This morning, we get the expected announcement that the 2020 NCAA Men's Basketball Championships for all three divisions will be played in Atlanta, in the same weekend. The same will be true in Dallas in 2023.
https://twitter.com/InsidetheNCAA/status/1121074194731753478 (https://twitter.com/InsidetheNCAA/status/1121074194731753478)
Presumably, eight teams will go to Fort Wayne for the sectional finals and national semifinals. It remains to be seen how the timing and format will change, given that the championship will be played two weeks later than usual.
Quote from: fantastic50 on April 24, 2019, 11:50:47 AM
This morning, we get the expected announcement that the 2020 NCAA Men's Basketball Championships for all three divisions will be played in Atlanta, in the same weekend. The same will be true in Dallas in 2023.
https://twitter.com/InsidetheNCAA/status/1121074194731753478 (https://twitter.com/InsidetheNCAA/status/1121074194731753478)
Presumably, eight teams will go to Fort Wayne for the sectional finals and national semifinals. It remains to be seen how the timing and format will change, given that the championship will be played two weeks later than usual.
From the Tweet by the NCAA - just to clarify - 2020 is only for the men and 2023 is only for the women.
Although I won't be able to see the Championship game, it's exciting to know I'll be able to see SIX games instead of 3 (four, if you count the All-Star game). Will there be an all-star game that weekend? I don't recall what happened last time the Championship game was in Atlanta...barring any unforeseen circumstances for my family, like this past tournament :'( :-[
Thank you for pointing this out...I have now edited the post accordingly.
Quote from: Flying Dutch Fan on April 24, 2019, 01:38:20 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on April 24, 2019, 11:50:47 AM
This morning, we get the expected announcement that the 2020 NCAA Men's Basketball Championships for all three divisions will be played in Atlanta, in the same weekend. The same will be true in Dallas in 2023.
https://twitter.com/InsidetheNCAA/status/1121074194731753478 (https://twitter.com/InsidetheNCAA/status/1121074194731753478)
Presumably, eight teams will go to Fort Wayne for the sectional finals and national semifinals. It remains to be seen how the timing and format will change, given that the championship will be played two weeks later than usual.
From the Tweet by the NCAA - just to clarify - 2020 is only for the men and 2023 is only for the women.
Will the early rounds be spread out like in 2013?
I'm assuming there will be a two-week gap between the semis and the championship game. I hope not though. I wouldn't be opposed to having one round a weekend just so we don't have that gap, but I'm sure that could cost a lot more money in regards to island teams advancing.
Why not do a logical thing (and save the NCAA a bunch of money) and just have the season finish a bit later so the regular tournament format can still exist? Have round 1 on the first weekend (when it's easiest to get teams within 500 miles), rounds 2 and 3 on the 2nd weekend, rounds 4 and 5 the 3rd weekend in Fort Wayne, and championship the 4th weekend.
I'm guessing the regular season dates are already set. I'm sure many schedules are mostly, if not completely, finished. You could probably get away with single rounds the first three weekends and then the Elite 8 in Fort Wayne the 4th weekend and the championship the 5th weekend in Atlanta. I just don't like that two-week gap. Stretch out the NCAA tournament.
It wouldn't be too difficult for most conferences (except the conferences like UAA which have travel partners and such) to just take a couple mid-week conference games and move them to the end of the season. In the HCAC for example, just take one or two of the Wednesday slates and move them to a Saturday at the end. It would have the added benefit of less missed class time.
They have no choice on the men's side but go with a two week gap between semis and championship. Fort Wayne is scheduled to host the Sweet 16/Elite 8 in NCAA D1 women's basketball the following weekend - so they have NO ability to move (Salem moved a weekend, but still had a gap because we had funky calendar like this past season).
The men's committee will either have to go with a single game on the opening weekend followed by two (second and third rounds) and then Sweet 16 and Elite 8 ... or go 2-1-2. Personally, I like the 2-1-2 model (really 2-1-2-1 with the title game being on the end). I have not asked the committee nor do I expect they have decided as of yet. That will probably happen at their end of season meetings (which are around now) or maybe over the summer/beginning of next academic year.
Quote from: FCGrizzliesGrad on April 25, 2019, 11:46:38 AM
Why not do a logical thing (and save the NCAA a bunch of money) and just have the season finish a bit later so the regular tournament format can still exist? Have round 1 on the first weekend (when it's easiest to get teams within 500 miles), rounds 2 and 3 on the 2nd weekend, rounds 4 and 5 the 3rd weekend in Fort Wayne, and championship the 4th weekend.
I have made this argument before, but you have to then also start the season a week later as well. There is no appetite for "extending" beyond the "19 weeks" the season is already allotted (from practices to start to things end). We asked this question six years ago as well and when the women had their title game in Indy.
As for the last part about Fort Wayne ... see my previous post. And based on that fact (Fort Wayne not able to move their dates), extending the season won't work anyway.
Also, I think it is less of a challenge in this format where the tournament stretches out over five weeks versus the issue six years ago when it stretched out over six weeks.
I think I agree with Dave. 2-1-2-1 would be better for bracket diversity than 1-2-2-1.
The former allows the committee to mix up the regions and get creative with near-1,000 mile matchups depending on the location of the host seed. The latter would force just about every first-round matchup to be between teams within the 500 mile halo.
Quote from: KnightSlappy on April 25, 2019, 01:49:56 PM
I think I agree with Dave. 2-1-2-1 would be better for bracket diversity than 1-2-2-1.
The former allows the committee to mix up the regions and get creative with near-1,000 mile matchups depending on the location of the host seed. The latter would force just about every first-round matchup to be between teams within the 500 mile halo.
Less diversity, but more teams get to host, better rivalries and higher attendance.
Quote from: AO on April 26, 2019, 03:49:21 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on April 25, 2019, 01:49:56 PM
I think I agree with Dave. 2-1-2-1 would be better for bracket diversity than 1-2-2-1.
The former allows the committee to mix up the regions and get creative with near-1,000 mile matchups depending on the location of the host seed. The latter would force just about every first-round matchup to be between teams within the 500 mile halo.
Less diversity, but more teams get to host, better rivalries and higher attendance.
Seems to me that if we want to be accurate and not confuse anybody who is reading this board, we should be referring to these two alternatives as 2-1-2-0-1 and 1-2-2-0-1.
The basic rule of thumb on this is that every time there is a '1' in early rounds, the bracket gets really regional, and every time there is a '2' or other crooked number, there are more options to get creative with the bracket.
2-1-2-0-1 is >>>>>>> preferable than 1-2-2-0-1 from this standpoint.
With only one round of games in the Sweet 16, could there potential be a lot more flights?
I think it's far easier to find suitable matchups within 500 miles when there's 64 teams compared to when there's just 16 spread out. Lots more flexibility without terrible budgeting issues going 1-2-2-0-1.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on May 03, 2019, 09:55:28 AM
With only one round of games in the Sweet 16, could there potential be a lot more flights?
You're going to see more flights if they're bringing eight teams to Ft. Wayne. Typically they bracket with the top seeds able to drive somewhere the second weekend. Obviously, upsets sometimes mess with that a little (like this past season), but I suspect they'll bracket pretty similarly - especially if it is a 2-1-2.
We're obviously only talking about the first three rounds and the first two weekends. Either it's one round the 1st weekend and two rounds the second or vice versa. The Elite 8 is in Fort Wayne and that weekend can't be moved. The final is in Atlanta. Obviously there will be more flights to Fort Wayne because there's eight teams going, not four.
My point is that I'm guessing there will be more flights the 2nd weekend if we are only discussing 16 teams and eight hosts. If we only have one round the first weekend, there are enough teams where it shouldn't be too regionalized. In that case, the 2nd weekend pods would consist of eight teams hosting four-team pods.
The NCAA seems to have made a decision to make this happen which also means they have the check book out to make it happen.
As I recall, there are two venues very close to each other in Atlanta. D1 will be played in the larger venue. The other games will be played in the smaller venue between D1 games. Despite the delay for the non D1 championships, it was a fan, team and Atlanta area success.
Quote from: iwumichigander on May 07, 2019, 11:29:07 PM
The NCAA seems to have made a decision to make this happen which also means they have the check book out to make it happen.
As I recall, there are two venues very close to each other in Atlanta. D1 will be played in the larger venue. The other games will be played in the smaller venue between D1 games. Despite the delay for the non D1 championships, it was a fan, team and Atlanta area success.
Division III and the NCAA put aside money for this very event a year ago. Yes. They are planning accordingly.
And yes, the DII and DIII games will be played at State Farm Arena - home of the NBA and NHL teams that call Atlanta home. Just like the Final Four plans in 2013. You can find all you need to know here: https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2019/04/joint-championships-announced
We tend to stay on top of things pretty well and write about them. :)
Update for those paying attention: https://twitter.com/d3hoopsville/status/1214322665546289156?s=20
Now, I was told that the committee may not have been told it was confirmed. But I think we are good to go here.
And that will mean eight hosts - not four hosting two games.
Saw what you confirmed on Twitter in the posted pre championship manual. The page 22 bracket makes it seem like left side of bracket games will be March 13 and right side March 14. Dave do you know if these are set in stone or could they change?
Seems like an easy way to determine who plays Friday and who plays Saturday if it's all pre-set.
Quote from: PauldingLightUP on January 06, 2020, 10:56:16 PM
Saw what you confirmed on Twitter in the posted pre championship manual. The page 22 bracket makes it seem like left side of bracket games will be March 13 and right side March 14. Dave do you know if these are set in stone or could they change?
Seems like an easy way to determine who plays Friday and who plays Saturday if it's all pre-set.
How do you mean "set in stone" or could change?
If you mean what side of the bracket, I wouldn't worry about which side of the bracket means anything right now. However, I suspect they will try and keep the sides of the brackets separate for 3/13 and 3/14. They certainly aren't going to want to disadvantage one team in the elite eight if their opponent had one more days rest - that's a no-brainer. I suspect they also won't want to disadvantage a team in the semifinal if their opponent also got one more day's rest ahead of the weekend. By keeping the brackets equal on either side, every team knows their opponents had the same time to recover - just as they do in D1.
But nothing is pre-set except the bracket. Still need to fill those teams in and a blank bracket doesn't mean anything. With the Elite 8 in Fort Wayne, the committee actually has a lot of flexibility on who plays who this year in later rounds. We could see four regions presented each side of the bracket come Elite 8 time.
This makes the bracketing dynamics very similar to the baseball tournament.
So if I'm reading everything correctly...
1st round 3/6
2nd round 3/7
Probably one team host a 4-team pod?
3rd round 4 games on 3/13, 4 games on 3/14
Probably 8 hosts?
Elite 8 at Fort Wayne 3/20
Final 4 at Fort Wayne 3/21
Final in Atlanta 4/5
That is correct Greek.
You can read it all in the published pre-championship manual.
http://www.ncaa.org/championships/division-iii-mens-basketball
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 07, 2020, 12:04:56 AM
Quote from: PauldingLightUP on January 06, 2020, 10:56:16 PM
Saw what you confirmed on Twitter in the posted pre championship manual. The page 22 bracket makes it seem like left side of bracket games will be March 13 and right side March 14. Dave do you know if these are set in stone or could they change?
Seems like an easy way to determine who plays Friday and who plays Saturday if it's all pre-set.
How do you mean "set in stone" or could change?
If you mean what side of the bracket, I wouldn't worry about which side of the bracket means anything right now. However, I suspect they will try and keep the sides of the brackets separate for 3/13 and 3/14. They certainly aren't going to want to disadvantage one team in the elite eight if their opponent had one more days rest - that's a no-brainer. I suspect they also won't want to disadvantage a team in the semifinal if their opponent also got one more day's rest ahead of the weekend. By keeping the brackets equal on either side, every team knows their opponents had the same time to recover - just as they do in D1.
But nothing is pre-set except the bracket. Still need to fill those teams in and a blank bracket doesn't mean anything. With the Elite 8 in Fort Wayne, the committee actually has a lot of flexibility on who plays who this year in later rounds. We could see four regions presented each side of the bracket come Elite 8 time.
Thanks for a thorough answer Dave. I won't read too much into a blank bracket at this point. Just hopefully they put the put the games on one side of the bracket on the same day, so there are no advantages heading to Fort Wayne.
Quote from: PauldingLightUP on January 07, 2020, 09:57:55 AM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 07, 2020, 12:04:56 AM
Quote from: PauldingLightUP on January 06, 2020, 10:56:16 PM
Saw what you confirmed on Twitter in the posted pre championship manual. The page 22 bracket makes it seem like left side of bracket games will be March 13 and right side March 14. Dave do you know if these are set in stone or could they change?
Seems like an easy way to determine who plays Friday and who plays Saturday if it's all pre-set.
How do you mean "set in stone" or could change?
If you mean what side of the bracket, I wouldn't worry about which side of the bracket means anything right now. However, I suspect they will try and keep the sides of the brackets separate for 3/13 and 3/14. They certainly aren't going to want to disadvantage one team in the elite eight if their opponent had one more days rest - that's a no-brainer. I suspect they also won't want to disadvantage a team in the semifinal if their opponent also got one more day's rest ahead of the weekend. By keeping the brackets equal on either side, every team knows their opponents had the same time to recover - just as they do in D1.
But nothing is pre-set except the bracket. Still need to fill those teams in and a blank bracket doesn't mean anything. With the Elite 8 in Fort Wayne, the committee actually has a lot of flexibility on who plays who this year in later rounds. We could see four regions presented each side of the bracket come Elite 8 time.
Thanks for a thorough answer Dave. I won't read too much into a blank bracket at this point. Just hopefully they put the put the games on one side of the bracket on the same day, so there are no advantages heading to Fort Wayne.
That is what I am saying. The bracket makes it understood that is the plan. Sure, we have to see it to believe it, but the brackets in the past have given us hints about things like who will wear the home or away jerseys and who will play at what time in the final four. Thus, this is giving us the hint that the left side will all play on one day and the right side will play on the other.
We will confirm, of course, in the weeks ahead (sometimes we don't get a lot confirmed until late January as some of the i's and t's get taken care of).
Quote from: PauldingLightUP on January 07, 2020, 09:45:24 AM
That is correct Greek.
You can read it all in the published pre-championship manual.
http://www.ncaa.org/championships/division-iii-mens-basketball
Just keep in mind, the pre-championship manual does go through edits throughout the season. For example, College of Staten Island is listed in there as a DIII institution when in reality they are not - that needs to be deleted and a new version put online. So, don't just assume what you read in that manual is perfectly accurate - speaking generically.
Per the part in bold below:
Quote from: PauldingLightUP on January 06, 2020, 10:56:16 PM
Saw what you confirmed on Twitter in the posted pre championship manual. The page 22 bracket makes it seem like left side of bracket games will be March 13 and right side March 14. Dave do you know if these are set in stone or could they change?
Seems like an easy way to determine who plays Friday and who plays Saturday if it's all pre-set.
Thus why my tweet is a bit more "confirmed" than what you read in the manual (I can't tell you how many times we have other information than the manual).
That said, as we have said on Hoopsville numerous times this season (you guys should really check out the show; it's worth it - especially the effort we put into it) and tweeted in some form probably half a dozen times ... the format is 2/1/2/0/1 for this season. The opening weekend is the same as every other opening weekend. The Sweet 16 will take place over two days and as I said above it will be eight hosts:
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 06, 2020, 10:39:45 PM
Update for those paying attention: https://twitter.com/d3hoopsville/status/1214322665546289156?s=20
Now, I was told that the committee may not have been told it was confirmed. But I think we are good to go here.
And that will mean eight hosts - not four hosting two games.
There is also the hope to stagger the times the opening weekend (and heck, maybe the Sweet 16, though I haven't spoken to anyone about that idea specifically). You will notice a hint to that in the manual as well. That said, it isn't set in stone. Last year, the committee tried to pull this off as well, but due to other things (
like LATE Sunday conference championship games!!! These need to stop IMO!), the committee didn't have time to take this up. There is no guarantee they can pull it off this year, but they will be checking with hosts to see if it is possible (it is more complicated than just moving the time up on Friday and Saturday).
Quote from: PauldingLightUP on January 07, 2020, 09:45:24 AM
That is correct Greek.
You can read it all in the published pre-championship manual.
http://www.ncaa.org/championships/division-iii-mens-basketball
Thanks for the link.
Does anyone have any idea when the four games on Friday will be played and when the two games on Saturday will tip-off? Will it be two different sessions, say 11 am and 2 pm and then 5 pm and 8 pm? Will Saturday's games be 1 and 4 or more like 5 and 8? I booked my Fort Wayne hotel recently for Friday and Saturday, so depending on when the games are, I may have to get a Thursday hotel and possibly just drive home Saturday after the 2nd game.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on January 14, 2020, 10:30:03 PM
Does anyone have any idea when the four games on Friday will be played and when the two games on Saturday will tip-off? Will it be two different sessions, say 11 am and 2 pm and then 5 pm and 8 pm? Will Saturday's games be 1 and 4 or more like 5 and 8? I booked my Fort Wayne hotel recently for Friday and Saturday, so depending on when the games are, I may have to get a Thursday hotel and possibly just drive home Saturday after the 2nd game.
1pm, 3:30pm, 6pm, 8:30pm Friday; 5pm and 7:30pm on Saturday (with a 2:15pm All-Star game)
The website says two sessions Friday, but it'll be really tight to try and clear the arena between those sessions. You want the full weekend ticket anyway, so it won't matter.
https://www.muspartans.com/NCAA/
With eight teams ineligible, that's really going to open up the All-Star Game selections.
Thanks, Ryan.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on January 15, 2020, 11:34:43 AM
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on January 14, 2020, 10:30:03 PM
Does anyone have any idea when the four games on Friday will be played and when the two games on Saturday will tip-off? Will it be two different sessions, say 11 am and 2 pm and then 5 pm and 8 pm? Will Saturday's games be 1 and 4 or more like 5 and 8? I booked my Fort Wayne hotel recently for Friday and Saturday, so depending on when the games are, I may have to get a Thursday hotel and possibly just drive home Saturday after the 2nd game.
1pm, 3:30pm, 6pm, 8:30pm Friday; 5pm and 7:30pm on Saturday (with a 2:15pm All-Star game)
The website says two sessions Friday, but it'll be really tight to try and clear the arena between those sessions. You want the full weekend ticket anyway, so it won't matter.
https://www.muspartans.com/NCAA/
I just saw the same thing. I couldn't believe they're going to try to clear the arena and then do re-entry in 30 minutes.
Quote from: KnightSlappy on January 15, 2020, 01:22:08 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on January 15, 2020, 11:34:43 AM
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on January 14, 2020, 10:30:03 PM
Does anyone have any idea when the four games on Friday will be played and when the two games on Saturday will tip-off? Will it be two different sessions, say 11 am and 2 pm and then 5 pm and 8 pm? Will Saturday's games be 1 and 4 or more like 5 and 8? I booked my Fort Wayne hotel recently for Friday and Saturday, so depending on when the games are, I may have to get a Thursday hotel and possibly just drive home Saturday after the 2nd game.
1pm, 3:30pm, 6pm, 8:30pm Friday; 5pm and 7:30pm on Saturday (with a 2:15pm All-Star game)
The website says two sessions Friday, but it'll be really tight to try and clear the arena between those sessions. You want the full weekend ticket anyway, so it won't matter.
https://www.muspartans.com/NCAA/
I just saw the same thing. I couldn't believe they're going to try to clear the arena and then do re-entry in 30 minutes.
Thirty minutes IF the early games get finished on time. I suspect they're pushing the Full weekend ticket package pretty hard, so maybe they're just going to reserve certain sections for individual session attendees, which would be easier.
They have the D1 women's tourney the following weekend - I wonder if we're going to be guinea pigs for crowd control?
I think the biggest reason is they (any arena) tends to have four sections reserved for those fans of teams participating ... harder to do that with eight. They have to reuse sections and thus not able to necessarily sell those seats twice. This isn't for the general seating, but the fan-specific seats and such. If someone buys an all-weekend pass, I suspect they are seated somewhere where that doesn't matter.
I think Salem did the same thing, but I can't remember those logistics.
I don't recall if I had "reserved" tickets or not. But, whenever we went to the 1st game, we sat where there were open seats. Once that game ended and the other team cleared out, we basically moved over behind the Pointer bench without any problem. I always got the upper level tickets, so maybe that played a part in it...also, there were only four teams everytime I went.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on January 15, 2020, 02:17:58 PM
I don't recall if I had "reserved" tickets or not. But, whenever we went to the 1st game, we sat where there were open seats. Once that game ended and the other team cleared out, we basically moved over behind the Pointer bench without any problem. I always got the upper level tickets, so maybe that played a part in it...also, there were only four teams everytime I went.
The sections they "reserve" they tend to do for those like students so they can have "crowds" in certain spots.
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 15, 2020, 03:54:39 PM
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on January 15, 2020, 02:17:58 PM
I don't recall if I had "reserved" tickets or not. But, whenever we went to the 1st game, we sat where there were open seats. Once that game ended and the other team cleared out, we basically moved over behind the Pointer bench without any problem. I always got the upper level tickets, so maybe that played a part in it...also, there were only four teams everytime I went.
The sections they "reserve" they tend to do for those like students so they can have "crowds" in certain spots.
You mean like where the camera's typically pointed? ;)
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 15, 2020, 03:54:39 PM
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on January 15, 2020, 02:17:58 PM
I don't recall if I had "reserved" tickets or not. But, whenever we went to the 1st game, we sat where there were open seats. Once that game ended and the other team cleared out, we basically moved over behind the Pointer bench without any problem. I always got the upper level tickets, so maybe that played a part in it...also, there were only four teams everytime I went.
The sections they "reserve" they tend to do for those like students so they can have "crowds" in certain spots.
Is Turner still doing all the broadcasting in Ft. Wayne, even though there's no championship game there this year?
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on January 15, 2020, 04:11:00 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 15, 2020, 03:54:39 PM
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on January 15, 2020, 02:17:58 PM
I don't recall if I had "reserved" tickets or not. But, whenever we went to the 1st game, we sat where there were open seats. Once that game ended and the other team cleared out, we basically moved over behind the Pointer bench without any problem. I always got the upper level tickets, so maybe that played a part in it...also, there were only four teams everytime I went.
The sections they "reserve" they tend to do for those like students so they can have "crowds" in certain spots.
Is Turner still doing all the broadcasting in Ft. Wayne, even though there's no championship game there this year?
They did in Salem in 2013.
Turner is still doing the games ... yes.
I am not sure about the Championship ... supposedly CBS Sports Network like 2013 (and after), but I always wait for confirmation with them.
Annual question: Men or women get first preference the 1st weekend? Also, related: Will that have any effect on who hosts with the 2-1-2-0-1 format (obviously, only the first two weekends matter)?
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on February 19, 2020, 08:14:32 AM
Annual question: Men or women get first preference the 1st weekend? Also, related: Will that have any effect on who hosts with the 2-1-2-0-1 format (obviously, only the first two weekends matter)?
I tried to remember by thinking "____ are odd," but now I can't remember whether I was being misogynistic or not when I came up with that memory tool.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 19, 2020, 08:17:40 AM
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on February 19, 2020, 08:14:32 AM
Annual question: Men or women get first preference the 1st weekend? Also, related: Will that have any effect on who hosts with the 2-1-2-0-1 format (obviously, only the first two weekends matter)?
I tried to remember by thinking "____ are odd," but now I can't remember whether I was being misogynistic or not when I came up with that memory tool.
Well played. :P
Pretty sure the men have priority this year (I only remember that because last year it was priority to the women, which was why there were rumblings about NCC hosting the first weekend going into conference tournament weekend.)
Would the fact that the quarterfinals are in Ft. Wayne factor into the bracketing? Since the usual geographic concerns at that round don't matter this year, would they ever have a "midwest" pod and "northeast" pod feed into one quarterfinal, for example? (Pod is probably not the right term.) It would seem a shame to not take advantage of the format and have teams from different parts of the country play each other earlier than is usually possible.
Men have the priority this year in the first week. Second week women but not sure how that will be impacted on the men's side with it only being a solo game.
Also, I would imagine the committee will attempt to put host pods that are within 500 miles of each other adjacent to one another in the bracket to try to cut down on the amount of flights prior to the Final 8 games in Fort Wayne (I.E. Nebraska Wesleyan and St. Thomas probably will be next to each other in the bracket). I would also imagine they will put Emory and a potential Texas pod adjacent to one another in the bracket to guarantee one flight comes out of that group of 8 teams.
If the season ended today (qualifier), here are possible 16 host sites (obviously each of these schools would have to put in a bid to host and have the ability to host (looking at you Wittenberg and Texas schools!):
1. Emory
2. Texas-Dallas
3. St Thomas
4. Nebraska Wesleyan
5. Randolph Macon
6. SUNY Brockport
6. Wisc Platteville
7. Wittenberg
8. Wash U
9. Mt Union
10. Johns Hopkins
11. Swarthmore
12. WPI
13. Middlebury
14. Stevens
15. Springfield
16. RPI
Quote from: txg on February 19, 2020, 10:16:54 AM
Would the fact that the quarterfinals are in Ft. Wayne factor into the bracketing? Since the usual geographic concerns at that round don't matter this year, would they ever have a "midwest" pod and "northeast" pod feed into one quarterfinal, for example? (Pod is probably not the right term.) It would seem a shame to not take advantage of the format and have teams from different parts of the country play each other earlier than is usually possible.
