MBB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

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Fresh off her one week foray into and through the Golden State, the ever perceptive Mrs. OldKnight had several interesting comments from last night's action. She entered VNA, looked at the Comets' record in the program, and wondered out loud what had happened to Gene Giffords' coaching skills. It only took her 5 minutes of play to recognize that her sorrow for KVS and his player losses was compeletely misplaced because Olivet is a team bereft of talent. Quite a comedown from the McClary years. I told Mrs. OK that Calvin seems to have mysteriously become a better shooting team the last few games and she then pointed out  the obvious--the Knights shot selection is greatly improved and maybe that had something to do with it. I hate it when she notices something I should have seen.

Doug Wentworth opined on the broadcast that coach Gifford's problem is that he ran out of McClarys (McClaries?)

[KnightSlappy]

Others I've seen great improvement throughout the season:  Rietema, Van Eck, Dykstra.  I disagree with KS on Van Eck--I think he will be an important part of the squad in 2012-13.  Dan Stout gives me the impression of a young Brent Schuster--tall, thin, and good rotation on his shot.   

My saying Van Eck won't make the team next year is more of a commentary on their potential depth, and less a knock on Nate. I think he could be a useful player for 9-12 minutes per game next year, but it would be tough to carry a senior on the end of the bench. It's a numbers game; I just don't see enough minutes available.

[Happy Calvin Guy]

Others I've seen great improvement throughout the season:  Rietema, Van Eck, Dykstra.  I disagree with KS on Van Eck--I think he will be an important part of the squad in 2012-13.  Dan Stout gives me the impression of a young Brent Schuster--tall, thin, and good rotation on his shot.   

My saying Van Eck won't make the team next year is more of a commentary on their potential depth, and less a knock on Nate. I think he could be a useful player for 9-12 minutes per game next year, but it would be tough to carry a senior on the end of the bench. It's a numbers game; I just don't see enough minutes available.

Good point KS.  A lot of that depends on the injured/ineligible crowd and who returns to the roster next year.  Speaking of that, I don't have a good understanding of who sits on the bench with the team and who doesn't.  Last night Mickey DeVries was on the bench (in street clothes of course) and I think earlier in the season Jordan Brink was there for awhile.  No sign of Mitch Vallie or Brent Henry.  Is it simply up to the player, or is there more significance to this to read into?  My understanding is that academically ineligible players can't practice either....but I guess they can sit with the team during games.

By the way, someone raised the question on this board a while back about 3-point gunner Jaren Edsall of Olivet and his recent absence from the lineup.  I'm not sure if anyone answered the question.....apparently it's a concussion issue and he should return to the lineup soon. 

[Busted Stuff]

Others I've seen great improvement throughout the season:  Rietema, Van Eck, Dykstra.  I disagree with KS on Van Eck--I think he will be an important part of the squad in 2012-13.  Dan Stout gives me the impression of a young Brent Schuster--tall, thin, and good rotation on his shot.   

My saying Van Eck won't make the team next year is more of a commentary on their potential depth, and less a knock on Nate. I think he could be a useful player for 9-12 minutes per game next year, but it would be tough to carry a senior on the end of the bench. It's a numbers game; I just don't see enough minutes available.

Good point KS.  A lot of that depends on the injured/ineligible crowd and who returns to the roster next year.  Speaking of that, I don't have a good understanding of who sits on the bench with the team and who doesn't.  Last night Mickey DeVries was on the bench (in street clothes of course) and I think earlier in the season Jordan Brink was there for awhile.  No sign of Mitch Vallie or Brent Henry.  Is it simply up to the player, or is there more significance to this to read into?  My understanding is that academically ineligible players can't practice either....but I guess they can sit with the team during games.

By the way, someone raised the question on this board a while back about 3-point gunner Jaren Edsall of Olivet and his recent absence from the lineup.  I'm not sure if anyone answered the question.....apparently it's a concussion issue and he should return to the lineup soon.

I believe Jordan Brink is headed to England for second semester.

[AlwaysHope]

Doug Wentworth, the former Hope football announcer and current Calvin BB announcer, is retiring:

http://www.mlive.com/sports/grand-rapids/index.ssf/2012/01/legendary_football_basketball.html

[HopeConvert]

Hope over Olivet and Trine +54.

Calvin oner Olivet and Trine +55.

Hope over Calvin +16

says the Calvin grad...

We've tried everything -- interventions, exorcism -- and still he continues in his stubborn apostasy.

He could be Frisian, and thus hopeless.   

A convert, by definition, moves from darkness to light, from despair to Hope, and doesn't look back, having now experienced a greater and deeper joy. Would you accuse St. Paul of becoming an apostate on the road to Damascus?

As my daughter would say: that's right. I went there.

[DewCrewVett]

Others I've seen great improvement throughout the season:  Rietema, Van Eck, Dykstra.  I disagree with KS on Van Eck--I think he will be an important part of the squad in 2012-13.  Dan Stout gives me the impression of a young Brent Schuster--tall, thin, and good rotation on his shot.   

