FB: Ohio Athletic Conference

[USee]

I personally don't think firing Dartt is going to restore Mt Union to national championship contender. The program has been elite but others have caught up and in a few cases, passed Mt Union. Under Kehres, what Mt Union accomplished is likely unrepeatable and requires an alignment across an institution that is extremely difficult to achieve. You think UWW wanted to end up where they are after Leipold (Or Augustana after Bob Reade)? A coach is one of many pieces that have to be in place for success. NCC has a great HC in Brad Spencer, but they have 9 full time assistant coaches that only do football. They have alignment in the administration from the AD to the President and involvement of alums that is rare. They are in a recruiting hotbed with a financial aid process that crushes competitors.

The gap below Mt Union is a lot larger than the gap above them at this point. Mt Union can certainly fire Dartt and any new hire will bring new optimism, but if the the level of support across the institution doesn't look to increase don't be surprised if you end up with results that are similar or worse than you currently have.

[Dr. Acula]

Luckily I was busy yesterday so didn't have time to post all my thoughts immediately.  But then I was thinking about it this morning and the sad thing is I realized that I really wasn't even that upset yesterday.  I guess indifference has crept in for me with the football program.  I went into the playoffs not even considering a national title as a decent possibility so losing yesterday versus next week or the semis is not a ton different if you don't think you lost out on a chance for a title. 

As for the game, I thought the defense played their best game of the year probably.  And they did so without Liebler which is even more impressive.  Brown is just a beast.  Holding JCU to 7 points in regulation should have resulted in a comfortable win.  I am concerned about 2026 because I'm not sure who is going to be their stud edge rusher.  If Harris is back combined with their current interior DL that should be a strength, but the edges are a question mark IMO.

The offense just didn't get it done.  I thought JCU played well up front defensively and in several key third downs their secondary did a nice job.  The 3 RBs averaged exactly 3 ypc combined.  The turning point in the game was when Mount fumbled inside the 10 yard line attempting to answer JCU's tying TD.  If Mount scores there and immediately punched back I think it mentally deflates JCU and settles Mount down.  Even after the fumble they forced a 3 and out and got the ball back at midfield, but couldn't capitalize on good field position.  The final play I'm guessing everyone watching knew what was coming when they were in that formation.  JCU certainly did.  The bottom line is that they scored on their first play and proceeded to score 0 points on the remaining 62 plays.  That is generally not going to end well for the good guys.  Disappointing ending to the season to say the least.

They'll win the OAC again next year even if they only have Maloney and their JV team around him, but beyond that who knows.  Truthfully that's the current reality.

[WRMUalum13]

Luckily I was busy yesterday so didn't have time to post all my thoughts immediately.  But then I was thinking about it this morning and the sad thing is I realized that I really wasn't even that upset yesterday.  I guess indifference has crept in for me with the football program.  I went into the playoffs not even considering a national title as a decent possibility so losing yesterday versus next week or the semis is not a ton different if you don't think you lost out on a chance for a title. 

As for the game, I thought the defense played their best game of the year probably.  And they did so without Liebler which is even more impressive.  Brown is just a beast.  Holding JCU to 7 points in regulation should have resulted in a comfortable win.  I am concerned about 2026 because I'm not sure who is going to be their stud edge rusher.  If Harris is back combined with their current interior DL that should be a strength, but the edges are a question mark IMO.

The offense just didn't get it done.  I thought JCU played well up front defensively and in several key third downs their secondary did a nice job.  The 3 RBs averaged exactly 3 ypc combined.  The turning point in the game was when Mount fumbled inside the 10 yard line attempting to answer JCU's tying TD.  If Mount scores there and immediately punched back I think it mentally deflates JCU and settles Mount down.  Even after the fumble they forced a 3 and out and got the ball back at midfield, but couldn't capitalize on good field position.  The final play I'm guessing everyone watching knew what was coming when they were in that formation.  JCU certainly did.  The bottom line is that they scored on their first play and proceeded to score 0 points on the remaining 62 plays.  That is generally not going to end well for the good guys.  Disappointing ending to the season to say the least.

