MBB: Wisconsin Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[John Gleich]

[N]oone is stepping up and saying "I'm a POWER".

I think Oshkosh *may* be doing that right now.  They've won 11 out of 12 and beaten Point and Whitewater, the next two teams in conference, as well as La Crosse.  The conference grind gets tough the next 3 games... the Titans have to go on the road to River Falls, La Crosse, and Stout, but the finish up the year with three in a row at home, before the conference tournament.  These last 3 games have the potential to really give them confidence going into the conference tournament IMO, where they, barring a collapse, host a minimum of one game.

I think this conference race is very similar to the race in 2001/2002 when Point, Whitewater, and Oshkosh tied for the regular season title.  There wasn't a clearly dominant team (no team really dominated... Oshkosh did beat Whitewater 3 times that season, but they split with Point, River Falls and La Crosse, and lost to Platteville twice... Whitewater beat Point 2 out of 3, and lost to Oshkosh 3 times, but split with Stout... Point split with Oshy and WW, but lost to Stout twice and split with La Crosse... La Crosse, who was in control of their own destiny, lost their last 2 games and first conf tourney game, all at home, and went from a one game lead to one game back... basically, it was all a jumble) but Oshkosh still made it to the Sweet 16.

I think that the rankings are not necessarily the best barometer of how the teams are playing *at a particular moment* in the season.  For instance, your Titans are ranked 5th in the country but just 4-3 in their last 7 games.  They are in 3rd (right now) in their own conference, it would be hard to argue that they still deserve the top 5 rating.  They are arguably a few bad bounces away from being 1-6 in conference and tied for last!

The WIAC Titans, however, like I said, have won 12 out of 13 and beaten the more touted conference foes.  Titan Q, on Hoopsville, has talked about the "body of work," for a team during a season... but one really needs to look at the immediate ramifacations of what's happened to properly judge the teams.

I just think back to 2002-2003.  The Gusties of Gustavus Adolphus had a record of 21-6, and had climbed to a #24 ranking... but they had won 11 out of 12 games heading into the NCAA tournament.  On their way to a National Runner-Up finish, they beat #12 Whitworth, my #8 Pointers, #7 Hanover, ORV Occidental, and #4 Hampden Sydney before relinqueshing an 8 point lead in the Nat. Champ game with 3 minutes to go against #3 Williams.  They were a HOT team who was hot at the right time... during mid-January, February, and March.

My point is this:  The WIAC grind gets teams prepared to play in big games, and which ever team makes it out, ESPECIALLY if the team is on a roll, will be a team not to take lightly.  Only three times in the last 8 seasons has EVERY WIAC team who has made the NCAA's gotten at least to the Sweet 16 (in 1998, Platteville beat Oshkosh in the second round enrout to a National Championship, in 2000, 4 seed Eau Claire got the auto-bid after being the ONLY higher seed to win in the first round of the conference tourney... and they made it to the second round of the NCAA's, and GAC beat UWSP in 2002, enrout to the Nat Runner-up I noted before).  During that span, WIAC teams won 4 National Championships, was Runner-up once, made 8 sweet 16's, and 7 elite 8's.

Could this be a year like 2000?  Sure, it could.  But I think there's a better chance that the WIAC rep(s) will do quite well against their NCAA opponents.

[ajwagner]

Well, I picked a hell of a game to come back for. Oshkosh looked good, despite some big shots by Point, this one was not in doubt. Capelle and Jahnke impressed the hell out of me, and I really enjoyed seeing Gibson make a game for himself. However, I think it's fairly obvious that Gibson has far from realized his own abilities. Lord help this league if he does. For some reason, Doedens really stood out at me. I liked the way he drives and kicks. He's no offenseive machine, but he's very mobile. And defensively, while he's heistant at times ... he does a good job of contesting shots.

What really got me was talking to Capelle afterwards ... hearing a guy say "we haven't played to our full potential" and not meaning it as a way of saying "yeah we're the best and we don't have to try ... (ahem, Tom Crean)" That was impressive. This reminds of me of the 01-02 squad that dropped a couple of league games midway through the season, but hit their peak in the league tournament.

