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Messages - Pinecone_Curtain

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1
West Region / Re: Northwest Conference
« on: February 27, 2015, 04:35:39 pm »
Yeah... I'm just trying to allow for the outside chance... but I would agree, Whitworth could be done.

Whitworth or Whitman?

And, yeah, I could definitely see Whitworth not hosting at all if the cards fall as they might. But a win tomorrow helps.

2
West Region / Re: Northwest Conference
« on: February 27, 2015, 04:28:49 pm »
Whitman and Whitworth are in serious danger of not getting at large bids because a loss will do nothing to justify being ahead of Buena Vista. Those SOS numbers are not good this season.

The only way Whitworth finishes third in the region is if they win the AQ... and hosting has far less to do with where they are ranked and more with the fact Whitworth would host the SCIAC winner and then fly to wherever the bye team is located for the second round. Whitworth sure as heck isn't hosting a full pod.

When I said hosting, I should have made it more clear: I think Whitworth will continue the tradition of hosting a SCIAC team. I doubt they host more than that. I wasn't saying they will (or even should) host an entire pod--just the West Coast game. I still think Whitworth will get in no matter what--if they lose tomorrow, I bet they host the winner of SCIAC/LC. If they win, then I bet they get either host a SCIAC team or get sent somewhere.

Dave, I would say Whitman is more than in serious danger of not getting an large bid. There's no way they are in at this point--unless something crazy happens. You can't lose to Pacific AND LC and still expect to get in--especially in the beautiful PNW.

3
West Region / Re: Northwest Conference
« on: February 27, 2015, 03:25:31 am »
My gripe with WW has always been that they're not a national level team after 7 years of winning it.  I can't recall, it must have been A Buc, who seems to have some logic, who pointed out the trajectory of WW right before Hayford left, and a bit of a restart with Logie.  That was a very strong point.  I liked that.

I think that was me.

With how the NWC has matched up on a national level in past years, were you the committee, you'd give them an at large over the other western conferences??

Yeah, YOU might not think they're national quality, but you are not the lone voter (or even a voter). The #16 national ranking seems to tell me otherwise. Plus Whitworth will jump Whitman for sure in the regional rankings. Might even jump Buena Vista (West #3) who lost tonight too. I think it's entirely realistic that Whitworth ends the season as the #3 team in the west--good enough to host, I would think.

4
West Region / Re: Northwest Conference
« on: February 27, 2015, 01:22:48 am »
If blackhawks would stick to giving us insight on Whitman (scouting reports, gameplans, game recaps, etc) and some game/league standing predictions, he would be a fantastic poster. Its the whole, post a bunch of factually incorrect garbage that makes him unlikeable sometimes.

Death, taxes, and Blackhawk making baseless claims about WM winning that never come true. This may be overkill, but after all the talking Blackhawk does, I don't care. Loved that Whitworth won tonight, LOVED that Whitman lost tonight.

Should be a good game Saturday. Hopefully Whitworth takes care of business as usual. I think at this point Whitworth is probably into the tournament either way. If they win, they're the only NWC team in. If they lose, they probably host LC in the 1st round--or the LC/SCIAC winner. Can't imagine the #16 team not in right? Right...?

5
West Region / Re: Northwest Conference
« on: February 25, 2015, 03:13:49 pm »
First game the chances of winning are:      0.99  (that means they will beat that team 99 times out of hundred for the UPS grads out there).

 ;D ;D ;D

Blackhawk, Whitworth is not an overachiever. Ya happy? Whitworth is also not an underachiever. They have won when the conference was tough and when the conference was weak. They've never won a national championship, but they continue to win conference championships. Remember--we're the first team in NWC history to win 6 straight undisputed championships--so we are achievers.

