Love to hear people's thoughts on D3 All Americans.
These are some players to consider and watch play in my opinion based on talking to people around the country:
Blayde Reich (York, PA)
Spencer Levi (U of Dallas)
Aaron McFarland (CNU)
Thomas Bonacum (Ramapo)
Jay Howard (Catholic)
Spencer Cook (Stevens)
James Heskett (Williams)
Tim Howell (Whitman)
Travion Kirkendoll (Centenary)
Robby Dooley (ETBU)
Well, guest323, it seems you may have missed the Central region, with the likes of several CCIW and WIAC candidates, and a Wash U player, as well as...
Shea Feehan of Eureka, who may be the 1st SLIAC player to merit consideration... ever....
Chad Roy (Wittenberg)
From New England, the top candidates, in no particular order, are:
Jake Ross, Springfield
Jack Daly, Middlebury
James Heskett, Williams
Jaqhawn Walters, Albertus Magnus
Raheem Anderson, Husson
Marcos Echevarria, Nichols
Tarchee Brown, Eastern Conn
Bradley Jomard, MIT
Ty Nichols, Keene State
I'm guessing if the season ended today, all nine of those guys would be on all-region first and second teams, in some order. In fact, I'd say there is a fairly steep drop off after that group of 9, unless I'm forgetting someone ... outside of NESCAC, the most impressive players I've seen play this year (all vs. NESCAC teams) were Walters, Brown, Swarthmore's Cam Wiley, Ross (who to be fair I saw during the midst of a bit of a down stretch of play for him, he may have been banged up, at his best he is surely as good as anyone), Hamline's Zach Smith and Stevens' Spencer Cook, in that order.
Quote from: hopefan on January 30, 2018, 05:43:34 AM
Well, guest323, it seems you may have missed the Central region, with the likes of several CCIW and WIAC candidates, and a Wash U player, as well as...
Shea Feehan of Eureka, who may be the 1st SLIAC player to merit consideration... ever....
Not ever.
http://www.d3hoops.com/awards/all-americans/men/1998
http://www.d3hoops.com/awards/all-americans/men/2009
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 30, 2018, 11:33:26 AM
Quote from: hopefan on January 30, 2018, 05:43:34 AM
Well, guest323, it seems you may have missed the Central region, with the likes of several CCIW and WIAC candidates, and a Wash U player, as well as...
Shea Feehan of Eureka, who may be the 1st SLIAC player to merit consideration... ever....
Not ever.
http://www.d3hoops.com/awards/all-americans/men/1998
http://www.d3hoops.com/awards/all-americans/men/2009
I almost thought you had committed the cardinal sin of confusing McMurry with MacMurray until I realized the egg was on my face. I had simply skipped past the first team, assuming no SLIAC player would've ever been on one. Of course 1998 does predate my awareness of d3 by a couple years, so I'm giving myself a convenient excuse.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on January 30, 2018, 12:39:38 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 30, 2018, 11:33:26 AM
Quote from: hopefan on January 30, 2018, 05:43:34 AM
Well, guest323, it seems you may have missed the Central region, with the likes of several CCIW and WIAC candidates, and a Wash U player, as well as...
Shea Feehan of Eureka, who may be the 1st SLIAC player to merit consideration... ever....
Not ever.
http://www.d3hoops.com/awards/all-americans/men/1998
http://www.d3hoops.com/awards/all-americans/men/2009
I almost thought you had committed the cardinal sin of confusing McMurry with MacMurray until I realized the egg was on my face. I had simply skipped past the first team, assuming no SLIAC player would've ever been on one. Of course 1998 does predate my awareness of d3 by a couple years, so I'm giving myself a convenient excuse.
Good job Pat... I got lazy and didn't look up the facts before I commented... I Should have remembered both of those guys!!!!
Sam Toney from NJCU is also worthy of consideration. Here is a story from the front page about his path to NJCU, very inspirational.
http://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2017-18/contrib/20180130xelrj7
Obviously Whitman won't have three All-Americans, but Joey Hewitt and Austin Butler should be in the conversation along with Tim Howell. Howell is still the guy they'll turn to when they need a bucket, but Hewitt has been very impressive all year and Butler just does it all. Butler is leading Whitman, in steals, blocks, rebounds, and assists, while shooting 68% from the floor. He's really amazing to watch out there!
Tyheim Monroe is pretty much a lock, probably for first team. Dude is a double double machine.
Nate Axelrod of OWU is also a good bet for All-American selection.
Others out of Ohio that haven't been mentioned yet, but more of an outside shot of AA status:
- The duo of ONU Burger and Bruns (both are over 24 ppg, what is the most points a duo has averaged in a single year. Pretty impressive by these two)
- Dempsey, Muskingum
- Kuhn, BWU
- Matthew, John Carroll
Aston Francis of Wheaton was Pre-Season All-American and having a tremendous year, so we will be seeing him on either 1st or 2nd teams, more than likely.
Elsewhere in the Central, we have some good candidates:
- Brady Rose for a top #15 IWU squad, leading the CCIW
- Sorenson, NCC
- Herink, UW-RF
West Region may not have too many AA nods this year but here is a short list:
- Kevin Grow, Carleton
- Tyler Weiss, #4 SJU
- Josh Ruggles, Loras
- Douglas, UM-Morris (UMAC and not a great team so he won't get recognized but has some real solid numbers)
Not trying to be negative, but I'm not sure why Marcos Echevarria is even listed as an All-American candidate at this point in the season. There are three players I can list off the top of my head from the CCC who are having overall better seasons than him (Keith Brown of Endicott, Austin Coene of Roger Williams, and Eric Demers of Gordon). Maybe he is just being considered more because he plays on a better team that gets more national recognition but the three other players I listed all play on teams that are at least 6 games above .500 as well. Marcos is a great player but compared to last year he is simply underperforming (barely shooting above 40% from the field).
Some of you may already know this, but we did an All-American pool prior to the season starting. So this is like that one, but midseason. It's in the Fantasy League tab if anyone is interested to see who we picked in November.
Echeverria is certainly putting up all-American numbers: 22-4-5 plus 2 spg, on 42/43/80 shooting. His true shooting percentage is very high when you consider how many 3's he attempts (well more than half his attempts). Keith Brown is having a tremendous year but his team was blown out twice by Nichols, and players tend to get rewarded for team success. I would not say he is having a better individual season statistically, either -- 25-5-2 plus 1 spg, on 46/42/73 shooting. I'd call that basically a wash. Demers, likewise, is just a tad behind Echeverria statistically, on a worse team.
Coene's stats are off-the-charts good, for sure: 24-7-3.5, 2 spg, 56/49/73. He suffers too from playing on a team that hasn't made, and is not likely to make, regional, let alone national, noise (they have also lost twice to Nichols), but based on stats alone he is worthy of all-regional consideration and as a junior will certainly be on the short list for all-American as a senior if he keeps improving. Still, ultimately team success matters, especially for players who play in a low-profile conference that is almost certain to be a one-bid league, and Echeverria has led his team to the front of the league, despite some adversity (the second-best player on the team missing a good chunk of time, including both league losses). Also, Nichols has tested itself vs. Wesleyan and Trinity ... Roger Williams, on the other hand, has played no one of consquence (outside of Nichols).
