Quote from: AndrewB on June 10, 2026, 07:24:03 PMMy question to you then is:
1) Would you feel the same way for a coach?

No, I would not, because coaches don't take classes, and don't have to graduate, and don't have academic progress to make. Coaches can change teams all they want, i do NOT care - they are paid to be what they are. D3 student athletes are students, first and foremost, and I want to think that they think about that when they enroll. There could be a lot of reasons why someone decides to transfer, but it is my sincerest hope that the only reason they might do it is because they've graduated and are looking for a program their old school doesn't support.

The part that irked me more than anything is that the two schools are in the same conference- the NCAC. Things will always be unequal, that's life in D3, I'll never pretend otherwise. But your conference should be full of the most similar institutions you can get. And while I have no numbers to back it up, this just feels new, it feels like something that wasn't happening before, and maybe that's the transfer portal, or maybe this was really happening all the time, but it just doesn't feel like the NCAC I've known before.

Quote from: Patrick Coleman on June 10, 2026, 04:05:46 PMIt is not "poaching," or "tampering," or in any way improper for a school to contact someone who is in the portal.

To be clear, because I do respect the JCU program, I never bandied about the term "tampering". I certainly don't think they did anything illegal or against the rules. And I will rescind my use of "poaching" to be replaced with the term "wealth transfer" or "trickle up economics".

Quote from: Patrick Coleman on June 10, 2026, 02:08:46 PMSomeone who is in the portal has released from their previous school. They're a free agent.

Unrelated, but isn't this not really a thing in D3? They no longer guarantee you a roster spot, nor will they honor your athletic scholarship, but those aren't in play in D3 anyway, so, you COULD return without any impact assuming they wanted you back.

Quote from: Patrick Coleman on June 10, 2026, 11:05:36 AMCurious as to why you want to assign the term "poach" to this.

Yes, he was in the portal, yes, he was looking to transfer, but in the same way every school can reach out, they also have the option not to reach out. As I said, most of the schools within the NCAC are very similar in makeup, and so hypothetically, someone could just decide to swap around schools until they found the right place to play and that seems against the spirit of being a teammate, if not against the rules.

I can't say why he's transferring, but it doesn't seem to be academically related, as Dennison has economics same as JCU does. It seems almost entirely football based, and I think that's what bugs me. I get that athletics are a part of many students lives, but I want to think that you do your diligence and check out all your options, and especially if you're paying for it, find the school that is the right fit for you the first time. It wasn't like he wasn't playing, he was, so it wasn't a looking for playing time situation.

It's super possible I'm just off base, but I don't love seeing what seem to be solely athletically motivated decisions in D3, because as a division, I think we've shown that's not really what it's about. I think of it as "poaching" because he's going up the win/loss ladder, a good team getting better and also making a conference rival worse, there isn't a term for that, but it feels like "poaching".

So, sure, let's not call it "poaching", but at the same time, I would love to see schools in the same conference try not to make approaching players in the portal the norm, at least before they've graduated. We know that the transfer portal is as much about seeing what kind of offers you can get as it is about actually being unhappy where you are.

It just rubs me the wrong way, and potentially I'm the only one, but it just doesn't feel right. Possibly I'm just old fashioned in that I think it's weird to transfer to a conference rival. The article mentions wanting to work in football, but also why not go to JCU to begin with? I can't really say.

Maybe it's a me problem but I don't like it.

https://www.news-herald.com/2026/06/09/john-carroll-to-add-tyler-green-a-record-setting-qb-from-denison/ 

Does anyone else hate this as much as I do? I mean, I get this is how it works now, and I'm not mad at him or JCU. But to me an inter-conference transfer in D3, and maybe especially in the NCAC just feels - gross.

I don't know what I was expecting. Teams want to win, but I think maybe I was just hoping that the schools in the NCAC would try to prioritize helping athletes graduate as efficiently as possible and not poach student athletes. If someone had said that he was transferring OUT of conference I wouldn't bat an eye-lash, but in conference is just no bueno. It just feels like something you read about at the D1 level, and not where no one is "getting paid".

I wish both him and his new school success (but not too much obviously, a few nice 3rd places finishes would be about perfect) but also I just don't like anything about it. I still also struggle with the fact that the NCAC is a far less level playing field than it was in recent years, with both Wash U and JCU having hearty graduate schools (yes, Wittenberg has one, but they need all the help they can get with enrollment it seems) - and there being no prohibition on redshirts coming in from other divisions, and the whole 5 years thing the government seems to be proposing.

