FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[washdupcard]

I haven't enjoyed a discussion as much as I have this one, in maybe 20 years on this Board. Bravo to all, especially Mr. Sager, for the comprehensive and detailed analysis. As has been said, the alignment that slowly evolved at NCC beginning in the early John Thorne era until today, is really unprecedented. Having played at NCC in the late 90's, I always believed NCC was a sleeping giant compared to the other CCIW schools. Bill Mack (another Hall of Fame H.S. coach in Illinois until he was hired at NCC) never got a fraction of the support from the Admin that the Thornes and Brad Spencer have been able to enjoy over the last 20 plus years. The only way I see the NCC machine being toppled for the foreseeable future is from within. Whether it's from the College's Admin or key coaching personnel leaving (which is unlikely based on their ties to the school and young families) it does not seem likely that any school outside of Wheaton has the ability recruit at a level even close as there is no comparable draw, and Wheaton's recruiting is really an outlier as there's a strong religious component that isn't comparable to any other CCIW school.

[Gregory Sager]

it does not seem likely that any school outside of Wheaton has the ability recruit at a level even close as there is no comparable draw, and Wheaton's recruiting is really an outlier as there's a strong religious component that isn't comparable to any other CCIW school.

... and let's just say that there are issues there as well. Wheaton's not the same school it was even in the not-too-distant past when my old buddy (and D3boards regular) the late Dave Lawrenz was on staff there. I'm not so sure that it's the easy sell to parents in the evangelical world that it used to be.

And before USee or any other Wheaton alum raises his hackles, let me point out that the other CCIW school with a strong religious component -- North Park -- isn't the same school it was, either. Last weekend being Homecoming reminded me of how common a topic that is among my fellow alumni, especially those that identify as "NPC alumni" rather than "NPU alumni" (that's an age thing, not a nomenclature thing; nobody complains about the Park being a university anymore).

Change is inevitable in life. Some of it is good; some of it is bad; some of it is a mixed bag. For more information, consult your alma mater's admissions department.

[GusD]

A sometimes overlooked or at least diminished aspect of athletic success is administrative support. Specifically, in the case of NCC football, past president Hal Wilde greatly helped kick start team success by bringing former head coach John Thorne aboard in 2002. And John of course brought son Jeff, who succeeded him, with him. He also hired current coach Brad Spencer in 2004. When Dr. Wilde was being interviewed for his position he requested the opportunity to go for a run with the legendary Al Carius. During his tenure he secured funding for the construction of Benedetti-Wehrli Stadium, Zimmerman Baseball Stadium, and the (400 bed)Residence Hall/(91,000 sq-ft)Recreation Center, and expanded the athletic department with the addition of women's soccer, golf, and lacrosse. Wilde was a frequent presence on the sidelines and in the stands to watch the Cardinals compete throughout his presidency and into retirement. Subsequent top Administration has also been largely supportive of athletics as part of the overall student experience.

Also greatly responsible for NC's success on the gridiron is Athletic Director Jim Miller. Miller is a NCC lifer who assumed his position in 2005. He was a football captain during his playing days and has been an integral part of establishing a winning culture within the football program. Miller hired Brad Spencer as head coach in 2022 following Spencer's 6 year run as OC.

[Augie6]

Wait a minute. You went to Augie and I had to build a case for Augie finishing over IWU?
What is it with you Augie guys underestimating Augie? In the beginning of the season they are predicting 4-6 and they are going 4-1 this weekend.

You have to understand that '80s Augustana football alumni regard themselves as the Roman legionaries who carried the eagle standard into every conquered town when the Roman Empire ruled the world ... and now it's the Middle Ages. Rome has fallen. The barbarians won. The d3 football world has turned into a great big dismal heap of disease, starvation, putrescence, random cruelty, and petty bickering among small men. And Rome itself? Alas, the she-wolf suckles no more heroes-to-be. Mother Rome is a shabby heap of broken stone where ragged peasants haul off one piece of cracked ancient marble after another to form rude shelters.

Some people call it the Middle Ages, and some people call it the Dark Ages, and you see that some people are not like some other people, but those some other people have a reason for their glass-half-empty view of things. You and I look at Steve Bell's 2025 team and we see a pretty good CCIW outfit that has a realistic shot at a top-three finish. The old Augie alumni look at it and see mice nesting in the ruins of Bob Reade's temple.