They'll win the OAC again next year even if they only have Maloney and their JV team around him, but beyond that who knows.  Truthfully that's the current reality.

I think what really hurt the most about this year's campaign is that it was a trip to CANTON on the line. Seeing mount play in a Stagg Bowl that close is on my football bucket list

[uvmcatamount14]

Well, then the whole University needs to clean house. Plenty of football talent in Ohio, Pennsylvania, Virginia, in the recruiting hotbed. If this is the level people are accepting, so be it. Model more of NCC. Invest. Dedicate. Get rid of the old and bring in a lot of new. Otherwise, this is the standard you choose to accept. Most people have higher standards. Perhaps Mount Union no longer does.

[D3fanboy]

we all know that Dartt will not be fired by the University, nor is he very likely to leave via "promotion".  Despite his gaudy OAC numbers that are used by his supporters, I doubt that he's a very hot stock on the coaching market and his wife is the bread winner, so we're stuck with him.  (Although maybe Vince could use a waterboy or towel washing specialist in Upper NY?)

It sucks, but in today's college football world (even in D3), Dartt better take his wonderful personality to the transfer portal and load up on some dudes.  Other than QB1 and some of those young defenders, there are not many positions that should be safe from an incoming player.  This team needs to get more depth and build some...any level of toughness.  Building your own high school recruits is great, but they need some upperclassmen and need them yesterday.

But just like when Mount was embarrassed by something called an Alma, this total flop at the hands of your "rival" will likely lead to basically no changes.  Just more coach speak and zero accountability from the "leadership".  But as long as we keep moving the goalposts back and back, Mount should stay OAC for years and years!!!!...until one of those late season Jeff-with-a-G specials bites the Raiders.  Maybe then people will be ready for the difficult conversation

2021 - ran into a buzzsaw with NCC in the semis, no shame
2022 - needed a hail mary bounce off of a BW player to win the conference (after being up 17-0 at half, the only other score was the hail mary)  made a run to the Stagg Bowl.  Offense didn't show up until the 4th quarter after a 21-0 hole
2023 - Alma.  Was the Dartt masterpiece until 12/6/25
2024 - great run to the Stagg Bowl after a couple of turds in OAC play.  The end of the 1st half coaching blunders took away any chance of an upset
2025- peaked in week 2 (or was it the 3rd quarter of game 1?)  went through the motions for much of the OAC year and laid the program's biggest egg yesterday

can't wait to see what is in store for the 2026 Raiders

[JCUStreaks70]

Follow up question I have 24 hrs after the game. For well over 30 years, it required a perfect game to beat Mount, and even then it was often not enough. I believe that JCU played a far from perfect game yesterday; look at the turnovers and blowing the chance to win in the first OT. Has JCU joined the "ranks" of elite teams? or do you think Mount has fallen from utter supremacy? For so long, there was only one team in all of D3 who could play toe to toe with Mount, and be able to get away with mistakes. Are we seeing a broadening of talent and more "tier one" teams? Or is it NCC standing alone, followed by a level of a half dozen teams? then a respectable tier 3, and then the rest? If Mount is no longer elite, has JCU hit the same level?

Now, I do not believe that one win means "we're equals", but I cannot help but think that because of the mistakes we also had proves that the gap between Mount and JCU closed immensely, at the very least.

Just curious your thoughts, from a Mount perspective. Anywho, thanks again for all your congrats and the fact that many of you are cheering for us the rest of the way! I do miss the banter with you all, so this week has been a fun blast from the past. Hate to say I wish MUC57 were alive to see it, but would've been nice to hear his congrats.

[Dr. Acula]

IMO it's NCC and a half dozen a tier below them.  Mount is not on that level currently.  They had a shot last yr, but between Alma and JCU the consistency is gone.  2 of the last 3 playoffs they're a top 15 team and by no means elite.

