Future of Division III

[y_jack_lok]

^^^ Hmmmm. I'd love to discuss economics -- especially how it's being taught -- but I think we'd better stick to more appropriate topics on this forum.

[Kuiper]

Interesting informtion. I hope BW successfuly comes through this. Also intersting that Economics was eliminated. Hopefully they still offer some courses. I believe it is important for every student to at least be introduced to it. So does ACTA when they evaluate institutions. I know at CNU, every student has to take at least one Econ class, it might be 2.

What is ACTA? Requiring students to take one or two economics courses wasn't part of the RMC curriculum back when I attended in the 1960s. Nor was it a requirement at Fordham U in New York City where my son graduated in 2009. Is it something recent?

ACTA (American Council of Trustees and Alumni) is an advocacy organization that "grades" schools and tries to sway curriculum.  It has no actual power, other than through the politicians it lobbies or the people who read their ratings and like them.  It probably has gained some influence in the current political climate.

It rose to a modicum of prominence over a decade ago for a report that found that only 3% of schools required economics and mocked the titles of courses taught at some liberal arts schools that satisfied the history requirements at those schools.  Since very, very few liberal arts colleges actually require specific courses as part of their general education requirements (they usually offer a menu of options within certain categories), the whole exercise is a bit misleading.   

Connecting this to the Baldwin Wallace situation, I think it's fair to say that a lot of schools have seen declining interest in majoring in certain "classical" liberal arts majors, such as econ or history.  They want majors that have more real world purchase in their minds.  Eliminating those majors, however, does not mean that they don't still teach econ or history.  As a practical matter, though, if you don't offer a major, you don't really need a "Department," which means no one is really pushing to hire faculty in the field, and what you end up with is a couple of currently tenured faculty teaching the survey courses and no advanced courses being offered.

[scottiedoug]

The elimination of sociology as a major puts BW right in line with DeSantis' campaign to eliminate fields in Florida where students might learn how social forces work. And who needs to know how capitalism works?  I am glad I am not trying to run a college these days!

[Gregory Sager]

The elimination of sociology as a major puts BW right in line with DeSantis' campaign to eliminate fields in Florida where students might learn how social forces work. And who needs to know how capitalism works?  I am glad I am not trying to run a college these days!

Baldwin Wallace is located in Ohio, not in Florida.

[WUPHF]

The elimination of sociology as a major puts BW right in line with DeSantis' campaign to eliminate fields in Florida where students might learn how social forces work. And who needs to know how capitalism works?  I am glad I am not trying to run a college these days!

It may have been a political decision, but they also have majors in history, political science, psychology and social work.  The sociology department probably had fewer majors than the others.

[Kuiper]

The elimination of sociology as a major puts BW right in line with DeSantis' campaign to eliminate fields in Florida where students might learn how social forces work. And who needs to know how capitalism works?  I am glad I am not trying to run a college these days!

It may have been a political decision, but they also have majors in history, political science, psychology and social work.  The sociology department probably had fewer majors than the others.

BW cut the History major too.

As a practical matter, the future for many small liberal arts colleges in DIII in an era of declining enrollment and tighter finances is consortium style curricula where schools in the consortium concentrate on a smaller number of majors in areas of strength and the majors don't overlap among schools.  Students can graduate from one school while majoring in something only offered at another school in the consortium and either remote or hybrid remote/in-person classes are permitted.  That already exists at some of the consortiums out there and is spreading.  For example, Pitzer students can major in something at Claremont-McKenna if that major isn't offered at Pitzer (e.g., Philosophy, Politics & Economics).  Right now, that mostly covers unique majors, but I expect it won't be long before schools parcel out the classical majors so that one offers history, one poli sci, one philosophy, etc.

[WUPHF]

BW cut the History major too.

For whatever reason, Baldwin-Wallace had a public history major that has been merged with the history major.  But the once popular history major has survived the latest round of cuts.

I would not be surprised if history and political science are merged.

I do think the consortium model will expand, but I generally do not see that as the future of Division III.

