoin? My exact words: "I would give them a little more chance than most," i.e., most people, like you think they have zero chance and will lose big, whereas I'd put them in the 10% range. Second, a coach cannot just command victory. "Pemper would not allow a loss?" What, then, would she do if they did indeed lose by some mysterious fluke? It is without question that she will have her team prepared to win. I don't think the rivalry is as heated as it was a few years ago since Bates isn't as serious of a contender, but it's obviously a game Bowdoin wants to win, and a time in the season where they want to develop momentum if they have national championship aspirations, which I'm sure they do. I don't doubt that the place will be packed, and I don't doubt that Flaherty will want to go out big. Bowdoin is the overwhelming favorite, no one denies this.

So, no, I won't change my opinion. But I'd appreciate it if you understood my opinion. I would expect Bowdoin to win, much as I expected them to in the non-conference game, which, you'll remember, was at Bates (and by the way, statements like "they should have lost by twenty the other night" have absolutely no validity. What didn't go Bowdoin's way that kept them from winning by 20? Bates had the lead down to 2 or 3 with a few minutes left despite losing Matia to injury. I wasn't at the game, but I did listen to it on BatesCast. Also, if they "should have lost by 20" at home the other night, why do you project them to lose only by 18 at Bowdoin? That seems illogical.). I am open to changing my opinions on things--if not, why would I even read other people's posts, or even be on here in the first place?--but arguments without evidence don't change my opinion. Your post failed by providing unjustified claims and misunderstanding my stance.

I'll state again, just for clarity: Bowdoin is better than Bates, and I expect them to win.

And, I'll state again: please read my posts more carefully.

Moving on: that game is a week away--anyone have any feelings on the games slated for this weekend?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: papabear on February 01, 2007, 07:27:04 PM
In response to whoarewebobcats:
    They  (BOWDOIN) have lost one time in the last five years at home. It was at the buzzer on a 25 footer last month. They are coming down to the stretch of NESCAC and heading to the postseason and will want to go in on a role plus they just don't like Bates. Marta was a non factor at all the other night so that is irrelevant. Evidenced by Flaherty taking 12 free throws. It is senior weekend in a packed Bowdoin gym. If you give them a 10 percent chance to win your nuts. I understand that you are not claiming they are better I am just telling you the percentages since you like to work with them so much are 1 out of 76  or 1.125 percent.... Then take into account the previous statements above and I would give them about a 1-250 chance of winning. Those are the facts I enjoy your post's but believe they are misguided in your bias towards a average at best team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on February 01, 2007, 08:06:43 PM
Now we're talkin! It doesn't surprise me that Matia was a non-factor, part of what has underwhelmed me about the Bobcats this year is her inability to be a dominate force underneath. I wish she had a little of the mean streak that Meg has. To me, the team plays a little soft as is--that's why I loved that 05 team (that and that they were much better overall!)...toughness all around. I still have hopes for Matia--she has all kinds of talent, there's no denying, I just don't think she's using it properly, or maybe defenses just focus on her too much and Val looks better playing against weaker defenders/less attention, who knows.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on February 02, 2007, 03:24:49 PM
as a male i found the front page article on d3 hoops on the upper right hand corner about the louisiana college team "walking out" to be a real shocker. apparently one the girls to walk out of practiced cited the following reason, as told by her father... "They didn't do it to hurt the basketball program," said Lynn Peairs, Ashley's father. "They came into a program where basketball was secondary and helping the girls become well-rounded, moral, Christian girls was more important. I think they knew after a week or so (into the preseason) that that program is no longer there." i guess it's shocking to think that girls in this day in age think like that, especially from an athlete nonetheless. glad to be on the east coast.

i think the games in medford and lewiston will be the most interesting. the status of kostakis will be a major factor in the williams game - if she isn't healthy, i don't see the game being terribly close. however, if she is i think the ephs will have a tough win. i think midd-tufts will be an intersting game to see where both teams stand but i suspect tufts will win. midd-bates will be a close one if kostakis is not healthy. and obviously, i think the game of the weekend will b/t the ephs and jumbos to declare 2nd place in the conference. ephs will win a tight one.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on February 02, 2007, 10:15:30 PM
Bates 60 Williams 59.  To answer the arguments as to whether Bates will get a home game this win certainly helped, and the team who would likely get left out?  Williams as they would lose the tie breaker to Bates.  There's still a lot of basketball to go, but I have to think that this win puts Bates into the top 4.

To use my alliteration of the day:  I'm perplexed by their persistant perimeter play.  Williams best players are O'Malley and Miller.  There strength is size, strength, and total domination of the paint.  On top of that Matia Kostakis is out with an ankle injurty (sustained against Bowdoin).  Williams should have been able to pick on Beckwith at will because she's just way to small to handle the big strong 6-foot centers without getting seriously into foul trouble early, and I reference Eileen Flaherty's ability to handle Beckwith relatively routinley to back up this statment.  Although I'm concerned with her foul trouble, Kostakis is a better matchup because that lob that Beckwith can never reach is not high enough to elude a taller Kostakis (and if it were it would also be over Flaherty's head and go out of bounds).

My question is this:  If Williams best players, and their strength, is in the paint, and Bates' weakness is strength in the paint given their lack of defensive size to be able to stop opponents without getting into foul trouble and having Kostakis out with an injury,  then why didn't Williams ever try to pound the ball in to the centers and big forwards and take control with strong post play, control of the paint, and the ownership of the boards that they had anyway?

More than half of Williams shots was from the outside (it reminded me of the mens team) and although they weren't bad, they weren't good either.  Bates won the points in the paint battle 24-20.  This is inexcusable for a team whose captain is the center.  Maggie miller had only 3 points (all on foul shots) and she only had 3 shot attempts from the field.  Why didn't the Ephs best player get a lot more touches, and why didn't the Ephs try to post?  The reason that Miller only got 3 shots is not the Bates defense, as good as they were, but more because of the small number of attempts that Williams made to go inside.

As much as I enjoyed the Bates victory, I wouldn't be fair if I didn't consider the possibility that Williams choice of strategy turned into their own worst enemy.  Bates played well, but I've got to believe that Williams would have done better if they'd played to their strength.

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on February 02, 2007, 10:19:40 PM
What a game! Bates wins 60-59 without Matia, and despite shooting 32.5%. Quick officiating note: Um, the officiating was pretty terrible, on both sides. The refs blew a lot of calls in Williams' favor in the first half, made up for it in the first part of the second half, and then did a pretty decent job at the end of the game. It was one of those weird games where the fans hated every call, and the refs managed to make the wrong call on many different plays, ultimately I think relatively evenly, but individually missed a lot of calls.

The most exciting part of the game, especially given all the talk about Sarah on this board recently, was a little personal drama on the side. She played a strong first half but in the second half with 7 minutes left made two turnovers on consecutive possessions, causing Murphy to yell, to no one in particular "Get her out of there!" and push Maggie toward the scorer's table. When Sarah came out, he instructed her to take care of the ball, and then said, "Enough with the turnovers--you're a junior" and walked away. It was kind of dramatic, very movie-like. Williams immediately closed what had been (I think) a 4 pt gap, taking the lead within about 40 seconds, and Murphy called for Sarah to go back in. He was very nice with her the rest of the way through--at every timeout he would say something encouraging to her and pat her on the head or smile or something. And she came through--no more TOs, and then with a minute left down a point, Sarah got the ball at the foul line, back to the basket, looked for passes and seeing nothing took a step back and pulled up for an 18-footer. As soon as she released it, she started to go back on D--no question she would make it. Williams scored, leaving Bates with the ball with 28 seconds, down a point. Murphy drew up a play they had already run: get Sarah the ball on the right wing off a pick from Lauren Yanofsky, who then curled to the basket looking for a lob pass. Since they had already seen it, Williams pounced, doubling Sarah and deflecting her pass. Val came up with it and when the D collapsed on her she hit Teal on the baseline, who calmly laid the ball in. 13 seconds left, Williams timeout. Bates put on a full court trap, Williams crossed the half court line with about 7 seconds and got the ball to no. 14, Meghan Stetson, who had 33 points on the game, tried to free herself for a shot, couldn't, kicked the ball to the wing, and Lauren Yanofsky deflected the shot as the clock expired. Alumni exploded (kind of a pathetic crowd actually, but those of us who were there were happy), and Murphy couldn't contain himself. I've never seen him so happy. It was a masterful coaching job, evenly pacing 2nd half timeouts to keep the girls fresh and aggressive in their 2-3 zone (caused 25 turnovers), motivating Sarah, and calling plays.

Val finished with 27, 8 boards; Lauren Yanofsky had 11 rebounds and did all kinds of great things (despite shooting 0-12), Maggie Fitzgerald hustled and scored 10, Sarah had 8 assists vs. 3 turnovers.

And did I mention Matia didn't play?

Very exciting game--especially encouraging given that they have been pretty lax on D all year and not very dynamic on offense. A thrilling night in Alumni, showing promise for the future, and now at 4-2, maybe some for the present. I won't be able to make it to tomorrow's game, and I kind of worry about a letdown after such an emotional win, but who knows. Wonderful night in Lewiston.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on February 02, 2007, 10:23:10 PM
Red-- I was also confused about that--did you notice about halfway through the 2nd half, after no. 14 missed a few consecutive shots, they looked underneath and got a couple of quick easy layups? Where did that go? One thing I'll say in Bates' favor about that was that many times when the ball was dumped to the middle of the zone, Val knocked it away, or one of the wing players--usually Maggie or Sarah--would collapse and either knock it away or force them back outside. A strong defensive effort by Bates, mostly based on energy, but I definitely agree--odd strategy by Williams, and they never adjusted to the zone, they just tried to shoot around it. That usually doesn't work over the course of 40 minutes.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on February 02, 2007, 11:10:40 PM
From Red: My question is this:  If Williams best players, and their strength, is in the paint, and Bates' weakness is strength in the paint given their lack of defensive size to be able to stop opponents without getting into foul trouble and having Kostakis out with an injury,  then why didn't Williams ever try to pound the ball in to the centers and big forwards and take control with strong post play, control of the paint, and the ownership of the boards that they had anyway

Err...at the risk of annoying Simon and Feces.....I respectfully submit that the Williams program is not being coached at the highest possible level......

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on February 03, 2007, 04:57:34 AM
I don't know enough about coaching basketball to agree or disagree with Remsleep, but I was certainly surprised that Williams didn't make a change in strategy when they came out for the second half.  Especially given that the first half showed that the strategy didn't work. 

I did notice that Williams got a couple of easy layups in the middle of the second half.  I was sitting down at that end, and I can't say that it looked to me like they "looked" to go inside so much as they were not fully in control of the play and #25 (whose name I regretfully cannot remember) found herself with the ball and no one between her and the basket.  This was partially able to happen because of Bates' adjustment for the 2 outside shooters.  Bates does not rotate back to the weak side or their zone very well (and I'd guess Williams tried, albeit unsuccessfully, to exploit that) leaving shooters open.  In the second half Bates adjusted by not bringing the back side of the zone in as far to protect against the inside pass and post style play as it normally would if one of the 2 shooters was out there.  Williams, however, made no offensive adjustment in the second half and Bates' adjustment proved to be successful.  By not allowing the zone to collapse it did allow Williams to grab lose balls underneath, hence 25 getting those surprisingly easy layups.  It looked like Bates began to collapse the weak side and knock more balls away later in the second half when Williams proved to be rather cold from the outside.

Another thing that Whoarewe mentions that I did also notice was that Val was able to knock away quite a few balls.  This is because the fews times Williams did try to go in it was always with the bounce-pass.  This low type of pass is something Val can react to quickly and get a hand on.  As Bowdoin has shown time and again, the correct approach to getting inside against Val is to come in high (as in over her head).  The height disadvantage was so great under there that if they had lobbed it over Val she wouldn't have been able to get to it and that would have left O'Malley, Miller, or one of the other 6 or 7 six-footers with easy lay-ups.  Val never plays behind the defender because she's too small to stop them from posting up on her and she knows it, so she has to play in front and try to keep the ball from getting to them.  The bounce-passes were just what she needed.

I say this all the time, and I'll say it one more time, Bates needs to get more ball-fakes into their game.  Williams plays very tight defense and I really think that Bates could have had more offensive success by making ball-fakes and driving past defenders who didn't leave themselves enough space to react.  The same is true when playing Bowdoin.  Although the Polar Bears do leave themselves enough space, and are a phenominal defensive team, they do tend to fall for solid ball-fakes.  This was especially true of Pourevalis who graduated last year, and I feel that no team, especially Bates, really took enough advantage of it then, nor do they now.

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on February 03, 2007, 06:38:23 PM
Bates 70 Midd 65.  Nothing spectacular to note.  Just the score.

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on February 05, 2007, 12:54:48 PM
remsleep,
a buddy of mine works up at bates and went to the bates/williams game and jokingly asked me "how did #21 get into williams? she made some plays that were really dumb that cost them the game." i have never heard great things about the williams coaching but some things players do you can't control as a coach. i would think that without kostakis and coffin, that williams should have been able to win without ANY coach. i guess not. tough weekend for the ephs. that hurts.

kudos to the bobcats - i don't expect them to beat bowdoin but they are really setting themselves up for a REALLY good year in '07-'08
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 08, 2007, 12:20:48 AM
Quote from: remsleep on February 02, 2007, 11:10:40 PM
Err...at the risk of annoying Simon and Feces.....I respectfully submit that the Williams program is not being coached at the highest possible level......

And I respectfully submit that, in lieu of recent events, remsleep may be correct.

The conference so far, in order:

Bowdoin: Top team in the conference/region and a lock for the postseason, but the impending game against Tufts obviously looms. While the Jumbos are the threat of the week, certainly the industrial school in Lewiston has made its presence known. Likely finish: 26-1.

Tufts: The Jumbos have certainly made their presence known, but their recent surge (5-1) has mirrored a six-game home streak. As impressive as the Bates and Williams victories were, this is the same team that lost to Wheaton (which lost to the Ephs by 25). I'll give the UConn alum her "propers" and assume she has the Pachyderms just where she wants them. Best case scenario has Tufts 18-8.

Bates:  You just know that Red, WAWB, Rufus and the rest of the Bobcat contingent are just waiting for the postseason because Bates is scary right now. The best non-AQ scenario for the Bobcats is 17-9, which is unlikely to be enough, but Murphy spooks the hell out of me right now, nevermind next year. Honestly, I don't want to talk about this team anymore.

Williams: I think I've figured out the Ephs. They are the team no one outside the NESCAC wants to see. All of the in-conference teams have them figured out, but those not used to the inside presence (Messiah '06, etc.) can't handle it. NESCAChoops' girls are going to make the tourney, and I bet they're actually gonna do pretty well. But in terms of (my) preseason expectations? Low. Finish: 21-6

Wesleyan: The Cardinals have had no right to earn an NCAA bid for the past two seasons, but somehow managed to massage a bid. Barring an AQ, the ride stops here. Best case scenario is 17-9

The Rest: Amherst-- needs Prozac. Can hammer Wesleyan and Bates, and then lose to Mnt. Holyoke and Piedmont (?). Middlebury -- should be a lot better, but at least they beat Piedmont (?). Trinity & Colby -- no excuses. Conn. College -- I'll be wearing my Camel t-shirt this weekend praying for the .500 record.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on February 08, 2007, 02:39:51 AM
Unless someone takes out bowdoin in the nescac tournament for the first time ever the only possible class C team from our league is Williams (barring anymore bad losses). 

I don't know about the rest of Nescac, but the reason that Bates beat Williams wasn't because the bobcats were able to handle the Ephs inside game.  It was because Williams never used their inside game.  They didn't attempt to go inside more than a few times in the whole game.

Bates is finally figuring out how to play this game again.  If there's going to be a spoiler in the Nescac tournament this year, look for it to be the Bobcats.

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 08, 2007, 04:22:36 PM
Quote from: Red1 on February 08, 2007, 02:39:51 AM
Unless someone takes out bowdoin in the nescac tournament for the first time ever the only possible class C team from our league is Williams (barring anymore bad losses). 

I think if Tufts finishes 18-8 (which is feasible) they will get serious consideration. Wesleyan was sitting at 18-7 last year with a quarterfinal NESCAC loss and still got in.

The wild card will be how the other conferences in the region play out. I see two possible, if not likely, landmines for Pool C bids. It wouldn't suprise me if Salem State knocks off Fitchburg in the MASCAC and Maine Maritime lost to UMF (which they've already done twice). If this happens, it is conceivable both Williams and Brandeis could be left out.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: atn alum on February 09, 2007, 11:38:27 AM
would be 8 regional losses for tufts, and that may be too much to overcome when the committee looks at things like regional win pct and quality-of-wins...I believe two of wesleyans losses last yr in regular season were out of region...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 09, 2007, 12:11:09 PM
Quote from: atnwriter on February 09, 2007, 11:38:27 AM
would be 8 regional losses for tufts, and that may be too much to overcome when the committee looks at things like regional win pct and quality-of-wins...I believe two of wesleyans losses last yr in regular season were out of region...

I forget about the in/out-of-region stuff, and I'll also admit to having a remedial grasp on the whole quality of win ratio. I was just eye-balling it. I guess I'd like to think a 7-1/8-0 team in the NESCAC would be a contender w/o an AQ.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 09, 2007, 02:23:25 PM
When you only play one quarter of your games in conference the conference record doesn't carry the same weight. There's a lot more outside games you can screw up your record with. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 09, 2007, 02:49:00 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 09, 2007, 02:23:25 PM
When you only play one quarter of your games in conference the conference record doesn't carry the same weight. There's a lot more outside games you can screw up your record with. :)

To be fair, it's over a third of the games (9-of-24). However, I will side-step the whole double round-robin dilemma for fear of starting down a path that has already been beaten (to death).

Quick picks:

Bates over Colby by 15.
Bowdoin over Tufts by 3.
Wesleyan over Midd by 7.
Williams over Conn. College by 27.

Tufts over Colby by 21.
Williams over Wesleyan by 6.
Middlebury over Conn. College by 11.
Amherst over Trinity by 2. In overtime.
Bowdoin over Bates by 4.

If Bowdoin was on the road, I would have picked a split. I think the mostly likely loss would come to Bates.

This would make the conference quarters:

Trin at Bow
Midd at Tufts
Amherst at Bates
Wesleyan at Williams
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 09, 2007, 02:51:02 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on February 09, 2007, 02:49:00 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 09, 2007, 02:23:25 PM
When you only play one quarter of your games in conference the conference record doesn't carry the same weight. There's a lot more outside games you can screw up your record with. :)

To be fair, it's over a third of the games (9-of-24). However, I will side-step the whole double round-robin dilemma for fear of starting down a path that has already been beaten (to death).

Right. But compared to conferences where it's two-thirds, three-quarters, it's not as significant.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on February 09, 2007, 03:36:08 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on February 09, 2007, 02:49:00 PM
Bowdoin over Tufts by 3.

The three points are a home court advantage. 
I would take Tufts, in Medford, by 8
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on February 09, 2007, 04:48:58 PM
  would be surprised if bowdoin beats tufts by less than ten. tufts is ok, but other than a couple of their guards, they are slow,but big
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on February 09, 2007, 05:02:29 PM
Quote from: pureshooter on February 09, 2007, 04:48:58 PM
  would be surprised if bowdoin beats tufts by less than ten. tufts is ok, but other than a couple of their guards, they are slow,but big

Your more than likely right, I forgot about the Morrell Gym factor!  :o
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on February 09, 2007, 10:12:02 PM
The Bowdoin-Tufts game was a rout:

Bowdoin 60 Tufts 41
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on February 10, 2007, 08:44:31 AM
 i figured bowdoin would win easy. unless bates pulls the upset, don't think bowdoin will lose within the nescac tournament.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on February 10, 2007, 08:42:34 PM
This was a real thumping:

Bowdoin 78 Bates 47
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 11, 2007, 01:56:08 PM
Oh, the humanity.

After playing relatively poorly offensively on Friday night (and still winning by 19), Bowdoin hangs the worst loss on Bates in the past 20 years of the rivalry. And with the men's team also losing to Bowdoin, they're going to have to start collecting belts and shoelaces in Lewiston.

Tournament shook out as expected. Williams needs to get to the semis to assure an at-large bid, and that will likely do it for the conference.

All-conference honors:

First Team
Flaherty, Bowdoin
Miller, Williams
Cox, Trinity
Barton, Bates
Anelauskas, Bowdoin

Second Team
Krah, Tufts
Cummings, Bowdoin
Beckwith, Bates
Stetson, Williams
Fourney, Wesleyan

Wow, that was surprisingly difficult. The league coaches tend to go with seniors and having the better teams represented. This is the team I would go with, although I think Kostakis will bump Anelauskas, and Anelauskas will bump Fourney off the second team. It's kind of wrong that Bates would get two on the first team, but there is a tendency to reward "time served."

Tufts coach earned coach of year, but Pemper will likely get it. Flaherty is a lock for POY. Not many impact freshman, so it will likely go to one of the bottom-feeders (Card, Tri; Frazer, CC; or Cappelloni, Col).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on February 12, 2007, 11:46:28 PM
This probably should be posted in the "General Issues" area but I decided that putting it here would be most appropriate because of how erudite the NESCAC crowd is.
All of my Bowdoin, Amherst,etc acquaintances assumed that readers from the other conferences probably wouldn't be able to stick with an article this lengthy so best to post it where it will be fully read and comprehended.
Anyhow, from today's Times:  http://www.nytimes.com/2007/02/13/sports/othersports/13ncaa.html
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 13, 2007, 01:11:07 AM
Rem,

I first heard about the concept of breaking up DIII in 1996 when the NCAA created a committee to examine the premise. Many of the issues rehashed by the Times article -- this is a pretty old concept, and one that has been covered before -- are the ones the original committee ran up against. The Annapolis Group also briefly touched on this subject but found athletics to be too dirty a subject for their "erudite" minds to be bothered with.

The crux of the Times article:

"One division would require institutions to play a large number of sports, perhaps as many as 18, and would restrict athletic departments in the sensitive areas of recruiting, the lengths of playing seasons and number of off-season practices. The other division would be more permissive in its recruiting, practice and competition rules, and require as few as 6 to 10 sports so that members could more easily focus on high-profile sports."

The first sentence is essentially verbatim from the NESCAC handbook. And if you think back to pre-1993, the NESCAC was D4. The second sentence is basically your large public schools (ex: the Wisconsin franchises) with their redshirts, non-traditional seasons, and tiny offerings.

I've honestly been waiting for the pendulum to swing back toward the Dark Ages in the NESCAC for quite some time. Shortly after the elmination of the ECACs (2001 maybe?), I thought the conference was going to opt to allow just the AQ to accept an NCAA bid in each sport (no Pool Cs) but a cabal of school presidents did not let that happen. And I don't foresee it happening anytime soon.

There might be a move from a couple of the NESCAC-chasing conferences (Centennial, UAA, SCAC) to get in line with the D4 concepts espoused by the NESCAC, like eliminating non-traditional season, reining in recruiting, etc., but I don't see an official split in D3 coming anytime soon. If the NESCAC, as a whole, cannot agree upon solution, there won't be one on a national level.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on February 15, 2007, 01:09:11 PM
anybody have any predictions for this weekend? i think i feel an upset in the making. amherst has already shown that they are able to beat the bobcats, but it will be a much harder task up in lewiston this time. i think midd could easily catch tufts off-guard and i have been surprised that midd hasn't been better this year. that being said, i think they have some talent that is capable of taking down the jumbos. i think williams is better than wesleyan but it's always tough to beat a team for the third time in a season, not to mention that the two teams played last week. aside from the bowdoin/trinity game, i think it should be a pretty interesting weekend. we'll see...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: papabear on February 15, 2007, 05:00:39 PM
Aside from the Trinity / Bowdoin game? I think Trinity has a shot to knock of the Polar bears. Sarah Cox has played well lately, and Bowdoin has really been sloppy in their last two contests. Flaherty needs to play like an All American, too much inconsistency, and free throws have been very problematic of late. Clearly the best team in the Northeast/ country, with one of the best five players in the country but they need to play better or they will get knocked out early in NCAA'S.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on February 15, 2007, 06:54:00 PM
The smart money doesn't buy the proposition that having beaten a team twice in a season causes beating it a third time to be more difficult.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 16, 2007, 07:53:30 PM
Overall, I agree with papabear.

I think Tufts will beat Middlebury by a wider margin than Bowdoin over Trinity. Bates will win comfortably, likely by 12+. Wesleyan-Williams is the game of the weekend. The Lady Ephs should be a no-brainer, but they just don't inspire confidence right now. Regardlesss, I'll take -- as Frank Uible would say -- the "Broads from Billsville."
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on February 16, 2007, 08:03:41 PM
Did I ever say that? I don't think so but wish I had.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on February 16, 2007, 08:13:18 PM
 bowdoin beat trinity by 15 on the road, i think they'll be better this time around. williams-wesleyan should be good. did williams underachieve a bit this year? only saw them play once.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 16, 2007, 08:42:39 PM
Quote from: frank uible on January 30, 2007, 08:57:12 PM
Of course, Bobcat Broads has a better, and also alliterative, ring to it than Lady Bobcats.

My mistake. I just remembered B's.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on February 17, 2007, 05:51:38 PM
Saw the Bates/Amherst game...Bates won relatively comfortably, double digits. It was close throughout the first half (my grandpa on their performance: "It was like they found a new way to turn the ball over each possession") and Murphy pulled Sarah twice to settle her down (and then had an aneurysm over something she did on the second half, even though they were up 15). Matia did a bunch of good little things, on the floor for the ball, hustling a lot. Maggie and Katie really played well--I'm continually impressed with how much they both have improved. My girl Lauren Yanofsky did a bunch of good things but it didn't show up much in the box score (the box score is crazy...Sarah went 11/8/6 with 6 TOs, Katie led the team in scoring (hit 5 threes)). The funniest moment of the afternoon came when Murphy wanted the team to run the clock out with about two minutes left and Maggie was wide open for three with about 20 seconds left on the shot clock, and let it go, and Murphy started to yell "Maggie!" all disgustedly, and the ball rolled in and he dropped his head and smiled. They pulled away early in the second half...I think Amherst only scored 2 points for the first 6 or 8 minutes of the 2nd half while Bates just piled it on. Sarah, Lauren, and Val were excellent passers throughout the game (the 6 TOs are obviously troubling for Sarah [including one that literally did go into the stands, nescac hoops :)], but they mostly came in the first eight minutes, she really settled down and played an excellent game thereafter). They looked pretty good, a little streaky, but overall good. Amherst looked lousy...I didn't see a whole lot of good things that they did, except that they seemed to be excellent three point shooters and their PG on the bench (no. 13) was very quick and creative (but small). I've never seen a player rely on illegal activity as much as Amherst's no. 21 (Swensen, I think her name was), who committed about a dozen illegal screen, and pushed every player she screened, rebounded against, or went by. It was pretty impressive how much she got away with, but also kind of unbelievable that their coach encourages such play. All in all a nice afternoon at Alumni, even though it was basically empty while the school was on break.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 17, 2007, 06:38:26 PM
Quote from: whoarewebobcats on February 17, 2007, 05:51:38 PM
my grandpa on their performance: "It was like they found a new way to turn the ball over each possession"

If the NCAA was ever going to devise a comprehensive marketing slogan for Division III women's basketball, a la the NBA's "It's FANtastic" campaign, this would likely be it. With an exclamation point.

Quote from: papabear on February 15, 2007, 05:00:39 PM
Sarah Cox has played well lately, and Bowdoin has really been sloppy in their last two contests. Flaherty needs to play like an All American, too much inconsistency, and free throws have been very problematic of late. Clearly the best team in the Northeast/ country, with one of the best five players in the country but they need to play better or they will get knocked out early in NCAA'S.

Papabear pretty much described the Polar Bears win over Trinity, and he wrote it mid-week. An underwhelming effort, to say the least, for Bowdoin. The Bantams were probably one of three teams in the conference against whom the Polar Bears could give such a performance and get away with it. I want to be clear that I don't think it's a matter of effort; the shots just weren't falling. With that said, I think it was pretty clear from January on that Bowdoin would only go as far as its defense would take it.

As predicted, the Jumbos coasted comfortably. Congrats to the Ephs for clinching a Pool C bid with their 20th win. It will interesting see what version of the this mercurial Williams team the East Region sees in the tourney. Bates at home against a mediocre team -- the results were predictable.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on February 20, 2007, 08:48:42 AM
Quote from: feces monkey on February 17, 2007, 06:38:26 PM
Congrats to the Ephs for clinching a Pool C bid with their 20th win. It will interesting see what version of the this mercurial Williams team the East Region sees in the tourney.

feces,
i was up in williamstown this weekend to watch the men's and women's game. i was only able to see half the women's game but, in talking to people, i don't think they see themselves getting in if they were to lose next weekend. obviously, the committee may think differently but many surrounding the ephs don't think they have had the season/wins that they had the year before to get in with a pool c bid unless they have under their belts like bowdoin. last year, EVERY team they lost to made it to the tourny. this year they have lost to teams like salem st., tufts, bates, etc. who will probably not make the tourny unless there is a major upset. last year they also had wins against tourny teams like wesleyan, bates, springfield etc.. wesleyan, springfield, bates were ranked when they beat them last year (or receiving votes). this year they have yet to get a defining win....or atleast that's what a lot of people think up in williamstown. i don't really understand pool c pick all the time but i think that the ephs would do better in the tourny than a lot of other NE pool c contenders...norwich. i'm also sligtly skeptical about a team like framingham st. but their record is very strong. i think the ephs need favorites to win their respective conferences and for the committee to take into account how well they did in the tourny last year to get in. obviously, i think if the ephs can't beat bowdoin this weekend to advance and get a good win under their belts then they have a VERY strong shot of getting in with a win like that.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 20, 2007, 09:07:34 AM
NH,

Interesting. The committee is a funny bird, so I suppose it's possible that Williams wouldn't make it with a 20-6 record (their likely record), but it seems odd for the NESCAC to qualify three Pool C teams for the tourney last year, and then get shutout even with a 20-win squad. And according to Pat Coleman's QoWI rankings on the Pool C board, Williams is 11th in the country in that quotient.

If the Pool A's play out as expected in the region, Williams should get in over Norwich (talk about a team with no quality wins), UMF/MMA and Brandeis. If the Ephs do get in, they would likely clean up again as they would be thrown into the East region, the sorriest of them all, to start.

I'm interested to see how the brackets shake out in the Northeast. Bowdoin and Emmanuel will likely host, and hopefully they won't send all the Maine teams to Brunswick and all the Mass. teams to the Fens. A little variety would be nice.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on February 20, 2007, 10:53:22 AM
monkey,
  How far do you see Bowdoin going in the NCAA Tournament this year?
They will surely miss the presence of Pourevalis.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 20, 2007, 11:26:11 AM
Quote from: Balder Eagle on February 20, 2007, 10:53:22 AM
How far do you see Bowdoin going in the NCAA Tournament this year?

Really depends on the bracket. If USM is assigned to Brunswick, Bowdoin could be out in the second round. If the Polar Bears get the kind of bracket USM did last year as the top seed (MMA, UMF, Norwich) with, say, Colby-Sawyer, UMF and the NEWMAC winner, they'll advance. Don't know much about the East, but assumably Rochester and NYU will be the teams to beat.

I'm not sure who is scheduled to host the sectionals, but obviously if Bowdoin gets it everything changes (although Bowdoin actually has a better road record than at home this year). The team that scares me -- and should scare the rest of the region -- the most is Emmanuel. The longer Bowdoin avoids them, the better.

Quote from: Balder Eagle on February 20, 2007, 10:53:22 AMThey will surely miss the presence of Pourevalis.

That was the conventional wisdom heading into the season, and I'm sure emotionally they have missed her, but the Bowdoin defense seems stronger this year. Not sure if it's just because the conference is down or if they are playing better. Anelauskas and Cummings have been better defensively than I anticipated. Credit Pemper and her ability to adjust her personnel.

Personally, I'll miss the presence of Mary Washington on Bowdoin's side of the bracket, and the possibility of visiting Fredericksburg in the spring...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on February 20, 2007, 01:19:45 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on February 20, 2007, 11:26:11 AM
Personally, I'll miss the presence of Mary Washington on Bowdoin's side of the bracket, and the possibility of visiting Fredericksburg in the spring...

I suspect the Eagles would love to have another go with the Polar Bears in Fredericksburg, or a neutral location  ;D
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: papabear on February 20, 2007, 07:15:15 PM
Bowdoin out in the second round is a bit much. I do however agree the success will be determined by the Defense as well as Flaherty. Pourevalis was a great player and I loved watching her play at Bowdoin but she has been replaced nicely by Aneluskus. This senior class is special and I would be suprised if they did not end up in Springfield.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 21, 2007, 08:27:00 PM
I'll throw a question out there to those who have a better grasp on things than I:

Nescac Hoops wrote that the feeling he got while in Williamstown was that the Ephs needed to at least beat Bowdoin to earn an at-large bid. The more and more I looked at things, the more I felt Williams was a lock regardless of a loss to Bowdoin, which would put them at 20-6.

This feeling was hardened when I saw the QoWI rankings that had Williams at No. 12 in the country, and fifth in the region. One poster even highlighted possible pool C candidates that dipped down so low that Tufts (!) and Bates (?) were in the conversation.

Yet, here comes the regional rankings that have Williams 8th in the Northeast behind Brandeis, MMA and UMF (the last two I find laughable).

So if things play out as expected (the favorites for Pool A's win), can Williams breathe easy or are they in trouble? Can someone delineate what is going on? Do the regional rankings rule, or is it the QoWI? A blend?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on February 21, 2007, 10:49:38 PM
Williams is in
Bowdoin will advance no further than the elite 8 but will be ranked in the final poll in the top 4
Tufts should go but.....thats another story.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: atn alum on February 21, 2007, 11:38:42 PM
To the Hole, I'm not understand your logic, but I'll let that go...

History tells us that Q o WI is a big deal...case in point a couple of years ago when many of us were surprised by Wesleyan's selection (including, as was mentioned on Hoopsville, Wes had basically packed up its stuff for the year).

Poster "DeisCanton" (Allen) was ahead of the curve of all of us basically...he was insistent that Q O WI would be what got Wes in when we all insisted they would be shut out. The numbers proved him right.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 22, 2007, 12:17:02 AM
Quote from: atnwriter on February 21, 2007, 11:38:42 PM
Poster "DeisCanton" (Allen) was ahead of the curve of all of us basically...he was insistent that Q O WI would be what got Wes in when we all insisted they would be shut out. The numbers proved him right.

Okay, putting aside the past predictions of the New England region's clairvoyant poster, how does one read the regional rankings? It appears that the committee has ignored the QoWI to a degree in formulating their list, leading one to believe there is either a.) another guideline they are incorporating or b.) a human element (read: 'unscientific' method) involved.

Since both A & B are not enunciated (to my knowledge) in any formal way by the NCAA, either DeisCanton made a lucky guess or the regional rankings are a show pony.

Thoughts?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on February 22, 2007, 07:00:28 AM
Quote from: feces monkey on February 22, 2007, 12:17:02 AM
Quote from: atnwriter on February 21, 2007, 11:38:42 PM
Poster "DeisCanton" (Allen) was ahead of the curve of all of us basically...he was insistent that Q O WI would be what got Wes in when we all insisted they would be shut out. The numbers proved him right.

Okay, putting aside the past predictions of the New England region's clairvoyant poster, how does one read the regional rankings? It appears that the committee has ignored the QoWI to a degree in formulating their list, leading one to believe there is either a.) another guideline they are incorporating or b.) a human element (read: 'unscientific' method) involved.

Since both A & B are not enunciated (to my knowledge) in any formal way by the NCAA, either DeisCanton made a lucky guess or the regional rankings are a show pony.

Thoughts?

There are three other primary criteria that one must take into account when doing these regional rankings:

1.)  In region head-to-head competition.
2.)  In region results vs. common regional opponents.
3.)  In region results vs. regionally ranked teams.  (Regionally ranked teams are defined as those teams ranked at the time of the currently published regional ranking or at the time of the secret regional rankings that are used for the selection call.)

Brandeis can be ranked higher than Williams on the basis that both teams played Wheaton (MA) and Tufts this season.

Both Williams and Brandeis defeated Wheaton (MA) this season.  However, Brandeis was the only one of the two teams who was able to defeat Tufts this season.

You can also add in the fact that Brandeis has defeated a regionally ranked opponent this season (Rochester in conference play-- which makes it an in-region result), while Williams has defeated no regionally ranked opponents yet this season.  (Note:  As of this week, the Chicago women are not regionally ranked, so I can no longer use these results to bolster my case.)

Maine Maritime can be ranked higher than Williams on the fact that while both teams played Bowdoin this season, Maine Maritime was the only one of the two teams who was able to defeat Bowdoin.

Norwich can be ranked higher than Williams on the fact that while both teams played Bates twice this season, Norwich was the only one of the two teams to beat Bates twice.  Williams went 1-1 vs. Bates this season.

This, of course, is strictly according to the NCAA's primary criteria, and nothing more than that.

PS-- Last year, all of the women's basketball teams ranked in the final published regional rankings for the Northeast Region got in to the NCAA tournament, and I have no reason to believe that this year will be any different.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PJ on February 22, 2007, 07:09:05 AM
Is this the ranking being referred to?
  http://www.ncaasports.com/basketball/womens/polls/rankings/diviii

Also,  Page 12+ has the selection process for NCAA tournament (and criteria used for regional ranking):
  http://www.ncaa.org/library/handbooks/basketball/2007/2007_d3_w_basketball_handbook.pdf
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on February 22, 2007, 07:25:37 AM
Thanks, PJ, for putting up these links.

The Daily Dose on http://www.d3hoops.com also has a copy of this week's regional rankings-- you can comment on these rankings there.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on February 22, 2007, 12:05:29 PM
i don't know if the ephs necessarily deserve to get in. they only lost one or two players last year and with what they had returning, they should be in a much better position than they are. that being said, if they were to lose on saturday they will be 20-6. two of their losses would be to bowdoin (both when they were ranked #1) and another to lake forest (ranked 16th) all three of which were on the road and two coming in a brunswick gym where wins for for the guest team are hard to come by. the loss to lake forest was in st. louis. all of the other losses were on the road too (the ephs haven't lost at home). the salem st. loss hurt them but it was the 1st weekend of the year - the ephs had 2 weeks of practice while salem st. had 4 weeks to prepare, which is a big difference at that point in the year. obviously, the tufts-bates weekend absolutely killed them for a number of reasons. the first being that instead of seeing the polar bears in the semifinals they would have seen them in the finals. then there are the
brandeis/norwich debate and those two teams both beat those opponents. i think the tufts loss is legit and one they could have avenged had they beat bates and received the 3rd seed instead of the 4th. if they don't get in, the bates loss would really be the killer. i really still feel that bowdoin and williams will/would do the best in the tourny. norwich hasn't beaten anybody impressive either and brandeis did well this season but in a conference that is VERY talented but has been very up-and-down in terms of team's consistency, especially chicago. i can't really justify my position on this one but i will say that the pretty much same eph team beat the nyu violets (ranked 6th this year) last year in thei 1st round of the tourny and it seems that the ephs can bring their A game in the tourny. they may not be the most deserving in the NE region for a pool C bid but i think they would do a lot better than some of the more deserving teams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on February 23, 2007, 01:14:53 PM
any predictions for the weekend? i think " the more things change, the more they stay the same." i anticipate another bates-bowdoin championship game. murphy is too good of a coach to let the polar bears embarrass his club again so ill take bowdoin by a mere 13 points for the nescac title.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on February 25, 2007, 03:05:47 PM
Bowdoin stomps Tufts 64-48 in the NESCAC final. Tufts kept it close well into the second half but was swept away by a classic Bowdoin surge . .
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 25, 2007, 03:52:22 PM
If Williams plays like they did in the first half against Bowdoin, they'll go a couple of rounds deep. Bowdoin spooked them in the second half with a couple of threes and they collapsed.

Tufts is a nice team with some future stars, but turned the ball over way too much, especially in the second half. Both Williams and Tufts had a chance but couldn't stand the heat for 40 minutes. Bowdoin's defense is playing very well right now, which is covering for some offensive hiccups. Williams and Tufts both had mild success with Flaherty in the low post -- something tourney teams will likely try -- but couldn't handle Pemper's adjustments.

I really liked the way Loonin played this weekend and I think she could be a wild card in the tourney. The youngsters (Rubega, Kaubris & Cote) all played well. Anelauskas didn't have the prettiest line this week, but did some little things that helped.

If Williams draws a team that loves to run-and-gun it, they'll be okay. They just don't seem to have the personnel/desire to play NESCAC-style defense for a long period. While Bowdoin wins by attrition on defense, I think the Ephs would rather do it on offense.

Saddest note of the weekend: a once-proud Bates team scoring nine points in a half.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 25, 2007, 04:05:49 PM
Just noticed out front that D3hoops.com is projecting the Jumbos as making it. Here's hoping they are correct.

Tufts season doesn't exactly pass the "eye-ball" test for me, but I hope I'm wrong.

If they do get in, I'd say the Jumbos will cause some problems, especially if they get a second look at a team (or third, as the case may be), but would be unlikely to make it out of the second round. If the NCAA was interested in saving a couple of bucks, an Emmanuel/Brandeis/Tufts/Fitchburg bracket would cost pennies on the dollar.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on February 26, 2007, 01:35:21 AM
It looks like Tufts did not make the NCAAs - heres a list of the New England schools that received pool C bids :

Brandeis
Keene State
Maine Maritime
Norwich
Williams
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on February 26, 2007, 10:29:08 AM
Congrats to the Eph women for making the tourney.  Brutal draw -- Southern Maine on the road in round one.  But, had they at least split with Tufts / Bates, they'd be in much better shape right now.  They are capable of winning that game but will certainly be big underdogs. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on February 26, 2007, 11:53:15 AM
  i have not seen the teams yet, but i assume tufts is in the ecac, maybe the 1 seed?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 26, 2007, 12:16:01 PM
NESCAC Teams do not compete in the ECACs. Haven't for five or six years now. The Jumbos are done.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on February 26, 2007, 12:29:54 PM
 i forgot about that. didn't think they would get in to ncaa's unless they beat bowdoin
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: farmingtonfan on February 26, 2007, 03:52:47 PM
So how good is Brandeis?  I guess we will find out how good Farmington is as well as the NAC in general when they start the tourney, should be interesting.  I think UMF has been underratted all year, to be honest I wouldn't be surprised to see them go as far as 2-3 rounds deep in the tourney, before possibly losing to USM.  Just my two cents.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 26, 2007, 04:04:13 PM
Quote from: farmingtonfan on February 26, 2007, 03:52:47 PM
So how good is Brandeis?  I guess we will find out how good Farmington is as well as the NAC in general when they start the tourney, should be interesting.  I think UMF has been underratted all year, to be honest I wouldn't be surprised to see them go as far as 2-3 rounds deep in the tourney, before possibly losing to USM.  Just my two cents.

Both you and UMF are out of your league.

You, in a literal sense, as Brandeis is in the UAA (find them in the multi-regional section). UMF, figuratively, as Brandeis is a notch above UMF in talent and level of competition. The Beavers might hang around for a half, but it's unlikely they'll be able to sustain it.

I will root for UMF, but if it wins on Friday it will likely be the biggest upset of the first round.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 26, 2007, 07:46:34 PM
Nice story on the championship game in the Press Herald:

http://sports.mainetoday.com/college/basketball-women/070226bowdoin.html

The note at the very end sounds ominous.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on February 26, 2007, 07:56:26 PM
feces,
do you know anything about this? it seems very odd to suddenly stop playing her. i do not want to jump to any conclusions or accusations but i have noticed in action shots ( i haven't seen the polar bears play this year) that berne looks like she has lost a lot of weight. she used to be very athletic and strong and looks drastically different. has she been sick or anything? very weird.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on February 26, 2007, 08:52:19 PM
 i noticed that about berne as well. she had a decent year last year didn't she?
she was a pretty good 3 point shooter when i saw her play @ some aau tournaments a few years back.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on February 26, 2007, 09:56:17 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on February 26, 2007, 04:04:13 PM
Quote from: farmingtonfan on February 26, 2007, 03:52:47 PM
So how good is Brandeis?  I guess we will find out how good Farmington is as well as the NAC in general when they start the tourney, should be interesting.  I think UMF has been underratted all year, to be honest I wouldn't be surprised to see them go as far as 2-3 rounds deep in the tourney, before possibly losing to USM.  Just my two cents.

Both you and UMF are out of your league.

You, in a literal sense, as Brandeis is in the UAA (find them in the multi-regional section). UMF, figuratively, as Brandeis is a notch above UMF in talent and level of competition. The Beavers might hang around for a half, but it's unlikely they'll be able to sustain it.

NESCAC H--I wouldn't be too sure about that. Although I was incorrect earlier in the season by predicting that Brandeis would be out of the top 25 by season's end, I think that UMF has the kind of team that causes problems for Brandeis.  UMF will be quicker and more athletic than Brandeis...Brandeis will be bigger and deeper.  Also, Brandeis will not suffer from the tournament jitters as much as UMF.  I would say that if UMF does hang around for a half that Brandeis could be in trouble.  Interestingly, Brandeis personnel-wise is similar to MMA ( we know what happened there).

I will root for UMF, but if it wins on Friday it will likely be the biggest upset of the first round.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on February 26, 2007, 09:59:33 PM
the preceding is the most screwed up, out of whack post I've seen thus far...my apologies.  Apparently, I am somewhat posting-challenged in regard to responding to quotes.

In a nutshell, UMF could beat Brandeis
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on February 26, 2007, 10:25:43 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on February 26, 2007, 07:46:34 PM
Nice story on the championship game in the Press Herald:

http://sports.mainetoday.com/college/basketball-women/070226bowdoin.html

The note at the very end sounds ominous.

Ominous indeed.   No question that, when uninjured, Berne is in the Bowdoin top 5.  Certainly a more skilled player than Anelauskas ( no disrespect to Jill, Berne simply presents way more match-up problems for opponents).  I'm quite sure there has been some type of back injury that has hindered Berne for quite a time period ( going back as far as last season).   The odd part, of course, is Coach Pemper's curt " coach's decision" response.   Mo is a terrific player and a terrific person....I wish her well.  if this thing has to fall apart for her it is unfortunate that it happens entering her Senior year....there are a lot of teams out there who would love to have her as a transfer if she were a current soph instead of junior.  If there is some type of coach/player rift they simply need to clear the air in the off-season and build up from there.  It's not like Bowdoin won't be needing Berne next season...they will.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 27, 2007, 01:59:43 PM
Friday's opponent: Mount Holyoke (21-7)

Positives
- Beat Fitchburg St. (25-2) in the first game of the season
- Hung around with USM (losing by 13) on a neutral floor
- Appear to have a decent backcourt combo with Silvey & Astuccio
- Balanced rebounding numbers
- Four players who aren't afraid to take the three
- Solid team defense numbers

Negatives
- Play in the NEWMAC
- Run only eight-deep
- Turn the ball over. A lot.

This doesn't look like a real good match-up for the Lyons. It looks like this team is a bunch of slashers, with very little post presence. Strong post players give Bowdoin some trouble, but smaller, more mobile teams do not. I'll conservatively say the Polar Bears by 14.

Agreed that it is a terrible draw for Williams, but the Ephs are used to USM's style and this Huskies team isn't as dominant as years past.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on February 27, 2007, 05:31:16 PM
My understanding is that Bowdoin's Marissa Berne has a serious back injury that causes her a lot of pain and has greatly limited her this year. . . The "coach's decision" may mean only that she was available to play but, in the coach's mind, it did not make sense to play her in that particular game . .
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on February 28, 2007, 03:04:13 PM
the all-conference awards are up. i could not have done it better myself. congrats to the coaches for voting so well. absolutely love that cummings and tildsley are the co-defensive players of the year. the two are not nearly as flashy as barton, but get the job done just the same at the point position.

http://www.nescac.com/2006-07/sports/basketball(w)/allconference.htm
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 28, 2007, 03:31:01 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on February 11, 2007, 01:56:08 PM
Tournament shook out as expected. Williams needs to get to the semis to assure an at-large bid, and that will likely do it for the conference.

All-conference honors:

First Team
Flaherty, Bowdoin
Miller, Williams
Cox, Trinity
Barton, Bates
Anelauskas, Bowdoin

Second Team
Krah, Tufts
Cummings, Bowdoin
Beckwith, Bates
Stetson, Williams
Fourney, Wesleyan

Not too bad a prediction. Flip-flopping Barton and Beckwith could have have gone either way. I got one wrong and I'll be honest -- Reiff wasn't even on my radar -- and Cummings received some recognition for her defense, not second team, which is a nice consolation.

I'm glad Berube received coach of the year. Swenson, as Amherst in general, was off my radar, as well.

Nescac Hoops, I went back looking for your predictions, but they must have been in December (!) or something. Getting in on the ground floor.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on February 28, 2007, 04:17:34 PM
feces,
i just tried to quote my predictions that i made on january 2nd but hit "delete" instead of quote. i didn't have cox as a first teamer but mine was almost as close as yours.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on March 01, 2007, 02:19:45 PM
monkey
Any word on Marissa Berne  ?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 01, 2007, 04:43:41 PM
Quote from: Balder Eagle on March 01, 2007, 02:19:45 PM
monkey
Any word on Marissa Berne  ?

All I know is she missed the three conference tourney games and last played Feb. 10.

I wouldn't feel comfortable commenting as to why. I'll let the coach do that.

Good work by Bowdoin to get the hockey tourney games in before the hoops on Saturday, although I'm guessing the 14 or so parking spots available for rink and gym parking will be gone by 5 p.m.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: papabear on March 01, 2007, 05:07:12 PM
I would be shocked if Berne played the rest of the year never mind this weekend. She has battled injuries throughout the season and many believe Pemper has penalized her unfairly for working so hard to be out there. "Coach's Decision" is the common phrase used when something other than an injury is involved. The team is going to try to keep it in house but the only people that know the reason are tight lipped. Stop complaining about the parking I just leave 2 hours before the game and have no problem, the game is always worth the effort.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bballsneaks on March 01, 2007, 06:03:59 PM
i think berne is an OK player but i think she is being given too much credit. bowdoin is a good team and i don't think berne is as fundamentally sound as many of the players that see a lot of time. sure she can hit a 3 once in a while but scoring isn't necessarily what a bowdoin player should be all about.. and she is too hot/cold and isn't as consistent as the team in general. i don't think pemper would play someone that shouldn't be on the court, and i'm sure she would rather 'penalize' that one player than potentially 'penalize' the whole team.
just my thoughts.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on March 01, 2007, 06:28:22 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on March 01, 2007, 04:43:41 PM
Good work by Bowdoin to get the hockey tourney games in before the hoops on Saturday, although I'm guessing the 14 or so parking spots available for rink and gym parking will be gone by 5 p.m.
Quote from: papabear on March 01, 2007, 05:07:12 PM
Stop complaining about the parking I just leave 2 hours before the game and have no problem, the game is always worth the effort.
My thoughts are that monkey is accurate about the parking. After all the pines across the road from the rink will even fill quickly.
Thanks for the input RE: Berne, hope that she is healthy or that things get sorted out. Good luck to The Polar Bears!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 02, 2007, 10:19:38 AM
Posting on this message board as much as I do is cause for enough concern. Arriving two hours before a game just for parking privileges would demand a thorough life reassessment. Obviously, if there were tailgating involved the dynamic would change, but now that the whole 'global warming' thing turned out to be a sham, the conditions aren't optimal.

I temporarily rebooked my trip to Fredericksburg in anticipation of next weekend and I look forward to witnessing that Southern hospitality I've heard so much about. Not exactly sure about the dress code for basketball games down there, but I'll pack my denim overalls and three-string banjo just in case...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on March 02, 2007, 11:22:40 AM

that's pretty funny, feces.

my last thought about berne....pemper is one of few coaches who has no "loyalty" to her players. this isn't meant to sound bad and i used "loyalty" for lack of a better word but she is not the type of coach who is afraid to sit a past starter/star in favor of playing a younger, better player who perhaps fits the current system better. i can't be 100% postive of the two players that most come to mind but one i think was vanessa russell and the other's last name was trotter (?) - i think the former is now a coach at rochester. anyways, these two were both starters earlier on in their carreer but barely played come their senior season in favor of younger players. one of my biggest gripes with berne, who is a VERY talented player that creates a lot of mismatches with her size, has been her speed/defense. this year, from what i hear, bowdoin's best asset is their defense and i could see why berne, even though she is very good offensively, might not fit the mold for this year's team as well as she did in year's past. that's not taking anything away from bowdoin's defense in the past (it has ALWAYS been very good) but this year i hear it is flat out amazing.....just ask norwich.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 02, 2007, 11:29:42 AM
Quote from: nescac hoops on March 02, 2007, 11:22:40 AM
she is not the type of coach who is afraid to sit a past starter/star in favor of playing a younger, better player who perhaps fits the current system better.

I think the most successful college coaches (in either gender) are the ones who follow this pattern, although it is not always easy to do.

And N'Hoops, you better get cracking if you're going to make it to USM for tip-off...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on March 02, 2007, 11:34:28 AM
Quote from: feces monkey on March 02, 2007, 11:29:42 AM
I think the most successful college coaches (in either gender) are the ones who follow this pattern, although it is not always easy to do.
And N'Hoops, you better get cracking if you're going to make it to USM for tip-off...
i completely agree! but like you said, it's not an easy thing to do and it's one of the reasons pemper is head and shoulders above a lot of coaches. i just checked the usm website - it looks like the game is postponed until tomorrow!  http://www.usm.maine.edu/athletics/
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on March 02, 2007, 11:42:39 AM
monkey-
Park at the Shop n' Save, stop at the Bohemian Coffee House and get warm as well as updated on what's happening before the game, it's not a long walk and the exercise might serve you well.

I was thinking along the lines of meeting at Newburgh, NY. Should you decide to come to Fredericksburg bring warm weather clothes and sun tan lotion. It will be a relief from the frigid North East.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 02, 2007, 11:47:48 AM
Yeah, it's nasty business in Portland. At least the snow is white. It's probable a black, toxic rain in Gorham that is melting tires and causing riots.

Still on in Brunswick for now -- I'm guessing the teams have already arrived.

Eagle, if I'm going to hoof it, I'll park at Joshua's and take the edge off before the trek.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 02, 2007, 01:19:58 PM
From the Bowdoin website:

1:00 p.m. update: Friday's NCAA Women's Basketball Games are on as scheduled for this evening. The teams arrived locally last evening and the contests are expected to be played, regardless of weather. For the latest details, you can call the Polar Bear Sports Hotline: (207)725-3061

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on March 02, 2007, 03:17:12 PM
Remember that for Saturday's second-round game game, the Bowdon campus will also be jam packed with hockey players and hockey fans for the NESCAC men's semifinals that will be taking place in Dayton Arena next door to Morrell Gym and that there will be overlap between the 4:00pm Middlebury-Colby hockey game and the 5:00pm sectional final in women's bball. I'm surprised that the 5:00pm start time for the second-round women's bball game has not been pushed back to 7:00pm to relieve some of the burden on the Bowdoin facilities.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on March 03, 2007, 08:05:49 AM
 no post game comments from the bowdoin- mt. holyoke game?
did silvey alone keep them in that game?
looks like bowdoin shot the ball well.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 04, 2007, 01:25:33 PM
Couple of wins for the Polar Bears where the final score was not indicative of the level of competition. Mount Holyoke lost by 17, but still had the player of the game (Silvey, who was remarkable) and Keene State lost by 25 although they led by one with about 15 minutes to go. Conditioning and depth were keys in both games.

Although better in the second game, free throws were troubling in the first. All of the teams are excellent from here on out, so it's the little things that get you bounced. Free throws could be one of them.

Scranton makes sense as a site geographically. Should be three good games.

On a lighter note, my theory about a black, toxic rain falling in Gorham was not too far off. It actually melted the roof of the USM gym.

http://sports.mainetoday.com/college/basketball-women/070304usmwom.html

It's no wonder the committee didn't need to see the results of Sunday's game to make their decision. Thank goodness none of the Williams players were hurt. And with the State of Maine nearly bankrupt due to Baldacci's universal healthcare boondoggle, that roof might not be fixed until 2010. Maybe some of the recent alums can donate some of their hard-earned "campus job" money to fix the problem...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on March 05, 2007, 08:50:41 AM
monkey have you made your travel plans yet?   ;D
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 05, 2007, 12:26:18 PM
Ah, Eagle, while the historic sites and bucolic vistas of Fredericksburg might have piqued my interest and prompted a weekend getaway, the greater Scranton/Wilkes-Barre area does not hold the same allure...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on March 05, 2007, 03:54:11 PM
monkey I am in shock!!
Not only did I assume you would not miss the sectionals I also assumed you might take in the parade, I am told the local "establishments" open at 7 AM on Saturday!

http://www.saintpatricksdayparade.com/scranton/index.htm
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 06, 2007, 10:42:19 AM
While the possibility of celebrating St. Patrick's Day on back-to-back weekends is enticing, I've found in my advancing years that even my Irish liver can't handle the heavy workload once taken for granted during my halcyon college days.

With that being said, the question still begs: why does Scranton celebrate SPD a week before the actual day when it already falls on a Saturday? Is there some kind of town ordinance that doesn't allow holidays to be celebrated on their designated date? Very strange.

Regardless of any celebrations planned for Scranton, I'm sure the genteel Mary Washington set will be content with a virgin mint julip and an afternoon nap before tipoff.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on March 06, 2007, 02:16:17 PM
I will take the nap and settle for warm tea as a beverage.
Perhaps the parade people celebrate for the whole month?

http://www.saintpatricksdayparade.com/index.htm


Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on March 07, 2007, 05:45:32 PM
FM: To answer your question as to why Scranton holds their St.Patrick's Party/Parade a week before the actual date...it's due to the fact that probably 100 or so of the marching units & floats also participate in New York's Parade, so in order to get everyone together they have it on the Sat. prior to the 17th. In addition, they bring in many groups from NYC such as the Police & Fire units & Pipers who've been coming to the Scranton parade for decades. It really does create a festive atmosphere during the day to then be topped off that evening with the games. For anyone heading into the city for the games this weekend, both the Raddison & Hilton are only one block from the UofS campus. The Raddison is really nice...it gives you that old world flavor with High Tea serverd with scones, clotted cream & assorted jams & preserves for those so interested & the Hilton is only about 2 yrs. old & has all the immenities inclusive of indoor pool etc. At any rate...2 very good choices right by the campus & safe travels to all those heading in.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 07, 2007, 06:35:11 PM
Makes sense. And sounds like a good time.

My early thoughts are Rochester is a 7-10 point favorite over Bowdoin and Scranton has a four-point edge over Mary Washington.

The UAA is the dominant conference in the country right now and Bowdoin would do well to be in the game at halftime. We'll see. One of the few games this year the Polar Bears will be serious underdogs.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: papabear on March 07, 2007, 09:34:07 PM
To fesces Monkey.... Ok Mssey has the poler bears by ten, they are ranked unanimiously number one in both polls and you have them losing by 10, saying Bowdoin will be lucky to keep it close.... I must have misread that because quite frankly it is non logical.... I really do not need to further elaborate.....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 08, 2007, 12:09:54 AM
Quote from: papabear on March 07, 2007, 09:34:07 PM
To fesces Monkey.... Ok Mssey has the poler bears by ten, they are ranked unanimiously number one in both polls and you have them losing by 10, saying Bowdoin will be lucky to keep it close.... I must have misread that because quite frankly it is non logical.... I really do not need to further elaborate.....

PB,

Grab a Snickers bar or something; I think your blood sugar is getting low. Or maybe put a little tonic in that gin.

Anyhoo, I appreciate your unwavering allegiance to the Polar Bears and hopefully they will win a game or two. However, I would argue that Massey ratings and Top 20 rankings lose their relevance (if they ever had any) at this point. Losing to Rochester won't make Bowdoin a bad team, or even overrated. Sometimes it comes down to match-ups and from what I've deduced the Polar Bears will be hard-pressed to win on Friday. Hopefully I'm wrong.



Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on March 08, 2007, 03:50:17 AM
Put up money in a sum sufficient to hurt a lot if lost!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: papabear on March 08, 2007, 11:57:58 AM
Based on what matchups?? Bowdoin is a much more complete team and I do not see anything that would stop Flaherty from having a big game in the post and Loonin has been shooting the ball at a clip above 50%, couple that with Cummings and Anelauskus and Rubega a freshmen off the bench and I think Fesces must be a Bates fan.. Polarbears by 13.Count on it.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 08, 2007, 12:54:39 PM
Quote from: papabear on March 08, 2007, 11:57:58 AM
Based on what matchups?? Bowdoin is a much more complete team and I do not see anything that would stop Flaherty from having a big game in the post and Loonin has been shooting the ball at a clip above 50%, couple that with Cummings and Anelauskus and Rubega a freshmen off the bench and I think Fesces must be a Bates fan.. Polarbears by 13.Count on it.

Glad to see you are a little more coherent this morning. Although no need for the character assasination by aligning me with the Lewiston rehab center.

The matchups I was referring to had to do with Rochester having two decent post players along with good three-point shooters, meaning Flaherty and Anelauskas will likely not get any help. This makes them (especially Flaherty) susceptible to foul trouble. Both will cause their share of problems on the other, but they have to be in the game. I don't put much stock in freshman, unless their last name is Trenkle. Loonin needs to take care of the ball better.

And if we must resort to name-calling, your guarantee of a 13-point victory in the Sweet 16 against a ranked opponent makes me think you're also an Amherst men's fan.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 09, 2007, 01:39:19 PM
http://sports.mainetoday.com/college/basketball-women/070309bowdoin.html

No love for Mary Wash at the end...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on March 09, 2007, 10:31:23 PM
  monkey,
 
     you got a prediction wrong. can't believe it
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on March 10, 2007, 07:43:21 AM
Quote from: pureshooter on March 09, 2007, 10:31:23 PM
  monkey,
 
     you got a prediction wrong. can't believe it

monkey you are missed and should be here. Any predictions for tonights matchup?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on March 11, 2007, 06:46:04 PM
Quote from: tothehole on February 21, 2007, 10:49:38 PM
Williams is in
Bowdoin will advance no further than the elite 8 but will be ranked in the final poll in the top 4
Tufts should go but.....thats another story.




mmmmmmmmmm

whats left, the final poll
Bowdoin should not be ranked any higher than 5
but what does the tourney play have to do with it?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on March 11, 2007, 10:34:33 PM
  have to disagree w/ tufts.
they didn't and shouldn't have gone.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 12, 2007, 12:34:09 AM
I don't expect Bowdoin to be in the top four in the final poll.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on March 12, 2007, 10:42:40 AM
Why would it be different from last year?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 12, 2007, 11:09:46 AM
Another solid campaign for the Polar Bears and a nice run for this year's seniors.

A couple of thoughts before signing off for the summer.

- If there are any Ivy openings this offseason, those institutions would be foolish not to have Pemper on the short list.

- NESCAC should be fun next year. I predict more of a pack than a one-horse race.

- I'll take DePauw to win it all.

- Coffin's return should flush all of the Bates frontrunners back out.

- Now that Bowdoin is ponying up $20M for a new hockey rink, Papabear won't have to show up two hours before gametime in 2008...

Until September.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bbald eagle on March 12, 2007, 11:18:41 AM
Coach Pemper did a great job and showed a lot of class last year when Bowdoin beat Mary Washington in the tournament and again this weekend when it lost to UMW in the tournament.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 12, 2007, 12:04:32 PM
Quote from: tothehole on March 12, 2007, 10:42:40 AM
Why would it be different from last year?

Because last year they lost on the opponent's home floor and a cinderella-type team made the Final Four from another bracket who could be reasonably considered to not be in the top four.

This year Bowdoin lost on a neutral floor and everyone who made the Final Four was in the Top 11.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on March 12, 2007, 01:01:28 PM
Did the cinderella-type team make the final 4?
Then they beat the people in front of them.
Sounds like an AD's excuse to me.
We'll see what happens but I stand with the prediction.
Bears at 4
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 12, 2007, 01:10:12 PM
Never having been an AD I don't know what that would sound like.

They beat the teams in front of them. But in Division III, as you know, the teams are not distributed evenly throughout the bracket. This is not Division I.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on March 12, 2007, 01:31:59 PM
  FM,
 
    I'd have to agree with you. Having not seen DePauw live, they look good on paper( i know,you have to play the game and all the other cliches).
May have to venture to Blake Arena to catch their act.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on March 12, 2007, 01:36:04 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on March 12, 2007, 11:09:46 AM
NESCAC should be fun next year. I predict more of a pack than a one-horse race.
feces, what teams do you think will make up this pack. obviously, bates gets infinitely better with the return of coffin, though it will be interesting to see if she recovers 100% from her injury. as i understand, she did quite a number on it and tore multiple ligaments. bowdoin, tufts, and williams lose A LOT. it seems like bowdoin loses a lot every year but always seems to remain on top - williams and tufts will be a different story. i think wesleyan will be back up there next year with such a young team this year that managed to have a pretty strong season. reliable sources at amherst tell me that bill mcbride has been "fired" - i.e. "promoted" to a different postion in the athletic department. this move immediately makes amherst more of a contender. i think amherst, bates, wesleyan, and bowdoin (in no particular order) will make up the top 4. however, the bants might be able to sneak in there with such strong younger players and a very solid coach.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 12, 2007, 02:07:00 PM
Quote from: nescac hoops on March 12, 2007, 01:36:04 PM
reliable sources at amherst tell me that bill mcbride has been "fired" - i.e. "promoted" to a different postion in the athletic department. this move immediately makes amherst more of a contender.

Ahh, a NESCAC classic. Look for a "Scheduling Assistant," "Squash Court Facility Manager," or "Buildings & Grounds Liasion" to show up on the Amherst human resources chart, only to be filled quickly by McBride (if the rumors are true).

In all fairness, McBride is product of bygone era -- a football assistant filling a position for what was once viewed as a throw-away sport. While it is probably not delineated anywhere, I would imagine McBride's recruiting priority would lie with his fall sport, not the winter. And he's obviously done an excellent job in football.

The fact that the Amherst women's ice hockey team went from joke to a Frozen Four team in about four years under its new coach (former Bowdoin asst.) probably expedited McBride's "promotion." If there is a change, Amherst will get a lot of excellent candidates applying and should be a real contender soon.

I thought Williams was going to be the shoe-in NESCAC champ this year, so I won't predict who will be in the final pack. I just don't see a run-away winner.

Also, I would be remiss without congratulating Mary Washington. Well done and good luck.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pgc6655 on March 13, 2007, 03:17:43 PM
Small bit in the Portland paper today reported that Coffin would be rejoining the team "for the 2nd half of the season."  If that's accurate, it would raise some interesting challenges for Murphy and the team.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on March 13, 2007, 04:23:55 PM
i know that meg coffin only has one semester left of academic work. i wonder if her "joining the team 2nd semester" is a result of any rule that only allows a player to participate when he/she is enrolled in classes or if this is a time frame of her projected recovery. does anybody know if there is such a rule? interesting to say the least...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on March 13, 2007, 10:38:20 PM
I'm not sure of the nuances of the rules but I believe the NCAA limits the number of semesters of sports participation in D3 to 8 so Coffin probably used up her 7th semester while playing soccer in the fall of 2006, leaving her with only one remaining semester of eligibility.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bearsonocow on March 17, 2007, 01:50:26 PM
From what I've seen this year, I believe Williams is going to have a tough year next year.

Reason for the post is a conversation I just had with an Amherst alum about their men's win last night and their impending victory today.  As I've followed the women closer, I asked about the coaching change and he sees this as a seismic shift and they're thinking the women will be challenging for late NCAA appearances in as little as two years.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 17, 2007, 11:10:46 PM
I'd like to hear some of you weigh in on the WABC selection of Eileen Flahertyof Bowdoin as Division III Women's National Player of the Year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on March 18, 2007, 08:21:55 AM
Quote from: remsleep on March 17, 2007, 11:10:46 PM
I'd like to hear some of you weigh in on the WABC selection of Eileen Flahertyof Bowdoin as Division III Women's National Player of the Year.

Congrats to Eileen Flaherty, she is a class lady as well as excelling in Womens Basketball.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Perseph on March 18, 2007, 09:11:25 AM
As we all know, basketball is a team sport and while awards such as "player of the year" or MVP are not as absurd as academy awards for acting (as if actors were actually competing with each other for these awards) they are particularly problematic in basketball and furthermore in D3 ball where perhaps only a very few would have actually seen the 50 possible "nominees".
Nonetheless, if awards are to be presented as such for a job well done then I can think of none more deserving the Flaherty.
A member of a particularly successful class, she helped bring Bowdoin up to four Elite 8's and one Final 2. She played in every game and became a starter in her freshman year after only a few games into the season. She isn't big, but was assigned a defensive role against the bigs on the other team and furthermore was a prolific rebounder and broke every record in scoring at Bowdoin with more than 1700 pts on a team that isn't known for its offense. She rose to play each game as the sun rises. She was a significant member of a class whose record was 112-9 over four years.
If awards like this one are to be given, who better than Flaherty should be singled out? 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 18, 2007, 09:15:22 PM
Individual and team basketball awards are temporal. In two months Flaherty will receive a diploma from a NESCAC school, which puts her among the nation's overall elite, past and present.

Diplomas are always heavier than trophies, no matter the material from which each is made.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on March 19, 2007, 12:05:03 AM
I'm afraid that there are some poor sports in the state of Maine who have gone public with their complaints about the grant of this award to Flaherty instead of their favorite USM player. Read on .  .

http://sports.mainetoday.com/college/basketball-women/070317womenstop.html
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on March 19, 2007, 09:05:05 PM
Quote from: speedy on March 19, 2007, 12:05:03 AM
I'm afraid that there are some poor sports in the state of Maine who have gone public with their complaints about the grant of this award to Flaherty instead of their favorite USM player. Read on .  .

http://sports.mainetoday.com/college/basketball-women/070317womenstop.html

USM was very tasteless to allow that interview.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 19, 2007, 10:06:48 PM
Quote from: Balder Eagle on March 19, 2007, 09:05:05 PM
...  to allow that interview.

I'm not sure I'm going to be able to tell Gary Fifield what to do. He's been there more than a quarter of a century, if I do my math correctly.

Interesting that three awards went the other direction: D3hoops.com (decision made prior to this news article's release), DIII News and the New England Women's Basketball Association coaches all voted for Marble as their player of the year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 19, 2007, 11:18:07 PM
I read this quote and I don't see what the problem is.

Quote"I know I'm probably not taking the high road here, but I have to defend (Marble). Compare the numbers across the board -- points per game, rebounds per game -- and look at the supporting cast surrounding (Flaherty)."

Is that what you're so aghast about?  Seems pretty matter of fact. Is he not allowed to state the facts or defend his own player?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 20, 2007, 12:35:30 AM
The most amusing quote is from Curt Smyth of UNE. What a pimple. His team hasn't been within 37 points of Bowdoin (37 this year, 46 in '05, 52(!) in '04) since Flaherty's sophomore year and he's surprised Flaherty got the award. No wonder -- she probably hasn't been in past the 10 minute mark against UNE.

UMF doesn't have a dog in this fight and their coach spoke accordingly. If Pemper wasn't so classy, I'd expect the Polar Bears to "Pull a Lincoln" on UNE next winter.

The silver lining for Fifield and USM players: whatever they lack in national recognition, they'll surely make up for through work-study payroll 'bonuses.'
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on March 20, 2007, 03:32:50 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 19, 2007, 11:18:07 PM
I read this quote and I don't see what the problem is.

Quote"I know I'm probably not taking the high road here, but I have to defend (Marble). Compare the numbers across the board -- points per game, rebounds per game -- and look at the supporting cast surrounding (Flaherty)."

Is that what you're so aghast about?  Seems pretty matter of fact. Is he not allowed to state the facts or defend his own player?

In this case, the idea that the USM coach is just "defend[ing]" is not realistic. The article in question appeared in the Portland Press Herald and was likely a USM plant since that's the local paper. I seriously doubt that the Portland Press Herald reporter would have thought of writing this article without some serious prodding by USM and the various coaching allies that were likely recruited by the USM coach to support his grievance. Newspaper articles about D3 women's basketball that appear in newspapers like the Portland Press Herald typically appear only after serious spadework is done by the school that is covered. So it's about a 95% certainty that this article appeared only as a result of proactive action by USM, making it therefore unlikely that this coach was simply defending his player.

And since the USM player apparently won many awards herself, it seems particularly ungracious of the USM coach has gone to so much trouble to complain in such a public way about the fact that Flaherty also received an award. After all, the USM coach admits that he is not acting properly when he acknowledges that he is "probably not taking the high road." He's got that right . . .
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on March 20, 2007, 09:17:54 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 19, 2007, 11:18:07 PM
I read this quote and I don't see what the problem is.

Quote"I know I'm probably not taking the high road here, but I have to defend (Marble). Compare the numbers across the board -- points per game, rebounds per game -- and look at the supporting cast surrounding (Flaherty)."

Is that what you're so aghast about?  Seems pretty matter of fact. Is he not allowed to state the facts or defend his own player?

QuoteReader comments

ken farber of Portland, ME
Mar 17, 2007 9:12 AM
Coach Fifield was right about one thing--he is not taking the high road. That is disappointing. My nine year old daughter and I made it to just about every Bowdoin home game this year including Bowdoin's victory over USM and Ashley Marble. Besides her great numbers, Eileen Flaherty added tremendous poise and leadership on and off the court, which served to enhance the level of play by her teamates and made for a much more balanced and better team than USM. Eileen was a selfless team player, which doesn't necessarily show up in the statistics. It was quite observable if you followed the team, and Bowdoin's success was in large part because of her leadership. She is most deserving of the award and that doesn't take anything away from Ashley. How about a little good sportmanship Coach Fifield?!

Cooper Foster of Rockland, ME
Mar 17, 2007 9:11 AM
I can't believe I'm going to side with the pick of Flaherty on this as I played ball at USM. However when looking at who had the best season it's hard to argue against Flaherty. Yes Marble had the better season statistics. Flaherty played a tougher schedule and had a better supporting cast who took states (shots and rebounds) away from her. Also look at the head to head match-up. A 60 to 45 win for Bowdoin. Marble played 32 min and had 5 points on 1 for 11 shooting and 4 rebounds. Flaherty on the other hand played 36 min and finished with 15 points and 12 rebounds....enough said.

Fantastic
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 20, 2007, 12:02:14 PM
Quote from: speedy on March 20, 2007, 03:32:50 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 19, 2007, 11:18:07 PM
I read this quote and I don't see what the problem is.

Quote"I know I'm probably not taking the high road here, but I have to defend (Marble). Compare the numbers across the board -- points per game, rebounds per game -- and look at the supporting cast surrounding (Flaherty)."

Is that what you're so aghast about?  Seems pretty matter of fact. Is he not allowed to state the facts or defend his own player?

In this case, the idea that the USM coach is just "defend[ing]" is not realistic. The article in question appeared in the Portland Press Herald and was likely a USM plant since that's the local paper. I seriously doubt that the Portland Press Herald reporter would have thought of writing this article without some serious prodding by USM and the various coaching allies that were likely recruited by the USM coach to support his grievance. Newspaper articles about D3 women's basketball that appear in newspapers like the Portland Press Herald typically appear only after serious spadework is done by the school that is covered. So it's about a 95% certainty that this article appeared only as a result of proactive action by USM, making it therefore unlikely that this coach was simply defending his player.

And since the USM player apparently won many awards herself, it seems particularly ungracious of the USM coach has gone to so much trouble to complain in such a public way about the fact that Flaherty also received an award. After all, the USM coach admits that he is not acting properly when he acknowledges that he is "probably not taking the high road." He's got that right . . .

D3hoops and DIII News came out after this story was written. At the time Kevin Thomas interviewed people it was a much different landscape. In fact, he approached me for comment on Friday via e-mail but since it was the day of the national semifinals, I didn't have time to get back to him.

And I have followed the Portland paper's coverage off and on all season. They don't seem to need prodding from anyone to do a story about D-III basketball. Unless you're willing to suggest also that Bowdoin prompted them to do the story in January about the battle for No. 1 in the two polls, talking to Bowdoin's coach who votes in both.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on March 20, 2007, 02:51:01 PM
Quote. . .
And I have followed the Portland paper's coverage off and on all season. They don't seem to need prodding from anyone to do a story about D-III basketball. Unless you're willing to suggest also that Bowdoin prompted them to do the story in January about the battle for No. 1 in the two polls, talking to Bowdoin's coach who votes in both.

Virtually all stories of any length that appear in the Portland Press Herald with regard to women's D3 basketball would be the product of spadework by the institution covered. And, yes, I can almost guarantee that the January story was produced in response to work by Bowdoin. I seriously doubt that a reporter sat in his office at the Portland Press Herald, dreamed up the idea that giving the award to Flaherty was "controversial," and then called a bunch of coaches who would confirm that theory. It happened the other way around . .   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 20, 2007, 02:52:23 PM
If you say so. Seems rather insulting to the writer.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 22, 2007, 09:57:54 AM
Between Amherst's coaching change and returning almost all its key players from a solid team, and Williams getting decimated by graduation, next year could represent the best chance for the Herst to break Williams' long stretch of dominance (something like 14 victories in a row over around six years) in women's hoops.  Anyone have any idea where Williams will get scoring from next year, especially inside?  Hopefully the Ephs have some top-notch frosh coming in or some bench players ready to step up, because right now it looks like Amherst is significantly more talented, and Williams rarely beats teams that have a talent advantage (they aren't going to out-strategize anyone).  Great run for the graduating senior class, which has to be among the most talented and accomplished in Williams history. 

Tough luck for Bowdoin ... has to be frustrating to just barely miss the final four on so many occasions.  Still, Pemper is an amazing coach and, if interested, definitely deserves a chance to coach at an Ivy or someplace like that.  Without Flaherty, Bowdoin likely won't be the preseason NESCAC favorite (that would be Bates), but they'll likely win yet again anyway. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on March 22, 2007, 11:39:08 AM
it's official. my sources were correct.

http://ncaa.thetask.com/market/view_full.php?id=43839

I would be somewhat shocked if Hersey (?), the female co-coach the past few seasons, is named the sole head coach if she wants the posistion. She is a young, female and I think it would be a real slap in the face if they didn't
hire/stick with her. That being said, I am sure there will be a ton of great canidates hoping to land a cushy coaching spot in the NESCAC.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 22, 2007, 01:37:51 PM
Maybe Hixon could coach both since, from what I've read on the men's board, he invented the game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on March 23, 2007, 08:14:48 PM
Created the Earth!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 26, 2007, 09:48:44 AM
Boston Globe article on Williams' Maggie Miller:

http://www.boston.com/sports/colleges/womens_basketball/articles/2007/03/25/miller_time_is_over/
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: goubears89 on April 01, 2007, 10:26:04 AM
Any word on what admissions letters have arrived where and who might be joining NESCAC school rosters next season? (And could that sentence be one of the worst constructed ever?)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: atn alum on April 02, 2007, 01:22:45 AM
we typically do this on daily dose off the front page, but the info trickles in slow, we don't like to deal in rumors, and most schools don't publicicze this much...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on May 30, 2007, 01:30:28 AM
Congratulations to the NESCAC schools for not artifically inflating their attendance figure in order to gain ill-gotten attention.

I guess the highest academic standards and unmatched athletic excellence will have to suffice.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on May 30, 2007, 09:50:30 AM
Good to hear from you Monkey, shall we plan to take in some games this coming season?  ;D
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on May 30, 2007, 08:22:43 PM
BE,

Good to hear from you. I trust all is well in the border states.

Maybe I could sneak down for the CAC tournament, as that seems to be a very competitive bunch of games. Pencil me in for the Goucher-St. Mary's grudge match. Or is Catholic the team to beat this year?

Needless to say, there is an open invitation to come up to God's country during striper season. Merrymeeting Bay should be teeming with bass this August, and, appropriately enough, it also has a large population of Bald Eagles.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bbald eagle on May 30, 2007, 09:04:18 PM
Ah, monkey, you must be pulling balder's leg. He's quite the fisherman, I hear, but even he knows, alas, that Goucher and Catholic women will never win the CAC - never having won the crown, they have departed for a new conference in their quest for an elusive title.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on May 30, 2007, 09:38:07 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on May 30, 2007, 08:22:43 PM

Needless to say, there is an open invitation to come up to God's country during striper season. Merrymeeting Bay should be teeming with bass this August, and, appropriately enough, it also has a large population of Bald Eagles.



Monkey Man, I will be off Phippsburg fly fishing for stripers next week, possibly over by Georgetown also. Then will head up country in July stalking brook trout and salmon. Just love the Western Mountain Area of Maine! I was considering putting a UMW Final Four T-Shirt on the statue of Joshua Chamberlain at campus but decided against it, too old for the college prank thing  ;)  Maybe we can cross paths at Little Dog Coffee Shop, after all it has big bite! I suspect I will be taking in several Bowdoin games this season before coming south for the CAC.
:-*  enjoy the cam  http://www.briloon.org/watching-wildlife/eagle-cam.php
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on May 30, 2007, 10:28:04 PM
Is the CAC a league that hands out its "championship" in the tournament? Many leagues crown their champion based on the regular season and give the automatic bid to the tournament winner.

If the latter, then your statement is incorrect, I believe.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on May 30, 2007, 11:38:39 PM
BE,

Excellent. If you wear your MWC Third Place t-shirt on Popham Beach i'll be able to find you. You seem to be a spinner-bait type of guy, so you should be easy to spot. Or perhaps a spear-fisherman?

I'm up in the Belgrade Lakes for the summer, but I'll make the trip down if you're up for a friendly competition. Fresh water is my game (my nine for an eight-weight accuracy is legendary around these parts) but I'll get salty if there's money on the line...

On a sidenote, my apologies for the CAC inaccuracies. Damn you, Landmark Conference.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on May 31, 2007, 08:56:12 AM
Monkey-

  At this point maybe you will be best served by inviting P C along for the competition. I actually prefer freshwater over salt, however the man at Kennebec Angler in Bath has been pressuring me to land a striper, so I figure I will have a go at it this year. I will use my 6 weight, more sporting and a lot of fun. With a nine weight I suspect you might be more accurate throwing a line with a basketball attached. There are a few things Popham Beach is good for, Sun tanning and bait fisherman are the most popular. I do not meet the criteria of either. Should you look for me I will be just off shore in a Boston Whaler throwing my 6 weight, I switch to a 4 weight when inland.

Those folks at LL Bean are too much for me, with Cabela's coming to Maine it will be good for the local consumer. You don't strike me as the typical Mainer going with the "LL Bean Look."

Belgrade Lakes eh, don't tell me you jet ski  ::)

Happy Fishing
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bbald eagle on May 31, 2007, 02:58:56 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on May 30, 2007, 10:28:04 PM
Is the CAC a league that hands out its "championship" in the tournament? Many leagues crown their champion based on the regular season and give the automatic bid to the tournament winner.

If the latter, then your statement is incorrect, I believe.

It's been the former in the CAC. The tournament winner is the league champion and also gets the invite. And it remains that way with the league handbook update in light of the exodus of some teams and others joining the CAC.

I've seen a couple of banners  though saying something like "regular season champions" where the team got knocked off in the CAC tournament (one's at Catholic).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on June 04, 2007, 01:29:37 AM
BE,

There would be about two weeks a year calm enough for me to fish with a six-weight. And I like to fish outside of an arm's length, so I would use a screen-porch door instead of a four-weight. I hope your brook is bubbling.

I bought a set of snow-shoes from Bean's this winter and found the purchase to be much like the fleeces I've bought there: nothing terribly disappointing, but nothing to justify the substantial mark-up. I've already reverted back to the cat-gut shoes I used before. Plus, I'm becoming slightly agoraphobic in my old age so Freeport holds no attraction.

Jet-ski owners are the dregs of humanity. Period.

See you at Cook's Lobster House.


Quote from: Balder Eagle on May 31, 2007, 08:56:12 AM
Monkey-

  At this point maybe you will be best served by inviting P C along for the competition. I actually prefer freshwater over salt, however the man at Kennebec Angler in Bath has been pressuring me to land a striper, so I figure I will have a go at it this year. I will use my 6 weight, more sporting and a lot of fun. With a nine weight I suspect you might be more accurate throwing a line with a basketball attached. There are a few things Popham Beach is good for, Sun tanning and bait fisherman are the most popular. I do not meet the criteria of either. Should you look for me I will be just off shore in a Boston Whaler throwing my 6 weight, I switch to a 4 weight when inland.

Those folks at LL Bean are too much for me, with Cabela's coming to Maine it will be good for the local consumer. You don't strike me as the typical Mainer going with the "LL Bean Look."

Belgrade Lakes eh, don't tell me you jet ski  ::)

Happy Fishing

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on June 25, 2007, 02:27:52 PM
any thoughts about the new hire at amherst? as much as i hate to say it as a williams fan, i think gromacki is a great coach and amherst is lucky to get him. slightly surprised that amherst did not go with a female given the gerenal trend to hire female coaches for female sports teams, however, gender aside, i think he is one of the best out there. ill be interested to see what he can do over at amherst and how quickly he can do it...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on June 27, 2007, 12:57:35 AM
Best out there? I know Ham Tech won the coveted Liberty League title (edging out Vassar, no doubt) but let's not get ahead of ourselves. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt because he was hired by Suzanne Coffey -- the same AD who hired Jim Murphy.

With that said, I am also a little surprised that a progressive institution like Amherst would take this route. Unless the position was lowballed financially (unlikely considering Gromacki is clearly a mercenary), it really makes no sense.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on June 27, 2007, 08:07:24 AM
feces,

obviously the liberty league is not what the nescac is in terms of talent. however, ham tech did beat 2 out of the 3 nescac teams they played last year - they lost to williams and beat middlebury and amherst. they also gave scranton a run for their money in the ncaa tourny and only lost by six. i think a lot of my respect and admiration comes from what he did at st. lawrence where he made them a sweet sixteen or elite eight team (can't rememeber which) in 2 or 3 years. i don't think he is as good as pemper or murphy, but i think he was one of the best available coaches amherst could get.  i think he'll do well at amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: fpc85 on June 27, 2007, 10:00:14 AM
Will he be a long term solution? Is this the type of situation he wants to be a part of for years to come?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on June 27, 2007, 10:33:11 AM
fcp85,

i can't speak for gromacki, however as i understand it, nescac coaching positions is every d3 coach's dream. i've heard that from a number of coaches given the benefits, job security, and the relatively easy task of recruiting players to a top notch institution (though actually getting players into schools is much harder). the UAA is obviously another great gig but many coaches don't like the travel that comes with the conference play. unless they move onto d1 programs, you really don't see a ton of coaching changes especially at the higher tier of nescac schools - amherst, williams, midd, etc. - that move around to too many different places.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: atn alum on June 27, 2007, 11:15:18 AM
Actually, (in response to person who said he got SLU to elite 8/16) he got st. lawrence to the finals in 2002 (beating Bowdoin to get there), barely losing to wisconsin-stevens point.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on June 27, 2007, 12:55:57 PM
Quote from: atnwriter on June 27, 2007, 11:15:18 AM
Actually, (in response to person who said he got SLU to elite 8/16) he got st. lawrence to the finals in 2002 (beating Bowdoin to get there), barely losing to wisconsin-stevens point.

i stand corrected. yes, it was the title game. thanks for the info though - going to the title game improves my claim that gromacki is the real deal when it comes to coaching. it should be interesting to see how he does with an amherst time that really has been mediocre at best over the past 5 years or so.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on July 11, 2007, 04:33:29 PM
Monkey,

   Sorry I have been absent - life has kept me quite busy. I must confess I found a nice pool on the upper Kennebec that was a distance away, and had to break out my six weight in order to get to it- some big fish though. Most of my fishing is done on remote ponds.

   A friend has me planning kayaking and fly-fishing from it for striped bass, stay tuned.

  Trust you are well and enjoying the cool weather.

 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on July 17, 2007, 01:50:11 AM
BE,

Glad to hear all is well. You'll have to let me know of any hot spots in the head waters. The cool weather has been a mixed blessing. If you hit Merrymeeting on the kayak let me know the particulars.

Whoever introduced Northern Pike to Central Maine should be drawn and quartered.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: usmhoops1 on July 17, 2007, 12:56:00 PM
Good morning to all.  Check out the top academic teams in D3.  Very surprised to not see Bowdoin, Bates, Colby in the mix.  Certainly tough standards though.  An interesting mix though.
Article is on the home page for D3hoops.


Only a couple months to go.  Dont want to wish away the sunshine though. What a gorgeous day in Maine today!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 17, 2007, 01:08:25 PM
True, not listed. But then again, all that means is that the team's GPA could be as high as 3.376, which is pretty darn outstanding.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on July 17, 2007, 08:27:16 PM
And honestly with a team gpa that high (above 3.37+), then i would be surprised to have Bowdoin, Bates, and Colby in the mix. In fact, I am (happily) surprised Vassar and Emory are that high (especially with the bio and physics majors on the Emory team). Emory pre-med is darn serious.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on July 20, 2007, 04:34:28 PM
Three Colby Recruits:

Karlyn Adler - from Blind Brook High School in NY. listed at 5'9", maybe shes 5'8". Averaged 17.5 ppg in her senior year. Plays truly as a guard and not a post player. She can shoot. Range up to about a foot behind the 3pt line. Has to work on defensive quickness and offensive explosiveness. More offensively-minded than defense-minded. Numerous awards, but you can google her name for those.

from maxpreps:
Her Maxpreps page (http://www.maxpreps.com/FanPages/Player.mxp/NewYork/Girls_Varsity_Basketball_Winter_06-07/AreaID-/SchoolID-772e0484-793e-496c-8ec9-e0a6ce54a25a/AthleteID-350e91ca-bded-43de-9442-2f333c48dc85)

Julianne Kowalski - Montville, NJ - The single dominating force on her high school team. I think she is 6'1." From what I remember of seeing her play (almost 2yrs ago), range up to 15-16 feet. Will need to work on upper body strength (like most freshman post players). An excellent three sport athlete (lacrosse, field hockey, basketball) and excelled at all 3. Numerous awards in all three sports, but you can google her name for those too.

From an article I found online at  NJ.com article (http://www.nj.com/hssports/girlsbasketball/ledger/stories/index.ssf?/hssports/girlsbasketball/stories/morris.html):
QuoteHometown hero: Julianne Kowalski could have played at her choice of private schools, but chose to attend Montville, where she never played on a winning team, but will graduate as the school's all-time leading scorer with 1,030 points. She averaged 16.2 points and 10.2 rebounds this year for a 7-17 team. More importantly, she's ranked eighth in her class and will continue her career at Colby in Maine.

"It was tough not to win many games, but my teammates were awesome and it was great getting to play with them," she said.

Meredith Aronson - (Mt. Lakes) - Don't know much about except that she is a forward and played for an excellent AAU program; If I see her play in a summer league when I take my August trip to NYC, Ill post something.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on August 19, 2007, 04:14:44 AM
Quote from: Wydown Blvd. on July 20, 2007, 04:34:28 PM
"It was tough not to win many games, but my teammates were awesome and it was great getting to play with them," she said.

Appropriately enough, I believe this is a verbatim excerpt from every graduating Colby women's basketball player's yearbook entry...
Title: Colby players
Post by: tothehole on August 20, 2007, 08:55:37 PM
Thats cold but hey thats Maine duh
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on October 30, 2007, 11:35:04 PM
Only one senior on the Polar Bear roster for 07-08. I guess this is the year the dregs of Division III finally catch up with the best.

Actually, the Mary Washington loss was already a sign of the apocolypse. Oh, well. Division III will be broken up by academic standards soon enough.

I'm jumping on the Conn. College bandwagon early. Go Camels!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on October 31, 2007, 11:43:26 AM
 FM,  what about bates? bowdoin will still be there, but not nearly as strong.
ooh ! a low one to the Camels.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bbald eagle on October 31, 2007, 01:41:15 PM
Monkey - i'd guess you think the preseason USA TODAY ESPN DIVISION III TOP 25 COACHES' POLL's got Bowdoin way overranked at #5? What about Southern Maine at #10? Bates is in their "also getting votes" category.

http://www.wbca.org/DIIICoachesPoll.asp
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on November 01, 2007, 09:52:43 AM
Monkey,

   How are you? I read bbald's post, a good ranking for Bowdoin. I heard Bowdoin added three or four Freshman Women that will have immediate impact. Any input?
     
   My fishing season came to an end. During my last outing I managed to land some big salmon, several 18 to 24 inch fish, on my 4 wieght.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: met_fan on November 03, 2007, 02:09:27 AM
Well it's a new season for Gromacki to work his magic.  How many schools in how many years is it now?  And I know.....I'm a Hamilton guy so it's sour grapes, but how many schools is it in the last five years?  (Part of my bitterness is that Hamilton should still be NESCAC for BB, but since they still are for about  75% of sports, I continually hold out hope that they rejoin for BB.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: newtonnancy on November 03, 2007, 09:21:23 AM
Hello all,

Brandeis I see picked up Williams, anything is an upgrade from last years non conference schedule but is Williams as good as past few years or are they down?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on November 04, 2007, 12:31:23 AM
 Nancy: it's good to hear from you. It's nice to see that you're still interested in this neck of the woods and the student athletes at Deis. Williams lost four out of five starters and I think their top two reserves. The big losses (no pun intended) were Margaret Miller and Meg(h?)an O'Malley. A couple years ago they lost a lot of people and came up with the O'Malley / Miller crew. Are you still a Maroon? Maroon fan i.e.? Kidding aside, I've sort of missed you.
   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: newtonnancy on November 04, 2007, 11:09:34 AM
Thanks,

Yep still in Chicago, but still follow the UAA, can't get into any of the other schools out here, its just not the same as back east. I will always be a Judge, its just I have friends still at Brandeis and I hear stuff that makes me nuts, that was my reason for jumping on the Maroon bandwagon. Sometimes people just get so full of themselves and believe their own press and hearing some comments I really was hoping the Maroons would put the smack down on the Judges last year.

Just want to see and read about good bballllllllllllll
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on November 04, 2007, 10:40:41 PM
Just took a little nudge -- and jab -- to get the NESCAC ball rolling.

Yes, Eagles, the Polar Bears are over-ranked at this point, but who knows what things will look like at the end of the season? Certainly not in the same league as Mary Wash. However, I've got nothing on the freshman class, which, if Pemper's record holds, will be pretty strong.

I'm sorry to say I haven't done my homework on the conference yet, however it is quite humorous that Brandeis scheduled Williams during what appears to be the Ephs' weakest season in the last decade. The Brandeis coach is a former Colby grad, so she's used to playing a soft schedule.

http://www.bkstr.com/ProductDisplay/10001-10003-10443-4000000000000081809-1?demoKey=d

I've already bought my plush Camel good luck charm. This is the year. Go CC!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops and football impact
Post by: tothehole on November 06, 2007, 09:23:58 AM
http://sports.espn.go.com/espntv/espnMicrosite?showID=FBCG
Will Coach Manning change her practice schedule? Will Coach Paulsen?
Lee Corso says yes
Look for the Ehps at College Game day
A great moment for the NESCAC
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on November 06, 2007, 10:31:47 AM
 heard tufts has a d-1 transfer that plays the five. anyone hear the same?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops and football impact
Post by: feces monkey on November 07, 2007, 10:04:18 PM
Quote from: tothehole on November 06, 2007, 09:23:58 AM
http://sports.espn.go.com/espntv/espnMicrosite?showID=FBCG
Will Coach Manning change her practice schedule? Will Coach Paulsen?
Lee Corso says yes
Look for the Ehps at College Game day
A great moment for the NESCAC

A great moment for the NESCAC is when another alum is sworn in as a federal judge or becomes the CEO of a Fortune 500 company. Not when a sports network sends a tedious preview show to hype a pair of middling football teams. Didn't Williams lose to Bowdoin?

I'm skeptical of D-1 players transfering to D-3 schools. It usually happens for a reason. Unless of course they are going to Southern Maine, where they will be paid handsomely.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: papabear on November 10, 2007, 01:24:34 PM
As a long time follower of the polar bears it is very hard to imagine the team being close to as successful as last years team. They lost there best three players in Flaherty Cummings and Loonin and there most talented player in this years "class" has been kicked off the team because of a clash with Pemper. It is a pretty sad story for the privileged few that know the whole story. This years class consists of one senior who has not seen more than wipe up duties the first three years and that is unlikely to change this year. It is hard to replace the player of the year, Cummings, and Loonin.  Forget about the talent they lose but the leadership displayed by those three will be sorely missed this year.

Will they be competitive? Sure, but there is so much uncertainty and the only players that had significant roles last year are Kaubris, Anelauskas and to some point Rubega. Much of Anelauskas game relied on easy baskets as the defense doubled Flaherty so I think her numbers will go down. I hope I am wrong but I think the polar bears streak of NESCAC titles and NCAA bid's is over. One thing is for certain the crowds will be smaller and thankfully you will be able to get to the game less then three hours before the tip to get a parking spot. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on November 11, 2007, 07:52:11 PM
I think papabear's blood sugar is getting low again.

Although it is good to see he is able to put a positive spin on the impending Bowdoin decline -- seat availability! Arriving later could put a crimp in his game-day routine, which included hitting the "Early Bird" special at Friendly's (ham & cheese, fries and a sundae, $4.99).

Papa, you've obviously got the "inside scoop," but I'll go ahead and give Pemper the benefit of the doubt.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: newtonnancy on November 12, 2007, 08:08:53 AM
Considering that the NESCAC sounds to be down this year re comments about Williams, The Polar Bears etc and with Emmanuel losing a player,  that must have Brandies as possibly the top regionally ranked team this year.... ;)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on November 12, 2007, 09:22:34 AM
Quote from: Balder Eagle on November 01, 2007, 09:52:43 AM
Monkey,

   How are you? I read bbald's post, a good ranking for Bowdoin. I heard Bowdoin added three or four Freshman Women that will have immediate impact. Any input?
Quote from: feces monkey on November 11, 2007, 07:52:11 PM
I think papabear's blood sugar is getting low again.

Although it is good to see he is able to put a positive spin on the impending Bowdoin decline -- seat availability! Arriving later could put a crimp in his game-day routine, which included hitting the "Early Bird" special at Friendly's (ham & cheese, fries and a sundae, $4.99).

Papa, you've obviously got the "inside scoop," but I'll go ahead and give Pemper the benefit of the doubt.
OK Papa, maybe you can give insight to the incoming Freshman? I do trust Monkeys faith in Coach Pemper.  He also eats at better establishments as he eluded last year to frequenting Joshua's Restaurant & Tavern.

come on guys, I see a Flaherty listed as an incoming Freshman player  :)
25 Kathleen Flaherty 11 F 5-9  Fairfield, Conn./Lauralton Hall
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on November 12, 2007, 01:39:56 PM
Quote from: newtonnancy on November 12, 2007, 08:08:53 AM
Considering that the NESCAC sounds to be down this year re comments about Williams, The Polar Bears etc and with Emmanuel losing a player,  that must have Brandies as possibly the top regionally ranked team this year.... ;)

not so fast nancy, expect bates to be up there this year. they return all american meg coffin for the second semester after she missed all of last year with a knee injury. combined with sarah barton (all american) and matia kostakis (co-nescac rookie of the year with sarah barton - kostakis was on amherst at the time and transferred to bates), expect them to be a top the region!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on November 12, 2007, 06:28:05 PM
Meg Coffin doing a 5 er. Wow how D 1 of her.  I wish her luck and I hope her knee hold up.  The Hospital for Special Surgery in NYC will be more than to see most of these NESCAC ladies in about 10 years. I wish all the ladies a injury free season and look forward to seeing all the battles on the court. Lets get ready to rumble....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on November 14, 2007, 01:34:16 PM
Quote from: nescac hoops on November 12, 2007, 01:39:56 PM
Quote from: newtonnancy on November 12, 2007, 08:08:53 AM
Considering that the NESCAC sounds to be down this year re comments about Williams, The Polar Bears etc and with Emmanuel losing a player,  that must have Brandies as possibly the top regionally ranked team this year.... ;)

not so fast nancy, expect bates to be up there this year. they return all american meg coffin for the second semester after she missed all of last year with a knee injury. combined with sarah barton (all american) and matia kostakis (co-nescac rookie of the year with sarah barton - kostakis was on amherst at the time and transferred to bates), expect them to be a top the region!

Don't forget Val Beckwith, who emerged as the best player on the team for most of last year's games. Lauren Yanofsky was outstanding in limited time, too, and I hope to see Kellie Goodridge picking up some of Sarah's creativeness. Sad to see that Teal Carroll isn't on the roster, she was a really effective scorer off the bench. But the team looks to be quite formidable, at least on paper.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on November 15, 2007, 08:20:00 PM
Quote from: tothehole on November 12, 2007, 06:28:05 PM
Meg Coffin doing a 5 er. Wow how D 1 of her.

This isn't that unusual at D-III, using a medical redshirt.
Title: Re: Med reshirt
Post by: tothehole on November 16, 2007, 09:29:26 AM
Does any one have an idea how many NESCAC women basketball players have medical redshirted a 5th year in the last 5 years?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: newtonnancy on November 16, 2007, 12:05:46 PM
Well it wasn't a "medical red****" but I remember Kelly Manning at Wash U went to Maine tore an ACL and then played a 5th year at Wash U while she took Grad Classes a few years ago..

Also, I think Brandeis is in for a long UAA season, I have been talking to a few people here and Chicago is suppose to be playing really well together, I am not going to get crazy about them like last year and I do want to see how Brandeis does against Emmanual, Williams and in their Tourny this weekend, but they could be anywhere from 3 to 6 in the UAA and with what I read here about Bates, USM and the Polar Bears, I may be wrong with them being the top team in the NE Region.

Title: Re: Med reshirt
Post by: nescac hoops on November 16, 2007, 09:18:36 PM
Quote from: tothehole on November 16, 2007, 09:29:26 AM
Does any one have an idea how many NESCAC women basketball players have medical redshirted a 5th year in the last 5 years?

i don't know of any. being a williams alum (as was meg coffins all american basketball playing brother), i can tell you that the coffin family, while VERY athletic, are a bit "off" at least when it comes to athletics...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on November 17, 2007, 12:15:47 AM
<sigh>

Folks, we already beat the "Coffin Fifth Year" thing to a pulp last spring. She got hurt and she really likes basketball, so she's massaging her timeline. Whatever. She is/was a great player, but this ain't gonna swing the balance of the power in the conference. Just a kid trying to maximize the college experience. I don't know Coffin from Eve and I dislike Bates more than Hillary Clinton, but this is a non-issue.

There is no other explanation for Nescac Hoops' comment other than he is still in love with Meg. That post was far too gratuitous to not be from a scorned suitor.

It appears Nancy has been dipping into the Manischewitz again. It's the NESCAC board, Nance. Just because you have an incoherent UAA story vaguely related to the current topic doesn't mean it's time for an update to your 'unofficial' New England rankings. Shouldn't you be instant messaging Karon about when you're picking him up at O'Hare?

Balder, great catch on the new Flaherty. Didn't even cross my mind. Alas, judging by the box score, the next edition may need a couple of years to match the previous. However, I'm not sure if Arcadia (?) was a good indicator. Arcadia. I looked at the schedule and they only played two games last year (according to D3hoops.com). I think I've camped there a couple of times. Blackwoods, to be specific. Maybe the campus is in Winterharbor.



Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on November 17, 2007, 07:42:33 AM
Feces monkey your such a fm Do you have a pink boa to boot? Meg C should get on with the life mon and bye the bye what are you smokin. Williams bye 12 today
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on November 17, 2007, 09:47:51 AM
Quote from: feces monkey on November 17, 2007, 12:15:47 AM
<sigh>
There is no other explanation for Nescac Hoops' comment other than he is still in love with Meg. That post was far too gratuitous to not be from a scorned suitor.

fm, perhaps my last post was inappropriate. as i have said before, when you go to a nescac school it is for an education - future employers, etc may not understand sports dedication and why it took her 5 years to complete college. i also really cherished my senior year and graduating with my classmates, something that meg will miss out on. as for being a "scorned suitor"....i'm trying my hardest to bite my tongue on this one but ill just say that her brother received a number of chants at lefrak in amherst, ma regarding the coffin genetics.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: newtonnancy on November 17, 2007, 10:19:43 AM
WHOOOOOOOOPS   
DARN  I stepped  in Monkey $hit again
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: newtonnancy on November 17, 2007, 10:22:22 AM
Also, the gratuitous Manischewitz comment was a wondeful touch, but then again not unexpected from the great white state of Maine.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: JeffRookie2 on November 17, 2007, 08:36:15 PM

The Amherst women start off with an eye-popping 98-33 victory over CCNY. Hopefully this is indicative that the new coach has them moving in the right direction, and not that CCNY is really, really bad.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: emmanuelfan on November 18, 2007, 10:34:00 AM
Well, it seems that the Williams Women will have a very long season as they lost to WNEC!!!!! Correct me if I am wrong but WNEC was about .500 last year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on November 18, 2007, 11:24:56 AM
Ephs are very young ... they started two frosh (both of whom look promising based on their stats) and have two more frosh in the rotation ... might take them awhile to gell with only one returning starter and lots of new players, definitely will be a rebuilding year, it all depends how quickly the frosh acclimate. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on November 18, 2007, 12:10:21 PM
Nescac1's take on Williams could be applied to Bowdoin, as well, although I don't think the Polar Bears are quite as young as the Ephs. Bowdoin was dismantled yesterday, especially on the offensive glass. Both Williams and the Pbears may take a bit to figure out the new personnel. Or something.

Early season prediction for the league:

1. Tufts
2. Bates
3. Bowdoin
4. Wesleyan
5. Williams
6. Amherst
7. Middlebury
8. Colby
9. Conn. College
10. Trinity

I think the league will be more balanced this year, but not as powerful (nationally) at the top.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on November 18, 2007, 12:25:55 PM
Monkey good (read) to see you  :)
Thanks for the kudo.
I agree Bowdoin will have to sort out is plan. Never underestimate Coach Pemper, she gets the most out of her girls as Coach Finney does at Marymount (CAC.)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on November 19, 2007, 11:17:02 AM
FM,
   i see you have tufts at the top. as i said,they have a d-1 transfer playing the 5, along with the other 6-1 post player. but you can run on them.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on November 19, 2007, 11:25:14 AM
BALDER, pemper is a good coach. if a coach has a really good system and schemes they run, they will get the most out of whatever talent they have.of course, good coaches know what to do in tight games with a few minutes to go.
  talent makes a good coach great.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on November 19, 2007, 05:56:31 PM
Looks like Williams has a stellar frosh class ... and could end with frosh as three of their four top scorers.  C. Jackson in particular put up ridiculous numbers (21 points, 8.5 rebounds, 2.5 blocks, 67 % from two and 5/8 from 3) this weekend.  Two other frosh each averaged over 10/6.  Of course, too early to judge just how good they are until better competition in league play, but the Ephs may be better than expected this season, if the young players grow up fast to make up for the lack of experience on the roster. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: papabear on November 20, 2007, 08:17:18 PM
Sorry folks been away for a few days, I missed the polar bears get beat by Rochester thankfully.  I think I was dead on with my prediction this team is immature, and not nearly as skilled as past teams. I can not recall Bowdoin women losing by double digits never mind 20+.Pemper is a good coach but she has never won the big game. She just likes to kick back and relax during the game not a micro manager at all, it also helps when you have such enormous talent in Justine Porevoluis in the past and Flaherty, Cummings, Loonin, and Berne while she was on the roster. This will be a tough season for the polar bears and Joshua's tavern has nothing on Sea Dogs stay tuned.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: goubears89 on November 21, 2007, 03:14:14 PM
Papabear, in the interest of the holiday season, I am going to try and hold back from responding to your absurd comment about Stef Pemper. To say she likes to "kick back and relax" is ridiculous. True, there is no clear leader as she's had in the past with Myers-Mayol-Royer-Trenkle-Pourevelis-Flaherty, but the season is young, and I think over time there are a number of candidates who could step up. Maybe I'm reading your post wrong, but are you inferring that Pemper should start micromanaging? Will that really improve a young team that needs to find itself and its leader?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on November 22, 2007, 09:36:37 AM
  if bowdoin doesn't have the talent this year, that's the way it is. deal with it.
they still should be decent if they play within the coach's system.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: papabear on November 22, 2007, 10:25:25 AM
Well yeah they will be decent it is easy to be decent in a conference that has fallen apart. They will continue to pound on the weak teams, Arcadia, and New England so far and even Emmanuel looks weaker this year, I believe Bowdoin has them scheduled in December at home which should be a good test.

Pemper is a good coach who would have won a national championship if she played her stars Flaherty, Cummings, Loonin and Analeuskas  more, and did not play a freshmen in big spots foolishly. Look at the time they spent on the bench in close games last year and it ended up costing them in the end. Watch a game and tell me how many times she gets off the bench, excluding half time and time outs which she rarely calls.  She will be sitting there with her leg crossed. She is a good coach, but the talent is gone so this is a big season for her.

Happy Thanksgiving all I will be back on Sunday.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: newtonnancy on November 23, 2007, 07:39:06 AM
Can TUFTS get up and beat Brandeis on Sunday????
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on November 24, 2007, 06:56:39 PM
Anybody at the Bates/USM game on Tuesday? My usual crew wasn't there so I didn't get to hear anything outside of the recap (which was depressing from my end, but I imagine pleased most of you).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on November 25, 2007, 04:27:03 PM
Quote from: whoarewebobcats on November 24, 2007, 06:56:39 PM
Anybody at the Bates/USM game on Tuesday? My usual crew wasn't there so I didn't get to hear anything outside of the recap (which was depressing from my end, but I imagine pleased most of you).

only down at 5 at the half. first game of the season for the bobcats (usm with +2 weeks of practice and 2 games under their belt). kostakis having a miserable night shooting. sans meg coffin. game at southern maine. ill take the bobcats by 15+ if the two teams meet up again later in the season when it counts. whoarewebobcats, you can lay off the prozac.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: newtonnancy on November 26, 2007, 12:23:22 AM
Kudos to TUFTS.....Great Win!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on November 26, 2007, 08:17:44 AM
I just wanted to state that when coach Berube and the Tufts Jumbos arrived back on the Tufts campus yesterday after their victory over Brandeis, I personally congratulated them on the win.   Both Brandeis teams were playing Tufts yesterday, with the men's game taking place at Cousens Gym on the Tufts campus, and both games were challenging affairs.

Best wishes to Tufts in the upcoming NESCAC conference season...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on November 26, 2007, 09:38:14 AM
Quote from: nescac hoops on November 25, 2007, 04:27:03 PM
Quote from: whoarewebobcats on November 24, 2007, 06:56:39 PM
Anybody at the Bates/USM game on Tuesday? My usual crew wasn't there so I didn't get to hear anything outside of the recap (which was depressing from my end, but I imagine pleased most of you).

only down at 5 at the half. first game of the season for the bobcats (usm with +2 weeks of practice and 2 games under their belt). kostakis having a miserable night shooting. sans meg coffin. game at southern maine. ill take the bobcats by 15+ if the two teams meet up again later in the season when it counts. whoarewebobcats, you can lay off the prozac.

I wasn't all that worried about it, just looking for anything that the recap/box score might not have showed. Thanks.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on November 26, 2007, 09:55:13 AM
WAWB,
I know. It was jsut a joke. All joking aside, I don't think there is too much to worry about up in Lewiston as far as the women's team is concerned....men's team, well that's another story. With a Tufts win yesterday against Brandeis I think it will be be a bobcat-jumbo conference title game assuming coffin's knee rehabilitation allows her to return to her old form.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on November 26, 2007, 01:23:25 PM
Yeah I figured you were joking, I just didn't want to come off as panicky :) I agree with your thoughts on the team though. One weird thing about these Bates girls teams of the last few years is that they seem to have one or two of these kind of blowout losses a year. Maybe it's true of any team. Sometimes I think Murphy just gives up on the team during certain games. But if Meg can come back even at 80% of her old form, this should be a pretty good team.

The boys are a different story, yes. I saw them at the Babson tourney (posted about it in the men's forum) and they are certainly in rebuilding mode. Some good young players, though, they could be good again in a couple years.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on November 26, 2007, 04:42:01 PM
Quote from: deiscanton on November 26, 2007, 08:17:44 AM
I just wanted to state that when coach Berube and the Tufts Jumbos arrived back on the Tufts campus yesterday after their victory over Brandeis, I personally congratulated them on the win. 

Following the bus back to Medford, huh? I'll assume you've already received the 100-foot restraining order by certified mail.

You can bet Carol Simon is furiously crossing Tufts off the '08-'09 schedule today and skimming the NAC for a replacement.

The Polar Bears head south for their annual match-up with the Gorham semi-pro franchise tomorrow. Word has it there will be a little extra in the pay envelopes if the Huskies can send a message. Judging by the Bobcat score, I'd say Bowdoin is a 20-point 'dog.

Quote from: papabear on November 20, 2007, 08:17:18 PM
She just likes to kick back and relax during the game not a micro manager at all, it also helps when you have such enormous talent in Justine Porevoluis in the past and Flaherty, Cummings, Loonin, and Berne while she was on the roster.

The odd (and somewhat laughable) inclusion of Berne on the above list leads me to believe Ol' Papabear is not an objective observer to the Polar Bear squad.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on November 26, 2007, 07:35:12 PM
Feces, do you know exactly what happened to Berne....perhaps papabear would be the better one to ask?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: papabear on November 27, 2007, 06:49:56 PM
In response to Berne I am not sure of the details, I heard through a third party, the team has been very quiet about it, all I can say is it was a coaches decision.

I think the bears lose by 15tto USM I will be there though.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on November 27, 2007, 10:15:23 PM
USM 77, Bowdoin 58

Seasons Beatings.

Governor Baldacci has already bankrupted the state with his health care farce, so he's going to have to dip into the emergency fund to pay off Fifield's impending "work-study" bonuses after this beat down. And according to GoDaddy, Papabear has already registered StefStinx.com.

Brunswick is Burning.

Circle the date: Jan. 15, Conn. College v. Bowdoin. Toilet Bowl.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on November 28, 2007, 09:24:30 PM
I have a quick question after looking at Bowdoin's schedule. I know the Maine schools played each other twice similar to the Little Three games that Williams-Amherst-Wesleyan do. Why is Bodwoin playing Colby at Thomas (?) - what/where is Thomas and why are they playing there? Is something wrong with the Colby gym. Renovations?

Also, Bates is playing the Apprentice School of Norwich next week. Now I have heard of Norwich College but who is this? I know Murphy wanted to pad the first semester with cupcakes while Coffin is not eligible, but is this game really necessary?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on November 28, 2007, 11:45:31 PM
The floor for the Colby basketball court was damaged by water and is in the process of being replaced. In the meantime, Colby is playing its home games elsewhere . .
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on November 29, 2007, 11:26:12 AM
 anyone know what happened at colby over the past year? did the coach eliminate the previous coaches' recruits ( other than mccabe) and replace them with her kids?

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on November 29, 2007, 03:23:33 PM
Quote from: nescac hoops on November 28, 2007, 09:24:30 PM
. . what/where is Thomas and why are they playing there? Is something wrong with the Colby gym. Renovations?

Also, Bates is playing the Apprentice School of Norwich next week. Now I have heard of Norwich College but who is this? I know Murphy wanted to pad the first semester with cupcakes while Coffin is not eligible, but is this game really necessary?

Thomas is in Waterville so it's close to Colby.

It's not the Apprentice School of Norwich. Rather, it's the Apprentice School or Norwich. It's a tournament so Bates's second round opponent is unknown.  Here's a link for the Apprentice School, which appears to be a school in Newport News, VA for potential shipbuilders: http://www.gobuilders.com/landing/index
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on November 29, 2007, 04:02:35 PM
Saw on the front page of D3 sports that Amherst is 4-0 under new coach Gromacki.  If the NESCAC is so weak this year, does Amherst have a chance.  Freshmen look to have had some success.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on November 29, 2007, 07:24:14 PM
Quote from: sumfun on November 29, 2007, 04:02:35 PM
Saw on the front page of D3 sports that Amherst is 4-0 under new coach Gromacki.  If the NESCAC is so weak this year, does Amherst have a chance.  Freshmen look to have had some success.

amherst hasn't played anybody worth mentioning. when they do, we'll see how good they are. i don't think the nescac is that weak this year - just different teams on top. right now i think tufts has to be the best team in the NE region though people could make a argument for USM but i think tufts has played much better competition. while bates lost to USM, i expect them to be neck and neck with tufts once all american me coffin returns for bates second semester. just because bowdoin, is down this year doesn't mean the entire conference is. come february i expect tufts and bates to be two of teams in the NE region.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on November 29, 2007, 08:17:41 PM
 i know tufts has a freshman quard playing a lot of minutes, but the big difference is the d-1 transfer from william and mary playing the five. at 6-3, with another 6-1 post(senior), it will be tough to get many second chance shots against them. other than brandeis, they really haven't played anyone.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: papabear on December 01, 2007, 08:26:26 PM
Another Bowdoin loss they came out of the gate down 12-0. This team is flat and unspired. Attendence was fair at best.  3-3 it is the worst start I can remember.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: newtonnancy on December 02, 2007, 09:56:55 AM
Looks like the Northeast Region is a wide open affair this year.....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on December 05, 2007, 12:21:08 PM
Williams seems to have brought in a strong frosh class to essentially replace the talent they lost from the class of 2007 ... after starting 1-2, the Ephs have won four in a row, with frosh leading the way in many of those games ... Jackson, Harris, and Shea are all at least 5'11, and they combine to average over 35 points and 21 rebounds, plus a fourth frosh is the first guard off the bench.   With such a young team, expect some more bumps in the road, but this group should mature into a formidable nucleus for the next 4 years. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on December 05, 2007, 07:16:10 PM
nescac 1,
you beat me to it! I was just going to post something about how strong the class of 2111 (wow, that's awkward to write) seems to be along with the play of Peterman and Savageau. I don't know how good these teams are they have been playing in the last 4 games but impressive numbers from the class of 2111 nonetheless. It will be interesting to see how they do in conference play but I think the early season losses they had are more indicative of the team's age and "regrouping" after all the seniors they lost last year. I think if those two games were played in February the outcomes could very well be different, as I think this young team has nowhere to go but up with each game. I know people sometimes give coach Manning some flack and I realize that the name "Williams" does most of the recruiting, but kudos to her for having this team play so well together (as evident in their balanced scoring attack) so soon.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 05, 2007, 08:01:00 PM
Quote from: nescac hoops on December 05, 2007, 07:16:10 PM
nescac 1,
you beat me to it! I was just going to post something about how strong the class of 2111 (wow, that's awkward to write) seems to be along with the play of Peterman and Savageau.

It's probably awkward to write because it won't happen for another hundred years. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on December 05, 2007, 09:45:45 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on December 05, 2007, 08:01:00 PM
Quote from: nescac hoops on December 05, 2007, 07:16:10 PM
nescac 1,
you beat me to it! I was just going to post something about how strong the class of 2111 (wow, that's awkward to write) seems to be along with the play of Peterman and Savageau.

It's probably awkward to write because it won't happen for another hundred years. :)

2011, right. In 2111, I don't think these 11's (is that what you are supposed to call them?) would be good anymore. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on December 06, 2007, 09:56:04 PM
williams won in overtime tonight against union 89-84. I have no idea how good union is (they are now 2-2) but another VERY impressive night on behalf of chessie jackson (28 pts and 7 boards), who has to be the nescac ROY this year, along with savageau (14 assists - she has outplayed barton from bates so far this year), and peterman who has really had a breakout season despite a relatively cool night shooting. not to mention froshies shea  and harris who combined for 23 points and 15 boards.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: newtonnancy on December 08, 2007, 02:27:44 PM
Very disappointed in Williams, listening to the game against Brandies and Brandeis blowing them out by 20 in 1st half with 6:41 left.

Lot of Williams Turnovers and can they make a foul shot
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: newtonnancy on December 11, 2007, 03:52:53 PM
WOW  this is one quiet board when the Polar Bears are not doing well
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on December 11, 2007, 09:14:02 PM
Quote from: newtonnancy on December 11, 2007, 03:52:53 PM
WOW  this is one quiet board when the Polar Bears are not doing well

Well, with all the new teams atop the NESCAC (Tufts ranked 20th and Amherst on the brink of the top 25 with "receiving votes), perhaps their fans have not heard of this site.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on December 12, 2007, 04:23:43 PM
Quote from: newtonnancy on December 11, 2007, 03:52:53 PM
WOW  this is one quiet board when the Polar Bears are not doing well

It does seem slow, perhaps Monkey is missed?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on December 16, 2007, 03:19:54 AM
Well, I was considering not coming back this year, but it's just too much fun to pass up.

A few tidbits of info to wet some whistles:

Bates' Yarnofsky hasn't played in a while.  Someone mentioned some injuries for Bates in the first half of the USM game (I was only able to make the 2nd half), but I'm hard of hearing and in a gym with lots of noise I missed exactly who got injured and how badly.

Someone asked if Union was good.  A couple of things about that.  I grew up in upstate, NY and have watched a lot of Liberty league basketball (formerly UCAA).  The top teams are definitely St. Lawrence, Williams Smith, and Hamilton, but Liberty League teams in general have a knack for playing up to (and down to) their opponents.  At best I'd give Union 4th, but the 3 teams ahead of them are pretty good.  Is it possible that the Liberty League is actually good this year?

Team to beat in New England: quite possibly Amherst.  I know this seems strange, but you've gotta know about their new coach.  This guy brought Hamilton College from one of the worst teams in the country to the Liberty League champion and a sweet-sixteen exit from the NCAA tourney by only a few points to a very strong Scranton team.  Oh, and he did this in just one (1) year.  This guy assisted at D1 for a while, took a job at Drew, then took a 1 year interim job at Hamilton without having coached a single game at Drew.  He was a shoe-in for the full-time coach position, but chose Amherst instead, and Amherst wasn't terrible last year, so he's starting at a higher level then he did with Hamilton.  This coach alone makes Amherst scary, and they already look pretty good so far this year.  This is a team that cannot be overlooked.  To do so is to be surprised and embarrased by them.

Early prediction for Nescac based on the little evidence we have so far:

1.  Tufts
2.  Amherst
3.  Bates
4.  Bowdoin
5.  Williams
6.  Wesleyan
7.  Middlebury
8.  Trinity
9.  Conn Coll.
10. Colby

The NESCAC is pretty wide open this year.  Bowdoin is beatable, and the usual lower teams are getting some early wins and looking better than in the past.  I really think that Tufts has to be the favorite to win NESCAC at this point, but Amherst could surprise them easily, and obviously the rest of the top 5 can't be ruled out.  The top 2 aren't far enough ahead to be beyond upset like Bowdoin used to be.

Cheers,
Red1

p.s.  the camping place in Maine is called Acadia National Park.  Arcadia University is in Pennsylvania (just north of philly)   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bbald eagle on December 16, 2007, 10:03:02 AM
Quote from: Red1 on December 16, 2007, 03:19:54 AM
Arcadia University is in Pennsylvania (just north of philly)   

Used to be Beaver, right?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on December 16, 2007, 10:57:10 AM
Nice article on a future Eph point guard:

http://www.boston.com/news/local/articles/2007/12/16/it_starts_at_the_point/


She was Boston Globe all scholastic as a junior, which is impressive.  As I've said before, Williams will have some ups and downs (such as the Brandeis game, for the latter category) this season with such an inexperienced team (3/4 top scorers are frosh), but they are building a bright future.   If Amherst is going to break its loooong losing streak against the Ephs, this year may represent the best chance (and the first time in a long time that Amherst will be favored vs. the Ephs). 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on December 18, 2007, 06:16:23 PM
Just a few tidbits on the unstoppable force that is the Lady Jeffs:

- They've played one (1) team with a winning record in the first nine games
- The cumulative record of their opponents so far is 26-49 (Bowdoin's is 35-28 for reference)

I think we can figure out Gromacki's methodology to instantly become "competitive," even if it's among the Bright Lights in the cut-throat Liberty League. Amherst is better (they couldn't get much worse), but let's take a deep breath. A win over St. Norbert would go along way to convincing me they are a contender.

Quote from: newtonnancy on December 11, 2007, 03:52:53 PM
WOW  this is one quiet board when the Polar Bears are not doing well

It's these types of intellectual gems we've come to expect from the Big Brains in the UAA.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 18, 2007, 06:49:31 PM
Don't forget that before Gromacki turned around Hamilton in one year, and went to Temple, he took St. Lawrence to the D3 Championship game.  I was told much of this schedule was set before he took over, but will be fun to see how they do against St. Norbert and better teams.  All hearsay now, January will be fun to watch!!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on December 20, 2007, 10:53:03 PM
I don't really know much about Amherst (I'm a Bates fan), but I admit they have just about the weakest schedule possible for a NESCAC school (hey can you think of an easier way to put up enough wins to have a shot at an at large bid for the NCAAs?).  But I do know a little bit about Gromacki.  This guy has brought success everywhere he's gone.

I realize the Liberty League is very weak.  Hell, I grew up watching the Liberty League (it was called the UCAA back then), and when I went to Lewiston and started watching Bates the difference was night and day.  NESCAC is far superior.  However, I also know that Scranton is one hell of a good team, and playing them within 6 points at their place is no small task for anyone.  Liberty League asside, the formly terrible Continentals showed that they could hang with some of the best DIII has to offer.  To do that with a team in just 1 year deserves some respect.

Is Amherst the best team in the country?  No.  Are they going to play tough against every one of their very few actually good opponents, and stand a chance of winning the league?  Yes.  Gromacki has had too much success everywhere to take him lightly.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on December 21, 2007, 12:09:23 AM
Red: I have to agree with you on the Gromacki situation. As a Scranton alum, I was somewhat concerned last year when I saw he had been hired at Drew Univ. which is in our conference. The reason for my concern was because Drew has been a perennial last place team with top tier talent. He had already brought St.Lawrence to the Final Four, spent 2 years at Temple & had four starters returning at Drew that were very, very good...individually. When he left after about 4 weeks on the job during the summer for Hamilton... I thought we'd never hear from him again. Wrong! Who did Scranton face in a winners bracket game last season in the first round of the NCAA's...you guessed it...an unbelievably improved Hamilton team. Scranton won...their individual talent level was far superior to Hamilton, but, the adjustments he made at halftime & throughout the second half brought his kids back & they came within 4 points of knocking off the Lady Royals at home...which, until this year happened about as often as Leap Year. What he'll accomplish at Amherst or how long he'll even stay is up for debate...what I do know is the guy can get it done from a coaching perspective...and for that reason alone, some rather comfortable NESCAC teams may soon feel otherwise.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on December 21, 2007, 10:36:24 AM
The good news for Amherst: They have a coach with a great track record.

The bad news for Amherst: Judging by this same track record, his first batch of resumes went out last week.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 21, 2007, 08:54:46 PM
Think he's a Boston native so there are probably only a couple of jobs that better fit the geography.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on December 22, 2007, 05:03:44 AM
Hmm. So the move from SLU to Ham Tech to Drew (for a bit) to Amherst is part of a master plan to get closer to Boston? Wasn't there openings at Simmons, Regis, Wellesley and Pine Manor during that time?

I'm sure there's a pot o' gold at the end of some rainbow for this guy, but I don't think it's Boston and I don't think it's DIII.

Considering the frequency and lateral nature of the positions he's taken I would normally think there are some buried red flags with this guy, but I'll defer to Suzanne Coffee and her decision-making ability.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on December 22, 2007, 11:52:05 AM
Quote from: feces monkey on December 22, 2007, 05:03:44 AM
Hmm. So the move from SLU to Ham Tech to Drew (for a bit) to Amherst is part of a master plan to get closer to Boston? Wasn't there openings at Simmons, Regis, Wellesley and Pine Manor during that time?

I'm sure there's a pot o' gold at the end of some rainbow for this guy, but I don't think it's Boston and I don't think it's DIII.

Considering the frequency and lateral nature of the positions he's taken I would normally think there are some buried red flags with this guy, but I'll defer to Suzanne Coffee and her decision-making ability.

Gromacki is actually from the western mass so amherst is actually close to his hometown. I read the story on the Amherst website about his hiring. I don't know how much this will play a part in his "stay" at Amherst but time will tell. I agree with Feces, nobody can question his abilities as a coach but I think these abilities will someday bring him to a D1 job.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 22, 2007, 02:39:27 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on December 22, 2007, 05:03:44 AM
Hmm. So the move from SLU to Ham Tech to Drew (for a bit) to Amherst is part of a master plan to get closer to Boston? Wasn't there openings at Simmons, Regis, Wellesley and Pine Manor during that time?

Eastern or Western Mass doesn't make Simmons, Regis or Pine Manor attractive jobs. Kathy Hagerstrom hasn't left Wellesley, to the best of my knowledge.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on December 22, 2007, 10:24:49 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on December 22, 2007, 02:39:27 PM
Eastern or Western Mass doesn't make Simmons, Regis or Pine Manor attractive jobs.

Or the moon, for that matter. However, who would believe a small, all-women's Catholic college in the Fens like Emmanuel could be a national player in women's hoops? If Gromacki is chasing geography (which seems rather odd), there are numerous schools holding potential. Or maybe you just have to be a loveable lunatic like Yosinoff to pull it off.

And, yes, I know Emmanuel is co-ed now.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 06, 2008, 05:37:14 PM
"A win over St. Norbert would go along way to convincing me they are a contender."

With everyone on vacation, haven't heard much action on this topic.  Did see that Amherst beat St. Norbert in a close one, and Endicott (who only lost to Tufts by 4) in a buzzer beater. 

Looks like other top teams in 'CAC had good holiday games.  January and February could be really fun.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on January 09, 2008, 08:38:16 AM
Saturday is Amherst's best chance to get off the schneid against the Ephs.  Does anyone know the last time Amherst women won this "rivalry"?  I think it's something like ten or twelve straight for the Ephwomen.  For the first time in recent memory, however, Amherst is the more experienced and talented team overall ... plus the new coach seems to provide an additional edge. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: dman on January 09, 2008, 04:37:10 PM
last amh. victory over williams was jan. 13, 2001 in ot at williams.....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: daoustian on January 11, 2008, 01:30:02 PM
Last win at LeFrak was in 2000.  Lady Jeffs have lost their last 14 in a row to Williams and are 3-20 vs. Williams since 1996-97.  It'd be a great win tomorrow and I'd have to think they'd hit the Top 25 if they pulled it off.

Next question: when is the last time the Lady Jeffs were in the Top 25?  Now there's a doozy.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: daoustian on January 11, 2008, 01:51:13 PM
Sorry, that last one was a trick question.  Amherst W-hoops has never been ranked in the top 25 before according to my sources.  Been close several times though. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: daoustian on January 12, 2008, 03:52:34 PM
Amherst wins the early game 65-53. Good stuff.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on January 12, 2008, 06:17:30 PM
Well,

I'm not convinced about Amherst yet.  Williams is pretty good, but Amherst is yet to play a really good team.  (and by really good team I refer to Tufts).

Tufts is clearly the team to beat at this point.  Bates has been money since returning to full strength and went to Medford this afternoon hoping to make a statement about who the best team in Nescac is.  Instead it was Tufts making the statement handling Bates (and with only the score to go on I'd surmise relatively routinely).

It is clear that Tufts is the top team in Nescac and the team to beat.  On the plus side both Tufts and Amherst have to come to Lewiston for their conference games this year.

New predicted rankings (cause my first one was just wrong):

1.  Tufts
2.  Bates
3.  Amherst
4.  Bowdoin
5.  Williams
6.  Wesleyan
7.  Middlebury
8.  Trinity
9.  Conn
10. Colby
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: JeffRookie2 on January 12, 2008, 07:28:58 PM
Amherst won while probably their best player in Stef Reiff played only 1 minute. Not sure why she had limited time, but it makes Amherst's victory even more impressive.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on January 12, 2008, 09:02:08 PM
 Reiff had a brace on her leg which I don't remember seeing. I didn't see So. Vt. but I don't think she played? Now Amherst W seem to have two big problems. Reiff might be out or play limited minutes from now on and they have to play Bates, Tufts, Bowdoin and Ephs (conference game) away.

Of course Reiff could return and be able to play at full strength. Playing only one minute today is not a good sign.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 13, 2008, 08:13:09 PM
Reiff sprained her knee in Endicott game, but MRI showed nothing,  probably still sore.  Williams wasn't the conference game so coach must not have wanted to push it.  Great energy in that gym for both teams....both girls and boys game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 13, 2008, 10:26:25 PM
The prospect of this board being inundated with the bookies and copyright lawyers from the open-mouth breathing Amherst men's posting contingent is certainly unsettling, but it appears the Lady Jeffs are for real. At least by my standard (they did, indeed, defeat St. Norbert). The conference schedule is a grind, however, and a long way from the relatively easy schedule posted by Central Mass's finest.

The quirks of the scheduling draw mandates we'll be seperating the wheat from the chaff in the first weekend of conference action. Undefeated Amherst must travel to unblemished Tufts on Friday night in what, at this point, appears to be the game for hosting priviledges. I'll take the Jumbos in this one, by five. While the Amherst coach is new to the conference, hopefully he received some decent advice and is not having the team stay in Medford-Somerville or Lewiston-Auburn on Friday night. Amherst gals are used to woodsy surroundings and would struggle with the noxious fumes bubbling up from the Charles and Androscroggin, respectively. I'd suggest Portsmouth, or maybe the fresh air of God's Country on the Brunswick coast.

I also like Bates over Amherst on Saturday.

The Polar Bears are obviously a shadow of their former selves, and their opening road trip could produce an 0-2 start. The Williams and Middlebury trek is no fun for anyone craving civilized company, and especially so for a team lacking the cold-blooded leaders Bowdoin has had in the past. Perhaps out of nostalgia, I'll bank on Pemper's troops taking the back-end against the Panthers. Bowdoin's travel partner will probably score around 50 points for the weekend. Again, out of nostalgia, it should be noted that one of the most impressive parts of the Polar Bears run was their ability to dominate the conference while having a Maine Class D J.V. squad as a travel partner.

For all those interesting in attending the "rivalry" game between Wesleyan and Conn. College, may I suggest taking a hard right turn and try the sushi buffet at Mohegan Sun.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on January 14, 2008, 11:38:38 AM
Amherst is most likely the worst undefeated team out there. Williams starts two freshman and looked very young. I only saw the second half but I think Williams may even beat the Jeffs when they get them at home. I would be shocked if Amherst won either NESCAC game this weekend, especially b/c they are both away and Amherst will have no answer for Coffin/Kostakis and the inside game of the Jumbos.

1. Bates (if Coffin stays healthy)
2. Tufts
3. Bowdoin (will beat Amherst at home)
4. Amherst
5. Wesleyan
6. Williams
7. Midd
8-10. pick 'em
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: daoustian on January 15, 2008, 12:54:10 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on January 13, 2008, 10:26:25 PM
The prospect of this board being inundated with the bookies and copyright lawyers from the open-mouth breathing Amherst men's posting contingent is certainly unsettling,

Tell me about it!  Imagine if people started actually posting over here!  It's much better the way it is now, averaging one post every 2 days or so.  Nice and calm -- I can go on vacation and not lose an entire morning of work on the first day back checking what everyone has said in this forum.  Whew!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 15, 2008, 01:49:06 PM
Can't wait for the fun to begin.  I agree with your predictions if Amherst had the former coaching staff.  What we're forgetting here is the Gromacki factor.   An earlier post said that in one year he took a lot less talent at Hamilton to the Sweet 16.  The girls still have to go out and play hard, but he's made some brilliant moves from the bench.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: JeffRookie2 on January 18, 2008, 09:28:00 PM
Amherst knocks off Tufts in Medford by 2. Might make them the team to beat in the NESCAC right now. Bates should be a great game tomorrow.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on January 19, 2008, 02:23:49 AM
 Have to admit that I'm a little surprised since the game was a t Tufts. Now if they manage to beat Bates----
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: eclinchy on January 19, 2008, 03:15:14 AM
What a heartbreaker.

Swensen made a buzzer-beater in the final second to win the game.  I've never heard a more deflated Cousens Gym than I did tonight.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 19, 2008, 04:55:44 PM
Amherst just might be for real.  Close game at half, but Amherst comes out hot and opens a 12 point lead.  I think final score was 78-69.  Two good road wins.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on January 20, 2008, 01:04:07 PM
Sumfun: As was discussed back in Dec. on this board when people were just starting to notice the change in Amherst womens basketball...some wondered if perhaps the new coach may actually be making a difference. Trust me...he is. He has brought teams from relative obscurity to the National scene virtually overnight ( please refer to St.Lawrence & Hamilton) and with no time to even recruit, he has taken Amherst to a level never before attained. I would'nt necessarily go & book any flights to Hope just yet...that may be something to consider next year...but, for anyone to think this start is a fluke does so at their own peril. The Larry Brown of D-III can flat out coach & he is proof that great teachers of the game can bring average talent to unbelievable heights & mediocre coaches can do absolutely nothing with outstanding kids. As long as he remains there, Amherst will be the team to beat in the NESCAC...no question about that. The only question that may yet be determined is whether plans to move his office across town have already begun.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 20, 2008, 07:44:22 PM
"Larry Brown of DIII?" "Bring average talent to unbelievable heights?" "Anyone to think this start is a fluke does so at their own peril?"

While hyperbole may be the norm in the MAC ("My GPA is really good!"), simple facts will do here. You obviously have a creepy, unrequited love for Gromacki, and that's fine. Bill Clinton has taught us that age is no obstacle. Perhaps you can enlighten us as to an impending "move across town."

The Lady Jeffs have proven to be the class of the NESCAC. Hopefully they'll be able to put the conference on the national map. It will help with recruiting...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: kate on January 20, 2008, 10:22:32 PM
Feces Monkey, Saratoga is now with the Landmark Conference.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on January 20, 2008, 11:31:15 PM
FM: Relax... no love for Gromacki, unrequited or otherwise. An appreciation for what he's accomplished at so many different schools that, prior to his arrival have had virtually a non-existant womens basketball program...most definately. I just enjoy seeing well-coached teams play the game and make the adjustments necessary to pull some wins out against teams with much more talent. Generally speaking, he's done that. Trust me, I've seen enough D-III games on the east coast where coaches, if given the talent of UConn or Tennessee couldn't make adjustments to knock off the bottom-feeders. The "move across town" was not to infer the job at UMass was about to be offered...just that I believe he's headed for a D-I job probably sooner rather than later. Those, would be the simple facts.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on January 20, 2008, 11:57:23 PM
  They've had 3 games where they lost a big lead. Twice the other team pulled ahead. I think it was Endicott and Wesleyan. Obviously they came back but hopefully that won't happen again. 
  I know everyone says Bowdoin is down and from the results so far, it does seem to be the case. However, at Bowdoin is most likely a tough game. They might have to play Tufts in the NESCACS. It's far from over.
 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 21, 2008, 12:15:19 AM
Quote from: kate on January 20, 2008, 10:22:32 PM
Feces Monkey, Saratoga is now with the Landmark Conference.

Kate, my apologies for impugning the MAC. I'd like to say we'd meet up again, but I'm afraid the NESCAC doesn't have the juice this year. You'll have to deal with the Eagles -- Bald or Balder -- along the way. They're good people, as far as simple Southern folk go.

Saratoga, don't get your knickers in a bunch. I can understand the breathless appreciation of Gromacki. He defintely has out-done any expectations held by the most die-hard Amherst women's basketball fans (if there were any). I was a cynic, but now I'm a believer. I won't predict anything, but I guess I'll throw my money behind those wacky kids from Brunswick. The Polar Bears could be a great Cinderella story.

It's too bad the NESCAC still isn't eligible for the ECACs. I think we could definitely take it this year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: kate on January 21, 2008, 09:08:59 AM
Feces Monkey, we're still above that Mason-Dixon Line - :)!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on January 21, 2008, 09:04:00 PM
FM,
  this is old news but your polar bears got a commitment from one of maine's own for the fall, from morse, they need some size for next year don't they?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: goubears89 on January 22, 2008, 04:46:30 PM
Here's a story and pic on the Polar Bear recruit in question -- Jill Henrikson of Morse HS. http://sports.mainetoday.com/highschool/stry.html?id=5691506 (http://sports.mainetoday.com/highschool/stry.html?id=5691506).

And huskynan.com reports the following accolades:
2007 Maine Sunday Telegram All-State 1st team; 2007 Bangor Daily News All-State HM; 2007, 2006 All-Conference 1st team; 2006 Maine Sunday Telegram All-State HM; 2005 All-Conference 2nd team. AAU team New England Crusaders.

But really, what luck has Bowdoin had recruiting from Maine?  ;D
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on January 23, 2008, 10:14:43 AM
 3 of their starters are from maine.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: goubears89 on January 23, 2008, 06:29:22 PM
I was being sarcastic. They've had an amazing run of recruiting in-state talent.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on January 23, 2008, 11:37:49 PM
 i hear you.
but in recent years, their stars are not from maine, other than pouravelis.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on January 24, 2008, 10:31:50 PM
Quote from: pureshooter on January 23, 2008, 11:37:49 PM
i hear you.
but in recent years, their stars are not from maine, other than pouravelis.

I'm sure I'm overlooking someone, but with the exception of Flaherty, I think all of Bowdoin's "stars" have come from Maine. Can't remember where Schultz is from.

Recruits are nice, but one thing I've learned in this conference is until they're dribbling up and down the court in the opening tournament they aren't worth much. It'll be nice to have Shipbuilder on the squad, if she makes it.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on January 25, 2008, 11:39:10 AM
 schultz is from maine.
i was thinking more recent, loonin, flaherty, cummings and russell are out of state.
but maine produces many good ones, and you don't need to go d-1 to get a great experience.

i know two of maine's best are in the ivy league, one at stanford.
the trend with many kids now is to enroll in a good academic school , play ball, without the d-1 school owning you for twelve months ( see my post from 11/06/07, tufts transfer from william and mary).

  i don't know what style amherst plays, and they nipped tufts at the buzzer.
tufts is solid,well coached, with some skilled players.
the way to beat them is with speed and an uptempo pace for 40 minutes. their point guard is quick, can shoot the 3, but that's it. they run things thru the 2 big posts.
it will be interesting to see how they do against bowdoin and bates.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on January 25, 2008, 03:45:00 PM
Here's a story on another Bowdoin recruit by the name of Calli Coffee from Connecticut - She is an all-state player and apparently quite the 3-point shooter:

http://www.theday.com/re.aspx?re=6e52e0fa-7bcd-48a7-a28b-2f8e90679a91

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on January 25, 2008, 10:24:30 PM
GP Gromacki is the man
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on January 26, 2008, 10:07:03 AM
Quote from: feces monkey on January 21, 2008, 12:15:19 AM

Kate, my apologies for impugning the MAC. I'd like to say we'd meet up again, but I'm afraid the NESCAC doesn't have the juice this year. You'll have to deal with the Eagles -- Bald or Balder -- along the way. They're good people, as far as simple Southern folk go.

I won't predict anything, but I guess I'll throw my money behind those wacky kids from Brunswick. The Polar Bears could be a great Cinderella story.

Monkey, thanks for the hype   ;D
Looks like Bowdoin just may  "be a great Cinderella story"
   Trust all is well with you.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on January 26, 2008, 06:55:29 PM
Quote from: walzy31 on January 25, 2008, 10:24:30 PM
GP Gromacki is the man
So what happened in Williamstown Mr GP Man Gromacki?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac33 on January 26, 2008, 11:54:15 PM
Well, for the first time since the NESCAC tournament was instituted....there is no clear favorite as to who is going to win it, which basically means that the dominant Polar Bears, for the first time since 2000 are not the clear favorite, even though I do expect them to take the league for the 8th consecutive time....they have the returing First Team all NESCAC in Jill Anelauskes, as well as an imerging dominant post in Caitlyn Hynes (last week's NESCAC player of the week)...they had a little hiccup today against Wesleyan...however what was Pemper thinking by not playing Anelauskes the last 10 mins of the game, or Katie Bergeron...Bowdoin's rookie sharpshooter...not playing either...they clearly still had a shot to make a run, but who knows what that coach was thinkin...good win for the cardinals however...Fourney was a star out there as the cardinals, who are now 3-0 and in control of their own destiny for the top seed in the league...as for Bowdoin they are now 3-1 and might be a little shaken from their first NESCAC home loss in a long time, but I do expect Anelauskes and the bears to bounce back strong and make a run to win NESCACs
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 27, 2008, 10:03:43 PM
tothehole - Did anyone expect the barely tested Jeff's to go undefeated?  He's certainly proved himself as a coach, and teams do learn from losses.  The Nescac will be a tight race this year with most any team able to knock off any other.  Williams played a hard-nosed physical game.  They deserved their comeback and victory.  Pat Manning did a great job of using her players...a few with 4 fouls.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on January 28, 2008, 12:10:28 AM
Sumfun I agree.
Coaches coach but only players play.
And what Amherst saw was a team determined and well coached.
Amherst has players but so does the rest of the NESCAC from top to bottom.
I look forward to the next weeks to see some of the hardest fought games in the last 5 years.
Congrats to Pat, Erika, Shevie, and to the patient seniors Dom Nikki and Whit and the rest of the team.
If you want to hear whats in store for next years crop of recruits check out this link.
http://www.williams.edu/athletics/flash/?folder=Women'sBasketball
Happy Cheering ya'll
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on January 28, 2008, 04:16:40 PM
Quote from: nescac hoops on January 14, 2008, 11:38:38 AM
Amherst is most likely the worst undefeated team out there. Williams starts two freshman and looked very young. I only saw the second half but I think Williams may even beat the Jeffs when they get them at home.

With the exception of the point guard (Pollock?), Amherst has not impressed me. I was SHOCKED they beat both Bates and Tufts, but given that Bates has not proved to be quite as strong as many had thought (probably Meg Coffin included when she chose to come back) and that the Jeffs won against Tufts on a buzzer beater that GP "the man" Gromacki himself called "lucky" perhaps their "strong wins" (Tufts, Bates, and Williams in the little 3 game) are not all that impressive. Being realistic, I think that Williams has the opportunity to be a real "spoiler" for many teams this year but I still think they are a season away from being a real contender. I think Bowdoin and Tufts have the best shot at winning the conference -- they have the best mix of talent and superior coaching, though Bates has this too and I don't know why they aren't performing better.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: savahoops on January 28, 2008, 09:36:53 PM
bates isn't going to be as strong because their guards may be slow and not able to stop penetration...witness first year hart from tufts torching them for 17pts and 5 assists.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on January 29, 2008, 10:30:44 AM
Quote from: savahoops on January 28, 2008, 09:36:53 PM
bates isn't going to be as strong because their guards may be slow and not able to stop penetration...witness first year hart from tufts torching them for 17pts and 5 assists.

If I were Bates, I would worry about the 46 points they were able to put up against Tufts. You can stop all the dribble penetration in the world, but if you can only muster 15 points in the first half, you wont beat many teams....just the ones on Amherst's non-conference schedule ;)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 29, 2008, 12:27:11 PM
Just keep taking Amherst for granted.  I'm sure they won't mind, particularly the seniors Reiff and Roach, along with Pollack...or NESCAC rookie of the year Swensen, and by all means discount Leyman since she comes off the bench.  Let's give all these teams their due....good athletes, competitive games, and the conference is wide open as to who can win it or the tournament.  Whoever has the hot hand on any given day will find themselves on top.  Look at Trinity last weekend... two losses by a total of two points, they could be a great spoiler.

Buckle your seatbelts...we're in for SUMFUN
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: savahoops on January 29, 2008, 06:01:36 PM
Speed works both ways, if you got it, you can penetrate. And if you can pressure the ball on the defensive end because of your speed, the other team can't penetrate. Thus 46 points cuz you can't get anything going inside.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on January 30, 2008, 01:46:49 PM
Well Savahoops,

I do not really want to argue about this, especially b/c I haven't seen Bates play in quite some time but their point guard dished out 9 assists and Meg Coffin (their center) had 15 pts. in the Tufts game. Beckwith also got to the line 11 times. On the the other hand, Bates 1-13 from 3pt land. At least as far as this game is concerned, I don't think they had a hard time getting penetration and getting inside points. While I would say that Barton is not that quick and her defense leaves something to be desired, she does manage (often times with muscle) to get to the hoop and dish. And while I was not at this game obviously, I would still argue that the 15 pts. scored in the first half is more alarming than defending the penetration....not to mention the fact that Bates lost the rebounding match 51-34 which is perpahs the real telling statistic from that game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on January 30, 2008, 10:05:14 PM
  you need to push the ball against tufts. for the most part, they are slow. you can't get into the halfcourt game with them.
don't know if murphy plays an uptempo game or not. but you need to break off made baskets against tufts. their posts are big and physical, that's why they had the rebounding edge.
if i'm not mistaken, bates posts are more the running type.
tufts runs some basic pick and roll stuff. you need to switch  a lot, then they have you in mismatches.
have to beat them in transition, get open looks from that transition and of course, make those open un-guarded shots.
just looked,18.8% shooting in 1st half, 24.6% for game. that's major brick laying.
who are bates best shooters? barton usaully is, and i know goodridge is good from long range.
the first time they met it was closer, but bates shot 33%.
tufts can play good half court defense, tough man to man, usually gives opponent low shooting %'s.
again, you need to get unguarded looks against tufts in transition. this is not rocket science.

i think many coaches at this level don't stress shooting, don't know how to teach it and don't work on it enough. there are some ugly releases around the women's game, not only d-3.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: savahoops on February 02, 2008, 10:12:31 AM
Quote from: nescac hoops on January 30, 2008, 01:46:49 PM
Well Savahoops,

I do not really want to argue about this, especially b/c I haven't seen Bates play in quite some time but their point guard dished out 9 assists and Meg Coffin (their center) had 15 pts. in the Tufts game. Beckwith also got to the line 11 times. On the the other hand, Bates 1-13 from 3pt land. At least as far as this game is concerned, I don't think they had a hard time getting penetration and getting inside points. While I would say that Barton is not that quick and her defense leaves something to be desired, she does manage (often times with muscle) to get to the hoop and dish. And while I was not at this game obviously, I would still argue that the 15 pts. scored in the first half is more alarming than defending the penetration....not to mention the fact that Bates lost the rebounding match 51-34 which is perpahs the real telling statistic from that game.

Tough game against Wesleyan for Bates.  Guard play struggles again?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: wbbhoopsfan on February 03, 2008, 10:44:14 AM
The top of the conference seems to have gotten more muddled, but the plaoyffs teams appear to be set.  Gotta feel badly for Trinity, which has some tough losses in its 0-6 league record.  Surprising that Bates is at 2-3, with all the hype of returning Coffin and her supporting cast.  Seems like any team can beat anyone (with some obvious exceptions) which should make the final two weeks and tournament fun.  I'm sure they would disagree, but Bowdoin's "return to the pack" has been great for the conference.  Good luck down the stretch ladies!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on February 03, 2008, 04:52:36 PM
GP the man can you spell tailspin.
"Senior Meg Coffin (Westford, Mass.) tallied 13 points and 13 rebounds, leading Bates College to a 57-45 victory against Connecticut College in a NESCAC game played at Luce Fieldhouse Saturday afternoon."
Its all about Meg I'm sure her brother(the bmoc) and mom are so happy about the season. They(Bates) were a better team without her. Ya think she'll graduate this year? Poll yes or no?
Can anyone stop the Tufts half court offense?
Who has the crystal ball? Anyone?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: wbbhoopsfan on February 03, 2008, 08:11:59 PM
Why attack Meg Coffin?  She made a choice to take a year off to recover from an injury and end her college career on her terms... good for her!  Its not as if she quit school to turn pro or waitress tables at the Lewiston Diner.  I think anyone in her shoes, with the perspective of a 22 y.o, would do the same or at least strongly consider it.  That being said, Bates' season is probably not what some may have expected, but they can be disruptive and dangerous and Tues' game vs. Bowdoin could be interesting.

I think Tufts is the best team, or at least has the most weapons, so they are my pick to win the tourney.  Wesleyan is very physical and plays strong defense, and Bowdoin brings an expectation and history to the table.  I , unlike others, don't really believe in Amherst and their version of James Naismith, but they have some nice players.  They have been lucky in games this season, but it is always better to be lucky than good!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on February 03, 2008, 11:20:11 PM
Why pick on the waitress at the Lewiston Diner.  I have a problem with any d3 red shirt.  That's my opinion just an opinion.  Not picking on her or the infamous family ego just an opinionated observation. I think there have been too many egos in the NESCAC. This year there are fewer egos and I think the overall play of the conference is better. We'll see how they do in the NC2As.
PS the waitresses at the dinner are nice you be nice now!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 03, 2008, 11:21:47 PM
Quote from: wbbhoopsfan on February 03, 2008, 08:11:59 PMThey have been lucky in games this season, but it is always better to be lucky than good!

I haven't always been a believer, but from my perspective there appears to be little luck involved in the Lady Jeffs run. They're legit. They lost in Williamstown and Brunswick -- I'm not sure if there are many tougher places to play in the region. Amherst is pretty much a lock for the tourney and depending on how they finish up they could have several games in that circus tent known as LeFrak.

Bowdoin's win was nice, but a lot of red flags appeared during the win. Rotation, shot distribution, etc., are just some of the issues, but Pemper is smart enough (despite what the Lil' Woodens on this board surmise) to play for the win. The Polar Bears will have to grind out the rest of the season, including the Tufts game, which might be the game of the year in the conference.

Taking a step back, this could be an epic year for the conference in terms of tourney bids. Amherst and Tufts look like locks at this point and Wesleyan, Bowdoin and Williams are all legitimate tourney teams. Bates needs an AQ but is talented enough to pull it off if necessary. I predict at least four teams this year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 04, 2008, 09:32:22 AM
So answer some rookie questions????  Do both the NESCAC conference champs and NESCAC tourney winner get automatic bids?  After that I take it there are "at large" bids.  How large is the D3 bracket?  I agree with the monkey (and where did you get that name), the NESCAC could have 4 teams strong enough to make the tourney.  Some I've seen in person and some via webcast.  Such fun to watch!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: atn alum on February 04, 2008, 09:37:32 AM
Only automatic bid goes to the tournament winner.

NCAA Tournament FAQ

http://www.d3hoops.com/faq.php?category=NCAA%20Tournament
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: savahoops on February 04, 2008, 04:08:44 PM
Quote from: tothehole on February 03, 2008, 11:20:11 PM
Why pick on the waitress at the Lewiston Diner.  I have a problem with any d3 red shirt.  That's my opinion just an opinion.  Not picking on her or the infamous family ego just an opinionated observation. I think there have been too many egos in the NESCAC. This year there are fewer egos and I think the overall play of the conference is better. We'll see how they do in the NC2As.
PS the waitresses at the dinner are nice you be nice now!

How about if a student is sick, and has to miss a year, so is eligible for a 5th year, and loves to play, and is taking a masters program on campus. Should they play as a 5th year senior?  What is the difference and who cares?  Its about having a fun college experience with your friends and being part of something positive.   And none of it is really important.  Only the fun of playing ball.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on February 04, 2008, 08:52:21 PM
Savahoops
For any student to be gone for a year due to illness (presumably its serious) not being able to take any classes, I think any parent would think twice to allowing their child to participate at a varsity level the following year. Now if a student uses the system to get the "extra year" red shirt I think that they should realize its D3 and get on with their life and get over it. My opinion just mine, D3 is not D1 and the student athlete  is a student first .  How many NESCAC institutions have comprehensive PG programs.  Tufts is a fine university I'm sure they have fine PG programs in most fields. Most other Nescac schools don't have comprehensive PG programs to support their red shirts' Masters programs. So, somehow somewhere there are students and coaches working the system, but I'm sure with some work Meg could become a competent waitress. So as a board certified psychoanalyst I say get over it, grow up, become a citizen and get out of my office, p.s. pay the bill on the way out. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Gilby on February 05, 2008, 07:36:09 AM
I'm new to the board and a fan of the Jumbos from Tufts.  I want to comment on the Meg Coffin issue.  I think it is unfair to use the term "redshirt" when describing what she did.  Redshirting is a common practice in DI but is illegal in DIII.  It is when a first year student, who is usually healthy, practices but doesn't play any games in order to save a year of eligibility for later.  Coffin's case is completely different.  In my view, the decision to do what she did is a sign of the times.  Even at the DIII level, sports have become extremely important to these kids and their families, not necessarily at the expense of their commitment to academics.  What she did is more common than you might think.   As a parent, I don't think I would encourage my child to do it but don't begrudge Meg or her family the choice they made.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 05, 2008, 06:02:08 PM
Yep, it's called a medical hardship year in D-III.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on February 06, 2008, 10:54:32 AM
Anyone have any details about the Bates/Bowdoin game last night? My crew opted to travel to Lewiston to see the boys in a non-league game--a sign of how poor the girls look this year. Also, any word as to why Meg was out? Was she at the game on the bench at least?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on February 06, 2008, 12:55:39 PM
Bowdoins Event Summary

http://www.bowdoin.edu/hoplite/teamNavigation?method=result&id=12935

Congrats to Anelauskas  -  Player of the Week

http://www.bowdoin.edu/hoplite/teamNavigation?method=release&id=874
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: goubears89 on February 06, 2008, 03:46:10 PM
floorgeneral, I have to disagree with you on Pemper's game management. She relies on her players' abilities, yes, but to suggest she only cares about minutes played is absurd. And to trash her intelligence is to diminish someone who has immersed herself in the campus culture, is visible at myriad events, and supports her players' interests outside of basketball.

Why is there all this Pemper bashing on here? Is it because she's had a strong program for so long and the team is "just" having a good, solid year? Is there something more? I don't get it.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on February 07, 2008, 01:40:08 PM
Quote from: Balder Eagle on November 18, 2007, 12:25:55 PMNever underestimate Coach Pemper, she gets the most out of her girls as Coach Finney does at Marymount (CAC.)

Quote from: floorgeneral on February 06, 2008, 04:38:05 PM
Sorry, typo in last post ;D

I meant to say in the last sentence, " that has convinced many that smart coaching decisions are NOT being made by the person in charge."

Quote from: bbald eagle on February 07, 2008, 09:41:03 AM
three cheers and hearty congratulations to Marymount's coach Bill Finney for victory number 500 last night
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 08, 2008, 03:45:40 PM
The alternative was not showing up for the tournament. First available flight they could've gotten was Monday, after the tournament was over.
Title: Colby blog
Post by: wbbhoopsfan on February 08, 2008, 10:58:20 PM
Was surfing around for info on the weekend games and stumbled across this blog on the Colby site.  Nothing out of the ordinary, but thought I'd post it here anyway:  http://colbywomensbasketball.blogspot.com/

My prediction in Brunswick: Bowdoin 74, Colby 60

Huge win for Bates over Williams tonight; Trinity continues with close losses but falls to 0-7.  Ouch.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: JeffRookie2 on February 09, 2008, 11:20:10 AM

Congrats to Stef Reiff who reached the 1,000 point plateau last night for the Jeffs.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: goubears89 on February 09, 2008, 11:33:08 AM
floorgeneral, I'm not enough of a student of the game to go head-to-head with you on each of Pemper's coaching decisions and I no longer get to see them regularly enough to comment on your questions. My earlier post also was not as eloquent as I would have liked. However, what I was trying to say is that Stef in a short time has turned that program into one of the country's elite and transformed women's hoops status at the school. I began following that program in 1986 when you'd be lucky to see 10 fans at the games, which were played in decrepit Sargent Gym, not even Morrell. Her players are active parts of the campus, go on to be successful, well-rounded individuals, and she herself, like many of Bowdoin's coaches, are supportive of students in a variety of pursuits. THAT's what I want to see out of any extra-curricular activity. I am not a Stef Pemper apologist, although I love what she has done for the school and her student-athletes. I too have heard some stories about treatment of certain players or situations, but I've heard those stories about all kinds of coaches.

Would I like to have seen them win on '04? Absolutely. Do I wish they could have moved on from their seemingly yearly Elite 8 exit? Of course. Do I care about an internal decision on how to get to a game, given budget constraints, players' desire to play the tourney, and the uncertainties of a Maine winter? Well, not really. To identify specific mistakes in games is certainly your right, but you can't really on the one hand say "her coaching decisions and not knowing how to manage the talent of her team personnel is glaringly apparent" given the team's overall success during her tenure. 

All I know is that there are an awful lot of smart, talented women who have benefitted from the Bowdoin basketball experience and who in turn have given a great deal of excitement to hundreds if not thousands of fans.  Thirty years ago, the ticket in Brunswick was to go watch the men's hockey teams play championship-level hockey under Sid Watson. Now you've got two championship-level hockey teams, an elite women's hoops program, an ever-improving men's hoops program, and, that's just the winter sports. Morrell Gym has been by far the hottest ticket in town for the last 5-7 years. Oh, by the way, check out what our field hockey team has done in the last three years.

All this is to say I think Bowdoin does it right in balancing athletics within one of the most competitive conferences in d3. I think it's safe to say that more varsity programs than ever before are in the upper reaches of their sports while admission to the student body (one of the smaller ones in NESCAC, by the way) continues to be increasingly difficult.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: JeffRookie2 on February 09, 2008, 06:02:15 PM
Williams beats Tufts leaving Bowdoin in control of their own destiny. If Tufts were to beat Bowdoin next weekend, and there were 5 2-loss teams, who would host?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: goubears89 on February 09, 2008, 06:40:23 PM
JeffRookie2, here are the tie-breaker procedures from the NESCAC women's basketball handbook:

QuoteThe following tie-breaking procedure (listed in priority order) will be used to determine participants and seeding.
2-way tie:
1. Head-to-head result (if teams play each other more than once during the regular season, the game that appears on the
league schedule will be the game that is counted).
3-way or more tie:
1. Best record among tying teams, against one another (head-to-head).
2. Most conference wins (in games that are part of the conference schedule and count toward league standings).
3. Comparison of results of conference games played against top 4 teams (including all teams at the 4th spot).
4. Comparison of results of conference games played against top 8 teams (including all teams at the 8th spot).
5. Comparison of results of conference games played against conference teams in rank order. Comparisons shall be
made one team at a time starting with the highest ranked team.
6. If the tie remains after comparing results against the highest ranked team, the results against the next team in rank
order shall be used. This process is continued until a winner is determined.
7. Coin flip (or similar random action involving all tied teams).

So in your scenario,
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: JeffRookie2 on February 10, 2008, 10:01:39 PM
In my scenario, if Tufts beats Bowdoin and Williams beats Wesleyan (and no upsets) it would be:

1. Bowdoin (2-1 against top 4, beat Williams)
2. Williams (2-1 against top 4, lost to Bowdoin)
3. Amherst (1-2 against top 4, beat Tufts)
4. Tufts (1-2 against top 4 lost to Amherst)

OR if Tufts beats Bowdoin and Wesleyan beats Williams (and no upsets):

1. Amherst (2-1 against top 4, beat Tufts)
2. Tufts (2-1 against top 4, lost to Amherst)
3. Wesleyan (1-2 against top 4, beat Bowdoin)
4. Bowdoin (1-2 against top 4, lost to Wesleyan)

Did I do that right? Now, if Tufts losses to Bowdoin, I'm still not sure who gets the #2 spot, understanding that it depends on who wins the Wes/Williams matchup.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bobcat44 on February 11, 2008, 09:16:09 PM
Does anybody know what is wrong with the Bates Bobcats this year?  They had high expectations at the begining of the season and just have not produced.  They have two 1,000 point scorers in Coffin and Kostakis.  Val Beckwith will also be there by seasons end.  Then you add in Sarah Barton who has over 650 assists and over 800 points and you get 13-9 overall and 3-4 in the conference.
I was one picking bates to win nescac this year but after a loss to middlebury this weekend i'm just not sure.  I still believe that they can win the conference but they got to change something if they want to get that done.
Title: Bates
Post by: tothehole on February 11, 2008, 11:39:47 PM
Saw the Middlebury Game
Any team willing to push will always get a 5 on 4 with the Bates line up .
Some of them have trouble walking. I don't think they're at full strength.
Its been a long season. They will have zero chance to do any damage.
Any news on their recruits
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 12, 2008, 12:00:10 PM
Quote from: floorgeneral on February 08, 2008, 09:26:48 AM
There may be something more to it, but could you shed some light on why Pemper made the decision to drive the team all the way to Atlanta in Bowdoin College vans when their flight out of Portland was canceled the night before their Christmas tournament game? Do you think that was a smart coaching decision?

It's called handling adversity and honoring commitments.

Tell me, floorgeneral, how would you rate yourself in these areas?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: goubears89 on February 12, 2008, 05:39:04 PM
There's a wonderful piece from the Bowdoin alumni magazine a few years ago that gives some detail on the team and on Pemper's coaching philosophy. I do not think it mentions her thoughts on travel arrangements.  ;D

http://www.bowdoin.edu/bowdoinmagazine/archives/features/000056.shtml (http://www.bowdoin.edu/bowdoinmagazine/archives/features/000056.shtml)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: goubears89 on February 13, 2008, 12:04:36 PM
floorgeneral, even if what you say is correct, I would think that the athletic director and/or dean of students would have been involved. If you have a beef about this, have you brought it up with them?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on February 13, 2008, 01:19:56 PM
floorgeneral,

didn't you get the message that you can't criticize the polar bears program in any way or you'll catch the wrath of the alum?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: wbbhoopsfan on February 13, 2008, 07:24:03 PM
Regardless, why air this dirty laundry re: Pemper?  Sounds like she was in a tough decision and was forced to make a quick decision in order to get the team to their games.  Coupled with the safety of the players, this is a high priority during the season.

I am not a Pemper aplogist, in fact, I don't really like her very much, but this is petty. 

Floorgeneral - interesting that your associated email is "kaub@roadrunner.com" - any relation to Alexa?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 15, 2008, 12:10:59 AM
Quote from: floorgeneral on February 13, 2008, 04:11:05 PM

From what I understand, AD was notified by some furious parents about the drive to Atlanta.

Any chance you're one of them? Perhaps you should confine your ax-grinding to proper channels and not to this message board.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 15, 2008, 11:54:26 AM
It appears floorgeneral has left the building.

This operetta should do wonders for the Bowdoin morale as the season winds down.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: papabear on February 15, 2008, 01:07:04 PM
That is irrelevant that someone else feels they need to speak through these boards to defend or oppose a decision by the coach.
The bigger question is why is everyone so upset about this, if it were Colby or Conn nobody would care. Pemper is the best coach the confrence has had, granted I disagree with many of her decisions including the one to dismiss the best returner to the team this year but give her some credit. The talent has been there but she is a big reason for the success.

Bowdoin is going to lose to Tufts by 8 tonight so everyone who thinks they are going to repeat as NESCAC Champs is off there rocker. I will make the trip down to the game but this team just has no drive, besides the upbeat and intense Kaubris and Nocus the team is lackadaisical and really not that talented. Analauskaus will have a tough night tonight if she plays as she hurt her head in a  game last weekend and has not been practicing this week, the size of Tufts will do them in. Bowdoin almost lost to Colby last week.Should be a strong Bowdoin 04-07 crowd there tonight, what great memories.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 15, 2008, 04:06:17 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on February 15, 2008, 11:54:26 AM
It appears floorgeneral has left the building.

I sure wish people would actually READ the Terms of Service beforehand.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: lefrakenstein on February 15, 2008, 08:19:38 PM
tufts has a handy lead over Bowdoin at the half. looks like everyone will be locked in with 2 losses after tonight
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Gilby on February 15, 2008, 08:39:42 PM
Tufts 83  Bowdoin 56 - Quite a performance by the Jumbos.  Everything seemed to clicking.  Bowdoin couldn't stop Jumbos inside players.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: atn alum on February 15, 2008, 09:59:27 PM
Quote from: lefrakenstein on February 15, 2008, 08:19:38 PM
tufts has a handy lead over Bowdoin at the half. looks like everyone will be locked in with 2 losses after tonight

Well, not everyone...Wesleyan lost to Middlebury. Williams lost to Conn...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 16, 2008, 07:32:18 AM
As I said earlier that there are very even teams in this league and almost any team can beat any other team in any given game.  Mental game prep and game plan by the coach seem to be huge as the talent is very even.  "Sumfun" that it all comes down to the last day of league play to decide the seeds.  Can't wait to see the results.  Good luck to all.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 16, 2008, 04:45:23 PM
Who would have have predicted this day:

Bates over Bowdoin
Wesleyan over Williams
Amherst over Trinity
Tufts over Colby.

Seems to me that Amherst and Tufts have the same record, but Amherst beat Tufts head to head so they will be the #1 seed.  Let me know if anyone sees it any differently.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on February 16, 2008, 05:13:42 PM
Quote from: sumfun on February 16, 2008, 04:45:23 PM
Who would have have predicted this day:

Bates over Bowdoin
Wesleyan over Williams
Amherst over Trinity
Tufts over Colby.

Seems to me that Amherst and Tufts have the same record, but Amherst beat Tufts head to head so they will be the #1 seed.  Let me know if anyone sees it any differently.


Um, I actually would have predicted all of those perhaps with the exception of the bates/bowdoin game, but given the reports of the bowdoin "having nor drive" etc. that result doesn't shock me too much either. bates has too much talent and I think they can beat anyone on a given day despite their inconsistency. Even though wesleyan lost to williams the first time, this game was at wesleyan where the officiating literally puts you in a 10-15 pt. hole from the get go. I think Williams is 1-10 at Wesleyan. The last two game aren't shockers at all.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: yellstoomuch on February 16, 2008, 05:56:01 PM
Re: Nescac hoops: Even though wesleyan lost to williams the first time, this game was at wesleyan where the officiating literally puts you in a 10-15 pt. hole from the get go. I think Williams is 1-10 at Wesleyan. The last two game aren't shockers at all.

Gee, this game was 26-20 Wesleyan at the half, and the Wesleyan defense held Williams to 2  (yes two)  points on field goals after 13 minutes in the second half, (I'm sure that is all the refs doing) and Alli Forney scored 23 points. We will see if Williams can make it out of the first round in NESCAC playoffs.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on February 17, 2008, 12:47:40 AM
Here's the line-up for the play-offs:

2008 NESCAC WOMEN'S BASKETBALL CHAMPIONSHIP
Quarterfinals - Saturday, February 23 at Higher Seeds
No. 8 Colby at No. 1 Amherst - 2:00 p.m.
No. 5 Bates at No. 4 Bowdoin - 2:00 p.m.
No. 7 Middlebury at No. 2 Tufts - 3:00 p.m.
No. 6 Williams at No. 3 Wesleyan - 3:00 p.m.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: papabear on February 17, 2008, 12:20:33 PM
Bowdoin having no drive is an understatement that team is bad in many aspects of the game. They have the weakest posts in the league and looked lost in both games. Anelauskaus has lost weight and is now frail and Rubega is out with a torn acl. I find it telling that in the biggest two games of the season against GOOD teams they lose by a combined fourty points. For the first time EVER there season will end in the first round of the NESCAC'S.


Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: lefrakenstein on February 17, 2008, 04:07:00 PM
I'm predicting Amherst-Williams, Bowdoin-Tufts second round match-ups. It's always tough to beat a team twice in a row. If you look at conferences that play a double round-robin you often the see the results of the first meeting reversed. I also think Bowdoin and Williams are the better teams, although I am biased because both beat amherst earlier in the year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: goubears89 on February 21, 2008, 09:18:45 AM
For those of you who've seen lots of the games this year, any predictions for NESCAC tourney play this weekend? As a board-described Bowdoin apologist, I shall refrain.
*backs away slowly*
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bobcat44 on February 22, 2008, 07:06:39 PM
The only upset I see this weekend is the bobcats over bowdoin.  The senoirs at bates never won at bowdoin and i think they will come out focused and win it.

GO BOBCATS!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: wbbhoopsfan on February 22, 2008, 08:24:09 PM
I would agree re: Bates/Bowdoin.  Either way, though, I think it'll be a great game.  I think Tufts is the team to beat in the tournament, and their rematch opportunity with Amherst, while a couple of wins away, could be a great game. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 23, 2008, 08:39:16 AM
I'm not in the region this weekend so my laptop will be busy from 2 to 5ish watching and listening to "sumfun" games.  I think it's hard for anyone to win at Bowdoin, but Bates could pull it off.  Best of luck to all!!! 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on February 23, 2008, 03:34:11 PM
Nice win for Bowdoin over Bates  Final  55 - 51, anyone know why Jill Anelauskas is having limited playing time?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: wbbhoopsfan on February 23, 2008, 03:39:08 PM
As told to me by a third party, she banged her head on the floor in the closing minutes of the game v. Colby and has been limited since.  I don't know if there was another injury today, but to me, if it is a head injury, you either play or you don't.  I hope she didn't have another setback and can be ready for next weekend - they'll need her and it is real credit to the P'Bears to pull out today's win without Jill and Rubrega.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: daoustian on February 23, 2008, 03:43:00 PM
Amherst beat up on Colby again, setting up a likely rematch with Bowdoin (assuming that all seeds hold).  Regardless, someone is coming to LeFrak next weekend for a home game.  If it is Bowdoin, that will be an interesting matchup since Bowdoin has so much more postseason experience than this Amherst team, despite Amherst's strong record this year.  I imagine it'd be a different matchup than the first with a full week to prepare -- last time the game was played in Brunswick as the second half of a Maine road trip.  Should be a fun one.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 24, 2008, 07:57:02 PM
Perhaps I fell under the pessimistic spell of Papabear and his senility, but I was mildly surprised to see Bowdoin pull it out on Saturday, especially since they were trailing at halftime. I think the larger story in that game was Bates and the fact that everyone's favorite -- especially NescacHoops -- fifth-year senior didn't give the Bobcats the title this year. In fact, they seemed worse with her. There was something seriously flawed about this year's Bates teams. I love Murphy, but something was amiss.

The NESCAC tourney road trip will be the first for the Polar Bears since '01 when they also went to Amherst. Bowdoin was the third seed then, beating #2 Colby before upsetting #1 Amherst for the first of every title. Now they get the Lady Jeffs right off the bat. If the Polar Bears do pull it off, it won't be pretty. They'll have to scratch and claw this one out, and I would guess they're 10-point underdogs.

Tufts and Amherst are in the tourney no matter what. I think if either Bowdoin or Wesleyan can pull one out of the bag (I think Wes has a better shot), the conference will get a third bid. If the Polar Bears and Cards advance there will be, obviously, four in.

Balder, thanks for checking in. Are the Eagles a FF lock again?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on February 24, 2008, 08:54:57 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on February 24, 2008, 07:57:02 PM
Balder, thanks for checking in. Are the Eagles a FF lock again?

Monkey Man  ;D  Good to hear from you.

The Eagles have what it takes to make the Final Four and go even further.  However, as we all know, anything can happen during Tournament Time, no one is a "lock"  :o

I was at the game against Colby when Jill Anelauskas took a hard fall to the floor, her game time has been down since then. I hope she is doing well. Bowdoin will need her strength if they are to advance.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on February 24, 2008, 09:09:13 PM
 As far as talent is concerned I don't think Amherst is blessed with a lot of it. Pollack is an extremely heady pg and Reiff is an offensive talent who needs special attention. However, the rest of the team contributes by hustling their ***** off almost all of the time.
This year a big difference is that I haven't seen too many plays/happenings where I found myself asking 'WHY did she do THAT!?' They play hard and smart and for the most part don't let down on defense. It's a lot of fun to watch players achieve because they never stop scratching.
   
   What has happened to Bates? I suppose a lot of people have theories and so why not give mine??
   Though the years I've watched Bates women, including a couple times at the Springfield tournament. The one thing that always struck me in the games that I SAW, was that Coach Murphy was always so relatively calm. He would talk and instruct and to me it didn't look any different than if he was casually talking to the girls in a normal everyday setting.
   Last year was different. There was something going on between Barton and the coach. Also, he was fussing and fuming and appeared to be genuinely angry/upset. This continued for pretty much the whole game, which Amherst won. I wondered why. Then it hit me. Fern Masse was no longer around.
   When coach Masse was there, I would always see him gently conversing with a girl or two before and after the huddle. It is possible that players were able to express themselves and perhaps let off a little steam to a very sympathetic 'Gramps' Flaherty was a really good player who played with a fiery intensity that I've seen from maybe one or two others.
   If you keep steam under pressure and don't let some of it out-well you know what happens. I think a lot of W teams could use a Grand Ma/Pa.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bbald eagle on February 25, 2008, 09:14:58 AM
Quote from: Balder Eagle on February 24, 2008, 08:54:57 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on February 24, 2008, 07:57:02 PM
Balder, thanks for checking in. Are the Eagles a FF lock again?

Monkey Man  ;D  Good to hear from you.

The Eagles have what it takes to make the Final Four and go even further.  However, as we all know, anything can happen during Tournament Time, no one is a "lock"  :o

I was at the game against Colby when Jill Anelauskas took a hard fall to the floor, her game time has been down since then. I hope she is doing well. Bowdoin will need her strength if they are to advance.

Mary Wash Eagles are again very good but surely no "lock" for the Final Four. Even last year they could have gone out at Sweet Sixteen in the Scranton game or at Elite Eight against Bowdoin, two excellent teams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Billy Hoyle on February 29, 2008, 01:29:42 AM
Senator Frost,

How can you say Amherst has no talent.  I don't care what sport you are playing, you can't win the regular season conference without talent.

First of all, Samantha Swenson is somewhere in the top 3 talented players in the league.  The entire Senior class screams with talent almost as much as the fresh four!  The NESCAC better watch out the next few years because the Lord Jeffs are loaded with talented players.  Swenson, Leyman, Dunleavy, Daigneault, and Long are ready for a few more NESCAC championships.

Don't tell me I didn't warn you
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 29, 2008, 07:17:21 AM
Billy,

I couldn't agree more, not to mention the Gromacki factor.  I think you'll see him put together a tougher out of conference schedule next year.  He pretty much inherited the schedule this year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: savahoops on March 01, 2008, 11:41:13 AM
Quote from: senatorfrost on February 24, 2008, 09:09:13 PM
As far as talent is concerned I don't think Amherst is blessed with a lot of it. Pollack is an extremely heady pg and Reiff is an offensive talent who needs special attention. However, the rest of the team contributes by hustling their ***** off almost all of the time.
This year a big difference is that I haven't seen too many plays/happenings where I found myself asking 'WHY did she do THAT!?' They play hard and smart and for the most part don't let down on defense. It's a lot of fun to watch players achieve because they never stop scratching.
   
   What has happened to Bates? I suppose a lot of people have theories and so why not give mine??
   Though the years I've watched Bates women, including a couple times at the Springfield tournament. The one thing that always struck me in the games that I SAW, was that Coach Murphy was always so relatively calm. He would talk and instruct and to me it didn't look any different than if he was casually talking to the girls in a normal everyday setting.
   Last year was different. There was something going on between Barton and the coach. Also, he was fussing and fuming and appeared to be genuinely angry/upset. This continued for pretty much the whole game, which Amherst won. I wondered why. Then it hit me. Fern Masse was no longer around.
   When coach Masse was there, I would always see him gently conversing with a girl or two before and after the huddle. It is possible that players were able to express themselves and perhaps let off a little steam to a very sympathetic 'Gramps' Flaherty was a really good player who played with a fiery intensity that I've seen from maybe one or two others.
   If you keep steam under pressure and don't let some of it out-well you know what happens. I think a lot of W teams could use a Grand Ma/Pa.
you are right, women are weak in this regard, too much going on in their head.  they  would rather talk to someone else about their issues than going right to the source.  just the way most of them are built.  Nurture and praise.  don't call them out on anything in front of peers.....unfortunately, sometimes coaches don't hold players accountable because they wont' confront bad sports habits in front of the team.  its a delicate balance.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: daoustian on March 01, 2008, 03:05:38 PM
Very impressive win for Amherst today over Bowdoin -- 71-47.  Even as an Amherst fan, I did not expect a score anything like this.  Nice job Lady Jeffs. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on March 01, 2008, 06:48:19 PM
 Bowdoin is just not that good.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 01, 2008, 10:56:24 PM
 Read what I wrote. I did not say Amherst had no talent. I said they didn't have a lot. What they do have is neverending drive at both ends of the court. Swensen has been a non issue lately. She got taken out after 11 minutes v Bowdoin and then missed a couple of games. She played 5 min. v Colby and 8 min. v Bowdoin. I am assuming she has some sort of injury.
  Perhaps I underestimated Roesch. The seniors can all get their own shot at least some of the time-the others just go all out. Harik is improving on offense and has always played good defense. Leyman is just one of those players who you look at and wonder why everyone can't be like her and so on.
   Improvement- that's what I see when I look at Amherst. So much improvement over last year and even the beginning of this season. I think there are a number of teams that have at least close to the same level of talent but the idea is to develop it and to hustle ALL the time.
   I could name a player who had a pretty poor year this year yet when she went up against Amherst and their glittering record, she became inspired. For that one game she looked like an all star but then seemed to go back into hiding. So does that mean she has no talent??
  Speaking of talent-Tufts looks really good. Three pretty big girls who can all move (for NESCAC) and a really top notch little pg who showed she can shoot on the run and do just about anything. The rest of the cast is like Amherst, in that they seem to hustle pretty much all the time.
   By the way has there ever been a woman who came back to the huddle and said, "Give me the ball I can take this turkey with no sweat?"
 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: mamadukes on March 01, 2008, 11:01:46 PM
In answer to your question senatorfrost.
YES!

I can't even believe I would dignify such a stupid remark!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 01, 2008, 11:17:41 PM
 Mr. Dignity-if you're responding to my second question, I doubt the answer is yes. Of course you are entitled to an opinion.
Another question I have is will the winner of Amherst/Tufts host since Southern Maine lost?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: heart4rose on March 01, 2008, 11:26:57 PM
Trinity beats Midd.
Hasiuk hit some huge shots down the stretch.
Go Bants - Sunday at 2:30!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 02, 2008, 11:14:39 AM
Good luck to Tufts and Amherst in the NCAAs. Hopefully they'll be on other sides of the bracket so they'll have the opportunity to make a run.

This site is projecting Bowdoin makes the field, but I hope not. This season needs to be euthanized.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 02, 2008, 11:37:17 AM
I hear ya, but they have the numbers. They're definitely on the bubble (we picked them 18th of 21) but they had the numbers.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 02, 2008, 12:23:05 PM
Bowdoin has definitely played the toughest schedule out of anyone in the conference but I think I'd rather see them ride off into the sunset with one 20+ point waxing instead of two, which will likely happen if they get shipped off to USM, Salem State or some other home seed. I think Wesleyan would put up a better fight at this point.

If only for a year, it appears Bowdoin is a men's basketball school ('cause it ain't women's hoops and it sure as heck isn't a hockey school anymore....)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 02, 2008, 12:25:46 PM
Guess they could always decline the invitation. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on March 02, 2008, 04:22:17 PM
Amherst and Tufts deserve to be in but Bowdoin???  I'm sure there are tons of better record teams; oh I forgot they get in because of their history.  Right, I remember at some point they got a final ranking of 4th not even making the final four. FUBAR Mr Coleman.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: eclinchy on March 02, 2008, 06:24:26 PM
Their history, and their strength of schedule...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: goubears89 on March 02, 2008, 07:04:05 PM
Well, if the Polar Bears do get in, it will certainly mark the first time ever that an NCAA selection committee has put a team in a tourney based in no small part on their history. Yep, this would be a first.

Congrats to the Lord Jeffs on the title. Let's hope for great NESCAC representation in the tourney.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 02, 2008, 11:46:51 PM
Actually, we projected the Bears based on their criteria, not their history.

Bowdoin's numbers (.727 regional win, .647 OWP, .547) and the fact they had a win against a regionally ranked opponent -- which most remaining teams did not -- separated them from the pack.

For what it's worth, Bowdoin was the 19th team we projected for a Pool C bid out of 21.  That doesn't make them last obviously, but they were certainly close to missing out.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: goubears89 on March 03, 2008, 08:05:32 AM
Gordon, it sounds like the rationale and the "placement" of the Pool C's is correct for the Polar Bears. Now I face the alumni director's dilemma -- my alma mater and my employer are both in -- likely on both the men's and women's sides. Let's hope Rochester and Bowdoin don't align to play each other again this year!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 03, 2008, 08:51:11 AM
Gordon, the big brain who theorizes about Bowdoin's history has been beating that drum for about three years now. We tend to ignore him in this room, but his slow-processing NEWMAC intellect provides a little diversity, which is in line with the overall inclusivity of the NESCAC philosophy.

If you want a preview of what will happen in the next 24 hours, especially if the NESCAC gets four in on the men's side like Pat is postulating, is the Hillary-esque whining about the unfairness of the NESCAC's single round-robin format. This differs from tothehole's half-baked theories in that it has been going on for a decade, but it is nice to hear from our cornfed friends in the Upper Midwest.

As for the Bowdoin women, I hope by some miracle they can get sent out of region because the Northeast is too rich for their blood right now. My instincts tell me they have a trip to Willimantic, Conn., this weekend.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: papabear on March 03, 2008, 09:57:32 AM
Do not worry about a possible Rochester/ Bowdoin match up. I think it is a act of God that they got into the NCAA'S. That is a disgrace, they are not going to be competetive at all. As a Bowdoin fan I am happy for the team but geese talk about getting in based on the good old days.
They will be one and done, and next year they should be a top contender in the NESCAC's as they lose nobody this off season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bbald eagle on March 03, 2008, 10:02:39 AM
Maybe the person who relies on Bowdoin's history is somebody who thinks Bowdoin gets mulligans?  ;) Oops, can't say that, wouldn't happen. But give Bowdoin credit for what its done in a season when it obviously wasn't at its peak. Bowdoin's turn at the dance may be short this year but it will be back I bet. Good coach and a strong program (history?); hard to keep that down.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 03, 2008, 10:32:25 AM
Great bracket for Tufts. I think they can go quite a ways in their inaugural visit to the tourney. They should be good until they get to Mary Washington. There's no winning that one either way. As we all know by now if the Eagles lose, it's because of the officiating, not talent...

Hopefully Bowdoin can tire out Bridgewater State for Amherst so the Lady Jeffs can get into the next tier. Not sure how'll they do at that point.

I have disdain for both programs, but I hope USM beats Brandeis by 50.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bbald eagle on March 03, 2008, 10:53:36 AM
Quote from: feces monkey on March 03, 2008, 10:32:25 AM
They should be good until they get to Mary Washington. There's no winning that one either way. As we all know by now if the Eagles lose, it's because of the officiating, not talent...

Cute, Monkey.  ;D +1. The officiating wasn't the problem in UMW's FF loss to DePauw last year or its loss to St. Mary's this year.   ;)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on March 03, 2008, 04:42:25 PM
Quote from: bbald eagle on March 03, 2008, 10:53:36 AM
Quote from: feces monkey on March 03, 2008, 10:32:25 AM
They should be good until they get to Mary Washington. There's no winning that one either way. As we all know by now if the Eagles lose, it's because of the officiating, not talent...

Cute, Monkey.  ;D +1. The officiating wasn't the problem in UMW's FF loss to DePauw last year or its loss to St. Mary's this year.   ;)
Quote from: Balder Eagle on February 24, 2008, 08:54:57 PM
I was at the game against Colby when Jill Anelauskas took a hard fall to the floor, her game time has been down since then. I hope she is doing well. Bowdoin will need her strength if they are to advance.

Friday looms!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 03, 2008, 09:40:13 PM
The Polar Bears road got tougher as now they have to play Bridgewater State at BSC instead of Amherst. I suppose this would give them a better chance (but still not much) if they got past the hosts. Don't know much about BSC, but they beat Salem State, which typically means you're pretty good. A trip to Bridgewater, Mass., is never fun.

Good luck to MWC all the way through. I'm sure they will represent the...um...ODAC (?) well.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on March 03, 2008, 10:44:12 PM
Monkey, after all these years I know your a tease   ;D
Repeat........ 
UMW Eagles -- CAC

O Ya, on my 4 wieght the salmon I took out of The East Outlet  -- Moosehead, last Sept.  :-*

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fa259.ac-images.myspacecdn.com%2Fimages01%2F21%2Fl_1bad6d225878d506efb7b6aaff143faa.jpg&hash=9e9d61da5b09479a4785a72c5e456d20745db157)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 04, 2008, 07:51:03 AM
I agree that Tufts got a good draw.  I know that NCAA doesn't rank and bracket according to D3 Hoops but Howard Payne could meet Hope in the Elite 8, and 4 of the top 10 are in the bottom right bracket with Amherst.  Thomas Moore and those coming in from the left side have a seeminly easier road, but as they say anything can happen any day and you have to play the game.  Can't wait for sumfun to start.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: dailes21 on March 04, 2008, 08:18:56 AM
what is  everyones opinion on the Tufts/ Wheaton game?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on March 04, 2008, 11:51:50 AM
 let's face it. tufts is where they are because of a d-1 transfer that didn't want to be "owned" by the school anymore. the frosh point guard is good, but it's basically the same team as last year with a five that gives them twin towers. i did not see any of the two amherst wins over them, but i assume they can bang with tufts in a half court set.
but other than a couple of players,  they are not very fast.  a good transition team can give them a game. not sure if amherst did that.
i would think wheaton will have to do that, and shoot well.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 04, 2008, 01:30:01 PM
The D1 transfer from Tufts is fine for D3, but a 5'11" freshman held her in check and beat her down the court every time.  She can't play long periods at a time.  Ummah had her usual great game, but was the majority of all of Tuft's points.  They're going to need a more balanced scoring attack to get more than a round or two in NCAA.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on March 04, 2008, 01:58:06 PM
sumfun, you proved my point.
but you have to be aware of her. she can pass well out of the double team and has a very good shot from the foul line in. i see the point guard did not shoot it well against amherst.
gomez is fundamentally solid, underrated. does things that don't get in the box score.
need to run them.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 04, 2008, 04:30:16 PM
You're right about passing well out of the double team as she can reach above everyone and make a strong outlet pass after a rebound or a pass.  Gomez is strong, and the first year point guard is going to only get better.  Amherst worked hard on doubling down on Ummah or #52.  It was a really good game, and actually pretty well officiated.  I wish only the best for both teams to represent the NESCAC well.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 04, 2008, 08:30:18 PM
  Glad to see others had the same reaction to the brackets as I did. It seems as if Tufts was better off losing to Amherst. Years ago in the late 90's and early 2000's I knew two extremely avid D1 women's basketball fans. For one of them it was life's work more or less. Anyway they were always complaining that 'les gals' put as many of the top teams coached by men in the same bracket as they could, so they could eliminate each other.
  I saw the chart they had 2x's and it sure looked like that was what happened. Several people made a semi issue of it and by 2002 or 2003 there were no more complaints.
   This year in D3 I don't know who has men coaching and who doesn't. I don't know who is on the placing committee or who holds the power. My unofficial guess is that hanky panky is rearing it homely head.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 04, 2008, 09:40:46 PM
Senator,

You may have stumbled upon something here. I happen to read about some griping that the two undefeated teams left in the NCAAs were put in the same bracket. Most chalked it up to the rigidness of the regions, but both are coached by men. And there is no question Tufts got the better draw than Amherst. This thing might have legs. It's time to get ATNwriter on the case.

And for the record, I believe Oswald killed Kennedy and the planes brought down the towers.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 04, 2008, 11:07:15 PM
Interesting theory.  Also hard to believe that the WBCA/ESPN Poll put Lake Forest at #25 and they were left out of the tournament.  I know D3 is much more rigid in the region thing so that can make a difference, but still seems a shame.  I still think Amherst will take the win over Tufts and take their chances in the draw.  So hard to say who will beat whom from different regions as as there is so few overlapping opponents.  The OOP and OOOP can only do so much.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 05, 2008, 12:08:30 AM
Lake Forest shouldn't have been in the Top 25 -- I think we more fairly rendered them. They had an opponents' winning percentage of below .500 and did not face one regionally ranked team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 05, 2008, 12:31:17 AM
 For the most part I think the D3 hoops poll is pretty good year in year out. No, I'm not trying to curry Pat's favor. Anyway the Tufts side has 3 of the top ten teams. The Amherst side has 7.
  This carries all the way through. The Amherst side has 10 of the first 16. The average placing of the Tufts side for all ranking in the top 25 is 14.8
For the Amherst side the average of those in the top 25 is 11.30. If I were guessing I would say that the power comes from the lower half. Two very tough conferences in that lower half are UAA and WIAC. Those teams are probably a little better than their ranking. The three of them are in there with only one top ten team to contend with. Kean is number 11 but how long has it been since they had a team in the final 4?
  Overall I think the WIAC and the UAA are likely the two toughest conferences in the country. If there is something rotten I don't believe it's a man thing. I think it's a ranking thing, trying to make sure you have the most weaksters on your plate as is possible. I say weaksters but you still have to beat some decent teams no matter how much you rig things. However, it's still easier when you rig.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on March 05, 2008, 12:07:32 PM
The Tufts Wheaton  match up will hinge on 3 positions. Will Wheaton front the bigs with their center forward combination and can their point cover the Tufts youngster.  In the Williams game the combination of de la Torre , Jackson, and Savageau shut them down. The D 1 girl spent more time on the floor and was very soft Ummah led Tufts with 13 points and 14 rebounds alot of that in the last mins when they were down big. Dominique de la Torre had 9 pts  11 boards battling both bigs getting them in foul trouble.  Taylor Shea a freshman sent Ummah to the bench after Shea got a rebound and Ummah crashed into her. The bigs didn't look agile that day. So if Wheaton pushes the ball they'll run the D1 girl off the court and run away with the game.
Amherst's approach against Tufts was more conventional and looked like they said we'll let the bigs score if they, can but no one else.
Tufts will have  tuff time(sorry) in the tourney but not against Wheaton. Against Albright Mount Saint Mary winner their run ends.
Amherst on the other hand has picked up their team defense as seen in the NESCAC run and will be a handful for Bridgewater State, sorry Bowdoin you'll wish you did decline the invite. Against Bridgewater State I think they'll loose close. Home court being the advantage. I hope I'm wrong but thats how I see it. Just an opinion
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: daoustian on March 05, 2008, 03:14:05 PM
All Conference teams were just announced:

http://www.nescac.com/sports/wbkb/2007-08/honors/allconference
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on March 08, 2008, 01:23:54 AM
 tufts got a scare tonight. wheaton had them on the ropes, but tufts hit some free throws at the end to close it out.
they will need to play better than that to go deeper, probably advance to next weekend. they should of dominated this game, but didn't. something missing with this team
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: daoustian on March 08, 2008, 09:02:43 PM
Congratulations to the Lady Jeffs for a historic win.  I was rooting earlier for WashU since I figured they'd be a slightly less competitive opponent than DePauw but then I decided to engage in horse trading to rationalize an early WashU loss and an Amherst win to equal more Director's Cup points to Amherst vs. WashU. 

DePauw will be a very challenging matchup. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 09, 2008, 08:41:54 PM
A hearty congratulations to Amherst and its players for advancing to the Sweet 16. They've had a great season and I wish them the best. Same with the Jumbos. I'd love to see both teams in the final eight, but it will certainly take some work.

Bowdoin's streak of seven-straight Sweet 16s comes to an end, but the Polar Bears gave it a good run. And it sounds like they actually had some shots down the stretch to win it, but there was no magic left. As someone noted before, they return quite a bit next year and can hopefully return to heights of the past.

Seemingly no one on this board cares for Pemper much, but I think she did one of her best coaching jobs this year. I hope Bowdoin doesn't lose her over the summer because an Ivy-type school would be stupid not to consider her.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 09, 2008, 09:36:05 PM
She did a beautiful job with those girls yesterday.  She pushed when called for, cheered, and applauded when appropriate.  I don't know the players well enough to know if she had the right combinations on the floor in any given situation, but I like her attitude and the way she handles the girls.  They do come back almost fully loaded, so I know we haven't heard the last from Bowdoin.  I certainly hope she stays as a strong NESCAC only improves the chances of one of our teams making a run in the tournament.  Jeffs pulled off a tough game, but you're right that both Tufts and Amherst have their work cut out for them.  At least Amherst doesn't have to play DePauw (defending D3 Champs) on their home court.  Have no idea how that worked out????
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 10, 2008, 04:28:13 PM
How are the "host" sites determined?  I would have thought that DePauw would have hosted the portion of the bracket that Amherst is in.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bbald eagle on March 14, 2008, 07:43:29 PM
Congratulations to Tufts on its round of 16 win over the UMW Eagles.

And thanks for the webcast of the game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on March 15, 2008, 09:52:02 AM
Congrats to The Jumbos  on their win -- 

webcast was appreciated   ;D
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 21, 2008, 09:05:50 PM
Eagles classy to the end. Good run for your ladies. Best of the luck in the future.

Have a great summer and stop photoshopping your fishing photos. Kidding. That's a great fish for a five weight. I've got a feeling my pond has a hog waiting for me this summer, but it will take a delicate touch (especially with my cable). Be well and maybe we can meet up in Greenville in the fall. I'll drop a worm off Kineo if they're biting...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on April 02, 2008, 01:27:13 PM
Williams is bringing in its backcourt of the future with two Boston Globe / Herald all-scholastic, Jill Greenberg at point and Laura Renfro at the 2.  Add that to the three front court players the Ephs brought in last year (Jackson, Shea, and Harris) and Williams should have a pretty solid nucleus for the next three seasons ...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on April 04, 2008, 12:46:47 PM
One other Eph guard recruit, nice article:

http://bozemandailychronicle.com/articles/2008/04/04/sports/000ham.txt

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on April 30, 2008, 07:14:14 AM
Any news from any of the other NESCAC schools about who is "coming" next year now that they have to commit by tomorrow?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on April 30, 2008, 08:04:36 AM
?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on April 30, 2008, 11:13:22 AM
Big news on the Bowdoin front: Stephanie Pemper has resigned as Bowdoin's head coach of women's basketball to  become the head coach at the US Naval Academy . .
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on April 30, 2008, 11:21:21 AM
Yep. This morning's lead story on D3hoops.com, for obvious reasons.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on April 30, 2008, 02:25:15 PM
Quote from: speedy on April 30, 2008, 11:13:22 AM
Big news on the Bowdoin front: Stephanie Pemper has resigned as Bowdoin's head coach of women's basketball to  become the head coach at the US Naval Academy . .
Coach Pemper must have seen the writing on the wall that the power in the NESCAC has shifted from Lewiston to Amherst (0-3 against Amherst this year after a win-streak of seemingly 39 games). Had to "jump ship" to Navy while she could.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: airball1 on April 30, 2008, 03:27:47 PM
Had a chance to meet Coach Pemper last winter when she came to Atlanta. Navy could not have made a better choice.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ralph Turner on April 30, 2008, 06:31:21 PM
Quote from: walzy31 on April 30, 2008, 02:25:15 PM
Quote from: speedy on April 30, 2008, 11:13:22 AM
Big news on the Bowdoin front: Stephanie Pemper has resigned as Bowdoin's head coach of women's basketball to  become the head coach at the US Naval Academy . .
Coach Pemper must have seen the writing on the wall that the power in the NESCAC has shifted from Lewiston to Amherst (0-3 against Amherst this year after a win-streak of seemingly 39 games). Had to "jump ship" to Navy while she could.
I have another thought about her moving to Navy.

I don't think that she "jumped ship".  How many other jobs in the country have similar student-athletes to what she coached at Bowdoin?  In D-I, are there 30 such jobs?  How often do those jobs open?  How many jobs at this time in her life and career are available to her in this five-year window?  Was there any place else for her to go if she needed to "jump-start" her career?  Did she think that she had become stale?  (I am not trying to impugn her integrity.)  This job may be the one that allows her to save for retirement.  The moving to D-I is hard and has not always been successful.

We D-III fans are sad to see her leave, but we are glad to have an advocate in such a high profile job.

Best wishes!

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on April 30, 2008, 08:23:18 PM
I don't think Pemper is worried about power shifting from Lewiston to Amherst since Bowdoin is in Brunswick.  Bates is in Lewiston. :)

Coach Pemper built Bowdoin into a regional powerhouse and a national title contender during her time there.  And I don't doubt that Bowdoin would've been a contender for the conference title again next year and the future under her. Look how striking the Polar Bears' record is compared to the pre-Pemper era.

http://www.bowdoin.edu/athletics/records/dissemination/wbbhistory.pdf

I don't know why she's decided to coach at Navy, but she's certainly earned the opportunity to do it.  Best wishes to her.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on April 30, 2008, 09:56:31 PM
Gordon,

That's a good point about Lewiston. How soon I forget where those Maine NESCAC schools are...

I think you and Ralph took me a little too seriously. I'm sure the Pempster will do well at Navy.

GP Rules

-Walzy
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on May 01, 2008, 09:15:52 AM
I may be alone on this one, but I am not completely sold on the idea that Pemper will be a great fit for Navy. At the very least, she is going to bring a new "vibe" to the Naval Academy. From what I've seen and read about Pemper/Bowdoin (a couple games and an article from the NY Times a couple years back), Pemper appears VERY laid back both in terms of personality and coaching style -- doesn't use timeouts, arranges "scavenger hunts" in NYC during a holiday tourny, bringing in the school president for a practical joke during practice, often doesn't talk to her teams at halftime, often laughing during the game with assistants, etc.  Don't get me wrong, I think she is a great coach and her "non chalant" approach has clearly worked for her up at Bowdoin and I know there are times when she probably rips into her team and players and its not all "warm and fuzzy". From what I can see/read, she recruits talented kids who will buy into her system and "take responsibility for their team" - certainly those are attributes that would fit a Navy student but the other more "non chalant"/joking qualities of her coaching may not go over as well on the D1 level, especially a school like the Naval Academy. I could really see this gig going either way for her.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: mamadukes on May 01, 2008, 09:17:09 AM
Best of luck to Coach Pemper. It was UMW's pleasure to meet the Bowdoin ladies on more than one occasion and she seemed to be a very nice lady and one hell of a coach. Navy has scored a big one!! She will enjoy the Maryland weather :D
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on May 01, 2008, 09:50:13 PM
Now that Coach Pemper has decided to move on...isn't it about time for that seemingly yearly announcement that Coach G.P. Gromacki has decided to leave his current school for the challenge of another? Perhaps this time for the fresh air of Brunswick? In all seriousness, all the best to Coach Pemper...she was a very large factor in putting Bowdoin on the womens basketball map.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bbald eagle on May 02, 2008, 10:22:14 AM
A real loss for Bowdoin. Best of luck to Coach Pemper, and to Bowdoin.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on May 02, 2008, 07:42:00 PM
She may have a laisez-faire way with her team, but I like how she handled the girls, and they resonded.    When I asked about new recruits and mentioned commitment, I meant that on May 1st students have to tell the colleges where they are going.  I'm sure there were a few on the fence that DIII, NESCAC schools were waiting to hear from as to their final choice.  So again, I ask, have anyone heard anything else about kids that are joining NESCAC teams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on May 03, 2008, 12:03:56 AM
May 1 is not a nationwide date. Is it the date for all NESCAC schools or something?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on May 03, 2008, 02:24:15 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on May 03, 2008, 12:03:56 AM
May 1 is not a nationwide date. Is it the date for all NESCAC schools or something?

May 1 is the deadline by which deposits have to be paid to NESCAC schools and the applicant has to make his or her final selection of a school. However, NESCACs admit a substantial majority of athletes through the early decision process, which involves December decisions, so the May 1 date is probably not very relevant in the context of the Pemper decision.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on May 03, 2008, 07:41:46 PM
May 1 is the date that most school's around the country(not just NESCAC) expect an answer to their offer.  They can then determine if they are going to their wait list.  I don't think May 1 had a thing to do with Pemper decision.  I just wondered about recruits at NESCAC schools whether through early or regular decision.  There was a lot of depth in the top 4 or 5 schools in the NESCAC this year, just wondering if any of those added more of others reloaded.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: goubears89 on June 11, 2008, 09:24:31 AM
Hot off the press:
BRUNSWICK, Maine - Adrienne Shibles has been named the sixth head coach in the history of the Bowdoin Women's Basketball program. Shibles, most recently the Athletic Director at Gould Academy in Bethel, Maine, was the head coach at Swarthmore (Pa.) College from 1996-2005.

"I am thrilled to have the opportunity to work with the amazing student-athletes at Bowdoin College," according to Shibles. "Their passion, strength, and sincerity inspires me, and I confident that these women will help to make my transition seamless. Together with this team, I am certain that we can strengthen the high standards and unique traditions that have been synonymous with Bowdoin women's basketball."

"We are ecstatic that Adrienne has agreed to take over the leadership of our Women's Basketball program," according to Bowdoin Athletic Director Jeff Ward. "She is a great coach and teacher who will maintain and build upon the traditions of our program. It was a very competitive process, but Adrienne clearly distinguished herself as the top candidate."

A 1991 graduate of Bates College, Shibles is a native of Knox, Maine, and a graduate of Mount View High School. At Bates she was a two-time captain of the women's basketball team, and a 1,000-point scorer, graduating with a degree in history. After coaching basketball at Babson College and basketball and soccer at Colby College, Shibles enrolled in a graduate program in exercise and sports studies at Smith College, where she earned a master's degree in 1996. While at Smith, she served as assistant and then head basketball coach at Elms College in Massachusetts.

At Swarthmore, she sparked a dramatic turnaround that saw the Garnet go from 7-17 one year prior to her arrival in 1997 to a school-record 23 wins and a Centennial Conference Championship just four years later. In her last five seasons at Swarthmore, Shibles averaged over 19 wins per year, qualified for the Centennial Conference Tournament four times, claimed the 2001 conference title and earned the program's first-ever NCAA Tournament bid. Overall, in nine years at Swarthmore, Shibles accumulated a school-record 138 wins against 96 losses and was named the WBCA District 4 Coach of the Year in 2001. During her tenure, she recruited and coached two Kodak All-Americans, an Academic All-American, a Josten's Trophy Recipient and two Conference Players of the Year. In addition, Swarthmore was a perennial member of the WBCA's Top-25 Academic Honor Roll under Shibles.

Shibles and her husband moved their family back to Maine in 2006, where she became the Dean of Athletics and Co-Curricular Programs at Gould Academy. While coaching the girl's basketball team to three-straight Maine State Tournaments, she also served as the school's Athletic Director, managing a program of 40 teams including nationally competitive on-snow squads.

Married to Kirk Daulerio, Shibles has two children, Madeline (5) and Elsa (4). She takes over one of the premiere programs in Division III basketball, as Bowdoin has qualified for the NCAA Tournament in each season since 2001, winning seven NESCAC Championships. She succeeds Stefanie Pemper, who accepted the head coaching position at the Naval Academy in May. Bowdoin will return 11 of 12 letter-winners from their
2007-08 squad that went 19-9 and reached the second round of the NCAA Division III Tournament.

"This opportunity is most certainly a dream come true for me," says Shibles. "Growing up in Maine, I have always admired Bowdoin as a united community that truly values the whole person, a place where students are respected for their contributions on the basketball court, in the community and in the classroom. My husband and I are truly excited to join the Bowdoin community, and look forward to raising our young family in Brunswick."

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on October 14, 2008, 10:47:40 AM
So there is lots of chatter on the Men's side about the upcoming season....new coaches, recruits, returning players.  What is anyone hearing on the women's side?  I know they haven't officially started, but the kids are thick into their pick up games and captain's practices.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: whoarewebobcats on October 15, 2008, 11:17:13 AM
I heard through someone who spoke with someone at Bates saying that they didn't have much coming in on the girls side, but I don't have any names or anything. Does anyone else? Or is it just going to be Val Beckwith scoring 30 a night, with the Bobcats losing by 20?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on October 28, 2008, 08:49:59 AM
So when the Top 25 is posted this week, how many NESCAC schools will be there?
Amherst, Tufts....any others?  Tufts lost Ummah, Amherst lost 3 seniors, point guard being one.  Will those losses knock either of them out of top 25?  Is Williams young team from last year ready to break into Top 25 this year?  Will new coach at Bowdoin get them into the tournament?  Any thoughts?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ephoops on November 16, 2008, 12:41:15 PM
Amherst [Women] Routs NYCCT 117-20 in 2008 Season Opener; Advances to Tip-Off Tournament Championship

This was the headline on the Amherst athletics web page this morning.

The score was 71-8 at halftime.  This game is an absolute travesty.  Why in the world is Amherst scheduling a game against NYCCT in its tip-off tournament???

What purpose does it serve Amherst, NYCCT or women's college basketball for Amherst to invite NYCCT to play in its tournament and then have Amherst absolutely embarass NYCCT??

The Amherst athletic department and its basketball program need to seriously re-assess their priorities.

Note: I'm posting this on the NESCAC men's board also because it appears that this board gets fairly limited traffic.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on November 16, 2008, 11:25:13 PM
Ha, ha. A Williams fan posting about weak competition in a regular-season tourney. Perfect. I guess not every school can have such luminaries that the Purple & Gold Classic has boasted in its illustrious history.

I understand Williams types become unhinged when it comes to Amherst and I accept that Eph grads have a higher sense of fair play than the rest of us terrestrial dwellers, but leave the holier-than-thou attitude to the Obama administration.

If you're looking for a real travesty, Bowdoin being ranked in the preseason fits that bill. The new hire would have to be considered negligent, at best. She seems like a sweet gal, but I find it hard to believe that Bowdoin was able to attract Pemper, an assistant at Harvard, who builds a power, and then is left with just a high school coach (with some college experience) as its best choice in the resume pile. The Polar Bears should revert back to a full-scale hockey school within two years.

I'm hopping on the Colby bandwagon early. At least they have a credentialed coach.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: OshDude on November 17, 2008, 12:30:44 AM
Any volleyball fans? I posted on my blog (http://uwoshvball.wordpress.com/) a Nationals Guide similar to the ones I did for the St. Thomas and Oshkosh regionals. Check it out if you're interested in Williams and/or D-III VB.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BBstudent on November 17, 2008, 11:16:07 AM

This was the headline on the Amherst athletics web page this morning.

The score was 71-8 at halftime.  This game is an absolute travesty.  Why in the world is Amherst scheduling a game against NYCCT in its tip-off tournament???

What purpose does it serve Amherst, NYCCT or women's college basketball for      Amherst to invite NYCCT to play in its tournament and then have Amherst absolutely embarass NYCCT??

The Amherst athletic department and its basketball program need to seriously re-assess their priorities.




Before you knock Amherst or the coach for having NY Tech on the schedule, you should be aware that many scheduling decisions are made on the basis of multi-year commitments. Some decisions may have been made before Gromacki took over coaching at Amherst and some may have been made because there were no other teams that could, in terms of schedule, fit the bill. I don't know why they were at the tournament and neither does anyone else on this board.
You can be sure that no successful coach, and he is clearly very successful, gets that way by scheduling games against much weaker teams.


Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BBstudent on November 17, 2008, 02:58:09 PM
This hardly deserves discussion because you are absolutely correct there is never an excuse for running up a score. However, if you had seen the game, you would know that any NESCAC team would have scored at least 100 points so long as they had  five players on the floor, and that no one ran up the score.
After the first ten minutes or so, the Amherst coach did not allow them to fast break, there was never any pressing, they tried to make several passes before shooting and, in the second half, tried to use at least 15 seconds of the shot clock. Without denigrating NY Tech because they played hard and seemed like very nice kids, imagine a decent Div III school playing U Conn or Tennessee, or even a WNBA team.
If you could suggest a way to have five girls on the court playing basketball without insulting the other team by just not shooting or deliberately turning it over, I would not mind hearing it, because no one at the game could think of what else could be done.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on November 17, 2008, 06:47:48 PM
This team came last year....same results, so there must be a multi-year deal, or they like to come to the Pioneer Valley to escape the big city.  I totally agree with BBstudent, Gromacki called off the dogs after 10 minutes.  I'd even say that he told them not to shoot until 5 to 10 seconds left on the shot clock, run the offense, give everyone a chance to play and score.  The other two teams were not push-overs.  Fitchburg, who beat Tufts in a scrimmage, gave Amherst plenty to handle.  Fitchburg did make a run in the second half and Amherst answered with outside shots to put the game out of reach.  Good looking group of Freshmen.  NESCAC will be competitive as always.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on November 17, 2008, 10:56:38 PM
  Why did that team show up since they got killed last year also? Agreement or not if I was in charge of that team I would have called Amherst and asked to be excused. RPI had them 50-9 at the half I think.
  When I first heard the name Shibles I went to the Centennial Conference page and looked her up. She improved Swarthmore with her OWN recruits. Many people come into a coaching job and achieve with the other person's recruits. Glenn Miller at Brown was a perfect example. Thet guy who was there before him had a ton of talent going nowhere. Miller escaped to Penn after his own recruits brought Brown back to earth.
  So anyway after a few years near the top the downhill slide began and very soon after she left, the team hit rock bottom. I figured that maybe that was because of Swarthmore itself. They cancelled football because they didn't feel comfortable winning, or something like that. So my guess was maybe they told her no more big compromises. Who knows? There are NESCAC schools who are always at the bottom of the football ladder and they wouldn't dream of cancelling the sport, almost un american.
   So I think the chances are she'll do okay although Yon Colby has a lean and hungry look. It's also possible she missed Maine and subconsciously wanted to return. She strikes me as a strong woman based on what I've read.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on November 22, 2008, 12:05:12 AM
Bates 58-Rhode Island College 39.  Does anyone know anything about this game beyond the score?  It appeared that neither team could hit a shot to save their lives.  Was this a product of good defense all around or just poor shooting?  Any analysis would be appreciated if someone out there saw it.

Thanks,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: goubears89 on November 22, 2008, 09:46:08 PM
Looks like a good first win for the Polar Bears tonight. Any fans at the game can give us a scouting report?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on November 23, 2008, 01:23:10 AM
Bates 65, Salem St. 60.  Hard fought win for the bobcats at Salem State.  I don't know much about them this year, but Salem State has tended to be one of the stronger teams in the region (and one of the few along with Bates, Bowdoin, and now Amherst and Tufts who have shown the potential to take down the always very strong Huskies of Southern Maine).  This win should give Bates some confidence as they head home to take on USM.

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on November 25, 2008, 04:17:10 PM
Watch Bates take on USM live in Alumni Gym on www.batescast.com (http://www.batescast.com) at 5:30pm!!!

Enjoy.

Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on November 25, 2008, 08:18:24 PM
USM 67-Bates57.  Not bad I guess considering the Huskies constant dominance in women's hoops.  Sorry about the webcast, I guess the Bates website was wrong.  I'm a little questioning of USMs 19-22 from the foul line while Bates only got 4 shots from the foul line (hitting 3).  That's a huge difference, far larger than normal, and more than the difference in the game.  Was Bates just handsy on defense or something?  How did such a huge discrepancy in foul shots occur?

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on November 28, 2008, 09:10:18 PM
Williams 1-3
Common thread with previous seasons Sr Captain Mika Peterman. (See last 2 games of last year)
She has never seen a shot she doesn't like, and the defensive intensity of the current Charlie Weis football team (sorry ND).

Mika Peterman worst NESCAC first team player in the world. My sincere apology to Keith O.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on November 29, 2008, 06:57:24 AM
Lehman beats #3 DePauw by 10.  What does that say about Amherst that beat Lehman by 23.  Lehman has a preseason All-American and 3 junior college transfers.  Sounds like Amherst beat them with tough defense and a deep bench.  Very surprised about Williams as I thought they were coming together as a young team last year. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on November 30, 2008, 12:13:15 AM
Quote from: sumfun on November 29, 2008, 06:57:24 AMWhat does that say about Amherst that beat Lehman by 23. 

What a nerve. Beating a team by 23 that bounced the No. 3 team in the country? Don't the Lady Jeffs realize they need to schedule more like Williams?

As if we needed to quantify the obvious, but just for posterity: Ephoops=Clown.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on November 30, 2008, 08:38:16 PM
 Chessie Jackson (Goleta, CA) scored 15 points for the Ephs against Union but did her defensive responsibility Michelle Rogers lay 38 pts on the Ephs?
Chessie Jackson (Goleta, CA) play some defense. For that matter, how about it ladies  you have given up 86, 91, 73, and 82 in your four losses, run some wind sprints. And Mika more assists less shooting your 45 of 123 is killing the team what are you trying to do score a 1000 pts, stop doing the best Stetson imitation and be a leader.  Defense ladies wins games, the stats will follow. RPI is coming to town and they can score points.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on December 03, 2008, 12:04:31 AM
Bates 79 Husson 64.

A solid 15 point for the Bobcats over a team against whom they should earn a solid 15 point win.  I don't have any stats from the game but Bates safely improves to (3-1) and comes home to play Wentworth Tech on Thursday at 6pm.

Cheers,
Red1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Red1 on December 04, 2008, 09:51:52 PM
Bates 75 Wentworth 49.  Bates cruised.  The bobcats couldn't buy a basket for the first 8 minutes, and it still didn't matter.  Once the shots started falling Bates ran away.   Wentworth tried to double and triple team Val Beckwith to keep her from scoring, but every time they did that they left Maggie Depoy open from outside and she was money from behind the arc tonight.

Bates' biggest problem right now looks to be their hands.  I found out why there was such a huge skew in foul shots taken between USM and Bates.  It's because Bates makes too many stupid fouls.  Most of them being or the reach in variety.  I'm a firm believer in the philosophy that it's only a foul if you get caught.  To put it in a way to illustrate tonights defensive side for Bates; If you're going to initiate contact at least try not to be obvious.

If Bates improves their defense and does a better job of moving their bodies, and not reaching with their arms (or at least do a better job of not getting caught :) the bobcats will be formidable in Nescac.

Chees,
Red1   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on December 05, 2008, 08:29:42 PM
Quote from: tothehole on November 28, 2008, 09:10:18 PM
Williams 1-3
Common thread with previous seasons Sr Captain Mika Peterman. (See last 2 games of last year)
She has never seen a shot she doesn't like, and the defensive intensity of the current Charlie Weis football team (sorry ND).
Mika Peterman worst NESCAC first team player in the world. My sincere apology to Keith O.

Tothehole,
While the ephs would certainly like to see her shoot the ball a little better, I think you are being rather harsh. I have not seen a game so I can't comment on her shot selection but she is the team's leading scorer and should be putting up 15 shots a game. She is shooting 38% from the field which isn't stellar but certainly not bad for women's basketball. It is hard to find a guard (not post player) who shoots a lot better as a team's leading scorer.
Quote from: tothehole on November 30, 2008, 08:38:16 PM
And Mika more assists less shooting
She is currently 6th in the league in assists with about 4 a game. She is second in scoring and not shooting the ball terribly. Neither of the top 3 scorers (guards) are in the top field goal % category. Again, Mika could certainly shoot the ball better but criticism is a little uncalled for...and inaccurate.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on December 07, 2008, 10:45:52 AM
Nescac hoops
See the Hamilton Guards last game that lit her up
Defense Mikia
Title: Wondering about Amherst
Post by: remsleep on December 08, 2008, 01:43:36 AM
How good is Amherst?  My impression, which began last season, is that Coach Gromacki is a terrific tactition.   This year's team seems to have added a couple of talented first year players.   My sense is that they are a rising team.   Any thoughts?  Comparison to Bowdoin, Trinity?
Title: Re: Wondering about Amherst
Post by: sumfun on December 08, 2008, 06:54:38 AM
I thought Amherst was going to take a hit having lost 3 vital seniors.  That seems not to be the case at all.  The bench is 6 deep, all of which can come off with fresh legs and score as much or more than the starting 5.  He can change up the starting 5.  His freshman are some of the leading scorers, and yes, last year the Gromacki factor was huge.  Not only is he a student of the game with great tactics, but the kids believe in him.  With a young team, they will have their meltdown moments, but they will only get better.  You can probably continue this discussion on the NESCAC link on the Northeast Women's Basketball.  Can't wait for NESCAC games to start as I think Trinity, Bates, Bowdoin and Tufts will be real tests.  I can't figure out for the life of me what's happened to Williams.  When they beat Amherst last year, I thought they were ready to make a charge with strong young players of their own.
Title: Re: Wondering about Amherst
Post by: Title9Fan on December 08, 2008, 05:58:02 PM
Quote from: sumfun on December 08, 2008, 06:54:38 AM
I thought Amherst was going to take a hit having lost 3 vital seniors. 

One of Gromacki's (many) talents is recruitment.   Reiff et al were tough to loose but he knows what it takes to keep his pipeline full -- and strong.  His biggest challenge is finding the kind of athlete he wants who can also get into Amherst.   Seems to me he's on his way to proving he can do it.  (Although I still maintain that the 117-3 score he ran up in the pre-season doesn't help his image any.) Overall, however, he's so good that (as the kids would say)...he's "wicked good".
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on December 08, 2008, 09:25:08 PM
 I can't figure out for the life of me what's happened to Williams.  When they beat Amherst last year, I thought they were ready to make a charge with strong young players of their own.
[/quote]
With the loss of 2 defensive minded players last year at the post and point Williams lost its "defensive soul". Watching their games last year it would be the post that paid for the defensive lapses of the shooting guard (Mika).  It will take a new leadership (ie the sophs) to get it turned around. Shea coming back and Jackson getting committed to defense first (some footwork work) will help but if Peterman doesn't change her game to defense first, and there is no reason to believe she will (look at the last 3 years) the team is destined to a sub 500 season. Other players can do it Coach Manning knows them. Will Coach have it to bench Mika when she plays matador defense and forgets help.  Coach Manning hasn't shown any inclination to do this but I feel if she doesn't bite the bullet the season will be lost. For Ephs sake Coach, hold Peterman accountable she'll need the experience in her next life, the real world for sure.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on December 08, 2008, 10:30:57 PM
Quote from: tothehole on December 08, 2008, 09:25:08 PM
I can't figure out for the life of me what's happened to Williams.  When they beat Amherst last year, I thought they were ready to make a charge with strong young players of their own.
With the loss of 2 defensive minded players last year at the post and point Williams lost its "defensive soul". Watching their games last year it would be the post that paid for the defensive lapses of the shooting guard (Mika).  It will take a new leadership (ie the sophs) to get it turned around. Shea coming back and Jackson getting committed to defense first (some footwork work) will help but if Peterman doesn't change her game to defense first, and there is no reason to believe she will (look at the last 3 years) the team is destined to a sub 500 season. Other players can do it Coach Manning knows them. Will Coach have it to bench Mika when she plays matador defense and forgets help.  Coach Manning hasn't shown any inclination to do this but I feel if she doesn't bite the bullet the season will be lost. For Ephs sake Coach, hold Peterman accountable she'll need the experience in her next life, the real world for sure.
[/quote]

tothehole,
Yes, Mika Peterman could play better defense and could be shooting the ball a little better but you're pretty harsh. You are bashing 18-21 year old college girls on a public forum. I'll leave it at that.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 20, 2008, 03:36:20 PM
During the downtime before Holiday play and league play, the men's NESCAC board has a discussion about student athletes, and do schools like Amherst and Williams let some athletes slide in the admissions process.  I think school like these, along with the Ivy's, attract students who are high achievers academically that would like to continue playing sports without the totally time consuming commitment of D1.  The player I'm closest to had close to perfect SAT's, National Merit Scholar, and straight A's.  So many former players are in finance, med school, or have landed great jobs.  Certainly there are exceptions, but I think they are exceptions and not the rule.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on January 04, 2009, 05:02:28 PM
Williams is starting to play better, winning 3/4 with the only loss an OT loss to a very strong opponent.  They were missing a key player who had mono first semester, and starting three frosh including a frosh point guard, not shocking they would take some time to gell.  Impressive blow-out win over Bates today, led by NESCAC frosh of the year favorite Jill Greenberg (averaging 12-5-6 plus 2.5 steals) who put up a ridiculous 18-11-11 stat line.   Williams only has one junior or senior who gets significant minutes (Peterman, who despite some criticism here has been lighting it up at 47 percent from 3 and over 90 percent from the line), so as they continue to get more experience they could become a force. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on January 05, 2009, 12:49:56 AM
Anybody see the Bowdoin - Hamilton game on Saturday?  Looks like Hamilton had plenty of opportunities to steal one in Brunswick.   What happened?  How did Hamilton keep Bowdoin at a total of 49 points?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 08, 2009, 08:09:43 AM
So Amherst struggles against Wesleyan, but pulls one out.  Williams is picking up their game which ought to make Saturday's game quite a battle and worth making the drive to see.  Williams broke Amherst undefeated streak at Williamstown last year, so Amherst will have to come with their best game.  Tufts knocks off Emmanuel which I thought would be a closer game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: lefrakenstein on January 12, 2009, 04:39:19 PM
How bad is Trinity's level of competition that they are not receiving votes at 11-0? I assume it couldn't be much worse than Amherst's.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 12, 2009, 09:57:04 PM
Trinity hasn't played Wesleyan or Williams yet, or a school like Lehman with an All-American whose team knocked off a top 5 team.  Someone must be taking note of Amherst and the depth on their team as they now are #4.  Time will tell and I can't imagine them going undefeated in the season....nor is it a good idea to do so.  Wasn't it just last year that Thomas Moore or Hope went undefeated and then lost in the first or second round of the NCAA.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 13, 2009, 07:41:12 PM
Trinity loses to Babson (8-5) so that tells you something.  On the webcast from Williams this weekend the commentators kept talking about the young team at Williams.  Check out on Amherst who is scoring and who is playing the most minutes.  The majority of them are sophomores and freshmen.  4 seniors...2 that have started, no juniors...loaded with underclassmen. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on January 13, 2009, 10:17:13 PM
Quote from: sumfun on January 13, 2009, 07:41:12 PM
Trinity loses to Babson (8-5) so that tells you something.  On the webcast from Williams this weekend the commentators kept talking about the young team at Williams.  Check out on Amherst who is scoring and who is playing the most minutes.  The majority of them are sophomores and freshmen.  4 seniors...2 that have started, no juniors...loaded with underclassmen. 

Williams lacks post players, Jackson loves the 3 and the rest of the team is loaded with guards.  Wes ran through them shooting open 3's or  driving for layups. The question is will they do better than 9-15.  No one is willing to play defense and foul for the team when selfish players play matador defense, Gone are Maggie, Mego and Dom who's fouls made teams pay to play. It will be years till we see a competitive Lady Eph team. A new bottom will be seen in Williamstown.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on January 13, 2009, 11:25:43 PM
amherst and tufts are the two best in nescac. williams lost by 40 to wesleyan tonight. wesleyan gave amherst a good game, but got hammered by wheaton.
williams needs a new coach
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 14, 2009, 07:37:44 AM
Williams coach knows how to get the job done on the court, but what hasn't dawned on her yet is the new reality in the NESCAC as she doesn't appear to be an active recruiter as compared to Berube and Gromacki.  Kids want to be wanted, and in the past she's been able to get the cream of the crop due to Williams reputation.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on January 14, 2009, 10:53:20 AM
I disagree with the last 2 posts.  Manning recruits well, just got the wrong position players. She always prefers guards to posts or forwards. Look at 2 years ago when she played one game with a front line of six footers and killed a nescac opponent(sorry Coffin hey is she still playing somewhere ?) and then reverted to a 3 -4 guard offense. Don't get me wrong the players she has are talented, teams or just killing them on match ups ie Mika VS Ali Fourney  was a joke, Mika got her points (some great moves) Ali just ran an offense as if Mika wasn't even there 5'10vs 5'5'. Pat needs some kick butt 6 footers. Williams will rebuild but this season will be a lost one, save Mika getting 1000 and as recent history has shown for Williams, 1000 point players can loose team focus. Jackson will get her points but her lack of speed and stamina will allow all the nescac to make layups (see last night). The only thing I would say to Pat would be stop preaching defense and start playing it. She always and I mean always puts her offense on the floor and will only put defense on the floor when dire straights require it, while preaching defense first. Pat actions speak louder than words. Bench Mika when people blow by her and only play Jackson when she can run full out.
Does any one know what happened to the freshman pt guard J Greenberg?  A one hit wonder? Or was monday's practice after Amherst the end of her.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 14, 2009, 03:01:11 PM
Tothehole, you have a point.  Chessie Jackson plays more minutes per game than any of the 3 or 4 players for Amherst that play the 4 and 5 position, but she didn't have their speed or stamina, got into foul trouble and then Amherst could always bring in fresh legs as they are deep under the basket.  I really like Pat Manning as a coach and she's produced some great teams....she'll get it back....and probably sooner than later.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 20, 2009, 10:49:32 PM
This board has been quiet.  Can Trinity throw anything at Amherst this weekend, and how about Tufts and Bowdoin matchup?  Are other games pretty much predictable or some upsets on the horizon?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 24, 2009, 09:27:45 AM
Colby beats Tufts.  Williams beats Wesleyan.....another wild, wacky, wonderful NESCAC season where on any day just about any team can beat another.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on January 30, 2009, 11:44:44 PM
  Bowdoin is a very good team. What impressed me most was the fact that the coach was the FIRST one to show me that they saw more than the super obvious things when she watched the films or when Amherst was scouted in person.
    I'm not going to say what I saw because in spite of the fact that people say the coaches see everything and that you can't tell them anything they don't know, I can assure you most coaches miss this about Amherst.
  It's not a big thing but tonight there is a very good chance it made the difference between winning and losing since the game was so close. What do some of these coaches do when they watch film? Come to conclusions like 'gee Daigneault does come up with rebounds. Make sure you box her out' etc.
   I have never complained about the refs before. I've seen some bad calls from close up but never so many against one team. I never even try to make a call unless I am right on top of it so to speak. Tonight, well my guess is that one of the refs applied to Amherst a while back and was not accepted. Tonight they got their revenge. This went on for a good part of the game until the last seven minutes or so. Hopefully Tufts rejected this ref also and will feel the wrath at a later date.
  It only takes a few calls.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on January 31, 2009, 12:02:17 AM
Actually, not surprised that Bowdoin took down Amherst, only surprised that it wasn't a bit more comfortable.  Bowdoin is hitting their stride when it counts ( though I was shocked that they lost to Tufts)
Having seen the team I root for get scalded by both Bowdoin and Amherst, it was clear to me that Bowdoin has more "baskeball players" than does Amherst.    Both teams will probably win  the rest of their games.....makes for a very interesting NESCAC tournament, and depending on the pairings, likely we will see these two in the final.     
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 01, 2009, 01:32:51 AM
Quote from: senatorfrost on January 30, 2009, 11:44:44 PMI have never complained about the refs before. I've seen some bad calls from close up but never so many against one team. I never even try to make a call unless I am right on top of it so to speak. Tonight, well my guess is that one of the refs applied to Amherst a while back and was not accepted. Tonight they got their revenge. This went on for a good part of the game until the last seven minutes or so.

The weakest of weak sauce.

You claim to have never complained about officiating, yet there is no one who complains about officating like you. You're that guy in third row, standing up and yelling during the block/charge calls in women's games. And always in Amherst's favor. There's nothing wrong with being a homer -- it makes you as close to a Williams grad as you'll get -- just don't bore us with your "objectivity."

Moving on to the season at hand. A mid-to-late season ranking:

1. Amherst -- yeah, the Bowdoin loss doesn't look good, especially at home, but the Lady Jerks are the team.
2. Tufts -- the elephants are my pick to win it all, despite not matching up well with Amherst.
3. Bowdoin -- they are what we thought they were.
4. Williams -- what does it take to get fired from that school?
5. Wesleyan -- can we trade them for Hamilton yet?
6. Trinity -- I'm enchanted by the fact there is another contender. Still a year (at least) away.
7. Bates -- a case of the best and worst coaching. Does that make sense?
8. Colby -- shouldn't they be better by now?







Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on February 01, 2009, 12:08:59 PM
  Monkey:
   I have to admit I'm glad to see you back. Your sly personal attacks have been missed. I remember last year when people from other conferences posted you were quick to let them know that they were inferior to you. I have no idea why you feel the need to  be like that but you do.
  I have seen two games in the past eight years which I thought were unfair as far as the refs were concerned. (I go to most of the men's games and about half of the women's.) Usually over the course of a game bad calls tend to equal out. I consider myself to be very objective and I might add that I have never voiced a complaint during a game. When I say 'voiced' I mean loud enough for a person sitting in front of me to hear every word.
   As a long time fan you should know every once in a great while a team has to suffer through a game like that. As far as Williams is concerned I think Pat Manning is having a tough year. Why would I want to post and make matters a little worse for her? It wouldn't give me any pleasure.
 
 
   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 02, 2009, 07:36:35 AM
I think Bowdoin is in the driver's seat as they have the easiest schedule remaining.  Having said that there are always surprises in the NESCAC. 

The officiating in the NESCAC isn't any better than most high schools.  Most times the games are called much too tight, particularly by the female officials.  I don't think they know what a "post move" with a drop step is when they see it.  It's almost always a travel.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 08, 2009, 05:24:26 PM
As usual it comes down to the last weekend to determine the #1 Seed for the NESCAC tourney.  Got to see Tufts game on Saturday.  Amherst must have made some adjustments after Bowdoin loss as Amherst shut down Tufts big scorers.  #52 fouled out and was held to 7 points and 4 Rbs for Tufts.  The Freshman point guard for Amherst totally took Collen Hart out of her game.  Daignault for Amherst had a big game, as did Leyman as she had to guard #52 for Tufts.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 15, 2009, 12:10:46 PM
Such a quiet board from year's past....any comments on matchups for the NESCAC first round and beyond?!!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on February 15, 2009, 07:55:12 PM
  The only thing I can think of is that Amherst should have the home court. Mind you I actually think that on a neutral floor Bowdoin probably has the better team but the game was at Amherst and that's a big help. See my crybaby post a ways back but remember sometimes the crybabies are right.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 18, 2009, 03:07:38 PM
For the NESCAC's Bowdoin will have the home court, and we all know how hard it is to beat the Polar Bears at home.  Actually in the first weekend, all the higher seeds should be alert to upsets.  Colby has come close to knocking off Amherst.  Williams....one never knows which team will show up, but if the good one does and Bowdoin is cold....one never can tell.  Bates/Trinity is a toss up.  Tufts should win as they only have to shut down two players.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 23, 2009, 10:03:47 PM
Wow, this is a quiet board compared to last year!?  Big weekend in Brunswick....any predictions?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 24, 2009, 12:49:43 AM
Prediction: the officials will once again hand the NESCAC title to Bowdoin.

According to the luminaries on this board, since 2001 we've all suffered through the following:

Record of the Bowdoin women's team when the officials have blatantly handed the Polar Bears the game: 224-0

Record of the Bowdoin women's team when there has been fair officiating: 0-35

Frosty's slow-twitch intellectual synapses actually make me pine for the days when all we had to worry about was the Mary Washington crew conjuring up striped phantoms on this board. I suppose with a whack-job liberal in the White House we were due for a Pioneer Valley nutter to finally feel adequate.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 24, 2009, 06:59:09 AM
I totally agree on all points.  Don't the refs for conference finals get picked by the league...not the school or usual assigner.  Not to turn this into a political board, but the market certainly has loved the performance of the "whack-job" in the white house.  See occassionally you'll find a conservative in the pioneer valley.  Notice that the market liked December....outgoing pres was a lame duck and incoming hadn't done anything to muck it up further....the markets were allowed  to work.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 24, 2009, 08:39:42 PM
Hi, guys -- there's a whole board devoted to politics. It's off-limits here on the rest of the boards.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bbald eagle on February 25, 2009, 03:08:55 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on February 24, 2009, 12:49:43 AM

make me pine for the days when all we had to worry about was the Mary Washington crew conjuring up striped phantoms on this board.


ahh, the pre-Scranton days!  ;)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 25, 2009, 04:27:48 PM
If I see that Amherst repeats as champs, I'll be amazed.  It certainly will be a testiment to Gromacki and the freshmen and sophomores that are driving that team.

The last three meetings between Tufts and Amherst have been decided by 2, 6, and 6 points.  Those games could have gone either way.  If Amherst can beat Tufts one more time, they will have had a much more physical game.  I suspect Bowdoin will have a much easier game with Trinity and be fresher should Amherst and Bowdoin meet in the finals.

The last two games between Amherst and Bowdoin have been decided by 1 point in the NCAA, and 2 points in their only match up this year.  Previous to that Bowdoin won by 11 at home last year and lost by 24 in NESCAC semi-final.

Should be a fun weekend to be in Brunswick.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Balder Eagle on March 01, 2009, 04:31:22 PM
Quote from: bbald eagle on February 25, 2009, 03:08:55 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on February 24, 2009, 12:49:43 AM

make me pine for the days when all we had to worry about was the Mary Washington crew conjuring up striped phantoms on this board.


ahh, the pre-Scranton days!  ;)

Since both Schools are in "The Dance" perhaps they may meet again ;) ......... long time no see Monkey, how are things? Cheers to you bbald!  ;D
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 02, 2009, 09:19:08 PM
   Gromacki lost 4 out of his first 6 from last year. Shibles lost one starter but Rubega came back so she really lost nothing. Gromacki reloaded? What did Bowdoin do? Henrickson looked EASILY as good as any frosh Amherst has. I'm pretty sure I could say the same thing about Gould. Bowdoin reloaded also.
   The biggest reason why Amherst is so good this year is because last year's frosh improved a lot. Last year Daigneault looked a little like a tin man. This year she's a work of art. I would guess maybe the coach had a little something to do with that. Long also improved. Last year I used to wince shen she moved with the ball. This year I watch her and am at ease.
   Leyman always looked fine last year and never made me wince but she's improved too. Brossy appears to be hobbled according to her minutes lately but she too used to make wince a bit. No more.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 02, 2009, 09:25:39 PM
 I should mention that last year Bowdoin looked like a team with problems. There was something about a van ride and then the coach left. This year seems like they're doing what they figured to.
  This could all be academic because only one team from NESCAC W has gotten to the final four since 1994-Bowdoin of course.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 03, 2009, 12:55:10 AM
Quote from: Title9Fan on February 25, 2009, 02:41:41 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on February 24, 2009, 12:49:43 AM
Prediction: the officials will once again hand the NESCAC title to Bowdoin.

Record of the Bowdoin women's team when there has been fair officiating: 0-35


Man....we've all done some whining about refs before but that's some serious
sour grape wine right there....

Must have been bad ref-ing that accounted for that 33 POINT LOSS by Williams (the land where they forgot that even Tennessee has to recruit) at Bowdoin last weekend.       

Um....forget it.

Anyway, it's good to have the hairless Eagles in the house -- welcome back boys. I figured it would take just a little cage-rattling to get Frederick's Finest to reappear. It's also nice to have the Polar Bears back in their rightful place. It's just a shame the refs had to spoil things again for Amherst.