[D3fanboy]

Follow up question I have 24 hrs after the game. For well over 30 years, it required a perfect game to beat Mount, and even then it was often not enough. I believe that JCU played a far from perfect game yesterday; look at the turnovers and blowing the chance to win in the first OT. Has JCU joined the "ranks" of elite teams? or do you think Mount has fallen from utter supremacy? For so long, there was only one team in all of D3 who could play toe to toe with Mount, and be able to get away with mistakes. Are we seeing a broadening of talent and more "tier one" teams? Or is it NCC standing alone, followed by a level of a half dozen teams? then a respectable tier 3, and then the rest? If Mount is no longer elite, has JCU hit the same level?

Now, I do not believe that one win means "we're equals", but I cannot help but think that because of the mistakes we also had proves that the gap between Mount and JCU closed immensely, at the very least.

Just curious your thoughts, from a Mount perspective. Anywho, thanks again for all your congrats and the fact that many of you are cheering for us the rest of the way! I do miss the banter with you all, so this week has been a fun blast from the past. Hate to say I wish MUC57 were alive to see it, but would've been nice to hear his congrats.

imo, neither team really played well at all yesterday.  The defenses were fine, but that was a couple of, as the kids say, "mid" teams.  Fumbles, missed kicks, tons of penalties, etc.  Mount played scared to lose after getting up by 7 and JCU had toughness, mentally and physically. 

I don't know how many times that I can say it, but when Mount is getting their plays lined up under 10 seconds and snapped with 5 or less, the offense is stagnant and stinks.

I don't know that there are many teams in the D3 world with as much talent at the top as Mount Union.  That talent needs leadership and coaching or it shows up to each game thinking that they have won due to the "Raiders" across their chest, despite the fact that they, themselves haven't done anything to earn that.  There is no champion upperclassmen left in the program to keep "the standard", so it's up to the coaches.  In a week where Mount Union alumni dominated the college football coaching moves and made millions upon millions...we are stuck with the same coaching staff in Alliance for over a half a decade now.  Why are there no coaches ever leaving for bigger jobs all of a sudden?

Sorry for the rant, congrats to the Blue Streaks.

[JCUStreaks70]

Follow up question I have 24 hrs after the game. For well over 30 years, it required a perfect game to beat Mount, and even then it was often not enough. I believe that JCU played a far from perfect game yesterday; look at the turnovers and blowing the chance to win in the first OT. Has JCU joined the "ranks" of elite teams? or do you think Mount has fallen from utter supremacy? For so long, there was only one team in all of D3 who could play toe to toe with Mount, and be able to get away with mistakes. Are we seeing a broadening of talent and more "tier one" teams? Or is it NCC standing alone, followed by a level of a half dozen teams? then a respectable tier 3, and then the rest? If Mount is no longer elite, has JCU hit the same level?

Now, I do not believe that one win means "we're equals", but I cannot help but think that because of the mistakes we also had proves that the gap between Mount and JCU closed immensely, at the very least.

Just curious your thoughts, from a Mount perspective. Anywho, thanks again for all your congrats and the fact that many of you are cheering for us the rest of the way! I do miss the banter with you all, so this week has been a fun blast from the past. Hate to say I wish MUC57 were alive to see it, but would've been nice to hear his congrats.

imo, neither team really played well at all yesterday.  The defenses were fine, but that was a couple of, as the kids say, "mid" teams.  Fumbles, missed kicks, tons of penalties, etc.  Mount played scared to lose after getting up by 7 and JCU had toughness, mentally and physically. 

I don't know how many times that I can say it, but when Mount is getting their plays lined up under 10 seconds and snapped with 5 or less, the offense is stagnant and stinks.