[WUPHF]

Interesting perspective on a proposed rule that may change whether or not an institution is eligible to issue student loans.

https://www.christianitytoday.com/2026/05/christian-colleges-financial-aid-earnings-test-regulation-trump/?utm_medium=widgetsocial

[MCScots2013]

The elimination of sociology as a major puts BW right in line with DeSantis' campaign to eliminate fields in Florida where students might learn how social forces work. And who needs to know how capitalism works?  I am glad I am not trying to run a college these days!

I'm glad we agree that Econ is a better subject to study rather than (...get ready to clutch your pearls...) Gender Studies or Dance Theory.  Those majors are major scams that do nothing but degrade the educational standards and puts people in debt while wasting four years.  If I'm running a college these days, I'm adding courses geared toward real life application in fields where people are making money.  Risk Management and Insurance, Project Management, Logistics and Supply Chain, Banking and Private Equity.  All of these can be added to curriculum and not diminish an institution's liberal arts philosophy.  Plus, more parents would be willing to spend the money to send Junior off the college if he's getting a useful education.  And, yes. I am calling out male enrollment.  5% drop (over 1 million) in enrollment since 2011.  There are two issues we can all can clearly see.  Declining birth rate and declining male enrollment.  Good luck.

[CNU85]

The elimination of sociology as a major puts BW right in line with DeSantis' campaign to eliminate fields in Florida where students might learn how social forces work. And who needs to know how capitalism works?  I am glad I am not trying to run a college these days!

I'm glad we agree that Econ is a better subject to study rather than (...get ready to clutch your pearls...) Gender Studies or Dance Theory.  Those majors are major scams that do nothing but degrade the educational standards and puts people in debt while wasting four years.  If I'm running a college these days, I'm adding courses geared toward real life application in fields where people are making money.  Risk Management and Insurance, Project Management, Logistics and Supply Chain, Banking and Private Equity.  All of these can be added to curriculum and not diminish an institution's liberal arts philosophy.  Plus, more parents would be willing to spend the money to send Junior off the college if he's getting a useful education.  And, yes. I am calling out male enrollment.  5% drop (over 1 million) in enrollment since 2011.  There are two issues we can all can clearly see.  Declining birth rate and declining male enrollment.  Good luck.

This is no lie...I'm not making this up at all. My daughter graduated from CNU with an Econ degree, Magna Cum Laude minoring in dance. She danced at Busch Gardens Williamsburg while in college and had lead roles in Christmas ballet shows and others. Just before graduation, she started traveling to auditions. She went to NYC and auditioned for one of two spots at a renowned Jazz company in Chicago. They auditioned hundreds in NYC, Boston Chicago and LA for 2 female spots and I believe one male spot. She was selected, signed a contract and moved to the North Side....Roscoe Village and danced with Giordano Dance Chicago. That lead to a career in dancing literally on every continent except Antarctica. She now has a family but is still teaching competitive dance teams, choreographs competion teams around the country and adjudicates competitions across the nation. She has won numerous regional and national awards for her choreography. So, no, I dont think Dance Theory waters down anything at all. Just because you don't understand something, don't mock it as a scam!

[y_jack_lok]

The elimination of sociology as a major puts BW right in line with DeSantis' campaign to eliminate fields in Florida where students might learn how social forces work. And who needs to know how capitalism works?  I am glad I am not trying to run a college these days!

I'm glad we agree that Econ is a better subject to study rather than (...get ready to clutch your pearls...) Gender Studies or Dance Theory.  Those majors are major scams that do nothing but degrade the educational standards and puts people in debt while wasting four years.  If I'm running a college these days, I'm adding courses geared toward real life application in fields where people are making money.  Risk Management and Insurance, Project Management, Logistics and Supply Chain, Banking and Private Equity.  All of these can be added to curriculum and not diminish an institution's liberal arts philosophy.  Plus, more parents would be willing to spend the money to send Junior off the college if he's getting a useful education.  And, yes. I am calling out male enrollment.  5% drop (over 1 million) in enrollment since 2011.  There are two issues we can all can clearly see.  Declining birth rate and declining male enrollment.  Good luck.

See bolded sentence above. OMG. If I had a dollar for every time I've heard a statement like that. There are countless ways that people make a living in the world that aren't considered "fields where people are making money". Where would we be without our grossly underpaid public school teachers, to name just one profession?

