Pool C - 2017

Started by wally_wabash, October 09, 2017, 09:11:08 AM

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Dave 'd-mac' McHugh

Quote from: smedindy on October 18, 2017, 01:52:45 PM
Interesting.

Could the NCAA accept a gift paying for flights? If someone wanted to pony up money for two additional charter flights, could the NCAA accept that?

(Don't look at me, I work in non-profit fundraising - I don't actually HAVE that kid of scratch...)

I am quite sure that isn't allowed. It would open a Pandora's Box of problems that I am sure would include Title IX. They have an operating budget that they work under.

Everyone is able to see the information (fact sheet is always the easiest: http://www.ncaa.org/sites/default/files/2018DIII_FactsandFigures_20170919.pdf) and I always check it out on a yearly basis.
Host of Hoopsville. USBWA Executive Board member. Broadcast Director for D3sports.com. Broadcaster for NCAA.com & several colleges. PA Announcer for Gophers & Brigade. Follow me on Twitter: @davemchugh or @d3hoopsville.

Pat Coleman

Quote from: smedindy on October 18, 2017, 01:52:45 PM
Interesting.

Could the NCAA accept a gift paying for flights? If someone wanted to pony up money for two additional charter flights, could the NCAA accept that?

(Don't look at me, I work in non-profit fundraising - I don't actually HAVE that kid of scratch...)

If you do know those potential funders, send them my way instead.  ;D
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Quote from: old 40 on September 25, 2007, 08:23:57 PMLet's discuss (sports) in a positive way, sometimes kidding each other with no disrespect.

wally_wabash

Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on October 18, 2017, 01:11:12 PM
Also keep in mind that more and more committees, men's basketball in particular, are starting to do the selection and bracketing process weeks in advance. They go through dummy scenarios and start compiling things well in advance. I have not said this before, but I know the men's basketball committee basically had a few mock brackets ready before Selection Sunday. They just had to figure out a few oddities or up-in-the-air scenarios before moving forward. Keep in mind, the committee chair had a team in the tournament due to an AQ last year. Football may have some of these items taken care of well before anyone has to step off a call.

I hope that helps.

This is fantastic policy and I hope committees are doing it increasingly.  I think doing mock brackets can only serve to help the committee build balanced brackets as best they can given geography and budget constraints.  The more you do it, the more outside-the-box kinds of things you can find that can produce better brackets than what you'd get doing it under the gun at who-knows-when on Selection Sunday eve.  I like it.  I hope this is a thing.
"Nothing in the world is more expensive than free."- The Deacon of HBO's The Wire

Dave 'd-mac' McHugh

Quote from: wally_wabash on October 18, 2017, 02:23:59 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on October 18, 2017, 01:11:12 PM
Also keep in mind that more and more committees, men's basketball in particular, are starting to do the selection and bracketing process weeks in advance. They go through dummy scenarios and start compiling things well in advance. I have not said this before, but I know the men's basketball committee basically had a few mock brackets ready before Selection Sunday. They just had to figure out a few oddities or up-in-the-air scenarios before moving forward. Keep in mind, the committee chair had a team in the tournament due to an AQ last year. Football may have some of these items taken care of well before anyone has to step off a call.

I hope that helps.

This is fantastic policy and I hope committees are doing it increasingly.  I think doing mock brackets can only serve to help the committee build balanced brackets as best they can given geography and budget constraints.  The more you do it, the more outside-the-box kinds of things you can find that can produce better brackets than what you'd get doing it under the gun at who-knows-when on Selection Sunday eve.  I like it.  I hope this is a thing.

Men's basketball has been doing this for several years now... working weeks in advance on "what ifs." I do have a feeling maybe last year it became a bit more of a solo effort, but I can't really say for sure. If so, it went maybe a little too far, but these individuals in basketball have had such a desire to get this stuff right that sometimes they may try too hard. :)

I am not sure if it is the norm everywhere, but I do get a sense the committee was encouraged to do it. However, their liaison has left the NCAA and I couldn't even guess what the new liaison may say.

