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Post Patterns (Division III football) => South Region football => Topic started by: jmccloskey on June 17, 2012, 03:02:30 pm

Title: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: jmccloskey on June 17, 2012, 03:02:30 pm
I was reading a press release from Christopher Newport, announcing the Captain's arrival in the CAC for the 2013-2014 season.  The interesting part was at the bottom, where it noted that the Captain's would join the CAC for all sports except Football (which the CAC doesn't sponsor) in the Fall of 2013.  It then noted that they were a member of the USA South for football, and would remain an affiliate member in that sport until 2015, or join the Capital Athletic Conference "if the league begins sponsoring football before that time."

I just found it interesting they put that comment in.  The CAC hasn't had football as a conference sponsored sport since it's inception.  That the Captains are even mentioning the possibility of joining the CAC for football would seem to suggest that might change in the forseeable future.  So, does anyone know?  Are there any serious discussions about starting conference play in football at some point?  Or was Christopher Newport just musing here?
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Pat Coleman on June 17, 2012, 11:20:54 pm
There definitely has been -- in fact, the CAC should be sponsoring football the moment that CNU hits but the CAC has been delaying this decision because there aren't enough schools for an automatic bid, or enough unattached schools for them to draw on.

CNU, Frostburg, Salisbury and Wesley make four, but they need seven for an automatic bid. There aren't any other independents to loop into the league.

I had heard that there were perhaps other USA South teams that might be interested in making the jump to the CAC, but haven't seen any movement on that in the 12 months since a few names were floated my way. Perhaps one of the schools will add football, although I have heard nothing, not even rumors, on any of those.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: SUADC on June 18, 2012, 10:02:53 am
There definitely has been -- in fact, the CAC should be sponsoring football the moment that CNU hits but the CAC has been delaying this decision because there aren't enough schools for an automatic bid, or enough unattached schools for them to draw on.

CNU, Frostburg, Salisbury and Wesley make four, but they need seven for an automatic bid. There aren't any other independents to loop into the league.

I had heard that there were perhaps other USA South teams that might be interested in making the jump to the CAC, but haven't seen any movement on that in the 12 months since a few names were floated my way. Perhaps one of the schools will add football, although I have heard nothing, not even rumors, on any of those.

I want to say the NCAA allows Newport News Apprentice to be an affiliate member for football, so that makes five. Nevertheless, three more teams would be suffice. I know about a year ago, there was an announcement that Stevenson was heading to the ACFC, which is basically the CAC might consider coming back.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Pat Coleman on June 18, 2012, 11:06:09 am
No, Apprentice is not eligible for the NCAA playoffs and cannot count toward anyone's minimum.

Stevenson was in the MAC for football and is leaving the CAC for the rest of its sports this fall to join the MAC Commonwealth.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: jknezek on June 18, 2012, 11:31:07 am
Catholic should be the easy one. Aren't they CAC for everything but football? With the ODAC adding Shenandoah losing Catholic would be annoying for scheduling purposes, to go back down to 7, but still meeting the AQ minimum.

Then again, I don't think Catholic would fare well with the other CAC football members, since they've had a rough go in the ODAC lately. That still puts them only at 5, so two more from the USA South, but you really have to want to build a competitive program to play Wesley, CNU, Salisbury every year. You are talking about 3 annual playoff caliber teams.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Ron Boerger on June 18, 2012, 01:35:16 pm
Tough to talk anyone in to joining/affiliating to get access to an automatic bid when Wesley is just going to get it anyway.   ;D
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: SUADC on June 18, 2012, 02:16:01 pm
Tough to talk anyone in to joining/affiliating to get access to an automatic bid when Wesley is just going to get it anyway.   ;D

If it was to become a football affiliate only, then yes. However, the CAC has more than just football to offer and the conference is well represented in other sports as well by other schools.

Now, I would love for its two other charter members, Galludet and Catholic to come back.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Pat Coleman on June 18, 2012, 03:46:48 pm
Catholic should be the easy one. Aren't they CAC for everything but football?

Catholic moved to the Landmark conference when it formed about five years ago.

I think the best setup for the CAC is to affiliate with another conference for football -- perhaps the Empire 8, since they currently share some members there.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: jknezek on June 18, 2012, 03:59:02 pm
Catholic should be the easy one. Aren't they CAC for everything but football?

Catholic moved to the Landmark conference when it formed about five years ago.

I think the best setup for the CAC is to affiliate with another conference for football -- perhaps the Empire 8, since they currently share some members there.