If I'm reading things correctly, I think we can have a regional of USM, Mary Washington, Bowdoin and Brandeis in Brunswick. That would be a peach, and just like old times. Stripers don't run for a couple more months in Merrymeeting Bay, but we can get Balder a bobber and worm and see what happens. Or maybe a four for a one-weight. That's your stick of choice, right?

Just think: if you come to Maine again, you could change your handle to "Baldacci's Eagles." And you can take him back with you (Sorry, forgot. No politics).

So I'll be rooting for Mary Wash to take care of business. I'm not a huge fan of Brandeis, but they've got a Colby gal leading the way, so I'll push for the Judges by default. Southern Maine is a crooked outfit, but they are Mainers. Since Amherst fans are obviously angling for an intellectual "bailout," we've got our regional.

Make it happen.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 03, 2009, 02:07:40 AM
 Monkey:
  I just saw your post on page 58.
  It takes a while for some of us to appreciate high level humor. I've always considered you to be the most intelligent person on D3 hoops and you proved me right.
   You took the word 'Jeffs' and took OFF the FF and put in RK which changed it to Jerks. Really clever as well as hilarious.
   I heard the favorite TV show up there, down east or whatever, is still All in The Family.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 03, 2009, 08:35:39 AM
Senator hit the nail on the head.  Gromacki is making this run on the backs of freshmen and sophomores.  Brossy hampered by an ankle and Harik with a broken nose have had limited minutes lately as seniors and there are no juniors on the team.  I heard a quote once...the best thing about freshmen....is they become sophomores.  Some of the streaky shooting and hesitancy to take a shot goes away with age and experience... all  very evident against Bowdoin.

Having said that, watch out for Amherst over the next few years as Gromacki is a great recruiter, but for this year I think their lack of experience will catch up with them this coming weekend or next.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 03, 2009, 09:22:51 AM
Question:

Obvioulsy who hosts Sweet 16 depends on who survives, but.....

.....if Amherst, NYU, Brandeis and Bowdoin emerge from this upcoming weekend....who would host?

Amherst - best record, central Mass.

Brandeis - centrally located and NCAA is trying to be sensitive to time, travel and cost in this economy.  Also has head to head win against Bowdoin.

Bowdoin - 2 wins against Amherst, NESCAC Champs, but parking is issue with contruction and back side is missing from the gym.  Public restrooms are far from gym.

Can't imagine NYU....to expensive to put up those teams in NYC.

Thoughts?

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 04, 2009, 04:36:27 PM
Sumfun

    If Bowdoin, Brandeis and Amherst and NYU all reach the sectionals, I would think for central location. and cost considerations, Brandeis should host.  This location would be a neutral court for both the NESCAC schools...though I am a Amherst supporter.
The Amherst athletic website has the time for the games on Friday and Sat.  There will be a live video, etc. for the Amherst game.  Since Amherst is also hosting the men's and women's hockey semifinal games and will video cast them, the times for the WBB games may have been impacted somewhat.  The Amherst BB game is the second game on Friday and starts at 6 PM.

   Amh63.... I am a new poster, an old graduate and long time supporter of Amherst sports.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 04, 2009, 04:44:46 PM
welcome, Amh63.  Think you might be right about Brandeis hosting, and would be neutral for NESCAC schools.  First things first.....those first seeds have to emerge from the weekend that could be full of upsets.
Title: NESCAC WBB
Post by: amh63 on March 04, 2009, 05:31:46 PM
SUMFUN,
   Thank you for your warm welcome.  Having read your postings, I have some Amherst WBB tidbits that maybe of interest to this board.
   I, as an old camp-follower of Amherst, met the Amherst's coach at Salem Va. during the men's team dinner on Sat.  He is a bright young man and knows what he wants in team players.  When the job opened up at Amherst, he sought advice  from an Amherst friend/graduate.  The old Amherst graduate of the 50's was on the St. Lawrence  Board of Trustees when he first met the coach.  This old Amherst graduate and I sat together during the Final-Four games in Salem and that is where I got the background story.
    It is interesting that the star of the Bowdoin WBB team's victory over Amherst was a teammate of an Amherst starter at Norwich Free Acad.  The Amherst player, C. Long, has a father that was a starter for the Uconn  MBB teasm awhile back.
      Amh63
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 04, 2009, 11:01:08 PM
Should it turn out that Amherst and USM meet on Saturday, I would be shocked if the Jeffs survive.  Look for those two Maine teams with tradition, despite the ups and downs each has had this season, to go a lot further in the dance than one might think....would not be a bit surprised if one or both makes it at least to the Elite Eight.....probably Bowdoin.
Title: Re: NESCAC WBB
Post by: sumfun on March 05, 2009, 08:55:33 PM
I heard that story from the Amherst Alum/St. Lawrence Board member.  The story goes that Amherst was Gromacki's dream job, so he backed out of the Hamilton job that he'd just accepted after a year as the "interim."  He's done amazing things at Amherst, is a very good recruiter, and has the full respect of the girls.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 07, 2009, 12:46:16 AM
So much for my insightful prediction about USM coming out of this bracket a winner.  Somebody forgot to tell Emmanuel they were supposed to lose.   Very disappointed in Babson's effort against Amherst, but understandable in that their strength lies in two first year players.....future will be bright for them.  Tomorrow?  I'm assuming Amherst will win, but.........

Tough night all over the place for the Little East ( Western, Eastern, USM all go down, RIC goes down on the mens' side as well)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 07, 2009, 06:37:50 PM
Amherst  game just finished.  Score: Amherst 76; Emmanuel 37.  It was a 21 point lead at halftime.  Amherst did  the damage inside this game vice outside yesterday.  Again, almost everyone was in the game for Amherst.  Now the waiting to see where the sectional will be.  The conference teams are doing well so far.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 07, 2009, 09:32:42 PM
Saw the last five minutes of the Bowdoin-Muhlenburg game.  Muhlenburg won 58-57.  Bowdoin fought back from an 8 pt. deficit.  The last 35 plus seconds was unreal.  I thought the people in the stripes gave the game to Bowdoin by awarding the ball to the polar bears with 13 plus seconds to go and down by 1 point.  A very strange "home court " call.  One that even the broadcasters questioned.  The strippers did not even check with the replay video that was available.  After this game, I may want to join the board members about the strippers up in Maine!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on March 08, 2009, 09:09:31 AM
amh63,
I did as well. the announcers on the vid talked about that home court call, but praised the Muhlenberg coach for not arguing, but settling  his kids down. Unreal call!!
I saw Bowdoin twice this year, looked very beatable + overrated, but they can defend.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Laserty on March 08, 2009, 02:24:53 PM
remsleep, you did it again! Good predictions. Unfortunately you dont see a good team in Amherst, and thats dissapointing. They might have the best deffense in the nation, and are finally peaking at the right point. Amherst is hosting, just btw.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 08, 2009, 02:27:12 PM
Amherst was selected to host a sectional site!  Guess the Bowdoin lost may have impacted the selection.  Yet, Amherst is the highest ranked team in the "pod" and has the experience of hosting sectionals for the MBB side.  Hope it improves Amherst's chances to get to the Final 4.  If the first year players continue to improve....i.e. decision making, hustle and shooting as they have over the last half of the month, I believe their chances are good.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 08, 2009, 04:59:52 PM
Totally different team this weekend in Amherst than last weekend in Bowdoin. I agree that if the first year's contine to gel, they are deep and hard to stop.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 09, 2009, 02:15:09 AM
Quote from: amh63 on March 07, 2009, 09:32:42 PM
The stripers did not even check with the replay video that was available. 

They're only allowed to check clock, whether a shot was off in time and whether it was a two- or three-point shot.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on March 09, 2009, 08:19:05 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on February 24, 2009, 12:49:43 AM
Prediction: the officials will once again hand the NESCAC title to Bowdoin.

According to the luminaries on this board, since 2001 we've all suffered through the following:

Record of the Bowdoin women's team when the officials have blatantly handed the Polar Bears the game: 224-0

Record of the Bowdoin women's team when there has been fair officiating: 0-35

Frosty's slow-twitch intellectual synapses actually make me pine for the days when all we had to worry about was the Mary Washington crew conjuring up striped phantoms on this board. I suppose with a whack-job liberal in the White House we were due for a Pioneer Valley nutter to finally feel adequate.




224-1 dooh
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 09, 2009, 11:33:34 PM
Quote from: Laserty on March 08, 2009, 02:24:53 PM
remsleep, you did it again! Good predictions. Unfortunately you dont see a good team in Amherst, and thats dissapointing. They might have the best deffense in the nation, and are finally peaking at the right point. Amherst is hosting, just btw.

Right you are Laserty, I have a noticeable propensity for mis-forecasting (is this a word?) outcomes.  I really thought that USM was going to dig deep in the Amherst bracket, and I felt that Amherst thought admittedly very strong was a little too young and not good enough to make enough offensive plays to get through.  Wrong again. 

While I'm doing the mea culpa thing let's not forget that I also predicted that it would probably be Bowdoin to climb to the Elite Eight......I had seen the Lady Mules play earlier this season and knew that they were pretty good.  In the case of the Bowdoin-Muhlenberg game ( which I did not see), I have to believe that the fact that Noucas was only able to play for 26 minutes hurt them mightily.  Your thoughts?   I spent the weekend on the MIT bandwagon over on the mens' side......a remarkable story there that ended too early.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Laserty on March 10, 2009, 01:11:20 AM
Hmm... I've seen Amherst get streaky, and I think they are getting hot now. Furthermore, I think whoever wins the NYU/AMH game goes to the final 4. Just my thought. Both teams can win, but NYU is just a one person team. I think Amh can take her off her game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 11, 2009, 10:53:32 AM
To remind everyone, there will be video coverage of the Amherst hosted sectionals.  It now seems that the NCAA will provide announcers which should be an improvement over the naive, inexperience Amherst announcers on the infant Jeffcast.  It seems that when it rains, it pours.  I will not complain when technology enables me to follow D3 hoops on the web.  Still not as good as being at the games, etc.
I have been a slow convert from men's BB, div 1 to div.3 and a slower convert from div.1 women to div. 3 women.  It really is based on the quality of the game, and effort of the players and yes, the officials.  I actually enjoy women's hockey over men's hockey because it is a cleaner,  shows off the skill of the players more and allows more of an finesse game.   All well, for those people that follow women's Div3 BB, I would like to hear your opinions about the level of play in the conference over the past decade.  Are the players more skillful, players playing at a higher level now then in the past. etc.?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 11, 2009, 11:08:53 AM
Yes, and the NCAA contracts out with us to provide announcers for these games, so you're getting two of our New England-area broadcasters: Mark Simon and Scott Sudikoff.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 11, 2009, 02:15:37 PM
Amh63...I too am looking forward to "real" announcers.  They may even talk to the coaches ahead of time and get some of the scoop about the team instead of just guessing what is going on with either team.

I too am a D1 women's and men's fan, but the more and more I watch of D3, it's really growing on me as these guys/girls can play.  Plus they are the true student athletes as they take a full schedule of classes, while working just as hard to better their game and their team.  The reffing can be suspect in any and all divisions.  All it takes is one of the three refs to decide he/she will take control of the game and you have way to many ticky-tack fouls called. 

Can't wait for this weekend to see who emerges!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 12, 2009, 10:38:33 PM
  Has anyone seen Brandeis or NYU who has also seen Amherst? On paper Brandeis looks really good. I threw out the game v Bowdoin figuring something was wrong with Bowdoin as Brandeis couldn't be THAT much better. Except for Regis they had an easy time in New England and they beat Tufts at Tufts.
   NYU beat Brandeis twice and it seemed like it was almost no problem. On paper NYU looks best of all. I also thought So. Maine would get by Emmanuel fairly easily.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Laserty on March 14, 2009, 12:01:59 AM
Amherst brought it tonight. This finally proved their worthiness. Can't wait for another good match up tomorrow with Brandeis and Amherst. I like Amherst's chances.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on March 14, 2009, 01:22:33 AM
Quote from: senatorfrost on March 12, 2009, 10:38:33 PM
  Has anyone seen Brandeis or NYU who has also seen Amherst? On paper Brandeis looks really good. I threw out the game v Bowdoin figuring something was wrong with Bowdoin as Brandeis couldn't be THAT much better. Except for Regis they had an easy time in New England and they beat Tufts at Tufts.
   NYU beat Brandeis twice and it seemed like it was almost no problem. On paper NYU looks best of all. I also thought So. Maine would get by Emmanuel fairly easily.

Amherst is the real deal. It will be tough vs. Brandeis. The Judges are pretty solid, excluding the Regis game. they are better than both Bowdoin and Tufts though. I think Bowdoin was not nearly as good as their record. Surprised Tufts went out in the 2nd round, close game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 14, 2009, 08:44:34 AM
Let's give Amherst their due.   Not many expected them to get by NYU.  Defensively they shut down NYU's all-american and fustrated the rest of the team.  Also give Gromacki his due.  What a game plan.  He targeted their weakness and took advantage of them with a spectacular game plan.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 14, 2009, 01:43:28 PM
Sumfun,
   I agree on all your points.  I hope you got to see the game live.  I watched the game on video.  The Ncaa camera men must have a time limit.  I could only get the first have of the game... though I did see part of the halftime show!.  It seems that after 800 PM ET, none of the Div3 games, men and women both, came through.  The site kept stating that the show was not available.  Had to listen to the game.  The announcers were quite good.  Provided coaches interviews and background info on several players.  Amherst star player in the sectional's, the freshman center/forward did not get into the "game" much due to fouls? 
Still Amherst found a way to beat NYU handily.  NYU's zone defense was porous to Amherst's penetrating guards.  Amherst's defensive pressure was key to the game, I believe, as well as their energy.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 14, 2009, 01:54:09 PM
 I didn't see Tufts this year but Bowdoin W are best team I've seen in past two years and I guess Brandeis is up there with them. Last year Bowdoin beat Amherst by a couple at home and lost by a point in NCAA. They got blown out in NESCAC tourney but I put that down to raging issues or maybe it was just a bad day for all? Happens.
   I thought Bowdoin was a slight shade better than Amherst this year.
   I don't see how Muhlenberg beat them but they did. To me it looks like Bowdoin played their best v Amherst.
   I looked and saw that Otieno was only 1-5 from the field, yet I thought she performed really well. People were in foul trouble and in my opinion she stepped in and stepped up. It appeared that she's been injured/hampered for good part of the season so in my mind it kind of makes last night extra special and so I made her the Senator Frost player of the game.





She'll probably extract the verbiage from this post and have it bronzed.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 14, 2009, 01:56:37 PM
 I don't know what NYU was supposed to look like but it's possible that Brandeis will be more ready for Amherst than NYU was.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 14, 2009, 02:39:39 PM
SFrost,
   I logged out earlier, but seeing your post, I had to login again.  It should be pointed out that the Bowdoin WBB team was not considered among the top two in the conference by most observers the majority of the year.  Tufts' team was considered better.  Check the scores, or do you think its one of those games one can throw out.  In most BB games, one should look at the matchups available for the coaches to consider.  Then it is up to the players to execute the game plan.   Muhlenberg is a very good team and won up in Bowdoin in spite of the refs.  It is up to the coaches to prepare the team for the game to come.  The fact that the senior guard for Amherst had 10 rebounds says that the other players were boxing out, etc.  Shooting the ball is in my mind the last option for a point guard.   Enjoy the game tonight!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 14, 2009, 03:37:23 PM
  First of all a lot of Otieno's time came with Finucane in the game. Finucane is the pg-simple as that. Now of course you can say they had 2 pg's in the game but I would disagree.
  I saw Bowdoin struggled maybe a little in the beginning. Before that tell me why anyone would have picked any other team to be on top of NESCAC? They had everyone back lost Anelauskas and picked up Rubega. Every one else had huge losses. Bowdoin also picked up the ROY I might add.

I use Amherst w as a barometer. I find them it pretty accurate to do so. They go all out defensively every game. Sometimes their shooting is horrendous like v Colby. In that case they missed open shot after open shot etc. etc. So after I saw bates and Bowdoin I concluded that Bates was simply not in Bowdoin's dimension as far as skills, talent etc were concerned. Just an opinion-you can say Bates is as good or better if you like.
   Bowdoin seemed to struggle in the beginning what with the new coach etc. However by the time they got to Amherst they looked fine. When Bowdoin players had the ball they were able to look much better player v player than Bates did. True bates may have been freelancing but the skills they displayed while doing whatever anyone wants to call it did not in my opinion measure up to Bowdoin's.
   Were you at the Muhelnberg Bowdoin game?


  You don't give Amherst all those close games over a two year period without a lot of talent. I threw out the Brandeis game by the way.
   
   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: daoustian on March 14, 2009, 07:38:14 PM
Nice job Lady Jeffs.  If only the men's team could have made a run, this would be quite the winter -- depending what happens with men's hockey tonight, Amherst could have 3 of the 4 major winter sports in the Final Four. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 15, 2009, 10:12:50 AM
Congrats to the Jeffs.  They brought intense defense the entire weekend with great ball handling and incredible inside play. 

Heard many problems with the webcast which shows there is still a way to go with that technology....things like Amh63 who had no second half picture, other complaints of no first half picture, streaky picture, audio 45 seconds ahead of video.  Any techies out there that have any suggestions, and/or didn't have problems let us know how you had your computer set up.

Best of luck to Amherst in the Final Four.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: daoustian on March 15, 2009, 12:57:02 PM
I had no problems with the video/audio on basketball.  Through the NCAA site, Windows XP, Firefox 3.0.7 as the browser, downloaded Microsoft Silverlight and everything was good to go.  As a side note, the LiveStats through the Amherst Sports Information site are about 5-10 seconds ahead of the video, which is kinda neat. 

Men's hockey video was another story with JeffCast.  It is better than nothing, but there were video/audio issues there and there's no graphics, so when you want to know the score, you have to wait for them to pan to the scoreboard, which is kinda funny. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ac08 on March 15, 2009, 04:49:24 PM
Long time lurker, first time poster.

Congrats to the 'Herst Women. Here is to "good, better, best" and the transformation into on of the Nation's elite programs.

Cut down the net in Meeechigan.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 16, 2009, 05:19:13 PM
This was predicted when Gromacki was hired -- and there can be no doubt at all, his reputation as a hell of a coach was well deserved.  I mean consider, Williams beat Amherst something like 12 times in a row before Gromacki came ... and this point, I'd be surprised if Williams beat Amherst anytime soon, at least so long as the coaching equation remains the same on both ends (the Williams coach does a good job recruiting and there is a lot of young talent on the roster, but it is very, very unusual for Williams to beat a team with equal or greater talent in recent years).   What is scary is that Amherst is doing this with almost all contributions from soph and frosh players -- in two years, they will be downright scary.  The only question is, will Gromacki want to be a NESCAC lifer (very cushy and rewarding, just ask Hixon or Sheehy) or does he have his eyes set on bigger things (D-I)?  Given his past history (giving up head coach for D-I assistant), I wouldn't be shocked to see him snag a D-I opportunity, and it is only a matter of time before it is offered.  The rest of NESCAC will certainly root for that to happen, because if he gets another recruiting class like the last two, and there is no reason to think his coaching ability will suddenly decline, the rest of the conference won't stand a chance, with the POSSIBLE exception of Bowdoin due to the Maine recruiting base and strong tradition there. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 16, 2009, 10:53:22 PM
  I read today Gromacki grew up in South Deerfield. That's no more than fifteen miles from Amherst. Maybe he's home for good? Would it be such a great move to D1? Some coaches struggle like Miller from Conn COll. He left Brown with very little after maximizing the other guy's recruits.
  The most impressive things about Wash U. as it's called are as follows.
 
They had six players make all UAA (including Hon. Men.)
 
Their assist to turnover ratio as a team!! is almost spectacular. 500-400 (off by 1 or 2)
 
They have five assistant coaches. You can call that what you want. I call it semi pro.
 
Their strength of schedule is very high-All the UAA's are probably very high and according to the other coaches Wash U has the most talent in league.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 16, 2009, 11:04:23 PM
I agree that you would be hard pressed to find a better coaching gig than being at a NESCAC school, near your hometown, with a chance to build a national powerhouse and maintain it, and have very, very little pressure in terms of job security (very rare to see a NESCAC coach fired) while making the NCAA's most years -- that is Hixon's situation and I am sure he wouldn't trade that for D-I (in fact I wonder if Paulsen has regrets ... lots of pressure in D-I and he inherited a tough situation at Bucknell).  But one never knows -- coaches by nature are of course competitive people, and many find it very hard to resist the lure of D-I and proving they can win on the big stage (not to mention, while earning the big bucks): for each Hixon or Dick Farley, there is one Paulen or Chuck Priore ...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 16, 2009, 11:57:02 PM
 You're right-they are competitive or they wouldn't be any good in the business. What does a school like Bucknell pay? In order for it to be worth the risk I would want somewhere around $250,000 a year at least and a six year deal, to leave a secure (relatively) NESCAC job. (assuming I'm doing well i.e.)
  Look at all the NESCAC coaches who would have been long gone if they were in D1. Then add in the fact that the level of coaching would be somewhat better and if not then the level of recruiting certainly would be.
   I think a lot of people don't realize what a tough job it really is.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: mark_reichert on March 17, 2009, 06:01:15 PM
Quote from: senatorfrost on March 16, 2009, 10:53:22 PM
They have five assistant coaches. You can call that what you want. I call it semi pro.

Only one is full-time, the rest have day jobs.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on March 17, 2009, 09:57:57 PM
But considering a minimum of 3 assistants travel to all of the WashU games (from what I have seen and heard)  thats pretty semi-pro/amazing...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 17, 2009, 10:47:48 PM
 I am assuming they are all paid something for their efforts. I realize it's probably not all that much. Still I bet all coaches would like to have that many helpers around for practices/coaching.
It's a luxury=semi pro
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 18, 2009, 11:03:22 AM
Nice article on D3hoops.com site about the Amherst team in general and the 1st year pt. guard in particular.  She is from Cortland NY which is near my daughter in Ithaca.  Being such, I read about her in the Cortland Standard (local newspaper).  She was one of the stars and leader on her high school team.  Wonder how the Amherst coach found her since NESCAC coaches are limited in their recruiting. Maybe from his Hamilton coaching days.  Must remind myself to ask him.
   Since the discussion has been on the Wash. U program, has anyone else notice the large number of players on the team?  They list 21 players!  Maybe that is one reason for the number of assist. coaches.  Wonder how many are on their traveling squad.  During NCAA play, there is a limit of 15 players to dress for games.  At least that is what the limit was for men's BB and soccer.  The Wash. U program reminds me of the Nebraska football program when the coach would have over 100 players and "store linemen" for future years (linemen take longer to develop).  It was also a way to prevent rival programs from getting good players.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 18, 2009, 11:04:14 AM
I believe UAA limits traveling squad as well -- obviously there's a significant cost factor there.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 18, 2009, 01:49:32 PM
Even in the UAA, the size of the WBB squad is unique, I think.  I have not checked all the UAA WBB teams however. Must do since I opened my mouth. Wash. U is a wealthy school! I do not think cost is a concern. I have a classmate who was born/raised in St. Louis and is a Wash. U business/law school graduate and is pressured to make donations.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 18, 2009, 02:10:59 PM
I am back.  After a scan of UAA web sites, the WBB teams size range from 14-16.  Wash. U has the largest at 21 and surprising, the U. of Chicago has 20!  I checked Emory, U.of Rochester, CMU and U. of Chicago.  I believe NYUU and Brandeis teams did not approach 20.  Have I missed any?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 18, 2009, 02:31:15 PM
I don't know if Wash U does this, but some schools in the midwest actually play a JV schedule.  Once again, a good way to mothball players and keep them away from the competition.  Wash U looks deep, but in close games they don't seem to go much beyond (with substantial minutes) the 8th or 9th player.  I think they match up well against Amherst, but they have to be troubled by how easily Amherst shut down UAA competition, particularly McEntee from NYU and point guard from Brandeis.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BBstudent on March 18, 2009, 02:33:07 PM
Possibly more important then how many players are on the team is the size of the school. Washington has approximately 6000 undergraduate students while most NESCAC schools are in the 2000 range. Amherst is 1600 +/- which would seem to be a huge liability in terms of the size of the pool you can draw from.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 18, 2009, 02:52:24 PM
Not necessarily -- this isn't high school where you have open tryouts and hang up signs around campus to bring people in. People play basketball at Division III schools because they were recruited to come there. The number of true walk-ons -- ones who would come to the team via the method you describe -- is very low, in my experience. You're not drawing from the student body -- you're putting people in the student body.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: mark_reichert on March 18, 2009, 04:20:38 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 18, 2009, 11:04:14 AM
I believe UAA limits traveling squad as well -- obviously there's a significant cost factor there.

Yes, and I think it is the NCAA roster limit of 15.  It's only regular season home games where the extra six suit up.  Granted, they were allowed to sit in their normal spots in the first two tournament games hosted by WashU, but they were in some black warmup/training suits.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: mark_reichert on March 18, 2009, 04:22:39 PM
Quote from: sumfun on March 18, 2009, 02:31:15 PM
I don't know if Wash U does this, but some schools in the midwest actually play a JV schedule.  Once again, a good way to mothball players and keep them away from the competition.  Wash U looks deep, but in close games they don't seem to go much beyond (with substantial minutes) the 8th or 9th player.  I think they match up well against Amherst, but they have to be troubled by how easily Amherst shut down UAA competition, particularly McEntee from NYU and point guard from Brandeis.

The WashU women have played JV games from time to time, but it is a very spotty schedule.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 18, 2009, 09:06:06 PM
  Being a larger school can help a very good school. That is, places like Wash U and Chicago can take in more tips than a smaller school because they have more regular students to balance things out. With US News hanging over all heads, no one wants to drop even a little as far as SAT scores go because a moderate drop can result in dropping a couple places in the ratings.
   Of course places like Bates, Bowdoin, and Middlebury don't think SAT's are necessary so they don't have to worry about scores. I would wager that many of the athletes at places that don't ask for SAT scores don't submit them. Don't ask=don't tell.
   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 18, 2009, 10:17:46 PM
I forgot about Case Western Reserve in the UAA.  The WBB team is the smallest with 13 members.  However, last year's squad had only 11.  Over the last 4 years the highest number of players was 14.  I guess that Wash. U's great MBB team is following in the footsteps of the WBB program.  Wash. U. men's team has a rooster with 20 players!  Both teams are going to the final 4 for the second time in three years.  Interesting trend here :).   Enough said on this topic.  I am going to get into deep waters here.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on March 19, 2009, 08:00:15 PM
I am admittedly not the most detail following fan of women's hoop...even in the NESCAC.

Question: If Amherst wins it all and brings home another title for the NESCAC, how many NESCAC rings would that be for the 2000's decade and does any other conference have more? I know Bowdoin and Bates used to do their thing and that Bowdoin one one or two titles.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: mark_reichert on March 19, 2009, 09:55:11 PM
Quote from: BBstudent on March 18, 2009, 02:33:07 PM
Possibly more important then how many players are on the team is the size of the school. Washington has approximately 6000 undergraduate students while most NESCAC schools are in the 2000 range. Amherst is 1600 +/- which would seem to be a huge liability in terms of the size of the pool you can draw from.

Pat's right and besides if that were true, NYU would dominate the UAA since its enrollment exceeds the next three largest schools combined, and is less than doubled by all other seven student bodies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_Athletic_Association

Mind you, a lot of those enrollment amounts are graduate students.  At least I know that to be true of WashU.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on March 21, 2009, 07:08:11 AM
There goes WashU again - running all over Amherst, the putative best of NESCAC. I suppose the principle applies to academics also.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 21, 2009, 08:52:39 AM
FrankU,  Your effort to be witty and to generate conversation is weak and negative.  There is another game this morning.  Will your comment apply after today's game.  On Amherst team's play, I felt that they looked flat and tired.   Mainly it was Wash.U's numbers and hustle/energy.  Though the rebounding difference was 11, it appeared more.  Wash. U was quicker to the boards and ball.  Wash. U had more foul shoots and made them.  Amherst's newest All-American had 4 points and very few looks at the ball...Wash. U's defense it appears.  To me, looking at the pt. guard and the leading scorer for Amherst, they looked like persons that had too little sleep; looked like runners that have "hit the wall" so to speak.  One more game to gain experience in the "bright lights".  It took the MBB team several trips to the final 4 to win it (three to be exact.)  Go Jeffs!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ethelred the Unready on March 21, 2009, 09:20:26 AM
Quote from: mark_reichert on March 19, 2009, 09:55:11 PM
Quote from: BBstudent on March 18, 2009, 02:33:07 PM
Possibly more important then how many players are on the team is the size of the school. Washington has approximately 6000 undergraduate students while most NESCAC schools are in the 2000 range. Amherst is 1600 +/- which would seem to be a huge liability in terms of the size of the pool you can draw from.

Pat's right and besides if that were true, NYU would dominate the UAA since its enrollment exceeds the next three largest schools combined, and is less than doubled by all other seven student bodies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_Athletic_Association

Mind you, a lot of those enrollment amounts are graduate students.  At least I know that to be true of WashU.

I think that's true at UR also.  I think the UG population is around 4200

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on March 21, 2009, 10:06:13 AM
My comments always have universal application (retrospective, current and prospective).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 23, 2009, 08:13:52 AM
Congrats to all four teams.  George Fox was the real deal as Wash U learned the next day.  As for academics, why even get into that arena here?  Check out US News and World Report rankings of Liberal Arts Colleges....enough said.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on March 23, 2009, 09:38:05 AM
Very few people refer to, much less rely on, USN&WR in making their life decisions.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 23, 2009, 09:59:56 AM
I don't know about that.  I looked at rankings in compiling my list of colleges to look at back in 2000.  It wasn't the only criteria, but it helped me survey the landscape.  And none of the colleges with rankings in their favor were afraid to trot those rankings out for people who were in the process of making life decisions.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on March 23, 2009, 10:15:38 AM
The man in the street doesn't know and doesn't care - and there are lots of men in the street for every person who looks at the USN&WR rankings.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: phil on March 23, 2009, 10:46:05 AM
The popularity of U.S. News college rankings is reflected in its 2007 release:

Within 3 days of the rankings release, U.S. News website received 10 million page views compared to 500,000 average views in a typical month. The printed issue incorporating its college rankings sells 50 percent more than its normal issues at the newsstand.

While the average man in the street may not know or care, there seems to be plenty who do.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 23, 2009, 11:36:25 AM
Quote from: frank uible on March 23, 2009, 10:15:38 AM
The man in the street doesn't know and doesn't care - and there are lots of men in the street for every person who looks at the USN&WR rankings.

The man in the street isn't applying for college.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 23, 2009, 06:02:44 PM
Interesting discussion but it doesn't relate too much to WBB and especially NESCAC WBB.  This is just another of Frank U.'s  comments stirring the "pot".
My congrats to all four teams in the Final 4.  However, I will admit that I was rooting for George Fox over Wash. U.  It is nice to see a small school with a good program winning over a large school with a dominating type program.  With Wash. U men's program becoming a dynasty like the WBB program, I really am wondering if maintaining large squads of 20 plus has anything to do with it.  The UAA WBB conference was great this year, but has it been this balance over the last five years?  Two schools have large squads and one has a very small squad.  Do their records reflect this difference?  I believe the NESCAC is more balance in both play, quality of players and size of squads.  The academic quality of players are the same for both the UAA and the NESCAC in my judgement.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: tothehole on March 23, 2009, 07:20:06 PM
Any bets the Jeffs are ranked outside the top 4 in the final poll.
What's the old saying what do Ephs and Jeffs have in common? They both got into Amherst,duh.
Congrats to the Lady Jeffs on a great run.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on March 23, 2009, 08:22:55 PM
yes, people look @ U.S. News and World Report, but it's not the bible. You need to use it as one of many sources.

NESCAC has many schools high on the list( 09 list online), followed by a mix of NEWMAC and UAA.
But they are not Ivy League.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on March 24, 2009, 07:41:16 AM
Most of the people who make the world go around have not heard of the USN&WR rankings, and the remainder ignore them on the basis that status seeking is a petty venture not worthy of their time.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 24, 2009, 12:13:48 PM
Frank uible,
  Your last post here.  I have pondered it and searched for a reason for it.  It can either be based on knowledge or ignorance.
 
Here is my response.  The majority of world movers and shakers, be they political or financial ones or even entertainers, all have something in common.  If they are family people, and have sincere concerns for the future of their children, they  have concerns about the education of their children.  Wherever they are, they want the best for their children.  They will prefer the "grey stone" universities in the UK, or Tokyo U. in Japan or Peking U. in China.  If it is the schools in the USA, they will seek info from friends and people in the know who in turn will seek data from references.  One such reference is the publication in question.

Having been involved in the admission/recruiting game for over 40 years in the Wash. D.C. area, I though not an "important" person but being acquainted with a number.  Like the political, financial leaders in NYC, the West Coast, the "college selection process" in the Wash. D.C. area is the same. 

Almost all the administrations officials from Ike to the present one, when schooling is involved, seek the best for their children.  Sadly, it even starts at times in Washington in the nursery schools.  The right lower schools in order to get into the right upper schools in order to get into the best colleges in order to get into the best professional schools.  The children of Presidents, members of Congress, Supreme Court Justices, Nobel Prize winners, hollywood powers, etc. have looked at and attended schools in the NESCAC.  Whether they personally referred to the same publications is another question.  They, however, all know about the best colleges and many such schools are listed in the subject mag.  The publication in question can be considered a reference to use for us "common folks".
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 24, 2009, 10:52:19 PM
This is truly a senseless repartee.   Any hoop news?  Recruits, coaching changes?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on March 25, 2009, 07:23:46 AM
True. Let's all agree to never mention the senseless USN&WR rankings or their ilk again. What is this obsession with forced ranking and digital quantification? Isn't it sufficiently more thoughtful and sophisticated to say that certain colleges are among those which might be good fits for certain students of certain general qualities? That is what people did before such rankings appeared on the scene.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 25, 2009, 11:55:30 AM
remsleep,
   Agree.  Your request for particular info brings up some questions.  New to the BB boards, I do not know much about  "recruiting" data for WBB.  As I mention on the MBB side, the admit letters for NESCAC are out and the next phase of "recruiting" begins.

   While the admitted students for say Amherst are in, it is now time to have them select Amherst over other schools that can range from Duke, Stanford, an ivy school or even another NESCAC school.  On the men's BB side, there are recruiting services that give one a lead on NESCAC recruits, especially in New England.  Are there equivalent sources/services for WBB? 

The only info that I know is that there is a coaching vacancy at Conn. College.  The NESCAC web site is one for such info and it quiet on the subject.  I do not believe the site ever provides recruiting info.   So how does this board get WBB recruiting info ?  In the past.

Looking in the local papers in my area, I often see data about top players going to a given school.  For example, a top woman soccer player coming to Amherst.  Info about WBB players going to schools are rare compared to MBB players in the local players....Div3 players in particular.

I am going to a local reception for admitted Amherst students in early April.  If there is a WBB player among the ones that show up,  I will let this board know.  Otherwise, who knows. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 25, 2009, 04:30:54 PM
Back again after scanning the NESCAC WBB sites for WBB news of interest.  If any.   
It is interesting to me that the Conn. College coach that resigned, was the WBB coach at the UAA member U. of Chicago prior to her appointment in CT.  The present squad count is quite small whereas the present squad count at the U. of Chicago is more than double that of Conn. College.  Recruiting problem?

The Williams WBB web site is surprising...at least today.  There is no first year players listed though the team picture show them.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 25, 2009, 05:39:33 PM
I think you're a little obsessed with this roster size thing, and I'm not sure it has nearly the impact as you think it does. The WIAC schools are successful, for example, with a conference-mandated 15-person cap on their rosters.

For Laura Hungerford's case, she was at Conn for eight years. Chicago is good now but that program was in the bottom half of the league when she left.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 25, 2009, 09:22:11 PM
Pat C.,
  Thanks for info on the Con. College coach.  I guess she may have been a weak recruiter everywhere.
Your opinion is accepted but I find it based on a weak foundation of info.  I am trying to generate discussion to make a better determination.  I can assure you that in a given conference, schools with small squad numbers will have poorer records than those that have consistently larger numbers in the long run, whether there is a conference limit or not.  If there is no correlation with squad size in BB, then why do certain schools have very large squads (as well as high numbers of assistants.)  Most schools have squads around 15, the mandated size for NCAA travel.  If the NCAA allowed raised the limit to say 18, I do believe that you will see squad size go up rather then stay at 15 or go down.  Conn College squad was 9 in a conference that the conference where the average squad size is 30-40% higher.  Even when one recruits good players, a larger size team improves the team play....via better practices, more experienced players around, more depth, etc.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 25, 2009, 11:00:03 PM
Yes, but having read your posts over the past week or so it sounds like you think it's the be-all and end-all. I don't think it is. There may well be a correlation between success and high roster sizes, but it may be a chicken-and-egg scenario. It could be that fewer people want to play for a team that's not successful and more want to play for a team that's successful, rather than more players making a team successful.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 26, 2009, 12:27:12 AM
Congrats to Amherst, its players and coaches. A great run. Many -- even the players and coaches themselves -- may view the last two games as a reflection of the season en masse, but that would be a mistake. Amherst represented the conference well and should be exceedingly proud.

Relatively speaking, the NESCAC is still a young conference (15 years, if memory serves) in terms of the NCAAs, and the student-athletes have always acquited themselves well. Some day down the road we'll get that national title.

To NESCACers and non, have a nice offseason.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 26, 2009, 10:02:20 AM
Sometimes large rosters are a function of who got in the school and who decided to come.  I had a UAA coach tell me once when I asked why the roster was so large and there were no JV games.  They said everytime they picked up the phone in the Spring a different kid said, "Hey, coach, I got in, I'm coming."  Some coaches prefer less than 15.  I believe Gromacki is one of those, while others by design have large staffs and take whatever they can get...ie Wash U.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on April 19, 2009, 03:16:35 PM
Any comments with Hamilton joining the NESCAC.  5 hour drive from Boston and 7 hour drive from Brunswick.  Ouch....that seems un-NESCACish.  I heard that scheduling is changing next year and boys and girls will try to travel together to save on costs.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on April 19, 2009, 06:46:02 PM
Mapquest says New London to Waterville is 4 hours and 53 minutes.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on April 19, 2009, 09:58:22 PM
I used mapquest also for the time from Bowdoin to Hamilton and Tufts to Hamilton.  Hamilton is a great school whose profile fits the NESCAC, but it will be a trek.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on April 20, 2009, 12:48:50 AM
No big deal - Hamilton already plays a NESCAC schedule for everything except basketball, lacrosse, and soccer.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on May 29, 2009, 07:31:59 PM
Did you see that retired Southern Maine coach is coming back to take the helm.  Will make it that much more difficult to get out of this region in the NCAAs. 

Also saw on men's boards that men and women will travel together in NESCAC this year to cut travel costs.  What affect does anyone see this having on the men's or women's programs.....good or bad?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on June 10, 2009, 08:56:47 PM
 I guess I shoulda kept my mouth shut
When I started to brag about my car
But I can't back down now because
I pushed the other guys too far

  I've gotten hundreds and hundreds of emails begging me to comment on the new Conn. Coach. I don't know what to say. I would bet anything he improves them but anyone with even a 2 digit IQ could come to the same conclusion.
  Holy Cross has not been the dominant team that they used to be before his (Coach Wilson) arrival but the head coach could be going stale. Or perhaps other teams have hired better coaches? I think it says something that Conn seems to realize that you have a much better chance of winning if you have a m-- as the head coach.
   If you hire a Gromacki you can look and see that he will probably win no matter where he ends up. That's why if I were on a search committee I would try to insist on a head coach. Yes I know you would miss out on some real good coaches.


 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on June 14, 2009, 11:27:10 AM
  Temper temper. Let's look at your response. Lori McBride played on a championship team and I didn't. That's true and it relates to my post as much as if you had said that Big Papi is having trouble adjusting to life without steroids.
   Shibles beat Gromacki-Well I agree she did. What you forgot to mention was that she also had to overcome the loss of Anelauskas and Leahy. True she picked up Rubega but Rubega was maybe not quite as valuable as Anelauskas.
   Gromacki on the other hand had it easy. All he had to do was replace 3/4 starters and 4 out of his first six as well as the best pg I've seen in NESCAC-a veritable cakewalk. (Pollack was great Senior year only)
    By the way I saw Muhlenberg and they were strictly a two trick pony, yet they beat Bowdoin.

M V W-Take a look at the number of responses and posts as far as NESCAC M and W are concerned-Look at the HUGE difference in posts and responses. Then factor in the fact that almost all of the posters for NESCAC women are men. Men, even in D3 live basketball all year round-They watch hundreds of games, they have endless discussions etc. etc. Women on the other hand seem to think behavior like that is not a life. No question you probably have a few women in D1 who are like men in that respect and maybe Pemper was one?
   For the most part they forget about basketball after the season-I mean where are they on this site?? Looking at the posts that appear right now you have 5 men and 3 women AT WORST!!  Personally I think it's 7 men and 1 woman but that could be wrong. I hope no one takes my guessing personal
  A couple years ago there were some women posters here but they wanted to talk about froyo forever.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on June 14, 2009, 01:22:20 PM
Not sure that a lack of traffic on the message board translates automatically to current women's players not working hard to get better in the offseason. In fact, I'm not sure how that even gets insinuated.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on June 14, 2009, 03:36:25 PM
 Pat I was talking about coaching-not players practicing to get better. In my opinion to be a good coach in terms of W's and L's you have to live, eat, breathe and sleep the game. You are free to maintain that women do but I am convinced they do not.
  How many women are watching the WNBA right now?-According to the stats I've seen not too many. How many are watching the NBA finals?-few  Most men's coaches are tuned in. You can learn by watching and so on. Few women throw themselves into the game like men do. This of course is simply my opinion.
   I will always maintain that Conn did the right thing and that it appears they are really interested in winning.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: kate on June 15, 2009, 01:28:52 PM
Hello, Senatorfrost!  Here's a woman, in the middle of a beautiful spring day, replying to your post about the lack of attention, enthusiasm, whatever for the women's game - both professional & collegiate.  i DO watch every WNBA game that we can get on our cable.  We also watch every college game available, all while attending our beloved Aggie women's games, & when we can fit em in, some of DeSale's, Moravian's & Muhlenberg's!  Yes, many times they are not as well attended, but we've noticed a definite hype in the sport with announcers, live stats, etc.  As for coaches, many of them are slightly younger with families, but they almost always have MALE assistants with what i assume would be male egos  ;), so if there is a tremendous discrepancy with W's & L's between men & women's coached teams i'd bet my bottom dollar that will be closing FAST! 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on June 15, 2009, 04:32:43 PM
Another female chiming in from the office, taking a coffee break from spreadsheets... :) ;D

As for myself, passionate is an understatement to how involved I am with the game, and I am certainly not alone in that regard. Do we have the numbrers in terms of fans and tv ratings like the guys, no...you're right about WNBA games relative to the general population SenatorFrost. But do the D3 female coaches throw themselves into the game in other ways (clinics, camps, videos, conference calls, books, etc...) Meet some female coaches in the conferences I follow (CCIW, UAA, WIAC), and I beg to differ with your uneducated opinion.

I usually cheer for the UAA, and one of the powerhouses within that "decent"  ;)  conference is this lady named Nancy Fahey and her 500+ wins and across the country are these two coaches Carol Simon (300+ wins) and the recently retired Janice Quinn (450+ wins)....I think they're pretty passionate  :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on June 15, 2009, 06:45:54 PM
While I agree with the previous posts regarding women's passion for the game, I wanted to talk about the senator's "claim" that male coaches are superior in the women's game. These days you have to be a REALLY REALLY good coach to get a position as a head coach of a women's team, especially in basketball. I guarantee that Gromacki was the only male finalist. I don't think that male coaches are better necessarily than female coaches, it's just that the males getting these jobs have to be very good. Coach Gromacki replaced one of the worst NESCAC coaches,  Billy McBride, who was a male  (p.s. Pollack was great throughout her entire career she just didn't play enough -- every game against Williams everybody in the stands  wondered why she didn't start-- Billy was that bad). I'm in support of female head coaches for women's teams but when a coach like Gromacki or any other great male coach comes along they are hard to turn down. If males and females were hired without gender taken into consideration, you would see more mediocre males coaching in the women's ranks.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on June 15, 2009, 08:38:13 PM
 Pollack was not great throughout her career. It always looked like she should be great. She could do things others just dreamed about but she'd get into games and wouldn't do well time after time after time. That's why she didn't start. I thought she was most talented/most skilled etc. but for whatever reason she did not bloom until Gromacki came.
  Great coaches? Not familar with Fahey but Carol Simon has underwhelmed me twice. She gets talent but with the open door/open wallet policy Deis has it's hardly a surprise. Simon showed no finesse. That's what I would call it but there is probably a better word.
   Did Fahey outcoach Gromacki? Not at all-she had a ton of talent. I thought Deis failed to play up to it's potential v Amherst. I also thought Bowdoin was best non tourney team I saw last year.
Personally I'm sort of a Mullen fan. Lately she's had a player or two each year and a bunch of scrappers who appear to give close to 100% Can she survive next year though?
    My favorite was Nora Bowman. 5% talent =95% attitude. A poor man's Kristi Royer.

  How can one tell if one is a REALLY REALLY good coach if all they've been is an assistant? This is not a challenging type of question. I'd really like to know. No sarcasm or hidden meanings here.
  It's my opinion that if you're coaching women in D3 that you should always keep things STRICTLY BUSINESS. Chit chatting should be kept to a bare minimum and you should never be buddies or anything close to it. I think what happens is that if you're chit chatting and relating then later on when you try and correct, criticize, or discipline that the action is taken personally and it shows up sometimes in a game where the player isn't totally on the ball and is maybe half a step behind because they're 'hurt' to some extent since there was a rapport/relationship.
   There people just got a good tip for free.
   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on June 15, 2009, 09:26:33 PM
Quote from: senatorfrost on June 15, 2009, 08:38:13 PM
Pollack was not great throughout her career. It always looked like she should be great. She could do things others just dreamed about but she'd get into games and wouldn't do well time after time after time. That's why she didn't start. I thought she was most talented/most skilled etc. but for whatever reason she did not bloom until Gromacki came.
 

My point was that a lot of players under McBride's reign underperformed and I don't think Gromacki "developed" Pollack into a player but rather but her in a position to be great.

Quote from: senatorfrost on June 15, 2009, 08:38:13 PM
How can one tell if one is a REALLY REALLY good coach if all they've been is an assistant? This is not a challenging type of question. I'd really like to know. No sarcasm or hidden meanings here.
 

I don't really know what your question is. Not to be sarcastic. I never once mentioned any assistant coaches in my prior post. To perhaps be clearer - I meant you have to be REALLY REALLY good to be hired as a male to get hired over a female. However, I don't understand where assistants fall in?

Gromacki got hired because he had a strong history as REALLY good head coach. Therefore, most males in the women's game are VERY strong coaches or they wouldn't have been hired in the first place over another female finalist. Thus, the ratio of strong male coaches, those who can actually get hired, is much greater in the women's game. As far as male assistants getting jobs in the female game it is highly unlikely because there is not much to separate them resume-wise from female candidates.  Most strong male coaches in the female game -- Southern Maine, Scranton,etc -- tend to be older and hired during a time when less females were coaching. Gromacki is certainly the anomaly in this group given his young age but is obviously a strong coach.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on June 15, 2009, 11:07:56 PM
  I never said Gromacki developed Pollack.  I did offer the observation that McBride did give her plenty of opportunities. I said she could do things others just dreamed about. To me that meant that while she always was theoretically capable of being 'great' it never happened until her senior year. The difference between Sr. and Jr. year was that she did really good things almost all the time as a Sr. There were only flashes as a Jr. along with a lot of mistakes, to's etc.
    There was probably a problem but if there was it wasn't (sheer) lack of opportunity.
  You said one has to be a REALLY REALLY good coach to get a job as a head coach in Women's basketball-Thus my question how can one judge if an assistant is a REALLY REALLY good coach? That question refers to the New Conn Coll coach and others. How can one tell anything for sure about an assistant? I would have missed out on Pemper, Berube and Gromacki at St. Lawrence. (Maybe Gear McBride?)I would have hired Davis and of course Gromacki in 2007. Obviously I'm not perfect at predicting. So how does one accurately assess an assistant?

   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on June 16, 2009, 08:25:12 AM
Having been out of town for a few days, I can't believe I missed so many posts.  I'm a woman who checks out D3 Hoops and the posts in all of women's bball.  I watch sports - men's and women's passionately.  In 2009 it's hard to believe that we're discussing the pros and cons of men vs women coaches.  It's more about knowing how to coach sports, not just the xoxoxo's, but players have to know you care.  I believe that close to a quote by Geno at UConn.  If they know you care then you can expect great things out of them.  You have to know as a person which players you can push and which you have to lay off....and when for both. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on June 16, 2009, 09:35:26 AM
Senator,

Sorry I did not clarify my post. I was saying that in order for a male to get a job over a female in women's basketball they need to be a very strong coach. Considering how desirable the NESCAC coaching jobs are and how many applicants they draw, if a male gets a job for a women's team, especially in the NESCAC, I know they are a very good coach.

As for your question about assistants..... assistants get jobs based most often on the recommendation of the head coach who they work under. The greater the coach they work under the more weight the recommendation carries. For example, at Williams College on the men's side, Coach Dave Paulsen had many great assistants who went on to move up to Yale and Rider as assistants and a couple of head coaching positions at D3 schools. I think people respected Coach Paulsen's opinion on the matter -- if he said they were good coaches, they were believed to be good coaches. The current new men's coach at Williams was an assistant at Creighton for a year, a D1 team that had 20+ wins the year he was there. At West Virginia he also won the NIT as an assistant and made the tournament his other year. I know he received strong recommendations on behalf of the head coaches at these programs and those coaches were right -- Williams recovered this year, the kids/parents/etc. all loved him and they are arguably favorite to win the NESCAC next year.

I just looked up who the new Conn College coach will actually be. He comes from Holy Cross, a patriot league school with similar academic/athletic values as the NESCAC. Head Coach Bill Gibbons is one of the more respected head coaches in the area and has made Holy Cross a dominant team in the Patriot league---they won 11 league championships in his 22 years. I'm sure he gave Wilson a great recommendation and that's why he got the job.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on June 16, 2009, 08:49:58 PM
 Hoops:
  I can think of three coaches from the Paulsen/ Hixon trees so to speak. (Luke Flockerzli hasn't been at Skimore long enough until next year in my opinion )
   Loeffler did well at Stevens but the other two have not come close to distinguishing themselves yet to put it mildly. How do you get a Gromacki or a Pemper if they come to you with no track record as a head coach? I think it's a crap shoot. That's why I would always go with the the head coach with a good record. I think it's a better bet overall.
   I took a look at the WNBA-13 teams. 8 Men head coaches and 5 women. That's not like college where you can overcome problems with great recruiting-It's just coaching and motivating etc. I might mention that there are those who think that Duke and North Carolina attract good players because of the Men's program through the years.
   I might add that a WNBA fan I know says that through the years Women coaches have crashed and burned quicker and more frequently than men. Anyway 8-5 in a women's league says something. No one will ever convince me that women  (as a group) throw themselves into the game with the same gusto/enthusiasm/passion etc. etc. as men. Not today anyway.
   I do believe that one day it will equal out, but not soon. This is JUST my opinion.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on June 16, 2009, 10:05:49 PM
Quote from: senatorfrost on June 16, 2009, 08:49:58 PM
Hoops:
 Loeffler did well at Stevens but the other two have not come close to distinguishing themselves yet to put it mildly.

Jimmy McCarthy is an assistant at Northeastern after being an assistant at Yale. Dane Fischer was an assistant at Rider and then followed Paulsen to Bucknell. John Fitzgerald has taken the more business/coaching approach to basketball after his assistant coaching stint and was Director of Basketball operations at Princeton and now does the same at Denver University. These guys are all under 30 years old - none of them are going to be head coaches at the D1 level yet but could certainly be in the future if not head D3 coaches in the near future as Loeffler has. I don't think it's fair to say that these guys haven't distinguished themselves.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on June 16, 2009, 11:10:51 PM
  I never heard of these guys. I was talking about one coach who is from the Paulsen tree who is now a D3 coach and one from the Hixon tree who is also a D3 head coach. They both seem to be improving lately but it's been a rough road.
  Being a good head coach is MUCH harder than most people think. Coaches do a lot of the same things that high level executives do.
   Speaking of NESCAC women, there are a couple coaches who are maybe a little worried that Conn is not likely to be a doormat for too much longer. I wonder where Nora Bowman is now??
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac hoops on June 17, 2009, 10:21:38 AM
Quote from: senatorfrost on June 16, 2009, 11:10:51 PM
  I never heard of these guys. I was talking about one coach who is from the Paulsen tree who is now a D3 coach and one from the Hixon tree who is also a D3 head coach. They both seem to be improving lately but it's been a rough road.

You are speaking of Devin Gotham who went on to be a head coach at MCLA. He took over a very awful team that is now just sort of awful -- so improved that they now appear in coach Hixon's extended
pre-season i.e. his non-conference schedule. Since MCLA, Gotham is ironically the WOMEN'S coach at his alma mater, Nazareth College. He took over a sub .500 team that is now +.500 and is apparently loaded with young talent (8 freshman, on of whom was on the all rookie team) that he recruited. The other guys who you "never heard of" were Paulsen's assistants on their national championship team and runner up team. Gotham and McCarthy (Fitzgerald was actually a senior captain) coached the championship team and Fischer and Fitzgerald coached the runner-up team.

Yes, I think hiring an assistant can be risky, but to answer your question, if they are to get hired its mostly from a strong recommendation from a strong head coach.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on August 03, 2009, 05:43:57 PM
So many of the other boards on the men and women's side are discussing incoming freshmen.  What's the news on the women's side around the NESCAC with new freshmen and/or transfers?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 06, 2009, 07:13:19 PM
It has been very quiet here.  Finally, the Amherst BB schedule is provided.  I guess the coach was trying to nail down the early opponents.  Amherst will be hosting two tournaments early in the schedule/season.  The first is the women's version of an established men's kick-off tournament.  The second one soon follows the first one and is in the time frame when the men plays a Springfield region tournament made up of area schools.   Also to note is the conference arrangement of having the women's teams traveling with the men's team.  In prior years, when the men's team was playing Trinity at home, the women's team would be playing away and vice versa.  Now both teams will play at the same site.  This I believe is due primarily to economize.
The team roster will not be available until practice starts.  Then we will see how the recruiting went!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on October 08, 2009, 09:22:02 AM
In preseason poll, Amherst starts off where they left off...#4.  No seniors, but young players with Final 4 experience.  Will be fun to see how new freshmen and transfer from Vermont contribute.  Bowdoin also in top 25, though they graduated their point guard from last year, they will still be very tough. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 08, 2009, 08:54:10 PM
Sumfun
  Good to hear from you.  The season is fast approaching.  You must have some inside connections.  I hope the Vermont transfer is a front court player.  Last year, many of the teams Amherst played  during its march to the Final Four had some large and talented players in the front court; in particular inside players.  Amherst needs some depth up front; rebounders.  Speed. talent and hustle as well as teamwork will carry you far. but depth is always need in a long season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on October 22, 2009, 08:13:50 PM
D3 Hoops poll has Amherst #2.  Some folks out there must value a team last year that started 3 sophomores and 2 freshmen and made it to the Final 4. Amh63 -  I think their inside/under the boards play will only improve.  Last year in the Final 4 the refs let the girls start the game physical and Amherst help their own even down a few inches in height.  When the refs started to call ticky tac fouls and Leyman and Daignault got in some foul trouble, that's when they need depth. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on October 30, 2009, 09:14:36 PM
What do Dolly Parton, Volbeat, Kitty Wells, Mike Ness and Emmylou Harris have in common with the majority of NESCAC men's and women's basketball coaches?

Hint-'for the future'

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BBstudent on November 06, 2009, 08:17:16 AM
to Amh63
"I hope the Vermont transfer is a front court player. "
The Vermont transfer is, I believe, a guard -  a tall (maybe 5' 9" or 10") guard but not front court
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on November 08, 2009, 06:06:29 PM
Why don't the NESCAC schools play pre-season scrimmages against DII or some of the smaller DI schools in the area like Wash U just played against S. Illinois?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on November 08, 2009, 10:49:23 PM
Quote from: sumfun on November 08, 2009, 06:06:29 PM
Why don't the NESCAC schools play pre-season scrimmages against DII or some of the smaller DI schools in the area like Wash U just played against S. Illinois?

Probably because of the NESCAC's strict limits on number of games that can be played in a season - scrimmages count against the limit.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Laserty on November 17, 2009, 05:47:37 PM
The D1 transfer is all of 6'1 and a guard... Most I guess wont be able to guard her.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: northernstar on November 17, 2009, 09:15:43 PM
I went on the website, and Amherst has her listed at 6' 0"!  I have known schools to fudge up on height, but it would be a story when a school understated a height!  It does have a glowing report of her in the team preview!  AMHERST SOUNDS LIKE THEY WILL BE VERY STRONG THIS YEAR!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on November 18, 2009, 07:30:37 AM
I read the same season preview, and I think they'll have a good season.  They do have a big bullseye on their back and Bowdoin is ranked very high also.  Also noted that the non-league competition is much more accomplished than the last two years.  They will be well tested.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 18, 2009, 02:32:32 PM
Sumfun,
  I replied to your question on the NESCAC football board.  The same answer relates to your question about why the conference do not have earlier games.  Wash. U and other D3 schools schedule their first games last Saturday because they can.  NESCAC games start this weekend...on Friday.  I believe this later start allows a significant number of multi-sport students make the transition from fall teams to winter teams.  In women BB, Rizzo at Amherst goes from soccer to BB.  A number of field hockey players go to ice hockey, etc.  For many conference schools, the ability to attract top players with Div. 1 abilities, to their programs is that in Div3, the students can continue to play more than one sport.
Whatever the true height of Ms. Jenner, she is listed as a forward.  I am sure that her ability to play guard will be utilized by the coach.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on November 18, 2009, 03:33:16 PM
Makes perfect sense to me.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on November 23, 2009, 11:41:29 PM
I was a little worried about Amherst's schedule this year, but I'm glad to see they've decided to keep the traditional non-conference powerhouses like Mount Holyoke, Lehman and Clark on the schedule again. It's always impressive to see student-athletes really challenge themselves in the classroom and the gym.

I'll assume that the evolving Baruch rivalry will just take a one-year hiatus and be back next winter.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on November 24, 2009, 07:00:23 AM
Your comment made me go look at the schedule and past games with those schools.  Holyoke and Clark are easy drives while kids in school.   Lehman gave them two good games last year.  Baruch will be a good test when I checked their website so I don't get your comment.  10 teams won 20 games or more, 6 teams from NCAA tourney.  Big improvement over last year, better than most NESCAC teams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on December 01, 2009, 01:57:52 PM
This is the first time in a while that someone has requested a Women's Basketball NESCAC spread, but here goes:

Amherst -11 Vs. Keene St
Over/Under: 110.5
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 01, 2009, 08:46:31 PM
Amherst by 25.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on December 02, 2009, 10:31:19 AM
Quote from: walzy31 on December 01, 2009, 01:57:52 PM
This is the first time in a while that someone has requested a Women's Basketball NESCAC spread, but here goes:

Amherst -11 Vs. Keene St
Over/Under: 110.5

Amherst 72
Keene St 47

Amherst -11 Vs. Keene St (Amherst Cover +14)
Over/Under: 110.5 (Over +8.5)

Not great but not terrible.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on December 08, 2009, 06:25:39 PM
Halftime--

#2 Amherst 53  #17 Emmanuel 13

Amherst shot 65.6% in the first half (21-32 from the field).  The Amherst defense held Emmanuel to 10% shooting in the first half.  (3-30 from the field.)

Amherst looks like they are capable of winning the national championship this season.  The Jeffs are heavily favored to go undefeated until they get to Bowdoin, and then, can the Polar Bears solve the problem of the Jeffs like Bowdoin did last season?   Amherst could finally get over the hump of Bowdoin right now the way the Jeffs are playing.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on December 08, 2009, 07:00:39 PM
Final

Amherst 85  Emmanuel 38

Amherst was up by 51 with a little over 11 minutes left in the game before cruising to the win.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 08, 2009, 09:43:17 PM
Great win for Amherst.  Emmanuel never got on track with Amherst's suffocating defense.  Looking at the stats before the game, I really thought that this was going to be a close. 

You're right Deis....Bowdoin will be the test, especially since it's in New Brunswick.  Until then, one game at a time.  Eastern Conn could also give them a challenge on Thursday if they let down.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on December 09, 2009, 04:45:02 AM
Bowdoin and Emmanuel already won at Eastern Conn this season, so it would be very disappointing if Amherst got a let down on Thursday and lost.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 09, 2009, 04:52:02 PM
Some observations after following several of the games on LS.
Renner has been getting more time at point.  C. Long has not returned yet from her injury.
C. Long replacement in the starting line-up is living up so far to her potential.
The three first year players are getting valuable minutes at critical times in the games.
Amherst all-american forward has not been needed to carry the team..with respect to points, and boards.
So far, Amherst has adjusted well in the games .....against stronger teams this season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on December 10, 2009, 12:29:49 AM
  What the LS won't tell you is how fast the replacement is. I'll tell you. She's very  fast with or without the ball and she plays very good defense too.  Her three point shot could use a little improvement but I'll be very surprised if she loses her place this year. It's always nice when someone improves from one year to the next as much as she has.
  Her name is Caroline Stedman.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on December 10, 2009, 04:59:23 AM
On another note, Caroline Stedman also happened to be a high school classmate of two players on the Brandeis women's soccer team-- so I happened to see her at one of the UAA women's soccer games this fall when Brandeis played Rochester.   The fan in me wanted to see a first semester rematch of the Elite Eight game between Amherst and Brandeis on the Auerbach Arena floor, but in retrospect, I am sort of fortunate that that rematch was not scheduled this season as a regular season game because I can imagine what probably would have happened if Amherst played the same level of defense against Brandeis right now that the Jeffs did in the Elite Eight match.    In the Elite Eight game, 27 of the 54 Brandeis points were scored by Cassidy Dadaos and Lauren Orlando.    Brandeis right now would have been hard pressed to make up those points against the Amherst defense.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on December 10, 2009, 09:13:32 PM
Quote from: sumfun on December 08, 2009, 09:43:17 PM
Great win for Amherst.  Emmanuel never got on track with Amherst's suffocating defense.  Looking at the stats before the game, I really thought that this was going to be a close.  

You're right Deis....Bowdoin will be the test, especially since it's in New Brunswick.  Until then, one game at a time.  Eastern Conn could also give them a challenge on Thursday if they let down.

that's Brunswick, Maine.
did one of Bowdoins starters get injured, i think henrikson? she hasn't played for a while?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: speedy on December 12, 2009, 02:04:23 AM
Quote from: pureshooter on December 10, 2009, 09:13:32 PM
that's Brunswick, Maine.
did one of Bowdoins starters get injured, i think henrikson? she hasn't played for a while?

Yup - she's injured - I don't know how long she will be out . . .
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: lefrakenstein on December 14, 2009, 01:41:33 PM
Quote from: deiscanton on December 10, 2009, 04:59:23 AM
On another note, Caroline Stedman also happened to be a high school classmate of two players on the Brandeis women's soccer team-- so I happened to see her at one of the UAA women's soccer games this fall when Brandeis played Rochester.   The fan in me wanted to see a first semester rematch of the Elite Eight game between Amherst and Brandeis on the Auerbach Arena floor, but in retrospect, I am sort of fortunate that that rematch was not scheduled this season as a regular season game because I can imagine what probably would have happened if Amherst played the same level of defense against Brandeis right now that the Jeffs did in the Elite Eight match.    In the Elite Eight game, 27 of the 54 Brandeis points were scored by Cassidy Dadaos and Lauren Orlando.    Brandeis right now would have been hard pressed to make up those points against the Amherst defense.

I hope the run of Amherst - Brandeis meetings in the elite 8 in either mens or womens bball continues. So far Amherst has gotten the better of both meetings, but there seems to be a decent chance of another womens meeting this year and an outside chance of a meeting on the men's side.

That '07-'08 men's game was so sweet... Brandeis was so confident they would beat us after they won in the regular season. Probably one of my favorite all time amherst wins.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3 new england fan on December 15, 2009, 02:08:26 PM
Brandeis won't be able to keep up their end of the bargain and make the elite eight....if they UAA is as tough as it usually is, the guard play at that level will eliminate Brandeis from NCAA tournament consideration, never mind a deep run into the tournament.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on December 16, 2009, 05:50:15 AM
I would also like to see a Brandeis-Amherst rematch in the NCAAs if possible.

As for a deep run in the NCAAs for the Judges this year-- I hope that is possible-- but that is not top priority on my mind right now.  The UAA has already booked Brandeis to host the UAA Indoor Track and Field Championships in the Gosman Fieldhouse on the weekend of March 5 and 6, 2010, (the track surrounds the Auerbach Arena court in the Gosman Fieldhouse) so both Brandeis basketball teams would most likely have to play the first weekend of NCAA tournament competition on the road this season should they be so fortunate to qualify.  Brandeis has yet to advance to the Sweet 16 by winning a second round game on the road in a regional.  (Both Elite 8 appearances occurred when Brandeis hosted in the first 2 rounds of the tournament.)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on December 23, 2009, 11:50:14 PM
Quote from: deiscanton on December 16, 2009, 05:50:15 AMAs for a deep run in the NCAAs for the Judges this year-- I hope that is possible-- but that is not top priority on my mind right now.

I shudder to think what is top priority on your mind. Wasn't that the basis for much of the Saw movie franchise?

Speaking of horror shows, is it too late to get another rant from Senator Frost about the evils of female basketball coaches? It's certainly film noir, but entertaining nonetheless.

Can't wait to see the end of the cut-throat Amherst non-conference schedule. Let's see, we've got Lehman, Clark and...wait for it...Bridgewater State! Phew, it looks like the Lady Jeffs statistical victory for widest victory margin is safely in the books.

"Amherst Women's Basketball: We'll play the terrible teams no one else wants to."

(Too long for a T-shirt?)

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on December 24, 2009, 01:49:59 AM
Quote from: feces monkey on December 23, 2009, 11:50:14 PM
"Amherst Women's Basketball: We'll play the terrible teams no one else wants to."

(Too long for a T-shirt?)

:D :D :D
+1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BBstudent on December 24, 2009, 07:04:08 AM
Quote from: feces monkey on Yesterday at 11:50:14 pm
"Amherst Women's Basketball: We'll play the terrible teams no one else wants to."

It seems almost too simple to need repeating, but here goes. In commenting on the schedules one should keep in mind that most of the student athletes graduate within four years. This leads to constant turnover which results in programs that may have been good one year not being as good another year. So, for example, Lehman last year had an All-American and did fairly well while this year they are probably not as strong.
In addition to guaranteed turnover every four years a certain number of girls stop playing during their careers which also leading to variation in the strength of programs from year to year. How can the Amherst coach know the strength of each schools recruiting class or which players may drop out, get injured or burn out?
Second, in order to keep every year from being a completely new adventure in scheduling, programs agree to multi-year home and home games which over time will average out player turnover. And that doesn't even take into consideration that coaches may schedule games against certain programs irrespective of the basketball benefits.
Finally, schools like Baruch, Emmanuel, Keene and Western CT State all have good records with their loss to Amherst usually being their first loss. If you look at the schedules of all those teams would you have been able to predict their won-loss record before the season started?
Things that look very clear in hindsight sometimes were not quite so clear looking forward. Just try to predict just for those four teams which games they will win for the rest of the year. Or predict where Amherst will end up in February or (I hope) in March.
So, while I will give you credit for a pithy one liner ("we'll play the terrible...") it makes me think somewhat less of your ability as a basketball analyst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 24, 2009, 09:15:55 AM
Feces....nice try, but looking at NESCAC website and clicking on schedule of each team,  many of the same teams that Amherst plays are played by the other NESCAC teams.  This schedule is a big improvement over two years ago.  I agree with BB, teams change from year to year.  Also Amherst isn't traveling during break for some reason so they don't have a chance to play teams outside of Northeast.  I think Gromacki will have them ready for league and tourney time.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on December 25, 2009, 02:33:36 AM
  Men coaches are definitely better than almost all women's coaches but they are not better than women NESCAC coaches in Maine. Those mainers are three times better than any man. There are many reasons for this. One reason is Maine Women's NESCAC teams have the best fans. They are a really super knowledgeable bunch, far more sophisticated and smarter than stupid Amherst fans.
  The only state where the fans come close to Maine is West Virginia. Some would insist they're  too close, but that's the way it is in Maine and W.Va..
One day women coaches outside of Maine will be as good as men coaches. Men coaches will never be as good as women NESCAC coaches in Maine, and fans of Women's NESCAC basketball in Maine will always be better than all other fans. Their brillance is wicked awesome as well as amazing.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on December 30, 2009, 12:24:14 AM
Quote from: BBstudent on December 24, 2009, 07:04:08 AMIn commenting on the schedules one should keep in mind that most of the student athletes graduate within four years. This leads to constant turnover which results in programs that may have been good one year not being as good another year. So, for example, Lehman last year had an All-American and did fairly well while this year they are probably not as strong.
In addition to guaranteed turnover every four years a certain number of girls stop playing during their careers which also leading to variation in the strength of programs from year to year. How can the Amherst coach know the strength of each schools recruiting class or which players may drop out, get injured or burn out?

Simple solution: trade in Lehman, Clark, and Baruch for Southern Maine, Salem State, and Brandeis. That way Gromacki doesn't have to worry about "the strength of each schools recruiting class or which players may drop out, get injured or burn out." Or would this dig too deep into the Amherst philosophy of playing teams with an "All-American [that] did fairly well, while this year they are probably not as strong?"

Quote from: senatorfrostOne day women coaches outside of Maine will be as good as men coaches. Men coaches will never be as good as women NESCAC coaches in Maine, and fans of Women's NESCAC basketball in Maine will always be better than all other fans. Their brillance is wicked awesome as well as amazing.

(nodding)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 30, 2009, 05:42:27 PM
Nice upset by Trinity of Thomas More yesterday.  Way to go.  I saw Thomas More play a while back and they had a big, athletic center.  If she's still there, then Trinity must have done a nice job neutralizing her. Watch out NESCAC, if Trinity thinks it can upset a ranked team they will be gunning for Bowdoin, Tufts and Amherst.  Can't wait for NESCAC games to start!!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Laserty on January 07, 2010, 02:00:34 PM
Crazy game yesterday with Amehrst at Wesleyan. Amherst mojo was interrupted by a 45 minute long fire alarm in the middle of the first half. Still won by nearly 30...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 09, 2010, 09:27:43 PM
Easy game today for Amherst at Williams.  On paper, it looked like it should be that way, but nothing like Amherst vs Williams to level the playing field.  With Bowdoin losing today, Amherst is the only unbeaten team in the NESCAC.  Still think Tufts and Bowdoin will be tough games for Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 10, 2010, 01:46:20 PM
Really surprised about the Bowdin lost yesterday.  Quick glance at the stats. shows that they lost the battle of the boards.
With regards to the Williams/Amherst game, the score did not show Amherst dominance.  In the second half, Amherst finished the game with 4 subs, including two first year players!
Interesting side note.  The leading scorer for Williams was a first year player, Grace Rehnquist, from MA.  I believe she is the daughter of an Amherst graduate....Jim Rehnquist '77 who was a great BB player for Amherst and held the scoring record up until the mid 90's.
I believe, Amherst will be ready for their Maine trips after facing a full house of Williams fans.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 11, 2010, 03:43:38 PM
I have noticed that C. Long is back in the lineup and getting some playing time.  However, in the last several games the name of a starter has been missing.  She is not even listed as a possible player.  Is this due to an injury? 
I will check on the LS tonight to see if she is back. (Kim F)
If I do not hear from any poster on the matter, I hope to check on the matter when I am up at Amherst this weekend...to watch the Wes. and Conn. games live.
If any posters are planning to attend the games at Amherst, look me up.  I am the grey haired old man in the purple sweater yelling at the officials.  I can offer to buy you a soft drink. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BBstudent on January 11, 2010, 07:40:26 PM
With respect to Kim F of Amherst being out of the lineup, she is letting an injury heal and will be out for awhile - She originally hurt her foot in the Emmanuel College game going for a loose ball but has been playing through it.
One comes back from injury so another has to go out - universal karma
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 12, 2010, 11:41:25 AM
Thanks BBstudent!  Universal karma?...nice touch but in my opinion, somewhat limiting viewpoint.  Like...one giveth and one taketh away.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 15, 2010, 10:56:52 PM
Let the fun begin.  Williams upsets Tufts.  The Nescac season is underway.  Certainly that won't be the only surprise of the season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on January 16, 2010, 10:17:00 AM
If the is some way to get this clip from Williams, this would make, I imagine, for a good buzzer-beater feature, sounds like a cool and unusual play:

With the game knotted at 57 points apiece, Williams junior Chessie Jackson and first-year Claire Baecher teamed up for a perfect give and go play on the final offensive possession of the game to defeat the 11th-ranked Tufts Jumbos (12-2, 0-1 in the NESCAC), 59-57.

Baecher ended up in a trap in the corner, but using her 6'3" frame, she managed to pass the ball to Jackson on the left wing.  Jackson found her teammate running along the baseline for a back door pass.  Baacher finished with a reverse lay up with 0.7 seconds left on the clock for the winning basket.  Williams (12-4, 1-0) halted Tufts 12-game win streak, and tallied its first conference win and first victory over a ranked opponent this season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Laserty on January 16, 2010, 05:58:03 PM
Saw that Colby upset as a possible. Not that surprised.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on January 16, 2010, 08:02:52 PM
OMG!
2 home losses for the polar bears already. they bricked their 3-pointers and Colby had 3 times as many free throws, cause Bowdoin got whistled for 7 more fouls, at home, imagine that!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Laserty on January 17, 2010, 06:26:38 PM
@ pure, I don't know whos side you're on. My sarcasm sensor is tingling.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 18, 2010, 03:46:49 PM
Richard Stockton gives Amherst a good game today.  The 15 point margin of victory for Amherst all game in the second half.  They got a test today, shot the ball poorly, and still came out on top.  Good teams win on bad/ugly days.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 18, 2010, 05:01:26 PM
Agreed sumfun.  Turned on the game at the half and saw the score and the stats.  Was wondering if the trip down right after two games over the weekend and the early start had took its toll.  I am sure the coach had scheduled the game to see if his team can respond to travel and a game after an emotional weekend.  Richard Stockton has good players and their bigs are good.  Amherst has two player on crutches now, on a team of only 12 players.  Bridget, their 6'1" first year player is out and Kim F. is also on crutches.  One of the players just had an operation and will be out for 4 weeks.  It relates to a broken foot!  The player in question is ? I spoke to the player's mother on the matter, but due to the noise and my age, I forgot the name.  In any case, the depth of team diminished somewhat.  With a long period of away games coming up, depth comes into play.  The positive side to the early blow outs is that the new players and others have had increased playing time and the coach has had time to evaluate different lineups/rotations in different situations and at different times of the games.  Game experience is valuable with the conference games ahead.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 18, 2010, 08:17:31 PM
Hey Pure....Maybe they've found some refs from outside of Maine to ref the games fairly.  Playing at Bowdoin has usually meant an additional 5 to 7 fouls for the away team....5 to 7 at the least.  Don't have any stats to back that up....just feels that way.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Laserty on January 19, 2010, 09:59:27 AM
What's amazing to me is the strength of schedule that richard stockton has. Just go through their schedule and look at the records and rankings of the teams they have lost to. Much better than their record says.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 22, 2010, 02:32:30 PM
Big weekend in the NESCAC.  Will be interesting to see if anyone comes out unscathed as Bowdoin, Colby and Tufts go head to head.  Amherst just has game with Trinity who I think knocked off Thomas More, so Amherst shouldn't take this game lightly.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 26, 2010, 09:42:06 AM
Looking at the Trinity game, I was struck by the fact that Amherst's starting point guard was not listed.  The first year point guard, Voight played very well over several games.....i.e. the Conn. game which I saw live.  However, does anyone know the reason of the "missing point guard".  Was the coach resting her and looking at backup personnel?  There was some sickness going around at Amherst that had hit some of the men's BB players.  The starting point guard, Finnicane, had her left forearm well wrapped when I saw her in both the Wes and Conn games.
I was struck by the missing point guard during the Trinity game since the men's team also had its starting point guard missing during the Trinity game.   Strange similiaritiy.
Oh yes, my memory returns.  The first year player out with a broken foot is the center, Bridget C.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 28, 2010, 06:42:39 AM
Tough to win at Bowdoin even with Bowdoin having two losses in the league. Amherst will have to bring their A-game to win on a court where they haven't had much success..  Seems like Amherst is kind of knicked up which could be a factor also.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 29, 2010, 10:52:12 PM
Amherst broke the jinx at Bowdoin.  Amherst was up by 15 with 30 seconds to go.  Turnovers resulted in 6 points by Bowdoin.  Though the fouls were about even, the foul stats jumps out.  Bowdoin seemed to get and made more foul shots....The strange Maine homecourt calls.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on January 29, 2010, 11:10:54 PM
  I started watching the women's game and turned it off because the screen kept freezing. Also the sound was very bad. So combining the freezing with the small screen, I couldn't tell the first thing about the fouls. I came back for the men's game but that was even worse.
  As far as refs go, last year at Amherst the refs handed Bowdoin women the game on the proverbial silver platter. Talk about bad calls. If I didn't know any better I'd say the game was fixed but of course that's hard to believe in D3. I realize that.
   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on January 30, 2010, 11:15:40 AM
  A nice win for Amherst last night. According to what I just read, the lead would have only been 5 with 3 1/2 min. left if a three pointer had not been waved off. Amherst was 50% from three so it's hard for me to get too excited because it seems with that kind of shooting the lead should have been larger at that point. BUT it was a win.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 30, 2010, 12:40:44 PM
A win is a win especially with some injuries on the bench for Amherst and some just coming back after missing a game.  I had trouble with the webcast also.  Very bad sound, and to keep the picture moving I had to keep my cursor moving especially when I went to full screen mode.

Jeffs had better be careful of not letting down against Colby today after being so up and focused on Bowdoin.  Colby has height and some shooters.

Bowdoin announcers were talking last night about Bowdoin being the second best team in the NESCAC.  They seem to have forgotten about Tufts.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 30, 2010, 03:56:52 PM
Wow, Bowdoin pulls off a close one after Trinity led most of the game.  Tough to close the deal on the Polar Bear's home floor.  Amherst wins by 20 or so, but it was close until the very end against Colby.  Didn't think that Amherst would come out of this weekend still unbeaten.  They could be the "real deal."  Williams stays atop the league by taking care of business against Middlebury.  The next two weekends will be big.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on January 31, 2010, 06:31:54 PM
Amherst is solid - very impressive. 

No homecourt advantage in either game (Amherst or Trinity) in terms of the officiating. 

Amherst actually had the bias benefit for some reason -- and I could call out a few in particular that changed the next few plays -- but I don't think it affected the game and certainly not the outcome.

I'm starting to think that the NESCAC board is actually an affiliate of the History channel.  Does anyone here actually go to the games??? 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on January 31, 2010, 07:09:51 PM
  I've seen Amherst many times through the years. I go to almost all of the big games except this year I had to miss the Keene St. game which relatively speaking, would have to be called a 'big game' I also missed the Fairleigh Florham game. Western Ct. is the best team I've seen this year.
   Maine is a little too far and the only watchable webcast seems to be Tufts.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on January 31, 2010, 07:12:00 PM
  Forgot to mention I also went to the Springfield game and was sorry I bothered. Not much of a game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on January 31, 2010, 07:58:12 PM
I was referring to NESCAC games as a whole, not just Amherst games. 
There seems to be about 4 or 5 people here who actively post and I have yet to read (other than Amherst) anything from anyone who actually attended a game.  Why is that?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 01, 2010, 07:14:15 AM
Good question.  Where are the Tufts, Williams, Colby, Bowdoin, etc etc fans?  They post on the men's side, and with this year's format of women playing first, they hopefully see some of the womens' games. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BBstudent on February 01, 2010, 09:14:58 PM
Amherst women #1 for (I am fairly sure) the first time ever. And, as has been pointed out by other posters, they did it without being at full strength - the point guard missed two games, another starter has missed eight games and their first sub in has also missed at least one game.
A real team with many players each one stepping up and making unique contributions when needed.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jumpshot on February 02, 2010, 08:37:48 AM
In my opinion, this ranking, while well earned by the players, reflects what the "General Manager" does.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 02, 2010, 06:18:35 PM
which means.....the coach is super????  The AD hired a great coach????  The coach recruits well???
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on February 03, 2010, 12:18:26 PM
jumpshot - in addition to the questions raised by sumfun, are you referring to the AD when you say GM?  Because at Amherst the AD is the previous women's BB coach I believe -

Exceptional D3 coaches are rare.  Gromacki is one of the best in the nation IMO. 
I think you'll see NESCAC turned on its heels in the next few years.  New(er) coaches are going to bring records that surprise - and new dominant teams.

It's all about the coaching.  And to jumpshot's point (?) - the ADs hire the coaches.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 03, 2010, 03:10:11 PM
Amherst AD came from Bates.  She's been at Amherst 3 or 4 years and did hire Gromacki.  One of the former Amherst bball coaches is the Smith Head Coach.  The other is an Assistant AD at Amherst.  He also used to coach football.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on February 03, 2010, 04:21:43 PM
Interesting sumfun.  I was thinking about the Assistant AD - McBride.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 03, 2010, 05:56:24 PM
McBride is a former wide receiver coach for the football team....he played some pro football.  Nice man, but out of his element coaching women BB.   The AD at Amherst was the former AD at Bates.  Her son played soccer for Amherst.
Saw the women play over the Wes/Conn weekend live.  What impressed me most, while watching live, was the fast pace of play by Amherst.  The players really like to push the ball up and both point guards do not hesitate to put up three's...confident that their teammates will get any missed shots.  Often the opponents are not in any defensive sets and/or out numbered by the Amherst team.  The quick fast Stedman thrives in this style of play.  You better run and play defense if you want to play for Amherst.  Did the coach play this style of game when he was at St. Lawrence and had a team that was ranked as high as 2nd?
I do not pick up the speed of the play while watching online.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on February 03, 2010, 06:33:40 PM
Every game is faster in-person.  Video stream just doesn't catch speed nor intensity for that matter.

Amherst's strength (IMO) is its balance.  Yes, they play strong D and they can take off (run and gun) and control the ball in the backcourt - but so do some other NESCAC teams.  Amherst, however, is the best shooting team I've seen this year and I've seen 19 or 20 games live in the Northeast so far.

They also move the ball effectively in the air -  I've seen several teams that dribble all day and then make desperate passes to beat the clock - way too much offense happening slow on the ground - not enough in the air.  Amherst's timing is better than that.  Much better.

Fast and solid passing; offense that mixes it up;  decent M2M "d" without over-playing; solid perimeter and FT shooting; strong on the boards.  Man -- what's not to like?

Colby's team is young and starting to kick it up a notch.  I like their size and their upside but they have some holes to fill.

I think Tufts is probably over-rated.   Middlebury seems to be waking up for the first time in a few years so that might be interesting - haven't seen them live yet - looking foward to it.  Williams also. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on February 04, 2010, 12:23:08 AM
I would assume that some folks are looking forward to the Tufts-Amherst game this weekend.  Having seen both teams play I cannot imagine Tufts being within 20 points of Amherst....however, the asinine way that the NESCAC schedules conference play has Amherst in Lewiston, ME for a 6PM game on Friday followed by a 2PM game in Medford the next day.....at least Tufts plays these two dates at home.  Therefore, let's say it will be Amherst by 13 due to fatigue.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 04, 2010, 07:43:24 AM
How about those regional rankings.  Not quite sure why there are 10 in New England region, but 5 of the top 6 are NESCAC schools.  Massey Ratings still has Wisconsin IAC a bit above the NESCAC, but I'll take the New England Smalls anyday for academic schools in gorgeous locations with great women's basketball.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on February 04, 2010, 04:41:04 PM
DIII Champions:

1982 Elizabethtown
1983 North Central
1984 Rust
1985 Scranton
1986 Salem State
1987 UW-Stevens Point
1988 Concordia-Moorhead
1989 Elizabethtown
1990 Hope
1991 St. Thomas
1992 Alma
1993 Central
1994 Capital
1995 Capital
1996 UW-Oshkosh
1997 New York U.
1998 Washington U.
1999 Washington U.
2000 Washington U.
2001 Washington U.
2002 UW-Stevens Point
2003 Trinity, Texas
2004 Wilmington
2005 Millikin
2006 Hope
2007 DePauw
2008 Howard Payne
2009 George Fox

With 3-4 teams in the Top 25 this year -- each of which has a young roster of impact players -- we might see a NESCAC team on the list very soon! 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 06, 2010, 03:50:25 PM
The Amherst/Tufts game was a tight one with Amherst prevailing by nine..after being down 6 at the half.

The Amherst speed prevented Tufts fast break.  Interesting rotation by Amherst.  Amherst soph forward from Chicago has not really played much in the past two games.  She was a key player last year and early in this season.  Her length could have been used today.  It seemed like a physical game and when S. Leyman was taken out with fouls, the game changed for the worst for Amherst.  Instead of height/experience, a first year point guard entered...Voight.  Does anyone know what is "wrong" with L.A.?
In any case, a good win and the chance for an undefeated reg. season continues.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 06, 2010, 03:56:50 PM
My apology to comment in riddles/third person.  I am afraid to misspell a player's name.  The forward is Lem A. McCormick.  the Frosh pt. guard is Voigt vice my misspelling.  Anyway, Amherst needs her height/talent. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 08, 2010, 02:14:15 PM
Bates came to play against Amherst on Friday night, but the OVER HEATED conditions in their gym really work to their advantage as they are used to playing in a sauna.  On Saturday Amherst learned what it takes to come from behind.  Good experience for later in tourney play.  Williams really seems to be coming into their own.  Big win over Bowdoin setting up a great match up on Friday for home court advantage in the NESCAC tourney.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on February 08, 2010, 04:28:02 PM
How big a lead did Bates manage in the infamous sauna?

Williams has some very nice plays - their defensive trap on the wing is a gem - and on offense, they are organized -- which maximizes their skill level.  They get their shots off with ease and confidence.  Calm, organized, Obviously well coached -- nice to team to watch.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 08, 2010, 04:58:29 PM
I don't think Bates ever had the lead, but Amherst could never put them away, and it felt like Bates was could grab the lead at any time.

I recommend wet towels and ice packs for players necks, legs etc for any visiting team in that gym.  Take note this weekend Tufts.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on February 10, 2010, 09:17:53 AM
Where's the monkey?  He hasn't posted in a couple months when he could be insisting some of us eat some crow - and do some crowing of his own about his forecasts.  Hat's off to him. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 11, 2010, 04:06:26 PM
Seems to be a little quiet on the board as the regular season finish heads into this weekend.  Amherst with a win over Williams on Friday can be seeded first, I believe.  Hope the team can focus on the games ahead.
Seems my question about Lem McCormick was answered at the Bridgewater State game.  In 17 minutes, Lem scored 25 pts., pulled down 10 rebounds and blocked 5 shots.  It was good to see Bridget back on her feet even if for a few minutes.  Dido wrt to C. Long and Dunlevey.  Saw the game on the web in the second half.  Noticed that Amherst all-American was end for only 5 min.  Hoping here that she is preparing for the weekend.
Anyway, will miss seeing the team live this weekend.  Weather conditions in the Nation's Capital have messed up my travel plans with few options available.  Go Jeffs!
Shouldn't the seedings for the conference tournament be important?  Where is the chatter?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 11, 2010, 10:57:56 PM
Ill Wesleyan lost to Carthage and the #1 spot.....and Carthage was a team they had beaten by around 30.  Could Amherst take Williams too lightly after beating them by 25ish on Williams court?  Seems like they are focused girls and Gromacki always draws up excellent game plans.....but it is The Williams Game.  Williams could also have a let down after big game on Saturday night and lose on Trinity's home court.  Will all be worth watching. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on February 12, 2010, 08:34:59 AM
Carthage is hitting its stride and peaking at the right time, plus there's less difference between ILW and Carthage right now than there is between Amherst and Williams.  Amherst won't take anything for granted and will be ready.  I'd love to see "The Williams Game" in-person though.  Two very well coached and capable teams should make for a great game. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 12, 2010, 01:37:24 PM
I wouldn't be so hard on Bowdoin coach Shibles (sp?).  She was the only one to beat Gromacki twice last year.  She's had a major drop in talent with the loss of the senior point guard from last year.  If she recruits well, she'll keep the program strong.  You are right about the Colby coach being legit.  I think it's neat that NESCAC has attracted two women coaches from quality D1 programs....Colby coach who played for Hatchel at North Carolina and Tufts coach who played for Geno at UConn.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on February 13, 2010, 10:05:14 AM
Quote from: sumfun on February 12, 2010, 01:37:24 PM
You are right about the Colby coach being legit.  I think it's neat that NESCAC has attracted two women coaches from quality D1 programs....Colby coach who played for Hatchel at North Carolina and Tufts coach who played for Geno at UConn.

Thanks but it was fecesmonkey's post - not mine.  It seems, much to my chagrin, that h/she is no longer active - so I decided it was not a good idea to quote him in his absence - even though his prediction appears to have been quite accurate - it was probably a little rough so I deleted it.

I think it's great when NESCAC teams attract both credentialed and talented coaches with exceptional bball acumen - regardless of gender or D1 (vs D3) experience.
D3 has very few outstanding women's basketball coaches.  And exceptionally few superstar (going pro) athletes.  While a good coach can't make a great team from bad players, a bad coach, can ruin a team with "decent" players, and a great D3 coach can make it rain with "decent" players. 

Gromacki's going to make it rain for awhile (maybe a long while) and anyone who loves women's basketball will be happy about it -- not busy worrying about how many men vs. women coaches are in the NESCAC.  Ask any female athlete if they prefer one gender over another in a coach if one is talented and the other is mediocre.  Hands down they want the better coach. 

What really deserves discussion is why we don't pay our D3 coaches more.  Now that's a subject that can change the game....       

Meanwhile, I hope it ends up Amherst and IW in the D3 championship.  It'll be a great match-up for true fans of the game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Laserty on February 13, 2010, 11:05:02 AM
In other news... How does the seeding work beyond Amherst's  #1 spot. Assuming colby, williams, and tufts win today who is 2, 3, and 4? Colby beat williams, williams beat tufts, and tufts beat colby. All will be 7-2, assuming they all win....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on February 13, 2010, 01:06:13 PM
NESCAC tie-breaking procedures explained here:

http://www.nescac.com/sports/wbkb/2009-10/championship/index

Scenario:  Amherst finishes 9-0 in NESCAC play, and Colby, Tufts, and Williams all finish 7-2 in NESCAC play.

Answer:  Since no other tie-breakers will settle the seeding, the names of Colby, Tufts, and Williams would be placed in a hat at the end of conference play today (assuming all 3 teams win today) and drawn out randomly.   The first team drawn out randomly will get the #2 seed, the second team drawn out will be the #3 seed, and the last name drawn out will be the #4 seed.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Laserty on February 13, 2010, 01:21:16 PM
So assuming no upsets occur, then that is looking like the case. I think Williams has a slight chance of losing as well as tufts. Colby is a lock.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on February 13, 2010, 04:38:34 PM
Bates pulled off the upset, 71-55, over Tufts today.  Bates took the lead from the opening tip and never looked back.

Tufts finishes at 6-3 in NESCAC play and will be the #4 seed.

NESCAC Quarterfinal matchups-- Saturday, February 20

#8 seed Wesleyan at #1 seed Amherst-- 3 PM
#7 seed Trinity (CT) at #2 seed Colby-- 2 PM
#6 seed Bates at #3 seed Williams-- 2 PM
#5 seed Bowdoin at #4 seed Tufts-- 3 PM

Wesleyan and Middlebury finished tied at 2-7 in NESCAC play, however Wesleyan defeated Middlebury in the head-to-head tiebreaker to get the #8 seed.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 13, 2010, 06:32:00 PM
I thought Bates might pull off that upset.  They were game against Amherst, and that gym was probably even hotter than before.  Wonder if the league can do something about the heat factor at Bates.  Not good for fans, not good for players.  Congrats Amherst on a great season!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Laserty on February 15, 2010, 12:06:26 PM
How many NESCAC teams do we think could get NCAA bids? 4? Could be the most represented conference in the tourney. Amherst is a lock, Colby is virtually a lock. Then 2 bids between Tufts, Bowdoin, and Williams?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 17, 2010, 03:36:35 PM
Tufts will make it as they are still in the top 25.  Williams and Bowdoin will depend on how they do in conference tourney.  4 teams would be great, but not sure NCAA will go for that.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 18, 2010, 06:13:59 PM
The most recent NCAA regional rankings has four NESAC teams ranked high, with Bowdoin the lowest.  On the men's board, there is much chatter about where the conference teams will be put.  If there are 4 teams for the women's NCAA, the placement of the teams should lead to much speculation.  Out of region, in region, etc.  Any thoughts if Amherst, Colby, Tufts and either Williams or Bowdoin  get selected.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on February 18, 2010, 06:47:50 PM
Sumfun--

The D3Hoops.com Top 25 poll has nothing to do with the selection process.  

However, I have been analyzing all 5 NESCAC teams with the primary criteria and secondary criteria given by the NCAA in mind, and I can make a even stronger case for the NESCAC deserving all 5 of their women's teams in this year than I could for the UAA last year.

Last year, the UAA got 4 teams in (Wash U with the automatic bid, and Pool C's going to NYU, Rochester, and Brandeis).

I made an argument then that Chicago, with a .680 regional percentage (17-8 regional record) and a high enough strength of schedule, was just as deserving of a Pool C on primary criteria.   However, Chicago did not get in, and the reason why they did not get in was because they suffered an in-region loss to Carroll in non-conference play-- their only in-region loss to a team not regionally ranked.   Carroll finished 13-10, 8-8 in the Midwest Conference last year.   Had Chicago beaten Carroll, then the Maroons would have been in the NCAA field with an 18-7 regional record.

Right now, all 5 NESCAC teams regionally ranked have regional percentages over .700, and all 5 of those NESCAC teams will finish with regional percentages over .700 no matter what happens in the NESCAC tournament.  This is very important this year because we have 5 teams with perfect in-region records in DIII nationally on the women's side right now-- Amherst being one of them.  (The others are Hope, Kean, Christopher Newport, and Farmingdale State.)

On the strength of schedule criteria, as of this week's regional rankings, there are 10 teams nationally that have strength of schedule numbers over .600-- as noted by the NCAA.  6 of those are NESCAC teams-- Williams, Amherst, Bowdoin, Tufts, Wesleyan, and Bates.  2 of those are from the UAA-- Brandeis and Chicago.  The other two are Richard Stockton and UW-Whitewater.

Colby has a strength of schedule number of .581 this week, has an in-region percentage of .857 (at 18-3 in region record), and is unbeaten in 3 games out-of-region.  Colby has a record of 2-3 against regionally ranked opponents.  I don't see a problem with Colby getting in as a Pool C-- the Mules are currently ranked #3 in the Northeast.

Tufts is currently ranked at #2 in the Northeast with a regional percentage of .842 and a strength of schedule number of .624 as of last Sunday.  Tufts has gotten another regional victory over Worcester State since then to improve their regional percentage.    Tufts is 4-2 against regionally ranked opponents this week.  I see nothing on their schedule right now that I could use to deny Tufts a Pool C bid.

Amherst has locked up a bid with their perfect record-- 8-0 against regionally ranked opponents is the best in Division III.  Illinois Wesleyan at 5-1 against regionally ranked opponents is second nationally in that regard.

Which brings us to Williams and Bowdoin.

Williams is currently ranked at #4 in the Northeast with an in-region record of 18-5 (.783 in-region percentage) and a strength of schedule number of .633 (tied with Bowdoin for the highest strength of schedule number in DIII, according to the NCAA.)  Williams plays Bates this week-- if Williams loses this week, they finish at 18-6 in-region (.750 in-region percentage).  Williams is 3-5 against regionally ranked opponents  Their 3 regionally ranked wins are against Skidmore (#2 in the East-- 200 mile game), Tufts, and Bowdoin.

The only thing on the secondary criteria that could be used to deny Williams a Pool C bid is their out-of-region loss against Baldwin Wallace-- tied for first place in the OAC along with Mt Union and Capital currently.  However, that only comes into play if Williams's primary criteria is even with a Great Lakes Pool C candidate.  Mt Union is currently ranked #6 in the Great Lakes, with the other two OAC teams tied with them are not regionally ranked.

Saturday morning update to post:  Rochester from the UAA is now also vying for a Pool C bid with their upset loss to Brandeis in the Palestra.   Rochester has a secondary criteria win over Baldwin-Wallace, the same team that beat Williams in that tip-off tourney.  Should Rochester and Williams be on the table at the same time with only one Pool C bid left to give, and should Rochester and Williams be even at the end on the primary criteria, I believe that Rochester will get a Pool C bid over Williams based on the result against that common opponent.  Right now, though, Williams has the stronger strength of schedule number-- so a Williams win today bolsters their case for a Pool C.

Bowdoin has a regional record of 16-5 for a .762 in-region winning percentage as of last Sunday.  Their strength of schedule of .633 according to the NCAA is tied with Williams for highest in that category.  Bowdoin is ranked #6 in the Northeast this week.  Bowdoin finishes with a regional percentage of .727 if they lose on Saturday to Tufts.

Bowdoin is 2-5 against regionally ranked opponents this week-- both of those wins coming early this season against Eastern Connecticut and Colby.  Bowdoin has not gotten a regionally ranked win since December.  Bowdoin's regionally ranked losses are to Emmanuel. Colby, Williams, Tufts, and Amherst.  Bowdoin will play their 8th game against a regionally ranked opponent this Saturday.

Bowdoin is 3-0 out-of-region with a secondary criteria win in January over Skidmore, the #2 ranked team in the East currently, if Bowdoin should need that to bolster their case for a Pool C.

That is the state of the NESCAC teams currently going into Saturday's NESCAC tournament.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on February 18, 2010, 07:11:32 PM
Quote from: deiscanton on February 18, 2010, 06:47:50 PM
That is the state of the NESCAC teams currently going into Saturday's NESCAC tournament.

Outstanding synopsis - thank you.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 18, 2010, 08:17:55 PM
Great recap.  Thanks.  Time will tell, but fun to see the NESCAC so strong this year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Laserty on February 18, 2010, 09:11:43 PM
The next question then is where will all those teams fit? They won't keep all 5 teams in the northeast region bracket. So, where will they go?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 19, 2010, 12:04:24 PM
We can expect more than 10 New England teams, perhaps well more than 10, to qualify for the tournament. Some will filter out into the "East" bracket and "Atlantic" bracket.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on February 19, 2010, 03:49:03 PM
The NCAA will try to keep teams within 500 miles of their respective campuses for first and second round action, but other than that, if you are not hosting a pod in the first/second rounds, prepare to do some travelling and stay in a hotel for the weekend if you want to personally attend the games.

Last year, for example, Tufts had to travel to Moravian for first and second round action-- Amherst hosted a pod at Lefrak Gym (with Babson, Emmanuel, and S. Maine in that pod), and Bowdoin hosted a pod at Morrell Gym that included Muhlenberg from Allentown, PA. (Westfield State and Castleton State were in that pod, I believe.)  Tufts defeated the host school in the first round, but lost in the second round to the College of New Jersey (which eventually went to the "Final Four").

Updated correction:  Yes, at the time, the Tufts court was too short to host first and second round playoff games.  Since then, Cousens Gym has been renovated, and if Tufts wins on Saturday, the Jumbos will be more likely to host a pod on the first weekend for the first time in school history.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Laserty on February 19, 2010, 03:52:43 PM
Tufts would have probably hosted the first weekend last year. BUT, their gym wasn't quite legal at that time. (Too short)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on February 20, 2010, 09:28:03 PM
If there's a bright side to Saturday's outcome, we've avoided another misogynistic rant out of Senator Frost since two of the four coaches are male. Next week's Amherst-Bates game might replace Christmas, July 4th and Thanksgiving in terms of joyous events for Frosty. As long as his wife remembers to iron his shirts, that is...

Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 19, 2010, 12:04:24 PM
We can expect more than 10 New England teams, perhaps well more than 10, to qualify for the tournament. Some will filter out into the "East" bracket and "Atlantic" bracket.

Captain Obvious, to the rescue!

Bowdoin should decline any further NESCAC or NCAA bids, take the travel money and put it towards lowering the concession stand costs at the hockey rink for the NESCAC tourney. It will save the Lady Bears two quick losses.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 21, 2010, 12:15:30 PM
In the Bates/Williams game yesterday, it seemed like live stats froze for quite a while.  In reading review on Bates website, it says there was a 20 minute break for a player injury, but no mention of who or what.  Anyone know any scoop?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: eph partisan on February 22, 2010, 12:00:35 AM
New to the boards, so I do not know what the etiquette is in terms of discussing injured players, but it was an Eph who was hurt. She was hit going up for a layup and landed on her back. The injury was not ultimately serious - something like a herniated disc - but they did not want to move her until they could bring a stretcher because it was a back injury.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 22, 2010, 07:45:53 AM
Welcome Partisan.  We need more Eph perspective on this board.  Good recap....we didn't need names etc.  I was just concerned as usually when a game is delayed that long it involves back, neck or head concerns as they always error on the side of caution when moving the player.  Glad to hear player will be OK. 

I'm sure you'd agree that the Bates coach has those girls playing very well at just the right time after a disappointing early NESCAC season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 22, 2010, 12:40:06 PM
I follow the Div I UConn women's BB team as well as Amherst.  I have told an old friend that as UConn goes, so does Amherst.  Both teams over the years are thin at critical areas due to injuries and have to face tough conference opponents many times during the season and in conference tournaments.  This was pointed out in the broadcast for the Amh/Wes game.  It is tough to play a team three times.  It is fortunate that the upcoming Bates game is at the cooler LeFrak.  Bates is on a roll and have a large team.  Hope Amherst's injured players are not needed this weekend.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 22, 2010, 12:42:19 PM
Quote from: feces monkey on February 20, 2010, 09:28:03 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 19, 2010, 12:04:24 PM
We can expect more than 10 New England teams, perhaps well more than 10, to qualify for the tournament. Some will filter out into the "East" bracket and "Atlantic" bracket.

Captain Obvious, to the rescue!

Hey, the question was asked. Spare me.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on February 22, 2010, 04:36:19 PM
Quote from: amh63 on February 22, 2010, 12:40:06 PM
I follow the Div I UConn women's BB team as well as Amherst.... Hope Amherst's injured players are not needed this weekend.

I'm a Stanford fan, but if you're right, the Jeffs will have no problem with the rest of this season because UConn looks like a pre-pro team this year. 

Whose on the injured list for Amherst?  Box scores look like they're full force.  Not the case?




Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 22, 2010, 07:47:53 PM
Title9fan,
    I also like the Stanford team.  Bridget Crowley, the 6'1" firstyear player has only recently returned to the team after an extended absense.  Kim Fiorentino, a starter has been absent for awhile and is not expected to return this weekend.  The other key front court player is all-american Jaci Daugneault who has missed the pass three games, I believe. The missing two starters  were mentioned by the announcers in the Wes. game as Amherst's front court players were picking up fouls.  To the credit of Leyman, Renner, etc. the front court players played through their fouls, rebounded and scored when needed.  The Amherst team has only 12 players total.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: eph partisan on February 23, 2010, 02:41:56 AM
Quote from: sumfun on February 22, 2010, 07:45:53 AM
I'm sure you'd agree that the Bates coach has those girls playing very well at just the right time after a disappointing early NESCAC season.

Very much agreed.

Any one have any sense on whether or not Williams has a real shot of making the tournament? I know there were comments earlier that said they could hypothetically, but at 18-7, I feel like they are going to need a lot of luck to get in.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on February 23, 2010, 03:14:20 AM
Williams only has 6 losses that can be counted in the primary criteria for in-region percentage.   Williams's real in-region record is 18-6, for a regional percentage of .750.   That does not make Williams a Pool C lock, but they will be considered for Pool C selection.   However, that depends on where Williams ends up in tomorrow's regional rankings and how Williams ends up in the regional rankings after all the conference tournaments have been played, since that will determne the final order in which Williams gets to the national table from the Northeast.   However, I do expect Williams will end up on the national table for consideration.

The other loss is an out-of-region loss to Baldwin Wallace, which may hurt them on the secondary criteria if they have to go to it.  That gives Williams an out-of-region common opponent with Rochester, who is also vying for Pool C consideration.  Other Great Lakes Pool C candidates may also be helped by the Williams loss to Baldwin Wallace on the secondary criteria.  However, that is only if the primary criteria is not enough to reach a final decision on Williams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on February 23, 2010, 03:56:18 AM
Tournament resume for Wiiliams:

In-region record:  18-6  Regional percentage is .750

OWP is .645 as of Sunday, Feb 21 according to D3Hoops.com calculations (4th highest in Division III).

OOWP is .580 as of Sunday, Feb 21 according to D3Hoops.com calculations.

Strength of schedule (2/3 OWP, 1/3 OOWP) is .623

Record vs regionally ranked opponents (thru 2/14) is 3-5.  

Current wins vs regional ranked opponents (primary criteria)-- Skidmore (#2 in East, within 200 miles of Williams), Tufts, Bowdoin

Current losses vs regional ranked opponents (primary criteria)-- W. Connecticut, E. Connecticut, Amherst (2 losses to Amherst), Colby.

Loss this Saturday to Bates was the first in-region loss this season to a non regionally-ranked opponent.

My prediction as to the Wednesday regional rankings:   I could see W. Connecticut jumping ahead of Williams in the regional rankings, but I would be amazed if Eastern Connecticut also jumped ahead.   Eastern Connecticut is 17-8 in region (.680 regional percentage) as of games through Sunday, Feb 21, which would make it very hard for the Warriors to get selected as a Pool C pick.

Note:  Updated for clarification.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on February 23, 2010, 08:51:52 AM
Quote from: deiscanton on February 23, 2010, 03:56:18 AM
Tournament resume for Wiiliams:

Current wins vs regional ranked opponents (primary criteria)-- Skidmore, Tufts, Bowdoin.

Skidmore counts?

Amh63:

Thanks for the update.  Hope every team at the semi's has most - if not all, of the players that brought them there - healthy and able to play!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on February 23, 2010, 08:54:07 AM
Skidmore isn't ranked at Top 10 (or is it?) -
How deep does the "regionally ranked" definition go? 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on February 23, 2010, 11:56:17 AM
Quote from: Title9Fan on February 23, 2010, 08:51:52 AM
Quote from: deiscanton on February 23, 2010, 03:56:18 AM
Tournament resume for Wiiliams:

Current wins vs regional ranked opponents (primary criteria)-- Skidmore, Tufts, Bowdoin.

Skidmore counts?

Amh63:

Thanks for the update.  Hope every team at the semi's has most - if not all, of the players that brought them there - healthy and able to play!


Yes, Skidmore counts.  Skidmore is within 200 miles of Williams, therefore Skidmore is in-region for Williams and a primary criteria opponent.

Skidmore is out of region for Bowdoin.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on February 23, 2010, 12:55:46 PM
Quote from: Title9Fan on February 23, 2010, 08:54:07 AM
Skidmore isn't ranked at Top 10 (or is it?) -
How deep does the "regionally ranked" definition go?  

Regional rankings are given by the NCAA regional advisory committees for their respective evaluation regions.

Skidmore is ranked at #2 in the East as of the February 14 regional rankings.

As Skidmore is within 200 miles of Williams, a Skidmore-Williams game is an in-region game and it counts in the primary criteria for both teams for their respective regional rankings.

In-region games are defined as:

(1)  All conference games  (when Hamilton officially becomes part of NESCAC basketball conference play, then conference games vs Hamilton will count for all NESCAC teams as part of the in-region primary criteria.)

(2)  All non-conference games vs teams in your defined evaluation region.  

(3)  All non-conference games vs teams located within 200 miles of your campus.

(4)  All non-conference games vs teams located within your NCAA administrative region, even if the team is otherwise over 200 miles from your campus.

For all New England based teams, their NCAA administrative region also includes all DIII teams from New Jersey, Delaware, Maryland, and Washington DC-- and is known as NCAA Administrative Region 1.

All New York and Pennsylvania Division III teams are in NCAA Administrative Region 2.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on February 23, 2010, 03:07:00 PM
Thanks for explanation deiscanton.  Can the matrix get any more complex?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 23, 2010, 05:30:55 PM
Selection in Div 1 is less complex, relatively.  In the mistreated Div 3 (by the NCAA) it gets more difficult to win a National Championship due to the lack of MONEY.  Enter the "500 mile" limit which often lead teams meeting a rival for the third or 4th time.  Then there is having sectional finals and the final 4 being played on "host" gyms vice neutral sites.  This year, the final 4 site is at IWU.
The NCAA is a complex org. and therefore generates complex criteria.
With that said, what do you think will happen this weekend at Amherst?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on February 23, 2010, 08:11:38 PM
Amherst hosts all the way to the final 4 from here?  Well deserved, but did I hear that correctly (Sunday's Hoopsville interview)? 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on February 23, 2010, 08:58:45 PM
Amherst has a perfect record (all games played in-region for Amherst)  coming into the weekend, and has 8 wins vs regionally ranked opponents, the most in Division III.   If Amherst wins out this weekend, they will go into the NCAAs having gotten their 9th win vs a regionally ranked opponent this season-- with that win coming in the NESCAC title game.

(Amherst's 8-0 vs regionally ranked opposition:  Amherst defeated W. Connecticut, E. Connecticut, Emmanuel, Williams (2 wins vs Williams), Colby, Bowdoin, and Tufts).   Should Amherst win on Saturday, they would face either Bowdoin or Colby again in the NESCAC title game.

I can't see why Amherst doesn't host the first two weekends of the NCAA tournament under those circumstances-- of course, as long as Amherst wins these games and remains in the NCAA tournament, that is.

Note:  Even if Amherst is upset this weekend, Amherst would still host NCAA tournament games up until the Final Four assuming Amherst wins both games in the first weekend of the NCAA tournament.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 23, 2010, 11:41:38 PM
Quote from: Title9Fan on February 23, 2010, 08:11:38 PM
Amherst hosts all the way to the final 4 from here?  Well deserved, but did I hear that correctly (Sunday's Hoopsville interview)? 

There's the potential, absolutely.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on February 24, 2010, 02:40:35 PM
NCAA has just released this week's regional rankings, and the top 5 teams in the Northeast this week are all NESCAC teams.

In order, they are ranked as follows:  Amherst, Colby, Bowdoin, Tufts, and Williams.

Below them are Emmanuel, the top 3 Little East teams, and Babson.

(It's a shame that the Tufts loss on Saturday could have cost the Jumbos the opportunity to host first and second rounds of the NCAA-- after they worked so hard to renovate Cousens Gym over the summer to make it NCAA regulation size in order to achieve that goal.)

PS-- That Bowdoin v Tufts match last Saturday was very exciting-- just like a game in one of the later rounds of the NCAA tournament most years.

PPS-- Does Colby have a regulation size court on their campus in Waterville, Maine?  I'm just asking.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: moseshightower on February 24, 2010, 05:55:03 PM
Colby's court is regulation.  They could host but I'm guessing that may depend on who ends up winning some of those smaller Northeast conferences.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 26, 2010, 11:17:03 AM
NESCAC conference semis and finals this weekend.  Maine is coming to Amherst with Colby playing Bowdoin and Bates playing Amherst.  Should be great games as all three teams are very competitive.  They've given eachother a run for their money as well as Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 26, 2010, 08:04:09 PM
Considering the weather conditions on the coastal areas of Maine, here's hoping the Maine teams and their supporters arrive safely.  Good luck to all.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 27, 2010, 05:03:54 PM
Saw the game on Jeffcast.  Amherst looked great after the first  10 minutes.  Glad to see Kim F., Bridget C. and Courtney L. get extended playing time....over 6 plus minutes.  Surprised by the stats that show Sarah L. only get 2 rebounds!  Thought she got twice that much in the first half.  Whatever, Sarah played strong today as well as the whole team in the win.
Back to the 2nd game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on March 01, 2010, 06:52:12 AM
Bracket is being announced today.    According to D3Hoops.com projections, RPI's upset wins over St. Lawrence and Skidmore in the Liberty League tournament may have costed NESCAC a 5th team in the NCAAs.  We will see when the official bracket is released this afternoon.

D3Hoops.com projections currently have just Colby, Bowdoin, and Tufts getting in as Pool C's, with Williams on the table when the final Pool C bid is announced-- but having the 21 Pool C's run out before Williams is selected.

However, here is my question now.   D3Hoops.com projections had Williams at 2-5 vs regionally ranked opponents in their secret regional rankings-- which are the deeper rankings that the NCAA uses to select teams.   If RPI replaced Skidmore in the East regional rankings as a result of their LIberty League title,  isn't Williams still 3-5 vs regionally ranked opponents since Williams also defeated RPI in regular season competition?   If so, just put RPI instead of Skidmore  for the 3rd quality win-- RPI is also within 200 miles of Williams.   Amherst also gets another regionally ranked victory if RPI is now a regionally ranked opponent in the East as a result of RPI's Liberty League automatic bid.

Just my thoughts-- just over 30 minutes to go until the bracket gets announced.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 01, 2010, 12:50:29 PM
Women's bracket posted: http://www.d3boards.com/playoffs/wbkb-bracket2010.pdf

All five.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 01, 2010, 01:25:29 PM
Congrats to 5 NESCAC teams for making the NCAA's.  Colby and Williams could run up against Amherst again, while Tufts and Bowdoin come in from the other side and have to go through Kean.  Great conference, great schools!!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: toad22 on March 01, 2010, 02:55:09 PM
I am very happy for the Williams women. I talked with a few of them yesterday and about half were pessimistic and half optimistic. All very much wanted a chance at the big dance! They have their work cut out for them. Congratulations and good luck.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 02, 2010, 01:17:52 AM
As an admitted anti-NESCAC low-life, I continue to be astounded by the unconscionable favoritism bestowed upon the tweedy topsiders from Brunswick, Williamstown, etc. by the fawning and cooing members of the selection committee.  Year after year.  Nothing ever changes.  Holy Blueblood!!!!....get your collective heads out of your
%$#ses! 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 02, 2010, 06:38:46 AM
Hey Rem....I think you can save comments like that for yourself or your other anti-NESCAC friends.   Your supposed bias didn't help on the men's side.  Though 5 is a lot, just maybe strength of schedule, and the power rating of the conference helped.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 02, 2010, 08:16:04 AM
If it were an exclusively mathematical, wholly objective selection process than the D3Hoops predictions would never be off.  I think the predictions made more sense than the official bracket.  Williams/NESCAC has a lot of people scratching their heads.  (Especially Capital if you read the NCAA Championship discussion - some valid questions from Weiser). 

I wish people who spend their time here would care more about the integrity of the game than just pumping their own team or conference.  (yeah, right.  well, one can hope!)  I'm ok if people write some vitriol once in awhile if they also talk about the actual GAME of women's D3-level basketball.  Little less hype, little more substance -     
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 02, 2010, 11:53:03 AM
See Deiscanton explanation under NCAA Tourney in Multi-Regional topics.  The math and record vs regional competion makes sense whether the number from one conference or another doesn't.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 02, 2010, 03:13:38 PM
As I said before, if the process was that simple, D3Hoops' projections would be perfect - all of the time.  Next year, sumfun -- we'll just ask you 3 days prior to the announcements for the 2011 bracket.  No need to wait, eh? 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 02, 2010, 05:38:15 PM
I never would have predicted 5 NESCAC teams.  I even doubted that Bowdoin would make it, but I don't look at all the numbers like deis and the committee.  I'm just a fan having fun watching kids play.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 02, 2010, 11:02:35 PM
Seems that at this time of the year, someone always complains.  On the men's side there are complaints about how few conference reps were picked.
As I have remarked earlier, just sit back, pick a favorite team and enjoy the play.  This time of the year, in the "second season", if one have favorites in the NCAA. it is like dessert.  Go NESCAC teams.  Go Jeffs!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 03, 2010, 12:06:11 AM
Hey...my karma went up a point
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 03, 2010, 07:51:23 AM
The weekend games were decent match-ups. 

The most improved team this year is Colby.  (Always the sign of a good coach so Kudos to Gear-McBride.)  They're solid under the basket and bigger/taller at the 4-5 than most NESCAC teams and can shoot from the line (all of their shooting has improved significantly over the course of the season) so they're dangerous.   Amherst looked strong and ready for the next rounds.  Gromacki made game adjustments so quickly and seamlessly in both games that it's hard to find their weak spot(s).  Bates came out with an explosiveness early on that was fun to watch but couldn't (and didn't) last.  Bowdoin's offense is a mess but in the right match-ups they can impress.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 03, 2010, 02:19:12 PM
Rem....Your Karma must have been due to your anti-NESCAC blunt remarks.  One of your fellow anti-board comrades must have rewarded you.
Accept it as it is given.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 03, 2010, 02:55:16 PM
NESCAC games this weekend.  Amherst and Bowdoin will provide free webcasts of the games I believe.  Do not know if the Colby games will be on the Web.  Game tickets at each site are the same. (not so on the men's side)  Amherst will provide free tickets to the first 100 Amherst students for each day.  For Amherst community members (staff, etc.) free tickets will also be available but vary by the day.  Need to check the Kean and Ithaca sites to webcast info for the Tufts and Williams games.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 03, 2010, 03:45:50 PM
Congratulations!
2009-10 NESCAC Women's Basketball All-Conference

Player of the Year
Caroline Stedman, Amherst, Sr.  (Walpole, MA)

Coach of the Year
G.P. Gromacki, Amherst

Rookie of the Year
Marcia Voigt, Amherst, Fr.  (Skillman, N.J.)

Defensive Player of the Year
Vanessa Miller, Tufts, Jr.   (Cincinnati, Ohio)

First Team 

Alison Cappelloni, Sr., Colby   (Sudbury, MA) 
Colleen Hart, Jr., Tufts,    (Needham, MA)
Caroline Stedman, Sr., Amherst  (Walpole, MA)
Julia Baily, Sr., Tufts     (Farmington, CT)
Lauren Yanofsky, Fr., Bates    (Belmont, MA)
 
Second Team 

Shannon Finucane, Soph, Amherst   (Cortland, NY)
Chessie Jackson, Jr., Williams   (Goleta, Calif.)
Leah Rubega, Sr., Bowdoin   (Norwich, Conn)
Caitlin Hynes, Sr., Bowdoin   (Owl's Head, Maine)
Sarah Leyman, Jr., Amherst   (Cincinnati, Ohio)

               
   
               
       

               
   
               
         
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on March 03, 2010, 09:14:35 PM
what's the deal with J.C. Daignealt ,is she going to be able to play?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on March 03, 2010, 09:17:44 PM
Quote from: remsleep on March 02, 2010, 01:17:52 AM
As an admitted anti-NESCAC low-life, I continue to be astounded by the unconscionable favoritism bestowed upon the tweedy topsiders from Brunswick, Williamstown, etc. by the fawning and cooing members of the selection committee.  Year after year.  Nothing ever changes.  Holy Blueblood!!!!....get your collective heads out of your
%$#ses! 

Wow, good one Rems. I needed a good laugh.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 04, 2010, 12:03:22 AM
Quote from: pureshooter on March 03, 2010, 09:17:44 PM
Quote from: remsleep on March 02, 2010, 01:17:52 AM
As an admitted anti-NESCAC low-life, I continue to be astounded by the unconscionable favoritism bestowed upon the tweedy topsiders from Brunswick, Williamstown, etc. by the fawning and cooing members of the selection committee.  Year after year.  Nothing ever changes.  Holy Blueblood!!!!....get your collective heads out of your
%$#ses! 

Wow, good one Rems. I needed a good laugh.

Isn't their some venerable poster on this board, (Frank Ubile perhaps?) who frequently chirps "we aim to please"...well anyways, ditto
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: eph partisan on March 04, 2010, 03:19:49 AM
I have to admit that I was pleasantly surprised that the Ephs got in. Though, rem, I think that to call it "unconscionable favoritism" is a little unfair - it's not as though any of the these teams came out of nowhere in the tournament discussion, and each had a (relatively) solid resume. Frankly, the selection committee wants to get it right as badly as we want them to, and it wants to put the teams it feels are most deserving into the tourney - conference be damned. We might not always agree with their decisions - the treatment of the NESCAC on the men's side has already been brought up, and clearly you feel as though something went wrong - but to attribute the committee's choices to "unconscionable favoritism" strikes me as off-base.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: farmboy on March 05, 2010, 12:46:13 AM
Initially I too was a bit suprised about the Ephs, but if you combine a bit of analysis as well as personal knowledge of the individual games in the season it becomes a bit more clear.  I admit to knowing virtually nothing about Capital.  However if you look at individual games it is seen that the Ephs dispatched Bowdoin as well as Tufts.  With a mere 20 seconds left in their game with Colby the Ephs sunk a three and took a two point lead.  Only because the Ephs managed to allow a Colby player three offensive rebounds did Colby send it into overtime.  Amherst thumped the Ephs twice, but in the second game in the second half after being blown off the court the first half a particular set of Ephs came right back at Amherst and pulled within 9 points making Gramecky sweat a bit...but all for not as these individuals were substituted out and Amherst came back with a vengeance.  Still it shows what is true, this Eph team has quite a bit of talent.  Young yes...but a lot of ability. If that ability is used correctly, and the ladies get it together, they have a chance to prove their being picked was a wise choice.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: farmboy on March 05, 2010, 12:48:00 AM
Sorry coach...that would be Gromacki:)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: feces monkey on March 05, 2010, 02:57:37 PM
Hmmm, Baruch. Oh, hey! Friday night will feel just like an "Amherst Classic" early season tournament game! What luck! Maybe Senator Frost can come up to heckle the officals and sumfun can wait outside the locker for autographs to complete the picture.

I'll be rooting for UNE this evening. The Nor'Easters' coach tells it like it is.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 05, 2010, 03:28:54 PM
That's a good part of the bracket over at Bowdoin.  I'll be sure to try to get there now, what would you like me to have autographed.....bball, t-shirt, program?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 06, 2010, 08:25:26 AM
West Conn deserves a medal for playing through UNE+3 refs last night. 

Next set of refs for Game #2 weren't really needed - Baruch doesn't play defense and their shots were off, so it was a nonstarter. 

Tonight's game should be much more interesting.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: eph partisan on March 06, 2010, 10:56:09 PM
Wow. Go Ephs. Did anyone see the game tonight? I was watching the Williams men.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 06, 2010, 11:24:02 PM
It's SO annoying to be wrong so frequently......the two NESCAC teams that I felt so strongly should never have even been in the dance are now Sweet 16.....meanwhile Colby and Tufts are done.  I think this board is serving as a trap to catch me being stupid.   Anyhow, sincerely, congrats to Bowdoin and Williams....they have taken advantage of the opportunity
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 06, 2010, 11:30:35 PM
On another crazy note....while in attendance at the Colby-Babson game tonight I was told by some purported Colby insider ( i.e. a parent of a Colby College employee) that there is a movement adrift seeking to make a change at the Head Coach level of the womens' team.  This sounds preposterous to me.   Anything to it?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 07, 2010, 11:05:02 AM
As "anticipated", Amherst will host the Sectionals and meet Williams on Friday for the third time this year.
I had hoped for a matchup of Amherst and Ithaca since my daughter who lives near Ithaca has been telling me how good the team was during the season.  Surprised that Tufts stayed with Kean for a half.  Surprised also about the Colby lost.  The write-up of the Colby game had the Colby star miss a foul shot in regulation that allowed the game to go into overtime.  That is what makes this "section season" so exciting and worrisome at the same time. 
Though the webcast of the Amherst game quit for the last 4 minutes ( I followed on the live stats), I was pleased to see Amherst play Southern Maine so well.  Like many teams in the NCAA, there are very good players on Southern Maine.  Amherst just seems to have more of them  Hope J.C. D. plays this weekend.  The hand injury maybe more serious than I thought.  Is the coach just being cautious?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: paulie on March 07, 2010, 12:44:35 PM
Call it sour grapes now that they have lost - because that's what it is - but Tufts was shown no love by the committee compared to Bowdoin. The Jumbos beat Bowdoin by 12 in the regular-season, then lost to them in OT in the conference tournament quarterfinals. Tufts finished 6-3 in NESCAC compared to 5-4 by Bowdoin. I guess it comes down to in-region wins, and Tufts had three of its victories at out-of-region tourneys. Bowdoin had an edge in strength of schedule (they were first, but Tufts was fourth). Plus, the Jumbos didn't help themselves any down the stretch. But that sends Tufts to a team that can beat them without their best player ever (Kean), while Bowdoin gets a cakewalk to the "Sweet Sixteen" against Baruch and Western Conn at home? Even Williams, generally regarded as the fifth NESCAC team to get in, got a better deal by being sent to Ithaca. Oh well. I know they don't have an easy job. All's fair in love, war, and NCAA Tournament seedings. Thanks for your indulgence.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 07, 2010, 07:59:32 PM
Quote from: remsleep on March 06, 2010, 11:30:35 PM
On another crazy note....while in attendance at the Colby-Babson game tonight I was told by some purported Colby insider ( i.e. a parent of a Colby College employee) that there is a movement adrift seeking to make a change at the Head Coach level of the womens' team.  This sounds preposterous to me.   Anything to it?

That's more than preposterous.  It's insane.  I don't know the answer to your question but I know there was some bellyaching (whining) about her running the Colby program too much like a D1 program a while back.  Bet nobody complains about that level of commitment with Gromacki.  Colby should appreciate what it has (a highly credentialed, knowledgeable, skillful coach who treats the D3 women's game with RESPECT) before they loose it.

She's broken the Colby WBB record this year and her team is by far, the most improved this season with a huge upside for next year.  She understands the game (which is sadly unusual in D3 WBB) and is probably the only NESCAC coach who can give Gromacki a run for the money when it comes to game coaching.  NESCAC is full of .500 team coaches who keep their jobs for decades and yet there's a "movement" to get rid of a D1 championship winner who is commited to developing a program?  Grow up, Colby. 
   
If they loose or give up Gear-McBride, they didn't deserve her in the first place. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh07 on March 07, 2010, 09:56:28 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 07, 2010, 11:05:02 AM
Hope J.C. D. plays this weekend.  The hand injury maybe more serious than I thought.  Is the coach just being cautious?
I thought I heard an announcer say she had a broken hand. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on March 07, 2010, 10:15:04 PM
Quote from: Title9Fan on March 07, 2010, 07:59:32 PM
Quote from: remsleep on March 06, 2010, 11:30:35 PM
On another crazy note....while in attendance at the Colby-Babson game tonight I was told by some purported Colby insider ( i.e. a parent of a Colby College employee) that there is a movement adrift seeking to make a change at the Head Coach level of the womens' team.  This sounds preposterous to me.   Anything to it?

That's more than preposterous.  It's insane.  I don't know the answer to your question but I know there was some bellyaching (whining) about her running the Colby program too much like a D1 program a while back.  Bet nobody complains about that level of commitment with Gromacki.  Colby should appreciate what it has (a highly credentialed, knowledgeable, skillful coach who treats the D3 women's game with RESPECT) before they loose it.

She's broken the Colby WBB record this year and her team is by far, the most improved this season with a huge upside for next year.  She understands the game (which is sadly unusual in D3 WBB) and is probably the only NESCAC coach who can give Gromacki a run for the money when it comes to game coaching.  NESCAC is full of .500 team coaches who keep their jobs for decades and yet there's a "movement" to get rid of a D1 championship winner who is commited to developing a program?  Grow up, Colby. 
   
If they loose or give up Gear-McBride, they didn't deserve her in the first place. 




she's probably not long for that place anyway, just a stepping stone on the way to a D-1 program. I know when she arrived she got rid of most if not all of the players she inherited.
The problem with Running it like a D-1 program is, it's not D-1, kids got to go to class and actually study for a while.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 08, 2010, 08:49:13 AM
"she's probably not long for that place anyway, just a stepping stone on the way to a D-1 program. I know when she arrived she got rid of most if not all of the players she inherited.
The problem with Running it like a D-1 program is, it's not D-1, kids got to go to class and actually study for a while."


Not sure who wrote that, so I've taken it out of the quote box.

The difference(s) between D1 and D3 is somewhat (and often) overstated.  It's become sort of an oversized myth that gets repeated like muscle memory.  The kids at the Ivy D1s, Stanford and other top colleges have every bit the level of academic challenge and discipline as the NESCAC athletes.

I don't think the Colby coach "got rid" of anyone....she says what she wants right up front and she is candid when she's talking to recruits about what they can expect on her team (I've heard it) which is commendable.  (Another trait she has in common with Gromacki). 

If Colby isn't as committed to a winning women's basketball problem as the coach is, perhaps it should have been more up front in the interviews.  Anyone hear Geno's recent ESPN interview about mediocrity in women's basketball as opposed to men's?  It's the same thing between D1 and D3.  They are different, but the goals should be the same:  To develop every player to the best of their ability and then to coach and play the best game possible.  He said missed lay-ups are NOT okay just because it's a women's team.

Well the same is true in D3.  Mediocrity is not okay.  Or is it?






Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on March 08, 2010, 12:24:32 PM
In colleges like Colby, coaches are not let go solely for failure to win.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pcarr on March 08, 2010, 05:10:29 PM
Quote from: amh07 on March 07, 2010, 09:56:28 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 07, 2010, 11:05:02 AM
Hope J.C. D. plays this weekend.  The hand injury maybe more serious than I thought.  Is the coach just being cautious?
I thought I heard an announcer say she had a broken hand. 

I broadcast the game for D3hoops on Saturday, and Amherst people said that she did have a broken hand.  They hoped she could play this weekend, but they were in wait-and-see mode.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: wbbhoopsfan on March 08, 2010, 05:16:39 PM
if she is back and Beryuti is out at Kean, look for Amherst to win the title.  Anyone feel there is a better team?  I think Kean has an athleticism edge - and have certainly been just as dominant - but you can't remove arguably the top player in the country and expect to run the table.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 08, 2010, 05:43:06 PM
Quote from: frank uible on March 08, 2010, 12:24:32 PM
In colleges like Colby, coaches are not let go solely for failure to win.

Gee.  I had no idea. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 08, 2010, 09:04:59 PM
Don't know very much about Kean, but Amherst is extremely well balanced, and there top 7 (even without Daigneault) is very strong. They play great defense, and everyone can score. They should make a good run to the finals
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on March 08, 2010, 11:58:40 PM
Title9, that was my quote.

Colby should be happy, but i don't think she will stay long if those "complaints" about her trying to run it like a D-1 program are true. D-1 has the money for scholarships, like Stanford, and I think they are much different than the Ivy League because of that. That makes a huge difference. The school owns you for 12 months. Many D-3 kids want some time off, and have transferred from D-1 + D-2 programs to these schools so they can have a life and play as well. And a lot of kids paying full freight at the D-3 level can't be working out all off season, because they have to work.
And its all about the talent the coach brings in, makes coaches good coaches if they can do that. Anyone doubt that Amherst has  the best talent in the NESCAC? That is a credit to the school as well
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 09, 2010, 06:44:48 AM
I think the biggest difference between D1 and D3 is that the kids rarely miss class for games since they travel by bus and play in-region.  Class and labs take priority over practice so practice times are moved around to accomodate kids' schedules.  Another big factor is the coach not on the floor in spring and fall.  UAA conference does more plane travel, but play on Friday and Sunday so class is not missed.

The D3 kids work as hard as other divisions in the off season and summer with pick up games, captain's practices and workouts.  In the summer they have full time jobs and internships but still find time to join a summer league and do the workouts sent by the coach or trainer.   It's a year-round commitment (if you want to be the best) whatever division.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh07 on March 09, 2010, 07:54:01 AM
Quote from: wbbhoopsfan on March 08, 2010, 05:16:39 PM
if she is back and Beryuti is out at Kean, look for Amherst to win the title.  Anyone feel there is a better team? 

I'm concerned about Hannah Munger at George Fox, who is listed as tall as Troy Whittington at Williams (6'5'').  Amherst will certainly benefit from another tall body to take fouls.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 09, 2010, 08:20:25 AM
All good points, shooter and sumfun. 

That said, the top teams in the nation will always require a stronger commitment and a higher set of performance goals (for the coach, the players, and the entire athletic department) than the bottom - at every division level.

In the meantime, is Melissa Beyruti healthy?  Seems Kean had no touble with Tufts even without her.     
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Laserty on March 09, 2010, 04:37:53 PM
If the Colby coach is looking for a new job and wants to go into the realm of D1, the UMass Amherst job just opened up...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 09, 2010, 11:20:14 PM
  Am not sure of the exact number but I'd guess that in the past few years about ten+ players have left (been bounced?) from the Colby W Basketball team. I heard there was some sort of a conflict with the players and that the coach was given authority to drop the malcontents. Whatever the truth is they lost a lot of players. This seems like D1 to me.
  Winning is of course very important but I would be curious as to what actually happened. I mean why not keep the players and if they don't perform well, then don't play them. Most teams have players who are perfectly happy to sit on the bench and just be part of the experience. It's hard for me to believe all those players left voluntarily with no pressure being applied but--
   Those girls came to Colby and most of them probably had the notion that they would be on the team for four years. I wonder if they're hurt and disappointed? On the other hand she has produced a winner this year even though Babson ended their season. That 3 point loss to Husson wasn't exactly inspiring I might add. I would like to say that I am not mentioning all this because I dislike the Colby coach or because she's a woman. The last thing I want is a screaming monkey calling me a masseur.
    On another note my girl won't be going to the game because she's picking up a brand new mop she ordered on Friday and she can hardly wait to try it out.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BruinFan on March 09, 2010, 11:46:17 PM
Quote from: wbbhoopsfan on March 08, 2010, 05:16:39 PM
if she is back and Beryuti is out at Kean, look for Amherst to win the title.  Anyone feel there is a better team?  I think Kean has an athleticism edge - and have certainly been just as dominant - but you can't remove arguably the top player in the country and expect to run the table.

I hope no one minds me jumping in on the NESCAC board. No one commented on the NCAA Tournament board when I stated I believe the champion will come from either one of the lower brackets.

The last team from the NE region to make the finals was S. Maine in 2006 when they lost to Hope.  The last 6 national champions by region have been West (George Fox), South (Howard Payne), Great Lakes (DePauw), Great Lakes (Hope), Central (Millikin), Great Lakes (Wilmington).

Each year is different and trends can change, but I think the Central, Great Lakes, and West regions represent the highest level of basketball in Division III.

So yes, I expect there are 4-5 schools left in the tournament that will give Amherst all they can handle and may even be better than the Lord Jeffs. If I'm wrong, I will be sure to congratulate Amherst in a couple of weeks.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 10, 2010, 12:11:25 AM
  Bruin Fan:

    you won't hear (read) me talking about any championship for Amherst. They're not even in the final four yet. However, I will admit that on paper they appear to be headed for the final four. Of course they can't let down this weekend or they won't get a rematch with Wash. U. If one goes to the Wash U website one will see that they have six assistant coaches. This to me is D1 or semi pro. Most NESCAC schools have one or two assistants. Wash U also carries twenty players. Talk about a big budget.
   I was impressed with the quality of Wash U players last year-waves of talent going in and out of the game v Amherst. A true display of power if I ever saw one. I bet NESCAC coaches would love to have six assistants-has to be a big help in developing players. $$$$$
   I'm somewhat sure there's a wonderful explanation but 6 will always be 3x's as much as two. I know a lot of coaches must be jealous.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 10, 2010, 06:43:04 AM
Couldn't agree more that Wash U has a huge program, but looking at Amherst men's program with 4 coaches and 18 on the roster, Gromacki could probably have the same if he wanted it.  He really likes a roster of 12 to 13, 14 at the max.  Almost was a problem this year due to all the nagging injuries, but he must think team chemistry is better with fewer where all contribute.  Certainly not saying outright that Amherst will win it all, but they have the tools and depth to do so if a few shots fall their way.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 10, 2010, 08:50:29 AM
Quote from: Laserty on March 09, 2010, 04:37:53 PM
... the UMass Amherst job just opened up...

Somebody better tether Gromacki to a Jeffs statue -- quick.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 10, 2010, 10:05:50 AM
Speaking of division differences -- how is it that Kean is Division 3?  With 13,000-14,000 students?  Is it the number of teams/sports they have?  Investment/budget?  Can't remember the primary reqs. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 10, 2010, 10:39:47 AM
It's the number of scholarships awarded. NYU is Division III also, and it's a lot larger than Kean.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 10, 2010, 10:41:52 AM
Many of the Wisconsin schools are larger than Kean, but give no scholarships and have smaller facilities.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 10, 2010, 01:33:41 PM
It is interesting how particular topics cycle into discussions....during the "downtime" between games.  The question about squad sides and number of coaches on a given program has arisen again.  I brought it up over a year ago while looking into the UAA programs.  I was put down a bit for it.  The question of Div.i versus Div 3 approaches seems to have raised the size of squads, etc. again.
Even in Div 1, when a new coach appears there is "house cleaning" of sorts as it happened in the men's BB program at Harvard recently. 
In my limited observations in Div 3 in general and NESCAC in particular, the size of the squad, number of assistants, and number of players leaving. etc.  is strictly the function of  the head coach.  With respect to Amherst BB programs, it is the head coach preferences primarily.  On the men's side, coach Hixon always keeps a long time top assistant and adds one or two young assistant coaches.  The younger coaches leave for jobs elsewhere over the years.  These younger coaches often are in a degree program at UMass.  The top assistant remains, helping Hixon with his over 30 plus years of BB experience.  The size of the squad vary over the years and range from 15-18.  Players leave and sometimes join the squad again.  Several years ago, a player made the squad in his junior year.
On the women's squad, it appears as others have pointed out that head coach prefers a smaller squad....or it maybe its the fact that the present squad size is a reflection of the coach's "recruiting".
Prior to the present head coach, there was an Amherst player who won Rookie of the year for her play.  The talented player transferred to another NESCAC school in Maine.  She  continued to win honors  both as a player and as a student.
Remember, during the NCAA games, I believe there is a limit of 15 players dressed. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 10, 2010, 02:02:40 PM
Good luck to the Ephs on Friday!  It will be a herculean task even staying close to Amherst, but the Ephs are playing with nothing to lose, as they were not expected to make the Sweet 16.  Quite a turnaround for a young Ephs team (like Amherst, no seniors get meaningful PT), after an awful year last season.  A great group of frosh seems to have energized them, so they have a bright future.

As for Gromacki, I note that he was an assistant at Temple for a few years prior to coming to Amherst, and he had tremendous success there.  I believe they are in the same conference as UMass ... between that and his local ties, UMass HAS to be aware of him, I'd be shocked were he not a leading candidate.  And frankly, as an Eph fan, I'd be happy to see him move up the food chain ... with Pemper gone, I don't see any NESCAC team standing much of a chance vs.  Amherst so long as Gromacki is around.  What he did with them this year, dominating the conference despite tons of important injuries and no seniors, is downright remarkable.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 10, 2010, 02:16:08 PM
there is no doubt that Gromacki is the best Coach in the Conference. He has made a huge difference with Amherst.  Amherst has a talented team, but I don't believe there top seven are better than the top seven at Bates, Colby, or Bowdoin. But when you watch how they move the ball so quickly, and how as soon as any of their players sense a double team, the ball ils gone.  That is what makes them so difficult to defend.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on March 10, 2010, 08:14:12 PM
Gromacki has a great system, is what you're saying, and it has worked elsewhere.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 10, 2010, 11:11:57 PM
  I pretty much agree with what Maine 1 wrote. Remember that before Gromacki came Pollack couldn't start for Amherst which was 3-6 in conference (or thereabouts) After he showed up she became the best non center in the league. Others improved also but not as dramatically. If he went to anopther school in the league-similar things would happen.

   I seem to remember that he dropped no one from the team. I think one girl left and two had injuries of some sort. There were girls who hardly played yet they stayed.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 11, 2010, 06:38:51 AM
Quote from: amh63 on March 10, 2010, 01:33:41 PM
Prior to the present head coach, there was an Amherst player who won Rookie of the year for her play.  The talented player transferred to another NESCAC school in Maine.  She  continued to win honors  both as a player and as a student.
Remember, during the NCAA games, I believe there is a limit of 15 players dressed. 

Who was that transfer, where did she go, and how rare is that?  Are NESCAC's transfer rules the same as NCAA's for D3?  (allowed without redshirting)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BBstudent on March 11, 2010, 07:27:00 AM
"Prior to the present head coach, there was an Amherst player who won Rookie of the year for her play.  The talented player transferred to another NESCAC school in Maine.  She  continued to win honors  both as a player and as a student."

Matia Kostakis was the player and she transferred from Amherst to Bates. I believe Bates had been her first choice since she knew and liked the coach there.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 12, 2010, 02:40:43 PM
Though I will not be in attendance for the games at LeFrak,  it was nice to see that the Amherst community that includes alums, staff, faculty, students, etc. will be given free tickets at the door.  If you are under 2 the NCAA will not charge you.  Ticket cost are covered by the college!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh07 on March 12, 2010, 07:08:36 PM
On the NCAA site, when I click on the Amherst-Williams game, I get the Brandeis Mens game.  What's going on?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on March 12, 2010, 08:39:37 PM
Amh by 2 with 9 to go, nice comeback
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 12, 2010, 09:39:47 PM
amh07
had the same problem.  Seems the NCAA wants to make it hard.  If you go to the babson/brandeis earlier game...which I went to...you finally get the Amherst Game.  It could be that the game gave you the men's BB site by keying off the Williams name.  The first game at Amherst went into overtime so that didn't help the start time....25 min. delay.   Amherst won 71 to 66.  They were down by 15 at the half and only led at 2-0 in the first half. I believe it was 40 to 25 at the half with Williams ahead.  Amherst was out- rebounded  the first half and couldn't hit a 3-point shot while Williams hit 4 of 6 three's, I believe.  The second half, Amherst hit 6 for 10 threes and Williams did not hit a three except in the last 25 seconds.  Williams played hard but ran out of gas somewhat as they are not a deep team.  It was a tense game to watch.  It is hard to blow out a team 3 times.  Williams does have talent and should be a challenge next year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 13, 2010, 07:12:47 AM
Williams played a great game last night against Amherst.  However, in a situation like this (where one team has dominated the other twice), Williams probably had a big mental edge going into that game.  They could play loose and easy, since everyone expected a blow out. Amherst probably was not geared for a close game.  That is what makes for upsets in tournaments.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 13, 2010, 06:59:25 PM
Watching Babson-Amherst game.....if Babson had just average back court play, they could win this game.  In it's absence, however, I don't think they stand much of a chance
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Laserty on March 14, 2010, 08:33:20 PM
I've never seen a bunch of fans corner the refs after the game. Babson lost by 15... not some close game. SO, way to keep it classy Babson. I tried to be friendly with some of their fans the night before, and even rooted for them... Unfortunately they pretty much yelled at me. Anyhow, congrats Amherst, repeat final 4... not an easy task.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh07 on March 14, 2010, 10:19:15 PM
I was glad to see Wash U take out George Fox yesterday.  For Amherst to take on Hannah Munger in offense and the almost impenetrable George Fox zone defense would be scary (for me).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 14, 2010, 10:34:43 PM
From Hoopsville to other predictions, there is NO respect for Amherst and the Northeast....let alone Rochester.  Definately Hope and Wash U will have the fan base being close to IWU.  Amherst is a different team from last year....some due to injury, some to new players, and a lot to another year of experience under their belt....I wouldn't count them out yet.  That's why you play the game.   Look how many people were ready to hand the trophy to IWU as the host. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: WUPHF on March 15, 2010, 12:39:36 AM
Quote from: sumfun on March 14, 2010, 10:34:43 PM
From Hoopsville to other predictions, there is NO respect for Amherst and the Northeast....let alone Rochester.  Definitely Hope and Wash U will have the fan base being close to IWU.  Amherst is a different team from last year....some due to injury, some to new players, and a lot to another year of experience under their belt....I wouldn't count them out yet.  That's why you play the game.   Look how many people were ready to hand the trophy to IWU as the host. 

It will be interesting to see how many fans drive up from St. Louis to cheer on Washington University this year with only one team left in the tournament. 

You mentioned that you though Amherst in particular and the Northeast in general did not get the respect they deserved.  The D3hoops.com forecast, or one of the forecasts I read, barely even mentioned the Bears as an option, even though this Washington University squad is clearly better than last year.

I think this is going to be a very fun to watch Final Four.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 15, 2010, 01:37:34 PM
Sumfun might be referencing my appearance on Hoopsville last night.  I picked Washington U to beat Hope in the final.  I said Rochester could pick off Hope but didn't speak much about Amherst as a likely title winner.

I like and respect Gromacki a lot.  He's a tremendous coach.  Amherst has had a great season.  They've displayed a level of dominance within their portion of the country that is very rare.  And they play in tough conference.

But until I see a team from the East, Northeast, Atlantic or Mid-Atlantic win a title, I won't pick them to do so.  The last one to do so was NYU at home in 1997, and the Violets are multi-regional in that they play in the UAA (as is Rochester).  Before them, you have to go back to Elizabethtown in 1989.

That said, I'm looking forward to seeing if Amherst can prove me wrong.  They wouldn't be the first ones to do so. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 16, 2010, 09:26:36 PM
In response to a D3 hoop Guru.......you must be an "ignorance is bliss" type of person.  You should get out and look around a bit.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 16, 2010, 09:49:18 PM
Dunno -- Gordon is 1) from the Northeast and attended a NESCAC school, and 2) has been at every women's final four since ... how long, Gordon, 2001? 2000? He's got some experience.

A New England team hasn't won the title since 1986. It's a tough sell sometimes.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 17, 2010, 12:21:57 AM
Yeah, 2001.

I've based my opinion on what I've seen in the Final Four including Amherst getting dominated by Washinton U in the paint last year.  They got outrebounded by 11.  Their starting front court had fewer field goals combined than every starting front court player for Washington.

And I've seen several highly ranked Northeast teams - Bowdoin, Southern Maine - wilt against deeper front courts in the final four.

But if you want to make a case for Amherst, go ahead.  I'm open to being proved wrong whether it's on these boards or on the court on Friday.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 17, 2010, 07:11:30 AM
If the Amherst front court doesn't get into trouble like last year, I hardly expect them to "wilt" this year.  Should be a good match up.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 17, 2010, 08:07:20 AM
I haven't seen the frontcourt play of the midwest teams.  However, Amherst did have to deal with a couple of teams that had strong front courts this past season.  Amherst held their own against Babson, who started three players at 6 foot or taller. This was the strength of Babson's team.  Also, Colby started three players at 6 foot, and had a 6 foot 3 player off the bench. Again, Amherst handled Colby twice. 

The issue is foul trouble. Lehman is very tough inside, but is she gets into foul trouble, then they will have a problem
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on March 17, 2010, 10:09:10 AM
Quote from: Laserty on March 14, 2010, 08:33:20 PM
I've never seen a bunch of fans corner the refs after the game. Babson lost by 15... not some close game. SO, way to keep it classy Babson. I tried to be friendly with some of their fans the night before, and even rooted for them... Unfortunately they pretty much yelled at me. Anyhow, congrats Amherst, repeat final 4... not an easy task.
Bab shot 48% +lost, 23 turnovers, had 10 more free throws, granted they had 18 less shots. but got outrebounded offensively by 7 + Amh had more fouls called against them. I know , i was not there. Looks like they didn't take care of the ball + got outplayed by Amh guards.
Those parents are brutal, i saw it enough thru the years, but only since they became a better team. their 2 bigs fouled out twice all year, go figure.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 17, 2010, 10:46:27 AM
QuoteIf the Amherst front court doesn't get into trouble like last year, I hardly expect them to "wilt" this year. 

Fair enough.  I don't expect a Gromacki coached team to wilt either.  Wilt is a poor choice of words on my part.  "Struggle" is a better one.  Even with those struggles, Bowdoin was competitive with Millikin and Southern Maine with Hope (the two teams I referenced). 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 17, 2010, 04:21:18 PM
Gordon, nice articles on Hope and Amherst.  Will look forward to articles on Rochester and Wash U.  D3 Hoops does try to cover all bases and is the life-line of those of us that love true student-athletes.  You're certainly right about one thing, and as the NCAA likes to say....These kids are going pro in something besides basketball.  They're great kids who work hard in school and on the court to get to this level.  Nice to celebrate that!!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 17, 2010, 04:58:21 PM
Glad you enjoyed the articles.  The Amherst piece was written by one of our best writers who prefers to remain anonymous.  Some good stuff on how this year's team differs from last year's.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Laserty on March 17, 2010, 06:47:22 PM
Quote from: pureshooter on March 17, 2010, 10:09:10 AM
Quote from: Laserty on March 14, 2010, 08:33:20 PM
I've never seen a bunch of fans corner the refs after the game. Babson lost by 15... not some close game. SO, way to keep it classy Babson. I tried to be friendly with some of their fans the night before, and even rooted for them... Unfortunately they pretty much yelled at me. Anyhow, congrats Amherst, repeat final 4... not an easy task.
Bab shot 48% +lost, 23 turnovers, had 10 more free throws, granted they had 18 less shots. but got outrebounded offensively by 7 + Amh had more fouls called against them. I know , i was not there. Looks like they didn't take care of the ball + got outplayed by Amh guards.
Those parents are brutal, i saw it enough thru the years, but only since they became a better team. their 2 bigs fouled out twice all year, go figure.

Yeah, I don't know they seemed hostile and inappropriate. But, what's done is done.  And at one point there were 7 amherst fouls to 1 Babson foul in the second half... and they were still complaining. I dunno they seemed terrible.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on March 17, 2010, 08:56:26 PM
Laser,
I've seen them over ten times in my 4 years ot watching, and IMO, they take after the coach, chronic complainer to officials. Most of them do complain, some way more than others. they follow her lead.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 17, 2010, 10:53:59 PM
  Last year when Amherst met Wash U they lost by 16 I believe. At one point they were trailing by twenty two. If you go to the Amherst web site, the game is in the archives. It appears Wash U lost a starter and two others who played more than a little. On the other hand Amherst has lost two starters and maybe one player who got minutes.
  Yes both team have improved but Fiorentino had improved a lot, and was beginning to look like something special. Daigneault has been out and like Fiorentino now gets a few minutes here and there. If these two were healthy and in the lineup I would be encouraged. However, the reality is they're not and so Amherst is a very clear underdog.
   If I remember correctly Amherst lost to Depauw in 2008. That's another loss inflicted on a northeast team by a midwest team. I'm starting to think there is something to that midwest is best thing. I'll be hoping Amherst wins of course. What I would like to see is for Walzy show up and give a spread.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 18, 2010, 12:36:54 AM
  The two three pointers that McCormick hit v Williams have been mentioned. I thought I would mention what I thought was the key shot v Babson. Babson had been hanging around and only trailed by 3. It seemed as if Amherst was never going to shake loose.
  At 10.44 Voigt got the ball in the corner, sunk a three and Amherst led by 6. After that things seemed different. Here was a frosh who had not been used much in the beginning of the season, putting up a three with no hesitation, and hitting it. Suddenly it seemed as if the 'feeling' had changed. Right then I KNEW it was all over for Babson. People can say that Amherst would have won anyway but I'll remember that shot for a long time. A frosh in that pressure packed situation, coming thorugh.
   Anyway that was the shot of the game in my opinion.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 18, 2010, 07:23:10 AM
Senator....I had a theory about the midwest thing....but George Fox shot that one down last year.  It seemed like for the last number of years the championship is held in the midwest.  The Northeast teams have a 2 hour early morning bus ride to major airport.  Land in major airport in midwest and another long bus ride to the site.  If they aren't on Spring Break they've got to arrange to make up class and lab time etc.  BUT, George Fox came from Oregon to Holland last year and took care of the Northeast (NJ) and midwest (Wash U).

Agree with you on other points about Amherst.  Fiorentino and Daigneault are now heathly and could provide a spark off the bench. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 18, 2010, 11:20:21 AM
SenatorFrost...your comment with respect to Voight, the first-year player, was right on.  In the first half, she rushed her shots a little and she tends to dribble into trouble along the baseline too much for me.  However, during the 2nd half warmup, I watched Voight take a series of 3-point shots "around the horn" and hit all of them.  In the second half, Babson went into a zone defense that stymie Amherst a bit.  Voight was put in and I was waiting for her to shoot the long ball.  The shot you saw in the corner was indeed the key.  It was followed by another Amherst 3 and Babson's zone was ineffective.  Voight gives Amherst depth at the point guard spot as well as Renner
I bring up the guard play because, I believe in college at all levels, the guard play is critical.  Williams' close game with Amherst was IMO due to the improved play of the Williams' guards.  I know that the discussion has dwelled on the front court.  The front court rebounding, etc. is vital.  However, the guards get the ball to the front court and the outside shoots open up the passing lanes.  Somewhere in the postings, I remember that someone commented that Amherst's Final Four defeats last year was in part due to Amherst's smaller size guards who were "controlled" in their play by their opposites.  I know that Amherst had faced teams on their way to the Final four last year with large front courts (i.e. Tufts, NYU).  It was the guard discussion that stuck with me.  However, I believe, that Amherst is bigger, has more experience and stronger guard play this year!  Oh yes, with Voight, more depth.  Go Amherst!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: farmboy on March 18, 2010, 12:08:39 PM
Defense wins or loses tournaments.  It doesn't matter if Div. I,II, or III.  But I have noticed Div. III seems infatuated with shooting.  The Williams Guards made virtually none of the points where it mattered, however they did assist well, and move the ball.  But that begs the question...was the Amherst defense found wanting in the early going?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 18, 2010, 12:23:56 PM
Midwest plays a much more physical game under the basket than most NESCAC teams ever encounter.  Teams that try to turn high school guards and small forwards into 4s and 5s find that it doesn't sell in Peoria.  You can't go deep into the tournament without a solid front court that has years of experience in those positions.  It isn't about height or even size (although they both matter) it's about experience playing with your back to the basket in areas where the refs call loose games until they get to the NCAA tournament.  It's a different game.  Centers and power forwards out west are fearless by this point in the season while NESCAC's typical 4 and 5 are playing a finesse game.  

I was at the Depauw v. Amherst game Senator Frost mentioned and Gromacki understands this - you can tell from his recruitment and player development over the past two years.  McCormick is an example of that effort.  Colby's front court is also much more serious than in the past, but not quite in the Wash U league yet -- so Amherst will have to bring it's best inside game of the year against McFarlin and Evans.  

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 18, 2010, 12:41:30 PM
Quote from: farmboy on March 18, 2010, 12:08:39 PM
Defense wins or loses tournaments.  It doesn't matter if Div. I,II, or III. 

"Defense wins" get so much press....yet here we are, with Rochester in the Final 4....

"If you can't shoot, nothing else matters" might trump the "d wins" quote this weekend.  We'll see.     
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: farmboy on March 18, 2010, 03:09:54 PM
Well you see...that went right by your left ear.  If there is great defense, the shooter doesn't get the ball, gets off a hurried shot, just gets frustrated and is knocked off their rhythm, or most commonly are too exhausted to follow through properly.  But I don't blame you, not many examples are out there to illustrate the point.  What we need is a new statistic...the forced turnover..FO:)  Then more players would be interested in being tight on their player.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: farmboy on March 19, 2010, 12:10:02 AM
"Old Dominion Pulls Off Tourney's First Upset, Downing No. 6 Seed Notre Dame, 51-50
Monarchs hold Irish star Luke Harangody scoreless until the final minute"

Copied from NCAA recap site.

Yep....defense is dead.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: WUPHF on March 19, 2010, 09:39:05 AM
Quote from: farmboy on March 19, 2010, 12:10:02 AM
"Old Dominion Pulls Off Tourney's First Upset, Downing No. 6 Seed Notre Dame, 51-50
Monarchs hold Irish star Luke Harangody scoreless until the final minute"

Yep....defense is dead.

I think Defense wins championships is an interesting, but very generalized statement about how games and championships are won, but the game is much more complex than that.  The truth is that in addition to defense, Old Dominion had to find a way to score 51 points to win yesterday.

Defense is very much alive, but it would not bother me at all if the Defense wins championships mantra moved on in to the after life.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: slufan on March 19, 2010, 10:13:53 AM
This is the year Gromacki gets his title. It is the 3rd time he has been to the Final 4. People in the NESCAC forget that he was within 2 points of a title when he was at St. Lawrence, where he put them on the map. He made St. Lawrence a D3 powerhouse in the Northeast and is doing the same at Amherst. This is the year he wins it all...eventhough the team at St. Lawrence that lost in the finals was much better. They were a senior dominated team, and Amherst is a lot younger...the jury will be out on this discussion about the better team in a year or two. Gromacki is a great coach and Amherst fans better hope he sticks around and doesn't leave for D1. I will be cheering for (Gromacki) and  Amherst to win the title!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: WUPHF on March 19, 2010, 10:56:46 AM
Quote from: slufan on March 19, 2010, 10:13:53 AM
This is the year Gromacki gets his title. It is the 3rd time he has been to the Final 4.

I wish it worked that way. 

Coach Fahey and Washington University are in the Final Four for a record 9th time.  I thought last year, Fahey would get her 5th title.  Last year we had a great team.  And, we lost a very creative point guard and a potent offensive threat to graduation, but I think we have an even better team this year.

It should be a great game today.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 19, 2010, 03:37:42 PM
WUH.....
In the end, it is all about the play of the players, guided by the coaches.   Wash. U has set up a great system within the UAA. Amherst within the NESCAC has no "JV" team, and therefore fewer asst. coaches, fewer players.  It also doesn't have a "university" system which can allow the benefit of bringing back its best front court player as a graduate student.  The best team play will prevail. Go Jeffs!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: WUPHF on March 19, 2010, 04:19:44 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 19, 2010, 03:37:42 PM
WUH.....
In the end, it is all about the play of the players, guided by the coaches.   Wash. U has set up a great system within the UAA. Amherst within the NESCAC has no "JV" team, and therefore fewer asst. coaches, fewer players.  It also doesn't have a "university" system which can allow the benefit of bringing back its best front court player as a graduate student.  The best team play will prevail. Go Jeffs!

Its so true what you say.  If you look closely, I was only responding to the previous post.  I do not necessarily view the fact that we have graduate programs as a major advantage though it did work that way this year.

The last two games I watched were among the best games I have seen.  Very competitive, very fun to watch.  I expect quite the battle this afternoon.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 20, 2010, 11:42:05 AM
Quote from: amh63 on March 19, 2010, 03:37:42 PM
Amherst within the NESCAC has no "JV" team, and therefore fewer asst. coaches, fewer players.  

Stats are dangerous when evaluating a game unseen but the Bench points are interesting -WASHUW 30, AMH 19 - which suggests that depth was a significant factor (it almost always is in an overtime game).  Gromacki said in an interview that they were worn down.  Which explains why their shooting didn't hold up in overtime.
Wash U is deep and both their JV team and their recruiting/scouting efforts paid off in the tournament games.  
 
Congrats to the Amherst team on a fantatic season and to Coach Gromacki for a fine job -- he has raised the bar yet again for NESCAC coaches --and for winning the WBCA national Coach of the Year award.  Hats off!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 20, 2010, 02:07:09 PM
Amherst jumped out to a 11-0 lead with several 3 pt. shots.   Rochester came back with their outside shooting.  I thought it was going to be a repeat of the game with Wash. U.  HOWEVER, Amherst grinded out a double digit lead again and held the lead to win the game.  Amherst won this game due to their "bench" as Amherst rotated players  heavily in the first half.  In fact, everyone got in.  This helped Amherst stay fresh.  Rochester appeared slower and tired throughout the game as was pointed out by the announcers several times.  Seems that there was a power outage for the second game that resulted in the game ending around 11 PM. 
Though I would liked to have seen both teams fresh, etc. I believe that the double digit win reflected the difference between the teams. 
Amherst closed out the season 32-1!.     
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 21, 2010, 03:34:27 PM
Congratulation to Sarah Leyman who was selected All-Tournament at the Final 4.  Also to Stedman who was selected All-American by D3hoops.  I hope now that Gordonmann realize that Amherst has a great front court and can play with any team in any region.  Amherst had two front court players with double-doubles in the semifinal game.  Without too much pressure on the team, I expect next year, the "seniors" to lead the team back to the final four.
I am staying away from the men's board for awhile to let the dust clear away.   Instead, I will provide a story to follow and a hearty THANK YOU to the women's BB team from an old alum.
I enjoy visiting colleges in my travels. Last Spring found me in Rochester.  I took the time to visit the U.of Rochester.  There in the lobby of their field house/BB court on the left side is a glass case of important items of past athletic wins.  The basketball drew my attention.  It was inscribed with a Rochester win over Amherst during my college years.  The days of games in the now Coolidge Cage and an all male enrollment....the dark age.  I do not believe that Amherst has ever beaten the U. of Rochester in BB.  The men's BB team in 2005 lost to Rochester, I believe, in the regionals.  Though I preferred to have Amherst play Hope this past weekend, it is still nice to get "redemption" from the win over Rochester by Amherst in BB.   Thanks!..  for the win and a great season. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 22, 2010, 10:49:08 AM
QuoteI hope now that Gordonmann realize that Amherst has a great front court and can play with any team in any region.

For the most part, you're right.  Amherst's front court played well.  I underestimated them and I was wrong.  I acknowledged that in our broadcast, too.

However, I'm still left with the basic premise underlying my prediction last week.  Teams in the Northeast/East/Atlantic/Mid-Atlantic don't win national championships, regardless of how good their record is.  They haven't done in it 13 years now.  That intrigues me.

Amherst played well enough to win on Saturday, but didn't.  St. Lawence almost beat UW-Stevens Point in 2002, but didn't.  Eastern Connecticut almost beat Trinity (Texas) in 2003 but didn't.  Bowdoin almost beat Millikin in 2005 but didn't.  

If it was just a couple years, I could dismiss it as coincidence, just a couple good or bad breaks either way.  But the persistence of the results precludes this being a fluke.

My theory is that teams in this part of the country don't have enough depth in terms of big, physical players to beat the teams outside of this region at the Final Four.  Note that I'm not just talking height since there's more to physical play.  Also note that the physical advantage can apply  to guards as well as forwards.  One coach from this region suggested that's because there are so many programs, including non-Division III (D2, low level D1) competing for the same talent that they divide it up and make it much harder to establish depth.  Someone else mentioned the JV component below, which is an interesting factor I hadn't considered.

I tried this theory out on a Northeast region coach this weekend.  She agreed with the basic premise, though she thought the NESCAC schools could be immune to it since they have a wider recruiting base.

As it applies to Amherst, Leyman and Atanga McCormick certainly have the skill set I'm referring to.  But did it hurt Amherst that there wasn't a third or fourth forward on the team that did?  Did Leyman and Atanga McCormick wear down because Wash U could rotate three or four forwards throughout the game?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: kate on March 22, 2010, 12:49:32 PM
Hello, Gordon!  The idea of the NESCAC Coach regarding the competition of the East, Northeast, & Mid Atlantic colleges all going after that same talent pool is a valid one, i think.  That  same competition in some instances is a good thing - where else could our graduating senior Kim Vennera play four outstanding years of women's basketball if she attended a school in the Mid West or West?  At 5'4", she could have been overlooked in spite of her incredible basketball ability.  She was named player of the year for the MAC.  Yes, a team of giants with great athletic ability is a good thing, but giving each person who has the basketball talent a chance to play for probably the last time on a team is a good thing, too.  Interesting thoughts there.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 22, 2010, 01:12:07 PM
I have a follow up on the "factors" resulting in a lack of championships from the Eastern region in Women's BB.  One has mentioned talent, coaching, and depth.  I want to dwell on experience and leadership a bit.  Experience in winning tough games; leadership in critical times, etc.  It was pointed out by analysts with respect to the upsets in the men's Div. 1 NCAA tournament games that with the exception of Kentucky, the top seeded teams that survived the weekend had senior leadership.  The teams had experienced players that had been around for 3-4 years.  This could be the overlooked factor.  "Seniors" bring experience and therefore depth....giving that the talent level is there.  Another posters pointed out that the St. Lawrence team had senior leadership.
Amherst had young starters last year and this year the talented starters were again young....no seniors on the team.  There was a lack of depth of experienced players even when you considered the availability of injured starters from last year.
Washington University has a program that has a large squad, a JV program and the ability to have players return as graduate students.  The MVP player of the final 4 is a graduate student who has the experience of three previous final 4 play.  
The NESCAC doesn't have any form of JV programs and tend not to have large squads.  I believe that when a talented team with upperclass experience/leadership is guided by the right coach, one has a winner.
Again, I will say to all, watch out for Amherst who will be loaded with senior and junior starters with final 4 experience.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: mark_reichert on March 22, 2010, 09:30:31 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 22, 2010, 01:12:07 PM
Washington University has a program that has a large squad, a JV program and the ability to have players return as graduate students.  The MVP player of the final 4 is a graduate student who has the experience of three previous final 4 play.  

You're just going to keep going on about that, aren't you.  As many have pointed out, players who get a medical redshirt at colleges can come back for a fifth year if they have another major they want to add (and of course have the money).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 22, 2010, 09:32:17 PM
And by the way, lots of D-III colleges have graduate programs, so you might want to find another tree to bark up.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: WUPHF on March 22, 2010, 09:52:42 PM
The leadership argument was dead-on.  The Bears had a host of players who had been there before, including sophomores, juniors, and three key seniors.

The graduate student we had on the floor this weekend did win the big honors, and rightly so, but if you look at the season as a whole, she was one of several that made this all happen.

I also think the JV argument needs to be clarified.  The Bears have a 19 woman roster which is more than both Amherst and Hope, but all three schools have exactly the same number of athletic scholarships to offer. 

If you look at the box score, Amherst had 8 players with significant minutes while the Bears had 10.

And, I need to double check this, but from what I remember, the Washington University JV squad plays like 6-7 scrimmages against regional opponents.  The majority of the starters and key reserves this year never played much on the JV squad.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 23, 2010, 12:31:10 AM
Pat,
So do many Div I schools.  What is your point  in stating that obvious fact in the discussion at hand?  Veteran experience of talented players.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 23, 2010, 07:47:45 AM
I assume by number of scholarships you mean none. 

I totally agree with the senior and final four experience discussion, and I also seem to remember comments at other times on this board that the Northeast schools like Amherst/Williams have to compete with the Ivys for players....something that the midwest schools for the most part do not have to do.  To get into most NESCAC schools you're academic resume must be up to par to the Ivy's.  The pool is small and it limits the possibilities.  The admissions dept won't give the coaches many passes when it comes academic standards.  I would say the standards are similar for Wash U and they probably lose some kids to the Ivys, Northwestern etc, but not as many.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: WUPHF on March 23, 2010, 08:29:06 AM
I am boring enough that I find the elite university recruitment issue very interesting.  And, I am not expert, but here are a few thoughts.

The first is that I know Washington University competes very well with the Ivy League in the general admissions process.  Our top competitor used to be Northwestern, but in the last two years has been Yale.  In terms of the general admissions process, we are more competitive than Northwestern and at least two Ivy League schools.  Hard to believe, I know.  If you look at our Top 10 peer schools, the list includes several Ivy League schools plus Duke, Stanford, and Northwestern.

It is harder to compare the institution to non-peer schools.  Amherst has a much smaller admissions class.

An interesting question, and one that may be very hard to answer, would be to what extent do students consider the University first and the athletics program second.  Also, to what extent do students consider a Division I Ivy League program and a Division III program such as Amherst, Chicago or Washington University.

Washington University has several left and right coast players on the roster, including a Brown University transfer.  Amherst has a Chicago-area player that was reportedly recruited heavily by Coach Fahey.

I would have to think about this a little more.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 23, 2010, 12:50:06 PM
A discussion topic to attempt to find the reasons that the Eastern schools are having a difficult time winning Div3 titles has morped into topics that, though interesting are often thorny.  I must preface here that I am not trying to put down any program, school or even conferences.
The question/discussion raised is now being pursued by the media in Div.1 (men's side) in a year where UNC, UCLA, Arizona, etc. are missing in the "big dance".  The power conferences are losing, and the mid-majors are winning.  Everyone seems to be delighted to see Cornell with no scholarship in the sweet 16, just like Davidson last year.  In short, Div.1 has many levels of BB programs.
Likewise in the 400+ Div3 schools.  Are all schools the same in size, cost, requirements, etc.?  Of course not.  Just as the BB programs at the schools are uneven.  Does particular schools, on paper, have advantages over other in the "recruiting" of BB players.  Of course.  Are particular programs stronger than others?  Yes.
Even in the NESCAC, there are significant differences in enrollment.  There are several members that have graduate programs/schools that attract students.  Most of the NESCAC BB programs, both men and women, recruit around the country and even overseas. They all compete with the Ivies, the UAA schools, Stanford, Duke, state universities, etc.  Getting the students is another matter.  Why do students pick Div3 over Div1 schools?  The primary reason is to participate in more than one sport.
Somewhere the coach and the BB program available enters.  Wash. U has a great program that goes to the final 4 quite often and gets talented players.  Amherst has a great men's BB program and now, a great women's program. Both have had Div.1 transfers.
Oh yes, even in Div3, I along with others, am delighted to see schools like MIT develop a strong BB program. Being an alum of sorts of MIT, I am quite aware of the class workload on even the brightest and talented students. 
Enough said.  WUH....don't need to "defend" your school's program.  I have a frat classmate who is a native St. Louis person and went to both the WashU law and business schools.....and donates accordingly.  We both know how good Wash U. has become.  Just do not take all the great local players!  Save some for the NESCAC.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 23, 2010, 06:08:11 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 23, 2010, 12:31:10 AM
Pat,
So do many Div I schools.  What is your point  in stating that obvious fact in the discussion at hand?  Veteran experience of talented players.

I raised the point because the way you keep hitting the point in regards to Wash U makes it far from obvious that you believe that, making it sound like it's a rare advantage.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 23, 2010, 06:31:26 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 23, 2010, 12:50:06 PM
Most of the NESCAC BB programs, both men and women, recruit around the country and even overseas.

I enjoy your posts, but that is simply not an accurate statement.  NESCAC is unjustifiably arrogant in its approach to scouting and recruitment.   Very few players in NESCAC are from areas outside of their home states and/or New England. Even fewer are from regions outside the NE.  Yet how many New England high school teams are ever nationally ranked?  

NESCAC coaches tend to fish off docks in their own backyards instead of getting out into the national stream of talent.  

WashU is an extremely selective school and absolutely competes with the Ivies.  Yet the coach manages to get to the East coast to events targeting academically qualified prospects (along with Gromacki who was there) and she recruits all over the country.  Kids on nationally-ranked teams talk about coaches they've met and what they're looking for (in positions and talent) if they themselves can't qualify academically.   Word spreads like wildfire about coaches in the right places at the right time in the spring and summer of junior years when it comes to D3.

Recruiting when done right for academically elite colleges is hard work.  Two of the best college coaches I've met when it comes to recruiting nationally for academically elite schools both ended up in the Final 4.

It's not a coincidence.  
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 23, 2010, 10:17:03 PM
Title9Fan.....My statement on "recruiting" applies to all sports in general and even recent BB teams.  The Williams men's BB team was noted in the Washington Post to have players from 13 states and from Australia.  The Amherst men's team has players from Minn., California, Va.. NJ, Fla. and yes, even RI, Ct. and Mass.  The women's BB team has players from NY, NJ, ILL, Ohio, and even Mass.  It has had players from Va and other states outside of New England.  The women's national championship ice hockey team has goalies from South Carolina and California.   The men's soccer team has players from Korea, Brazil, Germany, etc.  There is another factor that must be pointed out.  In the NESCAC , their are limits put on the coaches of teams with respect to travel to meet potential recruits.  I  am aware that with respect to football, the coaches cannot visit potential recruits off-campus.  I am sure that similar restrictions apply to other sports.  It was only in the 80's that NESCAC teams were allowed to go to the NCAA...post regular season events.  These are restrictions dictated by the Presidents of the schools in the conference.  Please check the rosters of the various teams at Amherst and other conference schools.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 23, 2010, 10:46:09 PM
To cite other sports is a bit unfair in the discussion here.  However, I forgot about the pair of twins from TX on the Amherst men's BB team.  The NE area is rich with prep/private schools that provide talented players for the conference.  These schools are nationally known and attract students from around the world.  They also serve as a place for many Div.1 schools to have high school "recruits" do a post HS year to improve their study habits, etc.  The private school leagues play a high level of  BB.  The UCONN men's program has benefited in the past from such private schools.  This talent pool is primarily used on the men's side.  I do not know about the women's side.  These "local " national known private schools know about the NESCAC programs and the conference coaches reap the benefits.
I hope this clarifies areas for you, Title9Fan.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 24, 2010, 08:32:18 AM
Quote from: amh63 on March 23, 2010, 10:46:09 PM
To cite other sports is a bit unfair in the discussion here.  

It dilutes the discussion; actually derails it for the most part.  You wrote "Most of the NESCAC BB programs, both men and women, recruit around the country and even overseas."  You are wrong. 

As for the other teams and sports, there are other forum topics for those discussions; this one is NESCAC WBB.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 24, 2010, 11:35:54 AM
Quote from: gordonmann on March 22, 2010, 10:49:08 AM

My theory is that teams in this part of the country don't have enough depth in terms of big, physical players to beat the teams outside of this region at the Final Four....  

As it applies to Amherst, Leyman and Atanga McCormick certainly have the skill set I'm referring to.  But did it hurt Amherst that there wasn't a third or fourth forward on the team that did?  Did Leyman and Atanga McCormick wear down because Wash U could rotate three or four forwards throughout the game?

Each of these comments is right on the money.  McCormick remember is from Loyola in Chicago (tougher game style in high school and AAU regional as well as national circuit than New England players are used to) although she had an abbreviated senior year there.  But to your bigger point, depth is key.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 24, 2010, 11:56:52 AM
Quote from: amh63 on March 22, 2010, 01:12:07 PM
 "Seniors" bring experience and therefore depth....giving that the talent level is there.  

Experience does not equate to depth; they're two different things.  Depth is how many players can contribute at a significant level (be an "impact" player) coming off the bench.  Seniors don't automatically equate to either one.   There are seniors who haven't played much in earlier years; many who have no "big game" experience at all; and some who are primarily practice players.





Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 24, 2010, 12:04:03 PM
Interesting thoughts on recruiting, Title9Fan.  Glad to have your perspective.

Would you consider the players who played high school ball at New England prep schools to be local, even if their families are from other parts of the country?  My first thought is yes since that's where they've developed their skills, but curious to hear your thoughts.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: WUPHF on March 24, 2010, 12:10:19 PM
Quote from: Title9Fan on March 24, 2010, 11:35:54 AM
McCormick remember is from Loyola in Chicago (tougher game style in high school and AAU regional as well as national circuit than New England players are used to) although she had an abbreviated senior year there. 

It is true that the best Chicago-area schools play the toughest basketball around.  As tough as any other region.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 24, 2010, 09:11:11 PM
  NESCAC coaches have very strict rules when it comes to recruiting. Probably stricter than any other conference. However, I say probably since I can't remember exactly what those rules are.
  A few words about Wash U and their 6 coaches. Here in the EAst, I have been almost shocked upon learning just how FAR the local UAA schools (Deis and Roch)will go for basketball. Not only academically but also with the $$. Financial aid rules can be bent if one is so inclined and the UAA round here is certainly so inclined. I was talking with a UAA parent two years ago and they said that the Limbo is a way of life in UAA schools when it comes to basketball.
  Now before people get hot and bothered let me say that that there is a perfectly good and logical reason for things to be that way. The UAA schools are much bigger. Even Deis has 3200 (approx) undergrads. Wash U has at least 6000+ That means that they can take a few low scores because they have so many more people to equal things out so to speak.
   Also Wash U for example doesn't have hockey or lacrosse. Those two helmeted sports take up a few Tips here and there. Deis has no Lacrosse, hockey or football.That certainly helps the basketball team. Thus these big places (relatively speaking) that have fewer helmeted sports and bigger enrollments have a huge advantage over most NESCAC schools when it comes to basketball.
  While I'm here I'd like to say that I thought what ALex Hoover did to Caroline Stedman was pretty brutal to put it mildly. Obviously the game was more important than the health and safety of an opponent, or in this case, perhaps the word 'Enemy' may be more accurate. Stedman was no doubt stunned and shaken by the cheap shot and it's for certain it didn't help her at the line. I would not have been at all surprised if she had been badly hurt-luck was with her.
  However, all that counts is winning in some places and student athletes will do what they're told and taught. So congratulations coach Fahey et. al. I wonder which coach is in charge of brutal fouls?
  This is simply my opinion. Maybe D3 Women's hoops is no different than a Calipari team and there are probably many people who think the whole thing was no big deal.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ac08 on March 25, 2010, 12:30:12 AM
I rarely post on the womens' side of the forum, but I just wanted to congratulate Amherst for representing the NESCAC so well all year long.
Title: Latest D3 Hoops.com Pole
Post by: Maine 1 on March 25, 2010, 06:41:04 AM
Not sure the final D3 hoops .com pole as it relates to the order of the NESCAC teams makes much sense. Particularly between Colby and Bowdoin. Colby was 2-1 against Bowdoin during the season (losing in December, and then winning at Bowdoin in January, and again in the NESCAC semis at Amherst).  Colby clearly was a better team at the end of the season.  Colby lost a double overtime game to Babson (an elite 8 team) in the NCAA, and clearly should be ranked ahead of Bowdoin, and probably ahead of Williams (Williams lost 8 games, including a game to Colby at Williams).

The voters should consider the entire season, and not reputation.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 25, 2010, 07:23:11 AM
Quote from: gordonmann on March 24, 2010, 12:04:03 PM
Interesting thoughts on recruiting, Title9Fan.  Glad to have your perspective.

Would you consider the players who played high school ball at New England prep schools to be local, even if their families are from other parts of the country?  My first thought is yes since that's where they've developed their skills, but curious to hear your thoughts.

Absolutely - yes.
Title: Re: Latest D3 Hoops.com Pole
Post by: Title9Fan on March 25, 2010, 08:40:44 AM
Quote from: Maine1 on March 25, 2010, 06:41:04 AM
Not sure the final D3 hoops .com pole as it relates to the order of the NESCAC teams makes much sense. Particularly between Colby and Bowdoin. Colby was 2-1 against Bowdoin during the season (losing in December, and then winning at Bowdoin in January, and again in the NESCAC semis at Amherst).  Colby clearly was a better team at the end of the season.  Colby lost a double overtime game to Babson (an elite 8 team) in the NCAA, and clearly should be ranked ahead of Bowdoin, and probably ahead of Williams (Williams lost 8 games, including a game to Colby at Williams).

The voters should consider the entire season, and not reputation.

I have to agree with you - Colby belongs on top of the two in the final ranking.  As I've noted before, the entire team improved significantly throughout the season and that's almost always a relfection on the coaching performance.  In a big game, I'd put Gear-McBride's game coaching ability up against Gromacki's before any other NESCAC coach.  Her team is still young with a huge upside.  It's also balanced.   There's no confusion in her roster about who is doing what.   She has five positions and is building depth at each one.  They proved they could learn and improve and the improvement wasn't spotty - it was consiistent throughout the season. That's a big deal.  

Bowdoin on the other hand seems to be running on Pemper's fumes and with the graduation of seniors Rubega and Hynes I wonder about the new coach's talent and ability at a competetive D3 level (as opposed to Swarthmore) because it was a hot mess this year.  The SOS rating is relative if you want to be successful outside of the NESCAC region, which is the discussion that's been going on lately.  If you can't hold a candle to Amherst, nor beat Colby at the end of the season, you will never stand a chance against George Fox or IW, let alone Wash U.  Rochester btw was lucky.  Sometimes it's better to be lucky than good, haha.  Rochester played very sloppy ball against Christopher Newport.   In the next round, it was Kean's game to loose (which it did).  Bowdoin also had every opportunity to beat Kean.  It was  a coach's loss IMO.  

Bates was underpowered in too many positions, but you have to give them props for hitting thier stride at the right point in the season.  

Back to your point, Maine1:  Not sure why Colby didn't get the respect it deserved.    
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 25, 2010, 08:45:48 AM
Quote from: senatorfrost on March 24, 2010, 09:11:11 PM
 NESCAC coaches have very strict rules when it comes to recruiting. Probably stricter than any other conference. However, I say probably since I can't remember exactly what those rules are.

Can anyone elaborate? 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 25, 2010, 09:03:02 AM
Quote from: senatorfrost on March 24, 2010, 09:11:11 PM
While I'm here I'd like to say that I thought what ALex Hoover did to Caroline Stedman was pretty brutal to put it mildly. Obviously the game was more important than the health and safety of an opponent, or in this case, perhaps the word 'Enemy' may be more accurate. Stedman was no doubt stunned and shaken by the cheap shot and it's for certain it didn't help her at the line. I would not have been at all surprised if she had been badly hurt-luck was with her.
  However, all that counts is winning in some places and student athletes will do what they're told and taught. So congratulations coach Fahey et. al. I wonder which coach is in charge of brutal fouls?
  This is simply my opinion. Maybe D3 Women's hoops is no different than a Calipari team and there are probably many people who think the whole thing was no big deal.

I didn't see the game, Senator but that's precisely what I meant when I've referred to the Midwest as a tougher region in its style of play.  I'm sorry to hear about the play you mentioned.  

It's not about WashU per se.  It's a regional style.   When I hear people complain in New England about a game being rough I am always shocked.  I haven't seen a rough game here - ever.  

Griner for example, from Baylor who got into a lot of trouble for thowing a player to the ground was fouled hard for the entire game.  People only saw video bytes of the exact pay-back.  Griner had been seriously pushed on -- and pulled -- and hooked -- and fouled for most of the game before she threw the fouling player to the ground.  Rewind and you'll see refs not doing thier jobs.  It wasn't that they didn't see it.  It was that they ignored it.  I'm not saying Griner was right - but justified?  Probably.  Pain makes people react and she's incredibly strong.  The refs blew it by not calling the game clean from the beginning.  What about some penalties for them?

A lot of WBB games in the midwest,  at every level, would look like third-degree assault to NESCAC fans.  It's a different game from one region to the next.  I like the NESCAC "finesse" style of game much better myself, but the differences mean coaches have to plan for success if they want to go deep into the tournament outside of their region (you can't turn high school guards into college centers unless you have Shaq as an assistant coach, for example) and Gromacki is doing more of it every year.      

Again, Amherst's advantage is that its coach understands all of this and it will adapt.
They'll win a national title if Gromacki stays.  It's not "if" - it's "when".  

One of the other stengths Gromacki has in the play-offs outside of his region is that he lets the refs knows he's going to take care of his players and keep them safe.  It's a contact game, which means silence is not golden.  Refs are impossible to predict.  So you better, as a coach, be effective and competent in talking to the refs.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 25, 2010, 09:51:07 AM
I actually liked the more physical play in the midwest, except for the clothesline of Stedman and body tackle from hehind  of McCormick at end of Amherst/Wash U game.  Leyman and McCormick could actually play the physical game that they both learned in the midwest and not get called for silly touch fouls.

When it comes to NESCAC recruiting, they have very limited travel/recruiting budgets.  You don't see NESCAC coaches at the showcase tourneys in the midwest or southeast, nor do you see them at AAU national tourneys.  You do see the UAA coaches at those tournaments.  NESCAC coaches rely on what they can see in the Northeast and other kids that contact the coach due to the school's reputation, and of course word of mouth from interested alums and followers of the program.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 25, 2010, 10:11:45 AM
Nothing wrong with NESCAC's obssession with in-region games and local rivals.  But that's the answer to the question of why historically it doesn't go deep into the tournament.

It's also why serious fans of women's basketball in the NE are feeling grateful to Amherst.  They worked their way outside of the box and liked it!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: WUPHF on March 25, 2010, 10:44:13 AM
Quote from: senatorfrost on March 24, 2010, 09:11:11 PM
 NESCAC coaches have very strict rules when it comes to recruiting. Probably stricter than any other conference. However, I say probably since I can't remember exactly what those rules are.
  A few words about Wash U and their 6 coaches. Here in the EAst, I have been almost shocked upon learning just how FAR the local UAA schools (Deis and Roch)will go for basketball. Not only academically but also with the $$. Financial aid rules can be bent if one is so inclined and the UAA round here is certainly so inclined. I was talking with a UAA parent two years ago and they said that the Limbo is a way of life in UAA schools when it comes to basketball.
  Now before people get hot and bothered let me say that that there is a perfectly good and logical reason for things to be that way. The UAA schools are much bigger. Even Deis has 3200 (approx) undergrads. Wash U has at least 6000+ That means that they can take a few low scores because they have so many more people to equal things out so to speak.
   Also Wash U for example doesn't have hockey or lacrosse. Those two helmeted sports take up a few Tips here and there. Deis has no Lacrosse, hockey or football.That certainly helps the basketball team. Thus these big places (relatively speaking) that have fewer helmeted sports and bigger enrollments have a huge advantage over most NESCAC schools when it comes to basketball.
  While I'm here I'd like to say that I thought what ALex Hoover did to Caroline Stedman was pretty brutal to put it mildly. Obviously the game was more important than the health and safety of an opponent, or in this case, perhaps the word 'Enemy' may be more accurate. Stedman was no doubt stunned and shaken by the cheap shot and it's for certain it didn't help her at the line. I would not have been at all surprised if she had been badly hurt-luck was with her.
  However, all that counts is winning in some places and student athletes will do what they're told and taught. So congratulations coach Fahey et. al. I wonder which coach is in charge of brutal fouls?
  This is simply my opinion. Maybe D3 Women's hoops is no different than a Calipari team and there are probably many people who think the whole thing was no big deal.

My favorite part is the I talked to a parent, so I have proof of everything.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 25, 2010, 01:00:45 PM
Quote from: senatorfrost on March 24, 2010, 09:11:11 PM
    However, all that counts is winning in some places and student athletes will do what they're told and taught. So congratulations coach Fahey et. al. I wonder which coach is in charge of brutal fouls?

That's certainly true in general but not about Wash U.  Which isn't to say the play didn't happen the way you describe.  You just can't roll it up to those wild statements with any credibility.  It's an outstanding school with a coach who has a good reputation - is both liked and respected - and yes, wins big games.   I'm going to have to watch the archived game to see the play, but Wash U is a great program; one that doesn't deserve to be taken down based on one play. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 25, 2010, 01:05:01 PM
Sumfun....thanks for more insight of conference "recruitment limits".  However, I do believe SenatorFrost is correct to state that there are more limits put on coaches....limits imposed by the Presidents of the conference schools.  Buried in an earlier post was my statement of NCAA participation by conference teams.  The "ban" on teams was lifted in 1993.  It was preceded by a temporary lift in the mid 80's when the conference wanted to see what impact it would have on the academic schedules.
Anyway, though my info is based on the men team side, I believe it crosses over to the women teams.  Your point on the limited budget for recruiting maybe a "chicken or egg" type point (in spite of the economic conditions these days).  If you have tight limits, it follows that one's budget is smaller.  As I stated earlier in another post, I believe the football coach cannot talk to possible recruits in person off campus.  A decade or more ago, I was told by a work associate that he saw the Amherst soccer coach at an all-star game/tournament in which his son was participating (his son went on to a Div1 school to play).  I was quite surprised at the info.  The following Fall, Amherst had a new soccer coach with the previous coach going to a Div. 1 school in the mid-west, I believe.  here again, the change may be a "chicken and egg" thing.  I guess the particulars of the conference restrictions must be obtained from the AD's.
Oh yes, there is to be the first WBB all-star game in the MD/Va/DC area for both public and private HS players.....after decades of such events for the MBB players.  It was interesting to read statements that the girls enjoyed the chance to play and be recognized by their friends, etc.....even though many had played in numerous AAU-type events.  What is next?  On-line recruiting forums/updates/services that exist now for the boys.  Are there online sites now for WBB?  I am in uncharted waters here.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: WUPHF on March 25, 2010, 01:45:05 PM
Quote from: Title9Fan on March 25, 2010, 01:00:45 PM
That's certainly true in general but not about Wash U.  Which isn't to say the play didn't happen the way you describe.  You just can't roll it up to those wild statements with any credibility.  It's an outstanding school with a coach who has a good reputation - is both liked and respected - and yes, wins big games.   I'm going to have to watch the archived game to see the play, but Wash U is a great program; one that doesn't deserve to be taken down based on one play. 

If you find the archived game, can you post the link?  I watched almost the entire game and I do not remember the Hoover move, so I want to see this for myself.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 25, 2010, 02:23:09 PM
QuoteWhile I'm here I'd like to say that I thought what ALex Hoover did to Caroline Stedman was pretty brutal to put it mildly. Obviously the game was more important than the health and safety of an opponent, or in this case, perhaps the word 'Enemy' may be more accurate. Stedman was no doubt stunned and shaken by the cheap shot and it's for certain it didn't help her at the line. I would not have been at all surprised if she had been badly hurt-luck was with her.

I didn't see it that way and I don't remember Gromacki or Stedman taking exception to the foul.  And Stedman had a time out taken in between the free throws to shake off the contact.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 25, 2010, 06:35:47 PM
I'm still looking WUH - will let you know.  Although if I don't find it, Gordon's comment suffices (for me).  
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 25, 2010, 08:12:54 PM
   Parents and what they say. I once had an Amherst parent tell me his offspring had 1480 SAT's. I believed but I would not have been willing to back my conviction. I once had a parent from another NESCAC school tell me their offspring had 1160-80 SAT's. They said 1180 was not high enough for Amherst. I believed because if they really wanted to impress me a little they could have told me somewhere around 1300.
  Then I had a UAA parent tell me that their offspring scored less than 900 and they were surprised they got in to the UAA school. I also met a UAA parent who reported a less than 1000 SAT. They were also surprised and were even more surprised or pleased at the amount of financial aid.
  Then I met a parent who didn't mention any scores but did tell me about the financial aid package and how wonderful that it was for MUCH more than anyone else offered. I was told that's the way it was in the UAA (more or less) and in view of the greater class sizes it's not so unbelievable. Wash U is probably about 30-40 points higher than Deis and probably about the same as Amherst so they probably don't have to bend as much-
   So everyone is free to believe what they want. Isn't it always a choice between fantasy and reality?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 25, 2010, 08:31:38 PM
  Gee whiz I got more negative karma. Talk about hurting a person, wow. I'm stunned!!!
  I saw Wittenberg. They played what I was told was midwest style-They pushed and shoved and gave hard fouls. They were rough and I thought they bordered on the 'dirty'. The refs disagreed and I would like to point out that I never saw Wittenberg do anything as bad as what the Hoover girl did. (In D3 i.e.) I've certainly never seen a D3 woman come close to what she did. Stedman could have been very badly hurt.
  I'd like to see the film also. It doesn't matter to me what Gordon Mann says or what Title 9 fan says. I know only what I see and praising the Wash U coach because she wins and/or the school is a good one isn't going to change my mind at all. What I find very interesting is that Mr. Mann makes a judgment as to how Stedman felt based on what? How she looked on the screen? He also seems to know that her nerves were fine inside after being smashed and smashed hard. Well it's nice to have that kind of power and insight. When I was smashed I never recovered all that quickly. I needed at least 4-5 minutes.
  If I had been coaching I would have wanted revenge and that's one reason why I'm not coaching because to seek revenge in a situation like that is also wrong.

   I would like to see the film if anyone can produce it. I hope someone can make it available. I mean let's see. Wash U could certainly put it on here.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 25, 2010, 08:47:02 PM
  Just went to the site to see highlights. I was shocked to see that all they showed were baskets, mostly 3's. Very pretty-people like to see that. It was called highlights but gee whiz they left out the smashing with the game on the line. What a surprise.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 25, 2010, 11:01:27 PM
No, Senator, I made my judgment based on being at the game and having the benefit of seeing all of Amherst not react to the play.  Including the bench.  If Amherst thought it was a dirty play, they had a funny way of showing it.

And incidentally Wash U. doesn't have the power to put the video online.  It's owned by the NCAA.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 26, 2010, 12:24:43 AM
Sorry Gordon it doesn't always work like that. In 2005 I saw a player grab and violently shove an Amherst M player on a breakaway who went flying into some padding. This particular player who shoved seemed to have a screw loose as it was he who started complaining to the ref.
   The ref called the foul so there was nothing for Hixon to do since a intentional foul call is strictly a matter of judgment AND is almost never called in such a situation unless the offending player can't somehow mask her intent.
    Coach Gromacki for the most part seems to do all his complaining very quietly. I haven't seen him get too demonstrative over calls. Also the foul was called-little point in arguing. However, if you want to believe it was a wholesome foul, go right ahead.
Let me ask you a question. I saw many highlights at the Wash U site of the Amherst game-Does that mean the NCAA put them there? Is it possible Wash U filmed it the game? I think Wash U could get the tape.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on March 26, 2010, 08:25:32 AM
Frost,

I watched Fahey coach and train high school prospects for an entire week at Brandeis the summer before last.  (Much more info than you seem to have, yet you're bashing her).

If the foul as was you say, that's one thing.  (I agree that the midwest style is as you described: much more pushing, shoving and hard fouling in the paint).  But you've confused the whole issue and caused it to digress into a slam against a coach and an entire program based on one 2 second play by 1 player.

Fahey is one of those coaches who players flock to, btw.  She's got a great sense of humor and a contagious love of the game.  That's from personal experience and observations.  

Let's keep some perspective when talking about the game vs. individual people.  This is a fair issue but you've really messed it up big, and that's probably the karma result.  
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: WUPHF on March 26, 2010, 08:56:30 AM
Quote from: senatorfrost on March 26, 2010, 12:24:43 AM
However, if you want to believe it was a wholesome foul, go right ahead.

Let me ask you a question. I saw many highlights at the Wash U site of the Amherst game-Does that mean the NCAA put them there? Is it possible Wash U filmed it the game? I think Wash U could get the tape.

You seem to be a man (or woman) of extreme views. 

The foul was either brutal or wholesome.  The Bears played so aggressively that you want to call the Chancellor.  The NESCAC is a league of angels, the UAA a league of devils.  Washington University, if they have the right to distribute a highlight reel, they must have the right to distribute the entire game tape. 

Everything to you is always a choice between fantasy and reality.  Those are your words.  I am not even sure if I should take your comments seriously. 

In regards to the parent comments, do you find a seat by random parents and start asking them personal questions such as how did you son or daughter score on the college boards?  Or, did the university offer you a good financial package?

In regards to the Chancellor comment, the Chancellor and his wife were in attendance, but I do think you should call his office and complain.  That would be great.  He would probably tell you that half the local high schools play more aggressively than what you witnessed on Friday.

In regards to the actions by Coach Gromacki, obviously he knows what he is doing, but I know that if I thought the opposing team flagrantly fouled my player, I would defend my player and let the officials know.  Most coaches would, I believe.

And, finally, you have made too much of one foul, committed in the final, high pressure minutes of a Final Four game.  You suggested that this was an action of both the player, and indirectly the coach, and that position is not defensible.

I am going to have to remember to follow you next year.  Your posts are hilarious.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 26, 2010, 01:07:55 PM
Quote from: senatorfrost on March 26, 2010, 12:24:43 AM
I saw many highlights at the Wash U site of the Amherst game-Does that mean the NCAA put them there? Is it possible Wash U filmed it the game? I think Wash U could get the tape.

The schools can't use the NCAA.com broadcast, but if they taped it with their own camera, like any other news organization, they could show highlights.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Hwbb on March 26, 2010, 02:54:31 PM
Just a couple of observations on your ongoing and interesting discussion, for what they're worth (and it may be nothing), from a midwesterner who's been listening in:

On recruiting locally or nationally, this additional observation--all of Hope's starters were from high schools and hometowns closer in distance to the Hope campus than any of WashU's starters were to their campus. Advantage or disadvantage? I don't know, except that there is apparently success in both. (And while Hope doesn't compete with Ivy League schools for players, as Amherst does, it competes with the D-2 Director's Cup recipient located 15 miles away and a host of NAIA schools, all of whom offer athletic aid.)

On the "Midwestern" style of play: yes, the Hope-WashU game was, I suppose, typically Midwestern rugged. Ironically, it was officiated, and thus allowed to be rugged, by three referees from the northeast region.

For what it's worth....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: WUPHF on March 26, 2010, 05:51:28 PM
Quote from: Hwbb on March 26, 2010, 02:54:31 PM
On recruiting locally or nationally, this additional observation--all of Hope's starters were from high schools and hometowns closer in distance to the Hope campus than any of WashU's starters were to their campus. Advantage or disadvantage? I don't know, except that there is apparently success in both. (And while Hope doesn't compete with Ivy League schools for players, as Amherst does, it competes with the D-2 Director's Cup recipient located 15 miles away and a host of NAIA schools, all of whom offer athletic aid.)

On the "Midwestern" style of play: yes, the Hope-WashU game was, I suppose, typically Midwestern rugged. Ironically, it was officiated, and thus allowed to be rugged, by three referees from the northeast region.

If the NESCAC fans are not careful, they may lose this thread, at least temporarily, to the midwesterners.  It may be that there are a few fans who do not want to stop talking basketball, and this is the one of the last active threads.

Your point about the Hope College and Washington University rosters is interesting.  The same could be said about the Hope College and Washington University Final Four volleyball teams.

I do think that your observations illustrate an important, if maybe obvious, point and that is that recruiting is very complex, and there is not one-size-fits-all solution.  Each institution faces is own unique challenges and obstacles.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 26, 2010, 07:53:39 PM
  I don't mean to suggest anyone is a devil or an angel. Wash U and other UAA schools have certain advantages that lets them do things small NESCAC schools can't. However if you like the terms devils and angels go right on using them.
   I thought about it and then realized that the rough play in the midwest is understandable. I am quite sure that at a similar stage of development (about 150 years ago) New England sports were most likely very rough and violent. Remember New England has the oldest universities in the country. They were 'book larnin' while folks in other parts were Baar huntin'.
  As for the foul it was clearly brutal. I saw Wittenberg-consistently very rough from the beginning but nothing that approached the Wash U foul. Perhaps the words fantasy and reality were a bit extreme.
  Through the years I have had a few parents from other schools tell me that they wished their offspring could have gotten into Amherst. At that point I confess, I always ask for scores, but I have never initiated such a conversation. The Amherst parent was proud but irked that his offspring didn't get into Harvard.

    The chancellor response is not all that perusasive. What you are saying is the equivalent of saying 'I know Daddy I did it but Scott did it more and it was his idea.'
Speaking of the Chancellor, would he be the first Chancellor to say violence is great if it brings victory to the cause. There was a very famous Chancellor but the name escapes me. I'll think of him.
   Gromacki is extremely well behaved. I sit behind the bench to the right and near the top. I have never heard him say a word. Soft spoken. I have made too much of this? No one forces you to read what I write or to respond. I feel I have to say something when I read the fantasy (oops) that Wash U defenders write. The foul may(?) have been barely legal, but it put a young woman in jeopardy. That's what I mean by brutal and win at all costs.
   As far as fabulous Coach Fahey-obviously she can coach and recruit. Even if she can really dip, there are plenty of competitors who can do the same, so her success sort of speaks for itself. However, she obviously espouses brutal fouls. (as seen by a New Englander) Just because everybody out there does it, doesn't make it any less brutal to me.  Oh and the fact that she has a great sense of humor is very sweet.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 26, 2010, 07:55:53 PM
Quote from: senatorfrost on March 26, 2010, 07:53:39 PM
   I thought about it and then realized that the rough play in the midwest is understandable. I am quite sure that at a similar stage of development (about 150 years ago) New England sports were most likely very rough and violent. Remember New England has the oldest universities in the country. They were 'book larnin' while folks in other parts were Baar huntin'.

Spare me. This stuff is ridiculous. New England sports is somehow more developed? Get over yourself.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 26, 2010, 08:06:39 PM
  My my-there doesn't seem to be room for diversity of opinion here. By the way Pat I thought that since D3 hoops announced the game that they would have somehow had the tape/film. So then am I right in assuming that the camera(s) and the film/tape belonged to the NCAA? I would have thought they had their own announcers.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 26, 2010, 08:15:25 PM
When your "opinion" is as ridiculous as the one I quoted, then it deserves to be called out.

Midwest basketball is not some inferior, less-evolved life form. You are not some higher life form. That's arrogance of the highest order.

By the way, the NCAA hired us, Senatorfrost, same as they did last year. And the year before. They know how to find good neutral Division III basketball announcers.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: WUPHF on March 26, 2010, 09:13:54 PM
Quote from: senatorfrost on March 26, 2010, 07:53:39 PM
I thought about it and then realized that the rough play in the midwest is understandable. I am quite sure that at a similar stage of development (about 150 years ago) New England sports were most likely very rough and violent. Remember New England has the oldest universities in the country. They were 'book larnin' while folks in other parts were Baar huntin'.

In terms of arguments, you are indeed taking the road less traveled.

It is true that no one here needs to read your posts, but they get better and better each day.  The latest is absolutely the best I have read

I particularly love the history lesson.  Of course, Amherst was founded only about twenty-five years before Washington University (founded 1854).  And, basketball was not played at the collegiate level until 40 years later.  The game was first played in Massachusetts, but Naismith left soon after for the midwest.  The University of Chicago, a founding member of the Big 10, and eventually, a founding member of the University Athletic Association, started basketball in 1901.  Amherst was a football school, right?  But no matter.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 27, 2010, 12:09:44 AM
  Geez, I'm logged in all the time. I thought I unclicked. First of all I have no ties to Amherst. I am not an alum. I go to some Trinity games and once in a while some Wesleyan games. I go to more Amherst games because it's a lot closer than Wes. and easier to navigate around, so to speak, than Trinity. In past years I went to a Springfield game or two.
 I had no idea when Wash U or Amherst were founded and I had no idea they were a football school. I thought they were a baseball school because one of the lobbies has a number of old baseballs behind glass. First off I have to say that I have been laughing almost uncontrollably at the reactions to my New England v Midwest nonsense. Psst-here's a secret, I was 90% or so kidding. I say 90% because being perfectly honest,I do have some stereotypical beliefs about some folks in other  parts of the country. (The Hinterlands i.e.) However, for the most part I was kidding. Actually I was somewhat curious to see if people would react the same way that wrestling fans react to almost pure nonsense and lo and behold, some did.
  Now I've been thinking and I see I will not be able to view the tape. However, I asked myself would I have thought the brutal foul was quite as brutal if it had been dished out in a Men's game? In keeping with my policy of nothing but the truth, the answer is probably not. I guess I'm chauvinistic. I guess I don't like to see the women's game take such a turn, where the personal safety of a young girl is disregarded and the win becomes more important than safety-see how I think. I can't help it. I will always believe that it was a really brutal foul but I probably would have forgotten about it five minutes afterwards, if I saw it in a Men's game.
 'Book larnin' cracks me up.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: GoGreenGoRed on March 27, 2010, 01:10:56 AM
I don't think I'd consider a college sophomore to be a "young girl," but why not talk about semantics...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: WUPHF on March 27, 2010, 03:16:14 PM
Quote from: senatorfrost on March 27, 2010, 12:09:44 AM
First off I have to say that I have been laughing almost uncontrollably at the reactions to my New England v Midwest nonsense. Psst-here's a secret, I was 90% or so kidding. I say 90% because being perfectly honest,I do have some stereotypical beliefs about some folks in other  parts of the country. (The Hinterlands i.e.) However, for the most part I was kidding. Actually I was somewhat curious to see if people would react the same way that wrestling fans react to almost pure nonsense and lo and behold, some did.

I am trying to decide what to post next.  Do I say something to keep the garbage coming, or do I give everyone else a break and say that 10 percent of a heaping pile of garbage is, well, still garbage.  Yeah, the latter is better. 

Have a great off-season Division III basketball fans.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 27, 2010, 11:30:55 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 26, 2010, 08:15:25 PM
When your "opinion" is as ridiculous as the one I quoted, then it deserves to be called out.

Midwest basketball is not some inferior, less-evolved life form. You are not some higher life form. That's arrogance of the highest order.

By the way, the NCAA hired us, Senatorfrost, same as they did last year. And the year before. They know how to find good neutral Division III basketball announcers.

Thank You Pat!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on March 28, 2010, 08:36:49 AM
Quote from: remsleep on March 27, 2010, 11:30:55 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 26, 2010, 08:15:25 PM
When your "opinion" is as ridiculous as the one I quoted, then it deserves to be called out.

Midwest basketball is not some inferior, less-evolved life form. You are not some higher life form. That's arrogance of the highest order.

By the way, the NCAA hired us, Senatorfrost, same as they did last year. And the year before. They know how to find good neutral Division III basketball announcers.

Thank You Pat!

I second that Pat! The arrogance and elitist attitude of some of the nescac fans, coaches etc. is ridiculous.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Laserty on April 06, 2010, 10:44:30 PM
The UVM coach got the UMass job. Everyone can exhale now.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on April 07, 2010, 11:27:54 AM
A collective sigh of relief on the Amherst campus!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on April 07, 2010, 03:19:32 PM
Coaching changes are always interesting this time of the year.  However, concern that Amherst's coach would go over to UMass is  interesting but not a real one based on what I know.   An Amherst alum who knows the Amherst coach from his time at St. Lawrence gave me the background that brought Coach G. to Amherst.  The discussion was held at the men's BB Final 4 in Salem in 2008.  Later, I met Coach G. at the team dinner ( along with Coach Hixon).  Coach G. sought advice from this alum who was on the Board of Trustee/director at St. Lawrence when their friendship began.  Coach G. considered the job at Amherst his "dream job" but was not sure whether to apply because of his recent hire at Hamilton.  The Amherst alum suggested a path to take that would be respectful to Hamilton and allow Coach G. to submit an application.   My read of Coach G. is that his honor/rep and the job is more important than money.   Yet, Cornell's MBB coach just signed with Boston College.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on April 09, 2010, 11:51:01 AM
A little side item on Div 3 recruiting that surprised me.  First, a disclosure; I know very little about recruiting on the women's side, especially at the Div3 level.  However, I am learning a little.
Last night, I attended a reception in D.C. for accepted students at Amherst in the MD/VA/DC region.  I met a potential WBB player for Amherst.  She plays the guard position and was recruited by a number of Div 1 schools along with Div 3 schools.  She has met team members and is quite comfortable with Coach G., so much so that she may even attend Amherst.
She surprised me with her being aware of the vacancy at UMassAmherst and its possible effect on her options.  Speaking to her father, I learned the following:
  Parents of recruited players are quite up to date of coaching changes, etc. and the history, personality of coaches.  Her father stated that he had received a number of calls from Div 3 schools when the UMass  vacancy came up.  The message conveyed was that Coach G. may apply, etc. since the job at UMass pays 3 times the Amherst salary.  How do people know this?  Interesting that even at Div 3,  such inferences are made, rumors started.   I am learning about the competitive nature of WBB at the Div 3 level!
To convey "the rest of the story", the father made a call to Coach G..  Coach G. answered the call, by remarking that he had just come back from an interview at UMass.  After a pause, the worried father was told by Coach G. that he was just kidding.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on April 10, 2010, 11:18:45 PM
Quote from: amh63 on April 07, 2010, 03:19:32 PM
Coaching changes are always interesting this time of the year.  However, concern that Amherst's coach would go over to UMass is  interesting but not a real one based on what I know.   An Amherst alum who knows the Amherst coach from his time at St. Lawrence gave me the background that brought Coach G. to Amherst.  The discussion was held at the men's BB Final 4 in Salem in 2008.  Later, I met Coach G. at the team dinner ( along with Coach Hixon).  Coach G. sought advice from this alum who was on the Board of Trustee/director at St. Lawrence when their friendship began.  Coach G. considered the job at Amherst his "dream job" but was not sure whether to apply because of his recent hire at Hamilton.  The Amherst alum suggested a path to take that would be respectful to Hamilton and allow Coach G. to submit an application.   My read of Coach G. is that his honor/rep and the job is more important than money.   Yet, Cornell's MBB coach just signed with Boston College.
I don't get your point about Coach Donahue, new BC coach, former Cornell coach as it relates to your "read" of Coach Gromacki.  Are you suggesting that Coach Donahue values money more than his honor/rep?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on April 14, 2010, 01:01:21 PM
my comment also stated  "...and the job".  You can infer anything you want, however.   Coach G., I believe, has been at Amherst or about three years and hopes to win a national championship there.  The "job"/place should allow him to reach that goal.  The former coach at Cornell had been there for over seven years.  He won three IVY Championships the past three years.  I doubt he will ever win  a national championship or even reach a Final Four in an Ivy college. (Did Princeton reach it with Bill Bradley?).  The BC job puts him in the ACC conference and a better chance to reach the Final Four.  It will still be a major challenge but his compensation will/can be in the seven figures.  It is a win/win situation and a better job for him with min. impact on his coaching rep., IMO.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Rick Vaughn on May 11, 2010, 09:22:36 AM
Colby's McBride is a finalist for the UVM job...With her Canadian roots and UVM's great success with Canadian players, I think she could be the favorite.

http://blogs.burlingtonfreepress.com/oncampus/2010/05/10/cliffsnotes-on-uvms-coaching-candidates/
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on May 11, 2010, 10:27:48 AM
Thanks for posting the update Rick.  She'd be an outstanding choice for UVM and a big loss for Colby.  
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on May 11, 2010, 11:26:24 PM
  I agree on McBride but I think Debbie Black will get it. She appears to be a better fit. The coach from New Haven is on a downward slide so I'd be really surprised if she got it. I think McBride has done a pretty good job and remember when she first came to Colby she dumped a lot of players, so she started pretty much from scratch.
 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on May 15, 2010, 03:01:41 PM
Congratulations to Lori Gear McBride - named Head Coach at University of Vermont!
Best wishes and best of luck - ! 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Rick Vaughn on May 15, 2010, 06:14:30 PM
http://www.burlingtonfreepress.com/article/20100515/SPORTS0101/100515008/1002/SPORTS/Vermont-names-Gear-McBride-coach

The formal announcement.  Hate to toot my own horn, but I called it.

Toot, toot!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on May 17, 2010, 07:32:09 AM
Colby's a very good opportunity.  Any idea if someone has the inside track or who might be interested?   They lose two seniors who were starters, but have a good and tall group of returning players.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on May 17, 2010, 03:17:17 PM
Some will think that what Colby wants in a head coach is  a "very good" opportunity and others will avoid it like the plague.

What I'd like to know is this:

Are NESCAC colleges chasing away some of their best women's basketball coaches (Pemper, McBride in the last couple years) or are they just too good for D3 and they're being targeted for recruitment by D1 programs? 

Does D3 (& NESCAC) value outstanding WBB coaches who truly know the game in-depth and coach it well -- or do D3 ADs prefer an administrator/PR type of coach who could never/would never/will never coach D1.

???
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on May 17, 2010, 10:29:33 PM
  Obviously I was wrong. I would have chosen McBride because I like coaches who come with good W-L records. However, I really thought Black would get it. Colby still looks pretty good for next year what with the tall girls coming back as well as the frosh guards.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on May 18, 2010, 09:28:49 AM
The question with colby next season will be depth. I am not sure what they have coming in, and they had a very thin team last season.  They lose two starters, including there two best outside threats, so they will be very thin unless they have some good new recruits.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on May 19, 2010, 10:50:08 AM
With the exception of Amherst, there wasn't any depth throughout NESCAC last year, and I don't consider Amherst deep either -- they float to the top in terms of depth only by comparison.  Depth is a factor of coaching strength.  Not only in terms of recruiting prowess, but in terms of knowing how to develop players early; design game plans to exploit talent and maximize productivity; and time the season's peak.   Under Gromacki, Amherst is developing depth -- but it takes more than a season or two.  

As for Colby, that "thin" team acheived the best record in Colby history.  They had a few players who came off the bench who have big upsides -- particularly in the back court.  The Asst who is taking over as interim head coach might be able to capitalize on that if she learned anything from McBride.  McBride understands how to acheive depth and the program was on its way to becoming a major D3 program nationally.  

What happened with Colby and Amherst in terms of coaching performance this past year, makes NESCAC women's basketball better.  Anyone who doesn't appreciate that, just doesn't understand the game.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: wbbhoopsfan on May 23, 2010, 07:27:26 AM
Colby should have another year or two of success in them, but if you look at the roster and incoming players, recruiting will really need to rev up in order to sustain the success.  Nothing different from Bowdoin in many ways; when you bring in a new coach, particularly one without the experience of its predecessor, then you enter into a situation that may not be as productive.  At the same time, I think some of the NESCAC administrators might be growing frustrated with good coaches "jumping ship" for better jobs.  The hirings at Bowdoin and Colby are much "safer" than the previous ones.  It also sends a message about how important on-the-court success really is in the league to the Maine schools.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on May 26, 2010, 08:27:32 AM
I completely agree, wbbhoopsfan.  I would only add that I think the administrators need to get over it.  Top talent will always get recruited.  Guess we're in for a long ride on the mediocre train with the lame excuse that smart kids can't play ball.  Tara VanDerveer would disagree, but hey -- only the mediocre are always at their best -- and some administrators prefer that long, smooth ride, only comparing themselves and their teams to other local/regional teams.  The big picture -- shooting for the national title -- seems to not even enter the discussion.  Maybe that's why Amherst is becoming the engine that could and the one that lots of WBB fans throughout the NE want to see win it all.  Because they WANT it!!   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: wbbhoopsfan on May 26, 2010, 02:26:20 PM
Much of Amherst's success can be credited to the coach, as GP does a great job.  But, it is no coincidence that the AD at Amherst is herself a star at the Division III level in Suzanne Coffey.  She is a cut above and recognizes the importance of success in athletics to a school.  For a place like Amherst, it is one more attractive quality on top of national ranking (academic), endowment, location, etc.  It's not only wbb, either - they are good in virtually every sport.  You gotta want it.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on May 27, 2010, 04:34:25 PM
Not to mention their men's and women's tennis teams are in the top 4 in the country, and football was undefeated.   Across the board, Suzanne Coffey has supported the already excellent coaches that were there and brought in top notch coaches when there was an opening.  She came from Bates....wondering if she had similar success at Bates or has Amherst given her the green light to recruit coaches and kids that will make a difference?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on September 30, 2010, 04:38:01 PM
There is a nice write up of the summer experience of two starters/stars on the Amherst website.  Sort of a tease type article for the up coming season.  No news on incoming players until mid Nov., I guess.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on October 04, 2010, 02:10:09 PM
http://www.ncsasports.org/about-ncsa/power-rankings

Here's a good article for NESCAC fans.  The power ratings that combine Director's Cup points and US News and World Report to rate the best schools for "student" athletes.
NESCAC has 4 of the top 10.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on October 05, 2010, 11:16:39 AM
As a fan of the UAA, I laugh... not only is the director's cup a joke (benefiting the teams that offer the most sports), but the US New Report (even if you believe its credible) doesn't compare colleges to universities. So enjoy the power rankings, we'll continue to compete with the Ivies :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on October 05, 2010, 01:23:50 PM
I'd say the UAA did very well also in the "power" rankings.  Many schools in the NESCAC and UAA compete with the Ivys....at least it was the case in our household.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 05, 2010, 03:08:32 PM
I have my private doubts about the USN&WR too.  The Director's Cup is based on results, more so than number of  varsity sports provided  The key factor, I believe, is the one that gives the graduation rate of the student-athletes at the schools.  That must have put Amherst over Williams.   The AD at Amherst remarked at the Williams-Amherst Football game last year (a sport that NESCAC schools play but is not counted in the Director's Cup) that she was most proud of the number of academic All-Americans by the sport participants at Amherst.(led the conference in spite of not having the largest number of student athletes.)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on October 05, 2010, 04:29:59 PM
Yes the UAA's compete with the Ivys and Nescac and for the sake of recruiting and athletics you can add the Patriot League, etc... I was just pointing out where I think the errors are in the rankings. When you combine them, the NESCAC benefits the most. People (recruits, parents) put way too much into rankings and sometimes they don't know where the biases are with the rankings, but this composite ranking just irks me.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on October 05, 2010, 07:18:58 PM
Totally agree that have to take all rankings with a grain of salt.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PostPlay on October 14, 2010, 05:13:59 PM
Practice starts tomorrow!  And views on the NESCAC season?  Can anyone give Amherst a run for the title?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on October 15, 2010, 01:36:19 AM
Welcome to the boards PostPlay!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on October 15, 2010, 09:44:14 AM
PostPlay, welcome.  Amherst had no seniors on the team last year.  Will be interesting to see what they added, but they will be hard to unseat in the NESCAC.  Practice can start on October 15th, but I think the NESCAC doesn't start until November 1?  Girls still having captains practices and pick up games?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PostPlay on October 15, 2010, 11:49:54 AM
Quote from: Wydown Blvd. on October 15, 2010, 01:36:19 AM
Welcome to the boards PostPlay!

Thanks!  Happy to be part of the conversation!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PostPlay on October 15, 2010, 11:51:32 AM
Quote from: sumfun on October 15, 2010, 09:44:14 AM
PostPlay, welcome.  Amherst had no seniors on the team last year.  Will be interesting to see what they added, but they will be hard to unseat in the NESCAC.  Practice can start on October 15th, but I think the NESCAC doesn't start until November 1?  Girls still having captains practices and pick up games?

Thanks!  I agree on Amherst...will be tough to unseat.  Who do you think will be in the othe top slots?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on October 15, 2010, 02:46:54 PM
Bowdoin and Colby, possibly Williams since they gave Amherst a test in the Sweet 16 game, though they were blown out the other two meetings. 

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on October 16, 2010, 08:41:38 PM
Hi All - First post...

I'm glad to have found this board.  A good family friend will be playing at Amherst this year.  Her name is Jasmine Hardy and she is a sophomore.  She played at the University of New Haven last year.  She's very excited about joining the team, and is really enjoying the challenging academic side.  I'm looking forward to following the season.  Jas tells me that, yes, they do begin official practice on November 1.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 17, 2010, 12:33:50 PM
Thanks for the info on the U. of New Haven transfer, Jasmine.  Welcome aboard!.  Could you provide any info on what position she hopes to play?   Also it is interesting to note that there are two NESCAC teams playing in the D3 initial Hoop Classics tournament in Las Vegas (?) over the holidays...Bates and Amherst.  Wonder if the two teams will share flights out of Boston.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on October 17, 2010, 01:13:45 PM
Jasmine is a shooting guard.  She should give Amherst some outside scoring options.  She is also a very smart player with excellent court vision.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 18, 2010, 04:44:20 PM
Amherst has posted its WBB schedule and the preliminary roster.  No new players are listed.  From NH NESCAC Fan we are aware of Jasmine Hardy, a talented "shooting guard" that has transferred in.  I am curious if a talented guard from the DC/MD area has selected Amherst.  I met her at a welcome function in DC last Spring.  I believe her name (bad memory due to age here) is Sally Marx from Georgetown Day School.  If those posters that have players/friends on the squad and if Captain's practices have started, maybe can post here if Sally M. (no relation to the President, I believe) has participated to date.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on October 19, 2010, 06:20:19 PM
Sally Marx is at Amherst.  Here is preseason DIII News (not Hoops) poll

Here is the preseason top 25:

The Women's DIII News Top 25:
1. Amherst
2. Hope
3. Washington (Mo.)
4. Ill. Wesleyan
5. Rochester
6. Chris. Newport
7. Kean
8. Wis. Stevens Point
9. Babson
10. George Fox
11. Mt. Union
12. W. Connecticut
13. Messiah
14. St. Benedict
15. Gettysburg
16. Mary Washington
17. DePauw
18. Carthage
19. Calvin
20. Lebanon Valley
21. Roanoke
22. St. Thomas
23. Utica
24. Marymount
25. Thomas More
Others to watch include:

Southern Maine, Emmanuel, Ithaca, Cortland, La. College, Maryville, Muhlenberg, Scranton, Baruch, Moravian, DeSales, Wm. Paterson, Manhattanville, Medaille, Franklin, Ohio Wesleyan, Denison, Minn. Morris, St. Norbert, Simpson, Redlands

Surprised not to see Bowdoin, Colby, Williams or Tufts. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 19, 2010, 08:11:06 PM
Thanks Sumfun!   Interesting poll.....for a preseason one.  Many of the preseason polls, i.e. MBB, tennis...takes last year's results and repeat the standings from the NCAA results.  The poll has Amherst and Wash U. flipped from the year end standings.  This poll may have considered the changes on the squads....and the fact that Amherst could have beaten Wash. U last year if not for tired players in OT and/or on the line.   Does anyone know who provides the inputs into the poll?....writers, coaches, etc?
It is still pre...preseason and the season is long. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on October 20, 2010, 11:53:07 AM
My guess on the ranking flip has more to do with Amherst returning 100% of their team while Washington lost 3 of their 5 top scorers and rebounders.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 21, 2010, 04:17:30 PM
Thanks for the info NH NESCAC Fan.  My curiosity got the better of me and I went to the Wash U. website to find out what starters returned this year.  A. Hoover is the starter that was listed as a starter for the season and in the game with Amherst.  The other "starter" was not listed as such in the latter part of the Wash. U season or in the Amherst game.  The forward was however a major  player in the win over Amherst.   I expect her to be a starter this season.  Wash U. does keep a large squad during the season so the 14 returning letter winners on a Championship team is not surprising.
Speaking of squad size, it seems with the two known newcomers to the Amherst team, there is still room for another new player for the 15 member traveling squad.  This is also assuming that the  coach realize that having a larger team is a good thing.....especially after all the injuries last year.   Hope any additional player is a front court type player since Amherst will be thin after this season up front.  The two front court senior players are both 1st team NESCAC quality players and potentially All-American players, IMO.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jaybird44 on October 21, 2010, 08:20:00 PM
Kathryn Berger not only was pivotal in the win over Amherst, she was a most effective 6th-person top reserve who played starter-type minutes.  For much of the season, she averaged over 20 points per 40 minutes of action.  So, yes, she will be a very important player for Wash-U again this season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on October 22, 2010, 05:31:20 PM
Surprised Williams isn't getting any poll love after making the Sweet 16, and coming fairly close to knocking off Amherst in that game.  After some ups and downs, they really gelled / came together late in the season when they got healthy, and they return their entire rotation (plus perhaps another solid player who spent junior year abroad?).  They were very young last year, starting two frosh.  If Amherst is (deservedly) number one, I'd think the Ephs would at least be a top-25 team going into the season ...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 25, 2010, 04:45:55 PM
nescac1.......you worry too much.  It is only a preseason poll.  Lobbying should occur after mid-season for post-season spots.  I agree, Williams' last game with Amherst in the sweet 16 game at Amherst (I was in attendance) was worrisome.  The two first year players were major contributors.  However, Amherst did blow-out Williams in two regular season games...i.e. over 20 plus points.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 30, 2010, 04:29:48 PM
D3hoops preseason poll is up with three NESCAC teams in the top 25.   Amherst, Williams, Bowdoin and Colby selected.  Oops, that is four!  Williams' high rankling must be due to fine last game with Amherst in the Sweet 16 game at Amherst after being blown out in two earlier games.  They do have a large number of talented players returning. 
Sumfun...nice picture on the website.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on November 04, 2010, 08:43:28 AM
I just noticed that the Amherst roster has been updated to include the three new players.  In addition to Jasmine Hardy, and Sally Marx (who were previously mentioned) they also have Claire DiMario from Lake Forest, IL.  Claire is listed as a 6' forward.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on November 08, 2010, 10:47:26 PM
some thoughts on coming season--I don't see anyone beating Amherst--they bring back entire team, and they were clearly the class of the league last year.  Williams could be tough also, as they bring back their entire team, and finished strong.  Colby loses their top scorer and top outside threats, and their coach, but returns a strong group.  Bates as always will have a lot of talent, and it will be interesting to see what Bowdoin and Tufts have  Should be a very interesting and competitive season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: wbbhoopsfan on November 15, 2010, 04:41:04 PM
I have enjoyed following women's basketball in the NESCAC (and men's) for the last couple of years since moving ot Maine.  Without as much dialogue on this side of the table, compared to the men, I thought I'd try to get some activity flowing with my preseason predictions.  Please don't bash the kids (or me, haha)... just one person's humble opinion of a league where information is tough to come by.

1. AMHERST - lost nothing, got better with additions ... my pick for National Champs, too
2. WILLIAMS - were young last year but gained experience and played well at the end ... PG is a legit scorer
3. BOWDOIN - until someone proves otherwise, count on 20 wins ... may be a transition year but i like the recruiting class
4. BATES - something about this team I like ... they are scrappy and have a good PG who will need to score more in 10-11
5t. TUFTS - lost a lot but have a good guard tandem back ... coaching is strong here and Hart is key at PG
5t. COLBY - lost two key perimeter players and coach, replacing with young, unproven assistant ... talent is there but transition might be tough.
7. TRINITY - coach has worked hard to build program and they are on the brink ... could easily finish as high as 3/4 with some things going in their favor.
8. WESLEYAN - my, how they have fallen
9. MIDDLEBURY - not much exciting here, seem to be in status quo
10. CONN COLLEGE - new coach brought in a ton of kids... year away from upward movement, although could sneak into 8th spot ... proven track record as recruiter at Holy Cross will help immensley, similar to Colby a few years ago and Bowdoin before it
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: wbbhoopsfan on November 15, 2010, 04:49:42 PM
Because the league doesn't do this part either, here are my preseason all-stars.  (I did notice, however, that more and more D. III leagues are doing preseason stuff... kinda nice and fun for us hoop junkies)

POY - Stedman, Amherst
May not be top scorer in  the league, but hands down the most dymanic and talented player. 

FIRST TEAM
Colleen Hart - classic PG who can shoot and defend.  Love her game (have only seen her live 2x and a few others in jumbocast)
Sarah Leyman - very skilled post player who will dominate inside this year.
Jill Greenberg - another strong permiter player who can score in bunches.  Always has the ball in her hands.
Julianne Kowalski - classic, post player who can knock down the outside shot consistently.  If they don't change to too much, she will get a lot of touches.
Annie Burns - always active on offense and defense

Lots of good player in the league... fire away!  ;)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on November 15, 2010, 08:58:42 PM
Not much to disagree with in your analysis.  With that big bulls-eye on their back, everyone will be focusing and keying in on Amherst.  They will have to be really focused to win NESCAC.  Can't take any game lightly.  Let the fun begin!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 19, 2010, 12:31:42 PM
Started to focus my attention on BB after the end of football season.  The roster of the WBB is up on the Amherst website with all the updated pictures.  The first game is Sat. and will have live stats.  Seems the limited video hardware is assigned to cover the women's hockey games.  Maybe when the WBB team wins the national title, it will get some priority.   More likely, someone will just have to fund the school for more hardware.   I really think it is also having knowledgeable announcers available.
Let the games begin and every team/opponent have an injury free season!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Amherstfan3385 on November 21, 2010, 09:23:23 AM
Quote from: amh63 on November 19, 2010, 12:31:42 PM
Seems the limited video hardware is assigned to cover the women's hockey games.  Maybe when the WBB team wins the national title, it will get some priority.   More likely, someone will just have to fund the school for more hardware.   I really think it is also having knowledgeable announcers available.

You are right in that there is limited hardware and also students to run the hardware as Thanksgivng break started Friday.  However, as far as women's basketball not being a priority over hockey, there are a few reasons other than women's basketball hasn't won a national championshop.  The women's hockey team has won back to back national titles, is ranked #1 in the nation and was playing a league opponent on Saturday. I think that is way they chose to webcast that game.  I doubt money is an issue for Amherst since they don't charge for webcasts like some other schools (i.e. Williams).  Once Amherst get's their student body back, I expect that both men's and women's hockey and basketball to have virtually all home games webcasted.  On another note, it looks as though Amherst is going to start hot out of the gate again with a 40 point win over RPI.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on November 21, 2010, 11:58:30 AM
I went to the Amherst game last night.  They are GOOD...no real surprise there.  They won by 40 as you know.  And that was without Lem, who was in street clothes.  Someone had asked about Sally Marx earlier, and when I asked about her last night I was told that she is injured, and may be out for a while.  So, Amherst dressed 13.  They are a very deep 13.  There were presumably some first night jitters, but you couldn't really tell.  New Paltz this afternoon.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 21, 2010, 12:48:28 PM
Amherst guest poster 3385....my comments about priority was really tongue in cheek.  The hockey games have a "professional" announcer, that normally covers the UMASS games and last year volunteered to cover the Amherst games.  I hope it is so this year.
I noticed the absence of the missing players when the contest was "over" and various combinations of players entered.  I was aware of Sally Marx's injury.  Her mother dropped that info to me over Homecoming weekend in a passing conversation.
My comments wrt to the first game:  
 Jaci Daigneault  appears back to her All American form with a double double.
 Bridget Crowley appears to be playing aggressive and well, in spite of , IMO, her relative slight built.  
 Jasmine Hardy's outside shots came after her second insertion into the game.  Seems she is not afraid to rebound and play defense.
 Dunleavy seems to be returning to form also and L. Rizzo has made her presence on the floor with strong rebounding.  Did her soccer fan club show up?
 Sarah Leyman and S. Finucane were solid.
 RPI does have a 6'4" center and a 6'2" player.  Seems they did not prove effective wrt to Amherst's front court players.
 Will try to follow today's game online.
Title: Amherst // Colby
Post by: jumphigh on November 21, 2010, 02:15:05 PM
Why aren't Amherst and Colby playing each other in the tourney today?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on November 21, 2010, 02:55:24 PM
Purely a guess, but it probably is because they have not started playing in-conference yet.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on November 21, 2010, 09:07:16 PM
The match ups were pre-set in the weekend.  It wasn't a matter of winners play in championship game and losers play in consolation.  Tournament the weekend after Thanksgiving has a format of winners play winners and others play in consolation game.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 24, 2010, 12:13:23 PM
Sort of quet on this board.  Anyway, happy Thanksgiving to all.
Though last night's game of Amherst vs. MHC was a blowout, I noticed the absence of two players into the game.  Was it due to the Holiday recess?  It seems hard on the team members to have games schedule during the recess.   Does the school make arrangements for the players (all Teams), especially, the "out of area" members?
In my days in the "dark ages" of short 3-days for Thanksgiving and exams after the Christmas holidays, it was not cost efficient to go home.  I stayed with my older brother at Harvard while Amherst was closed....since we both could not afford the money/time to return to DC.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on November 30, 2010, 11:37:58 AM
How did Colby look at the Amherst tournament
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 30, 2010, 05:00:29 PM
Amherst is on the road at Keene State.  It is an early 5:30 PM game and is on the web.  It was good to read about the return of L.A. McCormick back on the court.  She made an impact in her 15 minutes.  B. Crowley's presence in the game was nice.  It answered my question in part wrt to the MHC game.   Will see if an early away game will impact the play of the team.  Will know soon enough.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 30, 2010, 08:43:45 PM
Amherst's first road game was a blowout....41 points......with all 14 dressed players playing.  Most interesting part of the game was the combinations of Amherst players throughout the game.  Scoring, rebounding and assist was well distributed.  Keene was blow out early but rebounded well with Amherst with basically a young and smaller team.  The glaring difference was the turnovers made by Keene that led to points.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on November 30, 2010, 10:10:59 PM
I have only made it to the first Amherst game, but your last comment about the Keene turnovers reminded me of something that I noticed while watching that game.  Keeping in mind that they have not had a close game yet, and therefore, very little to criticize, it seems that the one thing that the coach does not tolerate is turnovers.  About the only emotion he shows is when someone turns it over.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: toad22 on November 30, 2010, 10:51:49 PM
It is a little early in the season to be this definitive, but I have no doubt that this Williams team is the best one I have ever seen. They have strong senior leadership, talented youth, great shooting, rebounding, and ball handling. Most importantly, they are driven to be good and win. I expect a great season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 01, 2010, 08:06:38 AM
I agree about Williams for many reasons.  Seems the coach realized she really had to recruit.  Also seems that she is making a statement with 7 players.  Even with big leads, few but the top 7 see more that 5 to 8 minutes.  It's a long season and depth with on court experience will be key.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 04, 2010, 02:44:45 PM
Amherst game tonight at 8PM.  It will be on the web and is free.....go to the Amherst website.  There will be another game on Sunday. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 05, 2010, 02:54:30 PM
Pretty quiet on this board lately.
Amherst is playing Richard Stockton at 4PM this afternoon.  It will be Webcast available on the Amherst site.....free.
R. Stockton will be a step up in competition for Amherst in this Amherst Tournament championship game.
Not much to say about last night's game against Emerson.  It was another blowout with the defense leading to many points.
Was impressed with the play of B. Crowley, the tall thin F/C for Amherst.  She has good moves around the basket and plays extended defense away from the basket.  She does have good footwork and is quick.
It was noted by the announcers last night and on the conference website that Sr. Captain Sarah Leyman is one of only 5 finalist through-out Div. 1,2 and 3  for the Wooden Award......based on citizenship, grades, and sport play, etc.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BBstudent on December 06, 2010, 12:30:16 PM
Sarah Leyman has to be the epitome of the student athlete. I don't think anyone who watched Amherst women's basketball over the last three plus years can cite a single play, much less a half or a game, when Sarah did not give at least 100% effort. There may have been times when she couldn't hit the side of a barn or when you would question a pass or a shot but her work ethic and desire have been undeniable. She is the "Rudy" of the team, always working as hard as possible irrespective of the results, simply because that is how it should be done, out of respect for the game and herself.
I am sure that everyone who played against her hated every minute of it, because I know I sure would have.
(and all that good citizen stuff and pre-med workload and great GPA at an academically pretty decent  college is just fluff to a basketball fan)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 07, 2010, 10:08:01 AM
BBstudent,,,,,welcome aboard on this "board".    I guess you are an Amherst supporter.  Your post is a little confusing to me.  Sarah is indeed a hard grind it out type player.  She is also the captain and provides the leadership on and off the floor that is vital to team success.  Leadership in part by setting the example.
Somehow, your post seemed to diminish her BB talents, IMO.  Sarah has the talent.  One only has to look at her numbers in last year's semi-final game against Wash. U.
Anyway, keep on posting. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on December 07, 2010, 09:50:38 PM
Wow.  Amherst was fortunate to escape tonight with a W.  I watched the first half online before leaving my office, and the ladies clearly did not have it tonight.  They seemed tired and slow.  Passes weren't crisp, ball handling was erratic, shooting was off.  It is a long season, and nights like this will happen  Get some rest and move on.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 07, 2010, 10:20:59 PM
Write-up states that Amherst got a scare tonight in the away game.  The seniors led the way to a win and the more experienced players provided the support when the outside shots did not fall, etc.  ESU was a team that Williams beat by 18 in Boston and a team that will play Bowdoin in a few days.  I note this because Bowdoin climbed into the national ratings after its win over Colby.
Anyway, the next game with Eastern Conn. State at home will be most interesting on Thurs.  It will pit two ranked teams and two undefeated teams.  ESU is now 7-0 and has blown out a number of teams.  They do have 3 six footers on the team.  Amherst needs its rest after three games in 4 days.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BBstudent on December 07, 2010, 11:34:34 PM
Wow.  Amherst was fortunate to escape tonight with a W.  I watched the first half online before leaving my office,   and the ladies clearly did not have it tonight.  They seemed tired and slow.  Passes weren't crisp, ball handling was erratic, shooting was off.

Clearly Amherst's three point shooting was off (a loss of 9-12 points) but court side to my old and near-sighted eyes the Amherst players did not look tired or slow. The Emmanuel coach was at Sunday's Amherst game scouting and I think he did some things that other coaches haven't done against Amherst, which kept them in the game (and no, I would not like to discuss what I think those tactics were as the season is very young). In addition, Emmanuel always does some things well, such as sending a player long as soon as the ball is shot and in the first half Emmanuel must have scored 8 or more points catching Amherst with no one back. While I am sure that GP warned the team to expect that before the game, the change was made at halftime so in the second half there were no easy baskets given up because of that type of defensive lapse.
I think more then anything else this game shows what a very good coach (Andy) can do against a deeper and more talented team, even one that may be having an off night shooting (Amherst usually shoots 34% from 3-point line instead of 17%)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 08, 2010, 07:57:45 AM
First real test, and it was on the road.  Team a bit nicked up, but nothing like last year.  A win is a win, and good teams have to learn how to win when their best stuff isn't falling and they miss some easy ones right below the basket.  I have no doubt that Gromacki will make the proper adjustments and help Amherst learn from this game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on December 08, 2010, 08:40:45 AM
I'll defer to your in attendance review BB.  As I said, I was watching on the computer...not the best of pictures.  But I will say that compared to opening night (the only game I've made in person) they definitely did not look like the same team.  In fact I clicked it on shortly after it started, and I had difficulty telling if I was even watching the right game...based on the level of play that I was expecting versus what I was seeing.