Here is the list of our All American predictions...before the season started. The requirement was that they couldn't be listed on the D3hoops.com preseason list.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on November 15, 2017, 03:28:49 PM
Looks like we got 10 posters participating.
| Player | Votes |
| Pace | 8 |
| Sanders | 7 |
| Nichols | 6 |
| Rose | 5 |
| Scadlock | 5 |
| Ekekeugbor | 4 |
| Kenny | 4 |
| McCarthy | 4 |
| Roach | 4 |
| Neal | 3 |
| Schimonitz | 3 |
| Sortillo | 3 |
| Traub | 3 |
| Carter | 2 |
| Cooper | 2 |
| Daly | 2 |
| Federici | 2 |
| Feehan | 2 |
| Hawkins | 2 |
| Long | 2 |
| Moore | 2 |
| Murdock | 2 |
| Simonds | 2 |
| Boll | 1 |
| Brown | 1 |
| Bruton | 1 |
| Colhoff | 1 |
| Davis | 1 |
| Fails | 1 |
| Hewitt | 1 |
| Highsmith | 1 |
| Jomard | 1 |
| Jones | 1 |
| Light | 1 |
| Meinholz | 1 |
| Orr | 1 |
| Rapoza | 1 |
| Scibelli | 1 |
| Smith | 1 |
| Stenglein | 1 |
| Thomasson | 1 |
| Tyler | 1 |
| Weiss | 1 |
| Wind | 1 |
| POTY | Votes |
| Howell* | 3 |
| Axelrod* | 2 |
| Bonacum* | 1 |
| Monroe* | 1 |
| Rupkus* | 1 |
| Sorenson* | 1 |
| Walters* | 1 |
| Rookie | Votes |
| Williams** | 3 |
| Perkins** | 2 |
| Guitierrez** | 1 |
| Jordan** | 1 |
| Preston** | 1 |
| Robinson** | 1 |
| Uzorh** | 1 |
And this is D3hoops' preseason AA
Do you think all the good players are taken? Of the 25 preseason All-Americans selected last year, only 10 made the list at the end of the year. Harvey and Blackledge made 1st team, Herink and Jack for 2nd team and Howell and Bonacum made 3rd team, all without getting preseason nods. Plenty of guys to choose from.
http://www.d3hoops.com/awards/all-americans/men/preseason-2018
First team
Pos. Player School Year Hometown
G Nate Axelrod Ohio Wesleyan Sr. Dublin, Ohio
G Tim Howell Whitman Sr. Calabasas, Calif.
G/F Wes McKinney Hanover Sr. Batesville, Ind.
F Thomas Bonacum Ramapo Sr. Fanwood, N.J.
F Alex Herink Wis.-River Falls Sr. Hudson, Wis.
Second team
Pos. Player School Year Hometown
G Aston Francis Wheaton (Ill.) Jr. Tyler, Texas
G Chrishawn Orange Augustana Jr. Algonquin, Ill.
G Edvinas Rupkus Skidmore Jr. Naujoji Akmene, Lithuania
F Tyheim Monroe Cabrini Sr. Philadephia, Pa.
F Alex Sorenson North Central (Ill.) Sr. Dunlap, Ill.
Third team
Pos. Player School Year Hometown
G Raheem Anderson Husson Sr. Miramar, Fla.
G Marcos Echevarria Nichols Jr. Lynn, Mass.
G Michael Scarlett Claremont-Mudd-Scripps Sr. Irvine, Calif.
F Cooper Cook Nebraska Wesleyan Jr. Overland Park, Kan.
F Connor Raridon North Central (Ill.) So. Plainfield, Ill.
Fourth team
Pos. Player School Year Hometown
G Jake Ross Springfield So. Northampton, Mass.
G David Stokman St. John's Jr. Maple Lake, Minn.
G Cam Wiley Swarthmore Jr. Atlanta, Ga.
F Adam Gigax Emory Sr. Mason, Ohio
C Patrick MacDonald SUNY-Maritime Sr. Buffalo, N.Y.
Honorable mention
Pos. Player School Year Hometown
G Nick Comenale Babson Sr. New York Mills, N.Y.
G Chris Jones UW-Whitewater Sr. Milwaukee, Wis.
G Rich Ross Wells Jr. Bronx, N.Y.
F Jaqhawn Walters Albertus Magnus Jr. Hartford, Conn.
F Jay Howard Catholic
Quote from: nescac1 on January 31, 2018, 04:10:50 PM
Echeverria is certainly putting up all-American numbers: 22-4-5 plus 2 spg, on 42/43/80 shooting. His true shooting percentage is very high when you consider how many 3's he attempts (well more than half his attempts). Keith Brown is having a tremendous year but his team was blown out twice by Nichols, and players tend to get rewarded for team success. I would not say he is having a better individual season statistically, either -- 25-5-2 plus 1 spg, on 46/42/73 shooting. I'd call that basically a wash. Demers, likewise, is just a tad behind Echeverria statistically, on a worse team.
Coene's stats are off-the-charts good, for sure: 24-7-3.5, 2 spg, 56/49/73. He suffers too from playing on a team that hasn't made, and is not likely to make, regional, let alone national, noise (they have also lost twice to Nichols), but based on stats alone he is worthy of all-regional consideration and as a junior will certainly be on the short list for all-American as a senior if he keeps improving. Still, ultimately team success matters, especially for players who play in a low-profile conference that is almost certain to be a one-bid league, and Echeverria has led his team to the front of the league, despite some adversity (the second-best player on the team missing a good chunk of time, including both league losses). Also, Nichols has tested itself vs. Wesleyan and Trinity ... Roger Williams, on the other hand, has played no one of consquence (outside of Nichols).
Well written response Nescac1. I actually took a look at his numbers from the field compared to last year after I wrote my initial post and was dumbfounded to see he didn't even shoot 40% from the field. He has actually improved in every single offensive category compared to last year, minus free throw shooting percentage. So my apologies for not doing my research before making that statement. I think I may have overlooked Echevarria's performance this year due to the improved play by the other three players I mentioned. It certainly makes sense that All-American selection depends on how well the team the player is on is doing.
I would definitely agree based on stats that Austin Coene deserves recognition for at least an All-Region selection this year. RWU had a rough streak of four losses in a row against the best teams in the CCC the other week, with the combined losses by an average of four points. They have now seemed to get back on track, granted against the lower half of the CCC, winners of three straight. We will see how they fair against Wentworth in Boston on Saturday as they look to climb back into the Top 3 of the CCC. They will likely be without senior playmaker Jaylen Jennings who sprained his ankle in their win against UNE this past week.
Thanks, D3ball1845. I must admit I'd never before heard about Coene, let alone see him play. Definitely someone to watch for in the future, his stats are crazy good.
Quote from: nescac1 on February 01, 2018, 09:48:36 AM
Thanks, D3ball1845. I must admit I'd never before heard about Coene, let alone see him play. Definitely someone to watch for in the future, his stats are crazy good.
The only teams who get real exposure from the CCC are Endicott and Nichols. That's why you have heard about Keith Brown and Marcos Echevarria. Coene has the same amount of 30+ point games as Keith Brown does this year, each having 5. Coene and Brown battled it out in a double overtime game the first time their teams clashed this season, in which Coene scored 38 points and Brown scored 53. In their most recent wins on Tuesday night, Coene scored 41 against Salve Regina and Brown scored 43 against Western New England. Nescac1, I'm not sure where you're from but Endicott and Roger Williams play each other again in Bristol, RI on 02/17/2018 at 3:00 PM. It will definitely be a fun game to watch in what should be an important matchup for both teams before the conference tournament that features two of the top 15 scorers in Division 3 basketball.
Josh Ruggles of Loras are both having outstanding years for the Duhawks. Ruggles, last I checked, was the ONLY D3 players at 50/40/90, he is one of the most efficient players I've seen in years. Teammate Ryan DiCanio is also having a crazy year, averaging 17 pts, 7 rebounds, nearly 5 assists per game for the Duhawks.
Quote from: dunkin3117 on February 02, 2018, 09:52:22 AM
Josh Ruggles of Loras are both having outstanding years for the Duhawks. Ruggles, last I checked, was the ONLY D3 players at 50/40/90, he is one of the most efficient players I've seen in years. Teammate Ryan DiCanio is also having a crazy year, averaging 17 pts, 7 rebounds, nearly 5 assists per game for the Duhawks.
