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Posting Up (Division III basketball) => Men's Basketball => Multi-Regional Topics => Topic started by: Greek Tragedy on October 06, 2018, 10:57:39 pm

Title: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on October 06, 2018, 10:57:39 pm
I booked my hotel reservations for Salem Fort Wayne today. Am I the first?  ??? :P ::) ;D. It's only 5 1/2 hours away and I got a hotel with a pool, so wife and son will be happy.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on October 06, 2018, 11:50:49 pm
Should probably mention this now ... championship weekend will be buried in the middle of D1 conference championships this year. Quirk of the calendar (remember 2013?).

And Pat already has you beat ... he's been to the facility already. No comment on whether he plans to just stay there until March.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: ronk on October 07, 2018, 01:22:02 am
I booked my hotel reservations for Salem Fort Wayne today. Am I the first?  ??? :P ::) ;D. It's only 5 1/2 hours away and I got a hotel with a pool, so wife and son will be happy.

 Don't go there by train - when Ft. Wayne(predecessor of the Detroit Pistons) was in the NBA, the train stop was miles outside of town and the Celtics had to hitchhike or get a taxi to complete their trip from the stop.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on October 07, 2018, 01:33:01 am
I'm not sure why you'd cite a factoid from the 1950s in this case, ronk ... but the interesting (and relevant) truth is that it's still true today. Amtrak doesn't come any closer to Fort Wayne than Waterloo Station, which is 25 miles north of the city and has no buslines or any other form of public transportation connecting it to the city.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on October 07, 2018, 06:29:52 am
Should probably mention this now ... championship weekend will be buried in the middle of D1 conference championships this year. Quirk of the calendar (remember 2013?).

And Pat already has you beat ... he's been to the facility already. No comment on whether he plans to just stay there until March.

If Pat ends up staying at the Coliseum, then I'm the first since he won't need to book a hotel reservation!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: 89Pirate on October 17, 2018, 07:19:16 pm
I must have missed something...Fort Wayne, IN?  Not Salem?  For how many years?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on October 17, 2018, 09:20:35 pm
I must have missed something...Fort Wayne, IN?  Not Salem?  For how many years?

The bid for men's basketball was given to Fort Wayne, IN starting this season and for four seasons. After 23 years, Salem is no more for men's basketball. Not sure it will return.

Women's basketball will be at Roanoke College, in Salem, this season and two years later.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on January 01, 2019, 07:54:20 pm
A little food for thought here...

I'm probably in the less than 1% here that is going to the Final Four regardless if my team I support makes it there or not. I suppose there aren't many people that can say that.  Anyway, there's obviously a better chance that Stevens Point doesn't make the Final Four as opposed to being one of the last to play come March. This poses a question for myself and anyone else who would like to make a comment.

What is my dream Final Four? What is YOUR dream Final Four (assuming "your team" doesn't make it)? Who would you want to see most? An all-System Final Four? Pacific, Greenville, Grinnell and U of NE? The undefeateds? Nebraska Wesleyan, Hamilton, Whitewater and Scranton? The preseason top 4? Nebraska Wesleyan, Oshkosh, Augustana and Whitman? Teams you've never seen before?

I really don't know the answer to that. What do you think?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: nescac1 on January 01, 2019, 09:30:47 pm
Greek Tragedy:

NWU (loaded defending champ)
Whitman (deep, talented, unusual pace and style)
Williams (my team, four top-notch players who are all fun to watch, massive lineup)
Wheaton (need an underdog, most fun individual player)

Others who would be fun: Hamilton, MIT, Whitewater, Augustana
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on January 02, 2019, 09:19:48 am

I think NWU, Whitman, Williams, and Augustana would be the best competition-wise, but I'd love to see MIT matchup with people and the media coverage of Yeshiva would be pretty cool to have as part of it.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: fantastic50 on January 02, 2019, 07:08:15 pm
Four teams that would bring thousands of fans to Fort Wayne... Hope, Wooster, IWU, and Marietta.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 02, 2019, 07:21:58 pm
Four teams that would bring thousands of fans to Fort Wayne... Hope, Wooster, IWU, and Marietta.

The Chamber of Commerce loves your thinking!  All four are close enough to bring lots of fans (and at least the first three have rabid fans who travel well), yet not close enough to avoid overnight stays and dining!  That line-up would likely result in the most lucrative final four for the host community EVER!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on January 02, 2019, 07:51:50 pm
St Joseph - Jim Calhoun would bring a little national attention and a first year program having a shot.

MIT vs Caltech - Caltech of the east vs MIT of the west would be cool. Plus who wouldn't love to see Caltech have success.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: augie77 on January 02, 2019, 08:06:26 pm
Four teams that would bring thousands of fans to Fort Wayne... Hope, Wooster, IWU, and Marietta.

The Chamber of Commerce loves your thinking!  All four are close enough to bring lots of fans (and at least the first three have rabid fans who travel well), yet not close enough to avoid overnight stays and dining!  That line-up would likely result in the most lucrative final four for the host community EVER!

Hope, Wooster and Marietta ranked 1-2-3 in D3 attendance last year.  Based strictly on Chamber of Commerce aspirations I'd replace IWU with Augustana, who came in fourth last year.  IWU has historically travelled well, and would still bring a sizable crowd, but Augie draws far better these days, at least for home attendance.  According to NCAA attendance statistics Augustana averaged 1,218 fans per game last year compared to IWU at 797.  This season the numbers are even more pronounced, with Augie prevailing in that category 1,330 to 575.  It also bears noting that at the Rhodes College Tournament in Memphis last month, Augustana appeared to have more fans than the other three schools combined (host Rhodes, Centre, and Blackburn) despite the 550 miles separating Rock Island, Illinois and Memphis. 
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on January 02, 2019, 08:33:25 pm
Four teams that would bring thousands of fans to Fort Wayne... Hope, Wooster, IWU, and Marietta.

The Chamber of Commerce loves your thinking!  All four are close enough to bring lots of fans (and at least the first three have rabid fans who travel well), yet not close enough to avoid overnight stays and dining!  That line-up would likely result in the most lucrative final four for the host community EVER!

Hope, Wooster and Marietta ranked 1-2-3 in D3 attendance last year.  Based strictly on Chamber of Commerce aspirations I'd replace IWU with Augustana, who came in fourth last year.  IWU has historically travelled well, and would still bring a sizable crowd, but Augie draws far better these days, at least for home attendance.  According to NCAA attendance statistics Augustana averaged 1,218 fans per game last year compared to IWU at 797.  This season the numbers are even more pronounced, with Augie prevailing in that category 1,330 to 575.  It also bears noting that at the Rhodes College Tournament in Memphis last month, Augustana appeared to have more fans than the other three schools combined (host Rhodes, Centre, and Blackburn) despite the 550 miles separating Rock Island, Illinois and Memphis.
Attendence figures for those wondering
1) Hope - 1981
2) Wooster - 1474
3) Augustana - 1330
4) Marietta - 1208
5) UW-Stevens Point - 1172
then a gap to those below
6) Albright - 848
7) Whitworth - 774
...
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: fantastic50 on January 02, 2019, 09:26:52 pm
On a different 2019 NCAA tournament topic, there will be a Pool B bid this year, along with 43 Pool A and 20 Pool C bids. The Pool B berth will likely go to an AEC team (maybe Neumann), rather than an ACAA or independent team. However, while the AEC will hold a conference tournament, the berth won't necessarily go to the champion.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on January 03, 2019, 06:39:40 am
On a different 2019 NCAA tournament topic, there will be a Pool B bid this year, along with 43 Pool A and 20 Pool C bids. The Pool B berth will likely go to an AEC team (maybe Neumann), rather than an ACAA or independent team. However, while the AEC will hold a conference tournament, the berth won't necessarily go to the champion.

Don't forget Thomas More is in the ACAA this year, their last before leaving the NCAA.  They're going to play a lot more non-d3 games than the AEC teams will, but they'll have competitive numbers with the top AEC teams, especially if the AEC beats each other up in conference.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on January 04, 2019, 05:46:55 pm
Four teams that would bring thousands of fans to Fort Wayne... Hope, Wooster, IWU, and Marietta.

The Chamber of Commerce loves your thinking!  All four are close enough to bring lots of fans (and at least the first three have rabid fans who travel well), yet not close enough to avoid overnight stays and dining!  That line-up would likely result in the most lucrative final four for the host community EVER!

Hope, Wooster and Marietta ranked 1-2-3 in D3 attendance last year.  Based strictly on Chamber of Commerce aspirations I'd replace IWU with Augustana, who came in fourth last year.  IWU has historically travelled well, and would still bring a sizable crowd, but Augie draws far better these days, at least for home attendance.  According to NCAA attendance statistics Augustana averaged 1,218 fans per game last year compared to IWU at 797.  This season the numbers are even more pronounced, with Augie prevailing in that category 1,330 to 575.  It also bears noting that at the Rhodes College Tournament in Memphis last month, Augustana appeared to have more fans than the other three schools combined (host Rhodes, Centre, and Blackburn) despite the 550 miles separating Rock Island, Illinois and Memphis.
Attendence figures for those wondering
1) Hope - 1981
2) Wooster - 1474
3) Augustana - 1330
4) Marietta - 1208
5) UW-Stevens Point - 1172
then a gap to those below
6) Albright - 848
7) Whitworth - 774
...

Off the top of my head, I'm pretty confident Stevens Point had the furthest to travel for all four Final Fours they participated in and I can also be pretty confident that we had the most support in Salem each and every time.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 04, 2019, 08:21:33 pm
Four teams that would bring thousands of fans to Fort Wayne... Hope, Wooster, IWU, and Marietta.

The Chamber of Commerce loves your thinking!  All four are close enough to bring lots of fans (and at least the first three have rabid fans who travel well), yet not close enough to avoid overnight stays and dining!  That line-up would likely result in the most lucrative final four for the host community EVER!

Hope, Wooster and Marietta ranked 1-2-3 in D3 attendance last year.  Based strictly on Chamber of Commerce aspirations I'd replace IWU with Augustana, who came in fourth last year.  IWU has historically travelled well, and would still bring a sizable crowd, but Augie draws far better these days, at least for home attendance.  According to NCAA attendance statistics Augustana averaged 1,218 fans per game last year compared to IWU at 797.  This season the numbers are even more pronounced, with Augie prevailing in that category 1,330 to 575.  It also bears noting that at the Rhodes College Tournament in Memphis last month, Augustana appeared to have more fans than the other three schools combined (host Rhodes, Centre, and Blackburn) despite the 550 miles separating Rock Island, Illinois and Memphis.
Attendence figures for those wondering
1) Hope - 1981
2) Wooster - 1474
3) Augustana - 1330
4) Marietta - 1208
5) UW-Stevens Point - 1172
then a gap to those below
6) Albright - 848
7) Whitworth - 774
...

I'm fascinated that Albright drew well enough to land this high in the attendance rankings. Unlike the other programs listed here, which are perennial powers (that have large townie followings), Albright's men's basketball legacy is a fairly modest one -- five appearances in the 44 years that the D3 tourney has been held, with a 4-6 record -- and prior to the Lions' 20-7 season last year that culminated in a tourney appearance (and first-round loss to Springfield), they had had four decidedly mediocre seasons. But a cursory glance at the box scores for those mediocre seasons tells me that the Lions drew fairly well even then.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: saratoga on January 04, 2019, 09:49:58 pm

What's even harder for me to believe are the attendance numbers for Scranton over the past 10 years.

When I was in college they routinely drew several thousand each home game & the weekends were a zoo.

We used to have a student section that was merciless on the opposition, now maybe 10 kids sit there.

The chants of, "if you can't go to college, go to Kings" can still be heard if you listen closely.

One game against Susquehanna, some kids at Scranton went to high school with a player now at Susquehanna & when he went to the free throw line late in a tight game, they got the whole student section to chant, "Ginny's pregnant" as they knew both he & his high school girlfriend. He missed the front end.

Every possession for the opposition had a designated villain and the noise level inside the Long Center would be deafening.

Currently, if they draw 300 on a week night, that's about average.

Several years ago, the women drew more than the men.

No idea why there is such a lack of student support but clearly the students don't come out to any games until the playoffs begin and, that's unfortunate for the players who really deserve far more support than they currently receive.

Maybe Danzig needs to borrow some of Bess's old tuxedo's he'd wear to fire up the fan base but they clearly need to do something to generate on-campus interest.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on January 05, 2019, 12:17:34 pm
Sadly, now-a-days most of those chants would be considered offensive, technical fouls would be given and students would be escorted out.

I remember a few years ago when new Wisconsin high school chant rules came out and you couldn't even yell, "scoreboard" etc...sad.

http://www.sportingnews.com/us/ncaa-basketball/news/wisconsin-hs-sports-banned-chants-cheers-wiaa-high-school-athletics-sportsmanship/zfkhur3n30xm10sg0ruj1hxls
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: SaintPaulite on January 05, 2019, 05:36:13 pm
Most fortunately, not everyplace is Wisconsin. Most places those things are still just fine.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on January 05, 2019, 11:41:33 pm

HS sports have been going this way for a while.  Pretty much anything directed at the other team besides "good game," is going to be pushed out.  I don't really mind - it's High School.  I yelled some pretty terrible things at the top of my lungs during those years and it was not good for me.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ralph Turner on January 06, 2019, 02:34:56 pm

HS sports have been going this way for a while.  Pretty much anything directed at the other team besides "good game," is going to be pushed out.  I don't really mind - it's High School.  I yelled some pretty terrible things at the top of my lungs during those years and it was not good for me.

...like every time the opposing coach got out of his seat...

"Sit down, Bus driver!"
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 06, 2019, 02:57:52 pm
On a different 2019 NCAA tournament topic, there will be a Pool B bid this year, along with 43 Pool A and 20 Pool C bids. The Pool B berth will likely go to an AEC team (maybe Neumann), rather than an ACAA or independent team. However, while the AEC will hold a conference tournament, the berth won't necessarily go to the champion.

This has happened before in odder setups... SCAC had to give it's AQ to Trinity when they lost in the conference title game to Colorado College (I think) who wasn't eligible for the NCAA tournament as of yet.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ralph Turner on January 06, 2019, 05:47:58 pm
On a different 2019 NCAA tournament topic, there will be a Pool B bid this year, along with 43 Pool A and 20 Pool C bids. The Pool B berth will likely go to an AEC team (maybe Neumann), rather than an ACAA or independent team. However, while the AEC will hold a conference tournament, the berth won't necessarily go to the champion.

This has happened before in odder setups... SCAC had to give it's AQ to Trinity when they lost in the conference title game to Colorado College (I think) who wasn't eligible for the NCAA tournament as of yet.
Are you thinking about B-SC in 2011 (moving from D-1 to the SCAC) when they won the East Division of the SCAC but were not eligible for the SCAC post-season tourney, So,B-SC beat Franciscan OH and Covenant in a post-season tourney Steubenville OH? SCAC-East runner-up Centre won the SCAC bid and then lost to Marietta in the 1st round.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 06, 2019, 07:07:25 pm
I think Dave might be thinking of 2014, when Trinity and Centenary (La.) went to the SCAC tournament final but since Centenary wasn't eligible for the NCAA Tournament, Trinity clinched the AQ by reaching the final. (Trinity did win the game as well.)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 07, 2019, 12:52:52 am
I think Dave might be thinking of 2014, when Trinity and Centenary (La.) went to the SCAC tournament final but since Centenary wasn't eligible for the NCAA Tournament, Trinity clinched the AQ by reaching the final. (Trinity did win the game as well.)

THAT'S who I was thinking of... yes. Thanks. Colorado College didn't seem right, but I didn't have time (Hoopsville preps) to double-check.

I think Trinity clinched the AQ by being the best team in the league? I seem to remember it falling back to the season winner. But I was also sure Trinity lost ... but clearly, I was wrong with that fact as well.

Brain is mush ... need a cache clear I guess.

Thank you.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 30, 2019, 01:44:36 pm
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Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 04, 2019, 05:02:25 pm
What a weekend!

It was one of those sets of days we have seen often in Division III where at every turn there was something to watch, a result to ponder, and upset to breakdown. The hardwoods across the country had games worth watching all with just three weeks left in the regular season.

It started with Dave and Pat's trip to Holland, Michigan to witness the 200th meeting of Calvin and Hope. The game at DeVos Fieldhouse lived up to expectations. From the crowd to the battle on the court, every moment was a thrill ride.

And the Super Weekend didn't stop there. A number of teams in both Top 25s took losses that not only will shake up the polls, but also shakes up conferences races and adds plenty of intrigue for the first Regional Rankings to be released this week. Oh, and a 200-point explosion from a high-powered offense!

On this special, Monday, edition of Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com), Dave and guests have plenty to try and breakdown. Dave will share his reactions from "The Rivalry" and you will hear one of the crazier stories on how a mom names a son. Plus, hear about the Greenville-Fontbonne game which saw 346 points put on the board. And coaches from Hamilton men and East Texas Baptist women along with one of the top players for WashU women give us insight on how their teams are doing.

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Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: SaintPaulite on February 05, 2019, 07:22:00 pm
I don't see this fitting anywhere else, and I'm on a bus in a snowstorm and bored, so I wanted to start some talk about host sites.

In an ideal world, the top 16 teams would host and this would be easy. Hahahahaha! Yeah, right.

First, I am assuming that St. Thomas, UW-Oshkosh, and Amherst will be hosting women's tournament games.

I hope everyone can agree that Whitman, Nebraska Wesleyan, Augustana, Randolph-Macon, Wooster, MIT, Marietta, and Williams will host if logistically possible. That's half the host sites.

Based on the combination of geography, facility and ability, it seems likely that Swarthmore will host. It would probably be helpful to the committee if Hamilton at least notionally earned a spot. I think Christopher Newport has a good case and a lot of teams can travel to them even from PA and NJ. Either North Central or Loras, but probably not both, seem like strong candidates to host as a UWO replacement in that region. Capital would make 3 hosts in Ohio, but is more accessible from points west than the other two, and still pretty accessible from the east. That's 13.

After this I have no idea. Would the east get another host, maybe Nichols? Maybe New Jersey City? Oswego? I'm kind of out of ideas now, and I'm almost to my stop. :)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 05, 2019, 09:49:26 pm
I hope everyone can agree that Whitman, Nebraska Wesleyan, Augustana, Randolph-Macon, Wooster, MIT, Marietta, and Williams will host if logistically possible. That's half the host sites.

Based on the combination of geography, facility and ability, it seems likely that Swarthmore will host. It would probably be helpful to the committee if Hamilton at least notionally earned a spot. I think Christopher Newport has a good case and a lot of teams can travel to them even from PA and NJ. Either North Central or Loras, but probably not both, seem like strong candidates to host as a UWO replacement in that region. Capital would make 3 hosts in Ohio, but is more accessible from points west than the other two, and still pretty accessible from the east. That's 13.


Too soon in the Great Lakes Region, I think, to be this confident about who would host. If one of these three run-the-table from here on out, they would be strong candidates to host. But running the table is a *big* if. Capital and Marietta both still travel to Wilmington and Mount Union, the current #3 and #4 teams in the OAC, plus the OAC conference tournament is famous for unexpected upsets. Wooster and Wabash both have games left with current NCAC #3 Witt and #4 DuPauw, too.

Probably one or two of those four emerge as good host candidates, but it's pretty easy for the committee to ship them elsewhere if their resumes falter down the stretch.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 05, 2019, 10:48:04 pm
Some of your hosts have to consider geography as well. There is a chance Whitman could be hosting on the women's side as well.

The problem with "agreeing" as to who will host is there are still three weeks of games to be played - and pretty much guarantee nearly everyone, if not everyone, will lose games. Anything is possible and I can't tell you how many predictions before the first regional rankings are revealed just don't stand up.

I usually wait to see how the first rankings shake out and go from there.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: SaintPaulite on February 05, 2019, 10:50:22 pm
I hope everyone can agree that Whitman, Nebraska Wesleyan, Augustana, Randolph-Macon, Wooster, MIT, Marietta, and Williams will host if logistically possible. That's half the host sites.

Based on the combination of geography, facility and ability, it seems likely that Swarthmore will host. It would probably be helpful to the committee if Hamilton at least notionally earned a spot. I think Christopher Newport has a good case and a lot of teams can travel to them even from PA and NJ. Either North Central or Loras, but probably not both, seem like strong candidates to host as a UWO replacement in that region. Capital would make 3 hosts in Ohio, but is more accessible from points west than the other two, and still pretty accessible from the east. That's 13.


Too soon in the Great Lakes Region, I think, to be this confident about who would host. If one of these three run-the-table from here on out, they would be strong candidates to host. But running the table is a *big* if. Capital and Marietta both still travel to Wilmington and Mount Union, the current #3 and #4 teams in the OAC, plus the OAC conference tournament is famous for unexpected upsets. Wooster and Wabash both have games left with current NCAC #3 Witt and #4 DuPauw, too.

Probably one or two of those four emerge as good host candidates, but it's pretty easy for the committee to ship them elsewhere if their resumes falter down the stretch.

I disagree. It will be very, very difficult to put together a bracket without them. It's already not going to be easy.

But yes, obviously the season is not over. But it would be a pretty pointless exercise if it was.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 05, 2019, 11:00:13 pm
The committee will put together a bracket with hosts - that do include what they feel are the top sixteen teams based on NCAA criteria - they can. It is not perfect as we clearly saw last year and geography could force them to have to give hosting to other teams and take it away from one of the top 16.

I talk to the committee chairs multiple times a year on Hoopsville. Just had the chairs on Thursday. Very insightful and they do provide plenty of information. They can't give it all, of course, but it is helpful.

Great Lakes will depend on if hosts are needed, but any team sitting three down on regional rankings is on the outside in for hosting. Not that it won't happen, it just gets less likely. I will even say that the number two teams are not guaranteed hosting. The committee may feel a three or even four ranked team in another region is more worthy via criteria than a two in region. That has happened before and probably will happen again.

And the women's teams hosting the first weekend is a major factor. St. Thomas, Oshkosh, and some others are going to throw a monkey wrench into a lot of things (I don't think Amherst is going to be a factor at all in the men's bracketing) - Whitman as I mentioned could also make things interesting. They wouldn't necessarily shift it to the next deserving host. They will find a team that is a lower seeded team to host where they can still get everyone to the bracket properly and keep the high-ranked team in that pod treated as such (playing a lesser ranked team in the first game and not having a ridiculous second round game - if possible). In other words, they wont shift it straight to the third ranked team in a region necessarily.

It can get pretty complicated.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: SaintPaulite on February 05, 2019, 11:17:18 pm
The committee will put together a bracket with hosts - that do include what they feel are the top sixteen teams based on NCAA criteria - they can. It is not perfect as we clearly saw last year and geography could force them to have to give hosting to other teams and take it away from one of the top 16.

I talk to the committee chairs multiple times a year on Hoopsville. Just had the chairs on Thursday. Very insightful and they do provide plenty of information. They can't give it all, of course, but it is helpful.

Great Lakes will depend on if hosts are needed, but any team sitting three down on regional rankings is on the outside in for hosting. Not that it won't happen, it just gets less likely. I will even say that the number two teams are not guaranteed hosting. The committee may feel a three or even four ranked team in another region is more worthy via criteria than a two in region. That has happened before and probably will happen again.

And the women's teams hosting the first weekend is a major factor. St. Thomas, Oshkosh, and some others are going to throw a monkey wrench into a lot of things (I don't think Amherst is going to be a factor at all in the men's bracketing) - Whitman as I mentioned could also make things interesting. They wouldn't necessarily shift it to the next deserving host. They will find a team that is a lower seeded team to host where they can still get everyone to the bracket properly and keep the high-ranked team in that pod treated as such (playing a lesser ranked team in the first game and not having a ridiculous second round game - if possible). In other words, they wont shift it straight to the third ranked team in a region necessarily.

It can get pretty complicated.

Holy buckets dude did you even read my post? I literally called out as granted those women's hosts from the start (and how do you say "it's too early" and then say "Amherst won't be a factor"?). I don't think you're right about Whitman, I think a Texas site will be favored, but whatever.

I've also literally referenced the conversation with Sam on these boards. You make it sound like I'm totally clueless when I've clearly covered several of the things you call out.

This is really not that complicated, to be honest, not to me, anyway.

If you had the right constraints, a computer program could probably bracket this thing with no human involvement whatsoever. Just rank the teams in the field 1 through 64 with a binary grid for whether or not one school is within 500 miles of another and constraints to keep conference teams from playing each other or whatever. Or you just let it run without that and then switch teams to avoid matchups as needed. Give the computer an objective function (say, give me as close to a ranking total of 130 -- the aggregate of a true snake bracket's ordinal values) and away you go. Obviously it wouldn't get close, and in the cases where you know you don't have enough within 500 miles there would need to be a contingency for that too, but it would do its best. I'm pretty sure I've done more complicated operations.

I bet you'd get some interesting matchups this way that no one ever even thought of, and a much more balanced tournament, to be honest. Like has anyone even thought of Baruch going to Marietta? 499 miles. Found that out just looking at likely "4 seeds" and slotting them into "top 8 host" matchups.

So you can either respond or not or agree or not, but I'd appreciate keeping the "Dave-splaining" to a minimum.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: sac on February 06, 2019, 01:30:18 am
We don't even have to go back that far in history to see what the NCAA might do.  In 2017 we ran into a similar problem.  WashU were in line to host on the men's side but couldn't because their women's program was hosting.   https://d2o2figo6ddd0g.cloudfront.net/5/c/wiqcwti9wk13rx/mbb-bracket-2017.pdf

The West region ended up with one host, Whitman.  Hardin-Simmons, from Texas, was used in the opposite bracket as a defacto Western host site from the South Region.    The West Region in 2017 was "weaker" than it is this year where I think you can make a case for Whitman, NWU and St. Thomas as host worthy, maybe even Lora.  In 2017 it was Whitman and then no one else really.

In the Central Region, UW-River Falls and WashU were in line to host.  The CCIW was a little bit of a mess so a second host site went to UW-Whitewater ranked #3.  WashU was sent to Hope from the Great Lakes Region as the "1" seed.  Hope was ranked #4 in the Great Lakes Region that year.  Hosting was a geography pick "a Chicago pod".

The Great Lakes hosts were Marietta and Hanover.  Marietta's pod was put together with a pod from Rochester, Whitman and Hardin-Simmons....the "fly-in" Sectional.  The Hanover pod went with Hope, River Falls and Whitewater.


I'd draw a big circle within 3 hours of Chicago, there always seems to be a need for one or two pods somewhere in that zone.   Somewhere like North Central or Wabash even Loras could pick up that pod if needed even if they aren't #1 or #2 in the region.  I'd say anyone who falls outside the #1 or #2 slot in the Central or Great Lakes region but is within 3 or 4 hours of Chicago is in play as a host site as long as there is someone who may not be able to host.



2017 we ended up with 6 Great Lakes/Central/West host sites.  We've had years where we had 7



Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 06, 2019, 01:03:05 pm
The committee will put together a bracket with hosts - that do include what they feel are the top sixteen teams based on NCAA criteria - they can. It is not perfect as we clearly saw last year and geography could force them to have to give hosting to other teams and take it away from one of the top 16.

I talk to the committee chairs multiple times a year on Hoopsville. Just had the chairs on Thursday. Very insightful and they do provide plenty of information. They can't give it all, of course, but it is helpful.

Great Lakes will depend on if hosts are needed, but any team sitting three down on regional rankings is on the outside in for hosting. Not that it won't happen, it just gets less likely. I will even say that the number two teams are not guaranteed hosting. The committee may feel a three or even four ranked team in another region is more worthy via criteria than a two in region. That has happened before and probably will happen again.

And the women's teams hosting the first weekend is a major factor. St. Thomas, Oshkosh, and some others are going to throw a monkey wrench into a lot of things (I don't think Amherst is going to be a factor at all in the men's bracketing) - Whitman as I mentioned could also make things interesting. They wouldn't necessarily shift it to the next deserving host. They will find a team that is a lower seeded team to host where they can still get everyone to the bracket properly and keep the high-ranked team in that pod treated as such (playing a lesser ranked team in the first game and not having a ridiculous second round game - if possible). In other words, they wont shift it straight to the third ranked team in a region necessarily.

It can get pretty complicated.

Holy buckets dude did you even read my post? I literally called out as granted those women's hosts from the start (and how do you say "it's too early" and then say "Amherst won't be a factor"?). I don't think you're right about Whitman, I think a Texas site will be favored, but whatever.

I've also literally referenced the conversation with Sam on these boards. You make it sound like I'm totally clueless when I've clearly covered several of the things you call out.

This is really not that complicated, to be honest, not to me, anyway.

If you had the right constraints, a computer program could probably bracket this thing with no human involvement whatsoever. Just rank the teams in the field 1 through 64 with a binary grid for whether or not one school is within 500 miles of another and constraints to keep conference teams from playing each other or whatever. Or you just let it run without that and then switch teams to avoid matchups as needed. Give the computer an objective function (say, give me as close to a ranking total of 130 -- the aggregate of a true snake bracket's ordinal values) and away you go. Obviously it wouldn't get close, and in the cases where you know you don't have enough within 500 miles there would need to be a contingency for that too, but it would do its best. I'm pretty sure I've done more complicated operations.

I bet you'd get some interesting matchups this way that no one ever even thought of, and a much more balanced tournament, to be honest. Like has anyone even thought of Baruch going to Marietta? 499 miles. Found that out just looking at likely "4 seeds" and slotting them into "top 8 host" matchups.

So you can either respond or not or agree or not, but I'd appreciate keeping the "Dave-splaining" to a minimum.

You have to consider that I am not always responding to you. I am responding to your comment but understanding there are many people who read these, so I do talk generically for those who may find it interesting.

BTW - Texas schools can host and still have a NW team host. That was the plan last year. They are islands and a lot of the time they need both to host. It usually, but always, remove one of the top 16 teams from hosting. We have also seen when Emory has had to host to make it three "islands" and removed another hosting opportunity from someone we thought would host. Even Rhodes has hosted (I think more on the women's side) because it allows teams to get to them within 500 miles. However, it once again removes a host we all thought would get one the opening weekend.

Per Amherst, fair point. I don't think Amherst will be in the mix for a hosting opportunity, but you are right that if I am saying it is too soon ... then I shouldn't guess/state that either.

Per the computer idea, if they could rank out the teams that might be interesting. They do use computers to check on previous match-ups, mileage, and other things. The real challenge comes down to who has put in to host (as we learned last year, not everyone actually puts in to host as we have assumed to some degree over the years). Once that blows things up, they might as well just do it themselves.

That said, as you know, ranking the teams 1-64 isn't exactly something that works in DIII. Hell, I'd argue it doesn't really work in DI, either, but in DIII we just don't have enough cross-pollination nor does the mileage restrictions allow it. I know we at D3hoops have tried to "seed" how we think it was seeded in the past and it starts to become a massive headache and time consuming. I think Pat ends up doing it to some degree when we write up the previews, but that's thanks to a few days of thinking on it.

Again ... SaintPaulite, don't take posts especially on this board and others as if I am only talking to you. We have a lot of new people on these boards (who may not post) every singe year who are reading and trying to understand what happens in DIII. I have found in the past that if the topics don't explain generic details some of us obviously know, then we are asked about them later in some forum and we go back and explain them anyway. I take advantage of situations where I think it is helpful to remind people in general how things work. Heck, the other day I reminded a long-time poster about something that had been forgotten. I even forget things.

It is a complicated set-up and sometimes it is okay to explain things over again to be helpful. Those times aren't directed at you, SaintPaulite.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: SaintPaulite on February 06, 2019, 01:28:32 pm
We don't even have to go back that far in history to see what the NCAA might do.  In 2017 we ran into a similar problem.  WashU were in line to host on the men's side but couldn't because their women's program was hosting.   https://d2o2figo6ddd0g.cloudfront.net/5/c/wiqcwti9wk13rx/mbb-bracket-2017.pdf

The West region ended up with one host, Whitman.  Hardin-Simmons, from Texas, was used in the opposite bracket as a defacto Western host site from the South Region.    The West Region in 2017 was "weaker" than it is this year where I think you can make a case for Whitman, NWU and St. Thomas as host worthy, maybe even Lora.  In 2017 it was Whitman and then no one else really.

In the Central Region, UW-River Falls and WashU were in line to host.  The CCIW was a little bit of a mess so a second host site went to UW-Whitewater ranked #3.  WashU was sent to Hope from the Great Lakes Region as the "1" seed.  Hope was ranked #4 in the Great Lakes Region that year.  Hosting was a geography pick "a Chicago pod".

The Great Lakes hosts were Marietta and Hanover.  Marietta's pod was put together with a pod from Rochester, Whitman and Hardin-Simmons....the "fly-in" Sectional.  The Hanover pod went with Hope, River Falls and Whitewater.

I'd draw a big circle within 3 hours of Chicago, there always seems to be a need for one or two pods somewhere in that zone.   Somewhere like North Central or Wabash even Loras could pick up that pod if needed even if they aren't #1 or #2 in the region.  I'd say anyone who falls outside the #1 or #2 slot in the Central or Great Lakes region but is within 3 or 4 hours of Chicago is in play as a host site as long as there is someone who may not be able to host.

2017 we ended up with 6 Great Lakes/Central/West host sites.  We've had years where we had 7

Thanks, this is much more what I was hoping to get for a response. And I'm thinking along similar lines. It seems hard to make it all work without Loras or North Central (maybe both) since you don't have Oshkosh or St. Thomas, and I think it would be a horrible injustice if Nebraska Wesleyan didn't host. One thing I don't know is if North Central will even be available. They apparently have a men's volleyball team and scheduled home games for that weekend. So maybe UW-Lax is in this too? I also had a crazy idea that you could pod at St. Norbert as a stand in for Oshkosh, since they're so close together. I have no idea if that would be considered. I think Capital is stronger than Wabash, so I'm hoping that works well enough for a "western" GL site.

6 sitings for 3 regions seems par, really. That should be the minimum expectation for the strongest part of the country. It might not happen some years because of St. Thomas's women's team. A St. John's pod doesn't look very likely, bc most of the teams that could get there you're going to need to get to NWU. so it's Loras or nothing, really. UW-Lax would be pretty close to a west region pod though. I also think the GL sites are going to be needed to get teams out from back east (though Randy Mac and CNU could be good for that as well). Without them you have a really really hard time gluing the country together, I think.

I'd also love to see Pomona Pitzer and Emory fly into weaker pods to strengthen them up a bit. Like an Oswego or some "well, we need 2 more sites" pick from back east -- like NJ City maybe. Pomona is absolutely no doubt flying somewhere, and it doesn't really matter where. And Emory is flying unless either they host, or someone wild like Centre hosts purely for geography. I don't think they can get to either Randy Mac or CNU.

I'm as much or more a geography nerd as basketball, so that's why I get into this maybe earlier than some!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: SaintPaulite on February 06, 2019, 01:33:25 pm

You have to consider that I am not always responding to you. I am responding to your comment but understanding there are many people who read these, so I do talk generically for those who may find it interesting.
(snip)

It is a complicated set-up and sometimes it is okay to explain things over again to be helpful. Those times aren't directed at you, SaintPaulite.

Oh no no no no no, you are not getting away with that.

This was you.
Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
« Reply #32 on: Yesterday at 10:48:04 pm »
Quote
Some of your hosts have to consider geography as well. There is a chance Whitman could be hosting on the women's side as well.

The problem with "agreeing" as to who will host is there are still three weeks of games to be played - and pretty much guarantee nearly everyone, if not everyone, will lose games. Anything is possible and I can't tell you how many predictions before the first regional rankings are revealed just don't stand up.

I usually wait to see how the first rankings shake out and go from there.
--------
So who is "your" if not a direct reference to me? Of course I had already demonstrated that I have considered geography, hell the whole thing is geography, otherwise you'd just snake draft from the selections (and flip to avoid conference matchups)!

You then quote me directly in the next paragraph and effectively say that my post was a waste of time because too much can happen, and because you usually wait, everyone should.

So no, you can't get away with "oh I was making a general statement" for the good of everyone...because it's obvious that's just not true. You were responding, directly, to me.

I won't respond to the rest of your post because I didn't read it. I'm not sure why you'd have anything else to say on the topic after you already said you don't see any value in talking about it before the regional rankings. But I won't patronize and give you my thoughts without reading yours.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 06, 2019, 02:31:13 pm
I was responding to your example, but speaking in a general way. Yes, I can do that. You cited an example, but I wasn't speaking directly to you. I was trying to explain a larger thing.

Sorry if you don't like that.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 06, 2019, 04:14:18 pm
Here are the first rankings for the men this season: https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2019/02/men-regional-rankings-first
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: SaintPaulite on February 06, 2019, 06:55:59 pm
I was responding to your example, but speaking in a general way. Yes, I can do that. You cited an example, but I wasn't speaking directly to you. I was trying to explain a larger thing.

Sorry if you don't like that.

LOL you literally quoted me. With quotation marks. And used a second person form of address. If you weren't talking directly to me, it sure as heck would be hard for a reasonable person to know it.

Tell ya what, to avoid this in the future, if you are talking directly to me -- quote the post to which you're replying. Otherwise, I'll assume you're just gracing us with your "wisdom" and ignore it. Solved.

Sorry if you don't like me wanting to talk about things before you're ready, and generally being right about most of it.  8-)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: sac on February 07, 2019, 01:31:13 am
We don't even have to go back that far in history to see what the NCAA might do.  In 2017 we ran into a similar problem.  WashU were in line to host on the men's side but couldn't because their women's program was hosting.   https://d2o2figo6ddd0g.cloudfront.net/5/c/wiqcwti9wk13rx/mbb-bracket-2017.pdf

The West region ended up with one host, Whitman.  Hardin-Simmons, from Texas, was used in the opposite bracket as a defacto Western host site from the South Region.    The West Region in 2017 was "weaker" than it is this year where I think you can make a case for Whitman, NWU and St. Thomas as host worthy, maybe even Lora.  In 2017 it was Whitman and then no one else really.

In the Central Region, UW-River Falls and WashU were in line to host.  The CCIW was a little bit of a mess so a second host site went to UW-Whitewater ranked #3.  WashU was sent to Hope from the Great Lakes Region as the "1" seed.  Hope was ranked #4 in the Great Lakes Region that year.  Hosting was a geography pick "a Chicago pod".

The Great Lakes hosts were Marietta and Hanover.  Marietta's pod was put together with a pod from Rochester, Whitman and Hardin-Simmons....the "fly-in" Sectional.  The Hanover pod went with Hope, River Falls and Whitewater.

I'd draw a big circle within 3 hours of Chicago, there always seems to be a need for one or two pods somewhere in that zone.   Somewhere like North Central or Wabash even Loras could pick up that pod if needed even if they aren't #1 or #2 in the region.  I'd say anyone who falls outside the #1 or #2 slot in the Central or Great Lakes region but is within 3 or 4 hours of Chicago is in play as a host site as long as there is someone who may not be able to host.

2017 we ended up with 6 Great Lakes/Central/West host sites.  We've had years where we had 7

Thanks, this is much more what I was hoping to get for a response. And I'm thinking along similar lines. It seems hard to make it all work without Loras or North Central (maybe both) since you don't have Oshkosh or St. Thomas, and I think it would be a horrible injustice if Nebraska Wesleyan didn't host. One thing I don't know is if North Central will even be available. They apparently have a men's volleyball team and scheduled home games for that weekend. So maybe UW-Lax is in this too? I also had a crazy idea that you could pod at St. Norbert as a stand in for Oshkosh, since they're so close together. I have no idea if that would be considered. I think Capital is stronger than Wabash, so I'm hoping that works well enough for a "western" GL site.

6 sitings for 3 regions seems par, really. That should be the minimum expectation for the strongest part of the country. It might not happen some years because of St. Thomas's women's team. A St. John's pod doesn't look very likely, bc most of the teams that could get there you're going to need to get to NWU. so it's Loras or nothing, really. UW-Lax would be pretty close to a west region pod though. I also think the GL sites are going to be needed to get teams out from back east (though Randy Mac and CNU could be good for that as well). Without them you have a really really hard time gluing the country together, I think.

I'd also love to see Pomona Pitzer and Emory fly into weaker pods to strengthen them up a bit. Like an Oswego or some "well, we need 2 more sites" pick from back east -- like NJ City maybe. Pomona is absolutely no doubt flying somewhere, and it doesn't really matter where. And Emory is flying unless either they host, or someone wild like Centre hosts purely for geography. I don't think they can get to either Randy Mac or CNU.

I'm as much or more a geography nerd as basketball, so that's why I get into this maybe earlier than some!

Another way to think of this might be the "replacement host" should probably be within 500 miles of the host being replaced.  That way you don't mess up the seedings to badly.   So anyone within 500 miles of Oshkosh with good criteria could be a potential host site.