Don't know how I missed that. Thanks. That's what I get for basically being ODAC parochial.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: SUADC on June 18, 2012, 04:33:34 pm
Catholic should be the easy one. Aren't they CAC for everything but football?

Catholic moved to the Landmark conference when it formed about five years ago.

I think the best setup for the CAC is to affiliate with another conference for football -- perhaps the Empire 8, since they currently share some members there.

Maybe the USA South can go with the affiliate move, then we can have a real conference championship. 5 division games, 2 cross division games, 1 OOC game, then a conference championship game between the champions of each division. The rest of the conference can get a draw on final game matchups.

I was bored at work. So I decided to come up with a solution to Wesley and Huntingdon possibly joining a conference. I think this could go into effect after this upcoming season. I know there are many factors and issues with conference alignment and the sorts. But, like I said I was bored so this is what I have to say.

I think the USA South Conference should invite both Wesley and Huntingdon into the conference, as well as invite Salisbury*, Frostburg*, and Newport News Apprentice** to join the confernce and split it into two divisions.

USA South (N)                          USA South (S)
Wesley                                             NC Wesleyan
Salisbury*                                         Huntingdon
CNU                                                 Maryville (Tenn.)
Ferrum                                              Averett
Frostburg State*                                LaGrange
Shenandoah  ***                               Methodist
Newport News Apprentice**                 Greensboro   



*Subject to Empire 8 Contract
**Not considered NCAA institution
***Leaving for the ODAC
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Pat Coleman on June 18, 2012, 08:25:49 pm
They certainly overlap better in terms of geography with the USA South, but the USAC doesn't need help maintaining its automatic bid, where the Empire 8 just might.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Former NNASID on June 18, 2012, 10:29:13 pm
No, Apprentice is not eligible for the NCAA playoffs and cannot count toward anyone's minimum.

Stevenson was in the MAC for football and is leaving the CAC for the rest of its sports this fall to join the MAC Commonwealth.

We're recognized enough to be a countable game with NCAA (and NAIA) -- stats and everything count playing us but us in the ACFC was more of a scheduling alliance.  We only finished at .500 one time (in 2006).  We were eligible for All-ACFC awards.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Pat Coleman on June 18, 2012, 11:45:10 pm
Right. But not a member of the NCAA. Like many other non-NCAA institutions, games against Apprentice count, but they can't count toward someone's conference membership level for automatic bid purposes.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Ralph Turner on June 19, 2012, 09:49:12 am
Catholic should be the easy one. Aren't they CAC for everything but football?

Catholic moved to the Landmark conference when it formed about five years ago.

I think the best setup for the CAC is to affiliate with another conference for football -- perhaps the Empire 8, since they currently share some members there.

Maybe the USA South can go with the affiliate move, then we can have a real conference championship. 6 division games, 2 cross division games, 1 OOC game, then a conference championship game between the champions of each division. The rest of the conference can get a draw on final game matchups.

I was bored at work. So I decided to come up with a solution to Wesley and Huntingdon possibly joining a conference. I think this could go into effect after this upcoming season. I know there are many factors and issues with conference alignment and the sorts. But, like I said I was bored so this is what I have to say.

I think the USA South Conference should invite both Wesley and Huntingdon into the conference, as well as invite Salisbury*, Frostburg*, and Newport News Apprentice** to join the confernce and split it into two divisions.

USA South (N)                          USA South (S)
Wesley                                             NC Wesleyan
Salisbury*                                         Huntingdon
CNU                                                 Maryville (Tenn.)
Ferrum                                              Averett
Frostburg State*                                LaGrange
Shenandoah  ***                               Methodist
Newport News Apprentice**                 Greensboro   



*Subject to Empire 8 Contract
**Not considered NCAA institution
***Leaving for the ODAC
The problem with the conference championship game in football is that it hurts the chances at a Pool C bid.

I like Pat Coleman's suggestion that E8 and the CAC affiliate. The CAC affiliating with the E8 would permit the E8 to keep their football AQ.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Former NNASID on June 19, 2012, 02:01:41 pm
Right. But not a member of the NCAA. Like many other non-NCAA institutions, games against Apprentice count, but they can't count toward someone's conference membership level for automatic bid purposes.

