Quote from: Ron Boerger on February 27, 2026, 09:32:47 AMThe only place they are "antagonistic" is football.  The two conferences play each other freely in basically all other sports.

The SCAC has pitched itself as a more academic conference - certainly Colorado College, which only accepts 20% of applicants, is one that is - but the distinction is not what it once was, first with the SAA schools splitting off 13 years ago and then Southwestern and Trinity leaving last fall.  McMurry was on the more exclusive side (58% acceptance rate), Schreiner the less (88%) so not much changes with their departure to the ASC.  Other schools in the SCAC range all the way from 47% (Austin) to 95% (TLU).  The ASC "core 4" accept from 60-68% (ETBU, HPU) to 95-97% (UMHB, HSU) of applicants.

Schools choose conferences for any number of reasons.  When the SCAC was in danger of disbanding it made a pitch that obviously appealed to the schools that left the ASC.  When the ASC was in danger of losing its auto bids it made a financial pitch that appealed to Schreiner and McMurry.  What will be interesting is what happens with the five schools left playing football in the SCAC now that their path to an autobid is, for the foreseeable future, a fantasy.  None of the five could compete for one in the ASC anyway (absent structural and expensive program changes) so maybe they'll just be happy to play each other and hope to pull what TLU did a couple of seasons ago.  And I've heard that Gallaudet, of all schools, will be participating in the SCAC season-ending tournament to allow all five schools that are left to have that tenth game.   

It would not surprise me to see more movement by non-football playing schools from the SCAC back to the ASC now that the conference's future seems secure. 

Could there be a world where we all combine in a similar way, the MIAC did for a few years where some teams don't have to play the upper tier? With Gallaudet that would be 12 teams, split us up 6 to a side with a few crossovers and we almost all have a full schedule already.

Quote from: The Third Division on February 14, 2026, 01:15:30 PMUMHB's two year scheduling agreement with Keystone screams desperation. It is not a good look for the program.

We are desperate, last year we were told loudly and repeatedly to find D3 games. Last year every member of the ASC played at least one non countable game to get 10 games and this year we need MORE non conference games.

I've always said I'd take whatever the ASC and UMHB offered since it didn't cost anything. The feeds are generally okay — nothing special, but fine for free. If I'm going to be paying for it now (which I will), I'll expect more, and  from everything we have heard from other schools/conferences I won't get more.

With that said, yes, please to on-demand; that would make it worth it right there, especially if we could go back in time and see some of the bigger games of the past.

Quote from: tigerguy on December 02, 2025, 03:03:11 PM

Quote from: Ralph Turner on December 01, 2025, 03:36:18 PMI looked up Trinity's games against the ASC in post-season play.
2025 Update

Year........	Team......	Score....	W/L....
1999	HSU	40-33	Win
2000	at HSU	30-33	Loss
2001	UMHB	30-6	Win
2002	UMHB	48-38	Win
2003	at ETBU	41-42	Loss
2004	UMHB	13-32	Loss
2005	UMHB	6-35	Loss
2007	at UMHB	23-52	Loss
2011	McM	16-25	Loss
2021	at UMHB	3-13	Loss
2022	HSU	14-7	Win
2022	UMHB	17-24	Loss
2023	HSU	20-6	Win
2024	UMHB	22-29	Loss
2025	HSU	(27+pick six 7 = 34)-24	Win

How many other games were "closer than the final score"?

2021: Trinity's 13-3 loss to UMHB in first round. For 58 minutes Trinity held the national champs and #3 offense in the country to only two field goals (I think they missed a third). Down 6-3 with 2:13 left, Trinity held UMHB to what would have been an attempted field goal on 4th and 6 from Trinity's 22, which would have given Trinity one last drive to try and tie. Trinity's player jumped offsides attempting to block the field goal, making it 4th and 1, so UMHB went for it and scored on the ensuing play. I'm pretty sure Urban instructed them to let him score so they could get the ball back, but it made the final score look less close than the game was played. The entire game was a defense masterpiece by both squads.

