Author Topic: FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin  (Read 5361942 times)

Offline New Tradition

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Re: FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin
« Reply #38100 on: December 23, 2019, 02:15:40 pm »
1. 2019 - 59-52 win over Mount Union -- not many teams come out of Alliance with a win, and this opened up all that happened in the past month
3. 2019 - 41-24 Stagg Bowl win over Whitewater
2. 2004 - 31-10 win over Augustana... first proof point that things were different now... you just didn't beat Augie in that era
4. 2013 - 41-40 loss to Mount Union... going toe to toe against D3's alpha program when they blow out most non-purple opponents suggested the gap could be closed
5. 2005 - 21-19 loss to Capital... first-ever playoff game... reaching and being competitive in the playoffs  helped to reset expectations

Wholeheartedly agree with this entire list!
NT and Kiko, I would agree with this list, but if we focus only on the John Thorne era (thus eliminating the obvious #1 and #2), I would submit the following three for consideration:
a.  2007 - 44-42 win over Franklin on the road... Fanthorpe to Hlavac as time ran out with the Franklin fans rushing the field... gave the Cardinals a chance to play one of the Purple Powers for the first time with a second round trip to UWW.
b. 2010 - 20-10 loss to UWW at home... gave Cardinals confidence that they were getting closer to being able to being able to compete with Mount and UWW and a huge step forward from the 2007 outcome at UWW.
c. 2011 - 29-28 loss to Wabash on the road... left everyone with a bad taste and a drive to win... everyone was still talking about that game going into this year's playoffs.
If we’re doing just JT$, I’ll also submit:
d. 2005 - 35-26 over Wheaton. That was the last of the CCIW dragons that needed to be slain and the first time we got the Bell. After that, we knew we could run with anyone in the conference and could legitimately set our sights on a higher goal.
« Last Edit: December 23, 2019, 02:20:00 pm by New Tradition »
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Offline GoIrish7

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Re: FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin
« Reply #38101 on: December 23, 2019, 02:34:33 pm »
NT, regarding whoís going to be manning the helm for NCC next year: thereís already rumors afoot of a transfer from a scholarship school.

The spot couldnít be any more attractive for someone considering.

Does the scholarship school wear Green and White?  8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) (There is no truth to this, I just think it would be awesome)

Offline kiko

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Re: FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin
« Reply #38102 on: December 23, 2019, 02:37:13 pm »
Two quick thoughts, and they won't be as eloquent as what you read above...

A) If you had told me when I graduated many eons ago that North Central's football team would finish higher on the national stage than its cross country team, my reaction would have been "oh... what a shame that the cross country program has fallen off from where it was".  The idea of hoisting the walnut and bronze was not remotely a consideration.  It's hard to have a playoff team in football given how scarce access to the postseason is.  It's *really* hard to reach the playoffs, let alone be competitive, on a regular basis.  And as NT alludes to above, competing with the purples is in another stratosphere.  Kudos to the current team, and to those who helped establish the foundation and build, brick by brick, the program to where it is today.  This one belongs to all of you.

B) I'm curious as to what other Cardinal supporters think, but IMO the five most important games in the Thorne era (and by extension, since little of note happened in this program prior to 2002, in program history) would be these:

1. 2019 - 59-52 win over Mount Union -- not many teams come out of Alliance with a win, and this opened up all that happened in the past month
3. 2019 - 41-24 Stagg Bowl win over Whitewater
2. 2004 - 31-10 win over Augustana... first proof point that things were different now... you just didn't beat Augie in that era
4. 2013 - 41-40 loss to Mount Union... going toe to toe against D3's alpha program when they blow out most non-purple opponents suggested the gap could be closed
5. 2005 - 21-19 loss to Capital... first-ever playoff game... reaching and being competitive in the playoffs  helped to reset expectations
From this long-time fan's perspective, kiko's list of milestone games looks about right.  I'd like to add to it, though:  two games in 2002.  On multiple occasions I've heard John say that in his first season there were two games (I don't remember the specific ones) which could have gone either way.  He says that getting those two wins let him recruit with a 6-4 record rather than 4-6, and that helped him attract the 2003 recruiting class, men who became the core of John's first CCIW champs in 2006.  Those first years were crucial to getting the team where it is now.

So congratulations and thank you to the 2002 North Central College Cardinals.

How about the not so much milestone games?

The Augie FG game
Kam Kinsís mono game @ Wheaton
Playoff game vs Franklin

Could be a good list

Good point!  I'll add the loss the Wheaton where Mike Swider took his foot off the gas because he prized a share of the CCIW title more than winning a tiebreaker that would give the Thunder a Pool 'A' berth.

Offline formerd3db

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Re: FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin
« Reply #38103 on: December 23, 2019, 03:24:23 pm »
79jaybird:

Thanks for you PM.  Check yours again!
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Offline hazzben

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Re: FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin
« Reply #38104 on: December 23, 2019, 03:28:20 pm »
Steve Ryan just won back to back NAIA National Titles at Morningside. He'd be the top of my wish list if I were Wheaton. Not sure if they can lure him away, but he'd be my first call. Interesting to see how things develop for the Thunder this offseason.

