For what it may be worth: the Cleveland Clinic, Ohio's version of Minnesota's Mayo Clinic, has done a study that claims leather helmets are just as good as modern plastic ones in preventing concussions.
Go to http://www.uni-watch.com and scroll down to Uni Watch News Ticker, the first item.
If true, bring back the "leatherheads," I say. It would be nice to see Princeton, Michigan State, and Michigan, e.g., in the original versions of the winged helmet. :)
warren, i was having this discussion today during lunch. we got to talking football and I mentioned that with all the changes in helmets why does it seem like there are just as many or more concussions. i know all about the size and speed of the players, but you would think that the changes would decrease them.
I think the biggest problem is that the modern helmets make the players feel indestructible - and since people that age (especially males) feel indestructible anyway .... :P
I suspect a player in a leather helmet is MUCH less likely to lead with his head than one in modern plastic.
As a hockey fan, as well as a football fan, I think Ypsi has it right. The quality of the protective gear, including, but not limited to, helmets, has increased their use as "weapons" - either intended or not. I also played rugby, with no pads, and the incidence of severe injury was relatively rare. You always knew you were vulnerable, and there was a subconscious aversion to putting yourself in unsafe positions.
I'm not sure what the solution is, but the players themselves have to have respect for the damage they can do before anything gets better.
Quote from: retagent on November 07, 2011, 11:31:58 PM
I also played rugby, with no pads, and the incidence of severe injury was relatively rare. You always knew you were vulnerable, and there was a subconscious aversion to putting yourself in unsafe positions.
I'm not sure what the solution is, but the players themselves have to have respect for the damage they can do before anything gets better.
I played rugby too. You are taught to tackle much differently in rugby because you don't have the pads. If you watched any of the rugby world cup this summer you noticed that tackles look more like wrestling moves than violent collisions. If we could get coaches to teach that, and the pros to endorse it, the incidence of injury in football would drop. Of course, it would dramatically impact ESPN highlights and video game manufacturers who thrive on punishing hits.
I have thought for some time that the research in automobile crash survivability should be applied to helmet construction. Cars are constructed with parts that have a progressive crush-ability. The old leather helmets had some of the same flexibility. I think the rigid modern helmets should have a 1/4" or 3/8" softer outer layer to reduce the sudden impact effects. The softening effect of the two helmets, plus the additional interior padding should have a significant reduction in the trauma sustained by soft brain tissue as it tries to bounce about in the rigid skull container. I hope some research will be done on this matter. Any takers?
From the Helmet Project:
"*1 The "red stripe" on these helmets actually consisted of some extra padding worn on the exterior of the helmet shell, making this a physical feature of the helmet rather than just an "artistic" one. Ohio State used this helmet style during at least the period 1960 through 1965, and possibly earlier, but it has been reported to me that from 1960 through 1963, the "padding only came halfway down the back of the helmet". The other colleges known to have apparently used this "padded" helmet design (all at about the same time as did Ohio State) are Ohio University, Fresno State, Duke, Harvard, and Brigham Young."
http://www.nationalchamps.net/Helmet_Project/
The stripe was 4-5 inches wide.
Quote from: wildcatter23 on November 23, 2011, 12:30:12 AM
I have thought for some time that the research in automobile crash survivability should be applied to helmet construction. Cars are constructed with parts that have a progressive crush-ability. The old leather helmets had some of the same flexibility. I think the rigid modern helmets should have a 1/4" or 3/8" softer outer layer to reduce the sudden impact effects. The softening effect of the two helmets, plus the additional interior padding should have a significant reduction in the trauma sustained by soft brain tissue as it tries to bounce about in the rigid skull container. I hope some research will be done on this matter. Any takers?
The reasoning I've heard against this is that the outer shell is designed to make it so that two helmets strikings against each other glance off. Adding an outer layer could reduce concussions, but it could also result in an increase in neck injuries. That being said, I'm sure the design of the helmet could be improved upon in some way to reduce concussions without sacrificing elsewhere.
I know it has been said before but, teach and encourage PROPER Tackling form.
Too many young players try to blow up the ballcarrier and make ESPN type hits, rather than use proper tackling form and wrap up.
I once heard that modern helmet design and resultant testing are to protect players primarily from skull fractures, not from concussions per se. Can anyone either confirm this statement or let me throw it in the trash bin?