Good to see all my pals at Kolf again. I didn't see any rats, but my brat sure tasted somewhat odd.

[badgerwarhawk]

There was a game played in WHITEWATER[/color] and the WARHAWKS[/color] looked pretty decent in beating LaCrosse 83-70.  Fueled by a 54 point second half the WARHAWKS[/color] ran away from the Eagle.

The WHITEWATER[/color] bigs, Mike Toellner and Andy Freund, held Joe Werner without an offensive rebound and contributed 29 points and 9 rebounds between them.  Melvin Williams was like glue on Marcus Conigliaro and held him to 7 points on only 7 shots. Conigliaro was noticeably frustrated at times.  Williams also scored 10 points.  Rob Perry played very well with 15 points in 23 minutes.  Perry was too quick for the matchups LaCrosse made.  At one point they even tried Werner on him.  Gio Riley sparked the team in the second half with two steals converted into layups.   

Foul trouble hampered Werner somewhat.  Though I thought our bigs played him well he did have a nice game with a game high 18 points, on 7-9 from the floor and 4-5 from the line.  He also had 7 rebounds.   Once he gets the ball in the low post he simply has his way.   Chris Ask had another nice game against us.   

All in all a good effort by the WARHAWKS[/color]. 

Tonight it's a nonconference matchup against Marian College.

[titan2000]

BW:

Don't let your guard down with Marian.  They can bite you in the behind if you take them for granted. 

Good luck.

T2K

[badgerwarhawk]

Hopefully Loras and Carroll taught us that lesson 2K. 

[Greek Tragedy]

I'm not one to know anything about what goes into scheduling games on a year to year basis, but it seems to me that the WIAC teams might have a hard time scheduling games.  On the surface, they must find a way to schedule in-region games (or, of course, games within 200 miles) to play because these out-of-region games (especially ones that they win) are going to hurt their chances come tourney time.

Whitewater has FOUR wins that don't count for anything.  Oshkosh also has FOUR wins that don't mean squat.  Improved records from 11-4 in region to 15-4 in-region is a big difference for Oshkosh.  As is 8-4 to 12-4 for Whitewater!  Granted I don't expect every WIAC team to win EVERY nonconference game, so in-region losses for Whitewater to Loras and Carroll don't help, nor does Oshkosh's losses to Lawrence and Wartburg (all of those in-region losses).  But, with eight or nine non-conference games available, teams like Whitewater and Oshkosh (just to name the top teams) have to try to schedule more than half of those games as in-region! 

Like I said, I don't know what goes into scheduling games each season, and maybe they try their hardest.  Sometimes it's just tradition (like Point and La Crosse) playing Viterbo EVERY year, but these teams have to realize it doesn't help in the end, IMO.

Hopefully Loras and Carroll taught us that lesson 2K.

I'm sure you didn't take either of those teams lightly.  You guys seem to play Carroll every year and they are definitely the 2nd beat team in the MWC.  Loras is having a very good year and they were pretty decent last year as well.  I'm sure the loss to Loras is a little more surprising, but I guess it just wasn't your night!

Good luck.  I'm chearing for everything WIAC.  I want the WIAC to get two teams in the dance this year (doesn't look likely though).

Oh yeah, if you lose to Marian, I'm not sure if I can have any faith in Whitewater again.  They aren't very good at all.  2-8 in the LMC.

[John Gleich]

BW:
Don't let your guard down with Marian.  They can bite you in the behind if you take them for granted. 

Shocker of the season!!  Whitewater lets down their guard tonight and



... only beats Marian by 20.   

[Mr. Ypsi]

[N]oone is stepping up and saying "I'm a POWER".

I think Oshkosh *may* be doing that right now.  They've won 11 out of 12 and beaten Point and Whitewater, the next two teams in conference, as well as La Crosse.  The conference grind gets tough the next 3 games... the Titans have to go on the road to River Falls, La Crosse, and Stout, but the finish up the year with three in a row at home, before the conference tournament.  These last 3 games have the potential to really give them confidence going into the conference tournament IMO, where they, barring a collapse, host a minimum of one game.

