BB: Just Some Guy's West Region Rankings

Started by Just_Some_Guy, February 20, 2007, 11:09:24 PM

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Chapman vs Linfield

Chapman splits 4 games with Linfield
2 (40%)
Linfield sweeps
1 (20%)
Chapman sweeps
0 (0%)
Linfield takes 3 of 4
0 (0%)
Chapman takes 3 of 4
2 (40%)

Total Members Voted: 5

Ullcme41

To answer your question Mr. Parkman on the D1 and D3 transfering, i definitly think that players should be able to transfer in college baseball, not only up divisions but also down. The reason being is very few if any players in D1 get full scholarships, while D3 gets no athletic scholarships at all, and with the coaches coming and going as the please, this makes players not want to stick around. Not mention how you can have a 17 year old make a decision on where they want to live for the next 3 to 4 years. It takes more than a fun recruiting trip to figure  that tough decision out.

Now to the point of the "power arms" this one really ruffled yalls feathers a bit. I consider in the D3 level if you can hit 90+ you can throw it by guys. The average velo of most teams 78-83 not much more than that. The reason i bring those certain players up is because, excluding one, they all have other pitches they can go to. Yes three out of the pen would start for almost any other team including those texas boys. I agree 90 DOESNT mean good i truly believe you in that case, but 90 does give you room for error which the low 80s does not.

I sure do like the feedback though this is going to be a fun chatroom when reading about everyones outlooks from so many different parts of the country

Ullcme41

Oh and two of the players were fallbacks from D1, one from Fullerton and one from U of San Fran

BigPoppa

#272
Quote from: Ullcme41 on January 27, 2009, 02:48:34 AM


Now to the point of the "power arms" this one really ruffled yalls feathers a bit. I consider in the D3 level if you can hit 90+ you can throw it by guys. The average velo of most teams 78-83 not much more than that.

Are you kidding me??? Where are you watching college baseball? 78-83 is a BP fastball and will get hammered by even the worst college hitters. Maybe you are used to seeing the lack of velocity so when some reaches 85-87 you immediately think it must be "scraping" 90 or even 93.

I am really looking forward to watching you backpedal on your statements in the next few weeks when your "untouchables" all get touched.

If I am wrong, I will be the first to admit it.
Baseball is not a game that builds character, it is a game that reveals it.

infielddad

#273
I'm standing with Big Poppa on this one.
Ullcme, here are some references of a team I watch a lot.
Davis: 88-91; Bleich: 88-91, Inman: 90-92, Storen:90-92; Yount:85-87, Sandbrink:85-88.
That was the pitching staff for Stanford last Spring that got them to the semi-final game in Omaha.  Are we to think CLU has 8 guys that would put the Stanford pitchers in their bullpen? ???
I checked the stats for USF and Fullerton and those two pitchers still have to prove they can pitch at the collegiate level, from what I read.
I am not sure of your DIII background but it sure isn't what I have seen.
For a case in point, in 2003, Trinity had a big 6'5" righty transfer from a JC.
He threw 91-94 straight overhand....and straight.  He absolutely could not get anyone out in the Fall.  The hitters were getting hurt running to the back rack.
Well, they changed his arm angle, his velocity dropped to 88-91 with  hop on the fastball and he developed a nice little slider.  From there, he was one of the best pitchers in the West region and had terrific success in Independent league ball when he graduated.
To further illustrate this point:  According to the  Trinity coaches, Yacko was 88-91 with a great slider in the West Regional in last May.  Bronson was 85-88.  Are you suggesting CLU has 8 guys better than those two, and with more velocity?
Having watched a lot of minor league ball at the low and High A levels, I can tell you that very few Milb teams have 8 guys with the velocity you assert for the CLU staff.
I like your enthusiasm but your comments are lacking in reliability.

Dawgsdad

I have to also agree with Infielddad, and Big Poppa as well.  You certainly don't need or see overpowering stuff at any level. It comes down to location and keeping hitters off balance. I've seen guys look silly at a fastball thrown at 88 and turn right around and crush a 91 heater for extras... As a pitcher if you get too predictable, your doomed no matter how fast you throw.

I also believe that those that just go out there and throw hard all the time don't last long, and will always have arm trouble.  Sure it's nice to know you got the gas in the tank, but the smart ones know how and when to use it to their benefit.

My kid, and some of our Texas boys played in the NYCBL this past summer and were not given a chance. Upper eighties, and lower to mid nineties got them to the championship game against Glen Falls which had more D1 players than anything else and quite honestly, we destroyed them. You know your in a good league of good pitching when you have pitchers that have appeared in more  than half of their teams games and ERA's of just around 1 and can't make any of the conference teams - that's tough competition and no one was as dominate has what CLU fan is highlighting!

Ullcme41

NO you can trust me big Poopa i know what is and is not good velocity, That velocity is what most D3 pitchers throw sorry to burst your bubble. In saying that I do believe those boys can still compete with the lack of velocity. I don't need to guess velocity, even though im usually right on, because i have had a radar gun in my hand while seeing them play. Not a jugs either a good ole Stalker.

I wont "backpedal" from there velocities because it is what it is, I will not put predictions on there stats, but I will stick by that that kind of pitching they have will make them the favorites in the SCIAC.

As for you infielddad, I said 5 not 8 who are hitting 90+, and i said they would start for any other team in the country, not meaning the group of three go together and take a team over, I meant as individuals, Im not talking about D1 pitchers because this is a D3 chatroom, thought you would put together my bad.
The USF kid Tigert was injured for half the year but has been a top 100 prospect all growing up.