With St. Thomas and Oshkosh both being so far North it could be difficult to find a new host site for both if St. Thomas were to get into position to host somehow.  Then seedings would probably take a hit somewhere.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 07, 2019, 03:33:46 pm
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The show will begin with continuing coverage of the UW Stevens Point case that finally wrapped up after more than three-and-a-half years. Athletics Director Brad Duckworth will join us for an exclusive, in-depth, interview about the case, the findings, the punishments, and what it all means for UWSP and the basketball program.

We will then shift into what would be a normal Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) episode talking to teams that are making headlines in the final month of the season. Not only are teams surging, but with Regional Rankings now out the focus on who may be in or may be out of the NCAA Tournament starts to come into focus.

In the WBCA Center Court segment, Dave will also talk with a women's assistant coach who is turning heads not only in the program, but also in the conference and around the country.

Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) is presented by D3hoops.com (https://www.d3hoops.com) and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch Thursday's extended show starting at 7:00 p.m. ET here: http://bit.ly/2SyWv6X (or video Facebook Live and Periscope simulcasts).

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Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: bbfan44 on February 11, 2019, 05:22:31 pm
Is there a "host" hotel in Ft Wayne that might have special rates?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 11, 2019, 05:37:37 pm
Is there a "host" hotel in Ft Wayne that might have special rates?

Wouldn't that be a participating school thing?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: BobbyO on February 11, 2019, 05:53:11 pm
Is there a "host" hotel in Ft Wayne that might have special rates?

Wouldn't that be a participating school thing?

Check out Magnuson Hotel Fort Wayne North - Coliseum  $60 a night 3 miles from game.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 11, 2019, 07:24:13 pm
I've been looking for the hotel that offers special rates to d3boards.com Hall of Famers.

No luck yet.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: bbfan44 on February 11, 2019, 09:12:17 pm
I thought maybe the NCAA might have designated a nearby  hotel to be the main hotel and may have negotiated rates for people attending the Final Four.  I never went to Salem so I don't know how these things work.

I think someone should start a "GoFundMe" page for Sager.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: iwumichigander on February 11, 2019, 10:51:44 pm
The hotels designated by NCAA will be for teams and officials.  Those hotels will have NCAA rates but you usually have find out which ones from the teams. 
Most hotels in Salem had NCAA rates but ... you had to ask for them.  For example, we used to make reservations in Salem well in advance.  Once we knew the team would be in Fianl Four, you call the hotel and ask for the rate.  I would think that might be the case in Ft Wayne. No hotel wants to lose rooms to a competitor.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 13, 2019, 03:21:26 pm
The second week Regional Rankings have been released: https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2019/02/men-regional-rankings-second
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Augie15 on February 14, 2019, 12:55:59 pm
Was bored at work and didn't know if this data was readily available so I complied a list of all the games played in the Division III Tournament from 1975-2018 using the D3Hoops Playoff History Tab. I was wondering who had the most wins, losses, Best win %, and most wins by round. It is all in an excel that I can't post on here since 1) it's excel and 2) it's way too big.

A brief run down of what I found was following:

Top 5 Wins
1. Illinois Wesleyan - 51
2. Wittenberg - 48
3. Williams - 44
4. Franklin & Marshall - 42
5. Amherst - 41

Top 5 Losses
T2. Hope - 27
T1. Wittenberg - 27
T1. Wooster - 27
4. Scranton - 26
5. Franklin & Marshall - 25

Top 5 Win %
1. North Park - 0.862
2. UW-Platteville - 0.821
3. UW-Stevens Point - 0.776
4. Rowan - 0.758
5. Whitman - 0.750

Top 5 Win % (Min. of 25 tournament games played)
1. North Park - 0.862
2. UW-Platteville - 0.821
3. UW-Stevens Point - 0.776
4. Rowan - 0.758
5. Williams - 0.746

Top 5 Win % (Min. of 50 tournament games played)
1. Williams - 0.746
2. Amherst - 0.707
3. Augustana - 0.696
4. Illinois Wesleyan - 0.680
5. UW-Whitewater - 0.679

Top 5 Round of 64 Wins
T1. Illinois Wesleyan - 14
T1. Wooster - 14
3. Wash U - 12
T4. 4 Teams (Hope, John Carroll, UW-Whitewater, and Williams) - 11

Top 5 Round of 32 Wins
1.  Illinois Wesleyan - 18
2. Franklin & Marshall - 17
3. Wittenberg - 16
4. Amherst - 13
T5. 2 Teams (Augustana and Scranton) - 12

Top 5 Sweet 16 Wins
1. Wittenberg - 12
2. Illinois Wesleyan - 11
T3.  4 Teams (Amherst, Augustana, Frankling & Marshall, and Potsdam St.) - 10

Top 5 Elite 8 Wins
1. Williams - 8
T2. Amherst - 7
T2. Wittenberg - 7
4. Illinois Wesleyan 6
T5. 7 Teams (Augustana, Franklin & Marshall, Nebraska Wesleyan, North Park, Potsdam St., UW-Platteville, and UW-Whitewater) - 5

Top 5 Final 4 Wins (Semi Finals)
T1. North Park - 5
T1. Potsdam State - 5
T3. 6 Teams (Augustana, UW-Platteville, UW-Stevens Point, UW-Whitewater, Williams, and Wittenberg) - 4

Top 5 Championships
1. North Park - 5
T2. UW-Platteville - 4
T2. UW-Stevens Point - 4
T2. UW-Whitewater - 4
T5. 6 Teams (Amherst, Calvin, Potsdam St., Scranton, St. Thomas, and Wash U) - 2

Long list, if any one is interested in the complete file, let me know and I can email it to you.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Augie15 on February 14, 2019, 12:58:03 pm
Top 5 Games Played
T1. Illinois Wesleyan - 75
T1. Wittenberg - 75
3. Franklin & Marshall - 67
4. Wooster - 61
T5. 2 Teams (Williams and Scranton) - 59
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 14, 2019, 01:18:42 pm
All my spreadsheets I use for fantasy leagues were either Excel or Open Office.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 14, 2019, 03:12:23 pm
Thanks, Augie15. But some of your numbers are off:

* Wittenberg is 52-28
* Illinois Wesleyan is 54-25
* Williams is 47-15
* F&M is 45-30
* Hope is 32-29
* Wooster is 35-28
* Scranton is 37-28

* UW-Platteville's winning % is .825 (33-7)
* North Park's winning % is .813 (26-6)
* Rowan's winning & is .725 (29-11)
* Williams's winning % is .758 (47-15)
* Amherst's winning % is .672 (41-20)
* Whitman's winning % is .769 (10-3)
* Illinois Wesleyan's winning % is .684 (54-25)

Check pages 8-13 here:

http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/m_basketball_champs_records/2017/DIIIMBB.pdf

... and add these results:

https://d2o2figo6ddd0g.cloudfront.net/u/w/gz6x5j3cpa738j/mbb-bracket-2018.pdf
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Augie15 on February 14, 2019, 03:39:31 pm
Thanks, Augie15. But some of your numbers are off:

* Wittenberg is 52-28
* Illinois Wesleyan is 54-25
* Williams is 47-15
* F&M is 45-30
* Hope is 32-29
* Wooster is 35-28
* Scranton is 37-28

* UW-Platteville's winning % is .825 (33-7)
* North Park's winning % is .813 (26-6)
* Rowan's winning & is .725 (29-11)
* Williams's winning % is .758 (47-15)
* Amherst's winning % is .672 (41-20)
* Whitman's winning % is .769 (10-3)
* Illinois Wesleyan's winning % is .684 (54-25)

Check pages 8-13 here:

http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/m_basketball_champs_records/2017/DIIIMBB.pdf

... and add these results:

https://d2o2figo6ddd0g.cloudfront.net/u/w/gz6x5j3cpa738j/mbb-bracket-2018.pdf

Ahh. I wish I knew about the first link before doing this haha. I believe my numbers are off since I forgot about the 3rd place games.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 14, 2019, 03:51:22 pm
Don't feel too badly about it. I did the exact same thing that you did -- I, too, kept a running tally of D3 tourney stats for years before one day, while wandering through the ncaa.org site looking for something else, I stumbled across the D3 tourney results link.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 17, 2019, 05:04:43 pm
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=n39hj/y3zd18adjie55k0v.jpg)

It is now or never.

The last week of the Division III basketball regular season is here. Conferences will decide who will earn automatic bids to the NCAA Tournaments and teams try and position themselves for at-large bids, hosting opportunities, and bracketing considerations.

For teams who have been faltering, this is the last chance to right the ship. For programs which have underachieved, this is the last opportunity to live up to expectations. And of course for those with Cinderella dreams, this is the chance to try on the glass slipper.

Sunday's Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) will cover it all in a special, extended, episode which for the first time (outside of Marathon programming) will feature a guest from each of the eight regions. We will also discuss which teams may be on the bubble, who has most likely secured at-large bid, and which teams need to win the AQs. Plus, we talk about how regions as we know it now could very well change in the future.

Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. Sunday's show will hit the air at 6:00 p.m. ET. It can be watched live right here: http://bit.ly/2EeG5ZE (and simulcast on Facebook Live and Periscope).

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to dave.mchugh@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options below.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Katherine Bixby, Johns Hopkins women's coach
- Jonathan Crosthwaite, Occidental men's senior
- Marc Brown, NJCU men's coach
- Justin LeBlanc, Millsaps women's coach
- Jamie Seward, SUNY New Paltz women's coach
- Marcos Echevarria, No. 17 Nichols men's senior
- Herman Carmichael, La Roches men's coach
- Klay Knueppel, Wisconsin Luthern women's coach
- Brad Bankston, ODAC Commissioner
- Pat Coleman & Ryan Scott, D3hoops.com (Bubble Talk)

If you enjoy the show via the podcasts, choose your favorite avenue to listen and/or subscribe via the the following four avenues (click on the images when necessary):
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Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ralph Turner on February 19, 2019, 03:01:14 pm
Thanks, Augie15. But some of your numbers are off:

* Wittenberg is 52-28
* Illinois Wesleyan is 54-25
* Williams is 47-15
* F&M is 45-30
* Hope is 32-29
* Wooster is 35-28
* Scranton is 37-28

* UW-Platteville's winning % is .825 (33-7)
* North Park's winning % is .813 (26-6)
* Rowan's winning & is .725 (29-11)
* Williams's winning % is .758 (47-15)
* Amherst's winning % is .672 (41-20)
* Whitman's winning % is .769 (10-3)
* Illinois Wesleyan's winning % is .684 (54-25)

Check pages 8-13 here:

http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/m_basketball_champs_records/2017/DIIIMBB.pdf

... and add these results:

https://d2o2figo6ddd0g.cloudfront.net/u/w/gz6x5j3cpa738j/mbb-bracket-2018.pdf

Ahh. I wish I knew about the first link before doing this haha. I believe my numbers are off since I forgot about the 3rd place games.
+1 Augie15.
Glad to have you on the message boards.
I appreciate your effort and contribution.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Fifth and Putnam on February 19, 2019, 03:37:56 pm
Do we know what time the Selection Show will be Monday?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: fantastic50 on February 19, 2019, 04:06:12 pm
Planned for 12:30pm EST on Monday.

https://www.ncaa.com/news/basketball-men/article/2019-01-03/2019-ncaa-championships-winter-selection-show-schedule
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 20, 2019, 03:37:07 pm
The third public NCAA Division III regional rankings are out: https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2019/02/men-regional-rankings-third
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 21, 2019, 01:49:17 pm
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=nag43/okqvyloab8xsjr9h.jpg)

There are just days left in the regular season and conference tournaments are in full throat. And those vying to get into the NCAA Tournament are already sitting on the proverbial "bubble."

There are two ways to keep dancing in March, either win the conference automatic qualifier (i.e. tournament in most cases) or hope one's resume is good enough to be selected. However, with upsets in conference tournaments come some nervous times for those needing the at-large avenue.

Some teams are already on the bubble, but are they in trouble?

On Thursday's Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com), Dave brings in guests who either have already lost or may need to win. We also enjoy the thrill of victory. And hear from a coach in charge of off-season workouts and practices at her institution. What goes into such a job as most teams start to make the transition to next season.

Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. Thursday's show can be seen LIVE starting at 7:00 p.m. ET right here: http://bit.ly/2NhkfYn (or via Facebook Live and Periscope simulcasts).

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to dave.mchugh@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options to the right.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Cameron Hill, Trinity (Texas) women's coach
- Kristin Karat, Cedar Crest women's coach & Assistant Director for Athletic Performance (WBCA Center Court)
- Jeff Brown, Middlebury men's coach

If you enjoy the show via the podcasts, choose your favorite avenue to listen and/or subscribe via the the following four avenues (click on the images when necessary):
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Don't forget you can always interact with us:
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Email: hoopsville@d3hoops.com
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Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: ronk on February 21, 2019, 04:47:21 pm
Proposed change to NCAA Selection show:
 For the at-large selections, at the table are, for example:
NE-Amherst,E-Rochester,A-Rowan,M/A-Scranton,S-Randy Mac,GL-Wooster,C-Loras,W-Pomona

with the 1st choice, the committee chooses Amherst; Hamilton now come to the table.

and so on through the 20 selections

or

when they announce the brackets, for each team that comes from pool C, announce what # selection that they are.

Again, for example:in the regional to be held @ Swarthmore, NJCU(winner of the NJAC) will meet Rochester(#18 from pool C).

This would give an idea where on the bubble other teams would find themselves in relation to Rochester as the #18 selection.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 21, 2019, 07:02:09 pm
Proposed change to NCAA Selection show:
 For the at-large selections, at the table are, for example:
NE-Amherst,E-Rochester,A-Rowan,M/A-Scranton,S-Randy Mac,GL-Wooster,C-Loras,W-Pomona

with the 1st choice, the committee chooses Amherst; Hamilton now come to the table.

and so on through the 20 selections

or

when they announce the brackets, for each team that comes from pool C, announce what # selection that they are.

Again, for example:in the regional to be held @ Swarthmore, NJCU(winner of the NJAC) will meet Rochester(#18 from pool C).

This would give an idea where on the bubble other teams would find themselves in relation to Rochester as the #18 selection.

ronk -- great idea, but what makes you think that the NCAA will embrace this type of transparency?!  ::) ;)  They don't want a significant number of folks second guessing why someone was chosen as the last Pool C pick and everyone else was left on the table!  :o

Of course, the real irony is that the NCAA proudly states that they support higher education..blah...blah..blah…. so they should be in favor of full transparency...but wait, as long as it doesn't apply to their own selection process! (Heavy sarcasm)  ;D 

They only give us a small peek under the tent by releasing the final regional rankings but of course that still doesn't come close to revealing who was the last Pool C pick or which team has a specific seeding or why they chose a specific team to host games.  ::)

Oxymoron: NCAA Transparency!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 21, 2019, 07:26:19 pm
Do you want a show that takes two hours? LOL

They do tend to give us a sense at the end of where teams came off the table. I am the one who would reveal that info on air ... but I am not sure I would get that info. While the committee chairs tend to be pretty transparent with us, there is some information like that they rather not get too detailed about - mainly for the second-guessing and none-stop phone calls and emails they get.

We can usually figure it out, by the way, once the regional rankings are released officially.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: sac on February 21, 2019, 09:03:32 pm
Do you want a show that takes two hours? LOL

They do tend to give us a sense at the end of where teams came off the table. I am the one who would reveal that info on air ... but I am not sure I would get that info. While the committee chairs tend to be pretty transparent with us, there is some information like that they rather not get too detailed about - mainly for the second-guessing and none-stop phone calls and emails they get.

We can usually figure it out, by the way, once the regional rankings are released officially.

yeah, god forbid they ever have to explain their decisions.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 21, 2019, 09:04:43 pm
No offense Dave but no one wants a 2 hour show to get transparent info.  We just need the NCAA to publish three simple sheets:

Sheet #1: Numerical list of all Seeds in the Bracket from 1 to 64.

Sheet #2: List of all Pool C teams in the order picked.  Bonus: provide the names of teams "on the table" (under consideration) as each Pool C pick was made.

Sheet #3: List of schools by name who applied to be a host site.  Bullet point rationale on how host sites were picked and honesty about where the travel budget was a limiting factor.

We could all read the three sheets in 10 minutes and don't need a 2 hour show.

Why don't you suggest these three sheets the next time you interview a Committee member?

Transparency is the best approach and we don't have it today. :)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 22, 2019, 10:01:13 am

They don't rank teams 1-64, so you're not going to get that one.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 22, 2019, 11:01:17 am
Could be a fairytale ending for Newbury. They close their doors at the end of the school year. The 6th seeded Nighthawks have beaten the 3rd and 2nd seeded teams and now face 4th seeded Mitchell in the NECC Final.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 22, 2019, 11:04:08 am
Nice catch, Tom. You have a nose for a good story.

Ryan, Newbury looks like a great subject for one of your ATN columns.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Rofrog on February 22, 2019, 01:22:11 pm
I would have loved to known!Why Scranton #2 seed few years back,Why they gave only one host in the Middle Atlantic and 3 in the East?( Yes Scranton was shipped up to Brockport st)So transparency--Most Definite From the NCAA.Still waiting for a response from them.Lol
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: wally_wabash on February 22, 2019, 01:25:56 pm
Sheet #2: List of all Pool C teams in the order picked.  Bonus: provide the names of teams "on the table" (under consideration) as each Pool C pick was made.

This part you can reverse engineer with a reasonable degree of accuracy once you see the final RRs.  The water here is a little muddier than it is in football with fewer at-large teams and regions, but I think anybody who follows along closely with the content Dave, Ryan, Matt, and Drew put out can figure out who just made it in and who just didn't.  Good questions post-selection can pull some of those answers almost all the way up to the surface, but in my experience, committee chairs don't tell us who exactly was last in let alone the round by round record for each selection.  They may strongly infer certain things, but they aren't (can't?) say exactly who got picked when in the process. 
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 22, 2019, 01:36:13 pm
Nice catch, Tom. You have a nose for a good story.

Ryan, Newbury looks like a great subject for one of your ATN columns.

Thanks, Greg...if they win!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 22, 2019, 01:46:38 pm
Sheet #2: List of all Pool C teams in the order picked.  Bonus: provide the names of teams "on the table" (under consideration) as each Pool C pick was made.

This part you can reverse engineer with a reasonable degree of accuracy once you see the final RRs.  The water here is a little muddier than it is in football with fewer at-large teams and regions, but I think anybody who follows along closely with the content Dave, Ryan, Matt, and Drew put out can figure out who just made it in and who just didn't.  Good questions post-selection can pull some of those answers almost all the way up to the surface, but in my experience, committee chairs don't tell us who exactly was last in let alone the round by round record for each selection.  They may strongly infer certain things, but they aren't (can't?) say exactly who got picked when in the process.

Just so people also understand, sometimes this information is withheld not because these chairs want to hold it back, but chairs in other sports want to.

Best example, we went years without the final rankings being produced publicly. Basketball and football all pushed for these to be made public and did for a number of years. They were out-voted by other chairs in other sports routinely. Some committee chairs (or others) would then get us the data (#glean) until the Championships Committee finally had enough (I think you can see the changes to that committee as maybe a reason that changed) and told all chairs they had to release the information. Thus, we have final rankings now.

The "last four in; first four out" - while being a little weird with eight teams at the table - is something some chairs have given us when asked and some have not. It has been inconsistent and based on the chair. Some sports absolutely do NOT want this data out (you can draw a straight line to those who didn't want the final rankings out, either). They are probably more insecure about that type of information than others.

So the transparency question is a bit more tricky than people would like to make it. Chairs in basketball, for the most part, are pretty darn transparent. There is certain things they are either told they can't share or because of the temperature with other chairs choose to share it or not. As Wally indicated, we can reverse engineer this stuff pretty often and I don't think it is that big a deal in the long run. We have been able to determine who the last eight teams at the table and thus the last team from each region to be selected for a number of years now.

As for the 1-64 stuff ... I am a bit surprised those who know DIII keep asking for that. We can't properly seed a tournament at our level due to the limitations of bracketing (hell, most NCAA sports even at D1 have similar limitations). It just isn't a realistic thing to ask or expect.

I would have loved to known!Why Scranton #2 seed few years back,Why they gave only one host in the Middle Atlantic and 3 in the East?( Yes Scranton was shipped up to Brockport st)So transparency--Most Definite From the NCAA.Still waiting for a response from them.Lol

This question was raised quite a bit. We asked it in 2013 and it actually turned into one of my lesser interview moments, honestly. The answer had partially to do with Emory needing to host, in the committee's mind, for geographic reasons. There were some other things we were able to figure out, but I think the committee may have botched it as well. However, there was a lot of information received even if it wasn't direct.

However, I will also ask ... what transparency would have given you the answer you were looking for anyway? They were not "seeded" #2 to begin with. They were in the second ranked team in their region. That was about the time the national committee started moving away from "guaranteeing" (or trying to guarantee) the top two regionally ranked teams in each region would host outside of extenuating circumstances (that year, an extra host needed in Emory and Texas). We didn't really realize it at the time, but since then the committee has tried to have their top 16 teams host games and that doesn't mean it has to be the top two regionally ranked teams.

When this sport moves to ten regions, the top two in each region - even the top team - isn't going to be guaranteed this kind of stuff.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 22, 2019, 02:02:47 pm
Could be a fairytale ending for Newbury. They close their doors at the end of the school year. The 6th seeded Nighthawks have beaten the 3rd and 2nd seeded teams and now face 4th seeded Mitchell in the NECC Final.

I suspect a lot of their late success can be attributed to transfer Tank Roberson who came in for second semester.  He spent three seasons at Pine Manor and this fall at Castleton.  He's scored more than 1800 points in his career and is a strong ball-handler and a confident scorer.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 22, 2019, 02:20:30 pm
Over 1,800 points at three different D3 schools? This guy sounds like a story waiting to be told himself.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 22, 2019, 02:22:35 pm
Over 1,800 points at three different D3 schools? This guy sounds like a story waiting to be told himself.

Most of them were at Pine Manor - a really strong team, but most of them graduated last year, so I'm guessing he took the opportunity to go elsewhere.  Not sure the rational for transferring the last semester of your senior year to a school that's closing, but I don't know the details, so I won't judge.  He's also 5'8"
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Rofrog on February 22, 2019, 03:29:52 pm
 Dave please name another time that the number one or two Ranked team in there region didnt host ?Not because of women have the  rights (first week)or they didnt fill out the right paperwork(Ursinus).Dave it always went that way the top two teams.Please show me another case like Scranton?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 22, 2019, 04:28:26 pm
Dave please name another time that the number one or two Ranked team in there region didnt host ?Not because of women have the  rights (first week)or they didnt fill out the right paperwork(Ursinus).Dave it always went that way the top two teams.Please show me another case like Scranton?

Don't have to go that far ... last season. Men had priority in the opening weekend, yet ...

East Region men only saw Plattsburgh host.

Atlantic men only saw Cabrini host.

And in the Central, FOUR teams host: Augustana, UWSP, UWP, and WashU.

Oh, and the Mid-Atlantic had THREE teams host: Christopher Newport, Johns Hopkins, and York (Pa.).

BTW - this may blow your mind... in 2016 when the priority also gave the men all the flexibility they wanted, the East and Atlantic ALSO only saw ONE team host (Stockton and Plattsburgh).

It has not always been the top two. We have moved on from that mentality ... and 2014 might have been our wake-up call.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: sac on February 22, 2019, 09:09:11 pm
Dave please name another time that the number one or two Ranked team in there region didnt host ?Not because of women have the  rights (first week)or they didnt fill out the right paperwork(Ursinus).Dave it always went that way the top two teams.Please show me another case like Scranton?

Don't have to go that far ... last season. Men had priority in the opening weekend, yet ...

East Region men only saw Plattsburgh host.

Atlantic men only saw Cabrini host.

And in the Central, FOUR teams host: Augustana, UWSP, UWP, and WashU.

Oh, and the Mid-Atlantic had THREE teams host: Christopher Newport, Johns Hopkins, and York (Pa.).

BTW - this may blow your mind... in 2016 when the priority also gave the men all the flexibility they wanted, the East and Atlantic ALSO only saw ONE team host (Stockton and Plattsburgh).

It has not always been the top two. We have moved on from that mentality ... and 2014 might have been our wake-up call.
 

UWSP did not host last year, they played North Central at St. John's.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 22, 2019, 09:38:15 pm
Thanks, sac. I got a bit gready. Saw the St. John's host, but when looking at other things somehow transplanted UWSP into that role.

So three hosts. Oops.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: TheOsprey on February 22, 2019, 09:39:58 pm
Both system teams get thrown to the curb, by lower seeds.  Maybe conf. foes are figuring things out, when it counts most.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 22, 2019, 09:45:57 pm
Both system teams get thrown to the curb, by lower seeds.  Maybe conf. foes are figuring things out, when it counts most.

System games have been around for a long time. MWC has seen the system for how many years? Greenville has been in it now for three years. I am not sure I jump on the idea that conf opp are "figuring things out." I think they can beat them for a lot of reasons on any given night.

But I am going to be disappointed Greenville won't be in the NCAAA tournament. This team looked like it could have made the opening weekend interesting.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 22, 2019, 10:20:41 pm
Eureka just beat them by a similar score recently. This result hardly surprised me, if at all. I'm with you though, I would've liked them in this year's tournament. I just don't think Grinnell was that good this year. They had some real stinkers.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: TheOsprey on February 22, 2019, 10:22:29 pm
It seems like both teams fell apart in the second half.  Grinnell was out shot 63% to 28% in the second half(55-23pts) and Greenville gave up 90 pts. to a sub .500 team.  Go figure. 🤔

I too will miss them in the tourney.😔
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Rofrog on February 22, 2019, 10:57:12 pm
 Well Dave if that is the case why have regionally rankings then?For talking points
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Caz Bombers on February 22, 2019, 11:03:38 pm
Baruch beats Staten Island to win the CUNYAC championship on a jumper with 0.2 on the clock after CSI had tied it with a three with 4.7 ticks left. Baruch ran a wild inbounds play where the other 4 guys took off from the far baseline like wide receivers at the snap, one short pass, one long pass and bang, Bearcats win and go dancing.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 22, 2019, 11:16:06 pm
Well Dave if that is the case why have regionally rankings then?For talking points

There is a lot more things involved in regional rankings than hosting information. That is how teams are selected to the NCAA tournaments in nearly all sports across all three divisions. Regional Rankings have a lot of importance when it comes to selecting teams to tournaments, bracketing, hosting as well, and so on. BTW - I believe D1 MBB has them as well, just not known as much.

Sorry to disappoint you.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Inkblot on February 23, 2019, 01:51:00 am
BTW - I believe D1 MBB has them as well, just not known as much.

The DI Principles and Procedures mention, in passing, the "NABC regional advisory rankings", but I've never heard any mention of those elsewhere. The idea of regional rankings was new to me when I started following D2 and D3.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 23, 2019, 02:27:21 am
BTW - I believe D1 MBB has them as well, just not known as much.

The DI Principles and Procedures mention, in passing, the "NABC regional advisory rankings", but I've never heard any mention of those elsewhere. The idea of regional rankings was new to me when I started following D2 and D3.

In D1 basketball, the media and other entities don't care about them as much because the field is SO frickin bigger than any other NCAA tournament - when looking at access ratios.

From what I understand, regional rankings exist in a lot of sports that people don't realize. Though, RPI tends to be the thing in D1 more people are interested in.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on February 23, 2019, 06:32:17 am
Doing a little work on conference seeds...

10 conferences determine championship matches today
1vs4; 2vs3 (AMCC, ACAA, LL, NACC, SAA, SCAC)
1vs5; 2vs6 (ODAC; SCAC)
1vs4; 2vs6 (HCAC)
2vs8; 3vs4 (NESCAC)
1Nvs2S; 1Svs2N (NEAC)

34 championship games are known:
15 are 1vs2 (ARC, CAC, CC, CUNYAC, CCIW, CCC, Land, LEC, MAC:F, MASCAC, MIAA, NJAC, NCAC, NWC, Sky)(CUNYAC and NJAC completed with each seed winning one)
9 are 1vs3 (AEC, CSAC, E8, MAC:C, MWC, SCIAC, SLIAC, SUNYAC, UMAC)
2 ar 2vs4 (MIAC and NAC)
2 are 2vs5 (NEWMAC and OAC)
2 are 3vs4 (PAC and WIAC)
1 is 1vs7 (GNAC)
1 is 4vs6 (NECC)
2 have divisional seeding:
1Evs3W (ASC)
2Evs2W (USAC)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on February 23, 2019, 06:40:36 am
These do not include the ASC, NEAC, and USAC due to divisional seeding

Pre-quarterfinals results (ODAC)
7 vs 10: 1-0
8 vs 9: 0-1
9 vs 8: 1-0
10 vs 7: 0-1

Quarterfinals results:
1 vs 8: 6-1
1 vs 9: 1-0
2 vs 7: 8-1
3 vs 6: 21-7
4 vs 5: 25-7
5 vs 4: 7-25
6 vs 3: 7-21
7 vs 2: 1-8
8 vs 1: 1-6
9 vs 1: 0-1

Semifinals Results:
1 vs 4: 21-5
1 vs 5: 4-2
2 vs 3: 17-11
2 vs 6: 2-1
3 vs 2: 11-17
4 vs 1: 5-21
5 vs 1: 2-4
6 vs 2: 1-2
6 vs 7: 0-1
7 vs 6: 1-0

Finals results
1 vs 2: 1-1
2 vs 1: 1-1
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 23, 2019, 07:49:34 am
Good stuff +1
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: kiko on February 23, 2019, 09:49:00 am

Quarterfinals results:
1 vs 8: 6-1

Which was the 8-defeats-1 result?

And, this must have taken some time to compile... nicely done.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 23, 2019, 09:55:20 am

Quarterfinals results:
1 vs 8: 6-1

Which was the 8-defeats-1 result?

And, this must have taken some time to compile... nicely done.

Tufts over Middlebury - the very first conference playoff game there was this year.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 23, 2019, 09:57:12 am
https://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/conference-tournaments/index

Very handy tool.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: ronk on February 23, 2019, 10:05:44 am
Doing a little work on conference seeds...

10 conferences determine championship matches today
1vs4; 2vs3 (AMCC, ACAA, LL, NACC, SAA, SCAC)
1vs5; 2vs6 (ODAC; SCAC)
1vs4; 2vs6 (HCAC)
2vs8; 3vs4 (NESCAC)
1Nvs2S; 1Svs2N (NEAC)

34 championship games are known:
15 are 1vs2 (ARC, CAC, CC, CUNYAC, CCIW, CCC, Land, LEC, MAC:F, MASCAC, MIAA, NJAC, NCAC, NWC, Sky)(CUNYAC and NJAC completed with each seed winning one)
9 are 1vs3 (AEC, CSAC, E8, MAC:C, MWC, SCIAC, SLIAC, SUNYAC, UMAC)
2 ar 2vs4 (MIAC and NAC)
2 are 2vs5 (NEWMAC and OAC)
2 are 3vs4 (PAC and WIAC)
1 is 1vs7 (GNAC)
1 is 4vs6 (NECC)
2 have divisional seeding:
1Evs3W (ASC)
2Evs2W (USAC)

The Landmark championship(1 vs 2) had been rescheduled to Sunday, instead, because of the snow storm Wednesday.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: kiko on February 23, 2019, 10:06:54 am
https://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/conference-tournaments/index

Very handy tool.

Thanks... I've used that a bit this year, but was being lazy and decided to Ypsi Griz.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on February 23, 2019, 01:43:15 pm
7th seeded St Joseph (CT) is trying to make it in their very first season. They have a slight lead late in the first half of the GNAC championship.

A bit reminiscent of another Jim Calhoun led team, 2011 UConn. As the 9th seed they won 5 games in 5 days to take the Big East crown then went on to win the NCAA tournament as well.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 23, 2019, 01:55:48 pm
7th seeded St Joseph (CT) is trying to make it in their very first season. They have a slight lead late in the first half of the GNAC championship.

A bit reminiscent of another Jim Calhoun led team, 2011 UConn. As the 9th seed they won 5 games in 5 days to take the Big East crown then went on to win the NCAA tournament as well.

Saw their progress earlier this week as well. That would be a nice story too!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 23, 2019, 03:02:10 pm
Albertus Magnus knocks off St. Joseph (CT).
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 23, 2019, 04:09:11 pm
Nice catch, Tom. You have a nose for a good story.

Ryan, Newbury looks like a great subject for one of your ATN columns.

Thanks, Greg...if they win!

It doesn't look like Newbury will be in the tourney. Losing in OT.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: sac on February 24, 2019, 12:58:35 pm
For a pod at Neb. Wesleyan I can only find 6 teams that can make it to Lincoln NE without a flight.

St. John's
St. Thomas
Platteville
North Central
Eureka
Northwestern, MN

One of St. John's/St. Thomas,  Platteville/North Central   Eureka/Northwestern looks like the only options to me.   Loras can also make it but being in the ARC with NWU I think that options out.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on February 24, 2019, 01:25:29 pm
In thinking about national seeding and potential hosts, I've tried to seed the top 16...actually top 18 since UW-Oshkosh and Amherst women will almost certainly be hosting.

1. (W) Whitman: .963, 26-1/.563/5-1
2. (MA) Christopher Newport: .893, 25-3/.549/7-3
3. (W) Nebraska Wesleyan: .963, 26-1/.575/2-1
4. (NE) Amherst: .852, 23-4/.568/8-3  *can't host/women

5. (C) Augustana: .889, 24-3/.547/8-3
6. (S) Randolph-Macon: .926, 25-2/.535/6-2
7. (MA) Swarthmore: .889, 24-3/.536/5-1
8. (NE) Hamilton: .852, 23-4/.553/4-4

9. (C) UW-Oshkosh: .885, 23-3/.542/3-3 *can't host/women
10. (W) Loras: .778, 21-6/.587/2-2
11. (MA) Rowan: .769, 20-6/.560/9-3
12. (W) St. John's: .852, 23-4/.534/4-2

13. (E) Oswego State: .815, 22-5/.532/8-4
14. (GL) Wittenberg: .815, 22-5/.545/6-3
15. (C) North Central: .815, 22-5/.543/5-3
16. (GL) Marietta: .769, 20-6/.549/6-4
--------------
17*. (NE) Nichols: .926, 25-2/.525/4-2
18*. (NE) Williams: .769, 20-6/.598/6-5

In a perfect D3 bracket world, I think those 16 should host.

Other strong host resumes
19. (GL) Wooster: .821, 23-5/.543/3-4
20. (E) Rochester: .800, 20-5/.539/5-2
21. (S) Emory: .800, 20-5, .564/2-4
22. (NE) MIT: .846, 22-4/.555/1-0
23. (S) Centre: .840, 21-4/.526/1-1


Slotting those by region...

Atlantic
11. (MA) Rowan: .769, 20-6/.560/9-3

Central
5. (C) Augustana: .889, 24-3/.547/8-3
9. (C) UW-Oshkosh: .885, 23-3/.542/3-3
15. (C) North Central: .815, 22-5/.543/5-3

East
13. (E) Oswego State: .815, 22-5/.532/8-4
20. (E) Rochester: .800, 20-5/.539/5-2

Great Lakes
14. (GL) Wittenberg: .815, 22-5/.545/6-3
16. (GL) Marietta: .769, 20-6/.549/6-4
19. (GL) Wooster: .821, 23-5/.543/3-4

Middle Atlantic
2. (MA) Christopher Newport: .893, 25-3/.549/7-3
7. (MA) Swarthmore: .889, 24-3/.536/5-1

Northeast
4. (NE) Amherst: .846, 22-4/.568/7-3 
8. (NE) Hamilton: .885, 23-3/.553/4-3
17. (NE) Nichols: .926, 25-2/.525/4-2
18. (NE) Williams: .769, 20-6/.598/6-5
22. (NE) MIT: .846, 22-4/.555/1-0

South
6. (S) Randolph-Macon: .926, 25-2/.535/6-2
21. (S) Emory: .800, 20-5, .564/2-4
23. (S) Centre: .840, 21-4/.526/1-1

West
1. (W) Whitman: .963, 26-1/.563/5-1
3. (W) Nebraska Wesleyan: .963, 26-1/.575/2-1
10. (W) Loras: .778, 21-6/.587/2-2
12. (W) St. John's: .852, 23-4/.534/4-2


 
I have 7 of the top 16 being from the West + Central regions.  If we assume Oshkosh can't host, it's 6 of 16. 

This illustrates the bracketing challenge - and fear of a 10-year anniversary Bracket of Death - I started bringing up in early-January.  I think all 6 of those teams (Whitman, Nebraska Wesleyan, Augustana, Loras, St. John's, North Central) deserve to host on the first weekend...but I don't think it's possible to make happen.  And then I'm really concerned about the pairings for weekend #2 and how to keep the top West + Central teams from meeting too early.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on February 24, 2019, 02:15:15 pm
Based on what I have above, logical bracket quadrants could be...

#1 Whitman Quadrant
1. (W) Whitman: .963, 26-1/.563/5-1
16. (GL) Marietta: .769, 20-6/.549/6-4

9. (C) UW-Oshkosh: .885, 23-3/.542/3-3 *can't host/women
10. (W) Loras: .778, 21-6/.587/2-2

#4 Amherst Quadrant
4. (NE) Amherst: .852, 23-4/.568/8-3 
13. (E) Oswego State: .815, 22-5/.532/8-4

7. (MA) Swarthmore: .889, 24-3/.536/5-1
8. (NE) Hamilton: .852, 23-4/.553/4-4



#2 Christopher Newport Quadrant
2. (MA) Christopher Newport: .893, 25-3/.549/7-3
15. (C) North Central: .815, 22-5/.543/5-3

6. (S) Randolph-Macon: .926, 25-2/.535/6-2
11. (MA) Rowan: .769, 20-6/.560/9-3


#3 Nebraska Wesleyan Quadrant
3. (W) Nebraska Wesleyan: .963, 26-1/.575/2-1
14. (GL) Wittenberg: .815, 22-5/.545/6-3

5. (C) Augustana: .889, 24-3/.547/8-3
12. (W) St. John's: .852, 23-4/.534/4-2
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: With Age Comes Wisdom? on February 24, 2019, 02:19:24 pm
Again, I may be showing my lack of knowledge here, but I was under the impression that the Amherst women would be an absolute host thereby probably making it difficult if not impossible for the men to host as well?  Am I showing the question mark in my name again? ;)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on February 24, 2019, 02:24:26 pm
Again, I may be showing my lack of knowledge here, but I was under the impression that the Amherst women would be an absolute host thereby probably making it difficult if not impossible for the men to host as well?  Am I showing the question mark in my name again? ;)

I am not sure what all the women's bracket implications are.  I have just heard about UW-Oshkosh. 

Maybe someone can confirm?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: NEsoccerfan20 on February 24, 2019, 02:27:30 pm
Not showing a lack of knowledge at all.... that would be correct. With this year being a women's preference year, the Amherst women will most likely host first weekend meaning the men can't. It will be interesting to see what schools in new england host pods with Amherst unable to and Nichols (I'm assuming not able to either because of their tiny gym). I'd presume it would be Hamilton,  and then any of MIT/Williams/Keene State possibly?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on February 24, 2019, 02:31:02 pm
Not showing a lack of knowledge at all.... that would be correct. With this year being a women's preference year, the Amherst women will most likely host first weekend meaning the men can't. It will be interesting to see what schools in new england host pods with Amherst unable to and Nichols (I'm assuming not able to either because of their tiny gym). I'd presume it would be Hamilton,  and then any of MIT/Williams/Keene State possibly?

If Nichols can't host (is that confirmed?), I'd say Williams is next in line there to replace Amherst.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: NEsoccerfan20 on February 24, 2019, 02:34:14 pm
Titan Q- no idea about Nichols. I'm just assuming because their gym holds less than 1000.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: With Age Comes Wisdom? on February 24, 2019, 02:42:14 pm
The funny thing about Hamilton is that it's an East school wolf in Northeast clothes...   Think that the Cont's definitely deserve to host (maybe a Morrisville, Plattsburg, Skidmore type of pod)...wishful think on my part.lol
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: hickory_cornhusker on February 24, 2019, 02:46:26 pm
Based on what I have above, logical bracket quadrants could be...