OK, I don't understand some of the newer stat measurements... what does 50/40/90 mean? Thanks
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on January 31, 2018, 05:02:50 PM
Here is the list of our All American predictions...before the season started. The requirement was that they couldn't be listed on the D3hoops.com preseason list.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on November 15, 2017, 03:28:49 PM
Looks like we got 10 posters participating.
| Player | Votes |
| Pace | 8 |
| Sanders | 7 |
| Nichols | 6 |
| Rose | 5 |
| Scadlock | 5 |
| Ekekeugbor | 4 |
| Kenny | 4 |
| McCarthy | 4 |
| Roach | 4 |
| Neal | 3 |
| Schimonitz | 3 |
| Sortillo | 3 |
| Traub | 3 |
| Carter | 2 |
| Cooper | 2 |
| Daly | 2 |
| Federici | 2 |
| Feehan | 2 |
| Hawkins | 2 |
| Long | 2 |
| Moore | 2 |
| Murdock | 2 |
| Simonds | 2 |
| Boll | 1 |
| Brown | 1 |
| Bruton | 1 |
| Colhoff | 1 |
| Davis | 1 |
| Fails | 1 |
| Hewitt | 1 |
| Highsmith | 1 |
| Jomard | 1 |
| Jones | 1 |
| Light | 1 |
| Meinholz | 1 |
| Orr | 1 |
| Rapoza | 1 |
| Scibelli | 1 |
| Smith | 1 |
| Stenglein | 1 |
| Thomasson | 1 |
| Tyler | 1 |
| Weiss | 1 |
| Wind | 1 |
| POTY | Votes |
| Howell* | 3 |
| Axelrod* | 2 |
| Bonacum* | 1 |
| Monroe* | 1 |
| Rupkus* | 1 |
| Sorenson* | 1 |
| Walters* | 1 |
| Rookie | Votes |
| Williams** | 3 |
| Perkins** | 2 |
| Guitierrez** | 1 |
| Jordan** | 1 |
| Preston** | 1 |
| Robinson** | 1 |
| Uzorh** | 1 |
That's not really very helpful, though, because it's just a list of surnames. Any posts in this room should include the player's full name and his school, because this is a multi-regional room and readers can't be expected to be able to identify each and every good player in the nation simply by surname alone.
Quote from: hopefan on February 02, 2018, 10:50:37 AM
Quote from: dunkin3117 on February 02, 2018, 09:52:22 AM
Josh Ruggles of Loras are both having outstanding years for the Duhawks. Ruggles, last I checked, was the ONLY D3 players at 50/40/90, he is one of the most efficient players I've seen in years. Teammate Ryan DiCanio is also having a crazy year, averaging 17 pts, 7 rebounds, nearly 5 assists per game for the Duhawks.
OK, I don't understand some of the newer stat measurements... what does 50/40/90 mean? Thanks
Those are shooting splits. He's averaging at or above 50% FG, 40% trey, and 90% FT.
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 02, 2018, 10:56:57 AM
Quote from: hopefan on February 02, 2018, 10:50:37 AM
Quote from: dunkin3117 on February 02, 2018, 09:52:22 AM
Josh Ruggles of Loras are both having outstanding years for the Duhawks. Ruggles, last I checked, was the ONLY D3 players at 50/40/90, he is one of the most efficient players I've seen in years. Teammate Ryan DiCanio is also having a crazy year, averaging 17 pts, 7 rebounds, nearly 5 assists per game for the Duhawks.
OK, I don't understand some of the newer stat measurements... what does 50/40/90 mean? Thanks
Great... thanks....
Those are shooting splits. He's averaging at or above 50% FG, 40% trey, and 90% FT.
Quote from: dunkin3117 on February 02, 2018, 09:52:22 AM
Josh Ruggles of Loras are both having outstanding years for the Duhawks. Ruggles, last I checked, was the ONLY D3 players at 50/40/90, he is one of the most efficient players I've seen in years. Teammate Ryan DiCanio is also having a crazy year, averaging 17 pts, 7 rebounds, nearly 5 assists per game for the Duhawks.
If that threshold qualifies you, then Jason Beckman of Hope is a definite candidate. 50.3/43.3/94.5 are his percentages and he is averaging 22.4pts, 2.6 reb, 2.4 ast per game.
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 02, 2018, 10:53:06 AM
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on January 31, 2018, 05:02:50 PM
Here is the list of our All American predictions...before the season started. The requirement was that they couldn't be listed on the D3hoops.com preseason list.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on November 15, 2017, 03:28:49 PM
Looks like we got 10 posters participating.
| Player | Votes |
| Pace | 8 |
| Sanders | 7 |
| Nichols | 6 |
| Rose | 5 |
| Scadlock | 5 |
| Ekekeugbor | 4 |
| Kenny | 4 |
| McCarthy | 4 |
| Roach | 4 |
| Neal | 3 |
| Schimonitz | 3 |
| Sortillo | 3 |
| Traub | 3 |
| Carter | 2 |
| Cooper | 2 |
| Daly | 2 |
| Federici | 2 |
| Feehan | 2 |
| Hawkins | 2 |
| Long | 2 |
| Moore | 2 |
| Murdock | 2 |
| Simonds | 2 |
| Boll | 1 |
| Brown | 1 |
| Bruton | 1 |
| Colhoff | 1 |
| Davis | 1 |
| Fails | 1 |
| Hewitt | 1 |
| Highsmith | 1 |
| Jomard | 1 |
| Jones | 1 |
| Light | 1 |
| Meinholz | 1 |
| Orr | 1 |
| Rapoza | 1 |
| Scibelli | 1 |
| Smith | 1 |
| Stenglein | 1 |
| Thomasson | 1 |
| Tyler | 1 |
| Weiss | 1 |
| Wind | 1 |
| POTY | Votes |
| Howell* | 3 |
| Axelrod* | 2 |
| Bonacum* | 1 |
| Monroe* | 1 |
| Rupkus* | 1 |
| Sorenson* | 1 |
| Walters* | 1 |
| Rookie | Votes |
| Williams** | 3 |
| Perkins** | 2 |
| Guitierrez** | 1 |
| Jordan** | 1 |
| Preston** | 1 |
| Robinson** | 1 |
| Uzorh** | 1 |
That's not really very helpful, though, because it's just a list of surnames. Any posts in this room should include the player's full name and his school, because this is a multi-regional room and readers can't be expected to be able to identify each and every good player in the nation simply by surname alone.
Fair enough. I'll try to get something up this weekend...
Quote from: Flying Dutch Fan on February 02, 2018, 12:03:16 PM
Quote from: dunkin3117 on February 02, 2018, 09:52:22 AM
Josh Ruggles of Loras are both having outstanding years for the Duhawks. Ruggles, last I checked, was the ONLY D3 players at 50/40/90, he is one of the most efficient players I've seen in years. Teammate Ryan DiCanio is also having a crazy year, averaging 17 pts, 7 rebounds, nearly 5 assists per game for the Duhawks.
If that threshold qualifies you, then Jason Beckman of Hope is a definite candidate. 50.3/43.3/94.5 are his percentages and he is averaging 22.4pts, 2.6 reb, 2.4 ast per game.
Ruggles is also averaging just under 5 boards and 4 assists/game while commiting less than 30 TO on the season
http://miacathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2017-18/players/collinolmscheidqjyq
Collin Olmsheid is also now in the 50/40/90 club. He is having a great senior season for the Auggies and a great article was just released about him on d3hoops.com.
If this was a 2019-2020 All American Predictions thread, I might add Jack Nolan. He is shooting 53% from the field, 49% from three and 93% from the line.
Quote from: WUH on February 02, 2018, 04:06:29 PM
If this was a 2019-2020 All American Predictions thread, I might add Jack Nolan. He is shooting 53% from the field, 49% from three and 93% from the line.
I think he will be a 1st Team All-American as a sophomore.
Quote from: Titan Q on February 02, 2018, 04:54:17 PM
Quote from: WUH on February 02, 2018, 04:06:29 PM
If this was a 2019-2020 All American Predictions thread, I might add Jack Nolan. He is shooting 53% from the field, 49% from three and 93% from the line.
I think he will be a 1st Team All-American as a sophomore.
WOW... a bold prediction... but noteworthy coming from TQ!!!