That is probably the saltiest I have ever been when it comes to the unfair Texas-teams playoff matchups. Trinity's defense was probably the best in the program's history and #2 overall in D3 that year. Their offense was also very good, but it was Tucker Horn's first year as a starter and they couldn't get anything going against a great UMHB front.

After Trinity, UMHB steamrolled through the playoffs and put up 42 against #13 defense BSC, 49 against #12 defense Linfield, 24 against #22 defense UW-Whitewater, and 57 against Defending Champ North Central in the national championship. I know most people know all of this since the game was fairly recent, but I thank you for bringing up this painful topic to allow me to vent some more.

The Texas Sub Bracket is not fun but what makes it worst is it is usually followed by the Island School/ best of the West Region bracket.

Lets say Trinity beat UMHB that year, their prize, getting to play Birmingham Southern again. After that it was going to be Linfield or St. Johns who were the #1 and #3 in Region 6 followed by UWW the #2, all for the right to play the reigning national champion.

Quote from: Ralph Turner on December 01, 2025, 03:29:48 PMIf one could turn the TUTx-HSU game into a movie, it would be dramatic slugfest, each team countering the other's blows. HSU would be seen rising up from the adversity and driving to place the killing blow in the last minute of the movie. TUTx responds in that moment and the tipped pass on 4th & 5 turns into the pick-six. This would be the cinematic dynamic blow, with blood squirting all over the face of the screen, and obliterating HSU's chance for a dramatic ending!  Okay, bring on the CGI crew now and we will submit it for an ESPY. (Wouldn't that be TUTx's 2nd ESPY?)

Sadly for HSU fans this is a horror movie they have seen before

Quote from: Etchglow on November 25, 2025, 09:33:13 AM

Quote from: crufootball on November 25, 2025, 08:34:11 AM

Quote from: D3Navy on November 24, 2025, 07:35:54 PM

Quote from: CruFrenzy on November 24, 2025, 12:59:27 PM

Quote from: Etchglow on November 23, 2025, 09:39:40 PMSince I was bored, I went and looked at the folks who have announced they were transferring from UMHB.  Only 9 of the 29 have offers.  7 of the offers are D3, 3 are NAIA, 2 are FCS, and 1 is for a community college.

Yup. Some of the guys I'm not mad at. The JV guys that saw the writing on the wall and just want to play somewhere, no problem. Then you have a guy like D Morris who likely lands on a good FCS or a low end FBS roster, I still don't like it but it's somewhat understandable. JJ Davis probably lands on a mid to low end FCS... I kind of get it but still think it's a mistake. Then you have guys like Battle III that had no business transferring out. Could have stayed and been a damn good corner on a really good defense but instead he jumped on the portal wagon after D Mo and JJ did and he's got no offers. Not saying he's not good enough to get offers but he doesn't have the same body of work yet as Morris or Davis did.. reminds me a lot of Dorien Hill playing 4 games last year in the playoffs and hitting the portal. He showed a ton of promise and might've been our best LB if he had returned this season but instead he hit the portal and got East Central and Trinity and went to Trinity.. that's basically Battle this year... maybe he will come back.

On the positive side of things it looks like we've kept everyone else so far. If that's all we lose we return a way more cohesive group than we have in a few years and will just need to find a few secondary guys to step up.

You got BJ Stewart, we got Dorien Hill.  Both fine athletes who found better fits.

Well I can't speak for everyone but I hope Dorien has a great game this weekend. 

Event if Dorien wasn't down there, I'd be rooting for Trinity this weekend

But I do think Dorien and his defensive friends are the key for a Trinity victory. I don't think they can win a high scoring game but I think a low scoring game plays more to Trinity.

Quote from: D3Navy on November 24, 2025, 07:35:54 PM

Quote from: CruFrenzy on November 24, 2025, 12:59:27 PM

Quote from: Etchglow on November 23, 2025, 09:39:40 PMSince I was bored, I went and looked at the folks who have announced they were transferring from UMHB.  Only 9 of the 29 have offers.  7 of the offers are D3, 3 are NAIA, 2 are FCS, and 1 is for a community college.