Pat - I have never claimed us to be NCAA.  ACFC was more throwing us a lifeline (so to speak).  If I am over-reacting forgive me, but we are proud members of the USCAA - one that does play a handful of NCAA D3's in FB (this year Muhlenberg, Greensboro, Gallaudet, Bridgewater) and yes various others to fill a 10-game schedule.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: jknezek on June 19, 2012, 02:52:17 pm
nnasid -- I think you are just missing the point. This thread is primarily about the CAC and what it would take to get them to sponsor football. Primarily, they need 7 NCAA qualifying members to get an AQ. Without that, there is much less incentive to sponsor the sport.

Pat's point is simply that Apprentice can't help them with that. Apprentice is not a qualifying member for AQ purposes, though a perfectly legitimate opponent in all other respects. It's not a knock on Apprentice, its just a fact that while there is nothing wrong with scheduling Apprentice or being in a conference with Apprentice, it simply won't help you get to the 7 members necessary to receive an AQ.

There is nothing here to over-react to as no one is saying anything bad about Apprentice. In this one limited respect, 7 members to get an AQ, the school just don't provide any help.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: smedindy on June 19, 2012, 03:25:14 pm
Would the NCAA grant a waiver to a conference to include Apprentice in the 7-member minimum?

There's got to be a logical way to not have musical chairs so that everyone has a chance at an auto bid.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Former NNASID on June 19, 2012, 06:16:45 pm
apologies to all  :)
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Pat Coleman on June 19, 2012, 08:51:31 pm
I'm just clarifying.
Right. But not a member of the NCAA. Like many other non-NCAA institutions, games against Apprentice count, but they can't count toward someone's conference membership level for automatic bid purposes.

Pat - I have never claimed us to be NCAA.  ACFC was more throwing us a lifeline (so to speak).  If I am over-reacting forgive me, but we are proud members of the USCAA - one that does play a handful of NCAA D3's in FB (this year Muhlenberg, Greensboro, Gallaudet, Bridgewater) and yes various others to fill a 10-game schedule.


I was just clarifying.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Pat Coleman on June 19, 2012, 08:53:07 pm
Would the NCAA grant a waiver to a conference to include Apprentice in the 7-member minimum?

There's got to be a logical way to not have musical chairs so that everyone has a chance at an auto bid.

I think there is one logical way already -- affiliate the E8 with the CAC or vice versa.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Ryan Tipps on June 19, 2012, 10:04:40 pm
Would the NCAA grant a waiver to a conference to include Apprentice in the 7-member minimum?

There's got to be a logical way to not have musical chairs so that everyone has a chance at an auto bid.

I think there is one logical way already -- affiliate the E8 with the CAC or vice versa.

I understand the basic need for these teams, if they want the stability of a full schedule as well as an automatic bid. But isn't an E8/CAC pairing geographically unsettling? I was never thrilled with Frostburg and Salisbury joining in the first place, and I would prefer to see the schools' presidents and ADs come up with another solution rather than perpetuate the hefty travel efforts by adding Wesley and CNU to the long-range mix.

Feels too much like they would be taking a page from the Big East playbook. :)
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: jknezek on June 20, 2012, 09:44:32 am
Would the NCAA grant a waiver to a conference to include Apprentice in the 7-member minimum?

There's got to be a logical way to not have musical chairs so that everyone has a chance at an auto bid.

I think there is one logical way already -- affiliate the E8 with the CAC or vice versa.

I understand the basic need for these teams, if they want the stability of a full schedule as well as an automatic bid. But isn't an E8/CAC pairing geographically unsettling? I was never thrilled with Frostburg and Salisbury joining in the first place, and I would prefer to see the schools' presidents and ADs come up with another solution rather than perpetuate the hefty travel efforts by adding Wesley and CNU to the long-range mix.

Feels too much like they would be taking a page from the Big East playbook. :)

With the schools known to be leaving the NJAC for the E8, doesn't it seem more likely that Frostburg and Salisbury will rejoin the NJAC for numbers purposes? I know this still leaves Wesley out in the cold, but I really don't see a solution for that. But it always seemed to me that Frostburg and Salisbury were a good NJAC fit, expecially after Brockport (E8), Western CT (MASCAC) and Buffalo State (E8) move on.

Looking at it in terms of miles, Frostburg is 271 miles from TCNJ (more or less the center of NJ), and Morrisville is 262 miles from TCNJ. Comparable numbers. The problem is Salisbury/Frostburg to Morrisville, 640/621 miles, but with Frostburg/Salisbury affiliated with the E8, they are making many of those trips now, joining the NJAC would limit it to one per year (assuming you split Cortland/Morrisville home/away each year). It would add one of those long trips per year to the NY based schools, but they can always try and find a home in the E8 if they are unhappy.

