FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

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AndOne

Quote from: matblake on September 26, 2016, 04:43:30 PM
Just re-watched Coach Swider's post-game comments.  Favorite part, "Don't let anyone steal your joy."  Winning a football game is a fun thing, no matter how it happens.  I haven't played competitively in 25 years, but those kids are lucky getting to do what they love.  It was good to watch again now that a little time has passed since the game. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=97C_mDPw438
Quote from: AndOne on September 25, 2016, 07:57:53 PM
I agree with Coach Swider. A win is a win, "bad" or not.
A coach who "only" posts "bad" win after "bad" win year after year is going to be looked at as one VERY good and successful coach.  ;D

As I said, if all you do is win, no apologies are really necessary whether you classify those wins as good or "bad." Also, a coach who is able to pile up all those wins is one that a lot of schools would love to have.

Gregory Sager

Quote from: CardinalAlum on September 26, 2016, 09:38:32 PM
What's the NP people's view on the struggles this year vs last?

NPU continues to be very young. These seniors represent (at least in name) the first of Mike Conway's recruiting classes, and, remember, he took over in January of that year. He was coming from three states away, really didn't have the local connections, and had to start over by selling a program that hadn't won a league game in almost thirteen full seasons. Small wonder that his first recruiting class was so barren. There are eight seniors on this team, and only three of them (including his son) have been around from the beginning as freshmen in the fall of 2013. A grand total of three of those eight seniors (QB T.D. Conway, WR Norm Cupiccioti, and CB Franz Dorcely) are starters this year.

Preseason injuries really hurt the Vikings this year. Losing WR Devin Childress, one of the best weapons in the league, has been catastrophic. Losing DT Allen Lagaaia has really hurt the defense as well. Fortunately, two of the preseason casualties, DB Uati Pati and DE John Kellum, came back this past weekend; Kellum saw limited action, while Pati, who was supposed to be eased in, was forced to play more snaps than the coaches wanted because another DB got ejected from the game for an unsportsmanlike conduct call.

These injuries matter more than they matter to most teams, because NPU really hasn't built up the depth it needs to compete yet. I've always said that one of the two measuring sticks of a competitive CCIW team is a two-deep that consists of nothing but CCIW-starter-level players. NPU doesn't have that yet. The talent is there, or it's getting close, but the experience is lacking. (The other measuring stick is at least a half-dozen players who are All-CCIW quality.)

The offense has been just awful the past two weeks. Some of it is an inexperienced receiver corps; the number of dropped passes and WRs running the wrong routes continues to be dismaying. But T.D. Conway really has been seriously off of his game the past two weeks as well. He improved somewhat against IWU over what he did against Elmhurst, but, frankly, that was no accomplishment at all, since nobody could possibly play worse than he did against the 'jays. He's just not hitting his targets the way that he has in the past, even when the NPU wideouts were all living in Drop City.

The running game has been OK, and the very young offensive line has done better than I expected. But it's a spread offense; the primary task of a spread offense is to throw the ball effectively. NPU has fallen lamentably short of that over the past three weeks, the past two weeks in particular. And, in the end, inexperience is no excuse.

Special teams were decent until this past Saturday, and this past Saturday they were just plain awful. The defense hasn't played well, but, again, it wasn't as horrible against IWU as it was against Elmhurst. IWU simply had a player in Maurice Shoemaker-Gilmore whom the Vikings just couldn't seem to stop. Then again, the most disappointing aspect of the past two weeks is something that I pointed out here in my post-mortem on Saturday afternoon, and that's the fact that the Vikings proved to be the cure for two offenses (Elmhurst and Illinois Wesleyan) that were totally stagnant until they faced the Vikings. I could accept the 42 points given up to Midland, which is undefeated and nationally ranked in NAIA and is a legitimate offensive juggernaut at 39 ppg. EC and IWU were different matters entirely.

It's a bad stretch right now for NPU. The Vikings will simply have to push through it, and I'm hoping that a struggling Millikin team will prove to be the cure for them that they in turn had proven to be for EC and IWU.