By the time I got home the second half was about halfway over, and it did appear that they had made adjustments, and were moving the ball much better.  But still, I am sure they will be happy for a break here shortly.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BBstudent on December 08, 2010, 09:15:01 AM
Don't defer too quickly as I am extremely poor at judging relative speed, that is, whether a player is actually fast/quick, or only looks that way because of the competition.
The real reason I doubt they were tired is that virtually every player, prior to last night, was playing in every game for between ten and seventeen minutes, with Jaci averaging eighteen and a couple at nine minutes.
While that reduced playing time "hurts" a player's individual stats, for example for the last two years Amherst has been under-represented if you look at the NESCAC individual leaders list, it has the benefit of keeping the team healthy and at least physically fresh.
In that respect, one might even ask that instead of points, rebound, etc., per game the stats instead be per minute played, because right now Amherst players are getting their points, rebounds, assists, etc. in about half the minutes compared to other schools.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on December 08, 2010, 10:54:12 AM
Yes, it certainly has been interesting to review the box scores after each game and see that in at least one case not one player had 20 minutes...and they were still blowing teams out.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 08, 2010, 02:50:56 PM
Wasn't able to see the webcast last night and appreciate all the activity on the board wrt game.  Sure would like to get posters to discuss other teams and games.  I made reference to Bowdoin in my last post, partly because the Emmanuel team will be the common opponent of all the conference ranked teams.  Amherst, Williams and Bowdoin will soon all have  have played Emmanuel in the early season on the same floor.  I am aware that to make comparative game analyses can be most misleading.  However, with scant info sources elsewhere...what can you do?
Several points that interested me about last nights game.
1. J. Renner was not listed.  Sunday's game with R. Stockton was a rough and tumble game. A nicked player?
2. The starting lineup had M. Voigt in place of S. Finucane....though Shannon had more playing time.  Guess the coach is still working/evaluating combinations.  Marcia V., conference rookie of the year, IMO, seemed to be pressing a bit when she enters the games.  Her outside shots were not going in and she was not playing up to her ability on defense.  Was her starting a reward for her first steller game to date on Sunday?
3. C. Stedman is having a hard time so far this season "getting her game"  back.  It is good that Jaci D. is playing at her soph. year level, if not better, when she made All-America.  
4.  I see that the players having high turnover numbers had the lowest playing time among the "starters".
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 09, 2010, 10:07:07 PM
Amherst was giving a tough game tonight for most of the first half and even for a large part of the second half.  Amherst led ESU by 15 at the half due to a burst of scoring in the last minute.  In the second half, Amherst extended the lead to around 20 and it stayed that way for most of the second half.  Amherst's depth prevailed, aided by good defense.  ESU's turnovers was its downfall.  
Amherst's outside shoots started to fall in and ESU could not catch up.   ESU mixed up the defense early and seemed to confuse Amherst.  Late in the second half, ESU's full court trapping reduced the lead to 16, but Amherst adjusted and won going away.
Several points of possible interest.
Stedman did not dress.   Renner was dressed but was held out for a long period in the first half. Her injured knee was tested in the game and she played well.
The ESU fans were vocal and bothered the announcers.  Good for them!  
I wondered if ESU's president came up for the game.  She is married to an Amherst grad.  He is presently some bigwig for all of Mass.' colleges.  On the other hand,  BB was not his thing in college and probably would not meet his wife to watch a WBB game.  If he did show up, he can get on my case......since he is a classmate.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on December 10, 2010, 07:34:54 AM
I watched the Amherst game online again last night.  I don't know if it was the quality of the feed or what, but the quality of the play last night seemed much, much better than against Emmanuel the other night.  It's nice to see them cutting down on the turnovers as well.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on December 11, 2010, 07:20:51 PM
just thought I would remind everyone on this board that I believe there are a few other teams in this league besides Amherst.  (Williams, Bowdoin, Colby, et al)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 12, 2010, 09:20:29 AM
Couldn't agree more Maine1.  So let's hear what others think.  Williams is winning, but they are doing it with a 7 player rotation.  Can they be successful with the length of the season, especially against Amherst since we've seen the balanced scoring coming off Gromacki's bench?  Can Colby's new coach find the passion to help those girls remain competitive?  Can Colleen Hart carry Tufts who seems to be lacking depth, especially under the basket.  Will Bowdoin rise to its former strength or even play the spoiler role?  Start chatting....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 12, 2010, 02:25:19 PM
Maine 1.......welcome aboard and please feel free to chat about teams in the conference you like/support/watch...etc.
I hope they include the Maine teams.  Bowdoin and Colby were/are ranked teams and have talented players.  I am aware of Williams' talented team and curious about Wes., Tufts, etc.  I even look at other conference websites to check on writeups, etc.  However, I do not feel  it is my place to discuss conference teams that I do not know or have not watched live or on the web.
I encourage you if you know supporters of other conference teams , to have them post.
Oh yes, I apologize to Eastern Conn. State University for posting ESU vice ECSU.  I have been in and through the town they are situated many times.  My wife is a UConn graduate and I taught briefly at UConn, nearby.  As I posted earlier, my wife and I have met the Pres. of ECSU and even dined with her.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 14, 2010, 11:10:21 AM
Amherst game at home vs. Springfield will be on the web tonight in addition to live states.
Beside the Main schools, the conference is having a good early season of play. Via the conference website, I noticed that Midd is also unbeaten to date and that Tufts has only one lost.  Tufts has a record breaking senior guard that.  The conference games will be most interesting.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 14, 2010, 08:41:05 PM
Meant to type Maine vice Main in my last post.
Anyway, Amherst beat Springfield 69-49 tonight.  Amherst's shooting was off and Springfield would not back down.  Good defensive game from both teams.    Next games for Amherst will be in Las Vegas against some mid-west schools.  Now it will be finals and the Holiday break.
   In midst of planning my trips up North to see the Amherst teams LIVE.......It will be next year.
  Anyway........Have a good Holiday Season to all!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 15, 2010, 10:00:15 AM
Under Gromacki, Amherst is undefeated in pre holiday break games which means seniors haven't lost a game during this time.  Nice job seniors, great job coach!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on December 15, 2010, 11:11:29 AM
Anyone willing/able to take a stab at strength-of-schedule rankings in NESCAC this season?  Some very weak SOS in some of the top schedules.  Amherst looks strongest of course (Gromacki overlooks nothing) -- at least at a cursory glance.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 15, 2010, 02:50:20 PM
If you just want to concentrate on the numbers....even knowing that numbers don't tell the whole story....go to www.masseyratings.com.  Overall, ratings comes from many numerical sources, but you can also sort the teams by power, offense, home advantage, strength of schedule played, full schedule strength.  Scroll down and the conferences are also ranked.  Wisconsin is #1, Nescac #2.

Like I said, numbers don't tell the entire story and the teams have to show up and play the games, but it's fun to look and see what the numbers say.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on December 15, 2010, 04:10:03 PM
Strength of Schedule is a pretty straightforward datapoint which is why its used for play-off berths.  It can (like last year) matter.    Anyway-thanks for the link Sumfun.  The only surprise is that for the S.O.S. Full Schedule - Williams has the highest national rank within NESCAC.    

Strength of Full Schedule (FS)
1.  Williams (9th in nation for full schedule)  (116 for games played)
2.  Amherst (10 FS)  (58 GP)
3.  Tufts (34 FS)  (109 GP)
4.  Bates (52 FS)  (240 GP)
5.  Colby (54 FS) (94 GP)
6.  Bowdoin (54 FS)  (108 GP)
7.  Trinity (57 FS)  (139 GP)
8.  Middlebury (97 FS)  (307 GP)
9.  CT College  (196 FS)  (215 GP)

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 15, 2010, 06:13:46 PM
Fun to watch throughout the season as these numbers can shift and change depending on how teams do throughout their season.  Fun also to match these rankings up against D3Hoops, WBCA/ESPN poll, and D3 News Poll, especially once NCAA bracket comes out.  They can vary wildly.  Sunday afternoon in front of a fire task....otherwise, who has the time!?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on December 16, 2010, 11:14:16 AM
What the current "just numbers" i.e., strength-of-schedule (for full seasons vs. games played thus far) show is why the first half of the season is so hard to like.   Very few of the wins indicate much about the winning team.  Early season Losses among ranked winners, however,  are hugely informative.

Hey sumfun -- you wanna open up the discussion/number of participants or you wanna write boring/borderline patronizing lectures about how fun everything is?  At least the Amherst discussions have some substance.  Just sayin'....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 16, 2010, 11:37:23 AM
what?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on December 16, 2010, 12:40:30 PM
Someone's Thursday morning mamosa was a little too strong  ???

Title9Fan, I get where you are going with what the SOS reveals, but can you repost a little clearer? If you're going to jab at sumfun  ;D then at least have it make sense  ::)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PostPlay on December 16, 2010, 12:54:33 PM
Hi all--

New to the board and love the discussions!  Our daughter is a junior and is starting to look at schools and has a strong interest in the NESCACs and is a basketball player.  She plays on a HS team with 2 kids who are going D1 - -- so we know that level of ability (she is a good player but not that good).  But can someone generally categorize the ability/skill/talent of NESCAC women's  basketball?  In some NESCAC sports (womens soccer is one), you hear there is "D1 talent choosing to play D3 sports for the academics".  And we have heard NESCAC schools getting athletes in who wouldn't get in on their own.  Any thoughts?    
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 16, 2010, 04:12:57 PM
There are all levels of ability in NESCAC, but generally one of top two or three D3 leagues.  Right now at the top 4 or 5 schools there is definately D1 talent, even D1 transfers.  Not so much at the bottom 4 schools.  You'll find cases for both of your comments where a coach helped a kid get in and kids that chose academics and D3 travel schedule over ie - Ivies, Patriot League and Southern League.  Not many kids that could have played Big East, Duke, Standford or Rutgers.  (Look at score from Kean vs Rutgers yesterday)

Don't know where you live, but I'd go watch some games if you can.  Show interest to the coaches by sending in academic resumes and DVDs of an entire game. The coaches really only see kids in the Northeast.  They don't have recruiting budgets to travel to showcase tournaments and AAU Championships in the south, southeast or midwest, let alone the west.

Good luck!!



Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on December 16, 2010, 07:07:27 PM
Might as well throw this in... I know its the NESCAC forum, but I would also have your daughter look into the UAA if she wants to broaden her reach. Both are very high basketball conferences, and most importantly, the academic caliber of the universities in the UAA conference equal the colleges of the NESCAC. Also D1 talent in the UAA in the top 3 or 4 schools. Different college experience, but both are excellent academic routes.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 16, 2010, 08:38:09 PM
Totally agree about UAA.  You can tell from the rosters that kids come from all over the country to play at NESCAC and UAA schools.  Get a first-class education at great schools in great settings.  Nice mix of urban and rural depending on what type of setting and part of country they want. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PostPlay on December 17, 2010, 11:39:32 AM
Thanks to you both!  Obtaining a DVD of a complete game makes great sense.  Also, you are the second person who mentioned the UAA as a great women's basketball conference. 

As for "recruiting", since there is not a binding LOI or scholarship deal like D1, how does recruiting work?  Does a coach say "I want you" and you are in?  That is basically the D1 model assuming your kid meets NCAA minimums --which are not that high a standard).  Or is not that clear?  I hear horror stories of D3 coaches telling a kid they are in and Admissions denies or waitlists them.  Any info on the D3 recruiting process?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on December 17, 2010, 12:18:43 PM
Quote from: PostPlay on December 17, 2010, 11:39:32 AM
Thanks to you both!  Obtaining a DVD of a complete game makes great sense.  Also, you are the second person who mentioned the UAA as a great women's basketball conference. 

As for "recruiting", since there is not a binding LOI or scholarship deal like D1, how does recruiting work?  Does a coach say "I want you" and you are in?  That is basically the D1 model assuming your kid meets NCAA minimums --which are not that high a standard).  Or is not that clear?  I hear horror stories of D3 coaches telling a kid they are in and Admissions denies or waitlists them.  Any info on the D3 recruiting process?

After a coach says "I want you," then that sort of puts you on a list for slightly different consideration from the Admissions Office. That is a broad generalization, but you still have to meet or come close to meeting the same standards for admission as other students. I would say at the least the 25th percentile mark on scores/gpa (usually called "hards"). Its just that your basketball ability is now looked at as an excellent extra-curricular/leadership skill, and adds appropriately to your resume ("softs"). If there are two students with equal standing, you will basically get somewhat of a priority because you have someone in the admissions office specifically looking at your admissions profile. That's about it (legally) from the world of D3.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: hopefan on December 17, 2010, 01:26:05 PM
Wydown... I think more than tough Admissions decisions being made, many times it's the financial aid decision that is critical....   Coaches likely will not usually recruit a kid who simply is below the admissions standards of a D3 school..  why?  because if they do get in, they are not likely going to be able to stay in..  there's very little academic flexibility at most D3 schools... if you get in, you have to find a curriculum, you have to go to class (or at least take tests and do papers), and you have to pass....  and unprepared students just can't do it...

However, whereas the borderline student, or less than borderline student may be admitted, there is less likelihood  that he/she will get a good scholarship package... particularly if the student is expecting scholarship money rather than loan....  this is where the academic standing of the college comes into play...  let's look at a top fifth, high 20's ACT kid... a solid student... but not necessarily at the level a WashU would give a $25k schol to.... Wash U will admit him, might offer 10k schol and 15k in loans...  school B on the other hand is thrilled with that academic record, and would award all scholarship.... where are most kids going to end up?  School B of course.   

I really think that the kind of individual who coaches at an academic type school is well aware of the type student to go after and is therefore rarely disappointed with admissions decisions.... financial aid decisions are another thing....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on December 17, 2010, 03:24:55 PM
Quote from: PostPlay on December 17, 2010, 11:39:32 AM
Thanks to you both!  Obtaining a DVD of a complete game makes great sense.  Also, you are the second person who mentioned the UAA as a great women's basketball conference. 

As for "recruiting", since there is not a binding LOI or scholarship deal like D1, how does recruiting work?  Does a coach say "I want you" and you are in?  That is basically the D1 model assuming your kid meets NCAA minimums --which are not that high a standard).  Or is not that clear?  I hear horror stories of D3 coaches telling a kid they are in and Admissions denies or waitlists them.  Any info on the D3 recruiting process?

Rare for a good coach to tell a kid they are in, and then they are denied or waitlisted. Either the coach would wait for the official or unofficial decision to come down or the coach would see that the kids scores are high enough above admission standards and make the call. Rare, but I guess its possible.

Quote from: hopefan on December 17, 2010, 01:26:05 PM
Wydown... I think more than tough Admissions decisions being made, many times it's the financial aid decision that is critical....   Coaches likely will not usually recruit a kid who simply is below the admissions standards of a D3 school..  why?  because if they do get in, they are not likely going to be able to stay in..  there's very little academic flexibility at most D3 schools... if you get in, you have to find a curriculum, you have to go to class (or at least take tests and do papers), and you have to pass....  and unprepared students just can't do it...

However, whereas the borderline student, or less than borderline student may be admitted, there is less likelihood  that he/she will get a good scholarship package... particularly if the student is expecting scholarship money rather than loan....  this is where the academic standing of the college comes into play...  let's look at a top fifth, high 20's ACT kid... a solid student... but not necessarily at the level a WashU would give a $25k schol to.... Wash U will admit him, might offer 10k schol and 15k in loans...  school B on the other hand is thrilled with that academic record, and would award all scholarship.... where are most kids going to end up?  School B of course.   

I really think that the kind of individual who coaches at an academic type school is well aware of the type student to go after and is therefore rarely disappointed with admissions decisions.... financial aid decisions are another thing....

I agree with most of what you said above. I hadn't address finaid questions, which in the UAA are pretty interesting considering most, if not all, of the schools are able to offer merit based scholarships. I stand by what I said about admissions decisions... my short professional experience in admissions helps a bit, but I have to generalize of course.

The nescac/uaa finaid process is way too complicated for a forum post. I know you said "most kids" but every case is so drastically different, its incredible. Coaches usually have little leeway with scholarship packages, but can have its recruits to apply to certain scholarship programs or (in the UAA) particular colleges. But I agree, that the small $$s from School A, but big $$$s from School B plays a big part --- which why some schools/teams recruit better than other when they can close that gap without offering $$$s

The coach definitely tries to recruit kids that fit into the "system" both academically and athletically, but you only addressed kids that are prone to drop out of the school. More importantly is the fact that students frequently drop from the team. Coaches may not put a high-schooler high on their recruiting priority list, but they will rarely turn an application and possible acceptance down because they don't know who may just push through the crop (and stick in their program). Quite simply, a full-ride recruit in D3 may not play four years. No matter how prized the prospective student, once you get somewhere on the list, you will get that admissions push for "soft" qualities. There are more than enough academically-median student-athletes who get "10k schol and 15k loans" who pick the better school over School B's better finaid package or more importantly, sometimes that 10k/15k is the best finaid package they may receive!

Here are generalizations of different student-athletes that apply to schools in the UAA and may apply to NESCACs:
the regional kid - applies to all of the schools in the region both UAA and may include a "big state school" (to attend as a non-student-athlete) and other regional destinations, is smart enough to get into the best school, but will get money from all of the others

the ivy kid - applies to the ivies/stanford and their D1 counterparts (sometimes recuited, sometimes walk-on, sometimes non-athlete), uses the UAA as another option because UAA schools offer merit based scholarships unlike most if not all Ivies

the uaa (or insert conference here) kid - applies to every school in the UAA or conference X. may or may not talk to all of the coaches in the league and the parent/kid may or may not pit the coaches against each other

the concerned-Christian kid - applies to a UAA school, but is unsure about the nature of non-religious higher education, also applies to the higher-caliber academic religious colleges to take a peak at both

the basketball kid - has great academic #s, but applies to schools based solely on basketball talent with some minimum academic standard in mind (sometimes this is similar to a UAA kid), a testament to the Division III recruiting battles, but unlike the UAA kid, goes to the school that both fits athletically and gives the best finaid offer
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 17, 2010, 04:37:02 PM
Williams and Amherst are like the Ivys....need blind, need based.  No athletic or merit scholarships....not sure about other schools in NESCAC. 

We asked one UAA coach, how come so many on the roster?  The coach told us that they'd recruited well that year and in the spring when the phone rang it was always a kid saying that they got in and were coming.  So coaches don't always know who will end up on their doorstep.  They can even chose to cut kids come the fall if the roster is too big. 

Coaches also say that since there is no money attached to a place on the team, they have to continually recruit their current players to keep their rosters full.  I wouldn't say this is the case for Wash U or Amherst or a top program, but you can see how that could be the case with middle of the league or lower teams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: farmboy on December 18, 2010, 05:37:21 PM
Speaking in regards to NESCAC and IVY scenarios.  The coaches know that admitting anyone that does not have the academic standards to get in will not do anyone any favors.  It is quite a bit harder to go to what are already extremely challenging schools, and then add on a major sport. So IF you have the numbers AND you have the ability AND the coach feels you can contribute you will get THE push.  The most common way this is accomplished is the student will be asked to apply via early acceptance...so it requires a commitment on the part of the player.  I am sure some students just apply and get in and then go out for the sport...and occassionally make the team and play...but not real common.
                 One IVY league coach who tried to get our student into their track program said one of the biggest things they look for is that the student is well organized.  Even if they are smart and talented if they can't organize their time well they just won't be able to make it work.

Its quite a deal when your daughter or son can utilize a sport talent to get them an edge into a great school...because the truth is there are a lot of smart unidimensional kids out there.  In my opinion this option is overlooked far too often when I see Dads particularly talk like D1 is where all the greatest go...just not true.  When you are in a system that primarily wants a ballplayer then the amount of time alotted including coaching time and coaching ability is vastly greater with fairly predictable results.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on December 19, 2010, 02:32:11 PM
check the men's NESCAC boards. it has a recent post with more talk on the recruiting subject:
http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=4491.9390
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PostPlay on December 20, 2010, 09:27:37 AM
Hi Everyone--

Great perspective...thanks!

I also am guessing the visit is key -- how your kid likes the coach and team and visa versa.  Plus the facilities, dorms, etc. 

Is spring your junior year to make visits?

Thanks!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 20, 2010, 10:17:29 AM
Make first visits throughout junior year and meet coach face to face.  Go back and visit your top 2 to 5 choices depending on your time.   In the fall they can spend the night with girls on the team, watch a practice, depending on what is going on some will let you play pick up with them in pre-season practice.  That's when you can have to chat about whether coach wants you to apply early decision.

Throughout the junior year, summer and senior year send updated resumes as get new academic info (SAT scores, national merit etc) and athletic team and individual info.  Can even see if teams that you're most interested in hold a summer camp.  Might be worth attending.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 26, 2010, 07:34:58 PM
Good luck to Amherst and Bates in Vegas....if they get there????
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on December 27, 2010, 07:37:05 AM
Article which notes a future Eph:

http://www.salemnews.com/sports/x1666507115/Danvers-girls-finally-escape-feisty-Marblehead

She was her conference player of the year as a junior:

http://www.salemnews.com/sports/x1690088035/Danvers-Macdonald-named-girls-basketball-MVP-in-NEC-Small-as-boys-girls-all-star-teams-are-announced

and she is also a big soccer star (I imagine she may play both sports at Williams?)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on December 27, 2010, 06:02:49 PM
Update on D3Hoops.com Classic--

The Bates women are in Las Vegas according to Pat Coleman, but the Amherst women have not arrived in Las Vegas yet as of 5:53 PM Eastern Monday.   The Amherst women have not officially cancelled the trip yet, however, and are still attempting to get to Las Vegas in order to play at least one game.

The modified schedule for tomorrow has 3 games with Bates playing St. Norbert at 2 PM Pacific-- 5 PM Eastern, but the Amherst game vs. Kenyon will not be played as of this moment-- Whitworth v Ripon on the men's side will be played in the 4 PM Pacific/7 PM Eastern time slot instead.   Should Amherst not be able to make it to Las Vegas, St. Norbert will play Kenyon on Thursday on the women's side with Bates playing Kenyon on Wednesday at 2 PM Pacific/5 PM Eastern.

Update #2--

No Amherst game Tuesday

Revised schedule-- Tuesday from Las Vegas, NV

1.)  Men-- UW-Stevens Point v. Colorado College--  Noon Pacific,  3 PM Eastern
2.)  Women--  Bates v. St. Norbert-- 2 PM Pacific, 5 PM Eastern
3.)  Men--  Whitworth v Ripon-- 8 PM Pacific, 11 PM Eastern

Revised schedule for Wednesday

1.)   Women-- Kenyon v Bates-- 2 PM Pacific, 5 PM Eastern
2.)    Men--  Colorado College v Whitworth-- 6 PM Pacific, 8 PM Eastern
3.)    Men--  Ripon v Ramapo--  8 PM Pacific, 11 PM Eastern

Revised schedule for Thursday  

1.)  Women-- St. Norbert v Kenyon--  Noon Pacific,  3 PM Eastern

Source--  Video webcast of today's men's game between UW-Stevens Point and Ramapo from the D3Hoops.com Classic.

Update No. 3-- (Tuesday morning, 12/28-- 6:08 AM Eastern)  Should Amherst be able to make it to Las Vegas,  Amherst would play just 1 game in the tournament on Thursday-- that game would be vs. Kenyon at noon Pacific, 3 PM Eastern on Thursday, according to Kenyon's updated athletics website.  Hopefully, there will be another update during Tuesday's D3Hoops.com Classic games as to the status of Amherst's trip to Las Vegas.  The revised schedule for Wednesday is now assumed to be the Wednesday schedule for the D3Hoops.com Classic unless otherwise further updated.  

Update 3A  (Tuesday afternoon 12/28-- 3:52 PM Eastern)--  Modifications made to reflect the cancellation of Amherst's trip to Las Vegas due to the weather as announced by Amherst's athletics department this afternoon.  The games involving Amherst this week will not be made up, and St. Norbert will play Kenyon on Thursday instead.

Looking forward to seeing Bates in action.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on December 28, 2010, 03:47:41 PM
Update #4 on the D3Hoops.com Classic--

Amherst has publicly announced on their athletics website Tuesday afternoon (12/28/10) that due to the women's basketball team not being able to arrive in Las Vegas by the Noon Pacific/3 PM Eastern deadline today, the blizzard that affected New England has officially cancelled Amherst's participation in this week's D3Hoops.com Classic.

The games involving Amherst this week vs Kenyon and St. Norbert in Las Vegas will not be made up, and the revised D3Hoops.com Classic schedule is now final.

Bates will still play today and tomorrow vs St. Norbert and Kenyon respectively, and St. Norbert will play Kenyon on Thursday.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on December 28, 2010, 06:03:30 PM
I'm watching the Bates v St. Norbert game now, since I did pay for the full D3Hoops.com Classic internet package.

St. Norbert up 1 at the half in a well-played first half, but Bates had the final possession of the half and the shot to take the lead went off iron at the buzzer.

Well-played first half from both teams.

It would be interesting to see the final numbers of the people watching the games on-line vs the people attending the games in person.   Due to the weather, I would happen to think that more people will be watching the video streams on-line this week.   It looks like just family members of the players are in the stands in Las Vegas, and there doesn't seem to be that many in the arena.  The arena seats about 2,800 in the configuration set up for the D3Hoops.com Classic, from what I could get out of the videocast commentary.

Very brave attempt from Amherst to actually consider taking a charter bus to Columbus, Ohio to fly out to Las Vegas, but I guess that didn't pan out seeing that Amherst was forced to finally cancel the trip this afternoon.

According to Dave McHugh and Pat Coleman's commentary,   Bates flew early from Maine to Charlotte, NC before the storm and stayed overnight in Charlotte in order to fly out to Las Vegas to make it to the classic.  That arrangement did work for Bates, and as a result, I get to see Bates on video this week.

Back to the game.....

Update-- St. Norbert defeated Bates today, 78-69.    Bates plays Kenyon tomorrow.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on December 29, 2010, 12:53:57 AM
As expected, Bates is more resourceful than Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 29, 2010, 11:58:30 AM
Nice comment Frank U.  Considering the storm arrived on Sunday, the 26th, and the team members needed to arrive from around the country......who knows if Amherst had the option to leave a day early.   I guess one has to keep the Williams' standards up.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on December 29, 2010, 12:12:45 PM
We aim to please.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 06, 2011, 10:48:29 AM
Just thought I would give some perspective on D3 recruiting/ NESCAC.   Had a daughter that had a very successful career at a NESCAC school. The level of basketball at the top end of the NESCAC is very good (probably equivalent of low D/ DII in some places, players are probably not as fast, but overall verygood basketball). At the lower end of DIII, there are players that really aren't even good high school players--so a wide spectrum.

The student really needs to like the school they are going to. Coaches change, players get hurt, all Coaches promise many players that they will play alot.  It is a recruiting process. You have to try to see through that.

You should try to go to watch some games of the schools you are interested in.  See the team play, watch the Coach, gauge the chemistry.  Informal visits in the Spring of the junior year are great, probably more formal visits in fall of senior year are also good
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 06, 2011, 10:51:07 AM
tonights Colby-Bates game should be interesting.  Colby has played a relatively soft schedule so far, with only real challenge being Bowdoin. Bates seems to be well balanced, has depth and size.  We should get a good sense of how good each of these teams are tonight.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 06, 2011, 11:16:13 AM
Bates was a significantly different team without Igoe on the floor in Las Vegas. They need her to stay out of foul trouble. Seemed like she picked up some silly fouls, weak contact fouls and chances that weren't worth taking.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 06, 2011, 03:39:11 PM
Some comments from last night's Amherst vs Wes. game in LeFrak.  The game writeup and boxscore are on the Amherst website, so I will make some general observations and comments.
 It took almost 5 minutes for Amherst to shake off their "rust" from game condition play...since they did not play the two games in Las Vegas.   Once they turned on their defense, the Wes. turnovers came and the blowout started.
 There were several times when Amherst lost their focus and timeouts were called by the coach.  Once, when Amherst took outside shots and didn't have anyone go to the boards on a miss.  The team retreated down the court.....was this in anticipation of the Williams team which has a strong transition game.  The other time, when they got sloppy with their passes.
 Wes. went into a zone defense for a brief time and Amherst did not recognize it and adjust.
 It was interesting to see the tall Amherst lineup on the floor together.  This consisted of B. Crowley at center, Lem McCormick at forward and J. Renner at point guard.  It proved effective, especially when Jackie R. attacked the basket on the dribble and picked up fouls.  Again, I believe Renner's length on defense will help defend against good outside shooting teams....such as Williams.  Wes. had a big lineup on the floor at times and Williams can also put up a tall lineup on the floor.
 The game was very physical at times....I believe conference opponents will play Amherst physical in order to stay with them.
 The foul shooting by both teams was average and Amherst needs to improve in this area.
  The key to last night's game was the turnovers as Wes. had 25 vice 11.  The blocks, steals and shooting numbers were about even.  Amherst had more rebounds and therefore still more chances to score.
  It was good to see that all players are  contributing and that the team has good depth this year.  Effort does not decrease as subs enter the game.



 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: wbbhoopsfan on January 07, 2011, 12:37:38 AM
Watched the Colby-Bates game on video and was impressed once again by Bates' tenacity.  They never gave up and while Colby was composed early, the energy really flowed with Bates.  Bates had a couple of big runs that I think really stunned Colby but in the end, Colby was out-coached in overtime.  Murphy has a lot of games under his belt, relative to the new coach at Colby and it showed.  His kids came out of the gates in OT and looked determined while Colby looked deflated.  Taking Aarika Ritchie out in OT (I couldn't tell if she had fouled out) and replacing her with Adler was the nail in Colby's coffin.  Bates wisely played off her and she misfired badly on a couple of ill-advised three-pointers, which seemed to paraliyzed Colby's offensive flow.  Bates was agressive on the offensive end in OT and Colby looked worn down by their pressure.  (it was effective, as the TO margin was something like 24-10). 

Colby looked like it was playing not to lose, if that makes sense.

Manduca had a heck of a game for Colby but was a non-factor in OT while Dobish and Igoe were a great 1-2 punch for Bates.  I am liking this Bates team and, unfortunately for Colby, the only two times I have watched them play (once live in Brunswick and once on video tonight), they haven't looked great.  Tough transition with the coaches but they certainly have the talent to compete every night.  A big, early regional win for Bates that may prove to be a difference maker for BOTH teams come selection time.

All in all, a great game to watch from both sides.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: wbbhoopsfan on January 07, 2011, 12:48:32 AM
Hey Maine1... saw your email and assume you are the father (or mother) of Alison Cappelloni, who played at Colby and was a great player for the them last year.  Also did a quick search and saw she is coaching.  How was her experience at Colby and how is the transition going into the coaching world?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 07, 2011, 07:51:37 AM
Amh63.... agree about what you saw on Wednesday night.  I would also guess that the Williams coaches were in the crowd and Amherst didn't want to show their hand, but these teams know eachother so well.  Saturday will be VERY interesting and begin to answer some questions like how much did it hurt Amherst to not play in Vegas and is Williams as good or better than their ranking.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 07, 2011, 05:40:19 PM
For those who watched the Amh. vs. Wes. game last night, there was an unique foul called.....one I believe that the refs must call this year.  Late in the second half, a Wes. player was called for a foul to Rizzo of Amherst.  The result was Rizzo had two foul shots and Amherst would also keep the ball.  The Wes. player was called for swinging her elbow in the head area of Rizzo when both went for the ball.  New rule put in place starting this year in college games.
 Also, the refs seemed to be calling walking more this year.   Saw it in the mens game...also.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: farmboy on January 07, 2011, 09:49:59 PM
Amherst will easily handle Williams.  Williams has only played St.Mary Girl teams.  Watch and learn.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: beltsh97 on January 08, 2011, 11:07:24 AM
Just thought those of you who are Amherst fans would like to know that #1 Amherst and #9 Kean have scheduled a game for this Tuesday @ 6pm at Kean. Both teams needed to add a game after recent cancellations.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 08, 2011, 07:40:00 PM
Thanks for the heads up beltsh97.  Based on the writeup of the Kean win, the game will be played at Kean with a starting time of 6 PM.  NJ may not be as exciting as Las Vegas, but an top opponent at his time of the year will be good for Amherst.  Anyway, it is the home state of a number of the players,
  The Amherst vs. Williams game was a surprisingly easy game for Amherst...though the Williams player played the second half almost even.  Rematch at Williams not too far in the future.  Last year, Amherst won going away in the regular season two games but had to rally back to win in the sweet 16 game at Amherst in the third game.
  Sumfun...it appears that the players are playing well in spite of their "long layoff".   To my eyes, Amherst was .. quicker than Williams  overall.  The seniors for Amherst played very well and the coach kept them in for long periods of time.  Amherst also seemed to be going inside against Williams.....hoping to pick up points/fouls....though Amherst had more fouls in the first half.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on January 08, 2011, 09:48:01 PM
   I was watching the Amherst Williams game. It was late in the first half and suddenly Caroline Stedman was on a breakaway. #14 on Williams was behind her and she's a pretty fast runner. (Jennie Harding) Suddenly I had a vision. I pictured #14 putting on a burst of speed and trying to shoove Caroline Stedman from behind, and into the wall.
   Stedman had too big a lead for #14 to stop her clearly, so I braced for a second and I was very happy to see that #14 had no low life ideas in her head. It was Amherst-Williams so there was no doubt about the intensity level on both sides, but #14 drew the line so to speak.
    There are players who would have tried to catch Stedman and shoove her into the wall, but Pat Manning is simply not that kind of coach. 2 points is not worth injuring a player in my opinion, and most likely in Pat Manning's opinion also. Of course the same may be said about #14. Well who knows how these visions enter our heads and who knows why? HOw many assistants does Pat Manning have anyway?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 09, 2011, 10:42:33 AM
I did not see the game, but I am not surprised at how easily Amherst appears to have handled Willaims.  I don't see anyone challenging Amherst in the Nescac this year. They are simply too deep.  They bring 3-4 players off the bench that would be starters on everyother Nescac team.  That is an extremely deep team.  Very balanced, extremely well coached.  Obviously, anything can happen when they play the better teams, but it could be another undefeated run.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 09, 2011, 11:51:04 AM
A number of random comments after a Great Amherst weekend in sports.
Senatorfrost.....envy your live viewing of the game last night....am worry about your "visions".  Did you enjoy the games in LeFrak?  Would be interested in your game comments.
Last night, the Amherst Captains, Jaci Daigneault and Sarah Leyman, both were approaching their 1000 points milestones.  After the game, they both, I believe, need less than 10 points to reach it.  Both have had in their time at Amherst, missed games due to injuries.  Both to date have had a good to great season.  Jaci seems to be returning to her All-American form.
Last night's game indeed had its physical play.  It seemed that there were a very large numbers of contested "jump ball" calls along with bodies on the floor.  Several times, after a player went to the floor for a lose ball, other players fell on top and a jump ball was called.  A foul call in such situations would reduce such play that could cause injuries.
It is interesting to read the write ups of the MBB and WBB games on the Williams' website.  The men's coach praised his team's play in the lost.  The women's coach was not happy with her team's play in the lost.   
The William's team photo has a number of people in the picture other than players and coaches.  Often there is the trainer and even the coach's daughter( I think).  Maybe the persons near the Williams' bench were advisers or recruits.
Maine 1.....thanks for keeping me posted on the teams in Maine.   What is your take on Bowdoin?  They have only one loss to date.  I believe that Amherst will have to be careful when they go to Maine.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 09, 2011, 03:44:28 PM
Correction.......Amherst plays the Maine teams at home this year.  Still dangerous teams.
The D3hoopsville broadcast on the D3hoops website.....first of the year?....will have Coach G. as a guest.  The program runs from 7-9 PM.    Some conflict with my watching the Div1 UMaryland Duke MBB game.(local favorite teams)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 09, 2011, 09:46:33 PM
I am hoping to get to the Colby-Bowdoin game this Saturday to watch live.  Will report back on what these two teams bring.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PostPlay on January 10, 2011, 12:32:34 PM
Quote from: Maine1 on January 06, 2011, 10:48:29 AM
Just thought I would give some perspective on D3 recruiting/ NESCAC.   Had a daughter that had a very successful career at a NESCAC school. The level of basketball at the top end of the NESCAC is very good (probably equivalent of low D/ DII in some places, players are probably not as fast, but overall verygood basketball). At the lower end of DIII, there are players that really aren't even good high school players--so a wide spectrum.

The student really needs to like the school they are going to. Coaches change, players get hurt, all Coaches promise many players that they will play alot.  It is a recruiting process. You have to try to see through that.

You should try to go to watch some games of the schools you are interested in.  See the team play, watch the Coach, gauge the chemistry.  Informal visits in the Spring of the junior year are great, probably more formal visits in fall of senior year are also good

Thanks for the advice...very helpful.  How was your daughter recruited?  Did they see her in HS, AAU, showcases, camps, etc.?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: farmboy on January 10, 2011, 08:58:00 PM
Postplay

Please see my post.  BB coaches are pretty ADD so you have to be the aggressor.  Track Coaches are far better with focus etc but then again it is a bit easier to do data search for Tracksters.  Basketball stats are pretty useless for searching for good players, especially if your player is a great defensive player.

So get in their face.  Do a camp there if at all possible.  And use your phone.  Do some vids if you have the tech. The only coach that really impressed me was Gromecky (sp...not sure why I have such a problem remembering how to spell his name) who is a great judge of character and capability of players.  If you ever meet him you will agree.

But first of all love the school and what it will do for your player...BB is just a game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: HoopMama on January 10, 2011, 09:40:18 PM
Post Play - During my daughter's jr yr she sent an athletic profile and game schedule to college coaches, pretty much all NESCAC in her case, at the start of bb season.  During course of season, sent gameworthy dvd's and any press of note.  Updated athletic profile with GPA, athletic honors, etc during course of year.  Visited schools and met with coaches spring of junior year.  Fall of senior year narrowed list and went back for several overnights.  Made decision to apply ED to first choice and was accepted.  Coaches approach varied.  Some came to a hs game or sent asst coach.  Others went with dvd's, aau and showcases.  good luck.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: pureshooter on January 10, 2011, 11:41:20 PM
HoopMama
Have to like the school first, in case of injury. do i want to study here if i can't play b-ball? is the question.
study the roster, see who is leaving at your child's position, and watch a few games. watch the coach closely to see how they react during games.D-3 coach's are just as whacked as D-1, and some of the egos were amazing, in nescac and outside.
see what kind of system they play.
they will tell you how much your kid will play and all that, don't believe all the bs.
AAU coaches are usually the best link to the college level, or that is what i found. Good AAU programs will have college coaches watch tournaments they are in or even go to practices.

good luck
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PostPlay on January 11, 2011, 11:19:31 AM
Quote from: pureshooter on January 10, 2011, 11:41:20 PM
HoopMama
Have to like the school first, in case of injury. do i want to study here if i can't play b-ball? is the question.
study the roster, see who is leaving at your child's position, and watch a few games. watch the coach closely to see how they react during games.D-3 coach's are just as whacked as D-1, and some of the egos were amazing, in nescac and outside.
see what kind of system they play.
they will tell you how much your kid will play and all that, don't believe all the bs.
AAU coaches are usually the best link to the college level, or that is what i found. Good AAU programs will have college coaches watch tournaments they are in or even go to practices.

good luck

Thanks to the great points above on recruiting....very helpful!  I appreciate it.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 11, 2011, 11:49:09 AM
Amherst plays Keen at 6PM in NJ.  It is a game to fill the schedule after missing the 2 Vegas games.  It will have stats and video.
In the latest WBB polls, Kean has moved up to no. 6 from 9th in the rankings.
During the radio/video show on Hoopsville , several interesting bits of info emerged.  One, Sarah Leyman, was the only player from Amherst to make to Vegas.  She is from Cinn. Ohio and is one of the Sr. Captains.  Typical of her play....determination to overcome barriers.
Second,  Coach G. was still trying to get another game scheduled.....even calling some Div. 1 schools for a makeup game.  Having a hard time to date.
For the posters who have kids in the college search.....you may watch some college games online and or attend some games to gage the level of play at the schools and the style of the coaches and the team play.   Tonight's game maybe a good one to see two top teams play.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 11, 2011, 12:34:43 PM
Post Play

Looks like you have received some good advice on the board regarding the recruiting process.

In my daughters case, she was recruited primarily through AAU.  Most coaches attend the key AAU tournaments, and this is where players can stand out and make an impact.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jumpshot on January 11, 2011, 08:19:21 PM
Amherst women stunned by Kean in overtime tonight.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PostPlay on January 11, 2011, 09:20:24 PM
Quote from: Maine1 on January 11, 2011, 12:34:43 PM
Post Play

Looks like you have received some good advice on the board regarding the recruiting process.

In my daughters case, she was recruited primarily through AAU.  Most coaches attend the key AAU tournaments, and this is where players can stand out and make an impact.

Thanks Maine 1!   Did she end up at a NESCAC school and/or did you look at other D3 schools?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on January 12, 2011, 05:52:37 AM
Congratulations to Jaci Daigneault and Sarah Leyman on becoming the 9th and 10th players in Amherst women's basketball history to join the 1,000 Point Club.

I was wishing that your accomplishments could have been in the context of an Amherst victory, but the fact that the result of the Amherst/Kean game did not go as I hoped does not take away from these worthy achievements.

The Kean University press release of the game has already been posted on D3Hoops.com, but Amherst has added some perspective to the release which can be seen  here.  (http://www.amherst.edu/athletics/teams/winter/basketball-w/articles/2010-11/0111_kean)

I watched the final few minutes of regulation and the overtime of the Amherst v Kean game-- it was an entertaining affair.  I wished that there would have been some post-game comments from Coach Gromacki of Amherst and Coach Sharp of Kean, but I will take what I can get.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: kate on January 12, 2011, 10:28:51 AM
Good morning, Deiscanton.  The teams were probably in a hurry to get out of Harwood to beat the storm.  My team is Delaware Valley College, but i've always followed Kean, since they beat us in an opening tourney several years ago, and have come to really appreciate them.  Congratulations to your two 1,000 point players, and i certainly hope the team made it home safely.  Incidentally, DeSales University is in our MAC Freedom league, and DSU, while having a fair season, took Kean to OT just the other week.  Nothing like D3 Women's Basketball!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 12, 2011, 01:12:30 PM
Just finished cleaning off the car after the snowfall......and focusing my thoughts for this post after last night's Amherst lost to Kean.
I hope the team got back to school and everyone is ok......several Amherst sports events have been postponed today and Ct. got over 22 inches to date......the team had to travel thru Ct. to get back.
I basically missed the game last night.  My Mac laptop did not get the video feed and the "livestats" feed froze after the first half.
Thought the storm was messing with the internet/broadband , etc. It was after 10pm before the Kean website posted the win.
Anyway, after going over the boxscore, and reading the writeups available to date, I have a number of comments and general questions which I will put forth and hope posters will provide me info and their viewpoints.
First, my congrats to the senior captains who both reached a milepost last night as well.  The stats show both had 10 rebounds and 5 fouls each!
Anyway, I must preface my comments to give a brief bio that may explain a little about my points to follow.  I have been a college BB junkie for over 50 years in the DC area.  I am a "first class junkie" and a "third-rate BB player".  I have watched and played in local playground games along side many local HS BB legends that have gone on to star in college, etc.  I have watched playground games with the former coach of the Boston Celtics and many local sports writers.  As a player, I was not as good as my two sons at Amherst!  My comments:
The OT lost at Keen had great similarities to the last game Amherst lost....in the semifinal game against Wash U.  BOTH GAMES WENT INTO OVERTIME.  In both games, Amherst lead after the first half.  In both games, Amherst had a good chance to win in the last minute on the foul line.  In the Final four, Amherst ran out of steam in OT.  This time, it looked like the Amherst team may have tired also.  Coach G. recognized the problem and this year, rotation seemed to include more players, etc.  In the game with Kean, only 8 players were used and one was in for only 9 minutes.  Kean used more players and their bench contributed a great deal.  Was Coach G. seeing how his "core starters" would play against a top team that was as quick as his team and in a close game?
Was Kean a physical team?  In the Final 4 , Wssh U. played a physical game against Amherst and it affected Amherst play.
Amherst was out rebounded by Kean and there were tons of fouls.  Both of Amherst captains fouled out. and 2 other starters had 4 fouls.  Who was on the floor for Amherst in the late minutes of the game...in OT?
Amherst's offense seemed favor the 3-point shot too much...30 attempts!  Why didn't the players go inside more?  Stedman is a terrific player and uses her quickness to get down the floor and put up inside shots when she can.  She was in for 29 minutes and had 2 points, few rebounds, and was 0-7 from the field and 0-6 from outside!  She has recovered from a back problem recently.  Did she shy away from going inside?
J. Renner is also a good driver.  Did she drive inside during her time in the game.
It was a good game for Amherst....one to learn from....and hopefully the coach will adjust better, IMO, the next time the players face an aggresive, apparent physical team that has both depth and quickness to match Amherst.  It is an away game and in post season play, there will be many more.....a lost then will be more costly.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: farmboy on January 12, 2011, 07:45:27 PM
I give Amherst and coach G credit for playing real teams in an effort to better themselves for the final push.  Too many of these "top ranked" teams play lesser teams to pad their appearance.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BBstudent on January 13, 2011, 11:47:13 AM
Amherst vs Kean   >:(
I haven't seen Kean play before so I can't make a comparison to their other games, and the following is not meant to minimize Kean's accomplishment in any way but I can say that based on how Amherst played, Amherst did not deserve to win. It might have been the emotional let down from the Williams' game or any number of excuses (and we all know about those) but the Amherst team looked completely out of it mentally. Just one example, for the first time in maybe 100 of the Amherst games I've seen, no one boxed out the shooter on a foul shot and they gave up a put back. I know I have missed games and have missed plays at games I've attended, but that mental lapse was a first, going back all the way to 2003. Without getting into details, Amherst's passing was poor, their vision was atrocious and the boxing out for the whole game was mediocre (when it wasn't worse then that). Since shooting comes and goes for everyone at every level I don't consider that a factor in the loss. If Amherst had done everything they usually do this might have been a more interesting game instead of for me, just a frustrating one.
That the game went to overtime is, IMHO, a tribute to how deep and talented the Amherst team is, and not a reflection of how they actually played.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on January 13, 2011, 12:47:53 PM
AMH63 - I just read your post about the difficulty with the live stats and the video.  I, too, had a hard time with the frozen livestats, and then couldn't get the Live feed to work either...until I went to the Kean website.  Their live stats were also frozen, but I was able to get the OT live feed to work through their link...not through Amherst's.   You may have tried that as well, but I thought it worth mentioning for the future.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 13, 2011, 11:02:15 PM
Did you guys ever try the links on D3hoops.com? :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 14, 2011, 12:19:39 PM
I tried the Kean and Amherst site and got the frozen stats.  The video feed failures at both sites happen early and never tried again.
Pat C. ....is there any technical based reason why the D3hoops site feed would be better than the school sites?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 14, 2011, 09:47:41 PM
Amherst 61-Conn 42........Both team had 27 points in the second half.  Everyone dressed played for Amherst.  The stats for Amherst were ugly......less than 30% from the field......over 30 attempts from 3-point land and 27% shooting.  Foul shooting was under 60%.   Rebounding and generating turnovers gave Amherst the victory margin.
Only positive factors are the starters got some rest and everyone got some game experience.  Oh yes, Conn also shot poorly.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 14, 2011, 10:23:00 PM
Quote from: amh63 on January 14, 2011, 12:19:39 PM
I tried the Kean and Amherst site and got the frozen stats.  The video feed failures at both sites happen early and never tried again.
Pat C. ....is there any technical based reason why the D3hoops site feed would be better than the school sites?

No, it would all be the same feed, but we may have had a different link to it, based on what NH NESCAC Fan said. We would have had the same link Kean had, the one that NH NESCAC fan said worked for him.

There are multiple ways to get to the same video -- someone could choose to link to the page the video is on, or to the video URL itself.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 15, 2011, 10:09:27 AM
Any one have feedback from the Williams-Bates game.  Based on the recap, looked to be a very close game.  Appears that Williams has no depth (I think 3-4 players played 35 plus minutes).   Tufts easliy handled MIddlebury, who had a 9-1 preseason record.  It will be interesting to see who emerges as the number two team in the NESCAC among Williams, Bowdoin, Colby, Tufts, and Bates.  I would expect some very close games among that group.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 15, 2011, 11:21:54 AM
I guess persistence is the key!  Last night, I watched the WBB game at Bates to see Bates.  The game got away from Bates early in the first half.  Found out that the "big girl" for Bates is a cousin of the "big girl" from Williams.  Went away from the game and went to the Conn. website to see if I could get a score of the Amherst/Conn game.  Went to the WBB schedule site and there was a "Live Stats" notice.  Hit it and lo and behold, got live stats of the game.  Saw on D3 hoops that Bates was only 4 points behind at the half.  Went back to the Bates game and watched for awhile.  Bates even went ahead in the second half by several points.  Their defense was better and their hustle and intensity of play help them stay even with Williams for much of the second half.
Williams found it hard to score inside.  Their lead in the first half......by 17 at one time...was due primarily to solid shooting on their part and turnovers by Bates.....also problems by Bates getting their offense going.
Went back to the Amherst game when Bates was down by 6-7 late in the game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 15, 2011, 12:11:57 PM
I thought Bates, especially in their steamer of a gym, might knock off Williams last night.  Bates is tenacious and has some outside shooters.  Amherst came out smoking up 16-0 before Conn knew what hit them, and Amherst easily stopped their leading scorer under the basket. Hope the Conn's young players work hard and stick with it as there is some talent there.  With a big lead Amherst is still playing a bit sloppy and needs to clean it up as better competition is around the corner.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 15, 2011, 05:53:45 PM
Amherst 80-Wesleyan 30......game at Wes.   Blowout worst than at home.  It must have been a tough week of practice to get back to basics and to sharpen the shooting and passing.  It was 41-12 at the half.  Enough said.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 16, 2011, 06:53:06 AM
Bowdoin-Colby

Both teams play outstanding defense. Difference in the game was that Bowdoin was able to create more opportunities in half-court offense.  Guards for Bowdoin (number 2 and 3) were abe to penetrate, get to the rim, and create scoring opportunities.  Colby was unable to exploit its height advantage in the post, and outsdie shooting was not on.  Colby needs to get Mack more involved in the offense.  Bowdoin did a really nice job trapping the Colby guards and really disrupting the Colby offense.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: wbbhoopsfan on January 16, 2011, 08:26:05 AM
Was at the Colby-Bowdoin game and Maine1 is right on.  Colby looked very flustered by Bowdoin's pressure, just as they were in Brunswick back in December.  Perhaps missing Bennett wore down the other guards but it seems like Colby's guards aren't very comfortable with pressure.  Mack is way to passive on offense - not sure if it is her issue or a team issue in terms of getting her more involved offensively but when the guards are being harrassed all over the floor, it is hard to get set in the halfcourt.  A return trip to the NCAA's appears to be sliding away...  Bowdoin, meanwhile, looked prepared, confident and brought a great game plan to Waterville.  Definitely a different style of play under Shibles (vs. Pemper) but it is turning out to be equally as effective.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 16, 2011, 09:33:57 AM
Hey wbbhoops fan-looks like we both say the same game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 16, 2011, 02:45:35 PM
In a previous  post about the Williams/Bates game, I remarked that the two opposing teams centers were cousins.  Bates' center, Jessie Igoe is from Lexington Ma. and Claire Baecher of Wlliams is from Brunswick Me.  Wasn't sure how to spell their names in my last post.....a sin for sure.
Forgot to mention that Kim Fiorentino, the starting guard, for Amherst is having a fine season to date.  She was the high scorer with 14 points in 19 minutes.  
Anyone surprised that Williams had to go to OT to beat Tufts?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 16, 2011, 03:48:57 PM
I was not surprised that Willaims-Tufts went OT--At Tufts.  Tufts has talented guards, and there Coach has had consistently strong teams over the past 5-6 seasons.  As I mentioned in an earlier post, it appears that Williams/Bates/Bowdoin/Colby/Tufts are very comptetitve, so we should expect close games among that group all season. Will be interesting to see how Trinity fairs against this group.  Next week Tufts and  Bates play at Colby and Bowdoin--would not be surprised if they all go 1-1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 18, 2011, 09:04:10 PM
Amherst has picked up another game.  It will be at Farmingdale State Un. in NY.  The opponent has a 10-4 record to date and was in last year's NCAA tournament.  Live stats will be available.  The game is a 5:30 pm on Thursday the 20th of Jan.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on January 19, 2011, 10:03:37 AM
Quote from: farmboy on January 12, 2011, 07:45:27 PM
I give Amherst and coach G credit for playing real teams in an effort to better themselves for the final push.  Too many of these "top ranked" teams play lesser teams to pad their appearance.

Absolutely the case.  Good for Gromacki for breaking the mold. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 20, 2011, 07:44:40 AM
I would guess that since the Amherst men are playing well this season that Amherst women may not have the opportunity to host the first two rounds of the NCAA as they have in the last two years.  Gromacki has to have his team ready to play good teams on the road. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 21, 2011, 11:08:28 AM
Amherst and Williams ought to have a pretty easy weekend.  Tufts and Bates at Bowdoin and Colby ought to provide some more insight as to the best challengers to Williams and Amherst. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on January 21, 2011, 11:22:56 PM
Saw the Tufts-Bowdoin womens' game earlier tonight......was not surprised that Tufts won but I was stunned at the gap between the two teams.   Berube has her team play an offensive style that is much different than almost any D3 womens' team I have seen....namely, everybody clear out and let Hart or Konegay go one on one and try to create....that kind of confidence in D3 guards is rare....amazingly, Bowdoin almost never tried to stop or slow down the ball in the back court allowing the two guards for Tufts to pretty much do what they wanted to do.  More impressive, however was Tufts ability to generally stuff Bowdoin's efforts on the offensive end...Bowdoin does not have the kind of players who can beat tight defense off the dribble..Tufts figured that out and basically shut them down.   
On another point, why is Bowdoin not getting any of the good recruits from Maine?.....recruiting performance in-state for past two classes is poor.  Colby, especially, much better....this will spell trouble for the Polar Bears despite their current good record....soon they will have to replace the Bergerons, Sweeneys, Henriksons, etc.....the cupboard is looking bare.
Nobody is going to challenge Amherst....Williams is not even in the same universe....and for the life of me I cannot figure out how they beat Tufts.    In the end, after Amherst, it will likely be Tufts.....hopefully they get a shot at an at-large berth....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 22, 2011, 06:24:04 AM
I watched the Colby-Bates game last night.  A triple overtime game, although both teams had plenty of opportunity to put the game away before that. Colby was able to win primiarly on the strenght of offensive rebounding and good free-throw shooting. Based on the games I have seen so far, they struggle with getting good looks out of the set offense.  Also, their guards are not comfortable with pressure--I expect that Tufts will give the guards fits today.  Bates did not do a good job at all rebounding. These are two even teams, and I suspect both are a bit below Tufts and Williams, and Bowdoin.  Colby has no bench, as in a triple overtime game, they essentially went with 6 players. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Title9Fan on January 22, 2011, 08:34:08 AM
Quote from: remsleep on January 21, 2011, 11:22:56 PM
On another point, why is Bowdoin not getting any of the good recruits from Maine?.....recruiting performance in-state for past two classes is poor.  Colby, especially, much better....this will spell trouble for the Polar Bears despite their current good record....

Why does it matter where they're (talented players) from?  These aren't community colleges and the teams ought to reflect their campuses.  Recruiting prowess matters and it needs to be less about geography and more about talent if a NESCAC team is going to take a national champsionship any decade soon.   Pemper and Gear-McBride were both strong recruiters.  Colby's recruits under Gear-McBride were strong and geographically incidental.  "Local" mattered to her only because it improved the likelihood they'd attend if accepted.   Gromacki doesn't care where talented propsects are from and he works his arse off to scout and evaluate them.  (Really impressive level-of-effort throughout the entire process).  I suspect Berube is also a strong recruiter (she "trained" with Geno, after all).    

Great game re-cap, btw Rem!    
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 22, 2011, 09:43:33 AM
McBride's strong suit was recruiting--She was able to attrack some of the top Maine talent, along with strong players from New Jersey and Massachusetts.  The question is whether the new Coach will be able to continue to recruit top level talent.  This year's recruiting class was non-existent.  I don't think Bowdoin needs to worry about recruiting, they have another good team, and the school has a great reputation.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 22, 2011, 05:55:40 PM
Where was Colleen Hart today for Tufts?  Hope she's not hurt, but is just dealing with the flu and colds that I'm sure players on many of these teams are dealing with this time of year.  After her strong game yesterday, they really missed her today.

Was Bates as good in person as they looked on webcast or was Bowdoin's shooting just "off?"
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 22, 2011, 06:56:36 PM
I understand Hart missed today's game because of an injury suffered in last night's game at Bowdoin--Colby picked up a big break with Hart no playing.  What happened to Bowdoin against Bates?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: JustAFan on January 22, 2011, 07:17:29 PM
Hart sprained her ankle in the final 2 minutes of the Bowdoin game on a drive to the hoop with contact....tough to bounce back from that in less than 24 hours.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: toad22 on January 22, 2011, 10:37:37 PM
Chessie Jackson probably had the greatest weekend of basketball in the history of Williams women's basketball. She was immense. In two games she scored roughly 60 points, shot over 50% from the floor and from 3, had many rebounds, a number of assists, blocks and steals, and didn't turn it over once. Quite an achievement. I doubt that I will live long enough to see two better performances back to back. Go Williams!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on January 23, 2011, 12:21:02 AM
  I think Williams is the second best team in NESCAC. I think they have a chance to beat Amherst AT!! Williams in February. I think Jackson will likely make all conference. She can hit the three or play underneath. She is a very talented player, BUT Wesleyan and Conn. are hardly the stuff that dreams are made of.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 23, 2011, 05:56:25 AM
This past weekend was a big weekend as it relates to the top four spots in the NESCAC.  Colby was a big winner, going 2-0 wins over Bates and Tufts, two teams that are likely to be close to them in the standings.  Bowdoin losing two games, to Tufts and Bates, will hurt them down the stretch.  This coming weekend will also be huge, as Colby and Bowdoin head to Trinity and Amherst.  We will see if Trinity can compete with Colby and Bowdoin.  Although Williams is off to a good start, they end with four very hard games. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 24, 2011, 08:03:21 PM
Was up at Amherst to see my first live games of the season...to date.  Amherst did have a good weekend of play this "weekend"...winning an away game on Long Island on Thursday and winning a conference game  against Trinity on Saturday.
I wanted to see the Trinity game through, but only caught the first 15 minutes.  My Ct. host who drives me up from the Old Lyme Ct. area for games is a UConn BB junkie.  We made a compromise on Sat.  We would attend the 2 PM men's game and tape the 2 PM UConn MBB game.  However, we would leave to be able to watch the UConn WBB game later in the evening.
Anyway, saw the team warm up and was surprised to see their "entrance" onto the floor for pre-game warmups.  The team entered and wound around the Trinity team warming up at their basket and went to the Amherst side of the first half.  The team was up beat and seemed to be looking forward to a conference game.  Amherst two Sr. Captains were honored before the start of the game for entering the 1000 pt "fraternity".  Jaci Daigneault and Sarah Leyman are 8th and 10th players on the Amherst WBB scoring leader list.   Oh yes, Amherst was ahead by double digits at the half.....picked it up on the car radio.
Said hi to coach G. before the game......before his team's entrance.  He is indeed a muti tasker coach.  He was standing on the "banner side" of  LeFrak....talking to someone about his team's record....watching the Trinity team warming up and still noticed that I wanted to say hi.  I met him first in Salem Va.  at the MBB championship 07 games.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 25, 2011, 07:35:57 PM
I realize, that I should talk about the game a bit.  Looking at the writeup and the stats...it is very clear that the game was won by Amherst's defense.....like most of Amherst wins, IMO.  The rebounding was only slightly in favor of Amherst.  When one looks at the turnovers.....supported by the steals and blocks....all in favor of Amherst......then the win becomes clearer.  Trinity's shooting percentage overall was in the 20's and 3-point shooting in the teens.
Amherst players' scoring was well distributed.  Five players had double digit scoring numbers.  I was surprised to see Lem McCormick with a knee brace.  It didn't seem to affect her scoring.
It may be of interest to posters that Trinity's coach is also a product of the UConn WBB program.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 26, 2011, 02:35:36 PM
Nice article in the Tufts' newspaper about the play of two FY players from CT.  I found it on the D3hoops.com page in the "what we are reading" section.  It is dated Jan. 26, 2011.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 28, 2011, 02:34:16 PM
For those who are interested in the Colby/Amherst game tonight....you can catch it online starting at 8PM.  You will have to go to the Amherst website and then to the athletic site.  It is free!  D3Hoops site only states that there is a live stats link.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 29, 2011, 11:33:00 AM
Amherst beat Colby by 20+ points last night.  Good writeup on the Amherst website so I won't go into the details.  Amherst jumped into a lead early  and was never in danger.  However, Colby played Amherst even in the second half.  Colby stayed with Amherst mainly via the foul line.  The game was decided by the turnovers committed by Colby.  During one stretch, Colby must have had 4-5 walks on the offensive side....straight.  Amherst is much quicker than Colby and had double the steals and almost a third less turnovers.  Many of Amherst's turnovers were on passes in transition...to speed up the game.  Shannon Finucane, Amherst's junior point guard became Amherst's leader in steals with 201 early in the game.  She finished with 4 steals, 4 assists and 11 points.  Colby's height/size up front came into play in the second half ....which led to fouls, etc.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 29, 2011, 08:58:47 PM
I was at the Amherst-Colby game. The game was over 10 minutes in, when Amherst went up 30-10. Colby essentially packed in at that point, playing their bench more then the starters.  I was very impressed with Amherst. They played smothering defense, up-tempo offense, and clearly were the far better team. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 29, 2011, 09:08:11 PM
Maine1 - I saw the same exact thing last night.  This afternoon same thing with Bowdoin, but on a night that Amherst wasn't sharp from 3 or the free throw line, they still racked up big points inside.  Can't remember when the three big inside players each scored a double, double.  I'm sure Gromacki knew that Bowdoin's inside game is much diminished from past years so attacked there.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 02, 2011, 03:24:36 PM
First Regional Rankings: http://www.d3blogs.com/d3hoops/category/ncaa-stuff/regional-rankings/
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 04, 2011, 11:42:56 AM
There are 4 conference BB players that have been selected on the Capital One All-District Academic teams.  Details can be found on the Amherst website.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PostPlay on February 04, 2011, 01:26:20 PM
Congratulations to all 4 athletes!  Well done.

On a related note, I noticed with dismay Vermont's misfortunes this season:  2-20 record and an RPI ranking of #315 (out of 343 D1 teams).

Has anyone seen them play?  Is the talent that bad?  New coach growing pains?

Could Amherst play them competitively?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: wbbhoopsfan on February 05, 2011, 12:44:44 PM
While I don't understand how your Vermont inquiry is related to an academic award, I too am surprised by the 2-20 record.  I don't know enough about it to pass judgement, but Gear McBride took over a pretty bad Colby program and led them to the NCAA Tournament - an achievement that seems unlikely this year based on the first regional ranking - so I suspect it is a matter of time and getting her own players into the program.  As for Amherst competing, they probably could hang in for a while but there is a big jump from Division I to Division III, no matter how good Amherst is or how bad UVM may or may not be. 

You see D. III teams beat Division I schools from time to time so it is certainly possible.  They'll never play each other, so kinda pointless debate. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: wbbhoopsfan on February 05, 2011, 12:50:56 PM
Back to Division III discussion, today is a big day in the NESCAC.  Good luck ladies!

I think the Colby-  Williams game is a huge one, esp. after last night's results.   Williams VERY surprising loss at Bowdoin salvaged the Polar Bears' reeling season and tightened the pack, save for Amherst.  Tufts-Trinity will also be worth watching as Trinity has been competitive but hasn't been able to come away with the result. 

The unfortunate part, esp. for the kids on those particular teams (Wes, Conn), is that 1-8 seems set, so no last minute playoff scramble.  At this point, looks like it is just seeding with a lot still up in the air.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: wbbhoopsfan on February 05, 2011, 08:03:30 PM
Things shaking out in the league today as it appears that Amherst-Colby will finish 1-2 for the second straight year, after today's wins.  Impressive showing by Colby in beating Williams handily, setting up perhaps a fun NESCAC semifinal although Williams may also get another shot at Bowdoin as the Ephs were snake-bitten by the "Maine trip" this weekend.

Great effort by Bates again vs. Amherst, but just not enough to compete for 40 minutes.  Barring any upsets next week, things are pretty well in order although some seeding changes (like Bowdoin vaulting over Bates) could happen next weekend.

Although the NESCAC tournament looks again like a for second place, there should be some competitive QF games.

They should rename the 8th seed to "the Middlebury seed"
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on February 06, 2011, 05:43:21 AM
Quote from: amh63 on February 04, 2011, 11:42:56 AM
There are 4 conference BB players that have been selected on the Capital One All-District Academic teams.  Details can be found on the Amherst website.

Also, for your information, here is the link to the Capital One All-District Academic teams, on which you will find these 4 NESCAC BB players representing the College Division's District One, as selected by CoSIDA:

  http://www.cosida.com/media/documents/2011/2/2010_11_AAA_WBB_All_District.pdf  (http://www.cosida.com/media/documents/2011/2/2010_11_AAA_WBB_All_District.pdf)

Jaci Daigneault of Amherst is eligible to be selected as an Academic All-American (having made first team All District), while the other 3 NESCAC BB players on the list (Jules Kowalski of Colby and Amherst players Sarah Leyman and Caroline Stedman) were selected as third team All District out of District One.

Once again, congratulations to these outstanding scholar-athletes!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 07, 2011, 10:50:57 AM
It was very clear from the start of the season that Pat Manning was only going 7 deep.  I can't speak expertly as to what she has after those seven, but it is a long season and a tough league.  Depth is key, and by comparison Amherst has eleven players with double digit minutes, nine with at least 13 minutes/game, yet no player averages over 22 minutes. 

Colby is close to that with 10 in double digit minutes and no players averaging over 26 minutes.

Williams by comparison has only 7 in double digits and one of those averages only 12 minutes.  Most of Williams "six" players are in for 27 to 29 minutes.  Makes for tired legs come February, especially when on long road trips.

Having said all that, I'm sure Williams will be "up" and ready for Amherst in Williamstown this weeend.  It should be a good game.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Rick Vaughn on February 07, 2011, 11:13:02 AM
Quote from: PostPlay on February 04, 2011, 01:26:20 PM
On a related note, I noticed with dismay Vermont's misfortunes this season:  2-20 record and an RPI ranking of #315 (out of 343 D1 teams).

Has anyone seen them play?  Is the talent that bad?  New coach growing pains?

Could Amherst play them competitively?

I have heard that Gear McBride has a monster recruiting class coming in, but she walked into a very difficult situation.  UVM graduated two of the best players in program history (#3 & 5 on the all-time scoring list).  Also, the old coach Sharon Dawley took a couple players, incoming recruits, and coaches with her to UMass.  Really a classless gutting of the program by Dawley.  On top of that, Dawley had scheduled an incredibly tough slate of games for Gear McBride to play including Nebraska, Marist, BC, Michigan St., Kansas St., and Oklahoma St.   UVM women's hoops has a strong history and should be fine, but Dawley really screwed them for a year or two.

As for the Amherst vs. UVM discussion.  This year I believe a stacked Amherst team would beat them, but UVM did beat Franklin Pierce (a perennial DII power) in the preseason, so you never know.  I'm a DIII guy myself, but scholarship athletes are tough to compete against without scholarships.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on February 07, 2011, 08:14:07 PM
  Game of the week.
  Let's assume for a moment that Colby beats both Conn. Coll. and Wesleyan. You never know but most people think they will. Then look at Trinity-Midd. Similar records and the game is at Midd, so Midd would figure to be a slight favorite.
  Let's say they both Trinity and Midd lose their upcoming Friday night game. Then what? If Midd beats Trinity, their reward would be traveling about 300 miles to Colby. If they lose, they travel about 150 miles to Amherst and might not have to sleep over.
  If Trinity wins they have to travel about 280 miles vs about 50 if they lose. To be honest, if I were in that situation, I know what I'd do.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 08, 2011, 05:56:18 AM
I was at the Colby-Williams game--Colby played extremely well (shot 7-8 on threes), while I thought Williams did not play well, and relied too much on threes (4-22).  Many of those threes were wide open threes takenon 3-1 breaks, which, unless you are going to make 9-10, are bad shots.

The NESCAC playoffs are definitely for second place.  I believe that of the group os Williams, Colby, Bates,and Bowdoin, Bates may be the top team of that group, but anyone of this group can beat anyother team. Tufts appears to be struggling, but I certainly would not want to play them in a first round game.

I would expect 5 teams from the NESCAC to get to the NCAA's.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 08, 2011, 12:02:33 PM
SenatorFrost......read your post twice and still did not get your points....It was late and I was tired.  Still, are you saying that you would rather lose so as to travel less and therefore be in a better position to lose?
Maine 1...interesting comments wrt Williams' offensive approach.  Based on Amherst's performance.....Bates does look like the best candidate for second.  However, Amherst does have two away games this weekend....one with Williams.
What do you base your prediction on 5 conference teams in the post season?  Isn't that a little high? Three is the most likely number...even in a down year for other conferences.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 08, 2011, 01:38:56 PM
Prediction is based on the relative strenghth of the conference (NESCAC is far and away the strongest conference in the East, and there any of five I mentioned would dominate most of the other leagues), the fact that the NCAA took five teams from the NESCAC last year (Amherst, Colby, Bowdoin, Williams, and Tufts), the fact that there is very little to differentiate between Colby, Bowdoin, Williams and Bates (Williams beat Bates, Bates beat Bowdoin (1-1 on the season), Bowdoin beat Williams, Bowdoin beat Colby twice, Colby beat Williams, Colby split with Bates).  And all 5 of those teams are in the regional rankings.  It is hard to pick between those four teams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on February 08, 2011, 03:01:49 PM
Maine1--

I wish that the NCAA released the SOS data last week with the regional rankings nationally.  Unless the NCAA releases this data, I will have no way of confirming whether or not your belief that NESCAC will once again get 5 teams into the NCAAs will be correct or not.

Just based on the positions of the teams in Week 1 of the regional rankings, I can see 4 teams from NESCAC getting in.  However, unless the NCAA releases their SOS data, I cannot make a determination on whether or not NESCAC will once again get 4 Pool C bids.

However, should 4 Pool C bids go to NESCAC, it would most likely be Williams, Bowdoin, Colby, and Bates picking up those bids at this time-- with Bates taking the place of Tufts.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 10, 2011, 06:02:54 AM
note that the latest rankings out yesterday have 6 NESCAC teams (Amherst, Bowdoin, Colby, Bates, Williams, and Tufts) in that order in the top 12 in the Northeast.  The strength of schedule information is also included.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 12, 2011, 06:33:39 PM
Want to be the first to congrat Amherst players on their win in a surprising close game.....Amherst 66-Williams 55.  Amherst was led again by their senior captains.   Writeup of the game now posted on the Amherst website.
Amherst will be the top seed for the conference tournament and will host the tournament if they win their quarter final game.  Pairings are listed on the conference website, I believe.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on February 12, 2011, 06:59:38 PM
So outstanding that it deserves to be said twice.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 12, 2011, 07:25:46 PM
Thanks Frank for pointing out the errors in my post.  Made the corrections.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on February 13, 2011, 06:11:53 AM
We aim to please.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 13, 2011, 05:37:18 PM
Amherst should win the NESCAC tournament. I would expect Colby to have very little trouble with Middlebury. The other two games are toss-ups.  I would not be surprised to see Tufts beat Williams, although the Williams gym is a hard place to play for visiting teams. Bowdoin and Bates could go either way, but we could see three out of last year's four teams at Amherst in the finals.  I expect Bowdoin and Tufts to move forward, with a Bowdoin Amherst final.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on February 13, 2011, 11:00:06 PM
  My opinion is that only the top 4 teams in a conference should be in the playoffs. However, in these times people are in to giving out as many accolades as they can. As far as I'm concerned Trinity 'Won' the game with Middlebury because they get to make a quick one day trip to trip to Amherst. (about 50+ miles).
   Middlebury on the other hand gets to travel about 300 miles to the middle of Maine. I think Middlebury is slightly better than it's record, so Colby had better not take them lightly. Yes, I know, miracles can happen.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on February 15, 2011, 12:14:37 PM
I think the upcoming playoffs/tournament will be interesting for Amherst.  While I think we all agree that they are the class of the NESCAC field, I think that Gromacky's tendency to shrink their bench in tight games may come back to haunt them.  Coach G has done an excellent job of spreading the PT throughout the season, except in close games.  And it is in those close games that the 7-8 player rotation gets gassed, especially in an up-tempo offense.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 15, 2011, 12:27:17 PM
It is hard to question someone that has had the success Gromacki and Amherst have had.  Back to back final fours, 1 loss in the last two seasons, playing in a very tough conference.  I don't see them being challenged in the NESCAC championships (it appears that for some reason Williams seems to give them trouble once in a while, but I don't see Williams getting past Tufts, even at Williams).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on February 15, 2011, 12:37:46 PM
My intention was not to question the coach.  He has the chops, there is no doubt of that.  I am merely making an observation that I think it will be interesting as they progress deep into the NCAA Tournament...I agree that the NESCAC tournament should not be an issue.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 15, 2011, 04:21:29 PM
It's interesting that since Amherst has eleven players in double digit minutes/game that in tight games Gromacki elects to go with 7 or 8.  I think alot must have to do with match-ups with the other team.  For example this past weekend Leyman played many more minutes than her average but matches up well with Jackson from Williams who has scored 4,2, and 5 points in the last three games Amherst.  At this point in the season, the girls are in great shape since they haven't been "overused," and it seems Gromacki is going to go with his gut and play his horses.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 16, 2011, 08:30:10 AM
I would also say that at most level, the best coaches generally shorten their rotations when it comes to playoff time, basically playing their best players most of the game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 16, 2011, 03:34:10 PM
Week 3 Regional Rankings are out: http://www.d3blogs.com/d3hoops/2011/02/16/ncaa-2011-regional-rankings-week-3/
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 19, 2011, 05:52:27 PM
Middlebury and Tufts give Colby and Williams all they can handle.  3 point win down to the wire by Colby and 5 point win in overtime for Williams.  Congrats ladies as your season continues and all will be in Amherst next weekend for NESCAC Finals.  Maine vs Maine, and Mass. vs Mass. in the semis, just as the seeding predicted.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 19, 2011, 06:55:18 PM
I did not see any of today's games, but I am not surprised by the results.  I thought that Tufts would actually beat Williams (I believe they deserve an NCAA bid).  Also, I was not surprised that Middlebury played Colby close (looks like it was a tightly officiated game).  I expect that Amherst will handle Williams next Saturday.  Bowdoin-Colby should be interesting--Bowdoin has already beaten them twice this year, in relatively close games.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 23, 2011, 03:56:35 PM
Nice preview of the upcoming Amherst-Williams match this weekend on the Amherst website.
NH NESCAC Fan.....on the general Amherst website is a featured WBB picture wrt to this weekend games.  Your "favorite" player is in the picture, I believe.
For those going to the games at Amherst, be careful and enjoy.  Weekend weather is predicted to be not good for travel.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 23, 2011, 04:28:03 PM
Final Regional Rankings before Selection Sunday: http://www.d3blogs.com/d3hoops/category/ncaa-stuff/regional-rankings/
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 25, 2011, 03:54:21 PM
BIG weekend at Amherst.  Always tall order to beat a team 3 times.  Hope Maine teams make it down OK with snow, sleet and ice.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 25, 2011, 07:45:16 PM
Both Amherst and Bowdoin have to accomplish that feat--I would expect Amherst to handle Williams, but for some reason Williams seems to be able to match up well with Amherst. I plan to make it out to Amherst to catch the games
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 26, 2011, 04:04:56 PM
Amherst beats Williams 71-64.   Amherst led by 21 at the half.  Amherst led by 28 at the 15 minute mark in the second half.  Williams led a great charge back and held Amherst without a field goal in the last 5 minutes.  Williams started fouling Amherst in the last minutes and Amherst could not hit foul shots until the last 10 seconds.  Amherst got very sloppy in the last quarter of the game as many of the "starters" were out of the game and/or looking ahead to the next game.....bad trend.
Anyway, a win is a win this time of the year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 26, 2011, 06:42:38 PM
Amherst played as well as they've played all year, especially on defense.  With a big lead and subs in, Williams did make a run, but game wasn't really in doubt or all starters would have been back in.  Bowdoin dominated Colby.  If Colby would box out their bigs would dominate on defense.  Bowdoin vs Amherst should be a good game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 26, 2011, 09:15:08 PM
My view on the Amherst-Williams game was that Amherst simply stopped playing with about 8-9 minutes to go. They seemed to lose focus.  Williams didn't exactly make a run, Amherst let them into the game.

I agree that Bowdoin controlled the Bowdoin-Colby game from the start.  Colby did not take advantage of their size, and Bowdoin was able to get good lucks from their cards the entire game. If Bowdoin had not had a few sloppy possession when they were up by 17, it could have been a 20 point plus lead.

However, I would expect Amherst to easily beat Bowdoin tomorrow.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 27, 2011, 01:56:36 PM
Amherst blows out Bowdoin......by more than 30 points.   Score is not material.....since Amherst's players stayed focused and never let Bowdoin in the game.  Amherst's defense was again the key.  I expect Amherst to host a NCAA bracket and may met the other top team in the region.....Babson.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 27, 2011, 02:18:03 PM
Unfortunately for Babson, I understand that one of there three big people (Collins) is hurt and out for the season.  I would be surprised if they get out of the second round, but that will be a big function of the draw, and who hosts.

I was not at all surprised that Amherst beat Bowdoin by 30--they are that much better than mostof the teams in the area.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 27, 2011, 02:55:41 PM
As a West Conn student I would love to get a second shot at Babson in the tournament somewhere down the line. They beat us by 6 in overtime for one of our 3 losses this year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 27, 2011, 05:01:29 PM
Dominant defensive game by Amherst to hold Bowdoin to under 40 points.  Caroline Stedman, All-American last season, scored more points by halftime as entire Bowdoin team.  Jaci Daignault, All-American year before last, had huge game. Bowdoin must have decided that a key to winning was to double down on Sarah Leyman.  She had more assists than points as she'd kick the ball out to open teammates.  Wondeful intensity by Amherst, next stop NCAA's.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: walzy31 on February 28, 2011, 01:01:19 AM
Quote from: sumfun on February 27, 2011, 05:01:29 PM
Caroline Stedman, All-American last season, scored more points by halftime as entire Bowdoin team.

1) sumfun, beat me to that fun fact which was texted to me by a fan of Amherst Athletics.
2) Congratulations to Coach GP Gromacki and the Amherst College Women's Basketball team for amassing a 114-9 record (entering 2011 NCAA Tournament) over the past four seasons to go along with the Final Four appearances and NESCAC titles.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 28, 2011, 05:28:02 PM
NCAA pairings are interesting--Colby may have gotten a benefit as they are not in Amherst's half of the bracket.  Williams and Bowdoin, if they can get out of their regionals, will have to go through Amherst.  Surprised that Tufts was not invited.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jumphigh on February 28, 2011, 06:13:46 PM
ok where is the best place to stay at Bowdoin
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 28, 2011, 06:43:19 PM
Quote from: jumphigh on February 28, 2011, 06:13:46 PM
ok where is the best place to stay at Bowdoin

When I went up to their game vs. Tufts back in January, I stayed at the Days Inn right down the street.  Nothing pretty, but all I needed was a bed for that night since I was going over to Gorham the next day for the West Conn/USM game.  Plus, it gave you the number of the pizza hut on your room card.  Not sure what else there is in the area.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: HoopMama on February 28, 2011, 06:52:58 PM
Fairfield Inn and Suites.  Clean, good value.  Complimentary continental breakfast.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 28, 2011, 07:48:11 PM
Holiday Inn with a pretty good restaurant, but meals aren't included.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jumphigh on February 28, 2011, 07:51:59 PM
Thanks for the suggestions!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 01, 2011, 08:45:55 AM
Hey Jump - Don't know how much time you've spent in the Brunswick, ME area, but depending on your timing stop at Kennebunk Port for lunch on way up, or lots of Lobster Shacks not far off expressway.  LLBean and outlet stores are 10 miles down expressway in Freeport.  Brunswick is a cute, New England college town.  Enough of the travel log, back to basketball. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on March 01, 2011, 10:13:41 AM
Quote from: jumphigh on February 28, 2011, 06:13:46 PM
ok where is the best place to stay at Bowdoin

I have stayed at Travelers Inn at 130 Pleasant Street in Brunswick, Maine on my previous trips to Bowdoin.

Good bed, cheap rates.  Motel atmosphere, but there are fast food places nearby.

About a 30 min walk from campus, but the exercise will invigorate you-- within walking distance of downtown Brunswick and the Bowdoin campus.

  http://www.travelersinnme.com  (http://www.travelersinnme.com)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 03, 2011, 12:16:19 PM
Congratulations to all the NESCAC  conference selections!  Especially to Coach G. of Amherst who won COY.  Was surprised he did not win last year when the Amherst team was unbeaten until the Final Four.  Is there "politics" in the selection committee?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 03, 2011, 12:48:06 PM
Amh63 - According to the Amherst website, Gromacki was COY in 2010.  I think Bowdoin coach got it in 2009, and Gromacki in 2008.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 03, 2011, 03:44:32 PM
Thanks Sumfun.  Can't read the Amherst Website correctly.  Coach G. shared the title in 2008.....according to the write-up.  Hope the game goes well for the team so as to allow the younger players to get some NCAA experience.  Will be watching.
Title: Coaching Position Open (?)
Post by: remsleep on March 03, 2011, 11:39:11 PM
OK, so I get that the position that Coach Clancy of Colby accepted prior to the season was an interim position.  Am I to understand that her 21-5 record does not  warrant removal of the "interim" label.   Apparently not, the position is being advertised.  Can someone familiar with Colby protocols educate me as to their policies in these types of situations?...do they have a requirement to advertise vacancy whenever a position has been held by an "interim" coach?
I wish Coach Clancy well.....but this policy does not bode well for her future there unless Colby is simply a victim of their own policy requirements and has to go through the motions of a search for a coach then award the position to Clancy.  Please illuminate.

On another note....for all you Mainers out there....first round match-up of Colby v. Stevens features a couple of Maine kids squaring off as Head Coaches....Clancy from Yarmouth HS and Bri Fecteau from Westbrook HS.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 05, 2011, 12:38:56 PM
Congrats to the conference teams last night; especially Amherst who hopefully had their top players well rested for tonight's game.
Several random comments-
Didn't like the Amherst webcast as it seemed to stop too often and I lost vocal a number of times.  Amherst needs to upgrade its system.
Seems the game tonight is at 6PM.  This will make watching the MBB game at 7 PM a little hard for awhile.  These, I believe, are NCAA dictated times.  I hope Amherst will put the game away early.....so I can turn to the men's game which should be more challenging.
Last night, some poster on the men's side made a comment dealing with both Williams games that I thought was of interest here.  The men's game between Williams and Husson was a nail biter that went to overtime...because Husson missed a last second shot.  The comment referred to the upset lost by the Williams women's team in the last second by a 3-point shot from the team from PA.    The poster commented that after the women's team lost, if the Williams men team lost in OT, then he hoped that the town/college had good mental/medical help for all the depressed supporters.  I parapharsed and toned down the comment.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 05, 2011, 12:48:16 PM
That is an interesting note on the web cast.  The last two games I have had difficulty, to the point where I have just shut it off, and "watched" the game through the live stats instead.  Last night the web cast worked fine before the game started.  I had a great view of an older gentleman in a white hat and glasses chatting away as the teams went through their warm-ups.  Once the game started the feed went away and didn't come back, so I turned it off.  I'll try again tonight.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 05, 2011, 01:08:26 PM
I've had the same frustrations with the Amherst feed for a couple years now.  I tried to watch the Williams game at Amherst and it wasn't sustainable.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 05, 2011, 04:01:47 PM
If video doesn't work, some anonymous unnamed person is providing a great audio feed from Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: atn alum on March 05, 2011, 05:31:58 PM
Audio link for today's Eastern CT-Amherst game at 6 ET

http://www.ustream.tv/channel/amherst-regional
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 05, 2011, 05:56:42 PM
Thanks atn alum for the info.  The audio feed will be much better than the announcers for the Amherst video feed.  I do believe the feed is also available on the Amherst website...athletic page.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 05, 2011, 09:25:11 PM
The webcast was actually acceptable tonight.....thought the D3hoops announcer was enjoyable.  Oh yes, Amherst won by 22 this time as ECSU played a better game against Amherst overall.  Kim Fiorentino and Sarah Leyman were both outstanding.  Kim's outside shooting and overall play led the way.  Sarah had a double double in points and rebounds as she countered ECSU's Carter's efforts.  S Finucane was her dangerous self as she and Leyman both made key steals.  It was a good win!  Bowdoin advanced but Colby fell.  Two UAA teams advanced...Wash U. and Chicago.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 06, 2011, 03:48:21 PM
Amherst will host the sectional again thus year. Babson, one of the undefeated teams will meet Bowdoin.  Amherst will meet the surprise team so far..the one that beat Williams in the last seconds...the team from PA ...Muhlenburg!
It will be nice to have Amherst meet Babson vice playing Bowdoin for the third time.  First things first......must get past the Muhlenburg team from PA.  No NCAA foe must be overlooked this time of the year.  Gosh, had trouble spelling Muhlenburg...twice.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 06, 2011, 04:34:18 PM
Amh63 - You're so right.  One game at a time, and anything can happen this time of year.  All team effort this weekend in both games.  Also illustrated again that Amherst doesn't rely on any one player.  Key to have Daignault and Fiorentino at full strength.  Something that due to injury, Amherst didn't have last year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 06, 2011, 05:47:09 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 06, 2011, 03:48:21 PM
Amherst will host the sectional again thus year. Babson, one of the undefeated teams will meet Bowdoin.  Amherst will meet the surprise team so far..the one that beat Williams in the last seconds...the team from PA ...Muhlenburg!
It will be nice to have Amherst meet Babson vice playing Bowdoin for the third time.  First things first......must get past the Muhlenburg team from PA.  No NCAA foe must be overlooked this time of the year.  Gosh, had trouble spelling Muhlenburg...twice.

And, alas, got it wrong all three times - it's bErg! ;D
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 06, 2011, 06:11:15 PM
Thanks Mr. Ypsi.... Part of the problem being, I cannot read.....the mascot being "Mule" and I have been living in a town ending in bUrg for 40 plus years.  
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: senatorfrost on March 06, 2011, 09:39:26 PM
  Muhlenberg won on a last second shot and then they came back from a 17 point halftime deficit. In addition they have one of D3 basketball's great names.
Alexandra Chili-a really good shooter and seemingly one of their two best players.
Example-Mules stomp Bullets as Chili gets hot.    Now what can you do with Bergeron, Shea, Manduca or Stedman?
   I saw them two years ago and I thought Kelly McKeon was a VERY good player. Look at the box score from the Rochester game.

Amherst bottles up Chili, beats Muhlenberg.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 07, 2011, 06:08:12 AM
Bowdoin-Babson is an interesting matchup.  My understanding is that Babson will be at full strenght (which will be big difference) with their third six footer playing.  If she does play, Babson's inside game with overpower Bowdoin. The question will then be whether the Bowdoin guards can do enough to offset that. Assuming Amherst can beat Muhlenberg, a Babson-Amherst match up would certainly be more interesting than another Amherst Bowdoin route
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 08, 2011, 09:04:33 AM
Not much chatter on this board, especially since there are two conference teams in the sweet 16 and in region team Babson.
There is much posting on the UAA board who also has two teams still dancing.  I noticed that the fees to attend the sectional games are higher!  Does the NCAA pay the people in stripes more for these games.  Really, that is a shame to charge so much in these economic times......even 4 dollars for little kids.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 08, 2011, 03:06:12 PM
Here is my only true BB post until after the Friday evening game.
Going over Amherst's next opponent...Muhlenberg...it is a team that is driven by the play of three key players... the center Cook, the guards Chili and McKeon.  Chili is the main scorer on the team and led the team in points throughout the season.  She often scores most of her points in the second half and often it is her outside shot that wins the game....like in the Williams game.  Chili is a big 5'10" guard.  The key guard is the smaller, 5'6" McKeon senior guard from Watertown Ct.(outside Waterbury).  In the Williams game she was the high rebounder for both sides.  In the last 4-5 games, McKeon has been the top team rebounder and has had double doubles in many of them.  When both Chili and McKeon score well then they are hard to beat.  The team has many big players, though three are FY centers.  I believe that the key to winning is to stopping/containing McKeon.  It seems she has been the go to player of late and is their point guard...controlling the game for the Mules.  The coach may have had the bigs block out to allow the guard rebound so well in their last 4 games...tournament games.  What I cannot asses from their stats is how quick they are.  Their two defeats by conference foe Johns Hopkins has come about will defense.. The Mules are the big scorers in the conference and when they are held down.....then they are vulnerable.....unless you are beaten by a Chili last second shot or a Chili led 2nd half charge.
Amherst will have a handful this Friday.  All NCAA foes are tough this time of the year. Unless there is an injury in practice this week, I believe Coach G. will have them prepared.  Amherst has the talent, the experience and the depth to win the game.  Focus and execution on both sides ladies!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PostPlay on March 08, 2011, 03:10:26 PM
Babson-Bowdoin will be a great game.  Babson last year beat Colby in OT and played Amherst very tough.  They are all back and will be much more ready for Sweet 16 pressure.  Bowdoin will have not seen 3 athletic 6 foot + kids who can run and in two cases, really shoot the 3.  IMO, it is the best front line in D3 basketball.  Always the question with Babson is guard play.  If their guards can hit some key shots to keep defenses honest, run the offense well, and limit turnovers, Babson is a very tough matchup.  And they are very hungry after last year.  
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 08, 2011, 06:17:42 PM
Bowdoin could give Babson a good game because they beat Colby who also has very good post players.  I still expect Babson to win this game.  Muhlenberg seems to be peaking at the right time.  I think Amherst has more players that play significant minutes so I'd guess they are a bit deeper.  Amherst also has played their best the last few weeks.  Will be interesting to see if Mulenberg can handle Amherst's defense.  Great games in all sections this weekend. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Hoop Guy on March 08, 2011, 07:17:11 PM
The Babson Bowdoin game is going to be a very good game as the teams do not match up at all, so it will be interesting.  Clearly most of the "experts" are expecting a clear Bowdoin victory.  Despite being ranked #4 in the country,  Babson has only been ranked #5 regionally. No respect from NCAA, the committee or D3Hoops for that matter.   Pat Coleman insulted them on Hoopsville selection show.

Today we finally see the final regional rankings, and they STAYED at 5.  Williams and Colby lost games, and held their position AGAIN.  As we have now seen they both have exited early from the NCAA's.   

Despite all this lack or respect all Babson does is win.  They are the only team to have made the sweet 16 two consecutive years without playing a home game in the tournament.  I cant wait to hear Pat Coleman explain why this was an easy and expected feat by a not very good team.  On Hoopsville Pat explanined last year they really did not beat anyone in the NCAA run to the elite 8.  I guess he considers lasts year's Colby team, playing at home, with a star senior player they did not have this year, not a good team.  Pat gives them no credit for an undefeated season because they play in an easy conference.  I think he should count how many other teams are undefeated in easy conferences.  He can count on hand that is missing a few fingers.

Further, they have made the sweet 16 this year with one of their top players out.  They were not beat down by the NCAA sending an undefeated team 8 hours west to play two very good teams, on in front of a packed house of home fans. Resilient if nothing else.

They do probably have the best frontcourt in D3.  The guard play is better than last year.  They may not win, but I think you can be sure it will not be for a lack of effort.  I am  looking forward to the game. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 09, 2011, 02:29:44 AM
Denison is a good example of a team that ran the table in an easy conference, got a much tougher draw than Babson, and got bounced.

I find it amusing that you say in consecutive sentences that Babson is ranked highly in the country but disrespected by D3hoops. Where does D3hoops rank Babson?

If you consider unranked Geneseo and unranked Medaille to be good teams, wait until Babson plays a ranked team. Babson starts the tournament with three unranked teams. They should be thankful they got sent out of the Northeast for the first weekend.

Just my two cents. Welcome to the board.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 09, 2011, 09:54:32 AM
I do believe that Babson has been underrated all year.  Their three post players are outstanding.   As it relates to last year's victory over Colby, my view on that is that if those two teams played 10 teams, last year's Colby team would win 8 of those games.   However, Babson's post players dominated Colby's post players, and that was the difference in the game.  Babson then went on to give Amherst a strong game.

I think Babson's post group is far better than Colby's this season.  I don't see Bowdoin shutting down Babson's big three.  I would expect Babson to beat Bowdoin.  However, I don't see them getting by Amherst
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Hoop Guy on March 09, 2011, 10:16:33 AM
Pat, I appreciate your taking the time to answer, despite it being logically flawed.
When I say Babson is disrespected by D3Hoops, I am talking mainly about you particularly as the face of D3 hoops, not the poll.  The poll is a panel of people who are participants with D3Hoops, but most of them are not employees or contractors or associated with D3Hoops in any way except being poll voters. So the use the poll as an indicator of D3Hoops respect is really disingenuous. 

You are again quick to diminish Babson's competitors overall, but do not address my Colby point from last year.   You want to suggest again this year they beat weak competition, because it is "unranked".  Using your own stated logic you are contradicting yourself.  The two teams Babson beat last week may be unranked by D3Hoops, but they are ranked #1 and #3 in their region respectively.  So they are ranked by the rankings you often seem to use as Bible truth and the rankings that are used to get into the tournament.  I said yesterday Babson is the only team that is in the sweet 16 two years in a row with all road games.  That does not happen twice in a row, simply by the luck of the draw no matter how many times you try to say it does.   Babson is the only team that has done it, that is not luck. How many teams are in the sweet 16 this year having beat teams ranked #1 and #3 in their region on the road?   I have not checked but I bet zero.

It is all perspective, and anything can happen on any given night.  The point is this team is very good as are Bowdoin, Geneseo, Medaille and others, yet you are going out of your way to suggest they are somehow undeserving.  Even to the point of saying they were "lucky" to go out of region?? That is crazy.  No matter how good you are, traveling 8 hours to play good teams at their house or in their backyard is not "lucky".  Last year they did it the other way, they stayed in region, beat a ranked NESCAC team at their place, and that is still not good enough for you.

You cant have it both ways.  In fact if you use your logic, Amherst was not very good last year.  They did not beat a ranked team, nor did they win a game on the road during the tournament.  As soon as they left Amherst, and met a ranked team they lost.  If they make the final four this year and do not play Babson, they will have again made it with no road games and no ranked opponents....They must not be that good right?  An easy road to the final four?

I am not sure what your problem really is, but you are embarrassing yourself in this instance and unfairly diminishing the accomplishments of student athletes to prove a point that is not provable.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 09, 2011, 10:46:08 AM
When  Amherst played E. Conn earlier in the year they were in top 25, as was Williams, Bowdoin, Tufts and Colby.  Kean was a great test on the road as they were #4 at the time.  The NESCAC, according to Massey Ratings, is currently 4th, often has been second toughest conference in the country. 

Massey has Medaille at #122 and Geneseo at #64, so I can see what Pat was saying.  That's not to say that Amherst didn't have a favorable draw also with Husson at #282 and E. Conn at #77. 

As for the Colby post players, they are VERY talented players that Bowdoin handled with not much problem.  What Colby lacked this year was an experienced coach.  Anyone who has coached any sport, if being honest, will say the learning curve is steep in the first few years. 

Don't take the comments personally about Babson.  You'll find out over the years that the Northeast doesn't get much respect overall.  Until a team wins a National Championship, it's probably deserved.  Keep smiling and let the girls figure it out on the floor. This weekend will be much closer in all games as the teams have very similar season stats.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 09, 2011, 12:46:08 PM
I'm probably stepping on a land mine, but I don't see how the Northeast region doesn't get much respect overall.  

They routinely have multiple teams ranked in the Top 25 and the majority of the voters in those polls (whether ours or the coaches) are from outside Northeast.  They routinely get multiple at-large teams in the NCAA tournament, which means that national organization respects them, whether for quantitative reasons, qualitative reasons or both.  The Northeast teams lead our front page story a lot, partly because they are quality programs that generate some interest (or at least recognition) outside the region.  

I can't comment on Pat's remarks about Babson since I don't know what they were.  I've personally said that I won't pick a Northeast (or Mid Atlantic, Atlantic or East) team to win the national championship until I see them do it.  But that doesn't mean I don't respect them.  The best teams in the Northeast are definitely among the nation's best annually.  They just aren't the absolute best in the last 10 years or so.

To put it differently, which region gets more respect than the Northeast?  What's the basis for comparison?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 09, 2011, 12:56:30 PM
No land mines.  Agree totally...just waiting to see which team can break through for the ultimate prize.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 09, 2011, 01:27:02 PM
Okay, understood.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 09, 2011, 05:08:53 PM
I had posted earlier that I would make comments wrt the topic you have brought up here, Gordonmann.  I will post after Amherst  advances to the Final 4, as I have previously so stated.   In particular, if you review an earlier Hoopsville  broadcast when Dave or Pat was discussing the selection of the brackets with one of the selection committee members.....from a school in the PA area, if I recall, the topic of what region produces the best teams for the championship was brought up.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 09, 2011, 05:18:42 PM
Quote from: NE Hoop Guy on March 09, 2011, 10:16:33 AM
When I say Babson is disrespected by D3Hoops, I am talking mainly about you particularly as the face of D3 hoops, not the poll.

Then say that, rather than what you said.

Quote from: NE Hoop Guy on March 09, 2011, 10:16:33 AM
... they are ranked #1 and #3 in their region respectively. So they are ranked by the rankings you often seem to use as Bible truth

No way is that true. I never rely on the NCAA's regional rankings as the bible truth on anything, except ...

Quote from: NE Hoop Guy on March 09, 2011, 10:16:33 AM
... and the rankings that are used to get into the tournament.

... that they are the rankings used to get into the tournament. By that point we have no choice but to reference them because the NCAA doesn't care what our voters think. Even though we are right more often than they are. Babson proved that right last week, in fact!

Quote from: NE Hoop Guy on March 09, 2011, 10:16:33 AM
I said yesterday Babson is the only team that is in the sweet 16 two years in a row with all road games.  That does not happen twice in a row, simply by the luck of the draw no matter how many times you try to say it does.   Babson is the only team that has done it, that is not luck. How many teams are in the sweet 16 this year having beat teams ranked #1 and #3 in their region on the road?   I have not checked but I bet zero.

Probably right. How good is the East Region, exactly? It's less than half the size of the Northeast, for example. It's a lot easier to get into the top three of the East than the top three of the Northeast.

Quote from: NE Hoop Guy on March 09, 2011, 10:16:33 AM
The point is this team is very good as are Bowdoin, Geneseo, Medaille and others, yet you are going out of your way to suggest they are somehow undeserving.

Of what, a top five national ranking? Yes. But they're still good. They're just not in the top 1.2 percent of Division III teams.

Quote from: NE Hoop Guy on March 09, 2011, 10:16:33 AM
Even to the point of saying they were "lucky" to go out of region?? That is crazy.  No matter how good you are, traveling 8 hours to play good teams at their house or in their backyard is not "lucky".  Last year they did it the other way, they stayed in region, beat a ranked NESCAC team at their place, and that is still not good enough for you.

More about Colby below. I think you missed something I said. And yes, they were lucky to get the teams ranked 122 and 64 which were sitting in the East bracket as opposed to better ranked teams in the Northeast. If you can't win away from a familiar gym you ain't winning the national title, unless you're lucky enough to be hosting all the way through.

Quote from: NE Hoop Guy on March 09, 2011, 10:16:33 AM
nor did they win a game on the road during the tournament.

Just for the record, this is your logic, not mine. You're the one talking about winning games on the road during the tournament, not me.


Quote from: NE Hoop Guy on March 09, 2011, 10:16:33 AM
If they make the final four this year and do not play Babson, they will have again made it with no road games and no ranked opponents....They must not be that good right?  An easy road to the final four?

Depends on who they lose to, when and how.

Quote from: NE Hoop Guy on March 09, 2011, 10:16:33 AM
I am not sure what your problem really is, but you are embarrassing yourself in this instance and unfairly diminishing the accomplishments of student athletes to prove a point that is not provable.

It's provable in the tournament. We'll see.

On Colby 2009-10, I saw that point, it was pointed out to me on the show, and I corrected myself on the show that very night. Maybe you missed that? But it doesn't speak to Babson 2010-11. That game was not played this season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 09, 2011, 07:22:50 PM
QuoteIn particular, if you review an earlier Hoopsville  broadcast when Dave or Pat was discussing the selection of the brackets with one of the selection committee members.....from a school in the PA area, if I recall, the topic of what region produces the best teams for the championship was brought up.

Okay.  I said that the Central region produces the best teams for championships with the Great Lakes coming in second.  I still feel that's true.  It's hard to argue with what they've done over the last 15 years.

2010: Washington U (Central)
2009: George Fox (West)
2008: Howard Payne (South)
2007: DePauw (Great Lakes)
2006: Hope (Great Lakes)
2005: Millikin (Central)
2004: Wilmington (Great Lakes)
2003: Trinity, Texas (South)
2002: UW-Stevens Point (Central)
2001: Washington U (Central)
2000: Washington U (Central)
1999: Washington U (Central)
1998: Washington U (Central)
1997: New York U (East)
1996: UW-Oshkosh (Central)

That doesn't I don't respect mean Amherst, Babson, Bowdoin, Eastern Connecticut, Southern Maine or any other strong New England program.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on March 10, 2011, 02:22:20 AM
Just as an fyi.

Bowdoin's record on the d3hoops 2011 sectionals at a glance page (http://www.d3hoops.com/playoffs/2011-sectionals) is incorrect. They are 24-5 not 27-1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 10, 2011, 02:41:29 AM
Quote from: Wydown Blvd. on March 10, 2011, 02:22:20 AM
Just as an fyi.

Bowdoin's record on the d3hoops 2011 sectionals at a glance page (http://www.d3hoops.com/playoffs/2011-sectionals) is incorrect. They are 24-5 not 27-1

They blew it on IWU also - 'signature win: Lewis & Clark x2'.  That, of course, was George Fox; IWU and L&C never played.  Since the sectional is at UWSP, I suppose the relevant signature win would be winning AT UWSP (though winning AT Kean is probably just as impressive).

The editing was not up to Pat's usual standards.  (I'm gonna guess he did not personally edit it.)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on March 10, 2011, 05:58:14 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on March 10, 2011, 02:41:29 AM
Quote from: Wydown Blvd. on March 10, 2011, 02:22:20 AM
Just as an fyi.

Bowdoin's record on the d3hoops 2011 sectionals at a glance page (http://www.d3hoops.com/playoffs/2011-sectionals) is incorrect. They are 24-5 not 27-1

They blew it on IWU also - 'signature win: Lewis & Clark x2'.  That, of course, was George Fox; IWU and L&C never played.  Since the sectional is at UWSP, I suppose the relevant signature win would be winning AT UWSP (though winning AT Kean is probably just as impressive).

The editing was not up to Pat's usual standards.  (I'm gonna guess he did not personally edit it.)

Amherst's record is 28-1 going into Friday's sectional, not 28-2.

Amherst women got in to the NCAAs by clinching the NESCAC automatic bid-- it incorrectly states that Amherst got in as a Pool C bid.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 10, 2011, 10:56:15 AM
as it relates to the Babson debate--I wanted to point out the relevance of Babson's performance during last year's NCAA playoffs against Colby and Amherst. The reason these games are relevant, even though last year, is that this is exactly the same Babson team.  They beat a very good Colby team (nationally ranked) and they gave Amherst a very good game in the final 8.  So this is a strong Babson team. They should have been ranked number 2 in the East, and I expect them to beat Bowdoin tomorrow.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 10, 2011, 11:09:20 AM
Maine1 - Totally agree.  Both teams come back with the same players, although Amherst won by 15 and this year will have Daignault(sp?) and Fiorentino who played no minutes in that game last year as they were coming off injuries.  I still think all the games this weekend will be close.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: atn alum on March 10, 2011, 03:18:09 PM
We will be broadcasting the sectional. All 3 games. Link can be found here ... same link as last week actually.

http://www.ustream.tv/channel/amherst-regional
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 11, 2011, 01:17:12 AM
Quote from: amh63 on March 08, 2011, 09:04:33 AM
Not much chatter on this board, especially since there are two conference teams in the sweet 16 and in region team Babson.
There is much posting on the UAA board who also has two teams still dancing.  I noticed that the fees to attend the sectional games are higher!  Does the NCAA pay the people in stripes more for these games.  Really, that is a shame to charge so much in these economic times......even 4 dollars for little kids.


Amherst student and faculty get in free though.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 11, 2011, 12:38:58 PM
True.  Good for Amherst.  Will help bring in the home crowd.  Spring break starts on the 12th.  Seniors' last day to take comprehensive exams is on the 11th.  Many athletic teams are away in Florida, playing, etc.  Amherst will absorb the cost and consider it community service...just kidding....though there are many locals and staff that root for the team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 11, 2011, 01:46:20 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 11, 2011, 12:38:58 PM
True.  Good for Amherst.  Will help bring in the home crowd.  Spring break starts on the 12th.  Seniors' last day to take comprehensive exams is on the 11th.  Many athletic teams are away in Florida, playing, etc.  Amherst will absorb the cost and consider it community service...just kidding....though there are many locals and staff that root for the team.

I'll donate to the Amherst funds tonight.  I'm making the trek up 91 from Connecticut for the games today.  Hopefully Babson/Bowdoin games is a good game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: lefrakenstein on March 11, 2011, 07:37:48 PM
Quote from: 7express on March 11, 2011, 01:46:20 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 11, 2011, 12:38:58 PM
True.  Good for Amherst.  Will help bring in the home crowd.  Spring break starts on the 12th.  Seniors' last day to take comprehensive exams is on the 11th.  Many athletic teams are away in Florida, playing, etc.  Amherst will absorb the cost and consider it community service...just kidding....though there are many locals and staff that root for the team.

I'll donate to the Amherst funds tonight.  I'm making the trek up 91 from Connecticut for the games today.  Hopefully Babson/Bowdoin games is a good game.

Turned out to be a great game. Wish I could have seen it live.

Anyone able to get Jeffcast video to work? Right now I have the audio and a black screen with a score display at the bottom that says Baruch 0, Eastern Conn 0. Huh?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: lefrakenstein on March 11, 2011, 07:39:48 PM
Quote from: atn alum on March 10, 2011, 03:18:09 PM
We will be broadcasting the sectional. All 3 games. Link can be found here ... same link as last week actually.

http://www.ustream.tv/channel/amherst-regional


can only get audio on this too. video worked fine for the men's game at williams i watched earlier, so i dont think it's my computer.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 11, 2011, 07:52:27 PM
could notget the video of the Bowdoin/Babson game. Would have loved to have seen it. Babson pulled out another one.It appeared that in the end, Babson's advantage on the boards and inside was able to overcome Bowdoin's defense and guard play. Wurdeman hit a huge 3 to tie.   Bowdoin appeared to do a good job holding down Babson's post players, but in the end Bowdoin good not get enough shots to fall. I was surprised that Bowdoin played thisone so close-give them a lotof credit
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 11, 2011, 10:17:44 PM
Amherst took charge early and kept the pressure up throughout the game.  Good audio and sad no show video.  Had to go watch the men's conference game and check back often to see how the game was going on.  Balanced attack.  Renner must have guarded Chili well as the outside shooter was held in check.  Seemed that the Mule's point guard was their offense.....eight rebounds for a guard of her size.  Announcer stated that she was closer in size to our point guard.  Oh well, the team played well overall, as there were 5 players in double figures and the rebounds were distributed around.
Undefeated Babson ahead with it's big front line.  Amherst 79-Muhlenberg 60.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 11, 2011, 11:40:21 PM
Impressed with Babson, they just refused to die and fold no matter how dire the situation looked.  They were down 6 with about 80 seconds left to play, and they forced the OT session, then after missing 3 of 4 free throws leading by 1 forced a Jill Henrickson travel which was the culmination of her terrible day and the game for Babson.  I feel sorry for Babson though because they'll probably get steamrolled tomorrow, 30-0 and they'll probably end up losing their first game in the elite 8 by 15+.  Brings up an interesting question: would you rather have your first loss in overtime in the sweet 16 after comming back from 6 down, or lose by double figures in the elite 8??
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Hoop Guy on March 11, 2011, 11:45:08 PM
I was wondering when Pat Coleman was going to eat crow?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 12, 2011, 05:33:10 AM
Good rematch of last year's elite 8. I don't see this game ending any differently than last year. Amherst is a stronger team now then one year ago, and Babson is not as strong as Collins is limited.  Look for an Amherst 20 point win
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 12, 2011, 09:39:12 AM
NE, calm down.  Pat has no crow to eat.  Babson had a heroic comeback last night, but look at all the NESCAC teams Bowdoin lost to during the season.  Beating Bowdoin doesn't require eating crow. Good luck the rest of the way. Enjoy the ride and be happy for the girls and coaches.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: atn alum on March 12, 2011, 11:02:30 AM
We'll have the call tonight (audio) at 6 ET

http://www.ustream.tv/channel/amherst-regional

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 12, 2011, 05:37:44 PM
Quote from: atn alum on March 12, 2011, 11:02:30 AM
We'll have the call tonight (audio) at 6 ET

http://www.ustream.tv/channel/amherst-regional




Looking forward to it.  I think if Babson can keep it close for the first half (like close being within 6 or less) they'd have a chance to win.  They can't let Amherst go on a big run, because that big run will end up being the difference.  Since I don't have a dog in this fight (though I did pick Amherst to lose to Ill Wesleyan in the finals on the d3 contest) I think Amherst wins anyways, but if Babson can keep this close, who knows...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 12, 2011, 07:56:24 PM
Amherst heads to their third final final 4 in a row!  Amherst 68-Babson 49.  Twenty point lead at the half.  Amherst had out shot Babson from the field, outside, etc. and dominate the boards.  Surprising, Amherst had one more turnover than Babson.....17 to 16.  Very surprising.  The team were led by their sr. captains and their starting jr. guards.  Go lady Jeffs!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 12, 2011, 09:25:28 PM
No surpise. Amherst has been one of top teams in the country for the past three years-I hope they can finish with a championship.  If they play the way they have been, they should win it all
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: atn alum on March 12, 2011, 11:16:45 PM
For those who follow (coaching) alums.

Stefanie Pemper (ex-Bowdoin coach) takes Navy to its first NCAA Tournament...her team comes from 12 down to beat American for the Patriot League title.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PostPlay on March 13, 2011, 04:08:59 PM
Quote from: Maine1 on March 12, 2011, 09:25:28 PM
No surpise. Amherst has been one of top teams in the country for the past three years-I hope they can finish with a championship.  If they play the way they have been, they should win it all
Congrats to the Lord Jeffs!  But the down side--how long can Amherst keep Coach G? I know he likes all that is good with D3/NESCAC basketball but at some point, he will get an offer too good to refuse.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: farmboy on March 13, 2011, 07:06:59 PM
His mother who he takes care of lives there so he is commited the local area probably for some time.  At least that is what he told us.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BBstudent on March 13, 2011, 07:42:13 PM
But the down side--how long can Amherst keep Coach G? I know he likes all that is good with D3/NESCAC basketball but at some point, he will get an offer too good to refuse

There is nothing anyone can say to rain on our, or at least my parade. If he gets an offer next week that he accepts I would wish him all the best and I would bet the ranch on any program he goes to. He gave Amherst four great years, showed us what was possible (even though I can't figure out how he does it) and I am sure he gave the girls something that will stay with them for life. Whatever he chooses to do for personal and/or family reasons can't diminish the fun we've had.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 13, 2011, 07:59:39 PM
Gromacki has done a great job with Amherst--first, he has been able to recruit good players--but the best thing that he does, his he has then playing great defense, and a very free and open offense--he seems to have them running patterns and not plays, and so they are able to capitalize on what a defense gives them. 

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: farmboy on March 13, 2011, 09:24:29 PM
I agree, but let me put it another way.  First of all he is Women's coach, not a girl's coach...he has brought a lot of maturity in coaching to the NESCAC.

Next as stated, defense is number one, offense number two, and when it does come to offense he works hard to recruit good/great players then he gets out of the way and lets them be good/great players.  I guarantee you if you don't play full out defense you won't play, and if he has a defensive standout you can be sure that player is on the floor first.  There is no such thing as being "hot" on defense on a given night, you either do it or you don't.  He knows how to put his best defensive players on the other teams best offensive players...it simply works, but my experience watching some of the coaches in NESCAC...they talk defense, but they only think in offense.  It gives them a good record, but they very seldom go all the way.

The man truly enjoys what he does, he loves his players and they know it.  There are no personal games being played, and players are not played against each other.  He treats them as the grown up young women that they are...this keeps the catfighting to a minimum, and team play on the front burner.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: HoopMama on March 13, 2011, 10:06:50 PM
Kudos to Farmboy on pointing out the distinction "women's coach."  I am a graduate of a women's college and I always want to correct the use of "girls" at the collegiate level.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 14, 2011, 10:56:13 AM
Amherst's great team chemistry starts with the coach filters through the captains and is a reflection of very good recruiting.  I'm sure they are very proud of their defense as it's awesome. 

I think Gromacki for many reasons is very happy at Amherst.  If he wasn't tempted by the UMass job which would have left him in the same city near family, I don't think much will tempt him for a while.  Much less traveling/flying and overnight stays during the week with D3.  I get the impression that he likes that with a young family.  He has certainly raised the bar of coaching and recruiting in Women's Basketball in the NESCAC
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 14, 2011, 03:35:23 PM
Well put Sumfun.
I had previously posted awhile ago wrt his ties to the Western Ma. area.......before my knowledge that he is now married and has a family and is caring for his mother.  Coach G. grew up in the area and has assisted Coach Hixon in MBB camps.  He expressed to a mentor/friend that he considered the WBB coach job at Amherst his "dream job".  At the time, he was the coach at Hamilton.  The friend who is a Amherst grad. and who was a Trustee/overseer at St. Lawrence when he meet Coach G., gave him advice at that particular crossroad.  The rest is history.
I believe his opportunities will grow after a couple of D3 national championships under his belt.  Money may become a factor when his family grows and/or his children wants to go to a conference school with its high costs.
This is such a minor distraction really.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 14, 2011, 04:10:59 PM
For what it's worth, I hope Gromacki stays at Division III.  He's a fantastic coach and a lot of fun to talk to.  If he decided to try something else, I certainly wouldn't begrudge him that.  But Division III basketball is better with him around.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 14, 2011, 04:41:50 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 14, 2011, 03:35:23 PM
Well put Sumfun.
I had previously posted awhile ago wrt his ties to the Western Ma. area.......before my knowledge that he was now married and has a family and is caring for his mother.  Coach G. grew up in the area and has assisted Coach Hixon in MBB camps.  He expressed to a mentor/friend that he considered the WBB coach job at Amherst his "dream job".  At the time, he was the coach at Hamilton.  The friend who is a Amherst grad. and who was a Trustee at St. Lawrence when he meet Coach G. gave him advice at that particular crossroad.  The rest is history.
I believe his opportunities will grow after a couple of D3 national championships under his belt.  Money may become a factor when his family grows and/or his children wants to go to a conference school with its high costs.
This is such a minor distraction really.

As long as his kids wanted to go to Amherst, I'm sure he could get a tuition break put into his contract (if he hasn't already).  A relatively cheap way for the college to compete with the 'big guys' if and when they come calling.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 14, 2011, 04:59:03 PM
While as an Eph fan, I'd love to see Gromacki go as I don't see any NESCAC team besting Amhest (or at least, it will be very rare, just like Pemper / Bowdoin) with him at the helm, I think from all I've heard he may be a lifer, or at least there for a very long time.  There are many appealing things: not a high cost of living area and the salary is probably not bad.  Little pressure and basically life tenure, he will coach there as long as wants, no doubt.  A chance to be in the NCAA tournament, and make runs, virtually every year.  Why leave?  Unless he is someone who just feels the need to test himself at a higher level. 

I am sure Williams soccer coach Russo, or Amherst hoops coach Hixon, or Williams football coach Farley, or lots of others, could have gone to a higher level, some just decide, enjoy the pace, the quality of life, the coaching of student-athletes as opposed to athletes who attend class, that comes with a top notch D-3 program.   As a Williams fan, I know it won't be long before both Coach Maker and Coach Kelton (football) get higher-level offers.  I can only hope both resist the siren song of more money and more prestige, from a coaching perspective, in favor of all the advantages D-3 has to offer.  If Gromacki did have no interest in UMass job, it sounds like he may fit into the latter category. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 16, 2011, 11:29:52 AM
For those that may have overlooked it.....there is a nice writeup on the D3Hoops.com site on the Amherst team, featuring quotes from the teams captains.   The writer is from D3hoops.    Need to check again if the games this weekend will be telecasted.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 16, 2011, 04:04:11 PM
Amh63:

Turner Sports will have streaming video of the semifinals and the national title game (maybe the third place game too - don't know about that).  We'll have streaming audio of all the games.  None of the games will be on national television, though.  The same is true on the men's side.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 16, 2011, 04:29:53 PM
Thanks gordonmann!  I'm assuming that the D3hoops streaming will be linked at their website.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 16, 2011, 06:15:03 PM
Yep.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 17, 2011, 10:30:43 PM
If anyone is still prowling about, we tried something new for this year's final four.  We put together five minute profiles on each team that you can listen to and watch on UStream.


Click here for Amherst (http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/13379120)

Click here for Christopher Newport (http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/13378546)

Click here for Illinois Wesleyan (http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/13382880)

Click here for Washington U. (http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/13388730)



While we're at it, here's the link for this weekend's audio broadcasts:
http://www.ustream.tv/channel/division-iii-women-s-basketball-championships
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on March 18, 2011, 01:44:50 PM
All the very best to Amherst this weekend...certainly my bet to bring home the title.
As a matter of fact, another Scranton fan & I traveled to Amherst the past two weekends to see them play & came away more impressed after each game.
Talented, well coached, focused, you name it, they have it.
Once I saw GP was headed your way, I knew you'd have something special for quite some time.
That was my feeling in a post dated 1/20/08 & not much has happened since then to change my mind.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 18, 2011, 02:52:26 PM
Agreed -- GP knows his stuff. He did wonders at St. Lawrence and although Amherst has now sustained this success for a few years, remember what a big turnaround that was when he started?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 18, 2011, 03:21:18 PM
Congratulation to Jaci Daigneault of Amherst for being selected to the coaches All American team as well as Player of the year.  Caroline Stedman was a honorable mention selection this year.  Jaci's selection is her second all-american.  she won it her soph. year and missed out last year due to a late season injury that also kept her out much of the tournament.  Her impact in last year's final 4 was minor due to her injury.  Kim Fiorentino impact will be felt this year as she was hindered last year also due to injuries.
Go Jeffs!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 18, 2011, 03:36:25 PM
GP's turn around of Amherst was immediate.  He took the same 5 starters from the year before who were 12-13, and turned them into a Sweet 16 team of 27-3.  Three Final Fours since then.  Coaching DOES matter. Good luck Amherst, bring it home to the Northeast.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 18, 2011, 08:00:22 PM
Amherst 69- CNU 59.    Amherst defense and the offense of two seniors led to a large lead that CNU tried to reduce through fouling in the last minute and half that took over 5 minutes to play.  Amherst hit the foul shots and the shots made by CNU did not effect the game, only the margin of victory.  Oh yes, one of the seniors came off the bench to score 10 points.  The other was the center.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Erm Schmigget on March 18, 2011, 11:34:03 PM
Great to see that Amherst is in the championship game.  I was Hope-ing  ;) to see my Flying Dutch on the other side of the ball in this game, having been very impressed with the Lord Jeffs (and their fans) at last year's Final Four.  I still think the Leyman v. Snikkers match-up would have been much more entertaining to watch than anyone Wash U can put up against Sarah. Her presence under the basket from what I saw the last 2 years in the Final Four makes her seem more than her 5-11 roster height.  By the way, congrats to Jaci Daigneault for being named POY by the WBCA.  With the level of talent I have seen in the last few seasons, that is indeed an honor to be considered the best.

My support will be going to Amherst tomorrow evening.  I will be rooting from afar, but rooting as if I were there.  Go Lord Jeffs, beat those Bears!  Make 'em look silly.   :D
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Erm Schmigget on March 19, 2011, 09:53:08 PM
Yay!!!  Amherst wins!!!  Wash U loses!!!  Yay!!!

Congrats Lady Jeffs on winning the National Championship.  A well-played game, and a well-deserved win.

Congratulations!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 19, 2011, 09:56:14 PM
Congratulations to Amherst--Class team that has had a great team for three years.  And clearly showing that a little offense, and a lot of defense, wins championships. What a great defensive showing the last two nights. Nice to see Steadman have two big games after last year's final four.  Also a great night for the NESCAC, and Northeastern basketball.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 19, 2011, 10:11:55 PM
Congrats, Amherst. Impressive performance and very deserving champions.  Those kids were the definition of focus and determination this season.  They're also the definition of champs.

PS - My theory is dead.  New England teams apparently can win the title. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 19, 2011, 10:13:56 PM
Ditto... Maine 1.    Nothing more to say right now.  
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ralph Turner on March 19, 2011, 11:31:39 PM
Quote from: gordonmann on March 19, 2011, 10:11:55 PM
Congrats, Amherst. Impressive performance and very deserving champions.  Those kids were the definition of focus and determination this season.  They're also the definition of champs.

PS - My theory is dead.  New England teams apparently can win the title. :)
But is Amherst really a New England team?  Is there a difference between New England and players from the NY/NJ area?

Considering players with double-digit minutes by region by state

From New England -- MA 20 minutes; MA 23 minutes; CT 25 minutes = 68 minutes;  22.67 min avg

From NY/NJ -- NY 10 minutes; NJ 15 minutes; NY 24 minutes; NJ 22 minutes = 71 minutes  17.75 min avg.

From the midwest -- IL 16 minutes; OH 24 minutes = 40 minutes; 20 min avg.

That makes me think that Amherst is national.  The LEC teams are much more local in nature.   :)

Roster for Kean Women 2010-11 (http://www.keanathletics.com/sports/wbkb/2010-11/roster)

Roster for Southern Maine Women 2010-11 (http://www.usm.maine.edu/~athl/Women%27s_Basketball/wbbroster.html)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BBstudent on March 20, 2011, 01:25:24 AM
That makes me think that Amherst is national.  The LEC teams are much more local in nature.   Smiley


I don't think Amherst, or most of the NESCAC teams, have ever thought of themselves as "local." From the Amherst web-site "Students hail from 39 states, plus D.C., PR, GU and 23 foreign countries" (https://www.amherst.edu/media/view/181593). Without putting words into anyone's mouth I think the idea of the post, and I seem to remember the same "Midwest issue" being justifiably mentioned last year, i.e., that Amherst plays in New England and the style of game and how it is officiated varies from region to region, sometimes markedly.
(One might also note that Washington University out of a roster of twenty, has only four girls from MO, two from KS but also several from NY, NJ and CT as well as one from CA, so it also feels somewhat "national".)
Moreover, there seems to be no getting around the fact that Midwest teams, whether because of a particular style or familiarity with how the games will be called, have been extremely successful at the national level and in winning NCAA championships - I think the post was merely emphasizing that teams that play very few games in the Midwest may be at a disadvantage in March and until they prove themselves the odds favor betting against them.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 20, 2011, 02:18:55 AM
I know Amherst has that statement on its website -- many colleges do -- but I still consider it a New England school.  Definitely different from other schools in the northeast, but still a New England school.  the players who logged significant minutes tonight were from Guilford, CT; Newton, MA; Holmdel, NJ; East Setauket, NY; Walpole, MA; Cincinnatti, OH: Cortland, NY; and Chicago. The coach is from Deerfield, MA.  Only two of 7 players are from outside the region I generally consider the northeast. I don't mean northeast as the NCAA defines but rather northeastern quadrant of the country.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ralph Turner on March 20, 2011, 02:27:11 AM
Quote from: gordonmann on March 20, 2011, 02:18:55 AM
I know Amherst has that statement on its website -- many colleges do -- but I still consider it a New England school.  Definitely different from other schools in the northeast, but still a New England school.  the players who logged significant minutes tonight were from Guilford, CT; Newton, MA; Holmdel, NJ; East Setauket, NY; Walpole, MA; Cincinnatti, OH: Cortland, NY; and Chicago. The coach is from Deerfield, MA.  Only two of 7 players are from outside the region I generally consider the northeast. I don't mean northeast as the NCAA defines but rather northeastern quadrant of the country.

Thanks for the comment...

Then do I understand you to consider the NJAC in that same "northeast" region?

How far south and west does your "northeast" region extend?   :)

A related question...for my edification.

How much different is the style of play in NJAC and the Mid-Atlantic from New England?  Thanks.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 20, 2011, 10:47:06 AM
Earlier, I posted that I had some issues with Gordon Mann concerning his views of regional teams/players winning the big one.
Yes it was a bit of carry over from last year pointed out by BBstudent's post.  I had decided to not bring it up especially after Amherst won the big one last night and Mr. Mann acknowledge his "mistake" to a degree. However, the issues of regional teams/players chances of success have, IMO, come up again.  I will put my "two cents" in again and probably more in the debate.  Here goes.
 The discussions of last year covered regions, style of play, players, coaches, referees, etc., etc.  One cannot argue against the fact that the "midwest" teams have a history of winning the national championships.  Mr. Mann's opinions, I believe, are built on years of watching games, etc.  and I respect his knowledge and opinions in general.  However, I do believe that his views do have flaws.  We all are human and have our bias, etc.
First, I do not believe that any "regions" have a hold on talented coaches.  The style of play is a "red herring", IMO.  Good coaches will often adjust their preferred style of play with the talent on hand.
Second, talented players are recruited from all states/regions.  The NESCAC and the UAA are two conferences that have players year in and year out from many regions.  Admission criteria is more of a problem in "recruiting" than players' home towns.
The central issue that I believe that has not been discussed here enough and that analyst like Gordonmann has overlooked in his evaluation of WBB teams is the college WBB programs differences by regions.
What I mean is that the WBB programs run by the central/midwest schools that have had a history of success are "stronger".
Let me explain further before I get killed here.  Schools like Hope, Calvin, Wash. U , and Ill. Wes. have put WBB high in their priority of sports in their athletic programs.   Like Kenyon College in swimming....they dominate D3 swimming.
If you check the rooster size of Wash. U. and Ill. Wes. you see 20 plus players.  The NE schools rarely have teams over 15 players.  No matter what you think, Wash. U . has on their website, at least four asst. coaches, though only one is given in bold type.  How many were hovered around the Wash. U. coach last night during game stoppage.  Some of the schools have the ability of playing grad. students and "red-shirted" players that were injured.   In short, there are programs that have put more emphasis on BB.  Good for them.  Good for the fine facilities built.  I just want to point out that the programs that are in place are the key difference in regions......not the players, coaches, referees, style of play.
To you, Gordon, I say, open your mind to your Triad Theory and to your bias to the size of a player.  You pointed out in your comments on the Jan. Hoopsville broadcast that you preferred athletic players that could play defense, shoot outside, etc.  Last night, Amherst's starting point guard proved you wrong.  She led the 2nd half charge with two 3-point shots,  hustle and defense.  She holds the steal record at Amherst and is often the key to her team's offense as well as making key rebounds.  She is athletic, talented and  has the drive and leadership to win games...even critical games.  
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jaybird44 on March 20, 2011, 12:10:39 PM
I hope you are not insinuating that Wash-U neglects academics in favor of making sure its basketball program remains successful.  I'm told that the university doesn't recruit players who score less than a 30 on the ACT.  For those of you who haven't taken the ACT, a 30 is an exceptional score.  That is climbing a mountain in rarified air, very near the summit of perfection.  I thought I did well when I scored a 21 on it many, many moons ago.  So, on that point, don't imply that Wash-U recruits players that can't spell "cat" by spotting them the "c" and the "t". 

Secondly, if you are still seething about the eligibility of Jaimie McFarlin, the Most Outstanding Player of last year's Final Four, just because she was granted a 5th season via a red-shirt situation...well, you need to take that up with the NCAA.  It gave McFarlin and Sean Wallis 5th seasons because they lost nearly all of a season due to injury.  Go take your troubles and put them on the NCAA's doorstep.

Amherst certainly deserves its newly-won national championship.  The Lord Jeffs played exceptional defense and made some gutsy shots to earn the title.  But, don't try and sully Wash-U's championship last season with subtle and flawed innuendo, while you celebrate Amherst's.  That dog won't hunt or even get off the porch.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Hoosier Titan on March 20, 2011, 12:46:23 PM
Quote from: jaybird44 on March 20, 2011, 12:10:39 PM
I hope you are not insinuating that Wash-U neglects academics in favor of making sure its basketball program remains successful.

It is definitely true, as well, that student athletes at Illinois Wesleyan must meet the academic requirements of the university.  I'm not sure that is what amh implied by saying that Wash U and IWU "put more emphasis on BB", but relaxed academic standards are definitely not a part of that emphasis (if it exists).  The IWU seniors this year whose plans I know about have been accepted to graduate schools in veterinary science, physical therapy, and clinical psychology (two).

The large rosters include JV players.  I am not sure how this translates to "more support for basketball," since athletic scholarships are not an issue in division III.

And medical redshirts--well, agreed, take it up with the NCAA.  Christina Solari, an All-American for IWU last season, lost her first season to an ACL injury in her first game.  She would have been eligible for a redshirt but chose to graduate and get on with life.  More power to her--and more power to Sean Wallis and Jamie McFarlin for their decisions to play an extra year. 

Having been born in Indiana, educated in New York, lived in Boston for 20 years, and now moved to Illinois (and having watched basketball in all of them), I have to say I find this discussion about regions pretty irrelevant.  I took Gordon's original comment as a simple statement that, in his experience, most NCAA champions have come out of either the Great Lakes or the Central Region (were those the two regions, Gordon?).  I figured that would be an easy statement of fact to check.  It was one person's opinion, anyway.

And, for what it's worth, Amherst was IMO far and away the best team in this Final Four.  Everyone deserved to be there, but the Lord Jeffs were excellent in every phase of the game:  rebounding, defense, running their game plan even when things looked to be going against them.  They had chances to fold in both games and they didn't.  Bravo to them for a well-earned championship.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 20, 2011, 12:56:58 PM
jaybird44....calm down and step back.
First, Both the UAA and NESCAC schools are among the top rated colleges in the country.  Their students and BB players are recruited from around the world and their schools share the "problem" of academic qualifications applying equally to all applicants.  The comments I made was general in nature to the conferences and not specifically to particular schools.
My comments wrt particular school programs again were to point out that school programs in WBB have over the years been established that lead to success.   Like the swimming programs at Kenyon that have led to numerous championships; like the squash teams at Trinity College in CT....etc.like the Div.1 WBB program in Tenn....etc.   Such schools all have done such under what ever rules/criteria you want to state.  Good for them!   My point is that differences in established programs in different regions in the game of BB should be considered in evaluation of regional chances in the big dance.  If a school can use its graduate school to allow players to play and the student wishes, so be it.  If a school wants to keep teams of 10 players, 15 players or 25 players, so be it....if a conference has a "JV" program to help develop players, so be it.  The point to be made is that there are noted differences in programs.  Schools in D3 midwest regions play in large new areas where BB is given special emphasis, IMO,  In the NESCAC, the "gyms" vary greatly in age and size.  The ice hockey sites often are newer and seat more fans throughout the northeast.
Enough said.    
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ralph Turner on March 20, 2011, 01:19:54 PM
Quote from: Hoosier Titan on March 20, 2011, 12:46:23 PM
Quote from: jaybird44 on March 20, 2011, 12:10:39 PM
I hope you are not insinuating that Wash-U neglects academics in favor of making sure its basketball program remains successful.

It is definitely true, as well, that student athletes at Illinois Wesleyan must meet the academic requirements of the university.  I'm not sure that is what amh implied by saying that Wash U and IWU "put more emphasis on BB", but relaxed academic standards are definitely not a part of that emphasis (if it exists).  The IWU seniors this year whose plans I know about have been accepted to graduate schools in veterinary science, physical therapy, and clinical psychology (two).

The large rosters include JV players.  I am not sure how this translates to "more support for basketball," since athletic scholarships are not an issue in division III.

And medical redshirts--well, agreed, take it up with the NCAA.  Christina Solari, an All-American for IWU last season, lost her first season to an ACL injury in her first game.  She would have been eligible for a redshirt but chose to graduate and get on with life.  More power to her--and more power to Sean Wallis and Jamie McFarlin for their decisions to play an extra year. 

Having been born in Indiana, educated in New York, lived in Boston for 20 years, and now moved to Illinois (and having watched basketball in all of them), I have to say I find this discussion about regions pretty irrelevant.  I took Gordon's original comment as a simple statement that, in his experience, most NCAA champions have come out of either the Great Lakes or the Central Region (were those the two regions, Gordon?).  I figured that would be an easy statement of fact to check.  It was one person's opinion, anyway.

And, for what it's worth, Amherst was IMO far and away the best team in this Final Four.  Everyone deserved to be there, but the Lord Jeffs were excellent in every phase of the game:  rebounding, defense, running their game plan even when things looked to be going against them.  They had chances to fold in both games and they didn't.  Bravo to them for a well-earned championship.
Women's Playoffs (http://www.d3hoops.com/archives/index)

# 2002 UW-Stevens Point   WIAC      Central
# 2003 Trinity, Texas         SCAC      South       
# 2004 Wilmington             OAC       Great Lakes
# 2005 Millikin                   CCIW      Central
# 2006 Hope                     MIAC      Great Lakes
# 2007 DePauw                 SCAC      Great Lakes  (DPU is the only member of the SCAC from the Great Lakes Region.)
# 2008 Howard Payne         ASC       South
# 2009 George Fox             NWC       West
# 2010 Washington U.        UAA        Central
# 2011 Amherst                NESCAC    Northeast
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Hoosier Titan on March 20, 2011, 01:26:41 PM
Thanks, Ralph!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jaybird44 on March 20, 2011, 01:47:46 PM
I don't think I need to calm down.  I merely pointed out a couple of statements that you made, which seemed to have a bit of unfair criticism attached to them.  You even prefaced them by stating "Let me explain before I get killed here."  So, if you knew that someone may call you on those statements, why make them?

Regarding the number of coaches or players on a roster...who cares if there are 10 players or 24 on a roster?  And, if you can have a lot of assistant coaches, so be it.  What is wrong with that, as long as you are within the NCAA guidelines?  You make it sound as if Amherst and other schools in your region are somehow getting the shaft because of some sort of nefarious cloak-and-dagger derring-do among schools in the central part of the U.S. and the NCAA.  If you want more coaches, get more coaches.  Nobody is standing in your way.  You want more players on the roster, put 'em on there. 

Better yet, just relax and enjoy your well-deserved national championship.  Those are very fleeting and not guaranteed "a priori" from year to year.  Savor it...don't tarnish the enjoyment by pointing subtle fingers of unfair criticism regarding other successful programs.

It's not just me that feels that way...evidently Hoosier Titan picked up on your tome, too...

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 20, 2011, 02:15:57 PM
Wow.  You are all quite passionate about your opinions relative to the various conferences, and programs, players, coaches and regions, and I applaud you all for your passion.  I am posting this comment as a relative newcomer fan of DIII women's college basketball, and if you'll indulge me I'd like to throw out a few observations.  Please take them from where they are delivered, and understand that I don't really have a dog in this fight...so to speak.

What I have seen this season while watching many of the Amherst games online, and knowing one of the players on the team very well, is a group of young women that have been incredibly committed to doing the absolute best that they could on the basketball court, and in the classroom, since last summer.  I have seen good games, and I have seen bad games, but I have never seen games where the ladies on both sides weren't trying their hardest. (and no one here has suggested anything else)

Many of these young ladies had opportunities for athletic scholarships at either DI or DII schools.  Some went that route and determined that while the basketball aspect was fine the academic aspect was lacking, and decided to upgrade the academic side and forego the scholarship.  They play the game because they love the game.  They come from all over the country to attend all of these schools, and who really cares where they are from anyway?  Once they are at the school they are representatives of that school and they represent them all very well.

I enjoy watching the games not because of the quality of the basketball, but for the passion that the ladies bring to the games, and knowing what they have had to sacrifice to play a game that they love.  I think oftentimes we as fans lose sight of the bigger picture.  The Lord Jeffs deserve all of the praise that is being directed at them, and Wash U deserved the same last year.  Whoever prevails next year will deserve it as well.  It is a very long season.  They all play by the same rules, injuries happen, bad officiating happens, shots get missed half of the time.  You win, you lose...you play your best.  You congratulate the victor, and console the loser at the end of the game.  Now they all get to enjoy a month and a half of being normal college kids before it all starts up again.

Congratulations to all who left it all out there on the court.

I've forgotten the reason for writing this, but it is so long I feel compelled to hit the submit button!  :-)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 20, 2011, 07:43:44 PM
Ralph:

I define the northeast as DC through Maine. For Division III basketball, it encompasses the Northeast, East, Mid Atlantic and Atlantic. Yes, I consider the NJAC schools to be northeast.  I guess the CAC is the farthest south I'd go and mid-Pennsylvania is the farthest west, which sort of splits the AMCC schools.

As for regional dominance, you have to go farther back than 2002 to get the full flavor. You'll find champions from UW-Eau Claire, Capital (two of them), Washington U (four more of them), Hope, etc. The Central and Great Lakes regions have more then their share. And notice which region put two teams in the Final Four this year.  Some of that is how the brackets are put together, but not all of it.

Amh63:

I'm glad you shared your opinions.  And I agree with almost all of them.  I'm also quite fallible so feel free to disagree at will. :)

I don't think the coaching talent is concentrated outside New England. There are some outstanding coaches in that area - Gromacki, Fifield at Southern Maine, Yosinoff at Emmanuel, etc. You could also include Shea (Salem State) and Pemper (Bowdoin) until very recently.

I think the Central and Great Lakes have won more titles because their elite teams generally have depth at forward and larger guards. Amherst proved me wrong in some ways this year.  They definitely broke my geographic bias. When I asked Gromacki after the game what he identified as his biggest needs to win a title, he jokingly replied, "Size and depth because that's what some guy wrote on D3hoops.com."  While Finucane was a part of last night's victory, notice who played point guard most of the first half - six-foot Jackie Renner.  And then, when Atanga McCormick and Leyman got in foul trouble, Renner played forward.  She's a real nice weapon and one Amherst didn't have a couple years ago. But you're right - size doesn't reign supreme and it's fair to criticize me for focusing on it too much. Finucane did a great, great job running the offense in the second half.  She has been a huge part of Amherst's turn around.

I also agree with what I interpret as your general point that the schools with highly successful individual programs are the ones who have the desire and the resources to work toward that end. It's not a direct cause-and-effect.  You can make the commitment and still not win a title. Players still have to make plays, coaches have to work with talent they have and all the unpredictability that makes sports so much fun still apply. But it's hard to be consistently excellent without commitment from the broader institution.  Coaches and players always want to win and will work toward that end.  But their institutions have to be working toward that same goal.  That means allocating money for great venues, larger coaching staffs and (in some sports) bigger rosters.

I did notice the size of the Wash U and IWU rosters and the number of assistants on Wash U's bench.  We mentioned it in our broadcasts last year and this year.  To me, that indicates an institutional commitment to the sport. Maybe it's just coincidental or players wanting to play for winners.  If you look in other sports, like Division III football, there's often a direct correlation between the elite schools (Mount Union, Mary Hardin-Baylor, Wesley, etc) and their roster size. Of course there are exceptions to the rule both ways. But if you spend time around a program like Mount Union football or Hope basketball, you realize they have made the commitment to that program that others have not or cannot. Gromacki told me that, one of the reasons he wanted to come to Amherst was the Athletic Director told him there was a commitment to winning there. Commitment + resources + great players + great coaches = excellence

Incidentally, while it gets obscured in a sports forum, I also think it's okay for schools to decide they don't want to make the commitment. If a school decides it wants to focus its athletic resources on another program - or not on sports at all - that's completely okay with me. If the key leaders at Kenyon or the broader community decides it wants to commit more resources to swimming than other schools, great.  If Trinity wants to do the same with squash, awesome...though I'd have more fun as a Trin alum if they won some hoops titles. :)

To take it a step further, if a school decides it wants to invest its time, talents, energy and money building another part of the school - something completely unrelated to sports - that's fine with me, too.

The primary mission for these places isn't to win athletic events anyway.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ralph Turner on March 20, 2011, 08:52:16 PM
Gordon, thanks for the insight on "northeastern" basketball.  You would give us three geographic areas of basketball, the Northeast, the "Midwest" and the periphery, the South Region and west coast.

I was particularly impressed with George Fox.  They found another gear in the Louisiana College game at Chapman.  To beat UWSP at Quandt and then to come so close to IWU is remarkable.  It appears that GFU has re-loaded with new head coach Michael Meeks.

I went with a 10-year history because the ASC and the NWC weren't Pool A members until 2001.  You have three champions in the last 10 years from the peripheral conferences, SCAC, ASC and NWC.  (DePauw goes to the NCAC in 2011-12.)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 20, 2011, 09:27:35 PM
Sure.

Totally agree on George Fox.  I was also impressed by how Howard Payne closed the season.  Is it safe to say the Yellow Jackets have crossed the threshold from star burst sensation under Coach Kielsmeier to sustained national contender?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 20, 2011, 11:16:08 PM
I have to correct myself from the 7:43 post. Renner was on the team last year, I just didn't remember her.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ralph Turner on March 20, 2011, 11:51:59 PM
Quote from: gordonmann on March 20, 2011, 09:27:35 PM
Sure.

Totally agree on George Fox.  I was also impressed by how Howard Payne closed the season.  Is it safe to say the Yellow Jackets have crossed the threshold from star burst sensation under Coach Kielsmeier to sustained national contender?
ASC talk moved to the ASC board.   :)

http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=1526.4245
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 21, 2011, 10:02:43 AM
Gordon - thanks for great article on the Amherst team.  You captured so much of what they've been feeling.   As you pointed out, they are accomplished students that are going pro is something else besides basketball. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 21, 2011, 11:18:52 AM
Thanks. I hope they see the players, coaches and community see the article and enjoy it.

When I meet players during the Final Four, I often get a little envious of the parents, coaches and fans who have been able to get to know the players and see them develop over four years.  I think, "This is a really cool person - I wish I had seen them play and got to know them better."  I had that thought when I met Jaime McFarlin of Washington U and the same feeling after interviewing Courtney, Jaci, Sarah and Kristyn.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 21, 2011, 12:02:32 PM
Gordonmann....thank you for your response last night to my post.  Read your D3hoops article on the Amherst WBB team/program today and I add my kudos to the other posters.  You do justice to your "liberal arts" education at Trinity...much more than I.  Since you shared with me some of Coach G's (I refer to him like others do Coach K of Duke, with one letter) pointed humor, I will respond in kind.  The info was shared with me by the parents of Sally Marx of the D.C. area.  Sally is a FY recruit that did not dress this season.  Last Spring, the WBB coaching job at UMass-Amherst became vacant and there was speculation about that he would apply for the job "down the street".  Sally's father at the time made a call to Coach G. to inquire.  His daughter had been accepted by Amherst and was planning to attend.  Coach G. first response to the call was that he had just returned from his interview at UMass.  Coach G. had to tell Sally's father that he was just joking.
At Homecoming in the Fall, I met Sally's parents again near the WBB tent.  They recognized me from the Spring reception.  I asked how Sally was enjoying Amherst.  I was informed that Sally had an ACL injury in the Sept. time frame and was now in the recovery phase.  Sally really missed not being able to practice with her team members this season.  Otherwise school life was great.  Sally's mother told me that when Coach G. was informed of her injury, he jokingly asked Sally how she felt about attending five years at Amherst.
Last comment to you.  I agree that Trinity should spread its resources around to other sports such as the WBB program.  Especially away from its football team.  Oh yes, I hear that Trinity's new sparkling ice hockey facility is something else.  Part of Trinity's Community Outreach Program?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 21, 2011, 06:03:35 PM
Amh63:

Thanks for the kind words. 

I  took a guided tour of Trinity's new hockey arena last summer when I visited campus for my 10th year reunion.  It's a really nice facility that is apparently pretty busy with rec league teams when the College isn't using it.  There was a roller hockey game taking place when I visited.  The arena is in the same neighborhood where a lot of the community outreach happens, but I don't think there's an intuitive connection to the surrounding community.  That community probably gets more out of the charter school or performing arts center than the hocky rink.

I'm not real big on spending lots of money on new facilities but, in the case of the hockey rink, there was a compelling reason for it.  The College was renting space at a high school a couple towns over. Sort of embarrassing when you're recruiting against Middlebury or Norwich.

I wish Trinity would put some money in the Athletic Center since Ray Oosting Gymnasium is pretty non-descript, especially compared to LeFrak or Chandler.  Then again I don't wish that so much that I respond to the weekly letters asking me for another alumni contribution. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ECSUalum on March 30, 2011, 10:12:36 PM
A belated CONGRATULATIONS to Amherst women for a fantastic 2010/2011 season!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on April 14, 2011, 11:30:37 PM
Any word on progress toward naming permanent coach at Colby?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: cantdothat on April 15, 2011, 04:04:58 PM
what I heard was that the search is ongoing and that it should be wrapped up by mid-may for Colby WBB Coach.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on April 15, 2011, 05:04:45 PM
Is the current interim coach in the mix?  She was pretty young, and I thought could have showed a little more emotion to help fire up her kids, but I thought she could grow into the role.  Particlarly if she surrounded herself some some experienced assistants.  I got the impression the girls liked her.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: cantdothat on April 15, 2011, 08:33:21 PM
Personally I thought Clancy would be a slam dunk, but I'm hearing that the search is ongoing. NESCAC's a very tough league and I thought her team performed very well especially in tough back to back weekend games. Her Assistant, Tony Staffiere is very capable and experienced. Poor recruiting class last year. This is a huge year recruiting wise for the Mules as the players McBride recruited will be in their last years.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on April 16, 2011, 10:38:13 AM
If the search and final decision are extended into mid-May it is almost a foregone conclusion that there will be a new coach at Colby.  Too bad.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: wbbhoopsfan on April 18, 2011, 04:08:57 PM
My understanding is that former Bowdoin assistant and current Navy assistant Julie Vielleux is on campus at Colby interviewing today.  Interesting decision if the interview goes well.  On paper, Veilleux has much more impressive credentials but Clancy did a good job as interim head coach this year.  AS mentioned earlier, recruiting will be very important if Colby wants to sustain the success.  McBride proved to be an exceptional recruiter, benefitting a bit from the coaching transition at Bowdoin, but the last 2 classes have been sub-par.  Jenn Nale will be a non-factor and I don't think Colby has much talent coming in next year.  Colby's best players - Vaughn, Mack, Ritchie - will be seniors next year and then things really thin out.

Will be interesting to see how much longer this search lasts, especially with a men's coach to be hired as well.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on April 18, 2011, 09:11:11 PM
It would certainly be unfair if Clancy is not rehired.  She did a good job with the team she had.  No recruiting was done in the prior year, so she did have as good team as the prior year, and yet she ended up with just about the same record. I think you have to at least give her a chance with her own recruits.

I do believe the big question with Clancy is, does she have the ability to convince players, such as the caliber that Colby was able to attrack the last four-five years, to play for her.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: wbbhoopsfan on April 20, 2011, 12:38:39 PM
Julie Veilleux was on campus yesterday and word is she was impressive.  Her dad is a colby alum and played for outgoing men's coach, which adds an interesting wrinkle.

Perhaps Colby couldn't really go wrong hiring from the interim or Julie... or could they screw it up and go with an uknown candidate.

Anyone know is anyone else is interviewing?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: cantdothat on April 20, 2011, 10:27:07 PM
Veilleux's Dad, Gary was assistant coach @ Colby with the Men's Program under former Coach Dick Whitmore in the early 1970's.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on April 20, 2011, 11:27:40 PM
Just another object lesson to all you young folks out there working hard to advance in your profession....whether your name is Clancy or Veilleux or Blodgett or Pemper.....sooner or later you will learn....NEVER trust your employer.  Never.  Make your best deal going in because your sure won't get it on the way out.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PostPlay on April 21, 2011, 11:52:27 AM
Since we are on the subject of coaches, anyone care to offer a view of the league's coaches?  Who are the best? I know it is easy to look at overall records and say Coach G is the best, and he may be, but are there some other coaches in the league who do well with less talent? Or their teams play hard every night and are very sound?  On the other hand, are there any coaches who appear to be outmatched? 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on April 22, 2011, 04:37:46 PM
Guess others don't want to touch this any more than I do.  Feels like G.P. is the gold standard to which all others will be compared.  For that reason, I can see why Colby might be looking for someone with more experience, even though I think Clancy deserves a shot.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: farmboy on April 22, 2011, 05:18:47 PM
Coach G indeed.

Other colleges would do well to invite Coach G to a chat, look at his style, review films with him, and then, once they know what they should be looking for...only then should they go hunting for a new coach.  In a way there are different styles for sure, but the basics are the basics.  I have said this before, today this is Women's basketball...time for the girl basketball coaches to retire.
Title: Julie V to Colby
Post by: wbbhoopsfan on April 26, 2011, 09:08:46 PM
Word out of Augusta is that Julie Veilleux is the new Colby coach and interim Clancy will not be retained.  Whoever said not to trust your employer was right on this one.  A coach wins 24 games and advances in NCAA Tournament and isn't hired.  I thought athletics wasn't important at D. III/NESCAC level?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on April 26, 2011, 10:34:13 PM
I'm sorry for Clancy, but not surprised on many fronts.  I disagree as NESCAC is very competitve and I think Colby wants to be able to compete and recruit against Amherst and consistently beat their Maine rivals.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MVP on April 27, 2011, 01:48:58 PM
hey kudos to coach G and the Amherst team. We all know it is players talent that wins championships.
No debate. If you had a squad of misfits, the team would not be successful no matter how good the coach is. Question is, how much credit do you want to give a coach for that aspect of the program. Let's judge coach G after half a dozen years.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on April 29, 2011, 11:11:34 AM
response to a couple of items

In terms of NESCAC Coaches, Gromacki is far and away the best Coach--having watch his teams over the past 3-4 years, although he has talent, the talent differential on his team versus some of the other top NESCAC teams was not that great, but his teams played much better together--that is coaching.

On  the Colby job, I don't know much about the new Coach, but I have to guess the recruiting aspect was a potentially key differentiator.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MVP on May 01, 2011, 04:30:24 PM
does anybody know if there are game tapes or video of  NCAA  the 2011 Elite Eight weekend games, march 11 & 12th at Amherst that you can purchase?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on May 02, 2011, 12:03:21 PM
MVP - I doubt that there are good tapes of the Sweet 16 and Elite 8 games as Amherst was having video troubles that weekend as evidenced by previous chatter on these boards.

Also just read bio on "Coaching Carousel" on D3 Hoops.  Hard to fault Colby for going with the coach that has worked with Pemper for all those years while being part of the success at Bowdoin and turn around at Navy.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on May 02, 2011, 01:31:38 PM
It is interesting to note that the postings on this board have focused in the Colby WBB vacancy while on the MBB side the postings have dealt mainly on the new players to arrive on the conference teams.  There has been no chatter on the Colby MBB coach vacancy.
Likewise, there is no chatter on this board on any future conference players.  Does anyone know of new players coming into the conference?   It is after 1 May, the deadline for new students to notify the schools of their decisions to attend.  Of course, most of the future players would have been directed to apply ED.
I find the differences between the two boards most interesting.   Even more so with the release of info from the coaches/schools, etc.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MVP on May 03, 2011, 12:50:06 PM
ok, thank you SUMFUN. If there is anybody out there that has copies of the games, please post here. It's a shame that it is so much trouble getting game tapes.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PostPlay on May 03, 2011, 03:36:32 PM
As for Freshmen incoming to NESCAC teams, there are 2 from the Boston area I am aware of:

1.  Kellie MacDonald (Forward-In Eastern Mass Top 10) was called "the ultimate teammate" by her coach earlier this season.  She led her Danvers team in just about every category...scoring rebounding blocks, field goal and free throw percentage...you name it...she did it.  She scored over 14 PPG this year and also became only the 3rd female in Danvers history to go over the 1,000 point barrier for her career...kid has a great head on her shoulders as well as she heads off to play at Williams the next 4 years.
2.  Molly Brown (Guard-In Eastern MassTop 25) can flat out shoot the rock especially behind the 3 point arc.  She scored almost 23 a game this year with 8 boards and 4 assists each night...She was named a Globe and Herald all scholastic and finished her career with 1,167 points.  The night she scored her 1,000th point she did it in style going for 33 that night.  Coach Jim Murphy at Bates has to be smiling with thoughts of her playing ball there the next 4 seasons.

FYI...the recruiting web site this was pulled from is generally very reliable.  The guy who runs it sees a ton of games and knows talent.  And the fact they are both ranked in the Top 25 in Eastern Mass means they are very good players.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on May 03, 2011, 04:23:11 PM
Thank you Postplay!  Can you share the local website....for Eastern Mass.?
Amherst's three players in last year's class were from Ill., Md. and NH (via a transfer).  Amherst needs a "center" since the only center listed for next year is also an outside threat and a player that doesn't play 40 minutes and is not a true inside player.  I am curious to see if Coach G. will get another transfer player as he has the past two years.  Just random thoughts...really.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MVP on May 30, 2011, 10:02:19 PM
Looks like Babson will finally get to play Williams and Colby in non-conference contests in 2011-2012.
No respect, despite beating Colby, Bowdoin, Brandeis, E Conn, W Conn twice, Suny-Geneseo, Gettysburg, Emmanuel and reaching the Elite 8 last two seasons.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on June 14, 2011, 05:52:34 PM
Several events of interest.  The Bowdoin asst. coach has jointed the staff as an asst. coach at the Naval Academy.  She played for the former head coach at Bowdoin when she was a student at Bowdoin.
Amherst has selected its 19th President....it was announced today.  The new president was a star WBB player in high school and top of her HS class in Lynchburg, Va.  About right for a conference college president.  Seems she shot free throws at college BB games during her time as the head of the Un. of Wisconsin-Madison.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on June 23, 2011, 09:36:27 PM
Amh63 - did you watch some of the press conference at Amherst.  She was given a "Champions" T-shirt from women's basketball with 19 on the back for the 19th president.  Sounds like she is a big sports fan which can only be a plus.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jumpshot on June 24, 2011, 03:52:01 PM
Take a look at her video interview on the Amherst website regarding athletics in which she promises Amherst will win more contests with Williams than it loses each year for years to come!
Why the obsession at Amherst with attempting to catch up with Williams in many aspects continues is beyond me. Amherst graduates would be better served by advocating building on Amherst's unique attributes and natural strengths.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on June 24, 2011, 05:27:27 PM
Sumfun......Have watched/read a great deal about the 19th Amherst President to be since the announcement.  She was a sports fan at Wisconsin-Madison and a favorite of the students.  She was a star BB player in high school and her brothers were football players.  That was why she received the T-shirt and the football jersey with the number 19.  There has been much discussion among my classmates wrt her but on other matters.  Much of the discussion has been on the President versus faculty tug of war that is present in much of higher education.   To date, my classmates are positive about her and am pleased that she is an person with strong administrative skills.....which Present Marx did not have.  I, like many of my contacts, am looking forward to her arrival.  We are not worried about any directional changes to sports at Amherst.   The AD at Amherst appears to be a fan of Biddy.
Jumpshot.....I forgot what side of the Amherst vs. Williams  thing you rest.  In general, it is basically in fun.  After graduation, it continues to be fun.  Activities around the country/world are held among NESCAC  graduates in general and Amherst-Williams fans in particular.  I have attended numerous football events in D.C. that are jointly attended by fans from both sides. Bottom line....the future of Amherst and the direction it goes are not based on or guided by what Williams does.  I do believe it is the same with Williams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on June 27, 2011, 10:13:19 AM
Totally agree with all that Amh63 said in regards to Amherst/Williams.  It's a fun, age-old rivalry that is shared by each generation.  After hearing about Williams President talk at Amherst the day before he received an honorary degree from Amherst, I'd say the presidents of each Univerisity have a healthy view of the rivalry.  Amherst, Wesleyan, and Williams confer degrees on eachother's presidents, so Biddy will get hers from the other two over the next few years.

AD was part of the search committee so I'm sure she is glad to welcome Biddy and her pro-sports leanings to Amherst. 

Can't speak for Tony Marx's administrative skills, and I don't believe he came up through the academia ranks,  but what an orator.  Did great things for Amherst on the national stage, and sheparded the College through the worst of the recession.  I wish him the best of luck.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: daoustian on July 07, 2011, 09:54:31 AM
In the meantime...http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2011/07/kean-accused-of-fixing-grades -- the fix is in!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on July 07, 2011, 10:40:47 AM
The situation with Kean's WBB program that D3hoops has posted, was brought up by Sumfun on another WBB board several days ago and I posted an item on the topic on the Kean's conference site.  It is a sad day in D3 sports.  However it plays out, I believe the lost to Kean by Amherst in some ways helped the team in its title drive.   If Kean's win in OT is voided, it doesn't really matter.  It should not affect the Amherst players in the upcoming season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: farmboy on July 13, 2011, 09:05:59 AM
The lack of judgement in the leadership at Kean is amazing.  Can anybody tell me who was primarily responsible for the decisions leading to this and what is their age?  I haven' t had the time to do the homework.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: kate on July 13, 2011, 10:50:16 AM
No horse in the race here, but i do have to commend amh63 for a classy response on what seems to be a very sad matter with Kean.   It's definitely the students who suffer.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bad knees on September 16, 2011, 11:51:45 AM
Hello All,

I am a new poster, and am excited to find a great place to discuss DIII women's basketball in general, and NESCAC basketball in particular.

I have a question for everyone.  I am sure it has been answered before, but I could not find it.  Here you go: How do the NESCAC women's bball teams recruit girls who fit their unique profile?  Regular AAU tournaments?  Particular camps that are for players with strong academics?  Something else?

I have a son who plays a sport in the NESCACs, so I am familiar generally with how things work. But his sport is not basketball, so I am looking for info to help my younger daughter, who is a bball player and might be a good fit at one of the great NESCAC schools.

Thanks,

Bad Knees
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on September 16, 2011, 06:13:04 PM
Welcome aboard,,,bad knees!  Not much action on this board since the season is about two and half months away.  Still, in response to your question, it is a bit hard.  I am more familiar with MBB in the conference....where there are rating reports of players, more assistant coaches that scout/recruit for schools, etc.  When it comes to WBB, the recruiting/scouting reports seem fewer and the assistants fewer.  I even asked the question once on this board and not sure if I go an definitive answer.  You may have to ask a past poster of note....named Sumfun....who had a WBB player at Amherst.  Do not know if she will be active this year since her daughter has graduated. 
She could be most helpful.   I know that in MBB, there are summer BB events held at colleges that bring together players that are strong students and where the NESCAC and Ivy coaches can view the players.  I'm sure there are similar events for WBB.  Of course, each school in the conference holds summer "camps" for players.....where the coaches can evaluate/teach the candidates.  I know that Amherst has such a WBB summer camp.   Check out the Amherst website; in particular the WBB site.  Likewise, check out the other conference schools for summer camps, etc.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on September 19, 2011, 03:31:11 AM
With WBB, the coaches do see kids in the east coast, at camps, aau tourneys, but their time and number of coaches (as amh63 said) is limited so your best bet is to contact coaches at schools you are interested in, send athletic resume and dvd of a full game, then come visit.  This is particularly true if you're not in the northeast.  Be PROACTIVE....coaches want to know you are interested.  Most will be honest about their interest in your player and if her strenghts fit their needs.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bad knees on September 19, 2011, 05:03:41 PM
Amh and Sumfun,

Thanks very much for the information.  One more set of questions:  How does being a recruited athlete affect the player's likelihood of acceptance to the school?  I know that, in some NESCAC sports, there is a tip system, at least at some schools.  Under this system, the coach is given a certain limited number of "tips" per year - say 2 or 3 - which can be used to gain the admission of a player who is near the prevailing academic standards but otherwise would not be admitted.  In addition, the coach can put any number of players on a list and tell the admissions department, if these players are within the large mass of qualified applicants, please admit them because I see them as players on my team.  And the admissions department generally honors such requests.

Is this anything close to how it works in NESCAC women's bball?

Thanks,

Bad Knees
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on September 19, 2011, 08:19:50 PM
Bad knees......you are entering a "touchy" area, IMO.  The question of "tips" in a given sport at a given school in the conference is not that straight forward.  When you ask if the "player" is qualified for the upcoming class, that gets more fuzzy and enters the policy of the admission office as directed by the particular school.  Even if one assumes that the academic standards for all the schools within the conference are the same, the needs of the schools with respect to students will vary from school to school in any given year. Staying with sports only (versus need of talented students in the music dept., or the science dept. for example), how many "tips" are allowed may stay the same every year, but how they are distributed among the teams can vary in a given year....given the priorities of the school and coaches.
In any case,  if a player applies to a given school, the player will be directed to apply ED....that is the case for all the conference schools.  Other than that, it is a crap shoot....IMO.  The talents of a player in the class and on the playing field are the only sure thing.  Having three children attend Amherst where I am a graduate was not a "sure" thing.  Amherst limits, percentage wise, the number of "legacy" admits and all must qualify academically.  The school offers an interview of the child of an graduate in the junior year.  The admission office will inform the parent if the child will be academically qualified for the upcoming class.  If not, then advice is given to where to apply.  One child may be admitted in a given year, but it is not assured that the same child would be admitted the next year!  Amherst admitted only 13% of the applicants for the class of 2015.
Good luck!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: quicksilver on September 19, 2011, 09:57:57 PM
Quote from: bad knees on September 19, 2011, 05:03:41 PM
Amh and Sumfun,

Thanks very much for the information.  One more set of questions:  How does being a recruited athlete affect the player's likelihood of acceptance to the school?  I know that, in some NESCAC sports, there is a tip system, at least at some schools.  Under this system, the coach is given a certain limited number of "tips" per year - say 2 or 3 - which can be used to gain the admission of a player who is near the prevailing academic standards but otherwise would not be admitted.  In addition, the coach can put any number of players on a list and tell the admissions department, if these players are within the large mass of qualified applicants, please admit them because I see them as players on my team.  And the admissions department generally honors such requests.

Is this anything close to how it works in NESCAC women's bball?

Thanks,

Bad Knees

Yes -- that is basically how it works except that there are also levels of tips--A-,B-, and C-band tips--with C-band tips reserved for applicants who fall toward the bottom of the school's range of acceptability on SATs and GPAs (roughly 1800-1900 SATs and B students). C-band tips are few in number per school (something like 10/year with 4 reserved for football) so most tipped athletes are A- or B-band recruits, meaning that there academic credentials are stronger than C-band recruits.

Exactly how many tips are doled out to each team varies from year to year and from school to school and will be affected by things like the needs of particular teams (do we need a goalie for the hockey team or a QB for the fball team, etc.) and the sport's relative priority. Total number of tips vary from school to school with some in the low 70s and others in the low 60s and something like 14 reserved for football. And of course the SAT and GPA associated with each band vary from school to school too. "Protects" are athletes whose academics qualifications are in the middle to high-range of acceptability for the school and would be likely candidates for admission even if they were not athletes -- they are in addition to the 60-70 tips.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: kate on September 20, 2011, 09:34:18 AM
Good grief, never too old to learn something about these college sports that i hold so near & dear to my heart.  What  was that term "unique" something or other.   Will they be able to tell their grandchildren, "I was admitted to wherever on a tip"?  As i said "never too old"  :-\
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on September 20, 2011, 12:04:21 PM
  Does this mean that the coach may lobby the admissions office, but not the financial aid office? Where's the line drawn in D3?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bad knees on September 20, 2011, 03:55:58 PM
Many people say that D-III schools will find scholarship money for athletes even though there are no athletic scholarships available.  My impression is that this is not true in the NESCAC.  My understanding is that all aid at all NESCAC schools is based on need, and that the coach has no impact on that process.  Maybe others have a different understanding.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on September 20, 2011, 03:58:58 PM
Quote from: bad knees on September 20, 2011, 03:55:58 PM
Many people say that D-III schools will find scholarship money for athletes even though there are no athletic scholarships available.  My impression is that this is not true in the NESCAC.  My understanding is that all aid at all NESCAC schools is based on need, and that the coach has no impact on that process.  Maybe others have a different understanding.

From my current understanding (and from when I applied to a few NESCAC schools many moons ago), coaches had no influence on finaid -- strictly need-based in the NESCAC.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on September 20, 2011, 08:56:23 PM
Bad knees.......All NESCAC schools, like the ivies, do not have athletic related financial aid.  Most, if not all, admit their students "need blind".....an expression that simply means that an applicant is judged and admitted based on many things....but need for faid is not considered in the admission process.  The financial aid needs of a student is looked at only after the applicant is admitted. You need to look at the individual schools websites to see the particulars wrt to financial aid.
Having said that....the ability of conference schools to package financial aid to meet one's need will vary however....as the cost of attending varies a bit between schools.  Amherst has a policy that it does not want its admitted students to have to take out loans during their 4-years and thereby increases the "scholarships".  A number of other NESCAC schools have such polices, I believe.  This may be different for schools in other conferences such as the UAA.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: quicksilver on September 21, 2011, 12:33:06 AM
Quote from: ronk on September 20, 2011, 12:04:21 PM
  Does this mean that the coach may lobby the admissions office, but not the financial aid office? Where's the line drawn in D3?

It's more than lobbying of the admissions office. At many NESCACs, the applicant's qualifications are submitted to the admissions office by the coach before the student submits his or her application, with the application effectively pre-approved through these informal exchanges. Through this process, the coach knows that if he or seh uses a tip on applicant x, applicant x will be admitted. This is why tips are used primarily in the early decision process: the coach knows the applicant will be admitted and that the applicant will attend the school.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on September 21, 2011, 09:31:44 AM
  That makes sense, because nearly all of the lower D1-capable players I've seen last year and this year have verballed their decision by the November NCAA signing date. The rise of AAU ball has advanced decisions by several months the last few years. Only one made her choice during her high school season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bad knees on September 21, 2011, 10:15:04 AM
amh - The point I was trying to make is that the NESCAC is different from much of DIII.  There are no athletic scholarships anywhere in DIII, but the accepted wisdom is that many DIII schools will find ways to get athletes money, through various types of merit scholarships.  I agree that, in the NESCAC, aid is based entirely on need.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on September 21, 2011, 12:13:33 PM
Quote from: bad knees on September 21, 2011, 10:15:04 AM
amh - The point I was trying to make is that the NESCAC is different from much of DIII.  There are no athletic scholarships anywhere in DIII, but the accepted wisdom is that many DIII schools will find ways to get athletes money, through various types of merit scholarships.  I agree that, in the NESCAC, aid is based entirely on need.

Correct... To me, that is one of the distinct differences in recruiting for the NESCAC/Ivy League and the UAA. The UAA offers both need-based and merit aid.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bad knees on September 21, 2011, 04:29:41 PM
Just realized that Kate's comment was aimed at me and my reference to the challenge that NESCAC coaches have in finding women's bball players who have the "unique profile" that NESCAC schools require.  Kate, I'm not sure what you find objectionable with my shorthand reference to the substantially-above-average academic requirements for admission to most of the NESCAC schools.  Perhaps you could enlighten us.  Also, I am not sure what you find distasteful about the tip process.  Getting admitted may not be much of an issue in the MAC, but it is a very difficult and challenging process for anyone who wants to go Williams, Amherst, Middlebury, Tufts, etc.  Those schools have to turn down many outstanding applicants who are academically qualified to attend the school.  Using one's achievements in athletics to make one's application stand out among the many applications that meet the school's standards seems to me to be something to be proud of, not ashamed of. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: kate on September 21, 2011, 06:01:50 PM
Hello bad knees - I am a TOTAL diversity person, and have always felt that a person learns nothing if they can't associate with ALL kinds of people.  This is especially important, i feel as they go through their college years.  If they play basketball, fine - if they don't that's O.K., too, and believe me, i LIVE for b'ball season.  I'm thrilled that Amherst won the championship last year.  A very close relative attends the school.  Regardless of who get in where, it's what they do with their lives after they've graduated, and even more important how they treat everyone with whom they come in contact.  If indeed, they're that wonderful, they will play b'ball &  be top-notch students.  A big world out there awaits them
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bad knees on September 21, 2011, 06:20:19 PM
Kate,

I agree with all you have said, but I don't think that anything I have said is inconsistent.  Putting financial issues aside, a young person should choose his or her college based on academics and the overall experience, including especially the people at the school.  Athletics may or may not work out, and no DIII athlete should choose a school based on a coach or a program.  Having a diploma from a prestigious university may open some doors, but what matters most in the end is what happens when you walk through whatever door you choose.

bad knees
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: kate on September 21, 2011, 06:34:56 PM
Hello, again, bad knees!  I never felt that you were inconsistent - at all.   Thank you for responding so quickly.  Also, good luck to your daughter wherever she decides to attend.   Incidentally, the MAC, in my humble opinion needs no defense - 100 years and going strong despite several departures of late.   Right now, i'm getting ready to watch my Phillies play one of their two final regular season games at CBP, so i gotta run.  It's been very interesting talking to you.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: kate on September 23, 2011, 09:59:41 AM
Good morning, bad knees.  That will teach me to run out on a conversation for a Phillies game  >:(.   They have been pathetic, but that's a line for another board.  Some day, i would hope to meet you and explain how i truly feel about sport's leagues segregated by "like-minded" ideas.   Certainly wouldn't mind a good consortium of colleges & universities to work on global warming, or crop growth, or wind power.  Can see leagues, for athletics, reconfiguring for distance, or if a school suddenly swelled in population, or dwindled, but just  can't figure out the like minded philosophy for sports.  Anyway, it has been interesting talking to you.  PS, we also have a niece who graduated years ago from Hope, so we sort of cover the bases.   I will always be an Aggie Fan, and my personal slogan for the school has always been - Delaware Valley College - We are Outstanding in our Fields :)   Friends in sports - Kate
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: kate on September 27, 2011, 08:55:55 AM
Smile and please resume posting, NESCAC folks!  Practice starts in three weeks - hoping everyone up north has a productive, healthy & fun season!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on September 30, 2011, 04:11:10 PM
Kate,    I think 3 weeks is a little early for the teams in our conference.  I do not expect practices to start any earlier than 6 weeks.  The conference welcomes Hamilton into the mix this year.  It impacts the schedules and could affect the start of practices....since Hamilton's Fall sports started earlier than the other conference schools.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on October 04, 2011, 08:21:52 PM
I don't know about everyone else, but Amherst starts practice on November 1.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 04, 2011, 10:50:02 PM
Thanks NHNESCAC Fan......Your date confirms data I have since acquired wrt basketball start practice dates in the conference.  Hamilton's entrance into WBB and MBB has shifted the scheduling of games a bit.  My earlier post was based on the fact that the start of Fall sports was so dependent on the start of school and FY orientation.  Hamilton's fall sports started a week earlier and I believe it was an carry over from their previous school calenders ...based in part to being a part of another sports conference.  Anyway, I am awaiting the start of practice....since I will get info wrt to new recruits and maybe info on a new assistant coach for Amherst WBB.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 17, 2011, 08:12:47 PM
The D3hoops pre-season picks for players is out.  IMO, it like many preseason list are more an indication of the pickers than the picks.  Who are the pickers for the NE region inputs?...Pat C.  I find that the publish picks are somewhat a joke for the NE region.
Babson has a 1st team player and also a 4th team player....both front court players.  Amherst played Babson in the elite 8 game last year and won easily by 18 points.  Sarah Collins, the 4th team center on the list, was not a starter for Babson in that game.  She played 18 minutes, had 4 rebounds and 5 points!  With Collins and N..Wurdeman, the 1st team forward, Babson was outrebounded by Amherst 41-21.  One of Amherst's guards had 1 less rebound (7-8) and just as many points in less time on the floor as Wurdeman.  Maybe one should pick the teams by players vice positions.  There should be some other returning front court players in NE or elsewhere.  There are two front court players on the Amherst team that return that played more valuable roles during the season than Collins' played for Babson.
Check the records and we can discuss this more. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: LORENZO123 on October 17, 2011, 11:04:15 PM
We're off to a great start so early in the season. My guess is that the picks were based on the entire season, not just the Babson - Amherst game. Collins played with a broken right (shooting) hand in a cast against Amherst. Babson beat Bowdoin in OT, 61 - 58 the night before. Collins, with her shooting hand still in a cast, had 10 points, 9 boards and 3 blocks. She made two clutch free throws shooting lefty in OT; 2 for 2 free throws for the night, left handed. She missed the previous 6 games due to her injury. Not a bad come back. Her numbers prior to the injury were very respectable.

Wurdeman's record speaks for itself.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on October 18, 2011, 11:33:25 AM
Amh63:

I'm the person primarily responsible for assembling Preseason All-American picks. So you can point your complaints and criticisms toward me. :)

That doesn't mean the picks are just my thoughts. We start with the postseason All-Americans from last year, unless someone else has returned from injury to knock them off the list. So Wurdeman's selection shouldn't be a surprise since she was 2nd team All-American last year.

Then I look at the All-Region picks (which feed into the All-American selections), which are made by sports information directors and media members in each region.  I look at players who were first team all-region without being All-Americans. That isn't a guarantee that someone will make the All-Americans but it helps identify strong candidates.

Then I do the same thing with second team All-Region picks, which is where Sarah comes in.  She may not have impressed you in that game, but she averaged 15 points and nine rebounds and added 89 blocks (first on the team) and 59 steals from a center position.  Plus, as Lorenzo pointed out, she had big games at other points.

I also factor in team success, strength of conference and input I've culled from coaches, media, etc.

The challenge for this year's team is that a lot of All-Americans and All-Region selections graduated.  Notice how many of the All-Region picks in New England graduated.

http://www.d3hoops.com/awards/all-region/2010-11/northeast-women

There are only three returning players who were first or second team all-region and all three are on our All-American list. 

Actually, if you look just at statistics, there's one player who apparently doesn't belong on the Preseason All-American list because her numbers are much lower: Caroline Stedman.  But she took over the Final Four games at pivotal moments, is an excellent player and shouldn't be penalized because her team is so outstanding that she doesn't play as many minutes. She's the best returning player on the best team and a key contributor to last year's title winner. So I made her a second team All-American despite her not appearing on last year's list at all.

It's not a perfect system and I'm open to recommendations on how to improve it. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 18, 2011, 02:57:25 PM
Gordonmann.....Thanks for the response and being open with your thought process.  You have a "big" job and the effort requires stats, etc. and then some particular consideration for Amherst's lone player C. Stedmann....based on her late season efforts.  Carole indeed played well in the post season as she was the MVP.  She comes up big in the critical/"big" games against the toughest talented teams.  Thank you for considering her efforts.  Stedmann "blossomed" so to speak in the year before when Daigneault was injured late in the season (Daigneault was selected an All-American the year before...I believe)  Carole picked up her play when Daigneault was hurt and in the late season critical games and in the Final Four she shined....though, tired she did miss her foul shots that let Wash. U beat Amherst in OT.  Last season, Carole's numbers were down due to her own injuries and adjustments,IMO, to the return of Daigneault as a starter.
Anyway, what I will point out is a method that will help make the selection, again IMO, better.  It takes more analyses of data and teams, and therefore time which you may not have.  I believe the best players can be selected by looking at the "best" teams of the previous seasons and look at the critical games they played  in conference tourneys and in the post season.  By looking at these games against other tournament teams, you can select returning players that produced vital minutes for their teams.  Players that blossomed late in the season, etc.
I will point out a case in point on the Amherst team.  Lem Atanga McCormick is a returning forward for Amherst.  She has often  contributed vital/critical efforts against tough opponents in critical and post season games....while playing less than 20 minutes/game.  Her "numbers" are therefore not great for a talented team.  When Daigneault was hurt in her Jr. year, Lem became a starter but her minutes were limited (the reason was not her play or her attitude on the team).  In the Final Four game against Wash. U two years ago,  Lem played her most minutes and scored 13 points and had 10 rebounds in the loss.  The only other player in the game with a double double was All American Jamie McFarlin who had more minutes.  Lem or Atanga as she is called, played well in the Babson vs. Amherst game that year in the post season.  Collins, a starter in the game had 8 points and 5 rebounds in 31 minutes.  McCormick had 15 points and 2 rebounds in 27 minutes.  Lem can play inside and shoot the 3 from outside  to bring the opponent's big players out from under the boards.  That year in the critical game against Williams in the post season, Lem had 16 points in 18 minutes  on 8-11 shooting...leading the team.   Last year, against Muhlenburg in the post season, in 20 minutes, Lem Atanga had 6 rebounds and 14 points on 7-11 shooting.  In the Final Four, Lem scored 10 points in 14 minutes on 2-5 from the 3-point areas in the C. Newport game.  In the Championship win against Wash. U. last year, Lem had 6 rebounds and 9 points in 20 minutes...but more important, it was her late game rebound and put back that inspired her teammates...the bench all rose up and everyone on the Amherst side, coaches, players and Amherst fans knew that the game was over.  Wash. U. would not make a comeback.
In summary, how does such a player on a great championship team that had gone to three straight Final Fours, not be considered.
What I have posted  is a method that, IMO, is fairer overall but requires much more effort and time.  I guess for now, we are at an impasse.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on October 18, 2011, 08:25:21 PM
Thanks for the suggestion. 

I like the idea of weighting players' performance late in the season, which is something I hadn't really considered.  It's certainly a valid criteria for a Preseason All-American team, similar to putting a team that finished the year on a roll on your Preseason Top 25 ballot.

I do try to factor success against playoff teams into the equation, particularly for players that put up big numbers while playing for non-contenders.  I look at how they did against the best teams they played.  Do their numbers hold up when they aren't playing weak teams or are they padding their stats against Pee Wee Tech?

That's even more the case when the player's team is a non-contender in a generally weak conference.  If they don't face any playoff teams, then I look for games against teams from strong conferences. For this region, that means the NESCAC.

You bring up a good point on Atanga who is the kind of player that defies award processes like these.  She's a very valuable contributor, the type of player that I believe teams need to win titles.  She's versatile, plays well around the rim and adds depth off the bench.  But is she one of the best 25 players in the country?  I think that's hard to say definitively given her role on the Lord Jeffs as a reserve. Remember, she didn't start any games last year and was seventh on her own team in minutes. 

Players like her are critical to championship teams.  They are the types of players you want if you're building a roster from scratch.  But they sometimes don't get individual accolades.

The good news for her is, depending on Gromacki brings in, she should have a chance to play more minutes this year with Leyman graduated and working with monkeys in Africa (one of my favorite post-NCAA career destinations).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on October 19, 2011, 06:16:20 AM
Just a couple of comments
Obviously, pre-season teams are a guess, particularly at the D3 level. There are so many good players that don't get attention unless they are on good teams.
On McCormick, I have watched her play several times over the past five years. My view is that if she were on anyother team but Amherst, she would be a first team all-NESCAC player.  I expect her to have a huge year this season. 
Interesting that Collins  of Babson is a fourth team player, yet kathleen King, who I believe is a far better player, is not mentioned.
Another player to watch this season in the NESCAC is Rachael Mack at Colby--she is a great all around player and should have a huge season.
Looking forward to another great year of D3 Hoops. Keep the discussions going.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 19, 2011, 01:01:50 PM
Thanks again, Gordonmann.....for your open mind.  Do not expect anything less from a Trinity man.   Several further comments.  Lem Atanga McCormick out of Chicago has Div.1 talent.  If I recall properly, she received an appointment to the Air Force Academy but it was withdrawn later.   I believe she wants to pursue a medical career and that interest helped her come to Amherst.  This year as a senior, she may start, but I believe she is more valuable coming off the bench..much like the "sixth man" role made famous by a Celtics player.  Either way, I believe her minutes throughout the season will still be somewhat limited.  It is more a "medical" reason rather than a talent team reason.  If she plays more minutes this year then that means she has been allowed and she has made the decision.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MVP on October 19, 2011, 01:15:08 PM
Happy New Year to all NESCAC WBB fans! A few thoughts on the Pre-season All Americans.  No list is ever perfect. There is a bunch to comment about recent posts but I'll start w/ Amh63. Amh63  argues that the "picker" didn't put enough effort nor time into the selections.  A pretty bold and patronizing statement.
Amh63  calls the list a "joke" Wow!  The "picker" un-like you is not biased. You sound like the typical "homer". Maybe the "picker" should just select the whole Amherst team and place them on the 2012 preseason All American teams. You say there are two returning Amherst players( Nationwide search) that played more valuable roles than Collins. Maybe you are the one who should take the effort and time to reviewl the stats.
I did check the stats/ records... and would like to discuss more...
You say there are two returning Amherst players that played more valuable roles than Collins. Which Amherst players are you possibly speaking about?  There are actually 5 Amherst forwards returning, 3 seniors, a junior and a sophomore.  I'll begin with the 3 returning seniors, Renner, Rizzo and McCormick.
Renner, started 8 games, averaged 20 min per game, averaged less than 3 pts per game.  Fg%of .321.
Rizzo, did not start in 33 games, averaged less than 4 mins per game , averaged less than 1 pt per game, fg% of .143.
McCormick, did not start in 33 games, averaged 17 mins per game, averaged 6.0 pts per game, fg% of .404, averaged just over 4 rebounds per game. One stat that does stand out for McCormick... she shoots .833 FF%, however she had only 4 freethrows all season  in conference play. Hardly amazing!! Hardly super valuable roles! So, which player were you speaking about?
Collins, a sopomore   on the other hand, started 22-25 games, 3 non-starts were last three games of the season, w/ a broken right hand. Averaged 28 mins per game, averaged 15 pts per game, fg% of .538 and  averaged just under 10 rebounds per game. Here is the real value beyond her nightly double /double stats for scoring and rebounds..., she had 55 assists, 59 steals and 89 blocks( 10th in the NCAA's) Renner had 64 assists, 6 steals and 6 blocks, Rizzo had 5 assists 1 steal, 0 blocks.  McCormick had 29 assists, 16 steals and 9 blocks. Hardly amazing!
Crowley , a junior  started 0 games,  averaged under 9 mins per game, averaged under 4 pts per game, fg% of .488, less than 2 rebounds per game. Dimario, a sopohomore started 0 games , averaged just over 5 mins per game , averaged 0.7 points per game, fg%of .333 Hardly amazing! 
To your several IMO's and specifically "Lem" you cite ,,,one performance from 2 years ago , yeah 2 years ago, where she scored 13 pts and had 10 rebounds. Wow! The Babson front 3 do that every night, night after night. You also cite a rebound and putback that, fans knew the game was over. Are you serious? 
You ask "how does a player on a championship team  not be considered. Hey Amh63, she was considered. She wasn't even close. Again, Atanga,  averaged only 17 mins a game, averaged 6 pts per game, averaged 6 boards per game, had only 7 steals/ 9 blocks all season. Hardly All American stats! 
In your opinion, the analysis should be '"critical games against best teams. Fair point, but  again, if you look at critical games against the best teams, 2012 pre-season All Americans should only include one Amherst player, Caroline Stedman.
There is so much more that needs to be addressed with your posts but I'll leave it at that for now.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MVP on October 19, 2011, 01:49:20 PM
To Maine 1,

McCormick, a 1st team all- NESCAC team?  Come on, first she has to earn many more minutes, maybe she'll do that this year, I hope so. She has to have more than 4 freethrows in the conference for the entire season. She also has to produce many more assists, steals/ and blocks( 7/9) to even be considered eligible. 
As far as Collins/ King. They're both great players, (probably 2 of the best power forwards in the country) It's obvious you haven't seen them play too much, a few games isn't really enough. Collins does it all.
She  averages a double / double ( pts/ rebounds) almost  everynight. She is in the top 10 in the country for FG%She is in the top 10 NCAA' s for blocks(89). She also had 59 steals. She has 2 more years to showcase her skills
King another great player, also averaged close to a double/ double, she had 14 blocks for the season 63 steals
However, I do agree King ...should of made the list.
Rachael Mack is a great player at Colby,  she does it all.  It will be great watching her play her senior year.  However,  on top of the points/ rebounds,  it is the assists, blocks and steals that distinquish and make the Babson big three All Americans.  I believe Babson plays Colby mid February.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 19, 2011, 03:33:55 PM
MVP....you do post from the heart and with passion.  From one "homer" to another, I hope Babson with, in your words so to speak, all-american front court, has a great season.  If luck prevails and the talent Amherst has returning performs well, Amherst will also have a good season.  Even the chance to return to the Final Four for the fourth straight year.   If both teams live up to both our bias expectations, maybe Babson and Amherst will meet for a third straight time in the post season.  In that game, I hope everyone will be healthy and all players at the top of their games.  If so, I should be at the contest and I will take Lem over Collins as players and Amherst over Babson. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on October 19, 2011, 03:39:58 PM
Maine1:

At the risk of turning this into the NEWMAC board, Kathleen King is an interesting case.  Her numbers are better than Collins, but she was "only" fourth team all region in 2011 while Collins was second.  That's according to people who see them both more than I ever will.  Unless I'm really familiar with the players involved or have reason to believe one school was underrepresented in All-Region voting (which clearly wasn't the case for Babson), I usually defer to the All-Region placements in the preseason.

MVP:

I think Amh63 was just venting and reacting, which is okay.  No harm, no foul. At least not to me. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BigMac on October 19, 2011, 04:08:51 PM
D III News also puts out 24 selections for preseason All-American players and they also only have Stedman from Amhurst as a pick.

The selections are close but there are different players:
Northeast :
Stedman - Amhurst
Wurdeman - Babson
Wehner - MCLA

EAST:
Fiore - Utica
Cohen-Cortland
Parks-Vassar

Atlantic
Lucas-Wm. Paterson
McRae-UMW
Pickell-NYU-Poly

Mid-atlantic
Chili-Muhlenberg
Woerner-Catholic
Marks-Misericordia

South
Prewitt-Centre
Duncan-Greensboro
Singleton-Concordia

Great Lakes
Verkaik-Calvin
Wiedt-Mt. Union
Ernst-Kenyon

Central
Simpson-Chcago
Karsten-Wheaton
Gregorich-Wis. River falls

West
Williams-Lewis & Clark
Geske-Gust. Adolphus
Barbetti-Cort-Redlands

With Taylor Simpson - Player of the Year

With 29 players as Honorable Mention

I will go with this list as my daughter is selected under Atlantic on this list and not on D-3 Hoops list :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MVP on October 20, 2011, 06:39:56 PM
gordanmann,

You put together a great 2012 pre-season All Americans list.  Good luck to all the NESCAC WBB teams and fans.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on October 20, 2011, 07:26:04 PM
MVP:

Thanks. I certainly would expect anyone to favor the list that includes their child on it. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 25, 2011, 08:57:24 PM
Saw Caroline S. of Amherst last Saturday at Homecoming (Amherst website has a nice writeup on her based on the D3hoops selection).  Found out that Amherst has indeed hired an assistant WBB coach (not announced to date); has three new players, two FY and a transfer.  Saw the head coach at the football game and he confirmed that an assistant had been hired.  Details, I guess will be in a few weeks.  Before the Nov. 1 start of official practices.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: kate on October 26, 2011, 09:08:43 AM
Good morning amh63!  Nov. 1 is this Tuesday!  That'll be two weeks before the Aggies of Del Val play their first game of the season with St. Mary's of Maryland.  CAN NOT WAIT, but that being said, good luck to Amherst this season - someday, i would hope to feel that euphoria felt by all the Amherst fans last March when you took it all. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 26, 2011, 12:25:11 PM
Thanks  Kate for the wakeup call.  Returned from a 5-day trip to NE...Homecoming football, watching other sports and the MBB's Captain's practice, etc.  Time and the day of the month, etc. are still not registering yet.....age and being retired for too many years, I guess.
Like you, I'm looking forward to the upcoming BB season.  However, Amherst is having great seasons in all the Fall sports with three nationally ranked teams and three undefeated teams to date.  My thoughts are somewhat scattered now.  Enough excuses with respect to my limitations.  Hope your teams have a great season...also.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 30, 2011, 05:55:19 PM
The D3hoops pre-season school rankings are out.  Amherst is no.1 but just 3 points ahead of Chicago.  Babson is no. 6, I believe.  The  other conference teams in the top 25 are Bowdoin and Colby.  The UAA is well represented with Rochester and Wash. U. joining Chicago.
The list should generate early season debate......the only real reason for it, IMO.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on October 31, 2011, 10:10:48 PM
I really think when it's all said and done, Babson will be the top rated East team at the end of the season, and quite possibly could be undefeted again.  Don't get me wrong Amherst is a great team, but they have a couple challenging games this year; @ Eastern Connecticut, 2 games vs. Williams, and the road games this year in Maine at Bowdoin & Colby, along with a road game @ Tufts.  Babson has a tough start to the seasom: Brandeis, Tufts (@ Williams), @ Williams, Wisconsin-Stout (@ Southern Maine) a potential game @ Southern Maine, and @ WPI all before New Year's, but the schedule really opens up for Babson after New Year's (only 2 tough games both at home; WPI and Colby).

Also, in a non NESCAC, I think William Paterson is incredibily overrated and way overhigh at #4.  Saw them once last year (against Mount St. Mary) and wasn't very impressed by them.  Mount St. Mary impressed me more last year then Paterson did.  I would've swapped then & Chicago in the rankings, because Chicago is a team that's underrated at #7.  Also, would have placed RIC higher then in the mid receiving votes category, that'll be a damn good team this year anchored by a PG that transfered from Franklin Pierce that was on back to back final 4 teams.  They have a pretty easy schedule for the most part (plus the LEC will suck this year since Western lost their whole team, and Eastern lost their whole starting 5), and I wouldn't be surprised to see them around #10 or #15 by the time the NCAA tournament starts if not higher.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on November 01, 2011, 12:14:26 AM
Chicago is 2. Wash U is 7 and yeah, it's definitely possible they could be higher when it's all said and done but with what they lost, this is a pretty good starting point.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 04, 2011, 04:33:47 PM
Since conference teams' formal practices just started this week and the previews are behind other conferences accordingly, a topic that may prove interesting to discuss, and more so, as it applies to conf. teams and players. 
Here goes......I understand that there are rule changes in WBB this year.  The only one I am sure of is the time to bring the ball across the mid court has been shorten.....to 10 seconds or something else?  Will it effect the play of some teams when full court pressure or any pressure is applied in the backcourt?  Do the teams have ball handlers in general and point guards in particular that can handle such pressure?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 04, 2011, 10:01:58 PM
I haven't really followed the off-season chatter, nor have I checked on graduation losses, but I figure you folks can clue me in without me having to do the work! ;D

Is Amherst the prohibitive favorite entering the season?  Who else should I be paying attention to?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: farmboy on November 05, 2011, 01:49:29 AM
Williams won't give Amherst any trouble.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on November 05, 2011, 11:58:10 AM
Amh63 - I just read an blurb that said there is one definite change this year for the women, and one that they will be experimenting with in the preseason.  The experimental is the 10 seconds that you refer to.  Personally, I don't believe a 10 second rule should be an issue.  It is less a case of teams needing slick ball-handlers than it is they need good passers and coaching.  In my opinion the easiest and fastest way to break a press is by passing the ball.

The second rule change, and the one that I think will be very interesting to see how it plays out, is that they are moving the women's three point line back a foot to be the same as the men's line.  The 3-pointer will now be from 20' 9".  That change may have a much bigger impact than the 10 seconds.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 05, 2011, 12:35:37 PM
Thanks NH...Fan for the particulars.  With a common 3-point line on the floor, there should be less confusion for us in the stands.  Does the player that you follow on the team have any feedback with the 3-point line change?  In general, the ladies of Amherst are capable of taking the shot anywhere.....strength wise.  Yet in the intensity of play and late in the game when condition also matters, the new line may affect the shooter.   More reason to develope  an inside game and play great defense.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on November 05, 2011, 12:49:46 PM
It will be interesting to see how it plays out.  I will check with Jasmine to see what her thoughts are, but knowing her I don't see it bothering her one way or another.  Interestingly, after i posted my last post I looked a little further on the NCAA website, and their rationale for making the change was threefold.  First, as you said, one line eliminates confusion.  Second they determined that the majority of threes taken were behind the men's arc anyway, and lastly (and surprisingly) the fg% was higher from behind the men's line than the women's.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on November 05, 2011, 11:46:08 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on November 04, 2011, 10:01:58 PM
I haven't really followed the off-season chatter, nor have I checked on graduation losses, but I figure you folks can clue me in without me having to do the work! ;D

Is Amherst the prohibitive favorite entering the season?  Who else should I be paying attention to?


Bowdoin & Colby would be the 2 team's that worry me since they play both of them up in Maine.  I don't think Williams gives them any trouble, and the rest of the conference should be pretty easy going (since Colleen Hart isn't at Tufts anymore, they should win that game easily as well).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on November 11, 2011, 12:08:02 PM
amh63...Just as an FYI update...the Amherst site has been updated to include the names of the new players...All bigs.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 11, 2011, 02:24:43 PM
Thanks NH...Fan!  Not too surprising in that Amherst lost two front court starters and one back-up from last year.  This year's team also has two senior players that probably will play more in the front court this year.  Need to reload the team so to speak.  There is a "pep rally" tonight at 9PM to cheer on the three teams in the post season tourn. and the football teasm.  The BB teams will be part of the show with dunking contests and 3-point shooting contests.  Hope someone will think about webcasting it.







Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 11, 2011, 02:50:39 PM
Back again after looking at the initial roster.  Of interest to me is that the coach brought in four players that are listed as forwards.  The lady from my neck of the woods....MD. must be the transfer player.  The new asst. coach is posted but the school has not yet made an announcement on the hire.  The other point is that one of last years forwards, C. DiMarco, is not listed.  Hope she did not transfer or is injured?.....there is only 14 players on the roster.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on November 11, 2011, 11:11:14 PM
I just googled her...Claire DiMario...it looks like she is still at Amherst. She was part of the women's tennis team this fall.  That is all my sleuthing could uncover.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 15, 2011, 07:27:57 PM
Amherst's team preview just posted on the website.  Gives schedule comments and good comments where team/players must step up this  season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 17, 2011, 12:16:08 PM
Amherst's first games this weekend.  Livestats only so far.  There is a 3 plus minute video of the team...preview type.....on the Amherst website.  Need to go to the u-tube button to get to the video for some reason.  Several comments on the team from two of this year's captains.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 19, 2011, 07:49:45 PM
Amherst opens up its season at home with a 90-38 win over Norwich.  The story is that Amherst's starters of five seniors started well, led by Stedman with 19 points.  Amherst played 6 other players.  Voight and Hardy played the guard positions and Amherst rotated 4 front court players, including three new players...one soph transfer, and two FY....all 6' or bigger.  The new front court players rebounded well and scored inside.  In short, Amherst seemed to have the found replacements for the rebounders that graduated.  It seems that Amherst's has two teams to put in without loosing a scoring/rebounding step.  It is only the first game and it is played at home, I know, BUT this team reminds me of the UNC MBB team under Dean Smith during the 70's-80's when they would rotate two whole teams. One was the white team and the other was the blue team...the colors refer to the school colors and the blue was sky blue.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh07 on November 19, 2011, 09:50:24 PM
Amherst with 65 rebounds against Norwich!  Is Amherst a better rebounding team this year than last year?

Megan Robertson the new Jaci Daignault? 

Savannah Holness the new Sarah Leyman?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on November 19, 2011, 09:57:27 PM
I think the score on Presto Sports from Williams has the teams switched in the Babson /Williams game.  Anyone at the game to confirm who won and final score?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on November 19, 2011, 10:13:09 PM
Yeah, something looks weird. Kathleen King had one point and Wurdeman and Collins didn't play for Babson? Seems unlikely.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on November 19, 2011, 10:32:45 PM
Quote from: amh63 on November 19, 2011, 07:49:45 PM
Amherst opens up its season at home with a 90-38 win over Norwich. 


It's too bad Mount St. Mary lost to St. Lawrence later in the night.  I know SLU was an NCAA team last year, but MSM vs. Amherst was a lot better matchup than SLU vs. Amherst is.  I more than likely would've been up at Amherst tomorrow if MSM vs. Amherst was the championship game, now I may head over to Williams to see Babson instead.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 20, 2011, 05:01:44 PM
If the early scores are correct, great start for the conference.  Colby beats Brandeis and Williams beats Babson.  The Williams MBB loses earlier while being highly ranked....while Williams WBB, unranked, beats the 5th ranked Babson team by a wide margin.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 20, 2011, 05:48:32 PM
Amherst wins its tournament in a win over SLU..93-63.  It was 45-24 at the half.  The lead increased to 36 and the subs by both sides entered and Amherst's lead did not go under 30 in the last quarter of the game.  Again, Amherst starters got a rest and if they returned, it was to work on different combos.....J. Renner, scored only 3 points but played pg for most of the second half and had 6 assist and 6 rebounds.  The rest of the starts all scored in double figures with McCormick leading with 16, followed by Stedman with 15 and Finucane and Fiorentino, both scoring 12 at least.  B. Crowley came off the bench and scored in double figures and rebounded well, as did Meg Robertson again.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on November 20, 2011, 08:00:40 PM
Quote from: amh63 on November 20, 2011, 05:01:44 PM
If the early scores are correct, great start for the conference.  Colby beats Brandeis and Williams beats Babson.  The Williams MBB loses earlier while being highly ranked....while Williams WBB, unranked, beats the 5th ranked Babson team by a wide margin.

That would be correct.  Babson hit only 21.9% from the floor (14-64).  Nicki Wurdeman (14 points), Sarah Collins and Kathleen King (each had 8) had 30 of Babson's 39 points on the afternoon.  First regular season loss for Babson since ECSU beat them January 4, 2010 (incidently also @ Williams).  The last 4 of Babson losses (regular season & NCAA) have occured on NASCAC team courts (twice @ Williams, twice @ Amherst).  Dating back to the start of the 09 season Babson is 55-2 when NOT playing on a NESCAC team floor and only 6-4 when playing on a NESCAC team floor.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MVP on November 21, 2011, 07:50:29 AM
Babson beat Tufts in the first game of the Williams tournament Saturday night by nine after trailing by nine at the half. Babson was beat on Sunday afternoon by a very good Williams team. Babson only shot 21% from the field for the game. This poor shooting performance is unlikely to happen again.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on November 21, 2011, 11:48:59 AM
I don't think of Tufts as a strong team this year and Babson struggled with them.  Tufts then lost to Whitman which isn't ranked in D3 Hoops.  The "big 3" from Babson should have more than handled Williams.  Looks to me that Babson will have to focus and dedicate itself to improving or they won't get that rematch with Amherst in the NCAA.  For that matter, neither Amherst or Babson have the luxury of believing that they deserve to be in NCAA Elite 8 against eachother.  That has to be earned.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ourtrun on November 21, 2011, 12:34:32 PM
I watched the Babson vs Williams game and from my observations, the Williams inside players were simply more athletic than the Babson BIG 3. As the pace of the game picked up the inside quickness and agility Williams became the big factor. Size wise (height) Williams matchup well the Babson Big 3.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: LORENZO123 on November 21, 2011, 01:25:30 PM
Babson's record is "only 6 – 4 when playing on a NESCAC team floor." Agreed, but 3 of the 4 losses were against Amherst; in the first round in 2009, in the Elite 8 in 2010 and again in the Elite 8 with Amherst winning the championship game in 2011. Babson's win against Colby two years ago in double OT was one of the best games I've ever seen. Their win against Bowdoin last year in OT wasn't a snorer either.

Secondly, the Babson and Amherst teams have both EARNED their successes.  Why anyone would suggest that because of their past success they think they deserve a free pass to the Elite 8 is a mystery to me. Last year the knock on Babson was their "easy" schedule. There are a limited number of non-conference games that can be scheduled and opportunities for getting tougher teams on your dance card doesn't happen overnight. They have a tougher schedule this year and losing this game will only make them better.

One game does not a season make. Williams had a great game, Babson did not. It's early in the season and the best is yet to come.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 21, 2011, 04:28:03 PM
NH..Fan & Sumfun...FYI if you are not already aware.....On the Amherst website, in the Flicker section, there is a number of photos of the ceremony of the unveiling of the 2011 NCAA Championship Banner in the Gym....and the handing out of rings to the players.  Saw two stars that graduated there to pick up their rings. J. Hardy is in the last photo receiving her ring.  It was held on Friday the 19th.
Also, If you go to the U-Tube video of the season preview, you will note that the players do not expect to return to the Final 4 without earning it on the floor.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on November 22, 2011, 06:04:44 AM
Looks like NESCAC overall is off to a good start.  Williams appears to have dominated Babson.  Williams has been coming on strong the past two seasons, and may have another strong season.  Amherst is loaded again, and appears to have replaced their inside players.  Watched Colby twice this weekend.  They will be strong again, although they do lack depth. There first five is strong, but not much scoring off the bench. The Brandeis team they beat was not strong, and missing their best player.  It looks like another good year for NESCAC women's basketball
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: toad22 on November 22, 2011, 01:21:13 PM
Williams has their best team in a long time. Claire Baecher is the most talented Eph in at least a decade. She completely disrupted the Babson bigs with her blocks and shot alterations. I hope they can start to believe in themselves. They could be very good.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on November 22, 2011, 01:48:28 PM
I saw Williams last year at Colby.  I thought that Baecher was very talented, but that overall Williams did not play very smart. They seemed to be in love with the 3-point shot, even though it was not falling. My sense is that they have the talent to compete at the top level of the NESCAC, as long as they play smart basketball.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 22, 2011, 07:56:30 PM
Amherst had a wake-up call game tonight at MHC.  In the pre-holiday game, it was 21-18 at the half, Amherst.  Using a number of combinations in the second half, Amherst scored 46 pts to 23 points in the second half.....for a 67-41 win.  Amherst was led by Meg Robertson, a FY front court player with 16 points.  Amherst couldn't hit their outside or inside shots in the first half.  MHC had a higher field goal % and 3-point % than Amherst.  Amherst won the battle of the backboards and had more chances at the basket.  Amherst turned on the defense in the second half and had over 20 steals in the game.  The coach let Finucane and Atanga McCormick sit after they scored in double figures early in the second half.  The reserves had plenty of time on the court with Renner playing her part......leading her team in assists and rebounds, I believe...as she directed the players off the bench.  Stedman had an off-night in the first half...1-10 in shots and 0-5 from outside.   Good to get a game like this early in the season....a good "lesson learning" game so to speak.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on November 23, 2011, 08:25:35 AM
amh63-can you give us a report on the freshman group at Amherst--looks like they have picked up a couple of strong post players.  Are they as deep as they have been. If so, that could be trouble for the rest of the NESCAC
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 26, 2011, 11:44:49 AM
Maine 1.....you flatter me on my knowledge, which I have little.  I again suggest you go to the Amherst website and watch the video of the practice.  First, remember the Amherst coach is a fine "recruiter" and recruits to fill needs and builds for the future.  This year, aware that the team lost two front court starters that provided both points and rebounds and leadership, the Coach brought in four front court type players.  Julia Weatherly is the 6' transfer from a Div.l school.  She will bring in her front court talents off the bench as she blends in  to the style and pace of Amherst on the offense.  Amherst tends to run up and down the floor when it can.  Julia's father is a Colby graduate.  Megan Robertson is the FY player that has gotten more and more time on the floor and appears to blend well with the starters.  She is a 6'2" front court player.  Her talents include rebounding and scoring down low and playing defense.  I expect her to be a major player off the bench.  Savannah Holliness is a FY player that also can play down low.  Listed at 5'11", she maybe taller and can hold her own against bigger front court players.  The 4th front court player is Uju Momah, a 6' FY player that has to date, not appeared in any games.  In a picture after the St. Lawrence game, she is in street clothes....so I believe she is recovering from an injury.  There is another "new player" in guard Sally Marx who missed all of last season due to an ACL injury.  She also has not appeared in a game to date but is seen in early practices with a leg brace.  I expect her to bring her talents by the Las Vegas tournament in late December.
  In discussing the depth question, one must consider the returning talent.  Five seniors return to be the starting 5.  Antanga McCormick goes to the  front court and will score and rebound there and will shoot the 3 if she is not guarded.  The other 6' player will be J. Renner, a Div. 1 transfer, who is more a point guard....sort of a "point forward" like the UConn MBB player in the late 90's, I believe. She is not a scorer inside as much as a outside shooter and a rebounder.  B. Crowley, a 6'1" player has shown in the games to date that she will be more than adequate as a scorer and rebounder down low.  This maybe her year to have a "break-out" type season.(Meg Robertson is the other front court player to give Atanga relief.)  Two other players may/will have their impact on the season.  Jasmine Hardy, a Div.2 transfer guard last year, now understands Amherst's team play, defensively and offensively.  She will bring her outside shooting talents and rebounding skills to play this year.  The conf. FY player of the year, M. Voight will also come off the bench and provide relief to the starters.  She can score inside and outside and like Amherst's guards, rebound.  She has learned to play tough defense and will have more time on the floor.
In short, Amherst will have depth this year....and if the early season is any forecast of the season, Amherst will be tough again.  Barring injuries and good chemistry and the blending in of the new players...They will remain tough in the front court.
Still, it is still early in the season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 29, 2011, 11:40:06 AM
Quickly glanced at the D3hoops latest polls.  Seems the conference has picked up another top 25 rated team,,,,Williams.  Bowdoin and Colby are still there as is Amherst. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 29, 2011, 09:43:36 PM
Amherst beats Keene at home 66-45.  It was 41-18 at the half.  Amherst played everyone that was dressed.  Keene played hard the 2nd half and drew the fouls.....getting ten fouls before Amherst got 5.  Amherst rotated players in and out and played a man to man defense that caused Keene fits.  Last year, Amherst beat Keene by 41 at Keene.  Amherst needs to work to get the ball inside more.  There was one play that had Amherst pass the ball around until B. Crowley lay it in under the basket without anyone guarding her.  Fooled Keene and the Amherst announcers.  The Amherst coach called time out when he wanted better offensive execution and/or more intense defense.  The boxscore provides the details.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BBstudent on November 30, 2011, 10:30:00 AM
The "one play" referred to above was a thing of beauty. Keene was in a 1-3-1 defense so Amherst's offense set up with two girls on opposite sides of the baseline, one on the foul line and two on top (a 2-1-2); the passing was side to side and baseline to opposite wing, strong passes that didn't "float" forcing the the whole Keene defense to be constantly moving at full speed. The ball never touched the floor and no one held it long enough to let the Keene players stop moving.... until the pass from the right wing to Bridget open on the right block for a layup. It was 7 or 8 passes and happened so quickly that I believe there were still about 10 seconds on the clock.
I would also observe that the improvement in Megan Robertson's defense between last Saturday's Saint Lawrence game and yesterday was what you might expect to see from freshman year to sophomore year, not in just ten days. She had great positioning and worked extremely hard the defensive end, and on this team that is what seems to get you playing time.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 30, 2011, 08:56:56 PM
BBstudent.....your description of "The Play" was quite informative and befits your "handle", so to speak.  Guess you were at the game.  I watched on-line and my eyes are not so quick or young....I'm guessing.  Anyway, it is a shame that the Amherst play is not recoverable and put on the u-tube.  There is no achieving of Amherst's webcasts......even with the new hardware.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 01, 2011, 07:55:21 AM
No surprise about new Amherst players improving in defensive area so quickly.  It is what G.P. Gromacki values and teaches so well.  Lem also is looking strong as her usual scoring threat, but improving on defense. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 04, 2011, 02:47:43 PM
Amherst hosted a matinee game at home against Lehman.  It was Amherst 88-Lehman 33.  Every active Amherst player played and scored.  It was Amherst's overall defense that led the way, causing turnovers, blocks, steals.  Amherst controlled the boards, surprisingly against the large front court of Lehmann.  Amherst wanted to establish the inside game and that happened.  The outside shots were not going in for Amherst in the first half.....but it was not needed as Atanga and FY player Meg Robinson carried the scoring load from inside.  When the outside shots started to go in the second half, the lead slowly went over 40 and into the 50's, even when wholesale subs came in.  The boxscore will show three centers/forwards leading the way with pg Finucane also in double figures.
It was a good game for Amherst, allowing the bench and FY players to get playing time and contributing on both sides of the game....without incurring any injuries.  Hoping that the other two players recovering from injuries will be playing soon.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 06, 2011, 02:28:25 PM
This weeks polls are out.  Changes to notice is the rapid rise of Williams and Bowdoin dropping out of the top 25.  Amherst remains #1, though I did not notice if they garnered more or less points this week.  Amherst has an game tonight and on paper the game with Emmanuel at home will be a challenge.  Emmanuel has a big team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 06, 2011, 07:17:36 PM
Emmanual was a wake up call last year and the same this year.  The difference being that when Amherst poured it on in the 2nd half they quickly put the game out of reach this year.  Congrats to freshman, Megan Robertson on a great night.  NESCAC teams were probably so glad to see Daignault and Leyman depart, but they may have met their worse nightmare with McCormick and Robertson.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 06, 2011, 07:22:50 PM
Amherst beats Emmanuel at home tonight 84-60.  It was a struggle all the way for the first 30+ minutes.  It was 31-30 at the half with Amherst ahead.  Amherst went up by 6 after the half, but Emmanuel came storming back to tie it.  It was nick and tuck in the first ten minutes of the 2nd half and Emmanuel went ahead 54-50 well into the 2nd half.  Putting most of the starters back with only Meg Robertson up front, Amherst shut down Emmauel's effective inside game and soon it was a ten point lead by Amherst.  With steals and preventing the pass inside, the lead grew.  Emmanuel started taking the outside shots and missed.  Amherst started hitting a few 3's (that was not falling in the 1st half) and started to make the xtra pass for layups and the lead was up to 20 with 3-4 minutes to go in the game.  Amherst made its foul shots and the game ended with a 24 point margin.  Amherst only shot 31% in the first half and was out rebounded by Emmanuel.  Amherst also missed about 5 layups as Emmanuel's physical play bothered Amherst.  Meg Robertson who missed several layups, pushed out of position, etc. in the first half adjusted and was the star of the game in the 2nd half.  Atanga and Finucane also put on a clinic with steals, rebounds fast break plays and brilliant passes in the second half.  Boxscore will tell the story when it comes out.
Emmanuel really bothered and pushed Amherst.....Amherst needed this game and the fact that most of the seniors were in until the last minute illustrates the level of play of Emmanuel's young team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on December 07, 2011, 05:46:12 AM
I watched the Colby-UNE game .  UNE was able to take the ball inside against Colby, and get Colby's post player in foul trouble.  UNE controlled the game from beginning to end.  If Emmanuell has size, they could give Colby trouble on Saturday  Looks like Maine basektball will be quite competitive this year, as UNE looks strong, USM appears to be much better, and Colby, Bates and Bowdoin are all strong
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 08, 2011, 11:45:17 AM
Amherst plays a young ECSU team tonight in Williamatic, CT.  Eastern's coach in a video after ECSU's last game considers it a major challenge for her young team....but holds out hope for a win.  On-line webcast at 7 PM.  ECSU gave Amherst a run last year in Amherst....and like most out of conference teams, they are several weeks ahead in practices and games....more time for the teams to mesh, learn, etc.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ECSUalum on December 08, 2011, 12:51:06 PM
I am afraid the Amherst @ ECSU game will be a blow-out.  Good experience for a bunch of newcomers to see a team which may be the best D-III womens basketball team in 10 yrs.  Ever wonder what a team like Amherst's would do in upper D-II or ever mid D-I competition?  Upper echelon D-I teams a la UConn would be a stretch though.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 08, 2011, 09:54:34 PM
Amherst beats Eastern Conn. by 21 in Ct.  Based on the boxscore and the recap, now on the Amherst website, the game was closer than the final score.  Amherst kept many of its starters in the game and the low-scoring starter, J. Renner, had a sort of "breakout" scoring night to keep the young ECSU players from pulling the upset.  I caught only a few minutes of the game as I was watching a close Amherst vs. Babson MBB on-line.  Both teams will learn from this game and improve going forward.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on December 09, 2011, 12:10:26 AM
Quote from: ECSUalum on December 08, 2011, 12:51:06 PM
I am afraid the Amherst @ ECSU game will be a blow-out.  Good experience for a bunch of newcomers to see a team which may be the best D-III womens basketball team in 10 yrs.  Ever wonder what a team like Amherst's would do in upper D-II or ever mid D-I competition?  Upper echelon D-I teams a la UConn would be a stretch though.


I'd like to see tham against St. Francis College of New York.  Coming into this year they had won 8 games the 3 years and had gone 4-50 in NEC games that same time period, and the NEC is one of the lowest rated leagues in D-1.  I have no doubt Amherst could beat that team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ECSUalum on December 09, 2011, 10:22:44 AM
What do you think express, is there a 10-15% overlap between D-III to D-II and D-II to D-I with respect to team competitiveness in college basketball?  It seems that the overlap might be getting larger over the last 5 or so years, where students would rather go to an excellent smaller Liberal Arts university , get a high caliber/quality education and at the same time be one of the stars on the team.  This is opposed to being a number at a large university, ie 20-or 30k students, and sitting or coming of the bench for at least a year or so.  I think these days everyone wants to be in the limelight. If you look at the NESCAC in particular, it seems there are quite a few students/athletes that fit the above category. I also see the trend in college baseball, soccer and LAX.  What's the college hoops overlap in your/others opinion?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on December 09, 2011, 01:13:38 PM
I think when you look at the top of D3 ( the top NESCAC schools, some of the other strong leagues), there is a very high degree of overlap between the qualify of the top players at those schools, and Dii and lower DI is fairly high. It would interesting to see an Amherst play teams like Lehigh, Holy Cross, etc. to see how they would do.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on December 09, 2011, 02:11:56 PM
Some of the better liberal arts schools, Amherst is one, seem to compete for the same recruits as the D1 Ivies.  Why not, the quality of education is similar, no athletic scholarships are on the table, and the cost of attendence is similar.  These girls have a strong academic inclination and some, while capable of playing at lower D1 level like the Ivies or Patriot League, might prefer the less intrusive athletic demands of a good D3 program.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 09, 2011, 02:54:28 PM
OK ECSUalum....interesting question you put on the board.  Staying with WBB....since it becomes more murky if the question is put to MBB, I will point out some facts with respect to Amherst and one can figure out the overlap.  On the present team there are four "scholarship" players out of 13.  Jackie Renner, SR., transferred in her sophmore year from U. Of New Hampshire; Jasmine Hardy,JR., transferred in last year from Un. of New Haven(Div.2); Atanga McCormick, Sr, had a offer from the Air Force Academy but it was withdrawn later...due to a medical condition, I understand; Julia Weatherly, SOPH., transferred in this year from a Div.1 team in N.J. (her father is a Colby graduate).  All are or had to sit on the bench for awhile to adjust to the stye of play, better players in front, etc.  Another FY player, Savannah Holness, was put up by her CT prep school for McDonald All-American.  Meg Robertson, a FY player has broken into the  starting rotation in the front court.  She is from a bigger prep school....Andover.  Do not know her offers or if she was ever interested.  She is indeed a talent.  Last year, a senior from Guilford, Ct. was selected All American for the second time and also won the POY for all of Div.3.  I'm sure she could play in Div.1.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jumpshot on December 09, 2011, 03:53:24 PM
ECSU alum--

Amherst's practice is widely known of taking numerous transfers, post-graduates, international athletes (hockey,soccer), more "tips" for fewer teams, etc., in order to boost athletic standing. More power to the school since it is free to choose whatever it does in any domain.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 10, 2011, 07:46:23 AM
Amherst can't take post graduates or 5th year players that had an "injury" year as there is no graduate school.  Schools in the UAA can have a 5th year player like Jamie McFarland for Wash U who is now playing in Europe.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 10, 2011, 11:35:05 AM
Nice post Sumfun. 
Jumpshot tends to be a "pot stirrer" on several boards with his posts mainly directed at Amherst.  I'm guessing he is a Williams supporter.  Against my better judgement, I will now respond to his post.............Amherst tends to attract talented student-athletes primarily because they provide FREE webcasts of key sporting events.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ECSUalum on December 10, 2011, 01:10:06 PM
Thanks guys, always an interesting debate.  Switching to men. I know when I was at ECSU in the early 70's (student pop, +/-1200, 95% CT residents), Warriors baseball, for example, played a lot of bigger and now D-I schools, ie St Johns U,  U of North Carolina, East Carolina U, (UConn chickened out), and beat or was  very competitive with all, but of course when D-III conferences were formed in the early 80's that level of competition pretty much went away.  Today in basketball RIC plays URI,, (RIC not much success), I think UW Whitewater plays U of Wisconsin, UWW w/o much success, there must be a few others but certainly rare for D-III to play D-I schools and more rare for D-III school to beat the D-I school.

sorry,  this is in the wrong thread
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on December 10, 2011, 02:29:03 PM
Quote from: sumfun on December 10, 2011, 07:46:23 AM
Amherst can't take post graduates or 5th year players that had an "injury" year as there is no graduate school.  Schools in the UAA can have a 5th year player like Jamie McFarland for Wash U who is now playing in Europe.

I heard these grumbles already from the CCIW/IWU folks about the 5th year. Amherst (and any other college) can offer a 5th year player the option of a second bachelors (BA, BS, BSBA, etc), while universities (including those in the UAA) can offer graduate school as an option for the 5th year. All schools have the opportunity of extending its student-athletes a fifth year.

The second option... that all schools have (and that the military academies use esp. for football) includes having the student-athlete take the semester off. The third option, which is more reasonable for the NESCAC, is to extend the degree (fewer hours and/or less degree requirements per semester).

The fifth year option is rarely taken by student-athletes... Even if you look at the UAA, how many 5th year players have we seen over the past 5 to 10 years. Not many, with WashU having the two high profile cases of 5th years on the mens and womens side.

Jumpshot does bring up a good point.  ;) But, regardless of the sport, each school/conference in D3 has its own recruiting advantages (tips, location, degrees, prestige, international presence, etc.). The best conferences and athletic departments are the ones that utilize those advantages the best.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 13, 2011, 09:26:26 AM
Three conference teams remain in the Top 25.  Amherst at #1. Williams at #11 and Colby at #20.  Bowdoin has a couple of points. 
Amherst last game of the semester is tonight at Springfield.  Need to stay focus.....before their trip to Nevada.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 14, 2011, 04:08:11 PM
Didn't catch Amherst's last game of the semester last night against Springfield away but the write-up and the boxscore is most revealing.
The score was Amherst 69, Springfield 26....with Springfield scoring the last 4 points.
The game saw the play of Amherst FY player, Uju Momah, for the first time.  The 6' FY player from Ct. is another front court player for Amherst. She was recovering from an injury.  Everyone dressed played.  Still not seen is Sally Marx, a soph. guard.  The scary part of the game is that it seems Amherst is tuning up the defensive end of their play.....scary to opponents.  Though the outside shooting was not up to par...only 69 points.....the game was won by defense.  Amherst had 7 blocks, 9 steals and forced 22 turnovers by the Pride while making only 8.  Coach "G" expects good defensive efforts of the players....and more time on the floor comes with defense.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: daoustian on December 18, 2011, 10:12:52 PM
Early start on the class of 2016 for Amherst:
http://www.lohud.com/article/20111217/SPORTS02/312170002/Con-Ed-Scholar-Athlete-Week-Irvington-s-Marley-Giddins

Good player though Irvington is a very small school playing in a small school division against a lower level of competition in NY.  Hopefully it works out. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 19, 2011, 11:35:30 AM
In any case, she will get a great education and should enjoy the experience.  Coach G is pretty good about evaluating players that will fit into his "system"...if there really is one.  Coach G has a history of players that do well in the classroom and on the floor and being athletic (track high jumper).  I may have met her during Homecoming weekend....in a around about way.  Was talking to Stedman about the team/coaches while she was leading a "future student" around the campus.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 20, 2011, 07:53:49 PM
Forgot to mention that the latest top 25 rankings are out.  What is of interest for this board is the drop of Williams.  All conference schools are in exams, in holiday break, etc.....no game activities.  The drop must be the result of other schools wins....changing selectors minds.  Still, the size of the drop is surprising with the few games that are being played.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 28, 2011, 04:53:46 PM
Amherst beats Concordia (Wisc.) 67-37 in its first game at the LV D3hoops tournament today.  Everyone played except for Sally Marx.  It was a 11 point lead at the half.  The court has an "open" end which seemed to affect the foul shooting in particular as Amherst's shooters missed most of their shots at the open end in the first half.  The story of the game seems to be the Amherst's coaches shirts worn during the game.....can be seen on the D3hoops website for the tournament.  Next game is with WPI on Thursday afternoon.  These games will be a nice warm up for the team after the end of exams.  First game in the new year will be with Williams. Oops...first game is with Wes., wrong "W" team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: formerbant10 on December 28, 2011, 05:45:37 PM
No doubt the shirts were inspired by Coach Gromacki's favorite TV Show
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on December 28, 2011, 11:02:54 PM
Good to see you're still prowling these boards, Former Bant. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Hoop Guy on December 29, 2011, 02:23:00 PM
I do not know anything about the shirts, but it is an interesting tournament.  How come there are some really good teams out there at the tournament and Amherst gets two of the less competitive teams?  Do they decide who they are willing to play or does D3hoops make the assignment?  I know they play a tough league schedule and they may want to not take on any major out of league foes, but it seems odd.  They will KILL WPI today and it was pretty easy yesterday.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on December 29, 2011, 03:29:30 PM
Agreed. I would love to see Amherst against UW-River Falls, Carthage, Simpson or Thomas More.

Pat Coleman makes the schedule with two priorities -- not repeating prior match ups and getting teams regional opponents, which helps them in the NCAA tournament selection process. Teams also have to agree to play each other, though. Some teams are not enthusiastic about playing Amherst for obvious reasons. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 30, 2011, 01:14:03 PM
Amherst beat WPI by a whole lot.  Write-up and score on both this board and on the Amherst website.  Important thing is that all of the Amherst players played, including Sally Marx and no injuries of note.  Rizzo did get an elbow in the face that required the trainer to evaluate and stoppage of the game.  It was a learning experience for both teams and should help Amherst in the start of conference play.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on December 30, 2011, 01:41:47 PM
Williams seems much improved this year, particularly on the defensive end -- Williams has shut down some pretty solid teams so far this year (holding opposing teams to .32 FG percentage despite playing a tough early schedule), and perhaps are a bit underrated nationally.  Claire Baecher should be the first Eph all-American since Maggie Miller, and all five starters are athletic and can really guard people.  Rehnquist like her Dad at Amherst appears to be a natural scorer.

Amherst will still be heavily favored, but the Ephs' defense could at least make things interesting this year, and the Ephs have only one senior starter so next year could be even better.  The big question is does Williams have enough offensively, with only three consistent scorers at this point, and seemingly only one consistent three point threat. 

This article notes a future Eph, MaryKate O'Brien:

http://www.naplesnews.com/news/2011/dec/30/ndn-holiday-shootout-penn-charter-defeats-maclay/
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on January 01, 2012, 07:31:03 AM
Nice article on Amherst frosh Robertson:

http://articles.boston.com/2011-12-29/north/30564212_1_gromacki-amherst-college-d3hoops-com
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 01, 2012, 04:56:48 PM
nescac1.....Thanks for the story.  Missed you at the Amherst MBB game.  Got some smiles from some Jeff fans when I told them I was looking for a Williams man that I had invited. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on January 01, 2012, 07:32:55 PM
Sorry, I had intended to make it but couldn't escape DC ... maybe in Salem :)! 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 04, 2012, 01:31:18 PM
Amherst will play its first conference game against Wes. on Friday.  Wes. has recruited a 6'4" center from NYC.  Hasn't made an impact to date.  In general it is a young team but is on a winning streak. Won a holiday tournament in Jan. 2012.  The win over NYU was led by senior guard Lippe.  She will have a family reunion of sorts on Friday.  Her younger brother, Max Lippe, is a 6'6" freshman player for the Amherst MBB team.  He was also a QB on the football team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on January 05, 2012, 03:02:38 PM
Amh63 - I am always amazed at the knowledge that you have relative to all things on this board.  For those of us who are relative newcomers...or maybe just for my benefit...what's your story?  I'm guessing you graduated from Amherst in '63, and I believe you've said you are down in the Metro DC/Northern Viginia neck of the woods, but it sounds like you get up here quite a bit?  Just curious.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 05, 2012, 05:21:03 PM
NH NESCAC Fan.......Curiosity will get you.....just kidding.  Basically, I grew up in Was. DC and went to Amherst when it was all male, under 1200 students, etc. I spent a great deal of time in the New England area going to school and during business trips.  I met my wife at UConn., my oldest son was born in Cambridge, Ma. Our three kids..a daughter and two sons are all graduates of Amherst....and there were much time spent traveling up to western MA.  I am based in Md. outside of Wash. D.C.  When I was working, I often had business trips to Boston, Providence, towns in Ma. and Ct.  During years of schooling at Amherst, UConn, MIT and even the Naval War College, etc. I have met and formed friendships with many people that are still in the New England area.  Since retiring at the end of 1999, I have become a somewhat sports junkie and a "camp follower" of Amherst sports in general, and BB in particular.  If you ever read my posts on the MBB board and the football board, you know that I enjoy "chatting" with other posters from other conference schools.
One of the great pleasures of following Amherst sports is meeting the players and their family members.  I often follow Amherst students from the D.C. area as they go through school and compete in sports.  In the NESCAC, there are many family related players playing at different schools and the relationships are often generational.
I have been involved in supporting Amherst over many decades....coordinating and interviewing prospects for the Admission Office in the 70's, etc.  Since retiring, it is primarily in fund raising lately.
Having said that, I want to point out that Jasmine Hardy had a sort of "break-out " game in Vegas.  I believe that Coach G. maybe looking at her to fill in next year as the PG while younger candidates are recruited/developed.
My next trip up will be for the Hamilton game on the 13th of Jan.  Hope to get to see most of the WBB game.  Probably will be eating dinner at Amherst Chinese in town before the WBB game.  If you are in town around 5PM and are hungry for asian food, join me.  I will buy you dinner.  Jasmine should know the restaurant...as AmChim....across the street from the Town Hall.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on January 05, 2012, 10:06:45 PM
That is a wonderful offer, thank you.  If I were heading down I would definitely take you up on it.  There is a chance I might get down there for this Saturday's game against Conn College.  My father-in-law lives in Chicopee, and we are due for a visit.

It was really nice to see Jas have the game she did in Las Vegas.  I watched much of the first game online, and the announcers commented on what a nice shot she has.  She is definitely happy that they moved the line back this year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on January 06, 2012, 07:50:07 PM
According to the Amherst twitter, they clobbered Wesleyan 76-39.  Caroline Stedman and Shannon Finucane each finished with 14 to pace the Lord Jeffs.
Also, Tufts upsets Williams 63-40, holding Williams to 21% shooting while forcing 21 turnovers
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 06, 2012, 09:01:23 PM
The Amherst win over Wes. was worst than the score.  The lead was around 40 plus for most of the second half.  Both teams inserted players freely and Amherst finished the game with the reserves.  Actually, Amherst started to build its big lead with only one starter in at times.  Wes. does have a big team and inserted their 6'4" FY center in the 2nd half.  The problem for Wes. was that they were not shooting very well, even under the baskets.  There was a period in the first half when it was close, but Amherst pulled away steadily. Amherst's outside shots were falling as Wes. went into a zone.  Slowed Amherst down for awhile....until adjustments were made.  Both teams played hard.  It was not the night for Wes. to pull an upset on the road.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 07, 2012, 10:55:04 AM
NH....Fan  ....Hope you caught the game last night.  There is a writeup of the game on the website that features Jasmine's pix and mentions that she is 8-11 in 3-point shots in her last 3 games.  She is a player with pose.  Her defensive game must be up since that is the key area that will get a player time on the floor,IMO.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 07, 2012, 05:41:41 PM
Amherst beats Conn. 93-42 as the defense shines again....holding the Camels to around 22% shooting.  Every one for Amherst got floor time with 5 players in double figures for Amherst.  The write-up of the game is on the Amherst website.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on January 07, 2012, 07:50:17 PM
amh63 - we made it down to the Amherst game today arriving with about 6 minutes left in the first half.  Amherst is really, really good.  They are extremely well balanced, very deep, and athletic.  It was fun to watch them.

FYI...there was a gentleman at the game wearing an Amherst 1963 jacket...I had to ask him to make sure, but as you know, it wasn't you.  I told him to keep an eye out for you next Friday.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 08, 2012, 10:08:57 AM
NH...Fan....Thanks for the alert.  Glad you enjoyed the game and saw Jasmine play well.
Now my curiosity is up......first my class has no gentlemen.  I know of two classmates that live in the immediate area but are not candidates to attend sporting events and/or wear their old freshmen letter(numeral) sweaters.  There were a number of other sporting events going on that may have brought out classmates....watching grandkids!  There were swimming meets going on with Williams and a hockey game also next door with Colby.  I will just have to see if he returns for a "late" game on Friday.  I do know of several alumni that attend games regularly....but they are either younger or older and never wear their class garbs.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on January 08, 2012, 07:54:58 PM
Duly noted on the use of the gentleman term.  I shan't make that mistake again.  Ok...so this "guy" said he was supposed to be in the class of '62, but he took a year off.  You won't be able to miss him if he is there, and wearing the jacket.  It is a purple wool jacket with white leather sleeves.  On the back it says "AMHERST".  Under that is a large basketball, and under that was "1963".  He apparently attends quite a few games because he was very familiar with Jasmine, and her shooting prowess of late.  I hope he's there.  Have a great time.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 09, 2012, 05:17:37 PM
NHNESCACFan.....Thanks you for the description.  Owe you and yours a dinner sometime...maybe durning a conference tournament period.  Yes, students in my days do "drop" out and end up in different classes eventually....maybe because of money, grades or just not attending the required number of "chapel" meetings.  Any case, you have indeed aroused my curiosity....not standard issued garb.  Need to ask for his tailor.  Watch the games on-line.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on January 10, 2012, 11:11:56 AM
OK...new topic for discussion.  Twelve games into the season I just went to the NCAA website to look at stats, and it is very interesting to me.  Amherst, because of their depth in large part, plays their starters roughly half of every game, minutes wise.  Consequently, when you look at the individual statistics you are hard pressed to find any statistical leaders from Amherst.  When you look at the team statistics, however, Amherst dominates.  This clearly, to me, highlights the importance of the team over the individual...but what does it mean at the end of the season when it comes time for the individual accolades?  There was some discussion earlier on this board about whether Caroline Stedman should be on the pre-season All America team based on her statistics.  If you've seen her play you have no doubt of her talent, but if you go strictly by stats you would never know she existed (exaggeration).

So, I guess it is a testament, in my mind, to the players who are willing to give up the individual glory for the team accomplishments.  It would be nice if they could have their cake and eat it too, but it rarely works out that way.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on January 10, 2012, 11:23:06 AM
Quote from: NH NESCAC Fan on January 10, 2012, 11:11:56 AM
OK...new topic for discussion.  Twelve games into the season I just went to the NCAA website to look at stats, and it is very interesting to me.  Amherst, because of their depth in large part, plays their starters roughly half of every game, minutes wise.  Consequently, when you look at the individual statistics you are hard pressed to find any statistical leaders from Amherst.  When you look at the team statistics, however, Amherst dominates.  This clearly, to me, highlights the importance of the team over the individual...but what does it mean at the end of the season when it comes time for the individual accolades?  There was some discussion earlier on this board about whether Caroline Stedman should be on the pre-season All America team based on her statistics.  If you've seen her play you have no doubt of her talent, but if you go strictly by stats you would never know she existed (exaggeration).

So, I guess it is a testament, in my mind, to the players who are willing to give up the individual glory for the team accomplishments.  It would be nice if they could have their cake and eat it too, but it rarely works out that way.



That's a really excellent point.  It's exacerbated at the D3 level because even the top players often aren't seen by a broad audience, so statistics are even more relied upon for individual accolades.  No easy solutions though....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BBstudent on January 10, 2012, 01:37:05 PM
Continuing on with that thought, it is always interesting to watch the NESCAC statistical leaders who, at the beginning of the season, can put up 18 points, 8 rebounds and 6 assists (hypothetically) until they start conference play against Bowdoin, Amherst and sometimes Tufts or Williams. Once conference play starts the numbers become more realistic. Conversely, now that conference play is starting, based on previous years experience, you will see the stats for the Amherst girls go up as the starters minutes rise from about 20-23 minutes a game to 27-32 minutes a game.
But, as you said, it is a team game and a testament to the girls that they each give up some individual glory so that as a team they can be as outstanding as possible.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 10, 2012, 01:59:44 PM
Interesting topic of individual glory versus team glory in essence.  The Wash. Post today had a quote from a top columnist with regards to the Washington Wizards. the local NBA team that remains winless.....it basically states that the team is made up of very selfish players that for the most part puts individual glory over team wins.  The pros are about money and individual stats lead to money.  Still the players like to win and do not like to be on a losing team.
At the college level at least and for the most part in Div.3, winning is the important thing, I believe.  Early in the season, players learn to work together and often become role players for the good of the team.  The season can turn when a key player gets hurt, lost, or is ill. When a team is built around a few players, winning becomes harder when they are defended well and/or have off-days....and they will have bad days.  Top teams recruit to have depth and develop players to be able to be team players, etc.  In the end, the team wants to win games and to win championships....conference and even national ones if possible.  Amherst gets players that want to play for Coach G., a winning coach.  They get talented players that want to win and be on a team that has a chance to win a national title.  Ask the players on the team and I'm sure they put the team first and their stats second.  Oh yes, they like their National title rings.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 10, 2012, 02:24:22 PM
They LOVE those rings, and TEAM has taken precedent over individual stats in the Gromacki era.  Part of that is G.P., part is the team leadership, and part is team chemistry.  Having said that, Amherst has gotten it's due at season end....Jaci as D3 Player of the Year over Christopher Newport's Schweer (sp?), Stedman as MVP of the tourney and All-American the year before, Leyman - NCAA record for most games played in a career.  Stedman's numbers were down last year due to mid season injury, but she more than made up for it when it counted in the Final Four.  BBStudent is spot on when saying that Amherst individual stats don't rise until NESCAC games, and still might not rise to the very top, but as a team, usually in top 3 in most categories.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 11, 2012, 11:22:49 AM
Amherst plays Farmington State away tonight.  No webcast.  One of the few out of conference games remaining on the schedule.
Returning to the topic brought up by NH...Fan.
In the tournament over the holidays in Vegas, Amherst blew out several teams.  In one of them, Lem Atanga McCormick...a senior starter was brought back in late in the game.  It puzzled me...though I am often confused.  Lem was aggressive in her scoring attempts.  She hits an outside shot and the Amherst Bench all rise up clapping and shouting.  Lem had scored her 1000th point and goes into the Amherst record book.  It seems that in spite of team goals, etc., the coach and her team are aware of stats that are important to individuals....and the team enjoy sharing those goals.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BBstudent on January 12, 2012, 01:45:24 PM
With respect to Lem's late return, I don't know that you are correct as to the reason but I also don't know if your speculation is incorrect. I think this early in the season the coach is more interested in trying out combinations and forcing new players to work with returning players. So, for instance, Caroline and Shannon were inserted back in the line up fairly late in the Farmingdale game playing with some of the non-starters. This might be considered "garbage time" in other programs but I think with this team whenever one is playing it is for a reason and part of a plan which may not be apparent at least to me. It may be to keep people from being hurt, or to keep players fresh for the next game or to see how the team might function if someone later is injured (bite my tongue) or can't play in a game because of foul trouble.
I may be wrong (or could change that to I usually am wrong) but I doubt if the coach realized that Lem was so close to 1000 points, especially since the season is just starting and she was not in danger of missing that milestone during the year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: daoustian on January 12, 2012, 11:15:06 PM
Another Amherst recruit for the class of 2016 -- we'll see whether soccer or basketball win out.
http://buckhead.patch.com/articles/pace-seniors-make-college-commitments
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 13, 2012, 08:27:08 AM
BBstudent....Good points all.  Your "handle" is most appropriate.  I was traveling yesterday and did not report on the long island NY game.  Still puzzled about this game....did last year too.  Guess it is to prepare the team for a long day trip game while school /classes are still out.
Thanks Doust.... for the info.  Like Spencer Noon, the new recruit will play both sports awhile until injuries or something else requires only one.  Amherst senior Rizzo plays both now.  In any case, the point guard position is critical for the future.  The recruits for this year are front court players.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 13, 2012, 08:34:30 AM
Forgot to say that I'm excited to see my first live game in LeFrak this year.  It is always fun to be up close and watch the team play.  The game against Hamilton will be interesting.  I'm sure Coach G. remembers recruiting point guard Finucane at Courtland NY....or becoming aware of her......when he was the coach at Hamilton.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ephoops on January 13, 2012, 11:58:39 PM
Question for the followers of Amherst WBB:

What is Gromacki's reputation on campus?  His on-court success speaks for itself.  Do the girls love playing for him?

The reason I ask is that the Bucknell women's job just opened up.  Apparently the coach who just resigned was a vilified by her former players and former assistant coaches.  There was an uprising on the Bucknell hoops internet message board this past week which culminated in the coach's resignation late this evening.  See the link below:

http://www.boards.basketball-u.com/showforum.php?fid/53/ (http://www.boards.basketball-u.com/showforum.php?fid/53/)

With the success that Dave Paulsen has had coaching the Bucknell men's b-ball team, Gromacki may be a candidate for the Bucknell women's job at season's end...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 14, 2012, 08:37:54 AM
Amherst beats Hamilton 78-25 last night, holding the visitors to their lowest score of the season.  The visitors came into the game with a rep. for holding opponents to around 43 points/game.  Amherst had that many points and more at half time.  Detail writeup of the game on the Amherst website.  Amherst did change their rotation of players a bit last night....bringing new players in groups of five,  Hamilton just doesn't have the players or the depth to match Amherst this year...or Amherst's defensive intensity.
To answer the EPHoops' posted question......Not at this time, IMO.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 14, 2012, 10:03:11 AM
The kids respect him and like playing for him, and they know that his game prep will win them games.  I can't imagine that if he wasn't interested in the UMass job that he'd be willing to go to Bucknell.  I don't think he really likes the flying and travel involved in D1, but that's just a guess.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BBstudent on January 14, 2012, 10:38:53 AM
I am not sure that is the correct tack to take in this situation. Instead of telling everyone how much the players like and respect him, which is obvious from their play, maybe we should make everyone think the opposite so he has to stay at Amherst. For example, we could say that it was really Gromacki, not Woody Hayes, who hit the Clemson player in 1978; and we could hint that it was the Amherst girls' basketball coach that suggested to Belichick the idea of stealing other teams signals... We could even hire some political consultant to run a dirty tricks campaign so no one will hire him.  For my money the less people know about what a great coach and person he is, the better off we are.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 15, 2012, 11:47:04 AM
Little shake up in the NESCAC yesterday with #18 Williams losing to Conn College and Tufts over #22 Colby.  Anything can happen on the road, but at this point in time seems like NESCAC teams will struggle against Amherst's suffocating defense and depth off the bench.  Amherst beat Conn 93-42. 