The second weekend will force the first weekend to be less geographically diverse - you have to keep all eight teams essentially within 500 miles of each other in order to avoid flights the second weekend - and they will be avoiding flights the second weekend because they'll likely need more the third.
However, once teams get to Ft Wayne, the bracketing can be far more creative. You could have a Tuft-St. John's matchup in the elite eight, since they'll already be in the same place.
I suspect they'll bracket with eight pretty geographically limited pods of eight teams, but then pair those pods together in unique ways that take advantage of the central location.
It's hard to make too many predictions this early, but I doubt you'll see a potential Swarthmore-RMC matchup in the fourth round the way you probably would in other years, when limited by geography.
We'll probably have some rematches in the third round that we don't like, but it should make Ft. Wayne more interesting.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 19, 2020, 10:41:06 AM
Quote from: txg on February 19, 2020, 10:16:54 AM
Would the fact that the quarterfinals are in Ft. Wayne factor into the bracketing? Since the usual geographic concerns at that round don't matter this year, would they ever have a "midwest" pod and "northeast" pod feed into one quarterfinal, for example? (Pod is probably not the right term.) It would seem a shame to not take advantage of the format and have teams from different parts of the country play each other earlier than is usually possible.
The second weekend will force the first weekend to be less geographically diverse - you have to keep all eight teams essentially within 500 miles of each other in order to avoid flights the second weekend - and they will be avoiding flights the second weekend because they'll likely need more the third.
However, once teams get to Ft Wayne, the bracketing can be far more creative. You could have a Tuft-St. John's matchup in the elite eight, since they'll already be in the same place.
I suspect they'll bracket with eight pretty geographically limited pods of eight teams, but then pair those pods together in unique ways that take advantage of the central location.
It's hard to make too many predictions this early, but I doubt you'll see a potential Swarthmore-RMC matchup in the fourth round the way you probably would in other years, when limited by geography.
We'll probably have some rematches in the third round that we don't like, but it should make Ft. Wayne more interesting.
The bolded part is what concerns me. You're going to have more flights (to Ft. Wayne) to pay for, but you're also going to have more flights in the second weekend because we'll only have two pods from which to find 500-mile matches instead of four. How many additional flights is the NCAA going to approve to have the combined championship weekend? I do not like it if it has an adverse effect on bracket diversity.
Quote from: KnightSlappy on February 19, 2020, 11:03:53 AM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 19, 2020, 10:41:06 AM
Quote from: txg on February 19, 2020, 10:16:54 AM
Would the fact that the quarterfinals are in Ft. Wayne factor into the bracketing? Since the usual geographic concerns at that round don't matter this year, would they ever have a "midwest" pod and "northeast" pod feed into one quarterfinal, for example? (Pod is probably not the right term.) It would seem a shame to not take advantage of the format and have teams from different parts of the country play each other earlier than is usually possible.
The second weekend will force the first weekend to be less geographically diverse - you have to keep all eight teams essentially within 500 miles of each other in order to avoid flights the second weekend - and they will be avoiding flights the second weekend because they'll likely need more the third.
However, once teams get to Ft Wayne, the bracketing can be far more creative. You could have a Tuft-St. John's matchup in the elite eight, since they'll already be in the same place.
I suspect they'll bracket with eight pretty geographically limited pods of eight teams, but then pair those pods together in unique ways that take advantage of the central location.
It's hard to make too many predictions this early, but I doubt you'll see a potential Swarthmore-RMC matchup in the fourth round the way you probably would in other years, when limited by geography.
We'll probably have some rematches in the third round that we don't like, but it should make Ft. Wayne more interesting.
The bolded part is what concerns me. You're going to have more flights (to Ft. Wayne) to pay for, but you're also going to have more flights in the second weekend because we'll only have two pods from which to find 500-mile matches instead of four. How many additional flights is the NCAA going to approve to have the combined championship weekend? I do not like it if it has an adverse effect on bracket diversity.
The place it will hurt is in the midwest - probably no more combining of Great Lakes and Central teams, or getting Maryville to WashU. I don't want to go too far into it until we've got a list of teams, because geography dictates so much regardless of schedule. You'll still be able to do a lot of cross-region pods in the E, NE, Atlantic, and MA.
Honestly, fewer Pool C bids from the Central might be a boon for bracketing or a tragedy - and it might all hinge on one team being in or out.
| First Weekend | Second Weekend |
Even Years | Men Host | Women Host |
Odd Years | Women Host | Men Host |
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 19, 2020, 12:52:59 PM
| First Weekend | Second Weekend |
Even Years | Men Host | Women Host |
Odd Years | Women Host | Men Host |
Alright, misogyny it is.
Week 2's Regional Rankings are out: https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2020/02/men-regional-rankings-second
Quote from: D3RetiredHooper on February 19, 2020, 10:40:54 AM
Men have the priority this year in the first week. Second week women but not sure how that will be impacted on the men's side with it only being a solo game.
Also, I would imagine the committee will attempt to put host pods that are within 500 miles of each other adjacent to one another in the bracket to try to cut down on the amount of flights prior to the Final 8 games in Fort Wayne (I.E. Nebraska Wesleyan and St. Thomas probably will be next to each other in the bracket). I would also imagine they will put Emory and a potential Texas pod adjacent to one another in the bracket to guarantee one flight comes out of that group of 8 teams.
If the season ended today (qualifier), here are possible 16 host sites (obviously each of these schools would have to put in a bid to host and have the ability to host (looking at you Wittenberg and Texas schools!):
1. Emory
2. Texas-Dallas
3. St Thomas
4. Nebraska Wesleyan
5. Randolph Macon
6. SUNY Brockport
6. Wisc Platteville
7. Wittenberg
8. Wash U
9. Mt Union
10. Johns Hopkins
11. Swarthmore
12. WPI
13. Middlebury
14. Stevens
15. Springfield
16. RPI
I'm no expert in geography, but I'm guessing you're going to need another central team hosting. Platteville is on the far southwestern part of Wisconsin. There's no host team to satisfy northern Illinois or eastern Wisconsin. I would think if NCC wins the CCIW AQ, they could host or, gulp, SNC. I do suppose it depends on how may CCIW and WIAC teams get in.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on February 19, 2020, 01:20:24 PM
Quote from: D3RetiredHooper on February 19, 2020, 10:40:54 AM
Men have the priority this year in the first week. Second week women but not sure how that will be impacted on the men's side with it only being a solo game.
Also, I would imagine the committee will attempt to put host pods that are within 500 miles of each other adjacent to one another in the bracket to try to cut down on the amount of flights prior to the Final 8 games in Fort Wayne (I.E. Nebraska Wesleyan and St. Thomas probably will be next to each other in the bracket). I would also imagine they will put Emory and a potential Texas pod adjacent to one another in the bracket to guarantee one flight comes out of that group of 8 teams.
If the season ended today (qualifier), here are possible 16 host sites (obviously each of these schools would have to put in a bid to
I'm no expert in geography, but I'm guessing you're going to need another central team hosting. Platteville is on the far southwestern part of Wisconsin. There's no host team to satisfy northern Illinois or eastern Wisconsin. I would think if NCC wins the CCIW AQ, they could host or, gulp, SNC. I do suppose it depends on how may CCIW and WIAC teams get in.
Obviously a lot to still play and who knows what teams win their Pool A bid, but every team that is either currently winning their conference or Pool C top 20 (according to @D3Bubble) can get to Neb Wesleyan, St Thomas, Platteville or Wash U.
Quote from: D3RetiredHooper on February 19, 2020, 04:14:11 PM
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on February 19, 2020, 01:20:24 PM
Quote from: D3RetiredHooper on February 19, 2020, 10:40:54 AM
Men have the priority this year in the first week. Second week women but not sure how that will be impacted on the men's side with it only being a solo game.
Also, I would imagine the committee will attempt to put host pods that are within 500 miles of each other adjacent to one another in the bracket to try to cut down on the amount of flights prior to the Final 8 games in Fort Wayne (I.E. Nebraska Wesleyan and St. Thomas probably will be next to each other in the bracket). I would also imagine they will put Emory and a potential Texas pod adjacent to one another in the bracket to guarantee one flight comes out of that group of 8 teams.
If the season ended today (qualifier), here are possible 16 host sites (obviously each of these schools would have to put in a bid to
I'm no expert in geography, but I'm guessing you're going to need another central team hosting. Platteville is on the far southwestern part of Wisconsin. There's no host team to satisfy northern Illinois or eastern Wisconsin. I would think if NCC wins the CCIW AQ, they could host or, gulp, SNC. I do suppose it depends on how may CCIW and WIAC teams get in.
Obviously a lot to still play and who knows what teams win their Pool A bid, but every team that is either currently winning their conference or Pool C top 20 (according to @D3Bubble) can get to Neb Wesleyan, St Thomas, Platteville or Wash U.
Per Neb. Wesleyan: Benedictine, Elmhurst, St. Norbert, and none of the UW's can get to NWU. I know you said "or," but there are only a few that are going to be able to get to NWU. That either will either hamper the committee's ability to split teams up especially for possibly second weekend games ... or keep them from sending NWU to very many places.
FYI - North Central is 499 miles from NWU; Benedictine is 502!
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 19, 2020, 04:23:43 PM
Quote from: D3RetiredHooper on February 19, 2020, 04:14:11 PM
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on February 19, 2020, 01:20:24 PM
Quote from: D3RetiredHooper on February 19, 2020, 10:40:54 AM
Men have the priority this year in the first week. Second week women but not sure how that will be impacted on the men's side with it only being a solo game.
Also, I would imagine the committee will attempt to put host pods that are within 500 miles of each other adjacent to one another in the bracket to try to cut down on the amount of flights prior to the Final 8 games in Fort Wayne (I.E. Nebraska Wesleyan and St. Thomas probably will be next to each other in the bracket). I would also imagine they will put Emory and a potential Texas pod adjacent to one another in the bracket to guarantee one flight comes out of that group of 8 teams.
If the season ended today (qualifier), here are possible 16 host sites (obviously each of these schools would have to put in a bid to
I'm no expert in geography, but I'm guessing you're going to need another central team hosting. Platteville is on the far southwestern part of Wisconsin. There's no host team to satisfy northern Illinois or eastern Wisconsin. I would think if NCC wins the CCIW AQ, they could host or, gulp, SNC. I do suppose it depends on how may CCIW and WIAC teams get in.
Obviously a lot to still play and who knows what teams win their Pool A bid, but every team that is either currently winning their conference or Pool C top 20 (according to @D3Bubble) can get to Neb Wesleyan, St Thomas, Platteville or Wash U.
Per Neb. Wesleyan: Benedictine, Elmhurst, St. Norbert, and none of the UW's can get to NWU. I know you said "or," but there are only a few that are going to be able to get to NWU. That either will either hamper the committee's ability to split teams up especially for possibly second weekend games ... or keep them from sending NWU to very many places.
FYI - North Central is 499 miles from NWU; Benedictine is 502!
If the final rankings look like the current rankings, you'd probably see either NCC or Whitworth (if there are three Texas teams in) going to NWU.
Yep ... that is possible ... and likely NWU headed to St. Thomas or WashU the second weekend (assuming all things equal; no major upsets).
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 19, 2020, 04:38:57 PM
Yep ... that is possible ... and likely NWU headed to St. Thomas or WashU the second weekend (assuming all things equal; no major upsets).
This is the nitty-gritty I promised I wouldn't get into yet, but: likely the NWU pod will be paired with the WashU pod, especially if Whitworth is involved, since you're likely going to have to pull a team (like Centre or Wittenberg) from farther east to St. Louis the first weekend, and you'd want to match your pods with potential second weekend flights together to prevent needing two.
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 19, 2020, 04:23:43 PM
Quote from: D3RetiredHooper on February 19, 2020, 04:14:11 PM
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on February 19, 2020, 01:20:24 PM
Quote from: D3RetiredHooper on February 19, 2020, 10:40:54 AM
Men have the priority this year in the first week. Second week women but not sure how that will be impacted on the men's side with it only being a solo game.
Also, I would imagine the committee will attempt to put host pods that are within 500 miles of each other adjacent to one another in the bracket to try to cut down on the amount of flights prior to the Final 8 games in Fort Wayne (I.E. Nebraska Wesleyan and St. Thomas probably will be next to each other in the bracket). I would also imagine they will put Emory and a potential Texas pod adjacent to one another in the bracket to guarantee one flight comes out of that group of 8 teams.
If the season ended today (qualifier), here are possible 16 host sites (obviously each of these schools would have to put in a bid to
I'm no expert in geography, but I'm guessing you're going to need another central team hosting. Platteville is on the far southwestern part of Wisconsin. There's no host team to satisfy northern Illinois or eastern Wisconsin. I would think if NCC wins the CCIW AQ, they could host or, gulp, SNC. I do suppose it depends on how may CCIW and WIAC teams get in.
Obviously a lot to still play and who knows what teams win their Pool A bid, but every team that is either currently winning their conference or Pool C top 20 (according to @D3Bubble) can get to Neb Wesleyan, St Thomas, Platteville or Wash U.
Per Neb. Wesleyan: Benedictine, Elmhurst, St. Norbert, and none of the UW's can get to NWU. I know you said "or," but there are only a few that are going to be able to get to NWU. That either will either hamper the committee's ability to split teams up especially for possibly second weekend games ... or keep them from sending NWU to very many places.
FYI - North Central is 499 miles from NWU; Benedictine is 502!
Using this: https://web1.ncaa.org/TES/exec/miles Platteville and La Crosse can both get to NWU in under 500 miles
Yeah, really don't see utilizing Nebraska Wesleyan as a host and potential round of 16 site as an issue. The committee can also choose to send Pomona-Pitzer or whoever wins the SCIAC to NWU and have them play NWU in the opener as they will have to be a flight regardless of where they go to fill the four teams.
This is true .. forgot about the western flank of Wisconsin. The risk, though, is you also need to make sure other teams can get to other teams. If you pull UWs out of there for NWU, you leave UST high and dry and probably WashU. The UWs can also get shifted eastward easily enough.
I'm planning on going to Salem Ft. Wayne this year. I'm pretty sure I want to see Nate West play.
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There is just one week left in the regular season and with it comes conference chaos.
Some conference tournaments are already underway and have seen upsets. It will be the theme of the week. With conference tournaments come upsets. Those upsets will cause teams on the NCAA tournament bubble to have their hopes burst. And there will be some Cinderellas who will capture the headlines.
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Sunday on Hoopsville (starting at a special earlier time) we chat with a few programs who are either looking to avoid the conference chaos or be a part of it.
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The Week 3 men's regional rankings are out: https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2020/02/men-regional-rankings-third
One good thing our of these rankings is how solidified the top 2-3 are for most regions. This is really helpful for bracketing, because hosts will be relatively easy to determine early.
-Stevens-Yeshiva won't change regardless of conference tourney outcomes.
-Same for JHU-Swat (a 1-2 head to head record isn't going to be enough for Hopkins to overtake the Garnet and they already beat CNU head to head behind them).
-I don't think either Platteville or WashU can be caught.
-Brockport has East #1 locked up. RPI probably stays ahead of Hobart regardless; at worst they'll be 2-1 head to head.
-Mount has beaten Marietta twice, so even a Marietta conference tourney win probably won't matter there and Marietta's SOS isn't likely strong enough to catch Witt, either.
-I could see UTD catching RMC if things work out a certain way, but you're going to have a Texas host anyway, so I don't know that it matters.
You're really just looking at the NE and W. Colby or Tufts winning the NESCAC could hop them over Middlebury, but you may have three hosts there anyway. Springfield would have to lose their semifinal to even be threatened and even then it may not be enough. St. John's winning the AQ could make things interesting out west, but the committee has already shown the SOS difference there is enough to keep the Tommies up. Maybe if NWU also loses early?
In any event, the top teams are much clearer than they've been in the past. We can confidently already pencil is as hosts:
Swarthmore
Johns Hopkins
Brockport
Platteville
WashU
Mt Union
Wittenberg
Emory
Randolph-Macon
UT-Dallas/LeTourneau
St. Thomas
Stevens
NWU
NESCAC - TBA
Springfield/NESCAC
That only leaves one spot. A third NE team might have a chance, unless it's Colby (although even Colby probably beats out RPI if they need an east team for geography. I don't see any way Yeshiva hosts under any circumstances). If they need someone out west or if Colby is the third NESCAC team, then you could see potentially St. John's, Benedictine, or North Central filling that spot, depending on how the weekend goes.
I suppose you could argue CNU might be in the mix there, but I don't think anyone else is.
As always, the actual teams in the tournament may dictate some geographic changes - RMC could be a casualty there and it's always tricky bracketing the midwest.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 26, 2020, 09:48:36 AM
One good thing our of these rankings is how solidified the top 2-3 are for most regions. This is really helpful for bracketing, because hosts will be relatively easy to determine early.
-Stevens-Yeshiva won't change regardless of conference tourney outcomes.
-Same for JHU-Swat (a 1-2 head to head record isn't going to be enough for Hopkins to overtake the Garnet and they already beat CNU head to head behind them).
-I don't think either Platteville or WashU can be caught.
-Brockport has East #1 locked up. RPI probably stays ahead of Hobart regardless; at worst they'll be 2-1 head to head.
-Mount has beaten Marietta twice, so even a Marietta conference tourney win probably won't matter there and Marietta's SOS isn't likely strong enough to catch Witt, either.
-I could see UTD catching RMC if things work out a certain way, but you're going to have a Texas host anyway, so I don't know that it matters.
You're really just looking at the NE and W. Colby or Tufts winning the NESCAC could hop them over Middlebury, but you may have three hosts there anyway. Springfield would have to lose their semifinal to even be threatened and even then it may not be enough. St. John's winning the AQ could make things interesting out west, but the committee has already shown the SOS difference there is enough to keep the Tommies up. Maybe if NWU also loses early?
In any event, the top teams are much clearer than they've been in the past. We can confidently already pencil is as hosts:
Swarthmore
Johns Hopkins
Brockport
Platteville
WashU
Mt Union
Wittenberg
Emory
Randolph-Macon
UT-Dallas/LeTourneau
St. Thomas
Stevens
NWU
NESCAC - TBA
Springfield/NESCAC
That only leaves one spot. A third NE team might have a chance, unless it's Colby (although even Colby probably beats out RPI if they need an east team for geography. I don't see any way Yeshiva hosts under any circumstances). If they need someone out west or if Colby is the third NESCAC team, then you could see potentially St. John's, Benedictine, or North Central filling that spot, depending on how the weekend goes.
I suppose you could argue CNU might be in the mix there, but I don't think anyone else is.
As always, the actual teams in the tournament may dictate some geographic changes - RMC could be a casualty there and it's always tricky bracketing the midwest.
Please elaborate....
Quote from: Swish3 on February 26, 2020, 12:15:05 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 26, 2020, 09:48:36 AM
One good thing our of these rankings is how solidified the top 2-3 are for most regions. This is really helpful for bracketing, because hosts will be relatively easy to determine early.
-Stevens-Yeshiva won't change regardless of conference tourney outcomes.
-Same for JHU-Swat (a 1-2 head to head record isn't going to be enough for Hopkins to overtake the Garnet and they already beat CNU head to head behind them).
-I don't think either Platteville or WashU can be caught.
-Brockport has East #1 locked up. RPI probably stays ahead of Hobart regardless; at worst they'll be 2-1 head to head.
-Mount has beaten Marietta twice, so even a Marietta conference tourney win probably won't matter there and Marietta's SOS isn't likely strong enough to catch Witt, either.
-I could see UTD catching RMC if things work out a certain way, but you're going to have a Texas host anyway, so I don't know that it matters.
You're really just looking at the NE and W. Colby or Tufts winning the NESCAC could hop them over Middlebury, but you may have three hosts there anyway. Springfield would have to lose their semifinal to even be threatened and even then it may not be enough. St. John's winning the AQ could make things interesting out west, but the committee has already shown the SOS difference there is enough to keep the Tommies up. Maybe if NWU also loses early?
In any event, the top teams are much clearer than they've been in the past. We can confidently already pencil is as hosts:
Swarthmore
Johns Hopkins
Brockport
Platteville
WashU
Mt Union
Wittenberg
Emory
Randolph-Macon
UT-Dallas/LeTourneau
St. Thomas
Stevens
NWU
NESCAC - TBA
Springfield/NESCAC
That only leaves one spot. A third NE team might have a chance, unless it's Colby (although even Colby probably beats out RPI if they need an east team for geography. I don't see any way Yeshiva hosts under any circumstances). If they need someone out west or if Colby is the third NESCAC team, then you could see potentially St. John's, Benedictine, or North Central filling that spot, depending on how the weekend goes.
I suppose you could argue CNU might be in the mix there, but I don't think anyone else is.
As always, the actual teams in the tournament may dictate some geographic changes - RMC could be a casualty there and it's always tricky bracketing the midwest.
Please elaborate....
I just mean, if CNU wins the CAC tourney, as expected, they'll be above .800 winning percentage with a .540 or so SOS. That certainly puts them in the mix for hosting, if geography is favorable - but geography is rarely favorable for CNU, which is why I discounted their chances so much. RMC will definitely host before them, due to the head to head and I can't see having enough teams to both feasible. I just wanted to recognize that they'll have a solid resume to be on the hosting bubble.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 26, 2020, 12:22:43 PM
Quote from: Swish3 on February 26, 2020, 12:15:05 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 26, 2020, 09:48:36 AM
One good thing our of these rankings is how solidified the top 2-3 are for most regions. This is really helpful for bracketing, because hosts will be relatively easy to determine early.
-Stevens-Yeshiva won't change regardless of conference tourney outcomes.
-Same for JHU-Swat (a 1-2 head to head record isn't going to be enough for Hopkins to overtake the Garnet and they already beat CNU head to head behind them).
-I don't think either Platteville or WashU can be caught.
-Brockport has East #1 locked up. RPI probably stays ahead of Hobart regardless; at worst they'll be 2-1 head to head.
-Mount has beaten Marietta twice, so even a Marietta conference tourney win probably won't matter there and Marietta's SOS isn't likely strong enough to catch Witt, either.
-I could see UTD catching RMC if things work out a certain way, but you're going to have a Texas host anyway, so I don't know that it matters.
You're really just looking at the NE and W. Colby or Tufts winning the NESCAC could hop them over Middlebury, but you may have three hosts there anyway. Springfield would have to lose their semifinal to even be threatened and even then it may not be enough. St. John's winning the AQ could make things interesting out west, but the committee has already shown the SOS difference there is enough to keep the Tommies up. Maybe if NWU also loses early?
In any event, the top teams are much clearer than they've been in the past. We can confidently already pencil is as hosts:
Swarthmore
Johns Hopkins
Brockport
Platteville
WashU
Mt Union
Wittenberg
Emory
Randolph-Macon
UT-Dallas/LeTourneau
St. Thomas
Stevens
NWU
NESCAC - TBA
Springfield/NESCAC
That only leaves one spot. A third NE team might have a chance, unless it's Colby (although even Colby probably beats out RPI if they need an east team for geography. I don't see any way Yeshiva hosts under any circumstances). If they need someone out west or if Colby is the third NESCAC team, then you could see potentially St. John's, Benedictine, or North Central filling that spot, depending on how the weekend goes.
I suppose you could argue CNU might be in the mix there, but I don't think anyone else is.
As always, the actual teams in the tournament may dictate some geographic changes - RMC could be a casualty there and it's always tricky bracketing the midwest.
Please elaborate....
I just mean, if CNU wins the CAC tourney, as expected, they'll be above .800 winning percentage with a .540 or so SOS. That certainly puts them in the mix for hosting, if geography is favorable - but geography is rarely favorable for CNU, which is why I discounted their chances so much. RMC will definitely host before them, due to the head to head and I can't see having enough teams to both feasible. I just wanted to recognize that they'll have a solid resume to be on the hosting bubble.
Ain't that the truth...thanks, Ryan!
We'll probably need 7 host sites in the Great Lakes/Central/West again.
I thought Hopkin's Gym was too small to host?
Johns Hopkins has hosted before and would host again. Maybe there might be a need for separate sessions, but Goldfarb Gymnasium is plenty big enough for the first weekend.
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The race for conference championships and automatic bids to the NCAA tournaments is nearly at it's peak. In less than 72 hours, we will know who have punched their tickets to the 'dance' and who sits on the edge of their seat hoping to keep playing in March.
Thursday night on Hoopsville, we not only recap what has already happened in conference tournaments across Division III, but we also look ahead at what should be an exciting final weekend of the regular season. Conference champions crowned, upsets, and those who's hopes to still playing will see their bubbles burst.
We also talk to both national committee chairs about the work left ahead of them, what they hope people understand about the process, and how they see bracketing coming together. Plus, we look ahead at the second annual Beyond Sports & WBCA Division III Women's All-Star Game and championship weekend.
Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Dixie Jeffers, Capital women's coach (WBCA Center Court)
- Karin Harvey, Montclair State women's coach & DIII Women's National Committee Chair
- Sam Atkinson, Gallaudet Assoc. Dir. of Communications & DIII Men's National Committee Chair
Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch Sunday's show
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Monday's show primarily covers the Atlantic, Central, South, and Northeast Regions. All men's coaches appear in the NABC Coach's Corner. And all guests are featured on the BlueFrame Technology Hoopsville Hotline.
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Quote from: NEPAFAN on February 27, 2020, 11:21:01 AM
I thought Hopkin's Gym was too small to host?
For purely personal reasons, I hope Scranton is sent there. ;)
Quote from: ronk on February 27, 2020, 07:55:07 PM
Quote from: NEPAFAN on February 27, 2020, 11:21:01 AM
I thought Hopkin's Gym was too small to host?
