Author Topic: Future College World Series Host  (Read 10543 times)

Offline BigPoppa

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Re: Future College World Series Host
« Reply #15 on: November 22, 2016, 03:12:05 pm »
Looks like a nice facility. Would California (PA) serve as the host?

Are there other places that could make a run at hosting it? Seems like a central location would be crucial... ANY D1 facilities in the Midwest/Mideast that would be ope to hosting?
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Offline 108 Stitches

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Re: Future College World Series Host
« Reply #16 on: November 23, 2016, 06:13:12 pm »
San Antonio, @Mission's field. TLU and Trinity could jointly sponsor it.

Offline Mr. Ypsi

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Re: Future College World Series Host
« Reply #17 on: November 23, 2016, 06:49:22 pm »
108, isn't San Antone probably too big a city for D3 to get any media attention?  And can you give a guarantee that it won't be 100+ by that time of year - or are you just trying to gain an advantage over all the northern schools! ;D

Offline ElRetornodelEspencio

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Re: Future College World Series Host
« Reply #18 on: November 23, 2016, 11:41:02 pm »
There are varying stories on why it was moved. I'm sure some teams didn't like having to play at a home field (especially a home field for a team with a good chance of winning). I don't want to speak completely out of turn but I know that at least one other early power program's coach had a personal rivalry with Schaly (may well have been more).
Any chance you could narrow it down further from Holowaty, Flaherty, Albies, Schoenig and Lechnir?  ;D

You forgot Valesente :) Ithaca was awesome back then. And it would have been Tiedemann more than Lechnir. Don't think Lechnir ever went to Marietta. Trying to think if there were any others off the top of my head. Your choice whether you put Tom Austin up there, but it's irrelevant to this because I know those two had a lot of respect for each other -- Methodist came up to Marietta for a weekend tournament one time. You could do those things before the NCAA effectively outlawed tournaments.

Offline ElRetornodelEspencio

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Re: Future College World Series Host
« Reply #19 on: November 23, 2016, 11:43:46 pm »
Looks like a nice facility. Would California (PA) serve as the host?

Are there other places that could make a run at hosting it? Seems like a central location would be crucial... ANY D1 facilities in the Midwest/Mideast that would be ope to hosting?

I would think a conference could host it, or jointly between like W&J, LaRoche, whatever -- similar to UWO and Lawrence. Having a D2 host for a D3 tournament doesn't seem very realistic.

Offline ElRetornodelEspencio

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Re: Future College World Series Host
« Reply #20 on: November 24, 2016, 02:43:14 am »
San Antonio, @Mission's field. TLU and Trinity could jointly sponsor it.

That seems unlikely. Say you get a West regional winner from Cal or Oregon. That tournament wouldn't draw flies.

Even with a TX school in it I doubt it would draw very well. Which begs the question "where would it draw well?" And now this post gets long. :)

It's going to be hard to replicate Appleton. It really is. If you think about "why does Appleton work?" and I think there are a few reasons.
-- The community supports it well. Great. Why do they support it well? Because with Oshkosh and SP nearby, there's a lot of visibility for D3 already, and not a lot of bleedover from other divisions because really the only notable D1 is UW, and they don't have baseball. WIAC programs are championship contenders in many sports. So D3 wasn't like "what's that?" to them. The media covers it well.
-- The WI programs are good. You can pretty much count on one being in the tournament most years, and there's more than one that is a candidate to do so.
-- The WI schools that do make the tournament are big. So if you get any kind of student/community turnout from those, it shows up big. Like when SP played Marietta in 2006, they got 2500 people. They're also in smaller communities that support their local program (Stevens Point, LaCrosse, Whitewater, Oshkosh).
-- Obvious things (field is good quality, good lighting, etc.) that are a must for any site.

So where can you replicate this (other than the original place where the blueprint was pretty much drawn)?
Well, what other regions/conferences produce a lot of champions and interest? Well for championships in football, no points for guessing. It's Mount Union, Whitewater and St. Thomas. In basketball there's usually an IL team in the final four, usually one from MA, and usually one from either WI or St. Thomas. Often but not as often one from VA or NC. In the 90s and early 2000s there was often one from OH, MI or IN, but not so much lately.

In attendance in the top 30 in basketball are 4 schools from the OAC and Wooster, and 7 from IL. Top 5 leagues in attendance are CCIW, Michigan (mainly due to 2 schools), IIAC, OAC and WIAC. NCAC which has much the same geography as OAC was 7th, including Wooster which was #3 in the nation.

Attendance in football is a similar story -- MN, ODAC, WIAC, Iowa, Centennial, OAC over 100k and top 7 in average, with MAC and Presidents over 100k due to high number of games total.

So we can say that there's significant interest in D3 in general in Minnesota (but Minnesota is a big state, and most of the MIAC is centered on a small part of it), Iowa, Ohio, and Wisconsin. So probably the site should come from in or near those states. This seems to fit well with where the baseball tournament has done well in the past -- Ohio and Wisconsin.

Problems: Iowa rarely puts a team in the championship. Minnesota rarely does other than St. Thomas. Wisconsin is where it already is, and there doesn't seem to be another candidate site from WI. Suitable sites in Minnesota are mostly in a large metro area (we presume this would hurt the tournament, but that's an assumption that's been untested).

Ohio has Marietta, BW, Heidelberg, Wooster that are all candidates to make the championship, and La Roche from PA and Adrian from southern MI. But the biggest and most likely draw of those is Marietta which is close to nothing (unlike Oshkosh and SP being close to Appleton and a source of community support for D3). That draws a central location in like northeast Ohio. So this seems to support the Eastlake site, but it's not really the same. It's too bad Marietta isn't as close to Eastlake as Oshkosh and SP are to Appleton. That would probably be ideal for the tournament. Then if they don't make it, hopefully some other regional program does.