I have heard there is some bad blood/history between Cortland and the E8, but I'm surprised Morrisville hasn't moved that direction. Anyone have an idea here?

As for Wesley... I just don't see a solution. The NJAC or the E8 are probably the strongest top to bottom conferences in the east/mid-atlantic region right now (or possibly the MAC, really don't want to start an argument about it, just my personal thought). But I don't see anyone really wanting Wesley.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Knightstalker on June 20, 2012, 10:52:10 am
Point of Order, Frostburg and Salisbury have never been NJAC members.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: SUADC on June 20, 2012, 11:55:35 am
Would the NCAA grant a waiver to a conference to include Apprentice in the 7-member minimum?

There's got to be a logical way to not have musical chairs so that everyone has a chance at an auto bid.

I think there is one logical way already -- affiliate the E8 with the CAC or vice versa.

I understand the basic need for these teams, if they want the stability of a full schedule as well as an automatic bid. But isn't an E8/CAC pairing geographically unsettling? I was never thrilled with Frostburg and Salisbury joining in the first place, and I would prefer to see the schools' presidents and ADs come up with another solution rather than perpetuate the hefty travel efforts by adding Wesley and CNU to the long-range mix.

Feels too much like they would be taking a page from the Big East playbook. :)

With the schools known to be leaving the NJAC for the E8, doesn't it seem more likely that Frostburg and Salisbury will rejoin the NJAC for numbers purposes? I know this still leaves Wesley out in the cold, but I really don't see a solution for that. But it always seemed to me that Frostburg and Salisbury were a good NJAC fit, expecially after Brockport (E8), Western CT (MASCAC) and Buffalo State (E8) move on.

Looking at it in terms of miles, Frostburg is 271 miles from TCNJ (more or less the center of NJ), and Morrisville is 262 miles from TCNJ. Comparable numbers. The problem is Salisbury/Frostburg to Morrisville, 640/621 miles, but with Frostburg/Salisbury affiliated with the E8, they are making many of those trips now, joining the NJAC would limit it to one per year (assuming you split Cortland/Morrisville home/away each year). It would add one of those long trips per year to the NY based schools, but they can always try and find a home in the E8 if they are unhappy.

I have heard there is some bad blood/history between Cortland and the E8, but I'm surprised Morrisville hasn't moved that direction. Anyone have an idea here?

As for Wesley... I just don't see a solution. The NJAC or the E8 are probably the strongest top to bottom conferences in the east/mid-atlantic region right now (or possibly the MAC, really don't want to start an argument about it, just my personal thought). But I don't see anyone really wanting Wesley.

As for teams not wanting to play Wesley, I do not see the point in not having them in the conference. They are almost a guarantee to get to the playoffs each year. If you expect to be a playoff team, why not play them. If its all about making the playoffs for a program, then I guess your program or conference should just play a round-robin at the end of the year amongst yourselves. I believe by playing them each year, you would realize what you need to do to get on their level (i.e Kean and Salisbury). I went to Salisbury and even though I never had the opporturnity of beating Wesley, I enjoyed every bit of the competition, it allowed me to measure myself against some of the top athletes in Division III. Even though the game was a conference and rivalry game, we always said if we do not play them now, we would have to eventually play them in the playoffs or even twice in season to get to a National Championship. We said if you want to be National Champions, we have beat the best and to beat the best, you have to schedule and play the best. Nevertheless, if your'e a true competitor it doesn't matter if you play Whitewater, Mount Union, or Wesley @ week 1 or week 15, you still have to play them and beat them to win a national championship.

Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: jknezek on June 20, 2012, 12:22:34 pm
Point of Order, Frostburg and Salisbury have never been NJAC members.

Dang fat fingers. Rejoin/join... I need a better stinking editor...  +1 for the correction
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Ralph Turner on June 20, 2012, 12:48:38 pm
I am enjoying the discussion.  Any shuffling that we see will be to maintain the conference AQ within travel budgets of the conference members.

I really don't care how the teams in another region handle their alignmetns. I am just glad that conferences are working to get the AQ's and to keep them.

Yes, Wesley is a tough one.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Pat Coleman on June 25, 2012, 01:37:33 pm
Another move that has been lurking out there that could help the CAC add football.

http://www.d3sports.com/notables/2012/06/southern-virginia-to-join-cac

The geography of Southern Virginia being added (near Lexington, Va.) may swing a school such as Averett or elsewhere in the USA South to consider switching leagues.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Ralph Turner on June 25, 2012, 03:21:39 pm
Another move that has been lurking out there that could help the CAC add football.

http://www.d3sports.com/notables/2012/06/southern-virginia-to-join-cac

The geography of Southern Virginia being added (near Lexington, Va.) may swing a school such as Averett or elsewhere in the USA South to consider switching leagues.
Did the Capital AC make a better offer to Southern Virginia than the USA South?