I'm not convinced that Jack Nolan is even the best freshman in his conference. Nolan is the better shooter, but Romin Williams of Emory is a force of nature unto himself. I've watched him online several times, and I can't figure out where his ceiling is as a player.
A few people have told me that Quentin Shields of UW-Platteville is the quickest freshman that they've seen this year. But I've seen both, and Williams makes Shields look like he's standing still.
Quote from: Titan Q on February 02, 2018, 04:54:17 PM
Quote from: WUH on February 02, 2018, 04:06:29 PM
If this was a 2019-2020 All American Predictions thread, I might add Jack Nolan. He is shooting 53% from the field, 49% from three and 93% from the line.
I think he will be a 1st Team All-American as a sophomore.
Respectfully disagree, but do not dispute his talent.
WashU is losing a huge senior class and I'm pretty sure all of their starters. I will admit that I don't have insider knowledge of their bench, but I would guess Jack will need to be the primary scorer on what may be a younger team, which will get him a lot opportunities, but Will WashU have some good secondary options as scorers next year? I guess that will play out. If not, good coaches will game plan for him making it extremely difficult. If he does become an All American, he will certainly have earned it.
http://d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2017-18/boxscores/20180202_8d99.xml
Kirkendoll > Levi
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 02, 2018, 10:00:37 PM
I'm not convinced that Jack Nolan is even the best freshman in his conference. Nolan is the better shooter, but Romin Williams of Emory is a force of nature unto himself. I've watched him online several times, and I can't figure out where his ceiling is as a player.
This is old news at this point.
I think I referred to him as the UAA newcomer of the year before he played his first Division III opponent. That prediction willl stand, but Williams is not exactly running away with it.
Williams is averaging 16 points per game overall and 14 points per game in the conference while Nolan is averaging 12 points per game overall and 13 points per game in conference. Washington University had the more difficult non-conference schedule by a margin.
Williams is playing a few minutes more, but the rest of the stats are not extraordinarily different. Williams has twice as many assists, but he turns the ball over just as often.
However, these two players are expected to play
very different roles on
very different teams.
I am not sure if the committees discriminates on the basis of conference affiliation when choosing the all-Americans, but maybe it is time for the league to feature two all-Americans.
Sam Toney from NJCU is a lock to be the NJAC Player of the Year as a sophomore and should on this list of All-Americans. In the NJAC alone he already has scored 30+ points five times, including 42 at Ramapo.
Even more amazing when you consider his life story:
https://www.mycentraljersey.com/story/sports/nj-hoops-haven/2018/01/30/homeless-to-hoops-stardom-sam-toneys-inspiring-journey-to-njcu/109932438/
Jon Patron, junior forward at Plattsburgh State, wasn't on anybody's radar early on as he had to sit out the first semester because he lost a half year when he transferred to Plattsburgh in 2015. He missed the first 8 games that Plattsburgh played and the Cardinals went 4-4. Since he joined the team on December 30th they have went 19-0 and now have the longest current winning streak in men's basketball, all divisions.
Patron is averaging 23.7 points per game and 10.4 rebounds per game. He has scored 426 points this season and now has 1244 career points. He is on pace to break the all time Plattsburgh State career points mark, held by former D3hoops All American Anthony Williams(2005 to 2008).
Jon saved his best for last weekend's SUNYAC Final Four as he had 35 points and 13 rebounds against Oswego State on Friday. He followed that with a 41 point, 9 rebound performance, in the Championship game on Saturday, against Oneonta, as the Cardinals claimed the Conference Tournament title to go along with their regular season crown. Jon was a combined 31x44 from the field, 4x6 from downtown, and 10x12 from the line. He was the MVP of the tournament and has won the SUNYAC player of the week award on 4 other occasions this year. He will most likely be named the MVP of the SUNYAC conference in the next few days. Three weeks ago he was on the D3hoops Team of the Week and his stats this past weekend certainly merit consideration for this week's award. Hopefully, the folks at D3hoops will see fit to bestow All American status on this outstanding player.
Rookie of the Year candidates are always the most difficult to parse out. Off the top of my head, I'd want to consider:
Romin Williams - Emory
Jack Nolan - WashU
Spencer Levi - UDallas
Darne Duckett - Whitman
I'm sure there are a few others - I know the NESCAC's got a bunch of freshmen getting big PT.
Austin Hutcherson of Wesleyan is definitely the top rookie in NESCAC and a likely future all-American. He is super versatile at 6'5 with pg skills. But I would not say he is a candidate for national ROY barring a big leap forward in the NCAA tourney. Regional ROY, perhaps, as no other obvious New England candidates come immediately to mind other than MIT's Hamilton Forsythe.
More generally, I earlier said that these guys were the top candidates in New England:
Jake Ross, Springfield
Jack Daly, Middlebury
James Heskett, Williams
Jaqhawn Walters, Albertus Magnus
Raheem Anderson, Husson
Marcos Echevarria, Nichols
Tarchee Brown, Eastern Conn
Bradley Jomard, MIT
Ty Nichols, Keene State
Jomard, unfortunately, suffered a serious injury and has missed the last seven games, knocking him out of contention. Nichols and Anderson's squads didn't make the NCAA tourney and neither was so dominant individually to warrant all-American honors, in my view.
That leaves Walters, Echevarria, Brown, Heskett, Daly, and Ross as the New England candidates. I think those six are fairly closely grouped; except for maybe Ross none are realistically in contention for first-team all-American, but all could make a case for second team or lower, and all but Walters (who to me is an all-American talent, he just didn't get enough help) will have a chance to make a stronger case against out-of-region competition in the NCAA tourney.
So it sounds like the D3 Recee's All-Star rosters will be named in the next couple days, according to Dave on Hoopsville today. Should be noted that only seniors that have played their last game are eligible for this game. All of these players had great senior years to go along with great careers at their school. Just a couple of accomplishments from each player is lister afterwards.
So here is my list, in no particular order:
1. Nate Axelrod - OWU: Josten's Trophy Finalist, 3x NCAC POY, 2000+ points, 500+ assists
2. Tyheim Monroe - Cabrini: 2x CSAC POY, 2000+ points, 1400+ assits
3. Tarchee Brown - Eastern Connecticut: LEC POY, 1900+ points, 4x All-LEC 1st team
4. Chimaechi Ekekeugbor - Baruch: CUNYAC POY, 2000 points
5. Jaqwan Walters - Albertus Magnus: 2x GNAC POY, 1800+ points, 1100+ rebounds
6. Patrick McDonald - SUNY-Matitime: Josten's Trophy Finalist, 3x All-Skyline, 1500+ points, 1000+ rebounds
7. Colin Olmscheid - Augsburg: MIAC POY, 1800+ points
8. CD Douglas - UM-Morris: UMAC POY, 3xAll-UMAC, 1900+ points
9. Kevin Grow - Carleton: Josten's Trophy Finalist, 1400+ points, 1000+ rebounds, 200+ blocks, 3xAll-MIAC
10. Michael Scarlett - CMS: 2x SCIAC POY, 1300+ points
11. Andrew Sanders - WashU: UAA POY, 1200+ points, 500+ rebounds
12. Jay Howard - Catholic: Josten's Trophy Finalist, Landmark POY, 2100+ points, 700+ assists
13. Andy Orr - Leb Valley: Co-SIDA All-District, Josten's Trophy Finalist, 3x All-MAC Commonwealth
14. Raheem Anderson - Husson: 2x NAC POY, 2414 points
Others in the mix, feel free to add people to this list as this is in no way all encompassing:
Hamed Shamseldin - Brockport
Alex Sorenson - NCC
Nate Burger - ONU
Chad Roy - Wittenberg
Sam Light - Lebanon Valley
Dejaun Smith - Albright
Players that could make it but are currently still playing in the NCAAs:
Tim Howell - Whitman
Jack Daly - Middlebury
Adam Gigax - Emory
Brandon Federici - F&M
Thomas Bonacum - Ramapo
The All-Star rosters come from the NABC All-American teams - so, likely, those will be out soon, too.
