FB: Old Dominion Athletic Conference

Started by admin, August 16, 2005, 05:13:40 AM

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tigerfanalso

Nash & Holton are both very good at what they do. I prefer not to discuss if they are the best all time at HSC. Under Marty's leadership there have been so many great players at these two positions. Everybody has an opinion as to who they feel is the best QB/WR in the history of the school but I will not go there. Both Nash & Holton will receive numerous post season awards and are certainly future HOF picks, just like many from the past. Sit back and enjoy these two guys because they only have four games left and if things go well, maybe their play will be extended into the post season.   

narch

#17731
Quote from: Michael Herbert on October 21, 2014, 08:52:52 AM
You're right, superfan.  Nash is probably the best QB in D3
pump the brakes, boys and girls...through 6 games, statistically, he's not even the best in his conference (pawlowski is), and i'm not sure he's the best in the region and he certainly isn't putting up the numbers that top qb's nationally do

conference comparison
pawlowski leads nance in every major passing category
efficiency (184.8 to 173.8)
completion % (68.6 to 66.8)
passing yards (2031 to 1793)
passing yards per attempt (9.8 to 9.4)
passing touchdowns (23 to 19)
yards per play (8.5 vs. 7.5)
td rate (11.1% of attempts to 10% of attempts)
int rate (1.4% of attempts to 2.6% of attempts)

regional comparison
i think an argument could be made that max reber is every bit as good as nance, even though reber is having a slightly worse year this year than last...but i'm biased

reber is just 2 yards behind nance (1788 vs. 1790), has thrown more td's (20 vs. 19), has just 5 fewer rushing yards and a higher per carry average (172 vs. 177) and has just one more turnover (7 vs. 6) - nance gets the ball around the goal line much more, as mu has a couple of really strong backs that get goal-line work, so nance has more rushing td's

of course, pawlowski should be in the regional comparison, as well, and craig from lagrange and bailey from huntingdon are putting up really nice numbers this season

national comparison
it's not even close...

damaschke from concordia, wisconson is putting up 416 yards per game of total offense through 6 games (vs. 328.3 for nance) while completing a similar percentage and accounting for a similar number of td's

swenson from rose hulman is putting up 394.3 yards per game and has 25 total td's and 9 to's while completing 66% off his throws

hendricks from gustavus adolphus is putting up 393.6 yards per game, has 31 total td's and 5 ints (couldn't find any fumbles) while completing 74.1% of his throws (74.1% is not a typo)

wilmer from del valley is putting up 349+ yds/game and 9.9 yds/play with 24 total td's vs. 3 int's (couldn't find fumbles)

callahan from wesley is putting up 316 yds/ game and 9.0 yds/play with 28 total td's vs. 4 to's and completing 69.1% of passes

burke from mount union (my vote for best qb in the country) is putting up 330.3 yards per game, completing 69.1% of his passes and has scored 25 total td's vs. 3 turnovers...all in about 70 plays fewer than most of the guys listed above - he's averaging an INSANE 10.4 yds/play

while nash nance is an incredibly talented player and clearly one of the best qb's in the odac, region and country, i think it's a stretch to call him "probably the best QB in D3" - i do think he's in the top 12 to 15 or so, though...which means he's pretty darn good

HSCTiger fan

Top 12 to 15?  Really?  You honestly think there are 11 to 14 QBs playing right now better than Nash Nance? You are entitled to your opinion but so are the guys at D3football who have named him All-American last fall and again this preseason.

As far as conference games are concerned Nance is crushing every QB statistically. He's leading the ODAC in per game passing yards 367, passing efficiency 207.4, completion % 66.7, TD passes 10, 0 interceptions, total offense 420, and most importantly wins 3.  I might add that he's done about 80% of that in the first 3 quarters of all three ODAC games.  The 4th quarter has been either mostly played with a back-up (CUA) or running the ball more to control the clock (WL and EH). 

I watched Reber play the CNU game. He was simply amazing. But there's not much Methodist did with Reber that I saw that Nance could not do. On the flip side, Reber as with most D3 QBs could not throw the passes that HSC asks Nance to throw.

It's a debatable argument that neither of us will ever agree on.
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jknezek

I will be interested to see if Nance comes up in the Gagliardi talk, or where he falls in All-America status at the end of the season. While the Gagliardi isn't exactly purely performance based, if you are the best QB in the country, or close to it, you are going to be seriously considered. Same thing with the All-America teams.