I like Steve, I think there is more to choosing a coach at Wheaton than just winning.  I am not sure Steve makes the short list for the Wheaton job.  I doubt he would even want it.

Totally. See my initial post regarding Ryan. Not sure what kind of culture fit he'd be or if he'd be drawn to Wheaton's culture as a coach. Sounds like maybe you have some intel to suggest he wouldn't be. And I'd agree, he's got things rolling at Morningside, which would be hard to step away from.

Offline AndOne

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Re: FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin
« Reply #38105 on: December 23, 2019, 05:19:01 pm »
It would seem that while stepping away from a well oiled program where things are rolling smoothly would indeed be a primary consideration. But, is the overriding principle here not the fact that there are six degrees of separation between an NAIA institution and how it operates and the philosophy and way things are done at Wheaton?
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Offline AndOne

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Re: FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin
« Reply #38106 on: December 23, 2019, 06:03:34 pm »
I just saw the final Top 25 and was generally fine with the Top 8, but personally would have probably have put NCC #1, Mount #2 and UWW #3, St. Johns #4, Muhlenberg #5, Wheaton #6, Delaware Valley #7, and UMHB #8.

1. North Central
2. Mount
3. Whitewater
4. St. John's
5. Wheaton
6. Delaware Valley
7. UMHB
8. John Carroll
9. Muhlenberg
10. Wartburg

Kiko,
I like your top ten, especially Delaware Valley above Muhlenberg. Only John Carroll gives me pause, I might move Muhlenberg there and Salisbury below them and follow with Wartburg. Certainly possible to make cases the other way. The one I think they got right for sure is NCC as #1 and two CCIW schools in the top ten.
I slid the Mules in at #5 ahead of Wheaton because they they actually made it to the National Semis, only allowed 8 points in the first three rounds of the playoffs, absolutely shut down a good Salisbury team, and only lost to the eventual National Champion. Wheaton did not make it to the National Semis, had to stage a comeback against SJU just to get into a position to send their game into OT, and then made three crucial mistakes in a row to lose to SJU (penalty, failed XP, and failed XP).  The Mules had a better defense than did SJU, and I don't believe that Wheaton would have defeated Muhlenberg head to head... it certainly would have been a low scoring game.


Wheaton beats Muhlenberg by 40 points.

This is just silly. Muhlenberg was a good team. But their route to the Semi's was ridiculously easy. I'd take SJU's D over Muhlenberg's any day. And like NCC experienced, when you face really good offenses (Mount, Wheaton), even very good D's give up points. We saw in the Semi's that the Mules 'Elite D' was fools gold, they faced a truly elite offense and got utterly exposed. Wheaton and SJU would have trounced Muhlenberg.

Call me crazy, but unless they possessed a truly good lite defense, it would seem like almost any teamís D would be ďutterly exposedĒ if they were facing a truly elite offense.

All we heard about the Mules defense was that it was truly elite. I sense this thinking was based on their giving up very few points throughout the season and especially in the playoffs. However, was this stout defensive record compiled against what could be considered elite offenses? In the NCC game, the Mules defense seemed slow to react. They gave up almost 300 yards on the ground, and 5 TDS through the air. This is not elite defense. Contrastingly, the Wheaton defense vs. NCC often appeared one step quicker. This was especially true of the D line in the second half. Vs that common opponent, it was like they were shot out of canons through the NCC O line, and into the backfield. (To the Cards credit, I think they learned from this game and subsequently applied that knowledge to elevate their play throughout the remainder of the seasonóbut thatís another story. 😊). To say the Mules are better than the Wheaties because they advanced further in the playoffs is follyóespecially considering WCís offense is also better than MUís. The Wheaties may not have beaten the Mules by 40, but Iím pretty sure 30 would be a very safe bet.
« Last Edit: December 23, 2019, 06:06:36 pm by AndOne »
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Offline BigRedScots

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Re: FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin
« Reply #38107 on: December 24, 2019, 09:14:43 am »
IMO, Muhlenberg doesnít belong in the top 15. From what I saw, if they play in the CCIW, MIAC, OAC or WIAC they arenít even in the playoffs.

Also, after watching the Aurora vs SJU game... Iíd put Aurora in the top 15. Up 10 with 4min to go and should have won. They were better than Muhlenberg for sure.

Offline formerd3db

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Re: FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin
« Reply #38108 on: December 24, 2019, 10:01:59 am »
IMO, Muhlenberg doesnít belong in the top 15. From what I saw, if they play in the CCIW, MIAC, OAC or WIAC they arenít even in the playoffs.

Also, after watching the Aurora vs SJU game... Iíd put Aurora in the top 15. Up 10 with 4min to go and should have won. They were better than Muhlenberg for sure.

Since we're all speculating here, then I assume you would put Hope in one of the last top 25 spots🙂 (they did get some votes.) Hope beat Aurora while it was a close game, they were playing very well at that time and did handle that very good team.😳🙂
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Offline BigRedScots

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Re: FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin
« Reply #38109 on: December 24, 2019, 10:26:29 am »
IMO, Muhlenberg doesnít belong in the top 15. From what I saw, if they play in the CCIW, MIAC, OAC or WIAC they arenít even in the playoffs.