In terms of the broader sweep of the program, I'm still 100% on board with what Mike Conway is doing. This is part of the growing pains of getting from Point A to Point B and then on to Point C. The Vikings are going to have to get to the point where they're putting dozens of seniors and juniors on the field, just like everybody else -- and until then, they're going to lose more often than they win. I'd just like to see them be a little more competitive and not fall apart so badly when things don't go their way.
"To see what is in front of one's nose is a constant struggle." -- George Orwell

CardinalAlum

Quote from: Gregory Sager on September 26, 2016, 11:58:50 PM
Quote from: CardinalAlum on September 26, 2016, 09:38:32 PM
What's the NP people's view on the struggles this year vs last?

NPU continues to be very young. These seniors represent (at least in name) the first of Mike Conway's recruiting classes, and, remember, he took over in January of that year. He was coming from three states away, really didn't have the local connections, and had to start over by selling a program that hadn't won a league game in almost thirteen full seasons. Small wonder that his first recruiting class was so barren. There are eight seniors on this team, and only three of them (including his son) have been around from the beginning as freshmen in the fall of 2013. A grand total of three of those eight seniors (QB T.D. Conway, WR Norm Cupiccioti, and CB Franz Dorcely) are starters this year.

Preseason injuries really hurt the Vikings this year. Losing WR Devin Childress, one of the best weapons in the league, has been catastrophic. Losing DT Allen Lagaaia has really hurt the defense as well. Fortunately, two of the preseason casualties, DB Uati Pati and DE John Kellum, came back this past weekend; Kellum saw limited action, while Pati, who was supposed to be eased in, was forced to play more snaps than the coaches wanted because another DB got ejected from the game for an unsportsmanlike conduct call.

These injuries matter more than they matter to most teams, because NPU really hasn't built up the depth it needs to compete yet. I've always said that one of the two measuring sticks of a competitive CCIW team is a two-deep that consists of nothing but CCIW-starter-level players. NPU doesn't have that yet. The talent is there, or it's getting close, but the experience is lacking. (The other measuring stick is at least a half-dozen players who are All-CCIW quality.)

The offense has been just awful the past two weeks. Some of it is an inexperienced receiver corps; the number of dropped passes and WRs running the wrong routes continues to be dismaying. But T.D. Conway really has been seriously off of his game the past two weeks as well. He improved somewhat against IWU over what he did against Elmhurst, but, frankly, that was no accomplishment at all, since nobody could possibly play worse than he did against the 'jays. He's just not hitting his targets the way that he has in the past, even when the NPU wideouts were all living in Drop City.

The running game has been OK, and the very young offensive line has done better than I expected. But it's a spread offense; the primary task of a spread offense is to throw the ball effectively. NPU has fallen lamentably short of that over the past three weeks, the past two weeks in particular. And, in the end, inexperience is no excuse.

Special teams were decent until this past Saturday, and this past Saturday they were just plain awful. The defense hasn't played well, but, again, it wasn't as horrible against IWU as it was against Elmhurst. IWU simply had a player in Maurice Shoemaker-Gilmore whom the Vikings just couldn't seem to stop. Then again, the most disappointing aspect of the past two weeks is something that I pointed out here in my post-mortem on Saturday afternoon, and that's the fact that the Vikings proved to be the cure for two offenses (Elmhurst and Illinois Wesleyan) that were totally stagnant until they faced the Vikings. I could accept the 42 points given up to Midland, which is undefeated and nationally ranked in NAIA and is a legitimate offensive juggernaut at 39 ppg. EC and IWU were different matters entirely.

It's a bad stretch right now for NPU. The Vikings will simply have to push through it, and I'm hoping that a struggling Millikin team will prove to be the cure for them that they in turn had proven to be for EC and IWU.

In terms of the broader sweep of the program, I'm still 100% on board with what Mike Conway is doing. This is part of the growing pains of getting from Point A to Point B and then on to Point C. The Vikings are going to have to get to the point where they're putting dozens of seniors and juniors on the field, just like everybody else -- and until then, they're going to lose more often than they win. I'd just like to see them be a little more competitive and not fall apart so badly when things don't go their way.