I don't know that there are many teams in the D3 world with as much talent at the top as Mount Union.  That talent needs leadership and coaching or it shows up to each game thinking that they have won due to the "Raiders" across their chest, despite the fact that they, themselves haven't done anything to earn that.  There is no champion upperclassmen left in the program to keep "the standard", so it's up to the coaches.  In a week where Mount Union alumni dominated the college football coaching moves and made millions upon millions...we are stuck with the same coaching staff in Alliance for over a half a decade now.  Why are there no coaches ever leaving for bigger jobs all of a sudden?

Sorry for the rant, congrats to the Blue Streaks.

Don't be sorry, mine was a long winded question. haha. But exactly my thoughts, as far as the game. I think we all would agree, for soooo long, even when Mount played poorly, their talent was enough. I have to imagine Mount still has more depth in talent than most anyone in D3, including JCU; so then the next logical answer would be coaching. I believe if I asked, Behrman or Dartt, you all would take Behrman??

So, with that said, if changes are not made in Alliance, is Mount just "the best OAC team" and no longer one of the top teams? I am genuinely curious what you all think.

I think parity is good for the sport. Sure, we each want our team to win every year; but as a whole, we would all probably agree fresh blood playing for titles makes it more exciting. So yeah, the homer in me wants to think that JCU has just entered the same arena as Mount, and are now arguable one of the Top 10 programs in D3. Maybe we are, maybe we're not; the coming weeks will tell.

Again, I am not going to take one win as law; but I just keep going back to the fact that with the exception of our D, we played a far from perfect game. And even then, our D was the prototypical "bend but don't break Defense" yesterday.

Now, I do believe we will beat Berry next week; unless we have an emotional let down. And if we get to Naperville, that's gonna be awesome! At least for me and my brother. Our dad is an NCC football alum, but we're obviously not. So, our family is a "house divided" and I only live an hour from NCC. Side note, I think NCC will/would be surprised by the JCU turnout, if it happens. We have a LARGE Chicago base, both for alums and current students.

[WRMUalum13]

Follow up question I have 24 hrs after the game. For well over 30 years, it required a perfect game to beat Mount, and even then it was often not enough. I believe that JCU played a far from perfect game yesterday; look at the turnovers and blowing the chance to win in the first OT. Has JCU joined the "ranks" of elite teams? or do you think Mount has fallen from utter supremacy? For so long, there was only one team in all of D3 who could play toe to toe with Mount, and be able to get away with mistakes. Are we seeing a broadening of talent and more "tier one" teams? Or is it NCC standing alone, followed by a level of a half dozen teams? then a respectable tier 3, and then the rest? If Mount is no longer elite, has JCU hit the same level?

Now, I do not believe that one win means "we're equals", but I cannot help but think that because of the mistakes we also had proves that the gap between Mount and JCU closed immensely, at the very least.

Just curious your thoughts, from a Mount perspective. Anywho, thanks again for all your congrats and the fact that many of you are cheering for us the rest of the way! I do miss the banter with you all, so this week has been a fun blast from the past. Hate to say I wish MUC57 were alive to see it, but would've been nice to hear his congrats.

Unfortunately for you guys I think this is more of Mount coming back to the field than JCU program elevating itself. The 2016 JCU squad was absolutely elite, as they went on to beat a good Mount Union team, manhandled a good UWW team and play a competitive semi final against Oshkosh.

If you saw my earlier post,  this year's UMU team played poorly against a lot of sub-par OAC teams so in terms of where programs

I don't think you'll have a good answer until next week, if JCU can go onto beat Berry and play a good semi final I'd say they are pretty elite or close to it, if you get smoked next week I think it was a bit of a fluke.

[D3fanboy]

Follow up question I have 24 hrs after the game. For well over 30 years, it required a perfect game to beat Mount, and even then it was often not enough. I believe that JCU played a far from perfect game yesterday; look at the turnovers and blowing the chance to win in the first OT. Has JCU joined the "ranks" of elite teams? or do you think Mount has fallen from utter supremacy? For so long, there was only one team in all of D3 who could play toe to toe with Mount, and be able to get away with mistakes. Are we seeing a broadening of talent and more "tier one" teams? Or is it NCC standing alone, followed by a level of a half dozen teams? then a respectable tier 3, and then the rest? If Mount is no longer elite, has JCU hit the same level?