I agree that I think it should happen more often. I know the committee chairs meet every September, but I have found it pretty surprising how often committees don't compare notes (despite what they may say publicly). The fact the men's and women's basketball committees don't work in a more similar manner surprises me. Men's committee has started midday and done by mid-evening the last few years. Women start the same time, but aren't done until well into the night. I just figure some of these things are obvious. That all said, men's lacrosse is so far off the reservation that it constantly reminds me that sometimes the culture and atmosphere allowed in the sport keeps it from changing. That mentality by a lot of sports is what kept the final regional rankings from being released for many years. Finally the NCAA stepped in and ended that nonsense.
Host of Hoopsville. USBWA Executive Board member. Broadcast Director for D3sports.com. Broadcaster for NCAA.com & several colleges. PA Announcer for Gophers & Brigade. Follow me on Twitter: @davemchugh or @d3hoopsville.

wally_wabash

Updated elimination table through Week 7:



click to enlarge

Changes this week:
- Newly eliminated teams have their names illuminated in white.  We lost 18 teams this week, leaving 94 still alive. 
- Grayed out Alfred State, Bellhaven, and Dean as they are also not eligible per the handbook. 
- Fun with fonts!  This week is papyrus. Why?  Because that SNL skit makes me laugh.   
"Nothing in the world is more expensive than free."- The Deacon of HBO's The Wire

smedindy


wally_wabash

Updated elimination table through Week 8:



click to enlarge

Changes this week:
- Newly eliminated teams have their names illuminated in white.  20 more teams are out.  73 teams remain (yes, there was a maths error last week). 
- Took Franklin off the board because if they don't qualify automatically, they'll have lost too many games to be viable. 
- Macalester (already a long shot) is out- they'll need to win the MWC championship to get in.  And if they don't, they'll have too many losses. 
- We've reached the point in the season where the UMACs are all out.  St. Scholastica and MacMurray are on track to decide the AQ.  Any losses by any non-AQ team here is too many.  So we can call the UMAC a one-bid league for sure at this point.
- Huntingdon has a two game lead in the USAC.  Losing that AQ will require multiple losses, which is too many for an at-large bid. 
- Albright in the MAC has just two losses, but there's not really a path for them at this point.  They'll have no quality wins and an SOS that is about to plummet.  They needed to beat Stevenson to stay viable, and didn't. 
- Fun with fonts!  Classed things up with Didot this week.   

Stay tuned...later this week I'll get out my first full at-large projection of 2017.  Hopefully tomorrow. 
"Nothing in the world is more expensive than free."- The Deacon of HBO's The Wire

bluestreak66

Quote from: wally_wabash on October 24, 2017, 08:59:54 PM
Updated elimination table through Week 8:



click to enlarge

Changes this week:
- Newly eliminated teams have their names illuminated in white.  20 more teams are out.  73 teams remain (yes, there was a maths error last week). 
- Took Franklin off the board because if they don't qualify automatically, they'll have lost too many games to be viable. 
- Macalester (already a long shot) is out- they'll need to win the MWC championship to get in.  And if they don't, they'll have too many losses. 
- We've reached the point in the season where the UMACs are all out.  St. Scholastica and MacMurray are on track to decide the AQ.  Any losses by any non-AQ team here is too many.  So we can call the UMAC a one-bid league for sure at this point.
- Huntingdon has a two game lead in the USAC.  Losing that AQ will require multiple losses, which is too many for an at-large bid. 
- Albright in the MAC has just two losses, but there's not really a path for them at this point.  They'll have no quality wins and an SOS that is about to plummet.  They needed to beat Stevenson to stay viable, and didn't. 
- Fun with fonts!  Classed things up with Didot this week.   

Stay tuned...later this week I'll get out my first full at-large projection of 2017.  Hopefully tomorrow.

Even though one of those losses is to a DI team? I'm not questioning it so much as I don't know what standard procedure is in a case like this!
A.M.D.G.
Whose House? STREAKS' HOUSE!