For purely personal reasons, I hope Scranton is sent there. ;)
For reasons of spreading out different region teams ... I rather they not.
But I wouldn't mind that myself. :)
I had fun watching parts of about 12 games online tonight...at times, four games on the screen at once. Tournament time is fun.
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 27, 2020, 08:16:34 PM
Quote from: ronk on February 27, 2020, 07:55:07 PM
Quote from: NEPAFAN on February 27, 2020, 11:21:01 AM
I thought Hopkin's Gym was too small to host?
For purely personal reasons, I hope Scranton is sent there. ;)
For reasons of spreading out different region teams ... I rather they not.
But I wouldn't mind that myself. :)
I'm guessing that you're referring to them both being in the Mid-Atlantic playing region instead of being in different administrative(region 1 - JHU, region 2 - Scranton) regions.
Hah -- haven't thought about administrative regions in years. Once they started calling all D-III games in region, the administrative regions became afterthoughts.
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 27, 2020, 11:48:53 PM
Hah -- haven't thought about administrative regions in years. Once they started calling all D-III games in region, the administrative regions became afterthoughts.
It may make a little more difference once we get to 10 regions. Some schools may need to watch those boundaries to get to 70%, depending on how things are divided.
Quote from: ronk on February 27, 2020, 11:46:49 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 27, 2020, 08:16:34 PM
Quote from: ronk on February 27, 2020, 07:55:07 PM
Quote from: NEPAFAN on February 27, 2020, 11:21:01 AM
I thought Hopkin's Gym was too small to host?
For purely personal reasons, I hope Scranton is sent there. ;)
For reasons of spreading out different region teams ... I rather they not.
But I wouldn't mind that myself. :)
I'm guessing that you're referring to them both being in the Mid-Atlantic playing region instead of being in different administrative(region 1 - JHU, region 2 - Scranton) regions.
Administrative regions never comes up when it comes to bracketing.
Yes ... both being Mid-Atlantic teams. I rather see four different regions in a pod whenever possible and based on not only JHU's location but where Scranton resides, to have them both in the same pod would seem like significant opportunities missed.
Nichols and La Roche with one-point victories in their conference finals today. Going dancing. Westfield St also wins.
York upsets CNU, but both are in.
Brooklyn, which only won 10 games in the regular season, pulls its third upset by seed in a week last night to win the CUNYAC and dance at 13-15. This is March, as Jon Rothstein says. It's not, but yanno.
Western Connecticut (20-7) has just punched its ticket. SUNY Canton (16-11) knocks off Maine-Farmington to win the NAC, since they haven't been eligible very long I assume this is the first dance for the punnily named Canton Kangaroos!
NEAC champ: Penn State Harrisburg (20-7) beat Lancaster Bible in OT. That move from the CAC to the NEAC immediately pays off.
Awesome for the Kangaroos! That's a great job by Coach Ben Thompson.
Quote from: Smitty Oom on February 29, 2020, 05:14:26 PM
Awesome for the Kangaroos! That's a great job by Coach Ben Thompson.
he's not there anymore. Former Chicago assistant Shiva Senthil is in his first year as head coach at Canton.
Quote from: Caz Bombers on February 29, 2020, 05:37:35 PM
Quote from: Smitty Oom on February 29, 2020, 05:14:26 PM
Awesome for the Kangaroos! That's a great job by Coach Ben Thompson.
he's not there anymore. Former Chicago assistant Shiva Senthil is in his first year as head coach at Canton.
Oh dang.. I knew coach Thompson but I guess and I thought I followed that team somewhat closely... but I guess not.
Connor Delaney....wow! Johns Hopkins takes the Centennial on a buzzer beater to hand Swarthmore its first loss. Would love to see these two play a 4th time.
LeTourneau (from Longview TX) 82, ETBU 79 (from Marshall TX) at Sul Ross State (in Alpine TX, officially 631 and 655 miles respectively) in the ASC Finals.
What a bus ride!
Quote from: Caz Bombers on February 29, 2020, 04:04:25 PMWestern Connecticut (20-7) has just punched its ticket. SUNY Canton (16-11) knocks off Maine-Farmington to win the NAC, since they haven't been eligible very long I assume this is the first dance for the punnily named Canton Kangaroos!
That team ought to wear green jeans during warmups.
Quote from: Caz Bombers on February 29, 2020, 04:04:25 PMNEAC champ: Penn State Harrisburg (20-7) beat Lancaster Bible in OT. That move from the CAC to the NEAC immediately pays off.
PSU-Harrisburg joins the list of first-timers in the D3 field, along with SUNY Canton and Adrian.
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 29, 2020, 10:41:32 PM
Quote from: Caz Bombers on February 29, 2020, 04:04:25 PMWestern Connecticut (20-7) has just punched its ticket. SUNY Canton (16-11) knocks off Maine-Farmington to win the NAC, since they haven't been eligible very long I assume this is the first dance for the punnily named Canton Kangaroos!
That team ought to wear green jeans during warmups.
That pun borders on being smite-worthy!
What is the time on Monday for the tournament selections?
Sunday, March 1 Deadline for conference offices to report their 2020 Automatic Q.
Fourth regional ranking.
Monday, March 2 Team selections and announcement of brackets.
CHAMPIONSHIP DATES
Friday/Saturday, March 6-7 First-/second-round games at 16 campus sites.
Friday, March 13 Third-round games at four campus sites (one game at each site).
Saturday, March 14 Third-round games at four different campus sites (one game at each site).
Friday/Saturday, March 20-21 Quarterfinal and semifinal games in Fort Wayne, Indiana.
Sunday, April 5 National championship game in Atlanta, Georgia.
I believe its 12:30 for men, 2:30 for women.
When's the big hoopsville Pool C show?
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 01, 2020, 02:05:23 PM
When's the big hoopsville Pool C show?
Dave goes on at 6pm; I think there are a couple interviews before we start picking.
Giving this web link a bump for those who want to work on their 500 mile pods.
https://web1.ncaa.org/TES/exec/miles
I specifically, was looking at a pod for NWU. Very few teams can get to NWU. WashU and UW-Platteville seem to be in good position to also host, so they likely won't be heading to NWU. Likely teams that could go to Lincoln include Saint John's/St. Thomas non hoster, Bethany Lutheran, Webster, North Central, and La Crosse and IWU if they happen to make it in at the end of the bubble.
This is limited to say the least without using a flight. Saint John's winning Pool A seems the more likely MIAC teams to host. St. Thomas and La Crosse met in the neutral game in Lincoln last year, which complicates things more. Maybe sending Pomona-Pitzer on a flight to NWU wouldn't be bad.
Would have to imagine Emory pod and Texas Pod (Letourneau/Texas Dallas) will be adjacent to each other in the bracket to try and minimize flight possibilities.
Emory pod will almost definitely be Emory vs Methodist; Centre vs Transylvania because those are the 3 teams that can get to Emory.
Quote from: D3RetiredHooper on March 01, 2020, 04:10:46 PM
Would have to imagine Emory pod and Texas Pod (Letourneau/Texas Dallas) will be adjacent to each other in the bracket to try and minimize flight possibilities.
Emory pod will almost definitely be Emory vs Methodist; Centre vs Transylvania because those are the 3 teams that can get to Emory.
You're going to have an extra flight somewhere, with the SCIAC and NWC teams. You might have three if Whitworth makes it in. Transy can drive to Randolph-Macon, so I suspect they'll end up there, with maybe Whitman or Whitworth at Emory. UTD is definitely getting in, so you'll have three teams in Texas with maybe Pomona there.
We're also going to have to see how potential second weekend geography works in the midwest - it might end up making more sense to pair the Texas pod with St Thomas or NWU if there aren't enough teams to get even numbers. Elmhurst could go to Mount Union second weekend, if necessary.
I think it's a little more fluid than what you've got here.
Quote from: D3RetiredHooper on March 01, 2020, 04:10:46 PM
Would have to imagine Emory pod and Texas Pod (Letourneau/Texas Dallas) will be adjacent to each other in the bracket to try and minimize flight possibilities.
Emory pod will almost definitely be Emory vs Methodist; Centre vs Transylvania because those are the 3 teams that can get to Emory.
Since Centre and Transylvania played each other twice in the regular season, I think it is doubtful that they would face each other in the first round.
Quote from: Baldini on March 01, 2020, 09:15:55 PM
Quote from: D3RetiredHooper on March 01, 2020, 04:10:46 PM
Would have to imagine Emory pod and Texas Pod (Letourneau/Texas Dallas) will be adjacent to each other in the bracket to try and minimize flight possibilities.
Emory pod will almost definitely be Emory vs Methodist; Centre vs Transylvania because those are the 3 teams that can get to Emory.
Since Centre and Transylvania played each other twice in the regular season, I think it is doubtful that they would face each other in the first round.
You've got Whitman, probably Whitworth, and Pomona who all have to fly somewhere. Hopefully they'll drive Transy somewhere else to avoid the third meeting.
Here's our projected bracket:
https://www.d3hoops.com/playoffs/men/2020/projected-mens-bracket
https://www.ncaa.com/news/basketball-men/article/2020-02-29/2020-diii-mens-basketball-selection-show-date-time-how-watch
Map I put together of tournament teams and bubble teams: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1hU23OPjDhOimHOSjwVblh-rXpJZ5T2O1&usp=sharing
I wanted to get this done before the show, so I didn't have time to include more of the bubble teams.
Now that the bracket's out, here's an map of all the teams, grouped by bracket: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1jt77yEWHz76V0S_d5IwpjCbKnUWIBgvs&usp=sharing
Quote from: Inkblot on March 02, 2020, 01:32:22 PM
Now that the bracket's out, here's an map of all the teams, grouped by bracket: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1jt77yEWHz76V0S_d5IwpjCbKnUWIBgvs&usp=sharing
This is great, Inkblot. +1
Not really related to anything, but watching the Milwaukee Bucks...and Duncan Robinson lighting it up for the Miami Heat.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 02, 2020, 09:05:15 PM
Not really related to anything, but watching the Milwaukee Bucks...and Duncan Robinson lighting it up for the Miami Heat.
He was recently on one of my favorite podcasts (right after Hoopsville of course) Titus and A
Tate podcast. It was very good. Talk about his time at Michigan and his rise to a NBA starter for a playoff team, relationship with Belien, 3 contest and more. He's a great interview and it's a casual convo. Definitely would recommend.
Quote from: Smitty Oom on March 02, 2020, 10:35:29 PM
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 02, 2020, 09:05:15 PM
Not really related to anything, but watching the Milwaukee Bucks...and Duncan Robinson lighting it up for the Miami Heat.
He was recently on one of my favorite podcasts (right after Hoopsville of course) Titus and A
Tate podcast. It was very good. Talk about his time at Michigan and his rise to a NBA starter for a playoff team, relationship with Belien, 3 contest and more. He's a great interview and it's a casual convo. Definitely would recommend.
Well if Hoopsville is really a favorite of yours ... you will remember we have had Robinson on said show. :)
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 02, 2020, 10:53:45 PM
Quote from: Smitty Oom on March 02, 2020, 10:35:29 PM
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 02, 2020, 09:05:15 PM
Not really related to anything, but watching the Milwaukee Bucks...and Duncan Robinson lighting it up for the Miami Heat.
He was recently on one of my favorite podcasts (right after Hoopsville of course) Titus and A
Tate podcast. It was very good. Talk about his time at Michigan and his rise to a NBA starter for a playoff team, relationship with Belien, 3 contest and more. He's a great interview and it's a casual convo. Definitely would recommend.
Well if Hoopsville is really a favorite of yours ... you will remember we have had Robinson on said show. :)
Oh really, When was that? I don't remember at all. I started listening routinely in 2018, only listened if MIAC guests were on in 2017.
Quote from: Smitty Oom on March 02, 2020, 11:20:16 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 02, 2020, 10:53:45 PM
Quote from: Smitty Oom on March 02, 2020, 10:35:29 PM
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 02, 2020, 09:05:15 PM
Not really related to anything, but watching the Milwaukee Bucks...and Duncan Robinson lighting it up for the Miami Heat.
He was recently on one of my favorite podcasts (right after Hoopsville of course) Titus and A
Tate podcast. It was very good. Talk about his time at Michigan and his rise to a NBA starter for a playoff team, relationship with Belien, 3 contest and more. He's a great interview and it's a casual convo. Definitely would recommend.
Well if Hoopsville is really a favorite of yours ... you will remember we have had Robinson on said show. :)
Oh really, When was that? I don't remember at all. I started listening routinely in 2018, only listened if MIAC guests were on in 2017.
My memory seems to recall January 2018.
Nope - year prior: https://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2016-17/feb2
Bracket challenge anywhere this year?
I would also join that. I was thinking of doing a different type of challenge on the fantasy and pickem thread. Check that out.
Anyone notice the "pod of death" at Platteville, First day has St. Thomas (23-3) vs. St. Norbert (22-4), and the winner likely gets host Platteville (22-4) the next evening. Three Massey top 20 Pool C teams in the same pod. Watching that one carefully.
Quote from: thebear on March 03, 2020, 02:42:07 PM
Anyone notice the "pod of death" at Platteville, First day has St. Thomas (23-3) vs. St. Norbert (22-4), and the winner likely gets host Platteville (22-4) the next evening. Three Massey top 20 Pool C teams in the same pod. Watching that one carefully.
Not to mention that they would then be rewarded with either St. John's or Eau Claire, assuming they can get through Whitman who has only won almost 100 games in the last four years.
Quote from: Smitty Oom on March 03, 2020, 01:29:31 PM
I would also join that. I was thinking of doing a different type of challenge on the fantasy and pickem thread. Check that out.
http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=9044.0
Come join the fun with this contest, plus more if you want!
Quote from: SpringSt7 on March 03, 2020, 03:03:36 PM
Quote from: thebear on March 03, 2020, 02:42:07 PM
Anyone notice the "pod of death" at Platteville, First day has St. Thomas (23-3) vs. St. Norbert (22-4), and the winner likely gets host Platteville (22-4) the next evening. Three Massey top 20 Pool C teams in the same pod. Watching that one carefully.
Not to mention that they would then be rewarded with either St. John's or Eau Claire, assuming they can get through Whitman who has only won almost 100 games in the last four years.
The toughest potential second round matchup in my opinion too. I think the first round game with the two strongest teams has to be Colby vs CNU. Thats a tough draw for both!
St. Thomas #4 and St. Norbert #22 are both in the top 25, only first round game that matches two top 25 teams, combined Massey of 20.
Colby is ranked 12th and CNU is 30th (ORV) Combined Massey of 40.
Both very tough matchups on neutral courts, Colby & CNU both have 400 mile bus rides [Ugh].
Quote from: thebear on March 04, 2020, 09:13:33 AM
St. Thomas #4 and St. Norbert #22 are both in the top 25, only first round game that matches two top 25 teams, combined Massey of 20.
Colby is ranked 12th and CNU is 30th (ORV) Combined Massey of 40.
Both very tough matchups on neutral courts, Colby & CNU both have 400 mile bus rides [Ugh].
Colby/CNU should be an interesting one -- CNU leads the country in 3ptFG% defense, and Colby shoots more threes (and shoots them well, 38% on the year) than any non-system teams (Grinnell and Greenville only two ahead of them). Something will have to give in that one.
Another interesting factoid is that out of the top 50 schools in 3pt FG defense, 17 (34%) are in the tournament. That would point to 3 pt defense being a key stat for successful teams.
Quote from: thebear on March 04, 2020, 11:29:39 AM
Another interesting factoid is that out of the top 50 schools in 3pt FG defense, 17 (34%) are in the tournament. That would point to 3 pt defense being a key stat for successful teams.
FG defense (and increasingly 3pt FG defense) along with rebound margin are typically pretty good indicators of success.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 04, 2020, 11:31:25 AM
Quote from: thebear on March 04, 2020, 11:29:39 AM
Another interesting factoid is that out of the top 50 schools in 3pt FG defense, 17 (34%) are in the tournament. That would point to 3 pt defense being a key stat for successful teams.
FG defense (and increasingly 3pt FG defense) along with rebound margin are typically pretty good indicators of success.
Incidentally, Hobart leads the nation in both, which would be troubling if they were not 407th in turnover margin. That negates a lot of extra possessions.
Quote from: thebear on March 04, 2020, 11:29:39 AM
Another interesting factoid is that out of the top 50 schools in 3pt FG defense, 17 (34%) are in the tournament. That would point to 3 pt defense being a key stat for successful teams.
But that also means 66% are sitting home this weekend. :D :D
Quote from: CNU85 on March 04, 2020, 11:42:39 AM
Quote from: thebear on March 04, 2020, 11:29:39 AM
Another interesting factoid is that out of the top 50 schools in 3pt FG defense, 17 (34%) are in the tournament. That would point to 3 pt defense being a key stat for successful teams.
But that also means 66% are sitting home this weekend. :D :D
It's 11 of the Top 20, though.
Quote from: CNU85 on March 04, 2020, 11:42:39 AM
Quote from: thebear on March 04, 2020, 11:29:39 AM
Another interesting factoid is that out of the top 50 schools in 3pt FG defense, 17 (34%) are in the tournament. That would point to 3 pt defense being a key stat for successful teams.
But that also means 66% are sitting home this weekend. :D :D
But only 15% of all teams are in the tourney! So that means more than double what would you expect if it was completely random or the stat had no effect on a teams success.
Quote from: Smitty Oom on March 04, 2020, 11:44:47 AM
Quote from: CNU85 on March 04, 2020, 11:42:39 AM
Quote from: thebear on March 04, 2020, 11:29:39 AM
Another interesting factoid is that out of the top 50 schools in 3pt FG defense, 17 (34%) are in the tournament. That would point to 3 pt defense being a key stat for successful teams.
But that also means 66% are sitting home this weekend. :D :D
But only 15% of all teams are in the tourney! So that means more than double what would you expect if it was completely random or the stat had no effect on a teams success.
aha...that math stuff! Thanks!
I'm surprised that correlates so well for D3. In the NBA (which admittedly is world's different than D3) 3pt FG defense is seen as something that defenses can't control very effectively. For most team's it regresses back to the mean over a large sample.
Quote from: Colby Hoops on March 04, 2020, 11:57:18 AM
I'm surprised that correlates so well for D3. In the NBA (which admittedly is world's different than D3) 3pt FG defense is seen as something that defenses can't control very effectively. For most team's it regresses back to the mean over a large sample.
The extra space makes a big difference. Even NBA bodies can't effectively cover all that distance consistently. The tighter three point zone in college does make it a little easier for defenses to scheme. There are a few mitigating factors, though - fast paced teams often have low 3pt defense because opponents just aren't shooting many (pressure defense provides more opportunity to get the ball to the rim). I'm sure there are more advanced stats that account for those things.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 04, 2020, 12:02:39 PM
Quote from: Colby Hoops on March 04, 2020, 11:57:18 AM
I'm surprised that correlates so well for D3. In the NBA (which admittedly is world's different than D3) 3pt FG defense is seen as something that defenses can't control very effectively. For most team's it regresses back to the mean over a large sample.
The extra space makes a big difference. Even NBA bodies can't effectively cover all that distance consistently. The tighter three point zone in college does make it a little easier for defenses to scheme. There are a few mitigating factors, though - fast paced teams often have low 3pt defense because opponents just aren't shooting many (pressure defense provides more opportunity to get the ball to the rim). I'm sure there are more advanced stats that account for those things.
I'd say it's more about NBA players bringing less defensive effort as the games are longer, the season is way longer and zone defense is illegal.
Zone has been legal since 2001, but they still have a defensive three seconds rule.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/17/sports/basketball/nba-zone-defense.html
Quote from: smedindy on March 04, 2020, 12:24:46 PM
Zone has been legal since 2001, but they still have a defensive three seconds rule.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/17/sports/basketball/nba-zone-defense.html
They play D in the NBA? Bahahahaha. I stopped watching the NBA a long time ago. So boring!
Quote from: AO on March 04, 2020, 12:20:14 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 04, 2020, 12:02:39 PM
Quote from: Colby Hoops on March 04, 2020, 11:57:18 AM
I'm surprised that correlates so well for D3. In the NBA (which admittedly is world's different than D3) 3pt FG defense is seen as something that defenses can't control very effectively. For most team's it regresses back to the mean over a large sample.
The extra space makes a big difference. Even NBA bodies can't effectively cover all that distance consistently. The tighter three point zone in college does make it a little easier for defenses to scheme. There are a few mitigating factors, though - fast paced teams often have low 3pt defense because opponents just aren't shooting many (pressure defense provides more opportunity to get the ball to the rim). I'm sure there are more advanced stats that account for those things.
I'd say it's more about NBA players bringing less defensive effort as the games are longer, the season is way longer and zone defense is illegal.
If it was effort based, you'd expect it would show up in the playoffs, which it does not. I think Ryan's floor spacing comments certainly make sense. Additionally, given the effectiveness of pick and rolls and how good guys are off the dribble in the NBA, if teams sell out to stop threes, they're almost certainly giving up better looks at the rim. At this level, you don't have to compromise your interior defense nearly as much to stop the three.
There are obviously a lot of things that don't translate from the NBA to D3. Post ups in D3 can still be a +EV offense, where in the NBA that's rarely the case. Just found it interesting!
3pt defense is tricky, it can be fairly random. Having a low 3pt% defense can also mean you just played a bunch of below average 3pt shooting teams or even a lot of home games as even good teams tend to shoot 3's at lower % on the road.
When the line moves out another foot for D3, I suspect we'll see 3pt numbers come down a bit more, both accuracy and volume.
I'd definitely agree that it could take a dip temporarily, but typically those numbers have come back up after a short period. I also think that as analytics continues to permeate basketball, we'll probably have more 3's shot.
Quote from: smedindy on March 04, 2020, 12:24:46 PM
Zone has been legal since 2001, but they still have a defensive three seconds rule.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/17/sports/basketball/nba-zone-defense.html
The 3 second rule makes it very difficult to play zone, so most don't even try. In theory a zone would allow more 3s, so maybe that wasn't the best example anyways.
Quote from: Colby Hoops on March 04, 2020, 12:57:15 PM
If it was effort based, you'd expect it would show up in the playoffs, which it does not. I think Ryan's floor spacing comments certainly make sense. Additionally, given the effectiveness of pick and rolls and how good guys are off the dribble in the NBA, if teams sell out to stop threes, they're almost certainly giving up better looks at the rim. At this level, you don't have to compromise your interior defense nearly as much to stop the three.
There are obviously a lot of things that don't translate from the NBA to D3. Post ups in D3 can still be a +EV offense, where in the NBA that's rarely the case. Just found it interesting!
There is definitely another level of defense in the NBA playoffs, but the teams that are left are usually pretty good at shooting the 3, so the stats might not show that extra effort.
How hard would it be for the committee to try and seed teams 1-16 in each region? Colby/CNU would be a heck of a 5/12 game in the division-1 bracket, assuming Stevens is a 4-seed. Obviously CNU is fairly land-locked and could only get to Mt Union, Stevens, Swat, Hopkins (who they played already) and Macon (who they played already) so that may not be a fair example.
For instance, Mount Union Region according to Massey (not a NCAA measurement) and where they finished ranked in their region:
1. Mt Union (1) GL-1
16. Cairn (284) Unranked
8. York (26) MA-3
9. St John Fisher (96) Unranked
4. Wittenberg (6) GL-3
13. La Roche (145) GL-9
5. Benedictine (83) CE-5
12. Susquehanna (93) MA-8
2. Macon (3) S-1
15. Wesley (142) AT-4
7. Marietta (20) GL-4
10. TCNJ (57) AT-3
3. Hopkins (14) MA-2
14. Penn State Harrisburg (202) Unranked
6. WPI (45) NE-5
11. Yeshiva (22) AT-2
Quote from: D3RetiredHooper on March 04, 2020, 05:48:19 PM
How hard would it be for the committee to try and seed teams 1-16 in each region? Colby/CNU would be a heck of a 5/12 game in the division-1 bracket, assuming Stevens is a 4-seed. Obviously CNU is fairly land-locked and could only get to Mt Union, Stevens, Swat, Hopkins (who they played already) and Macon (who they played already) so that may not be a fair example.
For instance, Mount Union Region according to Massey (not a NCAA measurement) and where they finished ranked in their region:
1. Mt Union (1) GL-1
16. Cairn (284) Unranked
8. York (26) MA-3
9. St John Fisher (96) Unranked
4. Wittenberg (6) GL-3
13. La Roche (145) GL-9
5. Benedictine (83) CE-5
12. Susquehanna (93) MA-8
2. Macon (3) S-1
15. Wesley (142) AT-4
7. Marietta (20) GL-4
10. TCNJ (57) AT-3
3. Hopkins (14) MA-2
14. Penn State Harrisburg (202) Unranked
6. WPI (45) NE-5
11. Yeshiva (22) AT-2
Very difficult to do because the D1 tournament can move teams around to find the appropriate seeds to face each team. They don't have any travel restrictions. DIII has massive travel restrictions with brackets being determined by 500 mile travel rules and hosting determined by who put in/available to host and which gender has the priority that particular year (look at Tufts women which got the top seeded spot, but is on the road because their men are hosting).
The other thing that makes 1-16 bracketing difficult in D-III is that there are 43 pool A and 1 pool B bids. 22 of these AQ bids are to teams that likely would not make the tournament otherwise [Massey 65 and below].
In D-I there are 68 bids and only 32 AQ's four of which must play in the Tuesday/Wednesday first four to get the honor of meeting a 1 seed on the weekend (16 seeds are 1-139 vs. 1 seeds).
