Quote from: Gregory Sager on November 12, 2025, 01:33:57 PM

Quote from: GoIrish7 on November 12, 2025, 10:52:04 AMBudgets, scheduling issues with the rest of the country for NonCon games, Inability to add in other sports.... and a little bit of competition is the story I have gotten on their removal.

Budgets - Added overnight trip for majority of the conference with lengthy travel to get there. Busses, hotels, team meals add up.

Scheduling issues - Seems to be a non issue with the league deciding to allow CUW to join. I just know it was easier to have 3 open weekends to find 2 games than 2 open weekends to find 1. By having 9 CCIW games, the CCIW "Bye week" has become an absolute waste. Many members having a week 1 bye and playing 10 straight, and others having a bye week following non con game 1. Again - this doesn't seem to have as much say into showing WashU the door but it was something referenced in the convo's to show the door.

Football only - Pretty simple here. They only joined for football and it made scheduling for other sports a little more difficult. But again other sports did not want them to join because of the travel. And WashU other sports not wanting to leave UAA.

Competition - The big dogs didn't mind it. But without coming out and saying it, it can be implied that the bottom of the conference would rather go play 2 winnable games early in the season vs a noncon + WashU.... Coaches lives and job depends on many things, but winning is definitely a main factor.

These were the issues I heard discussed on why decision was made. I am sure there were others as well.

Nope. Your source speculated incorrectly.

Quote from: Jbothe on November 12, 2025, 11:06:22 AMMy wife and I are parents of a WashU athlete, not a football player.

My perception is that the CCIW wanted a full member added to the conference that offered all major sports and fits the overall academic profile of the CCIW.

Nope. That's not the reason behind Wash U's dismissal, either. CCIW commish Mo Harty's press release comment sort of hints in that direction with the bit about the league keeping an interest in adding a possible tenth full member somewhere down the road, but that was strictly a non sequitur included in the press release in order to deflect from matters that the league would like to avoid disclosing.

Quote from: robertgoulet on November 12, 2025, 11:18:39 AM

Quote from: Jbothe on November 12, 2025, 11:06:22 AMMy perception is that the CCIW wanted a full member added to the conference that offered all major sports and fits the overall academic profile of the CCIW. 

Which is funny because when this was initially announced, some of us (not going to point fingers at myself because that would be gloating) said "they obviously want a full member and WU wasn't willing to do it, I bet we see a full member announced pretty quickly" and the old heads were adamant there were no plans for CCIW to add another full member in their place.

So maybe the ITK don't really know and my previous post can get trashed...or maybe for whatever reason they thought the jeopardy was too high to risk a D3 message board finding out that there were talks ongoing for some reason?

Look, this isn't a matter of me playing "I've Got a Secret". Let Mark A. and Bob Q. be the scoopmeisters. I don't care. I'm simply saying that I know the real reason, and I got it straight from someone who actually participated in the league's discussion of the matter. The fact is that, no, this has nothing to do with Wash U not wanting to be a full member, or the CCIW already being aware of Wash U's firm commitment to the UAA and not even bothering to ask, or Wash U's being (pretty obviously) an anomalous fit for the CCIW in terms of institutional profile, or anything like that.

Furthermore, there were no fixed plans to add a tenth full member. As the press release more or less said, the league was simply open to discussing the matter with any school that was interested in exploring CCIW full membership. That's simply prudent policy, given what's going on right now in D3 and in the larger world of American higher education. Being open to discussion with interested parties, and having an actual plan in place to put out the welcome mat and solicit a tenth full member, are totally different things.

Again, the timeline is all wrong as far as Wash U's departure being tied to CUW joining as the tenth full member is concerned. The announcement of Wash U's dismissal from the league as an associate member for football came in September 2024, and from everything I've been able to gather, the discussions with CUW began no earlier than last spring and possibly even as late as early summer.

All I'll say is this: There was no major scandal involved as far as Wash U and the CCIW are concerned, and there's nothing there that warrants further investigation at all. So let's move on.

From my seat.... This is the coaching standpoint. I have no source other than myself lol. "What are the coaches within the league saying about WashU and their long term standing playing football in the CCIW?"

Enter above.

Go Bluejays! Go get Millikin this weekend!

Other notes from last 3 weeks in the world of Elmhurst games(NCC, Wheaton, Carroll).

