Liberty League

Started by Saint of Old, August 12, 2014, 12:14:06 PM

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vassarfan

Hey guys I played at Vassar a few years back and just started following the league again last year. I just wanted to thank you all for your posts. Its great to get insight from people watching the games as I miss most of them and unfortunately the school write-ups don't really tell the full story.

Don't mean to add fuel to the fire, but in the case of Jansen, I don't think he was overrated at all. I battled against him for four years and thought he was a tough and skilled player that carried his team for most of his career. His individual accolades can be debated but I always thought his impact on the pitch spoke for itself. 

Quick question for the St. Lawrence bloggers. I played 09-12 and thought St. Lawrence had by far the most talented team in the league. Has the talent level dipped a bit on your squad since past years or was it just exceptionally good during those years? For reference, some of the guys on those teams were Brendan Gorman, Demello and Laird. I always thought Gorman was by far the best player in the league and it was really too bad he got hurt because that team would have been special.

Anyways thanks again for your posts. Really enjoy reading them and keeping up with the league

Saint of Old

Quote from: vassarfan on October 09, 2017, 11:55:47 AM
Hey guys I played at Vassar a few years back and just started following the league again last year. I just wanted to thank you all for your posts. Its great to get insight from people watching the games as I miss most of them and unfortunately the school write-ups don't really tell the full story.

Don't mean to add fuel to the fire, but in the case of Jansen, I don't think he was overrated at all. I battled against him for four years and thought he was a tough and skilled player that carried his team for most of his career. His individual accolades can be debated but I always thought his impact on the pitch spoke for itself. 

Quick question for the St. Lawrence bloggers. I played 09-12 and thought St. Lawrence had by far the most talented team in the league. Has the talent level dipped a bit on your squad since past years or was it just exceptionally good during those years? For reference, some of the guys on those teams were Brendan Gorman, Demello and Laird. I always thought Gorman was by far the best player in the league and it was really too bad he got hurt because that team would have been special.

Anyways thanks again for your posts. Really enjoy reading them and keeping up with the league
Welcome Brother.
I hated Vassar, but again it was because they always played tough.
They were new to the league during my era but played extremely hard back then and you knew it was only a matter of time before the program took off.

As to your question, yes, SLU had quite a bit of fire power back then.
Those teams also included Bednarsky (an all-time great midfielder for the team) the brilliant goalie Abernathy and Harry Copeland, the 7 foot technical defender.
I don't think the team has taken a dip talent wise, I think (as has been debated here) SLU now has 2 all-time great Saint  midfielders on the team and a young core of players that will come good in time.

This team will come good. Simply going through a transition at the moment, but still, currently on a modest 5 game unbeaten streak and lead the LL.

I agree with your assessment and believe that had Gorman and Demello not been badly injured the team would have won a 2nd championship duing the time period yo u referenced. In 2011 the team was #1 the entire season despite losing all three starting fwds to season ending injuries.

deutschfan

Welcome Vassar fan.  Your 2012 team win against Tufts in the NCAAs was against a group that would go on to win 2 national championships.  Very impressive.  Saint stole my thunder with his summary but here is this week's notes on a scorecard in order of current LL standings: 1) SLU--Tie against under .500 RIT at home due to poor defense and an inexplicable lack of OT urgency destroys any Pool C aspirations and renders this week's fixture against Vassar a must win given Vassar's 6 points from Union and RIT compared to SLU's 2; 2) Vassar--Goalie gaffe on 50 yard free kick keeps a league race alive although a repeat of 2015's home weekend wins against SLU and Clarkson will virtually seal regular season; 3) Hobart--Second tie against bottom table team also kills Pool C aspirations; 4) Skidmore--Offense lags against good teams and lucky not to be a 4 point team with 88th minute goal against RPI and gift from Vassar; 5) RPI--Last second win against Union can't hide fact that this is a paper tiger; 6) Clarkson--Tie with Hobart gives life but now needs a repeat of Coach Taylor's first game against Vassar; 7) RIT--Team that basically played even against the league leaders deserves a better place in the standings; 8) Ithaca--A good team takes out its frustrations against Bard but still only has spoiler role; 9) Union--Creative offensive play against RPI deserves kudos but alas; and 10) Bard--Hard to get results giving up an average of around 20 shots per game.

Part_Bart

Quote from: Saint of Old on October 09, 2017, 11:35:23 AM
What a LL we have on our hands.

Clarkson does very well to tie Hobart.
Hobart having real trouble scoring and Clarkson seems determined to hang on for a post season qualification.

Too bad for them Ithaca also intends to get to the post-season and had the best weekend in the conference with a dismantling of Bard.
Ithaca will cause some people trouble this year and are seemingly putting it together.

RPI is RPI, they will be in the post season, you can count on it.