Good test for Amherst with Kean coming to LeFrak on Tuesday evening.  Seems like Kean will have many of same players that beat Amherst last year as there have been no NCAA penalties to players or coach (yet) for their ineligible players playing.  Last year Amherst was trying to feed Leyman and Daignault as the both scored their 1,000th point that game, and Stedman was just coming off an injury.  This year I'd expect Amherst to play with all barrels firing.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 15, 2012, 09:13:18 PM
Looks like after Amherst-the battle for the other top three spots in the league will be interesting.  Bowdoin beat Tufts, but has lost to Colby,and lost to Bates this weekend. Williams has lost to Tufts and Conn College--Is Conn College that good, or is Williams overrated? Tufts seems to be a pretty solid team, with good wins of Colby and Williams, and a tough loss to Colby. Colby has been playing solid, will a good win over Bowdoin, but has lost to both UNE (out of league) adn Tufts. Hard to figure out at this point how this will all shake out.  It will make for an interesting season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 15, 2012, 09:18:40 PM
just noticed that Williams top player went out of the game after  6 minutes--any idea if the injury will keep her out longer?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 16, 2012, 04:40:42 PM
There is a nice preview write-up of the upcoming game with Kean of NJ on the Amherst athletics website.  Kean at 15-2 is the school that beat Amherst last year in OT and appears to have returned a number of the starters from that team.  It will be webcasted by Amherst since it is at Amherst.
NHNESCACFan....the "man in the jacket" was not at the game with Hamilton.  From a local fan, I got a name and then a picture in the yearbook.  I believe it is Mr. Sommers, a G/F  in 1963, a team that beat both Harvard and Brown, spit with Wes. and lost both games to Williams that year....also go clobbered by Holy Cross who had an All-American.  One of his teammates on that squad was at the game.
Oops, forgot to mention that I arrived in New London for the Williams vs. Conn. MBB game......missed the upset win by the Conn. College WBB team over Williams.  I think that the victory was aided a bit by Williams loosing their center early in the game.  Not sure of that fact.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on January 16, 2012, 11:17:27 PM
Quote from: Maine1 on January 15, 2012, 09:13:18 PM
Looks like after Amherst-the battle for the other top three spots in the league will be interesting.  Bowdoin beat Tufts, but has lost to Colby,and lost to Bates this weekend. Williams has lost to Tufts and Conn College--Is Conn College that good, or is Williams overrated? Tufts seems to be a pretty solid team, with good wins of Colby and Williams, and a tough loss to Colby. Colby has been playing solid, will a good win over Bowdoin, but has lost to both UNE (out of league) adn Tufts. Hard to figure out at this point how this will all shake out.  It will make for an interesting season.

Maine1....not only makes for an interesting season but it also provides for some thinking about how the balance of power in NESCAC WBB has shifted solely to Amherst.   Bowdoin, Bates dropping badly in last five years....Colby is rising but it is a tough road for them...I think Veilleux may get them to second best in NESCAC fairly soon....but she'll never get the players that Amherst can get.    Conn is definitely better, but that school has a horrible track record in athletics generally and in WBB specifically.  Tufts was probably as good as they can be a couple of years ago.    Trinity, Wes and Hamilton are irrelevant in WBB.     Why is Middlebury so bad? Especially given their elite status in other sports?  Williams, as always, terribly overrated.  Cannot ever be counted on in big games and simply never has the basketball culture that would allow them to be really good ( such as Bowdoin a few years back and Amherst currently).  If they had a Gromacki or Pemper clone watch out!---until that happens they will never be championship caliber.  Veilleux would be a great fit with them and be able to get players that she simply cannot get at Colby.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on January 17, 2012, 09:47:22 AM
amh63...sorry the mystery man wasn't there Friday night, but it sounds like you have zeroed in on who he is.

I think Remsleep makes a very good point about the stranglehold Amherst has over the rest of the NESCAC.  I, too, don't see that changing anytime soon.  They have created the perfect storm...best coach, selfless team, gorgeous campus, very accessible location, top flight academics, seemingly unbeatable...who wouldn't want to be a part of that.  Granted, all of the NESCAC schools have some of all of the above traits, but Amherst has all of them.  They are becoming the Duke of DIII.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 17, 2012, 10:28:38 AM
Wash U might have something to say about the "Duke of D3" as they have many of the same attributes and years of success. But to say, Gromacki with support of AD, have turned this program around is an understatement.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on January 17, 2012, 12:06:03 PM
Sumfun...your point is well taken...I should have said the Duke of the NESCAC, as that was what I had been discussing, my bad (as they say)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 17, 2012, 03:59:17 PM
Just some loose end comments, etc. before the game tonight.
The Duke of...whatever.....one of the reason I refer to Amherst's coach as Coach G is after Coach K of Duke who I admire.  Still, if we are talking about WBB vice MBB coaches, then one must think about UCONN or Stanford and yes even Tenn.  For the above single letter references to coaches.....the other reason is that I am not good at spelling.
It is interesting to note that this week's conference player of the week is from Conn.  In the top 25 listing, Conn. College actually picked up several points after a 2-0 weekend.  As Sumfun pointed out earlier, Amherst beat Conn. by over 50 points.....sort of shows the separation of Amherst from the other teams at this time.
In the preview of the Amherst vs. Hamilton game, it was pointed out that there had been only 5 previous meetings between the schools.  Amherst lost to Hamilton once.....in the 2007 meeting. I believe the Coach at Hamilton at that time was Coach G.  He left to come to Amherst after that season.  Some trivial relating to that move.....Coach G.(who I met at Salem Va. in the MBB Final 4 in 2008) had asked for some advice from a friend about the ethics/concerns he had with regards to pursuing the opening at Amherst.  The friend is an Amherst graduate who he met when he was the coach at St. Lawrence.  The friend was at that time on the Board of Trustees at St. Lawrence...or as they call such positions...Overseers.  That friend was at Amherst last Sat. to see the games.  I was introduced to his traveling companion as we went to watch the WBB game.  His companion is a graduate of Hamilton.  It is a small world.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 17, 2012, 08:24:06 PM
Amherst beats Kean 81-58 or close to that score....It was a 11 point lead at the half and such scores are "Close" for Amherst.  Lem Atanga McCormick lead the charge in the first half with defense, rebounding, etc.  with at least 6 rebounds by the mid point in the half.  She was hit in the head by an elbow near the end of the half and did not return in the second half.  Stedman took over in the second half and scored a career high of 31 before she was taken out of the game.  Jackie Renner played a great game on the defensive side against Kean's top scorer who scored only 7 points.  The boxscore and recap will be on the web shortly.  Kean's downfall was turnovers and Amherst's defense that caused many of them.  Kean's fast pace game was countered by Amherst's.  Amherst half court game was better than Kean's and Amherst depth also prevailed.  With the reserves being rotated into the game, the lead grew in the 2nd half.  Kean countered with a full court press and Kean's quick guards did produce several mini runs.  However the runs were too few and too short.  Amherst took the lead and never gave it up.  Kean could only get to within 7 early in the 2nd half before Steadman took over, it seems.
Still it was a physical game against a tough opponent and should help as Amherst goes on a long road trip in the conference.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 18, 2012, 02:00:23 PM
Several comments after looking at the boxscore.  Turnovers.  Kean had 28 and Amherst 22.  Kean as it was pointed out by the announcers tends to have a large number of turnovers due primarily to there style of play...fast pace transition game generated by rebounds and steals.  Kean had more steals than Amherst who had 7 steals.  Amherst won the rebound battle. Coach G dislikes turnovers, I believe.  One Amherst player who has been playing great was quickly pulled when her turnovers generated Kean points. A learning lesson in a contest that the opponents press and have quick hands and play physical.
Oh yes, for those that may have missed the game, there is a short video of highlights of the game and also game photos on the Amherst website. 
Glad to see Stedman  "breakout" so to speak.  After the game with Hamilton last Friday, she came out to watch the MBB game with a icepack around her right ankle....something of concern to all fans....since her speed down the floor is one of her strengths.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 20, 2012, 11:51:49 AM
Interesting story on the D3hoops front page today....just 3 days after Amherst's game with Kean at home.  The Kean coach was dismissed.  Will NCAA action follow?  Not good news in D3 in any way.
Amherst is taking the long road to Maine.  Two tough games ahead...back to back games against solid opponents.  Be looking at the rotation of players by Coach G tonight.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: farmboy on January 20, 2012, 01:28:15 PM
From the moment we first Coach G before he actually started his first year it was clear he was a game changer.  You could feel it in the interview.  Unfortunately Amherst was not to be the choice but I count myself lucky to have met him and shook his hand.

I think I have stated this before.  Williams has had possibly better women athletes/BB players than Amherst since Coach G got there, but William's coach is still coaching girl's BB and that all changed on the arrival of Coach G. There are a lot of head games always going on on the William's side, and Coach G has been extremely successful, like he always is, at getting rid of that factor at Amherst.  That fact is always crucial to girl's BB teams.  Its hard to change coaches apparently in the NESCAC with tradition and all, not to mention it looks to the unwashed like Williams has had great seasons over the last 2 -3 but that really isn't the case and has been a great squandering of talent. In reality I truly believe Williams should have been in the final four the last few years but what do I know.  I should mention this is/was not an isolated thought as it pretty well rippled through the Williams side in the last few years.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Hoop Guy on January 20, 2012, 04:07:25 PM
Sounds like quite an indictment of Williams, and probably not totally fair. 

Two years in the final four is a stretch.  Williams should have beat Amherst in the Sweet 16 two years ago. They had a big halftime lead, gave it all back and more in about ten minutes of the second half and then played them pretty even.  But they lost, and it did not appear to be coaching, she put them in a position to win and they could not.  Even if they had, no guarantee they would have beat Babson the next night who gave Amherst a good game.

Last year they lost in round 1 to a team that Amherst killed in the sweet 16.  That same team beat Rochester after they beat Williams.  So I think it is hard to say they should have progressed last year.

This year, I thought they were pretty good. Probably only two really good players, but some good parts.  Not sure how they lost to Tufts and though they lost Beacher, they still should be able to beat Conn College.  So I think to date this is a missed opportunity.  If they get their player back they may still be ok, if they dont it is all over.

But having seen both Williams and Amherst play over the last couple of years, it is not close in talent, and the difference is not coaching.  Amherst is deep in talent like no other team.  Does not mean good players cant and wont beat them, but player for player they are better than Williams and Williams missed the best chance they had in the Sweet 16.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: farmboy on January 20, 2012, 05:01:28 PM
I hardly agree with anything you say.  But thats okay:)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on January 20, 2012, 07:41:01 PM
Wow.  I'm watching the Amherst webcast and with about 2 mins left it is a 1 point game.  Amherst is playing very flat...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 20, 2012, 07:49:03 PM
Amherst held on to win--where was McCormick?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 20, 2012, 08:10:49 PM
Amherst wins by 4 in a squeaker.  It was 29-29 at the half.  Towards the end it was who was going to make the foul shots and the Amherst seniors held their composure and made theirs.  The players played against a game Polar Bear team that was aided by much to many foul calls by the refs who wanted to become too involved, IMO.  Coach G who is normally quiet was getting on the refs in the first half.  Good lesson for the team to play through a game with some "home cooking" along the way.  Example...towards the end of the game, a Bowdoin player is fouled on the floor and her NBA continuous shot was good.  Later, an Amherst player is fouled and her follow thru shot was called no good.  Amherst player makes her two foul shots.
To answer Maine 1.....Lem Atanga was hit in the head and taken out of the game in the first half against Kean on Tuesday.  She was held out for her health, I believe.....concussion?.  Will see if she plays any on Sat.  Normal front line depth was pushed hard.  Meg was called for a number of fouls early and Bridget was playing with 4 fouls when the game ended.
Must give Bowdoin players credit.  By the middle of the 2nd half, Amherst was ahead by 14 and the polar Bears made some 3's and made drives that normally would be challenged.  Stedman was not playing at the end of the game and Finucane had fouled out.  Need to see the box to see how things stats-wise panned out.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 20, 2012, 10:54:35 PM
Maine is notorious for home town calls.  Amherst hasn't had foul trouble all year, plus missing Lem, so front court is thinner.

I totally agree w NE Hoops....over the last three years Williams couldn't begin to match Up against Amherst.  I could give position by position example, but no reason to do that to players on either side when all give SO much effort.  Last year's Amherst senior class lost one game at Williams their 1st year.  This senior class is undefeated against them.  Enough said.  Some close games, yes, but wins for The Jeff's.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on January 21, 2012, 12:43:23 AM
It's not just Bowdoin; Southern Maine out of the LEC is notorius for getting home town calls up there too.  Must be something in the water up there/
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: farmboy on January 21, 2012, 01:15:28 AM
Duh Sumfun.   Good coaches that are successful have the recruiting edge.  But for the time I speak I hold fast.  Plus I know a bit of the inside the first couple of years.  Just saying.....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 21, 2012, 08:44:20 AM
If McCormick is out today versus Colby-I like Colby's chances of pulling the upset--not sure that Amherst has the inside game to deal with Vaughn, Mack and Potvin--
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 21, 2012, 11:30:47 AM
Maine 1.....Interesting thought.  My concern is that the team is focused on the game and not be distracted with the shopping at LL Bean nearby...just kidding...applies to the men's team too.
Though I hope that Lem is ok and gets to play a bit, it is noted here that last year's game at Amherst, Lem played only 13 minutes and had no significant impact stat wise on the Amherst win.  It was a game when Colby's best player had 18 points and 10 rebounds and Amherst won by 20 plus points.  It is the defensive aspect of missing Lem that is unknown.  In the Bowdoin game, Meg Robertson picked up 3 quick fouls and became,IMO, tentative and was off her game....Coach G took her out of the game.  I expect Meg can handle Colby's big players today.  Plus J. Renner is playing very well now on the offensive side and her defense is great. Bridget is playing very well now.  Bridget and Meg and Jackie are all front court players that can match up to Colby's players size wise and I believe have more quickness down low.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on January 21, 2012, 03:16:35 PM
Some awful shooting numbers in the Tufts/Conn College game:

Conn College is 5-38 from the floor (13.2) and combined the teams from three are 2-26 (7.7%).  Tufts is 1-17 from 3 by themselves.  Conn college made 2 field goals the entire first half.  Tufts leads 42-17 6:57 to play.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 21, 2012, 03:44:58 PM
Boy or boy....Amherst escapes with a 1....yes one point win at Colby(51-50).  Maine 1 was almost a genius here....I guess I have to give Maine 1 credit.  Amherst goes ahead on a layup by Stedman with 18.5 sec. to go in the game.  Colby cannot get a shot off as time runs out.  Colby guard is surrounded by three Amherst players at the end with arms raised.
Colby's big (Mack) makes 2 or three outside shots.  Colby's smallest player makes outside shots and gets steals and rebounds.  Announcers state that guard Bennett has never played this well. 
Colby goes up by 3 at the half on a last second shot as the half ends.....28-25, Colby.  Amherst ties and goes ahead at the 9 plus minute.  Goes ahead by 5.  Colby fights back and goes ahead by up to 5 with about 4 minutes to go.  Amherst only takes the lead with 1.01 secs to go. Colby and Amherst trade baskets and Amherst goes ahead by one with the time at 18.5 seconds.
Defense won the game for Amherst. Great play by Colby...from the guards and from outside that kept the game close...from unexpected areas.  Amherst got great play from Meg Robinson...blocks, points inside and outside and blocking out Colby's best front court players(18 pts., 9 rbs.)  Bridget had at least 7 rebounds in the first half and played good defense to neutralize another of Colby's big front court players.  Renner took over the third Colby big player.  Stedman and her fellow senior guards counter the fine play of the Colby guards.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on January 21, 2012, 05:09:26 PM
I've really like Caroline Stedman, really has come up with big plays this year in her final seasons.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MVP on January 21, 2012, 06:42:18 PM
Agree w/ amh63 and 7express ... but Colby choked! Colby had the game, had 7 pt lead w/ just over 3 minutes go.
Had 17.5 seconds to get a shot off to win game or draw a foul and didn't. Got to hand it to Amherst.
Colby looked good. At the same time Amherst looks beatable.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 21, 2012, 08:35:06 PM
Colby-Amherst was a fun game to watch--I thought Colby played a great game.  They just did not get a shot off at the end.  I did not think that Amherst was as strong as last year's team (or even the year before)--They definitely missed McCormick's all around play.  Amazingly, they won and really only hit one or two outside shots for the game.  Hope to see a rematch of these two teams down the road.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: farmboy on January 21, 2012, 09:43:12 PM
One more thing of note Sumfun.  Williams came within a whisker of beating Amherst that first year in the second game "at Amherest", and Williams was made up of a great deal of underclassmen.  If you can get a film of that game see if it is as obvious to you as it was to me how the game was lost by a serious set of coaching errors in the final 2-3 minutes....but it was a great game in which people like you said Williams didn't have a chance.

Okay...I will let this go:)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 22, 2012, 12:00:09 AM
Quote from: amh63 on January 21, 2012, 03:44:58 PM
Boy or boy....Amherst escapes with a 1....yes one point win at Colby(51-50).  Maine 1 was almost a genius here....I guess I have to give Maine 1 credit.  Amherst goes ahead on a layup by Stedman with 18.5 sec. to go in the game.  Colby cannot get a shot off as time runs out.  Colby guard is surrounded by three Amherst players at the end with arms raised.
Colby's big (Mack) makes 2 or three outside shots.  Colby's smallest player makes outside shots and gets steals and rebounds.  Announcers state that guard Bennett has never played this well. 
Colby goes up by 3 at the half on a last second shot as the half ends.....28-25, Colby.  Amherst ties and goes ahead at the 9 plus minute.  Goes ahead by 5.  Colby fights back and goes ahead by up to 5 with about 4 minutes to go.  Amherst only takes the lead with 1.01 secs to go. Colby and Amherst trade baskets and Amherst goes ahead by one with the time at 18.5 seconds.
Defense won the game for Amherst. Great play by Colby...from the guards and from outside that kept the game close...from unexpected areas.  Amherst got great play from Meg Robinson...blocks, points inside and outside and blocking out Colby's best front court players(18 pts., 9 rbs.)  Bridget had at least 7 rebounds in the first half and played good defense to neutralize another of Colby's big front court players.  Renner took over the third Colby big player.  Stedman and her fellow senior guards counter the fine play of the Colby guards.

I didn't watch the game, but this sounds like the Colby player froze and really blew it.  Assuming there were 3-4 seconds remaining when the triple-team first occurred, just throw it towards the basket and A) you may get 2 (or even 3) FTs, or B) there are now 4 teammates and only 2 opponents - someone may get the winning basket.  Do NOT let the clock simply expire!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 22, 2012, 06:37:39 AM
Just to clarify on the last shot--I would not say the Colby players froze--there was a play set up-the first option was not available, and when the ball was kicked out,  The amherst defense swarmed the ball--there really was no where for the Colby player to go with the ball (the Amherst players were taller than the Colby player). 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 22, 2012, 12:22:03 PM
Some comments on the weekend play and maybe some dings on comments made.
First, I posted that FY Meg Robertson had 9 rebounds.  It is recorded that she had only 7.  It was Bridget that is listed with 9 rebounds.
Meg who was learning how tough it gets in conference play in the last few games.....rebounded from the Bowdoin game with a huge game against Colby on Sat.....leading the team with 18 points and pulling down 7 boards.  It seems that Meg and Bridget held their own and more against the bigger Colby front line.  It is noted that Coach G was not concerned in such a tight game by bringing in another FY front court player late in the game to give Bridget some rest.
Bottom line on the last play, IMO.  Both coaches had time to prepare for the last 18.5 sec.  The last play shows what has lead this year's Amherst team...defense.  the Amherst defense won the game as Amherst outside game was off and Colby's front court reduced the effectiveness of the Jeff's inside game.
Maine 1......I would not say that this year's team is not as strong as earlier teams.  It is different and still learning.  Loosing 4 players that contributed over 4 years is hard...including two 1000 pt. scorers and the team's leading rebounder.  Last year's team had more depth than the previous year and this year's team is developing into an even deeper team.  With Lem Atanga sitting out the two games this weekend.....the team had to adjust to a younger less experienced front court.  With Lem out, both the outside and inside game suffered.  Oh yes, Lem is a 1000 pt. player.  Also one of the graduating seniors was the Player of the Year and a two time AA.
I'm glad that Farmer decided to let the topic go.  The final judge of teams, players and coaches is on the floor in games played under all sorts of conditions, etc.  This weekend, Amherst played two Maine teams at their place. Both Maine teams played very well.  Amherst players learned that one needs to stay focused....to handle the pressure of a win streak and other things.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 23, 2012, 06:23:09 AM
amh63--just following up on comparing this Amherst team to last few years--I am not sure what you are looking at.  Amherst lost Daignult, an all-American, and Leyman, who was a rock inside. They were able to bring McCormick off the bench.  This team does not have that depth or fire-power.  I thought Crowley was lost on offense on Saturday, and was just not a factor.  It appears that Amherst has not real bench either (look at the minutes played by the starters on Saturday). 
I actually felt that Colby's top seven were better than Amherst
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 23, 2012, 11:22:56 AM
That is what makes this board interesting.  Everyone sees things different and our view doesn't really matter.  If you are correct in your last post....then Colby should sweep the rest of their games by 20 plus points and end up in the conference tournament.  There if the seeds are correct, Amherst will meet Colby again in the title match for a rematch....the better team should prevail.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: lefrakenstein on January 23, 2012, 11:40:08 AM
Quote from: Maine1 on January 23, 2012, 06:23:09 AM
amh63--just following up on comparing this Amherst team to last few years--I am not sure what you are looking at.  Amherst lost Daignult, an all-American, and Leyman, who was a rock inside. They were able to bring McCormick off the bench.  This team does not have that depth or fire-power.  I thought Crowley was lost on offense on Saturday, and was just not a factor.  It appears that Amherst has not real bench either (look at the minutes played by the starters on Saturday). 
I actually felt that Colby's top seven were better than Amherst


It's unusual to say that a team with 3 1,000 point scorers on it doesn't have firepower. It might be fair to say that the team isn't as strong as last year's after the loss of Jaci and Leyman, but I think it has to be conceded that Lem and Robertson have played exceptionally well in the post to help account for their departure.

I think it's crazy to 1) criticize Amherst's bench when Colby's starters played all of 2 fewer minutes in aggregate than Amherst's did, and Amherst was missing a starter, and 2) to say that Colby's top seven is better than Amherst's top seven when Colby's top seven just lost at home to Amherst's top seven (and again, that's without Amherst's best, or second best, player!).

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 24, 2012, 01:24:40 PM
There is a nice preview of the upcoming "non-conference" games between Amherst and Williams on Wednesday at Williamstown on the Amherst website.
Both the WBB and MBB matchups are between ranked teams.  It must be a big thing in the Berkshires since there will be live TV coverage of the games in the western part of the state as well as the now FREE on-line webcasts out of Williams.  Expecting a full-house in the Williams gym.....in part to the local town following and the normal students......maybe the reason for the TV coverages of a D3 game.  Last year, the MBB game at Amherst received national mention on an ESPN show by a Boston writer in attendance.
The info on the TV and on-line coverage are noted in the Amherst preview for those interested.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on January 25, 2012, 08:44:17 PM
Amherst won easily tonight at Williams to remain undefeated.  The loss was only the third for Williams, and to me it highlights the difference in talent between the NESCAC and the other DIII teams up in the Northeast.  Now that the league schedule has started (and I know this one was technically non-conference) it will be interesting to see how everything shakes out in the next few weeks.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 25, 2012, 08:48:02 PM
Seemed huge for Amherst to have Lem Antanga McCormick back, and Ephs didn't have an answer for Stedman's 3's.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 25, 2012, 10:15:11 PM
For other interested  posters, Amherst won by 22...80-58 and it could have been more.  I believe the lead was 25 at the half.  There is a writeup of the game and the boxscore on the Amherst website now.  There will be video highlights on Thursday.  Stedman lead the scoring with all the "starters" contributing...defense, rebounds, etc.  Meg Robertson was huge tonight...starting for Lem.  She had a double-double...16 points and 10 rebounds.  Lem came in and sparked the 2nd half.  With Bridget also having a good solid game, Amherst dominated the boards.  Without Williams big player....ACL injury, Williams will have a tough time in conference play....against Colby's big front court.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on January 26, 2012, 04:53:16 PM
Quote from: NH NESCAC Fan on January 25, 2012, 08:44:17 PM
Amherst won easily tonight at Williams to remain undefeated.  The loss was only the third for Williams, and to me it highlights the difference in talent between the NESCAC and the other DIII teams up in the Northeast.  Now that the league schedule has started (and I know this one was technically non-conference) it will be interesting to see how everything shakes out in the next few weeks.

Only really tough game Amherst has left is @ Tufts, but they should still win that by at least 10.  I don't think Bates, Trinity or Middlebury give them much trouble, and they should win the game in Amherst against Williams by 15+.  They already got through the tough part of their schedule unscathed which I thought was their best chance to slip up (that week with the game vs. Kean and the road trip to Maine).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: LORENZO123 on January 26, 2012, 09:05:29 PM
Au contraire, mon ami. There is always Babson.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on January 26, 2012, 10:22:02 PM
Unless I'm missing something on Amherst's schedule...they don't play Babson.  Yup, just double checked, no Babson on Amherst's schedule and no Amherst on Babson's schedule. 

Wait, unless your comment is in response to my earlier post.  If so, I'm not saying that there aren't other good teams in the Northeast besides NESCAC schools, and clearly Babson is a good one, but it seems the NESCAC dominates outside conference.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: LORENZO123 on January 27, 2012, 02:29:41 PM
Actually, I was responding to 7express, a frequent and informative poster. I thought it would be obvious that I was responding to his post and that I was referring to the possibility of a fourth consecutive matchup of Amherst and Babson in post "conference" season play. Evidently not, but now you know. NESCAC teams' success outside their conference is a fact.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on January 27, 2012, 02:51:35 PM
Got it.  I was thrown because 7express's post was about the regular season schedule.  Clearly they will face tougher competition in the post season, including Babson.  Although at least going by the results, Amherst hasn't had too much trouble the past three years with Babson (avg margin of victory = 19 points).  Of course, every year is different.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: LORENZO123 on January 27, 2012, 02:54:09 PM
Agreed, "any given night" but a fan has to be optimistic!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 27, 2012, 03:22:11 PM
For those interested, there are short videos of the Amherst MBB and WBB games at Williams on the Amherst websites.  The highlights are of course edited to show off Amherst, but it does give a little of the atmosphere of the game.
NHNESCACFan....good answers to the Babson posters.  It happens every year that Babson with their big front line brings high hopes and raises challenges to Amherst. IMO, unless Babson has gotten quicker and gotten a better supporting cast to the three Big's this year, the results of a Babson vs. Amherst game will be the same as in past years.
Plan to be up for the Williams and Midd. games on the 10 and 11 of Feb.  My offer for dinner or Lunch before the WBB games is still open.  Let me know.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on January 27, 2012, 04:41:50 PM
Amh63, I posted this on the LEC board as well, but I'll copy it here as well because you'll probably check this before that one:


I'm probably gonna go up there for the Williams games on the 10th.  I know the men's crowd draws well, but does the women's game bring in a good crowd as well??  Probably will influence what time I leave Connecticut that night.
Just for the record, never been to an Amherst vs. Williams sporting even before, so sorry for the stupid question, and this date fits my schedule perfectly and really don't want to miss it.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 27, 2012, 05:08:16 PM
7Express...a bit of post tag....check my post on the LEC MBB board..I believe.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 28, 2012, 10:42:54 AM
Colby at Bowdoin today is a huge game in terms of the conference standings. The winner will have the inside track for the three seed in the conference.  Williams is fading without there big player, and I would expect the Conn College bubble to burst next week when they make the road trip to Bowdoin and Colby. 
Strange NESCAC weekend with no Friday night games
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on January 28, 2012, 10:52:56 AM
amh63...you'll be interested because she is from your neck of the woods...it happened again.  Sally Marx blew out her knee in practice the other day...the other knee.  Poor kid.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 28, 2012, 12:17:48 PM
NHNescacFan....Thank you for the sad news.  Sally brings a great deal of energy when she enters the game.  Have met her and her family in D.C. and at Amherst.  Spoke with her before the Hamilton game....about whether her braces were off.  Her delay in returning to full strength was extended a bit due to a concussion.  Her father mentioned that she had never suffered an ACL injury before and it has had an impact on her play a bit.  She was "recruited" for her quickness, speed, outside shot and all the talents for a lead guard.  I'm sure she is counted on to back up Jasmine and Marci next year and to take the lead in the future.  Here is hoping for a good/fast recovery and a return to form next Fall.  Should say the same for the Williams player that tore her knee/leg early in the Conn. game.  Key injuries will age coaches.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 28, 2012, 05:03:24 PM
For the record.....Amherst beat Trinity this afternoon in Hartford, 66-44.  Went on a 16-1 run and never looked back.  Lead by the seniors, Amherst was never challenged.  The box score and the writeup of the game are now on the Amherst website.  Amherst now looks forward to meeting Wes. in Middletown...hoping to continue their conference win streak....forgot, but it doesn't really matter.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 30, 2012, 11:49:14 AM
New week....fresh thoughts...I hope.
Interesting discussions on Sunday's D3hoops...Hoopsville broadcast.  Host put on and wore the Amherst BB t-shirt received from WBB team?   Introduced the new commentator for the Northeast,,,Mathew Noonan of Noontime sports...based in Boston.  Comments on the conference BB games/teams  and other conferences.  Also talked about Babson, Smith, and Tufts...mainly about Amherst games last week.  Tufts was mentioned as the team to watch out for.  Amherst plays Wes., Bates and Tufts all this week in away games.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 31, 2012, 07:46:23 AM
Tufts has been playing solid basketball.  They have good wins against Williams and Colby-only losses are two in the season opener, and a last second loss to Bowdoin.  They have an outstanding freshman post player and are disciplined.  They will give Amherst a battle at their home gym.

Weslelyan has been improving, and will be interesting to see how they fair against Amherst.  Bowdoin and Colby make the Williams/ Middlebury trip this week.  Williams is always tough at their gym, but I would expect both Bowdoin and Colby to each win their games this weekend.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on January 31, 2012, 03:03:47 PM
RIC vs. Tufts should be a good one tonight.

RIC hasn't been challenged at all for the most part in the LEC, and their OOC schedule was pretty bad.  Tufts will probably be the best team they would have played to date.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 31, 2012, 10:03:43 PM
Wesleyan did seem to be much improved over last year, and Amherst came out cold in the first 10 minutes.  1 for 17 from the floor.  Ouch, but good teams find a way to climb out of a hole and win even on an off night.  As an Amherst fan, I know they can find the focus like late in the season last year that propelled them to the Final Four and beyond.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 31, 2012, 10:05:40 PM
Amherst overcomes a slow start and beats Wes....69-48 in Middletown.  The win does not count in the conference standing...but does count in the "Little Three" honors.  Amherst won the one that counts in conf. standings at home earlier.  Now Amherst looks ahead to Bates and Tufts this weekend.  Amherst is now 20-0.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on February 01, 2012, 08:59:40 AM
Slow start, indeed.  Eleven minutes in Amherst had scored 4 points.  I think the starters were a combined 1 for 17 and 1 for 2 from the line.  It wasn't until the coach subbed in Marcia Voigt that the team actually (well Marcia really) started to score.  Marcia was the NESCAC rookie of the year after her first year but has struggled mightily since then, shooting horrifically...until last night.  She picked a great night to perhaps break out of her two season funk.  She was perfect from the field and the line in the first half, finishing with 13 of Amherst's 27 first half points.  Oddly, she started the second half on the bench. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on February 01, 2012, 10:44:37 AM
Quote from: NH NESCAC Fan on February 01, 2012, 08:59:40 AM
Slow start, indeed.  Eleven minutes in Amherst had scored 4 points.  I think the starters were a combined 1 for 17 and 1 for 2 from the line.  It wasn't until the coach subbed in Marcia Voigt that the team actually (well Marcia really) started to score.  Marcia was the NESCAC rookie of the year after her first year but has struggled mightily since then, shooting horrifically...until last night.  She picked a great night to perhaps break out of her two season funk.  She was perfect from the field and the line in the first half, finishing with 13 of Amherst's 27 first half points.  Oddly, she started the second half on the bench. 

Sounds like Voigt had a great night indeed.  However if she's had a tough time for two years, and given Amherst's huge success over those two years, I don't think you risk team dynamics and chemistry by benching a starter just because Voigt had a nice half.....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 01, 2012, 10:55:30 AM
NHNESCACFAN.....Nice post about the game and Marcia.  Marcia has all the talent to start but IMO she has tried too hard to find her role on the team and it has affected her play.  Many people forgot she was the conference ROY....but there are other talented players ahead of her.  I see her as a replacement for Kim F. next year when she starts....an all around player.  Marcia is not a true point guard and she is not a reliable outside shooter...yet.  She is athletic and strong and has a great inside-short jump shot.  Her defense has greatly improved but she is not a shut down defensive player as Kim...yet.  I believe Coach G. will bring her in for more floor time in the important games ahead....just as he will bring in Jasmine more.  Next year's starting guards need more tough game experiences.  Turnovers will also determine floor time.  Can the bench players produce under pressure and in tight spots...while spelling the starters during the game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 02, 2012, 02:37:11 PM
Nice story on the Amherst athletics website on the selection of Caroline Stedman of the WBB team's selection on the Capitol One NorthEast All-Academic 1st-team...making her an candidate for Academic All-American.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 03, 2012, 12:15:31 PM
Critical games ahead this weekend.
During my scanning the U-tube section on the Amherst website, there appeared a video produced by the Tufts Daily paper dealing with the BIG game on Saturday..the WBB game on campus.  It was a pro Jumbo production with comments by several players and the coach.  What bother me a little is that both the coach and one player stated that several games between Amherst and Tufts the last couple of years were close and couldn't have been over 10 points combined.  Really.  I can understand the player's impression...but the wise UCONN great player who is the Tufts WBB coach?  Three years ago at Amherst it was 6 points difference.  Two years ago at Tufts it was 6 points difference.  Last year at Amherst it was 30 points difference.  Expect a tight game in Melford...but the reporter should check the facts.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 03, 2012, 02:13:48 PM
I was at that game @ Amherst last year.  Think it would've been closer if Colleen Hart played in that game (she was out) like she was in the other 2, but Amherst was clearly better and would've won regardless more than likely.  They should win this as well, and I'll say between 10 to 15, my opinion closer to 10 than 15.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 03, 2012, 07:55:44 PM
Amherst beats Bates in Maine 75-63.  Amherst led by 9 at the half as Bates fought back in the first half.  In the second half, Amherst steadily built its lead to over 20 but couldn't get any higher as both sides made changes to the line-up.....it was warm in the gym.  Aided by fouls, Bates started to reduce the lead.  Coach G. had to put his starters back in as the calls started to go against Amherst.  Bates cut the lead to 9 and it stood around 10 or more.  Amherst was only making one of two foul shots and the game ended with everyone drained out.  The strange Maine calls started to show up in the last two minutes.....Senior point guard Finucane is called for a double dribble and then a walking call as she driving into the lane.  Both calls are rare for the her over 4 years!  Still they are made and the ball goes over to Bates.  Oh well, Maine teams are tough to beat in Maine.  Amherst will take the win and the score....considering the other two games in Maine.  One more road game on Sat.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Hoop Guy on February 03, 2012, 08:26:51 PM
Bold Prediction----Tufts beats Amherst tomorrow afternoon.....They seem on the verge, they are not blowing teams out, Tufts is hungry....they win
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 03, 2012, 08:43:09 PM
The heat in the Bates gym is notoriously unbearable.  Good win on the road, with good experience for many players.  Tufts will be tough tomorrow.  Sure do wish student announcers would take a few minutes to check with an assistant coach on how to pronounce the names.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 03, 2012, 11:48:04 PM
Or get a prununciation guide.  One or the other.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 04, 2012, 03:48:08 PM
Well the battle for the top spot in the conference is over.  Amherst beats Tufts 48-31 in a somewhat defensive battle.  Tufts scores the first 2 and Amherst goes on a 22-0 run and it took a while before Tufts scored 6 points.  Amherst's offense was good, though Stedman and the other starters seem to be having a tough time finding their shots.  It was a physical game and the refs according to the announcers were letting them play.  Only Lem Atanga was having her way in the post.  Amherst led by only 15 at the half...30-15, I believe.  The second half was even more of a problem.  Both teams seem to be missing their offense.  By the middle of the 2nd half, both teams could not score 10 points between them.  Marcia was brought in and she did again bring some spark.  Coach G seemed to let the "starters" stay on the floor to see if they could figure it out.  Meg Robertson and Marcia were the only subs until the last few minutes when Bridget and Jasmine entered.  Could it be that Coach G. didn't want to run up the score against the shorter Tufts bench on Tufts' senior night?  Boxscore will show how bad it was....Tufts shooting under 20% and both sides not able to hit from outside.
Next two conference games are at home against Williams and Midd.  Key to getting the right to host the tournament.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 05, 2012, 06:56:50 AM
  Looks like the top two spots in the NESCAC are set, with Amherst and Tufts.  Five teams are battling for the three and four, with four of those teams all facing off next weekend, as Wesleyan and Conn College visit Bowdoin and Colby.  If the Maine teams can sweep the weekend, then most likely Bowdoin will finish as the number three team, based on its win over Colby, and Colby will be number four. It will be a great weekend in Maine, and we will see how far Conn College and Wesleyan have come.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescachoopsfan2 on February 05, 2012, 09:16:15 AM
Quote from: amh63 on February 03, 2012, 12:15:31 PM
Critical games ahead this weekend.
During my scanning the U-tube section on the Amherst website, there appeared a video produced by the Tufts Daily paper dealing with the BIG game on Saturday..the WBB game on campus.  It was a pro Jumbo production with comments by several players and the coach.  What bother me a little is that both the coach and one player stated that several games between Amherst and Tufts the last couple of years were close and couldn't have been over 10 points combined.  Really.  I can understand the player's impression...but the wise UCONN great player who is the Tufts WBB coach?  Three years ago at Amherst it was 6 points difference.  Two years ago at Tufts it was 6 points difference.  Last year at Amherst it was 30 points difference.  Expect a tight game in Melford...but the reporter should check the facts.

Went back to find the video you're referring to, and just FYI - it was made in 2010. And up to that point - as the coach, players, and reporter correctly alluded - all four Tufts-Amherst games of the Gromacki era had been close:
07-08: Amherst by a buzzer beater in the regular season + Amherst by 6 in the NESCAC title game
08-09: Amherst by 6 in the regular season + Amherst by 3 in the NESCAC semifinals

So that's four Amherst victories by 17 points total. Not sure which "facts need to be checked." Also, don't really see how the video was a "pro-Jumbo production." It simply stated the implications of the game from a NESCAC and national perspective and talked about what the rivalry had meant to the Tufts players - an extremely relevant topic for the Tufts student newspaper to cover.

Not that any of this has anything to do with this season. Just felt the need to stand up for the student journalists who do good and thankless work promoting the NESCAC/Div. III athletics.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 05, 2012, 12:02:09 PM
nescachoopsfan2.....Thanks for the clarification and the time date.  I actually went to the Tufts Daily website to look for it again after my post and hit multimedia button and found the video...it was the only one on the "coming game".  It seemed appropriate..being a home game and the top two conference teams...standing wise...and could determine the host of the tourney, etc. The first time I saw it, it was on the Amherst U-tube area. When I found it again, I did not glance at the time date seen on the video...focusing on the reporter to verify it was the correct one.
Oh well....my mistake.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 06, 2012, 09:13:42 AM
Up early after the Superbowl.   Regional rankings of teams are this week...by the NCAA.  The key D3hoops website writers make known their thinking on teams and players at this time/point of the season.  It is in the lead story today.  One surprising possible pick for POY at this time is Megan Robertson of Amherst.  If the Amherst team plays well for the rest of the season and repeat as national champs..it might be an interesting story.  Right now, two key games this weekend....especially senior day game on Sat.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on February 06, 2012, 10:23:05 AM
Quote from: amh63 on February 06, 2012, 09:13:42 AM
Up early after the Superbowl.   Regional rankings of teams are this week...by the NCAA.  The key D3hoops website writers make known their thinking on teams and players at this time/point of the season.  It is in the lead story today.  One surprising possible pick for POY at this time is Megan Robertson of Amherst.  If the Amherst team plays well for the rest of the season and repeat as national champs..it might be an interesting story.  Right now, two key games this weekend....especially senior day game on Sat.

Interesting to say the least.  Robertson is having a very nice season no doubt, but mention of her as a POY candidate stretches all credibility in my opinion.  I think there are at least two stronger candidates on her own team, much less a bunch of really incredible and accomplished POY candidates on other teams.  Just as one example if you've seen Verkaik from Calvin play, there is a big step up.  Robertson has a fine future and should surely be in rookie of the year discussions, but POY mention seems ridiculous to me.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on February 06, 2012, 01:54:18 PM
Player of the year is a fun debate. 

My personal working definition is "The national Player of the Year is the athlete who, by her talent and performance, elevates her team to a high level that it could not accomplish without her." 

That player might take a very good team and make them a national title concenter, like Meia Daniels (Howard Payne) and Carrie Snikkers (Hope) did.  Without those players, Howard Payne and Hope would've been among the 10-15 best teams in the country.  With those players, the Yellow Jackets and Flying Dutch were elite.

Other players take their team from being solid (NCAA first or 2nd round) to making the Final Four. Chelsie Schweers did that for Christopher Newport. Without her, the Captains are probably done on the first weekend of the tournament. With her, they were a Final Four team. Hillary Klimowicz took an okay TCNJ team and carried them to the Final Four.  Players and coaches emphasize team efforts, as they should, but the Player of the Year is, by my definition, the cornerstone of their team's success.

Off the top of my head, I can only think of a few players who meet that criteria this year. Verkaik at Calvin is one. Munger at George Fox is another. Stedman at Amherst might be a third, but we won't know that until Amherst plays more games where they need her excellence to win (like the Colby-Bowdoin weekend).

Maybe Chicago has a player like that. I haven't seen enough of them to say.

Other teams have very good players, but their team would still be capable of success without them.  That's how I see Robertson.   That's also how I see Babson's top three players.  Would the Beavers be incapable of winning the NEWMAC and making the second weekend of the tournament without any one of those players?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 06, 2012, 02:05:38 PM
Quote from: gordonmann on February 06, 2012, 01:54:18 PM
Player of the year is a fun debate. 

My personal working definition is "The national Player of the Year is the athlete who, by her talent and performance, elevates her team to a high level that it could not accomplish without her." 

That player might take a very good team and make them a national title concenter, like Meia Daniels (Howard Payne) and Carrie Snikkers (Hope) did.  Without those players, Howard Payne and Hope would've been among the 10-15 best teams in the country.  With those players, the Yellow Jackets and Flying Dutch were elite.

Other players take their team from being solid (NCAA first or 2nd round) to making the Final Four. Chelsie Schweers did that for Christopher Newport. Without her, the Captains are probably done on the first weekend of the tournament. With her, they were a Final Four team. Hillary Klimowicz took an okay TCNJ team and carried them to the Final Four.  Players and coaches emphasize team efforts, as they should, but the Player of the Year is, by my definition, the cornerstone of their team's success.

Off the top of my head, I can only think of a few players who meet that criteria this year. Verkaik at Calvin is one. Munger at George Fox is another. Stedman at Amherst might be a third, but we won't know that until Amherst plays more games where they need her excellence to win (like the Colby-Bowdoin weekend).

And since Gordon named all three of those in his post, it didn't leave much for Dave or me to say.

In Gordon's defense, though, it wasn't clear Dave and I were going to have time to participate. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on February 06, 2012, 02:19:52 PM
All very good points and much more eloquently said than my post.  Again, I meant no disrespect to Robertson at all.  I agree with Gordon's definition and in that vein, I believe there are quite a few players more critical to the success of their team than Robertson is to Amherst, including Stedman and probably Atanga-McCormick.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on February 06, 2012, 02:49:20 PM
QuoteAnd since Gordon named all three of those in his post, it didn't leave much for Dave or me to say.

Ha. Yeah, sorry. I tried to avoid the "on one hand" answers since it takes up all the good answers. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 06, 2012, 02:57:08 PM
I was just trying to give a different point of view. There were many to chose from and in my longer version of answer I did mention Stedman, but in the efforts to trim and not repeat Gordon's exact comments, I chose eliminate that line.

Again, just wanted to shine a light on a player that has certainly made a big impact in just her freshman year and to provide a different take on the question... nothing more.

I certainly don't expect people to agree with what I write, I am just looking to give perspective... and we all tried not to repeat each other (though, on one I just couldn't avoid it).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on February 06, 2012, 03:31:21 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 06, 2012, 02:57:08 PM
I was just trying to give a different point of view. There were many to chose from and in my longer version of answer I did mention Stedman, but in the efforts to trim and not repeat Gordon's exact comments, I chose eliminate that line.

Again, just wanted to shine a light on a player that has certainly made a big impact in just her freshman year and to provide a different take on the question... nothing more.

I certainly don't expect people to agree with what I write, I am just looking to give perspective... and we all tried not to repeat each other (though, on one I just couldn't avoid it).

Dave, I understand and appreciate your thinking and didn't intend to sound too argumentative.  Differing points of view and good back and forth discussion is what these boards are all about.  In any case Robertson deserves some attention and accolades for playing a significant role on a very talented and experienced team.  Quite an accomplishment for a freshman.

For what its worth, I mentioned Verkaik because I recently had a chance to see her play for the first time.  Quite a presence... agile 6'2" with strong low post moves with deft touch either hand, keeps and shoots the ball very high making her extremely difficult to block, very accurate mid range shot facing the basket, and will even hit the 3 if her defender lays off.  Strong rebounder and even better shot blocker.  As good as she is she's very willowy, while she plays stronger than she looks if she adds a few pounds of muscle she'll be an absolute terror next year...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on February 06, 2012, 04:26:49 PM
Roundball:

That's a dead on scouting report on Verkaik.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 06, 2012, 05:03:49 PM
This possible POY debate is great.  Like the out of the box thinking by Dave and Gordon's definition of POY.  Decided to join in a bit...in a sort of partisan way.
The Amherst team "struggle" a bit in their Maine trip to play Bowdoin and Colby.  The Maine teams are tough in Maine and it was the start of a stretch of away games for Amherst.  Background....Amherst had just beaten Kean in an somewhat emotional game at home.  Lem Atanaga was most dominate in the first half.  Lem was injured late in the first half and was taken out of the game and did not return.  She  got hit in the forehead by an elbow, etc.  Amherst went on to dominate and beat Kean.
In both Maine games, Lem did not play.  Five seniors start for Amherst and they play well with each other....each picking up their game when/where it is needed.  Amherst beat Bowdoin by only 3.  Stedman scored well with 14...but it was Jackie Renner who stepped up in that game by scoring 12 points and pulling down 10 boards....both a step up from her normal contributions.  Meg Robertson did not contribute much.  She was "schooled" by the experienced Bowdoin front line.  It was Renner and Bridget Crowley (9 pts., 5 rebounds) that helped Amherst win the battle of the boards and also the game, IMO.  Jackie is 6' and Bridget is 6'1" and their heights and skills were needed.  The team was adjusting a bit to having a missing starter out....as well as the play of Bowdoin players.
In the Colby game the next day...Amherst was facing a tall and talented Colby front line....with a experienced 6'3" player and a 6'1 or 2" Mack that can shoot the 3's.  Amherst won the game by only 1!  Stedman played well and her points were critical.  Bridget came in again and helped get critical boards (9 boards).  Bridget is athletic but is not always effective against bulkier players.  Meg Robertson was the key in this game.  She was the top scorer for Amherst with 18 points and had 7 boards and 2 blocks!  She played well against the more experienced and bigger Colby front line....she learned her lesson and adjusted.  Meg is listed at 6'2"...though a Williams announcer thought she was much taller..maybe because she was playing much bigger against them.
Amherst is a talented team and Meg and Bridget and recently the play of Marcia, Jasmine and others are making it a TEAM of great depth.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 07, 2012, 07:02:26 PM
NHNESCACFan......FYI.....I got info from a sighter that our Amherst man with the custom BB jacket  was seen at the Bates game.  He travels well.  Hope to see him at the games in Amherst this weekend...and say hello, etc.  Will you make it down at any time to watch live?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on February 07, 2012, 08:53:31 PM
Unfortunately, no.  I am in the midst of tax season.  Not much time for traveling.  I am guessing that Jasmine's parents will be at one, if not both games.  Their names are Greg and Judy.  Greg has been reading these posts...say hello if you can figure out who they are.  Have fun.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 09, 2012, 06:06:27 AM
First regional rankings are interesting.  Bowdoin, with wins over Colby and Tufts, is not rated.  Conn College is rated (eight) above Colby.  We will see if Conn College is for real this weekend.  I have seen them play once this year, I don't believe they can play with either Bowdoin or Colby.  Babson ranking is pretty high. Babson is an interesting team.  They have a great record in a very weak conference.  They have a big out of conference game against Colby next week.  Some very interesting basketball coming up.  As it has been for the last few seasons, the road to the final four will go through Amherst
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 09, 2012, 11:30:39 AM
Maine1.....This weekend games and the conf. tourney will impact the next two regional rankings.  One of your Maine teams may get a bid to the post season.....though I was surprised by Colby's last lost.  Babson's coach was very careful in her discussion of her team on D3hoopsville...but did mention the win over Tufts.  Babson's team is built around the big frontcourt which IMO is kept in the games to much in wins....not allowing depth to develop.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 11, 2012, 09:00:21 PM
Conn College and Wesleyan could not handle the Maine teams this weekend.  Appears that Colby really blew Wesleyan out of the gym in the first half.  I would expect the top four teams to advance to the NESCAC semifinals at Amherst.  I don't see Conn College beating Bowdoin at Bowdoin, and I don't think Williams has enough to stop Colby.  Conn College has definitely improved and could be building something.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 12, 2012, 03:31:15 AM
NESCAC playoffs which start next Saturday:

#8 Trinity @ #1 Amherst
#7 Conn College @ #2 Tufts
#6 Wesleyan @ #3 Bowdoin
#5 Williams @ #4 Colby.

This is definitely Amherst's to lose, but Colby could give them some trouble in the semifinals and likewise Tufts/Bowdoin as well in the finals.  All 4 home teams should advance.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Hoop Guy on February 12, 2012, 11:07:09 AM
7Express, I appreciate your postings on these boards, but I find it hard to believe you think Colby or Bowdoin will give Amherst trouble in Amherst.  I agree they have seemed a bit vulnerable this year, and this is only relatively speaking given they are undefeated, but those small instances have been on the road.  Colby should have had them in Waterville and could not get a shot off in 18 seconds. Tufts got the doors blown off last week in Medford.  Bowdoin seems to be a step down this year.  I just do not see a chance of them losing at home.  Now Round 1 NCAA may be a different story, as they will have to play on the road for the first time on the Gromacki era I believe. Depending on the pod, that could be interesting.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 12, 2012, 01:30:36 PM
I do believe Colby can give Amherst a run, assuming Colby can get by Williams, which will not be an easy task.  Colby had Amherst beat in Waterville.  However, Amherst played without McCormick, and that will be a big difference if they play again.  I would expect Amherst to be playing at home as long as they are alive in the NCAA.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BBstudent on February 12, 2012, 01:47:17 PM
1) -To NE Hoop Guy I think the first year of the Gromacki era they started NCAA play at Bridgewater State against Becker (and then barely won the next game when Bowdoin missed a last second shot from less than eight feet away).
2) I agree that in theory Amherst should do better at home than on the road against teams such as Colby and Bowdoin, but in watching this year's games Amherst's MO is to get a big first half lead and then usually play even for the second half; of course that is aside from those games when Amherst starts slow and then blows the other team out in the second half (which I think covers most of the possibilities). My real point is that they seem to have had trouble concentrating for 40 minutes and when they are playing with a big lead they seem to revert to being nice, polite girls unable to stamp their opponents into the ground. I would point to their foul shooting as additional evidence of this, as I think foul shooting is a matter of concentration. All the girls have made thousands of foul shots and have the mechanics down perfect, which leaves focus as the reason they have left so many points at the line this year.
Finally, while I personally worry about the players' ability to focus for 40 minutes (or heaven forbid 45 or 50) I, along with all Amherst fans, have faith that Coach Gromacki will find a way to impress on the players the mindset needed to win the game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 12, 2012, 06:08:39 PM
Sorry about not posting on the games this weekend.  Did not use the college's computers and still was recovering from two last second MBB wins against Williams and Midd.  The write ups of the games are posted on the Amherst website and here is hoping there will be video of both women games as there was an camera person interviewing several players after the Midd. game.
My neglect is in part because the Amherst team was most efficient in basically overpowering both Williams and Midd.  Williams is not the same team after losing their star center to injury and there was never any question about who was in control.  With the strong play of Marcia Voigt and the now dominant play of Meg Robertson, I have no worries about any rematch with the Maine teams or Tufts on any court.  In the Midd. game, Coach G put in a number of players to evaluate the play of particular combinations...with Bridget and Meg both on the floor together.  Senior day came and went and pressure to go undefeated in conf. for two seasons and beat Bowdoin's win records, etc. are done deeds.  Coach G. will have the team with the senior leadership in focus to go forward to reach their goals.  The team is deep enough that I believe there will not be any more close games for awhile.  I spoke with Sumfun during the game with Midd.  I stated that the team on the floor at the time was a preview of next year's starters.....after six seniors and 5 starters have graduated.
Some BB fans/friends watching put it simply...the two teams on the floor playing against Amherst this weekend were "not on the same page" with Amherst.  These former MBB players were amazed at the skill level of the Amherst players and tried to avoid any negative comments  about their opponents level of play.....being elder gentlemen...and maybe not sure who was sitting behind us.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 13, 2012, 04:27:52 PM
FY Meg Robertson was selected again as the Player of the week in the conf.  She is positioned well to be the ROY in the conference and some speculate that she maybe the best center.  She would have to beat out teammate Lem, IMO.....but both play limited time so as to give more time to other teammates in often blow out games such as happened this weekend. I wonder if the POY be deferred to pick the Amherst team as the Team of the Year....individual stats are not as important as team wins at Amherst.  Many of the starters stats are not as high as others on other teams at a given position....due to less time on the floor in often blow out games.  If Amherst continues to win and heads to another Final Four, etc......I believe individual stats are not important to the starters/seniors, etc.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on February 13, 2012, 05:20:44 PM
Quote from: amh63 on February 13, 2012, 04:27:52 PM
FY Meg Robertson was selected again as the Player of the week in the conf.  She is positioned well to be the ROY in the conference and some speculate that she maybe the best center.  She would have to beat out teammate Lem, IMO.....but both play limited time so as to give more time to other teammates in often blow out games such as happened this weekend. I wonder if the POY be deferred to pick the Amherst team as the Team of the Year....individual stats are not as important as team wins at Amherst.  Many of the starters stats are not as high as others on other teams at a given position....due to less time on the floor in often blow out games.  If Amherst continues to win and heads to another Final Four, etc......I believe individual stats are not important to the starters/seniors, etc.

You're absolutely right, though the team focus, limited minutes for starters and resulting modest stats are not unique to Amherst.  Hope is one of the teams I follow and during the 2009-2011 years when she was a 3-time first team All-American, Carrie Snikkers never averaged more than 21 minutes per game, 15 ppg, or 8 rpg in any of those seasons.  Very nice but not huge numbers, and Hope was 87-7 during that span.  I'm sure there are many other examples.  Perhaps it makes it a bit more of a challenge to make selections for individual accolades, but I think for the most part the voters do a good job of seeing through the numbers to make selections based on more than individual stats.  Look at Stedman; her per-game numbers last year were modest but if I'm not mistaken she was selected as a pre-season first-teamer.  Her numbers are up a bit this year, but mainly in line with an increase in playing time from 23 minutes to 28 minutes per game.  In any case, she is a deserving All-American in my opinion and the voters demonstrated they can look beyond the numbers and see the skill of the player and the importance to the team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Hoop Guy on February 13, 2012, 06:28:20 PM
I also agree what the player does for the team is the most important thing going.  I do think it is naive however to think that players with lesser stats but offering a vital team contribution are regularly considered for All American.  The woman at Hope  a couple of years ago and now Stedman at Amherst are big contributors on very very high profile teams.  In that instance the voters can differentiate and appreciate and they will get the recognition.  Beyond maybe two or three teams that kind of recognition does not happen in D3, it is too big and too many players.  Voters seem to vote the stats, and in almost most instances that translates to points.  I am not sure that it is anyone's fault, but when it comes to getting individual high honors for being a big team contributor it really is not accurate beyond the very top tier.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on February 13, 2012, 06:53:36 PM
Quote from: NE Hoop Guy on February 13, 2012, 06:28:20 PM
I also agree what the player does for the team is the most important thing going.  I do think it is naive however to think that players with lesser stats but offering a vital team contribution are regularly considered for All American.  The woman at Hope  a couple of years ago and now Stedman at Amherst are big contributors on very very high profile teams.  In that instance the voters can differentiate and appreciate and they will get the recognition.  Beyond maybe two or three teams that kind of recognition does not happen in D3, it is too big and too many players.  Voters seem to vote the stats, and in almost most instances that translates to points.  I am not sure that it is anyone's fault, but when it comes to getting individual high honors for being a big team contributor it really is not accurate beyond the very top tier.

Of course players on high profile teams (read: very successful) have an extra opportunity to be noticed.  In my view, that is deserved.  If you can still be noticed as an individual standout even though you are a member of a team that has success at the national level - so by definition has a bunch of very strong players - then you probably deserve it.  But I might also argue that if you are an All-American caliber player on a lesser team, then you serve your team best by piling up some impressive stats rather than deferring so frequently to your teammates.  Of course it's not so clear cut but the idea is that great players can have modest stats on a great team, or they should have great stats on a modest team.  If they have modest stats on a team with modest success, there would have to be something highly unusual to warrant AA consideration.  So yeah, stats count especially for players NOT on top tier teams.  Just my opinion.  I might be naive.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 13, 2012, 06:57:07 PM
Just a slight correction on Roundball999's earlier post.  I was a tremendous admirer of Carrie Snikkers (I was really, really hoping for a match-up of her and the other AA CS, Christina Solari of IWU, but, alas, one or both kept losing before their Final Four showdown), but she was NOT a three time first-team AA.  In 2010, she was first-team (and national POY), but she was 'only' fourth-team in both 2009 and 2011 (in 2009, Solari was 3rd team; in 2011, arch-rival Carissa Verkaik of Calvin was 1st team).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on February 13, 2012, 07:16:00 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 13, 2012, 06:57:07 PM
Just a slight correction on Roundball999's earlier post.  I was a tremendous admirer of Carrie Snikkers (I was really, really hoping for a match-up of her and the other AA CS, Christina Solari of IWU, but, alas, one or both kept losing before their Final Four showdown), but she was NOT a three time first-team AA.  In 2010, she was first-team (and national POY), but she was 'only' fourth-team in both 2009 and 2011 (in 2009, Solari was 3rd team; in 2011, arch-rival Carissa Verkaik of Calvin was 1st team).

My apologies, I made my statement after looking it up on Hope's web site.  They are obviously referring to the WBCA Coaches' All American Team, which just picks ten players and doesn't distinguish a first and second team, Snikkers was on that team in those 3 years.  You obviously are referencing the team picked by D3hoops.com, thanks for the clarification. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 16, 2012, 05:07:50 PM
Went to the Regional Rankings of the NCAA...2nd of 3.  As expected, Amherst #1, RIC#3...etc.  What I did not expect is the Un. of New England at #2.  Need some help here.  Does any one on this board know anything about the school, team, etc.?  Hope to get some info on the website.   Do not even know what conference the school plays in.....Maine?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 16, 2012, 05:25:45 PM
Got my answer in part.....Maine school is a member of the TCCC conference.  Lost early in the season to Williams and Bowdoin and beat Colby in OT and Bates by one point.  Other than the NECAC schools, do not see NEWMAC or LEC schools.  Salve Regina is on the schedule.
Oh well, IMO, the region is one of extreme....Amherst at the top and an "unknown" school who is not well known outside of Maine in the 2nd position.  They seemed to have jumped three spots since the first rankings.  Welcome other opinions on this board.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 16, 2012, 05:41:44 PM
UNE is in the commonwealth Coast conference, which is not a very strong conference.  They have a solid team.  The win over Colby was at Colby. They have historically been a very solid, scrappy, hard nosed team. They will give anyone they play a battle. They don't have a lot of size, but are well coached, and fight hard.  Surprised to see them at number two--but then, hard to say who should be number two, given all of the losses among the top teams.  Maybe you could argue Tufts as number two.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Hoop Guy on February 16, 2012, 11:27:26 PM
Obviously debate is being invited here, for the purpose of people being able to throw darts.  Clearly Babson is number 2, but no one is going to admit that and in fact will find all sorts of reasons to suggest otherwise.  First they will say it is the conference, well yes NEWMAC is a bit weak but much better than TCCC, by a long shot.   So conference issues impact Babson, but not UNE. Then the OOC schedules, well Babson is 2-1 versus the NESCAC, which in the past has been a litmus test, but probably not this year since they pass.  Babson has proven they deserve it and can compete at a high level, they have made the Elite 8 two straight years, the only team to do it two years in a row winning every game on the road, and they have the same team nucleus as those two years.  So it is is not like they are untested or unproven outside their conference.   But some will then say they had an easy route to the NCAA's elite 8.  Remember the litmus test, each NCAA trip featured the defeat of the #2 NESCAC team, one of them (Colby) in their own gym, in overtime, with Maine refs.  Quite an accomplishment.  This year they beat the #2 NESCAC team in the regular season on a NESCAC floor.  So clearly Babson is #2 in the region, but it is just as clear no one will ever recognize it.  Not quite sure why because they have passed the highly valued NESCAC litmus test quite convincingly each year, they went to the National Quarterfinals twice in a row, no one else in the northeast (save obviously Amherst) has went at all.  Yet somehow the NCAA likes to bury them, and they have done it again.  But lets face it, being honest based on results and experience we all know who is number 2, there really is no doubt.  And unless the NCAA puts a fork in them by pairing them with Amherst on opening weekend, the chances for similar results this year are very good.  They are a lot like the Patriots, mentally tough, not too respected, but ultimately successful at the highest levels.  So lets talk about who is number 3.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: LORENZO123 on February 17, 2012, 12:05:34 AM
As I was writing my post NE HOOP GUY beat me to the punch. He's much more eloquent and factual but I'll add my two cents.


Maine1 - You were at the Colby - Babson game which gives you some cred yet you suggest that Tufts should be #2 rather than Babson. You must have been sitting behind me and to my left. Didn't Babson beat Tufts earlier in the season and Colby Tuesday night? I'll check the schedule. In fact, I'll go back two years ago to see how Colby did against Babson in the second round of the NCAA's.
No one wants to give Babson even a modicum of respect despite what they've accomplished in the past three years. Everyone seems to hold their nose at Babson's qualifying for the NCAA's (three years and counting) yet they've gotten closer to the dance than most other teams in the Northeast. Give these women the respect they deserve. They weren't one and done, they've done it three years in a row. We all have our loyalties but because Babson is in a conference that "sucks," which I take exception to and think is inappropriate, they keep getting it done.

In answer to amh63's request for opinions as to who should should be #2 instead of UNE, be carefui what you ask for. The answer is quite simple, BABSON. They didn't lose a game last week yet went from 3 to 9 with RIC and WILLIAMS losing games and only dropping two positions. I'll also add that amh63's soliloquy about MVP's posts on the NEWMAC blog are amusing. I'd venture to guess that MVP, like myself, is a Babson parent and should be allowed some leeway in their posts as opposed to a loyal fan of many years who has a different level of "skin" in the game. Be assured that Babson is a TEAM, not driven by the front court or any one player but by the coach and the women who make up and are a team. See you in Amherst.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 17, 2012, 06:06:59 AM
To the ardent Babson fans ---no disrepect intended when I was explaining who number 2 should be--in fact, I agree that Babson is a legitmate number 2 in the region.  I also think they deserve to be a first round tournament host, based on the body of work over the past three seasons.  The only point I would make is that unlike some of the other teams at the top of the ranking, Babson does not play the consistent strenght of schedule.  I believe a significant part of the rankings is how teams have done against other ranked teams. I would expect that we will see Babson move up in the rankings next week based on their victory over Colby.  Overall Tufts has probably played a tougher schedule.
Good luck to the Beavers--and I hope to see some NCAA games in Wellesley
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MVP on February 17, 2012, 08:46:37 AM
Babson has not and will not be distracted by the disrespect by the rankings. Nor will their fans or posters be distracted by Amh63 patronizing insults and her threat about bulletin board material for Gromacki reading these boards as she posted  earlier this week on the NEWMAC board.
Amh63  "Having said all that....I think Babson's coach does not want any Babson fan to post such BOLD predictions.  "Amherst's coach does read this board".  What?  Talking about foolish and bold!

That's just silly. Both coaches have better things to do. To consider my prediction that Babson will win NEWMAC and may  have a good shot at defeating Amerst is anything but bold. Babson has won NEWMAC three consecutive years and has made the trip to Amherst three years in a row... to the elite 8 the last two consecutive years. Yet, still get no respect. What other team in the NE save Amherst has accomplished that. Along the way they have beat Colby last year at Colby, Bowdoin at Amherst  in the semi's last year despite Collins suffering from a broken right hand and hitting two huge free throws shooting lefty, a tough Tufts team this year at the William's Little East tournament and Colby again just this week. 
I have talked about the Babson depth repeatedly this year and why I think that makes them a stronger team and tougher matchup . They are well coached and well balanced.
So, again Amh63  saying that as a  Babson fan  I'm  "beating the drum" and "it is getting a little tiring".... your remark is lazy and patronizing. Based on her daily lengthy posts about Amherst ROY and Amherst POY you'd the think the NCAA should just eliminate the sectionals, distribute "player of the year" and "rookie of the year" at LeFrak  and buy them a ticket to the finals in Michigan.  Babson does have one of the best dominating front courts in D3, no debate,  and they now have a much stronger back court which I've been touting all year. They are a strong team all-around. Amherst has a great program, a great team and everyone knows it . Babson should be ranked #2 in the regionals and everyone knows it.
Babson nor it's fans will be discouraged or distracted by the disrespect. We'll soon see how the seedings play out. Amherst has earned the #1 spot. I wish them well in the upcoming NESCAC conference title games. Babson has earned the #2 spot but will again take care of business on the court regardless of the seedings, Babson is used to winning big games on the road.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bballfan13 on February 17, 2012, 09:22:38 AM
Quote from: Maine1 on February 17, 2012, 06:06:59 AM
To the ardent Babson fans ---no disrepect intended when I was explaining who number 2 should be--in fact, I agree that Babson is a legitmate number 2 in the region.  I also think they deserve to be a first round tournament host, based on the body of work over the past three seasons.  The only point I would make is that unlike some of the other teams at the top of the ranking, Babson does not play the consistent strenght of schedule.  I believe a significant part of the rankings is how teams have done against other ranked teams. I would expect that we will see Babson move up in the rankings next week based on their victory over Colby.  Overall Tufts has probably played a tougher schedule.
Good luck to the Beavers--and I hope to see some NCAA games in Wellesley

This statement is what I think is wrong with the NCAA and some people's thinking about the tournament.  The tournament is a stand alone tournament that is held each year and should be viewed that way when seeding comes into play.  Now we all know geography comes into the discussion with D3, so it's a little harder.  But I don't think a team should be considered to host based on their "body of work for the last 3 seasons."  Yes, that team may have all of the same players but most likely they will have different players each year making them a different team.  Teams and players should be rewarded for their work done in the current year, and not the years past.

MVP, please don't take this the wrong way and think I am disrespecting Babson here.  They just happen to be the team mentioned in this thread.  I would say it about any team.  I agree that Babson should be ranked higher in the region than they are this week.  And yes, they should move up next week with the win over Colby.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MVP on February 17, 2012, 09:45:13 AM
Bballfan13- I agree, seedings should be based on current season results. Amherst has certainly earned #1 ranking year after year and in particular this year. But it is hard to ignore the diss that the Babson team has received and successfully overcome. Like you said Babson should move up, but is not holding their breath for a higher regional ranking next week. Like past years they will be forced to win on the road.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on February 17, 2012, 11:11:55 AM
Wow.  Bravo to all of you for your passion about the women's game in general, and your loyalty to your, or your child's, school, in particular.  I don't follow this stuff nearly as closely as all of you seem to, but I think it is important to remember that the only thing that the ladies on any of these teams can do is the best that they can.  If they all go out on the court and practice and play as hard as they can then they can and should feel proud about whatever they accomplish.  The kids have absolutely no control over where they are seeded.  Presumably the rankers (?) have some type of system in place for a large majority of their decisions, but I am also certain that subjective bias comes into play as well.  But it is out of the kids' control.

Do the Babson parents, players, coaches and fans feel they should be ranked #2?  Clearly they do.  Do the UNE folks think they should be?  Probably.  The same can probably be said for Tufts, and who knows who else.  But all the ladies can do is their best, and let the chips fall where they may.  They should not be distracted by perceived slights.  At the end of the day, whether a team is ranked 1st, 2nd or 10th doesn't matter.  You have to beat the best to be the best.

Stepping down off the soapbox, I think all of these athletes should be commended for the commitment that they make year in and year out.  Whether they are 24-0 or 3-21, they show up and do their best.  The time commitment combined with the academic workload these ladies have is impressive.  They should be proud of themselves for that, and should be applauded by all of us simply for their effort.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 17, 2012, 02:48:04 PM
Well said, NH Fan.  The ultimate pay off is these kids go on to do great things in life.  They know how to balance a heavy workload, use their time wisely, and lead others.  So many of the lessons they learn playing a sport will come in as handy as the knowledge from the classroom.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MVP on February 17, 2012, 07:44:56 PM
Well said. That truly is what the D3 experience is all about. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 20, 2012, 09:25:56 PM
Just to point this out... Babson has an SOS through LAST Sunday's games of .492 and has played just one regionally ranked opponent - a win. UNE has an SOS of .551 and has played four regionally ranked opponents, all-be-it 1-3. That is some of the factors when it comes to regional rankings... not sure it means Babson should be as low as they are, but it does make more sense why UNE may be that high.

Also, not sure anyone here has realized it, but Amherst will probably end up on the road for the first weekend in the NCAA tourney.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bsc73 on February 20, 2012, 10:02:47 PM
Babson has played 4 regionally ranked teams as of last Sunday (yesterday) and has a 2 and 2 record.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bsc73 on February 20, 2012, 10:05:44 PM
Quote from: NH NESCAC Fan on February 17, 2012, 11:11:55 AM
Wow.  Bravo to all of you for your passion about the women's game in general, and your loyalty to your, or your child's, school, in particular.  I don't follow this stuff nearly as closely as all of you seem to, but I think it is important to remember that the only thing that the ladies on any of these teams can do is the best that they can.  If they all go out on the court and practice and play as hard as they can then they can and should feel proud about whatever they accomplish.  The kids have absolutely no control over where they are seeded.  Presumably the rankers (?) have some type of system in place for a large majority of their decisions, but I am also certain that subjective bias comes into play as well.  But it is out of the kids' control.

Do the Babson parents, players, coaches and fans feel they should be ranked #2?  Clearly they do.  Do the UNE folks think they should be?  Probably.  The same can probably be said for Tufts, and who knows who else.  But all the ladies can do is their best, and let the chips fall where they may.  They should not be distracted by perceived slights.  At the end of the day, whether a team is ranked 1st, 2nd or 10th doesn't matter.  You have to beat the best to be the best.

Stepping down off the soapbox, I think all of these athletes should be commended for the commitment that they make year in and year out.  Whether they are 24-0 or 3-21, they show up and do their best.  The time commitment combined with the academic workload these ladies have is impressive.  They should be proud of themselves for that, and should be applauded by all of us simply for their effort.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bsc73 on February 20, 2012, 10:08:47 PM
Unfortunately it does matter where you are ranked. The seedlings determine if you get to host the first and/or second round and it also determines if you are selected as an at large selection.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 20, 2012, 11:40:40 PM
Sorry about my previous post with Babson at 1-0... I was reading from the NCAA SOS report. It should have read 1-2... but, that 1-0 could have been a typo... since as it has been pointed out to me, the two losses are to teams now ahead of them in last week's regional rankings.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on February 21, 2012, 09:15:51 AM
To follow up on Dave's earlier post re: Amherst playing the first weekend on the road.  This is a true statement.  Apparently, if the Amherst men win the NESCAC tournament they would presumably be the #1 seed coming out of the northeast.  The men's and women's tournaments begin on the same weekend, and as I understand it, the same school cannot host both the men's and women's tournaments, and because the women hosted last year the men would host this year.  My details may be all goofy, but that is essentially how it was explained to me.

So, if the #1 ranked team in the country has to play their opening round games on the road, then no one should complain about anything...ever!  (I'm just kidding people...don't go getting all crazy on me)   :D
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 21, 2012, 10:06:29 AM
Trying to catch up a bit while traveling and relaxing with family in the Sunshine state.  Enough time birdwatching and shopping.  Seems that the NCAA frenzy is sticking its head into the board.  Other than the UAA, which has no tournament, there is another weekend of play to watch one's team.  Then the "fun" that is out of all our control begin.....selection, where the selected teams play and hosting questions enter.....yes, the discussions of fairness in hosting will be discussed.
Back to the specifics of NCAA rules on hosting.  Bucket on the MBB conference board gave them.  Basically, When a school...Amherst here...has both men and women teams ranked enough to host, the odd and even year rule enters.  Since Amherst's women team hosted last year...odd year..through the sectional...they would have to play the 1st and 2nd round games on the road.  The Amherst's mens team will have the opportunity to host the first two rounds.  If both teams advance to the sectionals..3rd and 4th round...The wpmen's team will have the right to host and the mens team will go on the road.  This situation occurs because both Amherst teams are ranked at this time tops in the regional rankings.  Their rankings will likely hold even if they do not win their conference.  Last year the Amherst's mens team reached the elite 8, but was not ranked high enough in the regionals to enter the hosting picture....and the odd and even year rule did not come into play.
Back to kicking sand for me.  Hope to be back to catch at least the regional games live.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 21, 2012, 10:08:32 AM
It would make sense that the only reason that Amherst women would not host is that the Amherst men would be hosting. However, it does not make a lot of sense that the defending national champion, and undefeated and number one team (assuming they win the NESCAC title this weekend), would have to play another team on their home court.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 21, 2012, 11:59:18 AM
After the long haul on the road in January and early February, I think Amherst should be fine on the road the first weekend.  It's to their advantage to be able to host the Sweet 16 and Elite 8 while the men travel....assuming both teams are still in the tourney at that point.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 21, 2012, 12:18:30 PM
There is no "does not make sense that the defending national champion, and undefeated and number one team, would have to play another team on their home court" clause in the championship rules.

In the effort to be fair to mens and womens teams who all deserve to host, the NCAA has a rule in place that as described already gives the men the right to host in even number years in the first weekend and the women the right to host in the second weekend. Amherst would not be the first #1 team or defending champion to be on the road in the first weekend (Hope has had to go on the road in the second weekend for no reason what-so-ever).

Now, there is one loophole that *might* come into play. The men's committee *could* decide that Amherst deserves a first-round bye - giving them their first game on Saturday. I am not sure if this has been thought through or considered, but that could leave open the chance the women could host that weekend and a double-header would take place on Saturday with a men's and women's game being played at LeFrank. HOWEVER, this is just a thought... not sure it is something that will realistically take place... it is just a possibility.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 21, 2012, 02:42:15 PM
"Bucket"'s post on the MBB board of the rules did state something about 3 or 4 team sites...which I inferred to be cases of bye situations.  Appeals were stated to be useless.  Whatever the situation it will be revealed by next Monday and we all can moan and complain again.  Meanwhile, Amherst and other hopefuls must focus and play well in the games this weekend.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 21, 2012, 02:53:13 PM
A "bye" situation would result in just one men's game being played at Amherst with the opponent having played a game on Thursday at another location. The committees and the NCAA would have to agree that the women could host a normal regional weekend event and the men could host one game on Saturday... not sure that will happen or not.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 22, 2012, 03:56:23 PM
Nice preview of the games this weekend...with schedules and ticket info...all at the Amherst athletic website.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 25, 2012, 06:18:28 AM
Looking forward to the NESCAC final four today.  I expect Colby to give Amherst a good fight, but Amherst with McCormick should win. The match up of McCormick and Mack is a great matchup-with two of the more versatile post players in the country matching up.  Both can go inside or outside.  The Tufts/Bowdoin game should be very tight.  It can go either way.

enjoy the afternoon. all four of these teams deserve to be playing next week
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 25, 2012, 04:57:22 PM
The conference championship on Sunday will be between the top two seeds.  Both Amherst and Tufts won by double digits over their opponents. The Amherst recap and the boxscore are.   now posted on the Amherst website.  Watched the 2nd game a bit on-line.  Tufts had a hard time in the first half and had to make a comeback to only be behind by one point at the half.
Tufts made a run on Bowdoin early in the second half and led by double digits soon after the midpoint of the second half.  Bowdoin's leading scorer did not have a good day...mainly due to Tufts' defense.  With less than 3 minutes to go, Bowdoin had only scored 36 points while Tufts was in the 50's.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 25, 2012, 07:18:10 PM
Amherst had an excellent all around game today--the game was not as close as the final score, as Amherst pulled its started when they were up 27.  Colby then made a run to make it respectable.  Colby was way off shooting, and Amherst offense was running well.

Tufts defense absolutely smothered Bowdoin.  Great defensive team. They will certainly bother Amherst tomorrow.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 26, 2012, 11:38:38 AM
Today's championship game will be most interesting...to me at least.....since it is one between two of the best defensive teams in the conference.  I do not expect a repeat of the first game between the two at Tufts.  In that game...a low scoring game for both teams, Amherst did not play "well", IMO, in the second half of the game.  They appeared flat and seemed to loose focus.  Coach G left the starters in for a long time...not bringing in subs to provide energy and tempo to the game.  Both teams played hard but with little passion....is that possible?  I felt and posted my feelings earlier that Coach G wanted to see if his starters could find their focus on the floor and play up to their talents during their time on the floor.
In any case, I expect a different type of game and hope for a well played game by both teams leading to an Amherst win.
I expect a higher scoring game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 26, 2012, 12:33:40 PM
Great first half--excellent defensive battle--Tufts is playing well (except for some bad turnovers ).  They are giving Amherst a good battle. If Tufts can keep up on the offensive side, and stay close, it could be interesting.  Clearly the top two teams in the conference this year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 26, 2012, 01:44:42 PM
Amherst beats Tufts 65-39 with all dressed players playing.  It was 24-24 at the half and a somewhat defensive battle in the first half.  Amherst caused the turnovers but Tufts controlled the boards 24-12  in the first half.  Amherst could not establish their inside game and allowed Tufts to score from the outside.  In the second half, Amherst turned up their defense and went on a run to go ahead by double digits in the first 5-6 minutes of the second half.  The lead grew to 25 plus and slowly the starters were replaced.  The subs kept the led and it was evident that Amherst's "bench" could start for other teams and win games.  Tufts continued to play hard but their shots were not falling and Amherst was winning the boards and still causing turnovers.  Tufts has a good chance, IMO, to be invited to the post season tourney with a fine 20 pus win season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on February 26, 2012, 01:48:55 PM
I missed the first half of the game, but it seems like it was a fairly standard Amherst game this season, only in reverse.  Amherst has typically blown teams out in the first half.  Usually building about a 20 point lead, and then playing fairly even in the second hal.  Today they played the first half even, and blew Tufts out in the second.  It will be interesting to see what happens if they can put an entire game together.  They'll need to in the tournament.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 26, 2012, 01:54:09 PM
Great defense by Amherst in the second half--completely shut down a Tufts offense.  Amherst defense especially on Cornegay was outstanding, as they played off her and did not let her drive and create in the paint.

As far as Amhersts' second team--they gave up a 15-0 run yesterday against Colby--Voight was great off the bench the last two games, and McCormick is a starter coming off the bench. Hardy is a great shooter. 

They will be tough again in the NCAA tournament.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MVP on February 26, 2012, 07:16:58 PM
Congratulations to the Amherst WBB team for another strong performance and NESCAC championship.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 27, 2012, 03:41:20 PM
Amherst gets to host in the first two and even in the sectionals.  Key here is that the men's team gets a 1st round bye.
Should be interesting in the second round......Babson meets Amherst on Sat.....if both teams win on Friday.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 27, 2012, 04:05:32 PM
Quote from: amh63 on February 27, 2012, 03:41:20 PM
Amherst gets to host in the first two and even in the sectionals.  Key here is that the men's team gets a 1st round bye.
Should be interesting in the second round......Babson meets Amherst on Sat.....if both teams win on Friday.

Women get hosting privilages before men in the sectionals, so I'd say because of that, women get first dibs over the men if both advance to the second weekend, however the Amherst women have a very difficult second round matchup in Babson, much more tougher then the Amherst men do playing NYU/Misericorda.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 28, 2012, 05:35:08 AM
Two things that jump out at me related to the NCAA selections. Number one is that the selection committee missed the boat on leaving Colby out. Colby has one of the hardest schedules in the country based on the SOS, they had seven losses, all against regionally ranked (and it turns out NCAA tournament teams).  They also had three wins against regionally ranked teams.  They did  not have any bad losses (other than the last one at Amherst, but everyone losses badly to Amherst) and came within 18 seconds of defeating Amherst earlier in the season.  I heard the head of the women's selection committee say that they only look at numbers, and not the conferences of teams. If this is true, it is a huge mistake.  There is so much variation on the level of play across leagues.  A team like Kings, who had 5 losses, did not win its league, and has played only 1 ranked team and did not win that game, should not get in over a team with Colby's resume. 

The other item is that Babson was under-rated, not being allowed to host despite an excellent 25-2 record, and a good record I believe against ranked teams.  And then being sent to Amherst in the first round. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bsc73 on February 28, 2012, 06:43:44 AM
It is unfortunate that Colby didn't get in but the system is a flawed one. The fact that the system is based only on numbers and leaves little if no room for discussion speaks volumes. The NCAA is all about D1 men's basketball and football and everything else is an inconvenience to them. It's too bad they can't take the time, effort and expense to come up with a system that works. Your example is agood one and I'm sure that there are many more.


Quote from: Maine1 on February 28, 2012, 05:35:08 AM
Two things that jump out at me related to the NCAA selections. Number one is that the selection committee missed the boat on leaving Colby out. Colby has one of the hardest schedules in the country based on the SOS, they had seven losses, all against regionally ranked (and it turns out NCAA tournament teams).  They also had three wins against regionally ranked teams.  They did  not have any bad losses (other than the last one at Amherst, but everyone losses badly to Amherst) and came within 18 seconds of defeating Amherst earlier in the season.  I heard the head of the women's selection committee say that they only look at numbers, and not the conferences of teams. If this is true, it is a huge mistake.  There is so much variation on the level of play across leagues.  A team like Kings, who had 5 losses, did not win its league, and has played only 1 ranked team and did not win that game, should not get in over a team with Colby's resume. 

The other item is that Babson was under-rated, not being allowed to host despite an excellent 25-2 record, and a good record I believe against ranked teams.  And then being sent to Amherst in the first round. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on February 28, 2012, 08:25:31 AM
If they are indeed only looking at numbers to fill out the field, then perhaps the problem is that they need to be looking at different numbers.  Of the 64 available spots, 43 of them go to conference champions.  They then look to "Pool B" which is made up of either independents or teams that play in conferences that don't meet the criteria (whatever that may be) for automatic bids, and then the rest of the picks are from everyone else.  This year, St Joe's was the only Pool B selection, and that left 20 at-large picks.  I have no idea if the 20 at-large schools they picked are better or worse than Colby.  But in looking at the rankings that are posted on the NCAA website, of the 20, 9 are ranked in the top 25 (Colby is not), 6 others received at least one vote for top 25 consideration (Colby also received 1 vote in one of the polls).  The remaining 5 teams are Bowdoin, Carthage, Hartwick, University of New England, and St. Vincents.  Of those 5, all were included in their regional rankings with the exception of Carthage.  They play in the same conference as Illinois Wesleyan, who won their conference, but were only the 6th ranked team in their region.  Carthage finished third in their conference.  Eight of 10 regionally ranked teams in the Northeast made the tournament.  The two that didn't were Colby (8) and Williams (9).  Three of the ten are from the NESCAC.

So, all of that confusing stuff being said...did Colby get hosed?  Who knows?  I would be curious about the selection of Carthage, and I don't agree that St. Joe's should be in the tournament.  They finished the season 13-13, and got smoked in their conference final, in which they were the #1 ranked team.  I'd be curious to know if the committee HAD to select someone from Pool B.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Hoop Guy on February 28, 2012, 08:39:07 AM
Colby got totally hosed.  As pointed out their strength of schedule was huge.  UNE is the at large that should not have been in.  There strength of schedule is barely at .50, they have a similar record of ranked teams.  There is just nothing that suggests they should be in, save the fact their coach served on the committee the last three years.  I know that seems petty, but give me another explanation?  Anyone?  Please?   When was the last time the CCC had a Pool C participant?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MVP on February 28, 2012, 09:06:49 AM
Amherst faces St Joe's, a pool B bid in the 1st first round, a team w/ barely a .500 record and lost their conference.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on February 28, 2012, 09:35:48 AM
Devil's advocate - If UNE had played and lost to Amherst twice, as Colby did, my crude calculations have their strength of schedule increasing to at least .585.  Of course, they didn't so it is a moot point to some degree, but it is interesting to see what playing an undefeated team does to your numbers...even if you lose.  You also have to wonder if Colby hadn't lost to UNE early on would things be different?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 28, 2012, 10:40:09 AM
Just clarifying one of the posts--King's College was an at large team that is not in the top 25, has not received votes, did not win its conference, and did not beat a ranked team.  Yet made the tournament. (and is hosting)--I haven't reviewed others--just pointing them out.  I also believe the pool B team is a 13-13 team, without any great wins.  UNE has some bad losses (Endicott, Roger Williams). 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on February 28, 2012, 11:13:22 AM
Kings received one vote in the USA Today poll that is posted on the NCAA website.  Those votes are only for games through the 21st, so they are not the most recent, but they are the ones on the NCAA website.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Hoop Guy on February 28, 2012, 11:32:01 AM
NH Nescac Fan, That is a totally moot point, because it did not happen.  Further had it happened like you said, UNE would have also had two more losses against a ranked opponent and an overall less record, and never would have been considered for an at large.  I appreciate the thought nonetheless, because no one can justify UNE as an at large from the CCC to date.  But I am still waiting.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 28, 2012, 03:28:16 PM
Congrats to Caroline Stedman from Amherst, a Jostens Trophy Finalst!!!  Richly deserved, on and off the court!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on February 28, 2012, 03:52:27 PM
QuoteI'd be curious to know if the committee HAD to select someone from Pool B.

Yes, they did.  The allocation of Pool B and Pool C bids is done early in the season and is driven by the number of teams that are part of Pool B (i.e. not in conferences with automatic bids).  So someone had to get this bid.  Once one team is selected from Pool B, all the other candidates are considered against the at-large candidates (Pool C).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on February 28, 2012, 07:44:07 PM
Thank you, Gordonmann.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 29, 2012, 05:44:46 PM
The conference picks for all-conf. spots, etc. are posted on the Amherst website and the conference website. 
Caroline Stedman is POY and Megan Robertson is ROY.  Two other Amherst seniors made the ist and 2nd team.
Don't understand the COY pick.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 29, 2012, 05:52:25 PM
My position on COY has been posted earlier.  IMO, it is politics here and this trend really distracts from the level of the coaches in the conference....if it is only the coaches that makes the selection.  I could understand it better if Reilly was selected....giving his body of work this year.
Interesting to see that the 2nd team has no guards selected....guess position was not a selection criteria.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Hoop Guy on February 29, 2012, 06:42:15 PM
Who else would be coach of the year?  Tufts lost a great point guard, yet became an even better team this year.  That is good coaching.  Assuming I understand your parochial objection as to who should be coach of the year, you should recognize coaches with very good players are expected to win.  Coaches who win almost as much with less talent, they are coach of the year material.  I think it is an excellent choice and to even suggest politics is myopic.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: HoopMama on February 29, 2012, 08:41:21 PM
Quote from: amh63 on February 29, 2012, 05:52:25 PM
My position on COY has been posted earlier.  IMO, it is politics here and this trend really distracts from the level of the coaches in the conference....if it is only the coaches that makes the selection.  I could understand it better if Reilly was selected....giving his body of work this year.
Interesting to see that the 2nd team has no guards selected....guess position was not a selection criteria.

Who is Reilly???
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 29, 2012, 08:44:27 PM
I thought that the NESCAC year-end awards were consistent with what I have seen from the NESCAC for six years now. In general, the all league teams is essentially made up of the top four. Very hard for other good players to break in.  Given that, I thought the first team was well done. Hard to argue with any of them.  Henrikson of Bowdoin probably deserved player of the year, but given Amhersts outstanding record, it is understandable that Stedman got the award.

On Coach of the year, Gromacki could win it every year. He is outstanding.  However, Tufts had a very young team, and the Tufts coach did a great job.  You could have also given consideration to the Conn College Coach. I believe this might have been Conn College's first trip to the NESCAC tournament.

Everything can't be all Amherst all the time.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 29, 2012, 08:55:45 PM
Sorry posters......my comment here refer to the MBB choices.....my mistake!!!!
Reilly is the coach of Wes's men's BB team.
I find the selection of honors to be fair for the women's coaches and players.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 02, 2012, 07:35:40 PM
Looks like Babson is going to win their game...but for those that say they are a deep team, I'm not seeing that.  Nikki Wurdeman has scored 24 points, and the bench has scored 3.  Only one bench player has scored.  Wurdeman has been on the bench with foul trouble but is back in now with 5 to play as the lead has been cut to 10...it should be an interesting finish.

UNE is down 11 to Johns Hopkins with 6.5 to play...lending more creedence to the poster who was shocked they made it in at all.  (Sorry, I can't remember your name)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 02, 2012, 07:53:30 PM
23 seconds left UNE down 1 with the ball...giddyup
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 02, 2012, 09:00:39 PM
With such a big lead for Amherst, Gromacki goes to his bench 9 minutes into first half.  We're looking at the future, and the future is deep with good players in their own right.  Starters will be well rested for Babson while Bridgewater stayed close enought that Babson starters played most of the game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 02, 2012, 10:06:13 PM
Amherst beats St. Joe's by 54.....84-30....with the bench playing well.  Hardy at the point, Rizzo, Holderness, Weatherly and the FY lady from Farmington Ct.(Momah is her name)...afraid to spell her name wrong here...finishing the game.  Concern that Bridget Crowley was not dressed and not on the bench.  Hope it is not an injury and if so, not serious.  Can use her energy and length in the games ahead.   Voight and Robertson were the top scorers for Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 03, 2012, 12:10:58 PM
It is a little strange to have the WBB game be the "feature"game at 8PM. 
NH NESCAC Fan....Hope you saw Jasmine play last night.  Looked good playing the point.  Had a career 7 rebounds in her extended playing time...tough player.
Oh yes...did see the classmate with the jacket.  New jacket and bow tie to boot.  Came over to a group of OLD fans.  It was after the MIdd. game.  At the Fri. game, against Williams, I was talking with two of his team players....the 1964 MBB captains..looked around but did not see a person with "the jacket".  May be another time.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 03, 2012, 02:03:43 PM
I did, indeed, watch the game.  I thought Jasmine played very well.  She played with a great deal of confidence and energy.  It was nice to see her get some extended time.  I will be heading down to see the Babson game later today in the flesh.  I now have Jasmine's father, Greg, trying to pick you out at games I know you are attending.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 03, 2012, 02:47:15 PM
Amherst fans-don't get so excited over a win against a 13-14 team that probably would not make the NESCAC playoffs.  Look for a good game tonight. I expect that the Amherst defense will swarm all-over the Babson guards.  It is unfortunate that Babson has to play Amherst this early. Looking at some of the other games last night, they are definitely a sweet 16 team. 

Hope to catch the second half of the game on-line
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Hoop Guy on March 03, 2012, 03:12:50 PM
It is unfortunate that Babson has to play Amherst tonight, for both sides really.  The good news is no matter what happens tonight, I think most fair people realize that Babson is for sure a sweet 16 team, and at worst the 2nd best team in the Northeast as they have proved that consistently over three years now.  However, it has been known for many more than three years that the NCAA is an organization rifled with favoritism and cronyism at all levels.  Therefore the disrespect shown Babson, a new visitor to the NCAA elite, over the last three years is par for the course.  The unjust early round assignment this year, the lack of hosting with a perfect record last year, is what it is and cant be changed.  I am sure Babson will find the same challenges next year and beyond.  So we will just forever have to ponder how Emmanuel gets to go to RIC and Babson has to go to Amherst.  We will never figure out (save the coach's three years on the committee) how UNE gets an at large out of the CCC, and Colby a good team out of the NESCAC, with some senior who will never again get the chance, stays home.  The common denominator is the NCAA and their ethical shortcomings IMHO.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 03, 2012, 09:48:34 PM
couple of observations with about 4 minutes left--if Babson could shoot the game would not be close, and Voight is playing great
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on March 03, 2012, 09:58:52 PM
Quote from: Maine1 on March 03, 2012, 09:48:34 PM
couple of observations with about 4 minutes left--if Babson could shoot the game would not be close, and Voight is playing great

Frontcourt did a great job on the boards as expected, but 10 more turnovers than Amherst and only 4 points from the backcourt just isn't going to do it....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 03, 2012, 10:15:23 PM
Babson played Amherst close for most of the game with their frontcourt dominating the offensive boards.  Amherst allowing Babson too many 2nd chances and 3rd chances in the first half.  Amherst led by 2 at the half and was lucky at that.  In the second half, Amherst started to only allow Babson one shot and started to cause turnovers.  Amherst starts to get 2nd chances and then had several 3-point shots go in....one by Meg Robertson and one by Voight that was the dagger.....bringing up the lead to 9 and then the wheels start to fall off for Babson.  Amherst led by Lem Atanga started to block shots and make steals.  It was a 13 point spread at the end of the game as Amherst ran out the clock.  Babson's front court all had double doubles.  The senior star had a terrible time at the foul lane going only 3-9.   Poor foul shooting by Babson kept Amherst in the game. 
A better writeup of the game will be posted by the SID on the Amherst website.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 03, 2012, 10:33:18 PM
Much closer game than the score indicated.  Huge win for Amherst against a team they knew were gunning for them.  Congrats to Babson on a fine season.  Let's go, Jeffs, and bring another trophy to the Northeast.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 04, 2012, 01:25:25 AM
Wow, what a game.  It is 1:10 a.m. and we just got home from the 2 hour drive.  Amh63's synopsis is very good.  That Babson frontcourt was/is excellent.  Unfortunately for Babson, that is all they had/have.  I think that Wurdeman's poor free throw % probably was a result of being tired.  Their big 3 played the entire game.

After watching the game I will definitely agree with the posters who say that Babson got hosed being seeded where they did.  This definitely did not play like a second round game, and was much closer than the final score indicated.  Maine1 your comment that if Babson could shoot the game wouldn't have been close makes as much sense as when my friend said to me at the start of the second half...If we can keep them from scoring there is no way we can lose this game.  Babson rode their frontcourt all year.  The guards aren't shooters.

In any event, it was a heck of a game.  It's unfortunate someone had to lose, and I felt badly for the Babson seniors when all was said and done.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 04, 2012, 07:21:14 AM
Great to see three NESCAC teams moving on to the sweet 16.  Congratulations to both Bowdoin and Tufs, along with Amherst.  Tufts continues to win with defense.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 04, 2012, 10:59:11 AM
Babson's offense is based on the their front court...has been for three years.  Often as seen in their game on Friday, has one of their bigs pass to another big under the basket and if they miss the shot, two bigs go for the rebound and put back.  Surprisingly, King, I believe, made a number of outside shots in the first half of the game on Sat.   It is too bad that the tall Babson trio did not develop their talents in other areas....and got better support from their guards.
Several other comments from us who had to watch on-line.  First, there are too many "media time-outs".....it makes the game choppy and can stop runs.
NH NESCAC Fan....you may be correct that Wuderman was tired.  Even some Amherst starters started to miss foul shots near the end of the game...fatigued players.
Looking at the box score last night.....shows that Babson controlled the boards....the spread was not as bad as it was in the first half when Babson had 14 more boards...mostly offensive rebounds.  However, Amherst had more steals and more than doubled Babson's blocks.
The student announcers wondered out loud if Lem Atanga and Meg could be put in the game together..along with Jackie....to counter Babson's bigs....3 experienced six footers against 3 experienced six footers.  In the 2nd half, Lem and Meg played together and were the key to the win,IMO.  Both are offensive threats, good rebounders and shot blockers.  Both had foul problems in the first half.  In the second half both scored inside and from outside and caused defensive problems for Babson's bigs.  They along with Voight led Amherst to the win.  Stedman had an off night offensively...due in part, IMO, playing hard defense.....most of the time against King.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Hoop Guy on March 04, 2012, 11:24:11 AM
AMH63--you are really something.  I read these boards and from time to time (too much lately) offer a comment or two.  Your view's are so parochial and myopic that it is hardly worth responding too, but after resisting for a while I am giving in. 

Your comment that it is too bad the Babson trio did not develop their talents in other areas is ludicrous.  What are you talking about?  Do you think they should be playing volleyball also?   Is that what you mean? Surely you are not talking basketball talents, because if you look at the stats you will see that they fill the stat sheet in all categories.  They all regularly shoot from the outside, play tenacious defense (check with C. Stedman)so again what are you talking about?  Stedman was off because of the Babson defense on her, not because of the defense she was playing. 

For all the talk about the Babson lack of depth, and some of it has merit, I notice Stedman put in 40 minutes herself.  That would seem to indicate that the rotation is not quite what it was.  Fiorentino had 20 in the first half and likely would have also gone for 40 save the foul trouble.

So if you want to bleed Amherst as you do, that is great, but show some respect for the opponent.  That seems to be lacking in Amherst at times in many ways.  Amherst is very good this year, but not quite as good as they were.  They know they faced their toughest threat of the year last night and they got lucky in a couple of ways.  They held off a ferocious challenge and the bracket collapsed around them, so they have much weaker teams coming to Amherst than anticipated.  So I think they go to the final four again, but barring a great recruiting class they come back to the pack in the NESCAC next year, with Tufts the likely winner "IMHO".  So maybe a bit of humility would be helpful and respect for the tremendous talents and efforts of others along with your love for Amherst.  Again, just my opinion.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 04, 2012, 11:33:30 AM
In terms of last night's game--as I mentioned with four minutes to go, I thought Voight was the difference in the game.  Made some big shots, rebounded, and was a force. It looks like she is coming out of her season long funk, as she played well in the NESCAC finals. I also thought that putting in McCormick and Robertson togheter helped offset the Babson height advantage. 

Babson's achilles heel, as it has been the last couple of years, is consistent guard play.  The Big three had 44 of 48 points. If Babson had developed some reliable outside shooting during the season, it would have given them the balance that they would have needed.

I do agree with the previous poster, that Amherst does not have the depth it has had in the past.  Finnucane has not been effective, so she is starting, but not playing starter minutes. McCormick is a starter, so the only real reliable player off the bench is Voight.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 04, 2012, 02:11:57 PM
I can't see a team on their side of the bracket that can beat them.  George Fox probably has the best chance, but Mary Washington doesn't have enough offense to keep up.  If MW ends up winning their part of the bracket, Amherst can coast to the championship game without much trouble.  On the other side even though Tufts lost both games to them this year, Tufts held them to below 50 points in both meetings IIRC and have the most familiarity with them being conference opponents.  I also think Chicago can give them a run for their money, but imo the team most likely to knock Amherst off of the 15 that are left are Tufts.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 04, 2012, 02:29:03 PM
Maine1 - I agree.  Marcia Voight came up huge last night.  She clearly has come out of her year and a half funk.  While her scoring will be what people focus on, I think it was her rebounding that made the difference.

Amh63 commented on the "media timeouts".  I have to tell you, sitting there and watching the game, those things made it painful at times...and not just because bleachers aren't the most comfortable thing to sit on.  There was one point where Babson called a timeout with possession of the ball under their defensive basket.  It was a full timeout.  Play resumed, they inbound the ball, and I don't remember exactly what happened, but they used the bulk of the 30 second clock, at the end of which there was a foul.  Tweet...media timeout.  Really?

Amherst's depth is that every one of the 5 starters, and the players that come in off the bench are capable of playing excellent defense, and scoring as well.  Shannon Finucane, who has struggled during Marcia Voigt's re-awakening, is still a 1,000 point scorer.  If you rightly call Lem a starter, then you surely have to give a nod to Meghan Robertson as a bench player.  Jasmine Hardy led the NESCAC is 3 pt field goal %.  Babson's starters all played excellent D, but only 3 were a scoring threat, and there wasn't anyone on the bench, guard or forward, that was able to help with that.

NE Hoop Guy, re: your comment that showing some respect for the opponent seems to be lacking in Amherst at times in many ways, I'm not sure what you are referring to but I would be interested in your take.  Over the past two seasons I have attended a couple handfuls of games, and have not witnessed any disrespect toward Amherst's opponents.  In fact, there were two times last night that impressed me with the level of sportsmanship that fans showed.  With 23 seconds to play in the game, and the outcome determined, the Babson coach subbed a player in for Sarah Collins.  As she made her way to the bench and sat down she received an extended ovation from ALL of the fans in attendance, not just the Babson fans.  Everyone knew that this was her last game, and appreciated all of the effort that she had given.  The second moment came after the game was over. I was still in the gym when the Babson team came out of the locker room to meet up with their parents and fans.  As they emerged onto the court, the entire gym gave them an extended ovation.  It was very nice, and as crappy as those young women felt, I am sure they appreciated the support from all.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 04, 2012, 03:26:29 PM
Quote from: NE Hoop Guy on March 03, 2012, 03:12:50 PM
We will never figure out (save the coach's three years on the committee) how UNE gets an at large out of the CCC, and Colby a good team out of the NESCAC, with some senior who will never again get the chance, stays home.  T

Here's how:

Dec. 6, 2011: University of New England 70, at Colby 63
http://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/women/2011-12/boxscores/20111206_3liy.xml
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 04, 2012, 03:33:38 PM
With 23 seconds to play in the game, and the outcome determined, the Babson coach subbed a player in for Sarah Collins.  As she made her way to the bench and sat down she received an extended ovation from ALL of the fans in attendance, not just the Babson fans.  Everyone knew that this was her last game, and appreciated all of the effort that she had given.  

pretty sure Collins is a junior
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 04, 2012, 03:45:27 PM
Under big pressure I thought Stedman had a great game.  15 points, and some remarkable drives to the basket where her pure speed was on display.  She remained calm and led her team just as a senior should do in a tight game.  With others in foul trouble, and the luxury of media time outs no need to rest her.  I think you'll see more of Finucane in the next game(s), last night was a case where Gromacki needed height at every position.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 04, 2012, 03:52:19 PM
Remsleep...oops, my bad.  You're right.  I thought they were all seniors...so...Everyone, but me, knew this was the last game of her Junior year, and appreciated all of the effort she had given.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 04, 2012, 04:38:51 PM
NH NESCAC Fan....nice recap of the fans last night.   I try to sit on my coat at times while in the bleachers.  When I have to go up the bleachers with the parents (men), I tend to stand up....will not block any fan's sight lines.
I will clarify and respond to NE hoops Guy's comments at a later date....when he calms down from being mad at me, at Amherst, and at the NCAA committee...for not respecting Babson enough....it seems.  Amherst played a nationally ranked team last night in the 2nd round.  Stedman was in the game for 40 minutes because of the respect for Babson's pre-season All Americans.  Stedman is the conference POY.  I made my comments in part because of Stedman's play over the years...and in part of her play in Fri.'s blow-out.  Stedman was not sharp on Friday and was taken out to rest and because she was not needed....earlier than the other starters.
When she is needed to "take over a game" by her shooting and explosive drives to the basket and her steals, etc.,Coach G keeps her in the game.  Yes her drives were limited last night by Babson's defense....but her outside shooting was also off, even when unguarded.
She was still kept in for her defense of a bigger opponent, etc.
Ms. Finucane has been a starter for at least three years.  She is also Amherst's leading "stealer".  She controls the flow of the offense and plays great help defense and even rebounds well.  Jackie Renner at times will spell Shannon at point. 
Oh yes, Lem was selected as a 1st team conf. player, and Meg Roberston was selected Rookie of the Year....as was Voight her first year.  Kim F. was selected 2nd. team.  Just some info for Babson fans on the Amherst team that was on the floor and that struggled against Babson for most of the game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 04, 2012, 05:21:16 PM
NE Hoop Guy - Here i MUST take issue with your last comment about the Amherst families not participating in the ovation.  That is flat out baloney.  I was smack dab in the middle of the families, and we were all applauding the Babson team.  You continue to say... Which is fine, I would not expect them too,...perhaps that is the problem.  I fully expected them to, and they did.  That is good sportsmanship.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MVP on March 04, 2012, 05:48:05 PM
Congratulations to the Amherst womens basketball team! They played with poise and toughness in a game that could of gone either way. This was the rematch D3 and the fans were all waiting for all season. It's a shame it was a contest in the 2nd round. Babson almost had them. I think everyone including GP were sweating this one out. Babson was underrated by D3 , the selection committee and again by Amherst. Babson played them tough, left it all out on the court and nearly came up w/ the upset.   In the end Babson didn't quite have enough to beat them. Congratulations to the Babson women's basketball team, the program and its fans! What an amazing season, what a great run!!
Thank you and congratulations to the three seniors, Wurdeman, King and McKenna. You are all great BB players, leaders and women that brought class and recognition to a fantastic basketball program.

Congratulations to Judy Blinstrub, head coach Babson, for her 500th career victory.  Amazing!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BBstudent on March 04, 2012, 05:52:01 PM
An interesting discussion about the Amherst- Babson game.
When my daughter played in the NESCAC there were sometimes comments posted about how a team shut her down or she was over-rated; Looking back I am grateful I learned then how little we as fans know what is really going on. There were times when medically it was questionable if my daughter would even play. But of course the fans wouldn't know that and no one who knew would say anything because that wouldn't help the team. I have no idea what is going on physically or mentally with the team or anyone on it, but I know better then to speculate as to why a player may be having a good or bad game or a couple of good or bad games.

Much more important to me is the assertion that when the Babson players came out of the locker room after the game (and correct me this is not what was being referred to) the Amherst fans did not acknowledge them. It is not true -every Amherst person stood and applauded them, and some parents (Mrs. Stedman notably) even asked a couple of people sitting and talking to join in the recognition. The applause for the Babson team, since they came out togeather then that for any individual Amherst player when they came out. There was and is great respect among the Amherst fans for the Babson team and the players. The failure to see that, and I mean that in the literal sense of how could you not see everyone standing and applauding, raises serious questions.

I understand the comment about Shannon not being as effective as in past years, but I don't completely agree with it. There is a "movement" at Amherst in which it seems that every recruiting class is better in some ways then the class before. So it would be understandable for newer players to maybe be more talented, but I don't think that is the case here. First, with so much talent Coach can't, and I am sure doesn't want to just play seven deep. All these girls can play and they know it, so the starters have to share the time maybe more then in the past. But more important I think you are underestimating Shannon's leadership abilities. She comes in and everything solidifies, everything calms down and everything runs smoothly. The defensive intensity picks up (and we all know how important that is) and she even contributes with the occasional three (remember the Kean game, I think, when she hit two in a row). And if last night you watched during the timeouts, she was yelling at the girls on the floor, imploring them and I thought inspiring them. I know I did not fully appreciate Shannon the first year and a half so learn from my (many and large) mistakes - she is out there for a reason since GP does not give mercy minutes. In my opinion the reason she is out there is because she the team's leader.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: LORENZO123 on March 04, 2012, 06:33:02 PM
I'll second MVP's post. The game is over, the seedings were the seedings and in the end Amherst was the winner. A Babson -Amherst meeting in the Elite 8 would have been a great event but .....  Both teams are made up of some of the finest young women in Women's D3 basketball; last night they left it all on the court. They deserve our respect regardless of what school they play for or what conference they're in. They work hard to bring their best to their team after carrying a full class load semester after semester. The seniors will move on to new opportunities and adventures but they'll always have the friendships, memories and experience of playing for two of the best teams in D3 basketball along with the pride of knowing they did their best. They may have some regrets but their memories will focus on the good times and their collective efforts. I'll take the pride i have for my daughter's accomplishments over the last four years to my grave (hopefully not too soon) and I know i'm not alone.

With respect to the Amherst parents, I wasn't paying attention but I have great respect for them. They've always shown great respect to the Babson team; they're a class act. Negative comments or actions, if any, would likely have come from students who can be forgiven at their tender age. I expect that when they have kids of their own they'll show the same respect to opposing teams that the Amherst parents have shown Babson.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BruinFan on March 04, 2012, 10:00:48 PM
Quote from: 7express on March 04, 2012, 02:11:57 PM
I can't see a team on their side of the bracket that can beat them.  George Fox probably has the best chance, but Mary Washington doesn't have enough offense to keep up.  If MW ends up winning their part of the bracket, Amherst can coast to the championship game without much trouble.  On the other side even though Tufts lost both games to them this year, Tufts held them to below 50 points in both meetings IIRC and have the most familiarity with them being conference opponents.  I also think Chicago can give them a run for their money, but imo the team most likely to knock Amherst off of the 15 that are left are Tufts.

Never know for sure how much to read into it when trying to compare teams, but we don't have much else to go on when teams are on opposite sides of the country.

Tufts lost a neutral site game (@ Williams) to Whitman College of the Northwest Conference by 19 points. Whitman finished 3rd in the NWC with two losses to George Fox and two losses to Lewis and Clark. Part of the fun is different opinions. IMO, George Fox has an even better chance than Tufts of challenging Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 05, 2012, 05:40:34 AM
Hard to compare teams based on common opponents, and Tufts is probably much better now than it was at the beginning of the season.  I don't see Tufts being able to beat Amherst.  Tufts defense is great, but it doesn't have the offensive fire power to score against Amherst. (see both games)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 06, 2012, 12:08:20 PM
Nice post on the Amherst website that gives a writeup of all teams in the Amherst pod this weekend....times and prices at the gate and links to all the teams' school websites.....sort of one-store shopping for info on the teams.  SID does a good job.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 06, 2012, 10:56:00 PM
This is the time of year coaching changes start to accumulate.  I notice that Hamilton is looking for a new head coach for WBB.  Any rumors out there for imminent changes? 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 07, 2012, 12:22:17 PM
remsleep....Aside from history, I would think it is a bit early for the rumors, IMO.  I know one sure thing.  Coach G. will not return to Hamilton.  Has been a merry-go-round of coaches at Hamilton recently.  Pressure of joining the conference full time, maybe.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 07, 2012, 01:20:32 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 07, 2012, 12:22:17 PM
remsleep....Aside from history, I would think it is a bit early for the rumors, IMO.  I know one sure thing.  Coach G. will not return to Hamilton.  Has been a merry-go-round of coaches at Hamilton recently.  Pressure of joining the conference full time, maybe.
amh63....it's never too early for rumors...lol.    Also, we are definitely moving into the "sweet spot" time of year for bb coaching changes...will last about another 5 weeks....vacancies on the ncca.org site in college coaching jobs in bb has gone from about 6 to current 37 in last two weeks.  So I repeat...who is leaving? Williams coach?  Bates Coach?  Those programs are dormant/disappointing...never win anything
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 07, 2012, 01:31:55 PM
oh....and Middlebury
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 07, 2012, 02:22:56 PM
Speaking of coaches, does anyone know if the interim coach from Colby last year ended up coaching at another school?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 07, 2012, 03:09:35 PM
She is the assistant Coach at Washington and Lee
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 07, 2012, 04:11:47 PM
Thanks.  I'm glad she didn't leave coaching, and has a chance to build her resume and work with a quality program, though defininetly tough for her Northeast family to get to games.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: onetinsoldier on March 08, 2012, 11:56:11 AM
interesting story i found on one of the teams in the Amherst pod. 

http://citizensvoice.com/sports/king-s-leading-scorer-picks-spring-break-over-tournament-1.1282736#axzz1oXD9SyyA
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 08, 2012, 01:53:21 PM
Quote from: onetinsoldier on March 08, 2012, 11:56:11 AM
interesting story i found on one of the teams in the Amherst pod. 

http://citizensvoice.com/sports/king-s-leading-scorer-picks-spring-break-over-tournament-1.1282736#axzz1oXD9SyyA

wow....go figure
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 08, 2012, 03:49:31 PM
I remember the first year Amherst made the Sweet 16 five years ago, there were girls scrambling all over the place to cancel plans, change airline tickets etc.  They lost that game to then defending champ DePauw and some made it on spring break and some didn't.  Since then there hasn't been a player that has had a spring break as their break is the week before the Final 4.  I dare say they wouldn't trade those times together on campus preparing for the games then mid to late week departure to the Final Four.  I kind of feel sorry for the girl who is missing out on such a special team time to be one of the last 16 teams standing in the country.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 08, 2012, 03:55:15 PM
Quote from: sumfun on March 08, 2012, 03:49:31 PM
I remember the first year Amherst made the Sweet 16 five years ago, there were girls scrambling all over the place to cancel plans, change airline tickets etc.  They lost that game to then defending champ DePauw and some made it on spring break and some didn't.  Since then there hasn't been a player that has had a spring break as their break is the week before the Final 4.  I dare say they wouldn't trade those times together on campus preparing for the games then mid to late week departure to the Final Four.  I kind of feel sorry for the girl who is missing out on such a special team time to be one of the last 16 teams standing in the country.

And she has probably burned her bridges.  I can't imagine she'd be welcomed at any reunions! :P
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 08, 2012, 04:10:48 PM
Attempted point shaving scandal to follow?   :)  Wow.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 08, 2012, 08:22:55 PM
Completely unfathonable to me.  I can't imagine someone doing this.  RIC is on spring break next week, and I know a couple of them are going away, but I'm sure they'd stay at school if it meant they were still playing, especially the seniors on the team.  I don't think we'll be seeing her at any alumni festivities.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 09, 2012, 06:43:16 PM
I have a hard time believing that Amherst didn't broadcast the Emmanuel - King's game.  I thought if you got to host you had to broadcast.  It's the best of the early games and i don't see a link to it?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 09, 2012, 06:48:02 PM
Take that back.....found a link on Emmanuel's website
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 10, 2012, 12:57:19 AM
Amherst beat York 79-55.  York hung tough there for a while, Amherst was only up 8 at the under 4 media timeout before Lem Atonga make a couple baskets at the end of the half to bump the lead to 14.  Second half for the most part York didn't have an answer, and the Amherst defense gave York nothing easy.  They'll be playing Emmanuel who was an 11 point winner over King's in the 1st game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 10, 2012, 10:26:12 AM
Thanks 7Express.  There were fans checking on the Amherst team in Lancaster.  Still, it is nice to get a first hand writeup.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 10, 2012, 02:38:35 PM
Another great game from Voight last night for Amherst.  They are a much better team wtih her starting, and there front six right now is very strong.  I don't see Emmanuel giving them any trouble tonight. 

Very tough loss for Tufts.  They could not make a shot for a while, and then had to do an inbounds pass over becuase the scorer forgot to start the clock, leading to a steal with 20 seconds left. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 10, 2012, 06:09:07 PM
No stats or video from Amherst??  Dissapointing, but I agree with Maine1, Amherst should win fairly easily.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on March 10, 2012, 06:11:00 PM
Quote from: 7express on March 10, 2012, 06:09:07 PM
No stats or video from Amherst??  Dissapointing, but I agree with Maine1, Amherst should win fairly easily.

Video here:  https://www.amherst.edu/athletics/jeffcast/jeffcast2
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 10, 2012, 06:11:56 PM
Nevermind, I found it on the Amherst website.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh07 on March 11, 2012, 12:24:38 PM
Thoughts on the George Fox and Amherst match-up?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 11, 2012, 12:52:51 PM
Blue Zone Bruin asked my thoughts on the Amherst/GFU game since I've seen both teams live a couple times now. That doesn't make me an expert on either team but here are my thoughts.

I think the Amherst/George Fox game is a toss up. I told the George Fox broadcasters last night that I'd make GFU a slight favorite. I picked Amherst in the preview column. So clearly I'm torn.

Amherst has to take away Keisha Gordon's ability to drive, much like UMW did last night. Kim Fiorentino is an excellent defender who contained Division III all-time great Chelsie Schweers last year. Jackie Renner is essentially a 6-foot-1 point guard who plays wing. She's quick and long enough to take away some of the open three-point looks that GFU generated last night.

Amherst has more scoring threats than George Fox with Stedman, Robertson, Atanga McCormick and now Voight. But, like the rest of Division III, they don't have an obvious matchup for Hannah Munger. I asked Bowdoin's coach if the NESCAC had a similar player and she couldn't think of one at the time. Amherst took care of Babson who has a great front court, but George Fox has better guards/wings than the Beavers.

Amherst may try to do what Bowdoin did in the sectional semifinal. Bowdoin played its forward away from the rim to draw Munger away from the basket. Bowdoin got some open looks, but they didn't fall. Plus Bowdoin starts four guards and doesn't have the depth at forward that Amherst does. Hannah's also a physical player so fouls could be an issue with the wrong referee crew. The other George Fox forwards may be solid, but they aren't the unique threat that Munger is.

Keisha Gordon is a great player and will likely be an All-American for us again. She shot great last night, but even beyond that, her passes from the wing to Munger in the post were outstanding. I suspect she gets to defend Caroline Stedman which will be a fun battle of All-Americans.

I've seen a handful of very tall Division 3 women's players (6-foot-5 and taller). They almost always lack coordination, touch or strength. Hannah Munger lacks none of those. She has some of the nicest low post moves I've seen at this level. She has great hands, is a good passer and knows what she wants to do when she gets the ball.  It was a little like throwing a tape in the VCR and watching a Hakeem Olajuwon highlight reel. Defensively she anticipates shots nicely on the defensive end. She gets caught out of position occasionally on the glass, but usually because she's focused on boxing out her opponent.

I'm trying to think of another player like Hannah that I've seen in the 13 years I've covered Division III women's basketball and it's hard to come up with one. Mary Washington had a great center in Liz Hickey (who was incidentally at Friday's game). Liz was quicker but also a little shorter. The only other player I can think of is Cortland State center Kate Smith (http://www.d3hoops.com/awards/all-decade/women/fourthTeam) who was a Division I transfer and a selection to our All-Decade team. I didn't see the top centers (Ronda Jo Miller, Gallaudet and Alia Fischer of Wash U) since they are before my time.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 11, 2012, 01:16:14 PM
Nice comments Gordonmann.....First though, congratulations to Amherst and their seniors who led the team to its 4th Final Four!
Gordon, you should have looked at the video feed of the Amherst game.  Jackie Renner decided to become a scorer last night....since Emmanual left her open.  She even hit a 3-point shot and drove the lanes.  Voight continues to do well and hit two 3's...so her outside shot is coming along.  Lem hit 4-5 from outside.  Kim and Caroline do not have to hit the outside shot for Amherst to win.  Meg, continues to play the post well with another double double. 
All in all, plus experience in tough games and Final 4 pressure. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 11, 2012, 02:55:24 PM
If you concede that Munger will get her 20 and 10, then the key, I think, to Amherst winning the game is stopping Keisha Gordon and the guards from being factors offensively.  As Gordon pointed out, the other two front line players are not really offensive threats...at least it appears that way from looking at the stats.  (I've never seen them play)  Lem and Meghan did a much better job in the second half of containing the Babson frontcourt than they did in the first, and while none of those ladies are 6'5", all three were very talented. Hopefully they bring that knowledge with them.  Both these teams have the ability to get hot.  GF clearly was very hot last night.

It should prove to be a very good game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: msdiver98 on March 11, 2012, 09:04:50 PM
Congratulations to the Amherst women and best of luck in the Final 4!   Babson game was by far the best of the past two weekends -- too bad it was a second round matchup and not an Elite 8.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 11, 2012, 09:39:45 PM
Amh63:

I saw Jackie's father at the D3hoops classic in Las Vegas this December. I joked with him and Coach Gromacki that I'd see them in Michigan. Understandably they both demurred given the long road ahead at that point. Congratulations on getting back to the Final Four and establishing the program as the standard bearers for excellence.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 11, 2012, 10:12:07 PM
Quote from: amh07 on March 11, 2012, 12:24:38 PM
Thoughts on the George Fox and Amherst match-up?


Never seen George Fox play this year, but they put up a good showing on one of the nations toughest defenses...on their home court...in a game about 2,600 miles away from campus on the opposite coast.  Granted the game will still be pretty far away (anyone know if GF is on spring break this week??  I can't see GF going all the way back to Washington, only to fly back east a couple days later) but I'd make Amherst a 2.5 point favorite.  They have the expierence (4th straight final 4) and frankly don't lose (this senior class only has 5 total losses their 4 years on the Amherst campus; 3 coming their freshmen year).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 11, 2012, 11:49:03 PM
George Fox goes on spring break a week or two tomorrow. Unlike most schools, the GFU break doesn't overlap with the tournament.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BlueZoneBruin on March 12, 2012, 12:31:29 AM
Quote from: 7express on March 11, 2012, 10:12:07 PM

Never seen George Fox play this year, but they put up a good showing on one of the nations toughest defenses...on their home court...in a game about 2,600 miles away from campus on the opposite coast.  Granted the game will still be pretty far away (anyone know if GF is on spring break this week??  I can't see GF going all the way back to Washington, only to fly back east a couple days later) but I'd make Amherst a 2.5 point favorite.  They have the expierence (4th straight final 4) and frankly don't lose (this senior class only has 5 total losses their 4 years on the Amherst campus; 3 coming their freshmen year).

Couple thoughts: George Fox is from Oregon (not Washington), and they are back this week. They landed in Portland at about 12:30 this afternoon. My guess, based on previous experience, is that the NCAA will fly them back out on Wednesday. Spring Break is March 26-30, so the women will be in class until they fly out. They did the same thing in 2009, when they played in the sectional at Thomas More and then went on to Holland.

Very good point about the Amherst seniors. Three of those losses were their freshmen year, but two of them also came in the Final Four. 8-)

As for the Fox seniors, their record is 116-9, with two of those losses coming in the Elite 8 (WashU-2010, IWU-2011), and three coming to NAIA scholarship schools. Only one of those losses came at home.

Should be a great game. Can't wait! See you in Holland!

BlueZoneBruin
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 12, 2012, 02:47:58 AM
Sorry about that, for some reason I thought they were Washington.  Can't wait to watch this on Saturday night, should be a great game.  Anyone know what time the game times for Saturday get announced??
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 12, 2012, 08:43:33 AM
If you wait to watch this game on Saturday you will miss it.  The Final Four games are on Friday.  Amherst - GF at 5:00 and Ill Wesleyan - St Thomas at 7:00.  The final game is Saturday at 7:00.  (this is from the Amherst website)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 12, 2012, 10:50:35 AM
I give Amherst a slight edge just from the experience factor alone.  Amherst at Hope 3 years ago thought they were "the" team starting 2 sophomores and 3 freshmen, but Wash U and experience mattered.  George Fox and their coach had been there before, and they won the whole thing.

Last year IWU had to think playing at home and making the Final 4 it was "their" year, but they came in 4th.  This group hadn't experienced the pressure before.  Christopher Newport thought with the leading scorer, there was no stopping them, but experience mattered.

So for that fact alone, and as long as Amherst doesn't get into foul trouble trying to guard the taller Munger, I think Amherst should pull it out.  Hard to tell from video, but I think Amherst might have an edge on speed, especially with their bigs.  Both teams have multiple weapons, Amherst may have a few more, but this weekend, just like last weekend, Gromacki won't go more than 6 or 7 deep until or unless the game is "in hand."

Can't wait for the fun to begin!!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 12, 2012, 11:28:23 AM
does anyone know if GF plays predominantly man to man, or zone?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 12, 2012, 12:34:51 PM
NH NESCAC Fan......I believe that one of the best assets for the Amherst team is their coach.  I learned a new phrase recently with respect to games......"adjustments".  One can talk about match-ups and other critical factors as speed, bench depth, etc....but as the game is played, game adjustments need to be made.  Critical fouls, hot shooters, fatigue of players and so on require changes to parts of the game plan.  Coach G and other fine coaches make adjustments as needed...primarily based on how well the players are prepared to make changes, etc.  On my limited observations of the Amherst play...zone defense is not used often.  However, the players need to play it if game conditions call for it.  That happened in the men's game at F&M last weekend.  Amherst's reserves were making a comeback run in the first half.  The F&M coach went to a zone for the last few minutes to stop Amherst.  The Dips coach is known to make adjustments and his records for wins is the best in D3.
I believe, Coach G will have the team practice/refresh their zone defense this week...to be prepared.  My take is that Amherst will want to dictate its pace and game plan on G. Fox and have them make the first adjustments. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 12, 2012, 01:53:01 PM
Amh63 - I agree with everything you said, but my question was really about George Fox.  I was wondering what type of defense they typically play.  For instance, Amherst typically plays man to man.  In fact, the first time they played zone all year was in the first round of the tournament.  I fully expect Amherst to come out and play man to man.  I was just wondering if anyone knew if GF typically plays a man to man or a zone.  While most teams I have seen this year play a man to man, no other team has a 6'5" asset underneath.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 12, 2012, 01:54:53 PM
I'm sorry, I see the confusion...I was asking about GF (as in George Fox), not GP (as in Gromacki)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 12, 2012, 04:38:30 PM
Actually, NH NESCAC Fan.....my error...can not read is now another of my limitations.
Know nothing about G. Fox....except that it is in Oregon.  Spoke to my younger son on the subject and his response...Was it a Quaker College?  George Fox was the Founder of the Quaker brand of faith.  Have to go the website on that matter.
Actually, as I posted on the MBB board, will leave it to the coach. He will have the players work against a possible zone if G. Fox has used it and work on a zone defense.  A 2-3 zone and a 3-2 zone and variations of them.  Seems Syracuse uses a zone all the time.

Went to G. Fox website.....Yes they are a Christian Un.  Renamed George Fox in 1949 after the founder of the quaker Friends.  About 1900 undergraduates.   Saw a old video of the WBB team playing at home.  In the Dec. 9 game.....G. Fox played a full court press with the big girl playing catcher.  Do not seem to play a tight man to man.  Sort of loose one that swings with the ball.  Luger sits down low to block shots, etc.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on March 12, 2012, 06:56:13 PM
Here's a fun look at Devos for those that haven't seen it before.  It may not rock quite like this without a Hope team there (this was the men's team vs. IWU in the recent 2nd round game) but when the women play Calvin in The Rivalry it can get pretty close to this.  Anyway, it'll give you a look at the venue and the fabulous support for small college basketball.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aEuAYQ3q7kw

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BigMac on March 12, 2012, 10:43:29 PM
Vs. UMW GF played both m2m and zone. They pressed the whole game. They mix it up nicely.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 13, 2012, 12:54:52 AM
Not to put pressure on Amherst or anything, but 80-85% of d3 schools are east of Holland.  You will be the ONLY ones in the FF to be traveling west!  Three teams are from the West or Central - you represent the other 6 regions!

Not that I would try to psych you out or anything like that! ;D

(As I have expressed elsewhere, I think the winner of you vs. GF will take it all, but, hey, as an IWU guy, I gotta use any tool I can! 8-))
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 13, 2012, 01:30:29 AM
Anyone know if these games on Friday night are broadcast over on NCAA.com??  I know the final was last year and I assume it's going to be again this year, but I didn't pay attention to the semi's last year so not sure whether they were broadcast or not.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 13, 2012, 01:41:09 AM
They will be and we'll have the links for you guys.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BlueZoneBruin on March 13, 2012, 02:05:22 AM
Quote from: sumfun on March 12, 2012, 10:50:35 AM
I give Amherst a slight edge just from the experience factor alone.  Amherst at Hope 3 years ago thought they were "the" team starting 2 sophomores and 3 freshmen, but Wash U and experience mattered.  George Fox and their coach had been there before, and they won the whole thing.

Last year IWU had to think playing at home and making the Final 4 it was "their" year, but they came in 4th.  This group hadn't experienced the pressure before.  Christopher Newport thought with the leading scorer, there was no stopping them, but experience mattered.

So for that fact alone, and as long as Amherst doesn't get into foul trouble trying to guard the taller Munger, I think Amherst should pull it out.  Hard to tell from video, but I think Amherst might have an edge on speed, especially with their bigs.  Both teams have multiple weapons, Amherst may have a few more, but this weekend, just like last weekend, Gromacki won't go more than 6 or 7 deep until or unless the game is "in hand."

Can't wait for the fun to begin!!!!

About 2009... GFU had never been there before. The best they had ever done was one run to the Elite 8 in 2005. In fact, the 2009 team had no returning starters from the previous year that made the Sweet 16. Add in the one senior, and the 10 freshmen on the team, two of which started, and there wasn't much experience.

Experience does matter, but it isn't everything.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 13, 2012, 03:26:05 AM
Thanks Pat!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 13, 2012, 07:11:19 AM
Thanks, Pat.  That's why they play the games, and your knowledge and experience "really" matter.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 16, 2012, 08:34:27 AM
There is a very nice article on Lem Atanga McCormick on NCAA.com
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh07 on March 16, 2012, 02:23:38 PM
Thanks, NH Hoops Fan for pointing out the awesome article.  What an exceptional person.

http://www.ncaa.com/news/basketball-women/article/2012-03-15/atanga-mccormick-shows-many-sides
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: daoustian on March 16, 2012, 06:28:06 PM
Munger is pretty incredible -- hadn't seen her play yet, but gordonmann was right.  Just no answer for her.  If Amherst is able to survive this one, it'll be quite the accomplishment.  Really wish they were trying to take the ball at Munger a bit harder to get her into foul trouble. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: daoustian on March 16, 2012, 06:59:48 PM
Tough one -- too many Amherst turnovers and George Fox was very good.  Voigt is so fast but sometimes out of control and needs to throw more bounce passes to keep the turnovers down.  Incredible streak by the team over the past 1.5 seasons and still a fantastic season.  Ah well. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh07 on March 16, 2012, 09:39:10 PM
The Amherst seniors have been an inspiration to me for the past 3 years I've watched them.  They are role models to me and to everyone else for their dedication, persistence, focus, and confidence.

My impression at an arm's length:

- Lem Atanga McCormick is balance, flexibility, and quiet self-assurance, coolly transitioning to be a 3-point sharp-shooter when circumstances called for it.

- Jackie Renner is the Warren Buffett of D3 women's hoops, smart when others are impulsive, holding her resources in reserve until just that right moment when everyone else goes left and she goes right. 

- Shannon Finuncane is the epitome of emotional intelligence.  Her rapid low clap will invigorate anyone, not to mention her steals and her going to the floor.  Did you see her hand on Kim's shoulders after Kim fouled out?

- Kim Fiorentino is consistency and focused energy, always doing her job at the highest level even when she isn't the center of attention.

- Caroline Stedman is the picture of mental strength and "deer-like" grace, always leading the team at critical times.  I am at a loss for finding another example of a person outside of athletics who consistently steps up the way she does.

- Livia Rizzo: although I've seen less of her, she is apparently a very likable person, a great athlete, and a great basketball player.

The traits that these women possess are among the most important qualities that a person can have OFF the basketball court.  As they leave the Amherst bubble, the seniors should be aware that these qualities will place them steps above whomever might be their next competition.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh07 on March 16, 2012, 09:47:54 PM
Quote from: amh07 on March 09, 2010, 07:54:01 AM
Quote from: wbbhoopsfan on March 08, 2010, 05:16:39 PM
if she is back and Beryuti is out at Kean, look for Amherst to win the title.  Anyone feel there is a better team? 

I'm concerned about Hannah Munger at George Fox, who is listed as tall as Troy Whittington at Williams (6'5'').  Amherst will certainly benefit from another tall body to take fouls.

Some things come back to haunt you.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 17, 2012, 10:11:08 AM
Ahhhhh NUTS!!  OH well.  There was no answer to the talented 6'5" Munger.  I was surprised that GP didn't try a zone just as a different look for her.  But he is the winningest coach in the history of coaching so I'm guessing he knows more about this stuff than I.  It was a great game, but a bad result for all of us NESCAC fans.  Chins up ladies, it was a wonderful season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 17, 2012, 11:29:03 AM
I watched the game and was blue for a period....especially when I saw that the game went the way of the rebounds and the foul shots missed by Amherst....and the FT made by the fine GF center.  Amherst made the adjustments to stopping the center...late in the game..but it was their offensive efforts that seemed to let them down.  Even the best teams/coaches come up short in March.
The team has one more game today....Go Jeffs!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Hoop Guy on March 17, 2012, 12:27:26 PM
It was an excellent basketball game and the difference clearly was Munger who Amherst just could not stop, and as someone else pointed out that was not a huge surprise.  That is not a good match-up for them or anyone really, but it works against Amherst's defense strength.  They were shooting hot early and that almost overcame the challenge and they weathered storms a couple of different times during the game.  The one obvious difference this year with past Amherst teams was the depth he was comfortable going to.  Throughout this tournament he has really only been going 6 to 7 deep, which was surprising.  I cant help but wonder what that means for next year.

One thing that is confusing to me, is what happened to the point guard?  She played 10 minutes against Babson, and has barely played since, is there some sort of injury?  It is a different look without her for sure and made the bench even shorter.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 17, 2012, 05:30:07 PM
Sad to see these Amherst seniors end their careers this way.  After having no answer for Hannah Munger last night, it's like they don't even want to be here for this consolation game against St. Thomas, down 20 with 7:50 to play.  Granted, I don't really blame them, I'd be uninspired if I were them too.  Your the reighning champs, have 1 loss the last 2 seasons, and get relegated to the 3rd place game, but still I thought they'd go out with more of a fight.
St. Thomas finishes the win by 27 87-60.  By far the most points Amherst has allowed this season by quite a large margin.  Watching this game you could tell St. Thomas was excited about this game, getting a game against a quality opponent which could give them an expierience edge for next season should they make it back here to Holland.  After winning the championship last season, the consolation game was a downer for the Jeffs and it showed on the court.  Amherst started out the game 10-8, but St. Thomas ran out to a 20-8 run, and built as large a lead as 20 in the first half.  Amherst chipped away at the lead from there; a Caroline Stedman runner to beat the first half buzzer got the deficit down to 11 at halftime, and Amherst got as close as 7 or 8 in the 2nd, but St. Thomas held them at bay the rest of the game and didn't let Amherst get closer then 7 in the 2nd.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 17, 2012, 06:03:20 PM
Congrats to the seniors for a terrific 4-year run.   It was a pleasure to follow your efforts....the first full recruiting class for Coach G.
A great game by St. Thomas....for their defense and hustle.
Coach G. will not make any excuses or provide any hint of them.  It appeared to my eyes that the Amherst players were a step to slow today.....reaching in and not moving their feet.  Meg Robertson was fatigued even in the first half and did not play very much in the second.  Eveyone seemed to be off....except for Finucane who gave her all.  IMHO, it seems that several key players were ill.  Low energy level even in last night's game. 
Will look forward to next season......which I believe the Amherst team will have the talent to start a long winning streak.





Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 18, 2012, 09:02:14 AM
Did not watch much of the game, from what I did see, I would agree that Amherst looked like they had no desire to play this game, and if that is the case, I certainly can't blame them, particularly the senior group.  The whole team should be extremely proud of their accomplishments over the past four years.  There run will be hard to top.

I suspect the Amherst choke hold on the NESCAC ends next year, unless there is a super freshman in the incoming recruiting class.  If Voight plays the way she did at the end of the season, she will be one of the top players in the NESCAC.  However, after her and Robertson, there really doesn't seem to be that much that can be counted on.  Tufts will return some solid players, however Colby , Williams, and Bowdoin all lose a lot.  Will be a wide open season next year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 18, 2012, 05:06:32 PM
I might suggest that we should leave the jury out on the remaining members of the team until they actually get a chance to play.  With a five senior starting group as talented as this group is it can be very difficult for anyone else to establish themselves during any meaningful minutes.  The coach's reliance on the core group was evident in the semi-final.  Marcia played like the ROY that she was two years ago for the last quarter of the season.  Bridget showed in the semi-finals, and throughout the year, that she is quite talented, and has a nice shot.  Jasmine led the NESCAC in 3point FG% at almost 59% for the season in the league and 49% overall.  She was the best pure shooter on the team, IMO.  Meghan was the ROY this year.  Will next year's team be the equal of this team?  I'll go out on a very thick limb and say no, I don't think they will.  But, I do think they will still be very good.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 18, 2012, 06:19:24 PM
Congrats to Amherst seniors.  So much for which to be proud, at the very least the winningest class in NCAA history.  Seems many of your guesses were correct.  Megan was sick all weekend, but gave it all she had, and you could tell Amherst hearts were not in the second game.  That doesn't take anything away from the St.Thomas team who probably used the same motivation Gromacki used 2 years ago to launch their championship run....now is the start of the next season.  They are a talented team that could easily use that game to build on for another Final Four run.

Wonder why NCAA still thinks it's a good idea to play that consolation game when men don't, and I can't think of another sport that does.  Instead of marking the trophies 3rd and 4th.  Just mark them as "finalist," and move on.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 18, 2012, 10:03:06 PM
In the discussion this weekend, apparently water polo does. But that doesn't make for a long list.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 18, 2012, 11:18:18 PM
I can understand why coaches (including IWU's Dennie Bridges, despite going 2-0 in them, when the men still had them) and players hate the 3rd place game - it is AWFULLY anti-climactic after your dream has been crushed.  As a fan, I was proud that IWU NEVER finished fourth, but I understand (and identify with) the antipathy.  Still, I would have been hugely intrigued to see IWU and MIT square off (as long as both teams gave it their best, but that might be asking too much).

(In 1996, IWU took out their frustrations on F & M by 32 points, after a buzzer-beater loss to Rowan.  Both Hope and IWU fans agree that the 1996 championship game SHOULD have been contested between them, rather than the Prop 8 transfers from Rowan!  D3 instituted the 'Rowan Rule' the next year to close that loophole.)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 19, 2012, 12:58:36 PM
QuoteAs a fan, I was proud that IWU NEVER finished fourth, but I understand (and identify with) the antipathy...

I realize you're referring to the IWU men, but the IWU women finished fourth last year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 19, 2012, 01:08:31 PM
And I totally understand IWU's 4th place finish last year.  They gave every ounce they had to try to take down a big rival in Wash U on their home court.  When that goal fell short, even being on your home court doesn't help overcome the disappointment of the day before.  Last year, like this IWU plays a "first time" team to the Final Four who it is a big deal to win that consolation game, and Christopher Newport knocks off IWU.  Glad for the Titan's rebound this year.  Nice folks, and they do a great job when they host.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Walter Eagle on March 19, 2012, 01:22:57 PM
Wonder why NCAA still thinks it's a good idea to play that consolation game when men don't, and I can't think of another sport that does.  Instead of marking the trophies 3rd and 4th.  Just mark them as "finalist," and move on.
[/quote]

As a UST fan who drove two days each way to get to Holland, I really appreciated the consolation game.  There was so much disappointment and so many tears after having lost a game that we felt was not representative of the way we played all year, it was good for the players, coaches and fans to get another chance against a team that everyone thought was number one all year.  We learned some valuable things about ourselves and I suspect Amherst learned some things also.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 19, 2012, 01:27:39 PM
Anybody know anything about the Hamilton WBB coaching vacancy?  Wasn't the coach in her first year?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 19, 2012, 01:45:58 PM
Walter Eagle and Sum Fun summarize the two vantage points nicely.

How valuable the consolation game is depends on who is playing in it. When the program was in a different place, Amherst used the 2010 consolation game to prime themselves for the 2011 title run.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Hoosier Titan on March 19, 2012, 02:01:35 PM
Quote from: sumfun on March 19, 2012, 01:08:31 PM
And I totally understand IWU's 4th place finish last year.  They gave every ounce they had to try to take down a big rival in Wash U on their home court.  When that goal fell short, even being on your home court doesn't help overcome the disappointment of the day before.  Last year, like this IWU plays a "first time" team to the Final Four who it is a big deal to win that consolation game, and Christopher Newport knocks off IWU.  Glad for the Titan's rebound this year.  Nice folks, and they do a great job when they host.

A couple of other things played into IWU's showing last year.  First, they had probably peaked a bit emotionally with the huge come-from-20-down victory over George Fox the week before.   But even more important, at least two starters were really quite ill the last weekend with bronchitis.  They were trying not to show it, but they could barely talk afterwards and were coughing throughout the games.  Makes it hard to execute the high-energy run-and-jump press!  Whatever the cause, I'm sure that last year's results made this year's group even more determined to get as far as they could.

I was thinking that St Thomas, with no banners yet, had a lot more incentive than Amherst for that consolation game, and that's exactly how it played out.  Perfectly understandable on both sides.

Recent history suggests that good things may be in store for the Tommies.  We very much enjoyed watching this group of Amherst seniors over the past two years and wish them well.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Walter Eagle on March 19, 2012, 02:11:28 PM
St Thomas won it in 1991.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Hoosier Titan on March 19, 2012, 04:06:46 PM
Quote from: Walter Eagle on March 19, 2012, 02:11:28 PM
St Thomas won it in 1991.

Thanks!  Obviously I need more d3 history.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 19, 2012, 06:43:22 PM
Just goes to show how everything has to come together at just the right time to win the prize.  Last year IWU has sick players, this year GF loses Munger in last game.  Amherst had at least on sick key player that could barely talk with chills etc.  You're right about needing every bit of your energy to compete in those games.

It all has to come together perfectly after a long season, and this year it was IWU's turn.  Can't take anything away from an impressive weekend, but a little luck helps too.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 19, 2012, 07:39:42 PM
Is there any word (I haven't looked) as to what the extent of the injury was for GF's Munger?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 19, 2012, 08:36:53 PM
Quote from: NH NESCAC Fan on March 19, 2012, 07:39:42 PM
Is there any word (I haven't looked) as to what the extent of the injury was for GF's Munger?

I checked the GF website, but could find no update since the game recap.  Both she and the coach said she could have played, but was in great pain and would be risking further injury (and probably could not have played as well as her replacement).  She attended the postgame presser in a wheelchair.

Still, if she 'could have played' at all, it sounds like nothing she won't be 100% recovered from by next season.  Good wishes to her!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 21, 2012, 05:23:22 PM
Some positive news to end the fine season for Amherst.  The conference Winter All-Academic Team members have been announced for the winter sports.   Jasmine Hardy, Jackie Renner and Caroline Stedman made the team...representing WBB.  Congrats to them....it is not easy.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: RogK on March 22, 2012, 01:46:46 PM
I saw only the last two games of Amherst's season, but would like to say that I hope they don't feel bad about how their season ended. They achieved excellence and were topped only by two other excellent teams.
One player that impressed me was Kim Fiorentino. I think it was in the GFox game when at least twice she got a held ball while quickly grabbing the ball while the opposing player was just holding it over her own head, looking to pass. I can't remember seeing that happen the way she did it even once previously.
Such a hard-working player, she must be a major reason why Amherst has done so well in the last four years.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on April 03, 2012, 11:41:52 AM
Caroline Stedman of Amherst has been selected as the Player of the Year by the WBCA.  Story on the Amherst website nd the conference site.  Congrats to her.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on May 02, 2012, 06:35:31 AM
Article on future Eph:

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/high_school/basketball/baseline_duo_commit_to_high_level_Yu6PuxUzWHQz2W6v8nDQPK

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on May 03, 2012, 10:35:57 PM
I hear Caroline Stedman is going to be working at ESPN.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on May 19, 2012, 03:35:06 PM
Pat C....based on an feature article in the College newspaper, Caroline Stedman will be working for ESPN in Bristol CT. as a "stats analyst" in the appropriate stats & info group.  Eventually she hopes to pursue a MBA in  couple years.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on May 20, 2012, 01:57:34 PM
We have a good source. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on October 24, 2012, 05:31:06 PM
The D3hoops.com women's basketball preseason Top 25 is out:

http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2012/10/womens-preseason-top-25
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on October 24, 2012, 09:00:39 PM
Not that surprised by Amherst's rank at #15, as all teams above them probably have returning starters while Amherst lost 5 starters that had played in  four Final Fours.  BUT watch as the season progresses...if the current crop of players buy into the Gromacki system they will challenge for a top 5 spot.  The year after Gromacki took over and had lost most of his starting 5, he took a team made up of 3 sophomores and 2 freshmen starters to the Final Four.

The key will be if the current crop of players realizes how much work into that string of Final Fours, and do not take for granted that it just happens.  Can't wait for the first tip off!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 15, 2012, 03:24:30 PM
Amherst's preview and roster is now posted on the Amherst website.  Roster if FY players are heavy on guards.  Lost one front court player from last year...a FY player that did get some minutes.  First game will be on Say.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on November 17, 2012, 11:05:24 PM
And so it begins.  Amherst beat Brooklyn College tonight in the first round of their tip off tournament.  Inside game was effective.  Three for 20 from beyond the arc needs much improvement.  The young kids struggled shooting in their first game.  They'll take the W.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on November 18, 2012, 02:17:52 PM
Hopefully the first game jitters will be behind the new players and they can start to rack up some points.  Loved seeing Bridget Crowley put up some points!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on November 18, 2012, 05:37:48 PM
So much for the jitters.  New kids scored 29 of the 88 points scored in the Amherst win over William Patterson.  Marley Giddens led the team with 18 points and 12 boards.  The downtown shooting was much improved.  Jasmine Hardy 4-5, Sally Marx 2-2.  The team was 8-15 from 3...much better than 3 for 20.  Megan Robertson had 17 and 15.  Coach should be pleased.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on November 18, 2012, 05:41:18 PM
After a nervous start (down 17-4) Amherst finds it feet and shot and plays very well.  Congrats to ALL!! 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 19, 2012, 03:17:36 PM
Agree that the 2nd game against W. Patterson...a pre-season ranked team...showed  better Amherst team chemistry/play. 
Seems to me that Amherst is still looking for a PG and/or some backup PG options.....at least to help bring the ball up court under defensive pressure.  Seems the outside shooting is coming around....especially when the ball gets to open shooters like J. Hardy.  Expect the team will develop its chemistry as the season progresses.  The team seems to be working hard on defense.  The high number of turnovers is also a concern but expect it to decrease as the players get to play more with each other in game conditions.
Surprised not to see one of the listed front court players on the bench or even in the team pix on Sunday.  Anybody know the story?  With an already limited front court, I'm concerned.....though FY Giddins appear to be a player.  Just checked the roster and J. Weatherly is no longer listed.  That is another front court player gone.  Strange.
Am having a hard time telling the new players apart on the video feed.....all about the same size and light colored hair.   Just old eyes and small screen and no announcers, I guess.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 19, 2012, 04:43:22 PM
The Amherst roster is now showing only 10 players!  No Juniors as Sally Marx is also missing after scoring 10 points last night and coming back from a long ACL recovery the past two years.  Did the juniors both decide to take their junior year overseas/abroad?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on November 19, 2012, 10:47:23 PM
I guess Uju also decided not to play this year?  Have no idea about the other two.  Hoping for announcers after Thanksgiving.  Students, except for athletes are home on break.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on November 25, 2012, 10:44:44 AM
Yes, down to 10 players, and one of them was/is a walk-on.  Uju, as I understand it, decided not to play this year from a time commitment standpoint.  I believe she is pre-med(?), and wants to focus on her academics.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 25, 2012, 12:09:13 PM
NH.NESCAC Fan.....thanks for the info.  Understand the "?" attached to pre-med....since there is no such major even in my days.
In Jasmine's first year at Amherst, there was a FY front court player from Ill. that did not return to the team...believed she tried out for the squash team the next year.  In any case and for whatever the reasons, it will be a tough on the present team in regards to depth....hope there are injuries and that the front court players as all the players pick up their defense and rebounding efforts.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 27, 2012, 09:32:55 PM
Amherst....back from the Thanksgiving break wins against Keene State in New Hampshire by double digits with all players getting to play.  Near the end, all five new players were on the floor together.  Writeup  and box are coming on the Amherst website soon. 
The final score was 65-43, Amherst.   Amherst's outside shooting needs work and the turnovers are still there as the team seems to try too hard to share the ball.  Team chemistry is coming along as well as the defensive efforts. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on November 28, 2012, 10:00:29 AM
I've always had a very simplistic way of looking at whether or not I think a player is shooting too much...or taking shots that they shouldn't.  I look at the box score, and if a player takes 15 shots in the game I think he/she should score at least 15 points total at a minimum (including made foul shots in the total points).  If Kobe Bryant takes 40 shots in a game, he had better end the night with at least 40 points...as I said, simplistic, but I think it is fairly accurate.  Looking at Amherst under that light, the conclusion to me is that the majority of the players need to focus on non-three pointers.  In a very small sample (4 games) there are only two players that meet my criteria, and two others that are borderline.  They moved the line out last year.  It is a more difficult shot than it used to be.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 28, 2012, 11:14:57 AM
NH NESCAC FAN......thanks for the education......did not know that the WBB 3-point line was moved.  Guess you can "teach an old dog" something.  Now that I think about it, I recall reading about it.  The key to Amherst's team, IMO, is the need and therefore development of a PG.  Passes are at times sloppy and turnovers occur.  I was struck that one pass inside was easily picked off.....others were missed or over thrown.  Hopping that one of the FY players will come through as the senior guards seem uncomfortable in that position.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 01, 2012, 03:44:45 PM
Amherst wins over Skidmore in NY in a 20 plus game.  The game was close in the first half.....only a 3-point lead by Amherst at the half....29-26.  Megan Robertson go two fouls on her in the half and went out.  Bridget C. was not having a good game.  In the second half, Amherst held Skidmore to only 10 points and blew the game open.  Megan R. scored 12 points in the half and had 4 blocks.  S. Holiness came in and took control of the boards.  Amherst senior guards took over with 10 assists and 7 steals between them.  Both along with Megan scored in double figures with Jasmine Hardy leading the way with 15 points.  Particulars and box will be posted on the Amherst website soon.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on December 03, 2012, 01:20:53 AM
What happened with Colby this year??  I know they lost some starters off of last year's team, but didn't think it was as bad as Bowdoin had it.  Losing by 20+ at home to a bad Roger Williams team is not good.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 04, 2012, 10:05:34 PM
Amherst wins over Emmanuel in Boston tonight...74-61.  It was a 6 point lead at the half against the ranked Saints.  Amherst started to break open the game in the second half when J. Hardy and M. Voigt started to hit from the outside.  In the last 3 minutes, the Saints were trading fouls for long shots to come back....and when Voigt fouled out in a questionable charge foul, Jasmine Hardy took over the ball handing duties.  Both of Amherst's big front court players had 4 fouls in the second half as they were matched up with a big Saints' front line.  Both teams played hard and physical....but Amherst prevailed tonight against a game opponent in an away game.  Amherst had five players in double figures in scoring with Meg Robertson the leading rebounder with 12 boards....going along with 11 points.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 05, 2012, 11:11:36 AM
Several things that caught my attention while reviewing the write ups of the Amherst game from last night.  First, the box did not show any blocks for either team.  I thought that there were at least 3-4 blocks by Amherst and about the same for the Saints.
Last night, the Saints pressured the Amherst guards hard through out the game.  Amherst FY guards got a schooling at times and the press finally needed the senior guards to break.  It also was a good game for Amherst's front line players to gain experience.......against big physical players.  Several times Meg R. was knocked down and had her ball knocked away....as did Bridget C.  Both Amherst players adjusted their game accordingly.
OOPs, a Saints reserve player, that played very well, was credited with 3 blocks.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on December 05, 2012, 03:51:13 PM
Amh63:

Were you surprised by the short rotation last night?  I was surprised they basically used 7 players.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 05, 2012, 05:17:50 PM
Gordonmann....yes and no.....a somewhat non answer that is pure speculation on my limited video observations of the team.  Will try to be more specific.  During, a pre-season practice observation,  another alum observer and I were noticing the somewhat limited players on hand.....before the roster was posted.  Only 12 players as one front line player took the year off....see a post above.  After several games the squad was down to to 10.  The FY players are primarily guards and maybe a forward.  Though Coach G. has in the past gone with short rotations, the game last night, upon reflection...and based on your comment and the story on the D3 hoops front page...was a good time to evaluate his players and team under a good press and against a strong opponent.
The starting team has one FY guard and two senior guards.  Both Hardy and Voigt in past seasons have been off/scoring guards, IMHO.  They have not played full games in which they have had to handle the ball and distribute....run the offense.  I have commented that Amherst needs to find a reliable PG to distribute the ball and run the team and play DEFENSE.  There has been several FY players working at PG, it seems.  Last night, Voigt spent more time at point, imo, as the Saints went to a heavy press in the second half.  Voigt also was carrying the scoring load with Hardy.  When Bridget Crowley picked up fouls, there was need for Holiness to pick up the rebounding.  When Meg Robertson picked up her 4th foul, the other FY foward got some time.  When Voigt got her 5th foul, it was the experienced Hardy at the "point"....handling the ball, bringing up the ball.....a role she needed to step into....since Amherst did want to win the game.  Hardy was in for ALL 40 minutes!...and she came through....though I wish the foul shooting improves...it will.  In brief, the short rotation was there because the game dictated it with all the fouls called, and the defensive style the Saints was playing.  The new FY guards were being evaluated and the senior guards were also, imo, being evaluated in different "roles" in tough game situations.  A good early game for Coach G. to evaluate his talented players...new and experienced,,,under stress and often in new roles.  It was a game where Voigt fouled out, both experienced front line players had 4 fouls and basically a shooting guard having to play 40 minutes and being the prime ball-handling guard.....in a game that Amherst did not really have control until the last 3 minutes, I believe.
Amherst won the game and Coach G. has a better idea of what his team can do.....as well as how fast he needs to bring on his new players.   That is my take of the game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on December 06, 2012, 12:13:37 AM
Thanks for the scouting report, amh63. Maybe GP was trying out the shorter rotation since that's what he'll likely use down the stretch.  Whatever the reason, it was a good win for Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ECsaintsfan10 on December 06, 2012, 12:51:11 AM
I have to admit....I was quite impressed by the Emmanuel performance. Although Amherst came out on top- I think it proved that a GNAC team CAN compete with a NESCAC opponent. Emmanuel has struggled against Amherst for many years but I think this game proved they are strong competitors and relayed a message that if they were to meet again in the tourney they will not go out without a fight. I was quite impressed by both Bramante and Buijnowski. They were both a strong force. I am excited to watch the Tufts/Emmanuel game later this season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on December 06, 2012, 01:08:27 AM
Tufts is impressive.  Granted they haven't played anyone, but the defensive numbers their putting up are quite impressive.  I'm interesting to see their results of the 2 games this week against Boston (a surprising 5-1) and Bridgewater (now 6-1 who is 3-0 against the NESCAC so far).  They should beat Boston fairly easily, but @ Bridgewater on Saturday is probably their first test of the season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 06, 2012, 11:20:08 AM
ECsaintsfan10......I agree and you should be.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 06, 2012, 07:09:43 PM
Amherst beats a surprisingly game ECSU team at home 65-55.  The game was close at the half....Amherst ahead by 6.  Amherst's lead went up to 14 in the 2nd half but ESCU battled back and had the lead down to only 3 and often only 4.  One ECSU player......stats down/froze.... had between 25-30 plus points.  She made them inside and outside and over the bigger Amherst players.  The turnovers were about the same.  To many foul shots missed by ESCU.  Though Amherst seemed to dominate the boards....they missed a ton of inside/short shots.  Amherst hit more outside 3-point shots....though ESCU made more long 2-point shots it seems.  In any case it was a well fought game.  Everyone played for Amherst tonight.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 06, 2012, 07:54:40 PM
When you look at ECSU, their record doesn't demonstrate the close games they've had with strong teams.  I thought they might give Amherst a good game.  When you look at the stats, it becomes pretty clear that with a short bnch, the new players are going to have to come off the bench and score.  Hopefully this will happen as they become more comfortable with Amherst's offense .
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 08, 2012, 09:00:48 PM
Amherst wins big over visiting RPI tonight...74-43.  The Amherst starters led by Voigt with 19 built a big lead.  For more than 11 minutes in the 2nd half, it was reserves that played against RPI and they increased the lead.  Three of the reserves scored in double figures with one having 10 rebounds!  Other than Voigt, none of the other starters scored much.  Meg R. had 9 points, and Bridget C. had 4.  Jasmine Hardy who had a good game had no points.  Good game for the bench to get game experience.....with all the new players gaining confidence that they can be successful at the college level. 
The team with start playing after exams in a tournament....in Florida on the East Coast just south of Jacksonville.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 14, 2012, 11:00:07 AM
For the second year in a row, Amherst flies to a holiday time tourney to play an opponent that is just next door...WNE.  Game is in Daytona FL.    First game on Fri. Dec. 28. is against ranked Simpson in Iowa.  Amherst has a FY player from Iowa that starts at guard.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 28, 2012, 04:00:14 PM
Amherst beats Simpson in Daytona 62-60 in its first game after the end of the first semester/holidays.  It was a close game and although Amherst had a working margin of around 5 points in the last 5 minutes of the game, it was tied 60-60 with 20 seconds to go.  M Voigt who had 4 fouls and struggled with her shooting during the game, made the final shot with 2 seconds to go.  Amherst shooting was off, but won the rebounding battle.  Four Amherst players were limited by 4 fouls each as Simpson had many more foul attempts and shot well from the foul line and from the field.  Meg Robertson had a double-double with 12 rebounds and 12 points.  Bridget Crowley had 9 points and 12 rebounds.  Jasmine Hardy had a good all around game with 12 points and 7 rebounds.  Amherst's scoring was spread around.  Simpson was led by its top scorer Kate Neilsen who had 35 points  Both teams are ranked in the top 15 of Div.3.  It was a good test for Amherst against a fine ranked midwest team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on December 29, 2012, 09:54:45 AM
This game ought to give Amherst a shot of confidence as they head into NESCAC play.  A win on the road against another top ranked team when you're shooting is off and the fouls are mounting up is a "good" win.  All good teams learn to win "ugly" games. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 29, 2012, 03:28:12 PM
Amherst beats WNE today 69 to 45 in Florida.  Stats/recap to follow on the Amherst website.  Was at lunch when the rescheduled game started at noon.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 02, 2013, 07:15:12 AM
Thought I would try to inject some discussion beyond all Amherst all the time here.   It is always hard to tell how teams are off of the pre-season, but it looks like Tufts and Amherst will battle it out for the top spot in the conference.  Tufts has not played a very hard pre-season schedule, but still at 10-0, looks strong.  Amherst appears to have a great first five, but does not have teh depth it has had in the past.  It looks like Williams will be good again this year, especially if there big player can stay healthy. The number 4 spot seems to be a free for all.  It does not appear that any of the thre Maine teams (Bowdoin, Colby or Bates) are going to overpower anyone,  as those three teams will likely fall into the next three spots.  We will start to find out more this weekend as league play begins.  Good luck to all the teams, and looking forward to some good, entertaining basketball.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 02, 2013, 10:16:47 AM
Maine1......welcome aboard/back.  Your points about the upcoming conference contests agreed with my observations...based on the records to date.  Have watched a few of the other teams on the webcasts a bit but they have been few webcasts and of little interest to date.
This weekend results should hopefully bring on more posters from other schools.  Tufts was a team to watch last year and should be the "elephant" to hurdle again this year for Amherst.  I know....poor humor, but I couldn't miss the opportunity.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on January 03, 2013, 02:52:24 AM
Boston (9-2) and Bridgewater 8-2 aren't bad opponents.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 05, 2013, 10:20:59 AM
Had some trouble posting Amherst's close win over the Cardinals last night in Middletown.  It was a four point win and only a 2 point led at the half.  As the announcer so stated at the half and at the end of the game, it was an "ugly" game to watch.  The particulars on the game are on the Amherst website.  Here is my take.
The first half and the second half were quite similar.  Both teams had trouble scoring in the first half....with Wes. going 9 minutes without a point.  Amherst, shooting poorly goes ahead with good defense and takes a double digit lead only to have Wes. rally back in the last few minutes of the half.  In the second half, Wes. goes 11 minutes without a point and Amherst goes ahead by at least 18 points...even doubling the Wes.score and then lets down its defense and becomes sloppy with the ball in the last few minutes.....allowing Wes. to rally.  Amherst had a poor shooting night, with Jasmine Hardy not scoring from outside and from the foul line.  Points came mainly from only three players....Voigt, Robertson and Crowley.  Both teams had about the same number of boards and shot only in the low 20% range for the game, poorly from the foul line and made too many turnovers.  Amherst had control of the game for the most part except near the end of both halves.  Amherst's coach had to re-insert both Bridget and Megan back in the game near the end of the game as Wes. was getting too many 2nd chance shots....and making them.  Too many OF rebounds by Wes. and TO's by Amherst.  The key to Amherst's win was its defense with blocks and steals.  Megan Robertson had 12 points and 17 rebounds along with at least 5/6 blocks!
Concerned with the number of times Megan was knocked to the ground!  She is double teamed after getting a rebound and often pushed around. Noticed that Amherst players were slipping and falling down while making cuts.  I point this out since there were also too many slips in the earlier men's game by players....a floor problem?
Hope the Amherst women play well in today's away game at the Camel's den.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on January 05, 2013, 11:48:31 AM
Thanks, Amh63.

What's your take on the Jeffs' No. 7 ranking?  Too high?  Too low? Just right?

I'm having a hard time gauging this team, particularly because of the lack of depth.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 05, 2013, 02:11:07 PM
Gordanmann.....putting pressure on me when my heart and mind may conflict with respect to the Amherst team.  First, it is interesting to note that yesterday's matchups between the "CAC" teams all ended up within 5 points or less.  I state this because your question is based on "relative" factors/considerations......such as wins-loses, opponents rankings, home and away games, etc.  Tufts, the other highly ranked conference team had a 4-5 point win at home against Williams yesterday.  Williams maybe a stronger team on paper than Wes., but what factors do you use to rank them?
To the heart of your question.....depth.  Coach G. has a history of fielding "small number teams" and often has a short rotation of players.  It was only after losing to Wash U. several years ago in the NCAA in OT....when Amherst's players ran out of gas....that , IMO, had Coach G. use more players in games during the following season...to have more depth.  Also depth is a over-rated term, imo.  Talented depth, is a truer gage vice a bench depth based on players.  Last year's deep bench and talent seniors may have clouded the view of this year's team a little.
Amherst needs more experienced players. Amherst starts a FY guard from IOWA that scores little and is learning to be a PG.  Voigt, imo, is not comfortable being the primary distributor of the ball.  She is doing well at that role but sometimes, like last night, she tried tOO hard and made some judgement mistakes near the end of the game.  When, Coach G. put in the other FY players, there were many mental mistakes made....bad passes, poor defense, etc.  The talent is there in the FY players....for Coach G. knows talent.  At present, he does not have a player to go to when a starter has a bad day, not hitting shots, gets into foul trouble....not like years past.  Coach McGuire at UNC would recruit Irish players from NYC.  He was known to replace starters when the offense sputtered....to find the HOT shooting Irishman. 
I will state that Amherst's present ranking is OK for now....considering how other higher ranked teams around the country are having hard games, etc.  When Amherst's FY players...on the bench....starts stepping up and gets game experiences....learning from their mistakes, and they will learn....then Amherst will have greater depth...so to speak.  I believe that Amheerst by the end of the regular season will be there to challenge for the "CAC" title and do well in the post season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 05, 2013, 04:22:04 PM
Seems to me the NESCAC overall is a little down this year, but time will tell.  The 7th rank could be a bit high when you consider that Voigt, Crowley, and Hardy haven't played that many minutes due to the depth Amherst has had in the past.  They did get to practice against that depth though, so I agree with Amh63 that things will come together as the year progresses and they all have more minutes together under their belt.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 05, 2013, 05:17:52 PM
Am I missing something or do others have trouble picking up games on iPads even when clicking on stream for mobile device.  Also Amherst men's score is in women's score and currently I live stats.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 05, 2013, 06:17:43 PM
Amherst wins a close one against Conn. College in New London.  Score was 50-48....with a last second 3-pointer by Conn. cut a 5 point lead to two.  Again Amherst's defense carried them when their offense sputter....again.  Amherst lost the battle on the boards 39-31.  Strange game at times.  Hardy seemed reluctant to shoot after not scoring a point and going 0-4 from outside yesterday.  Today, she made her foul shots and made two critical 3-pointers, including a rare four point play.....being fouled while shooting a 3-pointer. In fact, I believe she scored 6 points straight and gave Amherst a lead after being down 5 points with around 4 minutes to go.  M. Voigt who had to sit with 4 fouls came back to make 4 straight foul shots giving Amherst a 5-point lead with about 9 seconds to go in the game.  Meg Robertson had 10 points and 5 rebounds and must have blocked 4 or 5 shots.....but only credited for one....and altered several more.  Voigt had double figures also as did Hardy.  Crowley had 9 points but was saddled early with 4 fouls.  Amherst got no points from its other starter in FY guard Pritchard.  Need some reliable scoring from somewhere in the future as teams learn to play physical against Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 05, 2013, 06:23:14 PM
Sumfun....based on my limited experience with my wife's IPAD, many of the broadcasts cannot interface with the IOS6 on Apple's mobile device well....one has to download an app...free in general.  Found that out in a MBB webcast.  This difficulty should change as more webcasts are updated.....some webcasts does not do well with Apple products without an outside "helper" software.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 05, 2013, 07:49:23 PM
After seeing the scores of the two Amherst games, I am wondering if those scores are a reflection of the quality of the current Amherst squad, significant improvement by both Wesleyan and Conn College, or both.  Looks like Williams and Tufts had good weekends to start the NESCAC season
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 05, 2013, 08:55:04 PM
Maine 1.....only time will tell.  Over on the MBB board, Midd. had two close....very close wins at Bates and at Tufts.  Your comment wrt Amherst here could apply to the Midd. men's team.  My take is that Conn.'s has some FY players that will get more time soon based on the game I watched against Amherst.  With respect to Wes.....Amherst's had more control of the game and Wes. started to make everything they threw up near the end of the game.  Both games were away games for Amherst.  All the WBB matches had close games on Friday.  The ninth ranked Tufts team only won by 5 at home against Williams.  Is that a reflection of the Tufts team? Who knows.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescachoopsfan2 on January 06, 2013, 12:46:52 AM
Having followed NESCAC basketball for the last few years, I feel this is definitely a down year for the league. Two factors:
1.) There aren't as many quality teams as years past. The NESCAC sent five teams to the 2010 NCAA Tourney, four to the 2011 Tourney, and three to the 2012 Tourney (though remember that Colby probably should have made it). This year, it seems like it will be tough to make an at-large case for anyone outside of Amherst, Williams, and Tufts - every other team in the league already has between 4 and 8 losses.
2.) The top of the conference, starting with Amherst, isn't as dominant. That's not intended as a knock against Amherst - but more just the reality of what happens when you graduate five all-NESCAC players in two years. Still a very dangerous and very well-coached team, but not nearly as deep as they've been recently. The fact that they only played 7 players and got only 4 bench points against a perennial bottom-half-of-the-league team like Conn. College shows how reliant they are on their starting five - very different from the Amherst teams of recent years that had a lot of experience (Lem Atanga McCormick, Jackie Renner, Marcia Voigt, etc.) coming off the bench. Still wouldn't bet against a G.P. Gromacki-coached team, but just doesn't strike me as that totally dominant, very balanced Amherst team of the last few seasons.

As for the weekend, Tufts probably could/should have won by bigger margins against Williams and Middlebury - but it shouldn't be discounted that those were their third and fourth games of the week. I also don't think a win by "only" four against Williams is somehow a poor reflection of Tufts. Williams has received top-25 votes the entire season, and they entered Friday with just one loss (by one point to a Bridgewater St. team that's performed very well against several NESCAC opponents this year). So I don't think Tufts' close win against Williams was all that comparable to Amherst's close win against Wesleyan.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 06, 2013, 07:24:06 AM
would agree in general with nescachoops fan. I think the Tufts win over what appears to be a strong Williams team, even though close, would seem to indicate that Tufts is a strong team.  Much more difficult to understand Amherst's close wins at Wesleyan and Conn College.  It maybe that we are going to see a new number one team out of the NESCAC in 2013
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: joe8579 on January 06, 2013, 07:26:39 AM
Quote from: amh63 on January 05, 2013, 08:55:04 PM
My take is that Conn.'s has some FY players that will get more time soon based on the game I watched against Amherst.  With respect to Wes.....Amherst's had more control of the game and Wes. started to make everything they threw up near the end of the game.  Both games were away games for Amherst.  All the WBB matches had close games on Friday.  The ninth ranked Tufts team only won by 5 at home against Williams.  Is that a reflection of the Tufts team? Who knows.
What kind of reflection is it that Tufts only beat Conn by 32 earlier this week - at Conn? You just can't read that much into single games.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescachoopsfan2 on January 06, 2013, 09:38:36 AM
Quote from: Maine1 on January 06, 2013, 07:24:06 AM
It maybe that we are going to see a new number one team out of the NESCAC in 2013

At the very least, I think there's much more competition for the top spot than in season's past, when Amherst had a stranglehold on the NESCAC and was the undisputed top team in the league. The combination of Amherst graduating four starters from last year's Final Four team, Tufts gaining an infusion of young talent (including three sophomores who are starting for them this year), and Williams bringing back a very strong class of current seniors has made the top a lot more muddled than in recent years.

I, too, am hesitant to make too big a deal out of one or two results from this weekend, as Amherst's body of work is very strong and back-to-back NESCAC games on the road are always difficult. That being said, Amherst's lack of bench production this weekend against two of the lesser opponents in the league is a red flag, at the very least.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 06, 2013, 11:03:50 AM
Nice to see all the "new" posters on the board.  Points raised and opinions, imo, are well taken....thought out.
If the focus is on the present Amherst squad.....I agree that there are shortcomings so far as shown up this weekend.  Does Coach G. wish he had more experience players to go to....sure...as do all coaches.  I could point out many shortcomings on this team....when it is compared with the teams of the past few years.  However it is now 2013 and not 2010 or 2011, etc.  The teams in the "CAC" are also changing, improving with new young players.  It is always surprising to me in WBB that contests between "good" teams and "poor" teams often end up in blowouts.  Blowouts meaning by 25 points and up.  Last year in a tournament in Vegas, Amherst won by over 60 points that proved meaningless as a learning experience...even for the bench players,imho.....but does change the stats for the team.  In the MBB games there are often more unexpected close games than blowouts.  Go read the Pathernation writeup of Midd.'s 1 point win against Tufts.  Tufts new players are given due credit, Midd.'s experienced starters are questioned, etc.  In short, even top players have good days and bad days. 
Last year, in a road trip weekend in Maine, the Amherst team struggled in several games, I believe.....and Colby was given credit as it should have.  This weekend, Amherst's offense struggled....NOT the defense....as pointed out by the Conn. announcer.  We as posters point out how Amherst is down this year....which is true at this point of the season.....and
not give credit to the Cardinals and Camels play.
I guess, I am trying to say that as followers of WBB, we may have a different set of criteria for WBB than for MBB.  Is it not possible that women games will have fewer blowouts as WBB teams pull closer in talent and coaching?
I have a few concerns about Amherst....but I will not post them here.  I will wait for the players and Coach G. to work them out as this year's team continue to improve...gain experience and discover its TEAM identity.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 06, 2013, 05:10:08 PM
I think we may have a long way to go in those terms -- there are so many part-time head coaches in Division III women's basketball that it is ripe for blowouts. There's a wide spread of teams in terms of not only talent but time commitment to the program.

A coach once described it to me this way: At almost every Division III school with men's basketball, it's a featured program, taken very seriously. But it's not like that in women's basketball.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bsc73 on January 06, 2013, 08:06:08 PM
I'm not sure what coach would make a statement like that but he/she is obviously not from New England. I'm not aware of any school in New England that has a full time men's coach and a part time women's coach. I'm also not aware of any school making their men's team the featured program. Is there a school that gives more money to their men's program, is there a school that gives more money to their men's program for recruiting, is there a school that hires more assistant coaches for their men's program? I believe the answer to those questions and any similar questions is no. If there are programs that are  favoring their men's program then shame on the women's coach.  The reason that there are more blowouts in women's basketball is simple: there are fewer good female basketball players then men. There are the same number of women's teams as men's (actually more) but fewer talented female players, thus more blowouts.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 07, 2013, 01:01:34 PM
Quote from: bsc73 on January 06, 2013, 08:06:08 PM
I'm not sure what coach would make a statement like that but he/she is obviously not from New England. I'm not aware of any school in New England that has a full time men's coach and a part time women's coach. I'm also not aware of any school making their men's team the featured program. Is there a school that gives more money to their men's program, is there a school that gives more money to their men's program for recruiting, is there a school that hires more assistant coaches for their men's program? I believe the answer to those questions and any similar questions is no. If there are programs that are  favoring their men's program then shame on the women's coach.  The reason that there are more blowouts in women's basketball is simple: there are fewer good female basketball players then men. There are the same number of women's teams as men's (actually more) but fewer talented female players, thus more blowouts.

Maybe not in the NESCAC, but there are about 80 women's teams in New England. Not everyone is nearly as well-funded as a NESCAC school is.

I pulled up the U.S. Department of Education's athletics funding data site and I didn't have to go very far into the alphabet to find a school in New England that meets my definition: Albertus Magnus, where the men's coach is a full-time employee of the school and the women's coach is not.

If this link works (http://ope.ed.gov/athletics/InstDetails.aspx?756e697469643d31323834393826796561723d323031312673656172636843726974657269613d33343364323734333534323732633230323734643435323732633230323734643431323732633230323734653438323732633230323735323439323732633230323735363534323732363335336432373336323732633237333732373236373236343734336433313266333732663332333033313333323033313332336133353335336133353338323035303464267264743d312f372f323031332031323a35353a353820504d), then click on Coaching Staff and Salaries from there.

Bridgewater State also met that criteria, as did others. I spot-checked non-NESCAC schools.

Your point is also correct, I believe, about there being fewer quality players to draw from, but it's not the only reason.

And I would shame the athletic directors and the people actually making the budget rather than a women's coach at an underfunded program. He or she likely does not have the power to force the school to make it a full-time position.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 08, 2013, 07:32:59 PM
Amherst goes on another road trip tonight....to Long Island NY to meet Farmingdale State.  Amherst gets more offensive effort from the whole team and wins 72-48.  Scoring in double figures by M. Robertson, J. Hardy and M. Voigt.  Team had 3-point shots made by 4 players.  Team controlled the boards as expected over the shorter opponents.  Particulars to be posted on the Amherst website.  A surprise return from an experienced player.....Sally Marx entered the game after a long absence.  Good news to have more "depth" on the team.  One more road trip to meet Hamilton in Clinton NY on Friday.....then a long home stand of critical games.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on January 08, 2013, 08:01:52 PM
Sorry to report amh63...Sally Marx is not back.  Must have been a bad stat.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 08, 2013, 08:36:35 PM
NH NESCAC Fan....Thanks for the update.  Nice to hear from you....even if you are bringer of sad news.  I had looked at the roster before the game on the Amherst website.   While "watching" the Live Stats...if you can call it that..late in the 2nd half, Sally's name was on the players' list.  I went to the "players on the floor" visual but she was not there. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on January 08, 2013, 11:21:06 PM
amh63...will you be going to any games this year?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 11, 2013, 09:57:35 PM
Amherst wins another "ugly" game on the road against Hamilton.....50-43.   How bad!  It was Hamilton 23 to 12 over Amherst at the half......yes, Amherst scores only 12 points as no starters could score and Meg Robertson sitting with 3 fouls.  M. Voigt had 2 points and it was S. Holness coming off the bench with 8 points in the first half....going 4-4 from the foul line.  In the second half, Voigt led the comeback with 14 points and Holness getting 10 more in the second half to lead the team with 18 points.  Meg Robertson comes back and scores several baskets but goes to the bench with 4-fouls somewhere by the middle of the half.  Amherst steps up on defense and even gets the rebounds as the Continentials had out rebounded Amherst in the first half.  Bridget Crowley plays well in the 2nd half and aids in the comeback.   Maybe it was the long ride to Clinton...as the Lady Jeffs played with no bounce and were generally flat.  They were out shot and out hustled in the first .....but with more energy, they held their opponent to 20 points in the second while scoring 38 themselves.   Coach G used more players from his bench....trying to get something going and I could see the younger players playing smarter and with more confidence late in the game.  Amherst shot only around 17% in the first half.  Both teams ended with only 2 outside shots made in the game and shot in the low 30% for the game overall.  Amherst had more rebounds, blocks and played better defense.  In the second half, Amherst composure was evident as the Hamilton players made more turnovers and rushed their shots......after Amherst took the lead and even got it to double figures several times.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 12, 2013, 08:37:16 AM
Based on what we have seen so far, it would appear that Tufts is the class of the NESCAC this season.  Amherst continues to struggle (third game in a row, so there is a trend here).  Tufts had beaten Williams, and handled Bowdoin at Bowdoin last night.  It does appear the Conn College may be up and coming.  The top three teams will likely be Tufts, Williams and Amherst (not necessarily in that order) and then my sense is that the next five spots could fall to any of the remaining 11 teams. Hamilton looks like it is playing in tough luck, with three very close losses, so they may have dug themselves a bit of a hole. The Bates-Bowdoin game today will could have a big impact on the overall results.  Bates won earlier this year in Lewiston, but this game is at Bowdoin.
Overall, the league is definitely down from prior years.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescachoopsfan2 on January 12, 2013, 10:08:36 AM
Yes, perhaps not the prettiest win for Amherst, but I think it's a good sign that they were able to rally and win despite getting only 15 minutes from Megan Robertson (who, although only a sophomore, is still a leading NESCAC Player of the Year candidate, in my opinion). According to the stats, Robertson went to the bench with her fourth foul with 10:51 left and Amherst trailing by 6. Very tenuous situation for Amherst, but Savannah Holness came in for Robertson and contributed 10 points on 4-4 shooting over the final 8 minutes. Doesn't appear as though Robertson returned to the game, which tells you how well Holness played. Should be a confidence builder for Amherst to see someone outside the starting five step up as Holness did last night, albeit against a middling Hamilton team.

Williams continues to look very impressive. They have four of the top 20 scorers in the conference, only two (very close) losses, and wide margins of victory in almost all their other games - including last night against Wesleyan. Hard to believe they're not in the top 25.

Agree with Maine1 that Williams, Amherst, and Tufts are the top 3, but I don't think Tufts is necessarily the clear-cut favorite. Williams played a great second half against Tufts and nearly rallied twice from double-digit deficits before coming up short. That game could have had a much different outcome if Williams had not dug itself a hole over the first 25 minutes or so. Meanwhile, Tufts hasn't beaten Amherst in at least five years and has to go to LeFrak on the second half of a back-to-back NESCAC to try to end that spell. Would not at all be surprised if Tufts wound up being the best in the league this year, but I feel that Williams and Amherst are right there with them.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 12, 2013, 10:13:24 AM
Maine1....good points all.  Have not seen Tufts play this season....though at this point in the season, will have to agree with you.  Don't know if your analyses will apply when the "CAC" tournament time arrives  Amherst, imo, after watching a very poor effort in the first half, where no one could make even a layup, showed me in the second half some hope that they CAN become a very good team as the season progress.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 12, 2013, 10:25:49 AM
NH NESCAC Fan,,,,,missed your post earlier.  My present schedule has me up for the Bates/Tufts games in early Feb.  I make my annual trip to Florida soon after and hope to make some tournament games in LeFrak later in the season.  Go visit your Father -in-law then and make an appearance in LeFrak....for the Tufts game.  My treat to snacks!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 13, 2013, 08:13:37 AM
Another interesting weekend in the Conference.  Middlebury rebounds with a good win after losing to Conn College on Friday.  Tufts defense smothers Colby (Tufts wins by 14, even though they are out shot from the arc by a margin of 24-3 ).  Watched a bit of that game on-line, and Tufts is very strong on defense.  Surprised by the Bates win over Bowdoin, but Bates two wins over the Maine teams this weekend could be very large in tie-breakers down the line.  Trinity at Hamilton today will be interesting.  Hamilton is due for a win.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 13, 2013, 01:13:00 PM
Speaking of Tufts fine season under Coach Carla Burube...now 15-0, will pass along a story from the now legendary HC of UConn's WBB team. I'm a fan of the UConn WBB program.   The head coach on his weekly TV show was told that his former player Carla had reached 200 wins faster than he did at UCONN. His "tongue-in-cheek", dry humor reply....paraphrasing here a bit..."Carla did it because she coaches SMART players at Tufts.  I had to coach dumb players like Carla here at UConn." Carla played on a national championship team at Storrs CT. and was a starter, I believe.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 14, 2013, 07:49:30 PM
Amherst wins big  over Kean in NJ...81-53.  Five players were in double figures for Amherst leading to the "blowout" against a Kean team that seems to be having a down year.  Kean was led by senior guard Erika Jones who had 34 points and 12 rebounds....shooting 5-9 from the outside in the first half alone.  Amherst led 42-30 at the half.  Amherst's pick up its defense in the second half...pulling away to a 30 plus point lead.  Jones had to return to the game after a rest....due to little offensive support from her team mates.  Every one on Amherst's team entered the game.  The taller Amherst team dominated the rebounds, led by Jasmine Hardy who had double figure rebounds along with her 15 points....mainly from outside shots.  Robertson led the team with blocks and joined B. Crowley, M. Voigt, and S. Holeness with double figure points.  Crowley and Holeness also approached getting double figure rebounds. 
More specific and accurate stats will be posted on the Amherst website soon.
Now Amherst will have a long home stand with two conference teams awaiting this weekend.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 18, 2013, 07:36:39 PM
Nice win for Williams tonight over Babson, at Babson.  Williams won by 20, and appeared to dominate the game opening up a big lead at the half.  Williams shot extremely well from 3, and shot well over all.  Should get Williams back into the top 25 next week.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 18, 2013, 09:53:29 PM
Amherst gets a workout today against Bowdoin for a half.  Amherst wins in LeFrak 74-58, but it was the Polar Bears 36-30 at the half.  S. Lorrey of Bowdoin scored 15 points all from the arc.  Amherst was letting her shoot and struggled as Bowdoin put up an energetic defense on Amherst and missed a number of inside shots.  In the second half, it was the complete opposite.  Amherst quickly ties the score and goes ahead with inside shots and outside shots by Voigt and Hardy.  Hardy goes 5-9 from beyond and Amherst's defense shuts out Bowdoin.  Megan Robertson makes a ton of blocks and Amherst causes the Bears to foul......With less than 10 minutes to go Bowdoin had 8 fouls and it was soon 10 fouls...Amherst's defense was tight and yet had few fouls.  By the 3 minute mark, with Amherst by a 10-12 points margin....Bowdoin starts to foul....Voigt going to the foul lane or Robertson and Crowley going to the line and it was soon over.  Better recap and more specific stats to be posted on the Amherst website soon.  Four starters scored in double figures and Crowley led with 10 rebounds with Robertson closely behind with 9.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 19, 2013, 07:24:33 AM
Some observations after another interesting Friday night in the NESCAC (caught parts of some games on internet).  I thought Bowdoin looked very good for one half against Amherst (I was actually surprised), but it appears Amherst wore Bowdoin down in the second half.  I believe that Bowdoin is a bit better than the current 1-3 record.   Good second half form Amherst.  Tufts continues to dominate.  The Tufts-Amherst game will be very interesting, as will this weeks Amherst-Williams match. Hamilton finally came out on top of a close game, and is clearly a competitive team.  Conn College had a very impressive win at Bates (always a tough place to play). Trinity looked ready to blow Colby out, but Colby came back, but doesn have enough offensive power on its team right now. Althought Trinity is currently 3-1 in the league, they do have all the strong teams ahead of them. It continues to look like Tufts, Williams and Amherst are the clear top 3 teams in the league,  but 4-8 is wide open.  The second half with be very interesting.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 20, 2013, 10:34:33 AM
Amherst beats Colby at home yesterday 69-60.  The particular are on the Amherst website.  The game was as the announcer stated soon over early in the second half.  Both sides cleared the bench.....Colby having a 14-2 run to cut the Amherst lead to only nine.  For Amherst, it was a good game for its FY players.  Amherst had four double point scorers.....two were by FY guards and one by the backup front court player, S. Holeness...who has been coming up big lately as she has been getting more time on the floor.  Meg Robertson was on the floor for only 17 minutes as she has been taking a few tumbles lately.  Colby had some game players but were clearly not a threat to upset Amherst.  Amherst had been looking for more scorers...especially from outside.  Finally, the FY guards....getting more floor time and confidence of late has started to provide points....inside and outside.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 20, 2013, 11:52:37 AM
I did watch the first half of the Colby-Amherst game.  I was actually surprised by the final score, as although I thought Colby played the best half of basketball it had played in a while, they were still down by 17 at the half. Presumably the final score was not indicative of the game.  Robertson did not look good, and although Amherst did hit a good number of threes, they also missed quite a few very badly. 
Overall for the NESCAC, it looks like there is a large gap between Williams/Tufts/Amherst, and the rest of the league right now.  Trinity's win over Bowdoin was a bit of a surprise.  Next week's Colby-Bowdoin game could be a critical game for those teams in the fight for the eighth and final spot in the playoffs
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Hoop Guy on January 20, 2013, 02:20:15 PM
Williams and Tufts are clearly the class of the NESCAC this year.  Amherst is ranked high, but it is a reputation ranking it seems, as it seems like they "could" lose many games.  Credit to them that they have not yet, but I will be very surprised if they have a winning record in the two Williams and one Tufts games coming up.  They lose at least two of those three games I think.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on January 20, 2013, 06:20:06 PM
Amherst is still up there, until they get beaten their still the favorites, imo.
Williams is lucky in that the game that "counts" comes in Chandler gym in Williamstown (though in that rivalry all the games count whether its a NESCAC meeting or not) HOWEVER with that said I think if Amherst loses this year its to Tufts even though that game is in Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MVP on January 21, 2013, 05:40:59 PM

Congratulations to Williams on making the d3 Top 25 for week 8 !!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 23, 2013, 10:58:46 PM
Amherst had a nip and tuck battle with Williams in LeFrak tonight.  Amherst prevailed 54-68, in a game that was not decided until late in the second half.  Williams led by one, 26-25 at the half.....and the game remained back and forth until Amherst built leads of 4-7 points in the last quarter of the 2nd half.  Amherst's defense tighten in the 2nd half...as usual and led by steady senior play of Crowley, Voigt and Hardy and strong effort from Holness, Pritchard and Meg Robertson...Amherst countered every Williams run.  Amherst won the rebound battle against an overall taller Williams team....Williams had more blocks...Amherst more steals.  Amherst shot a little better overall and had more foul shots as Williams fouled to get the ball back in the last few minutes.
The win streak in LeFrak for Amherst goes to 74!...tonight in the game that does not count in the conference standing....but for the "Little Three" title.  Rematch in Chandler at the end of the regular season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 24, 2013, 06:31:44 AM
Nice win for Amherst. tough loss for Williams. Caught the second half of the game.  The game was very tighly played, but I did not think either team played particularly well.  Both teams struggled shooting the ball, partly due to good defense, but also many missed open shots. It seemed like Williams forgot about Baecher for much of the second half.  These are two pretty evenly match teams, so I would not be surprised to see Williams win the league game at Williams. The other thing to note is that neither of these teams has any real depth, as Williams only had two players off the bench with more than 10 minutes, and Amherst really only played 6 players.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 24, 2013, 04:22:45 PM
Maine1.....good observations.
From by years of watching D3 BB, there is a tendency for Coaches to shorten their sub list when games are tight and when they are critical ones.  Unless, a starter is obvious tired, gets to many fouls, there is a injury and a bad mismatch...coaches avoid inserting new players regardless who they have on the bench.
Last night's game was both tight throughout, and a critical one for "The Little Three" title.
One has to remember that in the case of Amherst, they have only a 10 player team.  Of the 5 starters, one is a FY player. Game experience is important and recently that FY player is starting to contribute, imo, offensively....soon to join the other 5 players capable of scoring in double figures in any game.
In a OH By The Way note....two of Amherst's starters were selected ROY in the "CAC"....let you figure who they are via their play.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 24, 2013, 05:52:46 PM
 amh 63 I have been following the NESCAC for about 7-8 years nows, I believe both Robertson and Voight for ROY in the league, although that awards does not always go to the best first year.  Both of those players definitely were deserving, althoug Manduca from Colby had a very strong year with a good team during Voight's rookie year.
On the depth, I was really thinking about prior Amherst teams, that were able to bring three or four front line players off the bench.  This team does not have anything close.  So although I agree that in tight games coaches will shorten the bench, last night the bench did not exist.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: joe8579 on January 24, 2013, 10:13:07 PM
I don't know of any coach that would want their three starting guards to play those kinds of minutes, especially playing back-to-back games like the NESCAC does. Granted, this was a mid-week game, but still, 38+ minutes from two perimeter players and all 40 from your best scorer?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on January 25, 2013, 09:48:28 PM
I don't know how they keep pulling them out.  They are short-handed, their leading scorer is shooting 37% from the field and less than 30% from 3 point range, they were shorter than Williams across the board the other night.  The starters log more minutes than is ideal.  Their best three point shooter has had three games, I think, where she hasn't had her shot.  They clearly aren't undefeated because of their offense.  Must be the D.  Will that be good enough against Williams again, and Tufts?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 25, 2013, 10:47:02 PM
NH NESCAC Fan.....You have "revealed" the key factor, IMO....Defensive intensity and players that buy into the idea that players must play good defense to get on the floor.  Defense is hard work and not always given its dues and is not as appreciated to the casual fan as critical for any winning season and a fine team.  An example is in the Bowdoin game.  Down by 6 in the first half...36-30, I believe.  The senior guards seemed out of sorts.  J. Hardy couldn't come close to hitting from outside and M. Voigt even missed two chippy layouts..first one, got the rebound and missed the second one without a defender nearby.  After the half.....it was another story.  Bowdoin's outside shots stopped dropping...mainly due to better defense.  Amherst won the game by 16 or so...check the stats.  Jasmine goes 5-9 from beyond the arc.  In another game and the Williams game, Jasmine still seemed reluctant to shoot and her shots were off....but she played defense, got rebounds and assists.  The FY guards started to contribute as well, both hitting threes and driving for lay ups.  The FY guard starter even scored in double figures.  Meanwhile, defense and senior leadership won the games.  Defense is tough to play and takes energy.
This year's team can and will win games....not by blow outs like previous years when Amherst indeed had great depth.  Even last year,  in the road trips to Maine, with 6 seniors on the team and great depth, Amherst had close games. 
Yes, Williams stacked the lineup in the last game with tall players and players that had great range in their shots....and high percentage from 3-point range.  Their primary scorers did not score much and shot poorly relative to their stats.
To the previous posters that questioned the need to have Amherst guards on the floor for so long.....look at the box.
Williams guards..starters had almost equal time on the floor.  Cook had 39 minutes and their floor general...senior Harding had almost 35.  The third guard was taken out for the normal 6th "man" so to speak...Rhenquist, also a senior who is Williams best 3-point shooter.  Rhenquist is a regular rotated player , in for offense.  She tried a number of times to back down Amherst's FY guard with her size and experience and had more failures than success.  What is more telling is that Williams' best and tallest front court players...Beecher and Rainer...both seniors, I believe, ALSO spent around 35 minutes on the floor.  How about questioning Williams coach about her rotation policy.  Williams did rotate in a FY player with alot of energy and aggression....Much like Holness of Amhesrt who came in to relieve Robertson.  S. Holeness is stepping up with her defense and her offense underneath.  She matched Williams FY front court player rough play.  Williams Fy player from NYC picked up 4 fouls.
This year the wins just gets harder to obtain.  Still, the new players are coming along.  They need time on the floor to gain their confidence.  I hope the game with Trinity will be easier and the new players will gain some floor time.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 26, 2013, 07:16:46 AM
Always good to have some discussion.  Would love to see it expand beyond Amherst.  I agree with the previous post that the big difference with Amherst is outstanding defense, and has been since Gromacki has been there.  The other major difference, is that Gromacki is far and away the best coach in the conference, so that even in a year like this year, where he really doesn't have significantly more talent then others,Amherst is likely to come out on top in most of these close games.  Trinity has been playing well over the past few weeks, and given Amherst's struggles with Conn College and Hamilton, this game could be closer than you would think.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on January 26, 2013, 09:00:36 AM
Or not.  It depends on whether Jekyll or Hyde shows up.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 26, 2013, 06:10:37 PM
Amherst picks apart a game Trinity team...67-47 in LeFrak.  It was 38-18 at the half.  Trinity played better in the second half and had the lead down to as low as 14 but with the "bench" in,  finished the game strong.  Amherst used 9 players in the game and 8 scored.  Trinity had only one double figure scorer and Amherst had three with the FY starter scoring 9....all from beyond the arc....going 3-4 from outside.  Amherst had three FY guards play significant minutes and they all hit from outside the arc!  Voigt and Holness led the team with 13 points apiece, while Meg Robertson had 11 points, 8 rebounds, 6 blocks, steals, etc. while playing around 27 minutes.  It seems in my bias eyes that Amherst is trying to get its transition game going and with the young guards coming along, maybe it will be in place come tournament time.  As usual, Amherst played solid defense.  The only weakness shown today in foul shooting, as Amherst shot a higher percentage from outside than from the foul line.   Coach G. will have them working hard on that.  All the players played with energy.  Trinity only took 3 outside shots and made two....all in the 2nd half.  The Bantams inside game was hit and miss....see Meg's 6 blocks. Solid win tonight.....game never in doubt...more productive time on the floor among the FY players.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 27, 2013, 07:38:51 AM
Next weekend will be a big one in the NESCAC.  Huge game out a LeFrak on Saturday with Tufts at Amherst.  Tufts appears to be the class of the league, but winning at LeFrak is almost impossible.  Williams has to make the tought trip to Bowdoin and Colby.  Neither of these two  teams (Bowdoin or Colby) are very strong this year.  They played a high scoring game yesterday (primarily it appeared because of very soft defense on both sides).   I see Trinity battling an up and down Bates teams for the number four spot in the conference, so the Trinity-Bates games next weekend is also very important.  The fight for the 6-8 spots is wide open right now, and even Hamilton can get themselves back into the picture here with wins over Conn and Wesleyan next week. 

Lots of exciting basketball coming up.  Might take a ride out to Lefrak next week.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescachoopsfan2 on January 27, 2013, 08:55:10 AM
Four teams (Bates, Tufts, Amherst, and Trinity) have swept the Bowdoin-Colby weekend this year. Don't foresee a team the caliber of Williams having problems with it, either.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 27, 2013, 10:45:16 AM
Maine1....Seems that several other posters on this board will be at LeFrak next weekend, including me.  One poster notified me that I should wear some identified outfit for recognition such as a suit of armor, etc......then followed up with a comment that an Amherst player's father wants to meet me.  Should I be worried?  Hope to have a big body guard.....my host and driver is an admirer of Tufts' coach.  My host supports/follows UCONN WBB.
A question to you.....is there a particular favorite Maine school that you have.....do want to minimize my stepping on toes.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 27, 2013, 11:02:16 AM
amh63
Not surprised that a few posters will be in Amherst next week--since most of the posters are Amherst fans.
I am a Colby fan-down year for them, primarily due to the significant drop in recruiting over the past three years since McBride left.
Don't worry about stepping on toes-just keep everything constructive
Also, I agree that Williams should not have trouble with Colby/Bowdoin, but they have good teams in the past that have struggled on that trip. Tufts is likely the top team in the league, and both Colby and Bowdoin played them tough in Maine.  The Trinity/Amherst games were on the road.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on January 27, 2013, 02:32:00 PM
don't be too sure about Williams success up in Maine next weekend....they don't have the mind-set of an Amherst...wouldn't be at all surprised if 1-1.....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on January 28, 2013, 01:36:16 PM
No worries, amh63.  The suit of armor was meant as an identifier, not a passive protection method.   ;D
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 28, 2013, 08:34:24 PM
Today on the MBB "CAC" board, the head Admin. of D3Hoops, Pat Colman, posted that he planned to be in LeFrak on Sat.   My take is that the visit is to see the women's game more so than the men's....being that they are ranked no. 4 and no.5 in the latest polls.
All the more merrier, I say!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on January 28, 2013, 11:22:23 PM
Smith tops Williams tonight. Hersey is a real up and comer as a coach--have watched her for several years now.....after Amherst dissed her ( although they obviously did OK with Gromacki!),   look what she has done at Smith, which was pitiful prior to her arrival. Looks like Williams started their Maine trip a few days early.  They just never stretch themselves. Generally pretty talented but a little adversity and down they go.  Make that 0-2 in Maine.  Sorry, but they are sooooo frustrating.,,,,get someone like Hersey in there to coach the Ephs.,,,you would see a huge change for the better.   If anyone has watched Smith play I think you would agree with me that Hersey has gotten more out of very average talent than I have seen in quite a while.  They are intense....starting with the kid Quatrocchi who is a warrior.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 29, 2013, 01:21:23 AM
Quote from: amh63 on January 28, 2013, 08:34:24 PM
Today on the MBB "CAC" board, the head Admin. of D3Hoops, Pat Colman, posted that he planned to be in LeFrak on Sat.   My take is that the visit is to see the women's game more so than the men's....being that they are ranked no. 4 and no.5 in the latest polls.
All the more merrier, I say!

Probably true -- also, we'll be teaming up with D3Cast to broadcast the game live.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 29, 2013, 09:51:40 PM
Watched the game at the start and near the end of the first half....as I went over to the men's game in RI against the ranked RIC team.  That game had a loong delay and never got back to the game in LeFrak.  Amherst won 46-30 tonight against Wes. in the game that does NOT count in the standing.  When I saw the score at halftime, 32 to 12...Amherst ahead. I lost interest.  Looking over the stats, I will simply state that Amherst's Coach G. was not happy with his team.s effort in the second half....but will tell his team to throw the game out of their heads.  There is only two days left to prepare for two conference games this weekend, with the first being Friday's game with Bates.  Though one should only look to the next game, it is still hard to prepare for back to back games in two days.  On the men's side, Coach Hixon prepares for the Sat. game on Wednesday and the Friday's game on Thursday.  When Sat's game arrives, the team players will only need to be reminded of the of the game plan...their roles refreshed/adjusted accordingly to any new info on the Sat. opponent.
It seems that Amherst had lost their intensity in the 2nd half and went down to the level of their opponent....being outscored in the second half 16 to 14.   Ugly.  Best that I refer you to the recap on the Amherst website for any objective details.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on January 30, 2013, 01:15:04 AM
Some very impressive numbers from Carla Berube and the Jumbo's this year as I was looking at their results doing the Tufts/RIC recap on the LEC board.
9 straight opponents held to 50 points or less, and in 21 games Tufts has only allowed more then 50 5 times.  Also 5th time in 7 games Tufts has held the opposistion below 40 and on the season that has happened an extroidinary 9 times.  I know Amherst has NEVER lost a game in LeFrak under Gromacki (last time that happened was February 10, 2007 vs. trinity), but really, this Tufts team they play on Saturday could come in as one of the best defensive units Amherst has had to go up against @ LeFrak in quite some time, and Amherst has had some struggles on offense this season (43.5 points in 2 games to Wesleyan being the most notable).  Should be a great one, wish this was Friday instead, I could care less about Bates since I've already seen them twice this year
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 30, 2013, 10:53:10 AM
I think the Amherst/Tufts game will be a defensive battle. I don't believe Berube has beaten Gromacki yet, so the team that gets the hot shooting hand will probably pull off the win.  Tufts came close at Bowdoin in a NESCAC semi final, but Amherst won on a last second shot.  Amherst's last loss at home was to Bowdoin which was the reason that Bowdoin hosted the NESCAC tourney that year where Amherst beat Tufts I the semis, but lost to Bowdoin in the finals.  I don't believe that Trinity has beaten Gromacki either.





Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on January 30, 2013, 11:16:26 AM
Quote from: 7express on January 30, 2013, 01:15:04 AM
Some very impressive numbers from Carla Berube and the Jumbo's this year as I was looking at their results doing the Tufts/RIC recap on the LEC board.
9 straight opponents held to 50 points or less, and in 21 games Tufts has only allowed more then 50 5 times.  Also 5th time in 7 games Tufts has held the opposistion below 40 and on the season that has happened an extroidinary 9 times.  I know Amherst has NEVER lost a game in LeFrak under Gromacki (last time that happened was February 10, 2007 vs. trinity), but really, this Tufts team they play on Saturday could come in as one of the best defensive units Amherst has had to go up against @ LeFrak in quite some time, and Amherst has had some struggles on offense this season (43.5 points in 2 games to Wesleyan being the most notable).  Should be a great one, wish this was Friday instead, I could care less about Bates since I've already seen them twice this year

I'm struck by the similarity in stats between Tufts and Hope.  They are 1,2 nationally for scoring defense, neck and neck in the national rankings, and like the Jumbos Hope has only given up 50 points or more 4 times and have held 9 opponents to less than 40.  Would be really fun to watch that defensive battle if the two ever met in the tournament.  The biggest difference is that Hope scores about 8 more ppg, probably due to a bit higher rebounding and turnover margins.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on January 30, 2013, 02:14:06 PM
Quote from: sumfun on January 30, 2013, 10:53:10 AM
I think the Amherst/Tufts game will be a defensive battle. I don't believe Berube has beaten Gromacki yet, so the team that gets the hot shooting hand will probably pull off the win.  Tufts came close at Bowdoin in a NESCAC semi final, but Amherst won on a last second shot.  Amherst's last loss at home was to Bowdoin which was the reason that Bowdoin hosted the NESCAC tourney that year where Amherst beat Tufts I the semis, but lost to Bowdoin in the finals.  I don't believe that Trinity has beaten Gromacki either.

That 2007 loss to Trinity was with Lynn Hersey at the helm.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: joe8579 on January 30, 2013, 03:11:05 PM
Amherst's last loss at home was 1/30/2009 to Bowdoin, who ended up winning the NESCAC championship on their own floor by beating Amherst again.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 30, 2013, 03:15:14 PM
Saturday's Amherst-Tufts game should be very enjoyable.  Two very similiar teams.  Both play great defense, neither team has a true "star", both have some height, and both have great Coaches.  It should be a very close, defensive game, and fun to watch.  Hopefully both teams will play well, and I suspect that we will see them play at least one more time for the league championship, and this game will likely decide where that next game will be played.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 30, 2013, 03:15:55 PM
One more point--Amherst better not look past Bates--as Bates can ring up some big numbers and pull an upset.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 30, 2013, 04:52:38 PM
Maine 1....Do not expect either team's coaches will let that happen.  Do you?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: HoopMama on January 30, 2013, 04:59:44 PM
Never say never!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: joe8579 on January 30, 2013, 05:23:35 PM
I'm taking Bates over Trinity on Saturday.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bsc73 on January 31, 2013, 01:00:23 AM
Quote from: remsleep on January 28, 2013, 11:22:23 PM
Smith tops Williams tonight. Hersey is a real up and comer as a coach--have watched her for several years now.....after Amherst dissed her ( although they obviously did OK with Gromacki!),   look what she has done at Smith, which was pitiful prior to her arrival. Looks like Williams started their Maine trip a few days early.  They just never stretch themselves. Generally pretty talented but a little adversity and down they go.  Make that 0-2 in Maine.  Sorry, but they are sooooo frustrating.,,,,get someone like Hersey in there to coach the Ephs.,,,you would see a huge change for the better.   If anyone has watched Smith play I think you would agree with me that Hersey has gotten more out of very average talent than I have seen in quite a while.  They are intense....starting with the kid Quatrocchi who is a warrior.
Coach Hersey has done an outstanding job at Smith. she has taken a program that was awful and made them into a real force in New England. I do however feel you're doing the players a disservice when you say that they are a team of very average talent when in fact they have some players on that team that are very much above average and in fact would be significant contributors to any program in New England.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on January 31, 2013, 07:07:34 AM
Also give Hersey the credit for recruiting, along with Billy McBride, the class that were freshman in Amherst's first NCAA appearance (Sweet 16) and 3 Final fours with one National Championship.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: joe8579 on January 31, 2013, 08:09:41 AM
Gromacki definitely inherited two phenomenal forwards (Daigneault and Leyman), who were better than any first-year coach has a right to expect. Obviously, his next class was great as well, but there is no doubt that he started with very good pieces.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on January 31, 2013, 12:50:32 PM
Quote from: Maine1 on January 30, 2013, 03:15:55 PM
One more point--Amherst better not look past Bates--as Bates can ring up some big numbers and pull an upset.

Having seen both Trinity & Bates play Western Connecticut this year I'd say Trinity has a better chance of beating Tufts then Amherst has at losing to Bates.  Granted, both of those matchups were back in November, so both Bates & Trinity could be totally different teams now.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 31, 2013, 01:58:59 PM
The reason I believe Bates could pull an upset here is that Bates has beaten both Colby and Bowdoin twice.   And both Bowdoin and Colby played well against Amherst.  I believe Bates is better than both of those teams. I also believe Bates is better than Trinity, and should beat Trinity. But Amherst has to be at its best game to beat Bates.

Bottom line is that although there is a clear difference between the top three teams and the rest of the league, I do think any one of the other teams could give the top three a scare on the right night.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 01, 2013, 10:18:23 AM
Maine1....good points.  Will be there to watch tonight....should find out soon enough.  FYI, new video by a student put up yesterday of the Amherst and Williams games on LeFrak...on website...with a few remarks from both coaches.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MVP on February 01, 2013, 07:03:55 PM

One more point--Amherst better not look past Bates--as Bates can ring up some big numbers and pull an upset

Also, the Tufts v Amherst match-up , since these teams only meet once, the winner may determine who will have home court for the conference semi-finals and finals.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 02, 2013, 10:00:15 AM
So I missed quite a bit on last night's Bates-Amherst game.  Might have been one of Amherst's best game of the season.  They shot well from the outside, and the defense was suffocating.  Tufts had a strong finish against a tough Trinity last night, setting up a great game this afternoon. Looking forward to a ride out to Amherst this afternoon.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 02, 2013, 11:14:38 AM
I will be paying attention to this Amherst Tufts game from Western this afternoon
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: daoustian on February 02, 2013, 05:05:27 PM
Amherst-Tufts first half comments:
- Certainly living up to the rep as a defensive struggle, though in part that is due to poor shooting, particularly Amherst -- the Jeffs are having trouble finishing, aren't capitalizing the times they have good looks, etc.
- As I said last year, Voigt plays too out of control -- it's her game, always has been, but sometimes she plays too fast and loses the handle or can't finish after blowing past defenders, particularly to her left.  I don't know whether she'd be as good a player if she slowed down a bit, but I wonder.
- Amherst is having a lot of trouble in the post, which seems odd given its slight height advantage
- Zwecker is going to be a quality player -- haven't seen many Amherst games this year, but was impressed with her play once Voigt got into foul trouble -- creative passer, good penetration, looking forward to great things from her
- Crowley lost her cool in a bad way at the end of the first half with the third foul -- granted, she's getting beat up in the post pretty badly, but she committed a frustration foul and then didn't seem collected once she hit the bench -- looked like more than fatigue with her head in her hands for an extended period. 
- Barnosky is a good, scrappy player for the Jumbos.  She makes that team go.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 02, 2013, 06:09:22 PM
Great Amherst win.  They now control their own destiny, though Williams will be ready for them.  I'll take an "out of control" Voigt any day.  Much different team when she runs the point, and the presence of mind to put up that 3 as the shot clock ran down was amazing.  So nice to have such good video and replays from D3Hoops.  Nice job guys on the call too!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 02, 2013, 08:28:31 PM
Congratulations to both Amherst and Tufts--what a great game.  I give all the credit to the great defense by both teams--when teams
play defense the way Amherst and Tufts play, shooters rush open shots.  I thought the difference in the game was that Amherst had a bit more on offense than Tufts, and they were able to get some quality shots. The two freshmen guards had great games for Amherst, as did Holness off the bench.  The referees overall were very inconsistent, but they did not affect the outcome.  They let Holness get away with pretty much pushing everyone off her on the offensive end.   

Overall, I thought both teams played very well.  They are too evenly matched teams. Surprisngly, Amherst's bench outplayed Tufts. 
I would say Voights late three was a lot of luck, she had no choice as the shot clock was about to go off.
Would love to see these two teams play again.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 02, 2013, 11:05:42 PM
Maine1....Glad the game was worth the trip to LeFrak today.  Agree that both teams played in the "featured " game today.  Refer those that did not get to watch online to the recaps at either college websites.  Just wanted to make several comments wrt the atmosphere at the game and make a rebuttal to Maine1 that I feel necessary.
It was Senior day and the three Seniors...Crowley, Hardy and Voigt were honored along with the student assistant coach.  The stands were full with lots of loud Tufts fans...more fans than the men's game earlier.  Pat Coleman of D3 hoops was the announcer as D3 carried the game.  The Amherst championship team members....6 seniors that graduated last year were in the stands cheering the Amherst team on and questioning the refs like me.  I was somewhat quiet since the College president Biddy was sitting one row down from me.
Agree with Maine1 generally...on the refs and contribution of the two FY players and S. Holeness.
From my bias eyes, I thought that the refs were allowing the Tufts' players to play very physical defense and "foul/mug" a number of the Lady Jeffs under the boards, etc.  Since Tufts was to have the deeper bench...a good tactic to get Amherst to use it's short bench.  Bridget had two fouls early, and Voigt had to sit also for significant time in the first half.  Guess what....Holeness came in and gave as much as she was getting underneath and fighting for position.  Fy guard comes in and contribute on both sides for Voigt.  Amherst used 7 players and Tufts used primarily 7-8 players in their rotation.  At this time...in close games, coaches goes to the bench very little and use around 8 players or less, IMO.  As in the Bates game, the Fy players are comfortable starting or coming off the bench.  They are learning and growing with confidence with every game now.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 03, 2013, 12:38:44 AM
Quote from: sumfun on February 02, 2013, 06:09:22 PM
Great Amherst win.  They now control their own destiny, though Williams will be ready for them.  I'll take an "out of control" Voigt any day.  Much different team when she runs the point, and the presence of mind to put up that 3 as the shot clock ran down was amazing.  So nice to have such good video and replays from D3Hoops.  Nice job guys on the call too!

Thanks -- glad you enjoyed it! I know we enjoyed the experience and glad that D3Cast's Steve Clay came in to produce this game and make it look so good. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on February 03, 2013, 03:38:42 PM
Now, that, was a very good game, of two evenly matched teams.  I said afterward that this Amherst team just doesn't seem to be getting the respect this year.  The response was...well, they're ranked #3.  How much more respect do you want?...that was a very good point.  They may not be winning in blowout fashion, as we have gotten used to the last few years, but, they keep winning.  Years from now if you look up winning ugly in a sports book, there will be a picture of this team.  They didn't win ugly last night though.  And I agree with the earlier post that Haley Zwecker can play.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: joe8579 on February 04, 2013, 08:20:59 AM
Quote from: Maine1 on February 02, 2013, 08:28:31 PMThe referees overall were very inconsistent, but they did not affect the outcome.  They let Holness get away with pretty much pushing everyone off her on the offensive end.   
Frankly, I thought the officiating was an embarrassment. It was incredibly inconsistent from half to half (tons of ticky-tack stuff - especially from the younger shorter ref - in the first half and no calls in the second), and from official to official (as I said, one guy seemed like he was making every call). I was astounded by the level of physicality they let Holness get away with. She was displacing defenders (illegal according to the rules), hooking defenders (also illegal), and outright pushing (same) left and right, and was not called for it a single time.

I'm all for letting the teams play to a certain extent, especially in a hard-fought game as this was, but when you let an offensive player get away with murder and then call a defender on a ticky-tack foul somewhere else? That is just bad. I think all three officials were out of their depth. At one point, Meg Robertson blatantly imbalanced herself by leaning on a Tufts defender, then the defender moved away and she fell over. The result? A foul on the defender.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 04, 2013, 11:47:47 AM
For the posters that did not see the hard fought game between the leaders in the "CAC" you can see it.  D3hoops has a video on it.  I watched the mens game and realize that I missed a number of things while watching in the stands.  Will watch the women's game later.  It will be interesting to see if what I thought I saw in a given play is what some other posters saw differently...etc....same to the refs and their calls and no calls.
I have been to many D3 games as well as Div1 games...both men and women and have been upset about the calls many times.  I have vented about them and so forth...venting is good but doesn't change the outcome of games.
In the Tufts vs Amherst Game, there were several plays that occurred that I thought should have had a foul called against Tufts or a no call.  On one...that looked quite like the one described by an other poster, I turned to my friend in the stands and complained.  His answer was...she was leaning and when the defender moved, she fell down.  The no call was right.  Guess there were several like that and that we all see things differently at times...in the "heat of the battle".
If the drama of the season plays out "correctly" ...for me, I see Amherst meeting Tufts again in LeFrak for the "CAC" Title.  Maybe with a better crew of refs?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 07, 2013, 06:55:21 PM
Seems like travel on the East Coast could be difficult or impossible this weekend.  Be safe!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: HoopMama on February 07, 2013, 09:33:24 PM
Friday night games changed to Sunday afternoon.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: HoopMama on February 07, 2013, 10:26:35 PM
Saturday games on but time delays.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: joe8579 on February 08, 2013, 10:29:32 AM
So much for curling up with a cup of hot cocoa and a whole lot of NESCAC games today...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 10, 2013, 04:53:10 PM
Wow! what is going on at Williams-dominating first half by Williams-can they keep this up.  If so, assuming Williams, Amherst and Tufts win their remaining game, a three way tie for top at the NESCAC
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jumpshot on February 10, 2013, 06:08:54 PM
Williams women shock #3 ranked and previously undefeated (22-0) Amherst 71-51 in a blowout in Williamstown. Amherst alumni and fans from Maine to Florida immediately are calling for an investigation, task forces, special committees, etc. Protests scheduled for tomorrow on campus in spite of snow ....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 10, 2013, 06:37:24 PM
Quote from: Maine1 on February 10, 2013, 04:53:10 PM
Wow! what is going on at Williams-dominating first half by Williams-can they keep this up.  If so, assuming Williams, Amherst and Tufts win their remaining game, a three way tie for top at the NESCAC

Looks like they'll have to go to the old coin flip to decide seeds.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Hoop Guy on February 10, 2013, 06:48:13 PM
I do not think it is all that shocking.   If you look at Amherst,  Tufts and Williams on paper I think it is clear that they are the third best team.  How they avoided losing a game until now is what is shocking to me.  Be nice to see a NESCAC final somewhere else.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 10, 2013, 07:52:18 PM
If Tufts plays @ Williams this year they probably lose and if Amherst played @ Tufts they probably lose.  I thought Tufts was going to beat Amherst anyways, but not surprising Amherst won at home, and really not surprising all these teams held serve against each other on their home court.  Whichever one of these 3 get the home court advantage will be at an extreme advantage against the other 2.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MVP on February 10, 2013, 11:27:11 PM

Not a huge surprise. Amazing that Amherst held on this long till a loss. Williams is a very good team, playing very well. Makes it a 3 party race. Be nice to see the tourney in a different venue.

Will be watching closely. Match-ups very interesting.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 11, 2013, 06:46:51 AM
Assuming a three-way tie for first, the winner of the tiebreaker will have a huge advantage in the NESCAC tournament. First, they will have the home court advantage.  That alone is a huge.  Secondly, although anything can happen in one game, Amherst, Williams, and Tufts are so much better than the rest of the league, that the one seed will have a very easy road to the final.  The Amherst team did not seem to show up yesterday, and Williams was ready, and this time it appeared they found Belcher early and often.  Who ever gets that numbe one seed will be well on their way to the league championship.  However, all three teams should be NCAA teams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on February 11, 2013, 07:12:50 AM
Congrats to the Ephs on the long-overdue win vs. Gromacki!   Very emotional scene in Billsville.  The current senior class is a great one for the Ephs and will be deeply missed.  Baecher seemed limited coming back from the injury early in the season, but now seems to be finding her groove again at the right time.  There have been a few times during the long Amherst run that Williams seemed to have an advantage, only to let things slip from their fingers down the stretch.  In the last few years, however, Amherst has simply been much better (until last year, when with Baecher, the teams were pretty even, but not without her).  This Williams team, while susceptible to slip-ups, at its best can play with anyone and it showed that with a tremendous senior day performance.  Hopefully the Ephs can keep the momentum from this win going and play with the same precision and focus the rest of the year.  If they do, they have a good shot at a NESCAC title, but of course, as noted whoever gets home-court advantage will have a big edge. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 11, 2013, 09:13:06 AM
Agree with nescac1 that the atmosphere in Willytown was great for the game.  The write up on the Amherst website pointed out, as the game announcer did, that the senior class had never beaten Amherst.  Williams team had more energy than Amherst and the defense stopped Amherst...holding the Jeff's to only 18 points at the half.    Glad that Amherst played the Ephs even in the second half.  Coach G. had all his FY players in at the end..to get the Feeling of a game in Chandler....even before the Williams coach put her last senior player in to taste the victory over Amherst.
Great game by Williams.   Expect Amherst will be focused on Midd ahead.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 13, 2013, 11:11:47 AM
So if Williams, Amherst, and Tufts win tonight, is there a tie breaking formula for the NESCAC?  Head to head?  Out of conference?  No matter outcome of tournament and who hosts, I do believe all 3 teams will make NCAA.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 13, 2013, 11:58:19 AM
All 3 would be 1-1 against each other, 9-0 against the rest of the conference so I think they go to a coin flip.  Whether that flip decides all 3 teams or just the first team I'm not sure.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on February 13, 2013, 12:22:03 PM
Believe it or not, I think they put the three teams in a hat and pull them out.  The order they come out equals the order they are seeded.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 13, 2013, 08:43:46 PM
Amherst closes out the regular season with a win in VT...65 to45.  Jasmine Hardy had a double-double  and all the starters contributed on the boards and in scoring.
Williams also won so the drawing for the seeds should commence soon....game in LeFrak on Sat.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 13, 2013, 10:03:40 PM
NESCAC regular season is now over-three teams at 9-1, 6 teams at 4-6.  I believe as the previous poster said, the first second and third seeds will be based on random draw.  The other 6 teams will go through tiebreaker for 4-8, and one of the 4-6 teams will be left out.  I see very litte chance for an upset, so as I posted previously, who ever draws the one seed has a very easy route to the finals, while the other two 9-1 teams will have to play in the semis.

The six teams at 4-6 is a statement of the general level of play in the league this year--fall below the standards of previous years.  This is not a strong league after the top three this year.

Very disappointing season for Colby--they have fallen back to the bottom of the league--they seem to play almost exclusively for the three point shot--not a great strategy. 

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 13, 2013, 11:32:10 PM
NH NESCAC Fan was right the names were drawn out of a hat.

Tufts drew #1, Amherst #2, Williams #3.  Tufts has a big advantage.  I'm going with Williams vs. Tufts in the championship game I don't think Amherst can beat Williams on a neutral court.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on February 14, 2013, 04:16:54 PM
As my old basketball coach used to tell me whenever I made a shot...even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while!

Don't count Amherst out...they are the only one of the three teams to have beaten the other two, unless I am mistaken.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 14, 2013, 05:58:03 PM
In terms of the first round draw, I believe that Tufts has the toughest first round game of any of the top three teams.   The 4-6 is not a strong group, but I think Bowdoin is the best of that group.  Amherst/Williams at a neutral site would be a fun game to see.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: toad22 on February 14, 2013, 09:03:06 PM
Williams is easily the best team in the NESCAC now. Claire Bacher has finally recovered from her ACL injury last year. They will roll in this tournement. Williams is just better this year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on February 15, 2013, 09:12:10 AM
Oh good.  Glad that's decided.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on February 16, 2013, 05:56:37 PM
Down goes Frazier!  Down goes Frazier. 

Bowdoin pulls the huge upset over Tufts.  Potentially giving Amherst an edge as they now get to host...I think.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 16, 2013, 06:14:34 PM
I think so too as Amherst has the highest seed, even though they lost to Williams head to head in the game that counts towards the league standings.  I don't think seedings revert back to that I'd top seed goes down.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 16, 2013, 06:26:00 PM
It's on NESCAC website that Amherst does host. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 16, 2013, 09:44:58 PM
Welp Amherst in the drivers seat now.  I know Amherst now indeed will host both the mens and women's semifinals and finals, but do they reseed??  If not it gives a huge advantage to Bowdoin who, imo, should beat Middlebury pretty easily in the 1 semifinal while Amherst and Williams will be a dog fight in the other.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 17, 2013, 07:02:45 AM
NESCAC does reseed, so Bowdoin will now play Amherst, and Middlebury will play Williams, likely setting up a Wiliams/ Amherst file. As I posted earlier, I thought Bowdoin would be a tough draw for Tufts.  They were clearly a better team then Trinity and Wesleyan (even though they did lose to both these teams on the road).  Amherst is the beneficiary of that upset as the get the finals at home.  I am sure the Williams crew will make the trip to Amherst to pack the gym.   There will be quite a crowd in Amherst with both men's and womens' finals there next weekend.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: toad22 on February 17, 2013, 02:29:19 PM
I am very excited about the NESCAC semis and finals next weekend. This is the best chance Williams had had to win the championship in many years. All of the key players for Williams are healthy and playing as well individually and collectively as they ever have. A final factor that should not be overlooked is that they are no longer intimidated by Amherst. It will take a great effort to get there, but I am very hopeful.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 17, 2013, 03:42:57 PM
Been at the beach this weekend and out of the loop for abit.   Caught  abit of Amherst's game but the reception was not a good.  Surprised to see that the game  in LeFrak ended up a blowout.
Amherst is getting good play down the line.  Am concerned a bit that the team is short handed a bit....Coach G will have to change his practice routine somewhat.
Happy to see that the LJ's will host and the team has stepped up the team defense another notch.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 18, 2013, 07:18:17 AM
Some thoughts on the NESCAC finals--First, I am disappointed that Tufts lost, as I was planning on heading to Tufts for the Saturday semis--Amherst is a bit of a long drive, and with both men's and womens there, it will be a zoo.
Great job by Bowdoin pulling off the upset.  They will give Amherst trouble, particulalry if hitting from the outside.  Donahoe is having a great season, and Bowdoin has improved througout the year.  I don't think Middlebury has much of a shot at all against Williams.
I believe that as between Williams and Amherst, Williams is probably the better team.  Bacher is the Player of the Year--but Williams has to find her, and use her down low. Gromacki is the best coach, and Amherst has the home court.  When the two teams played earlier in the year at Amherst, I thought that Williams forgot to keep Bacher in the offense in the second half.
In these games, the best team does not always win.  If Gromacki were coaching Williams, I would definitely say Williams would win. But he isn't. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 18, 2013, 07:49:23 AM
Maine1, agree with your points.  Amherst will have to be prepared for Bowdoin and not look ahead to Williams.  Should they face Williams, the keys will be Hardy and Voigt getting some open looks at 3's and Megan Robertson providing an option down low and bothering Bacher.  Actually that's the key to every game.  Crisp, rapid passes that get an open look on the perimeter or an open backdoor cut.  Crowley having a good game with some points off the bench are also key.  Plus, as you say, there is the Gromacki factor. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: JustAFan on February 18, 2013, 01:24:05 PM
I don't think Bowdoin can play (or shoot) any better than they did against Tufts. They were unconscious from behind the arc (58% for the game, 71% in the second half alone!!) and also shot above average in general.  Tufts ran into the perfect storm, shooting terribly against a team that was shooting lights out (the usually reliable Kate Barnosky was 4-16 from the field, the team's second best shooter, Hannah Foley, was 2 for 12 and 1-7 on 3's).  This on top of having point guard Kelsey Morehead coming back from a concussion and not having guard Caitlin McClure available due to a sprained ankle. The Tufts defense forced 17 Bowdoin turnovers and only committed 5 on their end and Tufts still lost--go figure. I thought the Jumbos were going to pull it out when they came back from 10 down to go up by 2 with 4 minutes left.  The only coaching decision I found curious was the fact that Ali Rocchi, who was having a career game (5-7 from the field) and was the only player other than Bre Dufault who was able to score against Bowdoin, did not play during the game's final 5 minutes, even after Bre fouled out.

Give Bowdoin all the credit for a great game plan well executed, and give Coach Shibles a lot of credit for bringing this young team along and getting them to develop and gell over the course of the season. If I was picking next year's top teams Bowdoin would be in my top 3, and in 2 years they should be back to being the team to beat.  I was especially impressed by the play of the 3 Bowdoin freshman Saturday (Shannon Brady (a future POY), Selena Lorrey and Nina Hadzibabic) and there are a bunch of very good sophomores in the mix as well.  This is a much better Bowdoin team than folks saw in December or January, and while they are very young they have the talent to give Amherst a game if they shoot well and handle the defensive pressure in the backcourt that Amherst is sure to throw at them.

On the Tufts side, the Jumbos have to take heart that despite playing perhaps their worst game of the year on the offensive end they nearly pulled it out. I have to think that the prospect of hosting the league final four as the #1 seed played a role in the Jumbos playing a bit tight at the outset. But the game also exposed Tufts deficiencies on the offensive end--with one exception they have no outside shooting and their offensive sets are painful to watch, usually culminating with off balance drives to the hoop that they can't finish and, at least against Bowdoin, did not result in a foul to bail them out. Coach Berube never seems to have good offensive teams, and doesn't seem to recruit players with great offensive skills (on the whole, Bowdoin had a lot more players with better basketball skills than the Tufts side), but no team plays harder or with more heart than Tufts. The question is how far can that take them against the top teams in the country in the absence of any go to offensive players to get them the difficult hoop when they need it.  With all that said, this Tufts team has exceeded the expectations of most fans, and I believe they still have the ability to have a good run in the tournament with a little luck in their seeding. 



Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 23, 2013, 08:19:28 PM
Watched online an efficient Amherst team beat upstart Bowdoin 60-45.  The last time the two teams mer, the Polar Bears took an 6-point lead into the half....only to have the LJs smother them in the 2nd half.  This time around, Amherst led early and finish strong with 4 FYs' and a soph on the floor in the last 3 minutes.  Solid win for Amherst as they await the winner of the Midd vs Williams game in the finals on Sunday.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 23, 2013, 09:07:14 PM
Amherst vs Williams in both Men's and Women's NESCAC Finals tomorrow.  LeFrak will be the place to be.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 24, 2013, 08:06:57 AM
Hopefully both games will be wellplayed, and the referees will let the players decide the game.  If Williams women focus on getting the ball inside to Bacher and Rainer, they will win.  If they decided to make it a 3 point game, then I see Amherst.  Also, if the referees let Amherst play very physical against Bacher, this will have an impact.
I will watch on-line--should be an entertaining game
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 24, 2013, 03:56:29 PM
A lot of credit to Amherst and their defense, and a great second half by Voight, who was the only player (besides Holness) on either team who actually looked like they knew how to play offense.  Williams offense in the second half (and actually for most of the game ) was non-existent.  I would have thought Williams could have mustered a bit more.  We will see how these teams do in the NCAAs.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 24, 2013, 04:20:39 PM
Amherst wins another "CAC" title!  In a game that was only 18 to 17 at the half....Amherst goes on to win by 15....53-38....I believe.  Stats are down .In any case it was an ugly game in the first half as both teams could not hit any sort of baskets....both teams appeared tight...too tight.  Amherst won by less than 10 in the first game in LeFrak.  Went to Chandler on Senior day and got blown out in the first half....Ephs by 20 at the half in that game.  Amherst and Wiliams played even in the second half and Williams won by 20........It just seemed that the first half of today's game was a continuation of that game.
Amherst shoots only around 15% from the field and Williams was no better.  In the 2nd half, Amherst builds a 2-4 point lead.  With about 11 plus minutes to go...Meg Robertson gets her 4th foul...two quick fouls in the 2nd half and goes to the bench.  M. Voigt steps it up big time and scores 6 straight points and  the energy level on the team goes up.  Defense picks up and with 4 minutes to go, Amherst holds a lead of 12-14.  Robertson returns when Holness fouls out on illegal screen.  Meg gets several key rebounds and scores down low to hold off the Ephs.  Four FY players on the floor at the end of the game for Amherst.....their first conference title.....Amherst's 4th straight.  Forgot....Holness was the energy spark in both halves especially when Meg picked up her second and then her 4th.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on February 24, 2013, 07:53:27 PM
I was at the game.  Savannah Holness, was indeed, a difference maker today.  She played with confidence, and played excellent defense against Baecher.  While Baecher left the game very early with an injury to the index finger on her shooting hand, it didn't appear that the injury affected her shot.  I think she made all six of her foul shots.  Zero field goals, however.  She didn't get many good looks.

As I think has been the case all season, the defense of Amherst was what really won this game.  They never let up.  For 40 minutes there was constant pressure at every turn...on the ball and off the ball.  Williams didn't have the answer, and their defense wasn't as intense, or as effective.  My hat gets tipped to the ladies of Amherst.  They were clearly the better team today.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 24, 2013, 09:40:54 PM
NH NESCAC FAN.....glad you made the trip down...lucky to be at the game.  Was watching online and hosting family, friends and grand dogs.  You hit it on the nail....about defensive efforts.  On the Williams website, Coach Manning summarized the game....Amherst played tough  defense for 40 minutes and we played tough defense for 20 minutes.....
Coach G's teams always had that signature mark.  This year's team has signed up to play great defense.  Amherst's young players bought into it and their hard work has paid off.  Jasmine Hardy was guarding bigger Williams players and winning the battle....as well as her team mates.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on February 25, 2013, 07:43:32 AM
I need to correct my earlier post.  I thought Claire Baecher injured her index finger.  It was her pinky finger...take a look.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/amherstcollege/8504467017/in/set-72157632846386249/lightbox/

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on February 25, 2013, 08:28:49 AM
Quote from: NH NESCAC Fan on February 25, 2013, 07:43:32 AM
I need to correct my earlier post.  I thought Claire Baecher injured her index finger.  It was her pinky finger...take a look.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/amherstcollege/8504467017/in/set-72157632846386249/lightbox/



That quite a picture, but... ouch!  I hope she's OK.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on February 25, 2013, 03:41:15 PM
Bracket's out.  Amherst, Tufts, and Williams all made it.  Amherst and Tufts are in the same bracket.  Williams goes to Rochester.

Not only are Calvin, Hope, and Ohio Northern (#'s 2, 3, and 4) in the same bracket...they are in the same sub-bracket.  I'm betting there is plenty of gnashing of teeth at those schools today.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 25, 2013, 03:54:19 PM
Amherst and Tufts on pace for a sweet 16 matchup.

Think Tufts/Amherst both win this weekend, but I'd be worried if I'm Amherst, Bridgewater is one of the quickest teams I've seen in the women's side won @ Williams and lost to Tufts by only 1.  They definitely ain't gonna be an easy out.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on February 25, 2013, 05:13:40 PM
Quote from: NH NESCAC Fan on February 25, 2013, 03:41:15 PMNot only are Calvin, Hope, and Ohio Northern (#'s 2, 3, and 4) in the same bracket...they are in the same sub-bracket.  I'm betting there is plenty of gnashing of teeth at those schools today.


As a Hope fan... consider my teeth thoroughly gnashed.  Not too much to complain about though since a) we got in when last year at 22-5 we didn't (though the AQ took it out of committee's hands) and b) we were selected to host 1st round.  I suppose you have to beat everybody eventually to reach the ultimate goal.  But after three epic battles with Calvin this year, two in the past week, I would have hoped the committee would have seen fit to put us on opposite sides or at least delay the possibility of a fourth game a bit longer.  And Ohio Northern would be no picnic either I'm sure.  But it's all good, we're dancing!  HOPEfully we'll have the chance to see a NESCAC team down the road.  Good luck!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 25, 2013, 05:26:45 PM
Amherst has a tough road back to the Final Four, no doubt.  Massey gives Amherst the edge over Bridgewater 77% to 23%, but those numbers can be really off.  Babson vs Tufts will be a great game - Massey has Tufts 63% to 37% over Babson, but that's why you play the game.  Once again Babson has to go on the road to a NESCAC gym.  Will be a great few weekends.  Totally agree with Calvin - Hope teeth gnashing.  The one downfall of D3 is the travel thing and separating teams that play eachother a bunch.  Luckily Williams and Amherst won't have to play a 4th time in the early rounds.

I'd think Williams should be pretty pleased with their draw.  Strictly going by Massey Matchups, they make the Final Four.  Let me Madness begin!!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on February 25, 2013, 05:58:59 PM
If we get an Amherst/Williams IV, might we dub it The Maulin' in Holland?  Who's the Boss of DeVos?  The Lope to Hope?

Sorry...couldn't resist.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bballfan13 on February 25, 2013, 06:27:40 PM
Quote from: sumfun on February 25, 2013, 05:26:45 PM
Amherst has a tough road back to the Final Four, no doubt.  Massey gives Amherst the edge over Bridgewater 77% to 23%, but those numbers can be really off.  Babson vs Tufts will be a great game - Massey has Tufts 63% to 27% over Babson, but that's why you play the game.  Once again Babson has to go on the road to a NESCAC gym.  Will be a great few weekends.  Totally agree with Calvin - Hope teeth gnashing.  The one downfall of D3 is the travel thing and separating teams that play eachother a bunch.  Luckily Williams and Amherst won't have to play a 4th time in the early rounds.

I'd think Williams should be pretty pleased with their draw.  Strictly going by Massey Matchups, they make the Final Four.  Let me Madness begin!!!!

Sumfum, how do you find out the Massey predictions for these possible future games?  Is there a quick formula I can use?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on February 25, 2013, 07:47:24 PM
Quote from: bballfan13 on February 25, 2013, 06:27:40 PM
Quote from: sumfun on February 25, 2013, 05:26:45 PM
Amherst has a tough road back to the Final Four, no doubt.  Massey gives Amherst the edge over Bridgewater 77% to 23%, but those numbers can be really off.  Babson vs Tufts will be a great game - Massey has Tufts 63% to 27% over Babson, but that's why you play the game.  Once again Babson has to go on the road to a NESCAC gym.  Will be a great few weekends.  Totally agree with Calvin - Hope teeth gnashing.  The one downfall of D3 is the travel thing and separating teams that play eachother a bunch.  Luckily Williams and Amherst won't have to play a 4th time in the early rounds.

I'd think Williams should be pretty pleased with their draw.  Strictly going by Massey Matchups, they make the Final Four.  Let me Madness begin!!!!

Sumfum, how do you find out the Massey predictions for these possible future games?  Is there a quick formula I can use?

No formula needed.  Just hit the "More" tab at the top of the page on the women's D3 page, select "matchups" from the drop down list, then choose your two opponents and venue. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on February 25, 2013, 08:51:09 PM
Yep, that's how you do it.  Fun to run through the brackets for all tournament games.  Even helps with men's D1 predictions.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bballfan13 on February 25, 2013, 09:56:55 PM
Great, thank you both!   :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 26, 2013, 09:38:46 AM
7 Express......at this time of the year,  ALL opponents are going to be tough outs.  Just like in the regular season.....Amherst needs to focus on the only the game ahead.  This Friday, Amherst faces a team that they blew out earlier.   Coach G. will have them prepared...my take is that he will tell the team that the opponent on Friday is a DIFFERENT team now....a NCAA tourney team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 27, 2013, 02:12:47 PM
As a heads-up for those who don't already know, the Bracket Challenge is out! Our friends at d3photography.com manage our official picks contests:

http://d3photography.com/bracket_challenge/

Playing for pride, which means student-athletes and department personnel can participate.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 27, 2013, 08:02:32 PM
The conference honors have been posted.  Amherst's Coach G. wins coach of the year.  Amherst senior Marcia Voigt makes the first team and soph Meg Robertson makes the 2nd team.  Both Amherst players were selected ROY in their first year of play.  The three seniors on the team, M. Voigt, Bridget Crowley and Jasmine Hardy, led Amherst to four straight conference title.  No other conference school has won 4 straight.
Video highlights of the conf. final can be found on the Amherst website...in the write-up of the men's winners presently (combined men and women title wins).  Nice preview of the teams for this weekend games can also be  found for those interested. on the Amherst athletic site.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: lefrakenstein on March 01, 2013, 07:29:43 PM
Megan Robertson compared to Michael Jordan w/in the first two minutes of the Amherst webcast. I really like the Amherst announcers. Definitely don't shy away from hyperbole.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 01, 2013, 09:21:32 PM
Amherst wins easily over Farmingdale State...by 67-39 as 5...yes five new players on the floor at the end.  New players started to come in at the 11-12 minute mark of the 2nd half.  Often Coach G, had one senior and 4 FY players on the floor.  Amherst will meet the Un of NE in the 6 Pm game on Sat.  Many of the starters got a rest tonight.  Super sub S. Holness was kept on the bench to allow the bench to get some experience in an post season game.
Williams won by 20 over Scranton and Tufts is on the way to winning there game.  Good night and start for the "CAC".  box and recap of the game should be on the Amherst website shortly
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on March 02, 2013, 10:19:13 AM
First it was Duke and UNC. Then it was Michael Jordan's turn. Could Jesus Christ be next?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 02, 2013, 01:07:20 PM
Frank U....Could be.....it must be a generational thing.
Left you a compliment on the men's board....really enjoyed your last post there.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 02, 2013, 07:04:29 PM
They Jeff Cast announcers are entertaining, but they have no idea about what they are talking about.  Catholic is in the Atlantic region, Amherst is in Northeast region and does have the #1 seed.  With a win, they could host next weekend.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 02, 2013, 09:09:25 PM
Amherst wins big over the Un, of New England.  Marcia Voigt gets two fouls early in the first half and still Amherst leads by 30-19 at the half.  In the second half, Voigt returns and scores in double figures.  Both Robertson and Crowley have double -doubles in points and boards.  Jasmine Hardy almost gets a double -double with 11 points and 9 rebounds and a ton of assists.  Only concern is that one FY player is in a boot as a result of yesterday's play and Holness only plays a few minutes when Crowley gets into foul trouble.  Box and recap of the game to be up on the website soon.....It was a win by 0ver 30 points.
Seems that Amherst will meet Tufts next week in LeFrak.  Williams beats Rochester at Rochester. Good  night for the conference teams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 03, 2013, 11:26:29 AM
As to the question of whether Catholic would be hosting, given that they lost the point is moot right now, but as I understand it, there was some question about who would host once it got to the quarterfinals, if it was Amherst v. Catholic.  I don't know exactly what the fun Amherst announcers said, but if they were suggesting that Amherst might have had to have traveled to DC, I think they were correct.  Unlike with DI, the seedings in the brackets aren't made known.  So, you don't know if Catholic or Amherst were #1 in that bracket.  The Amherst parents knew that going to DC was a possibility.  They are happy that Catholic lost.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 03, 2013, 01:15:21 PM
Thanks NH Fan for that clarification.  If you hear through the grapevine about hosting....let us know.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 03, 2013, 01:23:12 PM
My assumption is that if Amherst beats Tufts, they would host the quarterfinals, as Catholic would have been the other potential #1 in the bracket.  I'll let you know if I get any official word that I can share.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 03, 2013, 01:50:25 PM
It has just been announced.  Amherst will host.  Williams will also host.  Hope will not, perhaps because the final 4 is there?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 03, 2013, 02:38:21 PM
Nescac NH Fan.....thanks for the verification of the official selection..too presumptive of me.   Amherst needs to take the advantage of the situation it has...home court....especially when meeting Tufts again.  Any impressions of last night's game?  Thought the FY players are gaining confidence in their "game".  Being at home is a bonus to their confidence.  In a way, at this time of the season.....they may not be FY players really in this the Second season period..
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 03, 2013, 03:02:28 PM
Quote from: NH NESCAC Fan on March 03, 2013, 01:50:25 PM
It has just been announced.  Amherst will host.  Williams will also host.  Hope will not, perhaps because the final 4 is there?