Thomas Skokna is as fun of in the league as I have seen in some time. Reminds me of Mark Hiben from Wheaton with his ball skills. Seems like he comes down with the ball on an 80% clip on 50/50 balls. Mix in some Devin Hester on special teams. Dude is a stud.

Congrats on a great Career to Reed Breckheimer from Carroll. Love watching him play and he has had a hell of a career vs Elmhurst. Just shy of 400 all purpose yards and 6 TD's from a listed TE.

I think Wheaton can make some noise in the playoffs. Their DL is stout and the defense seems like they have matured from last year. In their two losses, they struggled to get the QB off rhythm as both Mount and NCC QB's were able to get in grooves and be very efficient.

Budgets, scheduling issues with the rest of the country for NonCon games, Inability to add in other sports.... and a little bit of competition is the story I have gotten on their removal.

Budgets - Added overnight trip for majority of the conference with lengthy travel to get there. Busses, hotels, team meals add up.

Scheduling issues - Seems to be a non issue with the league deciding to allow CUW to join. I just know it was easier to have 3 open weekends to find 2 games than 2 open weekends to find 1. By having 9 CCIW games, the CCIW "Bye week" has become an absolute waste. Many members having a week 1 bye and playing 10 straight, and others having a bye week following non con game 1. Again - this doesn't seem to have as much say into showing WashU the door but it was something referenced in the convo's to show the door.

Football only - Pretty simple here. They only joined for football and it made scheduling for other sports a little more difficult. But again other sports did not want them to join because of the travel. And WashU other sports not wanting to leave UAA.

Competition - The big dogs didn't mind it. But without coming out and saying it, it can be implied that the bottom of the conference would rather go play 2 winnable games early in the season vs a noncon + WashU.... Coaches lives and job depends on many things, but winning is definitely a main factor.

These were the issues I heard discussed on why decision was made. I am sure there were others as well.

I do not see anyone catching NCC anytime soon. Can someone make a jump and become competitive for a handful of years like Cardinal773 suggested, yes. But long term, they have gotten too far our ahead of everyone else. They truly are the perfect storm, and credit to their leadership, they capitalize on damn near every opportunity that is presented their way.

No one in the league has a downtown Naperville within walking distance from their campus. Closest things to it could be considered Elmhurst or NPU being able to be in the big city. Naperville provides a direct train line to the city, a town with a population of over 150,000 residents, a town that is safe to be a college student in, and a social scene with balance for whatever you are looking for. They have bars, clubs, restaurants all within a few football throws of the football stadium. The town itself has also a balance of nice for their residents while also providing establishments for college aged kids with lesser budgets, something Elmhurst / NPU both lack. The city of Elmhurst wants the wine and cheese, the places for college kids to go has diminished overtime. The remainder of CCIW lacks a larger city presence. The one who I think over the next handful of years has a chance to make major headway is IWU. Bloomington/Normal is growing, ISU is right there, and with the hires made from leadership, Athletics will be on the forefront of making decisions with scale.

NCC's campus growth has also been impressive. They are taking advantage of every square foot of campus and are consistently building. Where as, Elmhurst's campus is still over 50% parking lot. The health and Science building is the first ground breaking on campus since I was there starting in 2008. Everything else from a campus perspective quite literally looks exactly the same minus some upkeep on facilities which is lipstick vs new.

The investment into the football program after sustained success also pulls them ahead. As mentioned above, FT coaches and GA/Support is far and away better than competing schools within the league. Also, the pay of those FT coaches is far and away better than other schools. NCC position coaches make what most of the league pays their coordinators, and their Coordinators pay competes with what league member pay their HC's..... This has set up for the core of the staff having no intention to leave unless an opportunity is so good they cant pass it up (Getting a Division 1 Job).

I was at the Wheaton / NCC game this past weekend, and I would say it was different than any D3 experience from a game-day atmosphere than anywhere else in the country. This cant / doesnt just happen with hardworking coaches. The school's leadership put on a display and spent money to do so... Moving homecoming game to night which opened up tailgating opp where members of student life were passing out bells, shirts, pom pom's, thunder sticks. The amount of inflatables, face painting, games, activities for young kids to participate in. The community bars running drink specials for homecoming through the day and night. An alumni tent offering food, drinks, and giving a spot for former players to come together. Topped with a firework show to end the game. It was a spectacle of an event that will keep everyone coming back. This, paired with the growth and organization of their golf outing, is something that at most places will fall under the coaches having to do more is supplemented by NCC's leadership to take experiences to new heights.