#1 Whitman Quadrant
1. (W) Whitman: .963, 26-1/.563/5-1
16. (GL) Marietta: .769, 20-6/.549/6-4

9. (C) UW-Oshkosh: .885, 23-3/.542/3-3 *can't host/women
10. (W) Loras: .778, 21-6/.587/2-2

#4 Amherst Quadrant
4. (NE) Amherst: .852, 23-4/.568/8-3 
13. (E) Oswego State: .815, 22-5/.532/8-4

7. (MA) Swarthmore: .889, 24-3/.536/5-1
8. (NE) Hamilton: .852, 23-4/.553/4-4



#2 Christopher Newport Quadrant
2. (MA) Christopher Newport: .893, 25-3/.549/7-3
15. (C) North Central: .815, 22-5/.543/5-3

6. (S) Randolph-Macon: .926, 25-2/.535/6-2
11. (MA) Rowan: .769, 20-6/.560/9-3


#3 Nebraska Wesleyan Quadrant
3. (W) Nebraska Wesleyan: .963, 26-1/.575/2-1
14. (GL) Wittenberg: .815, 22-5/.545/6-3

5. (C) Augustana: .889, 24-3/.547/8-3
12. (W) St. John's: .852, 23-4/.534/4-2

Flipping 15 North Central with 16 Marietta saves a flight to Christopher Newport and an additional flight if the NCAA doesn’t put up the money for flying three teams to Whitman the second weekend.

Edit: Flipping 14 Wittenberg with 15 North Central would cut down two flights as well but it places Augustana and North Central in the same quadrant which would be nice if it can be avoided.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on February 24, 2019, 03:09:35 pm
Good call, Hickory...I made that first flip...


#1 Whitman Quadrant
1. (W) Whitman: .963, 26-1/.563/5-1
15. (C) North Central: .815, 22-5/.543/5-3


9. (C) UW-Oshkosh: .885, 23-3/.542/3-3
10. (W) Loras: .778, 21-6/.587/2-2

#4 Amherst Quadrant
4. (NE) Amherst: .852, 23-4/.568/8-3 
13. (E) Oswego State: .815, 22-5/.532/8-4

7. (MA) Swarthmore: .889, 24-3/.536/5-1
8. (NE) Hamilton: .852, 23-4/.553/4-4



#2 Christopher Newport Quadrant
2. (MA) Christopher Newport: .893, 25-3/.549/7-3
16. (GL) Marietta: .769, 20-6/.549/6-4

6. (S) Randolph-Macon: .893, 25-3/.534/6-3
11. (MA) Rowan: .769, 20-6/.560/9-3


#3 Nebraska Wesleyan Quadrant
3. (W) Nebraska Wesleyan: .963, 26-1/.575/2-1
14. (GL) Wittenberg: .815, 22-5/.545/6-3

5. (C) Augustana: .889, 24-3/.547/8-3
12. (W) St. John's: .852, 23-4/.534/4-2
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: ronk on February 24, 2019, 03:17:34 pm
Titan Q- no idea about Nichols. I'm just assuming because their gym holds less than 1000.

There's no capacity limitation for the regional weekend, only the sectional weekend.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: kiko on February 24, 2019, 03:37:48 pm
Amherst women are 23-3 and were second behind undefeated Bowdoin in the most recent regional rankings.  They picked up their third loss to #3 Tufts after those rankings.

They are also coming off a two-year unbeaten run that could I expect influence things on the margins if they are being compared to a team from another region.

Net/net, from my uneducated POV, they will slip but not fall more than a slot or two in their regional ranking, and there is a good chance they will host the first weekend.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 24, 2019, 03:41:41 pm
I don't think we can pull enough teams west to support the number of "deserving" West/Central hosts. North Central and Loras are probably on the road. (I'm personally slotting St. John's ahead of Loras but could be convinced otherwise).
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: kiko on February 24, 2019, 03:56:57 pm
I don't think we can pull enough teams west to support the number of "deserving" West/Central hosts. North Central and Loras are probably on the road. (I'm personally slotting St. John's ahead of Loras but could be convinced otherwise).

I think North Central likely winds up on the road as they are the furthest East of the teams Titan Q mentioned.  Unless, that is, the committee can find a way to pair them with Eastern teams that are able to travel to the Western Suburbs of Chicago. (And places this pod in an Eastern quadrant.)

Whitman could potentially be set as a host for a pod in an Eastern quadrant, as a way to solve some of this logjam... you could send a bunch of island teams to the Pac Northwest since they will all be flying anyway, and then can pair that winner with Eastern teams for the second weekend.  Two reasons for this to be attractive: (1) if the winner of an island pod does not deserve to host the second weekend, you have mitigated the number of flights you'll need, and (2) if the winner of the island pod DOES deserve to host and the NCAA springs for three flights -- I'm not holding my breath on this -- then it doesn't matter whether those three flights originate from the Midwest or from somewhere in the Eastern time zone.

Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on February 24, 2019, 04:03:27 pm
I don't think we can pull enough teams west to support the number of "deserving" West/Central hosts. North Central and Loras are probably on the road. (I'm personally slotting St. John's ahead of Loras but could be convinced otherwise).

I think between St. John's, North Central, and Loras two will host and one will get shut out. 

Seems like St. John's will pass Loras in the final West ranking...so my money would be on Loras to be the odd team out.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on February 24, 2019, 04:05:25 pm
For Hoopsville tonight, it will help to have final projected regional rankings correct.  Anyone who has time to zero in on final regional rankings for a region or two (or three, or all) we'd love to see your thoughts.  A couple sources for the data you need:

https://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/p/division-iii-mens-regional-rankings.html

http://www.fantastic50.net/d3h_men.html

And here are the last regional rankings - https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2019/02/men-regional-rankings-third.

Those regional orders are very important obviously.  Thanks.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 24, 2019, 04:05:59 pm
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=4o2h3/5qe4yd77benqfa7a.jpg)

This is it! The regular season is over. The conference titles have been handed out and 86 teams know they will be playing next week in the NCAA Division III men's and women's Championship Tournaments!

However, 42 slots need to be filled. Which programs have best positioned themselves to selected to play for a national title?

It is the biggest show of the year. Bubble teams watch anxiously. Rivals watch wondering if their rivals will make the event. Others watch because ... this is one of the best nights of the entire season.

Tune in a special episode of Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) where we will make our mock selections of who will be in and who will be left out of the DIII national tournaments. Our teams of experts will make the picks using the same criteria the national committees consider.

Plus, hear, one last time before the brackets are announced, from the national committee chairs who discuss how this year's rankings and process have worked out. And hear from some teams who have already punched their tickets to the tournaments - many for the first time in program history!

Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. Sunday's special will hit the air at 6:00 p.m. ET right here: http://bit.ly/2XuWjWa (or via Facebook Live or Periscope simulcasts).

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to dave.mchugh@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options below.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- John Alesi, Baruch men's coach
- Sam Atkinson, Men's National Committee Chair (Gallaudet Associate Director for Communications)
- Russ Phillips, Alfred men's coach
- Bill Curley, Emerson men's coach
- Karin Harvey, Women's National Committee Chair (Montclair State women's coach)
- Rayne Reber, Rosemont women's coach
- Lyle Jones, Bethany Lutheran women's coach

Men's Mock Selections Team:
- Ryan Scott, D3hoops.com
- Bob Quillman, IWUHoops.com
- Michael Blaine, Medaille men's coach

Women's Mock Selections Team:
- Gordon Mann, D3hoops.com
- BJ Spigelmyer, DeSales Sports Information Director
- James Wagner, CSAC Assistant Commissioner

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Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Smitty Oom on February 24, 2019, 04:06:25 pm
I don't think we can pull enough teams west to support the number of "deserving" West/Central hosts. North Central and Loras are probably on the road. (I'm personally slotting St. John's ahead of Loras but could be convinced otherwise).

I think between St. John's, North Central, and Loras two will host and one will get shut out.  Seems like St. John's will pass Loras in the final West ranking...so my money would be on Loras to be the odd team out.

I agree on this, but it would probably be easier to construct a competitvely balanced bracket and pods with Loras hosting over SJU due to its more centralized location to other tournament qualifiers.

This is just speculation, I haven't researched which teams can reach Loras in Dubuque, IA that cannot reach St. John's in Collegeville, MN.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on February 24, 2019, 04:20:43 pm
For example.  Central region...

Last Central Ranking (through games of Sunday 2/17)
1. Augustana: .920/.534/7-2
2. UW-Oshkosh: .920/.541/3-2
3. Wheaton: .720/.567/4-4
4. North Central: .800/.520/3-3
5. UW-La Crosse: .680/.575/3-2
6. UW-Stevens Point: .667/.586/1-6
7. Illinois Wesleyan: .680/.560/2-7
8. Chicago: .625/.563/4-2

Projected Central Final Ranking (through games of Sunday 2/24)
1. Augustana: .889/.547/8-3
2. UW-Oshkosh: .885/.542/3-3
3. North Central: .815/.543/5-3
4. Wheaton: .704/.576/4-5
5. UW-Platteville: .630/.593/6-5
6. UW-Stevens Point: .667/.590/2-6
7. Illinois Wesleyan: .667/.569/2-8
8. UW-La Crosse: .654/.574/4-2
(Washington U: .680/.565/3-6)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 24, 2019, 04:25:05 pm
Oshkosh can't host due to women. Does the NCAA tend to just move that pod and keep Oshkosh as the "1", or would they move Oshkosh to another site (say North Central) and make the Titans serve as the "2"?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 24, 2019, 04:36:19 pm
Oshkosh can't host due to women. Does the NCAA tend to just move that pod and keep Oshkosh as the "1", or would they move Oshkosh to another site (say North Central) and make the Titans serve as the "2"?

Top ranked teams tend to be moved to another team in the pod they were bracketed with ... not to another team that is similarly ranked. They still get treated like the top team.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on February 24, 2019, 05:11:40 pm
Shouldn't be an issue in the AMCC as the power is back on at La Roche, but what would happen if a conference couldn't complete it's tournament by selection time?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 24, 2019, 06:32:31 pm
Shouldn't be an issue in the AMCC as the power is back on at La Roche, but what would happen if a conference couldn't complete it's tournament by selection time?

It has already become an issue - they needed the selections in by 6pm ET. They had to request an extension. They have until 8pm ET.

If they can't make it, I suspect they will revert back to the regular season title winner.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Smitty Oom on February 24, 2019, 06:38:37 pm
So what you are saying is that La Roche wanted to ensure their own spot int he NCAA tourney and have the "power go off" during the championship game?  Seems like a smart play to me. ;D :D

Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: ronk on February 24, 2019, 06:59:03 pm
So what you are saying is that La Roche wanted to ensure their own spot int he NCAA tourney and have the "power go off" during the championship game?  Seems like a smart play to me. ;D :D

 Cue one of Sager's cartoon videos.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 24, 2019, 08:27:31 pm
(https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-17-2015/TD8dX5.gif)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: ronk on February 24, 2019, 08:40:47 pm
Well done for spur-of-the moment. Is their mascot a bobcat?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 24, 2019, 08:43:38 pm
Alas, they're the Redhawks.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: iwumichigander on February 24, 2019, 11:00:27 pm
The RedHawk is there --- inside the cat  ;D
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 25, 2019, 01:21:22 am
Oshkosh can't host due to women. Does the NCAA tend to just move that pod and keep Oshkosh as the "1", or would they move Oshkosh to another site (say North Central) and make the Titans serve as the "2"?

Top ranked teams tend to be moved to another team in the pod they were bracketed with ... not to another team that is similarly ranked. They still get treated like the top team.

How this went down in our bracketing process is we started with UW-Oshkosh in a pod which was hosted by the 3-seed, Hanover. As the process progressed, we needed to move Hanover elsewhere and we ended up with UWO's pod being at the 4 seed, Lake Forest.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on February 25, 2019, 04:58:34 am
These do not include the ASC, NEAC, and USAC due to divisional seeding

Pre-quarterfinals results (ODAC):
7 vs 10: 1-0
8 vs 9: 0-1
9 vs 8: 1-0
10 vs 7: 0-1

Quarterfinals results (77 games):
1 vs 8: 6-1
1 vs 9: 1-0
2 vs 7: 8-1
3 vs 6: 21-7
4 vs 5: 25-7
5 vs 4: 7-25
6 vs 3: 7-21
7 vs 2: 1-8
8 vs 1: 1-6
9 vs 1: 0-1

Semifinals Results (82 games):
1 vs 4: 25-7
1 vs 5: 5-3
2 vs 3: 19-14
2 vs 6: 5-1
2 vs 8: 1-0
3 vs 2: 14-19
3 vs 4: 1-0
4 vs 1: 7-25
4 vs 3: 0-1
5 vs 1: 3-5
6 vs 2: 1-5
6 vs 7: 0-1
7 vs 6: 1-0
8 vs 2: 0-1

Finals results (41 games):
1 vs 2: 11-7
1 vs 3: 7-4
1 vs 7: 1-0
2 vs 1: 7-11
2 vs 3: 0-1
2 vs 4: 3-0
2 vs 5: 2-1
3 vs 1: 4-7
3 vs 2: 1-0
3 vs 4: 2-1
4 vs 2: 0-3
4 vs 3: 1-2
4 vs 6: 1-0
5 vs 2: 1-2
6 vs 4: 0-1
7 vs 1: 0-1
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on February 25, 2019, 05:07:00 am
Overall records:
1 seed: 56-22
2 seed: 45-29
3 seed: 43-34
4 seed: 34-38
5 seed: 11-32
6 seed: 8-20
7 seed: 3-9
8 seed: 1-8
9 seed: 1-1
10 seed: 0-1

Higher seeds overall: 145-57

1 seed higher (1v2; 4v5 etc): 58-32
2 seeds higher (1v3): 11-4
3 seeds higher (1v4): 49-15
4 seeds higher (1v5): 10-4
5 seeds higher (1v6): 8-1
6 seeds higher (1v7): 2-0
7 seeds higher (1v8): 6-1
8 seeds higher (1v9): 1-0

Champions by seed:
1 seed: 19
2 seed: 12
3 seed: 7
4 seed: 2
5 seed: 1
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: deiscanton on February 25, 2019, 05:36:46 am
All of New England is now under a High Wind Warning for damaging winds from.the same storm system that delayed the AMCC title games yesterday.  This weather situation is exactly the reason why conference title games should no longer be played on Sundays.  If this happens next week, the ECAC tournament will have to be cancelled.  I hope that my power does not go out this afternoon -- but I am not optimistic that I will be able to watch the NCAA selection shows live this afternoon-- I may have to watch the shows on demand once the storm blows through.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 25, 2019, 09:09:20 am
I never understood conference final games played on Sundays either.

Huge winds and snow caused a 131-car pile up on I-41 just north of Oshkosh yesterday.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 25, 2019, 09:33:04 am
I never understood conference final games played on Sundays either.

Huge winds and snow caused a 131-car pile up on I-41 just north of Oshkosh yesterday.

I get it for SCAC and ASC - places where there's significant travel required and you don't want players to miss essentially a week of classes to get a tournament in.  I also get that you want to give them as much recovery time as possible from the day before (and the day before that).  Those things do really make sense to me - I wonder, though, if you could do what the NESCAC and CUNYAC do and just finish your conference schedule a week early and play the first round one weekend and the semi/final the second.  With the extra week at the beginning of the season, you have the space to do that.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 25, 2019, 11:20:35 am
Aurora, Husson, Emerson, Rosemont and Platteville all come in with double-digit loses.

Eureka also has double-digit loses and also owns the only sub .500 record.

If we were to seed teams, would the Red Devils be the lowest seed of the 64?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 25, 2019, 12:37:14 pm
I haven't seen a link update yet on the NCAA page. Am I missing something or on the wrong page?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Riley056 on February 25, 2019, 01:08:29 pm
Observations from selection show....

Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 25, 2019, 01:15:10 pm
I haven't seen a link update yet on the NCAA page. Am I missing something or on the wrong page?

We had you covered at 11:37 a.m. CT. :)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 25, 2019, 01:18:13 pm
I haven't seen a link update yet on the NCAA page. Am I missing something or on the wrong page?

We had you covered at 11:37 a.m. CT. :)

I was on my phone. Probably part of the problem. I did finally find it there and here, but kept freezing up, so I just gave up. LOL
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 25, 2019, 01:18:57 pm
Observations from selection show....

La Crosse sucker punches everyone!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Riley056 on February 25, 2019, 01:23:50 pm
The win vs Oshkosh off set the loss vs Eau Claire?

Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Smitty Oom on February 25, 2019, 01:51:40 pm
Are all the game times decided by the host sites? If so when do they have to publish those times?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: nescac1 on February 25, 2019, 02:22:13 pm
While no bracket will ever be perfect, I'd say this is the most balanced D3 tourney bracket I've seen, and it should produce four very high-caliber teams in the Final Four:

Top left has number 2, 8, 11, 14 and 16 teams in most recent D3 hoops rankings. 
Bottom left has 5, 6, 7, 13, 15
Top right has 1, 4, 9, 10
Bottom right has only 3 and 12, so certainly the weakest on paper, but has a lot of teams that may not be highly ranked but who no one would be eager to play (Plattesville, Baldwin-Wallace, New Jersey City, Marietta, Wheaton, Capital). 
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: fantastic50 on February 25, 2019, 02:22:55 pm
Start time of the first game on Friday can be anywhere between 5:00 and 6:00 (host team's choice).  Second-round games start at 7:00.  Exceptions can be made by the NCAA in appropriate circumstances, as when Yeshiva played a Friday afternoon game last year, finishing before the start of the Sabbath.

https://ncaaorg.s3.amazonaws.com/championships/sports/basketball/d3/men/2018-19DIIIMBB_PreChampManual.pdf (https://ncaaorg.s3.amazonaws.com/championships/sports/basketball/d3/men/2018-19DIIIMBB_PreChampManual.pdf)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 25, 2019, 02:26:52 pm
Start time of the first game on Friday can be anywhere between 5:00 and 6:00 (host team's choice).  Second-round games start at 7:00.  Exceptions can be made by the NCAA in appropriate circumstances, as when Yeshiva played a Friday afternoon game last year, finishing before the start of the Sabbath.

https://ncaaorg.s3.amazonaws.com/championships/sports/basketball/d3/men/2018-19DIIIMBB_PreChampManual.pdf (https://ncaaorg.s3.amazonaws.com/championships/sports/basketball/d3/men/2018-19DIIIMBB_PreChampManual.pdf)

We heard rumblings that they may try to spread them out a little bit more throughout the day, but I have no real confirmation on that.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 25, 2019, 02:27:54 pm
Start time of the first game on Friday can be anywhere between 5:00 and 6:00 (host team's choice).  Second-round games start at 7:00.  Exceptions can be made by the NCAA in appropriate circumstances, as when Yeshiva played a Friday afternoon game last year, finishing before the start of the Sabbath.

https://ncaaorg.s3.amazonaws.com/championships/sports/basketball/d3/men/2018-19DIIIMBB_PreChampManual.pdf (https://ncaaorg.s3.amazonaws.com/championships/sports/basketball/d3/men/2018-19DIIIMBB_PreChampManual.pdf)

This actually may change this year ... stay tuned.

We heard rumblings that they may try to spread them out a little bit more throughout the day, but I have no real confirmation on that.

What he said ...
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Inkblot on February 25, 2019, 03:11:34 pm
Massey and the efficiency ratings both have Augustana as the only top-16 team in the lower right quadrant.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: WUPHF on February 25, 2019, 03:40:30 pm
I do wish they would start games earlier.  I would probably take a few hours off work to watch.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 25, 2019, 04:28:38 pm
While no bracket will ever be perfect, I'd say this is the most balanced D3 tourney bracket I've seen, and it should produce four very high-caliber teams in the Final Four:

Top left has number 2, 8, 11, 14 and 16 teams in most recent D3 hoops rankings. 
Bottom left has 5, 6, 7, 13, 15
Top right has 1, 4, 9, 10
Bottom right has only 3 and 12, so certainly the weakest on paper, but has a lot of teams that may not be highly ranked but who no one would be eager to play (Plattesville, Baldwin-Wallace, New Jersey City, Marietta, Wheaton, Capital).

Massey and the efficiency ratings both have Augustana as the only top-16 team in the lower right quadrant.

Fleshing this out:

Whitman section (upper left quadrant)
d3hoops.com top 25 ranked teams: six (2, 8, 11, 14, 16, 24)
d3hoops.com ORV teams: one
average d3hoop.com rank for section: 21
Massey top 25 rated teams: five (2, 5, 10, 11, 18)
Massey average for section: 64.75

Rochester* section (lower left quadrant)
d3hoops.com top 25 ranked teams: six (5, 6, 7, 13, 15, 20)
d3hoops.com ORV teams: two
average d3hoops.com rank for section: 21
Massey top 25 rated teams: five (6, 7, 13, 17, 22)
Massey average for section: 75.75

Nebraska Wesleyan section (upper right quadrant)
d3hoops.com top 25 ranked teams: eight (1, 4, 9, 10, 18, 21, 22, 23)
d3hoops.com ORV teams: two
avearge d3hoops.com rank for section: 20
Massey top 25 rated teams: eight (1, 4, 8, 9, 12, 14, 15, 21)
Massey average for section: 60.19

Augsutana section (lower right quadrant)
d3hoops.com top 25 ranked teams: three (3, 12, 17)
d3hoops.com top 25 ORV teams: five
average d3hoops.com rank for section: 23
Massey top 25 rated teams:  five (3, 19, 20, 24, 25)
Massey average for section: 65

*Otherwise known as the Amherst-masquerading-as-Rochester-due-to-the-women-getting-first-weekend-preference section
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 25, 2019, 04:39:01 pm

I hate to say it as a voter, but I'm not sure the D3hoops.com Top 25 is the best judge of the brackets this year.  Maybe if we did a Top 50.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: nescac1 on February 25, 2019, 04:48:42 pm
Looking holistically at all the competing data, the Nebraska Wesleyan bracket is clearly the strongest and by a decent margin, but not ridiculously out of whack with the others.  The other three brackets look essentially even with one another.  That's pretty darn good, given geographical constraints.   Maybe they could have flipped the Wooster and Oshkosh pods, and then moved the Oshkosh pod down to the bottom of the Augustana bracket (with the Oswego pod moving up to where the Wooster pod is now).  Other than that, looks quite solid. 
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: fantastic50 on February 25, 2019, 04:49:22 pm
Based on my computer rankings (of best teams, not most deserving of tournament bids), here is a similar breakdown...

Top left (Whitman) bracket
Top 25 teams: Five (2, 7, 13, 18, 22)
Top 50 teams: 7
2nd 50 teams: 5
Sub-100 teams: 4

Bottom left (Rochester) bracket
Top 25 teams: Four (6, 8, 9, 17)
Top 50 teams: 9
2nd 50 teams: 4
Sub-100 teams: 3

Top-right (Nebraska Wesleyan) bracket

Top 25 teams: Nine (1, 4, 5, 11, 12, 14, 16, 19, 24)
Top 50 teams: 10
2nd 50 teams: 4
Sub-100 teams: 2

Bottom-right (Augustana) bracket
Top 25 teams: Five (3, 15, 20, 21, 25)
Top 50 teams: 10
2nd 50 teams: 4
Sub-100 teams: 2

It's pretty clear which one is the toughest (though it could have been worse this year.)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: fantastic50 on February 25, 2019, 04:53:03 pm
Looking holistically at all the competing data, the Nebraska Wesleyan bracket is clearly the strongest and by a decent margin, but not ridiculously out of whack with the others.  The other three brackets look essentially even with one another.  That's pretty darn good, given geographical constraints.   Maybe they could have flipped the Wooster and Oshkosh pods, and then moved the Oshkosh pod down to the bottom of the Augustana bracket (with the Oswego pod moving up to where the Wooster pod is now).  Other than that, looks quite solid.

I think that the Wooster pod's placement (and even Wooster hosting at all) could have been influenced by geography.  It gives a plausible sectional host that everyone can reach, since Augustana is more than 500 miles from either Marietta or Oswego.  However, if Aston Francis puts up 50 points and ousts Wooster, which seems quite plausible, then Augie flies to Marietta for the second weekend.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: nescac1 on February 25, 2019, 04:56:00 pm
Ahhh, makes sense fantastic50.  So if things go according to chalk, who will be the four likely hosts in the sectionals? 
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 25, 2019, 05:00:23 pm
Looking holistically at all the competing data, the Nebraska Wesleyan bracket is clearly the strongest and by a decent margin, but not ridiculously out of whack with the others.  The other three brackets look essentially even with one another.

My thoughts as well. Even Ryan, a Top 25 voter, admits that the d3hoops.com poll is probably a little off, so I disregard the poll's implication that the Augustana section is weak. The various data ratings (including Drew's) seem to have three of the four sections fairly even, with the Nebraska Wesleyan section, while clearly the strongest, not quite making it up to Bracket of Death standards.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: fantastic50 on February 25, 2019, 05:19:52 pm
Ahhh, makes sense fantastic50.  So if things go according to chalk, who will be the four likely hosts in the sectionals?

Hamilton (with both Whitman & CNU having to fly in)
Amherst (RMC can drive)
North Central (Guilford must fly, but NWU can drive)
Wooster (Augustana can drive, barely, by way of Fort Wayne)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 25, 2019, 09:47:07 pm

I put it in the Preview, which isn't out yet, but Oshkosh shouldn't have to play St. John's that early, but they did lose their conference tourney, so you get what you get.  The problem, in my eyes, is that it's not a reward for SJU either.  I can see them not wanting to put the MIAC champ against the CCIW champ, but I do think switching SJU and Loras would've made it a little better.

That quadrant is the toughest, for sure.  Augie's is the easiest, but the difference isn't too great - and certainly better than we've seen in the past.  Augie also may have to go on the road in the second weekend, which definitely make things trickier for them.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 25, 2019, 09:59:16 pm
Augie's section is perhaps the easiest in terms of there being fewer top-notch teams, but in terms of the overall collection of sixteen teams it's not any easier than the Rochester or Whitman sections. In fact, it grades out slightly tougher in both Drew's and Ken Massey's ratings.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 25, 2019, 10:17:39 pm

I put it in the Preview, which isn't out yet, but Oshkosh shouldn't have to play St. John's that early, but they did lose their conference tourney, so you get what you get.  The problem, in my eyes, is that it's not a reward for SJU either.  I can see them not wanting to put the MIAC champ against the CCIW champ, but I do think switching SJU and Loras would've made it a little better.

That quadrant is the toughest, for sure.  Augie's is the easiest, but the difference isn't too great - and certainly better than we've seen in the past.  Augie also may have to go on the road in the second weekend, which definitely make things trickier for them.

I really think Oshkosh, and to a lesser extent, St. John's, really gets punished for not hosting. I believe if it wasn't for the women hosting, Oshkosh would've been playing at home this weekend.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on February 25, 2019, 11:16:58 pm
Based on my computer rankings (of best teams, not most deserving of tournament bids), here is a similar breakdown...

Top left (Whitman) bracket
Top 25 teams: Five (2, 7, 13, 18, 22)
Top 50 teams: 7
2nd 50 teams: 5
Sub-100 teams: 4

Bottom left (Rochester) bracket
Top 25 teams: Four (6, 8, 9, 17)
Top 50 teams: 9
2nd 50 teams: 4
Sub-100 teams: 3

Top-right (Nebraska Wesleyan) bracket

Top 25 teams: Nine (1, 4, 5, 11, 12, 14, 16, 19, 24)
Top 50 teams: 10
2nd 50 teams: 4
Sub-100 teams: 2

Bottom-right (Augustana) bracket
Top 25 teams: Five (3, 15, 20, 21, 25)
Top 50 teams: 10
2nd 50 teams: 4
Sub-100 teams: 2

It's pretty clear which one is the toughest (though it could have been worse this year.)

The "Rochester bracket" is actually the "Amherst bracket." 

The top four seeds are: Whitman, Nebraska Wesleyan, Augustana, Amherst.  (I believe in that order.)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Viking Mike on February 26, 2019, 03:05:50 pm
So in regard to sectional play from what I've been reading here....... if seeds hold, 3 of the 4 top seeds would be playing their sectional games on another teams floor, and possibly against          the home team and its fans!  How does that benefit these teams who have played so well all year and built up such a large fan base following?  Certainly levels the playing floor for the lower seed host school.

I know cost is the deciding factor always. Wish it wasn't!


Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Swish3 on February 26, 2019, 03:12:13 pm
So in regard to sectional play from what I've been reading here....... if seeds hold, 3 of the 4 top seeds would be playing their sectional games on another teams floor, and possibly against          the home team and its fans!  How does that benefit these teams who have played so well all year and built up such a large fan base following?  Certainly levels the playing floor for the lower seed host school.

I know cost is the deciding factor always. Wish it wasn't!

Ain't it great how the NCAA treats D3?!?!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 26, 2019, 03:22:18 pm
Look at it this way, Swish3: We're playing on D1's dime. D1 football and men's basketball basically fund the entire organization.

D3 tournaments definitely do not break even, regardless of sport.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 26, 2019, 04:27:05 pm
Look at it this way, Swish3: We're playing on D1's dime. D1 football and men's basketball basically fund the entire organization.

D3 tournaments definitely do not break even, regardless of sport.

D1 football actually has nothing to do with this. NCAA makes NO money on big time D1 football. Those bowl games and the Bowl Championship Series money goes to the conferences and the schools - nothing goes to the NCAA. That's because it isn't an NCAA Championship. The NCAA may certify the games, but they don't see a penny. I've said for years, NCAA should punt D1 BCS and have nothing to do with it, because they get nothing from it (there are a lot of sports schools have that the NCAA doesn't have anything to do with).

If the NCAA was involved, it would be a traditional championship tournament like FBS.

The money basically comes from the D1 men's tournament primarily. There is some other money in other tournaments, but not much (the DI women's basketball tournament is essentially a trade-out with ESPN).

To Swish's point ... the "NCAA" in all avenues is the membership. DIII approves it's own rules. They decide how to best use their money. It is similar to what other sports and other divisions do, but DII does things different than DIII does with basketball, for example. Those in Indy just execute what DIII membership chooses to do.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: AndOne on February 26, 2019, 05:13:53 pm
Dave,

It might just be foggy old age memory, but I seem to recall reading someplace on the boards a few years ago just what percentage of it’s annual budget the NCAA spends on D3, and the figure was minuscule. Yes? No?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 26, 2019, 05:15:06 pm
The figure is 3.18%, yes. And that number is established in the NCAA constitution, so any change to our percentage of D-II's percentage would require broad-based support.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 26, 2019, 09:07:12 pm
The figure is 3.18%, yes. And that number is established in the NCAA constitution, so any change to our percentage of D-II's percentage would require broad-based support.

I guess I've always wondered why d3 and d2 don't get together to just raise their own percentages.  They've got 2/3rds of the membership, right?  Or does it require 3/4ths?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: hickory_cornhusker on February 26, 2019, 09:22:23 pm
The figure is 3.18%, yes. And that number is established in the NCAA constitution, so any change to our percentage of D-II's percentage would require broad-based support.

I guess I've always wondered why d3 and d2 don't get together to just raise their own percentages.  They've got 2/3rds of the membership, right?  Or does it require 3/4ths?

Fear of possibly biting the hand that feeds them could be it. If The D1 schools don’t like giving up more of their money they may leave and D2 and D3 could end up with nothing.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: fantastic50 on February 26, 2019, 09:38:38 pm
The figure is 3.18%, yes. And that number is established in the NCAA constitution, so any change to our percentage of D-II's percentage would require broad-based support.

I guess I've always wondered why d3 and d2 don't get together to just raise their own percentages.  They've got 2/3rds of the membership, right?  Or does it require 3/4ths?

If it requires the NCAA Board of Gouvernors to sign off, remember that it has 16 from D1, 2 from D2, and 2 from D3 (soon to be joined by 5 more from outside.)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ralph Turner on February 26, 2019, 10:15:34 pm
I can see the Whitman sectional as being the new West Region when basketball expands to 10 regions.

Only Pool A bids are playing in Walla Walla.

On the Horizon, we have:

ASC (12 members after UT-Tyler departs and Belhaven comes on board).
NWC (9 members)
SCAC (10 members when Johnson & Wales Colorado and Univ of St Thomas in Houston TX come on.)
SCIAC (9 members).

There are your 40 teams and 4 conferences to make a new West Region. Or shall we call it an archipelago?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: sac on February 26, 2019, 11:40:39 pm
Paciforniatex
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 26, 2019, 11:47:20 pm
I can see the Whitman sectional as being the new West Region when basketball expands to 10 regions.

Only Pool A bids are playing in Walla Walla.

On the Horizon, we have:

ASC (12 members after UT-Tyler departs and Belhaven comes on board).
NWC (9 members)
SCAC (10 members when Johnson & Wales Colorado and Univ of St Thomas in Houston TX come on.)
SCIAC (9 members).

There are your 40 teams and 4 conferences to make a new West Region. Or shall we call it an archipelago?

As Ralph knows, this is what baseball is like in Division III, and others are like this as well.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Wooster Booster on February 26, 2019, 11:48:15 pm
...when basketball expands to 10 regions.

When is this going to happen, and why?  Eight works perfectly!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: kiko on February 26, 2019, 11:58:41 pm
...when basketball expands to 10 regions.

When is this going to happen, and why?  Eight works perfectly!

The complaint with eight (one of them, at least) is that there is a disparate number of teams per region.  (Example - 75 in the Northeast and 36 in the Mid-Atlantic.)  This leads to a different number of teams being regionally ranked since the number ranked is determined by a ratio.  And more regionally ranked teams means more chances for vRRO results in the regions with more teams.

One of the goals with the switch to ten is to even out the number of teams to be about 40ish per region.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Swish3 on February 27, 2019, 08:35:14 am
The figure is 3.18%, yes. And that number is established in the NCAA constitution, so any change to our percentage of D-II's percentage would require broad-based support.

Kind of says it all, right?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 27, 2019, 08:36:50 am
Massey's tournament predictions are up.

https://www.masseyratings.com/tourn?t=1068

20% Nebraska Wesleyan
16% Whitman
15% Augustana

So basically 50-50 those three vs. the field.

His model favors Randolph-Macon to come out of the Amherst quadrant.

I might post something similar based on my efficiency ratings if I can get to it while it's still relevant.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 27, 2019, 09:34:33 am
The figure is 3.18%, yes. And that number is established in the NCAA constitution, so any change to our percentage of D-II's percentage would require broad-based support.

I guess I've always wondered why d3 and d2 don't get together to just raise their own percentages.  They've got 2/3rds of the membership, right?  Or does it require 3/4ths?

If it requires the NCAA Board of Gouvernors to sign off, remember that it has 16 from D1, 2 from D2, and 2 from D3 (soon to be joined by 5 more from outside.)

Well, that explains it - and makes sense.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 27, 2019, 09:36:09 am

They're also trying to get a standardized ratio of participating teams to regions across all d3 sports.  Other sports are not in as workable positions as d3.  I think it's a good idea, although I'm struggling to think about how a ten team selection table is going to work out.  That's rough.  From that perspective I'd almost rather see five regions of 90 than ten regions of 45.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 27, 2019, 01:25:50 pm
Emerson College makes the news.

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/26086207/blazers-stuck-boston-elevator-30-minutes
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 27, 2019, 01:35:24 pm

They're also trying to get a standardized ratio of participating teams to regions across all d3 sports.  Other sports are not in as workable positions as d3.  I think it's a good idea, although I'm struggling to think about how a ten team selection table is going to work out.  That's rough.  From that perspective I'd almost rather see five regions of 90 than ten regions of 45.

Having seen what happens in other sports with large regions - it is just as insane and more inequitable. MLAX has been stuck at two regions and now with something like 250 teams for a number of years. They are FINALLY moving to five (probably six in the future) regions ... it allows for too many issues.

Granted, comparing ten teams at a time isn't fun, either.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: 7express on February 27, 2019, 09:31:35 pm
So, I did something different this year.  Not only did I fill out my bracket, but once I got to the final 16 I tried to pencil a host for the sectionals.  Here's what I came up with, and let me know what you think:

Upper left (the Whitman bracket): I had host schools Whitman, Senor Christopher Newport, and Hamilton all winning, and picked Plattsburgh to upend Williams in Williamstown, difficult to do, but you have to pick some upsets here and there, and I came up with Hamilton hosting that sectional.  Sorry, Whitman but the NCAA isn't sending 3 teams to Western Washington, and since Plattsburgh would have to fly to Newport (and vice versa) those 2 are out as well.  This looks seemingly straight forward for as long as Hamilton wins the first 2 games, they are hosting the next weekend.

Bottom left (the Amherst bracket): I had Randolph-Macon holding serve at home; Middlebury winning @ Rowan, Amherst winning @ Rochester and MIT winning @ Swathmore.  This seems like another straight forward bracket where as long as Amherst wins they are hosting the next round, and things only get crazy if Rochester win.

Now here's where things got messy....Bottom right (the Augie?? bracket): I actually had chalk meaning all 4 host teams make it out of their pods.  NCAA would have to fly all 3 teams to Augie, so just like Whitman they are out.  I went with Marietta to host this one as Oswego just checks in at under 500 miles.

Now let's get really crazy.....my upset bracket Upper right (The Neb Wesleyan bracket): I picked Neb Wesleyan to win their pod, but then Wittenberg to win @ Guilford, Oshkosh to win @ St. John's, and Loras to win @ North Central.  Loras is able to drive to Nebraska, but the other 2 can't, while Wittenberg, Oshkosh & Loras are all within driving distance of each other.  I went back and forth between Wittenberg & Oshkosh for this.  Wittenberg was #1 in their region, while Oshkosh was #3, but in the end I decided to give the sectional to Oshkosh because I think the numbers were slightly better, but this is the only one of the 4 I wasn't comfortable with.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 27, 2019, 10:26:54 pm
So, I did something different this year.  Not only did I fill out my bracket, but once I got to the final 16 I tried to pencil a host for the sectionals.  Here's what I came up with, and let me know what you think:

Upper left (the Whitman bracket): I had host schools Whitman, Senor Christopher Newport, and Hamilton all winning, and picked Plattsburgh to upend Williams in Williamstown, difficult to do, but you have to pick some upsets here and there, and I came up with Hamilton hosting that sectional.  Sorry, Whitman but the NCAA isn't sending 3 teams to Western Washington, and since Plattsburgh would have to fly to Newport (and vice versa) those 2 are out as well.  This looks seemingly straight forward for as long as Hamilton wins the first 2 games, they are hosting the next weekend.

Bottom left (the Amherst bracket): I had Randolph-Macon holding serve at home; Middlebury winning @ Rowan, Amherst winning @ Rochester and MIT winning @ Swathmore.  This seems like another straight forward bracket where as long as Amherst wins they are hosting the next round, and things only get crazy if Rochester win.

Now here's where things got messy....Bottom right (the Augie?? bracket): I actually had chalk meaning all 4 host teams make it out of their pods.  NCAA would have to fly all 3 teams to Augie, so just like Whitman they are out.  I went with Marietta to host this one as Oswego just checks in at under 500 miles.

Now let's get really crazy.....my upset bracket Upper right (The Neb Wesleyan bracket): I picked Neb Wesleyan to win their pod, but then Wittenberg to win @ Guilford, Oshkosh to win @ St. John's, and Loras to win @ North Central.  Loras is able to drive to Nebraska, but the other 2 can't, while Wittenberg, Oshkosh & Loras are all within driving distance of each other.  I went back and forth between Wittenberg & Oshkosh for this.  Wittenberg was #1 in their region, while Oshkosh was #3, but in the end I decided to give the sectional to Oshkosh because I think the numbers were slightly better, but this is the only one of the 4 I wasn't comfortable with.

Curious why Wittenberg (speculation) didn't put in a bid. Will they put one in for the 2nd weekend. I'm partial to Oshkosh since they would've hosted had it not been for the women hosting opening weekend.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 28, 2019, 12:05:26 am
I am told they had an arena conflict. I am also heard they may have tried to make things work, but it was too late.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: BluesBrother on February 28, 2019, 02:18:21 am
Sorry, Whitman but the NCAA isn't sending 3 teams to Western Washington

What about to Eastern Washington?  ;)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ralph Turner on February 28, 2019, 08:53:32 am
Is there a bracket pick'em contest this year?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: ronk on February 28, 2019, 09:16:07 am
 I read that the sponsor was no longer conducting the bracket contest.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Smitty Oom on February 28, 2019, 09:37:42 am
Is there a bracket pick'em contest this year?

