CCIW

Started by Mr. Ypsi, September 04, 2009, 08:57:08 PM

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Falconer

Thanks very much to Gotberg and Gregory for those fascinating comments about NPU soccer and athletics more generally. I knew Dr Parkyn liked soccer, and that was the basis for my ill-supported conjecture. I certainly hadn't meant to imply that the coach didn't deserve the lion's share of the credit. I simply wondered whether support from the top was helpful in advancing the program.

I didn't know Jerry Chaplin very well at all. He left Messiah at some point before his death. The only time I would run into him would be at a soccer game--and then only occasionally. I never saw him around town. I hadn't known about his NPU connection.

Gotberg

Quote from: Gregory Sager on October 19, 2017, 12:17:41 PM
Quote from: Falconer on October 19, 2017, 07:24:26 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on October 19, 2017, 01:42:06 AM
Quote from: tjcummingsfan on October 18, 2017, 10:20:34 PM
Greg, you'd know much better than I, is this the biggest win in NP Men's Soccer history?  Certainly those streak-breaking wins against Wheaton were, huge, but is the best win against a high ranked team?   

No, those breakthrough wins a decade and a half ago against Wheaton were bigger, because: a) they put NPU on the map, soccerwise; b) they represented the Park's first-ever victories against Wheaton after two decades of humiliating losses; c) they broke Wheaton's hegemony in CCIW soccer, which had been in place since the league first added the sport in the mid-'80s; d) league matches are always more important; e) they got Wheaton's attention and ignited a rivalry that NPU had always dreamed about having, even though it is only in one sport; and f) it's Wheaton, and every win regardless of the sport is bigger when it's against Wheaton if you're NPU.

But this was certainly the biggest win NPU's recorded in a long, long time. It also represents the first time in twenty years that the Vikings have vanquished Chicago, against whom they were only 2-8-3 all-time coming into tonight's match. Most importantly, this will flip the next NCAA Central Region rankings. Chicago was #1 and North Park was #2 in the most recent ranking. (Calvin is still undefeated, but the SOS of the Knights lags well behind that of both NPU and Chicago; in fact, the Knights are currently #4, behind the two Windy City sides and Wash U.)

Incidentally, the rise of NPU soccer has taken place under a president (David Parkyn) who worked for a long time at two other soccer powers, first Messiah and then Etown.

That's not accurate. David Parkyn assumed the presidency of North Park in the fall of 2006. By that point, NPU had already broken through and won two straight conference titles and conference tourneys and made the program's NCAA tourney debut. The Vikings were on a two-match winning streak against Wheaton, which had won 16 of the first 17 CCIW titles and had amassed a 92-2-2 CCIW record along the way before North Park's breakthrough, when David Parkyn unpacked his boxes in the president's office.

Quote from: Falconer on October 19, 2017, 07:24:26 AMHe used to live a block from Messiah's campus in downtown Grantham, if I may call it that--Grantham isn't on most state maps. I have no idea whether those dots actually connect as I sketched it, but someone here might be able to comment on it from a position of knowledge.

There are some other Messiah connections nationally where the dots definitely do connect. For example, the coaches at F&M and Eastern are former Messiah players. Those programs have flourished in recent years substantially because the coaches implemented things they learned in Grantham. Perhaps NPU, indirectly, should also be in that bucket?  ::)

No. David Parkyn was an enthusiastic supporter of North Park athletics as president, and that certainly included the soccer team. (He's the only college/university president I've ever seen who wore a genuine soccer scarf with his school's colors and emblem on it at matches. ;)) But I'm sure that he didn't share any soccer expertise with head coach John Born, nor would John have done anything but listen politely with no intention of taking him seriously if he had.