Hey Greg - I enjoyed reading your thoughts on this NC/Augie discussion and your comments above really do a good job of reflecting what a lot of Augie alums feel about the program today and describing it in a way that most people could not do.  Even if Augie ends up with a winning record this season, 6-4 isn't making any of the 80's Augie alums happy.  Coach Bell's record since he took over at Augie for the 2015 season is 41-53 with 2 seasons with a winning record.  Excluding the 2020 COVID season, he has finished 5th or worse in the conference 8 of 9 seasons.

The sad thing is that despite not challenging for a National Championship every year, Augie was very competitive until the Bob Reade connection was fully cut when Coach Barnes was let go after the 2010 season. Coach Schmulbach (an assistant on all of the Championship teams) followed after Coach Reade's retirement and Coach Barnes played for Coach Reade during his first 2 seasons at Augie.  At that point in time, Augie had gone from 1979 through 2010 with never having a losing record with the worst being a 5-5 season in 2007.  Since then, they have had 11 seasons at 500 or below. So are we excited about the potential to go 6-4? Not even remotely.

[Nate Riley]

A sometimes overlooked or at least diminished aspect of athletic success is administrative support. Specifically, in the case of NCC football, past president Hal Wilde greatly helped kick start team success by bringing former head coach John Thorne aboard in 2002. And John of course brought son Jeff, who succeeded him, with him. He also hired current coach Brad Spencer in 2004. When Dr. Wilde was being interviewed for his position he requested the opportunity to go for a run with the legendary Al Carius. During his tenure he secured funding for the construction of Benedetti-Wehrli Stadium, Zimmerman Baseball Stadium, and the (400 bed)Residence Hall/(91,000 sq-ft)Recreation Center, and expanded the athletic department with the addition of women's soccer, golf, and lacrosse. Wilde was a frequent presence on the sidelines and in the stands to watch the Cardinals compete throughout his presidency and into retirement. Subsequent top Administration has also been largely supportive of athletics as part of the overall student experience.

Also greatly responsible for NC's success on the gridiron is Athletic Director Jim Miller. Miller is a NCC lifer who assumed his position in 2005. He was a football captain during his playing days and has been an integral part of establishing a winning culture within the football program. Miller hired Brad Spencer as head coach in 2022 following Spencer's 6 year run as OC.

Gus, Jim is one of the best to ever do it. NCC has been extremely fortunate with ADs over the last 35 years...
From Al Carius to Walter Johnson to Jim Miller. Success breeding success.

[Nate Riley]

it does not seem likely that any school outside of Wheaton has the ability recruit at a level even close as there is no comparable draw, and Wheaton's recruiting is really an outlier as there's a strong religious component that isn't comparable to any other CCIW school.

... and let's just say that there are issues there as well. Wheaton's not the same school it was even in the not-too-distant past when my old buddy (and D3boards regular) the late Dave Lawrenz was on staff there. I'm not so sure that it's the easy sell to parents in the evangelical world that it used to be.

And before USee or any other Wheaton alum raises his hackles, let me point out that the other CCIW school with a strong religious component -- North Park -- isn't the same school it was, either. Last weekend being Homecoming reminded me of how common a topic that is among my fellow alumni, especially those that identify as "NPC alumni" rather than "NPU alumni" (that's an age thing, not a nomenclature thing; nobody complains about the Park being a university anymore).

Change is inevitable in life. Some of it is good; some of it is bad; some of it is a mixed bag. For more information, consult your alma mater's admissions department.

Greg, tremendous read. Thanks for your comparative perspective.

[CarollFan]

https://cciw.org/news/2025/10/9/cciw-football-notebook-oct-9-2025.aspx


Wheaton @ IWU preview includes game notes.
IWU pointing out their defensive performance.

https://www.iwusports.com/news/2025/10/8/football-titans-tilt-with-thunder-headlines-homecoming.aspx

[USee]

.
IWU pointing out their defensive performance.

yikes. 42 pts and 423 yds rushing vs WashU last Saturday. Yet they are 3rd in 8 categories in the CCIW. Hmmmm.

[Jbothe]

Wait a minute. You went to Augie and I had to build a case for Augie finishing over IWU?
What is it with you Augie guys underestimating Augie? In the beginning of the season they are predicting 4-6 and they are going 4-1 this weekend.