Costs and Geography also are an issue in D-III, although I suspect the D-I tournament spends more on the hospitality rooms at the various sites than the entire cost of the D-III tournament.
if NCAA would only open its wallet, this could happen like it does in D1. How cool of an experience would that be for players?
If D3 would only generate Television and Merchandise revenue like D1
Quote from: VT-Alum-NOVA on March 05, 2020, 10:26:38 AM
if NCAA would only open its wallet, this could happen like it does in D1. How cool of an experience would that be for players?
I like the unique elements of how the D3 tournament works. I wish they'd loosen the reigns a little in terms of budget to better balance the bracket, but we don't need to do a 100% national bracket like d1. You do lose something in that.
Quote from: VT-Alum-NOVA on March 05, 2020, 10:26:38 AM
if NCAA would only open its wallet, this could happen like it does in D1. How cool of an experience would that be for players?
DIII gets 3.18% of the operating budget. The D1 MBB tournament brings in something like 90% of that operating budget. Feel free to tell D1 to give up the money it's making for a division that isn't bringing in any revenue other than dues.
I'd love to see more money in DIII, but I am also realistic of the situation. The percentage was agreed upon back in the 70s when the divisions were created. DIII will get more money in the future, but the costs of producing the tournaments in all sports continues to go up (transportation and official fees being the biggest cost rises).
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 05, 2020, 10:56:06 AM
Quote from: VT-Alum-NOVA on March 05, 2020, 10:26:38 AM
if NCAA would only open its wallet, this could happen like it does in D1. How cool of an experience would that be for players?
I like the unique elements of how the D3 tournament works. I wish they'd loosen the reigns a little in terms of budget to better balance the bracket, but we don't need to do a 100% national bracket like d1. You do lose something in that.
The only I would like a more national level is so we don't see St. Thomas and St. John's possibly meeting sooner than later. So we don't see conference opponents like Texas-Dallas and LeTourneau possibly meeting in the 2nd round. Move conference teams as far away from each other as possible.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 05, 2020, 01:25:57 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 05, 2020, 10:56:06 AM
Quote from: VT-Alum-NOVA on March 05, 2020, 10:26:38 AM
if NCAA would only open its wallet, this could happen like it does in D1. How cool of an experience would that be for players?
I like the unique elements of how the D3 tournament works. I wish they'd loosen the reigns a little in terms of budget to better balance the bracket, but we don't need to do a 100% national bracket like d1. You do lose something in that.
The only I would like a more national level is so we don't see St. Thomas and St. John's possibly meeting sooner than later. So we don't see conference opponents like Texas-Dallas and LeTourneau possibly meeting in the 2nd round. Move conference teams as far away from each other as possible.
That's sort of what I mean. I'd love enough leeway to properly bracket 1-4 in each quadrant, at least. It would only be one or two more flights a year. It's really just a Midwest issue; the East Coast is usually compact enough to make it work.
Excellent preview and predictions Ryan. Bravo! Only 23 hours now until the games begin.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 05, 2020, 01:25:57 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 05, 2020, 10:56:06 AM
Quote from: VT-Alum-NOVA on March 05, 2020, 10:26:38 AM
if NCAA would only open its wallet, this could happen like it does in D1. How cool of an experience would that be for players?
I like the unique elements of how the D3 tournament works. I wish they'd loosen the reigns a little in terms of budget to better balance the bracket, but we don't need to do a 100% national bracket like d1. You do lose something in that.
The only I would like a more national level is so we don't see St. Thomas and St. John's possibly meeting sooner than later. So we don't see conference opponents like Texas-Dallas and LeTourneau possibly meeting in the 2nd round. Move conference teams as far away from each other as possible.
That would be nice ... and if the current pilot program (three years) is adopted, I wouldn't be surprised of committees push for no conference opponents in the first-weekend ... however, that would incur a significant cost, so I am not holding my breathe.
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The Division III Men's and Women's Basketball Tournaments are set to get going. It all starts at 1:00 p.m. ET on Friday with the first men's game.
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Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
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Johns Hopkins just announced they will not permit spectators to attend the first or second rounds games on their campus. Less than 15 hours before the first tip.
Guess you're staying home this weekend.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 05, 2020, 11:36:21 PM
Guess you're staying home this weekend.
We've been told media credentials will be honored. I plan to go. I'm also planning to drive from Baltimore to Philadelphia after the first game to catch the double headed at Swarthmore.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 05, 2020, 11:40:56 PM
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 05, 2020, 11:36:21 PM
Guess you're staying home this weekend.
We've been told media credentials will be honored. I plan to go. I'm also planning to drive from Baltimore to Philadelphia after the first game to catch the double headed at Swarthmore.
So - if you're a journalist(media) its ok to be potentially exposed.
If you are a player or coach its ok to be potentially exposed
If you are an official or time keeper its ok to be potentially exposed
If you are a parent of a player it is not ok to be potentially exposed
If you are a fan it is not ok to be potentially exposed.
I understand and support cautionary measures. I do not understand selective cautionary measures not based on medical circumstances but rather on what type of attendee you are to the event. I'm sure others will disagree. Just stating my opinion.
And the hotel that canceled Yeshiva's reservations. Geez. Would you rather have a team that has been checked out medically and cleared for travel, or random people walking in your front door in which you have no idea if they just stepped off a plan from Italy?
On with the games! This is making my heart monitor act up!
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 05, 2020, 11:40:56 PM
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 05, 2020, 11:36:21 PM
Guess you're staying home this weekend.
We've been told media credentials will be honored. I plan to go. I'm also planning to drive from Baltimore to Philadelphia after the first game to catch the double headed at Swarthmore.
Will be curious to hear how the empty gym effects the game, if at all.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 05, 2020, 11:29:09 PM
Johns Hopkins just announced they will not permit spectators to attend the first or second rounds games on their campus. Less than 15 hours before the first tip.
Absolutely ridiculous. Ugh.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 05, 2020, 11:29:09 PM
Johns Hopkins just announced they will not permit spectators to attend the first or second rounds games on their campus. Less than 15 hours before the first tip.
That's going to be a strange experience to play the biggest games of each team's season in front of an empty gym. Seems like there would have been capacity crowds for both games too.
And, ya know, for freaking JOHNS HOPKINS, a major medical research institution which is heavily involved in the COVAD-19 effort to do something this stupid sends a message that probably shouldn't be sent.
Quote from: Ron Boerger on March 06, 2020, 08:38:44 AM
And, ya know, for freaking JOHNS HOPKINS, a major medical research institution which is heavily involved in the COVAD-19 effort to do something this stupid sends a message that probably shouldn't be sent.
Or perhaps we have that backward. JOHNS HOPKINS is a major medical research institution with one of the world's premiere infectious disease departments. For them to do something like this sends a message that we might need to spend more time listening too. I guess it just depends on your point of view. Do you trust medical professionals, who are very concerned about this, or do you not?
That is your decision. But just about every major world leader, national medical service, international medical service says this is a difficult problem. Just about every major professional investor has decided this is a major problem. Just about every major travel company has admitted this is a major problem.
The people claiming this is not a major problem don't tend to have those credentials or that skin in the game.
Johns Hopkins has a home Lacrosse game against Maryland scheduled for tomorrow (Saturday) which has not been altered or changed in any way. There will be fans outside the gym in the afternoon, but not allowed in for the evening.
This is what really bothers me. It seems, from the outside, like they're targeting Yeshiva and any fans who might come from NY. If it's a general concern, they should ban fans from Lacrosse, too, right?
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 06, 2020, 09:18:52 AM
Johns Hopkins has a home Lacrosse game against Maryland scheduled for tomorrow (Saturday) which has not been altered or changed in any way. There will be fans outside the gym in the afternoon, but not allowed in for the evening.
This is what really bothers me. It seems, from the outside, like they're targeting Yeshiva and any fans who might come from NY. If it's a general concern, they should ban fans from Lacrosse, too, right?
Exactly. Selective cautionary measures.
or perhaps because JHU Lacrosse is D1 has something to do with that?
Does this have something to do with why Yeshiva is being singled out?
https://nypost.com/2020/03/04/yeshiva-university-cancels-classes-after-student-diagnosed-with-coronavirus/
Quote from: jknezek on March 06, 2020, 09:10:58 AM
Quote from: Ron Boerger on March 06, 2020, 08:38:44 AM
And, ya know, for freaking JOHNS HOPKINS, a major medical research institution which is heavily involved in the COVAD-19 effort to do something this stupid sends a message that probably shouldn't be sent.
Or perhaps we have that backward. JOHNS HOPKINS is a major medical research institution with one of the world's premiere infectious disease departments. For them to do something like this sends a message that we might need to spend more time listening too. I guess it just depends on your point of view. Do you trust medical professionals, who are very concerned about this, or do you not?
That is your decision. But just about every major world leader, national medical service, international medical service says this is a difficult problem. Just about every major professional investor has decided this is a major problem. Just about every major travel company has admitted this is a major problem.
The people claiming this is not a major problem don't tend to have those credentials or that skin in the game.
This crossed my mind as well. What do they know that we don't? But then as Ryan points out, it isn't consistent with Lacrosse. And as I pointed out, they are selective in attendees. If it's a concern, NOBODY gets in other than teams and officials. HA - If I am a parent I'm standing outside with a wad of cash ready to buy a media pass! ;D
QuoteSo - if you're a journalist(media) its ok to be potentially exposed.
If you are a player or coach its ok to be potentially exposed
If you are an official or time keeper its ok to be potentially exposed
If you are a parent of a player it is not ok to be potentially exposed
If you are a fan it is not ok to be potentially exposed.
Media are probably free to skip the event of their own volition. If we're being honest, at this level they don't need to be there for the event to happen (and a lot of the games played this weekend won't have media other than in-house staff).
I guess they could tell everyone else to stay home and cancel the event altogether. Would that be better than taking a more measured approach?
Quote from: gordonmann on March 06, 2020, 09:31:33 AM
Does this have something to do with why Yeshiva is being singled out?
https://nypost.com/2020/03/04/yeshiva-university-cancels-classes-after-student-diagnosed-with-coronavirus/
Yeah. That and a rabbi at the school was also diagnosed with Covid-19. So 2 cases on campus lead to a preventative measure. Not strong enough to ban a deserving team from the tournament, but strong enough to keep the general populace out. Presumably the athletes themselves are in a low-risk bracket, young and healthy. Spectators come in all flavors. Could they have taken an even shorter half measure and allowed in students but not general population? Probably, but that could have gotten sticky.
So yes, a half measure. But a half-measure with some logic. Though many will not want to accept that.
Let's not forget that some DI basketball games have also been cancelled. CHicago State and Missouri-KC pulled out of games at Seattle University.
Quote from: CNU85 on March 06, 2020, 08:21:43 AM
Geez. Would you rather have a team that has been checked out medically and cleared for travel, or random people walking in your front door in which you have no idea if they just stepped off a plan from Italy?
If I were a low-level hotel employee in Missouri, I would have no idea what it meant when the coach said that his team was medically cleared by the State of New York. I have to think it is the same in Maryland.
Why does the state have to medically clear a team in New York?
That's my take, too. Glad I'm not the only one, even if it's the wrong take. :)
Quote from: CNU85 on March 06, 2020, 09:33:46 AM
Quote from: jknezek on March 06, 2020, 09:10:58 AM
Quote from: Ron Boerger on March 06, 2020, 08:38:44 AM
And, ya know, for freaking JOHNS HOPKINS, a major medical research institution which is heavily involved in the COVAD-19 effort to do something this stupid sends a message that probably shouldn't be sent.
Or perhaps we have that backward. JOHNS HOPKINS is a major medical research institution with one of the world's premiere infectious disease departments. For them to do something like this sends a message that we might need to spend more time listening too. I guess it just depends on your point of view. Do you trust medical professionals, who are very concerned about this, or do you not?
That is your decision. But just about every major world leader, national medical service, international medical service says this is a difficult problem. Just about every major professional investor has decided this is a major problem. Just about every major travel company has admitted this is a major problem.
The people claiming this is not a major problem don't tend to have those credentials or that skin in the game.
This crossed my mind as well. What do they know that we don't? But then as Ryan points out, it isn't consistent with Lacrosse. And as I pointed out, they are selective in attendees. If it's a concern, NOBODY gets in other than teams and officials. HA - If I am a parent I'm standing outside with a wad of cash ready to buy a media pass! ;D
What do they know that we don't? Probably not much. Lots of info has been made public. They just take it more seriously because they better understand what the information means. As for the lax game, 1) it's outside. Yes that matters. Not as much as we'd hope, but it does matter. 2) it's not against a school with a confirmed infection or 2. 3) JHU's press release said this was a case by case basis. We will see. But there are differences.
Quote from: jknezek on March 06, 2020, 09:36:55 AM
Quote from: gordonmann on March 06, 2020, 09:31:33 AM
Does this have something to do with why Yeshiva is being singled out?
https://nypost.com/2020/03/04/yeshiva-university-cancels-classes-after-student-diagnosed-with-coronavirus/
Yeah. That and a rabbi at the school was also diagnosed with Covid-19. So 2 cases on campus lead to a preventative measure. Not strong enough to ban a deserving team from the tournament, but strong enough to keep the general populace out. Presumably the athletes themselves are in a low-risk bracket, young and healthy. Spectators come in all flavors. Could they have taken an even shorter half measure and allowed in students but not general population? Probably, but that could have gotten sticky.
So yes, a half measure. But a half-measure with some logic. Though many will not want to accept that.
Let's not forget that some DI basketball games have also been cancelled. CHicago State and Missouri-KC pulled out of games at Seattle University.
Elliot Steinmetz addressed these things in his conversation with Dave McHugh on Hoopsville last night. (The interview was recorded after the hotel canceled reservations but before the game was closed to spectators.)
https://d3hoops.com/playoffs/men/2020/goldfarb-will-be-empty-for-first-weekend
Otherwise, this decision was certainly made at the Chancellor level with the lawyers and public relations staff involved.
Elite universities such as John Hopkins are under the microscope (pun intended) in a way that schools such as Penn State Harrisburg are not. They are incredibly risk averse.
It does seem crazy, but what will we know in hindsight a few weeks from now? Hard to say.
Quote from: gordonmann on March 06, 2020, 09:31:33 AM
Does this have something to do with why Yeshiva is being singled out?
https://nypost.com/2020/03/04/yeshiva-university-cancels-classes-after-student-diagnosed-with-coronavirus/
It's a concern for sure. CNU is on spring break and students are traveling all over. One university trip to Italy this week was diverted to London. We have training sessions for professors next week on how to use on line technology in case classes have to be canceled and the campus shuts down. The plan is to continue on line (which is NOT a current option for any classes at CNU). Also, it is for any student that may have to self quarantine so they can keep up.
Again my comments are centered around the selectivity. If you have a lanyard with a card in it that says "Media"...sure come on in and be exposed. If you have a kid playing...nope....stand outside this door and wait. And go ahead and play a D1 sport on campus since it will be on an ESPN channel of some sort (delayed). Either there is an exposure issue or there is not.
Either way, my opinions truly do not matter. Let the games begin. I'm closing my office door at 4pm, getting the snacks out and sitting at my desk at work to watch the men play. Women start at 5 so I will bounce between games then rush home around halftime of Lady Captains game (end of men's game) to finish at home with a coldie.
BTW - good luck to everyone's teams today - except Colby men and Widener Women. haha!
Quote from: jknezek on March 06, 2020, 09:36:55 AM
Let's not forget that some DI basketball games have also been cancelled. CHicago State and Missouri-KC pulled out of games at Seattle University.
I think Chicago State just wanted their miserable season to be over.
Quote from: AO on March 06, 2020, 09:45:50 AM
Quote from: jknezek on March 06, 2020, 09:36:55 AM
Let's not forget that some DI basketball games have also been cancelled. CHicago State and Missouri-KC pulled out of games at Seattle University.
I think Chicago State just wanted their miserable season to be over.
;D ;D
Quote from: CNU85 on March 06, 2020, 09:43:38 AM
Again my comments are centered around the selectivity. If you have a lanyard with a card in it that says "Media"...sure come on in and be exposed. If you have a kid playing...nope....stand outside this door and wait.
This demonstrates that the threat is not imminent, but that they have decided to go with precautionary measures. Our pandemic plan involves cancelling non-academic events and programs at one stage or another.
Quote from: gordonmann on March 06, 2020, 09:36:35 AM
QuoteSo - if you're a journalist(media) its ok to be potentially exposed.
If you are a player or coach its ok to be potentially exposed
If you are an official or time keeper its ok to be potentially exposed
If you are a parent of a player it is not ok to be potentially exposed
If you are a fan it is not ok to be potentially exposed.
Media are probably free to skip the event of their own volition. If we're being honest, at this level they don't need to be there for the event to happen (and a lot of the games played this weekend won't have media other than in-house staff).
I guess they could tell everyone else to stay home and cancel the event altogether. Would that be better than taking a more measured approach?
Media is
always free to skip the event.
And depending on the desired outcome of what you're trying to do accomplish would be the answer to your question about canceling the event.
BTW - I truly enjoy reading everyone's thoughts on this. It is very interesting. And often I see things in a different light. So thanks to all for your input.
Agreed. This is the type of civil conversation that's hard to have online nowadays. :)
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 06, 2020, 09:18:52 AM
This is what really bothers me. It seems, from the outside, like they're targeting Yeshiva and any fans who might come from NY. If it's a general concern, they should ban fans from Lacrosse, too, right?
Absolutely. And fans from Platteville, River Falls, Stevens Point, and Whitewater as well. Quarantine all cheeseheads!
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 06, 2020, 10:23:15 AM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 06, 2020, 09:18:52 AM
This is what really bothers me. It seems, from the outside, like they're targeting Yeshiva and any fans who might come from NY. If it's a general concern, they should ban fans from Lacrosse, too, right?
Absolutely. And fans from Platteville, River Falls, Stevens Point, and Whitewater as well. Quarantine all cheeseheads!
Skol!!
Quote from: WUPHF on March 06, 2020, 09:41:57 AM
Otherwise, this decision was certainly made at the Chancellor level with the lawyers and public relations staff involved.
Elite universities such as John Hopkins are under the microscope (pun intended) in a way that schools such as Penn State Harrisburg are not. They are incredibly risk averse.
It does seem crazy, but what will we know in hindsight a few weeks from now? Hard to say.
I don't like so many rash cancellations, but I've learned to live with things like this. If they banned spectators at all campus events, I'd disagree with it, but I would recognize it's their right to do. For them to ban fans (for Friday and Saturday) for basketball, but not for the Lacrosse match right outside the building that happens between the two rounds of NCAAs seems unfair.
It's the lack of consistency that bothers me. I'll ask about it when I'm there today, but it looks, from the outside, like they're targeting Yeshiva when it's entirely possible people at other events will be coming from similarly virus-connected places.
I had the lacrosse opponent wrong. It's Syracuse. They're banning fans from one team in NY, but not those from another. How many of those visiting fans will also be coming from Manhattan?
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 06, 2020, 10:26:06 AM
Quote from: WUPHF on March 06, 2020, 09:41:57 AM
Otherwise, this decision was certainly made at the Chancellor level with the lawyers and public relations staff involved.
Elite universities such as John Hopkins are under the microscope (pun intended) in a way that schools such as Penn State Harrisburg are not. They are incredibly risk averse.
It does seem crazy, but what will we know in hindsight a few weeks from now? Hard to say.
I don't like so many rash cancellations, but I've learned to live with things like this. If they banned spectators at all campus events, I'd disagree with it, but I would recognize it's their right to do. For them to ban fans (for Friday and Saturday) for basketball, but not for the Lacrosse match right outside the building that happens between the two rounds of NCAAs seems unfair.
It's the lack of consistency that bothers me. I'll ask about it when I'm there today, but it looks, from the outside, like they're targeting Yeshiva when it's entirely possible people at other events will be coming from similarly virus-connected places.
Here's what I don't get: If the specific concern that is causing JHU to close off this weekend's games to the public is the COVID-19 outbreak at Yeshiva, then why was that not addressed in the school's press release? Instead, the press release specifically mentions COVID-19 diagnoses in
Maryland, not in NYC.
QuoteJohns Hopkins University is pleased to be hosting the first two rounds of the NCAA Division III men's basketball tournament this weekend. However, in light of Maryland's recently confirmed cases of COVID-19, and based on CDC guidance for large gatherings, we have determined that it is prudent to hold this tournament without spectators. We are not making any determination about other JHU events at this time; while we await further guidance from public health authorities, we will be assessing large events on a case-by-case basis. We regret any inconvenience to the families and fans of the players.
The Yeshiva connection to the changes is speculation.
Let's not conflate the Yeshiva hotel situation and the changes by Johns Hopkins...
At least not yet.
What I find strange is that these 2 DIII games would have drawn around 1000-1300 fans for each game, at the most. (Johns Hopkins' gym only holds 1200 people) So no one is allowed to watch these games in person, because there have been some recently confirmed cases of the coronavirus in Maryland.
Yet tonight, Sunday and Tuesday, approximately 40 miles from Johns Hopkins, when 12,000 to 20,000 people show up to watch the Washington Wizards play 3 home games, well that's OK, they don't need to worry about the coronavirus.
This makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.
Quote from: magicman on March 06, 2020, 11:04:31 AM
What I find strange is that these 2 DIII games would have drawn around 1000-1300 fans for each game, at the most. (Johns Hopkins' gym only holds 1200 people) So no one is allowed to watch these games in person, because there have been some recently confirmed cases of the coronavirus in Maryland.
Yet tonight, Sunday and Tuesday, approximately 40 miles from Johns Hopkins, when 12,000 to 20,000 people show up to watch the Washington Wizards play 3 home games, well that's OK, they don't need to worry about the coronavirus.
This makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.
From one angle, it's quite illogical. From another perspective, it's a different set of people making the decision, just as you or I might choose to respond differently to this situation.
I do not work at Johns Hopkins, but I have been in my share of meetings and conference calls with President-level administrators and have talked with colleagues who have done the same and seriously, there is no way Hopkins made the decision based on one student case at Yeshiva and the hotel incident.
This is Johns Hopkins being risk averse.
And now they pushed both games at JHU back an hour. Not really a big deal, but seems strange to be moving game times the day of the game.
I would think that the only concern that is caused by moving the tipoff time back an hour is that they're on the clock to get Yeshiva back to its hotel after the conclusion of the game. Dunno what time the sun sets in Baltimore this afternoon, but that -- and not the basketball game itself -- is the overriding concern of Yeshiva, as it should be.
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 06, 2020, 12:07:54 PM
I would think that the only concern that is caused by moving the tipoff time back an hour is that they're on the clock to get Yeshiva back to its hotel after the conclusion of the game. Dunno what time the sun sets in Baltimore this afternoon, but that -- and not the basketball game itself -- is the overriding concern of Yeshiva, as it should be.
6:05 pm; they'll be OK.
Quote from: Colby Hoops on March 06, 2020, 11:47:44 AM
And now they pushed both games at JHU back an hour. Not really a big deal, but seems strange to be moving game times the day of the game.
It just seems to get more puzzling. If you have no crowds to worry about why the delay?
By the by, the University of Washington cancelled classes through March 30 with the hope of moving instruction online. This is how colleges and universities think.
Quote from: BaboNation on March 06, 2020, 12:25:41 PM
Quote from: Colby Hoops on March 06, 2020, 11:47:44 AM
And now they pushed both games at JHU back an hour. Not really a big deal, but seems strange to be moving game times the day of the game.
It just seems to get more puzzling. If you have no crowds to worry about why the delay?
I've been told "paperwork."
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 06, 2020, 02:00:39 PM
Quote from: BaboNation on March 06, 2020, 12:25:41 PM
Quote from: Colby Hoops on March 06, 2020, 11:47:44 AM
And now they pushed both games at JHU back an hour. Not really a big deal, but seems strange to be moving game times the day of the game.
It just seems to get more puzzling. If you have no crowds to worry about why the delay?
I've been told "paperwork."
COVID-19 release forms! ;D
Maybe this is common knowledge, but very surprising to see former Georgetown great Michael Sweetney sitting on the bench as an assistant for Yeshiva. Pretty cool.
Ryan Turell with 23 in the first half and it's all Maccabees at the break, 51-30.
So, safe to say that Yeshiva will make it back to the hotel in time. Wow!
nice defense by RPI on the final possession and they take down New England College in a squeaker 58-57.
Susquehanna knocks off Benedictine by 5.
Elmhurst put a hurting on Lycoming by 24 points. John Baines was able to clear his bench and rest his rotation players a bit.
Whew. That was a nice game. Colby game back strong. I think the end to the comeback was when they tried to full court press the Captains. CNU ate that up.
CNU beats #12 Colby 74-64
Liberty League goes 3/3. Big wins for RPI, Ithaca and Hobart
I was worried about this game earlier in the week when I heard #45 wouldn't be playing. Glad he can suit up tomorrow.
Congrats to York for their win!
Steve Moore's tremendous coaching career comes to an end, as Wooster is upset on its home floor by Grove City, 67-62.
If I'm reading the NCAA record book correctly, this marks the first tourney win for a PrAC team since Bethany beat PSU-Behrend in the first round all the way back in the 2002 tourney, 110-98.
Big upset at Goldfarb Gym in Baltimore, as host Johns Hopkins goes down in overtime to first-time tourney participant PSU-Harrisburg, 104-96, behind Donyae Baylor-Carroll's 45 points. JHU star Connor Delaney was hurt and missed most of the game.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 05, 2020, 01:25:57 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 05, 2020, 10:56:06 AM
Quote from: VT-Alum-NOVA on March 05, 2020, 10:26:38 AM
if NCAA would only open its wallet, this could happen like it does in D1. How cool of an experience would that be for players?
