Time will tell if SU is a good fit for the ODAC. They must improve in football and basketball for the history books to suggest it was a wise decision on both parties part. Give them five years and hopefully the result will show SU is a good fit for the ODAC.

Football and men's basketball were a disaster for them. No doubt. But I was surprised, when I looked at the numbers, how bad they were across the board. It seems to me that if Shenandoah wants to fit in the ODAC they are going to have to devote some more resources pretty much top to bottom in the fall and winter sports. Men's soccer was pretty much as bad as football and baseball, and the track and cross country teams seem to be in the same area. You just can't be last, or second to last, in that many sports.

It will be interesting to see how the next couple years go for Shenandoah and if they can become productive members of the conference in more than just a select sport (baseball) or two.

baselinejam
Think you may have a fair point on JD Ey.  Whichever All-ODAC team he belongs on this year, he looks like the ultimate fundamental team guy for a career.  W&L site says he is the only player in school history with more than 1000 points, 800 rebounds, 200 assists, 150 blocks and 100 steals. (1023 points, 839 rebounds, 243 assists, 167 blocks and 141 steals)  Colton had 3 of those, but not all 5.  Maybe Algernon knows how many ODAC players have put together that list for a career?  Maybe more than we think?

I think JD suffered from being on a mediocre team for 4 years. A great player for W&L, just not quite enough around him to ever push W&L up the food chain. I think the Generals finished 8th or 9th in the conference all 4 of his years. Still, he'll come out with a great education. So first / second / third team... I'm sure it matters, but not too much in the grand scheme. At some point I've got to believe he will be back for his induction into the General's Hall of Fame.

You have to admire W&L's consistency!

Jk

In a previous post you mention OOC schedules don't look so good 2013. Beginning in 2014 HSC will play Wabash home and away. That should be fun and will greatly improve OOC for HSC. Double edged sword as you have stated; ODAC champ has to go 9-1 or 10-0 to get a decent first round game. If HSC or any other ODAC school loads up with two or three really tough OOC games and then run the table in the ODAC, the ODAC champ may well be in Alliance each and every year if the go 7-3 or 8-2.

I was surprised about the CG game since it seemed HSC had scheduled a really good OOC once a year recently. This must be a filler game before the Wabash home and away starts. Similar to how poor Alma had to travel to Lexington two years ago just because both teams needed to cover a gap. But I think the Wabash game is a really neat matchup. Two of the last all male schools, both with good academic reputations and long histories, playing. If I didn't live so far away, I'd go see that game.

Be interesting to see how it shakes out. Wabash is certainly not an opponent to take lightly. I don't think 8-2 sends you to Alliance. There is generally a 3 or 4 loss team that sneaks in from somewhere. But 8-2 from the ODAC will land you as a 7 or 8 seed, so it wouldn't be out of the question. On the other hand, if you schedule 3 strong OOC teams and lose to all 3, then run the ODAC schedule, it's hard to make a case that you would belong in the top half of a bracket. The seedings generally represent where teams belong. I think W&L maybe got shafted by a spot this year, maybe, but it was close enough. Other than the "flight avoidance" games, I haven't really seen a matchup that I think is an unjustifiable shaft.

So I wouldn't worry about it. You have to win. If you can't beat good teams in the regular season, you probably can't beat them in the playoffs. If you don't play them, go undefeated, you might get a good first round game, but you're going to get hammered in round 2. Ducking the competition just postponed the inevitable, it didn't actually change the outcome.

The ODAC champ can play with the 3-6 seeds in any given year. I have faith in that. Maybe not beat them, but play with them. But I haven't seen an ODAC champ since Bridgewater (and mostly I didn't see those teams since I was out of school and living far away!) that could compete with a 1 or 2 seed. So yes, going 10-0 or 9-1 and ducking all competition might get you a first round win, but it probably won't help the program improve over the long run. Playing up a level in competition and learning what it takes to beat those top teams... that can really help strengthen your program.