Skidmore will as well, but have tied too many games to have a realistic chance at #1 overall seed.
Vassar is doing very well and are poised to win the conference regular season title.

SLU could have really turned the season around in no uncertain terms, but fell 2 minutes short due to lack of concentration.

RIT is still in this thing.

Hobart can. not. score (1.1 GF, 0.8GA over 10 games, including six OT/five 2OT).
Like the Bard game, Clarkson this past weekend was a four act play in offensive ... effort.
If it goes as it has gone, Hobart may not score this weekend against Union OR RPI -- and may not let in a goal, either.
Am expecting 220 minutes of soccer.....

I think Ithaca is a team getting better and better this season and it puzzles me they lost to Clarkson (who may be able to snare the 6th LL tournament seed!).

Per the thread on SLU (past and present), my sense is that IF SLU is down a bit in talent (not for me to say, but IF), the play in LL is more a reflection of the rest of the league getting a bit more talent, being a bit better organized to stop other teams from scoring, and perhaps the stability of the top program's coaches (they know the other teams so well).  Or maybe it is just that I spend too much time watching RPI and Hobart?

Shout out to deutschfan's weekend update -- spot on for me.
Am thinking this is a big weekend as some of the upper-table teams play each other.
Looking forward to next Monday's update after this weekend's action.

deutschfan

A shout out also to Mr. Dede who had two excellent goals in two games and unlike most of the members of his team showed some signs of urgency in the RIT OT periods.  Saint--I call them like I see them.   

Ommadawn

Quote from: deutschfan on October 09, 2017, 01:57:02 PM
Welcome Vassar fan.  Your 2012 team win against Tufts in the NCAAs was against a group that would go on to win 2 national championships. 

Yes, welcome to a friendly, spirited, and informative thread on a friendly, spirited, and informative site!  There we some real standouts during your era as a Brewer, with herculean Zander Mrlik at the top of the list, joined by netminder Ryan Grimme, free kick artist Juliano Pereira, and distributor (and current Vassar assistant) Ross Macklin.  The Mrlik 2.0 (or actually 3.0, counting former Brewer basketball/baseball player Johnny) era is a bit different stylistically than the Mrlik 1.0 era, but is having a similar level of success on the pitch.

stlawus

Quote from: vassarfan on October 09, 2017, 11:55:47 AM
Hey guys I played at Vassar a few years back and just started following the league again last year. I just wanted to thank you all for your posts. Its great to get insight from people watching the games as I miss most of them and unfortunately the school write-ups don't really tell the full story.

Don't mean to add fuel to the fire, but in the case of Jansen, I don't think he was overrated at all. I battled against him for four years and thought he was a tough and skilled player that carried his team for most of his career. His individual accolades can be debated but I always thought his impact on the pitch spoke for itself. 

Quick question for the St. Lawrence bloggers. I played 09-12 and thought St. Lawrence had by far the most talented team in the league. Has the talent level dipped a bit on your squad since past years or was it just exceptionally good during those years? For reference, some of the guys on those teams were Brendan Gorman, Demello and Laird. I always thought Gorman was by far the best player in the league and it was really too bad he got hurt because that team would have been special.

Anyways thanks again for your posts. Really enjoy reading them and keeping up with the league

The 2011 and 2013 teams I think had the largest quantity of individual talent since the championship squad in '99.  The Durocher teams always had talented players but there were a lot of diamonds in the rough that Durocher recruited who fit the system perfectly.  Other guys have said this team haven't taken a dip in talent, and while I greatly respect their opinions I'm going to have to disagree as far as this year goes.  There are a few extremely talented players like Dede and Brandell, but collectively I think the talent level is a tad down this year.  Toshack is still finding his sea legs with the team so I expect the team to return to previous talent levels.  Right now there are just too many individual mistakes and lapses in concentration.   The issue with SLU soccer is that almost every year the best players get injured at the end of the season. 

deutschfan

Omma's listing of some of Vassar's standouts and Saint's prediction during his playing days that Vassar would improve reminded me that one of the main reasons for Vassar's rise over the past decade is the staff's ability to recruit outside the Northeast Region, and in particular to recruit from California.  From Brian Bianchetti, Vassar's first POY, to Zander Mrlik Vassar's first DPOY and All American, to Tom Wiechert Vassar's first unanimous First Teamer, to Mattie Mrlik Vassar's first Rookie POY, to Alex Gonzalez last year's LL Tourney Finals hero, all were California raised.  Nano Pereira, who was one of the best mid-fielders in the league during his four years, should have received more recognition but unfortunately was in DeMello's shadow. 4 of the starters on the 2012 and 2016 teams were Californians.  SLU has grabbed a few California players that made an impact including the Buntons but nothing like Vassar's California crew.  While Skidmore wins the prize for ability to attract talented international players, none of those players have enjoyed a LL Championship or NCAA berth.   