First time back on the boards in 3 years! Long time reader, and upon hanging up the cleats at Elmhurst I found this site and made an account to keep me involved in my love for d3 football and the CCIW. I come with what I would consider a unique perspective on the game and league. Played in it for 4 years under Coach Lester, jumped into coaching as a full time profession for 5 years coaching at Loras for a year, Syracuse for 2 years and Maryland for 2 years before exiting full time status to start up a company called GoRout where I am now the COO (I saw some shout out's earlier this year / last year on our products which are wearable devices for players to make coach to player communication more efficient.) Shane Dierking at NCC is one of my best childhood friends, having coaching buddies and customers on other staffs and I joined Mike Murray the last 2 years to aid in the rebuild of Elmhurst serving as the OC for the 23/24 seasons.

As disappointed as I am in Elmhurst start to the season, it is not shocking. We as a staff thought that this next season we would have a chance to get into the .500 conversation after taking over a roster that won 3 games in 5 seasons and then winning 5 games in 2 years. Our first spring we had 30 players on the roster and could barley complete a spring ball. The program was in complete turmoil and the overhaul continues. The timing of Coach Murray's departure really hurt us as we lost top talent to the portal with uncertainty on who would be our new HC. It also hurt this incoming recruiting class with the departure happening right in the commitment window for d3 programs. Elmhurst has talent, we are just extremely thin and injuries at any position is leading to position changes and having to recreate the wheel from a scheme perspective.

I am extremely happy with the hire of Coach Heff. The previous HC to Coach Murray struggled to retain its recruiting classes which left a depleted roster for Coach Murray's staff to rebuild. The Bluejays need Coach Heff to be our longterm answer to get us back in conversation of being competitive within the CCIW.

Small Roster + Partial recruiting class for 27 class due to coaching change + partial recruiting class for 29 class = a thin roster. God Bless our SR's that stuck it out and did not quit, this is their 3rd HC during their time at EU. They are great kids, and deserve better than the cards they were dealt when it comes to their college football career. Consistency in this rebuild will be key. I was Elmhurst 5th Offensive Coordinator in 5 years when I arrived and the 1st to make it multiple years to allow our players to develop, create and build good habits within a scheme.  The class of 28 (Sophomore's) will have to buckle down and be the leaders to get the program back. When you look at the current production that is where it currently lives, yet they are still 19/20 year olds playing in a grown man's league. Our OL is going to be solid these next few years, we have talent in the skill rooms, on defense we need to have a great recruiting class at the DL position (I think we have 7/8 DL on the entire roster) and DB position. Our So LB's are ball players and good leaders.

I am hopeful the Jays can get their 2nd win this Saturday. With a stout run defense, and balanced attack on O this would be a game we shouldy be in contention. I was very proud of the 2 years we spent at Elmhurst and one thing we preached and worked on everyday was ball security, sustaining drives, winning 3rd downs, and limiting turnovers through the air. If we are going to have a chance this weekend the Jays will have to get back to that script. Our INT total through 3 games is already 1 higher than what it was in 2024. Have to keep playing clean football!

Very excited to be back to being a fan of CCIW football and keep up with the chatter within the boards. With a continued investment into athletics paired with Coach Heff being a Bluejay and being bought in for the long haul the Bluejays have a path in front of them to get back to competing!

Go Jays!

Quote from: lmitzel on October 29, 2022, 06:58:03 PM

Quote from: kiko on October 29, 2022, 05:14:02 PM
North Central 59, North Park 0 at Burlington Northern Metra Line Field

That's a school record fourth consecutive shutout, by the way.

NCC has not allowed a point in 245-plus minutes of game action; last score they allowed was that Bowers to Bonga connection that made it 27-20 NCC late in the Little Brass Bell game.

Would love to see Shane Dierking get a HC opportunity!

Just got done watching the Elmhurst vs Carroll game. A few notes of positivity for the Jays.

1 - For the 1st time all season they won the turnover battle. Scored a TD on Defense. The new QB valued the football and kept his squad out of conflict. Through 5 games Elmhurst had 24 turnovers with 4.8 turnovers a game.