Travion Kirkendoll and Keenan Gumms
Add Jack Davidson (Wabash) and Quinten Shields (Platteville) to ROY list
When do the Regionals come out? This weekend????
Quote from: hopefan on March 06, 2018, 09:49:00 AM
When do the Regionals come out? This weekend????
D3hoops.com All-Region teams? Early next week.
If you haven't already seen the all-region lists...
http://www.d3hoops.com/awards/all-region/2017-18/index
Leads me to the question of who will be the National POY, using the Region POY as the 8 candidates:
Northeast: Jake Ross, Springfield
East: Jonathan Patron, Plattsburgh State
Atlantic: Tyheim Monroe, Cabrini
Middle Atlantic: Brandon Federici, Franklin and Marshall
South: James Contreras Jr., Averett
Great Lakes: Nate Axelrod, Ohio Wesleyan
Central: Aston Francis, Wheaton (Ill.)
West: Collin Olmscheid, Augsburg
I think that it really comes down to 3 'finalists' for me. Ross, Patron and Monroe. Axelrod had a great career but his team didn't make the NCAA so although he is probably a first team AA, I'll leave him off of the National POY top three. Of these three you are really splitting hairs as all of them led their team to the NCAA tourney and at least one NCAA win. I might lean Ross since he has led his team to the Final Four, but Tyheim Monroe is a Senior and giving him the award would be a great way to recognize him for being unstoppable for 4 years (I get its a 2017-2018 season award but you have to go to tiebreakers when they are as close as these 3 are, at least in my eyes).
When Monroe was a freshman. I remember one of the assistant coaches said Monroe was going to break every record at Cabrini. I kinda thought at the time it's not about records it's about winning as a team. Well he exceeded all my expectations. Not only did he break records, he brought that winning as a team thing to fruition. He's a leader and a winner and as such should be considered as Player of the Year. At least in my book! :)
I think the first-team will end up being Ross, Patron, Monroe, Francis, and Axelrod. Very close call for player of the year among those five, a good case could be made for any of them. None of them had a season like, say, Flannery last year, where there ends up being a no-brainer choice, but all have very impressive resumes.
I would think that Patron not playing the first semester would make him a long-shot to win POY. But, he's only a junior so he'll be back next year!
Francis put up huge numbers, but I think part of AA is winning. Wheaton didn't win anything or come close to it.
Quote from: spwood on March 13, 2018, 05:22:50 PM
I would think that Patron not playing the first semester would make him a long-shot to win POY. But, he's only a junior so he'll be back next year!
I agree, still should be 1st team AA in my eyes, like nescac1 said.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 13, 2018, 05:57:20 PM
Francis put up huge numbers, but I think part of AA is winning. Wheaton didn't win anything or come close to it.
Greek I agree, but in one of the very best d3 conferences Francis led the Thunder to a 17-9 record and a 10-6 conference record. Up until ending the season on a 3 game losing streak they were in the Pool C discussion. I would say Francis was the major cog of a very above average D3 team, and his monster numbers paired with this makes him an AA in my books, and probably a 1st teamer at that.
He's an AA, just not a 1st teamer, imo. We agree to disagree.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 14, 2018, 02:14:07 PM
He's an AA, just not a 1st teamer, imo. We agree to disagree.
27.4 ppg
4.8 rpg
4.4 apg
Against a very tough schedule. Those are 1st Team All-American numbers as I see it.
I agree with Bob. Aston Francis is a pretty clear-cut first-teamer.
Just announced - http://www.d3hoops.com/awards/all-americans/men/2018 - Please criticize at will.
I'd flip Francis and Roach, but otherwise no complaints. Nice job, guys.
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 17, 2018, 06:08:55 PM
I'd flip Francis and Roach, but otherwise no complaints. Nice job, guys.
That was heartily debated.
In case anyone is interested, I conducted an All-American pool in the fantasy leagues board at the beginning of the year. We could not pick any players that were listed on D3hoops' preseason AA list. Some of us actually did fairly well if we used the All-Region teams as well. Only two of us got 3 players on the AA teams and only two of us got the Player of the Year correct. None predicted Levi winning the Rookie of the Year. I'll be doing this pool again, but we'll use the All-Region teams for points as well as adding AA teams for bonus points.
http://www.d3hoops.com/awards/all-americans/men/2018
Not a lot of excitement or correct picks for All-Americans. I think to give us more opportunities, we'll be able to use All-Region teams for points and then All-American teams as bonus points.
Some of us actually did pretty well if we included the All-Region teams.
To be clear, I just counted All-American teams but listed the All-Region team results as well.
For example, in the All-Region team column, if there is a 1, they got 1st team, 2 they got 2nd team etc.
In the Pts column, if there's a 5, they got 1st team, 4-2nd team, 3-3rd team, 2-4th team and 1-honorable mention. If there's a 10, that means they got the POTY correct.
| POSTER | PLAYER | TEAM | Pts | REGION |
| 7express | Federici | F&M | 1 | 1 |
| 7express | Kenny | Misericordia | x | 1 |
| 7express | Roach | Whitworth | 5 | 1 |
| 7express | Sanders | Wash U | 5 | 1 |
| 7express | Walters-POTY | Alb Mag | x | 1 |
| 7express | Nichols | Keene St | x | 2 |
| 7express | Rose | IWU | x | 2 |
| 7express | Pace | Tufts | x | 4 |
| 7express | Preston-ROOKIE | Pomona-Pitzer | x | x |
| 7express | Scadlock | Williams | x | x |
| 7express | Simonds | Bowdoin | x | x |
| 7express | Traub | Susquehanna | x | x |
| . | . | TOTAL | 11 | x |
| POSTER | PLAYER | TEAM | Pts | REGION |
| Greek | Axelrod-POTY | OWU | 10 | 1 |
| Greek | Ekekeugbor | Baruch | x | 1 |
| Greek | Kenny | Misericordia | x | 1 |
| Greek | Sanders | Wash U | 5 | 1 |
| Greek | Feehan | Eureka | x | 2 |
| Greek | Cooper | Cortland | x | 3 |
| Greek | Pace | Tufts | x | 4 |
| Greek | Carter | CNU | x | x |
| Greek | Colhoff | LeTourneau | x | x |
| Greek | McCarthy | Amherst | x | x |
| Greek | Perkins-ROOKIE | Alb Mag | x | x |
| Greek | Smith | Hilbert | x | x |
| . | . | TOTAL | 15 | x |
| POSTER | PLAYER | TEAM | Pts | REGION |
| Grizzlies | Ekekeugbor | Baruch | x | 1 |
| Grizzlies | Kenny | Misericordia | x | 1 |
| Grizzlies | Monroe-POTY | Cabrini | x | 1 |
| Grizzlies | Sanders | Wash U | 5 | 1 |
| Grizzlies | Thomasson | SRS | x | 1 |
| Grizzlies | Feehan | Eureka | x | 2 |
| Grizzlies | Jomard | MIT | x | 2 |
| Grizzlies | Rapoza | Anna Maria | x | 4 |
| Grizzlies | Davis | Morrisville | x | x |
| Grizzlies | Jones | Hiram | x | x |