I like the unique elements of how the D3 tournament works. I wish they'd loosen the reigns a little in terms of budget to better balance the bracket, but we don't need to do a 100% national bracket like d1. You do lose something in that.
The only I would like a more national level is so we don't see St. Thomas and St. John's possibly meeting sooner than later. So we don't see conference opponents like Texas-Dallas and LeTourneau possibly meeting in the 2nd round. Move conference teams as far away from each other as possible.
I am just glad to see the ASC get a Pool C bid!
It was a great first round at UT-Dallas tonight...two 2-point games!
For those wondering ... I'll have opinions on the Hopkins thing on Hoopsville Sunday.
Simply, the inconsistencies and the actions those on hand were instructed to carry out didn't hold up to any tests. They blamed cases in Maryland, but ...
Just watch the show ... i'm not doing this tonight.
Sounds intriguing.
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 06, 2020, 09:12:02 PM
Big upset at Goldfarb Gym in Baltimore, as host Johns Hopkins goes down in overtime to first-time tourney participant PSU-Harrisburg, 104-96, behind Donyae Baylor-Carroll's 45 points. JHU star Connor Delaney was hurt and missed most of the game.
Did the ban of fans attending the JHU-PSU-Harrisburg game make it almost a "Neutral Court"? Just thinking...
Quote from: Ralph Turner on March 07, 2020, 11:41:23 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 06, 2020, 09:12:02 PM
Big upset at Goldfarb Gym in Baltimore, as host Johns Hopkins goes down in overtime to first-time tourney participant PSU-Harrisburg, 104-96, behind Donyae Baylor-Carroll's 45 points. JHU star Connor Delaney was hurt and missed most of the game.
Did the ban of fans attending the JHU-PSU-Harrisburg game make it almost a "Neutral Court"? Just thinking...
There's probably less of a home court advantage, but you get familiar lockerrooms and a normal schedule. It's definitely not netural.
The recent talk of splitting men's and women's hoops in the ten regions makes me think that we saw a "Region (Roman numeral) X" playoff with a Northwest Conference team, a SCAC team and 2 ASC teams in the pod.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 07, 2020, 11:43:41 AM
Quote from: Ralph Turner on March 07, 2020, 11:41:23 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 06, 2020, 09:12:02 PM
Big upset at Goldfarb Gym in Baltimore, as host Johns Hopkins goes down in overtime to first-time tourney participant PSU-Harrisburg, 104-96, behind Donyae Baylor-Carroll's 45 points. JHU star Connor Delaney was hurt and missed most of the game.
Did the ban of fans attending the JHU-PSU-Harrisburg game make it almost a "Neutral Court"? Just thinking...
There's probably less of a home court advantage, but you get familiar lockerrooms and a normal schedule. It's definitely not neutral.
Then "the stars were aligning" for PSU-H to have a chance to pull it off!
Quote from: Ralph Turner on March 07, 2020, 11:46:14 AM
The recent talk of splitting men's and women's hoops in the ten regions makes me think that we saw a "Region (Roman numeral) X" playoff with a Northwest Conference team, a SCAC team and 2 ASC teams in the pod.
From the sounds of it, the WIAC will move back into the West with the MIAC? We'll have two regional playoffs tonight with Eau Claire taking on St. John's and Platteville hosting St. Thomas.
Quote from: Ralph Turner on March 07, 2020, 11:47:09 AM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 07, 2020, 11:43:41 AM
Quote from: Ralph Turner on March 07, 2020, 11:41:23 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 06, 2020, 09:12:02 PM
Big upset at Goldfarb Gym in Baltimore, as host Johns Hopkins goes down in overtime to first-time tourney participant PSU-Harrisburg, 104-96, behind Donyae Baylor-Carroll's 45 points. JHU star Connor Delaney was hurt and missed most of the game.
Did the ban of fans attending the JHU-PSU-Harrisburg game make it almost a "Neutral Court"? Just thinking...
There's probably less of a home court advantage, but you get familiar lockerrooms and a normal schedule. It's definitely not neutral.
Then "the stars were aligning" for PSU-H to have a chance to pull it off!
PSUH was ahead when Delaney went down. That's not to say he couldn't have helped JHU comeback - obviously he would've been tough to handle - but Harrisburg was ready and they played really well.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 07, 2020, 11:43:41 AM
Quote from: Ralph Turner on March 07, 2020, 11:41:23 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 06, 2020, 09:12:02 PM
Big upset at Goldfarb Gym in Baltimore, as host Johns Hopkins goes down in overtime to first-time tourney participant PSU-Harrisburg, 104-96, behind Donyae Baylor-Carroll's 45 points. JHU star Connor Delaney was hurt and missed most of the game.
Did the ban of fans attending the JHU-PSU-Harrisburg game make it almost a "Neutral Court"? Just thinking...
There's probably less of a home court advantage, but you get familiar lockerrooms and a normal schedule. It's definitely not netural.
I did a little research on this in grad school. Crowd support is an oft-cited home advantage factor, but based on a study of European soccer where teams would have to play in front of empty crowds, or another that factored in two clubs that shared a stadium, crowd support isn't as big a factor as you think it would be. I'd have to go back and look at the actual study and data though.
While I'm on the topic, Platteville v St. Thomas in a 2nd round matchup? Just another reason to make it a national tournament, rather than regionally.
Quote from: lmitzel on March 07, 2020, 11:50:43 AM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 07, 2020, 11:43:41 AM
Quote from: Ralph Turner on March 07, 2020, 11:41:23 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 06, 2020, 09:12:02 PM
Big upset at Goldfarb Gym in Baltimore, as host Johns Hopkins goes down in overtime to first-time tourney participant PSU-Harrisburg, 104-96, behind Donyae Baylor-Carroll's 45 points. JHU star Connor Delaney was hurt and missed most of the game.
Did the ban of fans attending the JHU-PSU-Harrisburg game make it almost a "Neutral Court"? Just thinking...
There's probably less of a home court advantage, but you get familiar lockerrooms and a normal schedule. It's definitely not netural.
I did a little research on this in grad school. Crowd support is an oft-cited home advantage factor, but based on a study of European soccer where teams would have to play in front of empty crowds, or another that factored in two clubs that shared a stadium, crowd support isn't as big a factor as you think it would be. I'd have to go back and look at the actual study and data though.
I really don't think you can compare soccer and basketball. In basketball, the crowd is right on top of you, it's indoors, so the noise level can be a lot louder than an outdoor stadium.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 07, 2020, 11:51:27 AM
While I'm on the topic, Platteville v St. Thomas in a 2nd round matchup? Just another reason to make it a national tournament, rather than regionally.
This is obviously the one that happens due to geography. One extra flight and we'd be able to seed it a little better - switch St Thomas and Benedictine, for example. You'd love to see NCC and UWO meet later, but Oshkosh's record justifies their spot.
Quote from: lmitzel on March 07, 2020, 11:50:43 AM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 07, 2020, 11:43:41 AM
Quote from: Ralph Turner on March 07, 2020, 11:41:23 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 06, 2020, 09:12:02 PM
Big upset at Goldfarb Gym in Baltimore, as host Johns Hopkins goes down in overtime to first-time tourney participant PSU-Harrisburg, 104-96, behind Donyae Baylor-Carroll's 45 points. JHU star Connor Delaney was hurt and missed most of the game.
Did the ban of fans attending the JHU-PSU-Harrisburg game make it almost a "Neutral Court"? Just thinking...
There's probably less of a home court advantage, but you get familiar lockerrooms and a normal schedule. It's definitely not netural.
I did a little research on this in grad school. Crowd support is an oft-cited home advantage factor, but based on a study of European soccer where teams would have to play in front of empty crowds, or another that factored in two clubs that shared a stadium, crowd support isn't as big a factor as you think it would be. I'd have to go back and look at the actual study and data though.
I've read some of these studies, mostly at the professional level and the conclusion was that home crowds subtly impacted refereeing decisions, to account for the slight home field advantage.
Not sure how this translates to D3
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 07, 2020, 11:54:08 AM
You'd love to see NCC and UWO meet later, but Oshkosh's record justifies their spot.
When you say "Oshkosh's record justifies their spot", I think that is one of the challenges of the selection/seeding process -- the weighting on winning percentage.
Oshkosh's final resume was: .704/.601/6-6.
In the D3 selection/seeding process, that is considered kinda "bubble" because of the .704. But for me, that should be considered a
great resume. I mean a .704 WP vs a .601 SOS...12 games played vs RRO and 6 wins.
Since the D3 selection/seeding process is heavily data-driven (WP/SOS/RRO), a few other data-driven sources for us to consider:
* Massey has Oshkosh #8 in the country - https://www.masseyratings.com/cb2020/ncaa-d3/ratings.
* Matt Snyder's Efficiency Ratings have Oshkosh #10 - http://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/p/division-iii-mens-basketball-efficiency.html
* Matt Snyder's RPI system, using WP/SOS/RRO, has Oshkosh #15 - https://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/p/division-iii-mens-regional-rankings.html
In other words, these analytics-based sources have Oshkosh as a highly ranked team -- which I believe most of us, based on the eye test, would agree with.
These databases seem to capture the realistic ranking of Oshkosh a lot better than the D3 selection process does...because the D3 selection process is so heavily WP weighted.
This is what Massey is predicting for today:
| Swarthmore 83, Ithaca 77 | (SC 70%, IC 30%) |
| UT-Dallas 75, Whitworth 72 | (UTD 58%, WU 42%) |
| Brockport 83, Middlebury 79 | CB 63%, MC 37%) |
| Tufts 70, RPI 64 | (TU 72%, RPI 28%) |
| UW-Platteville 72, St. Thomas (MN) 71 | (UWP 52%, UST 48%) |
| St. John's 69, UW-Eau Claire 59 | (SJU 82%, UWEC 18%) |
| Emory 84, Pomona-Pitzer 80 | (EU 62%, PP 38%) |
| Elmhurst 82, Grove City 65 | (EC 93%, GCC 7%) |
| Mount Union 84, York (PA) 73 | (UMU 84%, YCP 16%) |
| Wittenberg 78, Susquehanna 69 | (WU 81%, SU 19%) |
| Randolph-Macon 71, TCNJ 63 | (RMC 78%, TCNJ 22%) |
| Yeshiva 88, PSU-Harrisburg 78 | (YU 82%, PSUH 18%) |
| Springfield 72, Hobart 66 | (SC 69%, HWSC 21%) |
| Christopher Newport 82, Nichols 71 | (CNU 83%, NC 17%) |
| Nebraska Wesleyan 77, Washington (MO) 73 | (NWU 63%, WU 37%) |
| UW-Oshkosh 70, North Central (IL) 69 | (UWO 52%, NCC 48%) |
Penn State Harrisburg vs. Yeshiva - at Johns Hopkins, last game tonight.
Intriguing matchup - PS-H has Donyae Baylor-Carroll, all 5'7" of him, who went off for 45 last night against Johns Hopkins, against 6'7" Ryan Turell from Yeshiva who had 41 against WPI in the first round. Imagine both listed as guards, but a foot difference in height.
Yeshiva also has 6'5" Gabriel Liefer, who is averaging 16 points 13 rebounds and 7 assists per game, who was held a bit in check by WPI last night with 4 pts, 8 rebs, and 8 assists.
Second round games I'm interested in today:
All of 'em
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 07, 2020, 11:51:27 AM
While I'm on the topic, Platteville v St. Thomas in a 2nd round matchup? Just another reason to make it a national tournament, rather than regionally.
This is essentially the St. Thomas vs Neb. Wesleyan match-up of a year ago in the 2nd round in Lincoln.
Wish they did the staggered starts for today's games as well---the change to that yesterday was awesome.
How about Friday-Saturday and Saturday-Sunday games?
Quote from: SpringSt7 on March 07, 2020, 06:55:16 PM
Wish they did the staggered starts for today's games as well---the change to that yesterday was awesome.
They are staggered -- the old textbook would be that everyone started at 7 p.m. local time.
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 07, 2020, 07:03:39 PM
Quote from: SpringSt7 on March 07, 2020, 06:55:16 PM
Wish they did the staggered starts for today's games as well---the change to that yesterday was awesome.
They are staggered -- the old textbook would be that everyone started at 7 p.m. local time.
Maybe I'm just greedy and wanted to watch basketball all day!
Brock holds on 84-81. Middlebury with a good look at a corner 3 for the win. Brock nearly shot themselves in the foot missing FTs at the end. A lane violation, by the FT shooter after a miss gave Middlebury a shot to win with about 8 seconds left.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 07, 2020, 08:25:57 PM
Brock holds on 84-81. Middlebury with a good look at a corner 3 for the win. Brock nearly shot themselves in the foot missing FTs at the end. A lane violation, by the FT shooter after a miss gave Middlebury a shot to win with about 8 seconds left.
Ken Massey's computer nearly prognosticated that one perfectly.
Jack Boyle of Pomona-Pitzer hit a well-contested fadeaway trey from the left corner at the buzzer to propel the Sagehens to a 71-70 upset over host Emory.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 07, 2020, 08:25:57 PM
Brock holds on 84-81. Middlebury with a good look at a corner 3 for the win. Brock nearly shot themselves in the foot missing FTs at the end. A lane violation, by the FT shooter after a miss gave Middlebury a shot to win with about 8 seconds left.
Wide open look for Cahill in his favorite spot, a shot he knocks down often. Just short.
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 07, 2020, 09:02:23 PM
Jack Boyle of Pomona-Pitzer hit a well-contested fadeaway trey from the left corner at the buzzer to propel the Sagehens to a 71-70 upset over host Emory.
Yeah. Good defense. Not good enough. Inbounds pass from the bench cross court, fake, then shot with a guy in his face. Nothing but net from the corner 3. Wow.
Dan Masino made a driving layup at the buzzer to lift Hobart to a 62-61 upset over Springfield, as another host bites the dust. The Pride had just taken the lead with seven seconds remaining on a Heath Post 17-footer.
Can someone confirm what the Springfield play-by-play guy cited ... Jake Ross is the only player in D3 history with 2500 points and 1000 rebounds?
Stop what you're doing, people, and tune into overtime in Naperville. UW-Oshkosh and North Central are playing an amazing game.
We will have a new champion this season. UW-Oshkosh fell in overtime to North Central, 84-82. The Cardinals had to erase a double-digit deficit in the second half with their two leading scorers, Connor Raridon and Mike Cappelletti, both sitting on the bench with four fouls apiece.
When do they announce hosts for next weekend?
Another home team goes down, as UT-Dallas succumbs to Whitworth, 73-66.
Sayonara to the WIAC, as UW-Platteville follows UW-Eau Claire and UW-Oshkosh through the exit door. St. Thomas knocked off the Pioneers, 73-70, in Platteville.
It's so strange to watch a tournament game that has no broadcasters.
Yeshiva shoots 65% from the field and beats PSU-Harrisburg, 102-83.
The JHU colorman just said that Ryan Turell was the star of the game for the Maccabees, as he scored 30 tonight. He's wrong. I don't know if anyone's ever achieved a triple-double in a tournament game before, but Gabe Leifer did it tonight for Yeshiva. Get this line: 10 points, 20 rebounds, 10 assists (and only two turnovers). That's just plain meshugga!
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 07, 2020, 10:29:22 PM
Yeshiva shoots 65% from the field and beats PSU-Harrisburg, 102-83.
The JHU colorman just said that Ryan Turell was the star of the game for the Maccabees, as he scored 30 tonight. He's wrong. I don't know if anyone's ever achieved a triple-double in a tournament game before, but Gabe Leifer did it tonight for Yeshiva. Get this line: 10 points, 20 rebounds, 10 assists (and only two turnovers). That's just plain meshugga!
It's his fourth career triple double. I believe he only trails Nate West of Letourneau and Cabrini's Aaron Walton-Moss all-time.
AWM was a triple double machine. He really stuffed the stat sheet..
Speaking of which.. no mentions of Nathan Bower Malone and his incredibly efficient night?? 53!! I haven't been able to watch but box score scouting looks like it's awesome. Excited to catch games next weekend.
Tommie Johnnie round 4 in the NCAA with a trip to Fort Wayne on the line... whew! Just one of the 8 great games!
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 07, 2020, 09:17:53 PM
Dan Masino made a driving layup at the buzzer to lift Hobart to a 62-61 upset over Springfield, as another host bites the dust. The Pride had just taken the lead with seven seconds remaining on a Heath Post 17-footer.
They also made a great pass prior to advance the ball past half court. From under their own basket with 2.8, to over the center court line only dropping to 2.2! What a finish!
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 07, 2020, 10:42:38 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 07, 2020, 10:29:22 PM
Yeshiva shoots 65% from the field and beats PSU-Harrisburg, 102-83.
The JHU colorman just said that Ryan Turell was the star of the game for the Maccabees, as he scored 30 tonight. He's wrong. I don't know if anyone's ever achieved a triple-double in a tournament game before, but Gabe Leifer did it tonight for Yeshiva. Get this line: 10 points, 20 rebounds, 10 assists (and only two turnovers). That's just plain meshugga!
It's his fourth career triple double. I believe he only trails Nate West of Letourneau and Cabrini's Aaron Walton-Moss all-time.
Yeshiva looked very, very good. Even if Turell did remind me of Kramer from Seinfeld. Especially with has big stride approach to the foul line. Hilarious!
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 07, 2020, 10:29:22 PM
Yeshiva shoots 65% from the field and beats PSU-Harrisburg, 102-83.
The JHU colorman just said that Ryan Turell was the star of the game for the Maccabees, as he scored 30 tonight. He's wrong. I don't know if anyone's ever achieved a triple-double in a tournament game before, but Gabe Leifer did it tonight for Yeshiva. Get this line: 10 points, 20 rebounds, 10 assists (and only two turnovers). That's just plain meshugga!
Leifer's absence will be felt tremendously next season, but they are still alive in this one.
Quote from: CNU85 on March 07, 2020, 10:03:44 PM
When do they announce hosts for next weekend?
Usually Sunday afternoon.
The host sites for the men's Sweet 16 have been released: https://www.d3hoops.com/playoffs/men/2020/bracket and game times: https://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2019-20/ncaa-tournament?date=2020-03-13 and https://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2019-20/ncaa-tournament?date=2020-03-14
In other words
Friday 13
Yeshiva at RMC 2 pm
Hobart at CNU 6:30 pm
Wittenberg at Mount Union 7:30 pm
Washington U at North Central (IL) 8:30 pm
Saturday 14
Tufts at Brockport 4 pm
Whitworth at Swarthmore 5 pm
Pomona-Pitzer at Elmhurst 6 pm
St. Thomas at St. John's 7 pm
I'm planning to be at Randolph-Macon Friday and contemplating driving down to CNU for their game, too. I just have to decide if I can do the four hour drive home after a 6:30 game. TBD.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 08, 2020, 07:49:36 AM
I'm planning to be at Randolph-Macon Friday and contemplating driving down to CNU for their game, too. I just have to decide if I can do the four hour drive home after a 6:30 game. TBD.
Might there again be a ban on fans at Yeshiva's game due to the corona virus? Seems possible.
New York declared a state of emergency yesterday over the Coronavirus which may not mean much but I have to think Randolph Macon spends a few days talking about it.
There may have only been three cases in Maryland on Thursday evening but the predictions have been steadily taking a turn for the worse every since.
So Collen Gurley goes for 40 on Friday night, and then 0 on Saturday, while Nathan Bower-Malone has 6 on Friday but 53 on Saturday?!?!?!? That has to be some sort of a record. I don't know what kind of record, but I don't think you're gonna see two teammates with a bigger variance in scoring than that, especially in the tournament.
Quote from: WUPHF on March 08, 2020, 09:54:24 AM
New York declared a state of emergency yesterday over the Coronavirus which may not mean much but I have to think Randolph Macon spends a few days talking about it.
There may have only been three cases in Maryland on Thursday evening but the predictions have been steadily taking a turn for the worse every since.
There have been no confirmed cases on Yeshiva's campus - campus affiliated infected individuals were not on campus - no classes all week and the team is planning to stay away. I suppose anything's possible, but Yeshiva's going to great lengths to avoid even the appearance of a problem.
I understand about Yeshiva.
My point is that the larger story of Coronavirus is that everything is developing very quickly.
St. Louis has our first case today; a student who returned from her cancelled study abroad program in Italy.
More and more colleges are cancelling classes or larger events and gatherings.
This is not the zombie apocalypse, but I think things get worse before they get better.
Quote from: WUPHF on March 08, 2020, 01:08:03 PM
I understand about Yeshiva.
My point is that the larger story of Coronavirus is that everything is developing very quickly.
St. Louis has our first case today; a student who returned from her cancelled study abroad program in Italy.
More and more colleges are cancelling classes or larger events and gatherings.
This is not the zombie apocalypse, but I think things get worse before they get better.
We got the most recent issue of TIME Magazine yesterday, I had a little time to read it today. They report most scientists recommend going about your regular habits, but washing your hands more often and avoiding touching your face. A lot of the precautions they had earlier were attempts to contain the virus, but that ship has sailed at this point. It's out there. Yes, this virus is a little worse than the flu, but you essentially take the same precautions. There aren't recommendations for cancellations from medical experts; those general come from the lawyers.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 08, 2020, 07:49:36 AM
I'm planning to be at Randolph-Macon Friday and contemplating driving down to CNU for their game, too. I just have to decide if I can do the four hour drive home after a 6:30 game. TBD.
I've done it after a 7 pm game from Scranton to MD and you're younger than me. :) As long as u won't be battling bad weather conditions and u get your rest Thursday night. Use your head.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 08, 2020, 03:28:04 AM
In other words
Friday 13
Yeshiva at RMC 2 pm
Nice to have an early game, and the extra hour from daylight savings time won't hurt either.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 08, 2020, 03:39:37 PM
A lot of the precautions they had earlier were attempts to contain the virus, but that ship has sailed at this point. It's out there. Yes, this virus is a little worse than the flu, but you essentially take the same precautions. There aren't recommendations for cancellations from medical experts; those general come from the lawyers.
The verdict is still out as to whether or not the positives of social distancing are worth the negatives.
I do agree that the cancellations are driven largely by lawyers, but I would add chancellors, presidents and other executives who will be making the decision at Randolph Macon and elsewhere.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 07, 2020, 11:23:00 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 07, 2020, 10:29:22 PM
Yeshiva shoots 65% from the field and beats PSU-Harrisburg, 102-83.
The JHU colorman just said that Ryan Turell was the star of the game for the Maccabees, as he scored 30 tonight. He's wrong. I don't know if anyone's ever achieved a triple-double in a tournament game before, but Gabe Leifer did it tonight for Yeshiva. Get this line: 10 points, 20 rebounds, 10 assists (and only two turnovers). That's just plain meshugga!
Leifer's absence will be felt tremendously next season, but they are still alive in this one.
I know he's technically a senior, but Leifer only started playing halfway through the 17-18 season, so I believe he has another year left. They didn't honor him on Senior Night, so there will be another year of the Leifer and Turrell show.
Quote from: Macsfan on March 08, 2020, 07:39:21 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 07, 2020, 11:23:00 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 07, 2020, 10:29:22 PM
Yeshiva shoots 65% from the field and beats PSU-Harrisburg, 102-83.
The JHU colorman just said that Ryan Turell was the star of the game for the Maccabees, as he scored 30 tonight. He's wrong. I don't know if anyone's ever achieved a triple-double in a tournament game before, but Gabe Leifer did it tonight for Yeshiva. Get this line: 10 points, 20 rebounds, 10 assists (and only two turnovers). That's just plain meshugga!
Leifer's absence will be felt tremendously next season, but they are still alive in this one.
I know he's technically a senior, but Leifer only started playing halfway through the 17-18 season, so I believe he has another year left. They didn't honor him on Senior Night, so there will be another year of the Leifer and Turrell show.
Yeah, I just found that out today. It'll be in the Yeshiva feature coming soon to D3hoops.com
Quote from: Macsfan on March 08, 2020, 07:39:21 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 07, 2020, 11:23:00 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 07, 2020, 10:29:22 PM
Yeshiva shoots 65% from the field and beats PSU-Harrisburg, 102-83.
The JHU colorman just said that Ryan Turell was the star of the game for the Maccabees, as he scored 30 tonight. He's wrong. I don't know if anyone's ever achieved a triple-double in a tournament game before, but Gabe Leifer did it tonight for Yeshiva. Get this line: 10 points, 20 rebounds, 10 assists (and only two turnovers). That's just plain meshugga!
Leifer's absence will be felt tremendously next season, but they are still alive in this one.
I know he's technically a senior, but Leifer only started playing halfway through the 17-18 season, so I believe he has another year left. They didn't honor him on Senior Night, so there will be another year of the Leifer and Turrell show.
So he has a semester left or a full year?
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 08, 2020, 09:16:29 PM
Quote from: Macsfan on March 08, 2020, 07:39:21 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 07, 2020, 11:23:00 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 07, 2020, 10:29:22 PM
Yeshiva shoots 65% from the field and beats PSU-Harrisburg, 102-83.
The JHU colorman just said that Ryan Turell was the star of the game for the Maccabees, as he scored 30 tonight. He's wrong. I don't know if anyone's ever achieved a triple-double in a tournament game before, but Gabe Leifer did it tonight for Yeshiva. Get this line: 10 points, 20 rebounds, 10 assists (and only two turnovers). That's just plain meshugga!
