NCAC NE's Top 15
1) Kenyon (last chance for senior class w/ 2 Sweet 16s and Elite 8; 37-4-3 last 2 years)
2) Amherst (will be tough to knock out especially by November)
3) Loras (among big teams with some rebuild I like Rothert to keep the machine rolling)
4) Oneonta St (major losses but still don't see who is going to stand in their way)
5) Wheaton (Ill) (another team that will handle losses well and reload)
6) Middlebury (deserve high expectations and we'll see if they can finally deliver)
7) Rowan (basically everyone back from stellar season)
8) Montclair St (not so fast, Rowan)
9) Lycoming (huge expectations which could be too much to handle)
10) Haverford (3 key graduations will take some time to overcome)
11) Chicago (watch out for the Maroons)
12) Brandeis (not ready to let go of hard-earned national prominence)
13) Redlands (just a hunch)
14) UW-W (6'8 Stanko didn't graduate)
15) Wash U (West did graduate but he's still there anyway as eligible grad student)
Knocking hard on the door, aka RV -- SLU, Salisbury, Messiah, Macalester, W&L, Trinity (TX), Tex-Dallas, Tufts, F&M, Gordon, OWU, DePauw, Calvin, Colorado, Pac Lutheran, Eastern
New England
I see Amherst, Middlebury, Brandeis and Tufts as the powerhouses with a full-returning Gordon squad as one to watch. Curious about Williams, Wesleyan, Conn Coll and Bowdoin, as well as who will emerge out of the NEWMAC where there doesn't seem to be an obvious clear favorite. UMass-Boston will have flair but we'll see if substance is there in the end.
East
Will another SUNYAC team challenge Oneonta? I doubt it. SLU will be right there as always. No clue who will shine in the Liberty League beyond SLU but don't see another strong national contender there. Will be interested to see if Rochester rebounds and Stevens usually seems to be in the mix.
Mid-Atlantic
My guess is that Messiah reasserts dominance over the Lycoming juggernaut. I'm sure F&M will contend but don't know if the Dips will be as strong as the past few years. Huge year for the Haverford program of course. I'm leaning towards Dickinson having an off year. Will Eastern and/or E-town prove to be threats?
South Atlantic
I'd really like to see an extra ODAC team get a Pool C and possibly go deep, or a Greensboro. W&L should continue building program momentum. The crystal ball is predicting a down campaign for Christopher Newport. Can Salisbury advance to a Sweet 16? The NJAC will be the usual dogfight with Rowan and Montclair having titanic encounters. I've got no read on whether Emory or Centre might have a good season. Is there a hidden gem out there, like a Birm-Southern or NC Wesleyan?
Great Lakes
Kenyon on paper at least is a clear favorite. OWU may or may not have growing pains, as their schedule looks pretty forgiving (not expecting Calvin to be like last year's version and Roy Rike won't be an easy first visit for W&L), but they'll be formidable for crunch time. Thomas More should remain competitive but I'm not expecting them to present the threat posed the last two seasons. Is a team like Grove City poised to emerge? The OAC should be very competitive at the top end with John Carroll, Ohio Northern and Capital. As noted elsewhere, even though CWRU is a program to watch over the next several years I don't see how they can prevail this year with such a brutal schedule especially losing Cvecko. Carnegie Mellon is a better UAA bet in Great Lakes.
Central
Calvin should again dominate their league but I don't see a repeat of last year's near perfection. I would favor Wheaton, Chicago and Wash U over the Knights. I don't know this region well enough to suggest a surprise squad.
North
Loras should be King again. The early schedule doesn't look that tough by Loras standards, which will give Rothert time to figure out who will step into roles opened up by graduation. Alex Bradley could be a national POY candidate. Macalester and UW-W should match or exceed their fine seasons last year. Last year's tourney surprise St. Olaf suffered major losses to graduation.
West
I wouldn't bet the house on Trinity (TX) being as dominant, but then again, they always seem to finish in the top 10 nationally. I expect a dip at Whitworth but certainly the Pirates will have a good shot to defend their conference crown with few true challengers. We'll see if Pac Lutheran can be a threat again. I'm loving Redlands, and I've got an eye on Texas-Dallas, Texas-Tyler and of course Colorado College.
Loras should be King again. The early schedule doesn't look that tough by Loras standards, which will give Rothert time to figure out who will step into roles opened up by graduation. Alex Bradley could be a national POY candidate. Macalester and UW-W should match or exceed their fine seasons last year. Last year's tourney surprise St. Olaf suffered major losses to graduation.
I'll probably get roasted for this, but I know for a first hand fact of one game that Loras usually has on their schedule and asked for again this year was declined because the opposing coach said (paraphrasing) "We don't have the talent this year and wouldn't be competitive". Good news is that team did beat a team from Texas 3-2 last night so they are doing pretty well.
Love ya Kickin, always keeping it real.
Loras' toughest games appear to be Carthage, UWW, and maybe St John's? And perhaps a revitalized Wartburg?
I checked into Wheaton's live stats and saw a lot of familiar names. No tears needed for the Thunder. In fairness, their first 6 opponents all appear decent to very good.
Can we get a refresh on the D3 scoreboard? Stops at 4:00 games today and have to scroll thru from Thursday action.
Good video at Rowan where Profs up 1-0 on W&L 1st half.
Quote from: NCAC New England on September 02, 2016, 04:48:28 PM
Love ya Kickin, always keeping it real.
Loras' toughest games appear to be Carthage, UWW, and maybe St John's? And perhaps a revitalized Wartburg?
I checked into Wheaton's live stats and saw a lot of familiar names. No tears needed for the Thunder. In fairness, their first 6 opponents all appear decent to very good.
I guess he thought 6-0 is better than 5-1 ;D
I guess he thought 6-0 is better than 5-1 ;D
[/quote]
Or 4-2.
Calvin-OWU a good, high quality game. OWU wins 2-0 (2-1, Calvin goal, actually a nice goal with 1 sec left). Could have been a draw or 1-0 either way. Thought Calvin thoroughly dominated first half and OWU must have gotten a talking to. OWU much better and probably better for the half than Calvin, although half-chances both ways. OWU scored on a nice but long free kick that Calvin GK probably misplayed by coming out and then OWU was gifted with a very unforced handball for PK (right call but bad error for Calvin). I was wrong about Calvin. They look very, very good again and easily in the Sweet 16 to Elite 8 range. OWU is very talented and the frosh are impressive (in numbers and impact). They stayed in the game long enough to become competitive in it, and then they looked like equal competitors with an excellent team after the first half. Will be interesting to see how chemistry issues evolve with so many freshmen having large roles.
Kudos to Rowan, E'town and Chicago for great starts. Messiah had a good road trip despite the draw. Looking forward to Haverford-Brandeis.
Quote from: NCAC New England on September 03, 2016, 09:22:51 PMKudos to Rowan, E'town and Chicago for great starts. Messiah had a good road trip despite the draw. Looking forward to Haverford-Brandeis.
Also of note is Carthage's 3-0 Eastern road trip, with come-from-behind wins against Endicott (won going away in the second half) and Gordon (won in 2OT). Ditto on Haverford-Brandeis!
Carthage goes 3-0 back to back to back. CCNY, Endicott, Gordon. All while scoring 12 goals in 3 games. I may be biased but it is never easy to play 3 days in a row. Congrats
Quote from: Ommadawn on September 03, 2016, 09:32:50 PM
Quote from: NCAC New England on September 03, 2016, 09:22:51 PMKudos to Rowan, E'town and Chicago for great starts. Messiah had a good road trip despite the draw. Looking forward to Haverford-Brandeis.
Also of note is Carthage's 3-0 Eastern road trip, with come-from-behind wins against Endicott (won going away in the second half) and Gordon (won in 2OT). Ditto on Haverford-Brandeis!
Ype, just saw that. Big for Carthage.
Emory and Texas-Tyler locked up in a shootout 4-4 going into 2nd OT. Emory was up 3-0 at half.
Also forgot to mention how good of a player that Vegter kid is.
And Tex-Tyler takes it 5-4 at 104:59. Goal by Tchitembo from Fernandes.
Quote from: NCAC New England on September 03, 2016, 09:22:51 PM
Calvin-OWU a good, high quality game. OWU wins 2-0 (2-1, Calvin goal, actually a nice goal with 1 sec left). Could have been a draw or 1-0 either way. Thought Calvin thoroughly dominated first half and OWU must have gotten a talking to. OWU much better and probably better for the half than Calvin, although half-chances both ways. OWU scored on a nice but long free kick that Calvin GK probably misplayed by coming out and then OWU was gifted with a very unforced handball for PK (right call but bad error for Calvin). I was wrong about Calvin. They look very, very good again and easily in the Sweet 16 to Elite 8 range. OWU is very talented and the frosh are impressive (in numbers and impact). They stayed in the game long enough to become competitive in it, and then they looked like equal competitors with an excellent team after the first half. Will be interesting to see how chemistry issues evolve with so many freshmen having large roles.
Kudos to Rowan, E'town and Chicago for great starts. Messiah had a good road trip despite the draw. Looking forward to Haverford-Brandeis.
At times OWU had 7 freshman on the field in the first half. I left at half but Calvin was the better team: a OWU parent said they are a good collection of players - not yet a team. A fair assessment. They aren't a big team - and they played very direct first half. They held on to, and dribbled too much; they turned into pressure when they had simple and wide open drop balls (play in the direction - anyone, anyone, Buehler?, Buehler?). Jay will fix that.
Calvin - I love Isky. If he gets on the ball that team is dangerous. Mitch Stark didn't get as many opportunities to go at defenders as he did the game before - but they will be fine.
All things considered - I liked Thomas More's potential the best these first three days - Great Lakes perspective. Chicago IS the real deal - not in the Great Lakes but a top 5 team by mid Sept - if not sooner.
Fantastic slate of games to close this first weekend...
Oneonta St-W&L
CWRU-Thomas More
Lycoming-F&M
Rutgers-Newark-Wheaton (MA)
Haverford- Brandeis
Lost amid the onslaught of games Christopher Newport scored a touchdown in first tilt and should roll against Allegheny. MIT got a big road win at Stevens that will come in handy down the line. Macalester and UWW played to a draw with my guy Stanko getting the equalizer. Would love to see Stanko go head to head with Gulley at Wheaton (Ill).
After profiling the Keuka (school and soccer program) I'm interested to see if the Wolves (previously Wolfpack) can hang with a name-brand program like Rochester. Why in the heck would a school like NC State care what a tiny D3 does with its nickname?
Great win for W&L over Oneonta, 3-2. Congrats to the Generals. Didn't watch but must have been good game.
F&m up 2-0 over Lycoming. Big win if they hang on for last 25
Quote from: NCAC New England on September 04, 2016, 01:58:32 PM
Great win for W&L over Oneonta, 3-2. Congrats to the Generals. Didn't watch but must have been good game.
Needed that after the big loss to Rowan.
Quote from: NCAC New England on September 04, 2016, 01:58:32 PM
Great win for W&L over Oneonta, 3-2. Congrats to the Generals. Didn't watch but must have been good game.
WOW!
On the train to Brandeis-Haverford. Station is adjacent to the field and the train gets in five minutes before kick off...love when logistics work out like that. Haverford is looking very dangerous, really looking forward to watching this one regardless of result.
Brandeis beats Haverford 1-0. Haverford could've had a PK in the first minute but no call. The ref made up for it with one of the worst refereeing displays I've ever seen - I don't usually complain about the officiating, and it may well be my blue-tinted glasses, but he was objectively bad, and the linesmen were equally complicit. Anyway, Haverford started better, Brandeis grew into the game and scored toward the end of the first half through a good break by Miskin. Haverford threatened intermittently through the second half but the Brandeis D held strong despite double-digit corner kicks from the Fords. First half featured good attacking talent from both sides, while the second was more defensive. All in all, a very good game that lived up to billing.
Watched Brandeis-Haverford on video. Looked like choppy, physical action with minimal flow. Competitiveness reminded me of recent Brandeis-Tufts games. Shots pretty even but Haverford with whopping 15-1 advantage in corners. Dangerous to let Corkery get that many whacks but he never got in range for one of his signature free kicks.
My Kenyon Lords are off to an underwhelming start, to put it mildly. 3 goals -- 2 Myers headers and a PK -- in 2 games against....Otterbein... and a Heidelberg squad with another new coach who Oberlin handled with ease before Oberlin got blown out by Ohio Northern. Not good. Not good when a centerback is your best offensive threat, as he was when the Lords had trouble scoring in the NCAA tournament last year. Kenyon barely got past Westminster in the 1st round (on a Myers header), were lucky to get past Chicago in PKs, needed Myers late versus Tufts, and then went scoreless against Calvin. Something not right early on this season. Either chemistry with new faces, believing your own hype so much you think you can just roll the ball out there and win 6-0, or stubbornness about who you've predicted to be superstars so you just keep acting like it's true game after game and season after season. I'm sure Heidelberg was physical and disrupted the Lords from getting into much flow, but all of the alleged super-dynamic offensive players generated hardly any good or clean chances against a team that will struggle to get to 5 wins. This also wasn't a 1-0 game where shots were 30 to 5. Heidelberg had some good chances and actually had 1 more shot overall. Kenyon drops like a stone right out of my top 15.
Am I reading that correctly . . . Rhode Island 2, Montclair St. 0 ! ! ! WOW! Is that the leading candidate for the biggest upset of the opening weekend?
Knox beating Gustavus Adolphus also a surprise.
Quote from: NCAC New England on September 04, 2016, 06:38:15 PM
My Kenyon Lords are off to an underwhelming start, to put it mildly. 3 goals -- 2 Myers headers and a PK -- in 2 games against....Otterbein... and a Heidelberg squad with another new coach who Oberlin handled with ease before Oberlin got blown out by Ohio Northern. Not good. Not good when a centerback is your best offensive threat, as he was when the Lords had trouble scoring in the NCAA tournament last year. Kenyon barely got past Westminster in the 1st round (on a Myers header), were lucky to get past Chicago in PKs, needed Myers late versus Tufts, and then went scoreless against Calvin. Something not right early on this season. Either chemistry with new faces, believing your own hype so much you think you can just roll the ball out there and win 6-0, or stubbornness about who you've predicted to be superstars so you just keep acting like it's true game after game and season after season. I'm sure Heidelberg was physical and disrupted the Lords from getting into much flow, but all of the alleged super-dynamic offensive players generated hardly any good or clean chances against a team that will struggle to get to 5 wins. This also wasn't a 1-0 game where shots were 30 to 5. Heidelberg had some good chances and actually had 1 more shot overall. Kenyon drops like a stone right out of my top 15.
I agree completely with this. One of my sleeper picks Chicago has looked fantastic thus far and my championship pick Kenyon has looked very subpar. That being said, I think you're overreacting a bit. The performances have been poor but at the end of the day they're 2-0. And the point you're making about Myers actually if anything should be a feather in their cap. The fact that they can have very off days offensively and still pull wins out because of the offensive prowess of their center back can only be a good thing. We all know on his day that Amolo is one of the top 3, if not the best striker in D3. He appears to be in a funk, as does the rest of the offense and midfield. There's no doubt the talent is there and the chemistry shouldn't be an issue either because Kenyon only graduated 1 player from the roster last year. That really only leaves some kind of mental issues the team is having. I agree with you that they likely have some sort of elitist attitude at the moment where they think they can just show up and win 5-0. They're likely overlooking games against these weaker teams and it could cost them if they don't watch out. I'm hesitant but I'm not going to pull the plug on picking them just yet. If they start to lose games or play poorly against the big teams (TMU, Case, DePauw), then I may have to reconsider.
Midwest Grinder, no worries. I expect a lot out of this team. Still do. I've promoted the Lords as much as I can over the last 3-4 years. Gotta be Kenyon's biggest fan, and love the college even more.
Quote from: MidwestGrinder on September 04, 2016, 07:16:07 PM
Quote from: NCAC New England on September 04, 2016, 06:38:15 PM
My Kenyon Lords are off to an underwhelming start, to put it mildly. 3 goals -- 2 Myers headers and a PK -- in 2 games against....Otterbein... and a Heidelberg squad with another new coach who Oberlin handled with ease before Oberlin got blown out by Ohio Northern. Not good. Not good when a centerback is your best offensive threat, as he was when the Lords had trouble scoring in the NCAA tournament last year. Kenyon barely got past Westminster in the 1st round (on a Myers header), were lucky to get past Chicago in PKs, needed Myers late versus Tufts, and then went scoreless against Calvin. Something not right early on this season. Either chemistry with new faces, believing your own hype so much you think you can just roll the ball out there and win 6-0, or stubbornness about who you've predicted to be superstars so you just keep acting like it's true game after game and season after season. I'm sure Heidelberg was physical and disrupted the Lords from getting into much flow, but all of the alleged super-dynamic offensive players generated hardly any good or clean chances against a team that will struggle to get to 5 wins. This also wasn't a 1-0 game where shots were 30 to 5. Heidelberg had some good chances and actually had 1 more shot overall. Kenyon drops like a stone right out of my top 15.
I agree completely with this. One of my sleeper picks Chicago has looked fantastic thus far and my championship pick Kenyon has looked very subpar. That being said, I think you're overreacting a bit. The performances have been poor but at the end of the day they're 2-0. And the point you're making about Myers actually if anything should be a feather in their cap. The fact that they can have very off days offensively and still pull wins out because of the offensive prowess of their center back can only be a good thing. We all know on his day that Amolo is one of the top 3, if not the best striker in D3. He appears to be in a funk, as does the rest of the offense and midfield. There's no doubt the talent is there and the chemistry shouldn't be an issue either because Kenyon only graduated 1 player from the roster last year. That really only leaves some kind of mental issues the team is having. I agree with you that they likely have some sort of elitist attitude at the moment where they think they can just show up and win 5-0. They're likely overlooking games against these weaker teams and it could cost them if they don't watch out. I'm hesitant but I'm not going to pull the plug on picking them just yet. If they start to lose games or play poorly against the big teams (TMU, Case, DePauw), then I may have to reconsider.
NCAC - see if you can't get some inside skinny from your son - if he's still connected to current players. There are subtle incidents - petulance - Amolo throwing his shin guards after a second half sub-out at Otterbein, gestures by players at others who may have not passed the ball or misplayed it.
Kenyon, as with all major programs, are going to get the "best effort" from teams they play. And not only is a win a win, a road win is a road win!
Not sure what to make of this first week of games in the Great Lakes. Parity? Everyone sorting through new line-ups? Going to need results from another week or two . . .
Domino, LOL. I have more inside scoop on the program than my son does at this point. I have to tell him what's going on. And if I did have inside info I sure wouldn't share it here. I certainly am not worried about Amolo. He's my guy and he'll be fine. I do think it takes talent and leadership within a team to handle a bunch of talented kids where there can be such a fine line between who plays and who doesn't and how much and who starts and all of that. Of course not playing at all sucks. But also being in the mix (and a parent of a kid in the mix) can always leave you wanting more and/or thinking you deserve more. Assessments and decisions are always going to be something that a good portion of team rosters have to deal with. I'm curious about the ingredients that go into coaches handling that stuff the best. I definitely have some ideas about this which maybe I'll write about down the road, but one thing that I think is critical is symmetry between the role and style of coaching and the mission/identity of the college in general.
Montclair St loses and NJCU already surpasses 2014 and 2015 win total in the first weekend; 3-0 with shutout wins over Baruch, Yeshiva and SUNY Purchase.
Babson falls to Willy P.
Rowan should be #3 when polls come out... A win over Oneonta St and you have your #2 until Amherst falls...
Quote from: Flying Weasel on September 04, 2016, 07:05:20 PM
Am I reading that correctly . . . Rhode Island 2, Montclair St. 0 ! ! ! WOW! Is that the leading candidate for the biggest upset of the opening weekend?
Knox beating Gustavus Adolphus also a surprise.
1 of 2 things happened.
1. MSU is not quite as good as last year. This I have no idea but I doubt. Usually they re-load.
or
2. Like I talked about in an earlier post that it was a 11am start and they prob trotted on the field and just thought they could show up.
I did not see the game or stats but maybe RIC is a decent side this year. They do have decent sides every 4-5 years.
Best part of all this....2015 National Champion Amherst opens up this week at RIC....
Rhode Island College has already lost to Clark 0-2. Clark may be slightly better than last year, but they are always one of the weaker sides in the NEWMAC. Either the Clark game was an aberration or Montclair St was.
Grove City College (PAC) quietly starts their season 2-0, scoring 8 goals and allowing 0. Head Coach Mike Dreves earned his 100th win for the Wolverines!
Quote from: Mr.Right on September 05, 2016, 07:25:01 AM
Quote from: Flying Weasel on September 04, 2016, 07:05:20 PM
Am I reading that correctly . . . Rhode Island 2, Montclair St. 0 ! ! ! WOW! Is that the leading candidate for the biggest upset of the opening weekend?
Knox beating Gustavus Adolphus also a surprise.
1 of 2 things happened.
1. MSU is not quite as good as last year. This I have no idea but I doubt. Usually they re-load.
or
2. Like I talked about in an earlier post that it was a 11am start and they prob trotted on the field and just thought they could show up.
I did not see the game or stats but maybe RIC is a decent side this year. They do have decent sides every 4-5 years.
Best part of all this....2015 National Champion Amherst opens up this week at RIC....
Box score and recap shows what actually happened.
MSU outshot RIC 19-7. Corners were 11-0 is favor of MSU. That looks like MSU showed up to play.
RIC scored on a ball played from the right side of the "endline" that somehow found the far left post and went in the net. RIC's second goal was a PK. MSU pressed hard and dominated the game stats but just could not find the net.
Quote from: D3soccerwatcher on September 05, 2016, 03:38:25 PM
Quote from: Mr.Right on September 05, 2016, 07:25:01 AM
Quote from: Flying Weasel on September 04, 2016, 07:05:20 PM
Am I reading that correctly . . . Rhode Island 2, Montclair St. 0 ! ! ! WOW! Is that the leading candidate for the biggest upset of the opening weekend?
Knox beating Gustavus Adolphus also a surprise.
1 of 2 things happened.
1. MSU is not quite as good as last year. This I have no idea but I doubt. Usually they re-load.
or
2. Like I talked about in an earlier post that it was a 11am start and they prob trotted on the field and just thought they could show up.
I did not see the game or stats but maybe RIC is a decent side this year. They do have decent sides every 4-5 years.
Best part of all this....2015 National Champion Amherst opens up this week at RIC....
Box score and recap shows what actually happened.
MSU outshot RIC 19-7. Corners were 11-0 is favor of MSU. That looks like MSU showed up to play.
RIC scored on a ball played from the right side of the "endline" that somehow found the far left post and went in the net. RIC's second goal was a PK. MSU pressed hard and dominated the game stats but just could not find the net.
And yet RIC won 2-0.....I say MSU DID NOT COME TO PLAY and I do not need to read a recap or boxscore to tell me that. Shots and SOG are never that accurate. Corners are accurate but I would guess Haverford had 15 corners to Brandeis 1 and they did not DOMINATE Brandeis....
NCAC NE's Top 15 (post-Labor Day Weekend Edition)
1) Rowan (results matter and the Profs had great results versus strong competition)
2) Amherst (not a fan of #1 from last season until you lose theory but clearly a contender for #1 nonetheless)
3) Loras (program is a machine...and ALWAYS come to play)
4) Chicago (sleeper role didn't last for long)
5) Kenyon (guessing here...and hopeful? and some other big teams already have losses)
6) Middlebury
7) Christopher Newport (early impressive results suggest I underestimated the Captains)
8) Brandeis (good and very good wins although left wondering how high the ceiling is as Judges seem to squeeze the most they can out of their ability)
9) Haverford (Brandeis game a good experience for a very good team still adjusting to roster changes from last year)
10) Franklin & Marshall (another team I maybe underestimated off to a great start)
11) OWU (they're going to be very good and frosh look like they expect a national title in first year)
12) Calvin (almost put the Knights ahead of OWU even though they lost...very good again and will coast through most of the season until run into an OWU or Kenyon down the road)
13) Trinity (TX) (I checked what RH wrote about 10 starters back and indeed the preseason review says the same...BUT...my research revealed 8 seniors graduating and 4-5 starters gone from the lineup that faced Amherst in Elite 8, so something is amiss or being calculated generously)
14) Macalester (2-0-1, with draw away at UWW and good win at home this afternoon against Wartburg)
15) Messiah (yes, Messiah -- considered E'town and Thomas More here but hard to go wrong picking the Falcons)
15A) Carthage (3-0 with very solid wins away in New England)
Some big names dropped out -- Oneonta, Montclair, Wheaton (Ill), Lycoming -- and we know at least some of them will be there in November. Waiting to see a little more sample size from SLU. Wheaton (MA) would be in the discussion if not for an opening day setback against Wentworth, coming back to beat two NJAC foes that handled Babson. W&L proved they are a good team and another to watch. Also in wait and see mode on Salisbury, Cortland, Rochester, MIT, Whitworth and Ohio Northern. Anxious to see Tufts and more from Wash U. UMass-Boston just snuck by Thomas in double OT...intrigued but not sold.
Oneonta St experiencing the loss of some valuable seniors. The EAST should be wide open for another team to step up...
The way Carthage (last season's CCIW Tournament Champ) exerted their mid-western CCIW will and grit in New England this past weekend, I think they could potentially go higher.
http://www.masseyratings.com/rate.php?s=csoc2016&sub=11620
When do the NSCAA and D3Soccer week one rankings come out?
Quote from: SuperSub15 on September 06, 2016, 10:02:05 AM
When do the NSCAA and D3Soccer week one rankings come out?
Usually Tues/Wed each week. All depends.
Knowing the NSCAA, I'd say...
1. Amherst
2. Loras
3. Rowan (I'd say 2nd in D3soccer)
4. Trinity
5. F&M
6. SLU
7. Kenyon
8. Chicago
9. Brandeis (I'd say 4th in D3soccer)
10. OWU
11. E-town
12. CNU
13. Whitworth
14. Carthage
15. Rochester
16. Macalester
------------------------
17. Messiah
NE: Amherst, Brandeis, MIT, MA Boston
North: Loras, Macalester, St. Thomas
South Atlantic: Rowan, CNU, Salisbury, York
West: Trinity, Whitworth, Claremont MS
Mid Atlantic: F&M, Etown, Messiah, Haverford
East: SLU, Rochester, Cortland St
Great Lakes: Kenyon, OWU, Thomas More, ONU
Central: Chicago, Carthage, North Park, Calvin
Quote from: lastguyoffthebench on September 07, 2016, 12:03:25 PM
NE: Amherst, Brandeis, MIT, MA Boston
NE: Amherst, Brandeis,
MIT, MA Boston, Middlebury
MIT lost a ton of talent (4 starters including two best offensive players) from a team that was not all that deep last year. Unless they have an exceptional Fr class, they do not belong on this list. NEWMAC coaches picked MIT 4th for this season.
Quote from: lastguyoffthebench on September 07, 2016, 12:03:25 PM
NE: Amherst, Brandeis, MIT, MA Boston
North: Loras, Macalester, St. Thomas
South Atlantic: Rowan, CNU, Salisbury, York
West: Trinity, Whitworth, Claremont MS
Mid Atlantic: F&M, Etown, Messiah, Haverford
East: SLU, Rochester, Cortland St
Great Lakes: Kenyon, OWU, Thomas More, ONU
Central: Chicago, Carthage, North Park, Calvin
Would add tufts and Middlebury to NE
Quote from: Off Pitch on September 07, 2016, 12:29:24 PM
Quote from: lastguyoffthebench on September 07, 2016, 12:03:25 PM
NE: Amherst, Brandeis, MIT, MA Boston
NE: Amherst, Brandeis, MIT, MA Boston, Middlebury
MIT lost a ton of talent (4 starters including two best offensive players) from a team that was not all that deep last year. Unless they have an exceptional Fr class, they do not belong on this list. NEWMAC coaches picked MIT 4th for this season.
Those weren't lastguy's picks but rather his predictions of what the NSCAA will do in their poll, which are largely based off of how teams finished last year.
Quote from: lastguyoffthebench on September 07, 2016, 12:03:25 PM
NE: Amherst, Brandeis, MIT, MA Boston
North: Loras, Macalester, St. Thomas
South Atlantic: Rowan, CNU, Salisbury, York
West: Trinity, Whitworth, Claremont MS
Mid Atlantic: F&M, Etown, Messiah, Haverford
East: SLU, Rochester, Cortland St
Great Lakes: Kenyon, OWU, Thomas More, ONU
Central: Chicago, Carthage, North Park, Calvin
You should see Scranton ahead of Etown, Messiah and Haverford. 2-0 with wins over Cabrini and Gettysburg and 2 shutouts...most impressive start from any team in this region.
OK, so maybe Amherst IS #1....on merit. A very deep, very talented roster. When you stop and think that they could have won 1 or 2 more national title over the past 5-7 years with just a little good fortune, the makings of a dynasty are not out of the question. Perhaps there is a new Sheriff in town.
And Christopher Newport continues the goal-scoring assault, up 3-0 on NC Wesleyan at the half.
I originally had Scranton ahead of Haverford, but I cannot bump them to 5th in the Mid-Atlantic with a 1-0 road loss to Brandeis. No chance Scranton is ahead of Etown... Yetttt.
Just noticed Whitworth splurging and coming to the East coast to play 1/3 of the NJAC in 4 days. This is a perfect example of how when the committee eliminated the in region record / out of region record primary and secondary criteria and combined it as just primary criteria you started to see more teams from different regions and over 500 miles apart start to play. Can only help recruiting and good for the fans as well.
9/10 at Rutgers-Newark
9/11 at TCNJ
9/13 at Montclair State
The first d3soccer rankings of the season (http://www.d3soccer.com/top25/top25-wk1) are out.
# School (1PV) Record Pts. Prev.
1 Amherst (15) D.N.P. 976 —
2 Brandeis (1) 2-0-0 867 —
3 Kenyon (1) 2-0-0 842 —
4 Loras 2-0-0 834 —
5 Trinity (Texas) 2-0-0 773 —
6 Rowan (2) 3-0-0 768 —
7 F&M 2-0-0 724 —
8 Ohio Wesleyan 2-0-0 706 —
9 Chicago 2-0-0 539 —
10 St. Lawrence 2-0-0 537 —
Brockport St sitting at 0-2 with Camden and Kean on the menu...
Dickinson sitting at 0-1-1 with Oneonta St and RPI next.
Eastern vs Lyco on Saturday...
I don't see NSCAA releasing rankings this week... I believe it was always on Tuesday afternoons around 1:00PM.
Quote from: lastguyoffthebench on September 07, 2016, 08:19:24 PM
I originally had Scranton ahead of Haverford, but I cannot bump them to 5th in the Mid-Atlantic with a 1-0 road loss to Brandeis. No chance Scranton is ahead of Etown... Yetttt.
Scranton sitting at 3-0, preseason favorites ahead of Etown in the Landmark, 3 shutouts, 2015 NCAA tournament team, beat Etown in the final last season....hard to not put them ahead of Etown in my opinion. This is the classic "well Etown was good back in the 90's so they must be good now" argument. Same with Messiah this year and last. Anybody who has watched Messiah in the last 5 or 10 years knows this team and last season's team is nowhere near the standard or dominance of previous teams yet spectators still believe they will win the national title. Everyone can have their opinion but please be some what realistic. My vote right now would go towards Scranton at this moment in time LastGuy. Etown has had a very strong start as well so I completely understand your logic :)
Quote from: Mid-Atlantic Fan on September 08, 2016, 10:15:32 AM
Quote from: lastguyoffthebench on September 07, 2016, 08:19:24 PM
I originally had Scranton ahead of Haverford, but I cannot bump them to 5th in the Mid-Atlantic with a 1-0 road loss to Brandeis. No chance Scranton is ahead of Etown... Yetttt.
Scranton sitting at 3-0, preseason favorites ahead of Etown in the Landmark, 3 shutouts, 2015 NCAA tournament team, beat Etown in the final last season....hard to not put them ahead of Etown in my opinion. This is the classic "well Etown was good back in the 90's so they must be good now" argument. Same with Messiah this year and last. Anybody who has watched Messiah in the last 5 or 10 years knows this team and last season's team is nowhere near the standard or dominance of previous teams yet spectators still believe they will win the national title. Everyone can have their opinion but please be some what realistic. My vote right now would go towards Scranton at this moment in time LastGuy. Etown has had a very strong start as well so I completely understand your logic :)
If you are going by difficulty...Muhlenberg, Gettysburg, Cabrini vs Hobart, TCNJ, and Wilkes
If you are going by Goal Dif... 7 vs 9
If you are going by last year... Etown beat Scranton in the league 2-0 and went 8-0 in the league... Scranton won 3-2 in the final...
If you are going by "preseason favorite"... Believe that Catholic was favored last year... and how did they do?
Regardless, its shocking that Scranton isn't in the top 25 especially since Etown is ranked 11th. These teams should be a lot closer. Also, as we have seen last year... just because a team is ranked in the Top 25 for D3soccer doesn't mean that they are looked at as the first 25 in... If I'm Scranton I get to play with a chip on my shoulder for the next week... I loved playing with a chip on my shoulder.
Quote from: lastguyoffthebench on September 08, 2016, 09:44:25 AM
Brockport St sitting at 0-2 with Camden and Kean on the menu...
Dickinson sitting at 0-1-1 with Oneonta St and RPI next.
Eastern vs Lyco on Saturday...
Big games for all those teams mentioned. Could make or break some seasons and it's only week 2!!
We should make Thursdays D3 trivia night.
Can't remember if I ever mentioned this before but Martin at OWU and Coven at Brandeis have a lot in common, including, obviously, longevity. Both very high in all-time wins with Martin being #1 overall across all NCAA divisions. Coven went over 500 last year I think.
Both are from Eastern Mass. Both went to college in Springfield, MA -- Martin a '71 grad of Springfield College and Coven '69 grad of American International College (AIC).
Springfield College, when formerly known as the International YMCA Training School, also was the birthplace of basketball via James Naismith, who eventually landed at Univ of Kansas where he coached Adolph Rupp and then Phog Allen coached Dean Smith.
Amos Alonzo Stagg, considered a father of American football, also was at Springfield College and the main athletic field there is called Stagg Field.
Another alum, William G. Morgan, invented volleyball.
Tony DiCicco also is a Springfield grad.
AIC was started as a college for French Canadian immigrants.
predictions for Friday:
Chicago WIN over North Park today in a solid match
F&M 3-0 WIN over Oswego St
St. John Fisher will test SLU and escape with a DRAW. Could be on upset alert... SJF defeated Hobart and lost to Kean 1-0...
Manhattanville to DRAW vs RPI.
Oneonta St will put up 3 on Dickinson in a 3-1 WIN
Caroll vs Rose-Hulman DRAW
Messiah WIN over Oglethorpe 2-0
Wheaton WIN over John Carroll late...
Key regional match-up
H-S vs Trinity
Dallas vs Colorado
K-zoo vs Elmhurst
Millsaps vs Maryville
I enjoy NCAC NE top 15 so I will give it a shot as well.
Shooter's 20
1. Amherst
2. Rowan
3. Kenyon
4. Brandeis
5. Loras
6. F&M
7. OWU
8. Chicago
9. CNU
10. Rose-Hulman
11. Trinity (Tx)
12. St. Lawrence
13. Haverford
14. Redlands
15. Ohio Northern
-----------------------
16. Scranton
17. Whitworth
18. Macalester
19. Etown
20. Montclair St.
Dickinson and Oneonta going at it right now on a beautiful afternoon in Upstate New York. Oneonta up 1-0 15 minutes in.
Oneonta scores again early in the second half on a nice header goal to go up 2-0 on Dickinson.
Quote from: lastguyoffthebench on September 09, 2016, 02:03:18 PM
predictions for Friday:
Oneonta St will put up 3 on Dickinson in a 3-1 WIN
lastguy's prediction fulfilled at the 64' mark. 3-0 Oneonta
Quote from: lastguyoffthebench on September 07, 2016, 08:19:24 PM
I originally had Scranton ahead of Haverford, but I cannot bump them to 5th in the Mid-Atlantic with a 1-0 road loss to Brandeis. No chance Scranton is ahead of Etown... Yetttt.
Yeah I couldn't disagree more on Scranton and Etown. Etown hasnt played anyone yet. Hobart is the biggest name on their schedule and they are currently winless. Etown is a good team, and the Waso kid is the real deal, but they don't get the kids that they used too anymore.
No reason for anyone to get all worked up yet, still incredibly early in the season, but from everything I've seen from Scranton they seem like they are for real.
Wheaton IL down 3-0 in 30th minute
Watched only most of the OTs but Lycoming vs Eastern appeared to be a very good, highly contested match ending 1-1.
Catching up from last night, John Carroll with huge road win at Wheaton (Ill) and now going to OT with Elmhurst. Chicago looked extremely impressive whipping North Park away. And Oberlin got a solid road win 4-0 at Geneva.
RPI got by Dickinson today in an almost must-win game for both sides.
Vassar is 4-0.
Carthage's rendezvous with the top 25 and "Who's #1" polls was brief, dropping two in a row after today...hammered by Hanover.
Kean picks up good win over Brockport while Rutgers-Newark spoils the front end of Whitworth's East Coast trip (3-1).
UMass-Boston impresses easily dispatching Union, and Gordon is held to a draw with Roger Williams.
John Carroll just hit the post at 91:50. Frostburg and Carnegie Mellon appear headed to OT in a 0-0 affair. F&M already has been taken to OT by Oglethorpe.
Texas-Dallas versus Trinity is a sleeper high quality match set to kick off at 8:00 pm. Wheaton (Ill) badly needs a win tonight versus Kzoo. York versus Gettysburg is another one to check out, along with the Kentucky derby with TMC and Centre just underway.
Forgot to mention Springfield is quietly 4-0. And still scratching my head about Jekyll and Hyde Wheaton (MA) losing 6-1 to Keene St. Wesleyan hanging on 2-1 late against Swat. Ohio Northern about to be 6-0 (5-0), albeit against less than stellar competition thus far, and now the Polar Bears visit to OWU this week looms large.
W&L takes out Ohio Wesleyan at the Battling Bishops home tournament. 3-1 after going down 1-0 in the first. All three goals scored in the second half. W&L outshot 15-14, but took more corners, 7-4. Two goals off corners, one off the run of play. OWU's goal came from the run of play. Outside the seasoning opening 2-0 loss to Rowan, W&L seems to be picking up the pace, scoring 10 goals in 3 games. Trip to Ohio raps up tomorrow with Wooster before the ODAC schedule begins.
Christopher Newport heading out West next week to play Redlands in what should be one of the feature games of the week and an also still unbeaten Chapman. I applaud these occasional cross-country trips at the D3 level, just as I applaud those programs that take advantage of preseason trips abroad. I see these as big perks for the kids and an enhancement of their overall collegiate experiences as student-athletes.
If state-funded schools like UMass-Boston and Christopher Newport can make cross-country trips then I see no reason why we can't get more at least cross-regional games, involving New England trips for Centennial, ODAC, NCAC, etc conferences and vice versa. Again, interestingly, some of the state-funded NJAC and SUNYAC teams seem to travel more than some others.
I watched the Chicago v NPU game on Friday. Chicago won 3-0 and NPU was fortunate they(we) only lost by 3. Chicago is very good.
St Norbert 2, Loras 1....right when I was penciling in Loras at #3 in my weekly poll.
A bunch of the unblemished are now blemished. Alma falls to still unbeaten Transy. Berry knocks off Mary Washington. Bates snuffs out Newbury. MSOE brings Rose-Hulman back down to earth. And of course Loras spits the bit.
Kenyon sputters to a come-from-behind 3-2 win over Frostburg, and the good news is that Tony "the Nimble Nigerian" Amolo gets the GW and his first goal of the year. Carthage barely avoids losing three straight with a comeback late at Mud Hollow Stadium (Wabash). DePauw picks up a valuable road win at CWRU as Gonzalez gets the GW. Luther and St. Johns draw in a 4-4 shootout.
Lycoming perhaps saves their season scoring twice in the last eight minutes to draw with Haverford 2-2. Whitworth outlasts TCNJ 4-3. GAC is saddled with yet another loss at Salisbury. Colorado Coll snakebites Pac Lutheran in OT. NC Wesleyan spoils Emory's Tarheel road trip.
NCAC NE Top 15 (Week 2)
1) Rowan (How will the Profs handle the early praise and massive attention?)
2) Amherst (Strong enough that we'll barely notice the adjustments they need to make from last season.)
3) Chicago (Probably benefiting from the bright lights being on the two above but just as impressive so far.)
4) Kenyon (Feels too high as a hysterical fan but don't see anyone else that is a better clear choice in this spot at the moment.)
5) Christopher Newport (Aye, aye, Captains!)
6) St Lawrence (The Saints, even with a storied history, tend to get buried for attention with all the focus on NESCAC, SUNYAC, new contenders, etc. I'm gonna risk an upside assessment as they are always right there in the end and will be an handful for anyone in the Sweet 16.)
7) Middlebury (Mostly a projection this early but a very real wild card in the national title race.)
8) Trinity (TX) (See SLU above. Trinity just keeps winning regardless of how many starters they really have back.)
9) Messiah (Who are we kidding? No one will want to draw a bracket with this team.)
10) Elizabethtown (A team on a mission? E'town being good enough for a bid is good for D3.)
11) Loras (Should be punished more harshly but I have to believe today's result will prove to be a fluke.)
12) UMass-Boston (The risk of underrating the Beacons has become too great.)
13) Redlands (We'll have a better idea after the upcoming week with games against undefeated Claremont-Mudd-Scripps and then Christopher Newport.)
14) Calvin (Will be tough to gauge as the Knights roll their schedule the next few weeks.)
15) Washington & Lee (Going 2-1 with the gauntlet of Rowan, Oneonta and OWU. Enough said.)
RV -- Brandeis, Carnegie Mellon, Cortland St, Eastern, Franklin & Marshall, Haverford, Lynchburg, Macalester, Montclair St, Ohio Northern (let's see how you do with OWU and CWRU back-to-back), OWU, Plattsburgh St, Rochester, Rutgers-Newark, Scranton, Vassar, Wash U
Contender or Pretender -- Centre, Chapman, Claremont-Mudd-Scripps, Dubuque, Endicott, Grove City, Kean, Luther, Potsdam St, Springfield, St. Thomas, Transylvania
DO NOT DELETE LIST -- Babson, Bowdoin, Carthage, Colorado Coll, DePauw, Elmhurst, Gettysburg, Gordon, John Carroll, MIT, Oneonta St, Rose-Hulman, Rutgers-Camden, Tex-Dallas, Tex-Tyler, Thomas More, Tufts, UWW, Wartburg, Wesleyan, Wheaton (Ill), Whitworth, Williams, York (PA)
Wheaton (IL) down 6 (yes 6) starters due to injury, including Danny Brandt. If they can't get healthy by Tuesday, U Chicago is not going to be a fun match. Chicago is certainly a team that could end up in the final 4. That being said, Wheaton's opener against UT-Dallas with most starters on the field was a convincing performance.
Quote from: Toure87 on September 11, 2016, 09:22:54 PM
Wheaton (IL) down 6 (yes 6) starters due to injury, including Danny Brandt. If they can't get healthy by Tuesday, U Chicago is not going to be a fun match. Chicago is certainly a team that could end up in the final 4. That being said, Wheaton's opener against UT-Dallas with most starters on the field was a convincing performance.
Wheaton always figures it out by the end of the season, so I wouldn't worry about them quite yet.
http://d3soccer.com/columns/ryans-ruminations/2016/ruminations-09-09-2016
Great piece Ryan!
Breaking news: The NCAA will move all championships from North Carolina, including the men's and women's soccer championships originally scheduled for Greensborol
http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/media-center/news/ncaa-relocate-championships-north-carolina-2016-17
Whitworth closes out the East Coast trip vs MSU tonight. After narrowly escaping TCNJ in the waning seconds, I'm thinking MSU rolls... 3-1, maybe 4-1. Playing a 3rd game in 4 days certainly will not help their case. NJAC, along with other South Atlantic schools are getting great results vs the New England and Mid-Atlantic regions... throw in wins over OWU and Whitworth, we might see a South Atlantic team back in the Final Four this year. MSU, Rowan, W&L will be the best chance...
