Author Topic: Big Dance  (Read 44530 times)

Offline MaturinNYC

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Re: Big Dance
« Reply #285 on: November 20, 2019, 03:32:37 pm »
Would like to see it in real-time, but from the description and pics I do not think this is handling in any sense... just unfortunate.    Did referees have open mics? discussion with AR? or was decision immediate?

It was immediate, no flag from the AR - and just guessing from his reactions afterwards (two quick yellows - one to a UR player on the field and one to the UR bench) he may have regretted it. Or he may not have, the home crowd certainly appreciated it!   But all i can say is that having seen the game, knowing the moment, and knowing the IFAB rules - "It is, however, considered natural for a player to put their arm between their body and the ground for support when falling, so long as the arm is not extended to make the body bigger." - the right call should have been to "play on".  However he was a human and sadly the NCAA doesn't yet have VAR, so here's another tale to tell about the game we all love.
Father, club & HS coach, sometime ref and ever a fan of the game

Offline southsidejet

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Re: Big Dance
« Reply #286 on: November 20, 2019, 05:07:50 pm »
Did anyone watch the JCU game? Seemed like they were contenders since they were ranked #1 in GL region.

Saw bits and pieces - but a good portion of it.  Two of the variables I commented on materialized in this game:  inability to score from the run of play (over-reliance on set-piece goals); and opponents being able to get behind the midfielders to run at the back four. Twice Centre was able to send through-balls past the midfield to Garuba and he created the first goal, scored the third as a result.

Towards the end of the game it was apparent how little attacking prowess they possessed. JCU will see many of the key players from this team return next year - and JCU West - St. Ignatius - won the DI State title, which has been a good source of players who don't go NCAA DI.

May be interesting to see which teams advance this weekend.  Some of the teams that made it this upcoming weekend can defend AND attack.  The "defend and wait for counters or set pieces" teams - wonder how they'll do?

I saw most of the JCU games this season (including this one) and agree with the assessment. Too much reliance on set-piece goals all season, not dangerous/efficient enough on the attacking end (goals-to-shots ratio was very poor this year). Also, too much reliance on general athleticism as well compared to area teams I feel do a better job of blending in good soccer talent (Kenyon, OWU... who are both, incidentally, still alive in the tournament).

Offline PaulNewman

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Re: Big Dance
« Reply #287 on: November 20, 2019, 06:51:37 pm »
Anybody have any insight on why Amherst is the only apparent top seed in a sectional playing the early game?  It is possible any teams were given a choice and wanted to avoid playing so early in the day?

Online d4_Pace

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Re: Big Dance
« Reply #288 on: November 20, 2019, 06:55:33 pm »
Host gets to choose even if they aren't "top" seed. Thats why tufts played the early game in the 2016 kenyon pod

Offline Christan Shirk

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Re: Big Dance
« Reply #289 on: November 21, 2019, 09:23:31 am »
Host gets to choose even if they aren't "top" seed. Thats why tufts played the early game in the 2016 kenyon pod

Actually, the Pre-Championships Manual says the following under "Start Times" in Section 2.1 (see the very top of of page 18):

     At all sites, the match shown higher on the championship bracket will be the first match played. The match shown lower on
     the championship bracket will be the second match played.


And you will see this carried out if you look at the occasions where the "top seed" has not hosted, both this year and in the past.  That's why Keene St., Oneonta St., Trinty (Tx.), Catholic, and Hope did not play the early game in the 1st/2nd Round pods.  Do you think none of those five hosts wouldn't have taken the earlier game given the chance?  Two years ago, when like this year the women had hosting priority the first weekend, Messiah still played the early game despite Buffalo St. hosting, likewise Oglethorpe having the early game at host Washington and Lee.  Messiah still played the early game last year even after the sectional was moved to Rochester.  Messiah also played the early game in the 2014 sectional at Muhlenberg.  And Tufts hosted the sectional in 2016 because they were shown higher in the bracket having emerged form the pod with the quadrant's top seed.
« Last Edit: November 21, 2019, 09:31:47 am by Christan Shirk »
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Offline Falconer