The only real athletics connection that NPU has had with Messiah was a negative one. The late Jerry Chaplin became Messiah's athletic director after having held the same position at North Park. I won't get into the specifics of his decision-making as North Park's AD, but, while Messiah had tremendous success (particularly on the soccer pitch) under Chaplin's tenure in the AD's office, the opposite was true at North Park. The school's signature program, men's basketball (five D3 national titles, still the standard in this division in that sport), totally collapsed into doormat status on his watch, as did the other perennially strong program on campus (baseball), and morale in the North Park athletics department was at an all-time low. He didn't have any second-hand touch with the North Park soccer program, either, which was middle-of-the-pack in the CCIW during his time on the North Side of Chicago.

He seemed like a nice guy, but his time at North Park is not remembered fondly.

Quote from: Gotberg on October 19, 2017, 09:05:26 AMGreg can probably give you better details, but I think the credit should really be given to the coach, John Born.  The program only had an upward trajectory after he arrived.

He's done a great job of recruiting quality American talent, as well as sustaining a pipeline of high level players from Sweden and Norway.

This is 100% correct. One man, and one man alone, deserves the credit for making North Park soccer what it is, and that man is John Born.

Don't get me wrong; it's not a one-man show, and other people involved with the program are important to NPU's ongoing success. F'rinstance, associate head coach Kris Grahn has played a key role in the program since he joined the staff five years ago, but NPU's success on the pitch predates him -- and a lot of NPU's success came when he was a star player under Born (Grahn was a two-time NSCAA All-American and the CCIW's Player of the Year in 2010). Given the perennial prominence of Scandinavian players on NPU's roster, it's certainly helpful to have a Scandinavian coach on staff as well (Grahn is a Swede). But he coaches everybody, not just the Scandinavians, and that's really a big part of John Born's success; he's found a way to make the Americans and the Scandinavians meld successfully both on and off the pitch, which is nearly not as easy as it sounds. By all reports, this is perhaps the most internally cohesive squad he's ever had, and I'm sure that that translates in some measure on the pitch.

Quote from: Gotberg on October 19, 2017, 09:05:26 AMJohn likes to play a technical game (less physical / run and kick) style and I think that is enticing.

I don't know about the "less physical" part, although the success of the Vikings has never been predicated upon mucking up matches. But, given enough big boys, NPU has certainly more than held its own in the giving and taking of bruises, too. This is actually one of his more physical Vikings outfits.

My mention of less physical means they don't have to be physical to make up for inferior soccer abilities.  I.e, some soccer teams will tackle hard, push to intimidate because they don't have matching soccer skills.  Back in my time at North Park, this was probably us :)

Some fairly recent Carthage, Augie and Elmhurst teams are examples where physicality made up for soccer quality.
I spent a lot of money on booze, birds and fast cars. The rest I just squandered. - George Best

Gregory Sager

Quote from: Gotberg on October 20, 2017, 09:04:28 AMMy mention of less physical means they don't have to be physical to make up for inferior soccer abilities.  I.e, some soccer teams will tackle hard, push to intimidate because they don't have matching soccer skills.  Back in my time at North Park, this was probably us :)

Yeah, that's what I figured you meant, which is why I made reference to good John Born teams not needing to muck up matches. I just wanted to state for the sake of clarity that there have been good Vikings sides like this present one that can, and will, dish it out as well as take it.

Quote from: Gotberg on October 20, 2017, 09:04:28 AMSome fairly recent Carthage, Augie and Elmhurst teams are examples where physicality made up for soccer quality.

Those would be my three CCIW examples as well, and by that I mean three CCIW programs that have been successful at overcoming skill or speed shortcomings by being physical. That category no longer includes Augie at the moment, though, since the Doggies are currently abysmal, and on occasion Carthage has been so highly skilled and/or fast that the Red Men really didn't have to resort to smashmouth soccer much.

Elmhurst is another story. The Bluejays have practically fetishized bullying tactics over the years, in tandem with an overly defensive-oriented style of play. That doesn't seem to be working well this season, though, as the 'jays are currently 7-6-2 overall and are probably on the outside looking in as far as the CCIW tourney picture is concerned. Not only are they 2-4 in the league, but three of their four losses were pretty lopsided:

North Central 3, EC 0
Wheaton 4, EC 0
Carthage 5, EC 0

Only their 2-1 double-OT loss at Illinois Wesleyan looked winnable.