Also, after watching the Aurora vs SJU game... Iíd put Aurora in the top 15. Up 10 with 4min to go and should have won. They were better than Muhlenberg for sure.

Since we're all speculating here, then I assume you would put Hope in one of the last top 25 spots🙂 (they did get some votes.) Hope beat Aurora while it was a close game, they were playing very well at that time and did handle that very good team.😳🙂

I would not. I think Aurora improves tremendously since that week 2 loss.

I am excited that Hope and Monmouth have each other back on the schedule. I also think your coach is awesome and Hope has the potential to turn into a North Central caliber program. I view Hollandale as Naperville, IL except on Lake Michigan. Awesome city.

Offline USee

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Re: FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin
« Reply #38110 on: December 24, 2019, 10:34:00 am »
For the Wheaton HC spot I expect a former Wheaton player to be named.  Probably mid Jan to Feb 1 timeframe.  Among those I have heard tossed around (alphabetical order)

Pedro Aruzza, RMC HC
Rick Fox, former Drake HC
Tim Hardy, HC at Greater Atlanta Christian HS in Atlanta
Neal Nertherly, DC Eastern Michigan
Rod Sandberg, Whitworth HC
Jesse Scott, Current OC at Wheaton
Andy Studebaker, 8 yr NFL LB.

I would expect the next HC to be one of these guys. Realistically itís probably a small subset of this list who are actual candidates.
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Offline USee

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Re: FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin
« Reply #38111 on: December 24, 2019, 10:35:24 am »
IMO, Muhlenberg doesnít belong in the top 15. From what I saw, if they play in the CCIW, MIAC, OAC or WIAC they arenít even in the playoffs.

Also, after watching the Aurora vs SJU game... Iíd put Aurora in the top 15. Up 10 with 4min to go and should have won. They were better than Muhlenberg for sure.

Since we're all speculating here, then I assume you would put Hope in one of the last top 25 spots🙂 (they did get some votes.) Hope beat Aurora while it was a close game, they were playing very well at that time and did handle that very good team.😳🙂

I would not. I think Aurora improves tremendously since that week 2 loss.

I am excited that Hope and Monmouth have each other back on the schedule. I also think your coach is awesome and Hope has the potential to turn into a North Central caliber program. I view Hollandale as Naperville, IL except on Lake Michigan. Awesome city.

so Aurora improved since week 2 but Hope didnít? Have you been speaking with Stagg or Bust?
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Offline izzy stradlin

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Re: FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin
« Reply #38112 on: December 24, 2019, 11:37:26 am »
For the Wheaton HC spot I expect a former Wheaton player to be named.  Probably mid Jan to Feb 1 timeframe.  Among those I have heard tossed around (alphabetical order)

Pedro Aruzza, RMC HC
Rick Fox, former Drake HC
Tim Hardy, HC at Greater Atlanta Christian HS in Atlanta
Neal Nertherly, DC Eastern Michigan
Rod Sandberg, Whitworth HC
Jesse Scott, Current OC at Wheaton
Andy Studebaker, 8 yr NFL LB.

I would expect the next HC to be one of these guys. Realistically itís probably a small subset of this list who are actual candidates.

Jordan Langs?  Heís got a good job now but so do Hardy/Studebaker and others. I gotta think coming back to Wheaton would mean something to them.  I saw Langs in the stands as a spectator at Wheaton playoff games.

Offline Baldini

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Re: FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin
« Reply #38113 on: December 24, 2019, 11:45:47 am »
For the Wheaton HC spot I expect a former Wheaton player to be named.  Probably mid Jan to Feb 1 timeframe.  Among those I have heard tossed around (alphabetical order)

Pedro Aruzza, RMC HC
Rick Fox, former Drake HC
Tim Hardy, HC at Greater Atlanta Christian HS in Atlanta
Neal Nertherly, DC Eastern Michigan
Rod Sandberg, Whitworth HC
Jesse Scott, Current OC at Wheaton
Andy Studebaker, 8 yr NFL LB.

I would expect the next HC to be one of these guys. Realistically itís probably a small subset of this list who are actual candidates.
 

Is Studebaker coaching somewhere now?

Offline izzy stradlin

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Re: FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin
« Reply #38114 on: December 24, 2019, 11:59:01 am »
For the Wheaton HC spot I expect a former Wheaton player to be named.  Probably mid Jan to Feb 1 timeframe.  Among those I have heard tossed around (alphabetical order)

Pedro Aruzza, RMC HC
Rick Fox, former Drake HC
Tim Hardy, HC at Greater Atlanta Christian HS in Atlanta
Neal Nertherly, DC Eastern Michigan
Rod Sandberg, Whitworth HC
Jesse Scott, Current OC at Wheaton
Andy Studebaker, 8 yr NFL LB.

I would expect the next HC to be one of these guys. Realistically itís probably a small subset of this list who are actual candidates.
 

Is Studebaker coaching somewhere now?

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