RIP MUC57- "Go everybody!"

2018 CCIW PICK EM'S CHAMPION
2018 & 2019 ODAC POSTSEASON PICK EM'S CHAMPION
2019 OAC POSTSEASON PICK EM'S CHAMPION

wally_wabash

Quote from: bluestreak66 on October 25, 2017, 09:19:47 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on October 24, 2017, 08:59:54 PM
Changes this week:
- Newly eliminated teams have their names illuminated in white.  20 more teams are out.  73 teams remain (yes, there was a maths error last week). 
- Took Franklin off the board because if they don't qualify automatically, they'll have lost too many games to be viable. 
- Macalester (already a long shot) is out- they'll need to win the MWC championship to get in.  And if they don't, they'll have too many losses. 
- We've reached the point in the season where the UMACs are all out.  St. Scholastica and MacMurray are on track to decide the AQ.  Any losses by any non-AQ team here is too many.  So we can call the UMAC a one-bid league for sure at this point.
- Huntingdon has a two game lead in the USAC.  Losing that AQ will require multiple losses, which is too many for an at-large bid. 
- Albright in the MAC has just two losses, but there's not really a path for them at this point.  They'll have no quality wins and an SOS that is about to plummet.  They needed to beat Stevenson to stay viable, and didn't. 
- Fun with fonts!  Classed things up with Didot this week.   

Stay tuned...later this week I'll get out my first full at-large projection of 2017.  Hopefully tomorrow.

Even though one of those losses is to a DI team? I'm not questioning it so much as I don't know what standard procedure is in a case like this!
Per the criteria, Franklin would have just two D-III losses- so you're right about Franklin not being eliminated here based on having sustained three in-division losses.  However, for Franklin to wind up in the at-large pool at this point would require them to lose a game to MSJ, Anderson, or Hanover- any of which I think are disqualifying losses at this point in the season.  Franklin's SOS is also not very good (0.450, 194th ranked) and it will actually get worse before the season ends.  The Grizzlies won't have any RRO results (probably...outside chance RHIT could wind up ranked), and that game against Butler really doesn't help them at all because it was pretty noncompetitive- even then, non-divisional games are secondary criteria.  I don't see a reasonable way for Franklin to take a loss during the rankings period (starting this Saturday!) and wind up high enough in the regional rankings to be selected-  or really be ranked at all, if we're being honest. 
"Nothing in the world is more expensive than free."- The Deacon of HBO's The Wire

bluestreak66

Quote from: wally_wabash on October 25, 2017, 09:35:26 AM
Quote from: bluestreak66 on October 25, 2017, 09:19:47 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on October 24, 2017, 08:59:54 PM
Changes this week:
- Newly eliminated teams have their names illuminated in white.  20 more teams are out.  73 teams remain (yes, there was a maths error last week). 
- Took Franklin off the board because if they don't qualify automatically, they'll have lost too many games to be viable. 
- Macalester (already a long shot) is out- they'll need to win the MWC championship to get in.  And if they don't, they'll have too many losses. 
- We've reached the point in the season where the UMACs are all out.  St. Scholastica and MacMurray are on track to decide the AQ.  Any losses by any non-AQ team here is too many.  So we can call the UMAC a one-bid league for sure at this point.
- Huntingdon has a two game lead in the USAC.  Losing that AQ will require multiple losses, which is too many for an at-large bid. 
- Albright in the MAC has just two losses, but there's not really a path for them at this point.  They'll have no quality wins and an SOS that is about to plummet.  They needed to beat Stevenson to stay viable, and didn't. 
- Fun with fonts!  Classed things up with Didot this week.   

Stay tuned...later this week I'll get out my first full at-large projection of 2017.  Hopefully tomorrow.