I think this conference race is very similar to the race in 2001/2002 when Point, Whitewater, and Oshkosh tied for the regular season title.  There wasn't a clearly dominant team (no team really dominated... Oshkosh did beat Whitewater 3 times that season, but they split with Point, River Falls and La Crosse, and lost to Platteville twice... Whitewater beat Point 2 out of 3, and lost to Oshkosh 3 times, but split with Stout... Point split with Oshy and WW, but lost to Stout twice and split with La Crosse... La Crosse, who was in control of their own destiny, lost their last 2 games and first conf tourney game, all at home, and went from a one game lead to one game back... basically, it was all a jumble) but Oshkosh still made it to the Sweet 16.

I think that the rankings are not necessarily the best barometer of how the teams are playing *at a particular moment* in the season.  For instance, your Titans are ranked 5th in the country but just 4-3 in their last 7 games.  They are in 3rd (right now) in their own conference, it would be hard to argue that they still deserve the top 5 rating.  They are arguably a few bad bounces away from being 1-6 in conference and tied for last!

The WIAC Titans, however, like I said, have won 12 out of 13 and beaten the more touted conference foes.  Titan Q, on Hoopsville, has talked about the "body of work," for a team during a season... but one really needs to look at the immediate ramifacations of what's happened to properly judge the teams.

I just think back to 2002-2003.  The Gusties of Gustavus Adolphus had a record of 21-6, and had climbed to a #24 ranking... but they had won 11 out of 12 games heading into the NCAA tournament.  On their way to a National Runner-Up finish, they beat #12 Whitworth, my #8 Pointers, #7 Hanover, ORV Occidental, and #4 Hampden Sydney before relinqueshing an 8 point lead in the Nat. Champ game with 3 minutes to go against #3 Williams.  They were a HOT team who was hot at the right time... during mid-January, February, and March.

My point is this:  The WIAC grind gets teams prepared to play in big games, and which ever team makes it out, ESPECIALLY if the team is on a roll, will be a team not to take lightly.  Only three times in the last 8 seasons has EVERY WIAC team who has made the NCAA's gotten at least to the Sweet 16 (in 1998, Platteville beat Oshkosh in the second round enrout to a National Championship, in 2000, 4 seed Eau Claire got the auto-bid after being the ONLY higher seed to win in the first round of the conference tourney... and they made it to the second round of the NCAA's, and GAC beat UWSP in 2002, enrout to the Nat Runner-up I noted before).  During that span, WIAC teams won 4 National Championships, was Runner-up once, made 8 sweet 16's, and 7 elite 8's.

Could this be a year like 2000?  Sure, it could.  But I think there's a better chance that the WIAC rep(s) will do quite well against their NCAA opponents.

I won't argue against ANYTHING you said - due to what they've picked up in the 'killer' conference season, both WIAC and CCIW teams often exceed their rankings once the tourney starts (MY Titans have, alas, been the exception to the rule the last two years - ah, but 2001: 3rd in the CCIW, 3rd in the country!).

I STILL maintain that player by player, IWU has the most talent of any d3 team in the country, and (through December) it certainly looked like they were the best TEAM in the country.  SOMETHING has gone wrong in the last few weeks and I have have no idea what.  It's discouraging that (except for the 5 sq. in. video yesterday), I can't see them and get a feel for what's up.  I'm still cautiously optimistic that they will right the ship by tourney time.

But NO ONE wants to meet a WIAC team in the tourney (at least prior to Salem)!  Even if your top team(s) never make the top ten, the oddsmakers still say the likelihood of a WIAC team in Salem are pretty darn good!

[badgerwarhawk]

Poised for action and ever vigilant against letting down the WARHAWKS[/color] started the game with a 22-2 run, or something like that, and cruised after that (well, actually you could say they were cruising at that time too).  Every player was in the game, all but two for double digit minutes.   Tough defense held Marion to 24% from the floor and just 15 points in the first half though, to their credit, the Sabre shot a blistering 71% (20-28) from the floor in the second half cutting the spread to twenty, 83-63, in the end.