CNU absolute best case to me would be Sweet 16 (face a real test heading West to play Redlands and Chapman) With Lynchburg, York, and Randolph after the road trip, we will see where the Captains fit. Let us not forget, started 10-0-3 and missed the tournament in 2015.
MSU doesn't know how to win in November (minus 2011 when they avoided Messiah).
Rowan is young, but NCAA experience last year may be just enough to get them in an Elite 8 match-up vs Messiah/SLU...
W&L had a tough draw last year and have done well to start the season. I'll be pulling for them to make a run.
------------------------------------------------
Messiah looks excellent going forward in the games that I have seen so far. Give them 10 more weeks and I am confident they will be firing on all cylinders.
Lyco took it to Eastern for the 30-40 minutes that I was able to watch. Eastern let up a real soft goal with some sloppy defending...
The Warriors season hinges on this Messiah result 10/11. I say this because even in a best case 7 blemish season, two losses to the same school if they fail to win the AQ will crush them. I'm expecting a close 2-0 win in favor of the Falcons (2nd goal coming late when Lycoming keeps bombing forward to equalize). The draw vs Haverford might have saved their season... mentally and physically. Being down 2-0 and scoring twice late against the Fords is a STRONG STRONG result!
http://d3soccer.com/top25/men/2016/week2
Quote from: Mid-Atlantic Fan on September 13, 2016, 08:57:46 AM
http://d3soccer.com/top25/men/2016/week2
Always amazed when you see something like the OWU/W&L pairing in this poll. Polls don't matter, but it has to make you chuckle. Yep, let's just ignore the head to head, with the road team scoring 3 and winning by 2. We know better than to actually go by results on the field!
I know, there's more data than just one game, and especially as the season goes on a single stale head to head is not the default answer, but given these teams comparative efforts to date, and the head to head just this past weekend, how does someone justify putting the losing home team over top of the visiting winning team? Ah, wait, W&L wasn't ranked and we simply can't move them too far forward! And OWU has a quality win, so we can't drop them. Well, the Battling Bishops must be better. We started the year believing that and we aren't ready to give it up yet!
Full circle back to my second sentence...
ONU at #9 is laughable as their schedule has been incredibly easy thus far... It's comparable to something like Ramapo (4-0). Is Ramapo deserving of votes, NO. Should ONU be top 10, definitely NO. Should ONU be top 25, QUESTIONABLE.
W&L loses to #3 Rowan, beats OWU. Still behind OWU... Makes sense!
Also have no problems with Kenyon ahead of Rowan...
CNU will go to Redlands and get the WIN.
RPI-Oneonta will be a good watch this afternoon. SUNY has rebounded nicely from its 0-2 NJ road trip and sits at 2-2, while RPI is 2-1-1 on the young season. Both have beaten Dickinson: RPI 2-1, SUNY 5-1.
I think most would pick Oneonta, especially since they're at home, but RPI almost stumbled ***-backwards into the Sweet 16 last year, so they can never be counted out.
Quote from: jknezek on September 13, 2016, 10:06:21 AM
Quote from: Mid-Atlantic Fan on September 13, 2016, 08:57:46 AM
http://d3soccer.com/top25/men/2016/week2
Always amazed when you see something like the OWU/W&L pairing in this poll. Polls don't matter, but it has to make you chuckle. Yep, let's just ignore the head to head, with the road team scoring 3 and winning by 2. We know better than to actually go by results on the field!
I know, there's more data than just one game, and especially as the season goes on a single stale head to head is not the default answer, but given these teams comparative efforts to date, and the head to head just this past weekend, how does someone justify putting the losing home team over top of the visiting winning team? Ah, wait, W&L wasn't ranked and we simply can't move them too far forward! And OWU has a quality win, so we can't drop them. Well, the Battling Bishops must be better. We started the year believing that and we aren't ready to give it up yet!
Full circle back to my second sentence...
A corollary to my post about Parity - or maybe an implied corollary: I think pollsters and writers - including us - are hung up on the "brand name" versus the actual product we are seeing on the field this year. Do these brand name programs usually pull it off by the end of the year - many times they do. But based what I've seen - in person and videocast - I think there are going to be a few new names rising in the polls and possibly making the post-season.
While W&L had the better of possession vs Wooster they did not create as many dangerous chances as they should have. Conversely, Wooster missed a couple half-chances - one with about 2 minutes left and just missed the upper corner (a shankopotamus effort!). W&L clearly have a couple-four first team all-conference players - but they should have had a second goal and they better learn how to close out games with 10 minutes to go. I do recognize they could have been flat after beating OWU.
ONU played 4 games in 5 days last week - not a killer schedule to be sure - but they are very deserving to be in the top 25. We'll find out much more about ONU and OWU tomorrow night . . .
With the NCAA coming down on NC, it'll be interesting to see where the DIII soccer and tennis championships end up for this school year. It's somewhat short notice to move the soccer championships, but I suppose there are plenty of places in the U.S. now with adequate facilities, especially that late into the season.
Quote from: Domino1195 on September 13, 2016, 01:04:10 PM
Quote from: jknezek on September 13, 2016, 10:06:21 AM
Quote from: Mid-Atlantic Fan on September 13, 2016, 08:57:46 AM
http://d3soccer.com/top25/men/2016/week2
Always amazed when you see something like the OWU/W&L pairing in this poll. Polls don't matter, but it has to make you chuckle. Yep, let's just ignore the head to head, with the road team scoring 3 and winning by 2. We know better than to actually go by results on the field!
I know, there's more data than just one game, and especially as the season goes on a single stale head to head is not the default answer, but given these teams comparative efforts to date, and the head to head just this past weekend, how does someone justify putting the losing home team over top of the visiting winning team? Ah, wait, W&L wasn't ranked and we simply can't move them too far forward! And OWU has a quality win, so we can't drop them. Well, the Battling Bishops must be better. We started the year believing that and we aren't ready to give it up yet!
Full circle back to my second sentence...
A corollary to my post about Parity - or maybe an implied corollary: I think pollsters and writers - including us - are hung up on the "brand name" versus the actual product we are seeing on the field this year. Do these brand name programs usually pull it off by the end of the year - many times they do. But based what I've seen - in person and videocast - I think there are going to be a few new names rising in the polls and possibly making the post-season.
While W&L had the better of possession vs Wooster they did not create as many dangerous chances as they should have. Conversely, Wooster missed a couple half-chances - one with about 2 minutes left and just missed the upper corner (a shankopotamus effort!). W&L clearly have a couple-four first team all-conference players - but they should have had a second goal and they better learn how to close out games with 10 minutes to go. I do recognize they could have been flat after beating OWU.
ONU played 4 games in 5 days last week - not a killer schedule to be sure - but they are very deserving to be in the top 25. We'll find out much more about ONU and OWU tomorrow night . . .
From what I saw W&L was very flat, I'd say more like emotionally exhausted, against Wooster. If you consider the schedule it's not hard to imagine. They travelled to NJ, lost to Rowan 9/3, beat Oneonta St 9/4 and returned to campus. Thursday 9/8 they beat SVa at home, then boarded the bus to Ohio. Beat OWU 9/9, then played Wooster 9/10 with the bus ride back to campus after.
That's a tough schedule. Not the toughest you could imagine, but it involved 3 big games in a stretch of 5 games in 8 days, and over 24 hours on buses over 8 days. While I think W&L is significantly better than SVa and Wooster, both had the chance to catch W&L either looking past or just emotionally wiped. Finding ways to grind out results in those games was important for the Generals even if it wasn't real pretty against Wooster.
Now that the OOC gauntlet is run, I'm interested to see how W&L settles down into the mostly 2 games a week ODAC pattern.
Quote from: jknezek on September 13, 2016, 01:07:36 PM
With the NCAA coming down on NC, it'll be interesting to see where the DIII soccer and tennis championships end up for this school year. It's somewhat short notice to move the soccer championships, but I suppose there are plenty of places in the U.S. now with adequate facilities, especially that late into the season.
I'd love to see them bring the championship weekend to the Maryland Soccerplex Stadium one of these years. Obviously you can't guarantee any of the schools participating will be from close by but you might have a chance to pull attendance from the wealth of schools within a 2-3 hour drive that may not have been willing to travel as far in the past.
It really could be just about anywhere. With only 3 games over 2 days, you only need 1 field with decent stands. They did the D1 College Cup here in Birmingham at a converted minor league baseball field / Hoover H.S. football stadium (Hoover is one of the premier public school football programs in the country. They draw thousands to their games). The field set up in a way that wasn't real pretty to look at, but worked fine and didn't even fill up for the finals.
I'm guessing the DIII finals attendance doesn't require all that many seats. The bigger issue with moving it this late in the process is motivating the local youth leagues to drive attendance and do any ancillary events that give it a larger community impact.
http://www.nscaa.com/web/Rankings/College_Rankings/NCAA_DIII_MEN/web/rankings/ncaa/diii_men.aspx
CNU ahead of Rowan, say what??? Lynchburg ahead of W&L? For one draw vs Messiah while sitting in the whole game?
Ohio Northern SOS rank of 214
Redlands SOS of 274
CNU SOS of 104
Etown SOS of 183
Could well be a product of the fact that there are 18 teams that are unbeaten/untied at this point in the year, but - as usual - I have a number of qualms with the NSCAA rankings, none of which pertain to my alma mater dropping out.
I get that there have been a number of surprise results this year, and I'm a firm believer that teams should be in there on merit rather than legacy/expectations, but 12 teams that were NR last week moved into the rankings, while only two that were RV moved in. Seems a bit drastic to clean house of basically half of the teams, especially when only two RV squads (so 1/6 of the number of NR squads) moved into the top 25.
Also, Puget Sound is reported to be 1-0-0, but the Loggers' website has them 3-1, the last result happening on Saturday well before the release of the rankings. Am I missing something here?
UMASS-Boston deserves to be top 25, but 13th is too high IMHO. Good to see Endicott getting some love in the RV section after beating Tufts and going 3-1 since losing to Carthage in its opening game. Think Williams could move into the top 25 if they go clean this week/weekend.
Quote from: jknezek on September 13, 2016, 02:14:55 PM
It really could be just about anywhere. With only 3 games over 2 days, you only need 1 field with decent stands. They did the D1 College Cup here in Birmingham at a converted minor league baseball field / Hoover H.S. football stadium (Hoover is one of the premier public school football programs in the country. They draw thousands to their games). The field set up in a way that wasn't real pretty to look at, but worked fine and didn't even fill up for the finals.
I'm guessing the DIII finals attendance doesn't require all that many seats. The bigger issue with moving it this late in the process is motivating the local youth leagues to drive attendance and do any ancillary events that give it a larger community impact.
It's actually
six games over two days, because the women play at the same site, but one field sufficed for the last two years in Kansas.
Quote from: 1970s NESCAC Player on September 13, 2016, 04:20:31 PM
Quote from: jknezek on September 13, 2016, 02:14:55 PM
It really could be just about anywhere. With only 3 games over 2 days, you only need 1 field with decent stands. They did the D1 College Cup here in Birmingham at a converted minor league baseball field / Hoover H.S. football stadium (Hoover is one of the premier public school football programs in the country. They draw thousands to their games). The field set up in a way that wasn't real pretty to look at, but worked fine and didn't even fill up for the finals.
I'm guessing the DIII finals attendance doesn't require all that many seats. The bigger issue with moving it this late in the process is motivating the local youth leagues to drive attendance and do any ancillary events that give it a larger community impact.
It's actually six games over two days, because the women play at the same site, but one field sufficed for the last two years in Kansas.
Fair enough. That was a pretty bad oversight on my part, mainly because the D1 College Cups are not at the same time/same field. +K for the reminder.
Wow. Over 1600 people watching live stream of Wheaton at Chicago....still 0-0 in 1st half.
Correction: Says over 1600 "views" and over 180 watching....and Chicago scores to go up 1-0.
Scranton and Rochester both remain unblemished with solid wins tonight.
Man, the Wheaton LB was
way too casual for Chicago's 2nd goal. To be fair, that's also great awareness from Desai to pressure him, and a good finish as well.
Quote from: NCAC New England on September 13, 2016, 09:17:16 PM
Scranton and Rochester both remain unblemished with solid wins tonight.
Perhaps Rochester is rebounding after a bad year last year. Really surprised that they had such a poor season given that they didn't lose a
ton from the year before, but it seems like they're putting it together so far this year. Only thing is that - while Hobart and Buff. State were certainly good wins they haven't had to go on the road yet, so next weekend's trip to RPI should give us a better idea of what they're made of.
Man, Chicago is absolutely bossing this game. Last year at this time, Chicago had started off brightly, and were highly-ranked, but then got thumped 4-0 at home by Loras. With the majority of their spine back and a year more experienced, the Maroons look significantly better.
Quote from: blooter442 on September 13, 2016, 09:59:16 PM
Man, Chicago is absolutely bossing this game. Last year at this time, Chicago had started off brightly, and were highly-ranked, but then got thumped 4-0 at home by Loras. With the majority of their spine back and a year more experienced, the Maroons look significantly better.
Yep, that was impressive. Even if Wheaton was missing some players that was still Wheaton out there that they were playing keep a way with and getting to every ball first.
Too bad we're not getting a rematch of Chicago and Loras in the Rock Bowl. That would be fantastic.
Quote from: blooter442 on September 13, 2016, 09:59:16 PM
Man, Chicago is absolutely bossing this game. Last year at this time, Chicago had started off brightly, and were highly-ranked, but then got thumped 4-0 at home by Loras. With the majority of their spine back and a year more experienced, the Maroons look significantly better.
Loras and Chicago already played this year is a pre-season exhibition. The ended in a draw I believe, not sure the score. I will get the skinny soon.
The Loras v Chicago match earlier this year was a 0-0 draw, the comments were that Chicago was a good squad and it was a good game.
It's been an indifferent start for Kalamazoo this year. Surprised to see them unable to beat Olivet at home. What's going on here. Can someone fill me in? Was expecting Zoo to challenge for a tourney birth this season.
Quote from: Letthekidsplay59 on September 14, 2016, 11:40:18 AM
It's been an indifferent start for Kalamazoo this year. Surprised to see them unable to beat Olivet at home. What's going on here. Can someone fill me in? Was expecting Zoo to challenge for a tourney birth this season.
To be honest, I've seen the Beavers play only two games this year, but they've had an incredibly challenging beginning to their season. Wheaton, elmhurst, Olivet, and DePauw; talk about rough scheduling. I see Kalamazoo straightening the ship once they hit the conference heavy part of their schedule. Though, yet again, the MIAA will not cease to excite.
Ohio Northern definitely looks legit. Look very even with OWU talent-wise and probably carrying the play with more clean chances. OWU GK made phenomenal reaction save from point blank range and another very good reaction kick save from close range. Guessing Ohio Northern is going to pay dearly for not snagging 1 or 2 in the 1st half. The ONU small kid with some kind of a cast is a heck of a player.
Still 0-0, btw.
ONU-OWU going OT. ONU tiring. OWU GK man of the match. ONU GK made a save at with 5:00 min left in reg that was as good or better than the spectacular saves the OWU GK made, which at last count was at least 4. And of course the stream goes blank for OT. I imagine OWU will get one given greater depth.
Literally think the videographer thinks the game is over.
Blockbuster Weekend Match-Ups
Friday-9/16
Colorado Coll.@#4 Trinity (Tx)----Possibly the game of the day features two undefeated teams that refuse to give up goals
#7 CNU@#18 Redlands-----------Some would argue this is the game of the day and I can see why
#12 Loras@Carthage--------------All eyes will be on the Duhawks this weekend to see how they respond vs a stingy Carthage team
Wheaton(Ill)@Wash. U-----------This could have HUGE outcomes come selection time if Wheaton doesn't mustard up a result vs an undefeated Wash. U
Saturday-9/17
#1 Amherst@Middlebury-------------Need I say more?
#2 Kenyon@Thomas More-----------This should be a fun game to watch!
#3 Rowan@ NJCU---------------------Didn't expect to pick this game but NJCU is undefeated and at home...do I smell upset alert???
#25 Cortland St@#6 St. Law.--------Cortland has only given up 1 goal all year...and St. Lawrence hasn't posted a shutout yet
Case Western@#9 Ohio Northern----Will ONU have enough juice and energy, after a 2OT draw to rival OWU, to compete vs a solid CWR side
#11 F&M@Swarthmore---------------Conference play begins in the Centennial! Swat coming off a nice win over Eastern
#21 Scranton@Lycoming-------------Can Scranton keep their win streak alive as they travel to face a struggling Lycoming side
RUN@RUC------------------------------Newark at Camden...NJAC...rivalry...nuff said
Vassar@Oneonta St-------------------Impressive start for Vassar will be more impressive if they get a road result at Oneonta St
Grove City@Heidelberg----------------How will GC respond after their first defeat of the year...
John Carroll@Hiram-------------------Both teams desperate for a win
RIT@Rochester-----------------------Battle for city supremacy...always a great game to tune in to
Top 5 Games of the Weekend
1. Amherst @ Midd
2. Cort. St @ SLU
3. Kenyon @ Thomas More
4. Scranton @ Lyco
5. Colorado Coll. @ Trinity (Tx)
Honorable Mention: Rivalry games of Newark@Camden and RIT@UR
Great outlook on this upcoming weekend. Thanks!
Quote from: Mid-Atlantic Fan on September 15, 2016, 12:32:42 PM
Blockbuster Weekend Match-Ups
Friday-9/16
Colorado Coll.@#4 Trinity (Tx)----Possibly the game of the day features two undefeated teams that refuse to give up goals
#7 CNU@#18 Redlands-----------Some would argue this is the game of the day and I can see why
#12 Loras@Carthage--------------All eyes will be on the Duhawks this weekend to see how they respond vs a stingy Carthage team
Wheaton(Ill)@Wash. U-----------This could have HUGE outcomes come selection time if Wheaton doesn't mustard up a result vs an undefeated Wash. U
Saturday-9/17
#1 Amherst@Middlebury-------------Need I say more?
#2 Kenyon@Thomas More-----------This should be a fun game to watch!
#3 Rowan@ NJCU---------------------Didn't expect to pick this game but NJCU is undefeated and at home...do I smell upset alert???
#25 Cortland St@#6 St. Law.--------Cortland has only given up 1 goal all year...and St. Lawrence hasn't posted a shutout yet
Case Western@#9 Ohio Northern----Will ONU have enough juice and energy, after a 2OT draw to rival OWU, to compete vs a solid CWR side
#11 F&M@Swarthmore---------------Conference play begins in the Centennial! Swat coming off a nice win over Eastern
#21 Scranton@Lycoming-------------Can Scranton keep their win streak alive as they travel to face a struggling Lycoming side
RUN@RUC------------------------------Newark at Camden...NJAC...rivalry...nuff said
Vassar@Oneonta St-------------------Impressive start for Vassar will be more impressive if they get a road result at Oneonta St
Grove City@Heidelberg----------------How will GC respond after their first defeat of the year...
John Carroll@Hiram-------------------Both teams desperate for a win
RIT@Rochester-----------------------Battle for city supremacy...always a great game to tune in to
Top 5 Games of the Weekend
1. Amherst @ Midd
2. Cort. St @ SLU
3. Kenyon @ Thomas More
4. Scranton @ Lyco
5. Colorado Coll. @ Trinity (Tx)
Honorable Mention: Rivalry games of Newark@Camden and RIT@UR
+ K....wonder if Scranton has a chance against Lycoming...
Thanks NEPA Fan and will you be at the game? Keep the updates coming if so? And I think Scranton is the favorite in my eyes but heading to Lycoming is never easy especially when they will be desperate for a big win. This game has huge implications for the region so I expect it to be a close game.
I will say 2-1 Lycoming in OT but it's a toss up!
Quote from: Mid-Atlantic Fan on September 16, 2016, 02:42:15 PM
Thanks NEPA Fan and will you be at the game? Keep the updates coming if so? And I think Scranton is the favorite in my eyes but heading to Lycoming is never easy especially when they will be desperate for a big win. This game has huge implications for the region so I expect it to be a close game.
I will say 2-1 Lycoming in OT but it's a toss up!
I'll be watching on line. Won't pay for the HD feed...haha.
Some interesting, some high profile, and some important maybe under-the-radar action around the country.
Amherst and Middlebury play to a draw...probably a result that neither team will mind that much.
Wheaton (MA) and Springfield play to a 2-2 tie in a key NEWMAC clash. Speaking of which, what is up with Babson?! After very fortunate circumstances yielded a PK 2OT win over rival Brandeis, the Beavers drew with Fitchburg St 0-0 and toady lost at home to Coast Guard. Seems almost all of the NEWMAC teams have played themselves into a position where they will need to win the NEWMAC tourney to get a bid.
Rutgers-Camden is back in the mix! Torched Rutgers-Newark today and I think now 4-0-2. Kean stays viable with a win over Stockton. Rowan hands Jersey City a first loss and now looks ahead to a showdown with F&M.
Oneonta St. comes from behind to hand the Vassar Brewers a first blemish. Plattsburgh stays unblemished and keeps Skidmore down in the dumps. Potsdam rebounds from a loss to Hobart with a good win over RPI.
Bowdoin gains a very valuable road NESCAC win against fellow perennial mid-table foe Wesleyan, 1-0. Tufts gets back on track dominating Bates, but still has work to do. Williams stays on course for the hoped for revival, getting by Colby at home.
Lycoming comes through with a big win over Scranton.
W&L comes from behind in a potential trap game to prevail over Virginia Wesleyan. Lynchburg follows up a draw with Oglethorpe with an important win over Berry to stay unbeaten.
Dubuque remains unblemished after saddling MSOE with a loss. Perhaps lost among so many games, Loras uncharacteristically drops 2 in a row falling to Carthage last night on a late goal. Carthage's roller-coaster ride of a season continues. Wheaton (Ill) also lost again last night to Wash U and now stands at a stunning 1-4-1. Unlike a Calvin that might be able to count on a conference tourney bid, Wheaton is no cinch for that route given the threat posed by Carthage, Elmhurst and North Park.
Speaking of Elmhurst, they could not handle Chicago last night, as the Maroons spotted the Bluejays a goal and stormed back in a romp. Chicago is handling their business in a very professional and impressive manner, befitting a true Final Four contender.
Concordia (Wis), after beating St. Norbert right after St. Norbert bested Loras, fell today to rival Wisconsin Lutheran.
Kenyon gets a solid road win at Thomas More, while Centre gives up a lead to DePauw and shows resiliency on the road by winning in OT. This sets up a mid-week collision of unblemished teams, as the Colonels head to Gambier. Grove City gets back to its winning ways outlasting Heidelberg 3-2 in OT and now can look forward to a huge game for them versus Carnegie Mellon.
Whitworth shrugged off jet lag and an early deficit to get a win against Willamette.
Haverford takes a big early season Centennial bout over Hopkins.
SLU's climb up the polls should continue after a huge win over Cortland St. Now the Saints go on the road to face another still unblemished SUNYAC, Plattsburgh.
Out West, we should note that Trinity (TX) toppled Colorado Coll last night. Redlands lost to Christopher Newport in one of the games of the week last night but rebounded today with a 5-0 shellacking of Whittier.
In late action, just saw that MIT barely got by Emerson 1-0 in OT. ONU has gone up 1-0 late against CWRU.
Ramapo knocks off MSU in OT, 4-3. Wow!
So I guess now we're just waiting for the results of the Rochester derby....0-0 in the 64th minute at last check.
Debating whether I'll provide coverage of Cal Lutheran@Occidental.
Quote from: NCAC New England on September 17, 2016, 08:50:44 PM
Some interesting, some high profile, and some important maybe under-the-radar action around the country.
Amherst and Middlebury play to a draw...probably a result that neither team will mind that much.
Wheaton (MA) and Springfield play to a 2-2 tie in a key NEWMAC clash. Speaking of which, what is up with Babson?! After very fortunate circumstances yielded a PK 2OT win over rival Brandeis, the Beavers drew with Fitchburg St 0-0 and toady lost at home to Coast Guard. Seems almost all of the NEWMAC teams have played themselves into a position where they will need to win the NEWMAC tourney to get a bid.
Rutgers-Camden is back in the mix! Torched Rutgers-Newark today and I think now 4-0-2. Kean stays viable with a win over Stockton. Rowan hands Jersey City a first loss and now looks ahead to a showdown with F&M.
Oneonta St. comes from behind to hand the Vassar Brewers a first blemish. Plattsburgh stays unblemished and keeps Skidmore down in the dumps. Potsdam rebounds from a loss to Hobart with a good win over RPI.
Bowdoin gains a very valuable road NESCAC win against fellow perennial mid-table foe Wesleyan, 1-0. Tufts gets back on track dominating Bates, but still has work to do. Williams stays on course for the hoped for revival, getting by Colby at home.
Lycoming comes through with a big win over Scranton.
W&L comes from behind in a potential trap game to prevail over Virginia Wesleyan. Lynchburg follows up a draw with Oglethorpe with an important win over Berry to stay unbeaten.
Dubuque remains unblemished after saddling MSOE with a loss. Perhaps lost among so many games, Loras uncharacteristically drops 2 in a row falling to Carthage last night on a late goal. Carthage's roller-coaster ride of a season continues. Wheaton (Ill) also lost again last night to Wash U and now stands at a stunning 1-4-1. Unlike a Calvin that might be able to count on a conference tourney bid, Wheaton is no cinch for that route given the threat posed by Carthage, Elmhurst and North Park.
Speaking of Elmhurst, they could not handle Chicago last night, as the Maroons spotted Carthage a goal and stormed back in a romp. Chicago is handling their business in a very professional and impressive manner, befitting a true Final Four contender.
Concordia (Wis), after beating St. Norbert right after St. Norbert bested Loras, fell today to rival Wisconsin Lutheran.
Kenyon gets a solid road win at Thomas More, while Centre gives up a lead to DePauw and shows resiliency on the road by winning in OT. This sets up a mid-week collision of unblemished teams, as the Colonels head to Gambier. Grove City gets back to its winning ways outlasting Heidelberg 3-2 in OT and now can look forward to a huge game for them versus Carnegie Mellon.
Whitworth shrugged off jet lag and an early deficit to get a win against Willamette.
Haverford takes a big early season Centennial bout over Hopkins.
SLU's climb up the polls should continue after a huge win over Cortland St. Now the Saints go on the road to face another still unblemished SUNYAC, Plattsburgh.
Out West, we should note that Trinity (TX) toppled Colorado Coll last night. Redlands lost to Christopher Newport in one of the games of the week last night but rebounded today with a 5-0 shellacking of Whittier.
In late action, just saw that MIT barely got by Emerson 1-0 in OT. ONU has gone up 1-0 late against CWRU.
Great recap NCAC.
Babson continues to confound. I was impressed by them against ECSU, but despite outshooting and then beating Brandeis they really haven't impressed other than that this year. Also, for all of its strength in SoS, Babson has pretty much stumbled into NCAAs via the NEWMAC tournament the last two years, and missed NCAAs three years back. Granted, winning the NEWMAC isn't a given, but the strength of the conference isn't the same as that of the NESCAC, and even if Bowdoin has done similar the last two years Bowdoin has been largely helped out by the top seed being upset elsewhere in the quarters and also managed to at least win an NCAA game both years, something Babson hasn't done since 2011 despite being at home twice. Simply put, Babson is a good program that plays a tough schedule, and they're a program I respect, but I would still say that they have a much easier road to an NCAA bid than, say, a NESCAC team with similar talent, a similar record, and a comparable SoS. It will be interesting to see how things unfold this year for the Beavers, as seemingly all of the momentum from the Brandeis win has evaporated.
Would like to see Rochester go on the road, as while the Yellowjackets are 5-0 all 5 games have been at home. Next weekend's trip to RPI will be worth a look.
Really curious to see how Chicago-Carthage turns out tomorrow. I'd expect Chicago to win, but this could be perhaps an even bigger test than Wheaton was.
I've been watching Lycoming as they progress through their schedule. And something jumped out at me...what seemed to be an inordinate number of of Yellow and Red cards. So I compared them to a sampling of top 25 teams around the country and here's what I found (information thru 9/17):
Lycoming: 17Y + 1R = 18 total cards
Rowan: 10Y + 1R = 11 total cards
Amherst: 5Y + 0R = 5 total cards
Trinity: 4Y + 1R = 5 total cards
F&M: 5Y + 0R = 5 total cards
Elizabethtown: 4Y + 0R = 4 total cards
Kenyon: 8Y + 1R = 9 total cards
Lynchburg: 7Y + 1R = 8 total cards
Univ of Chicago: 7Y + 1R = 8 total cards
It looks like Lycoming is leading this category (by a lot). There might be a place on the internet to compare these stats across all teams. I thought I had found a site that did that last year, but I could not find it this year. If you know where that site is, please let us know.
Today's Action
On the edge of my seat waiting to see if the Pine Manor Gators (Chestnut Hill, MA) in their 3rd year of existence can knock off the defending national champion and #1 ranked Amherst Lord Jeffs. Pine Manor? Really, Amherst? A browse around the Pine Manor website did reveal some interesting info. If you click on men's soccer history you are taken to results for the 2015-2016 Pine Manor basketball season. The Gator cagers smoked Albany College of Pharmacy and Health Sciences 118-54, right after losing to Ivy League Dartmouth 121-56. The Gators ended up on the wrong end of a 105-98 OT affair with Tufts and in the first round of the ECAC tourney nipped Elms 127-124 after two OT periods. The soccer team is led by Head Coach John Shimer, an OWU graduate who was an asst to Jay Martin for the 2012 OWU season and then an asst at Endicott, credited with recruiting some of Endicott's current players. Most surprising, especially given that Pine Manor only became co-ed for men a couple of years ago and has an enrollment of 450 or 350 depending on what web page you land on, is that the men's roster of 25 only has 2 players from Massachusetts, and 7 from El Paso, TX alone. The rest of the roster includes players from FL, GA, NY, AZ, MI, NC, NJ and CT. The Gators are 1-3 on the young season with a W over Becker and Ls to Newbury, ME-Framington and Suffolk.
Elsewhere, look for Univ Dallas to push Trinity (TX) in what might seem like an afterthought game for Trinity. A date with Chicago gives Wartburg a chance to grab a head-turning win, but the Maroons don't look like a letdown is in their near future. Christopher Newport closes out its West Coast trip versus Chapman. Getting to Monday morning classes will be a challenge for the Captains. Oneonta looks to continue reasserting its dominance with a visit to Hamilton. Don't be shocked if the Continentals make this more of a game than most would expect.
In the South Atlantic, Sewanee and Birm-Southern finish up a Virginia road trip by reversing partners. Sewanee (4-1-1) lost 1-0 to Hampden-Sydney yesterday and takes on Randolph (3-1-1). Birm-Southern looks to rebound from a 2-0 loss to Randolph by giving Hampden-Sydney (5-0) a first blemish. Hampden-Sydney is a bit like the Southern version of Wabash, one of the last remaining all-male colleges in the US.
The two most compelling games of the day might be Babson@Williams and Luther@Wash U. Who knows which Babson squad will show up. Luther at 4-0-2 could use a high quality win while Wash U still with only 3 games played (3-0) hopes to signal that the Bears are going to be a factor in November.
More locally, curious to see how Wheaton (MA) handles Bridgewater State on the back-end of a weekend that started with a draw at Springfield.
Quote from: NCAC New England on September 17, 2016, 08:50:44 PM
Some interesting, some high profile, and some important maybe under-the-radar action around the country.
Amherst and Middlebury play to a draw...probably a result that neither team will mind that much.
Wheaton (MA) and Springfield play to a 2-2 tie in a key NEWMAC clash. Speaking of which, what is up with Babson?! After very fortunate circumstances yielded a PK 2OT win over rival Brandeis, the Beavers drew with Fitchburg St 0-0 and toady lost at home to Coast Guard. Seems almost all of the NEWMAC teams have played themselves into a position where they will need to win the NEWMAC tourney to get a bid.
Rutgers-Camden is back in the mix! Torched Rutgers-Newark today and I think now 4-0-2. Kean stays viable with a win over Stockton. Rowan hands Jersey City a first loss and now looks ahead to a showdown with F&M.
Oneonta St. comes from behind to hand the Vassar Brewers a first blemish. Plattsburgh stays unblemished and keeps Skidmore down in the dumps. Potsdam rebounds from a loss to Hobart with a good win over RPI.
Bowdoin gains a very valuable road NESCAC win against fellow perennial mid-table foe Wesleyan, 1-0. Tufts gets back on track dominating Bates, but still has work to do. Williams stays on course for the hoped for revival, getting by Colby at home.
Lycoming comes through with a big win over Scranton.
W&L comes from behind in a potential trap game to prevail over Virginia Wesleyan. Lynchburg follows up a draw with Oglethorpe with an important win over Berry to stay unbeaten.
Dubuque remains unblemished after saddling MSOE with a loss. Perhaps lost among so many games, Loras uncharacteristically drops 2 in a row falling to Carthage last night on a late goal. Carthage's roller-coaster ride of a season continues. Wheaton (Ill) also lost again last night to Wash U and now stands at a stunning 1-4-1. Unlike a Calvin that might be able to count on a conference tourney bid, Wheaton is no cinch for that route given the threat posed by Carthage, Elmhurst and North Park.
Speaking of Elmhurst, they could not handle Chicago last night, as the Maroons spotted the Bluejays a goal and stormed back in a romp. Chicago is handling their business in a very professional and impressive manner, befitting a true Final Four contender.
Concordia (Wis), after beating St. Norbert right after St. Norbert bested Loras, fell today to rival Wisconsin Lutheran.
Kenyon gets a solid road win at Thomas More, while Centre gives up a lead to DePauw and shows resiliency on the road by winning in OT. This sets up a mid-week collision of unblemished teams, as the Colonels head to Gambier. Grove City gets back to its winning ways outlasting Heidelberg 3-2 in OT and now can look forward to a huge game for them versus Carnegie Mellon.
Whitworth shrugged off jet lag and an early deficit to get a win against Willamette.
Haverford takes a big early season Centennial bout over Hopkins.
SLU's climb up the polls should continue after a huge win over Cortland St. Now the Saints go on the road to face another still unblemished SUNYAC, Plattsburgh.
Out West, we should note that Trinity (TX) toppled Colorado Coll last night. Redlands lost to Christopher Newport in one of the games of the week last night but rebounded today with a 5-0 shellacking of Whittier.
In late action, just saw that MIT barely got by Emerson 1-0 in OT. ONU has gone up 1-0 late against CWRU.
Quite a thorough summary. Now I know where to come to see how games played out over the weekend! Great job
Wash U is blowing out Luther, 4-0, after roughly 70 min. UAA will be really interesting if Wash U is as good as that scoreline suggests. The Bears already have a win over Wheaton, which is still a good win even with Wheaton struggling record-wise.
Overlooked and [maybe] deserving some coverage
Best laid plans....did the prep work for this post only to have Keene St lose for the first time to Western CT and Hampden-Sydney lose at home to Birm-Southern.
Forging ahead...
Who expected Clark to be 6-0? The most recent win over WPI should have the rest of the NEWMAC taking note. As for Keene St, we'll see what happens against Middlebury on 9/21. Coast Guard, two years after a NCAA appearance is sitting at 5-0-1 after beating Babson at Babson 2-0. Springfield also is at 5-0-1 after a drew with visiting Wheaton (MA). Also worthy of mention are Williams, now 4-0-1, MIT at 4-1, Bowdoin and Conn College at 3-1, and Endicott and Gordon at 4-1-1. UMass-Boston now at 6-0 has received attention, and we'll see how media faves like Brandeis Tufts shake out over the next few weeks.
While Oneonta and Cortland have dominated the D3 news cycles, Plattsburgh St has gone about their business and is sitting at 7-0. Next week brings a stern challenge with SLU and Potsdam on the docket. I'll throw in that 5-0 New Rochelle is now 5-1 New Rochelle (and that might be beginning and end of New Rochelle coverage for the season). Old but slightly forgotten fave Rochester is 5-0 and likely to be 8-0 leading up to Wash U at home and Chicago away. Bard is a surprising 4-0-2 but the schedule, to be charitable, has been weak with the best win probably over a 1-5 Mount St. Mary outfit. Union most notable result was a big loss to UMass-Boston, but the Dutchmen also with an otherwise weak schedule are 5-1. Potsdam and Vassar are both 5-1-1 with Vassar suffering a tie to New Paltz and loss to Oneonta in the last two. Fredonia St. is 4-1-1 with its best wins over Baldwin-Wallace and Geneva.
Under the radar in the Mid-Atlantic might be Lebanon Valley at 5-1 with several at least decent wins, and Johns Hopkins, at 4-1-2, and despite a 3-2 loss to powerhouse Haverford, may be relevant in the Centennial.
How about Ramapo, at 6-0 and coming off a huge win over true NJAC heavyweight Montclair St. Ramapo might have been the one NJAC school that I couldn't have named. Centre is 5-0 after knocking off Thomas More and DePauw back-to-back. I was primed to hype Hampden Sydney, now 5-1, and I can't bring myself to hype the Emory and Henry Wasps, at 5-0, beyond just typing that. Kean opened the season with a narrow 1-0 loss to Rochester and now has reeled off 7 in a row with 26 goals for and 3 against. Rutgers-Camden, a usual media darling, this seems to have emerged from nowhere with a 4-0-2 start. Then there is St. Mary's at 6-0-1, sporting a draw with RUC and wins over GAC and Catholic. NJ City was a nice story but....Lynchburg has been discussed, but Mary Washington at 5-1 and Randolph surging to 4-1-1 could use a little love. Birm-Southern seems like they've lost 3 times but are 5-1 after today's win. Eastern Mennonite, you are 5-1-2...enjoy while it lasts.
Despite a high ranking, Carnegie Mellon barely has had a mention. The Tartans are a clean 5-0 with a test this week on the road at Grove City, which at 6-1, already has received quite a bit of attention. Capital at 5-1, Oberlin at 5-1, and Transy at 4-0-2 have been largely overlooked. We'll have to see who re-emerges among Thomas More, DePauw, John Carroll, CWRU, Wabash, Hanover and Rose-Hulman.
In the Central, the Millikin Big Blue are 5-0. Wash U will push into the national conversation at 4-0. Stretching to highlight anyone else , but we've got the Alma Scots at 5-1-1 and Concordia (Wis) at 5-1. Carthage (5-2), which has received a ton of attention, and Elmhurst at 3-1-2 are sleepers in the region.
Aside from Loras, the frozen tundra North region as a whole seems to be under-the-radar as a matter of course. The poor sister team from Dubuque, which is Dubuque, stands at 6-0 with an impressive 21 goals for and only 1 against. Macalester is 6-0-1. St. Thomas stands at 5-0-2. The Hamline Pipers are 6-1, with 6 straight wins since an opening day setback to Luther. UW-Platteville is a sneaky 6-1, as is likely not to be mentioned again North Central (Minn). Carleton is hanging around at 3-1-2. The next month should tell us who among UWW, Luther, Wartburg, St. John's and St. Olaf deserve more press.
The West seems to have slim pickings. There are the La Verne Leopards at 5-0-1 but they are staring down the barrel of a tilt with Redlands. Concordia (TX) is 6-1, but the schedule has involved little heavy lifting. Same with University of the Ozarks at 4-1-2. Trinity (TX), Colorado College and Whitworth, and this year Redlands, seem to dominate whatever coverage the West does get but I still would recommend keeping an eye on Texas-Dallas. The Comets are only 2-3-1 but the schedule has been legit and the Tex-Dallas gave Chicago its toughest game, succumbing in the season opener for both on a PK in OT.
Chicago eases out of a close game with Wartburg to win comfortably, 3-0.
Meanwhile, a major upset out West as Christopher Newport fails the back end of the cross-country trip, losing 5-3 to Chapman. A long flight back to Newport News.
Lot of ODAC schools sitting with pretty records on the backs of less than sterling competition. Va Wes, Roanoke, and Shenandoah are the only teams under .500. Va Wes and Roanoke have at least played some teams. E&H and EMU not so much.
NCAC NE Top 15 (Week 3)
1) Chicago (Tie)
1) Rowan (Tie)
3) Kenyon
4) Amherst
5) St Lawrence
6) Trinity (TX)
7) Middlebury
8) Franklin & Marshall
9) Washington University
10) Calvin
11) Washington & Lee
12) UMass-Boston
13) Christopher Newport
14) Ohio Northern
15) Centre
16 thru 25 (alphabetical)
Bowdoin, Carnegie Mellon, Dubuque, Kean, Macalester, Messiah, Oneonta St, OWU, Plattsburgh St, Redlands/Rochester (Tie)
RV (random order) -- Cortland St, Haverford, Williams, Rutgers-Camden, Ramapo, Gordon, Elizabethtown, Brandeis, Montclair St, Potsdam St, Loras, Scranton, Gettysburg, Salisbury, Vassar, Colorado College, Carthage, Scranton, Oberlin, Endicott, Lycoming, Eastern, Grove City, Johns Hopkins, Lynchburg, Randolph
Quote from: jknezek on September 18, 2016, 08:00:07 PM
Lot of ODAC schools sitting with pretty records on the backs of less than sterling competition. Va Wes, Roanoke, and Shenandoah are the only teams under .500. Va Wes and Roanoke have at least played some teams. E&H and EMU not so much.
I think that there are a number of unbeaten (and united) schools right now, certainly more than I've ever seen at this point in the season. As the season progresses, however, I think that number will start to fall drastically.
Quote from: blooter442 on September 18, 2016, 08:38:27 PM
Quote from: jknezek on September 18, 2016, 08:00:07 PM
Lot of ODAC schools sitting with pretty records on the backs of less than sterling competition. Va Wes, Roanoke, and Shenandoah are the only teams under .500. Va Wes and Roanoke have at least played some teams. E&H and EMU not so much.
I think that there are a number of unbeaten (and united) schools right now, certainly more than I've ever seen at this point in the season. As the season progresses, however, I think that number will start to fall drastically.
It's down to 16 (unbeaten/untied).
Quote from: D3soccerwatcher on September 18, 2016, 01:03:39 AM
I've been watching Lycoming as they progress through their schedule. And something jumped out at me...what seemed to be an inordinate number of of Yellow and Red cards. So I compared them to a sampling of top 25 teams around the country and here's what I found (information thru 9/17):
Lycoming: 17Y + 1R = 18 total cards
Rowan: 10Y + 1R = 11 total cards
Amherst: 5Y + 0R = 5 total cards
Trinity: 4Y + 1R = 5 total cards
F&M: 5Y + 0R = 5 total cards
Elizabethtown: 4Y + 0R = 4 total cards
Kenyon: 8Y + 1R = 9 total cards
Lynchburg: 7Y + 1R = 8 total cards
Univ of Chicago: 7Y + 1R = 8 total cards
It looks like Lycoming is leading this category (by a lot). There might be a place on the internet to compare these stats across all teams. I thought I had found a site that did that last year, but I could not find it this year. If you know where that site is, please let us know.
http://stats.ncaa.org/rankings/conference_trends
This website breaks it down by conference...from there you would have to check each team's website to confirm team cards. For example if you check out teams from the Allegheny Mountain CC you will find that the conference is 2nd in the country in terms of cards as a whole behind the Skyline. If you select a few randoms you can easily find teams with multiple card accumulations similar to Lycoming's total count and other schools mentioned in your post. For example, Medaille has 19 yellow cards and 3 red cards but no one seems to mention them because they aren't top 25? I guess I am just confused why you are focusing on top 25 teams and specifically Lycoming? Is there an end analysis or just something you decided to post about? I am sure if you research the Skyline teams you will find similar results.
We discussed last season on this thread about styles of teams and physicality etc. Amherst was among the nation's leaders in cards last season and won the national title. I don't necessarily think it's a bad thing to be a physical team as long as it's not dirty play. Another example is Messiah and with the way they play they typically tend to not pick up any cards. The year they won their last national title, 2013, they had 9 yellow cards and 0 red cards. So I guess I am still just curious on where you are going with your post as you continue to monitor those teams card accumulations...
The Weekday Spotlight
Today/Tonight
Thin slate but Trinity (CT) @ Endicott might be of some interest, more from the Endicott side of things as a win over any NESCAC adds credibility and confidence, while a loss to a bottom-end NESCAC would be a setback at this juncture. Another loss for Trinity might have the Bantams dusting off the golf clubs.