Yup. Some of the guys I'm not mad at. The JV guys that saw the writing on the wall and just want to play somewhere, no problem. Then you have a guy like D Morris who likely lands on a good FCS or a low end FBS roster, I still don't like it but it's somewhat understandable. JJ Davis probably lands on a mid to low end FCS... I kind of get it but still think it's a mistake. Then you have guys like Battle III that had no business transferring out. Could have stayed and been a damn good corner on a really good defense but instead he jumped on the portal wagon after D Mo and JJ did and he's got no offers. Not saying he's not good enough to get offers but he doesn't have the same body of work yet as Morris or Davis did.. reminds me a lot of Dorien Hill playing 4 games last year in the playoffs and hitting the portal. He showed a ton of promise and might've been our best LB if he had returned this season but instead he hit the portal and got East Central and Trinity and went to Trinity.. that's basically Battle this year... maybe he will come back.

On the positive side of things it looks like we've kept everyone else so far. If that's all we lose we return a way more cohesive group than we have in a few years and will just need to find a few secondary guys to step up.

You got BJ Stewart, we got Dorien Hill.  Both fine athletes who found better fits.

Well I can't speak for everyone but I hope Dorien has a great game this weekend. 

Quote from: Etchglow on November 22, 2025, 07:53:30 PM

Quote from: Mavchamp on November 22, 2025, 04:09:59 PMChristmas wish list.....

ASC recruits two-three schools to join the conference in the off-season

Wayland Baptist
Louisiana Christian
Sul Ross State
Nelson University
Centenary

I don't think Louisiana Christian will come back.  They just won 1/3 of the conference championship over in the sooner athletic conference. 

Holy cow, just looked at Sul Ross's football record... 0-11, only two close games, 3 point loss to a 2-9 team and a 6 point loss to a 3-8 team.  Outside of those two losses, average margin of victory was 58 2/3 points...  48.8 points total.  Outscored 129 to 666 :O...

What did LC win besides football? No matter what, yeah I can't see them coming back considering they did share the title in the SAC but still got crushed by HSU.

As for Sul Ross, I would assume playing at UTRGV and at SFA paid for the rest of the season so while it was a hard season, it is the life of a low tier D2 team.

Quote from: ziggy on November 17, 2025, 11:54:58 AM

Quote from: crufootball on November 16, 2025, 10:46:59 PM

Quote from: Ralph Turner on November 16, 2025, 07:55:59 PMI would like to see an NPI iteration for UMHB with wins over a 5-5 McMurry, a 6-4 TLU and a 2-7 Austin College, giving UMHB an 8-2 record.

I asked Logan Hansen a similar question and he said if UMHB had played teams with a final NPI of greater then 40 (and won) we would have been over the bubble. Since McMurry and TLU are 52+ but Austin is 37 then I assume we would be dancing right now.

Dial settings that lean more into strength of schedule would have also gotten UMHB in: https://d3datacast.com/2025/11/17/how-does-changing-the-dials-change-the-2025-d3-football-playoff-field/

Yes it seems like every other setting gets us in  Wasn't that true last year as well when you experimented with our dial settings?

Quote from: Ralph Turner on November 16, 2025, 07:55:59 PMI would like to see an NPI iteration for UMHB with wins over a 5-5 McMurry, a 6-4 TLU and a 2-7 Austin College, giving UMHB an 8-2 record.

I asked Logan Hansen a similar question and he said if UMHB had played teams with a final NPI of greater then 40 (and won) we would have been over the bubble. Since McMurry and TLU are 52+ but Austin is 37 then I assume we would be dancing right now.

Quote from: Ralph Turner on November 13, 2025, 11:04:27 AMFor the sake of the athletes, I am happy for the players at Lyon or AC or Centenary getting the chance to play opponents of comparable skill level. That is not a knock, because D3 athletics is for the development of the young adult. Competing for a conference championship is the real benefit.

I am saddened that McMurry is having to play so many games on Sunday, especially in basketball, in the SCAC. Returning to the ASC, where Sunday contests are uncommon, is one thing I like about the move.

I see your point, but the players at AC and Centenary can't be thrilled about ending up playing each other three times — plus Westgate Christian. And the issue is only going to get worse next year when McMurry is gone and they no longer have the opponent they expected in Schreiner University.

