Author Topic: MBB: Centennial Conference  (Read 1102449 times)

Offline Coach C

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Re: MBB: Centennial Conference
« Reply #390 on: December 23, 2006, 08:37:02 am »
Otis -

You may not like GRob, (lots of people don't).  But you have to give the man his due.  He's the dean of coaches in the region and on of the top 20 or so in the nation based on his accomplishments.  He's a top 2 or so in the league.  you also have Nelso too low.

I like Mucci, but his teams never seem to get over the hump.  If Amherst and Bates and the like can win with tough admissions standards, why doesn't Haverford get some of the same guys?

C

Offline otis

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Re: MBB: Centennial Conference
« Reply #391 on: December 23, 2006, 09:15:43 am »
Coach C-

Robinson may have been  a good coach at one time but IMHO he is a lousey coach now. He's also been blessed with a lot of talented players through the years.

He definitely knows his X's and O's but he lacks the most important thing necessary to be a good coach...he can't communicate with his players and they have "zero" respect for the man. I've been to many games over the years and have not seen a coach berate his players the way he does. He's got each player right by the b*lls and god forbid that kid should make a mistake or try to improvise and he gets yanked. You can't play basketball at any level (especially college) if you're looking over your shoulder all the time. Watch Small at Ursinus...no yelling...he talks to his players if they make a mistake to make sure they don't do it again but he makes sure they keep their confidence level up. They want to win for coach Small as much as they want to win for themselves.

And don't try to compare Robinson's style with Bobby Knight. Knight can be brutal but most of his players would do anything in the world for him. They know Knight would be right there if they needed him. I don't believe this to be so with Robinson.

I wasn't at the Alvernia game the other night but was told (and read) about him putting Ben Stone in the game at such a crutial time. How do you put a 6'7" 260 lb big man in the game who has very little experience and hadn't been in the game all night when F&M has turned the momentum around with 7 minutes to go in the game. And I'm not blaming Ben at all..you can't expect him to go into the game cold like that...not being the kind of player he is. In the blink of an eye you had two steals and fast break for a dunk...now that's a momentum killer and the game and that is on Robinson.

I could go on and on about his poor substituting and and his players true lack of respect for him but it's a waste of time. He is what he is and that's not going to change. I just don't want to hear anymore of this crap about "how is poor GRob going to pull a miracle out of his bag this year". He's got good players...not the best he's ever had but they can win and make it to the CC play-offs. If he would just put that hook away and show these players he's got enough confidence in them and believes in them they might start playing with the potential they have instead of playing "not to make a mistake".

I'll be back later with who my staring five would be and who should come off the bench.

And by the way you are probably correct about Nelson.





Offline Warren Thompson

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Re: MBB: Centennial Conference
« Reply #392 on: December 23, 2006, 09:31:46 am »
Mercy, otis! That's one devastating indictment of GRob. I wonder how much of it holds water ... or anything else.

Offline Leo

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Re: MBB: Centennial Conference
« Reply #393 on: December 23, 2006, 10:15:40 am »
I have seen Robinson coach several times at Ursinus's home court, and he is a very vocal/tough coach by his actions along the bench. However, the man has a long history of success.

Otis makes a good point on his analysis of poor substitution and how it affected the game. I appreciate Otis's comments because he brings some substance to his observations/comments as opposed to some comments on this chat board and other boards.

You can read Otis's passion for his team by his quote, and I am sure he is frustrated by F&M's play this year as some of us are about our team. Over time, Otis's comments will either pan out or fall along the wayside.

I, for one, appreciate Otis's comments.

FYI, Furey did not play last night and the team lost by 20. The Bears weakness is there lack of depth - I will concede that fact to everyone. However, losing a big man like that (albeit 1 game) could also be said for the Mules and Stewart. Does anyone know if Stewart will be playing in the Spring?


Offline Warren Thompson

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Re: MBB: Centennial Conference
« Reply #394 on: December 23, 2006, 10:24:12 am »
Over time, Otis's comments will either pan out or fall along the wayside.

That, of course. holds for any assertion: it's either true or it's false, it's either accurate or it's inaccurate. Thus otis has a 50% chance of being on the mark, as well as a 50% chance of missing it.

Now a question: other than observing GRob in action, does otis have any other evidence to support his claims?

P.S. I'm anything but an F&M fan.

Offline r.w. mcnickels

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Re: MBB: Centennial Conference
« Reply #395 on: December 23, 2006, 10:46:12 am »
Good to see the CC board shining with holiday spirit this morning... :o

otis, it's no secret that Robinson isn't the best adjust-on-the-fly coach.  His strength has always been preparing for games and getting his teams (whatever their talent level) to play disciplined, smart basketball.  If you've been watching over the years, as you say, you would notice that not much has changed.  He's always yelled, yanked players after a mistake, etc possibly even more a decade ago than now.

This isn't to say Robinson shouldn't take the heat for the losing.  At the end of the day, they have no weapons.  Even worse, there seems to be no leadership.  With the exception of Outerbridge, who occasionally shows some fire, the players don't show much grit.  I think Robinson's recruiting is to be blamed more than anything. 

We'll see where the program goes from here.  F&M has rebounded from previous down times fairly quickly (1985, 1997-98).  Time will tell.

otis, I'd put Dave Madeira in the top 5 CC coaches.  Robinson, Small, Nelson, Madeira, Petrie.
« Last Edit: December 23, 2006, 11:27:29 am by r.w. mcnickels »

Offline bearsfan1

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Re: MBB: Centennial Conference
« Reply #396 on: December 23, 2006, 11:42:32 am »
Does anyone know why Furey did not play last night?