Did the USA South even talk to Southern Virginia?
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: SUADC on June 25, 2012, 03:22:05 pm
Another move that has been lurking out there that could help the CAC add football.

http://www.d3sports.com/notables/2012/06/southern-virginia-to-join-cac

The geography of Southern Virginia being added (near Lexington, Va.) may swing a school such as Averett or elsewhere in the USA South to consider switching leagues.

Yeah, I believe the addition of Southern Virginia may swing some schools to the CAC. Other than football, the conference is well represented in all other sports. The addition of CNU helps in all sports, I know Salisbury and CNU have great rivalry games in baseball, softball, volleyball, and football. I know in the past that Averett played teams in the ACFC freqently. There may be other non-NCAA teams on the horizon, I would still love for Catholic, Galudet, and Stevenson to join. Catholic and Galudet are charter members and Stevenson vs. Salisbury in Lacrosse is always an epic match-up.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Ralph Turner on June 25, 2012, 03:27:24 pm
Another move that has been lurking out there that could help the CAC add football.

http://www.d3sports.com/notables/2012/06/southern-virginia-to-join-cac

The geography of Southern Virginia being added (near Lexington, Va.) may swing a school such as Averett or elsewhere in the USA South to consider switching leagues.

Yeah, I believe the addition of Southern Virginia may swing some schools to the CAC. Other than football, the conference is well represented in all other sports. The addition of CNU helps in all sports, I know Salisbury and CNU have great rivalry games in baseball, softball, volleyball, and football. I know in the past that Averett played teams in the ACFC freqently. There may be other non-NCAA teams on the horizon, I would still love for Catholic, Galudet, and Stevenson to join. Catholic and Galudet are charter members and Stevenson vs. Salisbury in Lacrosse is always an epic match-up.
For newbies to this message board...

Catholic left the CAC to form the Landmark Conference, and affiliate with the ODAC for football.
Gallaudet left the CAC to join the North East Athletic Conference
Stevenson is leaving the CAC for the MAC in all sports.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: SUADC on June 25, 2012, 05:23:46 pm
Another move that has been lurking out there that could help the CAC add football.

http://www.d3sports.com/notables/2012/06/southern-virginia-to-join-cac

The geography of Southern Virginia being added (near Lexington, Va.) may swing a school such as Averett or elsewhere in the USA South to consider switching leagues.

Yeah, I believe the addition of Southern Virginia may swing some schools to the CAC. Other than football, the conference is well represented in all other sports. The addition of CNU helps in all sports, I know Salisbury and CNU have great rivalry games in baseball, softball, volleyball, and football. I know in the past that Averett played teams in the ACFC freqently. There may be other non-NCAA teams on the horizon, I would still love for Catholic, Galudet, and Stevenson to join. Catholic and Galudet are charter members and Stevenson vs. Salisbury in Lacrosse is always an epic match-up.
For newbies to this message board...

Catholic left the CAC to form the Landmark Conference, and affiliate with the ODAC for football.
Gallaudet left the CAC to join the North East Athletic Conference
Stevenson is leaving the CAC for the MAC in all sports.

Yeah, I know. I can still wish.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Teamski on June 28, 2012, 12:18:49 am
Yeah, that sux that Stevenson left right at the wrong time for the CAC to gain some steam for getting Football added to the ticket. However,  I think it is just a matter of time for the CAC to gain football and with that, a home for Wesley Football.   Good news seeing SVU coming on board!

-Ski
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: PA_wesleyfan on June 28, 2012, 11:47:39 pm
The one fly in the ointment could be Frostburg St. They dropped Wesley like a hot potato from their schedule as soon as the ACFC commitment was over. So much for the CAC teams playing each other..  If you remember they refused to change there schedule the first season of the  ACFC existence. So I wouldn't be suprised if they held things up again.