Secondly, your Whitney/Wally/Will (great names BTW) analogy fails a bit. When Logie inherited WW, they were #1 in the nation. So, like a 99% student. Today they are a 91-93% student...not quite as strong of a student, but still in the upper tier of students. Also remember that when Hayford left, he took his recruits that year with him (Tyler Harvey who leads all D1 in scoring, Parker Kelley who is a solid starter at EWU and Collin Chiverton who was Big Sky Newcomer of the Year as a JC transfer). Logie basically had to come in and start from scratch. And while he hasn't maintained the Top 10 in the country year-in and year-out that Hayford had rolling by the end of his tenure, Logie has kept this team as a consistent Top 20 team. It took Hayford 6-7 years to really make The Leap, so don't write off Logie just yet.

BH, because I compromised a bit, I'm asking you to compromise a bit. So say it with me: Willamette exceeded expectations this year.

6
West Region / Re: Northwest Conference
« on: February 24, 2015, 04:19:14 pm »
All-NWC is out. Blackhawk, I was pretty close! Wettig got 1st team over Clough, other than that I got it. Ovchinnikov also got 2nd team.

Love = POTY makes sense. I thought either he or Jurlina would get it. K-Love really turned it on the 2nd half of the season. Logie got COTY which I'm fine with. I personally thought Kip should have gotten it, but who am I to argue against a Pirate?

First Team: Love, Jurlina, Holden, Luedtke, Mounier & Wettig
Second Team: Appleton, Clough, Luhnow, Ovchinnikov, Martin (so basically the LC and WM teams)
HM: Barber, Farnsworth, Valle, McDonald, McNally

All in all, pretty fair. WW got rewarded with 2 1st teamers and 2 HM's, WM got 4 total as well spread across, LC got 3. IMO, the best part is that while Holden and Mounier are seniors, we still get 2 more years of Jurlina and Love  ;D

7
West Region / Re: Northwest Conference
« on: February 24, 2015, 01:59:39 am »
...yet cry that it cant be done yourself.

Never said it can't. Just said it's hard. It's not the snap of the fingers that you make it sound like. However, we're up to #16 in the d3h polls! But, yes, let's move on.

Everybody has a chance since they're here. Pirates only won the regular season games by 8 (in Salem) and 7 (in Spokane), so it's not a complete mismatch. WILL is a weird team--they beat UPS, hung with WW, WM and LC, but then lost to LIN? What gives? I actually think WILL/WW will be closer than WM/LC. WW isn't built to blow people out, but methodically win. WM is built to blow teams out of the water, or if they're having an off night, lose to Pacific on the road for the 2nd straight year. But I can't imagine LC going into W2 and getting the win.

My guesses: WW by 8, WM by 15. I hope it's WM/WW for the ship. Who ya got?

8
West Region / Re: Northwest Conference
« on: February 23, 2015, 01:18:22 am »
Don't talk to me about the PNW island, Coach K is at a 5,000 student school in North Carolina with a gym as small as WW competing on a national level against Kentucky, UCLA, Florida, etc. He doesn't celebrate ACC titles, they're a stepping stone for him.

Uhh...did you just compare Duke to Whitworth? Blackhawk, this is why nobody takes what you say seriously! There's also this little thing called scholarships which Coach K can offer, plus the whole "71 players have been selected in the NBA Draft" thing probably doesn't hurt.

We get it. You think Whitworth underperforms in the national tournament. Remember that WW doesn't lose many home NCAA tournament games. MHB is the only one that comes to mind (though I definitely could be missing one). Even the year we were #1 with the national POY we were on the road in the S16/E8. So, yeah, the geography does work against us. We aren't going to neutral sites for the NCAA tournament like Duke. We went to Wooster to play a really good Wooster team on their home floor.

The way you talk about WW sounds like anything less than beating Duke at Cameron is a failed season. Bridge inherited a bad team that had literally nowhere to go but up. Bridge is a good coach, so they got better. Logie inherited a team that entered the NCAA tournament as the #1 TEAM IN THE NATION. Like, there's literally nowhere to go but down. I'm not sure you get that. One team sucked, they got better. One team was very, very, very good and they are still conference champs 4 years later.

Sorry we aren't beating Kentucky yet.

9
West Region / Re: Northwest Conference
« on: February 22, 2015, 10:27:34 pm »
Ah, another bhawks post that made us all dumber for having read...