That being said, W&L's schedule is probably set in stone for as long as the three traditional OOC teams agree to keep it that way. Centre, Sewanee, and a Centennial team are convenient, competitive, and cover the main recruiting areas. So I don't expect W&L to change up much, but then again I don't see W&L really attempting to challenge for a national title either. ODAC champs, maybe a playoff win or two, would see the Generals pretty much with a permanent smile.

Now when it comes to tennis, or it used to be with lacrosse, there was a definite possibility and goal of winning a national championship.

I'm pulling for all ODAC teams to get better but before GC can improve to a level of competing for the ODAC title, they need to keep the kids in the program for four years. There is a reason they played fresh. & soph last year; very few Jr. & Sr. in the program. I really want E&H to return to their glory days. They actually had some teams that could compete in the playoffs, BC as well. That's what needs to happen to make the ODAC better.

I don't think the ODAC, top to bottom, is a particularly weak conference, so I'm not overly concerned about strength across the board. Shenandoah could use some help, but they are new to the league and have recognized the issue with the coaching situation. The biggest problem with the ODAC is simply that the top team, in any given year, isn't as good as the top team in other conferences. The ODAC's OOC results show that most teams in the conference compare reasonably well with other local conferences. I think the USAC top to bottom is a bit weaker, the Centennial is probably a bit stronger, the SAA is pretty comparable, etc. The ODAC seems very much a middle of the road D3 league top to bottom.

What the ODAC lacks is a power team. I don't have a problem with the thought that the league as a whole could stand to improve, surely it could, but what the ODAC really needs to get a reputation boost is for the strongest team in the league to win a playoff game or two multiple years in a row. With a reputation boost comes the benefit of the doubt come playoff time, and that might give you one or two slots higher in the seeding, making it that much easier to win a game or two.

Jk

I see W&L, RMC, HSC & BC (in no particular order) fighting it out for the conference crown next year. I don't think SU, CU, GC or E&H really having a chance other than maybe pulling an upset against the four teams I see as favorites.

I think your gennies will be pretty damn good until the ODAC figures out how to defense that option (don't understand why that is taking so long). I think the last two weeks will define HSC's season with the outcome of those deciding the ODAC winner.

HSC out of conference schedule is easier next year. Huntingdon out, Averett, CNU & Coast Guard in. Don't know anything about CG but I figure they are not as good as HC.

You might be underestimating GC a bit. If they improve half as much in the 12-13 calendar gap as they did in the 11-12 gap, they will be in the mix. The Generals need to show that the option can continue to work at a top tier without Heinsohn, Murray and Vandalov. The first two, especially, were just a deadly combination of down the middle power and outside speed. The backs behind them got good time the last two seasons as W&L had plenty of "garbage time" to blood younger players. My impression, so far, is that there are some options as fast and shifty as Murray, but no one with the power Heinsohn had. There will need to be an up the gut threat and I'm wondering if the big tight end, Alex Evans, who is exceptionally good but mostly wasted since W&L doesn't throw, can be converted to that role.

I'm worried about the ODAC this year. To my early eye, this has all the hallmarks of one of those years where they eat their own in conference and the winner is a 3 or 4 loss team, something like 5-2 conf, 2-1 non conf. HSC should have no problems with CG or Averett. CNU will be interesting as always. The Captains seem like they can get up for Salisbury and Wesley, even if they don't get over the hump, but then drop a few winnable games later on. To be honest, HSC's OOC is uninspiring this year. Maybe the weakest of W&L, R-MC, H-SC grouping.

R-MC has Hopkins at home. That might be the only chance for the ENTIRE CONFERENCE to get on OOC signature win. Centre or F&M could be good (W&L), CNU (HSC) could be good, Hopkins (RMC) probably will be good. Shenandoah has Ferrum, Gallaudette, and CNU, but I don't think that will matter come the end of the season. Haven't seen Catholic, E&H, Guilford, or Bridgewater post a schedule yet, but none of those last three have recently scheduled particularly strong OOC games. Catholic had CMU last year, I don't know if there is a return game scheduled but CMU stands a chance of being the same tier as CNU, Centre, or F&M.