Also, FWIW, I would feel this way about any inter-conference transfer - hell if Wabash suddenly started poaching players I wouldn't like it either, and I would be issuing some strongly worded emails and making some phone calls. The fact that it's JCU bugs me, I think just because they least fit the profile of other NCAC schools, and also because they're our newest full time member. The fact is, the teams inside of the NCAC are far more similar than they are different and it feels like poaching COULD be a huge thing but it never has been, and now it's a thing (I feel a bit like Mugatu there).

Anyway, I'm wondering if I'm totally off base with the yuck of this, or others are feeling similar.

Quote from: art76 on June 09, 2026, 06:55:32 PMI still get peeved whenever Johnny Bench's name gets mentioned concerning his not being in the Baseball Hall of Fame in Cooperstown

I'm 99% sure you meant Pete Rose, but I'm with you all the way. Athletes gambling on the sport they participate in is just a big no-no. It's a no-brainer, which is what I also have to say about the judge that made that ruling.

Quote from: art76 on June 09, 2026, 09:23:06 AMSo, what's the consensus on the "Brendan Sorsby ruling". Is this as straight forward as it seems? What's the scuttlebutt?

If the "straight forward" part is "it's completely crazy and makes 0 sense" then yes, I'm on the train. He should 100% not be allowed to take the field.

The NCAA has a lot of rules, but the one rule that it just straight up will not let you break is gambling, it's like the absolute 1 thing you can't do, and dude did it - a lot. And while some kind of sickness could be what compelled him to do it over and over, he did something wrong, and he has to live with the consequences of that action - which should be not to play.

I hope no one chooses to play Texas Tech all season. If they're going to be that selfish, they deserve not to have any games. Try winning a natty without winning a single game on the field.

It's just a bonkers ruling, and frankly a bonkers verdict by a judge, but that's the way it is in this era of college sports.   

Quote from: BDB on June 07, 2026, 02:31:07 PMLooks like you just did.

I suppose Wis Poly would be easier.

Like California Polytechnic State University is Cal Poly.

I did no such thing. I did copy and paste from the website and then copy and paste from the blurb, but I do think they're going to have to come up with something shorter. Wis Poly or Wis Tech both make a lot of sense to me. In absence of coming up with a good shorthand, I feel like non-official stuff is just going to keep calling them Stout.

Quote from: BDB on June 07, 2026, 07:01:40 AMIt's officially UW-Stout Polytechnic now.

From the website:

Now, as UW-Stout Polytechnic, the university requests that members of the media and other outside organizations use University of Wisconsin-Stout Polytechnic or UW-Stout Polytechnic rather than UW-Stout or Stout.

Good luck with that. They'll always be Stout - ain't nobody got time to type or say UW-Stout Polytechnic.

To be clear, everyone at DPU and anyone visiting should be very excited to play in a lovely new stadium. Definitely an upgrade over the existing Blackstock.

I'd argue that across the board, the NCAC has some of the best facilities per capita, and this will definitely up the ante. I know the NESCAC throws a ton of resources at their athletics and their facilities reflect that. The liberty league has some nice stadiums too. I really enjoy watching Union home games as they have an interesting setup (at least across the field). All of the WIAC stadiums I've been to are quite large, but, imo, nice but not competing for best facilities.   

My point wasn't to demean Depauw's setup, just to say that UMHB threw a TON of money at their stadium, and as a consequence, it's just above and beyond what everyone else has. Thankfully, in the NCAC we ALSO remember to throw $$ at academics too.  So we can always celebrate that.

Quote from: DePauwalum05 on April 20, 2026, 04:06:09 PMBest football stadium in D3?

A nice stadium, maybe even top 10 - sure. But let's be honest, probably nothing will touch UMHB crusader stadium and for good reason. I don't think it's even close, and I'm not just saying that as a Wally, I'm just saying that as someone with eyes.

https://youtu.be/3Mnlec3ouOA

Quote from: Ralph Turner on April 03, 2026, 12:53:11 PMit said it could do it, but then said I'd have to wait two hours to ask again.

I think you may have asked a magic 8-ball on accident.  Just give it a shake until it says yes.

Quote from: OzJohnnie on April 01, 2026, 06:02:08 PMWell, make your choice: championship competitive or nostalgia lane.  Can't have both.