Also mildly curious to see that Redlands doesn't slip against Occidental...speaking of which, we really could use, to borrow political season jargon, a surrogate for regions and/or conferences largely uncovered.
I'm going to assume Wheaton (Ill) won't have trouble with Aurora, but who knows.
Tuesday
SLU @ Plattsburgh would appear to be the headliner, but there are some other good ones as well. This looks like derby day in various forms -- the New London, CT battle with Coast Guard traveling across the street to Conn Coll, Rochester versus St. John Fisher in another Rochester, NY affair, Bates @Bowdoin, Case Western @John Carroll, York (PA) visiting Messiah, and NC Wesleyan traveling to VA Wesleyan.
Other sleeper match-ups are Gordon @ECSU, Salisbury @Eastern, Frostburg @Lycoming and Concordia (Wis) @Elmhurst.
Wednesday
A typical full-slate Wednesday. Two key headliners have to be Rowan @F&M (strong case for game of the week) and Centre @Kenyon.
Also will be keeping an eye on Christopher Newport @Lynchburg, Macalester @Luther, Dubuque @North Park, RPI @Williams, DePauw @Rose-Hulman, St. Mary's @Swat and Carthage @UWW. I doubt Calvin will lose again in the regular season but Kzoo @Calvin might be worth a glance.
Thursday
Transy @Thomas More
Friday
Cortland at Oneonta (another contender for game of the week) and Carnegie Mellon @Grove City.
Update: And of course Wheaton (Ill) already down 1-0 in 1st half.
Wheaton 2, Aurora 2 Final
Wheaton now 1-4-2. Admittedly they have played a very competitive schedule, but I would think they now are in a position where they have to win the CCIW tournament. Are they still missing 5-6 starters to injury?
I think Rowan and Chicago have been the best teams in the country early this year. I'm an east coast guy so I haven't seen Chicago live but I hear they are the real deal. Rowan has had probably the toughest schedule so far and remains undefeated. If they take out F&M on the road tomorrow I don't see how they can not be number 1!
I have to say that the NSCAA rankings make little sense. Teams with multiple blemishes on their record ranked ahead of teams that are perfect. Can't wait to see how D3 ranks tomorrow!
Should be:
Rowan
Kenyon
Chicago
Trinity
St. Lawrence
Amherst
F&M
Ohio Northern
Carnegie Mellon
Centre
How does Amherst drop from the #1 ranking after going on the road and tying a top 25 team in Middlebury? Stats Amherst 16 shots/9 CK vs Midd 11 shots/4 CK.
This is what's wrong with D3 we move the defending champs for what reason? Did they lose? Am I missing something? I would put my money on Amherst to beat every team that moved above them. I use to enjoy D3 top 25 but starting to think it is just like NSCAA a waste of time.
Also anyone that says Rowan has had the toughest schedule I don't agree with. They played one tough road game at Lyco. Everything else is at home which if they are as good as everyone says, they should win. Within the next 2 weeks Amherst will have played as many if not harder games then Rowan has (@ Bowdoin, @ Midd, vs Williams, @ MIT, @ Tufts).
Give the champs some respect until beaten they should not be dethroned.
So you just ignore the blemish because they won last year? That doesn't seem right. If they were expected to win, and didn't, then they drop provided other teams did what they were supposed to do against quality opposition. It makes no sense to freeze a team in place based on last year. You go by results this year. And their result wasn't bad of course, but it wasn't what was expected of the No. 1 team.
It's not like they fell off a cliff. They dropped to third because in 4 games they took a blemish whereas in 7 games against good competition Rowan has not taken a blemish. I get road versus home, but still, there aren't too many polls in any sport where the No 1 team can lose or tie and hold off the dogs from below. Amherst will have plenty of chances to regain that top spot. As you pointed out they have a good schedule in the next 2 weeks. But Rowan has already played and won against good teams, Amherst doesn't get credit for games that they have yet to play and win, especially when they went to a good opponent and didn't win.
And if all that doesn't sway you, think about this. Rowan has a win against #9 W&L. I get it was at home, but that's a better result, right now, than a tie away against Middlebury. So no blemishes, a better signature win, and more games played. Hard to get too hot under the collar objectively.
Quote from: jknezek on September 20, 2016, 09:00:03 AM
So you just ignore the blemish because they won last year? That doesn't seem right. If they were expected to win, and didn't, then they drop provided other teams did what they were supposed to do against quality opposition. It makes no sense to freeze a team in place based on last year. You go by results this year. And their result wasn't bad of course, but it wasn't what was expected of the No. 1 team.
It's not like they fell off a cliff. They dropped to third because in 4 games they took a blemish whereas in 7 games against good competition Rowan has not taken a blemish. I get road versus home, but still, there aren't too many polls in any sport where the No 1 team can lose or tie and hold off the dogs from below. Amherst will have plenty of chances to regain that top spot. As you pointed out they have a good schedule in the next 2 weeks. But Rowan has already played and won against good teams, Amherst doesn't get credit for games that they have yet to play and win, especially when they went to a good opponent and didn't win.
And if all that doesn't sway you, think about this. Rowan has a win against #9 W&L. I get it was at home, but that's a better result, right now, than a tie away against Middlebury. So no blemishes, a better signature win, and more games played. Hard to get too hot under the collar objectively.
Agreed. This isn't a royalty thing. And believing that Amherst would beat the teams (all two of them) above them isn't determinative either. That's not how it works. I bet many of us believe that Haverford, Oneonta and Tufts would beat a bunch of teams ranked ahead of them currently, but that doesn't mean those teams based on results thus far should be ranked ahead of those teams at this juncture.
The back end of Rowan's schedule so far isn't as tough as I remembered but 3 consecutive wins over Lycoming, W&L and Oneonta is impressive. If there is a team that's being underrated so far it's Chicago which has remained unblemished against an even tougher overall schedule.
Finally, you certainly can argue that Amherst should still be #1 but to link dropping all the way down to #3 based on "disrespect" frankly strikes me as bizarre. Attention to the NESCAC dominates the site. But maybe Amherst can turn this disrespect against them into motivation to run the table and win another national title.
Perhaps if Amherst stayed perfect - that is, unbeaten and untied - then they should've kept the top spot (and even that I have problems with) but to suggest that Rowan is not deserving simply because they've played those games at home is leaning very heavily on the belief that "home turf" is a distinct advantage. When you see how many battles between true powerhouses have been won by the away team in recent years (Oneonta @ Haverford last year, Williams @ Amherst in '13 and '14, etc.) perhaps suggests that the advantage of home field is not as great as the difference between the home and away multipliers (0.85 vs. 1.25 IIRC) makes it out to be.
Just playing devil's advocate here:
MASSEY:
1) Amherst SOS 10
2) Chicago SOS 22
3) Trinity SOS 33
4) Rowan SOS 39
5) Kenyon SOS 90
Quote from: lastguyoffthebench on September 20, 2016, 10:48:54 AM
Just playing devil's advocate here:
MASSEY:
1) Amherst SOS 10
2) Chicago SOS 22
3) Trinity SOS 33
4) Rowan SOS 39
5) Kenyon SOS 90
Are those supposed to reflect schedule to date or schedule for the whole season?
Can't get my head around how RIC, Bowdoin, Midd and Pine Manor (followed by Mt. Ida) = SOS at #10.
NCAC, yes. Wheaton is still not close to full health. Danny Brandt has only played 1.5 games this season due to injury. Ben Bakke, a big time player who originally came from Creighton, is also hurt. 4 year starter Reed Bartley has played only 2 games as well. Jaxon Hulse, a sophomore starter, has also been missing games. Max Carey has also been in and out of games. If they can't get healthy by conference play, they are in trouble. Wheaton certainly needs to win their conference to get into NCAA's.
Quote from: lastguyoffthebench on September 20, 2016, 10:48:54 AM
Just playing devil's advocate here:
MASSEY:
1) Amherst SOS 10
2) Chicago SOS 22
3) Trinity SOS 33
4) Rowan SOS 39
5) Kenyon SOS 90
Yes. But Amherst also played only 4 games. If you look at Rowan's first 4 games, they played a Massey team average of 503 versus Amherst's average of 595. Now that's straight up, not accounting for home/away. But, Rowan's first 4 games were a tougher gauntlet, according to Massey, strictly by opponent. Then it falls off for Rowan, as they drop to a 708 average over 7 games.
Not entirely sure how much difference the home/away makes in Massey's formula, too lazy to see if he says, but applying the NCAA multiples you'd end up with Amherst = 595/1.25 476 (all road) and Rowan with a 453 (Lyco and Staten Island on the road, W&L and Oneonta St at home). So by that measure you'd say Rowan had it marginally tougher and didn't take a blemish.
Going forward it won't be hard for Amherst to catch up, as their schedule games 5,6, and 7 are much tougher than Rowan's were. But games 8-14 for Rowan are significantly harder than 8-14 for Amherst as Massey currently calculates.
Regardless, if Rowan keeps winning they should keep that 1 spot. If they accumulate a blemish, it will depend on what teams around them do, but you can't say Rowan hasn't fought for that spot and played quality opponents. If you are an Amherst fan and don't like that your team isn't 1, the simply solution is not to get a blemish...
Rowan at 8th for NSCAA... Behind Macalester
::)
Ohh boy, looks like the NSCAA broke the rules and dropped a defending champs from the #1 spot before they lost a game! How dare they!
Messiah quietly sitting at 5-0-2. Playing well at home as usual but struggling in their few road tests so far. The next 6 games will make or break their season in terms of at-large bid potential. I think they will end up 3-1-2 during that stretch, which isn't great but isn't horrible either. 4/6 are on the road. Losses and ties to Etown, Wash Lee, and Lycoming. Wins vs Misericordia, Leb Val, and Alvernia. If the Falcons can continue growing their confidence and get through this stretch at say 4-0-2 or 4-1-1 watch out!! Realistically I think Messiah will end up 13-1-4 or 13-2-3 and have no problem getting an at-large bid if needed.
Don't know if this is a function of catching some broadcasts from certain schools for the first time, but in general (because there are exceptions in the negative direction) video streams, production, and commentary appear to be getting better and better.
Plattsburgh is with NSN (as is much of the NESCAC) and the quality of video and commentary were very good. Only downside was camera angle from a corner and through netting.
Then caught tail end of Concordia (Wis) versus Elmhurst and Elmhurst also had very good commentary and replays. Good win for Concordia, btw.
Tough loss for Plattsburgh after reversing momentum in 2nd half and dominating SLU for long stretches.
That Rowan goal to equalize with F&M will stand as goal of the year. Wow. And F&M's actually was pretty good as well.
Quote from: Shooter McGavin on September 21, 2016, 10:51:23 AM
Messiah quietly sitting at 5-0-2. Playing well at home as usual but struggling in their few road tests so far. The next 6 games will make or break their season in terms of at-large bid potential. I think they will end up 3-1-2 during that stretch, which isn't great but isn't horrible either. 4/6 are on the road. Losses and ties to Etown, Wash Lee, and Lycoming. Wins vs Misericordia, Leb Val, and Alvernia. If the Falcons can continue growing their confidence and get through this stretch at say 4-0-2 or 4-1-1 watch out!! Realistically I think Messiah will end up 13-1-4 or 13-2-3 and have no problem getting an at-large bid if needed.
Misericordia is by no means an easy game for Messiah. They do not have a loss at home (4-0) and beat York and RC in last 2 home games. They have to play well to beat them. Could be a tie as well.
Quote from: NCAC New England on September 21, 2016, 08:16:06 PM
That Rowan goal to equalize with F&M will stand as goal of the year. Wow. And F&M's actually was pretty good as well.
Wow what a wild second half. Two missed PK's. F&M lots of near misses. They deserved a tie at least but that's soccer. Sometimes the narrowest of margins between victory and defeat.
31 fouls and 6 yellow cards. With so many stoppages it seemed more like a field hockey game at times than a soccer game. Certainly not the prettiest soccer game I've ever seen. Add to that what looked like a very fast turf on the online feed, and the ball was out of bounds frequently as well. Game didn't seem to have much flow to it at all.
Rowan marches on with a huge win. That's the first out of conference loss for F&M in 4 years. Snapped a 30 game unbeaten streak out of conference for F&M! Big road win against a team that will definitely be in the tournament. The surface played fast and hard and the game seemed to big for the referees at times. Both teams had chances and some very exciting moments at both ends. The number 1 ranking didn't trip them up!
And down goes university of Dubuque.
Christopher Newport loses.
Quote from: rudy on September 21, 2016, 08:26:41 PM
Quote from: Shooter McGavin on September 21, 2016, 10:51:23 AM
Messiah quietly sitting at 5-0-2. Playing well at home as usual but struggling in their few road tests so far. The next 6 games will make or break their season in terms of at-large bid potential. I think they will end up 3-1-2 during that stretch, which isn't great but isn't horrible either. 4/6 are on the road. Losses and ties to Etown, Wash Lee, and Lycoming. Wins vs Misericordia, Leb Val, and Alvernia. If the Falcons can continue growing their confidence and get through this stretch at say 4-0-2 or 4-1-1 watch out!! Realistically I think Messiah will end up 13-1-4 or 13-2-3 and have no problem getting an at-large bid if needed.
Misericordia is by no means an easy game for Messiah. They do not have a loss at home (4-0) and beat York and RC in last 2 home games. They have to play well to beat them. Could be a tie as well.
Messiah will win this game 3-1.
Lebanon Valley beat Misericordia 4-0. I would think Messiah could have a similar result.
Quote from: D3soccerwatcher on September 22, 2016, 09:00:18 AM
Lebanon Valley beat Misericordia 4-0. I would think Messiah could have a similar result.
That was away game and early. Not sure if misericordia had injuries or what...but last 2 home games show something. Wouldn't mind 4-0 win but not taking them for granted. Interesting to see Lynchburg beat Christopher Newport 2-1. Messiah tied Lynchburg early in the year 0-0 but thoroughly dominated them. Huge advantage in shots, possession, etc. I thought Lynchburg was not as good as Roanoke that weekend and just packed it in to get the draw. Now they beat a supposed top 10 team who will likely drop some spots after this loss
CNU is always overrated. It was the same saga last season. Ranked top 10 early on then faded and missed NCAAs all together.
Not only did Lynchburg prevail over CNU but in 2nd half dominated stats with something like 10 to 1 shots. I had same thought about Messiah game, wondering how that fits with the picture. CNU has now dropped two in a row after steamrolling all opponents and getting the big win over Redlands.
Watched most of the Rowan-F&M game as well. Both teams looked good and was a high intensity, NCAA-type tilt. Impressive that Rowan comes out with a win after going down 1-0 (against the run of play) on the road against a very good opponent.
In my mind Rowan and Chicago have separated just a bit over the next group which for me is Trinity (TX), Kenyon, SLU, Amherst, F&M and maybe Midd and/or Messiah. I would put W&L, OWU, Calvin and maybe UMass-Boston in the next, next group. Of course at least one team and probably more will emerge later from the group of heavyweights that picked up a couple of early blemishes (Oneonta, Haverford, Brandeis, Montclair, etc).
Two good games going....sleeper game in the West (well, actually Texas) between Concordia (TX) and Tex-Dallas. 1-1 at half. Comets and hosting and video very clear with interesting mix of camera angles and better approximate of speed of play. Really good play too.
Carthage is up 1-0 on UWW and UWW about 70 min in. Big game for both.
Actually Texas-Dallas pushed Chicago more than anyone so far, as the Maroons pulled it out 1-0 in OT in first game of season.
Among the more important games on tap for tomorrow are the Red Dragon Derby (Cortland v Oneonta) and Grove City v Carnegie Mellon.
Blockbuster Weekend Match-Ups
Friday-9/23
#13 Carnegie Mellon@Grove City-----If GC wants any chance at an at-large bid they need a convincing win tonight
Cortland St@Oneonta St-------------Huge implications in this clash. Can Cortland get a signature win over a clicking Oneonta?
Saturday-9/24
Williams@ #3 Amherst-----------------Game of the day? Big road test for Williams and they need a result to be taken seriously.
Rose-Hulman@ #5 Chicago-----------This will prove if Chicago is for real.
York@ #12 Christopher Newport------CAC conference play begins and CNU needs a win in this game or they are facing similar consequences from last season.
Tufts@ #14 Brandeis------------------Another possible game of the day? Jumbos need a result.
RI College@ #16 UMASS-Boston-----Flying under the radar but both teams off to great starts!
Bowdoin@ #20 Middlebury-----------Gotta love the NESCAC match-ups!!
#22 Messiah@Misericordia-----------Misericordia w/some big results as of late and Messiah's road struggles make this a little closer than once thought.
#24 Plattsburgh St@Potsdam St-----Battle of 1 loss teams with big conference implications on the line.
#25 Loras@Nebraska Wesleyan------Loras is in a downward spiral and might get tripped up once again by a stingy NW.
DePauw@Oberlin---------------------A big 3 game stretch starts for DePauw and this will be the easiest of the 3 for them.
Case Western@Lycoming------------Possibly the biggest game for two non-ranked opponents. It's make or break for both teams at this point.
Keuka@Morrisville St-------------------Winner wins the NEAC? Time will tell but this is a big one for both teams.
Swarthmore@Hopkins-----------------Centennial jostling starts for both teams in this cricital battle.
Rochester@RPI-----------------------A win for UR would almost guarantee a top 25 ranking in the next poll and an at-large bid would be in sights.
Eastern@Cabrini----------------------After not playing last season the rivalry is back!! Big game for Eastern to stay on pace in the region.
Camden@Montclair St----------------Big time game in the NJAC!!
Kean@Newark------------------------Playoff positioning on the line for these two teams with combined records of 15-3 this season!
Top 5 Games of the Weekend
1. Williams@Amherst
2. Tufts@Brandeis
3. Camden@Montclair
4. Rose-Hulman@Chicago
5. Bowdoin@Middlebury
Honorable Mention: Eastern@Cabrini(Rivalry), Swat@JHU, CWR@Lyco, and Kean@RUN
Quote from: Mid-Atlantic Fan on September 23, 2016, 09:40:10 AM
Blockbuster Weekend Match-Ups
Friday-9/23
#13 Carnegie Mellon@Grove City-----If GC wants any chance at an at-large bid they need a convincing win tonight
Cortland St@Oneonta St-------------Huge implications in this clash. Can Cortland get a signature win over a clicking Oneonta?
Saturday-9/24
Williams@ #3 Amherst-----------------Game of the day? Big road test for Williams and they need a result to be taken seriously.
Rose-Hulman@ #5 Chicago-----------This will prove if Chicago is for real.
York@ #12 Christopher Newport------CAC conference play begins and CNU needs a win in this game or they are facing similar consequences from last season.
Tufts@ #14 Brandeis------------------Another possible game of the day? Jumbos need a result.
RI College@ #16 UMASS-Boston-----Flying under the radar but both teams off to great starts!
Bowdoin@ #20 Middlebury-----------Gotta love the NESCAC match-ups!!
#22 Messiah@Misericordia-----------Misericordia w/some big results as of late and Messiah's road struggles make this a little closer than once thought.
#24 Plattsburgh St@Potsdam St-----Battle of 1 loss teams with big conference implications on the line.
#25 Loras@Nebraska Wesleyan------Loras is in a downward spiral and might get tripped up once again by a stingy NW.
DePauw@Oberlin---------------------A big 3 game stretch starts for DePauw and this will be the easiest of the 3 for them.
Case Western@Lycoming------------Possibly the biggest game for two non-ranked opponents. It's make or break for both teams at this point.
Keuka@Morrisville St-------------------Winner wins the NEAC? Time will tell but this is a big one for both teams.
Swarthmore@Hopkins-----------------Centennial jostling starts for both teams in this cricital battle.
Rochester@RPI-----------------------A win for UR would almost guarantee a top 25 ranking in the next poll and an at-large bid would be in sights.
Eastern@Cabrini----------------------After not playing last season the rivalry is back!! Big game for Eastern to stay on pace in the region.
Camden@Montclair St----------------Big time game in the NJAC!!
Kean@Newark------------------------Playoff positioning on the line for these two teams with combined records of 15-3 this season!
Top 5 Games of the Weekend
1. Williams@Amherst
2. Tufts@Brandeis
3. Camden@Montclair
4. Rose-Hulman@Chicago
5. Bowdoin@Middlebury
Honorable Mention: Eastern@Cabrini(Rivalry), Swat@JHU, CWR@Lyco, and Kean@RUN
Chicago is 8-0 with ONE goal against, a schedule not filled with cupcakes. How much "realer" to they have to get???? ;D
As real as Rowan proved after beating F&M this past week. Rose-Hulman is a big test and if they get a good result then I think you will see less doubters and more respect, which they should already have IMO.
Quote from: Domino1195 on September 23, 2016, 11:19:06 AM
Quote from: Mid-Atlantic Fan on September 23, 2016, 09:40:10 AM
Blockbuster Weekend Match-Ups
Friday-9/23
#13 Carnegie Mellon@Grove City-----If GC wants any chance at an at-large bid they need a convincing win tonight
Cortland St@Oneonta St-------------Huge implications in this clash. Can Cortland get a signature win over a clicking Oneonta?
Saturday-9/24
Williams@ #3 Amherst-----------------Game of the day? Big road test for Williams and they need a result to be taken seriously.
Rose-Hulman@ #5 Chicago-----------This will prove if Chicago is for real.
York@ #12 Christopher Newport------CAC conference play begins and CNU needs a win in this game or they are facing similar consequences from last season.
Tufts@ #14 Brandeis------------------Another possible game of the day? Jumbos need a result.
RI College@ #16 UMASS-Boston-----Flying under the radar but both teams off to great starts!
Bowdoin@ #20 Middlebury-----------Gotta love the NESCAC match-ups!!
#22 Messiah@Misericordia-----------Misericordia w/some big results as of late and Messiah's road struggles make this a little closer than once thought.
#24 Plattsburgh St@Potsdam St-----Battle of 1 loss teams with big conference implications on the line.
#25 Loras@Nebraska Wesleyan------Loras is in a downward spiral and might get tripped up once again by a stingy NW.
DePauw@Oberlin---------------------A big 3 game stretch starts for DePauw and this will be the easiest of the 3 for them.
Case Western@Lycoming------------Possibly the biggest game for two non-ranked opponents. It's make or break for both teams at this point.
Keuka@Morrisville St-------------------Winner wins the NEAC? Time will tell but this is a big one for both teams.
Swarthmore@Hopkins-----------------Centennial jostling starts for both teams in this cricital battle.
Rochester@RPI-----------------------A win for UR would almost guarantee a top 25 ranking in the next poll and an at-large bid would be in sights.
Eastern@Cabrini----------------------After not playing last season the rivalry is back!! Big game for Eastern to stay on pace in the region.
Camden@Montclair St----------------Big time game in the NJAC!!
Kean@Newark------------------------Playoff positioning on the line for these two teams with combined records of 15-3 this season!
Top 5 Games of the Weekend
1. Williams@Amherst
2. Tufts@Brandeis
3. Camden@Montclair
4. Rose-Hulman@Chicago
5. Bowdoin@Middlebury
Honorable Mention: Eastern@Cabrini(Rivalry), Swat@JHU, CWR@Lyco, and Kean@RUN
Chicago is 8-0 with ONE goal against, a schedule not filled with cupcakes. How much "realer" to they have to get???? ;D
I am intrigued to see how Chicago handles their UAA schedule. If they survive that then I will be a believer but beating a subpar Wheaton team doesn't make them "real" to me yet. Sure they didn't play cupcakes but they also didn't play multiple nationally ranked teams like others have this season.
Trending Review
The camera is beginning to focus...
Rowan and Chicago have separated just a bit with outstanding and consistent play while a pack of 4-5 runners are still easily within striking distance. And here comes Oneonta roaring back after the overreaction to two initial one-goal losses to the #1 ranked team in the country and another top 10-15 squad (W&L).
The disappointing trends are perhaps the easiest to identify. Thomas More has lost 4 out of 5, although in fairness one loss was to D1 Cincinnati in a game that was only 1-0 into the last minute and none of the other losses were big surprises except for perhaps the last one to still undefeated Transy. After a 4-0 start Rose Hulman has now lost 4 straight. Sewanee opened 4-0 and is now 4-3-1. York (PA) has lost 4 straight after a strong beginning. Apparent powerhouses just a while ago, Redlands and Christopher Newport have lost 2 each inside of a week. RPI has lost 3 in a row, albeit all away to Oneonta, Potsdam and Williams. John Carroll looked promising early but has now stumbled to 3-3-1 after a key loss at home to CWRU. You may recall JCU getting snubbed a couple of years ago with a 17-4 ledger, and pumping up the SoS only works with relative success. Wheaton (Ill) is a stunning 1-4-3. I still wouldn't count the Thunder out as they have just as good a chance as anyone in the CCIW to get the conference AQ, especially if they get some injured players back on the pitch, but a Pool C is probably already off the table. Babson is a very mediocre 3-4-1, taking on more water right after clipping Brandeis. Highly touted Loras has lost 2 straight, and somewhat touted UWW has failed to impress sitting at 3-2-2.
On the more positive end of the spectrum, we've seen historical powerhouses Messiah and Williams start with real promise instilling hope in their faithful. Calvin has stormed back after a loss to OWU. Then there are some less heralded teams trying hard to make noise. Ramapo is 7-0 and could be 9-0 heading into a match with Rutgers-Camden. Capital has won 6 in a row and will get a chance to impress more nationally with OWU visiting. Oberlin is 6-1, although one wonders if a 4-3 win over Baldwin-Wallace where the Yeomen were outshot 25-10 foretells troubles ahead. St Thomas stands at 6-0-2 and hopes to challenge also undefeated Macalester. Emory has scratched back to 5-2 after 3 wins in a row. Gettysburg is 4-1-1 and Johns Hopkins is 5-1-2. Lynchburg is an impressive 5-0-2 and coming off a valuable win over CNU. Scranton and E'town are both 5-1, and Eastern is 5-1-1 with an overlooked key win over Salisbury. Carthage has been a little all over the map but clearly are a dangerous outfit going forward. Gordon is putting together a pretty good resume. Keep an eye on Concordia(Wis) and Concordia (TX) had won 6 straight until an OT defeat by Texas-Dallas. Grove City's win over CMU today will reaffirm supporters and leave doubters wanting more. Same with Transy at 5-0-2 after a nice victory over Thomas More. Endicott was impressing but the loss to Trinity (CT) could prove deadly.
In the treading water but still dangerous category are Brandeis, Montclair, Haverford, Lycoming and Tufts. If any of them put together a nice 5-6 game win streak they will find themselves fully back on the radar. Also will be interesting to see how Plattsburgh and Cortland rebound from losses.
In the raising eyebrows but still more data needed category I would put Wash U at 4-0, Rochester at 6-0 and Kean at 8-1 (only loss on opening day away to Rochester).
My take on the weekend...
Williams@Amherst and Bowdoin@Midd are definitely two to watch but may be a bit overhyped. Williams is going to be fine but those wishing for Williams to be on even terms with Amherst I think are a bit premature. I see Amherst winning at home 2-0. The Ephs will have a better chance if the meet later down the road. It's also time for Middlebury to have an impressive win. Bowdoin just tied a Bates team that was outshot by Tufts 85-3 or something like that. Anything less than a 2-0 Midd win would be disappointing from my vantage point.
The best games of the day are the ones with big names that already have blemishes and are fighting for viability as Pool Cs. That means Tufts@Brandeis, RUC@Montclair, Kean@RUN, and maybe CWRU@Lycoming (although CWRU will need more than this game). Plattsburgh really needs to beat Potsdam but Potsdam has real life as well so that makes for a compelling matchup. And Cortland cannot afford to lose to an underappreciated New Paltz team (4-0-4). Also in the SUNYAC a vibrant Fredonia St at 6-1-1 looks to stay in the upper half facing Geneseo. DePauw@Oberlin is a huge Great Lakes and NCAC game, and they have some history. An Oberlin win at DePauw in 2013 probably put Oberlin in as a Pool C and left DePauw out. They have played very tight games the last couple of years. Oberlin hasn't generated any real confidence in them thus far and a win over DePauw would certainly help. Then there are the in-conference games among key foes who maybe already are out for Pool Cs but need to secure conference playoff spots. It's hard to get excited about Liberty League (other than SLU) and NEWMAC games, but tomorrow brings conference tourney-like tilts with WPI@Wheaton(MA) and Babson@MIT. Meanwhile, Coast Guard should challenge unblemished Clark. Hobart gets a shot at SLU while Vassar travels to downtrodden Skidmore. Rochester@RPI could be a good one, but probably won't be. Swarthmore@JHU is in same mold...a key conference matchup in the race to secure a conference tourney slot. Same story with MSOE@Concrodia(Wis).
Interesting "can they bounce back" games involve CNU hosting York, Centre entertaining Oglethorphe and E'town hosting Drew. Randolph also will look to avoid a damaging loss the VA Wesleyan. St. Mary's@PS-Harrisburg is a key CAC contest.
Capital@Thomas More has some compelling storylines with Capital's win streak and TMC's swoon, but watching a game on a turf football field is painful (unless it's the Rock Bowl). And the poor video doesn't help. Wesleyan really needs to beat Bates, and Conn Coll@Hamilton could end up being the best NESCAC game of the day. St Thomas needs to beat GAC at home.
I think Rose Hulman@Chicago will be mildly interesting for a half but I'm expecting at least a 3 goals win for the Maroons. I also don't see Messiah slipping up at Misericordia.
Sunday doesn't offer much, but after today Carnegie Mellon is facing a real dilemma on the road against a desperate John Carroll. The Tartans could drop two in a row leaving little room for more than a couple of blemishes in UAA play.
Williams@Bates could be tricky for the Ephs especially if they expend a ton of emotional energy at Amherst. Same kind of deal with Conn Coll traveling all the way back from Hamilton to host Colby.
As we catch our breaths before the evening session....
What the heck is the deal with Clark? 8-0 after beating Coast Guard 2-0. Sure, there are some tougher NEWMAC battles ahead, but still, who thought we'd be referring to 8-0 Clark? New recruits? Transfers? What?
I'm watching Centre do just what I've seen before. After looking like a viable NCAA candidate in the pre-conference phase a few weeks later they're 2-3-2 in the SAA. Going into 2nd OT with 0-4-2 Oglethorphe. Now Oglethorpe is getting a PK. Petrels win....after outshooting Centre by a large margin. Just don't get it.
In the NESCAC Middlebury survives Bowdoin 2-1 in OT on a PK as well. Hamilton beats a Devlin-less Conn Coll 1-0. Amherst squanders a 2-0 lead to Williams but rebounds to win 4-2. Colby, after the ref gives them a second throw-in attempt with under a minute left in the 2nd OT beats Trinity at Trinity. Bates surprisingly handles Wesleyan with apparent ease 2-0.
In the NEWMAC in two key battles the road team wins....WPI over Wheaton (MA) and Babson over MIT.
In SUNYAC action Fredonia St gets rudely brought back to earth with a 6-1 drubbing by Geneseo. Cortland sneaks by New Paltz 1-0, Oneonta crushes Oswego, and Plattsburgh gets a big bounceback win over Potsdam.
Ramapo's dream season stutters with a 1-1 draw with Stockton.
In some of the biggest news of the day Hobart shocks SLU at SLU 1-0. In other LL action we had a pair of draws -- Vassar@ Skidmore and RIT@ Clarkson.
Tough-to-figure Oberlin gets a vital NCAC win at home over DePauw.
And Lycoming wins 1-0 over CWRU in a game Lycoming outshoots the Spartans 19-2.
E'town and Drew are 0-0 late.
Quote from: rudy on September 22, 2016, 09:08:43 AM
Quote from: D3soccerwatcher on September 22, 2016, 09:00:18 AM
Lebanon Valley beat Misericordia 4-0. I would think Messiah could have a similar result.
That was away game and early. Not sure if misericordia had injuries or what...but last 2 home games show something. Wouldn't mind 4-0 win but not taking them for granted. Interesting to see Lynchburg beat Christopher Newport 2-1. Messiah tied Lynchburg early in the year 0-0 but thoroughly dominated them. Huge advantage in shots, possession, etc. I thought Lynchburg was not as good as Roanoke that weekend and just packed it in to get the draw. Now they beat a supposed top 10 team who will likely drop some spots after this loss
Exactly as I predicted...Messiah and Misericordia ends in 1-1 tie. Messiah struggling to win games on the road on turf fields. They were very close to getting the winner but just could not put one away. Of this were a home game I have no doubt they would have won.
Chicago scores twice in first 22 or so minutes and coasts over Rose-Hulman. Shots 18 to 1. Corners 10 to 2.
Decided to check in on the unblemished Millikin Big Blue. Already down 5-0 in 1st half versus UWW.
And Rowan put up 6 on WPU.
Polls this week?
MAF Top 25
1. Rowan 9-0-0
2. Chicago 9-0-0
3. Trinity (Tx) 8-0-0
4. Amherst 5-0-1
5. Kenyon 8-0-0
6. Ohio Northern 9-0-1
7. Washington Lee 6-1-0
8. Calvin 7-1-0
9. Mass-Boston 8-0-0
10. St. Lawrence 7-1-0
11. Macalester 7-0-1
12. Middlebury 4-0-1
13. Franklin & Marshall 5-1-3
14. Plattsburgh St. 8-1-0
15. Rochester 6-0-1
16. Haverford 5-1-2
17. Lynchburg 6-0-2
18. Messiah 5-0-3
19. Grove City 7-1-0
20. Carnegie Mellon 6-1-0
21. Ohio Wesleyan 5-1-2
22. Oneonta St. 7-2-0
23. Lycoming 5-2-2
24. Springfield 6-0-1
25. Washington U. 5-0-0
RV: Scranton, Gettysburg, Etown, Eastern, Union, Vassar, Buffalo St., Clark, Gordon, Williams, Ramapo, St. Marys (Md), Kean, RUN, RUC, Montclair St., NJCU, Centre, CNU, Oberlin, Capital, Carthage, Concordia, St. Thomas, Dubuque, St. Norbert, St. Olaf, Redlans, Colorado College, Ozarks, Whitwirth
NCAC NE Top 15 (Week 4)
1) Chicago (TIE)
1) Rowan (TIE)
[Can't see any clear reason to pick one over the other as both continue to live up to and/or exceed expectation]
3) Kenyon
4) Amherst
5) Oneonta St (Huge rise I know but who would want to play them?)
6) Trinity (TX) (Tough to evaluate with schedule and not totally sold but they keep winning)
7) Middlebury
8) Calvin
9) Washington & Lee
10) Ohio Northern
11) UMass-Boston
12) Wash U
13) St Lawrence
14) Rochester
15) Franklin & Marshall
16 thru 25 (alphabetical) -- Gordon, Haverford, Lycoming, Lynchburg, Macalester, Messiah, Montclair St, OWU, Plattsburgh, Eastern/St Thomas/Williams (TIE)
RV (random order) -- Carnegie Mellon, Oberlin, Grove City, Elizabethtown, Christopher Newport, Redlands, Cortland St, Buffalo St, Capital, Concordia (Wis), Rutgers-Newark, Ramapo, Gettysburg, WPI, Scranton, Colorado Coll, Vassar, Clark, Dubuque, Lebanon Valley, Springfield, Randolph, Claremont-Mudd-Scripps, Kean, Transylvania, Chapman/La Verne
Unranked and dangerous -- Bowdoin, Brandeis, Carthage, Emory, Johns Hopkins, Loras, Rutgers-Camden, Swarthmore, Tufts
*** Presumes Williams and Macalester winning today, and CMU would drop out of RV with a loss to John Carroll
Big slate of weekday games
First, great job by Carnegie Mellon going on the road and getting a W at a seemingly fading John Carroll (at Don Shula Stadium). Williams also comes through as predicted, and Macalester remains unbeaten while Conn Coll picks up a vital NESCAC win. Springfield, also still unbeaten but with bigger fish ahead, decimates Keene St which apparently just gave us a head-fake with a good start and the win over Wheaton (MA). The West is a mess, or at least a very foggy picture, as Whitworth draws and then loses in consecutive days in the NWC (Puget Sound and Pac Lutheran). Colorado Coll blows out Southwestern 4-0 while Trinity (TX) has a scare in a 2OT squeaker over Centenary (LA) [is that same Centenary that produced Robert Parish for the Celtics?]. UW-Platteville moves to 8-2 with a win over Minnesota-Morris. And Loras gets back in the win column traveling to Nebraska for an Iowa conference game.
Monday
Chapman@ Redlands -- Redlands is sputtering and Chapman beat CNU on the back end of the Captains' trip out West.
Tuesday
A smaller slate than Wednesday but some big games nonetheless and some that could seriously derail the chances of a few teams in terms of post-season hopes.
The headliners are Kenyon@ CRWU and Chicago@ Carthage. Chicago may get its toughest test yet as Carthage has proven to be dangerous and unafraid of challenges. Alma slipped up against Albion so Calvin@ Alma loses a bit of luster but a key conference battle regardless.
And then there are a handful of fascinating games...Wheaton (MA)@ Brandeis, Transy@ Centre, Middlebury@ Hamilton (and the Continentals should be confident with an early 3-0 NESCAC record and a great showing against resurgent Oneonta), Endicott@ WPI (a huge sleeper game in New England region), Wesleyan@ Tufts (fascinating to see if these teams continue in present directions) and New Paltz St@ Union.
Wednesday
Make sure you've got the extra devices charged and ready to go as will hard to pick which games to watch especially for neutrals...
Best of the bunch would seem to be OWU@ Capital (as Capital is on a big win streak and looking for respect), Loras@ UWW, Montclair@ Kean, Gettysburg@ Johns Hopkins, Bowdoin@ Babson, Lycoming@ Misericordia and of course the famed "Marshmellow Bowl" with E'town@ Messiah. Out West La Verne takes a strong record to one-loss Claremont-Mudd-Scripps.
Trap game and potential upset alerts involve Rowan@Stockton, Amherst@ MIT, F&M@ Ursinus, Randolph@ Christopher Newport, Ramapo@ William Paterson and Otterbein@ Oberlin.
Mary Washington@ NC Wesleyan, Swarthmore@ Mulenberg and Luther@ UW-Platteville may draw regional interest as well.
Thursday
Thomas More@ DePauw...TMC is now reduced to hoping to prevail over Grove City for the PRAC AQ and DePauw now desperately needs a win to keep Pool C hopes alive.
Friday
Dominated by a full slate of SUNYAC and Liberty League action.
This is the last week of a fair amount of non-conference games as Saturday, October 1 signals the real next phase of the season with conference play dominating from then until Selection Day. Here's a tease....Saturday the UAA finally gets underway with Chicago@ Emory and Brandeis@ Carnegie Mellon. And how about Kean@ Rowan, Kenyon@ DePauw, Vassar@ SLU, Gettysburg@ Haverford and Plattsburgh St@ Cortland St?
The excitement just ramps up from here.
Shooter's Rankings
1. Rowan
2. Chicago
3. Kenyon
4. Ohio Northern
5. Amherst
6. Trinity (Tx)
7. Calvin
8. Oneonta St
9. St. Lawrence
10. Washington & Lee
11. Middlebury
12. Haverford
13. Mass-Boston
14. F&M
15. Plattsburgh
16. Messiah
17. Rochester
18. Grove City
19. Wash U
20. Macalester
21. OWU
22. Montclair
23. Lynchburg
24. Springfield
25. Gordon
RV: Lycoming, CNU, Redlands, Vassar, Buffalo St, Scranton, Etown, Loras, Brandeis, CMU, Williams, Eastern, RUC, RUN, Clark, Colorado College, Dubuque, WPI
How is Ramapo not ahead of Montclair? The won at Montclair and are still undefeated! I don't think they will be their at the end but as for now, to me it doesn't make a lot of sense. They are not even receiving votes?
Thoughts on the Pool B bid? New Rochelle, Platteville, Whitewater?
Quote from: dontshootthegoose on September 26, 2016, 02:54:06 PM
Thoughts on the Pool B bid? New Rochelle, Platteville, Whitewater?
As of right now it's tight between those 3 but based off record, SOS, RvR, the eye ball test, etc. I would go with UWW, Platteville, then New Rochelle although that is opposite of how they are based on record. We will see how it shapes up but I think results vs Macalester, Luther, and Milikin and a tough loss to Carthage and an okay loss to Benedictine sits better than not playing anyone like New Rochelle and Platteville has lost both of their tough games.
NR: 6-1, RVR 0-0-0 and will likely stay 0-0-0, winning % .857
UWP: 8-2-0, RvR 0-2-0 w/opportunity of 3 other ranked teams, winning % .800
UWW: 4-2-2, RvR 2-2-1 w/potential of 6 more ranked teams, winning % .625
1) Anyone have any insight on when and if Majumder will be back for Tufts?
2) Same for Corkery at Haverford?
3) Will most of the injured players from Wheaton (Ill) be back in the next 2-3 weeks?
Quote from: NCAC New England on September 25, 2016, 08:46:13 PM
Big slate of weekday games
[...] Colorado Coll blows out Southwestern 4-0 while Trinity (TX) has a scare in a 2OT squeaker over Centenary (LA) [is that same Centenary that produced Robert Parish for the Celtics?].
Yes. Centenary [La.] was one of the smallest Division I colleges before moving to D3 about a decade ago.
And Chicago blowing open what was a tight 2-2 game with Carthage. 4-2, 15 left.
5-2.
6-2 Chicago now. Carthage leaving themselves open and Chicago running straight through them.
Quote from: NCAC New England on September 27, 2016, 09:50:36 AM
3) Will most of the injured players from Wheaton (Ill) be back in the next 2-3 weeks?
This was the injury report from a Wheaton insider a week ago in this room:
Quote from: Toure87 on September 20, 2016, 11:15:44 AM
Wheaton is still not close to full health. Danny Brandt has only played 1.5 games this season due to injury. Ben Bakke, a big time player who originally came from Creighton, is also hurt. 4 year starter Reed Bartley has played only 2 games as well. Jaxon Hulse, a sophomore starter, has also been missing games. Max Carey has also been in and out of games.
Here is their appearances, as of this evening:
* Brandt has played in three of Wheaton's nine matches, starting one of them.
* Bakke has played in seven of Wheaton's nine matches, starting four of them.
* Bartley has played in five of Wheaton's nine matches, starting three of them.
* Hulse has played in five of Wheaton's nine matches, starting three of them.
* Carey has played in seven of Wheaton's nine matches, starting six of them.
Here's the situation regarding each of them in Wheaton's three most recent matches:
* Hulse and Carey started in Wheaton's 2-2 draw with Aurora a week ago yesterday, while Bartley and Bakke came in as subs. Brandt didn't play.
* In Wheaton's 1-1 draw with Benedictine last Wednesday, Bartley and Hulse started and Brandt came in as a sub. Bakke and Carey didn't play.
* Tonight, in Wheaton's 1-0 win over Lake Forest, Bartley and Carey started and Bakke came in as a sub. Brandt and Hulse didn't play.
Whether the non-starts and the DNPs are the results of ongoing injuries or of the coach's decisions is unclear. But these are the facts as they appear on the Wheaton statistics page.
Last year's Sweet 16 teams are listed below with current record. 4 or 5 of the teams might already be eliminated from at-large bid contention with a few others riding a fine line. Who has the best chance to get back to this point this year? Who has the best chance to make the final on this list? Thoughts on the biggest surprises?
I think everyone can agree that Wheaton, Brandeis, and Tufts are the biggest disappointments. If 1 of these 3 have the season they are I don't think it is as shocking, but to have all 3 struggling this bad so early is eye opening. You could even throw Loras into the mix as well but they are on that fine line right now.
Amherst: 5-0-1
Lyco: 5-2-2
Brandeis: 3-3-1
Trinity (Tx): 9-0-0
Fords: 5-1-2
SLU: 7-1-0
Oneonta: 7-2-0
MIT: 4-3-0
Loras: 4-2-0
DePauw: 4-2-2
St. Olaf: 4-1-3
Wheaton (Ill): 2-4-3
Tufts: 3-3-1
Kenyon: 8-1-0
F&M: 5-1-3
Calvin: 7-1-0
Rowans next three: at Stockton, Kean, at MSU.
Stockton will just sit in and possibly escape with a draw.
Rowan should win at home vs Kean.