My saying Van Eck won't make the team next year is more of a commentary on their potential depth, and less a knock on Nate. I think he could be a useful player for 9-12 minutes per game next year, but it would be tough to carry a senior on the end of the bench. It's a numbers game; I just don't see enough minutes available.

Good point KS.  A lot of that depends on the injured/ineligible crowd and who returns to the roster next year.  Speaking of that, I don't have a good understanding of who sits on the bench with the team and who doesn't.  Last night Mickey DeVries was on the bench (in street clothes of course) and I think earlier in the season Jordan Brink was there for awhile.  No sign of Mitch Vallie or Brent Henry.  Is it simply up to the player, or is there more significance to this to read into?  My understanding is that academically ineligible players can't practice either....but I guess they can sit with the team during games.

By the way, someone raised the question on this board a while back about 3-point gunner Jaren Edsall of Olivet and his recent absence from the lineup.  I'm not sure if anyone answered the question.....apparently it's a concussion issue and he should return to the lineup soon.

With half of the conference season through I just want to jump in and ask if you really believe a 9-9 overall team with a mediocre 4-3 conference record even deserves to have a player in the MVP discussion? If MVP voting really only takes into account the conference season then I dont really think Snikkers or anyone on the Calvin team, has any reason to even be in the MVP discussion.

For the conference Snikkers has made 39% of his FG's and 21% of his 3PFG's...yes he averages 15.6 points, but he is definitely not the most efficient scorer or shooter. He also leads the team in TO's, which is no surprise from what we have seen. I guess what I am trying to say, is that any team that completely dominates the MIAA should have the MVP on their team. Bowser got absolutely snubbed last year, and everybody knows it. McClary was a great player and certainly deserving of MOP but not MVP. An MVP doesnt let their team fall to a .500 conference record, and bow out in the first round of the MIAA tournament.

Ben Hansborough (brother of Tyler) was voted MVP of the Big East last year, do you really think he was the best? No, but he led his team to the best record in the conference and was a very efficient player, thus deserving of the MVP. The MIAA needs to seriously consider adding the MOP distinction.

Basically, if by some miracle the MVP doesnt go to a Hope player I will be absolutely shocked.

[KnightSlappy]

Others I've seen great improvement throughout the season:  Rietema, Van Eck, Dykstra.  I disagree with KS on Van Eck--I think he will be an important part of the squad in 2012-13.  Dan Stout gives me the impression of a young Brent Schuster--tall, thin, and good rotation on his shot.   

My saying Van Eck won't make the team next year is more of a commentary on their potential depth, and less a knock on Nate. I think he could be a useful player for 9-12 minutes per game next year, but it would be tough to carry a senior on the end of the bench. It's a numbers game; I just don't see enough minutes available.

Good point KS.  A lot of that depends on the injured/ineligible crowd and who returns to the roster next year.  Speaking of that, I don't have a good understanding of who sits on the bench with the team and who doesn't.  Last night Mickey DeVries was on the bench (in street clothes of course) and I think earlier in the season Jordan Brink was there for awhile.  No sign of Mitch Vallie or Brent Henry.  Is it simply up to the player, or is there more significance to this to read into?  My understanding is that academically ineligible players can't practice either....but I guess they can sit with the team during games.

By the way, someone raised the question on this board a while back about 3-point gunner Jaren Edsall of Olivet and his recent absence from the lineup.  I'm not sure if anyone answered the question.....apparently it's a concussion issue and he should return to the lineup soon.

With half of the conference season through I just want to jump in and ask if you really believe a 9-9 overall team with a mediocre 4-3 conference record even deserves to have a player in the MVP discussion? If MVP voting really only takes into account the conference season then I dont really think Snikkers or anyone on the Calvin team, has any reason to even be in the MVP discussion.

For the conference Snikkers has made 39% of his FG's and 21% of his 3PFG's...yes he averages 15.6 points, but he is definitely not the most efficient scorer or shooter. He also leads the team in TO's, which is no surprise from what we have seen. I guess what I am trying to say, is that any team that completely dominates the MIAA should have the MVP on their team. Bowser got absolutely snubbed last year, and everybody knows it. McClary was a great player and certainly deserving of MOP but not MVP. An MVP doesnt let their team fall to a .500 conference record, and bow out in the first round of the MIAA tournament.

Ben Hansborough (brother of Tyler) was voted MVP of the Big East last year, do you really think he was the best? No, but he led his team to the best record in the conference and was a very efficient player, thus deserving of the MVP. The MIAA needs to seriously consider adding the MOP distinction.

Basically, if by some miracle the MVP doesnt go to a Hope player I will be absolutely shocked.

Don't you think that the MOST outstanding player would carry a lot of value?

I like to think of it this way: if all of the players were thrown into a pot, and you had to pick a team, which player would you select first?

And everyone answers in unison: McClary. Why? Becuase he would provide your team with the most value against the cost of that single roster spot.

Or to think about it in a professional context, which player's stats (or stats + intangibles) would you pay the most money for?

[Happy Calvin Guy]

Re: MVP. 

If the impact of a player to their team's success/win-loss % is the issue, one needs to look no further than Olivet's team this year vs last year to understand how VALUABLE Mike McClary was to that team. 