We can only play the teams in front of us, and the ODAC just doesn't have that top tier rep. So Nance's big chance to make a national splash came week 1. 24-37, 247 yards, 2 tds, 2 ints, -40 yards rushing (yeah, the sacks were UGLY) was pretty good, but it just isn't going to make anyone's jaw drop. On the other hand, it's the best anyone has done, BY FAR, against Wabash so far this season. Week 2 would also be a good OOC test, and 23-31, 204 yards, 4 tds, 1 int, 60 yards rushing looks efficient but also not jaw dropping. Also 3 teams already this season dropped more points on CNU than HSC did. Not all of that is Nance's responsibility of course.

Bottom line? Nance is good. I think he's best in the conference followed by Pawlowski, whose numbers are aided by a significantly softer OOC schedule than the Tigers. But I wouldn't crown him the best in D3. He might be the best in the South, but even there I see some significant competition. I expect him to make an All America team. I very much doubt it will be first team national All American.

Pat Coleman

I think it's important to use total offense rather than passing yards when looking at a quarterback's numbers.
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jknezek

Quote from: Pat Coleman on October 21, 2014, 03:49:54 PM
I think it's important to use total offense rather than passing yards when looking at a quarterback's numbers.

Maybe, but I'm not a big fan. I prefer to look at passing and rushing yards by the QB. I understand the argument for total offense, but I've never really thought of it as the primary stat for comparing QBs. For comparing offenses? Absolutely, but QBs are trickier as is any single player stats in a team game.

If I was really being picky I'd say when comparing QBs I prefer yards per attempt for both passing and rushing. And when I occasionally play fantasy football I look for passing stats like yards before first contact and, although rarely useful at the pro level, rushing stats like yards after first contact for a QB. But that is really getting feisty and rarely available at the D3 level.

Lots of ways to dice the numbers. Any way I've looked at them, Nance comes out looking very, very good. But not significantly better than the other top echelon D3 QBs. Of course being in that top echelon is ridiculously good to begin with.

hoopstermom

#17736
Quote from: hasanova on October 21, 2014, 09:50:30 AM
I see Saturday, Oct. 25, is Homecoming at RMC for the Guilford game.  I've been on the campus twice before and know where Day Field is, but I've never been to a Randolph-Macon football game.  Any advice from Macon fans on the best (any) places to park?  Thanks.

PS  I've been to Guilford's first six games ... and hope to make it to all ten this season.

I expect there will be parking on the grass across from the softball field (#75 on the map link below) - up W. Patrick Street.  The lots closest to the football field (#63) are reserved, Lot J is for tailgating, and Lot F is for handicapped.  You can try your luck parallel parking along Henry or N. Center Street or any of the streets or smaller lots but they fill up quickly.  You could also probably park at the elementary school which is a little ways North up Henry Street (past Smith Street). 

http://www.rmc.edu/images/default-source/admissions-images/rmc_2d_graphic_only.jpg?sfvrsn=6

hasanova

#17737
Thank you, narch, for looking up the actual numbers.  +1  You are the best non-QB poster in d3 who actually looks up the stats.

I do concede opening with Greensboro at home in 2014 is not the same as opening at Wabash, but MU and CNU appear to fairly evenly matched as evidenced by their classic OT game.   And CCA ... I'm confident several QB/WR tandems could score big stats against the Bears.

With all this said, the proof is on the field head-to-head ... and the sad truth is HSC has beaten my alma mater 14 years in a row.  HSC is the better team until someone else proves they can match up and play. 

hasanova

Quote from: hoopstermom on October 21, 2014, 04:27:06 PM
Quote from: hasanova on October 21, 2014, 09:50:30 AM
I see Saturday, Oct. 25, is Homecoming at RMC for the Guilford game.  I've been on the campus twice before and know where Day Field is, but I've never been to a Randolph-Macon football game.  Any advice from Macon fans on the best (any) places to park?  Thanks.

PS  I've been to Guilford's first six games ... and hope to make it to all ten this season.

I expect there will be parking on the grass across from the softball field (#75 on the map link below) - up W. Patrick Street.  The lots closest to the football field (#63) are reserved, Lot J is for tailgating, and Lot F is for handicapped.  You can try you luck parallel parking along Henry or N. Center Street or any of the streets or smaller lots but they fill up quickly.  You could also probably park at the elementary school which is a little ways North up Henry Street (past Smith Street). 