In  the fantasy and pickemleagues thread there is a game where you pick teams each round, but you can only use them once. Pick each round. Would be fun to get more participants!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 28, 2019, 11:57:59 am
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/26098338/forgetful-div-ii-team-forced-wear-host-unis

Funny story out of D2. Visitors forgot their unis and had to wear hosts' old away unis.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 28, 2019, 12:19:48 pm
Well, now we know that Illinois Wesleyan isn't the only men's basketball program in America that keeps all of the team's uniforms together for travel purposes rather than putting them back in the players' lockers once they've been laundered and thus making it the responsibilty of the players themselves to pack their unis in their bags. This same thing happened back in January 2013 when IWU forgot to bring its uniforms to North Park. Rather than take up NPU head coach Tom Slyder's offer to play the game in old Vikings road unis, the Titans decided to wait until their own uniforms arrived from Bloomington with the parents of one of their players. Tipoff took place 75 minutes after the game had been scheduled to start.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 28, 2019, 12:22:42 pm
Hey fans ... get ready!

https://youtu.be/fsYwv36MwTY
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 28, 2019, 12:25:37 pm
(https://guernseydonkey.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/Thumbs_Up_Skin-Color.png)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 28, 2019, 12:40:44 pm

They're also trying to get a standardized ratio of participating teams to regions across all d3 sports.  Other sports are not in as workable positions as d3.  I think it's a good idea, although I'm struggling to think about how a ten team selection table is going to work out.  That's rough.  From that perspective I'd almost rather see five regions of 90 than ten regions of 45.

Enjoyed your tournament preview, Ryan. Very comprehensive. You even included a picture of a red-faced (and sportscoat-clad) Grey Giovanine yelling something in the background of one of your pictures. ;)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 28, 2019, 04:49:29 pm

They're also trying to get a standardized ratio of participating teams to regions across all d3 sports.  Other sports are not in as workable positions as d3.  I think it's a good idea, although I'm struggling to think about how a ten team selection table is going to work out.  That's rough.  From that perspective I'd almost rather see five regions of 90 than ten regions of 45.

Enjoyed your tournament preview, Ryan. Very comprehensive. You even included a picture of a red-faced (and sportscoat-clad) Grey Giovanine yelling something in the background of one of your pictures. ;)

Thanks for the kind words.  Pat gets credit for the photo selection - and also for cleaning up some of my more awkward phrasing.  The picks are mine, though.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 28, 2019, 05:30:19 pm
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=nnprh/8dkw0vs268zljo93.jpg)

It is nearly time to tip off the 2019 Division III Men's and Women's Championship Tournaments, but not without checking with Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) first.

We talk to a number of programs getting ready for their first round games. From those dancing for the first time to those whose programs are a mainstay, we will cover the gamete on Thursday's show. Tune in starting at 7:00 p.m. ET to also hear who experts and friends of the show think will be in the final fours, even winning it all, in a few weeks time.

Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch Thursday's show in the video player above. If you miss any of the program, you can always watch it On Demand or listen to the audio-only podcast to the right (available shortly after the show goes off air).

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to dave.mchugh@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options to the right.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Matt Hunter, York (Pa.) men's coach
- Bobby Hughes, Rosemont men's coach
- Women's final four predictions
- Brian Morehouse, No. 10 Hope women's coach (WBCA Center Court)
- Brad Fischer, No. 13 UW-Oshkosh women's coach
- Terry Butterfield, Texas-Dallas men's coach
- Men's final four predictions

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Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: AllStar on February 28, 2019, 09:58:04 pm
Here's some NCAA tournament info (can click to make bigger):
(https://i.imgur.com/hFLXWeA.png)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 28, 2019, 10:50:59 pm
Here's some NCAA tournament info (can click to make bigger):
(https://i.imgur.com/hFLXWeA.png)

Nice work! Thanks!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 01, 2019, 09:34:45 am
It will be interesting to see how non-host hosts do. Amherst and Oshkosh probably should be hosting, but the women get the honors and Wittenberg probably should be hosting but couldn't the opening weekend.

Does the committee already know who put in bids/can't because of the women hosting rights?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: augie77 on March 01, 2019, 09:49:44 am
Emory would have had to fly to Wittenberg, whereas Guilford is drivable for all the schools.  This may have been a factor in Guilford hosting.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 01, 2019, 09:50:01 am
It will be interesting to see how non-host hosts do. Amherst and Oshkosh probably should be hosting, but the women get the honors and Wittenberg probably should be hosting but couldn't the opening weekend.

Does the committee already know who put in bids/can't because of the women hosting rights?

The two committees have to share info. One year back in the earlier part of this decade, this was a disaster and balls were dropped, but we haven't seen any issues since then.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Smitty Oom on March 01, 2019, 09:55:19 am
Here's some NCAA tournament info (can click to make bigger):
(https://i.imgur.com/hFLXWeA.png)

Nice work! Thanks!

Agree, thanks AllStar!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: raiderpa on March 01, 2019, 10:12:24 am
GOOD LUCK TO OAC TEAMS IN THE TOURNEY.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: TheOsprey on March 01, 2019, 10:20:14 am
https://youtu.be/Ot11DMJKhj8
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Caz Bombers on March 01, 2019, 03:34:52 pm
I'm pumped for these next two nights, I wanna see 32 buzzer beaters tonight and 16 more tomorrow!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 01, 2019, 03:39:45 pm
I'm pumped for these next two nights, I wanna see 32 buzzer beaters tonight and 16 more tomorrow!

And all 48 with variants of the Baruch-style football play!  (Of course. with Wooster using one of these against the Barookadookas tonight.)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 01, 2019, 03:40:30 pm
I'm pumped for these next two nights, I wanna see 32 buzzer beaters tonight and 16 more tomorrow!

Alright! So no overtimes, is what I'm hearing you say. :)

Here's how to follow with us tonight:
Live scoreboard: https://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/ncaa-tournament
Whiparound: https://www.d3hoops.com/playoffs/whiparound/index
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: lmitzel on March 01, 2019, 03:42:44 pm
I'm pumped for these next two nights, I wanna see 32 buzzer beaters tonight and 16 more tomorrow!

I don't think my heart can take three of those in person... but I'd eventually get over it and regale people with tales of the most dramatic first weekend pod in tournament history.

Alright! So no overtimes, is what I'm hearing you say. :)

:P
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: ronk on March 01, 2019, 04:11:38 pm
I'm pumped for these next two nights, I wanna see 32 buzzer beaters tonight and 16 more tomorrow!

And all 48 with variants of the Baruch-style football play!  (Of course. with Wooster using one of these against the Barookadookas tonight.)

How many mins of practice this week across both genders were devoted to defending the Baruchadooka?  ;D
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 01, 2019, 04:45:20 pm
Wasn't that a big Trace Adkins country hit? "Honky Tonk Baruchadooka"?

It's always good to see schools get into the dance for the first time ever. Here's the list of D3 programs that are losing their tournament virginity this time around:

Arcadia
Chatham
Emerson
Eureka
Lake Forest
Rosemont

It's especially good to see LFC in the tourney, as the Foresters have been a part of D3 since the very beginning of D3 men's basketball back in the 1974-75 season.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 01, 2019, 04:58:05 pm
I'm pumped for these next two nights, I wanna see 32 buzzer beaters tonight and 16 more tomorrow!

And all 48 with variants of the Baruch-style football play!  (Of course. with Wooster using one of these against the Barookadookas tonight.)

How many mins of practice this week across both genders were devoted to defending the Baruchadooka?  ;D

I like your spelling better! 

As to the play itself, the more I watch it, the more it looks like creative genius.  Hard to believe, though, that they actually just drew it up in the huddle, as perfectly as it worked.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: ronk on March 01, 2019, 05:53:03 pm
Wasn't that a big Trace Adkins country hit? "Honky Tonk Baruchadooka"?

It's always good to see schools get into the dance for the first time ever. Here's the list of D3 programs that are losing their tournament virginity this time around:

Arcadia
Chatham
Emerson
Eureka
Lake Forest
Rosemont

It's especially good to see LFC in the tourney, as the Foresters have been a part of D3 since the very beginning of D3 men's basketball back in the 1974-75 season.

 Thanks for the historical perspective. And, from the other end of the spectrum, Wittenberg becomes the leader in appearances as Scranton drops out of the previous tie by failing for the 2nd consecutive year to make the tourney. A conference semifinal win instead of loss might have gotten them in this year.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Caz Bombers on March 01, 2019, 07:17:47 pm
only one close finish so far, Nichols with some really good defense in the final minute to deny Middlebury 74-71.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 01, 2019, 08:21:22 pm
Another close finish: UW-Platteville and Capital are in overtime @ Augustana's Carver Center.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Inkblot on March 01, 2019, 09:37:32 pm
Behrend comes up just short despite Hamilton committing a five-second violation and an intentional foul in the final 20 seconds.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Caz Bombers on March 01, 2019, 09:56:43 pm
the Johnnies are getting pantsed at home by the UMAC champ for the second year in a row.

All the other games are beatdown city...I'm not getting the 2018-style nuttiness I was looking for at all.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 01, 2019, 10:04:52 pm
The UMAC does it again!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Smitty Oom on March 01, 2019, 10:05:59 pm
St. John’s can’t get out of their own way... balls bouncing off hands and nothing seeming to drop for the Johnnies. UNW on the other hand is rebounding well and shooting the lights out against a team that usually extremely limits both of those for opponents. Credit to the eagles, they always seem to be well prepared for these NCAA games! Hopefully they can give the Titans a game tomorrow!

Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Inkblot on March 01, 2019, 10:09:44 pm
That makes St. John's the first host team to lose. Even if they're hosting as a #2, by the computers they're good enough to have been a #1.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 01, 2019, 10:41:31 pm
That makes St. John's the first host team to lose. Even if they're hosting as a #2, by the computers they're good enough to have been a #1.

There were almost two tonight. Hamilton managed to come from behind to win by two in a game that PSU-Behrend led most of the way, and in which a pretty crazy ending culminated in PSUB missing two point-blank shots in the final three seconds, either one of which would've sent the game to OT if it had gone down.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 01, 2019, 11:52:02 pm

Arcadia and Moravian won their first ever NCAA tournament games tonight.  Augustana extends it's active record streak to six straight NCAA Tournaments with at least one win (Emory failed to win in their seventh straight tourney).  Wittenberg extends its all-time lead with a 22nd NCAA tournament with at least one win.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 02, 2019, 12:32:48 am
Emory would have had to fly to Wittenberg, whereas Guilford is drivable for all the schools.  This may have been a factor in Guilford hosting.

No ... Wittenberg couldn't host. They had a conflict with their gym this weekend. They were the #1 in the Great Lakes Region. The only reason they aren't hosting is because they couldn't. They would have shipped someone else (probably Marietta) to Guilford if Wittenberg was able to host.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 02, 2019, 10:19:36 am
The most "unfair" round of 32 games per the @D3Bubble rankings...

http://www.fantastic50.net/d3h_top.html

- #1 Nebraska Wesleyan vs #12 St. Thomas

- #2 Whitman vs #13 Pomona-Pitzer

- #9 Swarthmore vs #17 MIT

- #14 North Central vs #19 Loras

Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: AO on March 02, 2019, 10:28:04 am
The most "unfair" round of 32 games per the @D3Bubble rankings...

http://www.fantastic50.net/d3h_top.html

- #1 Nebraska Wesleyan vs #12 St. Thomas

- #2 Whitman vs #13 Pomona-Pitzer

- #9 Swarthmore vs #17 MIT

- #14 North Central vs #19 Loras
I think you forgot to list #4 St. John's vs #5 UW-Oshkosh   ;D
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on March 02, 2019, 10:53:45 am
The most "unfair" round of 32 games per the @D3Bubble rankings...

http://www.fantastic50.net/d3h_top.html

- #1 Nebraska Wesleyan vs #12 St. Thomas

- #2 Whitman vs #13 Pomona-Pitzer

- #9 Swarthmore vs #17 MIT

- #14 North Central vs #19 Loras
#14 vs #19 is exactly the matchup you'd expect in this round. #1 vs #32 through #16 vs #17
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 02, 2019, 11:41:57 am
#14 vs #19 is exactly the matchup you'd expect in this round. #1 vs #32 through #16 vs #17

Well sure, but you also have to look at the reality of the entire bracket.  Using @D3Bubble's rankings...

#1 Nebraska Wesleyan vs #12 St. Thomas
#2 Whitman vs #13 Pomona Pitzer
#3 Augustana vs #30 Capital
#5 UW-Oshkosh vs #74 Northwestern (MN)
#6 Randolph-Macon vs ##36 York (Pa)
#7 Christopher Newport vs #56 Alfred
#8 Amherst vs #34 Rochester
#9 Swarthmore vs #17 MIT
#11 Wittenberg vs #24 Guilford
#14 North Central vs #19 Loras
#15 Wooster vs #31 Wheaton
#18 Hamilton vs #61 Moravian
#19 Baldwin Wallace vs #45 Oswego State
#22 Williams vs (not in top 100) Gwynedd Mercy
#25 Marietta vs #62 Arcadia
#26 Nichols vs #40 Rowan

I consider the four I originally had - and then adding Wittenberg vs Guilford - as the most "unfair"/"too soon" matchups in this round.  In a perfect bracket world (which we will never have), those should be Sectional round matchups.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 02, 2019, 11:51:44 am
#1 Nebraska Wesleyan vs #12 St. Thomas
#2 Whitman vs #13 Pomona Pitzer
#3 Augustana vs #30 Capital
#5 UW-Oshkosh vs #74 Northwestern (MN)
#6 Randolph-Macon vs ##36 York (Pa)
#7 Christopher Newport vs #56 Alfred
#8 Amherst vs #34 Rochester
#9 Swarthmore vs #17 MIT
#11 Wittenberg vs #24 Guilford
#14 North Central vs #19 Loras
#15 Wooster vs #31 Wheaton
#18 Hamilton vs #61 Moravian
#19 Baldwin Wallace vs #45 Oswego State
#22 Williams vs (not in top 100) Gwynedd Mercy
#25 Marietta vs #62 Arcadia
#26 Nichols vs #40 Rowan

So.  Let me put this forth to you expert prognosticators.  If the chalk holds in today's games, with all of the favorites winning, does Wooster have much of a chance of hosting in the next round?  Seems to me that they'd probably need Wittenberg to lose, providing that the Tigers have no more gym conflicts, etc.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 02, 2019, 11:54:16 am
So.  Let me put this forth to you expert prognosticators.  If the chalk holds in today's games, with all of the favorites winning, does Wooster have much of a chance of hosting in the next round?  Seems to me that they'd probably need Wittenberg to lose, providing that the Tigers have no more gym conflicts, etc.

This is what I posted on the CCIW board...

-------------
Thinking of a Sectional that is:
- Augustana
- Wooster
- Marietta
- Baldwin Wallace

Wooster (500.0) and Marietta (603.0) can't bus to Rock Island.  I'm told the mileage cutoff is -- 499.9 bus, 500.0 flight. Baldwin Wallace (486.0) can. 

Baldwin Wallace is a zero flight option here.  Two flights vs zero would be a no-brainer.

Thinking of a Sectional that is:
- Augustana
- Wheaton
- Marietta
- Baldwin Wallace

Wheaton is three miles too far west to be a zero flight option - Marietta (502.0) can't bus to Wheaton.

But, again, Baldwin Wallace is a zero flight option.  Would top four overall seed Augustana be shipped to Baldwin Wallace to save one flight? Maybe.

Thinking of a Sectional that is:
- Augustana
- Wooster
- Marietta
- Oswego State (they host Baldwin Wallace tonight)

Augie would be two flights (Oswego State, Marietta)...Marietta and Oswego State would be just one flight (Augie).  I think Oswego State is a higher overall seed than Marietta...but that is close.

So Augustana does have some challenges in terms of hosting the Sectional, in that either winner of Oswego State vs Baldwin Wallace pulls the pod way east.

Here is the one Augie hosts for sure:
- Augustana
- Wheaton
- Marietta
- Oswego State

Two flights either way you slice it...highest seed (Augustana) wins.

When we know the four teams tonight, it will be easier to break down.

Official NCAA mileage calculator - https://web1.ncaa.org/TES/exec/miles.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 02, 2019, 11:58:04 am
Seems to me that they'd probably need Wittenberg to lose, providing that the Tigers have no more gym conflicts, etc.

Wittenberg is in the Nebraska Wesleyan quadrant...not the Augustana quadrant (where Wooster is).

Wittenberg isn't a factor for Wooster.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 02, 2019, 12:01:52 pm

The accountants are rooting for Witt, though - if they get through, Oshkosh can host everyone without flights.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: y_jack_lok on March 02, 2019, 01:11:30 pm
Looks like you haven't considered what might happen if Auguie and/or Marietta lose tonight.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 02, 2019, 02:21:09 pm
Looks like you haven't considered what might happen if Auguie and/or Marietta lose tonight.

Augie and Marietta are such heavy favorites it seemed like an inefficient use of prognostication time.

I gotta believe both of those teams will win comfortably.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Viking Mike on March 02, 2019, 02:47:15 pm
So...… if Wooster and Marrieta win tonight, how does NCAA determine who among the 4 Ohio/NY schools would host?

Both schools along with B/W and Oswego State are all under 500 miles of each other.  If Augie advances, and has to travel, do they put them in the gym of the next highest seed?  (Marietta or Oswego State)  or do they give it to the lowest seed (#4-Wooster) to give less advantage to the other higher seeds?  Or is it the most centrally located of the 3 schools? 







Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Viking Mike on March 02, 2019, 02:50:25 pm
Of course, if Wooster is the sectional host, Augie would get them next on their home floor.  Doesn't seem right.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 02, 2019, 03:15:16 pm
So...… if Wooster and Marrieta win tonight, how does NCAA determine who among the 4 Ohio/NY schools would host?

Both schools along with B/W and Oswego State are all under 500 miles of each other.  If Augie advances, and has to travel, do they put them in the gym of the next highest seed?  (Marietta or Oswego State)  or do they give it to the lowest seed (#4-Wooster) to give less advantage to the other higher seeds?  Or is it the most centrally located of the 3 schools?

https://ncaaorg.s3.amazonaws.com/championships/sports/basketball/d3/men/2018-19DIIIMBB_PreChampManual.pdf

The Championships Committee has prioritized the following site-selection criteria for all championships:
1. Complete bid;
2. Quality and availability of the facility and other necessary accommodations;
3. Geographical location (which may include such factors as rotation of sites, weather, accessibility and transportation costs);
4. Seeding; and
5. Attendance history, hosting history and revenue potential, which shall be considered necessary to assure fiscal responsibility.

------------

If it's:
- Augustana
- Wooster
- Marietta
- Oswego

The reality here, as Ryan Scott was alluding to on the CCIW board, is that even though Augustana to Wooster is 500.0 miles (or 501.0 whatever), Augie wouldn't actually fly to Wooster, OH...they would choose to bus.  It's just the easier way to go, all things considered.  So it seems like Wooster is the location where there are, in reality, zero flights.

Picking Wooster in this hypothetical scenario would purely be a geographic decision.  Because, as I see it, Wooster is the lowest seed of these four teams.  I think they stack up this way:
1. Augustana: .889/.544/8-3 (Central #1)
2. Oswego State: .815/.532/8-4 (East #1)
3. Marietta: .769/.549/6-4 (Great Lakes #2)
4. Wooster: .821/.543/3-4 (Great Lakes #3)

I'm confident that order is correct...the only question is between Oswego State and Marietta.  (That order could be flipped.)

In this scenario, do they:

A) Protect Augustana's overall top four seed status and pay for two flights (Oswego State, Marietta)?
B) Give it to the higher seed between Marietta and Oswego State? (Assuming one flight - Augustana.)
C) Give it to Wooster, assuming it is probably a zero flight option?

I think the answer is almost certainly B or C...and I guess I'd lean towards C (Wooster).

(Oh and by the way, if I'm Augie and they did that Wooster thing - assuming Augie would bus instead of fly - I'd stick it to the NCAA by flying.)

https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2019/02/men-regional-rankings-final
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 02, 2019, 03:19:25 pm
Note - "rotation of sites" could hurt Augustana.  They hosted a Sectional last year.  That could be a thing, who knows.

On the flip side, "revenue potential" could help - Augie is good for about 2200 people at Sectional games.

The site-selection criteria has a lot of flexibility built in...and we just don't know how a lot of that stuff plays out behind the scenes.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 02, 2019, 03:23:17 pm
Of course, if Wooster is the sectional host, Augie would get them next on their home floor.  Doesn't seem right.

Augie would be getting the lowest of the 4 seeds (Wooster) in this scenario. 
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Viking Mike on March 02, 2019, 04:04:26 pm
Thanks Bob,

All good thoughts! Seems like there is a whole lot that goes into this sectional selection process!  I think a lot of the Augie fans will be disappointed if the sectional is in Ohio.  The irony may be that the team and fans will have to travel through Fort Wayne in order to get to Wooster.

Hoping NCAA is thinking about the money to be made filling the Carver Center next week.  We had approx 1000 fans for the Capital/Platteville game and
1700 for the Augie/Aurora matchup.  Aurora brought maybe 50 fans tops!  Augie could certainly draw 2000 fans alone each night.  This has to help promote a sectional in RI. 

Other than a Viking win tonight, not sure what to hope for.  It sounds like Oswego State and Wheaton wins tonight would ensure RI sectional.  Even B/W and Wheaton wins may do it (attendance draw @ Augie vs cost of 1 flight)  Very well aware that Wheaton and Francis would be waiting next in the wing.  This frightens me as well.  Lots of anxiety with this NCAA national championship thing!




Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 02, 2019, 04:10:21 pm
FYI - let's not assume Wittenberg put in to host the second weekend. I am not sure, but sometimes schools don't get it done for the first weekend they didn't do it for the second weekend either. I know Witt had a gym conflict, but that is always in the back of my head.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Viking Mike on March 02, 2019, 04:11:03 pm
In regard to the rotation of sectional sites, I can see that as being fair.  Would much rather travel to Wooster than Oswego State in Upper NY.
At 830 miles and 12.5 hrs by driving, this is about as far as driving to Salem.  That would really cut off  travel plans for a large Augustana fan contingent!

Even Marrieta OH is about 90% of the way to Salem, VA.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 02, 2019, 04:11:43 pm
In regard to the rotation of sectional sites, I can see that as being fair.  Would much rather travel to Wooster than Oswego State in Upper NY.
At 830 miles and 12.5 hrs by driving, this is about as far as driving to Salem.  That would really cut off  travel plans for a large Augustana fan contingent!

Even Marrieta OH is about 90% of the way to Salem, VA.

Men are headed to Fort Wayne, this year.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Viking Mike on March 02, 2019, 04:48:35 pm
Yeah..... I know Final Four is in Fort Wayne.  My point is that a potential sectional would be farther for Viking fans that the Final Four is, and almost as far as when Augie was in Salem in 2015 and 2017.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 02, 2019, 04:52:29 pm
FYI - let's not assume Wittenberg put in to host the second weekend. I am not sure, but sometimes schools don't get it done for the first weekend they didn't do it for the second weekend either. I know Witt had a gym conflict, but that is always in the back of my head.

It's a moot point. I don't see Wittenberg factoring into the Sectional hosting conversation (based on the likely other 3 teams).
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 02, 2019, 04:54:55 pm
Yeah..... I know Final Four is in Fort Wayne.  My point is that a potential sectional would be farther for Viking fans that the Final Four is, and almost as far as when Augie was in Salem in 2015 and 2017.

I knew what ya meant FWIW. :)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: fantastic50 on March 02, 2019, 04:55:09 pm
Wooster most recently hosted sectionals in 2011, 2012, and 2013.  In 2011, one of the teams that came to Ohio was #1 Whitworth, but the Scots used the home court advantage to move on to Salem.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on March 02, 2019, 06:14:32 pm
Whiparound (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gPl6604MC4w) is live now for anyone who didn't know.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 02, 2019, 06:37:55 pm
In regard to the rotation of sectional sites, I can see that as being fair.  Would much rather travel to Wooster than Oswego State in Upper NY.
At 830 miles and 12.5 hrs by driving, this is about as far as driving to Salem.  That would really cut off  travel plans for a large Augustana fan contingent!

Even Marrieta OH is about 90% of the way to Salem, VA.

Ok.  But that last 10% of the way south is one heck of a road, the scariest stretch of freeway this old soul has ever been on.  I made the trip the last time Wooster was in the Final Four, riding with some fellow fans in a top-heavy SUV thanks to their swelled heads.  My attempts to get them to hold it to 70 on the downhill curves were met with laughter and increased pressure on the accelerator.  Seriously, I don't know how we made it through that roller coaster of a highway.  Streaming video is the way to go.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: BobbyO on March 02, 2019, 07:12:54 pm
Austin Elledge has his left hand in a cast. It looks likes he is out for the tournament. Bad break for Augie.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 02, 2019, 07:18:15 pm
He didn't play last night.

I wouldn't call him a major loss for Augustana.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 02, 2019, 07:52:38 pm
Almost half-time. Swarthmore is up 66-43. They've hit 92%, 23-25 from the field.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: txg on March 02, 2019, 08:25:57 pm
Almost half-time. Swarthmore is up 66-43. They've hit 92%, 23-25 from the field.

94-50.  Still ten minutes to go.  That team is really clicking.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Inkblot on March 02, 2019, 08:33:18 pm
Guilford will have to fly to sectionals.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Inkblot on March 02, 2019, 08:56:43 pm
So it's Amherst, Nichols, Swarthmore, and Randolph–Macon in the lower-left sectional. I notice it's 484 miles from Randolph–Macon to Amherst.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on March 02, 2019, 09:21:25 pm
Rules on the number of cheerleaders and pep band members... oh and there's some basketball games on too. Good work Dave, Ryan, and Gordon. :)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: SUMMIT? on March 02, 2019, 09:53:17 pm
and we are assured that there will not be a repeat champion.  NWU was tough but UST's defense, depth and balance carried the day,  Not bad for  team picked to finish 4th in its conference :)

who will host upper right Sweet 16? UST, UWO, Guiliford and Loras? I believe UST & UWO are committed to hosting the women's sweet 16
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 02, 2019, 09:56:12 pm
and we are assured that there will not be a repeat champion.  NWU was tough but UST's defense, depth and balance carried the day,  Not bad for  team picked to finish 4th in its conference :)

who will host upper right Sweet 16? UST, UWO, Guiliford and Loras? I believe UST & UWO are committed to hosting the women's sweet 16

In odd-numbered years, men have preference in the 2nd weekend.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on March 02, 2019, 10:04:15 pm
and we are assured that there will not be a repeat champion.  NWU was tough but UST's defense, depth and balance carried the day,  Not bad for  team picked to finish 4th in its conference :)

who will host upper right Sweet 16? UST, UWO, Guiliford and Loras? I believe UST & UWO are committed to hosting the women's sweet 16

In odd-numbered years, men have preference in the 2nd weekend.

Guilford is flying, the other 3 are all in range of each other. Loras was ahead of St Thomas in the regional rankings. My guess is Oshkosh hosts.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 02, 2019, 10:06:41 pm
UW-Oshkosh will host. Men have preference over the women in the second weekend for hosting purposes. And UWO was third in the final Central Region ranking, while Loras was fourth and St. Thomas was fifth in the West Region ranking. All three schools are within bus distance of each other.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 02, 2019, 10:14:08 pm
UW-Oshkosh will host. Men have preference over the women in the second weekend for hosting purposes. And UWO was third in the final Central Region ranking, while Loras was fourth and St. Thomas was fifth in the West Region ranking. All three schools are within bus distance of each other.

The Central #3 vs West #4 is not a thing at all. 

Just comes down to which resume is considered better:
* Oshkosh: .885/.542/5-3 
* Loras: .778/.587/3-2 (wins over two of the tourney's top four seeds - Augustana and Nebraska Wesleyan)

That is super, super close.  Probably Oshkosh by an eyelash.

(We do know it is not St. Thomas...because they are for sure behind Loras.)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 02, 2019, 10:17:59 pm
Here is the one Augie hosts for sure:
- Augustana
- Wheaton
- Marietta
- Oswego State

Two flights either way you slice it...highest seed (Augustana) wins.

Obviously Augie as a host is a done deal.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Inkblot on March 02, 2019, 10:22:01 pm
So Augustana, Oshkosh, Amherst, and Hamilton probably?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 02, 2019, 10:27:32 pm
So Augustana, Oshkosh, Amherst, and Hamilton probably?

I think Loras vs Oshkosh is a coin flip.

I think there will be serious discussion (financially) about flying 3 teams to Whitman.  I don't think Hamilton (or Williams) is a done deal over Whitman.

Whitman is the overall #1 or #2 seed in this tournament.  Shipping them east would be a big-time screw job.  Not saying it won't happen...but this has to be a huge conversation.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: kiko on March 02, 2019, 10:33:36 pm
UW-Oshkosh will host. Men have preference over the women in the second weekend for hosting purposes. And UWO was third in the final Central Region ranking, while Loras was fourth and St. Thomas was fifth in the West Region ranking. All three schools are within bus distance of each other.

The Central #3 vs West #4 is not a thing at all. 

Just comes down to which resume is considered better:
* Oshkosh: .885/.542/5-3 
* Loras: .778/.587/3-2 (wins over two of the tourney's top four seeds - Augustana and Nebraska Wesleyan)

That is super, super close.  Probably Oshkosh by an eyelash.

(We do know it is not St. Thomas...because they are for sure behind Loras.)

Not sure if it matters at all in this conversation, but Loras just beat the team directly ahead of Oshkosh in the last set of rankings.  I don't know if the committee freezes resumes at the end of the regular season or factors in the first weekend as it parses out resumes this close.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 02, 2019, 10:35:49 pm

Not sure if it matters at all in this conversation, but Loras just beat the team directly ahead of Oshkosh in the last set of rankings.  I don't know if the committee freezes resumes at the end of the regular season or factors in the first weekend as it parses out resumes this close.

They freeze them.  So they don't look at NCAA tournament games at all...just the Selection Sunday resumes.

https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2019/02/men-regional-rankings-final
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 02, 2019, 11:25:02 pm
There was a time the data changed based on the tournament ... before it was revealed to the committee that they were influencing how that data was changing based on their tournament brackets.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Rofrog on March 02, 2019, 11:59:17 pm
Gurantee alot of brackets took a hit with that loss of NWU!!!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ralph Turner on March 03, 2019, 12:01:15 am
Gurantee alot of brackets took a hit with that loss of NWU!!!
... except the brackets in Tommie-land...
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: 7express on March 03, 2019, 01:40:18 am
So....the bean counters that count the flights do they factor in how many women's teams have to fly AND the potential flights to the final 4, or do the separate men's and women's committee worry about the flights for their respective tournaments??

If the NCAA as a whole does the flights for both the men's and women's tournaments I could potentially see Whitman hosting again.  By my count, the women's bracket only had 2 flights in the first round (George Fox to Wash U, and Pomona-Pitzer to Oshkosh) and in my projected sectional final hosts I have 2 flights (Texas-Dallas to Thomas More, and Amherst to St. Thomas), and I believe the men's tournament had 3 flights (the 3 teams to Whitman).  If they are combined, a total of 7 flights throughout both tournaments doesn't seem terrible, especially considering some years it seems like there's 5+ flights on one side alone.  Add in 2 flights to the final 4 and we are at 9 total.  Will they pay for 3 more to go back to Eastern Washington??
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: 7express on March 03, 2019, 02:04:54 am
Bottom left bracket is definitely going to Amherst.  All teams check in at under 500 miles, so 0 flights for the NCAA, the other 3 regions, yikes!
Bottom right I'll go Augustana getting hosting duties.  Turns out that quadrant needs 2 flights regardless, so give it to the best team and that's Augustana.
Upper right I'll go Oshkosh.  Guilford will have to fly regardless and I think Oshkosh gets the slight edge over Loras, but that one is real close, I could see that going either way, not comfortable in that at all.
Upper left Hamilton: IF Wooster had won, all of a sudden you could turn that quadrant from 2 flights into 1 so I could see maybe sending 3 flights to Walla Walla, but now with 3 guaranteed already on top of the 3 they sent to Walla Walla in the first round, I don't see how they send 3 up there again, but hey I've been wrong before and I'll be wrong again at some point.  I'm not sure this would have been possible anyways, with the women having the priority first round and the Texas-Dallas women hosting a first round pod, but ironically if that Whitman pod gets sent to Texas-Dallas instead they could subtract 1 flight from the first round, so maybe Whitman gets to host instead??  Too bad because we'll never know.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 03, 2019, 07:56:02 am
Upper left Hamilton: IF Wooster Whitman had won, all of a sudden you could turn that quadrant from 2 flights into 1 so I could see maybe sending 3 flights to Walla Walla, but now with 3 guaranteed already on top of the 3 they sent to Walla Walla in the first round, I don't see how they send 3 up there again, but hey I've been wrong before and I'll be wrong again at some point.  I'm not sure this would have been possible anyways, with the women having the priority first round and the Texas-Dallas women hosting a first round pod, but ironically if that Whitman pod gets sent to Texas-Dallas instead they could subtract 1 flight from the first round, so maybe Whitman gets to host instead??  Too bad because we'll never know.

FTFY
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 03, 2019, 08:08:08 am
Upper left Hamilton: IF Wooster Whitman had won, all of a sudden you could turn that quadrant from 2 flights into 1 so I could see maybe sending 3 flights to Walla Walla, but now with 3 guaranteed already on top of the 3 they sent to Walla Walla in the first round, I don't see how they send 3 up there again, but hey I've been wrong before and I'll be wrong again at some point.  I'm not sure this would have been possible anyways, with the women having the priority first round and the Texas-Dallas women hosting a first round pod, but ironically if that Whitman pod gets sent to Texas-Dallas instead they could subtract 1 flight from the first round, so maybe Whitman gets to host instead??  Too bad because we'll never know.

FTFY

He had it right.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Flying Dutch Fan on March 03, 2019, 08:20:17 am
If both Loras and Augustana host, have we ever had two sectionals that close to one another before?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 03, 2019, 09:01:44 am
Here is how I see the seeding order of the 16 teams left, using the official Selection Sunday criteria...

Projected overall seeding order of remaining 16 teams
1. Whitman: .963/.563/5-1
2. Augustana: .889/.544/8-3
3. Amherst: .852/.568/8-3 
4. Christopher Newport: .893/.549/7-3
5. Randolph-Macon: .893/.542/6-3
6. UW-Oshkosh: .885/.542/5-3
7. Loras: .778/.587/3-2
8. Oswego State: .815/.532/8-4
9. Swarthmore: .889/.535/5-1
10. Hamilton: .852/.553/4-4
11. St. Thomas .846/.531/5-3
12. Nichols: .926/.525/4-2
13. Williams: .769/.598/6-5
14. Marietta: .769/.549/6-4
15. Guilford: .750/.545/5-4
16. Wheaton: .704/.573/5-5


Whitman Bracket
1. Whitman
4. Christopher Newport
10. Hamilton
13. Williams
(Actual bracket pairings: Whitman vs Williams; Christopher Newport vs Hamilton)

Amherst Bracket
3. Amherst
5. Randolph-Macon
9. Swarthmore
12. Nichols
(Actual bracket pairings:  Amherst vs Nichols; Swarthmore vs Randolph-Macon)

Nebraska Wesleyan Bracket
6. UW-Oshkosh
7. Loras
11. St. Thomas
15. Guilford
(Actual bracket pairings:  UW-Oshkosh vs Loras; St. Thomas vs Guilford)

Augustana Bracket
2. Augustana
8. Oswego State
14. Marietta
16. Wheaton
(Actual bracket pairings:  Augustana vs Wheaton; Oswego State vs Marietta)


In a perfect world (no mileage considerations), the 4 highest seeds (in bold) would host. (I have Oshkosh vs Loras as basically a tie...that is a tough one.)

Also time to give huge kudos to the national committee for making maybe the best bracket I have ever seen.  Check out the balance here -- this is really, really hard to do with the geographical constraints they have.

The Loras/UW-Oshkosh game is the only one above that is "one game too early" based on seeding...but had Nebraska Wesleyan won, that bracket would be perfect too.

Kudos...this is great stuff.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 03, 2019, 09:11:22 am
I continue to think making Whitman fly to Hamilton or Williams would be wrong. 

* Whitman is the highest seed in that pod, and the highest seed remaining in the tournament.
* This pod requires 2 flights if you use Hamilton or Williams...and just 1 more if Whitman

Gotta be a way to find 1 more flight to protect Whitman, as the highest seed left in the tournament.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 03, 2019, 11:54:27 am
Official...

Hamilton
Amherst
UW-Oshkosh
Augustana
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: blackhawks4 on March 03, 2019, 12:58:17 pm
I continue to think making Whitman fly to Hamilton or Williams would be wrong. 

* Whitman is the highest seed in that pod, and the highest seed remaining in the tournament.
* This pod requires 2 flights if you use Hamilton or Williams...and just 1 more if Whitman

Gotta be a way to find 1 more flight to protect Whitman, as the highest seed left in the tournament.

Agree, but WMN came in expecting to go on the road after the first pod--so it's no let-down.  Their road to the trophy is certainly one of the toughest
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ralph Turner on March 03, 2019, 01:52:27 pm
I continue to think making Whitman fly to Hamilton or Williams would be wrong. 

* Whitman is the highest seed in that pod, and the highest seed remaining in the tournament.
* This pod requires 2 flights if you use Hamilton or Williams...and just 1 more if Whitman

Gotta be a way to find 1 more flight to protect Whitman, as the highest seed left in the tournament.

Agree, but WMN came in expecting to go on the road after the first pod--so it's no let-down.  Their road to the trophy is certainly one of the toughest
Such is life on the archipelago...

I remember the 2008 women's Sweet 16.  Howard Payne was undefeated (29-0) and was filling the 3000 seat Brownwood Coliseum. The NCAA flew #19 DeSales (26-3) #1 Hope (29-0; Hope men were hosting the second weekend) and #22 George Fox (25-4) to Brownwood TX.  (An aside, the stars were aligned for HPU to host the Sweet 16!)

If Whitman had been undefeated, would the NCAA have allowed them to host?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 03, 2019, 02:12:52 pm
Upper left Hamilton: IF Wooster Whitman had won, all of a sudden you could turn that quadrant from 2 flights into 1 so I could see maybe sending 3 flights to Walla Walla, but now with 3 guaranteed already on top of the 3 they sent to Walla Walla in the first round, I don't see how they send 3 up there again, but hey I've been wrong before and I'll be wrong again at some point.  I'm not sure this would have been possible anyways, with the women having the priority first round and the Texas-Dallas women hosting a first round pod, but ironically if that Whitman pod gets sent to Texas-Dallas instead they could subtract 1 flight from the first round, so maybe Whitman gets to host instead??  Too bad because we'll never know.

FTFY

He had it right.

Yeah, you're right. He was talking about two different sectionals at the same time, so it was a little confusing. That's what I get for reading it in a hurry. My bad, 7x.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: sac on March 03, 2019, 02:22:55 pm
I think the Whitman bracket was always going to be in the East for Sectional weekend.

The possibility is still out there that all 4 final four teams could fly to Ft. Wayne.    Two guaranteed flights and St. Thomas, Guilford and Oswego St are all 500+ to Ft. Wayne.


Kind of interesting that 11 of 16 teams are eligible to fly to Ft. Wayne and if we were in Salem.......11 of 16 teams would be eligible to fly.  Though at present time only 1 bracket is a guaranteed flight to Salem vs the guaranteed 2 flights to Ft. Wayne we have at the moment.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 03, 2019, 02:27:38 pm
I've heard that the plan was to have Whitman host...until the Augustana bracket turned into a 2 flight situation. 
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 03, 2019, 04:46:42 pm
I've heard that the plan was to have Whitman host...until the Augustana bracket turned into a 2 flight situation.

I agree.  If those four could've driven, I think they would've sprung for one extra flight like they did the first weekend.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 03, 2019, 05:02:11 pm
As usual, this board is all about trying to think ahead of the NCAA regarding host locations.  Not a word about last night's games or the now-determined Sweet 16 match-ups.  Of course the subject matter is determined by everyone's interests, but I continue to find it amazing that the basketball itself receives so little attention.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 03, 2019, 05:06:37 pm
As usual, this board is all about trying to think ahead of the NCAA regarding host locations.  Not a word about last night's games or the now-determined Sweet 16 match-ups.  Of course the subject matter is determined by everyone's interests, but I continue to find it amazing that the basketball itself receives so little attention.

Meanwhile, the last post on the NCAC board was at 6:25pm yesterday.  Not a single post about the Wooster/Wheaton game.

http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=4200.15585
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: WUPHF on March 03, 2019, 05:08:47 pm
As usual, this board is all about trying to think ahead of the NCAA regarding host locations.  Not a word about last night's games or the now-determined Sweet 16 match-ups.  Of course the subject matter is determined by everyone's interests, but I continue to find it amazing that the basketball itself receives so little attention.

Be the change you wish to see in the world.
-Ghandi (or more likely someone else)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: sac on March 03, 2019, 06:13:28 pm
As usual, this board is all about trying to think ahead of the NCAA regarding host locations.  Not a word about last night's games or the now-determined Sweet 16 match-ups.  Of course the subject matter is determined by everyone's interests, but I continue to find it amazing that the basketball itself receives so little attention.