I think a combination of 2 things:
1) Hope is the final 4 host
2) St. Thomas to Hope is 550 miles, which would require an extra flight the NCAA has to pay for.  Their already paying for 4 this round: Newport & Montclair out to DePauw and Emory & Whitman up to Williams.  Whitewater was less then 500 miles from all 3 schools in that bracket.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 03, 2013, 03:13:16 PM
7Express - I think #2 may be the more likely answer.  The almighty $ wins again.

Amh63 - It has been nice to see the Amherst FY's get some playing time these last two games.  I do think they are true FY's still, though.  They didn't get much burn during the regular season.  I am a big fan of Haley Zwecker.  That young lady is one slick ball handler.  I was introduced to her and Cheyenne Pritchard after the Williams game.  They are both very nice kids...as they all are I suppose.  I thanked Haley for hanging in there this year, and I got the impression she gets it.  It has to be tough for these FY's as the vast majority of them were the stars that never came off the court in high school, and now they have to start all over again.  Their reward will come a lot quicker than it did for others.  There are no Juniors on this team.  They should all see major minutes next year.  It has certainly been fun to watch over these past three years that I've been paying attention.

Cheyenne, having started all year is a different story.  I think they'll be fine next year.  Meghan and Savannah will be Juniors.  Savannah has certainly proven she can play.  Cheyenne and Haley will do well.  I haven't seen much of the others, but what I have seen looks good.  None of them panic.  If they bring in a few more recruits, and maybe a transfer...who knows?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 04, 2013, 12:01:10 PM
the Brackets set up for two NESCAC teams in the final four.  Amherst is almost impossible to beat at LeFrak (not sure when they last lost a game there).  And Williams is equally hard to beat at Chandler (that is actually a very hard gym to play in as a visitor).  I see both of those teams advancing to the final four.

As far as Amherst's depth, they are a five person team, but Holness and the freshman guard off the bench can both play if they have to.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on March 04, 2013, 12:24:23 PM
Does that mean that one is being offered the field against the chauvinist proposition that both Amherst and Williams make the 2013 Final Four? I take the field despite the fact that history says that their joint men's appearance there happened in 2004.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 04, 2013, 01:51:12 PM
Maine 1
Frank U.......will like to take up your points in several weeks.  The possibilities of a repeat of the Conference finals repeating on another stage can then be more realistic assessed.....temping as it is now.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 04, 2013, 01:58:44 PM
Maine1 - Amherst's winning streak at LeFrak started January 31, 2009 with a 65-64 win over Colby.  Also, the depth is less of an issue during the tournament as the games are loaded with media timeouts...4 per half.  Foul trouble would be the biggest depth issue.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 04, 2013, 02:11:12 PM
Quote from: Maine1 on March 04, 2013, 12:01:10 PM
the Brackets set up for two NESCAC teams in the final four.  Amherst is almost impossible to beat at LeFrak (not sure when they last lost a game there).  And Williams is equally hard to beat at Chandler (that is actually a very hard gym to play in as a visitor).  I see both of those teams advancing to the final four.

As far as Amherst's depth, they are a five person team, but Holness and the freshman guard off the bench can both play if they have to.

I'd be concerned about Williams.  Ithaca is damn good team defensively, they've held 6 of their last 8 opponents to 50 points or less, and have only given up 60 3 times in 29 games this year, none since January 18.  Plus, their probably the best team in the bracket.  The only reason their not hosting is because their gym is undergoing renovations.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on March 04, 2013, 03:23:21 PM
amh63: Faites vos jeux! No past posting.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: joe8579 on March 04, 2013, 04:34:59 PM
I wouldn't look past Emory in Williams' bracket. They came out as the top team in what was probably the best conference in the country this year. I look for them to advance to Michigan from Williamstown.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 04, 2013, 05:07:38 PM
Coach Thomascutty has been at Emory for a while and has finally broken through.  She seems to have a deep talented team. 

Really like what I see from Ithaca, and one has to think that having a former Amherst player as an assistant coach (Shannon Finucane) that they will be prepared for Williams.  Williams also seems to have choked over the past few years in "big" games.

Having said all that if you go with Massey's head to head matchups, Williams makes the Final Four.  Can't wait for the fun to begin.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: toad22 on March 04, 2013, 08:44:08 PM
I don't know how good Ithaca or Emory are, so I can't predict the outcome of the Williamstown pod, but I know that if Baecher isn't hurt, this Williams tean is the best Williams team ever. They are really tough to defend. Claire needs to be on her game. If she is, I seroiusly doubt anybody in the pod will beat them. I'm very hopeful.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 05, 2013, 05:06:10 PM
Amherst website..athletics section....has just posted the preview of the women games in LeFrak.  Webcast and stats for all the games.  Time and ticket information for those interested.
It is most interesting that the ticket prices vary between the women and men's games in the same facility.  The women tickets cost a dollar more for adults and students/seniors....wether it is for two or one game.  For the women's game kids under two are free.  No mention of the free children tickets for the men's game.  Who sets the prices?  Amherst for the "CAC" games let Amherst students with IDs in free...maybe all students. 
Checking on the prices for the games in Williamstown......same prices...must be the NCAA.  Cannot see the refs  cost to be different .   Just inquiring.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 06, 2013, 10:43:55 AM
This is very cool, 100 free NCAA tickets for students donated by an anonymous donor: 

http://athletics.williams.edu/sports/wbkb/2012-13/releases/20130306hc5ftu

Women's basketball at Williams (and pretty much everywhere) doesn't receive the same level of fan support as men's hoops, so hopefully this will encourage a large and raucous student crowd at the women's game. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 06, 2013, 10:53:47 AM
Williams posters.....nice jester by someone.   In a way, nescac1 post answered my question wrt ticket price difference......lower attendance at women games.....income needed to pay the support crews, etc., being the same.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on March 06, 2013, 02:45:15 PM
Once upon a time not many years ago your faithful correspondent was advised by the predecessor Williams AD that a similar proposition with respect to a NCAA women's soccer playoff involving the Williams team playing at Williams would not produce additional attendance and consequently was abandoned.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 07, 2013, 06:06:04 AM
Nice article on Men's and Women's programs at Amherst and Williams, but for most of the article Coach Hixon is Coach "Dixon."  It truly is a great college rivalry and the only D3 rivalry to warrant hosting the live broadcast of ESPN College Game Day during a previous football season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on March 07, 2013, 08:36:00 AM
Said like a true believer.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 07, 2013, 10:23:01 AM
Yes indeed....Frank U!   Sumfun poster has a daughter that was a captain on the National Champs' BB team....experienced the contests on the floor for 4 years between the schools.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 07, 2013, 01:16:36 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 06, 2013, 10:53:47 AM
Williams posters.....nice jester by someone.   In a way, nescac1 post answered my question wrt ticket price difference......lower attendance at women games.....income needed to pay the support crews, etc., being the same.
Williams doesn't have enough cash on hand to pay facilities personnel?     hahahaha!!!    what a crock of @#$%!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on March 07, 2013, 05:48:13 PM
Williams squeezes a nickel until the bull bison lactates. You can't believe that it got rich doing otherwise.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 08, 2013, 06:01:57 AM
Four future members of the still-alive NESCAC squads mentioned here, one each going to Tufts and Amherst, two to Williams:

http://donerelite.com/players-at-next-level/

Katy Hicks-Tufts University
Hannah Peterson – Amherst College
Katie Leinbach-Williams College
Elise Testa- Williams College
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 08, 2013, 11:45:48 AM
nescac1.....thanks for the data......seems the "recruits" are all Mass based or local.  Two versus one recruits....Williams vs Amherst.....about right ratio if you look at the 6 seniors on the Williams roster and the 3 seniors on the Amherst roster.  Anticipate that Amherst will bring in more than three though.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 08, 2013, 12:07:22 PM
If the good Lord's willin', and the creek don't rise, I'm planning on watching the Amherst/Tufts rematch in person tonight.  If Amherst plays D like they did against Williams in the NESCAC finals they should have the upper hand.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 08, 2013, 12:30:26 PM
NH NESCAC Fan......Agree!   Drive carefully in the snow storm.  Amherst site seems ok.  Should sit behind the team bench and wear some funny hat so that we on.line can spot you.  If you sit with the parents on the normal side....will never see you.....unless you wave during halftime at the cameras.  Could say hello to the senior student announcers for me....especially Spencer Noon.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 08, 2013, 12:55:10 PM
I will do that...the saying hi part, not the funny hat part.  I will be on the parents side. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 08, 2013, 01:25:53 PM
Given that Tufts is challenged offensively, I see this the same way.  Also, if the referrees allow this to be a physical game, Amherst will dominate the inside.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 09, 2013, 08:41:23 AM
Well, that game was a little closer than I like them.  While Amherst never trailed, and in my eyes were clearly the better team, there was a 4 or 5 minute stretch (maybe longer) from the middle to the later part of the second half where they just couldn't put Tufts away.  And, to Tufts credit, they never gave less than 100%.  It was a tense game to watch.  As with most of these games I think the refs did a decent job, most of the time.  There were some questionable calls both ways as there always are. 

Amherst had a little bit of foul trouble in the first half, but Savannah Holness and Haley Zwecker came in and did a really nice job while they were out there.  Marcia Voigt and Jasmine Hardy played all 40 minutes.  Four media timeouts make that a lot more do-able than normal.  In looking at the season stats, Jasmine Hardy should go over 1,000 minutes for the season.  That is a lot of basketball.

Williams squeaked it out against Ithaca...in overtime.  So the Elite Eight has two NESCAC teams still alive.  If they each win their next two games, it will be an all NESCAC final.  That would be cool.  But first, Amherst has to get by Widener today, and Williams gets Whitman.  Good luck, ladies.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 09, 2013, 08:52:25 AM
Did a little multli-tasking last evening, and watched both Williams and Amherst. Too very good games.  The difference in Amherst and Tufts is that Amherst has more shooters, and that was the difference in last nights game.  Both teams play great defense, but when Amherst had some open outside looks, they were able to convert.  5 three-pointers to zero for Tufts was definitely the difference,  along with excellent free-throw shooting.  It was definitely an ugly game as neither team could get into any kind of flow offensively, and Tufts in particular struggled to get any type of good open looks. However, Amherst's defense is intent on keeping teams from getting open outside looks, so that is not a surprise.  Williams came up big in the closing moments and beat a good Ithaca team.  It would be great to see both NESCAC teams advance to the final four, particularly when I think everyone would agree that this has not been a strong year all around for the conference. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 09, 2013, 09:02:58 AM
Congrats to the Ephs, hopefully they can pull it out tonight and make it to their first final four.  They will likely need to go a bit deeper into the bench after several starters played more than 40 minutes vs. a very intense and physical Ithaca defense, hopefully they have enough left in the tank.  Ithaca (maybe with a bit of help from the Amherst assistant) had the Ephs scouted very well and did a good job of defending the post, often collapsing the defense inside.  But incredible individual games from Baecher and Harding (who hit numerous clutch high-stakes shots) carried the day.  Some highlights:

http://athletics.williams.edu/video/index
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 09, 2013, 09:38:50 AM
Board posters all....nice write ups of the Amherst game last night.   As they say....defense wins championships.....a little offense helps too.
Was too tense/tired after watching last night's games....both games in LeFrak.  Nice to see Amherst's "reserves" contribute when needed.  Both Tufts and Amherst played the same number of players.....teams do get shorter at this time of the year....unless it is their style to wear opponents down.  I fear that Amherst's opponent today is one of those teams.
Some sidenote comments.......
It seems that there were some starters of Amherst's Nat. Champ. team at both sites......Shannon Finucane , the Ithaca head JV coach in Willy town and Sumfun's daughter, Sarah Layman, at LeFrak.  Of course, the three Amherst seniors have the rings.  Those 5 players could beat most teams now, IMO.

Actually, saw Sumfun at the game...on the videocast.
NHNESCACFan.....should say hi to Sumfun tonight if you are going again.  Ask one of the Amherst announcers to point her daughter out and go from there....unless you have already met.
Nice crowd in LeFrak for the game.  There were free T-shirts of sorts at the game that may have helped the students' attendance....did cost money to get in.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 09, 2013, 09:56:39 AM
I did actually talk a little bit with Sarah's mom last night.  It is always nice to see the graduates return.  Unfortunately, I will not be there tonight.  They'll have to muddle through without me.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 09, 2013, 12:40:30 PM
Coaches can also play shorter benches because NCAA gets them ready for Final Four broadcast with "media" time outs which normally are not used in D3 contests as there are no ads running during webcasts.  Not sure what organization or network is broadcasting from Holland this year, but media time outs change the flow of the game in such a way that it is vital to get used to them during tourney run.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BruinFan on March 09, 2013, 01:21:38 PM
Quote from: sumfun on March 09, 2013, 12:40:30 PM
Coaches can also play shorter benches because NCAA gets them ready for Final Four broadcast with "media" time outs which normally are not used in D3 contests as there are no ads running during webcasts.  Not sure what organization or network is broadcasting from Holland this year, but media time outs change the flow of the game in such a way that it is vital to get used to them during tourney run.

So no media time outs during the regular season in the NESCAC? In the Northwest Conference regular season there are always 2 media time outs per half (under 12 and under 8) whether there is media present or not. Going to 4 medias in the tournament is still an adjustment and slows the game down more than I would like.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 09, 2013, 01:49:51 PM
Quote from: BruinFan on March 09, 2013, 01:21:38 PM
Quote from: sumfun on March 09, 2013, 12:40:30 PM
Coaches can also play shorter benches because NCAA gets them ready for Final Four broadcast with "media" time outs which normally are not used in D3 contests as there are no ads running during webcasts.  Not sure what organization or network is broadcasting from Holland this year, but media time outs change the flow of the game in such a way that it is vital to get used to them during tourney run.

So no media time outs during the regular season in the NESCAC? In the Northwest Conference regular season there are always 2 media time outs per half (under 12 and under 8) whether there is media present or not. Going to 4 medias in the tournament is still an adjustment and slows the game down more than I would like.

NCAA.com will be broadcasting the games once again... and they do run ads, mainly NCAA ones, during media timeouts.

Also, more schools and conferences are going to media timeouts for two reasons: schools are starting to figure out how to advertise during these breaks, even if it is just for their schools, and they are trying to get teams completely used to the breaks should they make the tournament. Also, some games tend to go a bit quicker with the different timeout structure that media timeouts bring with them. Instead of 4 drawn out full timeouts and 2 30 second timeouts... things move  a bit quicker when there are 5 30 second time outs (one has to be used in the first half or you lose it) and just 1 full timeout.

Finally, there are different structures to how you use the media timeouts during the season (NCAA mandates the under 16, under 12, under 8, under 4 plus the first timeout called in the second half is extended to a media timeout in the tournament). So you can go as short as 60 seconds for these and you can even modify down to just two timeouts as pointed out the NWC does.

I have seen more and more schools adding these and if schools can figure it out... they can use these for advertising opportunities.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BruinFan on March 09, 2013, 02:37:47 PM
I think the additional nuances to the timeouts taken in the NWC are the following:

A full time out taken prior to the under 12, eliminates or "burns" the first media timout.
A full time out taken between the 8 and 12 minute mark eliminates the under 8 media timeout.
30 second timeouts do not "burn" the media.

Full timeouts are 75 seconds, with the first horn warning coming at 60 seconds.
If the first timeout of each half is a 30, it is extended to a full timeout, but the team is only charged for a 30. (I don't get that one.)

Each team has 4 fulls and 2 30s.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescachoopsfan2 on March 09, 2013, 02:40:52 PM
Tufts has played with a shorter bench for the last few weeks due to injury.

Amherst got more points on three-pointers (15) and free throws (18) than they did on two-pointers (14) and still won. Not quite as painful as the Andrew Olson game from all those years ago, but still: another brutal loss for Tufts basketball in a Sweet 16 game at LeFrak.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 09, 2013, 08:45:48 PM
Congrats to Williams on making their first Final Four!  Williams in the first half played the best half of hoops I've ever seen from a Williams women's team.  They really could do no wrong, moving the ball beautifully for open looks all over the floor.  They ran out of steam a bit in the second half after all the tough minutes played during the weekend, but had such a dominant lead by halftime that it didn't matter.  What an unbelievable game from the Williams post players.  Baecher and Rainer combined for 28 points, 16 boards, 4 assists, 5 steals, and 12 massive blocks.  Wow.  Tremendous weekend for the Ephs and an exciting weekend in Chandler with three NCAA wins!!  Go Ephs!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 09, 2013, 09:19:40 PM
Amherst wins tonight to go to its 5th straight Final Four....joining Williams.   Amherst led by 7 at the half  30-23 and led by double digits through out the second half.  Final was 50 to 45.  Bridget Crowley and M. Voigt along with Jasmine Hardy....three senior captains came up big.....Bridget had 17 points and 16 boards!  Voigt was the leading scorer in the game with over 20 points 7 assists and 8-9 rebounds.  Widener was game but was over matched on this night against a determined Amherst squad.  Meg Robertson had almost a double double but got into foul trouble.  S. Holness stepped in again and came up big again with her energy and quickness. 
Better comments on Sunday
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BruinFan on March 09, 2013, 10:33:22 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 09, 2013, 09:19:40 PM
Amherst wins tonight to go to its 5th straight Final Four

Amherst road to the Final 4 over the last five seasons:

Tournament Home Games:  20
Neutral/Away Games:  0

Final Four Record:  3-5

I have geography jealousy.   ;)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jumpshot on March 10, 2013, 03:31:59 AM
Congratulations to the Williams College women's basketball team on going to the Final Four! The hard work, cohesiveness, and leadership of the six seniors, blended with contributions of teammates, produced a fabulous result Saturday in Williamstown for the team, parents, the community (including lots of young cheering kids), and other fans. Well done!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 10, 2013, 09:12:59 AM
Bruin Fan....welcome to the board.   Amherst's teams have earned the rights to host by their play during the regular seasons and conference tourneys.  Having said that....they also won at home...winning 86 straight games...two shy of the all time D3 records.  This senior class has set a new record of wins....surpassing the class of 2012 by one.  They move forward, hopefully to even their Final 4 record to 5-5 and win another title....maybe against arch rival Williams.  Ahead of myself a big bunch.  Just saying that members of the team want to overcome last year's trip where key members were ill and tried to play through during two losses.....want to show others what Amherst basketball play can achieve.
Better write up and more accurate scoring are found on the Amherst web site.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 10, 2013, 06:40:12 PM
Quote from: BruinFan on March 09, 2013, 02:37:47 PM
I think the additional nuances to the timeouts taken in the NWC are the following:

A full time out taken prior to the under 12, eliminates or "burns" the first media timout.
A full time out taken between the 8 and 12 minute mark eliminates the under 8 media timeout.
30 second timeouts do not "burn" the media.

Full timeouts are 75 seconds, with the first horn warning coming at 60 seconds.
If the first timeout of each half is a 30, it is extended to a full timeout, but the team is only charged for a 30. (I don't get that one.)

Each team has 4 fulls and 2 30s.

NWC is using just two media timeouts a half, right?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 11, 2013, 08:03:07 AM
Williams will of course be an underdog vs. Depauw, but when playing their best the Ephs can beat anyone.  Biggest concern heading into this game is keeping Depauw off the glass.  Despite winning the last three games, the Ephs got killed on the boards ...  giving up 54 offensive boards while only snagging 23, despite having a big height advantage.  Meanwhile, despite being undersized, DePauw dominated the offensive glass all year.  Part of that is a factor of the Ephs blocking so many shots, which takes them out of rebounding position and also results in a lot of balls going back to the shooter.  Even so, though, Williams needs to do a much better job of all five players boxing out, and that will be the key to hanging with DePauw, because the Ephs are truly stellar defensively at stopping the first shot attempt.  I'm sure that will be a point of emphasis for Coach Manning all week. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on March 11, 2013, 09:47:10 AM
nescac1: Maybe white upper middle class ladies with high SATs can't jump.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 11, 2013, 04:34:05 PM
Frank U......How about middle class or lower white women?  We are getting into a touchy area here....when class and race are brought into post even in playful jest. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 11, 2013, 04:54:02 PM
I hope Amherst or Williams take home the championship, but honestly I don't see anyone beating DePauw this year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on March 11, 2013, 05:11:54 PM
Right, wrong, insensitive or irrelevant, your correspondent calls 'em as he sees 'em.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: toad22 on March 11, 2013, 10:32:00 PM
Williams does have some unique talents on the team this year. Maybe Depauw is just too good, and those talents won't be important. This Williams team is a tough minded group, and I am quite hopeful that they will perform to their abilities. Good luck Williams!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 12, 2013, 11:58:56 AM
Nice write up on the front page of the Amherst team.  Would expect one soon on the Williams squad.
More to come as the weekend approaches.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 12, 2013, 01:00:35 PM
Yep, I'm working on the Williams write up. Hope to finish tonight.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 13, 2013, 09:43:38 AM
The Amherst website has posted a preview of the final 4 and includes besides Amherst, the other teams ....also some promises of video, pics , interviews.   Looks like one of the SiD's is traveling out.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 13, 2013, 02:48:55 PM
Congrats to Williams coach Pat Manning on being named regional coach of the year, and to Claire Baecher for making first team all-region in New England. 

Pretty incredible that (per the front page) one of Depauw's stars is playing in the tourney with a torn ACL ... that's insane.  Hasn't seemed to slow Depauw down one bit. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 14, 2013, 07:20:53 PM
BruinFan,

I totally get your drift about Amherst home NCAA record vs their Final Four record. Nothing like playing at home as Amherst is 2 games away from the home NCAA record.  They have been fortunate/lucky/talented enough to have #1 regional ranking in an area full of teams which usually means if you keep winning you get to host. 

As for the wins or lack of in The Shirk and DeVos Center....no excuses except the Final Four is the toughest competition, as well as going to the midwest means bus loads of fans do not follow.  A loud contingent of loyal fans, parents and a few alums have to compete against teams that can ship in many.  I've always been amazed at the amount of fans from George Fox that made the long trip.  We all know that noise and numbers help a team. 

Congrats to the 4 teams still in the hunt.  Looking forward to great games and wonderful Holland hospitality this weekend.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 15, 2013, 03:08:28 PM
Anyone figure GP to Dartmouth or Columbia?  Would be a great choice either place.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: sumfun on March 15, 2013, 04:27:40 PM
Nope,  I think he likes playing for NCAA Championships.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on March 15, 2013, 05:32:27 PM
More money, more prestige, more challenge, more pressure, more risk, possibly less fun in the Ivy League.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ramfan on March 15, 2013, 06:13:56 PM
You're the #6 team in the country, in the D3 semifinals have the ball with 25 seconds to go in the first half with a chance to take a lead into halftime and that's the best play you can come up with ?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on March 15, 2013, 06:24:02 PM
Quote from: ramfan on March 15, 2013, 06:13:56 PM
You're the #6 team in the country, in the D3 semifinals have the ball with 25 seconds to go in the first half with a chance to take a lead into halftime and that's the best play you can come up with ?

Voight is a great player, but relying on the isolation play for her is not going to work too often.  Whitewater guards are too quick, and good defenders.  Once they made her pull up, the play was done.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 15, 2013, 06:24:43 PM
Quote from: ramfan on March 15, 2013, 06:13:56 PM
You're the #6 team in the country, in the D3 semifinals have the ball with 25 seconds to go in the first half with a chance to take a lead into halftime and that's the best play you can come up with ?

From watching G.P. Gromacki before and during that play, I'm under the impression that that possession did not go according to plan.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 15, 2013, 06:25:53 PM
We're seated next to the Amherst bench and Gromacki was calling for Pritchard to set the screen. She didn't get the instruction, someone else tried to set the screen and Pritchard sort of wandered to a spot on the floor where she was out of position and wide open (because of it).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 15, 2013, 07:36:36 PM
 Looks like GP didn't subscribe to the stats that say up 3 with 7 secs left u foul the dribbler, not giving them the chance 2 tie with a 3-pter. The dribbler was even going to the left(away from her shooting hand).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jumpshot on March 15, 2013, 07:40:35 PM
Another bad loss by Amherst in the Final Four ---giving up a 12 point lead with a 24-10 run by huge underdog Wisconsin-Whitewater. The Lord Jeff women worked so hard all year and are still to be congratulated on a fine season. Gromacki may well consider Dartmouth.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 15, 2013, 07:54:21 PM
Wow.  It is easy to pick nits from the couch, but up 12 with 3 minutes to play, you've got to win that game.  The Amherst women played well above expectations all season.  They should be very proud of their accomplishments.  I agree with the earlier poster.  Up three, seconds remain, foul the dribbler.

But again.  Congratulations ladies.  You had a great year that you should be proud of.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on March 15, 2013, 08:08:17 PM
Quote from: jumpshot on March 15, 2013, 07:40:35 PM
Another bad loss by Amherst in the Final Four ---giving up a 12 point lead with a 24-10 run by huge underdog Wisconsin-Whitewater. The Lord Jeff women worked so hard all year and are still to be congratulated on a fine season. Gromacki may well consider Dartmouth.

Congrats on a fantastic season for the Jeffs.  But I don't agree about UWW being the underdog, having seen both teams play.  Wouldn't surprise me if they beat DePauw too.  They have a very, very solid and balanced team and have played all year against teams in a conference that is, top to bottom, probably the best in the country.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BruinFan on March 15, 2013, 08:14:37 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 10, 2013, 06:40:12 PM
Quote from: BruinFan on March 09, 2013, 02:37:47 PM
I think the additional nuances to the timeouts taken in the NWC are the following:

A full time out taken prior to the under 12, eliminates or "burns" the first media timout.
A full time out taken between the 8 and 12 minute mark eliminates the under 8 media timeout.
30 second timeouts do not "burn" the media.

Full timeouts are 75 seconds, with the first horn warning coming at 60 seconds.
If the first timeout of each half is a 30, it is extended to a full timeout, but the team is only charged for a 30. (I don't get that one.)

Each team has 4 fulls and 2 30s.

NWC is using just two media timeouts a half, right?

Busy week, so finally a response to the question.
Correct, the NWC uses two media timeouts per half all season long.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 15, 2013, 08:52:37 PM
Williams up by one at the half.  Depauw is REALLY good.  Much quicker than Williams, absolutely relentless on both ends going after loose balls, rebounds, defending hard.  Williams shot pretty well (four threes), moved the ball very well, and used their size advantage inside to deny the numerous Depauw players driving into the lane (six blocks).  Unfortunately, Baecher picked up her second foul on a real ticky-tack call ( course Williams received the benefit of a few calls themselves, so hard to complain) and left the game with Williams up 8, at which point the Eph defense pretty much fell apart.  Williams has to do a better job on the glass (as expected, too many offensive rebounds for Depauw) and in avoiding careless turnovers (at least three were totally avoidable, and two led to breakaway baskets).  If they do that, and Rainer and Baecher stay out of foul trouble, they can win the game because their half-court defense had been dynamite and once they get bast Depauw's pressure on the outside, they can get good looks at the basket.  But it's easy to see why Depauw is number one and Williams really has its hands full ... 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 15, 2013, 09:03:39 PM
Quote from: BruinFan on March 15, 2013, 08:14:37 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 10, 2013, 06:40:12 PM
Quote from: BruinFan on March 09, 2013, 02:37:47 PM
I think the additional nuances to the timeouts taken in the NWC are the following:

A full time out taken prior to the under 12, eliminates or "burns" the first media timout.
A full time out taken between the 8 and 12 minute mark eliminates the under 8 media timeout.
30 second timeouts do not "burn" the media.

Full timeouts are 75 seconds, with the first horn warning coming at 60 seconds.
If the first timeout of each half is a 30, it is extended to a full timeout, but the team is only charged for a 30. (I don't get that one.)

Each team has 4 fulls and 2 30s.

NWC is using just two media timeouts a half, right?

Busy week, so finally a response to the question.
Correct, the NWC uses two media timeouts per half all season long.

OK... thanks. Your description wasn't adding up for me so I wanted to make sure I knew how many they were using first - now it makes more sense.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 15, 2013, 09:32:20 PM
Depauw pulling away ... same issues, Williams can't get the ball inside, some careless turnovers, Depauw is killing them off the glass.  The announcer is driving me nuts since she keeps acting surprised that Depauw is dominating the boards ... Depauw is a great rebounding team, and Williams, despite it's height, is not.  Williams is really doing all they can to hang in, but Depauw is just so much quicker and more athletic, and that is the difference. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 15, 2013, 09:48:37 PM
Very good effort for the Ephs, losing by only three.  The key was the eight point run be Depauw late in the first half with Baecher sitting.  Williams when they got into the half court set was better, but Depauw more than made up for that with ton of steals and transition baskets, Williams just wasn't used to players with that type of quickness on defense.  Hopefully the Ephs can rebound from this and go out on a high note tomorrow vs. Amherst ... certainly not the typical consolation game, a lot more on the line than you'd expect for that sort of game as neither team will want to end the season with a loss to their arch-rival. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jumpshot on March 15, 2013, 09:53:03 PM
Williams women represent themselves and Williams College well in a competitive game. Depauw fundamentally sound, athletic, really hustle, pass well, play defense, execute offensive system, good game plan ---in short, well coached, quick basketball players.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 16, 2013, 09:23:59 AM
Nice to see all the posters from the Ephs on this board.  In any case I got the game that I wanted...maybe Frank U. too.  However, in the the lower bracket....at a time when the men's games are on. 
The remarks from the Amherst's Coach G.  speaks well for him...on the game.  He is proud of his team and their efforts.  He feels he let them down a bit....my interpretation.  The two shots by the same Whitewater player were special.  Coach G. remarked that it was as someone was guiding them in.
Me....more of a sore loser type.  The game, I feel, was not determined by the players on the floor for both teams.....both teams played hard and gave it all they had.  I will just point at the stats.....Amherst had more blocks, more steals, less TO, and both teams had about the same shooting % overall and on the foul line.  Rebounds were even and Amherst had double the assists.  The Warhawks had more than double the number of foul attempts!  Oh well, as in the men's game with Middlebury, if a buzzer beater or two beats Amherst, hats off to the Warhawks!
On the fourth game between the teams.....Go Jeffs.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on March 16, 2013, 09:48:44 AM
Quote from: amh63 on March 16, 2013, 09:23:59 AM
Nice to see all the posters from the Ephs on this board.  In any case I got the game that I wanted...maybe Frank U. too.  However, in the the lower bracket....at a time when the men's games are on. 
The remarks from the Amherst's Coach G.  speaks well for him...on the game.  He is proud of his team and their efforts.  He feels he let them down a bit....my interpretation.  The two shots by the same Whitewater player were special.  Coach G. remarked that it was as someone was guiding them in.
Me....more of a sore loser type.  The game, I feel, was not determined by the players on the floor for both teams.....both teams played hard and gave it all they had.  I will just point at the stats.....Amherst had more blocks, more steals, less TO, and both teams had about the same shooting % overall and on the foul line.  Rebounds were even and Amherst had double the assists.  The Warhawks had more than double the number of foul attempts!  Oh well, as in the men's game with Middlebury, if a buzzer beater or two beats Amherst, hats off to the Warhawks!
On the fourth game between the teams.....Go Jeffs.

As a neutral observer, I didn't see anything to suggest the refs influenced the outcome.  Foul shot disparity by itself means nothing and can often be attributed to factors other than the refs.  For example I thought the Warhawk guards were much more aggressive driving to the hoop and drawing contact. Kumerow had an excellent variety of low post moves with her back to the basket, though she only had a couple more FT attempts than Robertson.  The Jeffs starters all played more than 41 minutes, a grand total of 8 minutes combined by subs Holness and Zwecker, fatigue usually shows up first by being a step slow on defense.

Congratulations to both teams for a hard fought battle that was decided by, in my opinion, a couple of miraculous shots not the refs.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 16, 2013, 10:00:02 AM
I would tend to agree with Amh63--I thought that the officiating was questionable, and that some iffy calls kept UWW in the game early on in the second half, when they could not get a shot off to safe their lives. However, the bottom line in this game is that when you are up 12 with about two minutes to go, and you end up losing, you have only one place to look, and that is not at the referees.  Amherst did not stop the three (yes, they were tough shots, but the shooter was able to find some space to get the shot off), and did not execute on offense down the stretch.  So give UWW credit for pulling out a miracle win, and give Amherst credit for a great season.  Early on in the season I did not think this was an especially good Amherst team-no depth (as indicated by the fact that there was not one sub in the second half), and not a really good shooting team.  But there tenacious and consistent defense got them to the final four.

As far as Williams, they ran into a better team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 16, 2013, 10:58:37 AM
Maine 1....agree with your point wrt not preventing the three ball.  On one, Meg Robertson came to block one but was late getting to the player.
Roundball....good point with respect to fatigue point.  Did I say I was a neutral poster?  I will point out that you look at the stats that give you foul attempts per period.  Especially the first period when both teams are fresh.  Go even to the 2nd period.
On the comments relating to depth of teams, etc.....one sees that the Wiliams team used basically 6 players....their seniors.  Whitewater with their depth kept their starters on the floor quite long....their center was on the floor for 45 minutes.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on March 16, 2013, 11:25:01 AM
When in sport one's favorite team loses, and one knows that 99 44/100ths percent of the world believes that the officials' jobbing of the game caused the team to lose it, it serves one's character in the eyes of the world to take the high road and be silent about the jobbing.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on March 16, 2013, 11:48:56 AM
Quote from: amh63 on March 16, 2013, 10:58:37 AM
Maine 1....agree with your point wrt not preventing the three ball.  On one, Meg Robertson came to block one but was late getting to the player.
Roundball....good point with respect to fatigue point.  Did I say I was a neutral poster?  I will point out that you look at the stats that give you foul attempts per period.  Especially the first period when both teams are fresh.  Go even to the 2nd period.
On the comments relating to depth of teams, etc.....one sees that the Wiliams team used basically 6 players....their seniors.  Whitewater with their depth kept their starters on the floor quite long....their center was on the floor for 45 minutes.

Kumerow was on the floor 45 minutes but no other Whitewater starter played more than 37 and three were in the 33-34 range including the overtime.  Every Amherst starter played more than 41.  All the Final Four teams are very good but its not coincidence to me that the two deepest teams are playing for the championship.

But to me the FT disparity was mainly due to Warhawks Thill, Merg and Reeves driving hard to the hoop with greater frequency.  Voight was the only Jeff guard really looking to drive and most often she was forced to dish or shoot a pull up rather than getting to the rim.  The contact at the rim is what was drawing many of the foul calls.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 16, 2013, 12:25:09 PM
Quote from: NH NESCAC Fan on March 15, 2013, 07:54:21 PM
Wow.  It is easy to pick nits from the couch, but up 12 with 3 minutes to play, you've got to win that game.  The Amherst women played well above expectations all season.  They should be very proud of their accomplishments.  I agree with the earlier poster.  Up three, seconds remain, foul the dribbler.

But again.  Congratulations ladies.  You had a great year that you should be proud of.

I was watching the second half, when they went up by 12 (54-42 I think it was) with 2:50 to play went upstairs to watch the Georgetown Syracuse game because I figured Amherst had it in the bag came back downstairs about 15 minutes later just to see how much Amherst won by and was absolutely stunned they were playing in overtime.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 16, 2013, 12:31:34 PM
And also, I think third place games are meaningless, but the Amherst/Williams 3rd place game this afternoon should be interesting.  No disrespect to Whitewater, but DePauw is clearly the better team tonight, so the 3rd place game might be even more interesting then the championship game.  Since Amherst has a younger team this year then last, and the game is against Williams, hopefully they show up to play, but would understand why if they came out flat.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 16, 2013, 02:07:14 PM
Frank U.....advice on character ?  Interesting post and thanks anyway.

Speaking about character traits.  Once again, some person or persons is playing with my Karma points.  I care less about the points than the person who did it.  I post it here since I made a post wrt to the people in the strips that could not stay out of the game, IMO.  Anyway, I would like posters who did it to simply come out and state their action...Do even need to know why.  If they do, tells me about the person's character.
When I played BB on the inter city blacktops....it was normal to call out a person's play up front and then try to prove it on the court.  If a person was beat, he openly acknowledged it.  Respect, character and no hard feelings on both sides.
Hope to hear from somebody.
Agree with 7 Express post on the 4 PM game.  Didn't the MBB side drop it for an All-Star game?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 16, 2013, 02:51:29 PM
Don't sell UW-Whitewater short. DePauw is not the same team with Gasaway injured.  She's the team's top scorer but logged 9 minutes and two points against Williams because of a torn ACL. I'm not sure the Tigers have someone to match Kumerow down low.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 16, 2013, 03:14:48 PM
Amh, not sure if it was because of the All Star game, but they haven't played it on the men's side for quite a while; 3 or 4 years possibly even longer.

I think this year it actually would be beneficial to Amherst; a young team that made a nice run that came up short.  Absolutely awful for a veteran team that was expected to cut down the nets.  That's how the St. Thomas/Amherst game last year was a total blowout.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jumpshot on March 16, 2013, 03:32:52 PM
Amh63 (aka self-proclaimed "sore loser") -- clearly the referees did not squander a 12-point lead with three minutes to play. UW-Whitewater kept playing hard while the Lord Jeffs appeared to relax.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on March 16, 2013, 03:44:46 PM
Quote from: gordonmann on March 16, 2013, 02:51:29 PM
Don't sell UW-Whitewater short. DePauw is not the same team with Gasaway injured.  She's the team's top scorer but logged 9 minutes and two points against Williams because of a torn ACL. I'm not sure the Tigers have someone to match Kumerow down low.

Would agree Gordon.  UWW can be very tough and has been through the WIAC wars.  If they play like they did last weekend at home (I don't think they did yesterday) then they will be tough for anyone to beat including DePauw.

But DePauw is very impressive with speed and quickness at every position.  While they may well not be able to deny Kumerow her points down low, I'm not sure Kumerow will be able to stay with her man in a MTM defense.  But I think the real key for UWW will be to keep DePauw off the offensive boards.  Amherst had a ton of o-boards vs UWW especially early in the game and DePauw is even better on the o-boards.  DePauw shoots so well (#9 team FG % and #2 team 3pt %) you can't give them more than one chance.  If DePauw gets many more than 10 o-boards they probably win going away.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: lefrakenstein on March 16, 2013, 03:45:10 PM
That was heartbreaking. I feel so bad for the seniors. Have to hand it to that UWW girl though. What an incredible performance.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: lefrakenstein on March 16, 2013, 03:46:51 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 16, 2013, 02:07:14 PM
Frank U.....advice on character ?  Interesting post and thanks anyway.

Speaking about character traits.  Once again, some person or persons is playing with my Karma points.  I care less about the points than the person who did it.  I post it here since I made a post wrt to the people in the strips that could not stay out of the game, IMO.  Anyway, I would like posters who did it to simply come out and state their action...Do even need to know why.  If they do, tells me about the person's character.
When I played BB on the inter city blacktops....it was normal to call out a person's play up front and then try to prove it on the court.  If a person was beat, he openly acknowledged it.  Respect, character and no hard feelings on both sides.
Hope to hear from somebody.
Agree with 7 Express post on the 4 PM game.  Didn't the MBB side drop it for an All-Star game?

I gave you two +1's during the whole broadcaster kerfuffle. I wouldn't sweat it. They don't mean anything.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on March 16, 2013, 03:50:14 PM
Quote from: lefrakenstein on March 16, 2013, 03:45:10 PM
That was heartbreaking. I feel so bad for the seniors. Have to hand it to that UWW girl though. What an incredible performance.

Agreed, tough way for anyone to lose.  Amherst girls exceeded almost everyone's expectations and hopefully, when the pain fades a bit, they will be able to look back on the season with the pride they should feel for a fantastic season.

Don't know if you've heard the story about the UWW player who took her own life earlier in the season and to whom her teammates have dedicated their season, but it almost seemed that someone was guiding those buzzer beaters into the net.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 16, 2013, 03:52:24 PM
We've released our All-Americans. Congratulations to Claire and Marcia.

http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2013/03/womens-all-americans
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 16, 2013, 03:52:59 PM
Quote from: 7express on March 16, 2013, 03:14:48 PM
Amh, not sure if it was because of the All Star game, but they haven't played it on the men's side for quite a while; 3 or 4 years possibly even longer.

I think this year it actually would be beneficial to Amherst; a young team that made a nice run that came up short.  Absolutely awful for a veteran team that was expected to cut down the nets.  That's how the St. Thomas/Amherst game last year was a total blowout.

The All-Star game did replace the consolation game when it was becoming very clear the third-place game was not getting the best out of teams (i.e. Franklin and Marshall a few years ago). Unless the WBCA comes up with an all-star game like the NABC has, I don't see the third place game disappearing any time soon.

Also, if we go by the demeanor from last night's press conference and what I am watching on the floor right now... I am not that confident Amherst is going to make this a game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 16, 2013, 04:13:11 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 16, 2013, 03:52:59 PM
Quote from: 7express on March 16, 2013, 03:14:48 PM
Amh, not sure if it was because of the All Star game, but they haven't played it on the men's side for quite a while; 3 or 4 years possibly even longer.

I think this year it actually would be beneficial to Amherst; a young team that made a nice run that came up short.  Absolutely awful for a veteran team that was expected to cut down the nets.  That's how the St. Thomas/Amherst game last year was a total blowout.

The All-Star game did replace the consolation game when it was becoming very clear the third-place game was not getting the best out of teams (i.e. Franklin and Marshall a few years ago). Unless the WBCA comes up with an all-star game like the NABC has, I don't see the third place game disappearing any time soon.

Also, if we go by the demeanor from last night's press conference and what I am watching on the floor right now... I am not that confident Amherst is going to make this a game.

Like in a lot of these situations, you can judge determination and "came to play" status by individual players, and some are definitely here to play. I would especially cite Bridget Crowley as one of those.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 16, 2013, 04:29:20 PM
This is a battle... I am more than thrilled. Hats off to both teams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 16, 2013, 04:32:22 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 16, 2013, 04:29:20 PM
This is a battle... I am more than thrilled. Hats off to both teams.

Good. Glad you came around. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 16, 2013, 06:06:40 PM
Congrats to the Eph women on capping off a tremendous year with a win over Amherst.  Normally a third place game is a pretty dispiriting experience, but playing Amherst definitely upped the ante, especially for an Eph team that has really struggled to beat the Jeffs since Gromacki arrived.  Tremendous way for the best senior class Williams has ever had to end their careers, with a win over Amherst on the big stage.  Go Ephs!  Both Williams and Amherst lose a ton of talent, especially Williams.  Baecher and Rainer are basically irreplaceable as a dominant interior duo. 

The Ephs will be led next year by Ellen Cook and Kellie MacDonald, both of him really grew as players in the NCAA and showed that they are capable of scoring vs. elite defenders.  Frosh Mary Kate O'Brien, Katie Litman, and Oge Uwanka all got some valuable big game minutes today, and they will likely be called upon to step up in a big way and play much bigger roles next season.  How much that trio improves will determine whether Williams can return to the NCAA's ...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jumpshot on March 16, 2013, 06:09:35 PM
Williams senior women have the rest of their lives to savor a final game victory over Amherst, despite 22 turnovers, as Lord Jeffs make only 24% of 70 shots. Not sure that a consolation game has merit; perhaps an All-Star game would expand participation for other deserving seniors.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: lefrakenstein on March 17, 2013, 01:37:03 PM
Quote from: Roundball999 on March 16, 2013, 03:50:14 PM
Quote from: lefrakenstein on March 16, 2013, 03:45:10 PM
That was heartbreaking. I feel so bad for the seniors. Have to hand it to that UWW girl though. What an incredible performance.

Agreed, tough way for anyone to lose.  Amherst girls exceeded almost everyone's expectations and hopefully, when the pain fades a bit, they will be able to look back on the season with the pride they should feel for a fantastic season.

Don't know if you've heard the story about the UWW player who took her own life earlier in the season and to whom her teammates have dedicated their season, but it almost seemed that someone was guiding those buzzer beaters into the net.

Oh wow, I did not know that. Too bad they couldn't finish the season off with a title. They sure fought hard though.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 17, 2013, 01:51:44 PM
I didn't hear about the UWW story, either.  Wow. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on March 17, 2013, 02:12:53 PM
Quote from: nescac1 on March 17, 2013, 01:51:44 PM
I didn't hear about the UWW story, either.  Wow. 

Story here:  http://gazettextra.com/news/2013/mar/15/uw-whitewater-womens-team-feels-presence-former-te/
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 17, 2013, 03:47:35 PM
LeFrak....thanks for the support and advice.  Agree. Will return the favor.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: kate on March 17, 2013, 05:48:50 PM
Roundball 999 thank you so very much for giving everyone the link to that story.   Division 3 sports are indeed a Family.  Even as fans we feel that atmosphere, and we've never had a student who has played D3 sports.   Thank you again.   God bless the Family.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: WMass Fan on March 17, 2013, 06:01:50 PM
I am a first-time poster, and in full disclosure, an Amherst fan.  It's nice to see so much interest on this board.

I just wanted to say congratulations to Coach Gromacki, the assistant coaches, and the entire Amherst women's basketball team on your season.  You surpassed all expectations this year, and for that, you should be proud.

Where to start...Marcia Voigt.  You have the heart of a champion, and it was a pleasure watching you play.  It was obvious that you wanted another championship, and you almost willed your team to one.  You will go down as one of the greatest players to ever play for Amherst, and perhaps the best point guard.  To all three seniors...you gave 100% of yourselves all season long and set a great example for the underclassmen.  Underclassmen...So mature, so mentally tough.  We can't wait for next year!  To the team...you proved that with discipline and togetherness, the whole is definitely greater than the sum of its parts.

Coach Gromacki...I was an Amherst fan long before your arrival and can tell you firsthand the positive impact you have had on your team, the Amherst program, and the community.  Coach, thank you for bringing these wonderful women to our campus, coaching them up, and teaching them life lessons they will never forget.  Five Final Fours in five years.  Who does that?  No one.  Other schools have come and gone, Amherst players have come and gone, and every year for the past 5 years you have coached your team to the Final Four.  I want you to know how much the community appreciates what you have done, and the fine women you have brought to the Amherst community.  They are well-prepared to make a difference in this world, and for that, we thank you.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: frank uible on March 17, 2013, 09:44:00 PM
The answer is Alison Swain - as Casey Stengel used to say, you can look it up.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on April 09, 2013, 12:09:36 PM
Love to hear about coaching change rumors.  Let's dig and find out!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: lefrakenstein on April 10, 2013, 04:07:06 PM
Rachel Boyette a 6'3 center from Indian Rocks Christian HS in Tampa, FL has "committed" to amherst.

http://www.tampabay.com/hometeam/blog/ircs-rachel-boyette-commits-amherst-college/17078/
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on May 04, 2013, 07:34:03 PM
Unrelated note, but one that reminds us all of why these young women truly are special on the court and in the classroom...Jasmine Hardy (Amherst '13), while logging the most minutes in DIII this season, just learned that she will be graduating Magna Cum Laude, and has been named a Fulbright Scholar.  A great way to cap a great college career.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on May 07, 2013, 09:56:22 AM
NH NESAC FAN....thank for the ingo.    My congrats to Jasmine Hardy!  Those honors via the classroom and else ware are not easy to achieve at Amherst.  To get magna one has to not only get the grades but must receive a magna level grade on your thesis!  Proud parents and Coach G , I'm sure.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 23, 2013, 09:55:21 PM
The start of formal practice is just two weeks away.  Therefore, I will start the posting for the upcoming season.
Was up for Homecoming  and saw a number of players...both returning and new.  Met FY player Boyette, the Floridian, at the football game.  Her listed height of 6'3" seemed about right when she was near Meg Robertson.  Hope she can develop into a front court contributor this season...due to the lost of Bridget Crowley'13.  Did see that the number of players available for a student run practice session exceeded a dozen...more players than available during last season.  Depth would be nice to have this year.  Getting excited about the start of Basketball! :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on October 24, 2013, 10:47:27 AM
Excited to see new traditions start.  Though there are Final Four players on this team, no one is left from the National Championship Team.  We know the coaching is good, let's hope the leadership on and off the court develops. Anyone heard anything else about teams around the NESCAC?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 24, 2013, 11:36:52 AM
NEJeffsFan...welcome aboard.  Good point about  "leadership".  However, since there are no seniors on the team as well, it will have to come from the  juniors or sophs. 
On the Men Boards, info on recruits have been known early and teams' prospects well discussed.  On this board there has been very little if any news on new players.  Do not expect much discussion until rosters show up.
Went to check up on a name on the Amherst  roster and found listed the new FY players!  There are six  FY players.  Several caught my notice...one named Renner from Newton, Ma.  If she is related to a former player of the same family name and town, it is good news.  Jackie Renner, of the class of '12 was a three year starter on the championship team.  If related, the FY Renner should know what is expected of her wrt team play and defensive intensity.
There are two FY players from Richmond, Va.  I am familiar with the school, but not with the women BB program.  The school has sent academic strong student- athletes to conf schools.
Oh yes, met Marcia Voigt' 13 as she dropped in to greet. some of her teammates.  Once teammates, always teammates. :)
What was posted on the Amherst website has since been removed...hopefully temporarily.  Maybe for pix and other data?  Oh well.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on October 24, 2013, 01:59:14 PM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on October 24, 2013, 10:47:27 AM
Excited to see new traditions start.  Though there are Final Four players on this team, no one is left from the National Championship Team.  We know the coaching is good, let's hope the leadership on and off the court develops. Anyone heard anything else about teams around the NESCAC?

It's Amherst, so you know Gromacki and the rest of the coaches will have them ready to play every game.  May not finish unbeaten again (I'm pretty sure the Tufts game is @ Tufts this year) Williams is always tough, Bowdoin & Colby will probably bounce back, but they'll definitely be in the running for both the NESCAC championship as well as the NCAA championship.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on October 30, 2013, 05:56:40 PM
http://www.wbca.org/blog/index.cfm/2013/10/29/20132014-PreSeason-DIII-Poll/

Will be interesting to see what D3 Hoops thinks.  This poll puts a lot of faith in Gromacki and his process since Amherst lost 3 starters from last season.  They only have returning Robertson and Pritchard as starters along with Savannah Holness who had lots of minutes.  He's done well with young teams in the past.  Like seeing Tufts and Williams in the Top 10.  Always want the NESCAC to be well represented.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on October 31, 2013, 10:20:32 AM
Glad to see Williams ranked but, honestly, they are a BIG stretch for the top 10.  The Ephs are a very young, rebuilding team, returning only one senior who is not a rotation player, and lost four of their top five scorers, including all-American Claire Baecher.  And they don't have Gromacki, who has proven he can win with virtually any group of players, at the helm.  The Ephs do return two very good players to build around in Cook and Macdonald, but they will be counting on major leaps forward from last year's talented group of frosh, three of whom are likely to go from little-used reserves to starters (most likely Litman, Uwanaka, and O'Brien, who combined to average fewer than six ppg).  If the the Ephs make it to the NCAA tourney, it would be a VERY successful year for them, and they are probably a year away from again seriously contending for a NESCAC title, as Cook and Macdonald learn to be go-to players, and the rest of the team gains experience in the rotation.  The team does have talent, but loses a ton of leadership and experience. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 31, 2013, 07:00:41 PM
Went over quickly the returning players of the upper tier teams from last year...and knowing little of the new FY players on those teams..though having said hi to some on the Amherst squad...it could be an interesting season this year.  I believe Amherst and Tufts will become contenders again for the title.
Colby and Williams will be more of a wait and see situation.  The next few weeks should be revealing as rosters appear and one can then get a little more info about the talent level of the FYs.
Actually, my look at the Williams squad returning players was a big question mark wrt to experience, etc.  ..will soon find out with Babson on the schedule twice early in the season.
Agreed with your candid assessment...NESCAC1!
Have to consider The Polar Bear squad...as they return a large squad.  Bases my earlier comments on the teams that gave Amherst the toughest games.  Colby was a better match than Bowdoin...yet Bowdoin beat Colby handily.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on November 03, 2013, 04:53:55 PM
Nice to see a few posts with the new season coming up.  Very hard to form opinions on where some of the teams will be.  I think Tufts has some good players returning, and will give Amherst a run for the title.  I expect Williams will not be as strong, as they had some very strong seniors.  Even without know what Amherst has, Gromacki will have them in position to compete for the title.  Of the Maine teams, look for Bowdoin to be the top of that group.  Colby lost their top scorer and best all around table, and they just have not recruited the depth of talent that they had three of four years ago when McBride was there. Bates always gets its share of good players, so they could surprise.  And Conn College, Trinity and Wesleyan were improving last year.  As always, will be fun to watch the games.  Good luck to all the teams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: magicman on November 10, 2013, 04:58:27 AM
Bowdoin has a solid new recruit this year in 5'8" guard Marle Curle. I think she could contribute to the Polar Bears right away. The daughter of a coach, she has a good feel for the game, can shoot the 3, and also drive to the hoop. Was often called upon to guard the other team's best and biggest player. She's the type of player that will only get better each year. Bowdoin will be happy she elected to go there.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on November 10, 2013, 05:20:43 PM
  I understand that Bowdoin has received a verbal from Katie Kerrigan(2014), someone I've seen be an impact player in an AAU game with D1 recruits. Looks like the Polar Bears will be back next year as a factor at the top 25 level.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on November 12, 2013, 09:46:37 AM
Williams has its season preview and roster posted.  The Ephs have a very small roster (11 players) which is particularly light on veterans (no seniors, and only two juniors, as two upperclassmen who played little last season opted not to return to the team).  So it does look like a rebuilding year for the Ephs.  Williams does have excellent depth on the perimeter, adding three highly-regarded local perimeter recruits, plus a transfer who was a walk-on at the University of Minnesota, who will play behind a strong starting perimeter trio.  But up front the Ephs are perilously thin -- only three interior players on the roster, all of whom are only sophomores.  Sounds like the Ephs will be far more perimeter-oriented this season.  How quickly the three sophomores up front adapt to leading roles will be the biggest question for Williams to answer early in the season.  Finishing in the top three in NESCAC and/or making it into the NCAA tournament would be a hugely successful year for the Ephs this season. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 12, 2013, 06:31:37 PM
Amherst has just posted its roster and preview for the season.  Five new players which gives them a squad of 12.  Have added some depth to the front court.  Will be interesting to see how Coach G...like Coach K.. At Duke...can get the FY players to contribute.  See some talent, IMO, among the newcomers.  First game on the 19th and tough tournament opponents follow.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on November 17, 2013, 07:26:12 AM
very nice win for Colby over Brandeis at Brandeis.  Colby has a guard oriented team (they effectively play with five guards).  They have a nice seven-eight person rotation (I believe one of their good players may have been hurt).  They are small, so teams with size and talent inside will give them trouble.  Brandeis had size, but there big players could not convert in the post.  Colby will live and die by the three point shot (took 43 in two games this weekend), but all their players will take the three and all can hit the three.  They should improve from their bottom finish in the NESCAC last year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on November 17, 2013, 03:16:02 PM
Williams looks better than I expected winning their first two games with ease.  McDonald and Cook have transitioned from very good supporting starters to starring roles, as expected based on their play in last year's NCAA tourney.  But what is surprising for the Ephs is how good the newcomers look.  Soph transfer Jane Thompson is starting, she is tall, athletic and has a nice three point shot.  Two frosh look very good in addition and made big contributions off the bench in both of the first two games, McCall in particular is a good scorer off the bench.  Williams is playing a VERY small line-up starting no one over 6'0, so could have trouble vs. teams with strong post play, but they are extremely athletic and quick and space the floor well.  Still a very young team but with a promising future as the young players mature. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: magicman on November 17, 2013, 07:52:33 PM
Bowdoin opens up with 2 wins in the Salem State Tip Off Tournament.  Freshman Marle Curle scores 19 points in the Championship game and is chosen MVP. Nice start to her career. 8-)

Here's the link to the Bowdoin article:

http://athletics.bowdoin.edu/sports/wbkb/2013-14/releases/20131116d91u0s
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 19, 2013, 11:53:26 AM
Amherst has a busy week.  First game is today and another one on Thursday, followed by its tournament on the weekend.  The later start of the season is a little surprising, but maybe a schedule quick.  One learns not to question Coach G. :)
Am excited to see the team play, but only stats listed for the early home games...another thing that is strange to me.
At homecoming, met the Florida FY player and noticed that she " lost" an inch on the roster chart...but that is the Amherst way it seems.  In any case, will like to see her on the floor...her height is needed to replace Bridget from last season,IMO.  Meg Robertson, a presence since her first year....ROY..will need a backup and rest at times...which Bridget C. did last year.  Also interested in who will be the primary ball handling guard and the outside shooting guards.
One of the returnees did tell me that she felt that that Amherst would " be strong" up front this year.
Another FY player of interest is Renner of Newton.  I had posted earlier that she maybe related to another player of the same name and town who had transferred from a Div.1 school...Jackie Renner.
In any case, based on my inquiry, the FY Renner is a three sport athlete of note..fine student of course... coach G is proud of his players achievements in the classroom.  A trademark of his recruits, IMO.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 20, 2013, 01:10:28 PM
Amherst won its season opener over Keene last night...67-52.  Defense was fine, but Amherst had trouble with the zone defense of Keene.  Outside shots not dropping, and difficult to get the ball inside.  Shooting was not good overall...even left too many points on the foul line.
Number of FYs played and impressed with hustle and defense.  Leave judgement for another day and after more games...of Amherst defending its conference title with this young, but talented team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on November 20, 2013, 11:09:33 PM
 Amherst should get a test this weekend if they meet Ithaca in their tourney.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on November 20, 2013, 11:14:26 PM
  Just saw that Farmingdale St(Ithaca's 1st round opponent) took #18 Wm Paterson into 2 OT, so Amherst should get a test no matter which 2nd round opponent.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 21, 2013, 08:49:38 AM
Good to have solid opponents early to welcome the FYs to college play.  Saw that One front court player of note was not dressed..SH.  Spoke to her father at  homecoming...dad stated that they were awaiting a doctor clearance at the time.  There is a game tonight!
Last season, Ithaca college had a former player as an assistant coach.  See that she has left.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 21, 2013, 08:40:49 PM
Amherst beats a game Skidmore team in LeFrak 63-52.  It was close at the half with Amherst only ahead by a point.  Amherst got behind and only took the lead late in the half.  In the second half, it was another story as Amherst Meg Robertson starts to take over underneath.  Foul shooting greatly improved and fewer three's taken and of those made, more made.  More experienced players in the game and Amherst controls the tempo better.  FYs still needs to find their way on offense...but their defense is still strong.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 23, 2013, 12:25:01 PM
Amherst plays the tonight in the first game of their tip off tournament.  Expect it to be webcasted.   Looking forward to see how Coach G blends the newer players into the offense and how the team defense adjust to different styles of play.
Meg Robertson took over the other night offensively with 25 points.  Player still adjusting to the rules and what the refs are allowing.....yes even in the women side of the game :)
Amherst wins 80-56 over RPI in a game thar was not really that close.  Amherst played everyone that was dressed and everyone scored.  Amherst had a team of mostly FYs on the floor with over 8 minutes to go with all the starters out.  A starter returned to distribute the ball when RPI put most of its starters back in with 3 minutes to go....with the game still out of reach.....hoping to close the score.  It still remained in the 20's till the end.  Good shake out for the younger players.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 24, 2013, 06:09:46 PM
Amherst wins their tourny  by beating a game Ithaca team...66-44.  Thanksgiving vacation has come to Amherst...therefore a brief pause before more games.  Some difficult games ahead for Amherst  to use to develop a team ready for Conference battles.  Still need to see how the team plays outside the home confines of LeFrak.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on November 27, 2013, 07:36:51 AM
Time for some non-Amherst talk

As the teams start to play a few more games, we get a better idea of relative strenght.  Looks like Bowdoin will be the class of the Maine NESCAC teams.  They are off to a good start, and beat a previously unbeaten UNE team last night.  Cobly had a good start, but has lost 3 of its last 4 games, including a home loss to Regis last night.  Williams looks strong out of the gates, as does Tufts.  Amherst also has had a strong start.  Early on, the top four look to be Williams, Amherst, Tufts and Bowdoin, in no particular order.  It is always a little difficult to get a read on the Connecticutt teams (Trinity, Wesleyan, Conn College) because of the early season schedule, so we will need to wait until they start the NESCAC schedule to see where they will fit in.  Same for Middlebury. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 27, 2013, 11:54:27 AM
Maine 1...nice to get some inputs from the Maine schools.  This season will be more interesting in both the order of the school rankings and even the style of the play.
First, the order....many of the "stars" of the top teams for the past few years have graduated...therefore the new players to be blended into the teams will take time.  How fast school teams develop is the key,IMO.  With respect to style...the new emphasis on the "rules" this season will impact the play/style.  In the Williams game last night, the announcers mentioned the impact on the floor play.  Depth of teams and changes to defensive schemes must be considered...along with watching who will have a breakout season...on given teams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on November 27, 2013, 12:05:05 PM
I actually feel bad for the officials in regard to this absurd point of emphasis on hand-checking....they know what is a foul and what isn't but their discretion is being badly compromised...let the players play and the officials officiate...it's been awful to watch
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 28, 2013, 10:01:10 AM
Remsleep....that is the most astute comment I have read/ heard on the new emphasis of rules. 
Each official now must settle in his/ her mind their interpretation of the emphasis.  It does give cover to bad calls regardless :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 03, 2013, 03:04:05 PM
Amherst back from the holidays.  Plays Emmanuel at home at 7PM.  Disappointed that at present there is no webcast available.  Could it be that the men's team is playing away at Westfield State at the same time?  Go figure.  Hope that fans get to watch online...there has been last minute changes lately.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on December 03, 2013, 03:15:54 PM
Eastern SHOULD have video of the Amherst/Eastern game Thursday night on LEC.tv and the Eastern announcers do an excellent job as I'm sure ECSUalum can point out.  Not that it helps much for today, but giving you a heads up for later in the week.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on December 03, 2013, 07:14:54 PM
Amherst game is on.  New announcers good.  Color commentator needs to get closer to mike.  Live stats frozen
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 03, 2013, 08:44:31 PM
Amherst wins over Emmanuel 77-56 at home.  Video available but stats off -line until second half.  Everyone dressed got into the game with 4 players in double figures.  Meg Robertson has a double double in points and rebounds.  Seems that Amherst was out rebounded and the TOs were the same.  However Amherst was more successful from threes and two's.  Amherst still leaving too many points on the foul lane.  Could cost them in closer games...did shoot more foul shots.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on December 04, 2013, 11:24:08 AM
Williams is off to a surprising 7-0 start, with all but one victory coming in blow-out fashion.  After losing a tremendous senior class and with no seniors on the roster, I figured Williams would drop back some, but they seem to have picked up right where they left off last season, thanks mainly to suffocating defense. The two returning starters, juniors Ellen Cook and Kellie MacDonald, have adapted well to leading roles, and both are looking like all-NESCAC players as they fill up box scores in various categories.  The combine to average 25 points, 12 boards, 8 assists, 3 steals and 3 blocks per game.  The Ephs have received surprisingly strong production from a sophomore center platoon. Litman and Uwanaka split time at the five and combine to average 15 points, 14 boards and 3 blocks, combining to roughly replace all-American Claire Baecher's productivity.  Both are much improved with a lot more room to grow as players over the next two years.  The Ephs are still very young, with three frosh and one new transfer sophomore in the rotation, but those supporting players have all looked good at times and are athletic, quick and play good defense.   Williams may surprise a few teams this season, and by next year could be a legit contender once again. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 05, 2013, 09:03:50 PM
Amherst beats a game ECSU team in Willimatic Ct. tonight by 14, I believe.  Am not clear on the particulars as I was trying to follow the mens game on-line at the same time.  Must refer fans to the Amherst website for recap.  Meg Robertson again had a double-double....had 16 rebounds but fouled out with about a minute to go.  Amherst had too much height and speed and also too many turnovers.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on December 05, 2013, 10:17:16 PM
Amh: Robertson with 19 points and 16 rebounds both team highs.  Jamie Renner also had 18 for Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on December 08, 2013, 07:18:44 AM
As we go into exams and the break, it looks like the NESCAC is taking shape.  Although it is sometimes hard to get a good measure during this part of the season, there are four teams that are undefeated. They are Amherst, Williams, Bowdoin, and Tufts.  Wesleyan is 7-2, and played Williams very closely at Williams.  It is hard to say which of these four unbeaten teams will distinguish themselves once the regular season starts.  As Amherst continues to win, I am convinced that Gromacki  can win no matter who is on his roster.  Tufts looks very strong, and Bowdoin is clearly the class of the Maine teams, having swept the state with wins over both Bates and Colby, along with USM and UNE.  I would expect the four unbeaten to battle during the season for the top four spots, but also expect that we will see each of these teams lose at least one game in the league, if not more.  It looks like there will be a lot of balance, and none of these teams is a super team. I expect to see some very close games once league play starts in January.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on December 08, 2013, 02:48:57 PM
How many of those other 3 does Bowdoin have the NESCAC game in Maine for??  If it's 2 of the 3, I think they'll take the conference crown.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on December 08, 2013, 07:03:01 PM
I like Williams. The bruise sisters (Litman and Uwanaka platooning at center) combined for 15 points, 16 rebounds and 6 blocks yesterday to lift the team to an 8-0 record. They altered many other shots and held Wesleyan to 22% shooting. The team is built to match up against tall, fast teams like Amherst, Tufts and Bowdoin and can defend well. They are holding opponents to 26% shooting so far. Although they are the youngest team Manning has coached, they may be ready this year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 08, 2013, 08:36:51 PM
7Express....I will try to answer you, if I understand the question correctly.  Bowdoin's success against the other CBB teams are non conference wins so to speak.  The conference counting rematch will be later in the year..think the early wins were split between home and away games.....an important factor, imo. 
With respect to Amherst...and as NESCAC1 has pointed out with the young Williams team, Amherst has a team with no seniors.  They do return two starters and a strong ball handler...one of the first off the bench.  The soph PG from Atlanta that can dribble through and around most defenses.  One of the returnees is Meg Robertson, ROY, all conference F/C, and a pre-season All American.  At a listed 6'2" player she is one of the tallest impact player in the conference now.  Amherst has brought in a "relative large" group of FYs including a 6'3" player from Florida...listed on the roster as being an inch shorter.  The tall FY is being brought along slowly as she came from a small HS environment.  The other FYs include three talented players at 5'10" or taller.  All are quick, active on the boards and can handle the ball and shot from outside.  All need to get adjusted to the college game and PT on the floor.  Coach G. is providing them time on the floor ...often starting  3 FY players with the two returning starters.  The one getting the most time is a FY point guard by the name of Jamie Renner...a 5'8" 3-sport athlete...if you remember the last name...she is the younger sister of  Jackie, a 3 year starter for Amherst..one that transferred to Amherst from a Div1 school.  In any case,  the younger Renner is, with every game, has become a scorer...both inside and outside.  To date another front court soph player, Giddins, is having a break out year to date.  The strongest returnee front court player other than Meg, has not played to date.. Jr..S. Holness from a private school near Danbury.  She has an injury and I do not expect her to return until the Las Vegas games.  Coach G knows what she brings...rebounds, energy, quickness off the bench and a solid backup for Meg.  It was nice to see her and Robertson together battle the tall duo's  of Colby, Babson and Williams last season successfully.....all of which have now graduated, I believe.
On the negative side, Amherst travels to Bates, Bowdoin and Colby this year for conference games....tough trips,  However, Amherst's games with Wes. and Williams are at home.  Still the Tufts game is away.
In short, I must point out that Bowdoin is not a shoo in for the title.  Maine 1 might be correct that no team will go undefeated in conference regular play.  However, the key is to host the conference tourn.  If Amherst wins the right games, and gets to host the tournament again....they should be favorites to win the conf. title.  Why?.., they are almost unbeatable at home and by then, Coach G. will have his young team ready for still another Final 4 run.
Long response to your question, I think?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on December 09, 2013, 12:58:52 AM
Tufts, Bowdoin & Colby are going to be tough road games for this Amherst team I think.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 09, 2013, 09:08:20 PM
Amherst goes to 7-0 with a win against Albertus Magnus, 81-55.....in an away game.  Everyone on the Amherst Team played with the big news being the return of S. Holness.  She came in for about 5-6 minutes in the second half.  When she scored her first points, the whole bench stood up.  She left with 3 points and key rebounds.  Meg Robertson played well on defense and in rebounding.  AMagus was game but had no height to counter Amherst.  It seems that the starting line-up at all the positions were taller than their opposite player.....and were just as quick.  It was close for about 10 minutes, when Amherst's outside shots did not drop but the game changed when the outside shots started to go in.  When Amherst started to score inside in the second half, the lead went to as high as 30 for awhile, I believe. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 10, 2013, 11:25:11 AM
For what it's worth at this time of the year....Bowdoin has reached enough points to be considered to be ranked 26 in the latest D3hoops!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on December 10, 2013, 01:15:21 PM
In the WBCA poll Amherst is ranked 4, Williams 5, Tufts 8 and Bowdoin 20. I'm not that experienced, but that seems like quite a compliment for NESCAC.

http://www.wbca.org/blog/index.cfm/2013/12/10/20132014-Week-4-DIII-Poll/

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 12, 2013, 11:11:55 PM
In the only game played by a CAC team, Amherst beats a good Bridgewater State team in LeFrak. BSU was keeping it tight until their leading scorer was hurt in the second half and had to leave the game.  Leave the particulars to the Amherst SID...other then it was a fast paced game and that Amherst seemed to me changed their offense in the second half.   Amherst was hitting from the outside primarily in the first half.  In the second half, the offense went inside to Meg Robertson much more and Amherst's was working their offense to get shots inside; a rotational pattern of ball movement. It also makes the defense work harder.  Still too many TOs, imo.  Exam period and the end of semester awaits.  Amherst travels to the D3hoops Las Vegas event next.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on December 14, 2013, 12:27:03 AM
I thought it might be fun to look at the teams Amherst and Williams have played in common, since we will have to wait several more weeks to see them play each other.  They have played 3--Bridgewater State, Eastern Connecticut and Skidmore.

Bridgewater State: Amherst wins 86-73-- 13 point margin. starters played 149 mins, bench 51 mins
                               Williams wins 78-64--  14 point margin. starters played 111 mins, bench 89 mins

Eastern Ct:             Amherst wins 58-44-- 14 point margin. starters played 147 mins, bench 53 mins
                               Williams wins  67-48-- 19 point margin. starters played 130 mins, bench 70 mins

Skidmore College:  Amherst wins 63-52-- 11 point margin. starters played 143 mins, bench 57 mins
                               Williams wins 55-34--21 point margin. starters played 131 mins, bench 69


So a couple of takeaways-- Williams beat the common opponents each time by a little more and Amherst plays their starters more. It will be exciting to watch them play each other. They look well matched.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 16, 2013, 07:29:09 PM
Week 4 of the D3hoops poll is out.  Includes games thru Dec. 15.
Big news is that Bowdoin joins Amherst. Williams and Tufts in the Top 25.  Amherst goes to 3, Tufts goes up one spot and Williams stays the same.  Montclair State, the previous #3 drops down after their first loss.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on December 17, 2013, 01:34:36 PM
WBCA poll out. Amherst now # 3, Williams 4, Tufts 7 and Bowdoin 19. NESCAC has four teams ranked, the most of any conference. In this poll no other conference has >2. In the DIII hoops poll the WIAC has 3 (UW Whitewater, Stevens Point and Oshkosh).

http://www.wbca.org/blog/index.cfm/2013/12/17/20132014-Week-5-DIII-Poll/

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on December 19, 2013, 11:07:31 PM
Williams v Babson

In a game dominated by extraordinarily tight officiating, it took Williams 30 minutes to figure out a winning strategy: drive to the basket and get fouled. Once they did that, they pulled away. True to form Williams held Babson to 23% shooting but unlike recent games they got killed on the O Boards. Not their best performance but they found a way to win.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on December 20, 2013, 06:51:06 PM
Williams v Pottsdam State

Williams used a 21-2 second half run to pull away from the over-matched PS Bears. Stifling defense was once again the story as Williams limited the Bears to 28% shooting, while shooting 42%. Ellen Cook led all scorers with 20 points on 8 for 13 shooting. Kellie MacDonald contributed 11 points while Katie Litman scored 10 and snagged 10 rebounds, including 8 offensive boards.
The offense is explosive when they get out on the break but can sputter in the half court. The defense is consistently good. They seem tough minded but haven't been truly tested yet.

We'll see how good they are in 2014. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 21, 2013, 12:26:33 PM
nescacfan1......thanks for your coverage posts of Williams.  Thought about taking a look myself, but seasonal visits by family did not allow me.  Good to hear about Williams' defense stress.....a key element on Amherst's past and present teams.
Amherst's next game is in Las Vegas against Vassar.  Vassar got ranking points due to their win over then #3 Monclair State.  Interesting that Monclair's spot in the rankings was given to Amherst in the latest polls. :)
This second trip by Amherst to Nevada does give the team a strong opponent.  The first trip out west had Amherst matched up with a WPI team.....located only about 15 miles East of Amherst in MA...WPI was over matched and lost by over 50 points, I recall.  The Amherst vs Vassar game is on the 28th of Dec.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on December 28, 2013, 06:06:48 PM
Really looking forward to the Vassar/Amherst game in Las Vegas this evening.  Probably Amherst's toughest test to date.  Vassar this year has wins over New Paltz (they stink this year but last year were undefeated until mid January), Montclair (who was ranked #3) at the time, and NESCAC rival Wesleyan.  Vassar averages 47.8 opponents ppg and in 6 games, the opponent has only gotten into the 50's 3 times and have held all 6 teams to less than 59 points.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on December 28, 2013, 09:11:40 PM
Don't see any audio, video or live stats.  They must be at a different tourney than D3 hoops classic?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: daoustian on December 28, 2013, 09:49:38 PM
There's video.  http://client.stretchinternet.com/client/triplvh.portal
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 29, 2013, 07:18:02 AM
Amherst shakes of the holiday rust and beats Vassar 66-53 in first game in Las Vegas.  Stats and recap of sorts via Vassar can be found on Amherst's website.
Seems Vassar got no points from their bench.  Amherst still working out their rotation.  Got  a third of their points from the " bench".    Vassar got more points off the fast break , but lost the rebound battle badly.  Amherst still needs to work on the foul shooting and lower their TOs. :)
Meg Robertson got a double- double.
Thanks Daoustian for the video link...but too rich for my blood.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 29, 2013, 09:47:05 PM
Amherst beats Marywood tonight 73-49.  Everyone played for Amherst.  Things of note are the 11blocks by Amherst and the control of the boards.  Amherst made 8-9 foul shots.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 30, 2013, 10:54:43 AM
The details of the game are posted on the Amherst website.  The LJs' next game will be at RIC.  First encounter with RIC for the Lady Jeff's, I believe.
Some observations on the team to date.  Last season, the team was somewhat "short handed " and was led by three seniors that played many minutes on the floor.  This year, with no seniors and a bunch of talented FYs...the rotation of the team for conference games is still a work in progress.  It seems that the team is much deeper and there are many combinations that can be put on the floor.
The return of S. Holness from injury and the breakout play of Giddins have allowed Meg to get rest. There are a number of ball handlers to chose from that can run the offense and drive to the basket.  Outside shooters?  Whoever has the hot hand.  Seems there will always be on the floor, several outsider shooters available.  Rebounding, defense...team defense are still things to work on when new combinations are on the floor.  Game experience remains.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on December 30, 2013, 05:55:29 PM
Thanks amh63, for the kind comments. The scary part about Amherst is the way they beat a good Vassar team. They pounded them on the offensive boards, grabbing 21 offensive rebounds. It wasn't just one person either, but a team effort--Robertson and Holness had 4 each and 5 were listed as "team" rebounds. Also Holness appears to be back from injury and she is a prime defender, rebounder and scorer. As you described, Amherst has many options on offense and they play a swarming, pressing defense.

Williams defense, by contrast, focuses on intimidating shooters. They lead the nation in limiting opponents to 25% shooting. They average 8 blocks a game and defend shooters all over the floor. That means they are prone to getting out rebounded on the offensive boards because the are trying to block or alter shots. That doesn't match up well against Amherst which has size and shooters throughout their lineup. Oh and they can rebound too.

As much as I hate to say it, Amherst certainly looks intimidating right now.



Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on January 05, 2014, 06:47:19 AM
Finally one of the NESCAC top four picks up a loss as Bowdoin falls last night.  Still, hard to imagine NESCAC not ending up with four NCAA teams this year. 

Williams puts on yet another defensive clinic in last night's win.  I continue to be impressed / surprised by how well the Ephs have played despite losing so much to graduation, and relying so heavily on underclassmen (zero seniors and two juniors in the rotation).  The Ephs have allowed under 50 points in seven consecutive games, and limiting opposing shooters to 25.9 percent on the season, which is simply incredible!  The Ephs are better on D than they are on offense, as they rely very heavily on only three players on that end, one of whom (Katie Litman, who is one half of a very strong sophomore center platoon) did not play last night.  Oge Uwanaka picked up the slack in her absence, with the best game of her career: 12 points, 10 boards, 2 assists, 3 steals, 3 blocks. 

Hopefully whatever ails Litman is nothing serious -- if she is out for the Amherst game, beating the Jeffs on the road (which the Ephs, who I believe were clearly more talented than Amherst last season, weren't able to do on either occasion at Lefrak last year) next weekend becomes even more unlikely.  In fact, the Ephs have NEVER beaten a Gromacki-coached team at Amherst -- so long as the talent level is roughly even (which it looks to be right now so long as Litman plays, as both teams are undefeated with a scoring margin of 18 ppg) or favors Amherst, Amherst is essentially unbeatable at home due to his coaching excellence. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 05, 2014, 08:04:12 AM
I was surprised to see RIC beat Bowdoin, however, game was at RIC, and the first weekend after the Holiday break, may have caught Bowdoin off their game.  We will start to get a real look at the relative strength of the NESCAC teams with league play starting this weekend.  The top four teams all have had excellent pre-seasons (only 1 loss among them), but I am always leery about the strength of the pre-season schedules.  Amherst also plays at RIC this week, so it will be interesting to see how they do against them.  Looking forward to the regular season, but it is hard to see any of the other teams in the league making a run at the top four.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 05, 2014, 04:27:32 PM
Hoopsville is back on the air tonight and starting the usual twice-a-week format. Tune in to hear from a number of coaches including Tuft's Carla Berube.

Show starts at 7 PM EST and Coach Berube will be on around 8 PM.

You can tune in here: www.d3hoopsville.com (http://www.d3hoopsville.com)

You can also follow us and be social on Twitter (@d3hoopsville (http://www.twitter.com/d3hoopsville) and #Hoopsville) or Facebook (www.facebook.com/Hoopsville (http://www.facebook.com/Hoopsville)). You can even email us at hoopsville@d3hoops.com.

Thanks and enjoy the show!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on January 05, 2014, 09:18:22 PM
The Ephs continue their trend of winning with ridiculously tough defense but anemic offense, beating St. Lawrence 50-38 while holding them to 23 percent shooting and forcing 24 turnovers (but shooting only 32 percent themselves).  The Ephs are now allowing fewer than 47 ppg on the year.  Once again Katie Litman, who is easily the Ephs' best interior offensive player, did not play for the Ephs.  Fingers crossed that she can return for the Amherst game. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 07, 2014, 04:34:27 PM
Amherst vs. RIC game in RI is scheduled for 7PM.   Same time as the MBB game at home with ECSU.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on January 07, 2014, 05:42:42 PM
DIII hoops rankings--Week 5:

Amherst 3
Tufts 7
Williams 10
Bowdoin 25

WBCA rankings:

Amherst 3
Williams 4
Tufts 7
Bowdoin 20

Only one loss between all four teams. A 43-1 composite record. NESCAC looks v tough right now.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 07, 2014, 08:46:09 PM
Amherst wins a hard fought game at RIC 74-63.  RIc took the early lead but Amherst was ahead by 4 at the half.  Meg Robertson held down a bit in the first finish with 25 points.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 07, 2014, 09:22:09 PM
Nice win for Amherst by a team that beat Bowdoin.  Hopefully builds confidence as go head to head with Williams this weekend.  Will be a good match up for two young teams. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 08, 2014, 08:27:52 PM
NE Jeffs Fan.....Agreed, but there is another game on Friday with Hamilton.  One game at a time is my approach.
Watched the RIC game today via RIC's achives....since I watched the MBB game in LeFrak.  A little troubled that the WBB seemed sloppy in the first ten minutes of the game.....8 TOs and missed layouts, etc.  Concern is the flat play of Savannah H., one of my favorite players.  Was in the game to give Meg a breather but was taken out when she went 0-4 Three of the misses were on layups....two uncontested.  Not focused on the game or her play,imo.  Hope she wakes up for the conference games this weekend.  Back to back games are hard. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 10, 2014, 08:30:02 PM
As I said a week ago, hard to tell how teams are during pre-season. Trinity with a surprising win over Williams, and Conn College, who was much improved last year, took Bowdoin to the end at Bowdoin. Middlebury easily beat Bates.  Wesleyan easily over Colby.  We could be in for a very competitive NESCAC season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on January 11, 2014, 02:58:32 AM
Congrats to the Bants. I watched parts of the game from Dulles Airport.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 11, 2014, 10:07:59 AM
Trinity's nice win over Williams surprised us at the Amherst games.  You cannot overlook any of the teams in the conference this year.  Amherst had a competative game with Hamilton for awhile in LeFrak last night.  Everyone played last night except for J. Renner.  Her father mentioned that she needed to rest for the game tonight.  Should be a good one this afternoon.  Too much talent/size for the Contentials last night.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 11, 2014, 02:08:34 PM
Could Williams have been looking beyond the Trinity game?  Will be interesting to see how the season plays out for Trinity.  I would think Williams will be even more dangerous for today for Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 11, 2014, 09:32:22 PM
Amherst wins the critical Williams game...the one that counts for the determination of the tournament hosting.  Williams plays Amherst well in the first half.  Even when Meg gets her 4th foul in the 2nd half....the young Amherst team pulls out a solid win against a young Williams team.  Amherst win streak at home continues.  Enough said here....Recap on the Amherst website will do a better job of the game flow and the boxscore....the particulars.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 12, 2014, 08:13:59 AM
An interesting first weekend of league play.  Watched the Amherst/Williams game on video.  I thought Amherst looked very good.  Seem to have several excellent outside shooters, strong inside play, and the standard suffocating defense  The only thing that kept Williams in the game was Cook.  Amherst seems to have more depth and balance then last year.   Williams is clearly not as good as the pre-season record would indicate.  On the other hand, Trinity had an excellent opening week, as did Conn College and Bowdoin.  Conn College came within two of Bowdoin at Bowdoin, and then beat Colby. It is possible that Trinity will contend for one of the top four spots.  Tufts plays at Middlebury today, so this will be an interesting game to gauge the strength of Middlebury.  I also see Wesleyan being a tough team, particularly at their home court.  Two very big games next Friday-Amherst at Tufts, and  Bowdoin at Williams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 13, 2014, 12:03:54 PM
After two weekend games, Amherst travels to Farmingdale State on Long Island for a game tonight.  Seems to be an annual OCC.  Wonder what is the tie to schedule this Monday game.  Seems the game on the web via a D3hoops link.  Link not posted to date on the Amherst website.
Oops, update...Amherst website has a link too.
Big game with Tufts this weekend!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 13, 2014, 08:23:10 PM
Amherst wins over Farmingdale State 77-50.  All LJ players had PT.  Some lazy passes that resulted in TOs.  Quick players an a zone caused problems for Amherst...they adjusted.  Amherst scored well from outside and started to score inside in the 2nd half.  Giddens and Robertson led the way.  FY Renner sat for awhile after a slow start to observe the game.  Good game to get some experience against a team with quick guards.  Peterson and Pritchard picked up 4 fouls apiece and sat.  Two tough conference games this weekend....away games.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 17, 2014, 02:33:23 PM
Critical games this weekend...road games for Amherst.  Key game tonight at 6PM when the Tufts team meets the LJs in Melford.  Tufts's HBC has looked forward to this game out of LeFrak! :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on January 17, 2014, 03:13:36 PM
WOW, Amherst has 8 straight road games starting with the game @ Farmingdale Monday??
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 17, 2014, 06:48:19 PM
Usually Tufts is way ahead of the curve in the video area....Anyone having any luck with video or live stats from Tufts.  No luck on iphone or ipad.  Laptop just shows scoreboard with clock counting down, but no score on the scoreboard?????
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on January 17, 2014, 07:39:09 PM
Major overload situation.....just got in for a couple of minutes, though.....Tufts leads Amherst 58-53; 2:44 to go.......
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on January 17, 2014, 07:50:13 PM
63-56 Tufts; :02 to go. Saw almost none of it. Jumbos video system needs a complete renovation. When even Live Stats freezes up for most of the big game, that's not good. Cup half full, though - lots of interest in the game, apparently!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 17, 2014, 07:55:53 PM
Amherst loses to Tufts in a hard fought game 63-56.  Amherst's Meg Robertson injured only 3 minutes into the game.  Amherst in a state of disorder as Tufts goes ahead by 10 pts or more.  Lady Jeffs fights back and it is tied 25-25 at the half. Amherst ties the game around the 50 point mark as Tufts lead is no more than 4 in the second half.  Down by 4 with less than a minute to go, Amherst starts to foul to get the ball back and the lead goes to 5...almost gets it down to 3 but the 3's do not go in.  Do not know the extend of the injury to Meg.  Team needed their all-american.  Too many TOs and Tufts shot a higher %. 
Switched to live stats that was not good...in fact the whole Tufts' broadcast was lacking in many ways....overload, audio and real bad.  Hope the MBB game is better.
Do believe that Amherst was the better team and would have won with Meg playing.  Tufts center scored well.  Amherst's youth/inexperience showed in this away game.  The soph's and Juniors played well. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 17, 2014, 08:22:32 PM
Did announcers say anything about the nature of Robertson's injury?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescachoopsfan2 on January 17, 2014, 08:45:09 PM
Tufts had a student feed that was working fine: www.jumbocast.com. Now streaming the men's game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 17, 2014, 09:39:18 PM
I believe that was the first time that Tufts and Berube have beaten Amherst in the Gromacki era.  Plenty of close games along the way.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 18, 2014, 06:56:32 AM
Was at last nights Tufts/ Amherst game.  I have to give a lot of credit to Amherst, as they withstood loosing Robertson, and then scrapped their way back into the game.  Overall, it seemed to me that Tufts clearly has the deeper team, and probably has a bit more talent.  Tufts center missed a lot of very easy looks early in the game, otherwise the margin would have been much larger in the first half.  Amherst's outside shooting was awful--freshman guard (23) was I believe something like 2-15, and most of the misses weren't even close.  Amherst struggled all night for consistent offense.  It is hard to say what would have happened if Robertson does not get hurt.  Moynihan for Tufts was outstanding in teh second half (was probably Tufts best player and not sure why she does not start.  Big win for Tufts, as this gives them a big edge for homecourt in the playoffs.  Tufts gym may be the most difficult of any in the NESCAC.
Also, big wins for both Trinity and Williams last night.  Today's Trinity-Tufts game will be interesting.  Will Tufts let down after big win over Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescachoopsfan2 on January 18, 2014, 10:43:15 AM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on January 17, 2014, 09:39:18 PM
I believe that was the first time that Tufts and Berube have beaten Amherst in the Gromacki era.  Plenty of close games along the way.

Correct. Gromacki won his first 10 games against Tufts, including one NESCAC semifinal, two NESCAC finals, and one NCAA Sweet 16. Margins of victory were 2, 6, 6, 3, 9, 38, 17, 26, 5, and 6.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 18, 2014, 11:09:35 AM
The MBB GAME COVERAGE was no better :'(.  If Tufts wins the rights to host the conference tourny , they need to step up!
The writeup on the Amherst website does not mention the injury to Meg as is normal wrt to Coach G. In a final 4 game several years ago, Meg was ill, but played a little and it showed as she struggled up the floor.  In all the press conf. Coach G. Did not mention the illness to Meg and others.
In a game where FY starters Renner and Peterson did not shoot well or shine overall, it was good to see Holness show some of her talents again.  Picked up the slack on the boards when Meg left.  IMO, coach G. has started a number of FYs over some of his " veterans" during the season to give his young talented recruits game experience, especially on the road.  When Meg left, the team lost their poise, IMO....not like the game in LeFrak against Williams when Meg got her 4th foul and left in the 2nd half.  She did not to come back in as the "bench" played well.  I was pleased that Amherst tied the game at the half and was in the game until the last few minutes.  It should be noted that the players on the floor at the time were the "bench" veterans, playing the  6th ranked team even on the road...without their All-American backing them up.  Tufts played well, better than I have seen them play.  They schooled Amherst's FYs a little.  Good lesson...Amherst has smart players.  Mistakes will not be repeated.
Few more comments.  After her return from her injury, S. Holness was playing tentative.  Watching her live last weekend, she still looked/played like she did not want to injure herself..not mentally into games.  When she made a shot against Williams, the bench rose up to cheer her.  Last night she played much better...not up to her talent level.  She now knows her team needs her...had a career 11 rebounds and several blocks.
Going forward, I see more PT for the veterans as critical conference games are ahead.  The return of Meg Robertson is not known.  Maybe a bit of bravado, but I feel that when Amherst meets Tufts again, even in Melford , they will win the game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescachoopsfan2 on January 18, 2014, 12:27:34 PM
Quote from: amh63 on January 18, 2014, 11:09:35 AM
The MBB GAME COVERAGE was no better :'(.  If Tufts wins the rights to host the conference tourny , they need to step up!

I'll reiterate that Tufts had a second feed (from the student group JumboCast) that was working perfectly fine. Tufts didn't link to the JumboCast feed on their athletics site, which was probably a mistake on their part, but there was a functioning webcast for both the men's and women's game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 18, 2014, 06:20:36 PM
NHFan2...thanks for your info on the Jumbos secondary web video feed.  The problem still remains in that all the links led  an online fan to the problem feed.  Others on the MBB board do not know about the student feed particulars posted here.
Amherst wins in a blowout in Lewiston, Maine.  Everyone for Amherst got into the game except for the injured Meg who had a crutch by her side on the bench.  The Amherst lady jeffs scored 88 points in the game...more than the MBB team who also scored in the 80's....though averages in the 90's. 
Leave the details and stats for the Amherst SID...on the Jeffs' website.  Getting lazy....even my post on the men's board defer the details to other Amherst posters.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on January 18, 2014, 06:54:04 PM
Thanks for sharing that student group JumboCast link. I tried it Sat., but it didn't work for me at all (here in CT) today. Neither did the standard Tufts webcast link. I couldn't get even a single second of the Tufts/Trinity webcast. Strange. (Although thankfully, Live Stats was working today.) Until the past weekend, I'd watched every Jumbos home WBB game, with no problems at all. (And that recorded, pre-game screen, while the game is actually in progress, is especially annoying.) But get two NESCAC opponents with perfect league marks going in? Clearly far more folks trying to watch than the system could handle. Hopefully, Tufts Athletics Dept personnel will allow for many more viewers soon, with both NESCAC playoff games and NCAA games on the horizon, and many of them now just about a lock to be played at Cousens, this webcasting issue won't just be going away......
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on January 21, 2014, 06:31:36 PM
Williams bounced back and had a good weekend and beat Bowdoin and Colby. They got excellent production from Lauren McCall, a 6'1" first year, who went 24 points and 8 rebounds against Bowdoin on 9 for 11 shooting (including six 3 pointers) and 17 points and 6 rebounds against Colby on 7-11 shooting. They sorely miss Katie Litman, who is out with an injury. She is their best defender, rebounder and inside scorer. Maybe she'll be back in a week or two.

Regardless, they look ready to give a Robertson-less Amherst team a close game at Chandler tomorrow.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 22, 2014, 11:14:39 AM
Amherst has posted a preview of the Williams game on the Amherst website.  Informative write ups of both teams/players.  There are also links to photos and a video of the games played in LeFrak.  Surprisingly, mention is made of Meg's injury and the injury /absence of a key Williams player in the last game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on January 22, 2014, 07:47:09 PM
Very exciting finish in Williamstown and a great win for the Ephs.  Both teams were missing as expected top-notch centers.  Ellen Cook had one of the best games an Eph has played in quite some time -- 26 points, 12 boards, 3 steals, 2 blocks, seemed to hit a key shot every time the Ephs were struggling in the second half, typically via some very impressive and crafty ball handling and footwork.  She also hit the game-winning free throws.  She was by far the best player on the court tonight. 

On defense, Oke Uwanaka was a dominant presence for Williams, with 7 blocks and 3 steals in only 25 minutes.  She also added 13 points on offense.  As usual she struggles with foul trouble picking up some silly fouls, but kudos to her for accruing numerous game-changing blocks, including a spectacular block on the last Amherst possession, while playing with four fouls down the stretch. She is an elite defender when she avoids fouling.  Kellie MacDonald also had her usual strong and steady game for Williams, finishing with 18 points, including a late clutch three pointer. 

Amherst was tenacious on the offensive boards and collectively swished a lot of pretty deep three point attempts, a very good shooting group.  Williams has rarely been able to pull out close games with Amherst in recent years, nice to see them pick up a huge win in Chandler.  Williams needed that!  Now, let's see what the men can do ...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on January 25, 2014, 03:56:42 PM
Williams took down Hamilton 66-49 in a less than artful game at Chandler. Ellen Cook went for 18 points and 5 steals after a difficult first half. Kellie MacDonald had 16 and 8 rebounds, MaryKate O'Brien had 12 points and Oge Uwanaka had 13 rebounds and 6 points. Dani Fegan had 13 points and 5 rebounds and Samantha Graber had 10 points and 13 rebounds for the Continentals.
Williams only dressed 8 players for today's game--McCall and Caveney were sick and Litman was still injured. Coach Manning had to juggle players the whole game to keep them out of foul trouble.
A win is a win, but this was not well played by either side. Nevertheless, Williams held Hamilton to 25% shooting, an Ephs trademark this season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 25, 2014, 06:38:03 PM
Amherst keeps pace with the leaders in the Conference.  Wins by double figures over Trinity in Hartford.  Leave the particulars to the Amherst SID.  Good news ...Meg Robertson is moving/walking without crutches. Her left knee region was taped. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 26, 2014, 11:21:01 AM
Sounds like Robertson may be back?  That would make for an interesting final three weekends of the season.  Tufts schedule down the stretch has a tough game at Williams.  They also get Bowdoin at home. I don't see them losing twice in the NESCAC.   Amherst has to come to Bowdoin this coming weekend, but they should be able to beat Bowdoin, with or without Robertson, although Bowdoin does have some good inside players.  The battle for the three and four spot is going to go down to the end, as I don't think there is a lot of difference between Bowdoin, Conn College, Wesleyan, and Trinity.  Bowdoin all ready has wins over Wesleyan and Conn College, so that gives them a leg up.  I expect Williams to work there way up to the three spot in the league.  The final spot will likely be a battle between Middlebury, Hamilton, and possibly Colby.  Bates appears to be at the bottom of the league, and has not been competitive in most of their games this season.  Colby seems to be in every game at half-time, but they rely almost exclusively on outside shooting, which seems to fade. Seems like the recruiting has fallen off at both Bates and Colby over the past three-four years.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on January 27, 2014, 09:03:17 AM
Due to Carla Berube being my all-time favorite UConn player, I've become a big Tufts fan over the years. I really believe this has to be the Jumbos' year, if a NESCAC title is ever gonna happen. While taking nothing away from Williams (who just beat the Jeffs, in their non-league return match), and a resurgent Bowdoin squad, in the end, I think it's a two-horse race in '13-14. But to me, there is one person working in the NESCAC that is making Harry Houdini look like a rank amateur this season. To no one's surprise, it's GP Gromacki. From day one, he's started three FYs. His co-captain is a SO PG. His skilled JR post is the #1 option. And yes, we all know he has a highly skilled, prototypical 6th man, in Giddins. Of course, Gromacki isn't fazed by much of anything, so he manages to start out 14-0. A previous poster summed it up best: "I'm starting to think it just doesn't matter who Amherst loses to graduation. To me, they're still always gonna be the team to beat.....". I 100% concur.

To me, above all else, what makes Gromacki special is in both who he plays, how much he plays them, and when he plays them. In pre-season, it seems that he would purposely "assign" which player would be the team's quasi-#1 option on offense (within reason; he wouldn't tell a wide open player not to shoot a layup, for example.) I mean set play-wise. Once the first couple of games were played, he then threw each of his FYs starters into the "deep end of the pool." What I mean is that GP would run multiple, go-to offensive sets for, say, Jaimie Renner, over the course of one game. Then for Hannah Peterson the next. Then for Ali Doswell the next. Then rinse and repeat, to coin a phrase. To work the kinks out. I've never seen *any* other WBB coach use this method, to so quickly get multiple, young, talented players up to speed. It's the "Evelyn Wood Speed Reading" equivalent, for college WBB. It was a joy to watch. And it worked. All three were plenty ready for NESCAC play.

Yes, the Holness injury was a minor annoyance. That stuff happens to all teams. But Savannah was slated as a top frontcourt sub, and would've done that well, until Megan's injury has now required much more of her. But I want to address the recent Amherst at Tufts game. Yes, Robertson goes down, 3 minutes in. Just about the absolute worst case scenario for Amherst, especially being the first *major* battle for the young Jeff pup starters. But I also observed that Renner didn't play most of the Tufts game, either. Now I don't know if it's because her older sister also played for Gromacki, but to me Jaimie seemed to be the furthest along, among his 3 newbie starters. It was the loss of both starters, I feel, that nothing could reasonably prepare the remaining FR/SOs for, especially for most of the first half. Yet GP still almost pulled the game out, on the road. Tufts was up, by 7 or 9, until the last 2-3 minutes of the half. But the Jeffs come roaring back late, to tie it at halftime. I just thought that was an unforgivable lead giveback by the Jumbos. I also believe it was 100% preventable. But it perfectly highlights what I see as being the clear #1 difference between Coach Gromacki's and Coach Berube's coaching styles. And also why GP had never lost to Carla, until this game:

Because Berube plays way too many players in her regular rotation.

Obviously, Berube needs to substitute some, over the course of a game. However, against Amherst, even in the game they just won, I saw Tufts losing ground, basically whenever any of their five top players, by a wide margin (Foley, Kanner, Moynihan, Morehead and North) sat. Michala North is a flat out *stud* FY. To me, she's better than all 3 of Amherst's stellar freshmen - and that's saying something. North's overall production per minute, as a FY, is simply astounding. But does North start for the Jumbos? No. Instead, loyal, devoted to the program, veteran Tufts players McClure and Berman get the start. (I think the SR Rocchi was starting early, before an injury required her getting swapped out for Berman.) I am a big Tufts fan, so I hope this post is taken 100% the right way. I mean no harm. I respect everything about Tufts WBB. I just see a bit of Tufts coaching philosophy that I can't honestly reconcile with a deep '13-14 NCAA run. That's all. I truly respect and support every one of these wonderful young women, for both their academic and athletic commitments. That said, Rocchi, McClure and Berman combined still aren't half as talented as North is. Right now. Even though each of those three give absolute max effort, every second they're out there. What more could anyone ask of them? Nothing. My issue is not with the players. It is with Berube. And her player rotations.

I know North was hobbled for a couple of games early on, but I have no evidence her injury caused Berube to play her as few minutes as she has so far this season. I know Berube prefers to alternate Kanner and North in the post. Against most teams, that thinking will do no harm, and will result in Tufts victories. It just won't happen to get Tufts wins against the likes of Amherst, et al. Berube has played both posts together at times. The results are beyond special. Then why does it seem that I get to see it about as often as a lunar eclipse? Because Carla has a (yikes!) ten player rotation. Who play in *every* game, regardless of score or opponent. Gromacki doesn't ever rotate nearly that many players. Ever. And for a very good reason: because doing so won't help Amherst win games.

I do understand that DIII is a different animal. What Carla does is more commonplace, than in DI or DII. The only reason a problem creeps in is when the opponent is elite. Playing 10 will never be an option, going forward, vs the Lord Jeffs. Yes, Tufts won once. But given the crazy circumstances, it honestly does have a bit of an asterisk next to it. And this is coming from a big Jumbos fan...

During the late first half Amherst run to tie it up, this "deep every game bench" was in for the Jumbos. As usual. Poor Hannah Artner. The JR gets the call from Berube. While in there, she's doing her absolute level best for Tufts. But the Jeffs are able to shrink a hard-fought Jumbo lead, that took 17 minutes to build, quicker than an all-cotton shirt being placed in a 1000 degree dryer! Because Artner's been given a task, on this one day, that she can't possibly complete. But one that she can complete during most other Jumbo games: to help Tufts win, with the talent level she possesses.   

Therefore, effective immediately, I humbly request that Coach Berube shorten her bench during big games. Just like her old coach did. Carla, you were there. Remember? Did you see Geno ever put in Missy Rose when he was playing Tennessee? Heck no. And what actually pains me even more than seeing my Tufts team being placed at a competitive disadvantage here, is that I believe it is totally unfair for Carla to place a player in a situation where it is impossible for them to succeed. I view it as disrespectful to said player. And I don't feel they deserve that. It is quite clear, to most any trained WBB eye, to spot which specific players do and don't have the requisite skill level, to perform well in a team's most difficult games. Especially in DIII.

Coach Berube, I've been lucky enough to be intimately involved with a college WBB program that has been to several NCAA tourneys. The game will always be in my blood. Your goal is to get your team to the DIII Final Four this year, right? Then please don't cheat yourself. Or cheat your team. To this end, please take another look at your own game management. First off, move Michala North into the starting lineup. Immediately. And leave her there, for the next 3 1/2 seasons. And, barring foul trouble, let her play 30 mpg. The Amherst frosh have already benefitted *so* much from the major minutes they've gotten. North hasn't. Because she hasn't been allowed to play nearly as much. I almost sense sometimes that Berube is actually trying to slow down North's progress. How could this possible be? Michala doesn't look "lost" out there at all. She clearly knows the offense. She plays solid defense. She hustles. She's a team player. Your entire team already knows she's earned it. FY or no. Please reward her consistently excellent game results. Yet, when asked about North in a d3hoops interview, Berube said, "Michala's learning more every day". Can you say "understatement of the year?" You think GP is coddling his FYs? Or accepting baby steps? Heck no. He's getting after it. Like he always does. And so should you be, Coach Carla Berube, if you truly want to have a chance to win big this year. With Amherst, Williams and Bowdoin in this league, it requires pedal to the metal, not Kum Ba Ya! To me, there simply IS no other way to get it done.

Back to the suggested new starting lineup. Besides North. Of course, Moynihan is perfect in her 6th-man role. So leave her right there. (She's just like Giddens - the team's secret weapon, who's really no secret at all. And FYI, without Moynihan's superhuman effort vs Amherst, Tufts would still be winless vs GP, in my opinion. Liz was clearly tired of 4 years of her losing to the Jeffs, and she flipped the result in her favor.) Foley/Kanner/Morehead are locks. I guess, by default, McClure can stay as the 5th starter. But limit her overall minutes. Besides Moynihan, the only two other players I would play every game would be Roberson and, if now healthy, Rocchi. And sure, Carla, go ahead and keep playing all 10, if you like, against the weaker NESCAC clubs. My only request is that you don't deny young talent the game minutes they need to become major contributors, at the expense of your less talented, loyal soldiers.

Sorry to go so long. This was pent up for a while. Thanks for reading.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 27, 2014, 10:20:27 AM
d3wbbfan,
  Admirable analysis and passion, however, I would have(and have in the past) chosen the PM vehicle for conveyance in a similar situation.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 27, 2014, 11:00:12 AM
D3wbbfan....interesting post and very perspective.points, IMO.  I'm not knowledgeable on the Jumbo's players as you but am well aware of their coach...being a fan of WBB at UCONN.
I was most interested in your read of Coach G's coaching approach at Amherst.  His short rotation at times over the years has been due to various factors....like last year.  He has lost several upperclass players...note the no senior players on the team...due to some recruits pursuing other endeavors/ sports and multi- injuries, etc.
Still, if a young player is not ready to play at his level for an Amherst team, they are not inserted just to give them PT.  Amherst has a front court player of great potential on the bench...a 6'2-3" player from a small school in Florida.  Amherst does need front court backup.
In the lost to Williams, in Willy town, the Young Williams players were jumping with joy over their win.  Amherst young team lost in the last seconds to a T0  leading to foul shots, and fine play by an Eph team.
Several last points that you may already know....the young J. Renner is quite an athlete and played Four sports in H.S....but likes BB the best according to her father.  She does need to rest her knees at times and will miss some games doing so.  The other point is that Coach G is an astute judge of talent and recruits accordingLy.  You cannot win without talented players.  I guess your key point is that Coaches need to develop the talented players on hand.  I leave the pace and method up to the coaches...they are the one who recruited them and work with them. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on January 27, 2014, 03:28:46 PM
D3wbbfan...they are 16-0, last year they were 25-3.....you are off the deep end my friend...agree that Gromacki is a tremendous coach...absolutely one of the best.....Berube seems to be doing just fine, thank you, 10 player rotation or not....now take a big breath then exhale haha
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on January 27, 2014, 06:07:11 PM
Agree that rotations depend entirely on available personnel AND coaching style.  Nothing wrong at all with 10 man rotation; I follow Hope College closely and they almost always use a 10 man rotation.  Their defensive intensity requires fresh legs.  Results bear it out, almost always in the top rankings nationally and also always near the top for rebounding margin, steals margin, scoring margin.  I think if you use a deep rotation consistently year after year, you almost always have enough experienced players to go ten deep.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 27, 2014, 06:13:55 PM
A Couple of comments on the very long post on Tufts.  First, as it relates to Gromacki. Based on what I have seen over the past 7 years, he has shown an ability to take whatever talent he has and wins.  There is a saying in coaching that goes something like he can take his players and beat you, or he can take your players and beat you.  This year he doesn't have the talent or depth he has had, and yet he is still 16-2.  By far the best coach in the league.  Not sure exactly how he does it, but he does (and you can go back to Hamilton and before that to see the same result). 
As far as Tufts, my view on that, being at the Tufts-Amherst game, is that the Tufts coach appears to have a fixed rotation, and goes with it regardless of what is happening, particularly early in a game.  I have never understood this style of coaching. I am not sure if the rotations is too long, I think the timing is an issue.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on January 27, 2014, 11:16:46 PM
A wild game between Williams and Smith tonight at Chandler. Williams came out flat and were out hustled and outplayed by Smith in the first half who ran up a 46-32 lead at halftime. In the second half Williams shot 56% from the field, including 53% from behind the arc to beat Smith 89-80. It was an amazing comeback led by Ellen Cook, Lauren McCall and Oge Uwanaka. Uwanaka, when she's on, is a game changer. She can guard the post or the perimeter and is so quick that she can lunge for the ball, get beaten and still come back to make a play. She also hit free throws when they mattered. McCall and Caveney had been quite ill, so it was good to see them back and performing well.  It was also good to see Litman walking around and she might be back in a couple of weeks. If she's anything like she was before, that would help Williams a lot.

I cant figure this team out from game to game or half to half for that matter, but they find a way to win.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 28, 2014, 10:25:40 AM
Amherst has a "Little 3" game tonight in Middletown at 7:30.  Translation...it is a non conference game for the books....like the game in Williamstown.  Interesting to see if Meg Robertson is dressed.  Even if she is, I do not expect her in the game.  More important games this weekend.  Do not expect her in the game on Friday against Colby.  Best save her play for the more difficult game against  Bowdoin on Sat.  Two thoughts on this strategy...mine only...the Cardinal game does not really matter for tourny position, even in a lost...Wesleyan is a solid team.  Think the team without Meg can beat the Cardinals and the Mules, even in on the road.  Against Bowdoin, I would still hold Meg out, if she is ready to play.  I believe Amherst can beat the Polar Bears if the players are focused and their shots start to fall.  Several players that did not shoot well in the Tufts game, did well in the following road games.  Young first year players gaining confidence, playing without their Captain...stepping up their play.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on January 28, 2014, 07:43:30 PM
There have been a lot coaching compliments deservedly given to GP and Berube, but let's not forget Pat Manning at Williams. She lost six seniors last year, including the NESCAC player of the year and All American, Claire Baecher, her point guard Jenny Harding and her super forward Danny Rainer and she still managed to field a top 20 team. This is the youngest team she has ever coached and she has had to juggle lineups and change schemes to accommodate for injuries and illness. Lauren McCall (NESCAC player of the week) has developed into a true perimeter threat, Oge Uwanaka has become an offensive and defensive beast, Ellen Cook is an all NESCAC player, Kellie MacDonald is a super contributor, Katie Litman is one of the best posts in NESCAC and MaryKate O'Brien has really improved. This is coaching.
Further she sees the game well and is a great at in game adjustments, especially between the first and second half. She doles out PT depending on who is performing well that night and will give extra time to hot contributors as long as they stay out of foul trouble.

In their last 6 games against Amherst, Williams is 3-3. I don't think any other team has done as well. 

If Litman (injured) comes back strong, Williams may well challenge for the NESCAC title this year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 28, 2014, 09:19:41 PM
Amherst wins in Middletown 72-49.  It was a 9 point lead at the half.  Amherst was led by H. Peterson with 28 points.  Her second offensive output recently...she had a career high of 30 points recently.  Meg Robertson was not dressed for the game.  Everyone got into the game, including Boyette, the 6'2-3" FY center.  When she pulled down a rebound on a missed shot and put a nice bank shot it, the bench stood up for her effort, led by Meg.  The FY player runs the floor well and seems to be getting the feel of CAC games. 
Next game at Colby on Friday.  Expect Meg Robertson to sit out again...even in a conference game. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 28, 2014, 10:06:53 PM
Amh63,
  Went scouting tonite and found that a prospect that interested me from the summer AAU season has chosen Amherst. She's a 6-3 post from Montgomery County, MD that will be need development. I ran into GP at Junior Nationals this summer and he may have seen similar promise.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 29, 2014, 09:44:30 AM
Ronk....thanks for the info.  The county in MD, as you may know is where I reside.  Have not picked up the Was. Post sports news since I dropped the paper after over 40 years.  Fewer and fewer good writers, IMO.  What year is she...better yet...what school does she attend.  Maybe check her out in a live game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 29, 2014, 10:01:15 AM
 I send it as a PM.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on January 29, 2014, 12:41:00 PM
Quote from: remsleep on January 27, 2014, 03:28:46 PM
D3wbbfan...they are 16-0, last year they were 25-3.....you are off the deep end my friend...agree that Gromacki is a tremendous coach...absolutely one of the best.....Berube seems to be doing just fine, thank you, 10 player rotation or not....now take a big breath then exhale haha

Interestingly, Berube was just named DIIINews Coach of the Month.  :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 31, 2014, 07:43:17 PM
Amherst wins against Colby in Maine 67-44.  It was a workman like win.  Meg Robertson was dressed but never left the bench.  Encouraging progress.  Both Doswell sisters scored 13 points.  Everyone played....except Meg.  Boyette enters the game and scored again on a bank shot down low.  After the first 5 minutes, with Colby holding a brief lead, the game turned Amherst's way and the lead was in the double digits for most of the game.
Next match will be Bowdoin,  Hope Meg Robertson is not needed against the Polar Bears.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 01, 2014, 03:53:44 PM
Amherst wins over Bowdoin in Maine in the battle of ranked teams...65-57.  It was a two point lead by Amherst at the half.  Amherst held a 6 to 10 point lead for most of the latter part of the 2nd half.  Amherst could not hit an outside shot for most of the game but won off of rebounds and inside shots it seems.  Good win.  The somewhat down news.  Meg Robertson was not dressed for the game and wore a heavy brace on her left leg.  Seems a step back on her recovery.....possible strain during early practice and/or warming up.  FOUR players in double figures.  Renner, Holness, M. Doswell and Giddins...according to the announcers.  NSN announcers announced the game well but were clearly biasly behind the Polar Bears.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on February 01, 2014, 10:03:18 PM
Liked the even scoring of points with Meridith Doswell getting more into the mix.  The more options the Jeff's have while Robertson is down, the better for the long haul.  Amh63, I didn't see the knee brace, but that would say to me she could be lost for the season, but don't know that.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 02, 2014, 07:08:29 AM
I thought Amherst played a nice game against Bowdoin.  It was a well played game by both teams, from start to finish.  Amherst did a better job in this game getting to the basket, when the 3s would not fall (they did not do this against Tufts).  It still looks like Tufts is the top team in the league.  A lot of big games coming up in the next two weeks, with Bowdoin ,Williams, Trinity, Wesleyan and Conn College all fighting for the three and four spots.  Today's Hamilton-Middlebury game is a big game for the number 7/8 spots. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 02, 2014, 12:50:30 PM
NE JEFFS Fan....I did not see the brace.  The announcers mentioned that during the game there was the lea ding scorer and rebounder sitting on the bench with a heavy knee brace.  Caught a shot or two of Meg in street clothes next to the coaches.  When she walked by in the handshake line, she did so in a limp like manner....therefore my speculation of a strain maybe durning pre game practice.  On Friday, she was dressed and had been walking smoothly with only a taped knee.
Several points wrt to use of FY players.  H. Peterson who scored a career best 30 points in a recent game, was missing shots last night.  Maine 1 earlier posted that A. Doswell, no. 23, in the Tufts game was missing the basket entirely.  In a following game, she scores a career best 24 points.  She had an off night last night on the offensive side, but still tied with her twin M. Doswell for leading scorer.  Also, it seems that both of Amherst's captains were on the bench last night for some time.  Soph C. Pritchard was sat down....had an off game and was sitting with Meg.  J. Renner  had the reign and played well down the stretch.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 02, 2014, 08:28:27 PM
Looks like Colby or Middlebury need to win three games, otherwise Hamilton has probably wrapped up the 8th spot in the playoffs with their win today. Bates could still sneak in but would need to beat Hamilton and win at least one other game and hope that Hamilton doesn't win another.  Tough to see both Bates and Colby at the bottom of the league.  Colby seems to be in most games for a while, but then fades.  No inside game at all.  Not sure what the story is with Bates.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on February 03, 2014, 12:38:46 AM
Another interesting game for Williams vs Middlebury on Friday. Williams prevailed 60-55 but it was not pretty. MacDonald (19 points) and McCall (12) rescued a mediocre performance from much of the rest of the team. Cook was really off on her shooting but contributed 10 rebounds and 5 assists.

Big games this weekend vs Bates and Tufts at home.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on February 04, 2014, 01:31:54 PM
DIII rankings are out:

#6 tufts
12 amherst
15 williams
22 bowdoin
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on February 04, 2014, 06:24:10 PM
WBCA has it slightly differently, which may chap some Amherst fans:

Tufts 5
Williams 10
Amherst 11
Bowdoin 22

NESCAC is still the only conference with four ranked teams.   :o
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 04, 2014, 06:34:30 PM
Interested to see Tufts game @ RIC tonight.   The Jumbos are the 3rd unbeaten NESCAC team to come into the Murray Center in Providence in the last 30 days following Bowdoin & Amherst.  Bowdoin lost by 11 & Amherst won by 9.  I think Tufts is probably the best of those 3 teams (sorry Amh), but right now RIC is playing a whole lot better today than they were the beginning of January when they played the Jeffs & Polar Bears.  I have Tufts winning as I think they are just a better team than the Anchorwomen are, but hopefully, as an LEC homer, who's conference desperately needs a marquee victory, the Jumbos are looking past RIC and looking ahead to Williams (who's game is more important to them anyways in the long run).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 05, 2014, 08:07:04 AM
Agree that Tufts is the best team in the NESCAC.  However, I would not be surprised if they lose to Williams out at Williams.  And if Amherst gets Robertson back for the NESCAC playoffs, even though the game would be at Tufts (assuming Tufts does not lose two games in the league) I would not be surprised to see Amherst beat Tufts--primarily because of the coaching advantage
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 05, 2014, 10:41:05 AM
Don't want to get in a discussion with knowledgeable posters wrt to polls and best team in the region.  I will  however flatly state now that with Meg Robertson back' the Lady Jeff's will win the conference title where ever it is played.  This is based on the the play of the young Amherst team in recent games without one of its Captains.  Meg Robertson was an returning All- American.  With her, Amherst beat a Williams team easily at home and only lost by 2 at Williams without her.  She essentially did not play in the Tuft's game...getting injured 3 minutes into the game.
Mt post here is ...who won the game at RIC?

Never mind...saw that Tufts blew out RIC.  Now what were you saying about RIC 7 ? :).  One must remember polls are done by people with insufficient  data about loses...having many teams to think about , etc.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on February 05, 2014, 12:16:43 PM
Williams has been without Katie Litman, their sophomore post, for the last 10 games, but word is she will return soon. Litman is a double double threat every game and their best defender. With Litman (if she is near form) I would rank Willams and Amherst even on a neutral court. If Amherst plays at home, they have the advantage. Tufts is still the team to beat this year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on February 05, 2014, 01:26:40 PM
Using Massey's purely statistical approach, win probabilities on a neutral court:

Tufts 52% over Amherst
Tufts 80% over Williams
Amherst 78% over Williams

Tufts becomes a 61% favorite over Amherst if Tufts is hosting; Amherst becomes 59% favorite if it is hosting.  These are both large home field advantages compared to most HFAs by Massey calculations.

Massey also predicted a 86% probably of a Tufts win over RIC with median score of 62-50.  Surprisingly accurate.

Throw the statistics out the window when the ball is tossed up, but interesting nonetheless.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 05, 2014, 02:41:42 PM
Roundball.....thanks for the post.  Does provide another point to provide discussion.  Enjoyed the info.  Will not bore you or other posters with the pro and con of Massey and the statististical model approaches.  My simple :)  answer to using such models is weather predictions.  It has come a long way and now there are at least four different models that were used to predicit recent storms and maybe the recent weather for the Super Bowl.  Yes, I am also a skeptic of economic models and will admit to being skeptics of the top economists...including a Nobel Prize winner....all which I know and have been friends with over the years....from Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 05, 2014, 07:51:12 PM
Lots of really good points and opinions.  Let's hope for a NESCAC final four of Amherst, Williams, Bowdoin and Tufts--clearly the top four teams in the conference, and this would make for a great Saturday afternoon of D3 women's basketball.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 07, 2014, 07:43:59 PM
Amherst wins in LeFrak over a game Conn. College team 77-58.  The Camels came out smoking in taking a 9-0 ked and led the LJs by double digits.  Amherst ties the game when their shots start to hit , but the Camels led at the half 33-30.
It was a different story as M. Giddens starts to score inside and goes 10-10 in her shooting.  Peterson who was 1-7 from outside in the first half, hits her first two 3's in the second half and the game goes Amherst's way big.  Amherst turned up the defense, Amherst goes inside and gets fouled, and it was catch up the rest of the half.  Amherst dominated the boards...against a taller front court put on the floor by the Camels' coach.  Amherst players took advantage with their quickness and hustle.  Everyone on the Amherst squad got into the game....except for Meg Robertson.  According to the announcer, she maybe out for the season with an apparent ACL injury.  Meg was on the bench in street clothes and a taped knee...cheering her teammates on.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 08, 2014, 10:30:53 AM
Huge game out at Williams today.  A Tufts win would likely clinch the top seed in the NESCAC, as I don't see Tufts losing two games at home next weekend.  Bowdoin will give them a run, but Colby won't get all the open three looks they had last night, when they hit twelve threes to effectively kill any hopes Middlebury had of getting the number 8 spot.  Trinity could put itself in position to steal the number 4 spot with a win over Conn College today, as they have the tiebreaker over Williams, should Williams lose against Tufts. However, that opens up a possibility for a three way tie between Trinity, Bowdoin and Williams, should Tufts beat Bowdoin next week.  Several interesting games and match ups down the stretch here.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 08, 2014, 12:08:00 PM
I think Williams beats Tufts today.  Tufts should take care of business at home next weekend.  Colby shouldn't give them much trouble, Bowdoin might, but I think Tufts will win both of those games.  Bowdoin has had success vs. the Jumbos in recent years.  Didn't Bowdoin knock them off 2 seasons ago in the 1 vs. 8 game as the 8 seed or was that last year??
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 08, 2014, 02:03:40 PM
Why is Tufts wearing their white home uniforms this afternoon??
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on February 08, 2014, 03:03:31 PM
When teams are on the road they wear their away uniforms on Friday night and their home uniforms the next day as laundry time is tight.  Look at Amherst game today, Amherst in dark uniforms and Wesleyan in white.   Tough day for Amherst technology as no sound on video and live stats are frozen.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 08, 2014, 03:26:36 PM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on February 08, 2014, 03:03:31 PM
When teams are on the road they wear their away uniforms on Friday night and their home uniforms the next day as laundry time is tight.  Look at Amherst game today, Amherst in dark uniforms and Wesleyan in white.   Tough day for Amherst technology as no sound on video and live stats are frozen.

Alright, that makes sense.  Especially for the road team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 08, 2014, 06:16:12 PM
It was a game of limited resources it seems.  The announcers for the WBB game arrive less than a minute to go.  For the MBB game that followed, the "replacement announcers" for today were baseball players that did the first half and did not return for the 2nd half.  No stats as the stats people went to support the hockey game.  The running score in both games were quite behind.
To the game....The Lady Jeffs had a much easier  time with the Cardinals in the conference game.  It was a relative low scoring game with a lot of running up and down the court and missed shots by both teams.  Amherst wins by double digits....and keeps pace with Tufts...it seems.  Need someone to beat the Jumbos so that there maybe a coin flip to see who host's the tourny :) The Ephs did not do it today.  I will be back with the score, and defer others and the Amherst SID for the game details.
Back...Amherst 51, Wesleyan 39.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 08, 2014, 06:20:30 PM
Quote from: amh63 on February 08, 2014, 06:16:12 PM
It was a game of limited resources it seems.  The announcers for the WBB game arrive less than a minute to go.  For the MBB game that followed, the "replacement announcers" for today were baseball players that did the first half and did not return for the 2nd half.  No stats as the stats people went to support the hockey game.  The running score in both games were quite behind.
To the game....The Lady Jeffs had a much easier  time with the Cardinals in the conference game.  It was a relative low scoring game with a lot of running up and down the court and missed shots by both teams.  Amherst wins by double digits....and keeps pace with Tufts...it seems.  Need someone to beat the Jumbos so that there maybe a coin flip to see who host's the tourny :) The Ephs did not do it today.  I will be back with the score, and defer others and the Amherst SID for the game details.

Since the Jumbos beat them, doesn't Amherst need them to lose twice??  Let's say they lose to Bowdoin and beat Colby so they both end up 9-1 the Jumbos should still get the top seed based on the head-to-head win.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 08, 2014, 10:06:04 PM
First tiebreaker for NESCAC seeding if two teams are tied is head to head, so for Amherst to finish first, Tufts has to lose twice next week.  Highly unlikely.
Very impressive win for Tufts today.  Blew out Williams at Williams in the second half, after playing at Hamilton Friday night.  That is a very long road trip.  Tufts looked every bit the top team in the conference today.  Amherst struggled with a fair Wesleyan team.  Amherst will get the two seed.  The three-four seed will come down to next week.  Williams has a tough round trip to Conn College and Wesleyan.  Conn College is playing tough,  and could give Williams a hard time.  Trinity has the easiest game with Middlebury, and Bowdoin has a difficult game at Tufts. I could see Trinity ending up with the three seed, and they have the tiebreaker in a head to head tie with Williams. If Trinity gets the three seed, you could end up with a very interesting four-five game of Williams vs. Bowdoin.  The final weekend will definitely have some good matchups.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 11, 2014, 09:16:51 PM
Babson soundly beats Tufts in Melford tonight.  Looked at the box quickly and it seems that the entire  five starters for The Jumbos were flat.  Not a good lost as the Babson team based on the record this season to date is not up to past seasons.   Congrats to the Babson team. 
Tufts' coach needs to forget the lost and get team to focus on the conference games this weekend.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bballfan13 on February 11, 2014, 09:39:51 PM
Quote from: amh63 on February 11, 2014, 09:16:51 PM
Babson soundly beats Tufts in Melford tonight.  Looked at the box quickly and it seems that the entire  five starters for The Jumbos were flat.  Not a good lost as the Babson team based on the record this season to date is not up to past seasons.   Congrats to the Babson team. 
Tufts' coach needs to forget the lost and get team to focus on the conference games this weekend.

55-52 is soundly?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on February 11, 2014, 09:44:34 PM
Quote from: bballfan13 on February 11, 2014, 09:39:51 PM
Quote from: amh63 on February 11, 2014, 09:16:51 PM
Babson soundly beats Tufts in Melford tonight.  Looked at the box quickly and it seems that the entire  five starters for The Jumbos were flat.  Not a good lost as the Babson team based on the record this season to date is not up to past seasons.   Congrats to the Babson team. 
Tufts' coach needs to forget the lost and get team to focus on the conference games this weekend.

55-52 is soundly?

Wow, Tufts led 32-13 at the half, you would have expected they could mail it in at that point.  Then Babson outscores them by 25 in the 2nd?  Sounds like a very unusual game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MVP on February 11, 2014, 11:17:16 PM
Congratulations to Babson for going into Tufts and defeating them on their court  in a mid February contest.
Congratulations to Babson for not giving up being down by more than 15 at halftime.

FG % in 2nd half  tells the story in this one. Tufts mailed it in ... early 2nd half.  Big lift for a rebuilding Babson team post Wurdeman, King and Sarah Collins and concerning for a top #5 previously undefeated Tufts . 😊
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on February 13, 2014, 08:36:11 AM
Could be the best thing that happens to Tufts to drive home the point that every game counts and not to take anyone for granted.  I think they'll still have a leg up to host the NESCAC.  Largest concern is how loss to Babson will affect regional ratings.  Seems like Amherst is learning to play without Roberston.  Hoping to see a Tufts or Williams rematch in conference tourney.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 14, 2014, 04:33:13 PM
For Amherst fans, posted on the MBB board a way to see the WBB. Team pictures...in color no less.  Taken for senior day, I believe, primarily.  Since the WBB team has no seniors, it was an opportunity. :)

This weekend games can impact the position of the teams in the conference tourny.  Amherst should win at home against Middlebury...but after Tufts' last game, who knows.

I too hope for a rematch with Tufts in the title game. Expect a closer game than the last time.  Amherst is indeed learning to play well without their All- American.  The way Williams is playing, there may not be a chance of meeting Williams.  See a chance of Williams meeting again with Trinity.  Based on any further lost by Williams, they could be meeting Trinity in Hartford in the first game of the CAC tourny.   Makes the results of this weekend most interesting.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 15, 2014, 04:10:27 PM
Williams hasn't had a very good weekend.  15 point loss to the Camels and an overtime game against the Cardinals??  I know they're on the road and both teams are decent, but not very impressive.  Will be lucky if they get out of this game with Wesleyan with a win which it looks like they will up 74-71 with 11 seconds left.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 16, 2014, 01:39:50 PM
Amherst wins over  Middlebury 79-41 in LeFrak.  Everyone on the Amherst team got a workout.  Amherst started the game with 4 FY players and a sophmore captain.  Brought in more experienced players  later to give lift and energy.  Played tough man to man and some zone.  FY center Boyette had extensive time on the floor.  She is big and mobile.  Needs more PT in her adjustment to good college BB, IMO.  Good win for the team. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on February 16, 2014, 05:26:26 PM
Amh63, Coach Gromacki made the one final lineup tweak that I expected today. He elevated M Doswell to starter, and restored Holness back to her pre-Robertson injury, 7th man role. Which she's perfect at. The team has now 100% adjusted to life without Megan. I wish for her a full recovery next season. But this Amherst post-season is what I'm calling "Marley and the Miracles". GP rarely ever shows his hand. But he recently had do just that, up at Bowdoin - twice - because he had to have that key NESCAC win. By sitting a healthy Pritchard for the last 17 minutes, in favor of Renner at the point, with M Doswell/Holness as his only subs. I don't know if another HC in America would've sat his SO, co-captain PG, who was basically his only experienced player, in that same situation. But it was clearly the right move. Renner's already a highly skilled PG, as is Cheyenne, but Jaimie still provides solid offense from there, which allowed GP to sub in more O for Pritchard. I believe it will happen again, when absolutely necessary.

For me, the other GP-goes-pedal-to-the-metal tip is Zwecker's PT. She played less than 1 minute vs. Bowdoin. Again, that was the perfect move that day. Haley almost always plays double digit minutes. But her overall skill ceiling is just a bit lower than the other 7 Jeffs who played. GP wins more than anybody else because he not only knows his players, and their individual talents, but he's then willing to shorten his already short rotation, even down to 6 1/2 or 7, to help his team win, when a situation dictates. To their credit, every one of his players know that it's nothing personal. The objective is to win the game.

To me, Marley Giddins is the key to the Jeffs. By now, all four key freshman are plenty battle-tested, and are more than ready to make a deep NCAA run, regardless of "FY" being slathered all over GP's roster, and no Robertson. Her loss didn't kill Amherst, so it made them stronger. It might be the best coaching job I've ever seen. Of late, when Holness is sitting, GP's been playing Peterson at post on D. As usual, that's the move. All this moving around is hurting Hannah's 3-pt % of late, but all it takes is one. The truth: all shooters are somewhat streaky. Besides, she's logged an absolute ton of minutes for them this year.

As a loyal Tufts fan, I know that my earlier, long Tufts post was atypical. In it I addressed some concerns I had, within a wildly successful WBB program. I appreciate those who understood my comments were 0% personal, about either Coach Berube, or any of her players. As people, I couldn't possibly have any more respect for all of them than I do. Going 10-0 in the NESCAC is an incredible achievement. And I am thrilled both by it, and for it. But isn't that what "family" does, when we care? Make a suggestion or two, that might help? While being logical, and based on facts I'd learned from multiple, successful college HC's, while meaning no harm at all to Tufts?

I did watch the Tufts loss to Babson. While some write it off to a Hamilton/Williams 2-0 NESCAC road trip hangover, I somewhat disagree. Because I've seen that exact same half by the Jumbos this season. Also at Cousens. First half, vs. Conn College, non-NESCAC game, right before holiday break. And Coach Berube got them going at halftime. It happened because both Foley and Moynihan were ice cold from 3. Also, this year's team doesn't execute in the half court set as well as last year's team did. Tufts then becomes surprisingly vulnerable on O. Because it exposes a normally-hidden, Tufts weakness: they normally play a perfectly designed, prototypical power forward (Hayley Kanner) out of position - at center. Last year, they had absolutely no choice. Hayley is 6'2", and she was their only 6-footer. But Kanner is a deadly shooter from 12 feet, loves playing facing the basket, and strongly dislikes physical contact. (A very common trait in WBB, and is obvious, just by watching.) Kanner's missed a ton of layups this season, even when the Jumbos 3-ptrs are dropping. But when cool Jumbo shooting allows an opposing D to start collapsing down low (as it did with well-coached CC & Babson teams), Kanner then gets even less room to work, and has even more trouble. That's why I so fervently championed North, in a previous e-mail. She's a natural 5, looks 6"3" to me, loves playing back to the basket, doesn't mind contact at all, makes her lay-ups, and, most importantly, would allow Kanner to move to her natural 4 position. But Coach Berube remains extremely committed to a 80%+ either/or player scenario, as to having Kanner and North on the floor separately. It is likely way too late to get them used to playing many minutes together now. (The two surely go against each other in practice every day.) And that's a shame. Doesn't mean I'm still not 100% behind the Jumbos. But I just know that Coach Gromacki's team won't be far away. And even the fact that it's gonna be played at Cousens isn't giving me a real confident, warm fuzzy feeling right now. Good health and good luck to all teams! 

                                                                                                             
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 16, 2014, 07:20:18 PM
d3wbbfan.....enjoyed your post.  Very good points and analyses on Amherst and Tufts.  Lots for me to consider and digest.  +Karma to you.  Do differ with you on several players and observations. 
Am still enjoying the win over Middlebury on the MBB side so will wait another time to "talk" to you.

Will say that I was surprised at the offensive outburst of the Jumbos in their win over a solid Polar Bear team.  Was not surprised by the play of the Ephs this weekend.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on February 16, 2014, 09:21:01 PM
Many thanks, amh63. You've seen far more Amherst WBB than I. I hold your LJ opinions in very high regard, and will likely default to you on your own team's abilities. I enjoy it when folks don't always talk about "their" team, but will opine on other contenders as well. So I welcome your take on the Jumbos. (And I heartily concur with you, as to the Ephs' rough weekend being no surprise. Although I can't imagine the Polar Bears are exactly thrilled that Williams fell all the way to 6th, ending up as Bowdoin's QF opponent, however.)

Amh63, I know how much you enjoy the all-around game of "your All-American", as you like to refer to her as - Megan Robertson. I hope I made it clear that nothing Coach can come up with, post-injury, could ever replace her amazingly high level of play. A huge void remains. All your team can do now is to move forward with who's left. To me, watching GP's offense operate is a thing of beauty. For his current squad, the 5-out, high post weave he's been using a lot puts constant stress on opponents' D to stop repeated, potential dribble drives, each trip down. Which then opens up multiple, clean looks from 3. Yeah, Tufts and Williams' D historically get all the accolades. But most of these Jeff FY's are long, quick and very well-schooled on D. And they all possess 3 more years of eligibility. Yikes!

There are several other areas, re Tufts, that I believe can be exploited by GP. That I haven't shared on here. And if a huckleberry like me can notice these things, I don't imagine it'll escape the mind of your coach, either. Hence my Tufts post-season concerns....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 18, 2014, 02:54:38 PM
I was not totally surprised with Conn College beating Williams last week. Also, Tufts looked bad against Babson, and looked bad against a poor Colby team for most of that game.  They found their offense against Bowdoin.
I would expect Amherst and Tufts to win easily this weekend, so that the one and two seed should advance.  Bowdoin has a tough draw with Williams, but it is at Bowdoin. I expect Bowdoin to hold on and make it to the finals.  Conn College and Trinity is a close match up that could go either way.  I would not be surprised if Conn Colege wins. Either of those teams will give Tufts a battle in the finals, and the Bowdoin-Williams winner will give Amherst a tough game.  The final four should be an excellent Saturday afternoon of basketball. It will be interesting to see how many teams get into the NCAA tournament. Amherst and Tufts are likely locks at this point, but all other teams probably have to win at least one game, if not two , to get in.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 18, 2014, 04:35:51 PM
Maine.....nice clear assessment of the games ahead.  Thanks.  First glance, I will agreed with you....but admit, I have to do some more homework.  Conn College is the team that I feel has been under the radar.  Was more worried about them than say Bowdoin.  Trinity is another team that requires a look, imo.  Williams, a puzzle to figure out.  With Meg Robertson, the win over Williams was a cakewalk, in LeFrak...of course.  In Chandler, the game was still winnable with out Meg.  Game tied and Amherst with the ball with about 20 seconds to go.  Of course, Williams was also missing one of their best player...as pointed out by a Williams poster.  However, in the  recent games  I checked in on, The Williams team seems to depend on their star player, Cook. individual abilities too much, imo.  Seems that her team mates often defer to her too much.  Sometimes games are won that way, often more than likely it does not work against good teams.  I will admit here that I'm not an fan of the Williams HBC as a coach, period.  Regardless of my Amherst bias.
Lots of talent on the Williams team over the years....results over those years do not do justice to the talent level is where I am coming from.
Anyway, looking forward to the weekend.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 19, 2014, 04:30:13 PM
d3wbbfan....as promised this is my "talk/conversation" with you....sharing some thoughts on the Amherst team...my opinions only...the coach and various other things to give you a sense of where I'm coming from.
First, I am not as knowledgeable as you have shown to be with the "technical aspects" of BB and possible coach's view.  I have learned as I go...playing a little....and watching BB at all levels and WBB because of UCONN  and their coach.  I did not know what you call a 5-out flex weave formation.  I just know that when Amherst exercise it, it bothers me me with the FYs.  My reason is what I call "decision" making wrt players.  It should come up often when I talk about different players and my assessment of them...that may differ with yours :).   I will digress here to talk about D3 coaches....a little and about me and the Amherst WBB team over the years.....you pointed out my view with Meg Robertson.  Hopefully it will explain some things.
My wife and I went to UCONN...she for 4 years as an undergrad...me for two years as a grad student.  My best man and I  have followed UCONN BB for many years....in particular the women's team.  When I go up to watch football and MBB games....and therefore WBB games at Amherst, etc.,
I more than not stay with my best man in East Lyme Ct. area.  A number of years ago, there was a woman player from Norwich that went up to Amherst.  My friend noted that her father was a former MBB player from UCONN... We were hooked into watching more conference WBB games..consistently.  Last season, we went up to Amherst to watch the Tufts vs Amherst WBB game...2nd one in the tournament...in LeFrak when D3hoops Pat C. was up with his crew to broadcast the game.  It was fun, in part because one of my sons and his wife joined us for the games.....there was also a men's game with Tufts.  The primary reason was the Tuft's WBB coach...my friend remembers her at UCONN and all that stuff.  I enjoy watching games against Tufts since my grad school days at MIT....yes more schooling....wife and I enjoyed a restaurant in Melford then.
In my last post, I posted briefly my opinion on the Williams coach.  Maybe a little harsh.  Before the present Amherst Coach G....as I refer to him....like Coach K. for the MBB coach at Duke, that I also admire....the coach...who is still at Amherst..was not cut out for the position....he was a former football player and an asst. football coach at Amherst. There was talent coming to Amherst for the WBB team but the team never was really successful.  One talented player transferred to Bowdoin to play and became an all conference player there....hope you get the picture.  It upsets me to see talented players never achieve their potential.  Injuries and putting school work first, I can understand.  Enough said on that....the reason for my remark.
With respect to Meg....I have followed her closely since her FY when she won ROY in the conference.  I remember talking to her grandparents at her games...yes, I get too close to players at times via their parents, etc.  In the Williams
game in LeFrak, I met Meg's father for the first time...as well as the Doswell twins parents, etc.  We sort of bonded since he graduated from MIT and works there.  He told me something about Meg's recruitment by Coach G.  which cleared up some things for me.  Yes, you are quite correct that Coach G. knows his players and when to push them for their development and for the team....and for his wins.
I will shorten this post and talk about several players....really the PG position players.  Cheyenne Pritchard is better off at the off-guard position.  She plays tough defense and is needed for her leadership abilities.  She actually has a good outside shot, but often does not take them...partly because she has to handle the ball too much,imo.  She still is learning the critical area that I call ...making the right or best decisions during a game.  Taking a open shot instead of making a pass to another which ends up in a turnover.  Last season, she came in when the two senior guards needed a rest.  Likewise, Haley Zwecker came in and played great in many games...became a fan favorite...mine too.  She can dribble and drive to the hoop.  She actually has a fine outside shot.  This year,  she does not clearly know her role on the team.  She comes in as the PG and tries to distribute the ball...fine...but gives up the open look and dribbles too much...around.... looking for the open player to pass to and often there is a TO.  In the last game she found her way into the lane and scored well...at the right time utilizing her skills.  I noticed during foul shots by the team...she now goes over to talk to the assistant coach for instructions.  That is also something new this year.  While Coach G. is asserting himself more during games this year.. giving instructions during the flow of the game....he is deffering more to his prime assistant.  The guard coach?
In closing, the critical area in using so many FYs , imho, is how well their decision making is coming along.  Especially in close games.  You state that you like the player movement used by Coach G....especially the weave.  I do too, but I sometimes get tense in close games when I think that a player makes a pass off when she shouldn't...doing it by rote and not seeing that the situation has changed....a steal results because the defensive player has broken through.  Wrong decision at the time.  Smart players will learn quickly.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jumpshot on February 19, 2014, 06:15:53 PM
amh63 ----

Your lack of qualifications to judge coaches is exceeded only by the out-of-bounds nature of your comments. Suggest you review the post-game interview following Williams women's victory over amherst at last year's Final Four or this year's loss by amherst in Chandler. One's own self-acceptance is not enhanced by harsh remarks about someone to whom you've probably never spoken.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on February 20, 2014, 12:24:10 AM
Quote from: jumpshot on February 19, 2014, 06:15:53 PM
amh63 ----

Your lack of qualifications to judge coaches is exceeded only by the out-of-bounds nature of your comments. Suggest you review the post-game interview following Williams women's victory over amherst at last year's Final Four or this year's loss by amherst in Chandler. One's own self-acceptance is not enhanced by harsh remarks about someone to whom you've probably never spoken.
Quote from: amh63 on February 19, 2014, 06:39:17 PM
Jumpshot....Please, your lack of understanding is exceeded only by your judgement.  If you want to get get personal, let us go off line and off the board.  Thank you.


Can someone find Huge Nerd so he can bring some sensibility back to this board?   Amh63 and Jumpshot---I propose you both go into self-imposed exile from this board until, oh let's say, end of the 2019 season.  Thanks.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 20, 2014, 09:15:33 AM
remsheep....and others, I came today to remove my post and did.  In reflection, I realize it was a "thin skinned" reaction to a particular poster...on the MBB board...that I find annoying and for the most part ignore.  My question to you....since you post on this board primarily....why HUGENERD?  I do not remember him posting on this board.  Actually he has not posted on the MBB Newmac board this year....since he has started a new step in his life after getting his doctorate from MIT.  Just curious.
Oh yes, I do believe that posters have the freedom of opining....within limits....and should avoid negative personal matters. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ourtrun on February 20, 2014, 03:50:52 PM
Amherst has been playing very well lately, but I don't see them winning the NESCAC tournament this year without Robertson for several reasons. 1) Three pointers account for 36% of their shot attempts (this is probably higher since Megan's injury). The only NESCAC teams with a higher percentage threes shot attempts are Colby at 40% and Hamilton at 37% (not great company). Amherst's only two losses this season have come against teams (Williams and Tufts) that can pressure their shooters and force them to drive into the lane where their size and can either block or challenge shots. 2) Without a legitimate inside threat they'll have to shoot a better percentage than the 33% they've been averaging from behind the arc. Smart teams in the NCAA tournament will pressure their shooters and force them to drive. 3) One other observation, for the top teams 3 pointers only account for 30% to 20% of their field goal attempts (DePauw and Whitman respectively). Living off three pointers is a sure way to eventually go hungry.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on February 20, 2014, 11:57:15 PM
Quote from: amh63 on February 20, 2014, 09:15:33 AM
remsheep....and others, I came today to remove my post and did.  In reflection, I realize it was a "thin skinned" reaction to a particular poster...on the MBB board...that I find annoying and for the most part ignore.  My question to you....since you post on this board primarily....why HUGENERD?  I do not remember him posting on this board.  Actually he has not posted on the MBB Newmac board this year....since he has started a new step in his life after getting his doctorate from MIT.  Just curious.
Oh yes, I do believe that posters have the freedom of opining....within limits....and should avoid negative personal matters.

<sigh>
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on February 21, 2014, 01:00:07 AM
Outrun, I very much enjoyed your post. And you might just be right. Like you, I find plenty of good info in the season stats summaries, and love to dig in. However, I'd be careful to over-conclude here - at least in Amherst's case. The Jeffs' game at Tufts was the first-ever NESCAC road game for all the frosh. It was also the very game that Robertson went down, and only 3 minutes in, to boot. That's a pretty good 1-2 punch to the solar plexus for the Amherst young guns, no? Watching the game, and being a Tufts fan, I thought Amherst hung in extremely well that day, given it was the *one* game that Tufts had circled on their schedule. Major Jumbos payback game. They return a veteran club, and had absorbed two narrow Jeff losses (both at LeFrak) in 12-13, including the season ender. And yeah, while the narrow Amherst loss at Williams was an "L", it wasn't their "official" NESCAC game - Amherst had already won the one that counted, by 16, 11 days earlier.

I agree that Amherst has fired up lots of 3's this year. Initially, it's an easy way to give young players with both talent and touch some confidence and some early success, before they'd fully grasped GP's offensive/defensive principles. Besides, Megan didn't need early-season post reps - she'd been there/done that. But once she was lost, the whole Amherst offense required major, in-season re-tooling. Yes, Holness was a good stopgap. And she will remain valuable, going forward. But her game and Megan's are not at all similar. Adjusting to the Robertson loss took time. As a result of all these things, to me, the Jeffs' 13-14 season stats tell surprisingly little about how they are playing as a team today, and how they'll be playing going forward.

Outrun, I found your DePauw/Whitman vs Amherst stats argument intriguing. I've seen 5 13-14 games by the defending champs, on-line. Just for fun. And while Kris Huffman has been winning as big as Geno in recent years, through no fault of their own, the Tigers' league is usually very weak. How valid will their season stats prove to be, vs NCAA-caliber teams? Not very, I suggest. DePauw has a 4-game lead on the #2 team, has had only one league win by less than 10 pts, and are the only NCAC team in their NCAA region's latest rankings. (While the top four teams in NE are *all* from the NESCAC, even with 8 total leagues getting NCAA auto bids!) And while SR Alex Gasaway is great up front for DePauw, by NESCAC standards, she's quite undersized, at 5'10". 5'8" JR Savannah Trees is excellent. But the one who scares me most is their 6th man, Emma Ondik, a 5'5" JR who shoots 50% from 3, and has proven to be quite clutch, both last year and so far this year.

Whitman? I first stumbled upon them last March, when the beat host Lewis & Clark in the NCAA 2nd round. And looked special doing it. Next thing I know, they're in Williamstown! Yeah, they lost to the then-senior-laden Ephs, but they haven't lost a game since! 24-0. I watch their webstream regularly, and have even posted over in the NWC thread. To me, it's the one conference that runs neck and neck with the NESCAC, as to overall level of play, with the MN and WI D3 leagues right behind. Being out west, Whitman gets to lay low. They'd be totally off the D3 radar if they hadn't made the big NCAA run last year, and then gone undefeated in 13-14, in a very respected conference. Whitman is so improved from a year ago. It's startling, actually. They seamlessly went from "cinderella story" to being the hunted. The latter suits them perfectly. The higher the pressure, the better they play. And despite what many coaches say ("that's how my team plays!"), it is a VERY rare team that truly does. Trust me, no one from the NESCAC wants to see the team from Walla Walla, WA next month.

Given their strong league, Whitman's 13-14 stats are a fair reflection of who they are. Their #1 problem last year was having no reliable 3-pt shooters. They saw a ton of zone. But this year, out of nowhere, SR Tiffani Traver has become a sharpshooter, is among the league leaders in 3's made, with FR Alysse Ketner also helping out. Even so, the bulk of Whitman's O still comes from their "big three" of prolific, slashing JR PG Heather Johns, and SR posts Sarah Anderegg and Meghan White. With the 3's mainly for keep-the-defense-honest garnish. So, given this team's strengths, comparing Whitman's 13-14 3-pt stats against Amherst's would make the Jeffs look like they were being coached by Paul Westhead!   :)

Please forgive me for going out-of-region a bit here, my D3 friends. But outrun mentioned two teams I happened to know a good bit about, and I thought his thoughtful post deserved a thoughtful reply. Good luck to all NESCAC fans on Saturday! 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on February 21, 2014, 07:29:53 AM
I saw Depauw play the Ephs in the Final Four last year.  Williams played REALLY well in that game just to stick with them.  They have basically the same cast of characters back.  If they are playing at the same level this year (and it seems like, if anything, they may be better), trust me, they are substantially better than any current NESCAC team -- they play a similar style defensively to Amherst, a ton of intense pressure all over the court, but they have better athletes and are deeper, which makes them even more intimidating.  And they play great as a team on offense while having several very dynamic individual scorers who can break defenders down.  Given that Amherst and Williams return their entire rosters, and Tufts returns the majority of its key players, as good as NESCAC is this year, it could have several legit national title contenders next year.  But this year, I don't think any would come within 10 points of Depauw barring just an unbelievably hot shooting game.

Williams I do think has exceeded expectations this year after losing such a tremendous senior class, and without a lot of depth in terms of scoring options.  The Ephs did come back down to earth a few notches the past few weeks, but they are capable of regrouping and winning a few games in the NESCAC tourney, the NCAA tourney, or both.  They survived really well without Katie Litman, who is finally back, although obviously working her way back into basketball shape, so she has played very little in recent games -- hopefully she will have a much bigger impact this weekend.  The Ephs play very aggressively on defense, with a fair amount of body contact, and I think that how games are reffed may play a role in how well they do.  In the Conn game Conn shot 37 free throws!  Uwanaka and McCall both fouled out after playing a combined 40 minutes.  Uwanaka in particular needs to find a way to play her very effective, disruptive style of defense while avoiding picking up needless fouls.  With Litman back, Williams has a great five-player core with her, Uwanaka, McCall (playing very well of late), Cook, and MacDonald.  If Williams can manage to play its trademark suffocating defense without its stars getting in early foul trouble and having to ride the pine for long stretches, I think Williams could surprise some folks. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on February 21, 2014, 02:38:45 PM
Nescac1, I meant no slight to DePauw. My comparison of them to Geno was meant as high praise. My reply was specifically to Outrun's DePauw stat reference. I feel that their 13-14 season stats can't help but be a tad skewed, due to their weak league foes, the fact that they often play up to 18 players in games, while playing their starters limited minutes. Not that DePauw isn't again a fantastic team. Huffman has a proven system in place, with basically interchangeable parts. You're right. The Tigers possess both enviable team depth and overall athleticism. They're the real deal, and are the clear favorite to repeat. But the favorites don't always win. Every team has their good and bad nights. That's why you play the games, right? DePauw had to go to 2 OT to beat a solid, but not special Centre team earlier this year. Ondik had to nail both a late 3 in regulation, and then another one with :11 left on OT #1, just to tie it up both times. If the 12-13 Ephs were the DePauw opponent that day, I'd have liked Williams' chances.     

Similarly, I thought both Uwanaka and Cook had their very best 13-14 game at home vs Amherst. Caveney and McCall are big talents, and will be key future Eph cogs. I've always been a Macdonald fan. I do think Oge's inconsistency and her penchant for foul trouble has hurt Williams a ton, and became more magnified once Litman went down. Coach Manning needs Katie back to 100%, ASAP. To my eyes, the Ephs do struggle to score at times, and also to function as a single, fully cohesive unit on O. And while Cook can slash with the very best of them, and despite her best team intentions, she can forget to involve her teammates at times - especially if they're behind late.

Nescac1, to your point about the FT disparity at CC. Once the Camels made a key 3, with under 2 to go, to push their lead to 8, Manning then ordered her Ephs to foul immediately, and hope for misses. She has always done this. It happened 6 times: With 1:35 to go, 1:32, 1:22, 1:08, :58, and :52. That alone added 12 FT attempts to the overall CC ledger. When the Camels made all 12, Williams was toast. It did make the box score look strange. But that was 100% Manning's doing, not CC's. There was no home cooking. The game was both fairly and very well officiated. And as much as I hate to see a late parade to the FT line, I always think back to the 82-83 Jimmy V/NC State team. 1st round. Down to Pepperdine. The Pack keeps fouling. The Waves keep missing. NC State somehow ties it, wins in 2 OTs, and 5 wins later, Jimmy V's looking for someone to hug. Coach Manning just wants to give her team every chance to win.

The Williams at Bowdoin #6-at-#3 game is surely the one that NESCAC partisans will be keeping a close eye on. Actually, for a #6 seed, I think the Ephs continue to be getting an absolute *ton* of national respect. Bottom line: Williams was only 6-4 in conference. And were just an OT squeaker, NESCAC finale away from being 5-5. In the history of the NCAA D3 tourney, has a #6 league seed EVER garnered an at-large NCAA tourney bid? The answer has to be no, correct? Yet they clearly are. With all due respect, I can't honestly say that those who feel Williams may be a notch below the NESCAC WBB elite this year might not have a point. The best part? Their NCAA fate is in their own hands. Win their next 3 games, or cross their fingers and hope. I always root for high-quality basketball. And this league rarely disappoints. Stay healthy, and good luck to all teams this weekend!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 21, 2014, 03:28:39 PM
FYI.....posted on the MBB some items that I will post here. 
First the WBB game on Sat....at 2PM will be webcast.  Link on the Amherst website.  No link to date on the NESCAC website yet.....therefore maybe no link on the D3hoop site.  Alerted the SID at Amherst to see if it can be done.
2nd....there is a nice writeup on the upcoming WBB game this Saturday on the Athletic section for those interested.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: daoustian on February 22, 2014, 03:39:59 PM
That was an ugly beatdown of Hamilton.  Amherst made more 3s than 2s and shot 62.5% from beyond the arc, had a 50-point lead at one point.  Still a really young team for the Lady Jeffs, but great potential for the future. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 22, 2014, 03:56:39 PM
If I recall correctly...the final score was 78-33, with everybody playing.  FY Boyette again got PT and moved well and scored when she got the ball down low.  Seems early, Hamilton out rebounded the Lady Jeffs in the first half.....but turn over the ball too much....good defense by Amherst.  Amherst shot faound 65% plus from outside....while Hamilton finally hit two in the 2nd half from outside..they tried.  oops..Dauostian....you maybe more accurate as the outside shot is your shot, I believe :)

FYI, Bowdoin beat Williams by 25 at home...payback to a 5 point loss in Willytown in January.  Seemed that it was not even close for most of the game.  Announcers mentioned that in Chandler, the Ephs got a huge lead over the PBears in the first half only to survive a comeback run by the PBears in the 2nd half.   

Tufts win big over the Cardinals, but it was very close between Conn and Trinity....maybe in OT.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on February 22, 2014, 04:35:54 PM
Will be interesting to see if this knocks Williams out of NCAA contention. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 22, 2014, 06:37:40 PM
Trinity wins  a battle over Connecticut.  Got to look to see who will Amherst meet next.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 22, 2014, 09:24:15 PM
Trinity-Conn College game, not surprisingly, was best game of the day.  Caught most of the game on line, and it was close the whole game. Both teams played very well.  Trinity hit a couple more threes than Conn, and that was the difference.
Bowdoin totally dominated Williams.  The game was 25-5 at one point.  Never a contest.
I would not be surprised by anything next weekend.  The expectation would be that Amherst and Tufts should win, but I would be concerned that Amherst's offense is very focused on 3s--and as one of the posters mentioned, I don't believe you can win against good competition relying on 3s.  Amherst shot great today, but 3-pointer shooting is definitely streaky, and it looks like today was one of those days when everything goes in, and once a few people start making the shots, it gets contagious.
Bowdoin played Amherst tough earlier, and they have some good offensive balance. 
Trinity could make it a tough game for Tufts.  Tufts had a bad slump at the end of the season, and if they are not hitting their shots, Trinity will give them a battle.
Should be a very interesting day next Saturday-hope to get to Tufts
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on February 23, 2014, 01:43:11 AM
Maine1, I'm thrilled that Bowdoin has had a fantastic bounce-back season. It just isn't the NESCAC without the Polar Bears being among the elite. Shibles has worked hard, and done a super job. Brady has had a superb year. Looks like a great kid to build a team around. And I love a "fireplug" like Prue - what she lacks in athleticism, she makes up for with sheer spunk, determination and savvy. I've seen your team 6-8 times this year. It's funny. To me, your team looks its best on O, by a mile, when "The Binkster" (as your announcer calls her - I love it!) is on fire from deep. Same for Tufts, with Foley/ Moynihan. Same for Amherst. Another reason the Jeffs take so many is that all 4 primary frosh are "shooters." Moral of the story? ALL teams look 10 times better on O when the 3s fall.

I know Amherst is next for Bowdoin. And Maine1, you're looking for a path to a Bowdoin victory. Like any loyal PB fan would. That's half the fun. I get it. But is this "Amherst lives and dies by the 3" criticism legit? Believe me, I want to agree with you - my favorite team is Tufts. But it's total BS. When has it actually hurt Amherst this season? Never. 3 weeks ago at Morrell, the Jeffs shot an "arctic" 3-for-23 from 3, right? Must mean big Amherst trouble, by this shaky new theory. Well, who won that game? "Ice cold bombing" Amherst did. By 8. On the road. How did it possibly happen? They were frigid from bonus range. Easy. Because the Jeffs shot 19-36 from 2-pt range. Gromacki went to "Plan B." He needed Giddens & Holness to score that day. And they both produced. They teamed up for 26 points and 19 rebounds, in just 49 total minutes. Further, both Doswells and Renner added double figures. 5 Jeffs did, in total. Not with made 3's, but with plenty of dribble drives and short pull-up jumpers. The frosh get no credit for these skills. These Amherst FYs are simply not one-dimensional bombers. No matter how badly us Tufts and Bowdoin fans want them to be. Yes, the Jeffs were hot Sat, and hit 15 3's vs Hamilton. Meanwhile, Giddins/Holness took a total of 6 shots. Combined. Why? Did Hamilton shut those two down? Heck no. GP had them basically work on their cardio, not shoot, and rest up for the weekend. He's done that many times this year. The result? Amherst season stats that hide their true balance. Skilled on O, from both 2 and 3 pt range. On D, 3 of their FYs guards are at least 5'10". Long, quick, nimble and usually a major matchup problem for their man, no matter the opponent.

I encourage anyone to make their best case for a Bowdoin semifinal win. All I ask is that you give me something that I can actually get behind. To sink my teeth into. But not what's been put forth so far. It's already been proven totally incorrect. Find some true fault with Amherst, and trust me, I'll be in 100% lockstep!!

Changing gears, since we have a few days until the semis, I have a question for anyone familiar with ME D3 WBB. I'm noticing that Biddeford's UNE, from the CCC, is emerging as a very solid club, in recent years. Even showing up in the USA Today Top 25 poll. (And yes, I do know that the UNE coach is one of the 8 poll voters. But still....) They have one key JR, a 6'3" FY post who's a bit raw, but has nice upside, and a core lineup of several quality sophs. I think it's great to see. I realize that Southern Maine will always be there, and get their share of talent. But are Bates and Colby starting to lose kids to the Nor'Easters? Or, if not to them, where? It's just so weird for me to see those two at/near the bottom of the NESCAC. I know Murphy's been at Bates forever, and I know that Colby really cares about WBB. Is there any sense of Veilleux yet, 3 years in? Is she on the right track? Normally by then, admins, players and fans start to get a decent feel for a new coaches' recruiting skills, game management and overall ability to build/sustain a winning program. I have no clue. And no other purpose in asking, other than a "state of the programs" curiosity. Of the two, I guess I'm a bit more surprised about Bates, given their coaching stability and past successes. Any thoughts would be much appreciated. Thanks!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 23, 2014, 07:31:02 AM
Just to note, I am not a Bowdoin fan--I am just pointing out that depending on the 3 is risky, and in fact the regular season Bowdoin/Amherst game is a perfect case in point.  I think if Amherst had worked for some better shots on a day when they were ice-cold from 3, they would have had an easier win.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on February 23, 2014, 08:46:59 AM
Obviously a horrible performance by Williams at the worst possible time, seemed like everything that could go wrong, did, for Williams.  I watched a few minutes of the first half and it was obvious it was going to be a long night -- Bowdoin looked like they had a ton of energy and were playing with a lot of passion and precision, and Williams was unbelievably flat and sloppy, and once things started going wrong, it just began to snowball and the team never recovered, missing bunnies, free throws, everything.  Williams is obviously not playing to the level it is capable of right now, even if, as I noted before, they probably overachieved with a very young team which is thin on dangerous scoring threats -- they always were a bit too reliant on shutting other teams down (which until recently they were doing a great job of), since they only have a few players who are capable of creating shots for themselves and teammates. 

I still hope (and believe) that Williams will be in the NCAA tourney, barring a huge number of upsets in conference tournaments.  They were ranked third in New England prior to this week.  They obviously drop below Bowdoin, but Wheaton, who was sixth, lost two in a row to not very good teams, so they will stay behind Williams.  UNE (fifth) may move above them, but Roger Williams, who was seventh, also lost, so Williams at worst is fifth.  I can't believe that the NCAA would take fewer than four Pool C teams from New England, which is one of the strongest regions, leaving three for NESCAC squads and one for UNE if they lose in their conference tourney. If UNE wins its conference tourney (which they are favored to do), and assuming Tufts, Amherst or Bowdoin wins the NESCAC tourney (probably a safe assumption), then Williams would be in an even stronger position, nearly a lock I would think.  Despite its recent struggles, Williams still has a 20-win resume in one of the best D3 conferences, including some really strong wins, including Amherst, Bowdoin, Castleton, Eastern Conn, and Plattsburgh, all regionally ranked teams.  Those five wins vs. regionally ranked teams will end up being huge in the selection process, I doubt many Pool C candidates will have more, or better-quality wins than Amherst/Bowdoin.

Williams has two weeks of practice to try to get back on track.  Tufts and Bowdoin gave them lessons the last few weeks in the need to kick the energy level up an extra notch from the very start of a big game.  If the Ephs can get a game, or better yet a few games, of NCAA experience it would really benefit them for next season, when they should have a deeper and much more experienced team, and hopefully add at least one more scorer. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on February 23, 2014, 09:04:25 AM
I agree Williams will probably get in based on the most recent regional rankings and the favorable look they've received in national rankings for most of the year.  However, NESCAC seems a little down this year from its lofty recent history, Massey has it as the 8th best conference this year based on power ratings, while it was 2nd to 6th in recent years.  Hasn't been as low as 8th for at least 5 years.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on February 23, 2014, 09:21:09 AM
I am always skeptical of Massey's D3 rankings (he often underrates NESCAC men's basketball teams relative to their subsequent post-season performance) largely because there are so few games played in D3 between power teams from different regions, making any computer-based ranking system far less useful.  It's hard to see why NESCAC should be down, particularly in light of the fact that the top four NESCAC teams have a grand total of one combined loss to non-NESCAC teams.  Massey may not see it that way, but I am confident that the NCAA's views of NESCAC's strength has not changed, nor is there any basis for it to have changed. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on February 23, 2014, 09:38:17 AM
I guess we'll find out more come tournament time.  Of course if one dismisses the methodology when a conference/team are ranked lower, then it must also be discounted when the conference/team are ranked higher.  I actually thought it matched up pretty well with results in recent years.  BTW, Massey gave Bowdoin a 61% win probability vs. the Ephs.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 23, 2014, 10:36:35 AM
d3wbbfan...thought to provide several comments on Amherst that you can store in your "mind palace" of WBB.   Picked up that term from the latest Sherlock Holmes series on PBS....dealing with Holmes' storied knowledge in his head.
Anyway, in yesterday's game, even the student announcers notice the changes of personnel by Coach G...commenting on the different combos that were being tried out.  One had the FY Boyette in with Marley Giddins....do not know what you would name that lineup....like your "Miracles" label.
Yes, the team took and made a bunch of threes....a record number as it turns out.  Guess what, a number were made by Pritchard  and other guards...I did mention that the PGs at Amherst need to have that skill....no....oh well...in any case the green light was given to the shooters, and they took them.  Reason?  Game was under control since the defense was still "turned on".

Ms Renner even took and made a 3 pointer.  She comes from a family of fine bb players...her sister was a Div 1 player that transferred into Amherst and played on Amherst's title team as a starter.  I spoke with her father about what sport was the younger Renner.s favorite....she played 4 sports....including hockey goalie in HS.  Basketball of course...still some experiences in other sport transfers.  As a hockey goalie, you have to make quick  decisions and good ones.  I think that is one of the reasons she has been picked as the starting pg.  Renner often wore a knee brace early in the season.  Not so much lately...maybe she is quicker now.

On the subject  of recruits....Ronk, a poster alerted me to a recruit in my area that is coming to Amherst.  A raw player from a fine HS team that plays noticeable minutes.  Her best "talent"...she is at least 6'2-3" tall. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on February 23, 2014, 03:50:56 PM
Amh63, thanks for the "mind palace" compliment. For better or worse, retaining tons of basically useless information seems to run in my family!

I think any D3 fan appreciates recruiting updates. I realize the process is far murkier in D3 (deposits are made, instead of scholly offers signed.) But until updated rosters appear each October, new player info always seems like it's locked up inside "Area 51!"

Wanna briefly talk about my Tufts team. Very pleased with the Sat effort. You could tell the Jumbos hadn't forgotten the upset QF home loss to then-#8 seed Bowdoin a year ago.

I was practically doing cartwheels that Coach Berube went with just seven bodies, until late in the second half. To me, the closer the number of total minutes played by Foley/Kanner/Moynihan/North/Morehead is to 40 each (and Morehead already plays 40 in every big game), and 200 total, the better I like Tufts' chances vs. Amherst, who I also see advancing to the finals.

Sure, if a kid needs a quick blow, put in Rocchi or McClure. They're seniors, can play D, and know Berube's system to a T. My only point is that there is a perceptible dropoff in their basketball skill level, vs the other five. (Same deal for Roberson, whose Sat DNP was likely injury-related, not a coaches' decision.)

My eyes tell me that Rocchi is the 6th best Jumbo. (McClure #7, Roberson #8). My eyes tell me that Zwecker is the 8th best Lord Jeff. My eyes also tell me that Zwecker is a far better player than Rocchi is. (Again, nothing personal. I admire all NESCAC WBB players a great deal. I'm 100% talking each one's individual basketball skills.) Which means GP has two more pieces of quality depth than Carla does. Not depth. QUALITY depth. There's a huge difference. All that needs to be done in Medford is to accept this 13-14 reality. And adjust to it accordingly. It can be overcome. I do see Tufts acknowledging/adjusting to this reality as the Jumbos' #1 stumbling block, in reaching their FF goal.

For years, a dear friend of mine, who won an NCAA nat'l championship in hoops, kept a "plus-minus" on players. Like they do in the NHL. A running count, over a season, of who was on the ice when goals were scored. And when goals were given up. It's surely not a flawless indicator of each player's overall ability. But both he and I found that applying these same +/- parameters to basketball was insightful. Ever hear a coach say, "__________ does things for our team that don't show up in the box score." Well, if it's not points, rebounds, assists or steals, how big a deal is it, really? We found that most coaches actually use that phrase to give their "favorite players" (which most coaches do have, admit it or no) undeserved PT. No +/- "spike" was observed for most of them. But we did see some rare instances where these-type players did have a surprisingly positive +/- number. And thought this was finally a way to help either quantify or debunk the coach-speak.

This year, I can't tell you how many times I've seen Tufts players, who are not among their best five, mis-handle a perfect pass. That would've been an automatic two points. Or travel with the basketball, with no one between them and the basket. Or miss repeated, wide open layups. Or on D, get blown by their man like they were standing still. Yes. I recognize that all players make mistakes like this. But the Tufts players I rank #6 and below, despite giving 1000% of their best effort every single second, make these mistakes *much* more frequently than their best five do. In every single game they play. They're just not as good of a basketball player. This results in empty trips and turnovers. Without me even seeing the printout, I know that the Tufts +/- takes a major hit, with players #6 and below. It jumps out at me. Against 75% of their opponents, Tufts still wins, playing 8 to 10 kids. They can easily absorb the +/- hit that their bench players will generate. But the Jumbos simply don't have this luxury against the elite teams. And these opponents are the ones that now stand between Tufts and their own FF dream.

To this end, I'm hoping Coach Berube will pencil in (assuming Morehead's usual 40), 35 mins of planned PT each, for Foley, Kanner, North and Moynihan. (FYI, I have seen nothing all year that indicates to me that these 4 players can't maintain a very high level of play, with added minutes. They are young, and all in fantastic shape.) Spread the other 20 total minutes among Rocchi and McClure (and Roberson, if healthy. If not, then just the two.) Of course, early foul trouble often happens. If it does, fine. Then go ahead and give Ali R. and Caitlin more time. But *only* then. If she makes this further rotational change, over the course of 40 minutes, in total, I'd anticipate seeing a drop of about 5 less, costly mistakes made by Tufts players. How many postseason games come down to just a handful of good/bad possessions? A deep bench turnover made with 1:00 to go in the 1st half, that means 2 less total points, counts just as much in the final score as one happening with 1:00 to go in the game. A coach has only 200 minutes of total PT to dispense. Against the elite teams, and for coaches serious about advancing in post-season, I always suggest allocating each one of them to their very best players. 

I do think that Tufts' 7-player Saturday rotation was another huge step in the right direction, as to increasing their chances for a long postseason run. And while I'm happy for myself about this, I've 100 times happier for the Jumbos' classy coach and classy players! Gonna be some great NESCAC hoops coming up in Cousens. Can't wait! Thanks as always, for reading.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 28, 2014, 12:46:19 PM
FYI ....the Amherst SID has posted a preview of the games on the Amherst website.  Enjoy!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 01, 2014, 04:34:24 PM
Anyone else having trouble with NESN for Bowdoin -Amherst game?  Worked fine for Tufts game, now not working.
Title: Jeffs Win
Post by: Hoopsinfo on March 01, 2014, 05:52:48 PM
Amherst rides Giddins to the win.  Jeffs write-up before the game seems to not acknowledge Giddins' key role but as we've seen repeatedly this year, the Jeffs went to her in key stretches of the second half. Congrats to the Jeffs. Like the strong presence of Savannah and Giddins on the inside.  They would be wise to ride the same strategy for a win against Tufts tomorrow.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Hoopsinfo on March 01, 2014, 05:54:51 PM
Amherst rides Giddins to the win.  Jeffs write-up before the game seems to not acknowledge Giddins' key role but as we've seen repeatedly this year, the Jeffs went to her in key stretches of the second half. Congrats to the Jeffs. Like the strong presence of Savannah and Giddins on the inside.  They would be wise to ride the same strategy for a win against Tufts tomorrow.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 01, 2014, 06:16:34 PM
A typical Amherst game.  It is really all about defense for Amherst. They weren't very good on offense today, but they suffocated Bowdoin on defense.  Coach G's defense (for years now) simply will not allow the other team to stand and get open looks at the basket.  When Bowdoin did get an open look, they rushed the shot and missed. Bowdoin had plenty of chances to take a much bigger lead in this game and did not capitalize.
There is not a great team in the NESCAC this year.  I expect that tomorrow's game will be another defensive struggle.  If someone gets a hot hand, it could make the difference.  I think it is an even game.
Bowdoin, Amherst and Tufts should all get into the NCAA tournament.  Williams may still sneak in given its ranking last wek
I also could not get into the game in the first half, but had not trouble for the second half.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 02, 2014, 10:15:08 AM
Several upsets in league tournaments this weekend--may have an impact on the non-conference winners that get into the tournament
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 02, 2014, 01:36:47 PM
I was only able to watch the 2nd half of the Tufts/Amherst game.  Just a couple of quick observations.  Tufts was clearly the better team.  They killed Amherst on the boards, and while I understand the theory that you dance with the one that brought you to the dance, Gromacki's man to man defense was not getting it done.  IMO, an adjustment should have been made.  Also, it puzzles me why Haley Zwecker has ridden the bench so much this year.

Anyway...on to the NCAA's.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 02, 2014, 02:00:22 PM
I missed today's game, but looks like Tufts dominated inside.  Congratulations to Tufts--they were the best team over the course of the season.  I wonder if they can host an NCAA first round.  Their gym is very small, so I am not sure it would be able to hold the required number of people.
I also think the year-end NESCAC awards will be interesting.  There does not seem to be a clear cut player of the year.  I believe one that stands out is Brickley for Trinity, but usually  the league likes to give awards to players from the winning teams.  Tufts has a number of capable players, but I don't think anyone really stands out as a player of the year. 
Will be interested to see what happens tomorrow with the NCAA bids.  Expect to see four teams, including Williams, in the tournament, although I don't think Williams belongs there.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: LORENZO123 on March 02, 2014, 02:54:38 PM
Tufts hosted St. Lawrence, New Paltz State and Babson for the first round last year. It was a little cramped but the fans get to see the game up close and personal.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: joe8579 on March 02, 2014, 05:34:45 PM
Got to see Tufts for the first time in person today. Overall, a dominating performance against a very good (if thin) Amherst team. Amherst over the past few weeks reminds me quite a bit of Tufts from two or three years ago: they play great defense but can't score. A total of what, ~90 points over two games this weekend? They just don't have the weapons they did in the past, event as recently as last year.

The difference between Tufts two years ago and today is that they can now score multiple ways from multiple people. They still play superior defense but now you have to put up 60+ points to beat them, which is far from easy. How many opponents have scored that many this year?

Tufts hosted the first two rounds of the NCAA tourney both last year and the year before. This year, they will host for as long as they keep playing (up to the final four), since they're unquestionably the #1 seed in the Northeast and surrounding regions.

I don't have numbers to back it up, but Tufts' gym is very comparable in size to Amherst and Williams', when you count the seating on both ends. Maybe a little smaller, but certainly not smaller enough to affect the committee's decision there. It's not like there are thousands of people queuing up to get into these games, despite how compelling they are.

I am also confused as to why Zwecker didn't play more. She got to the rim well, made her free throws, and was probably Amherst's most dangerous offensive player. Barring some kind of injury/discipline problems, she should have played more minutes.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescachoopsfan2 on March 02, 2014, 06:33:39 PM
Tufts made renovations to Cousens Gym ahead of the 2009-10 school year that rotated the basketball court and made it a regulation-sized facility. Since that time, they have been eligible to host NCAA Tournament games. Prior to that, they weren't allowed to do so. The Tufts women qualified for the tournament in 2010 but were shipped out of region to Kean for the first and second rounds. They were left out of the tournament in 2011, then qualified and hosted first- and second-round games in 2012 and 2013.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 02, 2014, 07:22:26 PM
The Tufts women were clearly the better team today and the best NESCAC team throughout the season. Several elements that set them apart were evident on the court and revealed in the statistics .
First, their D. Amherst and Trinity struggled consistently to find good shots. Confirmed by these games and Tufts scoring defense ranking nationally this season and last.
Second, their protection of the basketball possessions: 6 turnovers today, 7 against Trinity. They got 19 more shots than Trinity, 17 more than Amherst. Hard to win against that stat, especially when they are pounding the ball inside. It is a luxury to be able to miss some bunnies when you keep getting them on every possession. Gave up 1 steal to Trinity, 3 to Amherst. Impressive.
Third, that power game. Kanner, North, and Rocchi give them a huge presence, and they know how to use it. Touch entry passes, plays that isolate the defense, and aggressive team rebounding (Foley is so quick to the ball) are keys. Against Trinity, Tufts had a nearly 3 minute possession and today a two minute possession, both at pivotal times.
Good luck to the Jumbos, Lord Jeffs, and Polar Bears, and should they make it, the Ephs. Jeffs and Jumbos should host.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: joe8579 on March 03, 2014, 09:26:52 AM
Great point on the number of shots difference between the two teams yesterday. It did seem to me that most of Amhersts possessions took a long time and yet did not result in a good shot. It's hard to score if you can't get quality looks, no matter how good a shooter you are. Also, none of the current Amherst players are great shooters yet - just look at their season 3pt percentages.

It'll be interesting to see how the brackets shape up later today.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Hoopsinfo on March 03, 2014, 12:26:13 PM
Observation - Amherst relies too much on the 3 point shot.  The mid-range jump shots were open yesterday but for some reason the players are reticent to take that shot.  Tufts was doing a good job defending the 3 and the mid-range jumpers would have opened up Tufts' defense.  I would say GP did not make the necessary adjustments during the game.  As for shooting percentages - Giddins has shot 56.4% from the floor (one of the best in the league) while leading the team in scoring and Zwecker shot 48% from the 3-point arc.  Why does GP have his best shooters coming off the bench as well as his leading rebounder (Giddins) after having lost his center?   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 03, 2014, 01:31:40 PM
I said this last year, and I'll say it again now.  Haley Zwecker can flat out play.  Why she has been relegated to coming off the bench is beyond me.  She is an excellent ball handler...She and Cheyenne Pritchard are the only guards on the team with fewer turnovers than assists.  Plus, she has the most assists on the team...while only playing 16 minutes per game.  As was already mentioned, she is their leading 3 point shooter.  And I don't believe her lack of time is due to any disciplinary reason.  I just don't get it.

Of course, I am not the college coach with the highest winning percentage in history, so...what do I know?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 03, 2014, 01:40:43 PM
I agree with both of you on Zwecker. Her Assist/TO ratio is much better as is her FG %. She had more assists than Renner in half the minutes. She attacked the basket effectively. Hard to figure. Stubborn? Coach G started pulling the point guards off the floor at silly intervals to critique them.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 03, 2014, 03:02:36 PM
Four NESCAC teams make the tournament.  Tufts, Amherst, Bowdoin and Williams.  The first three are all in the same bracket with Tufts and Bowdoin hosting.  Amherts goes to Hartwick to play Springfield College, and Williams travels to Scranton to play Vassar.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MVP on March 05, 2014, 01:08:51 PM
"Tufts made renovations to Cousens Gym ahead of the 2009-10 school year that rotated the basketball court and made it a regulation-sized facility. Since that time, they have been eligible to host NCAA Tournament games. Prior to that, they weren't allowed to do so. The Tufts women qualified for the tournament in 2010 but were shipped out of region to Kean for the first and second rounds. They were left out of the tournament in 2011, then qualified and hosted first- and second-round games in 2012 and 2013"

          Tufts gym is a tough place to play a game and a terrible place to watch a game. It may still not be regulation size. The lighting is awful and the acoustics are lousy. As you enter the gymnasium you must go down stairs ...then up some stairs ....then up and around and on and on. The visiting team's locker=room is up in the clouds somewhere... it takes them 10 minutes just to navigate the 71 steep steps to the locker-room.  Fans are constantly walking across the court to find seats and stopped by lunk-heads w/ attitudes who think they're security at a Giants game or something.  Get there early for a good seat w/out a hassle and bring your own popcorn.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescachoopsfan2 on March 05, 2014, 08:40:20 PM
Quote from: MVP on March 05, 2014, 01:08:51 PM
Tufts gym is a tough place to play a game and a terrible place to watch a game. It may still not be regulation size. The lighting is awful and the acoustics are lousy. As you enter the gymnasium you must go down stairs ...then up some stairs ....then up and around and on and on. The visiting team's locker=room is up in the clouds somewhere... it takes them 10 minutes just to navigate the 71 steep steps to the locker-room.  Fans are constantly walking across the court to find seats and stopped by lunk-heads w/ attitudes who think they're security at a Giants game or something.  Get there early for a good seat w/out a hassle and bring your own popcorn.

My response is based on having gone to several dozens of games at Cousens over the last 10 years:

1.) The renovated Cousens IS regulation-sized because if it wasn't, Tufts wouldn't be allowed to host NCAA games.
2.) It really isn't that difficult to navigate the seating if you enter through the front entrance of Cousens, which is always open on game days and is easily accessible, as it's located literally across the street from the parking lot. In fact, you don't even need to navigate stairs at all if you don't want to, as there is seating (and has always been seating) located behind the baskets on the same level as the entrance. And if you want to sit in the bleachers, you have to go down 1 flight of stairs.
3.) Fans are absolutely under no circumstances "constantly walking across the court" to find seats. Like other NESCAC gyms that I've been to, you're allowed to walk along the sidelines opposite the team benches to get to a seat, as long as you're not disrupting play. You're also allowed to walk behind the team benches. Never once have I see fans "walking across the court" to get to a seat.
4.) It really isn't that hard to find a good seat at Cousens - certainly not more so than any other Division III sporting event I've been to. In my opinion, there are no shortage of great places to sit at Cousens to watch the game: the aforementioned seats behind the baskets, the balconies, and the bleacher seating that was installed as part of the renovations all offer great views, and it's not like there is so much competition for those seats that you need to "get there early for a good seat w/o a hassle."
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on March 06, 2014, 04:39:14 AM
Warning ! Another long post coming - at least I waited until mid-week, while we're bored, waiting for the NCAA's to start!    :)

Congrats to Coach Berube and the Jumbos, on their first NESCAC title. I very much enjoy reading all the various NESCAC posts. Thanks! I thought some very lucid observations were made. And as someone who respects Coach Gromacki a ton (as previous posts indicate), I humbly offer my take on the final.

I've seen 80%+ of the Tufts games this season. Amherst games are often played simultaneously. But with both teams often holding solid leads early, by halftime, I'd choose the better contest that day, for half #2. As such, I know both team's personalities very, very well.

Offensively, Tufts' approach Saturday was not the one they employed all season. If Foley and/or Moynihan were cold from 3, or either was in foul trouble, scoring became a big problem. Period. To me, their game plan on O in the final was totally different than it had been all season. Sat, it was to have Kanner and North both pound the paint, and have Morehead initially look to drive coast-to-coast, until the Amherst D stopped her. Make Amherst defend Tufts from 10 feet and in. As many times as possible. And if this tactic got the LJ's in foul trouble? Even better. And if it resulted in good point production, any 3's the Jumbos then hit would just be gravy. It worked to *perfection*. And it was quite clear that Coach Gromacki didn't see that specific game plan coming from Berube.

The Jumbos have two accomplished, 6'2" frontcourt players. The only big Amherst had at that skill level (Robertson) is out for the year. Huge mismatch. To Coach Berube's credit, she exploited it, early and often. If a team can't stop a play, then just keep running it until they do. And Amherst never could stop them.

Of the Lord Jeff frosh, Ali Doswell has been the most consistent on O all year. But she picked up 3 first-half fouls, and never got back on track. Also, I firmly believe Gromacki prefers to have Holness come off the bench for him. But he was forced to start Savannah Saturday, to try to contain Kanner. And it only got worse for GP, when Carla stopped doing GP a huge favor, and finally played North big minutes. She's deserved them all year. I know all coaches love their hard-working seniors, and badly want to reward them with max PT. But emotions can creep in at times, as to minutes given. We're all only human. It's something I genuinely love about WCBB. I truly am a "journey" guy. But it's 100% a double-edged sword. And Berube has long been guilty of "heartstring PT", especially among top coaches. (Goodness, she just LOVES tri-captains Ali Rocchi, Caitlin McClure, and Moynihan.) I've heard her talk about them SO fondly. Several different times. Her eyes well up. But trust me, Carla-win them a natty as SRs, and they won't even REMEMBER the first 2 getting reduced postseason PT!) It's winning time. And they want to win. A lot. And their first NESCAC title just gave her beloved tri-captains a delicious, first taste of March postseason glory. Guess what? It's their last year, and they want to have even more to celebrate soon!

Thankfully, Carla has finally made good progress, as to playing her best players the most minutes. And with less regard to what year they're in. North played a season-high 25 minutes Sat. With at least 18 of them in tandem with Kanner, I'd say. And it was key. The two were pure magic together. They can both score down low. Which one does GP then have Holness guard? Big problem. But it didn't matter. They both scored in double figures. Turned out Holness couldn't stop either of them, and picked up 3 first-half fouls, to boot. With the LJ's now also having North to contend with in the paint, Kanner scored 21, and just had *so* much more room to operate down low. She thrived.   

I saw Morehead (who they list at 5"2"-my eyes say 4'11") actually cash in twice, on those aforementioned coast-to-coast layups. (Which should NEVER happen, against any college team, playing even average team D.) Holness is the last line of defense, once Kelsey had shed the LJ guard (who also has to do much better there), in that scenario. But Savannah was already very pre-occupied with the two Tufts bigs, having their way with her. She had a very poor game. To be fair, it was an awful lot to ask of Holness. Obviously, she badly wanted to be there for her team, and not foul out. She knows she's their only "big." But once she got the 3 fouls, her solution was to play "matador defense". There's just no other way to say it. In the second half, Holness left the "barn door" (post area) open repeatedly, for any Jumbo who wanted in. After the third or fourth easy 2nd half Jumbo hoop, GP pulled Savannah, and must've said something like, "I understand you have 3 fouls, Savannah. And we do need you in there badly. But if you play no D at all, and just let them score at will, it's as if you've fouled out already. Don't be careless, but you must keep playing good D. And if you do foul out, well, you foul out!" To me, Savannah looked like she had never been in that situation before. She was totally overmatched. But she's a good player, and I know she will bounce back.     

As for North's line, she would've already had numerous double-doubles this season. But she'd just never gotten enough minutes to reach them before. Well, Michela finally got one Saturday. 10 pts, and 14 rebounds. Tufts' NCAA opponents should expect to see this new game plan on O. Because it worked very well. Against a very good team. I don't know many DIII teams who are gonna be able to match up against two skilled 6"2" posts, playing together. (And they're both back next year!)

This was one other big, unexpected problem that Amherst had, with Kanner/North's major joint minutes. Scoring 2-pt FGs. And while dribble-drives haven't been a huge part of the LJ's 13-14 point production, the "Twin Towers" cut it to basically zero, until Zwecker's late entry. They totally shut Renner's slashes down. That is her #1 strength on O, aside from her normally-skillful PG play. And while Marley Giddens is as crafty and nimble as they come scoring down low, at only about 5'9", Kanner/North limited her to just 4-11 in FGs, with 7 more pts added at the FT line. Marley really had to work hard for her 15. And while Giddens is an effective, undersized 4 on O, expecting her to be able to stop a Jumbo post player on D is 100% unrealistic. But GP knows that already, and was a big part of the reason why he had to start Holness. I've never seen Marley play a single bad game for Amherst. And she was great again on Saturday. Even while navigating against the two Jumbo "redwoods".

I'm on record as saying that I feel Zwecker is Amherst's 8th best player. I don't mean that as a slight to Haley. Not in the least. Several posters said that she played great vs. Tufts. All of them are a million % correct. And have questioned Gromacki's choice to not play her more, and/or put her in earlier. Again, a very valid point. I both respect and understand the criticism. But I think it's mainly a "system clash" issue at play. Here's my take, with some "background" first:

As many have said, the LJs are dangerously 3-pt dependent, for points. It is true. All three of their best FY shooters are big guards: 5"10"/5'11". They are all "stationary" shooters, who depend heavily on offensive structure for their open 3-pt looks. Screens/skip passes/ball reversals get these ladies those open shots. Pritchard/Renner are the two best PG choices, to run GP's preferred offense. Those two are pass-first players, who see the floor, don't over-dribble, and who normally only look to shoot it if their man slacks off on D, and gives them a great look. Vs. Tufts, with the interior points shut down, it became even more important for Gromacki to get his long-range bombers open looks. To put quick points up. Several made 3-ptrs can catch a team up in a hurry. Someone said Gromacki pulled Renner, and then had a fairly intense discussion with her. I remember seeing that, too. And, weird as it sounds, that's often the best time for a talk like that. Because the difficult game situation is still very fresh in her mind. Jaimie likely hadn't been that frustrated before, all season. Where Tufts had basically rolled "police tape" around a 12-foot perimeter of the LJ hoop. No one was open. There was no one for Renner to pass to. There was no room for her to slash. And the 3-pt arc always seemed full of Jumbos, as well. That scenario would be near-impossible for any PG - much less a FY PG. Renner will handle it better the next time. Far more is learned after a loss.

Haley Zwecker's game is totally unique, among LJ players. She can create shots for herself, from the guard position. She's most comfortable when the basketball is in her hands. She loves to dribble, likes to match up, one-on-one, against her defender, and try to score. And she's very good at it. To me, the only other LJ with this beat-your-man ability is Giddens. But Marley's game on O is 99% from 10-feet and in. Which fits in far better with GP's 13-14 system, since he plays her exclusively up front. But Zwecker's a guard. And, through no fault of her own, her natural playing style is basically incompatible with the 4 FY's that play a lot. Haley's not a pass-first player. I'm not saying she's a selfish player. She not. At ALL! And during the next two seasons, when the LJ FY's become veterans, with experience, the FY's will be able to "co-exist" much better with Haley's game. For now, it's a matter of GP being so dependent, on multiple freshmen. Do you know how hard this situation is? For both the Amherst players and the coaches? Extremely hard.   

As a result, GP has had to "cater" his offense to the FY's. He had absolutely no choice. He's started four of them this year, on numerous occasions. And it's worked amazingly well. Somehow, their record is 24-3. In arguably the toughest DIII league in the country. To me, that is an AMAZING accomplishment. But back to Sat. By the time GP opted to put Zwecker in, it was sort of a last resort. GP hadn't given up on the game yet, but he knew that the FY's chances to now hit a number of late 3's basically dropped to zero, by subbing Haley in. Because he was putting Zwecker in to have her "do what she does". Beat her man, and provide a team lift. She's emotional, in a good way, competitive, and has great energy. She wasn't put in to be a pass first PG, and try get the FY's open looks at 3. Zwecker was "Plan B". To Haley's credit, she did exactly what GP wanted her to do. My kudos to her. But it then meant that all the FYs would each just find a corner to stand in, try to pull their man as far away from Zwecker as possible, so Tufts couldn't double-team Zwecker when she hopefully beat her man one on one. During her minutes, she was Amherst's #1 and #2 option on O.

Finally, I learned one basketball lesson a long time ago. It has served me very well. I always give a team - ANY team - ONE bad game a season. Just throw it out. Do a re-boot. I was actually expecting to see a game like this from Amherst well before the NESCAC games started. But they never had one. Until Saturday. Gromacki's team finally looked like who they actually are - a bunch of freshmen. It took them until their 27th game to show it. Incredible. And it took a veteran, highly skilled opponent, while playing on the road, to reveal it. The FYs finally looked like they got thrown into the deep end of the pool. Let's be realistic. Despite Gromacki's obvious skill, weren't many of us thinking that *this* was gonna be the year to finally be able to knock Amherst down a few pegs? Come on. It's true, right?   :)   Well, this bunch of 18-year-olds sure didn't fall very far down, have they? Even after losing the *one* player they absolutely could not afford to lose!

My sincere congratulations to the Polar Bears, for being selected as a host. It's a great reward for a fantastic, bounce-back season. I know Coach Shibles always has the pressure of high expectations to deal with. And her and her team came through like champions! Good luck to all four NESCAC-ers this weekend!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 06, 2014, 09:34:18 AM
Yes indeed, that was a long post...but a good one.

I will, however, disagree with you about the me first play of Zwecker.  The statistics just don't bear you out, nor does the thought that the first years are the best three point shooters on the team.  Assist to turnover ratio aside (and Zwecker and Pritchard have the only positive ones on the team), Zwecker is also, as mentioned previously, the overall leader in assists while playing significantly fewer minutes than Renner...43% fewer minutes, actually.  Also, she is the leading three point shooter, statistically, by a long shot (pun intended).  She has taken 1 shot for every 5.15 minutes she has played, versus 1 every 4.77 minutes for Renner.  (And I am not picking on Renner, just using her for comparison).  Oh yeah, and she has nearly the same number of total rebounds as Renner, all in the reduced minutes.  While statistics don't play the game, they certainly are very good indicators of how the game is being played...that's why they are kept.

As far as Savannah Holness goes I think it is a bit unfair to single her out for not being able to guard two post players at once, and be the last line of defense for the coast to coast runs of the point guard.  Seriously?  Who wasn't she responsible for covering?  Under Gromacki's system in years past you either played tight defense on your "man", or you sat down.  He does not teach a help style of defense.  In fact you ran the risk of being pulled if you dropped off to help, and left your player alone.  That was just the way it was.  But...he also doesn't make adjustments to his defense when, like on Sunday, the team is getting beat inside.  Berube out coached him.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 06, 2014, 09:42:21 AM
Good posts with interesting points.  Was a bit surprised when Tufts went low and Savannah is in foul trouble that he didn't try Boyette.  Once again a first year, but has height.   As it was said previously, GP values defense.   You don't get the job done on defense, you don't play many minutes.  We can speculate all we want by the coaches see every practice, know the players speed, strengths and weaknesses.  Amherst has an amazing group to build another powerhouse upon, and each of these kids will have to stay on their toes as each year he finds "difference makers."
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: joe8579 on March 06, 2014, 10:32:35 AM
Quote from: MVP on March 05, 2014, 01:08:51 PM
          Tufts gym is a tough place to play a game and a terrible place to watch a game. It may still not be regulation size. The lighting is awful and the acoustics are lousy. As you enter the gymnasium you must go down stairs ...then up some stairs ....then up and around and on and on. The visiting team's locker=room is up in the clouds somewhere... it takes them 10 minutes just to navigate the 71 steep steps to the locker-room.  Fans are constantly walking across the court to find seats and stopped by lunk-heads w/ attitudes who think they're security at a Giants game or something.  Get there early for a good seat w/out a hassle and bring your own popcorn.
As opposed to what, Babson's gym? I can only assume, from your prior posts, that you are connected to the Babson program in some way. Tufts' gym is perfectly adequate as a D3 facility. It has personality and quirks, sure, but what gym doesn't at this level? It's certainly a sight better than most of the NEWMAC venues (thinking mainly of the awful MIT, Wellesley, Coast Guard, and Clark gyms).

As mentioned, the court is regulation size. There is a decent amount (though probably not enough) seating. It's a perfectly fine place to play. So long as you have a full size court, decent lighting, and a bench to sit on, players don't particularly care about different gyms. You're either at home or you're on the road. If you're on the road and the gym meets the basic criteria I mentioned, who cares?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 06, 2014, 11:30:15 AM
I'm not sure I would want to play there as an opposing team because of all the circuitous stairs and whatnot, but from a fan's perspective, Tufts is one of my favorite D3 gyms.  Tons of history and character, and a really cool environment overall, plus comfortable seating with good views of the court. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 06, 2014, 11:33:36 AM
d3wbbfan....thanks for the long report of the game last Sunday.  Needless to say, I was at Amherst watching the games in LeFrak that along with a number of WBB fans that were trying to follow the game at Tufts online.  It was tough since the finals on Sunday was a battle of heavyweights....won by Amherst.  I'm glad you saw a bit of my "favorite" pg from Georgia.  Too bad it was not competative.  We heard that there was trouble in the first game when Amherst Amherst only scored 16 points in the close win over a fine Bowdoin team. 
Also see that there is also talk about gyms, hosting and other matters.  Same on the MBB board.  In the case of Amherst, how the WBB team does impact the hosting of games by the MBB team in accordance to the NCAA rules.

Best wishes for all the conference women teams going forward.....4 fine teams representing their schools first and the NESCAC second.  Will try to check in on the LJs on Friday.  Not sure of the webcasts arrangements for the NCAA games.
Does anyone here know the particulars about them....at Bowdoin and at Tufts for the weekend games?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 06, 2014, 03:25:45 PM
NH NESCAC fan, I find myself agreeing with you again. The stats you and I have cited about Zwecker indicate that she in able to effectively accomplish something that d3wbbfan failed to mention in his/her analysis of the LJ's 3-point based offense. She is able to draw the help defense off the shooters or dish to an abandoned post player for open looks. On Sunday she got all the way to the rim, something I don't recall any other Amherst player doing. Renner never did.
D3wbbfan, do you actually attend the games or are you only able to see the video feeds? Being there allows for much more perspective on what is happening off the ball. Your analysis, apart from your critique of Holness, has tended to focus on offense. To my point, it is clear that North is a very efficient force on O. Her defensive liabilities have limited her court time, not Carla's fondness for seniors. Berube is very competitive and committed to victory in any way, but it all begins with defense. Coach G and Schibles are both outstanding coaches all the way around, but the Tufts defense is the best, hands down. Your one-sided comments reveal your love for offense. That's fine, but please don't presume to tell one of the finest D coaches in the D-III pantheon how to apportion playing time if you aren't willing to balance your perspective with a cogent assessment their defense. As far as Sunday's PT, far from Carla finally seeing the light, North's minutes had a lot to do with Kanner's and Rocchi's foul troubles and with her effectiveness on BOTH ends. If she continues to deserve it, for example rebounding with a vengeance, she will play more. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: joe8579 on March 06, 2014, 11:12:55 PM
Quote from: nescacbbrules on March 06, 2014, 03:25:45 PM
NH NESCAC fan, I find myself agreeing with you again. The stats you and I have cited about Zwecker indicate that she in able to effectively accomplish something that d3wbbfan failed to mention in his/her analysis of the LJ's 3-point based offense. She is able to draw the help defense off the shooters or dish to an abandoned post player for open looks. On Sunday she got all the way to the rim, something I don't recall any other Amherst player doing. Renner never did.
D3wbbfan, do you actually attend the games or are you only able to see the video feeds? Being there allows for much more perspective on what is happening off the ball. Your analysis, apart from your critique of Holness, has tended to focus on offense. To my point, it is clear that North is a very efficient force on O. Her defensive liabilities have limited her court time, not Carla's fondness for seniors. Berube is very competitive and committed to victory in any way, but it all begins with defense. Coach G and Schibles are both outstanding coaches all the way around, but the Tufts defense is the best, hands down. Your one-sided comments reveal your love for offense. That's fine, but please don't presume to tell one of the finest D coaches in the D-III pantheon how to apportion playing time if you aren't willing to balance your perspective with a cogent assessment their defense. As far as Sunday's PT, far from Carla finally seeing the light, North's minutes had a lot to do with Kanner's and Rocchi's foul troubles and with her effectiveness on BOTH ends. If she continues to deserve it, for example rebounding with a vengeance, she will play more.
Well said. Anyone who has seen her play can clearly see that North is not up to the rest of the team's standard on defense. She will get there, but she is getting the PT her defense deserves right now.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on March 07, 2014, 05:24:47 AM
Thanks for the replies, guys.

Although if some of my friends in the coaching biz heard me categorized as "leaning big offense", they would either claim you picked the wrong guy out of the police lineup, or have a heart attack on the spot! Defense has always been my passion. I absolutely love it.

I very much respect the point re: offensive stat line advantages that Zwecker has, vs. Renner. I honestly do love everything about Haley's game. My overall view was based on Coach keeping things as simple as possible for the FYs. But doing so clearly comes with downside. In many games this season, Zwecker did play nearly 20 minutes a game. That did give her plenty of minutes with the FYs. My observation was based on, in the very few toughest LJ matchups, GP had dialed back a lot on Haley's minutes. And I thought I knew why. Maybe I did. Maybe I didn't. Maybe GP was right to do it. Maybe he wasn't. We'll see where Gromacki goes with it from here.

I also feel the criticism aimed at me about Coach Berube's judgement at times, is fair. She obviously knows what she is doing. I also do only watch games on-line. The point made that my perspective being skewed due to that is also very fair, and duly noted. There is also little doubt that North's defense is a clear work in progress. But at the DIII level, Tufts takes almost zero hit for this weakness. Just basic positioning, keeping hands up, and her affecting shots at 6'2" is plenty good enough, in my eyes, to maintain Carla's sparkling overall team defensive stats. The LJs sure weren't taking it to North. But if Michela were playing DI? Totally different story. But she isn't. And that matters a ton. I've watched  '13-14 DIII teams, from coast to coast. And a Kanner/North combo is a matchup that will give any top NCAA team nightmares. This *is* my team, remember. And if that means trading minutes with a SR, who plays total lockdown defense, to play them together, to me it's Basketball 101. Besides the fact it makes Kanner's on-court life so much easier. Great PGs? Great shooters? Great one-on-one/team defenders? All are very common, among top NCAA teams. My training taught me to try to exploit clear mismatches. That's all I'm suggesting. An offensively skilled, physical specimen like North is an extremely rare find in DIII. Berube was very fortunate to have landed her. Especially with two years together with Kanner. North had multiple suitors at the scholarship levels. It's not just her offense. North is an absolute vacuum cleaner on the glass. To further balance out her "D in progress".

I have taken all your observations to heart. I respect your takes/opinions very much. Enjoy the games, my friends!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NH NESCAC Fan on March 07, 2014, 11:23:21 AM
d3wbbfan - To paraphrase from Dustin Hoffman in Rain Man...you're an excellent poster.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 07, 2014, 02:14:58 PM
I agree with those sentiments, I think, not having seen the movie.
I will be in Medford tonight. The Monks have a fine team by the looks of it--size and a fine point guard--but haven't played a schedule even close to Tufts' in difficulty, so it is hard to predict how they will fare. I know their coach, Mike McDevitt, from years ago. He is excellent. But  if what is past is prologue, the GNAC teams, with the exception of Emmanuel, have struggled in the NCAA tournament. Moore and Cahill, their 6-foot forwards, carry the load for St. Joes, but will have to match up with Kanner, Rocchi, and North. Tough ask.
Of course, interested in seeing NYU and UNE. Maybe NYU based upon tougher schedule? But close.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on March 07, 2014, 07:05:51 PM
Williams loses to Vassar in the first round, 76-75, in Scranton. Was neck and neck the whole way.

I saw Vassar host (and defeat) Montclair St in pre-season. Montclair St is basically the only Top 25 team not to stream their games, so I took the opportunity to see them on the road that day. Really liked Vassar, though. They have two terrific seniors, guard Cydni Matsuoka and a skilled, 6'2" post named Hannah Senftleber. Matsuoka had 31, Senftleber 13, and 2 other Brewers in double figures.

Cook had 22, Caveney 15. Ephs went 8-29 from 3. Vassar just 5-11, given their strong post game. Uwanaka was again battling foul trouble and limited minutes (24), ending with 8 pts, 13 boards, and 4 fouls. Thompson also had 10 pts - her most in a while.

I stopped watching Amherst-Springield at 52-32 with 9 mins to go, but the feisty Pride managed to trim it down to 7 (53-46) with 2:13 to go, before it stretched back out to a 62-49 final. Giddens 20. Ali Doswell 16. Saw about half of it, out at Hartwick. To his credit, Gromacki really tinkered with the lineup today. LOTS of Haley Zwecker out there. She scored 7, and was a big reason the LJs  looked more like themselves today. A recent poster also was hoping to see the FY post Boyette play more. She did. I'd say at least 5 minutes in the first half, and more quality PT for Rachel in the second. She scored a hoop, had 3 boards, but got 4 fouls. Still, good game experience for the big girl. I like her hands. Nice potential.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on March 07, 2014, 09:11:19 PM
In a stunner, Castleton just beat Bowdoin, 64-62 - in the NCAA first round - in Brunswick! Derosches 32, Leonard 9, O'Sullivan 7. Brady 20, Phelps 16, Binkhorst 15 for the Polar Bears. Saw none of it - didn't see that coming at all. Maybe there is some substance to the whispers that the NESCAC is down a tad this year. All 4 NCAA teams have sky high SOS #s. But the NCAA is on record as not using one selection criteria I always do. The eye test. Don't see how they could, though. As they say, beauty is in the eyes of the beholder....

Tufts leads the Monks of St. Joseph's (ME), 38-21 at the half, at Cousens. It's now left to just the Jumbos and Lord Jeffs to represent the NESCAC. Not surprised at all with the Ephs' loss. Shocked by Bowdoin goin' down, though......



Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 07, 2014, 09:55:26 PM
I saw Williams going down from a mile away.  I know somebody that plays @ Skidmore, so I keep tabs on the Liberty League and Vassar was for real.  I figured as long as Cyndi Matsouka could get to 25+ points, Vassar would be in pretty good shape.  Bowdoin loss was definitely a surprise.  Castleton isn't a bad team by any means and I think they were ranked in the NE regional rankings at the end of the season, but that's a game you have to win at home.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 08, 2014, 10:07:05 AM
I watched a little of the Bowdoin game and it seemed to be one that the Polar Bears could control.  Left to go follow the Amherst game.  It was nip and tuck for Amherst and I was not happy when it was 19-18, Amherst with the 18....especially when Amherst had an early lead.  Slowly, Amherst got adjusted to the gym and went inside mostly to get points.  It was around 11 at the half.  I thought that if Amherst lost, it will be due to the missed foul shots....both teams  ended up under 60% from the foul line.  Seems everyone for Amherst got to play....except for soph Captain, C. Pritchard. 
Saw her leaving the dining halls on Monday.....since my computer did not get the video feed......could not see if she made the trip.  Strange to see Amherst's captains not on the floor.  Hope it is an academic thing....a course or lab that prevented her to make the trip with the team.  If so, she will join the team for the game today.  It happened with the Baseball team last year.  Several players had to return to class....3 plus hour trip one way...to take exams and then brought back.....driven by an assistant AD.
With regards to the lineup changes....there was a time during the game when the only FY player was Jamie Renner on the floor.  Coach G. put on the floor all the upperclass players he had available.  Those with some experience playing in post season big games.  Renner was taken out for earlier, after starting.  The FY players sat to watch as their outside shots were not going in and their defense was lacking a step.  Feel that young players often get overwhelmed by big games and need to get their "nerves" and focus  back.  Good to see that Boyette got into the game as it seemed for awhile that Amherst was losing the battle of the boards.
Boyette may well be needed again tonight.  Hartwick won in OT yesterday....led by their "Big" sophmore star, Dumas, who had 34 points and 15 rebounds.  The fine player is from Easton CT......my wife's little home town and from the same HS.  My wife was not amused when I pointed it out....since she was in the first graduating class from the h.s. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 08, 2014, 12:16:28 PM
Like all of you, I was more than surprised that Bowdoin lost at home. The Polar Bears set the New England all divisions record for consecutive home wins at 76 from 2001 to 2007, so losing at Morrell Gymnasium in a big tournament game to a small small college team is baffling. Congratulations to Castleton State for their first NCAA win in any sport.
I have been following Vassar for the past several years, so I was not surprised to see them knock of Williams. The Ephs have dropped a notch or two since their Little Three win over Amherst and The Brewers have a legit all-American in Cydni Matsouka. Her stat line is eye-popping: 36 min, 19 pts, 49% FG, 47% 3-pt, 94% from the line, and an assist to turnover ratio of nearly 3-1. Similarly against Williams: 38 min, 11 for 17 fg, 4 for 7 3's, 5 for 5 FTs, and 6 steals. And Manning was stacking her D against Matsouka. I've been to Scranton, however; a very tough place to win. Good luck to Vassar.
Great crowd at Cousens Gym last night. Coach Mike McDevitt summed up the Monks/Tufts game this way.  "We are just not used to this level of play in our league, but we made some adjustments and were actually playing better in the second half. But no doubt the better team won tonight, and I think Tufts could be a Final Four team this year." The Jumbos didn't have the kind of inside game they used against Amherst, but Morehead was on fire, making 5 of 6 attempts from behind the arc. On her only missed 3-pt, she pulled up in transition in the 2nd half and took the quick, completely uncharacteristic shot. Reacting to the self-realization that she usually only shoots 3's in the last 8 seconds of a possession, she smiled broadly. Then nailed another a couple of trips later. Tufts' inside/outside offense made the Monks' defense look average. Rocchi had an outstanding game on offense and playing tenacious D on the two talented bigs for St Joes. Didn't arrive in time to see the UNE-NYU game, but was told it could have gone either way. I expect Tufts' defense to be the story again today, but Coleman, Gribbin, and Brown are talented enough to make it close.
Berube scheduled Hartwick away early in the season, knowing they would be a challenge. Amherst, who really got the shaft from the NCAA not hosting this year with their men's team,  will face a real challenge beating Hartwick on their home floor. I think this may be the best game from the lower left quadrant today.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 08, 2014, 06:19:22 PM
Tufts has their hands full with UNE only up 2 under 7 minutes left to play.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 08, 2014, 06:53:29 PM
Tufts survives UNE 57-54 in overtime.  After the Nor'Easters were hit with a shot clock violation in a tie game, Liz Moynahan won it for the Jumbos with a 3 from the top of the key at the buzzer.  Also, Hannah Foley walked off the court in crutches, that's something to keep an eye on for next weekend.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on March 08, 2014, 07:19:01 PM
UNE played unbelievably well. I never saw a team run so many plays, isolating their guards against a Tufts guard, one v one, liking their chances there, and scoring so many points doing so. Gotta be a real eye-opener for Coach.

Moynihan's game-winning 3 at the OT buzzer was her *only* FG of the game. The most line-drive shot I've ever seen go in. Almost every NCAA top contender needs "lady luck" to smile on them, at some point. Well, the Jumbos surely used their allocation up today. Even just getting to OT. With :37 to go, down 2, and the shot clock at only 1 or 2, Tufts O was in very deep doo-doo. A long heave was coming. But an away-from-the-ball foul was called on UNE. Didn't see it at all. But it gave the Jumbos the ball back, with a fresh :30. Kanner got fouled, and made 2 huge FTs, to tie it up. And then a solid, final defensive Tufts stand. The announcer kept reminding us that would be hosting again next weekend. I kept saying to myself "not if we don't beat the Nor-easters, we don't!" UNE HC Anthony Ewing REALLY knows what he's doing. His team played just about a flawless game. They play stellar defense, rarely foul, and never hack. Keep on eye on them next year, because UNE is the real deal!

The NESCAC 13-14 standard bearer still has a pulse! It took some mouth-to-mouth, though. So true about Foley. They really need her. Her first-half ankle injury clearly stiffened up during halftime.

It was an EXTREMELY well officiated game.

Amherst leads at Hartwick 62-39, midway thru the 2nd half.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 08, 2014, 07:32:22 PM
Moynihan's shot was incredible. Her break from the backcourt undefended was a special situation win for Berube. But her offensive rebound of Kanner's missed 2nd free throw and the pass to Morehead for the 3 that tied the game in OT was essential. Lady Luck indeed, but a great hustle play and clutch poise from Kelsey.
That lob pass from the right wing with the seal, release and lay-in by Hayden was killing the Jumbos. I second your opinion about Ewing. He did a masterful job of isolating, even Gribbin inside. Her fadeaway jumper over Liz M in OT was something. If he had gotten that time out before the jump ball call, who knows.
More Medford time next weekend. Survive and move on. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on March 08, 2014, 07:58:03 PM
Nescacbbrules, you are a zillion % correct about that KEY Moynihan O rebound of Kanner's missed 2nd FT, which Morehead then turned into a absolutely vital, top-of-the-key 3, to tie it again up late in the OT. Without that one hustle play by Liz, I don't know if the Jumbos would still be alive. It was just that close. Tufts came within a whisker of absolute disaster today. Like you say, though, survive and advance. I'm right behind you on that score.

Thanks for a wisdom-filled paragraph!

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: JustAFan on March 08, 2014, 09:08:13 PM
Depending on your viewpoint, Tufts survives or gets lucky.  But what is not in dispute is that they beat a REALLY good UNE team, a program that is certainly on the rise. I thought the UNE coach outcoached himself twice with his final possession in regulation and in OT, in both cases letting the clock run down too much before he had his team start its play. It left him with too little time for a second chance on the play but maybe he was comfortable with one shot because his worst case was going into another session if his team missed.

UNE did a great job not giving Kelsey Morehead a lot of freedom at the point, especially in the second half, putting a big guard on top who consistently pushed her to one side and didn't allow her to reverse the ball with her dribble. Expect to see more of this defense against the Jumbos next weekend.

I sure hope Hannah Foley can play next weekend. Tufts is not the same team without her, especially on offense, where she calms everyone down and makes sure that plays get run all the way thru.  The Jumbos got quiet but very effective contributions from Emma Roberson and Ali Rocchi today.  Liz Moynihan often is out of control on offense, but her all out hustle on D and fearlessness in the second half today certainly rescued the Jumbos.  She made her own luck with her hustle.

I don't think Tufts will face a tougher front line or an all around more physical team than UNE.  They were big AND strong, and they were not afraid to bang underneath.  Had the referees not swallowed their whistles (which they did both ways, consistently so, all game long), this might have been a different game as Tufts would have found itself on the foul line a good deal more. 

I hope Tufts can take advantage of its good fortune/luck next weekend.  It sounded like a great atmosphere in Cousens. Too bad the students will be on break beginning next weekend.


Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on March 09, 2014, 12:43:55 AM
Because I wanted to see how their 6'3" FY post (Alisha Brown) was coming along late, I saw a decent chunk of two of UNE's CCC tourney games. She showed a really nice, fairly consistent 8-10 footer then. Luckily for Tufts, she was missing them all on Sat. To me, she was the only UNE player who looked noticeably nervous out on the floor Sat. That said, I applaud her overall defensive effort, and her willingness to compete. She's not passive out there. And a lot of big girls can be. Can't wait to see her play over the next 3 years.

UNE is a *very* young team. 5"10" JR Kelly Coleman and 5"11" FY Michaela Flanagan complete their starting frontcourt, while Hayden and Gribbin are both only sophs. In the tourney games, I saw Gribbin making a pretty decent # of iffy decisions with the ball. Great skills on O, though. However, she did a far better job with her ball distribution, etc. vs Tufts. And while I agree Ewing was playing for OT/more OT at worst, late in the OT, the game clock still had :34 seconds left, not under :30. Despite this, Ewing went with the same, last-shot tactic in OT. As a coach, he thought a UNE miss would leave Tufts only a second or two for a shot. I agree. But his young charges were clearly caught unaware of that subtle time difference, vs the end of regulation. That's why the shot clock violation happened. UNE had to shoot it by around :06, not :02. The players' heads were just not around this subtle fact. And a very heavy price was paid for it. That turnover then gave Tufts the ball at halfcourt. With time to set up a play. From which Moynihan drained the game winner.   

Heading to the Sweet 16, however, and with all due respect, I just can't agree at ALL that Tufts will be hard-pressed to find a front line that will surpass what the Jumbos went up defensively against in UNE today. And while I am as grateful as all heck that the Jumbos will live to play another day, I just watched a team from a league regarded for years as not being even close to at our level of competition (4 NESCAC bids; just UNE for the CCC) just push us to within an inch of our lives. At Cousens, no less! Not to mention a team from the also-very-lightly-regarded NAC (Castleton) ousting Bowdoin Fri. - at Morrell, no less! (And the Spartans won again tonight - Sweet 16.) If anything, the various NCAA events of the last 48 hours have made me 48 times more nervous about Tufts finally reaching their FF goal this month - not more so. The NESCAC appears more vulnerable than expected. And the competition? More formidable than expected. Hey, I'm not gonna have to take a Xanax or anything. I know that Tufts still has a lot of good basketball left in them.

Ending on a light note, I said earlier I thought the officiating was great (although another poster correctly stated that them letting both teams play so much likely denied the Jumbos many a chance to score at the stripe, to gain some breathing room.) But it was mid-to-late 1st half. A Tufts player missed a FT. A UNE player grabbed the rebound. The female ref then blew her whistle, and did the "palms up to palms down" hand signal, pointing to the end line. She told the UNE player that she had inbounded the ball incorrectly. Then as calmly as she could, the UNE player stated to the ref that no inbounds play had happened there - she'd simply grabbed a defensive rebound, and was starting upcourt. The ref's body language then tensed up, realizing that the player was 100% correct. Luckily for her, her wrong whistle caused a media timeout, making her possession reversal far less obvious to all. Happens to the best of us....     :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 09, 2014, 11:41:16 AM
Nice posts with respect to the Tufts win in OT.  It is surprising how many people were aware of the WBB game on the men's board.  If Tufts had lost.....then Amherst WBB team may have the right to host.....thereby the MBB sweet 16 site would go elsewhere.  Think I got that right.
In any case, thought I needed to mention several things about the Amherst win at Hartwick.  I came back from dinner to follow the game on Live Stats again.  Seems the Lady Jeffs were hitting from outside and won the battle of the boards.
Surprised that it was an easier than thought win.  The Hartwick team has a respected young coach, good size and a fine record, etc.   Late in the game, Hartwick's star, Dumas was taken out with 20 points and ten rebounds....while some other starters were left in......hope it was not an injury.   
Amherst's soph Captain did not show up on the roster.     However, there was a big "tease" in the boxscore.  The Amherst roster showed that #10, Megan Robertson, was in and took and missed a 3-point shot.   Only today was the notation removed from the Hartwick supplied box....in the recap of the game on the Amherst website.  For a brief moment...Oh well.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 10, 2014, 02:58:42 PM
It is clear that Coach Raymond has established Ithaca as one of the top Eastern D3 programs, although his team's W-L record is not quite as gaudy as some prior years. Because their conference is not as tough, it seems that Dan chose to prepare his team for tournament play by scheduling DePauw, Rochester, Amherst, and John Carroll in their pre-conference schedule, thus achieving a top-10 SOS. In the 2013 NCAA's, the Bombers lost a Sweet 16 match-up in OT by 4 at Williams, a game they had every chance to win, but their losses this season to Amherst and DePauw were not close. I wonder if any of our local experts would care to opine on their chances this weekend, noting that Amherst is now without Ms. Robertson, who had 14 and 10 in that game, and what the pivotal issues may be.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 10, 2014, 03:40:27 PM
My daughter works in Ithaca and pointed out Ithaca had played the Lady Jeffs earlier.  The game was very early in the season and yes Megan Robertson played her part in that win.  The game was in LeFrak...a place which the WBB team has not lost a game for quite some time..in years.

To answer a poster's question,  the two teams that played in November are not the same as presently. With respect to Amherst,  Amherst has two front court players available now that can contribute and balance the Bombers size up front...S. Holness who was out with an injury in the first game and is just now playing near her talent level....and FY Boyette who now has a full season playing the college game.  More important, since Amherst normally starts three FY players ...they too have had a full season getting experience playing in a tough conference.  On the down side, one of Amherst seasoned players...a sophomore Captain has not played in the last two games.  Now the Tufts gym is not one of the Lady Jeff's favorite places to play...having lost to Tufts twice there....still it is not entirely a strange gym.  The Ithaca players maybe impacted more.
I watched the interview of the Ithaca HBC and two of the players on the Ithaca website after their last win.  I got the impression that all felt that they are a better team now than earlier in the season.  That is how it should be...IMO .  The Bombers are on a roll...having won their conference.  Both teams have beaten Hartwick...a good team and a common opponent.  I expect a competative game.  If  Amherst's outside game is on, than it maybe like the first game...however.

Last year, in the Williams game in Willy Town...the Ithaca team had an assistant coach, a native of Cortland, NY who was a starter on the Amherst  Title team of '11.  One other factor to consider is the Amherst Coach...a very fine coach.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Bombers798891 on March 11, 2014, 12:15:13 PM
Quote from: nescacbbrules on March 10, 2014, 02:58:42 PM
It is clear that Coach Raymond has established Ithaca as one of the top Eastern D3 programs, although his team's W-L record is not quite as gaudy as some prior years. Because their conference is not as tough, it seems that Dan chose to prepare his team for tournament play by scheduling DePauw, Rochester, Amherst, and John Carroll in their pre-conference schedule, thus achieving a top-10 SOS. In the 2013 NCAA's, the Bombers lost a Sweet 16 match-up in OT by 4 at Williams, a game they had every chance to win, but their losses this season to Amherst and DePauw were not close. I wonder if any of our local experts would care to opine on their chances this weekend, noting that Amherst is now without Ms. Robertson, who had 14 and 10 in that game, and what the pivotal issues may be.

I would probably disagree on the 25-4 record not being gaudy by IC standards, considering it's the second-highest win total in school history, but the rest of this is accurate. The Bombers have always played a tough OOC schedule, as their 84-8 conference record over the last six seasons shows you what they're dealing with in-conference. But this is the first time where the national performance has been more consistent, with back-to-back Sweet 16 trips.

But this is a tough, tough matchup for IC. While the 44-point effort in the first game was in part a function of a 6-for-15 performance from the line that would be a strange repeat, this team's offensive struggles in the first half of its two NCAA games, coupled with Amherst's great defense makes me think Ithaca struggles to get past 50-55.

68-53 Amherst, maybe?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on March 11, 2014, 03:04:50 PM
Massey has Amherst winning 64-55 with a 77% win probability for Amherst.  I'd guess it to be closer than that, I think Amherst is much diminished without Robertson, but still give the Jeffs the edge.  Ithaca has had a very favorable draw into the Sweet 16... then again so has Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 11, 2014, 06:18:02 PM
Having watched at least a couple of Amherst games annually over many years, I believe this year's team is slightly down from the recent Gromacki era squads. They are still an excellent by any measure, but, as several posts have noted, they may rely too much on their 3-pt production to win consistently against the best defenses. On the other hand, without significant size or production inside, particularly with Robertson's absence, they almost have to get a large percentage from behind the arc or off their excellent defense. They beat a fine Hartwick club with lights out shooting--15 for 27 on 3's. (The LJ's take 21 3's per game, making just over 7.3. This 34% marksmanship represents nearly 32% of their total point production, an increase of 7% over last year's total of 25%. I believe that Voigt's absence is more a factor than Robertson's injury here. This season against Tufts with both contests at Cousens, they have shot a total of 9 for 33 from beyond the arc. Coincidentally, that is exactly what they shot last year combined,9 for 33, in the two games at LeFrak--27 %. Not bad shooting against tough D.) Ithaca is a physically strong, solid defensive squad by any metric. Clogging the middle against dribble penetration and chasing the LJ's off the 3-pt arc could well be critical if they are to succeed. And Mary Kate Tierney will have to produce like she did against Haverford.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 13, 2014, 11:30:12 AM
FYI...The Amherst website has a preview of the teams at the Tufts sectional on its athletic section.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 13, 2014, 12:23:38 PM
When you try to assess these NCAA tournament match-ups with top teams from vastly different conferences, the experience factor weighs heavily. Looking at the Tufts/Castleton State game, it is clear that the Jumbos' strength of schedule makes them a distinct favorite. Having beaten Rochester, Baldwin-Wallace, Brandeis, Colby-Sawyer, Emmanuel, and Harwick in pre-conference, and then sweeping the NESCAC, it is easy to place them well above the commensurate schedule of Castleton State. The Spartans went 2-1 against Colby-Sawyer this season, but their loss was at home by 10 to the Chargers while Tufts beat Colby-Sawyer (early in the season) by 41. Castleton's other losses were also at home by 7 to Williams and Westfield State; Tufts beat Williams by 19 in Williamstown.

These comparables are instructive but hardly definitive. Castleton beat Bowdoin and Plattsburg, two favorites on the road last weekend with gutsy performances, defying the "expectations." If Tufts is not overly subject to the weight of expectations, they should make it to Saturday to play the Amherst/Ithaca winner. But, as we all know too well, there is a reason they actually play the games, and the heart possessed by this Spartans team is not in doubt. I am looking forward to visiting Cousens again for several great games.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on March 14, 2014, 07:32:24 PM
Ithaca beats Amherst in OT, 74-71 at Cousens. LJs went 7-9 from 3 in the first half, and had about a 7-pt halftime lead (live stats already erased, preparing for Tufts-Castleton). Ithaca lost by 20 in preseason at LeFrak, before Robertson got hurt. Fun game to watch. The SR-laden Bombers vs. Marley and the FYs. Giddens got a rare start. Think she ended up with 22. Played fantastic, as always. Ithaca stormed back to tie early in the 2nd - then went back and forth. Ithaca threw a few careless, over-the-head passes to teammates there for a stretch, but are a disciplined, very good passing team who executes on O very well. DI transfer Mary Kate Tierney (Bryant) is their glue player, and the SR had a very solid game. LJs had the last possession in regulation, but couldn't get a shot off.

Amherst was 4 down late, but two late, clutch 3s by Ali Doswell got them back in it. Those who've been claiming an LJ over-reliance on 3's were proven right in this contest, despite the high # of them made. Their flow on O was not really there. Looked choppy. Each of their last 15 possessions, it seemed, found the shot clock at under 5 seconds, forcing "must shoot" shots. Both Pritchard (2 quick 3-pt misses in a row) and Holness (an ill-fated power move) took late, key shots, that probably weren't the ones Gromacki would choose. In their defense, though, quality options were few. The Bombers stayed on Giddens like glue, especially in the final minutes, minimizing her late damage. Marley was their #1 option on O, by a mile, and Ithaca knew it.

The "more minutes for Haley Zwecker" fans will be disappointed. Played just two minutes, as GP instead went with Giddens, the 4 FYs, with just Holness and Pritchard off the bench. Just as I had seen him do in other 13-14 big games. Second-guessers could surely make another case for more Haley here.

To me, the better team won today. Ithaca played an inspired game. I remember seeing at least 5 10-12 ft jumpers by the Bombers swish through, with LJ defenders all over them. A clutch Bomber performance. Those seniors badly wanted their season to continue. I don't think Ithaca made a 3 the entire game. Took very few. They pounded the paint for the full 40. To me, it was by far the game where Robertson's loss and overall lack of quality post defense hurt the LJs the most.

It's now up to the Jumbos to represent the NESCAC. Should the Jumbos beat Castleton, Tufts are gonna have their hands full with Ithaca on Saturday, though.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 14, 2014, 07:40:38 PM
good summary by d3wbbfan.  I would agree that the better team won.  I thought Ithaca played an excellent game from beginning to end, other than some sloppy passes in one stretch of the second half.  The only reason Amherst was ahead at the half was 7-9 shooting on threes in the first half.  In the second half they were 4-17, and many of those were very quick and not good shots.  Amherst was hurting Ithaca going to Giddens down low, but got away from it.  The Ithaca senior (Bryant transfer) is an excellent player--great passer, and Ithaca was very disciplined in their offense and got a lot of good shots. Tufts will likely blow out Castleton state, leading to a good game tomorrow to see who goes to the final four-
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Bombers798891 on March 14, 2014, 08:50:18 PM
Quote from: Maine1 on March 14, 2014, 07:40:38 PM
good summary by d3wbbfan.  I would agree that the better team won.  I thought Ithaca played an excellent game from beginning to end, other than some sloppy passes in one stretch of the second half.  The only reason Amherst was ahead at the half was 7-9 shooting on threes in the first half.  In the second half they were 4-17, and many of those were very quick and not good shots.  Amherst was hurting Ithaca going to Giddens down low, but got away from it.  The Ithaca senior (Bryant transfer) is an excellent player--great passer, and Ithaca was very disciplined in their offense and got a lot of good shots. Tufts will likely blow out Castleton state, leading to a good game tomorrow to see who goes to the final four-

So proud of the Bombers. I admit, I did not think they were going to win the game, but they're just getting it done. A triple-double from Mary Kate Tierney. The key was the 8-0 run to start the second half which prevented the game from becoming a blowout. The Bombers are in the elite 8 for the first time
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on March 14, 2014, 09:07:02 PM
Congrats, Bombers798891. Making history is always special, and your team deserved it. Good luck tomorrow against Tufts.

And Maine1 was correct, as Tufts ended Castleton's Cinderella run easily, 55-35. Hannah Foley did not play, and I thought I saw her in street clothes at the end of the bench. Anyone know if she's done for any remaining 13-14 games?

North lead the way with 14 points and 7 boards, in 20 minutes. Kanner had 12, as did Rocchi, which I'm guessing is a season-high for her. Especially happy to see it for Ali, given her knee woes.   

Desroches had just 5 for Castleton. Douglass' 11 was their only player in double-figures.

Castleton was an arctic 2-15 from 3 (13%), but Tufts was even worse, at 2-16. Moynihan still not quite herself from bonus range. Given Ithaca's non-emphasis on 3's in the first game, it looks like it'll be a battle for points in the paint. Should be a great battle, especially with the winner's first trip to the Final Four as the prize!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 15, 2014, 06:49:13 PM
Congrats to Tufts!  Represent the NESCAC well, and enjoy the ride.  It's an trip of a lifetime.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on March 15, 2014, 06:52:04 PM
Tufts on to the final 4, 61-59. What a game! So much for me thinking Ithaca wasn't a team that shot 3's. Shot 10-18 for the game, including what must've been 7 of them converted inside of the last 4 minutes, to keep it close. Man, that Kathryn Campbell - just one clutch late 3 made after another. Then Tierney makes an impossible 3, shot between top of the key and half court, with about 10 seconds left. And shaky FT shooting at the end for the Jumbos didn't help the cause any. It took a back-door cut layup rimming out for the Bombers at the buzzer to preserve the hard-fought Tufts win. Kanner led Tufts with 18; Morehead 14; North 11; Moynihan 10. For Ithaca, Campbell had 21, and Tierney 16. A very high-quality game. Both teams did themselves proud.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 16, 2014, 03:40:48 PM
This game was a classic. As has been noted, both teams played at a high level under great pressure when the stakes were high. As expected, Tierney was a tough match-up, but Roberson, whose playing time was stretched to 30 min due to Foley's injury, did an excellent job in her time guarding the Ithaca senior. Campbell's performance was simply outstanding. While she didn't knock down NBA range 3's like Tierney, she took and made virtually every clutch shot throughout the contest. Ithaca's ball movement in the first half, consistently hitting the open teammate against Tufts' defensive rotations in help, created so many open looks and was the best I have seen this season. But despite hitting a high percentage and playing a great half, the Bombers were down 2 to the Jumbos at the break.

Tufts shored up its defense in the 2nd half, and Ithaca was less patient, so their glitzy first half shooting percentage dropped. Tufts took advantage of their front line, effectively pounding the ball inside to their forwards who took 32 of the team's game total of 51 shots and made 50%. Michela North was isolated on smaller defenders for the buckets that gave Tufts some breathing space in the second half, and the first year's hustle plays, for example, diving for loose balls at mid-court, inspired her teammates. Coming off the bench but playing crunch time minutes, North has averaged 9.5 point and 7 rebounds in the tournament. Haley Kanner, playing with poise, displayed her ability to dribble her way to the rim or stop for an open lane jumpshot. Haley's 18 blocks in the 4 NCAA games have been huge, and she has averaged a double-double, 15 points with 10 rebounds, in the tournament. Kelsey Morehead's performances in the NESCAC and NCAA tournament games have been superb, and the diminutive pointguard's reputation for playing big in the BIG games has been reaffirmed. Offensively, she has doubled her regular season scoring output from 7 to 14 per game while maintaining a 2.5 assist to turnover ratio against the best defenses. Her defensive energy is so impressive, and her knack for hitting those big shots, whether 3's or sprints to the rim, is clear. The Jumbo seniors have stepped up as well, with Caitlin McClure, Ali Rocchi and Liz Moynihan helping to offset the absence of Hannah Foley this past weekend.

I believe that the better team, by a nose, won this game. Ithaca's late heroics once again highlighted the talent and heart of a team led by senior champions. Down ten with time running out, the well-coached Bombers lived up to their name, draining one improbable 3 after another and having a great shot to tie or even win the game at the buzzer. A truly memorable, gutsy performance for all lucky enough to see it.

Great to see the NESCAC champions going to their first Final Four. I know their growing fanbase appreciates the heart, skill, and commitment to the game and their teammates that they display. Tufts' great season rolls on to Wisconsin. All the best, Jumbos. 

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 16, 2014, 06:11:57 PM
Tonight on Hoopsville we will recap the sectional weekend of basketball action and start previewing the championship weekend in Salem, Vir. and Stevens Point, Wis. Here are the guests you will hear from tonight:

- Williams head coach Mike Maker and senior center Mike Mayer
- Illinois Wesleyan head coach Ron Rose
- UW-Whitewater siblings Alex and Mary Merg
- Tufts senior forward Liz Moynihan

Pat Coleman will also join us to talk about what he saw this weekend and the tournament so far and we will announce the All-Region teams!

Show starts at 7 PM ET and will run until about 9:00 tonight.

You can tune in here: www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2013-14/mar16 (http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2013-14/jan12)

Don't forget you can ask us or our guests questions via social media:
- Twitter (@d3hoopsville (http://www.twitter.com/d3hoopsville) and #Hoopsville)
- Facebook (www.facebook.com/Hoopsville (http://www.facebook.com/Hoopsville))
- Email (hoopsville@d3hoops.com)

Thanks and enjoy the show!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 17, 2014, 04:04:10 PM
Congratulations to the each of the outstanding performers on the All-Northeast Region team selections. The NESCAC is appropriately represented on the four teams by 6 players, including Player of the Year, Haley Kanner, of Tufts, and two other first teamers, Meredith Kelly of Bates and Hannah Brickley of Trinity. Kelsey Morehead, Tufts' anchor at the point, made the second team, and sharpshooter Hannah Foley of Tufts and Ellen Cook of Williams were third team selections. Well done, student athletes. And while we're recognizing excellence, congratulations to Tufts' Head Coach, Carla Berube, for another well-deserved accolade as regional Coach of the Year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Hoopsinfo on March 18, 2014, 12:57:47 AM
Congratulations to the NESCAC for having representatives from 4 teams as well as the Coach of the year and the player of the year.  Curious why there were no players from Amherst after finishing second in the conference and several players being amongst the statistical leaders in the conference.  I can certainly think of 1 or 2 players who deserved recognition.  Thought the Amherst players pulled through the season well.  Watched the Ithaca game online and was disappointed that the coach did not adjust strategy in the 2nd half when three point shots were not falling - after falling behind, they took the ball inside to retake the lead and then returned to 3 point shots that were not falling.  Seems like GP has one strategy and has trouble adjusting to what is working during the game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 18, 2014, 03:55:13 PM
I'd say GP has earned the benefit of the doubt after five straight Final Fours and bringing a team that had no business being there (lost best player to injury, no seniors, only one junior who played by the end of the year, no interior presence) to the Sweet 16.  Honestly, it may have been his best coaching job in years, considering that after the Robertson injury, he had one player from last year's team who averaged over 5 ppg, and she only averaged 7 ppg, to work with.  But if you are dissatisfied, I guarantee you that every Division 3 program in the country would happily take him off your hands! 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 18, 2014, 04:21:18 PM
Nescac 1...thanks for the support of Coach G....will mention it the next time I see him...truly.  Come to think if it...he maybe at Salem.  He was at the MBB team dinner with his girlfriend in 2008...about the time he arrived at Amherst.  The first time I meet him.

I thought about the lack of Amherst representation on the list....but thinking about it, Coach G may have decided not to put anyone up.  Motivation purposes is my thinking.  If Megan Robertson return to form and the young players develop more...especially Boyette, I believe Amherst will reach the Final 4 next season.  As posted earlier, Amherst has a raw big front court player coming in next year.  Be interesting to see who also will arrive.  Would not be surprised with a transfer player even.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 18, 2014, 05:39:35 PM
QuoteHonestly, it may have been his best coaching job in years, considering that after the Robertson injury, he had one player from last year's team who averaged over 5 ppg, and she only averaged 7 ppg, to work with.]Honestly, it may have been his best coaching job in years, considering that after the Robertson injury, he had one player from last year's team who averaged over 5 ppg, and she only averaged 7 ppg, to work with.   

My thoughts exactly.

If Amherst had made the Final Four and beat FDU-Florham next weekend, GP would've been my pick for National Coach of the Year, even if Amherst lost in the title game.

And I hope he comes to Stevens Point instead of Salem. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on March 18, 2014, 05:57:54 PM
Quote from: nescac1 on March 18, 2014, 03:55:13 PM
But if you are dissatisfied, I guarantee you that every Division 3 program in the country would happily take him off your hands! 

Well I get it's hyperbole, and GP is no doubt a very fine coach, but there ARE some other very fine D3 coaches and some D3 programs that would not trade their coach for GP, thank you very much :)

That said, I agree that he did an exceptional job this year and the Jeffs did much better than one might expect given the youth and lack of interior strength sans Robertson.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 20, 2014, 06:22:22 PM
I agree with several of the previous comments.  Gromacki did a great job with this year's team to get to the sweet 16 (although they had a good draw).  However, I have been saying for a few years now that he is one of the best Coachs I have seen at any level. 
On the year-end awards--my sense for a while now at D3, where many of the players are not seen widely, is that the awards generally go to the players on the Best team.  With all due respect to Kanter from Tufts, she wasn't even awarded the best player in her league (correctly went to the Trinity player). 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Hoopsinfo on March 21, 2014, 12:10:39 AM
To the writer who said that it was GP's great coaching that got his team to within 2 points of winning against the Ithaca Bombers, who then lost by 2 to the team that is now in the Final Four -  I disagree.   "They had no business being there" but for outstanding coaching?  That's an insult to the Amherst players.  I watched many of their games this year.  This young team played tough, hung in there and won - or kept games close -  even after losing their center (Robertson). That's what got them to the sweet 16. My view?  Amherst coach was outcoached in a number of games at the end of the season, esp against Ithaca -- I think Amherst was winning by 10 or so in the first half and (as other writers have said) this coach kept relying on 3 point shots that weren't falling despite some success under the basket.  And not using Zwecker at all in the second half of the game against Ithaca was a big mistake, I think.  This team needed leadership in overtime against Ithaca, and from what I could see - Coach G did not set the team up with a play in the last 20 secs.
   
Other programs may want Gromacki – I have no idea.  But it speaks very poorly for this coach if it's true that he didn't nominate any of his excellent players for the All Northeast region's four teams.  I can think of a few Amherst players who are statistical leaders in NESCAC who deserved this recognition (Doswell, Giddens, Zwecker among them), along with the players from Williams, Trinity, Bates and others whose coaches honored them for their hard work..... even if they did not make the Final Four.   Second in the NESCAC and Amherst girls missing from all of these teams is hardly motivational. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 21, 2014, 01:18:40 AM
QuoteBut it speaks very poorly for this coach if it's true that he didn't nominate any of his excellent players for the All Northeast region's four teams.

It's not true.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on March 21, 2014, 08:24:22 PM
FDU-Florham (32-0) defeats Tufts (30-2) in the Final Four's first semi-final, 42-39. Michela North was the only Jumbo in double figures, with 13. Kyra Dayon was the only Devil in double figures, with 17. Can't remember the last game with a *total* of just two players in doubles. Foley didn't start, but did manage to play some limited minutes. Florham's quickness gave the Jumbos fits all game. For all 94 feet. Kanner especially. Just 2 points and 6 TO's for the region's MVP, in 28 minutes.