Still, playing Elmhurst always makes me nervous, no matter what the record of the 'jays happens to be. DiTomasso's sides always have a tendency to get up for North Park, and I've seen too many Vikings helped off the pitch (or carted off) in the past to take EC lightly.
"To see what is in front of one's nose is a constant struggle." -- George Orwell

Gregory Sager

Quote from: Falconer on October 19, 2017, 09:18:57 PM
Thanks very much to Gotberg and Gregory for those fascinating comments about NPU soccer and athletics more generally. I knew Dr Parkyn liked soccer, and that was the basis for my ill-supported conjecture. I certainly hadn't meant to imply that the coach didn't deserve the lion's share of the credit. I simply wondered whether support from the top was helpful in advancing the program.

Having a soccer-loving university president certainly didn't hurt, but I don't think it helped, either. I've never seen the men's soccer program get any particular perquisites from either NPU in general or from the president's office specifically, and that's been true before, during, and after David Parkyn's presidency. And the NPU athletics department is pretty scrupulous about fairly apportioning its (very limited) resources to the various varsity programs.
"To see what is in front of one's nose is a constant struggle." -- George Orwell

Gregory Sager

In spite of having the run of play for the most part and a decided statistical edge, NPU required an own goal by Case Western Reserve this afternoon in the 85th minute to escape Cleveland with a 3-2 win. It propels the Park to 13-1-1 on the season.

While they're riding home on the bus, they can contemplate the ambiguous feelings they must be having for archrival Wheaton right now. The Sonic Atmospheric Disturbance did the Vikings a solid yesterday by taking down North Central in Wheaton, 2-0, to leave NPU the last unbeaten team standing. The Vikings can now clinch the CCIW title and home-pitch advantage with a win at home over North Central on Wednesday.

The other big match yesterday took place in Bloomington, where Carthage snapped back from that bad loss to Millikin by taking down erstwhile third-place Illinois Wesleyan, 2-1. Here's the standings and remaining CCIW matches for the five sides still in competition for the CCIW tourney:


*North Park  5-0-1  13-1-1  vs. NCC, @ EC
North Central  5-1    8-6-1  @ NPU, vs. IWU
Wheaton  4-2    8-7  vs. IWU, @ MU
Illinois Wesleyan  3-2    8-5-1  @ WC, vs. AC, @ NCC
Carthage  3-2-1  10-6-2  @ CU, vs. AC
Elmhurst  3-4    8-6-2  vs. NPU

*clinched tournament berth
"To see what is in front of one's nose is a constant struggle." -- George Orwell

tjcummingsfan

There was a little bit of a shake-up last night as Wheaton lost at home to IWU 4-1.  Here's how the standings look going in to tomorrow's games. 


*North Park  5-0-1  13-1-1  vs. NCC, @ EC
North Central  5-1    8-6-1  @ NPU, vs. IWU
Illinois Wesleyan  4-2    8-5-1  vs. AC, @ NCC
Wheaton  4-3    8-7  @ MU
Carthage  3-2-1  10-6-2  @ CU, vs. AC
Elmhurst  3-4    8-6-2  vs. NPU

*clinched tournament berth

We've seen some crazy results this year, so I'd rather not speculate beyond what's here.  Depending on tie-breakers (that I haven't taken the time to look up) there are 6 teams vying for conference spots going in to the last week. This should be a really entertaining week of CCIW soccer. 


Gregory Sager

#921
That is definitely a crazy result, especially as it seemed that Wheaton had found itself and was building late-season momentum by winning four matches in a row. It also sounded like the match itself was fairly even in terms of run of play (WC actually took more shots and had a lot more corners, and shots on frame were even), but IWU had better opportunities, better finishing, or better goalkeeping -- or some combination of the three. It's a particularly damaging loss for the Sonic Atmospheric Disturbance. As we head into the final two days of CCIW regular-season play, Wheaton, which has participated in all 15 CCIW tourneys held to date, is by no means a sure thing to make it 16-for-16. Wheaton fans will certainly be in the uncomfortable position of rooting for NPU tomorrow night, as well as rooting for their own troops down in Decatur.