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Re: Big Dance
« Reply #290 on: November 21, 2019, 09:31:25 am »
Was just reviewing the team scoring statistics across D3. Here's what they look like this week:

Offense:

1    Bethany Lutheran    3.95
2    Oglethorpe       3.58
3    Gust. Adolphus       3.45
4    Wis.-Superior       3.43
5    PSU-B          3.29
6    Manhattanville       3.28
7    Pine Manor       3.24
8    Calvin          3.17
9    Eastern Conn. St.    3.15
10    Loras          3.05

Defense:

1    WPI                  .452
2    Ohio Wesleyan       .500
3    St. Joseph's (ME)    .503
4    Middlebury       .503
5    Claremont-M-S       .513
6    Chris. Newport       .536
7    Messiah               .579
8    Rose-Hulman       .585
9    UMass Boston       .602
10    Chicago               .636

It's not hard to see which factor is more important for getting to the tournament and moving forward. Exceptions to this pattern are also obvious.

Not surprisingly, Bethany Lutheran has the #2 goal scorer, Max Busch (25), and the #3T assist man, Luuk Oosterbosch (16). Never saw them play, but the bigger picture is clear from this salient fact: they lost 6-0 last month to Wisconsin-Superior, obviously an excellent team that defeated Central before losing in PKs to Luther last weekend. They obviously got gaudy stats by feasting on turkeys.





Offline Flying Weasel

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Re: Big Dance
« Reply #291 on: November 21, 2019, 10:13:49 am »
Well, it looks like 6 of the top 10 offenses made the tournament and 6 of the top 10 defenses made the tournament, so that would hardly be considered "hard not to see".  But looking at the Sweet 16, now there is just one top 10 offense and thee top 10 defenses which better supports what I think you are inferring: that having a top defense is more important than having a top offense.  You'd make a stronger case if you expand to the Top 20.  Then the tournament field contains 10 of the Top 20 offenses and 14 of the Top 25 defenses and the Sweet 16 has two of the Top 20 offense and six of the Top 20 defenses.

Offline jknezek

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Re: Big Dance
« Reply #292 on: November 21, 2019, 10:21:41 am »
So offense wins games, defense wins championships? How long has that saying been around? Especially true in a low scoring sport like soccer.

Offline Gregory Sager

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Re: Big Dance
« Reply #293 on: November 21, 2019, 12:00:22 pm »
Not surprisingly, Bethany Lutheran has the #2 goal scorer, Max Busch (25), and the #3T assist man, Luuk Oosterbosch (16). Never saw them play, but the bigger picture is clear from this salient fact: they lost 6-0 last month to Wisconsin-Superior, obviously an excellent team that defeated Central before losing in PKs to Luther last weekend. They obviously got gaudy stats by feasting on turkeys.

Well, of course "obviously", given that Bethany Lutheran is a member of the UMAC -- a league that consists of an entire rafter of turkeys, aside from UW-Superior (and sometimes St. Scholastica). Play in a turkey league, feast on turkeys.

Bethany Lutheran's makeup is a far more interesting subject. Both of the high-flying scorers, Busch and Oosterbosch, are freshmen. They're also two of the 19 international players on the 34-man Bethany Lutheran roster. Eleven different countries are represented, and there's only eight Minnesotans on the entire BLC roster. That's one way to get around the MIAC stranglehold on good non-scholarship soccer players in the Land of 10,000 Lakes.
"Talent is God-given. Be humble. Fame is man-given. Be grateful. Conceit is self-given. Be careful..” -- John Wooden

Offline rudy

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Re: Big Dance
« Reply #294 on: November 22, 2019, 08:58:58 am »
a couple of very interesting games today for sweet 16. Calvin and NP could be a final 4 level game.