Craig Anderson led WHITEWATER[/color] with 13 points.  Josh King added 11 points and Andy Freund 10 points.  Kori Vernon saw his most extensive court time and finished with 9 points and a team high 6 rebounds in 21 minutes.  Ditto with Jack Simon who was productive with 6 points and 5 rebounds in 11 minutes.

Gio Riley had 4 steals converted into breakaway layups.  He's really picked up his defense and is giving us 2 or 3 of these baskets a game lately.  They're big momentum boosts, like a shot of adrenaline, and the team responds to them.   Riley leads the league with 37 steals despite averaging only 15 minutes of court time per game. 

All in all  not that much of a contest  but if Marion had shot both halves like the they did in the second one it would have been interesting.  The starters were rested and the backups got some court time.  They've been working hard all season so it was nice to see them get an opportunity. 

[Rico 21]

Buf -

There's no reason to foul when you constantly run the shot clock down to 5 - 10 seconds and then chuck up a 3.

[Rico 21]

Sorry, should have replied to Buf on the women's board...   rookie mistake!

[John Gleich]

Regardless if it's the men's or the women's board... it's a good point!

[Greek Tragedy]

Tough defense held Marion to 24% from the floor and just 15 points in the first half though, to their credit, the Sabre shot a blistering 71% (20-28) from the floor in the second half cutting the spread to twenty, 83-63, in the end.

All in all  not that much of a contest  but if Marion had shot both halves like the they did in the second one it would have been interesting.  The starters were rested and the backups got some court time.  They've been working hard all season so it was nice to see them get an opportunity. 

Two things:

1. Marion is in Indiana (I think).  Marian is in Fond du Lac 

2. I'm sure Marian shot a blistering 71% in the second half because Whitewater lead by 27 at the break and there was a little let down with the subs in.  Had Marian shot like that in the first half, I'm sure the starters would've played more than 15 minutes!  I seriously doubt coach would've let the game even get interesting in the first place!

[titan2000]

OS:

You are coddling those WW fans and trolling for karma.  Shame on you. 

[badgerwarhawk]

Tough defense held Marion to 24% from the floor and just 15 points in the first half though, to their credit, the Sabre shot a blistering 71% (20-28) from the floor in the second half cutting the spread to twenty, 83-63, in the end.

All in all  not that much of a contest  but if Marion had shot both halves like the they did in the second one it would have been interesting.  The starters were rested and the backups got some court time.  They've been working hard all season so it was nice to see them get an opportunity. 

2. I'm sure Marian shot a blistering 71% in the second half because Whitewater lead by 27 at the break and there was a little let down with the subs in.  Had Marian shot like that in the first half, I'm sure the starters would've played more than 15 minutes!  I seriously doubt coach would've let the game even get interesting in the first place!

Tough defense held Marion to 24% from the floor and just 15 points in the first half though, to their credit, the Sabre shot a blistering 71% (20-28) from the floor in the second half cutting the spread to twenty, 83-63, in the end.

All in all  not that much of a contest  but if Marion had shot both halves like the they did in the second one it would have been interesting.  The starters were rested and the backups got some court time.  They've been working hard all season so it was nice to see them get an opportunity. 

Two things:

1. Marion is in Indiana (I think).  Marian is in Fond du Lac 

2. I'm sure Marian shot a blistering 71% in the second half because Whitewater lead by 27 at the break and there was a little let down with the subs in.  Had Marian shot like that in the first half, I'm sure the starters would've played more than 15 minutes!  I seriously doubt coach would've let the game even get interesting in the first place!

OS,
I'm sure they would have played longer too.  But if a team can shoot 71% from the floor for an entire game the other coach will have a damned hard time keeping the game from getting interesting regardless of who he plays imo.   Not only that but they also substituted liberally, particularly in the second half so it wasn't like it was their starters kicking our subs.

You have to give them some credit.  It would have been a lot easier for them to simply tank it.

Oh ya,
1.  It's WHITEWATER[/color] led not "WHITEWATER[/color] lead."   I'm certain of that.