Elmhurst loses tiebreakers to both Wheaton and Illinois Wesleyan, both of whom beat the 'jays head-to-head, so Illinois Wesleyan's win last night eliminated Elmhurst from tournament consideration. Even though Carthage is in fifth, the Red Men are actually in pretty good shape, since they have the two weakest sides in the league remaining on their schedule. The three untied teams have an interesting situation between them, as Wheaton has defeated North Central and Illinois Wesleyan has defeated Wheaton; that IWU @ NCC match on Saturday could loom very large.

North Park would clinch the CCIW title with a win tomorrow night. There's a chance that we'll have multiple cameras on hand for our broadcast coverage for that match, so that's pretty exciting, as I suspect that we'll have a lot of viewers. A North Central win wouldn't guarantee an NCC title, and in fact it would still be a tough slog for the Cards to pull off the championship, since Illinois Wesleyan will also be playing for something and the Titans thus promise to be a tough customer on Saturday.

In the bigger picture, I think that NPU appears at the moment to be in good shape for a Pool C berth if one is needed, provided that the Vikings don't fold like an accordion over the next two weeks. I don't really see a way for any of the other four sides contending for a CCIW tourney spot to get into the D3 tourney via the Pool C route.
"To see what is in front of one's nose is a constant struggle." -- George Orwell

Gregory Sager

North Park clinched the CCIW championship and home pitch in the conference tourney by downing second-place North Central tonight, 3-0. The Vikings, who now find themselves in first place in the Central Region rankings, trading places with Chicago atop the region after having beaten the Maroons last Wednesday, advance to 14-1-1 on the season.

NPU's archrival and fellow traditional CCIW power Wheaton went in the opposite direction, as WC suffered a shocking draw at the hands of lowly Millikin tonight, 2-2. That eliminates Wheaton (4-3-1 in CCIW) from contention for a spot in the four-team CCIW tourney, as fourth-place Carthage (4-2-1) owns the tiebreaker with one league match remaining for the Red Men. After making the first 15 CCIW tourneys, Wheaton's streak is snapped, and WC will instead clean out the lockers after the final regular-season match on Saturday. The last time Wheaton's season ended without at least one extra match tacked on to the end of the schedule was 1992.

Illinois Wesleyan and Carthage both won, so the tourney field is set. All that remains to be seen is where the Titans, Cardinals, and Red Men will wind up in the seeding, as IWU and NCC, both now 5-2 in CCIW play, square off for second place and a first-round home match on Saturday in Naperville, while Carthage finishes up with a home contest against last-place Augustana.
"To see what is in front of one's nose is a constant struggle." -- George Orwell

Gotberg

Quote from: Gregory Sager on October 26, 2017, 01:15:07 AM
North Park clinched the CCIW championship and home pitch in the conference tourney by downing second-place North Central tonight, 3-0. The Vikings, who now find themselves in first place in the Central Region rankings, trading places with Chicago atop the region after having beaten the Maroons last Wednesday, advance to 14-1-1 on the season.

NPU's archrival and fellow traditional CCIW power Wheaton went in the opposite direction, as WC suffered a shocking draw at the hands of lowly Millikin tonight, 2-2. That eliminates Wheaton (4-3-1 in CCIW) from contention for a spot in the four-team CCIW tourney, as fourth-place Carthage (4-2-1) owns the tiebreaker with one league match remaining for the Red Men. After making the first 15 CCIW tourneys, Wheaton's streak is snapped, and WC will instead clean out the lockers after the final regular-season match on Saturday. The last time Wheaton's season ended without at least one extra match tacked on to the end of the schedule was 1992.

Illinois Wesleyan and Carthage both won, so the tourney field is set. All that remains to be seen is where the Titans, Cardinals, and Red Men will wind up in the seeding, as IWU and NCC, both now 5-2 in CCIW play, square off for second place and a first-round home match on Saturday in Naperville, while Carthage finishes up with a home contest against last-place Augustana.