Even though one of those losses is to a DI team? I'm not questioning it so much as I don't know what standard procedure is in a case like this!
Per the criteria, Franklin would have just two D-III losses- so you're right about Franklin not being eliminated here based on having sustained three in-division losses.  However, for Franklin to wind up in the at-large pool at this point would require them to lose a game to MSJ, Anderson, or Hanover- any of which I think are disqualifying losses at this point in the season.  Franklin's SOS is also not very good (0.450, 194th ranked) and it will actually get worse before the season ends.  The Grizzlies won't have any RRO results (probably...outside chance RHIT could wind up ranked), and that game against Butler really doesn't help them at all because it was pretty noncompetitive- even then, non-divisional games are secondary criteria.  I don't see a reasonable way for Franklin to take a loss during the rankings period (starting this Saturday!) and wind up high enough in the regional rankings to be selected-  or really be ranked at all, if we're being honest.

Makes sense! Thanks for clarifying!  :)
A.M.D.G.
Whose House? STREAKS' HOUSE!

RIP MUC57- "Go everybody!"

2018 CCIW PICK EM'S CHAMPION
2018 & 2019 ODAC POSTSEASON PICK EM'S CHAMPION
2019 OAC POSTSEASON PICK EM'S CHAMPION

FCGrizzliesGrad

Franklin would have to lose two of their last three to be in pool C. One loss would still tie for the title and they have the tiebreaker.
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wesleydad

Quote from: wally_wabash on October 24, 2017, 08:59:54 PM
Updated elimination table through Week 8:



click to enlarge

Changes this week:
- Newly eliminated teams have their names illuminated in white.  20 more teams are out.  73 teams remain (yes, there was a maths error last week). 
- Took Franklin off the board because if they don't qualify automatically, they'll have lost too many games to be viable. 
- Macalester (already a long shot) is out- they'll need to win the MWC championship to get in.  And if they don't, they'll have too many losses. 
- We've reached the point in the season where the UMACs are all out.  St. Scholastica and MacMurray are on track to decide the AQ.  Any losses by any non-AQ team here is too many.  So we can call the UMAC a one-bid league for sure at this point.
- Huntingdon has a two game lead in the USAC.  Losing that AQ will require multiple losses, which is too many for an at-large bid. 
- Albright in the MAC has just two losses, but there's not really a path for them at this point.  They'll have no quality wins and an SOS that is about to plummet.  They needed to beat Stevenson to stay viable, and didn't. 
- Fun with fonts!  Classed things up with Didot this week.   

Stay tuned...later this week I'll get out my first full at-large projection of 2017.  Hopefully tomorrow.

Wally, thanks for doing this.  Gives me something to read during lunch.

wally_wabash

Key at-large games to watch for this weekend:
UW-Lax @ UW-Platteville
Wittenberg @ Wabash
WashU @ CWRU
Dubuque @ Wartburg
Johns Hopkins @ Muhlenberg
Salve Regina @ Western New England
Marietta @ Ohio Northern
Hendrix @ Trinity
Millikin @ Carthage
Monmouth @ Lake Forest
Cal Lutheran @ Chapman
"Nothing in the world is more expensive than free."- The Deacon of HBO's The Wire

Andy Jamison - Walla Walla Wildcat

Wally - Now that GFU and Linfield played with the Cats winning a wet, windy game 12-6 do you think it is better for Fox's playoff hopes if Linfield wins out versus going losing a game.  I believe that the way that the NWC works is that the conference winner of the auto bid in the event of a tie is the head to result.

Linfield at 9-1 with the auto bid.  GFU at 8-2 with two losses and I'd guess a fairly high regional ranking.

Versus Linfield at 8-2 with the auto bid and GFU at 8-2 looking for a Pool C.

Just curious and really appreciate all the work that you put into this!

AO

Quote from: wally_wabash on October 24, 2017, 08:59:54 PM

- We've reached the point in the season where the UMACs are all out.  St. Scholastica and MacMurray are on track to decide the AQ.  Any losses by any non-AQ team here is too many.  So we can call the UMAC a one-bid league for sure at this point.
This can't be right, check your facts Wally.  We're a 3 bid league.