Leifer's absence will be felt tremendously next season, but they are still alive in this one.
I know he's technically a senior, but Leifer only started playing halfway through the 17-18 season, so I believe he has another year left. They didn't honor him on Senior Night, so there will be another year of the Leifer and Turrell show.
So he has a semester left or a full year?
Full year. He didn't play that first semester he was in school.
I should be better than to belabor the point, but they just cancelled a major tennis tournament in Los Angeles: https://bnpparibasopen.com/coronavirus/
I hope I am wrong, but the Coronavirus is a developing situation.
I will do my best to say no more about the Coronavirus, but I think this may be more complicated, at least in some cases, than basketball coaches (and athletic department administrators) making basketball-related decisions.
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=6w8mk/1suiql8xe7b8ab8p.jpg)
What an opening weekend of the NCAA tournaments? Upsets a plenty. Gyms closed to fans. Incredible finishes. And so much more. Sunday night on Hoopsville we tried to cover it all.
The show started with extensive information on decisions surrounding COVID-19. We discussed decisions by Johns Hopkins and Amherst to close their doors to fans for the first weekend's games. We also had reactions and statements on the choice to return to Amherst this coming weekend for the Sectionals in women's basketball
and the college's decision to, once again, ban fans from attending.
We also talked about the incredible stories coming out of the tournament of how teams are moving on and how seasons came to a sudden and emotional finish.
Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Pat Coleman, Editor-in-Chief, D3hoops.com
- Todd Raridon, No. 11 North Central (Ill.) men's coach
- Jackson Meshanic (sophomore) & Stefan Thompson (coach), Hobart men's team (Frank Rossi interviews)
- Greg Dunne, No. 18 Brockport men's coach
- Andy Rang, No. 23 Trine women's coach
- Pat Manning, Williams women's coach
- Bob Quillman & Ryan Scott
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If we were in France, every game would be played in an empty gym...
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-france-idUSKBN20V0WW?taid=5e65af0005296a0001045f70&utm_campaign=trueAnthem:+Trending+Content&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=twitter
Quote from: Macsfan on March 08, 2020, 07:39:21 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 07, 2020, 11:23:00 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 07, 2020, 10:29:22 PM
Yeshiva shoots 65% from the field and beats PSU-Harrisburg, 102-83.
The JHU colorman just said that Ryan Turell was the star of the game for the Maccabees, as he scored 30 tonight. He's wrong. I don't know if anyone's ever achieved a triple-double in a tournament game before, but Gabe Leifer did it tonight for Yeshiva. Get this line: 10 points, 20 rebounds, 10 assists (and only two turnovers). That's just plain meshugga!
Leifer's absence will be felt tremendously next season, but they are still alive in this one.
I know he's technically a senior, but Leifer only started playing halfway through the 17-18 season, so I believe he has another year left. They didn't honor him on Senior Night, so there will be another year of the Leifer and Turrell show.
Thanks for the info, Macsfan!! Would love to have you continue contributing to the boards about your favorite team. They are very fun to watch.
Insane question I came up with listening to Hoopsville. Dave mentioned Hobart to CNU is 500 miles and vice versa is 501 miles or possibly that's flipped. Let's say it was 500 from Hobart to CNU and 499 CNU to Hobart. Would they push to have Hobart to host solely because that doesn't require a flight?
Quote from: hickory_cornhusker on March 09, 2020, 09:14:21 AM
Insane question I came up with listening to Hoopsville. Dave mentioned Hobart to CNU is 500 miles and vice versa is 501 miles or possibly that's flipped. Let's say it was 500 from Hobart to CNU and 499 CNU to Hobart. Would they push to have Hobart to host solely because that doesn't require a flight?
We're working on getting that info. It's not always clear. I know there have been times in the past when the different distances between schools and sites have mattered - 499 vs 500 - but I'm not sure that's a hard and fast rule. We're trying to track down some definitive info on how it's being interpreted currently. I imagine its something where there's some leeway on the part of the NCAA staff who work with the committees. Is it "500 or less" or is it "less than 500?"
Usually, when it's close like that, without direct flights, teams will bus anyway - but I did see there's a pretty workable Thursday flight from Syracuse to Newport News with a quick stopover in Philly.
Hobart starts Spring break on Friday BTW.
Quote from: WUPHF on March 08, 2020, 10:57:34 PM
I should be better than to belabor the point, but they just cancelled a major tennis tournament in Los Angeles: https://bnpparibasopen.com/coronavirus/
I hope I am wrong, but the Coronavirus is a developing situation.
I will do my best to say no more about the Coronavirus, but I think this may be more complicated, at least in some cases, than basketball coaches (and athletic department administrators) making basketball-related decisions.
That didn't take long. LOL
Quote from: WUPHF on March 09, 2020, 12:12:15 AM
If we were in France, every game would be played in an empty gym...
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-france-idUSKBN20V0WW?taid=5e65af0005296a0001045f70&utm_campaign=trueAnthem:+Trending+Content&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=twitter
My best is not very good, apparently, but you guys all knew that... :P
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 09, 2020, 09:18:56 AM
Quote from: hickory_cornhusker on March 09, 2020, 09:14:21 AM
Insane question I came up with listening to Hoopsville. Dave mentioned Hobart to CNU is 500 miles and vice versa is 501 miles or possibly that's flipped. Let's say it was 500 from Hobart to CNU and 499 CNU to Hobart. Would they push to have Hobart to host solely because that doesn't require a flight?
We're working on getting that info. It's not always clear. I know there have been times in the past when the different distances between schools and sites have mattered - 499 vs 500 - but I'm not sure that's a hard and fast rule. We're trying to track down some definitive info on how it's being interpreted currently. I imagine its something where there's some leeway on the part of the NCAA staff who work with the committees. Is it "500 or less" or is it "less than 500?"
Usually, when it's close like that, without direct flights, teams will bus anyway - but I did see there's a pretty workable Thursday flight from Syracuse to Newport News with a quick stopover in Philly.
Admittedly, I didn't listen to the podcast, but can someone explain how there can be different distances going between two points?
Ramps, one-way streets, cloverleaf exits on the other side headed away from campus, etc.
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 09, 2020, 01:34:54 PM
Ramps, one-way streets, cloverleaf exits on the other side headed away from campus, etc.
Going around a mountain (thinking of how many ways I've seen highways split lol)...
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 09, 2020, 01:34:54 PM
Ramps, one-way streets, cloverleaf exits on the other side headed away from campus, etc.
So, who determines the best route? I bet you can create a straighter shot by taking backroads, it will take twice as long, but distance may be less.
Quote from: Oline89 on March 09, 2020, 01:59:26 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 09, 2020, 01:34:54 PM
Ramps, one-way streets, cloverleaf exits on the other side headed away from campus, etc.
So, who determines the best route? I bet you can create a straighter shot by taking backroads, it will take twice as long, but distance may be less.
The NCAA has a website that does the mileage between institutions - I believe from the main athletics facility to the other. We share it here all the time: https://web1.ncaa.org/TES/exec/miles
But you have to remember, this is based on (a) buses and not cars (backroads can't be an option) and (b) without crossing international borders (we've been through that debacle as well).
Quote from: Oline89 on March 09, 2020, 01:59:26 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 09, 2020, 01:34:54 PM
Ramps, one-way streets, cloverleaf exits on the other side headed away from campus, etc.
So, who determines the best route? I bet you can create a straighter shot by taking backroads, it will take twice as long, but distance may be less.
It's a program the NCAA uses - essentially google maps or something similar - using "shortest distance." These are the shortest distances.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 09, 2020, 02:09:02 PM
Quote from: Oline89 on March 09, 2020, 01:59:26 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 09, 2020, 01:34:54 PM
Ramps, one-way streets, cloverleaf exits on the other side headed away from campus, etc.
So, who determines the best route? I bet you can create a straighter shot by taking backroads, it will take twice as long, but distance may be less.
It's a program the NCAA uses - essentially google maps or something similar - using "shortest distance." These are the shortest distances.
... for use by buses. Not cars.
For Example Potsdam to Colby is about a 7 hour drive through Canada, but closer to 8 in the USA.
The debacle showed up a few years ago when SUNY Geneseo was awarded hosting of the Sectional when somehow the NCAA thought Hope could get there in under 500 miles ... then it was quickly realized the committee had been given bad intel from those above them. The mileage was as if Hope went through Detroit and Canada around the upper part of Lake Erie.
That was changed a few hours later to a school (which I can't remember) in Ohio instead.
Sweet 16 matchups per Massey:
#5-Swarthmore@
#25-Whitworth
#15-Brockport@
#19-Tufts
----------
#1-St. John's@
#2-St. Thomas
#8-Elmhurst@
#11-Pomona-Pitzer
-----------
#4-Mount Union@
#10-Wittenberg
#3-Randolph-Macon@
#7-Yeshiva
-----------
#14-Christopher Newport@
#23-Hobart
#6-North Central@
#9-Wash U
https://www.masseyratings.com/cb2020/ncaa-d3/ratings
Well this will add to the current level of pandemonium:
https://www.princeton.edu/news/2020/03/09/president-eisgruber-updates-university-next-steps-regarding-covid-19-ensure-health
No idea what this means for Spring/Winter athletics
Why can't they go through Canada? Of course the travelling entourage would all need to have a passport (most Michiganders do!), but going through Sarnia, Ontario (rather than Detroit) to Geneseo would cut off hundreds of miles.
Quote from: augie77 on March 09, 2020, 02:43:38 PM
Why can't they go through Canada? Of course the travelling entourage would all need to have a passport (most Michiganders do!), but going through Sarnia, Ontario (rather than Detroit) to Geneseo would cut off hundreds of miles.
Because on a few day's notice ... anyone without a passport or proper documents isn't going to be able to cross through. Not everyone has passports and such. And while drivers' licenses have been allowed in the past, that isn't always the case especially for buses.
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 09, 2020, 02:28:18 PM
The debacle showed up a few years ago when SUNY Geneseo was awarded hosting of the Sectional when somehow the NCAA thought Hope could get there in under 500 miles ... then it was quickly realized the committee had been given bad intel from those above them. The mileage was as if Hope went through Detroit and Canada around the upper part of Lake Erie.
That was changed a few hours later to a school (which I can't remember) in Ohio instead.
They also have to make sure it doesn't use ferries. Back when 200 mikes was the range for a way to be in-region and in-region was the record used and not overall record, the program said Hope and Carthage are less than 200 miles from each other but the only way that was possible was a ferry ride across Lake Michigan, in December.
Quote from: hickory_cornhusker on March 09, 2020, 03:39:44 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 09, 2020, 02:28:18 PM
The debacle showed up a few years ago when SUNY Geneseo was awarded hosting of the Sectional when somehow the NCAA thought Hope could get there in under 500 miles ... then it was quickly realized the committee had been given bad intel from those above them. The mileage was as if Hope went through Detroit and Canada around the upper part of Lake Erie.
That was changed a few hours later to a school (which I can't remember) in Ohio instead.
They also have to make sure it doesn't use ferries. Back when 200 mikes was the range for a way to be in-region and in-region was the record used and not overall record, the program said Hope and Carthage are less than 200 miles from each other but the only way that was possible was a ferry ride across Lake Michigan, in December.
This is true ...
Question(s) about the All Start voting announcement just posted.
1> It states that "The game will be played on March 20 at xxx p.m. ET, prior to the NCAA Division III men's basketball championship game." Will it be that weekend in Fort Wayne? Or two weeks later in Atlanta?
2> It states that the list of players will be from a "list with eight top senior student-athletes whose team is no longer participating in the NCAA Tournament." Will that list be updated as teams get knocked out of the tournament? Not my Pirates of course :)
Sorry - us anal-retentive accountants want to know these details...
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 09, 2020, 06:00:36 PM
Quote from: hickory_cornhusker on March 09, 2020, 03:39:44 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 09, 2020, 02:28:18 PM
The debacle showed up a few years ago when SUNY Geneseo was awarded hosting of the Sectional when somehow the NCAA thought Hope could get there in under 500 miles ... then it was quickly realized the committee had been given bad intel from those above them. The mileage was as if Hope went through Detroit and Canada around the upper part of Lake Erie.
That was changed a few hours later to a school (which I can't remember) in Ohio instead.
They also have to make sure it doesn't use ferries. Back when 200 mikes was the range for a way to be in-region and in-region was the record used and not overall record, the program said Hope and Carthage are less than 200 miles from each other but the only way that was possible was a ferry ride across Lake Michigan, in December.
This is true ...
For an early season football game, or a late season spring sport game, the ferry would be both plausible and pleasant. In the basketball season, it would be both unpleasant and impossible, since the ferries don't run then! ::)
Before 9-11-2001, cutting thru Canada would be totally reasonable and mileage and time saving. Since then, while Michigan-born players might well have 'enhanced drivers' licenses', allowing travel into or thru Canada, others might not. (And it appears that even Michiganders may need full-fledged passports pretty soon.) My wife and I used to go to Canada 5-6 times as year; we now rarely go (getting into Canada is rarely a problem, and always done very politely, it's getting back to the country we were both born in that is a major hassle! :()
Try living 25 miles from the border. For 30+ years we always played a preseason exhibition game against a Canadian team, not any more. That stopped when Border patrol sent half of the Canadian team back home on the way to a scheduled game. [Bush administration].
On a basketball note---does it feel like this is the first time in a couple of years that we have most of arguably the top 16 teams in the country, minus the usual standard midwest cannibalism?
13 of the 16 are D-III hoops top 20.
Hobart, Christopher Newport, and Whitworth are the others, should be a great week.
I probably wouldn't say the 16 best teams. However, they are in the sweet sixteen from what is probably the most difficult overall opening round games I have ever witnessed!
Go DIII.
Quote from: thebear on March 09, 2020, 09:21:26 PM
13 of the 16 are D-III hoops top 20.
Hobart, Christopher Newport, and Whitworth are the others, should be a great week.
Pomona-Pitzer got two votes in the last regular season poll.
Quote from: 89Pirate on March 09, 2020, 06:18:36 PM
Question(s) about the All Start voting announcement just posted.
1> It states that "The game will be played on March 20 at xxx p.m. ET, prior to the NCAA Division III men's basketball championship game." Will it be that weekend in Fort Wayne? Or two weeks later in Atlanta?
2> It states that the list of players will be from a "list with eight top senior student-athletes whose team is no longer participating in the NCAA Tournament." Will that list be updated as teams get knocked out of the tournament? Not my Pirates of course :)
Sorry - us anal-retentive accountants want to know these details...
We will fix that. It is ahead of the semifinals on Saturday in Fort Wayne.
I just can't remember the game time.
Quote from: TheOsprey on March 09, 2020, 09:22:50 PM
I probably wouldn't say the 16 best teams. However, they are in the sweet sixteen from what is probably the most difficult overall opening round games I have ever witnessed!
Go DIII.
Definitely not the best 16 teams---I don't know if that will ever be possible with the current regional set-ups (not a complaint). But with all things considered, we are set up for some really nice matchups down the stretch, thanks to a relatively upset free first weekend.
Relatively upset free? HALF of the 1st weekend hosts were knocked out. Wooster, JHU and Stevens lost the 1st night.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 10, 2020, 09:11:46 AM
Relatively upset free? HALF of the 1st weekend hosts were knocked out. Wooster, JHU and Stevens lost the 1st night.
Losing as a host does not necessarily mean that they were upsets, or huge, huge upsets. Platteville losing to St. Thomas, Emory losing to Pomona, Springfield to Hobart, etc., those are maybe surprising outcomes, but a lot of those games are essentially coin flips. We can't consider the 16 hosts to be the top 16 seeds like we could if this was Division 1.
With that being said, I just checked last year's bracket and it was much more upset-free than I recall, so maybe this is a bit of an overreaction, or I probably still have the first weekend of 2018 etched into my memory forever. My overall point was that we were able to hang on to almost all of the teams that have a real shot at winning the National Championship. Wooster and Stevens weren't going to win 6 games in a row.
unranked CNU beat #11 Colby
;D
Quote from: CNU85 on March 10, 2020, 12:19:53 PM
unranked CNU beat #11 Colby
;D
As a Williams fan, that wasn't an upset. ;)
Increasingly, it seem as though Johns Hopkins was leading the way rather than overacting...
There could very few basketball games played in front of crowds this weekend, but time will tell.
At some point there will be a moment when people go........Oh, thats why.
Quote from: sac on March 10, 2020, 03:21:48 PM
At some point there will be a moment when people go........Oh, thats why.
Yep. Reading some of the on the ground reports, either from doctors in Italy, or from how things spread and were handled on the cruise ships, or that nursing home in Washington really gave me some perspective on these decisions.
Quote from: sac on March 10, 2020, 03:21:48 PM
At some point there will be a moment when people go........Oh, thats why.
I watched World War Z last week and that reminded me of the 10th Man Concept. If 9 people agree on something, it's the duty of the 10th man to disagree. John's Hopkins is that 10th man.
My much anticipated trip to Fort Wayne is looking more and more in doubt.
Quote from: WUPHF on March 10, 2020, 03:14:23 PM
Increasingly, it seem as though Johns Hopkins was leading the way rather than overacting...
There could very few basketball games played in front of crowds this weekend, but time will tell.
Except that was their only decision ... Hopkins is still open and other athletic events are carrying on. I don't think Hopkins was leading anything other than showing how to overreact or not tell the entire truth.
I have a student athlete in my class tonight. I will ask her opinion about all these closings and fans being banned etc. Her season is going on now - Lacrosse. It will be interesting to obtain the perspective of someone who may be impacted directly.
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 10, 2020, 03:47:38 PM
Quote from: WUPHF on March 10, 2020, 03:14:23 PM
Increasingly, it seem as though Johns Hopkins was leading the way rather than overacting...
There could very few basketball games played in front of crowds this weekend, but time will tell.
Except that was their only decision ... Hopkins is still open and other athletic events are carrying on. I don't think Hopkins was leading anything other than showing how to overreact or not tell the entire truth.
On the contrary, deciding to cancel one event and carry on with others is in fact a series of decisions.
It is very reasonable for an administration to assess multiple situations and, based on the individual considerations and factors impacting different events, arrive at different conclusions as to the preferred path forward. These decisions were not made in a vacuum.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 10, 2020, 09:11:46 AM
Relatively upset free? HALF of the 1st weekend hosts were knocked out. Wooster, JHU and Stevens lost the 1st night.
Wooster may have hosted, but Elmhurst was clearly the best team in that pod, and they were ranked as such going in.
Is there somewhere to see the already-chosen All-Stars? I'm wondering if Wooster's Danyon Hempy made it.
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 10, 2020, 07:06:14 PM
Is there somewhere to see the already-chosen All-Stars? I'm wondering if Wooster's Danyon Hempy made it.
That has not been released, but as the NCAC POY, it's very likely he was invited. Whether he accepted or not we'll have to find out. I have no inside information, but we can generally guess at the two choices based on who is on the ballot. I'd all but guarantee Hempy was chosen. Again, not every accepts the invite, but he's a no brainer, especially since the OAC POY is still playing.
They will release the all-stars at some point in the next week or so. I think typically once the voting is done.
The list of who made it will undoubtedly include representatives of the eight teams which lose this weekend, which is why they haven't been made public as of yet.
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 10, 2020, 06:55:50 PM
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 10, 2020, 09:11:46 AM
Relatively upset free? HALF of the 1st weekend hosts were knocked out. Wooster, JHU and Stevens lost the 1st night.
Wooster may have hosted, but Elmhurst was clearly the best team in that pod, and they were ranked as such going in.
I understand not every host is technically the best team in the quad and we know why Elmhurst didn't host. However, to think Grove City beating Wooster on their homecourt wasn't an upset is completely wrong.
St. Thomas over Platteville was a very slight upset. Springfield was the best team in the NEWMAC during the regular season, has (probably) the POTY on it's team and plays in a conference that regularly gets multiple bids and is also highly rated. I don't think l Hobart and the Liberty League are any of those. So, in my opinion, Hobart over Springfield was a big upset as well, as was PS Harrisburg over JHU, fans or no fans.
Quote from: CNU85 on March 10, 2020, 04:31:15 PM
I have a student athlete in my class tonight. I will ask her opinion about all these closings and fans being banned etc. Her season is going on now - Lacrosse. It will be interesting to obtain the perspective of someone who may be impacted directly.
I teach on Tuesday nights at Clarkson, D3 school with D1 Hockey. My hockey players (2 in my class) are still practicing and expect to host an ECAC quarterfinal playoff series vs. Colgate this weekend. Spring Break starts at 10PM Friday. Potsdam's women's lacrosse team played today in Hilton Head, and our women's softball team has been playing games at the Clermont Florida complex since the weekend.
I have been told to prepare to teach online if needed.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 10, 2020, 08:47:10 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 10, 2020, 06:55:50 PM
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 10, 2020, 09:11:46 AM
Relatively upset free? HALF of the 1st weekend hosts were knocked out. Wooster, JHU and Stevens lost the 1st night.
Wooster may have hosted, but Elmhurst was clearly the best team in that pod, and they were ranked as such going in.
...to think Grove City beating Wooster on their homecourt wasn't an upset is completely wrong.
Completely agree with you. The Scots losing that first game was a surprise.
Quote from: CNU85 on March 10, 2020, 04:31:15 PM
I have a student athlete in my class tonight. I will ask her opinion about all these closings and fans being banned etc. Her season is going on now - Lacrosse. It will be interesting to obtain the perspective of someone who may be impacted directly.
and she is out with the flu....
Quote from: CNU85 on March 11, 2020, 08:28:11 AM
Quote from: CNU85 on March 10, 2020, 04:31:15 PM
I have a student athlete in my class tonight. I will ask her opinion about all these closings and fans being banned etc. Her season is going on now - Lacrosse. It will be interesting to obtain the perspective of someone who may be impacted directly.
and she is out with the flu....
Players are questioning why they are being sent to MA where there are more and more cases of COVID-19. Sure this is fear based but when all of your peers are being sent home and spring sports cancelled, players are wondering why am i going on an airplane petri dish to area where there are more cases.
Quote from: VT-Alum-NOVA on March 11, 2020, 09:05:16 AM
Quote from: CNU85 on March 11, 2020, 08:28:11 AM
Quote from: CNU85 on March 10, 2020, 04:31:15 PM
I have a student athlete in my class tonight. I will ask her opinion about all these closings and fans being banned etc. Her season is going on now - Lacrosse. It will be interesting to obtain the perspective of someone who may be impacted directly.
and she is out with the flu....
Players are questioning why they are being sent to MA where there are more and more cases of COVID-19. Sure this is fear based but when all of your peers are being sent home and spring sports cancelled, players are wondering why am i going on an airplane petri dish to area where there are more cases.
It appears the most common response to this is to prepare for online classes and limit crowds, not the full on evacuation/cancellation we're seeing from some. I know a number of schools are considering a "family only" policy for spring sports attendance and limiting large gatherings on campus.
There has not been, to my knowledge, any public recommendation to cancel classes or empty campuses. You see some private schools choosing this, but most schools are following public health guidelines.
It's going to be a very fluid situation moving forward, for sure.
Partial list of major colleges transitioning to online classes only after Spring Break or closing campuses. When you have Rutgers and Ohio State in these groupings, those are big freaking schools, you start wondering. I've taken online classes. My wife is currently taking them. We both hate them and think they are way less effective than in person classes. But apparently the Education Department is lessening rules and standards to help this transition. At some point the athletes have a point. Why should they be the only ones on campus and traveling? Why are they guinea pigs? Is sport really that important? More important than in-person classes students have signed up for?
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/10/us/politics/coronavirus-colleges.html
To add....
Not sure if it has been brought up here, but my alma mater, RPI, will be hosting Harvard in a best of 3 game series ECAC D1 Hockey playoff series this weekend..
In front of empty stands (capacity 4,780)
Contrary to opinions previously mentioned, IVY League Basketball players, led by Penn, are banding together to PROTEST CANCELLATION of the IVY League Men's and Women's Basketball tourneys, while Ivy teams in other sports are permitted to advance in various tourneys..
Quote from: hopefan on March 11, 2020, 10:20:43 AM
Contrary to opinions previously mentioned, Ivy League Basketball players, led by Penn, are banding together to PROTEST CANCELLATION of the IVY League Men's and Women's Basketball tourneys, while Ivy teams in other sports are permitted to advance in various tourneys..
Meh! Protests are the everyday on elite college campuses...
The colleges that are closing have student protests to stay open and the colleges not closing have students protests to shut them down. You're not going to satisfy everyone. I'd just encourage schools to work with local health guidelines; it's important for everyone to be on the same page.
Quote from: kiko on March 10, 2020, 06:03:16 PM
On the contrary, deciding to cancel one event and carry on with others is in fact a series of decisions.
It is very reasonable for an administration to assess multiple situations and, based on the individual considerations and factors impacting different events, arrive at different conclusions as to the preferred path forward. These decisions were not made in a vacuum.
Agreed!
Quote from: jknezek on March 11, 2020, 09:49:13 AM
At some point the athletes have a point. Why should they be the only ones on campus and traveling? Why are they guinea pigs? Is sport really that important? More important than in-person classes students have signed up for?
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/10/us/politics/coronavirus-colleges.html
My post was meant to show that the attitude of college athletes expressed in jknezbek's post is not necessarily the attitude shared by all college athletes....
No fans at Swarthmore. Announcement just came down - it's on their athletic page.
Wittenberg announced limited attendance, meaning athlete families will be allowed in. Mount Union with the same policy.