Thank you, GS!  That's great insight!  Good luck to the Park this weekend.
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AndOne

CCIW PLAYERS OF THE WEEK

Offense----------> Maurice Shoemaker-Gilmore, IWU
Defense---------> Tommy Sora, NCC
Special Teams--> Pat Cravens, NCC

NAPERVILLE, Ill. – Illinois Wesleyan's Maurice Shoemaker-Gilmore, along with North Central's Tommy Sora and Pat Cravens were named the College Conference of Illinois & Wisconsin (CCIW) Football Players of the Week on Monday.

Shoemaker-Gilmore, a senior running back from Kankakee, Illinois and Bishop McNamara High School (Business Administration major), scored three touchdowns and threw for another during a 45-10 win at North Park on Saturday. He rushed for 150 yards on 20 carries and two touchdowns, ran a kickoff back 88 yards for a touchdown and threw a 32-yard score in the third quarter. The 88-yard return was the sixth-longest kickoff return in Titan history.

Sora, a junior linebacker from Morton Grove, Illinois and Notre Dame College Prep (Finance/Economics/Management major), helped lead a Cardinal pass rush which produced a season-high 13 tackles-for-loss and six quarterback sacks in a 42-7 win over Millikin on Saturday. He totaled seven tackles (five solo), three tackles-for-loss and two sacks as North Central limited a second-straight CCIW opponent to single-digit scoring.

Cravens, a junior defensive back/punt returner from Chicago and Notre Dame College Prep (Management major), had four punt returns for 85 yards (21.3-yard average) against the Big Blue on Saturday. He had a 25-yard return deep into Millikin territory in the second quarter and added a 42-yard return to the Big Blue 28-yard line late in the third quarter that set up a two-play scoring drive.


2016 CCIW Football Players of the Week

Offense
Maurice Shoemaker-Gilmore – Illinois Wesleyan (9/26/16)
Orlando Hernandez – Elmhurst (9/19/16)
Broc Rutter – North Central (9/12/16)
T.D. Conway – North Park (9/6/16)

Defense
Tommy Sora – North Central (9/26/16)
Eric Stevenson – Wheaton (9/19/16)
DJ Warkenthien – North Central (9/12/16)
Sean Wetherell – Elmhurst (9/6/16)

Special Teams
Pat Cravens – North Central (9/26/16)
Zane Lodico – North Central (9/19/16)
Darquise Holman – Carthage (9/12/16)
Robert Martin – Augustana (9/6/16)

Gregory Sager

The first two CCIW Offensive Player of the Week winners during the CCIW portion of the season, EC's Orlando Hernandez and IWU's Maurice Shoemaker-Gilmore, each faced North Park's defense that particular week. That was a hallmark of the bad old days; whichever team played NPU had the inside track on winning the league's weekly awards. I'm not pleased that the situation has suddenly reverted back to what it had been before NPU started playing respectably. I can guarantee that Mike Conway's not pleased about it, either.
"To see what is in front of one's nose is a constant struggle." -- George Orwell

izzy stradlin

Quote from: Neverwas on September 26, 2016, 11:13:01 AM
Quote from: izzy stradlin on September 25, 2016, 11:29:23 PM
Quote from: thunderdog on September 25, 2016, 01:35:07 AM

After watching Wheaton's offense struggle for the 2nd consecutive week, I feel it necessary to expand on a few of your comments Mugsy. I'm completely baffled by the QB situation right now. Given that AB2 has now started the last 2 in a row, with only a brief cameo from JP11 in the Carthage game, it seems as if AB2 has been designated the starter. As I've stated before, I'm not a fan of any kind of rotation, be it intra-game or inter-game, so part of me is glad to see that a decision has seemingly been made...

...that said, I feel strongly that the wrong decision has been made.

Here are JP11's cumulative career stats:
Passing:  221 of 337    65.6%    2,864 yards    26 TD    9 INT    Yards/Attempt = 8.50    TD/Attempt = .077    INT/Attempt = .027
Rushing:  188 carries    892 yards    12 TD     Yards/carry = 4.75     TD/carry = .064

Here are AB2's cumulative career stats:
Passing:  170 of 292     58.2%    2,538 yards    22 TD    8 INT    Yards/Attempt = 8.69    TD/Attempt = .075    INT/Attempt = .027
Rushing:  157 carries    709 yards     8 TD      Yards/carry = 4.51     TD/carry = .051

Statistically, almost identical outside of the completion %. However, we all know there are many intangibles that go into leading an offense that go beyond the stats. This is where, IMO, Johnny Peltz separates himself. The offense just has a different feel when he's leading it. ..................It's time to go back to your SENIOR CAPTAIN.