I'm still having difficulty understanding and comprehending your point

If bhawks really believes what he types, I mean, if that is his actual thought process and those are his actual reasoning and critical thinking abilities...Bridgeland deserves an award for getting him through UPS' admissions process

Rat, you're the best. I think these three snippets sum up reading 70% of blackhawks' posts.

10
West Region / Re: Northwest Conference
« on: February 22, 2015, 09:54:17 pm »
This is your problem, Pinecone.  You're not special.  There is nothing about Whitworth hoops that is special (period).  Your consistent and you're good.  But you're not special, you're not anything more than good--nor do you care to be.  You celebrate accomplishing the same goal every year.  For the past (however many) years your program has been stuck in the mud.  In fact, by everyone on this boards accords, you're worse than you were in years prior.  You're going backwards.  Why aren't you better?

I mean...I don't even know where to begin. Every other school in our conference would trade with us in a heartbeat--from the tradition (remember how we've won 6 straight regular season titles and 8 straight conference tournaments?), to the best crowd in the conference, to the best X's and O's coach in the conference. Who wouldn't trade with us right now? We do celebrate the same goal every year: winning the NWC. I'm cool with that. Would I love to get to a Final Four? Absolutely! If you don't think Whitworth wants to do that, you're crazy.

Lost a heartbreaker in the 2nd round last year, we've been to the E8, a couple S16's. For a PNW island school, I'm fine with that. We aren't a Wisconsin state school with 11k undergrads, cheaper prices and an 80+% acceptance rate (*cough* Whitewater *cough*  :)). We're all in the same boat here in the PNW. We are small schools that are expensive, academically prestigious, and it's tough to get kids from Cali up here. The NWC is pretty dependent on PNW kids, but WW's two best players are from Australia and California. If you can't get some kids outside the PNW to come to the northwest, it's tough to win.

In 7 years Whitman has gone from the very worst program in the NWC to 20-5, 14-2 in league (hardly "crapping the bed" as you so eloquently say).   If WMN can be 15 games better in 5 years, why can't Whitworth just be 1 game better in 5 years? Even when Bridge was at UPS it was conference win, next year sweet 16, next year elite 8...always getting better.

When you're at the bottom, there's nowhere to go but up...

And I'm not saying the WM program is crap, they just always have "that game" where they crap the bed. Pacific this year and last year, for example. WW hasn't lost to Pacific in...? You're right, Whitworth should be 15 games better just like WM in that time! Not sure why we aren't winning 40 games a year. #FireLogie

Shouldn't you be more mad at Bridge? He hasn't won the NWC with WM yet in, what, like 6 years?! He got a huge donor to donate a lot of money a couple years ago and still can't jump the WW hurdle. Why aren't you more mad at him? Why are you so worried about WW's success? We went 15-1 this year. You worry about your program in Walla Walla, we're cool up here with our 6 straight.

If WMN takes down WW in the conference tourney finals, and WW is sitting at home while WMN represents the conference, how will that feel?  That you've made no progress in all these years and Whitman has gone from worst to best.  What's going to happen next year, and the year after as WMN keeps building and WW keeps maintaining?

That would suck, but WM is good too. You talk as if WW gives WM no respect. We do. You're good under Bridge, but so are we under Logie! If WM can beat WW at WW, they deserve it. No doubt. Bridge has been at WM longer than Logie at WW, and what does he have to show for it? A bunch of 2nd place trophies. Cool. I'll take Logie and 6 straight, thank you.

Did I mention 6 straight?  ;D

11
West Region / Re: Northwest Conference
« on: February 22, 2015, 05:09:07 am »
There is such a discrepancy in talent in the NWC this year, WW and WMN deserve two 1st teamers.

POTY:  Kenny Love
Mournier
Jackson Clough
Jurlina

Last two spots (your choice, but i'd go 1st two):  Holden, Ovchinnikov, Luedtke

Agree, Blackhawk.

