WBB: NESCAC

Started by Senator Frost, March 12, 2005, 09:18:11 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 3 Guests are viewing this topic.

Maine 1

Bowdoin played a great game today.  Once Amherst got behind early, I thought they got out of their disciplined offense and started jacking up quick threes, and Bowdoin just came down and ran a very effective half court offense.  Was really surprised at how ineffective Robertson was, and when Amherst took her out, Brady went wild.  Probably the best game Bowdoin has played all season.  Tufts did not play well against Williams, and I think the Foley injury really hurts them. If Bowdoin plays the way they played today, they beat Tufts.  In any event, both Tufts and Bowdoin should be hosting first round NCAA games.

CasualFan2

I agree that Bowdoin probably played best game today.  That having been said it was clear the second half of the year, despite the apparent depth, Amherst is not what they have been.  Still very good, but not what they were in the past.  Sounds crazy, buy maybe too much depth.   The great teams of 3,4,5 and 6 years ago had studs, but not always a lot of depth.  The present team has a lot of good players, but no true stud.  Some may say that Robertson is/was, but in reality she is one of those unfortunate college kids who had a bad injury and robbed her of two of her four seasons.   She was never the same.  Amherst gets in, probably, but I doubt they advance too far.  When was the last time they played an NCAA game on the road?  It is a big difference for all teams, but especially for Amherst.  When was the last big game they won on the road?

Too bad for Tufts they lost Foley.  Does anyone know how bad the injury is?  I agree they will lose to Bowdoin if she is out.

Interesting day, to see a bit of a changing of the guard. (just a bit).

Maine 1

Not sure I would call this a changing of the guard. I believe that the only teams to win the NESCAC are Bowdoin, Amherst and Tufts.  Bowdoin obviously ruled the league for many years, and appears to again be a force.  They were clearly better than Amherst in the regular season game, and even more dominant yesterday (perhaps the D3 pollsters will actually rank them ahead of Amherst this week).  I do agree that Amherst is clearly not as good as they have been.  They have talent, but as I said in my earlier post, when things go wrong, they seem to panic on the floor a bit. But don't be surprised to see them win a couple of games in the tournament--they are still better than the majority of other teams in the area.

I think today's game will be very competitive.  Tufts won in a blow out earlier this year (at Tufts)--Tufts was up 20 with 3 minutes left.  I expect a different game today

polbear73

Quote from: Maine1 on March 01, 2015, 07:42:48 AM
Not sure I would call this a changing of the guard. I believe that the only teams to win the NESCAC are Bowdoin, Amherst and Tufts.  Bowdoin obviously ruled the league for many years, and appears to again be a force.  They were clearly better than Amherst in the regular season game, and even more dominant yesterday (perhaps the D3 pollsters will actually rank them ahead of Amherst this week).  I do agree that Amherst is clearly not as good as they have been.  They have talent, but as I said in my earlier post, when things go wrong, they seem to panic on the floor a bit. But don't be surprised to see them win a couple of games in the tournament--they are still better than the majority of other teams in the area.

I think today's game will be very competitive.  Tufts won in a blow out earlier this year (at Tufts)--Tufts was up 20 with 3 minutes left.  I expect a different game today
I have to agree with Maine1 on the changing of the guard idea. Even when they stopped dominating, Bowdoin never went away, just as Amherst and Tufts won't through coaching changes and restocking periods. These are three quality programs who have shown the ability to sustain excellence, even if the order changes periodically. Regardless of today's outcome, I would expect these three teams to make their presence felt in the NCAAs.

nescacbbrules

From my perspective, Amherst and Tufts leaped into prominence when Gromacki and Berube were hired. Prior to those hires, Bowdoin was NESCAC's dominant voice and Williams and Bates as the backup singers. Manning, who enjoyed great success before the modern advent of NESCAC women's conference, has kept Williams in that role, but the continued success of the Bowdoin program since Pemper's departure is a testament to Shibles, although not particularly surprising since she had experienced great success at Swarthmore previously. It will be a challenge for the other NESCAC programs to approach the success that these three teams have maintained over time. Shibles' teams at Bowdoin are 149-46 (winning % of 76), Berube's Tufts teams are 267-79 (77%), and the gaudy Gromacki Amherst teams are 230-21 (91%) currently. By way of comparison, Mannings' record is outstanding over her 25 year career, 446-191, a 70% winning record, and Jim Murphy is a laudable 343-187 (64%) at Bates. The stability and consistent excellence of these programs is one of the elements that makes NESCAC women's basketball so dominant in the region and successful nationally. 