MSU will knock off Rowan... I still think MSU is the best team in the NJAC and will win the AQ.
Then the Profs host Camden and travel to Newark. This is a tricky 5 game run that could see Rowan pick up 3 blemishes, but I'm leaning on 2 (MSU and a wild card)...
Quote from: lastguyoffthebench on September 28, 2016, 09:13:39 AM
Rowans next three: at Stockton, Kean, at MSU.
Stockton will just sit in and possibly escape with a draw.
Rowan should win at home vs Kean.
MSU will knock off Rowan... I still think MSU is the best team in the NJAC and will win the AQ.
Then the Profs host Camden and travel to Newark. This is a tricky 5 game run that could see Rowan pick up 3 blemishes, but I'm leaning on 2 (MSU and a wild card)...
Didn't see the game but looks like Kean knocked off MSU 4-3.
And Stockton holds off #1 Rowan, 0-0. Chicago and Amherst #1 and #2 in the country in some order.
Quote from: NCAC New England on September 28, 2016, 11:13:20 PM
And Stockton holds off #1 Rowan, 0-0. Chicago and Amherst #1 and #2 in the country in some order.
Given that Chicago is 10–0 while Amherst has a tie to its name and very nearly lost to a .500 MIT side tonight (likely but for a blown offsides call), I'll give it to Chicago at this point. Could very well change once the UAA games start.
Rowan outshot Stockton 29-12 and 17-1 adavtage in corners! Couldn't get one to fall in a driving wind and rain.
Quote from: Gregory Sager on September 27, 2016, 10:24:48 PM
Quote from: NCAC New England on September 27, 2016, 09:50:36 AM
3) Will most of the injured players from Wheaton (Ill) be back in the next 2-3 weeks?
This was the injury report from a Wheaton insider a week ago in this room:
Quote from: Toure87 on September 20, 2016, 11:15:44 AM
Wheaton is still not close to full health. Danny Brandt has only played 1.5 games this season due to injury. Ben Bakke, a big time player who originally came from Creighton, is also hurt. 4 year starter Reed Bartley has played only 2 games as well. Jaxon Hulse, a sophomore starter, has also been missing games. Max Carey has also been in and out of games.
Here is their appearances, as of this evening:
* Brandt has played in three of Wheaton's nine matches, starting one of them.
* Bakke has played in seven of Wheaton's nine matches, starting four of them.
* Bartley has played in five of Wheaton's nine matches, starting three of them.
* Hulse has played in five of Wheaton's nine matches, starting three of them.
* Carey has played in seven of Wheaton's nine matches, starting six of them.
Here's the situation regarding each of them in Wheaton's three most recent matches:
* Hulse and Carey started in Wheaton's 2-2 draw with Aurora a week ago yesterday, while Bartley and Bakke came in as subs. Brandt didn't play.
* In Wheaton's 1-1 draw with Benedictine last Wednesday, Bartley and Hulse started and Brandt came in as a sub. Bakke and Carey didn't play.
* Tonight, in Wheaton's 1-0 win over Lake Forest, Bartley and Carey started and Bakke came in as a sub. Brandt and Hulse didn't play.
Whether the non-starts and the DNPs are the results of ongoing injuries or of the coach's decisions is unclear. But these are the facts as they appear on the Wheaton statistics page.
Brandt did not come in as a sub in the Benedictine game. He has not played or even dressed since the Rose-Hulman game on September 3. He has been injured and has not played since. The stat on Brandt playing is wrong. According to the live feed from the game, Bakke is nursing an ankle injury.
Quote from: blooter442 on September 28, 2016, 11:59:41 PM
Given that Chicago is 10–0 while Amherst has a tie to its name and very nearly lost to a .500 MIT side tonight (likely but for a blown offsides call), I'll give it to Chicago at this point. Could very well change once the UAA games start.
Impressive start by Chicago. Have they played any ranked teams yet?
Bloots, any change in opinion after Metro's helpful proof of the first goal as onside? ;)
Quote from: Jump4Joy on October 01, 2016, 11:42:00 AM
Impressive start by Chicago. Have they played any ranked teams yet?
Bloots, any change in opinion after Metro's helpful proof of the first goal as onside? ;)
Would have to look again, but they've played Carthage and Wheaton I believe. Will be curious to see how they do against Emory today.
And no, I haven't changed my opinion, because while he impressively dissects the call and makes a compelling case he actually - contrary to what you just said - did
not provide irrefutable proof that the linesman was in the correct position
or that he was onside. Nice try, though. ;)
Quote from: blooter442 on September 28, 2016, 11:59:41 PM
Quote from: NCAC New England on September 28, 2016, 11:13:20 PM
And Stockton holds off #1 Rowan, 0-0. Chicago and Amherst #1 and #2 in the country in some order.
Given that Chicago is 10–0 while Amherst has a tie to its name and very nearly lost to a .500 MIT side tonight (likely but for a blown offsides call), I'll give it to Chicago at this point. Could very well change once the UAA games start.
Tufts over Amherst today 3-0. So they will certainly drop in rankings.
Quote from: Toure87 on September 30, 2016, 01:29:06 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on September 27, 2016, 10:24:48 PM
Quote from: NCAC New England on September 27, 2016, 09:50:36 AM
3) Will most of the injured players from Wheaton (Ill) be back in the next 2-3 weeks?
This was the injury report from a Wheaton insider a week ago in this room:
Quote from: Toure87 on September 20, 2016, 11:15:44 AM
Wheaton is still not close to full health. Danny Brandt has only played 1.5 games this season due to injury. Ben Bakke, a big time player who originally came from Creighton, is also hurt. 4 year starter Reed Bartley has played only 2 games as well. Jaxon Hulse, a sophomore starter, has also been missing games. Max Carey has also been in and out of games.
Here is their appearances, as of this evening:
* Brandt has played in three of Wheaton's nine matches, starting one of them.
* Bakke has played in seven of Wheaton's nine matches, starting four of them.
* Bartley has played in five of Wheaton's nine matches, starting three of them.
* Hulse has played in five of Wheaton's nine matches, starting three of them.
* Carey has played in seven of Wheaton's nine matches, starting six of them.
Here's the situation regarding each of them in Wheaton's three most recent matches:
* Hulse and Carey started in Wheaton's 2-2 draw with Aurora a week ago yesterday, while Bartley and Bakke came in as subs. Brandt didn't play.
* In Wheaton's 1-1 draw with Benedictine last Wednesday, Bartley and Hulse started and Brandt came in as a sub. Bakke and Carey didn't play.
* Tonight, in Wheaton's 1-0 win over Lake Forest, Bartley and Carey started and Bakke came in as a sub. Brandt and Hulse didn't play.
Whether the non-starts and the DNPs are the results of ongoing injuries or of the coach's decisions is unclear. But these are the facts as they appear on the Wheaton statistics page.
Brandt did not come in as a sub in the Benedictine game. He has not played or even dressed since the Rose-Hulman game on September 3. He has been injured and has not played since. The stat on Brandt playing is wrong. According to the live feed from the game, Bakke is nursing an ankle injury.
Well, Brandt played tonight. In the 87th minute he got Wheaton's only goal in a 2-1 loss to North Park. In fact, all of the players you've mentioned save Bakke played this evening against NPU.
The win gives NPU the leg up on the rest of the CCIW. The Vikings are now 3-0 in league play, while Carthage and Illinois Wesleyan are the only two other unbeatens at 1-0 apiece. Wheaton is at Carthage on Wednesday, which should be an interesting match, while NPU is at Illinois Wesleyan.
Kenyon has dropped last 2? Ncac New England must have some comments about this? Injuries? Tough games?
Quote from: rudy on October 02, 2016, 08:09:44 AM
Kenyon has dropped last 2? Ncac New England must have some comments about this? Injuries? Tough games?
Parity, and sustaining a high level of intensity and effort over a full season, game in, game out. We've been discussing in the Great Lakes thread whether there are teams far ahead of others. In the dozens of games I've seen either broadcast or in person I cannot say there ARE any teams that are that far ahead of the others in the region. Winning road games IS difficult; matching a home team's intensity - especially when you are perceived to be "the better" team and have "the target" on your back.
I watched the entire game versus Case - Kenyon was the better team throughout the match. But Case follows that up with a loss to NYU? That's a third factor - emotions. Look at Saturday's results - especially the head scratchers. Emotion let-down after big games or tough losses. Unlike pointy ball,where those teams get a full week to reflect and recover, these kids get two or three days to bounce back - and sometimes it takes longer to emotionally recover.
Quote from: Domino1195 on October 02, 2016, 09:05:39 AM
Quote from: rudy on October 02, 2016, 08:09:44 AM
Kenyon has dropped last 2? Ncac New England must have some comments about this? Injuries? Tough games?
Parity, and sustaining a high level of intensity and effort over a full season, game in, game out. We've been discussing in the Great Lakes thread whether there are teams far ahead of others. In the dozens of games I've seen either broadcast or in person I cannot say there ARE any teams that are that far ahead of the others in the region. Winning road games IS difficult; matching a home team's intensity - especially when you are perceived to be "the better" team and have "the target" on your back.
I watched the entire game versus Case - Kenyon was the better team throughout the match. But Case follows that up with a loss to NYU? That's a third factor - emotions. Look at Saturday's results - especially the head scratchers. Emotion let-down after big games or tough losses. Unlike pointy ball,where those teams get a full week to reflect and recover, these kids get two or three days to bounce back - and sometimes it takes longer to emotionally recover.
After looking at stats for both Kenyon losses they dominated shots, sog, and corners but apparently could just not put it in the back of the net. In American football a heavily favored team almost always wins..not many truly big upsets. With soccer the weaker team can score with one SOG , pk, free kick, and then "survive" by packing it in and clearing the ball anytime the opposing team crosses midfield. A good keeper can make a big difference. There is a lot of parity but when a team has a 15+ shot advantage and 2-3 times more sogs, then luck and perhaps some strategy plays a role!
Quote from: rudy on October 02, 2016, 08:09:44 AM
Kenyon has dropped last 2? Ncac New England must have some comments about this? Injuries? Tough games?
No excuses. And bear in mind that I have no inside info so these are my impressions from 600+ miles away. Plus there was no video yesterday.
1) DePauw is a good team with a consistently good program. DPU has hung some big losses on OWU over the past 5-6 years and they've had Kenyon's number for the most part over that same span. Most of the games have gone to OT, ended 0-0 or at most been 1 goal affairs. DPU knocked off Loras last year and then played a good Sweet 16 game. Gonzalez who missed or had a PK saved yesterday is one of the most dangerous players in the country.
2) Kenyon has been feeling the pressure, on them since 2014, with this year perceived as possibly the last chance in a really good run over the last 4 years. They've probably also been a little overrated. The talent is good enough but there are more than a handful of teams with equal or stronger talent. There are other factors and/or intangibles as well, and I don't have a great feel for those with this team. Kenyon hasn't lost 2 games in a row since 2011. They never should have lost the Case game (who then loses at home to NYU) and that loss was all the more painful knowing that DPU away lay ahead.
3) Kenyon's margin for error has shrunk significantly. Oberlin away will be tough and Oberlin would love to knock off the Lords. Denison especially away is always tricky. They have OWU at home but in recent OWU-Kenyon matchups the away team has tended to win or come away with a result. OWU also likely will need that game as well the way things are going for them and OWU despite some recent struggles has top-level talent that in theory should really be gelling by that game. Wabash away also is tricky and the Little Giants have started playing well. The NCAC tourney could be huge this year and determine who gets a bid and who doesn't.
4) These are 19-21 year old kids. They need to be confident, in sync with each other, and feeling the full support of their coaches. There needs to be a bigger picture that sets the frame beyond just one season, that embraces values that go beyond winning or not winning a national title, and that focuses on the players and their well-being and promotes them both while they are playing and after they leave. The most successful programs, again from a distance, seem to be the ones where the alumni are heavily involved and appreciated. Messiah, Amherst, Loras, OWU come to mind. I bet Williams was like that during the Russo tenure. The pressure to win and feeling increased competitiveness and threats to dominance, though, also can get to the best of them. Martin's comments after some of OWU's recent games have surprised me. Psychology is a huge factor not just with an individual team but also with the program at large. I also think it's important that adjustments be made based on caring for the team and players, doing what is best for the team based on fairness and optimal team dynamics, and not out of any kind of retaliation for a loss, single error, or need to assert some kind of authoritarian whatever.
5) All that said, my guess is that the Lords will get through this stretch and be formidable in November. If they can get the AQ or a Pool C they actually might benefit from not playing at home and going in with a bit more of an underdog role. You have to get hot at the right time, and being ranked #1 or #2 for several weeks in a row or most of a season isn't necessarily a helpful burden.
Quote from: rudy on October 02, 2016, 09:58:27 AM
Quote from: Domino1195 on October 02, 2016, 09:05:39 AM
Quote from: rudy on October 02, 2016, 08:09:44 AM
Kenyon has dropped last 2? Ncac New England must have some comments about this? Injuries? Tough games?
Parity, and sustaining a high level of intensity and effort over a full season, game in, game out. We've been discussing in the Great Lakes thread whether there are teams far ahead of others. In the dozens of games I've seen either broadcast or in person I cannot say there ARE any teams that are that far ahead of the others in the region. Winning road games IS difficult; matching a home team's intensity - especially when you are perceived to be "the better" team and have "the target" on your back.
I watched the entire game versus Case - Kenyon was the better team throughout the match. But Case follows that up with a loss to NYU? That's a third factor - emotions. Look at Saturday's results - especially the head scratchers. Emotion let-down after big games or tough losses. Unlike pointy ball,where those teams get a full week to reflect and recover, these kids get two or three days to bounce back - and sometimes it takes longer to emotionally recover.
After looking at stats for both Kenyon losses they dominated shots, sog, and corners but apparently could just not put it in the back of the net. In American football a heavily favored team almost always wins..not many truly big upsets. With soccer the weaker team can score with one SOG , pk, free kick, and then "survive" by packing it in and clearing the ball anytime the opposing team crosses midfield. A good keeper can make a big difference. There is a lot of parity but when a team has a 15+ shot advantage and 2-3 times more sogs, then luck and perhaps some strategy plays a role!
Again, from a distance and without benefit of video...
Stats for DPU game are deceptive. They were pretty even until Kenyon got desperate in last 10 minutes and racked up some shots while I presume DPU was holding on. Kenyon actually was fortunate not to be down 2-0 in the first minute of 2nd half. They gave up 1st goal in 1st half with a foul at top of box as Moore scored on a free kick, and then in 1st minute of 2nd half a called handball gave DPU a PK, which Clougher may have saved but hit the crossbar.
Kenyon did dominate in the Case game.
Quote from: rudy on October 02, 2016, 09:58:27 AM
Quote from: Domino1195 on October 02, 2016, 09:05:39 AM
Quote from: rudy on October 02, 2016, 08:09:44 AM
Kenyon has dropped last 2? Ncac New England must have some comments about this? Injuries? Tough games?
Parity, and sustaining a high level of intensity and effort over a full season, game in, game out. We've been discussing in the Great Lakes thread whether there are teams far ahead of others. In the dozens of games I've seen either broadcast or in person I cannot say there ARE any teams that are that far ahead of the others in the region. Winning road games IS difficult; matching a home team's intensity - especially when you are perceived to be "the better" team and have "the target" on your back.
I watched the entire game versus Case - Kenyon was the better team throughout the match. But Case follows that up with a loss to NYU? That's a third factor - emotions. Look at Saturday's results - especially the head scratchers. Emotion let-down after big games or tough losses. Unlike pointy ball,where those teams get a full week to reflect and recover, these kids get two or three days to bounce back - and sometimes it takes longer to emotionally recover.
After looking at stats for both Kenyon losses they dominated shots, sog, and corners but apparently could just not put it in the back of the net. In American football a heavily favored team almost always wins..not many truly big upsets. With soccer the weaker team can score with one SOG , pk, free kick, and then "survive" by packing it in and clearing the ball anytime the opposing team crosses midfield. A good keeper can make a big difference. There is a lot of parity but when a team has a 15+ shot advantage and 2-3 times more sogs, then luck and perhaps some strategy plays a role!
There is the luck factor - impossible to quantify, measure or understand when you receive a good break or a bad one. But I believe, over a 90 minute game, if you have reduced your team's chances to one event - going your way or the other - you've overburdened your reliance on a lucky break helping you out. Without seeing the DePauw game I can only say that the OT loss at Case was a heart breaker and Kenyon then had to follow that up with a second road game at an above-average opponent. Grove City beats nationally ranked CMU on homecoming weekend - then drops they next two to teams they probably should have beaten. When I was a sports gambler I used to kill playing college games - got killed playing pro's. 18-22 year old boys play on a LOT of emotion. I'd look for sandwich games, games for teams after big wins or losses, etc. Basketball, like soccer - lots of games per week - the emotional and physical drain, knocks/injuries.
I started a discussion in the other group about the "role" of looking at statistics - and history. I prefer to watch teams play and base my assessment on what I see - today, right now. 15 shots is a number - how many were quality looks? 7 saves - any that were game savers?
It was interesting to note the number of teams (I follow mostly Ohio and a few other Great Lakes teams) who posted Twitter comments about it being a new season, records are now 0-0, forget or build on the pre-conference results. Some have taken that to heart looking at the results this first weekend.
FWIW - the NCAC should finish Kenyon - followed by OWU, DePauw and Oberlin - the last three in no particular order.
Oberlin is in the drivers seat right now in terms of NCAC play. Kenyon, Oberlin, DePauw and OWU/Wabash/Hiram for the last spot.
Also, OWU looks to be on the outside looking in of even making the NCAC tournament. 2 points from 2 games vs Denison and Wabash and still yet to face DePauw, Oberlin, and Kenyon. Not ruling them out by any means but a tough road ahead nonetheless.
Quote from: Midwest Soccer on October 02, 2016, 01:12:54 PM
Oberlin is in the drivers seat right now in terms of NCAC play. Kenyon, Oberlin, DePauw and OWU/Wabash/Hiram for the last spot.
Also, OWU looks to be on the outside looking in of even making the NCAC tournament. 2 points from 2 games vs Denison and Wabash and still yet to face DePauw, Oberlin, and Kenyon. Not ruling them out by any means but a tough road ahead nonetheless.
Oberlin is vulnerable on defense - only four clean sheets - 12 goals conceded. I watched them in a preseason game and saw the Baldwin Wallace game. Otterbein - a much improved team with some freshman that are impacting the results - blew a lead with three minutes to go at Oberlin. OWU and Kenyon defend much better - Kenyon can score - OWU is struggling. Kenyon and OWU have played much tougher schedules YTD. Oberlin will have to tighten things up in the back when they play the top three-four teams.
NCAC NE Top 15
1) Chicago
2) Rowan
3) Trinity (TX)
4) Calvin
5) Washington & Lee
6) Ohio Northern
7) UMass-Boston
8) Middlebury
9) Wash U
10) Messiah
11) Amherst
12) Rochester
13) St Lawrence
14) Oneonta St
15) Franklin & Marshall/Haverford/Lynchburg (TIE)
Hot teams/spoilers (random order) -- Luther, Capital, St Thomas, Conn College, Maryville, Gordon, Hamilton, Ramapo, WPI, Springfield, Oberlin, Rutgers-Newark, Colorado College, Hanover, Johns Hopkins
Quote from: NCAC New England on October 02, 2016, 08:12:40 PM
NCAC NE Top 15
1) Chicago
2) Rowan
3) Trinity (TX)
4) Calvin
5) Washington & Lee
6) Ohio Northern
7) UMass-Boston
8) Middlebury
9) Wash U
10) Messiah
11) Amherst
12) Rochester
13) St Lawrence
14) Oneonta St
15) Franklin & Marshall/Haverford/Lynchburg (TIE)
Hot teams/spoilers (random order) -- Luther, Capital, St Thomas, Conn College, Maryville, Gordon, Hamilton, Ramapo, WPI, Springfield, Oberlin, Rutgers-Newark, Colorado College, Hanover, Johns Hopkins
Well done NCAC!
Attrition keeps pushing W&L higher. The next 8 days will be interesting for them.
Shooter's Take
1. Chicago-----------11-0-0
2. Rowan------------10-0-1
3. Trinity------------11-0-0
4. Calvin-------------9-1-0
5. Ohio Northern----10-0-1
6. Mass-Boston-----10-0-0
7. St. Lawrence-----9-1-0
8. W&L--------------8-1-0
9. Oneonta St.------8-2-1
10. Amherst--------7-1-1
11. Kenyon---------8-2-0
12. Messiah---------7-0-3
13. Rochester-------7-0-2
14. Haverford-------7-1-2
15. Lynchburg------7-0-2
16. Springfield------9-0-1
17. Wash. U--------6-0-1
18. St. Thomas-----9-0-2
19. F&M------------7-1-3
20. Middlebury-----5-0-2
21. Colorado Coll---8-1-1
22. Capital----------9-1-0
23. Dubuque-------9-1-0
24. Newark---------11-2-0
25. Macalester-----8-1-2
http://d3soccer.com/top25/men/2016/week5
October 4, 2016
D3soccer.com Men's Top 25, Week 5
Through games of Sunday, October 2, 2016
# School (1st Pl. Votes) Record Pts. Prev.
1 Chicago (12) 11-0-0 980 4
2 Trinity (Texas) (4) 11-0-0 950 5
3 Rowan (3) 10-0-1 920 1
4 Ohio Northern 11-0-1 886 6
5 Washington & Lee 8-1-0 828 7
6 Calvin 9-1-0 790 8
7 St. Lawrence 9-1-0 750 9
8 Amherst 7-1-1 700 3
9 Mass-Boston (1) 10-0-0 684 10
10 Franklin & Marshall 7-1-3 555 14
11 Kenyon 8-2-0 523 2
12 Haverford 7-1-2 515 15
13 Messiah 7-0-3 504 20
14 Middlebury 5-0-2 502 12
15 Washington U. 6-0-1 476 17
16 Chris. Newport 9-2-0 470 16
17 Carnegie Mellon 7-1-1 319 18
18 Macalester 8-1-2 302 11
19 Lynchburg 7-0-2 275 25
20 Rochester 7-0-2 256 —
21 Oneonta State 8-2-1 241 21
22 Elizabethtown 6-2-1 198 19
23 Colorado College 8-1-1 195 —
24 St. Thomas 9-0-2 125 —
25 Capital 9-1-0 100 —
Dropped out: No. 13 Ohio Wesleyan, No. 22 Plattsburgh State, No. 23 Brandeis, No. 24 Loras
Receiving Votes: Ohio Wesleyan 86, Dubuque 80, Springfield 60, Redlands 38, Luther 32, Gordon 28, Cortland State 18, Plattsburgh State 14, Oberlin 14, Lebanon Valley 12, Scranton 10, Connecticut College 10, Rutgers-Newark 10, Lycoming 8, Clark 8, Loras 6, Montclair State 6, North Park 2
My thoughts are Tufts after beating Amherst and Brandeis deserves to be RV...ETOWN should be RV and not ranked still. I still do not see a decent win on their resume. UMASS Boston's got 2 good (not great) wins against a decent Wentworth side and Union 3-0. They have let up only 2 goals all year which is impressive but their schedule is weak. I haven't seen them yet this year and I know based on last year they have some definite talent but they are not a Top 10 team in the nation. We will see what they do today at Babson. If you are going to rank UMASS Boston so high after their weak schedule then why not at least rank Springfield who I believe is 9-0-1 and while they have played some weak teams they have also gotten some results against teams that are much better than UMASS Boston's opponents. Conn College at 6-2-0 should be receiving more RV
http://www.nscaa.com/web/Rankings/College_Rankings/NCAA_DIII_MEN/web/rankings/ncaa/diii_men.aspx (http://www.nscaa.com/web/Rankings/College_Rankings/NCAA_DIII_MEN/web/rankings/ncaa/diii_men.aspx)
NSCAA rankings. Some key differences vs D3soccer.com
Quote from: D3soccerwatcher on October 04, 2016, 12:58:38 PM
http://www.nscaa.com/web/Rankings/College_Rankings/NCAA_DIII_MEN/web/rankings/ncaa/diii_men.aspx (http://www.nscaa.com/web/Rankings/College_Rankings/NCAA_DIII_MEN/web/rankings/ncaa/diii_men.aspx)
NSCAA rankings. Some key differences vs D3soccer.com
Call me a hater, but I
reeeeeeeeeeally don't see how Rochester can be above WashU with one more blemish and having been the host for Saturday's 3-3 draw with the Bears.
Lucas Terci from MSU scores his 16-17-18th goal to lead the Redhawks over Manhattanville.
With only 4 games left on the schedule, Jiovanni Garcia has 17G and 12A for first year start-up College of New Rochelle... (good for 2nd and 1st in the nation)*
*2-0 box score over The King's College of NY has not been provided for 10/5/16.
Good matchup in the SCAC tomorrow night as Trinity (TX) travels to Colorado College. Trinity has a 2-1 decision over CC earlier this year but suffered their worst defeat of 2015, 1-3, last time they made the trip to the Springs. Video will be available (http://www.cctigers.com/showcase) for the 7PM (MDT) start.
With Calvin's double round robin in the relatively weak MIAA, it's hard to tell how they stack up compared to other top teams. Calvin plays 14 conference games in a double round robin plus two games of conference tournament, so they only get four games before the conference season, and no other games against non-MIAA opponents until and unless they get into the NCAA tournament. (I think pretty much everyone at Calvin wishes the conference would drop down to a single round-robin.)
In the four-game "pre-season", Calvin went 3-0-1 last year and 3-1 this year, but this year's team had a better goal differential against a better slate of teams. Maybe it's about a wash.
Calvin has completed one pass through the MIAA, seven games with a goal differential of 24-0. In last year's 14 games the goal differential was 48-2. It sounds pretty similar.
However, this year's MIAA is definitely weaker than last year's -- by almost a goal per game, according to Massey. Last year's Calvin squad had a goal differential of 18-1 the first time through the MIAA and 30-1 the second time through. So this year's result is about like last year's first pass through the MIAA.
I think last year's final four Calvin side really jelled in the second half of the year, playing quite a bit better than in the first half. This year's team is pretty comparable to last year's team for the first half of the year. This year's team will also have to jell and play quite a bit better if they hope to repeat that final-four finish. Maybe a ranking of top 10 or 15 is fair for now.
http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/media-center/news/ncaa-announces-sites-relocated-championships
http://www.odaconline.com/general/2016-17/releases/20161007gw3gou
The new site for the 2016 NCAA Division III Men's and Women's Soccer Championships is Donald J. Kerr Stadium on Roanoke College's campus. The City of Salem, VA in conjunction with Roanoke College and the Old Dominion Athletic Conference (ODAC) were selected as hosts.
Probably a decent choice. Close to the original site, the Roanoke/Salem area has ample experience hosting NCAA DIII championships, and it's got a shot at not having awful weather while still being relatively close to DIII's critical mass areas. If I wasn't already busy that weekend, I might have made the trip up.
A few pics of the stadium and the brand new Cregger Athletic Center at Roanoke College
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/f1/22/80/f122802782a545f314fa7ce176fd8af8.jpg (https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/f1/22/80/f122802782a545f314fa7ce176fd8af8.jpg)
http://wsls.com/2016/08/22/maroons-unveil-state-of-the-art-cregger-center/ (http://wsls.com/2016/08/22/maroons-unveil-state-of-the-art-cregger-center/)
Quote from: NokeAlum15 on October 07, 2016, 01:09:34 PM
A few pics of the stadium and the brand new Cregger Athletic Center at Roanoke College
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/f1/22/80/f122802782a545f314fa7ce176fd8af8.jpg (https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/f1/22/80/f122802782a545f314fa7ce176fd8af8.jpg)
http://wsls.com/2016/08/22/maroons-unveil-state-of-the-art-cregger-center/ (http://wsls.com/2016/08/22/maroons-unveil-state-of-the-art-cregger-center/)
Proceeds to drool.....
Quote from: dontshootthegoose on October 07, 2016, 01:49:10 PM
Quote from: NokeAlum15 on October 07, 2016, 01:09:34 PM
A few pics of the stadium and the brand new Cregger Athletic Center at Roanoke College
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/f1/22/80/f122802782a545f314fa7ce176fd8af8.jpg (https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/f1/22/80/f122802782a545f314fa7ce176fd8af8.jpg)
http://wsls.com/2016/08/22/maroons-unveil-state-of-the-art-cregger-center/ (http://wsls.com/2016/08/22/maroons-unveil-state-of-the-art-cregger-center/)
Proceeds to drool.....
The soccer field is turf, so that's my only complaint. At that time of year it provides guarantees about the surface quality but I just prefer soccer on natural grass.
I too really do not at all like the idea of playing the national championship on turf. IMO that's just not right. Roanoke's field is OK as far as turf goes I suppose. It looks good in the pictures but it is impossible to see the near touch line from the stands, so that takes away a good bit of the game from the viewing public (poor design).
Quote from: D3soccerwatcher on October 07, 2016, 03:17:01 PM
I too really do not at all like the idea of playing the national championship on turf. IMO that's just not right. Roanoke's field is OK as far as turf goes I suppose. It looks good in the pictures but it is impossible to see the near touch line from the stands, so that takes away a good bit of the game from the viewing public (poor design).
I agree that the far touch view is lacking. But brand new turf was laid this Summer.
Trinity (TX) scores twice in the final ten minutes to take a come-from-behind 2-1 win at Colorado College.
Quote from: Ron Boerger on October 07, 2016, 11:04:53 PM
Trinity (TX) scores twice in the final ten minutes to take a come-from-behind 2-1 win at Colorado College.
not taking anything away from what Trinity has done this year but i took a look at the i schedule and they don't really play any teams that will give them a run for their money besides one or two. they can easily finished undefeated but once ncaa time comes around they will be surprised
Very high quality play so far in a game with national implications, Messiah at Wash & Lee. Both sides have been very dangerous when attacking. Generals have had at least two excellent opportunities, one turned away when a defender blocked one off the line. Falcons already have two goals, with Jacob Bender involved in both--scoring one on a cross from left wing and assisting the other on a corner kick. If you like pretty soccer with athletic sides, you might tune in. I don't think this is the end of the scoring, and I don't anticipate a shutout.
Halftime in Lexington and the score is still 2-0, Messiah on top. The game is closer than the score, but the Falcons are getting the better of the action.
Neither Thomas nor Plaza started (they have both been injured), but they both subbed in after about 30 minutes and they both look pretty good, especially Plaza, who can dominate his area of the field when he's on his game. Plaza was partly responsible for shutting down Etown's top player in that game, but today he's not marking anyone so he's all over the field.
Falcons dominating the Generals in the second half, padding their lead on yet another play involving Jacob Bender. Mot of the 50-50 balls and the possession are now going Messiah's way. Not nearly as even a game as the first half. Could be a sign that the Generals are just gassed, even though Messiah subbed only minimally in the first half.
This one is all but over. Plaza creates a great look pretty far out and buries it. About 7 minutes left, 4-0 Messiah. After the offensive struggles recently against weaker teams, this has to be a very gratifying win for McCarty's boys. They just took W&L out of the game since the second half whistle. The final score will reflect the overall game, even though the first 25 minutes were close to even.
Not a good look for W&L getting crushed at home. Oh well. On to Lynchburg and it's all about winning the ODAC. I didn't get to see the game, but the stats certainly back up what you are saying.
Rowan with a big win away at Montclair! Down 0-2 early and battled back to win 4-3! It's a huge win and sets them up to run the table and finish 16-0-1. Rowan now has wins over Oneanta, Washington and Lee, Lycoming, Franklin and Marshall, Montclair. With 3 of the 5 wins away from home! In my opinion they have been the most impressive team in the country this year. I would say the NJAC is one of if not the toughest conferences in the country. The only blemish was a scoreless tie in a driving rainstorm where the stat line was 29-9 shots and 17-1 corners. Coach Baker and his staff have returned the once proud program to national prominence and are going to be a national contender moving forward as they only have 2 seniors on the roster!
Quote from: Go2Goal on October 08, 2016, 10:47:26 PM
Rowan with a big win away at Montclair! Down 0-2 early and battled back to win 4-3! It's a huge win and sets them up to run the table and finish 16-0-1. Rowan now has wins over Oneanta, Washington and Lee, Lycoming, Franklin and Marshall, Montclair. With 3 of the 5 wins away from home! In my opinion they have been the most impressive team in the country this year. I would say the NJAC is one of if not the toughest conferences in the country. The only blemish was a scoreless tie in a driving rainstorm where the stat line was 29-9 shots and 17-1 corners. Coach Baker and his staff have returned the once proud program to national prominence and are going to be a national contender moving forward as they only have 2 seniors on the roster!
Always tough to come back from 2-0 against a good team. Must have been exciting game. Looks like Chicago and Rowan will be battling for top ranking for regular season.
Quote from: Go2Goal on October 08, 2016, 10:47:26 PM
Rowan with a big win away at Montclair! Down 0-2 early and battled back to win 4-3! It's a huge win and sets them up to run the table and finish 16-0-1. Rowan now has wins over Oneanta, Washington and Lee, Lycoming, Franklin and Marshall, Montclair. With 3 of the 5 wins away from home! In my opinion they have been the most impressive team in the country this year. I would say the NJAC is one of if not the toughest conferences in the country. The only blemish was a scoreless tie in a driving rainstorm where the stat line was 29-9 shots and 17-1 corners. Coach Baker and his staff have returned the once proud program to national prominence and are going to be a national contender moving forward as they only have 2 seniors on the roster!
The reason Rowan returned is the change of coaching. say what you want about Gilmore but his time was up. there is no reason why any south jersey soccer player should choose schools like camden and stockton over rowan. nothing against them schools (i attended the one) but the rowan campus is far superior to any other NJaC school around this area.
Shooter's Take as of 10/10...
1. Chicago (12-0-0)
2. Rowan (11-0-1)
3. Trinity (13-0-0)
4. Ohio Northern (12-0-2)
5. Amherst (9-1-1)
6. Mass-Boston (11-0-1)
7. Messiah (9-0-3)
8. Springfield (11-0-1)
9. St. Thomas (10-0-2)
10. Lynchburg (9-0-2)
11. F&M (9-1-3)
12. W&L (9-2-0)
13. St. Lawrence (9-2-0)
14. Rochester (7-1-2)
15. Middlebury (6-1-2)
16. Haverford (8-2-2)
17. Wash U (7-1-1)
18. Kenyon (9-2-0)
19. Calvin (10-2-0)
20. Gordon (9-1-1)
21. Capital (10-1-1)
22. Oberlin (10-1-1)
23. Newark (13-2-0)
24. Carnegie (9-1-1)
25. St. Joseph's-Maine (10-1-3)
Serious question and I'm not trying to be smart here...
Do you think a team that loses a game by a 4 goal margin (W&L) to a lower ranked team should remain in the top 15 in the country? I would think perhaps not. A goal or maybe 2, but 4 goals? Wondering about everyone's thoughts on that.
Quote from: Shooter McGavin on October 10, 2016, 09:15:56 AM
Shooter's Take as of 10/10...
1. Chicago (12-0-0)
2. Rowan (11-0-1)
3. Trinity (13-0-0)
4. Ohio Northern (12-0-2)
5. Amherst (9-1-1)
6. Mass-Boston (11-0-1)
7. Messiah (9-0-3)
8. Springfield (11-0-1)
9. St. Thomas (10-0-2)
10. Lynchburg (9-0-2)
11. F&M (9-1-3)
12. W&L (9-2-0)
13. St. Lawrence (9-2-0)
14. Rochester (7-1-2)
15. Middlebury (6-1-2)
16. Haverford (8-2-2)
17. Wash U (7-1-1)
18. Kenyon (9-2-0)
19. Calvin (10-2-0)
20. Gordon (9-1-1)
21. Capital (10-1-1)
22. Oberlin (10-1-1)
23. Newark (13-2-0)
24. Carnegie (9-1-1)
25. St. Joseph's-Maine (10-1-3)
Not one North Region team, I don't disagree.
Quote from: D3soccerwatcher on October 10, 2016, 11:56:56 AM
Serious question and I'm not trying to be smart here...
Do you think a team that loses a game by a 4 goal margin (W&L) to a lower ranked team should remain in the top 15 in the country? I would think perhaps not. A goal or maybe 2, but 4 goals? Wondering about everyone's thoughts on that.
My thoughts are that (a) Messiah is a legitimate Elite Eight team that snuck up on many of us this year, owing to a slightly (not drastically) weaker early schedule and the fact that many probably didn't realize how young they were last year and how much maturation has taken place; and (b) W&L is considerably better than Lynchburg, based on what I saw from both teams vs Messiah. Lynchburg parked the bus and showed no evidence of having top-10 talent, while W&L played the Falcons straight up and for 20 minutes played them about evenly.
Obviously I could be wrong about both (a) and (b), but that's my answer to your question. W&L plays Lynchburg this Wednesday, so we'll know very soon whether (b) is wrong. If I am right about (b), then I would keep W&L in or near the top 10.
MAF Power Rankings
1. Chicago
2. Rowan
3. Trinity (Tx)
4. Ohio Northern
5. Amherst
6. Mass-Boston
7. Oneonta St
8. Messiah
9. F&M
10. Capital
11. W&L
12. Oberlin
13. Haverford
14. Calvin
15. Wash U
16. St. Thomas
17. Springfield
18. Lynchburg
19. Kenyon
20. St. Lawrence
21. CMU
22. Newark
23. Rochester
24. Gordon
25. Middlebury
Quote from: dontshootthegoose on October 10, 2016, 12:00:42 PM
Quote from: Shooter McGavin on October 10, 2016, 09:15:56 AM
Shooter's Take as of 10/10...
1. Chicago (12-0-0)
2. Rowan (11-0-1)
3. Trinity (13-0-0)
4. Ohio Northern (12-0-2)
5. Amherst (9-1-1)
6. Mass-Boston (11-0-1)
7. Messiah (9-0-3)
8. Springfield (11-0-1)
9. St. Thomas (10-0-2)
10. Lynchburg (9-0-2)
11. F&M (9-1-3)
12. W&L (9-2-0)
13. St. Lawrence (9-2-0)
14. Rochester (7-1-2)
15. Middlebury (6-1-2)
16. Haverford (8-2-2)
17. Wash U (7-1-1)
18. Kenyon (9-2-0)
19. Calvin (10-2-0)
20. Gordon (9-1-1)
21. Capital (10-1-1)
22. Oberlin (10-1-1)
23. Newark (13-2-0)
24. Carnegie (9-1-1)
25. St. Joseph's-Maine (10-1-3)
Not one North Region team, I don't disagree.
St. Thomas (MIAC) is in the North region. I don't disagree that the region is very weak this year though
http://d3soccer.com/top25/men/2016/week6
October 11, 2016
D3soccer.com Men's Top 25, Week 6
Through games of Sunday, October 9, 2016
# School (1st Pl. Votes) Record Pts. Prev.
1 Chicago (19) 12-0-0 991 1
2 Trinity (Texas) (3) 13-0-0 957 2
3 Rowan (1) 11-0-1 930 3
4 Ohio Northern 12-0-2 866 4
5 Amherst 9-1-1 816 8
6 Messiah 9-0-3 767 13
7 Franklin & Marshall 9-1-3 736 10
8 Mass-Boston 11-0-1 671 9
9 Kenyon 9-2-0 639 11
10 Washington & Lee 9-2-0 572 5
11 Calvin 10-2-0 553 6
12 Chris. Newport 11-2-0 545 16
13 Carnegie Mellon 9-1-1 532 17
14 Lynchburg 9-0-2 510 19
15 St. Lawrence 9-2-0 443 7
16 Oneonta State 10-2-1 415 21
17 St. Thomas 10-0-2 318 24
18 Haverford 8-2-2 306 12
19 Capital 10-1-1 303 25
20 Elizabethtown 8-2-1 296 22
21 Middlebury 6-1-2 238 14
22 Rochester 7-1-2 205 20
23 Washington U. 7-1-1 200 15
24 Springfield 11-0-1 174 —
25 Colorado College 9-2-1 139 23
Dropped out: No. 18 Macalester
Receiving Votes: Oberlin 64, Gordon 61, Redlands 57, Tufts 52, Macalester 42, Ohio Wesleyan 38, Cortland State 28, Lebanon Valley 21, Rutgers-Newark 14, Connecticut College 5, Maryville (Tenn.) 5, Kean 3, Dubuque 2
The D3soccer.com Top 25 is voted on by a panel of coaches, Sports Information Directors and D3soccer.com staff, and is published weekly.
Quote from: Falconer on October 10, 2016, 12:42:22 PM
Quote from: D3soccerwatcher on October 10, 2016, 11:56:56 AM
Serious question and I'm not trying to be smart here...
Do you think a team that loses a game by a 4 goal margin (W&L) to a lower ranked team should remain in the top 15 in the country? I would think perhaps not. A goal or maybe 2, but 4 goals? Wondering about everyone's thoughts on that.
My thoughts are that (a) Messiah is a legitimate Elite Eight team that snuck up on many of us this year, owing to a slightly (not drastically) weaker early schedule and the fact that many probably didn't realize how young they were last year and how much maturation has taken place; and (b) W&L is considerably better than Lynchburg, based on what I saw from both teams vs Messiah. Lynchburg parked the bus and showed no evidence of having top-10 talent, while W&L played the Falcons straight up and for 20 minutes played them about evenly.
Obviously I could be wrong about both (a) and (b), but that's my answer to your question. W&L plays Lynchburg this Wednesday, so we'll know very soon whether (b) is wrong. If I am right about (b), then I would keep W&L in or near the top 10.
Score lines are tricky... Stats can be one thing, but we can't see the tactics and how the game opened up once W&L went down 2-0. At that point, I'm sure they were chasing the game and exposed.
Messiah outshot W&L 7-4 first half, scoring twice...
W&L makes 2nd half adjustments, can't connect in mid to final third, Messiah gets in behind W&L with ease... [assumption]
Messiah outshot W&L 13-2 second half, scoring twice.
NSCAA NCAA Division III Men - National - Poll 5 - October 11, 2016
Rank School Prev. W-L-T
1 Trinity University (Texas) 1 13-0-0
2 University Of Chicago 2 12-0-0
3 Rowan University 3 11-0-1
4 University Of Massachusetts-Boston 6 11-0-1
5 Ohio Northern University 7 11-0-2
6 Franklin & Marshall College 12 9-1-3
7 SUNY Oneonta 22 10-2-1
8 University of St. Thomas 24 10-0-2
9 University of Rochester 4 7-1-2
10 Washington University (Mo.) 8 7-1-1
11 Amherst College 16 9-1-1
12 Messiah College 21 9-0-3
13 University of Redlands 13 11-2-0
14 Lynchburg College 20 9-0-2
15 Oberlin College 17 10-1-1
16 Luther College 9 9-2-2
17 Haverford College 5 8-2-2
18 Capital University 23 10-1-1
19 Middlebury College 14 6-1-2
20 Colorado College 19 9-2-1
21 Carthage College 25 10-3-0
22 Christopher Newport University RV 11-2-0
23 SUNY Cortland RV 10-2-0
24 Macalester College 15 8-2-2
25 Calvin College 18 10-2-0
Also receiving votes: Gordon College (5), Carnegie Mellon University (3), Washington & Lee University (2), St. Lawrence University (1)
W&L falls completely out of Top 25 after Messiah loss? Ouch!
Quote from: NokeAlum15 on October 11, 2016, 04:29:12 PM
W&L falls completely out of Top 25 after Messiah loss? Ouch!
Yep, following NSCAA "logic" there's no way four teams from more than one region could be Top 25. So when they slipped to #4 in the South Atlantic, they only had a 1 in 8 chance of snagging the 25th and final spot in the National Rankings. But that spot went to the Central Region #4 team, Calvin (I'm surprised that Carthage was considered ahead of Calvin in the Central). Interesting to note that the Mid-Atlantic #4 (Elizabethtown) was not "Receiving Votes". Neither were the North #4 and West #4.
Quote from: NokeAlum15 on October 11, 2016, 04:29:12 PM
W&L falls completely out of Top 25 after Messiah loss? Ouch!