Now, I do not believe that one win means "we're equals", but I cannot help but think that because of the mistakes we also had proves that the gap between Mount and JCU closed immensely, at the very least.

Just curious your thoughts, from a Mount perspective. Anywho, thanks again for all your congrats and the fact that many of you are cheering for us the rest of the way! I do miss the banter with you all, so this week has been a fun blast from the past. Hate to say I wish MUC57 were alive to see it, but would've been nice to hear his congrats.

imo, neither team really played well at all yesterday.  The defenses were fine, but that was a couple of, as the kids say, "mid" teams.  Fumbles, missed kicks, tons of penalties, etc.  Mount played scared to lose after getting up by 7 and JCU had toughness, mentally and physically. 

I don't know how many times that I can say it, but when Mount is getting their plays lined up under 10 seconds and snapped with 5 or less, the offense is stagnant and stinks.

I don't know that there are many teams in the D3 world with as much talent at the top as Mount Union.  That talent needs leadership and coaching or it shows up to each game thinking that they have won due to the "Raiders" across their chest, despite the fact that they, themselves haven't done anything to earn that.  There is no champion upperclassmen left in the program to keep "the standard", so it's up to the coaches.  In a week where Mount Union alumni dominated the college football coaching moves and made millions upon millions...we are stuck with the same coaching staff in Alliance for over a half a decade now.  Why are there no coaches ever leaving for bigger jobs all of a sudden?

Sorry for the rant, congrats to the Blue Streaks.

Don't be sorry, mine was a long winded question. haha. But exactly my thoughts, as far as the game. I think we all would agree, for soooo long, even when Mount played poorly, their talent was enough. I have to imagine Mount still has more depth in talent than most anyone in D3, including JCU; so then the next logical answer would be coaching. I believe if I asked, Behrman or Dartt, you all would take Behrman??

So, with that said, if changes are not made in Alliance, is Mount just "the best OAC team" and no longer one of the top teams? I am genuinely curious what you all think.

I think parity is good for the sport. Sure, we each want our team to win every year; but as a whole, we would all probably agree fresh blood playing for titles makes it more exciting. So yeah, the homer in me wants to think that JCU has just entered the same arena as Mount, and are now arguable one of the Top 10 programs in D3. Maybe we are, maybe we're not; the coming weeks will tell.

Again, I am not going to take one win as law; but I just keep going back to the fact that with the exception of our D, we played a far from perfect game. And even then, our D was the prototypical "bend but don't break Defense" yesterday.

Now, I do believe we will beat Berry next week; unless we have an emotional let down. And if we get to Naperville, that's gonna be awesome! At least for me and my brother. Our dad is an NCC football alum, but we're obviously not. So, our family is a "house divided" and I only live an hour from NCC. Side note, I think NCC will/would be surprised by the JCU turnout, if it happens. We have a LARGE Chicago base, both for alums and current students.

I've never thought of Behrman one iota in my life.  However, he spells his first name in a much more professional manner and as long as he has the personality of a dinner plate, that'd be an improvement.  I'd give it a whirl, what's the worst that could happen...we lose in the 2nd round of the playoffs every other year?

as much as I love to take shots at JCU, this is not one.  But which 2nd (3rd) round playoff team (s) would Mount beat yesterday with that effort?  Eastern, but then...uh...

so yeah, give me the Beerman from JCU, or the garbage man in my neighborhood, or anybody other than a BW alum, as long as they aren't an arrogant, entitled, nepo-baby.  Lets take a shot

[D3fanboy]

I personally don't think firing Dartt is going to restore Mt Union to national championship contender. The program has been elite but others have caught up and in a few cases, passed Mt Union. Under Kehres, what Mt Union accomplished is likely unrepeatable and requires an alignment across an institution that is extremely difficult to achieve. You think UWW wanted to end up where they are after Leipold (Or Augustana after Bob Reade)? A coach is one of many pieces that have to be in place for success. NCC has a great HC in Brad Spencer, but they have 9 full time assistant coaches that only do football. They have alignment in the administration from the AD to the President and involvement of alums that is rare. They are in a recruiting hotbed with a financial aid process that crushes competitors.