Offline Warren Thompson

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Re: MBB: Centennial Conference
« Reply #397 on: December 23, 2006, 11:54:27 am »
If things at F&M are as bad as claimed above, does anyone know why?

Offline otis

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Re: MBB: Centennial Conference
« Reply #398 on: December 23, 2006, 05:23:15 pm »
My starting five:

g - Outerbridge

g - Chasen

f - Hynes

f - Hamm

f - Tescke

subs:

McCaffrey, Prysbylowski, Leonard, Yost, Carney

Offline r.w. mcnickels

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Re: MBB: Centennial Conference
« Reply #399 on: January 04, 2007, 09:47:48 am »
Of six Centennial teams in non-conference action last night, only Swarthmore posts a win (77-66 over Philadelphia Bible).  Hard to remember a worse year for this conference in non-CC play.

Stat of the night:  F&M shoots 3-33 in the second half vs. Lincoln.

Offline Leo

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Re: MBB: Centennial Conference
« Reply #400 on: January 04, 2007, 01:04:49 pm »
Well McNickels, you can play with the men  8) , or you can play with bible-holding boys for the win  :D

Offline Warren Thompson

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Re: MBB: Centennial Conference
« Reply #401 on: January 04, 2007, 02:53:03 pm »
Of six Centennial teams in non-conference action last night, only Swarthmore posts a win (77-66 over Philadelphia Bible).  Hard to remember a worse year for this conference in non-CC play.

Stat of the night:  F&M shoots 3-33 in the second half vs. Lincoln.

The Dips shot 18% for the game (9.1% in the second half). Something other than the hallmark of a GRob-coached team.  :o
« Last Edit: January 04, 2007, 03:04:43 pm by Warren Thompson »

Offline chotch

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Re: MBB: Centennial Conference
« Reply #402 on: January 07, 2007, 08:00:54 pm »
After seeing some recent F&M games, I think that I would agree with many of otis' observations and others concerning G-Rob. While I did not witness games from the past 2 decades and so cannot comment on his coaching during that time, I do have some observations from the more recent seasons.

His players are definitely intimidated by him and afraid to do anything that would upset him for fear of being pulled from the game. They will often pass up wide open shots early in the shot clock because they believe they will be pulled if they do take those shots.

G-Rob runs a very structured, predictable, and one might argue predictable, system. I never noticed it before, but I did recently- if you watch the team closely, look at how many shots are created by an individual player. Almost all of their shots are pull up jumpers or low-post moves; almost never is a shot taken off the dribble.

As noted above, his subbing is suspect at times. The most recent example would be against Lincoln, Adam Leonard, who played about 8-10 minutes in the first half and hit two three-pointers against Lincoln's zone, did not see the floor in the second half. Unless Leonard aggravated an injury (which I did not notice at all) it was an asinine move on the coach's part. (This is of course not even mentioning the technical G-Rob got during the W. Conn. game, which F&M lost by 1).

Lastly, I think we can all agree that a good coach will make his players better over the course of their four years at a school. I do not think the G-Rob has done that. I can think of multiple players on the team who are no better now (or are playing even worse) than when they arrived at F&M. That is because the coach does not let them play the way they did when they were successful in high school and because they are so timid for fear of doing something that would get them yelled at or pulled from the game. G-Rob needs to consider coaching a system that fits the players he recruits instead of forcing players into an outdated and now ineffective, predictable system.

Offline diplomaniac1

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Re: MBB: Centennial Conference
« Reply #403 on: January 09, 2007, 05:24:37 pm »

Folks -

As a long-time Diplomat follower, I have been meaning to weigh in on this discussion for some time. However, the demands of work have limited my d-III attention span somewhat over the last year. Thus, I will keep my comments brief now and expand upon them in a subsequent post. For a frame of reference, you should note that I have followed the team actively since graduation in 1982 and, until the last two years, have seen 20+ games a year. I also saw the Dips' Final Four appearances in Springfield, Ohio in 1991, Salem in 1996, and Salem in 2000.

In the past, I am know there were players who did not care for GRob personally. However, they were always willing to put that aside, listen to and follow coaching instructions, and give the effort that was necessary for success. I do not believe that some of the current players are willing to do this now.

As to the comment about some of GRob's players getting worse or no better over the years, I strongly disagree. I can think of many players who developed more fully and got better from their freshman years when compared to their senior years.

I do concede that a GRob weakness is making "during play" adjustments. However, I have seen numerous games where half-time adjustments were made that produced wins.

Well, that's it for now. More to follow later..... Hope everyone's holidays were outstanding and relaxing! Regards to all.

Eric




Offline chotch

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Re: MBB: Centennial Conference
« Reply #404 on: January 09, 2007, 06:54:17 pm »
Diplomaniac, I am never said that players under him did not get better. It is inevitable that if you play basketball every day for four years that you will get better. That being said, there are definitely players on this team who are now playing worse than they did when they got here. I would say that is largely due to the fact that they are playing so timidly under him. I do not want to name names for the players' sake, but if you are a long time follower of the team then it should not be hard to pick them out. And notice that I am saying "playing." I am not saying they are worse players now, just that they are playing worse in large part because of the mind games G-Rob plays with his players.

For somewhat easily observable evidence, look at how some of the players, those who are normally in the rotation, have their minutes fluctuate dramatically from game to game, half to half. Sometimes they start, sometimes they don't. These mind games might work with some players or teams, but this team obviously does not.

While in the past players may have been able to set aside their personal feelings for him, there are many (most) players on this team who are currently not able to do so. I can see why, as being repetitively called out publicly in front of family and friends can where on a player.