Offline Buck O.

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Re: Big Dance
« Reply #295 on: November 22, 2019, 09:13:58 am »
Was just reviewing the team scoring statistics across D3. Here's what they look like this week:

Offense:

1    Bethany Lutheran    3.95
2    Oglethorpe       3.58
3    Gust. Adolphus       3.45
4    Wis.-Superior       3.43
5    PSU-B          3.29
6    Manhattanville       3.28
7    Pine Manor       3.24
8    Calvin          3.17
9    Eastern Conn. St.    3.15
10    Loras          3.05

Defense:

1    WPI                  .452
2    Ohio Wesleyan       .500
3    St. Joseph's (ME)    .503
4    Middlebury       .503
5    Claremont-M-S       .513
6    Chris. Newport       .536
7    Messiah               .579
8    Rose-Hulman       .585
9    UMass Boston       .602
10    Chicago               .636

It's not hard to see which factor is more important for getting to the tournament and moving forward. Exceptions to this pattern are also obvious.

Not surprisingly, Bethany Lutheran has the #2 goal scorer, Max Busch (25), and the #3T assist man, Luuk Oosterbosch (16). Never saw them play, but the bigger picture is clear from this salient fact: they lost 6-0 last month to Wisconsin-Superior, obviously an excellent team that defeated Central before losing in PKs to Luther last weekend. They obviously got gaudy stats by feasting on turkeys.

I'd suggest that the issue instead is that reliance on raw data provide less insight as to which teams have a good offense than as to who has a good defense.  Here are Massey's top 10 offensive teams as of this moment (Sweet 16 teams in bold):

1. Tufts
2. Amherst
3. Calvin
4. Messiah

5. Oglethorpe
6. Kenyon
7. GAC
8. NPU
9. W&L

10. Loras

Seven teams still in the tournament.  (Bethany Lutheran is #157.)

And here are Massey's top 10 defensive teams:

1. Midd
2. Conn College
3. CNU
4. JHU
5. CMS
6. F&M
7. Montclair St.
8. WPI
9. OWU
10. Wesleyan

Only four of these teams in the Sweet 16.

Offline Mr.Right

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Re: Big Dance
« Reply #296 on: November 22, 2019, 09:30:30 am »
a couple of very interesting games today for sweet 16. Calvin and NP could be a final 4 level game.



I agree both these games today are great matchups especially for the neutral. I have not seen any of these teams yet this season. Anyone know which team has the 6'6 striker with 20 goals? Luther...can this kid be the difference maker in this pod this weekend? On paper everything looks good.

Offline Gregory Sager

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Re: Big Dance
« Reply #297 on: November 22, 2019, 10:13:16 am »
a couple of very interesting games today for sweet 16. Calvin and NP could be a final 4 level game.

I'll settle for NPU winning in a walkover, but I'm not putting my money down on that happening. ;)
"Talent is God-given. Be humble. Fame is man-given. Be grateful. Conceit is self-given. Be careful..” -- John Wooden

Offline GoThunder1

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Re: Big Dance
« Reply #298 on: November 22, 2019, 10:22:07 am »
Greg,

Are you on the call today? I hope so, as you have done a tremendous job all year. Any news on Stuhlen or Khoury’s injuries? In my opinion, Khoury is the bigger concern if he can’t go - as I have been impressed by Sabovic in the limited action I have seen from him.

Best of luck today to your boys!

Offline rudy

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Re: Big Dance
« Reply #299 on: November 22, 2019, 11:21:27 am »
a couple of very interesting games today for sweet 16. Calvin and NP could be a final 4 level game.

I'll settle for NPU winning in a walkover, but I'm not putting my money down on that happening. ;)

Much less stressful to watch without any skin in the game. I have the same feeling about Messiah vs RPI tomorrow. I wouldn't be upset if it's 3-0 Messiah at half but not counting on it!