2 - New QB. Started a FR QB who was a little lighter on his feet than the previous starter. He was able to get himself out of some plays that would have been Sacks of TO's if the previous QB was in. The QB who started through the 1st 5 games definitely has more arm talent, but the new QB has much more wiggle and improvised well most of the day.

3 - Commitment to the ground game. The efficiency on the ground was not there. Did not run the ball well by any means. But it seemed like our OC tried to pound the ball / win the TOP battle. Sometimes the best Defense is an Offense who can stay on the field. All season we have tried to throw the ball around with short and intermediate throws. If we can run the ball with some success, by play design we will set ourselves up for some nice play action passes down the field.

All in all I think it's something to build on. I imagine the team has some hidden confidence in the new signal called with the result of the game. I actually think Pullock and Cavallo are a nice 1/2 combo at the RB position. Both are averaging around 4 YPC. We have just gotten in the habit of getting down a score or two and trying to stay in the game with our passing game to no success. A nice formula for the Jays the rest of the way will be Win the Turnover battle, Control the Clock, and run the ball. If we can do 2 of those 3 things we set at least give ourselves a chance like this past Saturday.

Will need to play lights out but 3 of our last 4 we got a chance to build heading into the off season!

Quote from: Gregory Sager on September 30, 2022, 04:40:32 PM

Quote from: markerickson on September 30, 2022, 12:38:52 PM
I almost spewed my coffee when I read GoIrish7's words about the NCAA's penalties.  FA used a wrong word?  EC's actions occurred over more than a year in two different programs, i.e., MBB and wrestling.  Why would that affect VBALL?

It was more than men's basketball and wrestling, Mark. The NCAA investigation of EU found that, "Over the course of four academic years, the director of financial aid awarded scholarships partially based on athletics to 26 student-athletes across 10 sports on 42 occasions."

https://www.ncaa.org/news/2017/10/27/elmhurst-lacked-institutional-control.aspx

As for why women's volleyball in particular was brought into the discussion ... well, GoIrish7's assertion is that the EU administation has adopted a parsimonious attitude towards student-athletes with regard to financial aid in the wake of the NCAA sanctions, and he thus directly attributes the collapse of the Bluejays across the board to the administration's over-cautiousness. Next Man Up (accurately, IMO) challenged that by raising the point that the EU men's basketball program has not only continued to be successful in the wake of the sanctions, it's improved. I mean, it's hard to argue against a D3 national second-place trophy for the 2021-22 season.

That's when GoIrish7 specifically brought up women's volleyball, which has traditionally been Elmhurst's standard-bearing sport. Women's volleyball is the source of Elmhurst's two national championships (1983 and 1985, which, unfortunately, means that the CCIW can't take credit for them as well). Since the CCIW first started sponsoring the sport in the 1986-87 school year, the Bluejays have won nine conference titles in women's volleyball, which is by far the most success that EU has had in any one sport in the CCIW's co-ed era.

Given that this discussion was about the Elmhurst athletic department (and financial aid department, and overall EU administration), not simply the financial aid violations and the NCAA penalties they brought about, EU women's volleyball was completely germane to the topic at hand.

Quote from: markerickson on September 30, 2022, 12:38:52 PMAnd the degree to which GI7 characterized the severity of sanctions is also laughable.

I strongly disagree. Even if you don't buy into GoIrish7's thesis about EU's financial-aid tightfistedness (and, as I said, Next Man Up makes a strong, although not airtight, argument against it), Elmhurst forfeited the 2012 CCIW co-championship in football and the women's volleyball CCIW tournament titles for 2012 and 2013. In addition, Elmhurst's 27-24 victory over Coe in the first round of the 2012 D3 football playoffs and the four matches that the Bluejays won in the 2012 D3 women's volleyball tourney en route to the Final Four, plus the two matches they won in the 2013 D3 women's volleyball tourney, were all vacated by the NCAA Committee on Infractions.

The severity of those penalties is most certainly not laughable, especially to the EU student-athletes and coaches who lost their claims to those CCIW titles and national postseason victories and to the Bluejays fans who support those two programs.

Thanks Sager. New to the boards, but your memory and ability to draw up old posts is impressive.