Meanwhile, the last post on the NCAC board was at 6:25pm yesterday.  Not a single post about the Wooster/Wheaton game.

http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=4200.15585

Video and audio feed must have been good.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 03, 2019, 06:53:45 pm
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=ntb5x/3u7xixj9qrgmdvn7.jpg)

We are down to 32. A great weekend of basketball has cut the NCAA tournament teams in half. There were some surprises, surprising outcomes, and fun environments around DIII. Even the end of the title defense of Nebraska Wesleyan.

On Sunday's Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com), we try and recap it all while also hearing from several of the coaches who found themselves in the thick of it.

Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. Sunday's show hits the air at 7:00 p.m. ET. You can watch it in the video player above. If you miss any of the show, you can watch it On Demand or listen the audio-only podcast to the right (available shortly after the show goes off air).

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to dave.mchugh@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options to the right.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Mike Schauer, Wheaton (Ill.) men’s coach
- Tom Palombo, Guilford men’s coach
- Randi Henderson, No. 22 WashU women’s coach
- Fred Richter, No. 15 DeSales women’s coach
- Bill Broderick, Christopher Newport women’s coach
- Dave Hixon, No. 7 Amherst men’s coach

If you enjoy the show via the podcasts, choose your favorite avenue to listen and/or subscribe via the the following four avenues (click on the images when necessary):
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Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 03, 2019, 09:58:30 pm
So is there official word on hosts?

Bob posted something earlier that started "official" and then seemed to list the hosts, but it looks like it got deleted. I haven't seen anything on the front page, Oshkosh page or NCAA page.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 03, 2019, 10:09:14 pm
So is there official word on hosts?

Bob posted something earlier that started "official" and then seemed to list the hosts, but it looks like it got deleted. I haven't seen anything on the front page, Oshkosh page or NCAA page.

We updated the brackets and we posted to Twitter.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: AllStar on March 03, 2019, 10:19:27 pm
(https://i.imgur.com/EoZiJxY.png)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 04, 2019, 06:23:41 am
So is there official word on hosts?

Bob posted something earlier that started "official" and then seemed to list the hosts, but it looks like it got deleted. I haven't seen anything on the front page, Oshkosh page or NCAA page.

We updated the brackets and we posted to Twitter.

Ok. Thanks. I didn't look at the brackets and I don't Tweet. I also didn't see anything on Facebook.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 04, 2019, 01:23:19 pm
There was one other place -- I updated our Saturday night recap on Sunday morning with the host sites.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ralph Turner on March 04, 2019, 01:58:53 pm
I guess that I read the Clinton pod as being a 1 v 4 game with Williams at the #4.

Hmmm... that is something you don't see very often, the NESCAC team at the #4 seed.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: (509)Rat on March 04, 2019, 02:22:19 pm
I guess that I read the Clinton pod as being a 1 v 4 game with Williams at the #4.

Hmmm... that is something you don't see very often, the NESCAC team at the #4 seed.

Just don't go feeling too sorry for the NESCAC team that gets to play 2.5 hours away from home in a gym they are very familiar with  ;)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: toad22 on March 04, 2019, 02:41:16 pm
I guess that I read the Clinton pod as being a 1 v 4 game with Williams at the #4.

Hmmm... that is something you don't see very often, the NESCAC team at the #4 seed.

Just don't go feeling too sorry for the NESCAC team that gets to play 2.5 hours away from home in a gym they are very familiar with  ;)

It is true that Williams knows the Hamilton gym pretty well. Personally, I think the gym is pretty bad, so another gym would be more fun, even if it was in Walla Walla!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 04, 2019, 02:44:00 pm
So is there official word on hosts?

Bob posted something earlier that started "official" and then seemed to list the hosts, but it looks like it got deleted. I haven't seen anything on the front page, Oshkosh page or NCAA page.

Still there...

Official...

Hamilton
Amherst
UW-Oshkosh
Augustana
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: ronk on March 04, 2019, 02:47:08 pm
Rules ?: what's the reason for the different semicircles under the baskets? is there a gender difference in distance from the hoop?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: lmitzel on March 04, 2019, 02:59:07 pm
Rules ?: what's the reason for the different semicircles under the baskets? is there a gender difference in distance from the hoop?

I checked both rule books; for both men's and women's it's a 4 foot radius. From what I can tell, the smaller ring is a 3 foot radius and was the rule for a few years before the NCAA expanded it to 4 feet. A lot of schools probably just haven't gotten around to removing the old arc yet.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: ronk on March 04, 2019, 03:15:08 pm
Rules ?: what's the reason for the different semicircles under the baskets? is there a gender difference in distance from the hoop?

I checked both rule books; for both men's and women's it's a 4 foot radius. From what I can tell, the smaller ring is a 3 foot radius and was the rule for a few years before the NCAA expanded it to 4 feet. A lot of schools probably just haven't gotten around to removing the old arc yet.

thanks, I talked with a knowledgeable high school ref yesterday and he wasn't aware of a distance change, so I was thinking gender difference, instead.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Oline89 on March 04, 2019, 03:17:32 pm
Rules ?: what's the reason for the different semicircles under the baskets? is there a gender difference in distance from the hoop?

I checked both rule books; for both men's and women's it's a 4 foot radius. From what I can tell, the smaller ring is a 3 foot radius and was the rule for a few years before the NCAA expanded it to 4 feet. A lot of schools probably just haven't gotten around to removing the old arc yet.

The same applies for the 3 point line, same for men's and women's teams.  Some schools have just not removed the old one.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Conts Fan on March 04, 2019, 03:44:53 pm
Rules ?: what's the reason for the different semicircles under the baskets? is there a gender difference in distance from the hoop?

I checked both rule books; for both men's and women's it's a 4 foot radius. From what I can tell, the smaller ring is a 3 foot radius and was the rule for a few years before the NCAA expanded it to 4 feet. A lot of schools probably just haven't gotten around to removing the old arc yet.

The same applies for the 3 point line, same for men's and women's teams.  Some schools have just not removed the old one.
Also - a lot of college gyms host high school games at times, which still use the closer 3 point line.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ralph Turner on March 04, 2019, 05:05:40 pm
I guess that I read the Clinton pod as being a 1 v 4 game with Williams at the #4.

Hmmm... that is something you don't see very often, the NESCAC team at the #4 seed.

Just don't go feeling too sorry for the NESCAC team that gets to play 2.5 hours away from home in a gym they are very familiar with  ;)
Yep, life is tough on the archipelago.   :(

Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Rofrog on March 04, 2019, 11:23:52 pm
This should be rule of thumb,You should never have two teams from the same league(Conference)hosting sectionals,that is in my book!!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Rofrog on March 05, 2019, 01:39:11 am
Whitman fans you guys got hosed by the ncaa.This stuff about flights is a joke 2 years ago they flew Scranton and Tufts to Wash U in the womens sectionals.You guys(Whitmans)  deserved to host if not you,at least CNU but it was all Whitmans Sectional!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 05, 2019, 12:03:22 pm
Whitman fans you guys got hosed by the ncaa.This stuff about flights is a joke 2 years ago they flew Scranton and Tufts to Wash U in the womens sectionals.You guys(Whitmans)  deserved to host if not you,at least CNU but it was all Whitmans Sectional!

I have no problem with people complaining about the limitations of the system.  That's fine and I think you'd get wide agreement about those frustrations.  I do have a problem with people saying a team "gets hosed" or bracketing is "unfair."  Making those claims implies that the men's committee has done something wrong or contrary to their own guidelines.

We have the tournament that d3 has designed.  The limitations are agreed-upon limitations, with a specific, spelled-out system that's incredibly transparent.  There is no big bad NCAA standing over little d3 being mean.  The NCAA is the schools, coming together for some attempt at a system that honors the realities in which they operate.

Would it be better if the bracket could be perfectly seeded and travel work without driving limitations?  Absolutely.  We all agree.  But it's not somebody's "fault."  There is no one to blame.  I know we all like having an enemy out there to call out, but that's not the situation we're in.

If we're going to complain about a less-than-ideal system (and that's cool; I like doing that), it's pretty unhelpful to do so without offering alternatives that make sense given the current realities.  In other words, it's got to be workable.

If you really want to see a ridiculous, messed-up bracket.  Go compare the 2009 men's tournament bracket with the rankings that year.  Things are better than they were and they continue to be so every year.  They can get better, but it won't happen if all we get are complaints without any rational solutions.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: stag44 on March 05, 2019, 12:19:59 pm

If we're going to complain about a less-than-ideal system (and that's cool; I like doing that), it's pretty unhelpful to do so without offering alternatives that make sense given the current realities.  In other words, it's got to be workable.

If you really want to see a ridiculous, messed-up bracket.  Go compare the 2009 men's tournament bracket with the rankings that year.  Things are better than they were and they continue to be so every year.  They can get better, but it won't happen if all we get are complaints without any rational solutions.

Im sure this has been discussed, but if the schools are able to raise an endowment to support an bracket that is more based on rankings and removes the geographic and cost related constraints, is this something the NCAA would be open to?

I'm sure we would need to make sure this held across all sports and that would grow the endowment, but if we were able to have say 10 or 12 flights in the first round if needed, I think that would create a much better bracket and if cost is really the only constraint or hurdle I've got to imagine this is something we can overcome.

I think that most schools in the SCIAC and NWC would be front and center in figuring out how to fund this and I'm not sure what size bill you would be looking at, but I'd imagine something like a $100M-$200M endowment would support this and I think some of these schools could go out and help fundraise it.

I don't know if that causes conflict of interest with the NCAA depending on the proportion of funding from each school, but if there was an agreement that this promotes a bracket that removes cost and geography and nothing else, it could be interesting. I'm not sure what the cost for flying teams around would be, but I think a road trip is something like $50K if you include flights and hotels for a weekend for the teams and staff on a conservative basis. If you did that across all sports to it would add up, but I think it would be feasible
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: WUPHF on March 05, 2019, 12:30:29 pm
I'm sure this has been discussed, but if the schools are able to raise an endowment to support an bracket that is more based on rankings and removes the geographic and cost related constraints, is this something the NCAA would be open to?

Its a good idea in theory, but you are unlikely to find any school who is going to contribute in any way whatsoever.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 05, 2019, 12:37:11 pm
There are 28 team championships in Division III ... what is done for one must be done for all. DIII spends over $25m currently on it's championships (75% of the roughly $35m operating budget). The amount of money needed to make it "fair" in all sports would be insane. Schools in DIII already give more than any other NCAA member (close to $2,000 a year per institution) and they raised it to that level willingly to try and close budget gaps. To ask for an endowment from all the schools that basically needs probably $10-$20 million more to be fair and equitable to all championships (and I am totally guessing how much it would really cost) is probably a real stretch.

Ryan nailed it on the head - probably said it better than I did at the end of Sunday's Hoopsville show. We need to stop claiming teams are being screwed when the reality has limits and the committees are doing a pretty decent job considering those limits. Three teams were shipped to Whitman in the opening weekend. In the past, that would have been unheard of. There was no chance in hell they were going to ship three more teams to Whitman as well. Comparing to a women's tournament that shipped two teams to a site isn't comparable since we have two teams "flying" to Hamilton (CNU to Hamilton is 548 miles).

Furthermore, as I said on Hoopsville Sunday, do NOT be surprised if the committee is handcuffed next season. There is real concern the men got away with a little too much (I can't go into all of what I have learned). The NCAA (those who are the bean counters to the rules, regulations, and budget membership agrees upon) may very well come back and tell the committee they got greedy and restrict them next season. It is a theory I have on the women's side this year (GFU not hosting three teams in comparison the opening weekend after last season's rather open bracket). Some things are unavoidable, but many years the possibility (worst case even) of flights the second weekend would force the committee to change the bracket to reduce the risk or opportunity. We are looking at eight flights in the opening two weekends of the tournament this year. That is a lot of flights in the grand scheme of things.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 05, 2019, 12:44:53 pm

A lot of the complaints hinge on the d3 tourney looking more like d1.  One of the hallmarks of d3 is that it isn't d1, that athletics are not driving the bus for how things work.  The schools, largely, like what we have.  The limitations are important for keeping athletics in check.  That's frustrating for some people, but it's very much the perspective of A LOT of the membership.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 05, 2019, 12:47:51 pm

A lot of the complaints hinge on the d3 tourney looking more like d1.  One of the hallmarks of d3 is that it isn't d1, that athletics are not driving the bus for how things work.  The schools, largely, like what we have.  The limitations are important for keeping athletics in check.  That's frustrating for some people, but it's very much the perspective of A LOT of the membership.

A LOT of NCAA tournaments actually don't look like the D1 men's and women's basketball tournament. Far more than people realize. DII and DIII for starters, but even DI has tournaments that don't mimic the MBB and WBB events.

And your last point about perspective is right on point.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Inkblot on March 05, 2019, 02:55:01 pm
The DI men's basketball tournament is unlike basically every other NCAA championship at any level, sport, or gender in that it's TV-driven. There was no particular reason to expand the field to 68 other than adding two more days of games. The women's tournament has never gone beyond 64.

The unique level of viewership and money adds one other unique factor: Virtually every other NCAA championship either determines hosts based on who the best teams are or has pre-determined host schools that will play at home if they qualify. The DI men's basketball tournament actually forbids teams from playing at home. Even if the games are off campus, often there's an official host school not allowed to play at the site.

Unless the NCAA takes over the College Football Playoff, it's difficult to imagine any other NCAA championships following the pattern of the DI men's basketball tournament.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Caz Bombers on March 05, 2019, 03:20:44 pm
there's also D1 men's hockey, the championships committee of which would seem to actively hate its own sport, taking away raucous on-campus rink atmospheres in March in favor of overpriced empty minor league arenas in such paradise destinations as Manchester, New Hampshire and Allentown, Pennsylvania.

Death to neutral site hockey, at the very very very least before the Frozen Four.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 05, 2019, 03:26:44 pm
I may be go to Manchester...England, even if it rains a lot, but probably not Manchester, NH.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Rofrog on March 05, 2019, 10:05:07 pm
We cant keep making excuses.We cant have one week the team with the better sos,rac numbers get in and then following week in the sectionals you hose a team because you don't want to fly 3 teams out there.Either we are going to follow standards through out the tournament or just say we will do what is good for the ncaa and not the Students.These kids bust their ass to get to these championship in d3 and it is about time the NCAA d1 starts supporting these kids
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: kiko on March 06, 2019, 12:40:30 am
We cant keep making excuses.We cant have one week the team with the better sos,rac numbers get in and then following week in the sectionals you hose a team because you don't want to fly 3 teams out there.Either we are going to follow standards through out the tournament or just say we will do what is good for the ncaa and not the Students.These kids bust their ass to get to these championship in d3 and it is about time the NCAA d1 starts supporting these kids

D1 already IS supporting these kids.  Do the math on the per-school dues that was mentioned earlier, and multiply that number by the number of D3 schools.  Then compare that to the $25MM annual cost mentioned earlier for putting on the various and sundry D3 championships.  D1 -- and specifically revenue from the D1 men's basketball tournament -- is very much supporting our tourney.

And nobody is making excuses.  As was noted above -- the committee is following a standard throughout the tournament that was set and agreed to by the membership.  If they did something other than what they are doing now, then it would be contrary to the wishes of the membership.  The D3 philosophy is that it is better for the students if everyone is not getting on airplanes and missing extra class time for the sake of a basketball tournament.  The schools on the D3 archipelago are eyes-wide-open as to how they are likely to be treated come tournament time, and yet they have still made the decision to affiliate with the division.

Regarding the idea of an endowment for tournament travel -- a good chunk of the D3 membership would likely self-identify as feeling underendowed.  A lot of schools have enough trouble raising money for their own endowments, and certainly would not have interest in cannibalizing their own efforts by tapping their donor base to raise money that would instead be used for other purposes.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Rofrog on March 06, 2019, 01:17:36 am
 They are still flying two teams why not reward the team that has a better record etc l,Like they do to get into the tournament.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on March 06, 2019, 01:45:41 am
They are still flying two teams why not reward the team that has a better record etc l,Like they do to get into the tournament.
There's 4 teams this weekend eligible to fly (Guilford, Marietta, Oswego St, Whitman). Not a chance that they'd send the pod out to Whitman and end up with 6 flights. If you were to start flying all over the place in one sport you'd have to do it in all sports and as has been said by others, it's just not in the budget.

Considering out of 16 teams, 4 will play at home. That means 1/3 of the traveling teams will be able to fly. That's a pretty high number.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: kiko on March 06, 2019, 01:55:02 am
They are still flying two teams why not reward the team that has a better record etc l,Like they do to get into the tournament.

Show us how to make it work so that Whitman hosts and there are the same number of flights this weekend as we have now.  That's why not reward the team with a better record, etc.

Selecting the tournament field is a matter of reflecting the D3 philosophy of equal access to the postseason.  Unlike when airplanes are involved, it has nothing to do with dollars and cents.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 06, 2019, 02:17:42 am
Well, one thing that could easily be changed. for clarity and without the need for permission from either the NCAA or any of the DIII schools, is the title of this thread.  How about:

2019 NCAA Tournament Seeding, Bracketology, and Logistics

 ;D
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Rofrog on March 06, 2019, 04:02:11 am
Maybe neautral courts!!See when it comes tournament time-they harp on SOS and Regional rankings etc So we have a team like Whitman(who was good enough to host the first/second round)but not good enough to host the sectionals.Why/what changed to not give one of the best teams( not from me but d3hoops/massey/ncaa)the right to host the sectionals.Im just trying to get a feel the way they work today with d3 sports?I'm not arguing just legitimate questions!Thanks for the input.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 06, 2019, 06:27:19 am
Maybe neautral courts!!See when it comes tournament time-they harp on SOS and Regional rankings etc So we have a team like Whitman (who was good enough to host the first/second round)but not good enough to host the sectionals.Why/what changed to not give one of the best teams( not from me but d3hoops/massey/ncaa)the right to host the sectionals.Im just trying to get a feel the way they work today with d3 sports?I'm not arguing just legitimate questions!Thanks for the input.

In regards to the 2nd weekend, it has nothing to do with the fact if they weren't good enough or not. Flight costs. Simple as that.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: CNU85 on March 06, 2019, 07:58:39 am
neutral sites won't work in D3 either.....there would be empty arenas until the final four.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 06, 2019, 08:30:47 am
neutral sites won't work in D3 either.....there would be empty arenas until the final four.

Plus, who would want to host?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 06, 2019, 08:58:58 am
We cant keep making excuses.We cant have one week the team with the better sos,rac numbers get in and then following week in the sectionals you hose a team because you don't want to fly 3 teams out there.Either we are going to follow standards through out the tournament or just say we will do what is good for the ncaa and not the Students.These kids bust their ass to get to these championship in d3 and it is about time the NCAA d1 starts supporting these kids

They ARE following the standards of d3 and the tournament.  You just don't like the standards.  Those are two very different arguments.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 06, 2019, 11:06:28 am
Neutral courts? How would that solve the Whitman problem?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 06, 2019, 11:48:57 am
Neutral courts? How would that solve the Whitman problem?

Glad someone said something. I was chuckling at the thought of somehow the NCAA paying to fly four teams to St. Louis or something.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: nescac1 on March 06, 2019, 11:59:58 am
It's indeed a bummer that, due to costs, Whitman will never, under any foreseeable circumstance, get to host a sectional.  But I will say, the NCAA did as good a job as possible under those circumstances in giving Whitman a fair shake this year.  By all accounts Whitman and NWU were the top two seeds in this tournament.  Had things gone according to chalk, here are their respective paths to the title game.  It's not at all clear that (notwithstanding two fewer home games), Whitman was expected to face a more difficult path:

Whitman: hosting Texas Lutheran, hosting Pomona Pitzer, vs. Williams on a neutral court, at Hamilton, vs. Amherst on a neutral court
NWU: hosting Eureka, hosting St. Thomas, hosting Wittinberg, hosting Wisconsin Oshkosh, vs. Augustana on a neutral court
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: WUPHF on March 06, 2019, 12:21:20 pm
Neutral courts? How would that solve the Whitman problem?

Glad someone said something. I was chuckling at the thought of somehow the NCAA paying to fly four teams to St. Louis or something.

OK, now we're talking!

By the way, St. Louis hosts both the GLVC tournament and the MVC conference tournament this weekend so it may not get the broad support it needs, but I would love to see a city like St. Louis or Chicago compete for the next round of Division III Final Fours.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: thebear on March 06, 2019, 01:15:33 pm
I go back to the college division [combined D-II/D-III] days.  As I recall then, the Final 8 went to Evansville for up to 3 games.

The NAIA for years used to do a four game tournament in KC over I think five or six days.

Really think Whitman got screwed, top seed remaining and they have to travel. 

Suspect the NCAA spends more on hospitality suites at the D-I tournament than those flights would cost.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: augie77 on March 06, 2019, 01:36:37 pm
The NAIA tournament in Kansas City consisted of 32 district winners playing over a span of six days.  Most but not all current D3 schools switched to the NCAA format in 1974-75.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Inkblot on March 06, 2019, 01:48:19 pm
> The NAIA tournament in Kansas City consisted of 32 district winners playing over a span of six days.

The NAIA still has 32 teams at one site for their tournaments, though that'll change in 2021.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 06, 2019, 02:14:44 pm
I go back to the college division [combined D-II/D-III] days.  As I recall then, the Final 8 went to Evansville for up to 3 games.

The NAIA for years used to do a four game tournament in KC over I think five or six days.

Really think Whitman got screwed, top seed remaining and they have to travel. 

Suspect the NCAA spends more on hospitality suites at the D-I tournament than those flights would cost.

Don't compare what D1 does with the money it has (and earned through it's contracts which DIII gets a percentage of by constitutional rule) and what D3 does. It isn't even worth the breathe. It also isn't helpful.

Whitman didn't get screwed because they hosted the opening weekend. By all measures in DIII, that shouldn't have happened at all. Three flights to Walla Walla when it could have been with two in Texas is a major deal.

As Ryan said, we can talk about changing it (and that means we need to find millions and million of dollars for the division on a yearly basis) or we can discuss the scope of how things operate. Whitman didn't get screwed this year. They were actually rewarded by playing at home the opening weekend. It sucks. We get that. No one is arguing that. What we are saying is this: In a realistic way ... how would you change it. The key word there: realistic.

BTW - there are five flights this weekend. CNU may still bus, but the consideration is they are a flight. (Heck, Marietta may be bussing, too, for all I know.) But again, a sixth flight isn't going to be allowed just "because it's the fair thing to do."

George Fox women got to host a sectional weekend a few years ago ... thanks to CNU, actually. Their women's team pulled off the upsets in the opening weekend and were now outside the 500 mile radius from Thomas More - not something the committee expected. That set-up three teams who had to fly to whomever the host was. It didn't matter - they were ALL outside of 500 miles from each other. That is a realistic and "fair" scenario when a team like Whitman would host. A scenario that has two teams within 250 miles of one another and two others needing flights ... is NOT realistic for Whitman to host.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: CNU85 on March 06, 2019, 02:15:46 pm
neutral sites won't work in D3 either.....there would be empty arenas until the final four.

Plus, who would want to host?

Exactly...who can support 32 teams. It would have to be a major city like the NAIA in KC. Oh...2017 attendance for that ...39,000 for 31 games. That sounds like a rip roaring environment.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 06, 2019, 02:22:28 pm
neutral sites won't work in D3 either.....there would be empty arenas until the final four.

Plus, who would want to host?

Exactly...who can support 32 teams. It would have to be a major city like the NAIA in KC. Oh...2017 attendance for that ...39,000 for 31 games. That sounds like a rip roaring environment.

So I noticed the average is about 1200 per game. Ouch.

To be fair ... DIII hasn't been able to prove a great environment for neutral games all that often. The MBB and WBB championships in Atlanta and Indy were great environments in front of tens of thousands of fans ... but those were one-off events and I believe the tickets for both (I know it was for MBB) were free.

The soccer championships were in KC a few years ... they didn't draw many even though that is a hotbed of soccer in this country.

Neutral site is not realistic. Teams will host if they have a vested interest. They aren't going to expend the costs nor the manpower for events that don't involve themselves. To be fair, that is why Salem had created a niche for so many years (and continues in a lot of sports). They have a city and a conference interested in doing it. Not many others have succeeded because they don't have an interest when their institution isn't involved.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 06, 2019, 02:42:00 pm
neutral sites won't work in D3 either.....there would be empty arenas until the final four.

Plus, who would want to host?

Exactly...who can support 32 teams. It would have to be a major city like the NAIA in KC. Oh...2017 attendance for that ...39,000 for 31 games. That sounds like a rip roaring environment.

So I noticed the average is about 1200 per game. Ouch.

... which is actually not bad for small-college basketball when you take into consideration that a whole bunch of those games are played at relatively inconvenient times of the day. But it's certainly not what you want for the division's showcase, especially in a large arena. It just comes down to too much travel expected from fanbases that are small to begin with.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 06, 2019, 02:48:12 pm
I agree with both points, Sager. It is good on average, but not for a showcase.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: WUPHF on March 06, 2019, 02:54:38 pm
The soccer championships were in KC a few years ... they didn't draw many even though that is a hotbed of soccer in this country.

The problem with a hotbed of course is that there are usually many options to consume soccer.  In KC, they have Sporting KC and Division II Rockhurst and the various high school and club teams, many of which have a strong following.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 06, 2019, 04:01:08 pm
It's indeed a bummer that, due to costs, Whitman will never, under any foreseeable circumstance, get to host a sectional.  But I will say, the NCAA did as good a job as possible under those circumstances in giving Whitman a fair shake this year.  By all accounts Whitman and NWU were the top two seeds in this tournament.  Had things gone according to chalk, here are their respective paths to the title game.  It's not at all clear that (notwithstanding two fewer home games), Whitman was expected to face a more difficult path:

Whitman: hosting Texas Lutheran, hosting Pomona Pitzer, vs. Williams on a neutral court, at Hamilton, vs. Amherst on a neutral court
NWU: hosting Eureka, hosting St. Thomas, hosting Wittinberg, hosting Wisconsin Oshkosh, vs. Augustana on a neutral court

I don't know if it's entirely impossible. In Point's first championship year, three teams flew out to Puget Sound because Stevens Point was hosting the women's sectional, and Lawrence's Alexander Gymnasium was too small. So we all went out West. Next year, women have rights the 2nd weekend. You never know what may happen.

Edit: Apparently, Lawrence hosted a first round game, so not sure why they couldn't host the sectionals.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 06, 2019, 04:06:12 pm
neutral sites won't work in D3 either.....there would be empty arenas until the final four.

Plus, who would want to host?

Exactly...who can support 32 teams. It would have to be a major city like the NAIA in KC. Oh...2017 attendance for that ...39,000 for 31 games. That sounds like a rip roaring environment.

I thought we were talking about neutral sites for the sectionals.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 06, 2019, 04:07:28 pm
neutral sites won't work in D3 either.....there would be empty arenas until the final four.

Plus, who would want to host?

Exactly...who can support 32 teams. It would have to be a major city like the NAIA in KC. Oh...2017 attendance for that ...39,000 for 31 games. That sounds like a rip roaring environment.

So I noticed the average is about 1200 per game. Ouch.

... which is actually not bad for small-college basketball when you take into consideration that a whole bunch of those games are played at relatively inconvenient times of the day. But it's certainly not what you want for the division's showcase, especially in a large arena. It just comes down to too much travel expected from fanbases that are small to begin with.

Plus, honestly, I wouldn't want our championship to be decided by a battle of attrition and who is still upright on the fourth and fifth day of a 32-team tournament.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: nescac1 on March 06, 2019, 04:30:07 pm
I'd be all in on the 32-team, five-day battle royale, so long as a cage is involved. 
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: AO on March 06, 2019, 04:39:54 pm
I'd be all in on the 32-team, five-day battle royale, so long as a cage is involved.
"It's bad enough we have to play in this cage you call a gym; your players are playing like a bunch of gorillas!"
(https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/VZ_1JZOpBGDDG9WIcRwh4OKwafA=/206x0:3593x2540/1200x800/filters:focal(206x0:3593x2540)/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_image/image/55907095/1_7267zxeOjJNGIN-fVgN8WA.0.jpeg)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 06, 2019, 05:39:34 pm
I'd be all in on the 32-team, five-day battle royale, so long as a cage is involved.
"It's bad enough we have to play in this cage you call a gym; your players are playing like a bunch of gorillas!"
(https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/VZ_1JZOpBGDDG9WIcRwh4OKwafA=/206x0:3593x2540/1200x800/filters:focal(206x0:3593x2540)/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_image/image/55907095/1_7267zxeOjJNGIN-fVgN8WA.0.jpeg)

+1k
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Rofrog on March 06, 2019, 06:00:59 pm
I just threw the neutral thing out there.I remember they use to play in the regional games for third place!But the game has moved on from that also.So hopefully things will change like they have over the years!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: saratoga on March 06, 2019, 07:27:03 pm

Sometimes you need to watch out for what you wish for.

If they go neutral, then teams & fans will be claiming if they were home they would have won.

Or, how could the NCAA have ever come up with that place as a neutral site?

Are there occasional unavoidable slights? Absolutely.

However, for the most part, I think the NCAA gets the host schools right far more than they screw them up.

Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Rofrog on March 06, 2019, 11:53:40 pm
Saratoga:except when Will Renken was on the committee  ;D ;D
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: saratoga on March 07, 2019, 07:21:37 am

You're right on that!

Will Renken was the NCAA committee.

And, Albright was always the neutral site.  ;)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: CNU85 on March 07, 2019, 09:12:08 am
neutral sites won't work in D3 either.....there would be empty arenas until the final four.

Plus, who would want to host?

Exactly...who can support 32 teams. It would have to be a major city like the NAIA in KC. Oh...2017 attendance for that ...39,000 for 31 games. That sounds like a rip roaring environment.

I thought we were talking about neutral sites for the sectionals.

Someone mentioned the NAIA just has a 32 team tournament at a neutral site....So I was responding to that concept.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: sac on March 07, 2019, 11:07:42 am
The NAIA II's first second round game in beautiful Sioux Falls, SD is at 8:30 am Friday between Spring Arbor, MI and Jamestown, ND


The NAIA is opting not to list attendance in its boxscores.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 07, 2019, 11:22:08 am
The NAIA II's first second round game in beautiful Sioux Falls, SD is at 8:30 am Friday between Spring Arbor, MI and Jamestown, ND


The NAIA is opting not to list attendance in its boxscores.

I can't imagine why.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: wally_wabash on March 07, 2019, 11:34:07 am
The NAIA II's first second round game in beautiful Sioux Falls, SD is at 8:30 am Friday between Spring Arbor, MI and Jamestown, ND


The NAIA is opting not to list attendance in its boxscores.

Go Hustlin' Owls!   :)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 07, 2019, 12:28:41 pm
8:30am game ... in a national tournament ... unbelievable.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: fantastic50 on March 07, 2019, 02:17:20 pm
At the other end up the spectrum, there was Roy Williams' rant a few years back over a first-round tip that was just before 10 p.m. local time. 

“I got to sit in the daggum hotel room,” Williams said. “I wake up at 6 in the morning, don’t go to work until freaking 9:30 at night.”

https://www.newsobserver.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/luke-decock/article67072337.html
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: (509)Rat on March 07, 2019, 03:15:29 pm
I don't know if this has been covered but I'd like to discuss how Whitman should be hosting this weekend as the #1 seed in the tournament and not flying to New York...
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 07, 2019, 03:17:29 pm
LOL!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 07, 2019, 03:52:50 pm
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=o0hph/9l54usrryjbt1lc9.jpg)

The second weekend of the DIII Men's and Women's Championship Tournaments is set to start. Can the upset minded teams continue to prevail? Can the "favorites" maintain their poise? What home team will enjoy their own cooking? And who will still be playing in Fort Wayne and Salem?

On Thursday's Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com), Dave is joined by a number of guests to get a look not only at the action ahead this weekend, but the action coming at the final fours. Which teams seemed ready to be playing one more weekend?

Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. Thursday's show will air live starting at 7:00 p.m. ET. here: http://bit.ly/2C82LcA (or via Facebook Live and Periscope simulcasts).

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to dave.mchugh@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options below.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- John Taurer, No. 13 St. Thomas men's coach
- Dave Hixon, No. 7 Amherst men's coach
- Nathan Denison, VP for Sales, Memorial Coliseum (Fort Wayne, Ind.)
- Mark Morefield, No. 12 UMHB women's coach
- Carla Berube, No. 4 Tufts women's coach

If you enjoy the show via the podcasts, choose your favorite avenue to listen and/or subscribe via the the following four avenues (click on the images when necessary):
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Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 07, 2019, 03:53:09 pm
I don't know if this has been covered but I'd like to discuss how Whitman should be hosting this weekend as the #1 seed in the tournament and not flying to New York...

Tune in to Hoopsville tonight ... we will not be discussing it. :)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 07, 2019, 04:54:27 pm
The NAIA II's first second round game in beautiful Sioux Falls, SD is at 8:30 am Friday between Spring Arbor, MI and Jamestown, ND


The NAIA is opting not to list attendance in its boxscores.


(https://i.imgur.com/DBXmC9w.jpg)

The glory days of getting out of school for the week, driving down to Kansas City with the pep-band and watching the NAIA tourney at Kemper Arena. Stevens Point was in the NAIA for a long time...until about 1997?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on March 07, 2019, 05:00:22 pm
It appears that Marietta took a private charter to the Sweet Sixteen.  Wow!

https://www.instagram.com/p/BursQVcB9DI/?utm_source=ig_twitter_share&igshid=tk7ip0inbatd

Since I do not think the NCAA pays for private flights, does that mean that Marietta paid the difference between a commercial flight and the charter?  That is a major show of love and commitment by the college and the athletic department.  Let me know if I am missing something or do not understand the expenses reimbursed by the NCAA.  Good luck Etta!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 07, 2019, 05:21:11 pm
It may be that the NCAA couldn't find commercial service for 20-whatever people from Marietta, Ohio, to Rock Island, Illinois.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: ronk on March 07, 2019, 06:36:09 pm
The NAIA II's first second round game in beautiful Sioux Falls, SD is at 8:30 am Friday between Spring Arbor, MI and Jamestown, ND


The NAIA is opting not to list attendance in its boxscores.

 At least the facility is great; I watched some of the D2 women's basketball championship from there last year.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Smitty Oom on March 07, 2019, 06:37:21 pm
The NAIA II's first second round game in beautiful Sioux Falls, SD is at 8:30 am Friday between Spring Arbor, MI and Jamestown, ND


The NAIA is opting not to list attendance in its boxscores.

 At least the facility is great; I watched some of the D2 women's basketball championship from there last year.

Sioux Falls is actually a great town (maybe not at this point in the year) and ronk is correct, the Pentagon is a great place to take in/play a basketball game.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ralph Turner on March 07, 2019, 06:57:47 pm
It appears that Marietta took a private charter to the Sweet Sixteen.  Wow!

https://www.instagram.com/p/BursQVcB9DI/?utm_source=ig_twitter_share&igshid=tk7ip0inbatd

Since I do not think the NCAA pays for private flights, does that mean that Marietta paid the difference between a commercial flight and the charter?  That is a major show of love and commitment by the college and the athletic department.  Let me know if I am missing something or do not understand the expenses reimbursed by the NCAA.  Good luck Etta!
Hope women flew on a charter to Brownwood TX (Howard Payne) in 2008 for the 16/8 games.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 07, 2019, 07:46:54 pm
It appears that Marietta took a private charter to the Sweet Sixteen.  Wow!

https://www.instagram.com/p/BursQVcB9DI/?utm_source=ig_twitter_share&igshid=tk7ip0inbatd

Since I do not think the NCAA pays for private flights, does that mean that Marietta paid the difference between a commercial flight and the charter?  That is a major show of love and commitment by the college and the athletic department.  Let me know if I am missing something or do not understand the expenses reimbursed by the NCAA.  Good luck Etta!

The NCAA paid for this.  It happens every now and then for sure.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: toad22 on March 07, 2019, 08:50:38 pm
I’m glad they did, they should!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 07, 2019, 09:23:42 pm
It appears that Marietta took a private charter to the Sweet Sixteen.  Wow!

https://www.instagram.com/p/BursQVcB9DI/?utm_source=ig_twitter_share&igshid=tk7ip0inbatd

Since I do not think the NCAA pays for private flights, does that mean that Marietta paid the difference between a commercial flight and the charter?  That is a major show of love and commitment by the college and the athletic department.  Let me know if I am missing something or do not understand the expenses reimbursed by the NCAA.  Good luck Etta!

The NCAA paid for this.  It happens every now and then for sure.

Yep - it happens when getting commercial flights has become a little too complicated AND when the costs are within reason.

I am told Whitman, who has traveled via charter on a number of occasions (too and from Marietta a few years ago comes to mind), did hope to fly charter this time around ... but the costs were apparently through the roof ... so they flew commercial. They spent the night in Spokane Tuesday and practices at Gonzaga on Wednesday morning. Then boarded a mid-day flight and hop-skipped through Minneapolis (I believe Pat met them there with water and snacks). They arrived in Syracuse around midnight (eastern time) and amazingly were in Clinton in about 90 minutes!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 07, 2019, 10:16:37 pm
It doesn't surprise me that Whitman got from Syracuse to Clinton in ninety minutes, baggage claim and all. Hancock Airport is very close to the Thruway, and, as bad as upstate winters get, it takes a tremendous snowstorm to overwhelm the Thruway's snow removal fleet. I'll bet that the Thruway was clear this week. It's about an hour from Syracuse to Clinton via the Thruway -- get off at the Westmoreland exit, take Route 233 south right to Clinton. The Hamilton campus is right off of 233. I've taken that ride before.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: sac on March 07, 2019, 10:31:11 pm
It appears that Marietta took a private charter to the Sweet Sixteen.  Wow!

https://www.instagram.com/p/BursQVcB9DI/?utm_source=ig_twitter_share&igshid=tk7ip0inbatd

Since I do not think the NCAA pays for private flights, does that mean that Marietta paid the difference between a commercial flight and the charter?  That is a major show of love and commitment by the college and the athletic department.  Let me know if I am missing something or do not understand the expenses reimbursed by the NCAA.  Good luck Etta!
Hope women flew on a charter to Brownwood TX (Howard Payne) in 2008 for the 16/8 games.

Only after Whitworth men flew the same plane from Spokane to Holland for their Sweet 16 at Hope.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 07, 2019, 10:33:35 pm
It appears that Marietta took a private charter to the Sweet Sixteen.  Wow!

https://www.instagram.com/p/BursQVcB9DI/?utm_source=ig_twitter_share&igshid=tk7ip0inbatd

Since I do not think the NCAA pays for private flights, does that mean that Marietta paid the difference between a commercial flight and the charter?  That is a major show of love and commitment by the college and the athletic department.  Let me know if I am missing something or do not understand the expenses reimbursed by the NCAA.  Good luck Etta!

The NCAA paid for this.  It happens every now and then for sure.

Yep - it happens when getting commercial flights has become a little too complicated AND when the costs are within reason.

I am told Whitman, who has traveled via charter on a number of occasions (too and from Marietta a few years ago comes to mind), did hope to fly charter this time around ... but the costs were apparently through the roof ... so they flew commercial. They spent the night in Spokane Tuesday and practices at Gonzaga on Wednesday morning. Then boarded a mid-day flight and hop-skipped through Minneapolis (I believe Pat met them there with water and snacks). They arrived in Syracuse around midnight (eastern time) and amazingly were in Clinton in about 90 minutes!

If I still worked for the travel management company, I could have. 😂
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 07, 2019, 11:05:17 pm
It appears that Marietta took a private charter to the Sweet Sixteen.  Wow!

https://www.instagram.com/p/BursQVcB9DI/?utm_source=ig_twitter_share&igshid=tk7ip0inbatd

Since I do not think the NCAA pays for private flights, does that mean that Marietta paid the difference between a commercial flight and the charter?  That is a major show of love and commitment by the college and the athletic department.  Let me know if I am missing something or do not understand the expenses reimbursed by the NCAA.  Good luck Etta!

The NCAA paid for this.  It happens every now and then for sure.

Did the NCAA also spring for the rapid construction of an airport in Marietta? ;)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Smitty Oom on March 07, 2019, 11:19:27 pm
Here is my predictions for tomorrow. Comments/Replies/Disagreements/Debates are all welcome before tomorrows games.

At Hamilton
:: CNU over Hamilton - Hamilton is better than they played last weekend, but that is the only time I have seen the Continentals play and I was not that impressed. I think the Captains can take them down on their own home court.

:: Whitman over Williams - Kind of like Hamilton, I have watched Williams in their bad games, so my view on them is probably swayed by that. However, I think Whitman is just too talented and deep for the Ephs, and as people have mentioned on these boards, Williams may lack enough ball handlers against the great press the Blues apply.