Washington PA would be closer for programs like Frostburg (other than La Roche closer than any school above to Washington) or Shenandoah. Through the magic of the Bud Shuster Highway (99), it would be a decent shot for Cortland as well, though so would Eastlake. In theory you could have Frostburg, Shenandoah, Cortland, Misericordia (or Keystone, or NJAC flavor of the year) and pretty much anyone in OH/PA/southern MI bunch all in same tournament and within 400 miles. I can't think of many/any other potentially suitable places for which that could be true. And for the othre teams, a plane flight into Pittsburgh is easy -- half hour from Washington, never go into the city. Hopkins is on the other side of the city from Eastlake in Cleveland, and the shortest route is through downtown.

The weakness is there's no *local* program to really carry the thing, but that seems to be proving hard to find anywhere except where it is now, and where it's been that it's likely not going again. Eastlake is suburban, no one there really cares what's happening in Berea, let alone Wooster. Washington is more like Oshkosh to Appleton -- it's a few miles out of town, but it's a standalone town, not a suburb.

So, for me, the sort of best-to-less best options would be stay in WI (if that works out), Washington, Eastlake, St. Paul - worth a shot for a contract, [other things]. I'm not even 90% in any of these.

The upside for St. Paul is that there's a lot of interest in amateur baseball in MN via the American Legion and in D3, it's just that the weather is so heinous in the spring season that no one in their right mind would go to a game half the time. I do wonder if it was here if there would be significant walkup just because it's a nice day, tickets are cheap, great stadium (seriously, grrrrreat stadium), easy access via transit, etc. It would be a risk, but it might be one worth taking -- hell it can't go worse than Salem or Bristol. It would also be obviously easy to get to by flying.

Offline Jim Dixon

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Re: Future College World Series Host
« Reply #21 on: November 25, 2016, 12:48:30 am »
I think that the success in Appleton is that it usually had a WI school and as you say, they have a bigger enrollment.

Salem never really had a larger D-III school that would bring in a big crowd.  This explains why some people think Salem did not draw.  If Ferrum had made there might be a different opinion about Salem.

The press box does appear too small in Washington Pa.  Not counting the NCAA committee folks.  D3baseball was 8 people last year.  You need space for 4 SIDs (the two from teams playing and the ones leaving/coming).  Two radio spots for 2-4 people.  You will need space for the TV crew (2-3).  There was another 6-10 running the program as well.  Add a newspaper writer or two (2-4 depending on interest, photo, etc) and you need space for 2-3 dozen.  Remember that the committee was not considered and expect ~8, one from each region.  Now we are thinking about space for 35-people.  Appleton was right sized only after they added the addition.  Of course this means that the interview room and hospitality suite are located elsewhere.


Offline ElRetornodelEspencio

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Re: Future College World Series Host
« Reply #22 on: November 25, 2016, 04:04:04 pm »
I'm not sure all of that is strictly speaking necessary.

Ferrum wouldn't have made any difference. It's like 40 miles away and the school itself is tiny.

It probably doesn't matter unless someone in a position to make a bid is reading this and taking notes. It's more about what should the committee be taking into consideration.

Eastlake has all of those facilities you're talking about and more, but the capacity of the place is like 8k+. Is it worth never ever feeling there's a decent crowd for that?

Offline 108 Stitches

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Re: Future College World Series Host
« Reply #23 on: December 03, 2016, 01:32:13 pm »
I have to say this is a really good and insightful discussion. I agree that Appleton will be hard to replace. (except for possibly the weather)

Offline BigPoppa

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Re: Future College World Series Host
« Reply #24 on: December 05, 2016, 01:03:51 pm »
I'd love to see it hosted by Hamline (or St. Thomas... or even the MIAC) at Seibert Field (Home of U of MN).
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Offline Ralph Turner

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Re: Future College World Series Host
« Reply #25 on: December 05, 2016, 01:18:15 pm »
+1 Elretorno!

Excellent analysis.

Offline ElRetornodelEspencio

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Re: Future College World Series Host
« Reply #26 on: December 05, 2016, 02:10:22 pm »
I'd love to see it hosted by Hamline (or St. Thomas... or even the MIAC) at Seibert Field (Home of U of MN).

Can't see that happening (U of M practices at Siebert, don't they?), but Hamline is the 2nd tenant at CHS.

Do you know where there would be a master list of games at US Bank Stadium?
« Last Edit: December 05, 2016, 02:12:40 pm by ElRetornodelEspencio »

Offline BigPoppa

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Re: Future College World Series Host
« Reply #27 on: December 06, 2016, 12:29:15 pm »
I'd love to see it hosted by Hamline (or St. Thomas... or even the MIAC) at Seibert Field (Home of U of MN).

Can't see that happening (U of M practices at Siebert, don't they?), but Hamline is the 2nd tenant at CHS.

Do you know where there would be a master list of games at US Bank Stadium?

I don't have the list, but here is the guy who sets it all up. In the past they sent me schedules when I asked for one and it was all in the Dome...
ronpetrich@mac.com
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Offline ElRetornodelEspencio

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Re: Future College World Series Host
« Reply #28 on: December 06, 2016, 11:01:13 pm »
Awesome! Thanks.

I figure it's the cheapest way I'll ever see the stadium, and the warmest way I'll ever watch baseball in Minnesota haha.

Hopefully they have wifi and I can study and watch baseball this spring.

Offline BigPoppa

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Re: Future College World Series Host
« Reply #29 on: January 05, 2017, 09:25:23 am »
Any updates on potential sites for the 2019 D3 Series? I'd love to see it in the Twin Cities on the turf at Seibert Field.
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