[jknezek]

College isn't necessarily trade school. It's supposed to be where you go to learn to think. Pigeon-holing a few majors as "worth it" is ridiculously narrow minded. Liberal Arts have led college education for decades. There is so much value in a well-rounded education. And that's coming from someone with a B.S. in Business Administration, a B.A. in Print Journalism and an MBA in Finance.

I'm the most trade school Liberal Arts guy ever, and I still loved all the non-core classes I took. From Geology to Fantasy Literature to American Religion and more, those courses were key to learning to think. Stats and Econ And intro Accounting were just homework that needed doing.

[CNU85]

The elimination of sociology as a major puts BW right in line with DeSantis' campaign to eliminate fields in Florida where students might learn how social forces work. And who needs to know how capitalism works?  I am glad I am not trying to run a college these days!

I'm glad we agree that Econ is a better subject to study rather than (...get ready to clutch your pearls...) Gender Studies or Dance Theory.  Those majors are major scams that do nothing but degrade the educational standards and puts people in debt while wasting four years.  If I'm running a college these days, I'm adding courses geared toward real life application in fields where people are making money.  Risk Management and Insurance, Project Management, Logistics and Supply Chain, Banking and Private Equity.  All of these can be added to curriculum and not diminish an institution's liberal arts philosophy.  Plus, more parents would be willing to spend the money to send Junior off the college if he's getting a useful education.  And, yes. I am calling out male enrollment.  5% drop (over 1 million) in enrollment since 2011.  There are two issues we can all can clearly see.  Declining birth rate and declining male enrollment.  Good luck.

See bolded sentence above. OMG. If I had a dollar for every time I've heard a statement like that. There are countless ways that people make a living in the world that aren't considered "fields where people are making money". Where would we be without our grossly underpaid public school teachers, to name just one profession?

Exactly . While I'm on a roll, my son-in-law. He is a performer. Played the role of Jerry Lee Lewis on a Eurpoean tour of Million Dollar Quartet. Played the West End of London (think Broadway) Has a finance degree from an AACSB accredited university in Australia. Has created/produced entire shows for Holland America. Does a ton of other things....and along the way he took classes at Berklee related to music production and other scam course offerings.

[y_jack_lok]

^^^ I wish I could point to that kind of success in my family. I can't just yet. But my son, who has a BA in Political Science, turned to writing about a decade ago and has just completed an MFA program in Creative Writing. Simultaneously he has a novel that was released on May 5th. It's not likely to be a best seller, but it could earn him royalties beyond the advance he was paid by his publisher. This has led to him being about to start a job ghostwriting a book for a computer science professor who spent over four years leading a federal government organization.

There are so many pathways in life.

[MCScots2013]

Thanks for the anecdotes.  I'm glad there are performers and I'm glad there are teachers.  We'd be a much better place if more folks did what they loved for a living, but sadly lot of graduates come out of school wide eyed and bushy tailed and find out what they just paid to study is not the ROI they expected.  CNU85, I would have to imagine your daughter having an Econ background to fall back on is better than have a Dance degree to fall back on if circumstances changed. You may feel differently, but as a girl dad myself I would prefer my daughter have your daughter's path.

The "what about the teachers!" line is overplayed. We all know teachers are fundamental to society.  Did I say Teaching Licensure was a scam?  No.  My wife was one of those underpaid teachers and my brother is college professor.  Grade school kids can't do basic math and are accepted into colleges and high school teachers are assaulted in the classroom and most parents couldn't care less. I don't live in a bubble. But, for a board called "Future of Division III" is sure does seem like some of us here do.

Colleges used to teach people how to think.  Now it's what to think, with very rare exceptions.  I can love my alma mater and be thankful for my education yet still be critical.  (Isn't that the "how to think" role of my education?)

You guys can crap on me all you'd like, and if I plucked a nerve I hope your Memorial Day Weekend is not ruined.  The facts are the facts. Only 40% of degrees this year were earned by men and down 3% from last year (before you call me sexist, we men make up half the population and half of possible enrollees).  Keep telling yourselves everything is just fine as we have numerous colleges and universities shutting down over enrollment and finances with many more on accreditation probation due to those poor finances. Larger universities are going to gain more market share.

We live in 2026, not 1996.  "The times, they are a-changin'."  Get busy finding ways to adapt or get left behind.  Simple as that.