At Amherst
:: Amherst over Nichols - I love watching Echevarria play and think the Bison definitely have enough talent to hang with the Mammoths, but my guess is they will fall just a little bit shy of making the Elite 8 as Hixon's squad has been been too solid on both ends of the court for the last half of the season. Home court always helps as well.

:: Swarthmore over Randolph-Macon - This game is probably the one I am most excited for. Swarthmore showed last week that they have the talent and cohesiveness to beat anyone if they bring their A game. Although I am not expecting 80% in the first half, I think Swarthmore wins the battle of the boards by quite a bit and that is the difference in this neutral court game (Swarthmore reb. margin = 9, Randolph Macon reb.margin = 3; Swartmore is incredibly long and athletic, starts 6'0,6'3", 6'3", 6'6", 6'7").

At Augustana
:: Augustana over Wheaton - Francis' amazing career will end, quite fittingly, in Rock Island as Augustana has won all 3 CCIW championships since he entered the conference in 2016-2017 season. Augustana is too deep and too familiar with this team, I am expecting this game to be similar to the other 2 this season.

:: Oswego St over Marietta - The Lakers are great at controlling the pace of play and slowing the game down and grinding it out on the defensive end will favor the Lakers over the Pioneers. The Pios, who lack a star-go-to-scorer unlike the past couple years, like to play a little more uptempo and average 85 ppg, if Oswego can in fact effectively slow down the game I like their chances. Also, a week of rest will greatly favor the Lakers, as they usually only play 6 guys.

At UW-Oshkosh
:: Loras over UW-Oshkosh - You don't need me to tell you guys this, but it is going to be a very good game. As we have seen, Loras is able to beat great teams and have done so all season. A senior laden team with tons of talent is always hard to bet against, but this Oshkosh team is more experienced given their Final Four run last year. Ruggles and DiCanio haven't both been on for the same night for awhile, and I am predicting that changes tomorrow night as they both go for over 25. This will probably go down to the final buzzer.

:: UST over Guilford - Admittedly I do not know much about the Quakers but they are very hot right now, winning the ODAC championship and winning their own hosted pod last weekend. I am still very confused by the success of this years Tommie team, as I do not think there are many great players (Freshman G Anders Nelson and Senior F Connor Bair are probably the only 2) on the team but this team embodies the quote that the whole is greater than the sum of the parts. As discussed on the MIAC boards, if the Tommies can play strong Tauer led defense as they did at NWU, they will be tough to beat.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 07, 2019, 11:33:42 pm
Here is my predictions for tomorrow. Comments/Replies/Disagreements/Debates are all welcome before tomorrows games.

At Hamilton
:: CNU over Hamilton - Hamilton is better than they played last weekend, but that is the only time I have seen the Continentals play and I was not that impressed. I think the Captains can take them down on their own home court.

:: Whitman over Williams - Kind of like Hamilton, I have watched Williams in their bad games, so my view on them is probably swayed by that. However, I think Whitman is just too talented and deep for the Ephs, and as people have mentioned on these boards, Williams may lack enough ball handlers against the great press the Blues apply.

At Amherst
:: Amherst over Nichols - I love watching Echevarria play and think the Bison definitely have enough talent to hang with the Mammoths, but my guess is they will fall just a little bit shy of making the Elite 8 as Hixon's squad has been been too solid on both ends of the court for the last half of the season. Home court always helps as well.

:: Swarthmore over Randolph-Macon - This game is probably the one I am most excited for. Swarthmore showed last week that they have the talent and cohesiveness to beat anyone if they bring their A game. Although I am not expecting 80% in the first half, I think Swarthmore wins the battle of the boards by quite a bit and that is the difference in this neutral court game (Swarthmore reb. margin = 9, Randolph Macon reb.margin = 3; Swartmore is incredibly long and athletic, starts 6'0,6'3", 6'3", 6'6", 6'7").

At Augustana
:: Augustana over Wheaton - Francis' amazing career will end, quite fittingly, in Rock Island as Augustana has won all 3 CCIW championships since he entered the conference in 2016-2017 season. Augustana is too deep and too familiar with this team, I am expecting this game to be similar to the other 3 this season.

:: Oswego St over Marietta - The Lakers are great at controlling the pace of play and slowing the game down and grinding it out on the defensive end will favor the Lakers over the Pioneers. The Pios, who lack a star-go-to-scorer unlike the past couple years, like to play a little more uptempo and average 85 ppg, if Oswego can in fact effectively slow down the game I like their chances. Also, a week of rest will greatly favor the Lakers, as they usually only play 6 guys.

At UW-Oshkosh
:: Loras over UW-Oshkosh - You don't need me to tell you guys this, but it is going to be a very good game. As we have seen, Loras is able to beat great teams and have done so all season. A senior laden team with tons of talent is always hard to bet against, but this Oshkosh team is more experienced given their Final Four run last year. Ruggles and DiCanio haven't both been on on the same night for awhile, and I predicting that changes tomorrow night as they both go for over 25. This will probably go down to the final buzzer.

:: UST over Guilford - Admittedly I do not know much about the Quakers but they are very hot right now, winning the ODAC championship and winning their own hosted pod last weekend. I am still very confused by the success of this years Tommie team, as I do not think there are many great players (Freshman G Anders Nelson and Senior F Connor Bair are probably the only 2) on the team but this team embodies the quote that the whole is greater than the sum of the parts. As discussed on the MIAC boards, if the Tommies can play strong Tauer led defense as they did at NWU, they will be tough to beat.

No Karma privileges now so you get a Facebook-style Like instead.  Nice post.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 07, 2019, 11:48:50 pm
Nice write up.

Also, Augustana has only played Wheaton twice this season, I believe.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Smitty Oom on March 07, 2019, 11:51:43 pm
Nice write up.

Also, Augustana has only played Wheaton twice this season, I believe.

You are right, misprint there. Just fixed my post.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 08, 2019, 01:07:32 am
It doesn't surprise me that Whitman got from Syracuse to Clinton in ninety minutes, baggage claim and all. Hancock Airport is very close to the Thruway, and, as bad as upstate winters get, it takes a tremendous snowstorm to overwhelm the Thruway's snow removal fleet. I'll bet that the Thruway was clear this week. It's about an hour from Syracuse to Clinton via the Thruway -- get off at the Westmoreland exit, take Route 233 south right to Clinton. The Hamilton campus is right off of 233. I've taken that ride before.

Every once in awhile ... I flip Albany and Syracuse in my head for travel times between Utica and those destinations. Did it again tonight.

My mother's family is Utica based, so I know the area pretty well (except for the aforementioned flip). My grandfather spent a number of years "commuting" to Albany and then when he retired from that job he spent a number of years "commuting" to Syracuse. So, I tend to flip them when thinking about the trip. That said, I've driven the Albany-Utica route ... more times than I can count and certainly remember the Syracuse-Utica route quite well.

I actually drove the Syracuse-Utica route in a massive snow storm exactly 18 years ago. My grandfather had passed and his memorial service was at Hamilton (we were staying in Utica/New Hartford, I think, not Clinton). I would normally drive up Route 12 from Binghamton (from Baltimore), but because of the storm, I stayed on the interstates. I was basically the only vehicle heading eastbound from Syracuse that night (around midnight). My timing even had the fleet of plows heading westbound.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: CNU85 on March 08, 2019, 10:32:15 am
It doesn't surprise me that Whitman got from Syracuse to Clinton in ninety minutes, baggage claim and all. Hancock Airport is very close to the Thruway, and, as bad as upstate winters get, it takes a tremendous snowstorm to overwhelm the Thruway's snow removal fleet. I'll bet that the Thruway was clear this week. It's about an hour from Syracuse to Clinton via the Thruway -- get off at the Westmoreland exit, take Route 233 south right to Clinton. The Hamilton campus is right off of 233. I've taken that ride before.

Every once in awhile ... I flip Albany and Syracuse in my head for travel times between Utica and those destinations. Did it again tonight.

My mother's family is Utica based, so I know the area pretty well (except for the aforementioned flip). My grandfather spent a number of years "commuting" to Albany and then when he retired from that job he spent a number of years "commuting" to Syracuse. So, I tend to flip them when thinking about the trip. That said, I've driven the Albany-Utica route ... more times than I can count and certainly remember the Syracuse-Utica route quite well.

I actually drove the Syracuse-Utica route in a massive snow storm exactly 18 years ago. My grandfather had passed and his memorial service was at Hamilton (we were staying in Utica/New Hartford, I think, not Clinton). I would normally drive up Route 12 from Binghamton (from Baltimore), but because of the storm, I stayed on the interstates. I was basically the only vehicle heading eastbound from Syracuse that night (around midnight). My timing even had the fleet of plows heading westbound.

Thanks for the memories. I used to live in Plattsburgh. My dad's job was to keep the runways free of snow so that the B-52's could take off and land.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 08, 2019, 11:02:31 am
rmc1982, you totally could have gotten that point across without all the ALL CAPS and the SHOUTING.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: CNU85 on March 08, 2019, 12:25:37 pm
rmc1982, you totally could have gotten that point across without all the ALL CAPS and the SHOUTING.

Also - I didn't notice anyone saying they are not worthy opponents.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: txg on March 08, 2019, 12:31:58 pm
Picking one team to win a game is not the same as saying the other team is unworthy.

Also, speaking of Quakers, Swarthmore used to be the Little Quakers long ago.  The more you know...
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 08, 2019, 12:46:40 pm
It doesn't surprise me that Whitman got from Syracuse to Clinton in ninety minutes, baggage claim and all. Hancock Airport is very close to the Thruway, and, as bad as upstate winters get, it takes a tremendous snowstorm to overwhelm the Thruway's snow removal fleet. I'll bet that the Thruway was clear this week. It's about an hour from Syracuse to Clinton via the Thruway -- get off at the Westmoreland exit, take Route 233 south right to Clinton. The Hamilton campus is right off of 233. I've taken that ride before.

Every once in awhile ... I flip Albany and Syracuse in my head for travel times between Utica and those destinations. Did it again tonight.

My mother's family is Utica based, so I know the area pretty well (except for the aforementioned flip). My grandfather spent a number of years "commuting" to Albany and then when he retired from that job he spent a number of years "commuting" to Syracuse. So, I tend to flip them when thinking about the trip. That said, I've driven the Albany-Utica route ... more times than I can count and certainly remember the Syracuse-Utica route quite well.

I actually drove the Syracuse-Utica route in a massive snow storm exactly 18 years ago. My grandfather had passed and his memorial service was at Hamilton (we were staying in Utica/New Hartford, I think, not Clinton). I would normally drive up Route 12 from Binghamton (from Baltimore), but because of the storm, I stayed on the interstates. I was basically the only vehicle heading eastbound from Syracuse that night (around midnight). My timing even had the fleet of plows heading westbound.

I love that drive up Route 12! That's a classic small-town-America drive.

Thanks for the memories. I used to live in Plattsburgh. My dad's job was to keep the runways free of snow so that the B-52's could take off and land.

Your dad was a busy man for about five months a year. ;)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: KnightSlappy on March 08, 2019, 12:53:37 pm
Randolph-Macon at Swarthmore certainly looks like the game of the night.
My efficiency ratings model likes Swarthmore to outscore Randolph-Macon by 0.3 points over 40 minutes, giving them a 51% chance to win!

http://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/p/division-iii-mens-basketball-efficiency.html
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: rmc1982 on March 08, 2019, 12:59:29 pm
Didn’t mean to ruffle any feathers -just taking up for our ODAC teams.... I beg to differ in the picks against us but I’m a little biased. I do think that Guilford stands a better chance than my Jackets because if the rebounding but it remains to be seen if Swarthmore can take us.... if we shoot well the scales tip in our favor....
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 08, 2019, 01:01:23 pm
It doesn't surprise me that Whitman got from Syracuse to Clinton in ninety minutes, baggage claim and all. Hancock Airport is very close to the Thruway, and, as bad as upstate winters get, it takes a tremendous snowstorm to overwhelm the Thruway's snow removal fleet. I'll bet that the Thruway was clear this week. It's about an hour from Syracuse to Clinton via the Thruway -- get off at the Westmoreland exit, take Route 233 south right to Clinton. The Hamilton campus is right off of 233. I've taken that ride before.

Every once in awhile ... I flip Albany and Syracuse in my head for travel times between Utica and those destinations. Did it again tonight.

My mother's family is Utica based, so I know the area pretty well (except for the aforementioned flip). My grandfather spent a number of years "commuting" to Albany and then when he retired from that job he spent a number of years "commuting" to Syracuse. So, I tend to flip them when thinking about the trip. That said, I've driven the Albany-Utica route ... more times than I can count and certainly remember the Syracuse-Utica route quite well.

I actually drove the Syracuse-Utica route in a massive snow storm exactly 18 years ago. My grandfather had passed and his memorial service was at Hamilton (we were staying in Utica/New Hartford, I think, not Clinton). I would normally drive up Route 12 from Binghamton (from Baltimore), but because of the storm, I stayed on the interstates. I was basically the only vehicle heading eastbound from Syracuse that night (around midnight). My timing even had the fleet of plows heading westbound.

I love that drive up Route 12! That's a classic small-town-America drive.

It really is a good drive. Slightly annoying when people are poking along. I don't want to rush the trip, but I also don't want to be dragging my feet (especially since heading north, the trip is already four to five hours old).

That said, I have noticed recently that map systems now suggest going up I 81 to Route 8 and then north. Something I've always wondered about, but never considered faster. I am sure I will test it out again - at least I hope I will (some family still lives in Remsen and extended family, even a high school classmate[!] in Clinton).
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 08, 2019, 01:03:13 pm
What RMC has to watch out for is the opening minutes. They need to be ready. Swarthmore is going to come out gunning and at full speed. They have done it all year and we saw an extreme example of it against MIT. RMC cannot afford to be sluggish, not completely ready, or slightly off shooting wise in the opening ten, or so, minutes. If they aren't ready, Swarthmore could be up 15 points in a blink of an eye and the game is going to change quickly.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 08, 2019, 01:03:32 pm
Didn’t mean to ruffle any feathers -just taking up for our ODAC teams.... I beg to differ in the picks against us but I’m a little biased. I do think that Guilford stands a better chance than my Jackets because if the rebounding but it remains to be seen if Swarthmore can take us.... if we shoot well the scales tip in our favor....

Tell us a little bit about your team!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Conts Fan on March 08, 2019, 03:08:47 pm
I love that drive up Route 12! That's a classic small-town-America drive.
Agreed...I made that trip many, many times going to school. Veering off onto 12B is even better...takes you right through Colgate (in the village of Hamilton, which frequently confused people).
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: BobbyO on March 08, 2019, 06:11:06 pm
At Carver Center. Wheaton is rumored to be bringing 400 fans. Had to move to the other end of the court. So I will be up close at the end with Augie right in front of me.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Smitty Oom on March 08, 2019, 07:13:30 pm
Well this Ephs-Blues game just got a lot more interesting...
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 08, 2019, 07:33:07 pm
Ephs hang on to win by three. The Blues had a chance to tie in the final half-minute, but one of their outside shooting aces, Trevor Osborne, shuffled his feet while trying to sidestep to his right for a cleaner look from beyond the arc.

Whitman missed a truckload of layups early in the game, most of them in transition, and, as the saying goes, points made at the beginning of the game -- or missed, in this case -- count just as much as the ones at the end. To the credit of the Ephs, they took what the Blues gave them, throwing over the top of the press for easy baskets. They got big contributions from a variety of guys off of the bench, and throughout the game they had the paint locked down with their superior size.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 08, 2019, 07:34:43 pm
The other two sectional semis that're already in the book were also close and well-played. Swarthmore, which trailed most of the game, came back to nip Randolph-Macon by one, and Guilford likewise came back after being down most of the way to beat St. Thomas by seven.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: BobbyO on March 08, 2019, 08:05:04 pm
Marietta advances.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 08, 2019, 09:15:14 pm
Nichols upsets Amherst at LeFrak, 62-58. Quite an ending.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 08, 2019, 09:17:56 pm
Amherst:

Missed 3
Offensive rebound
Missed layup
Offensive rebound
Missed 3

Had their chances... considering they we're winning.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 08, 2019, 09:46:09 pm
Another NESCAC team sees its season end on its home floor, as Hamilton goes down to Christopher Newport, 75-67, in upstate New York.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 08, 2019, 09:57:28 pm
UW-Oshkosh cruises to an 86-75 win over Loras at Kolf. The Titans were in control of this game pretty much the whole way.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: 7express on March 08, 2019, 09:58:02 pm
So I'm sure EVERYONE had Williams vs. Newport and Nichols vs. Swathmore as the last 4 teams standing on the left side of the bracket??  AmIrite??
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Smitty Oom on March 08, 2019, 10:08:26 pm
Anyone ever heard of this Francis kid? He seems to be having a great last couple minutes.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 08, 2019, 10:10:43 pm
Yes, but the story of the game is the performance of the guys in navy blue and orange who don't wear the #1 on their backs.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: nescac1 on March 08, 2019, 10:13:07 pm
I haven't seen the box-and-one for awhile (the last time I remember in fact was when Mike Nogelo played for Williams).  It seemed like a bad strategy because it gave open 3's to other guys, who were hitting at a high rate.  Then they went back to man and Francis just pulls up and hits 30-footers.  Damn.  He looks like Jimmer Fredette out there. 

Assuming Wheaton holds on, Oshkosh is the last big favorite remaining, and only two of the top eight teams made it to the Elite 8.  Crazy night in D3 hoops.  It's really, really hard to win games at this stage of the tourney. 
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Smitty Oom on March 08, 2019, 10:16:09 pm
Yes, but the story of the game is the performance of the guys in navy blue and orange who don't wear the #1 on their backs.

I just tuned in with like 4 minutes left and he immediately nailed a couple huge threes and knocked down some FTs. 
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 08, 2019, 10:17:51 pm
Yes, he did. He came up big in the clutch in close games, as he so often does.

But the story of the game is what happened before you tuned in.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on March 08, 2019, 10:19:33 pm
For all the endless talk about sectional hosts that's raged on for a full week, the hosts have gone 1-3 tonight with only UW-Oshkosh surviving into the elite 8.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Yogao on March 08, 2019, 10:21:07 pm
From a 6 point half time deficit to a 14 pt win, Wheaton shot almost 48% from downtown in the 2nd half and cruised to a victory in Rock Island. They held the Viking to 33% shooting in the 2nd half and 41% for the game.  They went 1-2 this year against Augustana, but picked the right game to win. 
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 08, 2019, 10:22:05 pm
Biggest upset of the night: Wheaton 93, Augustana 79 at the Carver P.E. Center.

For all the endless talk about sectional hosts that's raged on for a full week, the hosts have gone 1-3 tonight with only UW-Oshkosh surviving into the elite 8.

They're dancing in the streets of Oshkosh tonight.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 08, 2019, 10:22:55 pm
The presumed top four seeds are all out before the Elite 8. NWU, Whitman, Amherst and Augustana.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: nescac1 on March 08, 2019, 10:23:09 pm
Has there ever been an elite 8 featuring only one host team?  There are gonna be a lot of empty arenas tomorrow.  Nichols based on their fan support today will be practically the home team vs. Swarthmore.  Heck of a showing for a road team, kudos to them.

Speaking of arenas, is that Augustana arena typical for CCIW?  Looked almost like a low-level D1 arena ...
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 08, 2019, 10:32:36 pm
From a 6 point half time deficit to a 14 pt win, Wheaton shot almost 48% from downtown in the 2nd half and cruised to a victory in Rock Island. They held the Viking to 33% shooting in the 2nd half and 41% for the game.  They went 1-2 this year against Augustana, but picked the right game to win.

It was a 3-point game with 3:33 left. They hardly cruised.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 08, 2019, 10:56:06 pm
Has there ever been an elite 8 featuring only one host team?  There are gonna be a lot of empty arenas tomorrow.  Nichols based on their fan support today will be practically the home team vs. Swarthmore.  Heck of a showing for a road team, kudos to them.

Speaking of arenas, is that Augustana arena typical for CCIW?  Looked almost like a low-level D1 arena ...

LeFrak isn't all that big to begin with.  I imagine Nichols will have it filled up.  Swat will travel pretty well, too, I imagine, especially with tomorrow being Saturday.  It's only 5 hours from Philly.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: AllStar on March 09, 2019, 03:20:57 am
Eight left.
(https://i.imgur.com/giBHucg.png)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Yogao on March 09, 2019, 08:00:00 am
From a 6 point half time deficit to a 14 pt win, Wheaton shot almost 48% from downtown in the 2nd half and cruised to a victory in Rock Island. They held the Viking to 33% shooting in the 2nd half and 41% for the game.  They went 1-2 this year against Augustana, but picked the right game to win.

It was a 3-point game with 3:33 left. They hardly cruised.

The combination of Wheaton's tough D and Augie's poor shooting made it seem like more than a 3 point game. Since taking the lead with 12 minutes left in the game, Wheaton didn't trail the rest of the way.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 09, 2019, 10:09:54 am
Biggest upset of the night: Wheaton 93, Augustana 79 at the Carver P.E. Center.

For all the endless talk about sectional hosts that's raged on for a full week, the hosts have gone 1-3 tonight with only UW-Oshkosh surviving into the elite 8.

They're dancing in the streets of Oshkosh tonight.

Sectional hosts are not as successful as one might expect:
https://www.d3hoops.com/playoffs/sectional-hosts-chart
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: rlgyank on March 09, 2019, 12:48:39 pm
Biggest upset of the night: Wheaton 93, Augustana 79 at the Carver P.E. Center.

For all the endless talk about sectional hosts that's raged on for a full week, the hosts have gone 1-3 tonight with only UW-Oshkosh surviving into the elite 8.

They're dancing in the streets of Oshkosh tonight.

On the mens side for 2018, Augustana is in bold, but Oshkosh went to the final 4, not Augustana.

Sectional hosts are not as successful as one might expect:
https://www.d3hoops.com/playoffs/sectional-hosts-chart
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Inkblot on March 09, 2019, 02:09:57 pm
The Elite Eight come from eight different conferences: CAC, CCC, CCIW, Centennial, NESCAC, OAC, ODAC, WIAC.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Smitty Oom on March 09, 2019, 05:58:15 pm
Here is who I have:

Swarthmore over Nichols
Williams over CNU
Wheaton over Marietta
UWO over Guilford

Any other predictions for tonight?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 09, 2019, 06:19:05 pm
Here is who I have:

Swarthmore over Nichols
Williams over CNU
Wheaton over Marietta
UWO over Guilford

Any other predictions for tonight?

I'm most likely going to Fort Wayne. I'd like to see Oshkosh, Wheaton, Nichols and Williams.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on March 09, 2019, 06:25:00 pm
Here is who I have:

Swarthmore over Nichols
Williams over CNU
Wheaton over Marietta
UWO over Guilford

Any other predictions for tonight?
Swarthmore, CNU, Marietta, UWO
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 09, 2019, 07:49:39 pm
Swarthmore 69
Nichols 65

Congrats to the Garnet on qualifying for the program's first-ever Final Four.

And congrats to Nichols on a fantastic season that finished just short of Fort Wayne.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Drake Palmer on March 09, 2019, 07:51:17 pm
WOW!! Great ball game, and near comeback by Nichols.  Swarthmore 69-65 over Nichols.  Inside the paint was not for the faint of heart.  Some serious banging and hooping going on between the Swat bigs and Nichols bigs.  Good stuff!

Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 09, 2019, 08:12:33 pm
Francis has 20 points ... seven minutes into the game.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 09, 2019, 08:28:25 pm
Francis with 30, with six minutes to go in the half.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Caz Bombers on March 09, 2019, 08:40:44 pm
35 at halftime (everyone else on his team has 8, and they're losing by 2) but dios mio, man
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 09, 2019, 08:45:40 pm
The usual concern at a sectional final is with cutting down the net. At Kolf Arena in Oshkosh, they're concerned with putting the net back on the rim. Somehow, several strands of one of the nets came unhooked, delaying the game.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 09, 2019, 08:48:34 pm
Christopher Newport punches its ticket to its second Final Four in four years with a 79-70 win over Williams.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Caz Bombers on March 09, 2019, 08:49:57 pm
congrats to CNU!

"Captain? Captain, captain captain captain. Captain!!??!!"

"......captain?"

"CAPTAIN!!!"
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: CNU85 on March 09, 2019, 09:17:55 pm
Thanks!! I can’t believe it!! Final Four!!!  I am so happy for the team, the seniors, and especially for Marcus Carter. As a sophomore he was named All-American. Then the injuries. And this year the injuries continued and yet he not once even considered giving up! Wow!  Congrats to the team and coaches!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on March 09, 2019, 09:35:08 pm
Francis now up to 54 points and 12 rebounds, still 3 minutes left.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Drake Palmer on March 09, 2019, 09:45:12 pm
Francis is ridiculous!  62 pts!!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on March 09, 2019, 09:45:43 pm
Finished with 62 points including a couple big 3s at the end. How's he going to top that in Fort Wayne?
Francis 19 of 37 from the field, rest of Wheaton was 7 of 19.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 09, 2019, 09:48:08 pm
Wheaton 91
Marietta 87

Congrats to Wheaton on its first-ever D3 Final Four appearance.

Congrats as well to a really good Marietta team on a fantastic season.

Lastly, congrats to Aston Francis, who broke the D3 tourney single-game scoring record of 59 set by Guilford's Ben Strong in 2007. It took Strong a full game and three overtimes to get that 59. Francis finished with 62 in regulation ... none bigger than the huge trey from the corner he hit in the last few seconds to propel Wheaton from defeat to victory.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Smitty Oom on March 09, 2019, 09:48:31 pm
Greg mentioned on the CCIW board that it is a NCAA tourney single game scoring record, I would have to imagine the 12 made 3s would also be a single game record?

Such a fun player to watch. Excited we get to see him at least one more time.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Caz Bombers on March 09, 2019, 09:51:22 pm
utterly amazing stuff. We shall not see his like again, but his watch is not yet ended!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 09, 2019, 09:51:50 pm
Greg mentioned on the CCIW board that it is a NCAA tourney single game scoring record, I would have to imagine the 12 made 3s would also be a single game record?

It tied the record, originally set by Augustana's Kirk Anderson in a 1993 Elite Eight game against UW-Platteville.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 09, 2019, 09:53:44 pm
By the way, Francis finished with a dozen rebounds as well.

Hats off to Marietta, who played a really solid game and almost walked away with the win. Pios coach Jon VanderWal had a really good game plan against Wheaton.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on March 09, 2019, 10:02:27 pm
Oshkosh holds on 82-79

Interestingly, 3 of the 4 Final Four teams are located in the same location in their respective brackets (top of the bottom half of the quadrant) with Wheaton preventing a sweep as Marietta was also in that slot.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Caz Bombers on March 09, 2019, 10:03:39 pm
Oshkosh survives a turnover and two last second shots to beat Guilford 72-69. Congrats Titans.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 09, 2019, 10:04:17 pm
UW-Oshkosh survives a nail-biter against Guilford to prevail, 82-79. The Quakers had three tries at a game-tying trey in the final seconds, but couldn't get any of them to go down.

Congrats to UWO. And a nice tip of the cap to the Quakers, who gave the home-court Titans all that they could handle tonight.

To my mind, UWO is the favorite in Fort Wayne.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 09, 2019, 10:10:44 pm

CNU and Swat have only ever met once before - in the tournament a few years ago. CNU beat Swat in Swarthmore's gym.  Wheaton beat Oshkosh earlier this year.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 09, 2019, 10:14:35 pm
Aston Francis has scored 180 points in this season's tournament, setting a new D3 tournament record for most points scored in a tourney. The previous record was set by Michael Nogelo of Williams in 1998. It took Nogelo six games to set that record. Francis broke it in four.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 09, 2019, 10:27:07 pm
It was a great night of basketball. Three of the four games went right down to the wire.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: sac on March 09, 2019, 10:47:45 pm
Aston Francis has scored 180 points in this season's tournament, setting a new D3 tournament record for most points scored in a tourney. The previous record was set by Michael Nogelo of Williams in 1998. It took Nogelo six games to set that record. Francis broke it in four.

I was at the consolation game in 98, if I remember correctly Nogelo had a 30+ night against Wilkes.

It was, however, 21 years ago. :-\
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 09, 2019, 10:52:28 pm
Your memory's pretty good. Nogelo scored 38 against the Colonels in the consolation game.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 09, 2019, 11:02:44 pm
I witnessed Ben Strong score 59 points against Lincoln as I called the game. It is one of the highlights of my broadcasting career.

I am not sure if I am happy for ... or pissed at Aston right now. LOL

Edit: Side note ... Strong also had a lot of other options around him like Jordan Snipes who can hit a 35-foot screamer at the horn to force overtime. LOL

Not saying Wheaton doesn't have options, but Guilford that year seemed to have better options. Then again, who needs options when Francis can hit nearly from 40-feet (when the shot clock is running low). Insane.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: sac on March 09, 2019, 11:23:28 pm
Your memory's pretty good. Nogelo scored 38 against the Colonels in the consolation game.

One of those guys that sticks in your mind, even if the details fade a little.  He was really good.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 10, 2019, 12:51:23 am
Your memory's pretty good. Nogelo scored 38 against the Colonels in the consolation game.

One of those guys that sticks in your mind, even if the details fade a little.  He was really good.

He was nuts that year and especially in that game.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: AllStar on March 10, 2019, 01:27:03 am
(https://i.imgur.com/0HyHPnG.png)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: GoPerry on March 10, 2019, 07:41:01 am
(https://i.imgur.com/0HyHPnG.png)

Lower right is a thing of beauty!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 10, 2019, 09:49:02 am
The final 0:37 of Wheaton vs Marietta...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PkgorHabzTI
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Drake Palmer on March 10, 2019, 11:52:07 am
The final 0:37 of IWU vs Marietta...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PkgorHabzTI

Thanks Q, I’ve already watched it three times this morning.  What a performance! And he’s hitting turnaround, step back, one legged triples, plus, drive to the corner, turn, square up and shoot triples with a hand in his face. The MIAC’s Booker Coplin is great, but this is an entirely different level.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: AO on March 10, 2019, 11:58:35 am
The final 0:37 of IWU vs Marietta...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PkgorHabzTI
Is that International Wheaton University or just dreaming of Wesleyan making it to the final 4?  :D
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Drake Palmer on March 10, 2019, 12:14:16 pm
The final 0:37 of IWU vs Marietta...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PkgorHabzTI
Is that International Wheaton University or just dreaming of Wesleyan making it to the final 4?  :D

Ha, nice pick up. I’m sure just a Freudian slip.  ;)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 10, 2019, 12:41:58 pm
Ha, good stuff.  Had just tweeted the end of the IWU/Wheaton game...lots of schools on the mind involving Mr. Francis.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CI2Ta1slZcU
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 10, 2019, 12:56:07 pm
Ha, good stuff.  Had just tweeted the end of the IWU/Wheaton game...lots of schools on the mind involving Mr. Francis.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CI2Ta1slZcU

Oh. That game winner...the one that was talked about for a few days and many, many pages on the CCIW board?  ??? ::) :P
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 10, 2019, 01:01:26 pm
Ha, good stuff.  Had just tweeted the end of the IWU/Wheaton game...lots of schools on the mind involving Mr. Francis.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CI2Ta1slZcU

Oh. That game winner...the one that was talked about for a few days and many, many pages on the CCIW board?  ??? ::) :P

Hi ability to hit the big shot is pretty remarkable.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 10, 2019, 01:12:43 pm
Ha, good stuff.  Had just tweeted the end of the IWU/Wheaton game...lots of schools on the mind involving Mr. Francis.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CI2Ta1slZcU

Oh. That game winner...the one that was talked about for a few days and many, many pages on the CCIW board?  ??? ::) :P

Hi ability to hit the big shot is pretty remarkable.

True, but I believe the topic was more towards the defending aspect of that last play, including defending (non-defending) the player throwing the ball in. I digress...
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: GoPerry on March 10, 2019, 01:29:22 pm
The final 0:37 of Wheaton vs Marietta...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PkgorHabzTI

In post-game interview, Francis describes that last shot and how he had missed it vs Augustana, with the game on the line, back in January - so he practiced it and made it 100x “so it wouldn’t happen again . . .”

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sa76qxU79xA

1:00
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 10, 2019, 01:51:48 pm
Thank you for sharing that link!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ralph Turner on March 10, 2019, 02:31:41 pm

In post-game interview, Francis describes that last shot and how he had missed it vs Augustana, with the game on the line, back in January - so he practiced it and made it 100x “so it wouldn’t happen again . . .”

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sa76qxU79xA

1:00
Great link. The humility of the coach really comes through as he acknowledges the coaches who came before him.

"If I have seen further it is by standing on ye sholders of Giants."  Isaac Newton February 15, 1676
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 10, 2019, 02:33:43 pm
The final 0:37 of Wheaton vs Marietta...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PkgorHabzTI

In post-game interview, Francis describes that last shot and how he had missed it vs Augustana, with the game on the line, back in January - so he practiced it and made it 100x “so it wouldn’t happen again . . .”

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sa76qxU79xA

1:00

I watched that postgame earlier...great stuff.

And I remember that shot (at Wheaton) vs Augustana.  It was very similar - I remember it being more right wing vs right corner, but really close.  (I recall there being some question as to whether or not Chrishawn Orange fouled him.) The fact he went and practiced the same shot, waiting for this kind of moment, is just very cool and impressive.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on March 10, 2019, 02:37:23 pm
The CCIW has now sent 4 different teams to the Final Four in the last 7 seasons - North Central (2013), Illinois Wesleyan (2014), Augustana (2015, 2017), Wheaton (2019).  Without digging around, I am not sure any other league can say that?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 10, 2019, 02:41:48 pm
The CCIW has now sent 4 different teams to the Final Four in the last 7 seasons - North Central (2013), Illinois Wesleyan (2014), Augustana (2015, 2017), Wheaton (2019).  Without digging around, I am not sure any other league can say that?

If you expand it to nine years, the NEWMAC, WIAC, and NESCAC have each sent three.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: kiko on March 10, 2019, 02:49:03 pm
The CCIW has now sent 4 different teams to the Final Four in the last 7 seasons - North Central (2013), Illinois Wesleyan (2014), Augustana (2015, 2017), Wheaton (2019).  Without digging around, I am not sure any other league can say that?

If you expand it to nine years, the NEWMAC, WIAC, and NESCAC have each sent three.

There is a pretty concise list here:
https://d3hoops.com/archives/index-men (https://d3hoops.com/archives/index-men)

The WIAC, NEWMAC, NESCAC, and ODAC have sent three in a seven-year span in recent years (i.e. -- the era starting around 2006), but with a quick glance, I don't see anyone else with four.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 10, 2019, 03:00:52 pm

In post-game interview, Francis describes that last shot and how he had missed it vs Augustana, with the game on the line, back in January - so he practiced it and made it 100x “so it wouldn’t happen again . . .”

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sa76qxU79xA

1:00
Great link. The humility of the coach really comes through as he acknowledges the coaches who came before him.

"If I have seen further it is by standing on ye sholders of Giants."  Isaac Newton February 15, 1676

Yep. And that's who Mike is. He's a big-picture guy when it comes to his program, the history of it, and his place in it.

And you can tell, too, how invested in the CCIW he is. He made reference to Augustana SID and assistant AD Dave Wrath remembering what a bad player Mike was when he was at Wheaton, which wasn't a very good program in that era and thus could give Mike playing time ... and Dave demurred and said that he was actually pretty good. (Mike was a decent player; not great, but decent.) And he mentioned how he still sees himself as a player, going up against Aben Cooper and Kirk Anderson, two great Augie players of yesteryear (both of whom played in the '93 national championship game that Augie lost to Ohio Northern -- among his other accomplishments last night, Aston Francis tied Kirk Anderson's record for most treys made in a D3 tournament game).

So, yeah, the Isaac Newton quote really does describe Mike Schauer. It's the genuine humility of someone who appreciates the greatness of the coaches who came before him at Wheaton, the greatness of his league and the teams and players he's played and coached against in it, and who has a refreshing lack of ego in an occupation in which big egos are commonplace -- and that humility was on display on a night in which it'd be all too easy to bask in your own accomplishments.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 10, 2019, 03:48:27 pm
The CCIW has now sent 4 different teams to the Final Four in the last 7 seasons - North Central (2013), Illinois Wesleyan (2014), Augustana (2015, 2017), Wheaton (2019).  Without digging around, I am not sure any other league can say that?

If you expand it to nine years, the NEWMAC, WIAC, and NESCAC have each sent three.

I'm too busy to actually look, but can someone figure out the records of said leagues at the Final Four, including championships etc? Thanks in advance!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 10, 2019, 05:15:28 pm
Since I have the time, I'll allow myself to be Ypsi'ed:

league     FF programs  FF apps  W-L (.pct)    1-2-3-4    chips
WIAC  5 (UWEC, UWO 2, UWP 5, UWSP 4, UWW 5)    17  27-5 (.844)  12-2-1-1  UWP 4, UWSP 4, UWW 4
CCIW  6 (Augustana 6, Carthage, Illinois Wesleyan 6, North Central, North Park 5, Wheaton IL)    20  22-13 (.629)    6-4-9-0  North Park 5, Illinois Wesleyan
NESCAC  6 (Amherst 7, Connecticut C., Middlebury, Trinity CT, Williams 8)    18  13-18 (.419)    3-4-8-3  Amherst 2, Williams
NEWMAC  3 (Babson 2, MIT, Springfield)      4    2-3 (.400)    1-0-3-0  Babson

Note: This is D3 only. And it includes this season's Final Four.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 10, 2019, 05:52:56 pm
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=o65k8/8g9z0il3ffqsli12.jpg)

The final fours are set! Eight of the best men's and women's teams remain to battle it out for two national titles. On the women's side, many of those expected to make it to Salem. On the men's side, none of the top four powers will be in Fort Wayne.

Sunday on Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com), Dave takes a look at both a record breaking performance on the men's side and chats with the four teams dancing on the women's side. (Due to the extensive coverage in Fort Wayne at the men's championship weekend, Sunday's show will have more women's coverage than men's.) How one man put up 62-points in a game and has already shattered the single-tournament scoring record. And how the four hosts on the women's side survived their weekends to advance.

Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. Sunday's show can be seen LIVE starting at 7:00 p.m. ET right here: http://bit.ly/2NRnPZi (or via Facebook Live and Periscope simulcasts).

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to dave.mchugh@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options below.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Aston Francis, Wheaton (Ill.) senior guard
- Jeff Hans, No. 1 Thomas More women's coach
- Adrienne Schibles, No. 3 Bowdoin women's coach
- Ruth Sinn, No. 2 St. Thomas women's coach
- Bridgette Mann, No. 9 Scranton senior guard
- Carey Harveycutter, City of Salem (Vir.)

If you enjoy the show via the podcasts, choose your favorite avenue to listen and/or subscribe via the the following four avenues (click on the images when necessary):
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Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 10, 2019, 06:34:20 pm
Since I have the time, I'll allow myself to be Ypsi'ed:

league     FF programs  FF apps  W-L (.pct)    1-2-3-4    chips
WIAC  5 (UWEC, UWO 2, UWP 5, UWSP 4, UWW 5)    17  27-5 (.844)  12-2-1-1  UWP 4, UWSP 4, UWW 4
CCIW  6 (Augustana 6, Carthage, Illinois Wesleyan 6, North Central, North Park 5, Wheaton IL)    20  22-13 (.629)    6-4-9-0  North Park 5, Illinois Wesleyan
NESCAC  6 (Amherst 7, Connecticut C., Middlebury, Trinity CT, Williams 8)    18  13-18 (.419)    3-4-8-3  Amherst 2, Williams
NEWMAC  3 (Babson 2, MIT, Springfield)      4    2-3 (.400)    1-0-3-0  Babson

Note: This is D3 only. And it includes this season's Final Four.

Thanks, I appreciate the work!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ralph Turner on March 10, 2019, 09:03:24 pm
Since I have the time, I'll allow myself to be Ypsi'ed:

league     FF programs  FF apps  W-L (.pct)    1-2-3-4    chips
WIAC  5 (UWEC, UWO 2, UWP 5, UWSP 4, UWW 5)    17  27-5 (.844)  12-2-1-1  UWP 4, UWSP 4, UWW 4
CCIW  6 (Augustana 6, Carthage, Illinois Wesleyan 6, North Central, North Park 5, Wheaton IL)    20  22-13 (.629)    6-4-9-0  North Park 5, Illinois Wesleyan
NESCAC  6 (Amherst 7, Connecticut C., Middlebury, Trinity CT, Williams 8)    18  13-18 (.419)    3-4-8-3  Amherst 2, Williams
NEWMAC  3 (Babson 2, MIT, Springfield)      4    2-3 (.400)    1-0-3-0  Babson

Note: This is D3 only. And it includes this season's Final Four.
Yeah, yeah, yeah...

