Fitness Requirements?

Started by Ejay, July 12, 2017, 02:58:01 PM

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Ejay

Are you aware of any fitness requirements (i.e. 2 mile run in xx:xx) at the schools you have experience with? My HS freshman just received the requirements from the HS coach - 5:30 mile and 11:45 2 miles.  I wasn't sure how that compared to college expectations.

Mr.Right

Usually a 2 mile run should be under 12 but some are as low as 11:30. GK's are given plenty of leeway in that regard

Shooter McGavin

Mr. Right hit it spot on. The norm tends to be 2 in 12 or 1 in 5ish. All depends on the coach and what they are looking for. There are other fitness tests that teams may do such as the "Beep Test." All are pretty standard in the soccer world.

oldonionbag

2 miles can range anywhere from 11:30-12:00, or as Mr. Right said, 1 under 5. I've heard of 1 mile under 4:30 too. The beep test is pretty standard.

1970s NESCAC Player

Quote from: oldonionbag on July 12, 2017, 04:29:51 PM
2 miles can range anywhere from 11:30-12:00, or as Mr. Right said, 1 under 5. I've heard of 1 mile under 4:30 too. The beep test is pretty standard.

Any college soccer player that can run a 4:30 mile should seriously consider taking up cross country . . .

1970s NESCAC Player

Some schools will do a test consisting of a series of distances with a set interval between each, such as 2 miles in 12:00 minutes, followed by a 5 minute rest, followed by one mile in 6:00, followed by a 5 minute rest, followed by a 1/2 mile in 3:00.  There is some merit to this, as soccer games consist of intervals of running and resting.

The best coaches use these tests to gauge the fitness of individual players at the start of preseason, not to punish them if they don't make the times.

Many teams also test for speed, such as 40 yard dash times, and some sort of shuttle run.

Falconer

Quote from: oldonionbag on July 12, 2017, 04:29:51 PM
2 miles can range anywhere from 11:30-12:00, or as Mr. Right said, 1 under 5. I've heard of 1 mile under 4:30 too. The beep test is pretty standard.

Forgive my skepticism, but I'd like to see some evidence that any college use a 4:30 mile as a standard in soccer. I'd bet no one does.

Twenty years ago under Layton Shoemaker, Messiah had a standard of 2 miles in 12 minutes. Under Brandt it was 1 mile in 5 minutes, which most players reached. As far as I know, just one player managed to go a little under 4:40, namely, the AA defender and POY, J D Binger. I don't claim that the Falcons are the fittest team in D3, but surely they are among the fittest teams, despite the fact that their liberal substitution practice would suggest otherwise. Many players have said that they almost never play a team with comparable fitness--and they are in the best position to make such a comparison.

I agree with the comment above that any soccer player who can break 4:30 ought to be running XC. That's really fast. I was a XC runner in HS and college, not a soccer player, so I understand what it takes to go under 4:30, even today when lots of HS runners can go under 4:20. You can't just go out and run (say) 4:28, without specifically training to do that. Running for conditioning, as soccer players do (and I've always had much respect for their commitment to high levels of conditioning, which are probably higher than any other sport other than XC), won't get you under 4:30. To do that, a lot of interval work is necessary--a kind of training that doesn't seem as relevant for soccer.

Granted, there will on rare occasions be soccer players who can go that fast, but it will be rare unless they also run middle or long distances competitively. A few years ago there was a PA HS player who made the state final in 1600 meters, and I think he was right around 4:20. In my own case, a long time ago when 4:30 might get you to the state finals, I finished one place ahead of a soccer player in the mile at the county championships, but (again) he trained for the mile and not just for soccer. He was very good at both and played collegiately at Penn.

Certainly times are much faster today, but 4:30 is still really fast for anyone who isn't specifically training to do that. I'd bet the ranch that the vast majority of World Cup players can't run 4:30 without training specifically for it--and many still probably couldn't break 4:30 if they did train for it. Let me offer some support for that opinion from this event, the 1500 meters for the decathlon at this year's NCAA D1 championships: http://www.ncaa.com/sites/default/files/external/track-field/results/d1/outdoor17/final/041-0_compiled.htm. Remember: this event is about 100 meters shorter than a mile, so to run 4:30 in the mile you would be running somewhere around 4:13 for 1500 meters.

I think we can assume that (a) all of these men are top college athletes, comparable in that regard to professional soccer players, not to nearly all D3 soccer players; (b) they do train to run as fast as they can in 1500 meters, they don't just run for conditioning; and (c) they run as fast as they can on that day, with everything they have left after two days of competition that does NOT include any other race longer than 400 meters (and there isn't a separate qualifying heat either). Yes, they might knock off a few seconds if they were just running one mile and not anything else, but (again) these men are in top shape and this is the big kahuna so they do their best.