Quote from: hopefan on March 11, 2020, 10:43:42 AM
Quote from: jknezek on March 11, 2020, 09:49:13 AM
At some point the athletes have a point. Why should they be the only ones on campus and traveling? Why are they guinea pigs? Is sport really that important? More important than in-person classes students have signed up for?
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/10/us/politics/coronavirus-colleges.html
My post was meant to show that the attitude of college athletes expressed in jknezbek's post is not necessarily the attitude shared by all college athletes....
I agree with this 100%. If I paid for in person classes and got switched to online classes I'd be pretty mad. Let alone meal plans, room costs, parking fees, facility fees and everything else that SHOULD be refunded if campus isn't open or you aren't allowed to be there, but I wouldn't hold my breathe.
DIII athletes play for the love of the game. There is, literally, only costs involved. So if you are closing in person classes, as Amherst has done, what justification do you have for your athletes to stay and travel and play? Do players still want to play? Probably most of them. That's part of the love of the game. But that doesn't change the fact that the admin has decided campus is a risk, travel is a risk, but somehow traveling for sport and practicing on campus is not a risk. There is no logical justification for this. There is no way to put lipstick on that pig. You ARE treating athletes as lab rats, and that's not ok, even if they are willing to be those lab rats.
This is what drives me crazy. Especially at DIII where sport is simply an extra curricular activity. If campus is too risky for education, the whole point of being there, campus is too risky for extra curriculars... including sport.
And, to back up what I just posted...
https://generalssports.com/news/2020/3/11/baseball-thursday-contest-against-tufts-cancelled.aspx
Tufts just cancelled spring sports for the remainder of the spring semester according to a W&L press release. They were scheduled to play baseball.
Quote from: jknezek on March 11, 2020, 11:26:51 AM
And, to back up what I just posted...
https://generalssports.com/news/2020/3/11/baseball-thursday-contest-against-tufts-cancelled.aspx
Tufts just cancelled spring sports for the remainder of the spring semester according to a W&L press release. They were scheduled to play baseball.
Whole NESCAC conference cancelled spring sports: https://nescac.com/news/2019-20/COVID19-Athletics
Quote from: Colby Hoops on March 11, 2020, 11:29:00 AM
Quote from: jknezek on March 11, 2020, 11:26:51 AM
And, to back up what I just posted...
https://generalssports.com/news/2020/3/11/baseball-thursday-contest-against-tufts-cancelled.aspx
Tufts just cancelled spring sports for the remainder of the spring semester according to a W&L press release. They were scheduled to play baseball.
Whole NESCAC conference cancelled spring sports: https://nescac.com/news/2019-20/COVID19-Athletics
only the beginning, how can they even ask d3 players to stay on campus and travel when all other students would be going home? Many if not MOST USA universities will probably send students home including D1 schools
Quote from: VT-Alum-NOVA on March 11, 2020, 11:33:44 AM
Quote from: Colby Hoops on March 11, 2020, 11:29:00 AM
Quote from: jknezek on March 11, 2020, 11:26:51 AM
And, to back up what I just posted...
https://generalssports.com/news/2020/3/11/baseball-thursday-contest-against-tufts-cancelled.aspx
Tufts just cancelled spring sports for the remainder of the spring semester according to a W&L press release. They were scheduled to play baseball.
Whole NESCAC conference cancelled spring sports: https://nescac.com/news/2019-20/COVID19-Athletics
only the beginning, how can they even ask d3 players to stay on campus and travel when all other students would be going home? Many if not MOST USA universities will probably send students home including D1 schools
A lot of the big schools are moving to online classes and inviting students to go home; most are allowing them to stay, if desired. It's really public gatherings they're trying to minimize.
In light of recent event changes among DI and DIII, and I presume DII as well, do you think the Finals in Atlanta weekend will be affected?
I have the opportunity to go but...would hate to have to deal with airline cancellations etc...
Also - do we know the approximate cost for tickets for the Finals games for DIII?
Quote from: 89Pirate on March 11, 2020, 12:38:00 PM
In light of recent event changes among DI and DIII, and I presume DII as well, do you think the Finals in Atlanta weekend will be affected?
I have the opportunity to go but...would hate to have to deal with airline cancellations etc...
Also - do we know the approximate cost for tickets for the Finals games for DIII?
D2 and D3 finals are free to the public.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 11, 2020, 12:44:04 PM
Quote from: 89Pirate on March 11, 2020, 12:38:00 PM
In light of recent event changes among DI and DIII, and I presume DII as well, do you think the Finals in Atlanta weekend will be affected?
I have the opportunity to go but...would hate to have to deal with airline cancellations etc...
Also - do we know the approximate cost for tickets for the Finals games for DIII?
D2 and D3 finals are free to the public.
Saweet! Save me a few bucks anyway!
Quote from: 89Pirate on March 11, 2020, 12:49:06 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 11, 2020, 12:44:04 PM
Quote from: 89Pirate on March 11, 2020, 12:38:00 PM
In light of recent event changes among DI and DIII, and I presume DII as well, do you think the Finals in Atlanta weekend will be affected?
I have the opportunity to go but...would hate to have to deal with airline cancellations etc...
Also - do we know the approximate cost for tickets for the Finals games for DIII?
D2 and D3 finals are free to the public.
Saweet! Save me a few bucks anyway!
They play in the Hawks arena, so they aren't going to run out of seats.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 11, 2020, 12:57:30 PM
Quote from: 89Pirate on March 11, 2020, 12:49:06 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 11, 2020, 12:44:04 PM
Quote from: 89Pirate on March 11, 2020, 12:38:00 PM
In light of recent event changes among DI and DIII, and I presume DII as well, do you think the Finals in Atlanta weekend will be affected?
I have the opportunity to go but...would hate to have to deal with airline cancellations etc...
Also - do we know the approximate cost for tickets for the Finals games for DIII?
Not really worried about the number of seats, just worried that they may so no fans allowed - currently Mrs Pirate is on board with the trip idea so I am trying to get my ducks in a row before paying for anything. Hotels rates are killing me right now though.
D2 and D3 finals are free to the public.
Saweet! Save me a few bucks anyway!
They play in the Hawks arena, so they aren't going to run out of seats.
Quote from: jknezek on March 11, 2020, 11:06:17 AM
Quote from: hopefan on March 11, 2020, 10:43:42 AM
Quote from: jknezek on March 11, 2020, 09:49:13 AM
At some point the athletes have a point. Why should they be the only ones on campus and traveling? Why are they guinea pigs? Is sport really that important? More important than in-person classes students have signed up for?
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/10/us/politics/coronavirus-colleges.html
My post was meant to show that the attitude of college athletes expressed in jknezbek's post is not necessarily the attitude shared by all college athletes....
I agree with this 100%. If I paid for in person classes and got switched to online classes I'd be pretty mad. Let alone meal plans, room costs, parking fees, facility fees and everything else that SHOULD be refunded if campus isn't open or you aren't allowed to be there, but I wouldn't hold my breathe.
DIII athletes play for the love of the game. There is, literally, only costs involved. So if you are closing in person classes, as Amherst has done, what justification do you have for your athletes to stay and travel and play? Do players still want to play? Probably most of them. That's part of the love of the game. But that doesn't change the fact that the admin has decided campus is a risk, travel is a risk, but somehow traveling for sport and practicing on campus is not a risk. There is no logical justification for this. There is no way to put lipstick on that pig. You ARE treating athletes as lab rats, and that's not ok, even if they are willing to be those lab rats.
This is what drives me crazy. Especially at DIII where sport is simply an extra curricular activity. If campus is too risky for education, the whole point of being there, campus is too risky for extra curriculars... including sport.
Sport is "just an extra-articular activity"? Playing NCAA basketball is not the same as joining the Ultimate frisbee club. These athletes have busted their butts for years, spent endless hours in the gym/weightroom, and run countless miles in preparation to play for a championship. I am not saying that COVID 19 is not a serious health concern, however, these athletes are not lab rats. The CDC has not told the nation to quarantine, we are not currently in a police state. Take precautions, wash your hands, don't shake hands with everyone you meet, if someone has a fever/respiratory issue/severe cough, then contact your physician and stay home. Otherwise let's hold off on initiating panic, and calling athletes lab rats.
Extra curricular activity, rather than career path? If that's what jknezek was implying, I can get on board.
Quote from: Oline89 on March 11, 2020, 02:46:19 PM
Quote from: jknezek on March 11, 2020, 11:06:17 AM
Quote from: hopefan on March 11, 2020, 10:43:42 AM
Quote from: jknezek on March 11, 2020, 09:49:13 AM
At some point the athletes have a point. Why should they be the only ones on campus and traveling? Why are they guinea pigs? Is sport really that important? More important than in-person classes students have signed up for?
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/10/us/politics/coronavirus-colleges.html
My post was meant to show that the attitude of college athletes expressed in jknezbek's post is not necessarily the attitude shared by all college athletes....
I agree with this 100%. If I paid for in person classes and got switched to online classes I'd be pretty mad. Let alone meal plans, room costs, parking fees, facility fees and everything else that SHOULD be refunded if campus isn't open or you aren't allowed to be there, but I wouldn't hold my breathe.
DIII athletes play for the love of the game. There is, literally, only costs involved. So if you are closing in person classes, as Amherst has done, what justification do you have for your athletes to stay and travel and play? Do players still want to play? Probably most of them. That's part of the love of the game. But that doesn't change the fact that the admin has decided campus is a risk, travel is a risk, but somehow traveling for sport and practicing on campus is not a risk. There is no logical justification for this. There is no way to put lipstick on that pig. You ARE treating athletes as lab rats, and that's not ok, even if they are willing to be those lab rats.
This is what drives me crazy. Especially at DIII where sport is simply an extra curricular activity. If campus is too risky for education, the whole point of being there, campus is too risky for extra curriculars... including sport.
Sport is "just an extra-articular activity"? Playing NCAA basketball is not the same as joining the Ultimate frisbee club. These athletes have busted their butts for years, spent endless hours in the gym/weightroom, and run countless miles in preparation to play for a championship. I am not saying that COVID 19 is not a serious health concern, however, these athletes are not lab rats. The CDC has not told the nation to quarantine, we are not currently in a police state. Take precautions, wash your hands, don't shake hands with everyone you meet, if someone has a fever/respiratory issue/severe cough, then contact your physician and stay home. Otherwise let's hold off on initiating panic, and calling athletes lab rats.
Yes, sports is "just an extra curricular activity" at the DIII level. The amount of effort put in doesn't change that designation. I put more effort and hours into our student paper as editor than I did in the year I played soccer, and about as much as part of club rugby as DIII soccer. And all 3 are "just an extra curricular activity". Your opinion may vary, but by definition, DIII sports are an extra curricular activity.
As for the rest, that's all lagging. By the time it happens, it will be too late. Such is the way the world works. As we've seen with the NESCAC and JHU, some places will be proactive, some will be reactive. But I think the proper logic works like this... if you are closing campus, you should close your sports. And we've seen this with Amherst, I suspect we will see it with other places. Any other choice makes no sense. If you are not closing your campus, then keeping extra curricular activities going is a different decision. But once you end the MAIN ACTIVITY on campus... classes... all subsidiary activities, by logic, need to be ended as well.
Again, your opinion may vary, but I think Amherst made the right choice in ending sports once they ended on campus classes. We will see what other schools do as they end on campus classes.
Old me would give Jknezek a K+ for that. I'll get back to 200 posts eventually.
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 11, 2020, 03:03:07 PM
Extra curricular activity, rather than career path? If that's what jknezek was implying, I can get on board.
Man. Who would guess we would struggle with a definition like this? Extracurricular literally means "outside the curriculum." DIII sports are outside the curriculum of any college. You earn no credits toward a degree for doing it. Do you learn and grow and have all kinds of wonderful experiences from DIII sports? Absolutely. But it is an extracurricular activity.
I mean, we can go with Merriam-Webster if we want...
Definition of extracurricular
1: not falling within the scope of a regular curriculum
specifically : of or relating to officially or semiofficially approved and usually organized student activities (such as athletics) connected with school and usually carrying no academic creditextracurricular sports
Ohio bans mass gatherings including spectators at First Four in Dayton and first and second round NCAA games in Cleveland unless the NCAA moves them.
https://www.yardbarker.com/college_basketball/articles/fans_banned_from_march_madness_games_in_ohio_via_state_order_due_to_coronavirus/s1_127_31541621
Quote from: jknezek on March 11, 2020, 03:09:35 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 11, 2020, 03:03:07 PM
Extra curricular activity, rather than career path? If that's what jknezek was implying, I can get on board.
Man. Who would guess we would struggle with a definition like this? Extracurricular literally means "outside the curriculum." DIII sports are outside the curriculum of any college. You earn no credits toward a degree for doing it. Do you learn and grow and have all kinds of wonderful experiences from DIII sports? Absolutely. But it is an extracurricular activity.
I mean, we can go with Merriam-Webster if we want...
Definition of extracurricular
1: not falling within the scope of a regular curriculum
specifically : of or relating to officially or semiofficially approved and usually organized student activities (such as athletics) connected with school and usually carrying no academic credit
extracurricular sports
I have no problem with your definition of extra curricular activity. My problem is with your addition of the word "just"
I wouldn't consider the best 10-15% of DIII student newspapers "just" an extracurricular any more than I would the top 10-15% of DIII athletic teams. College students who do those things commit near if not actually professional levels of time and attention, likely as much or more than they give to their classwork. This is one of those definitions you'd probably have to let the participants decide on. I imagine many student athletes would come down on each side.
Ours wasn't even in that top echelon, by a longshot, but all four of the top editors went into the biz after graduation. :)
Seems there is at least some consideration to canceling the D1 tournament (which, would undoubtedly lead to the D3 tourney being canceled): https://twitter.com/Hassel_Chris/status/1237827196296757249?s=20
Still think fanless games are the most likely outcome, but we'll see.
NCAA COVID-19 panel just recommended closing all NCAA events to spectators (with limited family attendance).
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 11, 2020, 04:28:43 PM
NCAA COVID-19 panel just recommended closing all NCAA events to spectators (with limited family attendance).
And Mark Emmert just issued a statement that the NCAA will be following that recommendation for all championship events.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 11, 2020, 04:28:43 PM
NCAA COVID-19 panel just recommended closing all NCAA events to spectators (with limited family attendance).
saw this, hence the communique from A10 conference on coordination between NCAA and A10. I am assuming there is concern on A10 conference tournament continuing in Barclays Center since GMU vs St Joe's just finished.
Quote from: VT-Alum-NOVA on March 11, 2020, 05:13:13 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 11, 2020, 04:28:43 PM
NCAA COVID-19 panel just recommended closing all NCAA events to spectators (with limited family attendance).
saw this, hence the communique from A10 conference on coordination between NCAA and A10. I am assuming there is concern on A10 conference tournament continuing in Barclays Center since GMU vs St Joe's just finished.
The NCAA can't really dictate to schools or conferences on their events. That's where we're at right now. RMC, CNU, NCC, Elmhurst, and St. Johns are all currently allowing fans this weekend. They may change that policy for any number of reasons, but the NCAA can't force them to do so.
But we can assume that the finals in Atlanta are off? Still working on my travel plans...AAARRRGGG !
Quote from: 89Pirate on March 11, 2020, 05:24:16 PM
But we can assume that the finals in Atlanta are off? Still working on my travel plans...AAARRRGGG !
Definitely no fans there. I'm sure everything is fluid at this point, but the NCAA has pretty firmly ruled out fans for Ft Wayne and Atlanta.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 11, 2020, 05:27:54 PM
Quote from: 89Pirate on March 11, 2020, 05:24:16 PM
But we can assume that the finals in Atlanta are off? Still working on my travel plans...AAARRRGGG !
Definitely no fans there. I'm sure everything is fluid at this point, but the NCAA has pretty firmly ruled out fans for Ft Wayne and Atlanta.
Damn !
Quote from: 89Pirate on March 11, 2020, 05:31:31 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 11, 2020, 05:27:54 PM
Quote from: 89Pirate on March 11, 2020, 05:24:16 PM
But we can assume that the finals in Atlanta are off? Still working on my travel plans...AAARRRGGG !
Definitely no fans there. I'm sure everything is fluid at this point, but the NCAA has pretty firmly ruled out fans for Ft Wayne and Atlanta.
Damn !
I have no information, let me stress that, but if logistics work, they may just play all three rounds next weekend. The only reason they were going to Atlanta at all was for the atmosphere, which now won't exist. They could play Fri-Sat-Sun in Ft Wayne (if the Civic Center can spare an extra day) and just be done. It would save money, too.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 11, 2020, 05:34:06 PM
Quote from: 89Pirate on March 11, 2020, 05:31:31 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 11, 2020, 05:27:54 PM
Quote from: 89Pirate on March 11, 2020, 05:24:16 PM
But we can assume that the finals in Atlanta are off? Still working on my travel plans...AAARRRGGG !
Definitely no fans there. I'm sure everything is fluid at this point, but the NCAA has pretty firmly ruled out fans for Ft Wayne and Atlanta.
Damn !
I have no information, let me stress that, but if logistics work, they may just play all three rounds next weekend. The only reason they were going to Atlanta at all was for the atmosphere, which now won't exist. They could play Fri-Sat-Sun in Ft Wayne (if the Civic Center can spare an extra day) and just be done. It would save money, too.
Intriguing idea...but Spokane to Ft Wayne was twice the cost LOL.
That sucks. Just cancelled my three nights in Fort Wayne. :'( :'( :'( Two years in a row since the tourney moved from Salem that I planned to go and then had to cancel.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 11, 2020, 05:50:10 PM
That sucks. Just cancelled my three nights in Fort Wayne. :'( :'( :'( Two years in a row since the tourney moved from Salem that I planned to go and then had to cancel.
Two more to go, though. Assuming the human race survives this.
https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2020/03/tufts-joins-amherst-in-closing-doors
Brockport added to the list of restricted attendance.
Quote from: Colby Hoops on March 11, 2020, 11:29:00 AM
Quote from: jknezek on March 11, 2020, 11:26:51 AM
And, to back up what I just posted...
https://generalssports.com/news/2020/3/11/baseball-thursday-contest-against-tufts-cancelled.aspx
Tufts just cancelled spring sports for the remainder of the spring semester according to a W&L press release. They were scheduled to play baseball.
Whole NESCAC conference cancelled spring sports: https://nescac.com/news/2019-20/COVID19-Athletics
As I post this Bowdoin is in action against Babson in men's lacrosse. The link says "
conference competition". Can that possibly mean just matches between NESCAC squads? That wouldn't make sense, because, unlike basketball, the in and out of conference games are sprinkled throughout the lacrosse season.
Quote from: 89Pirate on March 11, 2020, 05:40:23 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 11, 2020, 05:34:06 PM
Quote from: 89Pirate on March 11, 2020, 05:31:31 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 11, 2020, 05:27:54 PM
Quote from: 89Pirate on March 11, 2020, 05:24:16 PM
But we can assume that the finals in Atlanta are off? Still working on my travel plans...AAARRRGGG !
Definitely no fans there. I'm sure everything is fluid at this point, but the NCAA has pretty firmly ruled out fans for Ft Wayne and Atlanta.
Damn !
I have no information, let me stress that, but if logistics work, they may just play all three rounds next weekend. The only reason they were going to Atlanta at all was for the atmosphere, which now won't exist. They could play Fri-Sat-Sun in Ft Wayne (if the Civic Center can spare an extra day) and just be done. It would save money, too.
Intriguing idea...but Spokane to Ft Wayne was twice the cost LOL.
I stand corrected, I can get to Chicago, and drive for about the same $...hmmm
Quote from: BaboNation on March 11, 2020, 06:06:16 PM
Quote from: Colby Hoops on March 11, 2020, 11:29:00 AM
Quote from: jknezek on March 11, 2020, 11:26:51 AM
And, to back up what I just posted...
https://generalssports.com/news/2020/3/11/baseball-thursday-contest-against-tufts-cancelled.aspx
Tufts just cancelled spring sports for the remainder of the spring semester according to a W&L press release. They were scheduled to play baseball.
Whole NESCAC conference cancelled spring sports: https://nescac.com/news/2019-20/COVID19-Athletics
As I post this Bowdoin is in action against Babson in men's lacrosse. The link says "conference competition". Can that possibly mean just matches between NESCAC squads? That wouldn't make sense, because, unlike basketball, the in and out of conference games are sprinkled throughout the lacrosse season.
The conference schedule, conference tournament, conference championship.
Assuming that schools will continue to participate until they are closed. Haven't seen what date that is for Bowdoin, if there is one.
Quote from: Ithaca798891 on March 11, 2020, 03:08:40 PM
Old me would give Jknezek a K+ for that. I'll get back to 200 posts eventually.
I got your back.
Quote from: jknezek on March 11, 2020, 03:09:35 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 11, 2020, 03:03:07 PM
Extra curricular activity, rather than career path? If that's what jknezek was implying, I can get on board.
Man. Who would guess we would struggle with a definition like this? Extracurricular literally means "outside the curriculum." DIII sports are outside the curriculum of any college. You earn no credits toward a degree for doing it. Do you learn and grow and have all kinds of wonderful experiences from DIII sports? Absolutely. But it is an extracurricular activity.
I mean, we can go with Merriam-Webster if we want...
Definition of extracurricular
1: not falling within the scope of a regular curriculum
specifically : of or relating to officially or semiofficially approved and usually organized student activities (such as athletics) connected with school and usually carrying no academic credit
extracurricular sports
So ... not entirely true. Most liberal arts schools, at least, give student-athletes credit towards their course work for being on a team. Some give it out once. I've heard of others twice. Many liberal arts colleges you need a physical education class or multiple classes to count towards your general ed requirements ... and thus participation (officially on the roster; not just trying out) with a varsity program counts and thus is part of the curriculum.
NBA suspends season! :o
Correction: Utah has a player with the Coronavirus. It will be interesting to see if the games continue, will entire teams need to forfeit...
I never watch NBA basketball...
This was just released a short while ago.
"After taking the initial step to play games in empty arenas, the NBA issued a statement on Wednesday night that all games will be suspended until further notice after a Utah Jazz player, reportedly Rudy Gobert, tested positive for the coronavirus.
Games that are in action Wednesday night will finish."
Virtually all (they are coming in frequently; maybe even all by now) public 4-year schools in Michigan have gone to on-line classes only. My younger son, teaching his first semester at Washtenaw CC says he is being trained in videotaping his lectures, and suspects this means CCs will soon follow.
Grinnell cancelled all Spring sports.
Fred Hoiberg coached his Nebraska squad against Indiana today even though he felt sick. With about five or so minutes to go he couldn't go on, and left the bench, and then the hospital. His team is being quarantined.
I don't know what the repercussions will be, but it could be that a 14th seed in the Big Ten Tourney may have ended the season for everyone.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 11, 2020, 10:26:23 PM
Grinnell cancelled all Spring sports.
A touch of what is going on in the D-III world.
https://www.d3sports.com/notables/2020/03/amherst-closes-campus-for-spring
Surprisingly, I see no announcements regarding classes or athletics from The College of Wooster. Not surprisingly, the local social media reactions to all things coronavirus are that it's either a hoax or no more dangerous than the regular flu. To these yokels, any of the government's actions, even those of their Republican elected governor, (Mike DeWine has actually been a far more moderate presence in Columbus than I'd expected.) are akin to those of a police state. This kind of thing scares me more than the virus itself.
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 12, 2020, 01:30:44 AM
Surprisingly, I see no announcements regarding classes or athletics from The College of Wooster. Not surprisingly, the local social media reactions to all things coronavirus are that it's either a hoax or no more dangerous than the regular flu. To these yokels, any of the government's actions, even those of their Republican elected governor, (Mike DeWine has actually been a far more moderate presence in Columbus than I'd expected.) are akin to those of a police state. This kind of thing scares me more than the virus itself.
Did they have spring break already? A lot of the concern from schools is students returning from break. If they're already back, it makes more sense to keep everyone on campus, presuming there aren't positive cases there already.
Quote from: smedindy on March 12, 2020, 12:29:07 AM
Fred Hoiberg coached his Nebraska squad against Indiana today even though he felt sick. With about five or so minutes to go he couldn't go on, and left the bench, and then the hospital. His team is being quarantined.
I don't know what the repercussions will be, but it could be that a 14th seed in the Big Ten Tourney may have ended the season for everyone.
He was diagnosed with influenza A, the common cold, and was not quarantined.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 12, 2020, 08:03:33 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 12, 2020, 01:30:44 AM
Surprisingly, I see no announcements regarding classes or athletics from The College of Wooster. Not surprisingly, the local social media reactions to all things coronavirus are that it's either a hoax or no more dangerous than the regular flu. To these yokels, any of the government's actions, even those of their Republican elected governor, (Mike DeWine has actually been a far more moderate presence in Columbus than I'd expected.) are akin to those of a police state. This kind of thing scares me more than the virus itself.
Did they have spring break already? A lot of the concern from schools is students returning from break. If they're already back, it makes more sense to keep everyone on campus, presuming there aren't positive cases there already.
They began Spring Break on 3/6. Classes resume on 3/23. Things will likely have changed much, on all fronts, by then.
List of Universities closed, closing, on hiatus growing rapidly by the hour
https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/arizona-education/2020/03/10/list-of-colleges-closed-online-because-coronavirus/5013436002/ (https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/arizona-education/2020/03/10/list-of-colleges-closed-online-because-coronavirus/5013436002/)
as news has reported, they are doing it in droves
Sounds like Hopkins was ahead of the curve...