SandyMac

Quote from: deutschfan on October 10, 2017, 12:22:52 PM
Omma's listing of some of Vassar's standouts and Saint's prediction during his playing days that Vassar would improve reminded me that one of the main reasons for Vassar's rise over the past decade is the staff's ability to recruit outside the Northeast Region, and in particular to recruit from California.  From Brian Bianchetti, Vassar's first POY, to Zander Mrlik Vassar's first DPOY and All American, to Tom Wiechert Vassar's first unanimous First Teamer, to Mattie Mrlik Vassar's first Rookie POY, to Alex Gonzalez last year's LL Tourney Finals hero, all were California raised.  Nano Pereira, who was one of the best mid-fielders in the league during his four years, should have received more recognition but unfortunately was in DeMello's shadow. 4 of the starters on the 2012 and 2016 teams were Californians.  SLU has grabbed a few California players that made an impact including the Buntons but nothing like Vassar's California crew.  While Skidmore wins the prize for ability to attract talented international players, none of those players have enjoyed a LL Championship or NCAA berth.   

Pereira was a maestro. That whole midfield 3 was fantastic together.

Mr.Right

This is the BIG weekend in the LL starting tomorrow and Saturday....waiting for deutschfan's and Saint of Old's predictions but since I have seen RPI, Skidmore, SLU and Hobart at least 2 times I might give it a go later today.

deutschfan

I am honored that Mr. Right invited my picks rspecially as they were so wrong last time. Invitation accepted. Biggest game of weekend SLU v Vassar. Vassar is the better team but will lose 2-1 because they will be severely tested on Friday by Clarkson while SLU was having shooting drills against Bard. Predictions: Friday-- Vassar 2-Clarkson 1; SLU 3-Bard 0; Skidmore 1-Ithaca 0; Hobart 1-Union 1; and RPI 1-RIT 1. Saturday--SLU 2-Vassar 1; Clarkson 2-Bard 1; Union 1-Ithaca 1; Skidmore 1-RIT 1; Hobart 1-RPI 0.

Mr.Right

Quote from: deutschfan on October 12, 2017, 11:51:39 AM
I am honored that Mr. Right invited my picks rspecially as they were so wrong last time. Invitation accepted. Biggest game of weekend SLU v Vassar. Vassar is the better team but will lose 2-1 because they will be severely tested on Friday by Clarkson while SLU was having shooting drills against Bard. Predictions: Friday-- Vassar 2-Clarkson 1; SLU 3-Bard 0; Skidmore 1-Ithaca 0; Hobart 1-Union 1; and RPI 1-RIT 1. Saturday--SLU 2-Vassar 1; Clarkson 2-Bard 1; Union 1-Ithaca 1; Skidmore 1-RIT 1; Hobart 1-RPI 0.


Ok...deutschfan must be a little busy today. I will make some pics and try to give a sentence or 2 explanation of why I am picking. Since I have only seen half the teams I will try my best and only pick Friday's games. The Liberty League teams I have seen this year give me the impression that like Nescac the league is down a bit. That does not mean the Champion could not make a run in the NCAA's as the champion will get a somewhat decent draw most likely on the road. No LL team has a good enough record to host in the NCAA's IMO. Unless Skidmore runs the table and wins a couple tournament games which by the way is possible looking at their schedule to finish the season. They do have a very tough match up at SLU next weekend that could decide the #1 seed.

Friday:

Clarkson at Vassar---I would guess history would tell me this has been a one sided affair tilting towards Vassar. Former Vassar assistant is doing a fine job rebuilding Clarkson. He was an interesting hire for Clarkson as he had no Head Coaching experience and was quite young. He is British I believe so the accent might have helped in the interview as did his experience in the LL. Anyway he has done a fine job and I watched Clarkson last year against someone and they were not just whacking the ball as they were trying to play a bit. Clarkson sit tied with RIT for that last playoff spot and #6 seed. I forget if the LL does positioning off of points like Nescac or winning %..A draw for Clarkson in this game should be the goal. Vassar is fighting for 1 of those coveted 2 Top spots to earn the bye and get directly into the LL Semi-Finals. They have the points and more importantly the games in hand. This is a huge weekend for them as if they sweep Clarkson and SLU on Saturday they should be able to punch their ticket to the Semi's...Vassar 2-1

SLU at Bard----No clue how good or bad Bard is. Looking at their results they have been in most games losing a ton of 1 goal games. I am guessing in the LL they have been out shot by a wide margin. The last 2 years it has taken OT for SLU to win both games v Bard. Bard also has a very young gun coach after the sudden passing of Andy McCabe who did all of Saward's recruiting at Middlebury. Brandon Jackson played at Middlebury when they won the 2007 NCAA Championship. He was a solid player if I remember correctly and was a hard worker. Excellent to see a young American coach get this job. It must be VERY tough to recruit to Bard so he has his hands full...I do not think it takes OT this year. SLU 3-1