After graduating I hoped into Coaching, first at the d3 level for 2 seasons then joined Lester at Syracuse for 2 years before heading to U of Maryland. The 2nd two schools had no issues obviously with offerings of money. Per what I know from the FA side, almost every d3 has secondary "grant" money which can be pooled on to close the gap of other d3 schools. At Loras we had the DuHawk grant, and a few others that was awareded to be competitive when it came to packaging. Or to close the gap to other schools.  At Elmhurst, I was not part of the group who was awarded the grant, but they flat out called it the Elmhurst Athletics Grant.... in your face spelled out breaking d3 rules. This is what I mean by it could have been avoided if we simply called it something else. The majority of teams while I was there were affected when they looked into who was awarded the grant. Elmhurst did a poor job explaining to the teams who were affected, we simply got a blanket email saying that FA broke rules and that wins would be taken away from teams, but all individual records would hold and not be taken away from players. After that - they were not available for questions or meetings with student athletes and we had to piece together what it was all about.

Since - Grant money has been under tight lock and key. Elmhurst has not been willing to make the same mistake twice and simply is not awarding much grant money to compete vs other CCIW schools.

As for this weeks match ups. I like NCC over Wheaton by 2 TD's! With Elmhurst falling off, I am an NCC fan by association with Shane Dierking being one of my best friends in high school. Hoping to see them come out loose and have a good showing.

Quote from: Next Man Up on September 27, 2022, 04:11:14 PM
GoIrish7————-

Allow me to ask a question please.

If an Iron Curtain exists between the Athletic Dept/Coaches and Financial Aid that prevents recruitment of high level football prospects, how come this phenomenon does not seem to affect the basketball program, which has lately been able to attract enough talent to reach lofty heights on the D3 landscape??

Valid - I can't speak on it as I do not know. As 79Jay mentioned below, HC / Assistants are rolling and great for them! Easier to find 1/2 studs to build a competitive roster around when only 5 people on the floor vs 22+ is all I got.

They have must have a great sales pitch because since 2012/13 when Elmhurst Football, Volleyball, Wrestling, Softball, Soccer, and more were all competing for CCIW championships and playoff runs all sports have dropped off. Just feel like Elmhurst Athletics as a whole are being handcuffed because FA did not word a grant properly. School got the book thrown at them and have been on eggshells with being competitive with Financial Aid since.  Many of the same coaches in the sports listed above who had their programs competing at a high level are now struggling to go .500 respectively..... Sorry for going on.... Back to football!

Quote from: Gregory Sager on September 27, 2022, 03:41:54 PM

Quote from: GoIrish7 on September 27, 2022, 12:43:43 PM
Combination of all 3 things. Recruiting is the biggest issue. Elmhurst won't be successful until they address the situation happening in Admissions / Financial Aid office. Staff currently has 0 connection with Financial Aid and are getting no help in making school affordable. At 99% of d3 schools if you go on a visit to lets say Carthage, NCC and Elmhurst and Elmhurst is where you want to be, the school may not be able to match the price of the other schools but they will atleast make an effort to meet in the middle or get close to the price of the other 2 schools. EC staff is being told the price is the price which in most cases is 5-10k higher than other schools they are competing against.

With regard to the first clause of your third sentence, "Staff currently has 0 connection with Financial Aid," I know that NPU has a very bright line between the Financial Aid office and the Department of Athletics that Vikings coaches cannot cross. When a North Park coach has a prospect in his or her office, and the prospect or his or her parents brings up the subject of financial aid, the coach has to say, "Sorry, but I can't talk about that subject. Here's a business card with the name and number of the person in our financial aid department who will be talking to you. I know him/her well, and he/she is good people. That's a person who is very good at what they do, and, like all of our financial aid people, he/she looks out for the best interests of the student. But their job is their job, and I'm not allowed to step on their toes by talking about numbers with you."

I can't say for sure, but I get the feeling that this is a pretty common policy among Division III schools. Anything that encroaches upon, or even hints at, student-athlete privilege when it comes to doling out financial aid is strictly curbed by clearly-set institutional guidelines -- and that means taking coaches out of the picture as much as possible. And I would think that Elmhurst, a school that got caught breaking D3's rules regarding excessive aid to student-athletes (and paid the price for it), would now be policing that bright line even harder than anybody else in the CCIW. At least, I would hope so.

You may be right about how Elmhurst's financial aid officers line up their price against Carthage and North Central. But, for the sake of the Bluejays, I sincerely hope that EU coaches and athletics staff are not a part of that conversation.