This has more to do with them following from 2 to 4 in regional rankings. If you aren't in top 3 regional rankings then you generally fall out of top 25 national. If a team ahead if them loses this week and they win 2 games then chances are they will move up in regional ranking back into top 3
Just to illustrate for anyone new to this, the NSCAA's national rankings have traditionally followed a rather rigid framework/template in which they slot their regional #1's in spots 1 thru 8, the regional #2's in spots 9 thru 16, the regional #3's in spots 17 thru 24, and one regional #4 in the final spot with some other regional #4's listed as "Receiving Votes". Last year or the year before, they loosened up a little, typically still holding to three teams per regions, but not having all the #1's ranked before any #2's and all #2's before any #3's. And they even occasionally let a couple regions get four teams in and one region only get two. But they apparently have reverted to their age-old OP as this week can illustrate.
NSCAA NCAA Division III Men - National - Poll 5 - October 11, 2016
Rank School Prev. W-L-T
WEST #1 1 Trinity University (Texas) 1 13-0-0
CENTRAL #1 2 University Of Chicago 2 12-0-0
SO.ATL. #1 3 Rowan University 3 11-0-1
NEW ENG. #1 4 University Of Massachusetts-Boston 6 11-0-1
G.LAKES #1 5 Ohio Northern University 7 11-0-2
MID-ATL. #1 6 Franklin & Marshall College 12 9-1-3
EAST #1 7 SUNY Oneonta 22 10-2-1
NORTH #1 8 University of St. Thomas 24 10-0-2
EAST #2 9 University of Rochester 4 7-1-2
CENTRAL #2 10 Washington University (Mo.) 8 7-1-1
NEW ENG. #2 11 Amherst College 16 9-1-1
MID-ATL. #2 12 Messiah College 21 9-0-3
WEST #2 13 University of Redlands 13 11-2-0
SO.ATL. #2 14 Lynchburg College 20 9-0-2
G.LAKES #2 15 Oberlin College 17 10-1-1
NORTH #2 16 Luther College 9 9-2-2
MID-ATL. #3 17 Haverford College 5 8-2-2
G.LAKES #3 18 Capital University 23 10-1-1
NEW ENG. #3 19 Middlebury College 14 6-1-2
WEST #3 20 Colorado College 19 9-2-1
CENTRAL #3 21 Carthage College 25 10-3-0
SO.ATL. #3 22 Christopher Newport University RV 11-2-0
EAST #3 23 SUNY Cortland RV 10-2-0
NORTH #3 24 Macalester College 15 8-2-2
CENTRAL #5* 25 Calvin College 18 10-2-0
NEW ENG. #4 RV Gordon College (5)
G.LAKES #4 RV Carnegie Mellon University (3)
SO.ATL. #4 RV Washington & Lee University (2)
EAST #4 RV St. Lawrence University (1)
Not sure how/why a regional #5 is ranked ahead of its regional #4 who then doesn't even get listed as receiving votes.
Just noticed that Calvin was #5 in the Central region rankings, but #25 nationally ahead of Central #4 North Park who wasn't even listed as receiving votes. Mistake? Or intentional?
Thanks guys. I knew how NSCAA rankings worked. Just always a harsh tumble.
Quote from: lastguyoffthebench on October 11, 2016, 10:36:38 AM
Quote from: Falconer on October 10, 2016, 12:42:22 PM
Quote from: D3soccerwatcher on October 10, 2016, 11:56:56 AM
Serious question and I'm not trying to be smart here...
Do you think a team that loses a game by a 4 goal margin (W&L) to a lower ranked team should remain in the top 15 in the country? I would think perhaps not. A goal or maybe 2, but 4 goals? Wondering about everyone's thoughts on that.
My thoughts are that (a) Messiah is a legitimate Elite Eight team that snuck up on many of us this year, owing to a slightly (not drastically) weaker early schedule and the fact that many probably didn't realize how young they were last year and how much maturation has taken place; and (b) W&L is considerably better than Lynchburg, based on what I saw from both teams vs Messiah. Lynchburg parked the bus and showed no evidence of having top-10 talent, while W&L played the Falcons straight up and for 20 minutes played them about evenly.
Obviously I could be wrong about both (a) and (b), but that's my answer to your question. W&L plays Lynchburg this Wednesday, so we'll know very soon whether (b) is wrong. If I am right about (b), then I would keep W&L in or near the top 10.
Score lines are tricky... Stats can be one thing, but we can't see the tactics and how the game opened up once W&L went down 2-0. At that point, I'm sure they were chasing the game and exposed.
Messiah outshot W&L 7-4 first half, scoring twice...
W&L makes 2nd half adjustments, can't connect in mid to final third, Messiah gets in behind W&L with ease... [assumption]
Messiah outshot W&L 13-2 second half, scoring twice.
Messiah controlled much of the game versus W&L. It was sorta "even" for about the first 15 minutes. After that the Messiah possession game took control. W&L was soon out of ideas, got of gas, and out of motivation. A dominating performance by the Falcons. As I thought might happen, W&L subsequently dropped out of the NSCAA Top 25 all together.
UPSET ALER!!
Oneonta lose to New Paltz 1-0 and Fredonia take down Plattsburgh 3-2
Quote from: Golden_Fan on October 15, 2016, 03:16:21 PM
UPSET ALER!!
Oneonta lose to New Paltz 1-0 and Fredonia take down Plattsburgh 3-2
Oneonta can deal with that loss as it will not hurt their Pool C chances unless they go on a 2-3 game losing streak which I doubt will happen as they are to good for that. Plattsburgh on the other hand is in a total
tailspin as it looks like they will not even be Top 6 in SUNYAC.
Quote from: Mr.Right on October 15, 2016, 05:16:49 PM
Quote from: Golden_Fan on October 15, 2016, 03:16:21 PM
UPSET ALER!!
Oneonta lose to New Paltz 1-0 and Fredonia take down Plattsburgh 3-2
Oneonta can deal with that loss as it will not hurt their Pool C chances unless they go on a 2-3 game losing streak which I doubt will happen as they are to good for that. Plattsburgh on the other hand is in a total tailspin as it looks like they will not even be Top 6 in SUNYAC.
Plattsburgh and Potsdam could both miss out on the playoffs if they both go 0-2 next weekend vs geneseo and brockport
NCAC NE Top 15 (Pre-NCAA Regional Rankings #1)
1) Chicago
2) Trinity (TX)
3) Messiah
4) Rowan
5) Amherst
6) Frankin and Marshall
7) Ohio Northern
8) Rutgers-Newark
9) Calvin
10) UMass-Boston
11) Cortland St
12) Haverford
13) Oneonta St
14) Christopher Newport
15) Kenyon
16 thru 25 (random order) -- Redlands, Capital, Middlebury, Carthage, Rochester, Wash U, Lynchburg, Washington & Lee, Colorado College, Maryville (TN)/Dominican/Oberlin (TIE)
Watch List -- Tufts, Babson, Williams, Bowdoin, St Thomas, Macalester, Springfield, Dubuque, Loras, St Mary's, Mary Washington, OWU, Johns Hopkins, Carnegie Mellon, Emory, Montclair St, Rutgers-Camden, St Lawrence, North Park, Texas-Dallas, Whitworth, Geneva, Rhode Island College, Clark, Hanover, Elizabethtown, Scranton, Wabash, Gordon
does anybody think there could be a chance newark overtakes rowan at #1 for fort regional rankjngs
October 18, 2016
D3soccer.com Men's Top 25, Week 7
Through games of Sunday, October 16, 2016
# School (1st Pl. Votes) Record Pts. Prev.
1 Chicago (17) 14-0-0 991 1
2 Trinity (Texas) (5) 15-0-0 969 2
3 Messiah 11-0-3 873 6
4 Amherst 11-1-1 862 5
5 Ohio Northern 13-0-3 833 4
6 Rowan 12-1-1 788 3
7 Franklin & Marshall 10-1-3 767 7
8 Kenyon 11-2-0 713 9
9 Calvin 12-2-0 653 11
10 Chris. Newport 12-2-1 544 12
11 Washington & Lee 10-3-0 521 10
12 Mass-Boston 12-1-1 485 8
13 St. Thomas 11-0-3 452 17
14 Elizabethtown 10-2-1 420 20
15 Haverford 9-2-2 416 18
16 Lynchburg 10-1-2 403 14
17 Colorado College 12-2-1 363 25
18 Rutgers-Newark 15-2-0 332 —
19 Rochester 8-1-3 330 22
20 Middlebury 8-1-3 304 21
21 Carnegie Mellon 9-2-2 272 13
22 Capital 11-1-2 259 19
23 Oneonta State 11-3-1 257 16
24 Tufts 7-3-2 130 —
25 St. Lawrence 10-3-0 126 15
Dropped out: No. 23 Washington U., No. 24 Springfield
Receiving Votes: Redlands 106, Oberlin 89, Lebanon Valley 71, Cortland State 64, Ohio Wesleyan 38, Washington U. 36, Springfield 36, Dubuque 20, Luther 16, St. Mary's (Md.) 13, Randolph-Macon 7, Montclair State 5, Clark 5, Connecticut College 2
The D3soccer.com Top 25 is voted on by a panel of coaches, Sports Information Directors and D3soccer.com staff, and is published weekly.
NSCAA NCAA Division III Men - National - Poll 6 - October 18, 2016
Rank School Prev. W-L-T
1 Trinity University (Texas) 1 15-0-0
2 University Of Chicago 2 14-0-0
3 Franklin & Marshall College 6 10-1-3
4 Ohio Northern University 5 12-0-3
5 Amherst College 11 11-1-1
6 University of St. Thomas 8 11-0-3
7 Rutgers University-Newark NR 15-2-0
8 SUNY Cortland 23 12-2-0
9 Messiah College 12 11-0-3
10 Rowan University 3 12-1-1
11 University of Redlands 13 13-2-0
12 University of Rochester 9 8-1-3
13 Haverford College 17 9-2-2
14 Carthage College 21 12-3-0
15 Middlebury College 19 8-1-3
16 University Of Massachusetts-Boston 4 12-1-1
17 Lynchburg College 14 10-1-2
18 SUNY Oneonta 7 11-3-1
19 University Of Dubuque NR 12-2-0
20 Colorado College 20 11-2-1
21 Oberlin College 15 11-2-1
22 Washington University (Mo.) 10 8-2-1
23 Kenyon College NR 11-2-0
24 Luther College 16 10-3-2
25 Calvin College 25 12-2-0
Also receiving votes: Elizabethtown College (6), Tufts University (4), Christopher Newport University (3), North Park University (1), Macalester College (1)
NSCAA NCAA Division III Men - National - Poll 6 - October 18, 2016
Rank | School | Prev. | W-L-T | Regional Rank |
1 | Trinity University (Texas) | 1 | 15-0-0 | West #1 |
2 | University Of Chicago | 2 | 14-0-0 | Central #1 |
3 | Franklin & Marshall College | 6 | 10-1-3 | Mid-Atlantic #1 |
4 | Ohio Northern University | 5 | 12-0-3 | Great Lakes #1 |
5 | Amherst College | 11 | 11-1-1 | New England #1 |
6 | University of St. Thomas | 8 | 11-0-3 | North #1 |
7 | Rutgers University-Newark | NR | 15-2-0 | South Atlantic #1 |
8 | SUNY Cortland | 23 | 12-2-0 | East #1 |
- | - - - - - - - - - - - - - - | - | - - - | - - - - - - - - |
9 | Messiah College | 12 | 11-0-3 | Mid-Atlantic #2 |
10 | Rowan University | 3 | 12-1-1 | South Atlantic #2 |
11 | University of Redlands | 13 | 13-2-0 | West #2 |
12 | University of Rochester | 9 | 8-1-3 | East #2 |
13 | Haverford College | 17 | 9-2-2 | Mid-Atlantic #3 |
14 | Carthage College | 21 | 12-3-0 | Central #2 |
15 | Middlebury College | 19 | 8-1-3 | New England #2 |
16 | University Of Massachusetts-Boston | 4 | 12-1-1 | New England #3 |
- | - - - - - - - - - - - - - - | - | - - - | - - - - - - - - |
17 | Lynchburg College | 14 | 10-1-2 | South Atlantic #3 |
18 | SUNY Oneonta | 7 | 11-3-1 | East #3 |
19 | University Of Dubuque | NR | 12-2-0 | North #2 |
20 | Colorado College | 20 | 11-2-1 | West #3 |
21 | Oberlin College | 15 | 11-2-1 | Great Lakes #2 |
22 | Washington University (Mo.) | 10 | 8-2-1 | Central #3 |
23 | Kenyon College | NR | 11-2-0 | Great Lakes #3 |
24 | Luther College | 16 | 10-3-2 | North #3 |
- | - - - - - - - - - - - - - - | - | - - - | - - - - - - - - |
25 | Calvin College | 25 | 12-2-0 | Central #4 |
Also receiving votes:
Elizabethtown College (6) | Mid-Atlantic #4 |
Tufts University (4) | New England #4 |
Christopher Newport University (3) | South Atlantic #4 |
North Park University (1) | Central #5 |
Macalester College (1) | North #4 |
Well, the NSCAA deviated a little bit from their standard framework, pushing the Mid-Atlantic and New England #3's up and dropping the North and Great Lakes #2's down. They also gave "Receiving Votes" to the fifth Central team. But overall, still rather rigid with three teams from each region ranked with one (Central) getting a fourth team in the final spot. The East, Great Lakes and West #4's did not "receive votes".
Well written article on the NCAA rankings
http://www.d3soccer.com/columns/christan-shirk/2016/the-rankings-that-matter
Question for anyone. It looks as if both Chicago teams(men and women) will be ranked #1 regionally.
They have both a grass pitch and turf. The men have been playing on the turf more than usual. Would the NCAA have Chicago host both men's and women's first round and if necessary beyond?
from page 24 of the 2016 Division III Soccer Pre-Championships Manual (http://www.d3soccer.com/ncaa-publications/2016/2016-NCAA-Division-III-Soccer_Pre-Championships-Manual.pdf):
QuoteJOINT HOSTING INFORMATION
The NCAA Division III Championships Committee has approved a recommendation from the NCAA Division III Men's and
Women's Soccer Committees to establish hosting guidelines for institutions whose men's and women's teams earn berths
in their respective championships. The committees established these guidelines to eliminate potential conflicts created by
hosting both championship events, to assist institutions in preparing for hosting opportunities and to ensure the opportunity
of providing a quality championship experience for all teams involved in both championships.
Institutions with both men's and women's teams in the championships will follow these hosting guidelines:
. | 1st/2nd Rnd | Sectionals |
Even Years | Men host | Women host |
Odd Years | Women host | Men host |
If conflicts prevent another institution from hosting while following these guidelines, the combined men's and women's
committees will determine which team will play first at the same site.
The men's and women's committees are concerned with conflicts created when institutions attempt to host both men's and
women's championship events, and the impact those conflicts have on the committees during site selection, and on the
institution during the administration of the events. The committees prefer that institutions not host both men's and women's
events in the same round of the championships.
The committees also recognize that some institutions with both teams in the championships, while recognizing their
limitations in hosting both events, may face administrative pressure having to choose to host one championship event
over another. The committees believe these guidelines can alleviate this administrative pressure. The committees'
primary concerns include the following:
● The potential for field conditions to deteriorate, particularly in the second games;
● The institutional administrative pressure to host both championship events and/or to choose between which championship
event it will host if it cannot host both events;
● The magnification of weather issues if an institution attempts to host both championship events; and
● The condition and availability of practice facilities.
This being an even-numbered year, the men have hosting priority for the 1st/2nd Round pods and the women have priority for hosting sectionals. So unless the committee couldn't find another acceptable host for the women's 1st/2nd Round pod or the men's sectional (should both men's and women's teams advance), they would not host both.
Rankings are up:
CENTRAL IN-DIVISION RECORD OVERALL RECORD
1. Chicago 14-0-0 14-0-0
2. Carthage 11-3-0 12-3-0
3. Washington-St. Louis 8-2-1 8-2-1
4. North Park 9-3-1 9-3-1
5. Dominican (IL) 10-2-2 10-2-2
6. Calvin 12-2-0 12-2-0
East In-Division Record Overall Record
1. Rochester (NY) 8-1-3 8-1-3
2. SUNY Oneonta 11-3-1 11-3-1
3. SUNY Cortland 12-2-0 12-2-0
4. St. Lawrence 10-3-0 10-3-0
5. Vassar 9-3-2 9-3-2
6. Buffalo St. 10-4-1 10-4-1
7. Hobart 7-4-3 7-4-3
8. Fredonia 10-5-1 10-5-1
Great Lakes In-Division Record Overall Record
1. Ohio Northern 12-0-3 13-0-3
2. Oberlin 11-2-1 11-2-1
3. Ohio Wesleyan 8-2-3 8-2-3
4. DePauw 8-3-1 8-3-2
5. Hanover 10-3-0 11-3-0
6. Kenyon 11-2-0 11-2-0
7. Carnegie Mellon 9-2-2 9-2-2
8 Wabash 8-4-2 8-4-2
Mid-Atlantic In-Division Record Overall Record
1. Messiah 11-0-3 11-0-3
2. Franklin & Marshall 10-1-3 10-1-3
3. Elizabethtown 10-2-1 10-2-1
4. Haverford 9-2-2 9-2-2
5. Drew 8-3-2 8-3-2
6. Scranton 10-3-0 10-3-0
7. Gettysburg 7-3-2 7-3-2
8. Lebanon Valley 9-2-0 10-2-0
9. Johns Hopkins 9-3-2 9-3-2
New England In-Division Record Overall Record
1. Amherst 11-1-1 11-1-1
2. UMass Boston 12-1-1 12-1-1
3. Clark (MA) 12-2-0 12-2-0
4. Middlebury 8-1-3 8-1-3
5. Rhode Island College 10-3-1 10-3-1
6. Williams 7-2-3 7-2-3
7. Babson 8-4-3 8-4-3
8. Tufts 7-3-2 7-3-2
9. WPI 7-2-4 7-2-4
10. Connecticut College 8-4-0 8-4-0
11. Coast Guard 8-3-2 8-3-2
12. Bowdoin 7-3-3 7-3-3
North In-Division Record Overall Record
1. Dubuque 12-2-0 12-2-0
2. St. Thomas (MN) 11-0-3 11-0-3
3. Luther 10-3-2 10-3-2
4. Macalester 10-3-2 10-3-2
5. Loras 9-4-0 9-4-0
6. St. Norbert 13-3-0 13-3-0
South Atlantic In-Division Record Overall Record
1. Rowan 12-1-1 12-1-1
2. Rutgers-Newark 15-2-0 15-2-0
3. Lynchburg 10-1-2 10-1-2
4. Christopher Newport 12-2-1 12-2-1
5. Washington & Lee 10-3-0 10-3-0
6. Emory 8-3-1 8-3-1
7. St. Mary's (MD) 10-2-2 10-2-2
8. Montclair St. 11-4-1 11-4-1
West In-Division Record Overall Record
1. Trinity (Texas) 15-0-0 15-0-0
2. Colorado College 11-2-1 12-2-1
3. Texas-Dallas 9-3-1 9-3-1
4. Redlands 13-2-0 13-2-0
5. Whitworth 8-3-2 8-3-2
Thanks for posting that, Golden-Fan! I got the women's rankings as soon as they came out so I could get them posted on D3soccer.com, but by the time the men's rankings were released I couldn't get on the NCAA site anymore--kept repeatedly getting the Network Error screen. So thanks to your post I was able to get the men's rankings up on D3soccer.com.
TOP 50: STRENGTH-OF-SCHEDULE AS PER NCAA
(games through Sunday, October 16)(used for Regional Rankings and At-Large Selections)
| TEAM (W-L-T) | SOS |
| Chicago (14-0-0) | .670 |
| Emory (8-3-1) | .636 |
| Rutgers-Camden (8-4-3) | .633 |
| Rowan (12-1-1) | .630 |
| Brandeis (6-4-3) | .628 |
| Oglethorpe (5-4-3) | .628 |
| Rochester (8-1-3) | .627 |
| Carthage (11-3-0) | .626 |
| Wheaton (Ill.) (4-7-3) | .624 |
| Lynchburg (10-1-2) | .618 |
| TCNJ (7-6-2) | .614 |
| Brockport State (2-9-2) | .611 |
| Case Western Reserve (4-7-3) | .610 |
| Rutgers-Newark (15-2-0) | .607 |
| Babson (8-4-3) | .606 |
| Stockton (4-7-4) | .601 |
| William Paterson (6-7-2) | .601 |
| Alvernia (3-10-0) | .600 |
| Loras (9-4-0) | .600 |
| Hardin-Simmons (6-3-2) | .599 |
| North Central (Ill.) (5-7-1) | .597 |
| Oneonta State (11-3-1) | .597 |
| Tufts (7-3-2) | .596 |
| Colby (4-7-2) | .594 |
| Montclair State (11-4-1) | .594 |
| Rhode Island College (10-3-1) | .594 |
| Dickinson (5-7-2) | .593 |
| Christopher Newport (12-2-1) | .590 |
| Muhlenberg (3-7-3) | .590 |
| Gustavus Adolphus (5-8-1) | .588 |
| Oswego State (4-11-0) | .588 |
| Luther (10-3-2) | .586 |
| Messiah (11-0-3) | .584 |
| MIT (4-8-1) | .584 |
| Cortland State (12-2-0) | .584 |
| WPI (7-2-4) | .584 |
| Macalester (10-3-2) | .582 |
| Williams (7-2-3) | .582 |
| Hobart (7-4-3) | .581 |
| Ramapo (8-3-2) | .580 |
| Washington and Lee (10-3-0) | .579 |
| UW-Whitewater (10-4-3) | .579 |
| Virginia Wesleyan (6-4-3) | .578 |
| Washington U. (8-2-1) | .578 |
| Amherst (11-1-1) | .577 |
| St. Olaf (6-2-6) | .577 |
| Heidelberg (5-7-1) | .576 |
| North Park (9-3-1) | .576 |
| Potsdam State (7-5-2) | .576 |
| Western Connecticut (5-7-1) | .576 |
Some teams with good W-L-T Records, but low SOS.
| TEAM (W-L-T) | SOS | Regional Rank |
| Colorado College (11-2-1) | .534 | West #2 |
| Buffalo State (10-4-1) | .533 | East #6 |
| Haverford (9-2-2) | .533 | Mid-Atlantic #4 |
| Dominican (10-2-2) | .532 | Central #5 |
| Milwaukee Engineering (10-6-0) | .532 |
| Scranton (10-3-0) | .531 | Mid-Atlantic #6 |
| Carnegie Mellon (9-2-2) | .531 | Great Lakes #7 |
| Benedictine (10-3-1) | .528 |
| Claremont-Mudd-Scripps (9-4-1) | .528 |
| Kenyon (11-2-0) | .528 | Great Lakes #6 |
| Stevens (8-4-1) | .528 |
| Roanoke (6-4-3) | .526 |
| St. Norbert (13-3-0) | .525 | North #6 |
| UW-Platteville (10-6-0) | .525 |
| Chapman (9-4-2) | .524 |
| North Carolina Wesleyan (10-4-0) | .524 |
| Redlands (13-2-0) | .522 | West #4 |
| Knox (12-3-1) | .520 |
| Johns Hopkins (9-3-2) | .519 | Mid-Atlantic #9 |
| Calvin (12-2-0) | .518 | Central #6 |
| Gordon (9-3-1) | .517 |
| Houghton (8-2-3) | .516 |
| Lebanon Valley (9-2-0) | .516 | Mid-Atlantic #8 |
| Merchant Marine (9-4-2) | .511 |
| La Verne (9-3-1) | .503 |
| Grove City (10-3-1) | .502 |
| Wentworth (9-2-4) | .502 |
| Thomas More (8-5-1) | .501 |
| Capital (11-1-2) | .500 |
| Eastern (10-3-1) | .500 |
| Mary Washington (10-3-0) | .500 |
| Springfield (12-1-1) | .499 |
| Geneva (10-3-1) | .494 |
| Transylvania (8-2-3) | .493 |
| Maryville (Tenn.) (11-2-0) | .491 |
| Randolph-Macon (8-2-2) | .477 |
| Hood (9-4-0) | .471 |
| Birmingham-Southern (9-4-1) | .470 |
| Penn State-Behrend (12-1-3) | .470 |
| Medaille (9-3-2) | .458 |
| Thomas (9-4-1) | .442 |
| Central (9-5-0) | .441 |
| Penn State-Harrisburg (10-4-0) | .437 |
| Penn State-Abington (10-2-0) | .436 |
| Morrisville State (11-2-0) | .421 |
| Immaculata (9-4-1) | .415 |
Quote from: Christan Shirk on October 19, 2016, 05:03:12 PM
Some teams with good W-L-T Records, but low SOS.
| TEAM (W-L-T) | SOS | Regional Rank |
| Colorado College (11-2-1) | .534 | West #2 |
| Buffalo State (10-4-1) | .533 | East #6 |
| Haverford (9-2-2) | .533 | Mid-Atlantic #4 |
| Dominican (10-2-2) | .532 | Central #5 |
| Milwaukee Engineering (10-6-0) | .532 |
| Scranton (10-3-0) | .531 | Mid-Atlantic #6 |
| Carnegie Mellon (9-2-2) | .531 | Great Lakes #7 |
| Benedictine (10-3-1) | .528 |
| Claremont-Mudd-Scripps (9-4-1) | .528 |
| Kenyon (11-2-0) | .528 | Great Lakes #6 |
| Stevens (8-4-1) | .528 |
| Roanoke (6-4-3) | .526 |
| St. Norbert (13-3-0) | .525 | North #6 |
| UW-Platteville (10-6-0) | .525 |
| Chapman (9-4-2) | .524 |
| North Carolina Wesleyan (10-4-0) | .524 |
| Redlands (13-2-0) | .522 | West #4 |
| Knox (12-3-1) | .520 |
| Johns Hopkins (9-3-2) | .519 | Mid-Atlantic #9 |
| Calvin (12-2-0) | .518 | Central #6 |
| Gordon (9-3-1) | .517 |
| Houghton (8-2-3) | .516 |
| Lebanon Valley (9-2-0) | .516 | Mid-Atlantic #8 |
| Merchant Marine (9-4-2) | .511 |
| La Verne (9-3-1) | .503 |
| Grove City (10-3-1) | .502 |
| Wentworth (9-2-4) | .502 |
| Thomas More (8-5-1) | .501 |
| Capital (11-1-2) | .500 |
| Eastern (10-3-1) | .500 |
| Mary Washington (10-3-0) | .500 |
| Springfield (12-1-1) | .499 |
| Geneva (10-3-1) | .494 |
| Transylvania (8-2-3) | .493 |
| Maryville (Tenn.) (11-2-0) | .491 |
| Randolph-Macon (8-2-2) | .477 |
| Hood (9-4-0) | .471 |
| Birmingham-Southern (9-4-1) | .470 |
| Penn State-Behrend (12-1-3) | .470 |
| Medaille (9-3-2) | .458 |
| Thomas (9-4-1) | .442 |
| Central (9-5-0) | .441 |
| Penn State-Harrisburg (10-4-0) | .437 |
| Penn State-Abington (10-2-0) | .436 |
| Morrisville State (11-2-0) | .421 |
| Immaculata (9-4-1) | .415 |
Without doing a thorough analysis I think we are seeing again that SoS as calculated is a very inexact science. Who would think Haverford would be at .533? They played Brandeis, RUC, Scranton, Lycoming, Stevens, etc. Capital as noted in the other thread has scheduled some good teams out of conference. Kenyon did a total flip increasing away games, including Thomas More (usually about 14-1 at this juncture in the season) and CWRU, and MAY end up lower than last year when they were blasted for low SoS.
Here's a small example that illustrates just how arbitrary and fickle this SOS thing is. With Haverford switch RUC and Lycoming with RUN and E'town. Just those two switches would have a significant impact on their SOS. And before the season most of us I think would have thought the first two were as tough or tougher than the second pair. Not to mention starting out the season on the road at Brandeis.
Quote from: Christan Shirk on October 19, 2016, 03:57:33 PM
Thanks for posting that, Golden-Fan! I got the women's rankings as soon as they came out so I could get them posted on D3soccer.com, but by the time the men's rankings were released I couldn't get on the NCAA site anymore--kept repeatedly getting the Network Error screen. So thanks to your post I was able to get the men's rankings up on D3soccer.com.
Any time!
rutgers newark with the biggest jump i have ever seen! the njac is crazy this year and i know rowan is not too happy. that loss to RUN killed them. looking forward to a crazy njac playoffs his year.
Quote from: NCAC New England on October 19, 2016, 05:39:53 PM
Without doing a thorough analysis I think we are seeing again that SoS as calculated is a very inexact science. Who would think Haverford would be at .533? They played Brandeis, RUC, Scranton, Lycoming, Stevens, etc. Capital as noted in the other thread has scheduled some good teams out of conference. Kenyon did a total flip increasing away games, including Thomas More (usually about 14-1 at this juncture in the season) and CWRU, and MAY end up lower than last year when they were blasted for low SoS.
Yes, Haverford is a great example of very competitive non-conference scheduling that just didn't pan out that way with how many of their opponents are performing below their recent norm this season.
WNEC 7-9-0 (haven't had losing season since 2003, and have a .701 over the 12 years since)
Brandeis 7-4-3 (haven't had 7 blemishes in a entire season since 2010 or 4 loses prior to the post-season since 2010)
Alvernia 3-10-1 (only under .500 once in last 6 years)
Lycoming 7-6-3 (went 18-2-2 and 15-3-3 past 2 yrs. with most everyone back)
Stevens 8-5-1 (last time they lost even four games prior to NCAA's was 2002)
Stockton 5-7-4 (haven't had a sub .500 season since 1992)
Rutgers-Camden 8-4-4 (haven't had as many blemishes as wins since 2009)
Scranton 10-3-1 (only opponent to match or exceed expectations)
Add to that two conference opponents that normally are much better:
Dickinson 5-7-2 (haven't had a losing season or lost 7 games in an entire season since 2004)
Muhlenberg 3-7-3 (last year's 5-9-2 mark was first losing season in over 2 decades)
Nothing Haverford could do about all that, but it puts Haverford at a disadvantage in the Pool C comparisons is that's where they end up. Two or three teams having down years is one thing, but six opponents significantly below expectations . . . That could have been a strong over-.600 SOS but is only a moderate .533 SOS.
Going a bit off topic here but I'll chalk it up to a free talk Friday. There is a morning radio sports talk I listen to on my commute and every Friday they do a "Small School Ass Whippins of the Week" for football and it's made up of Div II, Div III, and NAIA teams. Usually scores have a score differential of 50-60+ points. Well I thought I would do my own for D3soccer as I was looking at scores from last night and couldn't help but notice one that jumped out at me: Mid Atlantic Christian 1, William Peace University......20?!?! It made for a comical box score, 15 different players scored for the Pacers of William Peace, two whom had hattricks. There was one point in the second half when William Peace scored 6 golazos in less than 5 minutes. And to put the cherry on top, Mid Atlantic Christian Mustangs put one in their own net in the 87th. When it was all said and done, William Peace had earned 22 corners and recorded, wait for it, 85 SHOTS (45 on target). Unfortunately, this is just another day in the office for the Mustangs, who are currently 0-6 on the year with a goal differential of -56 (6GS, 62GA).
I had to share at the expense of Mid Atlantic Christian (sorry lads) as I have never seen/heard of a men's competitive match where 21 goals were scored.
I don't know why you don't just call the match after the first period - neither team is getting anything out of it. I guess if you're the coach of a 5-8-2 squad on senior night you just keep piling it on, and they actually scored more goals in the second period (12) than the first. Maybe the offer was made and rejected.
This is only the second year MAC has played the game. In a story on their web site the coach talks about his pride in a GK who is having to save 30+ shots a game. There are only 14 players on the roster, 9 of whom are freshmen. Per US News total enrollment is 205. Sadly, this was the second 20-1 loss suffered this season.
MAF Power Rankings
1. Chicago (14-0-0)
2. Messiah (12-0-3)
3. Rowan (13-1-1)
4. Ohio Northern (14-0-3)
5. Amherst (11-1-1)
6. Trinity Tx (15-0-0)
7. F&M (11-1-3)
8. Middlebury (9-1-3)
9. Kenyon (12-2-0)
10. Oneonta St (11-3-1)
11. Capital (12-1-2)
12. Calvin 13-2-0)
13. Newark (16-2-0)
14. Haverford (9-2-3)
15. Rochester (8-1-3)
16. Cortland St (13-2-0)
17. Mass-Boston (13-1-1)
18. St. Lawrence (10-3-0)
19. Springfield (13-1-1)
20. St. Thomas (12-0-3)
21. Lynchburg (10-1-3)
22. W&L (11-3-0)
23. Newport (13-2-1)
24. Colorado College (12-2-1)
25. Williams (8-2-3)
RV: Etown (11-2-1), Gordon (10-3-1), Tufts (8-3-2), Kean (14-4-0), PSU-Behrend (13-1-3), Wash U (9-2-1), Loras (10-4-0), Whitworth (8-3-2), Redlands (13-3-0) Leb Val (11-2-0), Montclair (12-4-1), Oberlin (12-2-1), Macalester (10-3-2), St. Olaf (6-2-6)
Nice job, MAF.
DePauw might deserve RV with wins over Kenyon and OWU. I see you included Loras and Tufts. Can't sleep on either of those.
Quote from: Christan Shirk on October 19, 2016, 04:20:59 PM
TOP 50: STRENGTH-OF-SCHEDULE AS PER NCAA
(games through Sunday, October 16)
(used for Regional Rankings and At-Large Selections)
| TEAM (W-L-T) | SOS |
| Chicago (14-0-0) | .670 |
| Emory (8-3-1) | .636 |
| Rutgers-Camden (8-4-3) | .633 |
| Rowan (12-1-1) | .630 |
| Brandeis (6-4-3) | .628 |
| Oglethorpe (5-4-3) | .628 |
| Rochester (8-1-3) | .627 |
| Carthage (11-3-0) | .626 |
| Wheaton (Ill.) (4-7-3) | .624 |
| Lynchburg (10-1-2) | .618 |
| TCNJ (7-6-2) | .614 |
| Brockport State (2-9-2) | .611 |
| Case Western Reserve (4-7-3) | .610 |
| Rutgers-Newark (15-2-0) | .607 |
| Babson (8-4-3) | .606 |
| Stockton (4-7-4) | .601 |
| William Paterson (6-7-2) | .601 |
| Alvernia (3-10-0) | .600 |
| Loras (9-4-0) | .600 |
| Hardin-Simmons (6-3-2) | .599 |
| North Central (Ill.) (5-7-1) | .597 |
| Oneonta State (11-3-1) | .597 |
| Tufts (7-3-2) | .596 |
| Colby (4-7-2) | .594 |
| Montclair State (11-4-1) | .594 |
| Rhode Island College (10-3-1) | .594 |
| Dickinson (5-7-2) | .593 |
| Christopher Newport (12-2-1) | .590 |
| Muhlenberg (3-7-3) | .590 |
| Gustavus Adolphus (5-8-1) | .588 |
| Oswego State (4-11-0) | .588 |
| Luther (10-3-2) | .586 |
| Messiah (11-0-3) | .584 |
| MIT (4-8-1) | .584 |
| Cortland State (12-2-0) | .584 |
| WPI (7-2-4) | .584 |
| Macalester (10-3-2) | .582 |
| Williams (7-2-3) | .582 |
| Hobart (7-4-3) | .581 |
| Ramapo (8-3-2) | .580 |
| Washington and Lee (10-3-0) | .579 |
| UW-Whitewater (10-4-3) | .579 |
| Virginia Wesleyan (6-4-3) | .578 |
| Washington U. (8-2-1) | .578 |
| Amherst (11-1-1) | .577 |
| St. Olaf (6-2-6) | .577 |
| Heidelberg (5-7-1) | .576 |
| North Park (9-3-1) | .576 |
| Potsdam State (7-5-2) | .576 |
| Western Connecticut (5-7-1) | .576 |
So the team with BY FAR the toughest schedule (so far) in the entire country is also 1 of 2 remaining teams without a blemish? This Chicago team is SCARY good.
MASSIVE win for Fredonia St over Oneonta St today 2-1. That win just might get Fredonia a Pool C as they will surely be moving up in the East rankings..
Wow, just when you think Oneonta has put behind a rough opening weekend against strong competition and can again be dependably good and a national title contender as we have come to know them in recent years, they drop two of four to teams that they shouldn't lose to. I can't remember a season as unpredictable as this one week to week, game to game.
Prediction: Wheaton (Ill), now at 5-7-2, will beat North Central tonight and sneak into CCIW playoffs and win the CCIW AQ. I don't know anything about the status of their injured players, but if they are close to their full squad by tourney time they also could then make a run.
Results of interest around the country...
F&M sneaks by Haverford in OT, 1-0.
Babson tops WPI, 2-0.
Vassar gets huge win over Rochester, 3-0, despite being outshot 14-5.
Whitman hurts Puget Sound's chances with 2-1 OT win, and Whitworth gets by Pac Luth 2-1 in OT.
Maryville (TN) keeps rolling with big win over NC Wesleyan, 2-1 in OT.
Tufts beats Williams, Amherst survives late versus Wesleyan, Bates shocks Midd in OT, and Bowdoin and Conn Coll draw. Hamilton with impressive long distance win over Colby.
Carleton knocks off St. Olaf 2-0.
CWRU upsets North Park, away, 2-0.
Chapman gets key West region win over enigmatic Redlands, 2-1.
New Paltz damages Buff St, 1-0.
Endicott halts Wentworth, 2-0.
TCNJ dents Kean' Pool C hopes, 3-2.
UW-Platteville takes Dubuque, 3-2.
Springfield stays hot over MIT, 1-0.
Skidmore gets key win over Clarkson, 2-0 while SLU gets by RIT, 2-1.
Hopkins avoids upset to Muhlenberg, 2-0.
Eastern outlasts King's, 1-0
DePauw remains a contender with win over Denison, 2-1.
Hood and Lyco draw 0-0.
William Paterson stuns RUC, 1-0.
Coast Guard and Wheaton (MA) shoot it out, 4-4.
Fredonia shocks Oneonta, 2-1.
Susquehanna and E'town draw 2-2.
Newport keeps winning, 4-2 over PS-Harrisburg.
W&L auto-corrects with 2-0 win over Randolph.
NCAC NE Top 15 (Homestretch edition)
1) Chicago
2) Rowan
3) Messiah
4) Rutgers-Newark
5) Amherst
6) Franklin & Marshall
7) Ohio Northern
8) Trinity (TX)
9) UMass-Boston
10) Calvin
11) Carthage
12) Tufts
13) Cortland St
14) Kenyon
15) Christopher Newport
Stellar surprises (random order) -- Geneva, Springfield, St Thomas, Maryville (TN), New Rochelle, Clark, Grove City, Capital, Hanover, Mary Washington, PS-Behrend, Lebanon Valley, St. Norbert, St. Josephs (ME), Knox, Rhode Island College
Heavyweights still looming (random order) -- Haverford, Middlebury, Rochester, Carnegie Mellon, Wash U, Emory, Brandeis, OWU, Montclair St. Oneonta St, Loras, Babson, Washington & Lee, Lynchburg, St Lawrence, UWW, Whitworth, DePauw, Colorado College
Still hopeful (random order) -- Gordon/Endicott/Wentworth, Scranton, Texas-Dallas, Dominican, Morrisville St, La Verne, Chapman, Johns Hopkins, Vassar, Skidmore, Oberlin, Wabash, Conn College, Williams, Bowdoin, Eastern, John Carroll, Rose Hulman, Transy, Redlands, St. Mary's, Elizabethtown, Macalester, Gettysburg, Luther
Two results today with some national implications, at least potentially.
Lycoming beats Oneonta, 3-2 in 2 OT. Lyco got 5 yellow cards and was outshot almost 3-1, but they won the category that counts. This can't possibly give Lyco a chance for a pool C, but it certainly could hurt Oneonta.
Williams decisively beats Middlebury, 3-0. Likewise, this doesn't help Midd and probably won't really help Williams. If you have an opinion on this one, Mr. Right, I'm all ears. 8-)
Luther and Loras 0-0 early 2nd half in a torrential rainstorm at the Rock Bowl. Video still pretty decent.
Loras takes the IIAC regular season title again with a hard-fought 1-0 win over Luther. A lot of people have written Loras off after their mid-season struggles but don't forget that last year the Duhawks also went through a rough patch and look where they ended up. This team is very young and talented and has a couple outstanding senior leaders so it's hard to know how deep they could go in the tournament.
MAF Power Rankings
1. Chicago (15-0-0)
2. Messiah (14-0-3)
3. Rowan (14-1-1)
4. Ohio Northern (16-0-3)
5. Amherst (12-1-1)
6. Trinity Tx (16-1-0)
7. F&M (11-1-3)
8. Kenyon (14-2-0)
9. Calvin (15-2-0)
10. Cortland St. (15-2-0)
11. Newark (17-2-0)
12. Mass-Boston (14-1-1)
13. Springfield (15-1-1)
14. St. Thomas (14-0-3)
15. PSU Behrend (15-1-3)
16. Lynchburg (12-1-3)
17. Colorado College (14-2-1)
18. St. Lawrence (11-3-0)
19. Middlebury (9-3-3)
20. Newport (14-2-1)
21. Loras (12-4-0)
22. W&L (12-3-0)
23. Leb Val (13-2-0)
24. Haverford (9-3-3)
25. Williams (9-3-3)
RV: Rochester (8-2-3), Etown (11-2-2), Whitworth (10-3-2), Macalester (11-3-3), St. Joe's (13-1-4), CMU (10-2-2), Houghton (10-2-4), Oneonta St (13-5-1), Whitewater (13-4-3), Tufts (9-4-2), Vassar (10-3-2), Scranton (11-3-1), Capital (12-3-2), Carthage (14-3-0)
Quote from: Mid-Atlantic Fan on October 26, 2016, 10:15:03 AM
MAF Power Rankings
1. Chicago (15-0-0)
2. Messiah (14-0-3)
3. Rowan (14-1-1)
4. Ohio Northern (16-0-3)
5. Amherst (12-1-1)
6. Trinity Tx (16-1-0)
7. F&M (11-1-3)
8. Kenyon (14-2-0)
9. Calvin (15-2-0)
10. Cortland St. (15-2-0)
11. Newark (17-2-0)
12. Mass-Boston (14-1-1)
13. Springfield (15-1-1)
14. St. Thomas (14-0-3)
15. PSU Behrend (15-1-3)
16. Lynchburg (12-1-3)
17. Colorado College (14-2-1)
18. St. Lawrence (11-3-0)
19. Middlebury (9-3-3)
20. Newport (14-2-1)
21. Loras (12-4-0)
22. W&L (12-3-0)
23. Leb Val (13-2-0)
24. Haverford (9-3-3)
25. Williams (9-3-3)
RV: Rochester (8-2-3), Etown (11-2-2), Whitworth (10-3-2), Macalester (11-3-3), St. Joe's (13-1-4), CMU (10-2-2), Houghton (10-2-4), Oneonta St (13-5-1), Whitewater (13-4-3), Tufts (9-4-2), Vassar (10-3-2), Scranton (11-3-1), Capital (12-3-2), Carthage (14-3-0)
Agree with your top 12 although I might have a couple of teams in a different order in that top 12. IMO I think you're off on PS-Behrend, Midd, and probably Springfield (all too high), Carthage (way too low), Newport (too low) and not sure about St. Josephs and Houghton making RV category. Capital also has slipped badly. And I would have both Oberlin and Wabash in RV and probably Endicott, Geneva, RIC, Maryville, Hanover, Dominican, Tex-Dallas and Babson.
I can definitely see the logic for all of that. I went off my rankings last week. So I had Capital very high (11 or 12 I believe?) so despite two losses since then I figured I would keep them as the last RV slot. Agreed Carthage should be a little higher (I missed on that one!) Springfield, St. Thomas, and Behrend have a combined 44-2-7 record...I'll take my chances slotting them together 13 thru 15. Until they mess up they deserve a little praise. Middlebury I had very high last week so again they dropped far (10 slots) based off 2 losses since then...probably should switch them with someone like UR or Etown and have them RV instead of ranked. All the others you mentioned for potential RV teams are definitely deserving of recognition.
Thoughts on Oneonta St? Chances they get an at-large bid after dropping their last 2 of the regular season? They are sitting at 13-5-1 right now. I believe they are on the wrong side of the bubble at the moment.