Draw your own conclusions.


sokermom

Quote from: 1970s NESCAC Player on July 12, 2017, 05:04:07 PM
Quote from: oldonionbag on July 12, 2017, 04:29:51 PM
2 miles can range anywhere from 11:30-12:00, or as Mr. Right said, 1 under 5. I've heard of 1 mile under 4:30 too. The beep test is pretty standard.

Any college soccer player that can run a 4:30 mile should seriously consider taking up cross country . . .

Exactly.  4:30 is plain crazy.

Clotpoll

#8
Such a common sight to see coaches blow players up with a Cooper test, then sprints on consecutive days. Absolutely useless, except for causing muscular injuries. And none of this stuff remotely helps the player who cannot recover and orient himself defensively or move well enough be an effective part of a simple attacking pattern.

I've always liked running a group thru Scottish 18s as a nice gauge of fitness. It's soccer-type running, and even though it's a go-to-failure exercise, it's not terribly hard on leg muscles and joints.

jknezek

I remember my h.s. coach laughing at a 5:30 mile time. He never cared what we could run a mile in. He cared we could do those jog sprints around the field. 50 yard sprint, 50 yard jog, ending width sprint, 50 yard jog, 50 yard sprint, ending width jog. Over and over for 20 or 30 minutes. All defenders together, all midfielders together, all forwards together. Your group got caught, you sprinted until you were back in place. I hated those practices. I don't think he even cared about speed too much. I don't know how many times he told me and others being slow just meant I had to be smarter. Coach Piranian was honest with me at W&L 21 years ago. I think he realized I was unlikely to be smart enough to make up for my lack of speed at the D3 level...

blooter442

I was All-Conference in cross-country in high school, and my best mile time was 4:42. Granted, this was in Maine (not the most competitive running state), and I was also better at longer distances than middle distance events like the mile – 16:15 for 5K and 34:39 for 10K, which percentile-wise are much better than a 4:42 mile – but my point is that you have to be blessed with some serious natural talent to drop a 4:30 unless you're running somewhere in the neighborhood of 50 miles per week. I grew up with a kid who was a soccer player and stumbled into track (he ran a 4:15 as a senior in high school) and then ended up running XC and track at Dartmouth, but he was very much the exception rather than the norm.

On that note, Tobias Muellers ran a 48 second 400 at the NESCAC outdoor track championships, which was good for second in the conference, so I imagine he might be able to come close because that is some insane leg speed. That said, I highly doubt that a coach would set a 4:30 benchmark for his (or her) D3 program – 5:00 is plausible, and I'd say that 12:00 for 2 miles is probably more likely.

D3soccerwatcher

According to "The Messiah Method" (Michael Zigarelli), the standard for the Messiah team is the 5:00 minute mile.  With about three quarters of the players making it and the others close behind.  Also, it appears that no Messiah player has ever achieved the 4:30 mark.  I agree, there isn't a D3 program in the country achieving 4:30 -- not one.

luckylefty

Teams have begun to get away from timed mile or 2 mile runs. Beep tests are becoming most prevalent amongst programs as a way to assess fitness.

In regards to teams and rest and recovery, you would be very surprised how conscious coaches are now. I know programs that barely have starters train the day after a game and will never have their core 16 or 17 players do fitness during the season.

Saint of Old

No one can truly grasp this topic, unless.. as was said before you have attempted to run 2 miles in 12 minutes.
Sure it sounds easy, did to me as a freshman... how bad could it be.
I will say that as a freshman I beat the entire team... after the first lap that is.
Then there were 7 laps to go.
Half way through the second lap it suddenly hit me that this would end up harder than I thought.

To be honest I was not sure I finished... so ended my first day as a college soccer player.

I never broke that barrier as hard as I tried, got a 12:15 junior year which is the fittest I have been my entire life.

430 mile is insane.
Actually if you can do a 430 mile, I would say you are in the wrong field and you should spend all your time on a track!!!

Mr.Right

The best part of the 2 mile test is to see how your Frosh perform. They are usually not quite as prepared as returning players and you can tell who has been slacking a bit or who was really preparing for the test. As a Frosh it would behoove you to run a fantastic 2 mile as that can impress the coach right away and if they can keep up with the returners in terms of skill, they will get a solid chance to make the team and get some minutes. On the flip, if a player is coming in as one of your top recruits and runs a poor 2 mile it might take them a week or 2 to get up to speed fitness wise and will not see the field until then.