Quote from: GoIrish7 on September 27, 2022, 12:43:43 PM
Because of that, the players they are getting just cannot complete in the CCIW. We are filling the roster with a bunch of players who aren't even on the radars of most CCIW schools because they could not play elsewhere.

Yes, this is exactly what I said here several weeks ago ... and, again, I didn't enjoy saying it:

Quote from: Gregory Sager on September 13, 2022, 02:56:53 PMThe other big part of the reason behind that 63-0 beatdown is that the Bluejays roster simply doesn't have very many CCIW-caliber players. At. All. I could envision about a half-dozen or so of them getting on the field and participating if they were wearing NCC or Wheaton unis -- Julian Cavallo and Winston Brown on offense; Bryce Gable, certainly, and also Antonio Carillo and Colton Kraus on D, and not much else. I know bad CCIW football when I see it, since I've seen more of it than anybody else who posts here, so hear me out: the Bluejays aren't "basically static" from 2021. They are actually worse than they were a year ago. It's essentially a mid-pack UMAC team that got lost on its way to Finlandia and somehow alighted between the Elmhurst Public Library and St. Mary Cemetery.

Moving on:

Quote from: GoIrish7 on September 27, 2022, 12:43:43 PMStaff is then having to go outside of IL to recruit to sell kids on coming to "Chicago" to play. Our roster is filled with out of state players because no Illinois kids want to pay more money to go rebuild a program when they can just go play for schools in the CCIW for cheaper and win games. This shows up big time with team connection. None of these guys are sticking around for summer and building the team internally. They go home and are on there own for summer months. The most important months for d3 team, IMO, are summer. Players run the lifts, players get together 2-3 times a week are work on the field to work checks, routes, conditioning etc. and then at night you bond as a team. None of this is happening when your pulling players from CO, TX, NJ, CA, AZ etc.

Here's where you and I part company. I don't agree with your declaration that the key to success is to recruit local players who work and play together during the summer. Cooperative off-season accountability with regard to body maintenance and development and to technique improvement? Absolutely. Coaches in all sports try to generate as much of that as possible during the parts of the school year that are neither in season nor in the official window of off-season team workouts and scrimmages. Team bonding during the off-season? Of course. One of the distinguishing features of college life is that student-athletes socially clump together in team-based friendships throughout their entire time in college. But the idea that success is dependent upon keeping your players in close proximity to each other in late May, June, July, and early August is a fiction.

For proof, look no further than Wheaton, with its Rand-McNally roster that stretches from sea to shining sea. On a perennial basis Wheaton is good at most sports, very good in some of them -- particularly football. And it happens despite the fact that a huge percentage of Wheaton student-athletes aren't anywhere near Chicagoland during the summer months. Part of what Wheaton demands of its student-athletes is a sense of personal accountability that renders distance from each other moot. Another example is North Park men's soccer, which is likewise a perennial national power.  A prodigious portion of the NPU soccer team isn't even in this country during the summer, let alone in Chicagoland. A lot of Augustana's most accomplished student-athletes in recent years -- football, basketball, baseball in particular -- have been Coloradans. Again, they're not lurking about the QC during the summer months; they're home enjoying mom's cooking while watching Rockies games or hiking the mountains when they're not at their summer jobs. It's not helping Augie football, perhaps, but it certainly hasn't hurt Augie basketball or baseball. Heck, even the non-Coloradan Augie student-athletes are pretty evenly diffused between the western Chicagoland suburbs and rural western Illinois and eastern Iowa -- in other words, they're too spread out and distanced from Rock Island to be gathering together for off-season workouts and night-time recreation.

Quote from: GoIrish7 on September 27, 2022, 12:43:43 PM
I think a change in leadership only helps if the new header goes through a venting process and interviews the other side of campus... How are we going to compete financially, what are we going to do to get our full time coaches offices(they currently work in an open area in cubicles with no privacy), What is the plan with the locker room? (The new locker room they slapped together is a worse set up than the previous one they had), Staffing(build your staff around Elmhurst Alumni, find good coaches who will work for less because they love the program).....

It's a sad truth that success and the almighty dollar go hand-in-hand, even in something that's supposed to be as pure and equitable as Division III athletics. But that's life.

Follow up --

1. Absolutely - Coaches of course cannot speak on behalf of financial aid... But, They can have peace of mind knowing when they do hand over the business card that they have a fighting chance to win or at least be competitive with the SA vs the competition. In this example, when a kid meets with FA they are being told, this is the price and the best we can do, where other institutions will attempt to match, close the gap or be competitive.