You have to understand that '80s Augustana football alumni regard themselves as the Roman legionaries who carried the eagle standard into every conquered town when the Roman Empire ruled the world ... and now it's the Middle Ages. Rome has fallen. The barbarians won. The d3 football world has turned into a great big dismal heap of disease, starvation, putrescence, random cruelty, and petty bickering among small men. And Rome itself? Alas, the she-wolf suckles no more heroes-to-be. Mother Rome is a shabby heap of broken stone where ragged peasants haul off one piece of cracked ancient marble after another to form rude shelters.

Some people call it the Middle Ages, and some people call it the Dark Ages, and you see that some people are not like some other people, but those some other people have a reason for their glass-half-empty view of things. You and I look at Steve Bell's 2025 team and we see a pretty good CCIW outfit that has a realistic shot at a top-three finish. The old Augie alumni look at it and see mice nesting in the ruins of Bob Reade's temple.

HAHAHAHA. I think this is a little far fetched...

I wish Augie the best every year.  I really like Steve Bell and the staff that I have met.  The players work really hard and I hope they are having a great experience.

I think there is a perception that once you play at a school you are forever bonded to each week's result. 

In reality the average alumni moves on and their child's school of choice becomes their favorite.

Our three children have/are currently attending D3 schools other than Augustana.  Two of them CCIW schools (counting WashU).  I spend way more time watching their schools and teams than anyone else and I would guess a lot of other alums do also.

[Cardinal773]

I spend way more time watching their schools and teams than anyone else and I would guess a lot of other alums do also.

If that's the case, I hope my kid doesn't go to IWU.  I... I don't know what I would do.  The idea of it is just...

[GusD]

I spend way more time watching their schools and teams than anyone else and I would guess a lot of other alums do also.

If that's the case, I hope my kid doesn't go to IWU.  I... I don't know what I would do.  The idea of it is just...

Let me guess, 773. Could the answer possibly be......🤮 ?



....

[GusD]

Don't know how common this is in the CCIW or any other conference around the country for that matter, but after North Central's big win over Wheaton Sat night they put on a pretty darn nice fireworks display. 💥 💫 ✨

[ncc_fan]

Don't know how common this is in the CCIW or any other conference around the country for that matter, but after North Central's big win over Wheaton Sat night they put on a pretty darn nice fireworks display. 💥 💫 ✨

Regarding the postgame festivities... I'm just relieved NCC was victorious. That postgame light show & fireworks would have felt wrong after a loss!

[Gregory Sager]

I spend way more time watching their schools and teams than anyone else and I would guess a lot of other alums do also.

If that's the case, I hope my kid doesn't go to IWU.  I... I don't know what I would do.  The idea of it is just...

That's a common feeling around the league. I've heard it expressed by representatives of a number of different CCIW schools and their fan bases, across several sports over the years. IWU just seems to be the love-'em-or-hate-'em outfit of this league.

I honestly don't think that for the most part it's because of Titans student-athletes, nor is it the coaches (especially now that Norm Eash has retired; IWU coaches such as Mia Smith, Ron Rose, and Kim Nelson-Brown actually seem to be pretty well-respected by everyone around the league) that evoke such acrimony. And it's not envy, because Augustana used to be the CCIW school that won the most across all sports and now it's North Central. I think it's a fan-base thing. That's my impression, at least.

[CarollFan]

I spend way more time watching their schools and teams than anyone else and I would guess a lot of other alums do also.

If that's the case, I hope my kid doesn't go to IWU.  I... I don't know what I would do.  The idea of it is just...

That's a common feeling around the league. I've heard it expressed by representatives of a number of different CCIW schools and their fan bases, across several sports over the years. IWU just seems to be the love-'em-or-hate-'em outfit of this league.

I honestly don't think that for the most part it's because of Titans student-athletes, nor is it the coaches (especially now that Norm Eash has retired; IWU coaches such as Mia Smith, Ron Rose, and Kim Nelson-Brown actually seem to be pretty well-respected by everyone around the league) that evoke such acrimony. And it's not envy, because Augustana used to be the CCIW school that won the most across all sports and now it's North Central. I think it's a fan-base thing. That's my impression, at least.

I never had a problem with IWU fans.
At Carroll they don't have separate visitor stands.
One year the IWU fans were so nice they introduced me to cow bells.
Then they spent 3 hours showing me how they work.