As for that 6'5" kid that turned out 88-91 and a good slider, he would not have been in the independent leagues some pro team would have given him a shot, so maybe ur velo numbers are a little off? Or he looks ridiculous doing it and cant project one litlle bit

And I most definitly am not saying that they are better than Yacko, even though Tigert could get there this year, Because ive seen him first hand and the kid spots up 90 and has a solid two plane slider that makes batters fish, so im please dont assume things  ;D

I sure like this chat though haha

Ullcme41

what are the name of the kids that were hitting the mid 90s in the NYPL im assuming the New york penn league? Hate to burst you bubble thats not to good of a league, sorry sir

infielddad

Oh brother!!!
I can tell you why that 6'5" pitcher did not get drafted and it was not that I overstated or understated his velocity.  It was because he was not projected to improve beyond that level and even though he could get batters out at the DIII level, they did not project the same in Milb.
Ullcme, I have been around a bit.  My son is a former DIII kid...pretty good player. I have watched him play against Team USA, in the MWL All-Star game involving probably 30 guys picked in the first 10 rounds of the 2004 draft.  He has had AB's against Randy Johnson, Homer Bailey(101mph on the gun), Houston Street, amongst others.  I have a pretty good idea of the competition at DIII and how it looks in the bigger world of baseball.
I have a pretty good idea about DIII velocity.
I also know Greg Moore at USF is respected as one of the very top pitching coaches in the Country.  He has had amazing success taking talented but raw pitchers and getting them drafted, and drafted at a very high level.
I like to see kids succeed.  Hopefully Tigert will.  He has not done it yet and it would be quite unusual that he would leave USF and a pitching coach who builds his reputation for getting the most out of pitchers and getting them to the next level.

theoneandonly

Quote from: infielddad on January 27, 2009, 02:16:41 PM
Oh brother!!!
I can tell you why that 6'5" pitcher did not get drafted and it was not that I overstated or understated his velocity.  It was because he was not projected to improve beyond that level and even though he could get batters out at the DIII level, they did not project the same in Milb.
Ullcme, I have been around a bit.  My son is a former DIII kid...pretty good player. I have watched him play against Team USA, in the MWL All-Star game involving probably 30 guys picked in the first 10 rounds of the 2004 draft.  He has had AB's against Randy Johnson, Homer Bailey(101mph on the gun), Houston Street, amongst others.  I have a pretty good idea of the competition at DIII and how it looks in the bigger world of baseball.
I have a pretty good idea about DIII velocity.
I also know Greg Moore at USF is respected as one of the very top pitching coaches in the Country.  He has had amazing success taking talented but raw pitchers and getting them drafted, and drafted at a very high level.
I like to see kids succeed.  Hopefully Tigert will.  He has not done it yet and it would be quite unusual that he would leave USF and a pitching coach who builds his reputation for getting the most out of pitchers and getting them to the next level.

well put
Baseball players get to every base.

Ullcme41

Well put indeed!! I like when people information that give arguments!! Good Stuff, I agree with the rep of The USF pitching coach though i have never worked first hand with him. I believe Tigert left for personal reasons, not because of a following out with the coach. It would definitly be tough to leave that type of coach.

Aas for the velos you have scene my goodness thows are some names!! what team did your son get picked up by thats pretty cool stuff!! I can understand now whay the 6'5" boy didnt get a shot that makes sense, even though its wierd how scouts dont give those guys a plane ticket to compete for a summer. Why not see if they can get the higher level players out? Just have always wondered

Good stuff infileddad

infielddad

#280
He was drafted and played himself into a prospect in the Blue Jays organization before an injury and surgery brought his career to an end.
Scouting is a very funny business.  There are those who project what you can do.  And a lot who project what you cannot.
I'll have to check Menlo and CSU East Bay and find out if CLU plays in Northern CA this Spring.

Blackcat00

Man that many staffs with high 90's. Hell maybe some the games will be on ESPN now!

Ralph Turner

Quote from: infielddad on January 27, 2009, 02:43:34 PM
He was drafted and played himself into a prospect in the Blue Jays organization before an injury and surgery brought his career to an end.
Scouting is a very funny business.  There are those who project what you can do.  And a lot who project what you cannot.
I'll have to check Menlo and CSU East Bay and find out if CLU plays in Northern CA this Spring.
IFdad, sorry that CSU-East Bay is moving to D-II, if for no other reason in that it cuts your exposure to D-III in half!

Menlo is committing to D-III this year.

One other note, La Sierra is now 3rd-year provisional.  Games against this Seventh Day Adventist college count as in-region.  LaSierra strictly observes the Sabbath, and does not play on Saturday.

Bob Maxwell

Ullcme41...

You made some goo dpoints about transfering... and then some ridiculous ones about velocity.  I am a late comer to this so I won't beat up on you about it  becasue the others have said much of what I would have said.  I just want to say that I've seen a lof  ot 90 fast balls land over the fence in D-III  because people think that you can just throw it by hitters.  There are a lot of D-III players who could play at the D-I level but don't becasue of what you said about transfers.  Its good baseball to watch...

I like this representation of what a 90 mph fastball does for a pitcher:
Quote90 DOESNT mean good i truly believe you in that case, but 90 does give you room for error which the low 80s does not.

Very accurate statement...  I've said it for years.

Ullcme41

Mr Maxwell,

With you agreeing about my comment about the 90mph fastball, where are the ridiculous ones on velo? Im not saying they will dominate im saying with those kind of arms it is tough to compete with that kind of depth from game to game. Most teams battle the starters and try to get to the pen, correct??? It is when you get to the pen you tend to pounce on the weaker pitcher. But with the depth that CLU has its going to be tough when they bring in solid pitcher after pitcher game after game. Thats where im going with the 90 comments, not that 90 dominates all!!

You can bash on me a bit its no sweat, these chats would not be fun if everyone keeps on agreeing with eachother and stroke the ego of Chapman haha ;)