2/3. I am glad we can agree!

4. I hear you. And I see what you are saying on success at other CCIW schools with players from across the country. I know players will go home and they should to enjoy off time. I am speaking on just my experience. School ended in May. Most SA's took off and went home for the month of May/June. When we were rolling I would say 90% of our team at Elmhurst were back in July. This included SA's from MI, FL, IN.. If you were player that was within an hour to 2 hours of driving distance, they drove in for Tuesday/Thursday night player run workouts and on field work during the month of July. This just becomes tough to do when 50-75% of your roster is from across the country. Those Tuesday's/Thursday's were some of the most competitive, fun 7 on 7 sessions I have been a part of. We all got together after at one of the off campus houses after and I just felt as if those work hard / play hard moments had mentally gave us confidence going into camp that we were all working together when others potentially were not.

5. And I say it again. I think Coach McDonald is doing a fine job. He is handcuffed in certain places outside of his control. The same defense that worked for years elsewhere is getting run through due to lack of Jimmy's and Joe's. From an Alumni standpoint he has busted his ass to bring guys back around and get former players involved. Much more than the staff prior. Was more saying if change in leadership did occur I hope the new header goes through an in depth venting process with AD/President before signing the dotted line. I think both Planz and Coach McDonald took the job as 1st HC opps without taking a deep dive into whats going on behind the curtain to see why the football team is struggling.

Combination of all 3 things. Recruiting is the biggest issue. Elmhurst won't be successful until they address the situation happening in Admissions / Financial Aid office. Staff currently has 0 connection with Financial Aid and are getting no help in making school affordable. At 99% of d3 schools if you go on a visit to lets say Carthage, NCC and Elmhurst and Elmhurst is where you want to be, the school may not be able to match the price of the other schools but they will atleast make an effort to meet in the middle or get close to the price of the other 2 schools. EC staff is being told the price is the price which in most cases is 5-10k higher than other schools they are competing against.

Because of that, the players they are getting just cannot complete in the CCIW. We are filling the roster with a bunch of players who aren't even on the radars of most CCIW schools because they could not play elsewhere. Staff is then having to go outside of IL to recruit to sell kids on coming to "Chicago" to play. Our roster is filled with out of state players because no Illinois kids want to pay more money to go rebuild a program when they can just go play for schools in the CCIW for cheaper and win games. This shows up big time with team connection. None of these guys are sticking around for summer and building the team internally. They go home and are on there own for summer months. The most important months for d3 team, IMO, are summer. Players run the lifts, players get together 2-3 times a week are work on the field to work checks, routes, conditioning etc. and then at night you bond as a team. None of this is happening when your pulling players from CO, TX, NJ, CA, AZ etc.

EC Defense is diverse and brings a multitude of looks. Players might be in position, but they just aren't talented enough to make plays. Because the Defense has to be complicated, it also comes with busts and giving up big plays... Damned if you do, Damned if you don't on that side of the ball.

EC Offense.... atleast it looks like football this year. Last year we had no concepts, just plays that looked good on a board and funky formations to be gimmicky with no plan. I would say the new OC seems to have a much better hold on the game and atleast we are running concepts that exist to other coaches. My frustration on O has been lack of comprehension of our opponent. North Central is a prime example. EC is not going to win that game. Come in with a plan to run the ball early, eat clock, and get out of there with a loss. EC came out slinging the ball early, resulting in multiple 3 and outs and the score got out of hand before anyone could even get settled into the game. I understand we arent going to run for 4-5 yards a carry, but the goal should be, we lost by 70 last year, lets minimize the damage and get out of there / close the gap a bit in how bad we get blown out by.

I think a change in leadership only helps if the new header goes through a venting process and interviews the other side of campus... How are we going to compete financially, what are we going to do to get our full time coaches offices(they currently work in an open area in cubicles with no privacy), What is the plan with the locker room? (The new locker room they slapped together is a worse set up than the previous one they had), Staffing(build your staff around Elmhurst Alumni, find good coaches who will work for less because they love the program).....

Hoping I can get back to the boards this year! Millikin has new header with great energy, I think with what they are building, recruiting efforts will be much improved. Biggest question mark will be retention. Decatur, from what I have been told, is not the best college town. Schools like IWU, North Central, Elmhurst, WashU, Wheaton retention should be high if they have things cooking with the amount of options available for their student athletes.