Hope has actually gotten better since Bowser graduated.   

[HopeConvert]

Re: MVP. 

If the impact of a player to their team's success/win-loss % is the issue, one needs to look no further than Olivet's team this year vs last year to understand how VALUABLE Mike McClary was to that team. 

Hope has actually gotten better since Bowser graduated.   

Post hoc ergo propter hoc.

Hope has added Bunn and VanArendonk to a team that went to the sweet 16 last year. Additionally, other players have improved their games.

[Happy Calvin Guy]

Re: MVP. 

If the impact of a player to their team's success/win-loss % is the issue, one needs to look no further than Olivet's team this year vs last year to understand how VALUABLE Mike McClary was to that team. 

Hope has actually gotten better since Bowser graduated.   

Post hoc ergo propter hoc.

Hope has added Bunn and VanArendonk to a team that went to the sweet 16 last year. Additionally, other players have improved their games.

Sorry, I should have used the wink emoticon instead of the simple smiley face.  I understand that it's hard to read some things as tongue-in-cheek when it's merely the written word and one also wears orange and blue lenses. 

So... just to clarify and be literal, I do firmly believe that Will Bowser was a very valuable player and deserved to be included in the 2011 MVP discussion. 

[Hopester]

Re: MVP. 

If the impact of a player to their team's success/win-loss % is the issue, one needs to look no further than Olivet's team this year vs last year to understand how VALUABLE Mike McClary was to that team. 

Hope has actually gotten better since Bowser graduated.   

Post hoc ergo propter hoc.

Hope has added Bunn and VanArendonk to a team that went to the sweet 16 last year. Additionally, other players have improved their games.

Sorry, I should have used the wink emoticon instead of the simple smiley face.  I understand that it's hard to read some things as tongue-in-cheek when it's merely the written word and one also wears orange and blue lenses. 

So... just to clarify and be literal, I do firmly believe that Will Bowser was a very valuable player and deserved to be included in the 2011 MVP discussion. 

I don't understand why offense was taken to that comment. I think it is very clear that Hope has improved since Bowser graduated. They also have improved since Jesse Reimink graduated. They obviously didn't do this because those two graduated. So no offense should be taken to your comment HCG and you no longer need to apologize.

[sac]

I was looking at conference only stats this morning and this jumped out at me......

ASSISTS
## Player-Team               Cl  G Assists  Avg/G
-------------------------------------------------
1.David Rietema-CALVINM....           7        34   4.86
2.Colton Overway-HOPEM..... JR  7        33   4.71
3.Delano Collins-ADRIANM...       JR  7        28   4.00
4.Chris Kent-TRINEM........              7        27   3.86
   David Krombeen-HOPEM.....       JR  7       27   3.86

Not bad for coming off the bench. 


Also this one..........

3-POINT FIELD GOAL PERCENTAGES
# Team                  G     FG   FGA   Pct
--------------------------------------------
1.Albion College......            7     47   115  .409
2.Calvin College......         7     28    71  .394
3.Alma College........           7     61   168  .363
4.Kalamazoo College...        7     46   129  .357
5.Hope College........         7     22    73  .301
6.Adrian College......           7     32   113  .283
7.Trine University....             7     27    99  .273
8.Olivet College......            7     27   115  .235

Its very hard for my brain to process seeing both Hope and Calvin at the bottom of the league in 3 point shots attempted.  It just doesn't compute for me.

[HopeConvert]

Re: MVP. 

If the impact of a player to their team's success/win-loss % is the issue, one needs to look no further than Olivet's team this year vs last year to understand how VALUABLE Mike McClary was to that team. 

Hope has actually gotten better since Bowser graduated.   

Post hoc ergo propter hoc.

Hope has added Bunn and VanArendonk to a team that went to the sweet 16 last year. Additionally, other players have improved their games.

Sorry, I should have used the wink emoticon instead of the simple smiley face.  I understand that it's hard to read some things as tongue-in-cheek when it's merely the written word and one also wears orange and blue lenses. 

So... just to clarify and be literal, I do firmly believe that Will Bowser was a very valuable player and deserved to be included in the 2011 MVP discussion. 

I don't understand why offense was taken to that comment. I think it is very clear that Hope has improved since Bowser graduated. They also have improved since Jesse Reimink graduated. They obviously didn't do this because those two graduated. So no offense should be taken to your comment HCG and you no longer need to apologize.

I took no offense. Just contributing to the banter. I knew HCG wasn't casting asparagus on Bowser.

Emoticons typically mean nothing to me.

[KnightSlappy]

I was looking at conference only stats this morning and this jumped out at me......

ASSISTS
## Player-Team               Cl  G Assists  Avg/G
-------------------------------------------------
1.David Rietema-CALVINM....           7        34   4.86
2.Colton Overway-HOPEM..... JR  7        33   4.71
3.Delano Collins-ADRIANM...       JR  7        28   4.00
4.Chris Kent-TRINEM........              7        27   3.86
   David Krombeen-HOPEM.....       JR  7       27   3.86

And also not bad for a guy who will be coming off the bench next season.