 Some of the discussion here about the CAC and another conference combining for football may be in the future!
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: CNU85 on July 08, 2012, 02:39:18 pm
Nice....A CAC football board. Gotta love it! I can assure evryone that there will be an AQ opportunity for CAC football schools. Trible would not have agreed to move to the CAC without it. And the man makes things happen. It will not take as long as people think. In fact, I bet there is a plan in place and in motion to make it a reality. I'm sure the SVU situation was known when CNU switched. Time for CNU football to take it up a notch. SU and Wesley....every  year....yikes! At least Wesley Dad and I can take turns buying rounds! I got the first round!
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: wesleydad on July 11, 2012, 10:24:15 pm
cnu, looking forward to it when it happens.  easy trip for me to cnu and really like the team.  wesley, salisbury, cnu, pretty good top of a conference.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: jmccloskey on July 12, 2012, 09:13:39 pm
Actually, the CAC and Empire 8 could join together for football without affecting any regular season scheduling.  The CAC members could be made associate members of the E8 for football only.  Each conference would be it's own division within the E8 for football, and play a separate schedule.  Then the two division champions play in the conference championship game for the automatic bid.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 12, 2012, 11:09:51 pm
Perhaps but that conference championship game would have to come out of the 10 games. The conference championship game is only exempt from the 10-game schedule when a conference has 12 teams, same as in D-I.

It's actually a D-III rule that D-I co-opted. :)
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: jmccloskey on July 20, 2012, 04:32:44 am
It's worth noting, the five football playing members of the CAC (as of July 1), produced three bids to last year's NCAA tournament.

Gallaudet, obviously, won't be joining the CAC for football, and the conference would have no reason to ask them back.  Though the CAC is a better geographic fit, the Bison have found their home in the ECFC.  They would never be competitive in the CAC.  In the ECFC, they can be....
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: SUADC on July 20, 2012, 06:45:50 pm
It's worth noting, the five football playing members of the CAC (as of July 1), produced three bids to last year's NCAA tournament.

Gallaudet, obviously, won't be joining the CAC for football, and the conference would have no reason to ask them back.  Though the CAC is a better geographic fit, the Bison have found their home in the ECFC.  They would never be competitive in the CAC.  In the ECFC, they can be....

There are many teams in other conferences that aren't competitive in any sport or just barely in one or two sports. The main goal for any progam is to be competitive and win. However, I believe there are many other factors in joining a conference. If being competitive was the only reason, you would see many sub-par teams in many conferences trying to join together to form a conference. 
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Captain Bob on July 26, 2012, 02:08:21 pm
Penn. State Harrisburg is joining the CAC next year as well.  Their athletics website (http://harrisburg.psu.edu/athletics/) indicates they don't yet sponsor football, but maybe that would change with a new conference.

Edit - I found the CAC press release (http://www.cacsports.com/general_releases/gen1112/PSH_membership_release.pdf)

Quote
"[...] Penn State Harrisburg and Southern Virginia are developing NCAA Division III programs and will surprise many with their competitiveness and success.  The CAC is
already a strong conference, and these new members will make it even stronger,Ē Byrnes said.

Penn State Harrisburg became a full member of NCAA Division III in 2010 and is currently a member
of the NorthEast Athletic Conference (NEAC).  The Lions, who sponsor 12 varsity sports but have plans to add
more in the next few years, have finished second in the NEACís Commissionerís Cup in each of the past two
seasons.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Ralph Turner on July 27, 2012, 11:50:28 pm
Penn. State Harrisburg is joining the CAC next year as well.  Their athletics website (http://harrisburg.psu.edu/athletics/) indicates they don't yet sponsor football, but maybe that would change with a new conference.

Edit - I found the CAC press release (http://www.cacsports.com/general_releases/gen1112/PSH_membership_release.pdf)

Quote
"[...] Penn State Harrisburg and Southern Virginia are developing NCAA Division III programs and will surprise many with their competitiveness and success.  The CAC is already a strong conference, and these new members will make it even stronger,Ē Byrnes said.

Penn State Harrisburg became a full member of NCAA Division III in 2010 and is currently a member
of the NorthEast Athletic Conference (NEAC).  The Lions, who sponsor 12 varsity sports but have plans to add
more in the next few years, have finished second in the NEACís Commissionerís Cup in each of the past two
seasons.
Thanks Captain Bob.  That  makes sense that the Capital AC is headed towards football.

One other point that I think that we need to recognize is the role of the NEAC as a generator of new athletic programs.

Lots of teams have moved thru the NEAC in the last decade.  The NEAC has provided entry to D-III into other conferences that one might think of as "stronger".