Greg, I enjoyed the new broadcast service - seeing the score/time and the multiple camera angles (replays too?).  Not sure if others experienced the same, but the broadcast stopped for me about 40 minutes into the game.  Mentioning it, just so you have some feedback.

I said after the Benedictine game, that this could be a fabulous NP team, and they proved it all season long.  Congrats to them. 

I spent a lot of money on booze, birds and fast cars. The rest I just squandered. - George Best

Gregory Sager

Quote from: Gotberg on October 26, 2017, 09:03:25 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on October 26, 2017, 01:15:07 AM
North Park clinched the CCIW championship and home pitch in the conference tourney by downing second-place North Central tonight, 3-0. The Vikings, who now find themselves in first place in the Central Region rankings, trading places with Chicago atop the region after having beaten the Maroons last Wednesday, advance to 14-1-1 on the season.

NPU's archrival and fellow traditional CCIW power Wheaton went in the opposite direction, as WC suffered a shocking draw at the hands of lowly Millikin tonight, 2-2. That eliminates Wheaton (4-3-1 in CCIW) from contention for a spot in the four-team CCIW tourney, as fourth-place Carthage (4-2-1) owns the tiebreaker with one league match remaining for the Red Men. After making the first 15 CCIW tourneys, Wheaton's streak is snapped, and WC will instead clean out the lockers after the final regular-season match on Saturday. The last time Wheaton's season ended without at least one extra match tacked on to the end of the schedule was 1992.

Illinois Wesleyan and Carthage both won, so the tourney field is set. All that remains to be seen is where the Titans, Cardinals, and Red Men will wind up in the seeding, as IWU and NCC, both now 5-2 in CCIW play, square off for second place and a first-round home match on Saturday in Naperville, while Carthage finishes up with a home contest against last-place Augustana.

Greg, I enjoyed the new broadcast service - seeing the score/time and the multiple camera angles (replays too?).  Not sure if others experienced the same, but the broadcast stopped for me about 40 minutes into the game.  Mentioning it, just so you have some feedback.

I hadn't heard that there were any problems, but I'll pass that along. My monitor wasn't working during the men's contest (it worked during the women's), but I'm used to not having access to a live monitor (or replays), so it didn't bother me.

Quote from: Gotberg on October 26, 2017, 09:03:25 AM
I said after the Benedictine game, that this could be a fabulous NP team, and they proved it all season long.  Congrats to them.

NPU seems very hungry. I do not think that this team is content to rest upon its laurels.
"To see what is in front of one's nose is a constant struggle." -- George Orwell

LM3

Quote from: Gregory Sager on October 26, 2017, 11:06:46 AM
Quote from: Gotberg on October 26, 2017, 09:03:25 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on October 26, 2017, 01:15:07 AM
North Park clinched the CCIW championship and home pitch in the conference tourney by downing second-place North Central tonight, 3-0. The Vikings, who now find themselves in first place in the Central Region rankings, trading places with Chicago atop the region after having beaten the Maroons last Wednesday, advance to 14-1-1 on the season.

NPU's archrival and fellow traditional CCIW power Wheaton went in the opposite direction, as WC suffered a shocking draw at the hands of lowly Millikin tonight, 2-2. That eliminates Wheaton (4-3-1 in CCIW) from contention for a spot in the four-team CCIW tourney, as fourth-place Carthage (4-2-1) owns the tiebreaker with one league match remaining for the Red Men. After making the first 15 CCIW tourneys, Wheaton's streak is snapped, and WC will instead clean out the lockers after the final regular-season match on Saturday. The last time Wheaton's season ended without at least one extra match tacked on to the end of the schedule was 1992.

Illinois Wesleyan and Carthage both won, so the tourney field is set. All that remains to be seen is where the Titans, Cardinals, and Red Men will wind up in the seeding, as IWU and NCC, both now 5-2 in CCIW play, square off for second place and a first-round home match on Saturday in Naperville, while Carthage finishes up with a home contest against last-place Augustana.