If the goal is to compete for a conference championship, build a more manageable schedule, and still have a realistic shot at the playoffs, they could just revisit what the SCAC did from 2013–2015. During that stretch, everyone played each other once and filled the rest of the schedule primarily with ASC teams. TLU not only won 3 conference championships under that model, but also made the playoffs and nearly beat UMHB in what turned into a 24-hour football game.

Quote from: UMHB03 on November 13, 2025, 08:11:21 AM

Quote from: crufootball on November 12, 2025, 09:30:29 PMI have to keep believing that sanity will prevail and the ASC and SCAC will come up with something that means all of them will be able to bus to each other and only need 1 or 2 more games after that. I mean really if you combine all of us that is 10 teams, meaning 9 guaranteed games and you only have to find 1 other game.

Its either that or all of us end up with schedules that don't make sense.

UMHB - 2 NAIA school (flight last year), 1 D2 team (flight) and UWW (flight last year)
HSU - 2 NAIA schools, and Chapman (flight)
HPU - 1 NAIA school and Pacific (assume flight next year)
ETBU - 1 NAIA school

Lyon - 1 NAIA school and playing Hendrix twice due to championship weekend
Hendrix - All D3 but playing Lyon twice
Austin - Playing Centenary 3 times and Westgate Christian
Centenary -  Playing Austin 3 times and Westgate Christian
TLU - All D3 but playing McMurry 2 times
McMurry - All D3 but playing TLU 2 times and either flew to Huntingdon or had a very long bus ride

Next year both of us will need more games if neither are going to play round robin, STOP THE MADNESS!

I'd love to see the ASC go back to 10 teams, but I don't see it. I don't think the SCAC schools mind playing the same opponents 2-3 times or scheduling Westgate Christian if it means not getting their butts kicked by UMHB and HSU every year or associating with the dastardly Baptist Four.

Assuming UMHB misses the playoffs, which sadly looks to be likely, then Harmon needs to be on the phone Monday trying to get some D3 opponents scheduled for 2026. Continuing with the kind of scheduling we've had the last 2 years is not a recipe for success.

You might be correct but unless Harmon is not telling the truth he does call every D3 school and is turned down. This quote  from him was in the paper this week.

"We just want a Division III opponent to have a home-and-home series. We'll go to their place first and they still turn it down, even with us handling their flight and their buses."

Quote from: Ralph Turner on November 13, 2025, 12:56:34 AMDoes Schreiner come on board next year in the ASC?

Yes, the should play the full ASC schedule next year.

Quote from: Ralph Turner on November 12, 2025, 10:08:09 PMMcMurry played at Huntingdon as the 10th game in 2007, so that is an occasional non-conference opponent.

And I am all for it, I would love a setup with 1 or 2 non conference games so that schools could pick what type of experience they want. But none of the schedules this year for ASC or SCAC teams are optimal for any D3 athlete, I am sure I don't know the whole story and am a biased UMHB/ASC fan but again STOP THE MADNESS!

I have to keep believing that sanity will prevail and the ASC and SCAC will come up with something that means all of them will be able to bus to each other and only need 1 or 2 more games after that. I mean really if you combine all of us that is 10 teams, meaning 9 guaranteed games and you only have to find 1 other game.

Its either that or all of us end up with schedules that don't make sense.

UMHB - 2 NAIA school (flight last year), 1 D2 team (flight) and UWW (flight last year)
HSU - 2 NAIA schools, and Chapman (flight)
HPU - 1 NAIA school and Pacific (assume flight next year)
ETBU - 1 NAIA school

Lyon - 1 NAIA school and playing Hendrix twice due to championship weekend
Hendrix - All D3 but playing Lyon twice
Austin - Playing Centenary 3 times and Westgate Christian
Centenary -  Playing Austin 3 times and Westgate Christian
TLU - All D3 but playing McMurry 2 times
McMurry - All D3 but playing TLU 2 times and either flew to Huntingdon or had a very long bus ride

Next year both of us will need more games if neither are going to play round robin, STOP THE MADNESS!