The constraints of travel budgets will temper some of the enthusiasm for current affiliation agreements (especially if a Salisbury and a Frostburg don't have to travel to upstate NY for 6-8 games every biennium.)
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: SUADC on August 23, 2012, 08:43:15 am
Here in Bruxelles, Belgium, the weather in warmer than usual. Just had some free time to read this year's Kickoff. I am very impressed with the detail of every team from top to bottom and some of the featured stories. However, speaking of featured stories, was there any write up on the CAC? If so, please tell me where to look, if not, oh well, I guess I'll have to wait until it becomes official.

If the CAC was in existence this year, I think it would contend for the 2nd or 1st best conferene, just my opinion of course.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Pat Coleman on August 23, 2012, 04:27:54 pm
There is no CAC football at the moment, so we didn't write about it. Glad you enjoyed Kickoff!
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 26, 2012, 01:15:52 pm
CAC football in the immediate term takes a bit of a blow today:

http://www.d3football.com/notables/2012/12/southern-virginia-links-up-with-njac
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Teamski on December 26, 2012, 02:59:55 pm
CAC football in the immediate term takes a bit of a blow today:

http://www.d3football.com/notables/2012/12/southern-virginia-links-up-with-njac

Yeah, that sucks.  Oh well, independent status forever for the Wolverines......  :(

-Ski
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: SUADC on December 26, 2012, 03:20:52 pm
CAC football in the immediate term takes a bit of a blow today:

http://www.d3football.com/notables/2012/12/southern-virginia-links-up-with-njac

Yeah, that sucks.  Oh well, independent status forever for the Wolverines......  :(

-Ski

Yeah, that really does suck for Wesley, I guess that roster size is killing you. Nevertheless, you guys are doing very well as an independent. However, being optimistic, they are affiliate members through 14-15 seasons, which I believe CNU is going to continue to be an affiliate of the USAC conference. I believe they are waiting for some other schools to jump on board, I guess we have to wait at least three more seasons unitl the CAC sponsors football.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: jknezek on December 26, 2012, 05:53:10 pm
A match only the E8 could love. Convenience sure makes ugly bed-fellows. I wonder after a few years of having Huntingdon kick the crud out of them if the USAS will be wishing they had taken SV instead...
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 26, 2012, 05:58:36 pm
A match only the E8 could love. Convenience sure makes ugly bed-fellows. I wonder after a few years of having Huntingdon kick the crud out of them if the USAS will be wishing they had taken SV instead...

The difference is that they have Huntingdon for all sports, whereas if they'd taken SVU, it would only be for football, since SVU was committed to the CAC for all sports.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Ralph Turner on December 26, 2012, 10:04:39 pm
SVU's decision told me how many other CAC schools were contemplating football...  It also told me how many football athletes that SVU anticipated attracting in the near future.

The NJAC will have to figure who gets the "other bye" in the last week when Cortland State plays the "Cortaca" game, but 8 is a nice round number.

Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: jknezek on December 27, 2012, 09:53:26 am
A match only the E8 could love. Convenience sure makes ugly bed-fellows. I wonder after a few years of having Huntingdon kick the crud out of them if the USAS will be wishing they had taken SV instead...

The difference is that they have Huntingdon for all sports, whereas if they'd taken SVU, it would only be for football, since SVU was committed to the CAC for all sports.

Forgot about that. I was looking at it from too limited a perspective. That being said, enjoy the bus rides NJAC. Long way to go (5 hour bus ride at least from College of NJ area), especially if you are the NY programs. SVU and Buena Vista were pretty much a non-entity 12.5 years ago when I left Lexington. Next time I hit W&L, I'll have to take a peek at SVU's campus.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 27, 2012, 01:35:29 pm
A match only the E8 could love. Convenience sure makes ugly bed-fellows. I wonder after a few years of having Huntingdon kick the crud out of them if the USAS will be wishing they had taken SV instead...

The difference is that they have Huntingdon for all sports, whereas if they'd taken SVU, it would only be for football, since SVU was committed to the CAC for all sports.

Forgot about that. I was looking at it from too limited a perspective. That being said, enjoy the bus rides NJAC. Long way to go (5 hour bus ride at least from College of NJ area), especially if you are the NY programs. SVU and Buena Vista were pretty much a non-entity 12.5 years ago when I left Lexington. Next time I hit W&L, I'll have to take a peek at SVU's campus.

I scouted out SVU's campus in the summer of 2011. It is really not impressive. Small, old buildings, not a lot of great-looking facilities. The comparables are not good -- it reminded me of Fisk, but less urban. Or Martin Luther.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: jknezek on December 27, 2012, 02:20:51 pm
A match only the E8 could love. Convenience sure makes ugly bed-fellows. I wonder after a few years of having Huntingdon kick the crud out of them if the USAS will be wishing they had taken SV instead...