Overall, this will be a very competitive ODAC season, again, with half the conference capable of winning the title but none of those teams probably packing signature wins. Not necessarily a good thing come playoff time...

jk

all good points but the more I look at this I think style of play needs to change and improve; offenses need to be more balanced run vs. pass and the defenses in the ODAC seem to be average at best most of the time. W&L runs the option as well as anybody but that is only going to take you but so far in the playoffs; pass happy teams are fun to watch but not going to beat a good team if you can't run the ball effectively as well.

much easier said than done.

Not sure that is necessary to win a playoff game, which was your original question. There are plenty of teams that make the playoffs that the ODAC champion will be competitive with or better than. The key is getting a high enough seed to face those opponents rather than the top of the brackets. If you are talking about making a deep run in the playoffs, balanced teams with strong defenses are a good starting point, but I view winning a first round game, and reaching the final 8, as two different enterprises.

There is no reason W&L wouldn't have competed with any of the 5 through 8 seeds in any bracket this year. W&L may not have beat all of those teams, though I do think they were the best of the 7 seeds (just a guess given limited data points) this year. That means they were better than 1/4 of the field. The problem W&L had was they weren't a 2 facing a 7, they were a 7 facing a 2. To flip that equation, W&L needed to beat Bridgewater, which was just a very bad loss, and not allow Gettysburg to score on the last drive of the first game of the season.  Winning either of those games pushes W&L up 1 or 2 seeds most likely, winning both and going undefeated would have all but ensured a fairly easy first round game as maybe a 2 or more likely a 3 seed (UMHB and Wesley are going to be out front in a "regional" bracket, some other historical power in a less "regional" bracket).

You just have to win. In any given year, there generally aren't enough undefeated teams to push a 10-0 team past a 3 seed. 9-1 probably gives the ODAC a 3-6 seed depending on SoS and other results. Either of these outcomes and I give the ODAC a better than even money winning in the first round. Going 8-2 and the ODAC is a 6-8, and only a small chance of improving.

Given the only team consistently scheduling a power OOC game is HSC, there is no reason the ODAC champion can't go at least 9-1. They simply haven't been able to do it and have paid the price when seedings come around.

Should be interesting that the NJAC Members will need to find 3 OC games. This year will only be 2 due to the MAC Challenge. It will be interesting to fill a 10 game schedule. I think you need 7 teams for an AQ, Southern Virginia seems a stretch, but maybe ther are rumblings of others leaving the NJAC. Morrisville could be a candidate and even one day it could be Courtland. Maybe my thoughts of Wesley and Salisbury (I think they leave the Empire-soon, but could be way off) joining the NJAC was not such a stretch.

Wesley will have issues with the roster limits. Salisbury and Frostburg might be more amenable. CNU is also a possibility with their football only status in the USAC kicking in, although that would be almost as bad a travel situation as SVU. A lot will depend on whether the CAC will eventually sponsor football.

CAC members currently playing football include (or will shortly include) Frostburg St., Salisbury, Wesley, CNU, and SVU. So they really only need 2 more for an AQ to come from Marymount, Mary Washington, St. Mary's (MD), York (PA), or Penn St Harrisburg. There are also some football playing schools in the Landmark Conference that could be a geographic possibility for the NJAC or CAC if they were to change conference affiliations. The Landmark has several football teams affiliated with other conferences including Catholic (ODAC), Juniata (Centennial), Moravian (Centennial), Susquehanna (Centennial), and Merchant Marine (Liberty League). Don't really see any of the Landmark schools as a good fit with the CAC or NJAC to be honest, but Catholic would probably be the best. Of course they left the CAC for the Landmark so there is already a stumbling block of some kind.

Just as a numbers puzzle, the Centennial has 10 members, so even 3 defections wouldn't cause an AQ problem and both the ODAC and LL each have 8 members, so losing a single member is ok. Be interesting to see how it continues to shake out.

I have to believe that the CAC is looking toward forming a football conference. CNU's movement from the USAC plus the invitations to the three recent conference additions (including SVU), puts them so close. Just looking at it objectively, Wesley needs a home and Salisbury, Frostburg and now SVU are just in ridiculous travel situations right now.