He volunteered to be Ypsi'ed.

It gave him another opportunity to mention the 5 North Park championships...

 ;)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: kiko on March 11, 2019, 01:26:39 am
Since I have the time, I'll allow myself to be Ypsi'ed:

league     FF programs  FF apps  W-L (.pct)    1-2-3-4    chips
WIAC  5 (UWEC, UWO 2, UWP 5, UWSP 4, UWW 5)    17  27-5 (.844)  12-2-1-1  UWP 4, UWSP 4, UWW 4
CCIW  6 (Augustana 6, Carthage, Illinois Wesleyan 6, North Central, North Park 5, Wheaton IL)    20  22-13 (.629)    6-4-9-0  North Park 5, Illinois Wesleyan
NESCAC  6 (Amherst 7, Connecticut C., Middlebury, Trinity CT, Williams 8)    18  13-18 (.419)    3-4-8-3  Amherst 2, Williams
NEWMAC  3 (Babson 2, MIT, Springfield)      4    2-3 (.400)    1-0-3-0  Babson

Note: This is D3 only. And it includes this season's Final Four.
Yeah, yeah, yeah...

He volunteered to be Ypsi'ed.

It gave him another opportunity to mention the 5 North Park championships...

 ;)

In fairness, if he wanted to play the reflected glory card, he'd have reminded us that North Park defeated Wheaton earlier this season.

https://d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/boxscores/20181201_dblj.xml (https://d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/boxscores/20181201_dblj.xml)

(You're welcome, Gregory...)  :)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 11, 2019, 09:20:58 am
Any hotel/ticket info from any of the teams? I checked Wheaton and Oshkosh's and didn't see anything.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: CNU85 on March 11, 2019, 09:55:47 am
If I hear something from CNU concerning tickets/hotels I will post. I am planning on just finding my own hotel and booking it. And I figured it wouldn't be sold out.

Hoping I can make it. Friday is deadline for Corporate tax returns. Just got off phone with tax guru trying to get me the info in time to file Thursday!

Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: sac on March 11, 2019, 10:57:45 am
The online fees for tickets in Ft. Wayne are a little more than disappointing.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 11, 2019, 11:02:09 am
The online fees for tickets in Ft. Wayne are a little more than disappointing.

No kidding. 2 adult ($26 each) and a student (does a kid count) is nearly $100 after fees and taxes. I doubt it will be a sellout, so I'll risk just getting tickets at the stadium on Friday. The price of "big time," I guess.

If I hear something from CNU concerning tickets/hotels I will post. I am planning on just finding my own hotel and booking it. And I figured it wouldn't be sold out.

Hoping I can make it. Friday is deadline for Corporate tax returns. Just got off phone with tax guru trying to get me the info in time to file Thursday!

Sure, but sometimes through participating schools, there's group discounts on rooms.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: D3ball1845 on March 11, 2019, 11:44:59 am
I'll be in attendance for the whole weekend. Flying in on Friday morning. Looking for opinions from those who have been to previous championship weekends, should I buy tickets in advance (I'm going with 4 other people)? I just don't want to travel all the way out there and it be sold out, especially when I am actually going to see someone specific play.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 11, 2019, 12:02:38 pm
 I've never bought tickets in advance. You want to get tix through the school if you want to sit with their fans. I've also walked up and said I want to sit with these fans and I've gotten general admission tix for that section. Fort Wayne may be completely different than Salem, but it's also much larger...get a room in advance, though
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: D3ball1845 on March 11, 2019, 12:09:25 pm
Okay, thank you for your input. Going to see someone play in the all-star game so I don't really care about sitting with the fans of any of the teams for the Final 4 and Championship games. I have been looking at Ticketmaster and it seems that they have changed their general admission seats to the back corners of the stadium on one side with the mid-to-upper level center court seats now sectioned off, while all the mid-to-upper level seats on the other side are general admission.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Smitty Oom on March 11, 2019, 12:51:42 pm
I've only been once, but if you are going specifically for the All-Star game I would almost guarantee there to be tix available.

I have not looked at ticket prices and online fees for this game specifically but most online sites always have outrageous processing fees for all games/concerts/etc. Quite annoying.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 11, 2019, 02:41:18 pm
Since I have the time, I'll allow myself to be Ypsi'ed:

league     FF programs  FF apps  W-L (.pct)    1-2-3-4    chips
WIAC  5 (UWEC, UWO 2, UWP 5, UWSP 4, UWW 5)    17  27-5 (.844)  12-2-1-1  UWP 4, UWSP 4, UWW 4
CCIW  6 (Augustana 6, Carthage, Illinois Wesleyan 6, North Central, North Park 5, Wheaton IL)    20  22-13 (.629)    6-4-9-0  North Park 5, Illinois Wesleyan
NESCAC  6 (Amherst 7, Connecticut C., Middlebury, Trinity CT, Williams 8)    18  13-18 (.419)    3-4-8-3  Amherst 2, Williams
NEWMAC  3 (Babson 2, MIT, Springfield)      4    2-3 (.400)    1-0-3-0  Babson

Note: This is D3 only. And it includes this season's Final Four.
Yeah, yeah, yeah...

He volunteered to be Ypsi'ed.

It gave him another opportunity to mention the 5 North Park championships...

 ;)

In fairness, if he wanted to play the reflected glory card, he'd have reminded us that North Park defeated Wheaton earlier this season.

https://d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/boxscores/20181201_dblj.xml (https://d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/boxscores/20181201_dblj.xml)

(You're welcome, Gregory...)  :)

Thanks, kiko. But if I had mentioned NPU's win over Wheaton, someone would've undoubtedly responded with an acerbic comment about how my Vikings fared in Kolf Arena against UW-Oshkosh back in November.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 11, 2019, 03:37:44 pm
We talked about tickets and such with Nathan Dennison on Hoopsville Thursday. Plenty of good info in our chat: www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2019/mar7

And fees online for tickets are basically SOP. Salem has them as well since they use TicketMaster.

Head's up ... there is a six-dollar per-day fee for parking in Fort Wayne. Again, in the podcast it is mentioned.

And where you sit is being done a little differently this year. Basically, throw out what you remember in Salem ... it may not be the same this time around. Dennison's interview touches on it.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: CNU85 on March 11, 2019, 04:23:30 pm
We talked about tickets and such with Nathan Dennison on Hoopsville Thursday. Plenty of good info in our chat: www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2019/mar7

And fees online for tickets are basically SOP. Salem has them as well since they use TicketMaster.

Head's up ... there is a six-dollar per-day fee for parking in Fort Wayne. Again, in the podcast it is mentioned.

And where you sit is being done a little differently this year. Basically, throw out what you remember in Salem ... it may not be the same this time around. Dennison's interview touches on it.

Thanks for the info D-Mac! I'm making plans now.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 11, 2019, 06:23:35 pm
Two years ago, Ohio Dominican hosted the DII women's national championships.  I was thinking of going to see the eventual champion, Ashland University, play.  However, ODU's online tournament ticket website forced prospective purchasers to set up an account (name, address, phone, credit card info) BEFORE revealing the setup and prices of the tickets!  I considered this to be ridiculous and stayed away.  I guess others did not, as they are hosting again this year.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: GoPerry on March 12, 2019, 11:03:26 am
We talked about tickets and such with Nathan Dennison on Hoopsville Thursday. Plenty of good info in our chat: www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2019/mar7

And fees online for tickets are basically SOP. Salem has them as well since they use TicketMaster.

Head's up ... there is a six-dollar per-day fee for parking in Fort Wayne. Again, in the podcast it is mentioned.

And where you sit is being done a little differently this year. Basically, throw out what you remember in Salem ... it may not be the same this time around. Dennison's interview touches on it.

It's killing me that I can't get to Fort Wayne this weekend. Out of town. Do we have any idea yet when CBS network will be broadcasting?   Or do I have to set the DVR to basically tape the entire 2 days?  Maybe even Sunday?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 12, 2019, 12:12:56 pm
I was thinking of coming up with a place and time to meet up with fellow posters. A late night meal after the 2nd game on Friday or a lunch time meet before the All-Star game on Saturday...
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: ronk on March 12, 2019, 12:21:51 pm
I was thinking of coming up with a place and time to meet up with fellow posters. A late night meal after the 2nd game on Friday or a lunch time meet before the All-Star game on Saturday...

 Good thought, Greek, but I'll be in Salem for the women's Final 4; maybe next year when the Scranton men may return to the Final 4.  ;)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: deiscanton on March 12, 2019, 12:43:50 pm
From what I have seen from the TV listings, CBS Sports Network will show the men's DIII basketball title game on tape delay at approx 11 PM Eastern on Saturday March 16.  CBS Sports Network has obligations to do live broadcasts of the Conference USA women's and men's title games on Saturday evening -- these games wil be playing at the same time as the DIII men's championship game.

It is unclear at this time whether a live video stream will be on ncaa.com Saturday at 7 PM Eastern.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on March 12, 2019, 12:56:59 pm
A little fun fact... this year's host institution is Manchester. The last time the title wasn't decided in Salem was back in 1995 when UW-Platteville won the title over... Manchester 69-55.
Some names people outside the D3 world may have heard of were on the sidelines with Bo Ryan coaching Platteville and Steve Alford coaching Manchester. According to Wikipedia on Alford's page... "The loss to Bo Ryan's University of Wisconsin-Platteville team marked the only title game in NCAA history matching two undefeated squads." which if true is quite interesting.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 12, 2019, 02:40:24 pm
It's true. The '95 title matchup was the only unbeaten-vs.-unbeaten national championship game in D3 history.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: CNU85 on March 12, 2019, 02:46:08 pm
I was thinking of coming up with a place and time to meet up with fellow posters. A late night meal after the 2nd game on Friday or a lunch time meet before the All-Star game on Saturday...

That would be cool. some ideas....There is an Italian place right across the street. Casa Ristorante. However...per the Fort Wayne page, that is the gathering spot for CNU faithful. There is a Ruby Tuesday across the street (but everyone has one of those).  Or...8/10 mile away is Granite City Food and Brewery.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 12, 2019, 03:17:06 pm
I was thinking of coming up with a place and time to meet up with fellow posters. A late night meal after the 2nd game on Friday or a lunch time meet before the All-Star game on Saturday...

That would be cool. some ideas....There is an Italian place right across the street. Casa Ristorante. However...per the Fort Wayne page, that is the gathering spot for CNU faithful. There is a Ruby Tuesday across the street (but everyone has one of those).  Or...8/10 mile away is Granite City Food and Brewery.

What's this page you talk of? Is there an unofficial place for all the teams?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 12, 2019, 04:01:17 pm
Listening to Hoopsville now...

https://www.visitfortwayne.com/event/ncaa-division-iii-mens-basketball-championships/21400/


For the first time, the NCAA Division III Men's Basketball National Championship comes to Fort Wayne at the Allen County War Memorial Coliseum. The event is hosted by Manchester University and Visit Fort Wayne. The tournament is a 61-team single-elimination tourney, with teams advancing from four regionals, to the semifinals and finals in Fort Wayne.

Friday, March 15: Semifinals at 6:00 p.m. and 8:00 p.m. (30 minutes following the conclusion of the first semifinal)
Saturday, March 16: NABC Reese's D3 All Star Game at 4:30 p.m., and Championship Finals at 7:00 p.m.

The best sources of information for NCAA D3 Basketball are www.d3hoops.com and www.d3hoopsville.com.
Ticket prices:
All session tickets (both days):  $26 adults, $16 students/seniors/military, 5 and under is FREE
Single session tickets (one day):  $15.50 adults, $10.50 students/seniors/military, 5 and under is FREE
Groups (10 or more):
All session tickets (both days):  $21 adults, $11 students/seniors/military
Single session tickets (one day):  $13.50 adults, $8.50 students/seniors/military
 
PARKING
CASH ONLY & SINGLE ENTRY
$6 MAIN LOT; $10 PREFERRED LOT; $18 BUS/RV



Really? Come on Fort Wayne...
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 12, 2019, 04:17:30 pm
Per broadcasts ... CBS will show the championship on tape-delay, however ... there is still an obligation that the title game be shown LIVE online. As noted a few times on Hoopsville (to steal Greek's comment: come on, people!) ... who is doing that is still up in the air best I can tell. One option is that CBS will show their production, live, online and then show it again on TV on tape delay (and most likely delayed past 11pm to be honest). The other option is that NCAA.com (Tupelo-Raycom) will show the title game, live, online (featuring Brendan Gulick and myself who will be doing the semifinals and All-Star Game as well).

Either way ... the title game will be shown live ... online
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: WUPHF on March 12, 2019, 05:07:47 pm

PARKING
CASH ONLY & SINGLE ENTRY
$6 MAIN LOT; $10 PREFERRED LOT; $18 BUS/RV[/i]


Really? Come on Fort Wayne...

Not to mention, they have a Tim Horton's coffee in the coliseum. Blech!

The idea of a parking lot and an upgraded lot is a little crazy.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 12, 2019, 05:48:23 pm
Parking might get a little crazy as they have some... let's say, inconvenient scheduling. Apparently they have a Monster Truck Jam at the same time. Too bad, I would've loved to take my kid there and then the championship game.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: pedro12 on March 12, 2019, 06:09:44 pm
well, if you have to be in FW here are a few local places to eat.

within reasonable distance of the Coliseum:

Wu's - nicer local chinese restaurant with very good back menu.
Shigs in Pit - BBQ place about 5 minutes away.  Owned by a local microbrewery so they have their own beer on tap. reasonably priced.
Cork and Clever - steakhouse close to the coliseum with a good salad bar
Casa's - local italian chain across the street from the coliseum. nothing spectacular but good food and reasonably priced.
Baker Street- nicer restaurant with steaks and seafood close to the coliseum.
Burger Fi - Good local burger place that also serves beer. reasonably price.

Dupont Rd area north of coliseum:
Black Canyon - nicer restaurant with quality food.
lucky moose - pub feel with a good variety. reasonably priced.

Southwest FW:
Catablu - one of my favorites in town. nicer restaurant. they also usually have good items for special diets.
Eddie Merlot's - higher end steak house.  this is a chain but it is the original.



Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: GoPerry on March 12, 2019, 08:26:19 pm
Per broadcasts ... CBS will show the championship on tape-delay, however ... there is still an obligation that the title game be shown LIVE online. As noted a few times on Hoopsville (to steal Greek's comment: come on, people!) ... who is doing that is still up in the air best I can tell. One option is that CBS will show their production, live, online and then show it again on TV on tape delay (and most likely delayed past 11pm to be honest). The other option is that NCAA.com (Tupelo-Raycom) will show the title game, live, online (featuring Brendan Gulick and myself who will be doing the semifinals and All-Star Game as well).

Either way ... the title game will be shown live ... online

Ok thanks for that info Dave.  What about the Friday semis?  Will those be streamed on NCAA.com?  Can they be viewed later ala Stretch OnDemand?  TV tape delayed? 

Sorry if you've already announced this and I missed it . . .

Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 12, 2019, 08:26:45 pm
Per broadcasts ... CBS will show the championship on tape-delay, however ... there is still an obligation that the title game be shown LIVE online. As noted a few times on Hoopsville (to steal Greek's comment: come on, people!) ... who is doing that is still up in the air best I can tell. One option is that CBS will show their production, live, online and then show it again on TV on tape delay (and most likely delayed past 11pm to be honest). The other option is that NCAA.com (Tupelo-Raycom) will show the title game, live, online (featuring Brendan Gulick and myself who will be doing the semifinals and All-Star Game as well).

Either way ... the title game will be shown live ... online

Do you know if the live online broadcast will be free, or will there be a charge?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 12, 2019, 08:29:10 pm
Semifinals will be streamed live, for free, as they have been for the past decade or so, yes.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on March 13, 2019, 04:28:57 am
It's true. The '95 title matchup was the only unbeaten-vs.-unbeaten national championship game in D3 history.
But the statement said in NCAA history which I took to mean all levels which is why I wasn't sure if it was completely true.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 13, 2019, 07:42:47 am
well, if you have to be in FW here are a few local places to eat.

within reasonable distance of the Coliseum:

Wu's - nicer local chinese restaurant with very good back menu.
Shigs in Pit - BBQ place about 5 minutes away.  Owned by a local microbrewery so they have their own beer on tap. reasonably priced.
Cork and Clever - steakhouse close to the coliseum with a good salad bar
Casa's - local italian chain across the street from the coliseum. nothing spectacular but good food and reasonably priced.
Baker Street- nicer restaurant with steaks and seafood close to the coliseum.
Burger Fi - Good local burger place that also serves beer. reasonably price.

Dupont Rd area north of coliseum:
Black Canyon - nicer restaurant with quality food.
lucky moose - pub feel with a good variety. reasonably priced.

Southwest FW:
Catablu - one of my favorites in town. nicer restaurant. they also usually have good items for special diets.
Eddie Merlot's - higher end steak house.  this is a chain but it is the original.

Thanks for the post. When we went to Salem, we used Mac and Bob's as our go-to place to eat after Friday's games and before Saturday's games. It had a hint of that Sports Bar feel because it had a bar area with a few televisions. It was nicer because there weren't flat screens all over the place and you could still find a quiet corner if that's what you wanted. I have a kid, so we'll steer clear of those "nicer" places. Sounds like the Lucky Moose is something we'll check out.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: CNU85 on March 13, 2019, 08:12:53 am
I was thinking of coming up with a place and time to meet up with fellow posters. A late night meal after the 2nd game on Friday or a lunch time meet before the All-Star game on Saturday...

That would be cool. some ideas....There is an Italian place right across the street. Casa Ristorante. However...per the Fort Wayne page, that is the gathering spot for CNU faithful. There is a Ruby Tuesday across the street (but everyone has one of those).  Or...8/10 mile away is Granite City Food and Brewery.

What's this page you talk of? Is there an unofficial place for all the teams?

Here is the page I was referring to......it gives hangout places for fans of each team.

https://www.visitfortwayne.com/ncaa/ (https://www.visitfortwayne.com/ncaa/)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: CNU85 on March 13, 2019, 08:16:47 am

PARKING
CASH ONLY & SINGLE ENTRY
$6 MAIN LOT; $10 PREFERRED LOT; $18 BUS/RV[/i]


Really? Come on Fort Wayne...

Not to mention, they have a Tim Horton's coffee in the coliseum. Blech!

The idea of a parking lot and an upgraded lot is a little crazy.

So Tim Horton is not so great, huh? I noticed there are tons of them in Fort Wayne. Was hoping for a nice morning donut.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: pedro12 on March 13, 2019, 08:44:27 am
a few more places:

cebollas - mexican, fast service, reasonably price, close to the arena, my favorite salsa
wings etc. - a little farther north on dupont rd, reasonably price with good wings and a full bar style menu
liberty diner - my favorite breakfast place.  on the west side of coliseum blvd.

donuts:
tom's donuts - south of the coliseum
rise and roll - north of the coliseum on dupont rd.  amish made donuts.  they are a little sweet for me but very popular.
Leo Donuts - Northeast of end of dupont rd almost out of town.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: WUPHF on March 13, 2019, 09:46:23 am
So Tim Horton is not so great, huh?

Apparently, they are good if you are from north of the border, but not a place I can recommend for coffee or donuts.  Try one of the other spots mentioned. 
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: GoPerry on March 13, 2019, 09:53:37 am
I was thinking of coming up with a place and time to meet up with fellow posters. A late night meal after the 2nd game on Friday or a lunch time meet before the All-Star game on Saturday...

That would be cool. some ideas....There is an Italian place right across the street. Casa Ristorante. However...per the Fort Wayne page, that is the gathering spot for CNU faithful. There is a Ruby Tuesday across the street (but everyone has one of those).  Or...8/10 mile away is Granite City Food and Brewery.

What's this page you talk of? Is there an unofficial place for all the teams?

Here is the page I was referring to......it gives hangout places for fans of each team.

https://www.visitfortwayne.com/ncaa/ (https://www.visitfortwayne.com/ncaa/)

The owner of the Acme Bar and Grill drew the short straw as the designated Wheaton fan spot!  The Sprite, Coke and Iced Tea sales should do well though.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 13, 2019, 11:31:02 am
So why does CNU get a fancy Italian restaurant while Wheaton and Swarthmore gets a sports bar and Oshkosh fans get The Pub? LOL
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 13, 2019, 01:12:37 pm
I was thinking of coming up with a place and time to meet up with fellow posters. A late night meal after the 2nd game on Friday or a lunch time meet before the All-Star game on Saturday...

That would be cool. some ideas....There is an Italian place right across the street. Casa Ristorante. However...per the Fort Wayne page, that is the gathering spot for CNU faithful. There is a Ruby Tuesday across the street (but everyone has one of those).  Or...8/10 mile away is Granite City Food and Brewery.

What's this page you talk of? Is there an unofficial place for all the teams?

Here is the page I was referring to......it gives hangout places for fans of each team.

https://www.visitfortwayne.com/ncaa/ (https://www.visitfortwayne.com/ncaa/)

The owner of the Acme Bar and Grill drew the short straw as the designated Wheaton fan spot!  The Sprite, Coke and Iced Tea sales should do well though.

Yeah, I immediately started snickering when I saw which establishment was hosting Wheaton fans. I'm not even sure that the Acme Bar & Grill is going to do well with Sprite, Coke, and iced tea sales. I suspect that a hefty percentage of the Wheaton fanbase will avoid altogether any bistro that has "bar" as the second word in its name.

The owner of the Acme Bar & Grill is obviously this guy:

(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-DdQTnuCwpy4/UnWoMYlcQMI/AAAAAAAADRY/lWrEKLuOanw/s1600/ACME_by_OtakuMako.jpg)

... and he's about to see his drink profits go over the cliff this weekend.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 13, 2019, 01:52:09 pm
So why does CNU get a fancy Italian restaurant while Wheaton and Swarthmore gets a sports bar and Oshkosh fans get The Pub? LOL

Maybe because CNU has to come the farthest they get the venue across the street from the game?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: CNU85 on March 13, 2019, 01:56:22 pm
So why does CNU get a fancy Italian restaurant while Wheaton and Swarthmore gets a sports bar and Oshkosh fans get The Pub? LOL

Mama always told me I was special!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: WUPHF on March 13, 2019, 01:59:17 pm
The Acme Bar and Grill looks very good.

If I were going, I would head there...
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 13, 2019, 02:01:12 pm
The Acme Bar and Grill looks very good.

If I were going, I would head there...

The Pub @ 1802 looks fine as well.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 14, 2019, 06:50:35 pm

Here in Ft. Wayne, already ran into Aston Francis in the weight room as I was exploring the hotel.  They really have done up the welcome wagon pretty well - balloons and banners everywhere.  Haven't been up to the arena yet - flight delays - but I hear it's a pretty good set-up as well.  My flight had two of the officials for this weekend and NABC All-Star Nick DePersia from Rowan.  Pretty cool.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: RogK on March 14, 2019, 07:37:01 pm
A little trivia for those doing the weekend in Fort Wayne :
Allen County War Memorial Coliseum opened in September 1952. The NBA Fort Wayne Pistons moved into the new arena for the '52-'53 season, having previously been situated in a large high school gym. Sharing the NBA Western Division with the Pistons that season were the Milwaukee Hawks, Indianapolis Olympians, Rochester (NY) Royals and Minneapolis Lakers. The Eastern Division consisted of the Philadelphia Warriors, Baltimore Bullets, Boston Celtics, Syracuse Nationals and New York Knicks.
Indianapolis folded, leaving the Western Division with four teams for the '53-'54 season.
Baltimore folded after a 3-11 start to the '54-'55 season and those games were voided. The remaining 8 teams (4 per division) completed a revised 72 game schedule.
The '55-'56 campaign saw the Hawks move from Milwaukee to St Louis.
No franchise movement for the '56-'57 season, but then the Fort Wayne Pistons relocated to Detroit and the Rochester Royals shifted to Cincinnati for '57-'58.
So, the War Memorial Coliseum saw NBA action for five seasons. Ponder that for a minute or three. An old Pistons program might still be lodged behind a seat somewhere.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: ronk on March 14, 2019, 08:12:49 pm
A little trivia for those doing the weekend in Fort Wayne :
Allen County War Memorial Coliseum opened in September 1952. The NBA Fort Wayne Pistons moved into the new arena for the '52-'53 season, having previously been situated in a large high school gym. Sharing the NBA Western Division with the Pistons that season were the Milwaukee Hawks, Indianapolis Olympians, Rochester (NY) Royals and Minneapolis Lakers. The Eastern Division consisted of the Philadelphia Warriors, Baltimore Bullets, Boston Celtics, Syracuse Nationals and New York Knicks.
Indianapolis folded, leaving the Western Division with four teams for the '53-'54 season.
Baltimore folded after a 3-11 start to the '54-'55 season and those games were voided. The remaining 8 teams (4 per division) completed a revised 72 game schedule.
The '55-'56 campaign saw the Hawks move from Milwaukee to St Louis.
No franchise movement for the '56-'57 season, but then the Fort Wayne Pistons relocated to Detroit and the Rochester Royals shifted to Cincinnati for '57-'58.
So, the War Memorial Coliseum saw NBA action for five seasons. Ponder that for a minute or three. An old Pistons program might still be lodged behind a seat somewhere.

 I've mentioned this before: when the Celtics came to "town" by train, they had to get off some distance outside of town and hitchhike or grab some local transportation to get into Ft Wayne. 
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: RogK on March 14, 2019, 08:47:04 pm
That's pretty revealing, ronk. The early NBA must have been a frequently low-budget operation.
Basketball may have looked rather primitive back then, too.
Click on the "show box score scan" here :
https://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/195211150INO.html
The starting 5 are identified as C LF RF LG RG! I assume that stands for Left Forward, Right Forward, etc.
They apparently thought it was useful to have rigidly-defined positions.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: AO on March 14, 2019, 08:53:36 pm
The NBA definitely had humble beginnings.  The Lakers had to play a couple playoff games at Hamline when they ran into scheduling conflicts with the Minneapolis Auditorium and Armory.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 14, 2019, 08:56:26 pm
That's pretty revealing, ronk. The early NBA must have been a frequently low-budget operation.
Basketball may have looked rather primitive back then, too.
Click on the "show box score scan" here :
https://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/195211150INO.html
The starting 5 are identified as C LF RF LG RG! I assume that stands for Left Forward, Right Forward, etc.
They apparently thought it was useful to have rigidly-defined positions.

Although the reality is much more fluid for at least most teams, is that necessarily that much more rigid than power forward, small forward, shooting guard, and point guard?

Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: y_jack_lok on March 14, 2019, 09:01:29 pm
Here's another food option: https://noriasiancuisine.com. Asian fusion, really good, not too expensive. It's just West of I-69 at exit 316 (which is a few miles north of the coliseum exit) in a complex with several other restaurants.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: RogK on March 14, 2019, 09:32:27 pm
Mr Ypsi, it would be rigid if "Right Forward" really meant he was told to confine himself to a small sector of the floor on offense. As you suggest, labels don't necessarily match actual movement of players. I guess "point guard" is the most accurate label, for someone who is primary dribbler / ball handler. If indeed a team has a primary dribbler.
I don't see any purpose in calling someone a power forward, for example. It's hard to define the dividing line between what is a 2 or 3 or 4 when they have overlapping skills.
Does a power forward have to get more than 28 rebounds per 100 minutes?
So-called 2s and 3s certainly seem interchangeable.
I guess my idea is to observe the game without preconceptions of what various players in alleged positions are supposed to do.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 14, 2019, 10:13:58 pm
Can't argue with anything you said.  I'm just wondering if RF and LF were in actuality as rigidly defined as the name suggests?  And I don't know the answer for that.  Have roles on the court really evolved that much in fluidity, or have they always been that way?  (I suspect they have gotten more fluid, but I wonder if they were ever as restricted as the old names implied?)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: RogK on March 14, 2019, 11:07:02 pm
Looking a little through the results of the ABA Indiana Pacers, they played a few home games in Fort Wayne (the Coliseum) such as 1/12/73 vs the Denver Rockets and 2/24/74 vs the Virginia Squires. I'm sure those dates seem ancient to the guys who'll play at the Coliseum this weekend, but they'll be able to say they've played in a building that saw regular season ABA and NBA games.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: sac on March 15, 2019, 12:29:29 am
Neat D3 trivia, Trine University's football stadium is named after Fred Zollner owner of the Ft. Wayne Pistons(they were actually known as the Ft. Wayne Zollner Pistons) as is the on campus golf course.  I was lucky to have played there twice in college when it was still Tri-State University.

Their new basketball arena actually houses the clubhouse for the golf course on the lower level and is built on the site of the old clubhouse.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: kiko on March 15, 2019, 02:15:29 am
We actually used the LG/RG/etc. designations when I was on the junior high school team in the sixth grade.  (Not joking -- this was in the era juuuuust before MTV came online.)  It indicated where you started before the team ran whatever play it was trying to execute in the half court offense, and where you were assigned if you were playing zone on the defensive end.

Whether this was the NBA system or not, I can't say... we were more than a few rungs down the pyramid from them.  It may have just been a way to organize things in a way that kids could understand, and maybe execute properly one time out of every six or so.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: BluesBrother on March 15, 2019, 02:02:21 pm
Slightly off-topic, but...

Whitman men's basketball senior guard Austin Butler is a finalist in the "Darkhorse Dunker" contest. On the line is a trip to the NCAA Division I Final Four in Minneapolis, Minn. to compete in the 2019 College Slam Dunk contest broadcast live on ESPN.

Voting starts today and ends Friday, March 22. You can vote once per day and do so on each of your devices and on each of the browsers installed on those devices. (Chrome, Firefox, Internet Explorer, Safari, etc.) Several browsers feature an "incognito" mode which you can also use to vote, and do so up to three times per day.

If you'd like to see Austin represent D3, go to http://www.darkhorsedunker.com/ and click "VOTE NOW" under Austin's headshot.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 15, 2019, 07:11:17 pm
First semi has reached halftime in Ft. Wayne: Swarthmore leads CNU, 36-29.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 15, 2019, 08:06:10 pm
Swarthmore will play for the "Big Doorstop", downing CNU 70-63.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: CNU85 on March 15, 2019, 08:21:39 pm
Swarthmore’s D was impressive. CNU was only able to hit 32% and were a dismal 24% from 3. And yet the game was competitive.  Sigh. Now a 13 hour drive home.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: CNU85 on March 15, 2019, 08:23:17 pm
Congrats to the Captains on another tremendous season! It was fun watching you, Logan Miller, Tyler Femi and Marcus Carter! Thanks for some fun years. Everyone else— see ya next year!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on March 16, 2019, 06:47:22 am
Could Francis possibly win Most Outstanding Player for the tournament without making the championship? I think he's a lock for the All-Tournament team but how often has a player won MOP without winning the title? My guess is Fravert if Oshkosh wins but I think I would go Francis over O'Dell if Swarthmore takes it.
All Tournament team I'd guess is Francis-Wheaton, Fravert and Boots- Oshkosh, O'Dell-Swarthmore, and the 5th chosen between Flynn, Wittchow- Oshkosh,  Shafer, Harkins, Wiley-Swarthmore and Carter-Chris Newport depending on how things go tonight.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: thebear on March 16, 2019, 08:22:56 am
In 1981 Max Artis from Augustana won the MOP, but Potsdam tied the game at the regulation buzzer and won in overtime.

The story was that the voting was done in regulation and it was too late to change. [The game was played in Rock Island].

From 1981 - 200 There were a total of five MOP's from non championship teams, but they all played in the finals. 

Since 2001, all of the MOP's have been from the championship team.

Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 16, 2019, 10:22:34 am
Could Francis possibly win Most Outstanding Player for the tournament without making the championship? I think he's a lock for the All-Tournament team but how often has a player won MOP without winning the title? My guess is Fravert if Oshkosh wins but I think I would go Francis over O'Dell if Swarthmore takes it.
All Tournament team I'd guess is Francis-Wheaton, Fravert and Boots- Oshkosh, O'Dell-Swarthmore, and the 5th chosen between Flynn, Wittchow- Oshkosh,  Shafer, Harkins, Wiley-Swarthmore and Carter-Chris Newport depending on how things go tonight.

There's only one game left, so that does and will change things, but if I were voting just after last night, I'd pick Boots, Flynn, Wiley, Carter, and Francis.  I believe O'Dell is Swat's best player, but he had some foul trouble last night and was really their third best in the game.  I'd love to find a way to get Nate Shafer on there - his defense really kept them in the game during the first part of the second half, when it could've gotten away.

I think Boots, Francis, and Carter are locks at this point, with the other two coming out of tonight's performance.  The only time I've ever seen a team completely left of the list is when they get smoked without a standout individual performance.  Wheaton got smoked, but even an inefficient 44 points is still 44 points.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 16, 2019, 01:25:17 pm
well, if you have to be in FW here are a few local places to eat.

within reasonable distance of the Coliseum:

Wu's - nicer local chinese restaurant with very good back menu.
Shigs in Pit - BBQ place about 5 minutes away.  Owned by a local microbrewery so they have their own beer on tap. reasonably priced.
Cork and Clever - steakhouse close to the coliseum with a good salad bar
Casa's - local italian chain across the street from the coliseum. nothing spectacular but good food and reasonably priced.
Baker Street- nicer restaurant with steaks and seafood close to the coliseum.
Burger Fi - Good local burger place that also serves beer. reasonably price.

Dupont Rd area north of coliseum:
Black Canyon - nicer restaurant with quality food.
lucky moose - pub feel with a good variety. reasonably priced.

Southwest FW:
Catablu - one of my favorites in town. nicer restaurant. they also usually have good items for special diets.
Eddie Merlot's - higher end steak house.  this is a chain but it is the original.

Pedro,

This list was clutch! Thank you for the recommendations!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 16, 2019, 06:50:05 pm
Unfortunately, I wasn't able to make it to Salem Fort Wayne this year. Something unexpected came up that prevented me from coming. Very disappointing since I booked my room in October, but it is what it is.


How have the crowds been? I know the place seats 13,000 or so, but I believe they were closing off the top section? I think I heard a number around 5,000 for the "lower bowl"? Is that correct?


Wheaton is just 3 1/2 hours away. Did they bring a big crowd Friday night? What about Oshkosh? They are a manageable 5 1/2 or so away? I think they would bring a lot based on the excitement.


The Oshkosh boxscore says about 2,000? Is that accurate?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ralph Turner on March 16, 2019, 09:15:03 pm
As an outsider, IMHO, the WIAC/CCIW axis is just heads-and-shoulders better the rest of the country.

That top right bracket, all the way down to Marietta in the lower left was a whole 'nother tournament.

Congrats to UW-O.

Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 16, 2019, 09:21:01 pm
Congrats to UWO. And congrats to the impossibly-young-looking Matt Lewis, whom I suspect is only the third-ever head coach to win a D3 national championship in his first season in charge of any program.

I think that today's moral of the story is: In an era in D3 in which it sometimes looks as though the traditional center is a vanishing breed, there is still plenty of room in this game for a good big man who can score with either hand down in the blocks. Jack "Moose" Flynn was clearly the difference-maker in this game for the Titans.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 16, 2019, 10:05:06 pm
Curious who made all tournament team.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: y_jack_lok on March 16, 2019, 10:21:11 pm
Unfortunately, I wasn't able to make it to Salem Fort Wayne this year. Something unexpected came up that prevented me from coming. Very disappointing since I booked my room in October, but it is what it is.


How have the crowds been? I know the place seats 13,000 or so, but I believe they were closing off the top section? I think I heard a number around 5,000 for the "lower bowl"? Is that correct?


Wheaton is just 3 1/2 hours away. Did they bring a big crowd Friday night? What about Oshkosh? They are a manageable 5 1/2 or so away? I think they would bring a lot based on the excitement.


The Oshkosh boxscore says about 2,000? Is that accurate?

They closed off the ends, but the sides were open all the way up. There were 14 seating sections on each side with about 150 seats in each, so about 4,200 seats there plus some extras higher up, thus 5,000 is about right. The 2,000 attendance figure also seems accurate. Wheaton, Swarthmore, and UW-O each had decent support, CNU a little less, especially tonight. Lots of Wheaton fans stuck around for tonight's game. Too bad you couldn't make it.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: cubs on March 16, 2019, 10:26:23 pm
And congrats to the impossibly-young-looking Matt Lewis, whom I suspect is only the third-ever head coach to win a D3 national championship in his first season in charge of any program.
Who were the other two if you don't mind me asking?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 16, 2019, 11:00:03 pm
Bosko Djurickovic at North Park (1985) and Joe Campoli at Ohio Northern (1993).
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: cubs on March 16, 2019, 11:01:17 pm
Thanks Greg!!!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 17, 2019, 09:26:28 am
Curious who made all tournament team.

MOP - Jack Flynn
Aston Francis
Adam Fravert
Cam Wiley
Zac O'Dell
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 17, 2019, 09:27:25 am
That's the logical five -- and the right MOP pick as well.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 17, 2019, 09:27:52 am
I will say I'm disappointed I spent a whole weekend here and didn't meet any of you posters who were in attendance.  Is it too hard to walk down the steps and yell at me?  I know it looks official and busy, but introductions are welcome (for future reference).  Maybe there should be a designated poster meeting place after Friday night next time?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 17, 2019, 10:16:37 am
I actually inquired about that when I was planning on coming. I got one response from someone who wasn't coming. LOL.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: AO on March 17, 2019, 12:40:18 pm
As an outsider, IMHO, the WIAC/CCIW axis is just heads-and-shoulders better the rest of the country.

That top right bracket, all the way down to Marietta in the lower left was a whole 'nother tournament.

Congrats to UW-O.
This is the 4th time in 8 appearances that my Northwestern Eagles have played the eventual champs in the 1st or 2nd round.  If you get past the last WIAC or CCIW team remaining, you've got to feel good about your chances to win it all. 
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 17, 2019, 01:21:49 pm
As an outsider, IMHO, the WIAC/CCIW axis is just heads-and-shoulders better the rest of the country.

That top right bracket, all the way down to Marietta in the lower left was a whole 'nother tournament.

Congrats to UW-O.
This is the 4th time in 8 appearances that my Northwestern Eagles have played the eventual champs in the 1st or 2nd round.  If you get past the last WIAC or CCIW team remaining, you've got to feel good about your chances to win it all.

Well, the axis will get split up with the expected expansion to ten regions in two years.  From everything I've heard, the WIAC will be lumped in with the MIAC, UMAC, and ARC, while the CCIW will get the HCAC, MWC, and maybe SLIAC?

I know there's proposed regions out there somewhere, but I have yet to track down an actual list.  All of this is just #gleaned from conversations.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 17, 2019, 02:09:38 pm
Of course, that won't make any realistic difference in the structure of the bracket itself. It'll just make a difference in how the bracket is constructed with regard to regional rankings. If you're a team from the Twin Cities that plays in the less competitive UMAC, you're still going to have to go through MIAC, WIAC, and CCIW teams in order to get to the Final Four.

(Although, considering what's happened over the past few tourneys, UMAC teams might actually start looking forward to getting paired up with MIAC teams. ;))
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: AO on March 17, 2019, 02:48:38 pm
(Although, considering what's happened over the past few tourneys, UMAC teams might actually start looking forward to getting paired up with MIAC teams. ;))
It would be fun once every few years to get sent to a place like Hope or even farther East where the games would be easier, but I'm very happy playing against great teams in front of as many of our fans as possible.  There's always something extra on the line when we're playing a MIAC power.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: AllStar on March 18, 2019, 12:12:59 am
Congratulations to UW-Oshkosh
(https://i.imgur.com/pHegnz0.png)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: ronk on March 18, 2019, 12:54:30 am
 I'm back from the former site of the men's Final 4(Salem Civic Center,VA) and Roanoke College's Cregger Center and the women's Final 4. Went into Roanoke's older gym(Bast Center) to see the home of former Mason-Dixon League games(pre-D3) when Catholic U and Mt. St. Mary(with NBA player Fred Carter) were conference opponents. Was expecting it to be the former home but find out looking at Roanoke's team page that they are still using it instead of the Cregger Center. What gives with that? And why is Roanoke College in Salem instead of Roanoke?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: fantastic50 on March 18, 2019, 08:57:30 am
As an outsider, IMHO, the WIAC/CCIW axis is just heads-and-shoulders better the rest of the country.

That top right bracket, all the way down to Marietta in the lower left was a whole 'nother tournament.

Congrats to UW-O.
This is the 4th time in 8 appearances that my Northwestern Eagles have played the eventual champs in the 1st or 2nd round.  If you get past the last WIAC or CCIW team remaining, you've got to feel good about your chances to win it all.