I believe most are looking at the problem all wrong. Yes there are lots of ideas here that will help but what you need to do is to go back to the era when it was encouraged to have head to head contact and ask why are more suffering concussions nowadays. I will say yes the forty times are faster now but the five yard times of linemen of the 70's and eighties were much faster. Also had the added speed of exploding into the opponent. We had many more cracked helmets or ruined helmets. My generation was copying Jack Tatum the "Assassin", by throwing your shoulder into the helmet by punching the air to the right or left of the player. We had inferior helmets. I started out with a helmet with two ear cushions and the head was protected by a 6" circle connected by straps. absolutely no head cushioning. How did every team do it? They did front and reverse side to side neck bridges. Many of us brought a helmet home year round to do them. Although it can be done without them as wrestlers do. My nickname was the Assassin. I knocked myself out twice and many others. Had many many running back and QB teammates throw the ball at me after a tackle. That bragging aside the purpose is that it the pressure on the top of the head while doing neck bridges is superior to that of the various neck machines of today. PROOF: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wE40JEoNCrk
The pressure over time will cause a thicker more dense skull as stated in the video. I can still punch a brick wall as hard as I can and not feel any pain or injuries at age 46. I have some freak bones in my hands do to all the punching helmets and walls as a kid before football games. I know its weird but its what we did back in the day. I survived a car accident that I had no business surviving. Which I thank God for everyday. A semi-truck went into my lane pushing my car into a ditch about eight feet deep. The truck only did minor damage to the car while my body destroyed and totaled the car. I went through the windshield were the mirror is while twisting twisting through the shoulder strap and had my left hip and pelvis torn off along with every muscle except the quad. I had no concussion or head pain at all. While my head and hip made the top of the car look like a triangle instead of the flat normal shape. A normal persons head would be cracked in many places but I only had a cut on my nose. Those neck bridges had something to do with not having a concussion.
So I would suggest neck bridges front, back side to side. Also the other area we learned from world record holding power lifters was strong stomach muscles protect you from pulling the back muscles. Also they help absorb massive shock. We would get on the incline board with the 100lb weight on our stomach and do situps, some with twists. I find it hard to believe all the big massive lineman who get ankle, shoulder injuries and concussions. They are just not preparing right point blank. One last comment on the level of competition we faced. Although I was extremely anti steroid and lifted in the American drug free power lifting association we played in the steroid era. So many of the elite athletes were doing steroids and cock tales of steroids since there were gyms that would point the athlete in that direction. My point is that there was some very hard hitting in the day. Many of the hardest NFL hits came from that era. There were different rules. We survived hard hits by doing the right things today's players are not effectively doing things to prevent injuries.
Guys -- something to remember here. It's not necessarily that there are more concussions today than there were in the past. It's that we know what to look for. Watch a 70s or early 80s era college football game. Some guy goes to the sideline and the announcer says something along the lines of, "boy he got his bell wrung!" You'll see the guy dizzy on the sideline with a trainer talking to him for a few minutes, and then he goes back in the game and generally plays poorly for a few plays until he straightens himself out or the coach pulls him for "being a pansy."
The guy had a concussion. He probably couldn't see straight, and the trainer probably told him to buck up and get back in the game when he was able to stand. He could have some aspirin at halftime. Check out the studies being done on the NFLers from the 40s through the 70s who have donated their brains, post mortem obviously, to study the issue as well as the 100 living players that have also agreed to be studied. The news is GRIM. When you look at the money the NFL is suddenly throwing at the problem, hundreds of thousands of dollars and independent and league sponsored research, you know there is a big problem developing.
These guys took a pounding and I guarantee they had many, many concussions. It just wasn't treated with the same severity as it is treated today. There is no help in history here. The only way to lessen this kind of injury is to teach good, fundamental, heads up, wrap up, tackling. No more throwing the body around like a weapon. You can't make a helmet that is going to prevent damage from two large bodies running full speed and smacking on hard (helmet to helmet or helmet to ground) surfaces.
As for the poster who said that he knocked himself out twice but didn't get a concussion because he did neck bridges... if you knocked yourself out from a hit, you got a concussion. Ask a doctor...
I think they have to eliminate the "cage" type facemasks, go back to single and double bar, double bar with bullring. People will not be so willing to lead with their face.
I'm not a doctor, but even I know jknezek is right. Knocked out (lost consciousness) = concussion.
Interesting little article about Toradol and concussions.
http://www.nj.com/giants/index.ssf/2011/12/former_nfl_players_say_they_di.html
Is this ever done on the D-3 level?
More on CWRU, Cleveland Clinic, and concussions.
http://www.cleveland.com/science/index.ssf/2012/02/new_cleveland_clinic-cwru_lab.html
I believe Rochester Univ. school of medicine is conducting a study similar to that of Purdue. They are looking at repeated hits vs. concussion type hits.
They are -- we did a story about it in September:
http://www.d3football.com/columns/around-the-region/east/2011/studying-the-football-brain
Wondering if anyone else saw PBS Frontline's League of Denial program last night about concussions, brain damage (CTE), and NFL's apparent cover-up?
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/
Or maybe some of you have looked into the book?
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fecx.images-amazon.com%2Fimages%2FI%2F51dSnD1HqyL._SX258_BO1%2C204%2C203%2C200_.jpg&hash=fdeb4b1018eeb673cdee673f229b8f8d5197e9ba)
http://www.amazon.com/League-Denial-Concussions-Battle-Truth/dp/0804128170
Very interesting indeed. Not sure I should have let my wife watch with me if I want our son to ever play the sport.
Players Just Wore This Startup's New Soft Helmets in an NFL Preseason Game
https://www.inc.com/kevin-j-ryan/nfl-players-wear-soft-vicis-helmets-in-game.html
A start-up company with new technology in helmet design.
We may see this new helmet at all levels of the game in the next 3-5 years.
I am sure that the investors will want the highest level of medical evidence before it gets below the highest levels of the game.
A simple collar might save football players, and our nation's heroes, from concussions
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/a-simple-collar-might-save-football-players-and-our-nations-heroes-from-concussions
For your consideration...
The physiology looks fascinating and like it might work.