Here's my All-NWC

POTY: K-Love
COTY: Logie or Kip (close one...one went 15-1 in NWC, the other took a cellar dweller to the playoffs)

1st Team: Jurlina, Mournier, Clough, Holden, Luedtke

12
West Region / Re: Northwest Conference
« on: February 22, 2015, 05:03:49 am »
Can I quote myself from earlier in the year?

I'm actually a little afraid of Whitman this year. They usually bring their A game for Whitworth, but then have those slip ups (loss @ Pacific last year) along the way. If they can figure those out, they could pose a real threat to Whitworth's dominance.

That one slip up cost WM a split title. And that's the biggest reason why WW has won 6 straight: WM might have as much talent as WW, but only WW takes care of business vs. lesser teams. WM always has that crap the bed game (and almost 2 this year--lucky to escape PLU with a W tonight).

"I couldn't be prouder of our two seniors for helping this group mature and for withstanding the target that comes with playing for Whitworth University.  This program is bigger than any of us involved individually and it's just a special, special thing to be a part of." -Logie after tonight...love how he's embraced the hoops tradition.

And if I can steal from Tennessee: "It's great...to be...a Whitworth Pirate!" 6 straight! Congrats to the coaching staff and the team. It's tourney time!

13
West Region / Re: Northwest Conference
« on: February 21, 2015, 06:18:47 pm »
A.    WW - WM tie breaker:  They split, they both swept LC, and they both swept Will.  WW will have lost to UPS  and WM swept, so WM would be 1st, WW 2nd, LC 3rd, and WIL (if they win) 4th because they beat UPS twice.

Correct me if I'm wrong--and I might be--but let's say WW loses tonight and WM wins. They would both be at 14-2 and would be co-NWC champs. But based on the tiebreakers, WM would get the home court for the playoffs. Is that correct? I think WW has clinched at least a share of the title.

Congrats to LF last night!

14
West Region / Re: Northwest Conference
« on: February 16, 2015, 03:04:14 pm »
Assuming UPS loses both in Eastern Washington (safe assumption)

Buc, the Whits will be traveling to UPS this weekend. Not something I would consider easy for either team. I'm just hoping the Bucs don't look past PLU Friday--I don't think Logie will let them do that. I also hope WM tires UPS out (and still loses ;D) Friday night.

Also, on a random note, it looks like the GF SID put on the NWC master schedule that the Bruins are playing in the NCAA tournament. Who wants to break the news to him?

15
West Region / Re: Northwest Conference
« on: January 28, 2015, 06:01:41 pm »
This is a fun read for Whitworth fans...well once you get over the fact that Tyler Harvey was headed to Spokane and not Cheney before Hayford left  :'(

The Eastern Washington Eagles are your new favorite team, you just don't know it yet


Not to mention that Eastern's other wing, Parker Kelly was also headed to WW when Hayford took the job at Eastern.  That's a scary D3 backcourt.

And this is why I'm convinced if Hayford was still at WW, we would have a National Championship banner in the Fieldhouse.

Switching topics:  How do you rank the coaching jobs in the NWC?  WW is obviously the best job in conference.  Linfield 2nd?  3rd?  What's the worst job in the conference?

I think for tradition and crowd support Whitworth is undoubtedly #1. However, Whitworth has a few things against it: some of my friends who played at other NWC schools called the Fieldhouse the "airplane hangar," so that's a downside; Whitworth, academically speaking, is roughly middle of the pack in the NWC (behind WM & LC, but ahead of others); it's a Christian school, so that automatically hurts with some players; and, for better or worse, it's in Spokane.

I like Portland better, I like UPS and Whitman's gyms better, WM and LC are better schools, PLU and WM give the most financial aid money...so I think it's fairly even between those schools.

I guess I'd rank right this second like this:
1) WW
2) WM
3) UPS (love this school)
4) LC (beautiful Portland campus)
5) WIL (love the gym and campus)
6) PLU (Parkland sucks but they give financial aid like it's on trees)
7) PAC (Forest Grove?)
8) GF (women's hoops this is probably #1, but all the students leave after the women's games)
9) LIN (football is king)

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