| Grizzlies | Moore | NC Wes | x | x |
| Grizzlies | Gutierrez-ROOKIE | Franklin | x | x |
| . | . | TOTAL | 5 | x |
| POSTER | PLAYER | TEAM | Pts | REGION |
| magicman | Daly | Middlebury | 2 | 1 |
| magicman | Ekekeugbor | Baruch | x | 1 |
| magicman | Sanders | Wash U | 5 | 1 |
| magicman | Stenglein | Nazareth | x | 1 |
| magicman | Howell-POTY | Whitman | x | 2 |
| magicman | Pace | Tufts | x | 4 |
| magicman | Carter | CNU | x | x |
| magicman | McCarthy | Amherst | x | x |
| magicman | Neal | Con Tex | x | x |
| magicman | Scadlock | Williams | x | x |
| magicman | Scibelli | Haverford | x | x |
| magicman | Williams-ROOKIE | Emory | x | x |
| . | . | TOTAL | 7 | x |
| POSTER | PLAYER | TEAM | Pts | REGION |
| NCF | Ekekeugbor | Baruch | x | 1 |
| NCF | Fails | Hanover | 3 | 1 |
| NCF | Sorenson-POTY | NCC | x | 1 |
| NCF | Rose | IWU | x | 2 |
| NCF | Hewitt | Whitman | x | 3 |
| NCF | Weiss | St John's | x | 3 |
| NCF | Meinholz | La Crosse | x | x |
| NCF | Scadlock | Williams | x | x |
| NCF | Simonds | Bowdoin | x | x |
| NCF | Sortillo | Augustana | x | x |
| NCF | Uzorh-ROOKIE | Trinity | x | x |
| NCF | Wind | Nazareth | x | x |
| . | . | TOTAL | 3 | x |
| POSTER | PLAYER | TEAM | Pts | REGION |
| nescac1 | Axelrod-POTY | OWU | 10 | 1 |
| nescac1 | Federici | F&M | 1 | 1 |
| nescac1 | Roach | Whitworth | 5 | 1 |
| nescac1 | Sanders | Wash U | 5 | 1 |
| nescac1 | Murdock | TCNJ | x | 2 |
| nescac1 | Nichols | Keene St | x | 2 |
| nescac1 | Pace | Tufts | x | 4 |
| nescac1 | Hawkins | Hope | x | x |
| nescac1 | Jordan-ROOKIE | Nichols | x | x |
| nescac1 | Long | Guilford | x | x |
| nescac1 | Scadlock | Williams | x | x |
| nescac1 | Traub | Susquehanna | x | x |
| . | . | TOTAL | 21 | x |
| POSTER | PLAYER | TEAM | Pts | REGION |
| Osprey | Daly | Middlebury | 2 | 1 |
| Osprey | Roach | Whitworth | 5 | 1 |
| Osprey | Bonacum-POTY | Ramapo | x | 2 |
| Osprey | Nichols | Keene St | x | 2 |
| Osprey | Cooper | Cortland | x | 3 |
| Osprey | Pace | Tufts | x | 4 |
| Osprey | Long | Guilford | x | x |
| Osprey | McCarthy | Amherst | x | x |
| Osprey | Perkins-ROOKIE | Alb Mag | x | x |
| Osprey | Sortillo | Augustana | x | x |
| Osprey | Traub | Susquehanna | x | x |
| Osprey | Tyler | Whitewater | x | x |
| . | . | TOTAL | 7 | x |
| POSTER | PLAYER | TEAM | Pts | REGION |
| ronk | Light | Leb Valley | x | 1 |
| ronk | Rupkus-POTY | Skidmore | x | 1 |
| ronk | Brown | E Conn | x | 2 |
| ronk | Murdock | TCNJ | x | 2 |
| ronk | Nichols | Keene St | x | 2 |
| ronk | Orr | Leb Valley | x | 2 |
| ronk | Rose | IWU | x | 2 |
| ronk | Schimonitz | Neb Wes | x | 3 |
| ronk | Pace | Tufts | x | 4 |
| ronk | McCarthy | Amherst | x | x |
| ronk | Neal | Con Tex | x | x |
| ronk | Robinson-ROOKIE | Amherst | x | x |
| . | . | TOTAL | 0 | x |
| POSTER | PLAYER | TEAM | Pts | REGION |
| Smitty | Kenny | Misericordia | x | 1 |
| Smitty | Sanders | Wash U | 5 | 1 |
| Smitty | Howell-POTY | Whitman | x | 2 |
| Smitty | Nichols | Keene St | x | 2 |
| Smitty | Rose | IWU | x | 2 |
| Smitty | Schimonitz | Neb Wes | x | 3 |
| Smitty | Pace | Tufts | x | 4 |
| Smitty | Boll | St Thomas | x | x |
| Smitty | Bruton | Nichols | x | x |
| Smitty | Moore | NC Wes | x | x |
| Smitty | Neal | Con Tex | x | x |
| Smitty | Williams-ROOKIE | Emory | x | x |
| . | . | TOTAL | 5 | x |
| POSTER | PLAYER | TEAM | Pts | REGION |
| WUPHF | Roach | Whitworth | 5 | 1 |
| WUPHF | Sanders | Wash U | 5 | 1 |
| WUPHF | Howell-POTY | Whitman | x | 2 |
| WUPHF | Nichols | Keene St | x | 2 |
| WUPHF | Rose | IWU | x | 2 |
| WUPHF | Schimonitz | Neb Wes | x | 3 |
| WUPHF | Pace | Tufts | x | 4 |
| WUPHF | Hawkins | Hope | x | x |
| WUPHF | Highsmith | Wash U | x | x |
| WUPHF | Scadlock | Williams | x | x |
| WUPHF | Sortillo | Augustana | x | x |
| WUPHF | Williams-ROOKIE | Emory | x | x |
| . | . | TOTAL | 10 | x |
So, nescac1 and I got Axelrod correct for POTY, so we each got 10 points for that. No one picked Levi for ROTY. Roach and Sanders were 1st team AA and Federici was HM, so nescac1 wins by a big amount with 21. Greek came in 2nd by picking the POTY correct and Sanders making 1st team, finishing with 15. 7express did really well, tying nescac1 with 3 players on AA teams, but failed to pick up the ROTY or POTY...thus finishing with 11.
Quote from: Titan Q on March 17, 2018, 05:07:41 PM
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 14, 2018, 02:14:07 PM
He's an AA, just not a 1st teamer, imo. We agree to disagree.
27.4 ppg
4.8 rpg
4.4 apg
Against a very tough schedule. Those are 1st Team All-American numbers as I see it.
I'm not debating his talent. Just so we're clear. But, he averaged those points by shooting over 500 times, twice as many as the next player on his team. He also only shot just over 41%. Vinny Curta, who plays in Grinnell's system shot
less than Francis, shot at a 48.9% clip, took less 3s and averaged 32.7 a game. Now, is it THAT impressive to scored 27.4 points a game when you're shooting it 20.7 times a game? Ironically, I just used Curta's stats since they were similar. Funny how I just checked and they both averaged 20.7 shots a game.
How come NCF didn't get any points for Sorenson? He made third team.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 18, 2018, 03:01:44 PM
Quote from: Titan Q on March 17, 2018, 05:07:41 PM
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 14, 2018, 02:14:07 PM
He's an AA, just not a 1st teamer, imo. We agree to disagree.
27.4 ppg
4.8 rpg
4.4 apg
Against a very tough schedule. Those are 1st Team All-American numbers as I see it.
I'm not debating his talent. Just so we're clear. But, he averaged those points by shooting over 500 times, twice as many as the next player on his team. He also only shot just over 41%. Vinny Curta, who plays in Grinnell's system shot less than Francis, shot at a 48.9% clip, took less 3s and averaged 32.7 a game. Now, is it THAT impressive to scored 27.4 points a game when you're shooting it 20.7 times a game? Ironically, I just used Curta's stats since they were similar. Funny how I just checked and they both averaged 20.7 shots a game.
Francis shot 37% from distance, while Curta only shot 30%. That's a very big discrepancy. Francis also grabbed a rebound and a half more per game than did Curta, and had more than half again as many steals as Curta had -- and he did all of this against significantly tougher competition than Curta faced.
Preseason AA could only be used for POY. Points came from players not on this list.
Sorenson was a pre-season All-American. When picking a Player of the Year, you could use someone on that list. When simply posting the AA picks, you couldn't use anyone from the pre-season list, hence the (POTY) next to Sorenson's name. nescac1 and I chose Axelrod as our POTY, but we couldn't just use him as one of our AA players because he was a pre-season (1st team) AA.