The difference is that they have Huntingdon for all sports, whereas if they'd taken SVU, it would only be for football, since SVU was committed to the CAC for all sports.

Forgot about that. I was looking at it from too limited a perspective. That being said, enjoy the bus rides NJAC. Long way to go (5 hour bus ride at least from College of NJ area), especially if you are the NY programs. SVU and Buena Vista were pretty much a non-entity 12.5 years ago when I left Lexington. Next time I hit W&L, I'll have to take a peek at SVU's campus.

I scouted out SVU's campus in the summer of 2011. It is really not impressive. Small, old buildings, not a lot of great-looking facilities. The comparables are not good -- it reminded me of Fisk, but less urban. Or Martin Luther.

Yeah. I wouldn't want to say anything bad without visiting the school, but Buena Vista is definitely "the wrong side of the tracks" compared to W&L and VMI in Lexington. Less than 5 miles apart. I don't think most of us in Lexington even knew SVU was there until the men's soccer team played them, around 1997 or 98 maybe. We visited Lex two years ago for my 10th reunion and we stayed in a campground in Buena Vista. Still pretty unimpressive town.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Ralph Turner on December 27, 2012, 06:15:20 pm
A match only the E8 could love. Convenience sure makes ugly bed-fellows. I wonder after a few years of having Huntingdon kick the crud out of them if the USAS will be wishing they had taken SV instead...

The difference is that they have Huntingdon for all sports, whereas if they'd taken SVU, it would only be for football, since SVU was committed to the CAC for all sports.

Forgot about that. I was looking at it from too limited a perspective. That being said, enjoy the bus rides NJAC. Long way to go (5 hour bus ride at least from College of NJ area), especially if you are the NY programs. SVU and Buena Vista were pretty much a non-entity 12.5 years ago when I left Lexington. Next time I hit W&L, I'll have to take a peek at SVU's campus.

I scouted out SVU's campus in the summer of 2011. It is really not impressive. Small, old buildings, not a lot of great-looking facilities. The comparables are not good -- it reminded me of Fisk, but less urban. Or Martin Luther.

Yeah. I wouldn't want to say anything bad without visiting the school, but Buena Vista is definitely "the wrong side of the tracks" compared to W&L and VMI in Lexington. Less than 5 miles apart. I don't think most of us in Lexington even knew SVU was there until the men's soccer team played them, around 1997 or 98 maybe. We visited Lex two years ago for my 10th reunion and we stayed in a campground in Buena Vista. Still pretty unimpressive town.
Yes, kinda the difference between old line Southern aristocracy (VMI and W&L) and an upstart Mormon resurrection project (http://svu.edu/about/history) that is less than 15 years old.  I think that it will take about another 30-40 years, when the early graduates from the last decade are in the 50's and 60's to begin for the university to grow in stature relative to its nearby institutions of higher learning.

We know that Mormons tithe. Look at the philanthropic contributions that the Main Stream Media did not trumpet about Mitt Romney's generosity. He gave his inheritance to charities!  The SVU alumni will support the alma mater generously.
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: D3MAFAN on June 28, 2013, 04:21:02 pm
I think Alfred State, Salisbury, Frostburg St., CNU, SVU, Wesley, along with the SCAC teams should join up, the SCAC teams should just play their normal opponents and one teams from the aforementioned teams listed...See I figured it out. 8-)
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: luvapontiac on October 31, 2013, 03:09:10 pm
Wow...same people still post here after so many years! :)
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: Ralph Turner on October 31, 2013, 03:13:27 pm
Wow...same people still post here after so many years! :)
I was thinking about posting on this site earlier this week when I saw that Alfred State comment.  It seemed to me that the E8 would want Alfred State if/when Frostburg St and Salisbury left.

I remain optimistic that the CAC will have a Pool A bid by 2020.

(It is just my guess, but Penn St Harrisburg looks like the next likely candidate to add a team.  And to fill out the schedule to make 8 teams once the Pool A bid is earned, Apprentice would make a nice addition to even out the schedule.)
Title: Re: Capital Athletic Conference Football?
Post by: @d3jason on November 01, 2013, 07:05:48 am
That would be an interesting addition. I've always though that most of the students that go to the Penn State satellite campuses are there for a year or two and then transfer to main campus. (That's what my cousin did, but that was 20 years ago.)