From all appearances, Hannah Foley did tear her ACL yesterday. She was playing at a high level at both ends of the floor, not relying solely on the 3-pointer. Fortunately, the Jumbos pulled together in the second half, and with the help of Kelsey Morehead's leadership and return to more minutes, found a way to win. Strong teams do that. Case in point, Bowdoin, who lost a leader in Megan Phelps but still found a way to beat Amherst on a neutral floor. Each team is tough and resilient. Congratulations to both. Heading to Cousens now to enjoy a great game.

polbear73

Very well said and a thoughtful post. Thank you.

nescacbbrules

Thanks. Josie Lee and Emma Roberson: awesome! Team defense so solid. North and Kanner such tough matchups. Strong win against a very game Bowdoin team. Well done Jumbos.

Hoopsinfo

Bowdoin played well yesterday - congrats.  Should be a good final today.  Not clear to me why Amherst shied away from good interior defense and relied on the 3 (26 shots).  Bowdoin was scoring at will from the inside and basically, Robertson and Giddens sat on the bench the majority of the game.  Both have demonstrated throughout the season that they can score, rebound and defend on the inside.  Better defense would have slowed Bowdoin down and by attacking the inside more on offense would have opened up more 3 point shots (Amherst shot 50% from 2 and 27% from 3.  This team does have stars, just need to play them and play them in the right positions.  Why not have Prichard start at point guard with Remer out?  This would allow all players to play at the positions best suited to them.  Food for thought going into the NCAAs.  Tufts, Bowdoin and Amherst all have plenty of talent to go far in the NCAAs.  Amherst has depth on their side too.  Play the players in the positions that best suit them and go with strength - don't give up the interior defense and scoring so that the team is heaving desperation 3s.  Looking forward to today's championship game.

Maine 1

Strong game from Tufts today.  A very good win against a good Bowdoin team.  Bowdoin could not hit the open threes in the first half, which is what let Tufts pull away.  Great game from Josie Lee.  Not sure how Bowdoin or Colby let her get away from Maine.  (The thing that made Colby so good a when McBride was there is that she was able to get more than her share of the top players from Maine).  Tufts has a lot of weapons, and with Morehead playing, and contributions from a number of players, they can make a nice run in the tournament and should be home as long as they are playing.

nescachoopsfan2

Tufts gave up 21 offensive rebounds and turned the ball over 18 times. Kanner shot 4-of-12. Foley was in street clothes...

...and they won. Convincingly.

Outstanding team win for the Jumbos. The defense did a great job limiting Binkhorst to 4 points for the game and Brady to 5 points in the second half. Josie Lee stepped into Foley's spot in the starting lineup and played 35 impactful minutes - 12 points, 6 rebounds, 5 assists, and 3 steals. Emma Roberson played the best game of her career - 16 points on 7 shots. Congratulations to Tufts and Coach Berube. As a neutral observer, they've been fun to watch in recent years.

bowdoin74

Either Binkhorst, Brady, or Phelps has been the high scorer for each of Bowdoin's 27 games this year.  A third offensive presence was missed.

Congratulations to Tufts.  Well played on both sides of the ball.     

CasualFan2

When I wrote last night, I said "slight" changing of the guard.  I mainly meant Amherst came back to the pack a bit.  A couple of years ago, for a good five years no one, even in the NESCAC, was really going to touch them.  So you had several real good teams and one untouchable one. 

I agree that the coaching changes at Tufts and Amherst began their success.  I do think Tufts will have a hard time without their star player though after round 1 or 2.

So do we see Amherst, Tufts and Bowdoin all host?

Maine 1

I am not sure I would say that Amherst was "untouchable".  They were certainly very good, and are still very good. Tufts, Bowdoin, and in the 2009-2011 period Colby, all gave Amherst tough games.
Certainly good to see better balance in the league.  Coaching makes a huge difference at this level. We have said many times on this board that Gromacki is outstanding, and Berube is very good also.
I would be surprised if Amherst hosts, but it could happen.  Tufts and Bowdoin should definitely host this weekend.

CasualFan2

I do not want to make it a debate because it is probably semantics.  But from 2009-2010 to 2012-2013 seasons I would argue they were untouchable, well above the rest of their league, that has so many good programs.

2009-2010  (32-1)  only loss in final four
2010-2011  (32-1)  National champs, one in season loss OOC to Kean
2011-2012  (31-2)  only two losses in final four
2013-2013  (30-3)  finally a loss reg season to Williams team that went to final four, and two final four losses

So,  that is total domination of the league.  They are not there any more.  That really is my point.  They are mortal again.  The were not during that stretch. 

Maine 1

Not to debate--but I would call UCONN and the way they win their league games by an average of something like 45 points a game as untouchable.  Although Amherst clearly was the top team in the league during that period, they had many competitive and close games--so I definitely agree they were the dominant team in the league, but in any of those years there were games that they could have lost.