RIT at RPI----RPI is 7-3-1 and their 3 losses were all by 1 goal to SLU, Oneonta and Williams. They will hang around in games and try to steal them on the counter against better teams. I was not overly impressed with this years squad as going forward they really struggle. Adam Clinton always has them working hard and playing scrappy. What has happened to RIT? Maybe about 7-10 years ago their slide started. They used to be a very tough team to play and would get some talent in the soccer rich area of Rochester. They always played teams tough and would get results and I beieve went to the NCAA's a couple times at the turn of the century. I have not seen them play in years but maybe someone could explain to me the downfall?  Both teams have a ton to play for as neither team is comfortable in the standings yet. 1-1

Hobart at Union----I have said my piece about Shawn Griffin and Hobart a couple weeks ago on this thread BUT they have not lost a game since opening weekend when they got swept at their own 2 game opening weekend tournament. The problem is they only have 4 wins. They are 4-2-4 and have maybe the toughest remaining schedule in the conference. Them and SLU easily have the 2 toughest SOS in the league. Hobart should be much more physical than Union but Union does have a couple skilled players. I cannot imagine Guinn sitting in against Hobart like he did at SLU although he was rewarded with a draw, their only point in the league. Union has to start winning league games or they will be eliminated from the playoffs. They do have an easier schedule to finish the season so maybe Guinn plays for another draw and tries to beat Bard, Clarkson, RIT and Ithaca. Hobart 2-0

Ithaca at Skidmore---Skidmore has a ton to play for. If they were to win out they could get a Pool C as I believe they will be regionally ranked maybe #6 or #7 in the first rankings. More importantly they are playing for one of those Top 2 seeds and the Bye into the Semi's. I have not seen Ithaca play but Head Coach Kyle Dezotell, another Midd graduate and pretty good player was Head Coach at Norwich University for years. I assumed he would have been next in line to take over for Saward at Midd but apparently NOT. They have a ton of losses and then this 5-0 trashing of Bard...Is that a 1 off? or are Ithaca improving as the season moves along. I think Skidmore takes them lightly and they get upset...Ithaca 1-0

Saint of Old

Clarkson at Vassar-
3-0 Vassar.
Biggest problem for Coach Taylor was having Jennings know he could beat him early in his Clarkson career. Wont happen again.

SLU at Bard-
2-1 SLU
Will be a tight game unless SLU scores early.

RIT at RPI- (Battle of the Alphabets)
2-0 RIT
This is where I pick my upset, RPI needs these three points real bad, but so does RIT.

Hobart at Union

0-0
Hobart has trouble scoring and Union will be tough at home.

Ithaca at Skidmore-
1-0 Skidmore

I would pick Ithaca at home, but they are a different team on the road.

We are all soccer Soothsayers...
Teams must beware of Friday the 13th.

Mr.Right


Part_Bart

Quote from: Saint of Old on October 12, 2017, 08:42:15 PM
Clarkson at Vassar-
3-0 Vassar.
Biggest problem for Coach Taylor was having Jennings know he could beat him early in his Clarkson career. Wont happen again.

SLU at Bard-
2-1 SLU
Will be a tight game unless SLU scores early.

RIT at RPI- (Battle of the Alphabets)
2-0 RIT
This is where I pick my upset, RPI needs these three points real bad, but so does RIT.

Hobart at Union

0-0
Hobart has trouble scoring and Union will be tough at home.

Ithaca at Skidmore-
1-0 Skidmore

I would pick Ithaca at home, but they are a different team on the road.

We are all soccer Soothsayers...
Teams must beware of Friday the 13th.

I don't see RIT scoring at RPI, and wonder if RPI can score v. RIT.
Am thinking RPI talent difference and ball pressure leads to 1:0 for the home team.

On Hobart, with my head, I'm with Saint of Old -- 0:0.
With my heart, I'm with Mr. Right -- 2:0.
With my use of data, I'm thinking Union wins -- 1:0.
Over the past three seasons, Union and Hobart have scored 1 goal each (in different years) against each other.
This year Hobart has taken 174 shots  to get 11 goals.  Opponents have taken 94 shots to get 8 goals.
If I am the Union coach, I am not so worried about the lethality of Hobart's attack and would be willing to push more people forward.
Hobart gives up most of its goals against on counters (they have swapped out wing defenders and their goalies almost every other game, and sometimes at half time during games, when this happens).  In 2013, Union beat Hobart 5:0 -- all off strong counter attacks (it was not fun to watch, though the joy of Union's players and fans was ... almost ... contagious).