Greg, I enjoyed the new broadcast service - seeing the score/time and the multiple camera angles (replays too?).  Not sure if others experienced the same, but the broadcast stopped for me about 40 minutes into the game.  Mentioning it, just so you have some feedback.

I hadn't heard that there were any problems, but I'll pass that along. My monitor wasn't working during the men's contest (it worked during the women's), but I'm used to not having access to a live monitor (or replays), so it didn't bother me.

Quote from: Gotberg on October 26, 2017, 09:03:25 AM
I said after the Benedictine game, that this could be a fabulous NP team, and they proved it all season long.  Congrats to them.

NPU seems very hungry. I do not think that this team is content to rest upon its laurels.

I was on hand for that NPU/Benedictine match and have seen them a few more times on vid...I am rooting for them, and do believe they have a good chance to make some noise. Very good team!

blue_jays

Quote from: Gregory Sager on October 26, 2017, 01:15:07 AM
North Park clinched the CCIW championship and home pitch in the conference tourney by downing second-place North Central tonight, 3-0. The Vikings, who now find themselves in first place in the Central Region rankings, trading places with Chicago atop the region after having beaten the Maroons last Wednesday, advance to 14-1-1 on the season.

NPU's archrival and fellow traditional CCIW power Wheaton went in the opposite direction, as WC suffered a shocking draw at the hands of lowly Millikin tonight, 2-2. That eliminates Wheaton (4-3-1 in CCIW) from contention for a spot in the four-team CCIW tourney, as fourth-place Carthage (4-2-1) owns the tiebreaker with one league match remaining for the Red Men. After making the first 15 CCIW tourneys, Wheaton's streak is snapped, and WC will instead clean out the lockers after the final regular-season match on Saturday. The last time Wheaton's season ended without at least one extra match tacked on to the end of the schedule was 1992.

Illinois Wesleyan and Carthage both won, so the tourney field is set. All that remains to be seen is where the Titans, Cardinals, and Red Men will wind up in the seeding, as IWU and NCC, both now 5-2 in CCIW play, square off for second place and a first-round home match on Saturday in Naperville, while Carthage finishes up with a home contest against last-place Augustana.

I wouldn't call any of Wheaton's results shocking. They just aren't the Wheaton of the past, and I'm not sure when they'll get back to that level again. The Wheaton standard of talent just isn't there. I thought they were a .500 team going into this year and that's what it seems to be. I've got several thoughts on the recent downfall, but I don't like being a guy who talks trash on teams in a public forum when they're still out there trying their best to win like everyone else.

Gregory Sager

Illinois Wesleyan took down North Central in Naperville, 2-1, on a Doug Ballard goal 49 seconds deep into overtime, and clinches the second seed and the right to host a semifinal with a 6-2 record. North Central, which fell to 5-3, will get the #4 seed and return to the North Side of Chicago on Wednesday to face North Park, unless Carthage loses to Augustana tonight in Kenosha -- a possibility that seems pretty unlikely. The easy guess is that it'll be Carthage @ Illinois Wesleyan and North Central @ North Park on Wednesday night.
"To see what is in front of one's nose is a constant struggle." -- George Orwell

Gregory Sager

#928
North Park didn't play a pretty match, but the Vikings did what they needed to do to stave off Elmhurst, 2-1, in the western suburbs to close out the regular season at 15-1-1 and 7-0-1. The Vikings will host North Central, since, as everyone expected, Carthage took down Augie today. The Red Men scored three second-half goals and won up in Kenosha, 3-0, so they grab the third seed and will travel to Bloomington on Wednesday to face #2 Illinois Wesleyan.
"To see what is in front of one's nose is a constant struggle." -- George Orwell

tjcummingsfan

So it looks like Carthage beat IWU last night in Overtime 2-1 to advance to the CCIW Tournament final.

I was surprised to see that they played on a different night than North Park & North Central. 

Greg, do you know if there's a reason for that?  I just assumed both semi's would take place the same night. 

Also, will there be video/audio/stats for tonight's NP v. NC game?