Anyway, I'm not saying Curta is better than Francis or that Curta should be POTY in the region or even be 1st team. I was just saying that when you average 27 a game but it takes 20 to average that, that's not as impressive as it initially looks, in my opinion. He's a talent and he obviously plays in a better league...I'm not sure Roach should've been in there on the 1st team and I'm surprised Daly was 4th team.
OK, I'm gonna get in trouble, but First Team, Andrew Sanders? Can't see it...
I don't know nation wide, who are legit big men, as I primarily read only the MIAA and CCIW board and write most of the SLIAC board...
But Sanders 16.9, 7.0, 55% field is certainly not elite level stats.. when I saw him in prior years, I'd walk away saying he missed too many close in shots, that he put the ball up too hard...
Compare to big men not on 1st team AA
Sorenson (North Central) numbers... 18.4, 9.0, 59% 3rd team AA
Waters (Albertus) .............. 26.5, 15.0, 54.8% 2nd team AA
Bruns (Ohio Northern) ..... 24.0, 8.7, 57.8% 2nd team AA
Monroe (Cabrini) ........... 21.5, 14.7, 50.9% 3rd team AA
Toney (New Jersey City)........ 20.6, 9.7, 47.5% 4th team AA
just wondering what the justification is, what put him over the hump....
Quote from: Titan Q on March 17, 2018, 05:07:41 PM
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 14, 2018, 02:14:07 PM
He's an AA, just not a 1st teamer, imo. We agree to disagree.
27.4 ppg
4.8 rpg
4.4 apg
Against a very tough schedule. Those are 1st Team All-American numbers as I see it.
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 17, 2018, 05:10:29 PM
I agree with Bob. Aston Francis is a pretty clear-cut first-teamer.
Is a guy whose coach goes on the post game radio show (more than once I believe) and criticizes his lack of effort on defense really a FIRST team All-American? ???
Sure. Coaches have their own ways of motivating players.
Mike Schauer has also made all sorts of public statements about his star player in which he exhausted the thesaurus while mining for superlatives to describe Aston Francis.
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 18, 2018, 11:08:44 PM
Sure. Coaches have their own ways of motivating players.
Mike Schauer has also made all sorts of public statements about his star player in which he exhausted the thesaurus while mining for superlatives to describe Aston Francis.
Sure coaches have their own ways of motivating players. But should a first team All-American need to be
motivated? Shouldn't he come to the gym with the
self motivation to excel? 🤔
I presume that those are rhetorical questions. All I can say is that, again, coaches have their own ways of motivating players. What you or I might consider to be a motivated player may be somebody that a coach thinks needs to have a fire lit under him. And we're not talking about every coach, either; coaches, and the players that they are trying to motivate, are unique individuals with their own personalities and ways of doing things.
Quote from: hopefan on March 18, 2018, 09:32:19 PM
OK, I'm gonna get in trouble, but First Team, Andrew Sanders? Can't see it...
I don't know nation wide, who are legit big men, as I primarily read only the MIAA and CCIW board and write most of the SLIAC board...
But Sanders 16.9, 7.0, 55% field is certainly not elite level stats.. when I saw him in prior years, I'd walk away saying he missed too many close in shots, that he put the ball up too hard...
Compare to big men not on 1st team AA
Sorenson (North Central) numbers... 18.4, 9.0, 59% 3rd team AA
Waters (Albertus) .............. 26.5, 15.0, 54.8% 2nd team AA
Bruns (Ohio Northern) ..... 24.0, 8.7, 57.8% 2nd team AA
Monroe (Cabrini) ........... 21.5, 14.7, 50.9% 3rd team AA
Toney (New Jersey City)........ 20.6, 9.7, 47.5% 4th team AA
just wondering what the justification is, what put him over the hump....
Not sure I can explain all of it, other than simply that stats are not a dominant criteria, although obviously involved. We try to avoid going too much in detail with the thought process here, but I would say one of Pat's big themes for choosing any of our award "teams" is that they be five guys who would conceivably take the floor together. I'm sure a good coach would find the right offense for whoever were her best athletes, but some combinations wouldn't necessarily be typical. There are also other factors that go into it as well, consistency, all-around play, etc. We're also basing these selections on the All-Region choices that are largely determined by a voting panel.
I'll say, if we were just choosing the five best individual players, it might not look like how we laid it out, but I'm very happy with the order we've got given the criteria we try to follow. These guys are all high level players and it's a tough call in many instances - this is one year (and it doesn't happen every year) where there are many deserving players who didn't make any of the five teams.
I'm a little surprised Tim Howell only made the HM list, after being a pre-season 1st teamer. He averaged just under 19 points per game in only 22 minutes, shooting .527-- he has to easily be one of (if not THE) most efficient scorers in the nation with those numbers, despite ostensibly being the focus of every opposing defense (having been a Pre-Season 1st Team AA). His career averages along those lines aren't far off-- 17.2 points on 51% shooting... which would be GREAT numbers for a post player, but are absurd for a guard who drives and shoots floaters. Last season, by comparison he averaged one more point per game, but had fewer assists in 25 minutes per game.
Obviously winning or a team's record doesn't play in the selections, but just for fun-- Whitman is 60-3 in the last two years, which is more than a little crazy. Howell's teams were 104-14 in his time at Whitman, which is the best winning % in all of D3 and close to the best in all of NCAA basketball, according to the Whitman website. I realize it's not a career award, but hard to believe that there are 12 better guards out there. I would argue whatever small 'dips' happened in Howell's numbers actually HELPED Whitman win this year, as you saw other guys (Hewitt, Duckett, Osborne) come into more of their own.
Also, for the record, there are not 10 players (possibly including Howell) in the country better than Austin Butler. He'll never get an award simply because it's (legitimately) too hard for voters to stay up and watch him, and because he's not a scorer so his numbers will never be sexy enough, but the guy dominates SO many games for WM.
Quote from: Whit-MAN on March 19, 2018, 03:32:04 PM
I'm a little surprised Tim Howell only made the HM list, after being a pre-season 1st teamer. He averaged just under 19 points per game in only 22 minutes, shooting .527-- he has to easily be one of (if not THE) most efficient scorers in the nation with those numbers, despite ostensibly being the focus of every opposing defense (having been a Pre-Season 1st Team AA). His career averages along those lines aren't far off-- 17.2 points on 51% shooting... which would be GREAT numbers for a post player, but are absurd for a guard who drives and shoots floaters. Last season, by comparison he averaged one more point per game, but had fewer assists in 25 minutes per game.
Obviously winning or a team's record doesn't play in the selections, but just for fun-- Whitman is 60-3 in the last two years, which is more than a little crazy. Howell's teams were 104-14 in his time at Whitman, which is the best winning % in all of D3 and close to the best in all of NCAA basketball, according to the Whitman website. I realize it's not a career award, but hard to believe that there are 12 better guards out there. I would argue whatever small 'dips' happened in Howell's numbers actually HELPED Whitman win this year, as you saw other guys (Hewitt, Duckett, Osborne) come into more of their own.
Starting with the fact that Howell was a 2nd-Team All-Region... he was already limited with just how high he was going to get slotted.
Quote from: Whit-MAN on March 19, 2018, 03:32:04 PM
Also, for the record, there are not 10 players (possibly including Howell) in the country better than Austin Butler. He'll never get an award simply because it's (legitimately) too hard for voters to stay up and watch him, and because he's not a scorer so his numbers will never be sexy enough, but the guy dominates SO many games for WM.
Butler wasn't nominated to All-Region... starts there. Trust me, the D3hoops.com staff lamented about that fact.
Quote from: Whit-MAN on March 19, 2018, 03:32:04 PM
I'm a little surprised Tim Howell only made the HM list, after being a pre-season 1st teamer.
No reason to be surprised especially when you consider that 3 of the other pre-season first teamers didn't make
any AA team, not even HM! And that's not the first time it has happened, nor will it be the last.