This is a legit question, not just being snarky, but SJU has only a single semi-final appearance (where they lost to UWW who was consequently boat-raced in the finals) and no finals appearances since that 2003 championship. Would it not be fair to say that decision is already made? A quarter century with a single semi-finals appearance would put SJU in the 30 or so that want to be nationally competitive and not the upper crust of "chasing championships". Keeping in mind I'm an outsider to the program and just peeking in every now and again on this board - SJU and the base could very well consider that they've just been incredibly close these last 23 years.

But since SJU last won a national championship, they've had the 3rd most national semi-final appearances...in the MIAC - behind Bethel and the now departed Tommies. Since SJU last played in a Stagg Bowl; Linfield, Cortland and UWRF have all won a natty, UMHB and NCC have won 3 each, and UWW and UMU have each won 6.

Admittedly, between actual Stagg bowl wins, given the limited sample size, SJU wins a D3 championship about every 27 years, so they're due around 2030, but does that count as being championship competitive?

FWIW, I'm serious about not being snarky. Wabash's glory day was a tough Stagg loss in 1977. I'd love for us to be back to being one of those 30 or so programs winning a playoff game or two each year. But I'm also pretty realistic about the fact that we're nowhere close to that upper tier at the moment.

Quote from: BDB on March 31, 2026, 06:50:52 AMThey probably feel like those guys worked their butts off to be that good and they are happy to have them on their team.

Here is my two cents. Call me crazy, but at the D3 level, I think of sports as an ancillary to the actual college/university and the education you get, it's definitely a part of the experience, but it shouldn't be the first thing you think of when you think of a school.

It might be blasphemous, but as both a Wabash College graduate and a UWSP alumnus, I would rather see my teams suck, and keep high character, hard-working dudes that are putting in the time and effort in both the classroom and the playing fields - than to get a bunch of D1 transfers that are essentially giving up at a higher level (minus grad transfers, but if you don't have a graduate program, those won't be the people you're getting anyway).

What says those d1 guys shouldn't be happy to be playing with all of the guys at the D1 level who are getting more NIL money, and seeing the playing field when they're not? After all they should probably be thinking "those guys worked their butts off to be that good and I'm happy to have them on the team". Why would you want those guys on your team, they basically said, "nah bro", on trying to put in the hard work and seeing if you get that playing time via injury, or improvement or whatever, and are now dropping divisions to find what wasn't there. That's one of my several nits to pick with modern college athletics - it just feels easier to give up for the wrong reasons.

Life isn't fair, and football only has 22 players on the field at a time, so there are always going to be dudes who don't see the field, but I'll take character over all else any day. Especially, as it relates to COLLEGE athletes, where what I hope would take first priority are the skills you'll take into the world after you're done. At a time when enrollments in D3 are going to take a hit first, losing guys to the transfer portal to replace them with D1 dudes who didn't give your school a sniff until they couldn't hack it, seems like a cop out and a great way to lose the kind of student athletes you'd want.

Run D1 programs like a business, I accept that. But for me, D3 programs net little to no money anyway, so running them like businesses is just a chance to make what was cool, worse.

Quote from: Jake Feldman on March 05, 2026, 11:12:04 PMFor the D3 split, I'd do it by the average athletic budget in each league.

The real question is why? Is it someone at the NCAA's job to dictate that things are an even playing field? If you go D3, you go knowing that it's a REALLY large tent, somewhere around 430 schools if I remember correctly. If you want to see teams competing for national championships, or even playoff wins, you're gonna need WAY more than 2 divisions.

The thing is, and I've said this before, the one thing you can always control is your conference. That's always going to be your best bet to partner with like minded institutions - academically, geographically, size, money, etc. If you choose to let a school that's 10 times your size, or has a 100 times your budget in, or is much more or less academically selective, you've made that bed and you lie in it. Win your conference, that's as even as you're going to get.

It's insane to try to balance competition in a division which doesn't have any checks and balances that aren't entirely self-imposed (NESCAC and WIAC roster limits are about the only thing I can think of). If you follow this particular thread closely you know that many, maybe even most, of the schools in d3 need all the help getting students they can. Separating divisions to indicate which sports are "major ones" seems like a good way to alienate anyone interested in sports that aren't that.

I'm not saying it's not an interesting or even noble pursuit, but it's also fruitless because D3 does 0 to police the field and make things equal, and if you start trying to do that, you'll just end up alienating someone, and more or less just go back to the idea of "win your conference".