Quote from: Mid-Atlantic Fan on October 26, 2016, 11:36:37 AM
I can definitely see the logic for all of that. I went off my rankings last week. So I had Capital very high (11 or 12 I believe?) so despite two losses since then I figured I would keep them as the last RV slot. Agreed Carthage should be a little higher (I missed on that one!) Springfield, St. Thomas, and Behrend have a combined 44-2-7 record...I'll take my chances slotting them together 13 thru 15. Until they mess up they deserve a little praise. Middlebury I had very high last week so again they dropped far (10 slots) based off 2 losses since then...probably should switch them with someone like UR or Etown and have them RV instead of ranked. All the others you mentioned for potential RV teams are definitely deserving of recognition.
Thoughts on Oneonta St? Chances they get an at-large bid after dropping their last 2 of the regular season? They are sitting at 13-5-1 right now. I believe they are on the wrong side of the bubble at the moment.
Oneonta of course will have a very good chance of winning their tournament. They seem to have Cortland's number. If not, I would guess they still may have a chance. Seems like this may be a strange year. A lot of teams stumbling but I don't see teams right underneath them right there to take advantage, unless we see something different with how SoS is used. Like will any of teams like Maryville, Capital, Geneva, Endicott, etc, etc get a bid if they don't win their tourneys? What teams are right on the doorstep ready to capitalize on teams that have stumbled like Oneonta, Midd, SLU, Macalester, etc? I think we may see at least several teams with 6-8 blemishes get in this year.
Yeah, it will be interesting to see what the committee does with some of these teams like Oneonta St that have more losses than normal and thus a lower win pct. than expected but good SOS. Will some teams with better win pct., but SOS's below the normal range of consideration get in the mix? It's a little bit of a new situation this year. I think. Not as many teams are "picking themselves" by keeping their blemishes to a minimum playing a pretty tough schedule. I think the committee's job is tougher than ever this year to weigh the different criteria and come to a decision. Seems we'll have to either see teams with more blemishes than normal get selected or teams with lower SOS than normal get picked.
Quote from: Flying Weasel on October 26, 2016, 01:05:47 PM
Yeah, it will be interesting to see what the committee does with some of these teams like Oneonta St that have more losses than normal and thus a lower win pct. than expected but good SOS. Will some teams with better win pct., but SOS's below the normal range of consideration get in the mix? It's a little bit of a new situation this year. I think. Not as many teams are "picking themselves" by keeping their blemishes to a minimum playing a pretty tough schedule. I think the committee's job is tougher than ever this year to weigh the different criteria and come to a decision. Seems we'll have to either see teams with more blemishes than normal get selected or teams with lower SOS than normal get picked.
You put it much better than I.
When I look at some of the regions where big names are faltering, I don't really see anyone else to pick. Like in the East with Oneonta and SLU who is right there to take advantage? Every time a team like Buff St or Fredonia gets on the cusp THEY lose. As teams like Clark, Gordon, etc fade who is going to jump over a slumping Middlebury. Will a team like Springfield get a bid without the AQ? I assume RIC is pretty well positioned but teams like RIC in all of these regions are pretty hard to find. Will a team like Hanover with a decent SoS get a bid if they don't get the AQ. Definitely is going to be interesting.
from D3soccer.com: http://www.d3soccer.com/rankings/2016/regional-rankings-Oct-26 (http://www.d3soccer.com/rankings/2016/regional-rankings-Oct-26)
CENTRALRANK | SCHOOL | DIV. III | OVERALL | SOS | RvR | PREV. |
1. | Chicago | 15-0-0 | 15-0-0 | 0.656 | 6-0-0 | 1 |
2. | Carthage | 13-3-0 | 14-3-0 | 0.618 | 3-2-0 | 2 |
3. | Washington U. | 9-3-1 | 9-3-1 | 0.580 | 2-1-1 | 3 |
4. | North Park | 9-5-1 | 9-5-1 | 0.579 | 1-2-1 | 4 |
5. | Calvin | 14-2-0 | 14-2-0 | 0.513 | 0-1-0 | 6 |
6. | Benedictine | 12-3-1 | 12-4-1 | 0.516 | 1-1-0 | -- |
EASTRANK | SCHOOL | DIV. III | OVERALL | SOS | RvR | PREV. |
1. | Cortland State | 15-2-0 | 15-2-0 | 0.565 | 3-2-0 | 3 |
2. | Oneonta State | 13-4-1 | 13-4-1 | 0.609 | 3-3-0 | 2 |
3. | Rochester | 8-2-3 | 8-2-3 | 0.623 | 3-2-1 | 1 |
4. | St. Lawrence | 11-3-0 | 11-3-0 | 0.553 | 2-1-0 | 4 |
5. | New Paltz State | 8-3-7 | 8-3-7 | 0.563 | 3-1-1 | -- |
6. | Fredonia State | 11-6-1 | 11-6-1 | 0.558 | 2-1-0 | 8 |
7. | Vassar | 10-3-2 | 10-3-2 | 0.563 | 1-3-0 | 5 |
8. | Hobart | 8-5-3 | 8-5-3 | 0.591 | 2-3-0 | 7 |
GREAT LAKESRANK | SCHOOL | DIV. III | OVERALL | SOS | RvR | PREV. |
1. | DePauw | 10-3-1 | 10-3-2 | 0.562 | 3-1-0 | 4 |
2. | Ohio Wesleyan | 9-3-3 | 9-3-3 | 0.562 | 3-2-2 | 3 |
3. | Oberlin | 12-3-1 | 12-3-1 | 0.562 | 2-3-0 | 2 |
4. | Ohio Northern | 14-0-3 | 15-0-3 | 0.515 | 1-0-1 | 1 |
5. | Hanover | 12-3-0 | 13-3-0 | 0.531 | 2-2-0 | 5 |
6. | Kenyon | 13-2-0 | 13-2-0 | 0.507 | 1-1-0 | 6 |
7. | Carnegie Mellon | 10-2-2 | 10-2-2 | 0.534 | 0-1-1 | 7 |
8. | John Carroll | 9-5-2 | 9-5-2 | 0.569 | 0-2-1 | -- |
MID-ATLANTICRANK | SCHOOL | DIV. III | OVERALL | SOS | RvR | PREV. |
1. | Messiah | 13-0-3 | 13-0-3 | 0.561 | 3-0-2 | 1 |
2. | Franklin and Marshall | 11-1-3 | 11-1-3 | 0.558 | 3-1-0 | 2 |
3. | Elizabethtown | 11-2-2 | 11-2-2 | 0.554 | 2-2-1 | 3 |
4. | Haverford | 9-3-3 | 9-3-3 | 0.572 | 2-1-1 | 4 |
5. | Scranton | 11-3-1 | 11-3-1 | 0.544 | 1-2-1 | 6 |
6. | Drew | 9-4-2 | 9-4-2 | 0.545 | 1-0-1 | 5 |
7. | Johns Hopkins | 10-3-2 | 10-3-2 | 0.522 | 1-2-0 | 9 |
8. | Gettysburg | 8-3-3 | 8-3-3 | 0.554 | 0-3-1 | 7 |
9. | Misericordia | 10-5-1 | 10-5-1 | 0.546 | 0-2-1 | -- |
from D3soccer.com: http://www.d3soccer.com/rankings/2016/regional-rankings-Oct-26 (http://www.d3soccer.com/rankings/2016/regional-rankings-Oct-26)
NEW ENGLANDRANK | SCHOOL | DIV. III | OVERALL | SOS | RvR | PREV. |
1. | Amherst | 12-1-1 | 12-1-1 | 0.565 | 4-1-1 | 1 |
2. | Tufts | 9-3-2 | 9-3-2 | 0.604 | 4-0-0 | 8 |
3. | Mass-Boston | 14-1-1 | 14-1-1 | 0.537 | 1-0-1 | 2 |
4. | Clark | 13-3-0 | 13-3-0 | 0.541 | 3-1-0 | 3 |
5. | Middlebury | 9-2-3 | 9-2-3 | 0.566 | 2-1-1 | 4 |
6. | Rhode Island College | 12-3-1 | 12-3-1 | 0.579 | 1-3-0 | 5 |
7. | Babson | 9-4-3 | 9-4-3 | 0.614 | 2-3-2 | 7 |
8. | Brandeis | 7-4-3 | 7-4-3 | 0.637 | 3-3-2 | -- |
9. | Williams | 8-3-3 | 8-3-3 | 0.595 | 1-3-1 | 6 |
10. | Connecticut College | 9-4-1 | 9-4-1 | 0.558 | 2-3-1 | 10 |
11. | Coast Guard | 9-3-3 | 9-3-3 | 0.547 | 1-2-1 | 11 |
12. | WPI | 8-3-4 | 8-3-4 | 0.574 | 0-2-1 | 9 |
NORTHRANK | SCHOOL | DIV. III | OVERALL | SOS | RvR | PREV. |
1. | St. Thomas | 13-0-3 | 13-0-3 | 0.555 | 2-0-1 | 2 |
2. | UW-Whitewater | 13-4-3 | 13-4-3 | 0.587 | 3-2-2 | -- |
3. | Dubuque | 12-4-0 | 12-4-0 | 0.558 | 2-1-0 | 1 |
4. | Luther | 11-4-2 | 11-4-2 | 0.594 | 1-3-0 | 3 |
5. | Wartburg | 12-5-1 | 12-5-1 | 0.566 | 2-3-0 | -- |
6. | St. Norbert | 14-3-0 | 14-3-0 | 0.521 | 1-0-0 | 6 |
SOUTH ATLANTICRANK | SCHOOL | DIV. III | OVERALL | SOS | RvR | PREV. |
1. | Rowan | 14-1-1 | 14-1-1 | 0.625 | 4-1-0 | 1 |
2. | Rutgers-Newark | 17-2-0 | 17-2-0 | 0.606 | 4-0-0 | 2 |
3. | Lynchburg | 11-1-3 | 11-1-3 | 0.580 | 1-1-1 | 3 |
4. | Christopher Newport | 14-2-1 | 14-2-1 | 0.573 | 1-1-1 | 4 |
5. | Washington and Lee | 12-3-0 | 12-3-0 | 0.567 | 3-2-0 | 5 |
6. | Emory | 9-3-1 | 9-3-1 | 0.603 | 1-1-1 | 6 |
7. | Kean | 14-5-0 | 14-5-0 | 0.573 | 2-3-0 | -- |
8. | Montclair State | 12-5-1 | 12-5-1 | 0.614 | 1-3-0 | 8 |
WESTRANK | SCHOOL | DIV. III | OVERALL | SOS | RvR | PREV. |
1. | Trinity (Texas) | 16-1-0 | 16-1-0 | 0.553 | 3-0-0 | 1 |
2. | Chapman | 11-4-2 | 11-4-2 | 0.550 | 2-1-0 | -- |
3. | Colorado College | 13-2-1 | 14-2-1 | 0.528 | 0-2-1 | 2 |
4. | Texas-Dallas | 11-3-1 | 11-3-1 | 0.574 | 0-2-0 | 3 |
5. | Whitworth | 10-3-2 | 10-3-2 | 0.555 | 0-2-0 | 5 |
are the refs around the country just as bad as the refs in jersey?! i attended the stockton camden game and the ref seemed to be playing for stockton. he called a pk which stockton won off of for a foul that a lot of you guys would laugh at. it's a joke that refs have the authority to do that. is it really that hard to find decent refs..
At least from my perspective in the Mid Atlantic, there is a small group of refs that are, for the most part, pretty good. Then the rest are either below average or just downright bad. So, yes, it seems to be an American reffing thing. You also see this in club and academy soccer as well as high school
Quote from: firstplaceloser on October 27, 2016, 10:07:05 AM
are the refs around the country just as bad as the refs in jersey?! i attended the stockton camden game and the ref seemed to be playing for stockton. he called a pk which stockton won off of for a foul that a lot of you guys would laugh at. it's a joke that refs have the authority to do that. is it really that hard to find decent refs..
We must of been at different games, I think the ref was equally bad for both teams. The penalty was a penalty every day of the week with a good ref or a bad ref. I thought it was good game each team had the balance of play for stretches and Camden had a few chances they should have put away to tie the game up.
Nothing like late season / post season NJAC games!!!
Quote from: NCAC New England on October 26, 2016, 01:48:15 PM
Quote from: Flying Weasel on October 26, 2016, 01:05:47 PM
Yeah, it will be interesting to see what the committee does with some of these teams like Oneonta St that have more losses than normal and thus a lower win pct. than expected but good SOS. Will some teams with better win pct., but SOS's below the normal range of consideration get in the mix? It's a little bit of a new situation this year. I think. Not as many teams are "picking themselves" by keeping their blemishes to a minimum playing a pretty tough schedule. I think the committee's job is tougher than ever this year to weigh the different criteria and come to a decision. Seems we'll have to either see teams with more blemishes than normal get selected or teams with lower SOS than normal get picked.
You put it much better than I.
When I look at some of the regions where big names are faltering, I don't really see anyone else to pick. Like in the East with Oneonta and SLU who is right there to take advantage? Every time a team like Buff St or Fredonia gets on the cusp THEY lose. As teams like Clark, Gordon, etc fade who is going to jump over a slumping Middlebury. Will a team like Springfield get a bid without the AQ? I assume RIC is pretty well positioned but teams like RIC in all of these regions are pretty hard to find. Will a team like Hanover with a decent SoS get a bid if they don't get the AQ. Definitely is going to be interesting.
An interesting situation is brewing in the midwest with OWU. Given Saturday's slate - the only chance OWU has of making the NCAC tournament is for them to win and DePauw lose at home to Allegheny. OWU finishes the season 10-4-2, does not make the tournament and is ranked #2 in the midwest. Their SOS might drop a little this week - not enough to drop them out of the top 4 in the 3rd rankings. Others in the region play another week and have the chance to increase their SOS as they play one another - or play other ranked teams. What to do, what to do . . .
I thin OWU will drop but not by much as the other teams in the region do not have comparable SOS, OWP and RvR...I say they drop to #4 and are squarely on the BUBBLE....The 19th Pool C team in the NCAA's could well come from past NCAA Champions OWU, SLU, Williams or Midd....Very interesting. I still say Kenyon better win the NCAC AQ as that SOS is beyond WEAK
Quote from: paclassic89 on October 27, 2016, 10:31:35 AM
At least from my perspective in the Mid Atlantic, there is a small group of refs that are, for the most part, pretty good. Then the rest are either below average or just downright bad. So, yes, it seems to be an American reffing thing. You also see this in club and academy soccer as well as high school
To go off this some more, I agree with paclassics89. The officiating is absolutely dreadful in this region for a large portion of games i have watched. This is for many teams and many locations throughout the region. It's a shame that their isn't a punishment for an official like there are for players and coaches. The lack of character in some officials is sad too. Yes they will get yelled at one way or another because one team will like the call and one team will not like the call. It's the nature of the game and job, but if the official can't take that then they shouldn't be doing the job. Dishing out unnecessary cards for a lack of "thick skin" is petty and childish at best. Sure there are instances I can recall from attending games that players rightfully deserve cards for dissent, but when asking for explanations on calls and getting carded for that is absurd. This year has by far been the worst officiating I have seen in all my years. I feel bad for the players having to deal with the uncertainty of what a foul is from game to game and usually from minute to minute. There is NO consistency from game to game or even half to half.
This is a really interesting situation re: OWU/Kenyon and makes me think that the selection committee needs to retool their process. I understand why the process is the way it is. To provide a selection criteria that is as objective as possible but when you have a team that doesn't even make their conference playoffs ranked that much higher than a team that is first in the same conference I think there is a problem with the way these rankings are constructed
I'm not sure how much this would affect the rankings but why not use an RPI system as another criteria similar to the way NCAA Bball is done? The RPI formula is as follows RPI = (WP * 0.25) + (OWP * 0.50) + (OOWP * 0.25) It seems like such an easy thing to implement instead of eyeballing records. From the NCAA selection process wiki entry:
"Additionally, the committee officially considers other computer rankings, such as ESPN's BPI, Sagarin, and Pomeroy Ratings, which use additional factors considered by the committee, such as injured players in the case of the BPI. Additionally, committee members consider how teams do on the road and at neutral courts, strength of conference and schedule, non-conference strength of schedule, record against other selected tournament teams, and other extenuating factors. Finally, the "eye test" is often quoted by pundits as something the committee uses, however ncaa.org's sparse description of the selection process doesn't officially mention the "eye test".[2] For instance, in 2016 Oklahoma athletic director Joe Castiglione, the NCAA selection committee's chair, said that the stark contrast in Syracuse's performance in 2015-2016 with Jim Boeheim present versus absent was considered the same as missing a key player during the slump."
Quote from: paclassic89 on October 27, 2016, 12:08:11 PM
This is a really interesting situation re: OWU/Kenyon and makes me think that the selection committee needs to retool their process. I understand why the process is the way it is. To provide a selection criteria that is as objective as possible but when you have a team that doesn't even make their conference playoffs ranked that much higher than a team that is first in the same conference I think there is a problem with the way these rankings are constructed
I'm not sure how much this would affect the rankings but why not use an RPI system as another criteria similar to the way NCAA Bball is done? The RPI formula is as follows RPI = (WP * 0.25) + (OWP * 0.50) + (OOWP * 0.25) It seems like such an easy thing to implement instead of eyeballing records. From the NCAA selection process wiki entry:
"Additionally, the committee officially considers other computer rankings, such as ESPN's BPI, Sagarin, and Pomeroy Ratings, which use additional factors considered by the committee, such as injured players in the case of the BPI. Additionally, committee members consider how teams do on the road and at neutral courts, strength of conference and schedule, non-conference strength of schedule, record against other selected tournament teams, and other extenuating factors. Finally, the "eye test" is often quoted by pundits as something the committee uses, however ncaa.org's sparse description of the selection process doesn't officially mention the "eye test".[2] For instance, in 2016 Oklahoma athletic director Joe Castiglione, the NCAA selection committee's chair, said that the stark contrast in Syracuse's performance in 2015-2016 with Jim Boeheim present versus absent was considered the same as missing a key player during the slump."
I'm not going to waste a lot of energy on this like I did last year. No amount of upset or outrage about it is going to change a thing. OWU scheduled almost all home games this year, I assume because of knowing they were young, while Kenyon scheduled almost all games away I assume specifically to address last year's fiasco. OWU is benefitting from Calvin having no challenges in their conferences and another great record, ONU having a great record which helps boost OWU's SoS while ONU drops from 1st to 4th without losing, Hanover having a great record in another weak conference, Oberlin and Kenyon's records, Capital having a great record that could not have been anticipated any more than Heidelberg, and W&L having one of their best seasons ever. On the other hand, on Kenyon's schedule TMC spit the bit this year way beyond what could be expected and CWRU has a bad record despite beating Kenyon and North Park, and everyone else (Catholic, Frostburg, Heidelberg, etc) were worse than normal. Kenyon doesn't even get the benefit of OWU having a typically stellar record. And then Wabash drops out of the rankings the same week they are celebrating their best season and biggest win in program history which will take away another ranked game for Kenyon. Hard to swallow when you've just dominated a team and outshot them 20-4. Then we've got DePauw which, at best, will finish 4th in the NCAC and sits on the #1 spot regionally. Forget Kenyon. That's not fair to ONU, Oberlin and Wabash.
Whatever. I think Mr.Right is mostly right. Kenyon probably needs to beat Wabash and then at least get to the final of the NCAC tourney. At that point, they might as well be completely safe and just win the thing again.
More broadly, one year after so many complaints about RPI, this could be the year of "RPI times five." Teams like Oneonta, SLU, OWU, Midd/Williams, etc could sneak in because there are very few teams behind them to take their place.
Quote from: Ji Sung Park the Bus on October 27, 2016, 10:41:00 AM
Quote from: firstplaceloser on October 27, 2016, 10:07:05 AM
are the refs around the country just as bad as the refs in jersey?! i attended the stockton camden game and the ref seemed to be playing for stockton. he called a pk which stockton won off of for a foul that a lot of you guys would laugh at. it's a joke that refs have the authority to do that. is it really that hard to find decent refs..
We must of been at different games, I think the ref was equally bad for both teams. The penalty was a penalty every day of the week with a good ref or a bad ref. I thought it was good game each team had the balance of play for stretches and Camden had a few chances they should have put away to tie the game up.
Nothing like late season / post season NJAC games!!!
he went down a little soft. i even heard stockton parents laughing about it. regardless i'm not making excuses for the loss either i'm just saying that the refs are very very weak. don't get me wrong i've had some good refs but even when i played in the ncaa tournament and even in the final four the refs were horrid.
Quote from: firstplaceloser on October 27, 2016, 01:23:52 PM
Quote from: Ji Sung Park the Bus on October 27, 2016, 10:41:00 AM
Quote from: firstplaceloser on October 27, 2016, 10:07:05 AM
are the refs around the country just as bad as the refs in jersey?! i attended the stockton camden game and the ref seemed to be playing for stockton. he called a pk which stockton won off of for a foul that a lot of you guys would laugh at. it's a joke that refs have the authority to do that. is it really that hard to find decent refs..
We must of been at different games, I think the ref was equally bad for both teams. The penalty was a penalty every day of the week with a good ref or a bad ref. I thought it was good game each team had the balance of play for stretches and Camden had a few chances they should have put away to tie the game up.
Nothing like late season / post season NJAC games!!!
he went down a little soft. i even heard stockton parents laughing about it. regardless i'm not making excuses for the loss either i'm just saying that the refs are very very weak. don't get me wrong i've had some good refs but even when i played in the ncaa tournament and even in the final four the refs were horrid.
Yeah sometimes you have to go down when a defender dives in, he fooled a ref that was fooled almost the entire night. It is almost a roll of a dice on how the refs will be when you show up to a game. Luckily we had some good refs when we won a National Championship!! ;D
Redlands have lost 3 in a row and somehow are listed as regular season champs. Is that right? Is La Verne ineligible?
Quote from: NCAC New England on October 29, 2016, 10:03:07 AM
Redlands have lost 3 in a row and somehow are listed as regular season champs. Is that right? Is La Verne ineligible?
No, I must have miscalculated or otherwise screwed up when I thought they had clinched the top spot.
How can a smart school like Carnegie Mellon not know how to run their video?
Quote from: NCAC New England on October 30, 2016, 01:31:22 PM
How can a smart school like Carnegie Mellon not know how to run their video?
They must be using the Marietta videographers . . .
Quote from: NCAC New England on October 30, 2016, 01:31:22 PM
How can a smart school like Carnegie Mellon not know how to run their video?
Word is the high winds and rain made them shut it down.
MSOE and Wisc Lutheran headed to OT in their conference tournament #6/#3 game....Only game on right now and decent video..2-2 and possibly PK's coming. I cannot believe Dominican won this league as when I saw them play Chicago earlier in the year they did not impress me. They were WHACKING everything and did not look very good. Maybe they had some injuries or had a bad game but it was UGLY. Chicago dominated them.
Wisc Lutheran wins it in OT 3-2 over MSOE to end their season. Nice 25 yard rocket but the MSOE GK was to far off his line and if he had been onhis line he would have caught it. Love this time of year...
If they hadn't already Whitworth clinches the NWC AQ with 2OT win over mid-table Willamette.
NCAC NE Top 15 (Post-season)
1) Chicago
2) Rowan
3) Messiah
4) Amherst
5) Rutgers-Newark
6) Trinity (TX)
7) Carthage
8) Calvin
9) Kenyon
10) Christopher Newport
11) Cortland St
12) Ohio Northern
13) UMass-Boston
14) Franklin & Marshall
15) Oberlin/Washington & Lee (TIE)
Pool C Drama Club (random) -- SLU, Vassar, Rochester, Emory, Carnegie Mellon, Wash U, OWU, DePauw, Middlebury, Tufts, Bowdoin, Babson, Colorado Coll, Scranton, Drew, Johns Hopkins, Montclair St, Lynchburg, Rhode Island College, Hanover, Rose Hulman, John Carroll, Chapman, Dubuque, Texas-Dallas, Loras
No Pool C Support Group -- Maryville (TN), Springfield
Quote from: NCAC New England on October 30, 2016, 09:50:28 PM
NCAC NE Top 15 (Post-season)
1) Chicago
2) Rowan
3) Messiah
4) Amherst
5) Rutgers-Newark
6) Trinity (TX)
7) Carthage
8) Calvin
9) Kenyon
10) Christopher Newport
11) Cortland St
12) Ohio Northern
13) UMass-Boston
14) Franklin & Marshall
15) Oberlin/Washington & Lee (TIE)
Pool C Drama Club (random) -- SLU, Vassar, Rochester, Emory, Carnegie Mellon, Wash U, OWU, DePauw, Middlebury, Tufts, Bowdoin, Babson, Colorado Coll, Scranton, Drew, Johns Hopkins, Montclair St, Lynchburg, Rhode Island College, Hanover, Rose Hulman, John Carroll, Chapman, Dubuque, Texas-Dallas, Loras
No Pool C Support Group -- Maryville (TN), Springfield
No Elizabethtown?
No Haverford?
Halloween Edition :D
MAF Power Rankings
1. Chicago (16-0-1)
2. Messiah (15-0-3)
3. Rowan (16-1-1)
4. Amherst (14-1-1)
5. Trinity Tx (18-1-0)
6. Ohio Northern (16-1-3)
7. Kenyon (15-2-0)
8. Calvin (16-2-0)
9. Cortland St. (15-2-0)
10. Newark (18-2-0)
11. Mass-Boston (15-1-2)
12. F&M (12-2-3)
13. Springfield (16-1-1)
14. Lynchburg (13-1-4)
15. PSU Behrend (15-1-3)
16. Newport (15-2-1)
17. Colorado College (15-2-1)
18. St. Thomas (14-1-3)
19. Carthage (16-3-0)
20. Haverford (11-3-3)
21. Loras (12-4-0)
22. W&L (13-3-1)
23. St. Joe's (14-1-4)
24. Etown (12-2-2)
25. Whitworth (12-3-2)
RV: St. Lawrence (11-4-0), Dominican (12-2-3), Macalester (12-3-3), Oberlin (14-3-1), DePauw (11-4-2), Oneonta St (13-5-1), Whitewater (13-4-3), Brandeis (10-4-3), Vassar (12-3-2), Scranton (12-3-1), Capital (13-3-2), Middlebury (10-3-3), Johns Hopkins (12-3-2)
Quote from: backyarddawg on October 31, 2016, 08:59:34 AM
No Haverford?
Good questions. I didn't include teams in the "Drama Club" that I either ranked (and that may end up that group like Oberlin, W&L, Kenyon, ONU, etc) to avoid duplicates OR teams like Haverford and E'town that I thought were relatively safe in terms of Pool C if they need one.
CNU going into 2OT against Frostburg State. They were up 1-0 with about 10 minutes left so I do not know how Frostburg St scored. CNU has maybe 1 legit team on its shcedule and only 1 ranked win, a decent to good SOS at .570 and good Win %. Still a loss or draw for CNU in this game would PUT THEM on the bubble as well as many other teams across the nation. Usually this league the Capital Athletic Conference has a couple ranked teams every year but the league must be way down this year. I would think CNU needs to advance only being ranked #4 in the South Atlantic with teams behind them capable of moving ahead of them in the rankings.
UPDATE: Bubble teams can breathe a little easier as CNU beats Frostburg St 2-1 it 2OT on a nice cross and header to finish off Frostburg. Bubble teams must root for CNU to get the AQ in this league
Quote from: NCAC New England on October 31, 2016, 09:34:04 AM
Quote from: backyarddawg on October 31, 2016, 08:59:34 AM
No Haverford?
Good questions. I didn't include teams in the "Drama Club" that I either ranked (and that may end up that group like Oberlin, W&L, Kenyon, ONU, etc) to avoid duplicates OR teams like Haverford and E'town that I thought were relatively safe in terms of Pool C if they need one.
Good answer!! ;D
Wisconsin Lutheran up 1-0 at Dominican at half!
Quote from: dontshootthegoose on November 02, 2016, 02:50:31 PM
Wisconsin Lutheran up 1-0 at Dominican at half!
WLC just leveled 2-2 with less than 10min to play!
Here comes PK's between Wisconsin Lutheran and Dominican!
5-4 Wis. Lutheran wins the shutout!
A couple of thoughts on the regional rankings...
First, the poll should perhaps have had another option, which would be a scenario where all 3 teams cited -- OWU, SLU and Tufts -- make the tournament. Given how the rankings are playing out it's hard to see who might overtake them, so the question may be whether the cmte goes 4-5 deep in those regions with a factor being the right teams getting AQs and not eating up spots, which so far would appear to be the case.
In Great Lakes, I think Ohio Northern and Oberlin would find being behind OWU hard to accept. It makes sense by the criteria I suppose and now ONU doesn't have a way to pick up more ranked wins and Oberlin can't get a ranked win over Wabash tonight. A couple of us wondered if Rose Hulman or Wabash might supplant Hanover, and instead what happened is that Hanover stayed and Rose Hulman supplanted John Carroll. That means DePauw and OWU keep their Hanover wins and DPU I believe get the bonus of adding a Rose Hulman win while adding a loss today. It is inconceivable to me that ONU could be left out if they don't win their AQ, and in some ways Oberlin would seem deserving overall than DPU or OWU, despite losing to both. Oberlin was unlucky not to walk away with a draw with Kenyon. They also don't get the credit for a win over Wabash which will be two if they win tonight because I think most would agree that Wabash is very much on par with both Hanover and Rose Hulman. Oberlin also isn't getting credited with very good wins over Geneva and Grove City.
In general it's interesting how some teams have been losing and yet haven't slipped at all or much at all in the rankings. Rochester drops games to NYU and Brandeis and still is solidly #3 in the East. Same deal with SLU. And there's no real reason to see how teams below them will jump them in the next week given a lack of ranked opponents and no head-to-heads. Same with DPU and OWU. DPU has losses to Wabash and Kenyon in the last week and amazingly still sits at #1. CMU adds a win and loss and jumps from #7 to #2 (including jumping over Kenyon). Their game with CWRU may have no impact at all.
The one team in the spotlight that may be in real trouble? Montclair State. MSU if they lose to Rowan will have a RVR of 1-5, as they will lose the Whitworth win and would add another loss. 7 blemishes and a 1-5 RVR might be too much to overcome.
Meanwhile, Tufts will go from 5-0 to 5-3 BUT other than possibly Middlebury jumping the Jumbos it's hard to see anyone else doing so unless RIC gets an AQ (and another ranked win). Otherwise I think RIC will be 1-4 on RVR. Even Midd can only get another ranked win by beating Hamilton and then also beating Amherst or Bowdoin. So Tufts' biggest danger might be Amherst not getting the AQ.
Correction: Oberlin beat DPU, giving them their one ranked win.
So, if I'm reading all this correctly, the aforementioned bubble teams, other than MSU, want Rowan, Amherst Messiah, Kenyon, F&M or Haverford and maybe Etown to win their AQs.
And UMass-Boston as well.
Loras in a back and forth game with Simpson, currently up 3-2 with 19' left.
Loras goes up 2-0. Simpson knots it at 2 in the middle of the 2nd half then Loras puts them away to win 5-2. Loras can put numbers on the board quickly, that's for sure. Should be a good IIAC title game against Luther, who beat Dubuque 4-0.
Year after Year we have some of the SAME issues with the Regional Rankings and their shock value to us in the know. A couple opinions:
Rochester----Chris Apple and his boys have somehow done it again. They are 8-4-3. They are 1-4-2 in their last 7 games against their best competition on their schedule. They go 0-2-0 at NYU and at Brandeis on the weekend and STAY ranked #3. Unbelievable...I mean to be fair the East is a complete mess. SLU goes 2-3-0 in their last 5 games and are still sitting at #4. The obvious question is who are the teams that can pass them in the rankings. The answer is no one really. BUT, that does not mean we just hand SLU and Rochester Pool C berths because they are Top 4 in their region. If Rochester cannot beat Emory this weekend and they still get a Pool C then this whole process is a joke. Maybe a team like Vassar with a weaker SOS but who defeated UR 3-0 could pass them in the rankings? Seems fair to me. With Durocher heading the East committee it seems SLU is pretty safe by not making their conference tournament and having 2 weeks off to get rewarded a Pool C. Personally, maybe the loser of the Cortland / Oneonta game gets the only Pool C in the region. Now I know the region is better than that but maybe other regions will benefit. It will be interesting to see play out.
Congrats to Skidmore for hanging tough with Hobart and getting to the LL Final where as I predicted in October will win the AQ over Vassar. Vassar would be eliminated with a loss. A draw might get them a Pool C and overtake SLU and frankly Hobart is now squarely on the bubble by not losing and grabbing a draw. Wrong side of the bubble but still on it. I really like Skidmore in this game at Vassar.
Bowdoin-------You have a 9-4-3 record. Play in an excellent league. Have only 1 loss since the middle of September and that was in OT and just went 2-0-0 against the 5th ranked team in New England Tufts in the past week. They are ranked 10th...Screwjob if I have ever seen one. Bowdoin will have to get a 3 peat in the Nescac Championship and the AQ to get into the NCAA's. Unless they beat Amherst and maybe draw with Midd and lose in PK's. They should be ranked #7 behind Midd only because of the Head to Head loss. Even Midd at 10-3-3 will lose a ranked win because Conn dropped off so that is only 1 ranked win all season...They really MIGHT have to win the AQ as well as a Hamilton win does nothing for them...Alot of pressure on Hamilton, Midd and Bowdoin this weekend to win the Nescac AQ. Tufts and their 4 ranked wins as the Conn win will disappear should have enough for a Pool C but if I were them I would be rooting for Midd to lose and for Bowdoin to lose as those 2 teams could jump them in the Final rankings.
I could go on and on about a few more teams in other regions where I feel are over / under ranked but let's wait and see it play out.
Pool C odds and ends....
Locks/Very Likely -- RUN, Brandeis, Cortland/Oneonta loser, F&M/Haverford loser or both, Etown/Scranton loser, Lynchburg/W&L loser
Very likely if lose conference semi/final -- Amherst, UMass-Boston, Rowan, Carthage, Kenyon, Trinity, Messiah, St Thomas, Babson?
Could these teams be left out if they lose conference final? -- Christopher Newport (no ranked wins), Calvin (low SOS and 1 ranked win), Ohio Northern (SOS and 1 ranked with 1 ranked tie), Macalester (only 1 ranked tie), RIC (would be 1-4 RVR if lose), Loras (will be 0-4 RVR), Colorado (only 1 ranked tie and no ranked wins)
What about? -- St Norbert (ranked and 2-0 RVR), Chapman (#2 in West and 1-0 RVR)
Wheaton (MA) only at #12 in region could be 4-1 RVR if beats Babson with good SOS. Wheaton perhaps was under-ranked?
Rest of hopefuls with likely strong consideration -- Rochester, Carnegie Mellon, Emory, Wash U, Tufts, Middlebury, Bowdoin, SLU, Vassar, Montclair, Hopkins, Benedictine (only 1 ranked win and lower SOS), DePauw, OWU, Oberlin, Texas-Dallas (0-2-1)
Might have missed one or two. Did not include ranked teams that seem too far down for very strong consideration and no path to improve standing.
And here come the Wheaton Thunder....2-0 at North Park late 1st half.
Wheaton Thunder rumble to a 3-1 win over North Park. Head now to the CCIW Conf final versus Carthage (who beat Wheaton earlier this season 4-2).
Heading into the weekend...
MAF Power Rankings
1. Chicago (16-0-1)
2. Messiah (16-0-3)
3. Rowan (16-1-1)
4. Amherst (14-1-1)
5. Trinity Tx (18-1-0)
6. Ohio Northern (17-1-3)
7. Kenyon (16-2-0)
8. Calvin (17-2-0)
9. Cortland St. (16-2-0)
10. Mass-Boston (16-1-2)
11. Newark (18-3-0)
12. F&M (12-2-3)
13. Springfield (16-1-1)
14. Lynchburg (14-1-4)
15. PSU Behrend (16-1-3)
16. Newport (16-2-1)
17. Colorado College (15-2-1)
18. St. Thomas (15-1-3)
19. Carthage (17-3-0)
20. Haverford (11-3-3)
21. Loras (13-4-0)
22. W&L (14-3-1)
23. St. Joe's (15-1-4)
24. Etown (13-2-2)
25. Whitworth (12-3-2)
RV: Macalester (13-3-3), Oberlin (15-3-1), Oneonta St (14-5-1), Whitewater (13-4-3), Brandeis (10-4-3), Vassar (13-3-2), Scranton (13-3-1), Capital (14-4-2), Middlebury (10-3-3), Johns Hopkins (12-3-2), Geneva (15-3-1), Lebanon Valley (14-3-0), Dominican (12-2-4), St. Lawrence (11-4-0)
Not a lot of movement in the top 25 but some reshuffling in the RV section.
Pool Cs
Rowan
Rutgers-Newark
Maryville (17-2) sweats out a 2OT win over Methodist to stay alive. NC Wesleyan in the final.
Centre moves on past Oglethorpe..
In a year in which numerous traditional and recent heavyweights (highlighted by Ohio Wesleyan, St. Lawrence, Tufts) have been picking up more than the usual number of blemishes, no one has been talking about Stevens whose 5 losses is their most in 15 years (2001). And they just crashed out of the Empire 8 tournament with a semifinal elimination in a PK shootout versus St. John Fisher. And unlike the aforementioned teams which stand a decent shot of getting at-large berths, Stevens season is certainly over as they have not been ranked regionally owing to those 5 losses and no wins versus ranked teams (a 0-3-1 RvR). First time not winning the Empire 8 since they joined for the 2007 and first time missing the NCAA tournament in 14 years (2002) as they have won their conference and the AQ every year from 2003 through last year, initially in the Skyline.
Question for FW, RH, etc...
Will the final RvR used for selections rely on who was ranked in Week 3 or do they go by their last and final Week 4 rankings?
As examples, Wentworth and JCU aren't ranked in Week 3. If either or both win their conference finals seems possible one or both could get ranked in the final ranking, which of course could impact opponents of those teams under Pool C consideration IF the cmtes go by the final regional rankings.
I see the article about how field is determined suggests the Week 3 rankings are the basis for the final RvR tallies. Is that correct or am I reading wrong? I'm having a brain freeze about why they wouldn't base RvR on the final, final rankings.
Here's the exact language, which I interpret as meaning RvR gets determined based on Week 4 instead of Week 3 rankings...
Results versus ranked Division III teams as established by the rankings at the time of selection. Conference postseason
contests are included;
Quote from: Flying Weasel on November 04, 2016, 10:53:02 PM
In a year in which numerous traditional and recent heavyweights (highlighted by Ohio Wesleyan, St. Lawrence, Tufts) have been picking up more than the usual number of blemishes, no one has been talking about Stevens whose 5 losses is their most in 15 years (2001). And they just crashed out of the Empire 8 tournament with a semifinal elimination in a PK shootout versus St. John Fisher. And unlike the aforementioned teams which stand a decent shot of getting at-large berths, Stevens season is certainly over as they have not been ranked regionally owing to those 5 losses and no wins versus ranked teams (a 0-3-1 RvR). First time not winning the Empire 8 since they joined for the 2007 and first time missing the NCAA tournament in 14 years (2002) as they have won their conference and the AQ every year from 2003 through last year, initially in the Skyline.
I never saw Stevens this season but this a shock for sure. St.John Fischer is known to be a Football school and also a little surprised Ithaca lost to Houghton. Stevens has never really been the same since Tim O'Donohue left the program to go to UCONN as an assistant and now is Navy Men's Soccer Coach
Cortland takes down Oneonta 1-0
Quote from: Golden_Fan on November 05, 2016, 03:24:39 PM
Cortland takes down Oneonta 1-0
oneonta has had one of their worst seasons in the last 5-6 years!
Loras currently down 0-3 at half to a very talented Luther side.
Loras will be grabbing a Pool C.
Loras loses a close one 4-3. They made it very interesting at the end. Had 2off the underside if the bar and an absolute sitter.
Pool C pre-analysis analysis....
Going to be a lot of hair-splitting. Strange year. Even when teams have been deemed locks (and likely still are) we see some still make things more interesting (Babson, Brandeis, probably Oneonta).
We're waiting on Amherst and Trinity to see if they get their AQs, but there could be a wrinkle thrown in there. Beyond that, I'm seeing Rowan, RUN, Brandeis, Babson, F&M/Haverford loser (although Haverford might sweat a little), the W&L/Lynchburg loser (although Lynchburg may sweat a little), Rochester is now likely with a 4-3-1 RvR and a jump over Oneonta likely, and I think E'town gets in this year.
The huge questions are what will happen with the New England and Great Lakes logjams. I don't how in the world they can decide between Tufts, Midd and Bowdoin (which means maybe all 3 will get in). For me, Wheaton (MA) is a real darkhorse with a loss today as they would be at 11-7-2 but with a good SOS and RvR of 4-1. RIC looks to be in trouble. Similarly, not sure how ONU, CMU, DPU, OWU and Oberlin are going to play out although the things look tough for an Oberlin team that out that group probably had the best season after ONU.
Elsewhere, Emory and Wash U are shaky on RvR. Oneonta drops to 3-5 on RvR (and to 2-3 if New Paltz and Fredonia are removed). Loras has no ranked wins unless Luther comes back in but that cuts both ways and would make Loras 1-5 on RvR instead of 0-4. Will there be any hidden reputation boosts on the last couple of spots? SLU is hard to evaluate (but on what basis could Loras for example be picked over SLU?), and I wouldn't be shocked if Hobart actually gets some strong consideration. Macalester has no ranked wins. Chapman has just 1 ranked win unless Redlands comes back in which would get Chapman to 2-2. Texas-Dallas doesn't have a ranked win. And Colorado doesn't have a ranked win, so they will certainly leave it all out there today with Trinity. Hopkins and Kean may even get a look.
Bottom line. More New England and Great Lakes teams are going to get in than most of us are expecting.
NCAC NE's Pool C Predictions/Selections -- Rowan, Rutgers-Newark, Haverford/F&M, W&L/Lynchburg, Babson, Brandeis, Rochester, SLU, Oneonta, Ohio Northern, Carnegie Mellon, DePauw, OWU, Middlebury, Bowdoin, Tufts, Elizabethtown
2 spots left (choose 2) -- RIC, Wheaton (MA), Hobart, Emory, Johns Hopkins, Oberlin, Wash U, Loras, Macalester, Chapman, Colorado Coll
Probably won't play out this way, but I would probably pick Oberlin and Wheaton (MA) (if loses today) OR Chapman. Pressure for regional diversity favors Wash U and a team from the North or West.
I really think Middlebury and Ohio Northern are in trouble. Ohio Northern's SOS is so weak in RvR not good especially if John Carrol is ranked like you project. I think RIC is in trouble as well but Wash U I think is a lock. Bowdoin is done after their loss to Amherst which is unfortunate because they had a 1-0 lead with 10 minutes left and a win would have been enough IMO. Bowdoin self-destructed in the last 10 minutes.
Quote from: Mr.Right on November 06, 2016, 01:45:57 PM
I really think Middlebury and Ohio Northern are in trouble. Ohio Northern's SOS is so weak in RvR not good especially if John Carrol is ranked like you project. I think RIC is in trouble as well but Wash U I think is a lock.
I thought that too until I tried to pick 19 teams. It's a VERY weak year. And Wash U only has like 1 ranked win. ONU's SOS should go to .530+ and I think will be 1-0-3 on RvR if JCU moves in. 17-1-4 stands out like a sore thumb among a ton of 7-9 blemish teams.
Quote from: NCAC New England on November 06, 2016, 01:48:57 PM
Quote from: Mr.Right on November 06, 2016, 01:45:57 PM
I really think Middlebury and Ohio Northern are in trouble. Ohio Northern's SOS is so weak in RvR not good especially if John Carrol is ranked like you project. I think RIC is in trouble as well but Wash U I think is a lock.
I thought that too until I tried to pick 19 teams. It's a VERY weak year. And Wash U only has like 1 ranked win. ONU's SOS should go to .530+ and I think will be 1-0-3 on RvR if JCU moves in. 17-1-4 stands out like a sore thumb among a ton of 7-9 blemish teams.
I agree that the eye test tells me ONU is a very good team and deserves to be in but I am not sure there SOS moves all the way up to .530. They could be the ETOWN if last year.