http://www.rmc.edu/images/default-source/admissions-images/rmc_2d_graphic_only.jpg?sfvrsn=6
Thank you, hoopstermom.  I appreciate the advice.  If you are at the game Saturday, walk by the Guilford stands and yell "nova".  lol

odacsuperfan

Sorry narch didn't mean to hurt your feelings about your QB. I never meant to slight Reber I just stated my opinion.  I'm sure all the coaches in the ODAC know how good Nance makes HSC . You seem to be consumed with stats and that is a good indicator but too many variables are in stats only to say whose better. A lot of the D3 offenses post crazy offensive stats but Favret seems to be protective of Nance until the Conference heats up.   I've seen a lot of D3 QB's and personally I think Nance is a notch above. You rarely see  his size , strength , speed , arm strength and most importantly Wins in a D3 QB. Certainly no disrespect to Reber.  IMO if Nance were playing for Mt Union Burke would be his backup. But , ...... we will never know.

jknezek

Quote from: odacsuperfan on October 21, 2014, 09:23:08 PMIMO if Nance were playing for Mt Union Burke would be his backup. But , ...... we will never know.

Bold. Very bold. Considering Burke was the First Team AA last year and preseason first team AA and he is killing the OAC and living up to the hype this year, that is a bold, bold statement.

hscathletics

Quote from: Michael Herbert on October 21, 2014, 08:52:52 AM
You're right, superfan.  Nash is probably the best QB in D3 and one of the best in ODAC history but I don't think things are going to get any easier once he graduates.  There will still be a deep receiving crew as well as a pretty solid QB in either Edgar Moore or Kyle Farlow.  Everyone knows Marty loves his QBs.  In all of his opportunities, Moore has done what he needed to do.  Of course we don't want to see Nash graduate, but when he does, we'll be ok...not at the same level, but we'll be ok.
Edgar Moore is going to be a good one, and Cam Johnson has a good chance of being the next great WR at H-SC.

narch

Quote from: odacsuperfan on October 21, 2014, 09:23:08 PM
Sorry narch didn't mean to hurt your feelings about your QB. I never meant to slight Reber I just stated my opinion.  I'm sure all the coaches in the ODAC know how good Nance makes HSC . You seem to be consumed with stats and that is a good indicator but too many variables are in stats only to say whose better. A lot of the D3 offenses post crazy offensive stats but Favret seems to be protective of Nance until the Conference heats up.   I've seen a lot of D3 QB's and personally I think Nance is a notch above. You rarely see  his size , strength , speed , arm strength and most importantly Wins in a D3 QB. Certainly no disrespect to Reber.  IMO if Nance were playing for Mt Union Burke would be his backup. But , ...... we will never know.
i didn't take it as a slight to reber...i just took it as an uninformed fan blinded by his allegiance and woefully unaware of the larger national picture (i say this with my tongue mostly planted in cheek...mostly) - i brought reber into the conversation for 2 reasons - 1, i wanted to show how close the two were statistically this year after a 2013 season in which reber was statistically better...the line between the two is very thin and 2, i felt like pumping up my guy :)

nash nance is very, very good, but there is little doubt in my mind that he is not the best d3 qb in the country and the numbers (stats) tell the story - if nance is truly that much more gifted athletically than the rest of the top-notch d3 qb's - "You rarely see  his size , strength , speed , arm strength...in a D3 QB" -  i would expect his numbers to reflect this - rushing touchdowns aside, his numbers simply aren't off the charts

understand, i have always felt like nash nance is a top-tier d3 quarterback (despite what the hsc fans might think), so this isn't meant as a slight...calling a guy a top 12  to 15 qb in all of d3 is a HUGE compliment...but he isn't the best

Pat Coleman

Quote from: jknezek on October 21, 2014, 10:13:40 PM
Quote from: odacsuperfan on October 21, 2014, 09:23:08 PMIMO if Nance were playing for Mt Union Burke would be his backup. But , ...... we will never know.

Bold. Very bold. Considering Burke was the First Team AA last year and preseason first team AA and he is killing the OAC and living up to the hype this year, that is a bold, bold statement.

No way in hell. Uh-uh.
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Quote from: old 40 on September 25, 2007, 08:23:57 PMLet's discuss (sports) in a positive way, sometimes kidding each other with no disrespect.

bashgiant

Quote from: odacsuperfan on October 21, 2014, 09:23:08 PM
Sorry narch didn't mean to hurt your feelings about your QB. I never meant to slight Reber I just stated my opinion.  I'm sure all the coaches in the ODAC know how good Nance makes HSC . You seem to be consumed with stats and that is a good indicator but too many variables are in stats only to say whose better. A lot of the D3 offenses post crazy offensive stats but Favret seems to be protective of Nance until the Conference heats up.   I've seen a lot of D3 QB's and personally I think Nance is a notch above. You rarely see  his size , strength , speed , arm strength and most importantly Wins in a D3 QB. Certainly no disrespect to Reber. IMO if Nance were playing for Mt Union Burke would be his backup. But , ...... we will never know.
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