I agree with what you are getting at about the intangibles and the play of a QBs teammates--there'a a reason they are not both captains--but that's hard to quantify.  In terms of numbers I think that completion percentage difference is huge.  That's 2-3 more in-completions that often happen on third down and end possessions.  In fact, I would venture that a difference in passing accuracy is more pronounced on third down.   In a game where Wheaton might have to come from behind (ie UWW last year with 50 pass attempts) that's 3-4 more in-completions from Bowers possibly with a similar number of possessions ended that wouldn't with Peltz. 

I try to give the Wheaton coaches the benefit of the doubt, and I think they believe Bowers speed ends up extending more possessions to make up for that difference?    While Bowers is faster, the numbers don't support their conclusion.

Quote from: ncc_fan on September 25, 2016, 01:35:23 PM
The pessimist in me says Swider is keeping Peltz and the real Wheaton offense under wraps until the Bell game.      :-\

In 2014 Wheaton had a 5 or so "bad" wins with the offense looking below average with Reece Butler and Andrew Bowers playing quarterback to start the season.  Right before Bell week, Peltz took over at QB put up >30 pts against NCC and the offense didn't look back.   The pessimist in me says Swider keeps Peltz on the bench (some kind of reverse nepotism).  The optimist says Peltz gets the ball this week, Bowers speed gets on the field in the slot, and Wheaton doesn't look back.


I agree with giving the coaches the benefit of the doubt.  After all, they know the calls, correct reads and watch practice every day.  They see how both QBs interact with the team and lead.  We can only watch on Saturdays.  However, it is pretty remarkable that (what seems like) every Wheaton supporter believes the coaching staff is making the wrong pick... I find that very interesting.

Well, we only watch Saturdays but Saturdays are all that count. It is very remarkable that every Wheaton follower and every d3 follower who watches Wheaton (wabash, elmhurst, north central fans, etc) see Peltz as the better QB.  Is it possible every single person out there is wrong and Mike Swider is such an amazing genius and knows better? No way! Football isn't that complicated.

The other Wheaton players aren't dumb either and don't think this isn't having a ripple effect on the offense.     

Neverwas

#33456
Has anyone been looking at Logan Hansen's Ratings for a stats oriented take on D3? http://loganahansen21.wixsite.com/hansen-ratings/game-predictions

Wheaton @ IWU has the highest game score of the week (higher the score the higher the "fun" a game might be to watch).
Elmhurst @ Augie is up there as well.

Also, has the CCIW as the second ranked conference. 

Anyways, I just started paying attention late last year and thought I would give a shout out to some one else giving coverage to D3 that isn't named Massey.

wally_wabash

Quote from: Neverwas on September 29, 2016, 10:13:04 AM
Anyways, I just started paying attention late last year and thought I would give a shout out to some one else giving coverage to D3 that isn't named Massey.

I don't know how much attention Massey is really paying to Division III.  He has a set of rankings sure, but when you have five NESCACs in the top 11, you're kind of telling on yourself a little bit aren't you? 
"Nothing in the world is more expensive than free."- The Deacon of HBO's The Wire

Neverwas

Quote from: wally_wabash on September 29, 2016, 10:30:51 AM
Quote from: Neverwas on September 29, 2016, 10:13:04 AM
Anyways, I just started paying attention late last year and thought I would give a shout out to some one else giving coverage to D3 that isn't named Massey.

I don't know how much attention Massey is really paying to Division III.  He has a set of rankings sure, but when you have five NESCACs in the top 11, you're kind of telling on yourself a little bit aren't you?