A fantastic season for Tufts, with still a consolation game to play against UW-Whitewater on Sat. Congratulations to Coach Berube, her staff, and a great bunch of hard-working student-athletes!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 21, 2014, 09:59:56 PM
From watching a few of them, that consolation game is the worst game in sport.  NO ONE wants to be there.  Congrats on a great year for Tufts, and play hard tomorrow.  3rd feels much better than 4th.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: CasualFan2 on March 21, 2014, 11:08:28 PM
Tufts did a very good job to get to where they did.  They could have won tonight with a bounce one way or the other.  They have continued to grow the program in an impressive manner, dethroned the multi year champ in Amherst, and went to the final four all in one season!  Pretty good work!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on March 22, 2014, 07:07:14 PM
Tufts loses the consolation game to UW-Whitewater, 72-54, to finish (30-3), and fourth nationally. Don't have stats handy, but North had another solid game Saturday, and to me had by far the best two-game effort by a Jumbo player in Stevens Point. Kanner had a nice bounce-back Saturday effort, and Morehead was her usual solid self. The team was in good spirits throughout, and was rightly enjoying the spoils of making it all the way to the Final Four. Great attitude. Congrats to the three seniors, and here's hoping that this year's stellar junior class can build on this experience, and make another run at it next season!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 23, 2014, 02:37:14 PM
Gordonmann...great work at the WBB final 4.  Did finally get to see a little of the title game.  Surprised to see the final score of the title game....based on the first 10 minutes of the game.  Nice to see a newcomer win the title...especially one that turned its program around so quickly.  In a way, it is like the way that the Amherst program was turned around by Coach G  in a short time.  Now when Amherst 's does not make it to the Final 4, it is somewhat surprising. 
For those posters who see fault with Amherst's present coach, lighten up a little. I too would have liked to see more of my favorite  player on the floor in the  Ithaca game...but remember this year's team was a very young team.  Seeing the teams in the final 4 play, Amherst would not have been competitive with them, IMO.

I am looking forward to next season...where I expect to see several conference teams in the Final 4 :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 23, 2014, 11:05:35 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 23, 2014, 02:37:14 PM
Gordonmann...great work at the WBB final 4.  Did finally get to see a little of the title game.  Surprised to see the final score of the title game....based on the first 10 minutes of the game.  Nice to see a newcomer win the title...especially one that turned its program around so quickly.  In a way, it is like the way that the Amherst program was turned around by Coach G  in a short time.  Now when Amherst 's does not make it to the Final 4, it is somewhat surprising. 
For those posters who see fault with Amherst's present coach, lighten up a little. I too would have liked to see more of my favorite  player on the floor in the  Ithaca game...but remember this year's team was a very young team.  Seeing the teams in the final 4 play, Amherst would not have been competitive with them, IMO.

I am looking forward to next season...where I expect to see several conference teams in the Final 4 :)

Looks like a crowded Final 4 with your several NESCAC teams, FDU, Montclair, Scranton, Thomas More; hardly any room for the Midwest or West. ;)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 24, 2014, 11:14:37 AM
Amh63:

Thanks.  Tufts will be very good next year and so will Amherst with Robertson back.  Ronk is probably kidding but he's right in that this region has several teams who look like national title contenders including Montclair and of course FDU-Florham. Scranton is poised to make another deep run too as their young players develop.  It should be fun.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on August 24, 2014, 04:24:52 PM
FYs and transfers arrived today. Seems that Amherst had brought in a class of five players.  Aware of one from the D.C. Area...not the others.  Hope all of last year's team return healthy well rested.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on August 31, 2014, 12:06:38 AM
 Tufts and Scranton will be meeting in Puerto Rico over Christmas break so we'll get a good idea of their relative strength.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: colby96 on September 28, 2014, 08:16:28 PM
Colby AD Zalot being forced to resign. Done at end of calendar year. Good news for Colby coaches.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on October 03, 2014, 06:43:24 PM
Amherst Schedule is on website.  Seems that Williams travel partner is now Hamilton, and Middlebury is on their own.  Finish the season on a Sunday with Middlebury and not a two game weekend.  Some of the usual non-league with the plus Rhode Island, Arcadia, Manhattanville, St Lawrence (former Gromacki school), and Drew (former Amherst Ass't Coach).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 04, 2014, 10:27:58 AM
NE Jeffs Fan.....thanks for being on top of the news.  Women news is always the last to come out...for example.... New players.  The MBB info is still closed.  Need to check on it.  Coach Hixon was trying to fill in the schedule awhile back.   November is coming fast. :). Plus K
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on October 06, 2014, 01:42:11 PM
Amherst men's schedule: http://www.d3hoops.com/teams/Amherst/Men/2014-15/index
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on October 07, 2014, 10:38:49 AM
A bit of early recruiting news for the Ephs:

Congrats to Blair Academy 6-0 Sr. G Lauren Vostal who has committed to Williams College.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on October 07, 2014, 02:20:51 PM
 I was interested in Lauren for Scranton, knew she had recently decided and was going to announce shortly.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 07, 2014, 03:31:21 PM
Pat C.....thanks for the info.  Interesting that you picked up schedule while the Amherst website has not posted the schedule to date.  Coach Hixon had been trying to fill a slot.  How did your associate Dave M.  get Coach Hixon to play Dave's school in Baltimore? :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 07, 2014, 03:42:28 PM
ronk....tall for a guard.  Any comments wrt to her talents?   Wonder if Amherst had any interest?  Amherst brought in 5 recruits this year...several with good size.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on October 07, 2014, 05:12:50 PM
Quote from: amh63 on October 07, 2014, 03:42:28 PM
ronk....tall for a guard.  Any comments wrt to her talents?   Wonder if Amherst had any interest?  Amherst brought in 5 recruits this year...several with good size.

I'd describe Lauren as best suited as an athletic wing(#3) rather than a guard; that's what she played with her AAU team, mostly because they had other guards to handle the ball.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on October 07, 2014, 05:17:37 PM
 Wesleyan gets a very good forward - Tara Berger 6-1 Rye Country Day.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on October 07, 2014, 05:26:11 PM
As it's only October and early decision isn't announced until sometime in December, a student athlete can commit to a school and say "you're my first choice, and this is where I want to go."  BUT the admissions office is has the final say as there are no national letters of intent etc.  Having said that usually each coach has from 1 to 3 slots for early decision and they can take their top few to admissions and be pretty sure that the admissions letters will say, "Welcome to ......"  You do hear once in a while about an athlete that committed to a school, but the admissions office didn't honor that commitment for early decision.

Please add other info that you might know.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on October 07, 2014, 05:30:18 PM
When Amherst men and women play on the same day league games, the games are listed at the same time.  Hopefully when posted on Amherst website, times will be correct on each schedule.  Not sure who plays first this year, men or women.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on October 07, 2014, 05:47:23 PM
In many years of following NESCAC sports, I've yet to hear of an athlete who announced a commitment to a NESCAC school in an early decision round, and then was denied admission.  Or for that matter, even in the Spring.   Coaches at these schools have a REALLY good idea of who will be admitted, directly from admissions, and they won't tell an athlete that they are going to be admitted ED without a good basis to do so.  If they did, word would get around in a hurry and they would stop getting "committed" athletes in the first place. 

I'm not saying it has NEVER happened, and of course there can be miscommunications or changes in circumstances (especially financial in nature).  But trust me, it is exceedingly, exceedingly rare. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 07, 2014, 08:28:41 PM
NE Jeff Fan....you and me both wrt to the confusion of time conflicts.  Earlier had myself convinced that the rotation of which team has the early start time was discontinued!  Seems that another conference in NY state is planning to switch the start times for the teams.  Oh well, life is too short for me to ponder further on the matter.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 09, 2014, 12:17:18 PM
NE JEFF FAN......the amherst men's scheduled is posted on the website.  It provides no clarity wrt to the time conflick in the start times of the women and men teams.  I have e-mailed the SID at Amherst to check on the conflict and resolve the posted schedules accordingly and reply to the question of rotation of team start times.  Hopefully it will be done shortly.  If not, will e-mail the AD on the matter.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 10, 2014, 03:35:30 PM
NE JEFF Fan......have the KEY to my confusion and maybe yours.  Did e-mail the SID on the matter.
Anyway...after not hearing anything from the SID, I decided to look over the schedules.  It seems that there is no conflict wrt to times.  Focusing on the Williams games on Jan 10 and 21....clarity arrived.for me.  The MBB team does NOT play at the same location as the WBB team.  In short, the locations are  different.  Therefore, there is no rotation of start times.....the two teams do not play at the play on the same floor.  Too lazy if this applies to other conference games...splitting the teams up.
Guess the SID was being kind in not replying.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on October 14, 2014, 02:32:01 PM
Guess they decided to split the fan base instead of combine it.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 14, 2014, 03:19:07 PM
NE JEFFS FAN....true.  The SID did get back to me on the matter.  He did not respond to my question. Of the rotation of start times.  Too lazy to check on the other regular conference games... Splitting of locations...and the policies if any during playoffs.  Will check further when I go up for Homecoming.
The new SID...former assist...may not have been aware of the rotation matter.  Concerned in that I will miss WBB games, etc. When I make my few trips up to watch live games in LeFrak.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on October 15, 2014, 11:45:44 AM
That's a shame, as once the NESCAC schedule starts, half the fun was seeing both teams play as well as catching some ice hockey, squash, and swimming all in one weekend.  Seems like that has to be a league decision, not an Amherst decision.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on November 07, 2014, 11:51:50 AM
Might as well get the discussion started....What does everyone think of the preseason D3Hoops poll?  Interesting that Amherst is above Tufts.  Did Tufts lose a large part of their starters?  Amherst doesn't even have their roster posted yet so we don't know names or anything about incoming first years.  Not sure about health of Megan Roberston (knee) and Savannah Holness (shoulder), Jeff's fourth years with the most experience.  Excellent soph and junior class to build a team around. 

Good to see Williams and Bowdoin in the Top 25 also.  Should be another strong year for the NESCAC.  Can't wait for the fun to begin!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on November 07, 2014, 01:45:51 PM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on November 07, 2014, 11:51:50 AM
Might as well get the discussion started....What does everyone think of the preseason D3Hoops poll? Interesting that Amherst is above Tufts. Did Tufts lose a large part of their starters?  Amherst doesn't even have their roster posted yet so we don't know names or anything about incoming first years.  Not sure about health of Megan Roberston (knee) and Savannah Holness (shoulder), Jeff's fourth years with the most experience.  Excellent soph and junior class to build a team around. 

Good to see Williams and Bowdoin in the Top 25 also.  Should be another strong year for the NESCAC.  Can't wait for the fun to begin!

Maybe, they got points for Gromacki. Bowdoin got a good frosh in Kate Kerrrigan.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: toad22 on November 07, 2014, 07:13:38 PM
I'm very high on Williams this year. Ellen Cook is better than ever, and they have some really good FYs. They should be in the mix for supremacy in the NESCAC.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on November 08, 2014, 02:17:21 AM
Quote from: ronk on November 07, 2014, 01:45:51 PM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on November 07, 2014, 11:51:50 AM
Might as well get the discussion started....What does everyone think of the preseason D3Hoops poll? Interesting that Amherst is above Tufts. Did Tufts lose a large part of their starters?  Amherst doesn't even have their roster posted yet so we don't know names or anything about incoming first years.  Not sure about health of Megan Roberston (knee) and Savannah Holness (shoulder), Jeff's fourth years with the most experience.  Excellent soph and junior class to build a team around. 

Good to see Williams and Bowdoin in the Top 25 also.  Should be another strong year for the NESCAC.  Can't wait for the fun to begin!

Maybe, they got points for Gromacki. Bowdoin got a good frosh in Kate Kerrrigan.

Amherst says it returns all five starters. Tufts lost two, including Liz Moynihan. Probably has a lot to do with the switch. Our voters don't tend to put much stock in freshmen because they have no D-III track record.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on November 15, 2014, 10:54:51 AM
It's DIII WCBB opening day!!!!!!    :)     I hope all of my fellow DIII fans had a pleasant off season!

Tufts did lose two starters, but neither of them was Moynihan. They were "glue players" SR Caitlin McClure (4.6 ppg), and the Tag-Team-Ali's: Rocchi (SR; 19 starts; 4.2 ppg, playing with a balky knee) and Berman (JR; 14 starts; 3.6 ppg; not back with team.) The SR Moynihan was Tufts' 6th man all last season, and only started a few games at the very end of '13-'14 (five), due to Hannah Foley's ill-timed leg injury. But Liz was always in there at the end of games, Pat Coleman, if that's what you meant by "starter".

While giving full respect to both the lost starters and such returning "glue players" as Emma Roberson, IMO Tufts got to the Final Four on the stat-stuffing abilities of just five players last season: Morehead, Kanner, Foley, Michela North and Moynihan. (Which was why Foley's injury hurt Tufts *so* much in March. She was the Jumbo's most reliable outside threat all year, by a wide margin, and they had no replacement for her sweet stroke.) The first four names are all back. Four FY's and a SO who didn't play BB last year (Katy Hicks) are added. My best guess for snagging the most PT among the newbies is 5'8" G Jennie Mucciarone. All coaches value upperclassmen, who've worked hard every single day, paid their dues and understand what it takes, but few do any more than Carla Berube does. So it'll be fun to see how her preferred 8-9 player rotation develops early. The vets'll surely get first crack at the minutes.

Tufts starts up today in Biddeford, ME, at the Univ. Of New England tourney. Of course, recall that the Nor'Easters came within an eyelash and a Moynihan desperation, line-drive 3 that somehow dropped in at the OT buzzer, of upsetting Tufts at Cousens back in the 2014 NCAA's opening weekend. UNE returns all 5 starters, and will likely play Tufts Sunday, assuming the Jumbos defeat Keene State and Coach Anthony Ewing's team beats Wellesley in tonight's tourney nightcap.

Bowdoin also begins today vs Roger Williams at the Maine Maritime tourney. The Polar Bears return 5 or their top 6 scorers, including their top two, JR F Shannon Brady (14.1 ppg) and SR G Sara Binkhorst (13.1 ppg), no doubt hoping to avenge their first-round NCAA tourney upset loss at home last March with a much longer NCAA run. These hopes are very realistic, perhaps even probable. 

Williams opens up against R.I. College this afternoon at the Babson tourney. They had no seniors last year, so everyone's back, led by their talented SR leader, Ellen Cook (14.3 ppg), as well as SR Kellie Macdonald (11.7 ppg). Six other quality players return, all who added between 5.2 and 9 ppg for the Ephs' in '13-14. But after a 19-2 start, the team began to experience repeated, long scoring droughts in games late in NESCAC play. And when the offense stopped generating points through structure, Williams' came to rely almost exclusively on Cook's leadership, determination and stellar one-on-one moves/individual skills to score. She did everything humanly possible for her team to compensate, but they fell short. With the very same group back, supplemented by three FY's, Coach Pat Manning has had all off-season to work out the kinks that clogged up her club's late-season point production. Luckily, her teams are always very defensive minded, so that's a great start. We could also be lucky enough to get another delicious NCAA rematch Sunday in Babson Park. Vassar is playing Babson in the other Saturday game. Should Vassar and the Ephs both win (or lose, as both Saturday games should be close), Cook & Co. have the chance for revenge, as it was Vassar who upset Williams in the NCAA First Round, 76-75, in Scranton, PA. And although Vassar graduated their two best players, all the Ephs are back, and they all surely remember the loss that ended last season for them.

I saw that there was a recent DIII Hoops WBB poll where Amherst garnered more votes than anyone else, including defending champ FDU-Florham (who has all their top players back), both getting far more votes than Tufts did. So folks across the country seem to think that Amherst is the team to beat this year. Now we all know how good a coach GP Gromacki is, but that result even caught me a bit by surprise. Granted, just getting Megan Robertson back from her midseason-ending '13-14 injury (assuming she's fully healthy) will be a huge boost. They also had no seniors on their roster of 12 last year, and they brought in five FYs. That would've meant 17 on the Jeffs' roster, which is not a common # for DIII teams without JV squads. Viewing the roster, it now has 15 names. Who can surely *all* play ball. It appears that both Savannah Holness and Virginia Hassell have opted to concentrate on their studies for the SR year. I know they will both be missed by their teammates, the coaching staff, and Amherst fans. 

I've been able to see  film on some of the FY's (for what that's worth, I know - always highlights!) At a quick glance, two of them (the kid from Switzerland, Lily Johnson, and the big lefty 3-pt shooter from CT, Jenna Schumacher) seem to have physical builds and shooting skills exactly like returning SO Hannah Peterson does. (That's great news for Coach Gromacki, if Peterson's 3-pt shot cools.)  6'1" Hannah Hackley (Westford, MA) and 6'0" Jackie Nagle (VT) had storied HS careers, and seem ticketed for the 3/4 spots. And Robertson can surely use the help down low. The 6'2" FR from MD seems not to be quite as game-ready out of the blocks, but that's very normal for bigger DIII girls, who usually require more development. I can't just mention Amherst without mentioning Marley Giddins, Cheyenne Pritchard, Jaimie Renner. Ali & Meredith Doswell, and Haley Zwecker. Heck, maybe the DIII Hoops pollsters are right after all. If this year FYs are half as good as last year's were, it looks like GP's 5 top non-starters would earn an NCAA bid on their own! Minutes are going to be at such a premium this year. I'll bet pre-season practices have been ultra-competitive.   

The *only* worry I see down the road with the voters is that Amherst isn't the quickest bunch of athletes I've ever seen. I try to watch every game that two DIII WBB teams play: One east coast & one west coast: Tufts and Whitman (Walla, Walla, WA). I sure got lucky last year-both teams made the Final Four. Whitman was unbelievable all season. But they lost in the final to Florham for one reason. Because Whitman opted to play uptempo against them. Whitman could win games at any pace, and had done so all year. And they have a great coach (Michelle Ferenz). She'd witnessed in person Tufts slog through a slow, defensive Final Four struggle with Florham in the first semifinal, FDU escaping with a 3-pt win. That was *exactly* the style of game Florham detests. Lucky for Coach Berube, her teams always D up hard, and are always patient on O. Tufts simply played that day the way they always play. Even though the Jumbos' were missing Foley, they still almost won that game. In the end, it's all about matchups. Ferenz saw Florham at their worst vs Tufts - playing slow, and having no fun. So when Ferenz revved up Whitman's uptempo engine for the final, they were out-jumped, out-ran, and out-quicked like they hadn't been all year. And the difference in athleticism was made even worse for Whitman, because they had to expend an awful lot of energy to beat a returning Final Four team with 8 seniors (UW-Whitwater) in the second Final Four semi. Whereas Florham played earlier, and had expended far less energy the day before against Tufts! I've always strongly believed that the more quick and athletic a team is, the slower I want the game tempo, and the less fun I want my opponent to be having. It can be done. It takes two teams to have a true "track meet." And it's worked. If Amherst should happen to meet Florham, I'm a little worried for GP. Because Whitman had *far* more team speed last year than his does this year. Then again, he is GP Gromacki. So he'll probably know to slow it down to a crawl against Florham, should they return. It's his best chance. And I think it could just work. But that's *way* down the road. The Lord Jeffs don't start until Tuesday night, at Keene State.

Most importantly, I wish good luck and good health to all NESCAC student-athletes and fans in '14-'15!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 15, 2014, 12:16:56 PM
D3wbbfan.....nice post to start the season.  Saw a number of the Amherst players at the Homecoming football game last Sat.  The FY players were hawking the game programs...working hard and yes they are big.  Savannah dropped by the WBB tent.  It should be an interesting season.  You forgot to mention the soph center from Florida...Boyette.  Hope she is ready to give Megan a few minutes of rest.  Based on discussion with Megan's father, the Captain Robertson will be ready to go without restriction by Dec.....in time for any CAC games.  Coach G.  Knows what Meg can do, so there is time to see how the younger players work with the returnees.  Early season is the time to build a Team!
Oh yes...plus k to you.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on November 17, 2014, 05:39:49 AM
Nice start to the season for the Ephs, beating, on a neutral court, two teams who made the NCAA tourney last year.  Especially impressive was the debut of frosh Amanni Fernandez, who averaged 18 ppg off the bench in her first two games, including 27 points in yesterday's payback win over Vassar.  Fernandez and Cook should form a really strong backcourt this year.  Good to see the Ephs get wins despite foul trouble and tough shooting games from Ellen Cook and Kellie Macdonald, who had to carry last year's offense by themselves much of the year.  Once those two get going, the Ephs could be a lot more potent offensively if Fernandez can build on her debut performance.  Also good to see Katie Litman off to a good start -- she is the Ephs' only consistent post scoring threat, and losing her (or having her effectiveness curtailed) for much of last year to injury really hurt. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 18, 2014, 09:11:28 AM
Amherst opens it's season today!  It also as a preview posted on the athletic section of the website.  Enjoy! :).   I'm excited.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 19, 2014, 02:50:11 PM
Amherst opened its season with a win at Keene St.
Amherst played 10 players with two FYs getting PT.
As expected, Megan Robertson was not dressed but was given support.  From a stats point, it was an interesting game....Keene shot better from outside and overall.  amherst was much better from the foul line.  Rebounding was spread around.  It was a competative game all around.  Good start for the stll young Jeffs. :)
Oh yes...amherst won 84-67.  Writeup on the Amherst website.  Anxiou to see how the player mix in the weekend home games.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on November 19, 2014, 06:48:28 PM
Williams crushed Smith last night 89-49 and the score doesn't reflect how dominant Williams was. They were ahead 37-9, 15 minutes into the game. Smith beat the Williams' final four team a couple of years ago, so I think Manning had them keyed up. McCall, Caveney and Cook had 15 points each and Litman had 4 blocks. Fernandez is a first year that might develop into a star point guard and Fechtelkotter, another first year, looks solid . They moved the ball well. The team has great depth. I've never seen Manning sub 5 players in and out.  Babson should be a real test this weekend. Great to have NESCAC hoops back.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bsc73 on November 19, 2014, 09:31:28 PM
Smith lost 2 starters to graduation, 2 to season ending injuries and the fifth starter, a pre season All American last year, decided not to play. Not as good a win as it appears
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on November 20, 2014, 03:23:30 PM
Agree with you bsc73. Smith has a much weaker team than last year. Nevertheless, the takeaway was that Williams has real depth at every position, unlike years past . Maybe they wont be so dependent on Cook and MacDonald to carry them, since they now have many more offensive weapons: Fernandez, McCall, Caveney and Litman among them. The defensive looks good, but hard to really tell until they play better teams. With depth, maybe they can press more. We'll see...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on November 20, 2014, 04:09:48 PM
When they play Eastern Connecticut in a couple of weeks would be a good time to see how the Ephs really are.  Wins over Vassar & RIC were good, but each team lost a lot from last season; Vassar graduated the All-American Cyndi Matsuoka, RIC lost the MVP of the Little East (Vandell Andrade) AND the coach of the year in the LEC and the team had trouble generating scoring in 2014 as it was.

Eastern was the preseason pick to win the LEC this year as much like the Ephs they returned all 5 starters from a year ago, and pretty much the whole team like the Ephs as well.  Should be a fun game
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on November 22, 2014, 09:19:49 PM
Williams had a productive weekend and pasted Worcester State 64-40 and beat a good Babson team 60-49. The team depth means that new players are emerging every game. Against Worcester, Caveney went for 17 and against Babson Cook was great and put the team on her back during a critical stretch, but Uwenaka and Thompson were also important.
Can Manning can give everyone enough playing time with her deep squad. Fernandez, the FY point guard is struggling a bit in her new starting role, but she is very talented and O'Brien was the starting PG last year. How does she improve Fernandez without discouraging O'Brien and hurting the offensive and defensive flow? There are tough calls like this that must be made up and down the roster.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 22, 2014, 09:36:19 PM
Amherst reached a milestone this afternoon in its win over Mt. Holyoke in LeFrak.  It won its 99 home game.  They share that recond now with the UConn WBB team.  The UConn WBB team congratulated the Amherst team in a tweet!  Nice gesture.  Amherst hopes to break the record on Sunday.  Going for 100 wins at home.   
Oh yes, the score....Amherst scores 97 in a 40 plus win.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on November 23, 2014, 03:34:54 AM
I think Tufts, Amherst and Williams have all improved from last season. Of course, each having all their major contributors returning (except for Moynihan at Tufts) makes that statement rather un-insightful. I've also glimpsed Bowdoin twice on-line so far. They're in the same boat as the others, as to returning players, but to me they haven't yet played at nearly the level the other three clubs have just yet.

I'm very pleased to see that Coach Berube is giving a couple of talented FYs meaningful minutes early on. It's not been her first instinct to do, over the years. The two I like the best so far are 6'0" Melissa Baptista and 5'3" PG Lauren Dillon. The latter is the heir-apparent to replace the SR Morehead next year. Anything at all Dillon can give the Jumbos this year is a bonus. But Baptista can actually help them this season. Berube is also giving two other 6-footers some PT up front: JR Maura Folliard and SO Katy Hicks. I give Hicks a slight edge in the battle for the eventual frontcourt #4 person so far, after the SR Kanner/SO North/Baptista. The one backcourt player getting added time this year so far is 5'7" SO Josie Lee. Tufts can always use another 3-pt threat. Morehead will at least keep a defense honest, but Berube wants her mainly focusing on running her offense. Historically, when the sharpshooting SR, Hannah Foley, has been cold from 3, it badly hurts Tufts' overall O, as teams will normally then switch to zone D, congesting the paint. There is no one else nearly as proficient from 3 as Foley (Moynihan used to help, but she was very streaky, and she's gone), although it looks like JR Emma Roberson's worked on her 3-ball over the summer. Time will tell. If any NESCAC team feels the pressure to win big this year most, it's the Jumbos, with their 3 key seniors now having their last shot at it.

Nescacfan1, I 100% agree with you. While watching, Williams did appear to have a lot more depth this year. But after I thought about it, it really is just Fernandez new to the rotation, correct? The FY Fechtelkotter isn't getting any real minutes yet. When I see Williams play, both this year and last (Cook and Macdonald excepted), I see one thing: inconsistent performances among their players. 12 points one game; zero the next. I've thought Uwanaka's game, especially, has always been quite up and down. Coach Manning is really giving Fernandez a lot of minutes right from the get-go, isn't she? About your concerns about O'Brien possibly losing confidence from Coach starting Amanni - I think it's happened already. It's not personal. MaryKate does what she can do out there. Her best. Always has. She's reliable, but not exceptional, by a long shot. Fernandez has significant potential as a scorer, as she's already shown in one game. Increasing her team's scoring punch was clearly Pat's #1 goal this offseason. 

If Litman's physically back to being 100% (and she appears to be so far), she'll really help. I expect both Caveney and McCall to make major strides as sophs, and Thompson seems to finally know where exactly she fits in for the Ephs. I think instead of Coach Manning pulling her hair out trying to get all of her kids to be great every single day, she should just surround her two seniors with the three other players in her 8-9 player rotation who are playing the best basketball that particular day. Lessen the pressure to score on each of her role players - if the shots fall, they fall. If not, Pat will put someone else in. To me, it was as clear as a Montana night sky that the players felt a ton of pressure, to have their shots go in late last season. And they just weren't. Right now, I see this as the best way for Williams to most quickly regain their swag, and tickle the twine on O most consistently. And to best incorporate Fernandez quickly. Mostly, it'll just get the players out of their own heads, and to get back to using their muscle memory to shoot.

No more time tonight. Next blurb - my thoughts so far on Amherst. Thanks as always for reading!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on November 23, 2014, 11:43:58 AM
That was a very thoughtful post d3wbbfan. I cant comment on Tufts, not having seen them play, but you were dead on about Williams. Here's some expansion on your thesis that Williams will look for the hot players on a nightly basis to surround the seniors:
Only Cook is core. MacDonald has had an inconsistent start to the season and there is a logjam at the 4 position with McCall and the less used Fechtelkotter as very capable scorers.
Fernandez hasn't decided whether she's a point guard or a score first 2. She needs some coaching so she can make others look better. She cant make no look passes in traffic or chuck up hard shots with her teammates open, if she is to guide Williams to a big season. If her assist total goes up, then Manning is succeeding.
Manning is looking for exceptional production at the 5 and she's getting it. Litman and Uwenaka are both very strong, physical players, who can play both ways. They average together a high double double every game and they are blocking shots and guarding the rim, albeit with a lot of fouls. Both are as physically talented as any 5's in the conference, but both need PT and consistency.
At the 2 Caveney and Thompson have improved and are both playing relaxed and confident.
Cook is the 3 and she will play a lot of minutes.
We'll see how they react in really tough games, but this team may be ready to challenge tufts and amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 23, 2014, 06:37:42 PM
Amherst wins its Tourny today in a well contested game....73-63 over Baruch.  It was Amherst 100 home victory...in a row.  Interesting game in that while Amherst was still making outside shots and put in their two big FYs, the second half..in a close game...was played with the starting five that ended the last season.  Also all the scoring was done inside...no outside shots taken, I believe.
Meg Robertson was in in street clothes and the other two 6'2" players/centers were not in.  Boyette and Ford did get to play significant mins yesterday and were even in the game together...interesting.
Believe Amherst was out rebounded today.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on November 25, 2014, 09:30:32 PM
Time to add some discussion related to some of the other NESCAC teams.  Noticed that Colby is off to a 5-0 start.  However, the schedule has been very soft, and they struggled against UMASS Boston and Wellesley.  Looks like again this team will live on the three point line, as through three games, almost 50% of their shots are threes.  They are hitting a very high percentage, but we know that against the stronger NESCAC teams, that shooting % will go down significantly.  We should get a much better sense of what kind of team next week, when they play Bates, St. Joes of Me, and Bowdoin before the break. Bowdoin seems to have a strong core back from last season, although they did get beat by what is becoming a very good Roger Williams program.  Bates beat Southern Me recently, and St. Joes was a very strong team last year.
Middlebury seems to be playing well with a new Coach.  Should be another interesting year in the NESCAC
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 27, 2014, 10:45:51 AM
Maine1....thanks for the fill in info!  Nice post...plus K
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on November 28, 2014, 02:40:46 AM
Maine1, I concur with amh63. I very much appreciated reading your initial take on the NESCAC's northern members. A big reason I enjoy this forum so much is that posters consistently offer up solid, valid, balanced assessments, not just for their favorite team, but the other schools as well. That is very thoughtful, and is not often found on other basketball boards. I'm always curious as to how each league team is looking early on, and grateful for the way folks here keep the dialogue classy, the info on point, while never getting personal, and keeping the whole exercise in perspective.

I have seen Bates on-line a bit. They're undersized, but I think they'll bounce back from last season's off year and make the playoffs, at bare minimum. Coach Murphy relies heavily on his five starters: SR's Molly Brown and Kristin Calvo, JR Chelsea Nason, SO Allie Coppola and FY Bernadette Connors. Their record is 5-2 so far. Bowdoin handled them fairly easily at home last week, but Maine1 is right to bring up the Bobcats' one-point home win vs Southern Maine Tuesday. Defeating the Huskies is never easy, and is always a quality win. 

I share Maine1's feeling that it's hard to know exactly what Colby's 5-0 start means yet. I also want to see if they can win against the better quality DIII teams on the schedule. I think it's safe to say that the jury is still out on Coach Julie Veilleux, now in her 4th season. And I understand her reasoning for scheduling some winnable early games. To get her players some confidence, hoping to begin to re-establish the Mules' winning WBB culture. The school cares about its WBB program. That said, I would imagine that Coach Veilleux needs to start showing some progress here, and begin to win more games. SO Kaitlyn Nolan averages 17.6ppg, JR Carylanne Wolfington is at 13.5ppg, JR Mia Diplock adds 11.4ppg, while SR Brooke Chandor rounds out the double digit scorers, with a 10.6ppg average. The good news is that this same basic cast of characters played together all of last year. The bad news is that their record was 1-9 in conference, and 7-17 overall. When this is the case, things can go either way. Some teams learn, grow, and improve by leaps and bounds. Others stagnate, and don't improve very much at all. All I know is that the NESCAC is more exciting when all three of the Maine schools are strong.

Trinity lost most of last season's top contributors to graduation, and have struggled mightily early on. SR F Taylor Higgins is scoring at a 10.4ppg clip, but there really isn't any other player stepping up on O for Coach Davis so far. Her team gives up 68 ppg, which isn't awful, but is only scoring 48.6ppg, on average. That's just not enough points to win a team many ballgames. I not only consider the '14-'15 Bantams to be a real long shot to claim a NESCAC playoff spot, but I suspect they could easily end up finishing dead last in the conference. 

Wesleyan is 2-3 so far in '14-'15. 6'2" SO Brenna Diggins is the Cardinals' lone double-digit scorer. Three seniors (Jess Cherenza, Miller Hartsoe, and Dreisen Heath) and JR Jackie Brown are the other starters, but none are exactly tickling the twine with much frequency, averaging between 4.4 and 8.4 ppg. And with no bench production to speak of, either, Coach Mullen will surely need to have her club playing lock-down defense, if she harbors any realistic hopes of avoiding the NESCAC's bottom three this season. 

New Middlebury coach KJ Krasco has the Panthers off to an early 4-1 start (including a win at an also-rebuilding Castleton). Krasco has all 5 starters playing over 30 mpg, and her top 3 scorers are a SO (Elizabeth Knox) and two FY's (Sarah Kaufman and Sabrina Weeks.) And while they lack size overall, their other two starters are experienced veterans, in seniors Alexis Coolidge and Rachel Crews. It wouldn't shock me to see Middlebury make a legitimate run at a playoff spot this season.   

Hamilton's been relying very heavily on JR Sam Graber so far, to the tune of nearly 20ppg. Coach Michelle Collins' club is 2-3 early, and also leans very heavily on her underclassmen. The Continentals have more solid pieces than Middlebury at present, however. The third-year coach Collins has a two-season advantage in her own team's rebuilding process, vs the rookie Middlebury coach, Krasco. Hamilton surely wants to build on/repeat last year's playoff appearance. But only time will tell if they will or won't. 

Conn College lost top scorer Tara Gabelman, but do have SO Liz Malman, JR Jenna Lovett and SR Carlee Smith back. FY F Mairead Hynes, a 6-foot redhead, has slotted nicely into the 6th-man role for the Camels, and has added red hot bench point production so far, averaging over 15ppg. I've always thought Brian Wilson was an excellent coach. And while I don't see the Camels breaking into the top 4 this season, they could surely repeat their 5th place finish of a year ago.

One of these days, I promise, I'll finally get to Amherst. I can flat out be a knucklehead sometimes......
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on November 28, 2014, 09:10:55 AM
A bit more info on Eph recruit Lauren Vostal:

http://www.blair.edu/athletic-center/teampage.aspx?TeamID=1079

In October, 6-foot wing Lauren Vostal spurned several Division I schools in order to commit to Williams College–the top academic school in the country (according to US News and World Report). Lauren is an amazingly versatile player, being able to play all five positions and creating match up nightmares for her opponents; however, she is projected to play wing at Williams. Lauren has also been one of the School's top students during her Blair career, ending every marking period on Blair's High Honor Roll. She hails for Manasquan, New Jersey, and is entering her fourth season at Blair. Click here to read Lauren's ESPN profile page.

Big road game for the Ephs coming up vs. Eastern Connecticut, who hung in with Tufts and has easily beaten all other comers.  The Eph defense continues to be ridiculously stingy, just a very quick, athletic team, but the offense, while improved over last year, still has room to grow.  The Eph senior leaders Cook and MacDonald have been fairly quiet so far, and will need to lead the team with big games against the tougher opponents.  Devon Caveney seems to have made the leap and is enjoying a big sophomore year, which has helped.  Amanni Fernandez adds a dose of quickness with the ball at the point, but she has been struggling with her shot after an a fast early start ... still learning when to pick her spots and working on shot selection, but eventually she should help set up teammates for easy scores with her ability to penetrate off the bounce and lead fast breaks. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 28, 2014, 12:23:51 PM
Amherst is quiet.....Thanksgiving break ends on Sunday.  FYI, there is a video of the weekend games...more a promo for the record setting team..but does show some of the younger players in action and has Coach G providing some comments  Appears happy....with the progress of his team?  It should be noted that three players were in street clothes for the Tourny.....Meg Robertson and the two FY 5'10" guards....one from East Lyme and the other from Switzerland. 
Will be most interested in watching the upcoming contest with ECSU in LeFrak.....like comparative shopping :) Williams and Tufts will have played the Warriors in Williamatic, while Amherst will meet the strong opponent at home.  Expect Megan will be held out for that game.  The early schedule for Amherst is heavy on home games....good place to mesh and build up the team and evaluate the rotation.  Also hope Coach G continue to rotate more players....need to get the bigger front court players ready for the likes of Tufts and Williams....and to see how his team's inside game develop.  The outside game is still there.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on November 28, 2014, 08:04:07 PM
amh63, I do want to address one Amherst personnel issue, that to me, you do seem to dwell on a bit. And I know that a certain segment of basketball fans are just like you, and share this specific concern. Height. A team's tallest players, and big curiosity as to their specific roles, and PT. Gromacki will absolutely utilize Megan Robertson as much as he possibly can, once she's cleared to play. But she doesn't really have to her 100% "old self" until postseason starts. She's expected back sometime next month. For Dec & Jan, all GP needs to do is to get Meg back into game conditioning, remove the skill set rust that's always there after injury, and to assimilate her back into the team's overall flow. And many thanks, amh63, for sharing the tidbit that the two LJ FY guards are in street clothes these days - good to know.

But I'll bet you a hot dog that neither 6'2" SO Rachel Boyette nor 6'2" FY Rebecca Ford will be among the Jeffs' '14-15 top 10 players, when it comes to total minutes played. And this isn't at all a slight to either player. It's just that both 6'1" FY Hannah Hackley and 6'0" FY Jackie Nagle have a *ton* of game. Yes, neither one is as tall as Boyette or Ford are. But I don't think that means a hill of beans to Coach Gromacki. They can both very effectively play for him at the 4 and/or 5 spots. With Robertson graduating in May, I can see Boyette getting a chance to compete for more minutes next season. I do like her game. But I don't ever really see Rachel playing the major type of role for the Jeffs that I see for Hackley and Nagle. Just my opinion. I didn't mention Boyette in my earlier Amherst post. You noticed, and you seemed to think I'd omitted her in error. I hadn't. I just felt she wasn't gonna be a part of the primary '14-15 LJ rotation then. And I still don't.

One other developing player rotation situation for Amherst to keep an eye on early. Cheyenne Pritchard vs Hannah Peterson, now competing for minutes at the 2 guard. It didn't take a rocket scientist to see that Pritchard had lost her starting PG spot to Renner last season. But coaches never make a sophomore a co-captain unless they see something very special in a player. And of course, Cheyenne handled the loss of her starting position with total class. But to my eyes, Pritchard has worked extremely hard on her 3-pt shot (the proof: she's made 7 of 11 so far this year!), and her offensive game in general during the offseason. She's a much better overall player now. Early on, I've noticed that Cheyenne's basically re-claimed the late game minutes that she wasn't getting last year. So I looked to see who the player was that was getting those same minutes last year, and is now sitting. It was Peterson. I do agree with GP's decision here. And I think this is a trend that will continue. For Amherst, this is all good. Simply honest competition for PT. The best players play. Last year, once Robertson was lost, I saw Gromacki often slot in Hannah down low on the defensive end, at the 5 spot, basically out of necessity. At 5'11", Peterson was the FY best suited to take on that "emergency" role. To her credit, she embraced it, did what her team needed her to do, and did it surprisingly well. But on offense, despite her length, to me Peterson seemed the most one-dimensional FY on offense last season. She took stationary 3-pointers. Period. Early and often. Which makes her easier to guard. Never a pull-up J. Never a dribble-drive. Last season's Jeff stats aren't archived on their site anymore. But I'm certain Hannah took the most 3's on the tam. By far. And, while she certainly made her share, she could either be very hot or very cold with it. And while that can be said of almost any "shooter", it looked more extreme to me in Hannah's case. And so far this season, she's only 4-15 from 3. I also thought Peterson led the team in minutes played last year, which I mostly attributed to her needed supplemental role down low on defense.

But this is a different year. Circumstances have changed. Hackley and Nagle are here now. Both are skilled, natural frontcourt players. So while I expect Peterson to still be part of the regular rotation, I sense Hannah would do well to take the cue from her co-captain, Pritchard, and work on further expanding her offensive game. As a 5"11" guard, she'll always have a mismatch if she'll at least try to put the ball on the floor and go by somebody once in a while, and shoot from closer in. Her doing so will then force Hannah's defender to not to play up on her so much, giving her added space for more wide open 3's. It's all connected. The more a player can do offensively, the more respect a defender has to give you. Basketball 101. I haven't ever seen Peterson in the fundamental "triple threat position". As a result, she's not a multiple threat. She's just a shooter. And going forward, that skill alone may not be enough to ensure her getting the major minutes she's become accustomed to getting early in her career. Again, it's all good. These are nice problems to have. Too many good players. Just something to keep an eye on.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on November 29, 2014, 12:53:23 AM
As Eastern showed with Tufts, they are a notch below the NESCAC powers and this week should fully explain it.  Close only counts in grenades and horseshoes!  If you want to be taken seriously, you have to win these games against the top dogs in the 'CAC and lately the LEC both the men & women have failed to do that.  I don't see that changing this week (Williams @ Eastern women, Eastern @ Amherst women)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 29, 2014, 11:37:22 AM
d3wbbfan....good points and keen "eyes" all around.  Admit to less time spent on the WBB side these early days...still stuck a bit on the football board.  Many of my attachments to the WBB players are via the parents...Megan's father and Renner's father and older sister.  Even the Doswell sisters' parents.
Anyway, nice observations wrt to Cheyene.  Remember watching her during "unofficial" practice last October...she was leading the practice session.  Believe her strengths are leadership and competative nature. Both are needed on this young Amherst squad.  Agreed with you wrt to the best players in the front court.  However, I think Coach G has other plans for his "taller" and bigger front court players both long term and this season.  Rachel and Rebecca both came to Amherst as players with potential.  Their skill sets need developing..yes.  Yet, even in D3 and in the CAC, tall big front court players are desirable...to go far in the post season.  Depth is also needed in the front court.  Last season was a "painful" example of lack of depth up front..a problem for the past few years.
Having said that, PT can be most helpful to developing both Rachel and Rebecca...to use their developing skill set down low with their on the floor teammates...in actual game situations.
Amherst has shown that the outside game  is still there.  The inside game is still a work in progress, imo. I think Amherst wants to run with the best this year as well as be able to slow the game down and go with with inside set plays.  Yes, all the tools needed to make a deep run in the post season against all types of opponents.  Amherst needs depth up front..rebounds to run and defensive stops against bigger opponents.  It can be a long season if one has a short bench.  Injuries will occur and even experienced players get tired...and make resulting fouls and defensive mistakes.
Some thoughts.  Plus K to you.
7 Express...interesting comments..grenades! :).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on November 30, 2014, 12:37:53 PM
Is there anyone out there who is familiar with the Bates team this year?   My question is why FY Jackie Welch has seen zero playing time.   Is she injured?   Extremely hard to believe she would not fit into their rotation.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on November 30, 2014, 09:21:46 PM
Williams beat Eastern Connecticut 70-64, but it was not a convincing win. They were up by as much as 23 in the second half when EC started a good run and almost caught up. Cook was very good, MacDonald was in form and Caveney had a good game. The offense was ok for most of the game but there were many missed opportunities. The defense started breaking down in the latter part of the game. Litman and Uwenaka were not on the floor because Williams was in the penalty and Manning was worried about fouls. The defense depends upon contesting jump shots and guarding the rim and it was concerning to see EC's Brooks, Ritrosky and McCourt slice through the heart of the defense and score layups or pass out for uncontested shots. There is work to be done to fix the defensive rotations. Tougher teams will take full advantage of these kind of lapses.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ourtrun on December 01, 2014, 05:12:02 PM
I agree with your Williams observations, they seemed to run out of gas mid second half. My take is that it's more of a byproduct of the schedule. Seven games in fifteen  days will challenge anyone's conditioning and mental toughness. I would like to see Williams be more consistent and committed to their inside game.

On another note my friends in Norton tell me not to be surprised if Wheaton gives Tufts a good game tonight (of courses their biased but aren't we all).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 02, 2014, 09:33:51 PM
Amherst wins their 4th game in Boston ...78-67...against Emmanuel. It was a game that had a strange finish.  With less than a minute to go and Amherst with a double digit lead, Amherst gets to shoot 4 foul shots.  Seems there was another tech foul call on the Emmanuel HBC and he had to leave the game.  With 36 seconds to go, and Amherst was running out the clock.  Amherst called for a walk...standing still.   Emmanuel gets the ball with just over a second to go and hits a shot at the buzzer.  It was a strange ending to an otherwise tough game for Amherst.  Another learning experience for the young team.  Need to win away from home under different conditions.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on December 03, 2014, 11:52:57 AM
Quote from: Ourtrun on December 01, 2014, 05:12:02 PM
...Williams observations, they seemed to run out of gas mid second half. My take is that it's more of a byproduct of the schedule. Seven games in fifteen days will challenge anyone's conditioning and mental toughness.
Ourtrun, I'd like to be able to agree with you on the two points that you made here, as to why the Ephs' are struggling so far, despite their 8-0 W-L record to date, but I honestly cannot do it. I've watched more than half of their '14-'15 games so far, and my early take on Coach Manning's club was only re-confirmed by their narrow 50-45 home victory vs Skidmore Tuesday. It included more than a 10 minute drought without a single field goal in the second half. To me, the Eph team I've watched early this year is a virtual mirror image of the team I watched go only 5-5 in the league last year, get smoked by 25 by Bowdoin on the road in the NESCAC playoffs, and then lose in the first round in the NCAAs.   

At times, the Ephs can be a very difficult team to watch. Almost like root canal. Painful. Teams who fancy themselves as a legitimate Top 25 team simply cannot struggle on offense anywhere near as frequently as Williams does. Either last year or this year. I do get the exact same "Uh-oh - Ellen Cook needs to try to create here one-on-one, or else" feelings at times so far this year. God bless her, the terrific SR from Oregon gives her team every single ounce of effort and ability she possesses. Every night. And I ask myself the question, "Is Williams doing the exact same things on offense that they did over and over last season, that so often resulted in scoring droughts, but is expecting different results this year?" It honestly looks to me like Coach Manning may simply be at a loss to come up with a real solution to this problem. Hey, it can happen. I do hope she can figure it out, though, because her kids deserve it. And I do 100% agree with Ourtrun's point, about the absence of post production contributing to the Eph's woes on O.   

As of today, my eyes say that Amherst and Tufts are clearly the class of the NESCAC, with Bowdoin and Williams a couple of levels below. The NESCAC always benefits from a sky-high SOS to make their NCAA case. I see a *ton* of league games. But in my heart, I thought they only deserved to get 3 teams in the NCAAs last year. The Williams upset didn't surprise me in the least, while the Bowdoin loss did a little, simply because they hosted. And in my first "NESCAC Bracketology", I'm thinking three could be the right number again. And I say this as a NESCAC partisan.....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on December 03, 2014, 01:56:59 PM
In the best of years (even the Final Four year) Williams is never an offensive juggernaut, it seems.  Defense is the team's calling card, always has been, and it seems that the defense is even better this year than last as the team is a bit deeper with two more very good athletes added to the rotation.   It's hard to see Williams losing more than 3, max 4 games, on the rest of the schedule, which means they should get a high NCAA seed this go-around.  Williams is just really, really hard to score on, most of the time. 

On the other side of the ball, the team has enough good offensive players that they should never go in a ten minute draught against a fair to middling team.  They have beaten up on a pretty strong schedule to start the year, and I think playing 8 games in such a short time span undoubtedly diminishes some of their sharpness over the past three halves of play ... remember, they were absolutely dominating a very good Eastern Conn team that played Tufts close before they did sort of run out of gas a bit, and the tired legs thing, while not explaining ALL of the issues, has to be somewhat of a factor.  At the same time, they could, for starters, stand to do more to get the ball inside for easy baskets; Litman is a very capable player who doesn't get nearly enough touches close to the rim, and Uganakwa is also capable of pretty finishes inside if she gets the ball in the right postion.  I note that McCall's playing time has diminished and her shooting opens some things up for other players; I'm not sure why she is not playing more, but inserting her into a more prominent role may help the offense.  In general they need more consitent flow and rhythm to the offense and better ball movement, but that just never seems to be something that the team gets going consistently, regardless of the personnel. 

Perhaps the Eph women can give the Eph men a clinic on how to play lock-down defense and the Eph men can give the Eph women a clinic on how to play team-oriented offense :)> 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 03, 2014, 03:20:31 PM
Did see some of the last Williams game.  Liked the play of several of the young guards.  Cook is indeed the go to player for the EPHS...scorer, rebounder and even ball handling.  When things become tough for the younger players, it seems to me that they defer to Cook.  I have not watched enough Williams games this year and even last season, but I get the feeling that the team lacked a solid PG to set the offense last season...I did not see one this season to date.  Yes, I maybe off track here.  Will watch more EPH games.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on December 03, 2014, 05:15:13 PM
I read the last 3 comments with interest. They are very thoughtful. Here's my take on the Williams game against the Thoroughbreds (great name) last night: their defense was good on the perimeter, less good down low. Botiba, Skidmore's post and their best player, scored 16 points and had 11 rebounds. Litman and Uwenaka are very good athletic defenders, but there was no help defense to speak of until late in the game. That was the same issue as the previous game and needs to be fixed.
The offense needs to evolve from outside in, to inside out. Outside shots don't fall some nights, but layups and free-throws usually do. They certainly have the personnel to do it: Litman, MacDonald, Uwenaka, even McCall and Fechtelkotter, can all play down low and swing the ball out or play pick and roll. Cook is great and leads the team in assists, but Fernandez has not shown that she can distribute the ball to make the offense hum. Throw it into the post or play pick and roll and let the offense spread out. That would open up scoring opportunities all over the floor. They cant go 11 minutes without a field goal and win games against the top NESCAC teams. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ourtrun on December 03, 2014, 05:40:07 PM
Wow! Some great points. However I would have to STRONGLY disagree with NESCAC1 with the assessment of the final four team (I'm very biased because my daughter was on that team).  Every team at every level goes through droughts. Question is what's the root cause? Poor shot selection, inability to run the offense, or just bad luck on quality looks.  The Williams final four team played great defense (led D3 in block shots as a team), but they also played an inside out game. Utilizing their size in the post to force teams to double down created great passing lanes and space. That team could beat you inside and outside but it all started from the inside.  As far as last year, remember that Litman was out hurt most of the season and this year their working in a freshman point guard so they're going to have some short-comings. That said, if Williams can start establishing their inside game and take some pressure off of Cook, they'll be tough for anyone.

So far this year for the NESCAC I see Tufts heads and shoulders above everyone else. They have great inside game and  very good outside shooting, a well balanced attack. They also have the strongest non-league of schedule. For me it's still too early tell (too few games) what Amherst's key competitive strengths are. The guards are coming around nicely and they have some nice freshman size, but without seeing Megan play I can't put them up there with Tufts, yet.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 04, 2014, 08:18:30 PM
Amherst wins over ECSU in LeFrak 66-51.  It seems that the Warriors played their now "patented" style against the top ranked CAC teams...all losses.  Get way behind and make a strong run in the second half, only to fall short in the end.  It's harder to come from behind playing away from home.
Amherst led by 19 at the half even when the 3-point shots were not falling.  However in the second half, the Warriors step up their defense and in an 8 minute period out scored Amherst by 15 points..cutting the lead down to one basket....from a margin that was over 20.  In the end, when Amherst did hit some outside shots and the Warriors cooled off, Amherst went up by double digits.
The stats showed that both teams shot poorly...good defenses?..  The Warriors had more rebounds but Amherst had more assists, steals and 13 blocks...all needed to secure the win.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on December 04, 2014, 08:55:15 PM
amh63,
  I watched some of the Amherst-ECSU game tonite; Ali Doswell has a very nice dribble drive with a smooth pivot either way at the basket-I'd put her in the top .5% of D3 players in that one phase offensively.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on December 04, 2014, 08:56:41 PM
Quote from: Ourtrun on December 03, 2014, 05:40:07 PM
Wow! Some great points. However I would have to STRONGLY disagree with NESCAC1 with the assessment of the final four team (I'm very biased because my daughter was on that team).  Every team at every level goes through droughts. Question is what's the root cause? Poor shot selection, inability to run the offense, or just bad luck on quality looks.  The Williams final four team played great defense (led D3 in block shots as a team), but they also played an inside out game. Utilizing their size in the post to force teams to double down created great passing lanes and space. That team could beat you inside and outside but it all started from the inside.  As far as last year, remember that Litman was out hurt most of the season and this year their working in a freshman point guard so they're going to have some short-comings. That said, if Williams can start establishing their inside game and take some pressure off of Cook, they'll be tough for anyone.

So far this year for the NESCAC I see Tufts heads and shoulders above everyone else. They have great inside game and  very good outside shooting, a well balanced attack. They also have the strongest non-league of schedule. For me it's still too early tell (too few games) what Amherst's key competitive strengths are. The guards are coming around nicely and they have some nice freshman size, but without seeing Megan play I can't put them up there with Tufts, yet.

Amherst plays Tufts at LeFrak, the NESCAC game with Williams @ Williams, and I believe Tufts plays Williams @ Tufts (someone correct me if I'm wrong on that).  Could very well see another year where all 3 finish 9-1 with the loss to each other.  Bowdoin could be another surprise team, but they have road games @ Tufts and @ Williams so I don't think they'll end up holding up.  Rest of the conference looks about average.  I don't see any of the rest beating one of the top 3.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on December 04, 2014, 09:45:45 PM
If some beats Amherst at Lefrak it should be in Sports Illustrated and reported by AP-- really. Gromacki has an incredible coaching record. Since he took over the Amherst program in the 2007-8 season, the team has 18 losses-- 18 in 7+ seasons-- that's ridiculous (Full Disclaimer-- I am a Williams fan, so I got to see 3 of those losses and they all felt great, especially the one two years ago when Williams broke an 11 game losing streak to Amherst). Nevertheless, Amherst has won 101 games at home in a row, which is unprecedented in women's college basketball. This accomplishment deserves to be recognized. Gromacki is one of the most talented coaches in women's college basketball at any level. Ironically, the best chance we have to publicize his and Amherst's greatness is when this streak ends. We should make every effort to do so. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on December 04, 2014, 11:04:16 PM
 I remember St Bonaventure winning 106 in a row @ home in the early '60s in men's bball, but don't know if it was or still is a record.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on December 05, 2014, 12:42:49 AM
Quote from: nescacfan1 on December 04, 2014, 09:45:45 PM
Nevertheless, Amherst has won 101 games at home in a row, which is unprecedented in women's college basketball.

Nearly unprecedented in all of college basketball... Kentucky holds the record... though, I can't remember the number off the top of my head.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 05, 2014, 11:24:32 AM
The Kentucky record is 129....of the top of my head which is shrinking.  To lazy to check.  Maybe that is why the Bonnies record got no press?  Not to diss WBB here ...of all places.......but cannot say what WBB was like back in the 60's.  Remember  about a decade before that the ladies did not play the game like the men....6 players and no crossing mid court.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on December 06, 2014, 06:33:09 AM
Very interesting Bowdoin-Colby game today.  Colby is 7-0. and last two wins over Bates and what looks to be a decent St.Joes of Maine team a bit more impressive than first 5.  Team looks to have 3-4 legitimate three point shooters.  Very guard oriented team, spreads floor to get threes and drives.   Bowdoin is off to a strong start.  This will tell us where these two teams stand, but it looks like Colby may be gearing up for a run at one of the top four spots. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on December 06, 2014, 11:16:24 AM
I doubt it
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on December 06, 2014, 05:13:16 PM
Williams beat Wesleyan today 77-59. It was a balanced effort and, what do you know, they played an inside out game! That took the pressure off Cook (who had 11) :  Uwenaka had 17 points, McCall was hitting and had 11,  Litman got some nice buckets and Caveney was on fire and scored 18 before she went out with an ankle injury. The defense was better but they committed way too many fouls that kept the Cardinals in the game for a while. Overall an encouraging effort against a NESCAC opponent. I hope Caveney's injury is not serious; she is a key contributor.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on December 06, 2014, 09:23:45 PM
Bowdoin beat Colby at Waterville 56-48.  Bowdoin pulled away in the second half, and had a 16 point lead with one minute to go. Colby scored two late threes.  So the 7-0 bubble is burst for Colby.  Appears that Bowdoin had more balance.  Colby looks to be living and dying with the three ball. Over 50% of their field goal attempts in the game were from three, as they were 6-28.  They have been taking close to 50% of their attempts from three, and against weaker opposition that does not defend, that plan works.  As Colby starts to play the tougher NESCAC teams, they will need to develop an inside game.  Bowdoin beat Colby inside and on the boards, and looks to be the top team in Maine again.  Based on what appears to be weaker teams at Conn and Trinity, and an up and down Williams team, I expect Colby to be much more competitive this year than the last two.  Bowdoin should contend for a top four spot again.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on December 07, 2014, 01:36:57 AM
Maine1, why are you categorizing Conn College as a "weaker" NESCAC team? They were very solid last year. Gabelman was their only major player lost to graduation. They are 6-1 so far, with their only loss being an early, narrow loss at Western CT. An even game throughout, they lost by going just 1-10 as a team from 3, compared to 6 made 3's by WCSU. Any team can have a cold shooting night from distance. The Camels are also operating a bit on the fly, as they've discovered that their #1 best player is a FY: 6'0" Mairead Hynes. With four starters back, that surely wasn't their pre-season expectation. They're adjusting quickly, though, and have now inserted Hynes into their starting lineup. Conn College is far and away the strongest CT NESCAC team in '14-'15. As for Trinity and Wesleyan, it's a much different story. Both teams won't make the playoffs, and I think are each other's only chance for a conference victory. Wesleyan is the better of the two, by a nose, as I see it.

Ourtrun, you mentioned that your daughter was part of Williams' FF team in '12-'13. I'm guessing then that you must be Claire Beacher's mom or dad. Claire was the best Williams WBB player that I have ever seen. The Ephs' wouldn't have had anywhere near the level of NESCAC/NCAA success without Claire's immense contributions in the post. You should be very proud of her. I truly hope she is doing well, and is happy "out there in the real world".

Watching Tufts today on-line, it looked to me like Michela North was in street clothes, sitting on the end of the bench. She did not play today, in their easy home win over Fitchburg St. All Jumbos fans should hope that it is nothing serious. There are four players that Tufts needs to stay healthy all season, if they realistically expect to get back to the FF - and North is absolutely one of them.   

To me, all the credit to Coach Carla Berube, however. And heck, I'm no James Naismith. But she's made both of the two minor tweaks that I thought were screaming to be made last season, 100% in her own team's best interests: 1) Reducing her regular rotation from 10 to 8, and 2) Giving her most talented FYs *way* too few minutes of PT, in favor of playing much less talented, upperclassmen role players. She's simply stopped doing that this season. As a result, Berube was today able to slide her top FY, F Melissa Baptista, into North's starting spot, without Tufts missing a beat. And Baptista was up for the challenge, since she's been getting solid minutes all season, performing both consistently and at a high level. Melissa gave her coach more of that same high-level play of today: 23 minutes, 12 rebounds, 4 assists, 4 blocks and 0 personal fouls. No coach can ask for any better from a "freshie".

A final observation: it seems to me as if Colby (none) and Bates (I think I've seen a few games offered) are the only '14-'15 WBB programs in the NESCAC to not reliably stream all of their home games on-line. All I know is that if I am Coaches Veileaux or Murphy, and I'm trying to bring my programs back to their recent WBB glory, the last thing I would want to do is to give either talented recruits, or just as importantly, the *parents* of these recruits (who are often footing the bill, and always LOVE having the option to watch their daughter's games online or on demand, trust me), a good reason to *not* have my daughter go to play hoops for Colby or Bates. Why give a kid a reason to say no to attending your school, when it can be easily remedied? Sometimes it's the little things can make a difference to a HS senior. Has any of this occurred to anyone up there?   

In my extensive experience, I can confidently state that easily over 75% of *all* DIII WBB games, from coast to coast, currently offer free live streaming. (Just check the daily D3 WBB schedule page.) Locally in ME, take a quick look at Bowdoin, UNE and Southern Maine. All of these currently "upper echelon" WBB programs schools provide free video, to anyone interested in watching their games. In 2014-15, streaming video of college athletics is not a "luxury item". It's a basic "perk", already offered by the vast majority of schools. And since DIII schools obviously can't offer athletic aid to a recruit, it's nice to at least be able to say "your parents can watch all your home games from wherever - as can you, after you've graduated!" The technology has become both so inexpensive and easy to set up these days, that even many HS and youth leagues, in countless sports, are making it available. All I know is that if I were Coach Veilleux, I'd do an hour's worth of research on this, and then be inside my AD's office first thing Monday morning. Because any college AD who hasn't yet addressed/exploited the topic of providing streaming video of games is doing his school, his coaches and all of his athletes a grave disservice.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on December 07, 2014, 07:49:36 AM
My reference to Conn College being weaker was in comparison to last year.  They lost there best player, and one of the better players in the conference.  Also, we always have to be very careful with the early season records.  For example, I was skeptical of Colby's 4-0 start, as it was pretty much a cupcake schedule of weak schools.  However, solid showings against Bates and St Joes, and a respectable game against Bowdoin, leads me to believe they will be competitive this year--along with Conn College and others.

Agree 100% on the video with Colby--they need to get with the program. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ourtrun on December 07, 2014, 02:12:09 PM
I probably shouldn't have mentioned that my daughter was a member of the F4 Williams team (wouldn't want to damper the candor of the board members). That said Clair was definitely a very talented player but that wasn't her greatest strength. Her unselfish approach to the game allowed her teammates shine, a true team player. Too often coaches and causal spectators look for that one player as the "superstar" to carry the team. The reality is the it's extremely tough and rare for one player to carry an entire team to the promised land. Hoop is and will always be a team game with each player understanding their role and contribution team. That's probably why I admire Renner of Amherst. She has embraced her role as the distributor and is getting better at recognizing mismatches with each game.  My high school coach was a intense mentor and used to say, "I'd rather play a team with one superstar  then a team with five team players".

Enough of that, teams battling  for the third or fourth spot in the NESCAC. A lot of discussion has been around Conn College, Bowdoin, and Colby. I would like to add Middlebury to mix. They had a great win against a more athletic Skidmore team. Their stats aren't impressive but I like their help defense (defensive rotations) and are well coached.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on December 07, 2014, 02:59:05 PM
Outrun:

Good to have you aboard. I enjoyed interviewing Clair a couple years ago. Hope she's doing well.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ourtrun on December 07, 2014, 04:43:36 PM
Just to be clear Clair is not my daughter.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on December 09, 2014, 01:29:32 PM
Polls don't mean as much as they will later on (or that much at all, till conference play begins), but three NESCAC teams are ranked in the top 10 in the WBCA poll and 3 in the top 11 in Diii hoops. The UAA has 2, Wash U and NYU. I consider NYU a semi-NESCAC team since Cassie Loftus, their assistant coach, used to be at Williams, so that makes 3.5 ;) 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 10, 2014, 08:27:20 PM
Amherst wins over RIC tonight in LeFrak...74-35..close enough.  Believe everyone dressed got into the game for Amherst.  RIC is undersized and has a short bench.  Their first year HBC has a big job rebuilding the program.  Believe RIC beat ECSU recently.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on December 20, 2014, 05:21:04 PM
According to the Eastern University (St. Davids, PA) website (and the Ephs' own site has just now confirmed-game was in P.R.-no Live Stats/Box Score available yet), the Eagles (8-3) have upset Williams (9-1), 51-40. Game tweets from Eastern indicates it was a tie game at the half, but then Eastern grabbed and maintained their second-half lead. The Ephs finish up in San Juan Sunday, vs. Lynchburg. These "resort" DIII holiday tourney results are typically hard to obtain quickly, so I just thought I'd pass it along.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on December 22, 2014, 10:27:20 AM
That's a really big win for Eastern, which had been pretty non-descript before Nate Davis took over as coach. Meghan Nowak is a really good forward who was national rookie of the year for us three years ago.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on December 22, 2014, 01:32:56 PM
Eastern played VERY well and had a good game plan, but it was one of those games for Williams. The Ephs couldn't put the basketball in the Atlantic ocean in the second half. They went 1-14 on 3 point shots , they missed mid range shots, they missed layups--they shot 25% for the Game and the first half was better than 25%. Most of the shots were good looks. Williams could have won, but just couldn't execute. Meanwhile Eastern made 3 pointers and free throws and stayed mentally strong in the second half and deserved to win.
Williams washed the bad game taste out of their mouths the next day with a win over a tough and physical Lynchburg team. They found a new starter perhaps in Fechtelkotter who had 13 rebounds and played tough D. They still had too many turnovers.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 22, 2014, 02:20:25 PM
Amherst returns to action late Dec.....hosting a two game tournament.  Seems HBC G. Is looking forward to it....many of the other HBCs are friends...former players and/or associates.  Looking forward to see if Meg Robertson is dressed and enter any games....as well as the other injured players.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on December 28, 2014, 03:07:42 PM
Just as Williams had recently, Tufts' 14-15 WBB absorbed their first defeat of the season in the opening game of their holiday tourney down in San Juan, P.R. The Jumbos (now 8-1) fell to #6 Scranton (9-1), 52-42. North was the only Jumbo in double figures, with 14. Morehead 8, Foley 7, Baptista 4, with Kanner, Roberson and Lee adding 3 each. Scranton won the boards battle, 41-32, went 17-21 from the FT line, and were 5-11 from 3, while the Jumbos were just 3-16 from deep, and 9-13 from the line. Scranton led 24-18 at the half. The box score doesn't use the standard NCAA structure; did my best to decipher it. Tufts will take on Ohio's Baldwin-Wallace (7-2) Monday.

The only other Sunday game involving a NESCAC team has also gone final. In Daytona Beach, FL, Colby defeated Alma (MI), 80-60. Brooke Chandor hit 6 3-pointers for 18, Caitlyn Nolan and Mia Diplock each had 17, while Carylanne Wolfington added 16 for the Mules, who improve to 8-1.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on December 29, 2014, 08:14:38 PM
A very interesting Monday afternoon in the NESCAC:

SR Megan Robertson sees her first game action for Amherst since her knee injury vs Tufts last mid-season. She played 20 minutes, and led the Jeffs with 14 points. She also added 7 rebounds and 3 blocks in their 67-50 win over Drew at LeFrak. Her conditioning looked surprisingly good, considering her long layoff, which means big trouble for both the rest of the NESCAC and for the other NCAA DIII 2014-15 women's hoops title contenders, for that matter. Giddins added 13; Meredith Doswell 11. Even before her return, Amherst had an incredibly deep and talented bench - even going by Amherst's and the NESCAC's own existing high standard of excellence. And with the last of the injured FY's (5'10" G Jenna Schumacher) making her season debut for the LJ's tonight (although 6'1" FR stud Hannah Hackley was in street clothes tonight on the bench), now it's just completely unfair. If you had to start players #8 through #12 in the Amherst 2014-15 rotation, I believe they would win just about every DIII league's title across the country, short of the NWC's, MIACs and WIACs of the world. And that's truly no slight to any of those other fine DIII conferences. Don't believe me? The LJs 14-15 top 7 are Robertson/Giddins/A Doswell/Renner/Peterson/M Doswell/Pritchard. That means 8-12 you'd start JR Haley Zwecker (who would be both starting and an all-star level performer, for any other NESCAC team, including Tufts), and FR Jackie Nagle, Hackley, Schumacher and Lily Johnson. With 6'2" SO Rachel Boyette and 6'2" FY Rebecca Ford off the bench. Any DIII team would *kill* to have either Boyette or Ford on their team right now. This would be no different for Amherst than what Gromacki did last year - start 4 first-years. He finished 26-4. These four FYs are very, very good; their only fault is that their graduation timing was a year off, so now they're behind all the sophs, that's all. Amherst has assembled an absolutely mind-boggling amount of talent. (And except for Robertson and fan-favorite Taylor Smith, the entire team returns next year.) Sometimes having so few minutes available, with so much talent, can be problematic as to hurt feelings, but that will never happen at Amherst. The only possible issue is the players not fully able to get into a "game flow", with so many subs in and out. But the rotation will surely shorten for the biggest games on the Jeffs' schedule. Most of my WBB background is in DI & DII, so I can say this with complete confidence: At full strength, the Lord Jeffs would be a FF team in Division II right now, and would easily beat 80% of DI teams, as currently constructed. Of course, I want Coach Gromacki coaching them in these "up a level or two" games.....       :)

The other Monday headline has to do with Tufts. The good news? The Jumbos bounced back, defeating a solid Baldwin Wallace team, 57-44. Only seven players scored for the Jumbos, but six had between 8 and 10 points, led by Foley. Although they only went 2-9 from 3, that's not necessarily a bad thing. This team's bread and butter is Kanner and North teaming up down low. And they'll have to be better than 11-20 at the stripe, which they were today. And while the box score from P.R. had no play-by-play (so I couldn't confirm that she went out early, and did not return), the stunner is that Tufts' 4-year starting PG, Kelsey Morehead, who always leads the NESCAC in total minutes played, played just 6 minutes today, and was scoreless. And while I'm crossing my fingers that it simply was a coaching decision by Carla Berube (although I truly doubt it), any Jumbos fan should be quite concerned, and hoping that Kelsey sat out most of today's game due to nothing more than an abundance of caution, due to a "tweak" of some sort, until the team can get her checked out back in Medford. The Tufts PG-in-waiting, FY Lauren Dillon, was then pressed into service, seeing a career-high 28 minutes. She played well, chipping in 9 points and 3 assists. SO G Josie Lee also saw increased minutes, as did JR G Michelle Wu. I'll keep a watch out for further news on Kelsey Morehead. But the obvious conclusion to be drawn from the addition of Robertson for Amherst today, and the possible loss of Morehead for Tufts is a HUGE advantage to Amherst. Especially with NESCAC play almost upon us.

Finally, in Daytona Beach, FL, in a nip-and-tuck battle the entire way, Torie Sutherland hit a layup with :05 to go, snapping a 65-all tie, and giving Coast Guard (4-4) a 67-65 victory over Bates. The Mules (8-2) were led by Carylanne Wolfington's 25, but her 3-pointer at the buzzer missed the mark. Caitlyn Nolan added 14 for Bates, while the Bears were led by 20 from Meghan Fornaro, 13 from Alexi Howland, and a dozen from Sutherland.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on December 29, 2014, 08:35:59 PM
Yes, Robertson looked very good for her first game back.  Amherst will be very tough.  But sorry, I just can't give this comment much credence: "If you had to start players #8 through #12 in the Amherst 2014-15 rotation, they would easily win just about every DIII league's title across the country".   Of course we'll never have a way to know.  Maybe if Amherst waltzes to the national title, blowing out everyone by 20+, it might hold some water.  In the meantime, I think the WashU, FDU, Thomas More, Hope/Calvin, St. Thomas, etc. crowd would beg to differ and perhaps take some offense :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on December 29, 2014, 08:51:08 PM
Roundball999, I read your mind. I was editing/clarifying my 8-12 post, while standing behind it, as you posted. I do truly understand your point. Wash U is a very veteran team this year (to me, it seems like SRs Melissa Gilkey and Maddy Scheppers have been there forever! Both are great players.) And we all know their history, but the unspoken reality is that the UAA has been down a tad in recent years, come March. I am also familiar with the NYU coach, who's very quickly brought them back to the Top 25, from virtually no roster at all. But have you seen them? I have, and NYU's not *all* the way back, level-wise, just yet. I did mention the WIAC; in my mind, I lumped St. Thomas in that league by mistake - my bad. I am a *huge* fan of the Tommies' Maggie Weiers - so glad she came back to use her 5th year, which DIII players don't usually do. I'd also deleted a mention I did have for both FDU-Florham/Thomas More, as those mega-powers in one-bid leagues are surely gonna be there in March. My conference point was more about the "usual suspect" DIII Top 10 conferences. All I ask of you is an open mind. Feel free to call me out later. I'll be here to take my lumps, if deserved, I promise. I do see an absolute *ton* of DIII women's game every year, from every region. Including every single team you mentioned.

And Ronk, I saw Montclair State play Baruch Sunday. Yes, the Red Hawks still have SRs Melissa Tobie and Janitza Aquino, but they lost key contributor Nicosia Henry from last year. They're just not as good this year. Melissa Tobie had 4 fouls late vs Baruch. If Aquino didn't nail two late 3's, they might've gone down at home. That's my point: Montclair is no better than Sweet 16 this year. And if they either lose or get a substandard effort from either, they can go down at any time. And I know that Scranton just upset Tufts. But the game before, they lost to a decent Cabrini team at home, 37-35. You gotta reliably score the ball more than that with your own rims, no?     :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on December 29, 2014, 08:55:45 PM
Quote from: Roundball999 on December 29, 2014, 08:35:59 PM
Yes, Robertson looked very good for her first game back.  Amherst will be very tough.  But sorry, I just can't give this comment much credence: "If you had to start players #8 through #12 in the Amherst 2014-15 rotation, they would easily win just about every DIII league's title across the country".   Of course we'll never have a way to know.  Maybe if Amherst waltzes to the national title, blowing out everyone by 20+, it might hold some water.  In the meantime, I think the WashU, FDU, Thomas More, Hope/Calvin, St. Thomas, etc. crowd would beg to differ and perhaps take some offense :)

And Montclair St, Scranton, and Cabrini.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 30, 2014, 11:45:05 AM
Amherst had a solid win in their first game back.  Cautiously watched when Megan entered the game..with a brace on.  The Lady Jeffs were a little rusty at first, but seemed to get into a good flow as the game went on.  Agreed that Meg was running and moving well, though her shots were off.  Her time on the floor and her insertion into the game, imho, was also to let her teammates and her get familiar with each other...again.  Loved her first block.  The LeFrak crowd gave her a standing ovation when she left the floor the first time.
The two centers....Boyette and Ford, also were running the floor well and contributing.  Seemed that some emphasis was  given to get the ball inside more.  Ali Doswell, Amherst's leading outside shooter was off, but she contributed.  Amherst had 10 recorded blocks!  Drew was a little undersized compared to Amherst and their "bigs" were slow down the floor.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on December 30, 2014, 07:03:36 PM
Quote from: d3wbbfan on December 29, 2014, 08:51:08 PM
Roundball999, I read your mind. I was editing/clarifying my 8-12 post, while standing behind it, as you posted. I do truly understand your point. Wash U is a very veteran team this year (to me, it seems like SRs Melissa Gilkey and Maddy Scheppers have been there forever! Both are great players.) And we all know their history, but the unspoken reality is that the UAA has been down a tad in recent years, come March. I am also familiar with the NYU coach, who's very quickly brought them back to the Top 25, from virtually no roster at all. But have you seen them? I have, and NYU's not *all* the way back, level-wise, just yet. I did mention the WIAC; in my mind, I lumped St. Thomas in that league by mistake - my bad. I am a *huge* fan of the Tommies' Maggie Weiers - so glad she came back to use her 5th year, which DIII players don't usually do. I'd also deleted a mention I did have for both FDU-Florham/Thomas More, as those mega-powers in one-bid leagues are surely gonna be there in March. My conference point was more about the "usual suspect" DIII Top 10 conferences. All I ask of you is an open mind. Feel free to call me out later. I'll be here to take my lumps, if deserved, I promise. I do see an absolute *ton* of DIII women's game every year, from every region. Including every single team you mentioned.

And Ronk, I saw Montclair State play Baruch Sunday. Yes, the Red Hawks still have SRs Melissa Tobie and Janitza Aquino, but they lost key contributor Nicosia Henry from last year. They're just not as good this year. Melissa Tobie had 4 fouls late vs Baruch. If Aquino didn't nail two late 3's, they might've gone down at home. That's my point: Montclair is no better than Sweet 16 this year. And if they either lose or get a substandard effort from either, they can go down at any time. And I know that Scranton just upset Tufts. But the game before, they lost to a decent Cabrini team at home, 37-35. You gotta reliably score the ball more than that with your own rims, no?     :)

  Yes, they should, but Cabrini's good defense and patient offense had a lot to do with that, as Thomas More found out this week.
  Even with the loss of Henry, there aren't 8 better teams in the country than Montclair. Tobie and Aquino are a year better and their frosh starters are playing well enough already.
My push back was against your idea that Amherst's 8-12 could win those conferences easily, if at all.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BruinFan on January 02, 2015, 07:05:21 PM
Quote from: d3wbbfan on December 29, 2014, 08:14:38 PM
Most of my WBB background is in DI & DII, so I can say this with complete confidence: At full strength, the Lord Jeffs would be a FF team in Division II right now, and would easily beat 80% of DI teams, as currently constructed. Of course, I want Coach Gromacki coaching them in these "up a level or two" games.....       :)

Wow. Easily beat 80% of D1 teams? I don't think they would beat a single team in the Pac-12. Compete - yes, beat them - no.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on January 04, 2015, 07:35:55 PM
BruinFan, what are you doing over here in the New England region? I'm the only nut case here with "dual region citizenship!"    :)

Amherst might just give Arizona a run in the Pac-12, but I wasn't referring to the "P5" conferences. And Amherst would lose to almost all of the A-10 and Big East teams. But do you know how many low-level NCAA DI leagues there are? Painfully, I do. I was very associated with one, for well over a decade. Skip the top team or two in each, and Coach Gromacki would make some *serious* hay in these 26 DI leagues/Independents, IMHO:

-America East
-American (AAC) (UConn obviously excepted)
-Atlantic Sun
-Big Sky
-Big South
-Big West
-Colonial
-Conference USA
-Great West
-Horizon
-Ivy
-MAAC
-Mid-American
-MEAC
-Missouri Valley
-Mountain West
-Northeast
-Ohio Valley
-Patriot
-Southern
-Southland
-SWAC
-Summitt
-Sun Belt
-West Coast
-WAC
-Independents
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on January 04, 2015, 09:13:05 PM
Tufts beat Regis 57-44 Saturday. Once the advertised UNE at Bates (won by Bates, 76-72) game's alleged video link ended up being a falsehood, I switched over to watch the Jumbos. Sure enough, Kelsey Morehead was in street clothes, with one crutch helping her get around. The game recap on the Tufts' website merely stated the obvious: "Tufts was without starting point guard Kelsey Morehead". I actually see that as a good sign, however, because if it was an ACL/clear season-ending injury, team doctors would know that by now. Her apparently being "day-to-day" is 1000% better news, even if it ends up being 2-4 weeks.

I watched the PG-in-training, FY Lauren Dillon, carefully. She looked surprisingly good. She understands the offense, and knows what Coach Berube wants/expects from her. What Tufts loses most without Morehouse is her being a viable option on offense. There have been times over the years when the team has needed double-figure point production from Kelsey. And she's delivered. Dillon just doesn't seem to have that in her repertoire; at least not yet. In her own words, in a recent Tufts article, Dillon confesses, "I'm a facilitator. I always have been. I get the ball to where it needs to be."

Vs. Regis (who should again win their league easily, despite enduring a bit of a losing streak late in their non-conference sched), Berube kept watching her #1 hardest-working player, Emma Roberson, struggle. Of all the Tufts players, I'm certain Roberson has worked by far *the* hardest to get to her current skill level. This girl absolutely loves basketball, and oozes determination and intensity. She has a rep as a top perimeter defender. And she is. But she is a player who has a certain characteristic that I do see turn up once in a while. She is very fast, but she is not very quick. They are two entirely different things. She's also very "choppy", while both moving laterally, and driving to the goal. I've seen her man blow right past her, and score on at least 3 occasions. Roberson had done her best. Think MLB HOF Brooks Robinson. Very slow runner. But as an Oriole 3B, for 2-3 steps either way, he was *lightning* quick. He had great reflexes, possessed the world-class quickness to be a 15-time All-Star, but couldn't run a lick. He's the exact opposite of Roberson. Emma has worked tirelessly on both her 3-pt shooting and her slashing ability. This kid wants to be good in the *worst* way, and has absolutely put the time in. In other words, she's a coaches' dream. She deserves the payoff. And I want it for her. The only problem is that all of Emma's hard work on offense hasn't really paid off for her at all. I swear I've seen her hit the side of the backboard on at least 8 different corner 3-pt attempts so far. And she hasn't taken all that many. That's a lot. Sadly, she's also launched a troubling number of air balls that have missed the rim by a country mile. And when Roberson sees an opening, and decides to drive to the goal, the ultra-determined JR gives it all she's got, but she never manages to separate herself from her man, and always chucks up a prayer of a shot, that never comes close. And usually without even locking onto the rim with her eyes before releasing the ball. EVERY shot she takes has been a good shot, 100% within the Jumbo offense. All Carla can do is clap her hands, and hope for better from her next time. I only hope my absolute respect for this player has come through here. My only point is that this is a *results* business. And I believe the correct decision is about to be made here, by Coach Berube.

Roberson currently starts. Whenever she's subbed out, it's always for the same player. Josie Lee. The 5'7" SO from ME was nailed to the Tufts bench all of last year. But she's been in the regular rotation all season, and deservedly so. She's played consistently well. To me, she plays perimeter defense just as well as Roberson does. (And I see this is Roberson's best single skill.) Lee has the exact same "drive to the goal" move in her repertoire that Emma attempts once/twice every game, without success. But Josie's effort is smooth and quick. She usually gets the needed separation from her man, and she usually makes the shot. Josie Lee shoots 31% from 3. Emma Roberson shoots 19% from 3. And if Dillon is gonna have to play big minutes, she provides far less points than Morehead would have. Berube is gonna need to make up that difference somewhere. The answer is obvious: Lee in, Roberson out. Even I would still start Emma. Even I don't have the heart to hurt her that way. But Lee's gonna have to be the one in there at the end of games for Tufts. To boot, Josie made two *pinpoint* inbound passes to the post Sat, for two easy layups, both inside of 3:00. And even if Kelsey does return soon, it's not like the Jumbos can't use/don't need another solid points option under 6'2" anymore. They surely will.

My point: three different times in the second half, with Regis staying within single digits, it become patently obvious that when Emma was in, the team was struggling. And when Lee replaced her, the team functioned far better. So much so, that in the final 6-7 minutes vs Regis, Berube correctly went with Lee, and sat Roberson. I think Coach Berube has been allocating her player's minutes in a brilliant manner this season. I did second guess her at times last season. So when I think she's 100% "on it" this season, she also deserves my most sincere praise. Get better soon Kelsey!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on January 05, 2015, 04:52:20 PM
Amherst wins on the road, beating Arcadia (PA) 74-50, in a non-conference Monday matinee. An early 3-pt barrage gave the LJs an early 21-1 lead just 4:00 in, but they struggled to maintain much offensive flow from there, allowing the Knights to narrow the halftime gap to just 11.

SR C Megan Robertson appeared rusty in just her second game of the season back from injury, shooting 4-12 from the field and 0-3 from the line. But 17 more minutes of valuable PT today surely helped her make more progress, in preparation for the important NESCAC games ahead.

Hannah Peterson led Amherst (10-0) with 17; Jaimie Renner had 12, including 3 3's, while Ali Doswell added 11. JR F Addy Crenny led Arcadia (6-6) with 15 points.

The Lord Jeffs' road trip wraps up tomorrow Tuesday at 4PM, as Amherst takes on the Rams of Farmingdale State (4-6) in New York. 

In other Monday games, Williams (11-1) hosted UMass-Dartmouth, and came out on top, 78-59. Ellen Cook was on fire all game, finishing with 33 points on 12-15 from the field, and was 5-6 from 3. The Ephs scored a season-high 41 points in the opening stanza, yet only led the Corsairs by 3 at the break, as UMD held a huge early advantage in points off turnovers. Williams was able to take much better care of the ball in the second half, while still scoring plenty, to pull away for the victory. 3 others reached double figures for Williams (Macdonald and Fernandez 11; Litman 10), while Alicia Kutil and Meghan Ronaghan paced Dartmouth (7-3) with 16 each.

Tufts was able to prevent a repeat of last year's upset home loss to Babson, prevailing tonight in Babson Park by a final of 57-43. The Jumbos led tonight at the break 34-20, but had led the Beavers by as many as 19 a year ago, before they stormed back for the come-from-behind 6-pt road win. Michela North lead Tufts (11-1) with 19, FY PG Lauren Dillon, currently filling in for the injured Kelsey Morehead, posted a career-high 15, including 3 3's, while Hayley Kanner hit for 13. Linnett Graber was the leading scorer for Babson (6-5) with 9.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on January 05, 2015, 07:34:26 PM
Cook was truly amazing for Williams and made many tough shots in her 12-15 shooting performance for 33 points--  and she played within the offensive scheme. It was one of the best outings I have seen from her and probably a career high. Litman had 10 points, 9 rebounds and 3 blocks and Macdonald and Fernandez had 11 points each and 11 assists between them. Caveney was back and scored 9 on 3-10 shooting. Williams had a poor defensive first half and committed 10 turnovers but really locked down UMD in the second half, limiting them to 24% shooting.
It's hard to say how Williams will perform when conference play starts this weekend. They are very talented and deep, but we'll see if they can play consistently enough to really challenge for a NESCAC title. Last year they lost to both Trinity and Amherst, but they are significantly better this year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on January 05, 2015, 07:51:03 PM
In an epiphany, I think the Ephs have taken on the character of their first year point guard, Fernandez. They are the "Guardians of the Galaxy" team -- a little bit good, a little bit bad and a little bit of both-- usually within the same game! Fernandez is immensely talented and if she plays to her potential the Ephs will go far... 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 05, 2015, 09:32:05 PM
Got a chance to watch most of the Amherst Game and most of the second half of the Williams game at home.
Have to thank d3wbbfan for the nice post of the Amherst win in PA.  Nothing much to add except that all the players dressed...14..played.  The writeup of the game on the Amherst website cited that Meg Robertson with her 4 blocks in the game now holds the Amherst all time record.  Her offense maybe " rusty" but her defense is fine.
nescacfan1...agreed that your FY guard is a bundle of energy.  However your comparison of the team to the movie characters..Guardians of the Universe...is a little confusing. I have the DVD of the movie even...recommended by my grown son.  Guess it is a generation thing. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: toad22 on January 05, 2015, 11:47:23 PM
I was at the Williams game tonight, and there were a number of parts of that game when I would say that I have never seen a Williams Womens' team play so well. They are capable of superior play, they are also capable of pretty mediocre play. I guess it is time to see which team will prevail. I don't think any team in the NESCAC that should take them lightly. They are a seriously explosive team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on January 06, 2015, 05:33:23 PM
Out on Long Island Tuesday afternoon, Amherst (11-0) easily defeated Farmingdale State, 67-40. SR C Megan Robertson led the way for the Lord Jeffs with 16 points, including the 1000th of her career. She also added 9 rebounds off the bench, and impressively rejected 2 consecutive Ram shots in the waning seconds of the opening half, which Amherst led 36-17. A Robertson FT line jumper ended a 14-0 game-opening LJ run. Marley Giddins and Ali Doswell each added 11 points in the victory. The Rams (4-7), out of the Skyline Conference, were led by 10 points each from SR Nicole Lanteri and JR Andrea Desvignes, despite the latter battlling through a tough 3-18 shooting day.

Best PA announcing of the season, however. The Ram student announcer must have his Amherst transfer papers in the works    :)     as he was quick, entertaining and witty. He came up with numerous gems, even during visitor scores, such as "3 for 5" on a Hannah Peterson 3, "3 to 4" on a Renner-to-Giddens hoop, and "1-2-3 for 23" on an Ali Doswell 3, just to name a few. He put a smile on my face. I appreciate it when a kid can turn what was surely his work study job into something creative and fun, without going over the line.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on January 07, 2015, 03:25:50 AM
I checked back a few pages to see if there had been any earlier chat on this topic.  NE Jeffs Fan and Amh63 did so briefly.  I notice a few posters here I recognize from the MBB  board so I know I am not alone in being interested in  both the men and women's games.  Does anyone know why the NESCAC made such an absurd decision to play men's and women's conference games at the same time and on opposing courts?  I used to enjoy seeing both teams play but my top loyalty is to the men's program.  If I can watch an away contest on my computer I'm not going to attend the women's game going on locally at the same time.  This decision is counter-productive to both programs like Amherst where a string of highly successful seasons has created an enthusiastic fan base that more than likely includes fans of the men's team as well, and programs trying to build or enlarge their existing ones.   Middlebury, after several lackluster seasons has a new HC and a team off to a rather successful start.  On one of local fans few chances to watch both teams play the women came back from a double digit deficit to beat Skidmore in OT.  The OT meant that more than a few fans showing up just for the later mens' contest witnessed the exciting last few minutes.  That's how interest is generated but with the new scheduling it's all for naught.  NESCAC schools pride themselves on their high academic standards.  This  administrative decision is, in a word, DUMB.  Spread the word.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 07, 2015, 10:41:17 AM
Vandy 74....good for you!   Plus K.  Thought about posting on the point, especially since Amherst plays Williams this Sat!  I posted in the pre season about it, but let it go.  Did see that Middlebury WBB team followed the MBB game in Plattsburg last night.  Good for the Panthers....figured it was to have both teams on the same bus :).   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on January 07, 2015, 02:55:52 PM
Quote from: Vandy74 on January 07, 2015, 03:25:50 AM
I checked back a few pages to see if there had been any earlier chat on this topic.  NE Jeffs Fan and Amh63 did so briefly.  I notice a few posters here I recognize from the MBB  board so I know I am not alone in being interested I  both the men and women's games.  Does anyone know why the NESCAC made such an absurd decision to play men's and women's conference games at the same time and on opposing courts?  I used to enjoy seeing both teams play but my top loyalty is to the men's program.  If I can watch an away contest on my computer I'm not going to attend the women's game going on locally at the same time.  This decision is counter-productive to both programs like Amherst where a string of highly successful seasons has created an enthusiastic fan base that more than likely includes fans of the men's team as well, and programs trying to build or enlarge their existing ones.   Middlebury, after several lackluster seasons has a new HC and a team off to a rather successful start.  On one of local fans few chances to watch both teams play the women came back from a double digit deficit to beat Skidmore in OT.  The OT meant that more than a few fans showing up just for the later mens' contest witnessed the exciting last few minutes.  That's how interest is generated but with the new scheduling it's all for naught.  NESCAC schools pride themselves on their high academic standards.  This  administrative decision is, in a word, DUMB.  Spread the word.

Wisconsin-Stevens Point has 2 separate courts: 1 used by the women's team only and the other used by the men's team only so they always play at separate venues (i.e. when the men's team is at home, women are on the road; men on the road women at home).  Not sure what other conferences do that.  I thought most conferences shared the same bus.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 07, 2015, 03:03:39 PM
  Scranton and the Landmark play at opposite venues at the same time for the midweek, shorter-travel conference games, and have the doubleheaders for the Saturday, longest-travel games, sharing the bus this year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 08, 2015, 01:46:24 PM
I used to love the energy in LeFrak as one team came off the floor and the other team came on the floor.  Being a fan of both, the new schedule really puts a cramp in that.  One year the men played first, the next the women played first.  Really was a nice balance!  Sorry to see it go by the wayside.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on January 08, 2015, 02:02:17 PM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on January 08, 2015, 01:46:24 PM
I used to love the energy in LeFrak as one team came off the floor and the other team came on the floor.  Being a fan of both, the new schedule really puts a cramp in that.  One year the men played first, the next the women played first.  Really was a nice balance!  Sorry to see it go by the wayside.

Agreed. :(
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 09, 2015, 11:37:09 AM
Does not help in my visits to watch live games.....but I have figured it out watching online!  A little slow...but I will have one game on my tablet and the other game on the computer in my office.  Have yet to figure out the way to get a game onto my TV.  Will talk to my SMART son when he and his wife pay a visit next week...actUally both sons are smarter than me wrt to this new tech stuff.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 10, 2015, 01:05:07 PM
Amherst's 105th home win over Hamilton last night is covered on the Amherst website.  Just wanted to note here that Meg Robertson set another record in her brief time on the floor.  She broke the 700 RBs milestone and now has 703...got 4 last night.  The last "injured" Jeff returned to the floor last night and played like she missed the action....good to see.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on January 10, 2015, 03:42:43 PM
Since there are no Live Stats offered for this one, I thought I'd post that Amherst (13-0, 2-0 NESCAC) beat Williams (12-2, 1-1 NESCAC) at LeFrak, 77-51. The LJs got out to early leads of 9-2, 21-5, and 40-18. (Williams had to burn 2 TO's in the process.) It took an Ellen Cook right corner 3 at the buzzer (Williams' only trey of the half) to reduce the Eph locker room deficit to 21. I know Coach Manning prides herself on her team's superior defense, but it just didn't display itself at all in the opening stanza, as Amherst had numerous open looks, both driving and from 3. I only remember one offensive board by Williams the entire half. Otherwise, it was one-shot-and-done for the Ephs, who scored all but a couple of FGs by driving to the hoop themselves. The Ephs' defense in the 2nd half was very much improved, and more typical of their usual team D, but it was too late, as they could narrow their deficit to no lower than 17, at 46-29 and and 53-36. To me, Katie Litman was extremely active, and far and away the best Eph performer on the afternoon, but without stats yet I can't accurately provide point breakdowns for either club. Coach Gromacki went with a tight, 7-player rotation (starters Giddens, Ali & Meredith Doswell, Jaimie Renner and Hannah Peterson, with only Megan Robertson and Cheyenne Pritchard off his bench), until around the 3:00 mark to go.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on January 10, 2015, 05:11:37 PM
Middlebury opened conference play with a 65-56 victory over Bates in Pepin last evening bringing their record on the season to 8-4.  A solid performance all around with four starters playing at least 38 minutes.  Elizabeth Knox lead scorers with 21 while Alexis Coolidge and Sarah Kaufman chipped in 16 and 14 respectively.  Kaufman also pulled down 14 boards.  Siobhan O'Sullivan added 6 points to go with with 11 rebounds, 4 assists and 3 steals.  Coming off the bench for the first time this season, possibly a victim of the same stomach flu bug that hit the men's team this week, South Burlington (VT) H. S. product Rachel Crews played 23 minutes contributing 8 points and 3 rebounds.  To repeat, it's a shame the new scheduling format seldom has the men and women playing on the same court on nights they face the same opponent.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 11, 2015, 07:56:53 AM
After the first weekend of league play, we have a better sense of how teams stack up.  Clearly appears that Amherst (surprise) is at the top of the league.  Bowdoin and Tufts would seem to be at the upper level.  Will need to see more of Williams as the season goes on but would definitely have them in the top four.  The next group will probably change over the course of the season, although Trinity and Bates both look to be weak, as does Wesleyan.  Middlebury had a good win over Bates, and Colby split with Conn College and Wesleyan. Season as usual promises to be interesting and I expect to see a lot of close games among particularly the 5-11 teams in the conference
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on January 11, 2015, 09:59:09 AM
The Amherst - Williams game was decided in the first two minutes of the game. Williams won the tip and immediately got a good look near the basket--miss. second trip--close shot--miss, third trip--great look from 10 ft--miss, fourth trip --right side layup miss. By that time Amherst was up by 8 and Williams started pressing. Williams actually took more shots than Amherst the first half but after the first series the shots became less selective and the ball stopped moving. Meanwhile Amherst sliced Williams up with pretty give and go's and drive kick outs and shot over 60% in the first half. And that, as they say, was the ball game. Credit Amherst for being prepared and putting the petal to the metal early in the first half. It was a great performance by Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 11, 2015, 10:10:32 AM
Maine1.... Nice points and most helpful since I do not study the Colby's and Middlebury's much....sorry Vandy.  Seems that you are a fan of Bowdoin...as I am, though I believe they will not challenge Amherst.  My major focus presently is Tufts and Williams, though I am thinking the Ephs maybe more of a paper tiger after the game in LeFrak.....blowout win for Amherst with limited...but effective...play by Meg Robertson.  Actually, Hamilton played better than Williams in LeFrak, imo.
Amherst has a long, long road ahead...away games.  I suspect Coach G will rotate more young players in the games, especially the front court players.
Anyway, am curious to see how Tufts play in Vt today.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 11, 2015, 12:20:26 PM
I was almost ready to be much more positive on Colby, but I did watch their Game with Conn College.  I thought Colby had more talent, but Conn College played them smart.  Really challenged every three (Colby is still highly dependent on 3s).  As long as Colby relies on the three as their primary offense, they will be challenged against better teams.

On another matter, I noticed some posts on the end of the Men and Women playing at the same location.  The current arrangement (with Men and Women playing different schedules) is what the NESCAC had done about 6 years ago and prior, so they are back to the old way.  Not exactly sure what is driving this, as certainly having the teams travel together had to be much more cost efficient. And in many of the schools, particularly when the Women played first, it made for a bigger crowd at the end of the Women's games
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on January 11, 2015, 08:13:58 PM
Middlebury (8-5, 1-1 NESCAC) managed to stay even with Tufts for a half (23-all), but an 18-2 Jumbo run over the last 10 minutes resulted in a 57-37 victory over the Panthers Sunday in Vermont. SR Hayley Kanner scored 19 on 8-16 shooting, and to her credit, really put the team on her back during the big 2nd half run. JR Emma Roberson added a season-high 13 for Tufts (12-1, 1-0 NESCAC), while SO Michela North chipped in with 10. SR F Rachel Crews was the lone Panther in double-digits, posting 14.

I absolutely love the job first-year Middlebury coach KJ Krasco is doing. This team is on the rise on the NESCAC - mark my words. The Panthers play physical (in a good way), they get on the floor/compete for every rebound and loose ball, they take good shots, pass the ball well, run good stuff on offense, and they have a couple of kids who can skillfully drive to the goal and convert. It was pretty clear this afternoon that they simply ran out of gas late. FR PG Sarah Kaufman (who's gonna be really good) played the full 40, had 7 assists and 7 rebounds, but struggled with her shot, going 3-17. A lot of those misses were surely just fatigue. Crews played 39, SO F Elizabeth Knox (whose game I also like a lot) played 38, while SR G Alexis Coolidge logged 33. Krasco can absolutely build around Knox and Kaufman, and once she gets a recruiting class or two under her belt and is able to go at least 7 deep, I see Middlebury as a Top 5 NESCAC team. It all depends on how quickly she can get that done. I'm betting on quickly. Middlebury is not afraid, they play tough defense, and they are extremely well coached. That combo will be winning them lots of NESCAC games, much sooner than later.

I finally had a chance to see Bates on-line. Friday at Middlebury. I was very unimpressed with the Bobcats. Yes, they do have some talent. But are a total finesse team - in a bad way. I'm sure they are a wonderful group of young ladies. Yes, they were trying hard, and appeared to be doing exactly what they were being told to do. But they have a very methodical, almost lumbering way about the way they play. And they always play at that same pace. I just saw no fire, no emotion, and no getting on the floor for loose balls. As a result, Middlebury won every 50/50 ball/rebound. They wanted it much more than Bates. Not meaning to offend anyone - just stating what I saw. Also saw a bit of Colby vs Wesleyan (not their narrow home loss to Conn College Sat, as I was watching Amherst/Williams.) As Maine1 said, Colby is clearly a better team than Bates. But Coach Veilleux didn't seem to be very happy with her club's play in a 22-pt Friday home win vs Wesleyan. Which surprised me a bit, as she has a veteran group. Shouldn't they all be on the same page by now? I'll defer to the Maine board regulars as to specifics, however. Maybe that's just Julie's normal bench demeanor, and I'm totally mis-reading it.

Williams continues to be up and down. There's obviously no shame in losing at Amherst. Coach Manning did make one statement in the Eph postgame story that left me utterly confounded. She said that the 77-51 final score did not reflect the way the game was played. Well I watched the entire game, and I thought that the LJs *were* 26 points better than Williams on this day. If someone else out there knows what Coach Pat meant by that, I'd appreciate the help, as her point went *way* over my head!     :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on January 12, 2015, 07:57:52 AM
I feel like in the Gromacki era, when the teams are close in talent, it's very, very difficult for Williams to win, and almost impossible to win at Amherst.  From 2010-12, Amherst was just far more talented in addition to the Gromacki edge.  In 2013, I believe that Williams clearly had a better team, and while they blew Amherst out at Chandler, they lost handily at Amherst, before eeking out a neutral-court victory in the Final Four. It was a testament to Gromacki (who is easily the best coach in D3 women's hoops) that Amherst could win even one of those three games against a loaded Eph team.   In 2014, when the teams were, I thought, roughly even in talent, Williams also lost handily at Amherst, despite winning a close game in Chandler.  This year, I think, with Robertson back and a really strong sophomore class blossoming, Amherst is a bit more talented than Williams, but just a bit ... in Williamstown, I think the game will be far more even and the Ephs could conceivably pull out a win if they play well ... Amherst is just so consistently prepared and motivated, especially at home.  Williams this year, as others have said, is capable of very high highs, but has yet to find that consistent second gear in every game -- which is true of almost every college hoops team.  Which is why Amherst's run under Gromacki is so remarkable.  They basically NEVER lose to a team with lesser or roughly equal talent. 

By the way, I'm surprised amh63 wasn't all over this article:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/12/sports/ncaabasketball/at-amherst-division-iii-team-with-no-1-ambition.html 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on January 12, 2015, 08:36:48 AM
Quote from: nescac1 on January 12, 2015, 07:57:52 AM
I feel like in the Gromacki era, when the teams are close in talent, it's very, very difficult for Williams to win, and almost impossible to win at Amherst.  From 2010-12, Amherst was just far more talented in addition to the Gromacki edge.  In 2013, I believe that Williams clearly had a better team, and while they blew Amherst out at Chandler, they lost handily at Amherst, before eeking out a neutral-court victory in the Final Four. It was a testament to Gromacki (who is easily the best coach in D3 women's hoops) that Amherst could win even one of those three games against a loaded Eph team.   In 2014, when the teams were, I thought, roughly even in talent, Williams also lost handily at Amherst, despite winning a close game in Chandler.  This year, I think, with Robertson back and a really strong sophomore class blossoming, Amherst is a bit more talented than Williams, but just a bit ... in Williamstown, I think the game will be far more even and the Ephs could conceivably pull out a win if they play well ... Amherst is just so consistently prepared and motivated, especially at home.  Williams this year, as others have said, is capable of very high highs, but has yet to find that consistent second gear in every game -- which is true of almost every college hoops team.  Which is why Amherst's run under Gromacki is so remarkable.  They basically NEVER lose to a team with lesser or roughly equal talent. 

By the way, I'm surprised amh63 wasn't all over this article:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/12/sports/ncaabasketball/at-amherst-division-iii-team-with-no-1-ambition.html 

Just have to take issue with the "easily the best coach in D3 women's hoops" comment.  No doubt Gromacki is a fabulous D3 coach but there are others in that top echelon too.  One example would be Hope's Brian Morehouse, winning percentage over 19 seasons very similar to Gromacki while typically playing a tougher SoS.  Really hard to compare D3 coaches playing in different leagues and regions, but the "easily" portion of the comment doesn't hold water imo.

Not to say that I don't admire Gromacki greatly.  He does a great coaching job and is a smart recruiter, among other things going after girls who may be Ivy candidates athletically and academically but who may not want the time commitment involved in even non-scholarship D1 athletics.  Very smart recruiting niche.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on January 12, 2015, 11:19:40 AM
The thing with Gromacki, though, is wherever he has gone, he has immediately made the program a contender in an incredibly short time span (he elevated two other nondescript D3 programs into elite programs once he arrived, and they quickly fell off after he left).  He inherited an Amherst team that was mediocre at best, hadn't beaten Williams in years and never contended for even a NESCAC title, and with the talent on hand plus one recruiting class, almost immediately made them a national championship contender.  I've never seen anything like it, in any sport, in NESCAC.  Hope hasn't been in a Final Four since 2010; since that time, Gromacki has led Amherst to three final fours and a national title.  Gromacki, regardless of who graduates, has his team in Salem [edit, whatever the women's equivalent is] basically every year.  He is the Geno of D3 hoops.  As a Williams fan, I wish it weren't so, but no one is even close in terms of his ability to get immediate results, no matter who the players are, and no matter where he coaches. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 12, 2015, 11:41:39 AM
Nescac1.....thanks for putting up the link on this board.  Actually just finished reading the article online via an Amherst Twitter.  A late riser and NOT a NYT reader for decades.....was alerted of the article via a phone call from my oldest Amherst son who resides in Brooklyn.
Suggest Roundball read the article for info and why many consider Coach G  a top D3 WBB coach.  For others, it gives some history of the Williams - Amherst rivalry, Coach G, and in particular Megan Robertson.  It should be noted that Williams won in Willytown last season without Meg, IMO.  Meg went down early in the Tufts game last season in Medford...losing Amherst's chance to host the conf. Tourny.  Her lost was also a reason that Amherst missed another final four trip.   Considering that last season, the sophs leading the  team this year were FYs and Amherst brought in another big talented FY class...the present team's goal is a possibility.
Oh yes, Williams HBC is quoted several times in the article. 
D3wbbfan....can not help you with P. Manning's quotes. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 12, 2015, 12:57:42 PM
Quote from: Roundball999 on January 12, 2015, 08:36:48 AM
Quote from: nescac1 on January 12, 2015, 07:57:52 AM
I feel like in the Gromacki era, when the teams are close in talent, it's very, very difficult for Williams to win, and almost impossible to win at Amherst.  From 2010-12, Amherst was just far more talented in addition to the Gromacki edge.  In 2013, I believe that Williams clearly had a better team, and while they blew Amherst out at Chandler, they lost handily at Amherst, before eeking out a neutral-court victory in the Final Four. It was a testament to Gromacki (who is easily the best coach in D3 women's hoops) that Amherst could win even one of those three games against a loaded Eph team.   In 2014, when the teams were, I thought, roughly even in talent, Williams also lost handily at Amherst, despite winning a close game in Chandler.  This year, I think, with Robertson back and a really strong sophomore class blossoming, Amherst is a bit more talented than Williams, but just a bit ... in Williamstown, I think the game will be far more even and the Ephs could conceivably pull out a win if they play well ... Amherst is just so consistently prepared and motivated, especially at home.  Williams this year, as others have said, is capable of very high highs, but has yet to find that consistent second gear in every game -- which is true of almost every college hoops team.  Which is why Amherst's run under Gromacki is so remarkable.  They basically NEVER lose to a team with lesser or roughly equal talent. 

By the way, I'm surprised amh63 wasn't all over this article:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/12/sports/ncaabasketball/at-amherst-division-iii-team-with-no-1-ambition.html 

Just have to take issue with the "easily the best coach in D3 women's hoops" comment.  No doubt Gromacki is a fabulous D3 coach but there are others in that top echelon too.  One example would be Hope's Brian Morehouse, winning percentage over 19 seasons very similar to Gromacki while typically playing a tougher SoS.  Really hard to compare D3 coaches playing in different leagues and regions, but the "easily" portion of the comment doesn't hold water imo.


I don't think the numbers bear out Hope having a stronger schedule, FWIW.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on January 12, 2015, 01:14:28 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 12, 2015, 12:57:42 PM
Quote from: Roundball999 on January 12, 2015, 08:36:48 AM
Quote from: nescac1 on January 12, 2015, 07:57:52 AM
I feel like in the Gromacki era, when the teams are close in talent, it's very, very difficult for Williams to win, and almost impossible to win at Amherst.  From 2010-12, Amherst was just far more talented in addition to the Gromacki edge.  In 2013, I believe that Williams clearly had a better team, and while they blew Amherst out at Chandler, they lost handily at Amherst, before eeking out a neutral-court victory in the Final Four. It was a testament to Gromacki (who is easily the best coach in D3 women's hoops) that Amherst could win even one of those three games against a loaded Eph team.   In 2014, when the teams were, I thought, roughly even in talent, Williams also lost handily at Amherst, despite winning a close game in Chandler.  This year, I think, with Robertson back and a really strong sophomore class blossoming, Amherst is a bit more talented than Williams, but just a bit ... in Williamstown, I think the game will be far more even and the Ephs could conceivably pull out a win if they play well ... Amherst is just so consistently prepared and motivated, especially at home.  Williams this year, as others have said, is capable of very high highs, but has yet to find that consistent second gear in every game -- which is true of almost every college hoops team.  Which is why Amherst's run under Gromacki is so remarkable.  They basically NEVER lose to a team with lesser or roughly equal talent. 

By the way, I'm surprised amh63 wasn't all over this article:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/12/sports/ncaabasketball/at-amherst-division-iii-team-with-no-1-ambition.html 

Just have to take issue with the "easily the best coach in D3 women's hoops" comment.  No doubt Gromacki is a fabulous D3 coach but there are others in that top echelon too.  One example would be Hope's Brian Morehouse, winning percentage over 19 seasons very similar to Gromacki while typically playing a tougher SoS.  Really hard to compare D3 coaches playing in different leagues and regions, but the "easily" portion of the comment doesn't hold water imo.


I don't think the numbers bear out Hope having a stronger schedule, FWIW.

According to Massey, at least this year the numbers do.

Amh63, as I said, no one disputes Gromacki is a great coach.  I did read the article; similar articles can and have been written about other coaches.  I just think the whole "no one is close, he's easily the best"  thinking is just hyperbole and maybe regional narrow thinking.     With respect to Hope, Morehouse has been able to build an even longer string of sustained excellence with a recruiting base which is much smaller.  Last year TWO starters went down with ACL's and the team still went undefeated and made it to the NCAA 2nd round.

Who knows who the best women's D3 coach is?  I wouldn't pretend to know but I'm quite sure there there is more than one near the top.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on January 12, 2015, 04:48:26 PM
Amherst HC GP Gromacki and his team made the 5+ hour bus trek back to his former place of employment, St. Lawrence, for a Monday matinee just 20 minutes from the Canadian border up in Canton, NY, and came away with the 68-55 road victory. Amherst led 39-27 at the break, while the two teams played a fairly even 2nd half. Overall, the Jeffs shot a sizzling 55% from the field (26-48), with frequent dribble-drives for points today's preferred offensive option. Fellow sophs and twin sisters Meredith and Ali Doswell each led Amherst (14-0; 2-0 NESCAC) with 15 points each, while Megan Robertson had her most efficient offensive effort since her recent return from an ACL injury, with 14 points on 6-8 shooting, in just 18 minutes. FY Hannah Hackley added 9 off the bench, in a season-high 21 minutes of PT. JR G Lauren Quattrocchi led the Saints (8-4; 3-1 Liberty League) with 12 points, while SR G Allison Cady scored 11.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 12, 2015, 04:54:43 PM
On a night of college football, Amherst starts with a Monday game...the first of many road trip games...at St Lawrence Un.  Coach G was the head coach at the NY university a while back  In any case, Amherst wins in a workman manner 68-55, I believe.  The lead was 21 plus in the 2nd half and was close the first part of the first half.  Meg Robertson was the difference maker.  When she entered in the first half, she jump started the Lady Jeffs with inside play.  In the 2nd half she did the same.  Amherst was playing good defense against a solid St. Lawrence team...3-0 in the Liberity League.
Good game in that if Amherst got lazy on the defensive side, the Saints made you pay. H. Hackley was impressive.  A big player that has a outside shot and can handle the ball on the run.  Often sets up outside and will drive and score inside over often shorter defenders.  Amherst is too tall and quick for St. Lawrence basically.  Reflected in the announcer's comments who often stated that the home team needs to score if they want to Stay in touch with Amherst. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 12, 2015, 06:04:27 PM
Quote from: Roundball999 on January 12, 2015, 01:14:28 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 12, 2015, 12:57:42 PM
Quote from: Roundball999 on January 12, 2015, 08:36:48 AM
Quote from: nescac1 on January 12, 2015, 07:57:52 AM
I feel like in the Gromacki era, when the teams are close in talent, it's very, very difficult for Williams to win, and almost impossible to win at Amherst.  From 2010-12, Amherst was just far more talented in addition to the Gromacki edge.  In 2013, I believe that Williams clearly had a better team, and while they blew Amherst out at Chandler, they lost handily at Amherst, before eeking out a neutral-court victory in the Final Four. It was a testament to Gromacki (who is easily the best coach in D3 women's hoops) that Amherst could win even one of those three games against a loaded Eph team.   In 2014, when the teams were, I thought, roughly even in talent, Williams also lost handily at Amherst, despite winning a close game in Chandler.  This year, I think, with Robertson back and a really strong sophomore class blossoming, Amherst is a bit more talented than Williams, but just a bit ... in Williamstown, I think the game will be far more even and the Ephs could conceivably pull out a win if they play well ... Amherst is just so consistently prepared and motivated, especially at home.  Williams this year, as others have said, is capable of very high highs, but has yet to find that consistent second gear in every game -- which is true of almost every college hoops team.  Which is why Amherst's run under Gromacki is so remarkable.  They basically NEVER lose to a team with lesser or roughly equal talent. 

By the way, I'm surprised amh63 wasn't all over this article:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/12/sports/ncaabasketball/at-amherst-division-iii-team-with-no-1-ambition.html 

Just have to take issue with the "easily the best coach in D3 women's hoops" comment.  No doubt Gromacki is a fabulous D3 coach but there are others in that top echelon too.  One example would be Hope's Brian Morehouse, winning percentage over 19 seasons very similar to Gromacki while typically playing a tougher SoS.  Really hard to compare D3 coaches playing in different leagues and regions, but the "easily" portion of the comment doesn't hold water imo.


I don't think the numbers bear out Hope having a stronger schedule, FWIW.

According to Massey, at least this year the numbers do.

Only through half of the season. Here's the season-ending SOS for Amherst and Hope over the past five years, using your preferred Massey:

2014 Amherst 46 Hope 69
2013 Hope 13 Amherst 18
2012 Amherst 26 Hope 62
2011 Amherst 21 Hope 52
2010 Amherst 20 Hope 34
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on January 12, 2015, 07:00:22 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 12, 2015, 06:04:27 PM
Quote from: Roundball999 on January 12, 2015, 01:14:28 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 12, 2015, 12:57:42 PM
Quote from: Roundball999 on January 12, 2015, 08:36:48 AM
Quote from: nescac1 on January 12, 2015, 07:57:52 AM
I feel like in the Gromacki era, when the teams are close in talent, it's very, very difficult for Williams to win, and almost impossible to win at Amherst.  From 2010-12, Amherst was just far more talented in addition to the Gromacki edge.  In 2013, I believe that Williams clearly had a better team, and while they blew Amherst out at Chandler, they lost handily at Amherst, before eeking out a neutral-court victory in the Final Four. It was a testament to Gromacki (who is easily the best coach in D3 women's hoops) that Amherst could win even one of those three games against a loaded Eph team.   In 2014, when the teams were, I thought, roughly even in talent, Williams also lost handily at Amherst, despite winning a close game in Chandler.  This year, I think, with Robertson back and a really strong sophomore class blossoming, Amherst is a bit more talented than Williams, but just a bit ... in Williamstown, I think the game will be far more even and the Ephs could conceivably pull out a win if they play well ... Amherst is just so consistently prepared and motivated, especially at home.  Williams this year, as others have said, is capable of very high highs, but has yet to find that consistent second gear in every game -- which is true of almost every college hoops team.  Which is why Amherst's run under Gromacki is so remarkable.  They basically NEVER lose to a team with lesser or roughly equal talent. 

By the way, I'm surprised amh63 wasn't all over this article:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/12/sports/ncaabasketball/at-amherst-division-iii-team-with-no-1-ambition.html 

Just have to take issue with the "easily the best coach in D3 women's hoops" comment.  No doubt Gromacki is a fabulous D3 coach but there are others in that top echelon too.  One example would be Hope's Brian Morehouse, winning percentage over 19 seasons very similar to Gromacki while typically playing a tougher SoS.  Really hard to compare D3 coaches playing in different leagues and regions, but the "easily" portion of the comment doesn't hold water imo.


I don't think the numbers bear out Hope having a stronger schedule, FWIW.

According to Massey, at least this year the numbers do.

Only through half of the season. Here's the season-ending SOS for Amherst and Hope over the past five years, using your preferred Massey:

2014 Amherst 46 Hope 69
2013 Hope 13 Amherst 18
2012 Amherst 26 Hope 62
2011 Amherst 21 Hope 52
2010 Amherst 20 Hope 34

Yes, making a deep run into the tournament definitely boosts the season ending SoS, doesn't it?  It will take another deep Amherst run and a flop by Hope for Amherst to finish with a better SoS this year.  Massey has Amherst with a 120/50 SoS current/forward and Hope at 61/41.  But I really didn't intend this to be a Amherst vs. Hope or anybody else conversation; I just took issue with a statement that puts Gromacki far above every other coach in D3.  Great coach.  There are others too.

So, are you in the "Gromacki is the best coach by far" camp?  Or did Sac get you po'ed so this is pick on MIAA week?  :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 13, 2015, 12:13:16 AM
Quote from: Roundball999 on January 12, 2015, 07:00:22 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 12, 2015, 06:04:27 PM
Quote from: Roundball999 on January 12, 2015, 01:14:28 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 12, 2015, 12:57:42 PM
Quote from: Roundball999 on January 12, 2015, 08:36:48 AM
Quote from: nescac1 on January 12, 2015, 07:57:52 AM
I feel like in the Gromacki era, when the teams are close in talent, it's very, very difficult for Williams to win, and almost impossible to win at Amherst.  From 2010-12, Amherst was just far more talented in addition to the Gromacki edge.  In 2013, I believe that Williams clearly had a better team, and while they blew Amherst out at Chandler, they lost handily at Amherst, before eeking out a neutral-court victory in the Final Four. It was a testament to Gromacki (who is easily the best coach in D3 women's hoops) that Amherst could win even one of those three games against a loaded Eph team.   In 2014, when the teams were, I thought, roughly even in talent, Williams also lost handily at Amherst, despite winning a close game in Chandler.  This year, I think, with Robertson back and a really strong sophomore class blossoming, Amherst is a bit more talented than Williams, but just a bit ... in Williamstown, I think the game will be far more even and the Ephs could conceivably pull out a win if they play well ... Amherst is just so consistently prepared and motivated, especially at home.  Williams this year, as others have said, is capable of very high highs, but has yet to find that consistent second gear in every game -- which is true of almost every college hoops team.  Which is why Amherst's run under Gromacki is so remarkable.  They basically NEVER lose to a team with lesser or roughly equal talent. 

By the way, I'm surprised amh63 wasn't all over this article:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/12/sports/ncaabasketball/at-amherst-division-iii-team-with-no-1-ambition.html 

Just have to take issue with the "easily the best coach in D3 women's hoops" comment.  No doubt Gromacki is a fabulous D3 coach but there are others in that top echelon too.  One example would be Hope's Brian Morehouse, winning percentage over 19 seasons very similar to Gromacki while typically playing a tougher SoS.  Really hard to compare D3 coaches playing in different leagues and regions, but the "easily" portion of the comment doesn't hold water imo.


I don't think the numbers bear out Hope having a stronger schedule, FWIW.

According to Massey, at least this year the numbers do.

Only through half of the season. Here's the season-ending SOS for Amherst and Hope over the past five years, using your preferred Massey:

2014 Amherst 46 Hope 69
2013 Hope 13 Amherst 18
2012 Amherst 26 Hope 62
2011 Amherst 21 Hope 52
2010 Amherst 20 Hope 34

Yes, making a deep run into the tournament definitely boosts the season ending SoS, doesn't it?  It will take another deep Amherst run and a flop by Hope for Amherst to finish with a better SoS this year.  Massey has Amherst with a 120/50 SoS current/forward and Hope at 61/41.  But I really didn't intend this to be a Amherst vs. Hope or anybody else conversation; I just took issue with a statement that puts Gromacki far above every other coach in D3.  Great coach.  There are others too.

So, are you in the "Gromacki is the best coach by far" camp? 

Nope, just pointing out that your assumption might not be borne out by the facts. Also, if you look at the SOS numbers the NCAA uses that have kept some MIAA runners-up on the sidelines, those don't bear out either.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BruinFan on January 13, 2015, 10:24:52 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 13, 2015, 12:13:16 AM
Quote from: Roundball999 on January 12, 2015, 07:00:22 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 12, 2015, 06:04:27 PM
Quote from: Roundball999 on January 12, 2015, 01:14:28 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 12, 2015, 12:57:42 PM
Quote from: Roundball999 on January 12, 2015, 08:36:48 AM
Quote from: nescac1 on January 12, 2015, 07:57:52 AM
I feel like in the Gromacki era, when the teams are close in talent, it's very, very difficult for Williams to win, and almost impossible to win at Amherst.  From 2010-12, Amherst was just far more talented in addition to the Gromacki edge.  In 2013, I believe that Williams clearly had a better team, and while they blew Amherst out at Chandler, they lost handily at Amherst, before eeking out a neutral-court victory in the Final Four. It was a testament to Gromacki (who is easily the best coach in D3 women's hoops) that Amherst could win even one of those three games against a loaded Eph team.   In 2014, when the teams were, I thought, roughly even in talent, Williams also lost handily at Amherst, despite winning a close game in Chandler.  This year, I think, with Robertson back and a really strong sophomore class blossoming, Amherst is a bit more talented than Williams, but just a bit ... in Williamstown, I think the game will be far more even and the Ephs could conceivably pull out a win if they play well ... Amherst is just so consistently prepared and motivated, especially at home.  Williams this year, as others have said, is capable of very high highs, but has yet to find that consistent second gear in every game -- which is true of almost every college hoops team.  Which is why Amherst's run under Gromacki is so remarkable.  They basically NEVER lose to a team with lesser or roughly equal talent. 

By the way, I'm surprised amh63 wasn't all over this article:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/12/sports/ncaabasketball/at-amherst-division-iii-team-with-no-1-ambition.html 

Just have to take issue with the "easily the best coach in D3 women's hoops" comment.  No doubt Gromacki is a fabulous D3 coach but there are others in that top echelon too.  One example would be Hope's Brian Morehouse, winning percentage over 19 seasons very similar to Gromacki while typically playing a tougher SoS.  Really hard to compare D3 coaches playing in different leagues and regions, but the "easily" portion of the comment doesn't hold water imo.


I don't think the numbers bear out Hope having a stronger schedule, FWIW.

According to Massey, at least this year the numbers do.

Only through half of the season. Here's the season-ending SOS for Amherst and Hope over the past five years, using your preferred Massey:

2014 Amherst 46 Hope 69
2013 Hope 13 Amherst 18
2012 Amherst 26 Hope 62
2011 Amherst 21 Hope 52
2010 Amherst 20 Hope 34

Yes, making a deep run into the tournament definitely boosts the season ending SoS, doesn't it?  It will take another deep Amherst run and a flop by Hope for Amherst to finish with a better SoS this year.  Massey has Amherst with a 120/50 SoS current/forward and Hope at 61/41.  But I really didn't intend this to be a Amherst vs. Hope or anybody else conversation; I just took issue with a statement that puts Gromacki far above every other coach in D3.  Great coach.  There are others too.

So, are you in the "Gromacki is the best coach by far" camp? 

Nope, just pointing out that your assumption might not be borne out by the facts. Also, if you look at the SOS numbers the NCAA uses that have kept some MIAA runners-up on the sidelines, those don't bear out either.

Here are some facts:

Amherst road to the Final 4 during their run of five consecutive Final 4 appearances (2008-09 through 2013-14)

Tournament Home Games:  20
Neutral/Away Games:  0

Final Four Record:  3-5
Semi-Final Record: 1-4

Last year Amherst did not get to host.
The Northwest Conference is 3-0 in semi-final games over the last six seasons.
Amherst is a regional powerhouse, no question - and represents the best the Northeast has to offer. Not sure they can be considered a national powerhouse when you factor in the home court advantage.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on January 14, 2015, 12:29:34 AM
BruinFan, for those here in the Northeast not aware, is a George Fox loyalist/Northwest Conference fan. I follow both the NESCAC and the NWC very closely, and have come to respect BruinFan's viewpoints and his quality posts over in the West region.

To me, Amherst is that highly unusual program where you can't accurately draw the "just a regional power" conclusions that you have from the numbers you cite. Here's why:

Coach Gromacki took a long-stagnant, around .500 W-L program in an already-elite DIII league, and somehow started off 17-0 in his very first season (2007-08), with a team he 100% inherited, won both the NESCAC regular-season/tournament titles (both firsts for the Amherst women), and advanced to the Sweet 16 in their very first NCAA tourney, before losing a close, 68-63 contest to defending champion DePauw, finishing with an incredible 27-3 record, as well as going undefeated at home in his initial campaign. (He's only lost one home game *ever* at Amherst, and that was when a Bowdoin desperation 3-ptr at the buzzer went in!) All this while being hired extremely late in the off-season. Who ever does that? Then, each of the next three seasons, they run into the same, legendary Wash U team: they get killed the first year ('09), they lose narrowly the second year ('10), and then finally beat the Bears the third time, as Amherst won the 2011 DIII title. Which is the exact same # of titles that Fox has so far. (By coincidence, your Bruins also beat Wash U., to win in all in 2009.)

Yes, BruinFan, George Fox/NWC teams being located out in OR/WA has absolutely hurt its NCAA hosting chances, for years now. I hate that. I don't expect many NE readers to empathize, but I do still feel your now years-old pain. Your Bruins went undefeated twice in two different regular seasons, and only got a *total* of three hosted NCAA home games, That was an absolute travesty. When Fox won it all in '09, they got a first-round bye and then only got a single home game, before the NCAA sent you guys out to Thomas More (KY) for the rounds of 16 & 8. And when Fox again ran the table in 2012 (27-0), you then only got to host the opening weekend, before being forced to fly all the way out to Virginia, for the rounds of 16 & 8. Totally unfair to both your team and your league. Again. And to the Bruins credit, they again advanced. Your road to both the 2009 title and the 2012 final was clearly harder than any of Amherst's FF journeys. I cede you that point, although I don't expect much residual sympathy from NESCAC partisans here in the Northeast.   :)   One thing Fox and Amherst do have in common is that both teams are at the absolute mercy of wherever the NCAA tells you to go play. And yes, NESCAC teams' location have clearly benefitted them, travel-wise/home game-wise, vs. the NWC. It's as obvious as night and day. Hopefully, Whitman getting to host 4 NCAA games in Walla Walla last year is finally a step in the right direction, should Fox manage to run the table for a 3rd time (or come close) in 14-15. The NCAA surely "owes you one", there's no doubt about that. Good luck. 

But when I think of GP Gromacki's astounding coaching results, which included yet another DIII FF while coaching St. Lawrence (NY), I think of the old sports phrase, "He can beat you playing with his guys, and he can beat you playing with your guys."

Just know that it is not the fault of Amherst that the team is always selected to be an NCAA host. The NESCAC is always deep and talented, and both the overall SOS numbers and other criteria that the DIII Selection Committee uses to build the brackets always grades this league's elite at/near the very top. (I will admit that even I thought the NCAA went a bit overboard on the amount of NESCAC respect last year, however.) But to assert that the Lord Jeffs suddenly become mortal once they hit the road is extremely faulty. That's like saying UConn's won 9 DI titles because they always host NCAA games. Really? Amherst has won countless NESCAC road games, at perennial powers like Tufts, Bowdoin, and Williams. But most (not all) of these games are not NCAA games, so these key road wins don't show up in your stats, as reflected. Do you know how hard it is for Amherst to book non-conference road games? Few teams want to play Amherst, even at their own gym. And when it comes to Elite Eight/Final Four game results, you'd be hard pressed to find *any* single team anywhere with a record over .500, because it requires an unusually successful season to even participate in games this late in a postseason. And these games are always against "the best of the best."   

And while I've just written a West Region post lamenting this week's Top 25, and why the NWC elite is so low, your pro-NWC, 3-0 national semifinal NCAA post 1) Involves both Whitman and two of your George Fox teams, and 2) Happens to cite/focuses the light on the *one* specific NCAA round where the NWC is superior to the NESCAC. When your George Fox team beat Amherst in the FF semi in 2012, did your 6"5" Hannah Munger *ever* have a better day shooting from the FT line in her 4 years at GFU? She shot around 50% her whole career. But she shot a very-much-not-like-her 14-16 at the FT line that day, and your Bruins won by 7. I equate it to Wilt Chamberlain during his 100-point game in 1962. He also had an unusually great day at the FT line that day. Hey, it happens. All anybody can do is tip your cap, and say that it was Hannah's day, which it was. Amherst also hasn't been too successful in FF consolation games, which I don't think should even be played, to be honest with you. But when Amherst lost two years ago in the FF, it was to *another* NESCAC team - Williams. Your stats should somehow reflect that fact. That was the best Williams team I've ever seen. And was the very same team who knocked out Whitman (of the NWC) a round or two earlier.

Finally, you said "Amherst didn't host last year." I assume you meant when the Lord Jeffs lost vs Ithaca in OT, in the 2013-14 regional semi at Tufts. (FYI, Tufts had their best year ever last year, and made their first FF.) Because the Lord Jeffs did host and win their first two rounds. But no one, I repeat no one, can do anything else but shake your head in utter amazement at what Coach Gromacki managed to accomplish with last year's team. First, he started 4 freshmen. Then his only returning starter (6'2" C Megan Robertson) tore her ACL early in the very first truly *big* game that the FYs had ever played - at Tufts. They lost. GP had to then start/play his 6th man, 5'10" SO Marley Giddins, at the 5 spot. I still don't believe what I saw Amherst achieve last season. Gromacki somehow got all of his raw frosh and his top sub to finish 26-4 in the always tough NESCAC, where 4 teams got NCAA bids, and three teams were hosts. Any other coach I know would've done cartwheels, if they'd managed even a .500 season with such youth.

I just had to provide some background to your Amherst numbers. And to express my sympathy to you for getting *far* too few NCAA home games during March 2009 and 2012, my friend. That's indisputable to me. I hope you found my Amherst background helpful.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on January 14, 2015, 12:43:53 AM
Massey currently has NESCAC as 7th rated conference with 19th SoS.  NWC is 3rd rated conference with 2nd SoS.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on January 14, 2015, 12:54:20 AM
Roundball, you already made that point in your Hope argument. Hope is a fantastic program. But the NESCAC just started league play last weekend. You can't take a snapshot today, and have it mean anything at all. 80% of its leagues games haven't been factored in yet. You get that, right? Hope's numbers always drop from early on after MIAA play wraps up, while the NESCAC's always rise significantly from now until late Feb. Just as Pat Coleman outlined to you earlier.

I must say, you are extremely, extremely, extremely passionate about your team, and its coaches. You're a terrific fan. I also think it is genius that Coach Brian continues to utilize his dad's wealth of knowledge on the bench. That's a awful lot of smarts to have access to - no wonder you guys are great every season. Stay healthy, and best of luck to your Dutch!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on January 14, 2015, 07:23:14 AM
Quote from: d3wbbfan on January 14, 2015, 12:54:20 AM
Roundball, you already made that point in your Hope argument. Hope is a fantastic program. But the NESCAC just started league play last weekend. You can't take a snapshot today, and have it mean anything at all. 80% of its leagues games haven't been factored in yet. You get that, right? Hope's numbers always drop from early on after MIAA play wraps up, while the NESCAC's always rise significantly from now until late Feb. Just as Pat Coleman outlined to you earlier.

I must say, you are extremely, extremely, extremely passionate about your team, and its coaches. You're a terrific fan. I also think it is genius that Coach Brian continues to utilize his dad's wealth of knowledge on the bench. That's a awful lot of smarts to have access to - no wonder you guys are great every season. Stay healthy, and best of luck to your Dutch!

I said nothing about Hope.  I thought the current discussion was NWC and NESCAC, which was what I posted about?

So if you  want to use a full season, thinking that snapshot at the beginning of league play is not representative, then how about for the full season last year Massey had NESCAC as 9th rated conference with 10th SoS while NWC was 1st and 1st.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on January 14, 2015, 10:06:00 AM
d3wbbfan, that post sums it up better than I ever could.  It's one thing to gradually build a powerhouse at one D3 school, and sustain excellence there -- there are plenty of examples of that, across multiple sports, in Division 3.  But I can't think of ANY coach, in any D3 team sport, who has done anything like what Gromacki has done, instantly turning three dormant / mediocre programs into national contenders, and instantly competing for national titles, every single year, with a program that had no record of success in hoops, and again, after inheriting the same players who had been a mediocre team the year prior.  I agree that last year's coaching team was particularly good -- that particular Amherst team had no business having a record like that.  Believe me, I have no vested interest in pumping Gromacki up, being an Eph fan, but I'm confident that if you traded him for any other D3 women's hoops coach (and probably many D1 coaches), he would improve the team's record instantly -- indeed, he's already done it three times!  And if you give him the talent of any top-10 team, I'd bet on him to win the title, without blinking.  From what I understand due to a variety of reasons he is likely to stick around Amherst for a long time, and that is very, very lucky for the Jeffs, because otherwise I'm certain a lot of D1 teams (including any Ivy with a vacancy) would come calling. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 14, 2015, 04:30:14 PM
Changing the topic a bit...during this quiet period before the next conference battles. There is an interesting assistand WBB coach at Conn College.......Grace Rhenquist.  she is an recent Williams grad and was an outstanding outside shooter for the Ephs.  Her blood lines are Amherst though.  Her Aunt and father are LJs alums.  The latter was a record setting player for the MBB before the 3- point shot was recognized.  Considered by many as maybe the best player ever.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on January 14, 2015, 07:22:39 PM
d3wbbfan/nescac1 etc,

As a fan of the University of Scranton Lady Royal's, I can honestly say I've seen many great coaches come into the Long Center throughout its storied history & I've also witnessed one of the best patrol the sidelines for the Lady Royal's in the recently retired Mike Strong.
However, for my money GP is clearly the best of the best.
Coach Strong won a National Championship, took his teams to 8 Final Fours, never had a losing season & I believe never finished with less than 16 wins in a season.
Pretty incredible stuff.
But, if you had to win 1 game with only 1 day to get ready... there is no question regarding who my pick is to get the most out of his talent, understand & prepare his team for the tendencies of the opponent & execute with finite  detail.
GP gets it done.
Back in 2007 when I first heard he accepted the Amherst position, I made a few predictions about the future of Amherst women's basketball on this site.
They can be reviewed on thread 43 dated 12/21/07 & thread 45 dated 1/20/08.
The hiring of GP may be the best decision Amherst has made since their trek over the Berkshire's a few years back.  ;)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bowdoin74 on January 14, 2015, 08:02:15 PM
d3wbbfan,

Re: your post at 12:29 a.m. today

"(He's only lost one home game *ever* at Amherst, and that was when a Bowdoin desperation 3-ptr at the buzzer went in!)"

Bowdoin's Leah Rubega was assisted by future NESCAC all first team Maria Nucas while being guarded by Amherst's Sarah Lehman when Rubega made the game winning layup at the buzzer at LeFrak on January 30, 2009. 

Gromacki was out coached that game by A. Shibles, who started first year and future Honorable Mention All American, Jill Henrikson, for the first time. Henrikson scored a game high 16 points.  A case could be made that the etiology of Gromacki's lone loss at home was anemic scouting. Even if you disagree, his lone loss was not due to a game winning Bowdoin desperation 3 point buzzer beater.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bowdoin74 on January 15, 2015, 06:38:30 AM
Video evidence at the 9:15 mark

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4q0pELh7n5I

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 15, 2015, 10:24:44 AM
 bowdoin74.....got it!  Amherst lost at home in a last minute layup.  Your point ..if that is it..has been made. Move on to more positive contributions to this board.  The Polar Bears have a fine team this season and a fine coach.  Any thing else you want to contribute?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on January 15, 2015, 02:08:19 PM
I don't know if Gromacki is the greatest coach at the Division III level, but he's on the short list, along with  Morehouse, Nancy Fahey at Washington U, Hoffman at DePauw and undoubtedly a couple others I'm forgetting.

What impresses me most about Gromacki is he's a tremendous program builder. Sandwiched in between his accomplishments at Amherst and St. Lawrence, he took a non-descript Hamilton team to the NCAA tournament and played Scranton tough in the second round in their gym.

FWIW, I consider the power five conferences in D3 women's hoops to be the UAA, NESCAC, CCIW, WIAC and NWC.  Having seen the best those conferences have to offer in the Final Four for over a decade , those conferences consistently produce great teams and (here's the key) its not just the same team, year after year.

There are other outstanding programs outside of those conferences -- Hope is the example I usually cite. FDU-Florham is on that list now. Scranton has been in the past.  Those teams are just as good, or in any given year, better than the top teams in the power five.  But the conferences they come from aren't as deep. 

For the MIAA to get in that conversation as a whole, someone other than Hope and Calvin has to consistently (meaning more than a year or two) compete with those programs for the conference title. The third best team in that conference is probably Trine right now and they lost to Calvin by 47.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on January 15, 2015, 02:46:04 PM
Well said Gordon, I agree in all respects. 

Just for clarity, I never intended to imply (don't think I did) that MIAA was near the top of the conferences.  I think it's been well demonstrated that Hope and Calvin are typically able to compete nationally with anyone, but I agree the MIAA needs to get deeper in order to join those ranks as a conference.  I sincerely wish that would happen.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ourtrun on January 16, 2015, 04:55:13 PM
What no predictions on the games tonight?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Hoopsinfo on January 16, 2015, 11:38:34 PM
Interesting to read the comments about Coach Gromacki here.  I beg to differ about Gromacki's coaching prowess.  I like to watch good basketball so I tuned into the Tufts - Amherst and Williams - Amherst games last year and this year.  If Gromacki is such a great coach, how did he allow his team to fall behind like they did tonight with barely a timeout.  He needed to take his best shot at attacking the inside so it would open up his outside game.  Was Giddens injured tonight?  She absolutely dominated against Williams just a week ago and more than held her own against Tufts last year.  With Robertson back, why wouldn't he team his two most dominant inside forces to counterbalance Kanner's domination on the offensive end of the floor while forcing Tufts to collapse on the inside game to open up Amherst's outside game. Hand it to tufts tonight, they played great - especially Kanner. Better coaching, in my opinion, would have kept this game close and allowed Amherst to try and pull it out at the end.  Games between two tough teams are defined by in-game adjustments by coaches.  Gromacki gets great players but against the better teams they need some in-game strategic adjustments to compete.  I look forward to the next game between Tufts and Amherst - and a more competitive game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on January 17, 2015, 01:45:21 AM
Quote from: bowdoin74 on January 14, 2015, 08:02:15 PM
d3wbbfan,

Re: your post at 12:29 a.m. today

"(He's only lost one home game *ever* at Amherst, and that was when a Bowdoin desperation 3-ptr at the buzzer went in!)"

Bowdoin's Leah Rubega was assisted by future NESCAC all first team Maria Nucas while being guarded by Amherst's Sarah Lehman when Rubega made the game winning layup at the buzzer at LeFrak on January 30, 2009. 

Gromacki was out coached that game by A. Shibles, who started first year and future Honorable Mention All American, Jill Henrikson, for the first time. Henrikson scored a game high 16 points.  A case could be made that the etiology of Gromacki's lone loss at home was anemic scouting. Even if you disagree, his lone loss was not due to a game winning Bowdoin desperation 3 point buzzer beater.
Bowdoin74, you are absolutely right and I am absolutely wrong in describing the type of game-winning shot Bowdoin hit. I meant no disrespect. Any good NESCAC fan knows how good Coach Shibles is at what she does. Some years have gone by since that game was played, and I had no idea at the time that the loss that day was going to end up being an especially memorable one, for any reason, with it now being almost six years later. I apologize to you for my faulty memory, and I thank you for correcting me on it.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on January 17, 2015, 03:35:31 AM
I hate the way the scheduling with the mens' and womens' teams works this season.  I didn't see the game, even via the computer feed but I'm very glad to see the Lady Panthers matched the men with a win tonight to go 10-5 on the season and 2-1 in the 'CAC.  A low scoring contest that saw the Panthers maintain a 4 point halftime lead enroute to a 50-46 victory.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on January 17, 2015, 03:46:11 AM
Hoopsinfo, you've only made a few posts since you've joined last year. Still, while reading them, it is crystal clear that you are a big Amherst WBB fan who is not at all a fan of Coach Gromacki's coaching ability. Which is fine. I accept that. You 100% remind me of my sister Lee. She is a lifelong, diehard, Yankee fan who, like clockwork, would call or e-mail me *every* single time Mariano Rivera ever blew a save, throughout his long career. She has always thought him to be completely worthless as a baseball player, and will continue to until the day she dies. Even in his retirement, I'm sure he's managing to do something new that's pissing Lee off. Now I will always love Lee, but I noticed that she never, ever called or e-mailed me when he did save a game, or help them win another championship. But that's just my sister's personality. She really is at her happiest only when she's complaining, but at least she's cool enough to admit exactly that to all of us. So I don't begrudge you, either. You're entitled to your opinion.    :)

To me, tonight's loss wasn't all that big a surprise. After all, three of Amherst's four losses last year all happened at the very same place: Cousens Gym, including their OT loss to Ithaca in last year's NCAAs. The 4 SO starters have yet to win there, which does play a part in the team's psyche, just as it obviously helps the LJs to play at LeFrak.

I do agree that Carla Berube clearly out-coached GP Gromacki tonight. It was no contest. Now you and I are both happen to be big Marley Giddins fans. But tonight the Jumbos didn't give her one millimeter to maneuver inside. She's unusually crafty and nimble in the paint, so Marley doesn't need much daylight to be extremely productive down low. She's just so undersized as a 4/5, what's honestly amazed me is how many points she's able to put up, game in and game out. But Tufts was on her so closely tonight, after getting the ball down low, she was "in jail" 3-4 different times, and even picked up a legit 3-second violation for it once. She also picked up two quick first-half fouls. None of that was GP's fault. Or Marley's. She's had good games against Tufts in the past. But tonight, Tufts turned up the defensive pressure, big-time, and Amherst simply had no answer. North also starts this year, giving Tufts two "legit" 6'2" twin towers. Berube played either Kanner OR North last year, whereas they now play together, making the Jumbos far tougher to deal with down low in 14-15. And Michela's understanding/overall job on the defensive end also has been much improved as a SO.

That said, I must also cut Amherst some slack here. They're trying to re-assimilate SR Megan Robertson, post-ACL, into the team's flow ASAP. It's both a challenge, and a work in progress. I could tell Gromacki was trying to speed it up, because he hardly played Giddins at all in the Monday win up at St. Lawrence, opting instead for huge minutes for Robertson, surely with the January road games at Tufts, Williams and Bowdoin on his mind. Megan's making good progress each game. I think it's important to keep the season and its ultimate goals in mind here. It's not March yet. It's only mid-January. And I think Coach Gromacki is doing exactly that. This loss didn't end his team's season. His team will learn and grow from tonight's loss. And Tufts is no slouch. They made the Final Four last year, and all of their top players returned. Berube and FY backup PG Lauren Dillon deserve further kudos for how quickly and seamlessly she's stepped in for the injured Kelsey Morehead.

I do think that, one-on-one, each of the Tufts players had a quickness advantage on the Amherst player who was guarding them tonight, and Coach Berube was able to repeatedly exploit that to her advantage. That was an astute observation by her. In hoops, most benefits come with a consequence. Amherst is a very tall team, but I would describe their overall team speed as below average. These two things do normally go hand-in-hand.     

And a little over-achieveing good fortune doesn't hurt, either. FY Melissa Baptista absolutely had the first half of her *life* Friday night. Carla has smartly reduced her primary player rotation to just 7 this season (down from 9 a year ago), with only SO Josie Lee and Baptista playing regular minutes. The experience these two have gotten has proven invaluable. Lee has had several excellent games already, and tonight it was Baptista's turn to shine. She sank the first two 3-ptrs of her college career early on, and had a toe on the line for a third long jumper that connected. And her quick hands repeatedly created havoc for the struggling LJ offense. And although she did pick up 3 early PF's in the process, her contributions tonight were 100% positive, and very significant. Baptista's unexpected spark from deep also hid the fact that Hannah Foley was cold from bonus range, and allowed Tufts to match Amherst's 1st-half 3-ptrs made, at 3 each.

So while tonight's 23-point Amherst loss was only topped by an 87-60 LJ loss to St. Thomas (MN) in the consolation game of the 2011-12 Final Four, I'm thinking Coach Gromacki still isn't quite ready to throw in the towel yet on this season. His 8-year Amherst record now drops to 221-19. And for anyone wishing that someone else were coaching their favorite team, I would only caution you to be careful what you wish for. No, he's not perfect. But he's still pretty darn good in my book. Thanks as always for reading!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bowdoin74 on January 17, 2015, 08:40:44 AM
D3wbbfan,
Thank you for your classy response.  That game is memorable to me because it was my last visit to LeFrak and the last play was unforgettable if you were there; the final play is comparable to Liz Moynihan's epic 3 at the buzzer against UNE last March.  Both final plays are noteworthy. 

Amh63,
Pouring sunlight on a game that has as much significance as Amherst's lone loss at home is a positive contribution to this board.



Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 17, 2015, 11:19:38 AM
Maybe NY Times is as bad luck as SI covers.  I think they'll bounce back today, and be ready for Tufts come tournament time.  Young teams sometimes have to learn by fire.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 17, 2015, 12:23:28 PM
Quote from: d3wbbfan on January 17, 2015, 03:46:11 AM
You 100% remind me of my sister Lee. She is a lifelong, diehard, Yankee fan who, like clockwork, would call or e-mail me *every* single time Mariano Rivera ever blew a save, throughout his long career.

Thankfully that wasn't a lot of emails!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: magicman on January 19, 2015, 07:07:02 PM
Worth mentioning on this board is the free throw shooting percentage of Marle Curle, sophomore guard for Bowdoin. The NCAA leader in free throw shooting, Kiley Shoemaker, from Wheaton (MA) has made 39 out of 41 attempts for a percentage of 95.1%. Marle has made 40 out of 41 attempts for a percentage of 97.6%, clearly the best in the country. She isn't listed on the NCAA stat sheet because you have to have a minimum of 2.5 free throws made per game. Marle is 3 made free throws short of qualifying. Her 97.6% is also better than any of the D3 Men as well. Hope she has a couple of games where she gets to the line more than 2 or 3 times to give her the numbers necessary to make the NCAA Statistical Leaders List. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on January 20, 2015, 04:12:06 PM
Not making excuses for the Jeffs loss to the Jumbos a couple weeks back but with the way the 'CAC changed up the schedule where the men & women no longer played at the same place, Amherst really got the short end of the stick having to go to Tufts 2 straight years.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on January 20, 2015, 04:27:21 PM
Quote from: magicman on January 19, 2015, 07:07:02 PM
Worth mentioning on this board is the free throw shooting percentage of Marle Curle, sophomore guard for Bowdoin. The NCAA leader in free throw shooting, Kiley Shoemaker, from Wheaton (MA) has made 39 out of 41 attempts for a percentage of 95.1%. Marle has made 40 out of 41 attempts for a percentage of 97.6%, clearly the best in the country. She isn't listed on the NCAA stat sheet because you have to have a minimum of 2.5 free throws made per game. Marle is 3 made free throws short of qualifying. Her 97.6% is also better than any of the D3 Men as well. Hope she has a couple of games where she gets to the line more than 2 or 3 times to give her the numbers necessary to make the NCAA Statistical Leaders List.

Marle Curle is it?  Curle.....Curle....now where have I heard that name before..........And you say she plays basketball?...... :D :D ;)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on January 22, 2015, 05:57:39 AM
My observations from the 1/21/15, non-NESCAC, Amherst (16-1, 3-1) (65) at Williams (51) Little Three battle:

-SR Megan Robertson started her first game this season, scored 14 pts, and played 32 minutes. She is clearly the team's vocal leader out on the floor, and with just 7 games left in the regular season, I wouldn't be surprised if she went to Coach Gromacki and said she now felt ready to reclaim her starter/full-time minutes status. Tonight Giddens basically returned to the 6th-man role she performed so well before Robertson's ACL tear, around this time last season. Marley will again prove to be a great weapon coming off the bench.

-Of note to me was how few minutes Ali Doswell played tonight. 14. Including just the first 3 minutes of the second half, never to return. Zero points. Of all their young guns, to me Ali has been the LJ's best and most consistent one, both last year and this. Assuming it to be a "healthy scratch", a move like that is what separates Gromacki from the pack. In season, he employs this tactic somewhat regularly. Experiment. Tinker. I'm convinced tonight's minutes allocation was 100% temporary, as GP already knows exactly what Ali will give him every night - great basketball. So he instead used Ali's minutes tonight to allow Renner play the full 40, while also playing JR Cheyenne Pritchard a season-high 26 minutes. (Before tonight, there was more of an either-or lineup dynamic between those two.) Playing both together does make them a quicker team, and looking ahead, a better matchup vs. Tufts. Having Renner out there is essential. Not because she's the PG (because Cheyenne can handle that job just as well as Jaimie does), but because Renner's marvelous slashing/driving ability provides a solid, necessary, late-in-the-shot-clock scoring option, to contrast with Robertson's classic 5-player post game and all the 3's GP wants his team to hoist up each night. I expect Gromacki to further "customize" his rotation this way, from here on in, to reflect the key matchups/strengths/weaknesses of that day's opponent.

-I wanted to see which player Gromacki put on Ellen Cook tonight. For the most part, it was Hannah Peterson. Cook went 2-11, 0-5 from 3, and who scored 6 of her 10 tonight at the line. And I give Hannah some credit for that (although she still plays *way* too minutes for my taste, personally. I'd much prefer seeing the FY Hackley, who to me has a much more diverse, high-level skillset than Peterson's "one-trick-pony, 3-ptr-or-bust" mentality. GP disagrees with me on that. That's OK. He's allowed to be wrong this once.  :)) But Williams' struggles as a team on O so frequently, it's sometimes hard to know if it's their opponent's doing, or if it's the Ephs' shooting themselves in the foot again. Oge Uwanaka seems to have five really good games each season, and tonight was one of them. Otherwise, the Ephs' best moments on O were one-on-one moves by Caveney, Fernandez or Cook. And while that tactic worked well for Tufts vs. Amherst, Williams is a far better matchup for the LJ's, personnel-wise. Besides, Coach Manning's team doesn't work nearly as well together as an offensive unit, or execute their stuff on O anywhere near as well as Coach Berube's does. But, in their defense, I thought Williams did a fantastic job pressing Amherst for about a 3-minute stretch late in the second half, as even with both LJ PGs in the game, the Ephs caused several Amherst turnovers and TO's to be burned. Very impressive full-court pressure. But in the end, it wasn't nearly enough.

-Williams (14-4, 2-2) has six games left - all NESCAC. They host Hamilton and Bates, and play at Wesleyan; those 3 should be wins. But they better mind their Ps and Qs against a young Middlebury squad up in VT, however, and then games at Conn College and vs Tufts in Williamstown on 2/7 are gonna both be a challenge, to say the least. They struggled to end last season, are surely hope to avoid a repeat.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 23, 2015, 11:57:37 AM
d3wbbfan....thanks for the post wrt to the Amherst Ladies.  Because of the schedule that has Amherst teams playing at different sites...and at Tufts two years in a row....have not been able to catch the WBB games as much as I like.  plus K.
Your analysis of the Tufts game was most interesting wrt to team speed.  Agreed that the Tufts coach may have out coached Coach G.  Interest picked up when you carried over the speed at the guards point in the breakdown of the Williams game.  Anyway...Keep it up.
Full disclosure here wrt to the HBC of Williams...I am not a fan and it is probably due to her comments after games and her on the floor coaching.  In the Williams game...which was delayed a bit from the mens game,,,,her efforts to extend the game with fouls was a little overboard, imo.  In the Williams writeup of the game, P. Manning commented that there was a great deal of fouls called in the game...as if it supported the outcome of the game.  Really do not understand her thought process.   In an earlier game..a win....when E. Cook scored 30 points to reach the 1000 point club, Manning commented that she was unaware of the record and if she knew, she would have left Cook in the game. 
When Meg Robertson joined the 1000 point club in a game....scored 16 points...Coach G took her out of the game with her teammates cheering..all aware of the basket that gave Meg the "ticket".
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on January 24, 2015, 12:52:49 AM
I'm happy to assist you on the detailed LJ/NESCAC WBB updates, amh63. Your point about splitting the venues up this season for NESCAC M/WBB doubleheaders is an excellent one, from your "diehard fan of both teams" standpoint. I can think back to many seasons where watching M/WBB DH's were as good as Christmas morning, for those of us who closely follow/enjoy both squads, and such a split would've saddened me deeply, as I also hit the road many a time for such DH's. So were I the commish, I personally would've kept it the old way. But I can also see the reasons why they may have changed it, from the AD's/school's administrative level viewpoint. 

In the past decade, I've sadly noticed more of a separation of the M/WBB fan bases. Students included. And while you and I don't get it, the reality is that relatively few fans come to the gym with the intention of watching all of both games. And I know college BB coaches, be it M or W, hate it whenever the first game runs long, or goes to OT, delaying their game's start time - they are all creatures of habit. And remember, DIII teams play fewer total games than DI or DII schools do. I think 25 is the regular season max, with the NESCAC teams usually at only 24. I also believe the NESCAC is the only DIII league that plays each conference team just once each season (excepting "Little Three"/Maine schools/occasional other rematches, that don't count in the NESCAC standings.) Don't underestimate this unique fact. As it is now set up, every team gets every one of its NESCAC opponents hoop teams at home/on the road every year; 5 men's/5 women's. This change also means more total "event game days" on each campus. 10 NESCAC game dates are now guaranteed, as opposed to just 5 league DH's the old way. That increase in the # of events matters to certain folks at universities (not us), who always want as many "fun things to do around campus" going on as possible. Plus any earlier, pre-conference home M/WBB games. (I know many of those were already single games, but not all. Were any of those early games DHs in '14-15, or did the NESCAC do away all of with those, too?)

I also appreciate that you, amh63, and 7express, both noticed that Amherst WBB clearly pulled "the short end of the straw", and had to play their lone regular-season encounter AT Tufts two years in a row, due to the above-mentioned M/W DH change. Especially when it occurred during, arguably, the two strongest Tufts WBB teams in its history, and during the two youngest Amherst teams of Gromacki's tenure. (On the other hand, this same fluky situation has also likely helped preserve the LJ's record-breaking home court win streak, as Tufts' graduation losses this May will render them not nearly as formidable a squad next year, in effect depriving Coach Berube of both of her best chances to beat GP at LeFrak. The latter fact of which I don't suspect Carla's losing any sleep over!   :))
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MENESCACFAN on January 24, 2015, 06:44:04 PM
Just read the Tufts v Bates report on what seems a brutal beating.  I attended the Bates Men's game today and heard star player Molly Brown has suffered a career ending injury.  That is a bitter blow for a struggling team.

Thy have a basement battle with Wesleyan next week, and the loser of that could be looking at 0-10.  Tough times in Lewiston for Women's Hoops.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 24, 2015, 08:00:57 PM
Sad to see Bates at the bottom of the NESCAC.  They had such strong teams for a long time. 
This was a big weekend in terms of setting things up for the stretch run.  Conn College had a big win over Wesleyan, to keep them in the middle of the pack, and Williams held off a good Hamilton team.  I watched the Bowdoin-Colby game.  Colby made the game close, and if they would take some time to work on something other than a 3 point offense, they might be able to win some of these close games against good teams.  The difference in the game was down the stretch, Bowdoin was able to get easy baskets off their offense, while Colby tried to bomb threes.  I did not thing Bowdoin looked that strong in the game, and I would expect that Amherst and Tufts may beat them.  Amherst has to make a tough Bowdoin/Colby trip next week.  I haven't seen Amherst yet this season, but will try to catch one of those two games.  At this point, I see Tufts, Amherst, Bowdoin and Williams as the top four teams in the league, with Conn College having the advantage for the fifth spot by virtue of a victory over Colby, but a lot can happen over the next three weeks. Tufts looks like the top team in the league, coming off their big victory over Amherst last week.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MENESCACFAN on January 24, 2015, 08:46:53 PM
Agreed Maine1.  Coach Murphy is a legend there.  Still holds several Football records, coached multiple nationally ranked Basketball teams and won the NESCAC as a soccer coach.  You have to wonder how this miserable run is impacting him and if a change is on the way.  Personally, I hope not.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on January 25, 2015, 04:54:49 AM
I completely agree with your assessment, Maine1. Heading into this upcoming weekend, the women's side appears to be more defined and less chaotic than the men's. Still a lot of basketball to be played.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: magicman on January 25, 2015, 06:37:40 AM
Quote from: magicman on January 19, 2015, 07:07:02 PM
Worth mentioning on this board is the free throw shooting percentage of Marle Curle, sophomore guard for Bowdoin. The NCAA leader in free throw shooting, Kiley Shoemaker, from Wheaton (MA) has made 39 out of 41 attempts for a percentage of 95.1%. Marle has made 40 out of 41 attempts for a percentage of 97.6%, clearly the best in the country. She isn't listed on the NCAA stat sheet because you have to have a minimum of 2.5 free throws made per game. Marle is 3 made free throws short of qualifying. Her 97.6% is also better than any of the D3 Men as well. Hope she has a couple of games where she gets to the line more than 2 or 3 times to give her the numbers necessary to make the NCAA Statistical Leaders List.

This was my post from the other day lamenting the fact that Marle Curle was a few made free throws from being ranked #1 in the country in free throw percentage. I was hoping that in her next game she would get to the line and make 5 or 6 free throws to qualify for the rankings. Well, in her next game out on Tuesday January 20th, she didn't get to the line at all, making her chances of qualifying more difficult since her number of games has increased. She would now need a bigger number of made free throws in her next game than she has had all year. The basketball Gods must have been smiling down on her though, because last night against Colby, Marle got to the charity stripe 8 times and she didn't disappoint, as she canned every one of those 8 attempts. She has now made 48 out of 49 free throws and her percentage is 97.959 which the NCAA will round up to 98.0%. She has now met the qualifying standard of 2.5 made free throws per game, so in the next day or so when the NCAA updates their statistics, Ms. Curle will take her place at the top of the page as the Number One free throw shooter in Division III in the country, man or woman. Congratulations Marle, that's an incredible feat. 8-) She needs to keep getting to the line at least 2.5 times per game, to maintain her ranking (and of course keep making them when she does) so the only advice  I can give to her that might come in handy is....drive Marle... drive to the hoop...every chance you can.

Also worth noting is that the #8 free throw shooter in the country according to the current NCAA ranking with 54 made free throws in 60 attempts is also a member of the Bowdoin Women's team. That would be senior guard, Sara Binkhorst, who is knocking down her foul shots at a 90.0% rate.

Opposing coaches will be hard pressed to keep the Polar Bears from adding to their score late in the game, if the need to foul is part of their strategy. Putting either one of these players on the line is about as automatic as it gets. Nice weapons to have.       
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on January 25, 2015, 09:03:40 AM
Quote from: magicman on January 25, 2015, 06:37:40 AM
Quote from: magicman on January 19, 2015, 07:07:02 PM
Worth mentioning on this board is the free throw shooting percentage of Marle Curle, sophomore guard for Bowdoin. The NCAA leader in free throw shooting, Kiley Shoemaker, from Wheaton (MA) has made 39 out of 41 attempts for a percentage of 95.1%. Marle has made 40 out of 41 attempts for a percentage of 97.6%, clearly the best in the country. She isn't listed on the NCAA stat sheet because you have to have a minimum of 2.5 free throws made per game. Marle is 3 made free throws short of qualifying. Her 97.6% is also better than any of the D3 Men as well. Hope she has a couple of games where she gets to the line more than 2 or 3 times to give her the numbers necessary to make the NCAA Statistical Leaders List.
As a team, Bowdoin is shooting 79.5% from the line this season.  Colby is second in the Conference at 72.9%.

This was my post from the other day lamenting the fact that Marle Curle was a few made free throws from being ranked #1 in the country in free throw percentage. I was hoping that in her next game she would get to the line and make 5 or 6 free throws to qualify for the rankings. Well, in her next game out on Tuesday January 20th, she didn't get to the line at all, making her chances of qualifying more difficult since her number of games has increased. She would now need a bigger number of made free throws in her next game than she has had all year. The basketball Gods must have been smiling down on her though, because last night against Colby, Marle got to the charity stripe 8 times and she didn't disappoint, as she canned every one of those 8 attempts. She has now made 48 out of 49 free throws and her percentage is 97.959 which the NCAA will round up to 98.0%. She has now met the qualifying standard of 2.5 made free throws per game, so in the next day or so when the NCAA updates their statistics, Ms. Curle will take her place at the top of the page as the Number One free throw shooter in Division III in the country, man or woman. Congratulations Marle, that's an incredible feat. 8-) She needs to keep getting to the line at least 2.5 times per game, to maintain her ranking (and of course keep making them when she does) so the only advice  I can give to her that might come in handy is....drive Marle... drive to the hoop...every chance you can.

Also worth noting is that the #8 free throw shooter in the country according to the current NCAA ranking with 54 made free throws in 60 attempts is also a member of the Bowdoin Women's team. That would be senior guard, Sara Binkhorst, who is knocking down her foul shots at a 90.0% rate.

Opposing coaches will be hard pressed to keep the Polar Bears from adding to their score late in the game, if the need to foul is part of their strategy. Putting either one of these players on the line is about as automatic as it gets. Nice weapons to have.       
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bowdoin74 on January 25, 2015, 12:47:56 PM
Jill Henrikson was also ranked #1 in the country during her tenure at Bowdoin in FTs, but I am unsure how long she held onto that spot.  Henrikson's .832 career free throw percentage is first all-time at Bowdoin, but it looks like her record is in jeopardy.  Those are extremely impressive stats by Marle Curle, and if she or Sarah Binkhorst earn the top spot, it will be well earned and deserved.

Henrikson's career will be fun to follow, having moved on from Bowdoin to coach at Smith and earn a masters in Exercise Science and Sports Studies, and now to the number one assistant at Tufts. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on January 25, 2015, 03:48:19 PM
Quote from: bowdoin74 on January 25, 2015, 12:47:56 PM
Jill Henrikson was also ranked #1 in the country during her tenure at Bowdoin in FTs, but I am unsure how long she held onto that spot.  Henrikson's .832 career free throw percentage is first all-time at Bowdoin, but it looks like her record is in jeopardy.  Those are extremely impressive stats by Marle Curle, and if she or Sarah Binkhorst earn the top spot, it will be well earned and deserved.

Henrikson's career will be fun to follow, having moved on from Bowdoin to coach at Smith and earn a masters in Exercise Science and Sports Studies, and now to the number one assistant at Tufts.
Pretty good coaching tree from Bowdoin Coaches Pemper and Shibles.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 26, 2015, 11:25:36 AM
Want to mention that Amherst beat Trinity in Hartford on Sat. to uphold the honor of the LJs.  It was a game that allowed playing time for some of the "younger" players.
Next game up is a Little Three game in Middletown.  Afraid the game will be cancelled due to the big storm to arrive late today in New England.  Hard game to reschedule.  The game that counts for the conference is later In leFrak.. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 26, 2015, 05:10:19 PM
Amherst cancelled all classes and closed the school for Tuesday!
Doubt anything will be moving pretty soon.
One thing is sure, Bowdoin's recent announcements is causing interest.  Dowdoin's retiring prez has been there 14 years...a long tenure for a Prez in the CAC.  With the new found wealth...endownment growth...a new Prez with an M.B. A maybe maybe the road that Robert Frost suggested. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: magicman on January 27, 2015, 06:17:09 PM
Went to the NCAA's website which shows all the statistics, looking to see if it had been updated yet, showing Marle Curle as the nation's leader in free throw percentage. It had last been updated on January 19th so I was expecting it to be updated on January 26th but that day came and went without any new stats posted. It was finally updated on January 27th, although the website says it was updated on the 26th. It's too bad that the NCAA, with all the money it makes can't afford to spend a few dollars to make sure their website has accurate facts. They have listed Marle Curle as a freshman when she's a sophomore. They have listed her height as 4'0" which is an insult. Marle's correct height is 5'8".

They have also listed Bowdoin's Sara Binkhorst who is the #8 best free throw shooter in the country as a junior instead of a senior and have her height at 4.0. Her correct height is 5'7".

I looked at over 200 women listed on the free throw percentage individual statistics page and they have made that mistake on the 2 women from Bowdoin and a player from Utica College also listed as 4'0". On two other players they show no height listed and leave that stat blank. Better to leave it blank than show an incorrect number that is a far cry from reality.

Incidentally Marle is not only the percentage leader in DIII she is the number one free throw shooter in all of college basketball, men or women, in NCAA Divisons I, II, or III. She may not end up there or even stay for another week, but for 1 week she can say she was the best. 8-) Congratulations Marle and Sara. 


Edit 10:32 PM:  Meant to post a link to the NCAA Statistic showing the Free Throw Percentage Leaders. Here it is:

http://www.ncaa.com/stats/basketball-women/d3/current/individual/108             
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 27, 2015, 11:40:22 PM
Schools provide that roster/bio info to the NCAA.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on January 27, 2015, 11:42:56 PM
I'd update this info for the NCAA for free!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: magicman on January 28, 2015, 01:40:09 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 27, 2015, 11:40:22 PM
Schools provide that roster/bio info to the NCAA.


Pat,
Are you saying the school told the NCAA the girls were 4'0" tall and they were a year younger than they actually are? Why would they do that?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bballfan13 on January 30, 2015, 10:13:24 AM
On a related topic.  Has anyone ever tried to access ncaa.com from their phone?  They have designed the site to be "mobile" friendly but it is terrible.  Try going to the NCAA bracket once they release them and you can only view the left side as it does not let you scroll over.  I've complained multiple times on the contact us page and I believe it gets sent to Turner Sports.  I've never heard back from them.

Yes, the NCAA has a lot of money, they just don't spend it the way I think they should  :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 30, 2015, 10:34:37 AM
Quote from: magicman on January 28, 2015, 01:40:09 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 27, 2015, 11:40:22 PM
Schools provide that roster/bio info to the NCAA.


Pat,
Are you saying the school told the NCAA the girls were 4'0" tall and they were a year younger than they actually are? Why would they do that?

No -- but if the school didn't fill in that data on the roster file it provided the NCAA, then that's one possible way their system might render it. If data is missing or in the wrong format, the website may still report out something.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 30, 2015, 03:33:16 PM
Seems the latest Storm has resulted in the Amherst and Trinity teams to postpone their Maine games tonight to Sunday.  Had thought about that possibility after watching the weather report.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 31, 2015, 06:35:05 AM
Looking forward to catching some of Bowdoin-Amherst today. I believe this game will be a good test of both teams,  and give us a sense of how strong Bowdoin is.  I expect a very close game. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 31, 2015, 10:06:16 AM
Maine1...agree!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 31, 2015, 10:27:49 AM
  Was impressed with Bowdoin's Kate Kerrigan during the AAU season 2 summers ago; made big plays against lower D1-capables, then.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jumpshot on January 31, 2015, 04:51:06 PM
Bowdoin women savior a sweet win over amHerst who struggle away from the friendly conditions in lefrak. Bowdoin fends off desperate fouling by ljs late in second half by making free throws and handling the ball well against pressure defense. NESCAC women's tournament should provide some good competition later this month ....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on January 31, 2015, 09:35:34 PM
Bowfin plays @ Tufts later in February, right?!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on February 01, 2015, 03:13:49 AM
Quote from: 7express on January 31, 2015, 09:35:34 PM
Bowfin plays @ Tufts later in February, right?!
Saturday, 2/14 at Tufts, 3pm.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 01, 2015, 07:15:58 AM
Very sound wind by Bowdoin over Amherst.  I was surprised that Bowdoin dominated inside early, as Brady totally dominated and could not be stopped in the first half.  Robertson on Amherst was totally ineffective on both ends of the floor.  Amherst offense consisted off hoisting up threes, even though if you take away the three that Peterson hit early, and one late three, they were about 1-20.  And many of those were wide open, uncontested.  Several times Amherst had a chance to come within 7 or 5 points, only to take a quick long three and miss.  Bowdoin, on the other hand, worked their offense for good shots consistently, and was able to hold the ten point lead through the second half. This is not a power house Amherst team.  They could get knocked off by Colby today, if Colby is hitting their threes. Bowdoin is playing very well right now, and their game against Tufts will decide the regular season and number one seed.  That game is at Tufts and I believe is the last game of the regular season.
As I have said on this board several times, teams that rely on the three for their offense will struggle in close games--you need to be able to get to the rim and get an easy two out of your offensive sets.   Past Amherst teams have been known for very quick ball movement, and the ability to get to the basket.  I don't see that in this team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 01, 2015, 11:41:49 AM
Maine1....good recap of the game.  Saw only a bit of the game and WAS surprised at the score just before the half.  Yes, the lady Jeffs seemed out of sorts when I returned to watch late in the game.  Could use the excuse of a long trip to Bowdoin and driving conditions...but rather think it was the play of the Polar Bears.  Am concerned about the condition/play of Meg Robertson...short time on the floor.
Saw the short use of the bench...and the short shots...rushed shots of good outside sHooters..unguarded shot. 
Looking to see if tHe team has any bounce and energy in the game with Colby today.  Hope so. Congrats to the fine play of the women of Bowdoin....and their Coach.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on February 01, 2015, 03:36:22 PM
Bowdoin beat Trinity, 63-47 in a game I thought closer than the score indicates. Trinity led for much of the first half until a beautiful behind the back assist by Sara Binkhorst gave the Bears the lead by 2 as the first half ended. Bowdoin controlled the second, but hats off to a game Trinity team that played well and inspired.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: magicman on February 01, 2015, 03:37:40 PM
Another nice win by Bowdoin as they defeat Trinity by a 63-47 score. With a 19-2 overall record and unblemished in the NESCAC with a 7-0 conference slate, with wins over Williams and now Amherst, I would think the Polar Bears would receive a healthy jump up in the rankings.

I'm still trying to figure out why Tufts keep showing up ahead of Bowdoin in the D3hoops conference standings. Isn't 7-0 a better record than 6-0? I haven't seen any other D3hoops conference standings where a team with a lesser record is listed over a team with a better record. I know when I go to this site: http://www.nescac.com/sports/wbkb/index   Bowdoin is listed at the top of the standings. ;D Maybe it has something to do with how high D3hoops ranks you. ???

My favorite women's player, Marle Curle, was 4 of 4 today from the line. She has now made 49 free throws in a row. Not sure what the women's NESCAC record is but hope she's close to it if she doesn't already have it. Overall she has made 54 of 55 for a 98.2 %. For at least another week, Marle will remain the top free throw shooter in all divisions of NCAA basketball.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 01, 2015, 05:15:44 PM
Nice bounce back game for Amherst against Colby today.  Only stats and slow info at that.  Feeling better with the play of Meg Robertson as she asserted herself more in the 2nd half.  Amherst's ability to make long runs was back.  The play of Ali Doswell was much better today.  Colby did cut a large second half lead down. 
Magicman....the rankings of CAC teams are often based on previous year's performances...trips to the Final Four, etc.  Do expect the Polar Bears to rise.  Expect Tufts, Bowdoin and Amherst to all finish with in the top 4 seeds and win a coveted home site first round game.  After that, I see a toss-up as to who will win the CAC title and an auto- bid to the post season.  Do expect a possibless 3-bid post season selection.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 01, 2015, 07:31:33 PM
Unless Tufts and or Bowdoin completely implode the final 3 games (like Tufts going 1-3 & Bowdoin 0-3, etc) looks like the Bowdoin/Tufts game on February 14 will be for the championship.  Since both teams have the tiebreaker over Amherst now, both teams are really 3 games up on Amherst with Tufts having 4 'CAC games left & Bowdoin with 3 conference games left.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 01, 2015, 09:10:07 PM
7express...as I understand the "process"....the regular season  ends with the standings...including the tiebreakers result in a seeding of the top 8 teams.  The top 4 teams get a first round home game.  The first plays the 8th; the 2nd plays the 7th and so forth.  The highest remaining seed in the next round gets to host the conference tournament.  The winner of the tournament is the conference champs and gets the automatic NCAA bid.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 02, 2015, 06:31:35 AM
Not sure why Colby seems to be the only school in the NESCAC that doesn't have their games on video, and the live stats are totally inconsistent.  I suspect that Amherst suffocated the Colby three point-shooters (looked like most of the points in the last 10 minutes came from free throws).  Amherst appeared to have a better shooting day, and did appear to go inside to Robertson, where they would have had a big advantage.
I agree that the Bowdoin -Tufts game will be for the top seed in the conference tournament.  I think Amherst and Williams will be the three-four in that order.  Conn College has the inside track for five, with Colby and Middlebury fighting for the six position, although if one of the bottom four want a chance to get to the semis, I don't see any of them winning at Bowdoin, Tufts, or Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 02, 2015, 07:07:01 PM
Just looking at the latest D3 hoops top 25--Bowdoin ranked at 20, Amherst at 12.  Sorry, but I definitely would have ranked Bowdoin above Amherst.  They are a better team right now.  I know Bowdoin has two early season losses (including a loss to a Roger Williams team that, while not as good as last year, is a solid team, and a loss to UNE that is always tough), but lately they are playing very well, and have good wins over Williams and Amherst.  Bowdoin should definitely be ranked ahead of Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 02, 2015, 07:37:43 PM
Maine1, after voting in a couple posters polls for the last couple years, the voting process is actually harder then it seems on paper (and I'm only doing this for fun too).
If at all possible I try to take head-to-head records in terms of rankings team, but sometimes I can't do that.  if Amherst was top 8 on my ballot last week, and Bowdoin was unranked, it's kinda difficult to drop Amherst 18+ spots just because they lost the only head-to-head matchup of the season.  Like, for example in my D-1 posters poll I just submitted today I have Maryland ranked above Ohio State, even though they just got drilled by them, the reason being Maryland was #14 in my poll last week, and Ohio State was unranked at #28 (even though I only submit 25, I do a ballot of 30).  This week I have MD at #20 & Ohio state at 21, that way if MD loses this coming week and Ohio state doesn't, it's close enough I can bump Ohio State due to the win.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: magicman on February 05, 2015, 01:28:59 AM
Went to the Free Throw Percentage Stat Page on the NCAA website Wednesday evening and discovered that the women from Bowdoin all went through a growing spurt in the last day. Marle Curle went from 4'0" to 5'8" overnight and is now a sophomore instead of a freshman. Likewise Sara Binkhorst went from 4'0" to 5'7" in that same 24 hour period and is now a senior instead of a junior. Shannon Brady (#53 in field goal percentage) really shot up there as she went from 4'0" to 6"0".  I'm moving to Maine because there must be something in the water up there and I've always wanted to be 6' 6". :D

Here's the link to the NCAA stats showing Ms. Curle still at the top of the heap:

http://www.ncaa.com/stats/basketball-women/d3/current/individual/108   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 05, 2015, 12:15:47 PM
Magicman...Happy days are here again I see....with your crusade! :)
You know that it is still snowing somewhere in Maine!  Oh forgot...you live in Plattsburgh :).
Me..do not need the height...just want to be as astute as you wrt to BB.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: magicman on February 07, 2015, 04:24:34 AM
Quote from: amh63 on February 05, 2015, 12:15:47 PM
Magicman...Happy days are here again I see....with your crusade! :)
You know that it is still snowing somewhere in Maine!  Oh forgot...you live in Plattsburgh :).
Me..do not need the height...just want to be as astute as you wrt to BB.

Plus K for the compliment but you are as astute as anyone wrt to basketball! 8-) And forget Maine, it's still snowing here in Plattsburgh with another 8 to 12 inches on the way between this evening and Monday.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 07, 2015, 09:15:27 AM
Although there are still games this weekend and next, I think the NESCAC playoff order is pretty well set.  Tufts and Bowdoin will play next week for the number one seed, although Tufts almost got knocked off last night at Hamilton--Hamilton was up by three with 15 seconds to go, but Tufts tied the game with a three and then pulled away in overtime. Tufts has a tough game at Williams today, but should win. Amherst probably has the third seed sowed up, and Williams is in good shape at the four, unless Conn College knocks them off next weekend (which is not out of the realm of possibility).  Colby, with losses to Williams and Conn College, is locked in 6th, and Middlebury at 7th.  The final spot will come down to next weekends Hamilton/Wesleyan contest.  I think Hamilton is better than Wesleyan, but has lost some tough close games.  I don't see any of the lower seeds  (6-8) pulling a first round upset, but the 4-5 game can always go either way.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MENESCACFAN on February 07, 2015, 07:39:26 PM
Tough on for Bates today.  Kept it close right to the end before yet another loss.  Sadly looking like a winless ear for the 'Cats.  Very different story to the mens side!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on February 13, 2015, 09:54:45 AM
Bowdoin lost senior captain Megan Phelps to a broken ankle suffered in practice before the team boarded the bus to Middlebury last Saturday. They managed to pull away in the second half of that game, but remains to be seen how that loss will affect them this weekend. The Bates game is always a battle and expect a game game vs. Tufts.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bowdoin74 on February 13, 2015, 03:43:04 PM
Very difficult year for Megan.  Her father, Scott, six days shy of 45 years old, passed away in October, 2014.  Megan is the oldest of four children and a tremendous leader.  She is a gritty player from Mount Desert Island, the largest island off the coast of Maine, and grew up in Southwest Harbor. Every senior knows how many possible games are left in their career and it's exceptionally tough when those final games are unexpectedly taken away.  Megan's dad's death and her season ending injury will provide strong motivation for the Polar Bears as they finish out their season.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: MENESCACFAN on February 13, 2015, 11:59:07 PM
What a truly sad story that is.  Thoughts and prayers out to this girl as she gets herself in a good place life wise.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 14, 2015, 07:06:02 AM
Very sad for the senior from Bowdoin-terrible way to end a career. Certainly takes a bit away from today's Bowdoin-Tufts game, which is for the Top seed.  I think Tufts should win, they are very strong inside and without Phelps, this will hurt Bowdoin. 
Other than fighting for the 7th and 8th seed, the 8 teams are set for the playoffs.  I don't see any of the Top three (Tufts, Bowdoin, Amherst) losing next weekend.  Conn College could beat Williams, although Williams did hold them off last night.  I don't see Colby beating Amherst, since Colby's game is shooting and making threes, and Amherst does an excellent job of not allowing teams to take uncontested threes.  Tufts totally shut down Colby's offense last night by running the Colby shooters off the three point line, and making Colby take twos.  Hamilton could give Bowdoin a tough game, if Bowdoin is the two seed.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on February 14, 2015, 11:33:49 PM
First off, I'd like to add my best wishes to Bowdoin's Megan Phelps, her family and to her Bowdoin family. They had a "32" written in cardboard, and placed it at the end of their bench today at Cousens. Wonderful show of respect by her team.

Secondly, congrats to Coach Murphy and his Bates team for getting their second consecutive Senior Day home win over Colby. You never want to see anyone go "0-fer" in conference. And since Colby was already locked into the #6 seed for the upcoming NESCAC playoffs, win or lose, I wouldn't think Coach Veilleux was overly distraught over today's result. Coach Murphy's teams have struggled recently, but he has a long history of success up there, is a class act, and I will continue to root for Bates to come back strong in WBB.

The Tufts 66, Bowdoin 55 final score on Senior Day today appears much closer than the actual game was. It was 54-30 Tufts after a Kanner jumper with 13:17 to go, and from there, it was mostly Coach Berube taking the air out of the ball (dare I even use that analogy around teams from suburban Boston these days?)   :)   resulting in a 25-12 game-ending Polar Bear "run", of sorts.

Baptista is a gifted offensive talent, and one who rarely takes a bad shot (unusual for a FY.) She's also had some great moments on D, and appears to be making strides towards fouling less during the past 2-3 games - her #1 bug-a-boo during NESCAC play. Melissa is going to be a starter and major contributor for the Jumbos next year, and will soon be a star in this league. Last weekend, Coach Berube reverted back to an early season, bad habit of hers. She had Roberson on the floor, and Lee on the bench during the last 4:00 of a close game. Excepting for foul trouble/injury, that can't ever happen again. It's a little thing that really matters, as it could really cost her and her team. Trust me. This is Tufts' year, and they obviously want to make their run last as long as possible next month. Lee has this amazing knack for doing something positive when it is needed most: a clutch pass, rebound or shot. It is a gift, and it is 99% basketball instinct. The more pressure, the better she plays. Roberson, for all her relentless effort, just does not possess this trait/knack. In fact, Lee single-handedly saved the Jumbos' perfect NESCAC season at Hamilton last weekend. Coming out of a TO, and down 3 with :16 seconds left in regulation, Lee calmly drained a mega-clutch 3-ball to tie it up, to get the game into OT, where Tufts ended up winning by 7. I've seen players like Josie Lee before. They are rare and valuable. And that's exactly what players like that do. Help you win you important, close games.

Sara Binkhorst (7-12 FG; 5-5 from 3; 4-4 FT for 23 pts; 7 assists) did everything she could for Bowdoin. Shannon Brady added 12, but that was basically it. I honestly enjoy how pumped up and excited the Bowdoin WBB fans get when their team is playing well. I like seeing people happy. Do they get a little carried away at times? Sure. But I don't know a loyal fan anywhere who doesn't do the same. And there's no reason for them to still not be very optimistic, despite today's loss. The fun part is really only getting started.

To me, only *one* 14-15 NESCAC team drew the "very shortest straw", and had to play their lone NESCAC game at both Tufts and Bowdoin on the road both of the last two seasons (due to the league ending the M/WBB DH's): Amherst. And those happened to be the LJ's only two losses on the season. Do I think Amherst loses to Bowdoin at LeFrak this season? No. Or even to Tufts at LeFrak? Who knows? Although they clearly have flaws as a team, I think it's at least a 50/50 possibility that were it not for this wacky schedule quirk, Amherst may well be undefeated right now. Still, if I'm Gromacki, I'm happy it played out this way, because he got to see his team "exposed" against other top teams, in a way he might not have if those were home games. The great part now? None of that matters anymore. It's basically a reset. Because, barring a repeat of the #8 upset of #1 that we saw 2 years ago, NESCAC fans will likely get to watch Bowdoin and Amherst play at a neutral site (Tufts). May the better team that day win!

Kelsey Morehead update: Although she was in uniform this weekend, she did not play. Luckily, SR Ali Berman, who played her 1st 3 years at Tufts, was a halftime guest/2nd-half color analyst today. She happened to mention that Kelsey was "one more week away" from getting back out the floor. Since no info was ever released on what exactly her December injury is/was, I found that information valuable. And although FY Lauren Dillon has done an absolutely stellar job in her stead, Morehead's a SR, a 4-year starter, and brings more offensive punch to the Jumbos.

Sunday's Middlebury at Amherst NESCAC finale has no impact on the 4 playoff matchups, since Middlebury wins the tiebreak by beating Hamilton head-to-head, and should the Panthers pull the upset Sunday, they lost to Colby head-to-head. So here's next Saturday's NESCAC quarterfinals:

#8 Hamilton at #1 Tufts
#7 Middlebury at #2 Bowdoin
#6 Colby at #3 Amherst
#5 Conn College at #4 Williams

(Wesleyan, Trinity and Bates did not qualify.)

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on February 15, 2015, 01:52:18 PM
d3wbbfan, I find agreement with many of your comments here and elsewhere, but several points in this post suggest alternative points of view, at least from this Jumbo fan's perspective. First, your "Last weekend, Coach Berube reverted back to an early season, bad habit of hers. She had Roberson on the floor, and Lee on the bench during the last 4:00 of a close game. Excepting for foul trouble/injury, that can't ever happen again. It's a little thing that really matters, as it could really cost her and her team. Trust me." As I have noted before, you, despite your protests, have an "offense" lean in your player analysis. Josie hit, as you note, an incredibly clutch 3-pointer at Hamilton to send the game to OT. Why was she in the game? She is a fearless, if not Foley-accurate, shooter, and Coach Berube undoubtedly wanted the best long range options in. I think Wu, Foley, Dillon, Kanner and Lee were on the floor. She knew Hamilton would try to blanket Foley and Lee was an open, early option. The game situation demanded it, and as you suggest, Josie delivered. Obviously other game situation demand your best defensive options. Berube has always said the the best defenders start,  and Emma is just that. She is quick, strong, tough, and experienced. Josie has had a breakout season, and has earned her playing time and the trust of the coach. She has some of the most creative assists on the team, and is a fine rebounder for her size. However, remember that she played mostly clean-up minutes last year, while Emma was a regular on a FF team. With all due respect, I like Coach Berube's calculations on who plays at crunch time. Trust her.
As a Gromacki stalwart, or apologist in some contexts, do you offer him such critiques about his substitution patterns?

Your second point, that Amherst might well have beaten Tufts at LeFrak without the scheduling anomalies of this season, belies the Jan 16 23-point pounding that the LJ's and Gromacki took at Cousens and is specious at best. How many points are LeFrak and their fans worth? Last year the Jumbos won both games at Cousens by 7 and 16. Your implied notion that LeFrak would have made such an enormous difference suggests that Tufts may have been the better team in 2012-2013 where they lost two by 5 and 6. Each of those games I attended and they were close throughout. Is it not possible that Tufts is and has been the better team for the past 3 seasons notwithstanding Gromacki and some home court magic? Some Jumbo fans believe that if it were not for Bowdoin's upset win at Cousens in the prelim round of the NESCAC tournament, that second Amherst-Tufts game would likely have had a different outcome. In any case, the NESCAC tournament and NCAAs will be great, no doubt.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jumpshot on February 15, 2015, 02:11:33 PM
Ever notice that each year a key ingredient in amHerst's women's success is due to their ability to pass the ball ---often a weakness in many other less consistently good teams?

Say, amh63, isn't time your major capital gifts be used to upgrade amHerst's webcast's which continue to flutter ----have gone from first to worst in recent years....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 15, 2015, 03:53:47 PM
Regarding the thought that maybe Amherst would be undefeated if they had played Tufts and Bowdoin at Amherst--I watched both of those games, and Amherst was totally outplayed in both games.  I thought both Bowdoin and Amherst were the better teams in each of those games.  Tufts is clearly the top team in the league.  That doesn't mean that Amherst can't beat them (assuming they get another shot at them).  I do think that Amherst has to improve over the way they played the last time they played both of those teams.  Specifically, they need to get back to what has been the hallmark of the top Amherst teams on offense, which is very quick ball movement, and getting good open shots, and not necessarily settling for threes. 
I do think that Tufts looks very strong going into this tournament, and if they up to their capabilities, they should win the championship. I expect to see the top four seeds advance.  I don't think Hamilton can stay with Tufts.  Middlebury could give Bowdoin a little bit of trouble if they are on.  Amherst is so good at denying teams open three point looks, that even if they struggle offensively, I can't see Colby beating them.  Plus Colby doesn't have an answer for Robertson.  Conn College could upset Williams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on February 15, 2015, 04:28:07 PM
Maine1, I know you meant to say the both Bowdoin and "Tufts" were the better teams in those games. I saw both and agree. The Bowdoin win was no fluke, although Morrell is very tough for visitors to win in: the Polar Bear women won 76 consecutive games from 2001-2007. Amherst certainly can win against the best, but in the first game Tufts rotated beautifully to their shooters on the perimeter and doubled so quickly in the post that Amherst's passing offense was neutralized. If the top 4 seeds come through, the semifinals will be very interesting. Williams has some of the most athletic big girls in the NESCAC. They can put it on the floor, post up, and shoot from the perimeter. Although I have only seen them twice this season, it has looked like Coach Manning has some challenge controlling the team, particularly on the offensive end. There is, from my perspective, too much freedom to take the first open shot or to attack off the dribble a team defense that is ready to help. Their athleticism and skills work against lesser opponents, but the disciplined defenses give them trouble.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 15, 2015, 04:53:31 PM
Thanks for correcting me--yes I did Mean that Tufts was the better team
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 15, 2015, 06:31:17 PM
Amherst wins over Midd on Senior Day in LeFrak.  Good win for the the two seniors who started...Meg Robertson....I will miss her play..and she played well today.  Taylor Smith...a walk-on...guard is the other senior.  I will miss her too.  Her grandfather is a classmate of mine and a fine QB on the football team.
Believe the team has the bench and experience to make a run for the title...whether the games are in LeFrak or on the road.  If the key games ahead will be against the top seeds....it does not matter.
Go Jeffs!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on February 15, 2015, 08:48:06 PM
nescacbbrules, I very much enjoyed your thoughtful post. Thanks for reading, and taking the time to reply.

You are free to opine that my focus is mostly on offense, despite the fact that it truly never has been. What I have observed is that, at the DIII level, quality defensive players on top teams exist in surprisingly large numbers. Moreso than consistent point producers at DIII, for whatever reason.

I fully understand that Roberson played a lot last year as well, while Lee did not. In previous years, I thought Coach Berube gave her veterans a serious edge in PT over her newcomers. I understand why she would do that. Some conventional wisdom deems that to be a prudent approach. Experience/deeper understanding of her system/loyalty/trust/more confidence. That said, I believe many DIII coaches put too much importance on those things. I actually believe Josie Lee was a "casualty", if you will, of that thinking last season. She was a noteworthy talent in HS. IMO, the only reason Lee sat last year was because Coach giving minutes to FR, even over the SO Roberson, has historically been something Carla just hasn't done. You could even see that with a major talent like North last year. Carla far preferred the comfort level of say, SR Ali Rocchi, usually citing inherent defensive deficiencies present in all FYs. Yes, those do exist. I feel those concerns are overblown, however. Especially for a young big with a natural gift for rebounding.

Berube and I only ever disagreed on how to best address the issue. Carla wanted her FYs to learn by watching. I wanted her best FYs to learn on the job. By doing, by playing, by making mistakes in-game, during pre-season. These are smart kids. They learn these lessons fairly quickly. My experience has been that, after about 10 games or so, they usually cease to become a liability on D, and are basically good to go. And if they happen to "relapse", you can always sit them/have a teaching moment then.

That was my issue during last season. With North especially. This year, however, I have been singing Coach Berube's praises all season. Why? She's smartly and clearly de-emphasized her "seniority rules" approach. Baptista has been a major beneficiary of this. With each game, she's improving further, to cut down on her excessive fouling. By playing. The kid has quick hands, good court vision, and commits to playing good D. That's most of the battle right there. And she's a skilled and confident shooter. Which is much rarer, and arguably a more valuable trait, than defensive stalwarts are in the NESCAC. Simple supply and demand. All credit for Baptista's quick start goes to Carla/Melissa. Giving Dillon early PT before Kelsey's injury, over Wu, paid off big when Morehead went down. The job Dillon's done has been almost superhuman. So much so, no matter who the PG is come the NCAAs, the Jumbos are a legit contender. An incredible feat. All credit for it goes to Carla/Lauren.

You seem to think Roberson is a better defender than Lee is. I don't. At all. I know Emma has a *rep* as a lock-down defender, but I can't share that opinion, much as I truly want to. I give Lee the edge, due to better lateral movement, and better dead-stop to full-speed run transition. Lee runs like a puma. Smooth. Quick. As I detailed earlier this season, Emma has a choppy, head-bobs-up-and-down running style, and is fast but not especially quick. Emma has been vulnerable to the dribble drive. I've seen several clear "blow-by's" by her man this season. But I love Emma, because she's the hardest working, most intense competitor I've ever seen play out there. Still, in total, Lee's better overall athleticism, unusually good passing skills, and better overall shooting % of the two is why I still think it's in Carla's/Tufts best interests to make Josie the late game choice. I'm simply playing the percentages here. Of the two, I feel Lee is much more likely to make a great pass, sink a key hoop, or not make a mistake late, when each possession matters a ton. Any one of the above. Not just offense. We can agree to disagree on this. There are no guarantees. You are a Tufts fan, just like me. So I automatically like and respect you very much!   :)

Hey, I'm not making any claims of "foul", or trying to take *any* credit away from either Tufts or Bowdoin, for their 14-15 home wins over the LJs. I'm a Jumbos fan - I was absolutely thrilled to beat Amherst again! But I sure did consider getting them at Cousens two straight years, due to the scheduling fluke, to be a bit serendipitous. I just can't help but recall a huge # of comments made two years ago, lamenting the fact that the biggest NESCAC games always seemed to be played at LeFrak. Is it even debatable that, among the top NESCAC teams, the home court advantage is significant to who ends up winning? I mean, the Lord Jeffs have won 109 straight home games. For me to suggest earlier that there was a good chance for different outcomes, had those games been played at Amherst, doesn't exactly make me psychotic, does it? I just think it's only fair that I see/post about things not just from a Tufts point of view. But other teams, as well. amh63 and I manage to get along well, despite different rooting interests. And if what happened to Amherst WBB, schedule-wise, happened to Bowdoin WBB instead, I 100% promise you I would've made the exact same point (along with 10 loyal Polar Bear fans, I suspect!)

nescacbbrules, I can 100% see why you feel I am a "Gromacki apologist." Big picture, I do have a ton of respect what the man has accomplished. How can you not? But it might surprise you to know that, from the bottom of my heart, that I have *far* more issues with how he's "run his ship" this year than I do Carla. I give Carla a 98, and GP an 81. Berube's job has been much easier, though. Her top 7/8 players (counting Morehead) are clear cut. The only reason I bring up Roberson vs Lee is that everything else, rotation-wise, is 100% set for Tufts. All that's left is what happens if/when with Kelsey returns, and any "fine tuning." 

Amherst is a far more complex issue, for a number of reasons. Re-incorporating Megan Robertson into a prominent role since her recent return from a torn ACL has proven to be far from seamless. Why? I don't know. Guesses? When Megan went down last year, the 4 starting FYs (Renner, the two Doswells and Peterson) seemed to develop a comfort zone, with both each other and that weave offense, Giddins, Pritchard, Zwecker and Holness, although all just SOs and a JR, managed to adjust their games around the freshmen. Some said the scheme was too 3-pointer oriented, and they may have had a point. Still, the final W-L result for 13-14 Amherst was an absolute credit to all involved with the LJs.

So it's a new year for Amherst. No one graduated. A bunch more quality FYs are brought in. Robertson is due to return around New Years'. But what was GP gonna do with all of these players? Hackley, Nagle and Schumacher all had plenty of scholarship-level interest. And the girl from Switzerland (Lily Johnson) can also really play. First off, Holness and Virginia Hassell both decide to concentrate on their studies, which at least got the LJ roster down to 15. I made comments in December about the staggering amount of quality depth that Amherst has. I still stand by that characterization today. But some went a step further, and thought I was anointing the LJs as "the 14-15 chosen one". I absolutely was not doing that, at the time. My issue was that I just couldn't figure out how Gromacki was gonna fit 200 minutes of total PT per game into all of this assembled talent. I thought he'd actually over-recruited. But if anybody could somehow make it work, I figured it would be him. Everything about Amherst is class, so there's no back-biting or grumbling. But when a minimum of 12 kids deserve 20mpg each, what can you do? And when does healthy competition turn into "I better produce when I'm in there!" self-pressure?

Then comes at Tufts/at Bowdoin. The Jumbos are clearly quicker and bigger than Amherst. 5'10" Giddins struggled mightily down low. GP obviously wants a different result in March. Does he just write those two losses off to Megan being rusty, and an overall lack of time playing together recently? At least his "toolbox" is full. If he wants to unveil his own "twin towers", he could try matching up Robertson and Nagle with Kanner and North. I don't think Carla's seen a 14-15 opponent match her size. If Nagle's not 100% ready, she can at least give up some fouls, because GP has two other 6'2" girls on the bench. North is only OK at the FT line. If GP wants to go quicker, Renner, Pritchard, Hackley and either Doswell match up better with Foley, et al. Shannon Brady went off against the LJs in Brunswick, while Robertson was a non-factor that day. GP's quandry: was that day a fluke or not?

I just don't think Gromacki's a guy that's gonna unveil something totally unexpected, lineup-wise, in postseason, even if he has the ability/depth to do so. They don't really press. They've stopped running last year's high-post weave in recent games, even though I think he still likes it, deep down. They still shoot tons of 3's, while now incorporating Robertson's classic low post game. My gut is that he's gonna sink or swim with Megan, the 4 SOs, Giddins, Pritchard and Hackley. I do know the players all look up to Robertson - and I don't mean just literally. And they'll do their very best to have her finish up with a bang!

Good luck to all next weekend, my NESCAC buddies!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on February 15, 2015, 09:10:08 PM
Quote from: d3wbbfan on February 15, 2015, 08:48:06 PM
nescacbbrules, I very much enjoyed your thoughtful post. Thanks for reading, and taking the time to reply.

You are free to opine that my focus is mostly on offense, despite the fact that it truly never has been. What I have observed is that, at the DIII level, quality defensive players on top teams exist in surprisingly large numbers. Moreso than consistent point producers at DIII, for whatever reason.

I fully understand that Roberson played a lot last year as well, while Lee did not. In previous years, I thought Coach Berube gave her veterans a serious edge in PT over her newcomers. I understand why she would do that. Some conventional wisdom deems that to be a prudent approach. Experience/deeper understanding of her system/loyalty/trust/more confidence. That said, I believe many DIII coaches put too much importance on those things. I actually believe Josie Lee was a "casualty", if you will, of that thinking last season. She was a noteworthy talent in HS. IMO, the only reason Lee sat last year was because Coach giving minutes to FR, even over the SO Roberson, has historically been something Carla just hasn't done. You could even see that with a major talent like North last year. Carla far preferred the comfort level of say, SR Ali Rocchi, usually citing inherent defensive deficiencies present in all FYs. Yes, those do exist. I feel those concerns are overblown, however. Especially for a young big with a natural gift for rebounding.

Berube and I only ever disagreed on how to best address the issue. Carla wanted her FYs to learn by watching. I wanted her best FYs to learn on the job. By doing, by playing, by making mistakes in-game, during pre-season. These are smart kids. They learn these lessons fairly quickly. My experience has been that, after about 10 games or so, they usually cease to become a liability on D, and are basically good to go. And if they happen to "relapse", you can always sit them/have a teaching moment then.

That was my issue during last season. With North especially. This year, however, I have been singing Coach Berube's praises all season. Why? She's smartly and clearly de-emphasized her "seniority rules" approach. Baptista has been a major beneficiary of this. With each game, she's improving further, to cut down on her excessive fouling. By playing. The kid has quick hands, good court vision, and commits to playing good D. That's most of the battle right there. And she's a skilled and confident shooter. Which is much rarer, and arguably a more valuable trait, than defensive stalwarts are in the NESCAC. Simple supply and demand. All credit for Baptista's quick start goes to Carla/Melissa. Giving Dillon early PT before Kelsey's injury, over Wu, paid off big when Morehead went down. The job Dillon's done has been almost superhuman. So much so, no matter who the PG is come the NCAAs, the Jumbos are a legit contender. An incredible feat. All credit for it goes to Carla/Lauren.

You seem to think Roberson is a better defender than Lee is. I don't. At all. I know Emma has a *rep* as a lock-down defender, but I can't share that opinion, much as I truly want to. I give Lee the edge, due to better lateral movement, and better dead-stop to full-speed run transition. Lee runs like a puma. Smooth. Quick. As I detailed earlier this season, Emma has a choppy, head-bobs-up-and-down running style, and is fast but not especially quick. Emma has been vulnerable to the dribble drive. I've seen several clear "blow-by's" by her man this season. But I love Emma, because she's the hardest working, most intense competitor I've ever seen play out there. Still, in total, Lee's better overall athleticism, unusually good passing skills, and better overall shooting % of the two is why I still think it's in Carla's/Tufts best interests to make Josie the late game choice. I'm simply playing the percentages here. Of the two, I feel Lee is much more likely to make a great pass, sink a key hoop, or not make a mistake late, when each possession matters a ton. Any one of the above. Not just offense. We can agree to disagree on this. There are no guarantees. You are a Tufts fan, just like me. So I automatically like and respect you very much!   :)

Hey, I'm not making any claims of "foul", or trying to take *any* credit away from either Tufts or Bowdoin, for their 14-15 home wins over the LJs. I'm a Jumbos fan - I was absolutely thrilled to beat Amherst again! But I sure did consider getting them at Cousens two straight years, due to the scheduling fluke, to be a bit serendipitous. I just can't help but recall a huge # of comments made two years ago, lamenting the fact that the biggest NESCAC games always seemed to be played at LeFrak. Is it even debatable that, among the top NESCAC teams, the home court advantage is significant to who ends up winning? I mean, the Lord Jeffs have won 109 straight home games. For me to suggest earlier that there was a good chance for different outcomes, had those games been played at Amherst, doesn't exactly make me psychotic, does it? I just think it's only fair that I see/post about things not just from a Tufts point of view. But other teams, as well. amh63 and I manage to get along well, despite different rooting interests. And if what happened to Amherst WBB, schedule-wise, happened to Bowdoin WBB instead, I 100% promise you I would've made the exact same point (along with 10 loyal Polar Bear fans, I suspect!)

nescacbbrules, I can 100% see why you feel I am a "Gromacki apologist." Big picture, I do have a ton of respect what the man has accomplished. How can you not? But it might surprise you to know that, from the bottom of my heart, that I have *far* more issues with how he's "run his ship" this year than I do Carla. I give Carla a 98, and GP an 81. Berube's job has been much easier, though. Her top 7/8 players (counting Morehead) are clear cut. The only reason I bring up Roberson vs Lee is that everything else, rotation-wise, is 100% set for Tufts. All that's left is what happens if/when with Kelsey returns, and any "fine tuning." 

Amherst is a far more complex issue, for a number of reasons. Re-incorporating Megan Robertson into a prominent role since her recent return from a torn ACL has proven to be far from seamless. Why? I don't know. Guesses? When Megan went down last year, the 4 starting FYs (Renner, the two Doswells and Peterson) seemed to develop a comfort zone, with both each other and that weave offense, Giddins, Pritchard, Zwecker and Holness, although all just SOs and a JR, managed to adjust their games around the freshmen. Some said the scheme was too 3-pointer oriented, and they may have had a point. Still, the final W-L result for 13-14 Amherst was an absolute credit to all involved with the LJs.

So it's a new year for Amherst. No one graduated. A bunch more quality FYs are brought in. Robertson is due to return around New Years'. But what was GP gonna do with all of these players? Hackley, Nagle and Schumacher all had plenty of scholarship-level interest. And the girl from Switzerland (Lily Johnson) can also really play. First off, Holness and Virginia Hassell both decide to concentrate on their studies, which at least got the LJ roster down to 15. I made comments in December about the staggering amount of quality depth that Amherst has. I still stand by that characterization today. But some went a step further, and thought I was anointing the LJs as "the 14-15 chosen one". I absolutely was not doing that, at the time. My issue was that I just couldn't figure out how Gromacki was gonna fit 200 minutes of total PT per game into all of this assembled talent. I thought he'd actually over-recruited. But if anybody could somehow make it work, I figured it would be him. Everything about Amherst is class, so there's no back-biting or grumbling. But when a minimum of 12 kids deserve 20mpg each, what can you do? And when does healthy competition turn into "I better produce when I'm in there!" self-pressure?

Then comes at Tufts/at Bowdoin. The Jumbos are clearly quicker and bigger than Amherst. 5'10" Giddins struggled mightily down low. GP obviously wants a different result in March. Does he just write those two losses off to Megan being rusty, and an overall lack of time playing together recently? At least his "toolbox" is full. If he wants to unveil his own "twin towers", he could try matching up Robertson and Nagle with Kanner and North. I don't think Carla's seen a 14-15 opponent match her size. If Nagle's not 100% ready, she can at least give up some fouls, because GP has two other 6'2" girls on the bench. North is only OK at the FT line. If GP wants to go quicker, Renner, Pritchard, Hackley and either Doswell match up better with Foley, et al. Shannon Brady went off against the LJs in Brunswick, while Robertson was a non-factor that day. GP's quandry: was that day a fluke or not?

I just don't think Gromacki's a guy that's gonna unveil something totally unexpected, lineup-wise, in postseason, even if he has the ability/depth to do so. They don't really press. They've stopped running last year's high-post weave in recent games, even though I think he still likes it, deep down. They still shoot tons of 3's, while now incorporating Robertson's classic low post game. My gut is that he's gonna sink or swim with Megan, the 4 SOs, Giddins, Pritchard and Hackley. I do know the players all look up to Robertson - and I don't mean just literally. And they'll do their very best to have her finish up with a bang!

Good luck to all next weekend, my NESCAC buddies!

Possibly the only team to defeat her - Scranton.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on February 16, 2015, 01:40:07 AM
Thanks for the note, Ronk. That game in PR wasn't streamed, so it was one of the few Tufts games I couldn't watch. I have, however, seen the Lady Royals a couple of times. I remember your #55/#54 combo well. 6'1" SR Meredith Mesaris is impressive. 20+ ppg, 86% FT, and is more mobile and versatile than I expected, at first glance. She's even hit 22 3's on the year, with 3 of them coming in that win over Tufts. I also *really* like your younger, more slender big, 6'0" SO Sarah Payonk. Nearly averaging a double-double, and shooting 84% at the line. Quality production from a young player. I'm sure the other Landmark teams are thrilled to have to deal with Payonk for two more years! It's unusual for a team to have their 4/5 players be the clear go to's, but different is often better, and Scranton's having another great year - and with an interim HC, to boot! Quite impressive. Good luck in the NCAAs - maybe even a rematch, perhaps?   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on February 16, 2015, 10:16:16 AM
Thanks for the comprehensive reply, d3wbbfan. I appreciate your perspectives on the teams and the nuance of the game. To wrap up my thoughts on Josie Lee and Emma Roberson, they are each very tenacious and tough defenders, and Josie probably has a slight edge on offense. They tend to sub for each other, so they most often match up against the same player. It has been a joy to see an academic and athletic superstar like Josie from Cony HS contribute hugely this season. I do think that the experience differential has been negated at this point in the season, but would point to the fact that Emma leads the team in steals (surpassed in steals per minute played by the hugely quick Baptista).  In any case, it is worth remembering that in the biggest game of the year against FDU in the national semifinal, when Tufts absolutely had to steal without fouling, Emma, who scored 6 and had 5 rebounds to help replace the stats of the hobbled Hannah Foley, tied up the ball with 15 seconds to play giving Tufts the chance for a tying 3-pointer. It didn't work out for our Jumbos like Ms. Lee's shot at Hamilton, but it was just the kind of play you ascribe to Josie.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 16, 2015, 10:58:30 AM
Been " enjoying" the conversation wrt to rotation of players on the Tufts, Amherst teams....in particular to match- ups, etc.  I often do the same but more so on the men's side.  It often proves frustrating...usually when second guessing coaches moves of past games.
I went back two seasons ago..12-13 season...partly to check a recent posted remark about how good Amherst was over the years with respect to Tufts.  Why?  I got to watch the Tufts vs Amherst game live in LeFrak that season...both men's and women's games with my best man...a follower of the HBC of Tufts since her UConn days...and my youngest son and his wife.  My youngest son, an Amherst grad and follower of MBB as well as a fine HS player.
Anyway...to my point here...the Amherst teams won both games.  Amherst was the better team THAT day in both games...period.   The next game for Amherst was up in Williams....where Williams beat Amherst badly..by 20 pts...their only lost in the regular season.  Meg Robertson had an poor outing...reason unknown to me.
It is interesting that Amherst hosted the CAC tourney that year and won it and reached the Final 4 again.  Most interesting, Tufts was not the opponent in the CAC title game.  Amherst beat Williams for the title...by 15 points!
Suggest all should sit back and enjoy the upcoming conference tournament.  Match ups will be key, but how well players play in a game on a particular day is not known...imo.  It is then when the coaches earn their money. :). The depth of the bench helps too.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on February 16, 2015, 01:22:39 PM
Amh63, I remember the intensity of that 2013 game which I was also fortunate to see in person. Each team was undefeated and they were ranked 4 and 5 in the nation. The lead changed hands throughout the first half and was tied at intermission, 22 all. Amherst never trailed in the second half, but Tufts was right there until Voigt made a desperation heave from beyond the arc in the last 35 seconds that banked in to seal the Jumbo's fate. Voigt was a very tough, inspirational leader, I thought. Robertson was tough and had a double/double, but I remember Holness and Zwecker providing real lift off the bench, so important, as you suggest.

Amherst lost at Williams the next day but the Ephs had lost at Tufts, so all three had 9-1 records. Tufts drew the winning ticket for the tiebreaker and was set to host their first NESCAC tournament when an inspired Bowdoin team upset them in the quarterfinals, giving Amherst, the 2nd place lottery ticket holder, that gift. Tufts had to wait two weeks to play again at LeFrak, and although the game was different, the result was the same. A very tough, hard nosed matchup in which Tufts tying shot attempts rolled out and Amherst kept the streak alive and went to the Final Four.

Here's hoping Jumboland gets to host the LJs in Cousens this year. Good luck.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on February 16, 2015, 04:28:34 PM
Quote from: d3wbbfan on February 16, 2015, 01:40:07 AM
Thanks for the note, Ronk. That game in PR wasn't streamed, so it was one of the few Tufts games I couldn't watch. I have, however, seen the Lady Royals a couple of times. I remember your #55/#54 combo well. 6'1" SR Meredith Mesaris is impressive. 20+ ppg, 86% FT, and is more mobile and versatile than I expected, at first glance. She's even hit 22 3's on the year, with 3 of them coming in that win over Tufts. I also *really* like your younger, more slender big, 6'0" SO Sarah Payonk. Nearly averaging a double-double, and shooting 84% at the line. Quality production from a young player. I'm sure the other Landmark teams are thrilled to have to deal with Payonk for two more years! It's unusual for a team to have their 4/5 players be the clear go to's, but different is often better, and Scranton's having another great year - and with an interim HC, to boot! Quite impressive. Good luck in the NCAAs - maybe even a rematch, perhaps?   

You're very perceptive in your analysis of Meredith and Sara. Meredith has been a force from day 1 with an impressive array of offensive weapons, but Sara is the one whose play is appreciated by true fans of basketball. She does Everything on the court with no let-up in effort and still visibly enjoys playing the game, at the same time. I haven't seen any Scranton player have a more impressive debut than Sara's last season with a double double against a quality team and player(Montclair and Melissa Tobie). We have a 3rd big, also, who comes off the bench and hit for 30 in an NCAA game last season.
  Good luck in the NCAAs, also, and there would seem to be a good chance of a rematch, Elite 8 or later. Scranton has stumbled a couple of times this season, so anything can happen in the interim.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on February 18, 2015, 10:53:21 AM
Here are my highly unofficial predictions for 2014-15 All-NESCAC WBB:

1st Team
Sara Binkhorst, Bowdoin (SR)
Samantha Graber, Hamilton (JR)
Ellen Cook, Williams (SR)
Hayley Kanner, Tufts (SR)
Mairead Hynes, Conn College (FR)

2nd Team
Ali Doswell, Amherst (SO)
Shannon Brady, Bowdoin (JR)
Michela North, Tufts (SO)
Carylanne Wolfington, Colby (JR)
Mackenzine Griffin, Trinity (JR)

Player Of The Year: Sara Binkhorst, Bowdoin

Rookie Of The Year: Mairead Hynes, Conn College

Coach Of The Year: Carla Berube, Tufts

Defensive Player Of The Year: (far too subjective for me to even attempt)    :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 18, 2015, 11:37:55 AM
Amherst wins the Little Three again...beats Wesleyan in Middletown to close out the regular season.  It was a 30 point win....about the same as the conference counting game in LeFrak recently.
What is important for me to point out any score difference here is it was done with more "bench" contribution.  Believe Meg Robertson may have played her best offensive game in a long time...scoring 20 points with 18 in the first half.  coach G. Put on the floor a number of combinations and the offense continued well.  A particular sequence of passes that led to an easy layup got the top assistant and others off the bench and cheering.  I got the impression that the offense was directed to score inside...by the guards on drives and front court players on lay ups....in short...less reliance on the outside shot that could be impacted more in unfamiliar gyms...away games ahead.
It proved to be a most useful game for both coaches...as the WES coach also rotated a number of players...often two or more at a time and called a bunch of time outs.
A "classroom" game...a worthwhile game, imo.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on February 18, 2015, 02:40:02 PM
Thanks for offering your all-NESCAC picks. They've got me working overtime, but I find it a real challenge to evaluate the players with any high degree of confidence. I have been excavating the NESCAC conference statistics but am not sure this is a productive exercise. Do you, as I am inclined to do, give more weight to the conference play, against the better teams, with slightly additional weight on end of season performance? How highly do you rate the eye test, and do other seasons impact your picks? d3wbbfan, it seems that perhaps you see more games than some of us do. I tend to watch all the Tufts games and the other games of interest, Bowdoin-Amherst, Williams-Amherst, etc. I haven't seen much of Hynes or Griffin, Graber or Coppola. Because I live in a remote region of Maine, getting to Brunswick or Waterville is a challenge, much less Medford, Hartford, or Amherst. Now that tournament time is here, I will be traveling to catch the all NESCAC and NCAA games that our weather will permit.

Some of the stats I found: 
Allie Coppola of Bates is one of the top rebounders and an assist-to-turnover leaders, an unusual link.
Lauren Dillon, the unexpected PG starter for Tufts, led the league in assists--thank you Michaela and Haley.
Mackenzie Griffin had a great season for Trinity, period.
Mairead Hynes, a super fy, had 26 pts and 20 rebs against Griffin in New London. Wow.

It's tough to place talented team players on a balanced team on a continuum. This is true for Amherst while Tufts has potentially 4 all-conference performers. My take is that North has been more consistently instrumental to the success of the team--tougher than last year, and I would give her the nod over Kanner, but it's a tossup. Lauren Dillon has been consistent while running the offense and defending. Hannah Foley is a fantastic shooter and defends and rebounds at a very high level.
For discussion purposes, let me suggest my two WBB teams, also highly unofficial.

1st Team
Shannon Brady, Bowdoin -- Binkhorst's a great shooter, but I like Shannon's whole body of work
Mairead Hynes, Connecticut College
Michela North, Tufts
Lauren Dillon, Tufts
Allie Coppola, Bates

2nd Team
Hayley Kanner, Tufts
Ellen Cook, Williams
Mackenzie Griffin, Trinity
Sara Binkhorst, Bowdoin
Samantha Graber, Hamilton

I'll take a pass on the other superlatives.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on February 19, 2015, 03:09:12 AM
nescacbbrules, I thoroughly enjoyed reading your choices, and hearing of your reasoning. A pure and refreshing take.

Mine was who I think will actually appear, and I didn't use much, if any, personal evaluation. (Much as I would've liked to - more fun that way!) What makes doing the NESCAC especially challenging is that they only have 10 total spots. No league in the country has as few - some leagues honor more than 5 players per team, and include a 3rd team or honorable mention, further hamstringing me, selection-wise.

All I will say is that I have inside knowledge as to how these things usually go down, with the school's SID and/or assigned WBB person helping provide data/thoughts to the coaches:

1) Look at last year's 1st team/2nd team lists, and see who returned this year. And unless they missed major time due to injury, or had a precipitous stat/performance dropoff, they're virtually a guarantee to re-appear. Seven players fall in this category:

2013-14 1st Team:
-Sara Binkhorst, SR (15.2 ppg) (my prediction: repeat 1st Team)

-Ellen Cook, SR (14.6 ppg) (my prediction: repeat 1st Team)

-Kelsey Morehead, SR (gets left off, 100% due to her pre-season injury)

2013-14 2nd Team:
-Shannon Brady, JR (13.8 ppg) (my prediction: 2nd team. I cede your point. I, too, admire her all-around game. But she still has next year; Binkhorst doesn't.)

-Ali Doswell, SO (12.3 ppg) (my prediction: 2nd team. Personally, I don't believe any LJs should appear this year. That said, I just don't think she'll be left off-she is their leading scorer again. Besides, a team can't be 22-2, and then have no one selected. It's not PC.)

-Hannah Foley, SR (she was my #1 hardest choice to leave off-especially being a SR this yr. But she's a scoring guard, and has only averaged 11.5 ppg. That's not a lot, really. I believe the usual, repeat selection/upperclassman sentiment strongly favors Foley and Kanner, but you and I both know that North has clearly been Tufts best and most consistent player all year, despite being just a SO. But where does the sentiment end, and the logic begin? The actual choice will be fun to watch. You know Coach Berube would rather see her SRs, Kanner and Foley, honored before North. Between you and me, Michela, having two years left, could be left out altogether....)

-Hayley Kanner, SR (13.1 ppg) (my prediction: 1st team. Personally, I think she deserves 2nd team again. North has just played better. Further, Hayley has really struggled with her post offense the last couple of weeks. I'm guessing that won't matter in the end, however.)


2) Pull up the stat category of league PPG leaders (which I know is going to make your cringe, nescacbbrules; please don't shoot the messenger - just telling you the truth.....)

-Samantha Graber (JR) (17.4 ppg) (my prediction: 1st Team. Sam has carried this team on her back all year, and into the playoffs, almost single-handedly.)

-Mairead Hynes (FR) (16.9 ppg) (my prediction: 1st Team. Even her own coaches were shocked at how good she was, from Day 1. Still, she'd be incredibly easy to move down to 2nd team, as a FY, given the fact she's also gonna be FR Of The Year.)

-Mackenzie Griffin (JR) (16.2 ppg) (my prediction: 2nd team. I think she's easily been the best "off-the-NESCAC radar" player this year.  The Bantams lost so much to graduation last May, it was always gonna be a rebuilding year. Without her, though? Scary bad.)

-Carylanne Wolfington (JR) (14.9 ppg) (my prediction: 2nd team. Colby's got enough solid stat line players for one to appear here, and are on the rise as a team. She outscored fellow JR Mia Diplock by 3ppg. Caitlyn Nolan is just a SO, and SR Brooke Chandor only scores 9.3ppg; not enough to even get her in the discussion.)

-Michela North (SO) (13.9 ppg) (my prediction: 2nd team. Already discussed her situation above.)


3) In the case where two players from the same team have similar general stat lines, give the all-conference "tiebreaker" nod to the upperclassmen. In the case where two players from different teams have very similar stat lines, give the all-conference nod to the player from the team who had the better overall W-L record.

4) Call your fellow coaches, and ask if there is a specific player of theirs that they would like to see on the all-conference team, and vice versa. It's not always done, but it is quite often. Basic coaching community common courtesy. I've found that a good many coaches have strong opinions as to which of their own players they would like to see be given the honor, and some will lobby the others, to make it happen. Usually, as long as that specific player's numbers are in the general ballpark of the other players chosen, fellow coaches will almost always vote as they are asked to. Because, down the road, you may feel the exact same way about one of your kids, and will need their help to get them the honor. Basically, this exercise is like everything else in this world - there's some back room jostling. 

nescacbbrules, you and I are surely president and VP of the Lauren Dillon fan club. Her accomplishments filling in for Morehead notwithstanding, it is typically not the type of season that has ever really resulted in an all-conference selection. Especially as a FY, and also given the fact that Morehead may very well be back in the Jumbo lineup this Saturday, for the #8 at #1 quarterfinal vs Hamilton. Lauren's surely placed herself on the radar for the next three years, however. Especially if she can eventually reach Kelsey's level, as a more consistent scoring threat. As for Allie Coppola (SO) from Bates, I also feel that an all-league appearance for her is just a bit premature. She really is undersized for a post, but she's awfully crafty, and very tenacious out there. She easily has the best all-around skillset on the team. Losing Molly Brown was tough, but it gave some youngsters valuable PT. If Nason can work on shooting a better % from deep next year, and Connors and Davenport make the improvements I expect them to make on the defensive end next year, I expect to see the same W-L leap from Allie and the Bobcats that I saw from Colby this year. I really think we'll see Coach Murphy and Bates make the playoffs next season.     

And you're right - I make it a point to try and check out each NESCAC team as often as I possibly can online. Crossing my fingers that Colby and Bates will join the other NESCAC schools, and begin to provide video for all home games. The two schools are now way behind the country on this. Them not streaming video of their WBB games prevented me from seeing/evaluating either one nearly as much as I would've liked. To answer your earlier question, I am a *huge* proponent of the "eye test." I use it and trust it more than anything. Numerous companies offer this service in ME, at affordable rates. Audio commentary is optional. Ambient sound is fine. Us fans (not the mention the parents of the players) will be ecstatic! Safe travels, and enjoy the action this weekend. Being able to watch in person is always more fun!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on February 19, 2015, 03:08:41 PM
d3wbbfan, thanks for your response. You know very well how the process works; the horse trading by coaches, the current and past status within the team and conference of upperclass players, etc. And I get that your all-conference teams relied on last year's teams, points per game, class, etc. Your predictions will no doubt look more like the teams that are announced than mine. For my own sake, really, I wanted to look across the breadth of the conference and try to assess the season without those other factors involved. I don't pretend my suggestions bear any resemblance to what the coaches and SIDs would promote. I just tried to evaluate statistically all the conference categories and come to some balanced approach.

My parochial interests are mostly about Tufts. Let's take a look at the case of Lauren Dillon, for example. She led the CAC conference stats by more than one assist per game. She had one of the best assist-to-turnover ratios as well. It is certainly noteworthy that she stepped in for Kelsey, an all-conference senior PG, and floor-generaled the team to an undefeated regular season conference schedule. She averaged 2 points less than Kelsey and had an additonal .6 TO per game, but all other stats from shooting percentage to rebounds are very close. Lauren had a great team with senior leadership and Kelsey and Michelle were there to talk her through tough patches. How, then, should we evaluate her without all the other exceptions and factors you mentioned? I think Kelsey Morehead would undoubtedly have been a top candidate for player of the year in the superlative category, but how does her injury affect the way we evaluate the job that Lauren did? Maybe the only solution is that there should be a "Tufts tandem point guard" award.

When you think about Hannah Foley, should the fact that she plays on a team with two outstanding go-to forwards and is not the first offensive choice limit the way we evaluate her talent? How inflated do you imagine her stat line would be with any other team in the NESCAC? Doesn't her outstanding defense, shooting percentages, and all around hustle get her past any concerns about 11.5PPG? Oh, BTW, Hannah was tops in conference play in assist-to-turnover ratio and 8th in rebounding! (Ahead of Kanner) Should we devalue her status even knowing she would easily have scored 15 PPG on other teams?

One of the more interesting stats I came across in my research was the fact that Dillon, Foley, Lee, and Roberson are each in the top 7 in assist-to-turnover ratio for conference play among players over 200 minutes. Renner and the two Doswells for Amherst are the other 3. Says a lot about what Berube and Gromacki value. Tufts is also tops once again in all of Div 3 in scoring defense. Kate Kerrigan of Bowdoin is the leader in steals and highly ranked in rebounds, assists, and shooting percentage. Along with Kaufman (Middlebury), Hynes (Connecticut College), Dillon and Baptista (Tufts), Connnors (Bates), Getman (Hamilton), and Fernandez (Williams), Kerrigan is part of a talented group of first years.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on February 19, 2015, 03:13:19 PM
Quote from: nescacbbrules on February 19, 2015, 03:08:41 PM
d3wbbfan, thanks for your response. You know very well how the process works; the horse trading by coaches, the current and past status within the team and conference of upperclass players, etc. And I get that your all-conference teams relied on last year's teams, points per game, class, etc. Your predictions will no doubt look more like the teams that are announced than mine. For my own sake, really, I wanted to look across the breadth of the conference and try to assess the season without those other factors involved. I don't pretend my suggestions bear any resemblance to what the coaches and SIDs would promote. I just tried to evaluate statistically all the conference categories and come to some balanced approach.

My parochial interests are mostly about Tufts. Let's take a look at the case of Lauren Dillon, for example. She led the CAC conference stats by more than one assist per game. She had one of the best assist-to-turnover ratios as well. It is certainly noteworthy that she stepped in for Kelsey, an all-conference senior PG, and floor-generaled the team to an undefeated regular season conference schedule. She averaged 2 points less than Kelsey and had an additonal .6 TO per game, but all other stats from shooting percentage to rebounds are very close. Lauren had a great team with senior leadership and Kelsey and Michelle were there to talk her through tough patches. How, then, should we evaluate her without all the other exceptions and factors you mentioned? I think Kelsey Morehead would undoubtedly have been a top candidate for player of the year in the superlative category, but how does her injury affect the way we evaluate the job that Lauren did? Maybe the only solution is that there should be a "Tufts tandem point guard" award.

When you think about Hannah Foley, should the fact that she plays on a team with two outstanding go-to forwards and is not the first offensive choice limit the way we evaluate her talent? How inflated do you imagine her stat line would be with any other team in the NESCAC? Doesn't her outstanding defense, shooting percentages, and all around hustle get her past any concerns about 11.5PPG? Oh, BTW, Hannah was tops in conference play in assist-to-turnover ratio and 8th in rebounding! (Ahead of Kanner) Should we devalue her status even knowing she would easily have scored 15 PPG on other teams?

One of the more interesting stats I came across in my research was the fact that Dillon, Foley, Lee, and Roberson are each in the top 7 in assist-to-turnover ratio for conference play among players over 200 minutes. Renner and the two Doswells for Amherst are the other 3. Says a lot about what Berube and Gromacki value. Tufts is also tops once again in all of Div 3 in scoring defense. Kate Kerrigan of Bowdoin is the leader in steals and highly ranked in rebounds, assists, and shooting percentage. Along with Kaufman (Middlebury), Hynes (Connecticut College), Dillon and Baptista (Tufts), Connnors (Bates), Getman (Hamilton), and Fernandez (Williams), Kerrigan is part of a talented group of first years.

I've mentioned a couple of times this year that Kate Kerrigan is a PLAYER.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on February 19, 2015, 05:51:22 PM
Ronk, yes you have and yes, she is. Looking forward to seeing more of her in tournament play.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 21, 2015, 03:14:54 PM
Very interesting (and effective) lineup for Amherst
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 21, 2015, 04:43:48 PM
Amherst wins over Colby by 20 plus...low scoring.  The lineup that started was a "big" lineup.  What I found interesting was the absence of normal PG Renner in the lineup/ game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 21, 2015, 06:22:37 PM
Amherst looked very good today against Colby.  I thought that there big lineup was very effective.  Hackley was outstanding. I thought they had much better ball movement then some other games that I watched this year.  Look much more like the power house Amherst teams of 2010-2013, with the weave offense and suffocating defense.  Colby was 6-23 from three, and at least three of those were desperation shots that went in.  I think Amherst will give Bowdoin a very difficult game next Saturday.  Williams squeaked by Conn College.  I expect to see a Tufts-Amherst match up in the final.
It seems like Amherst could go much deeper into their bench during games--I wonder why they don't.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on February 21, 2015, 07:03:13 PM
Looks like Robertson benefited from the tall lineup. Is Renner hurt or sick? She did not play at all. A Doswell uncharacteristically had 7 TO's and only 1 assist.
Bowdoin's lineup produced an easy win with the usual suspects statistically: Brady, Binkhorst, and Kerrigan, who had 11 rebs. Ally Silfen had a remarkable game off the bench with 17 points. I think the Amherst/Bowdoin match-up on Saturday will be a real battle.
Tufts dominated Hamilton defensively from the start with North putting up an easy 12 points and 14 rebounds. Dillon had her typical game at the point but also scored 10 and Kelsey Morehead returned and sparked the team with 2 threes. Tufts was up 23 at the half and led 51-18 with 12 minutes to play. They cruised and looked very sharp at times. 
Those who predicted that the Camels had a shot in Williamstown were proven correct. Williams escaped somehow because, in part, the guards for CC shot 3 for 24. Cook was a non-factor at best for the Ephs, shooting 1 for 8 with 5 rebs and 3 TO's, only 2 points. Uwanaka and Fechtelkotter produced huge results off the bench to send Manning's squad to the semis against the Jumbos and probably assure them an NCAA bid.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: d3wbbfan on February 22, 2015, 06:59:03 AM
Quote from: amh63 on February 21, 2015, 04:43:48 PM
Amherst wins over Colby by 20 plus...low scoring.  The lineup that started was a "big" lineup.  What I found interesting was the absence of normal PG Renner in the lineup/ game.
amh63, one of the LJ student announcers, after initially wondering out loud why Renner hadn't started/wasn't playing Sat vs Colby, went on to state late in the first half that he'd just noticed Renner sitting on the Amherst bench, in street clothes. I hate to see starters/key contributors for any team not able to be to play - especially at this time of year.

And congrats on your girl Meg - that's two straight games now, where she's displayed the exceptional form she so often showed in games pre-injury.

In that same spirit, it was fantastic to see Kelsey Morehead back out there for Tufts. Based on the brace, I guess the issue was her left knee. Her mobility/quickness looked to be at just about pre-injury levels, which is great news all around.

Bowdoin looked solid and businesslike vs Middlebury. I've become a big fan of first-year HC KJ Krasco, and I can't wait to see how her team's young core progresses after she adds a couple of her own recruiting classes to the mix.

Williams dodged a major bullet at home. Down 10 at the half, Hynes tweaked a knee early in the 2nd half and had to sit, spurring the Eph comeback. Even when Mairead came back in later, re-stabilizing the Camels, there were times when it looked like she was basically playing on one leg, and guts alone. When she received the inbounds pass at the FT line with :04 to go, with CC down one, the video's picture frame kinda cut off the action, but it looked to me like Hynes was basically tackled by a Williams player - the Ephs were extraordinarily fortunate to have somehow emerged from that final sequence with a no call. And I doubt that they would have, were the game not being played at Chandler. You surely want the players to decide an important game, but the level of contact there appeared to be just too significant to ignore. Mairead is solidly built, and it was no flop. I believe Hynes was still down during the post-game handshake line.

There are some wonderful Eph fans who post here, who I much admire, but I caution for minimal expectations from here. I'm thinking "two and out" is most likely what's ahead. They'll again make the NCAA field, as strong numbers used by the selection committee obscure the very same eye test Williams miserably failed (to me) last year. Same group. Same issues. They'll again get shipped out to NY/PA somewhere. If they happen to draw a weak league's AQ, they might even win a game. I place 0% blame for this plight on the players, who are nothing but total effort and total class at all times. I only wish they were being better positioned to be rewarded in postseason, for their consistent dedication and hard work.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 22, 2015, 08:37:29 AM
D3wbbfan....thanks for the info wrt to Renner.  Have followed her older sister at Amherst and chatted with her father at games for years.  Quite an athletic family.  The present Renner was a top multi- sport player in HS.  Sure any injury is bugging her.  Did not get any video view of her on the bench to see if she was into the game.
Agreed with your thoughts wrt to Williams in the post season...but most would say it is because I'm a LJ fan :).  Actually, I have noticed that sr. Cook has been very quiet in her play in many late season games.  I also feel that Williams' talent has not been used well....but have not watched enough non Amherst games over the years to make a definitive opinion here.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 22, 2015, 11:38:25 AM
Based on the games I have seen this season, Williams is by far the weakest of the NESCAC final four.  I would be surprised if their game with Tufts is close.  They have a couple of good players, but don't have the overall talent of the other three teams in the finals. As I said in my earlier post, an Amherst team that plays the way they did Saturday, working to get the ball inside, moving the ball, and taking the three when it is there, will be a formidable opponent for Bowdoin.  Although I like Bowdoin, and think that Brady, Binkhorst and the other guards are excellent, Amherst's tenacious defense will make this a very close game.  I would also expect Tufts, Amherst and Bowdoin to get NCAA bids.  As another poster said, Williams may get in, but they aren't a top team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bowdoin74 on February 24, 2015, 07:16:14 AM
Hannah Graham (notorious name) to Bowdoin. 

http://bangordailynews.com/2015/02/23/sports/tourney-time/bouchard-graham-worcester-irving-earn-osborne-mvp-all-tourney-awards/
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on February 24, 2015, 01:14:35 PM
I wouldn't count out Williams just yet. Every team needs a little bit of magic to survive  and advance in the playoffs and maybe Williams had a touch against Conn College. Nevertheless, Cook and MacDonald, their two senior starters, had two points between them, Fernandez, the freshman point guard, had no assists, Williams scored only 45 points, shot 1 for 11 on 3 pointers and still found a way to win. Their front court of Uwanaka and Litman saved the day.
Williams has depth and that's important at playoff time when opponents focus on your primary options.  They also led Tufts in their home game this month with two minutes to go and couldn't close it. They can beat Tufts, if they play together and have some playoff magic. The Williams front court matches up well against Kanner (2-14 vs Williams) and North. Fernandez, if she's on, can guard Foley. Tufts should definitely be favored, but don't throw dirt on the Williams grave quite yet. Depth matters now.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on February 24, 2015, 02:06:03 PM
It is so nice to hear that Hannah Graham is headed to Bowdoin. I have enjoyed watching her positive, smart, all-around play in the Maine HS tournament for the past 4 years. My daughter played for the Polar Bears and had a wonderful experience. All the best to Hannah.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on February 24, 2015, 04:39:28 PM
Quote from: nescacbbrules on February 24, 2015, 02:06:03 PM
It is so nice to hear that Hannah Graham is headed to Bowdoin. I have enjoyed watching her positive, smart, all-around play in the Maine HS tournament for the past 4 years. My daughter played for the Polar Bears and had a wonderful experience. All the best to Hannah.

Did she play for Stephanie Pemper? Scranton played Bowdoin in the NCAA tourney in consecutive years('04&'05) and the '05 game was as fine a game as I've ever seen in the tourney. I usually see Stephanie at the summer AAU tourneys, looking for Navy midshipmen now.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on February 24, 2015, 06:15:41 PM
Yes, Ronk. She played on the teams that beat Scranton at home in '04, ultimately losing its only game in the final seconds of the national championship game to Wilmington, and the '05 team that lost at Scranton to Taryn Mellody and the Lady Royals in the sectional final. That was a great game in a tremendous atmosphere. Pemper's teams had some great runs.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on February 24, 2015, 06:39:57 PM
Quote from: nescacfan1 on February 24, 2015, 01:14:35 PM
I wouldn't count out Williams just yet. Every team needs a little bit of magic to survive  and advance in the playoffs and maybe Williams had a touch against Conn College. Nevertheless, Cook and MacDonald, their two senior starters, had two points between them, Fernandez, the freshman point guard, had no assists, Williams scored only 45 points, shot 1 for 11 on 3 pointers and still found a way to win. Their front court of Uwanaka and Litman saved the day.
Williams has depth and that's important at playoff time when opponents focus on your primary options.  They also led Tufts in their home game this month with two minutes to go and couldn't close it. They can beat Tufts, if they play together and have some playoff magic. The Williams front court matches up well against Kanner (2-14 vs Williams) and North. Fernandez, if she's on, can guard Foley. Tufts should definitely be favored, but don't throw dirt on the Williams grave quite yet. Depth matters now.

Nescacfan1, I am willing to bet that no one who has seen Williams this year is counting them out of any game. The are long, experienced, and very athletic. To say that they are seeded appropriately behind Bowdoin, Amherst, and Tufts in no way assumes that they should be counted out. You can rest assured that Jumbo fans, players, and coaches know how difficult this semi-final will be and will take nothing for granted. Although Tufts has won the last for meetings over the past four seasons, two were nail biters including this year's game. I do believe that Tufts reserves with two 6 footers, Melissa Baptista and Maura Folliard, and guards, Josie Lee and the recently returned Kelsey Morehead, makes them less vulnerable to Williams' outstanding lineup and bench. As for predictions, I rate the Polar Bears, LJs game as a pick-em, with a slight edge to Bowdoin if Renner cannot go. Bowdoin has leadership and confidence going into this game. I like Tufts on their home court by 8. Can't wait.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bowdoin74 on February 26, 2015, 07:09:03 PM
Hannah Graham named one of three finalists for Miss Maine Basketball today.  I believe the last MMB finalist on the Bowdoin roster was Jill Henrikson '12. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Hoopsinfo on February 28, 2015, 12:56:48 AM
Should be an exciting weekend of basketball.  The Lord Jeffs played well against Colby with more of an inside presence and less dependence on the 3.  Against Bowdoin and Tufts (hopefully), like to see the Lord Jeffs push the ball up the court and take advantage of their speed and quickness over some of the taller players.  Speed and quickness is an LJ asset to be used against taller teams.  Pushing the ball up the court and playing an inside out game, will actually provide more open looks at the basket, including from the 3 point line.  The important thing for Amherst is to make Bowdoin respect the inside game and that can be done by pushing the ball up the court. As mentioned in the previous post, the Lord Jeffs also have to make better use of their bench.  They need a tough inside presence against these teams - a presence that Giddens and Nagle have proven they can provide off the bench in addition to the starters. Keep everyone fresh - rotate players and play an up-tempo game.  Robertson and Giddens can score and rebound inside, even against taller opponents as they have proven all year.  I also like Doswell (Meredith) and Nagle's strong inside presence.   Amherst is a deep team - use the speed, quickness and depth to wear others down - and we will see the tournament title return to Amherst. It will be interesting to see if GP adjusts strategy to change the game in Amherst's favor in the match-ups this weekend.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on February 28, 2015, 02:33:05 PM
Hannah Foley injures right knee. Gym silent.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jumpshot on February 28, 2015, 05:49:12 PM
A cohesive, unselfish Bowdoin team has fun beating amHerst today. lord jeffettes didn't start to play freely until late in the game. Appears to be too much a case of being a "job surrounded by expectations." Certainly skilled players and good kids ....just wound up too tight with not enough smiling ....
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 28, 2015, 07:28:17 PM
Bowdoin played a great game today.  Once Amherst got behind early, I thought they got out of their disciplined offense and started jacking up quick threes, and Bowdoin just came down and ran a very effective half court offense.  Was really surprised at how ineffective Robertson was, and when Amherst took her out, Brady went wild.  Probably the best game Bowdoin has played all season.  Tufts did not play well against Williams, and I think the Foley injury really hurts them. If Bowdoin plays the way they played today, they beat Tufts.  In any event, both Tufts and Bowdoin should be hosting first round NCAA games.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: CasualFan2 on February 28, 2015, 10:15:05 PM
I agree that Bowdoin probably played best game today.  That having been said it was clear the second half of the year, despite the apparent depth, Amherst is not what they have been.  Still very good, but not what they were in the past.  Sounds crazy, buy maybe too much depth.   The great teams of 3,4,5 and 6 years ago had studs, but not always a lot of depth.  The present team has a lot of good players, but no true stud.  Some may say that Robertson is/was, but in reality she is one of those unfortunate college kids who had a bad injury and robbed her of two of her four seasons.   She was never the same.  Amherst gets in, probably, but I doubt they advance too far.  When was the last time they played an NCAA game on the road?  It is a big difference for all teams, but especially for Amherst.  When was the last big game they won on the road?

Too bad for Tufts they lost Foley.  Does anyone know how bad the injury is?  I agree they will lose to Bowdoin if she is out.