Not surprising considering their university is heavily geared to medical research.
Quote from: VT-Alum-NOVA on March 12, 2020, 09:01:11 AM
List of Universities closed, closing, on hiatus growing rapidly by the hour
https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/arizona-education/2020/03/10/list-of-colleges-closed-online-because-coronavirus/5013436002/ (https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/arizona-education/2020/03/10/list-of-colleges-closed-online-because-coronavirus/5013436002/)
as news has reported, they are doing it in droves
It's not on this list, but Wheaton (IL) declared yesterday that it, too, is going into online mode only for the rest of the semester.
Both NCC (https://northcentralcardinals.com/news/2020/3/12/mens-basketball-statement-on-fridays-ncaa-tournament-basketball-game.aspx) and Elmhurst (https://elmhurstbluejays.com/news/2020/3/12/mens-basketball-elmhurst-to-host-ncaa-championship-game-without-fans.aspx) will limit attendance at their games this weekend.
Almost all of the D1 conference tournaments have now been cancelled.
I suspect it won't be long until the NCAA tournament is called off and I'm beginning to doubt that any further D3 games will be played.
Quote from: jamtod on March 12, 2020, 11:58:33 AM
Almost all of the D1 conference tournaments have now been cancelled.
I suspect it won't be long until the NCAA tournament is called off and I'm beginning to doubt that any further D3 games will be played.
There are eight eight-team DII Women's Regionals starting tomorrow. I follow undefeated Ashland who plays at Drury (Missouri), also undefeated. No fans of course, but so far no word about not playing, and I suspect that the teams are already there.
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 12, 2020, 12:06:27 PM
Quote from: jamtod on March 12, 2020, 11:58:33 AM
Almost all of the D1 conference tournaments have now been cancelled.
I suspect it won't be long until the NCAA tournament is called off and I'm beginning to doubt that any further D3 games will be played.
There are eight eight-team DII Women's Regionals starting tomorrow. I follow undefeated Ashland who plays at Drury (Missouri), also undefeated. No fans of course, but so far no word about not playing, and I suspect that the teams are already there.
Teams and fans were on the court getting close to tip-off for many of these conference tournaments today when the decisions were made also.
Wooster has just announced the suspension of in-person classes until at least 4/3.
It has spread now beyond 4-year schools. Washtenaw CC (where my son is teaching his first semester currently) has just announced nothing but on-line classes starting Monday.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 12, 2020, 08:07:10 AM
Quote from: smedindy on March 12, 2020, 12:29:07 AM
Fred Hoiberg coached his Nebraska squad against Indiana today even though he felt sick. With about five or so minutes to go he couldn't go on, and left the bench, and then the hospital. His team is being quarantined.
I don't know what the repercussions will be, but it could be that a 14th seed in the Big Ten Tourney may have ended the season for everyone.
He was diagnosed with influenza A, the common cold, and was not quarantined.
Actually Influenza A is the most severe of the flu variations..
"Type A influenza can be dangerous and is known to cause outbreaks and increase your risk of disease. Unlike a type B infection, type A viruses are categorized by subtypes and strains. Influenza A mutates faster than influenza B"
"Doctors usually say that you can go back to work five days after the onset of symptoms and 24 hours after your fever has cleared"
A little more than a common cold
Quote from: jamtod on March 12, 2020, 11:58:33 AM
Almost all of the D1 conference tournaments have now been cancelled.
I suspect it won't be long until the NCAA tournament is called off and I'm beginning to doubt that any further D3 games will be played.
Agreed. Same feeling here.
Quote from: NEPAFAN on March 12, 2020, 09:39:19 AM
Sounds like Hopkins was ahead of the curve...
Not when they conducted their other sports that weekend like nothing was happening.
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 12, 2020, 01:15:09 PM
Quote from: NEPAFAN on March 12, 2020, 09:39:19 AM
Sounds like Hopkins was ahead of the curve...
Not when they conducted their other sports that weekend like nothing was happening.
Freezing Cold Take...
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 12, 2020, 01:15:09 PM
Quote from: NEPAFAN on March 12, 2020, 09:39:19 AM
Sounds like Hopkins was ahead of the curve...
Not when they conducted their other sports that weekend like nothing was happening.
It is highly unlikely that in what was a chancellor or president-level decision, they said hey, let's close the basketball games because you know, Yeshiva, and then decided there was no need to consider the other outdoor sports. Those and every other event being held on-campus was certainly part of a conversation.
It is time to move on from the basketball decisions should be made by people involved in basketball mentality. It is time to move on from the I wash my hands, so let me do whatever I want mentality.
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 12, 2020, 01:15:09 PM
Quote from: NEPAFAN on March 12, 2020, 09:39:19 AM
Sounds like Hopkins was ahead of the curve...
Not when they conducted their other sports that weekend like nothing was happening.
You keep insisting this was the case, as though there weren't conversations and considerations that led to the choices that were made. JHU likely made nuanced decisions based on different risk calculations. Their administration doesn't owe an explanation on how they arrived at the choices they made to you, to me, or to anyone.
At the time you pointed to what others were (and weren't) doing with allowing public access to their tournament games, and huffed and puffed that JHU was overreacting. But look at what is happening now.
Hopkins was absolutely ahead of the curve. To suggest otherwise is, to be blunt, embarrassing.
Quote from: kiko on March 12, 2020, 02:15:21 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 12, 2020, 01:15:09 PM
Quote from: NEPAFAN on March 12, 2020, 09:39:19 AM
Sounds like Hopkins was ahead of the curve...
Not when they conducted their other sports that weekend like nothing was happening.
You keep insisting this was the case, as though there weren't conversations and considerations that led to the choices that were made. JHU likely made nuanced decisions based on different risk calculations. Their administration doesn't owe an explanation on how they arrived at the choices they made to you, to me, or to anyone.
At the time you pointed to what others were (and weren't) doing with allowing public access to their tournament games, and huffed and puffed that JHU was overreacting. But look at what is happening now.
Hopkins was absolutely ahead of the curve. To suggest otherwise is, to be blunt, embarrassing.
I'm not going to argue against what's happening now, but we do need to remember, just because everyone is doing it and most people are on board with it, we won't know for a few months (and maybe never) if it is an overreaction. You can't prove a negative.
The issue with JHU was not the decisions that were made, but the rationale they gave. They were spooked by having Yeshiva players and fans on campus - which is less and less unjustifiable as the days go on - but they never said as much. The NCAA and WPI seemed willing to say it; JHU never did. I think that's what rubbed a few of us the wrong way. Not the closing so much as seeming to dance around the real reasons.
Duke shutting down athletics, including basketball, makes it a "when", not an "if" NCAA gives up. Legitimacy of the tournament is now clearly at risk. I expect we will not get through this weekend without the NCAA pulling the plug.
Quote from: jknezek on March 12, 2020, 02:38:10 PM
Duke shutting down athletics, including basketball, makes it a "when", not an "if" NCAA gives up. Legitimacy of the tournament is now clearly at risk. I expect we will not get through this weekend without the NCAA pulling the plug.
Agree. Kansas (merely the #1 team in the country) has also suspended all home/away contests and all athletics related travel.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 12, 2020, 08:07:10 AM
Quote from: smedindy on March 12, 2020, 12:29:07 AM
Fred Hoiberg coached his Nebraska squad against Indiana today even though he felt sick. With about five or so minutes to go he couldn't go on, and left the bench, and then the hospital. His team is being quarantined.
I don't know what the repercussions will be, but it could be that a 14th seed in the Big Ten Tourney may have ended the season for everyone.
He was diagnosed with influenza A, the common cold, and was not quarantined.
I saw that later, but still....scary moment.
Quote from: GoPerry on March 12, 2020, 02:39:49 PM
Quote from: jknezek on March 12, 2020, 02:38:10 PM
Duke shutting down athletics, including basketball, makes it a "when", not an "if" NCAA gives up. Legitimacy of the tournament is now clearly at risk. I expect we will not get through this weekend without the NCAA pulling the plug.
Agree. Kansas (merely the #1 team in the country) has also suspended all home/away contests and all athletics related travel.
But they said this would not stop them from participating in the NCAA tournament should it be played.
Quote from: WUPHF on March 12, 2020, 02:01:10 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 12, 2020, 01:15:09 PM
Quote from: NEPAFAN on March 12, 2020, 09:39:19 AM
Sounds like Hopkins was ahead of the curve...
Not when they conducted their other sports that weekend like nothing was happening.
It is highly unlikely that in what was a chancellor or president-level decision, they said hey, let's close the basketball games because you know, Yeshiva, and then decided there was no need to consider the other outdoor sports. Those and every other event being held on-campus was certainly part of a conversation.
It is time to move on from the basketball decisions should be made by people involved in basketball mentality. It is time to move on from the I wash my hands, so let me do whatever I want mentality.
I was told it absolutely was a decision at the highest administrative levels. I also have a neighbor who was on the call representing those outside JHU ... so I know it involved higher admins.
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 12, 2020, 02:48:36 PM
Quote from: GoPerry on March 12, 2020, 02:39:49 PM
Quote from: jknezek on March 12, 2020, 02:38:10 PM
Duke shutting down athletics, including basketball, makes it a "when", not an "if" NCAA gives up. Legitimacy of the tournament is now clearly at risk. I expect we will not get through this weekend without the NCAA pulling the plug.
Agree. Kansas (merely the #1 team in the country) has also suspended all home/away contests and all athletics related travel.
But they said this would not stop them from participating in the NCAA tournament should it be played.
No way the tourney is played.
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 12, 2020, 02:48:36 PM
Quote from: GoPerry on March 12, 2020, 02:39:49 PM
Quote from: jknezek on March 12, 2020, 02:38:10 PM
Duke shutting down athletics, including basketball, makes it a "when", not an "if" NCAA gives up. Legitimacy of the tournament is now clearly at risk. I expect we will not get through this weekend without the NCAA pulling the plug.
Agree. Kansas (merely the #1 team in the country) has also suspended all home/away contests and all athletics related travel.
But they said this would not stop them from participating in the NCAA tournament should it be played.
Really? This tweet makes no mention of that . . .
https://twitter.com/KUAthletics/status/1238161457474306050?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet
Sounds pretty definitive - no travel.
Quote from: GoPerry on March 12, 2020, 03:15:58 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 12, 2020, 02:48:36 PM
Quote from: GoPerry on March 12, 2020, 02:39:49 PM
Quote from: jknezek on March 12, 2020, 02:38:10 PM
Duke shutting down athletics, including basketball, makes it a "when", not an "if" NCAA gives up. Legitimacy of the tournament is now clearly at risk. I expect we will not get through this weekend without the NCAA pulling the plug.
Agree. Kansas (merely the #1 team in the country) has also suspended all home/away contests and all athletics related travel.
But they said this would not stop them from participating in the NCAA tournament should it be played.
Really? This tweet makes no mention of that . . .
https://twitter.com/KUAthletics/status/1238161457474306050?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet
Sounds pretty definitive - no travel.
There's a much longer statement on the website that specifies that it doesn't include the NCAA tournament. But that may be moot as the ACC has announced they will skip the tournament unless it's postponed.
Also, at least one reporter talked to Bill Self and tweeted out the conversation about it not applying to the NCAA Tournament.
It's official. NCAA has canceled "D1 Men's and Women's basketball tournaments and all remaining winter and spring championships."
This came from Mark Emmert and I assume carries down to D3 as well?
Quote from: jamtod on March 12, 2020, 04:20:18 PM
It's official. NCAA has canceled "D1 Men's and Women's basketball tournaments and all remaining winter and spring championships."
This came from Mark Emmert and I assume carries down to D3 as well?
All remaining championships would apply to DIII.
Quote from: jknezek on March 12, 2020, 04:26:05 PM
Quote from: jamtod on March 12, 2020, 04:20:18 PM
It's official. NCAA has canceled "D1 Men's and Women's basketball tournaments and all remaining winter and spring championships."
This came from Mark Emmert and I assume carries down to D3 as well?
All remaining championships would apply to DIII.
I assumed as much, but was not certain if Emmert's purview was all of NCAA or just D1 (obviously his focus and comments were on D1 as that's where the $$ is)
Quote from: jamtod on March 12, 2020, 04:30:33 PM
Quote from: jknezek on March 12, 2020, 04:26:05 PM
Quote from: jamtod on March 12, 2020, 04:20:18 PM
It's official. NCAA has canceled "D1 Men's and Women's basketball tournaments and all remaining winter and spring championships."
This came from Mark Emmert and I assume carries down to D3 as well?
All remaining championships would apply to DIII.
I assumed as much, but was not certain if Emmert's purview was all of NCAA or just D1 (obviously his focus and comments were on D1 as that's where the $$ is)
I just got word. All means D3. Done. Official word will be out shortly.
I hope Whitworth and Pomona didn't already travel. That would be brutal.
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 12, 2020, 02:22:59 PM
Quote from: kiko on March 12, 2020, 02:15:21 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 12, 2020, 01:15:09 PM
Quote from: NEPAFAN on March 12, 2020, 09:39:19 AM
Sounds like Hopkins was ahead of the curve...
Not when they conducted their other sports that weekend like nothing was happening.
You keep insisting this was the case, as though there weren't conversations and considerations that led to the choices that were made. JHU likely made nuanced decisions based on different risk calculations. Their administration doesn't owe an explanation on how they arrived at the choices they made to you, to me, or to anyone.
At the time you pointed to what others were (and weren't) doing with allowing public access to their tournament games, and huffed and puffed that JHU was overreacting. But look at what is happening now.
Hopkins was absolutely ahead of the curve. To suggest otherwise is, to be blunt, embarrassing.
I'm not going to argue against what's happening now, but we do need to remember, just because everyone is doing it and most people are on board with it, we won't know for a few months (and maybe never) if it is an overreaction. You can't prove a negative.
The issue with JHU was not the decisions that were made, but the rationale they gave. They were spooked by having Yeshiva players and fans on campus - which is less and less unjustifiable as the days go on - but they never said as much. The NCAA and WPI seemed willing to say it; JHU never did. I think that's what rubbed a few of us the wrong way. Not the closing so much as seeming to dance around the real reasons.
Correct that we cannot prove a negative. We will never know what the impact of the more risk averse choice might be. But extra caution in a situation like that is not a bad thing IMO.
I'm not the least bit bothered by the reasons they gave for the decision. In my mind, it was diplomatic niceties. They took the action that they felt needed to be taken, but there was no reason to put another school in the crosshairs as they explained their rationale. It was the equivalent of a high level exec or official announcing a decision to leave an organization to "explore other opportunities" when it is clear they were asked to depart.
It's official. NCAA has canceled "D1 Men's and Women's basketball tournaments and all remaining winter and spring championships."
So this affects all of these sports:
Baseball (M)
Beach Volleyball (W)
Golf (M & W)
Lacrosse (M)
Lacrosse (W)
Rowing (W)
Softball (W)
Tennis (M & W)
Outdoor Track & Field (M & W)
Volleyball (M)
Water Polo (W)
Unprecedented for sure.
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=73mrs/m6gg5jcihb76rihu.jpg)
And with that, the 2019-20 seasons have come to a sudden end.
What a week it has been in college basketball. Exactly a week ago, as we hit the air, the first signs that COVID-19 was going to impact the NCAA Tournaments was seen. Since then, it has been a whirlwind.
Tonight on Hoopsville, we try and make sense of one of the stranger finishes in history for NCAA events. What started with isolated closings of gyms for games ends a week later in all games being called off through the rest of the academic year.
We will chat with those who were preparing for games on Friday and hear their reactions to the seasons coming to a close so quickly.
Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Michelle Ferenze, No. 10 Whitman women's coach
- John Krikorian, Christopher Newport men's coach
- Cheri Harrer, No. 9 Baldwin Wallace women's coach
Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch Thursday's show
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All men's coaches appear in the NABC Coach's Corner. And all guests are featured on the BlueFrame Technology Hoopsville Hotline.
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What a strange and disappointing way to end this year's tournament.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 12, 2020, 07:06:52 PM
What a strange and disappointing way to end this year's tournament.
From the Looking Desperately for a Silver Lining Department: Most years only one team finishes the tourney with a win - this year 16 teams did! ;D
Tournament per Massey...
Sweet 16
Swarthmore def. Whitworth
Brockport def. Tufts
St. John's def. St. Thomas
Elmhurst def. Pomona-Pitzer
Mount Union def. Wittenberg
Randolph-Macon def. Yeshiva
Christopher Newport def. Hobart
North Central def. Wash U
Elite 8
Swarthmore def. Brockport
St. John's def. Elmhurst
Mount Union def. Randolph-Macon
Christopher Newport def. North Central
Final 4
St. John's def. Swarthmore
Mount Union def. Christopher Newport
National Championship
Mount Union def. St. John's
https://www.masseyratings.com/cb2020/ncaa-d3/ratings
We'll never know. 🤔 🙁
Massey didn't take into consideration that Brockport's pre-season All American, Justin Summers, was back from an injury that sidelined him for about a dozen games. He scored 22 points in the game against Middlebury last Saturday. With him in the lineup Brockport wins it all. ;D
Congrats to CNU 2020 NCAA Men's and Women's National Co-Champions!!!! ;D
(Stole it from Coach K and Dave on Hoopsville).
Dave -- I was almost there! Haha. After class I ran into some athletic department folks heading home and they told me where the team was eating. I almost headed there but decided they just needed to be to themselves! Nice show, by the way. A difficult one for sure. You managed it with great empathy and understanding. Nicely done!
Quote from: txg on March 12, 2020, 04:53:53 PM
I hope Whitworth and Pomona didn't already travel. That would be brutal.
Not sure about Pomona Pitzer, but the Whitworth team was still on campus in the Fieldhouse waiting on the NCAA decisions.
Truly sad times for sports and sports fan as a whole.
Quote from: 89Pirate on March 13, 2020, 11:55:25 AM
Quote from: txg on March 12, 2020, 04:53:53 PM
I hope Whitworth and Pomona didn't already travel. That would be brutal.
Not sure about Pomona Pitzer, but the Whitworth team was still on campus in the Fieldhouse waiting on the NCAA decisions.
Truly sad times for sports and sports fan as a whole.
As far as I know, all 32 d3 teams were on site when the call came. Yeshiva was literally walking off the bus at their hotel. Tufts men may still have been on the bus.
Wash U guys were in the NCC gym in the middle of their practice session. Bummer. :
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 13, 2020, 12:03:06 PM
Quote from: 89Pirate on March 13, 2020, 11:55:25 AM
Quote from: txg on March 12, 2020, 04:53:53 PM
I hope Whitworth and Pomona didn't already travel. That would be brutal.
Not sure about Pomona Pitzer, but the Whitworth team was still on campus in the Fieldhouse waiting on the NCAA decisions.
Truly sad times for sports and sports fan as a whole.
As far as I know, all 32 d3 teams were on site when the call came. Yeshiva was literally walking off the bus at their hotel. Tufts men may still have been on the bus.
Like I said earlier, the Pirates were still in Spokane...my mother (long story) was there waiting with them.
Quote from: CNU85 on March 13, 2020, 08:23:28 AM
Congrats to CNU 2020 NCAA Men's and Women's National Co-Champions!!!! ;D
(Stole it from Coach K and Dave on Hoopsville).
Dave -- I was almost there! Haha. After class I ran into some athletic department folks heading home and they told me where the team was eating. I almost headed there but decided they just needed to be to themselves! Nice show, by the way. A difficult one for sure. You managed it with great empathy and understanding. Nicely done!
Thank you ... I appreciate it. I honestly don't even remember many parts of the show. The last week has been a serious blur. I have worked in sports and news my entire career ... I thought nothing was more surreal than post 9/11 and some other moments. This week ... on a different level.
Tomorrow's game between Elmhurst and Pomona-Pitzer would have been, hands down, the biggest game ever played at Elmhurst's wonderfully outdated RA Faganel Hall. Longtime Elmhurst fans have waited decades for a game of this magnitude, and now the game will exist only in the program's lore. I'm sure some other schools and fanbases were in the same situation.
My Division II alma mater was getting on the bus to head to Indiana for the first round.
At least we got one weekend of basketball.
If only the NCAA had announced the cancellation to happen after this weekend, we would have had the most extraordinary weekend of basketball. 8 championship games. As much as I agree with social distancing as a public policy, I could get on board with Ryan Scott on this as a no-brainer.
I am going to blame Fred Hoiberg for showing up to the game on Wednesday with the flu and the video of him looking like he was on his death bed (and his panicked assistant reaching down for the hand sanitizer).
Quote from: WUPHF on March 13, 2020, 04:48:34 PM
My Division II alma mater was getting on the bus to head to Indiana for the first round.
At least we got one weekend of basketball.
If only the NCAA had announced the cancellation to happen after this weekend, we would have had the most extraordinary weekend of basketball. 8 championship games. As much as I agree with social distancing as a public policy, I could get on board with Ryan Scott on this as a no-brainer.
I am going to blame Fred Hoiberg for showing up to the game on Wednesday with the flu and the video of him looking like he was on his death bed (and his panicked assistant reaching down for the hand sanitizer).
Fred was diagnosed before the game and cleared. Probably on the school or the broadcasters for not checking and making that clear to the public.
I had heard that quarantined the entire Nebraska basketball team in the locker room, so I assumed it was an unknown. Very interesting.
The breaking point was clearly Rudy Golbert.
Quote from: WUPHF on March 13, 2020, 05:51:05 PM
I had heard that quarantined the entire Nebraska basketball team in the locker room, so I assumed it was an unknown. Very interesting.
Apparently arena staff didn't know either.
Quote from: CNU85 on March 13, 2020, 08:23:28 AM
Congrats to CNU 2020 NCAA Men's and Women's National Co-Champions!!!! ;D
(Stole it from Coach K and Dave on Hoopsville).
Dave -- I was almost there! Haha. After class I ran into some athletic department folks heading home and they told me where the team was eating. I almost headed there but decided they just needed to be to themselves! Nice show, by the way. A difficult one for sure. You managed it with great empathy and understanding. Nicely done!
Funny, Hobart team members have been smoking National Co-Championship cigars......at least the Hobart team helped the local Virginia economy having checked into the hotel on Wednesday night ......
Quote from: Bartman on March 14, 2020, 11:39:01 AM
Quote from: CNU85 on March 13, 2020, 08:23:28 AM
Congrats to CNU 2020 NCAA Men's and Women's National Co-Champions!!!! ;D
(Stole it from Coach K and Dave on Hoopsville).
Dave -- I was almost there! Haha. After class I ran into some athletic department folks heading home and they told me where the team was eating. I almost headed there but decided they just needed to be to themselves! Nice show, by the way. A difficult one for sure. You managed it with great empathy and understanding. Nicely done!
Funny, Hobart team members have been smoking National Co-Championship cigars......at least the Hobart team helped the local Virginia economy having checked into the hotel on Wednesday night ......
:D :D :D
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While the season came to an abrupt end, there are still student-athletes, coaches, and programs to recognize for what they accomplished this season.
On a special edition of Hoopsville, we not only look at the final Top 25 polls of the season, but we also take a look at the All-Region awards.
Plus, the NABC All Star Rosters are announced, exclusively, here tonight. We then will talk to long time NABC Board of Directors member Pat Cunningham about the team and the announcement he is retiring as Trinity (Texas) men's basketball coach.
And we have a round-table discussion of all things Division III basketball. Pat Coleman, Gordon Mann, Ryan Scott, and Bob Quillman saddle up to their computers and join us for a spirited chat and maybe even answer your questions.
Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Pat Cunningham, NABC Board of Directors & Trinity (Texas) men's coach
- Pat Coleman, D3hoops.com Editor-in-Chief
- Gordon Mann, D3hoops.com Senior Editor
- Ryan Scott, D3hoops.com National Columnist
- Bob Quillman, IWUHoops.com
Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch
Tuesday night's show LIVE starting at 7:00 p.m. ET in the following ways:
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All men's coaches appear in the NABC Coach's Corner. And all guests are featured on the BlueFrame Technology Hoopsville Hotline.
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Well, a month ago I was planning on picking up my kid today at school and heading to Fort Wayne for the Elite 8 and semifinals this weekend. That I'm not currently doing that depresses me. :'(
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 19, 2020, 04:55:29 PM
Well, a month ago I was planning on picking up my kid today at school and heading to Fort Wayne for the Elite 8 and semifinals this weekend. That I'm not currently doing that depresses me. :'(
Yup. Here in Connecticut was high school championship weekend. Was gonna be leaving at 8:30 AM, head up to the Mohegan Sun Casino for about 11 hours of basketball. Get home by midnight if I was lucky, and do the same thing again on Sunday. Oh well :'(
They play high school basketball at a casino?
When my friend was stationed in the Navy up there, he frequented Mohegan Sun Casino...for poker, not high school basketball.
Quote from: Greek Tragedy on March 20, 2020, 07:56:01 PM
They play high school basketball at a casino?
When my friend was stationed in the Navy up there, he frequented Mohegan Sun Casino...for poker, not high school basketball.
Yup, been playing there for about 15 years or so (a little less I think it went there in 07 or 08). Got a nice arena, that's where the WNBA team the Sun play. Works out for everyone:
Good for the student athletes: Gets them their championship game in a professional arena
Good for the parents: Can play the slots before and after their kids play.
Good for the CIAC (the Connecticut sports governing body): Gets more folks through the turnstiles than other sites (Central Connecticut State & University of Hartford) did, and more folks = more money.
Good for the casino as a whole: Gets all these extra people frequenting all the bars, restaurants and other shops as well as the slots & poker tables, etc, so that's more money going into their pocket.