Yeah, you're right.  I always found it fun to use Massey as a proxy for predicted outcome/spread which can now be done with Hansen...just one more website to check each week :)

USee


HansenRatings

If you're looking for more sites that rate DIII, I have links to all of them on my Prediction Tracker page. There's a few that still aren't updated for this week yet (Wrathell, Waits, Wilson), and some that don't post any ratings until mid-season (FACT, Wolfe). Outside of my system, Atomic Football has had the best DIII score predictions so far this season. Massey is in the middle of the pack. If you're looking for a laugh, check out the Wilson Performance Ratings.
Follow me on Twitter. I post fun graphs sometimes. @LogHanRatings

AndOne

Quote from: wally_wabash on September 29, 2016, 10:30:51 AM
Quote from: Neverwas on September 29, 2016, 10:13:04 AM
Anyways, I just started paying attention late last year and thought I would give a shout out to some one else giving coverage to D3 that isn't named Massey.

I don't know how much attention Massey is really paying to Division III.  He has a set of rankings sure, but when you have five NESCACs in the top 11, you're kind of telling on yourself a little bit aren't you?

Perhaps Mr. Massey became confused somewhere along the line and, perceiving the year was a little further along than it actually is, thought he was analyzing basketball teams. This is especially plausible considering his basketball rankings always seem to be well populated by NESCAC teams.  ;)

AndOne

Quote from: USee on September 29, 2016, 11:48:35 AM
Front page re-ranking the conferences. CCIW, despite the weakness at the top, makes a move up:

http://www.d3football.com/columns/around-the-nation/2016/re-ranking-the-conferences-for-2016

4. College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

Kickoff ranking: 7

No. 6 North Central has impressed, but its two non-conference wins were against non-Division III programs. No. 11 Wheaton is also 4-0, but has slid down the polls after narrow wins over Carthage and Elmhurst. I'm of the opinion that those results do not show the strength of the middle of the league, but the lack of power at the top. Still, with two teams that can challenge the Purple Powers and a solid middle class, the CCIW earns high marks.


Not trying to be Mr. Controversial here, but it seems Mr. Turer is being at least a bit contradictory on a couple of points:

1. He says NCC has impressed, but its 2 non-con wins were against non-D3 programs.
it seems what is being missed is that while neither team NCC played is among the nation's best NAIA teams, they are scholarship teams and, are likely just as good as many, if not most, of the other D3 teams that the top ranked D3 teams have beaten. Is Mr. Turer suggesting that just because NCC's non-con wins were against NAIA teams, that they cannot be "impressive" victories? If so, I think this is an incorrect assumption.

2. He says there is "lack of power at the top." This seems incongruent with the fact that NCC and Wheaton are powerful enough to currently be ranked #6, and #11 respectively. Also, this statement seems to ignore the fact that Carthage is now probably the 3rd best team in the conference, and Elmhurst had a pretty good game as opposed to WC being stinky.

Wonder what others think so opposing viewpoints are welcomed. Thanks.   

USee

I have been on record as saying this Wheaton team could be better than each of the last two, both of which were top 10 at year's end. That was before they had their struggles on offense, which (IMO) are related to young, new coaches. This defense is good and has been consistently good against everybody.

North Central seems to be clicking on all cylinders. I have taken notice they are not running the ball as effectively as recent years despite two All conference type RB's and they are not stopping the run quite as well either. That may be a product of unknown factors or it may be they have come back to the pack in the trenches. After Wheaton plays IWU, these two will have a common opponent which will add a little more data to the mix.

I am of the opinion that the middle of the CCIW is better than they were. As I said all summer every team but one has their QB back (save Augie) and every team has their top and in most cases top 2 running backs back. Every team in the league returned between 14-19 starters. What I have noticed is the league is much better on defense than last year. Wheaton, Carthage, Elmhurst, Augie, IWU, all are giving up fewer points than a year ago.

The CCIW is definitely stronger, top to bottom, than it was a year ago I think that's pretty certain. Whether that means the top 2 are deep playoff teams remains to be seen.

ncaafootballdad

When starting Bowers in 3 of the first 4 games, Wheaton has scored 55 points. Peltz started 1 game and Wheaton scored 60 points. Peltz has had better season and career passing and rushing stats. Peltz is a captain as elected by the players. Peltz is 6'3". Bowers is 5'-10" Peltz appears to be much more respected by Wheaton's opponents. Peltz is Swider's nephew. Bowers is starting. This makes no sense.??