Well, the axis will get split up with the expected expansion to ten regions in two years.  From everything I've heard, the WIAC will be lumped in with the MIAC, UMAC, and ARC, while the CCIW will get the HCAC, MWC, and maybe SLIAC?

I know there's proposed regions out there somewhere, but I have yet to track down an actual list.  All of this is just #gleaned from conversations.

I'm not sure that having the WIAC a region in with St. Thomas, St. John's, Nebraska Wesleyan, and Loras will be any more balanced, especially when only 6-7 teams will be ranked.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: CNU85 on March 18, 2019, 09:09:46 am
I will say I'm disappointed I spent a whole weekend here and didn't meet any of you posters who were in attendance.  Is it too hard to walk down the steps and yell at me?  I know it looks official and busy, but introductions are welcome (for future reference).  Maybe there should be a designated poster meeting place after Friday night next time?

The cops stopped me from going too close to the lower levels. There was one officer a little more "into it" than the others. She even stepped onto the floor between the CNU bench and scorer's table during a timeout. I looked down at Swarthmore bench. Their officer was hanging out behind the bench. Made me chuckle a little. Maybe the CNU players had more tattoos?

Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 18, 2019, 09:22:45 am
As an outsider, IMHO, the WIAC/CCIW axis is just heads-and-shoulders better the rest of the country.

That top right bracket, all the way down to Marietta in the lower left was a whole 'nother tournament.

Congrats to UW-O.
This is the 4th time in 8 appearances that my Northwestern Eagles have played the eventual champs in the 1st or 2nd round.  If you get past the last WIAC or CCIW team remaining, you've got to feel good about your chances to win it all.

Well, the axis will get split up with the expected expansion to ten regions in two years.  From everything I've heard, the WIAC will be lumped in with the MIAC, UMAC, and ARC, while the CCIW will get the HCAC, MWC, and maybe SLIAC?

I know there's proposed regions out there somewhere, but I have yet to track down an actual list.  All of this is just #gleaned from conversations.

I'm not sure that having the WIAC a region in with St. Thomas, St. John's, Nebraska Wesleyan, and Loras will be any more balanced, especially when only 6-7 teams will be ranked.

Looks like the CCIW has to fight it out with Greenville, Grinnell and Hanover.  ::)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: fantastic50 on March 19, 2019, 09:18:39 am
As an outsider, IMHO, the WIAC/CCIW axis is just heads-and-shoulders better the rest of the country.

That top right bracket, all the way down to Marietta in the lower left was a whole 'nother tournament.

Congrats to UW-O.
This is the 4th time in 8 appearances that my Northwestern Eagles have played the eventual champs in the 1st or 2nd round.  If you get past the last WIAC or CCIW team remaining, you've got to feel good about your chances to win it all.

Well, the axis will get split up with the expected expansion to ten regions in two years.  From everything I've heard, the WIAC will be lumped in with the MIAC, UMAC, and ARC, while the CCIW will get the HCAC, MWC, and maybe SLIAC?

I know there's proposed regions out there somewhere, but I have yet to track down an actual list.  All of this is just #gleaned from conversations.

I'm not sure that having the WIAC a region in with St. Thomas, St. John's, Nebraska Wesleyan, and Loras will be any more balanced, especially when only 6-7 teams will be ranked.

Looks like the CCIW has to fight it out with Greenville, Grinnell and Hanover.  ::)

Such a region could lead to every halfway-decent CCIW team getting regionally-ranked; the league could have easily taken the top five positions this year.  That happened with the NJAC, which routinely had the top four slots in the Atlantic regional rankings, and sometimes a 5th team (TCNJ) also ranked.  I think that weak region impacted Ramapo's at-large selection. 

(The OAC frequently had five ranked, but that was a deeper league, with #5 seed Baldwin-Wallace winning the OAC tourney and nearly advancing out of the Oswego pod in the NCAAs.)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ralph Turner on March 19, 2019, 11:41:38 am
As an outsider, IMHO, the WIAC/CCIW axis is just heads-and-shoulders better the rest of the country.

That top right bracket, all the way down to Marietta in the lower left was a whole 'nother tournament.

Congrats to UW-O.
This is the 4th time in 8 appearances that my Northwestern Eagles have played the eventual champs in the 1st or 2nd round.  If you get past the last WIAC or CCIW team remaining, you've got to feel good about your chances to win it all.

Well, the axis will get split up with the expected expansion to ten regions in two years.  From everything I've heard, the WIAC will be lumped in with the MIAC, UMAC, and ARC, while the CCIW will get the HCAC, MWC, and maybe SLIAC?

I know there's proposed regions out there somewhere, but I have yet to track down an actual list.  All of this is just #gleaned from conversations.

I'm not sure that having the WIAC a region in with St. Thomas, St. John's, Nebraska Wesleyan, and Loras will be any more balanced, especially when only 6-7 teams will be ranked.

Looks like the CCIW has to fight it out with Greenville, Grinnell and Hanover.  ::)

Such a region could lead to every halfway-decent CCIW team getting regionally-ranked; the league could have easily taken the top five positions this year.  That happened with the NJAC, which routinely had the top four slots in the Atlantic regional rankings, and sometimes a 5th team (TCNJ) also ranked.  I think that weak region impacted Ramapo's at-large selection. 

(The OAC frequently had five ranked, but that was a deeper league, with #5 seed Baldwin-Wallace winning the OAC tourney and nearly advancing out of the Oswego pod in the NCAAs.)
+1!  Definitely.

But that is something that the selection committees will have to figure out.

If the committees are only selecting ~15% of the eligible members in each sport, we are only talking about ranking 6-7 teams.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: sac on March 19, 2019, 01:14:06 pm
Chicago and WashU will probably be in that region.  But yes we're going to see a few regions heavily lopsided towards one conference or another.

In the above example, it would have been hard to find a team from the NACC, SLIAC or HCAC to rank.  I think the ranking ratio would lead to 6 ranking spots.  It would not have been far fetched to see this ranking.   

1.  Augustana
2.  North Central
3.  Wheaton
4.  Illinois Wesleyan
5.  Elmhurst
6.  Chicago

I assume the new "Great Lakes" would be MIAA, OAC, NCAC, PAC, this year (and many others) it would be all Ohio schools in the 6 ranking slots.


It also means the Pool C process will have 10 teams at the table instead of just 8.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 19, 2019, 01:15:01 pm
I'm back from the former site of the men's Final 4(Salem Civic Center,VA) and Roanoke College's Cregger Center and the women's Final 4. Went into Roanoke's older gym(Bast Center) to see the home of former Mason-Dixon League games(pre-D3) when Catholic U and Mt. St. Mary(with NBA player Fred Carter) were conference opponents. Was expecting it to be the former home but find out looking at Roanoke's team page that they are still using it instead of the Cregger Center. What gives with that? And why is Roanoke College in Salem instead of Roanoke?

Which team page are you talking about? The men's team absolutely uses the Cregger Center. I've seen two of their games at that facility in the last two years.

And it is Roanoke College because they are in the Roanoke Valley. The entire region is known for the Roanoke name, not just the city.

Though, interestingly the school was founded near Staunton, Virginia back in 1842 - read something about a boys preparatory school at first. It moved to it's currently location five years later.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 19, 2019, 01:15:50 pm
Chicago and WashU will probably be in that region.  But yes we're going to see a few regions heavily lopsided towards one conference or another.

In the above example, it would have been hard to find a team from the NACC, SLIAC or HCAC to rank.  I think the ranking ratio would lead to 6 ranking spots.  It would not have been far fetched to see this ranking.   

1.  Augustana
2.  North Central
3.  Wheaton
4.  Illinois Wesleyan
5.  Elmhurst
6.  Chicago

I assume the new "Great Lakes" would be MIAA, OAC, NCAC, PAC, this year (and many others) it would be all Ohio schools in the 6 ranking slots.


It also means the Pool C process will have 10 teams at the table instead of just 8.

I know Ryan indicated there are alignments located some place ... I am not aware things have progressed that far as of yet. Mainly it is speculation on everyone's part. I suspect the national committee will take that up along with next year's tournament schedule in the offseason.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: ronk on March 19, 2019, 03:25:04 pm
I'm back from the former site of the men's Final 4(Salem Civic Center,VA) and Roanoke College's Cregger Center and the women's Final 4. Went into Roanoke's older gym(Bast Center) to see the home of former Mason-Dixon League games(pre-D3) when Catholic U and Mt. St. Mary(with NBA player Fred Carter) were conference opponents. Was expecting it to be the former home but find out looking at Roanoke's team page that they are still using it instead of the Cregger Center. What gives with that? And why is Roanoke College in Salem instead of Roanoke?

Which team page are you talking about? The men's team absolutely uses the Cregger Center. I've seen two of their games at that facility in the last two years.

And it is Roanoke College because they are in the Roanoke Valley. The entire region is known for the Roanoke name, not just the city.

Though, interestingly the school was founded near Staunton, Virginia back in 1842 - read something about a boys preparatory school at first. It moved to it's currently location five years later.

 Good to hear; the description I read of the Bast Center is that they house basketball and volleyball; thought I had seen it also on the D3hoops page for Roanoke basketball but I see now that the Cregger Center is listed.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: FCGrizzliesGrad on March 19, 2019, 04:38:25 pm
Some D3 connections coaching in the D1 tournament if you need someone to root for after your bracket is busted. This is from ESPN ranking (http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/26292605/ranking-2019-ncaa-tournament-coaches-players-1-68) all 68 coaches on their playing days

58. Mark Few, Gonzaga Bulldogs -- Few led Creswell (Oregon) High to the state's AAA semifinals as a senior point guard. Shoulder problems prevented him from playing at Linfield College, where he intended to play basketball and baseball.
56. Steve Prohm, Iowa State Cyclones -- Prohm was a three-year letterman at Northwest Whitfield High in Tunnel Hill, Georgia -- his claim to fame was hitting a half-court shot to win a game as a senior -- and played briefly at the Division III level at Oglethorpe University in Atlanta. Prohm subsequently transferred to Alabama, where he became a manager and student assistant.
53. Bill Coen, Northeastern Huskies -- Coen played four seasons for Division III Hamilton College in Clinton, New York, winning three ECAC championships under longtime coach Tom Murphy (now Northeastern's coordinator of basketball advancement). Murphy once quipped to the Boston Herald that his instructions to Coen as a player were: "Shoot it before you turn it over."
52. Randy Bennett, Saint Mary's Gaels -- Bennett started his career playing under his father, Tom, at Mesa Community College in Arizona (1980-82), then played two seasons as a point guard at Division III UC San Diego (1983-85). Bennett led the Tritons in assists for both of his seasons with the team.
50. Mike Young, Wofford Terriers -- Young was a four-year letterman and point guard for Division III Emory & Henry from 1982-86, serving as the Wasps' team captain his junior and senior seasons.
44. James Jones, Yale Bulldogs -- Jones played at then-Division III Albany from 1982-86 and captained the freshman team during his first year on campus.
43. Nate Oats, Buffalo Bulls -- Oats played at D-III Maranatha Baptist University in Watertown, Wisconsin, from 1993-97, serving as a captain and earning all-conference honors.
33. Russell Turner, UC Irvine Anteaters -- Turner was a two-time All-American at Division III Hampden-Sydney, establishing a school record with 2,272 points and leading the school to the first two NCAA tournament appearances in its history. Turner was inducted into the Hampden-Sydney Hall of Fame in 2002.
32. Chris Jans, New Mexico State Aggies -- Jans was a three-year starter and prolific scorer at Division III Loras College in Dubuque, Iowa, between 1987 and 1991, averaging 28.3 points per game and making a school-record 133 3-pointers during his senior season. During Jans' college career, the Duhawks broke 16 scoring records and two D-III records for 3-point shooting.
31. Mike Rhoades, VCU Rams -- Rhoades didn't just play Division III basketball, he was the best player in Division III, winning national player of the year honors in 1995 and two All America citations at Lebanon Valley (Pennsylvania) College. The shooting guard -- who also led the team to a national title in 1994 -- holds school records for points, assists, steals and free-throw percentage, and his jersey was retired by the school.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Smitty Oom on March 19, 2019, 05:27:17 pm
Awesome  article there by ESPN, thanks for sharing Grizz!

I will also note that Freddie Gillespie (JR), the starting center for the Baylor Bears, started his career at Carleton College (MIAC) playing his first two seasons of eligibility there. After he red-shirted last year, he worked his way to a starting spot midway through the season (an injury also opened up a window of opportunity for him).

He averages 5.2 points, 4.3 rebounds and 1.1blocks per game while shooting 64.3% from the field.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 20, 2019, 12:05:14 am
Becker at Vermont graduated from Catholic and while he didn't play, he did learn a lot under Lonergan while there. He followed Lonergan and took over Vermont after Lonergan left.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 20, 2019, 07:23:45 am
Chicago and WashU will probably be in that region.  But yes we're going to see a few regions heavily lopsided towards one conference or another.

In the above example, it would have been hard to find a team from the NACC, SLIAC or HCAC to rank.  I think the ranking ratio would lead to 6 ranking spots.  It would not have been far fetched to see this ranking.   

1.  Augustana
2.  North Central
3.  Wheaton
4.  Illinois Wesleyan
5.  Elmhurst
6.  Chicago

I assume the new "Great Lakes" would be MIAA, OAC, NCAC, PAC, this year (and many others) it would be all Ohio schools in the 6 ranking slots.


It also means the Pool C process will have 10 teams at the table instead of just 8.

I know Ryan indicated there are alignments located some place ... I am not aware things have progressed that far as of yet. Mainly it is speculation on everyone's part. I suspect the national committee will take that up along with next year's tournament schedule in the offseason.

A number of coaches I talked to last weekend definitely represented that they'd seen the proposed lists.  The New England split seemed less solidified than some of the others; I'm sure it's still a work in progress.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: ronk on March 20, 2019, 08:57:58 am
 Do we know the regions? We can then offer our guidance of how the conferences should be allocated.  ::)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 20, 2019, 09:59:53 am
I wonder if they'd actually split up the WIAC, moving Eau Claire, River Falls, Stout and maybe even La Crosse and Platteville to the West and keep Point, Oshkosh and Whitewater in the Central. There are several leagues that are inter-regional already.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 20, 2019, 12:26:51 pm
No, there aren't. Each of the previously-split leagues except for the UAA (for obvious reasons) were solidified within single regions several years ago. The entire AMCC is now within the Great Lakes Region, the entire Skyline is now within the Atlantic Region, etc.

I haven't heard anything about an expansion of the number of regions countermanding that don't-split-the-leagues edict.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 20, 2019, 12:58:47 pm
They will not split conferences into different regions. We have seen how that has not worked very well. UAA is the exception (and the ACAA, but that's another topic for another day).
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 20, 2019, 01:14:36 pm
I'm not real familiar with that. How has they not worked?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 20, 2019, 01:22:50 pm
I'm not real familiar with that. How has they not worked?

One great example - two teams from the same conference sitting at the table for an at-large bid at the same time. That happened a few times in women's basketball (CAC in the Mid-Atlantic and Atlantic Regions before the changes a number of years ago).
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 24, 2019, 01:46:25 pm
Stevens Point men's hockey just won the National Championship last night. I understand that hockey hosting rights may be different than basketball, but it's interesting to see Point host this past weekend. Three East teams flew out to Wisconsin and I believe Hobart, Geneseo and Norwich were all driving distance to each other. Point was undefeated and #1, but Geneseo was #2, Norwich #4 and Hobart also in the Top 10. The NCAA chose 3 flights instead of 1. I don't believe Point was already designated the Final Four site prior to the tournament.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 24, 2019, 02:20:37 pm
Yep, it was not a predetermined host before the tournament started. MIH went back in this direction after decades of having predetermined hosts. I guess that when it comes to the finals, they were going to reward the top seed no matter what.

This would be in line with what we were told in football, that the number of flights in the bracket that the committee needs to try to control for does not include the finals.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 24, 2019, 05:01:30 pm

You've also got the parity across sports.  If you had a pre-determined host, chances are you'd have to plan for at least 2-3 flights every year.  No reason to penalize the top seed just because you could save money.  Even with basketball, it's not so much about having the cheapest tournament, but one that fits within the budget.  They're going to plan for a certain number of flights each year, so long as you don't have too many in the early rounds, usually you've got 3 saved up for the championship weekend.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Oline89 on March 25, 2019, 09:41:48 am

You've also got the parity across sports.  If you had a pre-determined host, chances are you'd have to plan for at least 2-3 flights every year.  No reason to penalize the top seed just because you could save money.  Even with basketball, it's not so much about having the cheapest tournament, but one that fits within the budget.  They're going to plan for a certain number of flights each year, so long as you don't have too many in the early rounds, usually you've got 3 saved up for the championship weekend.

I actually prefer the idea of a predetermined host site.  Having 3 teams travel the top seed's home town is a huge advantage to the top seed, travelling is really tough on the teams (particularly in D3, where the teams are not used to 2-3 day travel itineraries).  Frozen Four, is a great moniker as well!
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 25, 2019, 10:54:27 am

You've also got the parity across sports.  If you had a pre-determined host, chances are you'd have to plan for at least 2-3 flights every year.  No reason to penalize the top seed just because you could save money.  Even with basketball, it's not so much about having the cheapest tournament, but one that fits within the budget.  They're going to plan for a certain number of flights each year, so long as you don't have too many in the early rounds, usually you've got 3 saved up for the championship weekend.

I actually prefer the idea of a predetermined host site.  Having 3 teams travel the top seed's home town is a huge advantage to the top seed, travelling is really tough on the teams (particularly in D3, where the teams are not used to 2-3 day travel itineraries).  Frozen Four, is a great moniker as well!

I agree, the pre-determined site makes for a better experience for everyone.  The big downside is attendance, which is always a tougher thing off-campus.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 25, 2019, 12:51:15 pm
I think you guys are inadvertently making a case for the top seed to host the Final Four. Two or three flights anyway? Why not to the top seed? Big advantage for the top seed to host? Why not? Isn't that your goal, to be a top seed, to host the 1st or 2nd weekends? Why not the 3rd? Attendance a problem. Probably less so if there was a host school, at least for their semi-final game.

Take this year's Final Four. Say, 500 for each team at a neutral site. Double that for a host team, at least. You'll probably get more casual fans involved if an "area" team is in the Final Four. This year, the closest participant was 3 1/2 hours away. Oshkosh? You have the whole Fox Valley area to draw from. Even Green Bay and Milwaukee are less than an hour away. Wheaton? Chicago is 40 minutes.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 26, 2019, 06:49:09 am
I think you guys are inadvertently making a case for the top seed to host the Final Four. Two or three flights anyway? Why not to the top seed? Big advantage for the top seed to host? Why not? Isn't that your goal, to be a top seed, to host the 1st or 2nd weekends? Why not the 3rd? Attendance a problem. Probably less so if there was a host school, at least for their semi-final game.

Take this year's Final Four. Say, 500 for each team at a neutral site. Double that for a host team, at least. You'll probably get more casual fans involved if an "area" team is in the Final Four. This year, the closest participant was 3 1/2 hours away. Oshkosh? You have the whole Fox Valley area to draw from. Even Green Bay and Milwaukee are less than an hour away. Wheaton? Chicago is 40 minutes.

What if Swarthmore makes it or Amherst?  They can seat 1800 officially, but it's just bleachers and that would be difficult.  Even the 1900 or so we had this year on Friday night wouldn't be able to fit very well.  Plus the host is going to provide a different level of accommodation for the players and fans - what championship bid sites are asked to do is much more involved than you could require from a school on short notice.

You go to a defined site ahead of time, because it makes the experience better for everyone.  By the way, there's nothing keeping UWSP or Hope or someone else with a large enough arena to bid for the hosting job.  I suspect the committee would look favorably on an on-campus site, if they could provide the level of accommodation that's become traditional for the championship weekend.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Oline89 on March 26, 2019, 08:06:43 am
I think you guys are inadvertently making a case for the top seed to host the Final Four. Two or three flights anyway? Why not to the top seed? Big advantage for the top seed to host? Why not? Isn't that your goal, to be a top seed, to host the 1st or 2nd weekends? Why not the 3rd? Attendance a problem. Probably less so if there was a host school, at least for their semi-final game.

Take this year's Final Four. Say, 500 for each team at a neutral site. Double that for a host team, at least. You'll probably get more casual fans involved if an "area" team is in the Final Four. This year, the closest participant was 3 1/2 hours away. Oshkosh? You have the whole Fox Valley area to draw from. Even Green Bay and Milwaukee are less than an hour away. Wheaton? Chicago is 40 minutes.


What if Swarthmore makes it or Amherst?  They can seat 1800 officially, but it's just bleachers and that would be difficult.  Even the 1900 or so we had this year on Friday night wouldn't be able to fit very well.  Plus the host is going to provide a different level of accommodation for the players and fans - what championship bid sites are asked to do is much more involved than you could require from a school on short notice.

You go to a defined site ahead of time, because it makes the experience better for everyone.  By the way, there's nothing keeping UWSP or Hope or someone else with a large enough arena to bid for the hosting job.  I suspect the committee would look favorably on an on-campus site, if they could provide the level of accommodation that's become traditional for the championship weekend.

Not to mention, is there really a consensus top seed in this tournament?  Is there a consensus top seed in any D3 sport?  Its been said "ad infinitum", too many teams, therefore too little inter-conference play.  Pick a central site with a good sports fan base, nice arena, and enough hotels.  The team fans will travel.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: WUPHF on March 26, 2019, 10:36:26 am
I planned a few regional conferences for my professional association.

Our conferences only had 200-300 people in attendance, but we could call the tourist and convention administrators in towns such as Stevens Point and get good deals well in advance that we could not get with one week notice.

It seems as though you could have called Stevens Point in September and say hey we just got of the phone with Wausau and they are willing to do X or Y.

That must be why basketball does not follow the hockey approach.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 26, 2019, 10:45:18 am
I think you guys are inadvertently making a case for the top seed to host the Final Four. Two or three flights anyway? Why not to the top seed? Big advantage for the top seed to host? Why not? Isn't that your goal, to be a top seed, to host the 1st or 2nd weekends? Why not the 3rd? Attendance a problem. Probably less so if there was a host school, at least for their semi-final game.

Take this year's Final Four. Say, 500 for each team at a neutral site. Double that for a host team, at least. You'll probably get more casual fans involved if an "area" team is in the Final Four. This year, the closest participant was 3 1/2 hours away. Oshkosh? You have the whole Fox Valley area to draw from. Even Green Bay and Milwaukee are less than an hour away. Wheaton? Chicago is 40 minutes.

What if Swarthmore makes it or Amherst?  They can seat 1800 officially, but it's just bleachers and that would be difficult.  Even the 1900 or so we had this year on Friday night wouldn't be able to fit very well.  Plus the host is going to provide a different level of accommodation for the players and fans - what championship bid sites are asked to do is much more involved than you could require from a school on short notice.

You go to a defined site ahead of time, because it makes the experience better for everyone.  By the way, there's nothing keeping UWSP or Hope or someone else with a large enough arena to bid for the hosting job.  I suspect the committee would look favorably on an on-campus site, if they could provide the level of accommodation that's become traditional for the championship weekend.

Exactly. Let's not lose sight of the fact that, before the Final Four moved to Salem, it was always in the home gym of a D3 member, as first Albright, then Calvin, then Wittenberg, and then Buffalo State hosted it. But those schools weren't hosts because their teams made the Final Four; as has been the case for Salem and Fort Wayne, they bid to host the Final Four long in advance, and they hosted for multiple years.

The only time that a host school's team has actually appeared in the Final Four was in 1981, when Augustana lost the national championship game to SUNY Potsdam in overtime at the Carver Center in Rock Island.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: CHalter33 on April 12, 2019, 01:44:25 pm
Who are the "too-early" favorites to win the 2020 D3 National Championship?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: thebear on April 12, 2019, 02:01:08 pm
Who are the "too-early" favorites to win the 2020 D3 National Championship?

I would say until someone proves different that Wisconsin-Oshkosh - returns three starters, including Jack Flynn, who may be the best Big in D-III.  They return 16 of 19 players.     

I suspect there are plenty of scorers on the bench there waiting for their turn.  In November UW-O lost by 12 to their Big Brother School in Madison who was a 5 seed in D-I March Madness.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on April 13, 2019, 09:02:43 am
Who are the "too-early" favorites to win the 2020 D3 National Championship?

I'm not sure why Oshkosh and Swarthmore wouldn't start next season ranked where they finished this one.  I can't think of a contending team, off the top of my head, that isn't going to have significant losses.  Maybe Wittenberg?  I know most of their best players were underclassmen.  Lots of teams will remain very good, but there will be questions all around.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Titan Q on April 13, 2019, 09:51:18 am
Who are the "too-early" favorites to win the 2020 D3 National Championship?

I'm not sure why Oshkosh and Swarthmore wouldn't start next season ranked where they finished this one.  I can't think of a contending team, off the top of my head, that isn't going to have significant losses.  Maybe Wittenberg?  I know most of their best players were underclassmen.  Lots of teams will remain very good, but there will be questions all around.

Agree.  UW-Oshkosh #1 and Swarthmore #2 seems like a no-brainer to me in the preseason poll.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: CHalter33 on April 13, 2019, 10:43:08 am
Who are the "too-early" favorites to win the 2020 D3 National Championship?

I'm not sure why Oshkosh and Swarthmore wouldn't start next season ranked where they finished this one.  I can't think of a contending team, off the top of my head, that isn't going to have significant losses.  Maybe Wittenberg?  I know most of their best players were underclassmen.  Lots of teams will remain very good, but there will be questions all around.

Agree.  UW-Oshkosh #1 and Swarthmore #2 seems like a no-brainer to me in the preseason poll.

Where does a team like Whitman or NWU stand, for their loss total might not decline due to the significant decline in the Conference team’s strength? Are these two teams who will be top 5 all year? Top 10?
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: ronk on April 13, 2019, 12:10:16 pm
Who are the "too-early" favorites to win the 2020 D3 National Championship?

 Here are the draft projections from the fantasy board of experts  ::) for next season:

Round 1
1. NCF - Oshkosh
2. Osprey - Swarthmore
3. Grizzlies - Wittenberg
4. ronk - Amherst
5. Hoops - North Central
6. Smitty - Emory
7. Greek - Middlebury
8. nescac1 - Wash U

Round 2
9. nescac1 - Wooster
10. Greek - Nebraska Wesleyan
11. Smitty - Augustana
12. Hoops - Nichols
13. ronk - Texas-Dallas
14. Grizzlies - Randolph-Macon
15. Osprey - St. Thomas
16. NCF - Hamilton
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: WUPHF on April 14, 2019, 10:05:38 am
I am not arguing against Oshkosh or Swarthmore, but a reminder: the Titans lose both Boots and Wittchow and the 60 minutes, 30 points (40% from three), rebounds, assists, steals and senior leadership.  Swarthmore loses Wiley.

By the way, Emory is a Final Four team.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on April 14, 2019, 11:40:41 am
Who are the "too-early" favorites to win the 2020 D3 National Championship?

I'm not sure why Oshkosh and Swarthmore wouldn't start next season ranked where they finished this one.  I can't think of a contending team, off the top of my head, that isn't going to have significant losses.  Maybe Wittenberg?  I know most of their best players were underclassmen.  Lots of teams will remain very good, but there will be questions all around.

Agree.  UW-Oshkosh #1 and Swarthmore #2 seems like a no-brainer to me in the preseason poll.

Where does a team like Whitman or NWU stand, for their loss total might not decline due to the significant decline in the Conference team’s strength? Are these two teams who will be top 5 all year? Top 10?

Whitman will be lower on talent, for sure, and definitely depth, but they're still going to be loaded with talent and perhaps having more defined roles will help the guys in them?  I don't think they have anyone on the level of Hewitt or Butler, but they've got a lot of really good players.  I think they'll be in the mix, but they'll have to prove themselves a bit.  They host St. Thomas in November, I believe, so that should be a good test for both teams.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: CHalter33 on April 16, 2019, 02:06:17 pm
Who are the "too-early" favorites to win the 2020 D3 National Championship?

I'm not sure why Oshkosh and Swarthmore wouldn't start next season ranked where they finished this one.  I can't think of a contending team, off the top of my head, that isn't going to have significant losses.  Maybe Wittenberg?  I know most of their best players were underclassmen.  Lots of teams will remain very good, but there will be questions all around.

Agree.  UW-Oshkosh #1 and Swarthmore #2 seems like a no-brainer to me in the preseason poll.

Where does a team like Whitman or NWU stand, for their loss total might not decline due to the significant decline in the Conference team’s strength? Are these two teams who will be top 5 all year? Top 10?

Whitman will be lower on talent, for sure, and definitely depth, but they're still going to be loaded with talent and perhaps having more defined roles will help the guys in them?  I don't think they have anyone on the level of Hewitt or Butler, but they've got a lot of really good players.  I think they'll be in the mix, but they'll have to prove themselves a bit.  They host St. Thomas in November, I believe, so that should be a good test for both teams.

I will definitely be tuning into the Whitman vs. St. Thomas game. I know the 2019 season just ended but does anyone know of "big games" scheduled for the 2020 season? (Top 25 matchups)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on April 16, 2019, 04:47:11 pm
Who are the "too-early" favorites to win the 2020 D3 National Championship?

I'm not sure why Oshkosh and Swarthmore wouldn't start next season ranked where they finished this one.  I can't think of a contending team, off the top of my head, that isn't going to have significant losses.  Maybe Wittenberg?  I know most of their best players were underclassmen.  Lots of teams will remain very good, but there will be questions all around.

Agree.  UW-Oshkosh #1 and Swarthmore #2 seems like a no-brainer to me in the preseason poll.

Where does a team like Whitman or NWU stand, for their loss total might not decline due to the significant decline in the Conference team’s strength? Are these two teams who will be top 5 all year? Top 10?

Whitman will be lower on talent, for sure, and definitely depth, but they're still going to be loaded with talent and perhaps having more defined roles will help the guys in them?  I don't think they have anyone on the level of Hewitt or Butler, but they've got a lot of really good players.  I think they'll be in the mix, but they'll have to prove themselves a bit.  They host St. Thomas in November, I believe, so that should be a good test for both teams.

I will definitely be tuning into the Whitman vs. St. Thomas game. I know the 2019 season just ended but does anyone know of "big games" scheduled for the 2020 season? (Top 25 matchups)

It's a little early to know all the matchups.  Schools don't usually release schedules until after the academic year is out (at the earliest) - often it's when the SID gets back from vacation and gets them loaded on the site.  Coaches are a little more forthcoming (John Tauer told me about their early season Whitman-Whitworth double) when I did their tournament feature.  I've heard some good rumors of matchups, but nothing concrete as of yet.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: fantastic50 on April 19, 2019, 09:22:36 am
In the 3rd annual Great Lakes Invitational, Dec. 28-29 at Wooster, the host Scots will play Whitworth and Keene State, while Marietta will face York (PA) and Salisbury.  Not all of those teams will be in the top 25, but they are still intriguing match-ups. 

https://twitter.com/OACBBallShow/status/1108534826754338816 (https://twitter.com/OACBBallShow/status/1108534826754338816)
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ralph Turner on April 19, 2019, 03:19:22 pm
In the 3rd annual Great Lakes Invitational, Dec. 28-29 at Wooster, the host Scots will play Whitworth and Keene State, while Marietta will face York (PA) and Salisbury.  Not all of those teams will be in the top 25, but they are still intriguing match-ups. 

https://twitter.com/OACBBallShow/status/1108534826754338816 (https://twitter.com/OACBBallShow/status/1108534826754338816)
Those tourneys look to the target-rich for Regional Ranked Opponents
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Pat Coleman on April 19, 2019, 06:32:54 pm
In the 3rd annual Great Lakes Invitational, Dec. 28-29 at Wooster, the host Scots will play Whitworth and Keene State, while Marietta will face York (PA) and Salisbury.  Not all of those teams will be in the top 25, but they are still intriguing match-ups. 

https://twitter.com/OACBBallShow/status/1108534826754338816 (https://twitter.com/OACBBallShow/status/1108534826754338816)

Does this supplant the Mose Hole tournament, or is it a double billing, so to speak? Wooster has always brought in great teams for the Mose Hole.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Fifth and Putnam on April 21, 2019, 11:03:46 am
In the 3rd annual Great Lakes Invitational, Dec. 28-29 at Wooster, the host Scots will play Whitworth and Keene State, while Marietta will face York (PA) and Salisbury.  Not all of those teams will be in the top 25, but they are still intriguing match-ups. 

https://twitter.com/OACBBallShow/status/1108534826754338816 (https://twitter.com/OACBBallShow/status/1108534826754338816)

Does this supplant the Mose Hole tournament, or is it a double billing, so to speak? Wooster has always brought in great teams for the Mose Hole.

Double billing. It's a one off format change for the Great Lakes Invite.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: nescac1 on April 22, 2019, 02:23:14 pm
Regarding Oshkosh and Whitman, I too was initially thinking that Oshkosh lost enough from that backcourt to mean they should not be the prohibitive favorite heading into the season, but I had a change of heart after seeing some of them in the tourney.  They dominated most of the teams they played, and their frontcourt should easily be the best in the country if healthy, just an impossible group for anyone to match up against.  The guards are a big loss, but Peterson had the look of a future all-American in the minutes he played, an athletic frosh who can play really well as a two-way role player on the biggest stage like that (including some great D vs. Francis if I recall) typically emerges as a prime time player when thrust into a bigger role  They also return Vlotho and add a loaded recruiting class including an impressive-looking D2 transfer who should help right away and several top-20 Wisconsin recruits, one of whom is a guard.  Between that group and other guys who were probably buried on the bench behind a veteran backcourt, they should still have a very good, and deep, backcourt.  It also helps that most of the rest of WIAC looks (relatively) down right now with a lot of uncertainty, so Oshkosh should once again post a gaudy record in the best conference in the country. 

Meanwhile, looking at the rest of the Elite 8, Williams loses its big three, Christopher Newport loses by far its best guy plus another key player, Swarthmore loses its top perimeter player and isn't nearly as deep as Oshkosh, they really need to have good luck with injuries (although they too should be very good again), Nichols loses its all-American from a team that was very thin, Guilford loses two of its three best guys, Wheaton loses Francis, Augustana loses three elite guys plus some depth, and Marietta loses two of its top three scorers plus another starter (though from a very deep team).  Of the teams that made deep runs last year, Oshkosh looks to be the best positioned for a return engagement.  I too think Emory looks absolutely loaded next year, as do Amherst and North Central, but they all have a lot of ground to make up vs. how Oshkosh has played in the last two NCAA tourneys.  I actually think in the draft we collectively nailed what will very likely be most (at least 8-9, maybe all 10, although Midd might start out a few notches lower) of the preseason top ten (barring major recruit / transfer / injury / defection new) heading into the season.  Marietta probably sneaks in, perhaps bumping Midd out.  Maybe Guilford, CNU, or RMC squeezes in as well, all are top-20 teams for sure to start the season, but those three seem pretty closely grouped to me as all three lose important players.  The only thing that is certain is that Oshkosh and Swarthmore should and will be ranked 1-2 in that order for sure.  I felt like those ten teams plus the four others I just listed were the most obvious choices on paper, and after that, things start to get much more difficult to predict with either powerhouse teams who were decimated by graduation or unproven up-and-comers who return most of their rosters. 

Whitman on the other hand I'm more skeptical of.  There is still a lot of talent but they lose SO much to graduation, and part of what made them great was that they could throw waves and waves of really good players at you and wear you down over the course of the game.  Next year's team on the other hand has only around 5-6 proven guys coming back.  Austin Butler alone is a HUGE loss, he was a two-way monster and was critical to everything they did, especially on defense.  I also didn't see anyone remotely like Jacob-Jones on the roster in terms of interior finishing, he was a very important player for them.  And Stewart and Hewitt were both tremendous scorers.  Duckett and Vickers will be one of the better backcourt in the country, Osborn is a great shooter, but up front they don't return a lot.  Indeed, they return only 23 points, 6 rebounds, and 2 assists from their total team production in the season-ending loss to Williams.  That's not a ton, even considering a lot of talent on the bench could have played more minutes elsewhere. 
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Gregory Sager on April 22, 2019, 02:37:44 pm
Whitman on the other hand I'm more skeptical of.  There is still a lot of talent but they lose SO much and part of what made them great was that they could throw waves and waves of really good players at you and wear you down over the course of the game.  Austin Butler alone is a HUGE loss, he was a two-way monster and was critical to everything they did, especially on defense.  I also didn't see anyone remotely like Jacob-Jones on the roster in terms of interior finishing, he was a very important player for them.  And Stewart and Hewitt were both tremendous scorers.  Duckett and Vickers will be one of the better backcourt in the country, but up front they don't return a lot.  They only return 23 points, 6 rebounds, and 2 assists from their total production in their season-ending loss to Williams.  That's not a ton.

Michael Gutierrez may have only played 12 minutes per game for Whitman last season, but the year before at Macalester he averaged 21.6 ppg and led the MIAC in scoring. Don't overlook him.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: nescac1 on April 22, 2019, 02:46:27 pm
Just edited my post a bit as you were posting Greg :)!  Fair on Guiterrez, but still, he goes from being like the 11th or 12th guy to now probably the 3rd or 4th guy, reflective of just how much big-time talent Whitman lost to graduation.  And part of what made them so tough was their relentless physicality and rebounding, and without Butler and Jacobs-Jones, that element is missing.  Still probably a top-20 team, but not a top-5 or even top-10 one on paper in my view, unless they bring in a ton of big-time talent. 
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: WUPHF on April 22, 2019, 06:28:26 pm
Regarding Oshkosh and Whitman, I too was initially thinking that Oshkosh lost enough from that backcourt to mean they should not be the prohibitive favorite heading into the season, but I had a change of heart after seeing some of them in the tourney. 

I think I am the only one to post I too worthy relatable commentary so I'll say, though your points are well taken, I do not think we should underestimate the loss of Boots and Wittchow. 

Oshkosh is surely the preseason favorite, but I am not sure we will talk about them in the same way we did Nebraska Wesleyan this season.

By the way, their contributions on paper:

Boots: 33 minutes per game, 15.7 points, 4 rebounds, 5 assists
Wittchow: 32 minutes per game, 14 points, 4.7 rebounds, 2.9 assists
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on April 23, 2019, 09:27:31 am
Just edited my post a bit as you were posting Greg :)!  Fair on Guiterrez, but still, he goes from being like the 11th or 12th guy to now probably the 3rd or 4th guy, reflective of just how much big-time talent Whitman lost to graduation.  And part of what made them so tough was their relentless physicality and rebounding, and without Butler and Jacobs-Jones, that element is missing.  Still probably a top-20 team, but not a top-5 or even top-10 one on paper in my view, unless they bring in a ton of big-time talent.

The question, in my mind, is how many of the fourth year players with eligibility left decide to use it.  They're going to lose four big-time players for sure, but with that style and that depth, they're going to be very dangerous.  I don't have a lot of details, but I hear they're doing very well on the recruiting trail, as well - perhaps gaining a more solid foothold farther east.  They're essentially recruiting a lot of the same prep schools as the NESCAC - if they can start getting those guys to head west with some consistency, it'll be interesting.

Whitman's system is basically entirely different than most other teams play.  I'm looking at Gutierrez as essentially a sophomore coming into this year, having spent a year learning.  I suspect you'll see a marked improvement, especially as a senior and without last year's class clout hanging over them.  I wondered all year if they were playing too many guys to really reach full potential.  We'll find out this time around.

I agree, they may not be Top 10, but I'm not going to count them out they way I might another team enduring those losses (a la Williams).

I just mean that Ducket, Obsborne, Gutierrez, Vickers, and Kirkley is a pretty darn good starting five.  If Colton and Harvey are also back, you've got a strong seven man rotation.  That's a good team.  If it's just that starting five, then there are a lot more questions.
Title: Re: 2019 NCAA Tournament
Post by: nescac1 on April 24, 2019, 09:48:53 am
The thing with Whitman is that (unless as you suggest a few guys are coming back for fifth years) they not only lose four big-time players, none of whom will be easily replaceable, they also lose a ton of their role players.  I think that the rotation probably was a bit too big last year, but to play that system effectively, you need at LEAST ten really good athletes (most of whom need to be good basketball players), probably more like 12-13 if you account for injuries, illness, etc.  They basically played 13 guys last year, and only five of them are returning.  Even though those five look very good, they need to find a lot of really good players this off-season if they hope to play effectively at a frantic, exhausting pace again.  They certainly may, and it helps that their main rivals seem to lose a lot as well.  Regarding the New England recruiting, I haven't seen any future Whitman guys listed on NERR (which is fairly comprehensive for New England recruiting, especially for the prep schools), but there is still a bit of time for guys to commit.