The gap below Mt Union is a lot larger than the gap above them at this point. Mt Union can certainly fire Dartt and any new hire will bring new optimism, but if the the level of support across the institution doesn't look to increase don't be surprised if you end up with results that are similar or worse than you currently have.

I think Dartt is driving the Mount program into the ground, but who are these programs?  NCC is the obvious at the moment but who else

[WRMUalum13]

Follow up question I have 24 hrs after the game. For well over 30 years, it required a perfect game to beat Mount, and even then it was often not enough. I believe that JCU played a far from perfect game yesterday; look at the turnovers and blowing the chance to win in the first OT. Has JCU joined the "ranks" of elite teams? or do you think Mount has fallen from utter supremacy? For so long, there was only one team in all of D3 who could play toe to toe with Mount, and be able to get away with mistakes. Are we seeing a broadening of talent and more "tier one" teams? Or is it NCC standing alone, followed by a level of a half dozen teams? then a respectable tier 3, and then the rest? If Mount is no longer elite, has JCU hit the same level?

Now, I do not believe that one win means "we're equals", but I cannot help but think that because of the mistakes we also had proves that the gap between Mount and JCU closed immensely, at the very least.

Just curious your thoughts, from a Mount perspective. Anywho, thanks again for all your congrats and the fact that many of you are cheering for us the rest of the way! I do miss the banter with you all, so this week has been a fun blast from the past. Hate to say I wish MUC57 were alive to see it, but would've been nice to hear his congrats.

Also... in regards to the "Does NCC Stand alone" I think they've pretty clearly been alone at the apex since 2022. I thought this article from back then summed up the state of the D3 world pretty well, and I think that's still pretty much where we are:

https://www.d3football.com/playoffs/2022/we-are-all-mount-union

[D3fanboy]

Follow up question I have 24 hrs after the game. For well over 30 years, it required a perfect game to beat Mount, and even then it was often not enough. I believe that JCU played a far from perfect game yesterday; look at the turnovers and blowing the chance to win in the first OT. Has JCU joined the "ranks" of elite teams? or do you think Mount has fallen from utter supremacy? For so long, there was only one team in all of D3 who could play toe to toe with Mount, and be able to get away with mistakes. Are we seeing a broadening of talent and more "tier one" teams? Or is it NCC standing alone, followed by a level of a half dozen teams? then a respectable tier 3, and then the rest? If Mount is no longer elite, has JCU hit the same level?

Now, I do not believe that one win means "we're equals", but I cannot help but think that because of the mistakes we also had proves that the gap between Mount and JCU closed immensely, at the very least.

Just curious your thoughts, from a Mount perspective. Anywho, thanks again for all your congrats and the fact that many of you are cheering for us the rest of the way! I do miss the banter with you all, so this week has been a fun blast from the past. Hate to say I wish MUC57 were alive to see it, but would've been nice to hear his congrats.

Also... in regards to the "Does NCC Stand alone" I think they've pretty clearly been alone at the apex since 2022. I thought this article from back then summed up the state of the D3 world pretty well, and I think that's still pretty much where we are:

https://www.d3football.com/playoffs/2022/we-are-all-mount-union

North Central coach Brad Spencer isn't quite convinced.

"We're not there yet," the longtime offensive coordinator said after winning a championship in his first season as head coach. "When you look at those three programs and the history that they have, it's pretty incredible. ... to be in the last three, it's a good start."

and that is one of the big differences between NCC and Mount right now.  Spencer moves the goal posts further and further down the field, Dartt repeats "the standard is the standard" and now alums are supposed to be thrilled with OAC titles