If you want to be surprised about something, consider 2nd place Oshkosh had no AAs at all, and the only player mentioned from national championship winner Nebraska Wesleyan could do no better than to join Howell on the HM list. 🤔
Quote from: AndOne on March 19, 2018, 04:26:14 PM
Quote from: Whit-MAN on March 19, 2018, 03:32:04 PM
I'm a little surprised Tim Howell only made the HM list, after being a pre-season 1st teamer.
No reason to be surprised especially when you consider that 3 of the other pre-season first teamers didn't make any AA team, not even HM! And that's not the first time it has happened, nor will it be the last.
If you want to be surprised about something, consider 2nd place Oshkosh had no AAs at all, and the only player mentioned from national championship winner Nebraska Wesleyan could do no better than to join Howell on the HM list. 🤔
I'm surprised by all of this, actually. Personally, I think performing well against the best teams in the country should carry more weight than being a statistical outlier for a mediocre team... and watching NWU against the Blues, they appeared to have five or six deserving players!
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 19, 2018, 04:13:01 PM
Quote from: Whit-MAN on March 19, 2018, 03:32:04 PM
I'm a little surprised Tim Howell only made the HM list, after being a pre-season 1st teamer. He averaged just under 19 points per game in only 22 minutes, shooting .527-- he has to easily be one of (if not THE) most efficient scorers in the nation with those numbers, despite ostensibly being the focus of every opposing defense (having been a Pre-Season 1st Team AA). His career averages along those lines aren't far off-- 17.2 points on 51% shooting... which would be GREAT numbers for a post player, but are absurd for a guard who drives and shoots floaters. Last season, by comparison he averaged one more point per game, but had fewer assists in 25 minutes per game.
Obviously winning or a team's record doesn't play in the selections, but just for fun-- Whitman is 60-3 in the last two years, which is more than a little crazy. Howell's teams were 104-14 in his time at Whitman, which is the best winning % in all of D3 and close to the best in all of NCAA basketball, according to the Whitman website. I realize it's not a career award, but hard to believe that there are 12 better guards out there. I would argue whatever small 'dips' happened in Howell's numbers actually HELPED Whitman win this year, as you saw other guys (Hewitt, Duckett, Osborne) come into more of their own.
Starting with the fact that Howell was a 2nd-Team All-Region... he was already limited with just how high he was going to get slotted.
Quote from: Whit-MAN on March 19, 2018, 03:32:04 PM
Also, for the record, there are not 10 players (possibly including Howell) in the country better than Austin Butler. He'll never get an award simply because it's (legitimately) too hard for voters to stay up and watch him, and because he's not a scorer so his numbers will never be sexy enough, but the guy dominates SO many games for WM.
Butler wasn't nominated to All-Region... starts there. Trust me, the D3hoops.com staff lamented about that fact.
I thought Howell probably should have been an All-Region 1st team selection for the same reasons as I mentioned earlier. Essentially identical numbers to the previous season, in fewer minutes, despite wearing the #1 target all season long.
Butler not being nominated is atrocious....did someone drop the ball there, or what?!
Here's how the D3Hoops.com staff faired...8 out of 25.
| PRE-AA | PLAYER | TEAM | AA |
| 1 | Axelrod | OWU | 1 |
| 1 | Howell | Whitman | HM |
| 1 | McKinney | Hanover | x |
| 1 | Bonacum | Ramapo | x |
| 1 | Herink | River Falls | x |
| 2 | Francis | Wheaton | 2 |
| 2 | Orange | Augustana | x |
| 2 | Rupkus | Skidmore | x |
| 2 | Monroe | Cabrini | 3 |
| 2 | Sorenson | NCC | 3 |
| 3 | Anderson | Husson | x |
| 3 | Echevarria | Nichols | x |
| 3 | Scarlett | CMS | 1 |
| 3 | Cook | Neb Wes | x |
| 3 | Raridon | NCC | x |
| 4 | Ross | Springfield | 2 |
| 4 | Stokman | St John's | x |
| 4 | Wiley | Swarthmore | x |
| 4 | Gigax | Emory | x |
| 4 | MacDonald | SUNY Maritime | x |
| HM | Comenale | Babson | x |
| HM | Jones | Whitewater | x |
| HM | Ross | Wells | x |
| HM | Walters | Alb Mag | 2 |
| HM | Howard | Catholic | x |
| x | Roach | Whitworth | 1 |
| x | Sanders | Wash U | 1 |
| x | Olmscheid | Augsburg | 1 |
| x | Adams | Olivet | 2 |
| x | Bruns | ONU | 2 |
| x | Duax | Platteville | 3 |
| x | Myers | Aurora | 3 |
| x | Fails | Hanover | 3 |
| x | Daly | Middlebury | 4 |
| x | Ebel | Augustana | 4 |
| x | Douglas | Minn-Morris | 4 |
| x | Toney | NJCU | 4 |
| x | Roy | Wittenberg | 4 |
| x | Federici | F&M | HM |
| x | Garver | Neb Wes | HM |
| x | Patron | Plattsburg St | HM |
| x | Grow | Carleton | HM |
Quote from: Whit-MAN on March 19, 2018, 04:38:02 PM
Quote from: AndOne on March 19, 2018, 04:26:14 PM
Quote from: Whit-MAN on March 19, 2018, 03:32:04 PM
I'm a little surprised Tim Howell only made the HM list, after being a pre-season 1st teamer.
No reason to be surprised especially when you consider that 3 of the other pre-season first teamers didn't make any AA team, not even HM! And that's not the first time it has happened, nor will it be the last.
If you want to be surprised about something, consider 2nd place Oshkosh had no AAs at all, and the only player mentioned from national championship winner Nebraska Wesleyan could do no better than to join Howell on the HM list. 🤔
I'm surprised by all of this, actually. Personally, I think performing well against the best teams in the country should carry more weight than being a statistical outlier for a mediocre team... and watching NWU against the Blues, they appeared to have five or six deserving players!
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 19, 2018, 04:13:01 PM
Quote from: Whit-MAN on March 19, 2018, 03:32:04 PM
I'm a little surprised Tim Howell only made the HM list, after being a pre-season 1st teamer. He averaged just under 19 points per game in only 22 minutes, shooting .527-- he has to easily be one of (if not THE) most efficient scorers in the nation with those numbers, despite ostensibly being the focus of every opposing defense (having been a Pre-Season 1st Team AA). His career averages along those lines aren't far off-- 17.2 points on 51% shooting... which would be GREAT numbers for a post player, but are absurd for a guard who drives and shoots floaters. Last season, by comparison he averaged one more point per game, but had fewer assists in 25 minutes per game.
Obviously winning or a team's record doesn't play in the selections, but just for fun-- Whitman is 60-3 in the last two years, which is more than a little crazy. Howell's teams were 104-14 in his time at Whitman, which is the best winning % in all of D3 and close to the best in all of NCAA basketball, according to the Whitman website. I realize it's not a career award, but hard to believe that there are 12 better guards out there. I would argue whatever small 'dips' happened in Howell's numbers actually HELPED Whitman win this year, as you saw other guys (Hewitt, Duckett, Osborne) come into more of their own.
Starting with the fact that Howell was a 2nd-Team All-Region... he was already limited with just how high he was going to get slotted.
Quote from: Whit-MAN on March 19, 2018, 03:32:04 PM
Also, for the record, there are not 10 players (possibly including Howell) in the country better than Austin Butler. He'll never get an award simply because it's (legitimately) too hard for voters to stay up and watch him, and because he's not a scorer so his numbers will never be sexy enough, but the guy dominates SO many games for WM.
Butler wasn't nominated to All-Region... starts there. Trust me, the D3hoops.com staff lamented about that fact.
I thought Howell probably should have been an All-Region 1st team selection for the same reasons as I mentioned earlier. Essentially identical numbers to the previous season, in fewer minutes, despite wearing the #1 target all season long.
Butler not being nominated is atrocious....did someone drop the ball there, or what?!
Sometimes SIDs do so strategically to avoid splitting the vote. Hewitt and Howell were nominated, putting a third Whitman player on there might've meant even lower All-Region standing for those guys.