Interesting day, to see a bit of a changing of the guard. (just a bit).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 01, 2015, 07:42:48 AM
Not sure I would call this a changing of the guard. I believe that the only teams to win the NESCAC are Bowdoin, Amherst and Tufts.  Bowdoin obviously ruled the league for many years, and appears to again be a force.  They were clearly better than Amherst in the regular season game, and even more dominant yesterday (perhaps the D3 pollsters will actually rank them ahead of Amherst this week).  I do agree that Amherst is clearly not as good as they have been.  They have talent, but as I said in my earlier post, when things go wrong, they seem to panic on the floor a bit. But don't be surprised to see them win a couple of games in the tournament--they are still better than the majority of other teams in the area.

I think today's game will be very competitive.  Tufts won in a blow out earlier this year (at Tufts)--Tufts was up 20 with 3 minutes left.  I expect a different game today
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on March 01, 2015, 10:01:26 AM
Quote from: Maine1 on March 01, 2015, 07:42:48 AM
Not sure I would call this a changing of the guard. I believe that the only teams to win the NESCAC are Bowdoin, Amherst and Tufts.  Bowdoin obviously ruled the league for many years, and appears to again be a force.  They were clearly better than Amherst in the regular season game, and even more dominant yesterday (perhaps the D3 pollsters will actually rank them ahead of Amherst this week).  I do agree that Amherst is clearly not as good as they have been.  They have talent, but as I said in my earlier post, when things go wrong, they seem to panic on the floor a bit. But don't be surprised to see them win a couple of games in the tournament--they are still better than the majority of other teams in the area.

I think today's game will be very competitive.  Tufts won in a blow out earlier this year (at Tufts)--Tufts was up 20 with 3 minutes left.  I expect a different game today
I have to agree with Maine1 on the changing of the guard idea. Even when they stopped dominating, Bowdoin never went away, just as Amherst and Tufts won't through coaching changes and restocking periods. These are three quality programs who have shown the ability to sustain excellence, even if the order changes periodically. Regardless of today's outcome, I would expect these three teams to make their presence felt in the NCAAs.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 01, 2015, 11:20:45 AM
From my perspective, Amherst and Tufts leaped into prominence when Gromacki and Berube were hired. Prior to those hires, Bowdoin was NESCAC's dominant voice and Williams and Bates as the backup singers. Manning, who enjoyed great success before the modern advent of NESCAC women's conference, has kept Williams in that role, but the continued success of the Bowdoin program since Pemper's departure is a testament to Shibles, although not particularly surprising since she had experienced great success at Swarthmore previously. It will be a challenge for the other NESCAC programs to approach the success that these three teams have maintained over time. Shibles' teams at Bowdoin are 149-46 (winning % of 76), Berube's Tufts teams are 267-79 (77%), and the gaudy Gromacki Amherst teams are 230-21 (91%) currently. By way of comparison, Mannings' record is outstanding over her 25 year career, 446-191, a 70% winning record, and Jim Murphy is a laudable 343-187 (64%) at Bates. The stability and consistent excellence of these programs is one of the elements that makes NESCAC women's basketball so dominant in the region and successful nationally. 

From all appearances, Hannah Foley did tear her ACL yesterday. She was playing at a high level at both ends of the floor, not relying solely on the 3-pointer. Fortunately, the Jumbos pulled together in the second half, and with the help of Kelsey Morehead's leadership and return to more minutes, found a way to win. Strong teams do that. Case in point, Bowdoin, who lost a leader in Megan Phelps but still found a way to beat Amherst on a neutral floor. Each team is tough and resilient. Congratulations to both. Heading to Cousens now to enjoy a great game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on March 01, 2015, 11:32:38 AM
Very well said and a thoughtful post. Thank you.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 01, 2015, 01:50:25 PM
Thanks. Josie Lee and Emma Roberson: awesome! Team defense so solid. North and Kanner such tough matchups. Strong win against a very game Bowdoin team. Well done Jumbos.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Hoopsinfo on March 01, 2015, 02:11:51 PM
Bowdoin played well yesterday - congrats.  Should be a good final today.  Not clear to me why Amherst shied away from good interior defense and relied on the 3 (26 shots).  Bowdoin was scoring at will from the inside and basically, Robertson and Giddens sat on the bench the majority of the game.  Both have demonstrated throughout the season that they can score, rebound and defend on the inside.  Better defense would have slowed Bowdoin down and by attacking the inside more on offense would have opened up more 3 point shots (Amherst shot 50% from 2 and 27% from 3.  This team does have stars, just need to play them and play them in the right positions.  Why not have Prichard start at point guard with Remer out?  This would allow all players to play at the positions best suited to them.  Food for thought going into the NCAAs.  Tufts, Bowdoin and Amherst all have plenty of talent to go far in the NCAAs.  Amherst has depth on their side too.  Play the players in the positions that best suit them and go with strength - don't give up the interior defense and scoring so that the team is heaving desperation 3s.  Looking forward to today's championship game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 01, 2015, 02:45:55 PM
Strong game from Tufts today.  A very good win against a good Bowdoin team.  Bowdoin could not hit the open threes in the first half, which is what let Tufts pull away.  Great game from Josie Lee.  Not sure how Bowdoin or Colby let her get away from Maine.  (The thing that made Colby so good a when McBride was there is that she was able to get more than her share of the top players from Maine).  Tufts has a lot of weapons, and with Morehead playing, and contributions from a number of players, they can make a nice run in the tournament and should be home as long as they are playing.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescachoopsfan2 on March 01, 2015, 03:00:51 PM
Tufts gave up 21 offensive rebounds and turned the ball over 18 times. Kanner shot 4-of-12. Foley was in street clothes...

...and they won. Convincingly.

Outstanding team win for the Jumbos. The defense did a great job limiting Binkhorst to 4 points for the game and Brady to 5 points in the second half. Josie Lee stepped into Foley's spot in the starting lineup and played 35 impactful minutes - 12 points, 6 rebounds, 5 assists, and 3 steals. Emma Roberson played the best game of her career - 16 points on 7 shots. Congratulations to Tufts and Coach Berube. As a neutral observer, they've been fun to watch in recent years.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bowdoin74 on March 01, 2015, 07:16:11 PM
Either Binkhorst, Brady, or Phelps has been the high scorer for each of Bowdoin's 27 games this year.  A third offensive presence was missed.

Congratulations to Tufts.  Well played on both sides of the ball.     
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: CasualFan2 on March 01, 2015, 11:37:54 PM
When I wrote last night, I said "slight" changing of the guard.  I mainly meant Amherst came back to the pack a bit.  A couple of years ago, for a good five years no one, even in the NESCAC, was really going to touch them.  So you had several real good teams and one untouchable one. 

I agree that the coaching changes at Tufts and Amherst began their success.  I do think Tufts will have a hard time without their star player though after round 1 or 2.

So do we see Amherst, Tufts and Bowdoin all host?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 02, 2015, 08:49:56 AM
I am not sure I would say that Amherst was "untouchable".  They were certainly very good, and are still very good. Tufts, Bowdoin, and in the 2009-2011 period Colby, all gave Amherst tough games.
Certainly good to see better balance in the league.  Coaching makes a huge difference at this level. We have said many times on this board that Gromacki is outstanding, and Berube is very good also.
I would be surprised if Amherst hosts, but it could happen.  Tufts and Bowdoin should definitely host this weekend.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: CasualFan2 on March 02, 2015, 10:10:30 AM
I do not want to make it a debate because it is probably semantics.  But from 2009-2010 to 2012-2013 seasons I would argue they were untouchable, well above the rest of their league, that has so many good programs.

2009-2010  (32-1)  only loss in final four
2010-2011  (32-1)  National champs, one in season loss OOC to Kean
2011-2012  (31-2)  only two losses in final four
2013-2013  (30-3)  finally a loss reg season to Williams team that went to final four, and two final four losses

So,  that is total domination of the league.  They are not there any more.  That really is my point.  They are mortal again.  The were not during that stretch. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 02, 2015, 11:00:19 AM
Not to debate--but I would call UCONN and the way they win their league games by an average of something like 45 points a game as untouchable.  Although Amherst clearly was the top team in the league during that period, they had many competitive and close games--so I definitely agree they were the dominant team in the league, but in any of those years there were games that they could have lost.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 02, 2015, 12:27:15 PM
Quote from: CasualFan2 on March 02, 2015, 10:10:30 AM
I do not want to make it a debate because it is probably semantics.  But from 2009-2010 to 2012-2013 seasons I would argue they were untouchable, well above the rest of their league, that has so many good programs.

2009-2010  (32-1)  only loss in final four
2010-2011  (32-1)  National champs, one in season loss OOC to Kean
2011-2012  (31-2)  only two losses in final four
2013-2013  (30-3)  finally a loss reg season to Williams team that went to final four, and two final four losses

So,  that is total domination of the league.  They are not there any more.  That really is my point.  They are mortal again.  The were not during that stretch.


CasualFan2, I think your term, "total domination" suggests non-competitiveness. I might suggest that your case may be stronger from 09-12 where they won conference games by an average of 25 points each season, but was surely not the case for 2012-2103 where that margin dropped to 9 points and that loss to Williams was by 20. That season they beat Conn by 2 and Wes by 4, Tufts by only 6 and 5. They had a great run in the NCAA's but were not by any stretch what I would term dominant.  Tufts and Williams won their conference schedules (all three teams were 9-1) by an average of 18 and 20 points that season. The case can easily be made that Amherst was actually the third best NESCAC team that season but had Marcia Voigt. Williams beat them twice and Tufts lost two very tight games at LeFrak which I have described in other posts. Assuming your point, Tufts has won each of its last 26 NESCAC games (including tournaments), but they, like Amherst during those seasons, have had some relatively tight wins. In regular conference play, their average margins of victory have been 19 and 20 points for the last two seasons. Strong, surely. Dominant....?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 03, 2015, 10:03:04 PM
In glancing at the NCAA brackets, I was a little surprised that neither the Amherst men nor the women will be hosting. For the LJ women, traveling to NYU to face an Eastern team that upset national champions FDU and defeated Williams and Cabrini will not be an easy opening game. With a win they would presumably have to face NYU who should be able to dispatch Virginia Wesleyan in the Coles Center. Bowdoin has to take on NEWMAC champion Babson in the first round, a team that upset Tufts last year. I like Ithaca to beat Mt. Saint Vincent, a 388 SOS squad, and the Bombers are a seasoned group as Tufts learned last year in a game that went to the last second at Cousens. Stevenson looks to be a tough out for Williams at Montclair State, and should they win, the Ephs will face the regionally top-ranked Red Hawks on their home floor. I am sure Stevenson and Montclair would not be looking forward to facing Williams the top SOS team in the nation. Tufts should be able to oust the first time NCAA team from Pine Manor, but then will probably face St John Fisher which upset Ithaca and Stevens to win the E-8 tournament. I think they will be strong in that game at home.
Should the Jumbos get through the first weekend, I hope and would like to expect that the NCAA will follow its recent pattern of allowing the top team remaining in the bracket to host the next round, i.e. Tufts by SOS. As it looks now, I think FDU, Scranton, and perhaps Cabrini will emerge from the first weekend. Sending them all to Medford would require more highway miles but not violate any 500 mile or home team minimums for regional games. Many hours of travel for that round to play your neighbor in a distant venue is par for the course.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 03, 2015, 11:04:27 PM
I think Tufts will easily hold that sectional, especially since Scranton just lost in the Landmark finals.

As for Tufts vs Pine Manor, Tufts should be the favorite but Pine Manor has nothing to lose.  I know its comparing apples to oranges, but 2 years ago USM went into the tourney 27-1 and played a team at home (smith) making its first NCAA appearance.  What happened that game??  USM got theirs doors blown off in a Smith rout.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 04, 2015, 12:07:34 AM
Quote from: nescacbbrules on March 03, 2015, 10:03:04 PM
In glancing at the NCAA brackets, I was a little surprised that neither the Amherst men nor the women will be hosting. For the LJ women, traveling to NYU to face an Eastern team that upset national champions FDU and defeated Williams and Cabrini will not be an easy opening game. With a win they would presumably have to face NYU who should be able to dispatch Virginia Wesleyan in the Coles Center. Bowdoin has to take on NEWMAC champion Babson in the first round, a team that upset Tufts last year. I like Ithaca to beat Mt. Saint Vincent, a 388 SOS squad, and the Bombers are a seasoned group as Tufts learned last year in a game that went to the last second at Cousens. Stevenson looks to be a tough out for Williams at Montclair State, and should they win, the Ephs will face the regionally top-ranked Red Hawks on their home floor. I am sure Stevenson and Montclair would not be looking forward to facing Williams the top SOS team in the nation. Tufts should be able to oust the first time NCAA team from Pine Manor, but then will probably face St John Fisher which upset Ithaca and Stevens to win the E-8 tournament. I think they will be strong in that game at home.
Should the Jumbos get through the first weekend, I hope and would like to expect that the NCAA will follow its recent pattern of allowing the top team remaining in the bracket to host the next round, i.e. Tufts by SOS. As it looks now, I think FDU, Scranton, and perhaps Cabrini will emerge from the first weekend. Sending them all to Medford would require more highway miles but not violate any 500 mile or home team minimums for regional games. Many hours of travel for that round to play your neighbor in a distant venue is par for the course.

Dave McHugh relayed my question on that exact topic to Dave Martin(women's chair) and Martin said the most deserving will get the sectional host and, by omission of a geography factor in his answer, I take that to mean that anything inside of the 500-mile barrier will not affect that choice. My own judgment is that it's foolish to send 2 teams 2 extra hours or more(pick your line in the sand) for winter time travel. It was hard to believe in 2009 that Muhlenberg was sent to Bowdoin(445 miles) for a regional pod(the approximate distance to Medford for Catholic if Catholic wins its regional).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 04, 2015, 09:12:08 AM
Ronk, thanks. I heard the Hoopsville response to your question. As you know, the drive from the Lehigh Valley to Maine or from DC to Boston is not short, and the NCAA has done some interesting things to send teams on the road. The neighboring USM and Bowdoin teams had to drive over 400 miles each to play one another in Wilkes Barre at Kings College in the 2003 regional semifinal. Eastern Connecticut University only had to go 225 miles from Willimantic. 1060 miles in total for the three teams. But Saint Patrick's Day in a flooded Wilkes Barre was a treat.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 04, 2015, 04:20:14 PM
Quote from: nescacbbrules on March 04, 2015, 09:12:08 AM
Ronk, thanks. I heard the Hoopsville response to your question. As you know, the drive from the Lehigh Valley to Maine or from DC to Boston is not short, and the NCAA has done some interesting things to send teams on the road. The neighboring USM and Bowdoin teams had to drive over 400 miles each to play one another in Wilkes Barre at Kings College in the 2003 regional semifinal. Eastern Connecticut University only had to go 225 miles from Willimantic. 1060 miles in total for the three teams. But Saint Patrick's Day in a flooded Wilkes Barre was a treat.

I hear you-you don't want to penalize schools because they are outliers or reward the geographically-centered but there should be some common sense. I'm familiar with USM and Bowdoin campuses since playing them both in the 2005 NCAAs, i stopped by on a trip to Acadia a few summers ago. Wouldn't want to trudge from the Bowdoin dorms back to their gym on a cold Maine winter night. Good luck with Babson; they were a Scranton opponent this year in Puerto Rico but I didn't get to see any video on the game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: just a fan 22 on March 04, 2015, 05:47:11 PM
When you're the third or fourth at-large bid from a region, you really can't complain about where you get put. Bowdoin was always going to host, and I would have been shocked if Amherst got to - they didn't deserve it.

The selection committee wants to minimize plane trips. So long as you are within 500 miles, they don't care if you're next door or 498 miles away.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 04, 2015, 06:11:05 PM
Quote from: 7express on March 03, 2015, 11:04:27 PM
I think Tufts will easily hold that sectional, especially since Scranton just lost in the Landmark finals.

As for Tufts vs Pine Manor, Tufts should be the favorite but Pine Manor has nothing to lose.  I know its comparing apples to oranges, but 2 years ago USM went into the tourney 27-1 and played a team at home (smith) making its first NCAA appearance.  What happened that game??  USM got theirs doors blown off in a Smith rout.

I know what you mean when you say that Pine Manor has nothing to lose. First round tournament games lend themselves to upsets because of that psychology. However, Pine Manor is the smallest of "Davids," a D-3 schools with only 213 students, a 9-9 D3 record and a 420th ranked strength of schedule (SOS).  By analogy, "Goliath" (Jumbo?), Tufts, at 26-1 has 5000 students and the nation's #2 SOS. So you are right in saying that the comparison is apples to oranges on two fronts. USM did not have a tough schedule that year, playing NESCAC teams that were down including Colby, who was 1-9, conference and only lost by 6. They were not battle tested. Smith, on the other, hand beat Middlebury by 33, Trinity by 21, and Williams by 4 AT Williamstown, so they not only had nothing to lose, but also had every confidence that they could play with USM. They were 22-4 going into that game. Pine Manor lost to Coast Guard by 56 early and is playing better now, but with no starters over 5'7", it will be a daunting challenge to match up with the Jumbos.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 04, 2015, 07:06:08 PM
All NESCAC conference teams and superlatives announced. Hayley Kanner of Tufts wins player of the year for the second time. Shannon Brady and Sara Binkhorst from Bowdoin are also first team selections, with Ellen Cook and Sam Graber rounding out the first team. North and Foley of Tufts make second squad along with Robertson and Doswell from Amherst and Wolfington from Colby. Mairead Hynes of Connecticut College is the rookie of the year, with Kate Kerrigan from Bowdoin and Cook the co-defensive players. Carla Berube is the top coach for a fifth time.

http://www.nescac.com/sports/wbkb/2014-15/honors/allconference
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 05, 2015, 07:42:41 AM
Saw the NESCAC all league team.  One of the things that I have noted over the years is that the NESCAC year-end awards are heavily slanted toward the top teams--which again is the case this season.  Of the 10 people named, Tufts has three, Amherst two, Bowdoin two, and Williams one--that is 8 out of 10.  There are some very good players on the other teams in the conference, but unless you are on a top team, it is very difficult to get all-league consideration in the NESCAC.  I think a perfect example of this in the current year is Robertson of Amherst.  She did not have an all-league season this year, by any measure. The first year from Conn College certainly should have been at least second team. 

Interesting that the NCAA has set up a potential Tufts-Scranton rematch in the bracket. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: just a fan 22 on March 05, 2015, 08:59:02 AM
Are coaches instructed to only take the conference season into account? Because Robertson played a little more than a third of the season, and for the first part of that was only playing 15m a game off the bench.

She made second team all NESCAC on inertia and past accomplishments, in my opinion. Statistically, she certainly didn't deserve it based on her season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 05, 2015, 10:35:33 AM
I agree with each of your comments on inertia and past accomplishments and on the heavy weight that top teams carry on the all-star squads. Has it not always been thus? Hypothetically, I think the only way to get a real all-conference team might be to have the coaches draft their teams (and coach them) from the complete pool of players. Robertson was certainly a top tier player, but she, like many before her, has been unable to reach her prior form this season following her injury. That takes nothing away from her talent, effort, commitment, or leadership. As I mentioned in a prior post, I agree that another player, perhaps from Trinity, Bates, or Connecticut College, merited the slot based on their entire seasons.

The Scranton/Tufts matchup is likely to happen. NESCAC teams have met the Lady Royals with some regularity in the tournament, and I would expect this to be another great game. I doubt Tufts will shoot quite as abysmally if they meet this time, but I heard that that Meredith Mesaris impressed all who saw her. Tufts' twin towers would need to play strong.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 05, 2015, 11:25:28 AM
In a strange weather day.....it seems the impact of snow, etc will impact the games in the mid-Atlantic and NYC more than NE.  Hoping that Amherst gets by Eastern to meet NYU....much purple in the last game? In the NYU gym for awhile.  Matchup better against NYU than Eastern, imo.  If Amherst plays up to their level of talent and capabilities....they will go deep in the post season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 05, 2015, 01:42:17 PM
Much too early to start talking about a Tufts/ Scranton game, but I saw Messaris play three years ago--outstanding player, and in a Tufts/ Scranton game, she would likely be the best player on the court.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 06, 2015, 12:04:59 PM
Just read the tournament prediction, and correct me if I'm wrong, but Megan Robertson was not on the 2011 Championship Amherst team.  Amherst did not win in 2012, but did make the Final Four in 2012 and 2013.  Will be interesting to see if she can put the team on her back and "will" the youngsters to win.  They are going to have to play better defense and take smarter, not panicky shots.  Hope all the NESCAC teams have a successful tourney!  Good luck!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 06, 2015, 12:37:33 PM
NE Jeffs Fan....nice to hear from you....hope all is well!  Plus K for your loyalty :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 06, 2015, 05:48:59 PM
Trying to watch end of Williams game.  Surprised there is no play by play announcer.  I'd think in today's world that if you host you have to have video, announcers, graphics withe the score, as well as live stats.  Just surprised.....as was Williams.  Sorry to see one NESCAC TEAM OUT.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 06, 2015, 10:05:40 PM
The CAC teams goes 3-1 tonight as Amherst, Bowdoin and Tufts win handily.
Amhers will play NYU in NYU's Cole Center on Sat.  Lots of Purple on the floor and in the stands will be seen :).  Meg Robertson played her best game to date as she had 5 blocks, 9 rebounds and 22 points, I believe.  More important, she intimidated Eastern will her blocks early...as Eastern's front court was neutralized. 
NYU also has a fine front court....but Amherst matches up well with the Violets. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on March 07, 2015, 09:42:08 AM
With the losses of Megan Phelps and Emily Campbell for Bowdoin, the starters have been stepping up as expected to fill the void. It should also be noted that 6 foot sophomore Ally Silfen has been contributing quality minutes and scored 13 key points for the Polar Bears against Babson last night. She had 17 against Middlebury in the NESCAC tournament.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 07, 2015, 10:51:14 AM
Polbear73, you mention the work of the Bowdoin starters and bench filling in admirably for Phelps and Campbell. I agree and one starter I was particularly impressed with was Marle Curle. Although she didn't have top games against Tufts, she had another double/double yesterday (plus 5 assists) in the Babson game just as she did against Amherst in the NESCAC tournament. Her speed and energy can cause great challenges for the defense, and teamed with Kate Kerrigan, they are a very talented young backcourt tandem. Good luck today against the Bombers.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 07, 2015, 04:14:17 PM
It's 4PM.  Can anyone explain to me why the 5PM game at NYU has NO...yes NO webcast.  How can a host school get away with that...even in D3!  yes... An UAA school no less.....bush league comes to mind. :'(
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bballfan13 on March 07, 2015, 04:18:58 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 07, 2015, 04:14:17 PM
It's 4PM.  Can anyone explain to me why the 5PM game at NYU has NO...yes NO webcast.  How can a host school get away with that...even in D3!  yes... An UAA school no less.....bush league comes to mind. :'(

Do a little searching and you will find it :-)

http://nyuathletics.tv/broadcasts/index.cfm?fuseaction=usrbrd&broadcasterid=59125&mobi=0
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 07, 2015, 04:45:31 PM
Bballfan13....thanks!  Did find it in the NYU website finally.
Linkage was not on the CAC website nor on the D3 hoop site and even on the Amherst site!
Sent an email to the Amherst AD on the matter....shortly after my earlier post.   Within 15 minutes....there is an link on the Amherst Athletic page....only video.  No stats, etc.
Amherst presently hosting CAC hockey and lacrosse....have video and stats on both.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 07, 2015, 09:13:35 PM
All three teams won tonight!  Amherst had an easy win over NYU led by Allie Doswell...and Megan Robertson...early in the first half.
See that Tufts had to go to OT to win over SJF. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on March 08, 2015, 12:32:44 AM
Quote from: nescacbbrules on March 07, 2015, 10:51:14 AM
Polbear73, you mention the work of the Bowdoin starters and bench filling in admirably for Phelps and Campbell. I agree and one starter I was particularly impressed with was Marle Curle. Although she didn't have top games against Tufts, she had another double/double yesterday (plus 5 assists) in the Babson game just as she did against Amherst in the NESCAC tournament. Her speed and energy can cause great challenges for the defense, and teamed with Kate Kerrigan, they are a very talented young backcourt tandem. Good luck today against the Bombers.
Great call on Marle Curle as she was instrumental in a great win over Ithaca last night with a career high 23 points, including two 3's to tie and then go ahead late. She was a great presence throughout the game. All in all, a great team win, and Curl was outstanding.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: magicman on March 08, 2015, 12:28:34 PM
Quote from: polbear73 on March 08, 2015, 12:32:44 AM
Quote from: nescacbbrules on March 07, 2015, 10:51:14 AM
Polbear73, you mention the work of the Bowdoin starters and bench filling in admirably for Phelps and Campbell. I agree and one starter I was particularly impressed with was Marle Curle. Although she didn't have top games against Tufts, she had another double/double yesterday (plus 5 assists) in the Babson game just as she did against Amherst in the NESCAC tournament. Her speed and energy can cause great challenges for the defense, and teamed with Kate Kerrigan, they are a very talented young backcourt tandem. Good luck today against the Bombers.
Great call on Marle Curle as she was instrumental in a great win over Ithaca last night with a career high 23 points, including two 3's to tie and then go ahead late. She was a great presence throughout the game. All in all, a great team win, and Curl was outstanding.

I was going to come on here and tout Marle Curle's accomplishments, especially the last 2 games in the NCAA tournament, but you guys beat me to it. Going 14x17 from the free throw line in the 2 NCAA games over the weekend has given Marle enough made free throws to once again qualify for the NCAA statistics for free throw percentage. She is now 75 for 83 on the year, including 51 straight during one stretch, and will be ranked 3rd in the nation when the NCAA updates their statistics. Sara Binkhorst continues to be ranked highly as well, currently 13th in the country.

Curle, just a sophomore, took over the game last night in the final 2:40 seconds, not just with her scoring (8 straight points) but with key rebounds and steals as well. Glad she saved her career high in points for such a memorable game. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on March 08, 2015, 01:14:00 PM
I didn't do Marle the justice for her performance as you, magicman. For those who haven't seen it, it's worth going to the Bowdoin athletic website to view the video of the highlights and interviews. It was quite a game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 08, 2015, 02:18:33 PM
Sweet 16 hosts are announced.

http://d3hoops.com/playoffs/men/2015/sectional-hosts-announced

Tufts, Montclair State (Bowdoin and Amherst regional), Thomas More, and Calvin, who gets to play at home because of the 500 mile rule, so George Fox has to travel. Amherst looked very strong at NYU and Bowdoin played tough to come from behind with a...HerCurlean effort...from Marle in Brunswick. Ithaca must feel jinxed. St John Fisher outplayed Tufts for 39:50, but lost because North and Morehead stepped up. Shoutout to the Cardinal women for an outstanding weekend and tournament.
 
Trinity and Bates men moving on as well, so five Sweet 16 teams from the conference. NESCACBBRULES!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: just a fan 22 on March 08, 2015, 04:59:38 PM
Bowdoin ended up with the tougher Ro16 matchup, in my opinion. Montclair State is a tough team that will be doubly tough to beat at home.

Tufts/East Conn should be a decent game, especially with FDU looming and the Tufts players possibly being distracted by anticipating that rematch the second day. No question that Tufts is the stronger team, but they're also rather depleted - in addition to missing Foley, they were without Batista this weekend.

All that said, there aren't any bad teams left in the tournament, so every game is going to be a struggle no matter who or where you play. I'm looking forward to next weekend. Hopefully not all the games start at the same time. Also looking forward to seeing if Wash U can do anything with Sydney Moss.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 08, 2015, 05:41:12 PM
Quote from: just a fan 22 on March 08, 2015, 04:59:38 PM
Bowdoin ended up with the tougher Ro16 matchup, in my opinion. Montclair State is a tough team that will be doubly tough to beat at home.

Tufts/East Conn should be a decent game, especially with FDU looming and the Tufts players possibly being distracted by anticipating that rematch the second day. No question that Tufts is the stronger team, but they're also rather depleted - in addition to missing Foley, they were without Batista this weekend.

All that said, there aren't any bad teams left in the tournament, so every game is going to be a struggle no matter who or where you play. I'm looking forward to next weekend. Hopefully not all the games start at the same time. Also looking forward to seeing if Wash U can do anything with Sydney Moss.

Montclair's Melissa Tobie is the best I've seen(excludes Sydney Moss); she's been doing it for 4 years, a complete PLAYER and effective in their full court press, also.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: magicman on March 08, 2015, 06:22:28 PM
Quote from: nescacbbrules on March 08, 2015, 02:18:33 PM
Sweet 16 hosts are announced.

Bowdoin played tough to come from behind with a...HerCurlean effort...from Marle in Brunswick. Ithaca must feel jinxed.

Plus K for the "HerCurlean effort". I'll have to show that one to her dad. He'll get a kick out of that. 8-)

I was pretty sure that Montclair State was going to host the Sectional next weekend. And of course Bowdoin has to play the hosts on the first day. The good news is if they can win that matchup,  then the next game to get to the Final Four will be against Stockton or Amherst at a neutral site.

polbear73,

Thanks for bringing to my attention about the video on the Bowdoin website showing the highlights and interviews. Plus k for you as well.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: magicman on March 08, 2015, 07:15:07 PM
These were back to back posts from ronk and myself back in November of 2013 regarding 2 future starters on the Bowdoin Women's team. It would appear that Marle, now a sophomore and Katie, a freshman have helped bring Bowdoin back into the picture as a Top 25 progam.  The next few years could be exciting ones for the Polar Bears.   


Quote from: magicman on November 10, 2013, 04:58:27 AM
Bowdoin has a solid new recruit this year in 5'8" guard Marle Curle. I think she could contribute to the Polar Bears right away. The daughter of a coach, she has a good feel for the game, can shoot the 3, and also drive to the hoop. Was often called upon to guard the other team's best and biggest player. She's the type of player that will only get better each year. Bowdoin will be happy she elected to go there.   

Quote from: ronk on November 10, 2013, 05:20:43 PM
  I understand that Bowdoin has received a verbal from Katie Kerrigan(2014), someone I've seen be an impact player in an AAU game with D1 recruits. Looks like the Polar Bears will be back next year as a factor at the top 25 level.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on March 09, 2015, 12:48:07 PM
Quote from: magicman on March 08, 2015, 07:15:07 PM
These were back to back posts from ronk and myself back in November of 2013 regarding 2 future starters on the Bowdoin Women's team. It would appear that Marle, now a sophomore and Katie, a freshman have helped bring Bowdoin back into the picture as a Top 25 progam.  The next few years could be exciting ones for the Polar Bears.   


Quote from: magicman on November 10, 2013, 04:58:27 AM
Bowdoin has a solid new recruit this year in 5'8" guard Marle Curle. I think she could contribute to the Polar Bears right away. The daughter of a coach, she has a good feel for the game, can shoot the 3, and also drive to the hoop. Was often called upon to guard the other team's best and biggest player. She's the type of player that will only get better each year. Bowdoin will be happy she elected to go there.   
Correct on all levels! Hopefully they and the rest of the Polar Bears play well on Friday. They have a tough task ahead of them.

Quote from: ronk on November 10, 2013, 05:20:43 PM
  I understand that Bowdoin has received a verbal from Katie Kerrigan(2014), someone I've seen be an impact player in an AAU game with D1 recruits. Looks like the Polar Bears will be back next year as a factor at the top 25 level.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 09, 2015, 10:11:56 PM
I have no illusions that defeating Montclair State in NJ will be easy, but I think that Bowdoin's SOS (12) and the fact that they have only lost to Tufts since November argues that they are the second best NESCAC team and a very tough "out" in the tournament. Their defense is solid and their offense does not require big point production from any one player. Their team rebounding is very impressive and I think the odds of the Polar Bears pulling the upset are higher than Massey suggests (33%). I put it much closer to 50%. Massey suggests that Amherst is a heavy favorite over Salisbury, and I agree, but I find it hard to see how they favor the LJs (75%) versus Bowdoin. BTW, they favor Amherst over Montclair St if that final should occur. I hope and expect Tufts to step up their game after their squeaker with St. John Fisher. In any case, it should be a fun, competitive, and exciting weekend.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 09, 2015, 10:31:18 PM
Quote from: nescacbbrules on March 09, 2015, 10:11:56 PM
I have no illusions that defeating Montclair State in NJ will be easy, but I think that Bowdoin's SOS (12) and the fact that they have only lost to Tufts since November argues that they are the second best NESCAC team and a very tough "out" in the tournament. Their defense is solid and their offense does not require big point production from any one player. Their team rebounding is very impressive and I think the odds of the Polar Bears pulling the upset are higher than Massey suggests (33%). I put it much closer to 50%. Massey suggests that Amherst is a heavy favorite over Salisbury, and I agree, but I find it hard to see how they favor the LJs (75%) versus Bowdoin. BTW, they favor Amherst over Montclair St if that final should occur. I hope and expect Tufts to step up their game after their squeaker with St. John Fisher. In any case, it should be a fun, competitive, and exciting weekend.

   To beat Montclair, Bowdoin needs to defeat their full-court zone press and contain Melissa Tobie. Bowdoin may have the guards to do that. Amherst should be favored against Salisbury because their bigs could dominate. Salisbury's strength is their guard play. The coach, Kelly Lewandowski, did play in back-to-back Final 4s 10 years ago with Scranton, and they're familiar with   Montclair's gym, having played in their holiday tournament earlier in the year. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on March 10, 2015, 09:29:24 AM
Since the loss to Roger Williams to open the season, I have tended to underrate Bowdoin throughout the season and I am happy to have been proven wrong. I too believe that Bowdoin has the guard play to beat the Montclair press and has a very good chance to upset a very good team. Also, while it is difficult to beat a very good team three times in a row, I still don't understand why Bowdoin is ranked lower and deemed to be an underdog to Amherst after beating them twice by a decent margin, granted once at home but also on a neutral court.Finally, while Coaches Berube and Gromacki have deserved all of their recent accolades, Adrienne Shibles also deserves to be in the same conversation.

Best of luck to the three NESCAC teams!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 10, 2015, 10:52:10 AM
Thought to add several bits of info here...maybe of interest to ronk.
Amherst's opponent on Friday...Salisbury State... Has many local MD players.  One in particular is most interesting.  She is from the HS just a short walk from me.  She went to Virginia Wesleyan near Norfork to school....made all- conference in the ODAC twice.  Transferred to Salisbury and made All-conference for the "third" time.  A player that Amherst needs to stop....slow down.
Looking at Bowdoin's opponent...I agree with Ronk in that Montclair's center maybe the key.  Believe the Polar Bears have the guards to keep up with their opposites; but do not know how the front court will match up.
At this time of the year, while home court maybe a plus; imo, playing well on the road is a a nice "trait" to have.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 10, 2015, 11:17:25 AM
Quote from: amh63 on March 10, 2015, 10:52:10 AM
Thought to add several bits of info here...maybe of interest to ronk.
Amherst's opponent on Friday...Salisbury State... Has many local MD players.  One in particular is most interesting. She is from the HS just a short walk from me.  She went to Virginia Wesleyan near Norfork to school....made all- conference in the ODAC twice.  Transferred to Salisbury and made All-conference for the "third" time.  A player that Amherst needs to stop....slow down.
Looking at Bowdoin's opponent...I agree with Ronk in that Montclair's center maybe the key.  Believe the Polar Bears have the guards to keep up with their opposites; but do not know how the front court will match up.
At this time of the year, while home court maybe a plus; imo, playing well on the road is a a nice "trait" to have.

Then we live < 10 miles apart. Saw her play a few times in high school through her rising senior summer; was more impressed with her teammates-sisters who are now playing for D1 Loyola. But then she made a leap forward(in my eyes) in play her senior season and by the time I recognized it, she had decided on Va. Wes. She has a motor and is proactive.
The PG is the opposite in temperament but strongly effective.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: just a fan 22 on March 10, 2015, 12:17:53 PM
Quote from: polbear73 on March 10, 2015, 09:29:24 AM
Since the loss to Roger Williams to open the season, I have tended to underrate Bowdoin throughout the season and I am happy to have been proven wrong. I too believe that Bowdoin has the guard play to beat the Montclair press and has a very good chance to upset a very good team. Also, while it is difficult to beat a very good team three times in a row, I still don't understand why Bowdoin is ranked lower and deemed to be an underdog to Amherst after beating them twice by a decent margin, granted once at home but also on a neutral court.
The national rankings are largely BS. None of the people with votes really have the time, means, or inclination to watch all the teams, so they're just going based on past history and what other people say. The relatively lack of inter-region play (as compared to Division I) also makes ranking teams relative to each other difficult to impossible.

I could see a team being ranked below a team they beat once, but after two relatively convincing wins against Amherst, Bowdoin really does deserve to be ranked above them. That should come via Amherst being dropped down to the 15-20th spot they deserve, and Bowdoin being bumped up a few places.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: magicman on March 10, 2015, 01:34:27 PM
Quote from: just a fan 22 on March 10, 2015, 12:17:53 PM
Quote from: polbear73 on March 10, 2015, 09:29:24 AM
Since the loss to Roger Williams to open the season, I have tended to underrate Bowdoin throughout the season and I am happy to have been proven wrong. I too believe that Bowdoin has the guard play to beat the Montclair press and has a very good chance to upset a very good team. Also, while it is difficult to beat a very good team three times in a row, I still don't understand why Bowdoin is ranked lower and deemed to be an underdog to Amherst after beating them twice by a decent margin, granted once at home but also on a neutral court.
The national rankings are largely BS. None of the people with votes really have the time, means, or inclination to watch all the teams, so they're just going based on past history and what other people say. The relatively lack of inter-region play (as compared to Division I) also makes ranking teams relative to each other difficult to impossible.

I could see a team being ranked below a team they beat once, but after two relatively convincing wins against Amherst, Bowdoin really does deserve to be ranked above them. That should come via Amherst being dropped down to the 15-20th spot they deserve, and Bowdoin being bumped up a few places.

Well, since there is only one more Top 25 poll and that won't come out until after the NCAA tournament is all over, it will really depend on what happens this coming weekend. If Amherst wins their game and they are favored to do so, and Bowdoin loses their game and they are the underdogs against the host team, then Amherst will continue to be ranked above Bowdoin. If they both win, it will depend on the next game when they will play each other for the third time. If Amherst wins that game they will still be ranked ahead of Bowdoin. So Bowdoin may go past Amherst in the next poll if they both lose their next game, but I wouldn't bet on that happening. If Bowdoin wins their next game and Amherst loses then Bowdoin will probably be ranked higher. And of course if they do face each other a third time and Bowdoin wins then I'm sure they will be ranked higher than Amherst. ;D

But I agree with you and polbear73, Bowdoin should have been ranked ahead of Amherst in the last poll after the Polar Bears beat them in the semis at Tufts.     
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on March 10, 2015, 02:02:20 PM
Quote from: just a fan 22 on March 10, 2015, 12:17:53 PM
Quote from: polbear73 on March 10, 2015, 09:29:24 AM
Since the loss to Roger Williams to open the season, I have tended to underrate Bowdoin throughout the season and I am happy to have been proven wrong. I too believe that Bowdoin has the guard play to beat the Montclair press and has a very good chance to upset a very good team. Also, while it is difficult to beat a very good team three times in a row, I still don't understand why Bowdoin is ranked lower and deemed to be an underdog to Amherst after beating them twice by a decent margin, granted once at home but also on a neutral court.
The national rankings are largely BS. None of the people with votes really have the time, means, or inclination to watch all the teams, so they're just going based on past history and what other people say. The relatively lack of inter-region play (as compared to Division I) also makes ranking teams relative to each other difficult to impossible.

I could see a team being ranked below a team they beat once, but after two relatively convincing wins against Amherst, Bowdoin really does deserve to be ranked above them. That should come via Amherst being dropped down to the 15-20th spot they deserve, and Bowdoin being bumped up a few places.

I understand the argument, but it seems based on the premise that head to head results should always be the determining factor in relative ranking.  I'm not sure I agree with that premise.  Some teams just don't match up ideally against another, even though they might be a better overall team.  I haven't seen enough of either Amherst or Bowdoin to have an opinion in the case of these two teams, but I did notice that Massey's purely statistical approach to rating shows Amherst with #32 SoS and Bowdoin with #71.  Amherst power rating is 0.85 #8 and Bowdoin is 0.66 #17.  Amherst also has a better overall record.  As Magicman points out, it will get sorted out in the next two weeks.  It's the ranking at the end that matters most :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 10, 2015, 02:03:28 PM
ronk.....maybe we can share a ride to a common interest game in the future! :)
Did not want to overlook the PG who is from Clarksburg, MD...about 10 plus miles up the road.  She was only the conference player of the year!...team leading scorer?  Salisbury did play Monclair State in an away game earlier in the year. Not relevant now since both teams have grown, imo.

For those who think about the rankings now....you cannot have it both ways. The important factor is to win and advance.  The Final Poll by D3 hoops... Yes the pollsters that one questioned earlier...will only in the end, IMO, provide data to be used for next season's pre- season rankings...and those will be challenged as the season progresses by posters...again.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 10, 2015, 08:22:46 PM
At this point, the discussion about whether Bowdoin should be ranked above Amherst is a bit academic.  For what it is worth, after too early losses, Bowdoin is undefeated against everyone but Tufts--and that includes two wins over Amherst, both relatively easy wins. I don't think there is any question that Bowdoin is a better team than Amherst. However, Bowdoin also got a tougher draw in the tournament, having to face MontClaire first.  I would not be surprised to see a Bowdoin/Amherst rematch in the regional final.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on March 11, 2015, 01:22:59 AM
Quote from: Maine1 on March 10, 2015, 08:22:46 PM
At this point, the discussion about whether Bowdoin should be ranked above Amherst is a bit academic.  For what it is worth, after too early losses, Bowdoin is undefeated against everyone but Tufts--and that includes two wins over Amherst, both relatively easy wins. I don't think there is any question that Bowdoin is a better team than Amherst. However, Bowdoin also got a tougher draw in the tournament, having to face MontClaire first.  I would not be surprised to see a Bowdoin/Amherst rematch in the regional final.
I am in complete agreement that the Bowdoin-Amherst ranking discussions are a bit academic at this point. I only brought it up under the assumption that the NCAA seeded Amherst higher, the result being a more difficult draw for Bowdoin. I also understand that other factors go into the bracketing.

The nice thing is that the teams can play this out on the floor. Looking forward to an exciting weekend.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Hoopsinfo on March 11, 2015, 01:41:33 PM
Sad to say that I agree that if Bowdoin and Amherst end up meeting again, Bowdoin is likely to win a third time unless the Amherst coach is able to change his strategy (if needed) and really take advantage of his talented inside players.  In my opinion (and yes I have said this before) it's not that Amherst is a less talented team – it's about the coaching.  In the last Bowdoin game, we shot 26 3s - Bowdoin only shot 7. We never adjusted. The coaches that oppose Amherst design their strategy around Amherst depending on the 3 shot. The strategy against Eastern worked well last Friday because Amherst ran, worked the inside and wasn't just heaving 3s. You could see it in the stats. I believe Amherst beat Bowdoin at the end of the season last year, even without Robertson. They can do it again (if given the chance) but need to change strategy and take advantage of our fast breaks and inside players.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: magicman on March 11, 2015, 04:04:43 PM
I just went to the NCAA statistics website and as expected Bowdoin's Marle Curle has made a reappearance in free throw percentage leaders because she qualifies once again after her big weekend in the NCAA tournament. With 75 made free throws out of 83 attempts she has been sinking them at a 90.4% rate. That's good enough to put her in 3rd place in the country. She probably can't move up any higher because the 2 players ahead of her are done for the year. She would need to make 17 in a row to take over the top spot. That's only a third of her earlier streak of 51 in a row (possibly a NESCAC Women's record?) so we know it's certainly possible. But she'll need to get to the line often and Bowdoin has to continue to win for that to happen.

Sara Binkhorst continues to be ranked as she is listed in the #28 spot with 76x89...good for an 85.4% rate.

Here's the link to the Stats page:

http://www.ncaa.com/stats/basketball-women/d3/current/individual/108   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 11, 2015, 05:18:34 PM
FYI....it is noted on the D3hoops.com site, the info of Friday's games.  Amherst vs Salisbury is noted to start at 5PM with stats and Video.  The surprising item is the game to follow...the Bowdoin vs Monclair State game! Yes, it states stats, video...BUT has the note "tickets".   I take that as it CoST to watch.  Hope it is in error....strange!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on March 11, 2015, 06:13:31 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 11, 2015, 05:18:34 PM
FYI....it is noted on the D3hoops.com site, the info of Friday's games.  Amherst vs Salisbury is noted to start at 5PM with stats and Video.  The surprising item is the game to follow...the Bowdoin vs Monclair State game! Yes, it states stats, video...BUT has the note "tickets".   I take that as it CoST to watch.  Hope it is in error....strange!

I assume you mean it would be strange to have to buy a ticket to watch streaming video of the game; I agree that would be strange.  But the link appears to be a site to purchase tickets in advance to attend the game in person.  That would not be unusual and would be a convenience especially when seats/tickets are expected to be limited. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 11, 2015, 08:26:16 PM
Quote from: Maine1 on March 10, 2015, 08:22:46 PM
At this point, the discussion about whether Bowdoin should be ranked above Amherst is a bit academic.  For what it is worth, after too early losses, Bowdoin is undefeated against everyone but Tufts--and that includes two wins over Amherst, both relatively easy wins. I don't think there is any question that Bowdoin is a better team than Amherst. However, Bowdoin also got a tougher draw in the tournament, having to face MontClaire first.  I would not be surprised to see a Bowdoin/Amherst rematch in the regional final.

It's all about when you lose and who you lose too.  If 2 of your 3 losses are before New Years it's tough to get ranked ahead of the team that was in the top 10 at New Years while you were in the 20-25 range even if you beat that team twice in the season.  In the division 1 poll UNC is ranked #19 with 10 losses while Butler is #22 with only 9 losses....and Butler beat them during the season!  The reason UNC is still higher with the head-to-head loss and more losses is that UNC has been ranked all season while Butler has been in-n-out of the rankings, and even though they have more losses, UNC'S losses are better.  I'm not going to downgrade UNC as far for losing to a NC State at home (19-12) then I would for Butler losing to a 19-12 Xavier on the road because the ACC is a tougher conference then the Big East, and is a bigger grind.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on March 12, 2015, 04:57:15 AM
Quote from: Roundball999 on March 11, 2015, 06:13:31 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 11, 2015, 05:18:34 PM
FYI....it is noted on the D3hoops.com site, the info of Friday's games.  Amherst vs Salisbury is noted to start at 5PM with stats and Video.  The surprising item is the game to follow...the Bowdoin vs Monclair State game! Yes, it states stats, video...BUT has the note "tickets".   I take that as it CoST to watch.  Hope it is in error....strange!

I assume you mean it would be strange to have to buy a ticket to watch streaming video of the game; I agree that would be strange.  But the link appears to be a site to purchase tickets in advance to attend the game in person.  That would not be unusual and would be a convenience especially when seats/tickets are expected to be limited.
A click on the ticket link indicates that they are offering the unused tickets for game admission from the Bowdoin allotment and not as a charge to stream the game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: magicman on March 12, 2015, 05:04:32 AM
Quote from: 7express on March 11, 2015, 08:26:16 PM
Quote from: Maine1 on March 10, 2015, 08:22:46 PM
At this point, the discussion about whether Bowdoin should be ranked above Amherst is a bit academic.  For what it is worth, after too early losses, Bowdoin is undefeated against everyone but Tufts--and that includes two wins over Amherst, both relatively easy wins. I don't think there is any question that Bowdoin is a better team than Amherst. However, Bowdoin also got a tougher draw in the tournament, having to face MontClaire first.  I would not be surprised to see a Bowdoin/Amherst rematch in the regional final.

It's all about when you lose and who you lose too.  If 2 of your 3 losses are before New Years it's tough to get ranked ahead of the team that was in the top 10 at New Years while you were in the 20-25 range even if you beat that team twice in the season.  In the division 1 poll UNC is ranked #19 with 10 losses while Butler is #22 with only 9 losses....and Butler beat them during the season!  The reason UNC is still higher with the head-to-head loss and more losses is that UNC has been ranked all season while Butler has been in-n-out of the rankings, and even though they have more losses, UNC'S losses are better.  I'm not going to downgrade UNC as far for losing to a NC State at home (19-12) then I would for Butler losing to a 19-12 Xavier on the road because the ACC is a tougher conference then the Big East, and is a bigger grind.

I understand where you're coming from 7, and I agree with you about the who and the when. But the UNC-Butler situation is quite different than the Amherst-Bowdoin argument. You're talking about 2 teams from 2 different conferences (one conference regarded to be stronger than the other) with 1 head to head meeting.

Some of the posters on this board have put forth the idea that Bowdoin should be ranked ahead of Amherst because of 2 wins by the Polar Bears in head to head play not just a single meeting. Plus we're talking about 2 teams from the same conference. Someone else mentioned that Amherst has only lost 3 games while Bowdoin has 4 losses but Bowdoin only has those 4 losses because they beat Amherst in that 2nd meeting. That meant Bowdoin had to face Tufts (for the 2nd time) in the championship game of the NESCAC. They should be rewarded for making the championship game and not penalized because they lost to Tufts. If Amherst had played in that game against Tufts they could very well have 4 losses.

I could see not ranking Bowdoin over Amherst after the Polar Bears won the first meeting back on January 31st. Amherst had been ranked as high as #2 in previous weeks and the loss to Bowdoin dropped them from #6 down to #12 at the time. Bowdoin who was ranked #24 prior to that game moved up to the #20 position. In subsequent weeks Bowdoin continued to move up in the standings while Amherst was fairly stationary in the 11-12 spot. After winning the NESCAC semifinal game against Amherst, at Tufts, where the Polar Bears dominated that game, then I believe, it was time to move Bowdoin ahead of the LJ's.

It should be pointed out that Bowdoin also lost a valuable starter for the season shortly after that 1st meeting with Amherst, when senior forward Megan Phelps was injured (11 rebounds and 9 points in that Jan 31st game against Amherst). Then her replacement, freshman forward Emily Campbell, was lost for the season several weeks later. So the Polar Bears were short 2 of their interior players and still easily defeated Amherst in that 2nd matchup.           
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 12, 2015, 09:03:13 AM
I think all have made some valid points with regard to the rankings of Amherst and Bowdoin. What strikes me is two things. First, Tufts thoroughly trounced Amherst and that should have been a notice to the voters that the LJs were not like their teams of the past in some ways. Amherst's defense was not strong and they struggled in their half-court offense.
Second, it's important to note that both victories by Bowdoin over Amherst were not nearly as close as the final scores indicate. Although the final margins were 9 and 8, Amherst was behind by 10 just 11 minutes into the first game and never threatened. On the neutral court at Tufts, the Polar Bears were again up double digits after 11 minutes and cruising by 21 at the half. Amherst played a better second half, but it was only two threes in the last minute that made it appear respectable.
Personally, I agree with the poster who said that the poll  voters don't pay close enough attention to the games, because the weight of those two victories should have pushed Bowdoin ahead of Amherst in the polls. This laziness, Amherst's early ranking and national status from the recent past more than Bowdoin's early losses accounts for the ranking anomaly. The loss to Roger Williams was poor, but losing to UNE on their court was not. Tufts barely scraped out a win there early in the season.
As I mentioned earlier, I sure hope they get to play once more. They each represent themselves and their conference with distinction.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on March 12, 2015, 09:59:37 AM
Quote from: nescacbbrules on March 12, 2015, 09:03:13 AM
I think all have made some valid points with regard to the rankings of Amherst and Bowdoin. What strikes me is two things. First, Tufts thoroughly trounced Amherst and that should have been a notice to the voters that the LJs were not like their teams of the past in some ways. Amherst's defense was not strong and they struggled in their half-court offense.
Second, it's important to note that both victories by Bowdoin over Amherst were not nearly as close as the final scores indicate. Although the final margins were 9 and 8, Amherst was behind by 10 just 11 minutes into the first game and never threatened. On the neutral court at Tufts, the Polar Bears were again up double digits after 11 minutes and cruising by 21 at the half. Amherst played a better second half, but it was only two threes in the last minute that made it appear respectable.
Personally, I agree with the poster who said that the poll  voters don't pay close enough attention to the games, because the weight of those two victories should have pushed Bowdoin ahead of Amherst in the polls. This laziness, Amherst's early ranking and national status from the recent past more than Bowdoin's early losses accounts for the ranking anomaly. The loss to Roger Williams was poor, but losing to UNE on their court was not. Tufts barely scraped out a win there early in the season.
As I mentioned earlier, I sure hope they get to play once more. They each represent themselves and their conference with distinction.
I could not agree more, especially with the last point of both teams representing themselves and the conference with distinction (and Tufts should be included as well).  Obviously, Bowdoin is going to have to be on top of its game to defeat Montclair's press and their talent inside and while the conventional wisdom is that Salisbury may be the easier opponent of the two, all teams reaching this point are talented and Amherst has its work cut out for them as well.  It would be a great accomplishment for Amherst and Bowdoin to meet a third time, and I wish both teams good luck-until that final, of course. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 12, 2015, 10:15:23 AM
I guess all this chit chat is keeping folks busy until Friday...in particular the relative ranking of Bowdoin to Amherst, etc, etc....
The teams rankings NOW are what they are.  Amherst rankings during the season was also done by another org.   Those were often higher than D3hoops'.  The teams are positioned to play this weekend and the only thing I see how the rankings may impact the games are the color of the uniforms...home or away uniforms.
For the Bowdoin fans that want to break down past games to support their points, my advice is it is not often good for forecasting, etc.  Amherst played on the road in its two NCAA games to date.  Both games were solid wins over fine teams....one highly ranked, the host.  Both games were basically over at the half, based on the score and the play on the floor.  It was done with Amherst starting PG not in uniform.  I have seen in MBB and other sports, these same discussions.  For example...Amherst beat Wesleyan twice by 20 plus points during the regular season....only to lose to the Cardinals in the CAC final in the title game.  Last season in the Final 4, Amherst was blown out by the Williams squad that Amherst beat 8 straight times, including THREE times last season!
The same discussions happened in men' s soccer.  When Tufts won the National title, the conference fans all gave praise.  I suggest sit back and enjoy the play and cheer the winners and hope a CAC team takes the Title so we can all clap.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 12, 2015, 10:50:51 AM
Quote from: polbear73 on March 12, 2015, 04:57:15 AM
Quote from: Roundball999 on March 11, 2015, 06:13:31 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 11, 2015, 05:18:34 PM
FYI....it is noted on the D3hoops.com site, the info of Friday's games.  Amherst vs Salisbury is noted to start at 5PM with stats and Video.  The surprising item is the game to follow...the Bowdoin vs Monclair State game! Yes, it states stats, video...BUT has the note "tickets".   I take that as it CoST to watch.  Hope it is in error....strange!

I assume you mean it would be strange to have to buy a ticket to watch streaming video of the game; I agree that would be strange.  But the link appears to be a site to purchase tickets in advance to attend the game in person.  That would not be unusual and would be a convenience especially when seats/tickets are expected to be limited.
A click on the ticket link indicates that they are offering the unused tickets for game admission from the Bowdoin allotment and not as a charge to stream the game.

Yes -- schools sell tickets to Division III NCAA Tournament games. If you have a question about a link on the site, click on it to find out!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 12, 2015, 11:16:13 AM
Pat C......Thanks for the advice.  Other than being lazy.....not too long ago, it was not uncommon for such labels to indicate that it was a charge to view.  We all have grown to free video streaming.  What made it strange to me is the earlier game...the Amherst game did not have the notice.  "normally" alloted" tickets if unsold by a given time are "returned" to the host school for sale.
A more general question to you.....is it a requirement for host schools to provide video and live stats for NCAA games?  If so, then why doesn't all games have such services cited on your site.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 12, 2015, 11:36:53 AM
Quote from: amh63 on March 12, 2015, 11:16:13 AM
Pat C......Thanks for the advice.  Other than being lazy.....not too long ago, it was not uncommon for such labels to indicate that it was a charge to view.  We all have grown to free video streaming.  What made it strange to me is the earlier game...the Amherst game did not have the notice.  "normally" alloted" tickets if unsold by a given time are "returned" to the host school for sale.
A more general question to you.....is it a requirement for host schools to provide video and live stats for NCAA games?  If so, then why doesn't all games have such services cited on your site.

We've never had labels on our site or anywhere in the Presto network for pay-per-view video labeled as "tickets."

It isn't a requirement. My understanding is there is video for all games this weekend but a couple of the schools are still putting the finishing touches on lining those things up. Some are looking into better services than their usual offerings since there is likely to be higher demand.

All of the games have live stats links.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 12, 2015, 12:07:24 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 12, 2015, 10:15:23 AM
I guess all this chit chat is keeping folks busy until Friday...in particular the relative ranking of Bowdoin to Amherst, etc, etc....
The teams rankings NOW are what they are.  Amherst rankings during the season was also done by another org.   Those were often higher than D3hoops'.  The teams are positioned to play this weekend and the only thing I see how the rankings may impact the games are the color of the uniforms...home or away uniforms.
For the Bowdoin fans that want to break down past games to support their points, my advice is it is not often good for forecasting, etc.  Amherst played on the road in its two NCAA games to date.  Both games were solid wins over fine teams....one highly ranked, the host.  Both games were basically over at the half, based on the score and the play on the floor.  It was done with Amherst starting PG not in uniform.  I have seen in MBB and other sports, these same discussions.  For example...Amherst beat Wesleyan twice by 20 plus points during the regular season....only to lose to the Cardinals in the CAC final in the title game.  Last season in the Final 4, Amherst was blown out by the Williams squad that Amherst beat 8 straight times, including THREE times last season!
The same discussions happened in men' s soccer.  When Tufts won the National title, the conference fans all gave praise.  I suggest sit back and enjoy the play and cheer the winners and hope a CAC team takes the Title so we can all clap.
Quite agree, amh63. Although various opinions have been stated,  I'm not sure that I've heard anyone suggest that their position on the ranking merits of the two teams informs their prognostication for a hypothetical rematch.
The pride we all have in our home teams is matched only by the collective pride we share in our connection to such a remarkable group of colleges and scholar athletes.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 12, 2015, 01:15:39 PM
And now all the games have video links except the ones at Randolph-Macon, where there will be video but the question is which platform they'll use.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 13, 2015, 05:45:49 PM
 LJs recover from 19-9 deficit via offensive rebounds & 3s to take halftime lead. Former Scranton coach Mike Strong sitting behind Salisbury bench supporting former player & now HC Kelly Lewandowski.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jumpshot on March 13, 2015, 07:02:15 PM
Despite having a huge size advantage, the ljs are unable to make adjustments to limit Salisbury's #10 who goes for about 30 points. Salisbury well-coached and handle final few minutes of the game to earn the win.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: magicman on March 13, 2015, 07:08:39 PM
Bowdoin just minutes away from the start of the game against Montclair State. Good luck to the Polar Bears. Hope to see them playing again tomorrow.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: D3MAFAN on March 13, 2015, 07:26:45 PM
Quote from: jumpshot on March 13, 2015, 07:02:15 PM
Despite having a huge size advantage, the ljs are unable to make adjustments to limit Salisbury's #10 who goes for about 30 points. Salisbury well-coached and handle final few minutes of the game to earn the win.

Watch the game against Bridgewater State, #10 is definitely a great player. The team is well coach as you aforementioned and plays lights out in the second half.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: magicman on March 13, 2015, 09:05:56 PM
Bowdoin Women lose to Montclair State by a 61-54 final score. Polar Bears gave it a good shot coming from a 15 point deficit to close to within 4 points but couldn't come up with some key stops when they needed to. Excellent year for the Polar bears. I think they will be back in the NCAA tournament again next year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 13, 2015, 09:07:34 PM
Tufts beats Eastern Connecticut 45-31.  Here's my sentence from the LEC board: "Not gonna win many games scoring 31 points overall, but this was a really ugly game as the score at halftime was 20-11.  Cant imagine you win many games scoring 45 points, Tufts will need to play a lot better vs. Florham tomorrow to advance to Grand Rapids."

NESCAC teams had a tough day at the office @ Montclair.  Can't imagine the conference is lining up to play there again anytime soon.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 13, 2015, 09:38:04 PM
Very impressed with Salisbury--they definitely beat Amherst. Amherst had chances, but Salisbury was able to close out games.  Number 10 was very good, as we I believe number 15.  Bowdoin just dug too big a hole.  They played well in the second half, but could never make the big shot to get to within 2 or less.  Tough night for the NESCAC.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 13, 2015, 11:34:42 PM
I suppose it's true that you can't expect to win many games scoring 45 points....unless, of course, you're the kind of team that blocks 12 shots while holding your opponent to 31 points on 17% shooting. Then you can expect to win lots of games. Tufts plays games that often are not hailed as beautiful, impressionistic art, but if you have a taste for gritty, in-your-face, grinding defense, then they play "ugly" masterpieces. FDU understands the difference. Last year their high scoring offense managed 42 points in their national semifinal win, a number very close to the average of Tufts' opposition and six fewer than FDU scored in the first half tonight against Geneseo.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on March 14, 2015, 04:46:05 AM
It's ironic to note that Bowdoin, a great foul shooting team all year, basically lost this game at the line, 17-9 as field goals were dead even (as was shooting percentage) and the Polar Bears scored one more 3. Going 9 for 17 from the line , along with digging a 15 point hole at the half was way too much to overcome against a very good team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: just a fan 22 on March 14, 2015, 08:27:36 AM
Quote from: nescacbbrules on March 13, 2015, 11:34:42 PM
I suppose it's true that you can't expect to win many games scoring 45 points....unless, of course, you're the kind of team that blocks 12 shots while holding your opponent to 31 points on 17% shooting. Then you can expect to win lots of games. Tufts plays games that often are not hailed as beautiful, impressionistic art, but if you have a taste for gritty, in-your-face, grinding defense, then they play "ugly" masterpieces. FDU understands the difference. Last year their high scoring offense managed 42 points in their national semifinal win, a number very close to the average of Tufts' opposition and six fewer than FDU scored in the first half tonight against Geneseo.
45 would have been more than enough to win last year's Tufts-FDU final four game. I do expect Tufts to need a few more than that today, but if they score 55, I think they'll win. Either way, it will be a great game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 14, 2015, 05:37:33 PM
Congrats to Salisbury State.  Will be hoping they continue their fine play tonight.
Been thinking a bit about the game a bit.  First the local guards on the Gulls were too tough for Amherst to contain.  The smallest player on the floor was also to fast and quick for the Amherst guards.
I break the game into four parts.  In the first part, Salisbury goes ahead by 19.  the 2nd half of the first half, Amherst led by Megan Robertson's play steadily pulls even and goes ahead by 8 at the half...in spite of 13 points by no. 10 of Salisbury.  For about the first 5 minutes of the second half, both teams trade baskets and the 8 point Amherst lead holds.  Then, as the game goes back and forth, Amherst outside game falters a bit.  salisbury's experienced guards takes over the offense.
Though Amherst had their chances to tie the game in the last minute....I believe several factors became clear too me between the two teams.  Upperclass experience and leadership took over for Salisbury.  The ball was in the hands of no.10...to score, and control the clock in the last minute.  Amherst does not have a go to player...to take charge.  In the last minute plus, no one wanted to take the shot or figure how to get the ball to Robertson down low.  Jackie Renner who had missed a number of games was worn out...her last foul shot did not even reach the basket. 
The better team won the game...better leadership and one heck of a player....the player of the year in their conference.
Megan and Ali...Amherst's all conference players played well and hard.  Megan had 16 points, 14 rbs and 5 blocks to close out her career.  The PG play of Amherst could not match Salisbury's PG...in experience, talent, speed/ quickness. 
Expect Amherst to figure out the backcourt issues next year and hopefully figure out a replacement in part for Megan Robertson up front.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 14, 2015, 11:49:31 PM
Huge congrats to the Tufts women on achieving their second consecutive Final Four, beating the defending national champions from FDU. Both teams defend hard, but FDU shot 50% in the first half and only carried a 2- point lead. Tufts' guards defended the one-on-one dribble drives very well throughout the second half and the forwards gave great help. Tufts had 14 assists to just 3 for the Devils for the entire game. FDU fought very hard, but Tufts' guards, especially Lauren Dillon, made the clutch shots. Well done and good luck in Michigan!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: just a fan 22 on March 15, 2015, 12:09:40 AM
Thoroughly deserved win from Tufts tonight. They hung tough in the first half and the relentless defensive pressure began to wear on FDUs short rotation of four guards in the second half. The tandem of Morehead, Dillion, and Roberson played very well on both ends of the court, and Kanner and North were solid as well. Neither team got much of anything from its bench, but with the increased number of timeouts and the stakes, teams operate with shortened rotations anyway.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on March 15, 2015, 05:34:02 AM
Impressive win by Montclair State over Salisbury to move to Final 4. They again jumped out to a big lead and kept their foot on the accelerator this time; Salisbury was never in the game. Montclair is very well balanced with quick, good shooting guards and tough play inside. Certainly a force in the Final 4.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 15, 2015, 09:48:36 AM
Congrats to Tufts for a heck of a win!  Yes, the Tufts' guards played big....the senior and the FY.

Did not get to see any of the Montclair State win over Salisbury.  Looked over the stats briefly.
Seems that Montclair...who had played Salisbury earlier in the year....a win...stopped the fine guard that " buried" Amherst....scored 29 points.  Monclair's top player Tobie?...the elder one...seemed to play up to her All American status. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bowdoin74 on March 15, 2015, 10:46:25 AM
Congratulations to Tufts! 

They are making this deep run without Hannah Foley on the court and yesterday Josie Lee had 4 fouls and sat on the bench for a long time.  Pretty amazing the way the Tufts players step up when needed for each other. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 15, 2015, 01:11:18 PM
Carla Berube, the Tufts coach, is featured in several articles about the '94 - '95 UCONN national championship team. I found this link on the Tufts site but think it is worth posting for the wider fans of NESCAC and women's basketball.

This in depth article recalls the UCONN women's team of '95 that changed the face of women's basketball in America. Fans of the women's game at any level will enjoy the read.

http://thebiglead.com/2015/03/12/the-1995-connecticut-huskies-the-team-that-made-womens-basketball/

The coverage and love affair with that team and its myriad fans lives on. One of its members featured in the piece, Carla Berube, is heading to her second D-III Final Four with the Tufts University women, and represents the positive legacy of that memorable group of women.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 15, 2015, 08:49:42 PM
I went to high school not too far from UConn in 1995 and that team had celebrity status. There was a buzz in the hallway after the team played because they weren't just good, they were superior in an almost Harlem Globetrotters way, minus the circus shenanigans. They were the best passing team I've ever seen until the San Antonio Spurs of last year.  Rebecca Lobo was the star but a lot of sports fans could name several players off the roster without much effort, including Berube.

If you didn't live in Connecticut at that time, it sounds like exaggeration to talk about how popular that team was. Women's college basketball doesn't usually capture people's imagination that way. But they were absolute rock stars.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on March 16, 2015, 05:13:03 AM
Carla Berube is obviously a great coach and I hope she stays at Tufts for a long time, not only for their sake, as her presence makes the conference a better one  (although opposing schools probably beg to differ). It does make one wonder when speculation will begin about her moving on to a Division I job. Bowdoin was fortunate to have Stephanie Pemper for 10 years, which is probably the most one can hope.
Best of luck to Tufts in the Final 4.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 16, 2015, 11:05:28 AM
Polbear73, Carla Berube is rapidly completing her 13th season as Tufts' head coach in a NESCAC which is highly competitive as compared with the early years when Bowdoin won the first 8 conference titles. Very happy to see a NESCAC team in the Final Four for the 7th consecutive season. Good luck to Coach and her Jumbo team.

Gordonmann, I was fortunate to attend a basketball coaching conference at UCONN in the Fall of 1994. We saw Geno Auriemma's breakdown drills for their triangle offense which the Huskies ran with such precision that season and also witnessed first hand the intensity of their practices. In a continuation drill, the unrelenting all-out physical pressure on outlet passes caused Carla and then FY Nykesha Sales to square off and be separated by teammates. Those who saw those young women compete like that against each other were not surprised to see them win all those games in their magical season.
We also saw Jim Calhoun's practices involving, among others, the Marshalls and a skinny kid named Ray Allen. I great time to be at Storrs.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacbbrules on March 20, 2015, 02:48:39 PM
Congratulations to Haley Kanner of Tufts on making the WBCA All-America team. In addition, sophomore Michela North of the Jumbos was named to the Honorable Mention All-America team along with Ellen Cook of Williams, and Shannon Brady and Sarah Binkhorst of Bowdoin. Tremendous individual achievements for each of these fine players from NESCAC. Carla Berube is also a finalist for Coach of the Year.

Now Tufts has to take on undefeated Thomas More and their All-American finalist for Player of the Year, Sydney Moss, in the national semi-finals. Quite a challenge, but Tufts is the team in Grand Rapids with experience from last year's Final Four. A nice piece in the Boston Herald points to this.

http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/college/on_campus/2015/03/tufts_women_get_second_chance_at_division_3_final_four

Let's go Bo's.
Title: jim murphy
Post by: bsc73 on April 07, 2015, 06:07:09 PM
sad to see that Jim Murphy retired from coaching at Bates College
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on April 07, 2015, 10:32:17 PM
I merged the posting about Coach Murphy onto the NESCAC board.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on April 15, 2015, 02:06:48 PM
of course now we get to see what will happen at Bates....that could be an attractive opportunity for somebody with the ability to out-recruit Shibles and Veilleux...will be VERY interesting to see if Bates thinks a little outside the box in this search...hope they do
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on April 17, 2015, 10:04:41 AM
remsleep.....to compete in the CAC these days, the new coach needs to recruit outside of New England and against ALL the other coaches.  Not an easy task....but a necessary one to keep the job.  Bates' relative new Prez knows that winning teams means stronger alum dollars, etc.  She is a Williams grad and understands the "drill".  Wesleyan's new AD set the example after being hired away from Williams as the Football coach....kicked off the school's fundraising and rebuilding of its athletic programs even while rebuilding the football program.
Maybe a little too much reality here but it is happening even in the Ivie today.  I have a classmate whose grand daughter is a senior on the Amherst team...a walk on.  At homecoming he was troubled that Yale was out recruiting Amherst for his other grand daughter....his daughter is also an alum. I spoke to Meg Robertson to have a chat with the young talented "recruit". :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on April 17, 2015, 10:57:31 AM
maybe if Bates Prez can avoid being sued by former office staff member she'll be able to focus more on basketball hahaha!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on June 04, 2015, 10:49:06 AM
Bates Has picked a new HBC...a former Maine HS star player, Bowdoin Grad, assist coach at Bowdoin and most recently, an asst. Coach at the Naval Academy.  Keeping it in the CAC family, the HBC at the USNA was her coach at Bowdoin.  Nice story on the Bobcat website.
New coach was the recruiting coordinator at her former job...but mentioned that she hopes to get the Maine talent based on her background...interesting perspective in the growing WBB  competitiveness in the conference.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on June 04, 2015, 01:56:57 PM
Quote from: amh63 on June 04, 2015, 10:49:06 AM
Bates Has picked a new HBC...a former Maine HS star player, Bowdoin Grad, assist coach at Bowdoin and most recently, an asst. Coach at the Naval Academy.  Keeping it in the CAC family, the HBC at the USNA was her coach at Bowdoin.  Nice story on the Bobcat website.
New coach was the recruiting coordinator at her former job...but mentioned that she hopes to get the Maine talent based on her background...interesting perspective in the growing WBB  competitiveness in the conference.

Alison played against Scranton in consecutive NCAA appearances; the 2005 game was a particularly outstanding Elite 8 matchup. As a recruiting competitor, I hope she concentrates on New England prospects now and leaves the Mid-Atlantic for others(Scranton).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on June 05, 2015, 09:47:39 AM
I apologize for not having the exact number, but I read recently that there are about 8 or 9  current assistant and head coaches now coaching in Divisions 1 and 3 from the Pemper/Shibles coaching tree. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on September 16, 2015, 01:39:55 PM
Amherst has finally posted a new assistant coach.  No school announcement yet, but pic on website. Amherst WBB site has few updates....tentative schedule,etc.  "Long term" former assistant was noted missing all Summer.  Amherst's men's new assistant still has his pic missing...but his bio is available.  guess Coach G has his own priorities/system.
Awaiting bio info of Pumla Sathula...new assistant with the interesting name.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on September 16, 2015, 05:04:37 PM
Pumla was a low post player for GP when he was at Hamilton. She's a South African native and a 1,000 point scorer for the Conts. I remember covering her when Hamilton reached the second round of the NCAA tournament.

Some names just stick with you. :)

Do a google search for Pumla Sathula and you'll find some cool stuff, including a photo of her from something called Hoop City ("Africa's #1 Basketball Magazine) that I hope is featured prominently on the Amherst website.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on September 16, 2015, 07:22:27 PM
Gordonmann....thanks for the heads up/ infoI. Had trouble with the name...since I could not figure out the phonetics.  plus K.  Coach G. did indeed spend a year at Hamilton..as an Interim coach.  Whatever the title, he wanted to return home to the Deerfield area.. And raise a family.
Yes, he could use a coach with front court experience....played the way he wants.  Amherst has two front court players that needs to step up...especially on the defensive side.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: magicman on October 30, 2015, 03:19:06 AM
The Top 3 NESCAC teams from last year, Tufts, Amherst, and Bowdoin who finished 5th, 11th and 12th respectively in the D3hoops Top 25 Final poll for the 2014-2015 season, are back at it again. The D3hoops Women's Top 25, preseason poll has been released and those same 3 teams are all present and well accounted for, as they have all improved on that final ranking from last season.

Amherst is near the top of the poll coming in at #2, right behind defending champion, Thomas More. Tufts is right behind the Lady LJs with a 3rd place ranking and the Bowdoin Polar Bears occupy the 7th place spot. Should be a few barnburners on tap this year when these 3 schools meet up with each other.

Happy to see that the Bowdoin ladies will open the season right here in my hometown of Plattsburgh NY on November 20th, when they take on Clarkson College, in the opening game of The Plattsburgh State Cardinal Classic Tip Off Tournament. It will be a homecoming of sorts for local hoopster, Marle Curle, former all star of the Champlain Valley Basketball League, who took her talents to Bowdoin, and is expected to be a major player in the Polar Bears goal of once again returning to the NCAA tournament. Marle, a starting guard during her first two years at Bowdoin is a junior this year and is the daughter of the long time head coach of Plattsburgh State Men's Basketball, Tom Curle. Plattsburgh State women will face Johnson State College in the other first round game of the classic with the winners scheduled to face off on Saturday Nov. 21st at 3 PM right after the 1 PM consolation game.

Of interest, at least to this follower of Plattsburgh State sports is that the Lady Cardinals will be challenged right after the New Year when they travel to Springfield College and face off against Tufts on January 2nd. The next day will be a battle of Cardinals when they meet another NESCAC team, Wesleyan College. They also have their annual game against Middlebury College on December 12th. If Plattsburgh State and Bowdoin both win their first round games in the Cardinal Classic, then Plattsburgh's appearance against Bowdoin in the championship of that tournament will mark the 4th NESCAC team Plattsburgh State will play out of their 7 non-conference games scheduled. By January 3rd we will have played more games against the NESCAC conference than we have played against our own SUNYAC conference(4 to 2). And no NESCAC team will have played more games against their own conference teams than Plattsburgh has. Not sure that will end up being a good thing for the Plattsburgh State Ladies. ???

Here's a link to the D3hoops Top 25 Women's Preseason Poll:

   http://d3hoops.com/top25/women/2015-16/preseason
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on November 11, 2015, 07:15:10 AM
This week's Williams campus paper interviews Val Oyakhilome, a basketball transfer from FDU (oddly the same school Amherst men got a transfer from last year).  She played a lot as a frosh and sophomore at FDU and appears to be an excellent shooter.  Despite losing star Ellen Cook to graduation the Ephs return a lot of talent elsewhere so if Oyakhilome (along with top recruit Lauren Vostal) can step right in and replace Cook's scoring the Ephs should be solid.  Last year's athletic frosh, especially Fernandez at the point, will need to make a leap forward however for Williams to challenge the top three.  The Ephs are very quick and athletic and should be stingy defensively once again.  They need to become far more efficient on offense than last year. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 16, 2015, 12:14:17 PM
Not much info to relate on the Amherst team as the WBB site is quiet on the roster...though there is a preview and a new assistant coach.  Have seen Coach G. at the football games....several times with his young daughter...in the stands. Did not make it to the team tent at Homecoming but did meet a new player selling football programs.  Heard that there is at least two new players.  However, Amherst did lose two players to graduation..Taylor Smith and All American Meg Robinson.  Meg is a BIG lost.
There was an interview of two players at the Williams football game....but the broadcast by NESN broke down.  Therefore it has been a " blackout" of sorts wrt to the Amherst team.
Oh well, the first game is this weekend!
Nescac1, I must say that Williams has been recruiting players with the most difficult last names to spell. :). Awaiting the announcers call of their names this season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on November 21, 2015, 05:04:19 PM
Quote from: amh63 on November 16, 2015, 12:14:17 PM
Not much info to relate on the Amherst team as the WBB site is quiet on the roster...though there is a preview and a new assistant coach.  Have seen Coach G. at the football games....several times with his young daughter...in the stands. Did not make it to the team tent at Homecoming but did meet a new player selling football programs.  Heard that there is at least two new players.  However, Amherst did lose two players to graduation..Taylor Smith and All American Meg Robinson.  Meg is a BIG lost.
There was an interview of two players at the Williams football game....but the broadcast by NESN broke down.  Therefore it has been a " blackout" of sorts wrt to the Amherst team.
Oh well, the first game is this weekend!
Nescac1, I must say that Williams has been recruiting players with the most difficult last names to spell. :). Awaiting the announcers call of their names this season.
Amh63,
  The preview didn't mention Rebecca Ford whom we've discussed in the past. New roster still not up; maybe a game time surprise. ;D
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 21, 2015, 07:51:10 PM
ronk,,,,,,yes, Rebecca Ford is not on the roster, along with the other 6'2" player from Florida.  There is also missing a 2 year starter and a soph from Switzerland.  Was told by a player, early in the football season, that both tall front court players did not return..  Amherst has 3 new players....one that just left the soccer field along with a sr player.....two sport student athletes.  In short...Amherst has a "short" roster...12 players. 
However, after tonight's game, all the players can run the floor, shoot, pass and most important...play defense.
Less than full roster but maybe a deeper rotation.  Looks like Coach G is going to a different offensive style; fast pace offense built around a strong defense.  Good start tonight....another game on Sunday.  We will see what the rotation will become soon enough.  Lots of road games early.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on November 22, 2015, 09:06:01 AM
good to have the start of a new season.  Always hard to make any conclusions from early games, but it looks like Bates is off to very slow start, and could be a long season there.  Bowdoin split two games this weekend.  Colby dominated against two week opponents, but they have a team that will score.  It is possible that Colby could be the top Maine NESCAC team. Amherst looks very strong, as usual, as does Tufts.  Looking for another competitive season, and would expect Amherst, Tufts and Williams at the top,, and then wide open after that.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 22, 2015, 09:36:52 AM
Maine1... Nice post.  Be busy elsewhere and have not reviewed the rosters of the other CAC teams at all.  Still looking at Amherst games to see how they play and do they have the team that can handle the likes of Tuft's with all the returning bigs and Bowdoin with its skilled players.  Yes, expect Williams will be competative again.  Admit to being clueless about the other schools' teams....like the CT schools and the other Maine based schools.  Your postings will help me.  Thanks.  Plus K
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 22, 2015, 05:27:52 PM
For the record....Amherst won its game today over Farmingdale State by 60 points.  Score is not important here.  The players played as a team in a number of combinations with everyone getting playing time.  The players also shot well outside, inside and against a zone.  The second half when the lead was hovering over 50 points, it was interesting to see the insertion of a FY guard to run the team of upperclassmen....as well as switching defensive schemes with different player combinations.
I noticed one of the coaches...maybe the HC of the other team clapping as Amherst executed a scoring play against his team.  In brief, it was a clinic.  Coach G and his opposite chatted awhile after the game...friendly sort of chat.  Believe the two teams play again on Long Island.  Amherst has an annual game with this school...first time in LeFrak.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 25, 2015, 12:58:13 PM
For the record...Amherst won its non- conference game with Wesleyan last night in LeFrak.  Next game for Amherst will be after Thanksgiving on Dec.1.  Score....not important as Amherst won big...around 40 plus points and every Amherst players had time on the floor.  Wesleyan has size but appear to be a young team and did not shoot well.  Scored only about 15 points at the half.  It maybe different when the two teams meet later in Middletown in a more important game.  A note of caution here...Amherst men's team beat their counterparts badly last season, both at home and away, only to lose to Wesleyan in OT at Trinity in the conference TITLE game. :'(
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 03, 2015, 03:53:17 PM
Amherst won its 4th game of the season 59-48 over Emmanual on Tuesday.  This game after Thanksgiving break was very competative...with Emmanual, playing its 7 th game of the season, scored the first 6 points of the game.  Amherst, with two players not dressed, played only 8 players.  Only one of the 3 contributing FYs got minutes on the floor.  Closest game of the season, but the game was never in doubt.  The home streak continues...114 wins.
Tonight, Amherst heads to ECSU, its first road game....against a solid opponent playing at home.  The Warriors was ranked in the pre- season top 25.  Happy to see the 7PM game in Williamatic will be broadcasted.  Anxious to see if all the LJs are dressed and available.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 04, 2015, 03:04:49 PM
Amherst wins its first road game last night, 65-49.  Not too bad for a road game against a quality that returns most of their starters from last season.  The details are posted on the website and summarized nicely by 7express on the Little East board.
Two players remained unavailable in street clothes and a senior guard was not in attendance.  Again, there was a short rotation of players with a slight different mix.  Amherst seemed to want to develop an inside game, rather than one based on outside shooting.  The stats show more points from outside than inside....maybe due to the Warriors defense.  Amherst did try to get the ball inside but passes were deflected and chippie shots were missed.....even the announcers mentioned the missed chippie shots missed after nice passing.  The announcers sometimes made comparison comments to the Tufts blowout of the Warriors earlier.
The Warriors took a lead in the second quarter and was behind only by 4 at the half. In the second half, it was all Amherst as the LJs clamped down on the Warriors, causing many turnovers and scoring off the TOs.  Lead was as high as 17 and remained in double figures for the last two quarters.  It was nice to see PG Renner playing better than her earlier games.  Amherst is giving its FY front court player from Granby, Ma. A significant number of minutes.  One play illustrates why these early road games are necessary before conference play. The talented FY forward makes a steal down low and takes off down the court dribbling pass and away from defenders and teammates both.  She takes an uncontested layup, rushes her shot and misses.  No teammates around for any RB.  Hanging her head a little, a teammate gives her a little encouragement...could almost hear a comment ..." That's OK, good effort". 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: magicman on December 06, 2015, 06:26:02 AM
Nice win for the Bowdoin Ladies as they topple the #3 ranked team in the country by a 61-43 final. The Polar Bears were down early but a big 2nd quarter gave them a 17 point halftime lead. The Jumbos were never really in the game after that. There's a writeup on the D3hoops front page. Here's the link:

  http://d3hoops.com/notables/2015/12/wrapup-1205-women

Maybe this will give the Polar Bears a lift and help them shake off those early season losses.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on December 06, 2015, 07:24:56 AM
Williams is off to a 6-0 start which is probably better than expected. There are no true stars yet. Different players have stepped up in each game. Last night the back court led-- Ammani Fernandez had 20 points and 11 assist and Devon Caveney had 29 points. The game before, the Williams bigs shone-- Katie Litman had 12 points and 21 boards, Oge Uwanaka had 12 points and 14 boards. The team will likely go as far as their super talented sophomore point guard, Fernandez, will take them. She is more relaxed this year and is playing much better but still turns the ball over more than she should. She leads NESCAC in 3 point shooting % so far. They will have to be more consistent to challenge Amherst, Bowdoin and Tufts (especially on offense), but on a good night they should be quite competitive.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 06, 2015, 06:20:08 PM
Boy, the Bowdoin big win at home over Tufts was a surprise...the margin mainly.  Not enough details and I did not watch the game.  Surprised that Tufts' front court did not seem to slow Brady down.  Will this be a year where the homecourt " factor" looms larger than ever?
Yes, Williams seem to rolling along.  This maybe a year that early season wins will be extended further into the season....into the conference games.
Do not know much about the other CAC teams...have not even been following them at all.
Oh yes...Amherst wins big over Bridgewater St. Home streak wins continue.  Team still working on a rotation of players that continue to put defensive and offensive pressure. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on December 08, 2015, 02:14:14 PM
I saw Bates play and they have heart and discipline, but not the physical skills of the better NESCAC teams. Their tallest player is 5'11" Allie Coppola and she has some talent, but is not fast. Their other forward Nina Davenport is their lead scorer at 14ppg and is skilled. Those two can rebound well. They have a guard that can shoot ,Bernadette Connors, and they screen to get her open. Their other guards are not that big and slower down the floor, but perform well enough in set pieces. They play 7 players mostly. They will not likely make the tournament this year, but may challenge some teams on good nights. They barely lost to Colby, for example.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on December 09, 2015, 04:55:59 PM
I think I say this every year in the early season.  Very difficult to draw conclusions based on the pre-season, as teams sometimes play a soft schedule.  Many of the NESCAC teams have very good records.  I was very surprised by the Colby-Bates game--given how bad some of Bates early losses are.  From what I have seen have Colby, they are pretty solid. I would expect them to compete for the 4-5 spot.  Bowdoin had a huge win over Tufts, Amherst is rolling as is Williams.  Conn College has been improving and is off to a very good start, and Trinity has a good record, but appear to have played a soft schedule. My expectation at this point is that Amherst, Tufts, Williams and Bowdoin will battle for the top four spots.  We will learn a little more about the Maine schools Saturday, when Bowdoin plays Colby.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on December 10, 2015, 09:57:37 AM
amh63,
   Just learned that 1 of my 2016 prospects has committed to Amherst(GP must have hacked my list ;D); she's a W/F & lower D1-capable.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 10, 2015, 01:44:07 PM
ronk.....I prefer to think that Coach G and you think alike and have similar lists of talented student athletes.  Any other particulars....school, physical attributes, etc. 
Coach G's FY players are getting time....two guards and a local forward.....all can handle the ball and are fast and quick and seem to be able to play defense.  Still Amherst needs some bigger front court players...to battle the CACbigs.  Amherst tallest player at 6'1" wants to play outside and shoot threes.  Does not like to battle hard for rebounds and tends to lose her "man".  I know, a little harsh...but defensive skills and toughness are critical in BB. Oh yes, Thanks for the info.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 10, 2015, 01:51:05 PM
Last night, Amherst won handily over an overmatched RIC team. in R.I.  Every one got to play that was heathy.  The RIC team was game and finally got their offense together in the fourth quarter...believe out scoring Amherst.  Good road win.  Last game before exams.  Next game down in Florida!  Team needs the break in many ways.  Several injured players need recovery time.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on December 10, 2015, 06:13:26 PM
Quote from: amh63 on December 10, 2015, 01:44:07 PM
ronk.....I prefer to think that Coach G and you think alike and have similar lists of talented student athletes.  Any other particulars....school, physical attributes, etc.
Coach G is FY players are getting time....two guards and a local forward.....all can handle the ball and are fast and quick and seem to be able to play defense.  Still Amherst needs some bigger front court players...to battle the CACbigs.  Amherst tallest player at 6'1" wants to play outside and shoot threes.  Does not like to battle hard for rebounds and tends to lose her "man".  I know, a little harsh...but defensive skills and toughness are critical in BB. Oh yes, Thanks for the info.

She's 5-10 and from NY St.(NOT a DC-area school or I'd give it to you)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on December 12, 2015, 08:36:42 PM
Williams played Wesleyan today and won their little three matchup 81-62. This not the margin that Amherst beat Wesleyan (41), but the outcome and the play make it clear that Wesleyan will struggle to match the elite teams. The Cardinals  have a really good first year post in Tara Berger who had a 16 point 10 rebound game, but even she struggled in the third quarter when Williams put their elite defenders, Litman and Uwanaka, on her, scoring only one point. They feature balanced scoring with Brenna Diggins, a junior forward, Maeve Vitale, a sophomore guard,Danielle Gervacio a senior guard and Kaylie Williams, a senior forward. The bench is not deep. They are just not fast and athletic enough to be in the top tier of NESCAC this year, though Berger could be a cornerstone of a better team, if she keeps working on her post game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on December 12, 2015, 09:43:28 PM
Two interesting games today.  Conn College beat Tufts.  Looks like this is not a strong Tufts team, and that Conn College needs to be taken seriously.  Second game was Bowdoin-Colby.  This game was close until mid-way through the fourth quarter, when Bowdoin blew the game open. I watched the second half of the game, and I think the Bowdoin was clearly the better team, and missed a number of easy shots.  Bowdoin was able to break the game open with a change to a zone press that bothered Colby.  Colby is a solid team, but may not have enough to battle the top teams. Bowdoin appears to be solid, well coached, with good inside and outside play. 

Will have to wait a few weeks for exams and break for the games to start again, but good to see some of the NESCAC teams playing each other this week. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on December 16, 2015, 09:13:35 AM
just for grins, here is my totally unscientific, pre-christmas rankings of NESCAC women's teams:
1.Amherst
2. Conn College--yes really
3. Williams
4. Bowdoin
5. Tufts
6. Trinity
7. Colby
8. Middlebury
9. Wesleyan
10. Hamilton
11. Bates

waiting for January to see how it turns out. It's clear that below Amherst, the top teams are closer in ability than recent years.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 29, 2015, 10:15:40 AM
Amherst wins over Adrian, 67-43, in Daytona, FL. Yesterday.  The first game since breaking for Exams.
Some players showed a little rust....all players dressed got minutes, I believe.  This afternoon, Amherst will face Salisbury, the team that beat them in NJ in the post-season last year.  Should be a test for Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on December 29, 2015, 10:52:34 AM
Quote from: amh63 on December 29, 2015, 10:15:40 AM
Amherst ins over Adrian, 67-43, in Daytona, FL. Yesterday.  The first game since breaking for Exams.
Some players showed a little rust....all players dressed got minutes, I believe.  This afternoon, Amherst will face Salisbury, the team that beat them in NJ in the post-season last year.  Should be an test for Amherst.

  The good Montgomery County guards(Hackett and Seipp) have graduated so not quite the test that it was last year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 29, 2015, 02:44:29 PM
ronk.....thanks for the assurance :).  Did check the roster to see if the guards that put a hurt on Amherst had graduated.  Still, Salisbury often starts three guards and two forwards...sometimes four guards. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 29, 2015, 05:19:40 PM
Amherst beats Salisbury, 59-35, in Florida...in a Sweet 16 rematch of two teams in last season post season.  Team heads home to NE where the campus got a nice snow cover today.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescacfan1 on December 31, 2015, 12:56:55 PM
Williams loses one and wins one in Nashville. The loss was to a very good Whitman team, avenging their elite 8 loss almost 4 years ago. Williams stopped passing the ball and turned the ball over 7 times in the 4th quarter in a game they could have won. In the next game, the Williams point guard, Fernandez, was back in form, dishing out 10 assists. She leads the league in assists and when she cuts down her turnovers, the team operates well. Litman and Caveney both had 19 points. Williams has a strong inside game with Litman and Uwenaka rebounding and scoring and good outside shooting with McCall, Caveney and Fernandez. Turnovers, fouls and sharing the ball are the issues for this team.
If Williams takes care of the ball, shares and stays out of foul trouble, Williams can give Amherst a good game next week. If not...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 03, 2016, 10:16:09 PM
disappointing performance by Colby at UMass Boston. Seemed like Colby was unable to get any offense going for most of the game.  I did not think UMass-Boston was a very strong team, but they controlled the game, and only a late Colby run got the game into the single digits (10) at the end.  Colby play Husson Monday, and Husson handled uMass Boston.  Not sure what that means.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 04, 2016, 10:00:57 PM
Amherst beats Albright today in PA in a game between ranked unbeaten teams.  Low scoring game.  Amherst lead at the half went to double digit at the end of the 3rd quarter..50-40.  The final spread was a bit higher.  Seems this Monday game was arranged between the schools because both coaches needed a 25th game.  Amherst's Coach G was the only coach willing to travel to play Albright.  PG Renner was the player to lead Amherst with 20 points...normally averages about 5 points..  Her scoring was needed with Giddins, Amherst's top scorer, was shut out.
Amherst basically won on the foul line in the second half...outside shots were not going in for Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on January 09, 2016, 01:33:11 AM
Second year Head Coach KJ Krasco's Middlebury squad opened the conference season with a win 76-59 victory over Wesleyan this evening.  Sarah Kaufman, averaging 18.7 ppg, scored 31 including 15-16 from the FT line.  FY center Catherine Harrison, whose middle name is double-double, scored 12 while pulling down 15 boards and blocking 4 shots.  Eileen Daley collected 11 rebounds and stole the ball four times. 

This is a very young team with no seniors on the roster.  The only two juniors have been out with injuries all season.  One is last season's leading scorer (14 ppg) Elizabeth Knox.  Krystina Reynolds was a key reserve averaging 18 minutes per game and 5 points. 

Despite the NESCAC's ongoing conspiracy to disallow attendance of both men's and women's games versus a common opponent on the same evening, I've managed to see this team play a few times.  I see Amherst, Tufts, Williams and Trinity listed among the Top 25 at present.  For what it's worth Middlebury's three losses have been by 3 to Skidmore, 6 to Plattsburgh and a 70-62 decision against #5 NYU.  They play some good basketball.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 09, 2016, 07:14:30 AM
Great to have the NESCAC season openers.  Very nice win for Middlebury. They were competitive last year, and seem to be improved.  Conn College continues to look like a legitimate contender, and had a good opening night last night.  Amherst blew Williams out--and I am not sure that Williams will be among the top four this year.  Very tight game between two strong teams, Tufts and Bowdoin.  Bowdoin should definitely be ranked if Tufts is, given the early season win by Bowdoin. Colby squeaked by what I believe is a very weak Bates team, and struggled earlier this week with a Husson team.  Early on it looks like Amherst, Tufts, Bowdoin and Conn College might be the top four, with Colby, Trinity and Middlebury and Williams after that.  Will have to check out Amherst as they seem to be really putting the pieces together for another strong run. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 09, 2016, 12:23:33 PM
Maine1.....thanks for your informative post!   Plus K.  Like Vandy74, I was watching the men's game of the Amherst-Williams match in LeFrak.  At half time, took a peek at the women's game in Willytown.  Surprised at the score.  Saw that the backup players....talented ones were in.  glad to see that all the players were dressed to play.  Nice to see Amherst score 80 points against a strong Williams team...ranked 19th with only 1 lost going into the game.  I think the surprising lopsided score was just one of those games.  The surprise was the Ehps were at home!...and had the bad game, relatively speaking.  Got to give Amherst's defensive effort some credit :).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 10, 2016, 08:19:05 AM
After first weekend of NESCAC play, it looks like Amherst is clearly the top team.  I watched the Tufts-Colby game, and if Tufts had any type of ability to put the ball into the basket, they would have won by about 20.  Tufts big players struggled with making shots inside against a small Colby team.  They also missed a number of wide open mid-range shots.  The score should not have been as close as it was.  It also looks like Conn College may be for real, as they won at Middlebury.  Wesleyan and Hamilton look to be on the weaker side  I expect to see a lot of close games among most of these teams.  The other interesting point is that in general, there appears to be very little depth across the teams, with starters playing big minutes, and very little bench scoring.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 10, 2016, 05:15:04 PM
Believe it or not, but we are pretty much halfway through the 2015-16 season and there are plenty of teams still surprising and records being rewritten.

Tonight on Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) we chat with the fourth person to reach the 900 wins in men's college basketball, a woman who keeps herself very busy even when she isn't coaching, and several other teams who are surprising everyone by leading their conference races.

Hoopsville hits the air at 7:00 PM ET and you can watch it here: www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2015-16/jan10 (http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2015-16/jan10)

Guests include ( in order):
- Glenn Robinson, #17 F&M men's coach - won career game 900 Saturday
- Pat Manning, #18 Williams women's coach - WBCA Center Court segment
- Amanda Crockett, North Park women's coach
- Mac Brown, New Jersey City men's coach
- Kendal Wallace, LaGrange men's coach

You can tune into the podcast after the show airs here::
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville (http://www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville)
iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/hoopsville/id1059517087 (https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/hoopsville/id1059517087)

And don't forget you can always interact with us:
Website: www.d3hoopsville.com (http://www.d3hoopsville.com)
Twitter: @d3hoopsville (http://www.twitter.com/d3hoopsville) or #Hoopsville
Facebook: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville (http://www.facebook.com/Hoopsville)
Email: hoopsville@d3hoops.com
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/d3hoopsville (http://www.youtube.com/user/d3hoopsville)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on January 10, 2016, 09:37:57 PM
Quote from: Maine1 on January 10, 2016, 08:19:05 AM
It also looks like Conn College may be for real, as they won at Middlebury.  Wesleyan and Hamilton look to be on the weaker side  I expect to see a lot of close games among most of these teams.  The other interesting point is that in general, there appears to be very little depth across the teams, with starters playing big minutes, and very little bench scoring.

I know I composed a message re the Conn Coll-Midd game but it would seem I never hit "post."  Just as well since you give me a few reference points to use Maine1.  I see no reason to question the Camels' legitimacy.  I'm not a longtime serious women's hoops fan but I see no wins against schools that would be considered scrimmage opponents in other sports.  The Chapman-Redlands conference, I draw a blank on the name, takes it's athletic reputation very seriously.  Redlands is the usual NCAA tournament representative each season in women's lax, a sport with which I am quite familiar.  What I would hope, taking your depth reference into consideration, is that Middlebury is also for real.  While the Camels only played six contributors, statistically speaking, they did put three other players on the court for a combined 17 minutes to rest the starters.  Liz Malman played the entire 40 minutes but Payton Ouimette logged the second most PT with 33.  All of the Panther starters played at least 33 minutes and Sabrina Weeks, the only player coming off the bench, played 25.  In a previous post I mentioned the two juniors on Middlebury's roster who have been unavailable all season.  Elizabeth Knox was last season's leading scorer and Krystina Reynolds was a key reserve who averaged 18 minutes per game.

Conn Coll got off to a fast start in Middlebury taking a 17-9 lead in the first quarter but the Panthers won the second 16-7 showing the ability to come back and had a one point lead at the half.  They fell behind by four after the third and the Camels dominated the closing ten minutes 25-16.  It's notable that no Connecticut player was in foul trouble.  Middlebury lost one starter to fouls while three other players had four by game's end.  I didn't see the game.  I'm only using statistics here but it does seem reasonable to conclude that Middlebury's lack of depth, in light of the fouls, contributed somewhat to the way the final period played out.  As I said, I believe the Camel's single-blemished record is legit.  I also believe that if the Panthers can add the two injured players to the active roster they are a team that can play 40 minutes with anybody.  From the three games I have actually watched I know there is also a lot a developing talent on the Panther bench. 

In closing I join amh63 in asking what common sense challenged brain trust came up with the (dare I say sexist?) idea of scheduling men's and women's games against common opponents home and away concurrently? ???  And got away with it. ::) ::) :P

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 11, 2016, 10:53:33 AM
Vandy74 is completely right on the matter of CAC separation of men and women games.  I believe the Nescac over reacting to Title IX concerns is the culprit.  Having said that, back to basketball matters.
Amherst played a game yesterday while the men's team was "idle".  Delaware Valley entered LeFrak for an out of conference game and got crushed, 73-38.  Sr. Marley Giddens was the top scorer of the game with 28 points....her career best.
For me, there are two stories taken from the game.  It seems that this year's Amherst team has many potential top scorers and is becoming a very good defensive team.  The leading scorer from Friday's win had a "bad" day and Giddens stepped up.  PG Renner who was a top scorer in another game had no points but dished out 8-9 assist.  In short, Amherst is becoming a team that can score in many ways and improving defensively.
The second story is DV.  Based on its record, it is a solid opponent from a conference that I am not familiar with....even though it's members are in the D.C/MD area.  How did this game come to be??
A regular season game vice a tournament opponent.  Maybe someone from D3hoops could inquire.  Coach G is rather like a statue on such matters ;D.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on January 11, 2016, 11:06:10 AM
Quote from: amh63 on January 11, 2016, 10:53:33 AM
Vandy74 is completely right on the matter of CAC separation of men and women games.  I believe the Nescac over reacting to Title IX concerns is the culprit.  Having said that, back to basketball matters.
Amherst played a game yesterday while the men's team was "idle".  Delaware Valley entered LeFrak for an out of conference game and got crushed, 73-38.  Sr. Marley Giddens was the top scorer of the game with 28 points....her career best.
For me, there are two stories taken from the game.  It seems that this year's Amherst team has many potential top scorers and is becoming a very good defensive team.  The leading scorer from Friday's win had a "bad" day and Giddens stepped up.  PG Renner who was a top scorer in another game had no points but dished out 8-9 assist.  In short, Amherst is becoming a team that can score in many ways and improving defensively.
The second story is DV.  Based on its record, it is a solid opponent from a conference that I am not familiar with....even though it's members are in the D.C/MD area.  How did this game come to be??
A regular season game vice a tournament opponent.  Maybe someone from D3hoops could inquire.  Coach G is rather like a statue on such matters ;D.

It was Lebanon Valley from PA, not Delaware Valley.  Commonwealth Conference is all PA colleges.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on January 11, 2016, 11:44:57 AM
Yeah, Leb Val is from the same conference as Albright, whom the Lord Jeffs beat earlier in the week. Del Val (which is also in Pennsylvania) is from the MAC Freedom. The MAC Freedom and MAC Commonwealth are one conference (the plain old MAC) for football and two for most other sports.

Leb Val has been a consistent conference title contender in the Commonwealth and was a repeat NCAA tournament team a few years ago. So it theoretically should've been a good non-conference test.

Leb Val's coach also was in New England (Southern Connecticut State) before she came to Amish Country. So maybe she knows Gromacki from that somehow?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 11, 2016, 03:02:14 PM
Roundball999 and Gordonmann......thanks for the correction.   My bad, and plus K to you both.
I knew it was LVC, but my brain was elsewhere.  I go by the area and remember my HS team playing Lebanon HS and getting beaten by a QB by the name of Dick Shiner....went on to Becoming an All-American at Maryland.  Yes, a very long time ago.
LVU plays Hood College in Frederick Md and has some local high school players.  Also checked out the coaches for the team.  HC father coached a bit in NE and HC was at Yale for a time.  Another assist has NY roots, etc.
You maybe correct Gordonmann.  Still, the coaches are all relative young...to initiate a seasonal game with Amherst. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: kate on January 11, 2016, 03:23:28 PM
Coach Gromacki was at Drew University for a very brief stint immediately after Drew left the MAC to be a member of the then newly formed Landmark League.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 11, 2016, 05:56:49 PM
Kate....thanks for that info.  The time frame is off somewhat for me.  The coaches at LVU would have been in HS then.  Coach G was a successful HC at St. Lawrence before moving on to Hamiliton...both in the NY state.  He just hired a former player at St. Lawrence as his top assistant.  I met him in Salem, Va.when he was just hired at Amherst.  He wanted to return to Western Ma. for personal reasons.
In any case, Coach G recruited in the NYState area of SJF and Alfred Un and in NE.  I would think he met the fathers of two of LVU coaches...one the HC of AU....during recruiting/ scouting trips.  It is possible that an initial inquiry was made by his assistant and/or via a father.
I just find " small  world" connections fascinating.  For example....when Coach G was at St. Lawrence, he had a mentor of sorts on the school's Board of Overseers (trustees), an Amherst alum.  After Coach G was given the job at Hamilton, after a successful season as Interim HC, the job at Amherst became open.  It was like his dream job...coach G grew up in nearby S. Deerfield and his mother was still living there.  Coach G asked his mentor for advice whether to apply.  I was told that the advice given was to tell Hamilton straight out first if he decided to apply, his reasons and accept how the chips fell.  His mentor and I often chat at Amherst BB games.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 11, 2016, 10:44:23 PM
Quote from: amh63 on January 11, 2016, 03:02:14 PM
Roundball999 and Gordonmann......thanks for the correction.   My bad, and plus K to you both.
I knew it was LVC, but my brain was elsewhere.  I go by the area and remember my HS team playing Lebanon HS and getting beaten by a QB by the name of Dick Shiner....went on to Becoming an All-American at Maryland.  Yes, a very long time ago.
LVU plays Hood College in Frederick Md and has some local high school players.  Also checked out the coaches for the team.  HC father coached a bit in NE and HC was at Yale for a time.  Another assist has NY roots, etc.
You maybe correct Gordonmann.  Still, the coaches are all relative young...to initiate a seasonal game with Amherst.

To also clarify, the MAC consists of teams from NJ, PA, and MD... not just PA. Hood and Stevenson from MD, FDU-Florham (recent national champs) from NJ. The rest are from PA.

And Gromacki's tenure at Drew was a few MONTHS, actually. He was hired in June of 2007 and left in October just two weeks before the season started - never coached a game - to take the Hamilton job on an interim basis. That title was removed in April of 2008... and he then left to take the Amherst job.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 13, 2016, 09:30:58 AM
Some conference news.
Amherst traveled down to NYC to play Baruch.  Won 85-34.  Stats only....checked in at halftime and it was 44-18.  It was high winds in the area....hope team got back safe.
The surprise result was Bowdoin's lost to Emmanual in Maine last night, 64-57.  Watched the game in the first half and it was back and forth.  Figured the Polar Bears would take control in the second half.
Emmanual played Amherst close in a 59-48 lost in LeFrak in early Dec.....still?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 13, 2016, 11:07:09 AM
That is a surprise with Bowdoin losing to Emmanuel.  As I mentioned, I believe that after Amherst, the league is not very strong.  Most teams don't put five people on the court that are scoring threats.  I think you will see some surprises as we get into the season, and I would not be surprised if Conn College cracks the top four. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 15, 2016, 08:57:49 PM
Some observations on tonight's games
Colby-Williams-after seeing both teams a few times, I don't think Williams is a very good team.  Colby shot lights out from three, but Williams does not have a lot of offense, and simply let one player take and make three wide open, uncontested threes in the second half (when that player already had hit three in the first half).  Colby is scrappy, but has lost to some rather weak teams.  I don't see Williams as a top four team, and more likely will be in the lower half.
Conn-Trinity-very close game, and impressed that Conn College won without there top scorer.  I am not sure why she did not play, but clearly Conn College has depth.  Tomorrow's Amherst-Conn College game will be very interesting and I think will tell us a lot about the strength of Conn College. I hope there top player plays.
Tufts-Middlebury--Tough game for Middlebury, appears that Tufts great defense totally stifled Middlebury.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 16, 2016, 01:06:05 PM
Maine1...I agree wrt today's Amherst-Conn in New London.   Who is Conn's best player?  Cannot tellgoingover the last few Conn's games.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 16, 2016, 02:53:01 PM
Mairead Hynes is their leading scorer-actually, it does look like she played last night-but only 11 minutes--and came off the bench.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 17, 2016, 06:12:36 AM
Good win by Amherst yesterday.  Conn College does have a very nice team, but Amherst looks to be the class of the league.  They have seven-eight very athletic players that play, all can score, and as usual, they play outstanding defense.  Given how offensively challenged most of the league is, I think Amherst will run away with this. Tufts could give them a good game because Tufts also plays great defense, but they have trouble scoring. Bowdoin will also play them close, but Amherst's balance will be the difference.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 18, 2016, 02:45:20 PM
Maine 1 .....watched the Williams vs Bowdoin game mainly in the 2nd half.  Watched the men's game in the first half...as you know Amherst teams plays Bowdoin this Friday.
I am also puzzled by the Play of the EPH team this season.  The team has a very good FY guard who is the leading scorer and has a big veteran front line, IMO.  Yet, there  appears  the experienced veterans plays with indifference and lack of energy.  One example that puzzled me and caused the Williams HC to put her hands on her head.  Late in the game, Williams' PG was bringing the ball up with pace.  She passed to her veteran center in the front court...just over the line.  Her Center was harassed and passed the ball back to the PG.  Turnover...The PG was not over mid court!  It was just one of many TOs by the Williams team.  Amherst crushed the EHPs in Willytown...surprising to me I have to say.  It was the number of TOs that Wwilliams committed that stood out to me.  Williams HC in the recap gave credit to Amherst's defensive effort.  However, the example Above would be more in the category of unforced error. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on January 20, 2016, 04:29:06 AM
Quote from: Maine1 on January 15, 2016, 08:57:49 PM

Tufts-Middlebury--Tough game for Middlebury, appears that Tufts great defense totally stifled Middlebury.

I didn't see this game Maine1 and a 13-2 record for a NESCAC team speaks for itself.  Our schedules aren't soft.  I did attend the men's game that evening however and know at least one key Panther was playing sick.  Middlebury only lost the combined 1st and 3rd quarters by a single point.  It was in the latter quarter of each half  that Tufts truly dominated.  Team leading scorer Sarah Kaufman played seven and a half minutes less than her average, didn't start and was held to only two points.  My intent is in no way to say the best team didn't win but several other observations lead me to suspect some Middlebury players were dealing with the flu bug. 

There is a game I did see on which I meant to make somewhat knowledgeable commentary.  Middlebury got off to a slow start tonight against Smith, trailing 9-0 at 4:20 in the opening quarter.  From there they gained the upper hand going on to a 70-57 victory and upping their record to 10-5.  Sarah Kaufman led all scorers with 21.  Eileen Daley added 14 tallies and collected 13 rebounds.  Catherine Harrison pulled down 8 more to go with 10 points and 2 blocked shots while Sabrina Weeks came off the bench to score 11.  Middlebury has added a 7th contributor to what has been strictly a six player rotation in highly competitive games.  Rachel Collins has been seeing playing time recently, scoring 5 points tonight in 5 minutes of action.  I also heard a few days ago that last season's leading scorer Elizabeth Knox, a 5'10" forward, has been practicing with the team although not yet suiting up to play.  Since my sister-in-law retired from the MC coaching ranks last season I no longer have legit insider information concerning Middlebury athletics but hopefully my source here is trustworthy.

The Panthers next game is at Williams on Sunday.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 21, 2016, 03:13:04 PM
amh63,
  Just learned another of my prospects has committed to Amherst; she's also from upstate NY 6-0 P who can make a 3; GP must have hacked into my list ;D I'd rank her less capable than the first 5-11 SF. Found out via an email from her father; it may not be public info yet so I won't identify her further; maybe GP will disclose to you.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 22, 2016, 09:34:48 PM
Ronk....thanks for the heads up.  Coach G does not talk to me...just smiles as he goes by with a nod.  I do see him at football games with his young daughter.  At BB games, his wife is in the stands and keeping check on their kids.  Nice to see family at games.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 22, 2016, 09:39:29 PM
Amherst played a game against a tough Bowdoin team and appeared to have the game in hand at halftime.  Therefore went back to the men's game where Amherst was behind at the half.
See that Both men and women teams won by double digit scores. 
Another game on Sat afternoon with Colby.  Hope the ladies are ready.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 23, 2016, 04:35:48 PM
Just watched Amherst vs Colby game.  Colby gave Amherst a great game in the first half, but without looking at the stats i.e. points fm the bench, Amherst came out strong in the 2nd half.  Not sure if Amherst bench is deeper, their shots started to fall, or pure coaching with great adjustments made to help defense at halftime.  Any insight appreciated.  We know GP is a great coach, I suspect games like this just reinforce that for me.

Saw that Marley Giddens started and played very little.  Announcer said she was on bench with ice on her knee.  Wishing her the best.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 23, 2016, 05:09:33 PM
Looking at the stats.....my take of the game.
Amherst was only up by 4 at the half....and not shooting well.  Colby was hitting the long ball.  Saw Giddens being worked on...only 1 minute in the game. 
Looking at the floor time of the starters, the team adjusted their offense with the lost of their Sr. Starter Giddens.  The win by less than 30 points is fine as two FY players got playing time.  Giddens lost to the team in the middle of the conference is a worry....as a talented FY front court player is also out...on crutches. A return of a front court player from CT helps.
At this time of the year a win is a win, especially in conference.  CAC Tourny seeding is critical.  top seed gets to host.

Back to back games is a worry by all coaches.  The men's team lost their first conference gain in Maine to Colby who won their first conference game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 23, 2016, 08:55:55 PM
Watched Colby-Amherst.  Colby is a solid team, with a lot of good shooters, particularly  if you give them space.  First half of the game I thought Amherst was definitely off on offense, missing some easy shots, and they lost Giddens early which took away offense.  However, the big difference in the first and second half was the Amherst defense.  Over the Gromacki years at Amherst, his teams have played great defense, and in particular, they are great at not letting teams get open looks from the three point line.  In the first half, Colby was 5-12 from three, and a lot of those were uncontested. That is totally out of character for Amherst.  In the second half, Amherst came out with an incredible intensity on defense, and totally smothered the Colby shooters.  (Colby was 0-4 in the second half on threes, and could not even find space to take a three).  In addition, Amherst forced a number of turnovers that they turned into easy baskets.
Offense comes and goes.  When you play defense the way Amherst does, you will win a lot of games.
Amherst should win the league.  I don't see any team that has an offense that can play against this defense.  Colby, Bowdoin, Middlebury and Conn College are going to battle for the three and four slots in the league. Next Saturday's Colby-Bowdoin game is a big game that will impact the league standings.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 27, 2016, 09:25:35 PM
Amherst beats Williams in LeFrak by a dozen or more points tonight in a game that does not count in the conf standings.  It was not a good shooting night overall for Amherst.  Actually Williams had a better FG percentage, better three point shooting percentage and foul shooting percentage.  Amherst did get two more rebounds.  The difference was defense.....Amherst had 11 more steals and much fewer TOs and more assists.  Senior Giddins was not dressed and sat on the bench in maybe her last Williams game. Hope her knee injury is mild.  Amherst only played 7 players.  A key FY front court player is out for the season, I believe.  The Granby Ma. Native is on crutches and has missed a number of games to date.  She had showed great promise in the games played.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on January 29, 2016, 07:09:33 AM
I upset my weekly Trivia team members on Wednesday by opting to attend Middlebury's game against Castleton.  The school is just 29 miles south down route 30 and their loyal fans turned out in force. 

Coming in at 12-4 a solid Castleton team made up almost entirely of VT ex high school players led most of the game.  Middlebury, with only 7 players in the rotation against this caliber opponent was without the services of Sabrina Weeks.  No idea as to the nature of her injury.  Having been down by as many as 7 points the Panthers played to a tie ending the 3rd quarter and scored the first basket of the 4th to take one of their few leads of the game.  Castleton answered almost immediately and dominated  the rest of the way going on to win by a score of 59-52.  Bryanna duPont led the victors with 19 points on 8-9 shooting and also pulled down a team leading 7 rebounds.

Catherine Harrison led Middlebury with 13 points and a career high 20 rebounds but Middlebury shot poorly as a team including 2-12 from behind the arc and never seemed capable of putting together any kind of a run.  This season's team leading scorer Sarah Kaufman was held to 11 points with 7 coming from the stripe.  Fatigue was clearly a factor in the final 10 minutes but Middlebury played erratically from the start never finding it's rhythm.

In fairness, Castleton did not play particularly well either but found a way to win.  The team shot just 37% from the field, 26% on trey attempts and lost the battle of the boards to Middlebury 41-37 despite a significant size advantage. 

Hopefully  Sabrina Weeks will be able to return to action shortly with five NESCAC games remaining, several against the conference's best.  Seven strong this young Panther squad has proven capable of playing with anyone and should be among the NESCAC's better teams the next few seasons regardless of how the remainder of this one plays out.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 30, 2016, 09:25:46 AM
I don't see either Tufts or Amherst having any problems in today's games.  Middlebury needs a win over Hamilton to stay in the pack of teams vying for the 3-4 positions. I think the Colby-Bowdoin game is a big game for both teams, with the winner of that game having a big edge going into the final two weekends of the season.  The first game at Bowdoin was a very tight game, with Bowdoin pulling away in the fourth quarter. This game is in Waterville, so expect it to be another close contest.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on January 31, 2016, 04:26:01 AM
Still without the services of Sabrina Weeks Middlebury needed OT to defeat Hamilton this afternoon.  Alex Huffman played 35 of the team's 38 bench minutes.  Winning the OT 13-3, 9 points coming from the stripe, it was another solid team effort by the Panthers outlasting the Continentals 75-65.  Colleen Caveney led the scoring with 19.  Only Eileen Daley failed to reached double digits falling just short with 9 but also led the team with 13 rebounds with Catherine Harrison collecting 12.   

Leading Hamilton in both scoring and rebounding was Sam Graber with 22 and 12 respectively.  Lauren Getman tallied 19.  It was free throws that cost the visitors an opportunity to gain the upset.  Given 9 attempts from the stripe they tallied with only 3. 

Hopefully Weeks can return for next weekend's trip to Maine where both Colby and Bowdoin appear to be must win games if the Panthers are to earn either the 3 or 4 seed.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 31, 2016, 07:15:38 AM
yesterday games went as expected. All of the top teams won. You still have what I consider a four team contest for the 3-4 spots between Conn College, Bowdoin, Colby and Middlebury.  I actually list them in the order I think they will finish.  I think Conn College has the best all-around team of this group in terms of consistent offense.  Bowdoin is great on defense (as they showed yesterday in really making it difficult for Colby to score), but like many of the teams are challenged on the offensive side.  I don't see Middlebury beating either Colby or Bowdoin in Maine next week, and given their loss to Williams, it is possible that Williams will overtake Middlebury in the league standings.  Amherst and Tufts seemed locked in at one and two, which means that next week's game at Amherst will decide the number one seed.  I think Amherst wins that game, as Tufts doesn't have enough offense to beat Amherst.  Two very good weeks left down the stretch.  The final week will see Bowdoin and Colby on the road both playing Conn College--so that weekend will have a big impact on the overall standings, as will the Conn College super bowl Sunday match up at Williams.  So Williams can still play there way back into this, but losses to Colby and Bowdoin will hurt them
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 31, 2016, 12:17:06 PM
Amherst wins at home over a game Trinity team.  Forward Giddens was not dressed.  Seems to me that Amherst was working their offense in the game...passing the ball quickly on the perimeter, inside and out...looking for the open shot.  Not too much driving during the time I watched....middle of the 3 rd period to the end. 
When time was running out for a shot, a open player would take the shot.  Trinity top scorer was basically shut down when I watched.
Key weekend games coming up....Bates and Tufts at home. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 03, 2016, 04:54:34 PM
For the third consecutive year, Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) will air for 12 hours as the regular season enters the final four weeks. Dave McHugh will chat with coaches, administrators, student-athletes, and others involved in Division III basketball from around the country. Other guests will include those who have Division III roots or appreciate the division and the game along with the student-athletes who play the sport.

Hoopsville will air from 10 a.m. to 10 p.m. (and maybe later) on Thursday, February 4 live from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can see what guests are scheduled, get more information, and watch the show here: http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2015-16/feb4

You can also read the press release about the show: http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/hoopsville-marathon-2016

Here is the guest list as we speak. All times are Eastern and subject to change. Additional guests to be added if and when necessary:


   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
TimeGuestSchool
10:15amConnie TilleySt. Norbert (WBB) - WBCA Center Court
10:40amJamie PurdyPeidmont (WBB)
11:00amKeri CarolloUW-Whitewater (WBB) - Nat'l Committee Chair
11:20amBrent PollariSaint Mary's (Minn.) (WBB)
11:40amKent MadsenNo. 21 Wheaton (Ill.) (WBB)
12:00pmRussell LoydRose-Hulman (MBB)
12:20pmKevin BroderickNazareth (MBB)
12:40pmJustin ScottArcadia (MBB)
1:00pmSam HargravesNo. 12 Alma (MBB)
1:20pmLenny ReichMount Union (SID)
1:40pmMaureen WebsterClarkson (WBB)
2:00pmBetsy WitmanYork (Pa.) (WBB)
2:20pmSara LeeDenison (WBB)
2:40pmKlay KneuppelWisconsin Lutheran (MBB)
3:00pmBrian Van HaaftenBuena Vista (MBB) - Nat'l Committee Chair
3:30pmSydney MossNo. 1 Thomas More (WBB)
3:45pmAaron RousellBucknell (WBB) - former Chicago coach
4:00pmTim ShanahanStaten Island (WBB)
4:20Pat CunninghamTrinity (Texas) (MBB) - NABC Coach's Corner
4:50pmBubba SmithSewanee (MBB)
5:15pmBen StrongFormer Guilford All-American
5:30pmKevin ConnorsESPN SportsCenter Anchor - Ithaca alumnus
6:00pmKristen DowlingClaremont-Mudd-Scripps (WBB)
6:20pmAllison ColemanSage (WBB)
6:40pmLandry KosmalskiSwarthmore (MBB)
7:00pmDave NilandNo. 23 Penn State-Behrend (MBB)
7:20pmAaron GallettaLasell (MBB)
7:40pmJohn BaronGwynedd-Mercy (MBB)
8:00pm
8:20pm
8:40pmMelissa HodgdonWheaton (Mass.) (WBB)
9:00pmG.P. GromackiNo. 2 Amherst (WBB)
9:20pmJames Wagner
9:40pmHAPPY HOURFree-for-all of calls, tweets, and fun!

We hope to get at least the full show on a podcast, or several podcast, during the on Friday. You can find it here:
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville
iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/hoopsville/id1059517087

Don't forget you can always interact with us:
Website: www.d3hoopsville.com
Twitter: @d3hoopsville (http://www.twitter.com/d3hoopsville) or #Hoopsville
Facebook: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville
Email: hoopsville@d3hoops.com
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/d3hoopsville

And a reminder the Hoopsville Fundraising Project has begun yet again. Please consider helping us cover Division III basketball the way it deserves to be covered. If you can not donate, please don't worry about - we understand. At least share the campaign with anyone you think might be interested: http://igg.me/at/hoopsville-fundraiser/x/6029509

Also, if you know any advertisers interested in promoting their company or products on the show, send them our way: hoopsville@d3hoops.com

Thanks!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 05, 2016, 10:34:57 PM
No surprises tonight.  All of the top teams won.  Williams pulled out a tight game against Wesleyan.  Williams has to be the weakest 16-5 time I have seen. They have a big game on Sunday with Conn College.  It looks like the 3-4 spots will come down to next weekend, when Colby and Bowdoin head to Connecticut and play Conn College. Both Colby and Bowdoin should win tomorrow.  I watched Middlebury for the first time this season against Colby, and they are not very strong.   No outside threat, not very strong inside, and weak on defense. Hamilton was blown out by Bowdoin, and I don't expect either Bowdoin or Colby to have much trouble tomorrow. In the game against the two unbeaten teams (in conference play), I would be very surprised if the game is even close. I expect Amherst to win handily. Although Tufts is great on defense, they don't score.  Amherst is equally good on defense, but will find ways to score.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: OldCardinal on February 06, 2016, 04:45:48 PM
Tufts beats Amherst on the road.  Amazing game.  Close the whole way.  As good as Tufts has been, I didn't see that coming.  Nice win for the Jumbos.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bowdoin74 on February 06, 2016, 05:06:19 PM
Quite a game in Amherst. . .a few thoughts:

1.  Neither team could shoot a three - in the end the poor three point shooting hurt Amherst more than Tufts. 

2.  Jill Henrikson Pace bookended the Amherst losses at home.  She was a first year player for Bowdoin 121 games ago, and an assistant coach for Tufts today.

3.  Baptista is a force.  She does everything well and presents major match up problems. 

Congratulations to the Amherst seniors for their tremendous four year record.  Tough loss on senior day.

Solid, special win for the Jumbos.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 06, 2016, 07:39:39 PM
Very surprised by the outcome of Tufts-Amherst. Watched most of the second half, and although I will give credit to both teams on defense (both teams play suffocating defense), the shooting was definitely not good on either side.  For most of the time I watched, Amherst offense consisted of mad drives into the lane and a hope of a foul.  They clearly have no post game without Giddens, and that is what hurt them against Tufts. Tufts will now have the number one seed (barring a major collapse at home against what I believe is a week Williams team, and even then they have the tie breaker).  As expected, Conn College, Bowdoin and Colby will play next weekend, with the third and fourth place seedings on the line.   Games are in Connecticut, so advantage to Conn College there.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on February 07, 2016, 08:12:08 AM
Sorry to lose home court advantage, but glad to get the home win streak monkey off their back.  I remember well the last minute shot by Bowdoin that was the last loss in LeFrak.  Agree about other comments on defense and shooting. 

If the team has Giddens back for tourney time, they can make a run, though I don't think any team (NESCAC or other league) is going to get by Thomas More and Sidney Moss.  They are just blowing out everyone they play.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 07, 2016, 11:23:08 AM
Nice coverage of the Amherst game by earlier posters.
Several comments to add.
It was a battle between the two best coaches in the CAC.  Boy it seemed to me the Tufts' HC really wanted this win.  The former UConn star player was coaching up a storm and getting after the refs.  So much so that some Amherst fans behind the Tufts' bench were making the "T" sign with there hands as a ref headed towards the Tufts coach.  The Tufts players were jumping up and down after the buzzer with happiness.
Agree that it was good in a way to have the pressure of the win streak off the Amherst players.
It is still the second longest streak in all of college BB...men and women! The record is 129.
I was not happy with Coach G when he called a time out to set up the Amherst approach in the last 32 plus seconds....not fouling the Tuft's guard bringing up the ball who shoots less than 50 percent from the line.  Agreed with Coach G to call the time out with 3.1 seconds to go and having the senior captain take the last shot. 
Not sure if senior Giddens would have made a difference in the game...even though she is the second highest scorer and plays well underneath this second.  She does run the floor well and Amherst runs the floor better than Tufts...beating the slower Tufts front court players. 
It is hard that Amherst has lost two front court players so late in the season.
Wondering if Ali Doswell was not at full strength.  Came off the bench and was reluctant to take an outside shot.
Still feel that Amherst can win the CAC title and get to host a regional game at home.  Tufts is a hard place to win a game....as is LeFrak. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 08, 2016, 07:21:19 AM
Williams win over Conn College sets up a potential three-way tie for the number 4 spot, if Conn College ends up at 6-4 and splits its games with Colby and Bowdoin (beating Colby, losing to Bowdoin), and assuming Colby beats Wesleyan, and Williams can split against Bates and Tufts.  Based on how teams are playing, none of that is a given.  Bates has been improving, and Williams has not played well on the road. Conn College is tough at home, and could sweep the Maine teams, although Bowdoin is playing very well.
I think Williams guard (Fernandez) might be the best player in the league. Watched a part of yesterday's game and she single handily brought Williams back from a 10 point deficit.  Deadly three point shooter and great driving to the basket. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 10, 2016, 02:32:59 PM
Alright, folks -- the NCAA's first women's basketball regional rankings are posted. Check out the full list from D3hoops.com:
http://www.d3blogs.com/d3hoops/2016/02/10/first-2016-regional-rankings-released-today/
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 11, 2016, 11:54:02 AM
Lots of respect to the Nescac in the First rankings.  Next rankings next week and the final rankings are not published if the process follows the men's procedure.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 11, 2016, 02:12:37 PM
Quote from: amh63 on February 11, 2016, 11:54:02 AM
Lots of respect to the Nescac in the First rankings.  Next rankings next week and the final rankings are not published if the process follows the men's procedure.

The process is the same across the board for all sports and all genders. We actually get three public rankings. This week, next week, and the one following. The fourth set of rankings are held private (men want to change that, women want to keep them hidden) and are used to select at-large teams and bracket.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 11, 2016, 03:37:41 PM
only comment as it relates to Northeast is that I think Williams is ranked too-high, particularly compared to Conn College, who played Williams pretty evenly at Williams on a Sunday afternoon. This weekend's games will have a significant impact on the overall rankings in the Northeast.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 12, 2016, 10:59:26 AM
Are you basing that opinion on your own eye test or using the NCAA criteria?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 12, 2016, 07:18:14 PM
that opinion is based on what I have seen this season, including some of Williams' losses, their game with Conn College which was essentially an even game. Not on the NCAA criteria
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 12, 2016, 09:52:21 PM
The top three held form tonight.  Amherst was obviously not happy with its loss last week, and absolutely trounced a weak Middlebury team.  Tufts shut down Williams.  and Bowdoin doubled Wesleyan. Conn College won a close game over Colby, setting up tomorrow's game with Bowdoin.  A Conn College win will give Conn College the third seed, with Bowdoin getting the fourth seed.  I think Bowdoin is the better team, but the game is being played at Conn College. As I posted earlier in the week, a three-way tie for the fourth seed is highly possible, as Colby should beat Wesleyan, and Williams should be Bates.  Assuming Bowdoin beats Conn College, you have a three-way tie for fourth, and it may come to a coin flip.  However, it would not surprise me at all if Bates were to upset Williams.  Bates seems to be improving, and they are tough to beat at Home.  Williams doesn't play a lot of people, and the Bates game is a sauna.  A two-way tie for the fourth spot goes to Conn College based on tonight's head-to-head win.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 13, 2016, 06:13:11 PM
Bates -Williams tomorrow afternoon will decide the fourth and final home seed in the playoffs. A Williams win and it is left to a coin-toss, which could have teams finishing anywhere from fourth to sixth depending on who wins the toss.  NESCAC should really look at the tie-breaker to come up with something that will actually break a tie, instead of a coin toss. Of the three teams that are tied-Colby, Conn College, and Williams, I think Colby is the best team, although they seem to play to the level of the competition and have a number of bad losses.  Home court is going to be a big factor in the four versus five game.  I also think the top three (Bowdoin/Amherst/Tufts) are markedly better than the rest of the league.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 17, 2016, 06:58:04 AM
This board has been pretty quiet this season (not sure where all the Amherst fans are). I would expect the first round of the playoffs to generally follow form. I don't see Tufts having any trouble with Middlebury, and the same for Amherst with Bates.  Although Bates is a much better team now then they were early in the season, they really don't have enough to give Amherst a game.  If Fernandez is on, Williams could give Bowdoin a fight, but Bowdoin has been playing so well lately that I can't see an upset here.  The 4-5 game between Conn College and Colby will be tight.  Colby may actually be a slightly better team, not withstanding the records.  However, if Conn College runs Colby off the three point line and strongly contests all threes, then they should hold on with the home court.  Colby is best if you let them drive and then dish to the open three shooters. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 17, 2016, 09:54:15 AM
Maine1.......you have been doing a super job.  Guess I have given my attention elsewhere....on the men's side recently where the seeding of the CAC Tourny was getting a little complicated, etc.
See you have reached the 200 posting level.  You can now smite and applaud posters.  Someone gave you a smite. Plus K for " keeping the store open" here with fine posts.  I have a policy to let a poster know when I smite....but that is not the norm unfortunately.

Back tO BB.   I made the trip up to Amherst to watch the home team and the seniors last regular season games.  I miss watching the WBB games as they are on at the same time as the men.  Whoever made the changes  should be taken to the woods shed!
Your assessment of the first round of the tournament is right on.  Will try to put my two bits in when I can...it is hard when you do not see the games.  Heading South  and will miss live games.  Hope to catch some live games in the post season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 18, 2016, 04:55:01 PM
There isn't that much time left in the regular season as teams continue to fight to get into conference tournaments and position themselves for hopefully NCAA tournament bids. Second round of Regional Rankings are also out with plenty of answers... and questions. Plus, some teams are putting on some shows recently including a lot of buzzer beaters!

On Thursday night's Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com), Dave McHugh rolls up his sleeves and takes a look at what is happening as we head into the last ten days of the regular season. McHugh will also get some insight on Wednesday's insane men's basketball game between Lynchburg and No. 21 Roanoke. Plus, get a preview of the NESCAC men's and women's tournaments along with talking to ranked teams on both the men's and women's side.

Hoopsville hits the air at 7:00 pm ET and promises to go at least 2 1/2 hours. You can watch the show here: http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2015-16/feb18

Guests scheduled (in order of appearance):
- Alex Graves, Lynchburg senior forward
- Howard Herman, Berkshire Eagle, NESCAC tournaments preview
- Brian Morehouse, No. 3 Hope women's coach
- Bill Broderick, No. 16 Christopher Newport women's coach
- Tom Curle, No. 23 Plattsburgh State men's coach
- Eric Bridgeland, No. 9 Whitman men's coach

You can also tune into the podcast(s) after the show has aired:
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville
iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/hoopsville/id1059517087

Don't forget you can always interact with us:
Website: www.d3hoopsville.com
Twitter: @d3hoopsville (http://www.twitter.com/d3hoopsville) or #Hoopsville
Facebook: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville
Email: hoopsville@d3hoops.com
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/d3hoopsville

And a reminder the Hoopsville Fundraising Project is halfway to the deadline but we are not that close to the goal. Please consider helping us cover Division III basketball the way it deserves to be covered: http://igg.me/at/hoopsville-fundraiser/x/6029509.

Thanks!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 20, 2016, 07:45:02 PM
No surprises for the top three teams.  It appears that Amherst is playing with spectacular defensive intensity, holding Bates to under 20% shooting. Tufts also pulled away with a monster third quarter.  Bowdoin eventually pulled away from Williams.  Colby had a nice win over Conn College-two reasons for that.  First, as I mentioned earlier in the week, you cannot let Colby get set and shoot threes.  And Conn College did just that.  Colby was 11-19 from three, scoring almost half their points from there.  The other factor was Conn College''s leading scorer went out with an injury after just  2 minutes, and that definitely hurt Conn College--but if they had played better defense they may have had a chance.
As for next week, I think the Amherst-Bowdoin game will be very interesting.  I give Amherst the edge, although Bowdoin can definitely play with them.  Tufts should handle Colby.  Tufts defense will smother the three point shooters  and make Colby beat them going to the basket.  Colby can't match up with North inside.
I would think that as far as NCAA bids go--I would expect the top three NESCAC teams to get in.  I would not expect a fourth team,  unless the committee reaches for Conn College.  The only way Colby gets in, with their 10 losses, would be to win the tournament and the automatic bid.

Should be a good weekend at Tufts next week, particularly if we end up with another Amherst-Tufts battle.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 21, 2016, 10:25:36 AM
Got to watch the Amherst double header in LeFrak yesterday.  Like the Good old days!
After the first quarter, I was a little surprised at the Bates team.  9 points in the quarter....in the first half, one of the Doswell sisters may have out scored the entire Bates team.  Bates was playing solid ball recently leading up to the game.  Started to watch the Bates HC reactions to the buzz saw  play of Amherst on her young players.  Did like the Bates players support of their of their teammates on the floor after the half....standing up and cheering.  Coach G put in his FY guards and played often with two PGs on the floor.  At the end of the game, a FY was at PG and Amherst was slowing the game down...no more points needed.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: magicman on February 23, 2016, 03:02:25 AM
The Bowdoin women make it back into the Top 25 edging out St. John Fisher by 2 points for the last spot in the  poll...#25. Bowdoin had 35 points Fisher had 33. It marks the 3rd time the team has been back in the Top 25. They dropped out after the preseason poll, re-entered in week 2 and  and dropped out again in week 5.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 27, 2016, 04:00:41 PM
dominating defensive performance by Tufts in its win over Colby, particularly in the first half when Tufts held Colby to 13 points. The game was over at half-time.  Tufts did as expected, and did not let Colby shoot the uncontested 3.  Colby was 3-17 from the arc. Baptista has to be the NESCAC defensive player of the year.  She absolutely shot down Wolfington, contesting every open look, playing close outside, and then staying with her and blocking shots on the drive.  She is long, quick , and athletic.   The second half of this game was essentially a scrimmage, as Tufts substituted freely. Tufts is still challenged on offense, and although I expect that if Tufts wins tomorrow, North will be the NESCAC player of the year, she is definitely not the best player in the league.  If she had above average offensive skills and inside moves, she would score much more. I thought Colby should have tried to get the ball to Driscoll inside more, as she was the only effective player on offense in the first half.

A good season for Colby, but they have to develop an offense that is not so dependent on threes.  They lose three top seniors, and they did not play a lot of people, so next year will be an interesting year for them


Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 27, 2016, 06:51:34 PM
Missed the games...was on the road.  It will be a Tufts Amherst final....as expected.  Hope Amherst wins over the host team...as Tufts did in LeFrak.  Looked at the stats for both games.  Seems the key starters for Tufts played no more than 26 minutes.  Amherst had two starters in for 40 minutes. Needed both for their RBs and points.
Hope the fatigue factor does not impact game...fingers crossed here.
Should be a good game.  winner should get to choose where to play next in the post season!
Nice write-up Maine.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: just a fan 22 on February 27, 2016, 07:09:54 PM
Caught the Amherst/Bowdoin game on the webcast, which was actually very well done.

The game was a very good one, and was as close as 5pts inside the last three and a half minutes. Amherst got a good bounce, the officials missed a clear walk, and someone hit a 3 and they did not look back. Bowdoin was very tough, but had a hard time handling the length of Amherst's front court. For a team without any post players, Amherst sure gets a lot of blocks from their bigger players.

Tufts can match that length, and also can score inside with North and Baptista. I think Baptista is the X-factor tomorrow. If she plays well, nobody in the NESCAC can guard her. Should be a great game tomorrow. I'd give Tufts a small edge because of the home-court advantage, as well as being completely fresh.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 27, 2016, 07:19:47 PM
I saw the first half of the Bowdoin-Amherst game. The first half was pretty even.  Based on looking at the play-by-play, it appears that Bowdoin really had a hard time scoring in the second half, and when Amherst did score, it was on threes.
You clearly have the two best teams in the conference playing tomorrow.  I believe that Amherst first six are better across the board then Tufts.  But both teams play such great defense, that both teams will struggle to score.  However, overall I think Amherst has more offensive power in Dowsell, Hackley, Jenner and even Zwecker.  Nagle has the size to neutralize North. North is not a strong offensive player when she is matched against someone here size.  It will definitely be a close contest.  Two terrific Coaches that stress defense at all costs.  It won't be pretty, but it should be a tight competitive game.  Both teams will likely end up hosting first round NCAA games.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: just a fan 22 on February 28, 2016, 11:18:06 AM
Good points, but I'm not sure I agree with giving Amherst the edge. Amherst shoots a ton of threes. It's not the only way they score, but with the lineups they've been putting out there lately, it is a huge part of their offense. Tufts can chase the shooters off the 3pt line and has shot blockers behind them to deal with any dribble penetration.

I agree that both teams will struggle to score. First to 55 will win it, I think.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 28, 2016, 02:58:57 PM
Well, no one got to 55.  A very gutty performance by Amherst.  Playing with no big (Nagle got hurt before the game) and with Hackley getting three fouls in the first quarter (the third a really unintelligent reach in when you have two fouls). Somehow Amherst won the game shooting 1-15 from three (but it was a big three).  Zwecker played a huge game off the bench, as Amherst went with three players going 40 minutes. They held there own on the boards, and Ali Doswell was able to draw fouls and convert at the line.  North had a big game going against no real center.  The key here was Baptista fouling out.  My point in the earlier post was that I feel that Amherst just has more good basketball players than Tufts, and I think this game showed it.
Great game, congratulations to both teams, and hopefully the NCAA will put them on opposite sides of the bracket so that if they play again, it is in the final four.
One comment on the referees.  I thought they were terrible and called too many touch calls early, got both teams into foul trouble.  Compared to yesterday, when at least the period that I saw I thought both games were officiated well, with the referees letting the teams play.  At this level, at this time of the year. the referees really have to keep the whistle in check.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 29, 2016, 03:04:02 PM
Amherst, Bowdoin and Tufts in the NCAA post season.  Bowdoin to host, but Amherst moved to Rowan pod since the men's exam is hosting.  Same scenario for Tufts.
Tufts and Amherst will not meet again until the Final Four.  Bowdoin and Amherst can meet again before the final 4.
This sYear, the men's team has priority.  Do not know what happens in the sectionals.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on February 29, 2016, 03:14:05 PM
Quote from: amh63 on February 29, 2016, 03:04:02 PM
Amherst, Bowdoin and Tufts in the NCAA post season.  Bowdoin to host, but Amherst moved to Rowan pod since the men's exam is hosting.  Same scenario for Tufts.
Tufts and Amherst will not meet again until the Final Four.  Bowdoin and Amherst can meet again before the final 4.
This sYear, the men's team has priority. Do not know what happens in the sectionals.

Women have priority in the sectional.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on February 29, 2016, 04:26:01 PM
Really agree about the touch fouls yesterday in Amherst/Tufts game.  What was up with the Amherst Athletic Website?  Had to go to D3Hoops to get link to the game.  That game certainly could have gone either way, but good for Amherst with so many on the bench.  Hope they can get a body or two back for the tourney.  GP usually plays a 7/8 man rotation when it gets to tourney time, but I think he'd like more than 6.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: just a fan 22 on February 29, 2016, 04:30:57 PM
Have to agree about the officiating. It was terrible. Inconsistent from half to half, too many touch fouls early on that kept stopping the game over and over again, and kept players from both teams on the bench. Not what you want to see when you have two of the top ten teams in the country playing each other in a conference championship game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 01, 2016, 07:06:55 AM
Some thoughts on end of year awards

Defensive player of the year Baptista from Tufts

All league-
Ali Doswell-Amherst
Michaela North-Tufts
Brady-Bowdoin
Wolfington-Colby
Hynes-Conn College (although I could also go with Baptista here

Player of the Year--this one is a toss up as I dont' believe one player stood out above the others--I would expect Doswell to get picked based on being the best player on the league champion

Coach of the Year--another tough one, but I would go with the Conn College Coach
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 04, 2016, 06:01:13 PM
Nice tourney start for Amherst...am I allowed to say Jeffs any longer?...Still seem to be playing with a very short bench.  Some of the first year did get some minutes at the end.  If anyone gets in foul trouble, may need them. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 05, 2016, 08:37:19 AM
NE Jeffs Fan....freedom of speech!  Would not worry about using Jeffs...the alums can sing the song after every Amherst football TD.  I and others are not changing our kids names :).
Yes there is a short bench.  Hope Amherst keeps winning, as a player or two may recover.  There is a 12 day delay this year in the Finals because of the game being combined with the Div 1 and 2 finals.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 05, 2016, 09:11:06 PM
All three Nescac teams won handily tonight.  Bowdoin at home over NYU, Amherst at Rowan over the host team and Tufts at Stockton?.  Forgot the opponent...was watching the Amherst men's game.  Will get back here. 
Tufts wins over Moravian
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 05, 2016, 09:23:07 PM
I can't see a scenario that Amherst doesn't get to host the next round.  Let's keep our fingers crossed that LeFrak is in the ladies future.  Nice game tonight.  Ali Doswell was hot and helped the team get off to a fast start.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 06, 2016, 12:05:18 AM
Amherst will most likely host, though Rochester could be a factor. Tufts will not host as CNU is over 600 miles from campus meaning a flight... that one is most likely headed to Scranton.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 08, 2016, 11:59:51 AM
Think the first shot across the bow against Amherst made by Stevens.  On the Stevens website today, there is a brief write up of the team going to the Sweet 16.  The SID must be out of it as the story goes on to refer to the UMass- Amherst school!  And Rowan.
Thought Hoopsville interviewed the Stevens coach?
Went back to the website to check if it was a misread.  Nope!  The schedule does show the Amherst College logo and the game starting at 7pm.
Went to check the roster...more confusion!  Really.  Picture of the team shows more players than listed on the roster.
Hope things get straighten out soon...maybe by Thurs....on Hoopsville :). One can hope .
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 09, 2016, 10:19:15 AM
Nice feature article on the Bowdoin WBB team on the D3hoops front page.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 10, 2016, 06:29:39 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 08, 2016, 11:59:51 AM
Think the first shot across the bow against Amherst made by Stevens.  On the Stevens website today, there is a brief write up of the team going to the Sweet 16.  The SID must be out of it as the story goes on to refer to the UMass- Amherst school!  And Rowan.
Thought Hoopsville interviewed the Stevens coach?
Went back to the website to check if it was a misread.  Nope!  The schedule does show the Amherst College logo and the game starting at 7pm.
Went to check the roster...more confusion!  Really.  Picture of the team shows more players than listed on the roster.
Hope things get straighten out soon...maybe by Thurs....on Hoopsville :). One can hope .

I have no idea what you are referring to... we did interview Stevens coach on the show Sunday night. As for the roster and the picture... the picture is taken at the beginning of the season before a game is played, so a lot can change... furthermore, the roster for the NCAA tournament is cut down to 15 no matter what.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 11, 2016, 08:42:04 PM
Good night for the NESCAC with two teams in the final eight. Overall, there does not appear to be a lot of depth in the D3 ranks given the lopsided scores tonight.  Rochester looks like a good team and may challenge Amherst, but Amherst is playing well now, and even short handed may get to the final four.  Tufts will have a very tough game against an excellent Scranton team tomorrow night.  I watched a bit of the Scranton game and they are vey good all around.  I believe they will beat Tufts.  The Scranton fans will fill the Long Center (Scranton is my home town and in my early years I watched some great U of S men's teams).  An Amherst-Scranton final would be a good match up.
Although the idea of having the DI, II, and III finals at the same time sounds good, the fact that the final four teams will need to take a road trip for one game next weekend and then wait two weeks to take another trip for the finals doesn't seem to be a great idea.  Tough on the teams and the families.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 11, 2016, 11:15:30 PM
QuoteI have no idea what you are referring to... we did interview Stevens coach on the show Sunday night. As for the roster and the picture... the picture is taken at the beginning of the season before a game is played, so a lot can change... furthermore, the roster for the NCAA tournament is cut down to 15 no matter what.

He was referring to Stevens' website, not Hoopsville. I think they had some errant information posted earlier this week.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 12, 2016, 02:14:59 AM
Here's a treat for you night owls. We had a short, fun interview with Tufts senior Maura Foliard following the Jumbos' win over Albright in the women's Sweet 16. She talks about her changing role on the team, her basketball family and her "bowling" skills.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mcj1XemUX38&feature=youtu.be
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 12, 2016, 10:05:14 AM
Maine1...nice post!  I watched the Amherst game and was glad to see one of the Amherst's "big" front court player dressed.  Glad to see she was not needed in the game.  Stevens can put a tall team on the floor, but they are not as athletic as Amherst.  Even when Amherst played with three shorter guards, the lead grew....to quick for the Stevens players.  Nice to see Amherst getting more points inside.
Gordonmann...thanks for pointing out to your co- worker that I was referring to the Stevens' website.
WRT the roster remark....Stevens roster size was never over 15...just confusing.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 12, 2016, 07:23:10 PM
Congratulations to Tufts on a great win at Scranton, against an undefeated Scranton team.  Baptista was outstanding.  She will be the dominant player in the NESCAC next year.  She has a great offensive game, and she is one of the best defensive players I have seen in a long time.  She totally dominated this game against a very good Scranton team. 
Amherst will also be in the final Four--Great to see two NESCAC teams in the final four.  The NESCAC is clearly the dominant Conference in the East for DIii,
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 12, 2016, 07:26:48 PM
Also, regarding Amherst.  Gromacki has a team in the final four, playing basically five or six players, losing one of his best players in Giden, and losing her backup and they are playing as well now as they have all season.  Both Tufts and Amherst are examples of the difference Coaching makes at this level.  Both Berube and Gromacki are great coaches. Give them one or two really good players, and they will take the rest of the pieces and win.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 13, 2016, 01:13:57 AM
Here's Tufts' post game press conference now embedded in our recap.

http://www.d3hoops.com/playoffs/women/2016/elite-eight-wrap

Driving home, I was thinking about Michela North's defense on Alexis Roman in the post. That plus Baptista's Steph Curry-like performance were the difference. Michela said that Coach Berube told her to play off Roman's shoulder in a way where it would make it especially hard for Scranton to get Roman the ball and make her favorite move to the hoop. Michela did that so well that it effectively shut down Scranton's entire offense for long stretches.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 13, 2016, 01:46:09 AM
Quote from: gordonmann on March 13, 2016, 01:13:57 AM
Here's Tufts' post game press conference now embedded in our recap.

http://www.d3hoops.com/playoffs/women/2016/elite-eight-wrap

Driving home, I was thinking about Michela North's defense on Alexis Roman in the post. That plus Baptista's Steph Curry-like performance were the difference. Michela said that Coach Berube told her to play off Roman's shoulder in a way where it would make it especially hard for Scranton to get Roman the ball and make her favorite move to the hoop. Michela did that so well that it effectively shut down Scranton's entire offense for long stretches.

Coach Berube was so gracious in the pressie that I thought Scranton had won the game. :) Best wishes in the semis.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: redrhino on March 13, 2016, 04:16:13 PM
As a Scranton fan, I just wanted to congratulate Tufts on an outstanding performance. To come into the raucous confines of the Long Center and perform the way the Jumbos did was truly special. It was a privilege to watch two quality teams employ every ounce of their energy as they battled each other.

In my humble opinion, Micheala North may have earned All-American simply because of the tremendous first-half defense she played against Alexix Roman. IMPRESSIVE!  Alexix still did some damage, but she was held down way below her normal output. Indeed what a great overall defensive team Tufts is!  They cut off passing lanes; pressured the ball with mind-boggling intensity; and held the Lady Royals to 48 points on their home court. Most teams only dream about doing something like that.

I wish the Jumbos luck as they try to finally push all the way through the Final Four this time.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 15, 2016, 11:12:51 PM
Here's our latest Road to Indianapolis feature, this time on Amherst.

http://www.d3hoops.com/playoffs/women/2016/amherst-doswell-twins

We'll have something for Tufts later in the week.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 16, 2016, 10:59:15 AM
Nice piece on the Doswell twin players!  Some other bits of info.  Going down on 95 heading to Richmond, near exit 98...an Amusement park  near by, there is a town named Doswell.  Spoke to a Richmond resident...classmate and frat brother.. wrt to the name.   He remarked that it was a prominent name and the twins' private school was near his sons' private schools.  Have chatted with the twins mother at a game.  In addition to being a former "Seven Sister" graduate, she has a MIT post graduate degree.  Believe she has New England roots.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 18, 2016, 12:48:38 AM
As promised, here's the Tufts feature.

http://www.d3hoops.com/playoffs/women/2016/tufts-third-time-the-charm

For those of you making the trip to Columbus, see you there.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 20, 2016, 09:20:47 AM
Just wanted to give a "shout out" to the team....Well Done!   Gave a scare to the No. 1 team.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 20, 2016, 09:26:00 AM
Look like they played their hearts out, but had no answer for Sidney Moss....just like every other team that TMC has played.  Amherst bringing back some good talent.  Will be excited to see who Gromacki is adding to the team.  Hopefully will get them back to the Final 4 next year.  Good luck to Tufts.  I know they'll represent the NESCAC well!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 20, 2016, 10:20:48 AM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on March 20, 2016, 09:26:00 AM
Look like they played their hearts out, but had no answer for Sidney Moss....just like every other team that TMC has played.  Amherst bringing back some good talent.  Will be excited to see who Gromacki is adding to the team.  Hopefully will get them back to the Final 4 next year.  Good luck to Tufts.  I know they'll represent the NESCAC well!!!

2 good wing/forwards, 1 of whom is lower-D1 capable; Amherst should be back to this level next year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 20, 2016, 04:21:33 PM
In addition to Moss, who was unstoppable, Thomas Moore has some other good players and also has depth.  The Amherst team gave it all they had, but you have to wonder why over the past two-three seasons, Amherst has not developed any bench strength. It is great to have three or four good starting players, but you have to be able to go 7-8 deep in order to compete. The past few seasons, Amherst has had no depth.  I understand that they lost Gidons and Nagle, but are the other players that bad that they couldn't play 4 or 5 minutes to give the starters a rest.  Also, Zwecker looks like she may have been a top player on any other NESCAC team, but only got in because of injuries.  I think Gromacki is a great Coach, as evidence by his record, but certainly needs to build a better bench for next season.
I think Tufts is a great defensive team, and Baptista is a superb defender, but Moss plays a different game then most of the D3 women, with her tought inside play and range--I believe Tufts will make it difficult for her to score, but I don't think Tufts has enough offense to win the game.  They do have more than two weeks to come up with a plan.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 20, 2016, 04:31:13 PM
Yeah, I've often been struck by Amherst's very short rotation, too. This year I think it was a combination of injuries to Giddins and Nagle and the fact that everyone shrinks their rotation during the tournament, especially now that there are designed breaks every five minutes plus halftime plus whatever timeouts people call. The Amherst ladies didn't seem gassed last night despite logging a lot of minutes.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 21, 2016, 10:52:47 AM
The Amherst Website has the post game interview.  Coach G gives a determined response to interviewer's comment about the close loss.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 22, 2016, 12:10:44 AM
If Tufts can score 60 points I think they'll pull off the shocker just because their defense is that good.  However, I don't see how they can score 60 points.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 22, 2016, 11:10:56 AM
Several comments on remarks  of posters.
First, the question of depth....development, etc.  The late lost of Sr. Giddens and later Nagle was unfortunate... but is part of the game of basketball.  Amherst in past seasons lost starters such as Meg Robertson at critical times.  This year, a front court player return was slow...the left hand shooter from East Lyme.  Nagle's improved play was needed but lost in the post season due to an injury.  There was a FY front court player that got time on the floor early in the season and then was lost to injury around mid season....the player from nearby Granby, Ma.  She will add depth next season.  Amherst has two FY guards that has shown promise....on both offense and defense and with be ready to support the starters.  I have heard from another poster that Amherst is bringing in several fine front court players....ones that he had interest in for his school.
Second, the question of players conditioning....short bench.  Agreed with Gordonmann that the extra breaks in the game helps.  The announcers mentioned that Amherst's missed shots may have been due in part to tired legs.  That maybe true, but it was primarily the offense of Moss that was the prime factor, imo. 
In fact, I noticed that Player of the Year Moss seemed to be gasping more in the shots of her during the time outs.  I noticed that she was not very intense on defense...perimeter..in the second half.  In the end, looking at the stats, the RBs difference was the key one for me....the others were awash between the two teams. 
Aside, it was the rebounding difference in the Amherst MBB lost to undefeated Benedictine that was cited as a the key one...by posters.

With respect to the upcoming finals, Tufts defense will carry the Jumbos and I feel that Tufts have the personnel to slow Moss down.  I also agree with 7Express that Tufts will need to generate some offense somewhere other than from North to win....otherwise the opponent will pack the inside..."shrink its interior defense"....a term I picked up recently from watching UCONN WBB :). 

Finally...Go Jumbos!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: P'bearfan on March 22, 2016, 02:16:04 PM
Belated congratulations to the Lady Polar Bears for a great season. 22-7 overall and advancing to the 3rd round of the tournament.  You did yourselves proud!

GoUBears!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 22, 2016, 07:36:06 PM
Moss is not speedy on defense, but North will have a lot to handle.  Both teams used short benches...happens in tournament time.  Certainly was how GP played things in the 2011 championship year.  Can't really remember, but think many starters played 40 minutes and only went 2 to 3 deep off the bench. Congrats to Amherst on a great year.  With the talent coming back and what's coming up, I think they can make it back to the Final Four. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 22, 2016, 10:32:32 PM
What a season of Division III basketball and it isn't quite over with yet! The men might have crowned their championship, but the women have one more game to go.

On this episode of Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com), Dave McHugh looks back at the two championship weekends with help from Ryan Scott, Gordon Mann, and Adam Turer. We look at the championship for St. Thomas and the near perfect miss by Benedictine. We also take a look at the two semifinal games in women's basketball and the upcoming championship between St. Thomas and Tufts to be played in Indianapolis.

Dave also talks to Page Moir, head coach for Roanoke, who suddenly announced on Tuesday he is stepping down from the position and looking for something new to challenge him.

You can watch the show in its entirety or listen to the podcast above.

Guests include (in order of appearance):
- Page Moir, Roanoke men's coach
- Keith Bunkenburg, No. 2 Benedictine men's coach
- Steve Fritz, St. Thomas athletics director and former men's coach
- John Tauer, No 1. St. Thomas men's coach
- Ryan Scott, D3hoops.com Mid-Atlantic reporter
- Gordon Mann and Adam Turer, women's semifinals report
- Jeff Hans, No. 1 Thomas More women's coach
- Carla Berube, No. 7 Tufts women's coach

You can also tune into the podcast(s) after the show has aired:
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville
iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/hoopsville/id1059517087

Don't forget you can always interact with us:
Website: www.d3hoopsville.com
Twitter: @d3hoopsville (http://www.twitter.com/d3hoopsville) or #Hoopsville
Facebook: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville
Email: hoopsville@d3hoops.com
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/d3hoopsville
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 23, 2016, 02:26:07 PM
The D3hoops.com all-American selections are out.  As always, but Not surprised that the Nescac players are not given much respect with their team play and strong defense approach.  Offensive numbers too often carry the day, IMO. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 23, 2016, 02:57:27 PM
The NESCAC has three representatives, more than any other conference.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 27, 2016, 10:16:27 PM
We have a new article posted on Thomas More's women's team, which isn't really relevant to this room. But I wanted to publicly (sort of) acknowledge that UConn coach Geno Auriemma took time out of his schedule this week to talk to us about building a dynasty, which I really appreciate. He, Wash U. coach Nancy Fahey and Messiah soccer coach Scott Frey offered interesting insight on what it's like to play as the prohibitive favorites. And special shout out to our reporter, Adam Turer, who got great input from all of them.

Here's the link to the article:

http://www.d3hoops.com/playoffs/women/2016/tmc-one-step-away

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 28, 2016, 03:22:06 PM
Nice article.  Good luck to The Tufts Women on Monday.  They will represent the NESCAC well, hopefully give TMC all they can handle.  I'm sure it will be a special time for Coach Berube as UConn and Geno will be there also. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 29, 2016, 11:48:08 PM
amh63,
   Just came across(third-hand or worse) another of my prospects commit to Amherst; she's a 6-1 W. Makes 3 so far; GP may have been following me ::)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on April 02, 2016, 12:03:13 AM
Is it April 4th yet?

Here's one last pre-title game feature on Tufts:

http://www.d3hoops.com/playoffs/women/2016/tufts-defense-one-more-stop
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on April 02, 2016, 11:02:10 PM
Ronk:

I'm starting to think you're working for the enemy!  :-\
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on April 05, 2016, 09:03:37 AM
Tufts played hard and came back to tie the game late in the half.  In the end, their offense could not keep up.  They represented the Nescac well.  Well done Jumbos!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: bowdoin74 on April 05, 2016, 06:20:47 PM
Sadie Otley, Vermont Gatorade Player of the Year, to Tufts. 

http://www.burlingtonfreepress.com/story/sports/high-school/2016/03/31/free-press-miss-basketball-cvu-sadie-otley/82487610/
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on April 22, 2016, 03:06:56 AM
I know it's mostly Amherst, Bowdoin & Williams fans here, but watch out for Sami Ashton at Conn College the next couple of years.  One of the better scorers I saw in HS this year that could easily be playing at a low-tier D-1 MAAC, Am East or NEC school if she wanted to she was that year.  Brian Williams got a complete steal with her.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on July 26, 2016, 01:07:11 AM
  Just attended a major AAU tourney - the DC Junior Nationals in my avocation as unofficial scout for my alma mater(U of Scranton). Had a few exchanges with GP Gromacki, kidding him that he must have hacked my notes since he ended up with more(4) of my 2016 prospects than Scranton(1). He asked for my secret in finding them; I replied that I'd tell him if he told me how to close the deal after finding them. I imagine that the attractiveness of Amherst had a lot to do with the outcomes. We left it at that.
  Later, I came across a young lady wearing the shorts of Loomis-Chaffee where 2 of my 2016 prospects attended. I asked her of the decision of the more prominent prospect(6-4 post/forward) and was told Middlebury. Then asked about the 2nd prospect and found out, after not recognizing her immediatedly(it had been a year and I wasn't expecting to see a graduate at an underclassman event), that it was her and that she was going to Bowdoin.
   So that makes 4 from my list to Amherst, 2 to Middlebury, and 1 each to Bowdoin and Tufts from the NESCAC.
 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on July 26, 2016, 11:57:41 AM
As a Salisbury grad... I am not sure I can endorse any Loomis-Chaffee grads... just saying. LOL
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on July 27, 2016, 12:59:42 PM
ronk....glad you are having a nice Summer to date.  Amherst 's coach is an intense  person but is quite socialable when he gets to know you...knows where you are coming from, IMO.  Met him at the 2007 National Tourny in Salem and later at a social function there.  Bump into him when I am up at sporting events at Amherst...when he has family members around...even at football games.
The Nescac should be most interesting this season....two new WBB head coaches....one at Colby who played BB for GP at St. Lawrence.  His present top assistant also played for him at St. Lawrence.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on July 27, 2016, 01:26:48 PM
Yep, just came to post that story here.

Colby hires Drew head coach, former Amherst assistant (http://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/women/2015-16/contrib/20160726kxlyqo)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: kate on July 27, 2016, 06:31:56 PM
Sure hope that Drew is happy in their "new" league.  One of these days, we have to have a discussion on the merits of starting new leagues.  That would be different from switching leagues for financial, number & types of sports offered and distances having to be travelled. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on July 28, 2016, 02:56:09 PM
Quote from: kate on July 27, 2016, 06:31:56 PM
Sure hope that Drew is happy in their "new" league.  One of these days, we have to have a discussion on the merits of starting new leagues.  That would be different from switching leagues for financial, number & types of sports offered and distances having to be travelled.

kate - I realize you are still bitter about team splitting away from the MAC, but I have heard no ill thoughts about Drew going to the Landmark and their ten (upcoming) years there. They and others joined the Landmark for good reason in their minds and besides for Merchant Marine, have been quite satisfied with their decision - USMMA is completely different story which is internal rather than external.

Again... this year marks the tenth year of the conference... if it wasn't working, they wouldn't still be there.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on July 28, 2016, 04:21:05 PM
  gordonmann....surprised you did not comment on your alma mater's  hiring a new Head Coach..  My take is that with recent success with the men's team, your AD wanted a similar rise on the women's side.
Seems Trinity is making a major upgrade to its facilities. Now a new large parking garage would raise the fan base! :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on July 29, 2016, 11:54:40 AM
Ha ha.

Yeah, I was about to say that the Clucks hiring an assistant who coached under Stephanie Pemper (former Bowdoin coach) was a really good idea. Then I realized Trinity hired an assistant from Army and Pemper coaches at Navy.

Hopefully it's still a good idea. :)

If they are bulldozing the R-Oost (Ray Oosting Gym), I want a chance to buy a piece of the floor.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on July 29, 2016, 01:45:36 PM
Gordonmann, the major upgrades, new and planned to date are outside....The Coop.  The Roost just had a refurbish of its playing floor.  Amherst had to compete and refurbished  its floor in LeFrak :).
Like the info wrt the Roost.  Been to the Roost a number of times and it is the parking that proves fustrating.  Same thing at Tufts.  Oh those Urban schools :).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: kate on July 31, 2016, 08:04:49 PM
Hi Dave!  After all the hype to justify their existence, I think they'd all be embarrassed to say it's not working :)!  Bitter may not be the proper adjective to describe what I thought when Drew & Scranton left our Freedom under the "like-minded" scenario, perhaps pissed & perplexed describes my feelings.  Really just gives me more of a reason to root against them - it's sad that today's students don't understand how much I want to beat a Juniata :)!  Just an example.  Also, said it before, back in the day a Drew fan yelled at me saying that it was hardly the decision of the student athlete to leave.  I know, I should let it go, but I'd still like to dissect this at some point.  Thanks for responding!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on August 01, 2016, 04:15:00 PM
AMH:

Yeah, parking stinks at the Roost. They're kind of landlocked in that spot, unless they buy a bunch of property next door for an expansion -- something they did for their hockey arena which is pretty spiffy.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on August 04, 2016, 01:59:20 PM
Quote from: kate on July 31, 2016, 08:04:49 PM
Hi Dave!  After all the hype to justify their existence, I think they'd all be embarrassed to say it's not working :)!  Bitter may not be the proper adjective to describe what I thought when Drew & Scranton left our Freedom under the "like-minded" scenario, perhaps pissed & perplexed describes my feelings.  Really just gives me more of a reason to root against them - it's sad that today's students don't understand how much I want to beat a Juniata :)!  Just an example.  Also, said it before, back in the day a Drew fan yelled at me saying that it was hardly the decision of the student athlete to leave.  I know, I should let it go, but I'd still like to dissect this at some point.  Thanks for responding!

What do you base it on "not working?" The Landmark may be one of the more competitive women's basketball leagues in the country. Moravian, Elizabethtown (now a member), Scranton, and Catholic have routinely been in the national conversation since the formation of the Landmark... not sure how that means it is isn't working. If anything, Drew is in a more competitive conference now. MAC Freedom usually has a good team or two at the top... and not much else. Not as much depth. Commonwealth has shown years of extremely great competition and has had a team or two at the top of the conversation, but some of those teams wouldn't be in the conversation if the Landmark hadn't been formed.

I have been the first to criticize the Landmark especially in MBB when I am disappointed it isn't as good as I expected, but I do not in any way think it has not worked.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on October 26, 2016, 11:46:17 PM
Hot off the press, so to speak...

http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/women/2016-17/preseason

Tufts is the Presesason No. 1 followed by Amherst. Bowdoin is also in the Top 25.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on October 26, 2016, 11:57:07 PM
Quote from: gordonmann on October 26, 2016, 11:46:17 PM
Hot off the press, so to speak...

http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/women/2016-17/preseason

Tufts is the Presesason No. 1 followed by Amherst. Bowdoin is also in the Top 25.

I'd rank Scranton #2 and it's hard to believe that Thomas More would have the most 1st place votes and not be ranked higher than 4th. Scranton has a good chance to play #7 Rochester in their tipoff tourney.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on October 27, 2016, 12:07:45 AM
Yeah. The opinions were split on Thomas More. On the one hand, they are the defending national champions and haven't lost in years. On the other hand, they lost arguably the greatest player of all time in Division III women's hoops and several other seniors.

Otherwise there was generally consensus on the rest of the Top 5 -- Tufts, Amherst, Texas-Tyler (returns everyone) and Scranton in some order.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Canvas Hightops on November 02, 2016, 10:41:56 PM
Saw the Middlebury womens' first practice.  Some notable additions.  Taller, more athletic, better shooting team than last season.  Should translate to a few more wins.  One hopes.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on November 03, 2016, 02:43:13 AM
Quote from: Canvas Hightops on November 02, 2016, 10:41:56 PM
Saw the Middlebury womens' first practice.  Some notable additions.  Taller, more athletic, better shooting team than last season.  Should translate to a few more wins.  One hopes.

I agree this season's team should win more.  Last year's squad was very young with only 6-7 players in the rotation against the stronger opponents because of injuries to the only two key returning veterans.  They were very competitive in almost every game until they tired toward the end of the season.  I haven't seen them practice yet but I've heard good things about the FY players.  I'm a big fan of the men's team and wish the NESCAC scheduling gods, or is it clods, would get their heads out of their collective a**es and return to the old format where both teams played on the same night on the same court.  I think I was able to watch the women play only 5-6 times last season.  That team was fun to watch and this one will be better.  These young athletes deserve more fan support.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on November 03, 2016, 11:03:07 AM
Quote from: Vandy74 on November 03, 2016, 02:43:13 AM
Quote from: Canvas Hightops on November 02, 2016, 10:41:56 PM
Saw the Middlebury womens' first practice.  Some notable additions.  Taller, more athletic, better shooting team than last season.  Should translate to a few more wins.  One hopes.

I agree this season's team should win more.  Last year's squad was very young with only 6-7 players in the rotation against the stronger opponents because of injuries to the only two key returning veterans.  They were very competitive in almost every game until they tired toward the end of the season.  I haven't seen them practice yet but I've heard good things about the FY players.  I'm a big fan of the men's team and wish the NESCAC scheduling gods, or is it clods, would get their heads out of their collective a**es and return to the old format where both teams played on the same night on the same court.  I think I was able to watch the women play only 5-6 times last season.  That team was fun to watch and this one will be better.  These young athletes deserve more fan support.

Vanessa young(6-4) & Becky knox(5-11) are good players that I saw in aau.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on November 13, 2016, 04:41:33 PM
Believe it not, the 2016-17 basketball season is just days away. But the season can't start without Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) hitting the air!

Tune in tonight starting at 7pm as Dave talks to the two preseason numbers one teams, finds out how the offseason went for the two defending national championships, and touches bases with the men's and women's basketball committee chairs.

Guests include:
- Kevin Vande Streek, men's basketball committee chair and head coach for Calvin
- Bobbi Morgan, women's basketball committee chair and head coach for Haverford
- John Tauer, head coach for No. 10 St. Thomas men
- Dave Hixon, head coach for No. 1 Amherst men
- Jeff Hans, head coach for No. 4 Thomas More women
- Carla Berube, head coach for No. 1 Tufts women

You can watch the show here: http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2016-17/nov13

You can also tune into the podcast(s) after the show has aired:
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville
iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/hoopsville/id1059517087

Don't forget you can always interact with us:
Website: www.d3hoopsville.com
Twitter: @d3hoopsville (http://www.twitter.com/d3hoopsville) or #Hoopsville
Facebook: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville
Email: hoopsville@d3hoops.com
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/d3hoopsville
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jumpshot on November 20, 2016, 04:49:55 PM
Eph women fortunate to win one of two games this weekend after committing 56 turnovers and 35 fouls ....painful to watch.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on November 21, 2016, 03:50:25 PM
Quote from: ronk on November 03, 2016, 11:03:07 AM
Quote from: Vandy74 on November 03, 2016, 02:43:13 AM
Quote from: Canvas Hightops on November 02, 2016, 10:41:56 PM
Saw the Middlebury womens' first practice.  Some notable additions.  Taller, more athletic, better shooting team than last season.  Should translate to a few more wins.  One hopes.

I agree this season's team should win more.  Last year's squad was very young with only 6-7 players in the rotation against the stronger opponents because of injuries to the only two key returning veterans.  They were very competitive in almost every game until they tired toward the end of the season.  I haven't seen them practice yet but I've heard good things about the FY players.  I'm a big fan of the men's team and wish the NESCAC scheduling gods, or is it clods, would get their heads out of their collective a**es and return to the old format where both teams played on the same night on the same court.  I think I was able to watch the women play only 5-6 times last season.  That team was fun to watch and this one will be better.  These young athletes deserve more fan support.

Vanessa young(6-4) & Becky knox(5-11) are good players that I saw in aau.

A promising start to the season for the Panthers in winning the Rose City Tip-Off Classic at Drew this past weekend.  They won the opener over Wittenberg 62-53 and cruised to an easy 74-39 win against Shenandoah in the championship game.  I'm not familiar enough with the caliber of this out-of-region competition to make any bold predictions but this team is far more talented than any that Middlebury fans have seen in quite some time.  It's a young team with only 3 juniors and no seniors on the roster.  They have size with 4 six-footers and one more at 5'11".  They have depth finally after last season when at times HC KJ Krasco had as few as 6 players capable of competing against the stronger opponents on the schedule.  10 players participated in both games while Sabrina Weeks and Vanessa Young seem to be unavailable, I assume due to injuries.  Weeks has been a key performer in each of the last two seasons and didn't suit up for the tournament.   Since a sister-in-law retired from the ranks of MC coaching I've lost my source of insider info on such matters. :(  I share amh63's frustration with the asinine men/women's scheduling format.  For Middlebury basketball fans who love the game this team will be as entertaining to watch as the men's court quintet.  Attention to the NESCAC powers-that-be: Start using that collective space between your ears as something more than just a hat rack.  ::)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 21, 2016, 09:23:28 PM
Amherst had a bit of a hurdle with Babson on Sunday as they fell behind at the half by 7 points. Almost shut Babson down in the third quarter to take a lead. Biult a solid lead in the 4th for the win.  Defense seemed to be the difference as the outside shots would not fall for Amherst  PG Renner took the offense over in the second half with her outside 3- point shots...an unusual role for her.
It is to be noted that two 6 footers are presently injured...Jr Nagle from Vt. And FY lady from Syracuse.  Expect them to join the team soon.  One Soph guard did join the team for the second game on Sunday.  She is also a soccer player of note and the Amherst soccer team lost to the No 1 team on Sat. in the 3 round of the NCAA Tourney.
It was only the second game of the season for both schools.  Seems Coach G has added two new Asst. Coaches.  One is an Amherst native that played for UMass- Amherst.  The most recent  assistant is also a local resident.....the former LT from the three time CAC football title team, all 6'5",289 lbs.  He is noticed sitting on the bench. ;D
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on November 21, 2016, 10:33:45 PM
Quote from: amh63 on November 21, 2016, 09:23:28 PM
Amherst had a bit of a hurdle with Babson on Sunday as they fell behind at the half by 7 points. Almost shut Babson down in the third quarter to take a lead. Biult a solid lead in the 4th for the win.  Defense seemed to be the difference as the outside shots would not fall for Amherst  PG Renner took the offense over in the second half with her outside 3- point shots...an unusual role for her.
It is to be noted that two 6 footers are presently injured...Jr Nagle from Vt. And FY lady from Syracuse.  Expect them to join the team soon.  One Soph guard did join the team for the second game on Sunday.  She is also a soccer player of note and the Amherst soccer team lost to the No 1 team on Sat. in the 3 round of the NCAA Tourney.
It was only the second game of the season for both schools.  Seems Coach G has added two new Asst. Coaches.  One is an Amherst native that played for UMass- Amherst.  The most recent  assistant is also a local resident.....the former LT from the three time CAC football title team, all 6'5",289 lbs.  He is noticed sitting on the bench. ;D

  I tried to interest all 4 frosh in Scranton; I see them all making contributions this year; One(Eck) is already starting and another(Hannah Fox) is very good.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 22, 2016, 11:24:53 AM
Ronk...thanks for the info.  You are indeed an astute judge of talent :). There is another "new" player on the team from Ct.....Emma McCarthy, a soph that is getting playing time.  She was Ist team all- state in HS, near Milford.  Seems that she may have  transferred from Fairfield Un..  Do you know anything wrt her..I.e. AUU team?
Anyway, Amherst plays tonight in Middletown against Wesleyan...in the game that does not count in the conference.  Should be interesting how the players respond on their first road trip!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on November 22, 2016, 03:35:01 PM
Quote from: amh63 on November 22, 2016, 11:24:53 AM
Ronk...thanks for the info.  You are indeed an astute judge of talent :). There is another "new" player on the team from Ct.....Emma McCarthy, a soph that is getting playing time.  She was Ist team all- state in HS, near Milford.  Seems that she may have  transferred from Fairfield Un..  Do you know anything wrt her..I.e. AUU team?
Anyway, Amherst plays tonight in Middletown against Wesleyan...in the game that does not count in the conference.  Should be interesting how the players respond on their first road trip!

Don't know of Emma McCarthy, but looked her up on Fairfield's stats; she got in 8 games @ 2 min/g. Fairfield had another frosh that I really loved as a player and she only got 6.5 min/g last year so I wouldn't hold Emma's lack of playing time against her.
  Wesleyan has a soph(Tara Berger 6-1) that I thought was going to be a bigger factor last year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 22, 2016, 09:28:32 PM
Amherst wins over Wes in Middletown in basically a blowout.  It was Amherst by 25  at the half with Amherst  shooting 60 percentage from the field and Wes shooting about 15 percentage.  2nd half was basically a standof. Every player on the Amherst got in the game that was not injured.  It was basically the reserves playing the Cardinals in the last two quarters.
Looking over the men and women BB games, all the Nescac teams won over their opponents tonight.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on November 22, 2016, 10:55:48 PM
Things started very slowly for both teams in Pepin Gym tonight as Middlebury and Johnson State played a ragged 1st half with the Panthers taking an 18-12 lead into the locker room.  Obviously suffering from some first home game jitters the young Middlebury squad shot just 22% from the field and managed only 3-8 from the stripe.  The second half was completely different as the Panthers put up 27 3rd quarter points including a 13-0 opening run en route to a solid 62-34 victory.  Catherine Harrison pulled down 11 rebounds while Maya Davis and Alex Huffman each collected 10  as Middlebury totally dominated the boards 54-29.  Colleen Caveney lead all scorers with 15 points and Sarah Kaufman chipped in 9.  Dominique Carter-Stanley led Johnson State with 11 points while Kasey DeGreenia led the in-state rivals with 11 boards. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 24, 2016, 12:28:33 PM
Vandy....nice report!  See you arrived for the Women's game in Pepin.  Does the students sit on the side that face the bench?  Is Bucket's son "working" the game?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on November 24, 2016, 01:20:43 PM
Quote from: amh63 on November 24, 2016, 12:28:33 PM
Vandy....nice report!  See you arrived for the Women's game in Pepin.  Does the students sit on the side that face the bench?  Is Bucket's son "working" the game?

Amh63.....Yes the student section faces the bench side in Pepin.  There are 3-4 more opportunities to see the MC women play in person before the conference scheduling lunacy kicks in.  "6th Man" Little Bucket continues to work the men's games. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on December 06, 2016, 10:44:26 PM
Middlebury kept things under control in Pepin tonight following an 18-5 run in the second quarter tonight as they beat Colby-Sawyer 65-44.  Colleen Caveney led all scorers with 18 and teammate Betsy Knox added 17 along with 8 rebounds.  Rachel Collins came off the bench to score 10 while floor general Alex Huffman dished out 6 assists, stole the ball three times and collected 6 boards.  The visitors probably wished KJ Krasco ('05) was still playing for them instead of coaching against them.  Colby-Sawyer was led by Tianna Sugars 13 point, seven rebound effort.  The 4-1 Panthers play host to Clarkson tomorrow night and Skidmore on Saturday.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on December 10, 2016, 08:39:00 AM
Welcome back to another NESCAC season.   Based on the pre-season, it looks like there won't be much change at the top of the NESCAC.  Amherst, Tufts and Bowdoin all seem to be starting off strong.  Bowdoin is clearly the class of the Maine NESCAC schools, and it appears that Bates is continuing to struggle to compete.  Colby is playing a lot of different combinations under a new Coach, so they may take a few years to get things going again.  It looks like Conn College continues to improve, as does Middlebury and Trinity.  We will learn much more starting in January when the teams start to play each other.  As always, looking forward to some exciting games.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 14, 2016, 02:04:44 PM
Thought I best post the Amherst win last night over Bridgewater State before the Holiday break.
The Lady Jeffs...my personal label whatever happens in the Amherst Mascot Selection business....see MBB board for possible choices...started slow over a smaller...in height...but game opponent.  Several interesting views in the 25 point win that was never in doubt.  First, the players were all wearing new sneakers in a grey color..brushed suede?...with the Under Armour logo.  Why?  Amherst has just recently signed a 5 -year deal with Under Armour to supply all sports with their products.  Thought the new footwear may have slowed the ladies a bit during the breaking in period.  Old purple color away suits worn last night. 
Second, it was the first time that two Amherst "bigs" was on the floor this season due to injuries.  Both are six footers.  Jr Nagle from VT moved well and scored underneath...wrist injuries.  Important in that she has experience and size to the counter the Tuft's front court.  The other player is a FY from Syracruse NY.  She moves well and played tight defense even at the perimeter and appears to be comfortable playing both outside and inside....another six footer with size.  Young Amherst players got minutes last night.  The announcers would mention often the experience gained playing both Tufts and Amherst would help.  They mentioned that Tufts was helded to 51 points, though Bridgewater did not break 40 points.  Bridgewater did break 40 points in the Amherst game...46 pts, though Amherst scored 71 with the entire team getting on the floor.
Amherst has two games after the hiolidays in California.  Maybe the team will be sporting new UA uniforms then.
It must be noted that at Homecoming I chatted with two UA agents as they were at
Amherst carrying samples, etc.  Their products are in commercial stores in town now.  Was wondering when the Amherst teams will be wearing new gear. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on December 14, 2016, 05:54:25 PM
Quote from: amh63 on December 14, 2016, 02:04:44 PM
Thought I best post the Amherst win last night over Bridgewater State before the Holiday break.
The Lady Jeffs...my personal label whatever happens in the Amherst Mascot Selection business....see MBB board for possible choices...started slow over a smaller...in height...but game opponent.  Several interesting views in the 25 point win that was never in doubt.  First, the players were all wearing new sneakers in a grey color..brushed suede?...with the Under Armour logo.  Why?  Amherst has just recently signed a 5 -year deal with Under Armour to supply all sports with their products.  Thought the new footwear may have slowed the ladies a bit during the breaking in period.  Old purple color away suits worn last night. 
Second, it was the first time that two Amherst "bigs" was on the floor this season due to injuries.  Both are six footers.  Jr Nagle from VT moved well and scored underneath...wrist injuries.  Important in that she has experience and size to the counter the Tuft's front court.  The other player is a FY from Syracruse NY.  She moves well and played tight defense even at the perimeter and appears to be comfortable playing both outside and inside....another six footer with size.  Young Amherst players got minutes last night.  The announcers would mention often the experience gained playing both Tufts and Amherst would help.  They mentioned that Tufts was helded to 51 points, though Bridgewater did not break 40 points.  Bridgewater did break 40 points in the Amherst game...46 pts, though Amherst scored 71 with the entire team getting on the floor.
Amherst has two games after the hiolidays in California.  Maybe the team will be sporting new UA uniforms then.
It must be noted that at Homecoming I chatted with two UA agents as they were at
Amherst carrying samples, etc.  Their products are in commercial stores in town now.  Was wondering when the Amherst teams will be wearing new gear.

amh63.....good to hear from you.   I thought I was the only NESCAC fan here, which doesn't bode well for the conference.  Middlebury has beaten Clarkson and Skidmore since I last posted.  There will be very few opportunities for me to see them play since I tend to follow the men's team more closely.  The Panthers are young, with no seniors on the roster.  Of the three juniors, only Sarah Kaufman starts but Rachel Collins proved to be the spark plug that put the team on track against Clarkson and Sabrina Weeks, just back from injuries, is a seasoned and solid contributor.  Catherine Harrison returns as a scoring and rebounding force underneath the boards and able floor general Alex Huffman leads the team in assists, averages 7 rebounds and has 23 steals 7 games into the season.  Coleen Caveney leads the Panther scoring with 12 ppg while Betsy Knox, starting since Maya Davis' injury, has shown signs of being a strong offensive presence as well.  If the Panthers can stay healthy there is no reason not to expect them to be a first division team.

"The Lady Jeffs" works fine for me.  The original depiction had nothing to do with the English gentleman/soldier.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on December 14, 2016, 06:43:18 PM
Quote from: Vandy74 on December 14, 2016, 05:54:25 PM
Quote from: amh63 on December 14, 2016, 02:04:44 PM
Thought I best post the Amherst win last night over Bridgewater State before the Holiday break.
The Lady Jeffs...my personal label whatever happens in the Amherst Mascot Selection business....see MBB board for possible choices...started slow over a smaller...in height...but game opponent.  Several interesting views in the 25 point win that was never in doubt.  First, the players were all wearing new sneakers in a grey color..brushed suede?...with the Under Armour logo.  Why?  Amherst has just recently signed a 5 -year deal with Under Armour to supply all sports with their products.  Thought the new footwear may have slowed the ladies a bit during the breaking in period.  Old purple color away suits worn last night. 
Second, it was the first time that two Amherst "bigs" was on the floor this season due to injuries.  Both are six footers.  Jr Nagle from VT moved well and scored underneath...wrist injuries.  Important in that she has experience and size to the counter the Tuft's front court.  The other player is a FY from Syracruse NY.  She moves well and played tight defense even at the perimeter and appears to be comfortable playing both outside and inside....another six footer with size.  Young Amherst players got minutes last night.  The announcers would mention often the experience gained playing both Tufts and Amherst would help.  They mentioned that Tufts was helded to 51 points, though Bridgewater did not break 40 points.  Bridgewater did break 40 points in the Amherst game...46 pts, though Amherst scored 71 with the entire team getting on the floor.
Amherst has two games after the hiolidays in California.  Maybe the team will be sporting new UA uniforms then.
It must be noted that at Homecoming I chatted with two UA agents as they were at
Amherst carrying samples, etc.  Their products are in commercial stores in town now.  Was wondering when the Amherst teams will be wearing new gear.

amh63.....good to hear from you.   I thought I was the only NESCAC fan here, which doesn't bode well for the conference.  Middlebury has beaten Clarkson and Skidmore since I last posted.  There will be very few opportunities for me to see them play since I tend to follow the men's team more closely.  The Panthers are young, with no seniors on the roster.  Of the three juniors, only Sarah Kaufman starts but Rachel Collins proved to be the spark plug that put the team on track against Clarkson and Sabrina Weeks, just back from injuries, is a seasoned and solid contributor.  Catherine Harrison returns as a scoring and rebounding force underneath the boards and able floor general Alex Huffman leads the team in assists, averages 7 rebounds and has 23 steals 7 games into the season.  Coleen Caveney leads the Panther scoring with 12 ppg while Betsy Knox, starting since Maya Davis' injury, has shown signs of being a strong offensive presence as well.  If the Panthers can stay healthy there is no reason not to expect them to be a first division team.

"The Lady Jeffs" works fine for me.  The original depiction had nothing to do with the English gentleman/soldier.

  I think Fy Vanessa Young will be a significant factor, also. I SPECULATE from the boxscores that she was injured, then played in 1 game, before possible re-injury. I think she has too much ability not to have played otherwise. But I have been wrong before on player evaluations. ::)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 02, 2017, 03:38:45 PM
Been watching the Lady Jeffs lately and they are running an offense that wants to score inside, even though they have fine outside shooters.  They play more " man to man" defense and will surround inside opponents.  When the chance occurs, they will run, run and run...fast break...as big opponents do not keep up.  A lot of young PGs are gaining floor experience.  Coach G seems to be getting the team ready for conference play in January.  Tried watching some other CAC teams too...in games that have NO " viewing" charge.  Bowdoin did lose agame in Pomona Ca.  Tufts did not have any recent games scheduled. 
Let the games begin.... ;D.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 07, 2017, 07:53:36 AM
Looks like the Big three of Amherst, Tufts and Bowdoin will lead the league again.  Amherst appears to be very strong and is scoring a lot of points.  Getting production out of everyone in the starting line-up, and it would appear that there is more depth that JP is willing to play then in the past few years.  Tufts will be very good--another excellent defensive team.  Watched a bit of the Bowdoin-Tufts game last night.  Two very good teams in a very tight, well played game.  I think both teams will have excellent seasons. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 08, 2017, 07:53:58 AM
My sense is that both Bowdoin and Tufts had a little let down after they big match up on Friday, as both teams struggled against Colby and Bates.  Both ended up with wins, but games were closer than I would have anticipated based on the overall quality of the teams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 08, 2017, 09:24:49 PM
Maine 1...Thanks for holding the fort here.  Plus k
I agree with your assessment that Coach G is rotating alot of players into games this season. My take is two fold. The talent level of new players and the return of young players that were injured last season.  The last several season, key experienced players were injured late in the season and prevented flexibility of player rotations in games.  Plus his PG Renner and the Doswell twins are seniors.  Amherst has brought in a D1 transfer from Fairfield Un that is presently playing well in the front court.  Her presence there and other bigs gives the starters rest.  In short, Amherst is deep and playing well together.
I reported on the MBB board that I checked in on the Williams game in LeFrak on Friday.  Williams is a strong team on paper and the addition of a FY guard from Newton North gives them gives the Ephs two high scoring guards.  The score near the end of the 2nd period was 48- 16 Amherst.  Amherst had five bench players on the floor at the time and the half ended 50-19.  Amherst won handily.  Amherst will score whoever is on the floor and play good defense. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 09, 2017, 06:41:33 PM
  Just watched(2nd & 4th quarters) Amherst dismantle a good Albright squad to see how my 4(Eck, Fox, Hendricks, Nardella) former prospects were doing as FY college players. Amherst stifled Albright with their man-to-man defense and there were a number of good inside moves for layups on offense. Looking forward to the meeting(s) with Tufts.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 10, 2017, 02:28:21 PM
ronk.....your prospects...FYs...are doing fine and contributing.  Eck was starting a number of games before the D1 transfer adjusted to the other starters.  Fox does get a lot of playing time and will compete with the other guards when Renner graduates.  Has a fine outside shot and will even go for RBs despite her size.  The front court player from Syracuse was out for the early part of the season with an injury and returned when Nagle returned.  The fourth  prospect is playing with more confidence now and blends well with the other younger players when she gets on the floor.  All allows the starters to get more rest during gamess
See your team is just behind Amherst now in 3rd.  Have corrected my earlier posts to make it more readable...spelling errors,etc.   Need to catch Scranton online soon.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 10, 2017, 03:47:27 PM
Vandy,
  I've recently learned that 1 of my 2017 prospects has committed to Middlebury. She's a nice PG from upstate NY.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on January 11, 2017, 02:43:09 AM
Quote from: ronk on January 10, 2017, 03:47:27 PM
Vandy,
  I've recently learned that 1 of my 2017 prospects has committed to Middlebury. She's a nice PG from upstate NY.

ronk......Thanks for the info.  That's the positional need now.  Alex Huffman played the full 40 against Conn Coll.  I've been remiss in posting lately.   The Panthers are off to a great start at 10-2.  The only losses are a 50-47 decision to host RPI and a 64-48 loss at Smith that included a 4-17 2nd Q.  Middlebury defeated Wesleyan and Conn Coll last weekend.  I did watch the second half of the latter.  The Panthers had maintained a single digit lead throughout most of the game when they finally opened up a 10 point advantage with 6:49 minutes remaining.  Over the next 6:48 they would add only a Catherine Harrison lay up and a Maya Davis FT and at :15 Mairead Hynes tied the game at 56 all with a clutch trey.  Hynes' 20 points led all scorers.  Sarah Kaufman, whose 18 tallies led the Panthers calmly put a short jumper through the net at :01 to decide the outcome. :P ;) 

But this is the NESCAC with Tufts and Amherst ranked #s 1 & 2 in DIII and Bowdoin sitting in at #19 as well.  Middlebury tests itself against the elite when they host Tufts this Friday night.   Bates comes in on Saturday. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 11, 2017, 02:48:34 PM
Some interesting scheduling by Coach G for the Lady Jeffs.  Game on Monday with Albright, followed with a trip to LI to play Farmingdale College.  In both wins in back to back games, the young players got a lot of time on the floor...giving the starters a rest.  Back to back games begin this weekend at Wes and Conn.  Both are conference counting away games.  Travel involved but both should be short day trips.   Early part of the week games served to get Amherst to the upcoming back to back Nescac games, imo.  Post season games are also back to back games for the most part.

Oops, the games this weekend are in LeFrak.  The MBB games are in CT...back to back conf. Games this season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 11, 2017, 05:17:31 PM
Quote from: amh63 on January 11, 2017, 02:48:34 PM
Some interesting scheduling by Coach G for the Lady Jeffs.  Game on Monday with Albright, followed with a trip to LI to play Farmingdale College.  In both wins in back to back games, the young players got a lot of time on the floor...giving the starters a rest.  Back to back games begin this weekend at Wes and Conn.  Both are conference counting away games.  Travel involved but both should be short day trips.  Early part of the week games served to get Amherst to the upcoming back to back Nescac games, imo.  Post season games are also back to back games for the most part.

I think you've analyzed GP's MO correctly. Nothing gets by him in prep for the big dance.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 15, 2017, 03:05:51 PM
The saying in the NFL is: "on any given Sunday." The idea being that anyone can win a game no matter the match up because, well, things happen. The same could be true in Division III basketball. On any given night, someone will pull off an upset. And in some weeks we see multiple upsets.

What to make of it all? Tune into Sunday's edition of Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) as Dave tries to make sense of most of it with guests from around the country who can provide their insight.

Also on tap for tonight, can Amherst women run the table? What to make of William Peace men's basketball. And why one coach is highly regarded in the Chinese-American culture.

Tune in starting at 7:00 PM ET here: http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2016-17/jan15 - or via Facebook Live. If you can't watch the show live, you can catch up On Demand once it is off the air or download the podcast via SoundCloud or iTunes.

Guests scheduled (in order of appearance):
- G.P. Gromacki, No. 2 Amherst women's head coach
- Claude Shields, William Peace men's coach
- Carol Jue, Chapman women's coach - WBCA Center Court
- Mark Beinborn, Augustana women's coach
- Ira Thor, New Jersey City SID - Atlantic Regional Reporter

And don't forget about the Hoopsville Mailbag segment! Email questions you may have to the show at hoopsville@d3hoops.com and we will answer them tonight or on a future show.

You can also tune into the podcast(s) after the show has aired:
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville
iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/hoopsville/id1059517087

Don't forget you can always interact with us:
Website: www.d3hoopsville.com
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Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 16, 2017, 06:10:01 PM
Excellent interview with Coach Gromacki. I totally agree with him that this is the best team he's had in a few years.... In my opinion, the best since his National Championship team.  Good to hear about the positive team chemistry, although what else is he going to say.  Anyway, all the talent in the world won't mean a thing if they don't get along, like to play together, and accept their role on the team.  They are fun to watch, whether in person or on a computer screen.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 17, 2017, 03:35:26 PM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on January 16, 2017, 06:10:01 PM
Excellent interview with Coach Gromacki. I totally agree with him that this is the best team he's had in a few years.... In my opinion, the best since his National Championship team.  Good to hear about the positive team chemistry, although what else is he going to say.  Anyway, all the talent in the world won't mean a thing if they don't get along, like to play together, and accept their role on the team.  They are fun to watch, whether in person or on a computer screen.

Thanks for tuning in... I enjoy chatting with Coach Gromacki, but sometimes I wish we could get a little more out of him. LOL He tends to be the shortest-answer guest we have on all year. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 17, 2017, 04:22:41 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 17, 2017, 03:35:26 PM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on January 16, 2017, 06:10:01 PM
Excellent interview with Coach Gromacki. I totally agree with him that this is the best team he's had in a few years.... In my opinion, the best since his National Championship team.  Good to hear about the positive team chemistry, although what else is he going to say.  Anyway, all the talent in the world won't mean a thing if they don't get along, like to play together, and accept their role on the team.  They are fun to watch, whether in person or on a computer screen.

Thanks for tuning in... I enjoy chatting with Coach Gromacki, but sometimes I wish we could get a little more out of him. LOL He tends to be the shortest-answer guest we have on all year. :)

GP might have had a longer response to my comments if I had gotten them to you before the interview :) I razzed him at a summer AAU tourney about the subject. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 17, 2017, 08:43:48 PM
Quote from: ronk on January 17, 2017, 04:22:41 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 17, 2017, 03:35:26 PM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on January 16, 2017, 06:10:01 PM
Excellent interview with Coach Gromacki. I totally agree with him that this is the best team he's had in a few years.... In my opinion, the best since his National Championship team.  Good to hear about the positive team chemistry, although what else is he going to say.  Anyway, all the talent in the world won't mean a thing if they don't get along, like to play together, and accept their role on the team.  They are fun to watch, whether in person or on a computer screen.

Thanks for tuning in... I enjoy chatting with Coach Gromacki, but sometimes I wish we could get a little more out of him. LOL He tends to be the shortest-answer guest we have on all year. :)

GP might have had a longer response to my comments if I had gotten them to you before the interview :) I razzed him at a summer AAU tourney about the subject.

That or shorter answers because he doesn't want to give anything away. LOL
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on January 18, 2017, 12:14:43 AM
Hey speaking of Amherst...

http://www.d3hoops.com/columns/around-the-region/northeast/2016-17/amherst-costa-rica
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on January 18, 2017, 12:40:27 AM
Where is the Tufts game this year, MA or at home in Amherst??  And I think Amherst will beat them anyways no matter where it takes place.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PolarBearPA on January 21, 2017, 05:57:16 AM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on January 16, 2017, 06:10:01 PM
Excellent interview with Coach Gromacki. I totally agree with him that this is the best team he's had in a few years.... In my opinion, the best since his National Championship team.  Good to hear about the positive team chemistry, although what else is he going to say.  Anyway, all the talent in the world won't mean a thing if they don't get along, like to play together, and accept their role on the team.  They are fun to watch, whether in person or on a computer screen.

Got to see them last night at Bowdoin. Extremely impressive team. Bowdoin took Tufts to the wire at Tufts and Amherst made it look easy against Bowdoin in their Gym. I think Amherst has to be the league favorite. They distributed the ball extremely well and made it look easy while making it extremely difficult for Bowdoin on the defensive end. Hats off to Amherst!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 21, 2017, 08:42:09 AM
I would agree with the post that this is a much better Amherst team than the past few years.  It appears that there is much more depth, as they are playing 7 or 8 regularly, and getting scoring from a number of places.  This is very much like the very deep  2009-2013 teams.  I was actually a bit surprised by the size of the win against Bowdoin.
After watching a few different teams, this looks like an overall down year in the NESCAC.  Williams is not a good team, and I don't see the Connecticut teams being very competitive against the top three (Amherst, Tufts and Bowdoin).  I haven't seen Middlebury yet. 
Amherst I believe plays at Tufts.  That will be a good game because both teams play great defense.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 21, 2017, 09:29:44 PM
Been watching D1 BB....fan of ACC men's and UConn women's Basketball.  Not much D3 BB lately.  In any case, the rare games have been the Amherst WBB team.  This season it appears Coach GP...I prefer Coach G...does have a deep team.  His FYs have been getting playing time and contributing.  He started the season with two front court players out with injuries, one a FY. 
A little perspective of Coach G's teams the last few years.  In those years, the Amherst team lost key front court players late in the season due to injuries.  Last season, some talented young players were lost due to injuries.  Such players provided rest for the starters.
This season, a D1 front court player was added to a group of talented FYs that included two front court players.  Ronk is aware of the talent level of the FYs brought aboard.  Yes, in the games I have watched...like the Bowdoin and Williams  games, it did not matter, home or away...they were 20 plus wins.  The rotation of players allowed starters to be well rested for the 4 th quarter if needed.  In back to back Nescac games scheduling, the starters are well rested for the next day's game.
I have checked the play of Tufts against common opponents and it is encouraging.  However, it is just that....comparing scores can be misleading since player match ups are key. 
7Express maybe correct.  However, if one goes back just to last season....Tufts beat Amherst in LeFrak by 1point and stopped Amherst record breaking homecourt winning streak.  Amherst broke UConn' s record and got a congrat from Coach Gino A. Of UConn.  Amherst got " revenge" by beating Tufts in Cousen by 1 point for the Nescac title. 
Both teams lost to the National Title winner in the Final 4.  I believe Tufts ranking is due to the fact they lost in the Finals and Amherst in the semis.  In any case , this year's game in Cousen will be a battle and will determine which team will host the CAC  Tourny.  . 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 25, 2017, 07:21:36 PM
What has happened to Williams?  Each Amherst/Williams game used to be so close with a packed gym.  Empty tonight, and Amherst seems to be on the way to another blow out. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 26, 2017, 01:49:42 PM
NE Jeffs Fan....many reasons, imo.  It was a midweek game that did not count in the conference race.  It is also semester break time and students are elsewhere.  Yes it is Amherst vs Williams....however unlike the years when you followed the battles more closely...the games have not been competitive.  The game at Amherst was Even more of a blowout. The home fans on a cold night maybe watching online.  It used to be that the women and men games were played together in one place.  Now they are split.  The men's team was in LeFrak...better crowd at Amherst but lack of Williams student in the stands.  Both Williams teams are rebuilding.  In addition, the women side games are dominated by Tufts and Amherst...no.1 and no. 2 in the national rankings.  Amherst has been blowing almost everyone out these days...not a fun time for any home crowd. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 26, 2017, 03:11:28 PM
I knew all that....students not back yet...teams split (which I, too, dislike)....I was wondering if any Eph fan out there could give us some insight into recruiting the past year or so, and what they see or hear about coming along.  Some teams do rebuild.  Amherst, like Kentucky men's bball, UConn women's bball, Clemson football....just reload.  Seem to come up each year with freshmen that can make a difference that play well with the seasoned juniors and seniors.  Anyway, thanks for taking the time to answer.  Having watch NESCAC bball for over 15 years, I find it kind of sad as I always looked forward to both games each year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 26, 2017, 03:35:32 PM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on January 26, 2017, 03:11:28 PM
I knew all that....students not back yet...teams split (which I, too, dislike)....I was wondering if any Eph fan out there could give us some insight into recruiting the past year or so, and what they see or hear about coming along.  Some teams do rebuild.  Amherst, like Kentucky men's bball, UConn women's bball, Clemson football....just reload.  Seem to come up each year with freshmen that can make a difference that play well with the seasoned juniors and seniors.  Anyway, thanks for taking the time to answer.  Having watch NESCAC bball for over 15 years, I find it kind of sad as I always looked forward to both games each year.

Lauren Vostal was on my prospect list 2 years ago; thought she would be a significant contributor by now. Emily Peckham was on my watch list but suffered an injury during her AAU season and missed her senior season; might still be recovering. Meredith Mesaris(on the coaching staff) was an All-American but has used up her eligibility @ Scranton.  :(
  2 from my 2017 list are going to Tufts and Middlebury next year. Haven't heard of any going to Williams yet, but I don't usually look closely at prospects north of Connecticut, which is most of Williams' roster or recruiting region.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 28, 2017, 11:35:00 AM
As I said last week -this is a very weak NESCAC relative to past years. Tufts
and Amherst are significantly better than everyone else (maybe Bowdoin can compete, but Amherst beat them easily).  We need to see if Middlebury is for real.
I also think splitting the men and women up is a mistake. Back when my daughter was playing (at least the first two years) men and women played together.  It was much better for the women if they played the early game, as the gym would fill up near the end and you had some good crowds that came to watch the double-header.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 29, 2017, 07:35:26 AM
Unfortunately, yesterday's games showed just how week the overall NESCAC is.  The top three teams (Tufts, Amherst, Bowdoin) won their games by a combined 110 points ( Tufts plus 29, Bowdoin plus 41, Amherst plus 41). And Middlebury showed that they are likely a pretender in losing to Hamilton. It wasn't long ago when the NESCAC was sending four and five very strong teams into the NCAA tournament.  I believe a lot of this is coaching as much as talent, and the ability to recruit.  A number of the other schools have had multiple coaching changes. It would be good to see the other teams step up and become more competitive.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 30, 2017, 10:10:46 AM
Maine1...I responded to your post!  Unfortunately it was posted on the Nescac football board.  Vandy74 pointed out my error.  To inept to transfer it here and lazy too.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jumpshot on January 30, 2017, 09:15:32 PM
Williams women score 91 points in tonight's win ----while committing 25 turnovers!

The Ephs have really struggled in recent years with an inordinate number of turnovers, many unforced.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on February 03, 2017, 02:23:03 AM
I've got Amherst over Tufts this weekend by 7....55-48.  Defensive battle as both of these games usually are, I just think Amherst can score more on Tufts than the Jumbos (outside of North) can score on Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on February 03, 2017, 08:46:30 AM
 Baptiste(Tufts) will be the swing factor in the game - if she avoids foul trouble or not will be a 10-point factor. Will go with Tufts because of home court and style with a grind-it-out defensive game. Amherst does play excellent defense but their offense will be constrained more so than vice-versa.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 03, 2017, 02:02:38 PM
Remember posters....last year's TWO battles between Tufts and Amherst ended up 1-point wins.  Amherst lost at home and won at Tufts for the conference title!  Almost all the starters for both teams return.  Amherst played without an injured SR. Front court player in the Ttle game.  Amherst has added fine front court players to battle the play of key Tufts bigs.  In the end, it will be defense and the guard play.  Amherst, imo, has the better guards...all starters returning...and more and better depth
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 03, 2017, 10:16:29 PM
Amherst blew out a game but weak Bates team in Maine.  The game was over after the first period.  None of Amherst starters played more than 17 minutes....the bench actually beat Bates statistically. Only one Amherst player was held out.  An often injured FY.
Tufts also won easily at Trinity.  Guess they will return to Medford to await Amherst who will remain in Maine, I would think. 
Big game on Sat. For the honor of hosting the Tourny.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 04, 2017, 05:01:55 PM
For the third straight game between Amherst and Tufts...second straight at Tufts, A 1 PT win!
Amherst takes the one point lead...behind most of the game...with under 30 sec. Tufts gets the ball... the clock...25.6sec.  Tufts tries to score but with about a sec to go, Amherst gets the ball and it was a win for Amherst!
Both 7express and ronk have  good points.  Ronk's wild card player was the top scorer for Tufts but fouled out with over two nineties to go.  7's point with respect to offense was correct...it was on the foul line.  A very low scoring game...with a lot of uncalled fouls underneath and TOs by both teams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 04, 2017, 09:30:22 PM

I thought Tufts looked the better team throughout.  The foul trouble is indeed a big achilles heel for the Jumbos.  Great defense on both sides, but if Tufts could've shot better than 1-7 in the fourth quarter, the result would've been different.  I imagine we'll see one, if not two more matchups before the year is out.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 04, 2017, 10:24:42 PM
Really Ryan!....based on what factors.  Tufts was playing at home before a crowd of 2000...must be record home crowd for WBB.  Amherst travels down from Maine.  Tufts jumps to a 7-0 lead and ends the first quarter by 18-8.  2nd quarter Tufts was almost blanketed scoring only 3 points as Amherst settles down and jack up the defense.  A comment of " If Tufts shot better than 1-7 in the 4th quarter" does't do it for me...really.  Also the foul issue with Tufts players.  Even the announcers questioned some of the TOs/ fouls called by the refs on Amherst...yet Tufts bigs were skirting around from fouling out...one did. From my bias view, North made some fouls that were  given to others nearby.  Check the replays on the matter.
Both teams had players that can shoot better than they did in the game...give the credit to defensive effort by both sides.  In the end, I believe Amherst had a deeper team with players off the bench contributing.  Check out Nagle in the last five minutes with blocks, hustle, deflections, etc.  Announcers seemed impressed.
Like me, your eyes will see what you want to see, my friend.  Want the facts!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 04, 2017, 10:44:53 PM
Finally good to see a competitive NESCAC game.  Overall, I did not think either team played well.  Part of that may have been really good defense, but also some poor shooting.  I did think that Tufts missed a lot of open looks.  Start of the game looked like Tufts would run away with the game. It looked to me that the two palming calls on Baptista through her off her game (you never see that called). There were a lot of fouls called, but both teams were forcing a lot of contact all over the court.  I do think if Baptista does not foul out, Tufts probably wins, but she does have a history of getting into foul trouble. Given how good a player she is, she has to learn how to stay out of foul trouble.  The player that really made a difference for Amherst was Nagle.  I thought she totally shut down North (North was a none factor) and got some really big rebounds.  Both teams shot poorly. The difference was free throws--which in a game which was as physical and grabby as this game was, I am not sure you can justify a team having 50% more free throws.  I thought the game was too tightly called--but that is hard to tell on the video. I believe both teams can play much better than what they played today.
As far as the announcers, I understand this is  D3 webcast, but they were about the worst I have ever heard.
Unless Bowdoin knocks one of these teams off, we will see Amherst and Tufts again at Amherst in the NESCAC final
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on February 05, 2017, 01:08:50 AM
It's very rare to see the top two teams play each other during the regular season. How rare? By my count it's only the fourth time it has happened since 1999-2000.

http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2017/02/wrapup-024-women
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 05, 2017, 09:45:37 AM
Maine1....nice post.  Missed the palming calls.  Amherst's PG Renner was called for traveling several times...also unusual on her.  Yes there was also a lot of "grabbing" going om.  Have not seen that term much in WBB.  It was a physical game with bodies on he floor...too much moisture in a packed house?
The announcers were trying to be objective but were getting players mixed up, especially the Doswell "twins"., on the Amherst side.
Yes Nagle has the size to counter North down Low.  One Amherst starter, a D1 transfer was frustrated by the fouls called on her early...checking North.  Has the height but not the strength/bulk of North.
Tufts is unique in the conference in that it runs its own broadcast production.  Love replays are great.
In my experience, there are full game videos available on utube later.  Everyone can see a big game they missed and I can observe action that I missed....did leave the game to check on the MBB scores.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on February 05, 2017, 10:04:09 AM
Quote from: gordonmann on February 05, 2017, 01:08:50 AM
It's very rare to see the top two teams play each other during the regular season. How rare? By my count it's only the fourth time it has happened since 1999-2000.

http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2017/02/wrapup-024-women

I was at the Bowdoin-Scranton game that you mentioned and remember as the best-played women's contest that I've seen in person, a battle for the full 40 minutes.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on February 06, 2017, 11:30:17 AM
Yeah, I saw the Hope/Howard Payne game in Texas and it's the first game that comes to mind when trying to think about the best women's game I've seen.

I also saw No. 1 Thomas More host No. 2 St. Thomas in the Elite 8 a couple seasons ago. I removed it from the list since that was one of the wins that Thomas More vacated.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 06, 2017, 04:06:32 PM
Interesting posts by two knowledgeable WBB followers.
Me, just watched the Amherst win over Tufts in Cousens on Tufts Senior night in front of announced 2000 fans from BOTH schools!  May not be the best announced (Maine1 comment...I agree) and called game by the persons with the striped shirts (thanks to replay), but it must be the best defensive game between two top teams with potent offenses.  Tufts, the number 1 ranked team scores just 3 points in the 2nd period and 5 in the fourth period...only 17 points in the second "half".
Again....three straight games in which the winner wins by ONE point!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 06, 2017, 10:25:02 PM
FYI....New rankings today....Amherst No.1 with Tufts at 4th.  Tufts surrounded by undefeated teams. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 11, 2017, 02:17:42 PM
quite week on the board.  We have 5 times with a 3-6 record fighting for the last three playoff spots. Colby with a big win last night over Conn College is in good shape for a spot if they win today.  If Middlebury beats Trinity they will secure the number 4 spot, but  I think anyone who finishes 5 can beat Middlebury.  I don't see anybody touching the top three.  Amherst will sleep walk to the NESCAC final, and Tufts and Bowdoin will have to fight it out.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 11, 2017, 05:22:09 PM
Amherst finished the regular season undefeated and had another blowout win in LeFrak.  Good home crowd...for senior day.  Announcer pointed out that the last time Hamilton went to the NCAA post-season, Coach GP was the HC of Hamilton.  Was enjoying his time there and only place he would move to was Amherst.  An opening came and Coach G arrived at Amherst, grew up in the area, etc.  The rest is history. Got advice from an Overseer/trustee of Hamilton, a friend and an Amherst Alum.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 11, 2017, 07:50:40 PM
Ii looks like both Williams and Bates will get in to the playoffs. If Bates wins, they would jump Colby for fifth as they have the head to head. If Willia ms wins, they would not jump over Colby.
Amherst is very lucky to have the Coach they have. He is a notch above everyone else in the conference.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on February 11, 2017, 11:07:42 PM
Quote from: amh63 on February 11, 2017, 05:22:09 PM
Amherst finished the regular season undefeated and had another blowout win in LeFrak.  Good home crowd...for senior day.  Announcer pointed out that the last time Hamilton went to the NCAA post-season, Coach GP was the HC of Hamilton.  Was enjoying his time there and only place he would move to was Amherst.  An opening came and Coach G arrived at Amherst, grew up in the area, etc.  The rest is history. Got advice from an Overseer/trustee of Hamilton, a friend and an Amherst Alum.

My understanding is that he did move to Drew but left without coaching a game there when Amherst became available.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 12, 2017, 03:53:51 PM
ronk...believe you are mistaken.  Coach GP did coach at a higher level before returning to D3 at Hamilton.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 12, 2017, 07:17:20 PM
according to Amherst website, he was at Temple between Hamilton and Amherst (doesn't mean he may not have been close somewhere)
Amherst, Tufts and Bowdoin should have no problem next week.  Colby and Middlebury are even, so that game could go either way.  The bottom five in the playoffs are interchangeable, and have no chance beyond next weekend.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on February 12, 2017, 07:44:06 PM
Quote from: Maine1 on February 12, 2017, 07:17:20 PM
according to Amherst website, he was at Temple between Hamilton and Amherst (doesn't mean he may not have been close somewhere)
Amherst, Tufts and Bowdoin should have no problem next week.  Colby and Middlebury are even, so that game could go either way.  The bottom five in the playoffs are interchangeable, and have no chance beyond next weekend.
Quote from: amh63 on February 12, 2017, 03:53:51 PM
ronk...believe you are mistaken.  Coach GP did coach at a higher level before returning to D3 at Hamilton.

Looks like he was @ Drew after Temple and before Hamilton, instead of between Hamilton and Amherst like I thought I had heard in a recent interview on Hoopsville.

http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2006/10/gromacki-leaves-drew-before-a-single-game
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 12, 2017, 09:03:28 PM
ronk...whatever. Did he leave in the middle of the night!? :). Not everything here on D3hoops is written in stone, imho.
Bottom line...coincide your point...do not care really.  Point I posted was when he left Hamilton to go to Amherst after a 20 win season at Hamilton.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on February 12, 2017, 10:27:37 PM
Quote from: amh63 on February 12, 2017, 09:03:28 PM
ronk...whatever. Did he leave in the middle of the night!? :). Not everything here on D3hoops is written in stone, imho.
Bottom line...coincide your point...do not care really.  Point I posted was when he left Hamilton to go to Amherst after a 20 win season at Hamilton.

Yes, Scranton met his Hamilton team that season in the 2nd round of the NCAA tourney; have suggested that Scranton invite Amherst to its December holiday tourney; would be an attractive matchup.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on February 12, 2017, 11:29:47 PM
 For the Williams fans - just learned of a commit by a good point guard
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 14, 2017, 03:47:36 PM
Quote from: ronk on February 12, 2017, 07:44:06 PM
Quote from: Maine1 on February 12, 2017, 07:17:20 PM
according to Amherst website, he was at Temple between Hamilton and Amherst (doesn't mean he may not have been close somewhere)
Amherst, Tufts and Bowdoin should have no problem next week.  Colby and Middlebury are even, so that game could go either way.  The bottom five in the playoffs are interchangeable, and have no chance beyond next weekend.
Quote from: amh63 on February 12, 2017, 03:53:51 PM
ronk...believe you are mistaken.  Coach GP did coach at a higher level before returning to D3 at Hamilton.

Looks like he was @ Drew after Temple and before Hamilton, instead of between Hamilton and Amherst like I thought I had heard in a recent interview on Hoopsville.

http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2006/10/gromacki-leaves-drew-before-a-single-game

Yeah - I apparently have gotten this screwed up. Sorry about that, ronk. I guess history has confused the story for me. Have to check with the guys, because I think a few of us have gotten this backwards over time... OR I am just losing my mind.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 19, 2017, 11:08:00 AM
No surprises in yesterday's first round (including Colby over Middlebury, which I did not think was a surprise).  Tufts and Bowdoin will be a close game next week, and I could see Bowdoin pulling the upset. I don't see any way that Colby beats Amherst.  Would love to see an Amherst/ Tufts rematch in the finals. Tufts,Amherst and Bowdoin should all make the NCAA tournament
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 21, 2017, 05:58:24 PM
Quote from: amh63 on February 12, 2017, 09:03:28 PM
ronk...whatever. Did he leave in the middle of the night!? :). Not everything here on D3hoops is written in stone, imho.
Bottom line...coincide your point...do not care really.  Point I posted was when he left Hamilton to go to Amherst after a 20 win season at Hamilton.

We generally don't publish a story that isn't true, amh63.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on February 26, 2017, 10:06:45 AM
Though they didn't start off as sharp as some games, I thought that Amherst did what they needed to do to beat former coach, Brittany Gaetano and Colby.  Amherst coach did a good job using many players so that his starters have plenty of rest for another epic battle with Tufts today.  Today's game could go either way. 

I, too, think Bowdoin also deserves to make the tourney.  Hope NESCAC has 3 teams represented!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 26, 2017, 10:58:15 AM
Some comments on the games I watched...and parts of the games I watched.
First time I watched the Bowdoin squad.  Seems the starters were really tight...emotionally tired?...as some were breathing hard at the end of the first period.  No real attempt to go inside and no effective outside game....five points in the first period.  In any case, Bowdoin should get to the post- season based on the latest regional rankings and the present high rankings of Amherst and Tufts.
Tufts also sat their big hitters as much as they could in order for the short turnaround period between games.  Expect they slept in their own beds last night.  North did return to the game in the second half.
Amherst made several moves in the first half that surprised me.  Renner was replaced early in the first period and the FY center from Syracruse...who missed many early games due to an injury..got a lot of time on the floor.  The return of a starter who missed the last few games into the lineup may have also been a reason for the slow Amherst start.
The key in the first half, imo, was the attempt by Amherst to go inside for points and hold their outside game.  Against Colby who has size, it was quite effective.  In the second half, Amherst started to take the outside shots...calibrating their offense?.
In any case, It should be a good game.  Key will be to stop Tufts outside game and winning the rebounds.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 26, 2017, 03:27:33 PM
Back again.
Amherst beats Tufts this afternoon in LeFrak to win its second straight Nescac title in front of a large partisan crowd.
No. it was NOT a one point win.  The score was 41-37, Amherst.  Last season in Cousen, the score was 36-35, Amherst.
If one looked at the halftime score, and just the stats, the above Amherst win would seem improbable.  Amherst made NO 3-point shots, had more TOs, missed a ton of foul shots and scored only TEN points in the first half.
Tufts made 5 3-point shots, all by their leading scorer and had 15 TOs.  Amherst scored more points over Tufts TOs than vice versa.
The difference was better defense by Amherst in the 3rd period that led to a 21 point offensive outburst and holding Tufts to 6 pts.  It was 16-10, Tufts at halftime. Amherst won the rebounding battle.  Amherst scored more than Tufts inside.
Ali Doswell who missed two outside shots that did not hit the net in the first half and her foul shots too, sat for a long time.  In the second half, she was outstanding, playing mostly inside.  She was the game leading rebounder, her team assist's leader and team high scorer. 
Both teams did not sub much.  Amherst led by about 4-9 points in the 2nd half and slowed the game down in the last five minutes of the game.
With the win, Amherst may host the rest of the post season games in LeFrak..maybe up to the Final 4, if they continue to win.  Why do I point this out?  Amherst won 0ver 120 home games last year..beating UCONN's record.
Tufts stopped that home court record....winning by 1 pt last season.  Both teams went to the Final 4 last season.
With luck and solid play, the two teams may meet again in the Final 4.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 26, 2017, 07:32:59 PM
watched most of the game.  Amherst really turned up the defense in the second half, which spurred the offense.  Ali Doswell took advantage of a mismatch down low, and Tufts could not find any consistent offense.  Amherst won't leave LaFrak until the final four.  Hopefully Tufts is in a different bracket.  Tufts needs to get more offense out of North.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 01, 2017, 01:38:24 PM
Looks like both Tufts and Amherst got good draws and if both continue to win wouldn't meet until the Final game.  Tufts may have a bit tougher pod, but would love to see Tufts vs Wash U.  Two great coaches, and I can't recall if they've matched up before.  There are a few teams, Bowdoin included, that could easily give Amherst a good game if the Purple and White (Lady Jeffs for us old timers) aren't on their game.

Let the fun begin!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 01, 2017, 01:51:45 PM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on March 01, 2017, 01:38:24 PM
Looks like both Tufts and Amherst got good draws and if both continue to win wouldn't meet until the Final game.  Tufts may have a bit tougher pod, but would love to see Tufts vs Wash U.  Two great coaches, and I can't recall if they've matched up before.  There are a few teams, Bowdoin included, that could easily give Amherst a good game if the Purple and White (Lady Jeffs for us old timers) aren't on their game.

Let the fun begin!!!

Tufts is absolutely the tougher draw and that is probably the right course of action by the committee. Amherst has some bumps, but the lower right is littered with good teams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 01, 2017, 02:24:25 PM
Dave...interesting word used in your discription of the lower right section..."littered" :)

NE Jeff Fan....Based on the Bowdoin vs. Amherst game and what I saw of Bowdoin vs Tufts in LeFrak, I do NOT see Bowdoin giving Amherst a battle in LeFrak.  Tufts is not a high scoring team.  Amherst can be.  Bowdoin does not match up well with Amherst, basically.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 06, 2017, 06:21:55 PM
I guess I shouldn't be surprised that Tufts has to fly to St. Louis, based on regional rankings etc I guess Wash U is ranked slightly higher.  Glad Amherst gets to host, and interesting chart on success of hosting teams getting to Final 4.  Amherst seems to be pretty successful when they host.  Looking forward to another weekend of great games.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 06, 2017, 11:41:20 PM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on March 06, 2017, 06:21:55 PM
I guess I shouldn't be surprised that Tufts has to fly to St. Louis, based on regional rankings etc I guess Wash U is ranked slightly higher.  Glad Amherst gets to host, and interesting chart on success of hosting teams getting to Final 4.  Amherst seems to be pretty successful when they host.  Looking forward to another weekend of great games.

WashU was the #1 in the Central; Tufts was #2 in the Northeast. Committee did discuss it and felt the criteria gave this to WashU. Was actually the second shortest conversation of the four host chats the committee had. You can probably guess which was the shortest. LOL
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 08, 2017, 12:07:15 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 06, 2017, 11:41:20 PM
WashU was the #1 in the Central; Tufts was #2 in the Northeast. Committee did discuss it and felt the criteria gave this to WashU. Was actually the second shortest conversation of the four host chats the committee had. You can probably guess which was the shortest. LOL

Obviously whether to send the bottom left teams to Ohio Northern, or Geneseo Dave, LOL ;D
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 08, 2017, 12:13:31 PM
Quote from: 7express on March 08, 2017, 12:07:15 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 06, 2017, 11:41:20 PM
WashU was the #1 in the Central; Tufts was #2 in the Northeast. Committee did discuss it and felt the criteria gave this to WashU. Was actually the second shortest conversation of the four host chats the committee had. You can probably guess which was the shortest. LOL

Obviously whether to send the bottom left teams to Ohio Northern, or Geneseo Dave, LOL ;D

That was indeed the longest conversation  ;D - committee apparently discussed it for a half an hour and were pretty split on whether Geneseo or Ohio Northern deserved to host. They didn't realize the problem with the travel for Hope to Geneseo at the time. If they had know about it sooner, it would have meant thirty minutes of their lives they wouldn't have lost. LOL
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 08, 2017, 12:47:48 PM
I actually thought St. Thomas might be the second shortest conversation.  There will be 3 flights regardless to whichever team hosted and St. Thomas clearly looked like the best team.  I would have ranked them time wise in order from shortest-longest it took to decide the hosts:
1) Amherst
2) St. Thomas
3) Ohio Northern
4) Wash U.

Goes to show how much I know (which is nothing), LOL.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 08, 2017, 01:42:33 PM
It was the second shortest... here was the order from shortest to longest as it was told to me:

- Amherst (duh)
- St. Thomas (being undefeated eventually won out)
- WashU (comparing to Tufts was at least a bit of a conversation)
- Geneseo... eh ONU (as indicated, the longest chat)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 08, 2017, 05:16:00 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 08, 2017, 01:42:33 PM
It was the second shortest... here was the order from shortest to longest as it was told to me:

- Amherst (duh)
- St. Thomas (being undefeated eventually won out)
- WashU (comparing to Tufts was at least a bit of a conversation)
- Geneseo... eh ONU (as indicated, the longest chat)

So, why is Wash U hosting over Tufts; Tufts has a higher WP, the same 9-2 vrro, and marginally trails on SOS, but has lost only to the #1 seed, while Wash U has lost to lesser opponents?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 08, 2017, 07:28:54 PM
Not sure where you are getting 9-2 for both... NCAA data doesn't have either team at 9-2 and I didn't either. Here is the most common data talked about from the NCAA at the close of the season:

WashU: 23-2 (.920)    8-2 vRRO   .621 SOS
Tufts: 25-2 (.926)   7-2 vRRO   .610 SOS

Per the vRRO category... Tufts lost to Amherst (#1) twice, WashU lost to Chicago (#2) and Rochester (#3)... I don't think I would call them "lesser opponents." Amherst is a great team, but it isn't like WashU lost to #8 or #9 in a regional ranking.

But more importantly it is the wins (in order of ranking):
- WashU: Chicago (#2), Rochester (#3), DePauw (#4), Wartburg (#5), IWU (#6), CMS (#8),  Carnegie Mellon (#8) twice
- Tufts: Bowdoin (#3) twice, Babson (#4)Keene State (#5), Skidmore (#5), Eastern Connecticut (#6), Univ. of New England (#10)

Pretty close, but I think I would give the edge to WashU especially with a win over a #2. They also played one more game against a regionally ranked opponent and have one more win. If this is coming down to splitting hairs, I can see where WashU has the advantage.

But I think another thing to point out, WashU split with those they loss to while Tufts lost both times to Amherst. That could have been a decision maker.

Finally, WashU was #1 in the Central Region and Tufts was #2... WashU's SOS is a little higher... I don't see a problem with them being host. I will also point out, that WashU was in the higher-seed position on the bracket. That doesn't always hold water (see Babson in the men's bracket), but it does for the most part. We saw how the committee felt about these two teams when the bracket came out.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 08, 2017, 10:31:25 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 08, 2017, 07:28:54 PM
Not sure where you are getting 9-2 for both... NCAA data doesn't have either team at 9-2 and I didn't either. Here is the most common data talked about from the NCAA at the close of the season:

WashU: 23-2 (.920)    8-2 vRRO   .621 SOS
Tufts: 25-2 (.926)   7-2 vRRO   .610 SOS

Per the vRRO category... Tufts lost to Amherst (#1) twice, WashU lost to Chicago (#2) and Rochester (#3)... I don't think I would call them "lesser opponents." Amherst is a great team, but it isn't like WashU lost to #8 or #9 in a regional ranking.

But more importantly it is the wins (in order of ranking):
- WashU: Chicago (#2), Rochester (#3), DePauw (#4), Wartburg (#5), IWU (#6), CMS (#8),  Carnegie Mellon (#8) twice
- Tufts: Bowdoin (#3) twice, Babson (#4)Keene State (#5), Skidmore (#5), Eastern Connecticut (#6), Univ. of New England (#10)

Pretty close, but I think I would give the edge to WashU especially with a win over a #2. They also played one more game against a regionally ranked opponent and have one more win. If this is coming down to splitting hairs, I can see where WashU has the advantage.

But I think another thing to point out, WashU split with those they loss to while Tufts lost both times to Amherst. That could have been a decision maker.

Finally, WashU was #1 in the Central Region and Tufts was #2... WashU's SOS is a little higher... I don't see a problem with them being host. I will also point out, that WashU was in the higher-seed position on the bracket. That doesn't always hold water (see Babson in the men's bracket), but it does for the most part. We saw how the committee felt about these two teams when the bracket came out.

After last weekend, when the sectional hosting was debated, Tufts additionally beat 2 regionally ranked opponents and Wash U one, bringing them both to 9-2.

Wash U lost to Chicago(#4 with 7 losses) and Rochester(8 losses); I'd certainly call them lesser opponents than the undefeated #1 seed, Amherst.

Tufts being #2 in their region to that same undefeated top seed could be still stronger than the #1 ranked in any other region.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 09, 2017, 12:08:40 AM
Quote from: ronk on March 08, 2017, 10:31:25 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 08, 2017, 07:28:54 PM
Not sure where you are getting 9-2 for both... NCAA data doesn't have either team at 9-2 and I didn't either. Here is the most common data talked about from the NCAA at the close of the season:

WashU: 23-2 (.920)    8-2 vRRO   .621 SOS
Tufts: 25-2 (.926)   7-2 vRRO   .610 SOS

Per the vRRO category... Tufts lost to Amherst (#1) twice, WashU lost to Chicago (#2) and Rochester (#3)... I don't think I would call them "lesser opponents." Amherst is a great team, but it isn't like WashU lost to #8 or #9 in a regional ranking.

But more importantly it is the wins (in order of ranking):
- WashU: Chicago (#2), Rochester (#3), DePauw (#4), Wartburg (#5), IWU (#6), CMS (#8),  Carnegie Mellon (#8) twice
- Tufts: Bowdoin (#3) twice, Babson (#4)Keene State (#5), Skidmore (#5), Eastern Connecticut (#6), Univ. of New England (#10)

Pretty close, but I think I would give the edge to WashU especially with a win over a #2. They also played one more game against a regionally ranked opponent and have one more win. If this is coming down to splitting hairs, I can see where WashU has the advantage.

But I think another thing to point out, WashU split with those they loss to while Tufts lost both times to Amherst. That could have been a decision maker.

Finally, WashU was #1 in the Central Region and Tufts was #2... WashU's SOS is a little higher... I don't see a problem with them being host. I will also point out, that WashU was in the higher-seed position on the bracket. That doesn't always hold water (see Babson in the men's bracket), but it does for the most part. We saw how the committee felt about these two teams when the bracket came out.

After last weekend, when the sectional hosting was debated, Tufts additionally beat 2 regionally ranked opponents and Wash U one, bringing them both to 9-2.

Wash U lost to Chicago(#4 with 7 losses) and Rochester(8 losses); I'd certainly call them lesser opponents than the undefeated #1 seed, Amherst.

Tufts being #2 in their region to that same undefeated top seed could be still stronger than the #1 ranked in any other region.

Ronk - I quoted you the official NCAA data... WashU is 8-2... Tufts is 7-2 vRRO. There is no arguing that. I went through their schedules... I don't see any other regionally ranked opponents than the 10 WashU played and the 9 Tufts played. You can't make them 9-2 suddenly because two games were played in the tournament. You cannot add in the NCAA tournament opponents to the criteria. The committees don't do that. Simply because they created the bracket and thus they could manipulate the date to change the situation. So no, the teams are not 9-2 vRRO. You go by the data at the end of the regular season.

BTW, you may want to belittle Chicago and Rochester with their losses, but their SOSs were just as strong if not stronger than the Tufts (Chicago: .640; Rochester: .606). Considering unlike the NESCAC, the UAA plays a double-round-robin which naturally pulls a school's SOS towards .500 the fact their SOS numbers were just as good as Tufts says a lot about their schedules which compensates for those losses in the eyes of the committee. Chicago took undefeated #2 St. Thomas to the wire. Rochester was beaten by a similar foe in Geneseo. Those results aren't considered, but I believe it shows you a lot more about those teams than you would let on. I know you like to stir the pot and be a contrarian and I know you like to just argue with me for whatever reason (even if I said the sky was blue), but I don't think it is fair to say Chicago and Rochester are "lesser opponents" by any stretch of the imagination. And I am quite confident the committee(s) would disagree with your assertion on the topic as well.

You may not like the decision by the committee because your beloved Royals have to fly to WashU, but I don't see a problem with it. If you didn't see this coming with how the bracket was built in the first place, I can't help you. In fact, I am quite sure I alluded to the fact it was going to head to WashU from the get-go because I talked a lot about the men being kicked out of the gym the first weekend, but may return the favor the next weekend.

Furthermore, WashU was the #1 in their region and Tufts was #2 in theirs as I said. WashU has the numbers in a lot of regards even when splitting hairs. I will also add if they are looking at just the records of the teams at the end of the regular season, they aren't going to punish WashU for the lack of a conference tournament and reward Tufts for three extra games (and two wins) just because they were played. I am not saying they are disregarded, but they are going to understand the difference in the WL numbers and the fact WashU could have easily had two or three more wins in a normal conference tournament just as Tufts could have two less wins (and one less loss) thanks to not having a NESCAC tournament. No one is going to gain an unfair advantage in the eyes of the committee. They try not to discount the NESCAC's data considering the lack of a double-round-robin, so I wouldn't expect them to discount the UAA for their lack of a conference tournament.

And by the way, I don't think Tuft's is a stronger #2 than Thomas More, Trinity (Texas), or St. Thomas along with WashU (all #1s in their regions) when it comes to the data - they are all undefeated teams besides WashU, so I am not sure where Tufts would win that argument. And an argument could be made if Tufts is in a strong position criteria wise than Ohio Northern or Geneseo (who does have a much lower SOS, but plays a TON of conference games). So no, I don't think Tufts "could be still strong than the #1 ranked in any other region."
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 09, 2017, 12:30:23 AM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 09, 2017, 12:08:40 AM
Quote from: ronk on March 08, 2017, 10:31:25 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 08, 2017, 07:28:54 PM
Not sure where you are getting 9-2 for both... NCAA data doesn't have either team at 9-2 and I didn't either. Here is the most common data talked about from the NCAA at the close of the season:

WashU: 23-2 (.920)    8-2 vRRO   .621 SOS
Tufts: 25-2 (.926)   7-2 vRRO   .610 SOS

Per the vRRO category... Tufts lost to Amherst (#1) twice, WashU lost to Chicago (#2) and Rochester (#3)... I don't think I would call them "lesser opponents." Amherst is a great team, but it isn't like WashU lost to #8 or #9 in a regional ranking.

But more importantly it is the wins (in order of ranking):
- WashU: Chicago (#2), Rochester (#3), DePauw (#4), Wartburg (#5), IWU (#6), CMS (#8),  Carnegie Mellon (#8) twice
- Tufts: Bowdoin (#3) twice, Babson (#4)Keene State (#5), Skidmore (#5), Eastern Connecticut (#6), Univ. of New England (#10)

Pretty close, but I think I would give the edge to WashU especially with a win over a #2. They also played one more game against a regionally ranked opponent and have one more win. If this is coming down to splitting hairs, I can see where WashU has the advantage.

But I think another thing to point out, WashU split with those they loss to while Tufts lost both times to Amherst. That could have been a decision maker.

Finally, WashU was #1 in the Central Region and Tufts was #2... WashU's SOS is a little higher... I don't see a problem with them being host. I will also point out, that WashU was in the higher-seed position on the bracket. That doesn't always hold water (see Babson in the men's bracket), but it does for the most part. We saw how the committee felt about these two teams when the bracket came out.

After last weekend, when the sectional hosting was debated, Tufts additionally beat 2 regionally ranked opponents and Wash U one, bringing them both to 9-2.

Wash U lost to Chicago(#4 with 7 losses) and Rochester(8 losses); I'd certainly call them lesser opponents than the undefeated #1 seed, Amherst.

Tufts being #2 in their region to that same undefeated top seed could be still stronger than the #1 ranked in any other region.

Ronk - I quoted you the official NCAA data... WashU is 8-2... Tufts is 7-2 vRRO. There is no arguing that. I went through their schedules... I don't see any other regionally ranked opponents than the 10 WashU played and the 9 Tufts played. You can't make them 9-2 suddenly because two games were played in the tournament. You cannot add in the NCAA tournament opponents to the criteria. The committees don't do that. Simply because they created the bracket and thus they could manipulate the date to change the situation. So no, the teams are not 9-2 vRRO. You go by the data at the end of the regular season.

BTW, you may want to belittle Chicago and Rochester with their losses, but their SOSs were just as strong if not stronger than the Tufts (Chicago: .640; Rochester: .606). Considering unlike the NESCAC, the UAA plays a double-round-robin which naturally pulls a school's SOS towards .500 the fact their SOS numbers were just as good as Tufts says a lot about their schedules which compensates for those losses in the eyes of the committee. Chicago took undefeated #2 St. Thomas to the wire. Rochester was beaten by a similar foe in Geneseo. Those results aren't considered, but I believe it shows you a lot more about those teams than you would let on. I know you like to stir the pot and be a contrarian and I know you like to just argue with me for whatever reason (even if I said the sky was blue), but I don't think it is fair to say Chicago and Rochester are "lesser opponents" by any stretch of the imagination. And I am quite confident the committee(s) would disagree with your assertion on the topic as well.

You may not like the decision by the committee because your beloved Royals have to fly to WashU, but I don't see a problem with it. If you didn't see this coming with how the bracket was built in the first place, I can't help you. In fact, I am quite sure I alluded to the fact it was going to head to WashU from the get-go because I talked a lot about the men being kicked out of the gym the first weekend, but may return the favor the next weekend.

Furthermore, WashU was the #1 in their region and Tufts was #2 in theirs as I said. WashU has the numbers in a lot of regards even when splitting hairs. I will also add if they are looking at just the records of the teams at the end of the regular season, they aren't going to punish WashU for the lack of a conference tournament and reward Tufts for three extra games (and two wins) just because they were played. I am not saying they are disregarded, but they are going to understand the difference in the WL numbers and the fact WashU could have easily had two or three more wins in a normal conference tournament just as Tufts could have two less wins (and one less loss) thanks to not having a NESCAC tournament. No one is going to gain an unfair advantage in the eyes of the committee. They try not to discount the NESCAC's data considering the lack of a double-round-robin, so I wouldn't expect them to discount the UAA for their lack of a conference tournament.

And by the way, I don't think Tuft's is a stronger #2 than Thomas More, Trinity (Texas), or St. Thomas along with WashU (all #1s in their regions) when it comes to the data - they are all undefeated teams besides WashU, so I am not sure where Tufts would win that argument. And an argument could be made if Tufts is in a strong position criteria wise than Ohio Northern or Geneseo (who does have a much lower SOS, but plays a TON of conference games). So no, I don't think Tufts "could be still strong than the #1 ranked in any other region."

It's not the data at the end of the regular season; it was updated to include the post season conference tourney; if there going to be consistent, they'll also update it for the regional weekend also.
The committee wouldn't have seeded Amherst #1 if they didn't consider Chicago and Rochester to be lesser opponents than Amherst.
And it has nothing to do with where Scranton is playing; it benefits Scranton to play a neutral court game rather than an away game against Tufts. Just want the committee to have consistency for their future decisions. BTW, wrt to a common opponent, Scranton won @ Rochester and Wash U lost there.
Just trying to keep your brain stimulated.  ;)
 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: nescac1 on March 09, 2017, 12:52:20 PM
Two recent articles discussing future Eph guards:

http://www.myrecordjournal.com/sports/southingtonsports/10069223-154/ciac-girls-basketball-no-23-lady-knights-take-quarterfinal-aim.html

http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/03/08/girls-basketball-pinewoods-mikaela-topper-passes-the-eye-test/
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 09, 2017, 01:13:50 PM
Quote from: ronk on March 09, 2017, 12:30:23 AM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 09, 2017, 12:08:40 AM
Quote from: ronk on March 08, 2017, 10:31:25 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 08, 2017, 07:28:54 PM
Not sure where you are getting 9-2 for both... NCAA data doesn't have either team at 9-2 and I didn't either. Here is the most common data talked about from the NCAA at the close of the season:

WashU: 23-2 (.920)    8-2 vRRO   .621 SOS
Tufts: 25-2 (.926)   7-2 vRRO   .610 SOS

Per the vRRO category... Tufts lost to Amherst (#1) twice, WashU lost to Chicago (#2) and Rochester (#3)... I don't think I would call them "lesser opponents." Amherst is a great team, but it isn't like WashU lost to #8 or #9 in a regional ranking.