I think NCC rolls this year. From what I have been told by staffs in the league - Carroll and WashU will be tough. Wheaton reloading with a large class leaving after this past season. Carthage brought in a monster of FR class. Hoping my Jays can get over the 2 win hump and get themselves back towards the middle of the pack / start closing the gap. I am completely removed and couldn't say I know much about the team heading into this weekend other than we have a top LB. New OC - really hope we make a big jump there. Since Derrickson (OC after Lester) left, the last 3/4 play callers seem like they are grabbing plays / concepts out of a hat weekly and hope they work. No identity when it comes to the Offense and anything we can hang out hat on. Way too much fancy formations, shifts, motions and asking kids to do too much rather than specializing in a smaller book and getting really good at it vs multitude of looks.

My wishful rankings

NCC
WashU
Wheaton
Carroll
Carthage
Millikin
Elmhurst
IWU
Augie
North Park

Quote from: USee on March 03, 2021, 11:20:44 PM
For Wheaton, they have a bunch of 5th year and regular seniors who want to win a title. They aren't going to pay 25k to play 5 meaningless games in the spring so they aren't even in school. That decreases the numbers significantly for the Thunder and increases the risk of injury to some key players who are in school. Spring games don't make sense for them.

Spot on here. I think most coaching staffs in the CCIW met extensively with parents on their sons futures via team zoom calls. Basically presenting a number of options.

Option 1 - Continue your course load as if COVID didn't happen. Participate in scrimmages and minimal games / continue progress towards your degree.

Option 2 - take a gap year, do not participate in spring season. Continue to train, participate in zoom position meetings and grab an internship or job. Return in fall to expense full 4 years of eligibility.

In Wheaton and NCC's cases so many guys opted for option 2 it left them in roster flux with limited numbers. The reality is if your cool spending a fulls year worth of tuition to play a few exhibition games  that's great, but many guys and their parents said no thanks to that. 

It's also given a handful of guys time to get ahead academically. I can see for the next few years everyone seeing a top senior, who classified as a junior on the football field walking away from football. At Elmhurst in 2011 we had a OL that had his degree in hand and still had a year to play.. his parents ponied up the money and gave their son his 4th year as he took courses to work on a minor in his field and return to the field in 2012 season. we also had a TE who was in this situation in 2013. He graduated, could come back for the 2013 season to play but opted to hang his cleats up due to finances and going out on a high note.

Don't think there is a right or wrong, whatever is best for the player and his family.

Quote from: New Tradition on January 06, 2020, 11:38:09 AM

Quote from: GoIrish7 on January 06, 2020, 11:27:30 AM

Quote from: WUPHF on January 06, 2020, 09:49:49 AM
It looks like Washington University football has a new head coach: https://washubears.com/sports/fball/2019-20/releases/20200106ekuf1a

A+ Hire. His offenses at EMU really allowed them to be competitive with less talent than other schools in the MAC. I think he will have WashU as a top 3 CCIW team for years to come.

Should be exciting!  A new era of CCIW dominance sounds both tantalizing and attainable.

By no means does dominance come into play...... When I was at Elmhurst all our coaches talked about early on was getting into the top third of the league. Beating Augustana for the 1st time in 30+ years was the first step. And then it became how could we find a way to upset either NCC/Wheaton/IWU.

NCC/Wheaton/IWU

WashU/Augustana/Carthage

Millikin/Elmhurst/Carroll/NPU

I think WashU could make a run to knock a IWU out of that top 3. NCC/Wheaton arent going anywhere any time soon.

Quote from: WUPHF on January 06, 2020, 09:49:49 AM
It looks like Washington University football has a new head coach: https://washubears.com/sports/fball/2019-20/releases/20200106ekuf1a

A+ Hire. His offenses at EMU really allowed them to be competitive with less talent than other schools in the MAC. I think he will have WashU as a top 3 CCIW team for years to come.

Quote from: New Tradition on December 22, 2019, 06:03:59 PM

Quote from: robertgoulet on December 22, 2019, 06:00:00 PM
NT, regarding who's going to be manning the helm for NCC next year: there's already rumors afoot of a transfer from a scholarship school.

The spot couldn't be any more attractive for someone considering.

Does the scholarship school wear Green and White?  (There is no truth to this, I just think it would be awesome)