After looking at Wash U's schedule you may be correct. They did not beat to many top UAA schools and out of conference schools that they played. However, that draw last night with Chicago might help and now the 4-0 win over Luther might also look very good right now but after looking at their schedule you are correct they are on the BUBBLE
Quote from: Mr.Right on November 06, 2016, 01:56:40 PM
After looking at Wash U's schedule you may be correct. They did not beat to many top UAA schools and out of conference schools that they played. However, that draw last night with Chicago might help and now the 4-0 win over Luther might also look very good right now but after looking at their schedule you are correct they are on the BUBBLE
Haha. I was just gonna say I think you're correct. Wash U is right now 1-4-2 on RvR. IF Dominican stays ranked and Luther comes back in the the best scenario is 2-4-2, but mostly like Dominican goes out and Luther comes in and so stays at 1-4-2...BUT, there are literally no other teams really to pick in the Central, North and West and I can't see all of those regions just getting shut out.
I will say this...I'll be shocked in Wash U and Emory BOTH get in. Emory has a great SOS, 10-5-1 record and a RvR of 1-3-1....very similar to Wash U....and sort of like trying to pick between Tufts, Midd and Bowdoin (where I'm picking all 3 of those NESCACs to get in unless they shade RIC over one of them but I don't know how).
Trinity(TX) and Colorado College all tied up at 0-0 at Halftime. Bubble teams should be rooting for Trinity here because I do not think Colorado College has the resume to get a Pool C.
Bubble teams in unison thanking Haverford, Kenyon, UMass-Boston, Amherst, Trinity...There was a point yesterday when Haverford and Kenyon were both losing 1-0. Trinity comes back from a deficit late to break Colorado College's heart in double OT.
Messiah and Christopher Newport winning didn't hurt either although CNU likely would have been sweating as well.
Congrats to Springfield and Maryville for making the tournament as the highest profile non-rankable teams with sterling seasons rewarded with NCAA AQs. Also a nod to Geneva, St. Norbert, St Josephs (ME), Penn State-Behrend and Texas-Dallas. I think St. Thomas was in regardless but congrats to the them for achieving the MIAC double and first NCAA appearance since 1995.
The much anticipated Wheaton (Ill) season ended last night in a CCIW finals loss to a formidable Carthage squad. Certainly not the season any of us could have anticipated for the Thunder.
Quote from: NCAC New England on November 06, 2016, 06:48:23 PM
Congrats to Springfield and Maryville for making the tournament as the highest profile non-rankable teams with sterling seasons rewarded with NCAA AQs. Also a nod to Geneva, St. Norbert, St Josephs (ME), Penn State-Behrend and Texas-Dallas. I think St. Thomas was in regardless but congrats to the them for achieving the MIAC double and first NCAA appearance since 1995.
The much anticipated Wheaton (Ill) season ended last night in a CCIW finals loss to a formidable Carthage squad. Certainly not the season any of us could have anticipated for the Thunder.
Wheaton lost one of its greatest senior classes in school history with 3 of them playing professionally after college. The fact they took a step back was inevitable, although the early season losses and ties were a bit shocking considering they've rolled those same teams in the past. Could be a couple years before they get back on the national stage.
MAF Pool C Projections
In no order...
1. Rowan
2. Newark
3. Babson
4. Brandeis
5. Tufts
6. Middlebury
7. Oneonta St
8. Rochester
9. St. Lawrence
10. F&M
11. Etown
12. W&L
13. DePauw
14. CMU
15. OWU
16. ONU
17. Chapman
18. RIC
19. Wash U
------------------------
Loras
Macalester
Colorado College
Oberlin
Dubuque
Emory
Kean
Post-analysis analysis...
I like the Wheaton (MA) and Williams picks. I was on to Wheaton (MA) and I started thinking about Williams last night. Sometimes you're better off not playing. That said, I don't think we'll be surprised if neither get in. Hard to see Wheaton jumping from #12 far enough up. And on what basis does Williams move up when they didn't play? If the cmte realizes they got a ranking wrong one week do they then correct that the next, or do they tend to stick with their decisions? Also, does Clark drop out and who does that impact besides Wheaton losing a win? At any rate, there MAY be two spots open if these two don't get in.
Never realized until this year how important those bottom rankings are. In Great Lakes I literally think there should be a tie for that last spot between RHIT, JCU and Wabash. Wabash has two ranked wins. And it won't happen but imagine if a good Geneva team (a NCAA team) got ranked, which would help out Oberlin. And if 3 ranked wins trumps 2 why was CMU ranked above OWU to begin with?
Also a bit confused about whether the cmtes consider the criteria equally or not. RH has heavily weighted RvR. And we've talked about a SOS threshold. But what about when a team has a massive advantage on winning pct? Does 3 ranked winds really trump 2 wins when some other variable is more heavily in another team's favor? And does RHIT's ranked win over Hanover count more than JCU's two draws with ONU?
And does the national cmte jump around on criteria....like RvR is huge or winning pct is huge UNLESS there is regional imbalance? How would one pick, without consideration of regional overload (i.e. too man picks from a region) between, let's say, Loras and Oberlin? If we switched the stat lines between Loras and Oberlin who do we think would get in? And what about Chapman? In a blind test, does one really pick Chapman over Oberlin?
In very tight cases do the cmtes ever consider "good losses"? Oberlin took Kenyon to double OT TWICE, proving they can compete with one of the better teams in the country. And then there is the factor that some teams don't benefit from making their tournaments because of arbitrary reasons. Midd drew unranked Hamilton in the semis and so couldn't add a ranked win even if Midd won while competitors Tufts and Williams were on the sidelines. Same with Oberlin getting Wabash in the semis. If Wabash was ranked that's two more ranked wins.
Also, a SOS of .560ish can't solid or good enough in one instance and then low or well below average in other cases.
One has to wonder if the national cmte ever reaches a point where they ask, "look, who just on a gut level seems more deserving." It's also one thing not to disqualify teams on the basis of not making their tourney (OWU, SLU) or early exits (amazingly Tufts for third year in a row departs in NESCAC quarters), but on the other hand should teams get some at least minor edge or boost from making their tournaments and advancing under tournament-type pressure?
Shooters Pool C Picks
I am looking at this as if I were the selection committee. I am going in order and not focused on regional inbalance. I am also using Ryan's classification of teams that he designed nicely for us. +K Ryan! Obviously we don't know the secret rankings and some teams will surely switch around. Based off what we have from the last rankings and the conference tournaments I'll maike my picks with all the above in mind...so here we go!!
1. Rowan
2. Newark
3. F&M
4. W&L
5. Babson
6. Oneonta St
7. Rochester
8. Brandeis
9. DePauw
10. Tufts
11. Middlebury
12. OWU (think they will jump CMU in secret rankings)
13. Chapman
14. St. Lawrence (hard to judge when they get slotted)
15. Etown
16. CMU
17. Wash U
18. Loras
19. ONU (Could be the Etown of 2015--not surprised if they get snubbed)
-------------------------------------------------
RIC
Oberlin
Macalester
Colorado College
Emory
Shooter, how did you get a copy of the cmte's final selections, lol?
Looks like you might have nailed it. If accurate, SLU, Loras and Wash U should cry tears of joy. If Loras, Wash U and Chapman get in I think it's at least partly for regional balance nationally.
Anybody think that it matters that one of the selection show sites is Wash U? I doubt it, but could be awkward if doesn't go the Bears' way.
NCAC NE Top 15 (NCAA Tourney Edition)
1) Chicago
2) Messiah
3) Amherst
4) Kenyon
5) Trinity (TX)
6) Rowan
7) Carthage
8) Cortland St
9) Calvin
10) Rutgers-Newark
11) UMass-Boston
12) Haverford
13) Ohio Northern
14) Springfield
15) Christopher Newport/Montclair St (TIE)
NCAC NE Pool C
1) Rowan
2) Rutgers-Newark
3) F&M
4) W&L
5) Brandeis
6) Babson
7) Rochester
8) Oneonta St
9) Ohio Northern
10) Tufts
11) Carnegie Mellon
12) Middlebury
13) Elizabethtown
14) DePauw
15) OWU
16) Wheaton (MA)
17) Oberlin
18) Wash U
19) Chapman or Loras
---------------------------------------------
SLU
RIC
Bowdoin
Williams
Emory
Macalester
Colorado Coll
Curious as to the rationale behind posters putting Loras ahead of Macalester in the Pool C running?
Loras was one position higher than MAC in the Nov. 2 regional rankings. Their overall record and RvR will be below that of MAC's going into the selection meeting. Loras will only have a slightly better SOS. After the conference tournaments played out - MAC lost a close one to the #1 team in the region in the MIAC final, while Loras lost to an unranked Luther side. - It is possible that MAC might actually jump Loras in the last rankings, to be published today.
Either way, I think both teams could very well end of on the wrong side of the bubble this year.
Quote from: gustiefan04 on November 07, 2016, 11:28:58 AM
Curious as to the rationale behind posters putting Loras ahead of Macalester in the Pool C running?
Loras was one position higher than MAC in the Nov. 2 regional rankings. Their overall record and RvR will be below that of MAC's going into the selection meeting. Loras will only have a slightly better SOS. After the conference tournaments played out - MAC lost a close one to the #1 team in the region in the MIAC final, while Loras lost to an unranked Luther side. - It is possible that MAC might actually jump Loras in the last rankings, to be published today.
Either way, I think both teams could very well end of on the wrong side of the bubble this year.
Loras to an unranked team will help in the RvR by NOT picking up another loss there, but will hurt the SOS slightly as to where Macalester will pick up another RvR loss which will not help but will give a slight boost to the SOS. It's a toss up and I think both will stay where they are from last week's rankings.
Quote from: NCAC New England on November 07, 2016, 10:56:21 AM
Shooter, how did you get a copy of the cmte's final selections, lol?
Looks like you might have nailed it. If accurate, SLU, Loras and Wash U should cry tears of joy. If Loras, Wash U and Chapman get in I think it's at least partly for regional balance nationally.
Anybody think that it matters that one of the selection show sites is Wash U? I doubt it, but could be awkward if doesn't go the Bears' way.
LOL I have my ways ;) Will be interested to see how close it gets. There are always surprises so one surprise I could see happening is a team like Hobart sneaking in due to a high SOS and decent RvR compared to teams like Loras or Macalester who have 0 wins vs ranked and a high SOS and similar winning % Emory is another that could burst some bubbles.
Quote from: gustiefan04 on November 07, 2016, 11:28:58 AM
Curious as to the rationale behind posters putting Loras ahead of Macalester in the Pool C running?
Loras was one position higher than MAC in the Nov. 2 regional rankings. Their overall record and RvR will be below that of MAC's going into the selection meeting. Loras will only have a slightly better SOS. After the conference tournaments played out - MAC lost a close one to the #1 team in the region in the MIAC final, while Loras lost to an unranked Luther side. - It is possible that MAC might actually jump Loras in the last rankings, to be published today.
Either way, I think both teams could very well end of on the wrong side of the bubble this year.
Great question. Very, very tight between those two. Loras WILL pick up another ranked loss but also a needed win as Luther almost certainly will be ranked again. So then one could argue that Loras has the one vital ranked win that Mac doesn't, which again raises a question about whether any credit (and how so) is given for ranked draws. Feels like part of what is going on is that none of us can really imagine Loras not in the tournament and one wonders if name recognition plays even a tiny role in these way too close to call cases.
Quote from: blue_jays on November 06, 2016, 06:58:14 PM
Quote from: NCAC New England on November 06, 2016, 06:48:23 PM
Congrats to Springfield and Maryville for making the tournament as the highest profile non-rankable teams with sterling seasons rewarded with NCAA AQs. Also a nod to Geneva, St. Norbert, St Josephs (ME), Penn State-Behrend and Texas-Dallas. I think St. Thomas was in regardless but congrats to the them for achieving the MIAC double and first NCAA appearance since 1995.
The much anticipated Wheaton (Ill) season ended last night in a CCIW finals loss to a formidable Carthage squad. Certainly not the season any of us could have anticipated for the Thunder.
Wheaton lost one of its greatest senior classes in school history with 3 of them playing professionally after college. The fact they took a step back was inevitable, although the early season losses and ties were a bit shocking considering they've rolled those same teams in the past. Could be a couple years before they get back on the national stage.
As many here will recall, following the 2014 season a very talented sophomore at Messiah, Danny Brandt (son of former coach David Brandt), transferred at first for just a few days to Louisville, then (I believe) for spring 2015 to a community college, then for fall 2015 to Florida Atlantic University (a D2 school) where he had to sit out the season, then finally to Wheaton where he played only 4 games this fall (with 2 starts) and scored just one goal--the only goal in the regular season loss to North Park.
Does anyone know his status for 2017 and perhaps even 2018? I assume he had a major injury of some sort this fall, since he must have been one of the best players on the Thunder squad this year. Is this assumption correct? I'd love to see him return to form before he graduates. Ironically, had he stayed put at Messiah, he'd be part of a team with a solid chance for another Final Four, and no doubt he'd be an important part of that story. Perhaps he will help Wheaton get back to the tournament next fall...
Quote from: Falconer on November 07, 2016, 11:44:44 AM
Quote from: blue_jays on November 06, 2016, 06:58:14 PM
Quote from: NCAC New England on November 06, 2016, 06:48:23 PM
Congrats to Springfield and Maryville for making the tournament as the highest profile non-rankable teams with sterling seasons rewarded with NCAA AQs. Also a nod to Geneva, St. Norbert, St Josephs (ME), Penn State-Behrend and Texas-Dallas. I think St. Thomas was in regardless but congrats to the them for achieving the MIAC double and first NCAA appearance since 1995.
The much anticipated Wheaton (Ill) season ended last night in a CCIW finals loss to a formidable Carthage squad. Certainly not the season any of us could have anticipated for the Thunder.
Wheaton lost one of its greatest senior classes in school history with 3 of them playing professionally after college. The fact they took a step back was inevitable, although the early season losses and ties were a bit shocking considering they've rolled those same teams in the past. Could be a couple years before they get back on the national stage.
As many here will recall, following the 2014 season a very talented sophomore at Messiah, Danny Brandt (son of former coach David Brandt), transferred at first for just a few days to Louisville, then (I believe) for spring 2015 to a community college, then for fall 2015 to Florida Atlantic University (a D2 school) where he had to sit out the season, then finally to Wheaton where he played only 4 games this fall (with 2 starts) and scored just one goal--the only goal in the regular season loss to North Park.
Does anyone know his status for 2017 and perhaps even 2018? I assume he had a major injury of some sort this fall, since he must have been one of the best players on the Thunder squad this year. Is this assumption correct? I'd love to see him return to form before he graduates. Ironically, had he stayed put at Messiah, he'd be part of a team with a solid chance for another Final Four, and no doubt he'd be an important part of that story. Perhaps he will help Wheaton get back to the tournament next fall...
Falconer, do u know why there were so many changes in such a short period of time? It seems quite unusual....
Quote from: Falconer on November 07, 2016, 11:44:44 AM
Quote from: blue_jays on November 06, 2016, 06:58:14 PM
Quote from: NCAC New England on November 06, 2016, 06:48:23 PM
Congrats to Springfield and Maryville for making the tournament as the highest profile non-rankable teams with sterling seasons rewarded with NCAA AQs. Also a nod to Geneva, St. Norbert, St Josephs (ME), Penn State-Behrend and Texas-Dallas. I think St. Thomas was in regardless but congrats to the them for achieving the MIAC double and first NCAA appearance since 1995.
The much anticipated Wheaton (Ill) season ended last night in a CCIW finals loss to a formidable Carthage squad. Certainly not the season any of us could have anticipated for the Thunder.
Wheaton lost one of its greatest senior classes in school history with 3 of them playing professionally after college. The fact they took a step back was inevitable, although the early season losses and ties were a bit shocking considering they've rolled those same teams in the past. Could be a couple years before they get back on the national stage.
As many here will recall, following the 2014 season a very talented sophomore at Messiah, Danny Brandt (son of former coach David Brandt), transferred at first for just a few days to Louisville, then (I believe) for spring 2015 to a community college, then for fall 2015 to Florida Atlantic University (a D2 school) where he had to sit out the season, then finally to Wheaton where he played only 4 games this fall (with 2 starts) and scored just one goal--the only goal in the regular season loss to North Park.
Does anyone know his status for 2017 and perhaps even 2018? I assume he had a major injury of some sort this fall, since he must have been one of the best players on the Thunder squad this year. Is this assumption correct? I'd love to see him return to form before he graduates. Ironically, had he stayed put at Messiah, he'd be part of a team with a solid chance for another Final Four, and no doubt he'd be an important part of that story. Perhaps he will help Wheaton get back to the tournament next fall...
Florida Atlantic is a DI school. I believe he transferred to Palm Beach Atlantic, a DII.
I don't understand the logic of leaving Loras out and putting Dubuque in, makes no sense! Loras by default was the top team in the North left after AQ's and Pool B and Dubuque jumps them, complete CRAP!
Wow! Stunning.
And a ton of killer first and second round matchups.
Quote from: Shooter McGavin on November 07, 2016, 10:46:36 AM
Shooters Pool C Picks
I am looking at this as if I were the selection committee. I am going in order and not focused on regional inbalance. I am also using Ryan's classification of teams that he designed nicely for us. +K Ryan! Obviously we don't know the secret rankings and some teams will surely switch around. Based off what we have from the last rankings and the conference tournaments I'll maike my picks with all the above in mind...so here we go!!
1. Rowan
2. Newark
3. F&M
4. W&L
5. Babson
6. Oneonta St
7. Rochester
8. Brandeis
9. DePauw
10. Tufts
11. Middlebury
12. OWU (think they will jump CMU in secret rankings)
13. Chapman
14. St. Lawrence (hard to judge when they get slotted)
15. Etown
16. CMU
17. Wash U
18. Loras
19. ONU (Could be the Etown of 2015--not surprised if they get snubbed)
-------------------------------------------------
RIC
Oberlin
Macalester
Colorado College
Emory
Believe I missed 2? Kean and Dubuque? WOW!! I am shocked that Midd got left out. Loras and Macalester not so much but Midd...tough break!!
And no Middlebury??? Again? SLU over Midd? Kean over Midd? Wash U over Midd? Dubuque???
It's currently 2:25 a.m. in China and I wouldn't be awake if not for my flight being delayed and getting in very late. That being said, I was (somewhat) pleasantly surprised to see Brandeis make it: not because of their resume, but because they were - at various points in the season - 3-3-1 and 5-4-3, hardly NCAA-worthy let alone worthy of a Pool C selection. So a quick homer shout out to my Judges for pulling it together and salvaging what I (the eternal pessimist/pragmatist) thought was a season to be forgotten.
Annoyingly, I can't get the selection show stream to work! Guess I'll have to see the full bracket posted for myself, although I did see that Brandeis could very well have a second-round matchup at Babson. Would be an excellent chance for the Judges to avenge that 2OT defeat earlier in the year, although they'd have to get by a gritty UNE side first.
On another note, surprised to see that Midd. got snubbed again. Wow. That said, I remember we were talking of their SoS being less-than-great last year, and - anecdotally speaking - I didn't see any major changes in terms of out-of-conference tests being added to their schedule this year. Could be wrong.
Quote from: blooter442 on November 07, 2016, 01:28:38 PM
On another note, surprised to see that Midd. got snubbed again. Wow. That said, I remember we were talking of their SoS being less-than-great last year, and - anecdotally speaking - I didn't see any major changes in terms of out-of-conference tests being added to their schedule this year. Could be wrong.
Strength of schedule was actually higher than it was last year. I just think the Panthers fell prey to a couple of crushing results at the end of the year, OT losses to Bates and Hamilton, the latter in the NESCAC semis.
Quote from: Mid-Atlantic Fan on November 07, 2016, 09:24:22 AM
MAF Pool C Projections
In no order...
1. Rowan
2. Newark
3. Babson
4. Brandeis
5. Tufts
6. Middlebury
7. Oneonta St
8. Rochester
9. St. Lawrence
10. F&M
11. Etown
12. W&L
13. DePauw
14. CMU
15. OWU
16. ONU
17. Chapman
18. RIC
19. Wash U
------------------------
Loras
Macalester
Colorado College
Oberlin
Dubuque
Emory
Kean
I also missed 2 but had Macalester and Loras on the outside looking in...also had Kean and Dubuque out as well. Surprised Middlebury missed out but the 19th slot was a toss up for me between RIC/Loras/Colorado/Macalester/Oberlin. Did not see Kean or Dubuque getting that last slot.
Might as well pencil in Chicago at Final Four. A weak looking quadrant with next best team Carthage who Maroons already dispatched with relative ease. Other regions look loaded except Cortland section looks pretty soft.
And I was right about the needed 4th option on the poll question...all three got in (Tufts, OWU, SLU).
How about first round games like Calvin vs ONU, Montclair vs CNU...
And the committee again has Messiah going thru Montclair St. or Christopher Newport.
The next pod down is pretty strong: Carnegie Mellon-Ohio Wesleyan-Calvin-Ohio Northern
Besides the 1st round game (2nd time in four years they got Centenary), Messiah got no favors for being one of only two remaining undefeated teams. Looking at other places where Messiah could have been slotted in, Cortland State and F&M got what looks like easier pathes to the Elite 8.
Since noone actually posted it . . .
POOL C AT-LARGE BERTHS
Dubuque
Babson
Brandeis
Carnegie Mellon
Chapman
DePauw
Elizabethtown
Franklin and Marshall
Kean
Ohio Northern
Ohio Wesleyan
Oneonta State
Rochester
Rowan
Rutgers-Newark
St. Lawrence
Tufts
Washington and Lee
Washington U.
POOL B AT-LARGE BERTH:
UW-Whitewater
Quote from: NCAC New England on November 07, 2016, 01:39:46 PM
Might as well pencil in Chicago at Final Four. A weak looking quadrant with next best team Carthage who Maroons already dispatched with relative ease. Other regions look loaded except Cortland section looks pretty soft.
Yeah, at first glance, it's not a very balanced, evenly distributed bracket.
Question for all the D3 historic junkies out there:
On paper, when was the last time we saw a team end the season with such an impressive on-paper resume as Chicago had this year? (Undefeated; .971 win%; .642 SOS; 8-0-1 RVR)?
Regional rankings are up....
RH and I were both wrong....in GL Kenyon, DPU, Hanover, CMU, OWU, ONU, Oberlin, RHIT.
Wheaton was next in line in NE at #6, with Williams at #7 and Midd at #8.
Kean got in from #7 spot in SA.
Redlands did come in at #2 in West helping out Chapman at #3.
In North, Dubuque was #5 and Loras at #6.
7 out of 8 South Atlantic teams in tourney with only #8 Emory left out.
6 of 8 in Great Lakes and looks like ONU was one of last, if not he last, teams in.
Springfield finally ranked in New England at #11.
Looks like maybe Wheaton (MA) was first team out.
Quote from: NEsoccerfan on November 07, 2016, 02:08:47 PM
Question for all the D3 historic junkies out there:
On paper, when was the last time we saw a team end the season with such an impressive on-paper resume as Chicago had this year? (Undefeated; .971 win%; .642 SOS; 8-0-1 RVR)?
SLU in 2011, 16-0-0 regular season, 4 top 25 wins.
Quote from: blooter442 on November 07, 2016, 01:28:38 PM
On another note, surprised to see that Midd. got snubbed again. Wow. That said, I remember we were talking of their SoS being less-than-great last year, and - anecdotally speaking - I didn't see any major changes in terms of out-of-conference tests being added to their schedule this year. Could be wrong.
Yes. I think Middlebury will have to start playing a harder non-conference schedule. Congrats the seniors on the team for their careers.
Messiahs bracket is LOADED. and 4 NJAC teams making it is unreal! congrats to all teams who qualified. this is when the fun begins!
Midd's SOS was high enough. They just failed to get needed results against Bates, Colby, Hamilton, etc. They got reprieve after reprieve and did not take advantage. Interesting that the differences between Tufts and Midd over the past 4 years were probably pretty slight and yet one barely sneaks in 3 years in a row while Midd barely misses 3 years in a row. One senior group wins a national title and has tow more NCAA trips while the Midd seniors never get to taste NCAA play. Slight shades of difference, which is how I feel for Oberlin right now. One or two games just a bit different, one more team ranked that didn't get ranked, etc, etc. Hard to swallow.
WOW. Both Chicago men and women hosting. Can't believe that has happened very often
Quote from: SandyMac on November 07, 2016, 02:57:28 PM
Quote from: NEsoccerfan on November 07, 2016, 02:08:47 PM
Question for all the D3 historic junkies out there:
On paper, when was the last time we saw a team end the season with such an impressive on-paper resume as Chicago had this year? (Undefeated; .971 win%; .642 SOS; 8-0-1 RVR)?
SLU in 2011, 16-0-0 regular season, 4 top 25 wins.
Good times, good times.
Quote from: Flying Weasel on November 07, 2016, 02:05:59 PM
And the committee again has Messiah going thru Montclair St. or Christopher Newport.
The next pod down is pretty strong: Carnegie Mellon-Ohio Wesleyan-Calvin-Ohio Northern
Besides the 1st round game (2nd time in four years they got Centenary), Messiah got no favors for being one of only two remaining undefeated teams. Looking at other places where Messiah could have been slotted in, Cortland State and F&M got what looks like easier pathes to the Elite 8.
Since Lucas Terci of MSU (who has 28 goals) got a red card, his second of the season, in the NJAC semi-final game, he misses their first tournament game vs CNU. Correct? If so that's a huge loss, but he knows whom to blame for it.
Two big misses for me:
(1) Dubuque. They were down at 6th in the North last week and lost 4-0 in midweek. I forgot to take into account Luther coming back into the rankings, which gave Dubuque a 2-1 RvR. Then the head-to-head over Loras made the difference.
(2) New England region. I thought the 4-1 RvR and high SOS would get Wheaton (Mass.) in, which would allow Williams and Middlebury to get on the board. My guess is that Wheaton's seven losses and nine blemishes were just too many, and the committee didn't go for it. So while Williams and Middlebury could have matched up favorably with many teams that got in - they have similar profiles to OWU, Kean, Wash. U., etc. - they never even came up for discussion.
Throw in Kean, but that's less surprising.
I wonder if regional balance played any role. In 2015 the West got zero bids, and in 2013 the West and Central both missed out. Dubuque and Chapman were at the edge of the bubble.
Let's take a spin around the four quadrants.
First, let's compare potential Sweet 16 match-ups according to highest national rankings (which we know won't hold but which should give one window into the relative competitiveness of each quadrant).
Chicago -- Chicago vs DePauw; Carthage vs St Thomas
Rowan -- Rowan vs Haverford; Trinity vs Kenyon
Amherst -- Amherst vs Babson/Brandeis; Rutgers-Newark vs Oneonta St
Messiah -- Messiah vs Calvin; Cortland St vs Franklin & Marshall
Chicago certainly isn't immune to an upset but I think most will agree their road looks the most doable.
After that, most would favor the chances for Amherst and Messiah getting through. There are definitely teams that could knock them off, but I don't see any game where they wouldn't be clearly favored, especially with a home field advantage that is significant for both.
I would argue that the Rowan quadrant is the most wide open. I'm not sure who I would pick. Rowan may be a little skittish after late season losses and especially the 3-0 loss to Montclair (even though Rowan knows they still dominated the stats). Haverford is very battle tested and used to playing tough NJAC teams and no doubt feels like they have unfinished business from last year. Trinity is 20-1 and in the Elite 8 virtually every year. Enough said. I'd feel better about Kenyon's chances of getting to Trinity if they had their pod at home, but they don't and they will have to fight like crazy to get out of Lynchburg still alive against two teams that have lost a total of 3 games all year combined. At any rate, I don't think Rowan is the clear favorite in this quad the way we might have thought just 2-3 weeks ago.
Going deeper, let's take a closer look at the Messiah quad. The Falcons might face their toughest test of the quad versus the winner of the Montclair-CNU game. CNU is usually very talented but I'd be more worried about a very emotional and talented MSU team with a chip on its shoulder, something to prove, and a star player returning who surely is looking to either make amends or double down in some way to prove his own point (and I'm not even sure what that means but as the jingle goes "I just know it's true."
The Carnegie Mellon pod might be the most balanced and the best first weekend venue for any neutral to attend. All four will feel like they got stuck with too many really good, high reputation-type teams, but all four also will feel like they can advance. I would actually give CMU the least chance of moving on. If OWU gets by CMU they won't feel like they can't beat ONU or Calvin even if either of the latter might be slightly favored. Any of these four could advance out of weekend. If Messiah gets upset, the survivor of the CMU weekend will have a decent chance against Montclair or Newport else, but I don't think they can handle the Falcons especially if it's in Grantham.
In the lower part of the Messiah quad and a first round upset wouldn't be shocking as Morrisville and PS-Behrend will show up to win. If they do get by the underdogs I would like Scranton's chances against Cortland unless Cortland really does have a decided home field advantage. In the other pod, F&M should get by Geneva and may benefit from SLU and W&L wearing each other out in a tight game that easily could go the distance. SLU or W&L could get out of the weekend but the advantage has to go with F&M on home turf. After all that, I don't see Cortland, Scranton, W&L, SLU or even F&M troubling Messiah while any of those would have a fair shot against anyone else from the other side.
In the Chicago quad, DePauw could give the Maroons a decent game but DPU has a ton of work to do to get there and may not make it. Wash U tied Chicago but seem to up and down recently to match that effort twice. I don't know Luther, St. Norbert or St. Thomas well enough to know if they could present any serious challenge to Chicago but I doubt any of those teams strike fear in Maroon hearts. I DO think Carthage, having the benefit of the earlier game to study, could give Chicago a real challenge, but they'll have to get through three hard games just to get a chance. That's a part of the bracket that I could see really open up with someone like UW-W emerging in the Elite 8. On the other hand, UW-W will be a popular upset special in the 1st round.
In the Amherst group, Babson vs Brandeis could be an early round classic but while each is capable of pushing Amherst I don't see either knocking the Lord Jeffs out in the Sweet 16. On the other side, I could see RUN struggling with the E'town-Vassar winner in the 2nd round. Hard to bet against Oneonta St finding its groove, and that is the one team that would love to get another shot against Amherst. RUN also could really challenge Amherst but I just don't see them getting through the two games they'd have to win to get the opportunity. Hard, though, to see anyone but Amherst walking off their own field with a Final Four ticket.
Back to the Rowan group...Tufts vs Springfield is very compelling, and certainly Rowan vs Tufts would be one of the most watched 2nd round games. UMass-Boston vs Kean also is intriguing. On first glance I like UMass-Boston to advance but then again I'm not sure a NJAC team is the best way for the Beacons to start a run. UMass needs to stay focused and not get lost in a chippy affair. I say that not knowing how chippy Kean is but they still are a NJAC team that will not be intimidated by or impressed with the flair of UMass. They also may sense that can get under UMass' skin. I'd love to see UMass move on because Haverford vs UMass would be another must-see game. Trinity has to be the heavy favorite in its pod on its home field but Whitworth has recent tourney experience and isn't a crazy pick for an upset. That's a tough 1st game for a team as highly rated as Trinity. Same with the Texas-Dallas-Chapman game which should be a good one. In the other pod, Lynchburg is a great darkhorse pick to reach the Elite 8. Two games at home in a 3000 seat stadium brimming with home support and the momentum from an exhilarating ODAC tourney victory, and then being pumped in the Sweet 16 to face the winner of the Trinity pod. Lynchburg drew with Messiah and has only lost ONCE. John Carroll, however, isn't some deer-in-the-headlights outfit. They will come to play riding momentum. I'm sort of glad Kenyon is getting out of Gambier and I think they'll respond well to the Lynchburg environment. The problem is I'm not sure if anyone knows just how good this Maryville team may be. They have drubbed some very good teams and they have the inspiration that only years of knowing you won't get an at-large bid builds inside you when you feel disrespected and overlooked. I don't want Maryville to become "a story," but that might well happen. If Kenyon can get through the Scots then surely a game with Lynchburg will be a taut affair that goes to the wire. If it's Kenyon and JCU they'll wonder why they're playing each other down in cured country ham country.
My opinion:
This whole process has been dictated by geography and saving money..
I am New England biased but I say New England and Nescac really got the shaft. Whoever led the New England Committee did not put up much of an argument or did and was completely overruled and "soft". Either way you have teams with 2-3-4 ranked wins and SOS's of at or close to .600 not get in and teams out West and Central / Great Lakes / South Atlantic take New England bids. The most represented region with the most teams gets ONLY 3 POOL C's. I think 4 and even 5 would be more appropriate.
Nescac teams have won the last 2 NCAA Championships and been represented in almost every NCAA Final 4 since 2007. Yet Nescac gets 1 Pool C and the UAA gets 4 Pool C's and year after year they get NOWHERE. UAA teams have FAILED miserably on THE BIG STAGE. Personally, after watching the NJAC a lot this season I do not mind the 3 Pool C's. They deserve it. RUN, MSU and Rowan are damn good teams and while I have not seen Kean this year they did well enough in their conference to deserve to get in. No problems with the NJAC and 3 Pool C's. However, for Nescac, 1 out of Bowdoin / Williams / Midd should have gotten a Pool C. They each beat each other up and that hurt but the league deserves at least 2 Pool C's.
I saw it coming a week ago when BOTH SLU and Rochester limped to the end of their respective seasons and DID NOT DROP in their Rankings. The fix was IN. SLU and UR should not be dancing. Frankly, if this was not such a down year normally a resume like Oneonta's would be considered a bubble resume. I am quite confident had Vassar drew with Skidmore and lost in PK's they would be OUT. I am not a Vassar fan but they would have been left out in favor of a team in their own conference that barely beat them and did not even make their own conference tournament and also left out for a team they slammed in UR 3-0. Oh Well...
So Nescac has Amherst and Tufts. Amherst has a VERY EASY draw until the Elite 8 and THEY WILL NEED IT. Serpone knows this is his worst Amherst side in years with a leaky defense compared to their best teams and horrific GK'ing. BUT who is going to beat them? Babson? Babson looked down right awful against Wheaton(MA) in the Newmac Semi's and are absolutely anemic up front. They cannot beat good teams. They have 3 very solid midfielders and that is it. I wouldn't be surprised to see them lose in the 1st round. Brandeis has played VERY WELL at the end of the year and deserved their bid. However ironically this might be Brandeis weakest side since 2012 and this will be their best chance to beat Amherst. Amherst has weaknesses that can be exploited but can this Brandeis side exploit them. Not sure. RUN at Amherst would be a great Elite 8 match-up and I would favor RUN BUT they will not be playing on their coveted carpet. They would be playing on Amherst grass field. I think a Tufts/ Rowan matchup in the 2nd round would be fantastic but Springfield(A Poor man's Amherst) will make it tough for Tufts to score as they WHACK everything in sight and are downright UGLY to watch.
I will be rooting for UMASS Boston and they will be a tough out with their beast of a striker in Williamson. Ommadawn stated this and i fully agree that you need a stud or 2 in the NCAA's to put their teams on their back and get a goal when needed or a stop when needed. That is why I loved Skidmore this season. UMASS Boston has that and if they get by Kean I think they could beat Haverford. It would be a challenge but doable. Frankly, for a team ranked 2nd in New England they got screwed not only for not hosting but their pod is very difficult. They should of had a much easier 1st round / 2nd Round game then they got.
Cortland State who I saw once this season against Oneonta and was not impressed at all. Maybe it was a one off but Oneonta dominated then in the regular season game I saw. Cortland got the easiest 1st / 2nd Round games besides the 2 "bye" teams in Amherst and Chicago. SLU got off easy as well as I think F&M and W&L are overrated and Durocher stuck his team in a draw they could get out of if they play to their potential.
Quote from: NCAC New England on November 07, 2016, 01:24:42 PM
And no Middlebury??? Again? SLU over Midd? Kean over Midd? Wash U over Midd? Dubuque???
The NESCAC, and NE in general, had a year where there was a lot of parity (to put it nicely). Other regions - Great Lakes being one - were given more bids as a result.
Quote from: Flying Weasel on November 07, 2016, 02:05:59 PM
And the committee again has Messiah going thru Montclair St. or Christopher Newport.
The next pod down is pretty strong: Carnegie Mellon-Ohio Wesleyan-Calvin-Ohio Northern
Besides the 1st round game (2nd time in four years they got Centenary), Messiah got no favors for being one of only two remaining undefeated teams. Looking at other places where Messiah could have been slotted in, Cortland State and F&M got what looks like easier pathes to the Elite 8.
At least OWU won't have to suffer an upset in the first round...
Rowan group has 6 in D3 soccer top 15. Messiah has 5. Chicago and Amherst have two each (so one other than themselves).
Quote from: wingtips2 on November 08, 2016, 06:16:11 AM
Quote from: Flying Weasel on November 07, 2016, 02:05:59 PM
And the committee again has Messiah going thru Montclair St. or Christopher Newport.
The next pod down is pretty strong: Carnegie Mellon-Ohio Wesleyan-Calvin-Ohio Northern
Besides the 1st round game (2nd time in four years they got Centenary), Messiah got no favors for being one of only two remaining undefeated teams. Looking at other places where Messiah could have been slotted in, Cortland State and F&M got what looks like easier pathes to the Elite 8.
At least OWU won't have to suffer an upset in the first round...
nothing like a little ncaa tourney banter before we kick off
Mr. Right, not a fan of the Landmark Champs Scranton Royals?
Quote from: Mr.Right on November 07, 2016, 11:57:05 PM
My opinion:
This whole process has been dictated by geography and saving money..
I am New England biased but I say New England and Nescac really got the shaft. Whoever led the New England Committee did not put up much of an argument or did and was completely overruled and "soft". Either way you have teams with 2-3-4 ranked wins and SOS's of at or close to .600 not get in and teams out West and Central / Great Lakes / South Atlantic take New England bids. The most represented region with the most teams gets ONLY 3 POOL C's. I think 4 and even 5 would be more appropriate.
Nescac teams have won the last 2 NCAA Championships and been represented in almost every NCAA Final 4 since 2007. Yet Nescac gets 1 Pool C and the UAA gets 4 Pool C's and year after year they get NOWHERE. UAA teams have FAILED miserably on THE BIG STAGE. Personally, after watching the NJAC a lot this season I do not mind the 3 Pool C's. They deserve it. RUN, MSU and Rowan are damn good teams and while I have not seen Kean this year they did well enough in their conference to deserve to get in. No problems with the NJAC and 3 Pool C's. However, for Nescac, 1 out of Bowdoin / Williams / Midd should have gotten a Pool C. They each beat each other up and that hurt but the league deserves at least 2 Pool C's.
I saw it coming a week ago when BOTH SLU and Rochester limped to the end of their respective seasons and DID NOT DROP in their Rankings. The fix was IN. SLU and UR should not be dancing. Frankly, if this was not such a down year normally a resume like Oneonta's would be considered a bubble resume. I am quite confident had Vassar drew with Skidmore and lost in PK's they would be OUT. I am not a Vassar fan but they would have been left out in favor of a team in their own conference that barely beat them and did not even make their own conference tournament and also left out for a team they slammed in UR 3-0. Oh Well...
So Nescac has Amherst and Tufts. Amherst has a VERY EASY draw until the Elite 8 and THEY WILL NEED IT. Serpone knows this is his worst Amherst side in years with a leaky defense compared to their best teams and horrific GK'ing. BUT who is going to beat them? Babson? Babson looked down right awful against Wheaton(MA) in the Newmac Semi's and are absolutely anemic up front. They cannot beat good teams. They have 3 very solid midfielders and that is it. I wouldn't be surprised to see them lose in the 1st round. Brandeis has played VERY WELL at the end of the year and deserved their bid. However ironically this might be Brandeis weakest side since 2012 and this will be their best chance to beat Amherst. Amherst has weaknesses that can be exploited but can this Brandeis side exploit them. Not sure. RUN at Amherst would be a great Elite 8 match-up and I would favor RUN BUT they will not be playing on their coveted carpet. They would be playing on Amherst grass field. I think a Tufts/ Rowan matchup in the 2nd round would be fantastic but Springfield(A Poor man's Amherst) will make it tough for Tufts to score as they WHACK everything in sight and are downright UGLY to watch.
I will be rooting for UMASS Boston and they will be a tough out with their beast of a striker in Williamson. Ommadawn stated this and i fully agree that you need a stud or 2 in the NCAA's to put their teams on their back and get a goal when needed or a stop when needed. That is why I loved Skidmore this season. UMASS Boston has that and if they get by Kean I think they could beat Haverford. It would be a challenge but doable. Frankly, for a team ranked 2nd in New England they got screwed not only for not hosting but their pod is very difficult. They should of had a much easier 1st round / 2nd Round game then they got.
Cortland State who I saw once this season against Oneonta and was not impressed at all. Maybe it was a one off but Oneonta dominated then in the regular season game I saw. Cortland got the easiest 1st / 2nd Round games besides the 2 "bye" teams in Amherst and Chicago. SLU got off easy as well as I think F&M and W&L are overrated and Durocher stuck his team in a draw they could get out of if they play to their potential.
Right I have to agree with your analysis on this one. NESCAC should have received 3. It's GAME ON time....
The parity of the tournament this year is unbelievable. A down year as some mentioned because a resume like Oneonta, I think was the exmaple, would be a MAJOR bubble team in past years and most likely not have gotten in. The favorites are the favorites for a reason but I would not be surprised to see the Final 4 lack any of the "#1" seeds.
NESCAC absolutely deserved at least 3 and maybe 4, especially seeing the UAA also filled with a bunch of shaky records get 5, the NCAC 3, and the South Atlantic 7 out of their total of 8 ranked teams. The problem is that no individual team in the NESCAC other than Amherst clearly deserved to be in. Even Tufts would not have had a huge complaint if left out with a 9-5-2 record and backing in with two straight losses. Williams probably only needed a draw with Midd in their last game and a win likely would have sealed a bid. Midd gets in if they win just one more regular season game they should have won and then beats Hamilton on a neutral field. Bowdoin came on strong at the end but too late. Also think RH's theory has some merit. They may have suffered by Wheaton rising so high but having a profile that didn't get Wheaton off the board for the cmte to present any of the NESCAC trio left out. Wheaton has got to be the only team with 4 ranked wins denied a bid but unfortunately they weren't even on the bid radar until the final week or so of the season.
Quote from: Mr.Right on November 07, 2016, 11:57:05 PM
My opinion:
This whole process has been dictated by geography and saving money..
I am New England biased but I say New England and Nescac really got the shaft. Whoever led the New England Committee did not put up much of an argument or did and was completely overruled and "soft". Either way you have teams with 2-3-4 ranked wins and SOS's of at or close to .600 not get in and teams out West and Central / Great Lakes / South Atlantic take New England bids. The most represented region with the most teams gets ONLY 3 POOL C's. I think 4 and even 5 would be more appropriate.
Nescac teams have won the last 2 NCAA Championships and been represented in almost every NCAA Final 4 since 2007. Yet Nescac gets 1 Pool C and the UAA gets 4 Pool C's and year after year they get NOWHERE. UAA teams have FAILED miserably on THE BIG STAGE. Personally, after watching the NJAC a lot this season I do not mind the 3 Pool C's. They deserve it. RUN, MSU and Rowan are damn good teams and while I have not seen Kean this year they did well enough in their conference to deserve to get in. No problems with the NJAC and 3 Pool C's. However, for Nescac, 1 out of Bowdoin / Williams / Midd should have gotten a Pool C. They each beat each other up and that hurt but the league deserves at least 2 Pool C's.
I saw it coming a week ago when BOTH SLU and Rochester limped to the end of their respective seasons and DID NOT DROP in their Rankings. The fix was IN. SLU and UR should not be dancing. Frankly, if this was not such a down year normally a resume like Oneonta's would be considered a bubble resume. I am quite confident had Vassar drew with Skidmore and lost in PK's they would be OUT. I am not a Vassar fan but they would have been left out in favor of a team in their own conference that barely beat them and did not even make their own conference tournament and also left out for a team they slammed in UR 3-0. Oh Well...