But more importantly it is the wins (in order of ranking):
- WashU: Chicago (#2), Rochester (#3), DePauw (#4), Wartburg (#5), IWU (#6), CMS (#8),  Carnegie Mellon (#8) twice
- Tufts: Bowdoin (#3) twice, Babson (#4)Keene State (#5), Skidmore (#5), Eastern Connecticut (#6), Univ. of New England (#10)

Pretty close, but I think I would give the edge to WashU especially with a win over a #2. They also played one more game against a regionally ranked opponent and have one more win. If this is coming down to splitting hairs, I can see where WashU has the advantage.

But I think another thing to point out, WashU split with those they loss to while Tufts lost both times to Amherst. That could have been a decision maker.

Finally, WashU was #1 in the Central Region and Tufts was #2... WashU's SOS is a little higher... I don't see a problem with them being host. I will also point out, that WashU was in the higher-seed position on the bracket. That doesn't always hold water (see Babson in the men's bracket), but it does for the most part. We saw how the committee felt about these two teams when the bracket came out.

After last weekend, when the sectional hosting was debated, Tufts additionally beat 2 regionally ranked opponents and Wash U one, bringing them both to 9-2.

Wash U lost to Chicago(#4 with 7 losses) and Rochester(8 losses); I'd certainly call them lesser opponents than the undefeated #1 seed, Amherst.

Tufts being #2 in their region to that same undefeated top seed could be still stronger than the #1 ranked in any other region.

Ronk - I quoted you the official NCAA data... WashU is 8-2... Tufts is 7-2 vRRO. There is no arguing that. I went through their schedules... I don't see any other regionally ranked opponents than the 10 WashU played and the 9 Tufts played. You can't make them 9-2 suddenly because two games were played in the tournament. You cannot add in the NCAA tournament opponents to the criteria. The committees don't do that. Simply because they created the bracket and thus they could manipulate the date to change the situation. So no, the teams are not 9-2 vRRO. You go by the data at the end of the regular season.

BTW, you may want to belittle Chicago and Rochester with their losses, but their SOSs were just as strong if not stronger than the Tufts (Chicago: .640; Rochester: .606). Considering unlike the NESCAC, the UAA plays a double-round-robin which naturally pulls a school's SOS towards .500 the fact their SOS numbers were just as good as Tufts says a lot about their schedules which compensates for those losses in the eyes of the committee. Chicago took undefeated #2 St. Thomas to the wire. Rochester was beaten by a similar foe in Geneseo. Those results aren't considered, but I believe it shows you a lot more about those teams than you would let on. I know you like to stir the pot and be a contrarian and I know you like to just argue with me for whatever reason (even if I said the sky was blue), but I don't think it is fair to say Chicago and Rochester are "lesser opponents" by any stretch of the imagination. And I am quite confident the committee(s) would disagree with your assertion on the topic as well.

You may not like the decision by the committee because your beloved Royals have to fly to WashU, but I don't see a problem with it. If you didn't see this coming with how the bracket was built in the first place, I can't help you. In fact, I am quite sure I alluded to the fact it was going to head to WashU from the get-go because I talked a lot about the men being kicked out of the gym the first weekend, but may return the favor the next weekend.

Furthermore, WashU was the #1 in their region and Tufts was #2 in theirs as I said. WashU has the numbers in a lot of regards even when splitting hairs. I will also add if they are looking at just the records of the teams at the end of the regular season, they aren't going to punish WashU for the lack of a conference tournament and reward Tufts for three extra games (and two wins) just because they were played. I am not saying they are disregarded, but they are going to understand the difference in the WL numbers and the fact WashU could have easily had two or three more wins in a normal conference tournament just as Tufts could have two less wins (and one less loss) thanks to not having a NESCAC tournament. No one is going to gain an unfair advantage in the eyes of the committee. They try not to discount the NESCAC's data considering the lack of a double-round-robin, so I wouldn't expect them to discount the UAA for their lack of a conference tournament.

And by the way, I don't think Tuft's is a stronger #2 than Thomas More, Trinity (Texas), or St. Thomas along with WashU (all #1s in their regions) when it comes to the data - they are all undefeated teams besides WashU, so I am not sure where Tufts would win that argument. And an argument could be made if Tufts is in a strong position criteria wise than Ohio Northern or Geneseo (who does have a much lower SOS, but plays a TON of conference games). So no, I don't think Tufts "could be still strong than the #1 ranked in any other region."

It's not the data at the end of the regular season; it was updated to include the post season conference tourney; if there going to be consistent, they'll also update it for the regional weekend also.
The committee wouldn't have seeded Amherst #1 if they didn't consider Chicago and Rochester to be lesser opponents than Amherst.
And it has nothing to do with where Scranton is playing; it benefits Scranton to play a neutral court game rather than an away game against Tufts. Just want the committee to have consistency for their future decisions. BTW, wrt to a common opponent, Scranton won @ Rochester and Wash U lost there.
Just trying to keep your brain stimulated.  ;)


Scranton isn't part of this conversation of hosts with three losses and a much lower SOS. So who cares about common opponents. They aren't in the comparison here at all.

Ronk, the data I quoted is end of the regular season. That data is what the committee is using to make their decisions for the entire season. It would be inconsistent to use the first weekend of the NCAA tournament and update the data because the committee is changing the data on purpose by bracketing. Suddenly, the top seeded teams who are playing lesser opponents are disadvantaged because of that fact. The top seeds should play lower seeded teams. But then to punish them for that advantage seems pretty ridiculous. They then lose out in criteria because they risk their SOS going down and they can't bolster their vRRO accordingly. Seriously?! Please stop pretending that is a good idea. It has been shot down by more committee chairs than I can think of. Do you think they should reseed the D1 tournament after the first weekend and maybe change where teams are headed as a result? The data these teams control is the regular season. That is the data the committee should look at... not added data that is completely out of the control of the teams.

With that fact, the fact WashU played an unranked team in the first round PROVES they were the top seed in this quadrant.

And your argument that Amherst was #1 compared to Chicago and Rochester makes NO sense. Your use of "lesser" in comparison to Tufts opponents makes it seem like Chicago and Rochester were actually 8 or 9th ranked teams in the grand scheme of things. Of course Chicago and Rochester were lower seeded teams than Amherst... who is undefeated with a solid SOS. Amherst is basically the top seed in the entire tournament (those teams usually get slotted in the upper left bracket - see Whitman on the men's side). Everyone is "lesser" than Amherst... but that doesn't mean Chicago and Rochester are lesser than Tufts.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 09, 2017, 01:47:16 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 09, 2017, 01:13:50 PM
Quote from: ronk on March 09, 2017, 12:30:23 AM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 09, 2017, 12:08:40 AM
Quote from: ronk on March 08, 2017, 10:31:25 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 08, 2017, 07:28:54 PM
Not sure where you are getting 9-2 for both... NCAA data doesn't have either team at 9-2 and I didn't either. Here is the most common data talked about from the NCAA at the close of the season:

WashU: 23-2 (.920)    8-2 vRRO   .621 SOS
Tufts: 25-2 (.926)   7-2 vRRO   .610 SOS

Per the vRRO category... Tufts lost to Amherst (#1) twice, WashU lost to Chicago (#2) and Rochester (#3)... I don't think I would call them "lesser opponents." Amherst is a great team, but it isn't like WashU lost to #8 or #9 in a regional ranking.

But more importantly it is the wins (in order of ranking):
- WashU: Chicago (#2), Rochester (#3), DePauw (#4), Wartburg (#5), IWU (#6), CMS (#8),  Carnegie Mellon (#8) twice
- Tufts: Bowdoin (#3) twice, Babson (#4)Keene State (#5), Skidmore (#5), Eastern Connecticut (#6), Univ. of New England (#10)

Pretty close, but I think I would give the edge to WashU especially with a win over a #2. They also played one more game against a regionally ranked opponent and have one more win. If this is coming down to splitting hairs, I can see where WashU has the advantage.

But I think another thing to point out, WashU split with those they loss to while Tufts lost both times to Amherst. That could have been a decision maker.

Finally, WashU was #1 in the Central Region and Tufts was #2... WashU's SOS is a little higher... I don't see a problem with them being host. I will also point out, that WashU was in the higher-seed position on the bracket. That doesn't always hold water (see Babson in the men's bracket), but it does for the most part. We saw how the committee felt about these two teams when the bracket came out.

After last weekend, when the sectional hosting was debated, Tufts additionally beat 2 regionally ranked opponents and Wash U one, bringing them both to 9-2.

Wash U lost to Chicago(#4 with 7 losses) and Rochester(8 losses); I'd certainly call them lesser opponents than the undefeated #1 seed, Amherst.

Tufts being #2 in their region to that same undefeated top seed could be still stronger than the #1 ranked in any other region.

Ronk - I quoted you the official NCAA data... WashU is 8-2... Tufts is 7-2 vRRO. There is no arguing that. I went through their schedules... I don't see any other regionally ranked opponents than the 10 WashU played and the 9 Tufts played. You can't make them 9-2 suddenly because two games were played in the tournament. You cannot add in the NCAA tournament opponents to the criteria. The committees don't do that. Simply because they created the bracket and thus they could manipulate the date to change the situation. So no, the teams are not 9-2 vRRO. You go by the data at the end of the regular season.

BTW, you may want to belittle Chicago and Rochester with their losses, but their SOSs were just as strong if not stronger than the Tufts (Chicago: .640; Rochester: .606). Considering unlike the NESCAC, the UAA plays a double-round-robin which naturally pulls a school's SOS towards .500 the fact their SOS numbers were just as good as Tufts says a lot about their schedules which compensates for those losses in the eyes of the committee. Chicago took undefeated #2 St. Thomas to the wire. Rochester was beaten by a similar foe in Geneseo. Those results aren't considered, but I believe it shows you a lot more about those teams than you would let on. I know you like to stir the pot and be a contrarian and I know you like to just argue with me for whatever reason (even if I said the sky was blue), but I don't think it is fair to say Chicago and Rochester are "lesser opponents" by any stretch of the imagination. And I am quite confident the committee(s) would disagree with your assertion on the topic as well.

You may not like the decision by the committee because your beloved Royals have to fly to WashU, but I don't see a problem with it. If you didn't see this coming with how the bracket was built in the first place, I can't help you. In fact, I am quite sure I alluded to the fact it was going to head to WashU from the get-go because I talked a lot about the men being kicked out of the gym the first weekend, but may return the favor the next weekend.

Furthermore, WashU was the #1 in their region and Tufts was #2 in theirs as I said. WashU has the numbers in a lot of regards even when splitting hairs. I will also add if they are looking at just the records of the teams at the end of the regular season, they aren't going to punish WashU for the lack of a conference tournament and reward Tufts for three extra games (and two wins) just because they were played. I am not saying they are disregarded, but they are going to understand the difference in the WL numbers and the fact WashU could have easily had two or three more wins in a normal conference tournament just as Tufts could have two less wins (and one less loss) thanks to not having a NESCAC tournament. No one is going to gain an unfair advantage in the eyes of the committee. They try not to discount the NESCAC's data considering the lack of a double-round-robin, so I wouldn't expect them to discount the UAA for their lack of a conference tournament.

And by the way, I don't think Tuft's is a stronger #2 than Thomas More, Trinity (Texas), or St. Thomas along with WashU (all #1s in their regions) when it comes to the data - they are all undefeated teams besides WashU, so I am not sure where Tufts would win that argument. And an argument could be made if Tufts is in a strong position criteria wise than Ohio Northern or Geneseo (who does have a much lower SOS, but plays a TON of conference games). So no, I don't think Tufts "could be still strong than the #1 ranked in any other region."

It's not the data at the end of the regular season; it was updated to include the post season conference tourney; if there going to be consistent, they'll also update it for the regional weekend also.
The committee wouldn't have seeded Amherst #1 if they didn't consider Chicago and Rochester to be lesser opponents than Amherst.
And it has nothing to do with where Scranton is playing; it benefits Scranton to play a neutral court game rather than an away game against Tufts. Just want the committee to have consistency for their future decisions. BTW, wrt to a common opponent, Scranton won @ Rochester and Wash U lost there.
Just trying to keep your brain stimulated.  ;)


Scranton isn't part of this conversation of hosts with three losses and a much lower SOS. So who cares about common opponents. They aren't in the comparison here at all.

Ronk, the data I quoted is end of the regular season. That data is what the committee is using to make their decisions for the entire season. It would be inconsistent to use the first weekend of the NCAA tournament and update the data because the committee is changing the data on purpose by bracketing. Suddenly, the top seeded teams who are playing lesser opponents are disadvantaged because of that fact. The top seeds should play lower seeded teams. But then to punish them for that advantage seems pretty ridiculous. They then lose out in criteria because they risk their SOS going down and they can't bolster their vRRO accordingly. Seriously?! Please stop pretending that is a good idea. It has been shot down by more committee chairs than I can think of. Do you think they should reseed the D1 tournament after the first weekend and maybe change where teams are headed as a result? The data these teams control is the regular season. That is the data the committee should look at... not added data that is completely out of the control of the teams.

With that fact, the fact WashU played an unranked team in the first round PROVES they were the top seed in this quadrant.

And your argument that Amherst was #1 compared to Chicago and Rochester makes NO sense. Your use of "lesser" in comparison to Tufts opponents makes it seem like Chicago and Rochester were actually 8 or 9th ranked teams in the grand scheme of things. Of course Chicago and Rochester were lower seeded teams than Amherst... who is undefeated with a solid SOS. Amherst is basically the top seed in the entire tournament (those teams usually get slotted in the upper left bracket - see Whitman on the men's side). Everyone is "lesser" than Amherst... but that doesn't mean Chicago and Rochester are lesser than Tufts.

I didn't say that Chicago and Rochester were lesser than Tufts; I said they were lesser than Amherst; the opponents Wash U lost to were lesser than the opponent that Tufts lost to. And you agree by saying that "Amherst is basically the top seed".
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jaybird44 on March 09, 2017, 06:39:49 PM
This is a circular argument that resembles a Category 1 hurricane rapidly strengthening in warm Caribbean waters to a Category 4...LOL
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 09, 2017, 06:50:38 PM
Ronk - I didn't read it the first time you said it, but I see what you meant. I apologize. That said, Tufts still lost to them twice. WashU at least split with their two. That is going to go in the favor of WashU in almost every conversation. Tufts wins one of those games against Amherst and this could be a very different conversation.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 11, 2017, 08:38:44 AM
We are going to talk about a little basketball here.  Interesting in looking at the four regional groups, that there are no ranked teams in Amhersts group.  Amherst has clear sailing to the final four, and should have no problem with Mass Dartmouth tonight.  Babson was competitive and had the game down to a 3 point game in the third quarter, and then Amherst clamped down their defense and Ali Doswell started making key baskets and it was over.  I think Tufts has a very good chance to win at Wash U tonight--if somehow they can bet Baptista to stop committing fouls.  She is so good and is such a force, but every game I watch she makes two-three very bad fouls, and is always on the bench in foul trouble.  Would love to see two NESCAC teams in the final four.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 11, 2017, 10:15:44 AM
Quote from: Maine1 on March 11, 2017, 08:38:44 AM
We are going to talk about a little basketball here.  Interesting in looking at the four regional groups, that there are no ranked teams in Amhersts group.  Amherst has clear sailing to the final four, and should have no problem with Mass Dartmouth tonight.  Babson was competitive and had the game down to a 3 point game in the third quarter, and then Amherst clamped down their defense and Ali Doswell started making key baskets and it was over.  I think Tufts has a very good chance to win at Wash U tonight--if somehow they can bet Baptista to stop committing fouls.  She is so good and is such a force, but every game I watch she makes two-three very bad fouls, and is always on the bench in foul trouble. Would love to see two NESCAC teams in the final four.

That is the strategy that suggests itself to opponents; Scranton did induce 1 early foul and Baptista accommodated with a couple more on her own, but Tufts' supporting cast played so well during her absence that it was a nonfactor last night.
  Haven't seen Wash U or St.Thomas/Whitman play yet, but have to think there's a good chance Tufts/Amherst will be the matchup for the title. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 11, 2017, 10:30:38 AM
Maine1...plus K  :).....glad someone was posting wrt games played now.
Never saw the first game with Babson, so did not know what to expect.  The key to the win by Amherst was the defensive adjustment made by Coach G.  Fouls on Babson's key player and putting a 6'1" player on her was fine....driving on her also helped in getting her in foul trouble.  Babson was stacking the inside but had to open the inside when Amherst shooters started to make their threes.
Went to the Tufts game as I was surprised to see the relative high score...for Tufts.  North was cheering on the bench with the score above 60!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 11, 2017, 10:35:03 AM
ronk....taking the opportunities to thank you the scouting rpt of talented players....the ones that Amherst HC "used" to get his FY players.  Almost all are contributing and one made ROY. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 11, 2017, 10:57:51 AM
Quote from: amh63 on March 11, 2017, 10:35:03 AM
ronk....taking the opportunities to thank you the scouting rpt of talented players....the ones that Amherst HC "used" to get his FY players.  Almost all are contributing and one made ROY. :)

Yes, I've kept my list under tighter control this year  ::), although Williams and Middlebury have PGs committed from it already.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 11, 2017, 11:04:00 AM
Quote from: ronk on March 11, 2017, 10:57:51 AM
Quote from: amh63 on March 11, 2017, 10:35:03 AM
ronk....taking the opportunities to thank you the scouting rpt of talented players....the ones that Amherst HC "used" to get his FY players.  Almost all are contributing and one made ROY. :)

Yes, I've kept my list under tighter control this year  ::), although Williams and Middlebury have PGs committed from it already.

ronk - while they aren't going to your beloved school, you have to appreciate that they at least are going to Division III programs and not elsewhere. That should at least be a satisfactory consolation prize.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 11, 2017, 11:46:14 AM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 11, 2017, 11:04:00 AM
Quote from: ronk on March 11, 2017, 10:57:51 AM
Quote from: amh63 on March 11, 2017, 10:35:03 AM
ronk....taking the opportunities to thank you the scouting rpt of talented players....the ones that Amherst HC "used" to get his FY players.  Almost all are contributing and one made ROY. :)

Yes, I've kept my list under tighter control this year  ::), although Williams and Middlebury have PGs committed from it already.

ronk - while they aren't going to your beloved school, you have to appreciate that they at least are going to Division III programs and not elsewhere. That should at least be a satisfactory consolation prize.

Yes, I could have thrown a dart blindfolded at the Women's bracket and hit some team with a former prospect - in  addition to Amherst/Tufts/ Williams/ Bowdoin/Middlebury, they were Babson, Messiah,Montclair,Ithaca,Roch Tech,SUNY-New Paltz,Geneseo, Muhlenberg,CNU,Marymount,DeSales,Catholic(generally, east of Ohio and north of Carolina) although it's easier to rationalize them choosing D!/D2 scholarship-level schools or instate state schools(lower tuition). It does give me more boxscores to follow each season.  :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jaybird44 on March 11, 2017, 10:49:49 PM
Quote from: Maine1 on March 11, 2017, 08:38:44 AM
We are going to talk about a little basketball here.  Interesting in looking at the four regional groups, that there are no ranked teams in Amhersts group.  Amherst has clear sailing to the final four, and should have no problem with Mass Dartmouth tonight.  Babson was competitive and had the game down to a 3 point game in the third quarter, and then Amherst clamped down their defense and Ali Doswell started making key baskets and it was over.  I think Tufts has a very good chance to win at Wash U tonight--if somehow they can bet Baptista to stop committing fouls.  She is so good and is such a force, but every game I watch she makes two-three very bad fouls, and is always on the bench in foul trouble.  Would love to see two NESCAC teams in the final four.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 12, 2017, 10:06:01 AM
Great job by Tufts at Wash U this weekend.  Coming out of that section with solid wins over top ranked teams.  On Friday they did it with offense. Last night it was the Tufts blueprint--incredibly tenacious defense and enough offense to win the game.  North had a huge game, dominating inside on both offense and defense.  The Tufts guards were all over on defense, creating havoc with the Wash U offense. And Barutti managed the bench expertly, effectively keeping Batista out most of the first half with two fouls, and then having her for the entire second half, when Batista came out firing and broke open what was a very close game. 
Amherst easily made it to the final four--as they had the easiest route to the finals.
We could see a rematch of Amherst and Tufts for the championship, which would be great for the NESCAC
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 12, 2017, 11:24:26 AM
The bubble burst for UMass-Dartmouth early after a 20-2 first period by Amherst.  In the second half, the subs started to enter and 11 players scored for Amherst.  It was a nice ride for UMD, their first trip to the NCAA post season.  In contrast, it was Amherst's 7th to the Final 4. 
It was nice to see four FY players on the floor at the same time and playing well...they are not really "freshmen" at this time of the year playing the tough defense and team offense insisted on by Coach GP. 
Amherst's opponent CNU in the tidewater area of Va also hosted and played well through their bracket.  Gametime on Friday will be announced this afternoon.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 13, 2017, 07:01:07 PM
The two CAC final 4 teams maybe impacted wrt travel to Michigan due to winter storms arriving late tonight.  Heavy snowfall and winds in western Ma and Boston area. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 14, 2017, 07:52:26 AM
Hopefully they'll be able to get out later on Wednesday or early Thursday.  Good luck to both teams!!!

Nice interview with Hannah Hackley on D3 Hoops podcast!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 14, 2017, 11:55:26 AM
NE Jeff Fans ....agree!  On the Hannah interview.  Listen to the interview with the Tufts HC.  A former UConn player, she concentrated on the defensive aspects of her team. 
While watching the D1 WBB selection show, I was struck by former players/commentators remarks that the key to top teams is the play of the PG.  In the wins over Babson and UMass-Dartmouth, Amherst's defense over the opponents PGs was the key.  Hannah Hackley...all 6'1" of her...is often the defensive player on the PG...to stop any outside shot, deflect any passes inside and to block the PG view.  HHackley offensive numbers may be down this year...but she is more valuable to her team on the defensive side.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 14, 2017, 03:12:21 PM
Amh63 - Agree on all points.  Liked Tufts Coach interview.  Hackley reminds me of the role Fiorentino (sp?) had on the 2011 team.  I think she was the one that GP asked to shut down the PG or outside scoring threat of other team.  Fun to watch the strategy of great basketball minds!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 14, 2017, 04:20:37 PM
The show is called Hoopsville... just sayin. ROFL

Glad you guys enjoyed the segments. We strive to have those on every show from all of our guests.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 14, 2017, 05:24:23 PM
NE Jeffs Fan.....yes your spelling is correct.  That 2011 team has brought back a number of good memories.  Went back to check the roster and schedule.  Some very interesting "connections" to this year's team.  Of course, that team won the National Title in The Midwest!
First, Amherst's present SR PG, J. Renner, older sister was on the 2011 team playing as a forward at 6".
The opponent in the semi-final game was CNU.  The title win was over Wash. Un.
In the Sectionals in 2011, Amherst won over Babson to get to the Final 4.
Hoping for an uneventful trip to Calvin for the Amherst Team.   Also hoping for the team to return with another title :).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 17, 2017, 07:11:37 PM
Great comeback win for Tufts--they looked like there were done, down 9 with about 5 minutes to go, but some huge steals and baskets by Baptista brought them back, including a three followed by a steal and layup to tie the game at 55, and then a huge 3 by one of the guards. Great finish and congratulations to Tufts. Lets see if Amherst can meet them in the final
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 17, 2017, 08:22:30 PM
 It's amazing how Baptista can disappear for minutes at a time, then reappear with great plays, offensively and defensively.
This was a great game. Langer was very impressive for St. Thomas.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 18, 2017, 06:48:16 AM
Amherst was very impressive in their win over CN.  Shooting was off, but great defense.  One more time with Tufts and Amherst--I still think it comes down to whether Baptista can make some plays and stay in the game.  She is the most talented player on the floor.  Expect another very tight game.  Great that there are two NESCAC teams in the finals.  Tufts has really had to win some games against top opponents to get to this point. Amherst has had a bit of a cake-walk.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: OldCardinal on March 18, 2017, 01:00:43 PM
Great showing by Amherst.  Amazing comeback by Tufts.  Here we go again.  Baptiste is a key for sure but Tufts will need someone else to hit a few outside shots too.  Should be another great match up. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: remsleep on March 18, 2017, 09:25:33 PM
Well.....congrats to Amherst.  Let's be honest, that was not a great game to promote women's basketball....excruciating to watch
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 18, 2017, 09:44:54 PM
Someone wrote somewhere about the battle between Tufts and Amherst...paraphrasing a bit here..."first team to reach 40 points, wins".  Well Amherst did that by the end of the 3rd quarter!
Not much more to say here at this time :).
Have to make a correction.....Amherst reached 40 mid way in the last period.  OK since it was a double digit lead over Tufts at the time.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 18, 2017, 09:46:44 PM
Have to agree--I understand that both teams play great defense, but other than Ali Doswell, I didn't see anyone that could consistently shoot the ball. Most of the Tufts team seemed like they didn't want to shoot. 
None the less-a great season for Amherst-33-0 and rarely challenged. The disturbing thing is that this Amherst team isn't even close to the 2009-2010-2011 teams, that had 6-8 players that could shoot, score, and those teams had much tougher games.  It would seem the overall level of D3 has come down a bit
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: oldknight on March 18, 2017, 09:53:54 PM
Quote from: Maine1 on March 18, 2017, 09:46:44 PM
Have to agree--I understand that both teams play great defense, but other than Ali Doswell, I didn't see anyone that could consistently shoot the ball. Most of the Tufts team seemed like they didn't want to shoot. 
None the less-a great season for Amherst-33-0 and rarely challenged. The disturbing thing is that this Amherst team isn't even close to the 2009-2010-2011 teams, that had 6-8 players that could shoot, score, and those teams had much tougher games.  It would seem the overall level of D3 has come down a bit

Since I had a free evening I went to VNA to watch tonight's final. While it was an extraordinarily low scoring affair, both teams played terrific defense. In the end, Amherst's length and athleticism--particularly on the perimeter--really bothered their opponent and proved too much for Tufts. When you play a defensive team as good as Amherst you better make the few open looks you get and the Jumbos couldn't do that. I do agree these teams do not appear to be as good on the offensive side as the George Fox/Thomas More teams I saw play in the recent past, though Ali Doswell is a terrific point guard who really knows how to run the show.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: JEFFFAN on March 18, 2017, 10:21:31 PM

Not sure that some of these comments are fair to the extraordinary athleticism of the Amherst team. They have played nasty defense all season, including tonight in the first half. They might not have the offensive firepower of prior winners but they play serious team defense.

Kudos to 33-0!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on March 18, 2017, 11:06:00 PM
Congrats to both Amherst & Tufts for truly being the class of DIII.

With no horse in this race (Scranton eliminated earlier by Tufts...again), I was just interested in viewing a great game.

However, although I have never criticized officials before, I have to say this was the absolute worst officiated game I've seen all year & the fact that this was the National Championship game makes it even worse.

How the NCAA came up with these three is truly hard to fathom. Phantom calls, incorrect calls, constantly checking replays...horrible.

Beyond that...remarkable run by Tufts & what coach Gromacki has done is beyond belief.

Congrats to both teams, their coaches, the moms & dads & all their fans.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ECSUalum on March 19, 2017, 09:10:43 AM
Great Job and Congratulations to the Lady Jeffs for a dominating final and 2017 season!!  Take some time to rest  ;)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 19, 2017, 10:01:02 AM
Final comments on the NESCAC season and the finals.
What a great accomplishment for Tufts--four final fours in four seasons. What an accomplishment for that senior class. I know they are disappointed with last nights loss, but they will look back on their careers with pride, knowing that got as far as they could go each year.  Coach Berutti has built a great program, and when you lose three times to the same team, you have to tip your hat to the better team.  I am sure Tufts will be back again battling Amherst.
As far as Amherst goes--33-0 in any league is a great accomplishment.  What a terrific season.  Gromacki continues to churn out power house after power house, and gets the most out of his players.  He is one of the best coaches in the college game right now.
The rest of the NESCAC has to up their game and start to challenge Tufts and Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ECSUalum on March 19, 2017, 02:03:12 PM
Quote from: Maine1 on March 19, 2017, 10:01:02 AM
Final comments on the NESCAC season and the finals.
What a great accomplishment for Tufts--four final fours in four seasons. What an accomplishment for that senior class. I know they are disappointed with last nights loss, but they will look back on their careers with pride, knowing that got as far as they could go each year.  Coach Berutti has built a great program, and when you lose three times to the same team, you have to tip your hat to the better team.  I am sure Tufts will be back again battling Amherst.
As far as Amherst goes--33-0 in any league is a great accomplishment.  What a terrific season.  Gromacki continues to churn out power house after power house, and gets the most out of his players.  He is one of the best coaches in the college game right now.
The rest of the NESCAC has to up their game and start to challenge Tufts and Amherst.

The UCONN of Div-III women's basketball!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ECSUalum on March 19, 2017, 02:12:02 PM
Quote from: JEFFFAN on March 18, 2017, 10:21:31 PM

Not sure that some of these comments are fair to the extraordinary athleticism of the Amherst team. They have played nasty defense all season, including tonight in the first half. They might not have the offensive firepower of prior winners but they play serious team defense.

Kudos to 33-0!!
I like to call it stifling defense!!  You could see Tufts getting more and more frustrated as the game progressed!  This is what outstanding defense does to a team!  We saw it first hand at ECSU!!! When you cannot score, it is demoralizing!!  They may not have the best O but if the other team cannot score, they have THE #1 D!! After all it got them 33-0 and another National Championship!  The UCONN of D-111!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 19, 2017, 02:12:51 PM
For anyone who may have missed the game, the Amherst web site on the WBB corner, there is a NCAA video replay of the game.
Apparently the game set a record.....lowest total points in a national title game.
For those that like style and more offense....or last second winning shots, etc....it is a defensive game that gets remember,imo.  Defense takes hard work and dedication as well as stamina and for winners, a will to win. 
How many NFL title games are low scoring games in harsh conditions with key defensive stops being highlighted. 
Heck, have a classmate...retired prof. in the Chicago area....that remembers the GREAT Packer games in freezing conditions in the snow while growing up....fond memories for him.  Cannot remember the scores now :).
Just a little opinionated perspective here. 
Expect both Tufts and Amherst to be in the conference title run next season!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 19, 2017, 02:34:37 PM
Thanks ECSUalum!  plus K. 
The UConn reference is interesting.  The HBC of UConn WBB sent a note to the Amherst team when they broke UConn's home winning  record.  Tufts was the team that stopped the run....an one pt. win for the Jumbos. 
Most posters are aware that the Jumbos HBC played at UConn.  She was gracious in her remarks after the game....but she was getting frustrated as seen by her actions with her players...questioning their play on the floor and avoiding some as they came off the floor, imo.  She even got a technical.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ECSUalum on March 19, 2017, 02:43:24 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 19, 2017, 02:34:37 PM
Thanks ECSUalum!  plus K. 
The UConn reference is interesting.  The HBC of UConn WBB sent a note to the Amherst team when they broke UConn's home winning  record.  Tufts was the team that stopped the run....an one pt. win for the Jumbos. 
Most posters are aware that the Jumbos HBC played at UConn.  She was gracious in her remarks after the game....but she was getting fustrated as seen by her actions with her players...questioning their play on the floor and avoiding some as they came off the floor, imo.  She even got a techmical! 
However, do expect both Tufts and Amherst to be battling gor the conference title next season.
Thanks, amh63
To me, there is nothing like good pure defense!  I have always been a fan of Princeton basketball because of their historic emphasis on the defensive aspect to the game!  Coach Geitner at Eastern emphasizes it as well.  If Keene St could develop a consistently good D they would win the Conference every year with this years team! They only seem to play good D vs Eastern and during the post season ;)
WRT UCONN women's basketball, Auriemma pretty much can sit back and watch the best women HS players in the country show up on his doorstep!  All he does is filter based on the women who can play, or who are able to be coached to play his style of basketball, the position players he needs and at the same time can be excellent students! (I really think Coach A really wants good students because in most cases they make excellent UCONN players).  BTW, UConn and Amherst have similar 30 pt PF/PA differentials!   If the Lady Jeffs coach can start rebooting every year with players of the caliber of this years team, he can really have a D-III "UCONN" dynasty if you will.  However, I dare say Amherst academics may "get in the way" of doing this, but I may be wrong!! What say you? 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: OldCardinal on March 19, 2017, 02:53:35 PM
Congrats to Amherst on an amazing season and well deserved NCAA title.  Ali Doswell was the real difference maker this year IMO - certainly in all three games against Tufts.  Gromacki is a great coach - no doubt about that,  But, so is Berube.  Don't forget, Tufts won the last three (before this year) NESCAC regular season titles and went to the final four four times in a row.  Both teams will be back next year for sure, and Bowdoin will be nipping at their heels.  They are a terrific program as well.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 19, 2017, 02:56:55 PM
I said final--but just thought I would add that I agree the defenses were great--and Amherst and Tufts have been outstanding defensive teams for a number of years now--But even the most ardent fans of both schools have to admit that both offenses were not good--missed open looks, not able to get shots, etc.  Yes, the defense has a lot to do with that-but 6 points in one half-that is also a lot of bad offense.
I think Berube's technical was pure frustration, and some questionable officiating--the foul on the box out was just terrible
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 20, 2017, 12:37:55 PM
It probably doesn't matter... but I have always referenced WashU as being the UConn of DIII WBB... considering they won three-straight titles and 80+ or so games. That said, you could argue they were Tennessee and Amherst is now UConn. Of course, Thomas More (technically) winning two straight and Tufts being to four straight final fours makes the reference rather complicated. That said, Amherst has certainly done some amazing things under GP Gromacki.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 20, 2017, 12:48:17 PM
Carla Berube has a couple kids from Connecticut coming in for next year.

One, Amanda Towney from Bethel is about a 5"10, 5"11 kid that can space the floor on defense, take the outside shot and is a great interior defender.
Emily Briggs from Canton is a lights out scorer, and is a 2 time state champion, so hopefully she can continue the Jumbo's winning ways, and hopefully maybe next year actually put the ball in the baskets.

Gabby Martin from Hand high school, going to Williams, is one of the best defenders in the state of Connecticut.  Will be following their progress for the next 4 years, and good luck ladies!

Also, watch out for Sami Ashton at Conn College next year.  She didn't do as much this past year as I thought she would, but she was a terrific player at the high school level, and I think she will get going next year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 20, 2017, 01:00:07 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 19, 2017, 02:12:51 PM
For anyone who may have missed the game, the Amherst web site on the WBB corner, there is a NCAA video replay of the game.
Apparently the game set a record.....lowest total points in a national title game.

Indeed -- should read our coverage.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on June 05, 2017, 10:43:25 PM
Congratulations to a former Eph on being named head coach at TCNJ. As Pat noted, this should make for interesting staff meetings since the Lions' head men's coach Matt Goldsmith is an Amherst alum.

http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2017/06/tcnj-jackson-hire
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: hoya73 on June 07, 2017, 01:16:38 PM
Coach Goldsmith was a part of the selection process and is a big supporter of the new Coach.  Don't tell anyone, but even with the rivalry there is a bonding and admiration thing between the schools, until the games start.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on June 08, 2017, 02:49:41 PM
Hoya73:

Yeah, that's always been my impression -- beneath the rivalry is a shared respect and often long relationships among alumni and their families. A bunch of years ago I went to the Williams/Amherst football game and the Cortland/Ithaca football game within a short period of time of each other. The NESCAC rivalry had an air of congeniality to it  -- almost as close as sibling or cousin rivalry-- while there was perceptible tension between Cortland and Ithaca.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on June 10, 2017, 11:09:42 AM
Hoya73, gordonmann.....agreed with your thoughts wrt to Amherst vs Williams fans in general.
Nice to read that the Amherst team will be in Las Vegas this Winter.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on October 31, 2017, 09:28:47 AM
Awfully quiet in here, but here's hoping we can get things going again with this post...

Tufts narrowly tops CNU and Amherst for the top spot in the D3hoops.com Top 25: http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/women/2017-18/preseason
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on November 01, 2017, 02:16:44 AM
I checked a couple of days ago to see if the Tufts roster was out yet.  Unfortunately it wasn't, so don't know what they have this year (I know Michaela North was a senior, but that's about it) but they are going to be loaded in 2 or 3 years.  Carla Berube has done a great job of getting kids from Connecticut.  I'd still pick Amherst to win the league, mainly due to the fact the NESCAC game is at LeFrak, but it'll be a close race.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 01, 2017, 04:17:51 PM
Last season. Amherst and Tufts met three times...the last one for the National Title on a neutral court.  The third time it was a blowout by Amherst after two close games in the conference.  Both teams lost three players.  North, the key one for Tufts in the front court and a key defensive guard in the backcourt.  Amherst lost the Doswell twins and the senior point guard.  Of course, one Doswell was the POY.
Having said that, Amherst brings only one player in this season.  It is rumored that there will be four talented players coming in the following year.  There are talented big front court players returning...two starters...and depth.  In the backcourt there are two point guards that won praise in the NCAA games and the rookie of the Year at a swing position.
Lots of talented, experienced wing players that can score inside and outside.   Amherst HC likes to play a fast tempo game with players that have speed and quickness and can play defense.  Imo, this season, the returning team should make another run for the Nescac title and a place in the Final Four...in Salem.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on November 01, 2017, 04:34:57 PM
Quote from: amh63 on November 01, 2017, 04:17:51 PM
Last season. Amherst and Tufts met three times...the last one for the National Title on a neutral court.  The third time it was a blowout by Amherst after two close games in the conference.  Both teams lost three players.  North, the key one for Tufts in the front court and a key defensive guard in the backcourt.  Amherst lost the Doswell twins and the senior point guard.  Of course, one Doswell was the POY.
Having said that, Amherst brings only one player in this season.  It is rumored that there will be four talented players coming in the following year.  There are talented big front court players returning...two starters...and depth.  In the backcourt there are two point guards that won praise in the NCAA games and the rookie of the Year at a swing position.
Lots of talented, experienced wing players that can score inside and outside.   Amherst HC likes to play a fast tempo game with players that have speed and quickness and can play defense.  Imo, this season, the returning team should make another run for the Nescac title and a place in the Final Four...in Salem.
Don't think it's Salem. They should have another battle with Tufts for the NESCAC crown.
Saw the Amherst HC at a couple of summer AAU tourneys. One day, he was wearing his well-earned NCAA championship t-shirt with undefeated season. Unlike the previous summer, I didn't converse with him, so I don't know who the frosh newcomer is, yet. Or, the four 2018s, either. Did email him a few days ago about a 2018 holiday tourney opening; if anything materializes, I'll let you know.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 01, 2017, 07:44:08 PM
Ronk....thanks for the info.  I am aware of the FY player.....sister of a player on the team  from Ma.  She was noted in the stands in the Title Game by a NCAA announcer.  Also saw her in a brief Captain's game over Homecoming...big guard.  Anyway, she will be listed soon enough since formal practice...with coaches happened Nov.1.  Fifteen formal practice days.
The WBB team that won the Title was honored at halftime of Homecoming football game.  Received their " rings"...pixs on the Amherst athletic website.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on November 01, 2017, 09:35:49 PM
Yeah... WBB is a year away from Salem. They will be there in 2019 and then again in 2021 (though at the Cregger Center at Roanoke College, not the Salem Civic Center). This season is in Rochester, Minnesota.

More info moving forward found here: http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2017/04/women-championship-on-the-move
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on November 16, 2017, 05:20:57 PM
The Division III basketball season has begun and tonight Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) will hit the air for its 15th season!

In tonight's season premiere, Dave McHugh chats with the two preseason No. 1 teams, both national committee chairs, and gets an update on a new tournament featuring several Top 25 teams. Dave will also try and get everyone up to speed on the new season and take a look at what has already happened in early season games.

One thing fans may notice is no video for this season's debut. This is not a change in the production of the show, just a temporary decision. There has been a lot going on leading up to the premiere and not everything got up to speed in time. We hope to have actual video broadcasts return in short order. We appreciate everyone's patience.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch the show LIVE staring at 7:00 p.m. ET here: http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2017-18/nov16 --- or via the Facebook Live (http://www.facebook.com/Hoopsville) simulcast. If you missed any part of the show, you can watch it On Demand or listen to the podcast.

You can also send your questions to the show and have them featured on the Hoopsville Mailbag segment. Email them to hoopsville@d3hoops.com.

Guests include (in order of appearance):
- Bobbi Morgan, Haverford women's coach and DIII National Basketball Committee Chair
- Tim Pitzpatrick, U.S. Coast Guard Academy Athletics Director and DIII National Basketball Committee Chair
- Eric Bridgeland, No. 1 Whitman men's coach
- Carla Berube, No. 1 Tufts women's coach
- Ryan Whitnabe, Great Lakes podcaster and Great Lakes Invitational creator

You can also tune into the podcast(s) after the show has aired:
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville
iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/hoopsville/id1059517087

Don't forget you can always interact with us:
Website: www.d3hoopsville.com
Twitter: @d3hoopsville (http://www.twitter.com/d3hoopsville) or #Hoopsville
Facebook: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville
Email: hoopsville@d3hoops.com
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/d3hoopsville
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on November 30, 2017, 04:20:09 PM
While admitting that I'm as guilty as anyone, how can this board still be silent 5 games into the season?  Are Nescac women's basketball fans so jaded that it takes the postseason to pique interest enough to post?   Tufts, Amherst and Bowdoin are Top 25 quintets as usual.  Tufts and Amherst rank #1 and #3 respectively.  Williams and ConnColl are included among those also receiving votes.  At 5-0, Middlebury is clearly better than they were as last season's #4 seed. 

Speaking of the Panthers, they dominated the 4th quarter last evening by a 29-18 margin to erase a point point deficit and defeat Rensselaer 64-54.  Playing without the services of Catherine Harrison who leads the team in rebounds, the door was open for a breakout performance by sophomore F Betsy Knox whose 23 points and 9 boards were team highs.  Floor general Alex Huffman put up 13 to go with 6 boards, 3 assists, 2 steals and a blocked shot.  Maya Davis had 8 points and 8 rebounds while Sabrina Weeks had 10 tallies, 4 boards and 5 blocks.  Besides Harrison,  Colleen Caveney, Sarah Kaufman and Lily Kuntz have all been among the team leaders in stats at some point in the young season, and Kira Waldman's production has been consistent  as well.  This team is deep in talent, steadily improving and fun to watch.

Rensselaer isn't short on talent either.  LaKissa Martin's 19 points led the visitors while Elisabeth Erkhardt added 15 of her own.  Kate Goodall's 12 rebounds were tops for both teams and four other Engineers gave solid contributions.  Each offense ran hot and cold.  Neither shot better than 33% from the field nor 31% from behind the arc.  Both were solid from the line, however, going a combined 29-32.  Some of the men's quintets should try emulating that statistic. 

It's been explained to me that the Nescac's scheduling policy of their men's and women's teams no longer traveling together, thereby making it impossible to watch both play on the same night 80% of the time, is both a cost saving move and one favored by the women's teams themselves.  Considering the endowments of most conference institutions that first argument makes one want to break out the violins. :'( ::)  As for it being in the best interests of the teams it's reported that 117 people attended Wednesday evening's contest in Pepin.  If that's true, 100 of them sat in the stands on the always least populated side of the arena.  This team, as well most others in the conference I expect, deserve a stronger following.



Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 30, 2017, 05:21:31 PM
Vandy74...well put, as usual.  The info wrt to the women's teams prefer to not travel with the men's team is quite questionable.  Spoke to the Doswell twins mother at a sports function recently.  She misses going to games when both teams play on the same night.  Many other fans like me enjoy the bigger crowds, etc. Each team has their own set of fans beside family members, etc but are supportive of the other teams.  I do not believe it should be a money thing.  More likely a coaches preference wrt to scheduling, IMO. 

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on November 30, 2017, 05:31:22 PM
Landmark plays Wed and Sat; Wed are single games in both teams' gyms; these are the 3 closest opponents in terms of travel distance and time away from school. Sat games are doubleheaders(4 most distant opponents) and the women and men travel on the same bus(at least, in Scranton's case). Seems to be a reasonable compromise to the question.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on November 30, 2017, 05:53:23 PM





Ronk:

Perhaps things have changed recently, but I know that for many years the Scranton men & women traveled in different busses to the same location.

They actually even used two different companies.

The games are far better when they are doubleheaders...especially at Scranton where the crowd for the women's game will usually stay for the first half on the mens game.

Usually.









Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on November 30, 2017, 07:42:43 PM
Quote from: amh63 on November 30, 2017, 05:21:31 PM
Vandy74...well put, as usual.  The info wrt to the women's teams prefer to not travel with the men's team is quite questionable.  Spoke to the Doswell twins mother at a sports function recently.  She misses going to games when both teams play on the same night.  Many other fans like me enjoy the bigger crowds, etc. Each team has their own set of fans beside family members, etc but are supportive of the other teams.  I do not believe it should be a money thing.  More likely a coaches preference wrt to scheduling, IMO.

Amh63, I reported what my sister-in-law has told me on more than one occasion.  She's only as connected with what is going on inside the MC athletic world as she cares to be these days, but she was sayinging the same thing four years ago when you and I first questioned the logic behind the scheduling change.  To some extent I may be privy only to how Middlebury views certain matters, but even then she told me the changes had been in the planning stage for quite some time .  Among the complaints she mentioned was the fact both teams shared the same bus on road trips, hardly a team unifying experience.  Did Amherst provide two vehicles, do you know?  Another concern might not have been as big a problem at Amherst where both teams have been highly ranked for a number of years, but very few people attended the Panther women's games.  When they were played at 6:00 pm it was too early.  Somewhere during the second half people would begin showing up to watch the men's game.  The fact they usually saw a losing Middlebury team on the court hardly lent itself to increased interest in the women's team.  In seasons when the men's game was played first, few stayed to watch the women.  As just stated, Middlebury women's basketball wasn't a very saleable product at the time.  It's ironic that the scheduling change took place exactly when a new HC was hired.  As she begins her fourth season at the helm, KJ Krasco and her assistant Jessica Turner have completely turned the program around.  It's difficult to believe that now, were the women's games still paired with the men's, they would fail to attract a larger audience.  As a stand alone event, it hasn't happened.  Only veteran fans are in much of a position to know how much better the team has become.  With four regional high schools' as well as MC's sports to report on, the local bi-weekly does it's best, but there are many times when even the nationally ranked men's team can receive only token coverage.  Another factor is that with the improvements in live streaming, and the fact that the  games are played at the same time, fans who would watch the women play but are essentially fans of the men's game, are more inclined to view the latter even when it's on the road.

On January 9th, when Castleton comes to town, it will be interesting to see if their fans outnumber Middlebury's by the four to one ratio they did two years ago.  The schools are only 30 miles apart.  The Panther men don't play that evening. 

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on December 01, 2017, 08:23:08 AM
Congratulations to Amherst coach GP Gromacki on achieving 300 career coaching wins.

Last night, Eastern Connecticut scored more than 50 pts on the Amherst defense, becoming the first New England team to do so since Babson on Nov. 20th last season.  Only 5 teams were able to score more than 50 pts on Amherst last season-- Babson, Randolph-Macon, Chapman, Mary Washington, and Christopher Newport.  3 of those teams did it before January, the other two in the NCAA tournament.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 01, 2017, 10:33:55 AM
deiscanton.....beat me to the news wrt Amherst's HC 300th win at Amherst!
Yes the Lady Warriors did a nice job blocking out and hitting their shots.  It must be pointed out that ECSU was ahead 2-0 before Amherst took the floor!  Twice the lady on the floor announcer just stated the technical foul call was due to "uniform apparel".  Really strange!  HC G did not even seem to be concerned.  As the the on floor announcer related, Coach G wanted more RBs and execution of the defense in the second half.  One of the returning injured players played well in her 2nd half appearance.  A starter remains out.  See that the younger players getting more time are working on their outside shots.  The two PG lineup is interesting and effective.  Both fine defensive players.  PG Fox now left open to score outside and go to the boards more.  Quite an efficient scorer and a great talent.  There are at least three players that are multi sport student athletes
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on December 01, 2017, 11:13:58 AM
Forgot some trivia comments.
First.....thanks Vandy74 for the info. 
ECSU on its website shows off its Team Bus...only One?
I have a personal type connection to ECSU..minor one.  The Prez of ECSU is married to a classmate of mine.  Met her at a reunion gathering.  Her husband has been connected with NE/Ma. higher edu for quite some time.  He was Prez of UMass- Boston, then Northeastern Un. And then was head of the Mass. public college system for a time. 
The Lady Mammouths...hope I spelled the new mascot correctly....has a busy diverging schedule from the men' s team.  They will be at the D3 hoops tourney in Las Vegas, and again be on a  West Coast tour again.  Me thinks that such out of conference games helps with recruiting a bit. :)
Last comment.  The game last season at Randolph-Macon was in part because of the Doswell-twins, now alums.  Their private school in Richmond sent a very large contingent of fans to the game. The game was played just down the road from the town of Doswell, Va.  The game was Never in doubt.
It must be pointed out that how well the team plays in the post season is most important.  Amherst played Tufts three Times last season.  Two close wins and a blowout in the Title game when Amherst really put a defensive clampdown on the Jumbos...presently ranked No. 1 by D3hoops.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on December 01, 2017, 01:51:47 PM
Any insight on Bowdoin?

I expected them to be good, but not this good.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PolarBearPA on December 01, 2017, 02:33:02 PM
Quote from: gordonmann on December 01, 2017, 01:51:47 PM
Any insight on Bowdoin?

I expected them to be good, but not this good.

Pretty deep team. Press entire game and if they are shooting the long ball well (Petit, Kelly, Choate, Kerrigan) they are tough to beat. Biggest question mark is defending the post - although they did a fine job against UMass Dartmouth inside players with 6'2" Stewart and 5'11" Hasson inside. Team needs to keep improving and not plateau after this hot start... but they should be in the mix with Amherst and Tufts.

Coach Shibles was interviewed in the latest Hoopsville podcast and worth a listen.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on December 01, 2017, 03:35:56 PM
Thanks.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on December 01, 2017, 07:51:16 PM
 Bowdoin's Kate Kerrigan impressed me during her last AAU season against D1-level opposition. She had an intuitive sense for making plays, not common at that level. Haven't seen her play for Bowdoin yet, but have been following her in the boxscores. Sam Roy is a good shooting guard. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PolarBearPA on December 04, 2017, 06:42:12 AM
Quote from: ronk on December 01, 2017, 07:51:16 PM
Bowdoin's Kate Kerrigan impressed me during her last AAU season against D1-level opposition. She had an intuitive sense for making plays, not common at that level. Haven't seen her play for Bowdoin yet, but have been following her in the boxscores. Sam Roy is a good shooting guard.

Kate is a great player. She is leading the team in assists, steals and rebounds (from the guard spot) and second in scoring. Hard to believe she is a senior already.

One more source of info on Bowdoin for those interested. Focuses on the "Maine Connection" to the program but will give you a good overview of the player mix to date.

http://www.pressherald.com/2017/12/03/bowdoins-success-in-womens-basketball-is-helped-by-mainers/ (http://www.pressherald.com/2017/12/03/bowdoins-success-in-womens-basketball-is-helped-by-mainers/)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on December 28, 2017, 04:34:16 PM
Nice win for Amherst in Las Vegas.  Slow start, but turned on the pressure, rebounding and shooting when they realized that UCSC came to play.  Looking forward to the game tomorrow with #6 Trine.  Will be good experience for upcoming NESCAC play.  The announcers were talking about how deep the NESCAC is this year.  Very few easy games once league play starts.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 01, 2018, 01:17:34 PM
Surprised at how quiet this board is with all the Holiday games.  Good win for Amherst over Trine.  Nice test for the team before NESCAC action starts, especially missing the Doswell twins and all their scoring and leadership.  One more game in California.  Quite a trip for the team!!!  Hope to hear from others as league play starts.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 01, 2018, 02:21:38 PM
NE Jeff's Fan...Amherst has a game at 5PM tonight with Redlands at Chapman in Southern Cal.
Nice to hear from you... and following the Lady Mommouths!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 01, 2018, 04:23:51 PM
Saw that, and another game today against Redlands.  Big time travel for the team.  Is your spelling of Mammoths in jest or just a typo?  I wasn't going to change my D3Hoops account just to reflect the Amherst mascot change.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 01, 2018, 08:49:33 PM
NE Jeff's Fan....a mistake.  Computerr acting up and software wants to spell for me :'(
Actually, a number of older Amherst posters kept Jeffs in their "handle".   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 02, 2018, 01:37:48 PM
Amherst returns home with a short bench shorter.  Sullivan, the elder one comes into the game and makes two threes and goes down with an injury soon after.  Appeared to me on the same leg that ended her season last season.  Hoping for the best.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 02, 2018, 05:01:17 PM
 I thought the 4 players I contributed to Amherst's roster last year would be enough. ::)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on January 02, 2018, 08:23:08 PM
Amherst back atop the rankings

http://d3hoops.com/top25/women/2017-18/week5
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 03, 2018, 12:48:21 PM
ronk...yelp, they are good ones!
Amherst brought in only one player this year...from nearby Granby, Ma......Sullivan's little sister.
Maybe you need to open your "book" again :).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PolarBearPA on January 07, 2018, 06:23:47 AM
Bowdoin takes Round 1 vs Tufts. Both teams played extremely hard - great women's basketball atmosphere at Morrell. Got a few to play but Bowdoin at Amherst looms large Jan 27.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 07, 2018, 08:29:27 AM
Nice to be starting another NESCAC season.  Looks like a three team league, with Amherst/Bowdoin/Tufts.  The other teams just do not appear to have the talent to compete with these three.  It looked like the officials had a big say in the Tufts/Bowdoin game,with Tufts best player, Battista, having to sit out most of the game with fouls (played 10 minutes). I didn't see all of that game, but clearly the last foul on here was a terrible call.  But Bowdoin does look like a strong, balanced team, with exceptionally quick guards who really harass the ball.  I am sure Amherst is strong as usual.  Watching Colby versus Bates yesterday, it was clear that those teams aren't even close to the level of Bowdoin and Tufts (and that was also clear from the previous nights games).  So it will be a battle for the four through 8 spots for the NESCAC tournament-off the start Middlebury had a good weekend with wins over Conn College and Wesleyan.  We will get a good look at them next weeekend when they play Tufts
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PolarBearPA on January 23, 2018, 06:45:34 AM
Hard to believe only 3 NESCAC weekends left! Bowdoin at Amherst this Saturday and Tufts and Amherst the following Friday will settle out the home court for the NESCAC playoffs. Maddie Bledsoe had an impressive weekend for Wesleyan averaging 14 pts and 15 rebs grabbing POTW honors. Will be an exciting home stretch.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 24, 2018, 03:08:52 PM
Should be a BIG game at Amherst this weekend with Bowdoin.  Any predictions from those that have seen both teams in person?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 24, 2018, 03:34:16 PM
Woke me up NE Jeff's Fan!   Just kidding.  Bowdoin has a deep bench and Amherst has a short one.  Amherst scores just enough to win and Bowdoin has passed 100 pts.  Amherst has taller players, etc, etc.
The key in the game will be match ups and DEFENSE.  Believe Amherst has the players to hold down the Bowdoin top/ key scorers and win the rebound battles.  If Amherst's outside scorers can hit their shots, believe a close game will become a big win.  There, an optimistic prediction...with crossed figures ;).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: truenorth on January 25, 2018, 07:47:22 AM
amh63, when you say a "big win" for Amherst, do you mean a meaningful victory in a close game, or a win by a large margin?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 25, 2018, 11:44:14 AM
truenorth....though I want a win against a solid ranked team....my phrasing meant a win by a large margin. 
This season, Amherst has won by large margins and is quite capable to continue to do so.  However, injuries have hurt their "outside" scoring....a bit.  Starters do need rests and fouls also will shorten the bench further.  Amherst very rarely reaches scores close to 100 pts.  Defense requires a lot of energy.
Amherst scores a great deal off their defense and rebounds and runs after steals, blocks, etc.
It is reported that Bowdoin's win over Tufts was due in part to the fouls on their top player that limited her time on the floor...to ten min., I recall. 
I recall in the Nat. Title win over Tufts last year, that same player was pulled by her coach due to her poor play, IMO. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: truenorth on January 26, 2018, 08:30:03 AM
Although this game is being played at Amherst, I think you'll find the Polar Bears to be a deep and competitive team.  I'd be surprised if Amherst pulls away to an easy win by a large margin...  Time will obviously tell...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 26, 2018, 12:34:05 PM
truenorth.....you asked and I responded.  No where did I imply that a game between ranked teams would be easy.  A big win does not imply a big margin and discounts a competitive game.  You must understand that a game with a team that pride itself on its defense will often reduce the opponents attempts to make baskets...leading to lower scores and likewise smaller margins. 
Case in point were the games with Tufts last season.  First two were won by Amherst by less than 3 points in LOW scoring games.  The Title game win was another low scoring affair....only the margin was much larger.
Your perspective maybe, IMO, be impacted by Bowdoin's wins that tend to be high scoring wins.
I take a win whether it be in LeFrak or in Maine.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 26, 2018, 09:05:22 PM
Good points, amh63.  Could they have been looking ahead tonight.  Hope they are ready for tomorrow.  They had a tough game while Bowdoin romped, but Bowdoin does have the long trip from Hamilton to Amherst.  Will be tuned in tomorrow.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 27, 2018, 11:44:11 AM
NE Jeff's Fan.....possibly, but Colby played a competitive game am must be given credit for it.  The second semester is here and the players maybe somewhat distracted a bit.  I notice that a usual starter did not have much floor time....she has had a number of low stat games recently.  Good news is the return of a often starter to the floor...Sullivan.  Been out awhile due to an injury. 
The game was tight for quite awhile but Amherst upped its defense in the second half with great play by Nagle.  Colby has several tall front court players and a coach that knows the Amherst's HC well.  She was a former assistant for him at Amherst and played for him at St. Lawrence.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 27, 2018, 01:50:05 PM
We will see shortly, but based on what I have seen of Bowdoin this year, they are a very deep team with a lot of quickness. They may beat Amherst today.  Colby is not a strong team, and they played Amherst very tough last night.  Will be a good game
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 27, 2018, 03:02:20 PM
Anyone else not able to get on the Amherst website to stream video?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on January 27, 2018, 03:08:56 PM
Video streaming seems to be still down in Amherst at the moment-- follow game on live stats for time being.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 27, 2018, 03:12:38 PM
That's what we're stuck with.  Tweet from NSN is their server is down so all NESCAC games are affected.  They say will be fixed soon....Hopefully!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 27, 2018, 05:17:48 PM
Yes, all nsn games were at least 10-15 minutes late.
The LJs won by 4... 49-45!  It was a battle of two top scoring defenses...Amherst no.1 in the nation and Bowdoin no.3!.  Amherst averages about 69 pts per game and Bowdoin about 82 pts/ game.   Other stats were close.  Low TOS by both and not much different in RBs.  Amherst just shot better from outside and down low. 
Still tough games ahead for Amherst...to get to host the CAC tourney.  Both teams should make the post season tourney. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 28, 2018, 06:07:03 AM
Tough loss for Bowdoin-they had the chances and had open looks at the end. Just could not make enough shots.  These teams will play at least once more as they are the class of the NESCAC (Tufts is not as strong as these two and Amherst should win that game next week).  Most likely Amherst will get the home court for the NESCAC championship, and I think that home court advantage was the difference yesterday. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 28, 2018, 08:10:46 AM
Maine1....your comments are solid ones.  Yes, the Polarbears did take more shots and missed more.
Interesting to me is that there were few fouls called on both teams.  Rebounds were close and both teams scored inside well.  Bowdoin seemed to be led by the play of one player...a fine one....in points, rebounds and assists.  Amherst's center had the most assists and it's prime PG had the most rebounds.  Two players tied for scoring leader.
Bowdoin did make Amherst "uncomfortable" by their press.  The announcer mentioned that this was one of the aims of the Polarbear's HC.  Having seen it once, it will be less effective next time, IMO.
Hope you saw the whole game.  I did!  Late last night, the entire NSN video...even early practices was available online.  Guess NSN was making up for there major broadcast failure throughout the conference?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 28, 2018, 09:59:13 AM
Quote from: amh63 on January 28, 2018, 08:10:46 AM
Maine1....your comments are solid ones.  Yes, the Polarbears did take more shots and missed more.
Interesting to me is that there were few fouls called on both teams.  Rebounds were close and both teams scored inside well. Bowdoin seemed to be led by the play of one player...a fine one....in points, rebounds and assists.  Amherst's center had the most assists and it's prime PG had the most rebounds.  Two players tied for scoring leader.
Bowdoin did make Amherst "uncomfortable" by their press.  The announcer mentioned that this was one of the aims of the Polarbear's HC.  Having seen it once, it will be less effective next time, IMO.
Hope you saw the whole game.  I did!  Late last night, the entire NSN video...even early practices was available online.  Guess NSN was making up for there major broadcast failure throughout the conference?

I take it that u meant Kate Kerrigan- she really impressed me 4 years ago during AAU play when she made big plays against future D1 players. Would have wanted her to choose Scranton, but, as I remember it, she was an early Bowdoin commit.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 28, 2018, 11:05:10 AM
ronk....you are correct...again :).  It is very surprising that she knows where to be to get rebounds and makes shots, open or not.  Not a tall player but one that has a "motor".....moves all the time. 
Amherst has a similar player in their prime PG from PA.  Same size and same court awareness.  Did you scout her too?  Amherst has presently, three players that play two sports.  After the game, it appeared that two of the players had teammates in the other sports came over to provide Congrats....volleyball and lacrosse.  Did not see the other PG that plays soccer after the game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 28, 2018, 12:21:39 PM
Quote from: amh63 on January 28, 2018, 11:05:10 AM
ronk....you are correct...again :).  It is very surprising that she knows where to be to get rebounds and makes shots, open or not.  Not a tall player but one that has a "motor".....moves all the time. 
Amherst has a similar player in their prime PG from PA.  Same size and same court awareness.  Did you scout her too?  Amherst has presently, three players that play two sports.  After the game, it appeared that two of the players had teammates in the other sports came over to provide Congrats....volleyball and lacrosse.  Did not see the other PG that plays soccer after the game.

I liked all 4 of the Amherst sophs-the 3 starters and the sub big. Amherst was just too attractive!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on February 03, 2018, 06:41:24 AM
Another classic between Amherst and Tufts.  Congrats to Tufts for not giving up on an away floor when they were down by almost 20.  Made it a close game that could have gone either way until the last 30 seconds.  Amherst's young team shows again that they can gang in there when the going gets tough.  I'm sure these teams will see each other again in the NESCAC Tourney.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 03, 2018, 08:09:28 AM
Colby versus Middlebury today could decide fourth place and a home court playoff game.  With Colby's win last night over Williams, a win today over Middlebury would give Colby a head to head tiebreaker over both of those teams, with games against Wesleyan and Conn next week. A Middlebury win today gets them to 5-3, and they have a win over Wesleyan. Haven't seen Middlebury yet this year.  Colby has played good basketball over the past few weeks, including battling Amherst in a close game last year.  They have essentially gone to playing only five players, with four players going 45 minutes in last night's OT win. 
The conference is still top heavy, as i don't see anyone beating the Big three of Amherst, Bowdoin and Tufts.
It was nice to see Baptista go 38 minutes last night and not get into foul trouble.  Tufts doesn't have as much horse power as they had the last few years-but she can carry the team far.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on February 03, 2018, 09:46:40 AM
 The team defense of Amherst continues to impress, allowing only 4 assists, indicating that most Tufts' baskets were 1-on-1 moves. They forced Baptista's 3-pt shots to be backing up/fadeaway attempts(1-7), a very tough shot, even for someone of her ability.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on February 03, 2018, 10:57:21 AM


Hasn't Tufts been playing without their leading scorer the past several games due to an injury?

If she's healthy by the time the NESCAC tournament rolls around...well, just a thought.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 03, 2018, 12:16:40 PM
Having watched Amherst since Gromacki started coaching there-they consistently play outstanding defense. There are very few easy shots in a game against Amherst. Which is why when they play good teams, the games are often not very pretty-since it is so hard to get good shots. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 03, 2018, 08:33:21 PM
ronk...good points.
The announcer at the Amherst vs Tufts game made the point that the Tufts top scorer was not dressed...ankle type injury.  Amherst also has solid players..scorers injured.  Tufts has the "problem" of size in the low post this year... all- American North has graduated.  In the Amherst game, some taller little used Tufts players ...I had checked their stats...came in and played well, IMO.  In three games last season, each time Tufts played Amherst the point spread increased.  Tufts comeback in late in Friday's game was quite similar to the Tufts comeback in the semi- final game in last year's Final Four.  In the Finals, the third mtg between Amherst and Tufts was a Blowout by Amherst.
I am not concerned that a 2nd mtg and maybe a third mtg between the two rivals can occur this season.  I hope in those possible mtgs that both teams are at full strength. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 04, 2018, 10:08:34 AM
Baptista is far and away Tufts best player, but they are missing a starter. Bowdoin is better than Tufts this year, and will be the tougher test for Amherst when it comes to the tournament.

Middlebury pulled out a big victory to give them the inside track for the fourth position in the conference and a home playoff game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 07, 2018, 02:37:06 PM
Women's first regional rankings of the season are out: http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2018/02/women-regional-rankings-first
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: OldCardinal on February 07, 2018, 08:25:03 PM
Quote from: Maine1 on February 04, 2018, 10:08:34 AM
Baptista is far and away Tufts best player, but they are missing a starter. Bowdoin is better than Tufts this year, and will be the tougher test for Amherst when it comes to the tournament.

Bowdoin could well be better than Tufts but I don't think that's for sure.  Baptista only played 10 minutes in the Tufts-Bowdoin game because of foul trouble.  That changed the game.  The player who has been out not just any starter.  DeCandido, is basically identical to Baptiste in points and rebounds... a huge loss.  With her, who knows what happens.  That said, the Amherst Def is really impressive and Bowdoin is also obviously exceptionally good as well.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 10, 2018, 01:06:02 PM
Last night's Colby Wesleyan game was a very well played, entertaining game.  Colby just needs a couple of players off the bench.  Driscoll had a great game and should be one of the five all league players. Wesleyan locked up the fifth spot and will play Middlebury-which should be a pretty even match up.  I will say that Wesleyan's defense was very poor as Colby hit a lot of layups.  Colby should take the sixth spot if they can beat Conn College today , unless Trinity pulls off the upset against Tufts. As I mentioned in an earlier post, Colby is playing very good basketball and could give Tufts a tough game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 14, 2018, 03:13:27 PM
New women's regional rankings: http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2018/02/women-regional-rankings-second
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 17, 2018, 07:01:51 AM
Amherst and Bowdoin should have no trouble in today's games.  Wesleyan-Middlebury could go either way, and based on the latest NCAA rankings, could also mean that the winner will get an NCAA tournament bid, although I don't see either of those teams as NCAA teams.  Conn College could give Tufts a battle, but expect Tufts to win.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: OldCardinal on February 18, 2018, 08:22:54 AM
Good call on three of the games, Maine1.  Mid vs Wes was a great game.  As expected, Amherst and Bowdoin had no trouble at all.  The only game that came down differently than you predicted was Tufts-Conn, which was a blow out.  I think you have been underestimating Tufts a bit.  We'll see next weekend.  I expect Amherst will win easily vs. Wes. and the Tufts-Bow game (on a neutral court) will be a real battle that could go either way.  Should be fun.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 18, 2018, 12:19:46 PM
Schedule of the games should be interesting since Amherst will also be hosting the MBB Tourny.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PolarBearPA on February 18, 2018, 01:06:18 PM
Looks like Wesleyan vs Amherst 1pm then Tufts vs Bowdoin 3pm. Winners at noon on Sunday. Men will go 5:30, 7:30 and winners 2:30 on Sunday.

I am rooting for my Polar Bears of course but I can see any of the Big 3 winning it - With Amherst the edge at home of course. Tufts vs Bowdoin should be a classic.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 18, 2018, 02:26:44 PM
Yes, I missed on Tufts-Conn, although it was a 10-point game at half. Tufts is up and down. Possibly with their starter back they will make a run. I still like Bowdoin a lot. I believe they are a better team with more depth than Amherst, but beating Amherst at Amherst it tough.  It will be a good final game--and Tufts Bowdoin will be a good game.  Too bad both finals are at Amherst--it will be crowded out there.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on February 18, 2018, 05:38:57 PM
Of course I'm biased, but I like that both finals are at Amherst.  Reminds me of the "good old days" when the men and women played and traveled to same schools each weekend.  Though not back to back, there will be a certain energy in LeFrak. 

I think Amherst women are a slight favorite on their home court, but Tufts/Bowdoin could go either way as could the finals.  Amherst should have the easier semi and their starters rested.

Sorry to see Williams have such an off year.  Injuries? Young team?  The NESCAC is better when Williams is in the mix.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on February 18, 2018, 06:38:34 PM


Williams played Amherst really tough for about 3 1/2 quarters at LaFrak several weeks ago but then faded down the stretch as Amherst hit one big shot after another & took control after being down by 9.

Since then, Williams season really started going in the wrong direction...losing 6 out of their last 8 with some games not even that competitive.

From what I can tell, injuries to their top 7 or 8 kids was not a factor.

Amherst, Bowdoin & now Tufts coming back at full strength...should be a battle for the title but I'm sure all 3 are capable of deep runs in the tournament.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: SidelineHero on February 20, 2018, 11:35:13 AM
My predictions: Bowdoin wins easily over Tufts and goes on to win the NESCAC.  I have seen all three teams play and Bowdoin is the best of the three.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: truenorth on February 20, 2018, 12:48:27 PM
Agreed...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 20, 2018, 02:39:36 PM
On the Amherst athletic website presently, are the ticket prices for the three sessions of basketball being held in LeFrak this coming weekend.  The two sessions on Sat....women and men and the Sunday session...Men and Women championships.  Gym will be cleared between Sat. Sessions.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: OldCardinal on February 21, 2018, 10:47:25 AM
Bowdoin - Tufts will be close.  Both are at full strength and playing at neutral site.  I think the difference will be under 5 points and could go either way.  Amherst will win easily in the semi's and has to be favored in the finals at home.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 21, 2018, 03:00:19 PM
The NCAA released the third set of women's basketball regional rankings with few changes from last week's version. This is the final set that we'll see before the Tournament bracket is released on Monday. Full list here: http://d3hoops.com/notables/2018/02/women-regional-rankings-third

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Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 22, 2018, 04:48:19 PM
It is down to the final week of the regular season. It is now or never. Win the conference tournament, earn the automatic qualifier, and a team will be playing in March. Don't win it and either hold out hope for an at-large selection or the season is over.

The season continues or ends on the bounce of a ball from here on out.

So who may be in jeopardy and who is sitting pretty? On Thursday's edition of Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com), we start to read the tea leaves while also chatting with teams who are hoping to punch their ticket for the Road to Salem or Rochester themselves. Plus, we get a preview of what could be a fascinating weekend of NESCAC tournament action at Amherst.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch the show LIVE starting at 7:00 p.m. ET here: http://bit.ly/2BIbiUe

If you have questions, be sure to email them to hoopsville@d3hoops.com or interact with the show via the social media avenues located to the right.

Guests include (in order of appearance):
- Steve Schulman, Lehman men's coach
- Matt Ducharme, UMass-Dartmouth women's coach
- Jamie Purdy, Piedmont women's coach
- Grey Giovanine, No. 9 Augustana men's coach
- Michele Durand, No. 24 Ohio Northern women's coach (WBCA Center Court)
- Howard Herman, Berkshire Eagle writer (NESCAC tournaments preview)

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Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: OldCardinal on February 24, 2018, 04:50:13 PM
Big win for Tufts over Bowdoin who could never get on a run offensively.  The offensive rebounding stat was key.  Tufts had over 20 off boards.  Two greats who could well meet again in the NCAA's.  AMH-TUF will be another defensive battle.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: OldCardinal on February 25, 2018, 10:21:46 AM
I'm curious what others thought about the Bowdoin-Tufts game.  Aside from the offiensive rebounding I mentioned before, I was impressed by Tufts offensive balance.  As good as Baptiste is, they will need others to step up to beat Amherst.  Yesterday they got that.  It will be interesting to see if they can repeat that today.  Amherst is great at taking a team out of their game (actually, so are Bowdoin and Tufts).  It's really hard to pick against Amherst any time, but especially at home.  That said, I think Tufts wins by a couple in a back and forth game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 25, 2018, 10:56:34 AM
I was very impressed (and a little surprised) by Tufts defeat of Bowdoin yesterday. It seemed like Bowdoin was never able to find any offensive rhythm, and then at the end started forcing a lot of shots.  I believe they may have had four or five straight empty possession when the score was 46-41--including some very quick forced shots, some bad turnovers (unforced), and that stretch cost them the game.  Also, Tufts had a great game on the offensive boards. I thought Knapp was the difference in the game with her rebounding and just keeping things alive. Also, Tufts got a big game from DeCandido.
As far as today's game goes--it will be a typical Tufts-Amherst game-I expect a defensive struggle, so it will not be a pretty game.  If Baptista can stay out of foul trouble (which will be hard in what wlll likely be a game with a lot of reaching and grabbing)--it will be close. If I had to pick I would go with Amherst on the home court. I have to believe that Amherst Tufts and Bowdoin are three of the top teams in the country
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 25, 2018, 02:17:31 PM
As expected--a tough defensive game-Eck was the difference in the game as she had a consistent offensive game.  Amherst shot a little better. Tufts had there chances, but couldn't cash in.  Not sure why Tufts coach did not have some of her bench players in to give fouls at the end (not that it made a difference, but it could have).  No reason to have DeCandido on the floor fouling out.

Some combination of Tufts, Amherst and Bowdoin will play again in the NCAA tournament
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on February 25, 2018, 03:09:00 PM
Maine1, I think all 3 teams will make the tourney.  Will be interesting to see how soon in the tourney one or the other might have to face each other.  Due to travel restrictions, I'll be at least two are on the same side of the bracket with one on the other side.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 25, 2018, 04:23:31 PM
To follow up on NE Jeff Fan, I believe all three will get into the post season.  Hope all will be in in different brackets.  Amherst will host and Be situated to host through one sectional quad...being top ranked and undefeated over 60 games to date.  Tufts and Bowdoin could host.  Do not think both will be in the the same sectional as Amherst. 
Monday it will be sorted out. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 25, 2018, 05:34:07 PM
I am sure all three will be in-I just meant that we should see some combination of those teams playing each other--I wouldn't be surprised if all three host-they are the top three teams in the Northeast, and nothing that  happened this weekend should change that.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on February 25, 2018, 05:50:33 PM
Can we pencil in Amherst vs Valley Forge in round 1?☺

(Sorry, Scranton...)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: OldCardinal on February 25, 2018, 06:14:31 PM
Quote from: Maine 1 on February 25, 2018, 02:17:31 PM
As expected--a tough defensive game-Eck was the difference in the game as she had a consistent offensive game.  Amherst shot a little better. Tufts had there chances, but couldn't cash in.  Not sure why Tufts coach did not have some of her bench players in to give fouls at the end (not that it made a difference, but it could have).  No reason to have DeCandido on the floor fouling out.

Some combination of Tufts, Amherst and Bowdoin will play again in the NCAA tournament

Totally agree that Eck was the difference.  She hit one big shot after another.  It was a defensive battle as all expected.  Congrats to Amherst on 60 straight wins.  On to the NCAA for all three for sure.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on February 25, 2018, 06:18:36 PM

Absolutely.

Amherst has certainly earned a bit of a breather on opening night.

Just hope the NCAA uses some common sense in the bracketing (which has been known to be missing in certain years).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 25, 2018, 10:10:32 PM

I'm guessing they get a visit from Valley Forge in round 1.  I'm putting the over/under on total Valley Forge points at 12.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 26, 2018, 06:59:34 PM
FYI Valley Forge sent elsewhere.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 26, 2018, 08:25:47 PM
Amherst looks like they have a good draw and should get to the final four.  Tufts, Bowdoin and Scranton are all in the same part of the bracket.  Assuming all three of those teams win, it will be interesting to see where the next round is played.  I would assume Tufts will be ranked ahead of Bowdoin in the final rankings, and they were both ahead of Scranton.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on February 26, 2018, 09:23:42 PM
According to the NCAA bracket, Scranton is seeded the highest in the upper right quad so they should host the sectional, if the regionals go to form.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 26, 2018, 10:36:36 PM
Yeah - I don't see how a four-loss Tufts is "ranked" ahead of Scranton. Even other data I don't think changes that. Scranton appears to be the higher seed in that grouping.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh07 on February 27, 2018, 08:23:45 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 26, 2018, 10:36:36 PM
Yeah - I don't see how a four-loss Tufts is "ranked" ahead of Scranton. Even other data I don't think changes that. Scranton appears to be the higher seed in that grouping.

Losses to Amherst shouldn't count.   ;D
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 28, 2018, 11:41:50 AM
Welcome to the board, I guess?  Have a sense of humor, which can help one get through a season.  Nice class year...fine year for Amherst sports, if memory serves.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PolarBearPA on February 28, 2018, 01:41:43 PM
Women's All-NESCAC teams out. Kate Kerrigan of Bowdoin both Player of the Year AND Defensive Player of the year. Big congrats to Kate and the entire All-NESCAC squad.

1st team
F   Melissa Baptista   Tufts   Sr.   Somerville, Mass.
G   Lauren Dillon   Tufts   Sr.   Wellesley, Mass.
G   Madeline Fox   Amherst   So.   Rye, N.Y.
G   Hannah Fox   Amherst   So.   Plymouth Meeting, Pa.
G   Kate Kerrigan   Bowdoin   Sr.   Wellesley Hills, Mass.

2nd team
G   Abby Kelly   Bowdoin   Jr.   Bombay, N.Y.
F   Maddie Bledsoe   Wesleyan   Sr.   Newton, Mass.
C   Haley Driscoll   Colby   Sr.   Bedford, N.H.
G   Amanni Fernandez   Williams   Sr.   Corona, N.Y.
F   Mairead Hynes   Connecticut College   Sr.    Mahopac, N.Y.
F   Maya Davis   Middlebury   So.   Milton, Mass.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PolarBearPA on February 28, 2018, 01:42:49 PM
And Emily Briggs from Tufts Rookie of the Year and G.P. Gromacki from Amherst Coach of the Year
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on February 28, 2018, 01:49:35 PM
Quote from: PolarBearPA on February 28, 2018, 01:41:43 PM
Women's All-NESCAC teams out. Kate Kerrigan of Bowdoin both Player of the Year AND Defensive Player of the year. Big congrats to Kate and the entire All-NESCAC squad.

1st team
F   Melissa Baptista   Tufts   Sr.   Somerville, Mass.
G   Lauren Dillon   Tufts   Sr.   Wellesley, Mass.
G   Madeline Fox Eck   Amherst   So.   Rye, N.Y.
G   Hannah Fox   Amherst   So.   Plymouth Meeting, Pa.
G   Kate Kerrigan   Bowdoin   Sr.   Wellesley Hills, Mass.

2nd team
G   Abby Kelly   Bowdoin   Jr.   Bombay, N.Y.
F   Maddie Bledsoe   Wesleyan   Sr.   Newton, Mass.
C   Haley Driscoll   Colby   Sr.   Bedford, N.H.
G   Amanni Fernandez   Williams   Sr.   Corona, N.Y.
F   Mairead Hynes   Connecticut College   Sr.    Mahopac, N.Y.
F   Maya Davis   Middlebury   So.   Milton, Mass.

So that's 3 of my former prospects that made 1st team; just didn't see the Tufts' duo during the AAU season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 28, 2018, 01:50:05 PM
Quote from: amh07 on February 27, 2018, 08:23:45 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 26, 2018, 10:36:36 PM
Yeah - I don't see how a four-loss Tufts is "ranked" ahead of Scranton. Even other data I don't think changes that. Scranton appears to be the higher seed in that grouping.

Losses to Amherst shouldn't count.   ;D

If only that's how it worked... welcome to the boards, at least.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 28, 2018, 02:20:14 PM
Very interesting selections of players for CAC "all-star'teams.  Though this season is far from over with the three teams in the post season dominating the first and second all conference teams.  A preview of sorts for next season, imho. 
I noticed in the CAC Tourny, that there were insertion of many young players by Tufts, Amherst and Bowdoin.  Would expect all three schools to be in the hunt for the Nescac title next season.
Amherst's Head Coach "G" won Coach of the Year"....3 straight!  Thus, my label, like Coach "K" at Duke.  In truth, I often misspell names.
Amherst, has only one FY on its team and loses 4 seniors, one out all season.  As posted earlier, rumor has it, that 4 "recruits" are on their way for next season.
Ronk, a top scout for Scranton, has informed me that he has NOT compared his list of players with Coach G...to date :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh07 on February 28, 2018, 04:14:38 PM
Quote from: amh63 on February 28, 2018, 11:41:50 AM
Nice class year...fine year for Amherst sports, if memory serves.

2007: 
It was an important year for Amherst basketball.  Can't speak to other sports.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 01, 2018, 04:11:52 PM
hadn't had a chance to look at this, but historically the First team all-NESCAC is reserved for the best players on the best teams, but that is a solid first team. I would have went with Baptista as the player of the year, and Gromacki is certainly deserving of Coach of the year-although I think the better comparison is to Gino Aueremia.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on March 02, 2018, 12:37:06 AM
Quote from: PolarBearPA on February 28, 2018, 01:42:49 PM
And Emily Briggs from Tufts Rookie of the Year and G.P. Gromacki from Amherst Coach of the Year

My good friend was her coach in high school in Connecticut.  She had a great year, I knew she was a great get for the Jumbo's but we were both surprised it came this fast for her.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 02, 2018, 08:08:29 AM
Hope all the teams get where they need to be this weekend.  Safe travels to all!  Let the games begin!!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 03, 2018, 10:28:49 AM
All three Nescac teams won last night with the Tuft's win the closest.  Bowdoin's win appear to me to be a statement of sorts :).  Amherst's win was big also over an overmatched conference winner.  Amherst played its "second" team for most of the second quarter and slowed the game down in the fourth quarter...running the shot clock down.  Opponent only scored 12 points in the half...only 3 in the second half.  Total mismatch.  Tougher game tonight.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dutchfan on March 03, 2018, 11:58:52 PM
The NESCAC is one of four conferences to remain undefeated and only one of two conferences with multiple teams in the tournament.







ConferenceTeamsRecord
NECSCAC36-0
MIAA24-0
IIAC12-0
PAC12-0
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 04, 2018, 12:22:24 AM
Quote from: Dutchfan on March 03, 2018, 11:58:52 PM
The NESCAC is one of four conferences to remain undefeated and only one of two conferences with multiple teams in the tournament.







ConferenceTeamsRecord
NECSCAC36-0
MIAA24-0
IIAC12-0
PAC12-0

Did u mean still in the tourney(sweet 16)? because there are many more conferences with multiple teams in the 64-team field?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dutchfan on March 04, 2018, 02:06:56 AM
Quote from: ronk on March 04, 2018, 12:22:24 AM
Quote from: Dutchfan on March 03, 2018, 11:58:52 PM
The NESCAC is one of four conferences to remain undefeated and only one of two conferences with multiple teams in the tournament.







ConferenceTeamsRecord
NECSCAC36-0
MIAA24-0
IIAC12-0
PAC12-0

Did u mean still in the tourney(sweet 16)? because there are many more conferences with multiple teams in the 64-team field?
I believe that is evident when I said they "remain undefeated". You can't remain undefeated if no games have been played.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 04, 2018, 09:12:44 AM
Amherst won a tough game last night at home.  Coach G appeared a little out of sorts in the NCAA interview after the game...can see it on the Amherst website, within the writeup of the game. The two Sophs picked for 1st team all conference, led the way.  Key to the game was the rebounds by Amherst and fewer TOs.  Amherst checked most of the scorers from the ladies from St. Joseph, except their star who scored 30 points from everywhere, it seems....maybe more but I am too lazy to check.
Interesting in the star/top scorer was off on her foul shots.  Mass- Boston had held her down, the night before.
Anyway, it was a Good win as the men's Nescac tteams hosting lost while the two other teams won on hostile floors :).
Amherst awaits the NCAA announcements of the hosting sites of the sectionals.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 04, 2018, 01:03:15 PM
Amherst will host a sectional.  Scranton will host another....to meet Bowdoin and later Tufts if they prevail. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 04, 2018, 05:54:32 PM
I mentioned earlier-I believe Amherst has the easier road to the finals.  I think Bowdoin and Tufts both got an unfair draw, being in the same side of the bracket and having to go to Scranton to play (and Bowdoin drawing Scranton).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 04, 2018, 06:00:53 PM
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With so much parity, especially in men's basketball, unexpected outcomes where to be ... expected. However, that doesn't prepare anyone for the number of upsets, who was upset, and how.

Sunday night on Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com), Dave tries to breakdown the opening weekend not only looking back at some of the crazier finishes, but also talking to programs who escaped the wrath. Programs who are dancing on to the second weekend and hoping to punch their ticket to a championship weekend.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCANABC Studio. You can watch Sunday episode LIVE starting at 7:00 p.m. ET here: http://bit.ly/2FbY54R.

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Guests in order of appearance (subject to change):
- Chuck McBreen, Ramapo men's coach
- Jason Zimmerman, No. 6 Emory men's coach
- Larry Anderson, MIT men's coach
- Bill Broderick, No. 18 Christopher Newport women's coach
- Laurie Kelly, Gustavus Adolphus women's coach
- Carla Berube, No. 8 Tufts women's coach

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Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 04, 2018, 06:02:02 PM
Quote from: Maine 1 on March 04, 2018, 05:54:32 PM
I mentioned earlier-I believe Amherst has the easier road to the finals.  I think Bowdoin and Tufts both got an unfair draw, being in the same side of the bracket and having to go to Scranton to play (and Bowdoin drawing Scranton).

For starters... Amherst should have gotten the "easier road" ... they are one of the top two teams in the country.

Secondly, why should Bowdoin and Tufts get easier draws? They aren't as highly ranked as Amherst and should absolutely go to another locale in the next round if they don't rank as well as that host (Scranton).

Why should they have it easier?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dutchfan on March 04, 2018, 06:24:28 PM
Quote from: Maine 1 on March 04, 2018, 05:54:32 PM
I mentioned earlier-I believe Amherst has the easier road to the finals.  I think Bowdoin and Tufts both got an unfair draw, being in the same side of the bracket and having to go to Scranton to play (and Bowdoin drawing Scranton).
Trine got an even worse draw. And I do agree that a little more balance would've been nice, but as Dave asked, why do Bowdoin and Tufts deserve an easier draw? Yes, Amherst got an easy draw, maybe even an unfairly easy draw, but what is special about them?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 04, 2018, 07:09:03 PM
You all must not have watched the game last night.  Amherst had all they could handle from St. Joseph's who was on a 27 game winning streak.  Amherst will have their hands full this upcoming weekend with the teams heading their way.  Sure, I hope the home court gives them an advantage and path to the Final Four, but you can make a case for Tufts, Scranton or Bowdoin to host the next round. 

I don't think either Tufts or Bowdoin wanted to be in the Amherst pod.  They didn't want to be in either of the other quadrants either to face Wartburg, St. Thomas, Hope or Thomas More to name a few.  There is much more balance in the bracket then back in 2011 when Amherst won their first title and made other runs in 2009 and 2010. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on March 04, 2018, 08:43:08 PM

Maine 1:

Where would you have preferred Bowdoin going...back in the Amherst bracket?

Sent out to Hope to go against them or Thomas More or CNU?

In all honesty, they got the best possible draw they could because if they are as good as advertised, they'll take care of Scranton & then they can square off against Tufts on a neutral court for winner takes all & a Final Four appearance.

If you lose, you can blame it on Dwight J. Schroot, NCAA Committee Member & beet connoisseur, as I understand he was in charge of the vision & development of this bracket.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 05, 2018, 12:23:52 AM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on March 04, 2018, 07:09:03 PM
... St. Joseph's who was on a 27 game winning streak. 

Very coach-speak of you! But much of the field -- in fact, I'm sure all of the remaining teams -- could have beaten those same 27 opponents just as easily.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 05, 2018, 07:48:49 AM
Actually I saw the bracket through the head to head Massey matchup....Bowdoin wins the whole things over Thomas More.  The percentage that win each game is over 70% until Thomas More, then they have a 56% chance of winning it all.  I'd take that draw.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Roundball999 on March 05, 2018, 09:22:06 AM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on March 05, 2018, 07:48:49 AM
Actually I saw the bracket through the head to head Massey matchup....Bowdoin wins the whole things over Thomas More.  The percentage that win each game is over 70% until Thomas More, then they have a 56% chance of winning it all.  I'd take that draw.

I've been impressed with Massey in the past, but seems to me this year it has been way off.  For example, in the Hope pod Massey had Wheaton winning easily over WashU when just the opposite happened.  Then it had WashU and Hope as a tossup and Hope won by 16.  Elsewhere it had IWU as a 92% big winner over Trine while Trine actually led wire to wire and won by 9.  So I've changed my tune about Massey and no longer think it is a very reliable indicator at all.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 05, 2018, 10:47:53 AM
Very true this year.  I did better in my own bracket on hunches and records than Massey did.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 05, 2018, 08:38:55 PM
Agree that Amherst, as undefeated and number one team in country, should have a good draw (although St. Joe's is in a weak league).  My comment on Bowdoin and Tufts is they are overall two of the better teams in the country, with Bowdoin only losing to Amherst and Tufts, and Tufts having three losses to Amherst and Bowdoin. I would have like to have seen the three NESCAC teams each in different parts of the bracket.  I expect to see Bowdoin and Tufts playing each other for a trip to the final four.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 06, 2018, 03:02:09 PM
With the D3 travel restrictions, there are really only two parts of the bracket for Northeast/East Coast teams.  There in lies the problem so for many years, whether it was Amherst, Tufts, Williams, or Bowdoin....if there are 3 teams from NESCAC they will meet each other somewhere along the line.  Seems that the committee this year wanted to put in opposite quadrants Amherst and Wartburg.  Let the fun continue!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dutchfan on March 06, 2018, 03:13:22 PM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on March 06, 2018, 03:02:09 PM
With the D3 travel restrictions, there are really only two parts of the bracket for Northeast/East Coast teams.  There in lies the problem so for many years, whether it was Amherst, Tufts, Williams, or Bowdoin....if there are 3 teams from NESCAC they will meet each other somewhere along the line.  Seems that the committee this year wanted to put in opposite quadrants Amherst and Wartburg.  Let the fun continue!!!
The same thing has has come back to bite teams in the Great Lakes region as well. Teams in Wisconsin and Minnesota can go west, teams in Iowa can go west or south, teams in Missouri can go south. But the teams and n Michigan, Indiana, Illinois and Ohio are pretty much guaranteed to play each other and there are usually a lot of good teams in the region. Heck, four of the top twelve teams in the latest poll are from the Great Lakes region.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 06, 2018, 03:14:26 PM
I think you mean east... not west... for teams in Iowa and the like. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 06, 2018, 06:52:32 PM
Quote from: Dutchfan on March 06, 2018, 03:13:22 PM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on March 06, 2018, 03:02:09 PM
With the D3 travel restrictions, there are really only two parts of the bracket for Northeast/East Coast teams.  There in lies the problem so for many years, whether it was Amherst, Tufts, Williams, or Bowdoin....if there are 3 teams from NESCAC they will meet each other somewhere along the line.  Seems that the committee this year wanted to put in opposite quadrants Amherst and Wartburg.  Let the fun continue!!!
The same thing has has come back to bite teams in the Great Lakes region as well. Teams in Wisconsin and Minnesota can go west, teams in Iowa can go west or south, teams in Missouri can go south. But the teams and n Michigan, Indiana, Illinois and Ohio are pretty much guaranteed to play each other and there are usually a lot of good teams in the region. Heck, four of the top twelve teams in the latest poll are from the Great Lakes region.

You can usually get Ohio teams to the East and the MA and vice versa.  It's possible to do better matchups - there's just not always the time.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 07, 2018, 11:11:01 AM
Maybe some difficult travel conditions for teams going to the sectional locations.  Amherst will be closed at Noon today for the storm to hit the NorthEast soon with mucho snow.  Do not expect changes to game start times??
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 07, 2018, 12:45:14 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 07, 2018, 11:11:01 AM
Maybe some difficult travel conditions for teams going to the sectional locations.  Amherst will be closed at Noon today for the storm to hit the NorthEast soon with mucho snow.  Do not expect game start times??

Doubt this storm will have any affect on anything... while it is a big one and northern New Jersey is expected to get a good amount of snow, it will also melt really fast and roads will be pretty easy to clear. I kind of doubt we see anything affected.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 10, 2018, 12:18:58 PM
For Bowdoin and Tufts fans, we have video from last night's post game press conferences at Scranton in our nightly recap:

http://www.d3hoops.com/playoffs/women/2018/wrapup-sectional-semifinal
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 10, 2018, 12:50:48 PM
Looking forward to 6pm time so can flip back and forth between NESCAC games.  Any word on Jackie Nagle for Amherst?  She only played 2 minutes in last night's game and trainer was working on her on the bench.  Seems like she give great minutes and works hard under the basket.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: OldCardinal on March 10, 2018, 02:18:25 PM
Looks like all three NESCAC teams are playing extremely well.  Bowdoin - Tufts should be a real battle.  Tufts has evolved into a really balanced team.  Baptiste is obviously a unique talent, with the ability to do some amazing things.  There was a time when she had to be on offensively or Tufts would struggle against a great team.  Now there are many others who can pick up the slack.  Yesterday, it was Knapp and DiCandido,  Defensively, they are just awesome as a team.  Of course, so is Bowdoin (and Amherst as well).  Can't wait until 6pm.  Should be fun.  Don;t know much about Rochester, but they play in a great league and have made it this far, so they must be formidable.  Tough to pick against Amherst though.  Good chance there will be two Nescac's in the final 4.  Lot's of great teams left in the other brackets.  Awesome tourney so far.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 10, 2018, 03:43:30 PM
Bowdoin and Tufts confirmed that one of those two should have been hosting this weekend. Bowdoin especially played a great team beating Scranton on Scranton's home court.  Too bad all three teams can't make it to the final four (I do believe one of these three will be standing at the end of this tournament).  Amherst should be successful this evening, and it is hard to tell between Tufts and Bowdoin. Tufts is playing very well right now, and may have a little more fire power than Bowdoin.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 10, 2018, 03:54:00 PM
Quote from: Maine 1 on March 10, 2018, 03:43:30 PM
Bowdoin and Tufts confirmed that one of those two should have been hosting this weekend. Bowdoin especially played a great team beating Scranton on Scranton's home court.  Too bad all three teams can't make it to the final four (I do believe one of these three will be standing at the end of this tournament).  Amherst should be successful this evening, and it is hard to tell between Tufts and Bowdoin. Tufts is playing very well right now, and may have a little more fire power than Bowdoin.

FYI - Bowdoin actually had no shot at hosting this weekend. With Messiah in the group and being 524 miles from Bowdoin, that was a no-go, even if Bowdoin had a chance (Bowdoin was behind Tufts in the regional rankings; they weren't going to suddenly host over Tufts who is in a better geographical spot than Bowdoin).

And if teams win isn't a factor in determining the criteria of who hosts. We would be spinning out wheels for hours and days (maybe weeks) if we determined who hosted by who we think will win particular games. There is criteria for a reason. Scranton with one loss and .589 SOS was going to host over a 4-loss and .658 SOS from Tufts (at some point, the SOS number is just too... gaudy when you have multiple losses).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dutchfan on March 10, 2018, 10:19:14 PM
Congrats to Amherst and Bowdoin on making the final four. Good luck to both of you next weekend.

Unfortunately my Dutch fell short tonight.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: OldCardinal on March 11, 2018, 11:48:47 AM
Bowdoin was great last night, showing excellent,balanced offense along with their typical stingy defense.  Scoring 66 points on Tufts is very hard to do.  The rebound stat kind of says it all.  Good luck to Amherst and Bowdoin in the final four.  Congrats to Tufts for another great season and to Baptiste and Dillon for tremendous careers.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 11, 2018, 04:56:47 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcdnak1.psbin.com%2Fimg%2Fmw%3D710%2Fcr%3Dn%2Fd%3D5fzhr%2Fnl2ewx65u7natfgf.jpg&hash=1d3f50b1fdbca920493edbe6408a62371602177d)

The Road to Rochester and Salem are nearly complete. Only thing left is to actually hit the road and get the teams, media, fans, and others to their respective championships.

It was a thrilling and, maybe, shocking Sectionals Weekend in Division III. For the women, quite a few exciting games, but four of the top five teams in the country advanced to the Championship Weekend.

Not so much on the men's side. Only one ranked team is headed to Salem. Two weren't even receiving votes in the last Top 25 poll. And two have never been to the final four. Only one host got out of their own gym by cutting down their own nets. It was crazy.

On Sunday night's episode of Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com), Dave and guests try and break down what happened this weekend and what we might be able to expect in Rochester and Salem. Who came up big, who had the bounces go their way, and more. Guests from four of the eight teams will also discuss their roads and initial thoughts on knowing they are two wins away from a national championship.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch the show LIVE starting at 7:00 p.m. ET (did you set your clocks back?) right here: http://bit.ly/2p2BbqB

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Guests include (in order of appearance):
- Pat Juckem, No. 24 UW-Oshkosh men's coach
- Ashley Shibles, No. 5 Bowdoin women's coach
- Jeff Hans, No. 3 Thomas More women's coach
- Dale Wellman, Nebraska Wesleyan men's coach
- Ryan Scott, D3hoops.com Around the Nation columnist
- Pat Cunningham, Trinity (Texas) men's coach (NABC All-Star Game)

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Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh07 on March 11, 2018, 06:40:17 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 10, 2018, 03:54:00 PM
Scranton with one loss and .589 SOS was going to host over a 4-loss and .658 SOS from Tufts (at some point, the SOS number is just too... gaudy when you have multiple losses).

This is 2018.  We are in the era of data science.  Evaluating teams based on SOS and winning percentage is not only old fashioned, but it is prone to bias and confusion. 

NCAA decision-making should never be based on these metrics.

Mathematically, these metrics have big problems, including: 
We need a single metric that estimates a team's quality.  There are many algorithms out there that do this.  One example is the Elo rating system used for chess: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elo_rating_system.  Chess and basketball are different in important ways -- such as that chess doesn't have seasons -- so Elo wouldn't fit basketball perfectly.  But there must be a good solution out there.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on March 11, 2018, 06:59:36 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 11, 2018, 04:56:47 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcdnak1.psbin.com%2Fimg%2Fmw%3D710%2Fcr%3Dn%2Fd%3D5fzhr%2Fnl2ewx65u7natfgf.jpg&hash=1d3f50b1fdbca920493edbe6408a62371602177d)

The Road to Rochester and Salem are nearly complete. Only thing left is to actually hit the road and get the teams, media, fans, and others to their respective championships.

It was a thrilling and, maybe, shocking Sectionals Weekend in Division III. For the women, quite a few exciting games, but four of the top five teams in the country advanced to the Championship Weekend.

Not so much on the men's side. Only one ranked team is headed to Salem. Two weren't even receiving votes in the last Top 25 poll. And two have never been to the final four. Only one host got out of their own gym by cutting down their own nets. It was crazy.

On Sunday night's episode of Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com), Dave and guests try and break down what happened this weekend and what we might be able to expect in Rochester and Salem. Who came up big, who had the bounces go their way, and more. Guests from four of the eight teams will also discuss their roads and initial thoughts on knowing they are two wins away from a national championship.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch the show LIVE starting at 7:00 p.m. ET (did you set your clocks back?) right here: http://bit.ly/2p2BbqB

If you have questions, be sure to email them to hoopsville@d3hoops.com or interact with the show via the social media avenues below.

Guests include (in order of appearance):
- Pat Juckem, No. 24 UW-Oshkosh men's coach
- Ashley Shibles, No. 5 Bowdoin women's coach
- Jeff Hans, No. 3 Thomas More women's coach
- Dale Wellman, Nebraska Wesleyan men's coach
- Ryan Scott, D3hoops.com Around the Nation columnist
- Pat Cunningham, Trinity (Texas) men's coach (NABC All-Star Game)

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Adrienne Shibles,
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 11, 2018, 09:14:30 PM
Yeah - it was a typo that I can't explain... but we fixed Shibles name where we needed. I blame DST. LOL
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 11, 2018, 09:37:35 PM
Quote from: amh07 on March 11, 2018, 06:40:17 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 10, 2018, 03:54:00 PM
Scranton with one loss and .589 SOS was going to host over a 4-loss and .658 SOS from Tufts (at some point, the SOS number is just too... gaudy when you have multiple losses).

This is 2018.  We are in the era of data science.  Evaluating teams based on SOS and winning percentage is not only old fashioned, but it is prone to bias and confusion. 

NCAA decision-making should never be based on these metrics.

Mathematically, these metrics have big problems, including: 

  • When an elite team beats a low-quality team, the elite team's SOS goes down although the win tells us nothing new about the team.  What if Bowdoin played another 30 games this season against teams that never won a game?  Suddenly, its SOS would drop, and its near-perfect record would lose its meaning -- for no good reason.
  • Another problem with using SOS and winning percentage is that doing so requires analyzing two numbers.  There is no good way to compare a team with a high SOS and low winning percentage to a team with a low SOS and a high winning percentage.
We need a single metric that estimates a team's quality.  There are many algorithms out there that do this.  One example is the Elo rating system used for chess: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elo_rating_system.  Chess and basketball are different in important ways -- such as that chess doesn't have seasons -- so Elo wouldn't fit basketball perfectly.  But there must be a good solution out there.

Seriously?! How are you going to use data in a division that doesn't have nearly the kind of cross-country cross over and cross-pollination? Many have discussed the idea of using the RPI in DIII, but point out how difficult it is because there isn't enough play across the country by teams.

There also is FAR more than SOS and WL%. RRO, head-to-head, comparable teams. Get to the secondary and non-conf SOS is used. When the committees look at the RRO, they DIVE into the RRO to look at the resumes.

FYI - the SOS does not take into account the game a team plays. In other words, a team is not punished by beating a team because that loss/win is not calculated. They can't do that or you are right, teams would have their SOS's dinged because they hurt their opponent's record.

As for comparing the numbers, NCAA stats has come up with the theory that seems to hold water that a difference of .030 in the SOS is equal to 2-games. We talk about it all the time. A team with 18-6 record and an SOS .030 better than a 20-4 team would be considered equal in the eyes of the committees. That is a very simple equation, but the committees do work on ways to compare, contrast, and understand the numbers better and better.

It is easy to knock on the system. I get that especially for those who don't know the history (not an indication of the poster here). There was a time there was no criteria basically to speak of. Then we went to the QOWI... oh lord that was bad. We moved to the SOS and now for the men the SOS also has a weighted measure based on where games are being played. The numbers are tweaked and each committee each year dives in to better understand the data and make the best decisions possible.

However, unlike one's wishes to go to a simple data-driven system (let's remember how much that screwed up the FBS system for a number of years), it isn't going to happen. Member schools that make the rules in the NCAA want a level of decision making and understanding teams outside of just straight data. Furthermore, as I believe famed poster Mr. Ypsi puts it, the data systems are created by humans anyway... so we can't eliminate problems there as well.

The system works. Is it perfect? No. No system is. Has it gotten better? Hell yes. Does it really miss out on decisions? No. By trying to say Scranton losing somehow showed the system is flawed... is a flawed argument.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dutchfan on March 12, 2018, 12:01:20 AM
The teams that made the final four this season were the top three teams and the fifth ranked team in the d3hoops poll AND were the top four teams in the WBCA poll.

You can complain about how the pods we're set up or how one team had a series of very tough matchups while another team had an easy road to the final four. But the only teams that have any kind of legitimate gripe are the teams that didn't make the tournament. Every team that made the tournament had the chance to make the final four. I'm a Hope College fan. We lost to Thomas More last night. I know we were a final four caliber team, but we lost and it had nothing to do with how the NCAA chose who played who. Ultimately it was because we didn't play as well as we could've. We turned to ball over 21 times, many of which were unforced. We shot terribly from the charity line. We didn't lose because the NCAA used the wrong metric for anything. We lost because yesterday they were better than us.

There is no metric that can perfectly rate teams. Metrics are all based on tangible stats. No metric can rate things like how some teams that every knows are inferior can match up so well against a superior team, or the impact a rivalry gas on games, or the impact of crowd noise or off nights and the nights where a team is "in the zone".
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 12, 2018, 12:03:27 PM
Good points from both of previous posts.  Enjoyed reading your perspectives.  Looking forward to this coming weekend, and hoping for good games.  All 64 teams can take pride in making the tournament.  Don't know what the current count is, but there were over 400 schools playing D3 Women's Hoops and to be one of the Top 64 is saying something.  Due to travel restrictions in D3 the system will never be perfect, but certainly has gotten better.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 12, 2018, 12:59:19 PM
 Best wishes to Bowdoin in the Final 4. They had the very good defender(Choate) to defend Scranton's Bridgette Mann and disrupt their offense. And, she was good on offense, also. Frequently, a defensive stopper has limited offensive capability; not so with Taylor.
  Kate Kerrigan played like Kate Kerrigan(7 offensive rebounds are like a dagger mentally and physically to an opponent that's just played defense for 25 seconds and now has to do it again without a break). I've mentioned here on more than 1 occasion that I've admired her play since her AAU days 4 summers ago and got to talk with her dad after the Scranton game about it.
  Coach Shibles was very gracious with her post-game comments about the Scranton game and hosting atmosphere.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 16, 2018, 06:15:47 PM
Really expected the video feed to be better.  Score is frozen and can't hear the announcers above the crowd noise.  Need to put mics closer
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 16, 2018, 08:50:42 PM
Audio on Men's NCAA feed is fine.  Awful from Rochester.  A bit better after halftime of Bowdoin game, but not much.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 17, 2018, 06:25:18 AM
Great night for the NESCAC.  Second straight year where the championship game is between two NESCAC teams.  Bowdoin looked outstanding in totally dominating Wartburg on what was close to a home game for Wartburg.  When Bowdoin plays the way it played last night, they are the best team in the country.  Nothing against Amherst, but Bowdoin is deeper than Amherst and has more players that can score. 
Amherst also had a great night.  If Bowdoin can shoot reasonably well tonight, they should be able to win.  The key for Bowdoin is to try to be a little better with their shot selection at times.  Over the course of this tournament I have seen them take some very quick long threes early in a shot clock, at times where they should work for a better shot.
What have been great to have Tufts at the final four also.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on March 17, 2018, 08:23:37 AM
I agree with Maine 1 in that it certainly looked like Bowdoin could have beaten anyone last night.  But tonight's a different story and Amherst is not just anyone.  It should be a great game tonight and Bowdoin certainly can win and their shot selection will definitely be a key along with their improved rebounding.  Whatever the outcome, congratulations to two great teams from a great conference and may tonight's game be a classic!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: truenorth on March 17, 2018, 09:33:40 AM
The lady Polar Bears have indeed been a joy to watch this season!  They play very well as a team, and executed extraordinarily well in last night's game vs. Wartburg.  Amherst is obviously one of the toughest defensive teams in the country.  I think it will come down to whether Bowdoin "peaked" in their game last night or whether they can bring the same level of play into tonight's game vs. Amherst.  If they sustain their level of play, I think they'll overcome Amherst's tough D.  We shall see...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 17, 2018, 09:41:00 AM
Agree with everything that the prior posters have said.  Two great teams from what is clearly the top conference in the league. I will just note that Tufts is as good defensively as Amherst, and Bowdoin was able to handle them in this tournament run.  Bowdoin just has to get themselves up one more time (and I think they will).  I also wanted to note that I have been extremely impressed with the Bowdoin coach. She really seems to be a class act.  I hope both teams play at their best.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on March 17, 2018, 11:46:40 AM
Coach Shibles has done a fantastic job with the Bowdoin program, especially when one considers that she succeeded the wildly successful Stephanie Pemper, never an easy thing to do.  She has established her own legacy of accomplishment, which certainly hasn't been easy since the NESCAC arrivals of G.P. Gromacki and Carla Berube.  She's very deserving of the Polar Bears' success this season. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PolarBearPA on March 17, 2018, 12:48:28 PM
Fortunate that I am in MN to watch Bowdoin in person. Tremendous effort last night. Wartburg brought a huge crowd with them and the Polar Bears did not blink. Very selfless team. Will be a great game tonight vs Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: old_hooper on March 17, 2018, 02:46:56 PM
Quote from: Maine 1 on March 17, 2018, 09:41:00 AM
Agree with everything that the prior posters have said.  Two great teams from what is clearly the top conference in the league. I will just note that Tufts is as good defensively as Amherst, and Bowdoin was able to handle them in this tournament run.  Bowdoin just has to get themselves up one more time (and I think they will).  I also wanted to note that I have been extremely impressed with the Bowdoin coach. She really seems to be a class act.  I hope both teams play at their best.

Maine1, to say that Tuffs defensive is as good as Amhersts: Tufts average per game 48.3 #7 nationally, Amherst 38.6 #1.  Amherst only allowed opp 3 times to score over 50.  WPI was #2 national at 47.1 per game or a 8.5 pt difference, not even close.  Coach Gromecki has made defense a high priority in this years success and it has paid huge dividends.  They held Thomas More who averaged 85 per game #3 nationally to 48.  Don't think many would have given Amherst a chance to be in this position at the beginning of the year.  If Amherst can hold game below 50, I like their chances.  Bowdoin played outstanding against Wartburg but defensively (Wartburg) they made no adjustments noticeable after the half to change the game.  It will be a fun game to watch because they are both deserving for to be playing for the championship.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 17, 2018, 03:22:25 PM
Agree on all points about Shibles.  NESCAC is fortunate to have a high level of coaching which has put it on the top of the DIII leagues for the moment.  Since most of the Finals are usually played in the Midwest somewhere, teams like Thomas More, Wartburg, Wash U, Hope, DePauw (to name a few) bring huge crowds often with mascots, bands and cheerleaders....not things usually seen in NESCAC play.  Takes a bunch of concentration to block all the noise and play your game.

Just noticed in my "local" listings that CBSSN (CBS Sports Network) is covering men's game at 6pm, but not Women's game at 8:30 so I hope the streaming audio better tonight.  If we'd known again that it would be two NESCAC teams playing for the title, NESN should have come for the coverage.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 17, 2018, 10:33:32 PM
Congrats to Amherst!!!  What can you say about their suffocating defense and some great shots under pressure.  3 Sophomores and a junior start so should continue to be strong.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 18, 2018, 02:01:09 AM
 Emma McCarthy easily was the main factor in the game in addition to the neutralization of Abby Kelly from approaching her production in the Wartburg semifinal and the ability of the Amherst starters to play the whole game without a dropoff.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on March 18, 2018, 03:11:39 AM
Here's my Ode to Amherst, in an effort to capture describe its defensive excellence for posterity.

I had a lot of fun covering the Tournament finals this weekend. Both Amherst and Bowdoin should be very proud of how they represented the NESCAC and Division III basketball overall.

http://www.d3hoops.com/playoffs/women/2018/amherst-mammoth-defense
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 18, 2018, 07:20:32 AM
Congratulations to both Amherst and Bowdoin.  Amherst clearly the better team last night and for the season.  I have been watching Gromacki and Amherst teams since his first season at Amherst, and no matter who has been on the team, the one constant is that there defense is better than anyone else.  They context all perimeter shots, and their defense is so suffocating that when a shooter does get an open shot, they generally hurry the shot and the result more often than not is a miss.  Great defense and McCarthy was definitely the difference as Bowdoin could not stop her. 
Bowdoin was bound to have an off night (not an excuse, just a fact)--and that was compounded by the stifling defense of Amherst.  From the very start it never looked or felt like anyone from Bowdoin was "on". Put  Bowdoin should be extremely proud of a great season, and a great run through the tournament, taking out Scranton in Scranton, Tufts and Wartburg.   The D3 title runs through the NESCAC.  Maybe the final four should be in Boston next year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 18, 2018, 08:16:00 AM
Maine1, love the thought of the Final Four on the East Coast.  Great article, Gordon.  Didn't realize that junior, McCarthy was out of eligibility, but I do remember that she transferred to Amherst.  Congrats to both Bowdoin and Amherst.  For the moment the NESCAC sits atop DIII Women's Basketball.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: polbear73 on March 18, 2018, 09:51:22 AM
Congratulations to Amherst; what a terrific accomplishment and there is probably more to come. What is it about the name McCarthy at Amherst that seems to doom Bowdoin! A truly great season for the Polar Bears. Both teams represented NESCAC very well.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ECSUalum on March 18, 2018, 10:10:33 AM
Congratulations to Amherst Women's BB for their National Championship and the excellence they have brought to the game!!

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 18, 2018, 10:19:52 AM
Gordonmann...enjoyed your writeup!  Yes, Emma, a transfer from Fairfield, was put in a game her FY and lost a year of play....even after Amherst filed for reconsideration.  Emma was recovering from a "hip" problem early in the season when I dropped by late in the Fall for Homecoming.  One of Amherst's juniors was also recovering from an injury.  Amherst brought in only one player this year.  She got in with her sister in the last few minutes and scored 4 points.  Both talented players are local players from nearby Granby...their father is a HS principal.  The older sister won a NCAA award this weekend for her "smarts".  Yes, Amherst loses 4 players.  As I posted earlier, it is rumored that HC G.P. has 4 talented players coming in...more length?.  Note that Amherst tends to play with a " short"
Bench...but a bench full of talented players that can step in.
Hope they are on ronk's list :).
Oh yes, there are three players...two starters...that are multi-sport players.  One reason that talented student athletes pick D3 schools vice D1...even over the Ivies.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: PolarBearPA on March 18, 2018, 10:33:45 AM
Game was close through 3 quarters but Amherst just had too much. Hats off to the National Champs & what a fine season for Bowdoin. A lot of fun watching this Polar Bear team play this year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 18, 2018, 03:13:46 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 18, 2018, 10:19:52 AM
Gordonmann...enjoyed your writeup!  Yes, Emma, a transfer from Fairfield, was put in a game her FY and lost a year of play....even after Amherst filed for reconsideration.  Emma was recovering from a "hip" problem early in the season when I dropped by late in the Fall for Homecoming.  One of Amherst's juniors was also recovering from an injury.  Amherst brought in only one player this year.  She got in with her sister in the last few minutes and scored 4 points.  Both talented players are local players from nearby Granby...their father is a HS principal.  The older sister won a NCAA award this weekend for her "smarts".  Yes, Amherst loses 4 players.  As I posted earlier, it is rumored that HC G.P. has 4 talented players coming in...more length?.  Note that Amherst tends to play with a " short"
Bench...but a bench full of talented players that can step in.
Hope they are on ronk's list :).
Oh yes, there are three players...two starters...that are multi-sport players.  One reason that talented student athletes pick D3 schools vice D1...even over the Ivies.

I know that you have a Mammoth network of Amherst confidants; when you get the names, send me a PM and I'll let you know if I've seen them play. Haven't heard of any Amherst 2018s yet, but both sides have tightened security in view of the 2016s'(current sophs) situation.  ;) I only have a couple undeclareds left on my 2018 list that Amherst MIGHT be interested in but even 1 of those is probably going to play D1 soccer rather than D3 basketball.
  Was talking last weekend with a Williams' assistant(former Scranton star) at the Scranton sectional involving Tufts and Bowdoin, also, but she said she wasn't scouting those NESCAC schools; was there to support Scranton, instead. Forgot to inquire who Williams had coming in next year; must be getting old.  ::)   

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 18, 2018, 05:31:00 PM
Quote from: ronk on March 18, 2018, 03:13:46 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 18, 2018, 10:19:52 AM
Gordonmann...enjoyed your writeup!  Yes, Emma, a transfer from Fairfield, was put in a game her FY and lost a year of play....even after Amherst filed for reconsideration.  Emma was recovering from a "hip" problem early in the season when I dropped by late in the Fall for Homecoming.  One of Amherst's juniors was also recovering from an injury.  Amherst brought in only one player this year.  She got in with her sister in the last few minutes and scored 4 points.  Both talented players are local players from nearby Granby...their father is a HS principal.  The older sister won a NCAA award this weekend for her "smarts".  Yes, Amherst loses 4 players.  As I posted earlier, it is rumored that HC G.P. has 4 talented players coming in...more length?.  Note that Amherst tends to play with a " short"
Bench...but a bench full of talented players that can step in.
Hope they are on ronk's list :).
Oh yes, there are three players...two starters...that are multi-sport players.  One reason that talented student athletes pick D3 schools vice D1...even over the Ivies.

I know that you have a Mammoth network of Amherst confidants; when you get the names, send me a PM and I'll let you know if I've seen them play. Haven't heard of any Amherst 2018s yet, but both sides have tightened security in view of the 2016s'(current sophs) situation.  ;) I only have a couple undeclareds left on my 2018 list that Amherst MIGHT be interested in but even 1 of those is probably going to play D1 soccer rather than D3 basketball.
  Was talking last weekend with a Williams' assistant(former Scranton star) at the Scranton sectional involving Tufts and Bowdoin, also, but she said she wasn't scouting those NESCAC schools; was there to support Scranton, instead. Forgot to inquire who Williams had coming in next year; must be getting old.  ::)

With Amherst's admissions schedule, wouldn't anyone coming in for next year be pretty much lock in at this point?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: P'bearfan on March 19, 2018, 06:46:22 AM
Congrats to both Amherst and Bowdoin on great seasons.  Pretty impressive to have a NESCAC final.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: truenorth on March 19, 2018, 01:05:38 PM
Yes, congratulations to both Amherst and Bowdoin on fabulous seasons!  And a tip of the cap to Amherst for their impressive two year run...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 22, 2018, 12:06:54 PM
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The 2017-18 season is now complete. Congratulations to Nebraska Wesleyan and Amherst on their Division III national championships!

However, there is still some business to take care of ... we need to wrap up the season on Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com).

Tune in Thursday, March 22 as Dave McHugh is joined by a few guests as we look back at the Championship Weekends along with looking ahead at what should be a busy off-season and exciting 2018-19 season.

Plus, it what may be surprising to some and expected from others, we talk to the now-retiring Mark Edwards of WashU men's basketball. We chat about 37 incredible years and why he feels it is time to walk off the court for good.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch the show LIVE starting at 2:00 p.m. ET on Thursday in the video player above.

If you have questions, be sure to email them to hoopsville@d3hoops.com or interact with the show via the social media avenues.

Guests include (in order of appearance; subject to change):
- Mark Edwards, No. 15 WashU men's head coach
- Dale Wellman, No. 1 Nebraska Wesleyan head coach (from Sunday's postgame show)
- Tim Fitzpatrick, Coast Guard AD and men's basketball committee chair (from Sunday's postgame show)
- Gordon Mann interview with Emma McCarthy, No. 1 Amherst sophomore forward
- Max Pearce, SUNY Purchase Senior guard participating in the State Farm College Slam Dunk Championship in San Antonio
- Nathan Dennison, VP of Sales at Allen County War Memorial Coliseum, Fort Wayne, Ind. (from Sunday's postgame show)

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Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 22, 2018, 03:38:18 PM
 Was watching the D2 women semis yesterday(involving Indiana U of PA which had some players that I had seen in AAU) and they had a screen shot of the all-time streaks in college basketball(UConn women had the top 2, then UCLA men, then Wash U women @ 82, then Ashland women(IUP's opponent yesterday @ 73 and counting). So, Amherst is getting into heady times with their current streak @ 66 and counting.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 22, 2018, 03:49:28 PM
Quote from: ronk on March 22, 2018, 03:38:18 PM
Was watching the D2 women semis yesterday(involving Indiana U of PA which had some players that I had seen in AAU) and they had a screen shot of the all-time streaks in college basketball(UConn women had the top 2, then UCLA men, then Wash U women @ 82, then Ashland women(IUP's opponent yesterday @ 73 and counting). So, Amherst is getting into heady times with their current streak @ 66 and counting.

Yes... yes they are. When we are talking about having a chance to get to WashU's record alone... makes me very aware of how insane a level they are at currently.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 25, 2018, 09:36:37 AM
Dave...your Hoopsville's broadcast wrt Amherst's Emma did not happen? What happen?  Also, Emma is listed inncorrect...she is an academic junior, but a senior wrt to WBB.  Believe she will be an assistant coach after a semester abroad for next year.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 25, 2018, 01:02:32 PM
Couple of things:

First we did accidentally leave off the interview with Emma McCarthy. Not sure how, but it didn't help when we shuffled the order of guests to get one of our live guests into a better slot (since we were running late) AND I realized at the last moment before air we needed to slot in the Jostens winners.

Another perfect example of why we need more human resources on this show than I am able to achieve.

We uploaded the interview that Gordon Mann conducted and it is available at the bottom of our show page along with a disclaiminer: http://bit.ly/2IGZ92E

As for what we list her by, I go by and trust the information given to me by the schools. They have her listed as a junior on their online roster, that is the information I go by. There are a lot of reasons for why she might be listed as a junior, but I go by their information. She actually should only be listed as a sophomore since this was only her second year on the team (it is based on eligibility) unless she used it somewhere else.

That all said, she says early on in the interview that this is her last season with the team ... but time will tell.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Homer on March 26, 2018, 10:10:39 AM
emma was undefeated in her career at amherst.  unfortunately she played 9 games for fairfield u. over two years.  i think 7 games her freshman year and 2 games her sophomore year, so she only had two years of eligibility left when she got to amherst.   academically, she was unable to transfer some credits from fairfield and came in as an academic sophomore. she is planning to spend the fall semester next year overseas and help coach the team in the spring semester.  she could not have ended her playing career with three better games than the ones she played against Rochester, TM, and Bowdoin.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 26, 2018, 12:35:16 PM
Quote from: Homer on March 26, 2018, 10:10:39 AM
emma was undefeated in her career at amherst.  unfortunately she played 9 games for fairfield u. over two years.  i think 7 games her freshman year and 2 games her sophomore year, so she only had two years of eligibility left when she got to amherst.   academically, she was unable to transfer some credits from fairfield and came in as an academic sophomore. she is planning to spend the fall semester next year overseas and help coach the team in the spring semester.  she could not have ended her playing career with three better games than the ones she played against Rochester, TM, and Bowdoin.

Very likely the Fairfield experience killed her eligibility. I lose track of transfers very easily. According to Fairfield's stats, she played in 11 games her freshman campaign and 8 her sophomore campaign. That would use up those two years of eligibility.

Not sure why Amherst would then list her as a junior as she clearly was a senior this year. She might be a junior academically, but that's why online rosters are supposed to be based on eligibility, not academics. That said, it isn't perfect.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 28, 2018, 09:18:41 PM
Amherst's new SID....an alum of Tufts..needs to take a refresher course in math.  Story on the Amherst website that sights the 12 national team titles won.  Problem is that the story forgot that the WBB team won three titles...two in a row as just recently noted.   Oh well, hope a correction is made soon :).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 29, 2018, 12:49:36 AM
Quote from: amh63 on March 28, 2018, 09:18:41 PM
Amherst's new SID....an alum of Tufts..needs to take a refresher course in math.  Story on the Amherst website that sights the 12 national team titles won.  Problem is that the story forgot that the WBB team won three titles...two in a row as just recently noted.   Oh well, hope a correction is made soon :).

Cites. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 29, 2018, 07:23:01 AM
Pat C.....thanks... :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 31, 2018, 02:19:54 AM
Quote from: amh63 on March 18, 2018, 10:19:52 AM
Gordonmann...enjoyed your writeup!  Yes, Emma, a transfer from Fairfield, was put in a game her FY and lost a year of play....even after Amherst filed for reconsideration.  Emma was recovering from a "hip" problem early in the season when I dropped by late in the Fall for Homecoming.  One of Amherst's juniors was also recovering from an injury.  Amherst brought in only one player this year.  She got in with her sister in the last few minutes and scored 4 points.  Both talented players are local players from nearby Granby...their father is a HS principal.  The older sister won a NCAA award this weekend for her "smarts".  Yes, Amherst loses 4 players.  As I posted earlier, it is rumored that HC G.P. has 4 talented players coming in...more length?.  Note that Amherst tends to play with a " short"
Bench...but a bench full of talented players that can step in.
Hope they are on ronk's list :).
Oh yes, there are three players...two starters...that are multi-sport players.  One reason that talented student athletes pick D3 schools vice D1...even over the Ivies.

I've found 2 Amherst commits from a recruiting data base:
Gabrielle Zaffiro - North Shore(NY) and Lauren Pelosi - Taft(CT)

Haven't seen either 1 play but Gabrielle looks like a winner
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on April 03, 2018, 10:19:47 AM
Pelosi is in the JCC Classic this weekend.  I'll see her today, Thursday & Sunday so I'll let you know what I think after my observations.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on May 21, 2018, 03:40:05 PM
Attended the Amherst women's Lax game at Gettysburg on Sat.  Got to chat with Hannah Fox's mother...as she noticed I was wearing a 2013 Men's Nat. title jacket.  The other parents behind was aware of Hannah's WBB achievements. Hannah is also an impact Lax player.  I was informed that Amherst May have 5 players arriving in the Fall...vice my 4 players " rumor" posted awhile back.  Amherst brought in only one player...in the class of '21.
I watched the Commencement Online on Sunday.  The three seniors on the WBB team have graduated. Emma M. will not be playing next season.  She will be studying abroad in the Fall and be an student assistant coach when the season starts.  Intriguing to hear about 5 players coming in the Fall...would not be surprised the additional player is a transfer...maybe a front court player :).  Coach G has a history of bringing in impact players from higher division.  Recall Renner'17's older sister was such a transfer from Holy Cross.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jayhawk on June 02, 2018, 09:25:56 AM
I tend to follow men's basketball but i grew up on Long Island and know of Gabrielle Zaffiro , Amherst Commit
She is the second all time girls basketball score in Long Island and as a junior scored 51 points in a game
Another Amherst commit is Jade Duval from Cleveland who has an ESPN rating of 88 which is tkpical of a player recrutied from scholls such as Big Ten - I believe Minnesota maiy have offered her. \

back to my day job
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on June 02, 2018, 10:58:43 AM
Quote from: jayhawk on June 02, 2018, 09:25:56 AM
I tend to follow men's basketball but i grew up on Long Island and know of Gabrielle Zaffiro , Amherst Commit
She is the second all time girls basketball score in Long Island and as a junior scored 51 points in a game
Another Amherst commit is Jade Duval from Cleveland who has an ESPN rating of 88 which is tkpical of a player recrutied from scholls such as Big Ten - I believe Minnesota maiy have offered her. \

back to my day job

This could become your new day job - college recruiting analyst.    ;)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on August 16, 2018, 01:50:33 PM
Seems the Amherst's WBB team will be honored at the NBC's pre season game between the Patriots and the Eagles...tonight?  The team was honored last season at a Red Sox's last season when it won a National Title.  The Red Sox's GM is an Amherst alum.  Do not know the connection here.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on November 04, 2018, 04:02:27 PM
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=hose0/hok5qio2xsm38omm.jpg)

Welcome to the 2018-19 Division III basketball season!

The season also gets tipped off a week earlier than normal as the new start is now November 8. With an earlier start date comes an earlier start (and more total shows) for Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) as well.

On the season debut of the 16th season of Hoopsville, Dave McHugh will chat with the two preseason top picks, and defending champions, along with a coach who made a big move in the offseason.

Dave will also talk about a lot of the hot topics entering the season including not only normal coaching changes, but also last minute changes including in the Top 10 of women's basketball.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. Sunday's debut will hit the air at 7:00 p.m. ET. You can watch the show here: http://bit.ly/2PHzL3o

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to hoopsville@d3hoops.com or share them on social media.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Dale Wellman, No. 1 Nebraska Wesleyan men's head coach
- Pat Juckem, WashU men's head coach
- G.P. Gromacki, No. 1 Amherst women's head coach

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Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 15, 2018, 04:34:05 PM
Amherst's roster is up on their website.  Big FY class wrt numbers.  Not listed was jr. player...Nardella..that was at Amherst's Homecoming football game....where the WBB team received their Nat. Title rings.  New assist coach listed.  Also not listed was the MVP from the 2018 title win.  She had planned to be abroad for the first semester.  Was to be a student assistant on the team when she returned since she is not eligible this her senior year.  Oh well...questions wrt team.  Amherst's first game on Friday at home.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on November 15, 2018, 10:36:48 PM
Hey Amh, is Emma McCarthy the girl that is studying abroad and coming back as a graduate assistant coach because she is not on the roster for this year??
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 17, 2018, 02:03:45 PM
Yes, 7express.  Emma is still an undergrad and believe she will be on the bench as a student assistant. 
She transferred in from Fairfield Un. and Amherst lost an appeal with the powers to be...so this her senior year she will support her teammates in a different capacity.  Maybe she will be listed in the second semester.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 18, 2018, 09:28:50 AM
Did not get to watch the Amherst game last night...a blowout of sorts.  Was out to dinner with friends.  Amherst won it's 67th game with strong contributions from its FY's.  Write up was brief and stats on-line indicate the outside and inside games continue to be fine.  Side note....the new sports info director from Tufts appear to be overwhelmed presently.  The stats were presented Twice!  Other write ups have been below par, imho.  The person needs some help...an assistant or two??  Lots of winter sports to cover and post season games, etc.
Seems the double stats appeared on writeups of other Nescac WBB games.  Must be a software cliche.
Sunday's game writeup has only a single stats presentation.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on November 20, 2018, 09:31:20 PM
So the pressure is off.  Amherst blows big lead...now the young team has an idea of what it takes to play with a bullseye on their back. If they win NESCAC or make a deep run in NCAA it will be one of GP's best coaching jobs.  Did you hear the exhale from StL and WashU as their streak is safe!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 23, 2018, 10:29:10 AM
NE Jeff's Fan....yes there was some pressure on the team members.  Your reference to Wash U.
brought back some memories.  On the women bb side, the legendary coach built a great program in her time at WashU.  There was a strong JV team program, etc. that provided seasoned players, etc.
Recall the time Amherst challenged them in the post season only to lose in OT...on a missed foul shoot...thus continuing the 100 game streak.  Remember meeting the now retired Men's HC  in Salem, Va. after an Amherst win for the Title.  The MHC  went on to win two Nat. titles. 
Amherst's WHC seems to prefer small...11 player rosters.  One of Amherst's taller experienced players did not score a point in the game and did not seem to want to take a 3 point shot in the last few minutes of the game.  Could have used her rebounding too...as she was playing with 4 fouls. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on November 25, 2018, 10:49:21 PM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on November 20, 2018, 09:31:20 PM
So the pressure is off.  Amherst blows big lead...now the young team has an idea of what it takes to play with a bullseye on their back. If they win NESCAC or make a deep run in NCAA it will be one of GP's best coaching jobs.  Did you hear the exhale from StL and WashU as their streak is safe!

Hmm... what streak is safe? You do realize Amherst already blitz WashU's streak prior to this run, right? The record is 122 - held by Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: 7express on November 25, 2018, 11:11:29 PM
So....through 10 or so days and 3 or 4 games, how do we feel about the NESCAC so far??

Amherst blows a big 4th quarter home lead to Eastern, and than the Warriors proceed to get clubbed by 2 other conference teams, both of which are on down cycles: 20 @ Trinity, and then today to Williams by 15 (who at one point in the 4th had a 20 point lead.)  Eastern's only other game is a 13 point win over Roger Williams a team that made the NCAA tournament as a pool C last year.  With I believe the road games @ Tufts and @ Bowdoin this year I think it's going to be difficult for the Mammoths to win the league this year, but seeing Williams in action today they could be a challenge as well, especially if they are knocking down the 3 as effectively as they were today.  Still think Amherst will end up prevailing in both games, but really I wouldn't be shocked if they won the game @ Williams.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 26, 2018, 11:30:49 AM
Interesting post 7express.   Watched the Warriors' lost at home to Williams.  Williams is a puzzle at times,IMO.  The guard that shot the lights out in the 2nd half was a starter last season but seems to have lost that role.  Have watched both Tufts and Bowdoin play to date....yes, in early season games against weaker teams than ECSU.  It must be noted that Amherst's Nat. Title wins against Tufts and Bowdoin were blowouts.  Yet during the season matchups in 2017 and 2018, wether it was at home or away, the games were close...and the Amherst wins were by a few points. 
It is early....yet, I do expect tight games against the likes of the Polarbears and the Jumbos.  However, I also expect two wins over the Ephs....it is simply based on talent and coaching.  Amherst will hit their threes and win the battle of the boards.  Just like I expect ECSU to beat Williams if they should meet again.  Chang will not get her three point shots away unchallenged and Warrior players will control the boards.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on November 26, 2018, 07:43:18 PM
Congratulations to the new No. 1 team in all the land, Bowdoin.

This continues the NESCAC's streak of having the top ranked team for every week since Thomas More won the title in 2016.

https://www.d3hoops.com/top25/women/2018-19/week1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on November 27, 2018, 09:14:12 PM
When did Amherst have a 122 game winning streak? 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NEHoopsFan on November 28, 2018, 08:29:51 AM
Based on their website it was 121 game winning streak.

http://athletics.amherst.edu/sports/wbkb/record_book
(http://athletics.amherst.edu/sports/wbkb/record_book)
Home Winning Streak --- 121 Games (NCAA Record)
Started: Jan. 31, 2009 (Amherst def. Colby, 65-64)
Ended: Feb. 6, 2016 (Tufts def. Amherst, 52-51)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NEHoopsFan on November 28, 2018, 08:37:16 AM
Actually, I take that back. That was their home winning streak.  Apparently their most recent run was their longest winning streak (68 games I think).  According to ESPN the longest streak is 81 games

Division III
Men -- 60, Potsdam State (season opener 1985-March 17, 1987)
Women -- 81, Washington-St. Louis (Feb. 20, 1998-Jan. 12 2001)

http://www.espn.com/espn/wire/_/section/ncw/id/5944646
(http://www.espn.com/espn/wire/_/section/ncw/id/5944646)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 28, 2018, 11:47:04 AM
In any case....the Amherst team blew out a taller  Emmanuel team in Boston last night.  Starting a new streak...hopefully.  The returning starters got their mojo back and did it with defense and more balanced team scoring....H. Fox was the exception here by scoring 33 pts :)
Key Head Coach move, IMO, was putting Sr. PG McNamara into the game to take the load off of Fox.  "Mac" set a new assist record...for herself and at Amherst. 
It should be noted that two key players are just getting their BB "Feel" back as both are key players on their Fall sports teams.  H. Fox Is also a key contributor on another team...the Lax team.
Liked the way HC G. was clapping his hands as his players were making steals and defensive stops.  Rarely seen in games I have observed.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on December 06, 2018, 03:37:54 PM
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The Division III basketball season is nearly a month along. We have reached the first quarter pole of the season to evaluate where everyone is and where teams are headed. There have been plenty of surprises, upsets, teams stubbing their toes, and more. There are also some who are doing well despite maybe not being fully saddled when they left the gate.

On Thursday's edition of Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com), Dave takes a look at three programs which had very late coaching decisions and how those decisions have affected the programs. Two teams, Salisbury men and Trine women, saw their coaches suspended and then fired in the month leading up to their first games. Another, Brandeis men, saw their coach make national headlines, be fired, an interim hired, but then that decision reversed and a new coach hired just two weeks before practices began.

All three, are off to terrific starts accounting for a total of two losses on the season so far.

What is it like to adjust to a last minute coaching change? What is it like to take over a program, or enter an athletic department and school, in such perceived turmoil? How hard is it to put the blinders on and focus at the task at hand? We follow up Ryan Scott's terrific story last week with a chat with two players and a coach on the experience of dealing with change.

Plus, after years of waiting it finally happened! Division III women's basketball is getting it's own All-Star Game! Williams' coach Pat Manning discusses the long journey to the announcement, how they found a sponsor, and why the game will be the center piece of changing the women's Championship Weekend altogether.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch Thursday's show live starting at 7:00 p.m. ET here: http://bit.ly/2E4YCb4.

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to hoopsville@d3hoops.com or use any of the social media options below.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Jean Bain, Brandeis men's coach
- Chase Kumor, Salisbury men's senior
- Cassidy Williams, No. 11 Trine women's senior
- Pat Manning, Williams' head coach & WBCA All-Star Game Committee member

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Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 01, 2019, 06:04:08 PM
It's been awhile...for me :)....since my last post here.  Anyway, Amherst completed their four game road trip during semester break today.  Two wins in Las Vegas and two wins in Orange County Ca. There was a NBA Lakers game outing in between.  Amherst's two all-American candidate junior guards performed well.  Hannah Fox who set a Amherst's scoring record of 43 points in Vegas in a win was followed by 30 point game in a win over host Chapman today by Madeline Eck.
First Nescac game this Friday with Trinity in Hartford.  Line up seems to be settling in...three juniors and two seniors.  One Soph and 5 FYs are the subs....with a FY "big" coming in for a taller lineup.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 01, 2019, 08:51:31 PM
Plus G.P. Gromacki won his 500th career game:
https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2018/12/gromacki-500-wins
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 02, 2019, 08:58:14 PM
Congrats to GP.  He's the epitome of "Coaching matters!"
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 04, 2019, 09:48:34 PM
Amherst wins in a surprising blowout of a solid Trinity team in Hartford.  Both teams had 10-1 records entering the game and now Amherst is 11-1..71 to 49 Victory.  Not much more to say.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: fb73 on January 05, 2019, 10:09:13 AM
Not surprised. Trinity's recorded is deceiving since they play a very weak non league schedule.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: JustAFan on January 05, 2019, 12:23:34 PM
Game of the day today clearly is #1 Bowdoin at #4 Tufts. This game will be a good benchmark for Tufts--are the young Jumbos (only 1 senior starter) overachieving despite graduating 2 key starters or simply rebuilding? Bowdoin defeated Tufts decisively in both the regular season and elite eight last year.  Neither team has been tested this year. The only common opponent was Colby, which Bowdoin defeated by 30 early in the season and Tufts beat by 17 last night.  Bowdoin is averaging 86.6 points a game and shooting an amazing 48% from the field while the Jumbos are an equally impressive 83 ppg and 48%.  Should be a good one!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: truenorth on January 06, 2019, 12:32:47 PM
To keep it in perspective, Bowdoin graduated 3 key seniors from last year's national runner up team, including D3 POY Kate Kerrigan.  Looks like Bowdoin pulled away in the 4th quarter during what had been a close game...
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 20, 2019, 05:44:21 PM
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Milestones, upsets, underdogs, under the radar, and giving back ... that's what's on tap for Sunday's Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com).

While in the conference grind, there are always results people don't expect. Whether an upset or a team flying under the radar finally pops up on everyone's radar, there are games and teams worth paying attention to outside the usual suspects. But even the top teams in the country have a story to tell.

On Sunday's episode, we will learn what it's like to be on the top team in the country, how a team can still fly under the radar with big results in on a difficult conference, how another team has emerged that no one was expecting on top of another competitive conference, how one of the top conferences in the county ticks and how the races there may turn out, and the importance of giving back to the community especially in honor of one of the country's greatest leaders.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. Sunday's show will air live starting at 7:00 p.m. ET here: http://bit.ly/2HoPIZf (and simulcast on Facebook Live and Periscope).

Oh ... and the show is definitely going to see some "overtime" tonight.

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to hoopsville@d3hoops.com or use any of the social media options to the right.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Hillary Scott, No. 17 Lynchburg men's coach
- Joe Crispin, Rowan men's coach
- Tim McDonald, Cabrini men's coach (NABC Coach's Corner)
- Chris Martin, CCIW Commissioner
- Abby Kelly, No. 1 Bowdoin senior guard
- Ryan Scott, D3hoops.com lead columnist (Top 25 Double-Take)

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Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 23, 2019, 10:51:32 AM
Yesterday, Amherst traveled to Middletown and won against a big Cardinals team.  Amherst has had problems against teams with a big front line.  Amherst seemed to be in a match-up zone defensive scheme for a long time.  Everyone on an eleven player team got minutes.  Seems there is a 6'1" FY guard contributing big time....been hitting 3-points at a high % in the last few games...and playing solid defense on the perimeter.  Amherst FY front line players contributing offensively and defensively.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 24, 2019, 12:00:38 PM
Seemed like Wesleyan's zone defense gave them fits for a while.  Good thing the 3's started falling, because they didn't get inside with any regularity.  I'm sure coach will be working on that.  Big weekends ahead.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on January 24, 2019, 12:21:38 PM
Bowdoin has good size down low and the Mammoths relied heavily on F Emma McCarthy to win the title game last year. It'll be interesting to see how Amherst handles that this weekend.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on January 25, 2019, 04:50:42 AM
Almost two years ago someone posted here that it was time to see if Midd is for real.  That was true then and it's true now.  It's also the way the schedule is set up.  The past two seasons Middlebury has been the best of the rest.  They've been the Nescac tournament quarterfinal host who didn't have reasonable expectations of playing in the final four a few weeks later.  The Panthers lost both times to a team they'd handled in the regular season.  5th year head coach KJ Krasco, an assistant coach at Bowdoin before coming to Middlebury, has revived a program that last thrived at the turn of the century.  She has a veteran squad that is ready to win a tournament game at home; if they're for real.  Still, the question.  On Sunday they face Trinity who once was ranked above them in the "also receiving votes"  Top 25 listing.  Trinity only has one loss except for the inevitable outcomes of having faced both Amherst and Bowdoin.  Only a season ending trip to Tufts remains; if Trinity is also for real.  Middlebury has only faced Tufts.  They played them to a four point margin except for an explosive third quarter.  Trinity is a must win game; if Middlebury is for real.  Do the math.  They host Bowdoin following the Trinity road trip and close out the regular season in LeFrak. 

Like amh63, I bemoan the decision several years back to end the M/W doubleheader scheduling format, especially in conference play.  I suspect that both the Panthers and the Bantams are for real.  The sad reality of the situation is that only one can own the boast when Sunday's game is finished.  Even then, there are a few more games to play.  Middlebury plays some good basketball.  They're a lot of fun to watch.  I wish I could do it more often.  I believe this team's for real.

Go Panthers!

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 25, 2019, 08:43:42 AM
 Having seen Middlebury's Betsy Knox play many times in AAU and high school, I know she's a quality player. Another, Vanessa Young, hasn't been a factor for reasons of injury and whatever.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 25, 2019, 10:54:33 AM
Vandy74....nice to read a perceptive post, again, my friend.  Had noticed that the lady panthers....no, women panthers, were making their talents known in the conference.
Several comments on the women Jeffs :)...since the return of Emma M. on the sidelines as an student assistant...been overseas and the new semester is starting. 
First, the experienced upperclass players are all starting and getting the minutes.
Second, ms Fox has moved more to the no. 2 spot and the primary PG duties have moved to Sr. captain, MacNamera that has surprisingly developed a solid 3-point shot.
Third, opponents have gone to a zone to eliminate the slashing/scoring drives of the former Nescac rookie of the year....now a junior and prominent scorer, Eck, along with Fox.
The matchup zone played recently is hopefully to reduce the effectiveness of opponents exterior offense...I.e., Bowdoin and Tufts. 
Seems that the women's game has turned to 3-point shooting these days in many conferences.  On that note, Amherst has Four starters now that can make outside shots...plus a 6 foot plus rookie that has shown that she can shoot them too in several recent games.  She also has long arms to guard the perimeter.   The young FY inside players are playing better in recent games...not being pushed around by bulkier opponents and not rushing their shots.  They are getting rebounds now. 
Will see if the interior play continues today against Colby.  Outside shots falling will open up the inside for drives.
Yes, big games today and on Sat.  Both away games. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on January 25, 2019, 10:59:23 AM
Vandy:

Good post re: Bants versus Pants.

The winner of the Trinity/Middlebury game also has a shot at making the 2019 NCAA Tournament as an at-large team. Both teams are going to have really good winning percentages and, I assume, really good SOS. The NESCAC has put four teams in the Tournament before.

PS -- I should've mentioned that Trinity also has a big game against Williams tonight. That's not a given and a loss there takes the luster off any win against the Panthers.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on January 26, 2019, 09:40:41 AM
I have been quiet so far this season, but should be a really good game this afternoon with Amherst and Bowdoin.  Bowdoin seems to have an overall well rounded team, with good size, inside and outside scoring, and very fast guards that can pressure.  Amherst also looks solid.  Based on what I have seen this year, I think Bowdoin at home has the advantage. This game will likely decide the home court for the NESCAC finals, since Bowdoin has already defeated Tufts.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: GameBall14 on January 26, 2019, 02:12:11 PM
Should be a great game between Amherst and Bowdoin today. Williams with a tough hard fought win at Trinity last night as they a late three gave the Ephs the win. Erickson with a great effort for the Bantams but the balanced attack from Williams prevailed.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 27, 2019, 01:23:32 PM
Hard fought game between Bowdoin and Amherst.  The youth of Amherst showed in the second half as they seemed to panic a bit when Bowdoin shots started falling and theirs did not.  Mammoths seemed to believe that they didn't have to play as intense defense in the second half with such a large lead.  GP teams rarely lose when they have a lead that large.  Hope they can learn some things and maybe have a repeat in the NESCAC tourney.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: truenorth on January 28, 2019, 08:53:25 AM
In fairness, the turning tide in that game had as much to do with Bowdoin's second half adjustments and committed, heads-up play as it did with Amherst's "declining defensive intensity"...  It was pretty remarkable that Bowdoin came back from 16 down at the half and prevailed by 9 points against arguably the best defensive team in D3 over the past several years.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 29, 2019, 02:30:27 PM
Totally agree with last post.  Hopefully young team will buy-in to what Gromacki is preaching when to comes to executing on defense.  Great adjustments by Bowdoin, and they came out of the locker room truly believing they could win the game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 29, 2019, 02:56:52 PM
A little late to post wrt the Amherst games last weekend.....with another key weekend of games ahead.  First...congrats to the Bowdoin women.  They played with great intensity in the second half before a tremendous home crowd.  The announcer...a favorite of mine...estimated 2200 plus with many standing in " no no areas on the stairs".  Offical posted crowd of 1500...facility basketball limit?
In the game against Colby, Hannah Fox's outside shooting was off and scored a few points only....leading scorer.  The other star Jr. player, Eck, carried the scoring load.  Number of FY players played.
In the Bowdoin game, Ms. Fox contributed more in the scoring total....but seemed to me to defer the outside shooting to others.  No outside shots taken by Sr. PG "Mac".   Credit is given to the Head Coach of Bowdoin with her subsitution of players throughout the game, especially in the 2nd half.  Other than the FY guard Resch, few if any other FY players were put in....no front court players.  Seemed Coach "G" wanted his FY players to watch and learn how it is before a "Hostile Home Crowd".  I used the term hostlle here for it was surprising to me to hear the boos...online...in the 2nd half, when calls went against the PBears.  Crowd was dead silent in the first half when Amherst was leading and foul calls were made.
The announcer noticed that in the last few minutes after several Amherst time outs, Amherst made fouls to get another chance to reduce the Bear lead and maybe win.  The announcer suggested on line that Amherst was maybe practicing a scenario in a future matchup.
In the last few years....Amherst played both Tufts and Bowdoin in regular season games that ended in wins, each by very few points.  However, in the national title game against Tufts, it was a blowout win.  In last year's National Title win against the Polar Bears...same result...a 20 point win.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: truenorth on January 30, 2019, 08:08:45 AM
Well, if we accept the notion that past events are a reliable predictor of the future, Amherst should win their rematches vs. Bowdoin and Tufts this season by blowout margins...   :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 30, 2019, 01:49:49 PM
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The Hoopsville Marathon Show ... is tomorrow!

Tune in starting at 12:00 p.m. ET as we talk to guests from around the country about nothing but #d3hoops.

It is all about celebrating the season, student-athletes, coaches, and an exciting season.

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We will share more about the show a little later.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: GameBall14 on January 31, 2019, 04:26:37 PM
I've seen Amherst play twice this year and they are not even close to the defensive team they've been the last couple of years. They are better offensively this year especially when Fox is on her game, which is most of the time. The halftime adjustments by Bowdoin got the Polar Bears going and got the packed house into the game. Congrats to Bowdoin and the Brunswick community for filling the gym, it was great to see!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 01, 2019, 12:51:23 AM
Quote from: GameBall14 on January 31, 2019, 04:26:37 PM
I've seen Amherst play twice this year and they are not even close to the defensive team they've been the last couple of years. They are better offensively this year especially when Fox is on her game, which is most of the time. The halftime adjustments by Bowdoin got the Polar Bears going and got the packed house into the game. Congrats to Bowdoin and the Brunswick community for filling the gym, it was great to see!

I would agree with you. Not as solid defensively and I attribute that to how they are a younger team with less experience, but they can still get it done offensively (and with the right opponent, put a lot of points on the board). I don't think Amherst is going to win a national championship, and I didn't expect that going into the season, but they will still make the NCAA Tournament interesting.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 01, 2019, 09:06:53 PM
Did you catch the Amherst vs Tufts game at Medford Dave?? :)
Check the score between the highly ranked teams.  Someone's offense was off? OR someone's defense was on.  Both Amherst's top scorers were hiddered by fouls in the first half....with Tufts making 4-5 foul shots and Amherst had NO foul shots.  Second half saw Amherst lead continue to grow to double digits. 
Guess Amherst got it's defensive groove back.  Amherst wins by ten points in an away game at Tufts. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on February 02, 2019, 01:40:35 AM
There was another game worth paying attention to this evening amh63.  Bowdoin outlasted Middlebury 62-58 in Pepin Gymnasium.  Trailing 3-12 at 3:53 of the 1st quarter the Panthers finally found their offense and the period ended with the scored knotted at 13 apiece.  The Polar Bears hit from behind the arc to open the second quarter but Middebury went on a 15-0 run over the final 6 minutes to hold a 33-22 advantage at the half.  The hosts led by 13 going into the final period.  It was, however, all Polar Bears in the final stanza.  Maddie Hasson and Abby Kelly combined for 21 points on 9-13 shooting and Bowdoin finally claimed the lead with just 20 seconds left on the clock.  Congratulations to the #1 ranked team in DIII women's basketball. 

The Panthers, basically a seven player rotation once conference play begins, were playing without the services of key starter Betsy Knox, and from 6:53 in the 3rd quarter team rebounding leader Cat Harrison played with 4 fouls.  Congratulations to Middlebury on a gutsy performance that almost earned the W.

When Williams defeated Colby tonight it was victory #500 in HC Pat Manning's career.   The Eph's mentor has been at the helm for 29 seasons, only six removed from a #3 national ranking and participation in championship weekend play.  Congratulations coach.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 02, 2019, 07:23:17 AM
Bowdoin has put up two extremely impressive wins on back to back weekends. I thought the Bowdoin comeback against Amherst was really all about how Bowdoin came out and attacked offensively in the second half.  Last night, Bowdoin turned in on in the fourth quarter with great defense and clutch offensive possessions.  They are a very sound and deep team, and their coach does a great job of rotating players so that the key players are at full strength at crunch time.  I think Kelly has had two monster games and continues to come up with the big shots and should be the NESCAC player of the year.
I was not surprised that Amherst beat Tufts.  I don't think Tufts is as strong as they have been
I was also very impressed with Middlebury, but they did fold in the end and could not get good shots against the amped up Bowdoin defense.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on February 02, 2019, 10:12:39 AM
Amh63,
   Amherst WBB has gotten a commit from a local VA player - Maggie Shipley 6-0 SG/W Yorktown High School. She is on my prospect list, like current stars Hannah Fox and Madeline Eck were, previously.
    On a separate note, took my son and grandsons this summer to Cleveland/Canton(RocknRoll/Pro Football HOFs). 1st exhibit in Canton was a display of football cards sponsored by Murad Cigarettes - in 1909, Amherst was 1 of 40 schools with their own team photo card.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 02, 2019, 10:43:19 AM
A little additional note....Amherst had several players foul out and a third with 4 fouls.  Eck, a 1st team conference selection and the ROY in the conference got two fouls early and went to the bench in the first half....played with four fouls late into the 2nd half.  Amherst milked the clock with Fox late in the 2nd half as Tufts pressed and fouled to get the ball back.  Tufts' announcer...student...thought the Jumbos still had a chance with less than a minute to go.  Fox's sealed the game on the foul line.  Solid effort by Tufts for a comeback at Home.
Nice post Vandy.....it clarified the game since I studied the stats of the game in Pepin.  I had a hope for an Big Upset in order to increase the chance that Amherst would Host the Tourny.  Now, I am worried by the Midd match....going South on Monday for family, Friends, and Warmth.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 02, 2019, 11:04:53 AM
ronk...thanks for supporting Amherst in finding great prospects ;D.  Keep up the good work.  Yes, another all-Nescac player would be nice.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 02, 2019, 07:03:44 PM
Colby upset today of Middlebury will shake up the final standings.  Trinity has tiebreaker over Middlebury.  Middlebury did not look good against Colby, and Colby shot lights out from three. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 06, 2019, 02:39:28 PM
First women's regional rankings are out: https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2019/02/women-regional-rankings-first
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 13, 2019, 02:53:33 PM
Regional Rankings Week 2 released: https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2019/02/women-regional-rankings-second
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 20, 2019, 03:00:34 PM
The new NCAA Division III women's basketball regional rankings are posted: https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2019/02/women-regional-rankings-third
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on February 24, 2019, 01:42:20 PM
We started the weekend with 3 undefeated teams.  Only Thomas More survived the weekend still undefeated.

Congrats to Tufts-- NESCAC WBB Champion.  Tufts knocks off #1 Bowdoin, 75-69/
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on February 24, 2019, 02:57:07 PM
It doesn't seem possible with the way D3 puts teams in brackets by region, but would be fun to have Amherst, Tufts and Bowdoin in separate quadrants of the bracket and see how far each can get.  Congrats to Tufts.  Came through when it counted!!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on February 24, 2019, 03:57:02 PM
From what I saw, Tufts may have played its best game of the year today.  The game was an excellent game on both sides.  Tufts got scoring from a number of people, and was able to hold of Bowdoin.  I still think Bowdoin is the better team, but obviously not today.  Hopefully the NCAA can arrange things so Bowdoin does not have to play either Amherst or Tufts until the finals four.  Amherst, Tufts, and Bowdoin and likely three of the top teams in the country.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on February 24, 2019, 06:26:49 PM
Quote from: Maine 1 on February 24, 2019, 03:57:02 PM
From what I saw, Tufts may have played its best game of the year today.  The game was an excellent game on both sides.  Tufts got scoring from a number of people, and was able to hold of Bowdoin.  I still think Bowdoin is the better team, but obviously not today.  Hopefully the NCAA can arrange things so Bowdoin does not have to play either Amherst or Tufts until the finals four.  Amherst, Tufts, and Bowdoin and likely three of the top teams in the country.

This would leave everyone else in the Thomas More quadrant; we'll see if it can be pulled off, but unlikely. It was the same last year but Bowdoin and Tufts ended up in the same Scranton sectional.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on February 25, 2019, 03:23:28 PM
Respect for the NESCAC!!  So glad Middlebury made it into the dance, and Tufts, Amherst and Bowdoin could all meet in the Final Four.  Hard to believe the committee separated those 3 teams, but each team has some really tough teams to get past to make the Final Four.   Good luck to all!!!

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 25, 2019, 03:28:40 PM
The brackets for the NCAA TOURNEY are out.   Bowdoin, Tufts and Amherst are ALL hosting!
Believe the committee separated them enough so that all three could meet in Salem. 
Middlebury is also in.  Each bracket has big hurdles though.  Nescac teams must be ready!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on February 25, 2019, 08:23:48 PM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on February 25, 2019, 03:23:28 PM
Respect for the NESCAC!!  So glad Middlebury made it into the dance, and Tufts, Amherst and Bowdoin could all meet in the Final Four.  Hard to believe the committee separated those 3 teams, but each team has some really tough teams to get past to make the Final Four.   Good luck to all!!!

The decision to separate the Big 3 isn't without precedent.  From 2009-2013, Amherst, Williams and Middlebury had the same kind of stranglehold in men's basketball that the Amherst, Bowdoin and Tufts women do now.  In conference play they only lost to each other.  In the 2012-13 season all three were top 10 teams, usually ranked no lower then #8, and were placed in different brackets in the postseason tournament.  All survived to the round of eight and Amherst went on to win the national championship.

A special congratulations to the Middlebury Panthers on being selected.  Head coach KJ Krasco has done an outstanding job in her five years at the helm, twice earning the #4 conference tournament seed.  This season in regular season play the Panthers led Bowdoin until only 20 seconds remained before losing 62-58.  Seniors Alex Huffman, Colleen Caveney and Catherine Harrison have played 298 games wearing the Middlebury blue and white, starting in 269 of them. 

Good luck to the four NESCAC representatives.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on March 01, 2019, 08:15:59 PM
Middlebury 62 John Carroll 54.  I wish I could have seen it.  No video.  No live stats.  Even the ongoing contest featuring the hosts provides only the latter.  Any idea if this was an unfortunate system breakdown or will tomorrow's game be unavailable to anyone without a ticket as well?

Congratulations to KJ Krasco's Panthers on their 20th victory of the season.  It had been 17 years since Middlebury women's basketball won 20 games and 23 seasons since the program advanced to the NCAA second round.  It was a solid team effort from seniors Alex Huffman, Coleen Caveney and Cat Harrison along with juniors Maya Davis, Kira Waldman and Betsy Knox.  Ten minutes of spot relief were provide by senior Ivy Houde.  Box scores only supply statistics.  Hopefully tomorrow's game will be available to online viewers.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 01, 2019, 11:50:43 PM
 At least the last 2 mins were on the D3 wrap-around show; don't know how they had the video and u didn't, but they'll be doing it again tomorrow nite @ 6 PM.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: BJ - DSU SID on March 02, 2019, 12:07:14 AM
Quote from: Vandy74 on March 01, 2019, 08:15:59 PM
Middlebury 62 John Carroll 54.  I wish I could have seen it.  No video.  No live stats.  Even the ongoing contest featuring the hosts provides only the latter.  Any idea if this was an unfortunate system breakdown or will tomorrow's game be unavailable to anyone without a ticket as well?

Congratulations to KJ Krasco's Panthers on their 20th victory of the season.  It had been 17 years since Middlebury women's basketball won 20 games and 23 seasons since the program advanced to the NCAA second round.  It was a solid team effort from seniors Alex Huffman, Coleen Caveney and Cat Harrison along with juniors Maya Davis, Kira Waldman and Betsy Knox.  Ten minutes of spot relief were provide by senior Ivy Houde.  Box scores only supply statistics.  Hopefully tomorrow's game will be available to online viewers.

Vandy74...we had both Live Video and Live Stats...not sure where you were looking but both were available and running smoothly.  Here is a link to the archived video - https://athletics.desales.edu/watch/?Archive=423&type=Archive

We will have both also available for tomorrow's game at 7 PM.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on March 02, 2019, 12:32:36 AM
Quote from: BJ - DSU SID on March 02, 2019, 12:07:14 AM
Quote from: Vandy74 on March 01, 2019, 08:15:59 PM
Middlebury 62 John Carroll 54.  I wish I could have seen it.  No video.  No live stats.  Even the ongoing contest featuring the hosts provides only the latter.  Any idea if this was an unfortunate system breakdown or will tomorrow's game be unavailable to anyone without a ticket as well?

Congratulations to KJ Krasco's Panthers on their 20th victory of the season.  It had been 17 years since Middlebury women's basketball won 20 games and 23 seasons since the program advanced to the NCAA second round.  It was a solid team effort from seniors Alex Huffman, Coleen Caveney and Cat Harrison along with juniors Maya Davis, Kira Waldman and Betsy Knox.  Ten minutes of spot relief were provide by senior Ivy Houde.  Box scores only supply statistics.  Hopefully tomorrow's game will be available to online viewers.

Vandy74...we had both Live Video and Live Stats...not sure where you were looking but both were available and running smoothly.  Here is a link to the archived video - https://athletics.desales.edu/watch/?Archive=423&type=Archive

We will have both also available for tomorrow's game at 7 PM.


The problem must be my computer although I've had no problem streaming any other games.  For some reason the video doesn't play.  Everything seems to be working.  There's a brief period of buffering.  Then nothing.  Where the events are listed below the vid-screen the basketball games have a gray box with a camera profile to the left.  All of the upcoming events below have an icon pic of the sport being played.  It suggests that for some reason only the basketball links are malfunctioning.  Very frustrating.  I watched both men's and women's basketball all night long without any other problems.   
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 02, 2019, 12:40:42 AM
We had no problems from DeSales broadcasts tonight.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on March 02, 2019, 12:43:52 AM
It occurs to me that the two basketball games may lack the game action photo ID at this time because they've already been played.  I don't know how things work on this school's site.  If that's the case I will only add that today when the game was being played there was no picture of basketball to the left of the game description.  The link seemed to be inoperative.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Vandy74 on March 02, 2019, 12:46:19 AM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 02, 2019, 12:40:42 AM
We had no problems from DeSales broadcasts tonight.

It would seem to be a compatibility issue with my computer then. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 02, 2019, 09:14:33 AM
I got the Middlebury feed, but was amazed in the day in age of great streaming video and audio that one of the feeds I watched for a while had a banner that said "no audio available."  Seems if you get the privilege to host you ought to be able to provide a person to call the game.  Maybe it was a technical glitch.  Looking forward to some great match ups today. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 02, 2019, 09:57:15 AM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on March 02, 2019, 09:14:33 AM
I got the Middlebury feed, but was amazed in the day in age of great streaming video and audio that one of the feeds I watched for a while had a banner that said "no audio available."  Seems if you get the privilege to host you ought to be able to provide a person to call the game.  Maybe it was a technical glitch.  Looking forward to some great match ups today.

And, Gordon Mann was there already as an interested observer.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 02, 2019, 10:07:18 AM
Vandy74.....after watching the earlier game in LeFrak, the Amherst game did not have any video!  Complained online to the NSN idiots and did not get a reply.  Seems the NSN late games would not function.  Guess the AD and SID will get a piece of my mind and loose my financial support...period
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 02, 2019, 10:11:50 AM
I watched the Amherst game from LeFrak with good video and audio.  Just goes to show that the streaming technology is not a foolproof as traditional broadcast media.  Sometimes I can get on phone and not computer and visa versa.  Also can help to shut down and reboot whatever device you're using. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 02, 2019, 04:13:41 PM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on March 02, 2019, 09:14:33 AM
I got the Middlebury feed, but was amazed in the day in age of great streaming video and audio that one of the feeds I watched for a while had a banner that said "no audio available."  Seems if you get the privilege to host you ought to be able to provide a person to call the game.  Maybe it was a technical glitch.  Looking forward to some great match ups today.

They had a commentator. We took the broadcast full and heard Mark Simon.

Or was this a different game? I heard broadcasters at all games we hit, but didn't hit every game. Also, that could be a default setting sometimes (sounds like a Stretch broadcast header).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 07, 2019, 03:56:39 PM
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=o0hph/9l54usrryjbt1lc9.jpg)

The second weekend of the DIII Men's and Women's Championship Tournaments is set to start. Can the upset minded teams continue to prevail? Can the "favorites" maintain their poise? What home team will enjoy their own cooking? And who will still be playing in Fort Wayne and Salem?

On Thursday's Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com), Dave is joined by a number of guests to get a look not only at the action ahead this weekend, but the action coming at the final fours. Which teams seemed ready to be playing one more weekend?

Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. Thursday's show will air live starting at 7:00 p.m. ET. here: http://bit.ly/2C82LcA (or via Facebook Live and Periscope simulcasts).

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to dave.mchugh@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options below.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- John Taurer, No. 13 St. Thomas men's coach
- Dave Hixon, No. 7 Amherst men's coach
- Nathan Denison, VP for Sales, Memorial Coliseum (Fort Wayne, Ind.)
- Mark Morefield, No. 12 UMHB women's coach
- Carla Berube, No. 4 Tufts women's coach

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Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: UWPSUPERFAN77 on March 08, 2019, 11:36:08 PM
Nice try Amherst! You fought from behind and almost won! You played like the defending champs !  St Thomas beat a great Team!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 09, 2019, 07:00:02 AM
Overall a great night for the NESCAC.  Bowdoin continues to look very strong, and Tufts played a solid game.  Amherst fought hard, and just came up a little short.  I continue to be surprised at how little Amherst uses its bench.  I believe they may have 13 minutes total from two players. Tufts will have a tough matchup in Scranton against the Lady Royals. Hoping to see two NESCAC teams in the final four.  The top of the conference continues to be the cream of Division III women's hoops.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: UWPSUPERFAN77 on March 09, 2019, 12:15:32 PM
I agree! I think you have to get worn out playing 45 minutes. However,Amherst does what  they do!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 10, 2019, 09:17:21 AM
Amherst's HC seems to prefer a "small in number" squad....11 players.  Last year, several players were injured and one was never dressed for the games.
The only conference team to remain is Bowdoin.  The Lady Royals finally beat Tufts and will be this year's Purple and White team in the Final 4. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Rofrog on March 10, 2019, 09:27:53 AM
So we tie it all up tufts beat us twice we beat them twice.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 10, 2019, 05:54:46 PM
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=o65k8/8g9z0il3ffqsli12.jpg)

The final fours are set! Eight of the best men's and women's teams remain to battle it out for two national titles. On the women's side, many of those expected to make it to Salem. On the men's side, none of the top four powers will be in Fort Wayne.

Sunday on Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com), Dave takes a look at both a record breaking performance on the men's side and chats with the four teams dancing on the women's side. (Due to the extensive coverage in Fort Wayne at the men's championship weekend, Sunday's show will have more women's coverage than men's.) How one man put up 62-points in a game and has already shattered the single-tournament scoring record. And how the four hosts on the women's side survived their weekends to advance.

Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. Sunday's show can be seen LIVE starting at 7:00 p.m. ET right here: http://bit.ly/2NRnPZi (or via Facebook Live and Periscope simulcasts).

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to dave.mchugh@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options below.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Aston Francis, Wheaton (Ill.) senior guard
- Jeff Hans, No. 1 Thomas More women's coach
- Adrienne Schibles, No. 3 Bowdoin women's coach
- Ruth Sinn, No. 2 St. Thomas women's coach
- Bridgette Mann, No. 9 Scranton senior guard
- Carey Harveycutter, City of Salem (Vir.)

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Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: UWPSUPERFAN77 on March 11, 2019, 10:24:49 AM
Thank you AMH63!  You gals really played well at St Thomas! It must be expensive to sit on the Bench at such an exclusive school! saw your gym on video. What an old and historical gym! You had 1900 hundread in on Friday for the men. must have been SRO! God bless!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: UWPSUPERFAN77 on March 11, 2019, 10:30:19 AM
Saw most of Tuffs game on Saturday! 1900  fans at Scranton PA! game ugly for 3 quarters,poor shooting. A big disappointment as the lost the  lead! Your conference went a little flat at the end ! You guys will be back! Enjoyed watching your great teams!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 11, 2019, 02:13:58 PM
Side note of sorts to UWPSUPERFAN77.  LeFrak gym...used for basketball and volleyball games was rebuilt and enlarged after a fire.  It is large enough for two courts now and can hold graduation ceremonies indoors if needed.  In fact, the complex of facilities have been updated and upgraded recently too....see facilities info on the website.  Amherst with an enrollment of 1800 plus, is now spending big bucks for overall school improvements.....recently completed a 240,000 sq. Ft. new Science Center in the Fall, 2018. 
Thanks for your praise of the WBB team...three are multi sport players.  A senior guard plays on the soccer team, a junior forward...the one that had her shot blocked and made a shot to take the game into OT is a fine volleyball player from Ct.  Jr guard, Fox, has just had her name added to the lacrosse team.....very good player.  Sat with her parents at Gettysburg College, PA. last spring.  Amherst with significant contributions from Hannah Fox almost beat Gettysburg in a NCAA sectional game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Rofrog on March 12, 2019, 07:20:36 AM
Uwspsuperfan 77 and amh63:I truly have a question for you guys.You said it was an ugly game between Scranton/Tufts did you see the game seriously?Let's compare your ugly game anaylist.First the great game Amherst/St Thomas Amherst hit a stellar 23-70 32.6%from the field.8-27 from 3pt range 29.6% and finally 4-8 free throw for 50%.St Thomas 22-55 40% from the field.5-18 from 3 pts range 27.8% and finally 12-20 60% on free throws.Lets move to the ugly game Tufts15-61 24.6%from the field.5-19 26.3 % from 3 pts range and 5-6 free throw 83.3 %.Scranton 14-43from the field 32.6% 3- 13 from 3 pt range for 23.1% and finally 13-18 for 72.2 %.My question is why was one game uglier and the other one was a great game?please explain?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: truenorth on March 12, 2019, 08:55:41 AM
Sounds like beauty might be in the eyes of the beholder...  ;)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 12, 2019, 10:35:26 AM
People also tend to include turnovers in that sort of description: 19 in the Amherst-UST game, which was 45 minutes, and 24 in the Tufts-Scranton game. One more set of data points to consider.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: UWPSUPERFAN77 on March 12, 2019, 01:54:32 PM
To Rofog: you raise some good points! I  give you karma You still need to put points on the Board,at least in the 50s at this level .  TO amh63" Thank you for the info. you are a great fanof womens hoops!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Rofrog on March 13, 2019, 01:55:21 AM
Since when do we have to score a certain amount to be considered a good game that is just wrong.One of the best games I ever saw (which i saw alot,Way before d3hoops)was between Scranton,Bowdoin again not hitting 50 but playing defense(I'm taking it ,That not many people like a defense of game.Well I do ,I hate games 101-98 if I want them games I will watch NBA.But anyways back to Scranton/Bowdoin I think the biggest lead was 3 pts at the end when Taryn Mellody hit a 3 in the corner at the long center to win and advance Scranton to its 9th final four 49-46.This game had the same feel yes alot of shots ,alot of turnovers but defense causes that on both ends and it propelled Scranton to their 10th final four appearance.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: UWPSUPERFAN77 on March 13, 2019, 11:12:53 AM
Rofog: We agree on more than not! good basketball are exciting games! We may disagree on what that is! keep your passion!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 16, 2019, 10:28:43 AM
Congratulations to Bowdoin.  Hopefully this is the year that Bowdoin can get their first national championship. They have a well balanced team, and Shibbles has continued the tradition established by her predecessor.  Thomas Moore is very good, and there Point guard is a tremendous player. The matchup with Choate will be interesting.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: truenorth on March 16, 2019, 11:20:55 AM
Agreed...Bowdoin has a very balanced and dynamic team, and has proven to be resilient when behind late in games.  They are quick at both ends of the court and seem to communicate very well with each other.  They're obviously up against a #1 ranked and undefeated team.  In looking at the rosters, Thomas More's starters are taller on average.  So it will be interesting to see how Bowdoin's athleticism and balanced scoring matches up with Thomas More's height advantage and consensus POY.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 16, 2019, 03:31:40 PM
Quote from: Maine 1 on March 16, 2019, 10:28:43 AM
Congratulations to Bowdoin.  Hopefully this is the year that Bowdoin can get their first national championship. They have a well balanced team, and Shibbles has continued the tradition established by her predecessor.  Thomas Moore is very good, and there Point guard is a tremendous player. The matchup with Choate will be interesting.

Had talked with Madison Temple's dad last nite & told him that Choate would be a challenge to her; then talked with Taylor's dad @ breakfast this morning and mentioned the reverse challenge with Madison. Should be a great game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Maine 1 on March 16, 2019, 09:31:45 PM
unfortunately, Thomas Moore was in a different league.  They had too much size and talent and clearly are the best team in D3.  A great season for Bowdoin.  They should certainly be proud of everything they accomplished, and it was great to see how hard they all played to the end, especially Abby Kelly.  She really showed a lot of heart and fought to the end.
A great two year run for Bowdoin.  Sometimes you just run into a better team
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: P'bearfan on March 18, 2019, 11:52:48 AM
Congrats to Bowdoin for a great year!!  It didn't end the way everyone hoped but the coaches and players put together terrific back-to-back seasons.

GoUBears!!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on May 29, 2019, 09:32:18 PM
Just been notified that the Tufts HC is the new HC of Princeton.  My best man who is an UConn fan....but now resides next to UNC...notified me.  Seems the Former Princeton HC is now the HC of UNC.  Anyway...the last Nescac HC that headed South to a D1 job was the Bowdoin HC who went to the Naval Academy in Annapolis, Md.
The long time great coach at D3 WashU recently left for a D1 HC too.  Guess money talks.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on May 29, 2019, 09:58:45 PM
Quote from: amh63 on May 29, 2019, 09:32:18 PM
Just been notified that the Tufts HC is the new HC of Princeton.  My best man who is an UConn fan....but now resides next to UNC...notified me.  Seems the Former Princeton HC is now the HC of UNC.  Anyway...the last Nescac HC that headed South to a D1 job was the Bowdoin HC who went to the Naval Academy in Annapolis, Md.
The long time great coach at D3 WashU recently left for a D1 HC too.  Guest money talks.

Stephanie Pemper(Bowdoin/Navy) has done well there; I usually see her on the AAU circuit. I expect Carla Berube to be similarly successful @ Princeton. She'll have 3 DC-area players to work with including All-America Bella Alarie(daughter of former NBAer Mark) and 1 more coming in 2020.
  The short time great coach @ Scranton also recently left for a D1 HC(Bucknell).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on May 29, 2019, 11:28:32 PM
WashU's former coach is not the most recent to jump from DIII to DI. In fact, she has been trumped by Michael Meek (George Fox to Portland), Trevor Woodruff (Scranton to Bucknell) and Lauren Sumski (Rhodes to Lipscomb) just this off-season.

Nancy Fahey (WashU) left in 2017 to Illinois ... she was joined that season by Loree Payne who went from Puget Sound to Northern Arizona. Last season Marc Mitchell left FDU-Florham for St. Peters and Scott Hemer left Genseo for Canisus.

There is a run on DIII coaches right now.

Side note if you didn't notice: two coaches from last season's final four took D1 positions this off-season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on May 29, 2019, 11:33:41 PM
Full list in our coverage from earlier tonight: https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2019/05/berube-gone-to-d1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on May 29, 2019, 11:53:22 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on May 29, 2019, 11:28:32 PM
WashU's former coach is not the most recent to jump from DIII to DI. In fact, she has been trumped by Michael Meek (George Fox to Portland), Trevor Woodruff (Scranton to Bucknell) and Lauren Sumski (Rhodes to Lipscomb) just this off-season.

Nancy Fahey (WashU) left in 2017 to Illinois ... she was joined that season by Loree Payne who went from Puget Sound to Northern Arizona. Last season Marc Mitchell left FDU-Florham for St. Peters and Scott Hemer left Genseo for Canisus.

There is a run on DIII coaches right now.

Side note if you didn't notice: two coaches from last season's final four took D1 positions this off-season.

Trevor Woodruff is one, but who is the other?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on May 30, 2019, 01:23:51 AM
HA! I jumped the gun!

Forgot Tufts LOST to Scranton in the elite eight ... my brain is on other topics ... like WOMEN'S LACROSSE(!) where Tufts made the final four ... so yeah ... sorry about that.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on May 30, 2019, 11:33:18 AM
ronk....Alarie, Mark....father of Bella...played at Duke, I recall.  Alas, my memory is "spotty" these days...like my spelling.
I believe that Berube's move was helped by the fine talent remaining at Princeton.
Anyway, The Nescac should be interesting next season in basketball....both men and women :).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: JustAFan on June 27, 2019, 05:22:32 PM
Tufts names Bowdoin grad and former Tufts assistant Jill Pace as coach of its women's basketball team. Great (and very quick!) hire. She did a very good job as head coach a Pomona, turning around their program in short order.

http://www.gotuftsjumbos.com/sports/wbkb/2018-19/releases/20190624j00o7i
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: cantdothat on June 29, 2019, 12:05:25 PM
Any word on who Colby will hire as new WBB Head Coach? Curious as to whether Jill Pace, new Tufts HC was in the mix at Colby. She is a Bath, Me. native.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on June 29, 2019, 09:08:11 PM

To be honest, I didn't even realize Coach left.

Looks like she resigned back in April...don't think that its even made the D3Hoops news circuit.

Doesn't even appear to be any release from Colby in all this time...kind of strange.

Now working for a NFP in Boston apparently.

Wish her all the best.

Got to see her several times while she was at Drew & she did a really nice job.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on June 29, 2019, 09:10:08 PM

To be honest, I didn't even realize Coach left.

Looks like she resigned back in April...don't think that its even made the D3Hoops news circuit.

Doesn't even appear to be any release from Colby in all this time...kind of strange.

Now working for a NFP in Boston apparently.

Wish her all the best.

Got to see her several times while she was at Drew & she did a really nice job.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on July 01, 2019, 01:35:32 PM
Yeah, we saw that the job was open a couple months ago. With no public statement from the school, we decided to make this a one-story transition (i.e. we'll post something when the job gets filled).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: cantdothat on July 08, 2019, 05:55:30 PM
Colby search reopened. Opening turned down by a top choice?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on July 10, 2019, 01:25:00 PM
Among the NESCAC incoming frosh:


Maggie Shipley  6-0   SG            Yorktown(VA)                                   Amherst

Jenna Berens      6-0   F          Hamden Hall(CT)                                 Bates

Madison Szabo    6-4   P         Middletown South(NJ)                           Wesleyan(CT)

Maggie Russell     6-0   F       Kent Place School(NJ)                            Tufts
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: cantdothat on July 15, 2019, 08:45:31 PM
Colby College Names Chenel Harris-Smith New Head Women's Basketball Coach
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on July 16, 2019, 08:46:27 AM
ronk...thanks for the info.
Not so sure wrt your position terms.  Amherst has a 6' shooting guard?  The Cardinals have a 6'4" ...P?  Was this to be a Forward?  Wes could use a Center, imho :).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on July 16, 2019, 08:58:27 AM
 P for post player or the equivalent of the center position for the Wesleyan player.
The Amherst player(SG or W) will be playing on the perimeter as opposed to on the baseline or in the paint for a forward.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on October 31, 2019, 04:08:31 PM
Top 25 released with some familiar names atop the rankings:

https://www.d3hoops.com/top25/women/2019-20/preseason

This was the toughest preseason ballot in a long time. I considered about six teams for No. 1 before picking Tufts, narrowly over Scranton and Amherst.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on October 31, 2019, 05:05:00 PM
gordonmann...must be a tough day! :)  Your post does not agree wrt the Noted poll.  Amherst is listed at the top.....not Tufts.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on October 31, 2019, 05:49:39 PM
 Gordon will probably say that his vote is only 1 of 25, although I would consider it the most meaningful. Was hoping that Amherst & Scranton would be playing each other in Vegas in Dec but someone(s) declined to have it happen.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on October 31, 2019, 11:25:55 PM
Yeah, I was just commenting on my own ballot.

I looked at Amherst, Mary Hardin-Baylor, Scranton, Tufts, Wartburg and even George Fox as potential No. 1 teams. I didn't look at Bowdoin long because they have to replace three really big pieces, though I like Sela Kay a lot and respect Coach Shibles as a recruiter.

Mary Hardin-Baylor's athleticism captivates me, but I don't know how to measure them relative to other programs because of their strength-of-schedule.

After going around and around, I realized I had to pick someone and chose Tufts. But it was nice to have a lot of choices.

I'm really looking forward to the season and the D3hoops classic (which I hope to attend). George Fox and Claremont are there, too.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on November 16, 2019, 10:21:28 AM
Amherst seemed to start the season in the past hosting a tourney of 3 other NE teams.   Is it a scheduling issue? 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 17, 2019, 12:15:27 PM
NE Jeffs fan....yes and no :).  Women side...same HC plus new assist.  Men's side...HC is on leave, top assist is the interim HC, plus two  assistants.  Schedule starts with a single game...then the Ken Wright two game tournament at Amherst follows.  Team goes to a new D3 tournament in Naples Florida later.  Out of state opponents in Florida, I recall.  Women's team ranked no. 1 and men's team in the top ten.  Maybe opponents do not want to chalk up a lost early in the season :).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on November 17, 2019, 04:42:10 PM
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=158ef/lwcdpjeztuhoeq1f.jpg)

The season is underway, so it is about time we get Hoopsville on the air.

Most Division III basketball teams have finally tipped up their first games. That means there is plenty to talk about on Hoopsville!

Sunday, Dave debuts the show for its 17th season live in studio - with plenty of changes in the offseason. We chat about the changes not only in studio, but around the game. Plus, we talk to the preseason D3hoops.com No. 1 teams - Amherst and Swarthmore.

And what do some of the gurus of D3 basketball think about the start so far and the season ahead? Bob Quillman and Ryan Scott join Dave for the first Top 25 Double-Take.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch Sunday's show LIVE here: www.d3hoopsville.com.

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to hoopsville@d3hoops.com or use any of the social media options to the right.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- G.P. Gromacki, No. 1 Amherst women's head coach
- Landry Kosmalski, No. 1 Swarthmore men's head coach
- Bob Quillman & Ryan Scott, Top 25 Double-Take

If you enjoy the show via the podcasts, choose your favorite avenue to listen and/or subscribe via the the following four avenues (click on the images when necessary):
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Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 17, 2019, 05:38:08 PM
ronk....your post here wrt an Amherst recruit from Virginia...Shipley...proved that you can spot talent.
Shipley played almost "starter" minutes today.  She played well in here 21 min. On the court.  Maybe her coach will cite her on Hoopsville  tonight ;).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on November 17, 2019, 10:57:59 PM
amh63 - I'm hoping he'll discuss why Amherst & Scranton can't arrange to play each other.  ::)  They r both @ Las Vegas in Dec and
    it would have been a good opportunity to see my 5 prospects(4 for Amherst  :( ) play against each other.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 18, 2019, 12:33:38 PM
ronk....guess our favorite teams will just have to meet in the post season :).  If they do somewhere on the east coast in the post season....we should plan to go together.  How's that for being optimistic!
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on November 18, 2019, 12:54:52 PM
 Optimistic and realistic. Pat Coleman said D3hoops tried to get them to play each other in Vegas; somehow it didn't work out.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 23, 2019, 08:21:01 PM
Amherst gets a double digit win over ranked Ithaca tonight at Amherst.  Hanna Fox led the way and joined the 1000 pt club.  Amherst now has TWO members in the 1K club on the team...both starting guards :).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on November 23, 2019, 10:25:49 PM
 7 of my prospects in this game(Amherst - 3 starters/1 reserve, Ithaca - 2 starters/1 reserve); thought it would be good game.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on December 03, 2019, 08:42:07 PM

Down goes Amherst.  Andy Yosinoff was literally dancing on the sidelines.  This is not your typical d3 wbb season.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Rofrog on December 04, 2019, 12:01:44 AM
Lol why is that Ryan ???
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on December 09, 2019, 07:30:55 PM
Congrats to Tufts on returning to the No. 1 spot. It's the third time they've had the top ranking.

https://www.d3hoops.com/top25/women/2019-20/week3

Bowdoin moves up, Amherst moves down and Williams gets some love, too.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on December 12, 2019, 05:46:53 PM
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=2f32h/3hyl0b8jvq4hveyi.jpg)

The basketball season now finds itself square in the middle of not only the holidays, but also finals. Teams are taking breaks to focus on academics and either not playing until the new year or finding openings to fit in games here and there.

And while the tempo of games subsides a bit, there is still plenty of news swirling around Division III. Tune in as Dave and guests tackle all of the news this week in what should be a jam-packed Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) on Thursday night.

Topics will include the latest news of two Capital Athletic Conference members announcing they are leaving for other conference homes. What is next for the CAC which will be down to just three members by 2021-22 season. The rumors about St. Thomas's future continue to swirl, we at least try and put some of those rumors to rest. And a MIAC president finally speaks out about the decision to push UST out the door. Maybe he should have not said anything.

Plus, there is a new number one team in women's basketball, a team that nearly completed an undefeated season has reemerged, another former champion is showing they may be back in the hunt, and a program we haven't talked about in a long time has made it known they are ready for the season.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch Thursday's show LIVE with the following options:
- Main page: www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville
- Show page: http://bit.ly/2rFn0MF (or www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2019-20/dec12)
- Facebook Live Simulcast: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville
- YouTube Simulcast: www.youtube.com/d3hoopsville
- Team1 Sports: www.team1sports.com/Hoopsville/
- Team1 Sports app (https://team1sports.com/) (Android TV, Amazon Fire, Apple TV, Roku) - you will either find it under the "live" section or search for the Hoopsville channel

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to hoopsville@d3hoops.com or use any of the social media options to the right.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Doreen Carden, Albion women's coach
- Jill Pace, No. 1 Tufts women's coach
- Stephen Brennan, No. 14 Babson men's coach
- Keith Bunkenburg, No. 24 Benedictine coach

If you enjoy the show via the podcasts, choose your favorite avenue to listen and/or subscribe via the the following four avenues (click on the images when necessary):
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https://www.iheart.com/podcast/256-hoopsville-30984615/

We also have the podcast now on iHeartRadio (https://www.iheart.com/podcast/256-hoopsville-30984615/), Tune-In (https://tunein.com/podcasts/Sports--Recreation-Podcasts/Hoopsville-p1153539/) and others coming. We will update them once we have better abilities to do so.

Don't forget you can always interact with us:
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Email: hoopsville@d3hoops.com
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Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 02, 2020, 04:00:38 PM
Watched the Amherst's games in Ca.  Chapman was the host for both games.  In the first game, the host broadcast of the game was strange.....Amherst stats/scores were listed as the opponent!!.  I watched but avoided the stats.
Then 2nd game against the host team had it's strange twists and turns in my bias opinion.  Chapman's coach would sub players throughout the game in groups...to confuse Amherst players??.  The Amherst fans/supporters were very vocal wrt the rough play allowed by the refs against Amherst.  Yes, watching online, there were also a number of questionable calls by the refs...that brought Amherst's fans to their feet and vocal challenges.  Amherst's coaches called a number of timeouts to make adjustments late in the 2nd half.  Amherst got the lead late in the game and iced the game on two clutch foul shots.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 02, 2020, 06:28:58 PM
 From the boxscore of the Chapman game, Hannah Fox had an abnormally unproductive offensive game for her. Haven't seen her stopped by anyone previously. I would suspect "under the weather" but she did play 34 mins.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on January 03, 2020, 12:31:59 AM
There are a handful of teams that substitute five at a time. The "System" teams (Grinnell, Greenville men) regularly do that. So do a few other teams (Brockport, John Carroll). Maybe Chapman does the same thing. I think it's less about confusing the opponent and more about maintaining energy for a frenetic style.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 05, 2020, 04:50:07 PM
 Amh63,
  Looks like Maggie Shipley joined the 3 seniors as Amherst starters and former prospects of mine; only the Cal player(Resch) was not known to me previously. Since Shipley is from Northern VA, her start today may have been a territorial choice with the game "nearby" in NJ.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 06, 2020, 07:26:13 AM
ronk......based on Shipley's performance, she has found a spot on the rotation.  The announcer pointed out that she played point guard at Yorktown.  Her size helps her rebound the ball.  She is the replacement for the present Sr all-American point guard next year, IMO.   
The announcer for Stevens was great....but made the same roster error that you made wrt to Eck on the game in Pa.  Reach is a talent.  She is athletic and can shoot the three ball.....and play defense.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on January 06, 2020, 03:45:47 PM
Watching Tufts vs SUNY Poly on live video stream--

At Halftime, Cailin Harrington still to get to the FT line.

She needs to go 3-3 from the line in the second half to officially stay tied with NYU's Brooklyn Shelton at #1 in FT percentage.  Otherwise, Harrington will dip below the mandatory average of at least 2.5 ppg scored from the charity stripe that is needed to be ranked nationally.

Final-- Tufts defeated SUNY Poly.  Cailin Harrington 0-0 from the FT line for the second straight game, putting her out of the NCAA rankings for best FT percentage.  She will need to go 6-6 from the line Wednesday to get back into the NCAA rankings before NESCAC play begins.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on January 12, 2020, 06:34:59 AM
Been quiet here.  Amherst is playing hard and developing depth as conference play has arrived.  Three Nescac teams in the top 4 of D3hoops rankings.  Expect some exciting tough battles ahead with Bowdoin and Tufts.
Williams with a fine record got notice last night that Amherst, even with one of two senior all-Americans having a modest stats night...they can still dominate the game with the other. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on January 12, 2020, 10:05:23 AM
Seems like young Amherst players are coming along nicely also.  Will be a fun team to watch as the season progresses.  Williams played hard, so seemed like a good test before Tufts and Bowdoin.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 29, 2020, 09:30:45 PM
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=4w24l/es7kvekeakkuc1v8.jpg)

Time for a marathon!

Thursday, Hoopsville will be on the air for at least nine hours in the 7th Annual Hoopsville Marathon Show.

This year's show will feature coaches, administrators, and many others around Division III to give us a sense of the season to date and what is to come. There is only a month or so left in the regular season, so there is plenty to talk about.

For more information about the show and its impact, click here.

The show's guest list is below with a rough idea of when they were scheduled to appear during the live show.

The marathon is also a chance to fundraise of the show. Many fans of Hoopsville ask often how they can give to the program so we can continue doing our work into the future. In the first few years of the Marathon, the fundraising side was an important aspect. However in the last few years, we have shyed away from fundraising as we tried to find other means to financially run the program. After requests from many, we are do have a few ways fans can contribute.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch the entire Marathon show LIVE in the video player above. We will effort to turn around podcast episodes of the entire show. They will be available to the right (after the show is off the air).

Guests appear on the Hoopsville Hotline presented by BlueFrame Technology.

And don't forget to interact with the Dave and guests. You can use the social media option to the right and even email (dave.mchugh@d3sports.com) questions to the show.


When it comes to the game of basketball, we love celebrating not only the student-athletes in Division III, but also those who help carry the game forward sometimes outside of the spotlight.

Sunday on Hoopsville, we celebrate those who have made the game of basketball, especially at DIII, so great. Coaches who continue to excel in different parts of the country and programs who play for more than just themselves.

Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch Thursday's Marathon Show in the following ways:
- Main page: www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville
- Show page: http://bit.ly/2GBqAuZ (or www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2019-20/marathon)
- Facebook Live Simulcast: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville
- YouTube Simulcast: www.youtube.com/d3hoopsville
- Team1 Sports: www.team1sports.com/Hoopsville/
- Team1 Sports app (https://team1sports.com/) (Android TV, Amazon Fire, Apple TV, Roku) - you will either find it under the "live" section or search for the Hoopsville channel

All men's coaches appear in the NABC Coach's Corner. And all guests are featured on the BlueFrame Technology Hoopsville Hotline.

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to dave.mchugh@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options.

Hoopsville Marathon Schedule
Timing approximate and subject to change

























Time (ET)GuestSchool/Institution
12:20 p.m.Jim CalhounSt. Joseph's (Conn.) men's coach
12:40 p.m.Pat JuckemNo. 11 WashU men's coach
1:00 p.m.Brian MorehouseNo. 3 Hope women's coach
1:20 p.m.Lauren BusalacchiRipon women's coach
1:40 p.m.Ryan HylandJohn Jay men's coach
2:00 p.m.Dan DutcherNCAA VP for Division III
2:40 p.m.Karin HarveyMontclair State women's coach, Women's National Committee chair
3:00 p.m.Adrienne ShiblesNo. 2 Bowdoin women's coach
3:20 p.m.Kate PearsonCabrini women's coach
3:40 p.m.Matt GilbrideRPI men's coach
4:00 p.m.Sam AtkinsonGallaudet Associate AD for Comm., Men's National Committee Chair
4:20 p.m.Matt DonohueCatholic women's coach
4:40 p.m.Charles KatsiaficasPomona-Pitzer men's coach
5:00 p.m.Jon HerbrechtsmeyerNo. 5 Bethel women's coach
5:20 p.m.Chris CarideoWidener men's coach
5:40 p.m.Dave HixonAmherst men's coach (sabbatical)
6:00 p.m.Tricia CullopWBCA Board President, Toledo women's coach
6:20 p.m.Alex RicheyNo. 18 Oglethorpe women's coach
6:40 p.m.Jody MayAlbion men's coach
7:00 p.m.Dave MacedoNo. 18 Virginia Wesleyan men's coach
7:20 p.m.Melissa KuberkaSt. John Fisher women's coach
8:00 p.m.HOOPSVILLE HAPPY HOUR A gaggle of some of the shows friends - to be announced
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on January 31, 2020, 05:44:33 AM
I have a rant about Northeast Sports Network (NSN), and how they charge fans to watch archived versions of their games.  Tonight's Tufts v Bowdoin game is on NSN, but I will not be able to watch it live due to a Brandeis home doubleheader vs CWRU going on at the same time.  I am shuddering at the prospect of paying $10.59 after tax to watch an archived stream of Tufts v Bowdoin next week.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 31, 2020, 08:34:46 AM
 Prediction:  Tufts by 6 tonight. Bowdoin lost more by graduation than Tufts since they met last.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 31, 2020, 01:54:37 PM
Quote from: ronk on January 31, 2020, 08:34:46 AM
Prediction:  Tufts by 6 tonight. Bowdoin lost more by graduation than Tufts since they met last.

Bowdoin and it isn't close.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on January 31, 2020, 04:28:22 PM
I'm one of two people voting Bowdoin No. 1 in the poll.

That's my pick, but it'll be close. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 31, 2020, 07:46:57 PM
 I think you'll change by the end of the game, Gordon. Great game at the half, worthy of a top 5 battle.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on January 31, 2020, 08:40:11 PM

Good call Ronk.

'Bowdoin & it isn't close"???

Not sure that that call will win you a trip to the prognosticator's HOF.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on January 31, 2020, 08:41:47 PM

By the way...truly a great game.

Absolutely 2 of the best teams out there right now.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 31, 2020, 09:46:07 PM
 My over/under  was off by 90 points, however.  ;D
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on January 31, 2020, 11:38:41 PM
Great, great game.

Both teams played at a really high level. I much prefer that to 36-35. :)

Hats off to Tufts. I've never seen them shoot like that before. They've now beaten two highly ranked teams in two very different ways. I spoke with Coach Pace after the game for our game story.

https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2020/01/tufts-tops-bowdoin-in-maine-event

I've a feeling these teams will see each other again this season, at least once more.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on February 01, 2020, 12:02:01 AM
Quote from: gordonmann on January 31, 2020, 11:38:41 PM
Great, great game.

Both teams played at a really high level. I much prefer that to 36-35. :)

Hats off to Tufts. I've never seen them shoot like that before. They've now beaten two highly ranked teams in two very different ways. I spoke with Coach Pace after the game for our game story.

https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2020/01/tufts-tops-bowdoin-in-maine-event

I've a feeling these teams will see each other again this season, at least once more.

That 2005 Bowdoin-Scranton game that you mentioned in your story was the best that I've witnessed previously, mainly because it was an NCAA tourney Elite 8 game and in person. But tonight's was very, very close in excellence.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 01, 2020, 02:34:44 AM
That game was awesome. I thought Bowdoin, especially being at home, would have that game especially the way they have been playing .. but wow Tufts came out gunning. Despite the score, I was also impressed with the way Bowdoin's defense would help them make runs at Tufts ... but they couldn't do anything about that shooting.

Not sure that game turns out that way if both teams have an average night from the floor, but that game lived up to the billing and was fun to watch.

And it was closer than the final score ... Tufts just hit FTs down the stretch and Bowdoin missed it's chances at the line.

Tufts is clearly the number one team in the country, but I am not sure I drop Bowdoin further down than three (understanding Hope would move into #2).
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: gordonmann on February 01, 2020, 12:58:15 PM
Ronk:

I had the same reaction. If someone asked me what the greatest women's basketball game that I've watched in person, I'd probably go No. 1 Hope versus No. 2 Howard Payne in Texas with both teams undefeated and a Final Four spot on the line. The stakes where higher in that game, but last night's game was better played.

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 01, 2020, 03:24:50 PM
Seems that I missed a great game.  Results should make the upcoming Amherst vs Bowdoin in LeFrak game a must watch :).
Was watching the Amherst vs Wes game in Middletown.  A much closer score wise away game than the one in LeFrak.  Note...Amherst lost to Tufts in OT in LeFrak.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: deiscanton on February 06, 2020, 06:15:48 AM
I paid the $10.59 on the credit card to Blueframe Technology, LLC for a 31 day access pass to Bowdoin's home archived content  on the Northeast Sports Network (NSN)  in order to watch the Tufts vs Bowdoin game on the archive.
Great game with a great broadcast.  At least the BlueFrame Technology player makes it easier to rewatch content than the Sidearm Sports player provided by Rochester's $10.95 a month subscription service.  Also, you can rewatch NSN content on a smart TV.  If you can afford it, the Tufts v Bowdoin game is well worth the price of the 31 day pass.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 07, 2020, 08:57:37 PM
Amherst led the whole game in a key win over Bowdoin in LeFrak.  Defense was the key as Amherst shut out the Polar Bears in 1st quarter....16-0.  Amherst closed out the game  with a run.  bBowdoin made a run in the 4th and cut Amherst's lead a number of times under double digits...maybe as low 6?
Most interesting game as both coaches went deep into the bench.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on February 11, 2020, 01:30:59 PM
Sets up a great NESCAC Tourney with Amherst and Tufts having had a close game.  Bowdoin and Tufts had a shootout, and Amherst took care of business vs Bowdoin. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on February 12, 2020, 11:39:16 AM
NE Jeffs Fan....points well taken.  The latest D3hoops broadcast  had a discussion wrt your points...the Tufts vs Bowdoin high scoring game, the low scoring Tufts vs Amherst battle and the low scoring Amherst vs Bowdoin game. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 12, 2020, 01:17:35 PM
Quote from: amh63 on February 12, 2020, 11:39:16 AM
NE Jeffs Fan....points well taken.  The latest D3hoops broadcast  had a discussion wrt your points...the Tufts vs Bowdoin high scoring game, the low scoring Tufts vs Amherst battle and the low scoring Amherst vs Bowdoin game.

We call it Hoopsville around these parts. :)
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 12, 2020, 03:36:28 PM
Women's first Regional Rankings released.

https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2020/02/women-regional-rankings-first
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 19, 2020, 03:09:54 PM
The second week Regional Rankings are out: https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2020/02/women-regional-rankings-second
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 26, 2020, 02:25:26 PM
Women's third regional rankings are out: https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2020/02/women-regional-rankings-third
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 07, 2020, 02:09:48 AM
Did other teams in NCAA tourney not allow fans in due to virus?  Is Corona Virus rampant in the Northeast?  Couldn't even let in the announcer...maybe he already had the virus.  I hate to rush to judgement, but seems a bit paranoid in an event that doesn't draw huge crowds, but is a highlight for each of those kids playing.  Did NHL or MLS keep out crowds this weekend?  What's MLB doing in Florida and Arizona?  Just asking for a friend?
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 07, 2020, 04:47:21 PM
Johns Hopkins also made the decision not to admit fans for Friday night's games:
https://www.d3hoops.com/playoffs/men/2020/goldfarb-will-be-empty-for-first-weekend
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 07, 2020, 06:10:43 PM
I saw that.  Still don't agree with the decision.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 08, 2020, 10:46:27 AM
Seems all four Nescac teams advanced to the Sweet 16.  Only Tufts' men's team moved forward. 
The hosts for the next round on the men's side is out today, whereas the Amherst's HC mentioned that he will know on Monday!
Hope the "panic" over the latest "Flu/C19" outbreak doesn't hurt Amherst's chances to host.  Big discussion on the web among my classmates....all doctors from the top medical schools wrt to the latest flu outbreak.  Yes, Amherst did ban fans from LeFrak this past weekend.
The Nescac teams all had blowout wins ...with the exception of Williams who was in Ithaca,NY.  Nice to see Williams' fans cheering for their team.
Note....Amherst's prez was the provost of Cornell Un. in Ithaca.  Lots of schools in Ithaca, etc. 
Back to the Amherst's win.  H. Fox reached a milestone and was back in form in the latest two wins.  Amherst's younger players also played well with one player setting a new record for blocks.  Nice to see the head coach talk/work with his young players during these post season games....Amherst loses three key seniors...two record setting guards. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on March 08, 2020, 01:13:48 PM
Seems that three of the Nescac women's teams will host...nice!  InTuft's case, the men's' team goes on the road...as by the rules.  Will see what the Amherst prez will do wrt fans in the stands.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 08, 2020, 01:50:32 PM
The Tufts men aren't the higher seed, so it wouldn't matter whether the women were still in the tournament or hosting.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 08, 2020, 11:21:55 PM
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=6w8mk/1suiql8xe7b8ab8p.jpg)

What an opening weekend of the NCAA tournaments? Upsets a plenty. Gyms closed to fans. Incredible finishes. And so much more. Sunday night on Hoopsville we tried to cover it all.

The show started with extensive information on decisions surrounding COVID-19. We discussed decisions by Johns Hopkins and Amherst to close their doors to fans for the first weekend's games. We also had reactions and statements on the choice to return to Amherst this coming weekend for the Sectionals in women's basketball and the college's decision to, once again, ban fans from attending.

We also talked about the incredible stories coming out of the tournament of how teams are moving on and how seasons came to a sudden and emotional finish. 

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Pat Coleman, Editor-in-Chief, D3hoops.com
- Todd Raridon, No. 11 North Central (Ill.) men's coach
- Jackson Meshanic (sophomore) & Stefan Thompson (coach), Hobart men's team (Frank Rossi interviews)
- Greg Dunne, No. 18 Brockport men's coach
- Andy Rang, No. 23 Trine women's coach
- Pat Manning, Williams women's coach
- Bob Quillman & Ryan Scott

Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch Sunday's show On Demand in the following ways:
- Main page: www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville
- Show page: http://bit.ly/2PWk7A7 (or www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2019-20/mar8)
- Facebook Live Simulcast: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville
- YouTube Simulcast: www.youtube.com/d3hoopsville
- Team1 Sports: www.team1sports.com/Hoopsville/
- Team1 Sports app (https://team1sports.com/) (Android TV, Amazon Fire, Apple TV, Roku) - you will either find it under the "live" section or search for the Hoopsville channel

If you enjoy the show via the podcasts, the show is already available, so choose your favorite avenue to listen and/or subscribe via the the following four avenues (click on the images when necessary):
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville


 
   
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We also have the podcast now on Tune-In (https://tunein.com/podcasts/Sports--Recreation-Podcasts/Hoopsville-p1153539/) and others coming. We will update them once we have better abilities to do so.

All men's coaches appear in the NABC Coach's Corner. And all guests are featured on the BlueFrame Technology Hoopsville Hotline.

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to hoopsville@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options.

Please also consider helping us out. We are accepting donations to the show - which many of you have asked about. The goal is to raise $7,500. We are approximately at $5,200 at the time of this posting.

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Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: GoPerry on March 10, 2020, 10:44:11 AM
https://twitter.com/d3hoopsville/status/1237129438304915458/photo/1


I'm really astounded by this decision and the inflexibility of Amherst and NCAA.  To me it is indefensible that Amherst and AD Don Faulstick did not withdraw their request to host this weekend knowing their no spectator policy.  In fact I find it hard to believe that they still wish to host at all?  It seems totally out of bounds for the NCAA to allow them to do so. 

UMHB, George Fox, and CNU fans and parents deserve an explanation on why the venue couldn't be switched.  I can understand why they are livid.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 10, 2020, 11:12:53 AM
Parents should be allowed in.  I'd be absolutely livid.  Test people, wear masks, anything by ban fans.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: GoPerry on March 10, 2020, 11:28:49 AM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on March 10, 2020, 11:12:53 AM
Parents should be allowed in.  I'd be absolutely livid.  Test people, wear masks, anything by ban fans.

From the NCAA WBB Manual:

Section 2•4 Site Selection
The championships committee has prioritized the following site-selection criteria for all championships:

1. Complete bid;
2. Quality and availability of the facility and other necessary accommodations;
3. Geographical location (which may include such factors as rotation of sites, weather, accessibility and transportation costs);
4. Seeding; and
5. Attendance history and revenue potential, which shall be considered necessary to assure fiscal responsibility.

So all that totally went out the window . . .
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jamtod on March 10, 2020, 12:09:48 PM
Quote from: GoPerry on March 10, 2020, 11:28:49 AM
Quote from: NE Jeffs Fan on March 10, 2020, 11:12:53 AM
Parents should be allowed in.  I'd be absolutely livid.  Test people, wear masks, anything by ban fans.

From the NCAA WBB Manual:

Section 2•4 Site Selection
The championships committee has prioritized the following site-selection criteria for all championships:

1. Complete bid;
2. Quality and availability of the facility and other necessary accommodations;
3. Geographical location (which may include such factors as rotation of sites, weather, accessibility and transportation costs);
4. Seeding; and
5. Attendance history and revenue potential, which shall be considered necessary to assure fiscal responsibility.

So all that totally went out the window . . .

Absolutely. On hoopsville, they talked a lot about how #5, Revenue Potential never factored in but I don't see how you even get to that. It starts with #2 and a facility where you can have 0 fans (regardless of revenue opportunity) ought to rule out a hosting bid right away.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: GoPerry on March 10, 2020, 12:22:09 PM
https://twitter.com/d3hoopsville/status/1237411778541367297

Tufts now . . .

Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on March 10, 2020, 04:20:31 PM
Quote from: amh63 on March 08, 2020, 10:46:27 AM
Seems all four Nescac teams advanced to the Sweet 16.  Only Tufts' men's team moved forward. 
The hosts for the next round on the men's side is out today, whereas the Amherst's HC mentioned that he will know on Monday!
Hope the "panic" over the latest "Flu/C19" outbreak doesn't hurt Amherst's chances to host.  Big discussion on the web among my classmates....all doctors from the top medical schools wrt to the latest flu outbreak.  Yes, Amherst did ban fans from LeFrak this past weekend.
The Nescac teams all had blowout wins ...with the exception of Williams who was in Ithaca,NY.  Nice to see Williams' fans cheering for their team.
Note....Amherst's prez was the provost of Cornell Un. in Ithaca.  Lots of schools in Ithaca, etc. 
Back to the Amherst's win.  H. Fox reached a milestone and was back in form in the latest two wins.  Amherst's younger players also played well with one player setting a new record for blocks.  Nice to see the head coach talk/work with his young players during these post season games....Amherst loses three key seniors...two record setting guards.

Amh63,
Thought this was the year that u and I could get together at the sectional but Scranton lost in the 1st round eliminating that and the virus precaution would have precluded it anyhow.
  Had a social media exchange today with the mom of 1 of those key seniors, commiserating with her about the denial of the opportunity for the mom to see her daughter play her final games in person.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: NE Jeffs Fan on March 10, 2020, 04:21:30 PM
Saw a report that numerous states are restricting the attendance of their high school tournament finals to immediate family only.  Amherst and Tufts should consider that.  Amherst just announced the following:


Amherst spring team sports will compete through Wednesday, March 11, and winter athletes will finish out their seasons. Spring team games will then be cancelled until the situation with COVID-19 becomes clearer. This does not mean the spring season is over entirely. Games will resume if and when classes resume on campus.

Doesn't even take into account that most Spring teams are outside. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Flying Dutch Fan on March 10, 2020, 05:54:10 PM
Bowdoin has joined the fan ban wagon...

https://athletics.bowdoin.edu/general/2019-20/releases/20200310n2unu0
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 12, 2020, 05:31:08 PM
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=73mrs/m6gg5jcihb76rihu.jpg)

And with that, the 2019-20 seasons have come to a sudden end.

What a week it has been in college basketball. Exactly a week ago, as we hit the air, the first signs that COVID-19 was going to impact the NCAA Tournaments was seen. Since then, it has been a whirlwind.  

Tonight on Hoopsville, we try and make sense of one of the stranger finishes in history for NCAA events. What started with isolated closings of gyms for games ends a week later in all games being called off through the rest of the academic year.

We will chat with those who were preparing for games on Friday and hear their reactions to the seasons coming to a close so quickly.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Michelle Ferenze, No. 10 Whitman women's coach
- John Krikorian, Christopher Newport men's coach
- Cheri Harrer, No. 9 Baldwin Wallace women's coach

Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch Thursday's show LIVE starting at 7:00 p.m. ET in the following ways:
- Main page: www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville
- Show page: http://bit.ly/3b1XeU3 (or www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2019-20/mar12)
- Facebook Live Simulcast: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville
- YouTube Simulcast: www.youtube.com/d3hoopsville
- Team1 Sports: www.team1sports.com/Hoopsville/
- Team1 Sports app (https://team1sports.com/) (Android TV, Amazon Fire, Apple TV, Roku) - you will either find it under the "live" section or search for the Hoopsville channel
Monday's show primarily covers the Atlantic, Central, South, and Northeast Regions. All men's coaches appear in the NABC Coach's Corner. And all guests are featured on the BlueFrame Technology Hoopsville Hotline

All men's coaches appear in the NABC Coach's Corner. And all guests are featured on the BlueFrame Technology Hoopsville Hotline.

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to hoopsville@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options to the right.

Please also consider helping us out. We are accepting donations to the show - which many of you have asked about. The goal is to raise $7,500. We are approximately at $4,600 at the time of this posting.

To donate, click our PayPal link here: https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_s-xclick&hosted_button_id=BSRFLPUJQ9MKL&source=url

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Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on April 27, 2020, 09:35:03 AM
 Former Bowdoin HC Stephanie Pemper was let go as Navy HC despite a good 12-year run, including 3 straight Patriot League championships('11-'13). A 7-29 Patriot record over the 2 most recent years was probably the reason.
  Stephanie's Bowdoin team split with Scranton in consecutive NCAA tourneys('04 and '05) and the latter game( a quarterfinal) was probably the finest D3 women's game that I have witnessed before this year's Bowdoin-Tufts game. 
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on April 27, 2020, 12:42:27 PM
Quote from: ronk on April 27, 2020, 09:35:03 AM
Former Bowdoin HC Stephanie Pemper was let go as Navy HC despite a good 12-year run, including 3 straight Patriot League championships('11-'13). A 7-29 Patriot record over the 2 most recent years was probably the reason.
  Stephanie's Bowdoin team split with Scranton in consecutive NCAA tourneys('04 and '05) and the latter game( a quarterfinal) was probably the finest D3 women's game that I have witnessed before this year's Bowdoin-Tufts game.

She had a decent run, but this last season especially did not go well. They had the talent, but things fell apart. There were also other reasons other than the record. I think everything else excluded they would have retained her moving forward. I am just not in a position to make any thoughts public. Maybe a later time.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on September 23, 2020, 06:28:16 PM
Will there be a 2020-21 NCAA Division III basketball season? If so what will it look like? What will the post-season look like?

It is on the mind of student-athletes, coaches, administrators, parents, and fans for several weeks, if not months, now. We are finally understanding what it may look like as a number of decisions or proposals are now making their way around Division III.

In this month's podcast, Dave McHugh not only downloads all the things being considered and the likely outcomes, but tries to give listeners an understanding of how much is still unknown despite some things becoming more clear.

McHugh also talks to Texas-Dallas women's basketball coach Polly Thomason for her take. Thomason has been in the Division III Women's Basketball National Committee for several years and is this season's chair of the committee. She also serves on the WBCA Board of Governors. Thomason not only provides her perspective on much of what is going on not only in Division III, but in women's basketball as well.

And of course, there is always the Hoopsville Notebook. Unfortunately, there is some sad news in the Notebook this month, but also news to celebrate especially when it comes to DIII alums making news in the NBA.

You can listen to the podcast here: https://bit.ly/3kMl0rZ

Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) broadcasts from the WBCA/NABC Studio. All guests are featured on the BlueFrame Technology Hoopsville Hotline. The offseason plan is to do a podcast each month. The shows will be audio-only leading up to the start of the 2020-21 when we will restart the video shows.

If you have questions, ideas, or want to interact with the show, feel free to send them to hoopsville@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options available.

If you enjoy the show via the podcasts, choose your favorite avenue to listen and/or subscribe via the the following four avenues (click on the images when necessary):
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We also have the podcast now on Tune-In (https://tunein.com/podcasts/Sports--Recreation-Podcasts/Hoopsville-p1153539/) and others coming. We will update them once we have better abilities to do so.

Don't forget you can always interact with us:
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Hoopsville Season Archive: www.team1sports.com/Hoopsville
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Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: jaybird44 on October 29, 2020, 11:12:28 PM
It seems that I have been the only member of the only (unofficial) fall sport at WashU, with my 100-mile ultramarathon attempt earlier this month to promote the fight for a cure during Rett Syndrome Awareness Month.  That attempt fell a bit short in miles and fundraising, so I'm going into overtime to try and reach $5,000 in donations.

Rett Gets Rocked 50K for $5K will commence Friday, October 30 at 8 pm Central, and end at 8 am Halloween morning.  Counting donations received (thanks to retired WashU men's basketball coach Mark Edwards and his wife Mary, and to Mike McGrath and his  University of Chicago men's basketball program for their donations!) and those yet to be sent and processed, I am at $4,440.53.  Very, very close to my goal...which will fund a researcher's work for a month.  Wouldn't it be cool if he or she cracked the code for a cure of Rett syndrome, on our dime?!

I reached 86 miles in my "Rett Gets Rocked Virtual Ultra Weekend" October 3-4.  I'm very proud of that result, but there's more work to be done.  Proceeds from the event will be split between Rettsyndrome.org (the only national organization spearheading research and providing resources for affected patients and their families) and the Rett Spectrum Clinic--a collaboration between the WashU School of Medicine and St. Louis Children's Hospital.

Rett syndrome is a rare, non-inherited neurological disorder that is caused by a gene mutation in the brain.  It primarily affects girls (1 in every 10,000 girls develop Rett).  It strikes typically when a child is 6-18 months old, and it has the characteristics of ALS, autism, epilepsy, and Parkinson's...all rolled into one sinister disorder.  It takes away the child's ability to move and communicate. 

In essence, Rett does to a child what Lucy in the "Peanuts" comic strip does to Charlie Brown when he tries to kick the football that she is holding.  The only difference is that Charlie Brown can get back up to try again.  Those who are afflicted with Rett syndrome don't get another chance to enjoy a vibrant life.

Researchers are working to re-engineer the gene mutation that turns on Rett, so it can be forever turned off.  Four drug therapies are in the FDA review pipeline, with one (trofanitide) one level away from review.  And, iPad tablets with retinal scan technology are giving those with Rett a voice they haven't had since they were toddlers.

The full court press on Rett is paying off.  You can help keep the pressure on Rett, by going to my Rett Racers donation page:  https://rettracer.everydayhero.com/us/rett-gets-rocked-2020

Thanks for your time and consideration, and hopefully there will be basketball to play and broadcast at the start of 2021!

Jay Murry
Play-By-Play Announcer, Washington University in St. Louis
Event Director, Rett Gets Rocked 50K for $5K
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on December 18, 2020, 01:49:50 PM
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=ljrwc/vxp5wavgbim7m9ca.jpg)

Since March 2020, the NCAA and especially Division III has been on a roller coaster. A ride no one ever predicted or would want to be on. The ride is also not over.

Since March, many in DIII have tried to keep athletics going though through fall seasons the decisions had nearly everyone on the same page. Winter sports have seen more of a multi-pronged approach - depending on the institution, location, type, financial security, mentality, etc., etc., etc.

On this final of a trip of Hoopsville podcasts, we talk to a couple of administrators on the impact the pandemic has made on the division and their institutions. We also talk about different approaches each has taken when it comes to trying to have intercollegiate competition. And we discover why even with the best efforts to move forward, some things are not within one's control.

Yeshiva Athletics Director Joe Bednarsh and Amherst Athletics Director Don Faulstick give us their perspectives in what is a complicated world of restrictions, protocols, testing requirements, and more that are also always changing. Each institution has taken a different path, so far, but it doesn't mean their thinking is all that different. Find out how each is trying to ultimately help student-athletes succeed.

Another place the virus has made a significant impact is to the D3sports.com network (https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2020/12/d3sports-needs-your-help). Page views are down a whopping 93%! That ginormous decline has also hurt the financial future of the company (https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2020/12/d3sports-needs-your-help). Editor-in-Chief Pat Coleman joins us to discuss the extremely difficult challenge of keeping the websites up and operational and how asking for help from those who frequent the sites seemed like the best course of action.

Plus, Dave gives another in-depth breakdown of where DIII basketball sits in terms of a season ahead and especially possibility of NCAA Championships. And an update on where Hoopsville sits during an unpredicted challenge in front of everyone.

You can listen to the podcast here: https://bit.ly/2K7QIDp

Hoopsville broadcasts from the WBCA/NABC Studio. All guests are featured on the BlueFrame Technology Hoopsville Hotline. We hope to start live, video, shows sometime in January.

If you have questions, ideas, or want to interact with the show, feel free to send them to hoopsville@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options available.

If you enjoy the show via the podcasts, choose your favorite avenue to listen and/or subscribe via the the following four avenues (click on the images when necessary):
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville


 
   
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We also have the podcast now on Tune-In (https://tunein.com/podcasts/Sports--Recreation-Podcasts/Hoopsville-p1153539/) and others coming. We will update them once we have better abilities to do so.

Don't forget you can always interact with us:
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Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on January 14, 2021, 08:29:36 AM

This transfer came to our attention this week.  Interesting, if nothing else.  Trinity begins their season tomorrow with SCAC play opening.

https://www.trinitytigers.com/sports/wbkb/2020-21/bios/shipley_maggie_85gx
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on January 19, 2021, 07:14:38 PM

A somewhat surprising degree of ouch factor in that profile.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: ronk on January 19, 2021, 07:56:22 PM
Quote from: saratoga on January 19, 2021, 07:14:38 PM

A somewhat surprising degree of ouch factor in that profile.

Saratoga,
  As I mentioned on the SCAC board, Maggie was on my prospect list since her rising junior AAU summer, and was among 4 that started for Amherst last season. A fifth stopped playing after her first 2 years. Was hoping to meet up with them again in the NCAA last year but our 1st round upset then covid squashed that.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 19, 2021, 08:18:43 PM
Quote from: saratoga on January 19, 2021, 07:14:38 PM

A somewhat surprising degree of ouch factor in that profile.

If you are referring to what I think you are referring to, that was noted by our team as well.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: saratoga on January 19, 2021, 08:59:35 PM

Pat,

I am.
It just kind of jumps right off the page.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on May 04, 2021, 08:45:02 AM


In case you missed it.  Another big change for Bowdoin:

https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2021/05/shibles-jump-to-d1
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on June 09, 2021, 08:33:51 PM

And Bowdoin has their coach, selecting Sacha Samtimano from ENC. She's a really good coach. You gota good one.
Title: Re: NESCAC Hoops
Post by: amh63 on November 16, 2021, 10:24:55 AM
Guess Nescac WBB is NOT too interesting a topic.  Too bad since Nescac has dominated New England WBB for sometime in general and Amherst in particular.  Oh well.  Caught Amherst play a game and several interesting points observed.  First, Amherst WBB team is young and deep.  Young point guards will be a hand-full for opponents...much like several former all-american point guards at Amherst.  Did notice an older male "coach" on the bench talking/coaching to some of the players while the posted coaches were following the play on the floor.  Looked like it was the retired Amherst men's HBC...to me.
Title: Re: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on December 06, 2021, 06:10:51 PM
MONDAY NIGHT SPECIAL

(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=3psxd/s5m35wat79mo9rgr.jpg)

November is behind us and now comes the month of distractions. Exams, travel, holidays, academic breaks, etc. At the same time, early conference games are already shaping how the basketball season will unfold.

On tonight's Hoopsville, we chat with one team already making waves in their conference, against conference foes, but not in conference games ... Bates women's coach Alison Montgomery chats about her squad's start and the big win over Bowdoin.

And we talk to a coach who has found a new home after his college was unceremoniously closed. Mississippi College of Women's Dean Burrows talks about guiding a new men's program after the success he had at Wesley.

Plus, Bob Quillman and Ryan Scott join the show to give their reactions to the latest D3hoops.com Top 25 poll. Tune in starting at 7:00 PM ET to watch the latest edition of Hoopsville!

You can watch the show LIVE (or on demand) here: https://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2021-22/dec6

Hoopsville broadcasts from the NABC Studio. All guests are featured on the BlueFrame Technology Hoopsville Hotline.

If you have questions, ideas, or want to interact with the show, feel free to send them to hoopsville@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options available.

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Title: Re: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: deiscanton on December 26, 2021, 05:36:50 AM
As of December 17, 2021, the athletics suspension at Middlebury that was necessitated by the COVID-19 red alert status on campus has been lifted when Middlebury moved to orange alert status.  Athletic facilities at Middlebury have now reopened, however, no spectators are allowed at Middlebury indoor home games under the current alert at this time.

In other news, the Amherst women's basketball team cancelled their 4 game road trip to Las Vegas and California in response to the Omicron variant.
Title: Re: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: amh63 on December 26, 2021, 07:39:13 PM
deiscanton....was aware of Amherst's cancelation of their four game trip out West....a trip that was almost a yearly thing.  However saw nothing on the Amherst's website to indicate WHY!  No notice on the D3 hoops site as the primary reason....plane flights or team members "hit" with the latest convid variations, etc.  D3hoops has been quite on the cancellation matter wrt it's Las Vegas event.
Title: Re: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: deiscanton on December 27, 2021, 06:17:28 AM
Quote from: amh63 on December 26, 2021, 07:39:13 PM
deiscanton....was aware of Amherst's cancelation of their four game trip out West....a trip that was almost a yearly thing.  However saw nothing on the Amherst's website to indicate WHY!  No notice on the D3 hoops site as the primary reason....plane flights or team members "hit" with the latest confide variations, etc.  D3hoops has been quite on the cancellation matter wrt it's Las Vegas event.

Actually, the operator of the event is Sport Tours International, and they would have the travel details.  D3Hoops.com is the presenting sponsor of the event, provides the commentators for the event, and streams the classic on Team1Sports.com, but anyway...

I just checked the Team1Sports.com updated video schedule for this week's D3Hoops.com classic, and all women's basketball games associated with this year's classic have been cancelled.  The D3Hoops.com Classic is being run this year as a men's basketball classic only, and the University of St. Joseph's men's basketball team has also cancelled its appearance in this year's tournament.  I posted the updated schedule of the classic on the UAA Men's Basketball discussion page, as the University of Chicago men's basketball team is still scheduled to participate in the Classic.
Title: Re: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 12, 2022, 03:22:30 PM
Just seeing this but can't really speak to Amherst specifically. We started with 19 teams and ended up with nine for a variety of reasons. Some teams had positive tests, some schools changed their travel policies, and two teams were unable to attend because of airline issues.
Title: Re: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: amh63 on January 15, 2022, 05:06:49 PM
Amherst turned on the "switch" at Tufts this afternoon.  Losing to Bates in Maine, they beat Tufts at Tufts today.  Looking forward to reading the story tonight.
Title: Re: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: amh63 on March 05, 2022, 10:27:53 AM
The three Nescac teams in the Big Dance moves forward......Amherst and Tufts on the left side of the brackets and Bates on the right side in OT! Amherst will play a tough opponent from the Rochester area.  Looking forward to see how Amherst play against a deeper team in the 2nd round.   Go CAC teams. ;D
Title: Re: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: amh63 on March 07, 2022, 09:36:40 AM
Lots of chatter on the men's side with only Williams remaining in the Big Dance.  Seems that with Three women's teams remaining in the Big Dance sweet 16, why am I alone on this board....doesn't matter.   Amherst will host the upper quad...with the top ranked WBB team and two Nescac teams...Tufts and Amherst.  Amherst will face the Jumbo's for the third time!  Should be a great game....hope it will be another win for the "older" mascot.
Title: Re: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: nescac nostradamus on March 07, 2022, 10:36:33 AM
Unfortunately, only 2 two women's teams from the NESCAC remain as Bates lost their second round game.  Amherst vs. Tufts 3 will be a great game.  We know Amherst is going to bring the heat on defense as usual.  Bates beat Amherst in the NESCAC finals by matching their intensity on defense (and they have a better offense).  Tufts is similar to Bates (I think Tufts was 1st in scoring in NESCAC, Bates was second) in that they would rather outscore their opponents.  Tufts seemed more committed to defense in their win versus a tough and talented DeSales team.  I'm predicting a close game that will go down to the wire, with the winner playing Trinity, TX who will upset #1 overall seed CNU for a trip to the final 4.
Title: Re: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: amh63 on March 11, 2022, 09:32:53 PM
NESCAC NOSTRADAMUS...put your "handle" in all caps....you called the outcome of two games at Amherst tonight!   No.1 team lost to Trinity of Texas and Amherst beats Tufts for the 3rd time in a LOW scoring game!
Title: Re: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: amh63 on March 12, 2022, 08:05:59 PM
Back again....Amherst wins over Trinity of Texas in a fast pace high scoring game....for Amherst.  Heading for the Final 4...again in Pittsburgh :P ;D
Title: Re: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: cantdothat on April 16, 2022, 07:15:19 AM
Santimano will not return as Head Coach of Bowdoin Women's Basketball.
Title: Re: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: gordonmann on April 16, 2022, 04:38:45 PM
True. The College's release cited family health issues as the reason for the departure.

Hope everything works out there.
Title: Re: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: cantdothat on May 18, 2022, 06:35:36 AM
https://athletics.bowdoin.edu/news/2022/5/16/megan-phelps-named-head-coach-of-bowdoin-womens-basketball-program.aspx
Title: Re: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: gordonmann on July 19, 2022, 06:13:12 PM
Hey, speaking of that thing that happened two months ago, here's an interview with Bowdoin's head coach.

https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2022/07/atn-megan-phelps-bowdoin
Title: NESCAC CONFERENCE PREDICTIONS
Post by: nescac nostradamus on January 02, 2023, 06:57:34 PM
Thoughts on wide open NESCAC as we approach conference play with predictions for top 8 in standings:

1) Trinity.  Would have been big favorite if Gallo returned, not sure what happened there.  Very un-NESCAC like with the D1 transfers, but to each their own!  Reilly is a very strong post presence who will be in the running for POY.  Second D1 transfer Wax is very good.  They play dood defense and have an experienced team.  Good win versus Springfield and almost took down a very good Smith team. 

2) Tufts.  Tufts is playing a relatively young/inexperienced lineup.  POY candidate Russell is a junior and averaging a double double again, but their next 2 leading scorers are freshman, followed by a Sophomore.  I expect Tufts to get better as the year moves along and the team gets more experience.  Tufts has played a BRUTAL schedule to date unlike Amherst (more on that in a bit) with games against NYU, Scranton, Emory, Stevens, and upcoming games against Smith and Babson.  Tufts played NYU very close for 2 and a half quarters without Russell before they ran out of gas and got rolled late.  They also played a very tough Scranton team well until the end of that game.

3) Bowdoin.  Huge props to new coach Phelps for having the Polar Bears playing great despite virtually the same team from last year (16-9, 5-5 in conf).  Bowdoin will be one of the most experience teams which could play dividends in what I expect to be many close games in a parity filled NESCAC this year.  Only 2 losses were the great effort against NYU and a close loss to Smith.

4) Amherst.  Amherst lost a LOT from their Final 4 team from a year ago.  While I agree with Gordon Mann that Amherst is young, I'm not sure about them being a super talented team.  Patel is special and will make all team 1st conference, but I don't see the same talent in the youngsters like I see at Tufts.  Maybe they will also grow as the season progresses, but I am skeptical.  Now, we all know they will be a great defensive team and incredibly well coached, but I don't see the firepower to compete for a NESCAC title this year.  Which leads me to my next point, did GP know this and schedule an incredibly weak out of conference schedule (outside of a good Springfield team) with the hopes his winning % gets him in the tourney?  My prediction, if they don't win the tournament, and I don't think they will, controversy will be coming when the committee either lets in a 4th NESCAC team, or not.

5) Williams.  I like Williams mix of experience and new blood.  Mandyk is very athletic and a really good rebounder while being a capable scorer.  Seniors Holtze and Biesbrock are both solid and have done well with increased playing time.  The wild card for Williams is Sophomore Gerig, who has lots of upside.  She is big, athletic, and can do it all.  If she continues to develop, I think Williams will have a few upset wins this year.

6) Hamilton.  Props to Coach Green - she has this team playing hard.  Their leading scorer is a Freshman Lambo who is big and good around the basket.  Sehring is very athletic and a good rebounder/defender.  Hall is a talented point guard and does a good job running the team.  Freshman Hill a is deadly 3 point shooter and Coach Green has some athletic bigs who come off the bench.  Hamilton has impressive wins against SJF and Rochester, lost to top 10 Baldwin Wallace in a close game, and lost to a good Ithaca team today.   Hamilton also has tough non-conference matchups with   
Smith and Babson on the horizon.  Hamilton is an up and coming program, but I don't think they quite have the talent to compete for a title this year.

7) Middlebury.  Like Patel, i think Mustafaj is special.  Her floater game is elite and her 3 point shooting is very good.  Middlebury is also fairly young and they also play hard.  With Mustafaj, they can beat any NESCAC team on any given night, I just don't think they have the talent beyond her to be at the top of the NESCAC.

8) Bates.  Yes, the defending champs will sneak into the NESCAC tournament, but it won't be easy.  Defending POY Graff is back and doing her thing, but does not have a lot of help.  Losing Gadeleta (don't know if she is coming back this year or not), really hurt the Bobcats.  As good as Graff is, it's going to a struggle to get that 8th spot this year for Bates.
   
Title: Re: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: gordonmann on January 03, 2023, 10:35:19 PM
I love this breakdown. +k to you

This feels like a year where the NESCAC could have 5 teams in the Top 40 (if that existed) but no teams in the second weekend of the NCAA Tournament. We'll see if any rise above what looks like a very deep field.

By the way, congrats to Trinity (Conn.) on its first ever appearance in the D3hoops.com Top 25 poll.

https://www.d3hoops.com/top25/women/2022-23/week5
Title: Re: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: saratoga on January 03, 2023, 10:56:24 PM

Agree, great overview.

This was the year I had the Bantoms winning the NESCAC (which they still can do) but, I figured Sam Gallo would be there to assist & obviously, it doesn't appear that will happen.
They very easily could be playing with 3 D-1 transfers & all very good players.
As it is, the two they have plus the supporting cast may well be enough.

Tufts will only get better as they play together, & they are tough right now.

Amherst doesn't seem to have the multiple options to score as they usually do but, they still play tough D & hit the offensive glass.
Never rule out a GP team.

Bowdoin doing a great job putting things together after a tough year last season & will also be a tough matchup by playoff time.

Should be fun.
Title: Re: NESCAC CONFERENCE PREDICTIONS
Post by: Riley Zayas on January 04, 2023, 01:37:13 PM
Quote from: nescac nostradamus on January 02, 2023, 06:57:34 PM
Thoughts on wide open NESCAC as we approach conference play with predictions for top 8 in standings:

1) Trinity.  Would have been big favorite if Gallo returned, not sure what happened there.  Very un-NESCAC like with the D1 transfers, but to each their own!  Reilly is a very strong post presence who will be in the running for POY.  Second D1 transfer Wax is very good.  They play dood defense and have an experienced team.  Good win versus Springfield and almost took down a very good Smith team. 

2) Tufts.  Tufts is playing a relatively young/inexperienced lineup.  POY candidate Russell is a junior and averaging a double double again, but their next 2 leading scorers are freshman, followed by a Sophomore.  I expect Tufts to get better as the year moves along and the team gets more experience.  Tufts has played a BRUTAL schedule to date unlike Amherst (more on that in a bit) with games against NYU, Scranton, Emory, Stevens, and upcoming games against Smith and Babson.  Tufts played NYU very close for 2 and a half quarters without Russell before they ran out of gas and got rolled late.  They also played a very tough Scranton team well until the end of that game.

3) Bowdoin.  Huge props to new coach Phelps for having the Polar Bears playing great despite virtually the same team from last year (16-9, 5-5 in conf).  Bowdoin will be one of the most experience teams which could play dividends in what I expect to be many close games in a parity filled NESCAC this year.  Only 2 losses were the great effort against NYU and a close loss to Smith.

4) Amherst.  Amherst lost a LOT from their Final 4 team from a year ago.  While I agree with Gordon Mann that Amherst is young, I'm not sure about them being a super talented team.  Patel is special and will make all team 1st conference, but I don't see the same talent in the youngsters like I see at Tufts.  Maybe they will also grow as the season progresses, but I am skeptical.  Now, we all know they will be a great defensive team and incredibly well coached, but I don't see the firepower to compete for a NESCAC title this year.  Which leads me to my next point, did GP know this and schedule an incredibly weak out of conference schedule (outside of a good Springfield team) with the hopes his winning % gets him in the tourney?  My prediction, if they don't win the tournament, and I don't think they will, controversy will be coming when the committee either lets in a 4th NESCAC team, or not.

5) Williams.  I like Williams mix of experience and new blood.  Mandyk is very athletic and a really good rebounder while being a capable scorer.  Seniors Holtze and Biesbrock are both solid and have done well with increased playing time.  The wild card for Williams is Sophomore Gerig, who has lots of upside.  She is big, athletic, and can do it all.  If she continues to develop, I think Williams will have a few upset wins this year.

6) Hamilton.  Props to Coach Green - she has this team playing hard.  Their leading scorer is a Freshman Lambo who is big and good around the basket.  Sehring is very athletic and a good rebounder/defender.  Hall is a talented point guard and does a good job running the team.  Freshman Hill a is deadly 3 point shooter and Coach Green has some athletic bigs who come off the bench.  Hamilton has impressive wins against SJF and Rochester, lost to top 10 Baldwin Wallace in a close game, and lost to a good Ithaca team today.   Hamilton also has tough non-conference matchups with   
Smith and Babson on the horizon.  Hamilton is an up and coming program, but I don't think they quite have the talent to compete for a title this year.

7) Middlebury.  Like Patel, i think Mustafaj is special.  Her floater game is elite and her 3 point shooting is very good.  Middlebury is also fairly young and they also play hard.  With Mustafaj, they can beat any NESCAC team on any given night, I just don't think they have the talent beyond her to be at the top of the NESCAC.

8) Bates.  Yes, the defending champs will sneak into the NESCAC tournament, but it won't be easy.  Defending POY Graff is back and doing her thing, but does not have a lot of help.  Losing Gadeleta (don't know if she is coming back this year or not), really hurt the Bobcats.  As good as Graff is, it's going to a struggle to get that 8th spot this year for Bates.


Excellent breakdown...very informative! Bowdoin looked VERY good against Springfield today...ON THE ROAD! The NESCAC is indeed a wide-open conference race this year.
Title: Re: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: MrMaus on January 19, 2023, 12:07:48 PM
Wonderful write up, it addresses the key pros and cons for each team very effectively. Thank you.

There has been at least one NESCAC team in the final 4 since 2012 (9 full tournaments), including 3 years with 2 and the 2020 season where it could easily have been 3. When placed up against that pedigree it is easy to imply that none of these teams are sweet 16 ready, but I think we have seen conference teams really step up in the NCAA tournament time and time again. No one was betting on a NESCAC final four participant last year but an inexperienced Amherst team (POY Schoonveld had more meaningful NCAA tournament minutes played than the entire Amherst team going into last year) showed the strength of the conference.

The write up clearly articulates the lack of dominant seniors which, I would argue, is the legacy of Covid. For example, Amherst's "two best seniors" are playing at Trinity of TX and Union, both transferring once the NESCAC announced the fact there would be no 2020/21 season, and Gadeleta and Gallo leave holes in their teams. Additionally, the recruiting class of '23 is very spotty, which makes sense if you were a recruit trying to find a home to play when the conference had one of the most strict lock down and testing policies around, and schools that charge $75k per year.

What I find very interesting is how the teams coming out of the Covid pandemic. There are exciting freshman, sophomores and juniors on all the squads, who will now get put through a cement mixer of conference play and the conference tournament. Having to play meaningful games every weekend will bring experience and confidence these players can use once the tournament rolls around.

I would like to speak specifically to Amherst. They have a front court of Stewart and Cwalina as sophomores (6'6 and 6'2), two freshman swing forwards in Tranum (6'0) and Liddle (35% from 3) and a back court of Patel, Vera and Barach, a junior and two sophomores, with significant NCAA tournament playing time. Just like last years team they will be wildly inconsistent as they learn the system, and in watching them they don't have the logic of GP's defense embedded in their behavior yet, but I don't think any of the current top 16 teams would be happy to see them in their bracket the first week of the tournament.

Personally 4 or 5 NESCAC teams in the tournament is completely reasonable and possible, which ones is something we will learn over the next month. Can't wait to watch.
Title: Re: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: gordonmann on January 23, 2023, 12:34:41 PM
Makes sense to me.

Someone asked me why the NESCAC was down this season, relative to its very high standards. My initial thought was COVID and the impact that the "lost season" had on programs. If that's true, it's perhaps not surprising that Trinity (Conn.) has weathered the storm with its influx of Division I transfers.

Big week for the Bants, starting with Babson tonight and then Hamilton and Amherst over the weekend.
Title: Re: WBB: NESCAC
Post by: nescac nostradamus on February 03, 2023, 09:47:15 AM
With 2 weekends left in the NESCAC regular season, I'm circling 2 big games on the last weekend of regular season play.  With Trinity and Tufts at the top of the conference standings, Trinity at Tufts on 2/11 could be for the regular season crown and hosting rights for the NESCAC tournament.  Trinity has rolled through the NESCAC to date, but finishes up on the road at Williams, at Middlebury, at Bates, and then at Tufts.  Tufts, who has been playing well as of late, has an easier schedule at Colby and Bowdoin, then at home against Wes and Trinity.  On the other end of the standings, I am also circling the 2/11 game when Bowdoin plays Amherst.  Could that game be a winner makes the NESCAC tournament and the loser stays home?  It could be, as Amherst is currently 2-5 in conference play and currently out of the NESCAC tournament.   Bowdoin has a tough remaining schedule playing Bates and Tufts this weekend, then the brutal at Hamilton and at Amherst to finish the season.  My prediction - Anherst wins the final 3 conference games to make the tournament and Bowdoin is on the outside looking in.  Amherst would be a tough opening game for one of the top finishers in the opening round of the NESCAC tourney.  Outside of Trinity and Tufts, the standings are tight in the still wide open NESCAC and it's going to be a great finish to the regular season and a wild, upset filled NESCAC tournament!