So Nescac has Amherst and Tufts. Amherst has a VERY EASY draw until the Elite 8 and THEY WILL NEED IT. Serpone knows this is his worst Amherst side in years with a leaky defense compared to their best teams and horrific GK'ing. BUT who is going to beat them? Babson? Babson looked down right awful against Wheaton(MA) in the Newmac Semi's and are absolutely anemic up front. They cannot beat good teams. They have 3 very solid midfielders and that is it. I wouldn't be surprised to see them lose in the 1st round. Brandeis has played VERY WELL at the end of the year and deserved their bid. However ironically this might be Brandeis weakest side since 2012 and this will be their best chance to beat Amherst. Amherst has weaknesses that can be exploited but can this Brandeis side exploit them. Not sure. RUN at Amherst would be a great Elite 8 match-up and I would favor RUN BUT they will not be playing on their coveted carpet. They would be playing on Amherst grass field. I think a Tufts/ Rowan matchup in the 2nd round would be fantastic but Springfield(A Poor man's Amherst) will make it tough for Tufts to score as they WHACK everything in sight and are downright UGLY to watch.
I will be rooting for UMASS Boston and they will be a tough out with their beast of a striker in Williamson. Ommadawn stated this and i fully agree that you need a stud or 2 in the NCAA's to put their teams on their back and get a goal when needed or a stop when needed. That is why I loved Skidmore this season. UMASS Boston has that and if they get by Kean I think they could beat Haverford. It would be a challenge but doable. Frankly, for a team ranked 2nd in New England they got screwed not only for not hosting but their pod is very difficult. They should of had a much easier 1st round / 2nd Round game then they got.
Cortland State who I saw once this season against Oneonta and was not impressed at all. Maybe it was a one off but Oneonta dominated then in the regular season game I saw. Cortland got the easiest 1st / 2nd Round games besides the 2 "bye" teams in Amherst and Chicago. SLU got off easy as well as I think F&M and W&L are overrated and Durocher stuck his team in a draw they could get out of if they play to their potential.
Well said Right. +K.
The one ironic thing is that, for a while, it did not seem like a down year - anecdotally speaking, I observed that there were a lot of unbeaten and untied teams much later than usual. How things can change quickly. In fact, that was part of the reason I figured Brandeis would be out after losing to Wheaton in September and being 3-3-1 at that point: while I did think that parity would increase and that some teams would come back to Earth, I didn't see most of the teams with good records dropping off so significantly. Midd. took until 10/8 to lose its first game, at which point it was 6-0-2 and Williams was 5-0-1 when it dropped its first game on 9/24. I figured both teams would lose two, maybe three games tops in the regular season, but the parity of the NESCAC - for better or worse - became evident as the season went on.
The one team I did think would drop off, and I made this pretty clear, would be Rochester. They certainly won more games than last year, but they flattered to deceive in my opinion - in their 16 game schedule, they had no real significant tests in their first 8 aside from RPI, who they drew with, and emerged from that stretch 7-0-1. Their second 8, however, saw them go 2-4-2. In the end, they had a .616 SoS and 4-3-1 RvR, so I can see why the committee picked them. That said, I felt that they were the one team who would drop off in the second half of the season.
Now I certainly can't complain about teams having average records and still getting into the NCAA Tournament, as it would be hypocritical considering the Brandeis men had a very average record this year. Even considering the loss to NYU, Brandeis probably deserved its bid, although I may well be biased, as did Rochester. Even myself, the resident Rochester critic can admit that the Yellowjackets, whose RvR and SoS was the best of the UAA Pool C candidates, perhaps deserved to get in.
However, even considering that geographic diversity is the primary reason that the UAA gets so many teams in, I can sympathize with - and even agree with - those who feel that the UAA is over-represented. For example, Carnegie Mellon: 1-2-2 RvR and a .556 SoS is poor, even considering a 12-3-2 record. Same with WashU's .589 and 2-4-2. In the end, I think that Carnegie and WashU should have been left out, and I personally would have taken Williams and Midd. in their places.
The one other team that had me scratching my head was Dubuque - 13-5 with a .542 SoS and 2-1-0 RvR. Hey, good for Dubuque for getting its first bid in program history, but I do think there were some other, perhaps more deserving candidates.
Kean... This years RPI. 7th in NJAC, misses conference playoffs and makes the dance.
MSU really lose their CM? They should struggle vs CNU but on a good day can beat Messiah. Gotta love it. I think RUN makes the deepest run out of the league
Tufts upset over Rowan, if they can counter (still a strong point for them? Haven't seen them this year).
I've been out of if this year with high school games every day.
Quote from: NEPAFAN on November 08, 2016, 08:07:34 AM
Mr. Right, not a fan of the Landmark Champs Scranton Royals?
Never seen them play but to be honest I am not expecting much. I realize that makes no sense but I have been around long to kind of know what to expect. maybe and hopefully for you they prove me wrong. I will try to tune into the game to see for myself if there are not other games in that time slot that interest me more.
The Dubuque At-Large is a joke but I am guessing that because their North region only has 6 ranked teams you only have half as many opportunities to pick up ranked wins compared to New England who has 12 ranked teams. So my guess is that all of a sudden a Ranked Win in regions with only 5 to 6 teams that can be ranked becomes like 2 or 3 ranked wins in New England or Mid-Atlantic. So their 1 ranked win and 1-0-0 RvR is comparable or better than say iWilliams 2-3-2 RvR. That is my opinion and I could be wrong but I would have no other explanation for it.
NOTE: Luther's AQ win over Loras IMO changed things ALOT. I believe it allowed Wash U to get in(beat Luther 4-0), obviously it eliminated Loras, gave Dubuque it's only ranked win and got them in and eliminated Macalester from getting a Pool C because they beat them. It also eliminated a couple teams from other regions(New England) because of those berths.
NOTE: Wash U got in because of that Luther AQ and beating them and that last game and draw v Chicago. A meaningless game for Chicago really because they had already won the UAA AQ and most likely would still have gotten a 1st Round Bye with a loss to Wash U. Wash U's resume is really unimpressive. They have 2 good wins over Luther and Dominican. I saw Dominican play twice on the stream and they were not a great side IMO and while never seeing Luther they have some questionable results as well. Wash U finished 2-3-2 in the UAA with their 2 wins over CWRU and NYU the 2 weakest teams in the UAA. So their draws against UR and Chicago did the trick. They should not be dancing and I am assuming Redlands will dispatch them in the 1st round.
Quote from: Mr.Right on November 08, 2016, 01:37:34 PM
Quote from: NEPAFAN on November 08, 2016, 08:07:34 AM
Mr. Right, not a fan of the Landmark Champs Scranton Royals?
Never seen them play but to be honest I am not expecting much. I realize that makes no sense but I have been around long to kind of know what to expect. maybe and hopefully for you they prove me wrong. I will try to tune into the game to see for myself if there are not other games in that time slot that interest me more.
Fair enough, wasn't sure if I was missing something. They were down forever after their success in the 1980s..
Quote from: NCAC New England on November 07, 2016, 09:01:49 PM
Let's take a spin around the four quadrants.
BIG SNIP...
After that, most would favor the chances for Amherst and Messiah getting through. There are definitely teams that could knock them off, but I don't see any game where they wouldn't be clearly favored, especially with a home field advantage that is significant for both.
BIG SNIP...
Going deeper, let's take a closer look at the Messiah quad. The Falcons might face their toughest test of the quad versus the winner of the Montclair-CNU game. CNU is usually very talented but I'd be more worried about a very emotional and talented MSU team with a chip on its shoulder, something to prove, and a star player returning who surely is looking to either make amends or double down in some way to prove his own point (and I'm not even sure what that means but as the jingle goes "I just know it's true."
The Carnegie Mellon pod might be the most balanced and the best first weekend venue for any neutral to attend. All four will feel like they got stuck with too many really good, high reputation-type teams, but all four also will feel like they can advance. I would actually give CMU the least chance of moving on. If OWU gets by CMU they won't feel like they can't beat ONU or Calvin even if either of the latter might be slightly favored. Any of these four could advance out of weekend. If Messiah gets upset, the survivor of the CMU weekend will have a decent chance against Montclair or Newport else, but I don't think they can handle the Falcons especially if it's in Grantham.
BIG SNIP...
Lynchburg drew with Messiah and has only lost ONCE.
I edited out most of this to focus on just these comments. NCAC, let me point out again that the Messiah men will NOT host the sectional, unless the Messiah women lose this weekend--which isn't that likely. Messiah will probably be on the road for any game with F&M or someone else next weekend.
As for MSU vs CNU, they will have to do it without their best scorer Lucas Terci. He got his second red card of the season in the NJAC semi-final, as you know. Doesn't that mean that he misses the NJAC final AND the first round game against CNU? I didn't check to see if any of the other two MSU players who got red cards will also miss more than one game, but they might. In any case, without Lucas Terci I don't see them beating CNU for a chance to play Messiah.
Finally, Lynchburg did tie Messiah zip-zip, but as I said at the time they not only parked the bus, they never even got off it. They literally made no serious effort to score the whole game, whereas the Falcons did. That was Messiah's second game of the season, long before McCarty knew what he had to work with. If they had been playing later in the season, once the Falcon offense was clicking, they would have lost. I was totally unimpressed, leading me to predict (I know I don't usually offer predictions) that Lynchburg would lose to W&L--and they did. I'm not saying that Lynchburg doesn't belong in the tournament--clearly their record speaks for itself on that. I am saying only this: don't put very much emphasis on that scoreless tie. It wouldn't have happened a month later, if they'd played the same way.
Am I missing something because the Messiah women are in Williams' women bracket and if both win I would assume Williams women would host anyway. They are the top team in their regional pod and the Williams men are gone.
With or without Terci MSU should dispatch CNU. I watched CNU in their conference tournament final and MSU is the better team from my eye.
Falconer, I accounted for the home field thing elsewhere I think, stating that I don't see F&M troubling g Messiah regardless of where they play. MSU also just beat Rowan 3-0 without 3 key players, including LT. Possible MSU is chomping at bit to get at Messiah and comes out flat but I wouldn't predict a definite win for CNU. As for Lynchburg, you have to employ your logic both ways. That was also an early game for Lynchburg and perhaps they are improved as well as their stellar record suggests, and of course they also have what I assume is a pretty good home field advantage.
Quote from: 4samuy on November 07, 2016, 06:18:00 PM
WOW. Both Chicago men and women hosting. Can't believe that has happened very often
Happening at Amherst this year, too, as it has before there.
I'm guessing at Williams, too?
Messiah takes turns, I believe, as they have only the one field.
Quote from: Mr.Right on November 08, 2016, 02:37:01 PM
Am I missing something because the Messiah women are in Williams' women bracket and if both win I would assume Williams women would host anyway. They are the top team in their regional pod and the Williams men are gone.
As is often the case, Mr Right, you're right. I hadn't considered that very real possibility. In that case if the Falcons go to the second weekend they are probably playing on their own grass field, which never hurts.
Quote from: NCAC New England on November 08, 2016, 02:49:20 PM
Falconer, I accounted for the home field thing elsewhere I think, stating that I don't see F&M troubling g Messiah regardless of where they play. MSU also just beat Rowan 3-0 without 3 key players, including LT. Possible MSU is chomping at bit to get at Messiah and comes out flat but I wouldn't predict a definite win for CNU. As for Lynchburg, you have to employ your logic both ways. That was also an early game for Lynchburg and perhaps they are improved as well as their stellar record suggests, and of course they also have what I assume is a pretty good home field advantage.
MSU is certainly unpredictable. Undeniably they soundly beat Rowan without either of the Terci brothers on the field. I based my comment on having actually seen Lucas Terci play in person: he's one of the most dangerous players I've seen in a long time, more dangerous (IMO) even than someone like Amolo (whom you have seen often). I frankly wish he were guaranteed not to play round two, so that Messiah wouldn't have to deal with him. Great scorers can change games, even games in which the opponent controls most of the possession. I anticipate that Messiah will out-possess MSU (if that game materializes), and I anticipate that CNU will out-possess MSU, so the absence of Terci could be the difference in that game with CNU.
My comments about Lynchburg were based on the eye test, evaluating the individual players not their style of non-play in that one game. I didn't see anyone who stood out; I didn't see evidence that they are on the same level with Messiah, or even W&L (who didn't park the bus so I could see what they have). However, since they parked the bus I had only limited opportunities to see their skills and athleticism, so they could have been hiding a mountain of talent behind the bus, just playing for a tie in the early season to protect their chances for the dance. I grant that possibility.
It's important to remember that while W&L beat Lynchburg 2-1 at home 10/12, W&L lost to Lynchburg at Lynchburg in the ODAC finals, also 2-1. Both games were pretty even affairs and the results of the home team squeaking past was fair. For all intents and purposes, these teams really are at the same level. Lynchburg earned home field for the ODAC playoffs, no excuse for W&L's home loss to Randolph-Macon, and got the more important win.
Quote from: Falconer on November 08, 2016, 03:12:50 PM
Quote from: Mr.Right on November 08, 2016, 02:37:01 PM
Am I missing something because the Messiah women are in Williams' women bracket and if both win I would assume Williams women would host anyway. They are the top team in their regional pod and the Williams men are gone.
As is often the case, Mr Right, you're right. I hadn't considered that very real possibility. In that case if the Falcons go to the second weekend they are probably playing on their own grass field, which never hurts.
For what it is worth, at this point, the William's women are #1 in the New England rankings and the Messiah women are #1 in the Mid-Atlantic. Messiah has been shipped off to Buffalo this weekend because the men are hosting so if both the Messiah and Williams women move on to the sectional round it would seem possible that Messiah women would host. However, the NCAA travel agents will ultimately be the ones who decide.
Is 500 miles the threshold for the NCAA having to fly a team in? The women's hosting could come down to whether Christopher Newport emerges from their pod or not as they would be over 500 miles from Williamstown, MA making Messiah or Stevens (should they advance) the sites that wouldn't require flights. Then again, depending how other sectionals work out with number of fights required, maybe the NCAA is willing to fly one team in this sectional to reward Williams with hosting privileges.
Quote from: Flying Weasel on November 08, 2016, 04:31:27 PM
Is 500 miles the threshold for the NCAA having to fly a team in? The women's hosting could come down to whether Christopher Newport emerges from their pod or not as they would be over 500 miles from Williamstown, MA making Messiah or Stevens (should they advance) the sites that wouldn't require flights. Then again, depending how other sectionals work out with number of fights required, maybe the NCAA is willing to fly one team in this sectional to reward Williams with hosting privileges.
500 miles by TES, which is different than Google. But yes, that is the limit.
https://web1.ncaa.org/TES/exec/miles
I heard 3rd hand that Kenyon missed by 20 miles, and so they get to enjoy an 8 hour bus ride to Lynchburg.
Quote from: NCAC New England on November 08, 2016, 04:43:35 PM
I heard 3rd hand that Kenyon missed by 20 miles, and so they get to enjoy an 8 hour bus ride to Lynchburg.
WOW....8 hours is a monster drive...HUGE disadvantage especially for the bigger players with long legs...That seems a bit unfair
Brandeis has played 8 tourney teams this year... EIGHT (4-3-1). Are they healthy enough to make a run?
Bloots can answer this better than me. I believe they are now fully healthy but IMO like I said before this is Brandeis weakest side since 2012 BUT it is also Amherst weakest side in q while with weaknesses that can be exploited especially in net but can Brandeis take advantage. I would give them a good shot to do so especially if they can score first and take as many shots as possible on Amherst GK and follow their shots as he has a horrible tendency of coughing up the ball right in front of him.
jknezek, what is the atmosphere like at Lynchburg? And is there a big difference between day and night games?
Mr. R,
Remind me who you're rooting for so I can advise others how to take them apart!
Or maybe how others can take the one other NESCAC team (Tufts) apart!
What happened to your NESCAC affiliation here? ;D
Quote from: NCAC New England on November 08, 2016, 06:26:14 PM
jknezek, what is the atmosphere like at Lynchburg? And is there a big difference between day and night games?
It should be pretty good. Lynchburg doesn't have a football team, so soccer and lacrosse are campus events. We aren't talking Messiah type support, but I think you'll get a decent and knowledgeable crowd for Lynchburg's game(s). I doubt anyone will be too fired up for the other side of the quad. Day versus night won't matter much. Facility is good but turf.
Quote from: NCAC New England on November 08, 2016, 04:43:35 PM
I heard 3rd hand that Kenyon missed by 20 miles, and so they get to enjoy an 8 hour bus ride to Lynchburg.
Now, now - not that far! I drove from Durham to my home north of Columbus today - 7 and a half hours with three stops (475 miles). Thought about stopping in at Lynchburg. Tell the bus driver that Virginia uses unmarked cars - and they were the only state in which I saw troopers during the 15 hour round trip drive.
Quote from: Jump4Joy on November 08, 2016, 06:28:39 PM
Mr. R,
Remind me who you're rooting for so I can advise others how to take them apart!
Or maybe how others can take the one other NESCAC team (Tufts) apart!
What happened to your NESCAC affiliation here? ;D
I tell it like i see it from my point of view. People disagree with me all the time and I really feel Amherst GK Lee Owen's best trait is PK's so that might help Amherst. I have seen Amherst over 8 times this year and I notice he struggles with certain shots especially holding onto the ball when shots are hit low and bouncing.
Quote from: Domino1195 on November 08, 2016, 06:48:26 PM
Quote from: NCAC New England on November 08, 2016, 04:43:35 PM
I heard 3rd hand that Kenyon missed by 20 miles, and so they get to enjoy an 8 hour bus ride to Lynchburg.
Now, now - not that far! I drove from Durham to my home north of Columbus today - 7 and a half hours with three stops (475 miles). Thought about stopping in at Lynchburg. Tell the bus driver that Virginia uses unmarked cars - and they were the only state in which I saw troopers during the 15 hour round trip drive.
Did you get out of the car take a nap and then play 90 minutes of intense futbol?
Quote from: Mr.Right on November 08, 2016, 07:40:23 PM
Quote from: Domino1195 on November 08, 2016, 06:48:26 PM
Quote from: NCAC New England on November 08, 2016, 04:43:35 PM
I heard 3rd hand that Kenyon missed by 20 miles, and so they get to enjoy an 8 hour bus ride to Lynchburg.
Now, now - not that far! I drove from Durham to my home north of Columbus today - 7 and a half hours with three stops (475 miles). Thought about stopping in at Lynchburg. Tell the bus driver that Virginia uses unmarked cars - and they were the only state in which I saw troopers during the 15 hour round trip drive.
There's nothing new about the 500 mile rule. It's part of why home field is a huge advantage. You think Kenyon has it bad? They have the possibility of 2 games in their one trip. Look at the mileage for Sul Ross State to Louisiana College. It's not an issue in soccer, but many other ASC sports. Conference game that requires an 800 mile bus trip. Supposedly 12 hours each way, but there is no way it is that short on a bus. Even farther for SRSU to get to Belhaven for football.
Quote from: lastguyoffthebench on November 08, 2016, 05:31:37 PM
Brandeis has played 8 tourney teams this year... EIGHT (4-3-1). Are they healthy enough to make a run?
They are as healthy as they've been all year. Good point about being 4-3-1:
John Carroll - W (3-1)
Haverford - W (1-0)
Babson - L (0-1) 2OT
Tufts - L (0-1) 20T
CMU - T (1-1)
Chicago - L (1-2) 2OT
Wash U - W (2-1)
Rochester - W (3-1)
I tend to agree with Mr. Right on this. While not as skilled as the past few Deis teams, as the above record against tourney teams shows, this is still a tested squad who could pose a strong threat to Amherst (if they can get past Babson).
A long drive can certainly impact a player when they have to play the same day as the drive. In the case of the NCAA tournament, teams arrive a day before, practice on the field and get settled in the hotel. Teams have a full 24 hours to stretch the legs and get comfortable with their surroundings.
Quote from: D3 Scout on November 09, 2016, 09:56:06 AM
A long drive can certainly impact a player when they have to play the same day as the drive. In the case of the NCAA tournament, teams arrive a day before, practice on the field and get settled in the hotel. Teams have a full 24 hours to stretch the legs and get comfortable with their surroundings.
Marietta played at John Carroll twice this year - a 1-0 win in reg season, a 7-1 drubbing in the OAC playoffs. Marietta has a 160 mile, 2 1/2 - 3 hour trip to get there and usually reserves northern Ohio games for Saturday evenings during the season. In the first game the stats were very even; saves, SOG, fouls, corners, etc. Game played Saturday at 7pm. The playoff game was played on a Wednesday at 4pm. Not sure if the home team dictates this or the OAC has to approve; if Marietta objected to the early start time, etc. JCU is a MUCH different team now than when they played Marietta the first time - but I believe the time of the playoff game was a huge disadvantage to the Marietta players.
Quote from: Mr.Right on November 07, 2016, 11:57:05 PM
My opinion:
This whole process has been dictated by geography and saving money..
I am New England biased but I say New England and Nescac really got the shaft. Whoever led the New England Committee did not put up much of an argument or did and was completely overruled and "soft". Either way you have teams with 2-3-4 ranked wins and SOS's of at or close to .600 not get in and teams out West and Central / Great Lakes / South Atlantic take New England bids. The most represented region with the most teams gets ONLY 3 POOL C's. I think 4 and even 5 would be more appropriate.
Nescac teams have won the last 2 NCAA Championships and been represented in almost every NCAA Final 4 since 2007. Yet Nescac gets 1 Pool C and the UAA gets 4 Pool C's and year after year they get NOWHERE. UAA teams have FAILED miserably on THE BIG STAGE. Personally, after watching the NJAC a lot this season I do not mind the 3 Pool C's. They deserve it. RUN, MSU and Rowan are damn good teams and while I have not seen Kean this year they did well enough in their conference to deserve to get in. No problems with the NJAC and 3 Pool C's. However, for Nescac, 1 out of Bowdoin / Williams / Midd should have gotten a Pool C. They each beat each other up and that hurt but the league deserves at least 2 Pool C's.
I saw it coming a week ago when BOTH SLU and Rochester limped to the end of their respective seasons and DID NOT DROP in their Rankings. The fix was IN. SLU and UR should not be dancing. Frankly, if this was not such a down year normally a resume like Oneonta's would be considered a bubble resume. I am quite confident had Vassar drew with Skidmore and lost in PK's they would be OUT. I am not a Vassar fan but they would have been left out in favor of a team in their own conference that barely beat them and did not even make their own conference tournament and also left out for a team they slammed in UR 3-0. Oh Well...
So Nescac has Amherst and Tufts. Amherst has a VERY EASY draw until the Elite 8 and THEY WILL NEED IT. Serpone knows this is his worst Amherst side in years with a leaky defense compared to their best teams and horrific GK'ing. BUT who is going to beat them? Babson? Babson looked down right awful against Wheaton(MA) in the Newmac Semi's and are absolutely anemic up front. They cannot beat good teams. They have 3 very solid midfielders and that is it. I wouldn't be surprised to see them lose in the 1st round. Brandeis has played VERY WELL at the end of the year and deserved their bid. However ironically this might be Brandeis weakest side since 2012 and this will be their best chance to beat Amherst. Amherst has weaknesses that can be exploited but can this Brandeis side exploit them. Not sure. RUN at Amherst would be a great Elite 8 match-up and I would favor RUN BUT they will not be playing on their coveted carpet. They would be playing on Amherst grass field. I think a Tufts/ Rowan matchup in the 2nd round would be fantastic but Springfield(A Poor man's Amherst) will make it tough for Tufts to score as they WHACK everything in sight and are downright UGLY to watch.
I will be rooting for UMASS Boston and they will be a tough out with their beast of a striker in Williamson. Ommadawn stated this and i fully agree that you need a stud or 2 in the NCAA's to put their teams on their back and get a goal when needed or a stop when needed. That is why I loved Skidmore this season. UMASS Boston has that and if they get by Kean I think they could beat Haverford. It would be a challenge but doable. Frankly, for a team ranked 2nd in New England they got screwed not only for not hosting but their pod is very difficult. They should of had a much easier 1st round / 2nd Round game then they got.
Cortland State who I saw once this season against Oneonta and was not impressed at all. Maybe it was a one off but Oneonta dominated then in the regular season game I saw. Cortland got the easiest 1st / 2nd Round games besides the 2 "bye" teams in Amherst and Chicago. SLU got off easy as well as I think F&M and W&L are overrated and Durocher stuck his team in a draw they could get out of if they play to their potential.
Well said, Mr. Right. I have been following the boards for a few years now and finally decided that I have to make an account to get some things out there. Sorry as this post may come off as aggressive for a first time poster. As you mentioned, I also agree that it is ridiculous that the NESCAC only got 2 teams into the tournament this year. The past two national champions have been from the NESCAC and teams from the league continue to dominate their non-conference opponents. New England has the most ranked teams for a reason and there is a reason that the NESCAC always has at least 3 or 4 teams ranked in the region.
From what I have heard, Serpone (head coach of Amherst) is the New England committee head. Quite frankly, I agree with your statement that he was "soft." On behalf of the NESCAC and especially Williams, Midd and Bowdoin, Serpone is an insult to the league. Don't get me wrong... he is obviously a successful coach and knows how to recruit and win. However, he should not represent the NESCAC. He is a pushover and honestly, I think it's for selfish reasons. I think that Serpone is a coward and is scared to play other NESCAC teams in the tournament. In the past, Amherst has been eliminated from the NCAA tournament by NESCAC teams and I think that he was scared to play Williams, Midd or Bowdoin. He ended the careers of 3 unbelievable senior classes and did not give them a chance on the big stage. And obviously for Midd, this is not the first time that he has screwed them over...
I have always enjoyed reading your posts, Mr. Right and just wanted to add my own thoughts.
Do you know how they elect regional committee members?
Quote from: NESCAC_United on November 09, 2016, 02:31:27 PMNew England has the most ranked teams for a reason and there is a reason that the NESCAC always has at least 3 or 4 teams ranked in the region.
And that reason is that the New England region has more eligible men's teams than any other region. The number of teams ranked has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with strength and/or depth of a region; they rank the top 15% of each region's eligible teams. More teams in a region = more teams ranked.
From the 2016 NCAA Division III Soccer Pre-Championships Manual (http://www.d3soccer.com/ncaa-publications/2016/2016-NCAA-Division-III-Soccer_Pre-Championships-Manual.pdf):
QuoteThe committee will rank the top 15 percent of eligible teams in each region (or a minimum of four teams, whichever is
greater) by applying the championships selection criteria. Based on 2016 sponsorship reports, the following number of
teams will be ranked in each region:
Central Region – 6
East Region – 8
Great Lakes Region – 8
Mid-Atlantic Region – 9
New England Region – 12
North Region – 6
South Atlantic Region – 8
West Region – 5
So, for the New England region that has 77 eligible teams, 15% of 77 is 11.55 or 12 teams to be ranked. There are more chances for mid-table NESCAC teams to be ranked thanks to the NAC, NECC, GNAC, MASCAC that make up about half of the region's teams but whose teams individually and collectively are typically irrelevant to the whole NCAA tournament and the rankings and at-large berths.
Quote from: Flying Weasel on November 09, 2016, 03:25:51 PM
Quote from: NESCAC_United on November 09, 2016, 02:31:27 PMNew England has the most ranked teams for a reason and there is a reason that the NESCAC always has at least 3 or 4 teams ranked in the region.
And that reason is that the New England region has more eligible men's teams than any other region. The number of teams ranked has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with strength and/or depth of a region; they rank the top 15% of each region's eligible teams. More teams in a region = more teams ranked.
From the 2016 NCAA Division III Soccer Pre-Championships Manual (http://www.d3soccer.com/ncaa-publications/2016/2016-NCAA-Division-III-Soccer_Pre-Championships-Manual.pdf):
QuoteThe committee will rank the top 15 percent of eligible teams in each region (or a minimum of four teams, whichever is
greater) by applying the championships selection criteria. Based on 2016 sponsorship reports, the following number of
teams will be ranked in each region:
Central Region – 6
East Region – 8
Great Lakes Region – 8
Mid-Atlantic Region – 9
New England Region – 12
North Region – 6
South Atlantic Region – 8
West Region – 5
So, for the New England region that has 77 eligible teams, 15% of 77 is 11.55 or 12 teams to be ranked. There are more chances for mid-table NESCAC teams to be ranked thanks to the NAC, NECC, GNAC, MASCAC that make up about half of the region's teams but whose teams individually and collectively are typically irrelevant to the whole NCAA tournament and the rankings and at-large berths.
Thanks for the clarification. Regardless, New England is probably considered the best region holistically. I understand that there are travel and regional limitations. It just seems ridiculous that the percentage of New England teams that make it is so much less than the percentage from other regions.
Was diving into why Loras was left out and Dubuque in but here is what the resumes are for all the people that think Loras should have got the nod and been slotted ahead of Dubuque in the final regional rankings...
Dubuque: 13-5-0, SOS .542, RvR 2-1-0, H2H Beat Loras 1-0
Loras: 13-5-0, SOS .593, RvR 1-5-0, H2H Lost Dubuque 1-0
I think the head to head matchup ultimately outweighed the slightly higher SOS or amount of ranked teams Loras had in their favor. Tough break for the Duhawks for sure.
I too feel badly for Loras.
Which is why it is so important to take your chance.
A quality program like that, I'm sure they will be back very soon, but perhaps should have won a championship within the last 5 years of totally dominating.
Regarding not getting more than two NESCAC teams into the tournament, I think there's a lot of merit in the earlier suggestion that Wheaton's position ahead of Williams and Middlebury in the New England region was the biggest factor. And we have to remember that the people responsible for ranking Wheaton ahead of Williams and Middlebury (the New England Regional Advisory Committee) are not the same people, bar one, who are making the at-large selections (the national committee composed of the eight RAC chairpersons). If the New England RAC was making the at-large selections, the reasoning that pushed Wheaton ahead of Williams and Middlebury in the rankings very well might have seen Wheaton selected ahead of Kean for an at-large berth. Who knows. Kean did have a better winning percentage than Williams and Middlebury, so maybe not.
And seeing a third NJAC school get an at-large berth before a fourth New England region team and seeing Ohio Northern means the national committee isn't ignoring winning percentage and number of losses and blemishes. We know that SOS and RvR are very important to them, but sometimes we may be overestimating how much it is weighed and underestimating the other criteria. And how one region's RAC weighs things may not be the same as the national committee, which brings me back to my previous paragraph.
Quote from: NESCAC_United on November 10, 2016, 09:44:02 AM
Thanks for the clarification. Regardless, New England is probably considered the best region holistically. I understand that there are travel and regional limitations. It just seems ridiculous that the percentage of New England teams that make it is so much less than the percentage from other regions.
Well, I'm not sure of your definition of "so mucch less". The only regions that really got more teams in the tournament by percentage are the South Atlantic and the Great Lakes. Those two regions have fewer eligible teams than the New England region and have fewer cupcakes, by percentage. That, combined with the NCAC being strong/deep, Ohio Northern failing to claim the OAC's automatic berth, and the NJAC being strong/deep, saw those regions get a higher percentage of teams into the dance.
New England: 11 berths from 77 eligible teams = 14%
East: 8 berths from 53 eligble teams = 15%
Mid-Atlantic: 8 berths from 60 eligble teams = 13%
South Atlantic: 9 berths from 52 eligble teams = 17%
Great Lakes: 9 berths from 52 eligble teams = 17%
Central: 6 berths from 42 eligble teams = 14%
North: 6 berths from 42 eligble teams = 14%
West: 5 berths from 38 eligble teams = 13%
If you remove the NECC and NAC teams and their automatic berths from the New England region, resulting in a number of teams closer to that in other regions and reducing the percentage of cupcakes in the region, the numbers for New England come out like this:
9 berths from 58 teams = 16%
I too am surprised that New England didn't get another couple teams in as is usual, but it's not entirely accurate to suggest they got "so much less" than other regions. It's just that they didn't get a higher percentage than other regions which typically is warranted due to the greater strength and depth at the top of the region.
Quote from: Mid-Atlantic Fan on November 10, 2016, 11:37:35 AM
Was diving into why Loras was left out and Dubuque in but here is what the resumes are for all the people that think Loras should have got the nod and been slotted ahead of Dubuque in the final regional rankings...
Dubuque: 13-5-0, SOS .542, RvR 2-1-0, H2H Beat Loras 1-0
Loras: 13-5-0, SOS .593, RvR 1-5-0, H2H Lost Dubuque 1-0
I think the head to head matchup ultimately outweighed the slightly higher SOS or amount of ranked teams Loras had in their favor. Tough break for the Duhawks for sure.
I don't know how the committee considers RvR. I'm fairly convinced that they are more interested in the wins vs. ranked than the loses. Or, at least, they have no problems with the losses (they want team to play tough schedules) as long as there are wins vs. ranked teams as well. For example, I think they would value a 2-3-1 (.417) RvR higher than a 1-0-1 (.750) RvR even though by winning percentage the later is much better. But that's just my impression. Looking specifically at Loras and Dubuque, I wonder if one way to look at the RvR comparison is that Dubuque only required 3 games versus ranked teams to notch two wins; Loras was given six opportunities (twice as many) and still couldn't get a second win. I don't know. Head-to-head went to Dubuque and RvR as well, while SOS significantly favors Loras. If those balance out in the minds of the committee, wouldn't head-to-head be a reasonable decider?
I'm surprised by the choice of Dubuque over Loras just like most everyone else. But it's not so absurd if you can completely forget about history and name recognition and look at the data the committee considers. The ranking and at-large selection process seems to be a highly quantitative exercise with minimal subjectivity. I don't completely agree with that approach, but recognizing it for what it is, the selection of Dubuque probably shouldn't be such a surprise.
Week 2
6. Emory 9-3-1 / .603 SOS 1-1-1 6th
7. Kean 14-5-0 / .573 SOS 2-3-0 -- NR
Week 3
7. Emory 10-4-1 / .601 SOS 1-2-1 RvR
8. Kean 14-5-1 / .564 SOS 2-3-0 RvR
FINAL
7. Kean 14-5-1 (.725) / .561 SOS / 2-3-1 RvR (losses to Rowan, Newark, Rochester 0-1)
8. Emory 10-5-1 (.656) / .600 SOS / 1-3-1 RvR (losses to Chicago, Brandeis, Rochester 0-1)
Incredibly close, but in the final week Emory loses to #3 NCAA EAST Rochester (same score as Kean); Kean IDLE after missing NJAC play-offs...
The loss to UR in final game, drop in win %, .01 knock to SOS, and the RvR hit...
In a game that should seemingly only help their cause with any positive result, ends up bursting their bubble... head scratcher, IMO.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Emory loses to #3 Rochester and #4 Brandeis in 2 of the final 3 games; 1-2
Kean beats #6 Drew, loses to TCNJ, and ties Ramapo; 1-1-1
I agree that when just looking at the RvR, SoS and head to head it's hard to pick between Loras and Dubuque. Flip a coin in my mind. What bothers me about Dubuque going instead of Loras is what happened after the two teams played and Dubuque picked up a lucky goal off a misplayed ball in the 89th minute. Dubuque proceeded to go 3-4 over the rest of the season. Loras went 8-1. I would like to think the selection committee would have put some more weight on the trajectory of a team's season.
Quote from: Dubuquer on November 11, 2016, 10:08:17 AM
I agree that when just looking at the RvR, SoS and head to head it's hard to pick between Loras and Dubuque. Flip a coin in my mind. What bothers me about Dubuque going instead of Loras is what happened after the two teams played and Dubuque picked up a lucky goal off a misplayed ball in the 89th minute. Dubuque proceeded to go 3-4 over the rest of the season. Loras went 8-1. I would like to think the selection committee would have put some more weight on the trajectory of a team's season.
They don't care whose hot and whose not unfortunately. Rochester limped into the tournament. Started 7-0-2 and finished 2-4-1 for a 9-4-3 overall record. Ironically, UR was 2-4-1 on the road and 7-0-2 at home. Will be interesting to see how they do on the road in the tournament.
I also noticed the 2 bye teams(Chicago and Amherst) got much different draws. It is my opinion that a bye is just that a bye..A walk into the RD 32 but IT SHOULD NOT BE a cupcake walk to the SWEET 16. Chicago's RD 32 match-up looks a bit more difficult as it gets the winner of an AQ/Pool C game while Amherst gets the winner of 2 very weak AQ's from 2 very weak leagues. IMO the "bye" teams should bet their bye and then play a Pool C / bubble team winner in the RD of 32 if possible. Amherst really got a good draw.
+k Nescac_United for the compliment and glad you enjoy my posts. Hopefully you continue to post and post in a fair and objective manner while being either critical or praise worthy. IMO those are the best posters to read.
http://www.nscaa.com/web/web/News/Articles/December_2016/NSCAA_Reveal.aspx (http://www.nscaa.com/web/web/News/Articles/December_2016/NSCAA_Reveal.aspx)
2016 NSCAA NCAA Division III Men's All-America Teams
First Team
K Theo Hooker Jr. Colorado College Albuquerque, N.M.
D Mark Heydt Sr. University of St. Thomas Brookfield, Wis.
D Anthony Passiatore Sr. SUNY Oneonta South Setauket, N.Y.
D Laurence Wyke So. Trinity University (Texas) Bolton, England
M Jacob Bender* Sr. Messiah College Baltimore, Md.
M Soren Frykholm Sr. Colorado College Boulder, Colo.
M James Grace Jr. Christopher Newport University Ashburn, Va.
M Stephan Hooker Sr. Calvin College Hudsonville, Mich.
F Fabio DeSousa Fr Rutgers University-Newark Long Branch, N.J.
F Shane Doherty So. Rowan University Delran, N.J.
F Matt Kinkopf* Sr. Ohio Northern University Hamilton, Ohio
F Max Lopez So. University Of Chicago Tulsa, Okla.
F Caleb Lucas* Sr. Maryville College Maryville, Tenn.
F Austin Michaelis So. Trinity University (Texas) Coppell, Texas
F Nick Tata Sr. SUNY Cortland Rochester, N.Y.
F Gilbert Waso* So. Elizabethtown College Elizabethtown, Pa.
Second Team
Pos Player Name Class School Hometown
K Chris Ralph Fr. Penn State-Behrend Murrysville, Pa.
D Evan Augustine Sr. Penn State-Behrend South Park, Pa.
D Marcelo Cunha Jr. University Of Massachusetts-Boston Goiania, Brazil
D Jack McCormick Sr. Colorado College Hudson, Ohio
D Will Sjaastad So. Rowan University Allentown, N.J.
D Trent Vegter So. Calvin College Hudsonville, Mich.
M Nicco Capotosto So. University Of Chicago Holland, Mich.
M Caleb Cole** Sr. Gordon College Coatesville, Pa.
M Patrik Devlin* Sr. Connecticut College Washington Crossing, Pa.
M Kellen Reid Jr. Trinity University (Texas) Coppell, Texas
M Christian Sakshaug* So. Trinity University (Texas) San Antonio, Texas
F Luke Alvaro Sr. Springfield College Somers, Conn.
F Alex Bradley Sr. Loras College Leighton Buzzard, United Kingdom
F Gonzalo Hernandez Sr. University Of Dubuque Madrid, Spain
F Nick Kapetanos Jr. Benedictine University Norridge, Ill.
Third Team
Pos Player Name Class School Hometown
K Hill Bonin Jr. University Of Chicago Lone Tree, Colo.
D Wyatt Fabian So. Franklin & Marshall College Sinking Spring, Pa.
D Henry Myers Jr. Kenyon College Lebanon, Ohio
D Harry Nodwell Sr. Christopher Newport University Devon, England
D Adebare Oyeniyi Sr. Skidmore College Lagos, Nigeria
D Jesse Toth** Sr. Houghton College Victor, N.Y.
M Austin Bitta Sr. Carthage College Libertyville, Ill.
M Shae Bottum Jr. University of St. Thomas West Lakeland, Minn.
M Bryce Ciambella Sr. Amherst College Ocala, Fla.
M Josh Ocel* Sr. Brandeis University North Attleboro, Mass.
M Nick Wertman Sr. Oberlin College Westlake, Ohio
F Gaston Becherano Sr. Tufts University Hollywood, Fla.
F Julian Gonzalez Sr. DePauw University Indianapolis, Ind.
F Caden MacKenzie Sr. Colorado College Denver, Colo.
F Ugochukwe Okolie So. Franklin & Marshall College Lagos, Nigeria
F Lucas Terci** Sr. Montclair State University Union, N.J.
* Asterisks indicate number of previous All-America selections
Here we go lets see who "shows" up today and who fades from our memory...
Is this a joke? 8 forwards? Lol that Nescac only has 3 players. Regardless of my bias, Devlin should be a first team all American. Hopefully other sites do a better job.
Colorado College with 4 All Americans? Interesting.
Quote from: NEsoccerfan on December 02, 2016, 03:02:03 PM
Colorado College with 4 All Americans? Interesting.
And Trinity also with 4. Also interesting. 8 from those two in same conference.
Quote from: PaulNewman on December 02, 2016, 04:04:36 PM
Quote from: NEsoccerfan on December 02, 2016, 03:02:03 PM
Colorado College with 4 All Americans? Interesting.
And Trinity also with 4. Also interesting. 8 from those two in same conference.
They were able to get the SID's from their conference to vote apparently.
Some odd selections all over the board.
Quote from: NEsoccerfan on December 02, 2016, 03:02:03 PM
Colorado College with 4 All Americans? Interesting.
exactly what i said. like who are half of these kids...
Quote from: firstplaceloser on December 03, 2016, 11:24:03 AM
Quote from: NEsoccerfan on December 02, 2016, 03:02:03 PM
Colorado College with 4 All Americans? Interesting.
exactly what i said. like who are half of these kids...
A question for the ages. If you have 4 all-americans and can't make the tourney, are they even all-americans.
Congrats to Chicago Sophmore forward Max Lopez, Sophmore midfielder Nicco Capotosto and Junior keeper Hill Bonin on their All-American recognition.
Falconer, Brandt tore a muscle in his groin and missed the majority of the season, only playing in 3 games. He took a medical redshirt and could come back for another fall if he wanted. However, with Brandt never getting to play for his dad, I wouldn't be surprised if he left after next fall to play for his dad with the Riverhounds. He has trained with multiple teams in the USL already and from what I know is very interested in playing professionally.
Quote from: CovensCorner on December 03, 2016, 11:37:41 AM
A question for the ages. If you have 4 all-americans and can't make the tourney, are they even all-americans.
I know this is a rhetorical question, but I agree with the implication: sounds impossible.
Quote from: Jump4Joy on December 04, 2016, 11:00:40 AM
Quote from: CovensCorner on December 03, 2016, 11:37:41 AM
A question for the ages. If you have 4 all-americans and can't make the tourney, are they even all-americans.
I know this is a rhetorical question, but I agree with the implication: sounds impossible.
Obviously they got too many but the other way of looking at it is that maybe they
should have been in the tournament. Only losses all year were to Trinity, who ends up season with highest win pct in the country.
Quote from: PaulNewman on December 04, 2016, 11:09:50 AM
Quote from: Jump4Joy on December 04, 2016, 11:00:40 AM
Quote from: CovensCorner on December 03, 2016, 11:37:41 AM
A question for the ages. If you have 4 all-americans and can't make the tourney, are they even all-americans.
I know this is a rhetorical question, but I agree with the implication: sounds impossible.
Obviously they got too many but the other way of looking at it is that maybe they should have been in the tournament. Only losses all year were to Trinity, who ends up season with highest win pct in the country.
go take a look at their All American worthy stats.... it's a joke and so is the nscaa commitee
Quote from: letsGOswans! on December 02, 2016, 02:55:44 PM
Is this a joke? 8 forwards? Lol that Nescac only has 3 players. Regardless of my bias, Devlin should be a first team all American. Hopefully other sites do a better job.
Spot on letsGOswans....looks even better now that another NESCAC has won the D3 Championship....congratulations Tufts Jumbos....Devlin should be 1st team no question.
I was expecting to see Garcia from College of New Rochelle on the NSCAA AA list... is this because they are a d3 independent?
Lucas Terci only 3rd team AA... crazy.
Quote from: lastguyoffthebench on December 07, 2016, 01:53:01 PM
Lucas Terci only 3rd team AA... crazy.
Terci with first- (and only) team honor on Hero Sports:
http://herosports.com/news/d3-mens-soccer-all-america-team-2016?utm_source=HERO+Master&utm_campaign=1fc3cf46e9-Men%27s+Soccer+12%2F5&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_25ee8a514c-1fc3cf46e9-83871405